Tim Blair, Ignorant Slut

Wingnuts • Views: 3,736

Tim Blair thinks people have only started leaving anti-Israel comments at LGF since my new “leftish conversion.” He says these are my “new friends.”

Blair, you ignorant slut. People have been leaving anti-Israel comments at LGF for many years. It happens every time there’s a phony international incident like this. The more excitable anti-Israel people get all stirred up and start posting comments anywhere they can. That’s why the IDF turns off comments for their videos at YouTube.

Some of these people go way over the line. Wow. Like I haven’t seen that before. Shocking.

And some of them are leftists, but by no means all. See: Ron Paul and Pat Buchanan.

And those would be your old, old friends, Timmy boy.

We’ve had these debates since LGF started. They’ve never stopped. And when the more extreme ranters do post their strange little rationales for violence against Israel, they get their asses kicked at LGF.

Nothing new about any of this, Blair, you freaking brain-dead right wing moron. Try harder next time.

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504 comments
1 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Jun 4, 2010 11:57:04pm

"Tim Blair thinks..."

I believe you give him too much credit, sir.

2 Charles Johnson  Fri, Jun 4, 2010 11:58:33pm

re: #1 Slumbering Behemoth

"Tim Blair thinks..."

I believe you give him too much credit, sir.

I was being sarcastic.

3 Tigger2005  Fri, Jun 4, 2010 11:59:57pm

re: #1 Slumbering Behemoth

"Tim Blair thinks..."

I believe you give him too much credit, sir.

Heck, I think Charles now owes an apology to ignorant sluts!

4 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:00:06am

re: #2 Charles

You what part of this he's going to quote, right?

People have been leaving anti-Israel comments at LGF for many years.
5 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:00:34am

re: #4 JasonA

You know what part...
PIMF

6 Drogheda  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:02:24am

re: #3 Tigger2005

Did Dan ever apologize to Jane?

7 Fenris  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:02:39am

re: #5 JasonA

Tim Blair will take that to mean Charles has been leftist for many years. Or not.

8 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:04:58am

To repeat myself (to repeat myself):

And what, pray, is "leftish"?

Is it like "dwarfish" or "doltish" or even "foolish"?

Damn. I grew up with "isms" and had to shed them. And along comes Tim Blair and I now have to deal with "ishes"?

9 Kragar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:05:37am

I think Tim is most upset with Charles systemic banning of people who post comments like "PLEASE BAN ME!"

Diabolic.

10 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:05:53am

Viva Ackroyd!

11 BARACK THE VOTE  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:06:02am

I just think it's great that we now have a "Sluttiness" tag.

12 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:07:21am

What a hypocrite Tim Blair is. I just left a comment on his site and I get a message that it is held for moderation. He had all of 4 approved comments and censors everything posted yet has the nerve to hold you responsible for comments on a popular forum with thousands of comments.

13 Tigger2005  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:07:43am

Been an hour or more since last IDF Twitter update...

14 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:07:54am

Youtube commenters in GENERAL are a dire species, I can't imagine what youtube commenters griefing the IDF would be like

15 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:08:00am

re: #11 iceweasel

I just think it's great that we now have a "Sluttiness" tag.

Psst.

You're not mad at me from the other morning, are you?

16 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:08:31am

re: #11 iceweasel

I just think it's great that we now have a "Sluttiness" tag.

I could have used that one for our recent what-have you about the [redacted redacted] fair! :D

17 Kragar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:09:06am

re: #16 WindUpBird

I could have used that one for our recent what-have you about the [redacted redacted] fair! :D

The Ron Paul in chaps comments?

18 laZardo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:09:18am

Internet connection is ass when both of little brothers are torrenting AND trying to go wireless on my PS3. Fuck them.

Anyhoo, because Naso Tang asked about that editorial which stated that "Israel has displaced North Korea as the foremost rogue state," here it is.

19 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:10:07am

re: #17 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

The Ron Paul in chaps comments?

That...yes... but I was thinking about the thread in gene-OH GOD THE IMAGES ARE IN MY CEREBRAL CORTEX IT STINGS

20 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:10:08am

re: #14 WindUpBird

It's Ozark butt ugly, and there seems to be a team of pro-radical Islamists dedicated to flagging as inappropriate any thing that that remotely favors Israel or remotely criticizes radical islamists.

21 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:10:18am

re: #7 fenrisdesigns

Tim Blair will take that to mean Charles has been leftist for many years. Or not.

Then he can post at the Stalker Blog. Rodan and co. will welcome him with open arms.

22 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:11:05am

re: #11 iceweasel

I just think it's great that we now have a "Sluttiness" tag.

Hi, ice. You're up late.

23 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:11:39am

I just hope he takes this in the spirit in which it is intended.

24 laZardo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:11:52am

re: #7 fenrisdesigns

YOUR ICON IS FAMILIAR. O:

25 Targetpractice  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:12:06am

re: #17 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

The Ron Paul in chaps comments?

...*Goes to get the drill and brain bleach...again*

26 BARACK THE VOTE  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:12:32am

re: #16 WindUpBird

I could have used that one for our recent what-have you about the [redacted redacted] fair! :D

Heh. You and others made quick fodder of CapeCoddah once again on that, I saw.

re: #15 JasonA

Psst.

You're not mad at me from the other morning, are you?

Course not! :)

27 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:12:44am

re: #11 iceweasel

I just think it's great that we now have a "Sluttiness" tag.

That's the wonder of LGF Pages: you can write your own tags, such as "Shameless pandering by people who think Rachel Corrie was anything more than a deluded dupe".

I dedicated a song to you and Jimmah on the last thread but one, by the way.

To save you the trouble of paging back, here it is again:

Cheers!

28 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:14:22am

Well I passed the corporate censor, here is my comment on Tim Blair's blog:

That is an entirely false assertion Tim. Israel haters always appear to spew lies, and they get schooled. There has been no change in the strong pro Israel stance at LGF.

Why this need to make stuff up in order to slander the man? I am grateful for the work Charles is doing now to combat this “peace flotilla” demonisation of Israel and then I see your column. What a weird inversion of reality.
Bagua Sat 05 Jun 10 (04:58pm)

29 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:15:04am

re: #28 Bagua

Well I passed the corporate censor, here is my comment on Tim Blair's blog:

That is an entirely false assertion Tim. Israel haters always appear to spew lies, and they get schooled. There has been no change in the strong pro Israel stance at LGF.

Why this need to make stuff up in order to slander the man? I am grateful for the work Charles is doing now to combat this “peace flotilla” demonisation of Israel and then I see your column. What a weird inversion of reality.
Bagua Sat 05 Jun 10 (04:58pm)

Spot on!

30 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:17:03am

re: #26 iceweasel

Heh. You and others made quick fodder of CapeCoddah once again on that, I saw.

Not to diss CapeCoddah, but:

Breakfast foods get oddah and oddah;
'tis a wise child who knows his foddah.

Ogden Nash, I believe. Or maybe James Thurber.

31 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:17:04am

re: #28 Bagua

Any news from the gulf?

32 laZardo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:18:59am

re: #31 JasonA

Any news from the gulf?

It's too early to be optimistic.

33 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:19:45am

re: #31 JasonA

Any news from the gulf?

Any news from Gaza?

34 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:19:50am

re: #20 Slumbering Behemoth

For instance there is a lovely yet tragically sad poem that keeps getting mirrored because it keeps getting flagged as inappropriate.

Perhaps the content of the imagery is inappropriate for young viewers, but there also is a trend there of flagging things critical of radical or fundamentalist islam.

NSFW, just in case.

Sharia Law by Nessrriinn

35 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:20:25am

I've got to head to bed. Sleep well, All.

36 bluesky  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:20:32am

Johnson is one of the very few who exposes objectively the real Marmara story - from the beginning ; for example, he was one of the firsts to report the fact that Hamas declined to accept the "Humanitarian" aids sent on the Marmara.

37 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:20:48am

How do you fail to get yourself killed so much?

38 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:22:42am

re: #33 Cato the Elder

Any news from Gaza?

Nothing yet. Last was that they ignored the second warning/request. They're 40 miles out of Gaza.

A rocket was fired from Gaza into Western Negev. No damage or injuries.

39 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:23:10am

re: #37 JasonA

How do you fail to get yourself killed so much?

Fail, fail, fail.

The Islamists fail more than any other people on earth.

If he were to come and visit me, I would grant his greatest wish.

At the jaws of my dog.

40 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:24:48am

re: #39 Cato the Elder

Awww Haku looks too cute to kill.

Have I been deceived by his adorableness?

41 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:26:34am

re: #40 JasonA

It's the pretty ones you have to watch out for. You should know that by now, brother.

42 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:26:41am
43 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:27:21am

So how long before Charlie Crist just turns Dem? [Link: tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

Crist's campaign has signed up the firm of SKD Knickerbocker, with co-founder Josh Isay becoming Crist's lead media consultant. From the Crist campaign's press release: "SKD Knickerbocker is one of the nation's leading political consulting firms. Clients have included Democratic Senators, Governors and Mayors from across the country. The firm is also a leader in electing Independent candidates including Senator Joe Lieberman and NYC Mayor Mike Bloomberg. SKD Knickerbocker has worked on the campaigns of the last 4 Democratic Presidential nominees."

He was a great moderate Republican and they tossed him out. I'd be happy for him to become a great moderate Democrat 8-)

44 BARACK THE VOTE  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:28:15am

re: #22 Dark_Falcon

Hi, ice. You're up late.

Hey DF! Yep! Went to a midnight movie and I'm convincing Jimmah to stay up and watch the sunrise from a seekrit nyc location. How are you? I hope you're getting better!

re: #27 Cato the Elder


I dedicated a song to you and Jimmah on the last thread but one, by the way.

To save you the trouble of paging back, here it is again:


[Video]Cheers!

Cato! S'up, statesman?

45 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:28:17am

re: #42 Gus 802

OK they tried again...

Update: Rachel Corrie has rejected IDF Navy request to dock at Ashdod Port for 3rd time

It's all a game to them, isn't it?

46 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:29:41am

Paging Racer X.

This happens in Arizona. It does not happen in Portland. Thank you.

An Arizona elementary school mural featuring the faces of kids who attend the school has been the subject of constant daytime drive-by racist screaming, from adults, as well as a radio talk-show campaign (by an actual city councilman, who has an AM talk-radio show) to remove the black student's face, and now the school principal has ordered the faces of the Latino and Black students to be changed to Caucasian skin.

47 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:29:49am

re: #31 JasonA

Any news from the gulf?

Nothing dramatic. The Top Hat #4 is still perched atop the leaking BOP. The first 12 hours recovered 1,810 barrels, which is a rate of 3,620 bbl per day. The insertion tube averaged about 2,000 bbl/d, but dropped to around 1,300 bbl/d before it was abandoned.

Over the next 24 hours they will tweak it and see how high they can get it to flow. But it is still an uglyOilcano down there.

In the next week they will prep the two 3" connections they made for the mud injection and try to reverse them and flow oil and gas to the Q400. If this works they can increase the amount they are capturing.

48 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:29:55am

re: #45 JasonA

It's all a game to them, isn't it?

It shows how thick headed they are. Don't they realize that letting them go to Ashdod is a rather big concession for Israel?

49 Charles Johnson  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:29:57am

The Rachel Corrie is a much smaller ship. And there are only 11 leftists aboard, who said they're not going to resist if they're boarded. No shahids in this bunch.

50 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:30:42am

re: #42 Gus 802

It would seem they're hoping to orchestrate another PR incident and use it to heap more scorn upon Israel.

*spit*

51 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:30:56am

re: #40 JasonA

Awww Haku looks too cute to kill.

Have I been deceived by his adorableness?

He and I have been to the Middle East together, and he has this unfortunate tendency to rip the balls off people who chant "allahu ahkbar" and "itbah al yahud".

52 Charles Johnson  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:31:24am

re: #50 Slumbering Behemoth

Yes, it is another PR incident, but this one's very unlikely to turn violent.

53 mrbaracuda  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:31:45am

Hey, I think you're offending all the sluts out there. They have feelings, too.

/

54 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:33:05am

re: #44 iceweasel

Cato! S'up, statesman?

Still waiting for you guys to head down to Baltimore for the Last Affordable Crabs!

55 BARACK THE VOTE  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:33:35am

re: #46 WindUpBird

Paging Racer X.

This happens in Arizona. It does not happen in Portland. Thank you.

beekiller and I did pages on that earlier-- unbelievable.

56 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:33:40am

re: #52 Charles

I hope so, sincerely. For everyone's sake.

57 Sergeant Major  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:34:16am

Charles: I wouldn't worry to much about Mr. Blair he had a TOTAL of 5 people reply to his post one of them being Bagua... his following is minimal at best.

58 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:34:34am

Tim Blair, I challenge you to find a single anti-Israel thread topic. Topic, not comment(s). Have YOU had any anti-Israel comments at your blog? Do you have links at your blog to anyone who has posted anti-Israel comments or threads?
How about that RonPaul?
Pat Buchanan much?

Is your house single pane, or energy efficient, double paned?

?

59 Tigger2005  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:37:10am

Sigh. Quick exchange in a social chatroom about the blockade run attempt, some guy with the usual ignorant comments, "Jews that starve children" blah blah blah, I asked him if he cared about the Jewish children killed or maimed by Hamas rockets, "As much as the ones killed by tanks"

It's hopeless. It's not moral equivalency either. I think with a lot of people it used to be..."oh, it's a mess over there, all that tit-for-tat fighting" as if the violence perpetrated by the Palestinians on Israels was identical to the Israeli responses...but they weren't really paying any attention. But now the hatred for Israel is just palpable. You can feel it in every word they type. Ordinary middle-Americans, filled with hatred for Israel and support for their Dark Ages enemy, an enemy that danced and passed out sweets when 3,000 civilians were murdered in cold blood. It chills me to the bone.

60 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:37:24am

re: #49 Charles

The Rachel Corrie is a much smaller ship. And there are only 11 leftists aboard, who said they're not going to resist if they're boarded. No shahids in this bunch.

Yeah, that video was of the last bunch. Which means he was one of the nine.

Or he's failed to get himself three times now. If that's the case just give it up, dude. This martyr thing just isn't for you.

61 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:37:58am

re: #46 WindUpBird

Paging Racer X.

This happens in Arizona. It does not happen in Portland. Thank you.


I'm still sort of blown away by this one. These people are offended by pictures of children being black and Latino? They scream racist crap at these pictures? What the hell do they do when out in public and confronted with actual children being black and Latino? Scream at them and attempt to bleach them? What the hell is going on here?

62 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:39:49am

re: #45 JasonA

It's all a game to them, isn't it?

A game to bleed Israel. They can tie up naval assets, cause disruption and expense, cultivate bad publicity to a complicit media, and enjoy a much safer Jihad holiday than going after the Americans or the British who tend to use much more force.

The whole purpose of the ambush was to raise the stakes for Israel who must now always prepare for a violent attack. Thus they hope to gain photos of the Israelis looking more dangerous and hope there will be some over-reaction by Israel they can turn to propaganda.

Each attempt to breach the security blockade will now tie up more forces and cost more in men and materials. The jihad is now on yet another front.

63 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:39:58am

re: #55 iceweasel

beekiller and I did pages on that earlier-- unbelievable.

Racism in America.

My sister lives next door to a sweet guy with early-onset Parkinson's and his Guatemalan wife.

"Neighbors" have driven up and blocked their driveway while shouting "you don't belong here!" in her face.

America. Fuck you for your everyday hate.

Fuck you again, backwards and sideways, for the rest of you who say nothing when this goes on in your c***-assed suburbs.

If this is the best we can do, may this country drown, stifle, choke, croak, bugger itself with its lawnmowers.

64 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:41:37am

Little Green Footballs painted up as a haven for anti-Israelites;...uh,yeah, that's the ticket! It could happen!

...fail

65 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:43:02am

re: #64 swamprat

Little Green Footballs painted up as a haven for anti-Israelites;...uh,yeah, that's the ticket! It could happen!

The opposition desperately wants to see it happen.

Charles is annoying the bejaysus out of them by continuing to be a jolly old Zionist.

66 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:44:27am

re: #46 WindUpBird

Paging Racer X.

This happens in Arizona. It does not happen in Portland. Thank you.

An Arizona elementary school mural featuring the faces of kids who attend the school has been the subject of constant daytime drive-by racist screaming, from adults, as well as a radio talk-show campaign (by an actual city councilman, who has an AM talk-radio show) to remove the black student's face, and now the school principal has ordered the faces of the Latino and Black students to be changed to Caucasian skin.

re: #61 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm still sort of blown away by this one. These people are offended by pictures of children being black and Latino? They scream racist crap at these pictures? What the hell do they do when out in public and confronted with actual children being black and Latino? Scream at them and attempt to bleach them? What the hell is going on here?

There ought to be a super extra special upding button for these posts.

67 Sergeant Major  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:45:13am

It's funny he refers to us a bad lizards....he gets referred to as an ignorant slut....I kinda of feel shafted.

68 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:45:22am

re: #66 Nimed

There ought to be a super extra special upding button for these posts.

I'd be pulling my kid out of that school pronto.

69 Tigger2005  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:45:54am

re: #46 WindUpBird

Paging Racer X.

This happens in Arizona. It does not happen in Portland. Thank you.

Good article, which I will be sharing on Facebook. I only wish HuffPo would show the same common sense and decency towards Israel, instead of supporting the haters and bigots who wish to destroy her, and acting like they have an important viewpoint that should be heard.

70 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:46:36am

I'd love to see see a thread on this school business. What a bleeping stupid thing.

71 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:47:16am

re: #61 SanFranciscoZionist

Ye gads that is bright-fucking ugly. Can that be real? I have a hard time processing what mentality that sort of can come from.

72 bluesky  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:47:53am

re: #49 Charles

... I heard 15 on the Israeli Radio, they declared war on Israel (they wouldn't stop), and yet apparently non violent

73 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:48:48am

re: #70 SanFranciscoZionist

I'd love to see see a thread on this school business. What a bleeping stupid thing.

"Bleeping?"

Z, if you can't cuss on LGF at 3:48 AM EDT, where can you cuss? :)

74 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:50:26am

re: #71 Slumbering Behemoth

Ye gads that is bright-fucking ugly. Can that be real? I have a hard time processing what mentality that sort of can come from.

It's been very widely reported on. Here's the Boston Herald.

75 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:50:44am

re: #61 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm still sort of blown away by this one. These people are offended by pictures of children being black and Latino? They scream racist crap at these pictures? What the hell do they do when out in public and confronted with actual children being black and Latino? Scream at them and attempt to bleach them? What the hell is going on here?

I have no idea, but it's blowing my mind.

Parts of Arizona seem to be going crazy.

76 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:50:52am

28 Miles off shore...

77 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:51:15am

re: #73 JasonA

"Bleeping?"

Z, if you can't cuss on LGF at 3:48 AM EDT, where can you cuss? :)

You may have noticed that I go the gamut from 'goshdarnit' to 'clusterfuck', depending entirely on my mood.

79 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:51:56am

re: #77 SanFranciscoZionist

You may have noticed that I go the gamut from 'goshdarnit' to 'clusterfuck', depending entirely on my mood.

I know. It's adorable. :)

80 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:52:50am

re: #75 WindUpBird

I have no idea, but it's blowing my mind.

Parts of Arizona seem to be going crazy.

The crap the radio dude is spouting is beyond belief. Somehow, this picture of a child is forcing 'diversity' on people.

It's all part of a plot to make us think there are supposed to be black people in America!!!!

81 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:53:13am

re: #79 JasonA

I know. It's adorable. :)

Why, thank you.

82 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:53:30am

re: #68 SanFranciscoZionist

I'd be pulling my kid out of that school pronto.

it's the highest ethnic mix of any school in that town.

So of course it's the target. Imagine if you're a black or hispanic family with a kid in that school.

Listen to this fucking subhuman anus of a city councilman:

City Councilman Steve Blair spearheaded a public campaign on his talk show at Prescott radio station KYCA-AM (1490) to remove the mural.

In a broadcast last month, according to the Daily Courier in Prescott, Blair mistakenly complained that the most prominent child in the painting is African-American, saying: "To depict the biggest picture on the building as a Black person, I would have to ask the question: Why?"

Read more: [Link: www.azcentral.com...]


What

theballs

83 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:53:58am

Time for me to skedaddle. Don't do anything I wouldn't do.

84 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:55:11am

re: #80 SanFranciscoZionist

The crap the radio dude is spouting is beyond belief. Somehow, this picture of a child is forcing 'diversity' on people.

It's all part of a plot to make us think there are supposed to be black people in America!!!

I wonder about that state. I wonder if something unthinkable will happen there soon. The evil is gaining steam. I keep hearing more and more freaky anecdotes from friends who used to live tin AZ, who have family there. it gives me the creeps.

85 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:55:23am

re: #76 JasonA

28 Miles off shore...

That's very close: about the distance of Santa Catalina Island from Santa Monica.

86 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:56:02am

re: #82 WindUpBird


What

theballs

Revealing, isn't it? In his mind, it's unnatural to make the black kid the center of the painting, so it can only signify some sinister agenda. (To make people think black children are normal or something?)

Teachers like me, we force this agenda of diversity, and people being different colors and stuff, on Real Americans.

87 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:56:13am

re: #82 WindUpBird


What

theballs

I see a radio licensing issue in the near future.

88 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:57:27am

re: #78 Gus 802

Update: The Rachel Corrie is now ~28 miles from shore, have rejected 3 requests from IDF navy to dock @ Ashdod Port

They started out from Cyprus early in the week. It's 100 miles from there to Gaza. What have they been doing the whole time?

Wandering like Ulysses?

Balling each other in the name of international revolution?

Hoping Israel would just forget about it all?

Bring it, bitches.

89 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:58:06am

re: #84 WindUpBird

I wonder about that state. I wonder if something unthinkable will happen there soon. The evil is gaining steam. I keep hearing more and more freaky anecdotes from friends who used to live tin AZ, who have family there. it gives me the creeps.

They seem to have a bad case of something going on. Nativitis, paranoia, perpetual outrage. I don't know. Maybe it's just that the spotlight is on them at the moment, but they do seem to be going through something, and it's not pretty.

90 Tigger2005  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:58:13am

re: #88 Cato the Elder

They started out from Cyprus early in the week. It's 100 miles from there to Gaza. What have they been doing the whole time?

Wandering like Ulysses?

Balling each other in the name of international revolution?

Hoping Israel would just forget about it all?

Bring it, bitches.

I vote for (2)

91 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:58:26am

re: #86 SanFranciscoZionist

Revealing, isn't it? In his mind, it's unnatural to make the black kid the center of the painting, so it can only signify some sinister agenda. (To make people think black children are normal or something?)

Teachers like me, we force this agenda of diversity, and people being different colors and stuff, on Real Americans.

We have agendas, you see!

92 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:58:57am

re: #88 Cato the Elder

They started out from Cyprus early in the week. It's 100 miles from there to Gaza. What have they been doing the whole time?

Wandering like Ulysses?

Balling each other in the name of international revolution?

Hoping Israel would just forget about it all?

Bring it, bitches.

I think they were floating around Malta for a while. That MV Rachel Corrie is a rust bucket. OK, a painted rust bucket.

93 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:59:24am

re: #63 Cato the Elder

Now hold a moment. Back in the day, before I was born and my grandpa was still a youngish man, a Chinese family was moving into the well-to-do suburbs he lived in. Some in the neighborhood started a campaign to keep 'them' out.

When approached, my grandpa was one of several to say "If they can afford to live here, they deserve to live here. Take your nonsense elsewhere."

In that spirit, I say: America. Thank you for your everyday hospitality.

I know it ain't perfect, but it does keep getting better. Every day.

94 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:59:43am

re: #88 Cato the Elder


Wandering like Ulysses?

"Whose idea was it to give every nut an island?"

95 Cheeseland  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:00:04am

re: #88 Cato the Elder

They started out from Cyprus early in the week. It's 100 miles from there to Gaza. What have they been doing the whole time?

Wandering like Ulysses?

Balling each other in the name of international revolution?

Hoping Israel would just forget about it all?

Bring it, bitches.

They may have forgotten to bring oars. It was not on the list.

96 Kragar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:00:38am

re: #88 Cato the Elder

They started out from Cyprus early in the week. It's 100 miles from there to Gaza. What have they been doing the whole time?

Wandering like Ulysses?

Balling each other in the name of international revolution?

Hoping Israel would just forget about it all?

Bring it, bitches.

Blunder incompetently in a wreck of a ship they probably barely know how to operate?

97 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:01:11am

re: #95 Cheeseland

They may have forgotten to bring oars. It was not on the list.

They followed friendly dolphins who ran them aground. They forgot to check the wondrous creature for the IDF badges and transmitters.

//

98 Targetpractice  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:01:44am

re: #88 Cato the Elder

They started out from Cyprus early in the week. It's 100 miles from there to Gaza. What have they been doing the whole time?

Wandering like Ulysses?

Balling each other in the name of international revolution?

Hoping Israel would just forget about it all?

Bring it, bitches.

IIRC, supposedly they put in dock for a few days to install all sorts of video and Sat-Com equipment so as to have crystal-clear footage of...I'm guessing being led like sheep to Ashdod after the Israelis take the boat, because if the Israelis get a hint that this is gonna be another Mavi Marmara, they'll skip the paintball guns.

99 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:01:50am

re: #46 WindUpBird

Paging Racer X.

This happens in Arizona. It does not happen in Portland. Thank you.

Portland yes. But Oregon?

Vancouver's Volksfront


Local members of Volksfront, a Portland based white-supremacy and neo-Nazi organization, have found an ambitious leader in Jeffery (an alias). Jeffery is a 32-year-old, recently unemployed construction worker and native Vancouver resident. He describes himself as being a serious contender in the current fight to become Volksfront’s next undisputed führer.

White supremacist guilty of sending noose to leader of Lima NAACP

In the aftermath of a police-involved shooting that led to racial upheaval in Lima, Ohio, a self-proclaimed white supremacist living several states away sent racially charged flyers to the Ohio community's black population and a noose to a local community activist, federal prosecutors said Monday.

Daniel Lee Jones, 33, of Portland, Ore., pleaded guilty in U.S. District Court Monday to mailing threatening communications. As part of the plea agreement, one count of interfering with civil rights will be dismissed.

That's just two I found in about 120 seconds.

100 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:02:21am

The ship might scuttle itself. I don't see anything good coming. I hope I am wrong.

101 Cheeseland  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:03:13am

re: #100 swamprat

The ship might scuttle itself. I don't see anything good coming. I hope I am wrong.

This is my fear.

102 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:03:42am

re: #99 Gus 802

That's just two I found in about 120 seconds.

I think I would argue that both of those cases, without saying they're not terrible, are more a case of fringe white supremacists, and less a case of seemingly normal people in a community forcing a school to do something totally ludicrous.

103 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:04:23am

Ships don't scuttle themselves. They are scuttled.

104 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:05:24am

re: #74 SanFranciscoZionist

JFC! I just can't wrap my head around that kind of thing. Disgusting.

re: #46 WindUpBird

Help me out here WUB. Why call out RacerX with this post? What does he have to do with this story?

105 Cheeseland  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:05:36am

re: #103 ryannon

Ships don't scuttle themselves. They are scuttled.

I take it swamprat meant the crew might scuttle the ship and make the IDF take the blame.

106 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:06:03am

re: #99 Gus 802

That's just two I found in about 120 seconds.

First of all, Vancouver is in Washington, not Oregon! It's very close to Oregon, but it is not Oregon :D

And of course there's creepshow racists in the area. Why, according to this, at least 20!

At a private meeting in Vancouver, approximately 20, patch wearing and tattooed members of Volksfront voiced support for Jeffery’s growing influence in the underground white supremacy movement.

But what there are not are city councilmen racists with radio shows egging this stuff on, peppering schools with mainstreamed racism, filling the airwaves with it.

107 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:07:21am

re: #102 SanFranciscoZionist

I think I would argue that both of those cases, without saying they're not terrible, are more a case of fringe white supremacists, and less a case of seemingly normal people in a community forcing a school to do something totally ludicrous.

There's 20 guys in a white supremacist movement in the Couv! Stop the presses! Totally equivalent!


double quoted for emphasis:

a case of seemingly normal people in a community forcing a school to do something totally ludicrous.

THAT is what I say doesn't happen in Oregon. We don't allow these people to win.

108 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:07:37am

re: #106 WindUpBird

Whatever.

109 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:07:49am

re: #105 Cheeseland

I take it swamprat meant the crew might scuttle the ship and make the IDF take the blame.

Normally, it would be the captain's decision.

110 Targetpractice  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:08:22am

re: #100 swamprat

The ship might scuttle itself. I don't see anything good coming. I hope I am wrong.

Nah, I figure these lemmings are more likely to run aground and hope Hamas will be there to cover their asses.

111 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:08:29am

19 year old "leaders".


During the murder trial, prosecutors argued that 19-year-old Kurtis Monschke, alleged leader of a Washington chapter of Volksfront, coordinated the crime to increase his standing among senior Volksfront leaders.

a far cry from broadcasters with political influence...

112 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:09:20am

re: #93 Slumbering Behemoth

Now hold a moment. Back in the day, before I was born and my grandpa was still a youngish man, a Chinese family was moving into the well-to-do suburbs he lived in. Some in the neighborhood started a campaign to keep 'them' out.

When approached, my grandpa was one of several to say "If they can afford to live here, they deserve to live here. Take your nonsense elsewhere."

In that spirit, I say: America. Thank you for your everyday hospitality.

I know it ain't perfect, but it does keep getting better. Every day.

Fine, but in this day and age, in a diddly-squat poor man's suburb like where my sister lives, with pitiful little pissant yards that take about fifteen minutes to mow, full of people who still haven't scraped the dirt out from under their white-ass fingernails, who expects that kind of racism and general shitheadedness towards a woman from Central America whose husband is physically disabled, for fuck's sake?

113 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:10:46am

They should practically be in sight of the Gaza coast by now. Once the population goes out in smaller vessels to meet and greet, it's going to be all over for the IDF.

114 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:11:10am

re: #109 ryannon

Normally, it would be the captain's decision.

How many have already died from this nightmare? They are up to something.

115 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:11:16am

re: #108 Gus 802

Dude, if anything, this article proves the opposite, that they're weak, with no centralized leadership.

Another quote.

According to Blazak, since Krager left Oregon, “Volksfront lacks a charismatic leader” able to unite the Volksfront organization. “There are competing factions claiming to be the heir of the Volksfront leadership, some more violent than others,” Blazak stated.

I'm not sure why the pushback. Are you trying to draw some sort of equivalency between some fringe weirdos Oregon and this rising mainstreamed nativist tide in Arizona? There's no there-there.

116 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:12:16am

The Israelis just might blink first.

117 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:12:43am

re: #115 WindUpBird

Dude, if anything, this article proves the opposite, that they're weak, with no centralized leadership.

Another quote.

I'm not sure why the pushback. Are you trying to draw some sort of equivalency between some fringe weirdos Oregon and this rising mainstreamed nativist tide in Arizona? There's no there-there.

There's no hyphen in "there's no there there", either.

118 Tigger2005  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:14:09am

re: #116 ryannon

The Israelis just might blink first.

And the message will again be sent...terror works.

119 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:14:18am

re: #112 Cato the Elder

...who expects that kind of racism and general shitheadedness towards a woman from Central America whose husband is physically disabled, for fuck's sake?

Not many, because it has been falling out of favor for a long time now. But that doesn't mean it's not gone, and we still have a long way to go 'til perfect.

My sympathies to your sister's neighbors. This is supposed to be the melting pot, and I find such attitudes un-American.

120 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:14:26am

re: #115 WindUpBird

WUB. Don't feel like talking about this with you right now.

I lived seeing plenty of racism with my family in New York, and Long Island. It included being called "sp*cs" and "W*Ps" and once having our house surrounded by 2 dozen youths that pelted our roof with rocks as they yelled out "sp*cs."

Anyway, I'm busy.

121 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:15:13am

re: #112 Cato the Elder Say something to them. It is risky, but without anyone standing up, this will continue.

122 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:16:29am

re: #115 WindUpBird

Again I ask you to help me out here. Why call out RacerX in your original post? What does he have to do with that article you linked?

123 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:17:44am

re: #119 Slumbering Behemoth

But that doesn't mean it's not gone...

PIMMFF!

Damnit!

124 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:18:03am

re: #121 swamprat

Say something to them. It is risky, but without anyone standing up, this will continue.

My sis just told me about it yesterday. I've only recently started to go mow her lawn and do other things for her, since her knees went bad.

Believe me, if I witness that shit, there will be articles in the paper about it.

125 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:19:27am

re: #124 Cato the Elder

I really hesitated about my post. I don't want to get you killed.

126 Targetpractice  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:22:08am

Well folks, I need at least a few hours sleep, so I'm headin' off. BBL

127 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:22:30am

re: #125 swamprat

I really hesitated about my post. I don't want to get you killed.

No worry. The sort of people who feel free to diss a disabled man's foreign wife to her face are not to be feared by the likes of me.

128 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:22:54am

For an event that the whole world (figuratively speaking) is following, there's an eerie silence. The calm before the storm or peaceful negotiations?

129 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:22:58am

Goodnight everyone.

Up yours, tim blair.

131 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:28:23am

re: #128 ryannon

For an event that the whole world (figuratively speaking) is following, there's an eerie silence. The calm before the storm or peaceful negotiations?

Well.

It seems to me, if you'll pardon the analogy, that the "Rachel Corrie" is well-named.

"If I keep on dodging around so I can't see the bulldozer driver, then he can't see me, so I'm safe."

Huh?

Sooner or later, the ships must come to grips.

Right now the "Corrie" is playing for time, and Israel has all the time in the world.

I say, run 'em around the Med until they have to eat the stale crackers that the good people of Ireland donated to the starving Gazans.

132 EdDantes  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:31:11am

I love a reference to the original S&L cast.

134 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:43:18am
135 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:43:26am

Alas Captain, there a ship at sea...

136 Kragar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:46:36am

No justification for force, says Martin

IRISH WARNING: THERE CAN be no justification for the use of force against anyone on board the Irish-owned aid ship headed for Gaza, Minister for Foreign Affairs Micheál Martin said last night.

The minister was speaking after it emerged that those travelling on the MV Rachel Corrie had rejected a proposal drawn up by the Israeli and Irish governments whereby the vessel would have agreed to be diverted to the Israeli port of Ashdod. He noted that those on board the ship had indicated they were willing to accept inspection of their cargo at sea before docking in Gaza, but the Israeli government was adamant it would not allow any breach of its naval blockade of the territory.

Well, no justification other than an international treaty governing blockades.

97. A blockade may be enforced and maintained by a combination of legitimate methods and means of warfare provided this combination does not result in acts inconsistent with the rules set out in this document.

98. Merchant vessels believed on reasonable grounds to be breaching a blockade may be captured. Merchant vessels which, after prior warning, clearly resist capture may be attacked.

Funny how the rules are only enforced or ignored when it would hurt Israel.

137 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:47:33am

re: #136 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

No justification for force, says Martin

Funny how the rules are only enforced or ignored when it would hurt Israel.

Turkey
Ireland

138 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:50:21am

re: #132 EdDantes

I love a reference to the original S&L cast.

What is "S&L"? Savings and Loan? That was a different cast of characters.

139 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:51:35am

This is turning into a made for Jihadi TV movie.

140 EdDantes  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:51:56am

re: #138 Cato the Elder

Yes, I meant SNL.

142 abaleh  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:57:24am
143 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:58:14am

re: #142 abaleh

Who's Motor Vessel Linda?

That was the previous name of the MV Rachel Corrie.

144 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:02:04am

I don't know if one escapes madness in the name of genius, or if genius leads to madness. Either way, I have poop on my shoe.:)

146 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:05:30am

re: #143 Gus 802

The naming of that boat. I find it more to be a more disgusting, cynical exploitation than the Nickname That Shall Not Be Named.

147 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:06:52am

re: #145 abaleh

According to @freegazaorg:
The Rachel Corrie has been forcibly seized by the Israeli navy and is being towed to Ashdod. All on board are reported safe. From Perdana

They're either confused or lying. Just watched an AJ report and they basically repeated the same news that IDF put out. It's still underway heading towards Gaza.

148 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:07:16am

re: #120 Gus 802

Hey man, I'm very sorry about the crap you went through with those fuckers.

149 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:09:00am

re: #148 Nimed

Hey man, I'm very sorry about the crap you went through with those fuckers.

Thanks Nimed. Used to bother me for a few years afterwards. Doesn't really bother me now. Times have changed for the better but that's just from my own personal experience.

150 SoSo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:09:33am

IDF, aka Navy has boats around the Irish ship cut its comm. off with high tech. . Now they will force a line to the ship and force tow it to port and inspect put the crew on shore take the cargo to Gaza themselfs if it is just concrete. About 20 min ago.

151 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:09:57am

re: #146 Slumbering Behemoth

I find it more to be a more

Fer fuck's sake. I am tapping out. Later Lizards.

152 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:17:14am

"Peace activists" my ass.

153 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:23:40am

Israeli Navy Contacts 7th Flotilla Ship Attempting to Break Gaza Maritime Closure

Already posted but if you have a Youtube account go there and give it a thumbs up.

154 Varek Raith  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:25:57am

Damn!
Charles pwned Blair!
Awesome.

155 swamprat  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:27:29am

What a shame that Israel has Palestine completely surrounded and won't let them come and go as they please because Israel has ....Egypt? Palestine has a border with Egypt? So Egypt won't let them through? Egypt won't let them immigrate?
Egypt won't let Palestinians go across the Egyptian border? But only Israel is the jailer! Only Israel is the oppressor! Egypt isn't Jewish! Egypt can't be the ones holding Palestine hostage! The media would tell us if it wasn't so!

156 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:30:22am

An example of the sort of treatment Israel gets from the UK media. Here is Jon Snow of Channel 4.

157 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:35:36am

re: #156 Bagua

re: #156 Bagua

fucking assholes.

158 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:36:21am

re: #157 Cannadian Club Akbar

re: #156 Bagua

fucking assholes.

Ditto. Fuck Jon Snow.

159 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:38:08am

Ya know, it's alll the Jews fault. No one else can be at fault. MFer....

160 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:38:58am

re: #159 Cannadian Club Akbar

Ya know, it's alll the Jews fault. No one else can be at fault. MFer...

Did you notice how he said "you can't be trusted"? That's the dog whistle.

161 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:39:03am

Man people are up late!

Gimme something to yell at, I had a very irritating boardgame night.

162 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:40:54am

re: #161 windsagio

Man people are up late!

Gimme something to yell at, I had a very irritating boardgame night.

Hey dude. Feel free to yell at me. :)

I don't want you to re-live your traumatic experience, but which board game was that?

163 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:41:23am

re: #161 windsagio

Man people are up late!

Gimme something to yell at, I had a very irritating boardgame night.

Yelling is the only exercise some people ever get..
/

164 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:41:29am

# IDF soldiers boarded the Rachel Corrie with permission by sea, no helicopters used less than a minute ago via web


The crew of the Rachel Corrie has permitted IDF soldiers to board 2 minutes ago via web

165 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:42:16am

They're in. Looks like maybe this can get resolved and the boobs can go to Ashdod.

166 abaleh  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:42:30am

re: #156 Bagua

An example of the sort of treatment Israel gets from the UK media. Here is Jon Snow of Channel 4.

[Video]

Well, I'm sure if we just let them have the Sudetenland Gaza Strip they'll be content and go about their peaceful ways.

167 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:42:53am

re: #162 Nimed

We were playing Antike, and it may or may not have lost me the game. It certainly made me irritated for the rest of it :p

What actually happened is too hard to explain unless you know the rules.

168 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:43:10am

Out for a spell...

169 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:46:23am

so yeah, since I'm angry and bored, anybody wanna see me make my icon something brutally offensive for about 5 minutes?

(Yet non pornographic!)

170 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:47:54am

re: #169 windsagio

so yeah, since I'm angry and bored, anybody wanna see me make my icon something brutally offensive for about 5 minutes?

(Yet non pornographic!)

Stay on Target....

171 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:48:39am

re: #160 Gus 802

Did you notice how he said "you can't be trusted"? That's the dog whistle.

This sort of relentless demonisation by the vile media directly encourages freak shows like The Rachel Corrie.

172 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:51:42am

re: #171 Bagua

This sort of relentless demonisation by the vile media directly encourages freak shows like The Rachel Corrie.

They're clueless. They have no concept of the long term strategic implications of this will be with regards to Iran and the ME. Again, they're playing PC games even though in the long run it will be a detriment to an enlightened civilization.

173 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:52:06am

re: #171 Bagua

Complaining about demonizing something while demonizing something!

Brilliantly postmodern!

174 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:52:15am

re: #169 windsagio

so yeah, since I'm angry and bored, anybody wanna see me make my icon something brutally offensive for about 5 minutes?

(Yet non pornographic!)

Let's see it!

175 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:52:44am

re: #173 windsagio

Complaining about demonizing something while demonizing something!

Brilliantly postmodern!

Be quiet troll.

177 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:53:44am

re: #174 Nimed

I kinda wimped out, Its really really offensive.


But... you have 30 seconds starting now to see it.

178 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:53:59am

I put it up on the LGF Pages but apparently it's over.

The MV Linda is going to Ashdod per IDF navy direction.

179 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:54:34am

123456789101112131415161718192021222324252627282930

too late!

180 Varek Raith  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:54:43am

re: #177 windsagio

I kinda wimped out, Its really really offensive.

But... you have 30 seconds starting now to see it.

PFFTTTT, you call that "offensive"???
Pansy.
:)

181 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:55:31am

re: #180 Varek Raith


the bonus is nobody will ever know what we're talking about...

Well, except I showed WUB :D

182 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:56:05am

re: #179 windsagio

12345678910111213141516171819202122232425262728293 0

too late!

An impressionist painting depicting a cat?

How is that offensive? O_O

183 Varek Raith  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:56:27am

re: #182 Nimed

An impressionist painting depicting a cat?

How is that offensive? O_O

You missed it.
:P

184 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:56:29am

re: #182 Nimed

thats the new one, you missed it!

And its not a cat!

185 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:57:08am

re: #182 Nimed

if you could PM on LGF I'd totally send you the link >>

186 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:57:36am

re: #184 windsagio

thats the new one, you missed it!

And its not a cat!

No fair! I didn't refresh my page. I'm doing other stuff in the intertubes. Very important stuff!!

So what was it?

187 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:57:40am

re: #172 Gus 802

They're clueless. They have no concept of the long term strategic implications of this will be with regards to Iran and the ME. Again, they're playing PC games even though in the long run it will be a detriment to an enlightened civilization.

We chronicle enlightened civilization going down the crapper every day here on LGF, and our focus is on only a small part of the larger picture. I'm not very optimistic about the future of it all, at all.

188 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:59:05am

re: #175 Bagua

Be quiet troll.

Hey, that's funny! As long as it's not me.

189 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:59:25am

re: #184 windsagio

thats the new one, you missed it!

And its not a cat!

Whaddya mean "it's not a cat"?

190 Varek Raith  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:59:27am

re: #184 windsagio

thats the new one, you missed it!

And its not a cat!

191 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:59:47am

re: #187 ryannon

We chronicle enlightened civilization going down the crapper every day here on LGF, and our focus is on only a small part of the larger picture. I'm not very optimistic about the future of it all, at all.

Yeah. When I was young the future of mankind would keep me up at night. I'm much older now and since I don't have children I don't tend to let it bother me. The reason being of course because I'm not optimistic in. Especially in times like these.

192 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:00:46am

re: #189 Nimed

I put up a bigger one. Its a kid wearing a mask :D

The old one represented violence.

If bagua wasn't around and still pisst at me, I'd put it up again. The problem is, if he catches something he can nail me with he totally will ;)

193 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:01:15am

re: #190 Varek Raith

The further hint is "When is a nut-shot not a nut-shot?"

194 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:01:23am

re: #190 Varek Raith

[Video]

LOL! THESQUIRLSATTHEEND!

195 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:01:46am

Israel: 2
Moonbats: 0

196 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:01:51am

re: #194 Nimed

Robot chicken is genius :D

197 Varek Raith  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:02:55am

re: #195 Gus 802

Israel: 2
Moonbats: 0

Anymore failboats fixin' to break the blockade?

198 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:03:19am

re: #192 windsagio

I put up a bigger one. Its a kid wearing a mask :D

The old one represented violence.

If bagua wasn't around and still pisst at me, I'd put it up again. The problem is, if he catches something he can nail me with he totally will ;)

Stop trolling for attention, so you posted a drawing of a crotch. Oooh, edgy. Aren't you the cool one.

199 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:03:34am

re: #197 Varek Raith

Presuming nobody got shot this time, I'd reckon they're done.

200 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:03:59am

re: #198 Bagua

That's not what it was quite :D


C'mon we were friends last night!

201 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:04:00am

re: #187 ryannon

We chronicle enlightened civilization going down the crapper every day here on LGF, and our focus is on only a small part of the larger picture. I'm not very optimistic about the future of it all, at all.

In 1945 The world laid in smoking ruins, 54 million people were dead, 6 million jews Murdered and we had just dropped 2 atomic bombs...
America rebuilt the world....
So how hard is the road ahead? Not as bad as it was prior...
I have great faith in America

202 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:04:16am

re: #197 Varek Raith

Anymore failboats fixin' to break the blockade?

None that I heard of but probably. I get the feeling they're going to keep switching countries. So far the managed to use Turkey, and more recently Ireland. It's a tactic of sorts.

203 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:04:31am

re: #200 windsagio

That's not what it was quite :D

C'mon we were friends last night!

Then don't be a prick tonight.

204 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:05:16am

re: #203 Bagua

Now now :P

Everybody here is smilin' and having fun in the conversation I"m seeing :D

205 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:05:27am

Time for me to post something offensive:

206 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:05:29am

re: #203 Bagua

I just like teasing Nimed ;)

207 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:06:08am

Guys

do NOT make me start taking webcam photos of my cats

I am serious

208 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:06:21am

re: #204 windsagio

Now now :P

Everybody here is smilin' and having fun in the conversation I"m seeing :D

Tee hee, giggle giggle. Everybody look at Windy ~~

209 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:07:26am

re: #208 Bagua

Tee hee, giggle giggle. Everybody look at Windy ~~

Jesus. What's up with you? If you don't like it, ignore it.

210 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:07:36am

re: #208 Bagua

Ok seriously bagua, whats your major malfunction?

Nobody's being dickish in here but you.

211 Varek Raith  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:10:04am

KITTEH, DON'T WALK ON MY KEYBOARD!
:)

212 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:10:33am

re: #210 windsagio

Anyway, that Sarah Silverman clip is genius. And there lots more where that came from...

213 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:10:38am

Anyways, why are you'all up?

Just night-owls?

214 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:11:08am

re: #212 Nimed

Oh I didn't see that, holdon :D

215 Varek Raith  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:11:33am

Sigh.
BBL.
Kitteh is getting into trouble.

216 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:11:48am

re: #215 Varek Raith

noooo!

217 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:13:01am

re: #212 Nimed

Ok yeah, her dress is totally awesome to me, that's hte main thing I get out of that video :p

218 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:13:12am

re: #210 windsagio

Ok seriously bagua, whats your major malfunction?

Nobody's being dickish in here but you.

Right, and your little post claiming I was "Complaining about demonizing something while demonizing something! Brilliantly postmodern!" was not "dickish"?

You start up and then you play the victim.

219 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:13:15am

re: #215 Varek Raith

Sigh.
BBL.
Kitteh is getting into trouble.

All cats are just tendrils of the one great OverCat

220 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:13:31am

re: #213 windsagio

Anyways, why are you'all up?

Just night-owls?

Finishing some simulations for Monday. But I'm reaching my limit, so I'm going to bed right in a few minutes...

221 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:13:39am

re: #219 WindUpBird

Like Shuma-Gorath!

222 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:14:21am

re: #221 windsagio

223 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:21:03am

re: #217 windsagio

Ok yeah, her dress is totally awesome to me, that's hte main thing I get out of that video :p

:D
The lyrics aren't your cuppa tea? They're a bit strong...

224 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:22:03am

re: #191 Gus 802

Yeah. When I was young the future of mankind would keep me up at night. I'm much older now and since I don't have children I don't tend to let it bother me. The reason being of course because I'm not optimistic in. Especially in times like these.

Ain't it the truth.

Talk about the best of times and the worst of times. So much good being done at the same time that an unprecedented tsunami of darkness, obscurantism, denial and lies sweeps the world. It's an epic struggle, and it's happening right here in front of us. Thus the importance of every individual doing what he or she can to try and affect the outcome.

225 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:24:07am

re: #201 HoosierHoops

In 1945 The world laid in smoking ruins, 54 million people were dead, 6 million jews Murdered and we had just dropped 2 atomic bombs...
America rebuilt the world...
So how hard is the road ahead? Not as bad as it was prior...
I have great faith in America

I do too Hoops - as well as faith in men of good will everywhere on the planet. But we're not at the end here; I fear that's it's just the beginning, and that the outcome is less than certain.

226 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:24:16am

re: #223 Nimed

They're not to any point but their own offensiveness >>

227 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:26:11am

re: #218 Bagua

Right, and your little post claiming I was "Complaining about demonizing something while demonizing something! Brilliantly postmodern!" was not "dickish"?

You start up and then you play the victim.

You guys are the like the fucking Road Runner and the Coyote, with each of you playing both roles!

228 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:26:49am

re: #227 ryannon

You guys are the like the fucking Road Runner and the Coyote, with each of you playing both roles!

We're good at what we do.

229 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:27:14am

re: #228 Bagua

I can't quit you.

Not when you say things like that!

230 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:28:51am

re: #226 windsagio

They're not to any point but their own offensiveness >>

Yeah... the Silverman shtick is playing a petty character that concentrates all the stereotypes of American society.

Plenty of people don't like it/find it offensive.

231 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:31:43am

Boy..Paul McCartney sure stepped in it by the cheap shot on Bush at the WH..
No class at all..
Next thing you know he'll be saying he is more popular than Jesus or something....The 60's were hard on him

232 Nimed  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:33:41am

Alright people, time for me to go. Have a good night.

233 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:33:42am

re: #231 HoosierHoops

Boy..Paul McCartney sure stepped in it by the cheap shot on Bush at the WH..
No class at all..
Next thing you know he'll be saying he is more popular than Jesus or something...The 60's were hard on him

Screw him. Hey, but at least the UK finally got rid of that idiot Gordon Brown and the epic failure of the Labour party has finally lost a great deal of power.

234 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:35:17am

re: #232 Nimed

Peaces!

235 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:35:36am

re: #232 Nimed

Alright people, time for me to go. Have a good night.

Good night? Good Night? it's 0630... I'm going swimming in an hour.. Good Night?
/

236 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:35:38am

re: #231 HoosierHoops

Boy..Paul McCartney sure stepped in it by the cheap shot on Bush at the WH..
No class at all..
Next thing you know he'll be saying he is more popular than Jesus or something...The 60's were hard on him

I lost a lot of respect for him. Laura Bush was librarian and there is the Laura Bush 21st Century Librarian Program.

237 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:35:45am

re: #227 ryannon

Speaking of which:

238 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:40:53am

re: #236 Bagua

I lost a lot of respect for him. Laura Bush was librarian and there is the Laura Bush 21st Century Librarian Program.

What do you expect from a bubble gum musician. He was good with the Beatles but started going down hill midway through his stint with Wings. Later he became this bland namby-pamby VH-1 musician that could never stop playing silly love songs. Plus that whole BS with his ex-wife and that divorce. He's right up there with The Monkees now.

240 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:43:06am
241 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:43:19am

re: #233 Gus 802

Screw him. Hey, but at least the UK finally got rid of that idiot Gordon Brown and the epic failure of the Labour party has finally lost a great deal of power.

Unfortunately the replacements are cut from the same cloth.

The Foreign Secretary William Hague has called on the Government of Israel to open all crossings for aid to enter Gaza and deplored the loss of life during the interception of the Gaza Flotilla.

Another cheek of the same ass.

242 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:45:17am

re: #241 Bagua

Unfortunately the replacements are cut from the same cloth.

The Foreign Secretary William Hague has called on the Government of Israel to open all crossings for aid to enter Gaza and deplored the loss of life during the interception of the Gaza Flotilla.

Another cheek of the same ass.

Oh shit. I forgot about that. Read that yesterday.

Looks like it's the trend now. Appease, appease, appease and throw Israel under the bus.

So, where's the message to Egypt?

244 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:48:14am

RIP John Wooden
He inspired millions of people...He sure meant a lot to the Hoopster..
There will be no one like John again in our generation
A member of the Hall of fame as both a player and a coach.. And a member of my Hall of Fame as a person..
You will be greatly missed

245 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:51:40am

re: #243 windsagio

And random people on the internet are clearly more informed and knowledgable than the British government.

Again, that comment and link is simply trollish behaviour. You are just trying to derail our conversation again.

246 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:52:00am

re: #243 windsagio

And random people on the internet are clearly more informed and knowledgable than the British government.

Funny. You know. From where I'm sitting it looks like you're out to demonize Bagua.

How post modern.

247 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:55:11am

re: #245 Bagua

re: #246 Gus 802

No guys, seriously.

Read the link and understand it.

You're presuming that you have more knowledge/expertise than experts in the field.

The British (or the US) government know way more about this thing than you or I do, and to rage out on them and call them asses or whatever isn't so smart.

248 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:56:08am

re: #247 windsagio

re: #246 Gus 802

No guys, seriously.

Read the link and understand it.

You're presuming that you have more knowledge/expertise than experts in the field.

The British (or the US) government know way more about this thing than you or I do, and to rage out on them and call them asses or whatever isn't so smart.

This.

249 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:59:54am

re: #247 windsagio

Trust and obey the government! They are our betters. Who are we to think and have opinions?

Ya right. How amusing coming from you two.

250 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:00:24am

re: #247 windsagio

re: #246 Gus 802

No guys, seriously.

Read the link and understand it.

You're presuming that you have more knowledge/expertise than experts in the field.

The British (or the US) government know way more about this thing than you or I do, and to rage out on them and call them asses or whatever isn't so smart.

I don't have to read it. It's pretty clear. You wouldn't have posted that if Bagua had posted something critical of someone you yourself are critical of. For example, if it was against a Republican you would have cheered in agreement.

The only reason you're pointing this out is because you were insulted because you're in agreement with Foreign Secretary William Hague and the condemnation of Israel.

Thus experts are only legitimate if they agree with your own ideology. Otherwise, they're not even experts.

There's also this thing called the 1st Amendment. Unless you've forgotten about that.

251 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:01:49am

re: #249 Bagua

Trust and obey the government! They are our betters. Who are we to think and have opinions?

Ya right. How amusing coming from you two.

Silence minon!

We're from the government and we're here to help.

I am the authority.

/

252 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:02:52am

re: #249 Bagua

To be frank, its a tricky line. Specifically the line is between with disagreeing with experts and angrily denouncing/insulting/shouting at (virtually) experts because their expert opinion disagrees.

253 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:02:58am

Anti-authoritarian authoritarians.

What a dilemma.

254 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:03:37am

re: #252 windsagio

To be frank, its a tricky line. Specifically the line is between with disagreeing with experts and angrily denouncing/insulting/shouting at (virtually) experts because their expert opinion disagrees.

What experts? He's a fucking politician.

255 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:05:09am

re: #250 Gus 802

There's also this thing called the 1st Amendment. Unless you've forgotten about that.

Ohhh man! I haven't heard that in years!

Nobody's trying to censor you, its just being suggested that you're probably not so much smarter about this subject than the British Gov't is.

256 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:06:02am

re: #254 Gus 802

yes, he just pulled that out of his ass.

The foreign secretary just shouts out whatever comes into his head! Its like some crazy politician's version of Tourette's!

257 fire at night  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:06:27am

Blair, you ignorant slut.

Simply beautiful.

258 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:07:26am

re: #257 fire at night

Blair, you ignorant slut.

Simply beautiful.

You know who is a slut? Jane Curtain.
/

259 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:10:07am

re: #258 Cannadian Club Akbar

Your mamma!

/no not really >>

260 fire at night  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:10:16am

re: #258 Cannadian Club Akbar

I'm up late as usual and that caught my eye and made me chuckle after a pretty long day. The reference is of course not lost on me.

261 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:10:38am

re: #258 Cannadian Club Akbar

You know who is a slut? Jane Curtain.
/


And me Ex. Just sayin'.

262 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:11:51am

re: #261 Cannadian Club Akbar

And me Ex. Just sayin'.

I meant whore, FWIW.

263 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:13:13am

re: #256 windsagio

yes, he just pulled that out of his ass.

The foreign secretary just shouts out whatever comes into his head! Its like some crazy politician's version of Tourette's!

Right. I keep forgetting. Your orthodox politics only allows you to criticize the accepted list of Left Enemies: Reagan, Bush, Nixon, Republicans, etc. And the only acceptable bigotry of regionalism is when it's directed against the American South.

You are quick to point out others tribalism but fail to see you're own tribalism which you adhere to much like a religious fundamentalist.

264 fire at night  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:13:26am

re: #262 Cannadian Club Akbar

Whores charge, sluts do it for fun.

/Classy I am, I know. G'night Lizards. I shall apologize for being uncouth in the morn.

265 laZardo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:16:06am

Buenos noches, honcos y honcas.

Apparently a workout at the gym did NOT relieve my anger from my #18.

266 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:16:50am

re: #263 Gus 802

Lol, 'can't argue the point attack the poster!'

On the other hand, I cop to the regionalism, its a personal flaw :p

The rest is just rage and hate.

267 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:17:12am

My poor step dad just woke up. He drove 12 hours. He looks like hell.

268 windsagio  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:18:10am

anyways it's freakin' late, I'll talk to you guys tomorrow. Hopefully less Gaza news so the blog can collectively cool down and people start having some fun again.

Exit Video

269 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:18:27am

re: #266 windsagio

Lol, 'can't argue the point attack the poster!'

On the other hand, I cop to the regionalism, its a personal flaw :p

The rest is just rage and hate.

What rage and hate? There is no rage and hate. That's a Strawman.

Obviously you've never experienced rage and hate in your life.

270 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:18:56am

re: #252 windsagio

To be frank, its a tricky line. Specifically the line is between with disagreeing with experts and angrily denouncing/insulting/shouting at (virtually) experts because their expert opinion disagrees.

I suppose it is tricky, I suppose we should respect and not question the expertise of the British government and their Foreign Secretary William Hague.


You do realise that the man you are defending, "Hague, has defended the votes of Tory MEPs against gay rights" and has a deputy, Mark Francois who "voted against four key measures – repealing Section 28, pro-gay measures in Harriet Harman's equality bill, anti-gay hate crime measures and gay adoption – the Labour government has brought in as part of its efforts to make Britain more tolerant."

Tories admit anti-gay allies are an issue

271 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:19:50am

re: #267 Cannadian Club Akbar

My poor step dad just woke up. He drove 12 hours. He looks like hell.

I should make breakfast.

272 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:20:04am

re: #270 Bagua

I suppose it is tricky, I suppose we should respect and not question the expertise of the British government and their Foreign Secretary William Hague.

You do realise that the man you are defending, "Hague, has defended the votes of Tory MEPs against gay rights" and has a deputy, Mark Francois who "voted against four key measures – repealing Section 28, pro-gay measures in Harriet Harman's equality bill, anti-gay hate crime measures and gay adoption – the Labour government has brought in as part of its efforts to make Britain more tolerant."

Tories admit anti-gay allies are an issue

Hahahaha! Excellent!

High five!

273 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:22:04am

re: #270 Bagua

I suppose it is tricky, I suppose we should respect and not question the expertise of the British government and their Foreign Secretary William Hague.

You do realise that the man you are defending, "Hague, has defended the votes of Tory MEPs against gay rights" and has a deputy, Mark Francois who "voted against four key measures – repealing Section 28, pro-gay measures in Harriet Harman's equality bill, anti-gay hate crime measures and gay adoption – the Labour government has brought in as part of its efforts to make Britain more tolerant."

Tories admit anti-gay allies are an issue

Here's more on "the expert":

"Foreign Land" speech

After a controversial party conference speech in March 2001, Hague was accused of xenophobia and racism by sections of the media[citation needed]. In the speech, Hague said:

We have a Government that has contempt for the views of the people it governs.

There is nothing that the British people can talk about that this Labour Government doesn't deride.

Talk about Europe and they call you extreme. Talk about tax and they call you greedy. Talk about crime and they call you reactionary. Talk about immigration and they call you racist; talk about your nation and they call you Little Englanders ... This government thinks Britain would be all right if we had a different people. I think Britain would be all right, if only we had a different Government.

A Conservative Government that speaks with the voice of the British people.

A Conservative Government never embarrassed or ashamed of the British people.

A Conservative Government that trusts the people [...] This country must always offer sanctuary to those fleeing from injustice. Conservative Governments always have, and always will. But it's precisely those genuine refugees who are finding themselves elbowed aside.[13]

The speech was criticised in even traditionally Conservative newspapers such as The Sun and The Times[citation needed]. Former Conservative Deputy Prime Minister Michael Heseltine, a prominent One Nation Conservative, was particularly critical of Hague's allegation that Britain was becoming a "foreign land", and confessed in newspaper interviews that he was uncertain as to whether he could support a Hague-led Conservative Party.[14] With hindsight, the speech served to cement the portrayal of the Conservatives' as "the nasty party" in the run-up to the general election.

274 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:22:44am

Quack.

275 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:24:45am

re: #271 Cannadian Club Akbar

I should make breakfast.

I was going swimming in a few minutes.. The sky darkened.. I turned on the Weather.. There is a bad bad storm coming to Indiana and it is almost here.
The Weather here changes every few minutes...Jeez..
I'm microwaving some pasta for breakfast...

276 teleskiguy  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:25:15am

I'm just waking up here in the central Rockies, and I just read this scathing Tim Blair rebuttal.

Way To Go Charles! Long Live The Truth!

277 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:27:52am

re: #275 HoosierHoops

Cold pasta is yummy. I like a nice parm sauce. Reduced cream. Good for the soul.

278 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:29:02am

I've been up too long. I'm just waiting to hear the next speech on what a genius Nancy Pelosi is and I'm almost out of whiskey.

279 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:30:00am

re: #266 windsagio

Lol, 'can't argue the point attack the poster!'

On the other hand, I cop to the regionalism, its a personal flaw :p

The rest is just rage and hate.

Lol, that is exactly what you did. First claim I was "demonizing" that vile pundit who was overtly hostile to the Israeli spokesman and then belittling me as some "random internet guy" and holding up the Tory government as some Bastian of expertise and knowledge when they were condemning Israel. You obviously know less about them than you do about Israel.

You didn't address the issue at all, rather, you attack the credibility or motivations of the poster. Oh, and try your best to piss them off. We call that trolling.

280 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:30:13am

re: #278 Gus 802

I've been up too long. I'm just waiting to hear the next speech on what a genius Nancy Pelosi is and I'm almost out of whiskey.

It's cool, I have booze.
/

281 laZardo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:31:34am

re: #280 Cannadian Club Akbar

It's cool, I have booze. bubblegum.
/

ftfy q:

282 teleskiguy  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:32:15am

This is for my hard hittin' Rock 'N' Roll Lizard Cannadian Club Akbar. May Peter Steele Rest In Peace.

283 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:32:42am

re: #281 laZardo

ftfy q:

WTF is bubblegum?
/

284 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:36:04am

re: #279 Bagua

Lol, that is exactly what you did. First claim I was "demonizing" that vile pundit who was overtly hostile to the Israeli spokesman and then belittling me as some "random internet guy" and holding up the Tory government as some Bastian of expertise and knowledge when they were condemning Israel. You obviously know less about them than you do about Israel.

You didn't address the issue at all, rather, you attack the credibility or motivations of the poster. Oh, and try your best to piss them off. We call that trolling.

I'm still scratching my head but you know that "rage and hate" line is playing the victim card. It's pretty typical with lefties.

I remember a couple of years ago I quickly double parked at a construction site to ask a client a question when along came some dorky liberal who made a scene and end up calling me "unethical" for doing so. I was like WTF, unethical? It was like arguing with Bantu.

You know what it was? I had a "Don't Tread on Me" bumper sticker along with the American flag and a USA sticker at the time.

285 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:37:43am

re: #282 teleskiguy

This is for my hard hittin' Rock 'N' Roll Lizard Cannadian Club Akbar. May Peter Steele Rest In Peace.

[Video]

Fucking awesome. Thanks.

286 teleskiguy  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:39:24am

re: #285 Cannadian Club Akbar

Fucking awesome. Thanks.

Dude, you and I chatted about R.K.L. a while back on this here blog. It's my pleasure!

287 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:40:49am

re: #286 teleskiguy

Dude, you and I chatted about R.K.L. a while back on this here blog. It's my pleasure!

They might have bun a rich boys, but the didn't suck. Heh.

288 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:41:01am
289 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:41:14am

Is it 2012 yet?

290 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:41:52am

re: #289 Gus 802

Is it 2012 yet?

I'd give it 2 years.

291 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:42:31am
292 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:43:27am

re: #287 Cannadian Club Akbar

They might have bun a rich boys, but the didn't suck. Heh.

Bunch=bun, pimf

293 teleskiguy  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:44:19am

re: #289 Gus 802

Is it 2012 yet?

Wherever I am in late December 2012, I will be in the town square at midnight screaming and laughing with a bottle of Johnnie Walker Black in my hand, belching "We're Still Here . . . Ha Ha Ha . . . Nothing Happened!"

294 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:44:52am

re: #284 Gus 802

I'm still scratching my head but you know that "rage and hate" line is playing the victim card. It's pretty typical with lefties.

I remember a couple of years ago I quickly double parked at a construction site to ask a client a question when along came some dorky liberal who made a scene and end up calling me "unethical" for doing so. I was like WTF, unethical? It was like arguing with Bantu.

You know what it was? I had a "Don't Tread on Me" bumper sticker along with the American flag and a USA sticker at the time.

Yep, it's all about labels. They hound and pester and they when you get annoyed they shriek about rage and hate and bigots. Funny how they never point out the bigots among the anti-Israel majority. They see them as qualified experts we shouldn't question, oh no. That would unfair.

295 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:45:18am

re: #291 Gus 802

Sweden ports to block Israel ships, goods in response to Gaza flotilla

WTF? Now I have to throw on my glasses.

296 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:46:12am

re: #295 Cannadian Club Akbar

WTF? Now I have to throw on my glasses.

Throw them on...

Swedish Port Workers Union spokesman Peter Annerback says workers will refuse to handle Israeli goods and ships during the June 15-24 blockade. The union has some 1,500 members and supports Ship to Gaza, which took part in the flotilla.

297 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:46:29am

"Whaaat's happening, Peter?"

299 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:48:21am

Can my head just splody without reason? I'm cool.

300 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:51:49am

I will go with a yes. BBIAB.

301 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:53:25am

re: #294 Bagua

Yep, it's all about labels. They hound and pester and they when you get annoyed they shriek about rage and hate and bigots. Funny how they never point out the bigots among the anti-Israel majority. They see them as qualified experts we shouldn't question, oh no. That would unfair.

It's all bullshit. Bill Maher says that Obama isn't a real black president because he doesn't have a gun. He gets a pass. Helen Thomas says Jews need to leave Israel and move "back to Germany and Poland" and she gets a free pass. Now it's "de moda" to throw Israel under the bus and the gawt damn US delegation votes yes to condemn Israel in the no good for nothing United Nations.

Otherwise I'm fine and not full of hate and rage. ;)

302 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:54:17am

Good morning lizards!

I just saw the Helen Thomas video this morning. What are the chances she gets fired for it?

303 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:54:54am

re: #302 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards!

I just saw the Helen Thomas video this morning. What are the chances she gets fired for it?

Zero to negative 10. She might get a promotion.

304 laZardo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 4:58:15am

re: #302 NJDhockeyfan

GODDAMMIT.

305 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:00:05am

re: #304 laZardo

No. As a matter of fact. I've never been that pissed off.

306 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:03:58am

re: #247 windsagio

re: #246 Gus 802

No guys, seriously.

Read the link and understand it.

You're presuming that you have more knowledge/expertise than experts in the field.

The British (or the US) government know way more about this thing than you or I do, and to rage out on them and call them asses or whatever isn't so smart.

Not necessarily true...anymore.

307 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:05:14am
308 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:07:29am

Ari Fleischer Says Hearst Should Fire Helen Thomas

Former Bush press secretary Ari Fleischer, who endured a lot of pointed Helen Thomas questions, told Sam Stein of The Huffington Post that Hearst Newspapers should dismiss Thomas for saying Jews need to "get the hell out of Palestine" and go back to Poland and Germany.

"She should lose her job over this," Fleischer said in an email. "As someone who is Jewish, and as someone who worked with her and used to like her, I find this appalling."

"She is advocating religious cleansing. How can Hearst stand by her? If a journalist, or a columnist, said the same thing about blacks or Hispanics, they would already have lost their jobs."

Thomas knows that she could never say the blacks should go back to Africa or the Hispanics should go back to Mexico, she would ruin her over-celebrated reputation as the "dean" of the White House press corps. Stein offered more details and an update:


Captured by Rabbi David Nesenoff of RabbiLive.com, the footage made the rounds on mostly conservative and neoconservative sites, with some private complaints that her comments weren't getting wider play.

Thomas would apologize in a written statement, saying she deeply regretted the comments -- which were offered in response to the killing of pro-Palestinian activists by Israel forces and came, ironically, during the White House's Jewish Heritage Celebration.

309 Bagua  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:09:20am

Censored footage from the Gaza Flotilla

310 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:11:18am

re: #255 windsagio

Ohhh man! I haven't heard that in years!

Nobody's trying to censor you, its just being suggested that you're probably not so much smarter about this subject than the British Gov't is.

You're equating a government with a politician. There may be people in British Intelligence (the government) who do have an inside track but any elected official is a politician. Governments are not seamless, efficient entities. They're full of asses, idiots and the delusional, just like every other organization.

Why am I thinking of Neville Chamberlain at this moment?

311 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:12:25am

re: #256 windsagio

yes, he just pulled that out of his ass.

The foreign secretary just shouts out whatever comes into his head! Its like some crazy politician's version of Tourette's!

PEACE IN OUR TIME!

(Smacks head against conference table)

312 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:14:34am

re: #302 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards!

I just saw the Helen Thomas video this morning. What are the chances she gets fired for it?

On May 27, 2010, outside a White House Jewish heritage event, Thomas stated that Israel "should get the hell out of Palestine" and that Palestine is a country of occupation, whose occupiers should leave the region, returning to "Poland, Germany and America and everywhere else". Thomas subsequently issued a statement of regret on her personal web site.

So... back off man!

313 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:15:57am

re: #311 ryannon

PEACE IN OUR TIME!

(Smacks head against conference table)

Hey. You know we actually have some people that think Hamas is either a) a legitimate political party or b) not elected by a majority of Gazans therefore not representative of Gazans.. Some don't even know that Hamas is/was a terrorist organization and are equally clueless about Fatah.

314 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:18:41am

re: #312 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

On May 27, 2010, outside a White House Jewish heritage event, Thomas stated that Israel "should get the hell out of Palestine" and that Palestine is a country of occupation, whose occupiers should leave the region, returning to "Poland, Germany and America and everywhere else". Thomas subsequently issued a statement of regret on her personal web site.

So... back off man!

Heh. Of course she did. I doubt anyone will believe her apology. It was pretty clear by the video where her heart is.

315 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:21:00am

re: #313 Gus 802

Hey. You know we actually have some people that think Hamas is either a) a legitimate political party or b) not elected by a majority of Gazans therefore not representative of Gazans.. Some don't even know that Hamas is/was a terrorist organization and are equally clueless about Fatah.

There are probably people out there who think Hamas is a brand of luncheon meat as well. Nothing surprises me anymore.

316 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:21:14am

Some kids in California are playing an old favorite game of Helen Thomas's...

California High School Ends 'Beat the Jew' Game

La Quinta, Calif. (AP) - Seven seniors at a Southern California high school were facing disciplinary action for participating in a game called "Beat the Jew" in which losers were subjected to "incineration" or "enslavement," a school administrator said Friday.

The game involved some students playing the role of Nazis who blindfolded and dropped off other students playing Jews who must find their way back to the campus, said Sherry Johnstone, assistant superintendent of personnel for Desert Sands Unified School District.

It was not immediately clear what either punishment comprised for losing players, she said.

Seven seniors at La Quinta High School could be suspended or barred from graduation, among other measures, Johnstone said.

"This is appalling to us," she said. "We want our students to understand the horror of a title like this."

The district started investigating a week ago after students reported the game to administrators.

The game was promoted online, attracting about 40 students. Seven showed up to play one evening in the campus parking lot, Johnstone said.

317 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:21:15am

re: #313 Gus 802

Oh. And if you mention the terrorist organization, Hamas, in the context of Gaza, they'll say you're unfairly painting the majority of Gazans with a "broad brush." Including "women in children." This would be the same Hamas and Gazans that refuse to accept Israel's right to exist and are constantly bombarded with anti-Israeli and anti-Semitic propaganda and incitement from Hamas and the PA.

318 laZardo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:22:31am

re: #316 NJDhockeyfan

Some kids in California are playing an old favorite game of Helen Thomas's...

California High School Ends 'Beat the Jew' Game

They're just appreciating Kazakh culture!

/hurr durr

319 Gus  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:23:35am

re: #315 ryannon

There are probably people out there who think Hamas is a brand of luncheon meat as well. Nothing surprises me anymore.

You mean like Ham-Ass? Yeah, that would probably be culturally insensitive.

They probably think they're Freedom Fighters. You know how it is with some people. It's "all relative man" even if it means it will come back to bite them in the ass.

320 reine.de.tout  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:23:36am

BP Has Sent Us Press Releases and Lawyers But Still No Money for Sand Booming Work

NEW ORLEANS (June 4, 2010) - Governor Bobby Jindal released the following statement today regarding his meeting with President Obama and elected officials in New Orleans, concerning the response efforts to the ongoing BP oil spill:

“I am glad the president came today. Every time he comes to Louisiana the pace of the response efforts quickens and things get done. Shortly before his first visit during this spill, Admiral Allen was named as Incident Commander. Before his visit last week, the Coast Guard called for BP to pay for one of the segments in our sand boom plan and before his visit this week, the Coast Guard called on BP to pay for the construction of all six segments approved by the Corps – although BP still hasn’t given the state a dime to pay for the work.

“Just as we said yesterday, we told the President we are moving ahead without BP. We already signed contracts to begin this work with Shaw and Bean Dredging. We put in a request to the Army Corps of Engineers this morning to release their available dredges and they have indentified four dredges – including one located close to the site that is most likely to be available – the MV CALIFORNIA. I met with the CEO of Shaw today and they said that if the US Army Corps of Engineers will allow them to borrow sand closer to the dredging sites, which we will replace, we could see sand by Monday.

“We are moving forward with or without BP. We gave them two choices – they can either send us a check, get out of the way and let us start this work, or they can sign a contract and do it themselves. We are going ahead without them. Last night, we met with Admiral Allen and he said he feels like he is making progress in getting BP to actually pay for this work. To date, BP has done a great job in sending us press releases and attorneys, but they haven’t sent us any money to dredge.

321 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:24:13am

In case you care... here's Helen's "Statement of Regret" from her website...

“I deeply regret my comments I made last week regarding the Israelis and the Palestinians. They do not reflect my heart-felt belief that peace will come to the Middle East only when all parties recognize the need for mutual respect and tolerance. May that day come soon.”

I feel all gushy now.

We don't cut Buchanan a break, why should we cut this woman a break.

323 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:28:37am

re: #321 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

In case you care... here's Helen's "Statement of Regret" from her website...

I feel all gushy now.

We don't cut Buchanan a break, why should we cut this woman a break.

I think Helen Thomas should get the hell out of the news business.

324 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:29:26am

re: #309 Bagua

Censored footage from the Gaza Flotilla



Notice the keffiyeh (jihad scarf) on the head of the assailant at 2:03.

326 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:33:51am

re: #314 NJDhockeyfan

Heh. Of course she did. I doubt anyone will believe her apology. It was pretty clear by the video where her heart is.

How many people are even going to look at her website. It's the video that will get the play.

327 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:34:32am

Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

The IDF released on Friday an audio reproduction of the moments before Monday's raid on a Gaza-bound aid flotilla.

In it, the soldiers can be heard warning the flotilla that its vessels are nearing an area under naval blockade. They are answered by calls of "Go back to Auschwitz" and "Don't forget 9/11 guys".

328 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:36:10am

re: #327 NJDhockeyfan

Flotilla passengers: Go back to Auschwitz

Don't worry. Informed government leaders know that they didn't mean it.

329 laZardo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:45:45am

re: #319 Gus 802

They probably think they're Freedom Fighters. You know how it is with some people. It's "all relative man" even if it means it will come back to bite them in the ass.

"We deserved it anyway...paying back our parents' debts."

/wait for it... no.

330 laZardo  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:53:47am

Gonna apply the Jaws of Life to my facepalm and then play Red Dead Redemption to see if blasting ornery varmints will relieve my frustration.

Cheers.

331 sattv4u2  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:54:13am

re: #321 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

“I deeply regret that my comments I made last week regarding the Israelis and the Palestinians were recorded . They do not reflect my heart-felt belief that peace will come to Israel should leave the Middle East only when all parties recognize the need for mutual respect and tolerance. May that day come soon.”

ftfher

332 sattv4u2  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:55:52am

re: #321 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

In case you care... here's Helen's "Statement of Regret" from her website...

I feel all gushy now.

We don't cut Buchanan a break, why should we cut this woman a break.

It's that whole seperated at birth thing

Image: yoda.jpg

333 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 5:58:16am

48 hour rule?

Obama told Netanyahu: Go Home, Don't Explain From Here

In the hubbub surrounding the “battle of the flotilla,” Netanyahu’s quick reversal of his decision to remain in the United States has been largely ignored. It turns out that Obama told him to leave because he didn’t want Netanyahu to use the White House as a stage on which to present Israel’s side of the story.

The flotilla violence caught Netanyahu in the midst of a diplomatic trip to North America. He was in the Canadian capital of Ottawa at the time, about to leave for Washington for a meeting with U.S. President Barack Obama. The meeting was to have been a way for Obama to make up for the humiliation he dealt Netanyahu on his last visit, when he refused to be seen with the Israeli leader in public.

Netanyahu announced immediately after the flotilla news broke that he would remain in North America and would meet with Obama as scheduled. However, within minutes after media reported Netanyahu would continue with his trip as scheduled, he abruptly announced a change of plan and set off immediately for Israel to “deal with the flotilla crisis.”

Behind the scenes, it was Obama officials who caused the turnabout. Globes cites sources in both Jerusalem and Washington who say that Obama officials gave a clear message to Netanyahu’s people: “Don’t come.”

Officials in both Washington and Jerusalem deny that this was the case.

334 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:10:52am

Whoa...

Lift the Siege of Gaza
by Pat Buchanan

In June 1948, our wartime ally imposed a blockade on Berlin, cutting off and condemning to death or Stalinist domination 2 million Germans, most of whom, not long before, had cheered Adolf Hitler.

Harry Truman responded with the Berlin airlift, in perhaps the most magnanimous act of the Cold War.

For nine months, U.S. pilots flew into Tempelhof, carrying everything from candy to coal, saving a city and earning the eternal gratitude of the people of Berlin, and admiration everywhere that moral courage is admired.

That was an America that lived its values.

And today, President Obama should end his and his country's shameful silence over the inhumane blockade of Gaza that is denying 1.5 million beleaguered people the basic necessities of a decent life.

Time to start acting like America again.

[snip]

It gets worse...

335 sattv4u2  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:11:06am

re: #321 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

In case you care... here's Helen's "Statement of Regret" from her website...

I feel all gushy now.

We don't cut Buchanan a break, why should we cut this woman a break.

AND ,, THE biggest problem with her statement (imho) is her insistance that the Jews go "back to Poland"

POLAND
umm,,, Helen ,, Geography Quiz Time

Q. Auschwitz was in which country?

A) Japan
B) Costa Rica
C) Switzerland
D) Poland

336 Tigger2005  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:11:40am

re: #323 NJDhockeyfan

I think Helen Thomas should get the hell out of the news business.

I think Helen Thomas should get the hell off Planet Earth. I will donate to the Send Helen to Land on Mercury Fund.

337 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:11:57am

re: #332 sattv4u2

I'm staying away from the whole "She's 90 and not a hottie" thing...

What she said was reprehensible.

338 sattv4u2  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:13:53am

re: #337 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I'm staying away from the whole "She's 90 and not a hottie" thing...

What she said was reprehensible.

But as you stated, she' won;t get anywhere near the same scrutiny in the MSM for it that a Buchanan gets, and her comment was OVERTLY discusting

As least Pat couches his vile with fast talking double speak and a smile

339 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:15:22am

Allgier's lawyers want neo-Nazi's tattoos covered during trial


Attorneys for Curtis Michael Allgier are afraid the murder suspect's head-to-toe tattoos -- which include swastikas, neo-Nazi symbols and the words "Skin Head" written across his forehead -- could negatively influence a jury.

So to ensure he gets a fair trial, they want the tattoos on the white supremacist's face, head, neck and hands covered up, even though that would "substantially change his appearance from what he looked like" on the day three years ago when he allegedly killed a Corrections officer during a visit to a Salt Lake City medical clinic.

Hiding the tattoos would potentially prejudice the state's case, but the defense argues the prejudice to the state is outweighed by prejudice to Allgier.

The defense motion, filed late last month, proposed covering the tattoos during trial but does not specify how they propose to do so.

Allgier, 30, is charged with capital murder for allegedly killing 60-year-old Stephen Anderson with his own gun after Anderson unshackled Allgier for an MRI scan on June 25, 2007.

340 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:17:40am

re: #338 sattv4u2

Darn tootin'.

341 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:21:01am

'We had no choice'

When St.-Sgt. S. fast-roped down from an air force Black Hawk helicopter onto the Mavi Marmara Turkish passenger ship on Monday morning, he did not expect to be landing in what he called “a battlefield” and facing off against a group of “murderous mercenaries.”

The 15th and last naval commando from Flotilla 13 (the Shayetet) to rappel down onto the ship from the helicopter, S. said on Thursday that he was immediately attacked by what the IDF has called “the mob of mercenaries” aboard the vessel, just like the soldiers who had boarded just before him.

Looking to his side, he saw three of his commanders lying wounded – one with a gunshot wound to the stomach and another with a gunshot wound to the knee. A third was lying unconscious; his skull was fractured by a devastating blow with a metal bar.

As the next in the chain of command, S., who has been in the Shayetet for three and a half years, immediately took charge.

He pushed the wounded soldiers up against the wall of the upper deck and created a perimeter of soldiers around them to begin treating their wounds, he said. He then arranged his men to form a second perimeter, and pulled out his 9 mm. Glock pistol to stave off the charging attackers and to protect his wounded comrades.

The attackers had already seized two pistols from the commandos, and fired repeatedly at them. Facing more than a dozen of the mercenaries, and convinced their lives were in danger, he and his colleagues opened fire, he said. S. singlehandedly killed six men. His colleagues killed another three.

On Thursday, S. sat down with The Jerusalem Post at the Shayetet’s base in northern Israel for an exclusive interview, during which he described the dramatic events aboard the Mavi Marmara on Monday; he is being considered for a medal of valor.

“When I hit the deck, I was immediately attacked by people with bats, metal pipes and axes,” S. told the Post. “These were without a doubt terrorists. I could see the murderous rage in their eyes and that they were coming to kill us.”

342 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:23:27am

re: #333 NJDhockeyfan

48 hour rule?

Obama told Netanyahu: Go Home, Don't Explain From Here

Definitely, sounds like some more made up "faux" news to me...

343 Tigger2005  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:26:06am

re: #334 NJDhockeyfan

Whoa...

Lift the Siege of Gaza
by Pat Buchanan

It gets worse...

What can anyone say? There's nothing left to say. In the past you wouldn't have had to say anything. Pat's words would speak for themselves, and the vast majority of people would realize what scum he is, and he could not find work as a shit-scooper's assistant for a dogcatcher. Today he gets paid by FOX News and other major news outlets. You can reply by calling him a Nazi but that has been so overused it has become meaningless to almost everybody, except for the growing number of people who think the Nazis were cool. You can reply with facts but nobody cares about facts. Nobody but a small, shrinking minority.

344 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:30:42am
345 sattv4u2  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:31:57am

re: #343 Tigger2005

Today he gets paid by FOX News and other major news outlets

I agree with all you posted, even the italicst above

HOWEVER, it should be noted that he is a mainstay NOT on FOX but on MS/NBC and has been for a long long time

[Link: www.google.com...]

Has he been on FOX shows? Yes
But the knee-jerk reaction to tie him to FOX rather than the what the reality is shopuld be noted, imho

NOW ,, the question is WHY is he so prominent on MS/NBC. My own opinion is to "show" their audience what troglodytes "rightys" are
"look at Buchanan,, he's the voice of the right,, see,, we have him right here on our shows,,, look how he is !!"

346 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:35:31am

re: #345 sattv4u2

Today he gets paid by FOX News and other major news outlets

I agree with all you posted, even the italicst above

HOWEVER, it should be noted that he is a mainstay NOT on FOX but on MS/NBC and has been for a long long time

[Link: www.google.com...]

Has he been on FOX shows? Yes
But the knee-jerk reaction to tie him to FOX rather than the what the reality is shopuld be noted, imho

NOW ,, the question is WHY is he so prominent on MS/NBC. My own opinion is to "show" their audience what troglodytes "rightys" are
"look at Buchanan,, he's the voice of the right,, see,, we have him right here on our shows,,, look how he is !!"

Bingo, Buchanan is on MSNBC's payroll, not FNC but that won't stop the loony left of demonizing Fox News instead of MSNBC anyway.

347 sattv4u2  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:37:31am

re: #344 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Y'all seen this... fun as hell to read.

Work. BBT.

ggrrrrr,, your link locked up my puter!!

348 Spare O'Lake  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:44:00am

Good Morning sluts, nuts and lovers of mutts.

349 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:49:49am

Some comments on HuffPo's Rachel Corrie thread...


Perry Winkler

Sweden ports to block Israel ships, goods in response to Gaza flotilla takeover
Week-long ban is initiated by Swedish Port Workers Union, who says act is reaction to the 'unprecedented criminal attack on the peaceful ship convoy.'

[Link: www.haaretz.com...]

More should join!

Will the very same people that on behalf of the besieged proclaim that there is no humanitarian crisis in Palestine also not be unencumbered by any type of boycott? I give it two days before the Israelis are screaming bloody murder before the port blockage even takes place and they will protest strongly.

---------------------

HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Ivan1977

Swedish dockworkers to refuse handing goods from Israel ships for a week to protest unprecedented criminal attack on the peaceful ship convoy:

[Link: www.haaretz.com...]

It started... yesterday the biggest British Union indicated that they would support boycott of Israel.

Wake Up World, let's show this apartheid state how we, people of the world deal with apartheid !!!

-------------------------------------

retrievals

Israel may have been created as a "Jewish" state. But that was 60 years ago.

The US and world was right to assist in its creation.

But not a racist, theocracy forever.

We didn't buy into that?

--------------------------------------------

retrievals

When will a NY York Times reporter ask Bi Bi, "do the millions of Palestinians who were born and raised in Israel have the same rights as you?"

why not?

---------------------------------


MikeBakunin

Another illegal boarding by pirates in international waters.

That's just a sample off the first of 19 pages of comments.

350 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:56:55am

re: #321 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

That's not an apology.

351 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 6:59:23am

I didn't see this little tidbit mentioned by the MSM yet...

...The soldiers reported that the activists had fired on them during the confrontation and that at least two commandos suffered gunshot wounds. After the incident, 9mm bullet casings were found - a kind not used by the naval commandos.

The Israel Defense Forces says that during the operation a number of pistols and an M-4 rifle were taken from soldiers, but they believe that the Turkish activists had other weapons. The captain of the ship told the naval commando chief that the guns were thrown overboard before the ship was completely taken over.

352 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:01:27am

re: #346 NJDhockeyfan

Bingo, Buchanan is on MSNBC's payroll, not FNC but that won't stop the loony left of demonizing Fox News instead of MSNBC anyway.

Nor will it stop people yapping on about the liberal MSM.

353 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:08:30am

re: #352 Obdicut

Nor will it stop people yapping on about the liberal MSM.

Do you believe the vast majority of the MSM are liberal?

354 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:13:41am

re: #353 NJDhockeyfan

Do you believe the vast majority of the MSM are liberal?

No. I don't even believe that the word 'liberal' is useful in any real way; it's mainly something used by politicians trying to get elected. It certainly doesn't coherently represent any political philosophy or set of values.

The media is irresponsible, terrible at their jobs, and alternate between hero-worship and scandal-mongering. They're at the absolute worst in science reportage; even when they're trying to do a good job, they usually fuck it all up.

The media is in a sorry-ass state.

Image: 20090830.gif

355 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:39:47am

re: #354 Obdicut

Media Bias Is Real, Finds UCLA Political Scientist


While the editorial page of The Wall Street Journal is conservative, the newspaper's news pages are liberal, even more liberal than The New York Times. The Drudge Report may have a right-wing reputation, but it leans left. Coverage by public television and radio is conservative compared to the rest of the mainstream media. Meanwhile, almost all major media outlets tilt to the left.

These are just a few of the surprising findings from a UCLA-led study, which is believed to be the first successful attempt at objectively quantifying bias in a range of media outlets and ranking them accordingly.

"I suspected that many media outlets would tilt to the left because surveys have shown that reporters tend to vote more Democrat than Republican," said Tim Groseclose, a UCLA political scientist and the study's lead author. "But I was surprised at just how pronounced the distinctions are."

"Overall, the major media outlets are quite moderate compared to members of Congress, but even so, there is a quantifiable and significant bias in that nearly all of them lean to the left," said co‑author Jeffrey Milyo, University of Missouri economist and public policy scholar.

356 Boogberg  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:44:18am

Guess I'll go see what's new on Hulu...

358 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:49:15am

This comment on DKos pretty much sums up the entire blog...


It's sad... (3+ / 0-)

...but getting a pro-Israeli diary rec'd on DKos is getting damn near impossible. Seems the vast majority of people even interested in I/P diaries are one-staters and their friends on the P-side of the two-state line.

by revprez

359 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:51:51am

Queen's birthday gaffe leaves Hillary Clinton red faced

An official statement from the US foreign policy chief paid tribute to the "Queen’s life and legacy,” despite the fact that the Monarch does not celebrate her official birthday until next weekend.

The diplomatic faux pas, sent on behalf of President Barack Obama and the American people on Friday, also celebrated the "special relationship" between the British and US governments.

"On this celebratory occasion, we pay tribute to the Queen's life and legacy and honour the special relationship between our two nations," Mrs Clinton said.

“The young princess Elizabeth helped rally her nation in the darkest days of that war, and she has remained a beacon of integrity and resolve ever since. The United States has always been grateful for her friendship and example.

“Once again, I wish Queen Elizabeth II a very happy birthday and peace and prosperity for the people of the United Kingdom in the year to come."

Mrs Clinton added that the “special relationship continues to provide a solid foundation as the United States and Britain”, which worked “side by side to meet the challenges of the 21st century”.

A spokesman for Mrs Clinton attemped to make light of the gaffe.

"We were a week early," Philip Crowley joked to reporters in Washington.

"As always, it is better to give a greeting a week early than a week late.”

360 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:55:08am

re: #356 Boogberg

Guess I'll go see what's new on Hulu...

Living In Oblivion is pretty good. It seems a little self indulgent film about making films at first but stick with it and it's actually a very interesting way to tell a story.

361 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:56:10am

re: #359 NJDhockeyfan

Wouldn't a 'reset' button be nice about now?
/

362 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:57:28am

re: #346 NJDhockeyfan

Bingo, Buchanan is on MSNBC's payroll, not FNC but that won't stop the loony left of demonizing Fox News instead of MSNBC anyway.

Well Fox is nonstop racism ya see?

363 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 7:59:26am

re: #313 Gus 802

Hey. You know we actually have some people that think Hamas is either a) a legitimate political party or b) not elected by a majority of Gazans therefore not representative of Gazans.. Some don't even know that Hamas is/was a terrorist organization and are equally clueless about Fatah.

It's sickening. 1 to 2 more generations of BS and lies and Israel is really going to F'd in the propaganda department.

364 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:02:21am

re: #355 NJDhockeyfan

The Drudge Report may have a right-wing reputation, but it leans left.

Yeah... no.

365 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:02:58am

re: #249 Bagua

Trust and obey the government! They are our betters. Who are we to think and have opinions?

Ya right. How amusing coming from you two.

I kind of thought it was a joke, but I am fully a believer now. The 'statists' think they are so 'intelligent and intellectual' that they truly, and this is what I thought was the myth, but they truly and wholeheartedly believe they could live your life better than you.

366 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:07:07am

Nice fennel!
Mine are still about 2 inches tall.

367 Boogberg  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:07:19am

re: #360 Killgore Trout

Thanks, K. I'll give it a look. :)

368 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:08:25am

re: #365 Oh no...Sand People!

There is really no point in broad-based smears like that.

I don't trust the British government one whit in their judgement on Israel. Or on pretty much any other nation, for that matter. Furthermore, I think a hell of a lot of the 'experts' in any non-scientific field are going to be full of shit.

Yet I get called a 'statist' a lot as well.

I've got a feeling that this is just a 'no true Scotsman' deal, where anyone who is sufficiently reasonable is not a 'statist' to you.

I do think that, for example, NASA knows a hell of a lot more about global warming than random people on the internet; does that make me a statist?

I do think that Reine knows more about how state government actually works than almost everyone else on this blog, since she was a state government employee. Does that make me a statist?

It's a convenient accusation to levy, but I really don't see the point of it.

369 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:08:48am

re: #366 Killgore Trout

Nice fennel!
Mine are still about 2 inches tall.

Just helped the In-laws over memorial day weekend put in box gardens with a shload of compost and other mixture stuff I am not familiar enough with to say. But pretty cool stuff.

370 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:09:16am

re: #359 NJDhockeyfan

They could send her the White House's bust of Churchhill as a birthday gift to try to make amends.... oh wait.

Some DVDs?

371 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:10:02am

re: #359 NJDhockeyfan

That's a really good example of the media paying attention to absolutely trivial bullshit.

372 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:10:15am

re: #363 Oh no...Sand People!

It's sickening. 1 to 2 more generations years of BS and lies and Israel is really going to F'd in the propaganda department.

Fixed.

373 Mickey Blumental  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:11:29am

Not sure the language is very useful. I understand this guy is an annoying moron, but blowing up like that shows that he got to you. I like it better when you play it cool and I'm sure that attitude pisses off your critics much more.

Just saying.

374 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:12:30am

re: #368 Obdicut

There is really no point in broad-based smears like that.

I don't trust the British government one whit in their judgement on Israel. Or on pretty much any other nation, for that matter. Furthermore, I think a hell of a lot of the 'experts' in any non-scientific field are going to be full of shit.

Yet I get called a 'statist' a lot as well.

I've got a feeling that this is just a 'no true Scotsman' deal, where anyone who is sufficiently reasonable is not a 'statist' to you.

I do think that, for example, NASA knows a hell of a lot more about global warming than random people on the internet; does that make me a statist?

I do think that Reine knows more about how state government actually works than almost everyone else on this blog, since she was a state government employee. Does that make me a statist?

It's a convenient accusation to levy, but I really don't see the point of it.

Their knowledge is fine and dandy. They can then go about sharing it through persuasion and conversation. If it makes sense and works well in practice, fantastic as long as I was able to make the choice or not. But so often I see they push it through legislation and force of law.

I know how to live my own life better than them is my point.

375 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:13:41am

re: #363 Oh no...Sand People!

It's sickening. 1 to 2 more generations of BS and lies and Israel is really going to F'd in the propaganda department.

Israel has been fucked in the propaganda department ever since a bunch of Jews started a nation. We're not allowed to do that. Even though every other nation on earth was born in a mixture of violence, settlement, and political deals, when Jews do it it's bad, don't you know. And, apparently, Muslims can't be expected to act rationally.

That's the part that annoys me most, actually, is the inherent racism/culturalism/whatever against the Muslim population in the Middle East. They're treated by Europe and the US, by and large, like they can't be anything else other than semi-theocratic assholes with unreasoning hatred for Jews, and that only the Jews are capable of being in any way reasonable. It's such a bigoted position.

376 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:13:48am

re: #308 NJDhockeyfan

I would cheerfully accept her apology as long at it is the last paragraph of a resignation letter.

377 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:14:54am

re: #374 Oh no...Sand People!

I'm unsure what you're talking about. Read briefly, that seemed to be an argument against all laws.

For example, pollution laws: those egg-head 'experts' do actually know which substances are terrible when poured into a river. We really do need laws against doing so. Persuasion alone doesn't work.

378 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:16:03am

re: #371 Obdicut

That's a really good example of the media paying attention to absolutely trivial bullshit.

Some would call that 'trivial bullshit' a sign of respect for an ally.

379 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:16:10am

re: #376 Rightwingconspirator

I would cheerfully accept her apology as long at it is the last paragraph of a resignation letter.

She could do a great piece on 'How did I come to be so biased? What went wrong that I became this person?'

But she won't.

380 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:18:06am

re: #378 NJDhockeyfan

Some would call that 'trivial bullshit' a sign of respect for an ally.

And I'd call it trivial bullshit. Especially when Britain is busy making assholic statements about Israel and Gaza. And especially when it's about a goddamn queen; it's fucking ridiculous that Britain still has a monarchy and noble class at all.

381 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:18:30am

re: #375 Obdicut

Israel has been fucked in the propaganda department ever since a bunch of Jews started a nation. We're not allowed to do that. Even though every other nation on earth was born in a mixture of violence, settlement, and political deals, when Jews do it it's bad, don't you know. And, apparently, Muslims can't be expected to act rationally.

That's the part that annoys me most, actually, is the inherent racism/culturalism/whatever against the Muslim population in the Middle East. They're treated by Europe and the US, by and large, like they can't be anything else other than semi-theocratic assholes with unreasoning hatred for Jews, and that only the Jews are capable of being in any way reasonable. It's such a bigoted position.

And now my favorite 'meme' coming out strong, "You can be Anti-Zionist without being Anti-Semitic!"

Trying to get as close to the line of justification as possible they are. The Jew hate is amping up to 12...well past 11.

382 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:20:16am

re: #379 Obdicut

She could do a great piece on 'How did I come to be so biased? What went wrong that I became this person?'

But she won't.

Hearst Corporation should send Helen to Auschwitz to do a report on the Holocaust before they can her wrinkled ass.

383 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:21:15am

re: #377 Obdicut

I'm unsure what you're talking about. Read briefly, that seemed to be an argument against all laws.

For example, pollution laws: those egg-head 'experts' do actually know which substances are terrible when poured into a river. We really do need laws against doing so. Persuasion alone doesn't work.

And how is the war on drugs, and immigration working out so far? The 'experts' are doing fantastic on those.

384 Tigger2005  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:21:17am

Another sample anti-Israel post from HuffPo:

Israel may be able to keep a few of the "I support Israel right or wrong" crowd, but they are rapidly loosing the world. Inprisoning a population, starving them, taking away their livelihood, and denying them medical supplies amounts to torture. The Jewish people speak of what was done to them in WWII, yet they refuse to even entertain pease efforts and show no compassion for the plight of other human beings. It is simplistic to blame the zealotry of their leaders because they choose their leaders. The News often reports that the people do not support these extreme measures, but the same politicians are repeatedly returned to power. AIPAC may have clout in the U.S., but the American population sees Israel's actions as indefensible and all the spinning by our politicians can not put a good face on what is happening. Look at the quality of the people and the acitivists that are risking their lives on these aid ships. WHO is carrying the aid tells even an unattentive world what side a thinking person should be on.

385 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:22:44am

re: #333 NJDhockeyfan

48 hour rule?

Obama told Netanyahu: Go Home, Don't Explain From Here

I read the original Globes report a few days ago.

So far that and INN are the only two sources for it, and INN is citing Globes.

Let's wait for others to independently pick it up.

386 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:23:15am

re: #384 Tigger2005

Another sample anti-Israel post from HuffPo:

Same tired tripe, new day.

And those same bastards will not take a look to the left and say anything about Egypt and it's wall.

Bastard hypocrites.

387 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:24:06am

re: #381 Oh no...Sand People!

Well, it depends how you define 'Zionist'. Anyone who thinks that Israel doesn't have legitimate right to exist or a right to defend herself is totally wrong-- but sometimes they're just massively uninformed, or misinformed by the propaganda surrounding the conflict.

I'd say, rather, that the propaganda has led a lot of people into anti-Semitism by identifying Israel with all Jews, and then lying continually about Israel's actions and being hypocritical about Israel's status vs. the rest of the nations on earth. I do not think that a lot of college kids, for example, who are anti-Israel are anti-Semites at the core, but instead believe a bunch of bullshit about Israel and have come to identify Israel with all Jews and so blame all Jews, collectively, for the (fictitious) misdeeds of Israel.

It's especially funny/sad since one of the things they blame Israel for is supposedly collectively punishing Palestinians.

388 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:24:19am

re: #384 Tigger2005

Another sample anti-Israel post from HuffPo:

Look at the quality of the people and the acitivists that are risking their lives on these aid ships. WHO is carrying the aid tells even an unattentive world what side a thinking person should be on.

THAT says it all, and explains why it is such a powerful propaganda tool by the ISM.

389 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:25:54am

re: #384 Tigger2005

I love that

Look at the quality of the people and the acitivists that are risking their lives on these aid ships. WHO is carrying the aid tells even an unattentive world what side a thinking person should be on.

So in other words, "Even 'educated and intellectuals' can be terrorists."

Glad he finally 'fessed up, got tired of hearing, 'only the poor can be suicide bombers..'

390 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:26:00am

re: #385 Joo-LiZ

I read the original Globes report a few days ago.

So far that and INN are the only two sources for it, and INN is citing Globes.

Let's wait for others to independently pick it up.

For some reason, I keep hearing things....

391 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:26:05am

re: #387 Obdicut

I think it's a finer distinction than that.

The College age kids who have bought into the propaganda, make the assumption of support of Israel by Jews, unless a Jew clearly denounces Israel. Then they are "good" Jews, and all is well.

392 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:29:01am

re: #383 Oh no...Sand People!

And how is the war on drugs, and immigration working out so far? The 'experts' are doing fantastic on those.

Strangely enough, it's not a binary dichotomy, as I've already said-- an 'expert' on the drug war is usually going to be a DEA dude who's heavily invested in continuing the drug war, just as an expert Austrian economist is heavily invested in the bullshit of Austrian economists. Just because someone can be labelled an expert doesn't, or shouldn't, give them any authority.

What you're observing, basically, is the trust and expertise problem: how do you identify the real experts, the people who really have good ideas? In science, this is relatively easy-- the scientific method, the peer review system, and the general nature of scientists provides an excellent method for sorting through supposed experts and identifying those who actually produce results. There is no such system for governance, economics, etc., and it would be very hard to come up with one, since those worlds cannot be controlled in a laboratory setting in the same way.

It's one of the eternal problems of civil society, but the solution is not to throw up our hands and give up.

Atual Gawande explores this problem at length in his books-- he's a really good place to start thinking about the subject.

393 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:29:35am

re: #384 Tigger2005

Another sample anti-Israel post from HuffPo:

See my post at #349.

394 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:30:24am

BBL...gonna work for a while.

395 Oh no...Sand People!  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:33:54am

re: #392 Obdicut

Strangely enough, it's not a binary dichotomy, as I've already said-- an 'expert' on the drug war is usually going to be a DEA dude who's heavily invested in continuing the drug war, just as an expert Austrian economist is heavily invested in the bullshit of Austrian economists. Just because someone can be labelled an expert doesn't, or shouldn't, give them any authority.

What you're observing, basically, is the trust and expertise problem: how do you identify the real experts, the people who really have good ideas? In science, this is relatively easy-- the scientific method, the peer review system, and the general nature of scientists provides an excellent method for sorting through supposed experts and identifying those who actually produce results. There is no such system for governance, economics, etc., and it would be very hard to come up with one, since those worlds cannot be controlled in a laboratory setting in the same way.

It's one of the eternal problems of civil society, but the solution is not to throw up our hands and give up.

Atual Gawande explores this problem at length in his books-- he's a really good place to start thinking about the subject.

Exactly. I hate the idea that many look out for their own paycheck, and (broad brush painting) many statists would rather use laws and government to make their money off the proles as opposed to coming up with a useful product, good, or service.

But I gotta go now. Later all.

And (Insert pretend myth character / fabrication here) bless Israel.

396 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:34:52am

This is my favorite Gawande book:


The Checklist Manifesto: How to Get Things Right

One of the things he does is examine how large, modern buildings are built-- which is a task of immense complexity, requiring large numbers of experts in a large number of different disciplines to work together, communicate with each other, and spread information promiscuously in every direction.

It's fascinating.

For a heavier, headier read, this is Darwin's Dangerous Idea, which attempts to begin the 'philosophy of engineering', including systems engineering.

397 sattv4u2  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:35:28am

re: #395 Oh no...Sand People!

And (Insert pretend myth character / fabrication here) bless Israel

I'd be willing to wager most Israeli's would prefer that to be GOD

398 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:35:54am

re: #382 NJDhockeyfan

Brilliant!

399 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:35:58am

re: #396 Obdicut

This is my favorite Gawande book:


The Checklist Manifesto: How to Get Things Right

One of the things he does is examine how large, modern buildings are built-- which is a task of immense complexity, requiring large numbers of experts in a large number of different disciplines to work together, communicate with each other, and spread information promiscuously in every direction.

It's fascinating.

For a heavier, headier read, this is Darwin's Dangerous Idea, which attempts to begin the 'philosophy of engineering', including systems engineering.

Does it have da maffs?

400 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:37:06am

Google is honoring the birth of Dennis Gabor, the inventor of holography with a neat logo

401 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:38:01am

re: #395 Oh no...Sand People!

I will readily agree with you on that. I'd say the 'real' experts on the drug war are people like the doctors who have concluded that marijuana is far less harmful than alcohol and the law enforcement personnel who have concluded that criminalizing such behavior only leads to creating more criminals, in the end. And that is because, as you pointed out earlier, I have read their arguments and been persuaded by them. But there is no overall system that actually accepts the scientific results of the doctors and ties it to legislation; we still claim, governmentally, that marijuana is more harmful than alcohol, when it is not.

I'm not saying there isn't a problem, but I am saying that we need to find a solution to the problem.

402 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:38:40am

re: #355 NJDhockeyfan

Media Bias Is Real, Finds UCLA Political Scientist

Huh? Bartender, I'll have a shot of whatever they were drinking. It's gotta be about 190 proof...

William

403 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:39:42am

re: #402 wlewisiii

Huh? Bartender, I'll have a shot of whatever they were drinking. It's gotta be about 190 proof...

William

I'll be sitting next to you....

404 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:41:11am

re: #399 MandyManners

Darwin's Dangerous Idea isn't very math heavy, but it is discussing the algorithms that lie behind evolution. It's mainly a review of how deeply Darwin's discoveries changed modern science, philosophy, and thought, and talks about the need to develop a philosophy of engineering, a philosophy of Design Space.

It is also very honestly an atheist book; a large part of its argument is a 'skyhook vs. crane' analogy, demonstrating that there is never actually a need to resort to 'skyhooks' (supernatural events or processes) to explain anything.

He does also kick the living shit out of Chomsky's views on consciousness, as well.

It is the most intellectually stimulating book I have ever read.

405 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:45:58am

re: #404 Obdicut

Darwin's Dangerous Idea isn't very math heavy, but it is discussing the algorithms that lie behind evolution. It's mainly a review of how deeply Darwin's discoveries changed modern science, philosophy, and thought, and talks about the need to develop a philosophy of engineering, a philosophy of Design Space.

It is also very honestly an atheist book; a large part of its argument is a 'skyhook vs. crane' analogy, demonstrating that there is never actually a need to resort to 'skyhooks' (supernatural events or processes) to explain anything.

He does also kick the living shit out of Chomsky's views on consciousness, as well.

It is the most intellectually stimulating book I have ever read.

Anything that kicks the shit out of Chomsky has gotta' be good.

406 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:46:58am
407 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:47:48am

re: #364 Obdicut

USA Today as the most centrist looked correct. So does this... IMO
"If viewers spent an equal amount of time watching Fox's 'Special Report' as ABC's 'World News' and NBC's 'Nightly News,' then they would receive a nearly perfectly balanced version of the news," said Milyo, an associate professor of economics and public affairs at the University of Missouri at Columbia.

408 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:53:06am

re: #407 Rightwingconspirator

That seems idiotic to me, I'm sorry. If they spent an equal amount of time watching those channels, they would receive a bunch of misinformation and oversimplified glosses on complex subjects.

I think the problem I have with any sort of examination like that is that the MSM is, above all else, wildly inaccurate, and presents information in a format that requires that all nuance be stripped away. I also don't think that there is any sort of simple left/right political axis that 'balance' can be achieved on.

409 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:54:55am

When I was in J-school, we were told to write for someone with an eighth-grade education.

410 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:00:36am

re: #408 Obdicut

Well you have a good point-Their inadequacies outshine their biases. But given the vast amount of anti Israel bias we have seen, within the misinformation, well it seems to come around in a circle. Idiotic as it may seem we got what we have. (insert irony icon)

411 Charles Johnson  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:01:54am

Ignorant slut Tim Blair replies, and says I'm "agitated."

Actually, there's nothing agitated in this post. Blair's just a right wing clown doing tricks for his Murdoch owned paper, and I couldn't be less "agitated" at his continuing smear attempts -- the correct word is "scornful."

412 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:03:34am

re: #408 Obdicut

Another point I would repeat from many previous posts-The bias is a result of the ratings chase, the politics just fall as per "popular" viewing habits evolution or whim.

It's like fine music (objective reportage) vs pop music (what we have on TV and in print)

413 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:05:05am

Hamas raids NGO offices in Gaza... where is the internaional outrage?

Hamas’s security forces on Monday and Tuesday raided the offices of several non-governmental organizations in the Gaza Strip and confiscated equipment and furniture, drawing sharp condemnations from human rights groups.

The sources said the raids were carried out by agents belonging to Hamas’s Internal Security apparatus without court permission.

Hamas spokesmen in the Gaza Strip on Thursday refused to comment on the raids.

After conducting a thorough search of the offices of the organizations, the Hamas security agents confiscated files, documents, computers, fax machines and other equipment.

The agents also informed the managers and workers of the organizations of the Hamas government’s decision to close them down indefinitely.

The Gaza-based Al-Mezan Center for Human Rights expressed outrage over the raids and called on the Hamas government to open an investigation.

“Al-Mezan condemns these assaults against NGOs and views them with much concern,” the center said. “Al-Mezan calls on the Gaza government to initiate an investigation into these acts, ensure full respect of the law, and protect the right of NGOs to work freely.”

414 insanity police  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:07:56am

Charles has remained a staunch defender of Israel. I applaud him for that.

415 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:08:16am

re: #413 Joo-LiZ

Hamas raids NGO offices in Gaza... where is the internaional outrage?

Same place it was when the Egyptians gassed Gazans in the tunnels.

416 insanity police  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:08:40am

re: #411 Charles

You may have to upgrade him to a "slunt"

417 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:09:02am

re: #406 Cannadian Club Akbar

I'm sure this has been posted. Makes me feel all warm and fuzzy.

"I am actually pretty confident this is going to work," BP COO Doug Suttles said on "Good Morning America."

And I'm actually pretty happy to hear that, Doug. After six previous failures, maybe this will actually succeed. Too bad you never foresaw this kind of a catastrophe beforehand, but that would require a type of intelligence and responsibility which you appear to lack. For the sake of the people and the environment down there, I hope you succeed this time. As for your sorry ass, consider yourself lucky if it doesn't end up doing prison time.

418 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:10:38am

Does Israel give these people their boats back? Maybe if they confiscated them it could provide a financial reason for these groups to think twice about trying to break the blockade.

419 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:13:25am

It's quiet in here...


ECHO

420 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:13:52am

echo...


....o

421 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:13:58am

re: #418 Killgore Trout

Does Israel give these people their boats back? Maybe if they confiscated them it could provide a financial reason for these groups to think twice about trying to break the blockade.

Israel is not a nation of pirates...
Although if they hired the Somali Pirates to hang out you'd never see a Free Gaza boat for hundreds of miles...

422 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:14:47am

re: #418 Killgore Trout

Does Israel give these people their boats back? Maybe if they confiscated them it could provide a financial reason for these groups to think twice about trying to break the blockade.

Excellent idea.

423 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:14:56am

re: #419 Joo-LiZ

It's quiet in here...

ECHO

I'll bet you 5 bucks you read this...

424 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:16:27am

re: #417 ryannon

7th try. Oklahoma, Nebraska, North Dakota.

425 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:16:41am

re: #413 Joo-LiZ

Nice catch. Page that! I want to send out links to it.

426 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:17:23am

re: #334 NJDhockeyfan

Whoa...

Lift the Siege of Gaza
by Pat Buchanan

It gets worse...

This news surprised anyone?

427 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:18:03am

Aerial Footage of Israeli Navy Soldiers Boarding 7th Flotilla Ship

No ambush, no deaths. It's not that difficult.

428 ryannon  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:18:39am

re: #418 Killgore Trout

Does Israel give these people their boats back? Maybe if they confiscated them it could provide a financial reason for these groups to think twice about trying to break the blockade.

Give them back? Say it ain't so. Scuttle them at sea, or use them for target practice by their naval forces.

Why do they always have to play nice?

429 Four More Tears  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:18:44am

re: #418 Killgore Trout

Does Israel give these people their boats back? Maybe if they confiscated them it could provide a financial reason for these groups to think twice about trying to break the blockade.

Bad idea, like Hoops said.

I'd at least take a dump on the captain's chair, though...

430 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:18:47am

re: #421 HoosierHoops

Israel is not a nation of pirates...
Although if they hired the Somali Pirates to hang out you'd never see a Free Gaza boat for hundreds of miles...

I think it's within the law to confiscate ships breaking a blockade.

431 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:19:19am

re: #345 sattv4u2


NOW ,, the question is WHY is he so prominent on MS/NBC. My own opinion is to "show" their audience what troglodytes "rightys" are
"look at Buchanan,, he's the voice of the right,, see,, we have him right here on our shows,,, look how he is !!"

I've heard this voiced many many times.

I will believe it when I see mainstream right-wing voices routinely denouncing him.

432 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:19:42am

re: #427 Killgore Trout

Aerial Footage of Israeli Navy Soldiers Boarding 7th Flotilla Ship


[Video]No ambush, no deaths. It's not that difficult no paintguns.


Hard lesson learned...

433 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:21:37am

re: #427 Killgore Trout

Aerial Footage of Israeli Navy Soldiers Boarding 7th Flotilla Ship

[Video]

No ambush, no deaths. It's not that difficult.

Who was the captain of the ship with terrorists on it?

434 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:22:13am

Laws of Blockade

The enemy warship may still seize the merchant ship and send it to a friendly port, but they must then PAY the owners for the cargo.
....
You cannot just SINK an enemy ship, under either of these scenarios, unless it attempts armed resistance or flight and, even then, you must make all efforts to use less than deadly force to stop the merchant vessel, such as firing a shot across the bows. You may sink the merchant ship if, and only if, it is in real and imminent danger of recapture by the other guys.

435 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:22:19am

re: #430 Killgore Trout

I can think of some amusing replacement characters painted on the deck now.

jdpost.com maybe?

436 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:22:30am

re: #425 Rightwingconspirator

Nice catch. Page that! I want to send out links to it.

Paged.


Toronto, yesterday, Friday June 4:
"Viva Viva Palestina, Viva Viva Intifada"

Pro-Israel counter-demonstration (slideshow montage -- photos of both sides)

437 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:22:46am

re: #433 MandyManners

Who was the captain of the ship with terrorists on it?

I don't know.

438 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:22:56am

re: #430 Killgore Trout

I think it's within the law to confiscate ships breaking a blockade.

I don't think that would be a good idea...PR Nightmare...

439 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:23:57am

re: #433 MandyManners

Who was the captain of the ship with terrorists on it?

This time around, I don't think we can call them terrorists.

Naive, Stupid, Useful Idiots, Enablers, yes. But there was no IHH, and these guys offered no violence.

440 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:25:03am

re: #436 Joo-LiZ

Cool. BRB!

441 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:27:25am

This day is not working out for me. BBL.

442 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:28:07am

re: #438 HoosierHoops

I don't think that would be a good idea...PR Nightmare...

Israel is so concerned with the PR that they released and deported EVERYONE without interrogating them as the IDF had wanted to.

There was probably a lot of good intel they could have gotten from the IHH folks.

I dunno if anyone else has made the connection, but I have and wanted to point it out for others.

We KNOW that there were two IHH members who were found with IDF guns with no ammo left in the clips (they emptied them out, shooting)

We KNOW that the IDF found casings of non-IDF-issue weapons, and the captain of the ship has admitted that the mercenaries through their weapons overboard as the IDF was boarding.

We KNOW that two of the IDF soldiers had 2 bullet wounds.

There were 9 killed, but very many wounded. The anti-Israel choir is making a big deal out of supposed autopsies in Turkey which show that the activists were shot at close range and in the back in some cases. I think it is not unlikely that many of the wounded were not wounded by actual commando fire, but rather were shot by their own, in order to maximize the propaganda impact of the incident.

443 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:28:36am

re: #436 Joo-LiZ

Paged.


Toronto, yesterday, Friday June 4:
"Viva Viva Palestina, Viva Viva Intifada"

[Video]

Where do you get these gems?!

444 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:30:03am

re: #443 MandyManners

Where do you get these gems?!

I think that one was through facebook.

I'm quite involved with the jewish student community in Canada, so I have a lot of friends who get this kind of stuff sent to them as representatives of official jewish organizations.

445 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:30:11am

re: #437 Killgore Trout

I don't know.

I asked because I noticed how the captain of the ship in that video took control of the situation and his passengers. Makes me think that the captain of the terrorist ship was either incredibly incompetent or a tersymp/terrorist himself.

446 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:30:43am

re: #439 Joo-LiZ

This time around, I don't think we can call them terrorists.

Naive, Stupid, Useful Idiots, Enablers, yes. But there was no IHH, and these guys offered no violence.

That's what I'm saying.

447 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:30:49am

re: #442 Joo-LiZ

What of the reports that the killings were as a result of the recovery mission to get some captured marines back? It has been reported one marine got 6 himself. Too thin a source maybe?

448 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:31:21am

re: #441 Cannadian Club Akbar

This day is not working out for me. BBL.

Overcast and rainy here...You work all week for the weekend and it's just ugly..The only thing in the pool is 2 geese..Question: They drink the pool water.. They are going to get sick aren't they? Sure stop in Indiana on the way to Canada..But don't drink the water!

449 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:32:21am

re: #442 Joo-LiZ

Israel is so concerned with the PR that they released and deported EVERYONE without interrogating them as the IDF had wanted to.

There was probably a lot of good intel they could have gotten from the IHH folks.

I dunno if anyone else has made the connection, but I have and wanted to point it out for others.

We KNOW that there were two IHH members who were found with IDF guns with no ammo left in the clips (they emptied them out, shooting)

We KNOW that the IDF found casings of non-IDF-issue weapons, and the captain of the ship has admitted that the mercenaries through their weapons overboard as the IDF was boarding.

We KNOW that two of the IDF soldiers had 2 bullet wounds.

There were 9 killed, but very many wounded. The anti-Israel choir is making a big deal out of supposed autopsies in Turkey which show that the activists were shot at close range and in the back in some cases. I think it is not unlikely that many of the wounded were not wounded by actual commando fire, but rather were shot by their own, in order to maximize the propaganda impact of the incident.

That might be a stretch. In close combat situations I'm sure that many get shot in the back. Shit happens very fast.

450 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:32:46am

re: #445 MandyManners

It had to be. They took the trouble to get and train terrorists to attack, the captain must have been chosen for the mission.

451 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:32:52am

re: #444 Joo-LiZ

I think that one was through facebook.

I'm quite involved with the jewish student community in Canada, so I have a lot of friends who get this kind of stuff sent to them as representatives of official jewish organizations.

Your posting them here gives them a huge audience!

452 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:33:18am

re: #447 Rightwingconspirator

What of the reports that the killings were as a result of the recovery mission to get some captured marines back? It has been reported one marine got 6 himself. Too thin a source maybe?

No, that was on the top deck, and by the commando himself.

I'm not saying the 9 were killed by their own. Only that the commandos were restrained in their fire and there would appear to be many bullets missing if at least two of the mercenaries emptied entire clips, but only 2 commandos were hit.

I suspect that without that factor, we would have heard about 9 dead, a couple injured, instead of dozens.

453 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:33:48am

re: #450 Rightwingconspirator

It had to be. They took the trouble to get and train terrorists to attack, the captain must have been chosen for the mission.

Who is he?

I'm gonna' go to FGM's site to see if I can find out.

454 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:34:13am

re: #452 Joo-LiZ

Oh got it. I misunderstood. Sorry.

455 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:34:35am

re: #449 MandyManners

That might be a stretch. In close combat situations I'm sure that many get shot in the back. Shit happens very fast.

From the video it appeared to be pure mayhem top side

456 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:34:43am

re: #453 MandyManners

Who is he?

I'm gonna' go to FGM's site to see if I can find out.

Here it is for anyone who wants to look.

[Link: www.freegaza.org...]

457 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:34:54am

re: #446 MandyManners

That's what I'm saying.

Ohhhh, misread your post.

My bad. I saw you were quoting a post with footage from the MV Rachel Corrie and were referring to them

458 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:35:33am

Passengers.

[Link: www.freegaza.org...]

459 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:39:12am

re: #436 Joo-LiZ

I hadn't read the subtext in the video I posted there -- I only posted it for the photos. Just sayin'

460 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:43:20am

Twitter:

RT @ismpalestine: Make no mistake, #RachelCorrie was illegally commandeered by Israel. Act itself was violent even if no 1 was hurt.@biobio

They sound terribly upset that they don't have more violence they can use to smear Israel with.

461 SixDegrees  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:43:59am

re: #449 MandyManners

That might be a stretch. In close combat situations I'm sure that many get shot in the back. Shit happens very fast.

Quite possible. On the other hand, Hamas isn't above using corpses as props; they've hauled bodies out of the local morgue in the past and "posed" them for propaganda effect, just as they're painted red crosses on rubble and rigged ambulances to make it appear that medical facilities and personnel were deliberately targeted.

Or it could just be the result of close-in fighting.

Note to Israel - videotape the bodies next time, before you return them, during your own mini-autopsy.

462 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:45:03am

Shane Dillon (36)
Dublin, Ireland

Shane is an Irish Seafarer. He has served as Chief Officer on Irish and Briish merchant ships, and is now based in Dublin.

463 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:45:15am

re: #449 MandyManners

That might be a stretch. In close combat situations I'm sure that many get shot in the back. Shit happens very fast.

Here is what I am talking about



Flotilla activists 'shot 30 times'

Autopsies on bodies of activists killed in Israel's attack on a Gaza-bound aid flotilla five days ago indicate that the victims were shot multiple times at close range.

Britain's Guardian newspaper quoted Yalcin Buyuk, the vice-chairman of the Turkish council of forensic medicine, as saying that the nine men were shot a total of 30 times.

Two men were shot four times, and five of the victims were shot either in the back of the head or in the back, Buyuk told the newspaper, based on preliminary autopsy reports.

464 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:46:08am

Denis Healey
Denis has been involved with boats for 45 years, beginning with small fishing boats in Portsmouth.
He has been captain of the Dignity on several successful voyages to Gaza, and was captain of the Spirit when it was highjacked by Israeli Naval forces in July 2009.
Denis learned to sail while at school and has been part of the sea ever since. He's a certified yachtmaster and has also worked on heavy marine equipment from yachts to large dredgers.

465 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:46:31am

This is speculation, by the way.

466 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:46:58am

Giorgos Klontzas (39)
Agios Nikolaos, Greece

George Klontzas is a professional diver and sailor. He was captain of the Liberty on the first voyage in August 2008, and captain of the Spirit of Humanity in January 2009

467 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:47:17am

More twitter

RT @GazaUnderSiege: Gaza has been under a siege for 1088 days. #Gaza #Israel #Egypt #Zionism #Flotilla #RachelCorrie #BDS

Gilad Shalit has been held captive for 1441 days.

468 Mickey Blumental  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:48:36am

re: #463 Joo-LiZ

What is this? A videogame? One shot per attacker? Of course they'll shoot them multiple times in a life threatening situation. You make it sound as if each "activist" was shot 30 times.

469 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:49:24am

No one is listed as the captain.

470 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:49:39am

re: #468 Udon

What is this? A videogame? One shot per attacker? Of course they'll shoot them multiple times in a life threatening situation. You make it sound as if each "activist" was shot 30 times.

Read up a bit, you jumped into our conversation a bit late.

471 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:50:53am

re: #461 SixDegrees

Quite possible. On the other hand, Hamas isn't above using corpses as props; they've hauled bodies out of the local morgue in the past and "posed" them for propaganda effect, just as they're painted red crosses on rubble and rigged ambulances to make it appear that medical facilities and personnel were deliberately targeted.

Or it could just be the result of close-in fighting.

Note to Israel - videotape the bodies next time, before you return them, during your own mini-autopsy.

I remember similar bullshit during the last war with Lebanon Syria.

472 Mickey Blumental  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:51:18am

re: #470 Joo-LiZ

I do that a lot! :)

473 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:51:30am

re: #463 Joo-LiZ

Multiple wounds are likely.

474 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:52:15am

re: #468 Udon

What is this? A videogame? One shot per attacker? Of course they'll shoot them multiple times in a life threatening situation. You make it sound as if each "activist" was shot 30 times.

Don't be mean to Liz.

475 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:52:35am

re: #473 MandyManners

I'm not disagreeing. I'm just saying that there is a lot of unnaccounted for ammunition, with 2 empty clips and only 2 bullets in soldiers.

I think it is something everyone is ignoring.

476 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:53:29am

I've searched the FGM site quite a bit but I cannot find the name of the captain.

Is there a registry somewhere on which ships must list their captains?

477 Øyvind Strømmen  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:54:12am

re: #467 Joo-LiZ

More twitter

Gilad Shalit has been held captive for 1441 days.

Gilad Shalit, thus, is one of the 1,4 million people held hostage by Hamas in Gaza.

478 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:54:23am

re: #475 Joo-LiZ

I'm not disagreeing. I'm just saying that there is a lot of unnaccounted for ammunition, with 2 empty clips and only 2 bullets in soldiers.

I think it is something everyone is ignoring.

A large part of me wants to chalk it up to "shit happens" and quadruple that in a battle. This was a battle.

479 Joo-LiZ  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:56:00am

re: #477 oslogin

Gilad Shalit, thus, is one of the 1,4 million people held hostage by Hamas in Gaza.

Indeed.

The world's ire is highly misdirected -- we need to find a way to refocus it on Hamas.

480 MandyManners  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:57:08am

re: #479 Joo-LiZ

Indeed.

The world's ire is highly misdirected -- we need to find a way to refocus it on Hamas.

Thanks to the MFM, Hamas is golden.

481 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:57:37am

re: #479 Joo-LiZ

Not just on Hamas. On all the governments of the Middle East.

The reason this is not done, in general, is because modern industrialized society is dependent on oil.

Not until we move away from oil as our chief energy source will this narrative change.

482 BenghaziHoops  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:58:36am

re: #477 oslogin

Gilad Shalit, thus, is one of the 1,4 million people held hostage by Hamas in Gaza.

I pray to God they are not torturing Gilad...

483 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:58:47am

re: #480 MandyManners

Thanks to the MFM, Hamas is golden.

No. Thanks to economics, the travesties of governments in the Middle East will be excused by all, even those who are hailed as friends of Israel. Until we stop using oil for energy generation.

Saudi Arabia are our allies. Saudi Arabia produce huge amounts of anti-Israel and anti-Western propaganda.

484 Cato the Elder  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 10:11:48am

re: #483 Obdicut

No. Thanks to economics, the travesties of governments in the Middle East will be excused by all, even those who are hailed as friends of Israel. Until we stop using oil for energy generation.

Saudi Arabia are our allies. Saudi Arabia produce huge amounts of anti-Israel and anti-Western propaganda.

Good luck with that.

485 Tigger2005  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 10:35:11am

re: #442 Joo-LiZ

There were 9 killed, but very many wounded. The anti-Israel choir is making a big deal out of supposed autopsies in Turkey which show that the activists were shot at close range and in the back in some cases. I think it is not unlikely that many of the wounded were not wounded by actual commando fire, but rather were shot by their own, in order to maximize the propaganda impact of the incident.

Which would go a long way toward explaining the dead American. The Israelis would have had no idea who he was. The people on that ship would not have been above shooting the American in an attempt to further damage U.S./Israel relations.

I suppose one could say a flaw in your analysis is that the "activists" could not have known the autopsies would not be conducted in Israel. But of course that would not make a great deal of difference...Israel would just be accused of making wild accusations and covering things up.

486 Øyvind Strømmen  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 10:36:42am

re: #475 Joo-LiZ

I'm not disagreeing. I'm just saying that there is a lot of unnaccounted for ammunition, with 2 empty clips and only 2 bullets in soldiers.

I think it is something everyone is ignoring.

You seem to presume that all bullets somehow hit a human target?

487 Boogberg  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 10:57:33am

re: #360 Killgore Trout

Living In Oblivion is pretty good. It seems a little self indulgent film about making films at first but stick with it and it's actually a very interesting way to tell a story.

Haha! That was awesome. Buscemi is good in eccentric movies like this. Two thumbs up. :D

488 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 11:55:27am

re: #484 Cato the Elder

Good luck with that.

Good luck with anything difficult or complex in this world.

Better than just waiting to die.

489 Sacred Plants  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:34:54pm

re: #411 Charles

Ignorant slut Tim Blair replies, and says I'm "agitated."

Actually, there's nothing agitated in this post. Blair's just a right wing clown doing tricks for his Murdoch owned paper, and I couldn't be less "agitated" at his continuing smear attempts -- the correct word is "scornful."

There is a sexual connotation in your rhetorics which shouldn´t be there if this was all just about left and right and the competition. It does not need a bigot to tell that even among regulars of this blog, the Arctic Sea incident, the Dubai Hotel killing and the Gaza Flotilla raid have increased the awareness for the limits of government power. It is centrism which is losing in this, big time and rightly so, and the surveillance lobby with its insane government run stalking. Tim Blair may be somebody´s useful idiot, but that doesn´t give you a right to sexually abuse him on your blog.

490 Charles Johnson  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:54:39pm

re: #489 Sacred Plants

Your sacred plants seem to be affecting your reasoning abilities. Might want to lay off for a bit.

491 Obdicut  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 12:59:51pm

re: #489 Sacred Plants

Referencing a classic Saturday Night Live skit is not sexual abuse, just as boarding a ship is not an assault.

492 Fozzie Bear  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:13:16pm

Ok, I missed the prior posts, so I apologize if I what I say has already been repeated ad-nauseum, but...

I was one of the people who questioned the wisdom of Israel during the blockade. I'd like to put a couple of things down for the record.

1. After having been shown countless links, videos, etc. here, I no longer think that Israel did anything wrong in the sense that I can't think of anything better they could have done that would not have resulted in loss of life. So I'm a hippy moonbat, whatever.
2. Questioning the wisdom of boarding that ship IS NOT the same thing as being anti-Israel. I saw several posters including myself take issue with boarding that ship in that way. I saw very little in the way of actual Israel bashing and active anti-Semitism.
3. Every time somebody did say something actually "anti-Israel", their karma took a dip, and fast, often followed by a ban. This is NOT a friendly place for anti-Semites to hang. I have no fucking idea where Mr. Blair gets this from.
4. This is the ONLY active political blog I have found where a wide mix of views are represented, fact-based debate occurs with lots of sourcing, and everyone piles on idiots quickly and brutally. I have never seen a ban for simply disagreeing. I have seen bans for being an asshole.
5. Since when can you get any large group of people together and have them all agree on everything? Does this guy actually think that if Charles hosts a blog wherein there is some small amount of dissent on any issue related to Israel, that this means Charles is a leftist? Wtf?

This Blair guy is a dick. I have no idea what your history is with him, but when I read that, I was astounded by how off the mark he is.

Just my .02.

493 Sacred Plants  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 1:38:51pm

re: #490 Charles

Your sacred plants seem to be affecting your reasoning abilities. Might want to lay off for a bit.

I understand I am over the target.

494 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:40:55pm

re: #489 Sacred Plants

There is a sexual connotation in your rhetorics which shouldn´t be there if this was all just about left and right and the competition. It does not need a bigot to tell that even among regulars of this blog, the Arctic Sea incident, the Dubai Hotel killing and the Gaza Flotilla raid have increased the awareness for the limits of government power. It is centrism which is losing in this, big time and rightly so, and the surveillance lobby with its insane government run stalking. Tim Blair may be somebody´s useful idiot, but that doesn´t give you a right to sexually abuse him on your blog.

hahahaha what in the christ are you talking about, it's a goddamn Saturday Night Live reference, possibly the most recognized single SNL reference of all time

495 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:43:30pm

re: #483 Obdicut

Saudi Arabia are our allies. Saudi Arabia produce huge amounts of anti-Israel and anti-Western propaganda.


Bolded for truth. There's a lot of people here who will happily look the other way that one of our allies is fucking over another one of our allies.

And of course they complain about all the middle eastern countries that are NOT our allies that are down on Israel (and rightly so) while conspicuously leaving out the one that is! *because they're intellectually dishonest)

496 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 2:46:48pm

re: #481 Obdicut

Not just on Hamas. On all the governments of the Middle East.

The reason this is not done, in general, is because modern industrialized society is dependent on oil.

Not until we move away from oil as our chief energy source will this narrative change
.

And this narrative is considered to be a leftist narrative (OMG EARTH DAY DAMN HIPPIES GLENN BECK SAID TO BURN TIRES ON EARTH DAY LETS DO THAT) so it'll be always be ignored, overlooked and reacted with hostility by the right wing.

497 Fozzie Bear  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 3:55:40pm

re: #494 WindUpBird

hahahaha what in the christ are you talking about, it's a goddamn Saturday Night Live reference, possibly the most recognized single SNL reference of all time

Seriously, if anybody doesn't understand why this post has "ignorant slut" in the headline, you need to google the phrase "Jane, you ignorant slut".

498 [deleted]  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 8:47:56pm
499 Morrisminor  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:29:55pm

Of course all right wing Xtian types simply love Israel and the Jews. It's only leftists who hate Jews. So Mel G. and Pat B. must be left wing. Even though Israel was started by leftist Jews and the left is still heavily Jewish.
/neocon "analytic" mind at work

500 ClaudeMonet  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:38:01pm

re: #284 Gus 802

I'm still scratching my head but you know that "rage and hate" line is playing the victim card. It's pretty typical with lefties.

I remember a couple of years ago I quickly double parked at a construction site to ask a client a question when along came some dorky liberal who made a scene and end up calling me "unethical" for doing so. I was like WTF, unethical? It was like arguing with Bantu.

You know what it was? I had a "Don't Tread on Me" bumper sticker along with the American flag and a USA sticker at the time.

You should have seen the multiple keyings of my car in 2005 at a regional theater convention for my having committed the high crime of having a "W" sticker on my car, left over from the previous year's election. Or what happened to a few cars that had McCain stickers two years ago.

Freedom of speech in action.

My next car will have a flag, a "Support Our Troops" sticker, and one that says, "Shut Up, Hang Up, Drive". Or I may go the other route, one that says, "I Don't Give A F*** About Your Opinion."

501 ClaudeMonet  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:46:37pm

re: #312 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

On May 27, 2010, outside a White House Jewish heritage event, Thomas stated that Israel "should get the hell out of Palestine" and that Palestine is a country of occupation, whose occupiers should leave the region, returning to "Poland, Germany and America and everywhere else". Thomas subsequently issued a statement of regret on her personal web site.

So... back off man!

BS. Imagine if a white "journalist" from a supposedly reputable organization said that about blacks, Hispanics, or Asians. They'd have been fired withing minutes, or "resigned to pursue other opportunities.

This crazy old b**** gets away with this stuff because of her longevity, the very thing the left assails politicians for. If there should be term limits for politicians, perhaps there should be term limits for political reporters.

Maybe Helen Thomas should retire. Or go back wherever her ancestors lived. Or join her ancestors.

OTOH, maybe this is the best way. Her attitude has clearly been anti-Israel for a long time, perhaps this open hatred will awaken some people.

502 Charles Johnson  Sat, Jun 5, 2010 10:13:11pm

re: #498 Sancho

And with that comment, you are cordially invited to go piss on somebody else's carpet.

503 Morrisminor  Sun, Jun 6, 2010 10:21:30am

re: #284 Gus 802

Maybe he was upset with you because you were tying up traffic with your selfish maneuver. I hate double parkers, you had no excuse at all. Double parkers are too lazy, inconsiderate and unethical to take an extra minute to find a legal space to park.

504 Sacred Plants  Tue, Jun 8, 2010 11:00:47am

re: #491 Obdicut
re: #494 WindUpBird
re: #497 Fozzie Bear

Three different people coming up with the same lame excuse should tell me something. The Urban Dictionary suggests that the phrase was a trademark for weaseling. But that does not make it anything less abusive.


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