Thursday Afternoon Music: Elvis Costello, ‘Monkey to Man’

Music • Views: 1,761

Today’s music break celebrates the discovery of Neanderthal genes in human beings with a great live version of Elvis Costello’s lesson in evolution, from the Jools Holland TV show.

Youtube Video

A long time ago our point of view
Was broadcast by Mr. Bartholomew
Now the world is full of sorrow and pain
It’s time for us to speak up again

You’re slack and sorry
Such an arrogant brood
The only purpose you serve is to bring us our food
We sit here staring at your pomp and pout
Outside the bars we use for keeping you out

You’ve taken everything that you wanted
Broke it up and plundered it and hunted
Ever since we said it
You went and took the credit
It’s been headed this way since the world began
When a vicious creature took the jump from Monkey to Man

Every time that man struggles and fails
He makes up some kind of fairytales
After all of the misery that he has caused
He denies he’s descended from the dinosaurs

Points up to heaven with cathedral spires
All the time indulging in his base desires
Ever since we said it
He went and took the credit
It’s been headed this way since the world began
When a vicious creature took the jump from Monkey to Man

Big and useless as he has become
With his crying statues and his flying bomb
Goes ‘round acting like the chosen one
Excuse us if we treat him like our idiot cousin

He hangs up flowers and bells and rhymes
Hoping to hell someone’s forgiven his crimes
Fills the air with his pride and his praise
He’s big disgrace to our beastly ways

In the fashionable nightclubs and finer precincts
Man uses words to dress up his vile instincts
Ever since we said it
He went and took the credit
It’s been headed this way since the world began
When a vicious creature took the jump from Monkey to Man

Jump to bottom

410 comments

1 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:30:15pm

Get down with your inner Neanderthal... Though I have read that the Neanderthals were actually rather peaceful.

2 Kragar  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:33:15pm

re: #1 LudwigVanQuixote

Get down with your inner Neanderthal... Though I have read that the Neanderthals were actually rather peaceful.

And they're probably the source of the gene causing red hair. I read that somewhere.

3 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:34:16pm

Does this mean I could get that job with Geico?

4 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:36:40pm

re: #1 LudwigVanQuixote

Chemistry question if you do not mind-The hydrates that are a threat to the deep drill rig repair-Are they very different from the methane hydrates that come out naturally (especially in recently warmer waters) or is it a different compound?

5 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:38:06pm

Ohhh and one pre-emptive post for those who will take this as some sort of call to arms...

Unfortunately, racial supremicists have twisted the Neanderthal line argument in exactly the same way they twisted Darwinism. In many ways this is worse, because it carries the seeming iron clad authority of genetics with their drivel.

There is absolutely no known or statistically accurate distinction between the intelligence of different ethnic groups.

Well except for Jews and Asians... everyone knows we are smarter...

But seriously. There is no, I repeat, NO evidence that one group is inherently smarter, or more altruistic, or more skilled than another, despite whatever superficial genetic differences the different ethnic groups may have. We are all the same species. Motivated by racism, people have been looking for such evidence for over 150 years. No such evidence has ever existed, but on the contrary, such searches have shown that pretty much all human genetic groups have the same baselines.

Whatever the effects of these Neanderthal markers may, or may not, be it has nothing to do with making anyone better than anyone else.

6 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:39:13pm

That's a much better musical accompaniment than the one that always springs to my mind.

7 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:39:38pm

re: #4 Rightwingconspirator

Chemistry question if you do not mind-The hydrates that are a threat to the deep drill rig repair-Are they very different from the methane hydrates that come out naturally (especially in recently warmer waters) or is it a different compound?

It depends on where you are talking, but for deep ocean, yes it is the smae sorts of compounds. I was not aware though that the repair crews were having issues with methane though.

8 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:41:43pm

We got a rotisserie a while back for the grill, here's what's cooking for the kid's visit tonight.

Image: Whats-cooking.jpg

9 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:42:25pm

re: #8 Thanos

We got a rotisserie a while back for the grill, here's what's cooking for the kid's visit tonight.

Image: Whats-cooking.jpg

CHEEKON YUMMM!

10 _RememberTonyC  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:42:26pm

re: #3 Rightwingconspirator

Does this mean I could get that job with Geico?

you already qualified due to your lizard-ness

11 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:42:54pm

re: #7 LudwigVanQuixote

Well they are talking about ice hydrates forming at those depths in the pipe and clogging the line up from that big "lid" they are installing. Then if that line clogs you risk another blowout or a cessation of pumping. If I read correctly anyway.

12 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:43:56pm

re: #5 LudwigVanQuixote

No such evidence has ever existed, but on the contrary, such searches have shown that pretty much all human genetic groups have the same baselines.

You'll never convince these backwards folks.

13 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:44:29pm

re: #11 Rightwingconspirator

Well they are talking about ice hydrates forming at those depths in the pipe and clogging the line up from that big "lid" they are installing. Then if that line clogs you risk another blowout or a cessation of pumping. If I read correctly anyway.

Is this what you're talking about?

First, crews need to properly position the four-story structure with the help of a remote-controlled robotic submarine. A steel pipe will then be attached to a tanker at the surface and connected to the top of the dome to move the oil.

That process presents several challenges because of the frigid water temperature — about 42 degrees Fahrenheit — and exceptionally high pressure at those depths. Those conditions could cause the pipe to clog with what are known in the drilling industry as "ice plugs." To combat that problem, crews plan to continuously pump warm water and methanol down the pipe to dissolve the clogging.

They are also worried about the volatile cocktail of oil, gas and water when it arrives on the ship above. Engineers believe the liquids can be safely separated without an explosion.

"But of course we haven't done this before, it's very complex and we can't guarantee it," BP spokesman David Nicholas said Thursday.

Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano said at a briefing in Biloxi, Miss., that officials were planning for the worst even though they hoped the device would work.

14 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:45:34pm

re: #11 Rightwingconspirator

Well they are talking about ice hydrates forming at those depths in the pipe and clogging the line up from that big "lid" they are installing. Then if that line clogs you risk another blowout or a cessation of pumping. If I read correctly anyway.

Then yes, that is the same stuff that is bubbling up when the oceans warm.

15 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:46:08pm

re: #5 LudwigVanQuixote

Ohhh and one pre-emptive post for those who will take this as some sort of call to arms...

Unfortunately, racial supremicists have twisted the Neanderthal line argument in exactly the same way they twisted Darwinism. In many ways this is worse, because it carries the seeming iron clad authority of genetics with their drivel.

There is absolutely no known or statistically accurate distinction between the intelligence of different ethnic groups.

Well except for Jews and Asians... everyone knows we are smarter...

But seriously. There is no, I repeat, NO evidence that one group is inherently smarter, or more altruistic, or more skilled than another, despite whatever superficial genetic differences the different ethnic groups may have. We are all the same species. Motivated by racism, people have been looking for such evidence for over 150 years. No such evidence has ever existed, but on the contrary, such searches have shown that pretty much all human genetic groups have the same baselines.

Whatever the effects of these Neanderthal markers may, or may not, be it has nothing to do with making anyone better than anyone else.

Glad you added that, Ludwig. We don't want to give our fan club any new Bronx Cheers to learn.

16 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:47:08pm

re: #11 Rightwingconspirator

Well they are talking about ice hydrates forming at those depths in the pipe and clogging the line up from that big "lid" they are installing. Then if that line clogs you risk another blowout or a cessation of pumping. If I read correctly anyway.

Yes.

17 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:47:32pm

re: #12 wrenchwench

You'll never convince these backwards folks.

SPLC Hatewatch just did an article about how that Peter Brimelow crowd (Sailer is seen most frequently at VDARE) are resurfacing the Reconquista/ Nation of Aztlan kookspiracy.

18 MandyManners  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:48:05pm
The only purpose you serve is to bring us our food

Sounds as if he'd been talking to a cat.

19 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:49:06pm

re: #13 reine.de.tout

Yes. Exactly. Except we also see methane hydrates in locations apart from oil fields. I'm into Google on the chemistry as best I can, but it seems the H in the water provides a bond, and the temperatures do the ice formation.

Part of what I read
[Link: www.netl.doe.gov...]

20 Kragar  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:49:19pm

Eh, going back to bed, started feeling sick last night and its hit me hard, can't even talk.

21 SixDegrees  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:49:47pm

As someone who learned anthropology from one of Millard Wolpoff's students, it's nice to see him at least partially vindicated by this result. His theories of human origins, though sound and well supported, have taken a vicious beating at the hands of the anthropological mainstream over the last few years.

Nasty bunch, anthropologists.

22 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:50:51pm

re: #17 Thanos

SPLC Hatewatch just did an article about how that Peter Brimelow crowd (Sailer is seen most frequently at VDARE) are resurfacing the Reconquista/ Nation of Aztlan kookspiracy.

OH GAWD. I hate that one. Especially when Malkin went all freaky about the Absolut ad.

23 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:51:38pm

re: #19 Rightwingconspirator

Yes. Exactly. Except we also see methane hydrates in locations apart from oil fields. I'm into Google on the chemistry as best I can, but it seems the H in the water provides a bond, and the temperatures do the ice formation.

Part of what I read
[Link: www.netl.doe.gov...]

They called them "ice plugs" in that article, but I'm not sure they were talking about actual ice, I took it to mean very cold (and therefore thick and slow moving) oil. Maybe I'm wrong. I wish the Roi were here so he could tell me what they mean by "ice plugs".

24 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:52:35pm

re: #17 Thanos

SPLC Hatewatch just did an article about how that Peter Brimelow crowd (Sailer is seen most frequently at VDARE) are resurfacing the Reconquista/ Nation of Aztlan kookspiracy.

As Charles called it earlier today, it's xenophobic red meat. Served raw.

25 MandyManners  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:53:40pm

re: #20 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Eh, going back to bed, started feeling sick last night and its hit me hard, can't even talk.

Take care!

26 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:54:46pm

re: #22 SanFranciscoZionist

OH GAWD. I hate that one. Especially when Malkin went all freaky about the Absolut ad.

Well there is a teensy hategroup / website out there... voz de aztlan is very anti-Semitic, but it's like all of three guys or something like that....

27 mr.JA  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:55:24pm

That article is really cool! Should read the original research tomorrow @work, this is a great insight into human evolution. I've read about the difficulty these researchers had to extract the ancient DNA from the samples, and they even posted a very detailed video on how-to online, so everyone can actually SEE how it was done... it is really tedious just to extract them, let alone how to do the bioinformatics.

28 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:55:50pm

re: #23 reine.de.tout

I think it is the clathrate or methane hydrate that forms. A methane/water Slurpee or snowcone if I understand it. All I can say is that ship with the pumps has a dangerous task. Best wishes and safety to that ship and her brave crew. If you ask me it's a frontline of combat for the gulf waters.

29 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:56:31pm

re: #12 wrenchwench

You'll never convince these backwards folks.

It was because of bastards like that that I made the joke about everyone knowing that Jews and Asians are smarter.

The only people who promote these wretched ideas in the present day are white supremacists, and the very public existence of very brilliant Jews and Asians really puts a thorn in their redneck hate fest theories.

Again, there is no evidence anywhere from any legitimate study that shows any baseline difference in intelligence amongst the different groups. Now for certain, whatever intelligence is, (and I said that carefully, because intelligence is very hard to define, let alone quantify) can be deeply effected by environmental and societal factors.

The next Einstein will never be Einstein if his mama drinks all through the pregnancy. The Next Marie Curie will never grow to be a great scientist if she comes from a culture where women are rarely taught to read and frequently die in childbirth. The next Shakespeare will have a hard time becoming the next Shakespeare if he never gets a literary education, goes off to work in a mill or a fast food joint, and everyone around him considers things like literature to be"faggy."

However, all of those kids had the right genes to be great - just not the rest of the circumstances. This is something that applies to all ethnic groups all around the world. Whatever genius is, it needs to be nurtured. Every ethnic group has the same chance to produce a genius genetically. Not every family has the attitude or the resources to see that a genius will flourish once she or he is born.

30 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 2:57:09pm

re: #20 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Eh, going back to bed, started feeling sick last night and its hit me hard, can't even talk.

Feel better man!

31 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:04:41pm

Today’s music break celebrates the discovery of Neanderthal genes in human beings

Is Charles calling Adam a Neanderthal?
/

32 Sheepdogess  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:06:12pm

OT - Navy Seal - Not guilty on all charges.

33 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:06:33pm

re: #27 mr.JA

bioinformatics

Now there's a cool word.

34 darthstar  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:07:19pm

Had to go to DMV to renew my license today (expired in March, thank you officer for pointing that out). Tried to make an appointment - soonest was June 17...so I just walked in (Hear that, Charles? I just walked in!)...took me all of 20 minutes. Now I'm collecting my dogs and heading to the beach (since I took the afternoon off to take care of the DMV).

See you all later...play nice.

35 MandyManners  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:07:24pm

re: #32 Sheepdogess

OT - Navy Seal - Not guilty on all charges.

Yipeee!

36 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:07:58pm

re: #26 Thanos

Well there is a teensy hategroup / website out there... voz de aztlan is very anti-Semitic, but it's like all of three guys or something like that...

Sure, Voz de Aztlan is horrible. And SPLC lists them as a hate group. But pretending that they have any importance, or pose some kind of threat to the U.S. is loopy.

37 Killgore Trout  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:09:49pm

I finally got around to looking into the American flag -t-shirt story.....
Hispanic students march through downtown for respect

Five teens were sitting at a table outside during their brunch break about 10:10 a.m. when Assistant Principal Miguel Rodriguez asked two boys to take off their American flag bandannas. The boys said they complied. In the same conversation, sophomore Dominic Maciel said, Rodriguez told the group to "walk with him to the office."

Dariano called his mother Diana, who spread the word to the other parents, who all arrived soon after to have a conference with Rodriguez and Principal Nick Boden. The group said they were not instigating anything and did what they always do at break - sit and talk and eat.

A parent of two Live Oak students, Teresa Casillas, said the American-flag wearing students were yelling "We live in America!" at the brunch break. She said her children were upset by their behavior at school, calling it disrespectful.

"We're all offended by it," Casillas said. She said parents of all ethnicities she spoke with felt that way. "Morgan Hill is too small of a community to start any racial wars. This is just bringing it out a little bit more."

The boys were told they must turn their T-shirts inside-out or be sent home - and that it would not be considered a suspension - but that Rodriguez did not want any fights to break out among Mexican-American students and those wearing American flags. Dariano said other students were wearing American flags but since they were a group of five "we were the easiest target to cause trouble" according to Rodriguez, he said.

Over at Gilroy High School, Mexican and American patriotic colors commingled peacefully Wednesday, Principal Marco Sanchez said.

"Kids were in good spirits," he said. "I was out on campus most of the day and didn't see anything that was abnormal."

There were other students with American flag attire who had no problem. It was the kids taunting and shouting in the lunch room who had a problem. The other kids with American flag attire were not bothered.

38 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:10:03pm

Well except for Jews and Asians... everyone knows we are smarter...

And yet, plans for a glorious Jewish Asian nation are conspicuously absent in the musings of these dispassionate, scientific-minded folks.

39 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:10:57pm

Also from Hatewatch: Fox Uses Dubious Stats to Demonize Undocumented Immigrants.

I give it forty-eight hours before some sleeper popping up here gives us that stat.

40 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:10:59pm

re: #13 reine.de.tout

reine.de.tout, did you catch the good news about the stock market?

41 garhighway  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:12:35pm

re: #34 darthstar

Had to go to DMV to renew my license today (expired in March, thank you officer for pointing that out). Tried to make an appointment - soonest was June 17...so I just walked in (Hear that, Charles? I just walked in!)...took me all of 20 minutes. Now I'm collecting my dogs and heading to the beach (since I took the afternoon off to take care of the DMV).

See you all later...play nice.

But remember, government is incompetent and inefficient.

42 MandyManners  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:12:36pm

re: #26 Thanos

Well there is a teensy hategroup / website out there... voz de aztlan is very anti-Semitic, but it's like all of three guys or something like that...

For such a teensy group, they have one heckuva' Web site.

43 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:13:45pm

re: #36 SanFranciscoZionist

Sure, Voz de Aztlan is horrible. And SPLC lists them as a hate group. But pretending that they have any importance, or pose some kind of threat to the U.S. is loopy.

Agreed, way back in 2006 I initially swallowed some of that Nativist chum, but backed off when I saw teh crazy

44 tnguitarist  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:14:00pm

re: #5 LudwigVanQuixote

Ohhh and one pre-emptive post for those who will take this as some sort of call to arms...

Unfortunately, racial supremicists have twisted the Neanderthal line argument in exactly the same way they twisted Darwinism. In many ways this is worse, because it carries the seeming iron clad authority of genetics with their drivel.

There is absolutely no known or statistically accurate distinction between the intelligence of different ethnic groups.

Well except for Jews and Asians... everyone knows we are smarter...

But seriously. There is no, I repeat, NO evidence that one group is inherently smarter, or more altruistic, or more skilled than another, despite whatever superficial genetic differences the different ethnic groups may have. We are all the same species. Motivated by racism, people have been looking for such evidence for over 150 years. No such evidence has ever existed, but on the contrary, such searches have shown that pretty much all human genetic groups have the same baselines.

Whatever the effects of these Neanderthal markers may, or may not, be it has nothing to do with making anyone better than anyone else.

What about the race of Nerds?

45 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:14:13pm

re: #42 MandyManners

It's a crap website Mandy, my kids could do better.

46 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:14:47pm

re: #32 Sheepdogess

OT - Navy Seal - Not guilty on all charges.

Huzzah!

47 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:14:57pm

re: #36 SanFranciscoZionist

Sure, Voz de Aztlan is horrible. And SPLC lists them as a hate group. But pretending that they have any importance, or pose some kind of threat to the U.S. is loopy.

Well it allows the haters to push the Nazi meme of "strangers amongst us with divided loyalties. We should do something! They are out to get us!!"

Just today, some quote I saw from wingnuts:

but let me ask this: why aren’t the Mexican kids and their enablers accused of “dual loyalty”?

They don’t have dual loyalty. They are loyal only to Mexico. As for the shirts, after this shit I’m going to get a “Remember the Alamo” T-shirt for next year’s festivities. Fuck ‘em. If they don’t like it they can always go home.

Cinco de Mayo was created to sell Corona to stupid American college students, as far as I can tell.

Cinco de Mayo was created to sell Corona to stupid white American college students, as far as I can tell

Because you know, these people actually believe that Latinos are here to take over! BWaahaahhaaahhhaa!

If only we hadn't heard all this shit before in German.

48 MandyManners  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:16:07pm

re: #45 Thanos

It's a crap website Mandy, my kids could do better.

I wasn't commenting on the structure but the content.

49 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:16:20pm

re: #37 Killgore Trout

I finally got around to looking into the American flag -t-shirt story...
Hispanic students march through downtown for respect

There were other students with American flag attire who had no problem. It was the kids taunting and shouting in the lunch room who had a problem. The other kids with American flag attire were not bothered.

And where did those kids learn to behave like that?

50 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:16:36pm

re: #47 LudwigVanQuixote

Because you know, these people actually believe that Latinos are here to take over! BWaahaahhaaahhhaa!

If only we hadn't heard all this shit before in German.

Straight from Limbaugh's microphone to their mouths. Seriously, that's the line I heard from him when we picked the Cornish game hens up near noon.

51 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:17:52pm

I gotta tell you. My husband and I were watching the news last night, and I saw this story, and the first thing I thought was 'the nuttosphere is going to go ballistic'.

52 Killgore Trout  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:18:05pm

re: #49 LudwigVanQuixote

And where did those kids learn to behave like that?

From what I can tell their parents instigated the whole thing.

53 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:20:11pm

re: #50 Thanos

Straight from Limbaugh's microphone to their mouths. Seriously, that's the line I heard from him when we picked the Cornish game hens up near noon.

Like I said, one look at the early Nazis and you see where Limbaugh got his playbook from.

Sometimes I wonder what it must be like to be someone like the Rodent when he hears this shit... He has to realize that if crap goes down, like the folks around him are agitating for, he will not be singled out a "one of the good ones." The cops will beat his Latino ass down too if he doesn't have a birth certificate on him.

54 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:20:36pm

re: #52 Killgore Trout

From what I can tell their parents instigated the whole thing.

Of course! I was being rhetorical.

55 MandyManners  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:20:53pm
56 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:21:43pm

re: #53 LudwigVanQuixote

Like I said, one look at the early Nazis and you see where Limbaugh got his playbook from.

Sometimes I wonder what it must be like to be someone like the Rodent when he hears this shit... He has to realize that if crap goes down, like the folks around him are agitating for, he will not be singled out a "one of the good ones." The cops will beat his Latino ass down too if he doesn't have a birth certificate on him.

No, I'm quite sure that he believes that his righteousness and his sangre castellano puro will shine through. And if it doesn't, he'll kick the racist cops' asses, because Latin Warriors are just gifted like that.

57 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:22:36pm

re: #53 LudwigVanQuixote

and if you wiki cinco de mayo you find out it started being celebrated in California in the 1860's -- I guess all that fabled "show prep" he does is just that -- a fable.

58 [deleted]  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:22:39pm
59 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:23:22pm

re: #47 LudwigVanQuixote

Cinco de Mayo was created to sell Corona to stupid white American college students, as far as I can tell

The Underpants Gnomes Theory of Hispanic Conquest
by: anonymous wingnut

1. Sell lots of beer.
2. ?????
3. Conquer America!

60 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:24:04pm

re: #48 MandyManners

I wasn't commenting on the structure but the content.

But who cares about content?
/

61 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:25:59pm

re: #39 SanFranciscoZionist

Also from Hatewatch: Fox Uses Dubious Stats to Demonize Undocumented Immigrants.

I give it forty-eight hours before some sleeper popping up here gives us that stat.

Undocumented...how sweet.

62 shiplord kirel  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:26:31pm

Eek!

The son of lawyer John Hemenway, also named John, was found dead of a gunshot wound on April 30th. The elder Hemenway is an attorney who filed a brief on behalf of accused birther/deserter Terry Lakin. He is NOT Lakin's attorney of record however. Best evidence from legitimate sources is that the fatal wound was self-inflicted, and possibly accidental.

The wingnut-o-sphere, however, sees no possibility other than an Obammunist assassination. A google search turned up a veritable cesspool of crazy conspiracy claims, with Paulians and black helicopterists heavily represented.

A few sane posters are trying to stem the tide of lunacy at Free Republic, but they are badly outnumbered and generally ignored or shouted down.

The blogs are jumping the gun on this incident, as there haven’t been any news reports (yet) or any press releases (that I know of).

All we know is there was a shooting, the identity and relationship of the victim, and that local law enforcement considers it at this point to be self-inflicted.

One example that goes beyond that, is the blog at [Link: americangrandjury.org...] which titles the incident as a “murder”.

An editor there (or the listed writer, Bob Campbell of Nogales) might be asked how they came to their conclusion, before any additional and unnecessary grief might come to the Hemenway family.

63 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:26:47pm

re: #56 SanFranciscoZionist

No, I'm quite sure that he believes that his righteousness and his sangre castellano puro will shine through. And if it doesn't, he'll kick the racist cops' asses, because Latin Warriors are just gifted like that.

Insanity. I have absolutely no idea how any Hispanic, Woman, Black, Jew or Gay person could be a member of today's GOP. I really don't get it.

I certainly do not think that Obama is perfect, and I am more than a little pissed at his treatment of Israel in particular, but when the only other choice is openly ant-science, racist, Nazi humping lunatics and morons who want to establish a pseudo-theocracy in America and truth be damned, it really is a no brainer.

64 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:27:16pm

re: #48 MandyManners

If that's the best website they can put together they aren't someone to worry about in the frame of "threat to Amuurrricannnn way of life"

65 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:27:58pm

re: #62 shiplord kirel

The new Vince Foster...
//

66 bosforus  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:28:05pm

re: #37 Killgore Trout

I finally got around to looking into the American flag -t-shirt story...
Hispanic students march through downtown for respect

The group said they were not instigating anything and did what they always do at break - sit and talk and eat.

A parent of two Live Oak students, Teresa Casillas, said the American-flag wearing students were yelling "We live in America!"


There were other students with American flag attire who had no problem. It was the kids taunting and shouting in the lunch room who had a problem. The other kids with American flag attire were not bothered.

Ah, this is turning into a he said she said deal. I'm changing my mind about the whole thing and am more convinced that the kids were doing more than simply wearing clothes. If they're going to mouth off about it then they were justly dealt with.

67 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:29:31pm

re: #62 shiplord kirel

Eek!

The son of lawyer John Hemenway, also named John, was found dead of a gunshot wound on April 30th. The elder Hemenway is an attorney who filed a brief on behalf of accused birther/deserter Terry Lakin. He is NOT Lakin's attorney of record however. Best evidence from legitimate sources is that the fatal wound was self-inflicted, and possibly accidental.

The wingnut-o-sphere, however, sees no possibility other than an Obammunist assassination. A google search turned up a veritable cesspool of crazy conspiracy claims, with Paulians and black helicopterists heavily represented.

A few sane posters are trying to stem the tide of lunacy at Free Republic, but they are badly outnumbered and generally ignored or shouted down.

Wingnuts need a Reichstag fire. They are looking for one.

68 webevintage  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:31:08pm

Thanks Charles, Elvis Costello always makes me smile...

69 shiplord kirel  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:31:24pm

re: #67 LudwigVanQuixote

Wingnuts need a Reichstag fire. They are looking for one.

They seem to having one every day anymore.

70 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:31:30pm

re: #66 bosforus

Ah, this is turning into a he said she said deal. I'm changing my mind about the whole thing and am more convinced that the kids were doing more than simply wearing clothes. If they're going to mouth off about it then they were justly dealt with.

The fact that it blossomed across the entire wingnutosphere and that the parents were being interviewed within hours certainly smells a lot as well . It's didn't go that viral that fast without some big groups pushing in the background.

71 Oh no...Sand People!  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:31:42pm

I need to gather my papers, drivers license and registration, (oh wait, they are already in my vehicle), but I'll even throw in my passport that I used to LEGALLY enter the philippines, as well as my social security card for good measure, and take my documented citizen status to a soccer game to see my just as documented son play.

Yeah, I am that evil.

72 Killgore Trout  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:31:58pm

re: #66 bosforus

Ah, this is turning into a he said she said deal. I'm changing my mind about the whole thing and am more convinced that the kids were doing more than simply wearing clothes. If they're going to mouth off about it then they were justly dealt with.


Agreed. I originally thought it was outrageous too but other kids wore American Flags and not making a scene. It was the kids causing trouble that were told to take them off or go home. That's very different than the version being told on right wing blogs.

73 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:32:02pm

re: #67 LudwigVanQuixote

Wingnuts need a Reichstag fire. They are looking for one.

Busily!

74 researchok  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:32:27pm

re: #62 shiplord kirel

Eek!

The son of lawyer John Hemenway, also named John, was found dead of a gunshot wound on April 30th. The elder Hemenway is an attorney who filed a brief on behalf of accused birther/deserter Terry Lakin. He is NOT Lakin's attorney of record however. Best evidence from legitimate sources is that the fatal wound was self-inflicted, and possibly accidental.

The wingnut-o-sphere, however, sees no possibility other than an Obammunist assassination. A google search turned up a veritable cesspool of crazy conspiracy claims, with Paulians and black helicopterists heavily represented.

A few sane posters are trying to stem the tide of lunacy at Free Republic, but they are badly outnumbered and generally ignored or shouted down.

Look for the resurrection of the Vince Foster affair.

75 researchok  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:33:18pm

Matthew McCabe found Not Guilty.

76 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:37:02pm

re: #67 LudwigVanQuixote

Wingnuts need a Reichstag fire. They are looking for one.

They're putting the cart before the horse. Hitler became Chancellor, then had the Reichstag set ablaze.

77 shiplord kirel  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:38:00pm

re: #37 Killgore Trout

I finally got around to looking into the American flag -t-shirt story...
Hispanic students march through downtown for respect

There were other students with American flag attire who had no problem. It was the kids taunting and shouting in the lunch room who had a problem. The other kids with American flag attire were not bothered.

Ahhh. Why am I not surprised at this development? When I first saw this, I thought immediately about the prevalence of American flags during the May Day demonstrations. That seemed to make it seem it unlikely that anyone would consider the flags offensive in the context of a Cinco de Mayo observance.

78 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:40:07pm

re: #76 Dark_Falcon

They're putting the cart before the horse. Hitler became Chancellor, then had the Reichstag set ablaze.

True that.

79 Jeff In Ohio  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:41:00pm

re: #62 shiplord kirel

Yes, it's true. Having been involved with the Obama campaign early on, I can attest to the existence of an assassination squad. They work as efficiently as the West Wing does in marshaling congress to do it's bidding. That's why you don't see any holds on nominations or filibusters of Obama's agenda. People KNOW (though won't tell!!) they'll be next if they get in the way.

80 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:42:31pm

re: #79 Jeff In Ohio

Yes, it's true. Having been involved with the Obama campaign early on, I can attest to the existence of an assassination squad. They work as efficiently as the West Wing does in marshaling congress to do it's bidding. That's why you don't see any holds on nominations or filibusters of Obama's agenda. People KNOW (though won't tell!!) they'll be next if they get in the way.

Who's his "Machine Gun Jack" McGurn?

/Chicago reference

81 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:42:42pm

I gotta go guys!

Be well!

82 researchok  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:44:56pm

Moron Media Report of the Day:

Shahzad's Motive 'Unclear' to CBS, Cites Money Pressure Since He 'Hasn't Realized Any American Dream'

He didn't get rich immediately so he became a terrorist.

I can see it now- 'Palestinian depressed he didn't live in Omaha- Blows up school bus in Tel Aviv'.

It's America's fault.

83 Jeff In Ohio  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:46:38pm

re: #80 Dark_Falcon

Who's his "Machine Gun Jack" McGurn?

/Chicago reference

I value my life to much to disclose. (actually I was going to put up the Dan Fanelli...Keeping America Safe video and point to the 'menacing looking dark complexioned man with a hair', but it has disappeared!! On noes, Obama has does it again!!11!11)

84 What, me worry?  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:47:12pm

re: #37 Killgore Trout

I finally got around to looking into the American flag -t-shirt story...
Hispanic students march through downtown for respect

There were other students with American flag attire who had no problem. It was the kids taunting and shouting in the lunch room who had a problem. The other kids with American flag attire were not bothered.

Ya know, the whole thing is just sad to me. I don't know how it could have been avoided... maybe the vice principal should have waited to see how it would play out before making a preemptive decision. I said before that I understood the decision (based on what I think I know about it), but all in all it's just awful. A community divided over what? Nothing... they're all Americans, they (we) all have a heritage to celebrate.

85 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:47:44pm

re: #21 SixDegrees

As someone who learned anthropology from one of Millard Wolpoff's students, it's nice to see him at least partially vindicated by this result. His theories of human origins, though sound and well supported, have taken a vicious beating at the hands of the anthropological mainstream over the last few years.

Nasty bunch, anthropologists.

Ahem. BACK WHEN I WAS AN ANTHRO MAJOR, the "killed-off or screwed-in" ideas were rocking back and forth. The radical Screwers insisted most Neantderthals would pass unnoticed in the NFL. The tide turned against the "screwed-in" crowd in the 70s and 80s, until the widespread use of cheap genetic analysis.

Yes, Anthros are nasty, but there is nothing sweeter than a coed gradschool summer Archaeo dig.

86 Killgore Trout  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:49:48pm

re: #77 shiplord kirel

Ahhh. Why am I not surprised at this development? When I first saw this, I thought immediately about the prevalence of American flags during the May Day demonstrations. That seemed to make it seem it unlikely that anyone would consider the flags offensive in the context of a Cinco de Mayo observance.

Good point.

87 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:50:05pm

re: #85 Decatur Deb

Ahem. BACK WHEN I WAS AN ANTHRO MAJOR, the "killed-off or screwed-in" ideas were rocking back and forth. The radical Screwers insisted most Neantderthals would pass unnoticed in the NFL. The tide turned against the "screwed-in" crowd in the 70s and 80s, until the widespread use of cheap genetic analysis.

Yes, Anthros are nasty, but there is nothing sweeter than a coed gradschool summer Archaeo dig.

At an exhibit at the San Francisco Academy of Sciences some years ago, they took one of the life-size Neanderthal models and, rather than putting him in the diorama, put him in street clothes and a baseball cap, and stood him next to the door.

Your eye could easily skip over him, unless you looked hard he just looked like another museum-goer.

88 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:51:02pm

re: #82 researchok

Moron Media Report of the Day:

Shahzad's Motive 'Unclear' to CBS, Cites Money Pressure Since He 'Hasn't Realized Any American Dream'

He didn't get rich immediately so he became a terrorist.

I can see it now- 'Palestinian depressed he didn't live in Omaha- Blows up school bus in Tel Aviv'.

It's America's fault.

CBS still has trouble figuring out who the enemy is.

89 Four More Tears  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:52:13pm

re: #85 Decatur Deb

Ahem. BACK WHEN I WAS AN ANTHRO MAJOR, the "killed-off or screwed-in" ideas were rocking back and forth. The radical Screwers insisted most Neantderthals would pass unnoticed in the NFL. The tide turned against the "screwed-in" crowd in the 70s and 80s, until the widespread use of cheap genetic analysis.

Yes, Anthros are nasty, but there is nothing sweeter than a coed gradschool summer Archaeo dig.

Pfft. Please. Everyone knows the Neanderthals were killed off by the dinosaurs.

Image: Creation_Museum_10.png

90 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:52:47pm

re: #42 MandyManners

For such a teensy group, they have one heckuva' Web site.


Those are HTML tables and cheesy animated GIFs, technology from 1995. Anyone with the least bit of web design experience would look at this site and conclude it's the outermost of fringe kookery, with no resources behind it. One person could build and maintain such a site easily.

91 wii42  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:52:49pm

Nice version of this song on the Hot as a Pistol, Keen as a Blade DVD, with The Imposters, Allen Toussaint, his Crescent City Horns and AB Brown.

92 Killgore Trout  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:52:58pm

re: #84 marjoriemoon

Ya know, the whole thing is just sad to me. I don't know how it could have been avoided... maybe the vice principal should have waited to see how it would play out before making a preemptive decision. I said before that I understood the decision (based on what I think I know about it), but all in all it's just awful. A community divided over what? Nothing... they're all Americans, they (we) all have a heritage to celebrate.

It is sad but most people are adapting to the changing demographics of America just fine. There are a few sad people who aren't adjusting as well. Those parents who instigated this are dooming their children to a future of isolation. Those kids are not going to be well suited for the future of our country.

93 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:55:53pm

re: #72 Killgore Trout

Agreed. I originally thought it was outrageous too but other kids wore American Flags and not making a scene. It was the kids causing trouble that were told to take them off or go home. That's very different than the version being told on right wing blogs.

And different from the initial stories on this.
It's all so confusing.
All I can say is thank goodness for LGF, where so many people are looking at so many different pieces of information to put the WHOLE story together.

94 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:56:11pm

re: #92 Killgore Trout

It is sad but most people are adapting to the changing demographics of America just fine. There are a few sad people who aren't adjusting as well. Those parents who instigated this are dooming their children to a future of isolation. Those kids are not going to be well suited for the future of our country.

Or dooming themselves to never seeing their kid after he grows up, if their kid rebels and realizes his parents are reactionary nitwits.

95 researchok  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:56:40pm

re: #87 SanFranciscoZionist

At an exhibit at the San Francisco Academy of Sciences some years ago, they took one of the life-size Neanderthal models and, rather than putting him in the diorama, put him in street clothes and a baseball cap, and stood him next to the door.

Your eye could easily skip over him, unless you looked hard he just looked like another museum-goer.

I had that blank stare in stats class.

96 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:57:02pm

re: #87 SanFranciscoZionist

At an exhibit at the San Francisco Academy of Sciences some years ago, they took one of the life-size Neanderthal models and, rather than putting him in the diorama, put him in street clothes and a baseball cap, and stood him next to the door.

Your eye could easily skip over him, unless you looked hard he just looked like another museum-goer.

There's some suggestion that the "caveman" image was created because the first few Neanderthal finds were atypical individuals. There aren't all that many, and their average brain case runs a hundred cc's or so larger than ours. You had to be smart to prosper in a dirk-tooth rich environment.

Image: BC_106.jpg

97 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 3:58:09pm

re: #60 Oh no...Sand People!

But who cares about content?
/

One guy who can copypasta links onto a geocities site does not a big scary organization make

98 researchok  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:00:17pm

re: #96 Decatur Deb

There's some suggestion that the "caveman" image was created because the first few Neanderthal finds were atypical individuals. There aren't all that many, and their average brain case runs a hundred cc's or so larger than ours. You had to be smart to prosper in a dirk-tooth rich environment.

Image: BC_106.jpg

So easy, even a caveman can do it.

99 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:00:42pm

re: #89 JasonA

Pfft. Please. Everyone knows the Neanderthals were killed off by the dinosaurs.

Image: Creation_Museum_10.png

That's just depressing.

100 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:00:48pm

re: #85 Decatur Deb

Ahem. BACK WHEN I WAS AN ANTHRO MAJOR, the "killed-off or screwed-in" ideas were rocking back and forth. The radical Screwers insisted most Neantderthals would pass unnoticed in the NFL. The tide turned against the "screwed-in" crowd in the 70s and 80s, until the widespread use of cheap genetic analysis.

Yes, Anthros are nasty, but there is nothing sweeter than a coed gradschool summer Archaeo dig.

Sounds like you took advantage of things to do some screwing of your own.

101 What, me worry?  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:01:08pm

re: #92 Killgore Trout

It is sad but most people are adapting to the changing demographics of America just fine. There are a few sad people who aren't adjusting as well. Those parents who instigated this are dooming their children to a future of isolation. Those kids are not going to be well suited for the future of our country.

Absolutely. Especially when it's usually a fun thing to celebrate someone else's heritage particularly when food and/or booze is involved.

102 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:01:43pm

re: #99 Decatur Deb

That's just depressing.

Quite Concur. How ideas that dumb can get such widespread backing is sad.

103 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:02:00pm

A story at the LA Times about one of the rig widows.

Her husband worked for the same company my husband works for.

104 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:02:47pm

re: #100 Dark_Falcon

Sounds like you took advantage of things to do some screwing of your own.

Sorta--My third kid was already on the way. I basically screwed myself out of Archaeology.

105 researchok  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:03:02pm

re: #103 reine.de.tout

A story at the LA Times about one of the rig widows.

Her husband worked for the same company my husband works for.

Damn.

106 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:04:40pm

re: #103 reine.de.tout

A story at the LA Times about one of the rig widows.

Her husband worked for the same company my husband works for.

Do you have a support structure like Army wives?

107 Jeff In Ohio  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:05:15pm

re: #103 reine.de.tout

A story at the LA Times about one of the rig widows.

Her husband worked for the same company my husband works for.

There was a story n NPR this afternoon about Deep Water Horizon insisting workers who got off the rig sign waivers following the accident.

[Link: www.npr.org...]

108 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:05:24pm

re: #104 Decatur Deb

Sorta--My third kid was already on the way. I basically screwed myself out of Archaeology.

In bed.

/not

109 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:08:02pm

re: #88 Dark_Falcon

CBS still has trouble figuring out who the enemy is.

I understand what they are trying to say kinda, how many stories have you heard where financial pressures, a failing marriage, loss of face at work, etc, has driven someone to "go postal?"

This guy was your typical harmless immigrant who had fitted himself into the American lifestyle, who never showed any signs of being a radical Islamist until the last few months. Apparently he mainly blames the drone attacks on Pakistan for his rage...

We have seen the same thing from hundreds of white collar workers who went off the edge and attacked people. Sometimes people just go friggin nuts, whether they are Christian, Muslim, or a Scientologist.

From the limited information we have so far and the totally inept bomb design I would have to guess that this is more about mental illness than it is about Islam.

Anyway, I think that is what they were saying about how his "Motives were not clear."

110 What, me worry?  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:08:20pm

re: #107 Jeff In Ohio

There was a story n NPR this afternoon about Deep Water Horizon insisting workers who got off the rig sign waivers following the accident.

[Link: www.npr.org...]

On the way to work this morning, radio news was saying they were also trying to force fisherman to sign agreements not to sue. They would be paid $5,000 and that's it.

111 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:08:36pm

re: #107 Jeff In Ohio

Wow. Lawyered right up on those guys. I wonder if anyone refused to sign.

112 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:11:41pm

Russian Commandos rescue crew of hijacked oil tanker

Less than 24 hours after their hijacking off the Horn of Africa, the crew of a Russian tanker seized by Somali pirates were rescued Thursday in an early-morning raid by Russian commandos. The 23 crewmembers were unharmed after they locked themselves in a safe room. One pirate was killed and 10 others captured, said Russian officials.

113 Jeff In Ohio  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:11:54pm

re: #111 Floral Giraffe

Wow. Lawyered right up on those guys. I wonder if anyone refused to sign.

It seems some things one can be prepared for.

114 bratwurst  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:14:09pm

Major announcement: 10 months of unemployment comes to an end Monday. I got hired! Less than 6 miles from me here in NW Chicagoland as well.

115 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:14:15pm

re: #107 Jeff In Ohio

There was a story n NPR this afternoon about Deep Water Horizon insisting workers who got off the rig sign waivers following the accident.

[Link: www.npr.org...]

Not unusual.
People should refuse to sign ANYTHING. If BP used their state of shock to get them to sign waivers - unconscionable. Just despicable. I hope it works against them when the lawsuits begin.

re: #110 marjoriemoon

On the way to work this morning, radio news was saying they were also trying to force fisherman to sign agreements not to sue. They would be paid $5,000 and that's it.

That was covered a day or two ago. I believe BP has been required to strip that out of new agreements, and have been told that that provision won't hold in the ones already signed.

116 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:15:51pm

re: #114 bratwurst

Major announcement: 10 months of unemployment comes to an end Monday. I got hired! Less than 6 miles from me here in NW Chicagoland as well.

Happy Days Are Here Again--I hope.

117 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:16:05pm

re: #114 bratwurst

Major announcement: 10 months of unemployment comes to an end Monday. I got hired! Less than 6 miles from me here in NW Chicagoland as well.

Congratulations!

118 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:16:12pm

re: #106 Decatur Deb

Do you have a support structure like Army wives?

No.
We mostly don't know each other.

I've never met any of my husband's coworkers, they live all over the place. No requirements as to where they can live, as long as they can get to the heliport when it's their turn to go out.

The fellow in this story did live in BR, but my husband was only very slightly acquainted; they never worked a rig together.

119 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:17:10pm

re: #114 bratwurst

Major announcement: 10 months of unemployment comes to an end Monday. I got hired! Less than 6 miles from me here in NW Chicagoland as well.

GREAT NEWS!
Glad to hear it.

120 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:18:07pm

re: #118 reine.de.tout

I guess it's good that, for all the risk, there aren't enough tragedies to drive you together.

121 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:18:23pm

re: #114 bratwurst

Major announcement: 10 months of unemployment comes to an end Monday. I got hired! Less than 6 miles from me here in NW Chicagoland as well.

Hoorah! What will you be doing?

122 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:18:29pm

re: #40 Nimed

reine.de.tout, did you catch the good news about the stock market?

No. Is there good news? Mine recovered by about 5% by the end of the afternoon.

123 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:19:03pm

re: #120 Decatur Deb

I guess it's good that, for all the risk, there aren't enough tragedies to drive you together.

You know, you are correct. This is very rare. The Roi has worked for 30 years, and has never been on a well that blew out.

124 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:19:49pm

re: #112 Thanos

Russian Commandos rescue crew of hijacked oil tanker

Less than 24 hours after their hijacking off the Horn of Africa, the crew of a Russian tanker seized by Somali pirates were rescued Thursday in an early-morning raid by Russian commandos. The 23 crewmembers were unharmed after they locked themselves in a safe room. One pirate was killed and 10 others captured, said Russian officials.

The good thing about the Russians capturing pirates is that they are prepared to deal with them. I hope the pirates get sent to the gulag.

125 bratwurst  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:20:16pm

Many thanks! Made a huge mistake leaving Germany for a job that was a left field opportunity to get out of education...but next week I will be back to what I know best: torturing students!

126 What, me worry?  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:20:34pm

My frangipani is blooming. I'm so happy. My neighbor has a white one with pretty yellow centers. They make Hawaiian leis out of them. And ohhhh the scent. So pretty.

Not mine.

127 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:20:42pm

re: #82 researchok

Moron Media Report of the Day:

Shahzad's Motive 'Unclear' to CBS, Cites Money Pressure Since He 'Hasn't Realized Any American Dream'

He didn't get rich immediately so he became a terrorist.

I can see it now- 'Palestinian depressed he didn't live in Omaha- Blows up school bus in Tel Aviv'.

It's America's fault.

I don't see any problem with that piece. Bob Orr from CBS explicitly alluded to investigators's statements:

Investigators say a quest for revenge seems to have played some role, but personal financial pressures may also have pushed Shahzad to act. He became a U.S. citizen just a year ago, but he has not realized any American dream. He quit his job, lost his house, and was separated from his family.

128 What, me worry?  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:21:26pm

re: #125 bratwurst

Many thanks! Made a huge mistake leaving Germany for a job that was a left field opportunity to get out of education...but next week I will be back to what I know best: torturing students!

Congrats! Always exciting to start a new job!

129 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:23:06pm

re: #96 Decatur Deb

There's some suggestion that the "caveman" image was created because the first few Neanderthal finds were atypical individuals. There aren't all that many, and their average brain case runs a hundred cc's or so larger than ours. You had to be smart to prosper in a dirk-tooth rich environment.

Image: BC_106.jpg

The Neanderthal gentleman at the museum looked Native American to me. Might just be the skin tone they chose to go with, but something about the high forehead and cheekbones had that look to me.

130 albusteve  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:24:45pm

Elvis in the afternoon....perfect

131 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:24:51pm

view of the gulf slick from space, you can see where streamers have reached the barrier islands.

[Link: blogs.discovermagazine.com...]

132 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:25:06pm

re: #122 reine.de.tout

No. Is there good news? Mine recovered by about 5% by the end of the afternoon.

Yes, the crash may have been at least partly due to a screw-up.

There were reports that the sudden drop was caused by a trader who mistyped an order to sell a large block of stock. The drop in that stock's price was enough to trigger "sell" orders across the market.

To the extend that this caused the crash, your stock will probably recover in the next few days.

133 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:26:38pm

re: #131 Thanos

view of the gulf slick from space, you can see where streamers have reached the barrier islands.

[Link: blogs.discovermagazine.com...]

ack, I read that it reached barrier islands in a story earlier and assumed the dark spots in this were parts of the slick, they were not. This photo was from teh 4th...

134 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:26:39pm

re: #129 SanFranciscoZionist

Got a glitch--your comment came up in spy, but only the quote made it to the thread. Anyone else get that on #129?

135 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:26:52pm

re: #109 ausador


From the limited information we have so far and the totally inept bomb design I would have to guess that this is more about mental illness than it is about Islam.

Anyway, I think that is what they were saying about how his "Motives were not clear."

I think what we may be seeing is what happens when a young man who's deeply screwed up goes off the edge--and happens to have cultural and regional ties to places where radical Islam thrives. "I can car-bomb Times Square and then flee to Pakistan, where I will be a hero, and not have to be a not-too-successful financial consultant with a wife and two kids in Connectricut."

136 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:28:10pm

re: #114 bratwurst

Congratulations!

137 albusteve  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:28:32pm

re: #133 Thanos

ack, I read that it reached barrier islands in a story earlier and assumed the dark spots in this were parts of the slick, they were not. This photo was from teh 4th...

nontheless, it has the makings for an epic disaster...and then there is the Niger River estuary

138 bratwurst  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:28:50pm

re: #128 marjoriemoon

Congrats! Always exciting to start a new job!

Only downside is that I am taking over (at a private language school) for a real Wonder Woman of a teacher. We have all seen the type: insanely energetic and CRAZY organized, bordering on anal retentive. Let's just say I am...uh..a bit different, hopefully the change of pace will be appreciated.

139 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:29:26pm

If the people at the school don't call me soon about the job, I will lose my ever-loving mind.

CALL! BAD NEWS OR GOOD, JUST CALL!!

140 albusteve  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:30:26pm

re: #138 bratwurst

Only downside is that I am taking over (at a private language school) for a real Wonder Woman of a teacher. We have all seen the type: insanely energetic and CRAZY organized, bordering on anal retentive. Let's just say I am...uh..a bit different, hopefully the change of pace will be appreciated.

the pigs are loose!
congratulations

141 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:30:59pm

re: #127 Nimed

Right, and no one born here and also anglo-saxon in racial heritage has ever done anything like that, never!

It is all because he is a Muslim and has nothing whatsoever to do with any of those over things that might have helped to drive him over the edge that they mentioned as possible factors.

Black or White: There is no such thing as gray!11!!!

///

142 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:31:05pm

re: #139 SanFranciscoZionist

{{{SFZ}}}
No news, is good news, my Mom always said...

143 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:32:27pm

re: #141 ausador

Right, and no one born here and also anglo-saxon in racial heritage has ever done anything like that, never!

It is all because he is a Muslim and has nothing whatsoever to do with any of those over things that might have helped to drive him over the edge that they mentioned as possible factors.

Black or White: There is no such thing as gray!11!!!

///

it's all that pesky reporting. WE WANT A VALUE JUDGEMENT STOP TELLING US THESE FACTS

144 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:32:58pm

re: #135 SanFranciscoZionist

Guy used to work for Elizabeth Arden!

145 shiplord kirel  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:33:03pm

Gwinnett (GA) officer indicted for Taser prank

A former Gwinnett County police officer was indicted Wednesday for allegedly stunning a Waffle House employee with a Taser as a prank.
A grand jury indicted Cpl. Gary Miles on charges of aggravated assault and violation of oath of office. He resigned from the department last June. Miles is out of jail awaiting trial on $8,100 bond.

The waiter, Daniel Wilson, 23, told investigators that Miles was a frequent patron of the restaurant at 2725 Grayson Highway in Loganville. Wilson said he was chatting with two other Gwinnett County officers on Feb. 16, 2009, when Miles came up from behind and zapped him with the Taser. He said Miles and the other officers laughed as his knees buckled and he fell to the ground.

Miles told investigators that he only "spark tested" the Taser near the employee's back "just to scare him a little bit, " according to an internal investigation file. A lawsuit that Wilson filed against Gwinnett County and the three officers is still pending in State Court.

Imagine the fun this clod could have had with a Tucker telephone.

146 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:34:28pm

re: #134 Decatur Deb

Got a glitch--your comment came up in spy, but only the quote made it to the thread. Anyone else get that on #129?

Yep, got that here. Happened twice this morning too.

147 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:36:27pm

re: #140 albusteve

Steve, did you see that Rolling Stones article I posted for you a few days ago?

148 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:36:47pm

re: #145 shiplord kirel

Gwinnett (GA) officer indicted for Taser prank

Imagine the fun this clod could have had with a Tucker telephone.

Like working at a Waffle House isn't bad enough before you get tasered....

149 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:40:25pm

re: #134 Decatur Deb

Got a glitch--your comment came up in spy, but only the quote made it to the thread. Anyone else get that on #129?

I clicked on the comment in Spy, it came out complete in its own window. From there I clicked on the thread title, and got the whole thread with the comment complete. Then I tried refreshing the original thread, and it came out with the comment complete.

Maybe you and I each have a tired hamster.

150 Vicious Babushka  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:40:50pm

Remember that pie I baked this afternoon?

Well now it looks like this.

I had to eat a piece for every one of you.

151 albusteve  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:42:00pm

re: #147 Dark_Falcon

Steve, did you see that Rolling Stones article I posted for you a few days ago?

I did, thanks for that....juicy

152 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:42:09pm

re: #149 wrenchwench

Thanks--I loaded a new Ubuntu a few hours ago, thought I'd muffed it.

153 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:43:03pm

re: #132 Nimed

Yes, the crash may have been at least partly due to a screw-up.

There were reports that the sudden drop was caused by a trader who mistyped an order to sell a large block of stock. The drop in that stock's price was enough to trigger "sell" orders across the market.

To the extend that this caused the crash, your stock will probably recover in the next few days.

That is indeed good news!
I'm breathing a sigh of relief . . ..

154 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:43:05pm

re: #151 albusteve

I did, thanks for that...juicy

Glad you enjoyed it. Glad also the visit is going well for you.

155 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:43:57pm

re: #152 Decatur Deb

Thanks--I loaded a new Ubuntu a few hours ago, thought I'd muffed it.

Sounds painful.

156 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:45:35pm

re: #132 Nimed

Yes, the crash may have been at least partly due to a screw-up.

There were reports that the sudden drop was caused by a trader who mistyped an order to sell a large block of stock. The drop in that stock's price was enough to trigger "sell" orders across the market.

To the extend that this caused the crash, your stock will probably recover in the next few days.

That could be a new entry for the "Disastrous Typo" list:

[Link: www.cracked.com...]

157 lostlakehiker  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:47:31pm

re: #5 LudwigVanQuixote

Ohhh and one pre-emptive post for those who will take this as some sort of call to arms...

Unfortunately, racial supremicists have twisted the Neanderthal line argument in exactly the same way they twisted Darwinism. In many ways this is worse, because it carries the seeming iron clad authority of genetics with their drivel.

There is absolutely no known or statistically accurate distinction between the intelligence of different ethnic groups.

Well except for Jews and Asians... everyone knows we are smarter...

But seriously. There is no, I repeat, NO evidence that one group is inherently smarter, or more altruistic, or more skilled than another, despite whatever superficial genetic differences the different ethnic groups may have. We are all the same species. Motivated by racism, people have been looking for such evidence for over 150 years. No such evidence has ever existed, but on the contrary, such searches have shown that pretty much all human genetic groups have the same baselines.

Whatever the effects of these Neanderthal markers may, or may not, be it has nothing to do with making anyone better than anyone else.

Well, actually, there is some evidence that Ashkenazi jews are smarter on average, and that biology plays a part in that gap. Natural history of Ashkenazi intelligence
Granted, culture plays a role. The Russians are not genetically destined to be chess champions. And if they drink enough, they won't even be contenders. But it's just scientifically wrong to assert that there is no evidence.

158 Vicious Babushka  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:47:51pm

re: #156 Decatur Deb

That could be a new entry for the "Disastrous Typo" list:

[Link: www.cracked.com...]

5 Famous Musicians who are Thieving Bastards

I'm surprised George Harrison is not on the list.

159 lostlakehiker  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:50:04pm

re: #127 Nimed

I don't see any problem with that piece. Bob Orr from CBS explicitly alluded to investigators's statements:

Investigators say a quest for revenge seems to have played some role, but personal financial pressures may also have pushed Shahzad to act. He became a U.S. citizen just a year ago, but he has not realized any American dream. He quit his job, lost his house, and was separated from his family.

He lost his house because he borrowed against it to finance jihad. He quit is job so as to have time for jihad. He left his family...

The cause of all his misfortunes is his embrace of an extremist doctrine, and not vice-versa.

160 albusteve  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:50:05pm

re: #154 Dark_Falcon

Glad you enjoyed it. Glad also the visit is going well for you.

thanks...lots of noise and activity, rushing around, get togethers etc...cool party and late night fire pit yak fest...a very nice buzz, all in all

162 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:50:52pm
163 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:51:46pm

Palin breaks with CA Tea Party to endorse Fiorina (of those Demon Sheep ads...) and takes the opportunity to brand the Moderate Republican as a liberal... (go figure0

[Link: blogs.abcnews.com...]

164 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:52:03pm

re: #153 reine.de.tout

That is indeed good news!
I'm breathing a sigh of relief . . ..

Yes he typed a sell order with a "B" instead of an "M", as in Billion instead of Million. Of course all the computer trading programs freaked out and instantly started selling once they saw a major "downshift" in the market.

Sad that a tiny human error like that can still cause a few billions in stock valuation loss before the humans can catch up with it. You would think we had found a better way of controlling the trading programs after the last couple of times something like this happened. :(

165 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:53:02pm
166 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:54:22pm

re: #165 reine.de.tout

Oil laps barrier islands; BP grilled about oil spill at Capitol

That's it. I'll quit now.

Don't--If there's a boll weevil outbreak, it will fall to me.

167 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:54:34pm

Boy, I'm REALLY glad I missed the flag comment thread.

168 Charles Johnson  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:55:01pm

Linkage is now turning into the LGF Diaries.

169 Reginald Perrin  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:56:05pm

re: #161 reine.de.tout

Recent Sea Turtle strandings not related to the oil spill

One hypothesis for the turtle deaths is that shrimp fisherman in their haste to harvest as much product as possible before the fisheries closed, were not using the mandated turtle catchers.

170 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:56:49pm

re: #166 Decatur Deb

Don't--If there's a boll weevil outbreak, it will fall to me.

heehee.
La. engaged in a Boll Weevil Eradication Program a few years back.
We don't have any, anymore.

I'm a bit upset at the CNN reporter in the video, though. He says La.s barrier islands have been decreasing in size because of hurricanes. That's only a small part of it. Some of it has to do with Corps of Engineers tinkering, and also the pollution coming down to NOLA and the mouth of the Mississippi River from all along its length.

171 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:56:56pm

re: #167 TheMatrix31

Boy, I'm REALLY glad I missed the flag comment thread.

I'll bet you are, you probably would have said something that you didn't even regret later...

172 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:57:12pm

re: #159 lostlakehiker

He lost his house because he borrowed against it to finance jihad. He quit is job so as to have time for jihad. He left his family...

The cause of all his misfortunes is his embrace of an extremist doctrine, and not vice-versa.

I didn't know about this. Do you have a source for it?

Just to be clear, personal and financial hardship obviously don't excuse his actions.

173 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:58:21pm

re: #169 Reginald Perrin

One hypothesis for the turtle deaths is that shrimp fisherman in their haste to harvest as much product as possible before the fisheries closed, were not using the mandated turtle catchers.

Could very well be.
The shrimpers are in a bad way; I would not be surprised if they are doing whatever they can to maximize their catch.

174 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 4:58:36pm

re: #171 ausador

I don't give a damn about my comments or views....but I care about my blood pressure.

175 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:00:24pm

re: #164 ausador

Yes he typed a sell order with a "B" instead of an "M", as in Billion instead of Million. Of course all the computer trading programs freaked out and instantly started selling once they saw a major "downshift" in the market.

Sad that a tiny human error like that can still cause a few billions in stock valuation loss before the humans can catch up with it. You would think we had found a better way of controlling the trading programs after the last couple of times something like this happened. :(

You'd think people would be very careful with this stuff, seeing as how regular folks like me stand to be so badly affected.

176 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:00:59pm

re: #157 lostlakehiker

Well, actually, there is some evidence that Ashkenazi jews are smarter on average, and that biology plays a part in that gap. Natural history of Ashkenazi intelligence
Granted, culture plays a role. The Russians are not genetically destined to be chess champions. And if they drink enough, they won't even be contenders. But it's just scientifically wrong to assert that there is no evidence.

The matter is still unclear, but there may be something to it. There's an interesting talk by Steven Pinker on the issue:

177 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:01:19pm

re: #170 reine.de.tout

heehee.
...snip Some of it has to do with Corps of Engineers tinkering, and also the pollution coming down to NOLA and the mouth of the Mississippi River from all along its length.

Have you visited the Corps of Engineers model of the Mississippi at Vicksburg?
It should be interesting--they're modeling the changes they're planning for NOLA protection.

178 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:02:05pm

re: #177 Decatur Deb

Link here:

[Link: chl.erdc.usace.army.mil...]

179 Shiplord Kirel  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:02:10pm

re: #156 Decatur Deb

That could be a new entry for the "Disastrous Typo" list:

[Link: www.cracked.com...]

Looks like a pandemic.
Birmingham City Council spells name of own city wrongly

The forms gave a return address for inquiries as 'Great Charles Street, Birmingam.'

The error came a week after the council sent out 60,000 postal ballot cards with a return deadline of May 29 2009 - last year's European Election date.

A second set of polling cards later arrived on doormats with the correct deadline for this year's local election of April 29, 2010 - but missing the 'h' in Birmingham.

A list of instructions also stated: "Make it is not left where someone else can pick it up" - leaving out the word "sure".

The grammatical gaffes were condemned by campaigners for better use of language.

Marie Clair, of the Plain English Campaign, said: "It is disappointing - we have done a lot of work with Birmingham City Council over the years so this is very naughty of them.

180 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:03:15pm

Dinner time!

181 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:03:29pm

re: #174 TheMatrix31

I don't give a damn about my comments or views...but I care about my blood pressure.

Well the reception was definitely mixed on that thread, banning the flag to accommodate a Mexican holiday was not going to sell everyone here no matter how convincingly it was presented.

182 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:03:34pm

re: #163 Thanos

Palin breaks with CA Tea Party to endorse Fiorina (of those Demon Sheep ads...) and takes the opportunity to brand the Moderate Republican as a liberal... (go figure0

[Link: blogs.abcnews.com...]

I actually agreed with Palin on this one. Fiorina is the best of the three candidates. Campbell isn't a bad man, but he's in favor of raising taxes, and that's normally a deal-breaker with me. I don't like Sarah Palin, but she made the right call.

183 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:04:06pm

re: #177 Decatur Deb

Have you visited the Corps of Engineers model of the Mississippi at Vicksburg?
It should be interesting--they're modeling the changes they're planning for NOLA protection.

No, I've never seen that!

At one of the museums here, they used to have a several-layered and colored plexiglass model of the Mississippi, showing all of the course changes it has made over time. THAT was really interesting, I looked at it every time I went to that museum. But it's gone now, and I don't know what happened to it.

184 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:06:11pm

re: #181 ausador


I'm wearing my American flag shirt out---wherever I go---tomorrow night.

185 reine.de.tout  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:06:16pm

re: #181 ausador

Well the reception was definitely mixed on that thread, banning the flag to accommodate a Mexican holiday was not going to sell everyone here no matter how convincingly it was presented.

The thing is - as it turns out, as the story has played out, it seems to be (as I read it, anyhow) that a few students may have been trying to provoke an incident of some sort, and the principal or vice-principal did what he needed to do to keep order.

186 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:09:06pm

re: #185 reine.de.tout

The thing is - as it turns out, as the story has played out, it seems to be (as I read it, anyhow) that a few students may have been trying to provoke an incident of some sort, and the principal or vice-principal did what he needed to do to keep order.

Could you go 'splain that to the nitwits still posting on that thread? All I have left is downdings.

187 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:12:21pm

re: #183 reine.de.tout

No, I've never seen that!

At one of the museums here, they used to have a several-layered and colored plexiglass model of the Mississippi, showing all of the course changes it has made over time. THAT was really interesting, I looked at it every time I went to that museum. But it's gone now, and I don't know what happened to it.

The Corps Waterways Experiment Station has a working (wet) model of the whole river that covers a football field or two. It used to be easy for tours, now better check with their Public Affairs office at that url.

188 Renaissance_Man  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:17:42pm

re: #186 wrenchwench

Could you go 'splain that to the nitwits still posting on that thread? All I have left is downdings.

You can't explain things to people like that. The only people who get worked up about non-stories like this one are those who want to get upset about something.

189 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:19:01pm

re: #162 reine.de.tout

Current spill operations

Thank you for keeping us posted, much appreciated.

190 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:22:12pm

Just riffing on FreeToken's post in the LGF Diaries about our Sarah blaming the foreign companies for the oil spill.

It is actually a Houston Texas company, Cameron, who made the Blow Out Preventer which didn't live up to its purpose. Haliburton, headquartered in Houston and Dubai, had just finished their work and may be implicated.

The rig was owned and leased by Transocean, who merged with GlobalSantaFe and is a spin off of Sonat from Alabama. The Transocean headquarters has its principal office in Houston as well, but was incorporated in the Cayman Islands, which has been subsequently moved to Switzerland. GlobalSantaFe was located in Houston.

I blame the bloody Swiss.

191 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:22:28pm

re: #186 wrenchwench

Sigh...because wearing the American flag is quite obviously racist and offensive to someone? If it is then they need to go someplace where they won't have to see it so often I guess.

WTF? when do we get to call something too PC? Wouldn't the people reacting badly to this "provocation" also bear some responsibility, or is it just the evil "flag wearers" fault?

"I was offended by what he did so I busted him up" is not an excuse under the law, lots of people seem to think it is but you have no right to not be offended by others actions. Sorry but it is a free country, so far anyway...

192 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:22:33pm

re: #188 Renaissance_Man

You can't explain things to people like that. The only people who get worked up about non-stories like this one are those who want to get upset about something.

Exactly. It fit into their preconceived notions just perfectly.

193 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:23:43pm

re: #191 ausador

You want a downding too?

194 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:23:57pm

re: #190 Bagua

Bagua - I think another funny aspect to Sarah blaming foreign co's (i.e. BP) is that her dang husband worked for them for 20 years!!

195 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:24:39pm

re: #193 wrenchwench

You want a downding too?

Owww...Immma scared now. :p

196 Decatur Deb  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:25:03pm

Dog time--BBL.

197 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:28:46pm

re: #194 Stanley Sea

Bagua - I think another funny aspect to Sarah blaming foreign co's (i.e. BP) is that her dang husband worked for them for 20 years!!

Amoco was bought out by BP. Prior to that buyout, my father worked for Amoco for more than 30 years.

198 wrenchwench  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:29:09pm

OK, now I'm out of dings too.

Later, lizards.

199 Interesting Times  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:29:47pm

re: #164 ausador

Sad that a tiny human error like that can still cause a few billions in stock valuation loss before the humans can catch up with it. You would think we had found a better way of controlling the trading programs after the last couple of times something like this happened. :(

True. All I managed to find was this copy of the trader's follow-up message:

PIMF: billions millions

200 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:29:49pm

Arent we getting a little too sensitive? I mean, if somebody asks me which way's Israel, you don't see ME flying off the handle!

/Seinfeld

201 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:31:07pm

re: #191 ausador

Would you like some cheese with your whine?

Why is disciplining asshats PC? IF you read about the incident, you'd know that kids who were wearing similar clothing but acting like civilized people didn't get told to change.

William

202 Kragar  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:31:33pm

Man, my "little nap" turned into 3 hours. Being sick sucks

203 Bubblehead II  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:31:36pm

Dinner at the BubbleHead II residence tonight.

Bubblehead II Spaghetti. So easy even a Neanderthal can make it.

1 13.25 oz box of Spaghetti.
1 Bottle Classico Mushroom & Ripe Olive Pasta Sauce (tm).
1 2.24 oz can sliced Black Olives.
1 7 oz can Mushrooms. Sliced or bits and pieces.
1 lb sweet Italian Sausage.

Cook Spaghetti per package directions.

Brown sausage. Rinse with hot water to remove excess fat.

Add Pasta Sauce, Mushrooms and Olives. Simmer over low heat for 10-15 minutes.

Drain Spaghetti. Rinse under warm water.

Add meat mixture to Spaghetti, mix well.

Serve with Texas Toast or Garlic Bread.

Like I said, so simple even a Neanderthal can make it.

My 1st submittal for Vol. 3 of the LGF cookbook ;-)

204 Jeff In Ohio  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:32:06pm

re: #190 Bagua

I'm sorry, but I've already shown proven posited speculated it was Dick Cheney's fault.

205 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:32:52pm

re: #204 Jeff In Ohio

I'm sorry, but I've already shown proven posited speculated it was Dick Cheney's fault.

You have an unassailable position.

206 Kragar  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:34:50pm

I miss anything good today?

207 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:35:01pm

May Day: All Students are to wear a Red T-shirt. Failure to do so will result in a one day suspension.

St. Patricks Day: All Students will wear a green T-shirt. Failure to do so will result in a one day suspension, wearing Orange will result in a ten day suspension.

Cinco de Mayo: All students will wear T-shirts of Red, Green, or White, the colors of the Mexican flag. Wearing other colors will result in a one day suspension, wearing another countries flag, even your own will also result in a one day suspension.

July 4th: Students will wear a gray T-shirt only, no flags or other "classically American" adornments to your attire may be worn as this might offend those of other cultural heritages...

/Coming to a highschool near you... :p

208 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:35:25pm

re: #184 TheMatrix31

I'm wearing my American flag shirt out---wherever I go---tomorrow night.

Well, just as long as you don't get up in a bunch of mexican-american students' faces yelling at them, like those kids in the news did, more power to you

209 Charles Johnson  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:35:35pm

re: #191 ausador

Sigh...because wearing the American flag is quite obviously racist and offensive to someone? If it is then they need to go someplace where they won't have to see it so often I guess.

WTF? when do we get to call something too PC? Wouldn't the people reacting badly to this "provocation" also bear some responsibility, or is it just the evil "flag wearers" fault?

"I was offended by what he did so I busted him up" is not an excuse under the law, lots of people seem to think it is but you have no right to not be offended by others actions. Sorry but it is a free country, so far anyway...

If you're the principal of a school, it's your responsibility to try to make sure that it doesn't get to that point.

I don't know why I'm wasting my time trying to explain this any more.

210 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:36:57pm

re: #200 TheMatrix31

Arent we getting a little too sensitive? I mean, if somebody asks me which way's Israel, you don't see ME flying off the handle!

/Seinfeld

Serenity Now!

211 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:37:20pm

re: #157 lostlakehiker

Well, actually, there is some evidence that Ashkenazi jews are smarter on average, and that biology plays a part in that gap. Natural history of Ashkenazi intelligence
Granted, culture plays a role. The Russians are not genetically destined to be chess champions. And if they drink enough, they won't even be contenders. But it's just scientifically wrong to assert that there is no evidence.

Let's just say that I am a little dubious that it's nature and not nurture, and that I do not like wandering down these sorts of paths, even if it might seem to be to the credit of my own little ethnic group.

212 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:37:55pm

re: #159 lostlakehiker

He lost his house because he borrowed against it to finance jihad. He quit is job so as to have time for jihad. He left his family...

The cause of all his misfortunes is his embrace of an extremist doctrine, and not vice-versa.

Evidence of this? I haven't kept up with all the news.

213 Charles Johnson  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:38:01pm

Wow. We got quite a few flag wavers suddenly waking up from slumber in that thread, didn't we?

214 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:38:05pm

re: #207 ausador

And we have a winner of the nativism/patriot theme.

215 Killgore Trout  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:38:10pm

re: #207 ausador

Seem my link at #37. Other students were wearing American flags too and the school didn't bother them. The students that were sent home were yelling and taunting other students at lunch. That's why they were sent home. They were being disruptive.

216 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:38:35pm

re: #163 Thanos

Palin breaks with CA Tea Party to endorse Fiorina (of those Demon Sheep ads...) and takes the opportunity to brand the Moderate Republican as a liberal... (go figure0

[Link: blogs.abcnews.com...]

How could Palin resist the woman whose campaign coined the term FCINO?

(That's pronounced fa-see-no, BTW)

217 Charles Johnson  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:38:53pm

re: #215 Killgore Trout

Seem my link at #37. Other students were wearing American flags too and the school didn't bother them. The students that were sent home were yelling and taunting other students at lunch. That's why they were sent home. They were being disruptive.

They just don't want to see it.

218 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:39:02pm

re: #207 ausador

Here's what I usually wear:

May day: death metal t-shirt
St. patrick's day: promotional tshirt from computer game developer
Cinco de mayo: industrial experimental band t-shirt
July fourth- death metal t-shirt

I prefer images of the flag done the Jasper Johns way

219 Gus  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:39:13pm

re: #215 Killgore Trout

Seem my link at #37. Other students were wearing American flags too and the school didn't bother them. The students that were sent home were yelling and taunting other students at lunch. That's why they were sent home. They were being disruptive.

Aha! I knew there was more to this story.

220 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:39:18pm

re: #213 Charles

Wow. We got quite a few flag wavers suddenly waking up from slumber in that thread, didn't we?

I gotta go see, haha

221 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:39:25pm

re: #172 Nimed

I didn't know about this. Do you have a source for it?

Just to be clear, personal and financial hardship obviously don't excuse his actions.

But motivations are important. They help us build the profile of these guys.

222 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:40:01pm

For the techno law geeks I posted a Berkman center lecture up top in spinoffs from Beth Noveck, who is Obama's CTO for Open Government.

223 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:40:11pm

re: #209 Charles

If you're the principal of a school, it's your responsibility to try to make sure that it doesn't get to that point.

I don't know why I'm wasting my time trying to explain this any more.

If some other students have a problem with American flag gear, then they should be the ones sent home. I maintain the vice-principal acted in error.

224 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:40:25pm

re: #184 TheMatrix31

I'm wearing my American flag shirt out---wherever I go---tomorrow night.

I don't think anyone will notice, or care, unless it is a particularly nice shirt.

225 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:40:47pm

re: #186 wrenchwench

Could you go 'splain that to the nitwits still posting on that thread? All I have left is downdings.

No use. Some people just keep resetting on something like this.

226 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:41:11pm

Why were the kids wearing bandanas told to remove them?

227 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:41:53pm

re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist

It's pretty nice. Lucky makes some good stuff.

228 Bubblehead II  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:42:07pm

re: #226 TheMatrix31

Against the dress code.

229 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:42:08pm

And now O'Reilly has Sarah Palin on. Hopefully she produces some nugget of stupidity we can all laugh at.

230 Cato the Elder  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:42:11pm

The creature did not become truly vicious until after the jump.

231 Jeff In Ohio  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:42:13pm

re: #226 TheMatrix31

Why were the kids wearing bandanas told to remove them?

Against the dress code was my understanding.

232 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:42:50pm

re: #191 ausador

Sigh...because wearing the American flag is quite obviously racist and offensive to someone? If it is then they need to go someplace where they won't have to see it so often I guess.

WTF? when do we get to call something too PC? Wouldn't the people reacting badly to this "provocation" also bear some responsibility, or is it just the evil "flag wearers" fault?

"I was offended by what he did so I busted him up" is not an excuse under the law, lots of people seem to think it is but you have no right to not be offended by others actions. Sorry but it is a free country, so far anyway...

1. The kids were deliberately trying to get a reaction.
2. To the best of my knowledge, no student who was offended did anything except say "I don't like your behavior". No one was 'busted up'.
3. I think the vp made a miscall, not out of POLITICAL CORRECTNESS, but out of an attempt to keep order in the school.
4. The district told him off.
5. The parents made it onto the Laura Ingraham show in less than 24 hours.

I'm sorry, this is bullshit.

233 Charles Johnson  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:43:03pm

re: #223 Dark_Falcon

If some other students have a problem with American flag gear, then they should be the ones sent home. I maintain the vice-principal acted in error.

The school is 40% Hispanic! You think they should have sent 40% of the students home because this small group of yahoos was acting up?

234 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:43:09pm

re: #231 Jeff In Ohio


Ah, okay.

235 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:43:17pm

re: #226 TheMatrix31

Why were the kids wearing bandanas told to remove them?

The school has an existing rule against bandanas.

236 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:43:23pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

See if she says anything about the Fiorina endorsement. Darndest thing, that.

237 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:43:28pm

OT:

For those following the UK elections.

Intrade had a Tory majority at 35% a few hours ago, they now have the opposite with 64% for a Tory majority.

Could still end in a hung parliament, likely the best result in my opinion.

238 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:44:06pm

re: #202 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Man, my "little nap" turned into 3 hours. Being sick sucks

Sleep is healing. Your body is working, and needs to shut down unnecessary systems.

239 Charles Johnson  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:44:19pm

re: #232 SanFranciscoZionist

1. The kids were deliberately trying to get a reaction.
2. To the best of my knowledge, no student who was offended did anything except say "I don't like your behavior". No one was 'busted up'.
3. I think the vp made a miscall, not out of POLITICAL CORRECTNESS, but out of an attempt to keep order in the school.
4. The district told him off.
5. The parents made it onto the Laura Ingraham show in less than 24 hours.

I'm sorry, this is bullshit.

It's absolutely pure unmitigated bullshit.

240 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:44:44pm

It is the offended's responsibility to act with restraint.

A few taunting words is not provocation, unless you're Zinadine Zidane---then you just go headbutt the opposing player.

241 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:44:59pm

re: #207 ausador

May Day: All Students are to wear a Red T-shirt. Failure to do so will result in a one day suspension.

St. Patricks Day: All Students will wear a green T-shirt. Failure to do so will result in a one day suspension, wearing Orange will result in a ten day suspension.

Cinco de Mayo: All students will wear T-shirts of Red, Green, or White, the colors of the Mexican flag. Wearing other colors will result in a one day suspension, wearing another countries flag, even your own will also result in a one day suspension.

July 4th: Students will wear a gray T-shirt only, no flags or other "classically American" adornments to your attire may be worn as this might offend those of other cultural heritages...

/Coming to a highschool near you... :p

You've really decided what happened here, haven't you?

242 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:45:54pm

re: #233 Charles

The school is 40% Hispanic! You think they should have sent 40% of the students home because this small group of yahoos was acting up?

No. A better approach would have been to tell the yahoos to cool it. Telling them to turn American flag shirt inside out seems over the top and disrespectful to the flag to me.

243 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:46:00pm

re: #218 WindUpBird

Here's what I usually wear:

May day: death metal t-shirt
St. patrick's day: promotional tshirt from computer game developer
Cinco de mayo: industrial experimental band t-shirt
July fourth- death metal t-shirt

I prefer images of the flag done the Jasper Johns way

Nice!

244 Bubblehead II  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:46:22pm

re: #239 Charles

It's absolutely pure unmitigated bullshit.

I have watched this since you first posted it this morning. Let's just call it what it was. Race baiting, pure and simple.

245 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:46:41pm

re: #237 Bagua

OT:

For those following the UK elections.

Intrade had a Tory majority at 35% a few hours ago, they now have the opposite with 64% for a Tory majority.

Could still end in a hung parliament, likely the best result in my opinion.

Why do you say that?

246 webevintage  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:46:46pm

If you were going to download a Terry Pratchett Discworld book to listen to which one would you choose?
I've read Thief of Time, The Wyrd Sisters, Hogfather and The Color of Magic.

247 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:47:01pm

re: #223 Dark_Falcon

If some other students have a problem with American flag gear, then they should be the ones sent home. I maintain the vice-principal acted in error.

Except that the available evidence indicates that the flag gear wearers were acting out. The other kids weren't.

248 Charles Johnson  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:47:17pm

re: #242 Dark_Falcon

No. A better approach would have been to tell the yahoos to cool it. Telling them to turn American flag shirt inside out seems over the top and disrespectful to the flag to me.

It's far more disrespectful in my view to use the flag as a kind of ideological cattle prod, to deliberately harass the Spanish kids on their holiday.

249 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:47:25pm

re: #226 TheMatrix31

Why were the kids wearing bandanas told to remove them?

Against school policy to wear headgear, according to the local news last night.

250 lostlakehiker  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:47:31pm

re: #212 SanFranciscoZionist

Evidence of this? I haven't kept up with all the news.

On the evening news that he borrowed 60K against his home equity, and quit his job, and went to Pakistan, all pretty much at the same time. Where, but to jihad, did the 60K go? Losing the house to foreclosure is pretty predictable if you borrow against your equity to the max, then quit your job, quit making payments, and go where you cannot be reached for months on end.

251 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:47:39pm

Intrade also has the Cali Marijuana legalization intiative to pass at 65%

252 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:48:23pm

re: #235 Dark_Falcon

The school has an existing rule against bandanas.

Probably to prevent the kids from wearing gang-related apparel. Also, lots of schools won't allow hats of any kind. Ours does not allow hats except outdoors.

253 sandbox  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:48:27pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

I am watching Sara Palin on O'Reilly. Why are they inflicting this on me? I voted for McCain/Palin, isn't that enough? I am one of those Republicans who think McCain's choice of Palin may have cost him the election. Now Fox put her on the payroll and on the air. Why.......

254 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:48:28pm

re: #244 Bubblehead II


Let's just call it what it was---freedom of speech.

God bless those who died who gave the right to these kids to wear the shirt they wanted to wear, regardless of motive.

255 webevintage  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:48:37pm

re: #226 TheMatrix31

Why were the kids wearing bandannas told to remove them?

Because no one should be wearing bandanas unless they are Bret Michaels.

256 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:49:27pm

re: #240 TheMatrix31

It is the offended's responsibility to act with restraint.

A few taunting words is not provocation, unless you're Zinadine Zidane---then you just go headbutt the opposing player.

The 'offended' did act with restraint. No 'offended' student did anything except agree, when the press asked, that they were offended.

257 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:50:12pm

re: #242 Dark_Falcon

No. A better approach would have been to tell the yahoos to cool it. Telling them to turn American flag shirt inside out seems over the top and disrespectful to the flag to me.

Using the flag this way seems pretty disrespectful of the flag to me. Remember, other students were walking around in flag shirts all day long, without a word said.

258 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:50:28pm

re: #245 Dark_Falcon

Why do you say that?

A hung parliament would be unstable, leading to new elections. A result other than a Tory majority would leave Cameron in an untenable position. Thus the ABC vote (anyone but Cameron) could lead to a Tory win in a year with a new leader and return to purpose.

259 Cato the Elder  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:50:36pm

re: #255 webevintage

Because no one should be wearing bandanas unless they are Bret Michaels.

Or Willie Nelson.

Or a cute dog.

260 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:51:12pm

Palin on The Factor: "I think we should just keep this clean, keep it simple. Go back to what our founders and our founding documents meant, they're quite clear: That, um, we would create law based on the God of the Bible and the Ten Commandments. It's, it's pretty simple."

Full Metal Theocrat = Constitution Interpretation FAIL

261 webevintage  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:51:16pm

re: #259 Cato the Elder

Or Willie Nelson.

Or a cute dog.

Forgot about Willie and dogs....

262 Charles Johnson  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:51:19pm

I see where all these sleepers are coming from. Someone posted a link to LGF in Michelle Malkin's thread about this story. The comments for that thread are completely nauseating, of course.

263 Vicious Babushka  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:51:24pm

re: #252 SanFranciscoZionist

Probably to prevent the kids from wearing gang-related apparel. Also, lots of schools won't allow hats of any kind. Ours does not allow hats except outdoors.

Schools should have a uniform and that's it. Kids are there to learn, not to make political statements, fashion statements or a fashion show.

White or blue shirt, blue/black/khaki pants/skirt, and no logo except for the school logo.

264 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:51:51pm

re: #256 SanFranciscoZionist

Then what's the problem? Why ask them to flip them inside out, or go home?

265 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:51:53pm

re: #257 SanFranciscoZionist

Using the flag this way seems pretty disrespectful of the flag to me. Remember, other students were walking around in flag shirts all day long, without a word said.


You would never catch me in flag attire. Sorry, I always thought it was a little over the top, and never really flattering. I do have a pair of socks with red white & blue stars on them though.

266 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:51:55pm

IMHO-Principles have need wide discretion to avoid disruptions, distractions and real trouble. Sending kids in provocative clothing home is fine with me. I just do not see trying to treat a shirt as a flag. It's just a shirt with a pattern. The flags in the classrooms or on the pole out front are the items that deserve respect.

Advocate politics can wait for college.

267 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:52:05pm

re: #254 TheMatrix31

Let's just call it what it was---freedom of speech.

God bless those who died who gave the right to these kids to wear the shirt they wanted to wear, regardless of motive.

You don't get to have pure freedom of speech in school. That's not how high school works.

268 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:52:24pm

re: #258 Bagua

A hung parliament would be unstable, leading to new elections. A result other than a Tory majority would leave Cameron in an untenable position. Thus the ABC vote (anyone but Cameron) could lead to a Tory win in a year with a new leader and return to purpose.

I actually think Cameron may do quite well. You seem not to like him.

269 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:52:43pm

re: #246 webevintage

If you were going to download a Terry Pratchett Discworld book to listen to which one would you choose?
I've read Thief of Time, The Wyrd Sisters, Hogfather and The Color of Magic.

Lords and Ladies is VERY good. I also like Maskerade.

270 Cato the Elder  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:53:17pm

Never confuse principals with principles.

271 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:53:19pm

re: #260 Dark_Falcon

Palin on The Factor: "I think we should just keep this clean, keep it simple. Go back to what our founders and our founding documents meant, they're quite clear: That, um, we would create law based on the God of the Bible and the Ten Commandments. It's, it's pretty simple."

Full Metal Theocrat = Constitution Interpretation FAIL

OH MY.

272 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:53:43pm

re: #253 sandbox

I am watching Sara Palin on O'Reilly. Why are they inflicting this on me? I voted for McCain/Palin, isn't that enough? I am one of those Republicans who think McCain's choice of Palin may have cost him the election. Now Fox put her on the payroll and on the air. Why...

They're just trying to get you worked up. Resist. Drink chamomile tea. Turn the TV off, or watch something pleasant.

273 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:53:51pm

re: #262 Charles

I see where all these sleepers are coming from. Someone posted a link to LGF in Michelle Malkin's thread about this story. The comments for that thread are completely nauseating, of course.

Great. Mosquitoes coming in from a fever swamp. I'll go get the Deep Woods OFF. That'll keep them away.

274 jaunte  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:53:54pm

re: #266 Rightwingconspirator

The man 'on the ground' and closest to the situation should have the authority to act freely to maintain the peace, especially in a school.
This principle used to be widely supported among conservatives.

275 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:53:56pm

re: #263 Alouette

Yeah, I was one of the few who liked having a uniform in HS. Never had to worry about what to wear.

276 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:54:04pm

re: #270 Cato the Elder

My bad.

277 Bubblehead II  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:54:25pm

re: #254 TheMatrix31

Let's just call it what it was---freedom of speech.

God bless those who died who gave the right to these kids to wear the shirt they wanted to wear, regardless of motive.

This was notA PUBLIC VENUE . It was a High School and the individuals involved were students trying to cause a disturbance. As Charles has numerous times pointed out,The VP acted to prevent that.

Perhaps we should just agree to disagree.

278 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:54:40pm

re: #254 TheMatrix31

Let's just call it what it was---freedom of speech.

God bless those who died who gave the right to these kids to wear the shirt they wanted to wear, regardless of motive.

Interestingly, the students who were not creating a disruption at school were allowed all the freedom of speech they could fit on their t-shirts.

279 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:54:49pm

re: #241 SanFranciscoZionist

You've really decided what happened here, haven't you?

Just satire of the worst case scenario. The reason it is satire and not parody is because it actually isn't that implausible anymore. ;)

280 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:55:10pm

re: #260 Dark_Falcon

Palin on The Factor: "I think we should just keep this clean, keep it simple. Go back to what our founders and our founding documents meant, they're quite clear: That, um, we would create law based on the God of the Bible and the Ten Commandments. It's, it's pretty simple."

Full Metal Theocrat = Constitution Interpretation FAIL

Wow, she just keeps going and going, I wonder if it really will be her winning the primary...

281 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:55:35pm

re: #259 Cato the Elder

Or Willie Nelson.

Or a cute dog.

Or an adorable kibbutznik girl in short shorts, but they wear them over the top of the head.

282 albusteve  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:55:38pm

re: #272 SanFranciscoZionist

They're just trying to get you worked up. Resist. Drink chamomile tea. Turn the TV off, or watch something pleasant.

getting worked up, over images and soundbites, is exactly what the nets want....shaping opinion through the backdoor

283 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:56:06pm

re: #277 Bubblehead II

This was notA PUBLIC VENUE . It was a High School and the individuals involved were students trying to cause a disturbance. As Charles has numerous times pointed out,The VP acted to prevent that.

Perhaps we should just agree to disagree.

Quite Concur with that last.

284 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:56:09pm

re: #260 Dark_Falcon

Palin on The Factor: "I think we should just keep this clean, keep it simple. Go back to what our founders and our founding documents meant, they're quite clear: That, um, we would create law based on the God of the Bible and the Ten Commandments. It's, it's pretty simple."

Full Metal Theocrat = Constitution Interpretation FAIL

Wow. Does she think that if she keeps saying this it will become true?

285 webevintage  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:56:13pm

re: #254 TheMatrix31

Let's just call it what it was---freedom of speech.

God bless those who died who gave the right to these kids to wear the shirt they wanted to wear, regardless of motive.

Students do not have a right to free speech...it can be and is controlled by the school.
(not that I agree, but kids in school do not have the same rights at school as they would have outside of school)

286 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:56:52pm

re: #260 Dark_Falcon

Palin on The Factor: "I think we should just keep this clean, keep it simple. Go back to what our founders and our founding documents meant, they're quite clear: That, um, we would create law based on the God of the Bible and the Ten Commandments. It's, it's pretty simple."

Full Metal Theocrat = Constitution Interpretation FAIL

Pray tell, what was O'Reilly's expression?

287 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:57:03pm

re: #263 Alouette

Schools should have a uniform and that's it. Kids are there to learn, not to make political statements, fashion statements or a fashion show.

White or blue shirt, blue/black/khaki pants/skirt, and no logo except for the school logo.

Well, I like the idea myself, but then again, I teach at a Catholic school.

And our dress code is much too lax, in my opinion.

288 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:57:46pm

re: #278 SanFranciscoZionist


If yelling something like "We live in America!" is called a disruption or inciting violence, then I would have been sent home every single day of High School, or I would have gotten into thousands of fights.

289 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:57:47pm

re: #280 WindUpBird

Wow, she just keeps going and going, I wonder if it really will be her winning the primary...

Oh, I hope not. Palin at the top of the GOP ticket would make 2012 a very bad year for me. I'd have to vote for Obama, and that would be extremely painful. I'd do it, but I'd hate it.

290 lostlakehiker  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:57:55pm

re: #211 SanFranciscoZionist

Let's just say that I am a little dubious that it's nature and not nurture, and that I do not like wandering down these sorts of paths, even if it might seem to be to the credit of my own little ethnic group.

Understandable. In personal life, braggarts are a pain and even making good on the brag does not endear them much to their fellows. But others, watching from the sidelines, can explore scientific possibilities and try to work out the why of a truly extraordinary run of achievement. You guys really are a light unto the nations. Culture works hand in hand with whatever native edge there may be, ensuring that a minimal fraction of extraordinarily talented children fail to thrive.

There's no telling what the native potential of Indians might be, to pick just one example from the ranks of nations that haven't got quite so impressive a resume. Ramanujan was, but for an accident of history, just another clerk. The existence of somebody so many standard deviations out from his pack is strong evidence that one is not looking at a simple bell curve distribution. One is looking, instead, at a tragic tale of wasted potential.

291 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:58:06pm

re: #268 Dark_Falcon

I actually think Cameron may do quite well. You seem not to like him.

I despise him. He stands for nothing and does not share core conservative values. His re-branding of the Tory party has been a disaster. Worse of all, he betrayed the voters by reneging on his promise to hold a referendum on the EU constitution Lisbon Treaty, and this before even being elected.

292 Charles Johnson  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:58:13pm

re: #266 Rightwingconspirator

IMHO-Principles have need wide discretion to avoid disruptions, distractions and real trouble. Sending kids in provocative clothing home is fine with me. I just do not see trying to treat a shirt as a flag. It's just a shirt with a pattern. The flags in the classrooms or on the pole out front are the items that deserve respect.

Advocate politics can wait for college.

The kids were apparently given a choice -- they could continue wearing the shirts and bandanas in school and be suspended, they could turn the shirts inside out and take off the bandanas and stay in school, or they could go home. They chose to go home.

293 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:58:15pm

re: #264 TheMatrix31

Then what's the problem? Why ask them to flip them inside out, or go home?

Because the kids were being disruptive and provocative in their speech and actions, and the principal was afraid there would be trouble. The kids are at school to learn, not to try to stir up tension among their classmates.

294 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:58:31pm

re: #286 Stanley Sea

Pray tell, what was O'Reilly's expression?

She was the only one on the screen as she was speaking.

295 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:58:50pm

re: #267 WindUpBird

You don't get to have pure freedom of speech in school. That's not how high school works.

Thank God.

296 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:59:29pm

re: #278 SanFranciscoZionist

Interestingly, the students who were not creating a disruption at school were allowed all the freedom of speech they could fit on their t-shirts.

Funny how that works!

We were all in high school,I don't understand why people don't get that causing a disturbance is grounds for the administrators to come down on you...

297 A Man for all Seasons  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:59:34pm

re: #281 SanFranciscoZionist

Or an adorable kibbutznik girl in short shorts, but they wear them over the top of the head.

Let's face it..You weren't really cool in the Bay area unless you had a bandanna wrapped on your knee...We were wanna be hippies....

298 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:59:38pm

re: #294 Dark_Falcon

She was the only one on the screen as she was speaking.

Another day when I wish I were friends with the production assistants.

299 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 5:59:47pm

re: #292 Charles

Seems more than reasonable.

300 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:00:01pm

re: #291 Bagua

I despise him. He stands for nothing and does not share core conservative values. His re-branding of the Tory party has been a disaster. Worse of all, he betrayed the voters by reneging on his promise to hold a referendum on the EU constitution Lisbon Treaty, and this before even being elected.

I see. Hopefully, he'll move to the right once in office.

301 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:00:21pm

re: #279 ausador

Just satire of the worst case scenario. The reason it is satire and not parody is because it actually isn't that implausible anymore. ;)

Yeah, actually it is that implausible. One principal made a judgement call. It's all over except for the screaming on the Internet and the talk shows.

302 TheMatrix31  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:00:58pm

Gotta go. Later.

303 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:01:32pm

re: #287 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, I like the idea myself, but then again, I teach at a Catholic school.

And our dress code is much too lax, in my opinion.

I would have been okay with a dress code that was no logos on shirts, plain pants, but no mandated clothing styles.

Then again, I live in black t-shirts and jeans, so it's already sort of a uniform to me :D

304 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:02:19pm

re: #295 SanFranciscoZionist

Thank God.

I knew what I was like in high school, and I was mild mannered! It would have been madness :D

305 windsagio  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:02:33pm

re: #291 Bagua

Why are you so strongly against the EU? /curious

306 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:02:35pm

re: #288 TheMatrix31

If yelling something like "We live in America!" is called a disruption or inciting violence, then I would have been sent home every single day of High School, or I would have gotten into thousands of fights.

You feel these youths were absolutely blameless, and the school had absolutely no call to discuss their behavior with them?

307 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:02:36pm

re: #263 Alouette

Schools should have a uniform and that's it. Kids are there to learn, not to make political statements, fashion statements or a fashion show.

White or blue shirt, blue/black/khaki pants/skirt, and no logo except for the school logo.

That one was brought up and defeated I think three seperate times here in Florida, even though everyone seemed to think it was a good idea for all the usual reasons. It sure would cut down on the elitest bullying crap if nothing else...

308 webevintage  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:02:50pm

re: #269 SanFranciscoZionist

Lords and Ladies is VERY good. I also like Maskerade.

Thanks.
There are so many to choose from including the one released last year.
Is Granny Weatherwax a main character in either?

309 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:03:33pm

re: #306 SanFranciscoZionist

You feel these youths were absolutely blameless, and the school had absolutely no call to discuss their behavior with them?

I think he's left the building :P

But yeah, I have no clue how anyone could get that opinion out of that news story

310 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:04:11pm

re: #308 webevintage

Thanks.
There are so many to choose from including the one released last year.
Is Granny Weatherwax a main character in either?

In both. She is my favorite Pratchett character.

311 Obdicut  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:04:23pm

re: #288 TheMatrix31

Um, why did you yell "We live in America" when you were in high school?

If I yelled in high school, I got in trouble no matter what I was yelling. Except in a pep rally, of course. God, I hate pep rallies.

312 windsagio  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:04:37pm

re: #309 WindUpBird

because:

AMERICAN FLAG!!!!!!!!!
313 windsagio  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:04:54pm

re: #311 Obdicut

arguing with damn hippies maybe?

314 Gus  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:05:01pm

re: #295 SanFranciscoZionist

Thank God.

Yeah. But you know the wingnuts that are supporting these t-shirt cretins would support crossdressing high school students' rights to free expression.

Actually, no. Here's a sampling from the prime wingnuts at Freerepublic regarding that scenario.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Where does the First Amendment mention anything about transgender homos?

----

Well, even if this eventually loses in court, good for the principal.

----

Mainstreaming mental ilness

How come his/her's is okay but my paranoia isn't

----

Why do these people take their weakness to the lime light? One sicko take it on himself to ruin a school event.

Fecking wingnuts.

315 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:05:01pm

re: #311 Obdicut

Um, why did you yell "We live in America" when you were in high school?

If I yelled in high school, I got in trouble no matter what I was yelling. Except in a pep rally, of course. God, I hate pep rallies.

I hate pep rallies more than you do. As a teacher, you have to freaking SMILE all the way through the pep rally.

316 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:05:15pm

re: #309 WindUpBird

I think he's left the building :P

But yeah, I have no clue how anyone could get that opinion out of that news story

He's not getting it from a "news story" he's getting it, I would bet, from a right wing scream blog.

317 Renaissance_Man  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:05:20pm

re: #279 ausador

Just satire of the worst case scenario. The reason it is satire and not parody is because it actually isn't that implausible anymore. ;)

True enough. I suppose it's just another sign of how the collectivists and their jackbooted liberal thugs are stomping on the faces of the free, and slowly inch by inch tightening their vise-like grip on every facet of good, decent folks' lives, controlling their every deed, their every breath, their every action. How long before the thought police come and round up the free citizens for merely having an individual, objectivist thought?

Clearly the only solution is to go Galt.

318 webevintage  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:05:23pm

re: #310 SanFranciscoZionist

In both. She is my favorite Pratchett character.

Well that made the choice easier.
and me too....

319 jaunte  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:05:36pm

re: #311 Obdicut

Um, why did you yell "We live in America" when you were in high school?


"West Side Story" rehearsal?

320 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:06:34pm

re: #317 Renaissance_Man

True enough. I suppose it's just another sign of how the collectivists and their jackbooted liberal thugs are stomping on the faces of the free, and slowly inch by inch tightening their vise-like grip on every facet of good, decent folks' lives, controlling their every deed, their every breath, their every action. How long before the thought police come and round up the free citizens for merely having an individual, objectivist thought?

Clearly the only solution is to go Galt.

I'm highly in favor of people going Galt. It will do them good to see that the world can get along without them.

321 Obdicut  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:06:37pm

re: #315 SanFranciscoZionist

Pep rallie sparked me interest in making out with a girl far away from the pep rally, because nobody would catch us.

So they're good for something.

322 A Man for all Seasons  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:07:05pm

re: #315 SanFranciscoZionist

I hate pep rallies more than you do. As a teacher, you have to freaking SMILE all the way through the pep rally.

I loved pep rally's!

323 Randall Gross  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:07:37pm

Thunderfoot gets a death threat from a muslim

324 sandbox  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:08:16pm

re: #289 Dark_Falcon

If Palin runs in 2012, I can't see her winning primaries.

325 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:08:38pm

re: #322 HoosierHoops

I never attended pep rallies. I hid in the art department storage room with my friends :D

326 [deleted]  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:09:04pm
327 Obdicut  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:09:28pm

re: #325 WindUpBird

Shout if anyone's coming, man, so Maika and I can pretend like we're studying.

328 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:09:30pm

re: #324 sandbox

If Palin runs in 2012, I can't see her winning primaries.

I'm starting to wonder, because she has the biggest brand among the people who will show up for primaries.

329 prairiefire  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:10:05pm

re: #321 Obdicut

Pep rallie sparked me interest in making out with a girl far away from the pep rally, because nobody would catch us.

So they're good for something.

Absolutely! Go outside for a smoke.

330 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:10:38pm

Reggie, check your email.

331 Obdicut  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:11:01pm

Okay. My pile of dishes has reached sentience and is negotiating with the recycling an compost. I'm going to go nuke it from orbit.

332 [deleted]  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:11:21pm
333 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:11:39pm

re: #323 Thanos

Thunderfoot gets a death threat from a muslim


[Video]

Only one? Slacker, tsk, tsk... :p

334 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:12:13pm

re: #305 windsagio

Why are you so strongly against the EU? /curious

Lol.

335 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:12:49pm

On illegal immigration as the larger topic here, I got hit right between the eyes today with a big point. My secular Jewish boss is a serious tem commandment conservative. He brought up a "fact" that Jews were turned away from America for lack of papers. They went back to Germany to wind up in the camps. I have not followed up on this online I take him at his word. That point really shocked me on the "sudden perspective shift" a person can experience. Seriously.

336 windsagio  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:14:02pm

re: #334 Bagua

oh c'mon, I'm really curious :p

Present crisis aside of course ;)

337 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:14:41pm

re: #336 windsagio

oh c'mon, I'm really curious :p

Present crisis aside of course ;)

You are serious?

338 A Sockpuppet's Sockpuppet  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:14:45pm

re: #242 Dark_Falcon

No. A better approach would have been to tell the yahoos to cool it. Telling them to turn American flag shirt inside out seems over the top and disrespectful to the flag to me.

The flag is nothing but a symbol, it does not deserve to be worshipped. If you respect what the flag stands for, then as a representative of that target of respect the flag can be respected, but you should be able to separate the symbol from the object.

Worshipping a flag, or any other symbol, even if you feel it necessary to worship the object it symbolizes, taps into the worst parts of religious beliefs. That makes it impossible for rational, objective views.

339 Vicious Babushka  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:14:55pm

re: #293 SanFranciscoZionist

Because the kids were being disruptive and provocative in their speech and actions, and the principal was afraid there would be trouble. The kids are at school to learn, not to try to stir up tension among their classmates.

Many years ago, a girl in my high school was suspended for wearing a black armband on her sleeve. When the teacher asked her why she was wearing it, she said "for the innocent Vietnamese who have been murdered by U.S. soldiers."

After she was suspended, the silly bitch sent messages to her classmates to wear black armbands to "continue" her protest. Not many gave half a shit.

A few months later, the silly bitch was suspended AGAIN, this time for smoking pot in the girl's lavatory.

340 windsagio  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:16:02pm

re: #337 Bagua

Yes I am.

I tend to think it was a good idea for them, altho overexpansion has been a problem.

Also, This site is a hoot.

341 tnguitarist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:16:02pm

re: #326 prairiefire
Comments at RS

This reminds me of a story I read during an election cycle. A lunch group of women all supported a particular candidate because he had a nice butt. I literally had someone say to me that she couldn’t support Fred Thompson because he had bags under his eyes, and, he wasn’t good looking enough to look presidential. Same goes for names. So, have we gotten to the point of looks, butts and names rather than policies?


Unfortunately the answer to your question at the end is “yes” in general. I knew we were doomed when the Republicans ran a grandpa against a rock star in 2008! Policies did not matter for too many people.


No irony there at all considering their doll gives them *starbursts*.

342 A Man for all Seasons  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:16:03pm

re: #325 WindUpBird

I never attended pep rallies. I hid in the art department storage room with my friends :D

Friday Afternoon college pep rallies at Napa JUCO were just a blast...Really they were more fun than when I went to State...I knew everybody at JUCO...
State was bigger but heck..I didn't know that many people up there...
Napa Knows how to throw a party after a pep rally...Don't fool yourself..

343 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:17:23pm

re: #339 Alouette

Many years ago, a girl in my high school was suspended for wearing a black armband on her sleeve. When the teacher asked her why she was wearing it, she said "for the innocent Vietnamese who have been murdered by U.S. soldiers."

After she was suspended, the silly bitch sent messages to her classmates to wear black armbands to "continue" her protest. Not many gave half a shit.

A few months later, the silly bitch was suspended AGAIN, this time for smoking pot in the girl's lavatory.

Silly bitch covers it nicely. Absorbed the miasma of lies the hard left spewed during the Vietnam War. I hope she wised up, but I doubt it.

344 tnguitarist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:17:39pm

re: #328 WindUpBird

I'm starting to wonder, because she has the biggest brand among the people who will show up for primaries.

I think everyone is underestimating the Republican primaries. They will be trying to win, so everyone genuflecting before her will be out the window.

345 sandbox  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:19:43pm

re: #344 tnguitarist

IMO even Republicans who like her may not vote for her, because she doesn't appear presidential.

346 Renaissance_Man  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:20:34pm

re: #341 tnguitarist

Comments at RS


No irony there at all considering their doll gives them *starbursts*.

The modern Conservative cult is a movement almost entirely dependent on the cults of personality of its leaders. It's simply rubbish, and ironic rubbish, when they accuse the 'other side' of AmIdol politics and settle back in their smug sense of superiority about their deeply held values and beliefs. About the only immutable belief in the cult is that 'Democrats/liberals are bad'. Everything else is defined either by the opinion of a cult leader, or by opposition to something the other side agrees with.

347 A Sockpuppet's Sockpuppet  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:20:57pm

re: #254 TheMatrix31

Let's just call it what it was---freedom of speech.

God bless those who died who gave the right to these kids to wear the shirt they wanted to wear, regardless of motive.

Freedom of speech is not the same as freedom to aggravate to action. This is similar to what bullies do, and that type of action has undesirable, sometimes dire consequences.

348 A Sockpuppet's Sockpuppet  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:21:15pm

re: #255 webevintage

Because no one should be wearing bandanas unless they are Bret Michaels.

Gang colours.

349 Vicious Babushka  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:21:34pm

re: #343 Dark_Falcon

Silly bitch covers it nicely. Absorbed the miasma of lies the hard left spewed during the Vietnam War. I hope she wised up, but I doubt it.

She's probably a Code Pinker, now.

350 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:21:42pm

California Politics-
[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]
Washington (CNN) – Sarah Palin broke ranks with the conservative movement on Thursday and endorsed former Hewlett-Packard CEO Carly Fiorina in California's Republican Senate primary, prompting a flurry of criticism from many of her loyal supporters.

After Palin announced the endorsement on her Facebook page, a number of her followers questioned why she would side with Fiorina instead of the more conservative candidate in the race, Assemblyman Chuck DeVore.

DeVore has the backing of several leading voices in the conservative movement, including Sen. Jim DeMint, RedState.com editor Erick Erickson and the Tea Party Express.

351 tnguitarist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:24:43pm

re: #350 Rightwingconspirator

After Palin announced the endorsement on her Facebook page, a number of her followers questioned why she would side with Fiorina


The thing is, she will never answer that question or any other.

352 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:25:02pm

OK-

Scientific American had an article about this back in the Early "Naughties." Of Course Neanderthal Genes are still among us. We Human Beings have our "Breeds" - as do dogs, cats, horses, sheep, goats, cattle, etc.
Signs are - Shorter, Stockier, etc. - Who Really Cares? What really matters is the content of one's character - OR - so I was taught. Was I Taught Wrong?

-S-

353 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:25:25pm

re: #340 windsagio

Yes I am.

I tend to think it was a good idea for them, altho overexpansion has been a problem.

Also, This site is a hoot.

Ah yes, I forgot that you are a recent arrival. I have a consistent Eurosceptic position here, my reasons have been spelled out numerous times over the last few years.

The site you list as a "hoot" is a European Commission site. That should be your first clue. The "myths" they list are the low hanging fruit from the Media, rumour and other easily dismissed stuff. They do not address actual EU scepticism on that page. I believe that is called deflection.

354 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:25:48pm

re: #350 Rightwingconspirator

California Politics-
[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]
Washington (CNN) – Sarah Palin broke ranks with the conservative movement on Thursday and endorsed former Hewlett-Packard CEO Carly Fiorina in California's Republican Senate primary, prompting a flurry of criticism from many of her loyal supporters.

After Palin announced the endorsement on her Facebook page, a number of her followers questioned why she would side with Fiorina instead of the more conservative candidate in the race, Assemblyman Chuck DeVore.

DeVore has the backing of several leading voices in the conservative movement, including Sen. Jim DeMint, RedState.com editor Erick Erickson and the Tea Party Express.

Has Carly come out as pro-choice in the past? Something made me think she did. This indicates she's changing her tune...?

355 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:28:10pm

re: #351 tnguitarist
We get to follow the money. So maybe.
Puts me in a odd spot, as I have some early respect for Fiorina and a lot for Campbell. I'm not a Republican, but if a Republican candidate is really odious, I'm just going to withhold a vote on that office.

356 A Sockpuppet's Sockpuppet  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:30:02pm

re: #285 webevintage

Students do not have a right to free speech...it can be and is controlled by the school.
(not that I agree, but kids in school do not have the same rights at school as they would have outside of school)

The school's right for civil behaviour of students is superior to the rights of the children to free speech. A parent's right to protect his/her children is superior to the rights of those children to do as they please. All rights are not of the same level, even if they appear to be in the written word.

357 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:30:04pm

re: #354 Stanley Sea

I am not expecting to see sudden conservative shift from Carly Fiorina. This is more about Palin.

358 A Sockpuppet's Sockpuppet  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:31:13pm

re: #286 Stanley Sea

Pray tell, what was O'Reilly's expression?

The same as usual - feigned indignation, with a hint of dollar bills.

359 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:31:19pm

re: #357 Rightwingconspirator

I am not expecting to see sudden conservative shift from Carly Fiorina. This is more about Palin.

I keep forgetting she's a rogue.

360 A Sockpuppet's Sockpuppet  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:33:11pm

re: #314 Gus 802

Fecking wingnuts.

Please! I just ate.

361 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:33:12pm

re: #354 Stanley Sea

Stanley Sea -

Suspect it is a GIRL thing. Where do you live? Have all'y'all had a Female governor? We in NJ have - Christine Whitman - Generally pretty good - AND -
More Females than usual were appointed while she was Governor - AND - when a Governor has to appoint people, He/She appoints people He/She knows. Take it from there. -S-

362 windsagio  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:33:13pm

re: #353 Bagua

Not sure 'recent' is appropriate anymore.

And it is a hoot :p I know what its from.

Why do you care so much tho? (If I may ask)

363 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:34:27pm

BRB
Cheesburger/beer break

364 tnguitarist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:35:24pm

re: #355 Rightwingconspirator

If I remember correctly, the last Republican primaries were quite the grinder. I would love for Palin to join them, but I don't think she will. There is no way she could handle the debates. I think she will run, but it will be as a third party candidate. Although, I believe she knows it would pull votes from R's. I would love to see her get eaten alive during the primary season.

365 freetoken  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:35:59pm

re: #352 Dr. Shalit

There was no proof until the genome decoding came along.

Previous allegations of neanderthal-sapiens interbreeding were hypotheses with conflicting evidence.

The truth is likely somewhat muddled. Species evolve in a population, and it is beginning to look like the development of sapiens in Africa was somewhat fuzzy, and it now looks like sapiens and neanderthal were not on their way to becoming totally separate before breeding folding genes back.

One thing that is now a serious question is if there were distinct populations of neanderthals, and that sapiens only interbred with certain groups. That will be a hard question to answer.

366 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:36:37pm

re: #361 Dr. Shalit

Stanley Sea -

Suspect it is a GIRL thing. Where do you live? Have all'y'all had a Female governor? We in NJ have - Christine Whitman - Generally pretty good - AND -
More Females than usual were appointed while she was Governor - AND - when a Governor has to appoint people, He/She appoints people He/She knows. Take it from there. -S-

Good point. How are you doing? Haven't seen you around much lately.

367 freetoken  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:37:41pm

re: #352 Dr. Shalit

BTW, Dawkins, in his latest book, has a good section on why not to get hung up on taxonomy, and how artificial it is to put one fossil in one species/genus vs. another.

368 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:37:49pm

re: #361 Dr. Shalit

Reply to Self -

Were I a SARAH as some of my cousins are named - rather than a "Scott" - the Anglicized Version of "Shlomo/Solomon" - I suspect I would know more "Sarahs" than "Scotts" while I grew up. That is all. -S-

369 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:39:08pm

re: #366 Dark_Falcon

Dark_Falcon -

Been BUSY as in VERY!

-S-

370 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:40:54pm

re: #364 tnguitarist

Sarah is not going to run.

371 Dark_Falcon  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:41:02pm

re: #369 Dr. Shalit

Dark_Falcon -

Been BUSY as in VERY!

-S-

I understand. Still glad to see you.

372 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:42:40pm

re: #359 Stanley Sea

I think she read California as a moderate place, and went with the likely winner. Root for the winner.

373 tnguitarist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:44:31pm

re: #370 Rightwingconspirator

Sarah is not going to run.

I tend to think she won't, but I'm not sure if her ego will let her not run. She's probably too happy with the money she makes, though. It's always easier to lob grenades and run then it is to jump in and fight.

374 tradewind  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:44:59pm

re: #266 Rightwingconspirator

advocate politics can wait for college

.
Yeah boy. Then it's let-yer-freak-flag-fly!

375 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:47:05pm

re: #361 Dr. Shalit

Stanley Sea -

Suspect it is a GIRL thing. Where do you live? Have all'y'all had a Female governor? We in NJ have - Christine Whitman - Generally pretty good - AND -
More Females than usual were appointed while she was Governor - AND - when a Governor has to appoint people, He/She appoints people He/She knows. Take it from there. -S-

The thing is, she's an insult to smart women. (I think I'm of that tribe)

376 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:49:05pm

re: #365 freetoken

There was no proof until the genome decoding came along.

Previous allegations of neanderthal-sapiens interbreeding were hypotheses with conflicting evidence.

The truth is likely somewhat muddled. Species evolve in a population, and it is beginning to look like the development of sapiens in Africa was somewhat fuzzy, and it now looks like sapiens and neanderthal were not on their way to becoming totally separate before breeding folding genes back.

One thing that is now a serious question is if there were distinct populations of neanderthals, and that sapiens only interbred with certain groups. That will be a hard question to answer.

Freetoken -

IF the Genomes are close enough, Interbreeding is possible - and - QUITE LIKELY. The worst that happens is the analogue of a MULE - a Sterile Hybrid Being. The best that happens is the enrichment of the Gene pool of a Species. that is Genetics as I learned it. Discussion? -S-

377 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:51:04pm

re: #362 windsagio

Not sure 'recent' is appropriate anymore.

And it is a hoot :p I know what its from.

Why do you care so much tho? (If I may ask)

Yes, recent is relative, and my having grown familiar to your being a fixture here is why I was surprised that you were unfamiliar with my positions.

That sight you link would be the equivalent to posting a link to some Baptist Family Group for facts about the gay lifestyle during a discussion about adoption. It is assumed to be highly biased and essentially propaganda.

As for why I care personally, I don't mind your asking, though I would also reference many prior posts.

In short, I oppose the EU because it is, on balance, a malign institution that brings more problems than advantages. The situation in Greece is merely the latest example. My core objection to the EU is that it transforms democratic nations into a post-democratic entity in which there is no direct accountability of the leaders to the people. What we end up with is a government of bureaucrats, perhaps no worse than the idiots that get elected, but with less democratic accountability.

The second core objection is the way it has progressed, not by vote, referendum and acquiescence but by dismissal of democratic vote and dishonest political maneuvering. The key example being the EU Constitution, which was voted against in national elections, but was re-branded into the Lisbon Treaty and put into power by fiat.

The third objection is exactly the situation we are witnessing in Greece. It was never going to work in the first place, this was known, the crises were inevitable. However this is key mechanism by which the EU grows in power, called engrenage. Every change has with it the foreknowledge that there will eventually be a crisis. Every crisis is then used as an opportunity to propose a reasonable sounding solution which always involves more Europe, more EU, never less.

378 windsagio  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:52:26pm

re: #377 Bagua

DUDE! I remember now!

Our first real interaction was about engrenage, and I thought it was a good thing and you didn't, and you mentioned the EU now. I'd forgotten until this moment :)

379 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:54:48pm

re: #335 Rightwingconspirator

On illegal immigration as the larger topic here, I got hit right between the eyes today with a big point. My secular Jewish boss is a serious tem commandment conservative. He brought up a "fact" that Jews were turned away from America for lack of papers. They went back to Germany to wind up in the camps. I have not followed up on this online I take him at his word. That point really shocked me on the "sudden perspective shift" a person can experience. Seriously.

This is one of the most famous episodes from that time.

380 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:57:37pm

re: #379 SanFranciscoZionist

I was sure he was correct. This episode has real relevance today.

381 CDRealist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:57:45pm

re: #14 LudwigVanQuixote: Chemistry question if you do not mind-The hydrates that are a threat to the deep drill rig repair-Are they very different from the methane hydrates that come out naturally (especially in recently warmer waters) or is it a different compound?

No. The hydrate part refers to water.

Methane hydrates are methane mixed with frozen water. That's what bubbles out of the bottom of the ocean.

Ice hydrates are ordinary water ice. It is formed in the pipe by a process not unlike freezing ice cream. I worked offshore oil for a few years.

382 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:57:54pm

re: #354 Stanley Sea

Has Carly come out as pro-choice in the past? Something made me think she did. This indicates she's changing her tune...?

Or, Palin didn't check, which wouldn't actually shock me.

383 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 6:58:25pm

re: #381 CDRealist

Okay, thanks! Appreciate that.

384 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:00:24pm

Well, here we are: Your text to link...Asked where she stands on abortion, Fiorina said, "I personally happen to be pro-life. John McCain has a very long pro-life record and he won't walk away from that record."

385 Bagua  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:00:49pm

re: #378 windsagio

DUDE! I remember now!

Our first real interaction was about engrenage, and I thought it was a good thing and you didn't, and you mentioned the EU now. I'd forgotten until this moment :)

Aha! Full circle. Good to see we are making progress mate.

386 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:01:57pm

re: #384 SanFranciscoZionist

Hair split. Personally. Read that as Not Going There In Office.

387 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:03:44pm

re: #382 SanFranciscoZionist

Or, Palin didn't check, which wouldn't actually shock me.

Also, I don't believe any of the viable Republican candidates aren't pro-choice, so Palin may just have picked the one she liked best anyway.

388 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:03:55pm

re: #379 SanFranciscoZionist

This is one of the most famous episodes from that time.

SF Zionist -

As To History - Your Boss IS Entirely Correct - I HOPE this is No News to You. It involves CUBA as well. Batista refused entry as well as FDR.
If you believe in the bless/curse sylogism with regard to treatment of the Jewish People the US has Atoned. At least since CASTRO, INC. - CUBA - Not so much. -S-

389 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:04:36pm

re: #388 Dr. Shalit

SF Zionist -

As To History - Your Boss IS Entirely Correct - I HOPE this is No News to You. It involves CUBA as well. Batista refused entry as well as FDR.
If you believe in the bless/curse sylogism with regard to treatment of the Jewish People the US has Atoned. At least since CASTRO, INC. - CUBA - Not so much. -S-

He's not my boss, and no, it is no news.

390 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:06:13pm

re: #389 SanFranciscoZionist

SF Zionist -

GOOD!! -S-

391 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:07:47pm

re: #379 SanFranciscoZionist

This is one of the most famous episodes from that time.

I just read through. OMG. I'm a bit hazy on how much we knew about death camps in 1939, but the persecution was clear in every sense.

392 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:10:36pm

re: #388 Dr. Shalit

It's not news, nor is it something I was well read on. My boss had a heck of a point. It gives him a harsh perspective on current policy.

393 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:12:59pm

re: #392 Rightwingconspirator

It's not news, nor is it something I was well read on. My boss had a heck of a point. It gives him a harsh perspective on current policy.

Interesting conver. I'm assuming your boss is more relaxed on immigration than most because of this?

394 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:15:38pm

re: #392 Rightwingconspirator

RWC -

Considering today's US Policy, a HARSH perspective is QUITE in order. -S-

395 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:17:11pm

re: #393 Stanley Sea

Oh no, Far less. He has a one word answer to illegal immigration. Out.

396 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:23:02pm

OK bottom line on the t-shirt thing:

1. The kids were not sent home for wearing the flag - which if you are actually patriotic, you know not to do anyway. They were sent home for purposefully trying to tell other American kids of Hispanic descent that they were not welcome.

2. That is nothing more than racism, plain and simple.

3. Other kids who were just wearing flag garments were not sent home because they were not being assholes.

4. No one here, except every Latino/a who sees this, and those who aren't totally tone deaf, is talking about how this was nothing more or less than telling some kids that they, and their holidays and their culture has no place for "real Americans."

5. As to Malkin, that evil woman came out in favor of Japanese internment.
What do you expect?

397 Eclectic Infidel  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:24:33pm

I thought this was the third time we've had the pleasure of listening to this particular tune by Elvis Costello. I was right. It's an excellent song and worth the repetition.

398 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:25:37pm

re: #395 Rightwingconspirator

RWC -

He is smoking something I might like to try. Utterly impossible - and! - though I am willing to be flexible on "Green Cards" - Citizenship and Voting for "Illegals" - HELL NO! - Not unless, as in the words of Former (Mexican) President Fox "There is No Border" - In Which Case - THERE IS NO MEXICO!

-S-

399 Dr. Shalit  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:29:42pm

re: #396 LudwigVanQuixote

LVQ -

Bottom Line - Flag Burning is Legal Political Expression - and T-Shirt Wearing Is??

-S-

400 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:31:13pm

re: #395 Rightwingconspirator

hmmm. I don't get it.

You screwed us, so screw everyone else!

401 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:34:19pm

re: #400 Stanley Sea

More as if the price of entry is permission, for everyone forever. Because of the price that has been paid. I'm not defending, and I'm not apt to argue the point.

402 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:40:22pm

re: #398 Dr. Shalit

In the same chat we discovered every President in our lifetimes has failed to support a strong border. The southwest is this zone just expected to absorb some chunk of Mexico's unemployed.

403 Political Atheist  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:41:03pm

I'm moving on. Upstairs.

404 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:46:06pm

re: #399 Dr. Shalit

LVQ -

Bottom Line - Flag Burning is Legal Political Expression - and T-Shirt Wearing Is??

-S-

Bottom line while adults have the Constitutional right to be assholes when they talk, school kids don't. Don't be stupid.

405 Stanghazi  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:49:15pm

re: #401 Rightwingconspirator

More as if the price of entry is permission, for everyone forever. Because of the price that has been paid. I'm not defending, and I'm not apt to argue the point.

It was wrong then though.

406 lostlakehiker  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:58:53pm

re: #335 Rightwingconspirator

On illegal immigration as the larger topic here, I got hit right between the eyes today with a big point. My secular Jewish boss is a serious tem commandment conservative. He brought up a "fact" that Jews were turned away from America for lack of papers. They went back to Germany to wind up in the camps. I have not followed up on this online I take him at his word. That point really shocked me on the "sudden perspective shift" a person can experience. Seriously.

It wasn't that they lacked papers, it was that they would have been immigrants in the middle of an economic downturn far worse than what we're now experiencing. Back then, few knew that they were refugees from hell-in-the-making.

They weren't refugees from the camps, for those came later. Hitler announced his hand in Mein Kampf, but he showed it only slowly.

The situation of Mexicans in Mexico today doesn't seem to be as bad as what we knew even then of the situation of Jews in Germany. It's not a crime against humanity to turn some away at the border.

If the drug war there degenerates to some genocidal frenzy such as what happened in Bangladesh when Pakistan waged war on her unhappy Eastern Bengali province, we'll have to do what India did and intervene both for humanitarian purposes and so we don't have to bring in all Mexico just to save them from their civil war. But the situation now is not remotely that bad.

407 Nimed  Thu, May 6, 2010 7:59:10pm

re: #399 Dr. Shalit

LVQ -

Bottom Line - Flag Burning is Legal Political Expression - and T-Shirt Wearing Is??

-S-

I'm not convinced that sending the kids home was the right call (unless their safety was in immediate danger). That said, this argument is silly. The 1st Amendment protects your political speech from infringement by the State. The kids would weren't arrested or prosecuted. This as a decision made by a school authority.

408 Eclectic Infidel  Thu, May 6, 2010 8:10:41pm

OT:
Current cap on liability for oil spill: $75 million. What is that, a day's worth of profit for BP? Lawmakers want to raise that to $10 billion. Good luck with that one. IMNSHO, the cap should be set to the average annual gross profits for the company responsible for the environmental disaster. At least for the clean up part. Then BP should pay back everyone, from the national guard to fishing companies and then environmental groups should be consulted as to how much BP should pay for the death of all the marine animals.

That's my .02.

409 nekama  Thu, May 6, 2010 8:20:11pm

Somehow this song isn't the same without the hotties dancing in their bikinis.

410 Eclectic Infidel  Thu, May 6, 2010 8:20:43pm

re: #409 nekama

Somehow this song isn't the same without the hotties dancing in their bikinis.

Word.


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