What Global Warming?

Environment • Views: 10,885

Greenland glacier calves island four times the size of Manhattan.

ScienceDaily (Aug. 7, 2010) — A University of Delaware researcher reports that an “ice island” four times the size of Manhattan has calved from Greenland’s Petermann Glacier. The last time the Arctic lost such a large chunk of ice was in 1962.

“In the early morning hours of August 5, 2010, an ice island four times the size of Manhattan was born in northern Greenland,” said Andreas Muenchow, associate professor of physical ocean science and engineering at the University of Delaware’s College of Earth, Ocean, and Environment. Muenchow’s research in Nares Strait, between Greenland and Canada, is supported by the National Science Foundation (NSF).

Satellite imagery of this remote area at 81 degrees N latitude and 61 degrees W longitude, about 620 miles [1,000 km] south of the North Pole, reveals that Petermann Glacier lost about one-quarter of its 43-mile long [70 km] floating ice-shelf.

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235 comments
1 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 1:41:53pm

This might be a good time to share again a conversation I had with my mother a while ago.

I said “Look. All I want is for Social Security and Medicare to last long enough to take care of you and Dad. When Husband and I are old, the kids can, I don’t know, put us on an ice floe or something.”

My mother said, “Hon, when you’re old, there aren’t going to be any more ice floes. They’ll have all melted.”

“Dammnit!!” I said.

2 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 1:45:03pm

And that is how global warming ruined my retirement plans.

3 tradewind  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 1:47:05pm

re: #2 SanFranciscoZionist
Wonder how that guy who sells arctic ice cubes for people’s cocktails is making out…..//

4 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 1:48:59pm

Strangely apropos:

The annual World Sauna Championships in Finland has ended in tragedy with the death of one of the finalists, the organisers [sic] said.

Russian finalist Vladimir Ladyzhensky and Finnish rival Timo Kaukonen were both taken to hospital after collapsing and Mr Ladyzhensky later died.

The event, which has been running since 1999, requires participants to withstand 110C for as long as possible.

Still pictures from the event released by news wires showed the pair being treated after having collapsed, apparently suffering burns.

5 allegro  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 1:50:52pm

re: #4 goddamnedfrank

Somehow that made me think of the Darwin awards.

6 Killgore Trout  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 1:51:16pm
four times the size of Manhattan.

Let’s hope nobody tries to build a mosque on it.

7 Lidane  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 1:55:37pm

re: #6 Killgore Trout

Let’s hope nobody tries to build a mosque on it.

On the other hand, if Fred Phelps and his minions want to build a church there and leave the States, I’d be all for it. Heh.

8 Winny Spencer  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 1:57:32pm

re: #6 Killgore Trout

But someone should encourage Gellar and Spencer to organize a rally there just in case.

9 Four More Tears  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:05:29pm

But but but.. the earth just goes through changes!

/

10 theheat  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:07:04pm
The last time the Arctic lost such a large chunk of ice was in 1962.

As the deniers will say, “See, this is nothing new. What’s all the hysteria about?” As just about anyone in front of a microphone from the Right will say, “No worries, God will take care of us. “

11 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:11:38pm

re: #10 theheat

As the deniers will say, “See, this is nothing new. What’s all the hysteria about?” As just about anyone in front of a microphone from the Right will say, “No worries, God will take care of us. “

You know, it’s funny. The political religious right is constantly threatening folks with God’s wrath, but at the same time, they seem to deny that we could actually upset God enough to inspire Her to let us take our fair lumps for abusing our ecosystem.

12 bratwurst  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:12:00pm

re: #10 theheat

As just about anyone in front of a microphone from the Right will say, “No worries, God will take care of us. “

This is literally what Limbaugh is saying every day…after he is done calling global warming a hoax, of course.

13 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:12:03pm

re: #7 Lidane

On the other hand, if Fred Phelps and his minions want to build a church there and leave the States, I’d be all for it. Heh.

In that case, I must admit I wouldn’t mind that that particular ice floe would melt at an accelerated rate.

This wouldn’t be a bad idea in general — having AGW deniers living on Arctic ice flows and monitor the evolution of their beliefs.
///

14 Virginia Plain  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:13:39pm

re: #10 theheat

As the deniers will say, “See, this is nothing new. What’s all the hysteria about?” As just about anyone in front of a microphone from the Right will say, “No worries, God will take care of us. “

Yeah, He sure will, by destroying the majority of us. Recall the story of the flood.

15 Four More Tears  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:14:21pm

Christ. I just got a call from a friend of mine. His brother’s, who used to be my best friend, wife’s water broke last night. Apparently she has a lot of allergies to medication and they almost lost her and the baby. It’s still not looking all that great. This sucks.

16 Funky_Gibbon  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:15:28pm

re: #10 theheat

As the deniers will say, “See, this is nothing new. What’s all the hysteria about?” As just about anyone in front of a microphone from the Right will say, “No worries, God will take care of us. “

You beat me to it. I was going to post about the danger of posting this with such as open challenge of a thread title as ‘What Global Warming?’ when the article says a similar thing happened in 1962. That just gives the deniers something to focus on when it comes to pretending all is well.

It might have been better to make it clear that this has some in the wake of US scientists showing that eleven indicators of climate change are all pointing to a warmer Earth and that one of those indicators was an increase in loss of ice.

17 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:17:01pm

re: #15 JasonA

Christ. I just got a call from a friend of mine. His brother’s, who used to be my best friend, wife’s water broke last night. Apparently she has a lot of allergies to medication and they almost lost her and the baby. It’s still not looking all that great. This sucks.

Hang in there. Crap.

18 Four More Tears  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:18:13pm

re: #17 SanFranciscoZionist

Hang in there. Crap.

Yeah, the two of us had been out of touch for a few years. We were starting to talk more since my mom had her accident. And now this.

19 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:29:50pm

re: #15 JasonA

{{JasonA}}

20 pharmmajor  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:34:34pm

Ooh shit…

21 pharmmajor  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:35:12pm

re: #15 JasonA

Christ. I just got a call from a friend of mine. His brother’s, who used to be my best friend, wife’s water broke last night. Apparently she has a lot of allergies to medication and they almost lost her and the baby. It’s still not looking all that great. This sucks.

Oh man, I hope that she and the baby are getting all the care they need.

22 HoosierHoops  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:36:21pm

re: #15 JasonA

Christ. I just got a call from a friend of mine. His brother’s, who used to be my best friend, wife’s water broke last night. Apparently she has a lot of allergies to medication and they almost lost her and the baby. It’s still not looking all that great. This sucks.

I’m deeply sorry…We lost a child during birth.. It is deeply painful..More than anything experienced in my life…I’m pulling for your friend

23 Four More Tears  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:42:20pm

re: #22 HoosierHoops

I’m deeply sorry…We lost a child during birth.. It is deeply painful..More than anything experienced in my life…I’m pulling for your friend

Thanks, Hoops. I appreciate it.

On a lighter note, my mom is doing much better. Her therapy is going well and they expect her to be able to get to the bathroom on her own next week. You have no idea how much she’s looking forward to that.

24 HoosierHoops  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:49:57pm

re: #23 JasonA

Thanks, Hoops. I appreciate it.

On a lighter note, my mom is doing much better. Her therapy is going well and they expect her to be able to get to the bathroom on her own next week. You have no idea how much she’s looking forward to that.

LOL.. I can relate..I blew my ACL out on my left knee when I was in High School..Having your mom take you to the bathroom is the most humiliating thing in the world as a teen

25 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:49:59pm

The haves are retirees who were once state or municipal workers. Their seemingly guaranteed and ever-escalating monthly pension benefits are breaking budgets nationwide.

The have-nots are taxpayers who don’t have generous pensions. Their 401(k)s or individual retirement accounts have taken a real beating in recent years and are not guaranteed. And soon, many of those people will be paying higher taxes or getting fewer state services as their states put more money aside to cover those pension checks.

bail out state pension funds?…CO is trying to draw the line that other states won’t

[Link: www.nytimes.com…]

26 Four More Tears  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:53:27pm

re: #24 HoosierHoops

LOL.. I can relate..I blew my ACL out on my left knee when I was in High School..Having your mom take you to the bathroom is the most humiliating thing in the world as a teen

I broke my ankle when I was a young teen. I know what you mean.

27 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:53:35pm

re: #24 HoosierHoops

LOL.. I can relate..I blew my ACL out on my left knee when I was in High School..Having your mom take you to the bathroom is the most humiliating thing in the world as a teen

I burned myself up years ago…casts covering grafts on my arms prevented me from feeding myself…the staff and my dad spoon fed me every day…I cleaned up my number twos with a wet washcloth wrapped around a back scratcher…you do what you gotta do

28 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:57:51pm

re: #15 JasonA

Oh, man. Wow.

29 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:58:46pm

re: #24 HoosierHoops
I blew my ACL out on my left knee

re: #26 JasonA
I broke my ankle

re: #27 albusteve
I burned myself

Wusses
I got a paper cut last week!

30 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 2:59:35pm

About the ice-island.

What happened in 1962 (the year of my nativity) that made a chunk that large fall off?

31 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:01:32pm

Can the ice-island be towed somewhere arid?

32 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:03:11pm

re: #31 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Can the ice-island be towed somewhere arid?

It’s very hard to tow a piece of a glacier over the Mojave dessert

(don’t even ask me how I know that)

33 Randall Gross  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:05:29pm

re: #30 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

About the ice-island.

What happened in 1962 (the year of my nativity) that made a chunk that large fall off?

Ward Hunt Ice shelf, I only remember this because it’s a perennial source of papers at UofA…
[Link: pubs.aina.ucalgary.ca…]

34 Randall Gross  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:06:48pm

re: #33 Thanos

Oops — speculation is that it was tidal and seismic forces…

35 Randall Gross  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:10:51pm

More on the Ward Hunt event

[Link: www.igsoc.org…]

36 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:11:05pm

food buzz…after 6 years I’ve found the best burrito in northern NM, and possibly the entire world…
an elderly woman that speaks no Gringo sells them out of a trailor at a strip a mile from me

finely chopped steak and plain cooked pintos…
just the right amount of white chedder…
smothered with a slurry of chopped onion, lettuce and tomato….
but she teases the veggies with small amount a mild spicy sauce like stuff of some sort….
out of this world…
a hefty handful of a meal for $4

37 Four More Tears  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:13:21pm

re: #36 albusteve

food buzz…after 6 years I’ve found the best burrito in northern NM, and possibly the entire world…
an elderly woman that speaks no Gringo sells them out of a trailor at a strip a mile from me

finely chopped steak and plain cooked pintos…
just the right amount of white chedder…
smothered with a slurry of chopped onion, lettuce and tomato…
but she teases the veggies with small amount a mild spicy sauce like stuff of some sort…
out of this world…
a hefty handful of a meal for $4

Okay, but is she legal?

/

38 Cato the Elder  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:13:22pm

re: #29 sattv4u2

I blew my ACL out on my left knee

re: #26 JasonA
I broke my ankle

re: #27 albusteve
I burned myself

Wusses
I got a paper cut last week!

I got a splinter yesterday.

39 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:14:23pm

brazen border insanity…everybody is pissed off now…left , right, middle

Immigration reform advocates blasted Democrats on Friday for pushing a $600 million border security bill through the Senate, accusing them of trying to placate Republicans who will never be satisfied with the government’s enforcement efforts.

Read more: [Link: www.politico.com…]

40 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:16:11pm

OT

A plug here for a retailer that is giving me some old fashioned customer service.
Wifey left a courtesy light on in one of our cars last week while we were away. Of course the battery (which is several years old) was dead. It wouldn’t take a jump and I had lent my charger to a friend (who had lent it to someone who let someone else use it who ,,,,)

Anywho. I took the battery out of the car yesterday before heading to work. I stopped at three separate garages along the way to check it and/or leave it to be charged. All of them stated “we don’t do that”. So this morning I took it to Advanced Auto Parts on my way to work. Not only did they check it (it’s still good) but they are charging it ,, FOR FREE,, without me even having to buy anything else!

41 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:17:02pm

re: #36 albusteve

a hefty handful of a meal for $4

I’ll send you $40
Mail me 10 of them

42 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:17:29pm

re: #27 albusteve

I burned myself up years ago…casts covering grafts on my arms prevented me from feeding myself…the staff and my dad spoon fed me every day…I cleaned up my number twos with a wet washcloth wrapped around a back scratcher…you do what you gotta do

re: #36 albusteve

food buzz…after 6 years I’ve found the best burrito in northern NM, and possibly the entire world…
an elderly woman that speaks no Gringo sells them out of a trailor at a strip a mile from me

finely chopped steak and plain cooked pintos…
just the right amount of white chedder…
smothered with a slurry of chopped onion, lettuce and tomato…
but she teases the veggies with small amount a mild spicy sauce like stuff of some sort…
out of this world…
a hefty handful of a meal for $4

Wow. Consecutive posts. :)

43 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:18:04pm

I do not have a problem with AGW. Came around quite a while ago I do believe it is real.

I have a difficulty blaming something with AGW that also happened almost fifty years ago.

44 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:18:05pm

re: #37 JasonA

Okay, but is she legal?

/

I hope so, but probably not….illegals are flooding into NM from AZ, but there is no work here either…what a fucked up mess
she charges a measly $4 for her burritos but I give her $6….it’s all I can do

45 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:18:16pm

re: #38 Cato the Elder

I got a splinter yesterday.

As Crocodile Dundee would say

“Thats not a splinter ,,,, now THATS a splinter !!”

[Link: www.google.com…]

46 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:18:44pm

re: #40 sattv4u2

Yep. They do that.

47 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:20:29pm

This is making me hungry. I’m gonna grab myself a not-quite-so-amazing-but-still-pretty-good bagel with cheese downstairs.

48 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:21:03pm

re: #46 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Yep. They do that.

NOW you tell me!

49 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:21:43pm

By the way… regarding Michelle Obama’s vacation. In every picture of her I am seeing? She looks freakin’ fantastic.

50 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:23:10pm
51 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:24:33pm

re: #41 sattv4u2

a hefty handful of a meal for $4

I’ll send you $40
Mail me 10 of them

I used to by frozen, homemade Cajun food from some guy down in the swamps in LA a couple times a years…I’d send him $100 up front and he’s mail me all kinds of stuff, with instructions where needed…only thing missing was the Abita…those were the good old days when I was a fat cat

52 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:24:51pm

re: #48 sattv4u2

You didn’t mention it before.

53 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:25:44pm

Back to the hospital. He’s still with us.

54 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:26:02pm

re: #52 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You didn’t mention it before.

You’re in sales. You should anticipate my needs

55 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:26:43pm

re: #53 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Back to the hospital. He’s still with us.

Stay strong for your daughter my friend

56 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:27:28pm

re: #51 albusteve

I used to by frozen, homemade Cajun food from some guy down in the swamps in LA a couple times a years…I’d send him $100 up front and he’s mail me all kinds of stuff, with instructions where needed…only thing missing was the Abita…those were the good old days when I was a fat cat

Lotsa frozen gator!!

(actually,,, gator meat is pretty good)

57 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:32:18pm

re: #56 sattv4u2

Lotsa frozen gator!!

(actually,,, gator meat is pretty good)

yeah…that was back in the early 90s…it was quite remarkable at the time, now the net is flooded with that stuff…and bbq gator tail is delicious

one time my dad was hanging around and said he’d like to see the Braves play at the old County Stadium before they moved…ten minutes later he had will call tickets….blew him away

58 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:36:04pm

stupid new dept….daddy’s little girl

Friends of actor Laurence Fishburne attempted to help him block the release of his daughter’s pornographic video by buying all of the DVDs for $1M, according to a new report from TMZ.

[Link: www.foxnews.com…]


that’s ONE MILLION dollars

59 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:38:08pm

re: #58 albusteve

stupid new dept…daddy’s little girl

Friends of actor Laurence Fishburne attempted to help him block the release of his daughter’s pornographic video by buying all of the DVDs for $1M, according to a new report from TMZ.

[Link: www.foxnews.com…]

that’s ONE MILLION dollars

Montana Fishburne tells TMZ that her father, star of such films as “The Matrix,” “Mystic River” and “Mission Impossible III,” is “very upset” at her decision to appear in porn.

“I heard that he’s mad at me but I haven’t spoken to him yet. I feel pretty confident that I can work things out with him,” she said. “I think he wants to support me in everything I do, and though he sees this now as a negative, I believe in time he will view it as a positive

100% sad … just ,, damn!

60 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:39:11pm

re: #59 sattv4u2

Montana Fishburne tells TMZ that her father, star of such films as “The Matrix,” “Mystic River” and “Mission Impossible III,” is “very upset” at her decision to appear in porn.

“I heard that he’s mad at me but I haven’t spoken to him yet. I feel pretty confident that I can work things out with him,” she said. “I think he wants to support me in everything I do, and though he sees this now as a negative, I believe in time he will view it as a positive

100% sad … just ,, damn!

she’s another rich bonehead…no sympathy from me

61 wrenchwench  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:40:04pm

re: #59 sattv4u2

I think he wants to support me in everything I do…

Can’t be much more supportive than buying every damn copy of her work….

62 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:46:51pm

Trash Drudge, Bash Rush and Get a Career Boost?

Although it has long been well-known that journalists overwhelmingly have liberal leanings, they have typically claimed that it doesn’t affect their reporting. But the boost given Weigel’s career by the revelations that he advocated shaping news coverage to help President Obama pass his legislative agenda was extremely surprising.

the round pound continues

And all this has helped his journalism career. Politico ran this headline: “Losing a job to get ahead.After leaving The Washington Post, Weigel was immediately signed on as a contributor for MSNBC. Just last week he was officially hired back by The Washington Post to write for Slate.com. Two weekends ago Politico listed him first on its short list of five “media stars.”

[Link: www.foxnews.com…]

63 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:48:33pm

re: #60 albusteve

Seems like she’s a big girl, and can do what she wants.

64 wrenchwench  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:49:18pm

Heh. Speaking of needing support, the local republicans just sent me an email with this in it:

I recently asked for help with our Fund Raising events noted below. We didn’t get one person to Volunteer! This is not how we are going to win this year! There are Young Men and Women all over the Globe putting their Lives on the line for our Great Country. Yet we can’t find a few Volunteers to man a Booth at a Fair or other Event? So many of our Young are willing to put it all on the line for this Country, yet we can’t get a few Volunteers to help save our Country from a Socialist Take Over?

Boo Hoo!

Maybe if they used additional Random Capitalization….

65 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:49:43pm

re: #63 windsagio

Seems like she’s a big girl, and can do what she wants.

obviously, she did

66 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:50:11pm

re: #65 albusteve

yup, good way to give your dad the finger, too!

67 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:51:15pm

re: #64 wrenchwench

haha gotta feel bad for them, they’be been relying on the whackjobs for their voluenteering for so long that they do’nt knwo what to do now that they’re losing control of them >>

68 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:51:25pm

Pupils have no excuse turning up late in this school bus, it breathes fire and rockets along at 367mph.

[Link: www.foxnews.com…]

69 Killgore Trout  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:56:15pm

re: #62 albusteve

Sure, why not? It was silly of the Washington Post to fire him. He’s quite good. Here’s his new blog: [Link: www.slate.com…]

I don’t get why Fox of all people are outraged by a reporter having an opinion. Same goes for conservatives. They have no room to nitch about biased reporting. At least all of his stories were accurate which is far beyond the capabilities of Fox and right wing blogs.

70 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 3:56:24pm

re: #66 windsagio

yup, good way to give your dad the finger, too!

The real crime here is that she has a successful famous parent, and so presumably she’s throwing the caché that goes with her surname away. If she was a broke nobody who used porn to further her own agenda, get money for an education, save the family farm, whatever, we wouldn’t be having this discussion. Because the spectacle can’t keep everyone in their place if all the roles are clearly understood.

71 Obdicut  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:08:40pm

I recommend the book Ten Technologies To Fix Energy And Climate

It’s a really good, comprehensive overview of the technologies available to us to combat climate change, with their economic, social, political aspects taken into consideration.

72 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:10:21pm

more crap about Cuban travel restrictions…BO doesn’t seem to get it either

President Barack Obama may ease travel restrictions on Cuba, allowing more Americans to visit the island on educational and cultural trips, said a U.S. official who declined to be named because he isn’t authorized to speak on the subject.

blather….I don’t feel it’s within the States Dept authority to restrict travel at all to Cuba or anywhere else that is not a combat zone…by what logic can they do this?

[Link: www.bloomberg.com…]

73 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:17:35pm

re: #71 Obdicut

I recommend the book Ten Technologies To Fix Energy And Climate

It’s a really good, comprehensive overview of the technologies available to us to combat climate change, with their economic, social, political aspects taken into consideration.

too late….Greenland is already melting, and people are stupid
a twofer

74 Obdicut  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:18:44pm

re: #73 albusteve

too late…Greenland is already melting, and people are stupid
a twofer

No, Steve, it’s not actually too late. Climate change’s severity depends on how quickly we react to that.

I don’t get the point of simply being defeatist on this topic.

75 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:21:33pm

Dave Weigel on the Tea Parties…

[Link: www.washingtonpost.com…]

76 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:22:44pm

re: #74 Obdicut

No, Steve, it’s not actually too late. Climate change’s severity depends on how quickly we react to that.

I don’t get the point of simply being defeatist on this topic.

show me the beef and I’ll light up the old afterburner….most of this optimism has no basis in reality

77 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:22:48pm

re: #74 Obdicut

Its easier mainly, if we’re doomed anyways there’s no need to change your behavior.

Especially since it won’t get REALLY bad until most of us are in our graves.

/no I don’t actually support that idea, just describing it :P

78 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:23:02pm

re: #76 albusteve

TOMATO!

79 Obdicut  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:23:29pm

re: #76 albusteve

show me the beef and I’ll light up the old afterburner…most of this optimism has no basis in reality

Read the book, then, Steve, as I said.

80 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:23:48pm

re: #72 albusteve

I don’t feel it’s within the States Dept authority to restrict travel at all to Cuba or anywhere else that is not a combat zone…by what logic can they do this?

The State can’t actually forbid you to go to Cuba, it can only restrict direct flights, right? The rationale is the current trade embargo, but it would be interesting to know how that works legally.

81 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:24:32pm

re: #77 windsagio

Its easier mainly, if we’re doomed anyways there’s no need to change your behavior.

Especially since it won’t get REALLY bad until most of us are in our graves.

/no I don’t actually support that idea, just describing it :P

I’ve been conserving energy since before you were born….my behavior doesn’t need to change

82 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:24:35pm

re: #80 Nimed

I think they settle most challenges, like they used to do with the draft.

You can certainly go indirectly, people do it all the time.

83 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:24:49pm

re: #81 albusteve

Woah, tiger!

84 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:24:56pm

re: #79 Obdicut

Read the book, then, Steve, as I said.

are there cool pictures?

85 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:25:38pm

Re: Cuba

Oh, and the Airlines and such have no diesire to make waves, its not worth it to them.

86 HoosierHoops  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:25:56pm

re: #74 Obdicut

No, Steve, it’s not actually too late. Climate change’s severity depends on how quickly we react to that.

I don’t get the point of simply being defeatist on this topic.

When I was a kid..Water was polluted..Air was dirty and the Love Canal was par for the course..We cleaned up our world then and we can continue to look forward to being good stewards of our planet…We were charged with being good stewards and I’m effen sick of the defeatist with Environmental issues.
We can and will succeed living on this planet in a responsible manner.. effen those that just want to rape the planet for profit…

87 Obdicut  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:26:57pm

re: #86 HoosierHoops

Wise words.

I’d like to note that the book has a kindle version , for those of you who use that.

88 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:27:28pm

re: #80 Nimed

The State can’t actually forbid you to go to Cuba, it can only restrict direct flights, right? The rationale is the current trade embargo, but it would be interesting to know how that works legally.

yes, typically Americans simply fly there via Canada or some other country, like Jamaica…Santiago is 100 mi from their north shore

89 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:29:52pm

re: #81 albusteve

I’ve been conserving energy since before you were born…my behavior doesn’t need to change

“It’s all somebody else’s problem, hide your money.”

90 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:30:58pm

re: #89 goddamnedfrank

“It’s all somebody else’s problem, hide your gold.”

FiXt

91 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:30:59pm

re: #85 windsagio

Re: Cuba

By the way, I’ll probably be buying Sc2 by the end of the month. I’m not sure how I feel about the plot of the Terran campaign, though. Looks like it’s going to be Raynor saving Kerrigan from herself. Or something.

Medivacs are a cool idea. Sounds thoroughly unrealistic even for that universe (a healing beam?), but hey, who cares?

92 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:31:58pm

re: #89 goddamnedfrank

“It’s all somebody else’s problem, hide your money.”

what would you have me do?….immediately license Hyperions?

93 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:32:33pm

re: #91 Nimed

lol that’s how medics work anyways, when you think about it ;)

Re the campaign, if you think about it wrong, the dialogue and stuff will make you rage-crazy.

You have to think of it as being written like a ’70s B-western. (Yes its that hokey, but it totally works!) With that adjustment the VO and such are utterly charming :D

94 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:33:01pm

re: #93 windsagio

(wish I could edit)

The Raynor > Kerrigan thing fits with that theme too, now that I think about it :)

95 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:33:02pm

re: #82 windsagio

re: #88 albusteve

Turismo es revolución!

96 Four More Tears  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:33:51pm

re: #94 windsagio

(wish I could edit)

Saying it over and over again won’t make it happen.

97 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:34:58pm

re: #96 JasonA

spamming is so rude :D

98 HelloDare  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:35:03pm

I thought calving was the sign of a healthy, growing ice sheet and glacier. When a glacier meets the ocean, it snaps off. When an ice sheet extends far into the ocean from land, stresses build and it breaks off.

The last few minutes on the web seems confirmed my belief. Fracturing seems to be the cause. I guess melting can cause the ice sheet to thin and that could cause it to break, but I didn’t find any references to melting. But then, I’m may be googling using the wrong terms.

In any case while researching, I came upon this.

Breakthrough in the physics of ice-shelf break-up

99 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:35:34pm

re: #95 Nimed

re: #88 albusteve

Turismo es revolución!

I don’t speak Spanish but I intend on going to Cuba within a couple of years, hopefully

100 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:35:57pm

re: #99 albusteve

Its still a freaking amazing place.

101 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:37:30pm

I’m stoked, now that we know how to warm up a planet, we can teraform and colonize Mars!
/

102 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:37:43pm

re: #98 HelloDare

I thought calving was the sign of a healthy, growing ice sheet and glacier. When a glacier meets the ocean, it snaps off. When an ice sheet extends far into the ocean from land, stresses build and it breaks off.

The last few minutes on the web seems confirmed my belief. Fracturing seems to be the cause. I guess melting can cause the ice sheet to thin and that could cause it to break, but I didn’t find any references to melting. But then, I’m may be googling using the wrong terms.

In any case while researching, I came upon this.

Breakthrough in the physics of ice-shelf break-up

I just read where somebody is using lasers to measure pole ice, and indeed Antarctic ice caps are thinning

103 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:38:35pm

re: #101 Jetpilot1101

We need gravity generators first, mars is too small to hold onto a real atmosphere.

104 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:38:38pm

re: #100 windsagio

Its still a freaking amazing place.

well of course…like time travel, backwards

105 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:39:58pm

re: #93 windsagio

lol that’s how medics work anyways, when you think about it ;)

Re the campaign, if you think about it wrong, the dialogue and stuff will make you rage-crazy.

You have to think of it as being written like a ’70s B-western. (Yes its that hokey, but it totally works!) With that adjustment the VO and such are utterly charming :D

The Raynor > Kerrigan thing fits with that theme too, now that I think about it :)

Yeah, the cutscene music is chosen to give an western feel to the campaign.

Jim Raynor is a drunk, but a brilliant and inspiring leader! And infested Kerrigan now has organic high heels!

106 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:40:26pm

re: #103 windsagio

We need gravity generators first, mars is too small to hold onto a real atmosphere.

…and I suppose a warp drive to get us those gravity generators there quickly wouldn’t be a bad thing either.

107 Achilles Tang  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:41:16pm

I haven’t heard anything from/about Inhofe since the last cold snap. Is he still alive?

108 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:41:44pm

re: #105 Nimed

lol I hadn’t noticed the latter :D

Actually started playing the skirmish and MP some, its easy to forget how differently blizzard RTS’ play from the other modern titles (C&C 4, supcom2).

Trying to wrap my mind around the playstyle changes still :)

109 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:42:54pm

re: #106 Jetpilot1101

Those would be nice, yes.

We can’t do a manned mars mission at all until we get a new propulsion technology anyways (unless they were willing to go one-way)

110 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:44:58pm

re: #103 windsagio

We need gravity generators first, mars is too small to hold onto a real atmosphere.

Even theoretically, gravity generators are an extreme form of bullshit. What we need on Mars are massive domes and underground facilities. We also need to develop edible, energy rich fungal life forms.

Yep, this is the way to go on Mars.

111 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:46:18pm

re: #109 windsagio

Those would be nice, yes.

We can’t do a manned mars mission at all until we get a new propulsion technology anyways (unless they were willing to go one-way)

I tell you what, if the scientists discovered a planet out there that they were reasonably certain (85% or so) could support human life and they needed volunteers to go on a manned mission for 70 years or so in space to get to it; I’d volunteer. Even if it meant that I’d most likely die in space and I’d never see earth again, I think it would be awesome to know that your children would someday settle and live on a new planet.

112 Targetpractice  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:46:24pm

re: #109 windsagio

Those would be nice, yes.

We can’t do a manned mars mission at all until we get a new propulsion technology anyways (unless they were willing to go one-way)

Antimatter!

113 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:46:26pm

hahaha!….the answer to AGW is colonizing Mars!…where’s Obdicut?
show him your beef

114 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:47:16pm

re: #111 Jetpilot1101

I tell you what, if the scientists discovered a planet out there that they were reasonably certain (85% or so) could support human life and they needed volunteers to go on a manned mission for 70 years or so in space to get to it; I’d volunteer. Even if it meant that I’d most likely die in space and I’d never see earth again, I think it would be awesome to know that your children would someday settle and live on a new planet.

Ground Control to Major Tom….

115 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:48:00pm

re: #110 Nimed

:p that was kinda the point :p To terraform mars the way you usually think of it would take some ‘scifi to the point of magic’ technologies.

re: #112 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

We actually have reasonable technologies on that subject almost within reach… Round trip to mars is a bitch tho, due to escape velocity problems.

Its good to have realists and people who care about cost-effectiveness running NASA now;

116 Jetpilot1101  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:48:27pm

re: #114 albusteve

Ground Control to Major Tom…

Total pie in the sky dream but I think it would be cool.

117 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:48:35pm

re: #111 Jetpilot1101

I don’t think any of us would get picked for something like that, sadly >>

118 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:48:45pm

re: #116 Jetpilot1101

Totally!

119 Targetpractice  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:48:46pm

re: #114 albusteve

Ground Control to Major Tom…

Your circuit’s dead, there’s something wrong.

120 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:49:09pm

Man all we have to do is mention space travel, and the thread comes to life!

121 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:49:20pm

re: #108 windsagio

Wow, just did an image search of Sarah Kerrigan with the filter off. Only one naughty image, but man!

Anyway, here

122 Achilles Tang  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:49:26pm

re: #103 windsagio

We need gravity generators first, mars is too small to hold onto a real atmosphere.

Actually, what it needs is a magnetic field generator, like earth; but we could make it comfortable for at least a few million years if we wanted to, without that.

How long would you need?

123 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:50:23pm

re: #122 Naso Tang

Lol very good point :D

we could refresh occasionally too! (well if we had a source of air for it :p)

124 Political Atheist  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:50:24pm

re: #6 Killgore Trout

That will be a frozen day in h…. Uh wait a minute.

BTW put a page up from the Mt Baldy area, images from this morning’s hike.

125 Targetpractice  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:51:00pm

re: #115 windsagio

We actually have reasonable technologies on that subject almost within reach… Round trip to mars is a bitch tho, due to escape velocity problems.

Its good to have realists and people who care about cost-effectiveness running NASA now;

You want to get to Mars quick? Haul out NERVA. Or Project Orion.

126 Achilles Tang  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:51:45pm

re: #123 windsagio

Lol very good point :D

we could refresh occasionally too! (well if we had a source of air for it :p)

Where it came from originally. Comets galore nout there, if one looks far enough.

127 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:52:15pm

re: #124 Rightwingconspirator

That will be a frozen day in h… Uh wait a minute.

BTW put a page up from the Mt Baldy area, images from this morning’s hike.

mighty pretty…to bad it’s all going to roast then flow away in the floods

128 HoosierHoops  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:52:21pm

HOF ceremonies are on ESPN.. A highlight every year for me…I regret never being there in person to see it live…

129 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:52:27pm

re: #114 albusteve

Ground Control to Major Tom…

That’s the better song, but this one is the more appropriate:

Mars ain’t the kind of place to raise your kids
In fact it’s cold as hell
And there’s no one there to raise them if you did
And all this science I don’t understand
It’s just my job five days a week

130 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:53:11pm

re: #125 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Nerva is tragic, and Orion is stupid :)

131 austin_blue  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:53:59pm

re: #15 JasonA

Christ. I just got a call from a friend of mine. His brother’s, who used to be my best friend, wife’s water broke last night. Apparently she has a lot of allergies to medication and they almost lost her and the baby. It’s still not looking all that great. This sucks.

{{JasonA}}

Hang in there, my man.

132 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:54:27pm

re: #128 HoosierHoops

HOF ceremonies are on ESPN.. A highlight every year for me…I regret never being there in person to see it live…

been to the HOF as a tourist…the ceremony would be tres cool, especially this year..I’m really happy for Floyd Little

133 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:54:28pm

re: #130 windsagio

Nerva is tragic, and Orion is stupid :)

Except if you’re referring to Masters of Orion II.

134 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:55:39pm

re: #133 Nimed

Which I’ve actually been playing a lot again, or was until Starcraft came out!

Over the last few weeks if I dissapperaead from LGF for ~an hour (and it wasn’t a weekend), it was because I was trying a game on impossible with one of the default races ;)

135 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:55:43pm

re: #128 HoosierHoops

HOF ceremonies are on ESPN.. A highlight every year for me…I regret never being there in person to see it live…

get last weeks Sports Illustrated

What a great story about the effort to get Floyd Little in

136 Jimmah  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:56:00pm

Hi folks - good to see you all. It’s been a real busy time. Chores this week:

1. putting up shelves
2. assembling furniture
3. washing the blood out of ice-ski’s kimono
4. removing iceweasel bits from the kitchen
5. paint.

Oh yeah - ice-ski can’t type too well just now, so for the time being all contact will have to be through me. She says to tell you all hello!

137 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:56:03pm

re: #132 albusteve

been to the HOF as a tourist…the ceremony would be tres cool, especially this year..I’m really happy for Floyd Little

see 135

138 prairiefire  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:56:12pm

Where’s Stanley? You guys could talk sports.

139 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:56:29pm

re: #129 Nimed

Rocket Man

140 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:57:33pm

re: #136 Jimmah

Kinky!

(ok off to game for a while :p)

141 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:57:38pm

re: #138 prairiefire

Where’s Stanley? You guys could talk sports.

hahaha!
oooofff!

142 prairiefire  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:58:00pm

re: #136 Jimmah

Was she trying to bake bread?!?
Hope you both are settling in well.
The US~Scotland Union has commenced!

143 prairiefire  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:58:32pm

re: #141 albusteve

hahaha!
ooofff!

What? She loves the subject.

144 Targetpractice  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:59:01pm

re: #130 windsagio

Nerva is tragic, and Orion is stupid :)

Both could get us to Mars in a reasonable time. NERVA was ready to go the spacecraft design stage for a manned Mars mission when Nixon dropped the axe on manned spaceflight after Apollo 17. Project Orion could get us to not only Mars, but the outer solar system in far quicker times than currently possible.

Of course, to do either, we’d have to take the training wheels off at NASA and tell the “No Nukes” crowd to cram it.

145 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:59:14pm

re: #135 sattv4u2

get last weeks Sports Illustrated

What a great story about the effort to get Floyd Little in

to bad the same effort doesn’t seem to apply to Drew Pearson, or Chuck Howley for that matter

146 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 4:59:27pm

re: #125 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

You want to get to Mars quick? Haul out NERVA. Or Project Orion.

In The Starship and the Canoe one of Dyson’s colleagues describes Freeman’s final design variant as giant shit-storms in space because it would have used H-bombs surrounded with the astronauts’s own feces as the vaporized shockwave propellent.

147 austin_blue  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:00:04pm

re: #92 albusteve

what would you have me do?…immediately license Hyperions?

No. Demand that New Mexico harness it’s sunshine and wind. Throw in some 4G nukes as peaking units and you could be off coal in fifteen years.

148 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:01:15pm

re: #147 austin_blue

No. Demand that New Mexico harness it’s sunshine and wind. Throw in some 4G nukes as peaking units and you could be off coal in fifteen years.

right!…I’m on it!

149 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:01:21pm

re: #134 windsagio

Which I’ve actually been playing a lot again, or was until Starcraft came out!

Over the last few weeks if I dissapperaead from LGF for ~an hour (and it wasn’t a weekend), it was because I was trying a game on impossible with one of the default races ;)

AH! I hear you. Impossible with a custom race can be pretty easy (if you have a decent home star). Of the default races… Who can beat the Psilons? Hard to beat full techs.

150 Achilles Tang  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:01:50pm

re: #130 windsagio

Nerva is tragic, and Orion is stupid :)

Is that your opinion or do you have an authoritative link?

Neither is stupid, nor tragic. As to travel to Mars, the most expensive part is to earth orbit. The rest is much less and it is even possible to have a “shuttle” in resonant orbit between earth and Mars with minimal power adjustments along the way. But you need to make the bus at the required intercept.

151 HoosierHoops  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:02:26pm

re: #135 sattv4u2

get last weeks Sports Illustrated

What a great story about the effort to get Floyd Little in

Last weeks SI is in my mailbox in Indiana..I get the sporting news, SI and ESPN the Mag…The only other thing I read is Technical manuals..
I’m a shallow person Satt
//

152 Jimmah  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:02:40pm

re: #140 windsagio

Kinky!

(ok off to game for a while :p)

Cheers windsagio! Have a good one. I’ll be off again shortly myself to watch “Summer of Sam”. Hope to be posting a bit more next week now that the major nest-building chores are done!

153 HoosierHoops  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:03:39pm

re: #136 Jimmah

Hi folks - good to see you all. It’s been a real busy time. Chores this week:

1. putting up shelves
2. assembling furniture
3. washing the blood out of ice-ski’s kimono
4. removing iceweasel bits from the kitchen
5. paint.

Oh yeah - ice-ski can’t type too well just now, so for the time being all contact will have to be through me. She says to tell you all hello!

Tell iceski Hello!
Kind regards and best wishes friends

154 Jimmah  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:04:59pm

re: #142 prairiefire

Was she trying to bake bread?!?
Hope you both are settling in well.
The US~Scotland Union has commenced!

Nah - slicing vegetables. The bread making has been a big success, with no casualties…yet. Soon iceweasel and I will be able to vote progressive in both countries. YAAY!

155 austin_blue  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:06:08pm

re: #136 Jimmah

Hi folks - good to see you all. It’s been a real busy time. Chores this week:

1. putting up shelves
2. assembling furniture
3. washing the blood out of ice-ski’s kimono
4. removing iceweasel bits from the kitchen
5. paint.

Oh yeah - ice-ski can’t type too well just now, so for the time being all contact will have to be through me. She says to tell you all hello!

Jeez, Jimmah, what happened?

156 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:06:16pm

re: #154 Jimmah

Nah - slicing vegetables. The bread making has been a big success, with no casualties…yet. Soon iceweasel and I will be able to vote progressive in both countries. YAAY!

I thought prog was derogatory? I can’t keep up with the terminology

157 Jimmah  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:06:33pm

re: #153 HoosierHoops

Tell iceski Hello!
Kind regards and best wishes friends

Ice sends her regards! How did your move go? Is Winston with you yet, or still at his sleep-away camp?

158 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:07:42pm

re: #150 Naso Tang

Is that your opinion or do you have an authoritative link?

Neither is stupid, nor tragic. As to travel to Mars, the most expensive part is to earth orbit. The rest is much less and it is even possible to have a “shuttle” in resonant orbit between earth and Mars with minimal power adjustments along the way. But you need to make the bus at the required intercept.

There are lot of problems. One of the most serious is simply just keeping the astronauts live, sane and healthy long enough for the mission’s duration.

159 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:08:48pm

re: #151 HoosierHoops

I’m a shallow person

wow ,, thats deep!

160 The Shadow Do  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:09:01pm

re: #132 albusteve

been to the HOF as a tourist…the ceremony would be tres cool, especially this year..I’m really happy for Floyd Little

Hi Steve, agreed on Floyd Little. I first started following football watching Floyd in Denver. That team was perennially awful and everyone knew what was coming. Hand it off to Floyd. Amazing and so long overdue. A crime it took Elway to break the ice on inducting Denver players, there are quite a few more - starting with Gradishar.

161 Jimmah  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:09:43pm

re: #156 albusteve

I thought prog was derogatory? I can’t keep up with the terminology

‘Prog’ is meant to be.

re: #155 austin_blue

Jeez, Jimmah, what happened?

Oh, she sliced part of her finger off with the mandolin while cutting vegetables up for soup. Ouch! (Tasty soup though - wonder what the secret ingredient was?) ;-)

PS wingnuts can rest assured that she rests securely in the lap of the NHS.

162 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:10:47pm

re: #158 Nimed

There are lot of problems. One of the most serious is simply just keeping the astronauts live, sane and healthy long enough for the mission’s duration.

robot sex dolls, with a rule you can marry them, it they will have you…problem solved

163 HoosierHoops  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:11:58pm

re: #157 Jimmah

Ice sends her regards! How did your move go? Is Winston with you yet, or still at his sleep-away camp?

I’m in a Hotel in Oklahoma…I sign a lease Monday here…The girl watching Winston sends me pics every day.. Poor Winston..He must think I left him forever…I can’t wait to go pick him up..Walk in her door and say..Oh Winston..Daddy came back for you..I can’t wait to see the look in his eyes

164 Achilles Tang  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:12:29pm

re: #158 Nimed

There are lot of problems. One of the most serious is simply just keeping the astronauts live, sane and healthy long enough for the mission’s duration.

The problems are in your assumed limitations. We could get to Mars in 3 or 4 months with conventional technology. People spend that much time and more in small sailboats on the oceans all the time, and have done so since recorded history.

165 Jimmah  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:14:42pm

re: #163 HoosierHoops

I’m in a Hotel in Oklahoma…I sign a lease Monday here…The girl watching Winston sends me pics every day.. Poor Winston..He must think I left him forever…I can’t wait to go pick him up..Walk in her door and say..Oh Winston..Daddy came back for you..I can’t wait to see the look in his eyes

I felt that that way about my wee kitties while I was in NYC. They recognised ice-ski as soon as she walked in the door btw.

166 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:15:17pm

re: #160 The Shadow Do

Hi Steve, agreed on Floyd Little. I first started following football watching Floyd in Denver. That team was perennially awful and everyone knew what was coming. Hand it off to Floyd. Amazing and so long overdue. A crime it took Elway to break the ice on inducting Denver players, there are quite a few more - starting with Gradishar.

Gradishar should certainly be looked at…I watched the Broncos go from bad to contenders, living in Denver in the 70s I saw the end of his career…bring in Miller and Morton and presto!…Orange Crush!…too bad the Cowboys demolished them

167 austin_blue  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:16:21pm

re: #161 Jimmah

Oh, she sliced part of her finger off with the mandolin while cutting vegetables up for soup. Ouch! (Tasty soup though - wonder what the secret ingredient was?) ;-)

PS wingnuts can rest assured that she rests securely in the lap of the NHS.

Who does she think she is, Michael Valentine Smith?

Glad you are getting settled in. Keep her away from sharp objects!

168 Jimmah  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:16:38pm

From Keith Richard’s increasingly intriguing i-pod selection - for Aug 2010:

169 The Shadow Do  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:17:21pm

re: #166 albusteve

Gradishar should certainly be looked at…I watched the Broncos go from bad to contenders, living in Denver in the 70s I saw the end of his career…bring in Miller and Morton and presto!…Orange Crush!…too bad the Cowboys demolished them

Hell yeah, the old Orange Crush! Town was nuts. M&M connection, make those miracles happen, and on and on. I partied with Alzado, a really great guy.

I hated the Cowboys I thought forever. Now I’m in Dallas. Go Boys!

170 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:18:33pm

Apropos of “Nothing”,

Starcraft 2 has a really ugly crash it does sometimes where it also turns off your graphics drivers entirely and you have to reboot (or I think that’s what happening, you sure as hell have to reboot)

Ok, off again!

171 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:20:57pm

re: #169 The Shadow Do

Hell yeah, the old Orange Crush! Town was nuts. M&M connection, make those miracles happen, and on and on. I partied with Alzado, a really great guy.

I hated the Cowboys I thought forever. Now I’m in Dallas. Go Boys!

I lived through all that, from hand holding in the huddle to beating the shit out of people…they beat Oakland on the road one year, first time like ever?, beat Bert jones, Beat a lot of teams…a great experience…I had a ball out there…no match for the Cowboys tho

172 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:21:05pm

re: #150 Naso Tang

Oops, will answer this too:

Opinions man, opinions!

NERVA was killed because it was seen as extending the space race, and they didn’t want to spend money on it, so they killed it in a backhanded way.

Orion, I”m sorry… Orion is just dumb. Hugely wasteful, and we can do better than that. Admittedly it wasn’t dumb in the ’40s and ’50s, back when it was being worked on, but things have changed since then :P

But no, no proof, just stating my opinions.

173 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:22:23pm

re: #158 Nimed

There are lot of problems. One of the most serious is simply just keeping the astronauts live, sane and healthy long enough for the mission’s duration.

This is the proper order of off world human colonization:

1. ) Land automated base building robots on the moon. Digger robots, pusher and shover robots, bender robots … etc.

2. ) After a base has been dug deep enough to keep your astronaut / engineers from getting fried by ionizing radiation, you can send them.

3.) Build a space elevator on the moon.

4.) Build a space elevator on earth.

5.) Now you can think about colonizing Mars.

174 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:23:41pm

re: #173 goddamnedfrank

This is the proper order of off world human colonization:

1. ) Land automated base building robots on the moon. Digger robots, pusher and shover robots, bender robots … etc.

2. ) After a base has been dug deep enough to keep your astronaut / engineers from getting fried by ionizing radiation, you can send them.

3.) Build a space elevator on the moon.

4.) Build a space elevator on earth.

5.) Now you can think about colonizing Mars.

is this before or after we save planet Earth?….do you own any gold?

175 prairiefire  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:24:50pm

re: #161 Jimmah

Oh, she sliced part of her finger off with the mandolin while cutting vegetables up for soup. Ouch! (Tasty soup though - wonder what the secret ingredient was?) ;-)

PS wingnuts can rest assured that she rests securely in the lap of the NHS.

Not The Mandolin!! Almost got part of my finger off with one. This past Spring one of the mum’s at my boy’s school took off the first joint of her thumb with one of those death traps. They took the thumb in a cooler to have it reattached at the hospital.

176 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:25:18pm

re: #169 The Shadow Do

Hell yeah, the old Orange Crush! Town was nuts. M&M connection, make those miracles happen, and on and on. I partied with Alzado, a really great guy.

I hated the Cowboys I thought forever. Now I’m in Dallas. Go Boys!

Sorry , but “really great guys” don’t let steroids take over their lives. I knew Howie Longs dad pretty well and been with Howie a few times. He told stories about Lyle going off the wall in a rage over nothing at times

177 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:26:16pm

re: #175 prairiefire

Not The Mandolin!! Almost got part of my finger off with one. This past Spring one of the mum’s at my boy’s school took off the first joint of her thumb with one of those death traps. They took the thumb in a cooler to have it reattached at the hospital.

I always slice my veggies with a Gibson SG….safety first!

178 reine.de.tout  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:26:52pm

re: #161 Jimmah

Oh, she sliced part of her finger off with the mandolin while cutting vegetables up for soup. Ouch! (Tasty soup though - wonder what the secret ingredient was?) ;-)

PS wingnuts can rest assured that she rests securely in the lap of the NHS.

Oh, OUCH. I did that once. Wishing her well and a speedy recovery.

179 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:27:26pm

re: #176 sattv4u2

Sorry , but “really great guys” don’t let steroids take over their lives. I knew Howie Longs dad pretty well and been with Howie a few times. He told stories about Lyle going off the wall in a rage over nothing at times

nobody (fans) knew about Lyle at the time tho…big difference

180 The Shadow Do  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:29:04pm

re: #176 sattv4u2

Sorry , but “really great guys” don’t let steroids take over their lives. I knew Howie Longs dad pretty well and been with Howie a few times. He told stories about Lyle going off the wall in a rage over nothing at times

I’m not apologizing for steroids, not at all. Lyle was dying testimony to the awful that lies there. But as for the rage thing, I never witnessed that except on the field. He was a very nice man.

181 Nimed  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:30:21pm

re: #164 Naso Tang

The problems are in your assumed limitations. We could get to Mars in 3 or 4 months with conventional technology. People spend that much time and more in small sailboats on the oceans all the time, and have done so since recorded history.

LOL@sailboats. Are you talking about those famous zero gravity boats?

There needs to be a minimal guarantee that the whole crew is kept healthy during the entirety of the mission. Also the 3 to 4 months estimate “with conventional technology” is, hmm, bullshit. Propulsion systems for flights shorter than 400 days are not yet developed.

182 Jimmah  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:31:16pm

re: #175 prairiefire

Not The Mandolin!! Almost got part of my finger off with one. This past Spring one of the mum’s at my boy’s school took off the first joint of her thumb with one of those death traps. They took the thumb in a cooler to have it reattached at the hospital.

Damn! I thought it was a nasty looking thing myself when I first saw it out of the box. We’re getting a microplane glove to protect against any repeats.

183 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:32:07pm

re: #181 Nimed

LOL@sailboats. Are you talking about those famous zero gravity boats?

There needs to be a minimal guarantee that the whole crew is kept healthy during the entirety of the mission. Also the 3 to 4 months estimate “with conventional technology” is, hmm, bullshit. Propulsion systems for flights shorter than 400 days are not yet developed.

Hyperions seem more practical than a cut and run plan
jus sayin

184 Jimmah  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:32:56pm

Night folks. For connossiers - “Wax and Wane” (Cocteau Twins cover by the Deftones) :

185 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:33:18pm

re: #182 Jimmah

Damn! I thought it was a nasty looking thing myself when I first saw it out of the box. We’re getting a microplane glove to protect against any repeats.

Full Carrot Armor
let’s be practical here

186 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:33:33pm

re: #180 The Shadow Do

I’m not apologizing for steroids, not at all. Lyle was dying testimony to the awful that lies there. But as for the rage thing, I never witnessed that except on the field. He was a very nice man.

In his own words

I became very violent on the field and off it. I did things only crazy people do. Once a guy sideswiped my car and I beat the hell out of him

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

Consider yourself amongst the lucky!

187 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:34:22pm

re: #186 sattv4u2

In his own words

I became very violent on the field and off it. I did things only crazy people do. Once a guy sideswiped my car and I beat the hell out of him

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

Consider yourself amongst the lucky!

that’s after the fact

188 The Shadow Do  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:35:03pm

re: #186 sattv4u2

In his own words

I became very violent on the field and off it. I did things only crazy people do. Once a guy sideswiped my car and I beat the hell out of him

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

Consider yourself amongst the lucky!

I do.

189 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:35:34pm

re: #187 albusteve

that’s after the fact

Whats ‘after the fact”
he stated he was violent on AND off the field

he started doing roids in college

That wasn’t after,, that was DURING

190 HoosierHoops  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:37:55pm

Damn..Russ Grimm’s Speech at the HOF almost brought tears to my eyes…
I so want to be the best I can be..He inspired me..Crap…Drying my eyes
Shut up..I never cry!

191 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:38:32pm

re: #189 sattv4u2

Whats ‘after the fact”
he stated he was violent on AND off the field

he started doing roids in college

That wasn’t after,, that was DURING

the fans didn’t know that, necessarily…give us a break, we know all about Alzado now

192 albusteve  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:40:02pm

re: #190 HoosierHoops

Damn..Russ Grimm’s Speech at the HOF almost brought tears to my eyes…
I so want to be the best I can be..He inspired me..Crap…Drying my eyes
Shut up..I never cry!

Hog!
he deserves it

193 The Shadow Do  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:46:11pm

re: #191 albusteve

the fans didn’t know that, necessarily…give us a break, we know all about Alzado now

I did a lot of people a favor by putting it all out there at the end. No one knew the repercussions until Lyle stood up, though he barely could by then.

194 The Shadow Do  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:51:01pm

re: #193 The Shadow Do

I HE did a lot of people a favor by putting it all out there at the end. No one knew the repercussions until Lyle stood up, though he barely could by then.

195 sattv4u2  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:54:11pm

re: #192 albusteve

re: #194 The Shadow Do

Listen. I know where you guys are coming from re; Alzado. When I was in Grammar/ High School in Boston playing hockey my idol wasn’t Bobby Orr or Phil Esposito, it was Derek Sanderson. A few years later when I found out he was a drug addict/ alcoholic I was devastated. I met him years later after he had hit bottom, had made amends and had changed his life

196 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:55:46pm

Yeah.

ONe of the most difficult things about working in this field is that we keep telling people that things are bad and going to get much worse. Not enough of the right people listen.

Then something like this happens and it confirms that we know what we are saying.

But then comes the deep realization that almost no one in power will put together how bad this all really is or what the implications of what they are looking at are.

We are still in a phase where he worst things - the things that would scare people who know what they are looking at green - are all happening elsewhere. Or, they are happening here, but we can mitigate them.

Sure there is a massive wheat shortage world wide, but America still has reserves.

What people don’t get is how finite that all is, and how our support systems are fading. They are fading, right in front of our eyes.

We are still in a phase that is growing slowly worse. People think that at this rate we have centuries before having to worry. What they don’t get is that these things accelerate. They pick up speed. A loss of a Manhattan sized ice chunk, even one 4 times larger) once this years will soon be forgotten, but then comes the period where we lose several like that in a year.

The drought in Russia or the heatwave in America seem like just bad weather now. But soon, that will become the new normal and bad weather by those standards will destroy entire crops across the globe.

But out of sight, out of mind eh? By the time it is so bad that even someone like Rush or Palin could no longer deny a problem, it will be much too late to do anything to effectively mitigate it, and it will get vastly worse because it will keep accelerating to a new equilibrium.

The new equilibrium we are pushing towards will not support our current population.

If we cross those lines, the real hard choices about who lives and who dies, who eats and who doesn’t, who has children and who doesn’t, get made.

197 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 5:59:55pm

re: #11 SanFranciscoZionist

You know, it’s funny. The political religious right is constantly threatening folks with God’s wrath, but at the same time, they seem to deny that we could actually upset God enough to inspire Her to let us take our fair lumps for abusing our ecosystem.

Yes. Yes absolutely.

There is a strong tradition in Judaism that G-d’s mercy is when He intervenes with nature on your behalf. You were doing something stupid. You should have died, but the car crash was ten centimeters to the left. You didn’t slip off the icy walk. etc…

G-d’s justice on the other hand is just that he let’s physics take its course. You were doing something stupid again, but this time, you didn’t merit that little nudge.

The environment is much like that. ause and effect are real. The physics is real, and I lack the faith in humanity so say that we don’t have it coming.

198 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 6:00:33pm

Somebody said Pusher Robots?

PAK CHOOIE

(oh for the days when SA was funny)

199 Achilles Tang  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 6:25:27pm

re: #172 windsagio

Oops, will answer this too:

Opinions man, opinions!

NERVA was killed because it was seen as extending the space race, and they didn’t want to spend money on it, so they killed it in a backhanded way.

Orion, I”m sorry… Orion is just dumb. Hugely wasteful, and we can do better than that. Admittedly it wasn’t dumb in the ’40s and ’50s, back when it was being worked on, but things have changed since then :P

But no, no proof, just stating my opinions.

Both involve nukes and we all know how sensitive we have become about that.

Orion is not dumb at all, but we don’t need it for Mars type trips. It is probably the best solution, within current grasp, for the outer system, and probably the only one at present that could get us to another star in reasonable time. More practical within present capabilities than, say, giant laser powered solar sail. In fact the physics of both are similar in many ways.

200 Achilles Tang  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 6:33:01pm

re: #181 Nimed

LOL@sailboats. Are you talking about those famous zero gravity boats?

There needs to be a minimal guarantee that the whole crew is kept healthy during the entirety of the mission. Also the 3 to 4 months estimate “with conventional technology” is, hmm, bullshit. Propulsion systems for flights shorter than 400 days are not yet developed.

I don’t know what your healthy kick is about. Do you think we are talking of lying in a coffin for months or years?

3 to 4 months is not bullshit, if the right alignment is used and cost is not a problem. It’s kind of like the difference between people who drive a RR and a Prius. All it takes is money and will, not magic.

201 Obdicut  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 6:53:11pm

re: #198 windsagio

Their WTF D&D is hilarious.

202 windsagio  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 6:54:26pm

re: #201 Obdicut

I’m just old and embittered.

203 Dancing along the light of day  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 7:16:57pm

re: #15 JasonA

Christ. I just got a call from a friend of mine. His brother’s, who used to be my best friend, wife’s water broke last night. Apparently she has a lot of allergies to medication and they almost lost her and the baby. It’s still not looking all that great. This sucks.

Best wishes & prayers going out for you & your friends.

204 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 7:27:28pm

re: #66 windsagio

yup, good way to give your dad the finger, too!

While doing it “Reverse Cowboy Curtis” style.

205 BishopX  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 7:29:04pm

re: #199 Naso Tang

The problem with nukes as a means of propulsion is getting them up there. Failure at launch or failure in low earth orbit would have catastrophic effects on everything down wind. This type of low-probability, high-impact risk is exactly the kind of thing people are generally bad at predicting or preventing.

Possible solutions to this problem all involve some form of orbit construction. Either a real live space elevator or some form of interplanetary shipyard which could receive small quantities of fissionable materials in armored containers and assemble the drive system there. Neither of these options is currently feasible.

206 Dancing along the light of day  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 7:40:05pm

re: #136 Jimmah

What did you let happen to her?
Grrrrr.
///

207 bricko  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 8:38:27pm

And? It says Calved, not Melted. BFD, another piece calved off in 1962 TWICE this size of this one.
[Link: www.udel.edu…]

Perhaps the evil Warming started before the IPCC could glom onto it. Or it just broke off like all ice sheets do.

208 Charles Johnson  Sat, Aug 7, 2010 9:17:09pm

re: #207 bricko

Fanatically ignorant is no way to go through life.

209 SixDegrees  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 12:47:47am

re: #208 Charles

Fanatically ignorant is no way to go through life.

Perhaps not, but the occurrence of similar and even larger such calvings in the past make the tie to present-day warming weak, at best. It is, apparently, something that happens normally, if rarely.

There are better measures out there. This one, not so much.

210 harlequinade  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 1:44:03am

And that is a somewhat misleading statement.

Let’s have a look at what the people who actually know something about this say, shall we? All the emphasis is mine.

Andreas Muenchow, the professor of ocean science and engineering at the University of Delaware, said

So - we can agree that he - you know - probably knows a thing or two.

“Nobody can claim this was caused by global warming. On the other hand nobody can claim that it was not.

And why can you not make that blanket statement you made there? Because:

“records on the sea water around the glacier have only been kept since 2003.”

That said - let’s look at some more information on it, shall we? Because learning is fun.

Scientists have said the first six months of 2010 have been the hottest globally on record.

The El Nino weather pattern has contributed to higher temperatures, but many scientists say elevated levels of man-made greenhouse gases are pushing temperatures higher.

Muenchow said he had expected an ice chunk to break off from the Petermann Glacier, one of the two largest remaining in Greenland, because it had been growing in size for seven or eight years, but he did not expect it to be so large.

“The freshwater stored in this ice island could keep the Delaware or Hudson Rivers flowing for more than two years,” Muenchow said.

“It could also keep all US public tap water flowing for 120 days.”

There.

So, looking at your conjecture - I’d say that you’re wrong. Not “weak, at best” at all.

211 im_gumby_damnit  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 7:51:57am

It’s funny because when it’s unseasonably cold somewhere, there’s always a Drudge headline about it and how global warming is a myth. But now when it’s unbearably hot (especially here in the South), you don’t see any headlines on Drudge about the heat. What happened to the logic of denial? Doesn’t it work both ways? Apparently not.

212 im_gumby_damnit  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 7:55:07am

Wait. Drudge does have two headlines about weather. They are both about how cold it is … in South America.

“Argentina Has Colder Winter Than Antarctica, Spurring Record Power Use” and “Cold kills 6 million fish, 1000s of alligators, dolphins”

213 Stinson  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 9:09:42am

Here come the scaredy cats ignorant of geology begging for the State to save them.

Was it global warming in 1962 too?

214 Stinson  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 9:12:05am

Also, it’s endlessly amusing that the anti-Christians label all skeptics “deniers.”

Just another word for heretic and the irony is completely lost on them.

215 mkelly  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 9:12:16am

Satellite imagery of this remote area at 81 degrees N latitude and 61 degrees W longitude, about 620 miles [1,000 km] south of the North Pole, reveals that Petermann Glacier lost about one-quarter of its 43-mile long [70 km] floating ice-shelf.

Please go the the DMI (it is the Danish meterological institude) web site and see that the temperature above 80 deg N is below average. It is barely above freezing. You folks like data well here is data that demonstrates that this is not caused by global warming. Calfing is not melting.

216 efuseakay  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 10:43:34am

Denier: See, AGW is still a hoax! It “calved” off, and didn’t melt!

217 efuseakay  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 10:44:35am

re: #212 im_gumby_damnit

Wait. Drudge does have two headlines about weather. They are both about how cold it is … in South America.

“Argentina Has Colder Winter Than Antarctica, Spurring Record Power Use” and “Cold kills 6 million fish, 1000s of alligators, dolphins”

And how’s Russia doing?

218 [deleted]  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 11:10:55am
219 Charles Johnson  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 2:59:26pm

re: #209 SixDegrees

Perhaps not, but the occurrence of similar and even larger such calvings in the past make the tie to present-day warming weak, at best. It is, apparently, something that happens normally, if rarely.

There are better measures out there. This one, not so much.

Giant Glacier Breaks on Anniversary of Global Warming:

On Thursday, scientists discovered that a huge mass of ice four times the size of Manhattan had broken free of Petermann glacier in northwestern Greenland. The “ice island” was the largest calving event on the glacier since 1962, and researchers estimated Petermann lost nearly a quarter of its floating ice tongue in one go.

Any individual calving event, like a bad storm, wildfire, or flood, is not necessarily a symptom of global warming. But large bergs also crumbled off Petermann in in 2001 and 2008, and Jason Box of Ohio State University has been studying the glacier — and expecting this breakup event — for some time. He said the glacier’s behavior in recent years is “all part of a climate warming pattern.”

220 mkelly  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 4:40:54pm

re: #216 efuseakay

Denier: See, AGW is still a hoax! It “calved” off, and didn’t melt!

I assume by your comment you did not go to DMI to check the temperature above 80 N.

221 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 4:45:13pm

re: #209 SixDegrees

Perhaps not, but the occurrence of similar and even larger such calvings in the past make the tie to present-day warming weak, at best. It is, apparently, something that happens normally, if rarely.

There are better measures out there. This one, not so much.

Are you insane? Really? Those glaciers were stable for tens of thousands of years. But the old ice is breaking up in city sized chunks in the last few decades, at an accelerating pace.

Yes there is a break up and refreeze cycle at the fringes. We are seeing losses far beyond that normal cycle.

This is not something that happens normally prima fascia, since we are seeing the loss of old ice.

This is a very striking measure, not a weak one.

For you to pronounce that this is at best a weak tie - as if you have any idea what you are talking about is utterly arrogant, false, and frankly stupid.

222 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 4:48:59pm

re: #215 mkelly

Satellite imagery of this remote area at 81 degrees N latitude and 61 degrees W longitude, about 620 miles [1,000 km] south of the North Pole, reveals that Petermann Glacier lost about one-quarter of its 43-mile long [70 km] floating ice-shelf.

Please go the the DMI (it is the Danish meterological institude) web site and see that the temperature above 80 deg N is below average. It is barely above freezing. You folks like data well here is data that demonstrates that this is not caused by global warming. Calfing is not melting.

Let’s try this slowly.

The glacier has been weakened by melt flows all across its surface for years. As the ice warms, water not only melts, but drains down through fissures causing the fissures to widen.

Once that gets going it really doesn’t matter what the outside temperature was when the break off occurred.

Caving is not melting - however the calving was caused by melting.

Your posts are consistently insipid. You are easily the dumbest and most stubborn poster I have ever seen attempt to be a denier.

223 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 4:49:52pm

re: #207 bricko

And? It says Calved, not Melted. BFD, another piece calved off in 1962 TWICE this size of this one.
[Link: www.udel.edu…]

Perhaps the evil Warming started before the IPCC could glom onto it. Or it just broke off like all ice sheets do.

Same point for you.

Let’s try this slowly.

The glacier has been weakened by melt flows all across its surface for years. As the ice warms, water not only melts, but drains down through fissures causing the fissures to widen.

Once that gets going it really doesn’t matter what the outside temperature was when the break off occurred.

Caving is not melting - however the calving was caused by melting.

224 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 4:52:47pm

re: #213 Stinson

So you are mentally deficient right? Does your anger stem from the fact that others can do algebra, while you can not, or does it stem from the fact that everyone is always smarter than you?

There is nothing anti-Christian about understanding and accepting the facts of science. And no, you are not a skeptic. To be a skeptic requires understanding what you are talking about.

225 b_sharp  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 5:05:13pm

re: #209 SixDegrees

Perhaps not, but the occurrence of similar and even larger such calvings in the past make the tie to present-day warming weak, at best. It is, apparently, something that happens normally, if rarely.

There are better measures out there. This one, not so much.

I know this is a dead thread, but this needs an answer.

Two things related to AGW contribute to calving from continental based glaciers, increased moisture in the air builds thickness in areas away from the coast and melted water acts as a lubricant. Combine the two and frequency of calving increases.

226 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 8, 2010 9:16:41pm

re: #214 Stinson

Also, it’s endlessly amusing that the anti-Christians label all skeptics “deniers.”

Would you prefer we use the term “useful idiots who love performing sexual favors for Saudi Arabia” instead? :)

Seriously, though, if you can look at this map of Russia showing how much of it is on fire, or this closer view, or this one showing the noxious, toxic smoke clouds that have resulted, and still think “there’s no problem”…you’ve reached the point of terminal, brain-cell-killing willful ignorance.

227 mkelly  Mon, Aug 9, 2010 6:13:19am

“Your posts are consistently insipid. You are easily the dumbest and most stubborn poster I have ever seen attempt to be a denier.”

By your post I assume you also have not gone to the DMI site. There is no evidence that above 80 deg N there is warming. And as shown on the site this year is below average.

The water may infact be under the galcier but that could be and probably is a result of pressure. The break then happens due to cantilever stress.

Your statement that this glacier has been weakened for years by melt water across its surface has no basis in fact nor do you supply evidence for you statement.

228 Interesting Times  Mon, Aug 9, 2010 6:39:31am

re: #227 mkelly

By your post I assume you also have not gone to the DMI site.

Well I did, and (as should surprise no one) you’re a shameless, bald-faced LIAR:

Climate change is evident from observations of air and ocean temperatures, widespread melting of snow and ice and global sea level change, and climate change will continue. It is, therefore, important to include knowledge on future climate change in long term planning in many sectors.

(bolding from the original page)

LOL@denier tool referring people to a site saying the exact opposite of what he claims :P

229 MKelly  Mon, Aug 9, 2010 8:45:26am

ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/meant80n.uk.phpre: #228 publicityStunted

(bolding from the original page)

LOL@denier tool referring people to a site saying the exact opposite of what he claims :P

ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/meant80n.uk.phpocean.dmi.dk/arctic/meant80n.uk.php

Above is the site address for the artic temperature above 80 deg N. I never said anything other than the average temperture above 80 dge N was below normal and the site shows that. If the temperature shown on thier temperture chart is in fact above average then yes I will have lied, but until that happens I have not.

230 MKelly  Mon, Aug 9, 2010 9:01:55am

[Link: ocean.dmi.dk…]

This one may work better.

231 Charles Johnson  Mon, Aug 9, 2010 10:34:36am

What you see at the end of this thread is the climate change deniers’ tactic known as “baffling ‘em with bullshit.”

232 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Aug 9, 2010 10:57:45am

re: #230 MKelly

[Link: ocean.dmi.dk…]

This one may work better.

Did you notice that the graph you just linked to has approximately 90 days in the arctic above freezing?

While we are at it, even if the air is cold, does the old air, stop absorption of IR by the ice?

You have a remarkable gift for linking to things that contradict yourself.

233 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Aug 9, 2010 11:05:59am

re: #227 mkelly

Actually, the site you have been referring to has satellite evidence of this.

[Link: ocean.dmi.dk…]

You can see the sorts of flows I was referring to in many of the images, as well as melt pools.

Do you ever actually take the time to understand, even remotely the the things you link to? How many times does something have to say the exact opposite of what you think it means, and boldly claim it means, before you get tired of being showed a fool?

234 MKelly  Mon, Aug 9, 2010 12:45:33pm

LVQ said “You have a remarkable gift for linking to things that contradict yourself.”

The only thing I have said is the chart of this years temperatures above 80 deg N show below average. I said it was barely above freezing per my post 215. That’s it.

So I cannot find how I have contradicted myself since you agree with what I said.

Since it has only been above freezing,and not much above at that, it is hard to blame the calving on the 2010 summer. Less heat than average.

If you disagree that the breakage is probably due to cantilever stress OK, but at some point the tensile strength of the ice was exceeded and it broke. I think it got to long and had to break no matter what.

235 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Aug 9, 2010 4:52:07pm

re: #234 MKelly

due to cantilever stress OK

And how would you calculate that? You have rendered an opinion, this is something that can be looked into scientifically, so please, justify your assertions about “cantilever stress.”

First define what you mean by that. The explain its origin.


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Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT
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Detroit Local Powers First EV Charging Road in North America The road, about a mile from Local 58's hall, uses rubber-coated copper inductive-charging coils buried under the asphalt that transfer power to a receiver pad attached to a car's underbelly, much like how a phone can be charged wirelessly. ...
Backwoods Sleuth
3 days ago
Views: 191 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 4