Weigel: Believing Sarah Palin

Dave Weigel uses his guest posting stint at Andrew Sullivan’s blog to request that Andrew drop his obsession with Trig Palin.

The Trig obsession has also, I’m sad to say, damaged Andrew Sullivan’s reputation. I’m stunned by the anger he’s generating not just among random Tweeters but among people who’ve been online for years, part of the rough-and-tumble of blogging. They know that 99% of what Sullivan writes is challenging, smart, and addictive, and that he’s very capable of honing in on bigger political and philosophical debates. People want him to take a deep breath and stop obsessing over this conspiracy theory. Count me among those people.

Me too.

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93 comments

1 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:38:22pm

He really should. It makes him looks stupid and petty.

2 wrenchwench  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:39:37pm
The other is that Sullivan is wrong about Israel.

Will there be a “Part 2”?

3 cronus  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:41:23pm

Amen. Sullivan’s Trig obsession is every bit as deranged as nirtherism and trutherism. I guy that intelligent should know better.

4 Killgore Trout  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:42:52pm

I think this also illustrates why the left is generally healthier than the right these days. Sullivan is tolerated in spite of his loony obsessions not because of them.

5 webevintage  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:48:55pm

Hate her.
Hate. Her. So. Much.
But I don’t give a shit if the kid is hers or not (though I hate the way she carts him around like a piece of luggage) and Sully needs to just move on.

6 teleskiguy  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:50:21pm

While I do think that Sully has kinda lost it on the whole Trig thing, I think he has a point when he raises the issue of Saint Sarah using little Trig as a political prop. Trig needs to be cared for and doted over at home, not brought along the campaign trail and raised in the air at rallies like something out of The Lion King.

7 mush57  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:51:34pm

the sad thing about Trig is that his Moron mother named him
after his Genetic Defect. (look up triG) My slavic heritage has
inured me to last names like “no hand” or “no eye” but to give
a kid a “given Name” like “Dumbo” or “Cripple”. I find grotesque.
May she rot in some location I will not venture to name.

8 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:51:46pm

re: #4 Killgore Trout

As a right leaning individual, it pains me to agree with you there. Yet I can find no fault in your statement. :sigh:

9 webevintage  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:54:44pm

re: #6 teleskiguy

I think he has a point when he raises the issue of Saint Sarah using little Trig as a political prop. Trig needs to be cared for and doted over at home, not brought along the campaign trail and raised in the air at rallies like something out of The Lion King.

Well it goes without saying that she uses her kids a props.
Plus she can drag them out when it is time to wear her professional victim cap or to hide behind.
But hey, she’s a “Grizzly Mama” so everything she does is gold.

(and I still have no fraking idea what a “Grizzly Mama” is)

10 wrenchwench  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:56:09pm

re: #7 mush57

(look up triG)

He’s got trigonometry? Or do I need to look it up in a Slavic language?

11 webevintage  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:56:40pm

re: #7 mush57

the sad thing about Trig is that his Moron mother named him
after his Genetic Defect. (look up triG)

I really don’t think her and the First Dude are smart enough to have known that…..

12 Kragar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:57:01pm

Once again, and as it is with most political figures, there is enough out there to attack her on the issues and her nutball political ideas that you can leave the family out of it.

13 webevintage  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:57:38pm

re: #12 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Once again, and as it is with most political figures, there is enough out there to attack her on the issues and her nutball political ideas that you can leave the family out of it.

If only she would….

14 darthstar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 1:59:54pm

re: #5 webevintage

Hate her.
Hate. Her. So. Much.
But I don’t give a shit if the kid is hers or not (though I hate the way she carts him around like a piece of luggage) and Sully needs to just move on.

I do feel sorry for Trig. When he’s old enough, I hope Sarah spends some of her millions sending him to a quality residential school for special needs children where he can flourish to his full potential.

15 wrenchwench  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:00:27pm

re: #7 mush57

Never mind, I found the reference at DU, which has the reference from Mr. Sullivan.

16 elizajane  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:06:12pm

Me three. Love Sullivan but his Trig posts make me cringe. Vastly lessens the effect of his other posts calling her out on lies and distortions that really matter.
Trig-as-campaign-prop also makes me cringe, of course.

17 windsagio  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:07:21pm

re: #6 teleskiguy

I think he has a point when he raises the issue of Saint Sarah using little Trig as a political prop. Trig needs to be cared for and doted over at home, not brought along the campaign trail and raised in the air at rallies like something out of The Lion King.

Nothing makes me crazy quite the way the exploitation of the disabled for emotional manipulation does.

It’s freakin’ maddening.

18 Four More Tears  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:20:33pm

I’ve criticized Sully for the whole Trig thing several times before. I do think it’s pretty uncool to call the guy out on it while guest-posting on his own blog, though.

19 darthstar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:21:16pm

OT, kinda…Speaking of Republicans who don’t write their own shit(no, not Sarah, and no, not Glenn)…

Although GOP gubernatorial candidate Scott McInnis presented his “Musings on Water” for publication as original works, portions are identical and nearly identical to an essay on water written 20 years earlier by now-Colorado Supreme Court Justice Gregory J. Hobbs.

A Clemson University expert who reviewed McInnis’ work next to Hobbs’ essay called it a clear case of plagiarism of both words and ideas.


So McInnis blames a research aide for the oversight…except he was paid $300,000 (which he took) to write the allegedly “original material” and takes full credit for its content.

20 reine.de.tout  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:23:06pm

re: #14 darthstar

I do feel sorry for Trig. When he’s old enough, I hope Sarah spends some of her millions sending him to a quality residential school for special needs children where he can flourish to his full potential.

I do too, Darth.
I know some folks with a young man who is mentally retarded, and they have kept him isolated at home all his life. I feel sorry for him; I think he could learn enough to work a job and have a life, but these folks seem intent on keeping him at home. What’s going to happen to him when they die? For some reason, that’s on my mind every time I think of him.

21 Kragar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:23:44pm

re: #19 darthstar

OT, kinda…Speaking of Republicans who don’t write their own shit(no, not Sarah, and no, not Glenn)…


So McInnis blames a research aide for the oversight…except he was paid $300,000 (which he took) to write the allegedly “original material” and takes full credit for its content.

Seems to be a lot of that going around lately.

22 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:24:30pm

I believe there is a fine line between ‘using’ Trig on the campaign trail and hiding him away because of his affliction. From where I sit, there ought not be a difference in how any candidate campaigns with any of his or her children.

23 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:25:40pm

re: #5 webevintage

Hate her.
Hate. Her. So. Much.
But I don’t give a shit if the kid is hers or not (though I hate the way she carts him around like a piece of luggage) and Sully needs to just move on.

Get help.

24 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:27:45pm

re: #14 darthstar

I do feel sorry for Trig. When he’s old enough, I hope Sarah spends some of her millions sending him to a quality residential school for special needs children where he can flourish to his full potential.

Is there any reason to think he will not receive a top-notch upbringing?

25 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:27:59pm

re: #20 reine.de.tout

I do too, Darth.
I know some folks with a young man who is mentally retarded, and they have kept him isolated at home all his life. I feel sorry for him; I think he could learn enough to work a job and have a life, but these folks seem intent on keeping him at home. What’s going to happen to him when they die? For some reason, that’s on my mind every time I think of him.

We don’t know the future. My only objection is the objectifying of Trig.

If the Palins use their position to advocate for the disabled and disadvantaged, good for them. If Trig is used only as a prop, shame on them.

Like you, I know parents of disabled kids. As a rule, they really do the right thing as best they can. I hope that is true in ths case.

26 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:28:14pm

re: #24 Spare O’Lake

Is there any reason to think he will not receive a top-notch upbringing?

Umm…. do you know who his mom is?

27 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:29:24pm

re: #26 Fozzie Bear

Umm… do you know who his mom is?

Why would you say that? Has she been derelict in any with her other children?

28 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:30:11pm

re: #27 researchok

Why would you say that? Has she been derelict in any with her other children?

I have a blanket concern for the children of extremist demagogues.

29 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:30:18pm

re: #26 Fozzie Bear

Umm… do you know who his mom is?

Does the hate extend to her relationship with her immediate family?

30 darthstar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:31:12pm

re: #24 Spare O’Lake

Is there any reason to think he will not receive a top-notch upbringing?

Yes. Her name is Sarah and she’s a professional victim. Anybody that narcissistic is going to focus more on feeding her own fragile ego than the needs of her family.

31 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:32:24pm

re: #29 Spare O’Lake

Does the hate extend to her relationship with her immediate family?

I don’t hate anybody. I think SP is a dangerous idiot.

Her kids, I just feel sorry for them. What tiny hope they may have had for a normal childhood evaporated when their mother decided to wage war on sanity.

32 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:32:41pm

re: #30 darthstar

Yes. Her name is Sarah and she’s a professional victim. Anybody that narcissistic is going to focus more on feeding her own fragile ego than the needs of her family.

Based on what evidence do you make that remark?

Would the same apply to the Clintons? Or the Obamas? People on teh other side can make that very argument.

33 Obdicut  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:33:19pm

re: #20 reine.de.tout

That is the main thing that I’ve talked about with the parents of disabled children. It’s a terrible conversation, every time, especially when the people are poor.

Some of the most heroic people to me are those with mentally disabled siblings who take care of them as adults, even though having a sibling who is retarded is incredibly stressful, shaming, and painful for kids.

And equal bravery is one disabled boy I know who talked his brother into checking him into an institution so that his brother could actually go to college. He understood he was preventing his brother from having a happier life, and was able to convince him that he’d do well in the institution— he even said “I’ll help the other kids because I’m smarter than them.” Which is true, he was very clever and had a near-perfect memory.

It’s an insanely problematic subject, ethically, and I’ve never really been comfortable commenting on Palin and her relationship to Trig except to be glad that they have money to provide for him in the future and feel somewhat appalled that they expose Trig to the media in the way that they do. But in the end, of all the Palin-related things, I think Trig should be the last anyone ever gets to.

34 teleskiguy  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:33:38pm

re: #19 darthstar

So McInnis blames a research aide for the oversight…except he was paid $300,000 (which he took) to write the allegedly “original material” and takes full credit for its content.

McGinnis was my congressman throughout my childhood. He was pragmatic and nondescript. After he left office, he went on to lucrative business dealings and lobbying. He’s a multi-millionaire now, made from lobbying for big energy companies vying for the energy reserves on the western slope of Colorado.

My point is, after his congressional stint, he was fed all these ideas by people with a lot of money. The man hasn’t one original idea in his head, he’s a quintessential puppet of these huge energy companies. It doesn’t surprise me that he plagiarized someone else’s study.

I’m not voting for McGinnis for governor. But I’m not to keen on Hickenlooper either. I might just write my father in.

35 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:34:10pm

re: #28 Fozzie Bear

I have a blanket concern for the children of extremist demagogues.

‘Extremist demagogues’?

Would that apply to religious people as well?

36 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:34:22pm

re: #30 darthstar

Yes. Her name is Sarah and she’s a professional victim. Anybody that narcissistic is going to focus more on feeding her own fragile ego than the needs of her family.

Actually she’s not much of a “victim” at all. Like it or not, she’s doing just fine financially and she seems to be extremely popular too.

37 njdhockeyfan  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:35:02pm

re: #30 darthstar

Yes. Her name is Sarah and she’s a professional victim. Anybody that narcissistic is going to focus more on feeding her own fragile ego than the needs of her family.

That’s a very strong remark. Do you have any proof her family’s needs aren’t being met?

38 windsagio  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:35:08pm

re: #20 reine.de.tout

With all due respect, his parents can keep him, and he can still have a fulfilling and wonderful life.

The idea that you have to put a disabled person into a residential facility is deeply unfair to the individuals. You’re basicly saying then ‘they can’t do it on their own, and their parents can’t deal with the challenges involved’.

Sometimes that is true, absolutely, and thats why group homes exist.

I work in group homes, and I have a brother whose disabled. As long as my sister and I are capable of providing for his care, he will never be in a group home. We can do better for him than that.

39 darthstar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:35:58pm

re: #27 researchok

Why would you say that? Has she been derelict in any with her other children?

Trap, or whatever the oldest boy’s name is, joined the Army to avoid jail.
Bristol, the oldest daughter, got knocked up by a guy whose mother sold prescription meds illegally and barely finished high school. She now runs her on PR firm and preaches abstinence.
Willow, the next daughter, had a recent run-in with the law for breaking and entering…the other kids got busted, but she didn’t.

So far, Piper and Trig are still clean.

40 windsagio  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:37:20pm

re: #33 Obdicut

Its stressful, but believe me it doesn’t have to be shaming or painful (well there are always incidents, like when they freak out in the Pike Place Market, and need to be removed by cops, but that’s another story…)

Sometimes a group home is the only answer, but its often sad when it is, because the individuals are often receiving inferior care, if not abuse.

41 darthstar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:38:00pm

re: #37 njdhockeyfan

That’s a very strong remark. Do you have any proof her family’s needs aren’t being met?

Just as much proof as you have that they are. This is merely internet speculation based on the public face of Sarah Palin. She throws herself out there to be scrutinized, then spends much of her time complaining when people do…and if they don’t, she brings up (of her own accord) rumors about her which had already died without gaining traction (boob-gate).

42 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:38:26pm

re: #38 windsagio

Hear, hear! Kudos on taking care of your brother. I have a nephew who is disables and my brother and his wife do a remarkable job taking care of him. I know the demands on both time and psyche are herculean.

Clearly, your brother is more fortunate than most.

I believe Obdis’ remarks were meant to cover the majority of family situations.

43 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:39:33pm

re: #39 darthstar

Trap, or whatever the oldest boy’s name is, joined the Army to avoid jail.
Bristol, the oldest daughter, got knocked up by a guy whose mother sold prescription meds illegally and barely finished high school. She now runs her on PR firm and preaches abstinence.
Willow, the next daughter, had a recent run-in with the law for breaking and entering…the other kids got busted, but she didn’t.

So far, Piper and Trig are still clean.

And that is so unusual? Sounds to be like a million other families- including progressive ones.

44 Obdicut  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:39:38pm

re: #40 windsagio

I favor at-home care with some structure so that they can get out, learn, and interact with others. I don’t like it when parents simply keep their child at home to ‘protect’ them. That’s all I really meant.

And about the children shaming part; I was making a generality. Many siblings can rise above that, but I’m talking about how it plays out in the social atmosphere of children. Other children certainly will be cruel about it. Whether that shame sticks is up to the child in question.

45 darthstar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:41:44pm

re: #43 researchok

And that is so unusual? Sounds to be like a million other families- including progressive ones.

Yes, that’s true.

46 Obdicut  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:42:06pm

re: #43 researchok

And that is so unusual? Sounds to be like a million other families- including progressive ones.

Funny moment at dinner the other day, when my brother revealed how often he’d actually been arrested. “Often” was his first description.

47 njdhockeyfan  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:42:09pm

Giving Palin a hard time and questioning her politics is fair game as it is with any politician. Everyone knows a politicians family, especially the kids, is off limits. It’s been like that for as longs as I can remember. The incredible disgusting obsession with the Palin kids is just down right wrong.

48 windsagio  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:42:20pm

re: #42 researchok

It depends on the situation, I also think people don’t quite know how much money is paid out for direct care. If you know what you’re doing, you can make caring for a disabled adult a full-time job.

Even with times being tough, in our families case, we get (I think) $1200/month for care, and additionally could charge board and rent out of his SSI (note that my parents don’t do that).

There’s emotional factors of course, and occasoinal abuses, but hte same thing happens in group homes as well. (believe me, the stories I could tell you guys would horrify. That being said, its mostly low level neglect and a massive amount of lack of fulfillment you see in homes. Stuff like ‘oh I don’t wanna go out, so the clients are staying home tonight, who cares if they want to go out to the dance, I hate doing it!’)

49 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:42:32pm

re: #39 darthstar

Trap, or whatever the oldest boy’s name is, joined the Army to avoid jail.
Bristol, the oldest daughter, got knocked up by a guy whose mother sold prescription meds illegally and barely finished high school. She now runs her on PR firm and preaches abstinence.
Willow, the next daughter, had a recent run-in with the law for breaking and entering…the other kids got busted, but she didn’t.

So far, Piper and Trig are still clean.

By the way, Al Gore’s daughters have been arrested for DUI, minor in possession. That does not include the ‘running around’ drama. Are the Gores bad parents too?

50 Four More Tears  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:43:20pm

ot: GOP Candidate: Obama And Carnahan Want To Take Away Your Chance To Find The Lord

Part of that freedom — when you take a government and you impose, and take away all your choices. One of the choices you take away is to find the Lord. And to find your savior.

And that’s one of the things that’s most destructive about the growth of government. It’s this taking away of that freedom. The freedom — the ultimate freedom, to find your salvation, to get your salvation. And to find Christ, for me and you.

And I think that’s one of the things that we have to be very, very aware of. That the Obama Administration and Congressman Carnahan are doing to us.

Obama has Jesus stashed away in Gitmo or something? I don’t get it…

51 Kragar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:43:47pm

re: #46 Obdicut

Funny moment at dinner the other day, when my brother revealed how often he’d actually been arrested. “Often” was his first description.

A question that comes up during security interviews, “Have you ever been convicted of a crime?”

Convicted? No.

52 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:44:28pm

re: #49 researchok

By the way, Al Gore’s daughters have been arrested for DUI, minor in possession. That does not include the ‘running around’ drama. Are the Gores bad parents too?

shhhh…it’s an inconvenient truth.

53 darthstar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:44:54pm

re: #49 researchok

By the way, Al Gore’s daughters have been arrested for DUI, minor in possession. That does not include the ‘running around’ drama. Are the Gores bad parents too?

Goredwin’s law.

54 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:45:27pm

re: #53 darthstar

Goredwin’s law.

Line of the day.

55 webevintage  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:45:54pm

re: #49 researchok

By the way, Al Gore’s daughters have been arrested for DUI, minor in possession. That does not include the ‘running around’ drama. Are the Gores bad parents too?

They are if they used their position to keep their kids from having to pay fines or do time or even make restitution.

56 windsagio  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:45:57pm

re: #44 Obdicut

Haha, sorry, I’m sure you can tell I have some vested in this :D

It varies alot from person to person of course,

And I absolutely agree with your first statement (my favorite client ever, his parents kept him isolated at home until he was in his late ’60s. Part of what I loved was seeing him finally break out into the world and start growing as a person. I still remember going shopping and him wanting to get a hawaiian shirt, instead of the gray slacks and sweater vests his parents insisted on. The manager kinda cheated and gave me the shirt after he died too, I love it.)

*cough*

The other part maybe we were just lucky or hardened or something. We ran from when I was a little kid, and my brother had a habit of pulling his unit out on the street whenever he had to take a leak. Can’t remember ever feeling embarassed tho’, maybe I was just used to it >>

57 Jack Burton  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:46:37pm

re: #39 darthstar

Trap, or whatever the oldest boy’s name is, joined the Army to avoid jail.
Bristol, the oldest daughter, got knocked up by a guy whose mother sold prescription meds illegally and barely finished high school. She now runs her on PR firm and preaches abstinence.
Willow, the next daughter, had a recent run-in with the law for breaking and entering…the other kids got busted, but she didn’t.

So far, Piper and Trig are still clean.

“A parent’s only as good as their dumbest kid. If one wins a Nobel Prize but the other gets robbed by a hooker, you failed.” -ShitMyDadSays

58 darthstar  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:47:34pm

Okay…saved by Climate Change. Buh-bye Palin thread.

59 Gus  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:48:29pm

re: #58 darthstar

Okay…saved by Climate Change. Buh-bye Palin thread.

Al Gore comes up in 3, 2, 1…

//

60 njdhockeyfan  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:48:34pm

Time for dinner. See ya later maybe…

61 HoosierHoops  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:48:50pm

re: #46 Obdicut

Funny moment at dinner the other day, when my brother revealed how often he’d actually been arrested. “Often” was his first description.

I got caught in College at Goat’s Rock on the Beach at 3am naked as a jaybird doing the wild thing with a girl by the beach patrol…The whole thing with the bright lights on you can be disconserting to say the least..
The first question they asked me was if I had any ID?
You mean like a effen birth mark or something?
Where are your clothes?
You know..I was just asking that very same question..
Turned out to be a long night

62 alexknyc  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:49:14pm

re: #57 ArchangelMichael

“A parent’s only as good as their dumbest kid. If one wins a Nobel Prize but the other gets robbed by a hooker, you failed.” -ShitMyDadSays

Updinged.

And re-posted for hilarity.

63 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:49:59pm

It happens in every family: No matter how well you are doing, some great aunt knows a 3rd cousin ‘Pauly’ in California who is doing better than you.

If you win the Nobel Prize in Literature, Cousin Pauly either wins the Nobel Prize in Physics or own 4 insurance companies.

64 Obdicut  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:50:26pm

re: #61 HoosierHoops

My very drunk answer to the “Do you have ID?” question one night:

“No, but I know who I am.”

Cop let me go with a chuckle.

65 elizajane  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:52:53pm

re: #43 researchok

And that is so unusual? Sounds to be like a million other families- including progressive ones.

Sorry, but her family-management record is pretty bad. Many parents, taxed only with being mayor of a dinky town with remarkably few responsibilities, could have managed better than she did. Saying “oh gosh, lots of people mess up their kids” does not excuse her.

66 ReamWorks SKG  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:53:53pm

I suspect, perhaps unfairly, that the “Trig Truthers” know their story is very implausible, but do it as a sort of revenge for the Birthers.

67 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:54:01pm

re: #64 Obdicut

My very drunk answer to the “Do you have ID?” question one night:

“No, but I know who I am.”

Cop let me go with a chuckle.

ahahahah rad

68 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:54:41pm

Wow. In a thread whose topic is about how a certain blogger should stop talking about his obsession with Palin’s kid, we do seem to be talking a lot about, um, Palin’s kids.

I am no fan of Palin, but I think all the “speculation” going on about her kids’ futures vis a vis her parenting is kind of bizarre.

Late last year I lost a young friend to a drug overdose. His mom was an evil, twisted psycho who had been fucking up his head from day one. He eventually turned to pills and alcohol as a way to deal with her and the crap she shoved into his head, and no matter how much I tried to help him break out of that, he died.

I have a feeling that Palin’s kids will fare far better.

69 researchok  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 2:55:30pm

re: #65 elizajane

Sorry, but her family-management record is pretty bad. Many parents, taxed only with being mayor of a dinky town with remarkably few responsibilities, could have managed better than she did. Saying “oh gosh, lots of people mess up their kids” does not excuse her.

With a little effort I could come up with bad family management records of ten of other politicians, on both sides of the aisle.

The Palins are remarkably unremarkable that way.

70 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:01:03pm

re: #69 researchok

With a little effort I could come up with bad family management records of ten of other politicians, on both sides of the aisle.

The Palins are remarkably unremarkable that way.

I couldn’t care less about the Palin’s family situation or whether she’s a great mother. A lot of ambitious people with successful careers are not the hottest parents, who cares. I’m not voting for a candidate to raise kids. Just like I don’t give a shit about whether a presidential candidate was in the military or not, I could not care less.

I just don’t want to see Palin’s superfans swinging around that Moral Orel family values bat at Democrats :D

71 windsagio  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:05:47pm

re: #70 WindUpBird

I couldn’t care less about the Palin’s family situation or whether she’s a great mother. A lot of ambitious people with successful careers are not the hottest parents, who cares. I’m not voting for a candidate to raise kids. Just like I don’t give a shit about whether a presidential candidate was in the military or not, I could not care less.

I just don’t want to see Palin’s superfans swinging around that Moral Orel family values bat at Democrats :D

Oop, moral orel reference!

72 reine.de.tout  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:15:24pm

re: #38 windsagio

With all due respect, his parents can keep him, and he can still have a fulfilling and wonderful life.

The idea that you have to put a disabled person into a residential facility is deeply unfair to the individuals. You’re basicly saying then ‘they can’t do it on their own, and their parents can’t deal with the challenges involved’.

Sometimes that is true, absolutely, and thats why group homes exist.

I work in group homes, and I have a brother whose disabled. As long as my sister and I are capable of providing for his care, he will never be in a group home. We can do better for him than that.

No, you’ve misunderstood me.

My concern wasn’t that he was at home and not a residential facility.

My concern was that they didn’t allow him to get any sort of schooling or training whatsoever.

There are jobs mentally handicapped individuals can do and from what I’ve seen of those doing the jobs, it’s wonderful for them to have that sense of earning their own money, interacting with other people.

They’ve kept this young man from doing that, to his detriment, IMO.

73 Neo_  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:19:32pm

It’s perfectly reasonable for Andrew Sullivan to be obsessed with Trig, since Andrew knows that Trig will, in the future, use a “time machine” to go back in time to become Andrew’s father.

74 palomino  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:22:21pm

re: #36 Spare O’Lake

Actually she’s not much of a “victim” at all. Like it or not, she’s doing just fine financially and she seems to be extremely popular too.

I guess that depends on how you define “extremely.” Palin’s popular with the base, but then so are Limbaugh and Malkin. Popular with the rest of the country? Not so much.

75 windsagio  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:22:56pm

re: #72 reine.de.tout

Ehehe, I agree with what you meant then, sorry :D

Like I said, very very important issue to me ;)

76 ReamWorks SKG  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:29:07pm

I didn’t know a lot about the whole “trig truther” movement, so I did some googling. For example

[Link: open.salon.com…]

It seems that they use the same tactics the “Birthers” use…

77 Red Pencil  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:31:43pm

re: #69 researchok

With a little effort I could come up with bad family management records of ten of other politicians, on both sides of the aisle.

The Palins are remarkably unremarkable that way.

Also may I state for the record that children are not entirely a product of “management” and that how well they do or don’t turn out is not all to be credited (or blamed) to their parents’ management style. I have seen some really objectively great, involved parents, and some of their kids still exhibit extremely poor judgement in relationships, substance abuse, academics, you name it; and some objectively terrible parents with children whose judgement, behavior, and achievements are much better than that of the kids with the “perfect” parents. Children are NOT empty little tabulae rasae who can or will be filled up with whatever the parent writes there. Sometimes that is a relief and sometimes it’s a real pain.

78 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:31:59pm

re: #5 webevintage

Hate her.
Hate. Her. So. Much.
But I don’t give a shit if the kid is hers or not (though I hate the way she carts him around like a piece of luggage) and Sully needs to just move on.

Yeah.

First, I’ve seen nothing to convince me that Trig is not, in fact, Sarah’s son.

Second, there are a number of non-criminal, eminently sane reasons why women and men sometimes claim children as their own who are in fact someone else’s. If Trig was not taken from a pram in front of the Wasilla CVS, this is no one’s business but the people involved’s.

This is not my business, or Sullivan’s.

79 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:32:55pm

re: #6 teleskiguy

While I do think that Sully has kinda lost it on the whole Trig thing, I think he has a point when he raises the issue of Saint Sarah using little Trig as a political prop. Trig needs to be cared for and doted over at home, not brought along the campaign trail and raised in the air at rallies like something out of The Lion King.

Yeah, that’s annoying, but it has nothing to do with the kid’s parentage, it’s just what happens when you are the infant son of someone on the campaign trail who’s making big hay out of being a Mom.

80 garhighway  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:33:58pm

re: #78 SanFranciscoZionist

Yeah.

First, I’ve seen nothing to convince me that Trig is not, in fact, Sarah’s son.

Second, there are a number of non-criminal, eminently sane reasons why women and men sometimes claim children as their own who are in fact someone else’s. If Trig was not taken from a pram in front of the Wasilla CVS, this is no one’s business but the people involved’s.

This is not my business, or Sullivan’s.

I absolutely agree. This is none of our business, and I find it odd that it is even the subject of a thread.

Families are off limits. Period.

81 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:34:25pm

re: #7 mush57

the sad thing about Trig is that his Moron mother named him
after his Genetic Defect. (look up triG) My slavic heritage has
inured me to last names like “no hand” or “no eye” but to give
a kid a “given Name” like “Dumbo” or “Cripple”. I find grotesque.
May she rot in some location I will not venture to name.

It’s a variant of Trygg, or Tryggve. Nice old Norse name.

82 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:35:58pm

re: #23 Spare O’Lake

Get help.

For hating Palin? If hating politicians is an illness, there’s a lot of sick people on this blog.

83 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:39:08pm

re: #73 Neo_

It’s perfectly reasonable for Andrew Sullivan to be obsessed with Trig, since Andrew knows that Trig will, in the future, use a “time machine” to go back in time to become Andrew’s father.

So Andrew is Sarah Palin’s grandson?

He ought not to talk about his granny like that.

84 Red Pencil  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 3:43:48pm

re: #78 SanFranciscoZionist


If Trig was not taken from a pram in front of the Wasilla CVS, this is no one’s business but the people involved’s.



But it’s ok to ask the question, isn’t it? WAS Trig taken from a pram in front of the Wasilla CVS? It’s ok to discuss the question, right? /

85 mush57  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 4:08:58pm

re # 81

Right, She named the kid after an early president of the United Nations

Spare me, She knew she was having a Downs Child She heard the nurses calling him a “trig Child” It’s what they call them, and thought it was cute.
Or, possibly, as you suggest, Mrs. “I can see Russia” is secretly a Norse scholar.

Take your pick.

86 RogueOne  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 4:31:02pm

re: #70 WindUpBird

I couldn’t care less about the Palin’s family situation or whether she’s a great mother. A lot of ambitious people with successful careers are not the hottest parents, who cares. I’m not voting for a candidate to raise kids. Just like I don’t give a shit about whether a presidential candidate was in the military or not, I could not care less.

I just don’t want to see Palin’s superfans swinging around that Moral Orel family values bat at Democrats :D

But you are voting for the commander in chief and his military record, or the lack thereof, is pertinent. It may not be tops on your list of needed qualifications but it should definitely be a consideration.

87 Stanghazi  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 4:36:15pm

I’m late to the party, but one thing about Palin…

She lies like a fucking rug. And doesn’t care. To me, this shows a bizarre personality, either she found her calling during 2008 - the “rabble rouser” and is continuing that path with her rabble rousing lies, or she’s a messed up person.

To blatantly lie about big and little things is concerning either way. Hello!

88 StarCylon2  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 4:46:36pm

re: #85 mush57

Where do your children’s names come from?

TODD: Sarah’s parents were coaches and the whole family was involved in track and I was an athlete in high school, so with our first-born, I was, like, ‘Track!’ Bristol is named after Bristol Bay. That’s where I grew up, that’s where we commercial fish. Willow is a community there in Alaska. And then Piper, you know, there’s just not too many Pipers out there and it’s a cool name. And Trig is a Norse name for “strength.”


http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20222685_2,00.html

89 wrenchwench  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 4:56:49pm

re: #88 StarCylon2

Welcome, hatchling. Thanks for the factual reference.

90 shai_au  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 5:39:55pm

I think Sully’s main problem with the Trig thing was related to the lack of media scrutiny that Palin was getting in general. She got nominated, didn’t talk to the press for ages, and somehow managed to mostly keep it that way up until the election.

He thinks there should have been more outrage over this. And that the press are just gutless in general. So maybe this obsession over Trig was him trying to provide the sort of scrutiny that he felt was lacking in the mainstream media.

It does make him look a bit unhinged, I’ll admit. Has he written about it recently though? I honestly don’t know - haven’t looked at his site in a while.

91 Timmeh  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 6:27:01pm

Totally agree.

It’s the other Birtherism.

92 Cato the Elder  Tue, Jul 13, 2010 7:18:19pm

Count me among the people who know the difference between “honing” and “homing”.

93 ThomasLite  Wed, Jul 14, 2010 4:12:37am

re: #92 Cato the Elder

Count me among the people who know the difference between “honing” and “homing”.

and yet another falls to the false security of a spellchecker.


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