Todd Palin Pals Around with White Supremacist Blogger

Charles Johnsonfollow me on twitter
Politics • Fri Sep 3, 2010 at 2:37 pm PDT • Views: 7,502

So who’s Todd Palin palling around with up there in Alaska these days?

Todd and Sarah won’t give interviews to the “lamestream” media, but they’ll make time to meet with white supremacist blogger Robert Stacy McCain: Hey, Who’s the Man? : The Other McCain.

Robert Stacy McCain was recently seen at LGF when he used the racial slur “beaners” to describe Mexicans, and is well known for numerous other overtly racist statements, such as:

“[T]he media now force interracial images into the public mind and a number of perfectly rational people react to these images with an altogether natural revulsion. The white person who does not mind transacting business with a black bank clerk may yet be averse to accepting the clerk as his sister-in-law, and THIS IS NOT RACISM, no matter what Madison Avenue, Hollywood and Washington tell us.”

McCain has also described Abraham Lincoln as a war criminal:

WANTED for WAR CRIMES: Abraham Lincoln

* Violation of the 10th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution
* Unconstitutional suppression of civil liberties in Ohio and other states
* Suspension of the writ of habeas corpus
* Disbanding the legislature of Maryland
* Aggression against the Southern Confederacy

… and defended the Confederate system of slavery as “cordial and affectionate.”

Even many slaveholders such as Thomas Jefferson recognized that by stigmatizing labor, slavery encouraged sloth in both master and slave. Though most 19th-century white Americans, North and South, subscribed to racial theories that consigned blacks to an inferior status as “hewers of wood and drawers of water,” it is incorrect to say that slavery was a system based upon racial hatred. Indeed, both white and black Southerners of the era have left us testimony to the cordial and affectionate relations which generally existed between the races in the Old South.

These quotes are from Robert Stacy McCain’s Usenet posts, as documented here: Meet Robert Stacy McCain, Neo-Confederate Wacko Extraordinaire.

There’s much more information on McCain, including his connections to white nationalist groups like American Renaissance and neo-Nazis like Bill White, in these posts:
Robert Stacy McCain’s Angry Departure From the Washington Times
The Other ‘Other McCain’
Robert Stacy McCain’s Latest Excuse

Now this sleazy racist has finally managed to ingratiate himself into the Palin family inner circle. Here he is posing on one of Todd Palin’s snowmobiles:

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669 comments

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1 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:39:14pm

I hope this is the beginning of the end for Palinmania.

2 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:39:29pm

Little man looks kinda scared on top of that big machine.

3 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:39:44pm

Will Todd Palin refudiate his friendship with white supremacist blogger Robert Stacy McCain?

4 jamesfirecat  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:40:21pm

* Aggression against the Southern Confederacy

Yeah because the North fired the first shot in the civil war...

5 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:41:39pm

re: #2 Cato the Elder

Little man looks kinda scared on top of that big machine.

Doesn't he look like he lives out of a refrigerator box?

6 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:41:54pm

And so this is the kind of reporter the Palins feel comfortable around.

7 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:43:55pm

Running down Abraham Lincoln is about the scummiest thing you can do in my book.

What a flaming asshole

8 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:44:13pm

Isn't that color scheme on the big machine Islamic Green? I wonder if Geller has seen this yet, it's a stab in the eye to all moose killing patriots.

9 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:45:02pm
testimony to the cordial and affectionate relations which generally existed between the races in the Old South.

Such as selling children away from their parents.

10 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:45:35pm

I think the remark, "Now this sleazy racist has finally managed to ingratiate himself into the Palin family inner circle" is probably the most accurate description of what happened.

I would hope after this comes to light, the Palins will make themselves unavailable to RSM.

Right.

11 Decatur Deb  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:47:00pm

This is a cache link to a site that does not consider itself neo-confederate or endorse neo-confederate thinking. That's because the clowns insist the old confederacy is still legitimate, though occupied. I thought it was a joke or scam at first (it does accept "taxes" from donors). They are serious. How deep can the weirdness go?

[Link: www.google.com...]

12 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:47:19pm

I bet he doesn't like Sherman either.

13 jamesfirecat  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:48:36pm

re: #12 Ojoe

I bet he doesn't like Sherman either.

Since DF isn't here I"ll do the honors.

14 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:48:42pm

re: #5 Gus 802

Doesn't he look like he lives out of a refrigerator box?

no, a van down by the river/

15 Kragar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:49:47pm

You ignorant sluts

16 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:50:08pm

Black bank clerks everywhere should memorize this man's face and put up the "window closed" sign as soon as he gets to the head of the line.

17 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:50:32pm

Lincoln enters Richmond Virginia.

Hard to read this one all the way through without sort of tearing up.

18 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:50:57pm

re: #6 Cato the Elder

And so this is the kind of reporter the Palins feel comfortable around.

yeah, there's nothing good about this.

i admit, unless they publicly refudiate this trou du cul immediately, i have been wrong about Palin. unlike many of you, i thought she was silly but not malevolently bad for us.

am i allowed to at least order a side of bbq sauce for my crow?

19 SpaceJesus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:51:13pm

today on the wasilla hillbillies...

20 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:52:09pm

re: #19 SpaceJesus

today on the wasilla hillbillies...

When the cement pond freezes over we can play ice hockey!

/

21 jamesfirecat  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:52:58pm

re: #19 SpaceJesus

today on the wasilla hillbillies...

Let me tell yeah all a story bout a man named Todd...
Was poor govenor's spouse barely kept the horses shod...

(Hey I do the best I can with what I've got...)

22 Kragar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:53:09pm

I guess McCain supports States Rights, just so long as they're the rights he supports, not pesky rights like all men being treated equally under the law and that liberal shit.

23 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:53:57pm

Sarah ain't gonna be elected to nuthin'.

24 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:54:45pm

re: #18 Aceofwhat?

yeah, there's nothing good about this.

i admit, unless they publicly refudiate this trou du cul immediately, i have been wrong about Palin. unlike many of you, i thought she was silly but not malevolently bad for us.

am i allowed to at least order a side of bbq sauce for my crow?

Crow is traditionally eaten without seasoning, but in your case we might make an exception

25 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:54:48pm

re: #10 researchok

I would hope after this comes to light, the Palins will make themselves unavailable to RSM.

I wouldn't bet on it.

26 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:56:31pm

re: #25 Charles

I wouldn't bet on it.

I won't take that bet either.

'Smart' isn't an adjective usually associated with the Palins.

27 Decatur Deb  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:57:11pm

re: #25 Charles

I wouldn't bet on it.

Their history with the AIP says "seccessionist".

28 ReamWorks SKG  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:57:14pm

Not that it matters much, but I wonder if the Palins actually believe that rhetoric, or if they're just too stupid to know to distance themselves. Or a little bit of both.

29 Kragar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:58:33pm

re: #28 reuven

Not that it matters much, but I wonder if the Palins actually believe that rhetoric, or if they're just too stupid to know to distance themselves. Or a little bit of both.

I wouldn't put it past them to think it was John McCain's brother and they were just hanging out with his family

30 webevintage  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:58:57pm

re: #1 BigPapa

I hope this is the beginning of the end for Palinmania.

But it won't be.
Look at what has been happening in the last year.
The true believers don't care.
They did not care about Todd being a secessionist.
There is a segment of the "conservative" population for whom doing an interview with a white supremacist is no big deal and if anyone in the media calls The Palin on this she will just go on Hannity and whine how the "lamestream" limp dick media is hating on her and her Patriotic-Heartland-of-America-God-Loving-Family.

31 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 2:59:04pm

Come 'n listen to my story 'bout a woman named Sarah
A poor Wassilian, barely kept her ego fed
And then one day, she was shootin' off her mouth
And up through the ground come a hillbilly McCain
Oily hair, that is, Robert Stacy McCain, Virginia teabagger

32 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:00:08pm

re: #13 jamesfirecat

Thank you.

33 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:00:30pm

re: #28 reuven

Not that it matters much, but I wonder if the Palins actually believe that rhetoric, or if they're just too stupid to know to distance themselves. Or a little bit of both.

Sarah, Sarah! Which book of Robert Stacy McCain's did you like the most?

All of them.

//

34 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:00:36pm

re: #6 Cato the Elder

And so this is the kind of reporter the Palins feel comfortable around.

Good point. Given how they treat most reporters, this is pretty special. I think he had all the right references. Oh, yes. It was this guy.

I would never have gotten this far if mutual friends -- including Anchorage conservative talk-radio legend Eddie Burke -- hadn't vouched for my bona fides.

35 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:01:05pm

I think I remember reading that Todd is much less conservative than Sarah and even votes Dem. It's possilbe he has no clue what this guy is and has really been about and would in no uncertain terms approve.

Let's hope.

36 Kragar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:02:34pm

re: #35 dwells38

I think I remember reading that Todd is much less conservative than Sarah and even votes Dem. It's possilbe he has no clue what this guy is and has really been about and would in no uncertain terms approve.

Let's hope.

Then why bother hanging out with him in the first place if he has no clue who this guy is?

37 allegro  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:03:07pm

re: #36 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

Then why bother hanging out with him in the first place if he has no clue who this guy is?

He digs his hat?

38 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:03:18pm

re: #35 dwells38

I think I remember reading that Todd is much less conservative than Sarah and even votes Dem. It's possilbe he has no clue what this guy is and has really been about and would in no uncertain terms approve.

Let's hope.

Doesn't matter, really. He's married to a public figure. He needs to know who is who.

Can you imagine Michelle Obama having tea with Glenn Beck?

39 webevintage  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:04:23pm
In the wake of a biting and highly controversial Sarah Palin profile in Vanity Fair, Robert Stacy McCain of the American Spectator is presumably out to show his readers that the opposite of a questionably sourced hit piece written by "impotent" and "limp" reporters is a cheery and circumspect fluff piece about former "First Dude" Todd Palin.

When even the Huffington Post will not point out that RSM is a white supremacist then then I don't know how any of this could splash back on The Palin.

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

40 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:05:03pm

re: #27 Decatur Deb

Their history with the AIP says "seccessionist".

Exactly, the AIP membership of Todd. I think they are more fringe than we'd like to imagine.

GOP Senate candidate Joe Miller wants to take back Alaska from the Feds basically.

41 Decatur Deb  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:05:22pm

re: #35 dwells38

I think I remember reading that Todd is much less conservative than Sarah and even votes Dem. It's possilbe he has no clue what this guy is and has really been about and would in no uncertain terms approve.

Let's hope.

Todd was a member of the AIP, part of this molecule:

[Link: www.google.com...]

(That's also a cache.)

42 3kids3dogs  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:06:26pm

re: #3 Gus 802

Will Todd Palin refudiate his friendship with white supremacist blogger Robert Stacy McCain?

It is unlikely that he will ever be asked to do so.

43 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:06:29pm

re: #29 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

I wouldn't put it past them to think it was John McCain's brother and they were just hanging out with his family

RS McCain attacked one of the Palin hated bloggers in Alaska. They know exactly who he is.

44 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:08:22pm

re: #41 Decatur Deb

Todd was a member of the AIP, part of this molecule:

[Link: www.google.com...]

(That's also a cache.)


seriously? wow.

45 webevintage  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:08:26pm

re: #40 Stanley Sea

Exactly, the AIP membership of Todd. I think they are more fringe than we'd like to imagine.

GOP Senate candidate Joe Miller wants to take back Alaska from the Feds basically.

Hopefully the Feds will send all that money they are sending to Alaska (that allows all those independent folks live there) to some of the states here in the 48 who could really use it.

46 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:08:39pm

re: #36 Kragar (proud to be kafir)

It's a good point. I only make that comment because it wasn't clear how they came to spend this time together. I was envisioning a possible situation where he's a friend of a friend of Sarah's (who isn't exactly well read either). And I've read elsewhere that this McCain guy is a good writer and comes off affable. So I'm hoping Todd is just being cordial. If you think the Palins are raging racists I'm fine with that. I'm not hear to defend them.

47 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:11:05pm

re: #45 webevintage

Hopefully the Feds will send all that money they are sending to Alaska (that allows all those independent folks live there) to some of the states here in the 48 who could really use it.

i love it when democrats realize that they don't like welfare either;)

48 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:11:46pm

Personally, I'm still trying to digest this morsel from Mr. McCain:

The white person who does not mind transacting business with a black bank clerk may yet be averse to accepting the clerk as his sister-in-law, and THIS IS NOT RACISM, no matter what Madison Avenue, Hollywood and Washington tell us.”

Why is this not racism? Please, tell me more about your belief system.//

49 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:13:18pm

Obama was hammered for being close to Rev Wright, as he should have been. Obama backed away, as he should have done.

Palin should get hammered for this. This could really fester into something bad for Palin.

I find McCain more 'unAmerican' than Wright ever was.

50 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:13:21pm

re: #48 calochortus

Personally, I'm still trying to digest this morsel from Mr. McCain:


Why is this not racism? Please, tell me more about your belief system.//

Because he says it isn't. See? That was easy.

51 palomino  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:13:34pm

re: #28 reuven

Not that it matters much, but I wonder if the Palins actually believe that rhetoric, or if they're just too stupid to know to distance themselves. Or a little bit of both.

I don't think Palin cares at all if she appears insensitive to blacks. Just look at her supportive "reload" comments to Dr. Laura following her ridiculous racist on-air rant a few weeks ago.

52 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:14:36pm

re: #50 EmmmieG

Oooh, where can I get some of that truth-by-declaration power? It would be useful-and I promise I wouldn't misuse it.

53 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:17:59pm

re: #49 BigPapa

No doubt. I don't like Wright for his over-the-top America bashing but I wouldn't call him racist. RS McCain is definitly a racist. And more dangersous because he's fairly intelligent and still can't understand why the quote calochortus singled out is flat out racist.

I think it's pretty clear that if you aren't a racist then why would you care who falls in love and marries whom?

54 Racer X  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:20:55pm

re: #49 BigPapa

I find McCain more 'unAmerican' than Wright ever was.

You have got to be kidding.

55 Racer X  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:21:48pm

Crap. Never mind.

Wrong McCain.

56 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:22:35pm

re: #55 Racer X

LOL!

57 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:22:46pm

re: #55 Racer X

Crap. Never mind.

Wrong McCain.

Maybe one of them could change his name? Or at least the spelling thereof.

58 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:23:11pm

Of course RSM goes to see Todd Palin...the "Great WHITE North" is the last pure place on the planet...except for those pesky Eskimos.

//

59 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:23:50pm

re: #58 darthstar

And isn't Todd mixed race?

60 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:24:08pm

re: #53 dwells38

No doubt. I don't like Wright for his over-the-top America bashing but I wouldn't call him racist. RS McCain is definitly a racist. And more dangersous because he's fairly intelligent and still can't understand why the quote calochortus singled out is flat out racist.

I think it's pretty clear that if you aren't a racist then why would you care who falls in love and marries whom?

Because she was really hot and smart and made good money and wouldn't give you the time of day?

Just a thought.

61 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:24:50pm

re: #59 calochortus

And isn't Todd mixed race?

He's 1/8th or something. Not to diminish it, but it's kind of a tough claim to me. His wife did nothing for the Natives when she was Gov.

62 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:25:11pm

re: #59 calochortus

And isn't Todd mixed race?

Yes, and this means somebody married them an eskimo.

He should find this nauseating.

63 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:25:37pm

re: #48 calochortus

Personally, I'm still trying to digest this morsel from Mr. McCain:

Why is this not racism? Please, tell me more about your belief system.//

I say this all of the time...one look at the progeny of an interracial union is all that it takes to realize that God and/or Nature, depending on one's belief system, is clearly supportive of interracial unions.

64 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:25:58pm

re: #61 Stanley Sea

He's 1/8th or something. Not to diminish it, but it's kind of a tough claim to me. His wife did nothing for the Natives when she was Gov.

Yes, but they and their kids will benefit from socialized medicine for life (so long as they stay in Alaska).

65 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:26:30pm

re: #62 EmmmieG

Yes, and this means somebody married them an eskimo.

He should find this nauseating.

Ding, ding, ding!

66 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:26:39pm

re: #63 Aceofwhat?

Actually one look at Halle Berry tells me that.

OK I'll stop.

67 Racer X  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:27:07pm

Can we refer to one as Really Stupid McCain?

and the other Senator McCain?

Thanks,

68 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:27:23pm

re: #64 darthstar

Yes, but they and their kids will benefit from socialized medicine for life (so long as they stay in Alaska).

I sent boxes of food to the Alaska Natives last year - they had a food drive on the Mudflats. Sarah showed up with cookies, Christian tracts and Franklin Graham.

69 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:28:03pm

re: #66 dwells38

Actually one look at Halle Berry tells me that.

OK I'll stop.

exaaactly

70 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:28:12pm

re: #67 Racer X

Can we refer to one as Really Stupid McCain?

and the other Senator McCain?

Thanks,

Duly noted. Don't square up on little ol BigPapa!

71 Randall Gross  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:30:14pm

Maybe we shouldn't have so easily forgiven/blown off the association of Sarah's ghostwriter with this racist way back when now that I think about it...

72 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:32:46pm

re: #59 calochortus

So that makes him a little like that delightful Dave Chappelle character in the fake Frontline spoof. The blind southerner who's all for white power and doesn't realize he's actually black himself. God that was hilarious.

73 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:33:44pm
74 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:36:03pm

re: #71 Thanos

Maybe we shouldn't have so easily forgiven/blown off the association of Sarah's ghostwriter with this racist way back when now that I think about it...

Weigel thought of that:

I think we're four or five minutes away from Gawker or someone else ringing alarm bells about this interview. McCain, whom I consider a friend, is also a friend and occasional collaborator with Lynn Vincent, the woman who ghosted Palin's "Going Rogue." That fact caused a mini-scandal in 2009 because McCain is -- how do I put this? -- not politically correct when he discusses race and class issues.
75 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:36:27pm

re: #73 BigPapa

Jeez! Not only would I not mess with her. I don't think I'd want to be anywhere near her with that thing in her hands.

76 Decatur Deb  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:44:50pm

re: #44 Aceofwhat?

seriously? wow.

Here is SP's video for an AIP convention. She is not said to be a registered member.

[Link: www.google.com...]

77 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:46:15pm

Weigel considers McCain a friend?

Low damn standards.

78 RadicalModerate  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:46:17pm

re: #39 webevintage

When even the Huffington Post will not point out that RSM is a white supremacist then then I don't know how any of this could splash back on The Palin.

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

Looking at that article, it appears that one of the forum moderators (MichaelCorleone) noticed the LGF story here and has linked to it.

79 Decatur Deb  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:46:52pm

Grandkid stuff. BBL

80 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:47:47pm

re: #77 Cato the Elder

Weigel considers McCain a friend?

Low damn standards.

Weigel's a strange dude. Fairly friendly to Ron/Rand Paul and the Tea Parties as well. He's generally honest but I question his taste.

81 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:48:22pm

re: #18 Aceofwhat?

yeah, there's nothing good about this.

i admit, unless they publicly refudiate this trou du cul immediately, i have been wrong about Palin. unlike many of you, i thought she was silly but not malevolently bad for us.

am i allowed to at least order a side of bbq sauce for my crow?

Personally I'd make you eat it raw, but, hey, thats just me.

82 AntonSirius  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:50:17pm

re: #58 darthstar

Of course RSM goes to see Todd Palin...the "Great WHITE North" is the last pure place on the planet...except for those pesky Eskimos.

//

Maybe after Alaska secedes, the Inuit can be the new slave labor force. Although I'm not really sure how you'd tote a bale of ice.

83 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:50:19pm

Wow...New Zealand got rocked with a 7+ earthquake today...

84 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:50:32pm

re: #77 Cato the Elder

Weigel considers McCain a friend?

Low damn standards.

I got into more than one discussion with iceweasel and Jimmah when I suggested that might be the case, starting in January of this year and continuing in February. They said I was smearing Weigel.

85 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:52:13pm

re: #41 Decatur Deb

I went to that website and I'm still confused about what the hell those people were talking about. They were even too extreme and weird for Beck.

86 It's a cookbook!  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:52:25pm
87 [deleted]  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:52:43pm
88 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:53:45pm

re: #84 wrenchwench


Really! That's the same Weigel that posed as a right-winger but is actually on the left? Why would he put up with that guy at all?

89 PT Barnum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:54:24pm

Evening all...

Picked up the new car this morning...(not new, just running) and picked up the new motherboard on my way home from work.

Life is much better now.

90 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:54:54pm

re: #58 darthstar

Of course RSM goes to see Todd Palin...the "Great WHITE North" is the last pure place on the planet...except for those pesky Eskimos.

//

Yah. Who the hell let the damn Eskimos into Alaska, anyway!!!

91 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:55:04pm

re: #76 Decatur Deb

Here is SP's video for an AIP convention. She is not said to be a registered member.

[Link: www.google.com...]

i appreciate Cato's allowance for bbq crow...it appears that i'll be having seconds/

92 PT Barnum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:55:16pm

Windows 7 takes forever to install BTW. Although it helps if you disable your floppy drive first.

93 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:55:29pm

re: #88 dwells38

Really! That's the same Weigel that posed as a right-winger but is actually on the left? Why would he put up with that guy at all?

I don't think that's a fair description of Weigel at all.

94 It's a cookbook!  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:55:50pm

re: #92 PT Barnum

Windows 7 takes forever to install BTW. Although it helps if you disable your floppy drive first.

What the hell is a "floppy" drive?

/

95 PT Barnum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:56:19pm

Hey b_ thanks for the encouraging words last night. The MB was the last straw in a very long day.

96 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:56:22pm

re: #66 dwells38

Actually one look at Halle Berry tells me that.

OK I'll stop.

In bed.

97 RadicalModerate  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:56:58pm

Note to Todd & Sarah:

I have a internal viewpoint compass that server me pretty well, and it's pretty simple. On almost any hot-button political/social issue, check to see what the stormfront crowd thinks about it.

Then choose the exact opposite position.

Ninety-nine percent of the time, I'm quite comfortable with my decision.

98 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:57:16pm

re: #86 JasonA

OT: Breaking News! Duke Nukem Forever uncanceled, playable at PAX

w00t!

"It's time to kick ass and chew bubble gum... and I'm all outta gum"

99 PT Barnum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:57:51pm

re: #96 b_sharp

In bed.

Halle Yeah! And I don't mean

100 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:57:57pm
101 RadicalModerate  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:58:39pm

re: #97 RadicalModerate

pimf - *serves me pretty well*

102 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:58:57pm

re: #95 PT Barnum

Hey b_ thanks for the encouraging words last night. The MB was the last straw in a very long day.

What? I didn't say anything encouraging. But your welcome :)

103 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:59:21pm

re: #93 wrenchwench

I don't think that's a fair description of Weigel at all.

Do you know that he and Ben Smith of Politico have journolist stalkers? Probably Ezra too. Every single post they make more than one comment is harping on journolist. A booga booga creation of The Daily Caller. They just won't let go!

104 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 3:59:40pm

re: #95 PT Barnum

Hey b_ thanks for the encouraging words last night. The MB was the last straw in a very long day.

Anytime.

I won't even charge you the $85.00/hr I charge my customers.

105 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:00:29pm

re: #102 Walter L. Newton

What? I didn't say anything encouraging. But your welcome :)

Sorry... I missed the small "b_" I thought you were talking to us in general... stupid me.

106 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:00:44pm

re: #63 Aceofwhat?

I say this all of the time...one look at the progeny of an interracial union is all that it takes to realize that God and/or Nature, depending on one's belief system, is clearly supportive of interracial unions.


And from a purely objective point of view, greater genetic diversity is correlated with greater general health and disease resistance, and decreases the chance of having medical conditions related to recessive traits.

107 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:02:14pm

re: #93 wrenchwench

Thought he was hired by the Wash Post to cover the conservative beat and was assumed to be leaning right. Exposed on Journolist as actually abhoring most conservatives and their viewpoints. Resigned and now works for Slate. Where am I wrong wrench?

108 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:02:51pm

re: #103 Stanley Sea

Do you know that he and Ben Smith of Politico have journolist stalkers? Probably Ezra too. Every single post they make more than one comment is harping on journolist. A booga booga creation of The Daily Caller. They just won't let go!

Stan- It's probably safe to say Ezra Klein is in a category of his own.

109 PT Barnum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:03:26pm

re: #104 b_sharp

Anytime.

I won't even charge you the $85.00/hr I charge my customers.

Man, I'm undercharging...I only get $50 per hour.

110 It's a cookbook!  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:04:34pm

re: #109 PT Barnum

Man, I'm undercharging...I only get $50 per hour.

I think his was in Canadian Dollars...

111 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:04:52pm

re: #106 elbruce

And from a purely objective point of view, greater genetic diversity is correlated with greater general health and disease resistance, and decreases the chance of having medical conditions related to recessive traits.

exactly. (thus the approval of Nature)

112 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:05:12pm

re: #106 elbruce

As my sociology prof used to say: Marry in, but not too far in. Marry out, but not too far out. In other words, don't marry someone so far out of your social network that you cut yourself off rather than increasing ties of mutual aid, but bring in some genetic diversity for heaven's sake.

113 Randall Gross  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:06:19pm

re: #80 Killgore Trout

Weigel's a strange dude. Fairly friendly to Ron/Rand Paul and the Tea Parties as well. He's generally honest but I question his taste.

I've been cutting him some slack for awhile since you have to sewer dive for some of the best stories, but sometimes I too wonder.

114 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:06:32pm

re: #86 JasonA

OT: Breaking News! Duke Nukem Forever uncanceled, playable at PAX

also good news while we wait for Mass Effect 3...Mass Effect 2: Lair of the Shadow Broker

115 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:08:20pm

For families of Muslim 9/11 victims, a new pain

After that cruel day nine Septembers ago, Talat Hamdani felt twice victimized: first by fellow Muslims who killed her son, then by fellow Americans who doubted that a Muslim like her Salman died a hero at the World Trade Center.

Now, Hamdani says that with anti-Muslim feeling aroused by plans for an Islamic community center and mosque two blocks from the Ground Zero site, she again feels like a double victim.

"It's worse now than it was then," says Hamdani, a retired middle school English teacher who supports the project. Despite feeling an anti-Muslim backlash in the weeks after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, she says, "at least there was empathy then. I got tons of support. Now I'm getting hate mail."

116 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:08:43pm

To be fair, "pallin' around" is a bit strong for "willing to do an interview with." It seems McCain claimed that he got Todd to do the interview by being vouched for by some hard-right DJ's that he wouldn't do a "hit piece" (i.e. anything that wasn't pure pro-Palin propaganda).

The paranoia described by the Vanity Fair article is at odds with their media ambitions - almost every interview they do ends up making them look bad, but they want to stay in the spotlight. So they have to seek further into extremist-right-wing-land for people willing to do the pieces they want done. This trend ought to be interesting...

117 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:09:37pm

re: #110 JasonA

I think his was in Canadian Dollars...

Bad news. Canadian dollars and American dollars are neck and neck.

I was just there.

118 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:09:44pm

re: #107 dwells38

Thought he was hired by the Wash Post to cover the conservative beat and was assumed to be leaning right. Exposed on Journolist as actually abhoring most conservatives and their viewpoints. Resigned and now works for Slate. Where am I wrong wrench?

You were wrong in saying he "posed as a right-winger" when you came closer to what I think is the truth in your more recent comment saying he "was assumed to be leaning right."

119 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:13:09pm

re: #116 elbruce

To be fair, "pallin' around" is a bit strong for "willing to do an interview with." It seems McCain claimed that he got Todd to do the interview by being vouched for by some hard-right DJ's that he wouldn't do a "hit piece" (i.e. anything that wasn't pure pro-Palin propaganda).

The paranoia described by the Vanity Fair article is at odds with their media ambitions - almost every interview they do ends up making them look bad, but they want to stay in the spotlight. So they have to seek further into extremist-right-wing-land for people willing to do the pieces they want done. This trend ought to be interesting...

Er... it appears in this case that RSM did the seeking, not the Palins, although they certainly should have know who they were dealing with and turned it down.

(RSM) "Getting an interview with Sarah Palin is difficult. Getting an interview with Todd is next to impossible, and I would never have gotten this far if mutual friends -- including Anchorage conservative talk-radio legend Eddie Burke -- hadn't vouched for my bona fides. "

[Link: www.slate.com...]

120 RadicalModerate  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:16:17pm

The Geller/Wilders crowd has another supporter - Pat Robertson's "CBNNews".

Link is from the GoogleCache:
'Islamization' of Paris a Warning to the West

121 sunnyj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:17:35pm

Palin's relationship with the odious McCain goes beyond just this meetup with Todd and their friendships with Eddie Burke - McCain cowrote a book with Palin's Going Rogue ghostwriter Lynn Vincent and the controversial relationship was discussed at the time. In fact, during the time Palin was working with Vincent, McCain somehow obtained an exclusive quote from Palin about a controversial blog post at The Immoral Minority that Todd and Sarah were splitsville - a quote that months after it appeared exclusively on McCain's blog and attributed to Palin turned up in Going Rogue itself.

It would stretch credulity to suggest that the Palins are unaware of the "issues" surrounding McCain. It is pretty apparent that they know and think he is a swell guy.

122 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:17:36pm

Friday afternoon...I'm headed home.

123 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:17:58pm

re: #119 Walter L. Newton

Er... it appears in this case that RSM did the seeking, not the Palins, although they certainly should have know who they were dealing with and turned it down.

(RSM) "Getting an interview with Sarah Palin is difficult. Getting an interview with Todd is next to impossible, and I would never have gotten this far if mutual friends -- including Anchorage conservative talk-radio legend Eddie Burke -- hadn't vouched for my bona fides. "

[Link: www.slate.com...]

Here's Eddie Burke
Eddie Burke

124 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:19:59pm

re: #120 RadicalModerate

The Geller/Wilders crowd has another supporter - Pat Robertson's "CBNNews".

Link is from the GoogleCache:
'Islamization' of Paris a Warning to the West

It's kind of ironic that people opposing the building of mosques are pissed because people are praying in the streets.
I looked into that story earlier. The guy who originally posted the videos on youtube is a big fan of Niche.

125 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:20:05pm

There's not much to the interview piece at all. It doesn't even link to a page 2, nor does it have any direct quotes, just a description of McCain's impressions.

126 blueraven  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:21:21pm

re: #116 elbruce

To be fair, "pallin' around" is a bit strong for "willing to do an interview with." It seems McCain claimed that he got Todd to do the interview by being vouched for by some hard-right DJ's that he wouldn't do a "hit piece" (i.e. anything that wasn't pure pro-Palin propaganda).

The paranoia described by the Vanity Fair article is at odds with their media ambitions - almost every interview they do ends up making them look bad, but they want to stay in the spotlight. So they have to seek further into extremist-right-wing-land for people willing to do the pieces they want done. This trend ought to be interesting...

Certainly no more of a stretch than Palin's oft repeated "Obama is palling around with terrorist" line during the campaign.
Or the "death panels" in the HCR.

Live by the sword...

127 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:22:57pm

re: #117 EmmmieG

Bad news. Canadian dollars and American dollars are neck and neck.

I was just there.

bad for traveling, but good for exports...

/nerd alert

128 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:25:05pm

re: #126 blueraven

Certainly no more of a stretch than Palin's oft repeated "Obama is palling around with terrorist" line during the campaign.
Or the "death panels" in the HCR.

Live by the sword...


Live a good, long time!
-Minsc

129 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:25:19pm

re: #121 sunnyj

Palin's relationship with the odious McCain goes beyond just this meetup with Todd and their friendships with Eddie Burke - McCain cowrote a book with Palin's Going Rogue ghostwriter Lynn Vincent and the controversial relationship was discussed at the time. In fact, during the time Palin was working with Vincent, McCain somehow obtained an exclusive quote from Palin about a controversial blog post at The Immoral Minority that Todd and Sarah were splitsville - a quote that months after it appeared exclusively on McCain's blog and attributed to Palin turned up in Going Rogue itself.

It would stretch credulity to suggest that the Palins are unaware of the "issues" surrounding McCain. It is pretty apparent that they know and think he is a swell guy.

Right you are. More here.

130 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:25:56pm

re: #125 elbruce

There's not much to the interview piece at all. It doesn't even link to a page 2, nor does it have any direct quotes, just a description of McCain's impressions.

The link at the top is not to the interview, it is to McCain's blog post about it.

131 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:27:15pm

re: #124 Killgore Trout

It's kind of ironic that people opposing the building of mosques are pissed because people are praying in the streets.
I looked into that story earlier. The guy who originally posted the videos on youtube is a big fan of Niche.

What I find interesting in this article is not once did the reporter mention WHERE on the streets of Paris this was taking place. I've been to some of the more mixed neighborhoods outside of Paris central, and you will find more people, of numerous ethnic backgrounds congregating in the street, like any big city.

I'll be there in Jan. and it was my intent of speaking to some people I know and getting a more first hand account of the current situation. It's been 3 years since my last visit, and I'll be able to tell if this is being blown out of proportion.

132 deranged cat  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:27:36pm

re: #92 PT Barnum

Windows 7 takes forever to install BTW. Although it helps if you disable your floppy drive first.

[Link: www.cracked.com...]
in my top 5 of favorite Cracked articles. Bucholz is a riot :D

133 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:28:15pm

re: #92 PT Barnum

Windows 7 takes forever to install BTW. Although it helps if you disable your floppy drive first.

What the hell is a "floppy drive"?!?!
/

134 dwells38  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:29:20pm

re: #133 Varek Raith

A hard drive but in a Salvador Dali painting?

135 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:29:32pm

re: #121 sunnyj

P.S. Welcome, hatchling.

136 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:29:45pm

re: #131 Walter L. Newton

What I find interesting in this article is not once did the reporter mention WHERE on the streets of Paris this was taking place. I've been to some of the more mixed neighborhoods outside of Paris central, and you will find more people, of numerous ethnic backgrounds congregating in the street, like any big city.


When I was there it seemed common for a lot of the smaller side streets to shut off car traffic in the evening/late afternoon to allow for pedestrians, farmers markets, food stalls etc.

137 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:32:27pm

re: #127 Aceofwhat?

bad for traveling, but good for exports...

/nerd alert

Most of the exporters here are whining about the dollar being too high.
They'd rather see it at .70.

138 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:33:06pm

re: #107 dwells38

Thought he was hired by the Wash Post to cover the conservative beat and was assumed to be leaning right. Exposed on Journolist as actually abhoring most conservatives and their viewpoints. Resigned and now works for Slate. Where am I wrong wrench?

Weigle is hard to pinpoint on political tendencies. He wrote for Reason for a long time, his coverage of the right for the left leaning Washington Monthly, his gig before WaPo hired him, was fabulous. I find it surprising and disturbing he claims RSM as a friend, but then again, the kind of access he gets to the crazy right and what he does with it makes me think he's gaming them. The Journolist revelations tend to support that notion and regardless of who he claims as friends, I haven't read anything of his that indicates he's providing cover or free PR for the shit stains of the rightwing.

139 Randall Gross  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:33:24pm

re: #131 Walter L. Newton

What I find interesting in this article is not once did the reporter mention WHERE on the streets of Paris this was taking place. I've been to some of the more mixed neighborhoods outside of Paris central, and you will find more people, of numerous ethnic backgrounds congregating in the street, like any big city.

I'll be there in Jan. and it was my intent of speaking to some people I know and getting a more first hand account of the current situation. It's been 3 years since my last visit, and I'll be able to tell if this is being blown out of proportion.

There's a photo gallery in Der Spiegel this week about the Gitans (2nd gen Roma) in France. Here's the article link, the gallery is above

[Link: www.spiegel.de...]

140 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:34:10pm

re: #137 b_sharp

Most of the exporters here are whining about the dollar being too high.
They'd rather see it at .70.

yep. as with most things, currency fluctuation is a mixed bag.

141 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:34:40pm

re: #136 Killgore Trout

When I was there it seemed common for a lot of the smaller side streets to shut off car traffic in the evening/late afternoon to allow for pedestrians, farmers markets, food stalls etc.

That's part of what I am saying in my post above... it's like any large city with ethnic enclaves scatter around, some of the activities in the neighborhood are going to be reflective of the cultures of the people living there.

My few "contacts" in Paris run the gamete (sp?) from socialist to conservative, so I'll get all sides of the story.

142 Walter L. Newton  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:35:56pm

Got to go to work... 6:15 to midnight, a supermarket, labor day weekend, should be slammed for 3 days straight.

See you all later.

143 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:38:28pm

re: #116 elbruce

To be fair, "pallin' around" is a bit strong for "willing to do an interview with."

Looks like the First Dude took the picture while McCain posed on his snowmobile. Is that normal behavior for an interview, or would you say it's fair to call that "palling around?"

144 Randall Gross  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:40:23pm

re: #141 Walter L. Newton

"Gamut" and you also will see in that gallery that the Roma also close off streets.

Also note that the pics of people blocking streets and praying are being passed around in conservative circles via some emails with a context and anti mosque lead in that makes it seem that this was in NY...

145 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:41:26pm

re: #138 Jeff In Ohio

Weigle is hard to pinpoint on political tendencies. He wrote for Reason for a long time, his coverage of the right for the left leaning Washington Monthly, his gig before WaPo hired him, was fabulous. I find it surprising and disturbing he claims RSM as a friend, but then again, the kind of access he gets to the crazy right and what he does with it makes me think he's gaming them. The Journolist revelations tend to support that notion and regardless of who he claims as friends, I haven't read anything of his that indicates he's providing cover or free PR for the shit stains of the rightwing.

I think Weigel is a good journalist. He has covered the right better than most journalists. But I think he is sincere about being a friend of McCain. There is no reason to doubt him when he says it.

146 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:42:01pm

re: #143 Charles

Looks like the First Dude took the picture while McCain posed on his snowmobile. Is that normal behavior for an interview, or would you say it's fair to call that "palling around?"

At the very least, it was clearly a meeting that went beyond the interview.

What I can't understand is the pass RSM gets from even left leaning outlets. It isn't as if his associations were debatable or subject to interpretation.

147 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:44:34pm

re: #143 Charles

Looks like the First Dude took the picture while McCain posed on his snowmobile. Is that normal behavior for an interview, or would you say it's fair to call that "palling around?"

as sacred as a snowmobile is to an Alaskan, i'd venture to guess that's hardly normal behavior for friends, much less interviewers...

148 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:47:56pm

re: #146 researchok

At the very least, it was clearly a meeting that went beyond the interview.

What I can't understand is the pass RSM gets from even left leaning outlets. It isn't as if his associations were debatable or subject to interpretation.

seriously. they'll forge something about GWB's national guard service to score empty points but can't be bothered to interest themselves in the avowed racist in the Palin milieu? cripes.

149 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:49:21pm

re: #148 Aceofwhat?

seriously. they'll forge something about GWB's national guard service to score empty points but can't be bothered to interest themselves in the avowed racist in the Palin milieu? cripes.

Absolutely mystifies me.

150 windsagio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:49:48pm

re: #148 Aceofwhat?

I'll liven things up some, that's a really bad parallel :p

They were probably just as much victims of the forgery as anyone else >>

151 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:50:09pm

re: #147 Aceofwhat?

as sacred as a snowmobile is to an Alaskan, i'd venture to guess that's hardly normal behavior for friends, much less interviewers...

Depends on whether that machine is Todd's 'baby' (primary machine) or just a spare.

152 Bear  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:53:48pm

OT
Don't know if this has yet been posted.

[Link: www.nzherald.co.nz...]

Not good at all. They will require help I am certain.

153 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:54:45pm

re: #143 Charles

Is that normal behavior for an interview, or would you say it's fair to call that "palling around?"

Grey area I think.

OTOH if RSM had been riding the snowmobile in the snow, with Palin, then for sure.

154 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:58:31pm

Somehow, I doubt Palin would have offered the same photo op to a reporter from the New York Times.

But of course, we don't know, because he refuses to do any interviews with the media at all. Yet he found time to hang with RSM.

Yep, "palling around." I totally stand by that description.

155 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:59:16pm

re: #124 Killgore Trout

I can only assume that if these were good Christians out praying en masse it would be something to be celebrated by these folks. You'd think people would realize that religious freedom means religious freedom. Or is that just one of those parts of the Constitution liberals get wrong.//
I can't recall that Christ required people to stamp out other religions either, but maybe I'm wrong on that.

156 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:59:23pm

Todd's also palling around with Hugo Chavez!!! I knew I had read this somewhere.

See the Mystik logo on Todd's snowmobile?

But Palin's anti-Venezuela sentiments do not appear to extend to her husband, whose snowmobile racing team was sponsored by a division of Citgo, [Mystik] the retail arm of Venezuela's state-owned oil and gas company.

LOL.

[Link: voices.washingtonpost.com...]

157 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:59:39pm

re: #154 Charles

OK

158 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 4:59:54pm

re: #150 windsagio

I'll liven things up some, that's a really bad parallel :p

They were probably just as much victims of the forgery as anyone else >>

i admit to valuing the humor potential of that parallel over the logical integrity...although at best they were 'victims' in the same way that a used car dealer would be the 'victim' if you sold them a mercedes with a Kia engine. it's sorta their job to check those things, you know?

159 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:00:19pm

re: #155 calochortus

Christ said love your enemy

160 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:01:28pm

re: #151 b_sharp

Depends on whether that machine is Todd's 'baby' (primary machine) or just a spare.

true. so at least, they were 'Pallin around', and at most, they're practically family.

'Pallin around' seems a very forgiving way of putting it!

161 windsagio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:01:54pm

re: #158 Aceofwhat?

You totally won my unceasing support with 'mercedes with a kia engine'

that was freakin' awesome :D

(you're largely right of course, the hyperbole about that particular thing is just a pet peeve... one among many :p)

162 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:02:42pm

re: #155 calochortus

I can only assume that if these were good Christians out praying en masse it would be something to be celebrated by these folks. You'd think people would realize that religious freedom means religious freedom. Or is that just one of those parts of the Constitution liberals get wrong.//
I can't recall that Christ required people to stamp out other religions either, but maybe I'm wrong on that.

absolutely true. it was good to see the NCOC come out in support of Park51...they represent an awful lot of american christians.

163 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:03:57pm

re: #161 windsagio

You totally won my unceasing support with 'mercedes with a kia engine'

that was freakin' awesome :D

(you're largely right of course, the hyperbole about that particular thing is just a pet peeve... one among many :p)

no worries, my dude. did you see JasonA's breaking Duke Nukem news?

164 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:04:00pm

re: #159 Ojoe

Christ said love your enemy

Yes, but "love" is kind of non-specific in that regard. The Inquisition and various witch trials were (ostensibly) all about saving souls for eternity at the expense of the living body. Surely a form of love. I think Christians are supposed to let people know about the "true religion" but not force it on them, or keep them from building mosques or synagogues?

165 windsagio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:05:40pm

re: #163 Aceofwhat?

No alas, I did not! I heard on the grapevine that they announced SOMETHING about it at PAX, but I'm not following pax closely have a weird prejudice against the penny arcade guys (probaly envy)

166 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:06:42pm

re: #164 calochortus

Well I was raised Catholic & they never told us to do anything more than inform "non-Catholics" about the faith, and pray for them; that was the extent of it.

1950s & 1960s

167 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:08:03pm

And by the way, McCain's "interview" with Todd Palin is one of the fluffiest pieces of right wing slobbery fanboi tripe I've ever read.

168 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:08:34pm

re: #166 Ojoe

That's pretty much what I thought-but then I was raised in a totally non-religious household, so I could always be missing something.

169 windsagio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:08:58pm

re: #167 Charles

Totally convergent goals. I can see both sides thinking 'wow I can totally use this guy!'

170 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:10:38pm

re: #167 Charles

And by the way, McCain's "interview" with Todd Palin is one of the fluffiest pieces of right wing slobbery fanboi tripe I've ever read.

Incoming latent homosexual insult coming your way Charles...

171 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:15:46pm

During the campaign there were times when I heard Sarah Palin repeat her description of Todd Palin as the "First Dude" I thought my head was going to explode.

172 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:17:18pm

re: #167 Charles

It barely appears to be an article, unless there is something more than I saw online. Is this just a 'teaser' or is there more inanity?

173 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:18:30pm

I should have said AND is there more inanity.

174 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:19:08pm

re: #156 Stanley Sea

Todd's also palling around with Hugo Chavez!!! I knew I had read this somewhere.

See the Mystik logo on Todd's snowmobile?

LOL.

[Link: voices.washingtonpost.com...]

Uh oh! And you know who Venezuela supports!'

Ahmadinejad!

Todd Palin is 5 degrees away from Ahmadinejad: Mystik, Citgo, Venezuela, Hugo Chavez, Ahmadinejad! That's well within 6 degree of separation!

Todd Palin! Open up your books!

/

175 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:19:18pm

re: #165 windsagio

No alas, I did not! I heard on the grapevine that they announced SOMETHING about it at PAX, but I'm not following pax closely have a weird prejudice against the penny arcade guys (probaly envy)

yeah, but...it's Duke Nukem!

176 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:19:26pm

I have a somewhat random PJ Media question: Is the Zombie that writes for them our old Zombie?

177 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:20:11pm

re: #171 Gus 802

During the campaign there were times when I heard Sarah Palin repeat her description of Todd Palin as the "First Dude" I thought my head was going to explode.

see, i kinda liked that. but then again, i tend to "dude" a lot...

178 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:20:56pm

re: #174 Gus 802

Uh oh! And you know who Venezuela supports!'

Ahmadinejad!

Todd Palin is 5 degrees away from Ahmadinejad: Mystik, Citgo, Venezuela, Hugo Chavez, Ahmadinejad! That's well within 6 degree of separation!

Todd Palin! Open up your books!

/

Todd Palin ♥ Sean Penn.

/

179 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:23:57pm

re: #178 Gus 802

Todd Palin ♥ Sean Penn.

/

lol

180 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:25:41pm

Wow. Awesome interview on the Olbermann show with Talat Hamdani, who lost her son in the 9/11 attacks.

Very eloquent.

181 compound idaho  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:26:02pm

re: #159 Ojoe

Christ said love your enemy

... and love your neighbor as yourself. What if I hate myself? I'm seeing an opening there.

182 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:26:22pm

When Palin was first nominated for VP I was appalled by the local NPR/Pacifica Radio types who immediately re-spoke the lines they were handed by the political type radio announcers, that Palin was dumb, etc, & tisk tisk tisk, how could Mc Cain be so stupid also...

The listeners-repeaters were so obviously eating up what they were told, & they had not heard of Palin much, or at all, even a few days before.

And then to have it turn out that way, really, is extra galling to me because it makes the uncritical lefties seem quickly smart and right so early on.

Feh.

183 Ming  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:27:20pm

Todd Palin's new racist pal kind of goes along with Sarah's tweet that Dr. Laura should reload, not retreat. Still, it's astonishing that Todd Palin would have anything to do with Robert McCain, whose views on racial matters (as Charles has pointed out) are rather well-known and explicit.

184 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:27:21pm

re: #181 compound idaho

It won't work if you hate yourself.
I suppose the suicide bombers must fall into that category.

185 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:30:06pm

re: #175 Aceofwhat?

yeah, but...it's Duke Nukem!

To give an idea of how long ago I played games, I played the original Duke Nukem, and Hexen.

186 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:30:13pm

Gah...Why is RSM palling around with that hat? When will he change his user name to Drudge manque?

(apologies if the hat has been mentioned, we're into the wine here, it's late here!)

187 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:30:32pm

re: #181 compound idaho

... and love your neighbor as yourself. What if I hate myself? I'm seeing an opening there.

nah, being dissatisfied with oneself is (supposed to be) a universal christian acknowledgment!

188 Kragar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:30:58pm

re: #185 b_sharp

To give an idea of how long ago I played games, I played the original Duke Nukem, and Hexen.

So when is the new Battle Toads being released?

189 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:31:36pm

re: #167 Charles

Slobbery Fanboi Tripe™

190 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:32:10pm

re: #189 Jeff In Ohio

Slobbery Fanboi Tripe™

Rotating Title?

191 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:32:18pm

re: #188 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

So when is the new Battle Toads being released?

I have no idea. I only kiss toads looking for a rich princess.

192 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:32:21pm

re: #184 Ojoe

It won't work if you hate yourself.
I suppose the suicide bombers must fall into that category.

Much like the honest man who lies only to himself. Yet how honest is that...
Any way the real undeniable dividing line is the will to initiate violence. Or the will to refuse such. A personal "no first strike" rule is what contains us from our day to day opponents. It starts at verbal levels.

193 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:32:58pm

re: #186 iceweasel

Gah...Why is RSM palling around with that hat? When will he change his user name to Drudge manque?

(apologies if the hat has been mentioned, we're into the wine here, it's late here!)

Hey, look at the jacket. Maybe we can call him McCainadinnerjacket from now on.

/

194 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:33:19pm

re: #185 b_sharp

To give an idea of how long ago I played games, I played the original Duke Nukem, and Hexen.

Hexen! Dear Lord, i forgot about that game...i played that damn thing to death...

195 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:33:30pm

re: #192 Rightwingconspirator

It starts at verbal levels.

Very important to note that.

196 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:33:53pm

re: #187 Aceofwhat?

There is quite a bit of difference between being dissatisfied with yourself and hating yourself. I'm never totally satisfied, but I am glad to exist and consider that to be a good thing. There is a healthy balance between narcissism and self-loathing.

197 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:34:22pm

re: #190 Ojoe

Rotating Title?

Not sure what that is, but it would be or already is a great porn line

198 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:34:24pm

What a fine blog

199 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:34:27pm

re: #156 Stanley Sea

Todd's also palling around with Hugo Chavez!!! I knew I had read this somewhere.

See the Mystik logo on Todd's snowmobile?

LOL.

[Link: voices.washingtonpost.com...]

Ha!


The Palin's Socialist Snowmobile Sponsor

200 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:34:52pm

re: #196 Irenicum

There is quite a bit of difference between being dissatisfied with yourself and hating yourself. I'm never totally satisfied, but I am glad to exist and consider that to be a good thing. There is a healthy balance between narcissism and self-loathing.

yes, of course. i was being light at the expense of being precise.

201 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:35:01pm

RS McCain got an exclusive statement from Sarah Palin back in 2009, when an Alaskan blogger started a rumor that she was getting a divorce:

"Divorce Todd? Have you seen Todd? I may be just a renegade hockey mom, but I'm not blind!"
-- SARAH PALIN

Yes, that is her OFFICIAL reponse [sic], which I got via phone at 5:35 this afternoon. Take that to the bank.

Of course, she may not remember that, but he sure does.

202 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:35:19pm

re: #199 iceweasel

Ha!


The Palin's Socialist Snowmobile Sponsor

Checkmate! Ha, I love it.

203 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:35:26pm

re: #200 Aceofwhat?

No problem.

204 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:35:41pm

re: #199 iceweasel

brilliant!

205 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:36:01pm

re: #195 Ojoe

Indeed. Thanks for recognizing that.

207 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:37:04pm

re: #205 Rightwingconspirator

Charles tries to keep it that way here on LGF.

208 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:37:24pm

re: #202 Gus 802

Checkmate! Ha, I love it.

heehee:

It turns out that Mystik Lubricants is owned by... wait for it ... Citgo. Yes, that same Citgo that's owned by Venezuela. Socialist Venezuela. Socialist, Hugo Chavez lovin', Venezuela.

Oops.

Guess they should have heeded the advice Sarah Palin gave to President Obama:

"Now is not the time to experiment with socialism!"

...or lubricants! /

209 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:37:39pm

By the way, anybody on the Zombie question? A friend has posted a piece written by a "Zombie" at PJ Media and I'd love to know if it's our dearly departed Zombie. Any takers on the Q?

210 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:38:04pm

re: #209 Irenicum

By the way, anybody on the Zombie question? A friend has posted a piece written by a "Zombie" at PJ Media and I'd love to know if it's our dearly departed Zombie. Any takers on the Q?

The answer is yes.

211 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:38:32pm

re: #205 Rightwingconspirator

& you're welcome.

212 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:39:09pm

re: #210 Gus 802

Thanks! I only found it today, and scrolling through previous pieces I had my concern. It had a certain "smell" factor that made me wonder.

213 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:39:17pm

re: #209 Irenicum

By the way, anybody on the Zombie question? A friend has posted a piece written by a "Zombie" at PJ Media and I'd love to know if it's our dearly departed Zombie. Any takers on the Q?

Yup, it's her.

214 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:39:29pm

re: #206 Killgore Trout

Beck guest Rabbi Lapin: "Atheists are parasites"

I'm not going to waste my time watching that. What is the general gist of his logic?

215 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:40:21pm

Ojoe,

If I understand what you are saying, the Attack Dogs were out in force on Palin when she first came out. It was pretty despicable, I agree. I was offended by it.

Now she can use that fact as a defense when they start looking at RSM.

That's why facts and consistency matter. I hope they don't double up by ignoring RSM.

216 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:40:43pm

re: #213 Killgore Trout

Thanks also. It helps clarify some of the little I just read. Makes more sense now.

217 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:40:46pm

re: #207 Ojoe

One of the reasons I like it here. The learning experience in blogging for me is getting the undertones from the comments alone. No eyes, no body language at all!

218 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:41:43pm

re: #214 b_sharp

I'm not going to waste my time watching that. What is the general gist of his logic?

Atheists are leeching off the society created by Christians without contributing anything back in return.

219 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:42:12pm

re: #209 Irenicum

By the way, anybody on the Zombie question? A friend has posted a piece written by a "Zombie" at PJ Media and I'd love to know if it's our dearly departed Zombie. Any takers on the Q?

Yes, and it includes a crude illustration credited to "buzzsawmonkey," one of the most evil-minded misogynistic creeps who no longer has an LGF account.

PJ Media is a sewer.

220 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:42:26pm

re: #201 wrenchwench

RS McCain got an exclusive statement from Sarah Palin back in 2009, when an Alaskan blogger started a rumor that she was getting a divorce:

Of course, she may not remember that, but he sure does.

That's almost identical to the account she gives in Going Rogue, btw, about the divorce rumours. Some lefty sites call it the creepiest passage in the book:

Some details of the Palins’ private life, however, suggest a reality at odds with Sarah’s image. In speeches, Palin pays tribute to the man she still calls “the First Dude.” One of the strangest passages in Going Rogue concerns post-election rumors that the couple was considering a divorce. “That day in sunny Texas when the divorce rumors were rampant in the tabloids, I watched Todd, tanned and shirtless, take the baby from my arms and walk him back to the ranch house,” she writes, like a frontier Barbara Cartland. “Dang, I thought. Divorce Todd? Have you seen Todd?”

Not surprising. Palin spews only what soundbites she can memorise or fit on her hand, and she repeats them over and over.
(impotent, limp, and gutless! etc)

221 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:42:48pm

re: #182 Ojoe

When Palin was first nominated for VP I was appalled by the local NPR/Pacifica Radio types who immediately re-spoke the lines they were handed by the political type radio announcers, that Palin was dumb, etc, & tisk tisk tisk, how could Mc Cain be so stupid also...

The listeners-repeaters were so obviously eating up what they were told, & they had not heard of Palin much, or at all, even a few days before.

And then to have it turn out that way, really, is extra galling to me because it makes the uncritical lefties seem quickly smart and right so early on.

Feh.

We usually are.

222 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:43:08pm

re: #208 iceweasel

heehee:

...or lubricants! /

You can't so much as sneeze regarding Citgo, et al, without the wingnuts going into convulsions. This is good irony. I found another connection a couple of years ago. It came from a Republican that was criticizing one of the Kennedy for the Citgo/Boston oil donations for the poor. Anywho, this Republican was a lawyer for a lobbying firm that did work for Venezuelan oil interests. Same old crap -- talking out of both sides of their mouth.

For more Citgo/Kennedy wingnut outrage click here.

223 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:43:14pm

re: #218 Killgore Trout

Atheists are leeching off the society created by Christians without contributing anything back in return.

Oh, just more of the 'we live in Christian nations' bull shit.

Creatards really are good at making shit up.

224 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:43:48pm

re: #214 b_sharp

I'm not going to waste my time watching that. What is the general gist of his logic?

Society is built by religious people, therefore atheists benefit from the actions of those people without contributing anything themselves. 'Cause you know, we atheists just can't do anything right

225 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:44:25pm

re: #221 prairiefire

OK but I bet you aren't one of the hard core party line types that abound here in coastal Northern California.

226 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:44:35pm

re: #218 Killgore Trout

Atheists are leeching off the society created by Christians without contributing anything back in return.

good grief

227 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:44:52pm

re: #218 Killgore Trout

Atheists are leeching off the society created by Christians without contributing anything back in return.

That's um. Well, think the r-word. That would be like atheists saying that Christians are leaching off the work created by atheist scientists.

228 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:45:02pm

re: #219 Charles

Thanks Charles. I visited the site only b/c of my friend's posting of the Z piece. The little I saw made me realize why I don't go there. Disgusting.

229 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:45:31pm

re: #218 Killgore Trout

Atheists are leeching off the society created by Christians without contributing anything back in return.

I'd let that Christian wipe my ass. That would be my contribution to his Christian society.

230 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:45:53pm

re: #220 iceweasel

That's almost identical to the account she gives in Going Rogue, btw, about the divorce rumours. Some lefty sites call it the creepiest passage in the book:

Not surprising. Palin spews only what soundbites she can memorise or fit on her hand, and she repeats them over and over.
(impotent, limp, and gutless! etc)

She sounds like quite the objectifier of men, too. Todd better watch out if he ever develops a beer gut, or gets ugly. She'll drop him like a hot moose turd.

231 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:46:12pm

re: #218 Killgore Trout

Atheists are leeching off the society created by Christians without contributing anything back in return.

Not just Christians-this was a rabbi speaking.

232 blueraven  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:46:19pm

re: #215 BigPapa

Ojoe,

If I understand what you are saying, the Attack Dogs were out in force on Palin when she first came out. It was pretty despicable, I agree. I was offended by it.

Now she can use that fact as a defense when they start looking at RSM.

That's why facts and consistency matter. I hope they don't double up by ignoring RSM.

With all due respect, she deserved most of what she got. Yes, there were some that were out of line. Mostly about her baby Trig, which was stupid. But the rest, she earned. She blew in on an ill wind, my friend.
Nasty doesn't even begin to describe her campaign style. Not to mention her downright lies. Bridge to no where? You gotta be able to take what you are dishing out.

233 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:46:29pm

Gets even funnier. According to James Randi there's a Christian lobbying group that lobbies against the metric system in the USA because, get this, "it was invented by atheists."

The metric system is the superior system of measurement.

234 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:46:40pm

re: #226 Aceofwhat?

good grief

See the laughable stuff we have to put up with?

235 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:46:56pm

re: #231 calochortus

Not just Christians-this was a rabbi speaking.

heh, i was trying to think of a witty way to come back with that but you pulled the trigger...

236 ProGunLiberal  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:47:03pm

re: #189 Jeff In Ohio

Sounds like a great name for a band. What Genre would a band by this name be in?

237 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:47:07pm

re: #229 Jeff In Ohio

I'd let that Christian wipe my ass. That would be my contribution to his Christian society.

You sellout.

238 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:47:22pm

re: #225 Ojoe

Well, if I had to compare a score card with them, I think I would be more "centrist" in my opinions. I'm still a hard core Democrat.

239 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:48:11pm

re: #236 ProLifeLiberal

Sounds like a great name for a band. What Genre would a band by this name be in?

Norwegian Death Metal

240 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:48:12pm

buzzsawmonkey and zombie both have some serious wimmin hatin issues. They also have their homophobia to hold onto in the cold lonely nights.

If i had more wine I'd try to get Jimmah to repost buzzsawmonkey's sad post at the stalker site about the difficulty poor buzz encounters in buying 'nonwhorish' underwear.

Ish. Yooos.

241 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:48:23pm

re: #229 Jeff In Ohio

I'd let that Christian wipe my ass. That would be my contribution to his Christian society.

Maybe that will work when you are 92.

242 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:48:48pm

re: #231 calochortus

Not just Christians-this was a rabbi speaking.

Probably the current right wing meme: Judeo-Christian.

Leaves one wondering about a lot of things. Besides Islam we of course have China.

243 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:49:06pm

re: #238 prairiefire

Centrism is where it's at IMHO.

BBL, time to make dinner.

244 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:49:13pm

re: #227 Gus 802

That's um. Well, think the r-word. That would be like atheists saying that Christians are leaching off the work created by atheist scientists.

Well, we are getting close to that. Many American Christians are turning against science. Not just evolution and biology but physics too. Young earth creationists don't have a whole lot to contribute to the advancement of a modern society.

245 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:49:24pm

re: #233 Gus 802

Gets even funnier. According to James Randi there's a Christian lobbying group that lobbies against the metric system in the USA because, get this, "it was invented by atheists."

The metric system is the superior system of measurement.

Well isn't that just so special.

Sounds to me like there are some religious people out there who are afraid reality has an atheist bias.

246 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:49:55pm

re: #237 b_sharp

You sellout.

You can take the host away from the parasite, but you can not pull the parasite from the host...

or something like that.

That makes sense and is funny.

247 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:49:55pm

re: #240 iceweasel

Concern about a type of underwear seems...weird.

248 Kragar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:50:07pm

re: #233 Gus 802

Gets even funnier. According to James Randi there's a Christian lobbying group that lobbies against the metric system in the USA because, get this, "it was invented by atheists."

The metric system is the superior system of measurement.

Aint no metric system in the Bible

249 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:50:33pm

re: #241 prairiefire

Maybe that will work when you are 92.

What? That's why I had kids. I think long range.

250 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:50:34pm

re: #245 b_sharp

Well isn't that just so special.

Sounds to me like there are some religious people out there who are afraid reality has an atheist bias.

Yep. Case in point. Look at the reaction to Stephen Hawking in the past 24 hours.

251 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:50:45pm

re: #245 b_sharp

Only because it does.

252 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:51:04pm

re: #248 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Aint no metric system in the Bible

Doesn't even have British Imperial Units.

253 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:51:35pm

re: #233 Gus 802

Gets even funnier. According to James Randi there's a Christian lobbying group that lobbies against the metric system in the USA because, get this, "it was invented by atheists."

The metric system is the superior system of measurement.

HAHAHAHA!

254 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:51:55pm

re: #246 Jeff In Ohio

You can take the host away from the parasite, but you can not pull the parasite from the host...

or something like that.

That makes sense and is funny.

I'll get back to you on that.

255 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:52:06pm

re: #249 Jeff In Ohio

What? That's why I had kids. I think long range.

I think when I am 92 (God willing) I will be glad to have anybody wipe my ass.

256 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:52:13pm

re: #234 b_sharp

See the laughable stuff we have to put up with?

"All thinking men are atheists."

--Hemingway

we all have our warts;)

257 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:52:19pm

re: #240 iceweasel

buzzsawmonkey and zombie both have some serious wimmin hatin issues. They also have their homophobia to hold onto in the cold lonely nights.

If i had more wine I'd try to get Jimmah to repost buzzsawmonkey's sad post at the stalker site about the difficulty poor buzz encounters in buying 'nonwhorish' underwear.

Ish. Yooos.

The distinct impression I got was that he was secretly incensed at God for creating genitalia.

258 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:53:00pm

re: #251 calochortus

Only because it does.

You won't find me arguing against that.

259 brownbagj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:53:06pm
The distinct impression I got was that he was secretly incensed at God for creating *small* genitalia.

FTFY

260 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:53:09pm

Boxers, men! Let your boys feel free!

261 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:53:19pm

re: #250 Gus 802

Yep. Case in point. Look at the reaction to Stephen Hawking in the past 24 hours.

That even just got a mention on the NBC Evening News. Must be a slow news day.

262 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:54:21pm

re: #247 prairiefire

Concern about a type of underwear seems...weird.

Ahhh-- not so weird for a guy who told us all that feminism was about 'fucking for fun' and that for women biology is destiny.

263 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:54:23pm

re: #240 iceweasel

Back in the days of the frequent creationism/'evolutionist' threads, he used to get quite upset at the idea that a system of ethical behavior could arise from human sources alone.

264 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:54:30pm

re: #255 prairiefire

I think when I am 92 (God willing) I will be glad to have anybody wipe my ass.

Yeah...my sister wipes my old mans. We live long. My Great Aunt Crocia lived to 110. She was a feisty old broad, lived in a log cabin, no running water, no electricity. I kid you not.

265 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:54:30pm

re: #240 iceweasel

buzzsawmonkey and zombie both have some serious wimmin hatin issues. They also have their homophobia to hold onto in the cold lonely nights.

If i had more wine I'd try to get Jimmah to repost buzzsawmonkey's sad post at the stalker site about the difficulty poor buzz encounters in buying 'nonwhorish' underwear.

Ish. Yooos.

bsm is a girl? or a guy buying girl underwear? and why am i asking questions to which i probably don't want an answer? ;)

266 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:54:52pm

The funny part is I don't think the metric system was "invented by atheists."

267 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:55:15pm

re: #266 Gus 802

The funny part is I don't think the metric system was "invented by atheists."

THERE IS NO ZERO!

268 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:55:26pm

re: #257 Jimmah

The distinct impression I got was that he was secretly incensed at God for creating genitalia.

A pecker problem eh? Men...what losers.

269 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:55:46pm

re: #182 Ojoe

When Palin was first nominated for VP I was appalled by the local NPR/Pacifica Radio types who immediately re-spoke the lines they were handed by the political type radio announcers, that Palin was dumb, etc, & tisk tisk tisk, how could Mc Cain be so stupid also...

The listeners-repeaters were so obviously eating up what they were told, & they had not heard of Palin much, or at all, even a few days before.

And then to have it turn out that way, really, is extra galling to me because it makes the uncritical lefties seem quickly smart and right so early on.

Feh.

We were.

Anyone who couldn't smell the idiot stench coming off her from the moment she opened her mouth was so blinded by partisanship that the pig didn't even need lipstick, apparently.

270 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:56:00pm

All this talk about assholes makes us forget there are some good guys...

Me? I heart Danny Trejo.

But, who knew he was so tiny?

271 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:56:30pm

Wired has a story about how cluster networks affect behavior. It might shed light on internet hate and bullying.
[Link: www.wired.com...]

I'd love to get the general take on this. I'll page it.

Done

Excerpt
The research has important implications for people designing online communities intended to change or maintain a behavior, like weight watchers or online health communities, Centola said.

To do the experiment, he created an internet-based health community and invited people already participating in other online health forums to join. Over 1,500 people signed up to participate, and they were placed anonymously in one of two different kinds of networks: a random network with many distant ties (above left), or a clustered network with many overlapping connections (above right).

Read More [Link: www.wired.com...]

272 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:56:39pm

re: #260 prairiefire

Boxers, men! Let your boys feel free!

indeed. i could never go back to tighty whities...

273 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:56:49pm

re: #264 Jeff In Ohio

110!! Did you consider this when partying your butt off when younger? My brothers and I used to tell each other "it's ok, we've got good genes."

274 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:56:53pm

re: #264 Jeff In Ohio

And she was convinced she was two hundred years old. At least it felt like she lived that long.
/

275 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:56:56pm

re: #270 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Cool.
But...
an Infowars link???

276 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:57:20pm

re: #252 Gus 802

Doesn't even have British Imperial Units.

W00t! Imperial Pint= 20 ounces bitches! //

277 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:57:44pm

Here's the video. It begins at 8:53.

James Randi on the metric system and the USA.

278 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:57:52pm

re: #276 iceweasel

W00t! Imperial Pint= 20 ounces bitches! //

Silly Brit.
/I do get to call you that now, yes?
:)

279 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:58:01pm

re: #275 Varek Raith

So?

280 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:58:38pm

re: #279 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

So?

Nothing.
It's just an Alex Jones site is all.
:)

281 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:58:59pm

re: #275 Varek Raith

Oh. Crap.

Note by Alex Jones.

See why I don't go to other sites?

282 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:58:59pm

re: #263 jaunte

Back in the days of the frequent creationism/'evolutionist' threads, he used to get quite upset at the idea that a system of ethical behavior could arise from human sources alone.

He also told Ludwig there was a conflict between being a devout Jew and a scientist.

283 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:59:10pm

re: #265 Aceofwhat?

bsm is a girl? or a guy buying girl underwear? and why am i asking questions to which i probably don't want an answer? ;)

He's a man with, shall we say, very little interest in women, (except to call them whores), pretending to buy underwear for his (most likely) pretend girlfriend.

He melted down in a frenzy of mysogynistic filth largely directed at iceweasel just before he got banned.

284 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 5:59:34pm
285 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:00:08pm

re: #280 Varek Raith

Nothing.
It's just an Alex Jones site is all.
:)

Yeah... oops.

Danny has a great story.

286 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:00:08pm

re: #281 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Oh. Crap.

Note by Alex Jones.

See why I don't go to other sites?

Lol, I know what you mean.
:)

287 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:00:15pm

re: #283 Jimmah

He's a man with, shall we say, very little interest in women, (except to call them whores), pretending to buy underwear for his (most likely) pretend girlfriend.

He melted down in a frenzy of mysogynistic filth largely directed at iceweasel just before he got banned.

So, simply put - he is a sick fuck.

288 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:00:19pm

re: #273 prairiefire

110!! Did you consider this when partying your butt off when younger? My brothers and I used to tell each other "it's ok, we've got good genes."

You mean like a last month?

I never really considered death. My old man was in Nagasaki 3 weeks after they dropped the bomb. He's had over 25 cancers. Death is not in our vernacular, we keep on keeping on. We just need someone to wipe our ass.

289 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:01:12pm

I just got around to reading that zombie article and it's so pathetic I almost don't know what to say.

Zombie is actually trying to support the anti-science Texas school curriculum, by arguing that it's the lesser of two evils.

The greater evil: the commies who control our universities.

290 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:01:30pm

re: #287 b_sharp

And we need to be less fascinated by them.

291 brownbagj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:01:39pm

re: #288 Jeff In Ohio

This topic seems to be of some importance to you. Didn't you mention shitting your pants a few days ago? Something about it being an Ohio thing?

/

292 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:01:43pm

re: #240 iceweasel

Pass the brain bleach, STAT.

293 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:01:56pm

re: #289 Charles

It is a strange little piece isn't it? I couldn't really make heads or tails of it.

294 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:02:03pm

re: #288 Jeff In Ohio

You mean like a last month?

I never really considered death. My old man was in Nagasaki 3 weeks after they dropped the bomb. He's had over 25 cancers. Death is not in our vernacular, we keep on keeping on. We just need someone to wipe our ass.

Insert a paint mixer in a drill, and glue a brillo pad to the end. It should reach.

295 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:02:04pm

re: #290 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

And we need to be less fascinated by them.

What, women's underwear?
///

296 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:02:19pm

re: #283 Jimmah

He's a man with, shall we say, very little interest in women, (except to call them whores), pretending to buy underwear for his (most likely) pretend girlfriend.

See, already this is evidence of dysfunction on his part (well, including the w--- slur). Because the only reason to buy underwear for your girl is to buy her inappropriate underwear! No sane man complains about finding too much racy underwear. Am i right or am i right or am i right?!?

297 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:02:45pm

re: #232 blueraven

With all due respect, she deserved most of what she got. Yes, there were some that were out of line. Mostly about her baby Trig, which was stupid. But the rest, she earned. She blew in on an ill wind, my friend.

Don't assume I'll play her the victim. The Trig stuff was shameless but much of the early reportage was rife with ideologues pressing a partisan attack line which in turn reality ended up matching the story. So in the end, I can agree with 'she deserved what she got' to some degree, but the way it came about reflected on the media and not her.

298 brownbagj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:02:47pm

re: #296 Aceofwhat?

Amen!

299 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:03:18pm

re: #289 Charles

I think the funniest part was the "shocking" revelation that Howard Zinn was a Marxist. Shocka!!! Except for those who actually ever read anything of course.

300 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:03:40pm

re: #290 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

And we need to be less fascinated by them.

They feed off the attention they get from people they are afraid may be better than them.

Haters are big on fear.

301 calochortus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:04:28pm

re: #299 Irenicum

I think the funniest part was the "shocking" revelation that Howard Zinn was a Marxist. Shocka!!! Except for those who actually ever read anything of course.

Read something??? Books are of the devil.

Dinner calls, so I'm off.

302 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:04:36pm

re: #287 b_sharp

So, simply put - he is a sick fuck.

Oh yes. He also defended the biblcal command to kill those who work on the Sabbath, melting down hideously (again) in the process. He has also sent Charles over 100 hate mails.

303 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:05:45pm

re: #291 brownbagj

This topic seems to be of some importance to you. Didn't you mention shitting your pants a few days ago? Something about it being an Ohio thing?

/

Yes, shit is important to me. Have you seen the Bristol shit chart?

[Link: i.crackedcdn.com...]

Your shit is a good indicator of your health. I take shit and shitting very seriously. I had to inspect my 12 year old for 6 months, and report back to her doctor.

304 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:06:20pm

re: #296 Aceofwhat?

You are right.

305 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:06:41pm

re: #303 Jeff In Ohio

Yes, shit is important to me. Have you seen the Bristol shit chart?

[Link: i.crackedcdn.com...]

Your shit is a good indicator of your health. I take shit and shitting very seriously. I had to inspect my 12 year old for 6 months, and report back to her doctor.

Well, shit.

306 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:07:03pm

re: #296 Aceofwhat?

See, already this is evidence of dysfunction on his part (well, including the w--- slur). Because the only reason to buy underwear for your girl is to buy her inappropriate underwear! No sane man complains about finding too much racy underwear. Am i right or am i right or am i right?!?

That is absolutely spot on, Ace. Seriously - imagine looking at a bra for your girlfriend and thinking "this is disgusting - it's designed to accentuate these devils dumplings...GAAH!!!".

307 brownbagj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:07:13pm

re: #303 Jeff In Ohio

Holy shit. Well, only if you are religious I guess.

You do know your shit.

308 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:07:18pm

re: #303 Jeff In Ohio

No shit?

309 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:07:26pm

re: #302 Jimmah

Oh yes. He also defended the biblcal command to kill those who work on the Sabbath, melting down hideously (again) in the process. He has also sent Charles over 100 hate mails.

Ah, those were the days. There was also something about making the Bible mandatory reading in public school. I argued against it claiming a slippery slope unless it made other comparative religious writing mandatory. They would have none of it and cultural chauvinism won the day.

310 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:07:36pm

re: #289 Charles

I just got around to reading that zombie article and it's so pathetic I almost don't know what to say.

Zombie is actually trying to support the anti-science Texas school curriculum, by arguing that it's the lesser of two evils.

The greater evil: the commies who control our universities.

You do so much on pushing back internet hate. I'd be quite interested in your take of the wired article. You have the reality to view the academic here.

311 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:08:16pm

re: #289 Charles

I just got around to reading that zombie article and it's so pathetic I almost don't know what to say.

Zombie is actually trying to support the anti-science Texas school curriculum, by arguing that it's the lesser of two evils.

The greater evil: the commies who control our universities.

If your mind tells you that anyone and anything on the "other" side is evil, eventually your mind will also tell you that everything and everyone on "your" side is good.

Which is a pretty neat illustration of how a lot of people here fell for the Lipsticked Pig, come to think of it.

312 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:08:27pm

re: #303 Jeff In Ohio

PIMF: My 12 year olds shit.

Otherwise, I make my wife do her laundry. Girls are gross.

313 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:08:40pm

re: #306 Jimmah

Mmmm, devil's dumplings!!!

314 brownbagj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:09:06pm

re: #311 Cato the Elder

Not only that, if they are evil then any means necessary to defeat them becomes the right thing to do.

Scary logic for sure.

315 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:09:11pm

re: #296 Aceofwhat?

See, already this is evidence of dysfunction on his part (well, including the w--- slur). Because the only reason to buy underwear for your girl is to buy her inappropriate underwear! No sane man complains about finding too much racy underwear. Am i right or am i right or am i right?!?

It was sad. Here's the comment Jimmah found:

That mullah buzzsaw post in full:

It may be possible to find plain men’s cotton briefs which are not designed to put the package on parade, but plain all-cotton boxers which are not low-cut, or side-slit, and which have a cotton-covered waistband, require a search almost akin to the Holy Grail.

I see what my girlfriend goes through in order to find plain undergarments which are, again, all cotton, and not designed with whorishness uppermost in mind.

Don’t get me wrong; there’s no reason why people can’t have all the silly “sexiness” they want. I’m just annoyed that the other option is virtually unobtainable.
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Ha!

LOL

316 brownbagj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:09:36pm

re: #313 Irenicum

Nom, nom nom.

317 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:09:39pm

re: #306 Jimmah

That is absolutely spot on, Ace. Seriously - imagine looking at a bra for your girlfriend and thinking "this is disgusting - it's designed to accentuate these devils dumplings...GAAH!!!".

some things simply aren't worth imagining/

318 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:10:30pm

re: #315 iceweasel

It was sad. Here's the comment Jimmah found:

Wow.

That is long term job security for a therapist.

319 Kragar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:10:34pm

Saying you're fighting against Evil (with a capital E) means you can let the little evils slide by in the name of the cause.

320 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:10:34pm

re: #315 iceweasel

It was sad. Here's the comment Jimmah found:

so. glad. I. missed.

321 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:10:43pm

re: #315 iceweasel

package on parade


Hah! What an optimist.

322 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:10:44pm

re: #315 iceweasel

It was sad. Here's the comment Jimmah found:

See, most wear these things called "pants".

323 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:10:49pm

re: #315 iceweasel

It was sad. Here's the comment Jimmah found:

Erm. Uh. Ah. Eee. Yikes. I remember that.

[Mouth agape.]

324 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:10:51pm

re: #315 iceweasel

Here's the subtext of that underwear statement:

I've never had a girlfriend. I am a virgin. I might be gay.

325 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:11:26pm

re: #316 brownbagj

Actually that reminds me of a great Blackadder episode featuring Edmund's Puritan relatives and a certain naughtily shaped veggie.

326 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:11:29pm

Sex is not wrong, it is not somehow bad, nothing about it is disgusting. People that are afraid of sex are afraid of some part of themselves.

327 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:11:33pm

Devil's Dumplings? LOL That's the funniest thing I've heard in weeks!

328 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:12:06pm

re: #315 iceweasel

It was sad. Here's the comment Jimmah found:

And now we have LGF members at Burning Man.

Yeehaw!

329 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:12:31pm

re: #326 b_sharp

Sex is not wrong, it is not somehow bad, nothing about it is disgusting. People that are afraid of sex are afraid of some part of themselves.

Let's me straight up. These people are parasites on secular society.

330 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:13:00pm

re: #329 Jeff In Ohio

PIMF Let's be. Typolepsy™!11!

331 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:13:08pm

A look back:

a) Bring up the Folsom Street Fair for the millionth time.
b) Bring up the Kinsey Report for the millionth time.
c) Bring up Dr. Holdren for the millionth time.

332 brownbagj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:13:37pm

re: #330 Jeff In Ohio

I thought you were giving us an up to the moment status.

333 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:13:54pm

re: #288 Jeff In Ohio

You mean like a last month?

I never really considered death. My old man was in Nagasaki 3 weeks after they dropped the bomb. He's had over 25 cancers. Death is not in our vernacular, we keep on keeping on. We just need someone to wipe our ass.

I think our biological makeup of actual DNA is carried down from generation to generation. I believe that there is a genetic memory. I also think there is spiritual realm on this earth, but here is where I will get poohed by the resident atheists.
The strength of our lives and memories, my own joy of life, makes me believe in a God the Creator. A huge mass of energy in the universe, maybe. I don't know.

334 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:13:55pm

re: #321 jaunte

Hah! What an optimist.

Killing me!

335 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:14:05pm

re: #332 brownbagj

lol

336 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:15:02pm

re: #327 BigPapa

Devil's Dumplings? LOL That's the funniest thing I've heard in weeks!

Sounds like a Tom Waits song.

/

337 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:15:06pm

re: #312 Jeff In Ohio

PIMF: My 12 year olds shit.

Otherwise, I make my wife do her laundry. Girls are gross.

I married a highly evolved man who still does his own laundry. He also does the dishes! ***

338 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:15:40pm

re: #337 prairiefire

You married me?

339 brownbagj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:15:51pm

Nite nite lizards.

Girls, make sure to put on the flannel nightgown.

Guys, sleep with one foot on the floor. No unnecessary sexual activities.

And no spooning. It leads to forking.

340 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:16:16pm

re: #339 brownbagj

In my spare time I like to spork.

341 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:16:27pm

Hezbollah places 15,000 rockets on border with Israel: Oren

Israel's ambassador to Washington, Michael Oren, warned Friday that Hezbollah has placed around 15,000 rockets along Lebanon's border with Israel, including some that could hit southern Eilat.

"The Syrian-Iranian backed Hezbollah poses a very serious threat to Israel," Oren said in a conference call focused mainly on the new direct Palestinian-Israeli peace negotiations.

"Hezbollah today now has four times as many rockets as it had during the 2006 Lebanon war. These rockets are longer-range. Every city in Israel is within range right now, including Eilat," he said...

342 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:16:34pm

re: #337 prairiefire

I married a highly evolved man who still does his own laundry. He also does the dishes! ***

re: #338 Irenicum

You married me?

Or me?
I'm so confused!
///

343 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:16:39pm

re: #315 iceweasel

It was sad. Here's the comment Jimmah found:

If Buzzy's girlfriend looks like the one in the center of the top photo here, I can sort of understand the problem.

If she's more like the one on the bottom, not so much.

344 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:17:04pm

re: #315 iceweasel

It was sad. Here's the comment Jimmah found:

what an oaf. "put the package on display"???

no one wants to put the package on display...no one. and if one finds that one's package has the potential to be on display, one should:
1. purchase boxers
2. discard the Robert Plant jeans
3. apologize to one's friends and acquaintances

345 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:18:03pm

re: #339 brownbagj

Nite nite lizards.

Girls, make sure to put on the flannel nightgown.

Guys, sleep with one foot on the floor. No unnecessary sexual activities.

And no spooning. It leads to forking.

Wait wait!

Did you change your avatar?! Love it

346 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:18:13pm

re: #344 Aceofwhat?

what an oaf. "put the package on display"???

no one wants to put the package on display...no one. and if one finds that one's package has the potential to be on display, one should:
1. purchase boxers
2. discard the Robert Plant jeans
3. apologize to one's friends and acquaintances

4. Apply for position with the folks at Chippendale's.

347 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:18:46pm

re: #333 prairiefire

I think our biological makeup of actual DNA is carried down from generation to generation. I believe that there is a genetic memory. I also think there is spiritual realm on this earth, but here is where I will get poohed by the resident atheists.
The strength of our lives and memories, my own joy of life, makes me believe in a God the Creator. A huge mass of energy in the universe, maybe. I don't know.

i won't let them poo you.

348 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:19:07pm

re: #333 prairiefire

I think our biological makeup of actual DNA is carried down from generation to generation. I believe that there is a genetic memory. I also think there is spiritual realm on this earth, but here is where I will get poohed by the resident atheists.
The strength of our lives and memories, my own joy of life, makes me believe in a God the Creator. A huge mass of energy in the universe, maybe. I don't know.

My own spirituality exist no further then dirt. We plant in dirt. We harvest what we plant. We compost what we don't consume. We use our compost to enrich the dirt that will enable us to plant and start the cycle again.

I love the notion of genetic memory, it resonates deep inside me. I'm not sure how much of that resonance is my own projection of a desire to be part of a historical continuum.

349 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:19:09pm

re: #327 BigPapa

Devil's Dumplings? LOL That's the funniest thing I've heard in weeks!

Here's the source of that magical phrase:

350 brownbagj  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:19:23pm

re: #345 Stanley Sea

Yeah. I did. I thought it was pretty hilarious.

The other picture was only supposed to be there fore a day or two and then I forgot to change it.

Enjoy. I will rotate with some other pretty funny pics from time to time.

351 Nimed  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:20:20pm

re: #324 Jeff In Ohio

Here's the subtext of that underwear statement:

I've never had a girlfriend. I am a virgin. I might be gay.

The guy also doesn't like revealing, "whorish" male underwear. The first two seem very likely, though.

352 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:20:22pm

re: #337 prairiefire

I married a highly evolved man who still does his own laundry. He also does the dishes! ***

Well, it's just a job to me. One I slack at just like any other.

353 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:20:26pm

re: #346 researchok

4. Apply for position with the folks at Chippendale's.

oops, that's my fault...'potential' was a poor choice of word.

and thanks for the Chris Farley shirtless dancing flashback/

354 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:20:32pm

Retweet this post, folks! Help get the word out about this.

355 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:20:51pm

re: #333 prairiefire

I think our biological makeup of actual DNA is carried down from generation to generation. I believe that there is a genetic memory. I also think there is spiritual realm on this earth, but here is where I will get poohed by the resident atheists.
The strength of our lives and memories, my own joy of life, makes me believe in a God the Creator. A huge mass of energy in the universe, maybe. I don't know.

Pooh. Pooh.

Recombination makes any genetic memory that could possibly exist peter out. You share 50% with a parent, 25% with a grandparent, and 12.5% with a great grandparent.

356 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:22:06pm

re: #354 Charles

Retweet this post, folks! Help get the word out about this.

I tweeted to @sarahpalinusa

as well as several others.

357 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:23:06pm

re: #348 Jeff In Ohio

My own spirituality exist no further then dirt. We plant in dirt. We harvest what we plant. We compost what we don't consume. We use our compost to enrich the dirt that will enable us to plant and start the cycle again.

I love the notion of genetic memory, it resonates deep inside me. I'm not sure how much of that resonance is my own projection of a desire to be part of a historical continuum.

Of course, "ashes to ashes, dust to dust." I look at mankind as a very large plant, with each genetic line growing like layered scales on our epidermal skin, under the microscope.
The Old Testament laws were actually the best set of regulations to continue a genetic line in those hectic, pandemic early years of humanity. Becoming civilised, climbing out of the swamp.

358 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:23:09pm

re: #356 Stanley Sea

Sweet tweet.

359 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:23:31pm

There was a neat quote about atheists here the other night. Something about scorning the idea of immortality whilst secretly keeping your fingers crossed.

Heh.

360 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:24:14pm

re: #13 jamesfirecat

Since DF isn't here I"ll do the honors.


[Video]

Thank you for that, James.

361 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:24:39pm

re: #359 Cato the Elder

There was a neat quote about atheists here the other night. Something about scorning the idea of immortality whilst secretly keeping your fingers crossed.

Heh.

That's what the clones and consciousness transference are for.

362 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:25:42pm

re: #361 Varek Raith

That's what the clones and consciousness transference are for.

Of course a clone would not recreate your consciousness. =)

363 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:26:00pm
364 Irenicum  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:26:05pm

As number six would say, be seeing you!

365 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:27:02pm

re: #355 b_sharp

You've read the stories about re-united twins that were raised separately but share so many traits?
How is it possible that my chin, my mom's, uncle's, and grandpas' chin going back 5 generations, looks just like my Scottish grandpa's from 100 years ago. We have a photo.

366 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:27:13pm

re: #349 Jimmah

Here's the source of that magical phrase:


[Video]

Hello, Jimmah! What's the good word across the big pond?

367 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:27:16pm

re: #362 Gus 802

Of course a clone would not recreate your consciousness. =)

That's why Glenn Reynolds (Instahack) is a transhumanist.

Seriously. He looks forward to a future where his consciousness can be 'uploaded'. Not. Kidding.

368 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:28:03pm

re: #367 iceweasel

That's why Glenn Reynolds (Instahack) is a transhumanist.

Seriously. He looks forward to a future where his consciousness can be 'uploaded'. Not. Kidding.

Killjoy.
:P

369 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:28:21pm

re: #361 Varek Raith

That's what the clones and consciousness transference are for.

Well, I hope Palpatine taught you that trick right, Varek. We don't want to lose you.

370 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:28:44pm

re: #367 iceweasel

That's why Glenn Reynolds (Instahack) is a transhumanist.

Seriously. He looks forward to a future where his consciousness can be 'uploaded'. Not. Kidding.

Well at least in his case we wouldn't be wasting too much storage space.

371 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:28:54pm

re: #367 iceweasel

That's why Glenn Reynolds (Instahack) is a transhumanist.

Seriously. He looks forward to a future where his consciousness can be 'uploaded'. Not. Kidding.

Heh. I wish him look with that idea.

372 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:29:12pm

re: #370 Cato the Elder

Well at least in his case we wouldn't be wasting too much storage space.

1.44" floppy ought to do.

373 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:29:17pm

re: #370 Cato the Elder

Well at least in his case we wouldn't be wasting too much storage space.

Rimshot!

374 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:29:20pm

re: #367 iceweasel

That's why Glenn Reynolds (Instahack) is a transhumanist.

Seriously. He looks forward to a future where his consciousness can be 'uploaded'. Not. Kidding.

I look forward to a time with fewer IPhone apps.

I can't keep up.

375 HoosierHoops  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:29:31pm

America is false to the past, false to the present, and solemnly binds herself to be false to the future.
Frederick Douglass

376 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:30:01pm

re: #367 iceweasel

That's why Glenn Reynolds (Instahack) is a transhumanist.

Seriously. He looks forward to a future where his consciousness can be 'uploaded'. Not. Kidding.

Some people seem determined to create their own personal hells.

377 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:30:34pm

re: #371 Gus 802

Heh. I wish him look with that idea.

There's some lefty site that ran a photoshop contest of Robot Glenn-- I have to find it. the winning entry had geller and other wingnut heads helping to form his new gigantic robot body...

378 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:30:54pm

re: #376 jaunte

Some people seem determined to create their own personal hells.

Best yet.

379 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:31:09pm

re: #377 iceweasel

There's some lefty site that ran a photoshop contest of Robot Glenn-- I have to find it. the winning entry had geller and other wingnut heads helping to form his new gigantic robot body...

SUPER HYPERSPACE TEAM WINGNUT GO!!!

380 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:31:11pm

re: #359 Cato the Elder

There was a neat quote about atheists here the other night. Something about scorning the idea of immortality whilst secretly keeping your fingers crossed.

Heh.

I just don't buy the idea of immortality. That doesn't mean I'm scorning it.

It would be nice if I had a million quid in my desk right now (perhaps planted by some benevolent fairy?). Would be nice, of course, but that hardly seems a valid reason to believe it.

381 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:31:36pm

re: #376 jaunte

Some people seem determined to create their own personal hells.

Hell is other people-- Sartre

Hell is oneself -- eliot.

382 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:32:25pm

re: #377 iceweasel

There's some lefty site that ran a photoshop contest of Robot Glenn-- I have to find it. the winning entry had geller and other wingnut heads helping to form his new gigantic robot body...

Year 1000. Scientists have decided to shut down Robot Glenn. It's been 1000 years and he can only repeat the same talking points from 2010: "it's de libruls fault!"

383 Ojoe  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:32:38pm

re: #333 prairiefire

A huge mass of energy in the universe, maybe. I don't know.

I think that God is not in the universe at all. God is outside the universe, outside of time, outside of all of it.

& So if you look in the universe for God you won't find anything.

384 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:32:43pm

re: #381 iceweasel

Hell is other people-- Sartre

Hell is oneself -- eliot.

Hell is...
Hot.
...
Yeah, got nothing.
:)

385 researchok  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:33:37pm

re: #384 Varek Raith

Hell is...
Hot.
...
Yeah, got nothing.
:)

Hell is my ex MIL.

She's enough for both of us.

386 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:34:04pm

re: #379 Varek Raith

SUPER HYPERSPACE TEAM WINGNUT GO!!!

Heh...this isn't it, but does have Pammy!

Image: glennversion2.jpg

387 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:34:36pm

re: #386 iceweasel

Heh...this isn't it, but does have Pammy!

Image: glennversion2.jpg

Oh the pain, the pain.

/

388 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:34:50pm

re: #379 Varek Raith

SUPER HYPERSPACE TEAM WINGNUT GO!!!

I hear they merge to form a black hole of Bad Craziness. The good news is that black holes are still vulnerable to resonance torpedoes.

389 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:35:07pm

re: #386 iceweasel

Heh...this isn't it, but does have Pammy!

Image: glennversion2.jpg

Frikkin Cylon Toaster.

390 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:35:41pm

re: #355 b_sharp

Maybe.

What if genetic memories of some kind are stored in .012% of DNA?

391 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:36:05pm

re: #365 prairiefire

You've read the stories about re-united twins that were raised separately but share so many traits?
How is it possible that my chin, my mom's, uncle's, and grandpas' chin going back 5 generations, looks just like my Scottish grandpa's from 100 years ago. We have a photo.

Identical twins share 100% of their genes.

There are approximately 25000 genes in the human genome. 3% (5 generations) of that is 750 genes. I don't know how many genes the nose shape allele has, but 750 is quite enough to cover it. Just as brown eyes are dominant and blues eyes are recessive (requiring that both alleles be for blue eyes), the nose shape allele, which is probably made up of several genes, will also contain dominant and recessive genes.

392 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:36:24pm

re: #375 HoosierHoops

America is false to the past, false to the present, and solemnly binds herself to be false to the future.
Frederick Douglass

“I believe in God... just in case. It's like there's some list somewhere and you don't want to be on it. I don't want to say THERE'S NO GOD! and then die and say, Oh, Hi... Is there some kind of community service I can do?”

-Marc Maron

393 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:36:42pm

re: #389 Varek Raith

Frikkin Cylon Toaster.

Hey! Jimmah and I are watching battlestar-- shhh. Haven't seen it all yet!

DF! good to see you, jimmah is making tea* and says he'll be right there in a sec.

* Not a euphemism!

394 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:36:43pm

re: #386 iceweasel

Heh...this isn't it, but does have Pammy!

Image: glennversion2.jpg

Great, now Glenn Reynolds has powered battle armor. Now I gotta get my Timber Wolf fitted with B-Pods...

/Battletech humor

395 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:36:49pm

re: #372 Varek Raith

1.44" floppy ought to do.

Low blow dude.

But funny.

396 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:37:57pm

re: #395 b_sharp

Low blow dude.

But funny.

Hey!
I could've said a 5 1/4" floppy!

397 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:38:06pm

re: #372 Varek Raith

1.44" floppy ought to do.

That's a lot of memory for Mr. Reynolds. How about the...

Image: card-ibm-new.jpg

398 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:38:34pm

I am against transhumanism if it would allow the "pretty" monsters like Pamela Geller to avoid eventually having to reveal their raddled, hate-ravaged faces to an aghast and horrified world.

399 Racer X  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:38:47pm

Thanks for all the fish!

400 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:39:29pm

re: #399 Racer X

Thanks for all the fish!

Dolphin flounce!
///

401 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:39:38pm

re: #393 iceweasel

Hey! Jimmah and I are watching battlestar-- shhh. Haven't seen it all yet!

DF! good to see you, jimmah is making tea* and says he'll be right there in a sec.

* Not a euphemism!

Glad to see you too. I found the perfect metaphor for what RSM and the Palins are doing to the GOP and how it should react. Hint, they're the tomcat:

402 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:40:25pm

re: #393 iceweasel

Hey! Jimmah and I are watching battlestar-- shhh. Haven't seen it all yet!

DF! good to see you, jimmah is making tea* and says he'll be right there in a sec.

* Not a euphemism!

Tis a good show.
:)

403 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:40:45pm

re: #367 iceweasel

That's why Glenn Reynolds (Instahack) is a transhumanist.

Seriously. He looks forward to a future where his consciousness can be 'uploaded'. Not. Kidding.

I have visions of him waking up in a recycle bin in his digital afterlife.

404 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:41:00pm

re: #390 Jeff In Ohio

Maybe.

What if genetic memories of some kind are stored in .012% of DNA?

How do you guarantee that .012% is passed on? If you want DNA that is passed on from generation to generation you'll have to look at mitochondria.

405 theheat  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:41:29pm

Racism + secessionism + snowmobiles = homoerotic fun for Todd and RSM.

406 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:41:58pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Glad to see you too. I found the perfect metaphor for what RSM and the Palins are doing to the GOP and how it should react. Hint, they're the tomcat:


[Video]

Catsex! How are you DF?

407 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:42:59pm

Evening lizards!

408 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:43:58pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Glad to see you too. I found the perfect metaphor for what RSM and the Palins are doing to the GOP and how it should react. Hint, they're the tomcat:

Don't let Mandy see that.

Wait...what?

Never mind.

409 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:44:01pm

Glenn Reynolds has been a very consistent booster of Robert Stacy McCain. Apparently, he's found a libertarian basis for ignoring RSM's white nationalism.

410 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:45:03pm

re: #404 b_sharp

How do you guarantee that .012% is passed on? If you want DNA that is passed on from generation to generation you'll have to look at mitochondria.

Fair enough, but that assumes that all things feel a connection with their past, when all things most certainly don't.

411 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:45:14pm

RSM's teeth are not going along with the white part.

412 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:45:43pm

re: #411 jaunte

RSM's teeth are not going along with the white part.

Ouch! Shwing! :)

413 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:45:47pm

re: #406 Jimmah

Catsex! How are you DF?

I'm good. I'm wondering if Reynolds was able to download his conscienceness, can we then install him in a computer in the White House. Make him have to listen to Obama and watch as Obama's policies are written out... the machine would suffer a blue screen crash with a day.

414 wrenchwench  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:46:26pm

re: #409 Charles

Glenn Reynolds has been a very consistent booster of Robert Stacy McCain. Apparently, he's found a libertarian basis for ignoring RSM's white nationalism.

I wonder whether it's the same basis Weigel uses. If he needs to use anything.

415 SpaceJesus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:47:14pm

if you feel like losing your minds, check out the comments on this article:

[Link: www.breitbart.com...]

416 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:47:18pm
417 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:47:58pm

re: #410 Jeff In Ohio

Fair enough, but that assumes that all things feel a connection with their past, when all things most certainly don't.

Not all things have the brain power to experience the abstract idea of a connection.

In fact, very few do.

BTW, I think the idea of genetic memory is a non-starter. Our feeling of connection is due to the way we pass down ideas from one generation to the next.

418 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:48:47pm

re: #349 Jimmah

LOL!
I actually watch all of your videos.
(WTF was that, anyway?)
Looked very funny!
*waves*

419 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:49:08pm

re: #417 b_sharp

Yeah, like I said, I know I'm projecting.

420 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:49:14pm

re: #414 wrenchwench

I wonder whether it's the same basis Weigel uses. If he needs to use anything.

Seriously. It's like saying you're "friends" with Ted Bundy.

"Yeah, I know about his dark side, but he can be so charming."

421 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:49:29pm

I always thought Reynolds' 'libertarianism' was bullshit-- a cover of sorts for claiming to not be partisan while mainstreaming RNC or wingnut propaganda and more-- often with just a link, which always lets him claim he was offering it but not presenting an opinion on it.

Instahack, basically.

422 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:49:35pm

re: #415 SpaceJesus

if you feel like losing your minds, check out the comments on this article:

[Link: www.breitbart.com...]

The only sane, and most downdinged, comment;

I love the Drudge circle jerk going on in here.
All religions suck, including Islam, Judaism and Christianity.
Keep preaching your hate and you all are no better than the Muslims you so choose to hate.
423 Aceofwhat?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:49:37pm

re: #413 Dark_Falcon

I'm good. I'm wondering if Reynolds was able to download his conscienceness, can we then install him in a computer in the White House. Make him have to listen to Obama and watch as Obama's policies are written out... the machine would suffer a blue screen crash with a day.

too complicated. use this.

424 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:49:56pm

re: #417 b_sharp

Not all things have the brain power to experience the abstract idea of a connection.

In fact, very few do.

BTW, I think the idea of genetic memory is a non-starter. Our feeling of connection is due to the way we pass down ideas from one generation to the next.

Memes not genes.

425 HoosierHoops  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:50:11pm

re: #418 Floral Giraffe

*Waves*
Hope you are well...I've had a crazy day!

426 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:50:12pm

re: #419 Jeff In Ohio

Yeah, like I said, I know I'm projecting.

That's OK, I like these kinds of discussions.

427 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:50:35pm

I want to join a White Inferiorist group. How would I go about doing that, or do I need to start my own?

I even have a catchy slogan...
We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy!

Seriously...I just looked and there is no antonym for "supremacist"...what the fuck is up with that? I don't like thinking of myself as superior to anyone, regardless of their race. Might as well call it ISWA - "Insecure Selfish White Assholes" - if you want to have a "supremacy" group...

428 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:51:05pm

re: #424 iceweasel

Memes not genes.

Good point Ice.

429 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:51:11pm

re: #415 SpaceJesus

if you feel like losing your minds, check out the comments on this article:

[Link: www.breitbart.com...]

No thanks. That much insanity would make me go clean around the bend.

430 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:51:19pm

re: #415 SpaceJesus

if you feel like losing your minds, check out the comments on this article:

[Link: www.breitbart.com...]

Ah yes. Breitbart dot come. Home of the wingnut brain trust.

Whew. They're almost as bad as the morons over at Liveleak.

431 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:51:21pm

re: #425 HoosierHoops

Packed, yet?
///

432 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:51:36pm

re: #427 darthstar

I want to join a White Inferiorist group. How would I go about doing that, or do I need to start my own?

I even have a catchy slogan...
We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy! We're not worthy!

Seriously...I just looked and there is no antonym for "supremacist"...what the fuck is up with that? I don't like thinking of myself as superior to anyone, regardless of their race. Might as well call it ISWA - "Insecure Selfish White Assholes" - if you want to have a "supremacy" group...

My ability to hurl bolts of lightning from my finger tips makes me better than you.
:P

433 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:52:18pm

re: #432 Varek Raith

My ability to hurl bolts of lightning from my finger tips makes me better than you.
:P

Yes, but I'm not interested in Diety Supremacy...I want to keep this mortal.

434 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:52:51pm

re: #433 darthstar

Yes, but I'm not interested in Diety Supremacy...I want to keep this mortal.

Oh.
*Goes back to zapping Ewoks*

435 brookly red  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:53:06pm

re: #432 Varek Raith

My ability to hurl bolts of lightning from my finger tips makes me better than you.
:P

would you mind charging my cell phone?

436 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:53:13pm

re: #428 b_sharp

Good point Ice.

Nah,-- I reckoned you'd know the ref to Dawkins and the Selfish Gene.

(it's where meme comes from people, not just the internet! "unit of cultural transmission"!)

437 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:53:28pm

re: #434 Varek Raith

Oh.
*Goes back to zapping Ewoks*

Fuck the motherfucking Ewoks. The only good Ewok is a Braised Ewok.

438 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:54:08pm

re: #433 darthstar

Yes, but I'm not interested in Diety Supremacy...I want to keep this mortal.

Who said anything about what you eat?

Oh, wait...you meant "Deity".

439 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:54:37pm

re: #436 iceweasel

Nah,-- I reckoned you'd know the ref to Dawkins and the Selfish Gene.

(it's where meme comes from people, not just the internet! "unit of cultural transmission"!)

First book of his I read.

440 Jeff In Ohio  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:54:43pm

re: #426 b_sharp

That's OK, I like these kinds of discussions.

It's not as entertaining as shit.

Yes, I like circles.

and goodnight.

441 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:54:49pm

re: #438 Cato the Elder

Who said anything about what you eat?

Oh, wait...you meant "Deity".

"Diety" is "Deity" after two manhattans. thanks for pointing that out though. :)

442 Millicent Islam  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:55:54pm

re: #439 b_sharp

First book of his I read.

Me too!

443 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:55:56pm

re: #415 SpaceJesus

if you feel like losing your minds, check out the comments on this article:

[Link: www.breitbart.com...]

Grotesque stuff there.

444 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:56:10pm

Well, I'm out for now. Got algebra to learn books to read.

445 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:56:49pm

re: #444 Cato the Elder

Well, I'm out for now. Got algebra to learn books to read.

If you watched more TV you wouldn't need those silly books.
/Sarah Palin mode off.

446 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:57:16pm

re: #383 Ojoe

I don't think I can go much further up than a mile, anyway.

447 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:58:19pm

re: #418 Floral Giraffe

LOL!
I actually watch all of your videos.
(WTF was that, anyway?)
Looked very funny!
*waves*

Blackadder. If you haven't seen it you're in for a treat. That episode was from the Elizabethan-set second season.

448 darthstar  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:58:24pm

re: #446 prairiefire

I don't think I can go much further up than a mile, anyway.

Well, not without a paddle, anyway...
/

449 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:59:12pm

Where's Samuel L. Jackson when you need him?:

95 snakes found in burst bag at Malaysia airport

KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia -- A Malaysian man pleaded guilty to wildlife smuggling after his bag bursting with 95 live boa constrictors broke open on a luggage conveyer belt at Kuala Lumpur International Airport, an official said Friday.

Keng Liang "Anson" Wong, 52, who was previously convicted of wildlife trafficking in the United States, was charged Wednesday in a district court with exporting the endangered boas without a permit, said Shamsuddin Osman, an official with Malaysia's wildlife department.

The offense that carries a penalty of up to seven years in prison and a fine, Shamsuddin said.

Wong was arrested Aug. 26 after airport authorities found the boa constrictors, together with a few other snakes and a turtle, when his bag broke open on a luggage conveyor belt. Wong was transiting from Malaysia's northern Penang state to Indonesia's capital Jakarta.

SNIP

450 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 6:59:51pm

re: #449 Dark_Falcon

Where's Samuel L. Jackson when you need him?:

95 snakes found in burst bag at Malaysia airport

SNIP

"I have had it with these motherfucking snakes on this motherfucking plane!"

451 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:00:40pm

re: #450 Varek Raith

"I have had it with these motherfucking snakes on this motherfucking plane!"

If it's not some crying baby it's a guy with a bag full of snakes.

//

452 HoosierHoops  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:00:51pm

re: #431 Floral Giraffe

Packed, yet?
///

I hate moving! I lost my Cell phone early this morning while packing stuff in the garage...I found my cell by going to each room dialing my number...After a complete panic I was in the garage pissed off on speed dial walking back when I heard my phone ring..What? I dialed again and a faint ring came from a packed box..I packed my effen Cell Phone in a box...
I'm still packing..But I'm leaving the Cell in a safe place

453 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:02:44pm

re: #449 Dark_Falcon

Where's Samuel L. Jackson when you need him?:

95 snakes found in burst bag at Malaysia airport

SNIP

Keng Liang "Anson" Wong, 52, who was previously convicted of wildlife trafficking in the United States, was charged Wednesday in a district court with exporting the endangered boas without a permit...

How much does a damn permit cost?

454 SpaceJesus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:02:52pm

re: #443 Jimmah

Grotesque stuff there.

i wonder how many of them vote republican...oh wait, all of them.

455 Aye Pod  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:03:09pm

Goodnight from ice and me - catch you all later :)

456 Ghost of Insanity  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:03:57pm

BBL

457 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:04:48pm

The MSM drops the ball again...
ABC Nightline: Paranoia Porn: Inside Alex Jones' World


Haw about exploring the similarities with Glenn Beck? Links from conservative sites like Drudge? Tea Parties? Koch Brothers? Birch Society? Ron Paul?
Fucking pathetic.

458 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:05:14pm

I'm out.
Later gators.

459 Eclectic Infidel  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:06:11pm

Off topic: I just got an email from some fellow "anti-ground zero mosque" Zionists who are distributing a clip from Arutz Sheva, regarding this,

In a letter to The New York Times, published on November 27, 1977, responding to the historic visit of Sadat in Israel he called on Muslims to "give a chance for peace." But he added, "I say to my Arab brothers, the Prophet Muhammad taught ... after the war with the infidels of Mecca, which lasted many years, he acceded to their demands in the Hudaibiah Convention, demands that his colleagues saw as most humiliating. And yet, peace has become the most effective weapon against the infidels.” Muhammad used the period to rearm and eventually conquered Mecca and defeated the heretics.

Rauf added "real peace, is impossible with a pure Jewish state in Palestine ... in a real peace, which will be in our lifetimes, Israel will become yet another Arab state with a Jewish minority."


Crikey. This is 33 years ago! I'm sure I've said some offensive stuff when I was younger too. Glad no one was around to unearth it.

460 Gus  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:07:46pm

I'll be Bach.

461 freetoken  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:11:09pm

re: #459 eclectic infidel


Rauf added "real peace, is impossible with a pure Jewish state in Palestine ... in a real peace, which will be in our lifetimes, Israel will become yet another Arab state with a Jewish minority."

Strange thing is, that's not too far from official US policy. Our promotion of the "two state solution" means that there will be one state (Israel) that is mostly Jewish, and a second (Palestine) that will be nearly all Arab.

If the West Bank and Gaza were just thought of as another part of Israel, the Arab population of Israel would be a significant fraction of the population, and with a birthrate higher they could become the majority.

462 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:12:19pm

re: #459 eclectic infidel

Off topic: I just got an email from some fellow "anti-ground zero mosque" Zionists who are distributing a clip from Arutz Sheva, regarding this,


Crikey. This is 33 years ago! I'm sure I've said some offensive stuff when I was younger too. Glad no one was around to unearth it.

Is there a link to that? I don't trust weird e-mails myself.

463 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:13:18pm

re: #461 freetoken

Strange thing is, that's not too far from official US policy. Our promotion of the "two state solution" means that there will be one state (Israel) that is mostly Jewish, and a second (Palestine) that will be nearly all Arab.

If the West Bank and Gaza were just thought of as another part of Israel, the Arab population of Israel would be a significant fraction of the population, and with a birthrate higher they could become the majority.

How many Jews in WB and Gaza now? There are Jewish towns in East Jerusalem, but there are no Jews in Gaza.

464 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:14:28pm

Q: How do you get Charles to start a new thread?

A: I start posting.

:p

465 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:16:38pm

re: #462 marjoriemoon

Is there a link to that? I don't trust weird e-mails myself.

Here it is on Politico.

Rauf's 1970s letters: Make Israel 'another Arab state'

466 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:23:29pm

re: #457 Killgore Trout

The MSM drops the ball again...
ABC Nightline: Paranoia Porn: Inside Alex Jones' World

[Video]
Haw about exploring the similarities with Glenn Beck? Links from conservative sites like Drudge? Tea Parties? Koch Brothers? Birch Society? Ron Paul?
Fucking pathetic.

Look on the bright side; A lot of people who had not heard of Jones now know of him. It may help check the spread of Jones' insanity.

467 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:23:46pm

re: #459 eclectic infidel

Off topic: I just got an email from some fellow "anti-ground zero mosque" Zionists who are distributing a clip from Arutz Sheva, regarding this,

Crikey. This is 33 years ago! I'm sure I've said some offensive stuff when I was younger too. Glad no one was around to unearth it.

I pasted a chunk of that text into Google and it came up blank. However in a related search, I did find this from Geller's site:

In a true peace it is impossible that a purely Jewish state of Palestine can endure. . . . In a true peace, Israel will, in our lifetimes, become one more Arab country, with a Jewish minority.

Looks like your email sender was paraphrasing.

But he's just talking about demographics here. Can any country keep all of its neighboring ethnicities and religions out forever? Either Israel is Jewish-only and works to preserve that, in which case they're unlikely to have a "true peace" because of the historical Palestinian claim to the same ground; or it decides its a secular, multi-ethnic society, in which case it's not going to be able to maintain a majority "Jewish identity" over the long run.

In any case, Imam Rauf's raison d'etre has always been to go over and speak to the more hard-line Muslims, and use any rhetoric he can in order to mellow them out. In this case, he is indeed arguing that peaceful coexistence rather than open conflict can give them the "victory" they envision. I'll grant that it appeals to questionable motives, but the goals of his argument - what he's trying to exhort them to do - are the same either way: democracy, multi-ethnicity, equality, and peace.

468 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:25:37pm

I don't know if his views have changed, but according to that info, Rauf supports a one-state solution (with full equality and multi-ethnicity) rather than a two-state solution. I must say that I have to agree with everything I've heard from him on the subject so far.

469 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:27:03pm

re: #465 NJDhockeyfan

Here it is on Politico.

Rauf's 1970s letters: Make Israel 'another Arab state'

Well, both Jordan and Egypt have since made peace, so he could argue that he no longer holds those views. But its fair to ask him about that.

470 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:29:09pm

re: #468 elbruce

I don't know if his views have changed, but according to that info, Rauf supports a one-state solution (with full equality and multi-ethnicity) rather than a two-state solution. I must say that I have to agree with everything I've heard from him on the subject so far.

I'm afraid that's impossible. Most Palestinians have been raised to hate Jews and Islam has a serious problem in dealing with other religions on equal terms.

Jews will only be safe in Israel as long as it is a Jewish state.

471 Temporarily Embarrassed Millionaire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:31:46pm

I seem to recall reading that O'Lake flounced [NSFW!!!]. Is this true, and can someone point towards the post?

If not, just insert Emily Litella saying "Never mind!" here.

472 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:32:46pm

re: #468 elbruce

I don't know if his views have changed, but according to that info, Rauf supports a one-state solution (with full equality and multi-ethnicity) rather than a two-state solution. I must say that I have to agree with everything I've heard from him on the subject so far.

Astonishing, that the whole point of Israel so readily escapes people like you.

473 Eclectic Infidel  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:35:38pm

re: #468 elbruce

I don't know if his views have changed, but according to that info, Rauf supports a one-state solution (with full equality and multi-ethnicity) rather than a two-state solution. I must say that I have to agree with everything I've heard from him on the subject so far.

Well on that note, there already is a state where Jews and Arabs can live together in peace, and have full equality, and that is multi-ethnic: Israel.

474 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:38:05pm

re: #470 Dark_Falcon

Most Palestinians have been raised to hate Jews

The fact is, that as with any entire populace, "most" of the people involved would really rather that the assholes with guns knock it off so they can get to work and send their kids to school. Don't underestimate peaceful coexistence.


...and Islam has a serious problem in dealing with other religions on equal terms.

This statement is worthy of Pam Geller's site. It's not "Islam" that has the problem; it's a lot of specific Muslims in specific places and times, as opposed to other Muslims in other places and times who deal with other religions on equal terms just fine (see: Rauf, Feisal Abdul).


Jews will only be safe in Israel as long as it is a Jewish state.

Then it would have to become a lot less secular than it already is. Right now, they're trying to have it both ways - purporting to be a secular state while making various laws and policies based on religion and ethnicity. The one undermines the other, and the other amounts to racial separatism. Either be an open society, or become a Jewish version of what the KKK dreams of. Splitting the difference is just impractical.

475 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:41:31pm

re: #472 Cato the Elder

Astonishing, that the whole point of Israel so readily escapes people like you.

Jews will always be safer in America than they will ever be in Israel. Freedom of religion, democracy and equality under the law for all are the ultimately the only solutions to the historic human problem of religious and ethnic conflict. The reason the Arab/Israeli thing is going to drag out for so many more decades is that so many people (including you) refuse to admit it.

476 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:45:08pm

re: #475 elbruce

Freedom of religion, democracy and equality under the law for all are the ultimately the only solutions to the historic human problem of religious and ethnic conflict.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think Israel already has those freedoms. They didn't take those away, did they?

477 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:48:18pm

re: #474 elbruce

The fact is, that as with any entire populace, "most" of the people involved would really rather that the assholes with guns knock it off so they can get to work and send their kids to school. Don't underestimate peaceful coexistence.

Incorrect. Every poll taken, every indicator measured, indicates that the majority of Palestinians don't want "the assholes with guns knock [to] it off so they can get to work and send their kids to school.". They want the Jews murdered. They cheer terrorist attacks, name streets after murderers to school and send their children to schools where Israel's right to exist is denied.


This statement is worthy of Pam Geller's site. It's not "Islam" that has the problem; it's a lot of specific Muslims in specific places and times, as opposed to other Muslims in other places and times who deal with other religions on equal terms just fine (see: Rauf, Feisal Abdul).

Many Muslims are indeed capable of co-existence, but in any country with an Islamic majority in the world today, the minorities faces considerable pressure from radicals as well as the government. Some Islamic countries still do treat non-Muslims decently on the whole (the main examples being Malaysia and Indonesia), but even Indonesia has had cases where the government has stood by and done nothing while Islamist mobs murdered Christians and drove them from their homes.


Then it would have to become a lot less secular than it already is. Right now, they're trying to have it both ways - purporting to be a secular state while making various laws and policies based on religion and ethnicity. The one undermines the other, and the other amounts to racial separatism. Either be an open society, or become a Jewish version of what the KKK dreams of. Splitting the difference is just impractical.

Israel is a mass of contradictions, but it remains far ahead of any other Middle Eastern country. Our attentions are better spent inspiring governmental change elsewhere.

478 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:48:32pm

re: #428 b_sharp

Good point Ice.

How can it be a meme if I came up with it myself?

479 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:50:26pm

And with that little comparison of Israel to the KKK, you just sank in my estimation beneath further notice.

480 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:53:53pm

re: #476 NJDhockeyfan

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think Israel already has those freedoms. They didn't take those away, did they?

Not yet. But it sounds like a lot of people here want them to. If they adhere to those principles, then they can't keep Arabs out in the long run.

Just as white folks in America are going to inevitably lose our majority (yay!) and become just another flavor in the melting pot, so too is Israel going to have to admit that in the long run that it can't maintain its identity as a nation "just for Jews." At least, not as long as they keep their freedoms intact.

We should recognize at this point that most of the people in Israel are secular, not particularly religious, and not particularly tied to any claims of ethnic identity. However there, as here, minorities can shout extremely loudly.

I'd also like to note that the Arab nations in the region should also become more open and submit to the consequences of that openness, including inevitable multi-ethnicity and the need for equality and democracy as well.

481 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:56:23pm

re: #465 NJDhockeyfan

Here it is on Politico.

Rauf's 1970s letters: Make Israel 'another Arab state'

I have a lot of problems with what is being quoted by this man. For instance, from that article.

Rauf also weighed in on the Iranian revolution in a February 1979 letter to the paper, rapping Americans for not giving Iran apologies for "past misdeeds," as the WSJ put it, and writing, "The revolution in Iran was inspired by the very principles of individual rights and freedom that Americans ardently believe in."

Yet despite last year's "sham presidential election," Rauf still called on President Obama to "say his administration respects many of the guiding principles of the 1979 revolution-to establish a government that expresses the will of the people; a just government, based on the idea of Vilayet-i-faquih, that establishes the rule of law," according to the WSJ.

What's wrong with this? Shouldn't the Iranian people have the same rights to liberty and freedom as we do?

And as far as the "misdeeds" in 1979, well that was the whole Carter, Iranian, Ayotollah scandal if you recall. I don't think we should apologize to the Iranians anymore than I think we should apologize to the Iraqis for propping up Sadaam Hussein in the first place. But it wasn't America's finest hour either.

Rauf's statement regarding "Vilayet-i-faquih" I can't speak to without asking a real live Muslim person. All the interpretations I'm reading are on rightwing sites; that Iranian citizens are under the permanent stewardshp of the mullahs, which with Rauf's other statements, also doesn't make sense.

So it's hard to read what's written about him.

Then again, I'm for the rule of law. This is America and he can build a mosque.

482 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:57:34pm

re: #475 elbruce

Jews will always be safer in America than they will ever be in Israel. Freedom of religion, democracy and equality under the law for all are the ultimately the only solutions to the historic human problem of religious and ethnic conflict. The reason the Arab/Israeli thing is going to drag out for so many more decades is that so many people (including you) refuse to admit it.

Your wrong about that, but I suppose there's no convincing you otherwise.

483 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 7:58:17pm

re: #480 elbruce

Not yet. But it sounds like a lot of people here want them to. If they adhere to those principles, then they can't keep Arabs out in the long run.

Just as white folks in America are going to inevitably lose our majority (yay!) and become just another flavor in the melting pot, so too is Israel going to have to admit that in the long run that it can't maintain its identity as a nation "just for Jews." At least, not as long as they keep their freedoms intact.

We should recognize at this point that most of the people in Israel are secular, not particularly religious, and not particularly tied to any claims of ethnic identity. However there, as here, minorities can shout extremely loudly.

I'd also like to note that the Arab nations in the region should also become more open and submit to the consequences of that openness, including inevitable multi-ethnicity and the need for equality and democracy as well.

Whoa, you are beginning to sound like my batshit crazy sister-in-law. Do you also frequent Jeff Rense's website like her as well?

484 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:00:13pm

re: #481 marjoriemoon

Hmmm. A nostalgic or glamorized view of the Iranian revolution?

485 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:01:56pm

When it comes to Israel, almost every left-liberal I know is a unicorn-riding moonbat. The LGF crowd not excepted.

486 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:02:54pm

re: #485 Cato the Elder

Coincidentally, the top post at Harry's Place today:
[Link: hurryupharry.org...]

487 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:03:41pm

re: #485 Cato the Elder

When it comes to Israel, almost every left-liberal I know is a unicorn-riding moonbat. The LGF crowd not excepted.

I saw that very well the other day at HuffPo. What is their problem with Israel?

488 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:05:31pm

re: #479 Cato the Elder

And with that little comparison of Israel to the KKK, you just sank in my estimation beneath further notice.

Holy Confederate Flag Batman!

ElBrucie:

In case you weren't listening before, I'll repeat it.

Israel is not a theocracy, but rather operates under a parliamentary system as a democratic republic with universal suffrage. All citizens have a voice, Jew and gentile alike.

Many people don't grasp that. They mix the Jewish religion with Jewish nationality. Meaning that Jews don't have to be religious to be a Jew. They can be Jewish culturally. Christianity is a religion. You have to believe in the religion to be Christian.

489 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:08:18pm

re: #477 Dark_Falcon

Incorrect. Every poll taken, every indicator measured, indicates that the majority of Palestinians don't want "the assholes with guns knock [to] it off so they can get to work and send their kids to school.". They want the Jews murdered.

Can I have a list of some of those polls? I found this one, which debunks your "every" claim right off the bat.

One problem I have with the Middle East is a lack of solid, regular polling data; it would actually settle a lot of the conflicts there if people knew what the people across the border actually thought instead of what their asshole leaders told them they thought. But good polls require good infrastructure, so...

But in any case regardless of poll numbers, I've heard of a number of Palestinians who just want peace. Maybe we should back those guys and help them convince their neighbors that that's the way to go?


Many Muslims are indeed capable of co-existence, but in any country with an Islamic majority in the world today, the minorities faces considerable pressure from radicals as well as the government.

Let's not forget Turkey. Why do people always forget Turkey? I'm also incredibly pleased that in Pakistan, after Bhenazir Bhutto got killed, they elected neither the hardline military party nor the hardline religious party, but voted mostly for the most rational/secular "middle ground" party. That was a few years ago, though.

Some Islamic countries still do treat non-Muslims decently on the whole (the main examples being Malaysia and Indonesia), but even Indonesia has had cases where the government has stood by and done nothing while Islamist mobs murdered Christians and drove them from their homes.

Don't forget Iran (oddly enough) while you're at it. But mentioning mobs of one religion attacking people of another just supports my main thesis: equality. It's been a century or two since mobs of Christians murdered people of other religions, but it's far from impossible.


Israel is a mass of contradictions, but it remains far ahead of any other Middle Eastern country. Our attentions are better spent inspiring governmental change elsewhere.


I think that we can do more than one thing at a time. I certainly don't want to downplay the extensive (and greater) problems with the rest of the Arab world, but I don't think that bringing up either discussion is a reason to support pushing the other one onto a "back burner" of some sort.

490 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:09:30pm

re: #487 NJDhockeyfan

I saw that very well the other day at HuffPo. What is their problem with Israel?

they can't get their heads around the fact that the side with great power is the right side. They're so used to "rooting for the underdog" they've forgotten that in this case the "underdog" is a people in the grips of a terroristic death cult (Not it is the militant Jew-hate and glorification of death and murder that defines the death cult, not Islam itself, though the enemy does use Islam to justify their actions.)

491 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:10:24pm

re: #482 marjoriemoon

Your wrong about that, but I suppose there's no convincing you otherwise.

Nope. I believe in American principles too strongly to believe that sorting out countries by ethnicity/religion as "home states" is a better idea. Most of the people who believe that are die-hard racists. Except when it comes to Israel.

492 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:12:22pm

re: #485 Cato the Elder

When it comes to Israel, almost every left-liberal I know is a unicorn-riding moonbat. The LGF crowd not excepted.

In the LGF crowd, it seems that saying that Israel gets it right only 98% of the time automatically qualifies you a unicorn-riding moonbat. And discussing the remaining 2% is completely verboten.

493 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:15:37pm

re: #491 elbruce

Nope. I believe in American principles too strongly to believe that sorting out countries by ethnicity/religion as "home states" is a better idea. Most of the people who believe that are die-hard racists. Except when it comes to Israel.

And with the current climate against the Muslims, you still believe that?

494 Kronocide  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:16:33pm

re: #491 elbruce

Nope. I believe in American principles too strongly to believe that sorting out countries by ethnicity/religion as "home states" is a better idea. Most of the people who believe that are die-hard racists. Except when it comes to Israel.

Try ethnicity/religion/government.

It sure seems like you're saying 'if you believe in a two state solution you're on the side of die hard racists.'

495 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:17:26pm

re: #479 Cato the Elder

And with that little comparison of Israel to the KKK, you just sank in my estimation beneath further notice.


I'm making a very specific point here. Racial separatists believe in racial separation. Either you think that racial separation is a good idea or you think that it is a bad idea. In fact, I didn't compare Israel to the KKK at all*. What I said quite intentionally was, "Either be an open society, or become a Jewish version of what the KKK dreams of." That is, either be a completely monocultural/mono-ethinc state, with all of your laws supporting that, or be an open democracy. I know which side I think would work best. And I know which side I think the KKK would work best. Which side do you think would work best?

* funny how when you bring up a comparison between a movement and a very specific line of argumentation regarding a subject, that people always jump in and claim you compared the movement to the subject.

496 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:17:46pm

re: #489 elbruce

I'm all for peace, but this:

Call for an independent Palestinian state with sovereignty in the West Bank, Gaza Strip and most of East Jerusalem (or in a shared Jerusalem). This means a Palestinian State that is viable and includes most of the land -- with only minor modifications made through land-for-land swaps. We need a movement to define exactly what we are expecting because clearly, Israelis are not hearing us.

Ain't happening. Jerusalem shall always remain the undivided capitol of Israel and if the war never ends due to that little "stickler" than it never ends. They can have a fair and just state all their own without Jerusalem as the capitol if they wanted it.

Arafat, by the way, turned down that very deal in 2000. A sovereign Gaza and 95% of the West Bank.

497 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:18:13pm

re: #487 NJDhockeyfan

I saw that very well the other day at HuffPo. What is their problem with Israel?

I dunno. Linky pleez?

498 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:18:25pm

re: #495 elbruce

I'm making a very specific point here. Racial separatists believe in racial separation. Either you think that racial separation is a good idea or you think that it is a bad idea. In fact, I didn't compare Israel to the KKK at all*. What I said quite intentionally was, "Either be an open society, or become a Jewish version of what the KKK dreams of." That is, either be a completely monocultural/mono-ethinc state, with all of your laws supporting that, or be an open democracy. I know which side I think would work best. And I know which side I think the KKK would work best. Which side do you think would work best?

* funny how when you bring up a comparison between a movement and a very specific line of argumentation regarding a subject, that people always jump in and claim you compared the movement to the subject.

How is Israel racially separated?

499 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:19:15pm

re: #491 elbruce

Harry Truman stated that he was for creating the nation state of Israel.
"For his part, Truman once asserted,
'Hitler had been murdering Jews right and left. I saw it, and I dream about it even to this day. The Jews needed some place where they could go. It is my attitude that the American government couldn't stand idly by while the victims [of] Hitler's madness are not allowed to build new lives.' "[134]

500 ProGunLiberal  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:22:40pm

re: #496 marjoriemoon

Why do I have skepticism over what happens to the temple mount and if the Muslims will be able to visit it Israel gets. Considering this poll below, I worry what happens to the Dome of the Rock and the Al-Aqsa Mosque itself.

[Link: www.israelnationalnews.com...]

501 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:24:09pm

re: #490 Dark_Falcon

they can't get their heads around the fact that the side with great power is the right side. They're so used to "rooting for the underdog" they've forgotten that in this case the "underdog" is a people in the grips of a terroristic death cult (Not it is the militant Jew-hate and glorification of death and murder that defines the death cult, not Islam itself, though the enemy does use Islam to justify their actions.)


Hey, for the record I'd like to mention that the anti-Israeli propaganda machine is one of the hugest problems out there. I just don't know how to deal with that, since media tends to be slippery.

But yeah, us left-leaning types do tend to knee-jerk towards the underdog. But then we also spend an inordinate amount of time pondering where our knee jerked and why and what it means, so I'm pretty confident in this: if you want change, talk to the people who have the power. Provided you've got any leverage.

On a side note, if we can get some proper energy independence going, we'll be in a really sweet position to lean on the Arab nations about how they're doing things. Eight years of Bush have taught us that rattling sabres at people who you have no feasible intention of attacking (Iran, North Korea) is worse than not doing anything at all. Eight years of Clinton have taught us that dealing with things that you can actually affect can add up to a lot of effect over time.

502 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:24:59pm

re: #500 ProLifeLiberal

This part of the poll seems to mean there is a majority in favor of not doing anything about it:

Should the State of Israel take active steps towards the reconstruction? Forty-eight percent said no, while 27% said yes.
503 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:25:00pm

re: #497 elbruce

I dunno. Linky pleez?

No thanks, I don't want to jump into that cesspool again. I spent some time reading the comments on two separate threads about the attack by Hamas that killed 4 Israelis (one was a pregnant woman). The love for Hamas at HuffPo was incredible. Lots of them even blamed Israel for the murders. Add in the usual anti-Semitism posts and I had to leave.

504 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:26:31pm

re: #500 ProLifeLiberal

Why do I have skepticism over what happens to the temple mount and if the Muslims will be able to visit it Israel gets. Considering this poll below, I worry what happens to the Dome of the Rock and the Al-Aqsa Mosque itself.

[Link: www.israelnationalnews.com...]

You probably meant to type your thoughts a bit more clearly. I don't know what you're asking?

You worry what's going to happen to the Dome of the Rock? Um... nothing?

If they can rebuild the Temple despite it, then that's wonderful.

505 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:27:10pm

re: #502 jaunte

This part of the poll seems to mean there is a majority in favor of not doing anything about it:

Yea, but then there was this:

Forty nine percent said they want the rebuilding of the Holy Temple, while 23% said they do not. The remainder said they were unsure.

So they want it, but not now, I'm supposing that means.

506 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:29:31pm

re: #505 marjoriemoon

It seems as if the question is open to some people responding: "that would be nice," and they would be counted in the "wants it rebuilt" column. If on further questioning, they don't want any concrete action taken, that seems more significant.

507 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:30:05pm

Liberal straw men presented by concern trolls.

Not entertaining enough to keep me reading here.

508 ProGunLiberal  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:30:11pm

My computer is having massive trouble with the thread's length. That's causing me to goof up when typing.

"Why do I have skepticism over what happens to the temple mount if Israel gets it, and if Muslims will even be allowed to visit it. Considering this poll below, I worry what happens to the Dome of the Rock and the Al-Aqsa Mosque itself." Is what I want to say. Truthfully, I feel more comfortable with the Palestinians holding the Temple Mount.

509 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:30:26pm

re: #498 marjoriemoon

How is Israel racially separated?

Well (and I keep getting shit for this, as if a minority shouldn't care) the name of the country is "Israel," which means "the Jewish people." It'd be like having a country named "Islam" or "Christianity." The flag is a mogendavid superimposed over a tallit. Right of return applies to Jews only, but not to Palestinians, Canaanites, Samaritans, or any other group with a purported historic claim to that region as its homeland. There are a variety of other local laws that the Orthodox's have gotten pushed through so they don't have to encounter anything they don't like in specific areas.

Other than that, Israel also happens to be the most open and democratic nation in the region. I'm not saying that it is racially separated, I was just originally clarifying Imam Rauf's observation that if it isn't, it's going to end up with a majority of Arabs living there in the long run anyway.

510 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:32:38pm

re: #503 NJDhockeyfan

No thanks, I don't want to jump into that cesspool again. I spent some time reading the comments on two separate threads about the attack by Hamas that killed 4 Israelis (one was a pregnant woman). The love for Hamas at HuffPo was incredible. Lots of them even blamed Israel for the murders. Add in the usual anti-Semitism posts and I had to leave.

I don't read comments at Huffpo. Occasionally I'll drop one and move on, but there's no real community there. Between the fact that all comments have to go through a mod before they appear, and the multi-paging (with no tools to "find" directly to your last comment), there's no point in trying to hold down a conversation with anybody. You might as well hold YouTube responsible for its "commenting community."

511 Eclectic Infidel  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:34:16pm

re: #479 Cato the Elder

And with that little comparison of Israel to the KKK, you just sank in my estimation beneath further notice.

ELBRUCE is just spewing forth one talking point after another. Facts be damned, but this is the world we live in now.

512 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:37:18pm

re: #510 elbruce

I don't read comments at Huffpo. Occasionally I'll drop one and move on, but there's no real community there. Between the fact that all comments have to go through a mod before they appear, and the multi-paging (with no tools to "find" directly to your last comment), there's no point in trying to hold down a conversation with anybody. You might as well hold YouTube responsible for its "commenting community."

There were over 2000 posts on each thread when I left. That's a lot for blog with no community and all those disgusting posts I read were approved by a mod? That speaks volumes about the people who run the site.

513 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:39:44pm

re: #499 prairiefire

Harry Truman stated that he was for creating the nation state of Israel.
"For his part, Truman once asserted,
'Hitler had been murdering Jews right and left. I saw it, and I dream about it even to this day. The Jews needed some place where they could go. It is my attitude that the American government couldn't stand idly by while the victims [of] Hitler's madness are not allowed to build new lives.' "[134]

Except we did. We created another state explicitly because we stood idly by while the victims of the Holocaust were not allowed to build new lives.

[Link: www.ushmm.org...]

Moving to America was the first option. We declined, so Israel was the second option.

514 Gitarzan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:40:28pm

re: #6 Cato the Elder

And so this is the kind of reporter the Palins feel comfortable around.

Right...nothing but softball questions, I bet.

515 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:40:51pm

More obsessive bitching about the flag and the very name of the nation of Israel.

It smells bad in her all the sudden.

516 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:41:41pm

re: #515 Cato the Elder

"here"

517 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:42:47pm

re: #511 eclectic infidel

ELBRUCE is just spewing forth one talking point after another. Facts be damned, but this is the world we live in now.

I addressed that question in #495. I know of no talking points that have informed my opinion on these matters. In fact, the terms you're using sound uncomfortably like boilerplate rhetoric.

518 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:46:06pm

re: #515 Cato the Elder

More obsessive bitching about the flag and the very name of the nation of Israel.


It's not obsessive bitching. I was asked quite specifically what about Israel is tied to Jewish identity rather than to a pluralistic secular society. I listed those things.

As a matter of fact, this entire discussion has consisted of drawing me out from what was initially a very mild statement of clarification of Imam Rauf's statement into pretty much anything you can pick apart into a "that guy hates Israel" thread. That's OK. I can take y'all on if that's the best entertainment to be had of a Friday night. But it's going to involve occasionally reminding you of the previous context you're lifting my statements from.

519 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:48:43pm

re: #512 NJDhockeyfan

There were over 2000 posts on each thread when I left. That's a lot for blog with no community and all those disgusting posts I read were approved by a mod? That speaks volumes about the people who run the site.


The less of a community, the more the posts are. Look at it this way - did you read all 2000 comments? Hell no. Neither did anybody else before adding a comment. that's no community. The comments section of Huffpo is more like YouTube or even 4chan. As for the pre-moderation, it doesn't seem to do anything to keep the discussion on any kind of even keel; it only serves to prevent any kind of back-and-forth conversation.

520 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:52:17pm

re: #513 elbruce

Except we did. We created another state explicitly because we stood idly by while the victims of the Holocaust were not allowed to build new lives.

[Link: www.ushmm.org...]

Moving to America was the first option. We declined, so Israel was the second option.

There is a difference of 6 years of world war between our two sourced dates.

521 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:54:41pm

re: #520 prairiefire

There is a difference of 6 years of world war between our two sourced dates.


There is. And I'm sure we would have been happy(ish) to take all of the Jews after the war was over, if they could trust us. Which they couldn't... because we sent a boatload of 'em back to die.

Seriously people, do you really believe that the only or even best solution to multi-religio/ethnic conflict is to have completely segregated nations? Then GTFO of my America.

522 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:55:35pm

re: #519 elbruce

The less of a community, the more the posts are. Look at it this way - did you read all 2000 comments? Hell no. Neither did anybody else before adding a comment. that's no community. The comments section of Huffpo is more like YouTube or even 4chan. As for the pre-moderation, it doesn't seem to do anything to keep the discussion on any kind of even keel; it only serves to prevent any kind of back-and-forth conversation.

Call it whatever you want. Now I know it's the mods who approve hundreds of anti-Semitic comments. That's all I needed to know. Thanks for explaining how it works to me.

523 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 8:57:25pm

re: #521 elbruce

There is. And I'm sure we would have been happy(ish) to take all of the Jews after the war was over, if they could trust us. Which they couldn't... because we sent a boatload of 'em back to die.

Seriously people, do you really believe that the only or even best solution to multi-religio/ethnic conflict is to have completely segregated nations? Then GTFO of my America.

The creation of Israel was in 1945. It has never been a completely segregated nation.

524 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:00:03pm

It's just a matter of time before we rise up and slaughter them all, eh?

Elbruce, you ever heard of man name Meir Kahane? He advocated for a 100% Jewish Israel. No Arabs. He didn't want to kill them. He wanted them relocated, and Israel would pay for it. No representation in the Knesset (like now), of course, because there would be no one to represent. After his assassination, his followers became violent and are currently on terrorist lists.

His views, however, we shocking to hear on their face to most Jews. He traveled around the globe in the 70s when Soviet Jewry was on everyone's mind (concerning Israel), freeing the Jews from the gulag and allowing emigration to Israel. The idea that everyone can get along was much stronger then than it is now so hearing that Israel should kick out the Arabs wasn't popular then or now.

Whatever is called, and it's been named many things and governed by many people, it will still be the Jewish homeland. That doesn't mean THEN in ancient times, as it doesn't NOW, that Israel is for Jews alone. You can't see that? I can't help you.

525 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:00:39pm

President Obama's approval rating at 50% in latest CNN poll.[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]

526 ozbloke  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:00:54pm

re: #519 elbruce

elbruce,

I lurk, its what I do...

To all of you having this chat, thank you.
It has been an interesting education, thoughtful and respectful.
elbruce, I admire your ability to keep your cool, thanks for being here.

Thats why I come here, oh that and waiting for the next piece of Cato's wit and/or LVQ's knowledge...

Thank you too Charles, best blog ever...

Cheers

527 ozbloke  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:06:40pm

Shit I killed the thread!

528 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:08:00pm

re: #527 ozbloke

Shit I killed the thread!

Hi Oz!

What's the word from Christchurch?

529 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:08:12pm

re: #518 elbruce

It's not obsessive bitching. I was asked quite specifically what about Israel is tied to Jewish identity rather than to a pluralistic secular society. I listed those things.

As a matter of fact, this entire discussion has consisted of drawing me out from what was initially a very mild statement of clarification of Imam Rauf's statement into pretty much anything you can pick apart into a "that guy hates Israel" thread. That's OK. I can take y'all on if that's the best entertainment to be had of a Friday night. But it's going to involve occasionally reminding you of the previous context you're lifting my statements from.

Jewish identity or culture is tied to lifestyle, as opposed to religion, or God. Meaning that the state law says that public restaurants will keep kosher. That Jewish storeowners close their shops on Friday night and Saturday for Shabbos. Not that anyone does, but if you wanted a cheeseburger, than you most certainly can do that. You just can't buy one already made.

If you want to shop on Saturdays, you go to the Arab market. I don't know how safe that area is now, but it's a big tourist attraction, or was.

No fashion police, prayer police or food police in sight.

530 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:08:25pm

re: #527 ozbloke

Shit I killed the thread!

Oh that happens to me all the time!

531 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:09:43pm

I seem to be defending two sides here. On the one hand, if I say Israel should be completely open, I get "don't you know why it was created?" On the other hand, if I refer to any Jewish-centric tendencies, I get "Israel is a completely secular state!"

Like I said way back at the beginning, pick one: racial separatism or open society. As long as they keep trying to split the difference, the "pro-Israel lobby" (as demonstrated here) will remain utterly confused as to which lines of attack they're advocating, and what it is exactly that they're "pro-."

532 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:10:10pm

re: #526 ozbloke

I'm surprised you can't see me gritting my teeth.

(that's teeth gritting there)

533 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:10:52pm

re: #531 elbruce

I think you're creating a false dichotomy.

534 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:11:08pm

re: #522 NJDhockeyfan

Call it whatever you want. Now I know it's the mods who approve hundreds of anti-Semitic comments.


Not all of their threads are flagged for pre-moderation. If you don't post a link, I can't have any idea what you're talking about.

535 Gitarzan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:11:57pm

re: #354 Charles

Retweet this post, folks! Help get the word out about this.

Not that I'm a Luddite or anything, but I finally came off it and registered for Twitter...post duly retweeted.

536 ozbloke  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:13:26pm

re: #528 Stanley Sea

Hi Stanley,

To be honest I haven't seen much (photos/video) in the Australian news papers about it.

I did check out:
[Link: www.nzherald.co.nz...]
I think its one one of NZ's leading papers.

They only had a one video at the time, and a few photos.

I do believe they have been lucky re injuries/deaths, just some damage to some homes and businesses.

537 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:14:06pm

re: #533 jaunte

I think you're creating a false dichotomy.


I am quite intentionally doing that, thanks for catching it finally (instead of switching back and forth between sides to argue against but never for). Israel is more likely to trend towards democracy and equality. I fully advocate that. But it's going to mean that its historic role as a "homeland for Jews " is going to end up becoming completely obsolete, just based on the demographics. This is the original point that Imam Rauf was making.

538 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:14:07pm

re: #532 marjoriemoon

I'm surprised you can't see me gritting my teeth.

(that's teeth gritting there)

Oh, I drew a little picture... let me try this

(--)

teeth gritting.

539 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:15:20pm

re: #537 elbruce

That is a pretty big assumption regarding the fate of Israel. And one I don't agree with.

540 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:15:40pm

re: #538 marjoriemoon

Oh, I drew a little picture... let me try this

(--)

teeth gritting.

(  ゚ _ゝ゚)

541 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:16:06pm

re: #536 ozbloke

Thank you.

542 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:16:08pm

re: #531 elbruce

I seem to be defending two sides here. On the one hand, if I say Israel should be completely open, I get "don't you know why it was created?" On the other hand, if I refer to any Jewish-centric tendencies, I get "Israel is a completely secular state!"

Like I said way back at the beginning, pick one: racial separatism or open society. As long as they keep trying to split the difference, the "pro-Israel lobby" (as demonstrated here) will remain utterly confused as to which lines of attack they're advocating, and what it is exactly that they're "pro-."

Ack, who said it was a completely secular state? You are looking for extremes and with M.E. politics extremes are for the extremists. The rest of us understand the various hills and valleys. Israel can exist as a Jewish state with both "religious" and "secular" values.

*Gay pride parades in Israel*

Just had to shout that.

And now I'm done :)

543 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:16:19pm

re: #538 marjoriemoon

Oh, I drew a little picture... let me try this

(--)

teeth gritting.

Crap~ that's how I cracked my tooth that almost abscessed. Kids are back in school, it's cool.

544 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:16:50pm

re: #540 Varek Raith

(  ゚ _ゝ゚)

I knew we kept you around for something! lol

545 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:17:23pm

Oh, shit! This sounds really bad...

US envoy Oren warns: Hizbullah has 15,000 rockets on border


Hizbullah has an arsenal of approximately 15,000 rockets amassed on Lebanon's border with Israel, including some with a long enough range to hit the southern city of Eilat, US envoy Michael Oren told AFP on Friday.

"The Syrian-Iranian backed Hizbullah poses a very serious threat to Israel...Hizbullah today now has four times as many rockets as it had during the 2006 Lebanon war. These rockets are longer-range. Every city in Israel is within range right now, including Eilat," he said.

Oren expressed Israeli concerns with Hizbullah's concealment of the weapons as well.

"In 2006, many of their missiles were basically out in the open, in silos and the Israeli air force was able to neutralize a great number of them...Today those same missiles have been placed under hospitals, and homes and schools because Hizbullah knows full well if we try to defend ourselves against them, we will be branded once again as war criminals."

546 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:19:41pm

re: #525 prairiefire

President Obama's approval rating at 50% in latest CNN poll.[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]

Uh huh. He's been floating roughly over/under 50% for better than a year now, just like most Presidents usually do. The big exception is Bush, who consistently trended downward except for big bumps after 9/11 and the on eve of the Iraq invasion.

Obama started with crazy-ridonkulous poll numbers, so the fact that they've leveled out since he's got to work is what wingnuts call a "plummet."

547 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:25:36pm

I have no problem with France remaining majority French until Judgment Day, or with Germany being largely composed of Germans until das Jüngste Gericht, or with Greece being mostly for the Greeks until the Greek Kalends.

But I'm supposed to look forward to the eventual demographic demise of the sole sliver of territory that belongs to the Nation of Israel out of a sense of weepy sentimental liberal "fairness"?

While overlooking the dozen or so countries that are currently exclusively for people of Arab parentage, and will most certainly remain so long after Paris is majority Muslim?

Something really stinks here.

548 ozbloke  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:26:42pm

re: #532 marjoriemoon

Hi marjoriemoon,

I think it has been a great chat.
No math for Cato, and everyone has had a vote.

I wish I was not so ignorant of the history of the Jewish race.
I have a love for the people, but have never spent much time educating myself regarding the post WW11 period.

I'm fascinated, though if I may respectfully say (this is about lgf historically, not you personally), most of these conversations that I have read here, when it seems there is one who disagrees with the LGF Jewish majority view, they don't seem to last long. It may be that often they have twenty people to respond to...

But elbruce has been civil, polite and interesting...

Now I love LVQ, just look through anything I have written historically, but it can become personal for him very quickly when he finds himself in the minority, he may put it "He doesn't suffer fools"
I can't bear to see he and Cato tiffing like a couple out of love...

They are two characters I would like to have a beer with...


I have just read what I posted, bugger I'm illiterate...
Maybe I'll take up math.

549 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:27:03pm

re: #542 marjoriemoon

Ack, who said it was a completely secular state?

I never did. But every time I say it's not, somebody comes and demands that I prove it, and claims that it is. Then when I provide evidence that it's not, somebody else comes and yells at me for suggesting that it shouldn't fill it's "historic role." Then when I argue that it's "historic role" is obsolete - wash, rinse, repeat.

550 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:28:26pm

re: #547 Cato the Elder

I have no problem with France remaining majority French until Judgment Day, or with Germany being largely composed of Germans until das Jüngste Gericht, or with Greece being mostly for the Greeks until the Greek Kalends..

So France, Germany and Greece should have laws restricting people who aren't ethnically French, German or Greek from having equal rights in those countries? We're right back to the 1930's all over again!

551 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:30:30pm

re: #550 elbruce

So France, Germany and Greece should have laws restricting people who aren't ethnically French, German or Greek from having equal rights in those countries? We're right back to the 1930's all over again!

Thanks for cherry-picking my post.

On this subject you are a woeful idiot.

552 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:30:50pm

re: #549 elbruce

The "historic role" of Israel being a home for Jews does not preclude it from being a home to people with other nationalities.

553 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:31:16pm

re: #550 elbruce

You're putting words in his mouth. He didn't say that.

554 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:31:43pm

re: #550 elbruce

So France, Germany and Greece should have laws restricting people who aren't ethnically French, German or Greek from having equal rights in those countries? We're right back to the 1930's all over again!

Does Israel have laws restricting the settling of non-Jewish people in Israel?

555 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:32:00pm
556 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:33:28pm

re: #546 elbruce

Uh huh. He's been floating roughly over/under 50% for better than a year now, just like most Presidents usually do. The big exception is Bush, who consistently trended downward except for big bumps after 9/11 and the on eve of the Iraq invasion.

Obama started with crazy-ridonkulous poll numbers, so the fact that they've leveled out since he's got to work is what wingnuts call a "plummet."

I think the fact that his numbers are going back up from an average of 44-45% after the Reps' long, hot, wacky summer says a lot.

557 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:33:35pm

re: #552 prairiefire

That's the false dichotomy I mentioned earlier. The state created to protect the Jews (which has been under attack since its creation) is protecting other people too.

558 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:33:36pm

Israel's historic role is obsolete?

Tell that to the Jews who are fleeing Sweden because of the sharp rise in anti-Semitism there.

559 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:33:37pm

re: #529 marjoriemoon

Jewish identity or culture is tied to lifestyle, as opposed to religion, or God. Meaning that the state law says that public restaurants will keep kosher. That Jewish storeowners close their shops on Friday night and Saturday for Shabbos. Not that anyone does, but if you wanted a cheeseburger, than you most certainly can do that. You just can't buy one already made.

If you want to shop on Saturdays, you go to the Arab market. I don't know how safe that area is now, but it's a big tourist attraction, or was.

No fashion police, prayer police or food police in sight.

I want to say something about this because I really misrepresented a bit here. And if a religious Jew or Israeli wishes to correct me, I'm open to that.

Religious Jewish law does govern in or near holy sites. For one, there is a dress code and if you attend in shorts and a t-shirt, you probably won't be allowed near the holy sites. But that would include Christian and Muslim holy sites as well.

There are also groups like Women of the Wall who are a voice for religiously observant women to pray at the Western Wall (the Kotel). Jewish law does not allow a woman to war a tallit (shawl) or pray from the Torah at the Kotel.

So we also have our difficulties as a people.

560 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:34:05pm

re: #534 elbruce

Not all of their threads are flagged for pre-moderation. If you don't post a link, I can't have any idea what you're talking about.

OK, for you I went back. Here is the thread link:

4 Israelis Killed In West Bank; Hamas Claims Responsibility

The first 2 comments showing:


HUFFPOST SUPER USER
Mo Reno 21 hours ago (3:23 AM)

Can we just give up on these foos yet? Hundreds of billions spent to defend people against their victims and in support of an apartheid state. Let Israel defend itself, it certainly doesn't defend us militarily. What is a suicide bomber going to swim here from Gaza?

...


HUFFPOST COMMUNITY MODERATOR
Json 05:15 PM on 9/02/2010

I can't believe all these comments by the anti-Israel crowd.
This was the easy one! This was your chance to say "I may hate Israel, but shooting Israeli civilians including a pregnant woman is just wrong."

Maybe I should lower my expectations and just be happy that people have stopped denying that Hamas was responsible, even though they claimed responsibility.

When the mods are sick of it, it's pretty bad over there.

561 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:35:01pm

re: #555 Varek Raith

Image: moon_bat.jpg

primal
I love this time of year. Full moon on a windy, cool, Fall evening. Yeah

562 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:36:45pm

It's the dreaded Hockey Stick!
/
Image: 205228W5_NL_sm.gif

563 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:36:58pm

re: #553 Dark_Falcon

You're putting words in his mouth. He didn't say that.

He said:

I have no problem with France remaining majority French until Judgment Day, or with Germany being largely composed of Germans until das Jüngste Gericht, or with Greece being mostly for the Greeks until the Greek Kalends..


We're talking about policy here. If there's a policy that France remains "majority Frendh," or that Germany is "largely composed of Germans" or that Greece is "mostly for the Greeks" then we're talking about putting ethnocentric laws into place in those countries. He said that.

564 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:37:16pm

re: #556 prairiefire

I think the fact that his numbers are going back up from an average of 44-45% after the Reps' long, hot, wacky summer says a lot.

Actually, the last poll I saw on CNN had him at 46%.

565 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:38:10pm

re: #551 Cato the Elder

Thanks for cherry-picking my post.

On this subject you are a woeful idiot.

I've already said that Arab nations shouldn't have Arab-centric laws either. Or Islam-centric laws.

So nu, what is it that I don't know?

566 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:38:45pm

re: #548 ozbloke

I agree their math efficiency= a vote throw down is brutal, but these things need to be hashed out.
LGF is interesting lurker territory. I think we just might like a good read.

567 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:39:25pm

re: #565 elbruce

I've already said that Arab nations shouldn't have Arab-centric laws either. Or Islam-centric laws.

So nu, what is it that I don't know?

Your ass from a hole in the ground.

568 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:40:00pm

re: #548 ozbloke

Hi marjoriemoon,

I think it has been a great chat.
No math for Cato, and everyone has had a vote.

I wish I was not so ignorant of the history of the Jewish race.
I have a love for the people, but have never spent much time educating myself regarding the post WW11 period.

I'm fascinated, though if I may respectfully say (this is about lgf historically, not you personally), most of these conversations that I have read here, when it seems there is one who disagrees with the LGF Jewish majority view, they don't seem to last long. It may be that often they have twenty people to respond to...

But elbruce has been civil, polite and interesting...

Now I love LVQ, just look through anything I have written historically, but it can become personal for him very quickly when he finds himself in the minority, he may put it "He doesn't suffer fools"
I can't bear to see he and Cato tiffing like a couple out of love...

They are two characters I would like to have a beer with...

I have just read what I posted, bugger I'm illiterate...
Maybe I'll take up math.

Hi oz

When I said I was gritting my teeth, it was figurative, but this conversation is driving me insane, quite frankly. I'm containing myself I think.

Like all of us, LVQ has his thorns, but he knows Israel and Jews fer sure.

I don't like when they fight either :(

Here's some resources if you're looking for All Things Jewlicious.

[Link: www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...]

[Link: www.jewfaq.org...]

[Link: www.palestinefacts.org...]

Oh and [Link: www.jewlicious.com...]

569 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:40:11pm

re: #564 Dark_Falcon

This one is from tonight. Perhaps an outlier.

570 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:40:21pm

re: #563 elbruce

No he didn't. He said that it would OK if those countries stayed majority native. He did not say they had, or should have, laws to ensure such a thing.

571 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:41:35pm

re: #552 prairiefire

The "historic role" of Israel being a home for Jews does not preclude it from being a home to people with other nationalities.


No, it doesn't. But its immigration laws are completely open to people who count as Jews under Orthodox rules. It's a glaring exception, and one that makes quite a difference over time. Although the Ethiopian Airlift was really really awesome.

572 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:42:06pm

re: #569 prairiefire

This one is from tonight. Perhaps an outlier.

Most likely. There are rare polls showing him lower, and this one shows him higher. The 46% sounded about right to me. But that's just me.

573 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:42:15pm

re: #563 elbruce

He said:

We're talking about policy here. If there's a policy that France remains "majority Frendh," or that Germany is "largely composed of Germans" or that Greece is "mostly for the Greeks" then we're talking about putting ethnocentric laws into place in those countries. He said that.

And you live in an airy-fairy world of "can't we all just get along" if you think that people can't, won't, or shouldn't fight for their ancient homelands.

574 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:42:48pm

re: #573 Cato the Elder

And you live in an airy-fairy world of "can't we all just get along" if you think that people can't, won't, or shouldn't fight for their ancient homelands.


Whoa, deja vu.

575 ozbloke  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:43:05pm

re: #568 marjoriemoon

Thanks marjoriemoon,

I'll take a peek, as its only 2:40 in the arv here...
Could take me through to the US morning, with lots of new LGF threads...

576 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:43:13pm

re: #573 Cato the Elder

And you live in an airy-fairy world of "can't we all just get along" if you think that people can't, won't, or shouldn't fight for their ancient homelands.

Don't harsh his mellow, Cato. He's high from unicorn farts.

577 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:44:01pm

re: #571 elbruce

No, it doesn't. But its immigration laws are completely open to people who count as Jews under Orthodox rules. It's a glaring exception, and one that makes quite a difference over time. Although the Ethiopian Airlift was really really awesome.

The glaring exception is the laws are not as open to non-Jews?

Ack, it's late. Night, lizards.

578 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:44:31pm

re: #558 Cato the Elder

Israel's historic role is obsolete?

Tell that to the Jews who are fleeing Sweden because of the sharp rise in anti-Semitism there.

Which option is better?

1) Sweden is put under international pressure to get its act together
2) Other states with religious freedom and hate crime legislation takes them in
3) They get their own country where they're the purported minority (unless they aren't).

And not all of them went to Israel. Per the link I found, many also moved to Stockholm or England.

579 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:45:55pm

re: #570 Dark_Falcon

He said that it would OK if those countries stayed majority native...

... until judgement day. How are they gonna do that without enforcing it as some sort of policy, pray tell? All I'm arguing against is the policy. If you believe he didn't imply that, then we've got nothing to argue about.

580 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:46:27pm

re: #575 ozbloke

Thanks marjoriemoon,

I'll take a peek, as its only 2:40 in the arv here...
Could take me through to the US morning, with lots of new LGF threads...


If you're curious about a subject, search through one of those search engines, print it out and read it when you have a chance.

History is important to me, ancient and recent. You'll find hard history at those sites, dates, names, places, documents.

581 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:47:13pm

re: #577 prairiefire

The glaring exception is the laws are not as open to non-Jews?

Correct. Non-Jews don't qualify for the "right of return" policy. They're subject to standard immigration limitations.

582 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:48:37pm

I'm fading too fast to keep going. I need to get to bed. Goodnight, all.

583 ozbloke  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:49:03pm

re: #580 marjoriemoon

Thanks again, marjoriemoon

584 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:49:35pm

re: #581 elbruce

What is your opinion of the HuffPo link I posted for you?

585 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:50:45pm

re: #565 elbruce

I've already said that Arab nations shouldn't have Arab-centric laws either. Or Islam-centric laws.

So nu, what is it that I don't know?

You apparently don't know, or care, that Israel is several light-years ahead of any Arab country (and most Muslim ones) in these matters.

Because that might get in the way of your permanent pissing and moaning about how Israel ought to be so much better than the rest of the world that it should fold up its tents and hit the road again.

586 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:51:38pm

re: #578 elbruce

Which option is better?

1) Sweden is put under international pressure to get its act together
2) Other states with religious freedom and hate crime legislation takes them in

Oh yea, like foreign policy with Mexico! Easy peasy baby! Or maybe Iran. We just need to put more pressure on them! Or maybe Castro!

Actually I'm for sanctions even though it obviously does not change government control of a country. American money into those countries doesn't go to the people.

587 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:52:03pm

re: #573 Cato the Elder

And you live in an airy-fairy world of "can't we all just get along" if you think that people can't, won't, or shouldn't fight for their ancient homelands.


OK, to the next person who claims that I'm the one insisting that Israel is not an open, egalitarian and secular society, please direct your finger pointing at this guy next time. Also Dark_Falcon. They are quite clearly stating that ethnicities and/or religions should have homogeneous homelands rather than secular open societies, which would involve policies to keep them homogeneous. Or at least that Israel should, as it relates to the Jewish ethnicity and/or religion. So when I respond to them, please don't come back at me claiming that I'm the one saying that Israel is a backwards society.

I hate to go here, but that statement what I quoted above sounds exactly like something that Hitler could have said.

588 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:54:17pm

re: #581 elbruce

Correct. Non-Jews don't qualify for the "right of return" policy. They're subject to standard immigration limitations.

Which Arab countries are granting reparations for Jews who were kicked out in 47? Iraq? Iran? Egypt? In fact, we've been living in Arab nations for 1000s of years.

Dang, I could be rich.

589 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:54:48pm

Yes, nationality should mean nothing anymore.

And tomorrow everyone should get a flying car that runs on moonbeams, even when there's no moon.

590 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:56:33pm

re: #589 Cato the Elder

Yes, nationality should mean nothing anymore.

And tomorrow everyone should get a flying car that runs on moonbeams, even when there's no moon.


I'll take one!

591 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:56:39pm

re: #584 NJDhockeyfan

What is your opinion of the HuffPo link I posted for you?

Good content site with a bunch of retards in the comments section. Reminds me of YouTube that way. But I wouldn't claim that YouTube was a "bad site" because of the comments people left on it.

Maybe if they did allow back-and-forth conversation they could form enough of a community that people could call the assholes out. Some people could get better known, others could line up their points of agreement, and they could go to town on over-the-top stupidity before it could proliferate. Responding to a news item on a Hamas attack by just saying "we should stop funding Israel" is the sort of thing that only happens when people don't expect to have to field a response to their comment.

But as it is, it looks like it's mostly inhabited by some incredibly uninformed moonbats. And anybody else who knows better can't really be bothered to correct them because of the lack of back-and-forth capability.

592 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:58:23pm

re: #587 elbruce

It's possible that you're oversimplifying and assuming everyone in the world has had the same relatively comfortable existence the U.S. population has had for the last 60 years. Given the history it's not terribly hard to understand that some Jews might want a refuge that they could rely on, and given the relative size of the territory involved, why not?

593 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 9:59:37pm

re: #589 Cato the Elder

Yes, nationality should mean nothing anymore.

And tomorrow everyone should get a flying car that runs on moonbeams, even when there's no moon.

Well, I don't know where you live, and I hope you get to where we are someday, but as a U.S. citizen, I gotta tell you it's totally worth the effort to separate nationality from religion and ethnicity. Nationality tied to philosophically grounded principles is way better. We did it, you should be able to also.

594 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:00:14pm

re: #592 jaunte

It's possible that you're oversimplifying and assuming everyone in the world has had the same relatively comfortable existence the U.S. population has had for the last 60 years. Given the history it's not terribly hard to understand that some Jews might want a refuge that they could rely on, and given the relative size of the territory involved, why not?

Because it makes the extremists mad and we shouldn't upset them.

Because if Israel weren't Jewish, then there would peace on earth.

But you know that already, huh.

595 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:00:40pm

re: #593 elbruce

Baltimore.

596 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:01:43pm

re: #595 Varek Raith

Err, sorry Cato.
That was awfully presumptuous of me.

597 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:03:17pm

And who said anything about homogeneity? There are plenty of non-French living in France. Some would say too many. But I wouldn't see any reason to visit France, or any other "foreign" country, if it were a fantasy secular humanist society of Esperanto speakers run by the UN and indistinguishable from Germany or Spain or Denmark.

Go ahead, Bruce, call me Adolf again.

598 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:04:00pm

re: #592 jaunte

It's possible that you're oversimplifying and assuming everyone in the world has had the same relatively comfortable existence the U.S. population has had for the last 60 years. Given the history it's not terribly hard to understand that some Jews might want a refuge that they could rely on, and given the relative size of the territory involved, why not?


Oh, sure. Personally I think that Israel is less reliable than the U.S.A. but I'm kind of partisan on that issue.

But does the "relative size of the territory involved" include the land that Israel had previously promised to give to the Palestinians? If so, then moving there might prove somewhat problematic.

The fact is, a lot of the people settling in the West Bank are hardcore Zionists who want to "anchor" it against the possibility of future democratic partitions. Many of them are recruited explicitly for this purpose from the United States. As such, they aren't running away from trouble, they're running directly towards it.

599 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:04:48pm

re: #593 elbruce

Well, I don't know where you live, and I hope you get to where we are someday, but as a U.S. citizen, I gotta tell you it's totally worth the effort to separate nationality from religion and ethnicity. Nationality tied to philosophically grounded principles is way better. We did it, you should be able to also.

Go preach that on the reservations, son, and see how long your head remains attached to your neck.

600 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:06:09pm

re: #596 Varek Raith

Err, sorry Cato.
That was awfully presumptuous of me.

De nada. It's common knowledge.

601 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:07:02pm

re: #597 Cato the Elder

And who said anything about homogeneity? There are plenty of non-French living in France. Some would say too many. But I wouldn't see any reason to visit France, or any other "foreign" country, if it were a fantasy secular humanist society of Esperanto speakers run by the UN and indistinguishable from Germany or Spain or Denmark.

What laws should France put in place to balance their "historic Frenchness" to just the level that you would find acceptable? If you say anything other than "none," then you're engaging in pure National Front-ism.

602 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:08:05pm

Am I in the Twilight Zone or something?

603 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:09:06pm

re: #598 elbruce

The trouble is caused by the states surrounding Israel, who keep propagandizing against its existence so they can maintain it as a red flag in front of their populations, rather than reforming their own polities.

604 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:09:34pm

re: #602 Varek Raith

Am I in the Twilight Zone or something?

Expecting something else were you?

605 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:09:37pm

re: #599 Cato the Elder

Go preach that on the reservations, son, and see how long your head remains attached to your neck.

If you're referring to Native American reservations then no, I'd just get mocked for having forgotten to mention the Great American Exception to Everything it Stands For (tm). I don't know which tribes you're accusing of beheading stupid Amur'kins, but I bet they'd call you a stupid Amur'kin too for suggesting that they behead people.

606 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:11:12pm
607 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:12:55pm

cre: #603 jaunte

The trouble is caused by the states surrounding Israel, who keep propagandizing against its existence so they can maintain it as a red flag in front of their populations, rather than reforming their own polities.

Actually, that's its own problem. As long as we keep saying that we can't resolve the Israeli/Palestinian situation until all of their neighbors shape up, we aren't going to get anywhere... at least not until we've developed complete energy independence and exported that technology to the rest of the world.

Mind you, I'm not saying that it's not a problem. Just that it's a different one, and we can't solve the first one without disentangling it from the second.

608 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:13:07pm

re: #601 elbruce

What laws should France put in place to balance their "historic Frenchness" to just the level that you would find acceptable? If you say anything other than "none," then you're engaging in pure National Front-ism.

Fine. Then I'm a member of the National Front who is deficient in algebra.

Go fuck yourself.

609 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:13:34pm

re: #607 elbruce

610 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:14:05pm

re: #609 jaunte

Well said!

611 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:14:16pm

re: #608 Cato the Elder

Fine. Then I'm a member of the National Front who is deficient in algebra.

Go fuck yourself.

Dude, it's easy!
Image: findx.jpg

612 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:14:29pm

re: #607 elbruce

c

Actually, that's its own problem. As long as we keep saying that we can't resolve the Israeli/Palestinian situation until all of their neighbors shape up, we aren't going to get anywhere... at least not until we've developed complete energy independence and exported that technology to the rest of the world.

Mind you, I'm not saying that it's not a problem. Just that it's a different one, and we can't solve the first one without disentangling it from the second.

They are, in fact problems that are next door neighbors.

613 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:15:41pm

re: #604 marjoriemoon

Holy crap. Haven't heard that song in at least a decade, maybe more. Now you got me thinking about gravity bongs and easy women.

614 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:16:15pm

re: #613 Slumbering Behemoth

Holy crap. Haven't heard that song in at least a decade, maybe more. Now you got me thinking about gravity bongs and easy women.

Please.
When are you not thinking of such things???
:)

615 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:18:54pm

re: #613 Slumbering Behemoth

Holy crap. Haven't heard that song in at least a decade, maybe more. Now you got me thinking about gravity bongs and easy women.

Woo hoo!

That album is imprinted on my brain. Much of the rest is a blur for some reason.

616 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:19:51pm

re: #613 Slumbering Behemoth

Holy crap. Haven't heard that song in at least a decade, maybe more. Now you got me thinking about gravity bongs and easy women.

What's a gravity bong, Oh Giant Sleepy One?

617 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:20:42pm

re: #616 marjoriemoon

What's a gravity bong, Oh Giant Sleepy One?

Image: GRAVITY%20BONG%20%231%20&%20%232.jpg

618 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:21:27pm

re: #608 Cato the Elder

Fine. Then I'm a member of the National Front who is deficient in algebra.

Go fuck yourself.

You could also present a clarification of the point I objected to (regarding sustaining nationally homogeneous cultures), and/or walk it back. Just responding with epithets and unsubstantiated claims of ignorance on my part doesn't cut it.

619 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:21:41pm

re: #617 Varek Raith

Seems like an awful lot of work...

620 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:21:42pm

re: #617 Varek Raith

Image: GRAVITY%20BONG%20%231%20&%20%232.jpg

Pot smokers are so creative, ain't they.

621 Varek Raith  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:22:40pm

re: #620 marjoriemoon

Pot smokers are so creative, ain't they.

Heh, indeed.

622 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:24:10pm

re: #612 jaunte

They are, in fact problems that are next door neighbors.

They're definitely problems that need to be dealt with, and I'm sure the U.S. has Israel's back on this. Which I support. But if we allow groups like Hezbollah to disrupt Israeli/Palestinian negotiations, then we're intentionally dooming ourselves to perpetual failure in terms of peace.

623 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:26:04pm

re: #614 Varek Raith

Well, it's true that I quite often think of easy women, but it's been a looong time since I've given any thought to gravity bongs.

624 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:28:17pm

re: #618 elbruce

You could also present a clarification of the point I objected to (regarding sustaining nationally homogeneous cultures), and/or walk it back. Just responding with epithets and unsubstantiated claims of ignorance on my part doesn't cut it.

I am quite comfortable with the French limiting immigration to preserve a French majority in France. If that makes me a National Frontist, I'll happily walk that forward for you.

625 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:29:17pm

re: #616 marjoriemoon

Varek's link is correct, but I used to use milk jugs. One large bowl, completely burned in a single hit. Definitely not something you want to do on a day when you need to get shit done.

626 jaunte  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:30:55pm

Time to get some sleep. Goodnight all.

627 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:31:38pm

re: #605 elbruce

If you're referring to Native American reservations then no, I'd just get mocked for having forgotten to mention the Great American Exception to Everything it Stands For (tm). I don't know which tribes you're accusing of beheading stupid Amur'kins, but I bet they'd call you a stupid Amur'kin too for suggesting that they behead people.

I wasn't referring to beheadings, you chucklehead.

But I personal know of one sacred mountain in New Mexico that you'd better not be caught on with a white skin.

628 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:34:41pm

re: #627 Cato the Elder

I wasn't referring to beheadings, you chucklehead.

OK...


re: #599 Cato the Elder

Go preach that on the reservations, son, and see how long your head remains attached to your neck.

So... they'll cast a curse on me that makes my head swell up and float away from my body? What? What else do you call that?

629 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:34:47pm

re: #623 Slumbering Behemoth

Well, it's true that I quite often think of easy women, but it's been a looong time since I've given any thought to gravity bongs.

Black Sabbath kinda scared me when I was a kid. I wasn't a fan. I preferred Jethro Tull, Rush, Judas Priest, AC/DC, ELO, Areosmith, ELP, Nazareth, Uriah Heep... the whole mellow rock, James Taylor, Phoebe Snow, Joni Mitchell...

Ozzie is amazing though. Mick and all those guys. Hey, they're still rocking. Go with yer bad self.

630 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:36:27pm

re: #629 marjoriemoon

Black Sabbath kinda scared me when I was a kid. I wasn't a fan. I preferred Jethro Tull, Rush, Judas Priest, AC/DC, ELO, Areosmith, ELP, Nazareth, Uriah Heep... the whole mellow rock, James Taylor, Phoebe Snow, Joni Mitchell...

Ozzie is amazing though. Mick and all those guys. Hey, they're still rocking. Go with yer bad self.

Nazareth was my first concert!

631 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:36:56pm

re: #630 NJDhockeyfan

Nazareth was my first concert!

No way. You lucky guy.

632 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:37:43pm

re: #624 Cato the Elder

I am quite comfortable with the French limiting immigration to preserve a French majority in France. If that makes me a National Frontist, I'll happily walk that forward for you.


OK, now how do you define who is "French" and who isn't? Does somebody who wants to become French get to? Is there a selection process? What should it be based on?

If it's an ethnic thing then yeah, you're going all National Front, to such a degree that you hardly get to curse me for drawing you out on it.

If it's a willingness to sign on to French founding principles (of which there are many) then it's not; but then it no longer applies as an analogy to Israel.

633 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:38:07pm

re: #631 marjoriemoon

No way. You lucky guy.

1979 at the War Memorial in Johnstown, Pa. They filmed Slap Shot a few years before that there.

634 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:38:53pm

re: #628 elbruce

OK...

re: #599 Cato the Elder

So... they'll cast a curse on me that makes my head swell up and float away from my body? What? What else do you call that?

Asshole. You don't understand metaphor any more than you do human nature.

Do you have "Kumbaya" on permanent repeat on your iPod?

635 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:40:05pm

re: #630 NJDhockeyfan

Nazareth was my first concert!

Bad Company for me in Chicago.

Technically, David Cassidy when I was 12 with the Rents. He got booed off stage. I was severely traumatized.

Then we went out for ice cream and I got over it.

636 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:40:06pm

Speaking of France...

French Teacher Suspended for Spending Too Much Time Teaching Holocaust

A history teacher has been suspended in France for spending too much time teaching students about the Holocaust.

Catherine Pederzoli, 58, a secondary school teacher who is Jewish, was accused of teaching the subject with insufficient neutrality for both her time dedicated to teaching about the Holocaust and trips she organized to former Nazi death camps, Pederzoli’s attorney Christine Tadic told Agence France-Presse.

"If this teacher had been a Christian, no one would have accused her of brain-washing," Tadic said. "Isn't it the case that this teacher's fault is to have been Jewish?"

A report compiled by school officials last month alleged that Pederzoli took up too much time preparing students for the annual school trips to Poland and the Czech Republic and accuses her of "lacking distance, neutrality and secularism" and "brain-washing" in teaching the Holocaust, AFP reported.

Tadic told the AFP that her client organized the trips for 15 years with no complaints and was unfairly targeted by a new school management team that arrived in 2007.

Now that's fucked up.

637 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:40:47pm

re: #634 Cato the Elder

Asshole. You don't understand metaphor any more than you do human nature.

Do you have "Kumbaya" on permanent repeat on your iPod?

No, I never stereotype people...

638 What, me worry?  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:40:53pm

Ok lizards, stay scaley :) nite

639 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:41:50pm

re: #635 marjoriemoon

Bad Company for me in Chicago.

Technically, David Cassidy when I was 12 with the Rents. He got booed off stage. I was severely traumatized.

Then we went out for ice cream and I got over it.

David Cassidy? My cousin had his poster on the wall in her room. One day I came over and ripped it up.

640 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:42:31pm

re: #629 marjoriemoon

Heh, I started listening to Sabbath when I was about ten. I found this in my mom's stack of old albums and was immediately hooked.

641 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:43:07pm

I am so looking forward to the day when every country gives up its identity to be just like America.

Not.

642 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:43:45pm

re: #636 NJDhockeyfan

Speaking of France...

French Teacher Suspended for Spending Too Much Time Teaching Holocaust

Now that's fucked up.

Oh yeah. It's not like there are two "controversial" sides to be balanced against each other. The Holocaust was bad. Period. Now, they might have had an argument if they were saying she was neglecting other important units to focus entirely on that single episode of history, depending on the expected class curriculum. But who the fuck came up with this "brainwashing" claim? That person's name is the one who should be foremost in the news report.

643 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:44:50pm

re: #641 Cato the Elder

I am so looking forward to the day when every country gives up its identity to be just like America.

Not.

Never! Every country has it's own history and identity. Do not fuck that up. Where would Octoberfest be held if that happened?

644 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:47:35pm

re: #641 Cato the Elder

I am so looking forward to the day when every country gives up its identity to be just like America.

Not.

So should we give up our ideals too in order to reclaim our "identity" from the threat of demographic shifts? Sarah Palin says yes...

Our identity is our principles. That and only that is what makes America exceptional.

Furthermore, what's right is right. Something can't be right just for us and not for others. It's right, period. If it's right for us, then it's right for them. 2+2=4 whether you're standing in L.A. or on top of Everest. We certainly should not try to export our culture. But our founding ideals, appealing to philosophy as they do, transcend all location, culture, religion and political affiliation. They are therefore applicable everywhere.

Frankly, all of this "homogenous Israel" talk is starting to sound like global-scale ghettoization...

645 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:47:39pm

I just went to find out how to join the Front National in France. Unfortunately, it looks as if they only want native ethnic French people as members. Plus I may have too many friends in Israel for them.

Sigh. I thought I had found my home at last.

646 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:49:45pm

re: #643 NJDhockeyfan

Where would Octoberfest be held if that happened?

My place? Pretty please?

647 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:50:04pm

re: #644 elbruce

You're the one who keeps bringing in the "homogeneous" part, like a sick parrot, every time you talk about Israel. When in fact it is the least homogeneous state in the region.

I think you have a Jew problem.

648 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:50:16pm

re: #643 NJDhockeyfan

Never! Every country has it's own history and identity. Do not fuck that up. Where would Octoberfest be held if that happened?

This is the town where I grew up.

649 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:53:59pm

re: #647 Cato the Elder

You're the one who keeps bringing in the "homogeneous" part, like a sick parrot, every time you talk about Israel. When in fact it is the least homogeneous state in the region.

Um no, I'm the one arguing against that position. In fact, I thought I had shut this line of attack down when I replied to this comment:

re: #573 Cato the Elder

And you live in an airy-fairy world of "can't we all just get along" if you think that people can't, won't, or shouldn't fight for their ancient homelands.

... by saying ...

re: #587 elbruce

OK, to the next person who claims that I'm the one insisting that Israel is not an open, egalitarian and secular society, please direct your finger pointing at this guy next time.

Oh look, that's you.

WTF game are you playing here?

650 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:56:03pm

re: #647 Cato the Elder

I think you have a Jew problem.

Only when my daughter refuses to shut her video game down on time and go to bed. Then I bring down a parental pogrom until she complies.

(getting at: my ex-wife was Jewish, and so therefore is my kid).

651 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 10:58:08pm

re: #650 elbruce

Only when my daughter refuses to shut her video game down on time and go to bed. Then I bring down a parental pogrom until she complies.

(getting at: my ex-wife was Jewish, and so therefore is my kid).

That does not prevent you from having a problem with Jews having a homeland, obviously.

But in your harebrained version of the world, all that stuff is obsolete.

652 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:05:47pm

re: #651 Cato the Elder

That does not prevent you from having a problem with Jews having a homeland, obviously.

But in your harebrained version of the world, all that stuff is obsolete.

My problem is a philosophical position, well thought through. What we call ghettoization on a city-wide scale we call zionism on a global scale. But it's the same thing. You can be for both or against both (me) but I don't see how you can be for one and against the other.

My "harebrained version of the world" is the primary principles of modern democracy. That includes separation of church and state, as well as equal protection under the law. Lack of those things should be obsolete. Now it may be the case that they aren't obsolete at present due to practical considerations; in which case, we should work towards making them obsolete.

And the difference between Israel and the Israel I'd like to see really isn't that far apart. Look at Britain. Their flag incorporates the Christian cross (quite intentionally) and they have a state religion, but you'd hardly know it from their society. Israel should be like that (with appropriate local flavor). So should Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Iran, Saudi Arabia... etc.

It'd be ideal if such countries would have it spelled out in sovereign constitutions as clearly as it is in ours, but I think Britain is a good model for this sort of thing, in the long run.

653 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:05:58pm

Good night lizards...I'm going to finish watching Patton in bed.

654 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:08:06pm

re: #652 elbruce

I am really, really glad that Israel doesn't give a flying fuck about how you think it should be.

If, that is, you think it should be at all.

655 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:08:47pm

re: #653 NJDhockeyfan

Good night lizards...I'm going to finish watching Patton in bed.

I had no idea you were into old, grizzled military dudes like that. NTTAWWT, but what would your wife think?
/

656 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:12:48pm

Oh, and by the way, when someone like you trumpets their well-thought-out philosophical positions, I reach for my revolver.

657 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:14:35pm

re: #654 Cato the Elder

I am really, really glad that Israel doesn't give a flying fuck about how you think it should be.

If, that is, you think it should be at all.

How a country should be and whether a country should be are two entirely different things.

And the issues that I've brought up are exactly issues that Israel is very interested in wrestling with every day: to what extent does their identity as a Jewish homeland conflict with their commitment to secular democracy?

658 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:20:33pm

re: #657 elbruce

How a country should be and whether a country should be are two entirely different things.

And the issues that I've brought up are exactly issues that Israel is very interested in wrestling with every day: to what extent does their identity as a Jewish homeland conflict with their commitment to secular democracy?

Fortunately for Jews everywhere, Israel's existence as the only Jewish homeland trumps your vision of a perfect world in which Israel disarms, opens its borders, and waits faithfully for its neighbors to follow suit.

Because the immediate result would not be a great sandy expanse of galloping unicorns and moonbats doing the Morris dance with their multi-ethnic neighbors, but the Second Holocaust.

As there are now more Jews living in Israel than in any other country in the world, this is how it's going to be for a long, long time to come. Hopefully that will not be too much of a thorn in your ethereal flesh.

659 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:26:33pm

re: #658 Cato the Elder

Fortunately for Jews everywhere, Israel's existence as the only Jewish homeland trumps your vision of a perfect world in which Israel disarms, opens its borders, and waits faithfully for its neighbors to follow suit.

Git that strawman, Cato! Beat 'im up! Beat him day'd!


As there are now more Jews living in Israel than in any other country in the world, this is how it's going to be for a long, long time to come.

Only by about 100,000 at the moment.

660 Cato the Elder  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:36:01pm

re: #659 elbruce

I do hope you won't be too awfully philosophically let down when your daughter decides to take a "Birthright" tour of Israel and comes home an ardent Zionist, or, better, decides to stay there and help defend Eretz Yisroel.

661 elbruce  Fri, Sep 3, 2010 11:55:27pm

re: #660 Cato the Elder

I do hope you won't be too awfully philosophically let down when your daughter decides to take a "Birthright" tour of Israel and comes home an ardent Zionist, or, better, decides to stay there and help defend Eretz Yisroel.

I would be. Yeah, I would be really let down.

662 Cheese Eating Victory Monkey  Sat, Sep 4, 2010 9:31:44am

re: #581 elbruce

Correct. Non-Jews don't qualify for the "right of return" policy. They're subject to standard immigration limitations.

You are wrong on several of your claims, so I might as well start here. If you inspect the Israeli immigration laws, you'll see that any person (Jew or non-Jew) has a right to aliyah if they prove that at least one grandparent was Jewish. You might not have heard this yet, but Israel has hundreds of thousands of non-Jewish, ex-Russians living in Israel who came here legally with the help of the Jewish Agency.

663 Mar  Sat, Sep 4, 2010 9:38:35am

Elbruce 578

Stockholm is in Sweden.

I've spent time in Israel. It is an open, secular and pluralistic society.

664 Cheese Eating Victory Monkey  Sat, Sep 4, 2010 9:49:08am

re: re: #480 elbruce

Just as white folks in America are going to inevitably lose our majority (yay!)

What wrong with that?

...and become just another flavor in the melting pot, so too is Israel going to have to admit that in the long run that it can't maintain its identity as a nation "just for Jews."

Israel is a Jewish and Democratic State of its citizens, not a "just for Jews" State.

We should recognize at this point that most of the people in Israel are secular, not particularly religious, and not particularly tied to any claims of ethnic identity.

Where do you get your information? A recent Haaretz poll showed that most Israelis define themselves as "traditional" and only a small minority as "secular". And you better believe that even those seculars have claims to ethnic identity.

I'd also like to note that the Arab nations in the region should also become more open and submit to the consequences of that openness, including inevitable multi-ethnicity and the need for equality and democracy as well.

Yes, but reality is always good to take into account.

665 Cheese Eating Victory Monkey  Sat, Sep 4, 2010 9:55:50am

re: #491 elbruce

Nope. I believe in American principles too strongly to believe that sorting out countries by ethnicity/religion as "home states" is a better idea. Most of the people who believe that are die-hard racists. Except when it comes to Israel.

I think that John Adams, Abraham Lincoln, and Truman were Americans who believed in American principles at least as strongly as you and would disagree with your point.

666 Cheese Eating Victory Monkey  Sat, Sep 4, 2010 10:07:43am

re: #521 elbruce

There is. And I'm sure we would have been happy(ish) to take all of the Jews after the war was over, if they could trust us. Which they couldn't... because we sent a boatload of 'em back to die.

1. Your "trust" theory makes no sense. Many survivors immigrated to America after the war, regardless of the US government's behavior.

2. Can you prove that the US would have been happy to take all of the Jews in? There was a 4 year gap between the end of the WWII and the end of the Israeli war of Independence, and thousands of survivors sat in DP camps in Cyprus (among other places), waiting for a home. Was the US handing out passports to all of them?


Seriously people, do you really believe that the only or even best solution to multi-religio/ethnic conflict is to have completely segregated nations? Then GTFO of my America.

1. You seem to be against the Wilsonian value of national self- determination. How ethnocentric of you.
2. If I don't agree with you, I have to leave America? And why is it "your" America? I think that's a more suitable thing to say in a totalitarian state.

667 Cheese Eating Victory Monkey  Sat, Sep 4, 2010 10:18:58am

re: #531 elbruce

I seem to be defending two sides here. On the one hand, if I say Israel should be completely open, I get "don't you know why it was created?" On the other hand, if I refer to any Jewish-centric tendencies, I get "Israel is a completely secular state!"

Like I said way back at the beginning, pick one: racial separatism or open society. As long as they keep trying to split the difference, the "pro-Israel lobby" (as demonstrated here) will remain utterly confused as to which lines of attack they're advocating, and what it is exactly that they're "pro-."

England has an official Church of England, but they still qualify as an open society. Germany gives citizenship to foreigners who can prove German lineage, but they're still considered an open society.
Ireland is handing out "heritage certificates" to their diaspora and are a defacto Catholic country, but they are still an open society. Why are you picking on Israel when there are plenty of non-American examples to choose from?

668 Cheese Eating Victory Monkey  Sat, Sep 4, 2010 10:21:55am

re: #531 elbruce

I seem to be defending two sides here. On the one hand, if I say Israel should be completely open, I get "don't you know why it was created?" On the other hand, if I refer to any Jewish-centric tendencies, I get "Israel is a completely secular state!"

Like I said way back at the beginning, pick one: racial separatism or open society. As long as they keep trying to split the difference, the "pro-Israel lobby" (as demonstrated here) will remain utterly confused as to which lines of attack they're advocating, and what it is exactly that they're "pro-."

Racial separatism?! Do you realize what you're saying?

669 prairiefire  Sat, Sep 4, 2010 1:05:58pm

re: #660 Cato the Elder

I do hope you won't be too awfully philosophically let down when your daughter decides to take a "Birthright" tour of Israel and comes home an ardent Zionist, or, better, decides to stay there and help defend Eretz Yisroel.

I think he tipped his hand.


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 Frank says:

You can tell what they think of our music by the places we are forced to play it in. This looks like a good spot for a livestock show. -- The Mothers of Invention were opening for Cream in April of 1968 in Chicago. The place was very large and did look like it had been used for displays of cattle and other such animals.