Liberals Rally in DC
US News • Views: 5,738
The “One Nation” liberal demonstration is now under way on the National Mall in Washington DC, and you can watch it live at C-SPAN.
245 comments
4 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:36:28am |
All I’m getting is a girl singing “Imagine” to a sort of lounge-jazz arrangement.
| 5 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:37:11am |
Urban National Hip Hop Choir doing John Lennon’s Imagine. Seems inspired by Glee, if you ask me. Nothing wrong with that, though, they’re actually pretty good.
| 6 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:38:01am |
re: #5 Dark_Falcon
Urban National Hip Hop Choir doing John Lennon’s Imagine. Seems inspired by Glee, if you ask me. Nothing wrong with that, though, they’re actually pretty good.
Cute kids.
| 7 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:38:11am |
The “Up With People” type group on the steps look like they’re having a good time…even if they are butchering the medley of songs with interpretive dance and over-singing.
| 8 |
Kronocide Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:38:31am |
re: #4 SanFranciscoZionist
All I’m getting is a girl singing “Imagine” to a sort of lounge-jazz arrangement.
Yeah, meh. Tell me it’s C-Lo and I’ll get worked up about it.
| 9 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:38:34am |
re: #3 Gus 802
Ah, this is a live feed. No spin.
That’s how C-SPAN rolls. They just shoot the main event, straight. It’s a good counter to partisan coverage.
| 10 |
reloadingisnotahobby Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:40:11am |
Liberals rally?
So 90% of the crowd are Politicians?
Didn’t have to drive far……
| 13 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:41:07am |
Ah, people with varying degrees of melanin being all chillax and singing and dancing ‘n shit.
Damn godless liberals, destroying this country with their ability to get down with the brown and clap to a beat.
| 14 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:41:40am |
re: #12 Thanos
Cool - Earth Wind and Fire
It’s a good song choice for them and they’re doing it well.
| 15 |
Kronocide Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:41:58am |
I caught myself getting goose bumps knee bouncin to EWF! Kid can sing.
| 16 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:42:10am |
re: #11 efuseakay
One. Hundred. Beelyon. Peepole!!!
Headcount isn’t what’s important. It’s giving those in attendance an opportunity to demonstrate that not everyone in this country is an extremist religious bigot.
| 17 |
reloadingisnotahobby Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:42:13am |
re: #13 goddamnedfrank
What??
I got rhythm!!
I’m white…….
| 18 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:42:23am |
I just hope the kids keep singing. I have a feeling that the adult speakers won’t suit me as well.
| 19 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:43:20am |
re: #18 SanFranciscoZionist
I just hope the kids keep singing. I have a feeling that the adult speakers won’t suit me as well.
Can’t wait! ;)
| 20 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:43:22am |
re: #13 goddamnedfrank
Ah, people with varying degrees of melanin being all chillax and singing and dancing ‘n shit.
Damn godless liberals, destroying this country with their ability to get down with the brown and clap to a beat.
It ain’t the entertainment that bothers me, it’s some of the attendees. They’ve had speakers questioning if Oswald killed Kennedy. Some these folks are really out there.
| 22 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:43:58am |
re: #18 SanFranciscoZionist
I just hope the kids keep singing. I have a feeling that the adult speakers won’t suit me as well.
Aw shit, we just got Schultzed.
| 25 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:45:06am |
| 26 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:45:17am |
re: #23 Dark_Falcon
Ed Shultz is speaking now. Anyone know him?
MSNBC daytime guy, with pretenses of being the anti-Beck.
| 27 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:45:31am |
| 28 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:45:43am |
My dog just looked at me as if to say, “I’ll bet there’s a defining moment in America closer to the beach.” But I’ll finish my tea first and hang out for another fifteen minutes or so. I like to drive to the beach during “Wait, wait” anyway.
| 29 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:45:48am |
re: #23 Dark_Falcon
Ed Shultz is speaking now. Anyone know him?
You know him. He’s been on MSNBC. The Ed Schultz show.
His brother is Dave Schultz, a professional golfer. //
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
| 30 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:45:53am |
Schultz is railing against shipping jobs overseas. Same words you’d hear at a Tea Party, truth to tell.
| 31 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:46:44am |
re: #26 goddamnedfrank
MSNBC daytime guy, with pretenses of being the anti-Beck.
re: #27 SanFranciscoZionist
He’s a talk-radio guy I think.
re: #29 Gus 802
You know him. He’s been on MSNBC. The Ed Schultz show.
His brother is Dave Schultz, a professional golfer. //
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
Thank you.
| 32 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:46:57am |
Sponsors and speakers of the One Nation Rally…
[Link: www.onenationworkingtogether.org…]
(Part of the list, see link for complete list)
Sojourners
SEIU 1199
National Action Network
United States Students Association
UAW, International Union
Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights
SEIU: Service Employees International Union
Rainbow PUSH Coalition
PowerPAC
National Council of La Raza
NAACP
Green for All
Communications Workers of America
American Federation of Teachers
Center for Community Change
AFL-CIO
Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights Under Law
The Shalom Center
Children’s Defense Fund
Colage
Climate Crisis Coalition
NYC Environmental Justice Alliance
Chesapeake Climate Action Network
Earth Day Network
National Wildlife Federation
Transition United States
United Puerto Rican Organization of Sunset Park
Sierra Club
Center for Biological Diversity
Apollo Alliance
Green Party
Union Jobs Clearinghouse
American Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee
The Southern Anti-Racism Network (SARN)
Green Party USA
League of United Latin American Citizens (LULAC)
General Board of Church and Society- United Methodist Church
TransAfrica Forum
Democracy for America
National Jobs For All Coalition
The Power: The People United for LGBT Equality
Ya Ya Network
Working Families Party
Women’s International League for Peace and Freedom
Women’s Caucus for Political Science
WPFW
WAND: Women’s Action for New Directions
Whitman Walker Clinic
Witness Against Torture
Wishadoo
Win Without War
Ward 7 Business Professional Association
Veterans for Peace
Voices for Creative Nonviolence
Voice of Haitian Americans Inc.
Harlem One Stop
Welfare Rights Committee
Veterans for Peace NY
Unitarian Universalist Association of Congregations
Urban Agenda
United Mine Workers of America
US Campaign to End the Israeli Occupation
US Peace Council
US Human Rights Network
TWU Local 100
William Kelibrew Foundation
Sikh Coalition
The Religious Institute
The New York Immigration Coalition
Imani Group
The Opportunity Agenda
Stonewall Democratic Club - Los Angeles
Student World Assembly
Society of American Law Teachers
Women’s Funding Network
Teamsters Local 808
The Community Church of NY Unitarian Universalist
SEIU Local 722
Single Payer New York
Single Payer Action Network Ohio - SPAN Ohio
SEIU Local 32BJ
September 11th Families for Peaceful Tomorrows
Retail, Wholesale and Department Store Union
Riverside Edgecombe Neighborhood Association (RENA)
Reform Immigration for America
School of Americas Watch (SoA Watch)
Progress Ohio
Progressive Democrats of America - NYS and NYC
Progressive Congress Action Fund
People’s Organization for Progress
Planned Parenthood
People for the American Way
Physicians for a National Health Program
Pennsylvania Council of Churches
Peace and Freedom Party
Peace Action Maine
Peace Action Education Fund
Peace Action Montgomery
Pax Christi Metro DC-Baltimore
NYC LCLAA
Ohio AFL-CIO
NY Coalition of 100 Black Women
New York Urban League
North Suburban Peace Initiative
New York State AFL-CIO
New York City Democratic Socialists of America
International Socialist Organization
Detroit Democratic Socialists of America
Democratic Socialists of America
Chicago Democratic Socialists of America
(… big tent for sure…)
| 33 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:47:06am |
re: #27 SanFranciscoZionist
He’s a talk-radio guy I think.
He used to be on Air America…now has “The Ed Show” on MSNBC. He gets under my skin sometimes, but he doesn’t pull punches when talking about the Bachmanns, Becks, and Palins of this world.
| 34 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:47:28am |
No, Mr. Shultz. Those Republicans just don’t want to spend money we don’t have.
| 35 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:48:23am |
re: #32 Walter L. Newton
I don’t see Jesus on that list. Glenn Beck had Jesus.
| 36 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:48:45am |
re: #32 Walter L. Newton
Truly a laundry list of the left.
| 37 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:49:16am |
re: #34 Dark_Falcon
No, Mr. Shultz. Those Republicans just don’t want to spend money we don’t have.
Sure they do. They just want to spend it on themselves - it’s called a tax cut for the rich.
| 38 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:49:17am |
re: #33 darthstar
He used to be on Air America…now has “The Ed Show” on MSNBC. He gets under my skin sometimes, but he doesn’t pull punches when talking about the Bachmanns, Becks, and Palins of this world.
“He is an enemy of the country, in my opinion, Dick Cheney is, he is an enemy of the country. He’s making it harder for those who are in power right now to protect the country. He’s about the political divide. It just, I just think the guy’s such a freakin’ loser. You know, Lord, take him to the Promised Land, will you? See, I don’t even wish the guy goes to Hell, I just want to get him the hell out of here.”
— Ed Schultz, The Ed Schultz Show, May 11, 2009. [MP3 audio]
“You’re damn right, Dick Cheney’s heart’s a political football. We ought to rip it out and kick it around and stuff it back in him. I’m glad he didn’t tip over….How come Dick Cheney’s health care isn’t being dropped? Do you realize that if you had five heart attacks — hell, you wouldn’t get past two heart attacks and they’d dump you. But, because you’re a war criminal, and because you are on the take from Haliburton and you had these executive meetings in 2001 back in the, you know, the days of the rolling blackouts and executive privilege on how we’re going to develop energy policy in this country, you do stuff like that — hell, you can get the best health care on the face of the earth.”
— Ed Schultz on The Ed Schultz Show, February 24, 2010. [MP3 audio]
| 39 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:49:46am |
re: #36 Dark_Falcon
Truly a laundry list of the left.
That’s the short list… there are over 400 on that list.
| 40 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:49:58am |
re: #35 darthstar
I don’t see Jesus on that list. Glenn Beck had Jesus.
Did Jesus make a donation?
(Damn, now I have “I Wrote A Hot Check To Jesus” going in my head.)
| 41 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:50:57am |
“The Forces of Evil: The Conservatives in this Country!”
Fuck You, Ed Schultz. The left is going to get gut-checked on November 2nd and I can’t wait to see your face when it happens.
| 42 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:51:11am |
I love the smell of politics in the morning. It reminds me of…
Let me get back to you on that.
/
| 44 |
Varek Raith Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:52:09am |
re: #41 Dark_Falcon
“The Forces of Evil: The Conservatives in this Country!”
Fuck You, Ed Schultz. The left is going to get gut-checked on November 2nd and I can’t wait to see your face when it happens.
Perhaps.
However, it’ll be a pyrrhic victory for the GOP.
| 45 |
Charles Johnson Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:52:14am |
re: #41 Dark_Falcon
Ed Schultz may be a ranter, but I agree that this kind of thing is flat out evil:
[Link: www.rnclife.org…]
| 46 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:53:42am |
re: #41 Dark_Falcon
“The Forces of Evil: The Conservatives in this Country!”
Fuck You, Ed Schultz. The left is going to get gut-checked on November 2nd and I can’t wait to see your face when it happens.
It’s entertaining watching conservatives fuck themselves over by voting for people who want to fuck up their health care, reduce their social services, privatize medicare, and wage more wars…but at the same time it’s kind of sad.
| 47 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:54:46am |
Regarding the voice over message, everyone needs to stop talking about “Wall Street and Main Street” right goddamned now! Find some new rhetorical sound bites you lazy schmucks.
| 48 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:55:41am |
Well, I’m still seeing a lot of airing of grievances. It’s pretty clear that both the left and the right aren’t happy with the direction this country is going. Polling does indicate this with the general American public.
| 49 |
PhillyPretzel Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:55:52am |
The membership of DC33 here in Philly was offered free meals and rides to and from this “event.” As you can tell I am here instead of there. Much better.
| 50 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:56:48am |
re: #40 SanFranciscoZionist
Did Jesus make a donation?
(Damn, now I have “I Wrote A Hot Check To Jesus” going in my head.)
I’m hearing a lot of references to God and religion here. Lots of it.
| 51 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:57:24am |
Democracy for America? We’ve already got that, Jim Dean, you asshat.
| 52 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:58:20am |
re: #50 Gus 802
I’m hearing a lot of references to God and religion here. Lots of it.
Many of the speakers are church people.
| 53 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:58:28am |
re: #50 Gus 802
I’m hearing a lot of references to God and religion here. Lots of it.
MLK speech getting recycled.
| 54 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:59:12am |
re: #50 Gus 802
I’m hearing a lot of references to God and religion here. Lots of it.
That’s strange… there can’t be people on the left who believe in G-d, or creation, or against abortion, or maybe skeptical about AGW, no… someone from the right must have infiltrated that One Nation Rally.
| 55 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 9:59:31am |
re: #50 Gus 802
I’m hearing a lot of references to God and religion here. Lots of it.
Yep. And Schultz mentioned the troops.
These guys are not doing this right! Don’t they know what lefties are supposed to sound like?
| 56 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:00:31am |
re: #53 darthstar
MLK speech getting recycled.
Yep. I understand that the keynote speakers will be Reverend Jesse Jackson and Reverend Al Sharpton.
| 57 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:01:08am |
re: #55 SanFranciscoZionist
Yep. And Schultz mentioned the troops.
These guys are not doing this right! Don’t they know what lefties are supposed to sound like?
Schultz kept it basic. He didn’t stray off into Indybay land.
| 58 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:01:27am |
re: #53 darthstar
MLK speech getting recycled.
I’m really sick of that meme. Yes, his “I Have a Dream” speech was powerful, and it must always be remembered. But the current rallies should focus on today’s issues and come up with their own words to tackle them. Quit trying to piggyback onto someone else’s words. It’s a sign you don’t have anything original to say.
And that goes for you too, Mr. Beck!
| 60 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:02:05am |
This new guy seems to want the return of the WPA.
| 61 |
sagehen Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:02:49am |
re: #34 Dark_Falcon
No, Mr. Shultz. Those Republicans just don’t want to spend money we don’t have.
Right.
I remember the vehement Republican protests to Medicare D, or putting two wars off-budget, and the cost-plus no-bid contracts for KBR and Blackwater to do the military’s job less well, for twice the money, and unconstrained by UCMJ.
Conservatives were outraged at those deficit-spending items, weren’t they?
| 62 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:03:04am |
re: #55 SanFranciscoZionist
Yep. And Schultz mentioned the troops.
These guys are not doing this right! Don’t they know what lefties are supposed to sound like?
Like this?
“Sometimes I think they want Obama to get shot. I do. I really think that there are conservative broadcasters in this country who would love to see Obama taken out. They fear socialism. They fear Marxism. They fear that the United States of America won’t be the United States of America anymore.”
— Ed Schultz, The Ed Schultz Show, August 11, 2009. [MP3 audio]
| 63 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:03:09am |
re: #55 SanFranciscoZionist
Yep. And Schultz mentioned the troops.
These guys are not doing this right! Don’t they know what lefties are supposed to sound like?
Forced abortions and gay marriage for everyone, also marijuana is mandatory now, so we’re putting it in children’s ice cream, Mandrake.
| 65 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:04:21am |
re: #62 Walter L. Newton
Like this?
“Sometimes I think they want Obama to get shot. I do. I really think that there are conservative broadcasters in this country who would love to see Obama taken out. They fear socialism. They fear Marxism. They fear that the United States of America won’t be the United States of America anymore.”
— Ed Schultz, The Ed Schultz Show, August 11, 2009. [MP3 audio]
I think he’s entirely right in that statement.
| 66 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:04:32am |
Damn…just remembered there are a couple of dozen college football games on right now…and the Ryder Cup. Well, I was getting “march on washington” fatigue anyway…I hope the people there have a good time and that they all go out and encourage five people to vote in their respective districts.
| 67 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:05:17am |
Took my earphones out. I can only take so much haranging at a time.
Can they bring the kids out for another number?
| 68 |
Varek Raith Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:07:17am |
re: #61 sagehen
Right.
I remember the vehement Republican protests to Medicare D, or putting two wars off-budget, and the cost-plus no-bid contracts for KBR and Blackwater to do the military’s job less well, for twice the money, and unconstrained by UCMJ.
Conservatives were outraged at those deficit-spending items, weren’t they?
LESS MONEY FOR THE POOR, MORE MONEY FOR BLOWING PEOPLE UP!!11TY
| 69 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:08:09am |
This is what the libertarians need to do; rally and let people learn what we stand for, make our presence known.
| 70 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:08:22am |
I hear you, Mr. Garrison, but these things take time. There’s not going to be a rapid recovery. That said, we do need to do our best for returning veterans.
| 71 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:09:02am |
re: #69 pharmmajor
This is what the libertarians need to do; rally and let people learn what we stand for, make our presence known.
Both of you?
| 72 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:09:22am |
| 74 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:10:07am |
re: #73 Dark_Falcon
SMACK!
I actually know a lot of libertarians. I put them into two groups. Republicans and Democrats.
| 75 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:10:21am |
re: #70 Dark_Falcon
I hear you, Mr. Garrison, but these things take time. There’s not going to be a rapid recovery. That said, we do need to do our best for returning veterans.
He’s OK. At least he had a moment of optimism there. Sometimes these things start to sound like a steady stream of complaints.
| 76 |
Varek Raith Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:10:42am |
re: #74 darthstar
I actually know a lot of libertarians. I put them into two groups. Republicans and Democrats.
Huh, mine is “sane” and “insane”.
| 77 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:10:49am |
re: #71 darthstar
Both of you?
The Libertarian… the party that IS and will ALWAYS BE the party of the future.
| 78 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:11:18am |
re: #77 Walter L. Newton
The Libertarian… the party that IS and will ALWAYS BE the party of the future.
Like Dippin’ Dots, the ice-cream of the future?
| 79 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:11:53am |
re: #75 Gus 802
He’s OK. At least he had a moment of optimism there. Sometimes these things start to sound like a steady stream of complaints.
True. That’s why I said that snark-free. Because his speech was free of Bad Craziness and because he served with honor.
| 80 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:12:50am |
re: #78 darthstar
Like Dippin’ Dots, the ice-cream of the future?
Sure… ? (they already pass that pot bill in Cali?)
| 82 |
sagehen Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:14:30am |
re: #65 SanFranciscoZionist
I think he’s entirely right in that statement.
From The Secret World of Exteme Militias in this week’s Time Magazine:
Threats against Obama’s life brought him Secret Service protection in May 2007, by far the earliest on record for a presidential candidate. At least four alleged assassination plots between June and December — by militiamen in Pennsylvania, white supremacists in Denver, skinheads in Tennessee and an active-duty Marine lance corporal at North Carolina’s Camp Lejeune — led to arrests and criminal charges before Obama was even sworn in.
| 83 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:14:38am |
re: #80 Walter L. Newton
Sure… ? (they already pass that pot bill in Cali?)
Not until November, but Arnold made pot an infraction ($100 fine) and no longer a misdemeanor. It’s cheaper to get caught smoking a joint than it is to get caught making an illegal u-turn.
| 84 |
William Barnett-Lewis Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:14:44am |
re: #71 darthstar
Both of you?
10 Libertarians = 12 Platforms
//only a little. They make it look like Will Rogers really did belong to an organized party.
| 85 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:15:46am |
| 89 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:20:52am |
re: #85 pharmmajor
Oh, Ha ha ha, how f**kin’ hilarious.
Yes, sorry about that. But I want you to know I sarc’d out at you out of love, and not because I think there are only two libertarians on the planet.
| 90 |
Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:21:11am |
Let us be dissatisfied until the [adjective] [plural noun] of [metaphor] no longer [verb] the [adjective] [plural noun] of our [noun].
| 91 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:21:25am |
re: #87 Gus 802
Defense spending only makes up 19 percent of the Federal budget.
Yikes! We pay more for Social Security.
| 92 |
Varek Raith Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:21:56am |
There is no global warming crisis. The alleged warming trends do not exist and there has actually been a cooling trend over the last ten or so years
-Dale Ogden, Libertarian.
| 93 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:22:09am |
re: #89 darthstar
Yes, sorry about that. But I want you to know I sarc’d out at you out of love, and not because I think there are only two libertarians on the planet.
Aw, well… I wuv you too.
*man-hug*
| 94 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:22:48am |
OT: just wanted to say a quick word on Sanchez as I missed that thread yesterday:
He fucked up, and he got fired for it. Too bad, because I actually liked his show sometimes, though his obsession with the twitter drove me fucking nuts.
As far as pointing out any demographic and trying to stereotype them goes, my advice is, no matter how you feel about it, shut the fuck up about it.
That said, I still think banjo players are, for the most part, kind of sketchy people.
| 95 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:23:10am |
re: #92 Varek Raith
There is no global warming crisis. The alleged warming trends do not exist and there has actually been a cooling trend over the last ten or so years
-Dale Ogden, Libertarian.
Okay, so we have our share of nuts. What political party doesn’t?
| 97 |
Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:23:45am |
re: #95 pharmmajor
There is no global warming crisis. The alleged warming trends do not exist and there has actually been a cooling trend over the last ten or so years
Okay, so we have our share of nuts. What political party doesn’t?
Ojoe in 5… 4… 3… 2…
| 98 |
calochortus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:24:06am |
re: #45 Charles
Ed Schultz may be a ranter, but I agree that this kind of thing is flat out evil:
[Link: www.rnclife.org…]
So, do I understand the Republican position correctly here?
1.) A fetus has a right to life that requires a woman to be an incubator for 9 months, providing literally the substance of her body to nourish and sustain it.
2.) Once the child is born a rich person cannot be compelled to provide $2 to vaccinate said child.
| 99 |
Lidane Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:24:35am |
re: #77 Walter L. Newton
The Libertarian… the party that IS and will ALWAYS BE the party of the future.
As long as the election laws in this country are rigged in favor of the Republicans and Democrats? Not a chance.
| 101 |
Varek Raith Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:25:06am |
re: #95 pharmmajor
There is no global warming crisis. The alleged warming trends do not exist and there has actually been a cooling trend over the last ten or so years
Okay, so we have our share of nuts. What political party doesn’t?
Just pointing out the the Libertarian party really isn’t all that different from the GOP.
| 102 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:25:53am |
| 103 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:26:05am |
re: #92 Varek Raith
There is no global warming crisis. The alleged warming trends do not exist and there has actually been a cooling trend over the last ten or so years - Dale Ogden, Libertarian.
“‘The Royal Society now also agrees with the GWPF that the warming trend of the 1980s and 90s has come to a halt in the last 10 years.”
30 September 2010 - Climate change continues to be a subject of intense public and political debate. Because of the level of interest in the topic the Royal Society has produced a new guide to the science of climate change. The guide summarises the current scientific evidence on climate change and its drivers, highlighting the areas where the science is well established, where there is still some debate, and where substantial uncertainties remain.
The document was prepared by a working group chaired by Professor John Pethica, Vice President of the Royal Society and was approved by the Royal Society Council.
[Link: royalsociety.org…]
| 105 |
NJDhockeyfan Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:26:44am |
re: #94 darthstar
OT: just wanted to say a quick word on Sanchez as I missed that thread yesterday:
He fucked up, and he got fired for it. Too bad, because I actually liked his show sometimes, though his obsession with the twitter drove me fucking nuts.As far as pointing out any demographic and trying to stereotype them goes, my advice is, no matter how you feel about it, shut the fuck up about it.
That said, I still think banjo players are, for the most part, kind of sketchy people.
Sanchez’s Jew remarks exposed his anti-Semitism. The next place we will probably see him is at HuffPo which will welcome him with open arms.
| 106 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:26:52am |
re: #101 Varek Raith
Just pointing out the the Libertarian party really isn’t all that different from the GOP.
We support equal rights for gays, decriminalizing marijuana, and a separation of church and state. I’d say that’s vastly different from the GOP.
| 108 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:27:41am |
re: #102 Dark_Falcon
What’s a “Slam Poet”?
A poet sitting in Shakespeare’s in Paris with a bottle of good wine.
| 109 |
sagehen Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:28:25am |
re: #98 calochortus
So, do I understand the Republican position correctly here?
1.) A fetus has a right to life that requires a woman to be an incubator for 9 months, providing literally the substance of her body to nourish and sustain it.2.) Once the child is born a rich person cannot be compelled to provide $2 to vaccinate said child.
Exactly.
Because when the declaration said “all men are created equal,” they made clear right there in the original text that they didn’t intend *women* to be free.
| 110 |
Varek Raith Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:29:28am |
re: #106 pharmmajor
We support equal rights for gays, decriminalizing marijuana, and a separation of church and state. I’d say that’s vastly different from the GOP.
Explain Ron Paul, a hero to the Libertarian Party.
Explain Bob Barr, former Libertarian candidate for PotUS.
| 111 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:29:47am |
re: #109 sagehen
Exactly.
Because when the declaration said “all men are created equal,” they made clear right there in the original text that they didn’t intend *women* to be free.
Oh, I forgot to add; the LP supports the rights of women to have abortions.
| 112 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:30:03am |
Van Jones said something for farmers in red states. That was nice.
| 113 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:30:39am |
re: #108 Walter L. Newton
A poet sitting in Shakespeare’s in Paris with a bottle of good wine.
A friend of mine had a slam poet infestation at her house once.
| 115 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:30:52am |
re: #110 Varek Raith
Explain Ron Paul, a hero to the Libertarian Party.
Explain Bob Barr, former Libertarian candidate for PotUS.
Like I said, all parties have their share of nuts, and Paul is all kinds of nuts.
Barr was a problem, but he changed his ways.
| 116 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:30:58am |
re: #107 Gus 802
Van Jones!! Woohoo! ;)
Very foolish of them. He’s a lightning rod and will attract attacks.
Drudge Headline:
“Van Jones plans to ‘fist’ America.”
| 117 |
calochortus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:31:31am |
re: #109 sagehen
I thought as much. Either that or the right to be born is totally divorced from the right to continue living…
| 118 |
Killgore Trout Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:31:35am |
The crowd size looks like it’s improved considerably since earlier….
[Link: www.flickr.com…]
| 119 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:31:45am |
re: #116 Dark_Falcon
Very foolish of them. He’s a lightning rod and will attract attacks.
Drudge Headline:
“Van Jones plans to ‘fist’ America.”
Yeah. He’s doing OK though.
| 120 |
Varek Raith Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:32:04am |
re: #115 pharmmajor
Like I said, all parties have their share of nuts, and Paul is all kinds of nuts.
Barr was a problem, but he changed his ways.
See what I mean?
The Libertarian party says one thing, then endorses people with the opposite views.
Why?
| 121 |
Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:32:13am |
re: #106 pharmmajor
We support equal rights for gays, decriminalizing marijuana, and a separation of church and state. I’d say that’s vastly different from the GOP.
Libertarians (capital L) are also entirely too comfortable IMHO with a philosophy of deregulation that is awfully close to anarcho-capitalism, and I wouldn’t be shocked in the slightest to see a (L) candidate advocating exactly that.
I’ve heard more than one Libertarian express utter dismay at the fact that there exists anything at all in public domain (e.g. parks, libraries, sidewalks, etc.) and that absolutely 100% of everything should be privately owned, because something something property rights something something.
| 122 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:32:27am |
re: #109 sagehen
Exactly.
Because when the declaration said “all men are created equal,” they made clear right there in the original text that they didn’t intend *women* to be free.
Well, they didn’t. The men of that time believed woman to be inferior in many ways and in need of control and protection.
| 123 |
calochortus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:32:53am |
re: #103 Walter L. Newton
Where in that document does it say that warming has stopped. It says the rate appears to have peaked in the 90s but it has continued.
| 124 |
Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:32:59am |
oh SHIT! They just busted out the GODFATHER.
git on up! get into it!
| 126 |
Lidane Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:33:09am |
re: #110 Varek Raith
Explain Ron Paul, a hero to the Libertarian Party.
Explain Bob Barr, former Libertarian candidate for PotUS.
For that matter, explain Michael Badnarik, Libertarian POTUS candidate, and 9/11 troofer. He sounds damn near like a younger Luap Nor.
| 127 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:33:25am |
re: #122 Dark_Falcon
Well, they didn’t. The men of that time believed woman to be inferior in many ways and in need of control and protection.
Scripture is the word of G-d, not man.
| 128 |
wrenchwench Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:33:25am |
re: #106 pharmmajor
We support equal rights for gays, decriminalizing marijuana, and a separation of church and state. I’d say that’s vastly different from the GOP.
Trouble is, when you say “we”, you mean yourself and a couple of unidentified compadres. Not the members of the party in general, and especially not the famous ones.
| 131 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:34:39am |
re: #127 Walter L. Newton
Scripture is the word of G-d, not man.
Where did that come from? I was talking about the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence.
| 132 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:35:48am |
re: #130 Gus 802
Speaking of lightening rods. D’oh!
Well, we said this pack was clueless, and all this does is prove it.
| 133 |
Charles Johnson Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:37:28am |
Van Jones got a really raw deal at the hands of the right wing. He was one of the first victims of the dishonest smear tactics that are now used against everyone in the Obama administration.
| 134 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:37:43am |
re: #131 Dark_Falcon
Where did that come from? I was talking about the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence.
Sorry… I thought you were talking about scripture.
| 135 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:37:47am |
re: #115 pharmmajor
Like I said, all parties have their share of nuts, and Paul is all kinds of nuts.
Barr was a problem, but he changed his ways.
My nephew, who just turned 16, is a Hannity watching wing-nut. When he turned 14, I was still working at Cafepress, and told him he could have any political t-shirt he wanted (it was 2008, after all). He chose a “Bob Barr for President” shirt. I got it for him, especially after noticing that the Bob Barr for president group had misspelled words on the back of the shirt.
| 136 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:37:57am |
re: #128 wrenchwench
Trouble is, when you say “we”, you mean yourself and a couple of unidentified compadres. Not the members of the party in general, and especially not the famous ones.
Okay then. Maybe you guys can help me out with this problem. How do we get the message across that the majority of libertarians aren’t like the radicals and extremists who get the most coverage.
| 137 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:38:17am |
re: #132 Dark_Falcon
Well, we said this pack was clueless, and all this does is prove it.
Most folks will take him at face value though. Unless he says something off the wall now which I doubt he will. I’ve gotten used to him over the years and after having seen him debate Christopher Hitchens. Hitchens won that debate of course — IMO.
| 138 |
Linden Arden Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:38:37am |
Over at Reason Magazine (Libertarian all the way) the editors and writers were polled before the 2008 election and the majority supported and voted for Obama.
And the Kochs fund them.
Reason “Who is getting your vote”.
I give them credit for editorial independence.
| 139 |
Kragar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:39:05am |
Ahmadinejad to visit ‘Iran’s border with Israel’
He’s refering the the Lebanese-Israeli border.
Iranian President lays claim to Lebanon’s southern border which he will visit during official tour; Lebanese official calls visit “a provocation.”
Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad plans to visit what he has reportedly called “Iran’s border with Israel” during a trip to Lebanon later this month, referring to the Lebanese southern border.
| 140 |
wrenchwench Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:39:49am |
re: #136 pharmmajor
Okay then. Maybe you guys can help me out with this problem. How do we get the message across that the majority of libertarians aren’t like the radicals and extremists who get the most coverage.
Disavow any candidate who doesn’t stick to the platform. You do have a platform? Is there a link?
| 141 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:40:28am |
re: #140 wrenchwench
Disavow any candidate who doesn’t stick to the platform. You do have a platform? Is there a link?
Yeah. Our platform is posted here:
[Link: www.lp.org…]
| 142 |
Decatur Deb Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:40:48am |
Found the rally. Seems less monochromatic than others I’ve seen.
| 143 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:41:38am |
A Yoot Minister…(I’m Irish, I get to have fun with this one).
| 144 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:42:29am |
Following the Reverend Al Sharpton we now have Minister Lisa O’Reilly.
Father Simon Bautista is supposed to speak in this segment too.
| 145 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:42:53am |
Lisa O’Reilly. Really old-school here, with an Irish speaker like that. Strong roots for that is US history.
| 146 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:43:22am |
re: #123 calochortus
Where in that document does it say that warming has stopped. It says the rate appears to have peaked in the 90s but it has continued.
Remove the first quote from my clipped and pasted… it appears that was editorializing on the part of someone at a different web site. The second paragraph is from the RS’s page. And of course the document is from their site.
| 148 |
Decatur Deb Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:46:30am |
We’ve committed to the Fear Sanity rally. Note that they’re getting act together and are running charter buses from almost all feasible states. Even Birmingham has an overnight up-and-back for about $140 per head.
| 150 |
wrenchwench Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:47:37am |
re: #141 pharmmajor
Yeah. Our platform is posted here:
[Link: www.lp.org…]
The abortion plank is not exactly robust:
1.4 AbortionRecognizing that abortion is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on all sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration.
The Environment plank is also weak.
But we were talking about letting people know that the majority of libertarians aren’t like the radicals and extremists who get the most coverage. That’s a tough one, because those who are getting attention as radicals are running as Republicans. Is Ron Paul actually a Libertarian, or just sort of a mascot?
| 152 |
Surabaya Stew Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:50:07am |
Am enjoying LGF for the first time on an iPad (thank you, meatpacking district apple store!), and am very temped to get one.
| 153 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:50:34am |
re: #147 calochortus
Got it.
The RS document seems to fairly deal with all three aspects of climate change, the known science, the possible science and what is not settled, which I find refreshing in comparison to the anti-science naysayers and the hyperbolic end-of-the-world climate “guru’s”
As one of the opening paragraphs says…
“In view of the ongoing public and political debates about climate change, the aim of this document is to summarise the current scientific evidence on climate change and its drivers. It lays out clearly where the science is well established, where there is wide
consensus but continuing debate, and where there remains substantial uncertainty. The impacts of climate change, as distinct from the causes, are not considered here. This document draws upon recent evidence and builds on the Fourth Assessment Report of Working Group I of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), published in 2007, which is the most comprehensive source of climate science and its uncertainties.”
[Link: royalsociety.org…]
I find this a fair assessment of the issue. I find the billion and billions will die to be no more scientifically stable than Left Behind believers.
| 154 |
darthstar Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:52:04am |
Okay…time for “Wait Wait, Don’t Tell Me” on NPR…that means load the dogs up for a drive to the beach.
See you all later.
| 155 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:52:18am |
re: #150 wrenchwench
But we were talking about letting people know that the majority of libertarians aren’t like the radicals and extremists who get the most coverage. That’s a tough one, because those who are getting attention as radicals are running as Republicans. Is Ron Paul actually a Libertarian, or just sort of a mascot?
That is a tricky matter. My best guess is that Paul is a libertarian-leaning Republican. And when you have people like him and Glenn Beck using that label, it tends to taint the public perception of actual libertarians. I dunno, I wish there was some way to let people know who really stands up for LP principles and who’s just using the party identity without giving a shit about what we stand for.
| 156 |
Charles Johnson Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:53:00am |
I’m pretty sure the Colbert-Stewart rally is going to have better comedy than this one.
| 157 |
calochortus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:54:10am |
re: #154 darthstar
No dogs here and no trip to the beach, but I’ll be listening to “Wait, Wait” myself, so catch you later.
| 158 |
Crimsonfisted Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:55:18am |
re: #90 negativ
Let us be dissatisfied until the [adjective] [plural noun] of [metaphor] no longer [verb] the [adjective] [plural noun] of our [noun].
Put that on a T-shirt and I would buy it.
| 161 |
Lidane Sat, Oct 2, 2010 10:59:22am |
re: #155 pharmmajor
But we were talking about letting people know that the majority of libertarians aren’t like the radicals and extremists who get the most coverage.
Except that the ones who get the most coverage, like Ron Paul, Bob Barr, and Michael Badnarik, are the ones who have been nominated for President by the Libertarian Party. Those are the people that the LP wants for its standard bearers.
That’s the problem. Libertarianism sounds great in theory. I’ve got books on my shelf about it, and can say that it seems like an attractive philosophy. However, given who they keep nominating for President and the reality of election laws in this country favoring the two major parties, IMO voting Libertarian, especially here in Texas, is the same as voting Republican. If I wanted to do that, I’d just pull the trigger for someone with an (R) after their name.
| 162 |
NJDhockeyfan Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:00:16am |
Gonna go back to the shed. Later lizards.
| 163 |
Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:04:59am |
Cute inarticulate teacher’s union speaker is cute.
| 164 |
Linden Arden Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:09:18am |
Bill Maher and Glenn Beck have claimed to be Libertarians so I question if the LP is really effective in their messaging.
It sounds nice until you get down to real problem solving - the LP is against Social Security but has never posited a reasonable plan for getting rid of it.
| 165 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:13:18am |
re: #164 Linden Arden
Bill Maher and Glenn Beck have claimed to be Libertarians so I question if the LP is really effective in their messaging.
It sounds nice until you get down to real problem solving - the LP is against Social Security but has never posited a reasonable plan for getting rid of it.
We’re not against Social Security, but we think people should have more control over their SS funds
[Link: www.lp.org…]
Libertarians believe you should be able to opt out of Social Security and invest your money in your own personal retirement account. An account that you own and control - one that politicians can’t get their hands on.
Even a very conservative investment strategy would yield three times the benefits promised by Social Security.
Given that there are now only 3 people paying in for every one person receiving, and Social Security will start paying more than it takes in, this does seem like a better alternative rather than letting the SS fund run out.
| 166 |
Gus Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:15:19am |
One Nation Working Together is a project of PowerPac. Here are the relationship maps for:
and the current Chair of PowerPac Steve Phillips.
| 167 |
alexknyc Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:16:15am |
re: #136 pharmmajor
Okay then. Maybe you guys can help me out with this problem. How do we get the message across that the majority of libertarians aren’t like the radicals and extremists who get the most coverage.
Maybe the libertarians need to retake the Libertarian party.
| 168 |
Romantic Heretic Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:16:34am |
re: #91 Dark_Falcon
Yikes! We pay more for Social Security.
Don’t see the problem with that.
And the U.S. spends more than the next ten nations after it.
| 169 |
Decatur Deb Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:16:43am |
re: #165 pharmmajor
We’re not against Social Security, but we think people should have more control over their SS funds
[Link: www.lp.org…]
Given that there are now only 3 people paying in for every one person receiving, and Social Security will start paying more than it takes in, this does seem like a better alternative rather than letting the SS fund run out.
Don’t know if I would have put my retirement in Enron or AIG.
| 170 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:17:02am |
re: #165 pharmmajor
We’re not against Social Security, but we think people should have more control over their SS funds
[Link: www.lp.org…]
Given that there are now only 3 people paying in for every one person receiving, and Social Security will start paying more than it takes in, this does seem like a better alternative rather than letting the SS fund run out.
What do we do with the people who lose all their money in that account, and then need a second safety net?
| 171 |
Decatur Deb Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:17:59am |
re: #170 SanFranciscoZionist
What do we do with the people who lose all their money in that account, and then need a second safety net?
The market has spoken. It says they should die.
| 172 |
Lidane Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:18:14am |
re: #170 SanFranciscoZionist
What do we do with the people who lose all their money in that account, and then need a second safety net?
For that matter, how is the Libertarian proposal any different from the GOP canard about privatization of SS, or individual investment accounts?
| 173 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:18:20am |
re: #170 SanFranciscoZionist
What do we do with the people who lose all their money in that account, and then need a second safety net?
Well, who says you need to invest it in the stock market? Why not put it in a savings account?
| 174 |
Decatur Deb Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:19:12am |
re: #173 pharmmajor
Well, who says you need to invest it in the stock market? Why not put it in a savings account?
My savings account is returning 1.1 percent.
| 175 |
ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:19:18am |
re: #75 Gus 802
He’s OK. At least he had a moment of optimism there. Sometimes these things start to sound like a steady stream of complaints.
That’s because they are a steady stream of complaints. Some are whiny, some are shouted; some are invoking a deity, some are not; some blame specific people, some blame whatever “them” is in fashion; some are male, some are female, perhaps a few are indeterminate; but all they do is complain.
The next liberal (or conservative) speaker at one of these rallies who actually has a comprehensive PLAN that improves A while not screwing B will be the first.
| 176 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:20:09am |
re: #174 Decatur Deb
My savings account is returning 1.1 percent.
There are account plans that offer a higher return. You’ve just got to look for them.
| 177 |
Romantic Heretic Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:20:27am |
re: #171 Decatur Deb
The market has spoken. It says they should die.
Hey. A person’s value is determined by the size of their bank account. Bank account empty=valueless person.
So who caress if they die? They’re failures.
//////////
| 178 |
Killgore Trout Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:20:46am |
Harry Belefonte? Is his buddy Chavez speaker next?
| 179 |
Decatur Deb Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:21:09am |
re: #176 pharmmajor
There are account plans that offer a higher return. You’ve just got to look for them.
Goldline?
| 180 |
Killgore Trout Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:21:24am |
Poor stupid lefties. They haven’t evolved at all.
| 181 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:21:32am |
re: #177 Romantic Heretic
Hey. A person’s value is determined by the size of their bank account. Bank account empty=valueless person.
So who caress if they die? They’re failures.
///
Okay, now you’re just taking the hostile, cynical response.
| 182 |
Linden Arden Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:21:44am |
Libertarians believe you should be able to opt out of Social Security and invest your money in your own personal retirement account.
And that would bust the federal budget wide open.
FICA taxes collected roughly equal SS payments outgoing.
Lets say its $800 billion annually. Who wouldn’t opt out for a private account?
But if 50% did that would add $400 billion to the annual deficit. The debt incurred over the last 10 years has really junked any possibility of reform like you suggest.
| 183 |
ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:21:48am |
re: #94 darthstar
OT: just wanted to say a quick word on Sanchez as I missed that thread yesterday:
He fucked up, and he got fired for it. Too bad, because I actually liked his show sometimes, though his obsession with the twitter drove me fucking nuts.As far as pointing out any demographic and trying to stereotype them goes, my advice is, no matter how you feel about it, shut the fuck up about it.
That said, I still think banjo players are, for the most part, kind of sketchy people.
You forgot mimes.
| 184 |
Eclectic Infidel Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:22:12am |
re: #170 SanFranciscoZionist
What do we do with the people who lose all their money in that account, and then need a second safety net?
Libertarians don’t have an answer for that. That’s why the LP will never make it mainstream.
| 185 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:23:23am |
re: #179 Decatur Deb
Goldline?
Actually I found a list here that compares a number of high-yield MMA rates:
[Link: www.bankaholic.com…]
| 186 |
ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:25:22am |
re: #95 pharmmajor
There is no global warming crisis. The alleged warming trends do not exist and there has actually been a cooling trend over the last ten or so years
Okay, so we have our share of nuts. What political party doesn’t?
I think the problem with the Libertarians is that by nature they are both all-inclusive and unwilling to commit to specific principles. This means that anyone can claim to have “libertarian principles” (Bob Barr, anyone?) and claim to be part of the party.
Frankly, right now, there may be true libertarians with a specific agenda, but the nuts outnumber and outshout them. Kind of like the Republicans.
| 187 |
Eclectic Infidel Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:26:02am |
re: #181 pharmmajor
Okay, now you’re just taking the hostile, cynical response.
So Libertarians, the one that value human life, would in fact support a government funded safety net? You know, one that keeps people housed, fed, even trained for a better job?
| 188 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:26:28am |
re: #179 Decatur Deb
Goldline?
Sorry, forgot to add this in the other post. It’s another list of banks that offer high-yield savings account plans.
[Link: www.consumerismcommentary.com…]
| 189 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:26:47am |
re: #173 pharmmajor
Well, who says you need to invest it in the stock market? Why not put it in a savings account?
What happens if they put it in the stock market and lose it?
| 190 |
Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:26:50am |
re: #158 Crimsonfisted
Put that on a T-shirt and I would buy it.
[Link: www.cafepress.com…]
Here ya go, quick and dirty.
| 191 |
ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:27:14am |
re: #105 NJDhockeyfan
Sanchez’s Jew remarks exposed his anti-Semitism. The next place we will probably see him is at HuffPo which will welcome him with open arms.
Will they outbid Fox News for him?
| 192 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:27:46am |
re: #187 eclectic infidel
So Libertarians, the one that value human life, would in fact support a government funded safety net? You know, one that keeps people housed, fed, even trained for a better job?
I wouldn’t mind that, provided guidelines were set in place to prevent unscrupulous people from abusing the system and taking money away from those who needed it. I saw too much of that happening when I worked in a community pharmacy: welfare cheats that chose not to work were getting their medicine for free while those who were really disabled or in need were struggling.
| 193 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:28:34am |
I love libertarian brand anarcho-capitalism. My portfolio of frozen chickens stuffed with ammunition is looking better every day.
| 194 |
Decatur Deb Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:28:55am |
re: #192 pharmmajor
I wouldn’t mind that, provided guidelines were set in place to prevent unscrupulous people from abusing the system and taking money away from those who needed it. I saw too much of that happening when I worked in a community pharmacy: welfare cheats that chose not to work were getting their medicine for free while those who were really disabled or in need were struggling.
Did you make the system work by reporting those welfare cheats?
| 195 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:29:45am |
re: #194 Decatur Deb
Did you make the system work by reporting those welfare cheats?
I wanted to, but we couldn’t because that would have violated HIPPA laws.
| 196 |
What, me worry? Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:29:49am |
re: #188 pharmmajor
Sorry, forgot to add this in the other post. It’s another list of banks that offer high-yield savings account plans.
[Link: www.consumerismcommentary.com…]
Ok, maybe I’m missing something. You consider 1.10 - 1.40% as high yield?
| 197 |
Obdicut Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:30:10am |
re: #186 ClaudeMonet
I used to call myself a libertarian, because I believe that maximizing individual liberty is a good thing. Then I realized that, for some reason, a lot of ‘libertarians’ thought that property rights were the starting point of all other rights.
I called myself a civil libertarian for awhile. But too many people calling themselves ‘civil libertarians’ are in favor of repealing the fourteenth.
Now I don’t call myself anything.
| 198 |
What, me worry? Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:30:49am |
re: #189 SanFranciscoZionist
What happens if they put it in the stock market and lose it?
And that’s exactly what’s going to happen if SS is privatized.
| 199 |
Linden Arden Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:31:26am |
re: #179 Decatur Deb
Goldline?
Gold will get shellacked when the Fed tightens again someday (raises rates).
And libertarians make up many of the goldbugs (Ron Paul)
| 200 |
ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:31:38am |
re: #148 Decatur Deb
We’ve committed to the Fear Sanity rally. Note that they’re getting act together and are running charter buses from almost all feasible states. Even Birmingham has an overnight up-and-back for about $140 per head.
Even though I’m a fan of neither Stewart’s show nor Colbert’s, I’d be at the rallies—except that I’m in a show the night before and that night. i think the other folks involved would be a bit miffed if I didn’t show up.
| 201 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:32:27am |
re: #195 pharmmajor
I wanted to, but we couldn’t because that would have violated HIPPA laws.
Stupid privacy and the rule law, how utterly inconvenient.
| 202 |
Eclectic Infidel Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:32:44am |
re: #192 pharmmajor
I wouldn’t mind that, provided guidelines were set in place to prevent unscrupulous people from abusing the system and taking money away from those who needed it. I saw too much of that happening when I worked in a community pharmacy: welfare cheats that chose not to work were getting their medicine for free while those who were really disabled or in need were struggling.
I did a brief stint of volunteer work at a welfare office in Napa, California, well over 15 years ago now. It was easy to cheat the system (single mothers lived with bfs who made a pretty penny, would have at least two kids, usually more, to collect on each kid). Everyone knew they were cheating but at that time, there was little to be done because the single mother hadn’t married the affluent boyfriend.
So yes, a check and balance system is absolutely required.
| 203 |
HoosierHoops Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:34:29am |
re: #202 eclectic infidel
I didn’t know you worked in Napa! I grew up in Yountville..Small world
| 204 |
Obdicut Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:35:00am |
re: #106 pharmmajor
We support equal rights for gays, decriminalizing marijuana, and a separation of church and state. I’d say that’s vastly different from the GOP.
Except when individual candidates supported by the libertarian party don’t, of course.
| 205 |
Eclectic Infidel Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:35:20am |
re: #197 Obdicut
I knew a couple of paleo-libertarians in college who believed that the only people who should be allowed to vote were property owners. They also took a literal interpretation of the Constitution and didn’t believe that women should have been granted the right to vote. A strange philosophy indeed.
| 206 |
Charles Johnson Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:35:27am |
That’s a pretty large crowd now. Looks at least as big as the Beck rally, maybe bigger.
| 207 |
Decatur Deb Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:35:50am |
re: #202 eclectic infidel
I did a brief stint of volunteer work at a welfare office in Napa, California, well over 15 years ago now. It was easy to cheat the system (single mothers lived with bfs who made a pretty penny, would have at least two kids, usually more, to collect on each kid). Everyone knew they were cheating but at that time, there was little to be done because the single mother hadn’t married the affluent boyfriend.
So yes, a check and balance system is absolutely required.
Laws are human product—they are often defective. The answer is to fix them, not throw our hands up and charge into the Gulch.
| 208 |
BongCrodny Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:37:35am |
re: #171 Decatur Deb
The market has spoken. It says they should die.
I logged in just so I could upding this.
| 209 |
Decatur Deb Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:37:37am |
re: #206 Charles
That’s a pretty large crowd now. Looks at least as big as the Beck rally, maybe bigger.
Almost dozens.
—M. Bachmann
| 210 |
What, me worry? Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:38:11am |
re: #192 pharmmajor
I wouldn’t mind that, provided guidelines were set in place to prevent unscrupulous people from abusing the system and taking money away from those who needed it. I saw too much of that happening when I worked in a community pharmacy: welfare cheats that chose not to work were getting their medicine for free while those who were really disabled or in need were struggling.
Welfare cheats. Really? Those terrible poor people scamming the government for $50 worth of medication.
Seemed to me the ones who caused the most trouble for Medicare were the doctors and who scammed the Columbia Healthcare System for hundreds of millions of dollars.
[Link: www.miamiherald.com…]
The strategy proved profitable. Federal investigators said Columbia made $6.9 million in illegal payoffs to 77 El Paso doctors — and in return received $103 million in Medicare business, court records show.
In addition to the doctor payments, whistle-blowers inside and outside the company — from Miami to remote Montana — also questioned Columbia/HCA’s methods of billing Medicare.
The questions eventually led to a federal investigation — and $900 million in fines.
About $400 million of the fines came from cheating on direct patient billing — called upcoding — in which Columbia/HCA filed claims stating that patients were sicker than they really were. A New York Times analysis of 30 million billing records found that Columbia/HCA frequently charged more on average for its patients than other companies.
| 211 |
ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:38:37am |
re: #197 Obdicut
I used to call myself a libertarian, because I believe that maximizing individual liberty is a good thing. Then I realized that, for some reason, a lot of ‘libertarians’ thought that property rights were the starting point of all other rights.
I called myself a civil libertarian for awhile. But too many people calling themselves ‘civil libertarians’ are in favor of repealing the fourteenth.
Now I don’t call myself anything.
Call me whatever you want, but don’t forget to call me for dinner.
I’m a fiscal and foreign policy mild conservative, a social small-l liberal, and a despiser of both weak-willed moderates and overbearing folks from either end of the political spectrum. I don’t know what to call my views and don’t care.
| 212 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:43:48am |
re: #210 marjoriemoon
Welfare cheats. Really? Those terrible poor people scamming the government for $50 worth of medication.
Actually, one woman bragged about how she used her welfare money to get an ABOVE-GROUND POOL, even though she was perfectly capable of working.
| 213 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:49:09am |
re: #212 pharmmajor
Actually, one woman bragged about how she used her welfare money to get an ABOVE-GROUND POOL, even though she was perfectly capable of working.
Let’s battle anecdotes, I personally once used welfare to pay for two days in the ICU, a Cat scan, x-rays, a echocardiogram, an MRI and a nuclear MIBG scan. I may have been a financial parasite, but I’m alive as a result.
| 214 |
pharmmajor Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:53:10am |
re: #213 goddamnedfrank
Let’s battle anecdotes, I personally once used welfare to pay for two days in the ICU, a Cat scan, x-rays, a echocardiogram, an MRI and a nuclear MIBG scan. I may have been a financial parasite, but I’m alive as a result.
Like I said, I have no problem with welfare going to those who truly need it, not those who abuse it.
| 215 |
wrenchwench Sat, Oct 2, 2010 11:55:44am |
re: #213 goddamnedfrank
Let’s battle anecdotes, I personally once used welfare to pay for two days in the ICU, a Cat scan, x-rays, a echocardiogram, an MRI and a nuclear MIBG scan. I may have been a financial parasite, but I’m alive as a result.
That sounds way too exciting. Glad you lived through it.
| 216 |
What, me worry? Sat, Oct 2, 2010 12:09:58pm |
re: #214 pharmmajor
Like I said, I have no problem with welfare going to those who truly need it, not those who abuse it.
That includes the doctors, billers, board members and ex-CEO Rick Scott of Columbia? You do know his running for governor of Florida and claims no responsibility for that entire scandal. Who is more dangerous?
| 217 |
ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 2, 2010 12:16:14pm |
I tried to watch the rally, I reaaly did. I made it through about 20 minutes and decided I didn’t like the sound of my brain melting.
What world do these people and their wingnut counterparts inhabit?
| 218 |
Lidane Sat, Oct 2, 2010 12:36:39pm |
re: #197 Obdicut
I know the feeling.
After spending the last few years dealing with hardcore anarcho-capitalist libertarians, Luap Nor fanboys, and idjits who actually think the Mises Institute has good economic ideas, I ultimately rejected the whole idea of calling myself a libertarian at all.
I call myself a liberal just because in this state, I am. It’s more a label of convenience than anything else.
| 219 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 2, 2010 12:38:25pm |
re: #214 pharmmajor
Like I said, I have no problem with welfare going to those who truly need it, not those who abuse it.
Then you’re not really a libertarian as I’ve come to understand the term. Also, the nuclear MIBG scan was ordered to rule out a pheochromocytoma that I didn’t have, meaning that I truly didn’t need it except to provide diagnostic peace of mind. In fact none of the tests were all that conclusive, my hypertension and hypertensive crisis has been ruled idiopathic. I’m on medication that keeps me alive but nobody knows the root cause of the condition except that my Dad got it at the same age and that a genetic predisposition is strongly suspected.
| 220 |
wrenchwench Sat, Oct 2, 2010 12:44:46pm |
re: #219 goddamnedfrank
I love the word “idiopathic”. Sucks when it’s a diagnosis, though.
| 221 |
sagehen Sat, Oct 2, 2010 12:53:50pm |
re: #214 pharmmajor
Like I said, I have no problem with welfare going to those who truly need it, not those who abuse it.
All the welfare cheats in the entire country for the last 20 years, all added together, don’t add up to one Enron or AIG. Which is a more cost-effective place to spend our enforcement dollars?
| 222 |
ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 2, 2010 1:05:58pm |
re: #219 goddamnedfrank
Then you’re not really a libertarian as I’ve come to understand the term. Also, the nuclear MIBG scan was ordered to rule out a pheochromocytoma that I didn’t have, meaning that I truly didn’t need it except to provide diagnostic peace of mind. In fact none of the tests were all that conclusive, my hypertension and hypertensive crisis has been ruled idiopathic. I’m on medication that keeps me alive but nobody knows the root cause of the condition except that my Dad got it at the same age and that a genetic predisposition is strongly suspected.
The important thing is that you’re alive. At the very least, you and the doctors know a lot more about what it’s NOT, and how to manage if not cure whatever it is.
| 223 |
dragonfire1981 Sat, Oct 2, 2010 1:08:01pm |
Funny to me how the major difference I notice between today’s crowd and the Beck crowd is that the people there today seem to be of multiple skin colors…
| 224 |
William of Orange Sat, Oct 2, 2010 1:34:06pm |
I cannot believe this screen shot!!
Fox news reporting and I think: “that picture must be doctored!”
:-)
| 225 |
prairiefire Sat, Oct 2, 2010 1:35:46pm |
re: #224 William of Orange
I cannot believe this screen shot!!
Fox news reporting and I think: “that picture must be doctored!”
:-)
That is beautiful!
| 226 |
Jadespring Sat, Oct 2, 2010 1:37:56pm |
re: #224 William of Orange
I cannot believe this screen shot!!
Fox news reporting and I think: “that picture must be doctored!”
:-)
That looks like a lot of people.
| 227 |
ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 2, 2010 2:11:27pm |
re: #226 Jadespring
That looks like a lot of people.
I don’t think it’s quite as many people as at Beckfest, which didn’t look that impressive to me to begin with. I’d like to see an overhead shot of the area to be sure.
| 228 |
Crimsonfisted Sat, Oct 2, 2010 2:38:32pm |
re: #190 negativ
[Link: www.cafepress.com…]
Here ya go, quick and dirty.
Back from church. That is soooooooo cool!! I LOVE IT.
| 229 |
The Great Ralph Sat, Oct 2, 2010 3:30:28pm |
re: #29 Gus 802
You know him. He’s been on MSNBC. The Ed Schultz show.
His brother is Dave Schultz, a professional golfer. //
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
Dave Schultz is Ed’s son. He brags about him whenever he can on the radio show.
| 230 |
zato Sat, Oct 2, 2010 4:03:46pm |
re: #37 darthstar
Sure they do. They just want to spend it on themselves - it’s called a tax cut for the rich.
The “rich” pay most of the taxes already. I don’t understand the obsession with declaring class warfare and wanting to tax the “rich” at a higher rate. Besides, its well known that lower government spending and lower tax rates would boost economic growth. And quite frankly, an equal tax rate for all (regardless of ethnicity, gender or income bracket) would sound fair to me. For the record, I am not “rich” and neither do I despise people for their wealth. The democrats are dividing the nation by campaigning on not extending tax cuts for the wealthy (of course, a small percentage of the electorate that they have chosen to discriminate against).
| 231 |
sagehen Sat, Oct 2, 2010 4:46:34pm |
re: #230 zato
Besides, its well known that lower government spending and lower tax rates would boost economic growth.
No it isn’t.
See, for example, WWII and the decade immediately thereafter — taxes started at about 15%, the highest marginal rate was 92%, spending was HUUUUGGGEEE, economic growth was incredible. During the war a full 10% of our population were in uniform on battlefields earning military paychecks, another 20% were working at defense plants, plus of course the normal range of government services that happen even in peacetime. After the war was VA spending on housing and educating all the vets, and the Marshall Plan, and the interstate highway system, and a gazillion new schools… there was some pretty serious economic growth in that era.
In the 60’s taxes topped out at 70%, there was Vietnam and the space program and the Great Society, economic growth was pretty good then too.
Economic growth in the 80s was better than the 70’s, but that was mostly a function of increased military spending and getting inflation under control; but deficits increased, income inequality increased. In the 90s we had a tax hike (0 republicans voted for it), and the economic increased hugely again. 22 million new jobs during Clinton’s presidency (more than Reagan and both Bushes combined).
And quite frankly, an equal tax rate for all (regardless of ethnicity, gender or income bracket) would sound fair to me. For the record, I am not “rich” and neither do I despise people for their wealth. The democrats are dividing the nation by campaigning on not extending tax cuts for the wealthy (of course, a small percentage of the electorate that they have chosen to discriminate against).
I don’t know why you even bring up ethnicity and gender — are you under the delusion that there’s ever been (or anybody ever wanted) tax rates based on anything other than income bracket?
A progressive tax has proved, over many decades and in many countries, to be the best way to expand an economy and keep it expanding. A thousand people with a hundred dollars each will buy a lot more toasters than a hundred people with a thousand dollars each. Skimming from the top to prop up the bottom is what keeps the maximum amount of money circulating.
| 232 |
Lidane Sat, Oct 2, 2010 4:46:49pm |
re: #230 zato
I don’t understand the obsession with declaring class warfare and wanting to tax the “rich” at a higher rate.
It’s the same reason why the right declares class warfare on poor and lower-income people, especially if they’re brown or from another country. It gets voters to the booth on election day.
The biggest divides in this country aren’t along racial, gender, or religious lines. They’re along class lines, and both parties exploit that resentment perfectly, whether it’s the Dems showing the clear and obvious excesses of Wall Street and CEO’s making hundreds of millions a year, or the GOP talking about welfare queens and people cheating the system and burdening Real America with their problems.
| 233 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 2, 2010 4:49:25pm |
Come on out, “BEAM”! You downdinged me at least five times and didn’t post at all. Explain yourself.
| 234 |
Obdicut Sat, Oct 2, 2010 6:01:22pm |
re: #230 zato
Your talking points are weak-ass.
First of all:
Progressive taxation doesn’t mean people in higher tax brackets are taxed more. It means that income at higher levels is taxed more. Why is this important? Because everybody pays the same tax on the same amount of money. Someone making a million dollars of income gets taxes on the first 8,375 at 10%, just like the person making 8,375 a year. And so on, and so on.
FUthermore, most truly wealthy people get their income through unearned income, which is not subject to income tax but capital gains tax. The maximum long-term capital gains tax right now is 15%— substantially lower than the tax on most middle-class incomes.
So you have your facts wrong: right now, the wealthy are privileged above the middle class in terms of taxation— as Warren Buffett ably pointed out.
If you really want to make all income taxed the same, then fine— take away the capital gains tax privilege. But I have a sneaking suspicion that you want to preserve that tax break for the wealthy.
| 235 |
Wozza Matter? Sun, Oct 3, 2010 5:21:16am |
re: #221 sagehen
All the welfare cheats in the entire country for the last 20 years, all added together, don’t add up to one Enron or AIG. Which is a more cost-effective place to spend our enforcement dollars?
corporations are poor people deserving of welfare too…………..
| 236 |
Euler Sun, Oct 3, 2010 10:54:18am |
I challenge Charles to apply his considerable talent in creating compelling animated GIFs (his most famous exploit being the Killian document) to this pair of images taken from precisely the same angle from atop the Washington Monument. I am confident you could have aligned them perfectly, Charles.
| 237 |
zato Sun, Oct 3, 2010 3:11:41pm |
re: #234 Obdicut
I don’t think taxing the wealthy at a higher rate (% of total income) and declaring tax warfare on business is going to get us out of this recession any quicker. Businesses with cash are holding on to it and they’re reluctant to make capital investments because of the uncertainty created by this administration- they’re uncertain about what taxes and hidden costs lie in store for them from the anti-business, idealogy driven President.
By the way, I understand how “progressive taxation” works. Like I said, I’m not wealthy but I just don’t like the idea of “skimming from the top” (as Sagehen refers to it). How about we all pull our own weight and cut back the massive spending so that we don’t have to talk about taxing the rich more (as a total percentage of their total income).
The Republicans screwed up the economy with massive spending in the pre-2008 period and now the reckless spending by the Democrat along with Obama’s ideology driven tax threats are merely prolonging the recession.
| 239 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Sun, Oct 3, 2010 4:54:38pm |
re: #237 zato
how’s it hanging, crypto Ron paulian
| 240 |
zato Mon, Oct 4, 2010 9:53:43am |
re: #239 WindUpBird
how’s it hanging, crypto Ron paulian
I’m not on the Ron Paul bandwagon. In fact, I’m a registered as an independent voter.
But I’m doing remarkably well, inspite of the recession. Unlike our politicians, I’m keeping my finances in order. I expect to be paying more in taxes soon (hidden taxes and embeded costs passed along by businesses). Employers in my city have mostly frozen hiring because of the uncertainty- they will soon be burdened with more costs (regulatory, taxes, etc). So I’m doing what any fiscally wise person will do- I’ve cut back on frivolous spending (no vacations, no purchases beyong basic necessities). I’m hoarding cash and inadertently contributing to the low consumer spending which will just delay or slow down the recovery.
How’s that hope and change stuff working out for you?
| 241 |
Obdicut Mon, Oct 4, 2010 10:31:03am |
re: #237 zato
I don’t think taxing the wealthy at a higher rate (% of total income) and declaring tax warfare on business is going to get us out of this recession any quicker.
It’s simply irrelevant.
Businesses with cash are holding on to it and they’re reluctant to make capital investments because of the uncertainty created by this administration- they’re uncertain about what taxes and hidden costs lie in store for them from the anti-business, idealogy driven President
You realize businesses don’t pay the same form of taxes, right?
By the way, I understand how “progressive taxation” works. Like I said, I’m not wealthy but I just don’t like the idea of “skimming from the top” (as Sagehen refers to it). How about we all pull our own weight and cut back the massive spending so that we don’t have to talk about taxing the rich more (as a total percentage of their total income).
You decided to just ignore that we’re taxing the rich at a lower percentage than the middle class, via capital gains tax.
Why are you ignoring this? Did you not know it, or can you just not deal with it?
The Republicans screwed up the economy with massive spending in the pre-2008 period and now the reckless spending by the Democrat along with Obama’s ideology driven tax threats are merely prolonging the recession.
Yes, you have proven you can recite talking points. Good job.
| 242 |
zato Mon, Oct 4, 2010 12:32:41pm |
re: #241 Obdicut
It’s simply irrelevant.
No, its absolutely relevant. Higher taxes and an uncertain environment are exactly the opposite of what we need to pull out of this recession.
You realize businesses don’t pay the same form of taxes, right?
That doesn’t mean that taxing businesses more will not hinder growth. Also, not to mention job creation- do you think its a coincidence that the stimulus has failed to boost employment?? No sane CEO will get off the fence when he/she is uncertain whether future costs are going to skyrocket.
You decided to just ignore that we’re taxing the rich at a lower percentage than the middle class, via capital gains tax.
Why are you ignoring this? Did you not know it, or can you just not deal with it?
The wealthy are not the only people paying the capital gains tax. Nowhere does it say that the not-so-wealthy cannot invest and earn money on their investment. Incidentally, research shows that collections go up when this tax rate is reduced. However, if you want to stiffle job creation and reduce the economic recovery, tax away.
Yes, you have proven you can recite talking points. Good job.
Thanks. I confess- I took an economics class back in school.
| 243 |
Obdicut Mon, Oct 4, 2010 12:56:08pm |
re: #242 zato
No, its absolutely relevant. Higher taxes and an uncertain environment are exactly the opposite of what we need to pull out of this recession.
The recession is over.
That doesn’t mean that taxing businesses more will not hinder growth.
But we weren’t talking about taxing businesses. We were talking about taxes on the wealthy. You suddenly introduced businesses taxes out of nowhere, with no justification or explanation.
The wealthy are not the only people paying the capital gains tax. Nowhere does it say that the not-so-wealthy cannot invest and earn money on their investment.
The wealthy by far, far, far, far are the ones profiting from the capital gains tax. Do you want the capital gains rate raised to match the taxation on a working joe making $45,000 a year?
Incidentally, research shows that collections go up when this tax rate is reduced.
Wrong.
| 244 |
zato Mon, Oct 4, 2010 3:05:52pm |
re: #243 Obdicut
The recession is over.
Where are the jobs? Where is the recovery?? Its similar to Obama’s announcement of the end of the war in Iraq- not sure if fancy words and loophole-definitions can mask the fact that many brave American troops will continue to fight combat operations in Iraq in the coming months, after their commander-in-chief has announced that the war is over.
As for the economics of tax cuts, I’ll agree to disagree. I’m time constrained and please consider this my last reponse.
This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.
Comments are closed.
Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds
- Featured PagesClick to refresh
Once Praised, the Settlement to Help Sickened BP Oil Spill Workers Leaves Most With Nearly Nothing When a deadly explosion destroyed BP’s Deepwater Horizon drilling rig in the Gulf of Mexico, 134 million gallons of crude erupted into the sea over the next three months — and tens of thousands of ordinary people were hired ...
Cheechako
5 days ago
Views: 169 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Alone in a Bathroom: The Fear and Uncertainty of a Post-Roe Medication Abortion Angel tucked two white pills into each side of her mouth, bracing herself as they began to dissolve. Her deepest fears and anxieties took over. Angel had wanted to talk to a doctor before she took the pills to ... Cheechako
2 weeks ago
Views: 1,295 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 3
They Were Desperate to Get Pregnant. Then IVF Gave Them Extra Embryos. One morning last spring, Ashley Harrolle put her 1-year-old daughter down for a nap and went to the kitchen. She pulled up her fertility clinic’s contact information. It was time to make the call. In a freezer several hundred ... Cheechako
2 weeks ago
Views: 381 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1- Pictures From Today’s Exhibition of Paintings Done by Jane LilienthalPROPS TO MICHELE AND SAGEHEN FOR CATCHING THE SPELLING ERROR IN THE TITLE THAT MY DIABETIC EYES COULDN'T CATCH I wanted to share pictures of the art show I visited today. The portraits were created by the mother of my ...Joe Bacon ✅
3 weeks ago
Views: 475 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 11 
March FavoritesYou've seen these all already but looking back, just because. These are my favorite shots of this last month. That 1937 Zeiss Sonnar is such a gloriously wonderful bit of glass. Thanks for looking.
William Lewis
4 weeks ago
Views: 579 • Comments: 2 • Rating: 9
Russia’s New Combat Robots Blown Up by Drones Near Avdiivka When we landed on the moon, I thought about how science fiction had become real. Now, the robot wars have begun. It's more poignant somehow on the ground than in the missile wars we have in the air as ...
Rightwingconspirator
4 weeks ago
Views: 578 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 5
Why Did More Than 1,000 People Die After Police Subdued Them With Force That Isn’t Meant to Kill? An investigation led by The Associated Press has found that, over a decade, more than 1,000 people died after police subdued them through physical holds, stun guns, body blows and other force not intended to be lethal. More: Why ... Cheechako
4 weeks ago
Views: 565 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 5- A Closer Look at the Eastman State Bar DecisionTaking a few minutes away from work things to read through the Eastman decision. As I'm sure many of you know, Eastman was my law school con law professor. I knew him pretty well because I was also running in ...KGxvi
4 weeks ago
Views: 466 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 4 
Abortions Outside Medical System Increased Sharply After Roe Fell, Study Finds The number of women using abortion pills to end their pregnancies on their own without the direct involvement of a U.S.-based medical provider rose sharply in the months after the Supreme Court eliminated a constitutional right to abortion, according ... Cheechako
5 weeks ago
Views: 818 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 4
- Recent PagesClick to refresh
The Pandemic Cost 7 Million Lives, but Talks to Prevent a Repeat Stall In late 2021, as the world reeled from the arrival of the highly contagious omicron variant of the coronavirus, representatives of almost 200 countries met - some online, some in-person in Geneva - hoping to forestall a future worldwide ... Cheechako
2 days ago
Views: 95 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ... Cheechako
2 weeks ago
Views: 261 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
