1 Randall Gross  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:58:17am

It's the misplaced apostrophes of the teapocalypse.

2 The Curmudgeon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:58:40am

Not very skillful regarding the apostrophe, but otherwise, not all that big a deal.

3 The Curmudgeon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:59:14am

Great minds ...

4 bratwurst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:59:38am

And the countdown to "it's a plant!" begins...

5 pingjockey  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:00:36am

He must've been listening to his teenagers rap albums!

6 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:00:48am

Oh, ugh.


re: #2 The Curmudgeon

Not very skillful regarding the apostrophe, but otherwise, not all that big a deal.

It isn't just the apostrophes, the "be pimpin'" usage is a clear clue who they're talking about, doncha think?

7 King of the Douche, now you may bow  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:01:47am

I wanna be a pimp, but I don't look good in silk.
/

8 pingjockey  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:04:27am

re: #6 reine.de.tout
I have a 16 yr old and an 18 yr old and when you hear them and their friends talking most of it is slang taken from rap and hip hop albums. BTW I live 150 miles from any major urban area where kids white, black, brown, purple polka dot talk like that!

9 King of the Douche, now you may bow  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:06:53am

re: #8 pingjockey

I have a 16 yr old and an 18 yr old and when you hear them and their friends talking most of it is slang taken from rap and hip hop albums. BTW I live 150 miles from any major urban area where kids white, black, brown, purple polka dot talk like that!

What you talkin' 'bout Willis?TM

10 Fozzie Bear  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:07:29am

I would bet fairly hefty sum that this guy wouldn't be using the phrase "be pimpin" in any other context than criticism of our (black) president.

Rather transparent racism imo.

11 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:15:59am

OY.

12 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:17:43am

Would it be seen as a sign of West Coast elitism if I went on a road trip following these guys around and offered a free Sign Grammar Clinic?

13 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:17:55am

re: #7 Cannadian Club Akbar

I wanna be a pimp, but I don't look good in silk.
/

Walter does, though/

14 pingjockey  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:18:55am

re: #2 SanFranciscoZionist
Nah. But some folks would take affront that you want to help them with their spelling and grammar!

15 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:19:25am

re: #12 SanFranciscoZionist

Would it be seen as a sign of West Coast elitism if I went on a road trip following these guys around and offered a free Sign Grammar Clinic?

yep. and i fully support it;)

16 Sigma_x  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:19:30am

Pimpin' ain't easy... but it's necessary.

- Too Short

17 AntonSirius  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:19:36am

Is that supposed to be a subtle ACORN reference?

Wait, what am I saying? Tea partiers don't do 'subtle'.

18 pingjockey  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:20:46am

re: #7 AntonSirius
From all the signs I've seen on the 'tubes and tv, subtle and nuanced are Right Out.

19 cenotaphium  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:21:42am

To be fair, I'm pretty sure people we're holding signs calling Bush out on riding dirty.

20 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:22:18am

re: #16 Sigma_x

Pimpin' ain't easy... but it's necessary.

- Too Short

"I wanted to tax that ass like the government!"

-Big Daddy Kane

21 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:25:40am

re: #12 SanFranciscoZionist

Would it be seen as a sign of West Coast elitism if I went on a road trip following these guys around and offered a free Sign Grammar Clinic?

Only if you bring your arugula with you.

Now, put "arugula" on a protest sign and I'll fall down in a faint.

22 Ojoe  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:26:08am

Well the congress, by ramping up the national debt by trillions of dollars, is effectively taking out mortgages on our kid's and grand kid's probable future prosperity.

So the sign holder may have a point.

I wouldn't use his exact words though.

23 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:27:39am

You know it's hard out here for a pimp....

Speaking of pimps, on Wed Mitch McConnell tried to whitewash meeting with big bankers and supporting the Bank Reg. bill by whining about that "the community bankers in Kentucky, the little guys, the mainstreet guys, are overwhelmingly opposed to this bill."...anyone know what he was talking about and why community banks should not be regulated more too?

24 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:28:45am

re: #8 pingjockey

I have a 16 yr old and an 18 yr old and when you hear them and their friends talking most of it is slang taken from rap and hip hop albums. BTW I live 150 miles from any major urban area where kids white, black, brown, purple polka dot talk like that!

"I'm hip."
"Can you dig it."
"Far out."
"Groovy"

and we weren't hippies either :) It's the music, man. And rock is dead (but that's another topic).

25 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:29:11am

re: #12 SanFranciscoZionist

Would it be seen as a sign of West Coast elitism if I went on a road trip following these guys around and offered a free Sign Grammar Clinic?

Make sure you bring some burly friends and your big red marker.
Just look at what happened to the poor "I Love Ham" guy....

26 Ojoe  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:29:24am

re: #18 pingjockey

"5 is right out."

27 pingjockey  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:29:41am

re: #24 marjoriemoon

Never used groovy in my life! Those others...oh yeah!

28 pingjockey  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:30:24am

re: #26 Ojoe
Hahaha! We have a lot of Python fans here!

29 Ojoe  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:30:54am

re: #27 pingjockey

It is hard not to use "cool."

***

I had a friend, who when asked what his "sign" was, would reply:

"I'm sorry, I don't speak granola."

30 Ojoe  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:31:25am

re: #28 pingjockey

best funny movie ever IMHO.

31 pharmmajor  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:32:24am

We need English teachers at these events so they can go around correcting nonsensical phrases like these, and also handing out F's to everyone.

32 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:33:03am

I do not like it when bad grammar is used to attract attention. Oy vey.

33 pingjockey  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:33:14am

re: #29 Ojoe

That's good! My better half has all kinds of astrology, numerology books. I leave the mystical stuff up to her. She is from Wales, so I figure there's Druids in her family tree somewhere!

34 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:34:01am

re: #29 Ojoe

It is hard not to use "cool."

***

I had a friend, who when asked what his "sign" was, would reply:

"I'm sorry, I don't speak granola."

Somebody once asked my son, "Who's your favorite teenage mutant ninja turtle?"

He said, "I don't speak Russian."

35 pingjockey  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:34:47am

re: #32 PhillyPretzel
Bad grammar can be used to make a point...Halp uz Jon Kary we iz stuk in Irak. But bad grammar, spelling out of not paying attention, yeah that bugs me too.

36 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:34:52am

re: #31 pharmmajor

We need English teachers at these events so they can go around correcting nonsensical phrases like these, and also handing out F's to everyone.

Love it. We should send Cato to these events with a big red marker and a "Punctuation Police" t-shirt.

37 pingjockey  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:36:10am

BBIAB

38 Ojoe  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:37:04am

BBL

39 Sigma_x  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:39:38am

Little O/T but not really.

There's been some dustup over last week's episode of South Park where they made fun of Muhammad.

And so but some homegrown Islamo-douche has been calling for fellow psychos to hunt down Trey Parker and Matt Stone and kill them, even going so far as to post the address of their offices in LA on a facebook page.

But (and here's the funny part) he issued his little "fatwa" on Twitter. And so a few smart asses started following him, just to be stupid, I guess.

So he tweeted this tweet that said, "LOL at all the Kufar who have just decided to follow me. Have fun Hutharees."

And so my question is (aside from how does some wanna-bee tough guy terrorist expect to be taken seriously writing "LOL"?) is the word Hutharee some arabic insult, or is it in reference to that Hutaree militia in MI that was just busted. I'm confused.

40 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:39:54am

re: #33 pingjockey

That's good! My better half has all kinds of astrology, numerology books. I leave the mystical stuff up to her. She is from Wales, so I figure there's Druids in her family tree somewhere!

In another incarnation, long, long ago, I was a card reader. Well, you name it, I'd read it. Cards, palms, tea leaves. Was pretty good, too, I must say! Had my own groupies and everything.

My grandmother's family is Hungarian. I always suspected we had some gypsy blood in there somewhere.

41 Lidane  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:43:01am

re: #31 pharmmajor

We need English teachers at these events so they can go around correcting nonsensical phrases like these, and also handing out F's to everyone.

I'm totally in favor of this. There should be a legion of teachers like the one from the Fairly Oddparents grading these signs:

Heh.

42 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:43:16am

re: #11 SanFranciscoZionist

OY.

One of the best expressions, evah.
It just says it all.

43 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:44:24am

re: #39 Sigma_x

Little O/T but not really.

There's been some dustup over last week's episode of South Park where they made fun of Muhammad.

And so but some homegrown Islamo-douche has been calling for fellow psychos to hunt down Trey Parker and Matt Stone and kill them, even going so far as to post the address of their offices in LA on a facebook page.

But (and here's the funny part) he issued his little "fatwa" on Twitter. And so a few smart asses started following him, just to be stupid, I guess.

So he tweeted this tweet that said, "LOL at all the Kufar who have just decided to follow me. Have fun Hutharees."

And so my question is (aside from how does some wanna-bee tough guy terrorist expect to be taken seriously writing "LOL"?) is the word Hutharee some arabic insult, or is it in reference to that Hutaree militia in MI that was just busted. I'm confused.

Suspect the latter. I imagine 'Hutaree' is now the terrorist version of 'honky'.

44 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:46:47am

re: #39 Sigma_x

Little O/T but not really.

There's been some dustup over last week's episode of South Park where they made fun of Muhammad.

And so but some homegrown Islamo-douche has been calling for fellow psychos to hunt down Trey Parker and Matt Stone and kill them, even going so far as to post the address of their offices in LA on a facebook page.

But (and here's the funny part) he issued his little "fatwa" on Twitter. And so a few smart asses started following him, just to be stupid, I guess.

So he tweeted this tweet that said, "LOL at all the Kufar who have just decided to follow me. Have fun Hutharees."

And so my question is (aside from how does some wanna-bee tough guy terrorist expect to be taken seriously writing "LOL"?) is the word Hutharee some arabic insult, or is it in reference to that Hutaree militia in MI that was just busted. I'm confused.

I agree with SFZ on that.

Was this a new Mohammed show? Or a repeat of the one they did a few years back.

Making fun of Mohammed is so 2005 anyway.

45 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:48:03am

Wow. Zvonareva just went into a fantastic meltdown. Obliterated her racquet, then kicked it. Good for her. She's getting annihilated...

46 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:48:05am

Political discourse relies on the ability to express one point of view, especially to those who do not already agree with it.

Part of it is a basic command of the language, but a lot of it is the ability and willingness to hear opposing points of view and accept the fact that the person holding it is not necessarily an evil extremist.

I find these abilities severely lacking in America of late, which I think is a major contributing factor to the decline of the level of debate and discourse in the country.

47 Sigma_x  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:48:18am

re: #44 marjoriemoon

I agree with SFZ on that.

Was this a new Mohammed show? Or a repeat of the one they did a few years back.

Making fun of Mohammed is so 2005 anyway.

No, it's a new one. And, yeah, it does seem a little dated. But it was still funny as fuck. They were making fun of celebrities who wanted to steal Muhammad's "super power" which is to be made fun of. It took the piss out of Tom Cruise more than Muhammad.

48 Sigma_x  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:48:45am

re: #47 Sigma_x

Sorry - his super power is that he CAN'T be made fun of.

49 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:49:41am

re: #47 Sigma_x

No, it's a new one. And, yeah, it does seem a little dated. But it was still funny as fuck. They were making fun of celebrities who wanted to steal Muhammad's "super power" which is to be made fun of. It took the piss out of Tom Cruise more than Muhammad.

So they're are attacking Scientology as well? Just wait until L. Ron Habib turns his mind powers on them!

50 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:50:11am

re: #44 marjoriemoon

I agree with SFZ on that. Was this a new Mohammed show? Or a repeat of the one they did a few years back. Making fun of Mohammed is so 2005 anyway.

They shouldn't be making fun of Mohammed, any more than things like "pissing on Allah's name" and mocking the Mormons (up and coming broadway musical by the South Park guys). We really should be trying to understand the different religious cultures, not trying to fight them all the time.

51 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:50:21am

re: #47 Sigma_x

No, it's a new one. And, yeah, it does seem a little dated. But it was still funny as fuck. They were making fun of celebrities who wanted to steal Muhammad's "super power" which is to never [FTFY] be made fun of. It took the piss out of Tom Cruise more than Muhammad.

But I like the new Mecha-Streisand Godzilla monster.

52 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:50:34am

re: #45 Aceofwhat?

Wow. Zvonareva just went into a fantastic meltdown. Obliterated her racquet, then kicked it. Good for her. She's getting annihilated...

What kind of racket was she into?

53 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:51:33am

re: #52 Walter L. Newton

What kind of racket was she into?

A Penn. Not Sean, but he wouldn't have stood a chance either/

54 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:51:56am

re: #47 Sigma_x

No, it's a new one. And, yeah, it does seem a little dated. But it was still funny as fuck. They were making fun of celebrities who wanted to steal Muhammad's "super power" which is to be made fun of. It took the piss out of Tom Cruise more than Muhammad.

hehe I do love a good Tom Cruise bashing.

I stopped watching Southpark. They started to insult me. I don't like the ethnic jokes anymore, particularly the way Cartman declares "Jew". I know it's supposed to be funny and it was once, but not my cup of tea anymore.

55 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:52:39am

re: #51 Alouette

But I like the new Mecha-Streisand Godzilla monster.

That was funny. It's not funny anymore to me.

56 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:54:06am

re: #55 marjoriemoon

That was funny. It's not funny anymore to me.

So don't watch it. I think it's funny.

57 Political Atheist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:55:30am

O/T
Tamron has been unable to deliver a promised lens, and will be unable for a month. So in a slight change of plans I ordered one of the new Canon cameras, the 7D. Just got the plans for a home built steadycam rig that is reasonable easy to make.
Love to take that to a few protest rallies!

58 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:59:24am

Tea Party supporters are wealthier and more well-educated than the general public, according to the latest New York Times/CBS News poll.

I suppose that explains how they have so much free time for protesting, but one also has to wonder why the pollsters thought they needed to look into this aspect in the first place.

Maybe, for some strange reason, they thought they would find a different result?//

59 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:59:45am

re: #50 Walter L. Newton

They shouldn't be making fun of Mohammed, any more than things like "pissing on Allah's name" and mocking the Mormons (up and coming broadway musical by the South Park guys). We really should be trying to understand the different religious cultures, not trying to fight them all the time.

Well that's kind of their shtick. To piss off everyone. And there probably isn't a group of people they haven't targeted.

There's a fine line with ethnic humor. I'm wondering to do it effectively, you don't have to be a member of the group you're laughing at. Catholics make funny Catholic jokes. Jews, funny Jewish jokes. Blacks, Asians, etc. Otherwise it doesn't come across very well. Well that's not a hard and fast rule, but I certainly think it's more difficult to do "crossover" ethnic humor.

60 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:59:58am

re: #55 marjoriemoon


I kinda ran into the same problem with the series as I did with the Simpsons: once it became a cultural institution, it grew a bit too self-conscious and lost its edge.

61 Virginia Plain  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:01:08am

re: #59 marjoriemoon

Well that's not a hard and fast rule, but I certainly think it's more difficult to do "crossover" ethnic humor.

Russell Peters does that well.

62 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:01:19am

re: #59 marjoriemoon

Well that's kind of their shtick. To piss off everyone. And there probably isn't a group of people they haven't targeted.

There's a fine line with ethnic humor. I'm wondering to do it effectively, you don't have to be a member of the group you're laughing at. Catholics make funny Catholic jokes. Jews, funny Jewish jokes. Blacks, Asians, etc. Otherwise it doesn't come across very well. Well that's not a hard and fast rule, but I certainly think it's more difficult to do "crossover" ethnic humor.

"Life of Brian" is a classic, but just think how much funnier it would have been if Mel Brooks had made it instead of Monty Python.

63 pharmmajor  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:01:36am

re: #50 Walter L. Newton

They shouldn't be making fun of Mohammed, any more than things like "pissing on Allah's name" and mocking the Mormons (up and coming broadway musical by the South Park guys). We really should be trying to understand the different religious cultures, not trying to fight them all the time.

"You know what? A society where anyone can make jokes about anyone else and everyone laughs is a truly tolerant society. Political-correctness charged censorship only serves to engender resentment and distance between social groups."
- Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw

64 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:03:10am

re: #61 Virginia Plain

Russell Peters does that well.

great call. he's hysterical.

65 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:03:11am

re: #59 marjoriemoon

Some of the best Jewish joikes ever come from Jews. I think they even pioneered the study of "Hebonics", without which the following joke would be incomprehensible:

Four Jewish ladies meet to play Mah-Jongg.

First Jewish lady: Oy!
Second Jewish lady: Oy, veh is' mir!
Third Jewish lady: Oy, veh, gevalt!
Fourth Jewish lady: I thought we weren't going to talk about the children!

66 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:03:24am

phone brb

67 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:03:39am

re: #62 Alouette

"Life of Brian" is a classic, but just think how much funnier it would have been if Mel Brooks had made it instead of Monty Python.

slanderous!

68 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:04:34am

re: #67 Aceofwhat?

slanderous!

Just think if Mel Brooks had done "The Passion of Christ"!

69 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:05:17am

re: #50 Walter L. Newton

We really should be trying to understand the different religious cultures

Good luck with that.

How does one understand any number of utterly conflicting messages from who knows where; all at the same time?

70 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:08:07am

There was a comic figure from German cinema, Vater Braun, who once said in a film that "Humor has something of the Divine in it: in order to be able to laugh at things, you have to stand above them".

71 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:10:23am

re: #70 ralphieboy

There was a comic figure from German cinema, Vater Braun, who once said in a film that "Humor has something of the Divine in it: in order to be able to laugh at things, you have to stand above them".

Right... in order to laugh at someone, you need to believe you are better than them.

72 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:11:23am

re: #68 ralphieboy

Just think if Mel Brooks had done "The Passion of Christ"!

It might be something like this.

73 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:11:42am

Not at all, you just have to be able to put youself at a healthy distance.

74 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:16:54am

re: #73 ralphieboy

Not at all, you just have to be able to put youself at a healthy distance.

I see... that's the PC version of humor... you're not laughing at them, you're just standing far enough away so that no one knows what you are laughing at.

Bullshit. Humor is all based on the travails of others. It's human nature to laugh at it. And no amount of your PC spinning will change that.

Go ahead and laugh, and be proud of it.

75 bratwurst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:18:54am

re: #74 Walter L. Newton


Bullshit. Humor is all based on the travails of others. It's human nature to laugh at it. And no amount of your PC spinning will change that.

So in your view there is no such thing as laughing with someone, only laughing at them?

76 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:19:18am

re: #74 Walter L. Newton

I see... that's the PC version of humor... you're not laughing at them, you're just standing far enough away so that no one knows what you are laughing at.

Bullshit. Humor is all based on the travails of others. It's human nature to laugh at it. And no amount of your PC spinning will change that.

Go ahead and laugh, and be proud of it.

Yes, our laughter is often an expression of relief that the hammer fell on someone else's foot, not ours.

But one does have to have a bit of the divine spark to be able to laugh at oneself. And I believe that those who cannot are truly lacking in it

77 cenotaphium  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:26:53am

re: #74 Walter L. Newton

Bullshit. Humor is all based on the travails of others.

Bullshit. Not all humor is schadenfreude. Personally, I'm a sucker for puns and comedic juxtaposition. If you've seen Monty Python, you know what I'm talking about. Or try this image, which always tickles me.

Of all the silly things to grandstand about, just to make a cheap political point..

78 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:27:07am

re: #31 pharmmajor

These folks are proud of their ignorance. Shows they are good ole boys and girls. They got the bible and its all the education they want.

79 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:28:57am

re: #78 Macha

These folks are proud of their ignorance. Shows they are good ole boys and girls. They got the bible and its all the education they want.

No, no, you've fallen behind on the buzz. Now they're better educated than the average American.

Which makes this inability to cope with apostrophes all the more worrisome.

80 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:30:34am

re: #40 marjoriemoon

In another incarnation, long, long ago, I was a card reader. Well, you name it, I'd read it. Cards, palms, tea leaves. Was pretty good, too, I must say! Had my own groupies and everything.

My grandmother's family is Hungarian. I always suspected we had some gypsy blood in there somewhere.

Can you still do it? I have a friend who reads Tarot cards. Her accuracy is uncanny. She works in a very specialized field of biology, but reads for fun in a shop on weekends.

81 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:31:08am

re: #79 SanFranciscoZionist

No, no, you've fallen behind on the buzz. Now they're better educated than the average American.

Which makes this inability to cope with apostrophes all the more worrisome.

Apostrophe's are elitist!!!

82 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:32:16am

re: #79 SanFranciscoZionist

Oh shoot. a day late and a dollar..... I missed that news. From the photos I've seen, I must need new glasses. Or maybe it is me that doesn't know how to spell. LOL

83 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:32:38am

Maybe those websites that do special deals for people on Palin or Beck's books can start bundling them with "Eats, Shoots and Leaves".

84 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:33:02am

re: #78 Macha

These folks are proud of their ignorance. Shows they are good ole boys and girls. They got the bible and its all the education they want.

totally. i mean, like, if we could just thin these Bibles out...we'd have this problem half-solved...

85 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:34:40am

These teabaggers just need to make a left at logic street and direct all this righteous anger at Wall Street. Just watched a great episode of Bill Moyers Journal regarding these issues:

[Link: www.pbs.org...]

Direct Video Link Here

SIMON JOHNSON AND JAMES KWAK
How did Big Finance grow so powerful that its hijinks nearly brought down the global economy – and what hope is there for real reform with Washington politicians on Wall Street's payroll? Bill Moyers talks with authors Simon Johnson and James Kwak, two of the nation's most respected economic experts and authors of the new book 13 BANKERS: THE WALL STREET TAKEOVER AND THE NEXT FINANCIAL MELTDOWN.

86 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:35:20am

re: #81 ralphieboy

Apostrophe's are elitist!!!

Something about that reminds me of Pol Pot's 'troops', who massacred people for wearing glasses, the logic being that if they could read, they were useless intellectuals corrupted by the West.

87 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:37:10am

re: #86 ryannon

Something about that reminds me of Pol Pot's 'troops', who massacred people for wearing glasses, the logic being that if they could read, they were useless intellectuals corrupted by the West.

good call - i didn't remember that until you posted it. although i don't remember Pol Pot's folks having a lot of bibles, so now i'm confused on another front...Macha...help me out here-

88 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:42:38am

The Khmer Rouge also classified by religion and ethnic group. They banned all religion and dispersed minority groups, forbidding them to speak their languages or to practice their customs. They especially targeted Buddhist monks, Muslims, Western-educated intellectuals, educated people in general, people who had contact with Western countries or with Vietnam, disabled people, and the ethnic Chinese, Laotians and Vietnamese. Some were put in the S-21 camp for interrogation involving torture in cases where a confession was useful to the government. Many others were summarily executed. Confessions forced at S-21 were extracted from prisoners through such methods as raising prisoners by their arms tied behind and dislocating shoulders, removing toenails with pliers, suffocating a prisoner repeatedly, and skinning a person while alive.[citation needed]

People were treated as opponents based on their appearance or background. Torture was widespread. In some instances, throats were slit as prisoners were tied to metal bed frames.
Thousands of politicians and bureaucrats accused of association with previous governments were executed. Phnom Penh was turned into a ghost city, while people in the countryside were dying of starvation or illnesses or simply killed.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

89 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:44:47am

re: #83 SanFranciscoZionist

Maybe those websites that do special deals for people on Palin or Beck's books can start bundling them with "Eats, Shoots and Leaves".

I just finished "Far from the Madding Gerund". Loved it-

bbiab

90 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:46:46am

re: #85 Locker

These teabaggers just need to make a left at logic street and direct all this righteous anger at Wall Street. Just watched a great episode of Bill Moyers Journal regarding these issues:

[Link: www.pbs.org...]

Direct Video Link Here

It was a very good episode.
I always call BMJ as TV people should be watching, the ep of This American Life that was referenced was good too.
And no one should talk about Wall Street without watching the shoe Frontline did on Brooksley Born and her campaign against derivatives.
[Link: www.pbs.org...]

BTW, I just read (wish I could remember where) that Clinton has admitted he should have paid more attention and regrets not listening to her.

I would take the tea party folks just a bit more seriously if they were supporting more regulation of the banking industry and Wall Street, but that is not what I am seeing. All I see is everything Obama is bad because....

91 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:47:43am

Virtually all Cambodians who had received even moderate levels of formal education prior to the revolution, such as civil servants and intellectuals, were eliminated in stages in a series of purges. Each successive purge called for the slaughter of those further down the hierarchy.[62] Among those specifically targeted were people who wore eyeglasses, which were symbols of reading and learning; Pol Pot perceived such individuals as threats because they were carriers of the ideas of the pre-revolutionary culture. As one Khmer Rouge leader said in 1975, "We have some people among us who still wear eyeglasses. And why do they use eyeglasses? Can't they see me? If I move to slap your face and you flinch, then you see well enough. People wear them to be handsome in the capitalist style. They wear them to be vain. We don't need people like that any more."[63] In time, educated people were virtually nonexistent in Cambodia.

[Link: www.discoverthenetworks.org...]

92 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:50:39am

re: #87 Aceofwhat?

Don't feel like playing with you today. See if you can get a rise out of someone else.

93 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:51:30am

An awful lot of Tea party ideology and iconography seems to be deeply rooted in the old Presbyterian/Calvinist belief that personal wealth is an outward sign of inner grace: those who are rich got that way because God favors them for being morally superior.

That would make them hesitant to attack the banks and Wall Street, which they still somehow manage see as a "victim" of government overregulation and interference.

As long as Wall Street can sell this image (while still benefitting from a government bailout) they are enjoying the Best of Both Worlds.

94 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:53:01am

Ace always gets a 'rise' out of me,

*wink, wink*

95 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:54:46am

re: #93 ralphieboy

can anyone remember the name of the 'affordable housing thing' that people like to blame the collapse on? I was getting in an argument with my parents about it, but I can't remember the name of the program they blame to do research.

The meme in question is the "The Government made banks take out bad loans, thats why they did it"

96 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:55:27am

re: #88 ryannon

Selecting out enemies based on appearance reminds me of what a friend of mine told me. She was a child in WWII. Her father was Dutch, her mother Indonesian. When the Japanese invaded, they lined everyone in the town up. Blue eyes went to prison camp, brown eyes stayed in the village. She had brown eyes, as did her mother. Her father and 10 yo brother were sent to prison camp. They were used as prisoners on ships to deter the Americans from bombing them.

97 Henchman Ghazi-808  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:57:21am

re: #95 windsagio

can anyone remember the name of the 'affordable housing thing' that people like to blame the collapse on? I was getting in an argument with my parents about it, but I can't remember the name of the program they blame to do research.

The meme in question is the "The Government made banks take out bad loans, thats why they did it"

It's called CRA, and it's not the cause of the financial meltdown. It was a contributing factor, but not the cause.

Just as the meltdown cannot be hung solely on capitalism, neither can it be solely hung on liberalism.

98 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:57:56am

re: #95 windsagio

can anyone remember the name of the 'affordable housing thing' that people like to blame the collapse on? I was getting in an argument with my parents about it, but I can't remember the name of the program they blame to do research.

The meme in question is the "The Government made banks take out bad loans, thats why they did it"

I remember reading analyses pointing to that. I have no idea if it's a meme or a fact.

99 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:58:16am

re: #78 Macha

These folks are proud of their ignorance. Shows they are good ole boys and girls. They got the bible and its all the education they want.

Interesting comment from someone who used "its", instead of the correct "it's".

100 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:58:38am

re: #97 BigPapa

Oh yeah 'community reinvestment act'. Thanks. Gonna read up on it myself :p

101 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:59:24am

re: #98 ryannon

A family friend who I fing really annoying, but who's a bigwig in WA is all about that. I desperately wanna shoot him down :p

/yay family politics! Also, Kemper Freeman can kiss my ass!

102 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:59:57am

re: #99 reine.de.tout

Mea Culpa. I still get those mixed up.

103 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:00:02pm

re: #95 windsagio

can anyone remember the name of the 'affordable housing thing' that people like to blame the collapse on? I was getting in an argument with my parents about it, but I can't remember the name of the program they blame to do research.

The meme in question is the "The Government made banks take out bad loans, thats why they did it"


The Commnity Reinvestment Plan, I believe. But those loans were insured and backed by the government.

Which was not the case with all the other loans the banks started making in droves, those adjustable-rate mortgages they started handing out to anyone who could sign on the line, and then rebundle and securitize those loans, leading to billions in toxic assets...

Well, the government let them, which is almost the same, just like allowing abortions is the same as killing babies.

104 Henchman Ghazi-808  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:00:23pm

re: #95 windsagio


The meme in question is the "The Government made banks take out bad loans, thats why they did it"

That's Tea Party logic; Them Libruls!

105 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:00:53pm

re: #99 reine.de.tout

Interesting comment from someone who used "its", instead of the correct "it's".

HARDBALL!

106 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:01:54pm

re: #101 windsagio

A family friend who I fing really annoying, but who's a bigwig in WA is all about that. I desperately wanna shoot him down :p

/yay family politics! Also, Kemper Freeman can kiss my ass!

As said above, a contributing factor, but certainly not the sole cause.

107 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:01:56pm

re: #91 ryannon

Virtually all Cambodians who had received even moderate levels of formal education prior to the revolution, such as civil servants and intellectuals, were eliminated in stages in a series of purges. Each successive purge called for the slaughter of those further down the hierarchy.[62] Among those specifically targeted were people who wore eyeglasses, which were symbols of reading and learning; Pol Pot perceived such individuals as threats because they were carriers of the ideas of the pre-revolutionary culture. As one Khmer Rouge leader said in 1975, "We have some people among us who still wear eyeglasses. And why do they use eyeglasses? Can't they see me? If I move to slap your face and you flinch, then you see well enough. People wear them to be handsome in the capitalist style. They wear them to be vain. We don't need people like that any more."[63] In time, educated people were virtually nonexistent in Cambodia.

[Link: www.discoverthenetworks.org...]

What would they have done to Noam chomsky?

108 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:02:23pm

re: #103 ralphieboy

The Commnity Reinvestment Plan, I believe. But those loans were insured and backed by the government.

Which was not the case with all the other loans the banks started making in droves, those adjustable-rate mortgages they started handing out to anyone who could sign on the line, and then rebundle and securitize those loans, leading to billions in toxic assets...
...

Exactly what I was thinking.

The banks ran with whatever they could get.

109 Henchman Ghazi-808  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:02:27pm

I'm awaiting an apostrophe flounce. Would that be a new one?

110 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:02:40pm

Sometimes apostrohes can be dangerous:

"He did not want to go off to become a priest and leave his little brothers behind."

vs.


"He did not want to go off to become a priest and leave his little brother's behind."

111 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:02:49pm

re: #107 Alouette

No such luck.

112 Dancing along the light of day  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:03:09pm

re: #1 Thanos

It's the misplaced apostrophes of the teapocalypse.

Rotating title nomination!

113 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:03:30pm

re: #108 reine.de.tout

but are happy to not take the blame >>

Off to google!!

114 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:04:58pm

re: #113 windsagio

but are happy to not take the blame >>

Off to google!!


Google well, my friend.
Find all sorts of links that will convince you to think more like me.

*laughing at my silly self here*

115 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:06:14pm

re: #80 Macha

Can you still do it? I have a friend who reads Tarot cards. Her accuracy is uncanny. She works in a very specialized field of biology, but reads for fun in a shop on weekends.

Sorry... I was doing the Sunday Afternoon Moon Family Telephone Relay :)

I haven't for years. It's a practice like anything else, if you stop doing it, you lose some ability.

116 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:06:41pm

re: #114 reine.de.tout

yeah good luck :p

<3

117 njdhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:07:01pm

re: #95 windsagio


The meme in question is the "The Government made banks take out bad loans, thats why they did it"

The guidelines the banks use were written to make it easier for people with bad credit to get a mortgage to buy a new house or refinance. I remember 109% loans were available at one point. There were also No Doc loans available up to 90%. That was a crazy time. If I'm not mistaken Barney Frank & Chris Dodd were somehow responsible for the change in the loan guidelines.

118 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:07:22pm

re: #99 reine.de.tout

Interesting comment from someone who used "its", instead of the correct "it's".

ZING!

119 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:08:51pm

re: #89 Aceofwhat?

I just finished "Far from the Madding Gerund". Loved it-

bbiab

Is that by the same author?

120 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:09:29pm

What shoule happen to all those who confuse their its and it's:

121 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:09:31pm

re: #118 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Its a tough room.

/

122 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:10:25pm

Man, theres something that came up last night that I wanna ask about, but I"m afraid of a tough reaction, if I bring it up will people gimme an 'out' if I need it? >>

Its wildly OT.

123 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:11:12pm

re: #102 Macha

Mea Culpa. I still get those mixed up.

But others who make apostrophe mistakes are stupid.

Must be cool to be so cool.

124 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:11:17pm

re: #122 windsagio

Man, theres something that came up last night that I wanna ask about, but I"m afraid of a tough reaction, if I bring it up will people gimme an 'out' if I need it? >>

Its wildly OT.

I'm all ears, can't wait.

125 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:11:36pm

re: #122 windsagio

Man, theres something that came up last night that I wanna ask about, but I"m afraid of a tough reaction, if I bring it up will people gimme an 'out' if I need it? >>

Its wildly OT.

That's a hellofa an opener. You know you have to go for it now.

126 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:12:04pm

re: #122 windsagio

Man, theres something that came up last night that I wanna ask about, but I"m afraid of a tough reaction, if I bring it up will people gimme an 'out' if I need it? >>

Its wildly OT.

Don't be such a pussy. Drink the beer! - Mr Garrison's Devil Conscience

127 njdhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:12:11pm

re: #118 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

ZING!

Hot sauce update:
Remember when I told you I sent a case & a half of my hot sauce to Afghanistan? I got my first email the other day. My hot sauce is now on the front lines of the war on terror. How cool is that?

128 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:12:15pm

re: #125 marjoriemoon

haha well it involves you :p


But I'll ask then;

Do you really think Jerusalem is the Center of the Universe?

129 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:12:39pm

re: #128 windsagio

haha well it involves you :p

But I'll ask then;

Do you really think Jerusalem is the Center of the Universe?

rofl

oy oy gevalt!

130 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:12:40pm

re: #123 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

it is wildly illogical, it + aspostrophe s would seem to indicate the possessive, when it's not...

131 Racer X  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:12:48pm

I'm starting to like these Tea Party guys.

132 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:12:54pm

re: #129 marjoriemoon

You can see why I was hesitant :P

133 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:12:58pm

re: #127 njdhockeyfan

Used as a weapon or a condiment?

134 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:13:48pm

re: #127 njdhockeyfan

Hot sauce update:
Remember when I told you I sent a case & a half of my hot sauce to Afghanistan? I got my first email the other day. My hot sauce is now on the front lines of the war on terror. How cool is that?

As a veteran who is extremely familiar with eating MREs 3 times a day and only finding one tiny bottle of Tabasco in the Spaghetti selection I applaud and salute you. Nothing was need more or better at spicing up cold military rations. Good looking out.

135 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:13:53pm

re: #128 windsagio

haha well it involves you :p

But I'll ask then;

Do you really think Jerusalem is the Center of the Universe?

The center of the Jewish universe, yes. Or did I leave that part out?

But also, if you think of the 2 other great religions, Christianity and Islam, they originate from Judaism, so in that regard, yes.

136 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:13:53pm

re: #130 ralphieboy

it is wildly illogical, it + aspostrophe s would seem to indicate the possessive, when it's not...

It apostrophe s is also a contraction for "It is".

137 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:14:25pm

re: #130 ralphieboy

I have actually considered giving up apostrophes once and for all. I screw them up all of the time. You'd think with four years of Grammar I, I would have picked up the basics.

138 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:14:41pm

re: #123 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Don't worry Macha - it's all part of being a bit new. What's even worse is when no one ever responds to your posts.

139 njdhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:14:49pm

re: #133 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Used as a weapon or a condiment?

Can be used as either. I want a picture of a jar of my hot sauce sitting next to a dead terrorist.

140 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:15:03pm

re: #135 marjoriemoon

Fair enough, just wanted to make absolutely-freakin'-sure you didn't mean in the medieval sense, which was how I brought it up last night :D

141 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:15:45pm

re: #139 njdhockeyfan

Can be used as either. I want a picture of a jar of my hot sauce sitting next to a dead terrorist.

Personally I was picturing a bunch of GIs sitting around full, happy and smiling with empty bottles of your sauce lying all over the place.

142 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:16:42pm

re: #141 Locker

Personally I was picturing a bunch of GIs sitting around full, happy and smiling with empty bottles of your sauce lying all over the place.

Could they be sitting on dead terrorists?

143 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:17:07pm

re: #128 windsagio

haha well it involves you :p

But I'll ask then;

Do you really think Jerusalem is the Center of the Universe?

No silly.
That would be the planet Oa, home of the Guardians of the Universe.

Jerusalem is a place of major importance.

144 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:17:44pm

re: #143 reine.de.tout

Good Geek answer!

145 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:17:53pm
146 njdhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:17:54pm

re: #141 Locker

Personally I was picturing a bunch of GIs sitting around full, happy and smiling with empty bottles of your sauce lying all over the place.

That would be great too. Here is the email I got on Friday:

Tried some of your hot sauce out here in Kandahar Afghanistan, and really enjoyed it. Has good flavor and keeps getting warmer, keep up the good work.
Matt

147 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:17:59pm

re: #142 ralphieboy

Could they be sitting on dead terrorists?

I've known some hard core guys in the Military but no one I've ever met had an appetite around a dead body, terrorist or no...

148 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:18:00pm

re: #127 njdhockeyfan

Hot sauce update:
Remember when I told you I sent a case & a half of my hot sauce to Afghanistan? I got my first email the other day. My hot sauce is now on the front lines of the war on terror. How cool is that?

Mazal tov! Is it being used as a condiment or a chemical weapon?

149 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:18:00pm

re: #137 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I have actually considered giving up apostrophes once and for all. I screw them up all of the time. You'd think with four years of Grammar I, I would have picked up the basics.

You could also just go into the sattv4u2 business, and just use a load of commas everywhere.

Once I got accustomed to satt, it didn't bother me anymore.

150 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:18:33pm

re: #140 windsagio

Fair enough, just wanted to make absolutely-freakin'-sure you didn't mean in the medieval sense, which was how I brought it up last night :D

My love for Israel comes from being Jewish. That's true, but I think if I wasn't Jewish, I would still hold the same feelings about Israel, which we were talking about last night. Why I pointed out to you that completely and totally separate from religion, Israelis contribute a huge amount to how people live their lives all over the planet.

151 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:18:41pm

re: #131 Racer X

I'm starting to like these Tea Party guys.

There's something kind of cute about them, I have to admit.

152 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:19:09pm

re: #146 njdhockeyfan

What can I say... that's fantastic. If even one guy takes the time to sit down and write to you then you can be assured there 100s of others he speaks for but are too lazy to write it. Exceedingly cool.

153 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:19:33pm

re: #150 marjoriemoon

I remember :D

I'm in too good a mood to tackle that right now, the 'center' thing just bugged me all night at work >>

*sad, I know*

154 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:20:22pm

re: #149 reine.de.tout

You could also just go into the sattv4u2 business, and just use a load of commas everywhere.

Once I got accustomed to satt, it didn't bother me anymore.

I haven't really been following this punctuation wars thread very much but that made me laugh Reine. How you doing today? Youngster make it back ok from her little trip?

155 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:20:38pm

re: #141 Locker

Personally I was picturing a bunch of GIs sitting around full, happy and smiling with empty bottles of your sauce lying all over the place.

I think that would make a better advertisement, certainly.

156 njdhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:22:40pm

re: #152 Locker

What can I say... that's fantastic. If even one guy takes the time to sit down and write to you then you can be assured there 100s of others he speaks for but are too lazy to write it. Exceedingly cool.

The Outlaws (the band), Phil Donahue, Marlo Thomas, and Roseanne Cash all have a jar and like it. That's pretty cool but what got me really excited was that email from the Air Force guy. I am still blown away by that email.

157 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:23:10pm

re: #155 SanFranciscoZionist

I dunno, I keep thinking of the ol' Pace ad, but replacing NJ with "New Your City?!"

158 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:24:05pm

re: #150 marjoriemoon

My love for Israel comes from being Jewish. That's true, but I think if I wasn't Jewish, I would still hold the same feelings about Israel, which we were talking about last night. Why I pointed out to you that completely and totally separate from religion, Israelis contribute a huge amount to how people live their lives all over the planet.

Good post and it really made me think. Not only am I not Jewish but I'm not religious in any sense, Agnostic is the closest description. Personally, my feelings about Israel are similar to say... England. Currently an ally of my country, promoting and supporting a way of life similar to my own.

I don't believe in any sort of religious mandate or whatever so I don't really think that anyone, including Jews, have a divine right to anything. You take what you can, you hold it as long as you can and you try to propagate your way of doing things. They just happen to be on our side at the moment.

159 njdhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:25:47pm

Later lizards...time for more yard & garden work.

161 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:26:06pm

re: #158 Locker


I disagree with a lot of Israeli policy on settlements, but I certainly support their right to exist as a state.

162 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:26:09pm

re: #123 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

But others who make apostrophe mistakes are stupid.

Must be cool to be so cool.

I see we are going to beat this horse to death. It wasn't a single apostrophe mistake to which I was referring, while making a similar mistake myself (perhaps that was karma jumping up to get me). It was the wealth of signs with spelling errors, which we have all seen in numerous photos, and the anti-education stances taken by many of the teabaggers, particularly those from the religious right, that I was targeting. It is a tough room.

Now, should I start watching to see how many LGF folks end their sentences with a preposition? I think not. That would be stupid.

163 Kragar  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:26:24pm
164 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:27:04pm

re: #162 Macha

I see we are going to beat this horse to death. It wasn't a single apostrophe mistake to which I was referring, while making a similar mistake myself (perhaps that was karma jumping up to get me). It was the wealth of signs with spelling errors, which we have all seen in numerous photos, and the anti-education stances taken by many of the teabaggers, particularly those from the religious right, that I was targeting. It is a tough room.

Now, should I start watching to see how many LGF folks end their sentences with a preposition? I think not. That would be stupid.


That's where it's at!

165 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:27:06pm

re: #162 Macha

Where's the preposition at?

166 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:28:23pm

re: #160 Alkmyst

Yup, the Tea Parties are totally about racism, nothing more.

Somebody sounds defensive >>

167 njdhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:29:07pm

re: #160 Alkmyst

Yup, the Tea Parties are totally about racism, nothing more.

How fucked up is this?

ALBANY, N.Y. — They've been called Oreos, traitors and Uncle Toms, and are used to having to defend their values. Now black conservatives are really taking heat for their involvement in the mostly white tea party movement — and for having the audacity to oppose the policies of the nation's first black president.

"I've been told I hate myself. I've been called an Uncle Tom. I've been told I'm a spook at the door," said Timothy F. Johnson, chairman of the Frederick Douglass Foundation, a group of black conservatives who support free market principles and limited government.

"Black Republicans find themselves always having to prove who they are. Because the assumption is the Republican Party is for whites and the Democratic Party is for blacks," he said.

168 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:29:21pm

re: #165 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Where's the preposition at?

Can't we talk about Verbs instead?

169 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:29:27pm

re: #160 Alkmyst

ALso; seriously, nice strawman. "Only" my ass.

170 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:29:29pm

re: #161 ralphieboy

re: #163 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

What the hell is Cosplay? Is that some new derivative of DailyKos?

171 njdhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:29:37pm

Yard work is calling....bye.

172 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:29:58pm

re: #153 windsagio

I remember :D

I'm in too good a mood to tackle that right now, the 'center' thing just bugged me all night at work >>

*sad, I know*

Sorry. Didn't mean to ruin your evening!

"Next year in Jerusalem." It's something we say at holidays and has many meanings, really. Here's an interesting article from a Jewish perspective, both religious and secular about that sentiment.

[Link: www.myjewishlearning.com...]

The end paragraph:

Every year, he writes, Jews drink four cups of wine and then pour a fifth for Elijah. "The cup is poured, but not yet drunk. Yet the cup of hope is poured every year. Passover is the night for reckless dreams; for visions about what a human being can be, what society can be, what people can be, what history may become. That is the significance of 'Le-shanah ha-ba-a b'Yerushalayim' (Next year in Jerusalem)."

173 Kragar  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:30:20pm

re: #170 Alkmyst

re: #163 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

What the hell is Cosplay? Is that some new derivative of DailyKos?

Dressing up in costume for events

174 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:30:36pm

re: #166 windsagio

Somebody sounds defensive >>

This is the old polemic hyperbole argument. There have been enough signs and utterances at demonstrations to prove that there are racists among the TP supporters, but this does not make them all racists.

Now let's try and get back to some discourse and not just a mutual shouting match. We've had enough of that lately.

175 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:30:47pm

re: #165 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Where's the preposition at?

I could never learn to diagram a sentence. I hated it.

176 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:30:48pm

So no one is at Coachella?

177 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:30:50pm

re: #138 ryannon

Don't worry Macha - it's all part of being a bit new. What's even worse is when no one ever responds to your posts.

Is it kind of like being twelve and the kid that hits you does it cause he likes you?

178 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:31:03pm

re: #158 Locker

You take what you can, you hold it as long as you can and you try to propagate your way of doing things. They just happen to be on our side at the moment.

I can take that angle as well. Israel exists as a spiritual entity for some people, but it also exists as a simple political nation-state.

179 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:31:14pm

re: #163 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

Well, that an Cosplay

Danger, some of these images are eyesearing.

180 Linden Arden  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:31:27pm

re: #117 njdhockeyfan

The guidelines the banks use were written to make it easier for people with bad credit to get a mortgage to buy a new house or refinance. I remember 109% loans were available at one point. There were also No Doc loans available up to 90%. That was a crazy time. If I'm not mistaken Barney Frank & Chris Dodd were somehow responsible for the change in the loan guidelines.

The Community Reinvestment Act prevented redlining - it never "forced" a bank to change their loan requirements or risk profile.

The major failures of the crisis (Bear, Lehman, Merrill) were never subject to the CRA anyway. They were investment banks and therefore not subject to regulations on loans.

Commercial banks are subsidized by the taxpayer via the Federal Reserve and must not discriminate based on geography - thus the CRA.

That said - old CRA areas did well in the meltdown. It was the suburbs that lost their ass (and mainly in 4 states where over 50% of foreclosures have occured).

181 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:31:55pm

re: #170 Alkmyst

re: #163 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

What the hell is Cosplay? Is that some new derivative of DailyKos?

The activity of people who dress up in dostumes and "play". See also Renaissance Fair and Comic Book Convention.

182 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:32:27pm

re: #134 Locker

As a veteran who is extremely familiar with eating MREs 3 times a day and only finding one tiny bottle of Tabasco in the Spaghetti selection I applaud and salute you. Nothing was need more or better at spicing up cold military rations. Good looking out.

I have a friend who is going to deploy soon. I'm going to keep that in mind when sending a box of goodies.

183 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:32:56pm

re: #158 Locker

Good post and it really made me think. Not only am I not Jewish but I'm not religious in any sense, Agnostic is the closest description. Personally, my feelings about Israel are similar to say... England. Currently an ally of my country, promoting and supporting a way of life similar to my own.

I don't believe in any sort of religious mandate or whatever so I don't really think that anyone, including Jews, have a divine right to anything. You take what you can, you hold it as long as you can and you try to propagate your way of doing things. They just happen to be on our side at the moment.

Israel is the Jewish homeland and has been for some 3800 years so we have a different take on the whole matter. What can I tell you.

I also think people aren't aware of all the Israeli contributions. Maybe they would have different opinions if they knew.

184 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:33:05pm

re: #177 Macha

You got ponytails we can dip in the inkwell?

185 Jadespring  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:33:07pm

Afternoon all.

I'm done for the day it seems. I just finishing loosening and digging about 1000 sq feet of soil. Took me a few hours.

Time for tea and the couch and most likely a nap.

186 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:33:29pm

re: #177 Macha

Is it kind of like being twelve and the kid that hits you does it cause he likes you?

In FBV's case, I suspect it's pie-withdrawal symptoms.

187 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:33:38pm

For those of you who don't know me, I am posting these not because not because I have a vested interest, as I do not live in the U.S.

I'm pointing them out because as examples go, the last few have really been sub-par and grasping

188 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:34:22pm

re: #183 marjoriemoon

I think the problem is that the Israel issue is to entangled in matters of religion to discuss effectively (and that is in no way an attack, just makes it hard to come from very different points of reference :p)

It is occasionally fun for the aerobics aspect tho' ;)

189 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:34:55pm

re: #185 Jadespring

Gardening is starting all over!

190 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:35:11pm

re: #162 Macha

I see we are going to beat this horse to death. It wasn't a single apostrophe mistake to which I was referring, while making a similar mistake myself (perhaps that was karma jumping up to get me). It was the wealth of signs with spelling errors, which we have all seen in numerous photos, and the anti-education stances taken by many of the teabaggers, particularly those from the religious right, that I was targeting. It is a tough room.

Now, should I start watching to see how many LGF folks end their sentences with a preposition? I think not. That would be stupid.

And I would get an F. I also like to start may sentences with conjunctions. You know what I spoke of?

:P :P

191 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:35:23pm

re: #187 Alkmyst

For those of you who don't know me, I am posting these not because not because I have a vested interest, as I do not live in the U.S.

I'm pointing them out because as examples go, the last few have really been sub-par and grasping

You forgot to end your sentence with a period.

192 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:35:51pm

re: #182 Macha

I have a friend who is going to deploy soon. I'm going to keep that in mind when sending a box of goodies.

That's cool of you to remember and support your friends. It's hard to describe the lift you get from a piece of mail or especially a package when you are deployed in the field for a long period of time. Hot sauce is great because it adds a lot and needs no preparation. Frank's and Tapatio were particularly popular. Any sort of prepared food that was different was also great. Canned fruit, sardines, spam, etc.

Thank you for supporting our soldiers.

193 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:36:02pm

re: #187 Alkmyst

Your point of origin has nothing to do with the wrongness and even dishonesty of your post.

Its generally considered rude to misrepresent others' positions.

194 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:36:05pm

re: #187 Alkmyst

For those of you who don't know me, I am posting these not because not because I have a vested interest, as I do not live in the U.S.

I'm pointing them out because as examples go, the last few have really been sub-par and grasping

Well, THANK you.

195 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:36:50pm

Wow, SFZ is totally caught up with the thread for once :D

196 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:37:22pm

re: #191 ryannon

I ended it with the submit button

197 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:37:22pm

re: #192 Locker

I live on Tapatio.

198 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:37:58pm

re: #193 windsagio

Misrepresenting who, exactly?

199 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:38:15pm

You like dipping things?

200 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:38:26pm

re: #197 Stanley Sea

I live on Tapatio.

You and me both and it started in the Army. I have a big refiller bottle downstairs and a smaller bottle at work. Also have a bottle of Frank's for the wife.

201 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:39:01pm

re: #196 Alkmyst

I ended it with the submit button

Something tells me you should have never started it.

202 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:39:29pm

re: #198 Alkmyst

Misrepresenting the position of this blog really, by refuting the idea that 'the teaparty movement is all about race', which nobody on here has claimed.

203 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:40:12pm

I think we can agree that if you're going to take the time and effort to communicate your views on a sign at a rally, any rally, you should probably get the spelling down correctly.

I've been posting on the computer since the BBS days of the 80's. I could care less about other people's grammatical errors online. It's very hard at LGF because this board moves so fast, it's easy to make errors.

204 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:40:20pm

re: #199 Macha

You like dipping things?

You offering guacamole, or what?

205 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:40:29pm

re: #202 windsagio


I've heard it claimed here that it is mostly about race.

206 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:41:12pm

re: #203 marjoriemoon

I don't even sweat it anymore. I can tough out people complaining about my 'netspeak :D

207 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:41:41pm

re: #190 marjoriemoon


We had a real thrashing of language, dialects and usage in the previous thread.

I would like to assert that good English is English that is appropriate, not just English that corresponds to the way the British aristocracy spoke in the XIXth century.

But when our politicians are trying to bring across complex ideas in an international context, it is critical that they have a solid command of English. Politicians who cannot do this have no place in that setting.

208 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:41:49pm

re: #202 windsagio

That seems to be the general thrust of the recent articles, at least what I see in the RSS from here.

209 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:41:55pm

re: #198 Alkmyst

Misrepresenting who, exactly?

I would say that no one on this forum would say that the Tea Parties were 'about nothing but racism', even those of us who think they're pretty stupid, and think that there is a distinct racist element in the crowd.

Hence, striking back with a petty, OH, it's all about RACISM response is decidedly misrepresenting the argument.

Also, proving that there are some black Tea Partiers is not terribly relevent to the discussion. There are, this is true. It's also true that the movement is approximately 95% white. Neither of these facts sheds a whole lot of light on the motivation of those involved with the Tea Parties, although it does shed some light on who this whole concept appeals to.

210 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:42:00pm

re: #205 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Question is "All".

And really? The theme on here seems to essentially to be that the organizers are largely racist, but the actual protesters, not nearly so much.

211 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:42:45pm

re: #207 ralphieboy

Goddamnit, I missed a linguistics argument?

Now I'm a sad camper.

212 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:42:55pm

re: #205 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I've heard it claimed here that it is mostly about race.

I'd disagree with that proposition. I think it's mostly about round number 462 of the Culture Wars (TM).

213 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:43:37pm

re: #211 windsagio

Goddamnit, I missed a linguistics argument?

Now I'm a sad camper.


Somebody was making fun of Bush's pronounciation of "newkular" and it kinda took off from that...

214 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:44:23pm

re: #213 ralphieboy

We need more of those. The ebonics one (was it only last night?) was stellar.

215 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:45:03pm

And you see, Alkmyst, this is the thing. We argue about such things here, and people have different opinions. Hence, coming out of the myst with a couple of articles that are supposed to BLAM out of the water the idea you've decided all the LGFers agree with, on a thread where no one's saying anything of the sort, is sort of silly.

216 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:45:13pm

re: #214 windsagio

We need more of those. The ebonics one (was it only last night?) was stellar.


Sorry I missed that one. I grew up a white minority kid in Gary, Indiana. I am preetty well versed in Practical Ebonics.

217 Kragar  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:45:28pm

'Hizbullah a division of Syrian army'

Israel has warned Syrian President Bashar Assad that any missile attack against Israel by Hizbullah would result in retaliation against Syria, the Sunday Times reported on Sunday.

According to the UK paper, Israel’s missive – sent earlier in April – defined Hizbullah as a “division of the Syrian army,” a military branch of Damascus in Lebanon.

The warning was reportedly delivered to Damascus by a third party.

218 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:45:39pm

re: #154 Locker

I haven't really been following this punctuation wars thread very much but that made me laugh Reine. How you doing today? Youngster make it back ok from her little trip?

Locker, yes, she's fine and dandy, OF COURSE.
She's doing well, therefore, I am too.
She got scheduled for her 1st semester next year, tested out of 20 hours (that's a full semester and then some! Will give her some room to "play" and take courses she finds interesting).

She's already starting the uh-oh, maybe that isn't what I want to major in game. I told her not to fret, she'll figure out during this next year, no need to worry about it now.

219 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:46:16pm

re: #215 SanFranciscoZionist

You seem to assume I'm new here.

220 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:46:20pm

re: #215 SanFranciscoZionist

I'd say comin' on too strong was a forgivable newbie mistake, but "Lol 2004", also a blog ranting about moonbats.

/yes I'm a mean person sometimes.

221 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:46:28pm

re: #204 ryannon

You offering guacamole, or what?

Tapatio

222 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:46:48pm

re: #217 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

'Hizbullah a division of Syrian army'


Time to buy gold. We are looking at a scenario of Iran attacking Syria, Iran stepping in to defend Syria and the whole thing blowing sky-high...

223 Macha  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:48:22pm

It has been fun people. Gotta go, I'm burning daylight here and chores are calling.
BBl if possible tonight.

224 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:48:28pm

re: #216 ralphieboy

It was a fun convo really, started when someone called Charles 'arguably racist' for using the term teabonics.

225 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:48:41pm

re: #219 Alkmyst

You seem to assume I'm new here.

Let me guess...checks...YEP, class of 2004.

Actually, I don't care if you're new or not. You haven't been participating actively in the discussion taking place on the blog about the TPers, and then you decide to throw out a couple of articles (at least one posted before), and sit back all smug.

You got something to say, say it. What do you think about the Tea Parties?

226 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:48:55pm

re: #218 reine.de.tout

Locker, yes, she's fine and dandy, OF COURSE.
She's doing well, therefore, I am too.
She got scheduled for her 1st semester next year, tested out of 20 hours (that's a full semester and then some! Will give her some room to "play" and take courses she finds interesting).

She's already starting the uh-oh, maybe that isn't what I want to major in game. I told her not to fret, she'll figure out during this next year, no need to worry about it now.

Excellent advice and congratulations to her on testing results. Saves time and money but mostly it demonstrates a willingness to learn and prepare. I think she's going to do very well.

227 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:48:58pm

re: #219 Alkmyst

You seem to assume I'm new here.

HAHA.. another one from the class of 2004!
You guys are legendary!
/Whats you got old timer? Flounce bitch!
LOL

228 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:49:12pm

re: #177 Macha

Is it kind of like being twelve and the kid that hits you does it cause he likes you?

No.
More like you're here, you're us, and we will rib you.
And an ability to laugh at oneself will help you go a long way.

229 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:49:37pm

re: #227 HoosierHoops

My favorite one is

Hows the ol' gout doin'?


Seriously, if they're not new no reason to be gentle >>

230 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:50:16pm

re: #210 windsagio

It could very well be that, granted. I generally don't read through the comments anymore. Haven't had the time.

231 bratwurst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:50:21pm

Strictly about race? Definitely not.

Frequently attended by unvarnished racists and sometimes even organized by same? Absolutely.

232 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:51:14pm

Random 80s music break!
(Nena has more and better songs than '99lufbaloons')

233 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:51:40pm

re: #227 HoosierHoops

So would

HAHA.. another one from the class of 2004!
You guys are legendary!
/Whats you got old timer? Flounce bitch!
LOL

exemplify the "new guard" here at LGF? If so, then my time is much better spent elsewhere.

234 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:51:42pm

re: #6 reine.de.tout

Oh, ugh.

It isn't just the apostrophes, the "be pimpin'" usage is a clear clue who they're talking about, doncha think?

Yes indeed. It's subtle racism. I entertain no doubt that if the President was white, the 'tea baggers' would just stay home, watch Fox news, and for the literate ones, make whiny blog posts.

235 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:51:47pm

re: #224 windsagio

It was a fun convo really, started when someone called Charles 'arguably racist' for using the term teabonics.


A Jewish friend sent me a link to a site dedicated to Jewish English, known as "Hebonics"...

236 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:51:56pm

re: #215 SanFranciscoZionist

And you see, Alkmyst, this is the thing. We argue about such things here, and people have different opinions. Hence, coming out of the myst with a couple of articles that are supposed to BLAM out of the water the idea you've decided all the LGFers agree with, on a thread where no one's saying anything of the sort, is sort of silly.

That mystical myst of the west. . . .

237 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:52:34pm

re: #233 Alkmyst

So would

exemplify the "new guard" here at LGF? If so, then my time is much better spent elsewhere.

Vay's mir.

238 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:52:52pm

re: #233 Alkmyst

So would

exemplify the "new guard" here at LGF? If so, then my time is much better spent elsewhere.

Is that all it took? Dang..Here grab a tissue on your way out...

239 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:52:53pm

re: #234 eclectic infidel

Yes indeed. It's subtle racism. I entertain no doubt that if the President was white, the 'tea baggers' would just stay home, watch Fox news, and for the literate ones, make whiny blog posts.

Granted, he said "our politicians" and not just the Democrats.

240 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:53:09pm

re: #231 bratwurst

Strictly about race? Definitely not.

Frequently attended by unvarnished racists and sometimes even organized by same? Absolutely.

I'm SO expecting you to find love on LGF with a person using the handle of Pierogi. You are cordially invited to the wedding of Bratwurst and Pierogi.

241 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:53:12pm

re: #235 ralphieboy

Freakin' awesome!

242 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:53:13pm

So, if I'm to understand this properly, the leaders of the Tea Parties are racists, but the majority of the people who subscribe to the Tea Party ideology are not?

243 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:53:37pm

re: #238 HoosierHoops

Also, I"m kinda offended that 2008 is the new guard. What do us real kids have to do for some street cred?

244 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:53:41pm

re: #233 Alkmyst

So would

exemplify the "new guard" here at LGF? If so, then my time is much better spent elsewhere.

If your skin is that thin then maybe you are correct. Later man.

245 Killgore Trout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:53:45pm
246 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:53:50pm

re: #215 SanFranciscoZionist

And you see, Alkmyst, this is the thing. We argue about such things here, and people have different opinions. Hence, coming out of the myst with a couple of articles that are supposed to BLAM out of the water the idea you've decided all the LGFers agree with, on a thread where no one's saying anything of the sort, is sort of silly.

Can you play Mysty for me, SFZ?

247 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:54:36pm

re: #242 Alkmyst

So, if I'm to understand this properly, the leaders of the Tea Parties are racists, but the majority of the people who subscribe to the Tea Party ideology are not?


I seem to remember Charles posting a photo of a Tea Party organizer with his "Congress = master Taxpayer = niggar" poster.

That does kind of prove his point

248 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:55:20pm

re: #242 Alkmyst

All of this is opinion of course >>

Many, but not all of the teaparty organizers are demonstrably racist.

With the followers, its impossible to tell, but varies greatly regionally. In no way are 'all of them' racist. In my opinion, many are tho'.

249 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:56:05pm

GOD I wake up and turn on my tablet and oh look! RACIST BEARDO who can't spell, holding his art project, smiling back at me as if half his brain is missing

I already need a drink :D

250 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:56:14pm

Greetings, lizards. Can't stay long, but I wanted to try to answer this one.

re: #39 Sigma_x

Little O/T but not really.

There's been some dustup over last week's episode of South Park where they made fun of Muhammad.

And so but some homegrown Islamo-douche has been calling for fellow psychos to hunt down Trey Parker and Matt Stone and kill them, even going so far as to post the address of their offices in LA on a facebook page.

But (and here's the funny part) he issued his little "fatwa" on Twitter. And so a few smart asses started following him, just to be stupid, I guess.

So he tweeted this tweet that said, "LOL at all the Kufar who have just decided to follow me. Have fun Hutharees."

And so my question is (aside from how does some wanna-bee tough guy terrorist expect to be taken seriously writing "LOL"?) is the word Hutharee some arabic insult, or is it in reference to that Hutaree militia in MI that was just busted. I'm confused.

He's probably referring to the Hutaree milita. AFAIK there's no Arabic insult that sounds like Hutharee, at least not that I've ever heard. I can read & write Arabic, though not fluently, so there could be such a word, bit I think I would have heard it by now if there was.

Like any other group, we (Muslims) have our share of armchair "warriors" who feel brave from behind the safety of their keyboards, not to mention the usual assortment of online bigots, ignoramuses, etc. We view them in much the same way as mainstream America views white supremacist groups, birthers, truthers, and other fringe types. I wouldn't let them get under your skin as I'm sure the feds have them tagged and keep a close eye on on anyone they feel might pose a real threat.

251 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:56:33pm

re: #238 HoosierHoops

If you are going to be representative of what it's like here now, than my time is simply better spent elsewhere.

We have our own problems over here

252 bratwurst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:57:05pm

re: #240 Locker

I'm SO expecting you to find love on LGF with a person using the handle of Pierogi. You are cordially invited to the wedding of Bratwurst and Pierogi.

From your keyboard to the cupid of Slavic love's ears!

253 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:57:10pm

re: #249 WindUpBird

Hey WUB! Did you know that having a black protester proves that not all teabaggers are Racist?

I expect it to hit the MSM by tonight!

254 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:57:51pm

re: #253 windsagio

Oh crap, nevermind. The MSM is controlled by the liberal cabal, and will never let that information out!

255 reloadingisnotahobby  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:57:58pm

re: #234 eclectic infidel

Yes indeed. It's subtle racism. I entertain no doubt that if the President was white, the 'tea baggers' would just stay home, watch Fox news, and for the literate ones, make whiny blog posts.

I don't think so....
His race means nothing to me ...
His past quoted statements and tho's of his closest friends
and pastor and who he has "Surrounded" himself with
Have been a great concern to me since he ran for the nomination.
I ,for one would stand against what he's doing if he was purple,white
or green!

256 Killgore Trout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:58:03pm

re: #242 Alkmyst

So, if I'm to understand this properly, the leaders of the Tea Parties are racists, but the majority of the people who subscribe to the Tea Party ideology are not?

There is a great deal of not so sublte racism on the right these days. Red comments on mainstream right wing blogs like Hot Air or Free Republic. The non-racist people on blogs or at Tea Parties don't seem terribly offended by the racists.

257 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:58:06pm

re: #251 Alkmyst

Go or don't dude :p

258 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:58:08pm

re: #248 windsagio

All of this is opinion of course >>

Many, but not all of the teaparty organizers are demonstrably racist.

With the followers, its impossible to tell, but varies greatly regionally. In no way are 'all of them' racist. In my opinion, many are tho'.

They're not all racist, they just don't seem to mind the Klan in their midst as all, they just smile and accept it because hey! It's easier!

the tribalism and the hatred of a black democratic president just trumps any sort of moral awareness with these guys. Weak minds. Lack of will. it's not their fault, they just don't have the strength to turn back

259 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:58:50pm

re: #245 Killgore Trout

No lie is too big for Breitbart's Big Government site...
Allee Bautsch’s Mother Speaks Out – Says Daughter Was Attacked by Leftist Political Protesters

If you go to the yahoo article that's linked, that is NOT of course, exactly what it says:


And Berning was emphatic that, while Bautsch and Brown believe they were attacked by members of the protest, they can't know what the attackers underlying beliefs were.

"You know, I don't want to label them or be too quick to judge," she said. "I don't want to try to define Republicans and Democrats here. I want to be an American first."

Although the possible political nature of the episode has drawn national media attention, Berning said the family "is not really concerned with the politics of the whole thing" at this point, adding that their main concern was the well-being of Bautsch and Brown and that the NOPD find the perpetrators of the attack.

On the way home from lunch Friday, I heard a local talk-show host talking about the NOPD, how they were "covering something up" and weren't "handling this case as they do" other cases. I actually started screaming at the radio (to the distress of the couple in the car next to me).

It's baloney.

260 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:58:51pm

re: #251 Alkmyst

If you are going to be representative of what it's like here now, than my time is simply better spent elsewhere.

We have our own problems over here

You're insulting Hoosier? The nicest dude on this blog?

Really?

261 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:59:15pm

re: #260 WindUpBird

Thats the second time too >>

262 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:59:26pm

re: #248 windsagio

All of this is opinion of course >>

Many, but not all of the teaparty organizers are demonstrably racist.

With the followers, its impossible to tell, but varies greatly regionally. In no way are 'all of them' racist. In my opinion, many are tho'.

Pretty close to how I'm thinking about it.
See what googling did for you?

263 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 12:59:59pm

re: #257 windsagio

Go or don't dude :p

Father's sending for him! Soon he will flounce back to the poolhouse :D


What's happenin? I need to find Behemoth, I bought a new record and he's the only other guy on this thing I can talk about it with!

264 Killgore Trout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:00:08pm

re: #259 reine.de.tout

On the way home from lunch Friday, I heard a local talk-show host talking about the NOPD, how they were "covering something up" and weren't "handling this case as they do" other cases.

When reality doesn't fit a conspiracy will suffice.

265 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:00:33pm

Hey, reine—got your email, thx! :)

266 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:00:45pm

re: #262 reine.de.tout

Man, I"m trying to find the Get Fuzzy where Bucky keeps insisting that Google is Rob's god.

I'm failing tho :(

267 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:01:05pm

re: #259 reine.de.tout

On the way home from lunch Friday, I heard a local talk-show host talking about the NOPD, how they were "covering something up" and weren't "handling this case as they do" other cases. I actually started screaming at the radio (to the distress of the couple in the car next to me).

It's baloney.

Have you ever heard something so fucked up on the radio you just leaned on your horn? I've done that before :D

268 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:01:23pm

re: #251 Alkmyst

If you are going to be representative of what it's like here now, than my time is simply better spent elsewhere.

We have our own problems over here

So you're one of those jooish fellas?

269 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:01:28pm

re: #250 CuriousLurker

Curious - I am really glad you are here @ LGF!

270 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:01:51pm

re: #265 CuriousLurker

Hey, reine—got your email, thx! :)

Good!
Hope you can hang around a bit today, tho I'll be leaving.
Daughter wants me to go shopping with her.
Which really means there's something she wants and she wants me to pay for it.

271 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:01:58pm

re: #268 ryannon

I think its an attempt to garnish support, however possible.

272 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:02:28pm

re: #251 Alkmyst

If you are going to be representative of what it's like here now, than my time is simply better spent elsewhere.

We have our own problems over here

You do realize all your 2004 classmates have flounced here right?
I barely teased you and you are ready to jump off the cliff..
I'm just having fun..Gawd help you if Ice logs in..We could have the best flounce ever...

273 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:03:21pm

re: #271 windsagio

I think its an attempt to garnish support, however possible.

Well, any port in a storm.

274 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:03:21pm

re: #269 Stanley Sea

Curious - I am really glad you are here @ LGF!

Thanks, Stanley. I'm glad to be here!

275 charlz  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:03:55pm

re: #271 windsagio

I think its an attempt to garnish support, however possible.

He'd relish that, eh?

276 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:03:58pm

re: #271 windsagio

I think its an attempt to garnish support, however possible.

A defensive maneuver!

277 Kragar  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:04:01pm

re: #272 HoosierHoops

You do realize all your 2004 classmates have flounced here right?
I barely teased you and you are ready to jump off the cliff..
I'm just having fun..Gawd help you if Ice logs in..We could have the best flounce ever...

All those 2004 peeps are a bunch of assholes.

Shit, I registered then too.

278 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:04:19pm

re: #273 ryannon

Apparently he really is a settler, like in that sense.

dunno if that's worth points or not.

ALSO: WUB, tell me about hte album, even if I don't get it I always like to hear you talk about music!

279 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:04:44pm

re: #256 Killgore Trout

I still have both of those in my RSS, as I do LGF and many others. I don't often have time to scan thru the comments, so unless it's overt I probably wouldn't have picked up on it.

280 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:04:45pm

re: #277 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

All those 2004 peeps are a bunch of assholes.

Shit, I registered then too.

We like you anyway!

281 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:04:55pm

re: #277 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

I dislike the 2007 crowd more

/ducks!

282 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:05:00pm

re: #267 WindUpBird

Have you ever heard something so fucked up on the radio you just leaned on your horn? I've done that before :D

Here's the only time I was ever tempted:

At one time, I had a boss who looked like Jimmy Swaggart. They could have been twins. I worked for this guy at the time Swaggart was going through his first prostitute scandal, so Swaggart's face was all over the place in the news.

So one day we're driving to a meeting and stop at a red light, several lanes of traffic across, the boss, me and one other lady from our office. All of a sudden, my co-worker notices that everybody seems to be looking at us but trying to hide that they're looking at us, they're whispering to their own passengers who then look over at us - and it finally occurred to us, they thought HE WAS SWAGGART! And I guess the speculation was that we were his harem.
LOL.

283 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:05:17pm

re: #270 reine.de.tout

Good!
Hope you can hang around a bit today, tho I'll be leaving.
Daughter wants me to go shopping with her.
Which really means there's something she wants and she wants me to pay for it.

I wish I could stay, but I have a ton of work to catch up on, so I have to get that done first. Have fun shopping!

284 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:05:31pm

re: #269 Stanley Sea

Curious - I am really glad you are here @ LGF!

I am as well. A welcome addition to the mix.

William

285 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:05:33pm

re: #278 windsagio

Apparently he really is a settler, like in that sense.

dunno if that's worth points or not.

ALSO: WUB, tell me about hte album, even if I don't get it I always like to hear you talk about music!

it's the new High on Fire album. It's sorta like if Motorhead played a lot of D&D :D

Just a screaming freight train of a record

286 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:05:50pm

re: #248 windsagio

With the followers, its impossible to tell, but varies greatly regionally. In no way are 'all of them' racist. In my opinion, many are tho'.

Everyone's a little bit racist...

287 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:05:59pm

re: #268 ryannon

Nope, not at all, I'm a plant working for the Haaretz magazine as a spy.

/yeah that's sarc

288 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:06:23pm

re: #282 reine.de.tout

Awesome story!

re: #285 WindUpBird

Actually you were right, beyond my ken. :D

289 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:06:48pm

re: #282 reine.de.tout

Here's the only time I was ever tempted:

At one time, I had a boss who looked like Jimmy Swaggart. They could have been twins. I worked for this guy at the time Swaggart was going through his first prostitute scandal, so Swaggart's face was all over the place in the news.

So one day we're driving to a meeting and stop at a red light, several lanes of traffic across, the boss, me and one other lady from our office. All of a sudden, my co-worker notices that everybody seems to be looking at us but trying to hide that they're looking at us, they're whispering to their own passengers who then look over at us - and it finally occurred to us, they thought HE WAS SWAGGART! And I guess the speculation was that we were his harem.
LOL.

aahahahah Oh nooo, that's hilarious. "It's him! The sinner!"

290 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:07:17pm

re: #286 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I would have personally responded with 'Islam is not a Race', but that's just me :)

291 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:07:19pm

re: #284 wlewisiii

I am as well. A welcome addition to the mix.

Thanks, William. :)

292 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:07:39pm

re: #290 windsagio

I would have personally responded with 'Islam is not a Race', but that's just me :)

it's really more of a rally than a race

///

293 reloadingisnotahobby  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:08:08pm

re: #282 reine.de.tout

I would have thought..Smart man,hired female Lawyers!!
I mean really why else would women be riding with him if it were
Swaggart?

294 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:09:24pm

re: #277 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

All those 2004 peeps are a bunch of assholes.

Shit, I registered then too.

LOL
Halftime of the Lakers Game...Winston is hiding in the bedroom wondering why I'm yelling at the TV...
We love ya K..Even if you did register in 2004...

295 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:10:46pm

re: #278 windsagio

re: #273 ryannon

Apparently he really is a settler, like in that sense.

You are very much correct in that statement.

296 Dancing along the light of day  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:10:51pm

re: #294 HoosierHoops

go lakers

297 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:11:40pm

re: #295 Alkmyst

I was just confirming that you weren't lying in respect to being in Israel. Of course it doesn't give you a bit more credibility.

In discussing things like the tea party, it actually gives you substantially less.

298 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:12:20pm

BBL

299 Killgore Trout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:13:29pm

Why I don't pick on the Koskidz much anymore.....
VIDEO--The Zionist Occupation of Palestine

A stupid diary for certain. Most Koskidz ignore it but there are comments like....

please, don't post this junk, here (6+ / 0-)

Recommended by:
kestrel9000, richiedoc, fizziks, Blicero, gravlax, Gatordiet

Honestly. It's bad enough that we have to deal with right-wingers accusing Obama of wanting to destroy Israel and rain death and destruction on the Jews. Please don't make us also deal with this 1970s-style overheated rhetoric nonsense from disgruntled liberals--who call Israelis "Zionist." "Vast spying operations?"

Just stop with this crap....


Hey, our old pal kestrel updinged that one.

300 reloadingisnotahobby  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:13:34pm

I'm going back outside to collect some Ultraviolet rays and a few vitamins while I'm at it!
It's far to nice to be indoors!
Life is gooood!

301 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:13:40pm

re: #296 Floral Giraffe

go lakers

Only beautiful women from LA get to say that...
*dang it!*
/

302 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:14:16pm

re: #239 ralphieboy

Granted, he said "our politicians" and not just the Democrats.

He's talking about Obama and those who advise him on policy. "Be Pimpin'" is a slur that wouldn't have been used on Biden, if Biden were President.

303 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:14:18pm

re: #296 Floral Giraffe

gNo lakers

304 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:17:33pm

re: #295 Alkmyst

You are very much correct in that statement.

Well come on in and tell us all about it. What's life like?

/no sarc intended.

305 reloadingisnotahobby  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:17:35pm

If Biden were President?....Thanks!
I just inhaled my gum....gag!

306 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:19:20pm

re: #297 windsagioYou have a point there - I'm just calling it like I see it from the view from over here.

Last summer when I was in NY I spoke with a man named Michael Myers who basically told me that Obama is "a fraud" and that he will only cause black people more poverty.

Personally, my instinct is to support anyone who wants to oust Obama. There's a reason that he is viewed favorably by only 9% of Israelis, well alot of reasons actually, but none of them have to do with skin color.

307 Dancing along the light of day  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:20:10pm

re: #303 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Boo.

308 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:21:32pm

re: #306 Alkmyst

You have a point there - I'm just calling it like I see it from the view from over here.

Last summer when I was in NY I spoke with a man named Michael Myers who basically told me that Obama is "a fraud" and that he will only cause black people more poverty.

Personally, my instinct is to support anyone who wants to oust Obama. There's a reason that he is viewed favorably by only 9% of Israelis, well alot of reasons actually, but none of them have to do with skin color.

I'm curious. Why did he say he's a fraud?

309 Killgore Trout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:22:38pm

re: #299 Killgore Trout

Meanwhile on the front page of Hot Air....

Hospice America

Let’s not mince words: if thousands of Americans died in a chemical or biological attack, and Obama responded with talk of sanctions and censure, or blew up a couple of tents with cruise missiles, he would be dragged out of the White House by a howling mob. You know it, and so does he.

I see the ban on revolution/coup rhetoric didn't last long.

310 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:23:31pm

Wow! An apostrophe three-fer. One wrong, one racist, and one missing.

Haven't seen it that bad since certain fucktards got the stick here and went to found their own blog.

311 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:23:34pm

re: #304 ryannon

In what regard? We have Ehud Olmert, corrupt former PM being investigated and a hair's breadth away from prosecution, we have the former mayor of Jerusalem, Lupoliansky, as an accomplice, we have Anat Kamm, who while in the army stole over 2000 classified documents and passed them on to Uri Blau of Haaretz Daily after she couldn't sell them directly to our enemies...

312 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:25:38pm

Now this is Big Pimpin'.

313 Killgore Trout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:25:44pm

re: #306 Alkmyst

Poll: Obama struggling with Jews, but not on Israel

A new survey shows President Obama struggling with American Jews -- but not on Israel-related matters.

The American Jewish Committee poll of U.S. Jews found that Obama's approval rating is at 57 percent, with 38 percent disapproving. That's down from the stratospheric 79 percent approval rating among Jews that Obama enjoyed about a year ago, in May 2009. The AJC poll was conducted March 2-23 and surveyed 800 self-identifying Jewish respondents selected from a consumer mail panel.


He's doing ok with American Jews.

314 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:26:31pm

re: #308 marjoriemoon

If memory serves, (and this is not to be considered any kind of legally binding statement to Mr Meyers) it was because Meyers considered Obama to not have any connection to the average black American, not having grown up with it.

315 Randall Gross  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:26:47pm

More on Palin's press phobia from Danielle Crittenden

[Link: www.frumforum.com...]

316 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:27:22pm

re: #313 Killgore Trout

Ok maybe, but from what I've read ~20% less than what he started out with.

317 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:27:37pm

re: #313 Killgore Trout


Poll: Obama struggling with Jews, but not on Israel


He's doing ok with American Jews.

How do you read that? Looks to me he's down about 20% which seems significant.

318 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:27:58pm

re: #316 Alkmyst

In line with the rest of the US.

The OMG Jews should hate Obama! meme really annoys me.

319 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:28:41pm

re: #308 marjoriemoon

I'm curious. Why did he say he's a fraud?

This oughta be good

320 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:30:09pm

re: #318 windsagio

Annoys you? Do you have any idea how he's been treating Israel? Anti- semetic attacks have risen by something like 2x since since his Cairo speech. Every time he coddles another muslim nation, it emboldens them to attack us.

321 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:30:29pm

re: #318 windsagio

Altho I should add, somebody (I think it was Cato) totally freakin' savaged the book about that a few weeks back.


Brutally.

322 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:31:06pm

re: #311 Alkmyst

In what regard? We have Ehud Olmert, corrupt former PM being investigated and a hair's breadth away from prosecution, we have the former mayor of Jerusalem, Lupoliansky, as an accomplice, we have Anat Kamm, who while in the army stole over 2000 classified documents and passed them on to Uri Blau of Haaretz Daily after she couldn't sell them directly to our enemies...

Sounds messy and disheartening. And just about like everywhere else these days.

323 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:31:27pm

re: #314 Alkmyst

If memory serves, (and this is not to be considered any kind of legally binding statement to Mr Meyers) it was because Meyers considered Obama to not have any connection to the average black American, not having grown up with it.

Gotcha. It's funny. Obama's upbringing is more like the people I know in South Florida, racially mixed homes. I have a lot of island friends and their families are all colors.

But Obama certainly wasn't born with a silver spoon in his mouth. Neither was Michelle. I'm not pressing you, but I'd be interested in Meyers' thoughts. Maybe he wrote about it somewhere?

324 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:31:29pm

re: #316 Alkmyst

Ok maybe, but from what I've read ~20% less than what he started out with.

If you can't comprehend the achingly, blindingly obvious notion that Obama had artificially inflated approval ratings right after the election due to the historic nature of his election, then I really REAAALLY can't help you.

325 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:31:50pm

re: #306 Alkmyst

You have a point there - I'm just calling it like I see it from the view from over here.

Last summer when I was in NY I spoke with a man named Michael Myers who basically told me that Obama is "a fraud" and that he will only cause black people more poverty.

Personally, my instinct is to support anyone who wants to oust Obama. There's a reason that he is viewed favorably by only 9% of Israelis, well alot of reasons actually, but none of them have to do with skin color.


Luckily it is my instinct to not support anyone who wants to oust the President.
Anytime the President annoys me I only have to thin President McCain and VP Palin and I'm back to being all hope and changey.

and I think the 9% poll was debunked or had issues....
(but I can't find the information to back that up so I'll just have to not say that for sure)

326 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:32:17pm

re: #305 reloadingisnotahobby

If Biden were President?...Thanks!

Imagine the comedic possibilities.
Personally, I don't think they got anywhere near enough yuks out of the 'FDR on TV in 1929' gaffe.

327 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:32:36pm

re: #314 Alkmyst

If memory serves, (and this is not to be considered any kind of legally binding statement to Mr Meyers) it was because Meyers considered Obama to not have any connection to the average black American, not having grown up with it.

Really? I don't know one Black man or woman in America that believes that shit...My impression is they are very proud of Obama...
You found the one black man in NY that thinks Obama is a fraud..Aren't you special?
/Sorry...Don't want to insult you..I have a very different view

328 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:32:39pm

re: #323 marjoriemoon

The conversation I had was at a friend's house on Shabbat, so there was no recording of any kind going on :( You could always try googling him, though.

329 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:33:36pm

re: #313 Killgore Trout


Poll: Obama struggling with Jews, but not on Israel

He's doing ok with American Jews.

I am suspicious of any poll that claims to represent "American Jews." How do they know their sampling method is accurate?

330 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:34:26pm

re: #320 Alkmyst

Annoys you? Do you have any idea how he's been treating Israel? Anti- semetic attacks have risen by something like 2x since since his Cairo speech. Every time he coddles another muslim nation, it emboldens them to attack us.

heard it all before dude, they're called talking points, I trade them like baseball cards

331 Dancing along the light of day  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:35:21pm

re: #313 Killgore Trout

OT, had the most amazing dinner out last night.
It was this, but without the cream fraiche & no mustard.
A slightly healthier version.

[Link: www.seriouseats.com...]

332 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:35:31pm

re: #322 ryannon

Sounds messy and disheartening. And just about like everywhere else these days.

But of course you've got the whole Middle East on your back, and that specificity is no trifling matter.

333 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:35:36pm

re: #322 ryannon

Those are just the recent headlines :) Life is not so bad - I finally have gotten around to going back to school, and I haven't been called up to Reserve duty anytime lately, so it could be alot worse.

334 Political Atheist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:35:55pm

re: #329 Alouette

The AJC poll was conducted March 2-23 and surveyed 800 self-identifying Jewish respondents selected from a consumer mail panel.

They don't really. But being an obscure poll, perhaps nobody significantly gamed it.

335 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:36:02pm

re: #320 Alkmyst

Annoys you? Do you have any idea how he's been treating Israel? Anti- semetic [sic] attacks have risen by something like 2x since since his Cairo speech.

Link, please.

Every time he coddles cuddles another muslim nation, it emboldens them to attack us.

FTFY.

Stop cuddling Yemen!

336 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:36:05pm

re: #330 WindUpBird

Eeh, this guy's a real joker anyways, I'm just annoyed that I pulled him back from the edge of a flounce by accidently mentioning his priveldged status.

337 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:37:01pm

re: #328 Alkmyst

The conversation I had was at a friend's house on Shabbat, so there was no recording of any kind going on :( You could always try googling him, though.

hehe I wasn't going to hold you to anything. I know there are Black people who don't like Obama and that's fine. He got, what 98% of the vote? So there are some 2 percenters running about I suppose.

338 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:37:30pm

re: #329 Alouette

I am suspicious of any poll that claims to represent "American Jews." How do they know their sampling method is accurate?

That bothers me, too. The first thing I thought of was, "They never call me!"

339 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:37:57pm

re: #338 marjoriemoon

800's a pretty small sample :p

340 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:38:14pm

re: #338 marjoriemoon

That bothers me, too. The first thing I thought of was, "They never call me!"

I never get called for the Catholic polls, either.

341 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:38:56pm

re: #306 Alkmyst

You have a point there - I'm just calling it like I see it from the view from over here.

Last summer when I was in NY I spoke with a man named Michael Myers who basically told me that Obama is "a fraud" and that he will only cause black people more poverty.

Personally, my instinct is to support anyone who wants to oust Obama. There's a reason that he is viewed favorably by only 9% of Israelis, well alot of reasons actually, but none of them have to do with skin color.

Well, there will be no chance of 'ousting' until 2012, so there is is.

342 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:38:57pm

re: #324 WindUpBird

American Jews (from memory) tend to vote solidly Democrat by 80%, so those numbers wouldn't be the ones being inflated.

343 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:39:22pm

re: #334 Rightwingconspirator

The AJC poll was conducted March 2-23 and surveyed 800 self-identifying Jewish respondents selected from a consumer mail panel.

They don't really. But being an obscure poll, perhaps nobody significantly gamed it.

They used names from a mailing list? Of what, subscribers to The Forward? That in itself would create a prejudiced sample.

My beef with all Jewish-American polls is that it is impossible to generate an accurate population sample with random phone calls (which is how most of these polls are generated)

344 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:39:44pm

re: #339 windsagio

800's a pretty small sample :p

Nobody told me there would be math.

345 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:39:48pm

re: #339 windsagio

800's a pretty small sample :p

yeah, totally. Drive through!

346 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:39:52pm

re: #342 Alkmyst

American Jews (from memory) tend to vote solidly Democrat by 80%, so those numbers wouldn't be the ones being inflated.

Do you live in the Holy Land?

347 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:39:56pm

re: #343 Alouette

That's all polls nowadays tho' >>

348 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:40:12pm

re: #329 Alouette

I am suspicious of any poll that claims to represent "American Jews." How do they know their sampling method is accurate?

The check for the absence of foreskins.
/sorry

349 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:40:49pm

re: #324 WindUpBird

If you can't comprehend the achingly, blindingly obvious notion that Obama had artificially inflated approval ratings right after the election due to the historic nature of his election, then I really REAAALLY can't help you.

Aren't his poll numbers about where most Presidents spend their time baring an attack like 9/11 which made Bush's shoot up?

350 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:40:54pm

re: #314 Alkmyst

If memory serves, (and this is not to be considered any kind of legally binding statement to Mr Meyers) it was because Meyers considered Obama to not have any connection to the average black American, not having grown up with it.

That could be true, but it hardly makes him a 'fraud'. No previous president has had much connection with the average black American either, except for a few who owned some average black Americans.

But we don't like to talk about that so much.

351 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:41:52pm

re: #349 webevintage

Aren't his poll numbers about where most Presidents spend their time baring an attack like 9/11 which made Bush's shoot up?

yeah, pretty much.

And then people with a political axe to grind take the numbers and construct a fake narrative and then act fake concerned

352 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:42:01pm

re: #320 Alkmyst

Annoys you? Do you have any idea how he's been treating Israel? Anti- semetic attacks have risen by something like 2x since since his Cairo speech. Every time he coddles another muslim nation, it emboldens them to attack us.

Anti-Semitics attacks where?

353 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:42:10pm

re: #349 webevintage

I'm not WUB, but yes, yes they are.

354 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:42:19pm

re: #347 windsagio

That's all polls nowadays tho' >>

I was once called by a Gallup poll. They start out as a random telemarketing call, and if you stay on the line long enough (that is, you don't hang up as soon as some stranger says "How are you today?") and then agree to participate in their 30-minute questionnaire, you are part of a "random sample" of people who don't mind talking to telemarketers for 30 minutes at suppertime.

355 Fozzie Bear  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:42:31pm

re: #59 marjoriemoon

Well that's kind of their shtick. To piss off everyone. And there probably isn't a group of people they haven't targeted.

There's a fine line with ethnic humor. I'm wondering to do it effectively, you don't have to be a member of the group you're laughing at. Catholics make funny Catholic jokes. Jews, funny Jewish jokes. Blacks, Asians, etc. Otherwise it doesn't come across very well. Well that's not a hard and fast rule, but I certainly think it's more difficult to do "crossover" ethnic humor.

I think you either have to stick to making fun of your own, or make fun of absolutely everybody. It's instances where people mock one particular group (not their own) over and over that I find telling.

356 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:42:48pm

re: #333 Alkmyst

Those are just the recent headlines :) Life is not so bad - I finally have gotten around to going back to school, and I haven't been called up to Reserve duty anytime lately, so it could be alot worse.

Well, hang in there. And try to understand that the life you're leading is as far-removed for many of us here as ours - meaning our politics - is for you. But perhaps I'm being presumptuous.

In any event, you've got a right to express your point of view here. It may not be met with a great deal of sympathy or comprehension, but that's the risk we all take....

357 shiplord kirel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:43:06pm

re: #4 bratwurst

And the countdown to "it's a plant!" begins...

Vegetables are plants.

358 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:43:24pm

re: #335 Cato the Elder

FTFY.

Stop cuddling Yemen!

But Yemen is so furry and adorable!

359 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:43:39pm

re: #352 SanFranciscoZionist

I probably shouldn't say this, but I'm gonna. From the few people I know over there, people like Alkmyst aren't popular anywhere.

Seem to be considered entitled troublemakers.

360 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:43:52pm

re: #350 SanFranciscoZionist

That could be true, but it hardly makes him a 'fraud'. No previous president has had much connection with the average black American either, except for a few who owned some average black Americans.

But we don't like to talk about that so much.

That Michael Myers guy seems to be a nowhere dude, his organization doesn't get many hits. I mean, he did chase after Jamie Lee Curtis, but we can forgive that.

Might as well say 'Man, my cousin is like well, he knows a black guy and that black guy said that Obama is actually a reptile and that proves something I guess somewhere also yeah."

361 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:44:28pm

re: #341 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, there will be no chance of 'ousting' until 2012, so there is is.

What? Are you CRAZY?
The Republicans are gonna take back the House AND the Senate and then they are gonna IMPEACH that muslimlovingnotborninAmericafunnysoundingnamesekretcommie and get a real American in office!!1111!!!!
/

362 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:44:31pm

re: #360 WindUpBird

That Michael Myers guy seems to be a nowhere dude, his organization doesn't get many hits. I mean, he did chase after Jamie Lee Curtis, but we can forgive that.

But he was awesome in "Austin Powers" and "Shrek"

363 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:44:35pm

Over on those sites with pictures of the Icelandic volcano, there's big arguments between the atheists and the soi-disant religious about whether or not God is behind it all.

If so, of course, then he also does earthquakes. And tsunamis. And floods. And building collapses. And tornadoes. And major pile-ups on the freeway. And wars.

What kind of God do these people believe in?

Never mind, I think we can tell.

364 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:45:12pm

re: #349 webevintage

Aren't his poll numbers about where most Presidents spend their time baring an attack like 9/11 which made Bush's shoot up?

Bush, Lord love the man, demonstrated just about everything that could happen to one president's poll numbers, over the course of eight years.

365 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:45:14pm

re: #358 SanFranciscoZionist

But Yemen is so furry and adorable!

Yeah, man!

366 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:46:01pm

re: #355 Fozzie Bear

I think you either have to stick to making fun of your own, or make fun of absolutely everybody. It's instances where people mock one particular group (not their own) over and over that I find telling.

I think you have to be a very empathetic person to pull it off well. To me, Mel Brooks is genius. It's sad to think that a movie like Blazing Saddles, a movie mocking racism and bigotry, could probably never be done again.

367 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:47:16pm

re: #355 Fozzie Bear

I think you either have to stick to making fun of your own, or make fun of absolutely everybody. It's instances where people mock one particular group (not their own) over and over that I find telling.

I see, to pass the politically correct humor test we need to start keeping a scorecard on comedians, comic groups, TV shows that are humorous and so on to make sure that they are being humorous at the expenses of enough different concepts, people, ethnic groups and individuals and so on, otherwise we can brand them as racist, bigoted or xenophobic?

Sure.

368 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:47:32pm

re: #12 SanFranciscoZionist

Would it be seen as a sign of West Coast elitism if I went on a road trip following these guys around and offered a free Sign Grammar Clinic?

Oh, totally. Plus if they discovered you're a Zionist, they could accuse you of being a ZOG agent and part of a conspiracy to quash free speech.

369 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:47:58pm

re: #363 Cato the Elder

Over on those sites with pictures of the Icelandic volcano, there's big arguments between the atheists and the soi-disant religious about whether or not God is behind it all.

If so, of course, then he also does earthquakes. And tsunamis. And floods. And building collapses. And tornadoes. And major pile-ups on the freeway. And wars.

What kind of God do these people believe in?

Never mind, I think we can tell.

Of course God is behind it. But the systems he created work, and we cannot rely on special intervention when the plate tectonics and the volcanoes and the gravity all work.

370 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:48:49pm

re: #360 WindUpBird

That Michael Myers guy seems to be a nowhere dude, his organization doesn't get many hits. I mean, he did chase after Jamie Lee Curtis, but we can forgive that.

Might as well say 'Man, my cousin is like well, he knows a black guy and that black guy said that Obama is actually a reptile and that proves something I guess somewhere also yeah."

I don't think that's fair. He got his J.D. at Rutgers so he's not an idiot. I'd be interested in his opinion, although I think I wouldn't agree with it.

371 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:48:51pm

re: #361 webevintage

What? Are you CRAZY?
The Republicans are gonna take back the House AND the Senate and then they are gonna IMPEACH that muslimlovingnotborninAmericafunnysoundingnamesekre tcommie and get a real American in office!!1111!!!
/

You know what side a dude's bread is buttered when he uses lines like "oust" or "regime" or whatever in regards to Obama. As if he's fucking Saddam Hussein.

Always classy

372 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:49:09pm

re: #363 Cato the Elder

Over on those sites with pictures of the Icelandic volcano, there's big arguments between the atheists and the soi-disant religious about whether or not God is behind it all.

Rush (who as always, was just joking) blamed it on Obama and the new Health Care Law....

Which begs the question why would God care? One would think that a supreme Deity had more important things to deal with.

373 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:49:52pm

re: #372 webevintage

Like Gays in New Orleans?

374 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:50:30pm

re: #370 marjoriemoon

I don't think that's fair. He got his J.D. at Rutgers so he's not an idiot. I'd be interested in his opinion, although I think I wouldn't agree with it.

well, what I'm saying is that using the guy as evidence that Obama doesn't understand or relate to black americans as if his organization is really super-influential, it doesn't wash.

At least that's the impression I got, that this guy's opinion was framed as being representative of black America, when it clearly isn't.

375 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:50:32pm

re: #335 Cato the Elderworking on it - gotta free up some memory - firefox is taking up over half a gig and 57% of my cpu

376 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:50:45pm

re: #363 Cato the Elder

Over on those sites with pictures of the Icelandic volcano, there's big arguments between the atheists and the soi-disant religious about whether or not God is behind it all.

If so, of course, then he also does earthquakes. And tsunamis. And floods. And building collapses. And tornadoes. And major pile-ups on the freeway. And wars.

What kind of God do these people believe in?

Never mind, I think we can tell.


You shouldn't have asked.

377 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:51:12pm

re: #373 windsagio

Like Gays in New Orleans?

We are SO GOOD AT CALLING STORMS. Fuck your city, it's weathermancy time!

378 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:51:14pm

re: #371 WindUpBird

You know what side a dude's bread is buttered when he uses lines like "oust" or "regime" or whatever in regards to Obama. As if he's fucking Saddam Hussein.

Always classy

ding ding ding

379 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:52:34pm

re: #378 webevintage

ding ding ding

I never used that shit with Bush. I didn't like him, but I didn't fly a big flag of stupid and claim he wasn't a "real" president. It's just so uncivilized and stupid. It does an insult to America.

380 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:53:59pm

re: #376 ryannon

You shouldn't have asked.

hahahahahaha
That made me click on this:

Two Talking Cats.
Kittahs!!!

381 Sigma_x  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:54:11pm

Coolest. Thing. Ever.

382 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:54:30pm

re: #367 Walter L. Newton

I see, to pass the politically correct humor test we need to start keeping a scorecard on comedians, comic groups, TV shows that are humorous and so on to make sure that they are being humorous at the expenses of enough different concepts, people, ethnic groups and individuals and so on, otherwise we can brand them as racist, bigoted or xenophobic?

Sure.

I wish I were a Jew..Those folks are the fucking funniest people on the face of this earth..do you have any idea how funny the stand up is going to be at Ceasars Palace in Heaven? Good Old Moses yelling, " Bring back that Steinfield guy..He was really funny"
/I hope to be the waiter in Heaven...Jesus..Would you like water or wine? or does it matter? Water? *wink* Right away Lord..

383 What, me worry?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:54:51pm

re: #374 WindUpBird

well, what I'm saying is that using the guy as evidence that Obama doesn't understand or relate to black americans as if his organization is really super-influential, it doesn't wash.

At least that's the impression I got, that this guy's opinion was framed as being representative of black America, when it clearly isn't.

No it's not. I didn't catch that Alk was saying that, but then I'm starting to get a fierce headache so I probably missed something. Actually, I need to log out a bit.

384 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:55:11pm

Link for Cato

The article does list it as TAU report saying it's because of Operation Cast Lead, but I think that's BS because there were operations in Gaza in other yeasr that hod no analagous effect worldwide.

385 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:55:56pm

re: #380 webevintage

hahahahahaha
That made me click on this:

[Video]Two Talking Cats.
Kittahs!!!

Every day I get thismuchcloser to just getting a damn kitty.

386 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:57:15pm

re: #384 Alkmyst

Link for Cato

The article does list it as TAU report saying it's because of Operation Cast Lead, but I think that's BS because there were operations in Gaza in other yeasr that hod no analagous effect worldwide.

I don't think it's BS, I think it's the sad reality. As for Obama being behind, it that's what I would call bullshit. Nonsensical, paranoid bullshit, to be precise.

387 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 1:59:15pm

re: #385 Stanley Sea

Every day I get thismuchcloser to just getting a damn kitty.

This one is mine ^_^ Image: snapshot689.jpg

388 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:00:07pm

This is cool: 8-Bit Dr. Horrible.

389 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:00:10pm

re: #380 webevintage

Best kittahs ever!

390 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:00:29pm

re: #374 WindUpBird

I'm using him as an example of someone I have personally met and spent a few hours talking with, that grew up in Harlem, that at the time expressed dep concern about Obama's effect on the U.S. Nothing more, nothing less. I added the link for the photo as an identifier as to who the man is, not for the organization. From what I remember he was involved in a few different organizations.

391 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:01:44pm

re: #385 Stanley Sea

Every day I get thismuchcloser to just getting a damn kitty.

Remember.
Cats on YouTube can be cuter then in real life.

In real life they can be bitter little bags of evil like Alley Cat who hates everyone but me...even the cats that are her own children.
She is evil and I know she is plotting the death of all the other animals in the house.
(I still love her bunches)

392 Kragar  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:03:12pm

Off for a bit. After yesterdays 40k game, both our kids wanted to play, so his son's space marines will be fighting my daughters' Orks. Carnage will ensue.

393 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:03:43pm

re: #387 WindUpBird

This one is mine ^_^ Image: snapshot689.jpg

haha! wow

394 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:04:22pm

re: #386 Cato the Elder

wow, first off excuse my typos on that last.

As to whether or not he's doing it intentionally, I have no way of knowing. But there consistently seems to be a rise in attacks after he speaks with another muslim leader.

The fact is whether or not it's intentional, the arab muslim mentality sees any attempt at outreach as weakness, and they are emboldened to attack.

395 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:04:52pm

re: #384 Alkmyst

Link for Cato

The article does list it as TAU report saying it's because of Operation Cast Lead, but I think that's BS because there were operations in Gaza in other yeasr that hod no analagous effect worldwide.

They weren't as widely reported or as broadly exploited by anti-Israel groups.

396 MJ  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:05:55pm

re: #313 Killgore Trout


Poll: Obama struggling with Jews, but not on Israel


He's doing ok with American Jews.


He's falling fast:

Major Findings:

I. A plurality of Jewish voters would consider someone else for President.

According to the 2008 exit polls, Barack Obama won 78% to 21% among Jewish voters. Now, in the second year of Obama’s presidency, only 42% of voters would re-elect him, while the plurality (46%) would consider voting for someone else.

Would you vote to re-elect Barack Obama as President or would you consider voting for someone else?

Total
Re-Elect
42
Someone Else
46
Don’t Know/Refused
12


[Link: www.mclaughlinonline.com...]

397 Walter L. Newton  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:06:44pm

Before I leave for 4 hours of work... this is a repeat from this morning.

This is the view from my "office" when I'm working the self-checkout station at work...

Image: ks_front.jpg

398 Kragar  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:07:21pm

re: #388 Slumbering Behemoth

This is cool: 8-Bit Dr. Horrible.

I reply with Mario Gundam

399 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:08:00pm

re: #397 Walter L. Newton

Before I leave for 4 hours of work... this is a repeat from this morning.

This is the view from my "office" when I'm working the self-checkout station at work...

Image: ks_front.jpg

Tell those customers to put the damn cart back in the cart stall. Lazy asses - my pet peeve in parking lots.

400 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:08:23pm

re: #395 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't quite follow your meaning there... are you saying that the attacks weren't as widely reported?

401 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:10:13pm

re: #397 Walter L. Newton

Before I leave for 4 hours of work... this is a repeat from this morning.

This is the view from my "office" when I'm working the self-checkout station at work...

Image: ks_front.jpg

Do you work with any interesting people?

402 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:10:24pm

re: #397 Walter L. Newton

Before I leave for 4 hours of work... this is a repeat from this morning.

This is the view from my "office" when I'm working the self-checkout station at work...

Image: ks_front.jpg

What are those green things and what are the white deposits on the ground? How come the ground is so lumpy?

403 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:10:25pm

re: #399 Stanley Sea

Tell those customers to put the damn cart back in the cart stall. Lazy asses - my pet peeve in parking lots.

Doesn't it piss you off when Walter claims how hard it is living in the Mountains? In God's Country?
Bastard!
/Love ya Walter

404 A Sockpuppet's Sockpuppet  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:11:41pm

re: #385 Stanley Sea

Every day I get thismuchcloser to just getting a damn kitty.

Try it first with a stuffed kittah and if things go well you can upgrade to the living version. Maybe talk to the furniture first though.

405 bratwurst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:13:08pm

re: #396 MJ

Naturally, being willing to "consider" someone else 2.5 years before the election and actually pulling the lever for whomever ends up on the ballot opposing him are totally different animals. I strongly suspect that SoCon baggage could turn off at least as many people as a perceived more pro-Israel stance could turn on.

406 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:13:54pm

re: #394 Alkmyst

wow, first off excuse my typos on that last.

As to whether or not he's doing it intentionally, I have no way of knowing. But there consistently seems to be a rise in attacks after he speaks with another muslim leader.

The fact is whether or not it's intentional, the arab muslim mentality sees any attempt at outreach as weakness, and they are emboldened to attack.

Oh, please. Of course he's doing it intentionally. That's what you're really driving at, isn't it?

Don't ever speak with any of them. Kill 'em all, in fact. That'll show the opposite of weakness. I'm sure they'd be quiescent when dead.

407 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:14:36pm

re: #398 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

I reply with Mario Gundam

See you with this bit of Divine Justice

408 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:17:16pm

re: #399 Stanley Sea

Tell those customers to put the damn cart back in the cart stall. Lazy asses - my pet peeve in parking lots.

Ya push the damn thing all over the grocery store, fill it up, than push that full cart all the way out to your car, but somehow you can't push the empty bastard another TEN FUCKING FEET to the cart stall?!?!

When I had my old fishing boat of a car, I would just use the bumper to push the carts out of my way.

409 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:17:30pm
410 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:20:05pm

re: #409 webevintage

Here's my evil cat:
Image: ?action=view&current=alleycat.jpg

He must be one evil motha: he's got the gift of invisibility.

411 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:23:18pm

re: #397 Walter L. Newton

Before I leave for 4 hours of work... this is a repeat from this morning.

This is the view from my "office" when I'm working the self-checkout station at work...

Image: ks_front.jpg

OMGWTFBBQ!!!!1 Is that there snow on teh ground?

412 Political Atheist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:23:37pm

re: #409 webevintage

Even the evil need a nap now and then.

413 MJ  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:24:19pm

re: #405 bratwurst

Naturally, being willing to "consider" someone else 2.5 years before the election and actually pulling the lever for whomever ends up on the ballot opposing him are totally different animals. I strongly suspect that SoCon baggage could turn off at least as many people as a perceived more pro-Israel stance could turn on.

There is downward trend in the amount of support Obama is receiving among Jews. This was latest poll. If Obama's one-sided pressure on Israel continues along with his lack of a creditable policy in dealing with a Iran, I would think this his support among Jews will further erode.
However, though I can't speak for any Jew beside myself, there must be a an alternative to vote for. In 1980, Ronald Reagan was a alternative that many Jews could support. I don't know who among the current crop of Republicans could succeed as well as Reagan.

414 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:24:33pm

re: #410 ryannon

He must be one evil motha: he's got the gift of invisibility.

hahaha
Ok, I'll try again:
Image: ?action=view&current=alleycat.jpg

415 Ojoe  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:24:55pm

re: #397 Walter L. Newton

How do you load a photo like that onto LGF?

416 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:25:41pm

re: #414 webevintage

hahaha
Ok, I'll try again:
Image: ?action=view&current=alleycat.jpg

417 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:25:54pm

re: #416 windsagio

oops forgot the text, I fixed it for you so it'd show :D

418 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:26:42pm

re: #417 windsagio

oops forgot the text, I fixed it for you so it'd show :D


THANK YOU!

419 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:26:59pm

re: #406 Cato the Elder

Do I -think- he's doing it intentionally, yes. Do I know for sure, no.

I'm going by his treatment of Israel since his election. I had problems with his associations with people like Ayers, Farrakhan, and Wright since before the election. The fact that he initially distanced himself does not impress me - you don't spend 20 years listening to someone without it having an effect on you.

Since he's been in office he has snubbed Israel on many occaisions. The reaction to the announcement of construction in Ramat Shlomo during Biden's visit is one of them. Don't know if it was reported in the U.S., but the construction in Ramat Shlomo has been ongoing for many years, and anonuncementduring Biden's visit was an internal political push by a Kadima MK who wanted to make Netanyahu look bad.

420 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:30:00pm

This is who we're dealing with.

They would rather destroy food that helps their own people than take anything from Jews.

421 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:30:17pm

re: #410 ryannon

He must be one evil motha: he's got the gift of invisibility.

That is a beautiful kitty. Since we're sharing, here's a shot of my girl, Mila.

422 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:32:11pm

re: #420 Alkmyst

do you use any other sources?

423 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:33:33pm

re: #420 Alkmyst

This is who we're dealing with.

They would rather destroy food that helps their own people than take anything from Jews.

The real enemies of the Palestinians are the PA, Hamas, Hezbollah, and related thugs & creeps. All you hear about is the illegal blockage and siege of Gaza, but never the mention of the hundreds of thousands of tons of food and medical aid that pour into the strip via Israel. The media bias against Israel very much bothers me.

424 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:34:42pm

re: #394 Alkmyst

The fact is whether or not it's intentional, the arab muslim mentality sees any attempt at outreach as weakness, and they are emboldened to attack.

Um, "arab muslim mentality"? Are you positing that Arab Muslims are one big homogeneous blob lacking any latitude of individuality in their thinking or actions?

425 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:35:29pm

re: #417 windsagio

oops forgot the text, I fixed it for you so it'd show :D

Thanks - and it doesn't look much like an alley cat to me.

I need step by step instructions for loading an image.

426 Political Atheist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:35:43pm

re: #421 eclectic infidel
Cute as can be.
Cat thread!
Well, if I share may as well...

427 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:36:07pm

re: #400 Alkmyst

I don't quite follow your meaning there... are you saying that the attacks weren't as widely reported?

No, I mean that other IDF action in Gaza wasn't as widely reported.

428 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:36:42pm

re: #419 Alkmyst

Do I -think- he's doing it intentionally, yes. Do I know for sure, no.

I'm going by his treatment of Israel since his election. I had problems with his associations with people like Ayers, Farrakhan, and Wright since before the election. The fact that he initially distanced himself does not impress me - you don't spend 20 years listening to someone without it having an effect on you.

Since he's been in office he has snubbed Israel on many occaisions. The reaction to the announcement of construction in Ramat Shlomo during Biden's visit is one of them. Don't know if it was reported in the U.S., but the construction in Ramat Shlomo has been ongoing for many years, and anonuncementduring Biden's visit was an internal political push by a Kadima MK who wanted to make Netanyahu look bad.

Farrakhan? That's a new one on me. What, did he buy a bean pie off one of those NOI street vendors once in 1993? Guess what, I've bought them in Baltimore. They're not that bad.

So nuts to that Kadima MK for the shit-stirring.

What you're saying is you think Obama goes and talks with Arab leaders (and by the way, since Cairo, how many direct contacts has he had - I don't know, but I can't recall that many outside the Saudi king, whom Bush blew on a regular basis) knowing that it will encourage anti-Semitic attacks worldwide?

Pshaw.

I'm one of the strongest defenders of Israel on this blog, as Dr. Cordell and various trolls can testify by their throbbing butthurt. But I also won't hesitate to call Obamanoia what it is - sad, paranoid and factitious.

429 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:39:15pm

re: #425 Stanley Sea

:D

2 easy steps:

1) make sure its a link directly to hte image (that was webvintages mistake), none of that code mumbo-jumbo.

2) paste the image like a youtube video

OR

2) put the image in like a normal link,

3) go into the text and insert the bolded text where I have it:

a href="URL" rel="shadowbox" target="_blank"

The advantage of doing it the long way is you can make the text say whatever you want, like a normal link :D

430 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:41:55pm

re: #422 windsagio

I'll use Ynet... as they reported about Elie Weisel, and his appeal to Obama to halt pressuring us.


As previously mentioned, Haaretz I will not. They are defending a reporter of theirs, Uri Blau, who is still out of the country facing questioning over the return of some 2000 classified documents obtained from Anat Kamm while she was in her army service.

431 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:42:10pm

Wright honors farrakhan

snip

Obama's Minister Honored Farrakhan
Monday, 14 Jan 2008 07:49 PM Article Font Size
By: Ronald Kessler


Barack Obama’s longtime minister, mentor, and sounding board has been a key supporter of Louis Farrakhan and last month honored the Nation of Islam leader for lifetime achievement.

Farrakhan has repeatedly made hate-filled statements targeting Jews, whites, America, and homosexuals. He has called whites “blue-eyed devils” and the “anti-Christ.” He has described Jews as “bloodsuckers” who control the government, the media, and some black organizations.

432 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:42:40pm

re: #429 windsagio

:D

2 easy steps:

1) make sure its a link directly to hte image (that was webvintages mistake), none of that code mumbo-jumbo.

2) paste the image like a youtube video

OR

2) put the image in like a normal link,

3) go into the text and insert the bolded text where I have it:

a href="URL" rel="shadowbox" target="_blank"

The advantage of doing it the long way is you can make the text say whatever you want, like a normal link :D

Thank you!

I'm freaking printing that out. Will try in awhile.

433 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:43:20pm

re: #424 CuriousLurker

Um, "arab muslim mentality"? Are you positing that Arab Muslims are one big homogeneous blob lacking any latitude of individuality in their thinking or actions?

If you read their own news, it would appear that way. Clearly there are some that think differently, but they do not get treated very well if they speak up; also born out by their own news.

434 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:43:31pm

re: #430 Alkmyst

That's about what I figured, thanks.

435 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:46:01pm

Lakers win game one...
It's not they they have 2 7 footers..It's Kobe...I posted last night I thought his knees may be gone..They are not..In the 4th quarter Kobe rose and shot about 14 feet high...Good Lord If Kobe can do that there is no way the Lakers don't win the west..What a stud!

436 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:47:54pm

re: #431 swamprat

Wright honors farrakhan

snip

Obama's Minister Honored Farrakhan
Monday, 14 Jan 2008 07:49 PM Article Font Size
By: Ronald Kessler

Barack Obama’s longtime minister, mentor, and sounding board has been a key supporter of Louis Farrakhan and last month honored the Nation of Islam leader for lifetime achievement.

Farrakhan has repeatedly made hate-filled statements targeting Jews, whites, America, and homosexuals. He has called whites “blue-eyed devils” and the “anti-Christ.” He has described Jews as “bloodsuckers” who control the government, the media, and some black organizations.

Oh well...

437 Dancing along the light of day  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:48:50pm

re: #435 HoosierHoops

He'd better earn that salary!

438 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:48:51pm

re: #424 CuriousLurker

Um, "arab muslim mentality"? Are you positing that Arab Muslims are one big homogeneous blob lacking any latitude of individuality in their thinking or actions?

Why of course they are. Just as all athiests must act alike, all christians must act alike and so on. Didn't you get the memo? God sent it out last week to everybody so He didn't have to keep using a scorecard to keep all our factions straight ...

/ Why yes it's sarc.

William

439 prairiefire  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:49:16pm

Such cute kitties! I'm glad I can enjoy them on LGF with out the sneezing and itchy skin they cause in the meat world.
18 years ago, after my 3rd sinus infection in 10 months, my Dr. said "I have a cure for your chronic infections!" He showed me his RX pad with the words "Get rid of you cats" written on it.

440 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:50:34pm
441 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:50:47pm

re: #436 brookly red

Lol, Wright.

And a 2 year old article no less!

442 Linden Arden  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:51:24pm

re: #396 MJ

He's falling fast:

Major Findings:

I. A plurality of Jewish voters would consider someone else for President.


[Link: www.mclaughlinonline.com...]

"someone else" = another Democrat.

With this Tea Party nuttiness rampant American Jews are not about to support a right-winger.

443 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:52:22pm

re: #441 windsagio

Lol, Wright.

And a 2 year old article no less!

Giggle, giggle, that's so, like, yesterday!

444 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:52:51pm

re: #434 windsagio

There are few news sources in English from Israel that I would consider legitimate. Haaretz has shown time and time again that they are more interested in demonizing religious Jews and "settlers" than they are in reporting fact. That they now are crying about freedom of the press and such impresses me not, since they were all for shutting down Arutz Sheva radio a few years ago, and are currently involved in trying to shut down a free newspaper called Israel HaYom (printed in Hebrew and distributed free) because it is supportive of Netanyahu.

445 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:53:05pm

re: #441 windsagio

Lol, Wright.

And a 2 year old article no less!

don't get me wrong about Wright. I am not a fan, but I don't see any reason to bang my head on the desk about it.

446 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:53:16pm

re: #443 Bagua

If you can't even stick with new talking points, why bother at all?

447 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:53:48pm

re: #442 Linden Arden

"someone else" = another Democrat.

With this Tea Party nuttiness rampant American Jews are not about to support a right-winger.

we aren't?

448 avanti  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:53:58pm

re: #431 swamprat

Wright honors farrakhan

snip

Obama's Minister Honored Farrakhan
Monday, 14 Jan 2008 07:49 PM Article Font Size
By: Ronald Kessler

Barack Obama’s longtime minister, mentor, and sounding board has been a key supporter of Louis Farrakhan and last month honored the Nation of Islam leader for lifetime achievement.

Farrakhan has repeatedly made hate-filled statements targeting Jews, whites, America, and homosexuals. He has called whites “blue-eyed devils” and the “anti-Christ.” He has described Jews as “bloodsuckers” who control the government, the media, and some black organizations.

2008, I remember it well, Wright was 24/7 on Fox, probably still hear about it in 2012 too.

449 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:54:19pm

re: #440 Naso Tang

Heads-up! A spectacular site will be streaking overhead if you are lucky enough to live along the landing path planned for the space shuttle Discovery.

Could this reporter have just come from a Tea Party demonstration?/

I'd love to see a 'site' streak overhead.

Come on, it's a journalist. You expect better from them for some reason?
/

450 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:55:10pm

re: #444 Alkmyst

I don't know haaretz from my own ass.

I can however parse alot from the way you talk about things showing what your criteria for a news organization are.

451 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:55:11pm

re: #449 Van Helsing

I'd love to see a 'site' streak overhead.

Come on, it's a journalist. You expect better from them for some reason?
/

I guess they can't afford editors anymore.

452 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:55:21pm

re: #446 windsagio

If you can't even stick with new talking points, why bother at all?

I'm fellin' ya. So what do the hip kids think about subject? What is their spin?

453 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:56:31pm

re: #452 Bagua

The hep kids don't spend any time thining about it anymore, really.

Its only the old farts that get all worked up about it.

454 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:56:40pm

re: #453 windsagio

*thinking, dammit.

455 Lidane  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:56:44pm

re: #448 avanti

2008, I remember it well, Wright was 24/7 on Fox, probably still hear about it in 2012 too.

Wright, Ayers, ACORN...it's all going to be there in 2012. There will still be calls for the birth certificate, accusations of being a seekrit Muslin Nazi Communist and an Al Qaeda plant, and all the other nutbar conspiracies.

456 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:56:45pm

re: #437 Floral Giraffe

He'd better earn that salary!

I loved the story last year in SI about Kobe..The writer was ridding in Kobe's yellow sportscar to the Staples Center and everybody on the freeway was hanging out the window waving to Kobe and he didn't notice anybody on the way to work...Completely focused on Ball in his 1/4 of a million dollar sports car....

457 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:57:05pm

pimf: feelin'

458 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:57:11pm

re: #452 Bagua

I'm fellin' ya. So what do the hip kids think about subject? What is their spin?

hip kids don't think, thats why there hip.

459 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:57:23pm

re: #433 Naso Tang

re: #424 CuriousLurker

Um, "arab muslim mentality"? Are you positing that Arab Muslims are one big homogeneous blob lacking any latitude of individuality in their thinking or actions?


If you read their own news, it would appear that way. Clearly there are some that think differently, but they do not get treated very well if they speak up; also born out by their own news.

That's about the gist of it. From personal experience, there are arab muslims that when speaking one on one will express sentiments of desire to just live their life, but when in groups, even small ones, revert to general anti-Jew rhetoric. So0 it makes it really difficult for me to trust them.

460 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:57:49pm

re: #456 HoosierHoops

I still remember with some distaste his crap with the second pro olympics team.

"I already got a gold medal."


/speaking of bringing up old stuff.

461 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:57:51pm

re: #444 Alkmyst

There are few news sources in English from Israel that I would consider legitimate. Haaretz has shown time and time again that they are more interested in demonizing religious Jews and "settlers" than they are in reporting fact. That they now are crying about freedom of the press and such impresses me not, since they were all for shutting down Arutz Sheva radio a few years ago, and are currently involved in trying to shut down a free newspaper called Israel HaYom (printed in Hebrew and distributed free) because it is supportive of Netanyahu.

I get most of my Israel news from YNet. Haaretz is too far-left and Arutz 7 is too far-right, and Jerusalem Post format sucks.

462 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:59:18pm

re: #433 Naso Tang

If you read their own news, it would appear that way. Clearly there are some that think differently, but they do not get treated very well if they speak up; also born out by their own news.

Regarding the news, perhaps so, but I wouldn't know as I don't have access to all Arabic news sources, nor do I read Arabic well enough to be able to understand them if I did. What I was taking issue with was the blanket statement. What if someone here said (in a negative context) "Israeli Jewish mentality" or "Asian Buddhist mentality" or "Irish Catholic mentality" or "Atheist mentality" or "African American mentailty" or... need I go on? FWIW, I would object just as strenuously to those characterizations as I would to the one I took issue with.

463 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 2:59:54pm

re: #436 brookly red

Oh well...

Yeah, things could always be worse...

464 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:00:22pm

re: #462 CuriousLurker

Its pretty clear that the whole point is the bigotry.

465 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:01:05pm

re: #453 windsagio

The hep kids don't spend any time thining about it anymore, really.

Its only the old farts that get all worked up about it.

I realise that, by why this need to "parse" us old farts when you don't fully understand the issues or even know one news source from another?

There are those of us who look at the media critically, like you do posters here, and we examine their biases and flaws.

466 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:01:37pm

re: #446 windsagio


President orders hit on American citizen.

snip

WASHINGTON — The Obama administration has taken the extraordinary step of authorizing the targeted killing of an American citizen, the radical Muslim cleric Anwar al-Awlaki, who is believed to have shifted from encouraging attacks on the United States to directly participating in them, intelligence and counterterrorism officials said Tuesday.

Mr. Awlaki, who was born in New Mexico and spent years in the United States as an imam...

467 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:01:42pm

re: #463 ryannon

Yeah, things could always be worse...

not so much... but why discuss the obvious, it is what it is.

468 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:01:44pm

re: #465 Bagua

lol@trying to pick a fight.

469 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:02:19pm

re: #459 Alkmyst

From personal experience, there are arab muslims that when speaking one on one will express sentiments of desire to just live their life, but when in groups, even small ones, revert to general anti-Jew rhetoric. So0 it makes it really difficult for me to trust them.

And had that been what you'd actually said, i wouldn't have taken issue with it.

470 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:02:27pm

re: #466 swamprat

Its new, I admit >>

Not sure the point of posting it in this context tho'.

471 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:03:04pm

re: #468 windsagio

lol@trying to pick a fight.

We don't call it picking a fight
We call it pulling a Walter
/

472 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:03:29pm

re: #471 HoosierHoops

OK, that made me snort.

and I like Walter!

473 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:04:14pm

re: #447 brookly red

we aren't?

Statistically? We aren't.

474 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:04:25pm

re: #451 Naso Tang

I guess they can't afford editors anymore.

Or perhaps they still can and the editor is sub-optimal as well.

475 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:04:48pm

re: #428 Cato the Elder

I know that you are a defender of Israel, I remember. However, I don't have Obamanoia. I simply don't trust him. Never have, and most likely never will.

I still have issues with Bush for not declaring Jerusalem as the site for the embassy, but that no longer relevant.

Regarding how the arab world in general is vis-a-vis Israel in regards to the relationship with Obama, either direct or perceived, I'll use this example.

Yesterday

Today

476 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:05:06pm

re: #466 swamprat

President orders hit on American citizen.

Have you been deep in the swamp where there's no internet for the past week?

This is old stuff.

477 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:05:59pm

re: #452 Bagua

I'm fellin' ya. So what do the hip kids think about subject? What is their spin?

Wright is over. Farrakhan is irrelevent. Nu, what next?

478 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:06:12pm

re: #426 Rightwingconspirator

Cute as can be.
Cat thread!
Well, if I share may as well...

Kitties!!!!
(Pepper the Gray Menance...funny, funny name)
So much better then arguing about how much Obama must hate Israel and obviously the only reason he became President is because Ayers and Wright told him too.

479 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:06:19pm

re: #468 windsagio

lol@trying to pick a fight.

Not at all, just making an observation. You assume all interaction is hostile, as you have an us against the bastards mentality. I don't see the contest, it's just chat with a bunch of virtual friends.

I can snark back at you, which from you is constant. Any reply and it is termed "picking a fight," that is nonsense. Don't be so sensitive.

480 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:07:10pm

re: #479 Bagua

mmhmm, that's totally what you're doing.

Sorry man, I know your history :P

481 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:07:13pm

re: #451 Naso Tang

I guess they can't afford editors anymore.

No one will pay for editors anymore.

That's why I get my nit-pick kicks on LGF, the Route 66 of the internet.

482 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:07:15pm

re: #459 Alkmyst

That's about the gist of it. From personal experience, there are arab muslims that when speaking one on one will express sentiments of desire to just live their life, but when in groups, even small ones, revert to general anti-Jew rhetoric. So0 it makes it really difficult for me to trust them.

I'm no social expert, but I lived many years in the Gulf states and the one feeling that could never be denied is that there is a mentality of "them versus infidels" which derives from more than tradition. It is taught.

Having said that, I was lucky enough to be there first time in the 70's. Then there was a genuine tradition of hospitality and tolerance. By the 90's that was mostly gone, collectively speaking.

483 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:07:15pm

re: #394 Alkmyst

wow, first off excuse my typos on that last.

As to whether or not he's doing it intentionally, I have no way of knowing. But there consistently seems to be a rise in attacks after he speaks with another muslim leader.

The fact is whether or not it's intentional, the arab muslim mentality sees any attempt at outreach as weakness, and they are emboldened to attack.

God, whatever

484 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:07:54pm

re: #466 swamprat

President orders hit on American citizen.

snip

WASHINGTON — The Obama administration has taken the extraordinary step of authorizing the targeted killing of an American citizen, the radical Muslim cleric Anwar al-Awlaki, who is believed to have shifted from encouraging attacks on the United States to directly participating in them, intelligence and counterterrorism officials said Tuesday.

Mr. Awlaki, who was born in New Mexico and spent years in the United States as an imam...

OK, that's current. Your thoughts?

485 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:07:58pm

re: #483 WindUpBird

486 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:08:39pm

re: #477 SanFranciscoZionist

Wright is over. Farrakhan is irrelevent. Nu, what next?

The man who considers them mentors is in the White House.

I still remember the radio interview Charles posted here in August 2008 where Obama expressed his views of the US Constitution.

Not pleased then, not pleased now.

487 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:08:56pm

re: #475 Alkmyst

I know that you are a defender of Israel, I remember. However, I don't have Obamanoia. I simply don't trust him. Never have, and most likely never will.

I still have issues with Bush for not declaring Jerusalem as the site for the embassy, but that no longer relevant.

Regarding how the arab world in general is vis-a-vis Israel in regards to the relationship with Obama, either direct or perceived, I'll use this example.

Yesterday

Today

I see two news articles.

What I don't see is a direct link, however tenuous.

488 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:08:58pm

re: #448 avanti

Obdicut, wozzablog, and I were just talking about this last week.

Isn't that right , Obdicut?

489 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:09:20pm

re: #477 SanFranciscoZionist

Wright is over. Farrakhan is irrelevent. Nu, what next?

Two years is not a long time in politics, issues around Bush, or Clinton or any present swirl about while they remain candidates. There is a midterm coming up and then another big one in 2012. We may be bored by certain issues but they did not disappear.

490 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:09:38pm

re: #486 Van Helsing

The man who considers them mentors is in the White House.

I still remember the radio interview Charles posted here in August 2008 where Obama expressed his views of the US Constitution.

Not pleased then, not pleased now.

FARRAKHAN? You're what we like to call a lying curl of shit.

491 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:09:54pm

re: #431 swamprat

Wright honors farrakhan

snip

Obama's Minister Honored Farrakhan
Monday, 14 Jan 2008 07:49 PM Article Font Size
By: Ronald Kessler

Well there ya go.
Obama MUST be a super!sekert Muslim Jew Hater.
/

492 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:09:55pm

Lol, matrix, man up!

493 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:11:43pm

re: #484 SanFranciscoZionist

Real change.
It offends both sides.
This is the kind of real trend-breaking I was hoping for.

Others may disagree, especially in light of the torture controversy.

494 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:11:44pm

re: #486 Van Helsing

The man who considers them mentors is in the White House.

I still remember the radio interview Charles posted here in August 2008 where Obama expressed his views of the US Constitution.

Not pleased then, not pleased now.

Obama considers Farrakhan a mentor? Interesting.

Otherwise, I'm not interested in hearing the whining and the crying about Wright and Ayers any more. They both appear to be out of the picture, and Obama has a record of his own as president for us to worry about. Fuck Wright and Ayers, because Obama most certainly has, and let us move on.

495 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:11:48pm

re: #486 Van Helsing

Obama does not consider Farrakhan a mentor. Why the hell do you believe something like that?

496 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:12:02pm

re: #491 webevintage

Well there ya go.
Obama MUST be a super!sekert Muslim Jew Hater.
/

Of course. Because if person A honors person B, that has direct implications for person C, even if C has long since disavowed both B and A.

It's sorta like the political version of superstring theory.

497 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:12:23pm

re: #490 WindUpBird

FARRAKHAN? You're what we like to call a lying curl of shit.

I'll amend that. He considers Wright a mentor.

My apologies.

498 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:12:26pm

re: #495 Obdicut

Easier to think of him as "Other", if he's associated with black radicals?

499 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:12:35pm

re: #487 Cato the Elder

What I said earlier is that when it is perceived that Obama is preferential to the arab cause, they are emboldened, and attacks occur with more frequency.

500 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:12:42pm

re: #491 webevintage

Well there ya go.
Obama MUST be a super!sekert Muslim Jew Hater.
/

see, those black people they all think alike

can't allow them to be in power because FARRAKHAN they'll like paint the white house black or soemthing

///
//
/
/
/
/

501 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:12:46pm

re: #496 Cato the Elder

Of course. Because if person A honors person B, that has direct implications for person C, even if C has long since disavowed both B and A.

It's sorta like the political version of superstring theory.

Or Seven Degrees of Kevin Bacon?

502 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:12:56pm

re: #492 windsagio

So you want me to egg on a "fight" as you call it? No thanks.

503 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:13:01pm

re: #488 swamprat

About what? The amount of 24/7 media attention the Wright stuff got?

Sorry, I'm a little distracted.

504 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:13:12pm

re: #462 CuriousLurker

Regarding the news, perhaps so, but I wouldn't know as I don't have access to all Arabic news sources, nor do I read Arabic well enough to be able to understand them if I did. What I was taking issue with was the blanket statement. What if someone here said (in a negative context) "Israeli Jewish mentality" or "Asian Buddhist mentality" or "Irish Catholic mentality" or "Atheist mentality" or "African American mentailty" or... need I go on? FWIW, I would object just as strenuously to those characterizations as I would to the one I took issue with.

There can be unpleasant collective truths in all those examples you give and I could, to balance the equation, say some pretty unpleasant collective things about Israeli Jews who think they were given certain lands by a god, or certain sects of African Americans who wear their pants below their butts, presumably as an excuse to fondle their balls while they hold them up.

However, if hatred of Jews is racism, then there are no more racist groups than Arab Muslims, and that evidence long predates Israel.

505 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:13:12pm

re: #489 Bagua

Two years is not a long time in politics, issues around Bush, or Clinton or any present swirl about while they remain candidates. There is a midterm coming up and then another big one in 2012. We may be bored by certain issues but they did not disappear.

This is a stupid issue. Let's find another one.

506 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:13:29pm

re: #498 windsagio

Easier to think of him as "Other", if he's associated with black radicals?

and easier to call him a n-word in polite racist company. WELL, HE'S LIKE FARRAKHAN'S STUDENT!

507 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:13:53pm

re: #480 windsagio

mmhmm, that's totally what you're doing.

Sorry man, I know your history :P

And I know your history Windsagio. You happily snipe away, as you were, and then bristle at the meanies when you get noticed. You maintain a steady stream of low level heckling, why can't you take a tiny bit in return?

Is any comment on your personal posting style off limits? That is weird considering the majority of your posting is observations about other posters and their motivations. Lighten up and enjoy.

508 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:14:16pm

re: #492 windsagio

Lol, matrix, man up!

He can't, he's a-skeered o' me.

509 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:14:17pm

re: #501 webevintage

Or Seven Degrees of Kevin Bacon?

ahahahah ding ding ding ding

510 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:14:21pm

re: #497 Van Helsing

I'll amend that. He considers Wright a mentor.

My apologies.

He DID consider Wright a mentor.
At one time.
No more.
Past history.
Life moves on.

511 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:14:41pm

re: #508 Cato the Elder

You wish.

512 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:15:12pm

re: #497 Van Helsing

I'll amend that. He considers Wright a mentor.

My apologies.

So you repeat a different lie?

Nice apology.

513 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:15:14pm

re: #489 Bagua

Two years is not a long time in politics, issues around Bush, or Clinton or any present swirl about while they remain candidates. There is a midterm coming up and then another big one in 2012. We may be bored by certain issuesginned up talking points but they did not disappear.

missed a spot

514 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:15:31pm

re: #494 SanFranciscoZionist

At the risk of being yelled at incessantly, I saw a post a week or so ago from Pamela Geller with Excel sheets from the WH website detailing recent visits from both to the WH.

515 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:15:37pm

re: #497 Van Helsing

I'll amend that. He considers Wright a mentor.

My apologies.

put the sheet back on, David Duke

516 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:15:56pm

re: #497 Van Helsing

I'll amend that. He considers considered Wright a mentor.

My apologies.

Further amended.

Obama's all grown up now and doesn't need mentors so much anymore.

517 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:15:56pm

re: #495 Obdicut

Obama does not consider Farrakhan a mentor. Why the hell do you believe something like that?

Because it fits the pigeonhole Obama is supposed to go into.

518 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:16:00pm

re: #505 SanFranciscoZionist

This is a stupid issue. Let's find another one.

I agreed, by the way, but it is not irrelevant to everyone, it is a bit of recent history. If someone wants to make a brief mention and cite a two year article, no problem, we are free to comment or ignore it.

519 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:16:51pm

re: #514 Alkmyst

At the risk of being yelled at incessantly, I saw a post a week or so ago from Pamela Geller with Excel sheets from the WH website detailing recent visits from both to the WH.

Hahahaha

520 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:16:52pm

re: #499 Alkmyst

What I said earlier is that when it is perceived that Obama is preferential to the arab cause, they are emboldened, and attacks occur with more frequency.

So far I am not seeing any actual evidence on this theory of yours.

521 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:16:58pm

re: #514 Alkmyst

At the risk of being yelled at incessantly, I saw a post a week or so ago from Pamela Geller with Excel sheets from the WH website detailing recent visits from both to the WH.

Oh Jesus.
You actually think that there are no other people in this country named Wright or Ayers?
Come on....
Why would anyone even pay any attention to Geller?

From now on your posts say nothing but wocka wocka wocka.....

522 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:17:03pm

re: #514 Alkmyst

I'm sorry, Crazy Shrieker Excel sheets what?

523 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:17:26pm

re: #515 WindUpBird

put the sheet back on, David Duke

sooner or later if you cry racist enough people get de-sensitized...

524 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:17:32pm

re: #511 TheMatrix31

You wish.

Ha! Made you look.

525 Lidane  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:17:57pm

re: #494 SanFranciscoZionist

Obama has a record of his own as president for us to worry about.

Yeah, this.

I don't care one whit about Wright, Ayers, ACORN, Farrakhan (lol, as if), Sharpton, or any other ridiculous conspiracies that people have about President Obama. I only care about what the man does as President. Period.

I voted for him with no regrets, but his presidency has been far from perfect. His time in office is all I'm going to be looking at in 2012 when I'm deciding on whether or not to give him my vote again. I could give a fuck about Wright or Ayers or any of that other garbage. The only folks who care about that anymore are the ones who are determined to turn the President into an "other", or make him out to be un-American, or different from everyone else somehow.

I'd rather focus on his actions and accomplishments, myself.

526 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:18:01pm

re: #513 WindUpBird

missed a spot

I don't disagree that most politics is ginned up to point of drunkenness. And this particular issue is one that bores me.

527 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:18:03pm

re: #495 Obdicut

Well Obdicut, last week I made what I considered a innocuous statement about this very subject, and wound up being called a liar. And got chastised for taking offense at it. Today, I think someone is misquoting an article where WRIGHT is named as Obamas' "mentor".
Whether the writer of the article is a "liar" I'll let you decide.

528 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:18:04pm

re: #514 Alkmyst

At the risk of being yelled at incessantly, I saw a post a week or so ago from Pamela Geller with Excel sheets from the WH website detailing recent visits from both to the WH.

It's not worth yelling at people who bring up Pamela Geller as a source, it's more like we're giggling at a kid with a big snot on his chin

529 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:18:07pm

re: #516 Cato the Elder

Further amended.

Obama's all grown up now and doesn't need mentors so much anymore.

Fair enough.

I wonder if he has changed his views on the Constitution as well.

530 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:18:50pm

re: #515 WindUpBird

Brutal diss! I likie!

531 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:18:52pm

re: #517 SanFranciscoZionist

Because it fits the pigeonhole Obama is supposed to go into.

It surrrrre does.

532 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:19:16pm

re: #525 Lidane

His time in office is all I'm going to be looking at in 2012 when I'm deciding on whether or not to give him my vote again.

Well that and who is running on the other side.
President Palin anyone?

533 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:19:42pm

re: #527 swamprat

I'm sorry, dude, I really don't remember what the hell you're talking about. Obama has definitively and publicly broken with Wright, and there is no reason to believe he is currently Obama's mentor in any way, shape, or form.

534 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:19:50pm

re: #528 WindUpBird

It's not worth yelling at people who bring up Pamela Geller as a source, it's more like we're giggling at a kid with a big snot on his chin

Thanks to webevintage we have a saying

wocka wocka wocka

been awhile since it's been needed, but dang that time did come around again.

535 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:19:56pm

re: #530 windsagio

So in your book, its okay to paint someone as a Klansman but its not okay for someone to say Wright was Obama's mentor/spiritual advisor?!

I see.

536 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:20:11pm

re: #514 Alkmyst

At the risk of being yelled at incessantly, I saw a post a week or so ago from Pamela Geller with Excel sheets from the WH website detailing recent visits from both to the WH.

Oh, Lord.

Pam Geller is a nutcase, you know that, right?

537 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:20:33pm

re: #529 Van Helsing

Fair enough.

"I wonder if he has changed his views on the Constitution as well."

...Van Helsing stammered, lips dripping with sauce, as he choked on a turkey leg comprised of his own racist stupidity

538 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:20:40pm

re: #517 SanFranciscoZionist

Because it fits the pigeonhole Obama is supposed to go into.

Can't harsh the narrative...

539 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:21:06pm

re: #516 Cato the Elder

Further amended.

Obama's all grown up now and doesn't need mentors so much anymore.

I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt that the unsavory people in his past were useful to him at the time. Of course that means pragmatism and is not necessarily a compliment; but are there any politicians who didn't use people to get where they wanted to be?

540 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:21:06pm

re: #499 Alkmyst

What I said earlier is that when it is perceived that Obama is preferential to the arab cause, they are emboldened, and attacks occur with more frequency.

Yeah, right.

Tell me again, when was the height of the "second intifada"?

And who was president then?

And, assuming as I do that by Arab cause you correctly mean the destruction of Israel, show me exactly how Obama prefers that option, would you?

Because if you can I'm going to have to rethink my whole world.

541 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:21:08pm

re: #532 webevintage

Palin is not running for office. She's too busy making millions of dollars. Who needs politics?

542 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:21:17pm

re: #518 Bagua

I agreed, by the way, but it is not irrelevant to everyone, it is a bit of recent history. If someone wants to make a brief mention and cite a two year article, no problem, we are free to comment or ignore it.

Yes, and I'm commenting. This is BS, has been from the beginning, and I am bored with playing the dumb-ass Jeremiah Wright game.

543 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:21:34pm

re: #521 webevintage

Yeah I figured it would induce this type of reaction, so much for listening to the other side of a debate.

I happen to have met her in person when she was here in Israel, and she was far from shreiking.

544 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:21:41pm

re: #537 WindUpBird

...Van Helsing stammered, lips dripping with sauce, as he choked on a turkey leg comprised of his own racist stupidity

....wow.....

If shock value is what you're going for, you're doing a helluva fuckin' job.

545 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:21:41pm

re: #538 webevintage

Can't harsh the narrative...

Looking pretty dire if that's all they've got. Still.

546 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:22:12pm

re: #535 TheMatrix31

Yup, well if the shoe fits anyways.


The problem with the slur you're lovin, is that shoe doesn't fit so well.


At least I scared you out into the open tho :D

547 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:22:25pm

re: #543 Alkmyst

I have never met a Geller supporter before. It's pretty damn shocking.

548 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:22:27pm

re: #535 TheMatrix31

So in your book, its okay to paint someone as a Klansman but its not okay for someone to say Wright was Obama's mentor/spiritual advisor?!

I see.

we see Duke, Byrd... lalala can't hear you

549 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:23:01pm

re: #546 windsagio

You didn't scare me for shit. I don't give a fuck about you, I just don't like being called out.

550 Henchman 25  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:23:04pm

re: #543 Alkmyst

I happen to have met her in person when she was here in Israel, and she was far from shreiking.

You don't get around much, do you?

551 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:23:08pm

re: #540 Cato the Elder

The 2nd intifada started right around the same time as Bush's entrance to office, maybe slightly before, I forget.

552 Lidane  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:23:09pm

re: #532 webevintage

Well that and who is running on the other side.
President Palin anyone?

The chances of me voting Republican in 2012, especially if this Tea Party silliness continues until then, are pretty much nil, unless President Obama really fucks up in some catastrophic way.

Those chances are even lower if Palin is the nominee. I actually like this country. Caribou Barbie as president would be horrifying. No thanks. If she's the nominee and I decide I can't vote for President Obama, I'll write someone in or vote third party. Simple as that.

553 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:23:15pm

re: #546 windsagio

The shoe, by the way, is a racist cowboy boot.

554 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:23:23pm

re: #529 Van Helsing

Fair enough.

I wonder if he has changed his views on the Constitution as well.

That's a lovely bit of passive-aggressive snideness. What do you think? Does his presidency appear to you in line with the views he expressed earlier?

555 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:23:30pm

re: #50 Walter L. Newton

They shouldn't be making fun of Mohammed, any more than things like "pissing on Allah's name" and mocking the Mormons (up and coming broadway musical by the South Park guys). We really should be trying to understand the different religious cultures, not trying to fight them all the time.

I disagree.

Walters new avatar- a Jimmah-Ice production :D

556 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:23:58pm

re: #549 TheMatrix31

"Thematrix31 threatens to beat someone up over the internet in 5...4...3..."

557 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:24:16pm

re: #553 windsagio

The shoe, by the way, is a racist cowboy boot.

you sure do use the word racist a lot....

558 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:24:33pm

re: #556 windsagio

lol, so transparent.

What a joke.

559 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:24:48pm

re: #543 Alkmyst

What do you think about the things that Geller has said about Charles, Alkmyst?

560 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:24:49pm

re: #533 Obdicut

It went something like this. I said that an honest person who listened to Wrights' sermons would admit that he promoted violence. Wozzablog said drop my line about him being a liar, or pony up the links. I told wozzablog to piss himself, and you had much to say about the subject.

561 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:24:57pm

re: #557 brookly red

I've only used it once so far. Its mainly WUB tonight.

I like 'bigoted', because most of the bigots on here are anti-islam ones, and

Islam is not a race.
562 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:25:18pm

re: #515 WindUpBird

put the sheet back on, David Duke

Bullshit. Suggesting a fellow commenter is a klansman is beyond ginned up, that is hallucinogenic. Surely you can do better than that.

563 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:25:33pm

re: #560 swamprat

Oh, yeah. You were completely wrong to say that. Absolutely and completely wrong. And you were wrong to fly off the handle in the way that you did.

I'm really not sure why you'd want to bring this up again.

564 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:25:47pm

re: #561 windsagio

I've only used it once so far. Its mainly WUB tonight.

I like 'bigoted', because most of the bigots on here are anti-islam ones, and

OK ...

565 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:26:02pm

re: #535 TheMatrix31

So in your book, its okay to paint someone as a Klansman but its not okay for someone to say Wright was Obama's mentor/spiritual advisor?!

I see.

No, I don't think you do see. Because Obama has a billion mentors if you ask these walking GOP talking points with weak minds who repeat by rote whatever made-up bon mot that Limbaugh spoon feeds them. Depending on the radio loudmouth or the crypto-racist blogger-of-the-week: It's Ayers, it's Alinski, it's Wright, it's Farrakhan, it's Ming the Mierciless, it's the Master Control Program from Tron, it's Saddam Hussein, it's The Ayatollah Khomeni, it's Karl Marx, it's Groucho Marx, it's Mark Lanegan, it's fucking Big Bird.

And yeah, if someone tries and ties Farrakhan to Obama? They're a sheetwearer. Wrap your lips around that and blow.

566 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:26:03pm

re: #564 brookly red

Thank you for your understanding.

567 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:26:16pm

re: #537 WindUpBird

...Van Helsing stammered, lips dripping with sauce, as he choked on a turkey leg comprised of his own racist stupidity

Did you hear the interview I was referring to?

568 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:26:29pm

I am amazed that there are people out there who spend their days making Excel sheets of who visits the White House and then claims that the Wrights or Ayers on the list are THE Wright and THE Ayers without thinking that there are millions and millions of people in the United States and a few of them might also be named J. Wright and B. Ayers.

Logic people.
It is your friend.

569 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:26:30pm

re: #547 Obdicut

Do I support every word she says? Probably not. Her blog is in my RSS feed, as is this one.

As to her and Charles, I'm not getting in the middle of it. I'd prefer rational discussion.

570 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:26:46pm

re: #514 Alkmyst

At the risk of being yelled at incessantly, I saw a post a week or so ago from Pamela Geller with Excel sheets from the WH website detailing recent visits from both to the WH.

Seriously. Crazy Pamz? You consider her a source for anything but madness and all-the-vodka-you-can-drink if you go visit her at her house?

571 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:26:54pm

re: #543 Alkmyst

Yeah I figured it would induce this type of reaction, so much for listening to the other side of a debate.

I happen to have met her in person when she was here in Israel, and she was far from shreiking.

She's a paranoid and a racist. fi you want to hang out with racist slime, that's your business.

572 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:27:12pm

re: #569 Alkmyst

As to her and Charles, I'm not getting in the middle of it. I'd prefer rational discussion.

Do you think that perhaps by coming onto Charles's website and defending her you are, in fact, getting into the middle of it?

How are you not?

573 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:27:19pm

re: #561 windsagio

Just CTRL+F'ed "racist" and scanned through posts where it appeared in something you've posted. Counted about 4 or 5 times.

574 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:27:28pm

re: #567 Van Helsing

Did you hear the interview I was referring to?


Sorry, done with you, you're not worthy of respect

575 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:27:31pm

re: #565 WindUpBird

Big Bird is Obama's mentor?

(obscure '70s sports joke!)

576 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:27:32pm

re: #569 Alkmyst

Do I support every word she says? Probably not. Her blog is in my RSS feed, as is this one.

As to her and Charles, I'm not getting in the middle of it. I'd prefer rational discussion.

I'd prefer it if you could distinguish between a rational blog and insane one.

577 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:27:55pm

re: #561 windsagio

I've only used it once so far. Its mainly WUB tonight.

I like 'bigoted', because most of the bigots on here are anti-islam ones, and

Which is why I take exception with you. You refer to the "bigots" and "racists" and "bastards" here, meaning fellow forum members. You are hostile. Period.

578 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:27:56pm

re: #540 Cato the Elder

Yeah, right.

Tell me again, when was the height of the "second intifada"?

And who was president then?

And, assuming as I do that by Arab cause you correctly mean the destruction of Israel, show me exactly how Obama prefers that option, would you?

Because if you can I'm going to have to rethink my whole world.

Cato, you ain't gettin' it! When Republicans are in charge, acts of terror against Israel and Jews are just par for the course. When Democrats are in charge and the same thing happens, the Democrats cause it.

Similar to the way Bush pushing a settlement freeze counts so much less than Obama pushing a settlement freeze.

579 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:28:44pm

re: #577 Bagua

Funny thing, hostility is earned.

There are good posters, then there are spreaders of poison.

You are correct that the spreaders of poison, I don't like too much.

580 Renaissance_Man  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:28:45pm

On a slightly related but hopefully less inflammatory note, I am not American and have never known any Jews, at least none that I would have interacted with on a cultural basis or spoken with about politics. So the pre-eminence of Israel in US politics is always somewhat of a mystery to me. Is there somewhere I can go to read up about the history of the relationship that isn't fraught with emotion and spin of one kind or another?

581 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:28:58pm

re: #565 WindUpBird

the crypto-racist blogger-of-the-week: It's Ayers, it's Alinski, it's Wright, it's Farrakhan,

.

The very blog we post on has had links about Ayers, Wright, Khalidi, Alinsky, etc.

582 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:29:06pm

re: #573 TheMatrix31

This thread?

583 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:29:24pm

re: #554 SanFranciscoZionist

That's a lovely bit of passive-aggressive snideness. What do you think? Does his presidency appear to you in line with the views he expressed earlier?

Yes, I do.

584 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:29:24pm

re: #577 Bagua

Which is why I take exception with you. You refer to the "bigots" and "racists" and "bastards" here, meaning fellow forum members. You are hostile. Period.

no racist isn't hostile, it's a defensive reaction...

585 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:29:34pm

re: #578 SanFranciscoZionist

If you would care to take the time to refer to some of my posts from the time period, I was calling out Bush on stopping any settlements then, too.

586 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:29:39pm

re: #562 Bagua

Bullshit. Suggesting a fellow commenter is a klansman is beyond ginned up, that is hallucinogenic. Surely you can do better than that.

If you don't think it's racist to force a tie from Farrakhan to Obama, then I don't know how to help you.

The black people, THEYS ALL THINKIN ALIKE AN' SCHEMIN', YES SUH

//

587 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:29:43pm

re: #567 Van Helsing

Did you hear the interview I was referring to?

I'll bite.
What did he say in that interview that was ZOMG! the worst thing evah?

588 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:29:44pm

re: #579 windsagio

Funny thing, hostility is earned.

There are good posters, then there are spreaders of poison.

You are correct that the spreaders of poison, I don't like too much.

I hear that... damn right I'm hostile to those throwing hostility and way, way worse. Personally I prefer that to pretending the are "cute" or "nostalgic" or "provincial".

589 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:29:48pm

re: #581 TheMatrix31

During the election. Not now. Big damn difference.

590 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:29:48pm

re: #584 brookly red

no racist isn't hostile, it's a defensive reaction...

Sometimes its just the truth >>

591 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:30:01pm

re: #575 windsagio

Horrible death. What an ending.

592 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:30:31pm

re: #563 Obdicut

Because it was never my intention to call wozzablog a liar, and I was astounded that he would react with so much venom, and that so many would gang up on his side. I further think that the reason he got mad had nothing to do with what what I said, but was rather because Wright is something that the left has no answer for...not that they need one.

593 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:30:36pm

re: #590 windsagio

Sometimes its just the truth >>

then try to say it for those occasions.

594 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:30:39pm

re: #543 Alkmyst

Yeah I figured it would induce this type of reaction, so much for listening to the other side of a debate.

I happen to have met her in person when she was here in Israel, and she was far from shreiking.

Geller, IIRC, has been proven to be wrong several times while trying to prove that certain people have visited the White House.

A lot of people here used to respect Pam's opinions greatly. Most of them have long since been burned out by her lies and hysterics.

595 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:30:43pm

re: #591 Stanley Sea

Good lord. That's what I get for not reading the article to the end.

596 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:31:37pm

re: #592 swamprat

I have no clue what argument you're trying to make. You were wrong to say that Wright advocated violence. I'm not sure what you mean the left has no 'answer' for Wright, either-- how does a person necessitate an answer? An answer to what about Wright?

597 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:31:44pm

re: #593 brookly red

I actually think I do a pretty good job of that. I suspect you might differ with that opinion >>

598 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:31:48pm

re: #589 Obdicut

During the election. Not now. Big damn difference.

So what wasn't "racist" then, is now considered "racist"?

Alright.

599 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:31:49pm

re: #579 windsagio

Funny thing, hostility is earned.

There are good posters, then there are spreaders of poison.

You are correct that the spreaders of poison, I don't like too much.

Again, more judgemental garbage. It's what you do. You poison the discussion with such bias.

Nobody here is spreading poison, and no regular posters are racists. We have a diversity of opinion, right, left, and middle, and most discussions are quite reasonable.

600 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:31:53pm

re: #464 windsagio

Its pretty clear that the whole point is the bigotry.

Well, since I don't know Alkmyst from Adamre: #504 Naso Tang

There can be unpleasant collective truths in all those examples you give and I could, to balance the equation, say some pretty unpleasant collective things about Israeli Jews who think they were given certain lands by a god, or certain sects of African Americans who wear their pants below their butts, presumably as an excuse to fondle their balls while they hold them up.

However, if hatred of Jews is racism, then there are no more racist groups than Arab Muslims, and that evidence long predates Israel.

If we're going to use "unpleasant collective truths" as the broad brush with which to paint large swaths of humanity, then we're on a slippery slope. If there are "no more racist groups than Arab Muslims" is it then acceptable to answer racism with racism? If so, then how can anyone claim moral high ground? Shall we just all roll around in the mud together?

601 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:32:45pm

re: #576 Cato the Elder

I read most of the things in my RSS for the links, and do my best to look past editorializing. She may be hyper, but many of her posts have links that lead to other sources that are by and large considered solid.

602 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:33:07pm

re: #598 TheMatrix31

No. What are you talking about? Can you please actually make a straightforward argument?

603 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:33:21pm

re: #585 Alkmyst

If you would care to take the time to refer to some of my posts from the time period, I was calling out Bush on stopping any settlements then, too.

Really? You're against stopping any settlements? No distinction, just settlements here, settlements there, settlements in my armpit hair? All settlements, all the time?

Because, you see, I don't necessarily agree with that approach, either.

Are you in favor of the settlements Israel herself has declared illegal and dismantled?

604 Locker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:33:31pm

re: #599 Bagua

Again, more judgemental garbage. It's what you do. You poison the discussion with such bias.

Nobody here is spreading poison, and no regular posters are racists. We have a diversity of opinion, right, left, and middle, and most discussions are quite reasonable.

Ok so you say that he poisons the discussion then the next sentence says nobody here is spreading poison. There is plenty of slander and poison that go on around here when certain elements congregate at certain times of the day to validate each others bullshit. It's not hard to find.

605 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:33:48pm

re: #546 windsagio

Just catching up...by the way...your #94 wins teh intertoob;)

606 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:33:57pm

re: #597 windsagio

I actually think I do a pretty good job of that. I suspect you might differ with that opinion >>

no you do a pretty good job that is why I bother to mention it, if you use it too much it loses it effectiveness... juss sayin

607 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:34:03pm

re: #599 Bagua

I think its time to stop this.

I have enough self-knowledge to see that you and me bickering isn't enjoyable for anyone else here.

So, last point then I'll quit prolonging this: just about everyone here remembers how insanely awful you were during previous AGW fights. That's probably enough to rest a case on, right there.

608 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:34:08pm

re: #551 Alkmyst

The 2nd intifada started right around the same time as Bush's entrance to office, maybe slightly before, I forget.

Just before his election. Clearly, the Palestinian leadership smelled his weakness and willingness to compromise, no? And the intifada continued under his presidency, because he was coddling Arab nations, right?

/should I bother?

609 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:34:29pm

re: #586 WindUpBird

If you don't think it's racist to force a tie from Farrakhan to Obama, then I don't know how to help you.

The black people, THEYS ALL THINKIN ALIKE AN' SCHEMIN', YES SUH

//

I agree we can debate the degree of racism in various events and issues, as we do. Pretty much everyone here is very against racism or bigotry of any sort. But we can surely discuss these issues among ourselves without suggesting that one of us is a member of the KKK because we don't see the issue like you do.

610 lostlakehiker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:35:01pm

re: #552 Lidane

The chances of me voting Republican in 2012, especially if this Tea Party silliness continues until then, are pretty much nil, unless President Obama really fucks up in some catastrophic way.

Those chances are even lower if Palin is the nominee. I actually like this country. Caribou Barbie as president would be horrifying. No thanks. If she's the nominee and I decide I can't vote for President Obama, I'll write someone in or vote third party. Simple as that.

Palin won't be the Republican nominee. Neither will Ron Paul or Mike Huckabee. Romney has some sort of chance but most likely it will be somebody some of us have heard of but who has yet to make a big name for herself beyond the regional level. Or himself.

611 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:35:15pm

re: #547 Obdicut

I have never met a Geller supporter before. It's pretty damn shocking.

shhh...you'll spook them. let's observe their behavior for a bit...be a good naturalist, won't you/

612 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:35:25pm

re: #581 TheMatrix31

The very blog we post on has had links about Ayers, Wright, Khalidi, Alinsky, etc.

yeah, and if you were actually paying attention you would also note that all the weak-sauce ties that the talking point drones bring up have been debunked over and over again. You bring 'em up, we knock 'em down. Repeat forever. The rich pageantry continues.

I'm noticing Charles is NOT indicting Obama for his ties to Farrakhan that don't exist. I'm noticing Charles shoots down the talking pointimplications that he's got all these sekrit ties to ACORN. I'm noticing charles shoots down the bullshit about how Obama's secretly some cryptoradical.

But get on with your tribalism. For the record, I think you're not a racist, just simply someone who won't be moved by facts, who is invested in rooting for your GOP team the way one roots for a basketball team or a football team. You're one of the most reliable talking point stenographers we have here.

613 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:35:36pm

re: #605 Aceofwhat?

YAY YOU SAW IT!

re: #606 brookly red

Thank you for the compliment anyways, sometimes in the heat of battle the argument becomes its own force. We have to try to step back at that point (which is what I'm trying to make myself do now >>)

614 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:35:41pm

re: #587 webevintage

I'll bite.
What did he say in that interview that was ZOMG! the worst thing evah?

Search the archive. I believe it was in August of 2008. It was a radio interview done in 2001(?). He was discussing his views of the Constitution and stated it was fundamentally flawed as it was a negative document, outlining what government could not do to you. It would have been much better if it dealt with what government should do for you.

That would be a pretty basic change in the set of principles the Republic was founded on.

615 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:36:18pm

re: #603 Cato the Elder

It is my belief that Israel belongs to the Jewish people, and any and all building therein is legitimate.

616 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:36:29pm

re: #602 Obdicut

In 565, WindUpBird talked about "crypto-racist-bloggers" going on about Ayers, Wright, etc.

In 581, I pointed out that the blog we POST at would go on about those links.

In 589, you posted about how that was during the election, and not now, and that there was a big difference.

In 598, I wished to clarify your response, because it looked to me like you were saying that pointing out those things during the election times wasn't "racist", but now they were, which was confirming WindUpBird's point.

.....not too sure what was terribly unclear about that sequence of posts and responses.

617 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:36:48pm

re: #614 Van Helsing


I totally trust your summation of that interview. Someone who first claimed Farrakhan was Obama's mentor and then claimed that Wright was still Obama's mentor-- obviously they'd never misremember anything about Obama!

/

618 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:36:48pm

re: #592 swamprat

Because it was never my intention to call wozzablog a liar, and I was astounded that he would react with so much venom, and that so many would gang up on his side. I further think that the reason he got mad had nothing to do with what what I said, but was rather because Wright is something that the left has no answer for...not that they need one.

If only people were outraged about Pat Robertson the way they pretend to be outraged about Wright.

The answer is we know who brings up Wright years after the election. And we know why. We understand :)

619 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:36:52pm

re: #568 webevintage

I am amazed that there are people out there who spend their days making Excel sheets of who visits the White House and then claims that the Wrights or Ayers on the list are THE Wright and THE Ayers without thinking that there are millions and millions of people in the United States and a few of them might also be named J. Wright and B. Ayers.

Logic people.
It is your friend.

There was some woman who was supposed to be the head of ACORN who visited, and Pam got very excited about that, but it turned out it was a completely different woman.

620 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:36:53pm

re: #601 Alkmyst

I read most of the things in my RSS for the links, and do my best to look past editorializing. She may be hyper, but many of her posts have links that lead to other sources that are by and large considered solid.

If your word for Geller is "hyper" rather than "hater" and chillul haShem, I feel bad for your moral compass, which is probably floating around in the Dead Sea wondering why you threw it away.

621 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:37:35pm

re: #570 Cato the Elder

Seriously. Crazy Pamz? You consider her a source for anything but madness and all-the-vodka-you-can-drink if you go visit her at her house?

Unless you represent the US Census, in which case you won't get in.

622 NJDhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:38:10pm

Hi folks. Taking a break from yard work.

Obama's mentors is the current subject? I see Frank Marshall Davis hasn't been mentioned yet.

623 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:38:11pm

re: #612 WindUpBird

yeah, and if you were actually paying attention you would also note that all the weak-sauce ties that the talking point drones bring up have been debunked over and over again. You bring 'em up, we knock 'em down. Repeat forever. The rich pageantry continues.

I'm noticing Charles is NOT indicting Obama for his ties to Farrakhan that don't exist. I'm noticing Charles shoots down the talking pointimplications that he's got all these sekrit ties to ACORN. I'm noticing charles shoots down the bullshit about how Obama's secretly some cryptoradical.

But get on with your tribalism. For the record, I think you're not a racist, just simply someone who won't be moved by facts, who is invested in rooting for your GOP team the way one roots for a basketball team or a football team. You're one of the most reliable talking point stenographers we have here.


Cool. Now I can sleep knowing that you don't think I'm a racist. That was really bugging me there, being confused and all that. Good to know you can clarify my feelings for me. I'm glad you're an expert at detecting such feelings.

624 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:38:16pm

re: #600 CuriousLurker

If we're going to use "unpleasant collective truths" as the broad brush with which to paint large swaths of humanity, then we're on a slippery slope. If there are "no more racist groups than Arab Muslims" is it then acceptable to answer racism with racism? If so, then how can anyone claim moral high ground? Shall we just all roll around in the mud together?

I agree except...well...can we roll around in the mud first and then not be racist? Because i'm all for not making racist generalizations but, on the other hand, rolling in mud is good too...

(other than that, i agree...let's keep the blankets in the linen closet;)

625 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:38:38pm

re: #583 Van Helsing

Yes, I do.

How so?

626 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:38:46pm

re: #622 NJDhockeyfan

Stop with the talking points, NJD. We set em up, they knock em down! You're just another reliable talking point stenographer.

627 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:39:13pm

re: #580 Renaissance_Man

On a slightly related but hopefully less inflammatory note, I am not American and have never known any Jews, at least none that I would have interacted with on a cultural basis or spoken with about politics. So the pre-eminence of Israel in US politics is always somewhat of a mystery to me. Is there somewhere I can go to read up about the history of the relationship that isn't fraught with emotion and spin of one kind or another?

You sound like you have lead a very sheltered life. Do I also take it that you are puzzled by the support for the PA or Hamas in Europe?

628 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:39:16pm

re: #616 TheMatrix31

Yes, continuing to harp on Wright, now that Obama has distanced himself totally away from it, is something that a lot of racist bloggers do. No, it wasn't racist to point out Wright's inflammatory statements during the campaign-- though the immense volume and persistence of attention this preacher got was definitely because he was black and leftist, since white preachers with just as radical conservative politics have been mainstream in the US for years.

I'm pointing out that Charles is now rather wisely judging Obama on his performance as president, and is not stuck in the election. If you can draw a connection between Wright's influence and any of Obama's actions, then Wright would be relevant. Otherwise, he's really not.

Does that make sense?

629 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:39:23pm

re: #615 Alkmyst

It is my belief that Israel belongs to the Jewish people, and any and all building therein is legitimate.

Ah. And I'm betting that your map of Israel is somewhat different than the Israeli government's.

630 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:39:36pm

re: #604 Locker

Ok so you say that he poisons the discussion then the next sentence says nobody here is spreading poison. There is plenty of slander and poison that go on around here when certain elements congregate at certain times of the day to validate each others bullshit. It's not hard to find.

I've lost count of the number of times Bagua has had poisonous comments of his own - aimed at fellow posters - deleted. Talk about hypocrisy on stilts.

631 NJDhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:39:57pm

re: #626 TheMatrix31

Stop with the talking points, NJD. We set em up, they knock em down! You're just another reliable talking point stenographer.

Bowling for hollers.

632 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:39:58pm

re: #585 Alkmyst

If you would care to take the time to refer to some of my posts from the time period, I was calling out Bush on stopping any settlements then, too.

I'm sure you were, however you appear to feel that Obama is actively encouraging anti-Semitic attacks worldwide. Why is one man so much more influential than the other?

633 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:40:26pm

re: #628 Obdicut

Yes, it does make sense.

I don't harp on those connections either, it was just the discussion at the moment.

634 prairiefire  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:40:35pm

re: #610 lostlakehiker

Palin won't be the Republican nominee. Neither will Ron Paul or Mike Huckabee. Romney has some sort of chance but most likely it will be somebody some of us have heard of but who has yet to make a big name for herself beyond the regional level. Or himself.

Sounds like a Unicorn to me.

635 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:40:48pm

This thread is going in some astonishing directions.

636 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:40:51pm

re: #627 Naso Tang

You know, not having an in-depth knowledge of Israel's situation is not really being 'sheltered'. People are allowed to not actually pay attention, in the same way that I really don't have much of a clue about the forces arrayed in the Congo.

637 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:41:05pm

re: #608 SanFranciscoZionist


re: #551 Alkmyst
The 2nd intifada started right around the same time as Bush's entrance to office, maybe slightly before, I forget.


Just before his election. Clearly, the Palestinian leadership smelled his weakness and willingness to compromise, no? And the intifada continued under his presidency, because he was coddling Arab nations, right?

I don't think the intifada had anything to do with Bush, and that it continued while he was president was due to the inertia. I do believe that had he not pursued the War on Terror as he did, chances are the intifada would have lasted even longer. Aside from being beaten by Israel, Arafat was shunned by Washington, and I think that does make a difference.

638 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:41:37pm

re: #618 WindUpBird

If only people were outraged about Pat Robertson the way they pretend to be outraged about Wright.

The answer is we know who brings up Wright years after the election. And we know why. We understand :)

I'm outraged by the both of them. Theyre both fucking pieces of shit.

"pretend" to be outraged. LOL. What a joke.

639 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:41:43pm

re: #615 Alkmyst

It is my belief that Israel belongs to the Jewish people, and any and all building therein is legitimate.

Which map are you referencing?

640 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:42:21pm

re: #604 Locker

Ok so you say that he poisons the discussion then the next sentence says nobody here is spreading poison. There is plenty of slander and poison that go on around here when certain elements congregate at certain times of the day to validate each others bullshit. It's not hard to find.

I'm not saying windsagio is unique nor especially egregious, though he certainly posts a great deal, it is not off limits to make my occasional observation.

My dual use of poison was a bit awkward, rhetorically. But the contrast is between one saying people are spreading poison, as in lies, foul ideas, conservative viewpoints, and that is is poisonous to label people as racist, and bigots and on the other hand saying it poisons the dialog to make such assertions about members of a social group.

641 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:42:47pm

re: #596 Obdicut

Wright told an audience of predominately black parishioners that America had enslaved them, America had produced diseases against them, America had bombed Hiroshima and Nagasaki... He told them that America had done every sort of evil ..

And he always said put it so that no one could accuse him of promoting anything like violence. But if you believed what he said, you would not oppose any sort of violence against the U.S.

His speeches were the same as Nixon's famous quote;
"but it would be wrong!"

Wright supported Hamas, and spread blood libel against the U.S.


And means little in today's politics; But truth is truth.

642 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:42:59pm

re: #600 CuriousLurker

If we're going to use "unpleasant collective truths" as the broad brush with which to paint large swaths of humanity, then we're on a slippery slope. If there are "no more racist groups than Arab Muslims" is it then acceptable to answer racism with racism? If so, then how can anyone claim moral high ground? Shall we just all roll around in the mud together?

Also, if we're going to go back before the state of Israel, then I would say that there is no way to make the claim that the Middle East shows a more unpleasant history of anti-Semitism than Europe. And I don't think anti-Semitism went away in Europe, they just ran out of Jews.

643 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:43:07pm

re: #636 Obdicut

You know, not having an in-depth knowledge of Israel's situation is not really being 'sheltered'. People are allowed to not actually pay attention, in the same way that I really don't have much of a clue about the forces arrayed in the Congo.

In this case I would agree, if they are from the Congo.

644 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:43:10pm

re: #629 Cato the Elder

If you're implying that I'd say we should conquer Jordan, that's not it. As long as they abode the peace agreement I have no problem with them, in fact I was even looking to do business there.

645 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:43:18pm

re: #638 TheMatrix31

I'm outraged by the both of them. Theyre both fucking pieces of shit.

"pretend" to be outraged. LOL. What a joke.

Yeah, it's a fucking pretense. Wright is nobody. Robertson was in and out of the Bush White House like a greased dildo. There is a difference.

646 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:44:31pm

re: #623 TheMatrix31

Cool. Now I can sleep knowing that you don't think I'm a racist. That was really bugging me there, being confused and all that. Good to know you can clarify my feelings for me. I'm glad you're an expert at detecting such feelings.

Ok , have I got this right - WUB's racism detector is not to be trusted? Are you suggesting that you are a racist?

647 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:44:43pm

re: #618 WindUpBird

As far as I am concerned, both those feathers were plucked from the same wing.

648 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:45:00pm

re: #644 Alkmyst

If you're implying that I'd say we should conquer Jordan, that's not it. As long as they abode the peace agreement I have no problem with them, in fact I was even looking to do business there.

I'm implying that you're saying Israel should declare all of the West Bank to be Israel proper, which goes further than anything any Israeli government has called for. Are you saying it's a stealth takeover?

649 prairiefire  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:45:24pm

re: #642 SanFranciscoZionist

Also, if we're going to go back before the state of Israel, then I would say that there is no way to make the claim that the Middle East shows a more unpleasant history of anti-Semitism than Europe. And I don't think anti-Semitism went away in Europe, they just ran out of Jews.

I just almost choked on my pretzel when I read that!

650 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:45:48pm

re: #630 Jimmah

I've lost count of the number of times Bagua has had poisonous comments of his own - aimed at fellow posters - deleted. Talk about hypocrisy on stilts.

Ah, the expert on the blog soap opera is here to disqualify me from having an opinion. How silly of me. I forgot you are an expert, having been on the opposite side of almost every conflict here in recent months.

Bait someone else, I'm not interested.

651 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:45:56pm

re: #647 swamprat

As far as I am concerned, both those feathers were plucked from the same wing.

The same bird, maybe. Definitely not the same wing.

652 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:46:09pm

re: #464 windsagio

Its pretty clear that the whole point is the bigotry.

Sorry, windsagio, I started to reply to you and it got mixed in with my reply to Naso. I was going to say that since I don't know Alkmyst from Adam, I'd be willing to give him/her the benefit of the doubt, which is why I asked if it was intended as it was written. The reply seems to have been given via Naso Tang instead of to me directly, so.... *shrug*

653 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:46:10pm

re: #646 Jimmah

wow....that's a twist if I've ever seen one.

No, I was just saying that he's nobody to declare anything about anyone being racist or not.

654 NJDhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:46:28pm

re: #645 Cato the Elder

Yeah, it's a fucking pretense. Wright is nobody. Robertson was in and out of the Bush White House like a greased dildo. There is a difference.

Obama spent 20 years listening to Wright preach hate. I find it virtually impossible that some of that didn't rub off on Obama.

655 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:46:52pm

re: #641 swamprat

And he always said put it so that no one could accuse him of promoting anything like violence. But if you believed what he said, you would not oppose any sort of violence against the U.S.

That's totally irrational, dude. Why the hell do you believe this?

First of all:

We really did enslave blacks. We really did do inhuman medical experiments on blacks. We really did sic dogs on them when they tried to vote. We really did imprison them, beat them, and kill them for attempts to mix with white society. And Wright lived through that time period-- he not only lived through that time period, he served as a Marine. I still cannot for the life of me figure out how this nation was lucky enough to have so many blacks serve in the armed forces before the civil rights movement, but thank god they did.

Wright's preaching was fire-and-brimstone rhetoric, but saying that it advocates violence or supports violence is like saying those Catholic bishops who refused communion are advocating violence by doing so.

I have no clue why you want to fight this all over again. It got pretty ugly last time. Why he hell can't you let Wright go?

656 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:47:00pm

re: #654 NJDhockeyfan

Lies, bro. Lies.

657 prairiefire  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:47:52pm

re: #654 NJDhockeyfan

Obama spent 20 years listening to Wright preach hate. I find it virtually impossible that some of that didn't rub off on Obama.

Who does President Obama hate?

658 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:47:52pm

re: #654 NJDhockeyfan

Obama spent 20 years listening to Wright preach hate. I find it virtually impossible that some of that didn't rub off on Obama.

Yeah, because that's all Wright ever did was preach hate. And Obama was there every Sunday without fail for 20 years. And...

Crap, this is old. I'm done with the topic.

659 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:48:03pm

re: #619 SanFranciscoZionist

There was some woman who was supposed to be the head of ACORN who visited, and Pam got very excited about that, but it turned out it was a completely different woman.

And in some cases where a person is confused with someone else carrying the same name, some harm can come (not necessarily physical harm).

People's identities need to be very carefully verified before accusations start flowing.

660 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:48:45pm

re: #632 SanFranciscoZionist

What I'm saying is that by not shunning arab dictators, relying on talking with wackos like Ahmedinijad, Assad, Khaddafi, it encourages attacks. It happened under Bush to some degree re: Saudis, but much less often than under Obama.

661 Lidane  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:48:59pm

Why is Wright still an issue for anyone? I'm having a hard time understanding this.

662 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:49:23pm

re: #654 NJDhockeyfan

Obama spent 20 years listening to Wright preach hate. I find it virtually impossible that some of that didn't rub off on Obama.

A. I don't think Obama went to church every freaking Sunday.
B. I don't think Wright was as nuts 20 years ago as he has gotten as he has aged.
C. I actually just don't fucking care....

663 Killgore Trout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:50:02pm

You guys are pretty lively for a lazy Sunday afternoon.

664 prairiefire  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:50:02pm

re: #661 Lidane

Dead, dusty horse being pulled out into the street to beat again.

665 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:50:44pm

re: #661 Lidane

Why is Wright still an issue for anyone? I'm having a hard time understanding this.

it is what it is...

666 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:50:54pm

re: #580 Renaissance_Man

On a slightly related but hopefully less inflammatory note, I am not American and have never known any Jews, at least none that I would have interacted with on a cultural basis or spoken with about politics. So the pre-eminence of Israel in US politics is always somewhat of a mystery to me. Is there somewhere I can go to read up about the history of the relationship that isn't fraught with emotion and spin of one kind or another?

Naso - way to answer an honest question with an insult. Classy.

Renaissance Man - i'd search past entries from SFZ, Alouette, Ludwig Van Quixote, Marjorie, and Joo-Liz regarding the Jewish perspective on this topic. They won't agree on every single point, which means you'll be informed from a few different perspectives, but on the topic of Israel, I've found all of their POVs to be highly informed, and extremely level-headed.

667 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:50:55pm

re: #654 NJDhockeyfan

Obama spent 20 years listening to Wright preach hate. I find it virtually impossible that some of that didn't rub off on Obama.

Not really. Obama sat and listened to ...several pastors in that church.
No one thinks he did that for any other reason than to promote his Carree.
While that may, or may not make him a hypocrite, It definitely makes him a typical politician.

668 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:51:06pm

re: #650 Bagua

Ah, the expert on the blog soap opera is here to disqualify me from having an opinion. How silly of me. I forgot you are an expert, having been on the opposite side of almost every conflict here in recent months.

Bait someone else, I'm not interested.

I stand here exposed as having been involved in several arguments on the opposite side from wingnuts.

Yes, folks it's it's true - I am not a wingnut.

669 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:51:17pm

re: #648 Cato the Elder


re: #644 Alkmyst

If you're implying that I'd say we should conquer Jordan, that's not it. As long as they abode the peace agreement I have no problem with them, in fact I was even looking to do business there.


I'm implying that you're saying Israel should declare all of the West Bank to be Israel proper, which goes further than anything any Israeli government has called for. Are you saying it's a stealth takeover?


No need to imply - I've said that openly many a time that we should officially annex.

670 Renaissance_Man  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:51:22pm

re: #627 Naso Tang

You sound like you have lead a very sheltered life. Do I also take it that you are puzzled by the support for the PA or Hamas in Europe?

I am not 'puzzled' as to why anyone supports anyone, just lacking in knowledge of the history of the politics in question. Where I'm from nobody has any dogs in the fight in the Middle East, and consequently Middle Eastern affairs are not often matters of great cultural and political impact. If that makes me sheltered, sorry to offend you.

671 Lidane  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:51:27pm

re: #664 prairiefire

Dead, dusty horse being pulled out into the street to beat again.

You'd think that horse would have been pulverized by now. Is this some kind of new genetically modified horse that can withstand 2+ years of being beaten and flogged to death?

672 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:51:36pm

re: #642 SanFranciscoZionist

Also, if we're going to go back before the state of Israel, then I would say that there is no way to make the claim that the Middle East shows a more unpleasant history of anti-Semitism than Europe. And I don't think anti-Semitism went away in Europe, they just ran out of Jews.

So, since that is in essence what I said earlier, why did you down me upthread; assuming it wasn't because of the clothing uniform comment?

673 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:51:41pm

re: #664 prairiefire

The scientists have cloned the DNA from a prehistoric mesohippus westoni and archaeologists have unearthed the oldest known man-made stick so that the two can come together for one last beating.

674 Alkmyst  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:51:56pm

2 AM. Calling it a night.

675 prairiefire  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:52:03pm

re: #666 Aceofwhat?

Thanks, Ace. I was hoping someone would answer him. Favorited for my own future reading as well.

676 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:52:44pm

re: #637 Alkmyst

I don't think the intifada had anything to do with Bush, and that it continued while he was president was due to the inertia. I do believe that had he not pursued the War on Terror as he did, chances are the intifada would have lasted even longer. Aside from being beaten by Israel, Arafat was shunned by Washington, and I think that does make a difference.

Do you see why I see this as perhaps something of a double standard? IE, the intifada just happened to happen, but anti-Semitic street attacks in London are Obama's fault?

677 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:52:46pm

I realize why I gave up giving a shit about politics over the last couple of weeks. It was a good, happy two weeks.

678 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:52:49pm

re: #642 SanFranciscoZionist

And I don't think anti-Semitism went away in Europe, they just ran out of Jews.

oh, SNAP

679 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:53:05pm

re: #661 Lidane

Why is Wright still an issue for anyone? I'm having a hard time understanding this.

It's a sore point. If there was one reason I didn't vote for Obama it can be summarized by "Wright".

680 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:53:10pm

re: #618 WindUpBird

If only people were outraged about Pat Robertson the way they pretend to be outraged about Wright.

The answer is we know who brings up Wright years after the election. And we know why. We understand :)


The inverse to that is; those who get outraged at those who bring up Wright. We know who those are. and we know why.

681 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:53:29pm

re: #661 Lidane

Why is Wright still an issue for anyone? I'm having a hard time understanding this.

An issue, what issue?

re: #668 Jimmah

I stand here exposed as having been involved in several arguments on the opposite side from wingnuts.

Yes, folks it's it's true - I am not a wingnut.


[Video]

Of course, you're right, I'm sorry, silly me. You are a noble Knight on a quest to do battle with the evil, racist wingnuts. Carry on.

682 Political Atheist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:54:00pm

re: #663 Killgore Trout

I suggest a smoke for smokers, a drink for drinkers, and an indulgent meal for the foodies among us. For me its a bit of the first two and a larger portion of the third.

683 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:54:04pm

re: #680 swamprat

And why is that?

Can you make the accusation plain, please?

684 prairiefire  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:54:11pm

re: #671 Lidane

You'd think that horse would have been pulverized by now. Is this some kind of new genetically modified horse that can withstand 2+ years of being beaten and flogged to death?

I'm guessing it is based on right ward leaning frustration at not having a solid Leader/Unicorn.

685 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:54:34pm

re: #654 NJDhockeyfan

Obama spent 20 years listening to Wright preach hate. I find it virtually impossible that some of that didn't rub off on Obama.

IIRC, that was a concern, as was the President's connections to some others.

The concern does not appear to have been borne out, looking at how things have played out after the election, at least in my opinion.

686 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:54:52pm

re: #671 Lidane

You'd think that horse would have been pulverized by now. Is this some kind of new genetically modified horse that can withstand 2+ years of being beaten and flogged to death?

well...conservatives tend to be more pro-GM food than liberals, right/

687 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:55:44pm

re: #682 Rightwingconspirator

I suggest a smoke for smokers, a drink for drinkers, and an indulgent meal for the foodies among us. For me its a bit of the first two and a larger portion of the third.

I'm off to eat my pot roast, home made biscuits and chocolate chess pie that i made today while also hanging out here.

688 prairiefire  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:55:50pm

re: #682 Rightwingconspirator

I suggest a smoke for smokers, a drink for drinkers, and an indulgent meal for the foodies among us. For me its a bit of the first two and a larger portion of the third.

I have a pot of Sicilian red sauce simmering on the stove. Meatballs to make and a Grolsh in the fridge calling my name!

689 windsagio  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:55:52pm

re: #686 Aceofwhat?

Unless they buy heirloom seeds.

690 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:56:33pm

re: #642 SanFranciscoZionist

Also, if we're going to go back before the state of Israel, then I would say that there is no way to make the claim that the Middle East shows a more unpleasant history of anti-Semitism than Europe. And I don't think anti-Semitism went away in Europe, they just ran out of Jews.

I had the same thought but didn't want to go there and possibly open up a whole other Pandora's Box. Because, ummm, I supposed to be working. This place is like crack, dammit!

691 prairiefire  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:56:42pm

re: #687 webevintage

I'm off to eat my pot roast, home made biscuits and chocolate chess pie that i made today while also hanging out here.

Man, Chocolate Chess Pie!!! Jealous!

FBV~~~~~Someone said Pie!

692 NJDhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:56:54pm

re: #685 reine.de.tout

IIRC, that was a concern, as was the President's connections to some others.

The concern does not appear to have been borne out, looking at how things have played out after the election, at least in my opinion.

His attitude toward Israel is not surprising.

693 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:57:07pm

re: #669 Alkmyst

No need to imply - I've said that openly many a time that we should officially annex.

Ah. Which would make things better how, exactly?

Or would your next move be "transfer"?

694 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:57:25pm

re: #683 Obdicut

Seems like you're having a comprehension issue bro. First with my post, now with his. I'm sorry if there is anything on your mind that's clouded your ability to read posts.

695 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:58:04pm

My final word on the subject.

Kibba You Mouth


- Admiral Tibett
696 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:58:10pm

re: #675 prairiefire

Thanks, Ace. I was hoping someone would answer him. Favorited for my own future reading as well.

it's not always easy to open up and ask an honest question, especially in a knowledgeable crowd. it's a mature act, and seeing someone reply with scorn absolutely makes the back of my hand itch.

whoops - hey. found my soapbox! guess i was accidentally standing on it/

697 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:58:22pm

re: #690 CuriousLurker

I had the same thought but didn't want to go there and possibly open up a whole other Pandora's Box. Because, ummm, I supposed to be working. This place is like crack, dammit!

Pandora's box is what we hope to open all the time. Sometime we do, sometimes we just end up punning.

698 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:58:38pm

re: #689 windsagio

Unless they buy heirloom seeds.

BWAHAHAHAHA! impeccable timing;)

699 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:58:43pm

re: #679 Naso Tang

It's a sore point. If there was one reason I didn't vote for Obama it can be summarized by "Wright".

But Wright would not have been veep. Palin gave you no pause, I take it?

700 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:58:54pm

re: #655 Obdicut

Yes. Everything Wright said is true...except for us making AIDS, or what ever. But he neglected the part where we went to war for Blacks to be free, or that the atomic bombs we dropped saved lives on both sides, or anything that is positive. And he openly supported Hamas...which is by definition supportting violence and terror.

701 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:59:11pm

re: #660 Alkmyst

What I'm saying is that by not shunning arab dictators, relying on talking with wackos like Ahmedinijad, Assad, Khaddafi, it encourages attacks. It happened under Bush to some degree re: Saudis, but much less often than under Obama.

I disagree, overall, especially since the attacks of which you are speaking are not military ones.

702 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:59:55pm

re: #692 NJDhockeyfan

His attitude toward Israel is not surprising.

Which attitude is that?

703 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 3:59:56pm

re: #666 Aceofwhat?

Naso - way to answer an honest question with an insult. Classy.

Renaissance Man - i'd search past entries from SFZ, Alouette, Ludwig Van Quixote, Marjorie, and Joo-Liz regarding the Jewish perspective on this topic. They won't agree on every single point, which means you'll be informed from a few different perspectives, but on the topic of Israel, I've found all of their POVs to be highly informed, and extremely level-headed.

Charles also still has Nekama's Troll Hammer featured in resources.

704 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:00:10pm

re: #669 Alkmyst

No need to imply - I've said that openly many a time that we should officially annex.

And what do we do with all the Arabs that come with the annexation?

705 Lidane  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:00:11pm

re: #679 Naso Tang

It's a sore point. If there was one reason I didn't vote for Obama it can be summarized by "Wright".

See, I never got why he mattered. As an atheist, I looked at Wright and just saw another hellfire and brimstone preacher. I figure there are enough bugfuck crazy preachers on the hard right -- some of whom have had real influence in politics (Robertson, Falwell, Dobson, etc.) -- to more than make up for all of Wright's douchebaggery, so I pretty much ignored him anyway.

706 Political Atheist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:01:01pm

re: #691 prairiefire
re: #687 webevintage

Well here it is NY steak, sauteed onions and baked potato. Oh, & artichoke hearts. D_L made tapioca pudding, which I'll coat with sugar and torch caramelize. A lazy Sunday indeed.

707 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:01:02pm

re: #683 Obdicut

And why is that?

Can you make the accusation plain, please?

Absolutely. Wright is an embarrassment.

708 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:01:42pm

re: #670 Renaissance_Man

I am not 'puzzled' as to why anyone supports anyone, just lacking in knowledge of the history of the politics in question. Where I'm from nobody has any dogs in the fight in the Middle East, and consequently Middle Eastern affairs are not often matters of great cultural and political impact. If that makes me sheltered, sorry to offend you.

Silly. You think I was offended?

Were are you from then? It might help the conversation.

709 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:01:50pm

re: #707 swamprat

Absolutely. Wright is an embarrassment.

To himself, certainly. Other than that, what is you point?

710 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:01:57pm

re: #701 SanFranciscoZionist

I disagree, overall, especially since the attacks of which you are speaking are not military ones.

that is in a way disturbing... it seems that those who would attack have learned not to take the risk of the retaliation a military attack would bring, death by a thousand cuts seem to be in fashion.

711 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:02:24pm

re: #707 swamprat

He's a piece of fucking shit, but "embarrassment" can also be used.

712 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:02:45pm

re: #709 Cato the Elder

He was obviously an embarrassment to Obama, otherwise he wouldnt have had to sever ties.

713 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:03:07pm

re: #710 brookly red

that is in a way disturbing... it seems that those who would attack have learned not to take the risk of the retaliation a military attack would bring, death by a thousand cuts seem to be in fashion.

Ahem...it did not begin under Obama, and it will not stop if a Republican takes office in 2012.

714 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:03:39pm

re: #543 Alkmyst

Yeah I figured it would induce this type of reaction, so much for listening to the other side of a debate.

I happen to have met her in person when she was here in Israel, and she was far from shreiking.

Suffice to say that when online, Pamela goes bat guano bonkers and makes herself look very bad.

715 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:03:45pm

re: #712 TheMatrix31

He was obviously an embarrassment to Obama, otherwise he wouldnt have had to sever ties.

Yes, so again, what is your point?

716 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:03:58pm

re: #666 Aceofwhat?

Naso - way to answer an honest question with an insult. Classy.

Renaissance Man - i'd search past entries from SFZ, Alouette, Ludwig Van Quixote, Marjorie, and Joo-Liz regarding the Jewish perspective on this topic. They won't agree on every single point, which means you'll be informed from a few different perspectives, but on the topic of Israel, I've found all of their POVs to be highly informed, and extremely level-headed.

I'd throw Obdicut onto that list.

717 brookly red  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:04:01pm

re: #713 Cato the Elder

Ahem...it did not begin under Obama, and it will not stop if a Republican takes office in 2012.

this is true, but when did I ever say it did?

718 Bagua  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:04:23pm

It's going to be a fun election season.

War


- Bob
719 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:04:39pm

re: #705 Lidane

See, I never got why he mattered. As an atheist, I looked at Wright and just saw another hellfire and brimstone preacher. I figure there are enough bugfuck crazy preachers on the hard right -- some of whom have had real influence in politics (Robertson, Falwell, Dobson, etc.) -- to more than make up for all of Wright's douchebaggery, so I pretty much ignored him anyway.

Obama took a lot of flack before he finally realized he had to do the bus thing with Wright. Had he done so immediately I may have voted differently; but of course then I thought Palin was a smart woman from up north.

720 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:05:21pm

re: #715 Cato the Elder

The point is that he wasn't solely an embarrassment to himself, as you claimed in the post I responded to.

721 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:05:36pm

re: #697 Naso Tang

Pandora's box is what we hope to open all the time. Sometime we do, sometimes we just end up punning.

No Pandora's boxes today, not for me anyway. This time I'm really going to try to get some work done, no more watching the Master Spy and jumping back in. :)

TTYL, lizards.

722 Renaissance_Man  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:05:42pm

re: #703 reine.de.tout

Charles also still has Nekama's Troll Hammer featured in resources.

That's not only funny, but more or less what I was looking for.

723 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:06:49pm

re: #716 SanFranciscoZionist

I'd throw Obdicut onto that list.

ah, so true.

Obdicut - my bad. i have you on that list in my mind...thought i put you on there.

thanks, SFZ-

724 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:07:43pm

re: #700 swamprat

He included something that was printed in the LA Times first. I don't think anyone would accuse Wright of having great judgement, but to claim that is support for Hamas's violence is a huge stretch.

The article itself is a bit of Hamas propaganda that is explicitly not a call to violence, it's a whitewash of Hamas. I can easily believe that Wright was dumb or naive enough to think it had any credibility, but the article is propaganda, not an honest representation of Hamas as violent.

re: #707 swamprat

I'm not the least bit embarrassed by Wright.

725 NJDhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:07:43pm

re: #719 Naso Tang

Obama took a lot of flack before he finally realized he had to do the bus thing with Wright. Had he done so immediately I may have voted differently; but of course then I thought Palin was a smart woman from up north.

He stood by Wright for a while before he threw Wright under the bus. It seemed like every day there was a new video of Wright spewing anti-American racist hate speeches. I could never understand why Obama waited so long to cut ties with Wright.

726 NJDhockeyfan  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:08:15pm

Back to yard work...bbiaw

727 TheMatrix31  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:08:56pm

re: #725 NJDhockeyfan

Yeah, somewhere in the early 80s would have been nice.

Oh well, time for playoffs. Later.

728 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:09:24pm

re: #600 CuriousLurker

If we're going to use "unpleasant collective truths" as the broad brush with which to paint large swaths of humanity, then we're on a slippery slope. If there are "no more racist groups than Arab Muslims" is it then acceptable to answer racism with racism? If so, then how can anyone claim moral high ground? Shall we just all roll around in the mud together?

No, but we should not pretend political correctness because we think we might get dirty.

729 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:09:58pm

re: #720 TheMatrix31

The point is that he wasn't solely an embarrassment to himself, as you claimed in the post I responded to.

Wow. Brilliant.

Wright is no longer an embarrassment to anyone but himself. There. That clear enough for you?

So what is the point with this pointless discussion of Wright?

730 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:10:05pm

re: #672 Naso Tang

So, since that is in essence what I said earlier, why did you down me upthread; assuming it wasn't because of the clothing uniform comment?

The clothing line didn't help, but the down-ding was because I understood you to be making the argument that the Arab world has historically been more antii-Semitic than Europe. If I misunderstood, I will swim back upstream and reverse myself.

731 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:10:18pm

re: #723 Aceofwhat?

Oh, I don't think I really belong there in terms of actual Israeli politics, which I know little about. I actually know more about the politics in the Arab States surrounding Israel.

Basically, all I do is correct people when they talk about the struggle between Israel and Palestine, and remind them that even if the Palestinian state was magically created overnight with the 1967 borders or even more, that the attacks on Israel would not cease because the actual aggression towards Israel isn't "Palestinian", it's from the Arab Muslim world at large.

And I'd note that one of our most important allies in that region, Saudi Arabia, is one of the largest enemies of Israel and supporters of terror in that region.

732 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:10:58pm

re: #731 Obdicut

there you go making sense again...

733 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:11:03pm

re: #725 NJDhockeyfan

He stood by Wright for a while before he threw Wright under the bus. It seemed like every day there was a new video of Wright spewing anti-American racist hate speeches. I could never understand why Obama waited so long to cut ties with Wright.

I had the same concerns about the President's associations as many, heck, probably most of the folks here prior to the election.

But Obama cannot have been expected to control Wright's attention-seeking behavior, or the coverage of him. THAT part of it was beyond Obama's control.

And as I said - from the way things have played out since the election, I've been relieved that the concerns at play at the time have not been borne out. Really. They haven't.

734 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:11:34pm

re: #724 Obdicut

He included something that was printed in the LA Times first. I don't think anyone would accuse Wright of having great judgement, but to claim that is support for Hamas's violence is a huge stretch.

The article itself is a bit of Hamas propaganda that is explicitly not a call to violence, it's a whitewash of Hamas. I can easily believe that Wright was dumb or naive enough to think it had any credibility, but the article is propaganda, not an honest representation of Hamas as violent.

re: #707 swamprat

I'm not the least bit embarrassed by Wright.

I'm not in the least surprised.

735 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:11:35pm

re: #728 Naso Tang

No, but we should not pretend political correctness because we think we might get dirty.

Then use a narrow brush...

736 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:12:12pm

re: #734 swamprat

So first your accusation is that he's an embarrassment, and now you're not surprised that I'm not embarrassed.

You make very little sense on this issue.

737 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:13:06pm

re: #690 CuriousLurker

I had the same thought but didn't want to go there and possibly open up a whole other Pandora's Box. Because, ummm, I supposed to be working. This place is like crack, dammit!

Ah, and you're hooked now! No getting away!

738 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:13:29pm

re: #666 Aceofwhat?

Naso - way to answer an honest question with an insult. Classy.

When I intend to insult you will know it.

739 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:14:14pm

re: #692 NJDhockeyfan

His attitude toward Israel is not surprising.

How would you define his attitude toward Israel, and why isn't it surprising?

I agree with some other posters here that he's been brusque and bristly working with the Israeli govt., but I don't see much beyond that.

740 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:14:34pm

re: #732 Aceofwhat?

Heh. And likewise, if Israel did what Israel would never do, and actually turned into what its enemies accuse it of being, and drove every Palestinian out and occupied the full territory-- again, there would not be peace for Israel.

Israel is a wiser nation than many others because they know that they have no truly free choices facing them. All paths have consequences.

741 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:14:43pm

re: #690 CuriousLurker

I had the same thought but didn't want to go there and possibly open up a whole other Pandora's Box. Because, ummm, I supposed to be working. This place is like crack, dammit!

I had to retire from my job to make sure I got my daily dose of LGF.

742 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:14:56pm

Meanwhile back in old blighty, Edmund Standing comments on another bigoted attack on a mosque:

...

(Manchester Evening News)
“Then at about 2am last Saturday two men got into the grounds. One is on film throwing bricks which had been taken from a wall of a neighbouring building. They attacked the building twice in about 20 minutes.

“Three sections of the windows were smashed and bricks were found inside the office of the mosque. We had another incident in March when eggs were thrown at people leaving the mosque by people driving past.”

I’m reminded of a comment by BNP Councillor Pat Richardson:

‘A brick through the window is a British method … of showing displeasure‘.

743 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:15:37pm

re: #700 swamprat

Yes. Everything Wright said is true...except for us making AIDS, or what ever. But he neglected the part where we went to war for Blacks to be free, or that the atomic bombs we dropped saved lives on both sides, or anything that is positive. And he openly supported Hamas...which is by definition supportting violence and terror.

You're talking about the LA Times reprint?

744 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:15:41pm

re: #719 Naso Tang

Obama took a lot of flack before he finally realized he had to do the bus thing with Wright. Had he done so immediately I may have voted differently; but of course then I thought Palin was a smart woman from up north.

You really didn't listen to the speech he made.

745 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:15:56pm

re: #736 Obdicut

My "accusation" was about WindUpBirds' post.

Your feelings about Wright are not surprising.

Hope that clears everything up.

746 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:16:29pm

re: #733 reine.de.tout

I had the same concerns about the President's associations as many, heck, probably most of the folks here prior to the election.

But Obama cannot have been expected to control Wright's attention-seeking behavior, or the coverage of him. THAT part of it was beyond Obama's control.

And as I said - from the way things have played out since the election, I've been relieved that the concerns at play at the time have not been borne out. Really. They haven't.

agree completely. we on the right side of the spectrum, as Lidane intimated, barely have enough solid ground from which to ask that Obama not be in lockstep with the dear Reverend. there's plenty of wacky religious snot to clean up on our side of the aisle before we get pickier, IMHO...

747 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:16:55pm

re: #738 Naso Tang

When I intend to insult you will know it.

All the more clumsy that it happened without your knowledge, then.

748 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:17:06pm

re: #730 SanFranciscoZionist

The clothing line didn't help, but the down-ding was because I understood you to be making the argument that the Arab world has historically been more antii-Semitic than Europe. If I misunderstood, I will swim back upstream and reverse myself.

Actually it has been, if you discount the Nazi aberration, and I include the time period after WWII.

Please don't tell me that the Arab Muslim obsession with Jews is based on the Palestinians.

749 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:18:28pm

Hey all.

I missed out on the last thread. I have a question.

Is saying "I like ham" a particular insult to teabaggers that I am not aware of?
Or is it just a case of the humorless being offended?

750 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:18:28pm

re: #699 Cato the Elder

But Wright would not have been veep. Palin gave you no pause, I take it?

She gave me pause, but I liked McCain, once.

751 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:19:34pm

re: #745 swamprat

WindUpBird is also, I am very certain, not embarrassed by Wright. I'm not sure what convinced you this is the case, but it really isn't so.

Anyway: The reprint of the LA Times article was in no way an advocation to violence, just a display of Wright's ignorance, naiveté, and possibly the anti-semitism that's unfortunately so common in the black community. Wright is really no longer relevant, as Obama has taken plenty of large actions while in office that allow us to judge him. Bringing him up repeatedly is irritating, not embarrassing, and when tied to people like Farrakhan, it really does just seem like an attempt to associate "Obama" and "Crazy black man".

752 albusteve  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:19:40pm

I know advanced first aid, CPR, and the Heimlich Maneuver...just in case

753 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:20:29pm

re: #748 Naso Tang

Actually it has been, if you discount the Nazi aberration, and I include the time period after WWII.

Please don't tell me that the Arab Muslim obsession with Jews is based on the Palestinians.

Are you really saying that if we want to understand anti-semitism in Europe we should ignore the 'aberration' of the holocaust?

754 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:20:53pm

re: #738 Naso Tang

When I intend to insult you will know it.

and don't argue with the poster who nabbed post #666 unless you wanna be a toad...

go to sleep little babe
go to sleep little babe
your momma's gone away and your daddy's gonna stay
didn't leave nobody but the baby
go to sleep little babe
go to sleep little babe
everybody's gone in the cotton and the corn
didn't leave nobody but the baby

755 Varek Raith  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:21:15pm

re: #752 albusteve

I know advanced first aid, CPR, and the Heimlich Maneuver...just in case

Yes, but, do you know the jitterbug???


How ya doing?

756 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:21:21pm

re: #735 Aceofwhat?

Then use a narrow brush...

I thought I did, in the context discussed. Perhaps we have different glasses.

757 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:21:48pm

re: #742 Jimmah

Sorry, forgot the link to the full article - [Link: hurryupharry.org...]

758 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:22:22pm

re: #710 brookly red

that is in a way disturbing... it seems that those who would attack have learned not to take the risk of the retaliation a military attack would bring, death by a thousand cuts seem to be in fashion.

Uh, mayyyyybe?

The attacks being referred to are worldwide. Does an attack by a racist white kid in London count the same as an attack by a Muslim kid with connections to political organizations? Without? This is a very hazy area.

759 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:22:23pm

OT but,

Limbaugh caught in yet another lie. Yes, the Rushter was trying to make the mine disaster into anti-union propaganda. It turns out as usual, the fat peice of filth was lying through his teeth.

[Link: blog.aflcio.org...]

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

760 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:22:25pm

re: #744 Stanley Sea

You really didn't listen to the speech he made.

What speech. The one he was finally forced to make?/

761 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:22:27pm

re: #746 Aceofwhat?

agree completely. we on the right side of the spectrum, as Lidane intimated, barely have enough solid ground from which to ask that Obama not be in lockstep with the dear Reverend. there's plenty of wacky religious snot to clean up on our side of the aisle before we get pickier, IMHO...

gawd, Ace, I'm so glad you're here!
It's nice not to feel so . . . alone.

762 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:22:28pm

And now I have an announcement that all will enjoy:

Right now I spy two lizards having sex on my porch.

763 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:23:14pm

re: #748 Naso Tang

I am really sick and tired of people excusing Europe's record of antisemitism in order to attack Muslims.

Europe wins the goddamn prize. They win the Inquisition prize, the Crusades prize, the first and second Inquisition prizes, the pogroms, the holocausts, and the systemic ghettoization and persecution of Jews throughout the ages prize.

The Middle East had many, many periods of violence and persecution of Jews as well, but never to the extent present in Europe, and perpetrated in the Middle East by Europeans.

Hell, there's also this little thing called the Diaspora that the Romans were responsible for-- that wasn't very nice.

764 Varek Raith  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:23:46pm

re: #762 Stanley Sea

And now I have an announcement that all will enjoy:

Right now I spy two lizards having sex on my porch.

You're such a perv.
/

765 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:24:16pm

re: #762 Stanley Sea

And now I have an announcement that all will enjoy:

Right now I spy two lizards having sex on my porch.

Video?

766 albusteve  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:24:28pm

re: #755 Varek Raith

Yes, but, do you know the jitterbug???

How ya doing?

I've known a few bugs....I'm doin fine

767 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:24:44pm

re: #719 Naso Tang

Obama took a lot of flack before he finally realized he had to do the bus thing with Wright. Had he done so immediately I may might have voted differently; but of course then I thought Palin was a smart woman from up north.

FTFY.

Watch those counterfactual conditionals, dude!

768 Varek Raith  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:24:54pm

I'm quite certain that being Jewish in Europe in the past 1000+ years sucked.

769 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:25:27pm

re: #767 Cato the Elder

FTFY.

Watch those counterfactual conditionals, dude!

Oh, crap.
Now I have to go look up "may" and "might", and hope to hell I never abuse them in Cato's sight.
sheesh.

770 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:25:39pm

re: #753 Jimmah

Are you really saying that if we want to understand anti-semitism in Europe we should ignore the 'aberration' of the holocaust?

Good grief. If you don't think the holocaust was an aberration in human history and you wish to diminish it to the same level as social discrimination; be my guest.

771 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:25:41pm

re: #761 reine.de.tout

gawd, Ace, I'm so glad you're here!
It's nice not to feel so . . . alone.

Reine, dear, if everyone was as brilliant as us, we couldn't be in the top 1%...

(oh yes i did)

772 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:25:55pm

Found the Obama interview link, FWIW.
Your text to link...

Lotta interesting stuff going on back then.

773 Varek Raith  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:25:57pm

re: #769 reine.de.tout

Oh, crap.
Now I have to go look up "may" and "might", and hope to hell I never abuse them in Cato's sight.
sheesh.

Where's the fun in that?

774 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:26:57pm

re: #771 Aceofwhat?

Reine, dear, if everyone was as brilliant as us, we couldn't be in the top 1%...

(oh yes i did)

ha!
true, true, so true.

775 albusteve  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:27:52pm

re: #769 reine.de.tout

Oh, crap.
Now I have to go look up "may" and "might", and hope to hell I never abuse them in Cato's sight.
sheesh.

language is meant to be twisted and abused....see that gal with the pink hair and spike heels?----->
that's Cato

776 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:27:56pm

re: #765 reine.de.tout

Video?

They saw me watching, got embarrassed and ran away.

It was classic though - I see the mating dance all the time, but never lucky enough to see them in action.

777 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:28:04pm

re: #743 SanFranciscoZionist

There are a couple of sources. And general antisemitism. There was some confusion because there are multiple "Wrights".

778 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:28:06pm

re: #768 Varek Raith

I'm quite certain that being Jewish in Europe in the past 1000+ years sucked.

Yeah. They were never able to be successful in any way at all, were they?

779 albusteve  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:28:55pm

oh boy!, climate change!

780 Varek Raith  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:29:24pm

re: #778 Naso Tang

Yeah. They were never able to be successful in any way at all, were they?

I'm saying that Europeans were certainly very anti Semitic for a very long time. Still are, in some parts.

781 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:29:41pm

re: #616 TheMatrix31

Can't we just get back to missing apostrophes?

782 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:29:44pm

re: #779 albusteve

oh boy!, climate change!

haha. Yep!

783 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:29:48pm

re: #778 Naso Tang

Yeah. They were never able to be successful in any way at all, were they?

you're kidding, right? that was sarcasm, right?

784 Van Helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:30:07pm

PIMF
Obama and the Constitution
Does anyone remember if this was picked up anywhere else?

785 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:30:32pm

re: #778 Naso Tang

Well, sometimes we were. On my mom's side, my family during the 1500s in Spain were doing pretty good. Then they were forced to either convert, die, or be enslaved, their property was stolen, and they arrived in the New World in chain.

It's really nice how often the Europeans let us become successful before stealing everything we owned.

786 Gus  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:30:51pm

Here's an idea. Jeremiah Wright was the pastor for the Trinity United Church of Christ. The congregation is primarily located in the Southeast side of Chicago. The idea is to all those that feel that Wright was out of line with his sermons would be to trade your lives for those that attend the church and live as they do in Southeast Chicago for one year. That is to walk a year in their shoes.

Just to give you and idea of the neighborhood have a peek at the latest news coming from the Southeast side of Chicago.

2 people shot on Southeast Side
‎Girl, 13, sexually assaulted on SE Side
‎Men Try To Abduct 2 Girls On Southeast Side
‎Woman's body found in lake on South East SideGang tensions on the city's Southeast Side ended in a hail of bullets

787 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:31:24pm

re: #748 Naso Tang

Actually it has been, if you discount the Nazi aberration, and I include the time period after WWII.

Please don't tell me that the Arab Muslim obsession with Jews is based on the Palestinians.

I disagree profoundly. The Nazis were a culmination, not an aberration.

788 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:31:33pm

re: #780 Varek Raith

I'm saying that Europeans were certainly very anti Semitic for a very long time. Still are, in some parts.

These kind of statements could make a Martian think biases and bigotry is exclusively felt by Jews.

789 Political Atheist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:31:55pm

re: #765 reine.de.tout

Hey how are ya? Got photog studio news...

790 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:32:09pm

re: #783 Aceofwhat?

you're kidding, right? that was sarcasm, right?

Yes it was.

791 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:32:16pm

re: #788 Naso Tang

What the fuck does that mean?

792 albusteve  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:32:18pm

re: #782 Stanley Sea

haha. Yep!

I'm donning my Green Armor

793 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:32:25pm

Gotta eat. BBL

794 Varek Raith  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:32:27pm

re: #788 Naso Tang

These kind of statements could make a Martian think biases and bigotry is exclusively felt by Jews.

As a Martian, I got no clue what you're talking about.
;)

795 reine.de.tout  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:32:54pm

re: #789 Rightwingconspirator

Hey how are ya? Got photog studio news...

What's up?

796 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:33:33pm

re: #770 Naso Tang

Good grief. If you don't think the holocaust was an aberration in human history and you wish to diminish it to the same level as social discrimination; be my guest.

No, the bigotry that made the holocaust possible is not an aberration in human history - you'd have to know nothing of our history to think that. The holocaust is part of that history of bigotry; to try to exclude it from a discussion of that subject on the grounds of its scale is insane.

797 albusteve  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:33:52pm

re: #794 Varek Raith

As a Martian, I got no clue what you're talking about.
;)

he's speaking in diphthongs again

798 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:34:31pm

re: #751 Obdicut


Good of you to know how WindUpBird feels.

I find myself defending Obama about as often as I go the other way.

How about you?

You can check this very thread for an example.

799 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:34:39pm

re: #768 Varek Raith

I'm quite certain that being Jewish in Europe in the past 1000+ years sucked.

It did. In many, many ways.

800 Varek Raith  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:35:10pm

re: #797 albusteve

he's speaking in diphthongs again

Ah, you humans confuse me.
:)

801 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:36:06pm

re: #778 Naso Tang

Yeah. They were never able to be successful in any way at all, were they?

They were also 'successful' in the Muslim world.

802 albusteve  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:36:06pm

re: #800 Varek Raith

Ah, you humans confuse me.
:)

I'm not a human, I'm a New Mexican

803 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:36:51pm

re: #796 Jimmah

No, the bigotry that made the holocaust possible is not an aberration in human history - you'd have to know nothing of our history to think that. The holocaust is part of that history of bigotry; to try to exclude it from a discussion of that subject on the grounds of its scale is insane.

Well, when one believes that any form of "success" is proof of lack of discrimination/bigotry rather than a remarkable story in the face of adversity, sanity is scarce...

804 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:36:53pm

re: #799 SanFranciscoZionist

It did. In many, many ways.

Fairchilds!
Illuminatti!

805 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:39:40pm

re: #798 swamprat

I have no idea what relevance that has. And I'm not speaking for WindUpBird-- but I'll bet you a dozen donuts that he's not embarrassed by Wright.

I find myself defending Obama about as often as I go the other way.

How about you?

What on earth are you talking about? If you're asking if I criticize Obama, yes, I have, and I do. But the Wright issue-- which is what we're talking about-- is a lame, lame issue to criticize him over in the present time. It's nutty to focus on an event in the past and to continue to misrepresent the events in order to use it as a line of attack.

806 Political Atheist  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:40:20pm

re: #795 reine.de.tout

Ordered a new camera, the Canon SLR that does HD video. Vimeo has some...That lets me include video for commercial clients and take better jewelry shots. A similar model to the the Canon SLR camera that was used to shoot the season ending episode of House.
These new cameras are broacast quality HD, small, and very affordable compared to a news camera or a "Red Camera", the current favorite of digital video filmmakers.

807 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:40:51pm

re: #805 Obdicut

I have no idea what relevance that has. And I'm not speaking for WindUpBird-- but I'll bet you a dozen donuts that he's not embarrassed by Wright.

What on earth are you talking about? If you're asking if I criticize Obama, yes, I have, and I do. But the Wright issue-- which is what we're talking about-- is a lame, lame issue to criticize him over in the present time. It's nutty to focus on an event in the past and to continue to misrepresent the events in order to use it as a line of attack.

SPEAK OF THE DEVIL AND HE SCREECHES TO A HALT IN HIS VW

808 Decatur Deb  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:41:13pm

Evening, all. I'm back from a weekend playing roadie for a bicycle criterion race and the annual Cheaha Challenge, a 100 mi climb to highest point in Alabama. Daughter finished in under 7 hrs. On topic, one of our vendor's signs spelled "balloon" wrong.

809 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:41:32pm

re: #807 WindUpBird

Dude! Tell me you've read all of Sam and Max: Freelance Police.

"Speak of the devil!"

"Okay! The devil! The devil!"

810 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:42:12pm

re: #808 Decatur Deb

How? Too many letters, or too few, or a more creative error?

811 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:42:50pm

re: #805 Obdicut

I agree. To misrepresent something, and then to use that misrepresentation as an attack, is wrong.

812 Decatur Deb  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:42:51pm

re: #810 Obdicut

How? Too many letters, or too few, or a more creative error?

One "L"

813 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:43:12pm

Dinner time - later folks :)

814 Decatur Deb  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:43:41pm

re: #813 Jimmah

Dinner time - later folks :)

Left-wing shift change.

815 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:43:52pm

re: #811 swamprat

And that is what was done by saying that Farrakhan was Obama's mentor, it's what was done by saying that Wright is his mentor, and it's what you did when you said that Wright advocated violence.

816 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:45:33pm

re: #807 WindUpBird


He asked what my accusation was. I really did not intend any ill feelings towards you. Although we frequently view things differently.

817 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:46:36pm

re: #815 Obdicut


And it was done when Wozzablog said I called him a liar and you piled on.

818 ryannon  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:47:31pm

re: #665 brookly red

it is what it is...

And I yam what I yam.

819 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:48:10pm

re: #817 swamprat

And it was done when Wozzablog said I called him a liar and you piled on.

I'm sorry, but I don't agree. And get the hell over it. Bringing it up again, and again making statements that are incredibly silly-- like reprinting the LA Times article being direct support for Hamas's violence-- is not going to do anything positive.

820 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:48:16pm

re: #815 Obdicut
You are quoting an incomplete quoting of an article I posted, and I addressed the commenter who made that mistake.

821 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:50:14pm

re: #819 Obdicut


So let us agree to be polite, and that should include wozzablog who started this and has thus far lacked to weigh in.

822 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:50:29pm

re: #820 swamprat

You are quoting an incomplete quoting of an article I posted, and I addressed the commenter who made that mistake.

Dude-- we are now beating a dead horse that is dressed in a little jockey outfit and sitting on the dead horse that is the Wright issue.

I'm sorry if you felt piled on. I do not feel that I went too far in any way and I do think that your statements on this are irresponsible in their inaccuracy.

823 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:52:04pm

re: #745 swamprat

My "accusation" was about WindUpBirds' post.

Your feelings about Wright are not surprising.

Hope that clears everything up.

If you wanna know how I feel about Wright, I think he's a small time Chicago power player, an important guy to be freinds with if you're a black politician in Chicago, and creating this fiction that Wright is in any way pulling Obama's strings, or going to the White House all the time (like that reject upthread said, quoting PAMELA GELLER of all things) that Obama is in like Flynn with the most goofy and crazy things Wright says is dog-whistle racism. I think he's a firey preacher, andsays some crazy stuff, and says some okay stuff. Either way, in 2010, he's completely, utterly irrelevant. We can play dumbass association games with every President ever, and we'll find all kinds of juicy nuggets. it's boring, it's not interesting, and it's a thing bad talk radio broadcasters need to bring up to keep weak people listening.

We don't even turn our heads when a guy like Pat Robertson, who does business directly with dictators, blames queers for 9/11, says the most insane stuff outside of Stormfront, he had all this political access? Not a peep. Wright isn't a hundreth as significant as Robertson is, but he's black and some sleazy operative dug through a thousand hours of footage to find one piece of VHS footage, so suddenly the whole country's real interested in that guy. This country still has a long way to go, is all I can say.

Bringing up really weak association politics is a sure sign of a lack of ideas, a lack of intellectual honesty, and a lack of any ability to challenge the man on his policies, on the facts.

If you want to know what Wright really is, he's a useful distraction that right-wingers employ to crank up that old-time Southern Strategy tribalist politics and draw attention from the fact that they have no ideas.

824 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:52:18pm

re: #809 Obdicut

Dude! Tell me you've read all of Sam and Max: Freelance Police.

"Speak of the devil!"

"Okay! The devil! The devil!"

I played the first game aloooong time ago. :D

825 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:54:36pm

re: #822 Obdicut

I only want to make it clear that I never considered Farrakhan to be Obamas' mentor. That sort of rhetoric is ridiculous, even from me.

826 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:56:28pm

re: #749 LudwigVanQuixote

Hey all.

I missed out on the last thread. I have a question.

Is saying "I like ham" a particular insult to teabaggers that I am not aware of?
Or is it just a case of the humorless being offended?

It's a bunch of nasty violent people who are mad they're being made fun of, and don't see any other way to deal with it than attacking a dude.

827 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:56:32pm

re: #825 swamprat

That's why I made it very clear what I was saying that you did-- which was represent the LA Times article that whitewashes Hamas as something that promotes violence.

828 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:56:35pm

re: #823 WindUpBird

Permission to save and repost? You said it all.

829 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:56:45pm

re: #823 WindUpBird

I can find nothing in your entire paragraph to disagree with.

I must be slipping.

830 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:56:56pm

re: #824 WindUpBird

The comic books are funnier and the art is much better. Read 'em!

831 Stanghazi  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:57:41pm

re: #825 swamprat

I only want to make it clear that I never considered Farrakhan to be Obamas' mentor. That sort of rhetoric is ridiculous, even from me.

That sort of rhetoric only showed up recently in my memory. Here @ LGF he's been mentioned the last week over and over again.

832 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 4:58:55pm

re: #822 Obdicut


That is unfortunate.

833 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 5:10:41pm

re: #796 Jimmah

No, the bigotry that made the holocaust possible is not an aberration in human history - you'd have to know nothing of our history to think that. The holocaust is part of that history of bigotry; to try to exclude it from a discussion of that subject on the grounds of its scale is insane.

So my arguments are insane now? I tried to Exclude nothing from the discussion.

As a result of the holocaust and the subsequent insanity in the Middle East, discrimination against Jews has been in the forefront of our political history since at least WWII.

However when people start thinking that Jews are the only people with a serious history of discrimination, then we do have a problem, and it is not of my making.

834 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 5:13:40pm

re: #833 Naso Tang

However when people start thinking that Jews are the only people with a serious history of discrimination, then we do have a problem, and it is not of my making.

Why on earth do you think there's any danger of that, though?

835 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 5:16:07pm

re: #833 Naso Tang

Ok. Maybe we can go easy. We can make the same point without the the invectives. I know tempers run high..(God, do I know it!), but it (anger)
does not lead to any good thing.

Trust me.

836 Aceofwhat?  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 5:20:06pm

re: #834 Obdicut

Why on earth do you think there's any danger of that, though?

yep, i'm not following either...

837 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 5:27:17pm

re: #791 Obdicut

What the fuck does that mean?

It simply means that Armenians don't get enough attention anymore, if you want a sarcastic reply.

This discussion is getting out of hand. The original issue was my contention, initiated by someone, that the Arab (and Persian) Muslim societies have a fundamental biase, hatred, of Jews that transcends simple basic social bigotry.

Now we are getting into scoring points for who was treated worse where and when.

Pointless.

838 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 5:32:17pm

re: #837 Naso Tang

Now we are getting into scoring points for who was treated worse where and when.

Only you are concentrating on the 'who' part. Nobody else is. And you are completely wrong to try to say that Europe's history of antisemitism isn't the primary one. It is.

839 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 5:36:02pm

re: #837 Naso Tang

That is interesting. I remember hearing that (supposedly) *itler said no one would care about the Jews because no one had cared about what had happened to the Armenians.

/citation needed

840 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 5:49:20pm

re: #838 Obdicut

Only you are concentrating on the 'who' part. Nobody else is. And you are completely wrong to try to say that Europe's history of antisemitism isn't the primary one. It is.

Now you are scoring points again. Are you saying it was Europeans, who had plenty of other biases in the past, were the ones to infect Islamic religious beliefs against Jews?

841 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 5:57:01pm

re: #840 Naso Tang

How am I 'scoring points' by correctly pointing out that antisemitism in Europe was systematic and terrible for millennia, including the mass kings of Jews throughout that time period, the theft of property, and the withholding of rights?

I'm making no accusations that Europeans are the source of all antisemitism in the world, so your question is absurd.

842 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 6:09:27pm

re: #841 Obdicut


We are obviously speaking a cross purposes here. Let's give it a rest.

843 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 6:14:28pm

re: #842 Naso Tang

I don't think we are. You're wrong when you assert that Europe was not as antisemitic as the Arab world. Europe takes the historical cake in antisemitism.

Other than that, you seem very close to an accusation that Jews are somehow hogging the persecution spotlight.

844 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 6:19:22pm

Severe fear mongering on Barbara "the babe in the bunker" Simpson's show on her radio program, KSFO San Francisco. She's interviewing people who used to live under communism. I just tuned in and have listened to 2 women. According to both of them, the US is on the path to socialism/communism/marxism BECAUSE OF President Obama. Both said over and over that events happening now ARE JUST LIKE the communist revolution. KSFO knows no shame.

845 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 6:40:19pm

re: #843 Obdicut

I don't think we are. You're wrong when you assert that Europe was not as antisemitic as the Arab world. Europe takes the historical cake in antisemitism.

Other than that, you seem very close to an accusation that Jews are somehow hogging the persecution spotlight.

Actually, I started by speaking of the present, not the past, then got sucked into the past. I don't have the numbers of how many Jews were left in the Middle East, where they originated, versus how many were in Europe during the last century, but I am of the impression that persecution or not, they did better in Europe.

I was simply stating that antisemitism is inextricably linked to Muslim culture in the Middle East today, and it doesn't originate with the state of Israel.

As to hogging the spotlight, in view of the holocaust it should be in the spotlight, always, but as an issue of everyday discrimination against minorities, that has existed in all human history and is no worse a fate for the individuals in smaller groups than for those in larger ones.

846 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 6:50:08pm

re: #845 Naso Tang

but I am of the impression that persecution or not, they did better in Europe.

You're wrong.

I was simply stating that antisemitism is inextricably linked to Muslim culture in the Middle East today, and it doesn't originate with the state of Israel.

No, you weren't. You directly asserted that there was a greater history of antisemitism in the Middle East than in Europe, and that is wrong.

It is also not inextricably linked. It can be extricated.

847 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 7:07:16pm

re: #846 Obdicut

No, you weren't. You directly asserted that there was a greater history of antisemitism in the Middle East than in Europe, and that is wrong.

It is also not inextricably linked. It can be extricated.

Why are there essentially no Jewish communities left in the Middle East, but many in Europe and elsewhere?

In any case, I repeat, that I was originally making a statement of the present.

As to extricating; are you suggesting rewriting the Koran?

848 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 7:11:58pm

re: #847 Naso Tang

Why are there essentially no Jewish communities left in the Middle East, but many in Europe and elsewhere?

Because of the present, and because of Israel; there are a lot of Jews in the Middle East. They're in Israel.

In any case, I repeat, that I was originally making a statement of the present.

But you disagreed with SFZ's statement about history. You either misread it very badly, and continued to misread it, or you really were asserting that.

849 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 7:13:43pm

re: #847 Naso Tang

As to extricating; are you suggesting rewriting the Koran?

Oh and give me a break: it's religion. It can change. They can have a reformation.

850 webevintage  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 7:24:50pm

re: #772 Van Helsing

Found the Obama interview link, FWIW.
Your text to link...

Lotta interesting stuff going on back then.

Wow you guys really got worked up over that.
[Link: mediamatters.org...]

851 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 7:27:04pm

re: #848 Obdicut

Because of the present, and because of Israel; there are a lot of Jews in the Middle East. They're in Israel.

Huh. You think that addresses what I said?


But you disagreed with SFZ's statement about history. You either misread it very badly, and continued to misread it, or you really were asserting that.

Maybe one or the other. At this time I am addressing what we are talking about more recently, and you continue to tell me what I am saying regardless of what I try to tell you I am.

Oh and give me a break: it's religion. It can change. They can have a reformation.

Good grief. If you were a Muslim and suggested that you would have a price on your head overnight.

852 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 7:34:51pm

re: #847 Naso Tang

As to extricating; are you suggesting rewriting the Koran?

Annnnd there it is. I knew this was going to come up sooner or later. Before you jump into exegesis of the Qur'an, can you please tell me if you 1.) have studied Qur'anic Arabic, 2.) have read the entire Qur'an, and 3.) understand the context in which each surah (chapter) was revealed, 4.) have read books of hadith (and if so, which ones), and 5.) have read a tafsir of the Qur'an (again, if so, which one).

Better yet, here's some very basic stuff before you start quoting the ayas (verses) that I know you're going to quote: Without going to Wikipedia, please list the 5 pillars of Islam, then describe the central concept that Islam is based on and how that relates to the Muslim world view. This is Islam 101.

853 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 7:47:14pm

re: #851 Naso Tang

Good grief. If you were a Muslim and suggested that you would have a price on your head overnight.

That is absurd, at least within mainstream Islam. There has been ongoing ijma' (consensus) for centuries, with different rulings arrived at based on the practical needs of Muslims living in various places, times, and circumstances.

854 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 7:50:35pm

re: #852 CuriousLurker

Yes I've seen some of those academic/theological arguments, but they are irrelevant to the reality.

I know how it is interpreted and quoted by the loudest of the preachers in Islam. Your academics are irrelevant in that context unless you are going to stand up there and argue with them in a mosque in Mecca.

855 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 7:56:34pm

re: #854 Naso Tang

re: #854 Naso Tang

This guy is not a mere academic on this subject. It is something he has intimate knowledge of. Ask him something and you may have a chance to learn.

But don't ask me, I'm still stymied about the difference between Sunni and Shia.

856 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:01:51pm

re: #854 Naso Tang

Yes I've seen some of those academic/theological arguments, but they are irrelevant to the reality.

I know how it is interpreted and quoted by the loudest of the preachers in Islam. Your academics are irrelevant in that context unless you are going to stand up there and argue with them in a mosque in Mecca.

And it was irrelevant to argue against the Catholic church during its heyday, too-- what's your point? It doesn't point to anything about Islam as a religion being different. They need Enlightenment values to knock religion off its pedestal, like we had.

857 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:05:37pm

re: #855 swamprat

re: #854 Naso Tang

This guy is not a mere academic on this subject. It is something he has intimate knowledge of. Ask him something and you may have a chance to learn.

But don't ask me, I'm still stymied about the difference between Sunni and Shia.


In that case CL, let me state that it is not my desire to bash religion here but neither will I be politically correct in choosing my arguments if I am pressed.

We see a lot of flack here against "Conservatives" for tolerating the loonies in their midst, and I mean their leaders as much as the illiterate. I don't think religious issues should be treated any different if they are discussed.

However I would like to ask you a question. Are you a Muslim by birth, or conversion?

858 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:13:30pm

re: #856 Obdicut

And it was irrelevant to argue against the Catholic church during its heyday, too-- what's your point? It doesn't point to anything about Islam as a religion being different. They need Enlightenment values to knock religion off its pedestal, like we had.

That is so general a statement I don't know how to respond.

Muslims today believe they are enlightened. How do you propose changing the literal word of Allah? There is a big difference between deciding that words are inspired by god and believing they are literal quotes.

859 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:17:44pm

re: #854 Naso Tang

Yes I've seen some of those academic/theological arguments, but they are irrelevant to the reality.

I know how it is interpreted and quoted by the loudest of the preachers in Islam. Your academics are irrelevant in that context unless you are going to stand up there and argue with them in a mosque in Mecca.

Those those academic/theological arguments may be irrelevant to you, but they aren't to most Muslims. You're saying that it is interpreted according to the loudest preachers you have heard. You're clearly not Muslim, so I have to assume that your clearly limited knowledge of Islam comes from living in the Gulf for some years as an outsider looking in and/or listening to whatever looney tunes extremsits you've heard howling at the moon as they issue fatwas that they're not in any way qualified to issue.

As for Mecca, why would I need to go argue in a mosque there? There are scholars (not the same as what you call "preachers") who specialize in ijma' for those living in the West in general, in America in particular, and right on down to the imam at the local neighborhood mosque (to deal with the specific local issues & personal issues of the members their congregations).

When you can demonstrate that you have a grasp of even the most basic Islamic tenets, and when you've got an argument better than "Well that's the reality that I've seen, therefore I'm going to declare that it's the reality for an entire religion of over 1.5 billion people, the vast majority of whom aren't even Arab," then we can discuss things further. Until then, I'm afraid that having an informed discussion with you about anything related to Islam will be impossible.

Stick a fork in me—I'm done.

860 van helsing  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:18:01pm

re: #850 webevintage

Wow you guys really got worked up over that.
[Link: mediamatters.org...]

The recording linked to has nothing to do with Drudge or any other interpretation. It is Obama speaking.

861 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:25:13pm

re: #859 CuriousLurker

So it comes down to the theology and realities in the news every day be damned.

Sounds kind of like the responses we have been hearing from the Vatican in response to criticism about child rape.

I'm sorry your done. Your choice.

862 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:25:43pm

PIMF: you're

863 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:35:05pm

re: #857 Naso Tang

In that case CL, let me state that it is not my desire to bash religion here but neither will I be politically correct in choosing my arguments if I am pressed.

That's fine, but if you're going to make certain wide ranging statements as if they're fact instead of personal opinion/experience, then you need to be prepared to back them up.

We see a lot of flack here against "Conservatives" for tolerating the loonies in their midst, and I mean their leaders as much as the illiterate. I don't think religious issues should be treated any different if they are discussed.

Read my previous post. My leaders—and the leaders of most law-abiding, decent Muslims in the world—are NOT some screechy Wahhabi fundamentalists living in Saudi Arabia (I've met many Saudis I've that loathe them and their "morals police"), nor are they some semi-literate mullahs living in caves in Afghanistan, nor are they some terrorists running around issuing fatwas that they have no business issuing.

//Perhaps if we could wean ourselves from the dependency on ME oil that puts so many petro-dollars in the pockets of dictators in the ME and helps them export their fundamentalism (and helps them support other dictators), then maybe their people would have a half a chance of standing up to them and fighting back.

However I would like to ask you a question. Are you a Muslim by birth, or conversion?

I'm a convert. Going on 20 years. And, no, I didn't convert through marriage in case you're wondering.

864 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:50:34pm

re: #863 CuriousLurker

Read my previous post. My leaders—and the leaders of most law-abiding, decent Muslims in the world—are NOT some screechy Wahhabi fundamentalists living in Saudi Arabia (I've met many Saudis I've that loathe them and their "morals police"), nor are they some semi-literate mullahs living in caves in Afghanistan, nor are they some terrorists running around issuing fatwas that they have no business issuing.

For what it's worth, it is hardly only Saudi Arabia, and since it needs to be spelled out to you I have never said that all Muslims are what you describe above, but you sure seem to be just about as sensitive to criticism, implied or specific.

What is it in your theology that prevents you from forming a new version of Islam then, which clearly disavows all the primitive and violent attributes that we see so much of, even in the birthplace of the religion?

...As Obdicut seems to think is so achievable?

865 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 8:52:30pm

re: #858 Naso Tang

Do you just not know what the Enlightenment was, or something?

Otherwise I have no fucking clue how your response makes any sense.

866 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:01:07pm

re: #861 Naso Tang

So it comes down to the theology and realities in the news every day be damned.

Sounds kind of like the responses we have been hearing from the Vatican in response to criticism about child rape.

Seriously? You saw it on the news, so it must be true? So, again, because you're not personally aware of any Muslims speaking out against hate or terrorism, then it's not happening, right?

And the media has no vested interest in presenting the most frightening pictures of Muslims they can find, right? Again, there are over 1.5 billion Muslims in the world, yet I see very few positive images of or stories about Arab Muslims in the media. I wonder why? It must be because there aren't any rational, tolerant, "normal" Arab Muslims, right?

I wonder how many advertisers would get on board if they started doing stories about Ahmed the widowed baker who works hard every day and helps people whenever he can, or Khadijah the happily married school teacher who goes home and bakes cookie for her kids. Not many would be my guess.

867 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:07:13pm

re: #865 Obdicut

Do you just not know what the Enlightenment was, or something?

Otherwise I have no fucking clue how your response makes any sense.

re: #865 Obdicut

Do you just not know what the Enlightenment was, or something?

Otherwise I have no fucking clue how your response makes any sense.

Are you being bloody minded just for the hell of it, or do you suddenly just get a kick out of using 4 letter words as arguments?

That you can't make sense of what I said says more about you than me, and it is you who are getting aggressively indignant when you think you hear anything you don't like. Why don't you just stick to downdings?

868 Achilles Tang  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:12:25pm

re: #866 CuriousLurker

Seriously? You saw it on the news, so it must be true? So, again, because you're not personally aware of any Muslims speaking out against hate or terrorism, then it's not happening, right?

And the media has no vested interest in presenting the most frightening pictures of Muslims they can find, right? Again, there are over 1.5 billion Muslims in the world, yet I see very few positive images of or stories about Arab Muslims in the media. I wonder why? It must be because there aren't any rational, tolerant, "normal" Arab Muslims, right?

I wonder how many advertisers would get on board if they started doing stories about Ahmed the widowed baker who works hard every day and helps people whenever he can, or Khadijah the happily married school teacher who goes home and bakes cookie for her kids. Not many would be my guess.

I am sure you noticed that you changed the subject again, and try to imply I am saying something I didn't.

Goodnight.

869 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:13:10pm

re: #867 Naso Tang

I swear. A lot of people do.

That you can't make sense of what I said says more about you than me, and it is you who are getting aggressively indignant when you think you hear anything you don't like. Why don't you just stick to downdings?

No, it really doesn't. Englightenment values doesn't have the same meaning as 'enlightened' in the sense you used it. Europeans used to be a bunch of religious zealots until the Enlightenment happened and brave, brave, brave men gave their all to change their societies, one after another. And even then, there is still enough religious insanity brewing in the background to clearly show that we could slip into it again-- the Dominionists are real.

The Muslim world needs an Enlightenment. It needs to go through the process that Christianity did. In many places, as CuriousLurker has noted, like the West, this has largely happened already; Muslims who identify first and foremost as Americans, for example.

There is nothing special about the Koran that makes it an evil religious book. Most religious books are basically the same, they all contain good and evil and justifications for terrible things and justifications for decent things.

870 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:16:59pm

re: #866 CuriousLurker

Actually, we do hear of Muslims speaking out. I am past linking,(too tired) but I have heard of groups and individuals objecting to the actions and rhetoric many find objectionable. As you said, it doesn't get the coverage it could..

871 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:20:13pm

re: #869 Obdicut

You have no idea how much I did not want to have to upding you for that comment.

872 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:21:48pm

re: #871 swamprat

Why?

873 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:24:46pm

re: #872 Obdicut

I was really hoping you would prove yourself to be an unreasonable asshole. But alas, you would not play along.

874 Obdicut  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:45:22pm

re: #873 swamprat

Oh. Sorry. I'm really not.

875 swamprat  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:46:55pm

Damn!
Lost another assumption!

876 Querent  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 9:58:23pm

wow, the scales are really flying in here tonight...

877 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:12:59pm

re: #864 Naso Tang

For what it's worth, it is hardly only Saudi Arabia, and since it needs to be spelled out to you I have never said that all Muslims are what you describe above...

And I didn't say you said they were. But you have stated that since the hate-mongers are the loudest and most often heard, then they make the academic/theological arguments of the mainstream irrelevant. If the academic/theological arguments that the vast majority of Muslims follow are irrelevant, then by default they must approve of the hate-mongers because (according to you) they say nothing against it.

...but you sure seem to be just about as sensitive to criticism, implied or specific.

Don't try to make this about me being sensitive, okay? You're criticizing my religion, not me. You're doing so by drawing a conclusion that I think is wrong because the logic doesn't make sense. I'm calling you on it the same as I did when you claimed that Muslim children aren't allowed to play with dolls. How, pray tell, is that about me being sensitive to criticism?

You have also implied more than once in this thread that hatred of Jews is somehow codified. It is not. I know what verses you're referring to, and as I mentioned earlier, there's no point in discussing exegesis with you if you don't understand the basic concepts of Islam (or if you refuse to accept any academic/theological arguments as valid—and you have already stated they are irrelevant to you).

As I said when I first introduced myself, I'll be glad to answer sincere questions, but you have to come to the table with an open mind because I have no interest in being the resident apologist for my faith by engaging with people who simply want to debate (instead of have a real discussion). Debates are about someone winning. I'm not here to win anything, I'm here to learn.

What is it in your theology that prevents you from forming a new version of Islam then, which clearly disavows all the primitive and violent attributes that we see so much of, even in the birthplace of the religion?

You're asking the question in a very negative way that seems designed to put me into a defensive crouch. The question starts off with the presumption that there's something inherent in Islamic theology that prevents the positive change or progress and disavows all the "primitive", "violent" attributes you see. Pretty negative stuff.

Try rephrasing your question, but first decide if you're willing to believe that perhaps Islam isn't what you currently understand it to be. If you're going to say that what you see in the news is the only reality you'll accept, then we have nothing further to discuss with regard to Islam.

878 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:15:22pm

re: #868 Naso Tang

I am sure you noticed that you changed the subject again, and try to imply I am saying something I didn't.

Goodnight.

Goodnight.

879 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:18:35pm

Obdicut & swamprat: thanks.

Sheesh, I'm exhausted now! And I still need to go back & upding people.

880 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:19:25pm

re: #876 Querent

wow, the scales are really flying in here tonight...

Indeed. They've been flying off & on all day.

881 Cato the Elder  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 10:28:32pm

re: #856 Obdicut

And it was irrelevant to argue against the Catholic church during its heyday, too-- what's your point? It doesn't point to anything about Islam as a religion being different. They need Enlightenment values to knock religion off its pedestal, like we had.

Maybe.

The Enlightenment is largely overrated and certainly enjoys an inflated reputation based on the name alone. Who could be against enlightenment?

Those who suffered and died on the guillotine or in the Vendée under the Reign of Terror following the "enlightened" French Revolution - their ghosts wail a different tune.

882 punchy100  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:18:22pm

Dear Charles and all other Tea Party haters:

As a former frequent reader of LGF (I was with you all the way through the Creationism Flap, the Velaams Belang Split, and the Birther Divide!). I'd like to offer up my own first hand account of the local Tea Party protest on Thurs.

They're just regular people. End of story. If you can't see that, you're fooling yourself.

[Link: roarkwolfe.blogspot.com...]

883 BARACK THE VOTE  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:29:25pm

re: #882 punchy100

Yeah, Regular People who are ignorant as hell:

In short, no matter how one slices the data, the Tea Party crowd appears to believe that federal taxes are very considerably higher than they actually are, whether referring to total taxes as a share of GDP or in terms of the taxes paid by a typical family.

Tea Partyers also seem to have a very distorted view of the direction of federal taxes. They were asked whether they are higher, lower or the same as when Barack Obama was inaugurated last year. More than two-thirds thought that taxes are higher today, and only 4% thought they were lower; the rest said they are the same.

As noted earlier, federal taxes are very considerably lower by every measure since Obama became president.

So since it isn't about taxes, I wonder what it is about?/

884 CuriousLurker  Sun, Apr 18, 2010 11:34:08pm

re: #865 Obdicut

Do you just not know what the Enlightenment was, or something?

Otherwise I have no fucking clue how your response makes any sense.

I think what he meant about "how do you propose changing the literal word of Allah", and earlier about having "a price on your head overnight" is a confusion about what might be acceptable reformation to a Muslim. Changing even one letter of the Qur'an would be completely unacceptable to a Muslim. I think the same can probably be said for the Jews/Torah and the Christians/Bible—i.e. you may translate it, you may reinterpret how what it says applies to modern day life, but you may not rewrite it or change any of the religion's basic tenets simply to make it more convenient. Anyone reading should feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on that.

As you obviously know since your family has a history in Spain (so does mine, BTW), Muslim Spain was considered very enlightened for its place & time. God willing, one day it will regain a positive status.

Anyway, I'm getting off track. What Naso was refusing to acknowledge was that there are already mechanisms within Islam that allow for change & adaptation, and some of that good old hopey-changey stuff is happening, albeit quietly & slowly on a grassroots level. It's happening here in America and elsewhere, or at least that what Muslims I've met from other countries tell me.

The thing is, there's also a poison out there. Add to that the dictatorships in the ME, socio-economic problems, and cultural issues that need to be addressed, and you have painfully slow change. Not only that, but the change has to move across a geographic area much larger & more (culturally) varied that that of Europe during the Reformation. Change didn't happen overnight for Europe—it took hundreds of years—and it's not going to happen overnight in the ME either.

I believe that Islam has its best chance to grow and adapt here in the U.S. Not with the aim of taking over and instituting sharia [insert *eyeroll*], but with the aim of taking our religion back, so to speak. Why here? Because of the freedoms we have (both religious & otherwise), because many American Muslims are converts who don't have the cultural baggage that gets mixed in with Islam as it exists in the ME and beyond, because America is the most amazing melting pot ever, which makes it easy for anyone who can get here to (eventually) be accepted as an American. IOW, is a place where Islam & Muslims can be free to grow & thrive just like everyone else. And I think it will.

Wow, I didn't intend to write all that. Okay, morning will come way too soon, so I'd better go. Night, lizards.

~~~~GONE~~~~

885 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Apr 19, 2010 1:05:54am

re: #677 TheMatrix31

I realize why I gave up giving a shit about politics over the last couple of weeks. It was a good, happy two weeks.

Yeah, for us.

886 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Apr 19, 2010 1:18:06am

re: #833 Naso Tang

So my arguments are insane now? I tried to Exclude nothing from the discussion.

As a result of the holocaust and the subsequent insanity in the Middle East, discrimination against Jews has been in the forefront of our political history since at least WWII.

However when people start thinking that Jews are the only people with a serious history of discrimination, then we do have a problem, and it is not of my making.

Yes your arguments are insane. When you suggest that we should exclude the 'aberration' of the holocaust from considerations of anti-semitism in Europe, you are being insane.

And no one suggested that "Jews are the only people with a serious history of discrimination"-- apart from you.

887 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 19, 2010 4:53:17am

This whole interesting discussion has me thinking about what we're pleased to call "the Enlightenment" and especially about its results. We recommend it to others as a sovereign remedy for their supposed endarkenment, but let's see, shall we, what has been the history of the West since then.

The French Revolution and the Reign of Terror followed by Napoleon and the Restoration

The War of 1812

All the other wars of the nineteenth century

WWI

The Great Depression

WWI

The atom bomb

All the proxy wars between the US and the USSR

The missing peace dividend

George W. Bush

Iraq

Not to mention: ongoing environmental destruction and rape of the future.

Some Enlightenment we got goin' on there, eh? Anyone care to tell me why the rest of the world should rush to imitate us?

888 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 19, 2010 5:06:17am

re: #882 punchy100

Dear Charles and all other Tea Party haters:

As a former frequent reader of LGF (I was with you all the way through the Creationism Flap, the Velaams Belang Split, and the Birther Divide!). I'd like to offer up my own first hand account of the local Tea Party protest on Thurs.

They're just regular people. End of story. If you can't see that, you're fooling yourself.

[Link: roarkwolfe.blogspot.com...]

Seeing that you're a full-on Randian or at least link to them with your little "Exploit the Earth or Die" ad†, I would not expect you to be able to tell a regular person from a Martian. But that's OK, I can't tell Randians from fascists.

†It's a cute logo, and I actually agree with it, except it needs one word changed - "Exploit the Earth and Die" is how it ought to read, and instead of a pretty girl dancing you should have a skeleton doing the macarena - because that is what we have been doing and will continue to do. I don't see any alternative, either, but the perky "we'll be fine" attitude of the Randians is a lie.

889 Obdicut  Mon, Apr 19, 2010 6:29:30am

re: #887 Cato the Elder

Some Enlightenment we got goin' on there, eh? Anyone care to tell me why the rest of the world should rush to imitate us?

Because we no longer kill people over religious issues, and we have pretty good separation of religion and state.

I'm sorry the Enlightenment didn't fix all the problems in the world. That really wasn't the point.

890 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 19, 2010 7:56:19am

re: #889 Obdicut

Because we no longer kill people over religious issues, and we have pretty good separation of religion and state.

I'm sorry the Enlightenment didn't fix all the problems in the world. That really wasn't the point.

Oh no? I kinda thought it was.

891 Obdicut  Mon, Apr 19, 2010 7:57:49am

re: #890 Cato the Elder

Oh no? I kinda thought it was.

Well, you were wrong. It happens.

892 punchy100  Mon, Apr 19, 2010 8:02:34pm

re: #883 iceweasel

Even if it were true that taxes aren't higher RIGHT NOW, how long do you think that can be sustainable after...

1) Bush's TARP
2) Obama's Stimulus
3) Health Care Overhaul (explicit provisions for taxes yet to be collected)
and coming soon...
4) Cap and Trade


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