Jump to bottom

743 comments
1 Achilles Tang  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:16:38pm

What. No arguments yet?

2 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:18:17pm

re: #1 Naso Tang

What. No arguments yet?

gimmie time to watch the vid...

3 Daniel Ballard  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:20:07pm

They argue and I had to go upstairs?! Wtf?
Just kidding.

4 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:23:14pm

I am no military expert but I seem to recall that holding the high ground has always been desirable...

5 Daniel Ballard  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:30:18pm

So there are no real winners in AGW, but there appear to be 2 big players that think they are AGW winners, or can be with sufficient will and force. I can imagine a fight over the new northernmost seas and passages.

6 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:30:28pm

Global warming is inevitable. No one is willing to make the necessary changes to their own personal lifestyle. To yours maybe, but leave mine alone.

Nuclear power plants in America? Forget it. Nowhere to put the waste. It's too much trouble.

Solar? No way! Those panels block my view, they're expensive and require too much effort.

Windmills? Dead birds!

Get used to warm weather people.

7 abolitionist  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:33:08pm

I believe energy shortages due to finite supplies of fossil fuels (and our slowness to address those issues) are going to have serious impacts much sooner than climate change --on food supplies, economies, politics, etc.

8 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:33:59pm

re: #5 Rightwingconspirator

So there are no real winners in AGW, but there appear to be 2 big players that think they are AGW winners, or can be with sufficient will and force. I can imagine a fight over the new northernmost seas and passages.

Well, Russia is one, but what's the other?

9 Daniel Ballard  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:37:14pm

re: #8 Dark_Falcon

China, given a propensity for epic scale manipulation of water and earth. A strategic view that assumes what hurts the west hastens their rise to global influence on a Soviet scale. A willingness to absorb epic casualties for the good of the nation.

10 Jerk  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:37:39pm

No wonder the Jetsons lived in such a tall home.

11 Daniel Ballard  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:38:03pm

re: #10 Jerk

LOL!

12 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:38:31pm

re: #7 abolitionist

I believe energy shortages due to finite supplies of fossil fuels (and our slowness to address those issues) are going to have serious impacts much sooner than climate change --on food supplies, economies, politics, etc.

Possibly. They still haven't capped the leak in the gulf yet either. We could have a global catastrophe in a few moths if they don't plug the damn hole.

13 freetoken  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:39:41pm

re: #6 Racer X


Get used to warm weather people.


"Warm weather" is not a very good summary of the problem.

What the speakers in the video are summarizing is that what used to take millennia to occur - changes in agriculture (what plants and where), large scale migrations over continents of the habitable areas for humans, the drowning of sea side human habitations - will be compressed into a century or so.

Yet again my lament is that the changes that are happening, as real as they may be, are too slow to grab the attention of enough people to make big enough changes, in order to minimize the problem.

That is why climate change is not very politically potent.

There has been much written on this of late.

re: #7 abolitionist

I believe energy shortages due to finite supplies of fossil fuels (and our slowness to address those issues) are going to have serious impacts much sooner than climate change --on food supplies, economies, politics, etc.

I tend to agree with you. Over the next 3 decades climate change will be real and measurable, but changes in oil supply will be much more obvious.

Another player in this is the limited coal resources for China and the rest of Asia. Russia has large deposits of coal and will likely be the exporter of choice to Asia, since rail is the most efficient way to transport the stuff. This will change the security dynamic of Asia (along with Russia being the exporter of last resort for natural gas.) Also, while India has notable coal resources they tend to be lower quality so even today they import, by barge, higher quality coal from SE Asia.

14 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:40:24pm

Semi-ot: This is going to be interesting A 33 degree temperature jump in two days. It's going to be hell on the garden.

15 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:41:41pm

re: #9 Rightwingconspirator

China, given a propensity for epic scale manipulation of water and earth. A strategic view that assumes what hurts the west hastens their rise to global influence on a Soviet scale. A willingness to absorb epic casualties for the good of the nation.

I think they're wrong about that. China is so dependent on imported food that AGW is more likely to result in societal collapse. Russia might indeed gain advantage, but China should fear AGW far more than the US.

16 Daniel Ballard  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:43:18pm

re: #13 freetoken

His point seems to me to be deal with it. Adapt as needed as it is happening. Play the resources for the adaption rather than prevention. He might be right.

17 freetoken  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:44:33pm

re: #14 Killgore Trout

I used to grow various plants here (in San Diego). One morning I watched (as a "santa ana" developed) the temps rise from a low near freezing (it was about 34F) to well above 90F, in one morning, while the humidity dropped into the low single digits. Needless to say some of the plants were none too happy.

18 Daniel Ballard  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:44:58pm

re: #15 Dark_Falcon

You are correct but I think but apparently they have a different conclusion. Just look at their global warming policy and their coal reality.

19 Daniel Ballard  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:45:24pm

re: #18 Rightwingconspirator

PIMF
One butt too many.

20 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:49:10pm

re: #17 freetoken

I used to grow various plants here (in San Diego). One morning I watched (as a "santa ana" developed) the temps rise from a low near freezing (it was about 34F) to well above 90F, in one morning, while the humidity dropped into the low single digits. Needless to say some of the plants were none too happy.

Ouch. I've sort of resigned myself to garden failure this summer so I won't be too bummed. I suspect I'm going to loose a lot to leaf burn. I pretty much have my money to build a nice big greenhouse this fall so that should carry me through the winter. I'll get some shade cloth to cover the tadpoles so the don't cook but everything else will have to fend for itself.

21 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:56:40pm

re: #18 Rightwingconspirator

You are correct but I think but apparently they have a different conclusion. Just look at their global warming policy and their coal reality.

Well, we'll see who's right.

22 freetoken  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 5:57:51pm

I mentioned downstairs the story today about a Dutch agency that owned up to giving an inaccurate bit of geographic detail about their country (regarding the % below sea level) to the IPCC, which then the IPCC dutifully copied into their AR4.

Sure enough that story is getting big play in the denial-o-sphere.

That same report today from the Dutch agency also concluded that mistake made no difference in the results of the IPCC. That part of the story is being ignored of course.

Another thing the Dutch report mentioned is that the AR4 conclusions focused mostly on the negative effects of AGW. (And rightfully so, in my opinion - lots of examples to choose from, but look at any daily national news report in this country where the news is about the daily catastrophe and not that the fact that some people had a sunny day somewhere in the country.)

Anyway, that conclusion too is being spinned into so great conspiracy.

There is an entire industry out there that now lives on denigrating the IPCC. Part of that has to do with the IPCC being a UN organization, and the anti-UN sentiment is quite strong in nationalistic movements around the world (not just in the US, though it is particularly strong, and weird, here in the US.)

23 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:00:44pm

Excellent video.

Let's recap some points.

I'll go from least awful to most awful:

1. 1.5-2.0 m rise in sea level by 2100. That in of itself will produce 500 million to one billion refugees, not to mention the complete collapse of our major coastal cities and coastal infrastructure. Hundreds of millions without homes and trillions of dollars lost. I recall the many here who called me chicken little for telling you the science first. I wish the science were different.

2. Mass starvation as eco systems fail. As I have pointed out many times here the United States is potentially facing a 95% reduction in crop output. That is worst case scenario admittedly. As the admiral pointed out, all models have been consistently outpaced by the actual changes we are seeing as things begin to change at exponential rates.

3. Three meals from anarchy. Starving people have the choice of fighting or dying. Governments will collapse, our military will be called nito more and more urban conflicts and then eventually, to keep mass waves of migrants out of America to protect our own dwindling supplies. We will be forced to send out soldiers to murder starving families trying to get here. Then when our food fails, they will have to determine who gets fed and who doesn't/

4. Loss of fresh water. 55 million Americans get there water from melts that will no longer be there. You can not live without water. Those people must move. Yes, in the long run, survivors might learn to be fremen, but most will perish. World wide the issue is larger.

5. Collapse of oceanic eco systems. This is the gift that keeps killing. The loss of food supply and oxygen supply from the oceans in the long terms will be utterly catastrophic. It will take thousands of years to turn that around. There have been mass extinctions in the past from such events. It can happen again.

Understand that from a military perspective we are looking at a global collapse and these generals and admirals are saying that they as the military will not be able to hold it all together. We act now in the coming decades or we face the complete collapse of our civilization. It is that simple. There is no more important issue. There is no more important challenge. Failure is not an option and we are failing.

Fortunately the technologies exist to change this and it it would even be a win on security, economy and quality of life to do so. However, we lack the political will to stand up to the vested moneyed interests that have our lives in the balance.

24 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:01:03pm

re: #19 Rightwingconspirator

PIMF
One butt too many.

There's a joke there somewhere.

In bed?

25 abolitionist  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:04:37pm

re: #23 LudwigVanQuixote

The phrase was nine meals from anarchy - three days.

26 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:07:47pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

Possibly. They still haven't capped the leak in the gulf yet either. We could have a global catastrophe in a few moths if they don't plug the damn hole.

yup, combined with a weak economy could tip us over the edge

27 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:08:28pm

re: #23 LudwigVanQuixote

no let's not recap...it's all been said a hundred times

28 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:09:19pm

re: #14 Killgore Trout

Semi-ot: This is going to be interesting A 33 degree temperature jump in two days. It's going to be hell on the garden.

Here... where I am... tonight 44 low... tomorrow... 82 high... tomorrow night low... 48... and on and on... happens all summer long.

29 webevintage  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:10:12pm

re: #14 Killgore Trout

Semi-ot: This is going to be interesting A 33 degree temperature jump in two days. It's going to be hell on the garden.

wow.

I've already mentioned this, but the only things I grow are tomatoes, spinach and swiss chard.
The greens never seemed to take hold this Feb and April (really, really rainy) and then it went into the 90's early.
We got a few tomatoes off the plants (mostly cherry type) but now the buds are dying and...I'm just so sad.

30 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:10:29pm

re: #27 albusteve

no let's not recap...it's all been said a hundred times

And it needs to keep being said till we see results. I still ran into outright AGW denial at work earlier this year. Until that denial goes away, this has not been said enough.

31 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:10:58pm

re: #29 webevintage

I feel your pain.

32 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:12:57pm

re: #25 abolitionist

The phrase was nine meals from anarchy - three days.

correction taken, I certainly misstyped.

33 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:13:54pm

re: #27 albusteve

no let's not recap...it's all been said a hundred times

Yes, and still you pretend it isn't important. It's such a pity you would rather troll than face facts.

34 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:14:27pm

re: #30 Dark_Falcon

And it needs to keep being said till we see results. I still ran into outright AGW denial at work earlier this year. Until that denial goes away, this has not been said enough.

Rock on DF.

35 freetoken  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:15:08pm

re: #30 Dark_Falcon

Denial is hard enough to deal with, but there is an entire industry now of full on lying and deceiving of this issue.

I mentioned that Dutch agency report several times so far today because the response to it is classic.

Here's a link to the English version of the actual report:
[Link: www.pbl.nl...]

Here is the official summary:

PBL Netherlands Environmental Assessment Agency has found no errors that would undermine the main conclusions in the 2007 report of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) on possible future regional impacts of climate change. However, in some instances the foundations for the summary statements should have been made more transparent. The PBL believes that the IPCC should invest more in quality control in order to prevent mistakes and shortcomings, to the extent possible.

Now take that summary and compare it to the headlines in the denial-o-sphere.

36 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:16:50pm

re: #35 freetoken

Denial is hard enough to deal with, but there is an entire industry now of full on lying and deceiving of this issue.

I mentioned that Dutch agency report several times so far today because the response to it is classic.

Here's a link to the English version of the actual report:
[Link: www.pbl.nl...]

Here is the official summary:

Now take that summary and compare it to the headlines in the denial-o-sphere.

I know, and it scares the Hell out of me. We've got entire parts of the country that become depopulated over this. It would seem that people from the Southwest should be eager to get in front of this.

37 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:18:13pm

re: #33 LudwigVanQuixote

Yes, and still you pretend it isn't important. It's such a pity you would rather troll than face facts.

show me where I ever said it was unimportant...show me where I'm anti AGW?....you can't, you bowhard

38 webevintage  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:18:55pm

sigh

39 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:19:31pm

re: #38 webevintage

sigh

yeah same old 'troll' shit

40 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:20:59pm

re: #36 Dark_Falcon

I know, and it scares the Hell out of me. We've got entire parts of the country that become depopulated over this. It would seem that people from the Southwest should be eager to get in front of this.

And New York, Boston, LA Houston, Galveston, Charleston, Seattle, much of Florida and Connecticut... but no worries...

And let's not forget dust bowls in the med-west and food riots in Chicago, but other than that...

41 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:22:28pm

Global warming presents national security issues. Well yes, but this video does nothing to flesh that simple skeleton out. Not an excellent video. This is the sort of drum beating that turns some folks off on the entire topic.

42 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:24:18pm

re: #40 LudwigVanQuixote

And New York, Boston, LA Houston, Galveston, Charleston, Seattle, much of Florida and Connecticut... but no worries...

And let's not forget dust bowls in the med-west and food riots in Chicago, but other than that...

Dr. Peter Venkman: This city is headed for a disaster of biblical proportions.

Mayor: What do you mean, "biblical"?

Dr Ray Stantz: What he means is Old Testament, Mr. Mayor, real wrath of God type stuff.

Dr. Peter Venkman: Exactly.

Dr Ray Stantz: Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling!

Dr. Egon Spengler: Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes...

Winston Zeddemore: The dead rising from the grave!

Dr. Peter Venkman: Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!

43 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:24:51pm

re: #37 albusteve

show me where I ever said it was unimportant...show me where I'm anti AGW?...you can't, you bowhard

Did you not just say that?

Let's not recap. It's all been said a hundred times?

Because you know if it's all been said it isn't important enough to keep taling about and all...

Steve, your ability to re-spin thing you have just said has republican grade hypocrisy. I also liked the blowhard stuff. TThe problem with you is not just that you are a trol, but a really silly one to boot. At least wait a fw comments before openly contradicting yourself OK? They teach that somewhere in troll school for the irrelevant, cranky, and not particularly bright yes?

44 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:24:58pm

re: #41 The Shadow Do

Global warming presents national security issues. Well yes, but this video does nothing to flesh that simple skeleton out. Not an excellent video. This is the sort of drum beating that turns some folks off on the entire topic.

it's junk...it doesn't put any blame where it is deserved, the enviro NIMBY weenies and their federal judges...our economic and energy problems lay squrae at the feet of the govt...why not just say it?

45 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:25:53pm

re: #42 Walter L. Newton

Dr. Peter Venkman: This city is headed for a disaster of biblical proportions.

Mayor: What do you mean, "biblical"?

Dr Ray Stantz: What he means is Old Testament, Mr. Mayor, real wrath of God type stuff.

Dr. Peter Venkman: Exactly.

Dr Ray Stantz: Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling!

Dr. Egon Spengler: Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes...

Winston Zeddemore: The dead rising from the grave!

Dr. Peter Venkman: Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!

Yeah that's about right. War, famine, plague and death on a global scale in a way that will make the horrors of the world wars seem trivial.

46 Fozzie Bear  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:26:06pm

I think we need to start spreading the meme that warmer temperatures make people gay. Have a massive media blitz on the issue.

The GOP would be on board within a week.

47 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:26:22pm

re: #42 Walter L. Newton

And now watch what happens... remember that song... "Watch What Happens"

48 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:26:41pm

re: #42 Walter L. Newton

LOL!

49 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:27:34pm

re: #44 albusteve

it's junk...it doesn't put any blame where it is deserved, the enviro NIMBY weenies and their federal judges...our economic and energy problems lay squrae at the feet of the govt...why not just say it?

And of course it has nothing to do with the fossil fuel lobbies or their pet politicians in the GOP... no nothing at all.

Even for you, that is remarkably divorced from reality.

Have you recently suffered a blunt force trauma to your head? That might explain the higher than average stupid coming from you tonight.

50 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:27:36pm

re: #46 Fozzie Bear

I think we need to start spreading the meme that warmer temperatures make people gay. Have a massive media blitz on the issue.

The GOP would be on board within a week.

LOL!

51 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:28:39pm

re: #46 Fozzie Bear

I think we need to start spreading the meme that warmer temperatures make people gay. Have a massive media blitz on the issue.

The GOP would be on board within a week.

Oh man. it's over 90' outside. I aint going out there. No fricking way. Uh-uh.

LOL!

52 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:30:20pm

re: #51 Racer X

Oh man. it's over 90' outside. I aint going out there. No fricking way. Uh-uh.

LOL!

Tin-foil codpiece.

53 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:30:26pm

re: #44 albusteve

it's junk...it doesn't put any blame where it is deserved, the enviro NIMBY weenies and their federal judges...our economic and energy problems lay squrae at the feet of the govt...why not just say it?

You just did! Can always count on you Steve.

If you want solutions look to the people. Solutions will come from a team of engineers at a CH2M Hill or a Bechtel or somesuch. Sure as hell won't be anything coming from our illustrious political leadership.

54 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:30:26pm

re: #46 Fozzie Bear

I think we need to start spreading the meme that warmer temperatures make people gay. Have a massive media blitz on the issue.

The GOP would be on board within a week.

that is the problem, stop with the memes & stick to the facts.

55 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:30:51pm

re: #37 albusteve

show me where I ever said it was unimportant...show me where I'm anti AGW?...you can't, you bowhard

I can. You've made it clear, all you care about is your money. Now, go playact at being all indignant, pretend again that your selfish, two-faced, malignant, well poisoning, mercenary attitude towards "the science" isn't the problem.

56 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:31:42pm

re: #54 brookly red

that is the problem, stop with the memes & stick to the facts.

And those facts are global war, famine, drought, pestilence and collapse.

57 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:33:01pm

Dang, why can't I ever be selfish, two-faced and malignant. Gotta work on this.

58 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:33:09pm

re: #43 LudwigVanQuixote

Because you know if it's all been said it isn't important enough to keep taling about and all...

Steve, your ability to re-spin thing you have just said has republican grade hypocrisy. I also liked the blowhard stuff. TThe problem with you is not just that you are a trol, but a really silly one to boot. At least wait a fw comments before openly contradicting yourself OK? They teach that somewhere in troll school for the irrelevant, cranky, and not particularly bright yes?

you idiot...I get tired of your evangelistc rant...my point of view has nothing to do with AGW...I suspect you are the troll, not me, you are a fool to consider everybody will listen to you go off...I for one don't give a shit about your point of view, that's why you hate me...I don't kiss your ass...you know it and I know it...keep your criticism to a few sentences and I might listen...and fuck you too...you are see thu

59 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:33:33pm

re: #56 LudwigVanQuixote

And those facts are global war, famine, drought, pestilence and collapse.


/wow you are an evangelical end of timer? who knew? :)

60 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:34:43pm

re: #58 albusteve

Steve, this in't about you. THis is about the very real problems coming down the pike and the fact that the top brass are noticing and skwaking. THis is more important than what you are tired f or your opinions or really anything at all about you.

No one cares.

Please do remember that.

61 b_Snark  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:34:43pm

I just had two pets euthanized and had to console my daughter, my wife, and my grandson, and I'm in no mood for pitch forks, torches and blind chases through dark forests, so I'm outa here.

62 BenghaziHoops  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:35:13pm

re: #45 LudwigVanQuixote

Yeah that's about right. War, famine, plague and death on a global scale in a way that will make the horrors of the world wars seem trivial.

Hi Ludwig!
We see the 4th of July weekend fade into the past..Just a few firecrackers into the night..The rockets red glare.
Hero's have secured our rights and freedoms with precious blood
It is not the end of the world....America still is a light upon a hill...

63 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:35:23pm

re: #55 goddamnedfrank

I can. You've made it clear, all you care about is your money. Now, go playact at being all indignant, pretend again that your selfish, two-faced, malignant, well poisoning, mercenary attitude towards "the science" isn't the problem.

ht frank!...give me all your money dumbass...now!
hahaha!

64 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:35:33pm

re: #59 brookly red

/wow you are an evangelical end of timer? who knew? :)

Worse, buddy, I am a scientist, and my prophecy is in the data. Unlike a prophet, I know these things are coming with the certainty of physics.

65 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:36:04pm

re: #62 HoosierHoops

Hi Ludwig!
We see the 4th of July weekend fade into the past..Just a few firecrackers into the night..The rockets red glare.
Hero's have secured our rights and freedoms with precious blood
It is not the end of the world...America still is a light upon a hill...

For maybe the next 50 years. Then we start the real slide.

66 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:36:31pm

Well back on topic, this was about national security & if the world really is going to hell in a hand-basket I guess we should start by sealing our borders & protecting our assets no?

67 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:37:52pm

re: #66 brookly red

Well back on topic, this was about national security & if the world really is going to hell in a hand-basket I guess we should start by sealing our borders & protecting our assets no?

Won't work--we hate each other, within the borders, too much.

68 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:38:09pm

re: #60 LudwigVanQuixote

I'm not sure how you get "the top brass are noticing and skwaking" from a series of lifted sound bites. These cats were tasked with looking at the security implications of global warming, no more and no less.

What is skwaking by the way?

69 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:38:34pm

re: #64 LudwigVanQuixote

Worse, buddy, I am a scientist, and my prophecy is in the data. Unlike a prophet, I know these things are coming with the certainty of physics.

well OK I accept that it is coming... so it was written no?

70 abolitionist  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:39:24pm

re: #65 LudwigVanQuixote

For maybe the next 50 years. Then we start the real slide.

I'd say 20. You must be an optimist. :)

71 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:41:02pm

re: #66 brookly red

Well back on topic, this was about national security & if the world really is going to hell in a hand-basket I guess we should start by sealing our borders & protecting our assets no?

NO, because that will only hold off the inevitable for a short time if at all. I personally do not look forward to having to shoot refugees because we can't feed them. Of course a few decades after that, the guns will be turned on hungry Americans.

Far better to implement a sane energy policy now.

Far better to fix the problem and even make money doing so.

Far better to stop funding horrible foreign regimes.

Far better to think about fixing the problem rather than reacting to it.

Far better to realize that sometime sooner rather than later we will cross a point where nothing we do will matter.

72 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:41:26pm

Last night, other posters helped me with the creation of a D&D-type Blog Warrior character: Dorkus, Prince of Blogstalking. Tonight, I'm thinking of a heroic character for Ludwig. Half dwarf, half human (to give him the power and strength I see the character as having) and armed with the Lance of Truth and a Troll Hammer. Alignment would be Chaotic Good. Thoughts?

73 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:42:07pm

re: #68 The Shadow Do

I'm not sure how you get "the top brass are noticing and skwaking" from a series of lifted sound bites. These cats were tasked with looking at the security implications of global warming, no more and no less.

What is skwaking by the way?

Did you miss what they said about the security issues involved? Did you not notice all the stars? Are you really in that deep a denial?

74 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:42:50pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

Last night, other posters helped me with the creation of a D&D-type Blog Warrior character: Dorkus, Prince of Blogstalking. Tonight, I'm thinking of a heroic character for Ludwig. Half dwarf, half human (to give him the power and strength I see the character as having) and armed with the Lance of Truth and a Troll Hammer. Alignment would be Chaotic Good. Thoughts?

My friend, I only ask more of an elf and more of a mage - my job does involve cosmic forces and all.

75 [deleted]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:43:12pm
76 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:43:45pm

re: #65 LudwigVanQuixote

For maybe the next 50 years. Then we start the real slide.

Then it's no sweat, mon. Our decisionmakers are trained not to think beyond the next fiscal quarter or next midterm election.

77 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:44:14pm

Such a shame we've wasted the last ten years just arguing over whether or not this stuff is going to happen. Ah well. Thanks for all the fish.

78 BenghaziHoops  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:44:23pm

re: #65 LudwigVanQuixote

For maybe the next 50 years. Then we start the real slide.

I understand the Jews made the desert Bloom and become the land of Milk and Honey....I got that right didn't I?
Have faith Ludwig....
/My bro

79 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:44:50pm

re: #69 brookly red

well OK I accept that it is coming... so it was written no?

Except that we can still stop it. In that way, you actually have the largest parallel to the biblical prophets. They were all really clear that if we changed our ways we could avert catastrophe. The same is true here. The difference though is in the data and the scientific method. There isn't a question of believing in my God or not. Believe the numbers.

80 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:45:18pm

re: #78 HoosierHoops

I understand the Jews made the desert Bloom and become the land of Milk and Honey...I got that right didn't I?
Have faith Ludwig...
/My bro

Faith? You must be joking...

81 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:46:23pm

re: #78 HoosierHoops

I understand the Jews made the desert Bloom and become the land of Milk and Honey...I got that right didn't I?
Have faith Ludwig...
/My bro

My friend, we also lost the land for 200 years and had the Temple burnt twice. If we do not avoid this catastrophe, it will come for the righteous and the sinner alike.

Israel will be one of the first to fall, of the Western nations, due to AGW.

82 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:46:46pm

Jeezuz Steve. Find some weed and do a few bong hits man.

83 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:47:11pm

re: #73 LudwigVanQuixote

Did you miss what they said about the security issues involved? Did you not notice all the stars? Are you really in that deep a denial?

Too busy honing my aiming skills at refugees.

84 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:47:31pm

re: #75 albusteve

This still isn't about you Stevo. Sorry to disappoint.

85 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:48:17pm

re: #83 The Shadow Do

Too busy honing my aiming skills at refugees.

Do you think that is funny? What do you think happens to Mexico? Where do you think those people will try to go?

86 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:48:41pm

re: #81 LudwigVanQuixote

PIMF

My friend, we also lost the land for 2000 years and had the Temple burnt twice. If we do not avoid this catastrophe, it will come for the righteous and the sinner alike.

Israel will be one of the first to fall, of the Western nations, due to AGW.

87 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:49:19pm

re: #83 The Shadow Do

Too busy honing my aiming skills at refugees.

Awesome. Let's shit up the environment and then take pot shots at anyone who wants refuge from the shitstorm we played a very significant part in bringing about. That's accountability I can believe in...

88 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:49:21pm

re: #79 LudwigVanQuixote

Except that we can still stop it. In that way, you actually have the largest parallel to the biblical prophets. They were all really clear that if we changed our ways we could avert catastrophe. The same is true here. The difference though is in the data and the scientific method. There isn't a question of believing in my God or not. Believe the numbers.

OK so then I have heard some of you solutions before & we did not agree so much... what plan do you have for changing our ways that A. don't involve a dictatorship & B. will matter cause the rest of the world will go along? Serious question not bating.

89 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:50:13pm

re: #74 LudwigVanQuixote

My friend, I only ask more of an elf and more of a mage - my job does involve cosmic forces and all.

The problem is that you have a fury about you that requires that your special power be Berserker Rage. That does not go well with a mage, IMO. I see you as a Paladin, and they can cast spells.

90 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:50:57pm

re: #85 LudwigVanQuixote

Do you think that is funny? What do you think happens to Mexico? Where do you think those people will try to go?

Yes, hilarious. Do you have any more horror stories you would like to share?

91 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:51:23pm

re: #82 Racer X

Jeezuz Steve. Find some weed and do a few bong hits man.

sure, give LVQ the high ground for calling me and Sharmuta and others nazi haters, morons etc etc...not gonna happen even if Charles lets it go...I won't...the record speaks for itself and I didn't start this childish feud but I won't back down

92 BenghaziHoops  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:51:46pm

re: #80 JasonA

Faith? You must be joking...

I never joke about faith...OK I make fun of religious hypocrites here but I draw the line there...

93 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:51:52pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

Last night, other posters helped me with the creation of a D&D-type Blog Warrior character: Dorkus, Prince of Blogstalking. Tonight, I'm thinking of a heroic character for Ludwig. Half dwarf, half human (to give him the power and strength I see the character as having) and armed with the Lance of Truth and a Troll Hammer. Alignment would be Chaotic Good. Thoughts?

More NG than CG. He's got no trouble worlkng with or against Law or Chaos as long as the evil ones are slain. Other than that, spot on. Possibly a level or two of Ranger with Troll as the favored enemy?

94 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:52:04pm

re: #87 JasonA

Awesome. Let's shit up the environment and then take pot shots at anyone who wants refuge from the shitstorm we played a very significant part in bringing about. That's accountability I can believe in...

Hey, it was Ludwig's suggestion. And I am just another evil natavist.

95 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:52:37pm

re: #89 Dark_Falcon

The problem is that you have a fury about you that requires that your special power be Berserker Rage. That does not go well with a mage, IMO. I see you as a Paladin, and they can cast spells.

I'll take that.

96 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:52:40pm

re: #94 The Shadow Do

Hey, it was Ludwig's suggestion. And I am just another evil natavist.

Way to miss the point.

97 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:53:11pm

re: #91 albusteve

And this still is not about you Stevo. Get a grip.

98 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:53:14pm

re: #92 HoosierHoops

I never joke about faith...OK I make fun of religious hypocrites here but I draw the line there...

Faith in what? Other people? You know the course we're on. You know what little has been done to alter that. This takes more than faith, Hoops. We need concrete changes.

99 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:53:19pm

re: #84 LudwigVanQuixote

This still isn't about you Stevo. Sorry to disappoint.

I hope not....but it is all about you and your bruised ego isn't it?...let me post without calling me all these silly names and I'll let it go, until then you are dirt, after all i like you

100 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:53:40pm

re: #96 Varek Raith

Way to miss the point.

Missed nothing my friend.

101 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:54:16pm

re: #94 The Shadow Do

Hey, it was Ludwig's suggestion. And I am just another evil natavist.

And that is why you should really ask yourself about the realities of turning starving refugees away. Do you really want to pull the trigger on that?

102 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:55:03pm

re: #97 LudwigVanQuixote

And this still is not about you Stevo. Get a grip.

I have one...how does it feel?...you don't impress me

103 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:56:31pm

re: #102 albusteve

I have one...how does it feel?...you don't impress me

Neither does this petty arguing.
Now, all of you, sit in the Happy Hippy Drum Circle and sing.

104 Fozzie Bear  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:57:11pm
105 BenghaziHoops  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:58:30pm

re: #98 JasonA

Faith in what? Other people? You know the course we're on. You know what little has been done to alter that. This takes more than faith, Hoops. We need concrete changes.

Faith in God..You really don't know me do you? I'm the eternal optimist..

106 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:58:37pm

re: #101 LudwigVanQuixote

And that is why you should really ask yourself about the realities of turning starving refugees away. Do you really want to pull the trigger on that?

I WISH EVERYONE WOULD STOP BAITING LUDWIG, STOP TROLLING AND STOP FORCING LUDWIG TO GET MAD.

107 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:59:05pm

re: #101 LudwigVanQuixote

And that is why you should really ask yourself about the realities of turning starving refugees away. Do you really want to pull the trigger on that?

Do you remember that L'il Abner character, you know, the one in black slumping along with a big floppy hat with the ever present black cloud with lightening bolt hanging over his head?

Joe Bascom or something like that?

LudwigVanBascom?

108 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:59:05pm

re: #103 Varek Raith

Neither does this petty arguing.
Now, all of you, sit in the Happy Hippy Drum Circle and sing.

I'd be happy to...for the record, I didn't start this thing and only LVQ can stop it...or Charles, but I prefer the former

109 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:59:07pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

Last night, other posters helped me with the creation of a D&D-type Blog Warrior character: Dorkus, Prince of Blogstalking. Tonight, I'm thinking of a heroic character for Ludwig. Half dwarf, half human (to give him the power and strength I see the character as having) and armed with the Lance of Truth and a Troll Hammer. Alignment would be Chaotic Good. Thoughts?

Make sure he has a Fistful of Data...

;)

110 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:59:13pm

I remember my high school earth science classes in 1975 (we got college credit for them btw) and all these scientists swore the ice age was coming & we needed to move our population south before it was too late... some of scientists had big real estate holdings in Texas. Once bitten twice shy.

111 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 6:59:45pm

I see it's squabble night on LGF tonight.

112 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:00:21pm

re: #111 Killgore Trout

I see it's squabble night on LGF tonight.

I've said my piece...I'm done

113 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:00:24pm

re: #102 albusteve

I have one...how does it feel?...you don't impress me

Let me see if I have this straight. Charles posts a video on Global Warming. Ludwig responds by going over some details. You tell him "No, let's not recap. It's all been said a hundred times."

Wtf is with you today?

114 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:00:41pm

re: #111 Killgore Trout

I see it's squabble night on LGF tonight.

No shit.

Post some Bollywood music videos - that will shut them up.

115 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:00:43pm

re: #88 brookly red

OK so then I have heard some of you solutions before & we did not agree so much... what plan do you have for changing our ways that A. don't involve a dictatorship & B. will matter cause the rest of the world will go along? Serious question not bating.

Well smart grids are real things and they are successfully deployed by our Navy, Germany, Denmark and Israel. Wind power works and is affordable and creates jobs. Nuclear technology exists and has progressed to the point where meltdowns are not possible and fuel cycles can be made so that the waste is manageable. New high energy density batteries have existed now for two years that would make electric vehicles with 1000 mile ranges possible - and they would out perform most sports cars, the torque on an electric motor is phenomenal.

Deploying all of those things would create millions of American jobs, save the nation from hemorrhaging money to countries that hate us, pay for themselves shortly, revitalize the economy and oh yes save our nation. Further we could trade green tech to other nations and impose tarrifs on their goods if they were not green.

Really any fear of dictatorship is bizarre to me.

The reason I say that is consider this:

On the road we are on now, at least one out of two and as many as 4 out of 5 Americans will not possibly have enough food to eat. What sort of government would decide who the unlucky ones were? By doing nothing you guarantee that future.

116 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:01:10pm

re: #106 Walter L. Newton

Nice try Walter. This in't about you either.

117 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:01:21pm

re: #108 albusteve

I'd be happy to...for the record, I didn't start this thing and only LVQ can stop it...or Charles, but I prefer the former

Here.
Image: mug.JPG

118 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:01:29pm

re: #106 Walter L. Newton

I WISH EVERYONE WOULD STOP BAITING LUDWIG, STOP TROLLING AND STOP FORCING LUDWIG TO GET MAD.

119 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:01:41pm

re: #107 The Shadow Do

Joe Blfstk

120 Macha  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:02:26pm

re: #61 b_sharp

I just had two pets euthanized and had to console my daughter, my wife, and my grandson, and I'm in no mood for pitch forks, torches and blind chases through dark forests, so I'm outa here.

In case you are still reading, I'm sorry to hear you had to make the call to say goodbye to your pets. That is a tough moment no matter what the reason. I want to thank you for having the strength to do a final kindness for them. At some point it is all we can do after a life of companionship. May they RIP.

121 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:02:31pm

re: #113 JasonA

Let me see if I have this straight. Charles posts a video on Global Warming. Ludwig responds by going over some details. You tell him "No, let's not recap. It's all been said a hundred times."

Wtf is with you today?

it goes back almost to when LVQ registered...ask him

122 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:02:39pm

re: #111 Killgore Trout

I see it's squabble night on LGF tonight.

Flashbacks to the Battle of Manhattan. They'll pass.

123 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:03:00pm

re: #119 Decatur Deb

Joe Blfstk

That's it!

124 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:03:00pm

re: #116 LudwigVanQuixote

Nice try Walter. This in't about you either.

He's a drama queen. Think back to the story of the scorpion and the frog. Can't help himself.

125 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:03:15pm

re: #110 brookly red

I remember my high school earth science classes in 1975 (we got college credit for them btw) and all these scientists swore the ice age was coming & we needed to move our population south before it was too late... some of scientists had big real estate holdings in Texas. Once bitten twice shy.

You misunderstood. As per the Milankovitch cycles, we were heading into an ice age in about 20000 years. We turned that around.

OK get that?

You were not bitten. You didn't get it the first time. That's your fault. Don't make that same mistake this time and get it right this time.

126 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:03:42pm

re: #116 LudwigVanQuixote

Nice try Walter. This in't about you either.

I was trying to stick up for you Ludwig, like we've seen many people do before... gee... I wonder how many times we've seen certain Lizards say "stop baiting Ludwig," "you're forcing Ludwig to get mad..." You're right Ludwig... it's not about me at all... it's all about you.

127 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:03:43pm

re: #114 Racer X

No shit.

Post some Bollywood music videos - that will shut them up.

The stalker are outraged over my tadpole posts. Tough decision. Maybe Hugh Fearnley Whittingstall has a new pigeon recipe I could link to. Hmmm.....

128 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:03:44pm

re: #121 albusteve

it goes back almost to when LVQ registered...ask him

Ah, I see. So what you have a grip on is a huge ass grudge. Okay then.

129 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:04:18pm
130 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:04:22pm

re: #127 Killgore Trout

The stalker are outraged over my tadpole posts. Tough decision. Maybe Hugh Fearnley Whittingstall has a new pigeon recipe I could link to. Hmmm...

LOLWHUT.

131 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:04:30pm

re: #127 Killgore Trout

The stalker are outraged over my tadpole posts. Tough decision. Maybe Hugh Fearnley Whittingstall has a new pigeon recipe I could link to. Hmmm...

They made you sound like Pol Pot for wanting to get rid of bullfrogs.

132 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:05:03pm

re: #129 Racer X

Heh.

Image: igTYl.jpg

lol

133 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:05:13pm

re: #93 wlewisiii

More NG than CG. He's got no trouble worlkng with or against Law or Chaos as long as the evil ones are slain. Other than that, spot on. Possibly a level or two of Ranger with Troll as the favored enemy?

Neutral Good works. So we've got the stats:

LudwigVanQuixote

Half human, half dwarf Paladin
Level: 25
Special Skilll Scholar and researcher

Armor: Shield of Reason (blocks all nonsense based attacks)

Spell:

Wrath of Nature: Calls into the minds of those it is used upon the full dangers of AGW, thus turning some foes into allies in Ludwigs quests.

Weapons:

Lance of Truth: Inflicts 3D6 damage. Double damage if on horseback and cantering or galloping.

Troll Hammer: Inflicts 2D6 damage on any non-troll who spouts fallacies (reduced by 33% with a save). Against Trolls or Demons this damage is tripled. Against Dorkus, damage is only doubled but the hammer inflicts 5 points of pain directly to Dorkus's butt.

Special Power:

Berserker Rage: When pressed hard, roll 2D6. On a roll of 8+, Ludwig enters a Berserker Rage for 1D6x10 posts. While in a rage, he inflicts +50% more damage with any attacks, but any successful fact-based attacks against him inflict +75% damage.

134 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:05:22pm

re: #124 JasonA

He's a drama queen. Think back to the story of the scorpion and the frog. Can't help himself.

Yawn.

135 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:05:50pm

re: #128 JasonA

Ah, I see. So what you have a grip on is a huge ass grudge. Okay then.

it's not my thing...I just respond, the grudge is entirely on someone else, insecurity is a powerful motivator

136 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:05:52pm

re: #107 The Shadow Do

Do you remember that L'il Abner character, you know, the one in black slumping along with a big floppy hat with the ever present black cloud with lightening bolt hanging over his head?

Joe Bascom or something like that?

LudwigVanBascom?

Why are you in such deep denial? You don't have to take my word for all of this. IN fact, you should look to the science and the data first. I certainly have given hundreds of links to you.

If you don't like that, what about the generals and the admirals in this thread;'s video? Do you think they are part of the left wing conspiracy? Patreus was one of them you noticed? Right?

What is your major malfunction?

137 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:05:58pm

re: #134 Walter L. Newton

Yawn.

Need a nap? Long day at work?

138 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:06:48pm

re: #125 LudwigVanQuixote

You misunderstood. As per the Milankovitch cycles, we were heading into an ice age in about 20000 years. We turned that around.

OK get that?

You were not bitten. You didn't get it the first time. That's your fault. Don't make that same mistake this time and get it right this time.

no dude, in 1975 the PTA was selling swamp land in Florida cause the ice age was coming! I lived it I don't need you to tell me I didn't get it.

139 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:07:43pm

re: #131 JasonA

They made you sound like Pol Pot for wanting to get rid of bullfrogs.

They've had a bee in their collective bonnet ever since Killgore's Sting against Hot Air.

140 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:07:58pm

re: #136 LudwigVanQuixote

Why are you in such deep denial? You don't have to take my word for all of this. IN fact, you should look to the science and the data first. I certainly have given hundreds of links to you.

If you don't like that, what about the generals and the admirals in this thread;'s video? Do you think they are part of the left wing conspiracy? Patreus was one of them you noticed? Right?

What is your major malfunction?

he didn't say he denied anything...the essence of your problem

141 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:08:45pm

re: #139 Dark_Falcon

They've had a bee in their collective bonnet ever since Killgore's Sting against Hot Air.

that was pretty cool...a highlight of my time here

142 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:08:56pm

re: #108 albusteve

I'd be happy to...for the record, I didn't start this thing and only LVQ can stop it...or Charles, but I prefer the former

Umm Stevo, really get a grip. Why don't you just let the grown ups talk? We are having a fine conversation about a real problem. If you don't like this convo, I am sure you can find someone to pay attention to you.

143 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:09:06pm

re: #114 Racer X

No shit.

Post some Bollywood music videos - that will shut them up.

Yes, the hypnotic dancing hips.

144 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:09:48pm

re: #108 albusteve

I'd be happy to...for the record, I didn't start this thing and only LVQ can stop it...or Charles, but I prefer the former

Interesting, you're trying to win a game of chicken, but want to be talked to like an adult.

re: #121 albusteve

it goes back almost to when LVQ registered...ask him

No. Be a man, get over it.

145 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:09:53pm

re: #105 HoosierHoops

Faith in God..You really don't know me do you? I'm the eternal optimist..

I guess someone has to be... :)

146 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:10:30pm

re: #136 LudwigVanQuixote

Why are you in such deep denial? You don't have to take my word for all of this. IN fact, you should look to the science and the data first. I certainly have given hundreds of links to you.

If you don't like that, what about the generals and the admirals in this thread;'s video? Do you think they are part of the left wing conspiracy? Patreus was one of them you noticed? Right?

What is your major malfunction?

Dear Ludwig, my malfunction, though I consider it minor, is that I am not a denialist, not at all. I just find all the shrieking and angst tedious. I was glad to see you placed a more positive post above positing some potential solutions. I even agree with most of it.

147 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:10:33pm
148 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:10:51pm

*snipe*
*snipe*
*snipe*
*snipe*
*snipe*
*snipe*
*snipe*
*snipe*
*snipe*
*snipe*
All this sniping.
Yawn.
:P

149 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:10:58pm

re: #138 brookly red

no dude, in 1975 the PTA was selling swamp land in Florida cause the ice age was coming! I lived it I don't need you to tell me I didn't get it.

Well those people were idiots and they didn't get what the science was then. I am sorry you had to deal with such idiots. However, even if you think I am an idiot - which I don't think you do - look at all the evidence and think it through for yourself. Legitimate scientific organizations the world over have made painstaking ly detailed web pages for all levels of scientific understanding. You don't have to trust me. Trust yourself to actually look at the facts and then see what you think.

150 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:11:01pm

re: #134 Walter L. Newton

Hey, Walter. We will be loading up the wagon in less than a week. I'm not sure if we will have internet access at the condo. I will have your phone number with me in case we tool around your area. Is it around Conifer? Cheers.

151 Macha  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:11:16pm

Sigh, this has turned into the Steve and Ludwig show, Monotony Squared. Take it outside boys, you're scaring the horses.

152 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:11:19pm

re: #142 LudwigVanQuixote

Umm Stevo, really get a grip. Why don't you just let the grown ups talk? We are having a fine conversation about a real problem. If you don't like this convo, I am sure you can find someone to pay attention to you.

I like the convo well enough....why don't you stop dealing with us preschoolers and get your own grip?....if we are so meaningless why do you keep posting about it?....you butthurt again?...same old same old

153 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:12:30pm

re: #144 goddamnedfrank

No. Be a man, get over it.

I stick up for myself in spite of rubes like you...you don't count frank...go dig into the archives and get lost

154 What, me worry?  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:12:35pm

re: #147 Racer X

I don't like that. That's just mean.

155 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:13:03pm
156 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:14:05pm

re: #133 Dark_Falcon

Neutral Good works. So we've got the stats:

LudwigVanQuixote

Half human, half dwarf Paladin
Level: 25
Special Skilll Scholar and researcher

Armor: Shield of Reason (blocks all nonsense based attacks)

Spell:

Wrath of Nature: Calls into the minds of those it is used upon the full dangers of AGW, thus turning some foes into allies in Ludwigs quests.

Weapons:

Lance of Truth: Inflicts 3D6 damage. Double damage if on horseback and cantering or galloping.

Troll Hammer: Inflicts 2D6 damage on any non-troll who spouts fallacies (reduced by 33% with a save). Against Trolls or Demons this damage is tripled. Against Dorkus, damage is only doubled but the hammer inflicts 5 points of pain directly to Dorkus's butt.

Special Power:

Berserker Rage: When pressed hard, roll 2D6. On a roll of 8+, Ludwig enters a Berserker Rage for 1D6x10 posts. While in a rage, he inflicts +50% more damage with any attacks, but any successful fact-based attacks against him inflict +75% damage.

I like it all, but I am most assuredly Lawful Good with a sense of humor and I ain't know dwarf. Geeze I'm near six foot!

157 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:15:48pm

re: #156 LudwigVanQuixote

PIMF

I like it all, but I am most assuredly Lawful Good with a sense of humor and I ain't no dwarf. Geeze I'm near six foot!

158 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:16:12pm

re: #150 prairiefire

Hey, Walter. We will be loading up the wagon in less than a week. I'm not sure if we will have internet access at the condo. I will have your phone number with me in case we tool around your area. Is it around Conifer? Cheers.

Yes... I live in Conifer... sorry I haven't got back to you... One of the kid friendly attractions around here is TinyTown... a miniature village, someone's hobby gone big time... sort of a famous local attraction, steam engine ride and such... in Golden, one of the foothill towns nearby, try the Colorado Railroad Museum... also, in Morrison, Dinosaur Ridge... roadside accessible dinosaur tracks and fossils... all these places are with in 40 minutes of each other, and of my house... get in touch with me closer to your actual trip... when you have some sort of idea which day(s) you might be, or would like to be, in the western foothills of the Denver area... maybe we could meet at one of those attractions.

159 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:16:31pm

re: #149 LudwigVanQuixote

Well those people were idiots and they didn't get what the science was then. I am sorry you had to deal with such idiots. However, even if you think I am an idiot - which I don't think you do - look at all the evidence and think it through for yourself. Legitimate scientific organizations the world over have made painstaking ly detailed web pages for all levels of scientific understanding. You don't have to trust me. Trust yourself to actually look at the facts and then see what you think.

well suppose for the sake of argument you are right we need to start defending our resources big time, we are not all going to survive this so we might as well seal the border now, no?

160 [deleted]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:17:17pm
161 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:17:38pm

re: #158 Walter L. Newton

Sounds great. We are looking forward to it.

162 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:17:50pm

re: #159 brookly red

well suppose for the sake of argument you are right we need to start defending our resources big time, we are not all going to survive this so we might as well seal the border now, no?

that's a fact

163 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:17:53pm

re: #159 brookly red

well suppose for the sake of argument you are right we need to start defending our resources big time, we are not all going to survive this so we might as well seal the border now, no?

Or for a fraction of the cost of actually sealing our borders and coast, build wind farms and avert the problem.

164 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:18:39pm
165 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:19:34pm

re: #163 LudwigVanQuixote

Or for a fraction of the cost of actually sealing our borders and coast, build wind farms and avert the problem.

wind farms?....hahaha!

166 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:19:56pm

re: #160 Spare O'Lake

than science
pimf

167 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:20:04pm

re: #163 LudwigVanQuixote

Or for a fraction of the cost of actually sealing our borders and coast, build wind farms and avert the problem.

And, desalination plants.
*waves*

168 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:20:19pm

re: #163 LudwigVanQuixote

Or for a fraction of the cost of actually sealing our borders and coast, build wind farms and avert the problem.

well OK but we are talking national security here so we need to protect our wind farms don't we?

169 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:20:32pm

Oh shit!

Image: vmz6N.jpg

170 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:20:59pm

re: #167 Floral Giraffe

And, desalination plants.
*waves*

right as rain, and for that we need nukes, lots of them

171 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:21:17pm

re: #160 Spare O'Lake

Your apocalyptic fear-mongering is more science fiction than fiction. Hardly what I would expect from a real scientist.

Name any one thing I wrote that is not factual there spare? Do you really need to see the links that you never read again? Were the generals and admirals in that video also apocalyptic fear mongerers who need t be dismissed? Of course, the fact that you might take their word for t over the world wide scientific community boggles me. But then again, you are not even taking their word for it.

So I challenge you Spare, name one claim I made that you think is false and I will get you the links yet again.

I dare you.

In fact, I triple dare you... come up with your own science for once that contradicts anything I said. But of course you don't have science, only bluster and a will to deny the truth.

172 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:21:18pm

re: #160 Spare O'Lake

Your apocalyptic fear-mongering is more science fiction than fiction. Hardly what I would expect from a real scientist.

All science fiction is fiction, and let's not start this real scientist shit again.

Ludwig has cited a plethora of peer reviewed studies. He is merely extrapolating from the most likely future scenarios those studies predict.

173 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:21:31pm

re: #169 Racer X

Oh shit!

Image: vmz6N.jpg

Whoops...
Did I leave that on...?

174 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:22:13pm

re: #161 prairiefire

Sounds great. We are looking forward to it.

And there is Red Rocks Arena... fun to visit even of you aren't attending a concert (Morrison)... almost every canyon on the west side of Denver in the foothills are interesting... Clear Creek Canyon (where Coors gets it's water (Golden)... Turkey Creek Canyon (Route 285, goes up to Conifer) and I can take you all on a 2-3 hours trip from my house to the Platte River, up ancient narrow gauge railroad beds, the oldest still operating mercantile in the state and then up Elk Creek canyon to one of the most unique restaurants in the area... that's the tour I gave Cato. I off most mid week days...

175 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:22:22pm
176 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:22:28pm

re: #156 LudwigVanQuixote

I like it all, but I am most assuredly Lawful Good with a sense of humor and I ain't know dwarf. Geeze I'm near six foot!

That's why the half-human, half dwarf. So you an have a dwarf's strength and a human's height.

177 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:22:43pm

re: #167 Floral Giraffe

And, desalination plants.
*waves*

Hey hun. I'm facing the normal troll contingent... It always happens. Charles comes out with yet another thread about the awful truth and they whine about how they hate me. It's really like clockwork with them.

178 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:23:03pm

re: #172 goddamnedfrank

All science fiction is fiction, and let's not start this real scientist shit again.

Ludwig has cited a plethora of peer reviewed studies. He is merely extrapolating from the most likely future scenarios those studies predict.

right so we should be covering our butts right now and protecting our limited resources... we can't save the world now can we.

179 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:23:31pm

re: #170 albusteve

right as rain, and for that we need nukes, lots of them

Yes, we do need to be building more Nuclear Power Plants, too.

180 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:24:16pm

re: #159 brookly red

well suppose for the sake of argument you are right we need to start defending our resources big time, we are not all going to survive this so we might as well seal the border now, no?

You are missing the point. Sealing the boarder will not stop the food shortages in the US.

181 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:24:18pm

re: #173 Varek Raith

Whoops...
Did I leave that on...?

Yeah, you set the destruction radius on the Galaxy Gun missile too high again. You destroyed an entire continent this time.

//

182 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:24:19pm

re: #178 brookly red

right so we should be covering our butts right now and protecting our limited resources... we can't save the world now can we.

No, but sure as hell can pull our weight when it comes to fucking it up.

183 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:24:20pm

re: #178 brookly red

right so we should be covering our butts right now and protecting our limited resources... we can't save the world now can we.

United States of Galt's Gulch.

184 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:24:46pm

re: #159 brookly red

well suppose for the sake of argument you are right we need to start defending our resources big time, we are not all going to survive this so we might as well seal the border now, no?

Obviously. Considering the massive carbon footprint of the average American, the massive influx of new consumers should be halted on the grounds of Climate Change and National Security.

185 Stanghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:24:49pm

re: #147 Racer X

KITTEH NOMS PURRITO

Thank you for that!

186 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:25:15pm

re: #180 LudwigVanQuixote

You are missing the point. Sealing the boarder will not stop the food shortages in the US.

less mouths to feed will help any way you spin it...

187 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:25:35pm

re: #180 LudwigVanQuixote

You are missing the point. Sealing the boarder will not stop the food shortages in the US.

That's why we have to get rid of the illegals already here!

/

188 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:26:09pm

re: #178 brookly red

right so we should be covering our butts right now and protecting our limited resources... we can't save the world now can we.

Actually we can avert this catastrophe. I am not sure why you would hear the catastrophe is avertable by certain measures, but then start arguing for things that will not avert it. It's like hearing you need to loose ten pounds and then start arguing for doing your hair. It makes no sense.

189 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:26:31pm

re: #174 Walter L. Newton

Awesome. We have our van. Do you mean a 2-3 hour hike. : )
What does the restaurant feature?

190 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:26:48pm

re: #180 LudwigVanQuixote

You are missing the point. Sealing the boarder will not stop the food shortages in the US.

yes I did read all about the coming food shortages... on WND

191 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:27:00pm

God forbid a discussion like this ever turn into a suggestion that we Americans consume less. No, that would be UnAmerican™.

192 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:27:22pm

re: #187 JasonA

That's why we have to get rid of the illegals already here!

/

Or all the mouthy scientists.
/

193 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:27:27pm

re: #188 LudwigVanQuixote

Actually we can avert this catastrophe. I am not sure why you would hear the catastrophe is avertable by certain measures, but then start arguing for things that will not avert it. It's like hearing you need to loose ten pounds and then start arguing for doing your hair. It makes no sense.

you are loosing focus...

194 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:27:30pm

re: #180 LudwigVanQuixote

You are missing the point. Sealing the boarder will not stop the food shortages in the US.

Well, we can work on improving our crop yields and preparing varieties that work in poorer soils. That would be a help. Even if we blunt AGW enough that we don't need such things here, its still going to bad enough that other place will need such things.

195 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:27:48pm

re: #184 Bagua

Obviously. Considering the massive carbon footprint of the average American, the massive influx of new consumers should be halted on the grounds of Climate Change and National Security.

They're not coming out of Jalisco, they're coming out of ovaries.

196 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:28:23pm

re: #180 LudwigVanQuixote

You are missing the point. Sealing the boarder will not stop the food shortages in the US.

No. It is about preventing those food shortages by reducing the population growth in the USA which has a massive average carbon footprint.

A 20% reduction via wind or solar is irrelevant if there is millions of new consumers using the 80% from fossil fuel.

197 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:28:34pm

re: #193 brookly red

you are loosing focus...

No, he's not.

198 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:28:38pm

re: #188 LudwigVanQuixote

Actually we can avert this catastrophe. I am not sure why you would hear the catastrophe is avertable by certain measures, but then start arguing for things that will not avert it. It's like hearing you need to loose ten pounds and then start arguing for doing your hair. It makes no sense.

curly bulbs!...hahaha!...you crack me up

199 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:28:51pm

re: #190 brookly red

yes I did read all about the coming food shortages... on WND

But not here when I posted the PNAS papers? Dude, you just compared peer reviewed research from the National Academy to world nut daily? Is there a reason you are being so astonishingly truculent and insulting? Why not read the papers for once and know what you are talking about?

200 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:28:58pm

Good grief.

201 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:29:43pm

re: #194 Dark_Falcon

Well, we can work on improving our crop yields and preparing varieties that work in poorer soils. That would be a help. Even if we blunt AGW enough that we don't need such things here, its still going to bad enough that other place will need such things.

we can?...hows that ethanol subsidy working out?...Ludwig? want to chime in?

202 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:29:45pm

re: #196 Bagua

No. It is about preventing those food shortages by reducing the population growth in the USA which has a massive average carbon footprint.

A 20% reduction via wind or solar is irrelevant if there is millions of new consumers using the 80% from fossil fuel.

Hence we need new nuclear plants as well. There ain't no silver bullet here.

203 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:30:22pm

Might I suggest a perusal of Amanda Little's blog?

Her book Power Trip is quite interesting re AGW and what to do about it.

204 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:30:40pm

re: #199 LudwigVanQuixote

But not here when I posted the PNAS papers? Dude, you just compared peer reviewed research from the National Academy to world nut daily? Is there a reason you are being so astonishingly truculent and insulting? Why not read the papers for once and know what you are talking about?

well they both say the same thing, that food shortages are coming... so one source is enlightened & the other damned? I just don't get it.

205 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:30:45pm

re: #191 JasonA

God forbid a discussion like this ever turn into a suggestion that we Americans consume less. No, that would be UnAmerican™.

No, that would be UnHuman. Never happen. Why? Human nature. Do you think that anyone, yourself included, is just fine with what you have today? Not very progressive.

206 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:30:56pm

re: #171 LudwigVanQuixote

War, famine, plague and death on a global scale in a way that will make the horrors of the world wars seem trivial.

Prove it.

207 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:31:01pm

re: #194 Dark_Falcon

Well, we can work on improving our crop yields and preparing varieties that work in poorer soils. That would be a help. Even if we blunt AGW enough that we don't need such things here, its still going to bad enough that other place will need such things.

Yes, and that can help a little but all crops need water and temperatures that are conducive to their growth. Rolling the dice on a miracle botany breakthrough is wishful thinking that will almost certainly condemn millions of Americans to death by starvation.

We drastically cut down on fossil fuels in the next few decades or it is all she wrote.. It is that simple. There is no sugar coating, there is no magic bullet.

208 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:31:32pm

re: #204 brookly red

well they both say the same thing, that food shortages are coming... so one source is enlightened & the other damned? I just don't get it.

Now you are just being an asshole and you know it. I'm done with you. Fuck off.

209 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:32:01pm

re: #201 albusteve

we can?...hows that ethanol subsidy working out?...Ludwig? want to chime in?

Why are you bringing up that piece of pork? You know damn well that both Ludwig and I haven't defended the pork-barrel ethanol subsidy. You seem to have brought it up to change the subject.

210 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:32:13pm

re: #205 The Shadow Do

No, that would be UnHuman. Never happen. Why? Human nature. Do you think that anyone, yourself included, is just fine with what you have today? Not very progressive.

Progressive doesn't mean what you think it means.

211 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:32:29pm

OK don't make me come over there.

212 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:32:47pm

re: #208 LudwigVanQuixote

Now you are just being an asshole and you know it. I'm done with you. Fuck off.

typical...you're just too soft

213 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:33:01pm

re: #196 Bagua

No. It is about preventing those food shortages by reducing the population growth in the USA which has a massive average carbon footprint.

A 20% reduction via wind or solar is irrelevant if there is millions of new consumers using the 80% from fossil fuel.

Actually we could power the whole nation from wind alone if we were able to build in the best places. However, I have always said nuclear, solar and wind with smart grids and battery deployment.

214 The Shadow Do  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:33:09pm

re: #210 JasonA

Progressive doesn't mean what you think it means.

Irony is lost on some.

215 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:33:24pm

re: #208 LudwigVanQuixote

Now you are just being an asshole and you know it. I'm done with you. Fuck off.

OK I see real clearly now... come on Ludwig, they both say the same thing so why is one wrong?

216 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:33:38pm

re: #189 prairiefire

Awesome. We have our van. Do you mean a 2-3 hour hike. : )
What does the restaurant feature?

No... 2-3 hours road tour... The Buck Snort is just your standard bar and grill... but the location is very unique... snuggled in a VERY narrow canyon, amongst red granite and red rock... The whole tour would take about 2-3 hours, depending on making stops on the Platte River, walking up the old narrow gauge railroad bed (The Denver/North Platte line, brought people/supplies up from Denver to Park Country over 100 years ago)... you can even see the old telegraph poles and occasionally find rusted rail bed spikes, glass telegraph insulators and chunks of coal...

The mercantile is a large grey granite stone block building... over 140 years old and still operating... you will also see the Harmon burn area... start reminder about the forces of nature and man and what can happen... always the possibility seeing elk, deer and other misc wild life.

Really... the little tour is really worth an afternoon of your valuable vacation time... get vista and picture taking opportunities too.

A good way to get a quick overview of the Rockies in a half a day.

217 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:33:55pm

This is why Global Warming will fuck us all and there is nothing that will be done about it. Petty backbiting and pointless arguments.

Nice job humans. Enjoy your climate change.

218 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:34:14pm

re: #209 Dark_Falcon

Why are you bringing up that piece of pork? You know damn well that both Ludwig and I haven't defended the pork-barrel ethanol subsidy. You seem to have brought it up to change the subject.


excuse me...I have no clue what either one of you thinks about it

219 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:34:38pm

re: #188 LudwigVanQuixote

Actually we can avert this catastrophe. I am not sure why you would hear the catastrophe is avertable by certain measures, but then start arguing for things that will not avert it. It's like hearing you need to loose ten pounds and then start arguing for doing your hair. It makes no sense.

They don't want to avert it. It's all about embrace and extend now. Embrace the science, extend the apathy.

"It's all inevitable now," that's the new meme: don't argue the science, just decry "alarmism", say that there's no bother trying as often as possible, tell people to watch your money, and in general just wear a shit eating grin while being a selfish disingenuous douche bag.

220 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:34:51pm

re: #218 albusteve

excuse me...I have no clue what either one of you thinks about it

Very well. I'll take your answer as good coin.

221 bratwurst  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:35:15pm

re: #210 JasonA

Progressive doesn't mean what you think it means.

Did somebody say Progressive?

Image: 1flo_stephanie_courtney.jpg

222 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:35:55pm

re: #208 LudwigVanQuixote

Now you are just being an asshole and you know it. I'm done with you. Fuck off.

Einstein use to sign off on all his scientific papers with that phrase... "Alan Turing... fuck off."

223 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:36:14pm

re: #81 LudwigVanQuixote

My friend, we also lost the land for 200 years and had the Temple burnt twice. If we do not avoid this catastrophe, it will come for the righteous and the sinner alike.

Israel will be one of the first to fall, of the Western nations, due to AGW.

So all the environmental technologies they developed is worthless?

224 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:36:15pm

re: #213 LudwigVanQuixote

Actually we could power the whole nation from wind alone if we were able to build in the best places.

Prove it.

225 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:36:27pm

re: #217 Racer X

This is why Global Warming will fuck us all and there is nothing that will be done about it. Petty backbiting and pointless arguments.

Nice job humans. Enjoy your climate change.

agreed, it's time to figure out how to deal with it instead of trying to avert it...it's here, now

226 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:36:55pm

SIX POINTS ABOUT THE BP OIL SPILL FROM A PRO-DRILLING ENVIRONMENTALIST

#1 Drill on our own turf

America must expand--not prohibit--offshore oil drilling. The worst thing we could do is to push the problem out of view. Only when we see oil rigs crowded along our coastlines, and experience the human consequences of oil extraction and consumption on our home turf, will we mobilize the shift toward energy efficiency and clean solutions on a grand scale. If our coastlines are closed to oil development, and our demand continues unabated, the risks of offshore production will simply shift to the coastlines of Nigeria, South Korea, Kazakhstan, Angola and other oil-producing nations where environmental standards are extremely lenient, if they even exist.

227 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:37:31pm

#2: Offshore drilling is inevitable, and will only get riskier

Offshore drilling is inevitable for decades to come. Deep-sea drilling regions are the industry's final frontier for major new oil discoveries -- most land reserves have been tapped. The industry will continue going further offshore and inserting drills deeper into sea beds to tap new resources, facing ever-greater risks in turn. It's not these risks that should concern us -- they can be managed with proper safety measures and regulatory oversight. The real problem is our failure to hold ourselves accountable.

228 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:37:56pm

#3: Consumers play a role

In a single day, Americans consume roughly 750 million gallons of oil—about 20 times more than the total volume of crude that has leaked into the Gulf so far. Per capita, we consume about 30 percent more oil each day than Europeans, and about 40 percent more than the Japanese. The spill has exposed our collective ignorance about what it takes to satisfy our unrivaled appetite for oil.

229 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:37:57pm

re: #221 bratwurst

Did somebody say Progressive?

Image: 1flo_stephanie_courtney.jpg

[snicker]

230 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:38:12pm

#4: The challenge isn't our technology, it's our mindset.

We are capable of solutions on a grand scale. Current innovations in renewable energy, electric cars, green buildings, sophisticated plastics and the smart grid are getting better and cheaper fast. But transformative change can happen only when mainstream America embraces it as absolutely necessary. The question that persists today is: What will it take to convince Americans that shifting away from fossil fuels is absolutely necessary?

231 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:38:27pm

re: #219 goddamnedfrank

They don't want to avert it. It's all about embrace and extend now. Embrace the science, extend the apathy.

"It's all inevitable now," that's the new meme: don't argue the science, just decry "alarmism", say that there's no bother trying as often as possible, tell people to watch your money, and in general just wear a shit eating grin while being a selfish disingenuous douche bag.

so what is your custom frank solution?...spill it, or is it an echo of LVQs wind farms?...you just another windy, solar echo?

232 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:38:29pm

#5 Preempting another disaster

Americans can offset every barrel of oil that's spewing into the Gulf. This is a shockingly easy proposition -- it just means cutting by a fraction our oil use for one day. Take public transit, carpool, fill up your tires with air, telecommute to work for a day, buy local--cutting our oil use is the best thing we can do in the long run to preempt drilling disasters.

233 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:38:39pm

re: #230 Racer X

#4: The challenge isn't our technology, it's our mindset.

We are capable of solutions on a grand scale. Current innovations in renewable energy, electric cars, green buildings, sophisticated plastics and the smart grid are getting better and cheaper fast. But transformative change can happen only when mainstream America embraces it as absolutely necessary. The question that persists today is: What will it take to convince Americans that shifting away from fossil fuels is absolutely necessary?

This is a great one.

234 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:38:47pm

#6 Past is prologue

America has a rich history of energy innovation--we drilled the first oil wells, we installed the first power plants and electricity grid, we mass-produced the first automobiles, we applied the first petrochemical fertilizers, we built the plastics industry, we invented the first solar panels and wind turbines. We have staggering potential as a nation to solve problems and innovate. American ingenuity got us into this mess, and American ingenuity will get us out of it.

235 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:38:55pm

re: #224 Spare O'Lake

Prove it.

He can't... because the current technology is no where near sustainable enough for that to work at that scale successfully.

236 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:39:27pm

re: #180 LudwigVanQuixote

You are missing the point. Sealing the boarder will not stop the food shortages in the US.

/sure glad I bought these seeds...

237 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:39:44pm

Sigh...

238 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:40:04pm

re: #216 Walter L. Newton

Fantastic. Are jeans better to wear when walking the trails? I'll make sure my 7 and 12 year old have walking shoes. Would you suggest bug spray for ticks, chiggars, etc.?

239 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:40:12pm

re: #230 Racer X

The question that persists today is: What will it take to convince Americans that shifting away from fossil fuels is absolutely necessary?

$20 gas.

240 bratwurst  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:40:22pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

[snicker]

I actually just saved about 40% by switching from her to the little lizard. I hate the commercials as much as anyone, but I hate wasting money even more.

241 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:40:24pm

re: #237 Varek Raith

Sigh...

Emo Sith?

242 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:40:34pm

re: #235 Walter L. Newton

He can't... because the current technology is no where near sustainable enough for that to work at that scale successfully.

unless a prop is mounted on his beenie...
pure bullshit

243 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:40:41pm

re: #202 Dark_Falcon

Hence we need new nuclear plants as well. There ain't no silver bullet here.

Yes, but you can't build nuclear plants and produce the fuel without a great deal of fossil fuel being used. Population growth control is the only way to reduce this base load consuming fuel, food, products, resources. Life in the USA is very carbon intensive, and even the most ambitious schemes to roll out alternatives over the coming decades is offset if there is a large increase in the base population load.

244 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:40:44pm

re: #241 JasonA

Emo Sith?

ZZZAAAPPP

245 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:41:30pm

re: #240 bratwurst

I actually just saved about 40% by switching from her to the little lizard. I hate the commercials as much as anyone, but I hate wasting money even more.

I've been with the lizard for about 10 years now. They've been great for me. Never had to make a claim, but the rates have been just fine.

246 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:41:37pm

re: #238 prairiefire

Fantastic. Are jeans better to wear when walking the trails? I'll make sure my 7 and 12 year old have walking shoes. Would you suggest bug spray for ticks, chiggars, etc.?

all that...you're in the mountains, not like flatlanders...Walter?

247 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:42:16pm

re: #240 bratwurst

I actually just saved about 40% by switching from her to the little lizard. I hate the commercials as much as anyone, but I hate wasting money even more.

re: #245 JasonA

I've been with the lizard for about 10 years now. They've been great for me. Never had to make a claim, but the rates have been just fine.

What odd...fetishes...
///

248 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:42:19pm

re: #239 Spare O'Lake

$20 gas.

yup, and it's coming

249 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:42:29pm

re: #244 Varek Raith

ZZZAAAPPP

Dark Side Points Gained.

250 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:42:58pm

re: #206 Spare O'Lake

Prove it.

Will you actually read the papers for once?

IF so look at this:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

That is all the proof you could need really with all the facts figures and science.

Please read it for once.

251 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:43:15pm

re: #239 Spare O'Lake

$20 gas.

yup 20 cents to Exxon & the rest is taxes...

252 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:43:22pm

re: #248 albusteve

yup, and it's coming

Good thing I don't drive!

253 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:43:26pm

Eight Reasons for Hope on Climate Change

(I know its Huffpo - please don't kick me outta the club)

Last month, scientists predicted a 6.3 degree rise in average temperatures -- higher than previously estimated -- by the end of this century, even if the strongest pollution-reduction targets proposed by the world's leaders go into effect. (The most recent ice age, for context, was triggered by a 3 degree change in average temperatures.)

The Obama administration, meanwhile, has been criticized for weakening its stance on the climate issue, and hopes are dimming for an international treaty at the December climate summit in Copenhagen. As Democrats struggle to pass a domestic cap-and-trade bill, partisan battles are increasingly shrill and contentious, casting doubt on the bill's chance of passage anytime soon. Even if it were to pass, enviros have criticized the legislation as "woefully inadequate" and "less than worthless."

Most of us are deaf to these laments. The more strident and dismal the climate battle becomes, the more the American public tunes out. We can't ignore the science, but we've got to move past the partisan bickering, past the politics of doom and gloom, and focus on what's going right. As Saturday's event made clear, there's a lot going right:

1. We are connected.

Online organizing and social media -- Flickr, Twitter, YouTube, Skype, Facebook, blogs -- are ushering in a new era of coalition-building and global climate outreach breathtaking in scope. These online tools "enable us to track the growing momentum on this issue," 350.org organizer May Boeve told me. "That's vital to movement building." Daily twitters and blog posts on climate change number in the tens of millions -- spreading information, rallying lobbyists, and stoking innovation. Al Gore, for one, has nearly two million followers on Twitter -- more than Martha Stewart.

254 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:44:35pm

re: #245 JasonA

I've been with the lizard for about 10 years now. They've been great for me. Never had to make a claim, but the rates have been just fine.

My wife has a lead foot. Every time we get a quote from the lizard it's between 15 and 20% higher than our current policy from General Casualty. The other big firms haven't been much different.

255 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:44:42pm

Amanda LittleAuthor of “Power Trip: From Oil Wells to Solar Cells, Our Ride to the Renewable Future"
Posted: October 27, 2009 05:39 PM
BIOBecome a Fan Get Email AlertsBloggers' Index
Eight Reasons for Hope on Climate Change
What's Your Reaction:

Inspiring
Enlightening
Infuriating
Scary
Helpful
Amazing
Innovative
Adorable
Read More: 350.Org , Global Warming , International Day Of Climate Action , Green News
27
0
views
Get Green Alerts

Email Comments 7
Saturday's International Day of Climate Action gave us overwhelming evidence of hope at a time of widespread despair on global warming.

Last month, scientists predicted a 6.3 degree rise in average temperatures -- higher than previously estimated -- by the end of this century, even if the strongest pollution-reduction targets proposed by the world's leaders go into effect. (The most recent ice age, for context, was triggered by a 3 degree change in average temperatures.) The Obama administration, meanwhile, has been criticized for weakening its stance on the climate issue, and hopes are dimming for an international treaty at the December climate summit in Copenhagen. As Democrats struggle to pass a domestic cap-and-trade bill, partisan battles are increasingly shrill and contentious, casting doubt on the bill's chance of passage anytime soon. Even if it were to pass, enviros have criticized the legislation as "woefully inadequate" and "less than worthless."

Most of us are deaf to these laments. The more strident and dismal the climate battle becomes, the more the American public tunes out. We can't ignore the science, but we've got to move past the partisan bickering, past the politics of doom and gloom, and focus on what's going right. As Saturday's event made clear, there's a lot going right:

1. We are connected.

Online organizing and social media -- Flickr, Twitter, YouTube, Skype, Facebook, blogs -- are ushering in a new era of coalition-building and global climate outreach breathtaking in scope. These online tools "enable us to track the growing momentum on this issue," 350.org organizer May Boeve told me. "That's vital to movement building." Daily twitters and blog posts on climate change number in the tens of millions -- spreading information, rallying lobbyists, and stoking innovation. Al Gore, for one, has nearly two million followers on Twitter -- more than Martha Stewart.

2. We have a target.

The most complex scientific problem humanity has ever faced has been distilled into a three-digit manifesto -- 350. Transcending language and education barriers, this global target was spelled out on beaches, mountain tops, monuments, and town squares, in human bodies linked to human bodies.

3. We have youth.

Kids and students were a highlight of the 350 event -- reflecting the youth climate movement that has been growing globally in recent years. In the US, the Energy Action Coalition has convened hundreds of thousands of students who are greening their campuses, lobbying state legislatures and Congress, and partnering with activists worldwide -- members of the China Youth Climate Action Network, Khmer Youth Association, Accion Climatica Colombia, the Indian Youth Climate Network, among other groups. In place of the panda, they've have chosen for their symbol the green hard hat, representing a new era of green jobs.

4. We have diversity.

Saturday's event produced the world's first grand-scale portrait of the global climate movement-and most of them looked nothing like Al Gore. The images of activists across all economic strata in Mumbai, Instanbul, Cairo, Dhakam, Gaborone and well beyond made it clear that environmentalism is no longer the domain of the white, privileged Prius-and-polar-bear set.

256 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:44:44pm

re: #243 Bagua

Bagua, America will never have a one child rule. Never, ever, ever.

257 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:45:10pm

re: #238 prairiefire

Fantastic. Are jeans better to wear when walking the trails? I'll make sure my 7 and 12 year old have walking shoes. Would you suggest bug spray for ticks, chiggars, etc.?

Like today... I just wore jeans... bug are no where near as much of a problem as in damper climates... I never wear any repellant... and this little "tour" is not going to bring us near any stagnant of slow flowing bodies of water... the Platte River is not meandering in the least... but good walking shoes are a good idea... once again, we will be walking on flat ground, cleared... like a fire access road in the woods... and there will be no climbing or up/down hill treks... except for the walk along the railroad bed... we won't be doing any other "hiking." more like milling around.

If you want to take 2-3 hours of you time, we can do this... think about it... see how your plans go... we have time...

258 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:45:14pm

re: #223 Alouette

So all the environmental technologies they developed is worthless?

NO they are fantastic, but they will not help Israel unless the US - the worlds largest polluter, China, India and the Russian also change course. IF America and Europe go green, Russia does not have all that oil to sell to and their economy would not withstand tariffs on their goods.

The same goes for China and India.

But is has to start with the US and Europe.

259 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:45:16pm

Yiikes!

PIFW

260 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:45:25pm

re: #254 wlewisiii

My wife has a lead foot. Every time we get a quote from the lizard it's between 15 and 20% higher than our current policy from General Casualty. The other big firms haven't been much different.

you have to pay to play.

261 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:45:40pm

re: #252 Varek Raith

Good thing I don't drive!

no but the food you eat comes on trucks...

262 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:46:22pm

re: #243 Bagua

Yes, but you can't build nuclear plants and produce the fuel without a great deal of fossil fuel being used. Population growth control is the only way to reduce this base load consuming fuel, food, products, resources. Life in the USA is very carbon intensive, and even the most ambitious schemes to roll out alternatives over the coming decades is offset if there is a large increase in the base population load.

YEs, there would be fossil fuel burnt. Much less than would be burnt in the following years when the nuclear power came on line. Your argument is specious.

263 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:47:08pm

5. We have a movement.

As the global climate movement diversifies, D.C.-based environmental groups have been joining forces with labor, veterans and religious groups in a broad coalition dubbed Clean Energy Works. The group is mobilizing organizers in 28 states and spending handsomely on television ads to promote climate policies that will transition America to a green economy and create millions of clean jobs.

6. We have action.

In the months leading up to the 350 event, governmental leaders of the Maldives Islands held a cabinet meeting underwater in scuba gear to expose the global warming threat. Greenpeace activists scaled the Houses of Parliament in London carrying "Change the Politics -- Save the Climate" signs. Student activists blockaded the entrance to a coal plant in downtown Washington D.C. This is activism with a wow-factor -- reminiscent of the 60s-era outreach that helped trigger a sea change in environmental policy.

7. We have faith.

Churches in the Presbyterians of America alliance tolled their bells 350 times. The target was also spelled out in signs draped across synagogues and mosques. Faith-based climate activism has been gaining ground in recent years, in particular the "creation care" movement spearheaded by evangelicals. With a membership of 45,000 churches and 7,000 megachurches, National Association of Evangelicals, for instance, is supporting mandatory carbon caps.

8. We have profit motive.

General Electric, Google, and Duke Energy are among a multitude of big-brand businesses positioning themselves to profit from a 350 ppm target --innovating climate solutions from electric cars to smart-grid components. We need these climate profiteers. To borrow and reinterpret a line from Thomas Edison: Corporate innovators are finally discovering what the world needs -- and they're proceeding to invent.

In a 1979 presidential address Jimmy Carter quoted an activist friend who said, "We've got to stop crying and start sweating, stop talking and start walking, stop cursing and start praying." These words resonate today as we face so much despair and political paralysis on climate change. The good news is that the sweating, walking and praying has begun.

264 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:47:16pm

re: #42 Walter L. Newton

Dr. Peter Venkman: This city is headed for a disaster of biblical proportions.

Mayor: What do you mean, "biblical"?

Dr Ray Stantz: What he means is Old Testament, Mr. Mayor, real wrath of God type stuff.

Dr. Peter Venkman: Exactly.

Dr Ray Stantz: Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling!

Dr. Egon Spengler: Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes...

Winston Zeddemore: The dead rising from the grave!

Dr. Peter Venkman: Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!

Well, Ludwig always looks at the worst case. Somebody has to do that. I look at what I think are mid-range possibilities. They're still scary. Let's say US food production holds up. Kind of. We shut down most of our feedlots and devote whatever grain production we can still swing to direct human consumption, and we use genetic engineering, drip irrigation from dam-fed reservoirs, and switching around what lands we farm.

No food riots in Chicago. But wait. What about the rest of the world? There are military implications to food shortages elsewhere. There are trade implications from a worldwide worse-than-depression.

And there are just no two ways about it: a lot of expensive infrastructure is going to have to be written off as it sinks beneath the waves. Rising temperatures may not bring more hurricanes. We might be able to build dams and capture water now conveniently stored for us in winter snowpack. But we cannot avoid the consequences of thermal expansion of existing ocean water, and the Greenland ice cap will melt and that brings a still larger rise in sea level. We could stop cold using fossil fuels, today, and that would still happen.

It's too late to prevent this cap going. The arctic sea ice is on its last legs, and when it goes, as the video makes clear it will, that means the waters around Greenland no longer help keep it cold.

So we face some difficulties. And as long as we don't act, the price just keeps going up. The Antarctic ice caps can melt too. They will, if we push global CO2 levels high enough. Then sea level goes up a lot more.

There's a little good news in this list of middle of the road doom: China is smart enough to see the writing on the wall, and for her, it's grimmer than it is for us. Bismark wrote that nations do not have friends, only interests. It is in their interest to cooperate with us on this matter. We CAN find a political solution.

When we ourselves come to our senses and look this problem in the face.

265 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:47:35pm

re: #250 LudwigVanQuixote

"Because of the political nature of this document - out and out mortality predictions are to be inferred by the intelligent reader, by piecing the information together."

Are you kidding me?

266 ryannon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:47:53pm

re: #127 Killgore Trout

The stalker are outraged over my tadpole posts. Tough decision. Maybe Hugh Fearnley Whittingstall has a new pigeon recipe I could link to. Hmmm...

Don't start with the pigeons or there could be real trouble.

267 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:47:57pm

re: #256 prairiefire

Bagua, America will never have a one child rule. Never, ever, ever.

Population growth will end one day. This is a fact.

268 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:48:42pm

Well of course it is threat to national and border security, as the coastlines go under water the Cambodian/Filipino/Korean/Chinese immigrants will be able to bypass the ports and float clear to New Mexico!

Buy guns!
Buy Gold!
Buy Non-Hybrid Seeds!
Buy Water Wings!

/We need to start building floating immigration checkpoints now!

269 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:49:00pm

re: #267 JasonA

Population growth will end one day. This is a fact.

well it in some ways has, most of our growth is immigration...

270 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:49:06pm

re: #256 prairiefire

Bagua, America will never have a one child rule. Never, ever, ever.

If we screw up our environment and our sociology, we might have difficulty maintaining an average as high as 1.

271 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:49:10pm

re: #224 Spare O'Lake

Prove it.

Been proven. Now it's your turn. Make a case that what I said is not inline with the science. Check the science for once spare. Really try it.

Now it is your turn to bring some physics of your own to contradict what is on those links. Good luck with that.

272 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:49:25pm

re: #267 JasonA

Population growth will end one day. This is a fact.

For certain demographics growth is already in decline.

273 abolitionist  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:49:35pm

re: #222 Walter L. Newton

Einstein use to sign off on all his scientific papers with that phrase... "Alan Turing... fuck off."

Obviously not all. Alan Turing was born in 1912. Einstein's 1905 paper on the photoelectric effect won him a Nobel Prize (in 1921).

274 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:50:07pm

re: #236 brookly red

/sure glad I bought these seeds...

Try growing them without fresh water or if it is too hot.

275 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:50:47pm

re: #264 lostlakehiker

I'm not afraid to die...bring it on and we'll see what we can do...you can die today with a fat belly or tomorrow all spent...the results are the same

276 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:51:03pm

re: #274 LudwigVanQuixote

Try growing them without fresh water or if it is too hot.

naww I just pop em in the micro wave...

277 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:51:14pm

re: #41 The Shadow Do

Global warming presents national security issues. Well yes, but this video does nothing to flesh that simple skeleton out. Not an excellent video. This is the sort of drum beating that turns some folks off on the entire topic.

god, fuck off

278 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:51:28pm

re: #264 lostlakehiker

Well, Ludwig always looks at the worst case. Somebody has to do that. I look at what I think are mid-range possibilities.

NO sir, I am talking the midrange. Remember the models are consistently too conservative and we are outstripping the worst case scenario emissions projections to be fed into them.

279 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:51:37pm

re: #269 brookly red

well it in some ways has, most of our growth is immigration...

think of all those votes tho!

280 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:51:55pm

re: #277 WindUpBird

god, fuck off

Why do you hate God?

281 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:52:02pm

re: #269 brookly red

well it in some ways has, most of our growth is immigration...

Our growth is going to mainly be American born and bred, American Latino citizens.
Their votes are up for grabs. They are the classic Independent voting block.

282 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:52:21pm

re: #265 Spare O'Lake

Are you kidding me?

No read it. You are smart enough to do that yes?

283 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:52:22pm

re: #279 albusteve

think of all those votes tho!

I do...

284 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:52:46pm

re: #271 LudwigVanQuixote

Been proven. Now it's your turn. Make a case that what I said is not inline with the science. Check the science for once spare. Really try it.

Now it is your turn to bring some physics of your own to contradict what is on those links. Good luck with that.

you quote speculation...it proves nothing no matter how well it's presented

285 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:53:08pm

re: #264 lostlakehiker

I was just interjecting a little lightness to the conversation... I don't care... I understand what needs to be done, I know what can be done, and I have my opinions on what we can't control... I don't need evangelizing any more from scientist that I need from religionist... and then you have scientists who also believe in G-d, and you have an extremely volatile mix... and a confusing one... and a stupid one IMO.

I'm just sitting here crafting hippie jewelry and listening to Mark Levin on the radio... and getting a good laugh... better than a sitcom.

286 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:53:40pm

re: #231 albusteve

so what is your custom frank solution?...spill it, or is it an echo of LVQs wind farms?...you just another windy, solar echo?

It involves raising taxes :D

287 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:53:43pm

This is AWESOME ... something we should all remember.

A 92-year-old, petite, well-poised and proud man, who is fully dressed each morning by eight o'clock, with his hair fashionably combed and shaved perfectly, even though he is
legally blind, moved to a nursing home today. His wife of 70 years recently passed away, making the move necessary.

After many hours of waiting patiently in the lobby of the nursing home, he smiled sweetly when told his room was ready.

As he maneuvered his walker to the elevator, I provided a visual description of his tiny room, including the eyelet sheets that had been hung on his window.

I love it,' he stated with the enthusiasm of an eight-year-old having just been presented with a new puppy.

Mr. Jones, you haven't seen the room; just wait.'
'That doesn't have anything to do with it,' he replied.

Happiness is something you decide on ahead of time.

Whether I like my room or not doesn't depend on how the
furniture is arranged .. it's how I arrange my mind. I already decided to love it.

'It's a decision I make every morning when I wake up. I have a choice; I can spend the day in bed recounting the difficulty I have with the parts of my body that no longer work, or get out of bed and be thankful for the ones that do.

Each day is a gift, and as long as my eyes open, I'll focus on the new day and all the happy memories I've stored away.. Just for this time in my life.

Old age is like a bank account. You withdraw from what you've put in.

So, my advice to you would be to deposit a lot of happiness in the bank account of memories!

Thank you for your part in filling my Memory Bank.

I am still depositing.

'Remember the five simple rules to be happy:

1. Free your heart from hatred.

2. Free your mind from worries.

3. Live simply.

4. Give more.

5. Expect less.

288 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:53:56pm

re: #273 abolitionist

Obviously not all. Alan Turing was born in 1912. Einstein's 1905 paper on the photoelectric effect won him a Nobel Prize (in 1921).

Go look for your sense of humor, cause you've lost it... call me in the morning.

289 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:54:07pm

re: #261 brookly red

no but the food you eat comes on trucks...

Good thing I don't eat!

290 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:54:09pm

re: #277 WindUpBird

god, fuck off

yeah baby, just fuck off!...hey!, fuck off you, and you too!...ahahaha!

291 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:54:13pm

re: #280 Racer X

Why do you hate God?

He keeps making my cocaine blow away!

292 Stanghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:54:35pm

re: #255 Racer X

3. We have youth.

The hope.

293 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:54:37pm

re: #290 albusteve

yeah baby, just fuck off!...hey!, fuck off you, and you too!...ahahaha!

You, okay?!?!?! I learned it from watching you!

294 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:54:48pm

re: #271 LudwigVanQuixote

You lose me when you rave and present apocalyptic worst-case scenarios as proven fact. Completely unscientific.

295 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:54:55pm

re: #219 goddamnedfrank

They don't want to avert it. It's all about embrace and extend now. Embrace the science, extend the apathy.

"It's all inevitable now," that's the new meme: don't argue the science, just decry "alarmism", say that there's no bother trying as often as possible, tell people to watch your money, and in general just wear a shit eating grin while being a selfish disingenuous douche bag.

Yeah that's about right. It's even more repulsive.

296 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:55:25pm

re: #286 WindUpBird

It involves raising taxes :D

everything does to people like you...yawn

297 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:55:44pm

re: #262 LudwigVanQuixote

YEs, there would be fossil fuel burnt. Much less than would be burnt in the following years when the nuclear power came on line. Your argument is specious.

No it's not specious Ludwig. If one achieves a 20% reduction in the proportion of fossil energy used by a population, that can be easily offset by an increase of the base population which is still using 80% fossil fuels. You know the math.

298 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:55:52pm

re: #294 Spare O'Lake

You lose me when you rave and present apocalyptic worst-case scenarios as proven fact. Completely unscientific.

Losing you is a feature, not a bug

299 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:55:53pm

re: #289 Varek Raith

Good thing I don't eat!

it is very popular now days... I my self have lost 15 pounds on the poverty diet. it is sweeping the country I hear.

300 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:56:24pm

re: #284 albusteve

you quote speculation...it proves nothing no matter how well it's presented

I recommend the lead article in the current issue of Skeptics Magazine on Climate Change... does a much better job of honestly looking at the situation, and putting a muzzle on the crazies... at both ends of the spectrum. It's not available on line (yet), I'll mail my copy to anyone who wants it.

301 ryannon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:56:37pm

re: #285 Walter L. Newton

I'm just sitting here crafting hippie jewelry and listening to Mark Levin on the radio... and getting a good laugh... better than a sitcom.

Sorry Walter and everyone, I can't resist. It's a Pavlovian reaction:

302 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:56:38pm

re: #296 albusteve

everything does to people like you...yawn

Yep! Sorry about that, you don't get results from systems by draining those systems of resources.

303 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:56:50pm

re: #299 brookly red

it is very popular now days... I my self have lost 15 pounds on the poverty diet. it is sweeping the country I hear.

Being an Undead creature does have its advantages.

304 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:57:11pm

re: #285 Walter L. Newton

I was just interjecting a little lightness to the conversation... I don't care... I understand what needs to be done, I know what can be done, and I have my opinions on what we can't control... I don't need evangelizing any more from scientist that I need from religionist... and then you have scientists who also believe in G-d, and you have an extremely volatile mix... and a confusing one... and a stupid one IMO.

I'm just sitting here crafting hippie jewelry and listening to Mark Levin on the radio... and getting a good laugh... better than a sitcom.

Levin?

I knew there was something wrong with you...

305 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:57:14pm

re: #292 Stanley Sea

3. We have youth.

The hope.

Weeelll, some of us have to let loose of the youth thing sooner than others. I will always have hope. I'm always looking for that unicorn./

306 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:57:32pm

re: #285 Walter L. Newton

I was just interjecting a little lightness to the conversation... I don't care... I understand what needs to be done, I know what can be done, and I have my opinions on what we can't control... I don't need evangelizing any more from scientist that I need from religionist... and then you have scientists who also believe in G-d, and you have an extremely volatile mix... and a confusing one... and a stupid one IMO.

I'm just sitting here crafting hippie jewelry and listening to Mark Levin on the radio... and getting a good laugh... better than a sitcom.

I'll gladly die along side you...let the freaks ruin it and be done...what difference does it make since there is a better life yonder eh?....ahahaha!

307 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:57:32pm

re: #285 Walter L. Newton

Have you ever noticed Mark Levin's quiet voice...LOUD VOICE! quite voice...LOUD VOICE rhythm? it's like his trademark now!

308 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:57:42pm

Could we please stop flaming each other? It turns the tread to shit.

309 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:57:48pm

re: #304 JasonA

Levin?

I knew there was something wrong with you...

I listen to Savage sometimes! Good for the lulz.

310 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:57:53pm

re: #287 Racer X

If you want to be happy for the rest of your life,
Never make a pretty woman your wife,
If you want my personal point of view,
Get an ugly girl to marry you.

311 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:58:30pm

re: #293 WindUpBird

You, okay?!?!?! I learned it from watching you!

you haven't learned anything...go forth and prog

312 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:58:45pm

re: #284 albusteve

No, I quote predictions made on hard data and sound understandings of physical laws. I haven't done this in a while, so I am goin to treat myself.

Steve..

What is the definition of entropy in the canonical ensemble?

What is a Lyaponov exponent and how would you calculate one?

Hell Stevo, what is a contour integral?

When you can answer those questions, you can talk about the efficacy of the physics. Otherwise, please stop pretending to know anything.

313 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:59:21pm

re: #311 albusteve

you haven't learned anything...go forth and prog

Lol.
(Sorry WuB)

314 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 7:59:41pm

re: #297 Bagua

No it's not specious Ludwig. If one achieves a 20% reduction in the proportion of fossil energy used by a population, that can be easily offset by an increase of the base population which is still using 80% fossil fuels. You know the math.

Uhhh nuke or wind? We could power the whole nation by both with current technology - as in a 100% transition. I am sugessting using both.

315 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:00:21pm

re: #312 LudwigVanQuixote

No, I quote predictions made on hard data and sound understandings of physical laws. I haven't done this in a while, so I am goin to treat myself.

Steve..

What is the definition of entropy in the canonical ensemble?

What is a Lyaponov exponent and how would you calculate one?

Hell Stevo, what is a contour integral?

When you can answer those questions, you can talk about the efficacy of the physics. Otherwise, please stop pretending to know anything.

you are speculating...just admit it

316 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:01:09pm

re: #310 Spare O'Lake

If you want to be happy for the rest of your life,
Never make a pretty woman your wife,
If you want my personal point of view,
Get an ugly girl to marry you.

How about you answer the challenge there spare. I'm tired of your antics and calling you out. Please enlighten us with your vast knowledge of physics.

317 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:01:13pm

re: #313 Varek Raith

Lol.
(Sorry WuB)

no it's fine, it was a good line :D

Though the term "prog" as an insult always makes me giggle, because it's like Mandy and Steve and everyone are calling me a 70's keyboardist in a wizard hat singing 14 minute songs about astral travel. Oh shit no! Save me from the phrygian lead figure!

318 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:01:46pm

re: #315 albusteve

you are speculating...just admit it

You are an ignorant redneck who ceased to have meaning in this world or even as a voice on this blog ages ago. Admit that ;)

319 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:02:12pm

re: #312 LudwigVanQuixote

No, I quote predictions made on hard data and sound understandings of physical laws. I haven't done this in a while, so I am goin to treat myself.

Steve..

What is the definition of entropy in the canonical ensemble?

What is a Lyaponov exponent and how would you calculate one?

Hell Stevo, what is a contour integral?

When you can answer those questions, you can talk about the efficacy of the physics. Otherwise, please stop pretending to know anything.

You really are a shithead.

320 [deleted]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:02:21pm
321 Stanghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:02:37pm

Uncle

322 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:02:40pm

re: #314 LudwigVanQuixote

Uhhh nuke or wind? We could power the whole nation by both with current technology - as in a 100% transition. I am sugessting using both.

Can't. They don't want us to use Yucca Mountain to store the waste.

NIMBY

323 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:02:49pm

re: #88 brookly red

OK so then I have heard some of you solutions before & we did not agree so much... what plan do you have for changing our ways that A. don't involve a dictatorship & B. will matter cause the rest of the world will go along? Serious question not bating.

Can I put in my two bits?

We don't need a dictatorship to work toward technology that will make coal obsolete. The fuel for solar energy is free, after all. How hard can it be to compete when your main input is free?

It's no trivial task. We have a lot of engineering work to do before we'll be able to beat the price at the wall outlet of coal-fired electricity. But IF we can beat that price, the rest of the world will follow of its own free will.

The same goes for any further improvements in wind, and if we could get past some of our hangups about nuclear power, we can already produce a nuclear kwh at less cost, amortized over the life of the plant, than the coal-fired price.

We don't need a dictatorship, though we do need a government, to require that buildings, henceforth, be constructed with improved energy efficiency in mind. This kind of requirement doesn't actually hurt anyone, because the homeowner saves in utilities what he loses in mortgage payments.

We don't need a dictatorship, and we don't even need government, to migrate to CF and LED and other futuristic lighting methods. Price signals will do that job. It would be nice if the price of a bulb had to prominently include the cost per lumen-hour to run it, assuming average lifespan of bulb and standard middling kwh prices. Just like foods now include calorie counts, say. That kind of a law just improves our ability to perceive price signals, after all.

All these things can be done country by country, because they're all to our own interest. If we had global agreement, we could all impose a tax on implicit carbon content of things. This would be a messy business and inevitably there would be some corruption here and there. But nations with high rates of solar, wind, thermal, hydro, and nuclear electricity behind their industry would receive favorable tariff treatment in this scheme, and those running on coal would not, so without war and dictatorship we could sort of discipline each other and avoid the tragedy of the commons.

This kind of path does not save us from all the troubles now facing us. We skate by the worst of them though. We preserve at least half, and maybe most, of the Antarctic ice caps, for instance. So we don't lose Memphis to rising sea levels, or any of that drastic shit that really does follow in the wake of unrestrained coal burning. We merely lose our coastal cities, and those, we lose slowly enough that we can let their infrastructure grow old and shabby while we build our new stuff further inland. It'll be bearable.

324 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:03:10pm

re: #315 albusteve

you are speculating...just admit it

scientists don't speculate, they theorize...

325 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:03:57pm

re: #294 Spare O'Lake

You lose me when you rave and present apocalyptic worst-case scenarios as proven fact. Completely unscientific.

I am presenting the midrange. If you ever read any of the papers you would know that. Try reading them just once.

326 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:04:03pm

re: #314 LudwigVanQuixote

Uhhh nuke or wind? We could power the whole nation by both with current technology - as in a 100% transition. I am sugessting using both.

But Ludwig, surely you are aware of the slow progress in rolling out these alternatives? Even the most optimistic programs point to less than the 20% I am talking about over the next 10-20 years. Adding a statistically significant increase to the base load population still using 80% negates any CO2e savings over the coming decades.

327 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:04:07pm

Well I see it's all sunshine and roses again tonight.

328 jaunte  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:04:26pm

re: #323 lostlakehiker

Price signals will do that job. It would be nice if the price of a bulb had to prominently include the cost per lumen-hour to run it, assuming average lifespan of bulb and standard middling kwh prices. Just like foods now include calorie counts, say. That kind of a law just improves our ability to perceive price signals, after all.


Good idea.

329 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:04:31pm

re: #311 albusteve

you haven't learned anything...go forth and prog

So he advocates measures you disagree with, so he's a "prog"? Don't talk like that, Steve. That's how Rodan talks, and you're better than that.

330 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:04:34pm

re: #314 LudwigVanQuixote

Uhhh nuke or wind? We could power the whole nation by both with current technology - as in a 100% transition. I am sugessting using both.

Nuke, wind, massive additions to our national train infrastructure leading to massive efficiencies in overground shipping (OH SHIT TAXES STEVE! FUCK NOOOO) changes to our laws governing motor vehicles and roads leading to way lighter cars, better diesel regs, lessened safety restrictions for high MPG vehicles, big gas taxes, weight-guzzler taxes on above-4000lb cars to subsidize electric fueling infrastructure.

That's just off the top of my head.

331 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:04:54pm

re: #319 Spare O'Lake

You really are a shithead.

It sucks being completely outclassed chump, doesn't it?

332 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:05:02pm

re: #317 WindUpBird

no it's fine, it was a good line :D

Though the term "prog" as an insult always makes me giggle, because it's like Mandy and Steve and everyone are calling me a 70's keyboardist in a wizard hat singing 14 minute songs about astral travel. Oh shit no! Save me from the phrygian lead figure!

333 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:05:03pm

re: #319 Spare O'Lake

You really are a shithead.

What for pulling out the fact that physicist know physics better than blowhards like you or Stevo? Yes it is so unfair to point out that real math gets used. Don't be such a fool, read the science, learn the science or shut up.

334 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:05:58pm

re: #320 Walter L. Newton

JasonA... fuck off...

WUP... yea... that's what I get a kick out of... he really doesn't say anything intelligent, at least in the sense of debating an issue, presenting talking points or something that comes across as a well-formed argument... but 20 minutes past the hour and 10 minutes before the hour... he erupts just like old faithful... does he really think anyone thinks it's anything but contrived...

A very funny show...

Of all the conservative talkers, the guy with the most talent is Savage. Savage can make anything riveting.

335 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:05:59pm

re: #326 Bagua

But Ludwig, surely you are aware of the slow progress in rolling out these alternatives? Even the most optimistic programs point to less than the 20% I am talking about over the next 10-20 years. Adding a statistically significant increase to the base load population still using 80% negates any CO2e savings over the coming decades.

No it does not actually, shall I call up the MIT analysis for you or the one from Princeton? Will you read them if I do bring them?

336 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:05:59pm

re: #314 LudwigVanQuixote

Uhhh nuke or wind? We could power the whole nation by both with current technology - as in a 100% transition. I am sugessting using both.

Just a note on nuclear power. One thing people have to keep in mind is that it requires an ample water supply. Droughts would have devastating effect on electrical generation. Increased ambient temperatures will also cause cooling tower run off to exceed maximum acceptable temperatures.

General Google search here: [Link: www.google.com...]

337 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:06:33pm

re: #317 WindUpBird

no it's fine, it was a good line :D

Though the term "prog" as an insult always makes me giggle, because it's like Mandy and Steve and everyone are calling me a 70's keyboardist in a wizard hat singing 14 minute songs about astral travel. Oh shit no! Save me from the phrygian lead figure!

What the hell did you just say?!?

338 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:07:37pm

re: #337 JasonA

What the hell did you just say?!?

Basically, read this: [Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

And then listen to a couple of Yes records, that'll give you the proper vibe :D

339 Reginald Perrin  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:07:51pm

I wonder how many of the people arguing with Ludwig took the time to watch the video and then spent a few moments thinking about what the generals and admirals had to say about Climate Change?

340 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:08:21pm

re: #224 Spare O'Lake

Prove it.

You might take a look at the information on the web. We get thus and so amount of wind energy from the stuff we've already built. Those wind turbines occupy thus and so a percentage of the land that gets good wind. You can look at a map and run the numbers yourself.

And think about this. We don't have to run the nation on wind power. Or solar. Or nuclear. We can run it on 25% solar, 20% wind, 20% nuclear, 5% oil, 5% hydro, 5% biomass, and 15% natural gas, and while that won't entirely solve the problem, it would make an enormous difference.

And you KNOW we can build enough wind towers to get 20% of our energy from that source. It's an obvious extrapolation from where we are now. West Texas, Wyoming, various ridge lines and windy coastal waters---they are not already paved with wind turbines. There's room for more.

341 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:08:29pm

re: #318 LudwigVanQuixote

You are an ignorant redneck who ceased to have meaning in this world or even as a voice on this blog ages ago. Admit that ;)

and you are an ignorant elitist wannabe...if you were only half as smart as you think you are you would have stopped arguing with this ignorant redneck long ago...you are a sissy that can't stand on your own...an insecure little putz who has made a fake reputation talking down to slugs like me...you just can't resist can you?...you are butthurt, too fucking bad, roger

342 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:08:50pm

re: #334 WindUpBird

Of all the conservative talkers, the guy with the most talent is Savage. Savage can make anything riveting.

Yea... but I have a real problem with Savage... yes, as a talker, someone who knows how to "act

343 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:08:57pm

re: #337 JasonA

What the hell did you just say?!?

also prog = progressive rock, if you missed that reference. :D So basically, Rush, Yes, King Crimson, ELP, Dream Theater, etc etc

344 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:08:59pm

re: #339 Reginald Perrin

I wonder how many of the people arguing with Ludwig took the time to watch the video and then spent a few moments thinking about what the generals and admirals had to say about Climate Change?

well the first thing they said was we don't know bit if...

345 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:09:19pm

re: #336 Gus 802

Just a note on nuclear power. One thing people have to keep in mind is that it requires an ample water supply. Droughts would have devastating effect on electrical generation. Increased ambient temperatures will also cause cooling tower run off to exceed maximum acceptable temperatures.

General Google search here: [Link: www.google.com...]

That is a fantastic point. Also warmer cooling reservoirs would reduce efficiency. That is why wind needs to be a major part of the solution.

346 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:09:27pm

re: #342 Walter L. Newton

Yea... but I have a real problem with Savage... yes, as a talker, someone who knows how to "act

Yeah, i don't believe he believes his schtick, which is probably why he's so good, it's all like pro-wrestling for radio.

347 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:09:43pm

re: #329 Dark_Falcon

So he advocates measures you disagree with, so he's a "prog"? Don't talk like that, Steve. That's how Rodan talks, and you're better than that.

I don't like being spoken to like that...too bad

348 Fozzie Bear  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:10:14pm

re: #326 Bagua

But Ludwig, surely you are aware of the slow progress in rolling out these alternatives? Even the most optimistic programs point to less than the 20% I am talking about over the next 10-20 years. Adding a statistically significant increase to the base load population still using 80% negates any CO2e savings over the coming decades.

When you are standing on a street, and you see a car coming, do you lay down on the road, or do you start heading toward the sidewalk?

349 abolitionist  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:10:39pm

re: #324 brookly red

scientists don't speculate, they theorize...

Of course scientists speculate. Imaginative guesses are a very important part of science.

350 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:11:06pm

re: #341 albusteve

So Stevo,

What is the definition of entropy in the canonical ensemble?

What is a Lyaponov exponent and how would you calculate one?

Hell Stevo, what is a contour integral?

When you can answer those questions, you can talk about the efficacy of the physics.

Please prove your worth.

I'll even make is easy what is d/dx sin x? That's calc one? Do you even know that?

351 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:11:10pm

OT/
As I've mentioned before, I follow Michael Yon on FB and twitter, and have appreciated his work very much. Unfortunately lately he seems to be heading into AGW denial territory (not officially yet, but seems to be leaning that way), and then tonight he posted about the NASA MOOSLEM CONTROVERSY!!!, and let me tell you, the thread on FB was butt ugly. Tons of conspiracy theorizing and a general ODS attitude pretty much ruled. One a few posts, mine included, said otherwise. This is really disappointing.

352 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:11:13pm

Oh man..... reading this thread was so riveting I burnt my pizza. It wasn't just any pizza, it was a California Pizza Kitchen, BBQ chicken pizza.

I guess that increased my carbon footprint.

353 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:11:23pm

re: #349 abolitionist

Of course scientists speculate. Imaginative guesses are a very important part of science.

Imagine if astronomers couldn't speculate. o_O

354 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:11:46pm

re: #329 Dark_Falcon

So he advocates measures you disagree with, so he's a "prog"? Don't talk like that, Steve. That's how Rodan talks, and you're better than that.

He clearly isn't better than that DF.

355 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:11:46pm
356 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:11:50pm

re: #350 LudwigVanQuixote

So Stevo,

What is the definition of entropy in the canonical ensemble?

What is a Lyaponov exponent and how would you calculate one?

Hell Stevo, what is a contour integral?

When you can answer those questions, you can talk about the efficacy of the physics.

Please prove your worth.

I'll even make is easy what is d/dx sin x? That's calc one? Do you even know that?

I used to. ;_;

357 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:11:59pm

re: #345 LudwigVanQuixote

That is a fantastic point. Also warmer cooling reservoirs would reduce efficiency. That is why wind needs to be a major part of the solution.

Yes. Plus in wide spread usage it would begin to compete with agricultural water use. A great deal of the water that is used in nuclear generation is lost to evaporation. Inland power plants would be particularly troublesome.

358 [deleted]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:12:13pm
359 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:12:14pm

re: #333 LudwigVanQuixote

What for pulling out the fact that physicist know physics better than blowhards like you or Stevo? Yes it is so unfair to point out that real math gets used. Don't be such a fool, read the science, learn the science or shut up.

You damage the cause of AGW (which I believe in) with your ugly demeanor and exaggerations. Your style is akin to a drooling religious zealot.

360 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:12:21pm

re: #352 Mr Pancakes

Oh man... reading this thread was so riveting I burnt my pizza. It wasn't just any pizza, it was a California Pizza Kitchen, BBQ chicken pizza.

I guess that increased my carbon footprint.

the Lord sayeth you no put BBQ chicken on pizza....

361 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:13:10pm

re: #338 WindUpBird

Basically, read this: [Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

And then listen to a couple of Yes records, that'll give you the proper vibe :D

Rick Wakeman rocks... as a decent keyboardist myself, he is one of the few rock musicians I still look up to. I never followed practically any musician when I was actively playing gigs... but I kept up with the Wakeman stuff.

362 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:13:25pm

re: #353 WindUpBird

Imagine if astronomers couldn't speculate. o_O

Pluto would still be a fucking planet!!!1!!1

Stupid Neil deGrasse Tyson fuckin' with my solar system...

363 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:13:43pm

re: #350 LudwigVanQuixote

What is the definition of entropy in the canonical ensemble?

What is a Lyaponov exponent and how would you calculate one?

what is a contour integral?

42.

364 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:13:47pm

re: #352 Mr Pancakes

That would've never happened of you'd had a real pizza (says the New Yorker).

365 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:13:50pm

re: #348 Fozzie Bear

When you are standing on a street, and you see a car coming, do you lay down on the road, or do you start heading toward the sidewalk?

What is your point? Laying or sitting in the road is silly.

366 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:14:43pm

re: #359 Spare O'Lake

You damage the cause of AGW (which I believe in) with your ugly demeanor and exaggerations. Your style is akin to a drooling religious zealot.

Aren't there some muslims somewhere you should be flipping out about?

367 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:14:52pm

re: #231 albusteve

so what is your custom frank solution?...spill it, or is it an echo of LVQs wind farms?...you just another windy, solar echo?

God will save us if we cut taxes and regulation. Also, bootstraps.

368 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:14:57pm

re: #359 Spare O'Lake

You damage the cause of AGW (which I believe in) with your ugly demeanor and exaggerations. Your style is akin to a drooling religious zealot.


Funny. Weren't we saying that about you back when your vision of religious freedom meant getting rid of all religious structures downtown just to stop a mosque?

369 freetoken  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:15:43pm

re: #351 Irenicum

I fear that Yon will go the way of so many, who after achieving some fame or recognition decide that they like the attention and then go after anything that will keep them in the spotlight.

It's sad, like older gentlemen who may be well educated (engineers, scientists) but in their old age start chasing nutty ideas.

370 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:16:07pm

re: #360 brookly red

the Lord sayeth you no put BBQ chicken on pizza...

Got it....... no BBQ chicken. You are right...... I'll stick with artichoke hearts, cilantro, shrimp, Gouda cheese, and sun dried tomatoes.

371 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:16:09pm

re: #359 Spare O'Lake

You damage the cause of AGW (which I believe in) with your ugly demeanor and exaggerations. Your style is akin to a drooling religious zealot.

So name one bit of science I have brought that is not a midrange prediction?

Really that is how you win this. You bring science and analysis that out competes my own - and for that matter, NASA, NOAA, APS, NAS, DOD, and the Royal society o name a few, but that is how you do it.

Try it.

I get that you think what I am saying is too severe, I claim I am talking about midrange predictions and have sourced my claims. What do you have?

372 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:16:12pm

re: #360 brookly red

the Lord sayeth you no put BBQ chicken on pizza...

BBQ chicken on pizza... what's the fuck the matter with people?

373 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:16:16pm

re: #366 WindUpBird

Aren't there some muslims somewhere you should be flipping out about?

foul, illegal comparison in the backfield... 5 yards repeat first down.

374 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:16:36pm

re: #355 prairiefire

I think that's Spike Jonze.

375 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:16:50pm

re: #367 goddamnedfrank

God will save us if we cut taxes and regulation. Also, bootstraps.

And close the Department of Education.

/

376 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:16:57pm

re: #358 albusteve

where have I ever doubted the physics?...you are a fraud...you continuously bring this up but cannot substantiate it...show everybody here, just do it and settle the issue you liar

Steve,

What is the definition of entropy in the canonical ensemble?

What is a Lyaponov exponent and how would you calculate one?

Hell Stevo, what is a contour integral?

When you can answer those questions, you can talk about the efficacy of the physics. Otherwise, please stop pretending to know anything.

377 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:17:01pm

re: #350 LudwigVanQuixote

So Stevo,

What is the definition of entropy in the canonical ensemble?

What is a Lyaponov exponent and how would you calculate one?

Hell Stevo, what is a contour integral?

When you can answer those questions, you can talk about the efficacy of the physics.

Please prove your worth.

I'll even make is easy what is d/dx sin x? That's calc one? Do you even know that?

I basically forgot most of that since I got my Math degree 24 years ago. However Zedushka entertains himself in the bathroom doing differential equations, so he'd probably ace your little pop quiz.

378 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:17:03pm

re: #370 Mr Pancakes

Got it... no BBQ chicken. You are right... I'll stick with artichoke hearts, cilantro, shrimp, Gouda cheese, and sun dried tomatoes.

bless you, and sin no more.

379 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:17:10pm

re: #350 LudwigVanQuixote

So Stevo,

What is the definition of entropy in the canonical ensemble?

What is a Lyaponov exponent and how would you calculate one?

Hell Stevo, what is a contour integral?

When you can answer those questions, you can talk about the efficacy of the physics.

Please prove your worth.

I'll even make is easy what is d/dx sin x? That's calc one? Do you even know that?

put up or shut up...you have been exposed and I challenge you to show I disbelieve the physics...you are a one trick pony, stuck on stupid...how can anybody that professes to be so smart, be so ignorant?...show everybody at LGF where I dispute the physics of global warming...do it, big shot....you continuously allude to this but never back up your claim...why is that?...show the folks here your fu...LGF is awaiting your proof

380 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:17:37pm

re: #363 Varek Raith

42.

I like that Sith dig Adams :)

381 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:18:01pm

re: #361 Walter L. Newton

Rick Wakeman rocks... as a decent keyboardist myself, he is one of the few rock musicians I still look up to. I never followed practically any musician when I was actively playing gigs... but I kept up with the Wakeman stuff.

Walter, do you have the "Knights of the Round Table" LP?

382 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:18:15pm

re: #379 albusteve

put up or shut up...you have been exposed and I challenge you to show I disbelieve the physics...you are a one trick pony, stuck on stupid...how can anybody that professes to be so smart, be so ignorant?...show everybody at LGF where I dispute the physics of global warming...do it, big shot...you continuously allude to this but never back up your claim...why is that?...show the folks here your fu...LGF is awaiting your proof

You're fucking delusional, Steve.

383 ryannon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:18:19pm

re: #348 Fozzie Bear

When you are standing on a street, and you see a car coming, do you lay down on the road, or do you start heading toward the sidewalk?

I take steady aim with my RPG.

Fucking cars.

384 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:19:01pm

re: #356 WindUpBird

I used to. ;_;

I know that feeling all too well :(

385 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:19:21pm

re: #368 JasonA

Funny. Weren't we saying that about you back when your vision of religious freedom meant getting rid of all religious structures downtown just to stop a mosque?

Who is "we"?
What I said (among other things) was that the mosque could not be stopped unless all other religious structures were also removed. It is a legal position, not a religious one.

386 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:19:27pm

re: #372 Walter L. Newton

BBQ chicken on pizza... what's the fuck the matter with people?

It's actually pretty good....... a chain of restaurants were created because of it ..... (don't look brookly) they have them in New York.

387 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:19:30pm

re: #377 Alouette

I basically forgot most of that since I got my Math degree 24 years ago. However Zedushka entertains himself in the bathroom doing differential equations, so he'd probably ace your little pop quiz.

I'm certain he would. I am also certain that he would take the time to read the papers provided and understand the science before making an ass of himself.

The point of the quiz is to remind certain trolls that coming to a science debate without science or math is like coming to a gunfight equipped with a rubber band. Such bluster might work on idiots, but the average lizard is too smart for that.

388 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:19:35pm

re: #370 Mr Pancakes

Got it... no BBQ chicken. You are right... I'll stick with artichoke hearts, cilantro, shrimp, Gouda cheese, and sun dried tomatoes.

No shellfish! (shrimp) Haven't you read the old testament?

389 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:20:33pm

re: #382 JasonA

You're fucking delusional, Steve.

no, I'm not...just because you want me to be won't make it true bro

390 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:20:49pm

re: #369 freetoken

I hate to agree with you, but I suspect you may be right. Yon is clearly working with topics far beyond his understanding. I'm not saying he shouldn't have an opinion. Hell, I love spouting off on tons of stuff. But there's only a few discreet areas where I am actually fairly knowledgeable about. It's in those areas that I'm willing to put my reputation on the line and defend my views strongly. For instance I know enough to know I don't know enough about military strategy. That's why I rely on those who specialize in that field to inform me. That's where I like Michael Yon. But if he goes into this other territory he's gonna get an amen chorus that will go to his head if he's not careful.

391 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:20:50pm

re: #385 Spare O'Lake

Who is "we"?
What I said (among other things) was that the mosque could not be stopped unless all other religious structures were also removed. It is a legal position, not a religious one.

Ohhhhh no you weren't. That's what we were telling you would have to happen. And you said you were just fine with that. The thread still exists. You can't change the conversation, you know.

392 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:21:17pm

re: #386 Mr Pancakes

It's actually pretty good... a chain of restaurants were created because of it ... (don't look brookly) they have them in New York.

we know where they are... the most foul is the General Taso's Chicken pizza.


we know where they are.

393 Ojoe  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:21:18pm

re: #340 lostlakehiker

You can design a passive solar heated home in most US climates that will save 2.5 to 3 barrels equivalent energy every heating season.

There are around 600,000 housing starts per year even now, during this depression.

As the years roll on, and IF we have the political will AND the general intelligence of the citizenry, the energy savings just from winter space heating on sunny winter days, will be in the millions and millions of barrels.

Passive solar heating is just one area, & the alternative energy effort will be multifaceted.

And eventually even the very stupid will realize that we have to work on every aspect of it.

Signed,

Ojoe, architect.

394 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:21:44pm

re: #295 LudwigVanQuixote

Yeah that's about right. It's even more repulsive.

goddamned frank pretty much nailed the meme and the psychology behind it imo. That's what's taking over the right.

As for here, the usual beta males are all frothy because you're reminding them again of how tiny their penises brains endowments are.

Rock on, ludwig baby. :)

395 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:21:58pm

re: #389 albusteve

no, I'm not...just because you want me to be won't make it true bro

Steve, you've already convinced yourself that you've won this conversation and outed Ludwig as a fraud or something... but that hasn't happened. Take a step back. It's okay to be wrong.

396 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:22:04pm

re: #381 prairiefire

Walter, do you have the "Knights of the Round Table" LP?

Maybe... the girlfriend and I have about 100 albums... and we haven't gone through them in a while... so I don't remember...

397 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:22:19pm

re: #379 albusteve

put up or shut up...you have been exposed and I challenge you to show I disbelieve the physics.

Didn't you just call it all speculation? Really... I seem to remember that? And you called it that after all those papers were once again provided, so you weren't just saying I was just speculating, but thousands of other scientists as well.

Once again Stevo, we had this problem up thread, so let's try again,

Steve, your ability to re-spin thing you have just said has republican grade hypocrisy. The problem with you is not just that you are a troll, but a really silly one to boot. At least wait a few comments before openly contradicting yourself OK? They teach that somewhere in troll school for the irrelevant, cranky, and not particularly bright yes?

398 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:23:29pm

re: #396 Walter L. Newton

Well, I could give you mine if you wanted it. I have not played it in years.

399 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:23:42pm

re: #394 iceweasel

goddamned frank pretty much nailed the meme and the psychology behind it imo. That's what's taking over the right.

As for here, the usual beta males are all frothy because you're reminding them again of how tiny their penises brains endowments are.

Rock on, ludwig baby. :)

you'd be the expert on tiny minds...how's jim doing?

400 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:24:06pm

re: #385 Spare O'Lake

Who is "we"?
What I said (among other things) was that the mosque could not be stopped unless all other religious structures were also removed. It is a legal position, not a religious one.

It's also not a practical position, given the religious structures already there. I'd rather accept a mosque than close down churches.

401 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:24:07pm

re: #398 prairiefire

Well, I could give you mine if you wanted it. I have not played it in years.

Nice... bring it if you think about it...

402 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:24:08pm

re: #394 iceweasel

goddamned frank pretty much nailed the meme and the psychology behind it imo. That's what's taking over the right.

As for here, the usual beta males are all frothy because you're reminding them again of how tiny their penises brains endowments are.

Rock on, ludwig baby. :)

I have no idea abut the size of Stevo's endowment. I would speculate though that it hasn't been usable for some time though.

403 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:24:08pm

re: #160 Spare O'Lake

Your apocalyptic fear-mongering is more science fiction than fiction. Hardly what I would expect from a real scientist.

You know, he really is a real scientist. Snide-talk is all good fun but really, what more proof can you ask of that without insisting he blow his cover? And that's no fair. In the real world, people have to be extra diplomatic and that makes straight talk that much harder.

I have never found Ludwig to lie. He may emphasize the strongest case for the point he's making, and not bring up facts that would water down its impact. That's just debate. But he knows his physics, and the physics is trying to tell us something.

With intuitive physics, we all get it. If you see a train coming your way down the tracks, you understand that it can't stop and that if you're still on that track in N seconds, you're going to be cut to pieces by the wheels and killed.

And you don't tell yourself that the scientists are just trying to scare you with talk of mass and momentum and insisting that steel can crush bones which you have complete confidence in. You move.

Here, the physics is just as real. We equally need to move. We may skin our knees jumping. The only difference is that this train is bigger and slower and only visible to senses that include the intellect, while jumping takes more time and more work and can't be done in a couple of seconds. And yes, the skinned knees cost billions of dollars, maybe even a few trillion. Nothing any more consequential for a society that produces 100 trillion of value every year, than a skinned knee for a man.

404 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:24:37pm

I'm tired.
Night everyone!

405 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:25:04pm

re: #402 LudwigVanQuixote

I have no idea abut the size of Stevo's endowment. I would speculate though that it hasn't been usable for some time though.

You have any scientific proof of that?

406 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:25:21pm

re: #366 WindUpBird

Aren't there some muslims somewhere you should be flipping out about?

ahahahahahahaha.

But how does this impact radical Islam? /

407 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:25:29pm

re: #405 Walter L. Newton

You have any scientific proof of that?

None. There I am speculating. ;)

408 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:25:49pm

re: #403 lostlakehiker

Thanks sir.

409 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:26:07pm

re: #392 brookly red

I love General Tso's chicken, and I love Pizza. Two different species and they should never breed. It's an abomination.

410 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:26:08pm

re: #395 JasonA

Steve, you've already convinced yourself that you've won this conversation and outed Ludwig as a fraud or something... but that hasn't happened. Take a step back. It's okay to be wrong.

he's claimed for months I disavow the science of AGW and uses that as a launching pad to trash me...it's hilarious, he keeps saying it but can't back it up...so if I were you, what would you do?, roll over?

411 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:26:35pm

re: #407 LudwigVanQuixote

None. There I am speculating. ;)

Well... check your butt :)

412 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:26:37pm

re: #402 LudwigVanQuixote

I have no idea abut the size of Stevo's endowment. I would speculate though that it hasn't been usable for some time though.

personal foul, 15 yards loss of credibility.

413 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:26:46pm

re: #402 LudwigVanQuixote

I have no idea abut the size of Stevo's endowment. I would speculate though that it hasn't been usable for some time though.

I'm now in your head...sissy

414 Stanghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:27:28pm

Night lovers!

415 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:27:29pm

re: #413 albusteve

I'm now in your head...sissy

You're taking the internet too seriously again.

416 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:27:30pm

re: #341 albusteve

and you are an ignorant elitist wannabe...if you were only half as smart as you think you are you would have stopped arguing with this ignorant redneck long ago...you are a sissy that can't stand on your own...an insecure little putz who has made a fake reputation talking down to slugs like me...you just can't resist can you?...you are butthurt, too fucking bad, roger

Steve, trust me on this. He's exactly as smart as he thinks he is. He has a reputation in the real world. He even has a reputation here, if you'd like to go karma-counting.

You are smart enough to realize this if you'll step back a pace and take a deep breath. That is one thing you just might be better at than Ludwig. Give it a try.

417 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:27:39pm

re: #412 brookly red

personal foul, 15 yards loss of credibility.

he has nothing but words, tons of words

418 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:28:08pm

Damn, lots of "friskiness" going on in here tonight. I can just gently step from ad hominem to ad hominem without ever having to dip my toes into the "tubes" at all... :p

419 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:28:09pm

re: #410 albusteve

he's claimed for months I disavow the science of AGW and uses that as a launching pad to trash me...it's hilarious, he keeps saying it but can't back it up...so if I were you, what would you do?, roll over?

Listen, I'm not here for every thread. I don't see every post that goes on between you two. I saw this one from the beginning, though, and I see you jumping on his back the second he posts something, saying that he should essentially just shut up.

420 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:28:12pm

re: #414 Stanley Sea

Night lovers!

Night Stanley.

421 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:28:35pm

re: #416 lostlakehiker

Steve, trust me on this. He's exactly as smart as he thinks he is. He has a reputation in the real world. He even has a reputation here, if you'd like to go karma-counting.

You are smart enough to realize this if you'll step back a pace and take a deep breath. That is one thing you just might be better at than Ludwig. Give it a try.

no

422 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:28:52pm

re: #417 albusteve

he has nothing but words, tons of words

We're on a forum. That's all any of us have bud.

423 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:29:39pm

re: #418 ausador

Heh, I feel like I'm having a quiet conservation in the middle of a bar fight. As long as none of the bullets hit my beer I'm cool.

424 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:29:54pm

re: #400 Dark_Falcon

It's also not a practical position, given the religious structures already there. I'd rather accept a mosque than close down churches.

That's fine. I personally would defer to the wishes of the survivors of the victims of 9-11 and the local ratepayers. But the law is the law.

425 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:30:05pm

BTW, the Stalkers are watching. 'MrPaulRevere' just reposted most of Freetoken's #369. He only omitted the last sentence, which is not crucial to the post. But lets watch our backs, since others of them may well try to take us out of context.

Not praising MPR, but I also want the record to accurately reflect people's actions.

426 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:30:09pm

I just ate an In-N-Out double-double animal style.

And you didn't.

*burp*

427 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:30:59pm

re: #417 albusteve

he has nothing but words, tons of words

yes I know but like the others that resort to personal attacks when challenged , just say no. No is a very effective weapon if you are not afraid to use it.

428 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:31:11pm

re: #426 Racer X

I just ate an In-N-Out double-double animal style.

And you didn't.

*burp*

Best burger in the world....... no dispute.

429 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:31:19pm

re: #402 LudwigVanQuixote

I have no idea abut the size of Stevo's endowment. I would speculate though that it hasn't been usable for some time though.

Shame on you.

430 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:31:30pm

re: #395 JasonA

Steve, you've already convinced yourself that you've won this conversation and outed Ludwig as a fraud or something... but that hasn't happened. Take a step back. It's okay to be wrong.

Wingnut logic: Just keep saying it over and over and you can pretend it's true!
File under 'Clap Louder'.

431 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:31:36pm

re: #422 McSpiff

We're on a forum. That's all any of us have bud.

all I ask is show where I have disputed LVQs physics...he can't and he knows it so he trashes me even further...he's a coward that won't admit he's wrong

432 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:32:13pm

re: #417 albusteve

he has nothing but words, tons of words

No not really, I have all that pesky math and data and science and stuff you don't understand. The there is the fact that my words make sense. Then there is the fact that you are just losing it over and over.

Steve really, I didn't come here to spar with you. I am vaguely amused at your impotent rage and incoherent jealousy at not being completely irrelevant, but I would much rather talk to the big people.

433 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:32:40pm

re: #427 brookly red

yes I know but like the others that resort to personal attacks when challenged , just say no. No is a very effective weapon if you are not afraid to use it.

no

434 Eclectic Infidel  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:32:41pm

re: #4 brookly red

I am no military expert but I seem to recall that holding the high ground has always been desirable...

Unless the high ground is under water...

435 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:32:44pm

re: #424 Spare O'Lake

That's fine. I personally would defer to the wishes of the survivors of the victims of 9-11 and the local ratepayers. But the law is the law.

I don't think they want churches closed either. Most of them would likely rather have the mosque than do that.

436 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:32:55pm

re: #345 LudwigVanQuixote

I'll jump in, again.
There is SO MUCH that each & every one of us could be doing today, to make an impact, and at least slow the problem down. Recycle all glass, plastic, paper & cardboard. Take a shorter shower. Reduce, reuse or recycle everything that you can. Compost it! Let it feed a vacant lot near you. Collect rain water, if you can. Recycle everything that your local Thrift shop can sell, even if it's for $0.25, better than having it go into a landfill. Can you grow some of your own fruits & veggies? They're fresher & better for you anyway.
So, yes, there are some pretty easy things that almost everyone could do, if they wanted to.

437 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:33:01pm

re: #399 albusteve

you'd be the expert on tiny minds...how's jim doing?

You think starting a random attack on someone else is the thing to do here, Steve?
Have at it.

438 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:33:04pm

re: #425 Dark_Falcon

BTW, the Stalkers are watching. 'MrPaulRevere' just reposted most of Freetoken's #369. He only omitted the last sentence, which is not crucial to the post. But lets watch our backs, since others of them may well try to take us out of context.

Not praising MPR, but I also want the record to accurately reflect people's actions.

What do you think this is "0" fucking "0" fucking "7"? This is the internet... not international espionage and intrigue... real up.. huh?

439 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:33:43pm

re: #413 albusteve

I'm now in your head...sissy

So if I were gay, that would make a difference to the science?

Interesting. Lucky for the science then that I'm straight, though I am surprised you think that being gay is an insult.

440 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:33:43pm

re: #434 eclectic infidel

Unless the high ground is under water...

you waited 430 comments to say THAT? sheesh.

441 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:34:11pm

re: #436 Floral Giraffe

I'll jump in, again.
There is SO MUCH that each & every one of us could be doing today, to make an impact, and at least slow the problem down. Recycle all glass, plastic, paper & cardboard. Take a shorter shower. Reduce, reuse or recycle everything that you can. Compost it! Let it feed a vacant lot near you. Collect rain water, if you can. Recycle everything that your local Thrift shop can sell, even if it's for $0.25, better than having it go into a landfill. Can you grow some of your own fruits & veggies? They're fresher & better for you anyway.
So, yes, there are some pretty easy things that almost everyone could do, if they wanted to.

Did I mention I adore you recently Floral?

442 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:34:31pm

re: #423 Irenicum

Heh, I feel like I'm having a quiet conservation in the middle of a bar fight. As long as none of the bullets hit my beer I'm cool.

So...the weather today. Sheesh, what's that about?

443 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:34:37pm

re: #431 albusteve

all I ask is show where I have disputed LVQs physics...he can't and he knows it so he trashes me even further...he's a coward that won't admit he's wrong

Sometimes you just need to be confident enough to know you're right, the other guy is wrong, and move on. That's all I'm saying. I'm not passing any judgment on this "He said He said" stuff.

444 Eclectic Infidel  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:34:42pm

re: #360 brookly red

the Lord sayeth you no put BBQ chicken on pizza...

But you can put linguica, extra garlic and tomatoes on the pie. Oh yes.

445 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:34:44pm

re: #432 LudwigVanQuixote

No not really, I have all that pesky math and data and science and stuff you don't understand. The there is the fact that my words make sense. Then there is the fact that you are just losing it over and over.

Steve really, I didn't come here to spar with you. I am vaguely amused at your impotent rage and incoherent jealousy at not being completely irrelevant, but I would much rather talk to the big people.

you came here to talk about my dick?...prove your incessant accusation about the physics or shut the fuck up about it...go ahead, for all your groupies go ahead, I can take it

446 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:35:25pm

re: #426 Racer X

Next comes the heartburn!
LOL!

447 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:35:27pm

re: #430 iceweasel

Wingnut logic: Just keep saying it over and over and you can pretend it's true!
File under 'Clap Louder'.

Who are you calling a "Wingnut" here?

448 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:35:28pm

re: #442 prairiefire

So...the weather today. Sheesh, what's that about?

Grrr. Hot here in NY today. Will be for at least a week.

449 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:35:43pm

re: #443 McSpiff

Sometimes you just need to be confident enough to know you're right, the other guy is wrong, and move on. That's all I'm saying. I'm not passing any judgment on this "He said He said" stuff.

Dude, I really do just want to keep this on topic.

450 Eclectic Infidel  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:36:06pm

re: #440 brookly red

you waited 430 comments to say THAT? sheesh.

Twas at a July 5th mid-day party and just walked in 30 min ago, or so. Still buzzed too.

451 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:36:15pm

re: #441 LudwigVanQuixote

Did I mention I adore you recently Floral?

It's mutual, Sir.

452 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:36:25pm

re: #427 brookly red

yes I know but like the others that resort to personal attacks when challenged , just say no. No is a very effective weapon if you are not afraid to use it.

see it really really gets to them big time cause the can't stand being ignored...

453 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:36:36pm

re: #445 albusteve

you came here to talk about my dick?...prove your incessant accusation about the physics or shut the fuck up about it...go ahead, for all your groupies go ahead, I can take it

Steve I assure you, your dick is one of the last things I, or any sane person, wants to think about.

454 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:36:50pm

re: #441 LudwigVanQuixote

Did I mention I adore you recently Floral?

So do I! Let's fight over her! /

455 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:37:02pm

Making Ezra Frech's Dream Come True

Kinda puts the trivial bickering into perspective.

456 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:37:12pm

So, how 'bout dem Mets? (to which have the lizards scream FUCK THE METS! and the other have start screaming FUCK YOU TOO>!>!>!!111)

Ah, that felt better.

457 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:37:36pm

re: #444 eclectic infidel

But you can put linguica, extra garlic and tomatoes on the pie. Oh yes.

re: #360 brookly red

the Lord sayeth you no put BBQ chicken on pizza...

Not only is it BBQ chicken....... they put BBQ sauce down instead of tomato sauce.

458 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:37:45pm

re: #449 LudwigVanQuixote

Dude, I really do just want to keep this on topic.

Hey its all good. Neither one of you are interesting enough for me to go sleuthing through your posts :-). I just wish more people would just agree to disagree when it comes to these meta-arguments. That goes for me too.

459 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:38:01pm

re: #447 Bagua

Who are you calling a "Wingnut" here?

Fuck off, Bagua. You were dealt with downstairs. Don't address me again.

460 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:38:08pm

re: #448 JasonA

It rained out our 4th fireworks display. My son cried bitter tears of jealousy because his sister was able to see the fireworks in another town.

461 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:38:32pm

re: #437 iceweasel

You think starting a random attack on someone else is the thing to do here, Steve?
Have at it.

random attacks?...do you ever really go away?...is this you?

As for here, the usual beta males are all frothy because you're reminding them again of how tiny their penises brains endowments are.


you don't impress me with your random attack bullshit

462 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:38:46pm
463 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:38:51pm

re: #459 iceweasel

Fuck off, Bagua. You were dealt with downstairs. Don't address me again.

Can't we all just get mad over pizza?

464 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:38:52pm

re: #454 iceweasel

So do I! Let's fight over her! /

Well we could spank her a little together?

465 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:38:56pm

Every year I care less and less about fireworks. Meh.

466 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:39:05pm

re: #454 iceweasel

So do I! Let's fight over her! /

LOL!
*smooch*

467 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:39:05pm

re: #457 Mr Pancakes

It's like the gastronomical Island of Doctor Moreau. That is so wrong.

468 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:39:30pm

re: #453 LudwigVanQuixote

Steve I assure you, your dick is one of the last things I, or any sane person, wants to think about.

fine, answer the question then tough guy...or shut the fuck up about it

469 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:39:54pm

re: #425 Dark_Falcon

BTW, the Stalkers are watching. 'MrPaulRevere' just reposted most of Freetoken's #369. He only omitted the last sentence, which is not crucial to the post. But lets watch our backs, since others of them may well try to take us out of context.

Not praising MPR, but I also want the record to accurately reflect people's actions.

It's no secret that many right wingers believe that the opinion of someone that was or is in the military is sacrosanct and above all reproach. If said person is incorrect and criticized the typical response from the American militarists is to say that those critical of said person are "anti-military." This of course is an invalid logical conclusion and could be noted by the very video Charles post above which includes generals and admirals.

Last I checked this was a democracy and not a military state. Military people are open to criticism even while in service by those citizens that choose to do so. To object to anyone criticizing them as such goes against the intentions of the Constitution and the proverbial Founding Fathers.

470 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:39:56pm

re: #459 iceweasel

Fuck off, Bagua. You were dealt with downstairs. Don't address me again.

Lol. You were going on about the wingnuts and haters and "alpha males" on the last thread. So I'm just wondering who you were attacking.

471 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:40:04pm

re: #437 iceweasel

You think starting a random attack on someone else is the thing to do here, Steve?
Have at it.

Lol - I wasn't even here. Has he started talking about how much he doesn't care about me yet?

472 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:40:14pm

re: #464 LudwigVanQuixote

So, what are your thoughts about Genetically Modified plants, if they didn't have the patents on them?

473 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:40:25pm

re: #417 albusteve

he has nothing but words, tons of words

In this forum, that's all any of us has.

But here's a thought. Go to this link and reflect on the fact that what you're looking at really does make concrete, exact sense to those of us with the technical training to follow. If it's Greek to you, that's OK; I can't read Greek and maybe you can. But there's things to know about the way the real world works that don't come clear without long study and a considerable helping of talent.

wikipedia explains Lyapunov exponents...

About the simplest example I can think of in this vein is this: you take a number somewhere in the interval 0 to 1, and you double it and then subtract 1 if it's greater than 1. That gives you a new number between 0 and 1. You repeat that move t times. If two numbers start very near each other, separated by some little quantity h, then after t steps, doing this rule to each, what can you say about how far apart they'll be?

For bonus points, what does this have to do with the distinction between predicting the weather, and predicting the climate?

474 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:41:04pm

re: #458 McSpiff

Hey its all good. Neither one of you are interesting enough for me to go sleuthing through your posts :-). I just wish more people would just agree to disagree when it comes to these meta-arguments. That goes for me too.

What really does offend me about Stevo and Spare and to some extent Walter is that everytime we have a serious thread on AGW they try to derail it with endless attacks on me rather than talk teh science. It is a very effective way of derailing an important topic.

They do it like clockwork. Then they cry like babies when called on it. I really really would rather talk the science.

475 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:41:06pm

re: #467 Irenicum

It's like the gastronomical Island of Doctor Moreau. That is so wrong.

Funny! What else is created by Dr. Moreau? Alfredo picante bacon cactus leaves?

476 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:41:12pm

re: #464 LudwigVanQuixote

Well we could spank her a little together?

[Hands Ludwig the paddle.]

477 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:41:15pm

re: #459 iceweasel

Fuck off, Bagua. You were dealt with downstairs. Don't address me again.

off with his head! off with his head! he addressed me off with his head!

sick.

478 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:41:37pm

re: #465 JasonA

Every year I care less and less about fireworks. Meh.

I feel that way too. Is this a sign of getting older or something? Just hate the crowds.
I'd definitely still go if I lived somewhere such that there were tiny displays that were easy to get to (and get away from).

479 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:41:51pm

re: #459 iceweasel

Fuck off, Bagua. You were dealt with downstairs. Don't address me again.

"Q. how many assholes does it take to drive away good posters? A. Not very many so long as they stick with it."

480 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:42:20pm

re: #473 lostlakehiker

In this forum, that's all any of us has.

But here's a thought. Go to this link and reflect on the fact that what you're looking at really does make concrete, exact sense to those of us with the technical training to follow. If it's Greek to you, that's OK; I can't read Greek and maybe you can. But there's things to know about the way the real world works that don't come clear without long study and a considerable helping of talent.

wikipedia explains Lyapunov exponents...

About the simplest example I can think of in this vein is this: you take a number somewhere in the interval 0 to 1, and you double it and then subtract 1 if it's greater than 1. That gives you a new number between 0 and 1. You repeat that move t times. If two numbers start very near each other, separated by some little quantity h, then after t steps, doing this rule to each, what can you say about how far apart they'll be?

For bonus points, what does this have to do with the distinction between predicting the weather, and predicting the climate?

Did I mention I adore you too. That is indeed why I mentioned it.

481 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:42:30pm

re: #470 Bagua

Lol. You were going on about the wingnuts and haters and "alpha males" on the last thread. So I'm just wondering who you were attacking.

no juice, another mouth...people here have decided to attack me again, fine...show me the beef Lud, and as for IW, you two faced twit, you are the best comedy here in ages....btw that pile is the shit right there

482 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:42:37pm

re: #470 Bagua

Lol. You were going on about the wingnuts and haters and "alpha males" on the last thread. So I'm just wondering who you were attacking.

No, Bagsy. You were being a massive hater and asshole on the last thread, and after getting your ass beaten in you want to drag it up here. Fuck off, asshole.

483 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:42:56pm

re: #479 Walter L. Newton

"Q. how many assholes does it take to drive away good posters? A. Not very many so long as they stick with it."

That's right. :)

484 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:43:20pm

re: #430 iceweasel

Wingnut logic: Just keep saying it over and over and you can pretend it's true!
File under 'Clap Louder'.

Repost

Lol.

We are a couple dozen people who like to chat here with each other, a very diverse group politically, and you insist on calling several of us names like "wingnuts" and "bigot." And you do this from thread to thread, month to month. But should someone get irritated at your repetitive antics and note that this is anti-social behaviour, you weep and moan for months demanding apolagies.

Lighten up a bit.

485 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:43:25pm

re: #475 prairiefire

I don't mind mixing and matching ingredients in general, I'm just a pizza purist. A snob for New York pizza of the highest order.

486 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:43:39pm

re: #472 Floral Giraffe

So, what are your thoughts about Genetically Modified plants, if they didn't have the patents on them?

It depends on what the modifications are. I think terminator genes are completely unethical.

But what do you think about me and Ice spanking you a bit?

487 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:43:48pm

re: #483 iceweasel

That's right. :)

Recognize that Tweet?

488 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:44:10pm

re: #479 Walter L. Newton

"Q. how many assholes does it take to drive away good posters? A. Not very many so long as they stick with it."

Nice to know you're reading me, Walter. Cheers!

489 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:44:49pm

re: #403 lostlakehiker

Global warming is as obvious as the melting sea ice and the receding glaciers. Only idiots and religious fanatics do not believe it is happening or that it is a hoax.
However the apocalyptic projections put forward here as proven facts do not enjoy the same level of acceptance AMONG SCIENTISTS or anyone else with a brain.

490 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:44:50pm

re: #482 iceweasel

No, Bagsy. You were being a massive hater and asshole on the last thread, and after getting your ass beaten in you want to drag it up here. Fuck off, asshole.

I love it when you talk dirty to me.

491 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:44:51pm

After the eighty-three year old lady finished her annual physical examination, the doctor said, "You are in fine shape for your age, Mrs. Mallory, but tell me, do you still have intercourse?"

"Just a minute, I'll have to ask my husband," she said..

She stepped out into the crowded reception room and yelled out loud: "Henry, do we still have intercourse?"

And there was a hush! You could hear a pin drop.

Henry answered impatiently, "If I told you once, Irma, I told you a hundred times...

What we have is.......


Blue Cross!

492 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:45:01pm

re: #474 LudwigVanQuixote

What really does offend me about Stevo and Spare and to some extent Walter is that everytime we have a serious thread on AGW they try to derail it with endless attacks on me rather than talk teh science. It is a very effective way of derailing an important topic.

They do it like clockwork. Then they cry like babies when called on it. I really really would rather talk the science.

Just gotta ignore them. Frame the discussion in your terms. There are posters here who can reply to my comments all day and they won't get a response. I'm not posting here for them. I'm posting for honest discussion, and ignore anything that isn't.

493 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:45:17pm

re: #474 LudwigVanQuixote

What really does offend me about Stevo and Spare and to some extent Walter is that everytime we have a serious thread on AGW they try to derail it with endless attacks on me rather than talk teh science. It is a very effective way of derailing an important topic.

They do it like clockwork. Then they cry like babies when called on it. I really really would rather talk the science.

you are an insufferable ass with a short, self centered memory...you don't cut it Lud...butthurt yourself over there with the rest of the sissies while you drag the whole blog down....you want to shoot you fat mouth off then back it up, or piss off

494 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:45:17pm

re: #479 Walter L. Newton

"Q. how many assholes does it take to drive away good posters? A. Not very many so long as they stick with it."

Spot on.

495 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:45:28pm

re: #488 iceweasel

Nice to know you're reading me, Walter. Cheers!

Reading you... I'm getting them :)

496 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:45:50pm

Albusteve was complaining about people not being happy the other day. And the week before that he attacked someone for using too many dots (ellipses) in their posts.

Just saying, I think this person might just have a wee bit of a capacity for projection there...;-)

497 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:46:01pm

I sense much dingage in the force tonight.

498 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:46:13pm

re: #485 Irenicum

I don't mind mixing and matching ingredients in general, I'm just a pizza purist. A snob for New York pizza of the highest order.

I've never had New York pizza....... I hear it's good. I wouldn't know. I say I like the pizza I get..... it's usually edible.... shrug.

499 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:46:15pm

re: #471 Jimmah

Lol - I wasn't even here. Has he started talking about how much he doesn't care about me yet?

I don't have to...readers here are not as stupid as you think they are

500 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:46:38pm

re: #497 Irenicum

I sense much dingage in the force tonight.

Lol. The dingbats are rampant.

501 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:46:56pm

re: #498 Mr Pancakes

I've never had New York pizza... I hear it's good. I wouldn't know. I say I like the pizza I get... it's usually edible... shrug.

You have not truly lived...

502 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:47:00pm

re: #497 Irenicum

I sense much dingage in the force tonight.

Downdingers SUCK!

Updingers RULE!

503 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:47:11pm

re: #489 Spare O'Lake

Global warming is as obvious as the melting sea ice and the receding glaciers. Only idiots and religious fanatics do not believe it is happening or that it is a hoax.
However the apocalyptic projections put forward here as proven facts do not enjoy the same level of acceptance AMONG SCIENTISTS or anyone else with a brain.

Back that up. Back up a single thing you just said. Try it just once. YOu really can't even look at the papers given can you? What is wrong with them? I have hundreds more that tell teh same story.

I just provided you with several dozen peer reviewed papers from scientists who would agree with what I said being in the midrange. How about you stop making stuff up and read the science?

504 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:47:18pm

re: #479 Walter L. Newton

re: #494 Bagua

just say no ignore them it is that easy watch they both downding this cause it scares the shit out of them.

NO.

505 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:48:08pm

re: #504 brookly red

re: #494 Bagua

just say no ignore them it is that easy watch they both downding this cause it scares the shit out of them.

NO.

It is like a study in abnormal psychology.

506 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:48:14pm

re: #495 Walter L. Newton

Reading you... I'm getting them :)

Go for it, Walter. You think I thought they were private? LOL.

507 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:48:17pm

re: #496 Jimmah

Albusteve was complaining about people not being happy the other day. And the week before that he attacked someone for using too many dots (ellipses) in their posts.

Just saying, I think this person might just have a wee bit of a capacity for projection there...;-)

it's only projection to a dim wit like yourself...if you have kept up you're an ass, if you haven't your an idiot...choose one Einstein

508 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:48:24pm

re: #492 McSpiff

Just gotta ignore them. Frame the discussion in your terms. There are posters here who can reply to my comments all day and they won't get a response. I'm not posting here for them. I'm posting for honest discussion, and ignore anything that isn't.

Ohh I know. If you really think I've been losing it at stevo, please then do read my poss. I am more amused than upset.

509 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:49:04pm

re: #498 Mr Pancakes

I'm a paper thin crust kinda guy. I grew up in a neighborhood that had a no name pizza place where I saw the guy (probably named Vinnie) spinning the dough like a true artist every day and you could get a Neapolitan slice for 75c and a Sicilian slice for a buck, and they were both heaven on earth. Nothing will ever beat that.

510 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:49:20pm

re: #506 iceweasel

Go for it, Walter. You think I thought they were private? LOL.

I don't know what you think about them... I find them interesting...

511 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:50:36pm

re: #508 LudwigVanQuixote

Ohh I know. If you really think I've been losing it at stevo, please then do read my poss. I am more amused than upset.

you have not posted your proof...where is it?...what's taking so long?...go to the archives and pull it up and post it

512 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:50:55pm

re: #501 JasonA

You have not truly lived...

I know..... but I have baja style fish tacos (not Rubios) and In-N-Out burgers to get me through.

513 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:51:17pm

re: #510 Walter L. Newton

I don't know what you think about them... I find them interesting...

A few people do, thanks. :)

514 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:51:33pm

re: #511 albusteve

you have not posted your proof...where is it?...what's taking so long?...go to the archives and pull it up and post it

Proof of what Stevo?

515 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:51:50pm

Upding this article if you liked it. So far it's just up to 7.

516 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:51:55pm

re: #508 LudwigVanQuixote

Ohh I know. If you really think I've been losing it at stevo, please then do read my poss. I am more amused than upset.

No, you're not upset. I know that. Steve knows that I think. But even if you're having fun, it derails your message midstream and takes away from the otherwise professional treatment you give the topic. I guess my advice would be… save it for the overnight threads?

517 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:52:10pm

re: #504 brookly red

re: #494 Bagua

just say no ignore them it is that easy watch they both downding this cause it scares the shit out of them.

NO.

see like clock work :)

518 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:52:16pm

re: #509 Irenicum

I'm a paper thin crust kinda guy. I grew up in a neighborhood that had a no name pizza place where I saw the guy (probably named Vinnie) spinning the dough like a true artist every day and you could get a Neapolitan slice for 75c and a Sicilian slice for a buck, and they were both heaven on earth. Nothing will ever beat that.

We just don't have that out here man. That I've ever seen anyway.

519 Eclectic Infidel  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:52:33pm

re: #457 Mr Pancakes

Not only is it BBQ chicken... they put BBQ sauce down instead of tomato sauce.

Well, you know, pie preference is a personal taste sort of thing. If BBQ chicken on pizza blows your skirt up and makes the voices in your head sing with joy, you order that bad boy and indulge.

520 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:52:39pm

re: #518 Mr Pancakes

I am truly sorry to hear that.

521 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:53:19pm

re: #486 LudwigVanQuixote

It depends on what the modifications are. I think terminator genes are completely unethical.

But what do you think about me and Ice spanking you a bit?

Sounds like a good bit of fun!

522 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:53:36pm

re: #519 eclectic infidel

Well, you know, pie preference is a personal taste sort of thing. If BBQ chicken on pizza blows your skirt up and makes the voices in your head sing with joy, you order that bad boy and indulge.

Yea..... I was trying to do that tonight but I burnt it.

523 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:53:41pm

re: #110 brookly red

I remember my high school earth science classes in 1975 (we got college credit for them btw) and all these scientists swore the ice age was coming & we needed to move our population south before it was too late... some of scientists had big real estate holdings in Texas. Once bitten twice shy.

Well, here's the deal. There were some articles in the popular press, but there was not in fact a scientific consensus about global cooling. Your high school earth science class, and maybe this is forgivable, went to popular sources rather than to difficult technical articles for its narrative.

More scientific work was published in 1975 about global warming than about global cooling.

Scientists aren't much good at real-estate wheeling and dealing. The shoemaker does best to stick to his last. But there have been professionals who were good at more than one thing. Ken Rogoff, author of a book about how "It's different this time" but really it isn't, was a chess professional for years and won prize money in tournaments and the rank of grandmaster before leaving the sport for economics. Where he is now a big wheel.

524 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:54:14pm

re: #516 McSpiff

No, you're not upset. I know that. Steve knows that I think. But even if you're having fun, it derails your message midstream and takes away from the otherwise professional treatment you give the topic. I guess my advice would be… save it for the overnight threads?

I'm upset that the single greatest threat to our civilization is trivialized by fools on this thread. I am hardly hurt by the silly attempts to get my goat.

525 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:54:17pm

re: #518 Mr Pancakes

Come to NYC and hit the outer boroughs, like Staten Island, Brooklyn and Queens, you'll find em. And you won't be disappointed.

526 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:54:45pm

re: #517 brookly red

see like clock work :)

Yep, Pavlovian.

527 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:55:07pm

re: #513 iceweasel

A few people do, thanks. :)

Of course... I found "One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest" to be morbidly interesting too! I find train wreaks interesting too! I'm watching one right now.

528 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:55:26pm

re: #525 Irenicum

Come to NYC and hit the outer boroughs, like Staten Island The Bronx, Brooklyn and Queens, you'll find em. And you won't be disappointed.

Don't play with the poor guy. :P

529 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:55:30pm

re: #519 eclectic infidel

An upding just for the imagery.

530 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:56:16pm

re: #521 Floral Giraffe

OK, this conversation is getting a bit cheeky!

531 Nimed  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:56:36pm

re: #527 Walter L. Newton

Of course... I found "One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest" to be morbidly interesting too! I find train wreaks interesting too! I'm watching one right now.

And I bet you think characters from the movie are trying to drive out of LGF.

532 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:56:41pm

re: #514 LudwigVanQuixote

Proof of what Stevo?

don't be stupid, people see right thru that...you know why I keep kicking your ass?...because you submit shit you cannot back up and you yourself know you are lying...you are soft, you are weak, and when the rubber hits the road you play stupid, just like your fans...why are you so smart and so stupid at the same time?...you may be smarter than me, but I'm not as stupid as you think bro...you have proven that, thanks

533 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:56:46pm

re: #525 Irenicum

Come to NYC and hit the outer boroughs, like Staten Island, Brooklyn and Queens, you'll find em. And you won't be disappointed.

I'd like to go back there again......My mom and I went there by Greyhound Bus when I was a 9 year old to see the 64 Worlds Fair........ ain't been back since.

534 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:01pm

re: #526 Bagua

Yep, Pavlovian.

it really does take the sport out of it...

535 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:02pm

re: #523 lostlakehiker

True, the "global cooling" scare in the media was must more thinly supported.

536 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:10pm

So I say that flaming each other turns the thread to shit, and now I see that Rodan put the comment up on his "Diary of Daedalus" while calling me a "Radical Progressive". And I'm remind that no matter how bad things are here, there are worse people out there. And some are such haters they attack even a honest desire for peace.

537 Eclectic Infidel  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:12pm

re: #463 Mr Pancakes

Can't we all just get mad over pizza?

SFZionist and I were talking the other day and I mentioned that if us Lizards met in person, we'd be friendly to one another, even under duress of strong disagreement. SFZ agreed.

It's easy to get attitude with someone when all you've got is a monitor staring you in the face, but even so, I think as a whole, we're decent enough to one another. And while we entertain jabs and insults, in the end, nothing to harsh seems to come of it.

538 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:17pm

re: #530 Irenicum

OK, this conversation is getting a bit cheeky!

Would you like a spanking too?
I can share ;)

539 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:20pm

re: #484 Bagua

Repost

Lol.

We are a couple dozen people who like to chat here with each other, a very diverse group politically, and you insist on calling several of us names like "wingnuts" and "bigot." And you do this from thread to thread, month to month. But should someone get irritated at your repetitive antics and note that this is anti-social behaviour, you weep and moan for months demanding apolagies.

Lighten up a bit.

The worst I'll call you is mistaken. Unless, of course, you call me mistaken. Then the gloves come off.

/////harharr

540 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:42pm

re: #534 brookly red

it really does take the sport out of it...

Yep, boring.

541 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:44pm

re: #533 Mr Pancakes

I'd like to go back there again...My mom and I went there by Greyhound Bus when I was a 9 year old to see the 64 Worlds Fair... ain't been back since.

come have a pizza :)

542 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:44pm

re: #532 albusteve

don't be stupid, people see right thru that...you know why I keep kicking your ass?...because you submit shit you cannot back up and you yourself know you are lying...you are soft, you are weak, and when the rubber hits the road you play stupid, just like your fans...why are you so smart and so stupid at the same time?...you may be smarter than me, but I'm not as stupid as you think bro...you have proven that, thanks

Smarter than I, Steve.

543 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:53pm

re: #457 Mr Pancakes

Not only is it BBQ chicken... they put BBQ sauce down instead of tomato sauce.

I am a giant fan of California Pizza Kitchen, good stuff! Though my favorite pizza joint is a place here in Portland with like 50 beers available and it's basically California style with crust that they must put heroin in, it's so good, lots of traditional pizzas and lots of zany Cali concoctions as well!

(cue rage from east coasters HLGRBLGHRBGH PIZZA ORTHODOXY)

544 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:55pm

re: #528 JasonA

Hey man, don't be dissing my Island! That's where the pizza place was that my mom and I frequented many a moon ago.

545 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:57:58pm

re: #537 eclectic infidel

SFZionist and I were talking the other day and I mentioned that if us Lizards met in person, we'd be friendly to one another, even under duress of strong disagreement. SFZ agreed.

It's easy to get attitude with someone when all you've got is a monitor staring you in the face, but even so, I think as a whole, we're decent enough to one another. And while we entertain jabs and insults, in the end, nothing to harsh seems to come of it.

Agreed

546 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:58:16pm

re: #543 WindUpBird

Vincente's on Hawthorne is the place for the two or three other Portlanders :D

547 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:58:38pm

re: #537 eclectic infidel

SFZionist and I were talking the other day and I mentioned that if us Lizards met in person, we'd be friendly to one another, even under duress of strong disagreement. SFZ agreed.

It's easy to get attitude with someone when all you've got is a monitor staring you in the face, but even so, I think as a whole, we're decent enough to one another. And while we entertain jabs and insults, in the end, nothing to harsh seems to come of it.

Agreed. I've made the point before that we would all get along swimmingly in person. We'd be a riot at the pub.

548 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:58:44pm

re: #544 Irenicum

Hey man, don't be dissing my Island! That's where the pizza place was that my mom and I frequented many a moon ago.

Staten Island's just Jersey with NYC taxes. :P

549 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:59:02pm

Yep. Another thread turns to shit due to personal petty bickering.

550 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:59:29pm

re: #540 Bagua

Yep, boring.

so like I say just ignore it... there is no up side.

551 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 8:59:38pm

re: #549 Racer X

Yep. Another thread turns to shit due to personal petty bickering.

Where have you been the last 500 comments?

552 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:00:06pm

re: #551 JasonA

Where have you been the last 500 comments?

hahahahahahahahaha

553 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:00:19pm

re: #543 WindUpBird

I am a giant fan of California Pizza Kitchen, good stuff! Though my favorite pizza joint is a place here in Portland with like 50 beers available and it's basically California style with crust that they must put heroin in, it's so good, lots of traditional pizzas and lots of zany Cali concoctions as well!

(cue rage from east coasters HLGRBLGHRBGH PIZZA ORTHODOXY)

Heroin? I thought it was crack cocaine........ anyway..... thanks. I was pretty much laughed at by the pizza traditionalists!

554 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:00:38pm

re: #543 WindUpBird

I am a giant fan of California Pizza Kitchen, good stuff! Though my favorite pizza joint is a place here in Portland with like 50 beers available and it's basically California style with crust that they must put heroin in, it's so good, lots of traditional pizzas and lots of zany Cali concoctions as well!

(cue rage from east coasters HLGRBLGHRBGH PIZZA ORTHODOXY)

Agreed. California Pizza is one of the few places that does a decent job imitating a good Italian pizza made in a wood fire oven.

555 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:00:56pm

re: #550 brookly red

so like I say just ignore it... there is no up side.

Amen brother.

556 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:01:07pm

re: #551 JasonA

Where have you been the last 500 comments?

Yep - it turned to shit 20 comments in.

557 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:01:09pm

re: #503 LudwigVanQuixote

Back that up. Back up a single thing you just said. Try it just once. YOu really can't even look at the papers given can you? What is wrong with them? I have hundreds more that tell teh same story.

I just provided you with several dozen peer reviewed papers from scientists who would agree with what I said being in the midrange. How about you stop making stuff up and read the science?

You know that the projections are all over the map...you yourself have backtracked from your original unqualified posts by later admitting that you have chosen the mid-range predictions to present here as proven fact.

558 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:01:09pm

re: #516 McSpiff

No, you're not upset. I know that. Steve knows that I think. But even if you're having fun, it derails your message midstream and takes away from the otherwise professional treatment you give the topic. I guess my advice would be… save it for the overnight threads?

that's where LVQ cuts my throat on my disability...he gets away with it because I'm sleeping....hey LVQ...did you and Palomino fuck me up good or what a month back about on a dead thread about me deserving my disability?...big fun eh?...but I went back and read that slur...you want me to post it for everybody here to see?

559 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:01:33pm

re: #553 Mr Pancakes

Heroin? I thought it was crack cocaine... anyway... thanks. I was pretty much laughed at by the pizza traditionalists!

Traditionalism is boring. :D

I think my favorite California Pizza Kitchen pizza is the Jamaican Jerk one, I remember it being REALLY SICY

560 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:01:45pm

Not sure why Charles even bothers any more. You people come in and shit all over his couch while arguing with each other. Have some respect for the man!

561 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:02:00pm

re: #555 McSpiff

Amen brother.

562 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:02:18pm

re: #548 JasonA

Ha! In so many ways that is so true.

563 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:02:19pm

re: #542 JasonA

Smarter than I, Steve.

right, I'm stupid

564 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:02:26pm

re: #497 Irenicum

I sense much dingage in the force tonight.

Speaking of dings...

The King of the Dings award for tonight goes to Spare O Lake for being so massively butthurt that he simply could not stop himself from dowdinging this post:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Well done Spare - the crown is yours - wear it with pride :D

565 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:02:51pm

re: #563 albusteve

right, I'm stupid

Nah, you're not. It was low hanging fruit. I'm man enough to admit that.

566 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:03:20pm

re: #560 Racer X

Not sure why Charles even bothers any more. You people come in and shit all over his couch while arguing with each other. Have some respect for the man!

some day we will have a pizza thread, some day.

567 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:03:29pm

re: #557 Spare O'Lake

You know that the projections are all over the map...you yourself have backtracked from your original unqualified posts by later admitting that you have chosen the mid-range predictions to present here as proven fact.

No, the projections you consider extreme are actually the midrange. You would know that if you ever read the papers.

568 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:04:09pm

Vincente's menu! That should make all the New York people scream :D

569 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:04:10pm

re: #425 Dark_Falcon

BTW, the Stalkers are watching. 'MrPaulRevere' just reposted most of Freetoken's #369. He only omitted the last sentence, which is not crucial to the post. But lets watch our backs, since others of them may well try to take us out of context.

Not praising MPR, but I also want the record to accurately reflect people's actions.

Classic.

570 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:04:45pm

re: #560 Racer X

Not sure why Charles even bothers any more. You people come in and shit all over his couch while arguing with each other. Have some respect for the man!

Any group is bound to get cranky and squabble from time to time.

571 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:05:26pm

re: #569 Gus 802

Classic.

Oh, BURN!

572 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:05:30pm

re: #532 albusteve

don't be stupid, people see right thru that...you know why I keep kicking your ass?...because you submit shit you cannot back up and you yourself know you are lying...you are soft, you are weak, and when the rubber hits the road you play stupid, just like your fans...why are you so smart and so stupid at the same time?...you may be smarter than me, but I'm not as stupid as you think bro...you have proven that, thanks

He didn't say you were stupid. Deep breath. Nobody around here is anything short of solidly above average. But we're talking science when we talk AGW, and there are people who know more and people who don't. I don't get all huffy when people tell me my French is weak. Pardon my French, I fucking well know I don't know it very well. My Spanish is just about nonexistent, and all I know of Italian is that it's what they speak in Italy.

We are, all of us, massively ignorant on all sorts of topics. Happily, we aren't all of us massively ignorant on all topics. This topic happens to be right up Ludwig's alley, and Charles has got there, and if I may say so, I think I've caught on too. If you'd park your pride by the door and take a walking tour through the evidence we set before you, I'm sure you'd arrive at a pretty good grasp of it by and by.

573 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:05:31pm

re: #425 Dark_Falcon

BTW, the Stalkers are watching. 'MrPaulRevere' just reposted most of Freetoken's #369. He only omitted the last sentence, which is not crucial to the post. But lets watch our backs, since others of them may well try to take us out of context.

Not praising MPR, but I also want the record to accurately reflect people's actions.

It's MrPaulRevere, you know, so nobody mistakes him for a chick

574 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:05:32pm

re: #506 iceweasel

Go for it, Walter. You think I thought they were private? LOL.

Super sekrit private tweets from iceweasel and jimmah! Attention all wingnuts : read your email!

575 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:05:49pm

re: #548 JasonA

I remember as a kid going to the doctor in the Upper West Side of Manhattan and when asked where we were from, when we said SI, were listed as being from out of town. Seriously! Nowadays it's not as big a difference. But remember, when I was little it was "before the bridge" which for "true" SI'ers is like BC and AD. Islands can be a weird place to live.

576 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:06:01pm

re: #527 Walter L. Newton

Of course... I found "One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest" to be morbidly interesting too! I find train wreaks interesting too! I'm watching one right now.

Speaking of which, shouldn't you be off somewhere composing another 30K useless words about 'coding errors' disproving AGW? LOL.

PS: it's spelled 'wreck'.

577 Ojoe  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:06:04pm

re: #523 lostlakehiker

It probably takes more energy than not to get an ice age going because all that precipitation has to be boiled off the oceans (with an equivalent amount of energy - you are vaporizing the water) and then the water vapor has to be carried on the wind to northern & southern places, and it takes energy to blow the wind.

I would bet that "global differential warming" might just be something that could lead into an ice age.

578 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:06:29pm

re: #568 WindUpBird

Vincente's menu! That should make all the New York people scream :D

I just sent that to the Vatican...

579 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:06:33pm

re: #558 albusteve

that's where LVQ cuts my throat on my disability...he gets away with it because I'm sleeping...hey LVQ...did you and Palomino fuck me up good or what a month back about on a dead thread about me deserving my disability?...big fun eh?...but I went back and read that slur...you want me to post it for everybody here to see?

I read it. I think it is a matter of personal ethics whether or not one poster throws personal information back at another poster's face. I have only rarely posted more personal info as I do not care to read other posters judgments on my personal matters.
If it is posted, there's no going back.

580 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:06:37pm

re: #571 Dark_Falcon

Oh, BURN!

Ding!

581 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:06:51pm

re: #570 Bagua

Any group is bound to get cranky and squabble from time to time.

This thread is pathetic.

582 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:06:57pm

re: #578 brookly red

I just sent that to the Vatican...

It's fine, they can't enter Portland city limits, they'll burst into flames

583 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:07:37pm

re: #574 Jimmah

Super sekrit private tweets from iceweasel and jimmah! Attention all wingnuts : read your email!

yawn... oh it is so sad.

584 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:07:40pm

re: #581 Racer X

This thread is pathetic.

Pizza is not pathetic Racer

585 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:07:43pm

re: #558 albusteve

that's where LVQ cuts my throat on my disability...he gets away with it because I'm sleeping...hey LVQ...did you and Palomino fuck me up good or what a month back about on a dead thread about me deserving my disability?...big fun eh?...but I went back and read that slur...you want me to post it for everybody here to see?

Hey man, I see anyone making cracks like that I'll give them a piece of my mind, promise. Doesn't matter who the poster is. And if that's true its a damn shitty thing to do. If that's the case, then yeah I'd want to tell LVQ off every chance I get too. But in the end, you're just upsetting yourself. Why waste the energy on someone a thousand miles away who clearly doesn't give a shit about you?

Seriously man, life's too short. And from what I've read here you've lived it plenty hard. Why not give yourself a break once in a while?

586 Four More Tears  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:07:59pm

Alright, I've had enough of this. Night, everyone.

587 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:08:00pm

re: #582 WindUpBird

It's fine, they can't enter Portland city limits, they'll burst into flames

I'm sure they'd be game if they could round up a bunch of young men to help them with their luggage.

/

588 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:08:16pm

re: #587 Gus 802

I'm sure they'd be game if they could round up a bunch of young men to help them with their luggage.

/

ahahahah yes :D

589 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:08:17pm

re: #581 Racer X

This thread is pathetic.

Agreed.

590 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:08:24pm

re: #567 LudwigVanQuixote

re: #536 Dark_Falcon

So I say that flaming each other turns the thread to shit, and now I see that Rodan put the comment up on his "Diary of Daedalus" while calling me a "Radical Progressive". And I'm remind that no matter how bad things are here, there are worse people out there. And some are such haters they attack even a honest desire for peace.

Reposted, because I wanted you to see it Ludwig.

591 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:08:30pm

re: #584 Mr Pancakes

Pizza is not pathetic Racer

Sorry man. My belly is full of Animal Style™. Pizza does not sound tasty right now.

592 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:08:45pm

re: #574 Jimmah

Super sekrit private tweets from iceweasel and jimmah! Attention all wingnuts : read your email!

I just looked.
Nothing there.
Does this mean I'm not a wingnut?
*smooch*

593 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:09:45pm

re: #581 Racer X

This thread is pathetic.

yeah it is what it is.

595 Nimed  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:10:22pm

re: #536 Dark_Falcon

So I say that flaming each other turns the thread to shit, and now I see that Rodan put the comment up on his "Diary of Daedalus" while calling me a "Radical Progressive". And I'm remind that no matter how bad things are here, there are worse people out there. And some are such haters they attack even a honest desire for peace.

4, 20, 22, 4, 6, 14. Alternative sequence of the LOST numbers? Nope. The number of comments of the last 6 entries of the Diary of the Daedalus.

One good thing about LGF noobs -- they don't know who is Rodan, and they don't particularly care. With each new registered commenter, that site will sink further into oblivion.

596 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:10:33pm

re: #591 Racer X

Sorry man. My belly is full of Animal Style™. Pizza does not sound tasty right now.

Pepto Bismal is your friend. Sooner, rather than later.
Spelling might be bad, but it's pink & comes in a bottle.
Pharmacies are still open...

597 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:10:53pm

re: #569 Gus 802

Classic.

Sure is.
I even remember that guy, barely, and if I remember right, he was polite while he was here. Once he flew the coop ALL kinds of nasty started oozing out from him and hasn't stopped.

(He's also left harassing comments on our youtube, and urged others to do so, btw)

598 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:10:54pm
599 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:11:00pm

re: #594 WindUpBird

This place isn't too far from me. Nobody names stuff like Catholics.

Aw, someone should cheer her up. Christ has risen.

600 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:11:06pm

hey LVQ...next time you have some disease where they chop off you body parts...you lose you job and all your savings, and have nowhere to turn but to SSD for a few bucks, I'm gonna laugh in your goddamned face...and I'm gonna go on a dead thread and mock you, you ass...if it's good enough for you, then I'll do it too

601 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:11:10pm

re: #558 albusteve

What are you talking about Stevo? Not that I really care, but honestly, do you really think you haven't been trying to start shit endlessly for months?

Honestly Steve, my opinion of you has never changed. I have no idea what your disabilities are other than stupidity.

Yes LLH, I do think he is really stupid on an impressive level in addition to being mean spirited and immoral, but I honestly think he is merely a troll and not really worth the effort.

602 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:11:37pm

re: #577 Ojoe

It probably takes more energy than not to get an ice age going because all that precipitation has to be boiled off the oceans (with an equivalent amount of energy - you are vaporizing the water) and then the water vapor has to be carried on the wind to northern & southern places, and it takes energy to blow the wind.

I would bet that "global differential warming" might just be something that could lead into an ice age.

Huh? The projections I've seen have all major parts of the earth getting warmer, but the poles, which were originally very cold, warm more than do the tropics.

That would lead to less wind, if anything, because winds are linked to temperature differentials. The energy for our winds comes from the sun, which heats some places more than it heats others. Where you get an ice age from that beats me. You sure you didn't confuse a fancy phrase with a real idea?

603 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:11:40pm

re: #585 McSpiff

Hey man, I see anyone making cracks like that I'll give them a piece of my mind, promise. Doesn't matter who the poster is. And if that's true its a damn shitty thing to do. If that's the case, then yeah I'd want to tell LVQ off every chance I get too. But in the end, you're just upsetting yourself. Why waste the energy on someone a thousand miles away who clearly doesn't give a shit about you?

Seriously man, life's too short. And from what I've read here you've lived it plenty hard. Why not give yourself a break once in a while?

It isn't true.

604 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:12:04pm

re: #597 iceweasel

Sure is.
I even remember that guy, barely, and if I remember right, he was polite while he was here. Once he flew the coop ALL kinds of nasty started oozing out from him and hasn't stopped.

(He's also left harassing comments on our youtube, and urged others to do so, btw)

Youtube commenters! Youtube commenters are the best. I saw a 300 message flame war on youtube over whether a Lexus IS could beat a 2005 Pontiac GTO in a drag race.

605 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:12:08pm

re: #585 McSpiff

Man I have no idea what he is talking about. I am pretty certain I have never cracked at anyone's disability. I am also certain he is making stuff up.

606 brookly red  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:12:25pm

ewww seems the tide is going out...

night y'all

607 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:12:55pm

Ah, the sound of bullets whizzing above my head as I sip my Guinness and chat with friends. I may write a poem about that.

608 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:12:59pm

re: #595 Nimed

4, 20, 22, 4, 6, 14. Alternative sequence of the LOST numbers? Nope. The number of comments of the last 6 entries of the Diary of the Daedalus.

One good thing about LGF noobs -- they don't know who is Rodan, and they don't particularly care. With each new registered commenter, that site will sink further into oblivion.

No... Rodan actually lives in the head of some Lizards, you can tell by the incessant remarks and comments about the stalkers... well, IMO the stalkers are getting just what they want every time anyone mentions their name here.

609 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:13:03pm

I think it's time to kick back a little and put some toe-tappin' music on.

610 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:13:06pm

re: #600 albusteve

hey LVQ...next time you have some disease where they chop off you body parts...you lose you job and all your savings, and have nowhere to turn but to SSD for a few bucks, I'm gonna laugh in your goddamned face...and I'm gonna go on a dead thread and mock you, you ass...if it's good enough for you, then I'll do it too

Steve where did I ever ever snipe at a disability of yours. You are lying.

611 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:13:27pm

re: #600 albusteve

hey LVQ...next time you have some disease where they chop off you body parts...you lose you job and all your savings, and have nowhere to turn but to SSD for a few bucks, I'm gonna laugh in your goddamned face...and I'm gonna go on a dead thread and mock you, you ass...if it's good enough for you, then I'll do it too

Can I see the link steve? If you don't wanna post it for public consumption, fire off an email to gmail.com

612 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:13:34pm

re: #605 LudwigVanQuixote

Man I have no idea what he is talking about. I am pretty certain I have never cracked at anyone's disability. I am also certain he is making stuff up.

No, you haven't. When would you do something like that, how could you?
If albusteve genuinely believes that someone did that to him we'd all condemn it. That shit is not on.

613 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:13:38pm

re: #595 Nimed

4, 20, 22, 4, 6, 14. Alternative sequence of the LOST numbers? Nope. The number of comments of the last 6 entries of the Diary of the Daedalus.

One good thing about LGF noobs -- they don't know who is Rodan, and they don't particularly care. With each new registered commenter, that site will sink further into oblivion.

THIS FOREVER

Seriously for sure. Let the fan club be the fan club.

614 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:13:48pm

re: #597 iceweasel

Sure is.
I even remember that guy, barely, and if I remember right, he was polite while he was here. Once he flew the coop ALL kinds of nasty started oozing out from him and hasn't stopped.

(He's also left harassing comments on our youtube, and urged others to do so, btw)

Yep. A lot of them did that. It was like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hide. Some of them were polite to us here and are now freaking out about us over there from time to time like we know them or something.

615 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:14:16pm

re: #604 WindUpBird

Youtube commenters! Youtube commenters are the best. I saw a 300 message flame war on youtube over whether a Lexus IS could beat a 2005 Pontiac GTO in a drag race.

Lot of weird commenters on youtube. Very nasty.

616 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:14:18pm

re: #600 albusteve

Steve I never mocked any disability of yours other than your ability to lie and be stupid. Prove your allegation now.

617 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:14:24pm

re: #600 albusteve

re: #601 LudwigVanQuixote

At some point ONE of you two is going to learn to ignore the other. Probably the smarter one.

Anyone wanna make a bet who it is?

618 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:14:25pm

re: #611 McSpiff

Can I see the link steve? If you don't wanna post it for public consumption, fire off an email to gmail.com

< my username here> < at>gmail.com

619 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:14:46pm

re: #611 McSpiff

Can I see the link steve? If you don't wanna post it for public consumption, fire off an email to gmail.com

NO have him print it here. This never happened.

620 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:14:49pm

re: #595 Nimed

4, 20, 22, 4, 6, 14. Alternative sequence of the LOST numbers? Nope. The number of comments of the last 6 entries of the Diary of the Daedalus.

One good thing about LGF noobs -- they don't know who is Rodan, and they don't particularly care. With each new registered commenter, that site will sink further into oblivion.

Yep!

621 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:15:10pm

re: #592 Floral Giraffe

I just looked.
Nothing there.
Does this mean I'm not a wingnut?
*smooch*

You're definitely not a wingnut, FG. :)

622 Ojoe  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:15:26pm

re: #602 lostlakehiker

It is my own idea, but the vast accumulations of ice need energy to get them there & if the tropics warm faster than the poles it could lead to more evaporation off the seas which just might work out in practice to more ice at the poles.

623 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:15:37pm

re: #567 LudwigVanQuixote

No, the projections you consider extreme are actually the midrange. You would know that if you ever read the papers.

You started out by presenting your chosen projections as unqualified fact, yes? Then you later stated they were mid-range predictions, yes? And now you ignore the FACT that "mid-range predictions" implies a whole range of scientific predictions, both more AND LESS severe that what you originally presented as unqualified fact.
Come clean.

624 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:16:14pm

re: #595 Nimed

4, 20, 22, 4, 6, 14. Alternative sequence of the LOST numbers? Nope. The number of comments of the last 6 entries of the Diary of the Daedalus.

One good thing about LGF noobs -- they don't know who is Rodan, and they don't particularly care. With each new registered commenter, that site will sink further into oblivion.

What is the "Diary of the Daedalus?"

625 Ojoe  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:16:31pm

Well good night all.

Be back tomorrow.

626 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:16:35pm

re: #609 Jimmah

FOETUS! yes :D

Okay, I'll bust out some industrial here:

627 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:16:40pm

re: #619 LudwigVanQuixote

NO have him print it here. This never happened.

I'm not making steve do anything. I just wanna see this for myself. If its as hurtful as his post implies, I can respect not wanting to link to it. I'm giving him a fair chance to bring proof.

628 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:16:51pm

re: #600 albusteve

hy LVQ...nxt tm y hv sm dss whr thy chp ff y bdy prts...y ls y jb nd ll yr svngs, nd hv nwhr t trn bt t SSD fr fw bcks, 'm gnn lgh n yr gddmnd fc...nd 'm gnn g n dd thrd nd mck y, y ss...f t's gd ngh fr y, thn 'll d t t

fixed

629 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:17:01pm

re: #585 McSpiff

Hey man, I see anyone making cracks like that I'll give them a piece of my mind, promise. Doesn't matter who the poster is. And if that's true its a damn shitty thing to do. If that's the case, then yeah I'd want to tell LVQ off every chance I get too. But in the end, you're just upsetting yourself. Why waste the energy on someone a thousand miles away who clearly doesn't give a shit about you?

Seriously man, life's too short. And from what I've read here you've lived it plenty hard. Why not give yourself a break once in a while?

it pissed me off to no end...it's inexcusable to think that about a fellow traveler that has dumped tens of thousands into the system and then gets ridiculed because "I deserve my money back", since I'm cripped...fuck that, and you know what?...I wish the worst on anybody that thinks that way...lets just see what Lud does when they come calling for his pieces parts

630 Gus  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:17:35pm

re: #600 albusteve

Dude.

631 Mr Pancakes  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:17:42pm

re: #604 WindUpBird

Youtube commenters! Youtube commenters are the best. I saw a 300 message flame war on youtube over whether a Lexus IS could beat a 2005 Pontiac GTO in a drag race.

I would put my money on the GTO........

Nothing like American muscle

632 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:17:53pm

re: #601 LudwigVanQuixote

What are you talking about Stevo? Not that I really care, but honestly, do you really think you haven't been trying to start shit endlessly for months?

Honestly Steve, my opinion of you has never changed. I have no idea what your disabilities are other than stupidity.

Yes LLH, I do think he is really stupid on an impressive level in addition to being mean spirited and immoral, but I honestly think he is merely a troll and not really worth the effort.

stupid, just stupid...fuck you

633 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:18:31pm

re: #623 Spare O'Lake

You started out by presenting your chosen projections as unqualified fact, yes? Then you later stated they were mid-range predictions, yes? And now you ignore the FACT that "mid-range predictions" implies a whole range of scientific predictions, both more AND LESS severe that what you originally presented as unqualified fact.
Come clean.

Oh dear God. The mid range is the most likely scenario assuming a certain rate of increasing GHGs. The problem is that all projections are low compared to observed tends today and that we are outstripping worst case emissions scenarios. That means that the worst case scenarios are the most likely and I am only quoting the mid range. I am actually being conservative and I am quoting ranges. Which I put in all of those predictions.

Read the actual papers just once spare.

634 Irenicum  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:18:37pm

re: #625 Ojoe

Likewise. G'nite kids. Have a drink if it'll mellow you out, or stop if that'll do the trick.

635 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:19:08pm

re: #610 LudwigVanQuixote

Steve where did I ever ever snipe at a disability of yours. You are lying.

fuck you

636 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:19:16pm
637 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:19:27pm

re: #629 albusteve

What was it. YOU are lying. I never made such a post Steve so print it.

I am calling you a liar. Print it here so we can all see.

638 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:19:31pm

re: #631 Mr Pancakes

I would put my money on the GTO...

Nothing like American muscle

Oh so would I! I've priced 2000's era GTOs, they're not any more than what I'm paying now, and I simply want a car with way more horse than I could ever use :D

639 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:19:33pm

re: #604 WindUpBird

Youtube commenters! Youtube commenters are the best. I saw a 300 message flame war on youtube over whether a Lexus IS could beat a 2005 Pontiac GTO in a drag race.

It's true-- they're some of the dregs of the internet.

I have a theory it's because the medium (video) removes even basic literacy requirements. This would also explain why every news channel site (Fox, ABC, anyone) also has hard-packed stoopit and just plain evil exploding in their comment threads.

(well, that and total lack of moderation. Similarly, loads of youtube hell could be avoided if people just blocked comments, deleted, or whatever, but I guess most youtube users just want a high number of comments or something. E.g., Jimmah blocked the PaulRevere freak, and we have a general policy of just deleting and not responding to such comments).

640 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:19:47pm

re: #632 albusteve

stupid, just stupid...fuck you


re: #627 McSpiff

I'm not making steve do anything. I just wanna see this for myself. If its as hurtful as his post implies, I can respect not wanting to link to it. I'm giving him a fair chance to bring proof.

I'd really like to see this post. This isn't something I can just accept without evidence.

641 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:20:08pm

re: #613 WindUpBird

THIS FOREVER

Seriously for sure. Let the fan club be the fan club.

Sorry, it's just hard for me. I take insults like that personally.

642 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:20:10pm

re: #609 Jimmah

That's toe tapping music?
LOL!

643 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:20:14pm

re: #635 albusteve

fuck you

If I had printed such a thing the proper response would be to link it and prove me wrong. That means you are lying. Thank you for proving yourself so pathetically in need of attention you will lie for it.

644 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:20:31pm

re: #489 Spare O'Lake

Global warming is as obvious as the melting sea ice and the receding glaciers. Only idiots and religious fanatics do not believe it is happening or that it is a hoax.
However the apocalyptic projections put forward here as proven facts do not enjoy the same level of acceptance AMONG SCIENTISTS or anyone else with a brain.

Some of them enjoy essentially universal acceptance. If the Greenland ice cap melts, sea level will rise thus and so much. It's as simple as predicting what happens when you pour water from a pitcher into a bowl. And a look at the current elevation of Galveston, New Orleans, New York, Houston, and some other places will tell you that they're gonna go the way of Atlantis.

Not today, not tomorrow, but within a century, New Orleans is lost. The case is hopeless. We should not be rebuilding. Same for Galveston. Houston, well, Houston might have a century, but not two. The Greenland ice cap is big and it won't all melt in this century.

Meantime, over in Bangladesh, even a 1 foot rise in sea level does a lot of damage. The nation is basically a long, flat river delta and much of it is mere inches above sea level. The livelihood of millions will be destroyed by that one foot rise.

In this interconnected world, trouble anywhere ripple far. Even with the most conservative plausible projections, we're in for so much more trouble if we sit and pretend there's no problem, than if we act now, that action is wisdom.

645 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:20:38pm

re: #640 McSpiff

I'd really like to see this post. This isn't something I can just accept without evidence.

It doesn't exist, he is lying.

646 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:20:55pm

re: #637 LudwigVanQuixote

What was it. YOU are lying. I never made such a post Steve so print it.

I am calling you a liar. Print it here so we can all see.

I thought so...I don't know what your talking about

647 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:21:05pm

re: #617 Racer X

re: #601 LudwigVanQuixote

At some point ONE of you two is going to learn to ignore the other. Probably the smarter one.

Anyone wanna make a bet who it is?

NO. No bets on that from here.

648 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:21:09pm

re: #641 Dark_Falcon

Sorry, it's just hard for me. I take insults like that personally.

It's just going to go on forever though :P

649 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:21:53pm

re: #626 WindUpBird

FOETUS! yes :D

Okay, I'll bust out some industrial here:


[Video]

Good stuff!

I'm just re-discovering Foetus these past few days - and liking it.

Here's another industrial blast from the past - Tackhead :

650 lostlakehiker  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:22:49pm

re: #605 LudwigVanQuixote

Man I have no idea what he is talking about. I am pretty certain I have never cracked at anyone's disability. I am also certain he is making stuff up.

Or maybe some other lizard who gets into flame wars has learned something neither of us knows. I do think it's best not to get into speculations on whose equipment works and just how well. Medical shit happens and you might accidentally strike closer to home than you intended.

651 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:22:54pm

re: #646 albusteve

I thought so...I don't know what your talking about

Even a thread name? Day you saw this? Search string I can use? I really want to see it.

652 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:23:52pm

re: #646 albusteve

I thought so...I don't know what your talking about

Steve you just claimed I wrote something terrible about your disability - mocked you for it or some such. You even almost convinced McSpiff of it. So prove it. Don't try to weasle out. post this awful thing you falsely claim I wrote that mocked some disability of yours - that I don't even know you have - other than stupidity.

Where is this terrible post I supposedly wrote liar?

653 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:24:45pm

re: #648 WindUpBird

It's just going to go on forever though :P

You're right. I'll try your way for a few weeks.

654 Nimed  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:24:47pm

re: #641 Dark_Falcon

Sorry, it's just hard for me. I take insults like that personally.

Well, have you tried not being a radical progressive?
/// (enough sarc tags?)

655 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:26:59pm

re: #654 Nimed

Well, have you tried not being a radical progressive?
/// (enough sarc tags?)

Isn't that like saying Jumbo Shrimp? :D

656 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:27:04pm

And silence from Steve.

Steve, you are not only a liar but a truly pathetic one at that. You are so deeply butthurt that you are trying to gain sympathy by claiming a bully beat you up on the play ground to any teacher who will listen. This after a night long attempt to start a flame war with me? You are truly pathetic.

657 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:27:07pm

re: #643 LudwigVanQuixote

If I had printed such a thing the proper response would be to link it and prove me wrong. That means you are lying. Thank you for proving yourself so pathetically in need of attention you will lie for it.

I don't have to prove anything...it isn't for the readers here...it's about you and me...you can fake them out but not me...you and Palamino had a good laugh about my situation....it doesn't matter if you can't recall I do bro...you're dirt, you said it, you know you did...make more sense now why I despise you?...dumbass, thought you would get away with it, you didn't...it's there and you know it, unless Charles ditched it which I don't think he would...I'm looking you straight in the eye bozo...you are a major asshole for that alone....major

658 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:27:45pm

re: #641 Dark_Falcon

Sorry, it's just hard for me. I take insults like that personally.

It's understandable. And it really sucks that they'd target you, because pretty much your only offense (in their eyes) is to be a conservative who defends Charles.

I think they hate you even more than they do those they perceive as 'libs'.
So it's understandable and I don't blame you for venting, but I do think the better general policy is to not discuss them openly (if we had private threads it could go there, where it doesn't turn off all the other readers).
I would also ignore the liars and trolls who ask for a link, like they don't know what the sites are.

659 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:27:51pm

re: #650 lostlakehiker

Or maybe some other lizard who gets into flame wars has learned something neither of us knows. I do think it's best not to get into speculations on whose equipment works and just how well. Medical shit happens and you might accidentally strike closer to home than you intended.

Since I know Steve on a more personal level than I think any other Lizard does... I can certainly say you make a very subtle point above... and I could see how certain remarks could be seen as too close.

660 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:28:02pm

Mmmm, the smell of hot, freshly deleted comments.

661 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:28:26pm

re: #652 LudwigVanQuixote

Steve you just claimed I wrote something terrible about your disability - mocked you for it or some such. You even almost convinced McSpiff of it. So prove it. Don't try to weasle out. post this awful thing you falsely claim I wrote that mocked some disability of yours - that I don't even know you have - other than stupidity.

Where is this terrible post I supposedly wrote liar?

it's not about Spiff, it's about you

662 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:28:42pm

What I remember reading, I don't know who posted, was "Albusteve is a conservative. And here he is taking disability." Paraphrasing.
I learned from that, and a few other things, don't write posts that you don't want to have judged in the future.

663 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:29:46pm

re: #654 Nimed

Well, have you tried not being a radical progressive?
/// (enough sarc tags?)

If I were able to produce my ballot from 2008, showing I had voted for McCain, plus photos of me attending a Republican event last weekend, He Who Will Not Be Named would still call me a "Radical Progressive". To him, anyone who defends Charles and Iceweasel as I have done must be a "RP".

And that's my last word on the subject.

664 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:30:21pm

re: #657 albusteve

I don't have to prove anything...it isn't for the readers here...it's about you and me...you can fake them out but not me...you and Palamino had a good laugh about my situation...it doesn't matter if you can't recall I do bro...you're dirt, you said it, you know you did...make more sense now why I despise you?...dumbass, thought you would get away with it, you didn't...it's there and you know it, unless Charles ditched it which I don't think he would...I'm looking you straight in the eye bozo...you are a major asshole for that alone...major

What are you talking about? You are lying. I have never made fun of anyone's disability. To the best of my knowledge you have none other than stupidity and a serious need ofr attention. Though compulsive liar seems to be coming onto the list.

Where is this terrible post?

You realize that everyone knows you are lying now?

665 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:32:26pm

re: #664 LudwigVanQuixote

re: #657 albusteve

Enough!

666 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:32:29pm

re: #662 prairiefire

What I remember reading, I don't know who posted, was "Albusteve is a conservative. And here he is taking disability." Paraphrasing.
I learned from that, and a few other things, don't write posts that you don't want to have judged in the future.

yes, and there was more...this is between me and Lud....he knows

667 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:33:18pm

re: #641 Dark_Falcon

Sorry, it's just hard for me. I take insults like that personally.

Oh please DF, they at the village are even more pathetic than Stevo. The other day they were having dream confrontations with us. Just pathetic. They only exist because of us. They have no other maning. They get together in their little cave and wonder how they were kicked out of eden. Without us they would have no definition. NO think about how pathetic they are when that is true. Not only does their whole existence revolve around a blog, but, it is a blog they were booted from for being losers?

668 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:33:33pm

re: #664 LudwigVanQuixote

What are you talking about? You are lying. I have never made fun of anyone's disability. To the best of my knowledge you have none other than stupidity and a serious need ofr attention. Though compulsive liar seems to be coming onto the list.

Where is this terrible post?

You realize that everyone knows you are lying now?

I don't care what anybody else thinks...you're pinned in my mind

669 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:33:47pm

re: #666 albusteve

yes, and there was more...this is between me and Lud...he knows

No I don't. Post it liar.

670 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:34:20pm

re: #668 albusteve

I don't care what anybody else thinks...you're pinned in my mind

They know you are lying. I know you are fucking insane.

671 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:34:43pm

re: #656 LudwigVanQuixote

And silence from Steve.

Steve, you are not only a liar but a truly pathetic one at that. You are so deeply butthurt that you are trying to gain sympathy by claiming a bully beat you up on the play ground to any teacher who will listen. This after a night long attempt to start a flame war with me? You are truly pathetic.

This is regrettably something that certain posters have been doing for a long time, Ludwig - and it seems to be getting worse. Accusations are just thrown out there about what posters have said or done, and are never backed up when the merest shred of supporting evidence is asked for. If what they were saying was true, they could easily prove it, but they never do. What can we conclude from this about the validity of their claims? Answers on a postcard, please/

672 wee fury  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:34:54pm

I blame it on Stormy Monday


T-Bone Walker
673 prairiefire  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:35:23pm

re: #659 Walter L. Newton

I'll email you later, Walter. Night, lizards.

674 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:35:31pm

re: #667 LudwigVanQuixote

True, very true.

And now I need to get to bed. Sleep well, all, and I'll see you tomorrow night.

675 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:36:04pm

re: #668 albusteve

I don't care what anybody else thinks...you're pinned in my mind

Well, I'm glad you aren't concerned about what I think. Because the fact that you refuse to provide any proof makes your claims extremely suspect. I really approached this one with an open mind, and I'm still going through LVQ's comment page but damn man... you gotta give me something.

676 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:36:37pm

re: #673 prairiefire

I'll email you later, Walter. Night, lizards.

Got it... hopefully we can get together and do a little tour of the Rockies.

677 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:38:30pm

re: #669 LudwigVanQuixote

No I don't. Post it liar.

I will as soon as you post the older sludge that I disbelieve the AGW science...you first sissy, go for it...how do you like your shit sandwich?...I'll drop the latter if you produce evidence of the former...do it, you have accused me for long months of being a moron denier...prove it Lud

678 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:38:35pm

re: #663 Dark_Falcon

If I were able to produce my ballot from 2008, showing I had voted for McCain, plus photos of me attending a Republican event last weekend, He Who Will Not Be Named would still call me a "Radical Progressive". To him, anyone who defends Charles and Iceweasel as I have done must be a "RP".

And that's my last word on the subject.

Yes. And I just want to add: it isn't strictly speaking fair to call you a defender of me, because you just tend to always want civility and you call out people for bad behaviour, regardless of who they are. You've called ME out many times and always do when you think I've gone over the line. And frankly, that's one reason why your opinion on that is one I will always listen to-- because I know you to be someone who is fair.
Even when i disagree with you, I think you're fair and I always respect you (that should go without saying but it's nice to say sometimes).

And that's probably what they hate about you most--because on certain VERY basic matters (like how we all interact), you're just about the least partisan person here and the most friendly to new people and most willing to stick up for what you think is right regardless of who says it.
This is a concept of honour that they can only despise, lacking it so wholly themselves.
End of. :)

679 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:38:40pm

re: #675 McSpiff

Well, I'm glad you aren't concerned about what I think. Because the fact that you refuse to provide any proof makes your claims extremely suspect. I really approached this one with an open mind, and I'm still going through LVQ's comment page but damn man... you gotta give me something.

I like Steve, I admit it. But, he's got nothing to give here.
Sorry, man. You're out on this one.
Better luck, with the next battle.
Be well, and may you see & drive many hot cars, Steve.

680 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:39:11pm

re: #675 McSpiff

Well, I'm glad you aren't concerned about what I think. Because the fact that you refuse to provide any proof makes your claims extremely suspect. I really approached this one with an open mind, and I'm still going through LVQ's comment page but damn man... you gotta give me something.

I don't like steve one bit. I have considered many of his views hypocritical and immoral - some even downright evil. However, I have never mocked him or anyone for a disability.

I mean hasn't everything he's done on this thread been a desperate cry for attention anyway? I am just shocked he would go so far as to claim wonds on an insult I didn't ever make so as to curry sympathy for being crazy tonight.

681 Nimed  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:39:12pm

re: #663 Dark_Falcon

If I were able to produce my ballot from 2008, showing I had voted for McCain, plus photos of me attending a Republican event last weekend, He Who Will Not Be Named would still call me a "Radical Progressive". To him, anyone who defends Charles and Iceweasel as I have done must be a "RP".

And that's my last word on the subject.

Hey, fuck him. I don't know anything about Rodan (and would like to keep it that way), but accusing you of being a radical progressive is so outlandish that it's pretty obvious the guy has a very tenuous contact with reality.

682 albusteve  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:40:03pm

re: #675 McSpiff

Well, I'm glad you aren't concerned about what I think. Because the fact that you refuse to provide any proof makes your claims extremely suspect. I really approached this one with an open mind, and I'm still going through LVQ's comment page but damn man... you gotta give me something.

I don't care if my motives are suspect...go ahead and call me a liar

683 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:40:44pm

re: #677 albusteve

I will as soon as you post ...

So you do have the evidence to prove that I said this horrible insult, which would cause everyone here to think I am a liar... yet you don't?

Uhhh Huh.

You are a pathetic liar and a moron Stevo. Yur behaviour would be bad for preschool.

684 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:40:54pm

re: #682 albusteve

I don't care if my motives are suspect...go ahead and call me a liar

Liar.

685 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:42:39pm

re: #677 albusteve

I will as soon as you post the older sludge that I disbelieve the AGW science...you first sissy, go for it...how do you like your shit sandwich?...I'll drop the latter if you produce evidence of the former...do it, you have accused me for long months of being a moron denier...prove it Lud

No post this supposed grievous insult I made on your disabilities. I want to see it. So does anyone still reading. Now you are a backing up... why is that Steve?

686 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:43:52pm

re: #650 lostlakehiker

Or maybe some other lizard who gets into flame wars has learned something neither of us knows. I do think it's best not to get into speculations on whose equipment works and just how well. Medical shit happens and you might accidentally strike closer to home than you intended.

Really. Who are you talking about and what exactly are you alleging?

687 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:44:09pm

OK little vote here. Everyone how knows Stevo is lying ding this up.

688 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:45:54pm

re: #682 albusteve

I don't care if my motives are suspect...go ahead and call me a liar

I'll tell you what I know, and then what I think. I know you claimed LVQ mocked your disability, and I know you refuse to link to the post. I also know I'm having a hard time finding the post (but LVQ posts a lot...). You also feel LVQ has put words in your mouth and won't link to the post.

So I think you're frustrated as hell, and you feel that someone is lying about you. I can understand a little "what's good for the goose is good for the gander". But I can't condone it.

I'm not trying to corner you, or play word games. I just want to know that you respect me and the rest of LGF enough to be honest. That's it.

689 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:46:58pm

re: #688 McSpiff

I'll tell you what I know, and then what I think. I know you claimed LVQ mocked your disability, and I know you refuse to link to the post. I also know I'm having a hard time finding the post (but LVQ posts a lot...). You also feel LVQ has put words in your mouth and won't link to your post.

So I think you're frustrated as hell, and you feel that someone is lying about you. I can understand a little "what's good for the goose is good for the gander". But I can't condone it.

I'm not trying to corner you, or play word games. I just want to know that you respect me and the rest of LGF enough to be honest. That's it.

Clarified.

690 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:48:46pm

re: #679 Floral Giraffe

I like Steve, I admit it. But, he's got nothing to give here.
Sorry, man. You're out on this one.
Better luck, with the next battle.
Be well, and may you see & drive many hot cars, Steve.

Steve, I like you as a poster, for the most part.
You are NOT going to win this one.
May I suggest quietly retreating from this battle?
I do like you, and hope to retain some respect for you.
Pissing matches, with no content from your side, aren't going to retain my respect.

Just saying...

691 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:48:51pm

re: #689 McSpiff

Clarified.

Actually I linked to two of his posts tonight where he claimed the opposite of what he said before and I called him on it.

So you really think he made this disability thing up as a sort of revenge lesson on me because he honestly believes he wasn't saying silly things about AGW that he was then caught on?

IS he really that messed up in the head?

Wow...

692 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:49:15pm

re: #687 LudwigVanQuixote

OK little vote here. Everyone how knows Stevo is lying ding this up.

No, he's not lying. I remember this from many months ago.

693 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:50:11pm

Like freaking kindergarten.

Why do I keep looking at it?

694 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:50:17pm

re: #692 Bagua

No, he's not lying. I remember this from many months ago.

So then what is it Bagua?

695 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:50:28pm

re: #692 Bagua

No, he's not lying. I remember this from many months ago.

Can you post a link?
I would believe a link.
Not that I doubt the sincerity of ANY of the posters here.
Bagua, I think you know that.

696 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:50:32pm

re: #693 Racer X

Like freaking kindergarten.

Why do I keep looking at it?

It really is pathetic.

697 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:50:44pm

re: #687 LudwigVanQuixote

OK little vote here. Everyone how knows Stevo is lying ding this up.

Dinged. Addendum: apparently albusteve has health problems. I don't know the exact nature of these, but I do know that those of us who object to his continual hateful trolling are often told "Oh, albusteve has a lot going on."

Fine. Sympathy for sure--but don't we all? Don't LOTS of people on here have illnesses, personal issues, whatever, that we might not talk about? Shouldn't the default assumption for ANYONE be that they have a whole life that isn't visible to those who only know you as a commenter on a political blog?

Is that EVER an excuse for vicious name calling and whatever else?

I'm quite certain that no one here has ever mocked albusteve or been hateful to him over whatever his specific personal situation is.

698 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:51:09pm

re: #693 Racer X

Like freaking kindergarten.

Why do I keep looking at it?

Because you LIKE the taste of Elmers Glue!
I can tell!
*SMOOCH*

699 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:52:11pm

re: #692 Bagua

No, he's not lying. I remember this from many months ago.

Months? Christ, I thought this was recent. I can understand not being able to find it. If that's the case, steve should just say that. It makes more sense anyways.

700 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:52:51pm

re: #690 Floral Giraffe

Steve, I like you as a poster, for the most part.
You are NOT going to win this one.
May I suggest quietly retreating from this battle?
I do like you, and hope to retain some respect for you.
Pissing matches, with no content from your side, aren't going to retain my respect.

Just saying...

And I respect the hell out of you lovely lady.

701 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:53:02pm

re: #694 LudwigVanQuixote

So then what is it Bagua?

Some people get pissed off when we criticise or report bigoted posts. But here's the thing - at least those posts do actually exist. We link to them and stuff. What are we getting in response from certain posters? Claims about 'evil' posts that they allege exist, although no one is allowed to gaze upon them for some never to be explained reason! Seriously.

702 Racer X  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:53:30pm

re: #698 Floral Giraffe

Because you LIKE the taste of Elmers Glue!
I can tell!
*SMOOCH*

LOL!

I do! It's tangy yet slightly chalky. Not like thick milk at all.

703 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:53:55pm

re: #694 LudwigVanQuixote

So then what is it Bagua?

I did a little search but I can't find it. I do remember this though, Steve isn't lying.

704 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:54:06pm

re: #700 McSpiff

And I respect the hell out of you lovely lady.

LOL! And you, Dear, Sir, Are just Spiffy!

705 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:54:08pm

re: #691 LudwigVanQuixote


So you really think he made this disability thing up as a sort of revenge lesson on me because he honestly believes he wasn't saying silly things about AGW that he was then caught on?

NO NO NO. He does have some serious health issues. He might even BELIEVE at this moment that you mocked him for them. That doesn't make it true.

706 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:54:13pm

For those who would like to chat with me on Yahoo, I am on. I am tired of this foolishness here.

707 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:54:45pm

re: #703 Bagua

I did a little search but I can't find it. I do remember this though, Steve isn't lying.

No quote, no foul.
Just saying....

708 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:55:44pm

re: #703 Bagua

I did a little search but I can't find it. I do remember this though, Steve isn't lying.

Bagua, I have never mocked anyone for their disability. Not once. You are a serious asshole to bring that without any proof. Consider yourself back on the douchebag list. Permanently.

709 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:55:48pm

re: #706 LudwigVanQuixote

For those who would like to chat with me on Yahoo, I am on. I am tired of this foolishness here.

What's the link to the yahoo chat?

710 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:56:48pm

re: #709 Bagua

What's the link to the yahoo chat?

Not one you will ever be invited to. Fuck off.

711 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:57:53pm

re: #709 Bagua

What's the link to the yahoo chat?

What an ass you are.

712 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 9:57:53pm

re: #708 LudwigVanQuixote

Bagua, I have never mocked anyone for their disability. Not once. You are a serious asshole to bring that without any proof. Consider yourself back on the douchebag list. Permanently.

I'm not siding against you Ludwig. I'm just saying I remember some sort of an exchange that Abusteve is referencing. Also, I'm not going to drag out old angry exchanges, as words are usually said on both sides.

713 Bagua  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:00:14pm

re: #710 LudwigVanQuixote

Not one you will ever be invited to. Fuck off.

That's not nice or called for. I'm just saying Steve is not a liar. Doesn't mean I am taking sides in the actual exchange, just that I remember it.

714 Ayeless in Ghazi  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:00:46pm

re: #710 LudwigVanQuixote

Not one you will ever be invited to. Fuck off.

This is the person who downstairs alleged that ice and I drove off hundreds of centrist posters/good people. When asked to name a few of them guess what came back? Yep - you got it - nothing.

715 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:01:19pm

re: #713 Bagua

That's not nice or called for. I'm just saying Steve is not a liar. Doesn't mean I am taking sides in the actual exchange, just that I remember it.

It means you are backing up his lies for whatever reason. I have never mocked someone's disability.

716 Eclectic Infidel  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:01:21pm

re: #687 LudwigVanQuixote

OK little vote here. Everyone how knows Stevo is lying ding this up.

I can't upding this post. I'd like to see the post where the alleged mocking took place. This is serious for me, because of the two women I've ever truly loved in this world, one is disabled (due to a drunk driver), and for the time we were together, my eyes were opened to another world unknown to me. Suffice to say I don't take such things lightly (mocking of one's disability) and when the accusation is out there, I definitely want to see proof.

717 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:01:46pm

re: #714 Jimmah

This is the person who downstairs alleged that ice and I drove off hundreds of centrist posters/good people. When asked to name a few of them guess what came back? Yep - you got it - nothing.

seriously, I'm on Yahoo.

718 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:02:48pm

re: #716 eclectic infidel

I can't upding this post. I'd like to see the post where the alleged mocking took place. This is serious for me, because of the two women I've ever truly loved in this world, one is disabled (due to a drunk driver), and for the time we were together, my eyes were opened to another world unknown to me. Suffice to say I don't take such things lightly (mocking of one's disability) and when the accusation is out there, I definitely want to see proof.

I would never ever mock someone for a disability. That is why this is so frustrating. It would be serious for me as well. It is an out and out slander,

He is lying.

719 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:03:30pm

re: #708 LudwigVanQuixote

Bagua, I have never mocked anyone for their disability. Not once. You are a serious asshole to bring that without any proof. Consider yourself back on the douchebag list. Permanently.

Good, he belongs there. See you on yahoo. :)

BTW-- for what it's worth folks, I remember albusteve doing a post in the fall (??-- several months ago) where he mentioned he was in a lot of pain and made a nice post saying he knew he was sometimes, or even often, an asshole here but that was the reason why.

To be honest that's made it very hard for me to respond to him when he's being nasty to me or other people. It was a very nice and a very brave post by him I thought, and I don't think people should get passes for being hateful, but....albusteve isn't lying when he says he has health issues, and even though I don't believe ANYONE here ever ragged on him for that, any long term illness is debilitating and horrible in many ways, as we all know.

Apologies albusteve if this seemed offensive to you, it really wasnt meant that way.

720 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:04:44pm

re: #716 eclectic infidel

I can't upding this post. I'd like to see the post where the alleged mocking took place. This is serious for me, because of the two women I've ever truly loved in this world, one is disabled (due to a drunk driver), and for the time we were together, my eyes were opened to another world unknown to me. Suffice to say I don't take such things lightly (mocking of one's disability) and when the accusation is out there, I definitely want to see proof.

I know LVQ. He would harm himself before he would mock someone for a disability. It didn't happen.

721 McSpiff  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:05:01pm

Its 2am on the east-east coast. I'm off to bed. I wish someone could give me a post to read, but it doesn't look like that's gonna happen. For the record, I accuse no one of lying. Hope I'm still friends with everyone tomorrow.

Truthfully, I'm wondering if it was me that made that post… if someone wants to check my history they're welcome to. But I've already apologized for what i said to steve early on.

722 Cato the Elder  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:07:27pm

If we humans can't control our tempers on a little blog thread (or, say, our gratuitous jabs at the Virgin Mary), what chance we can control our climate?

Answer: none.

723 Eclectic Infidel  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:08:11pm

re: #720 iceweasel

I know LVQ. He would harm himself before he would mock someone for a disability. It didn't happen.

It's telling that albusteve hasn't produced anything in this thread that resembles the proof of the accusation.

724 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:16:55pm

re: #723 eclectic infidel

It's telling that albusteve hasn't produced anything in this thread that resembles the proof of the accusation.

he can't.

A few posters have, over the years, pointed out that albusteve is supposedly taking gubbmint money (I dunno if it's disability or what) but always and only in response to albusteve posting rants about what he 'won't pay taxes for'-- people have pointed out that he has said (i guess?) that he hasn't even filed taxes for years.

I have no idea what in that is true and what isn't, but my very strong suspicion is that this traces back to some poster (not even LVQ) saying something like that to albusteve recently.

Anyway, the point here is that LVQ definitely didn't insult anyone's disability, albusteve ISN'T lying about having health issues, and maybe that's where it should all be dropped.

(But also: anyone here who mocked disabled people would get a very severe beatdown from everyone and an instant perma-ban from CJ I bet. It didn't happen.)

725 Nimed  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:23:52pm

re: #691 LudwigVanQuixote

So you really think he made this disability thing up as a sort of revenge lesson on me because he honestly believes he wasn't saying silly things about AGW that he was then caught on?

re: #724 iceweasel

Anyway, the point here is that LVQ definitely didn't insult anyone's disability, albusteve ISN'T lying about having health issues, and maybe that's where it should all be dropped.

Exactly. Ludwig, please check out Steve's comments in this thread, starting in comment #180.
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

726 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:28:53pm

re: #725 Nimed

Exactly. Ludwig, please check out Steve's comments in this thread, starting in comment #180.
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

OK I wasn't even on that thread or on LGF that day. That was Shabbos.

727 Nimed  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:33:31pm

re: #726 LudwigVanQuixote

OK I wasn't even on that thread or on LGF that day. That was Shabbos.

Of course. I know you're good people LVQ. Things got a little out of hand in this thread, that's all.

728 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:37:55pm

re: #633 LudwigVanQuixote

"I am actually being conservative and I am quoting ranges. Which I put in all of those predictions."

Other than with respect to sea level, would you please tell me where you quoted ranges in the following comment of yours? (Hint: You didn't)
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

729 BARACK THE VOTE  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 10:54:34pm

re: #728 Spare O'Lake

Other than with respect to sea level, would you please tell me where you quoted ranges in the following comment of yours? (Hint: You didn't)
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Hi Spare! Little something for you and some other folks here.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Deal.

730 ryannon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 11:53:00pm

re: #524 LudwigVanQuixote

I'm upset that the single greatest threat to our civilization is trivialized by fools on this thread. I am hardly hurt by the silly attempts to get my goat.

Among the single greatest threats to our civilization (including the Black Swans of which we have no knowledge at this time) is our inability to get along with one another - and of which these and other threads are the proof - if any were needed. That's the root cause, and one doesn't have to be a scientist to understand it.

731 ryannon  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 11:55:55pm

re: #531 Nimed

And I bet you think characters from the movie are trying to drive out of LGF.

Yes, but they just keep driving in circles before running out of gas.

*goody-two-shoes mode off*

732 boxhead  Mon, Jul 5, 2010 11:56:48pm

re: #730 ryannon

Among the single greatest threats to our civilization (including the Black Swans of which we have no knowledge at this time) is our inability to get along with one another - and of which these and other threads are the proof - if any were needed. That's the root cause, and one doesn't have to be a scientist to understand it.

yes.... in that i see what you are referring to. And no... is does have to be this way. we are better than that, aren't we?

733 ryannon  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 12:05:31am

re: #572 lostlakehiker

He didn't say you were stupid. Deep breath. Nobody around here is anything short of solidly above average. But we're talking science when we talk AGW, and there are people who know more and people who don't. I don't get all huffy when people tell me my French is weak. Pardon my French, I fucking well know I don't know it very well. My Spanish is just about nonexistent, and all I know of Italian is that it's what they speak in Italy.

We are, all of us, massively ignorant on all sorts of topics. Happily, we aren't all of us massively ignorant on all topics. This topic happens to be right up Ludwig's alley, and Charles has got there, and if I may say so, I think I've caught on too. If you'd park your pride by the door and take a walking tour through the evidence we set before you, I'm sure you'd arrive at a pretty good grasp of it by and by.

The really strange thing is that Steve has never denied 'the science'.

734 ryannon  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 12:10:28am

re: #594 WindUpBird

This place isn't too far from me. Nobody names stuff like Catholics.

Well, the Brits have 'grotty'.

735 ryannon  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 12:16:46am

re: #598 WindUpBird

The Catholic church needs more mazes.

Here's one from the floor of Chartres Cathedral:

Image: labyrinth.jpg

Many of the great French Gothic cathedrals had mazes set into their floor:

[Link: www.crystalinks.com...]

[Link: www.lessons4living.com...]

736 boxhead  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 12:20:20am

re: #732 boxhead

yes... in that i see what you are referring to. And no... is does NOT have to be this way. we are better than that, aren't we?

forgot the NOT... arrrg

737 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 4:47:14am

re: #729 iceweasel

It's "us vs them" for you, right here on LGF, isn't it?
Enjoy.

738 mkelly  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 6:27:42am

re: #524 LudwigVanQuixote

I'm upset that the single greatest threat to our civilization....

A little over the top on the GW theory.

What about a supervolcano?
Asteroid?
Loss of magnetic field?
Magnetic poles flipping?
a germ we have no cure/vaccine for?

739 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 7:32:10am
740 MKelly  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 8:29:31am

So you agree that GW is a greater threat than a supervolcano. I don't. A disagreement on severity of problems should get a more indepth response than a picture made up by someone else.

741 Ayeless in Ghazi  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 10:17:11am

re: #737 Spare O'Lake

It's "us vs them" for you, right here on LGF, isn't it?
Enjoy.

You and your chums attacked posters here for criticising and reporting a bigoted comment, a comment Charles saw fit for deletion. That fact that you and some others are prepared to defend the most bigoted and petty comments that right wing posters make here confirms that "us vs them" is YOUR mindset.

I am not against conservative posters - I get on very well with quite a few conservative posters here. What I am against is the rank dishonesty, bigotry, pettiness and partisan hate displayed by some posters on the right here.

742 Ayeless in Ghazi  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 10:21:14am

re: #740 MKelly

So you agree that GW is a greater threat than a supervolcano. I don't. A disagreement on severity of problems should get a more indepth response than a picture made up by someone else.

No - that would be giving your stupid post way too much credit.

743 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Jul 6, 2010 12:01:14pm

re: #738 mkelly


I'm upset that the single greatest threat to our civilization...
A little over the top on the GW theory.

Well, if you would take the time to read what the science actually says and listen to th scientists and the generals and admirals in this video, you would see that the midrange projections are global shortages of food and water affecting billions, flooding and desertification affecting billions, spread of contagion from disease vectors migrating with changing climates, and massive political unrest due to basic needs not being met.

In short, global scale war, famine, drought, plague, flooding, political instability and death.

Billions will die, who otherwise could have lived full lives, on the course we are on, as a result of this.

What about a supervolcano?

Those are really only a global threat on Krypton, but as you know it was destroyed.

Asteroid?

It is true a dinosaur killer would suck. The odds of one hitting in the next 100 years are substantially less than the certainties of AGW.

Loss of magnetic field?

I don't even know where you get this from. There is no reason to suspect that the Earth's magnetic field would go away.

Magnetic poles flipping?

They have been flipping semi-regularly for eons. We got through that.

a germ we have no cure/vaccine for?

One of the best ways to help that happen, is to spread disease vectors into areas that do not have immunities. That is exactly one of the results of changing climates. We are already seeing cases of Dengue fever in France and Italy for example.


This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT
LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal
Cash.app
Recent PagesClick to refresh