Boston Review on ‘What Darwin Got Wrong’

Science • Views: 2,940

At the Boston Review, Ned Block and Philip Kitcher have an excellent piece on a new book titled “What Darwin Got Wrong,” that tries to cast doubt on Charles Darwin’s theory of evolution by approaching the subject from a philosophical standpoint: Misunderstanding Darwin.

Since the science isn’t in question, it makes sense that attempts to discredit evolutionary science don’t actually involve, you know, science. The interesting thing about the book, though, is that the authors aren’t the usual fundamentalist religious fanatics, but materialists. (Or so they say.)

… Even as some scientists suggest that natural selection may be limited in ways Darwin could not envisage, they accept his basic insights and work to improve our biological understanding within the framework he set forth.

In their controversial new book, What Darwin Got Wrong, Jerry Fodor and Massimo Piattelli-Palmarini set out to dismantle that framework. They argue that standard evolutionary thinking—what they call Darwinism—is guilty of a basic logical error, not a mistake in biology but an “intensional fallacy.” That fallacy, they say, undermines the entire enterprise. To be clear, the authors preface their demolition with a disclaimer: in attacking Darwin, they are not supporting any religious view of “origins”; thoroughgoing materialists, they do not think that biological patterns require an intelligent designer. But their criticisms are intended to knock evolutionary theory from its scientific pedestal by demolishing the scientific credentials of natural selection.

Fodor and Piattelli-Palmarini are not biologists. Fodor is a leading philosopher of mind and cognitive scientist, best known for his ideas about the modularity of mind and language of thought; Piattelli-Palmarini is a cognitive scientist. They do not have new data, new theory, close acquaintance with the everyday practice of evolutionary investigations, or any interest in supplying alternative explanations of evolutionary phenomena. Instead, they wield philosophical tools to locate a “conceptual fault line” in contemporary Darwinism. Apparently unshaken by withering criticism of Fodor’s earlier writings about evolutionary theory, they write with complete assurance, confident that their limited understanding of biology suffices for their critical purpose. The resulting argument is doubly flawed: it is biologically irrelevant and philosophically confused. We start with the biology.

Read the whole thing and give your cerebral cortex some exercise. This review kind of made me want to read the book, just to see if it’s as bad as Block and Kitcher say it is. (Boo! There’s no Kindle version yet.)

PZ Myers also has an interesting post, responding to a summary of the book published in New Scientist. (He’s not fond of it either.)

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54 comments
1 Obdicut  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:05:54pm

Dennet pre-emptively slapped the shit out of this argument in Darwin’s Dangerous Idea.

[Link: www.amazon.com…]

I hope he writes a review.

2 MrSilverDragon  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:08:10pm

The only thing Darwin got wrong was not being able to determine how morons like these would manage to survive… although I suppose there is the “exception to every rule”, including “survival of the fittest”.

3 Kragar  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:09:05pm

Sorry, I’m busy reading an exhaustive analysis of the Greek Philosphers written by a person with an extensive background in indoor plumbing.

4 Obdicut  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:14:51pm

The fact that Darwin got evolution right without the benefit of understanding the mechanism— genes— makes it, in my view, the single greatest scientific achievement, ever.

5 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:15:38pm

This is re: #3 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Sorry, I’m busy reading an exhaustive analysis of the Greek Philosphers written by a person with an extensive background in indoor plumbing.

Or preparing to have butt cheek enhancement performed by someone with an extensive background in indoor plumbing…

(relinked from prior thread)

6 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:16:09pm

re: #4 Obdicut

The fact that Darwin got evolution right without the benefit of understanding the mechanism— genes— makes it, in my view, the single greatest scientific achievement, ever.

biology is shiny;)

7 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:16:21pm
They do not have new data, new theory, close acquaintance with the everyday practice of evolutionary investigations, or any interest in supplying alternative explanations of evolutionary phenomena. Instead, they wield philosophical tools to locate a “conceptual fault line” in contemporary Darwinism.

The cake DNA is a lie!

8 Locker  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:16:55pm

re: #7 Slumbering Behemoth

The cake DNA is a lie!

I regret that I have only one upding to give for your fine Portal reference.

9 Sol Berdinowitz  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:16:57pm

Controverse the teaching!

10 Killgore Trout  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:17:42pm

re: #3 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Sorry, I’m busy reading an exhaustive analysis of the Greek Philosphers written by a person with an extensive background in indoor plumbing.

Marcus Aurelius, eh?

11 Killgore Trout  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:19:02pm

re: #8 Locker

Portal 2 Confirmed by Valve
Expected sometime in the fall.

12 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:20:31pm

Speaking of the wing nut o sphere…

It was inevitable. First they called Darwin a Nazi, now AGW science and environmentalism is “nazi.”

I hesitate to show this as a link because of the true intense level of insanity here, but it should be seen if only because yes, the wingnuts really are that stupid.

This also has all the sorry memes of the far tight in one place… The Nazis are really leftist - their views on darwinism led them to their views on nazi ecofascism. And of course, this is all done while crying crocodile tears for my dead relatives.

These people do not know history, they do not care for history or facts or science and ironically, by dredging up the Nazis falsely, engage in the very tactics that would make Goebles proud.

To say that I despise them is an understatement.

[Link: www.aim.org…]

Thus, what later became known as the Final Solution was in fact an eco-imperial plan rooted in racist biology with ecological predilections. That this eco-imperial plan would far exceed the evils of the western powers in their drive to colonial expansionism has of course gone on largely unnoticed. However, the Final Solution was specifically contemplated by Hitler to resolve this Jewish “existential” threat. In short, the revenge of Nature against the Jews was to be carried out by the Nazis, who thought themselves to be the Master Race precisely because they deemed themselves the most ‘natural’ or ‘authentic,’ i.e., the most in tune with Nature’s pantheistic ways-all of which was largely defined by Ernst Haeckel’s evolutionary Social Darwinism called Monism.

The Green Nazis

Many Nazis, including the Fuhrer himself, believed that the industrial age along with its emphasis upon commercialism, city life, international trade and finance were corrupting the biological substance of the German people. The Nazis thus had an extreme literal reading of Nature which would spell absolute disaster for the Jews in particular precisely because they allegedly lived by a false, “eternal,” or transcendent ethos, far above the natural world and her “scientific” evolutionary natural laws of racism.

13 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:22:12pm

re: #12 LudwigVanQuixote

PIMF

Speaking of the wing nut o sphere…

It was inevitable. First they called Darwin a Nazi, now AGW science and environmentalism is “nazi.”

I hesitate to show this as a link because of the true intense level of insanity here, but it should be seen if only because yes, the wingnuts really are that stupid.

This also has all the sorry memes of the far right in one place when it comes to nazis… The nazis are really leftists - their views on darwinism led them to their views on nazi ecofascism. And of course, this is all done while crying crocodile tears for my dead relatives.

These people do not know history, they do not care for history or facts or science and ironically, by dredging up the Nazis falsely, engage in the very tactics that would make Goebles proud.

To say that I despise them is an understatement.

[Link: www.aim.org…]

14 windsagio  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:23:24pm

For some reason I am enamored to the idea that these guys really are ‘materialists’ and they’re just making a quick buck.

Its still terrible, but it tickles my fancy somehow >

15 researchok  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:24:12pm

Discussing the meaning of evolution and how evolution has impacted cultures is very different from discussing the science of evolution.

16 Purpendicular  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:24:59pm

“Materialist” usually means Marxist or some of its derivatives. They should be as negative to evolutionary thought as any religious fundamentalist. Evolutionary biology makes a few propositions and that they dislike:
First, there is such a thing as a human nature. Therefore, no “new man” à la the French or Russian revolutions.
Secondly, people 150 000 years ago, after homo sapiens appeared, were just like us, thus no primitive communism to start off from.
Thirdly, since there is a human nature, and since we tend to look out for number one more than for strangers, there can be no communist end state where everyone shares indiscriminately. There can be a dictatorship of the proletariat, but that state will most certainly not wither away.
So without its two endpoints, Marxism is, shall we say, “somewhat opposed” to Darwinist thought.

17 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:25:53pm

re: #8 Locker

I regret that I have only one upding to give for your fine Portal reference.

I haven’t even played the damn game (yet).

Yahoo Answers has a post with a more sinister and disgusting origin of the phrase, but I have no way nor any will to confirm the claim in this answer.

18 Locker  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:27:16pm

re: #17 Slumbering Behemoth

I haven’t even played the damn game (yet).

Yahoo Answers has a post with a more sinister and disgusting origin of the phrase, but I have no way nor any will to confirm the claim in this answer.

The main answer looks fairly accurate. The cake was bait but the final scene of portal does show a cake in a dark room…

19 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:28:25pm

And now back to Darwin:

20 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:28:35pm

re: #17 Slumbering Behemoth

I haven’t even played the damn game (yet).

Yahoo Answers has a post with a more sinister and disgusting origin of the phrase, but I have no way nor any will to confirm the claim in this answer.

yowza

21 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:29:02pm

re: #18 Locker

Read the entire description. It does not end with just a reference to Portal.

22 Sol Berdinowitz  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:29:11pm

re: #16 Purpendicular

“Materialist” usually means Marxist or some of its derivatives. They should be as negative to evolutionary thought as any religious fundamentalist. Evolutionary biology makes a few propositions and that they dislike:
First, there is such a thing as a human nature. Therefore, no “new man” à la the French or Russian revolutions.
Secondly, people 150 000 years ago, after homo sapiens appeared, were just like us, thus no primitive communism to start off from.
Thirdly, since there is a human nature, and since we tend to look out for number one more than for strangers, there can be no communist end state where everyone shares indiscriminately. There can be a dictatorship of the proletariat, but that state will most certainly not wither away.
So without its two endpoints, Marxism is, shall we say, “somewhat opposed” to Darwinist thought.


Remember Stalin and his anti-Darwinist man Lysenko, who set Soviet genetics and biology back by decades?

23 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:30:27pm

re: #20 Aceofwhat?

Again, I have no idea if that claim of origin is legit, nor do I have any interest in investigating it. There are some things I just prefer not to dig into.

24 windsagio  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:30:30pm

re: #16 Purpendicular

I would bet a ton of money that it’s not actually the case that they disbelieve Darwin because they’re Communists.

25 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:30:59pm

re: #22 ralphieboy

Remember Stalin and his anti-Darwinist man Lysenko, who set Soviet genetics and biology back by decades?

Why yes, this is what happens when you allow political dogma to govern science…. Go figure.

Did I mention that I bloody well hate the wingnuts?

26 rwdflynavy  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:31:23pm

re: #18 Locker

The main answer looks fairly accurate. The cake was bait but the final scene of portal does show a cake in a dark room…

Cake after your victory candescence….

27 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:31:32pm

re: #4 Obdicut

The fact that Darwin got evolution right without the benefit of understanding the mechanism— genes— makes it, in my view, the single greatest scientific achievement, ever.

My TV remote begs to differ.
/

28 Kragar  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:32:07pm

re: #27 Oh no…Sand People!

My TV remote begs to differ.
/

Hot dogs filled with a tunnel of chili.

29 The Curmudgeon  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:32:31pm

What is the point of a philosophical objection to evolution? I can frame philosophical objections to all kinds of scientific theories — especially quantum mechanics, but they’d all be worthless. For that matter, it was philosophical objections to a sun-centered solar system that got Galileo in trouble. Isn’t it time that philosophy grew up and understood its proper place in the scheme of things?

30 Randall Gross  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:32:38pm

Interesting, but I’m smelling something wrong with the new book — it’s very much an ICR and Discovery Institute tactic to dress a debunked last century debate, controversy, or turning point in the theory of evolution in new clothes and parade it out as a new AHA! This book could be precursor to a new parade of nonsense. I’ll have to read a bit more before I draw conclusions.

31 Sol Berdinowitz  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:32:57pm

re: #28 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Hot dogs filled with a tunnel of chili.

they only become a wonder when they are prepared in a microwave…

32 windsagio  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:33:40pm

re: #29 The Curmudgeon

Well you can’t dispute the accepted science (or one would think…) so you have to come up with a new angle.

33 Obdicut  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:34:39pm

re: #30 Thanos

It does seem to reflect a complete ignorance of modern biology. It would indicate none of them have read any of the most important modern works on Darwinism.

Actually, as the review states, it makes it seem like they don’t know what the modern synthesis was, too.

This level of ignorance is kind of astounding, and does make me suspicious that it’s an ‘ignorance’ maintained so that already-debunked ideas can be given a veneer of respectability.

34 SixDegrees  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:34:47pm

I’ve read about a third of the article, and haven’t found anything compelling in it yet. Yes, one can argue about what constitutes a trait and what, exactly, is being selected for. But none of that comes close to undermining natural selection; it doesn’t even scratch a shallow trench around it. Selection is still taking place, the moderator is still differential reproductive success, and over time genes which provide some advantage are favored over those that don’t.

I may keep reading, but I’m getting bored with what seems to be deliberate obsfuscation and willful ignorance on the part of the authors. And I have other things to do.

Show me a problem in the biological realm that natural selection fails to explain, and offer an alternative to natural selection that does explain it, or explains it better, and maybe I’ll perk up. But so far, the author’s argument sounds like an uber-pedantic one similar to discerning whether a zebra is a white animal with black stripes, or a black animal with white stripes, an exercise in trait-boundary gerrymandering that probably sounds profound as hell after several beers, but turns out to be sophmorically empty the following morning, although it may leave a lingering headache.

35 Obdicut  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:37:26pm

re: #34 SixDegrees

Exactly. Have they even heard of the Neutral Theory and its adoption into mainstream genetics?

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

That was a much bigger ‘challenge’ to Darwinism, and it was still ably encompassed by Darwinism.

The book I referenced above, Darwin’s Dangerous Idea, does a great job of tracing all of the attacks of every nature on Darwinism and showing how they fail to make a dent.

36 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:42:26pm

re: #4 Obdicut

The fact that Darwin got evolution right without the benefit of understanding the mechanism— genes— makes it, in my view, the single greatest scientific achievement, ever.

I need to track this down—I just saw it in an article, and now can’t find it—but there’s a page of Darwin’s notebooks where he’s drawn a very awkward first-stage chart of relationships between animals descended from a common ancestor—and over it, he’s noted “I think”.

WOW.

37 Obdicut  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:43:57pm

re: #36 SanFranciscoZionist

I think, also— the book is at work, and I’m at home today— that’s referenced in Darwin’s Dangerous Idea. He shows how close Darwin came to a lot more correct guesses, but points out that shows why Darwin was the guy to come up with Darwinism: He defined the limits of what he could prove conservatively, and so was able to present a masterful whole.

38 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:45:02pm

re: #7 Slumbering Behemoth

The cake DNA is a lie!

Over on FSTDT, they had one sterling quote from someone who claimed that DNA and RNA cannot exist because “the acid would melt us”. I have no idea how this person thinks his stomach works.

39 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:46:25pm

re: #7 Slumbering Behemoth

The cake DNA is a lie!

Dragon Age origins… I missed that!

Yes! One of the best games ever. Though I am also very very happy with Mass effect 2 and waiting for the expansion for DAO quite intently.

40 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:47:07pm

re: #38 SanFranciscoZionist

Over on FSTDT, they had one sterling quote from someone who claimed that DNA and RNA cannot exist because “the acid would melt us”. I have no idea how this person thinks his stomach works.

Well the lesson here is that intelligence is not always rewarded evolutionarily.

41 Randall Gross  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:53:38pm

Meanwhile Taitzerhead is running

[Link: scienceblogs.com…]

42 Purpendicular  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 12:59:02pm

re: #24 windsagio

Very few people claim to be communist today. Lot’s of people still hold related beliefs though, and they find it very difficult to articulate what went wrong in the Eastern Block. I don’t think they can give a coherent explanation of what happened in 1989 beyond a few bland sentences. I remember Reagan being treated as a buffoon and war monger by 95% of the political class in Sweden for asking that Gorbachev tears down the wall. That was in 1987 if my memory does not fail me.

I grew up in Sweden and we had pictures of Ujama villages and Olof Palme trying out Castro’s rifle in our high school history book. I haven’t heard anyone of the guilty to this say “oops, we were wrong”. Instead, collective amnesia is practiced.

43 Purpendicular  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 1:05:50pm

re: #24 windsagio

Yes they do. Marxism holds that you can change people by changing the environment. I do remember Lysenko very well. My high school biology teacher had a PhD in ethology on the behaviour of beavers and stuffed me full of Lorenz, Eibl-Eiblesfelt and Desmond Morris.

ralphieboy: Yes I do remember…
Lysenko just applied marxist theories to agriculture. Give the wheat lots of water and sun and it will become better generation after generation. That one destroyed decades of agricultural progress in the Soviet Union.

44 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 1:09:17pm

Rant on:

This is going to be a full blown, full of invective, Ludwig is pissed rant, my pointing out that anti science wingnut cretins have slightly less intellect than the crust on a drying splotch of dog vomit, I suggest you move your virgin eyes elsewhere.

This is a feculent age of stupid… Public displays of stupidity that would have shamed a more civilized generation are now considered acceptable.

I wish to thank the science education of America and home schooled right wing drones in particular for making the intellect of America be perceived as feculent around the world. Even British soccer hooligans consider themselves better educated than we are. Data would indicate that many are. Isn’t that great!

It is not just that that the right wing hates science, but it presumes to know science with it’s spiffy talking points. And what grand gems of brilliance they are!

Some gems cause educated people to feel pain, actual pain upon reading the talking points. It is one thing for something to be wrong. It is another to be so bad it does not even count as wrong - it exists in its own dimension of ignorant - a sort of twilight realm where arrogance and utter stupidity shamelessly make a smug mental bastard demon child whose squawks cause physical pain to the educated.

Consider the following :

The flood caused the Grand Canyon…

DNA and RNA are acids that would melt us…

It is impossible to warm the Earth because of the first law of Thermodynamics.

Evolution is impossible because of the second Law of Thermodynamics…

Methane is ocean farts. The Earth farts are the newest chicken little argument now that AGW has been proved a hoax.

It is impossible to trap heat…

The Nazis were really leftists.

The Nazis were Darwinist leftists.

The Nazis were Green Darwinist Leftists….

And who said that evolution doesn’t happen!

Ahh the arrogance. Ahh the stupidity. Reading these things when I first started here, I thought that people were just having a go with me. I mean I did not think it was possible for a person who could actually use a computer at any level to be that utterly mind numbingly stupid and ignorant, but alas I was wrong.

These people actually mean it. They actually believe it when they say these things.

Wanna talk Darwin, great - we let them vote, let’s see how long our country survives. News flash, the science says this country is driving towards its own destruction.

And here we are the nation of Washington, Adams and Jefferson, men of intellect, reason and rationalism reduced to the blathering of some red neck yokel and his snake oil views of pseudo science.

The UFO people, the New Agers, the Medieval Agers (in the case of the Christian right) the anti vaxers, the Nirthers, the Deathers, the truthers and everything else…

We have an infestation of stupid. And we are too stupid to say enough is enough.

45 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 1:20:27pm
46 Jimmah  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:42:46pm

The woefully confused arguments in this book will be dismissed by real scientists and philosophers, but will pick up sales from the creationist concern troll market, who will be studying it for years. In fact it won’t just be the creationists who are going to love this, but any anti-science concern trolls, for as the reviewer points out :

If Fodor and Piattelli-Palmarini’s criticism is taken seriously, then there are no facts of the matter about causal claims in any field of inquiry.

47 eastsider  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 3:09:57pm

I’ll save you all some time. FTA:

Are they right about this?
In a word, no.

48 jamesfirecat  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 3:24:51pm

re: #16 Purpendicular

“Materialist” usually means Marxist or some of its derivatives. They should be as negative to evolutionary thought as any religious fundamentalist. Evolutionary biology makes a few propositions and that they dislike:
First, there is such a thing as a human nature. Therefore, no “new man” à la the French or Russian revolutions.
Secondly, people 150 000 years ago, after homo sapiens appeared, were just like us, thus no primitive communism to start off from.
Thirdly, since there is a human nature, and since we tend to look out for number one more than for strangers, there can be no communist end state where everyone shares indiscriminately. There can be a dictatorship of the proletariat, but that state will most certainly not wither away.
So without its two endpoints, Marxism is, shall we say, “somewhat opposed” to Darwinist thought.

Wow, really?

What about Thomas “Leviathan” Hobbs, he was a materialist well before Communism came around!

You really have no idea at all what materialism is do you?

Here’s some place you can start learning…

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

49 Jimmah  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 3:29:07pm

re: #16 Purpendicular

“Materialist” usually means Marxist or some of its derivatives. They should be as negative to evolutionary thought as any religious fundamentalist. Evolutionary biology makes a few propositions and that they dislike:
First, there is such a thing as a human nature. Therefore, no “new man” à la the French or Russian revolutions.
Secondly, people 150 000 years ago, after homo sapiens appeared, were just like us, thus no primitive communism to start off from.
Thirdly, since there is a human nature, and since we tend to look out for number one more than for strangers, there can be no communist end state where everyone shares indiscriminately. There can be a dictatorship of the proletariat, but that state will most certainly not wither away.
So without its two endpoints, Marxism is, shall we say, “somewhat opposed” to Darwinist thought.

Oh for fuck’s sake. You are confusing all kind of things here. Firstly, you are confusing the political idea of materialism with the naturalistic one. When philosophers discuss ‘materialism’ in a scientific context, they aren’t thinking about Marx, or dealing in any political concepts whatsoever. Secondly, you are confusing scientists observations about how the world is with ideas about how it ought to be - the same mistake that creationists make when they argue that natural selection = nazism.

50 Larry A. Herzberg  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 4:02:31pm

Knowing some of Fodor’s past work, I’d be cautious of dismissing this book as quickly as Block & Kitcher seem to do in this review (although they are also very sharp philosophers). Many of the comments below the review are quite good, and hint at some of the complications. Read the book, learn some of the philosophical background, and then make an educated judgment.

51 iceweasel  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 4:21:53pm

re: #50 avram

Knowing some of Fodor’s past work, I’d be cautious of dismissing this book as quickly as Block & Kitcher seem to do in this review (although they are also very sharp philosophers). Many of the comments below the review are quite good, and hint at some of the complications. Read the book, learn some of the philosophical background, and then make an educated judgment.

Problem is, while no one doubts Fodor’s contributions in philosophy of mind and cog sci, he’s damned weak on biology and his prior work on evolutionary theory would also suggest that Block and kitcher are right. I’ll likely wind up reading it, but my money is on B& K here.

52 Olsonist  Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:02:38pm

re: #42 Purpendicular

…. I remember Reagan being treated as a buffoon and war monger by 95% of the political class in Sweden for asking that Gorbachev tears down the wall. That was in 1987 if my memory does not fail me. ….

Well, Reagan was war mongering in El Salvador, Nicaragua, Guatemala, ….

53 Purpendicular  Wed, Mar 10, 2010 8:06:46am

re: #49 Jimmah

Yeah, our universities are filled with disciples of Hobbs. No, wait a minute, they are, or used to be marxist, trotskist and the like. If someone calls themselves “materialist” these days, it is rarely because they are fond of evolutionary psychology, almost exclusively because they are (pseudo-)marxist.

Another reason why much of academia hates Darwin is that from an evolutionary perspective, the nature-nurture dichotomy is nonsense. Dawkins gave the example of bread, you cannot say it is 75% dough and 25% time in the oven.

So if you follow Darwin, “gender” as a “social construction” is a theory that is “not even wrong”. Gender can only be studied as part of biology. Such talk in a Women’s studies department does not win many favours.

54 iceweasel  Wed, Mar 10, 2010 8:09:57am

re: #53 Purpendicular


Another reason why much of academia hates Darwin

You’re flat out wrong if you think Fodor and Piattelli-Palmarini ‘hate Darwin’. They’re making a primarily philosophical argument that doesn’t, in fact, have anything to do with creationism or intelligent design, although the fucktards who support those things will doubtless try to seize on their work. Which they are incapable of understanding.
Fodor and Piattelli-Palmarini are materialists and naturalists, btw.


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