English Defense League Riots Again in Britain

WorldOctober 2010 • Views: 9,437

Robert Spencer and Pamela Geller, arguably the two most visible spokespeople of the anti-Muslim group “Stop Islamization of America,” are both very vocal supporters of the British organization called the English Defense League — an offshoot of the neo-Nazi British National Party, composed in large part of skinheads, white supremacists, and football yobs. They even invited the leaders of this thuggish organization to take part in their disgraceful 9/11 demonstration in Manhattan.

Today in Britain, the English Defense League staged an anti-Muslim demonstration in Leicester that turned into yet another riot: English Defence League Protesters Attack Sky News Satellite Truck In Leicester Protest.

This is what Spencer and Geller are importing to the United States.

Video

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206 comments

freetoken Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:31:25pm

Sound doesn't seem to work for me.

freetoken Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:31:54pm

Fixed.

Lidane Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:32:03pm

Sound doesn't work for me either.

freetoken Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:33:58pm

re: #3 Lidane

The Flash player seems to want to reset the sound to mute upon loading...though it is not clear by the icon. check the sound level.

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:35:46pm

Looks like the police need some more dogs.
[Link: www.flickr.com...]

freetoken Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:36:05pm

The EDL website says they are undergoing "maintenance"... hmmm....

ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:36:31pm

re: #6 freetoken

The EDL website says they are undergoing "maintenance"... hmmm...

Installing working brains in their members.

freetoken Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:37:09pm

Here's a vid purportedly from one of today's EDL marches:

Youtube Video

Mostly sane, most of the time. Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:37:17pm

So...the beer ran out? The only Hooters in England was full?

These are not thoughtful patriots. These are thugs.

Lidane Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:37:22pm

re: #4 freetoken

OK. That works now. Got it. Thanks! :)

Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:37:29pm

This might get the EDL less support over here. Sky News is owned by News Corp, so Fox News will not smile upon these riots.

Henchman Ghazi-808 Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:37:33pm

'Fough'in blut'ee dhimmi cops! Oy! Oy! Oy!'

ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:37:38pm

re: #4 freetoken

The Flash player seems to want to reset the sound to mute upon loading...though it is not clear by the icon. check the sound level.

Tried, but no luck. Kept resetting the sound level but couldn't get any sound.

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:37:57pm

This may be the fellow seen in Killgore's previous posting, taking a bite into an EDL hand: [Link: www.flickr.com...]

Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:39:15pm

re: #9 EmmmieG

So...the beer ran out? The only Hooters in England was full?

These are not thoughtful patriots. These are thugs.

Were they singing the Horst Wessel Lied as they set off to "protest"?

/I Hate English Nazis!

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:40:08pm

Well Robert Spencer and Pamela Geller. What do you have to say about the EDL now?

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:40:55pm

A perfectly reasonable face: [Link: www.flickr.com...]

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:42:15pm

re: #16 Gus 802

Clearly Skynews is practicing Takiya and are nothing but Dhimmis spreading the Islamasist propaganda as stipulated to them by their masters, the Muslim Brotherhood!!11ty

//It never happened cried Robert.

Henchman Ghazi-808 Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:42:33pm

A bunch of punks just itching for a fight. This was no protest at all.

Lidane Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:42:38pm

re: #11 Dark_Falcon

This might get the EDL less support over here. Sky News is owned by News Corp, so Fox News will not smile upon these riots.

Fox News would have to give the riots coverage first. I'm looking at their site now and there isn't so much as a peep about it yet, at least that I can find.

The BBC, however, has this:

[Link: www.bbc.co.uk...]

Apparently, this was the largest police action in England in 25 years. And the harpy and the gnome love these thugs. Unbelievable.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:42:58pm

re: #16 Gus 802

Well Robert Spencer and Pamela Geller. What do you have to say about the EDL now?

"The dhimmi network Sky News is viciously smearing the EDL," that's what Robert and Pam have to say about that.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:43:02pm

Sound's not working here so I went here...

[Link: news.sky.com...]

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:43:38pm

re: #22 Gus 802

Sound's not working here so I went here...

[Link: news.sky.com...]

Mine started silent, but I clicked on the sound and it went on.

b_sharp Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:44:14pm

re: #7 ClaudeMonet

Installing working brains in their members.

That sounds painful. I'm sure my brain wouldn't fit in my member.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:44:20pm

re: #21 SanFranciscoZionist

"The dhimmi network Sky News is viciously smearing the EDL," that's what Robert and Pam have to say about that.

Don't forget to add "mendacious" and "libelous."

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:45:17pm

The EDL is catching them young. Look at the kid in the blue shirt: [Link: www.flickr.com...]

Henchman Ghazi-808 Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:45:41pm

Being a riot cop is a thankless job. I don't think I'd have the patience to do it.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:45:52pm

re: #24 b_sharp

That sounds painful. I'm sure my brain wouldn't fit in my member.

It sort of looks like that scene in "Hanibal" with Ray Liotta. Only you don't eat the brain.

b_sharp Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:46:03pm

re: #15 Dark_Falcon

Were they singing the Horst Wessel Lied as they set off to "protest"?

/I Hate English Nazis!

The only good Nazi is a dead Nazi.

All the rest are a social disease.

Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:46:32pm

re: #18 Gus 802

Clearly Skynews is practicing Takiya and are nothing but Dhimmis spreading the Islamasist propaganda as stipulated to them by their masters, the Muslim Brotherhood!!11ty

//It never happened cried Robert.

/

The sick thing is that Crazy Pam actually says that. She'll claim that all the media is again in the tank for Islam, as she once again falls off of the Stupid Tree and hits every branch on the way down.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:46:37pm

re: #26 jaunte

The EDL is catching them young. Look at the kid in the blue shirt: [Link: www.flickr.com...]

Well, he's got the mad look down. What does the arm of the man standing by him say?

Henchman Ghazi-808 Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:47:02pm

re: #25 Gus 802

Don't forget to add "mendacious" and "libelous."

/

The 'mendacious libel blogger' reference, a classic!

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:47:23pm

re: #30 Dark_Falcon

The sick thing is that Crazy Pam actually says that. She'll claim that all the media is again in the tank for Islam, as she once again falls off of the Stupid Tree and hits every branch on the way down.

I know. That's why I posted the wacky addendum. I don't think they're capable of having a moment of clarity.

freetoken Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:47:25pm

Vid of EDL leader from today:

Youtube Video

ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:47:40pm

re: #24 b_sharp

That sounds painful. I'm sure my brain wouldn't fit in my member.

That's not what I meant--but your response was so funny that it was worth it.

re: #22 Gus 802

Sound's not working here so I went here...

[Link: news.sky.com...]

Thanks, Gus.

Lidane Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:49:09pm

OT, but since the harpy loves this idiot, it's relevant:

Bolton: Democracy Is Not ‘Always The Answer’

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:49:16pm

re: #32 BigPapa

The 'mendacious libel blogger' reference, a classic!

He's like a broken record. The orbicular poison dwarf.

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:49:28pm

re: #31 SanFranciscoZionist

Looks like "Oliver." Probably not the musical.

Dark_Falcon Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:50:18pm

Check out this photo as an EDL member's mask falls off:

Yes, that's a Nazi Salute.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:50:25pm

re: #36 Lidane

OT, but since the harpy loves this idiot, it's relevant:

Bolton: Democracy Is Not ‘Always The Answer’

Colonialism, good.

Democracy, bad.

goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:51:17pm

re: #31 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, he's got the mad look down. What does the arm of the man standing by him say?

OLIVER

Theater buff?

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:51:41pm

re: #39 Dark_Falcon

Check out this photo as an EDL member's mask falls off:

Yes, that's a Nazi Salute.

Damn. They do another one with just the index finger extended. It's rather common with the EDL bunch.

ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:51:48pm

re: #38 jaunte

Looks like "Oliver." Probably not the musical.

It looks like that to me, also.

I love the expression on the policeman's face at the left of the picture. "I signed up for THIS SHIT?"

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:52:51pm

re: #29 b_sharp

The only good Nazi is a dead Nazi.

All the rest are a social disease.

They're not actually good once they're dead, just not a problem any more.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:53:28pm

re: #26 jaunte

The EDL is catching them young. Look at the kid in the blue shirt: [Link: www.flickr.com...]

Basura.

Mostly sane, most of the time. Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:54:10pm

re: #44 SanFranciscoZionist

They're not actually good once they're dead, just not a problem any more.

Okay, how about "The only good Nazi is a reformed Nazi." That works for me.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:54:52pm

I'm glad my dad never took me to anything like that. I think even getting "the belt" was healthier. Looks at that poor little kid. His mouth is so expressive. He's like a little nut in a 12 year old body already.

b_sharp Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:55:01pm

re: #40 Gus 802

Colonialism, good.

Democracy, bad.

Did he really say that the US's interests are more important than another country's autonomy?

That is bloody scary for every other country in the world.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:55:52pm

re: #42 Gus 802

Damn. They do another one with just the index finger extended. It's rather common with the EDL bunch.

It's especially disturbing to me that the grandsons and great-grandsons of people who went through so much to defeat the Nazis think that's a cute thing to throw around.

ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:56:31pm

re: #41 goddamnedfrank

OLIVER

Theater buff?

Doubtful at best. He probably got the tattoo so he can remember his name.

BTW, I've been in a production of Oliver. Lots of fun as long as you can keep the kids on lockdown.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:56:33pm

re: #41 goddamnedfrank

OLIVER

Theater buff?

Might be the child's name. A lot of guys get tattoos with their kids' names.

Most of the ones I know are, well, not Nazis.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:57:25pm

re: #48 b_sharp

Did he really say that the US's interests are more important than another country's autonomy?

That is bloody scary for every other country in the world.

Let's put him up on the screen...

Youtube Video

You know it's pretty funny because we're finally engaging in military action inside of Pakistan and killing terrorists but he's still complaining.

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:57:26pm

re: #51 SanFranciscoZionist

Searching Oliver Cromwell and EDL; seems that he's a nativist hero.

ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:57:59pm

re: #44 SanFranciscoZionist

They're not actually good once they're dead, just not a problem any more.

That's good enough for me.

Ojoe Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:58:36pm

re: #36 Lidane

Democracy does work poorly in some places but other ways of governing are usually worse, though they may look better on the surface.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 9:59:22pm

re: #48 b_sharp

Did he really say that the US's interests are more important than another country's autonomy?

That is bloody scary for every other country in the world.

Yes. He did.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:00:20pm

re: #53 jaunte

Searching Oliver Cromwell and EDL; seems that he's a nativist hero.

Are they aware that he let the Jews back into England? Beginning of the end that was.

freetoken Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:00:43pm

Just another day in cheery old England:

Images from EDL protest in Leicester

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:02:00pm

re: #55 Ojoe

Democracy does work poorly in some places but other ways of governing are usually worse, though they may look better on the surface.

Yeah, but "Porn Stache" Bolton forgot to mention something. Under Musharraf he said no to military operations in Pakistan while Zardari said yes. Let it work itself through. Bolton is just a back seat driver.

lostlakehiker Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:02:22pm

re: #24 b_sharp

That sounds painful. I'm sure my brain wouldn't fit in my member.

Because size does matter.

b_sharp Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:03:53pm

re: #52 Gus 802

Let's put him up on the screen...

[Video]You know it's pretty funny because we're finally engaging in military action inside of Pakistan and killing terrorists but he's still complaining.

Being a Hawk is one thing, but tacitly threatening other countries with interference if those countries don't measure up to US standards, or if they just happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, is revolting.

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:04:12pm

re: #57 SanFranciscoZionist

The rationale seems to be that Cromwell overthrew government authority (the king) and established the right and duty for the people to prevent the gubmint from forcing them into "second class status."

Mostly sane, most of the time. Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:04:25pm

It's been said before, but these are all men. Young, mostly.

A wife and a job would help enormously.

"You're going where? Oh no, you aren't. You're going to watch the baby while I go to my mother's, and then you're going to fix the front step like I asked you to last week.

Turn on the telly and watch some football if you get bored. There's some roast beef left over in the fridge."

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:05:12pm

re: #61 b_sharp

Being a Hawk is one thing, but tacitly threatening other countries with interference if those countries don't measure up to US standards, or if they just happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, is revolting.

Yeah. He was out of line. Well if he was an official he would have been out of line. He said "we shouldn't have let" Zardari become president. That kind of rhetoric almost killed the Iraq plan.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:06:42pm

re: #58 freetoken

Just another day in cheery old England:

Images from EDL protest in Leicester

Is it me or does it look like they all come from the same gene pool?

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:06:58pm

re: #63 EmmmieG

There's the problem of attracting a wife, though:
[Link: www.flickr.com...]

Mostly sane, most of the time. Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:08:38pm

re: #65 Gus 802

Is it me or does it look like they all come from the same gene pool?

/

They are. You're an American and you forget that we are used to a very varied gene pool.

ClaudeMonet Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:09:42pm

re: #63 EmmmieG

It's been said before, but these are all men. Young, mostly.

A wife and a job would help enormously.

"You're going where? Oh no, you aren't. You're going to watch the baby while I go to my mother's, and then you're going to fix the front step like I asked you to last week.

Turn on the telly and watch some football if you get bored. There's some roast beef left over in the fridge."

Perhaps the young women of England have enough standards to not want these yobs./

Seriously, though, that was a good observation. Having no structure in their lives, they turn to unstructured rebellion.

Henchman Ghazi-808 Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:09:54pm

On a certain level it's hard to tell the difference between an 'O face' and a 'rage face.'

All that's missing is the ejaculation.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:10:58pm

re: #67 EmmmieG

They are. You're an American and you forget that we are used to a very varied gene pool.

Could you imagine living around that? I mean. You wake up on a Saturday, look out the window, and there's the EDL with their skinheads and pouty mouths screaming who knows what. Kind of makes me forget about gentrification.

Mostly sane, most of the time. Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:11:23pm

See you all later. The Princess just called to be picked up after their competition.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:13:30pm

re: #69 BigPapa

On a certain level it's hard to tell the difference between an 'O face' and a 'rage face.'

All that's missing is the ejaculation.

Looks like baby shoes was the order of the day. lol I remember I bought a pair of walking shoes once and wore them only once. I thought they looked like baby shoes. The EDL wears baby shoes.

lostlakehiker Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:14:45pm

re: #63 EmmmieG

It's been said before, but these are all men. Young, mostly.

A wife and a job would help enormously.

"You're going where? Oh no, you aren't. You're going to watch the baby while I go to my mother's, and then you're going to fix the front step like I asked you to last week.

Turn on the telly and watch some football if you get bored. There's some roast beef left over in the fridge."

But reading Theodore Dalrymple informs one that that's not going to happen. The culture of the proletariat in Britain has gone down the loo.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:17:50pm

They're so animalistic.

EDL swarm around Leicester Mercury building

Youtube Video

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:19:49pm

Protesters smash windows of International Arts Centre

Protesters have thrown missiles at the International Arts Centre, in Humberstone Gate East, and smashed windows.

Members of the English Defence League threw bottles and other items at second floor windows of the building during today's planned protest.

Four more people have been arrested.

One police officer was taken to hospital with a leg injury.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:21:19pm

And for the good people of Leicester.

Leicester peace vigil sends message 'EDL is not welcome here'

By laura elvin

Lime green ribbons adorned Leicester city centre last night as a peace vigil attracted hundreds making a stand against today's protests.

Campaign group Hope Not Hate led the "celebration" at the Clock Tower which saw faith leaders speak out against violence and racism.

Shouts of "EDL are not welcome in our town" echoed across Humberstone Gate, where the English Defence League and Unite Against Fascism activists will protest today.

Those at the vigil were encouraged to tie lime green ribbons – a colour that organisers said was politically neutral – to the Clock Tower after a series of speeches by faith leaders, MPs and councillors.

Continues.

b_sharp Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:21:19pm

re: #74 Gus 802

They're so animalistic.

EDL swarm around Leicester Mercury building

[Video]

We are just chimps and some of us have an underdeveloped neocortex.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:21:35pm

re: #75 Gus 802

Protesters smash windows of International Arts Centre

The Leicestershire Mercury weighs in with an editorial.

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:22:01pm

Here's a report from Nick Lowles of HopenotHate:

I would put the EDL numbers at 1,500, perhaps a few more, perhaps slightly fewer. The police I think have said 1,200 while the BBC said 2,000. Either way there were certainly a lot more than there were at Bradford.
The police were a lot harder on the EDL than their counterparts in Bradford. They were more aggressive towards them, boxed them in more quickly and stamped down on any misbehaviour instantly.

However, they let themselves down by letting the thugs leave the area without much supervision and so allowed the EDL to run around the streets and ultimately clash with locals.
.................
One of the main positives of the day was that the overwhelming majority of locals heeded advice and stayed away. Yesterday 700 turned up at our HOPE not hate peace vigil and we are hoping for even greater numbers for our community event tomorrow. It would have been understandable for local people to take to the streets to demonstrate their anger but wisely people decided that this was precisely what the EDL wanted.
[Link: www.hopenothate.org.uk...]

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:23:33pm

re: #78 SanFranciscoZionist

re: #79 jaunte

Awesome. Hope not Hate is a great group. I've referred to them before at LGF as have others. And the people of Leicester.

b_sharp Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:26:54pm

Off to bed I go.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:27:54pm

Bastids!

Bob Marley - Red Red Wine

Youtube Video

Prideful, Arrogant Marriage Equality Advocate Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:29:49pm

English Defence League forges links with America's Tea Party

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:34:45pm

re: #83 Cankles McCellulite

English Defence League forges links with America's Tea Party

1. Pam claims not to be anti-Muslim. Why the hell? Per her, Islam is pure evil, it's everywhere, trying to destroy decent people. WHY ISN'T SHE ANTI-MUSLIM?

2. Nachum Shifren, the Tea Party Rabbi, is an interesting guy.

Rabbi for Senate

also

Surfing Rabbi

and

His bookYour text to link...

jaunte Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:35:48pm

Time for sleep. This thought seems to apply to the EDL and friends:

"Politics is the art of preventing people from busying themselves
with what is their own business."
Paul Valéry

freetoken Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:36:53pm

re: #83 Cankles McCellulite

I notice in the comments to that article the Alex Jones defenders are showing up.

Eclectic Infidel Sat, Oct 9, 2010 10:56:02pm

re: #9 EmmmieG

So...the beer ran out? The only Hooters in England was full?

These are not thoughtful patriots. These are thugs.

Thuggery and patriotism go well together given the right circumstances.

Gus Sat, Oct 9, 2010 11:01:51pm

Jimi Hendrix - The Wind Cries Mary

Youtube Video

goddamnedfrank Sat, Oct 9, 2010 11:47:53pm

Caption this photograph:

"I've made a huge mistake."

freetoken Sun, Oct 10, 2010 12:45:52am

MP3 Audio

SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Oct 10, 2010 1:02:53am

re: #89 goddamnedfrank

Caption this photograph:

"I've made a huge mistake."

"This family isn't getting any better looking, no matter how many movie stars we bang."

freetoken Sun, Oct 10, 2010 1:13:46am

MP3 Audio

Kragar Sun, Oct 10, 2010 1:39:59am

re: #89 goddamnedfrank

Caption this photograph:

"I've made a huge mistake."

"I'm ronery."

freetoken Sun, Oct 10, 2010 1:48:34am

MP3 Audio

freetoken Sun, Oct 10, 2010 3:54:54am

MP3 Audio

daveyja Sun, Oct 10, 2010 4:04:04am

Hi, Lizards.

Been lurking for about a year (sent here from A. Sullivan). What does "Lizard" refer to?

I've been living abroad (japan) since before Clinton, and am most interested in what mainstream ("willing to talk to the other side") Americans think. I'm basically left, but am a Sullivanized left and understand the the traditional right stands for much that I believe in: freedom of thought, freedom of association, etc. I'm almost exactly half way round the world from most of you, so timely posting is problematic... That said, I'm so glad to have found LFG for a forum where Left and Right can at least TALK to each other. Rock on, you fabulous lizards, you!

freetoken Sun, Oct 10, 2010 4:12:12am

re: #96 daveyja

おはよう

At this time of the morning there is not much traffic here.

That said, I'm so glad to have found LFG [sic] for a forum where Left and Right can at least TALK to each other.

Many of us here have long objected to being categorized as "left" or "right". Mostly this crowd is a hodgepodge; the average age also used to be older than on many blogs, though the past few years I think the crowd has gotten younger.

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sun, Oct 10, 2010 4:13:50am

re: #95 freetoken

Phooey upon that. This is the One True Lacrymosa:

Youtube Video

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sun, Oct 10, 2010 4:17:40am

re: #96 daveyja

Been lurking for about a year (sent here from A. Sullivan). What does "Lizard" refer to?

I don't know for sure, but I've always associated it with this. Probably not the founder's intent, but it amuses me.

understand the the traditional right stands for much that I believe in: freedom of thought, freedom of association, etc.

The joke's on you, then.

100

freetoken Sun, Oct 10, 2010 4:38:01am

re: #99 negativ

The joke's on you, then.

I think he's not from the US. In much of the Anglosphere the "right" is not the reactionary wingnuts we've got here in the US. Indeed, in may countries the Clintons would be considered part of the "right".

101

jamesfirecat Sun, Oct 10, 2010 4:55:12am

Please Charles I believe they prefer to be called "Soccer Yobs"

102

Renaissance_Man Sun, Oct 10, 2010 5:07:11am

re: #100 freetoken

I think he's not from the US. In much of the Anglosphere the "right" is not the reactionary wingnuts we've got here in the US. Indeed, in may countries the Clintons would be considered part of the "right".

When I explain things to people back home, I always say that just like home, there are two wings of politics. However, here, they are the 'right' and the 'further right'.

103

wishbone Sun, Oct 10, 2010 5:08:20am

re: #101 jamesfirecat

We don't know what 'soccer' is in the UK. If you come here, you'll be playing football. It's a bit like 'soccer'......... only for men ;)

Generally speaking...............

You have no idea sometimes just how much it pisses me of to read that this bunch of morons are made up of, amongst other sub species of dickhea......... 'Skinheads'

I'm a Skin......... I know lots of Skins........ every one of us quite happy to be known as Skins........ and not a one of us associated, or willing to associate, with the fuckwits of the EDL. Using the term 'Skinhead' as a blanket term for the particular kind of Neo Nazi tosser you see in that crowd is a blatantly ignorant disregard for cultural context when commenting on UK society.

104

Romantic Heretic Sun, Oct 10, 2010 5:43:45am

re: #55 Ojoe

Democracy does work poorly in some places but other ways of governing are usually worse, though they may look better on the surface.

Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others that have existed. - Winston Churchill.

105

Romantic Heretic Sun, Oct 10, 2010 5:53:20am

My turn for uplifting music.

Youtube Video

Marley rocks.

106

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 6:02:02am

re: #103 wishbone

Wishbone--Don't disappear. I truly want to hear the differences you draw between your streetlevel neo-nazis and "Skins". Over here, there could be some distinction, but the vast majority of ours are the enemy of mankind.

107

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 6:28:28am

re: #84 SanFranciscoZionist

1. Pam claims not to be anti-Muslim. Why the hell? Per her, Islam is pure evil, it's everywhere, trying to destroy decent people. WHY ISN'T SHE ANTI-MUSLIM?

2. Nachum Shifren, the Tea Party Rabbi, is an interesting guy.

Rabbi for Senate

also

Surfing Rabbi

and

His bookYour text to link...

Looks like the Anti-Lerner. He gets a bump from Jackie Mason? I hope not.

108

ClaudeMonet Sun, Oct 10, 2010 6:36:03am

re: #84 SanFranciscoZionist

2. Nachum Shifren, the Tea Party Rabbi, is an interesting guy.

Rabbi for Senate

also

Surfing Rabbi

and

His bookYour text to link...

1. Those are some ugly Web sites. Not the content, but the sites themselves. Bad arrangement, bad colors, mixed fonts, you name it.

2. Some of his associates are the kind of people whose endorsements you don't really want.

3. He doesn't stand a chance, not in that district, as a non-Democrat, and up against a machine politician.

4. Points for not being dull!

109

ClaudeMonet Sun, Oct 10, 2010 6:38:36am

re: #103 wishbone

We don't know what 'soccer' is in the UK. If you come here, you'll be playing football. It's a bit like 'soccer'... only for men ;)

Generally speaking...

You have no idea sometimes just how much it pisses me of to read that this bunch of morons are made up of, amongst other sub species of dickhea... 'Skinheads'

I'm a Skin... I know lots of Skins... every one of us quite happy to be known as Skins... and not a one of us associated, or willing to associate, with the fuckwits of the EDL. Using the term 'Skinhead' as a blanket term for the particular kind of Neo Nazi tosser you see in that crowd is a blatantly ignorant disregard for cultural context when commenting on UK society.

And besides Deb's request in #106, I'd like to hear your view on the possible acquistion of Liverpool FC by New England Sports Ventures.

110

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 6:41:32am

re: #109 ClaudeMonet

And besides Deb's request in #106, I'd like to hear your view on the possible acquistion of Liverpool FC by New England Sports Ventures.

He's logged off. I hope he comes back--there is something to learn there.

111

ClaudeMonet Sun, Oct 10, 2010 6:54:04am

re: #96 daveyja

Hi, Lizards.

Been lurking for about a year (sent here from A. Sullivan). What does "Lizard" refer to?

I've been living abroad (japan) since before Clinton, and am most interested in what mainstream ("willing to talk to the other side") Americans think. I'm basically left, but am a Sullivanized left and understand the the traditional right stands for much that I believe in: freedom of thought, freedom of association, etc. I'm almost exactly half way round the world from most of you, so timely posting is problematic... That said, I'm so glad to have found LFG for a forum where Left and Right can at least TALK to each other. Rock on, you fabulous lizards, you!

Welcome!

Don't worry about "non-timely" posting. If you have something to say, go ahead and say it.

To address one of your observations--The traditional right you mention is nearly extinct in the USA. Those few who still remain are considered much more moderate than they used to be (and they're welcome here). What is called the right anymore is a pro-theocracy (so long as they're running it), anti-government (so long as their privileges are preserved), equality-espousing (so long as it's equality for all "white" people only, with men making all the decisions), Christians-only (so long as they're the ones defining "Christian") hodge-podge of screwball ideas and hostility without much focus beyond being against "they".

And you may ask, "Who are 'they'?" It's simple. "They" are not "us". "They" includes blacks, Hispanics, Asians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, scientists, people with more than a high school education, the literate, all non-heterosexuals, atheists, agnostics, feminists, government employees, liberals, moderates, traditional conservatives, and many others including those politicians who don't kiss "our" a**es.

112

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 6:57:10am

re: #111 ClaudeMonet

Excellent summary, but you forgot to tell him that "lizard" is just "LGFer".

113

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 6:59:09am

re: #97 freetoken

おはよう

At this time of the morning there is not much traffic here.

...snip the average age also used to be older than on many blogs, though the past few years I think the crowd has gotten younger.

Speak for yourself, punk.

114

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:00:06am

re: #96 daveyja

Hi, Lizards.

Been lurking for about a year (sent here from A. Sullivan). What does "Lizard" refer to?

I've been living abroad (japan) since before Clinton, and am most interested in what mainstream ("willing to talk to the other side") Americans think. I'm basically left, but am a Sullivanized left and understand the the traditional right stands for much that I believe in: freedom of thought, freedom of association, etc. I'm almost exactly half way round the world from most of you, so timely posting is problematic... That said, I'm so glad to have found LFG for a forum where Left and Right can at least TALK to each other. Rock on, you fabulous lizards, you!

Welcome. The sun never sets on the Lizard Empire.

115

ClaudeMonet Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:02:37am

re: #112 Decatur Deb

Excellent summary, but you forgot to tell him that "lizard" is just "LGFer".

I didn't forget that. I never knew. ;-) When I joined, the term "lizard" was in use, so I accepted it and went with the flow.

Now it's dumb question time. How does one create an avatar? I have several ideas for one for myself.

116

ClaudeMonet Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:03:36am

re: #113 Decatur Deb

Speak for yourself, punk.

Heaven help us if I help lower the average age anywhere.

117

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:07:12am

I'll have to recheck avatar-making, it's been a year. I know I had to make a relatively small (bit-wise) jpg or gif file, and was able to import it directly from my home computer. (Was also surprised that it worked the first try.) There are instructions somewhere around our header. Gee, what kind of graphic could go with "Monet"?

118

ClaudeMonet Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:12:14am

re: #117 Decatur Deb

I'll have to recheck avatar-making, it's been a year. I know I had to make a relatively small (bit-wise) jpg or gif file, and was able to import it directly from my home computer. (Was also surprised that it worked the first try.) There are instructions somewhere around our header. Gee, what kind of graphic could go with "Monet"?

Lots of choices.

Just in case you're wondering about the nickname--I played Monet in a play called Defying Gravity a few years ago and in the course of my research learned far more about Monet and Impressionism than I'd ever known before. In addition, I didn't want to reuse any of my other screen names.

119

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:12:47am

re: #115 ClaudeMonet

Ah. Hit "My Account" at the login window. It takes you to an "Icon" utility.

120

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:16:16am

re: #118 ClaudeMonet

You should engage Walter on theatre sometime. He was deep into a Colorado group when I logged in, and has a published play based on "I Never Promised You a Rose Garden".

121

Vicious Babushka Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:21:18am

re: #89 goddamnedfrank

Caption this photograph:

"I've made a huge mistake."

"you are worfress Wittle Kimmy"

122

Ojoe Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:24:38am

I bet Sarah Palin will be the next president.

Too bad Cato the Elder won't be here to entertain us when it happens.

123

Ojoe Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:26:01am

re: #117 Decatur Deb

How about an avatar of a B-17 ?

124

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:26:49am

re: #122 Ojoe

I bet Sarah Palin will be the next president.

Too bad Cato the Elder won't be here to entertain us when it happens.

Fair chance she'll be a candidate. Hillary will likely be the next president, in 2016.

125

ClaudeMonet Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:28:15am

re: #120 Decatur Deb

You should engage Walter on theatre sometime. He was deep into a Colorado group when I logged in, and has a published play based on "I Never Promised You a Rose Garden".

Already done. He sent me PDF copies of a couple of his plays a week or so ago. I'd read them today, but I'm going to a matinee, then have some work to finish at the office (only an hour or so).

re: #122 Ojoe

I bet Sarah Palin will be the next president.

Too bad Cato the Elder won't be here to entertain us when it happens.

I miss Cato, but after his epic meltdown Charles had no choice but to wield the Banhammer.

As for Palin, she's just a sideshow. I hope. Unless things get far worse, I can't see a way for her to be nominated AND WIN.

126

Ojoe Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:29:03am

re: #115 ClaudeMonet

If you go to google image search, advanced, on "size" tou can ask for "icon" and it will return tiny images for you.
Here is a tiny B-17 I got that way.

127

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:29:53am

re: #123 Ojoe

How about an avatar of a B-17 ?

I've got some dramatic B-17 photos, but stick with the nose-art shot of the jacket. It belonged to one of the 3 survivors of my dad's plane.

128

reine.de.tout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:30:57am

re: #112 Decatur Deb

Excellent summary, but you forgot to tell him that "lizard" is just "LGFer".

And right now, I cannot find the post where that term came into being. Bah.
I'll keep looking .. . .

129

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:32:26am

re: #128 reine.de.tout

And right now, I cannot find the post where that term came into being. Bah.
I'll keep looking .. . .

Morning. It was more than a couple years ago, before I started lurking.

130

reine.de.tout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:35:46am

re: #129 Decatur Deb

Morning. It was more than a couple years ago, before I started lurking.

aha!
There are two.
Here's the first, The Truth about LFG

and the second, "The Terrible Secret of LFG"

131

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:39:29am

re: #130 reine.de.tout

Excellent!! Those need to be kept on a "History" page. They explain several LGF bits (Denver Airport) I never quite understood.

132

reine.de.tout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:41:16am

re: #131 Decatur Deb

Excellent!! Those need to be kept on a "History" page. They explain several LGF bits (Denver Airport) I never quite understood.

The term "gamy buttocks" appears in that first one, as well.

133

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:42:47am

re: #132 reine.de.tout

Has the Zionist checks, too, but no sign of the Soros link.

134

reine.de.tout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:46:32am

re: #133 Decatur Deb

Has the Zionist checks, too, but no sign of the Soros link.

alrighty.
I just made a page, so I can find it when I need it.
Anyone wanting those two posts can search pages for my nic, and the tag "LGF" (or "LFG", or "lizard" or "lizard army" or any number of other things).

135

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:47:20am

re: #134 reine.de.tout

"Culture" Heh.

136

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:50:17am

There are other themes in Lizard ethnohistory that fit your page: "The Birth of Stinky Beaumont" is significant.

137

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:51:16am

The Little green football prayer list
On this day in History..

On Oct. 10, 1917, Thelonious Monk, the world-renowned American jazz pianist and composer, was born. Following his death on Feb. 17, 1982, his obituary appeared in The Times.

Let us pray
Sattv4u2: Prayers go out for Satt’s Mother who is ill and required a Transfusion and
Is being transferred to a Boston Hospital.
AlbuSteve: Lord give Speedy healing and strength to Steve.
Buck: Father has a tumor and has little time left.. Comfort his family and welcome him in your arms.
Thanos: Grant healing and strength to our dear friend
Obdicut: My friend Pam, who's ovarian cancer has returned. She's going into chemo again. And she believes in the power of prayer.

Jadespring: Dear Lord bring healing to a Sister.. Bring grace and strength to the Family.
We pray for your tender mercies

Ausador: Parents
Irenicum: Lord heal this family and bring comfort to them..
Guanxi88: Best wishes and lizard mojo to my wife's best friend. her father committed suicide not two weeks after her mother succumbed to cancer.
Reine: Health and Family.. Lord we ask you grant Reine’s Daughter a Special blessing..Look after her and grant grace.
gregb - 4 year old son who suffered a head injury last Friday and spent the
weekend in the ICU with some lingering effects all week.Jadespring: Our prayers go out to your sister…May she be healed
Baseballmom57: My God grant grace and healing to her son…
lurking faith… prayers for an aunt
Beekiller: Sister has been diagnosed with Cancer…We pray for a speedy recovery
Prairiefire: Health for Family and friends
FBV: We pray for his Mother to be cured of cancer
Mcspiff: if you could add my uncle to the list. He went in for surgery today and it didn't go so well. Extra organs had to come out, etc. Still just hearing bits and pieces now. But any prayers would be greatly appreciated.
Alouette’ Dear Father..His name in Hebrew is Pinhas ben Rivka. , and he is in congestive heart failure. He is 91 years old, and a WW2 Pacific vet.
Reloadingisnotahobby: Could add my parents?
They're in their 80's and slipping in to ALZ...Simultaneously
LaZardo: His dad is working in Asia all alone..Comfort and give him strength
HoosierHoops: Bring peace and strength to Joe and his family
Thank you Lord..
Amen

138

reine.de.tout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 7:52:31am

re: #136 Decatur Deb

There are other themes in Lizard ethnohistory that fit your page: "The Birth of Stinky Beaumont" is significant.

Argh.hat.
I'll see if I can find something on that.

139

Killgore Trout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:09:39am

Has this been linked to yet?
English Defence League forges links with America's Tea Party

The English Defence League, a far-right grouping aimed at combating the "Islamification" of British cities, has developed strong links with the American Tea Party movement.

An Observer investigation has established that the EDL has made contact with anti-jihad groups within the Tea Party organisation and has invited a senior US rabbi and Tea Party activist to London this month. Rabbi Nachum Shifren, a regular speaker at Tea Party conventions, will speak about Sharia law and also discuss funding issues.

The league has also developed links with Pamela Geller, who was influential in the protests against plans to build an Islamic cultural centre near Ground Zero. Geller, darling of the Tea Party's growing anti-Islamic wing, is advocating an alliance with the EDL. The executive director of the Stop Islamisation of America organisation, she recently met EDL leaders in New York and has defended the group's actions, despite a recent violent march in Bradford.

140

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:10:39am

re: #138 reine.de.tout

"Class of 2004" is an often-used term that would be confusing to newbies. A search returned many comments, but none that explained it well. It's a sensitive issue because it has taken on a negative use. Good or bad, those were the Dawn Lizards.

141

Killgore Trout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:11:56am

re: #139 Killgore Trout

more.....

Another Tea Party-associated grouping, the International Civil Liberties Alliance, which campaigns against Sharia law, confirmed that EDL leaders have made "contacts with members of important organisations within the American counter-jihad movement". A statement said: "It seems now that America and Europe are acting as one, and united we can never fail."
With the Tea Party said to benefit from millions of dollars of funding from conservative foundations, experts warn an alliance between the EDL and extremist elements within the US movement could allow the English group to invest in wider recruitment and activism.

142

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:13:26am

re: #139 Killgore Trout

SFZ posted about the surfin' rabbi today. If he sits down with those people he is an idiot.

143

Killgore Trout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:15:28am

re: #142 Decatur Deb

SFZ posted about the surfin' rabbi today. If he sits down with those people he is an idiot.

It's a fascinating article. I just assumed the connections between the EDL and American right were just informal generic support but it looks like there's a more formal and possibly monetary relationship.

144

lawhawk Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:16:36am

re: #89 goddamnedfrank

Caption this photograph:

"I've made a huge mistake."

Kim Il Jong: I can't believe I ran this country into the ground and this is the best I could do as a replacement.

Kim Jong Un: Stop staring at me before I have my brothers take you out back and pull a Commodus on you.

Kim Il Jong: Now let's see Matt Stone and Trey Parker do something with this! Not so funny now, is it...

145

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:16:42am

re: #143 Killgore Trout

It's a fascinating article. I just assumed the connections between the EDL and American right were just informal generic support but it looks like there's a more formal and possibly monetary relationship.

Just what we need, another freaking Bund, with the money flowing the other way.

146

lawhawk Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:19:57am

re: #140 Decatur Deb

Class of 2004 is best described as the first wave of registered commenters.

Prior to June 2004, Charles had open posting. Anyone who wanted to post, could. Thereafter, he instituted registration and the first wave is known as class of 2004.

Since then, quite a few members of that initial group have been banned for any number of reasons, not the least of which was disrespecting Charles in any number of ways, making threats, espousing violence, trollish behavior, personality conflicts with other members, etc.

There aren't that many members of the class of 2004 left (and I know as one of 'em).

147

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:21:24am

re: #144 lawhawk

Kim Il Jong: I can't believe I ran this country into the ground and this is the best I could do as a replacement.

Kim Jong Un: Stop staring at me before I have my brothers take you out back and pull a Commodus on you.

Kim Il Jong: Now let's see Matt Stone and Trey Parker do something with this! Not so funny now, is it...

Kim Jong Un: I think daddy noticed all his brandy is gone...Who can I blame? Thing man think..

148

Vicious Babushka Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:21:41am

re: #142 Decatur Deb

SFZ posted about the surfin' rabbi today. If he sits down with those people he is an idiot.

I just looked at Rabbi Shifren's webpage. Gah. What a breathtaking idiot. It does not say where he received his rabbinical ordination or what yeshiva he attended, if any.

149

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:24:17am

re: #148 Alouette

I just looked at Rabbi Shifren's webpage. Gah. What a breathtaking idiot. It does not say where he received his rabbinical ordination or what yeshiva he attended, if any.

Beit Kahuna.

150

Vicious Babushka Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:25:33am

re: #149 Decatur Deb

Beit Kahuna.

Beit Hakeesay

151

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:26:30am

re: #146 lawhawk

Yes. Something like that can be in Reine's Lizard 101 page.

152

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:29:20am

re: #150 Alouette

Beit Hakeesay

You're way past my goyish threshold. "House of the Seat"?

153

Vicious Babushka Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:32:11am

re: #152 Decatur Deb

You're way past my goyish threshold. "House of the Seat"?

Yep. The Throne Room. The Reading Room. The Shrine of the Porcelain Idol.

154

Ojoe Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:32:25am

re: #146 lawhawk

Ojoe, class of 2004, raises his hand.

155

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:32:44am

re: #153 Alouette

Perfect.

156

Shiplord Kirel Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:32:53am

re: #140 Decatur Deb

"Class of 2004" is an often-used term that would be confusing to newbies. A search returned many comments, but none that explained it well. It's a sensitive issue because it has taken on a negative use. Good or bad, those were the Dawn Lizards.

I suspect that I am the most senior Lizard at this point, having posted regularly here since October 23, 2001. It is hard to determine though, since that was before registration and I used a different nic in the early days (actually several of them, including "Eric Blair" and "Atomic Conspiracy").

157

reine.de.tout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:33:16am

re: #146 lawhawk

Class of 2004 is best described as the first wave of registered commenters.

Prior to June 2004, Charles had open posting. Anyone who wanted to post, could. Thereafter, he instituted registration and the first wave is known as class of 2004.

Since then, quite a few members of that initial group have been banned for any number of reasons, not the least of which was disrespecting Charles in any number of ways, making threats, espousing violence, trollish behavior, personality conflicts with other members, etc.

There aren't that many members of the class of 2004 left (and I know as one of 'em).

May I use that to update my LGF Culture Page?

158

Ojoe Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:33:49am

Dawn Lizards, LOL !

159

Ojoe Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:35:20am

re: #153 Alouette

Ivan means John so you could also call it the Ivan.

160

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:35:34am

re: #156 Shiplord Kirel

I suspect that I am the most senior Lizard at this point, having posted regularly here since October 23, 2001. It is hard to determine though, since that was before registration and I used a different nic in the early days (actually several of them, including "Eric Blair" and "Atomic Conspiracy").

Wow. I'm still a hatchling, coming up on my first birthday. (Come to tell. "hatchling" might also need defining.)

161

lawhawk Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:37:35am

re: #156 Shiplord Kirel

I think I'm in that ballpark too. I started posting here just a few weeks after 9/11.

162

lawhawk Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:38:18am

re: #157 reine.de.tout

Sure thing..

163

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:39:09am

re: #153 Alouette

Yep. The Throne Room. The Reading Room. The Shrine of the Porcelain Idol.

Would that relate to the word "keester"?

164

reine.de.tout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:40:37am

re: #151 Decatur Deb

Yes. Something like that can be in Reine's Lizard 101 page.

OK, updating of that page is going on.
I used Lawhawk's info, posted a link to Stinky Beaumont's registration, and used your "Lizard 101" in the title.

165

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:42:49am

re: #164 reine.de.tout

OK, updating of that page is going on.
I used Lawhawk's info, posted a link to Stinky Beaumont's registration, and used your "Lizard 101" in the title.

How about the Iron fist rule: If you think you are too drunk to post..Then you probably are

166

Killgore Trout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:48:50am

I probably know this guy....
Antique violin bows worth £110,000 feared stolen after being left on train

A musical craftsman has had a unique collection of antique violin bows worth a £110,000 stolen after he left them on a train.

Police are desperately attempting to track down the 11 precious 19th century instruments after the costly blunder, with one of the bows valued at more than £30,000 alone.

The distraught owner, an expert in antique bows, fears he left them on a train after he travelled from London to Ipswich.

The 49-year-old man, who has not been named, was carrying the bows in a brown case about 3ft wide and 1ft high.

167

reine.de.tout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:49:49am

re: #165 HoosierHoops

How about the Iron fist rule: If you think you are too drunk to post..Then you probably are

Got it.

168

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:52:04am

re: #166 Killgore Trout

Very sad, and that sort of thing happens repeatedly. Jet lag might contribute. (IIRC John Galway once left his floute in a cab.) The music world needs to adopt a simple 007 fix--handcuffed travel cases.

169

Shiplord Kirel Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:52:15am

A minor observation on the shift in rightwing attitudes. I still monitor Free Republic on a regular basis, since it is a good barometer of the right, especially the religious right.
There has been a definite change in responses to stories of US drone attacks in Pakistan, a change that would be consistent with a significant rise in Paulian isolationism. At one time, less than a year ago, in fact, these stories brought bloodthirsty cheering and recommendations for B-52 strikes as a follow-up. Now, the responses include a great deal of recycled 60s peace movement rhetoric, demands for withdrawal, and expressions of disgust with "Obama's war." A rightwing anti-war movement is nothing new of course, though we haven't seen such a thing since the days just before Pearl Harbor.

170

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:52:37am

re: #168 Decatur Deb

PIMF. He left his flute there, too.

171

reine.de.tout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:54:03am

Anyone who's been around awhile:

Kindly check the LGF 101 page; and let me know if I need to add/change/edit/delete anything. Thank you.

172

Henchman Ghazi-808 Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:55:12am

re: #169 Shiplord Kirel

It's because a Dem is in the WH. It's that simple.

Hoops, got the coffee hook up. Did some work for a doctor who owns a coffee farm right above town. His house looks over acres of coffee. And yes, when I work there I get served!

173

jaunte Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:55:24am

re: #166 Killgore Trout

The comments at the Daily Mail show no sympathy for the guy. Maybe they've never lost anything, or are just taking an easy anonymous jeer.

174

Nervous Norvous Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:55:34am

re: #170 Decatur Deb

PIMF. He left his flute there, too.

Perhaps he flouted his flute.

175

lawhawk Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:56:33am

re: #166 Killgore Trout

I wish I was this guy.

A Buffalo family may have a previously unknown Michelangelo on its hands - and it's value could rival that of those held in major museums around the world.

176

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:56:34am

Off to do Sunday things--productive morning, Reine.

177

Nervous Norvous Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:57:42am

re: #169 Shiplord Kirel

A minor observation on the shift in rightwing attitudes. I still monitor Free Republic on a regular basis, since it is a good barometer of the right, especially the religious right.
There has been a definite change in responses to stories of US drone attacks in Pakistan, a change that would be consistent with a significant rise in Paulian isolationism. At one time, less than a year ago, in fact, these stories brought bloodthirsty cheering and recommendations for B-52 strikes as a follow-up. Now, the responses include a great deal of recycled 60s peace movement rhetoric, demands for withdrawal, and expressions of disgust with "Obama's war." A rightwing anti-war movement is nothing new of course, though we haven't seen such a thing since the days just before Pearl Harbor.

I'm with Papa. If McCain had won, died, and Sister Sarah was doing it and they were still talking shite like this, then I would believe it was real and not simply a reaction to Brother Barry.

178

lawhawk Sun, Oct 10, 2010 8:59:25am

re: #177 PT Barnum

I concur.

179

Nervous Norvous Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:00:22am

re: #177 PT Barnum

I'm with Papa. If McCain had won, died, and Sister Sarah was doing it and they were still talking shite like this, then I would believe it was real and not simply a reaction to Brother Barry.

That being said, the drone attacks are certainly in keeping with what BO said in the election that he got so much shit for. "If there's actionable intelligence and Pakistan won't act, then we will"

Seems like the man has pretty much proved true to his word, despite a lot of the impediments put in his way.

180

Killgore Trout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:00:54am

re: #173 jaunte

The comments at the Daily Mail show no sympathy for the guy. Maybe they've never lost anything, or are just taking an easy anonymous jeer.

It's so easy to do. Those bow cases are small and it's so easy to forget them laying around.

181

Killgore Trout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:01:23am

re: #175 lawhawk

I wish I was this guy.

A Buffalo family may have a previously unknown Michelangelo on its hands - and it's value could rival that of those held in major museums around the world.

wow.

182

Nervous Norvous Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:01:54am

re: #180 Killgore Trout

It's so easy to do. Those bow cases are small and it's so easy to forget them laying around.

I, for instance, once left my heart in San Francisco. (I was an organ courier at the time) :)

183

lawhawk Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:02:06am

re: #179 PT Barnum

Actually, Obama got grief for essentially saying that he'd invade Pakistan - a nominal ally of the US. The drone attacks are a continuation of existing Bush Administration policy - ramped up because actionable intel has increased.

184

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:02:13am

re: #172 BigPapa

It's because a Dem is in the WH. It's that simple.

Hoops, got the coffee hook up. Did some work for a doctor who owns a coffee farm right above town. His house looks over acres of coffee. And yes, when I work there I get served!

Lawdy..A fresh cup of Kona coffee in Hawaii...There is nothing that tastes better in the world...I'll stop at Starbucks on the way to work today...Scream and shake my fist at you BigPapa!

185

Nervous Norvous Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:02:24am

re: #181 Killgore Trout

wow.

half the fun of watching Antiques Roadshow, ain't it?

186

Killgore Trout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:03:14am

I didn't know the purple taters have health benefits....
Anyone fancy a portion of purple chips? Spectacular potatoes taste the same as white variety

The colour survives the cooking process to provide purple chips, baked potatoes and even roasties and mash - which all taste the same as the familiar creamy white type.

As a bonus, the spectacular potatoes are packed with healthy anthocyanin, which gives blueberries, blackberries and aubergines their distinctive tints.

187

Nervous Norvous Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:08:19am

re: #183 lawhawk

Actually, Obama got grief for essentially saying that he'd invade Pakistan - a nominal ally of the US. The drone attacks are a continuation of existing Bush Administration policy - ramped up because actionable intel has increased.

re: #183 lawhawk

Except he never said he would invade, merely that he would send in US troops. A small tactical force is not the same thing as an invasion force. Given that the Pakistani government seems to have a fair amount of sympathy or at least intermingling with the Taliban, it's not an unreasonable position to take.

188

NJDhockeyfan Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:08:30am

Good morning lizards!

Here's some gospel for a Sunday morning...

Youtube Video

189

jaunte Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:12:07am

Purple Potato Tortilla recipe:
[Link: twofatals.com...]

190

Killgore Trout Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:17:00am

re: #189 jaunte

That's actually a frittata. Very delicious. You could also add greens, spinich and bacon to that as well. Maybe some sausage too.

191

jaunte Sun, Oct 10, 2010 9:18:04am

re: #190 Killgore Trout

It looks pretty good. I just ran across that website; they have a lot of good ideas.

192

Cheese Eating Victory Monkey Sun, Oct 10, 2010 10:08:26am

I read this in the Jpost today:

The English Defence League (EDL), a British far-right group opposing the "Islamification" of the West and which is in contact with the US-based Tea Party organization, has invited Tea Party activist and senior Rabbi Nachum Shifren to speak about Sharia law in London this month, the Guardian reported on Sunday.

193

SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Oct 10, 2010 10:22:46am

re: #106 Decatur Deb

Wishbone--Don't disappear. I truly want to hear the differences you draw between your streetlevel neo-nazis and "Skins". Over here, there could be some distinction, but the vast majority of ours are the enemy of mankind.

Although my sweet, German-raised rabbi did once comment that now so many perfectly nice young men shaved their heads and wore Doc Martens, for fashion, that it was rather unsettling--you used to KNOW someone like that was a problem.

194

SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Oct 10, 2010 10:28:24am

re: #148 Alouette

I just looked at Rabbi Shifren's webpage. Gah. What a breathtaking idiot. It does not say where he received his rabbinical ordination or what yeshiva he attended, if any.

The political website gives a source for his smicha--not someplace I know, but I'm no expert on yeshivot in Israel.

195

SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Oct 10, 2010 10:29:49am

re: #148 Alouette

I just looked at Rabbi Shifren's webpage. Gah. What a breathtaking idiot. It does not say where he received his rabbinical ordination or what yeshiva he attended, if any.

Rabbi Shifren attended Toras Chayim Yeshiva in Jerusalem and Yeshivat Tomchei Tmimim in Kfar Chabad, Israel, where he received his rabbinical ordination in 1990.

196

SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Oct 10, 2010 10:35:49am

re: #177 PT Barnum

I'm with Papa. If McCain had won, died, and Sister Sarah was doing it and they were still talking shite like this, then I would believe it was real and not simply a reaction to Brother Barry.

I imagined it so clearly:

Scene: An inauguration day in Washington, bright and clear. An elderly man steps forward to take the oath of office. To the side you see an attractive young woman, all smiles, surrounded by several children and a good-looking husband. As the old man repeats the oath, he pauses, clutches at his heart and falls to the ground. The Secret Service rushes forward. Cut to the young woman, holding her hands to her mouth, eyes wide.

BLACKNESS

Scene: An inauguration day in Washington, bright and clear. A young woman dressed in black, flanked by her children and husband steps forward to take the oath of office. It turns out she has rewritten it a little. As she swears to uphold the constitution 'by every moose, gas line and snowmobile in Alaska, so help me God!', the press corps begins to stir and mutter.

ROLL CREDITS.

I figured it would be a little like "Legally Blonde".

197

SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Oct 10, 2010 10:37:32am

re: #192 Cheese Eating Victory Monkey

I read this in the Jpost today:

The English Defence League (EDL), a British far-right group opposing the "Islamification" of the West and which is in contact with the US-based Tea Party organization, has invited Tea Party activist and senior Rabbi Nachum Shifren to speak about Sharia law in London this month, the Guardian reported on Sunday.

I wonder what Rabbi Shifren's exact qualifications to speak on Sharia are. Perhaps he's read a book or two by a guy called...Spencer?

198

Wishbone Sun, Oct 10, 2010 11:28:54am

re: #106 Decatur Deb

Since the 70's, there's been a 'skinhead' subculture in the UK. It wasn't borne out of any fascist tendency, more of a statement of working class, Brisish culture. Feel free to Google the term 'Skinhead' in context with UK subculture and you'll find a wealth of variety and differences between those here and what others perceive as 'Skinhead'. If you read the 'glossary of skin culture', the kind of muppet you're thinking of would be called a 'bonehead'.......... although in reality 'head' is usually just a suffix for a few choice descriptives.

I entered my teens in the early 80's..... and most of the skins I grew up around were very into the punk/reggae/New Wave of British Heavy Metal scene........ Reggae and emerging Ska acts figuring heavily in the clubs and venues. You don't play in that scene if you have anything approaching neo nazi leanings. The other skins, rastas and rude boys would kick absolute fuck out of you and send you packing, if you did.

The 'scene' as it was, died down toward the end of the 80's, but has always existed, notably with regard to the punk 'Oi!' movement which is very much alive and kicking today.

I'm more of a rocker, though I dig all sorts of music from punk to reggae, Ska to metal, classical to blues.......... from Mozart to Motorhead and back again. Mates of mine are seriously into their punk and will travel far and wide to see their heroes play. What does define skins as a group, of course, are a few things people see in common with the collective: The skinned head, for a start (mine is a bare blade cut, Wahl clippers, to the bone..... if it gets to 3mm I feel like a hippy ;). The Docs are also a bit of a giveaway........ I've almost always worn them for working...... I also like wearing my 14 eye docs. They're bloody comfortable, for a start. It may sound it, but there's no cultural or fashion statement being made here. I've just done this for so long, it's how (and probably 'who') I am.

I do concede that, in other countries, the term 'Skinhead' may carry an much more negative and singular significance. I do find it annoying, however, that the same narrow definition be applied in context with the one nation where the term has a much broader meaning. It takes due credit away from the countless Skins who have stood up against this sort of fascist shit and refused to budge.

re: #109 ClaudeMonet

Claude........ I remember asking on these very threads, three years ago, about Gillette and Hicks and no one seemed to have the knowledge to form an opinion, so I shrugged and thought nothing of it. If I'd seen this coming then, I'd have cried. Pair of bloody carpetbaggers if ever there was a pair.

After all the turmoil we've suffered so far, you'd probably understand that we're very cynical about John William Henry and NESV. We're overjoyed at the thought that the other two may be, not only on their way out the door, but getting screwed of 140 million quid as well. On the other hand, we're wary of yet another US investment group taking over.

Bluntly speaking, here's how we think: If some silly-rich Arab bought us out, not only financial investment, but also 'Emotional investment' wouldn't be an issue. You see...... Liverpool Football Club have a massive following in the Arab world. They love football........ They also love Liverpool and are well versed in our history and traditions.

American buyers, however, have no emotional investment; it's just business. That's understandable, in terms of pure capatalism. When you're faced with 50,000 angry Scousers 'cos you're running their club into the ground, that's recklessly endangering your own bacon.

As I said..... we're wary...... And I hope NESV do their homework on how we think.

199

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 11:38:31am

re: #198 Wishbone

Glad we crossed again. It's obvious (ska) that your skins and our skinheads are different species. Where are your benign skins on the Labor/Tory spectrum? How are the skins' styles visibly distinguished from the neo-nazis? Any group of 6 here, sporting your haircut, would be very likely a violent racist splinter group. (They also would not likely have your language skills.) Do hang in here, we need the subtleties.

200

wishbone Sun, Oct 10, 2010 12:21:05pm

re: #199 Decatur Deb

Therein lies the problem. Nazi salutes, espousing notions of racial purity and generally acting like a nazi moron tend to be a good giveaway...... But beyond wearing overtly provocative attire (anything with a swastika tends to stick out) a Skin is a Skin. Might as well ask how you spot a racist white man.

Any group of six skins here, would most likely be off to the pub for a few pints.

201

Decatur Deb Sun, Oct 10, 2010 12:30:21pm

re: #200 wishbone

Therein lies the problem. Nazi salutes, espousing notions of racial purity and generally acting like a nazi moron tend to be a good giveaway... But beyond wearing overtly provocative attire (anything with a swastika tends to stick out) a Skin is a Skin. Might as well ask how you spot a racist white man.

Any group of six skins here, would most likely be off to the pub for a few pints.

Yeah. It must have been easier when they wore black shirts. They must have an attitude toward non-violent skins, and a way to describe themselves in contrast. How to the numbers match up?

202

wishbone Mon, Oct 11, 2010 4:24:44am

re: #201 Decatur Deb

I don't really think it comes down to numbers, as such. I mean, there's no 'annual skin census' noting city of birth, political affiliation and nazi or non-nazi. They're just a reality of the social collective we live in.

In this day and age, idiots like that are well noted by their lack of intelligence and subsequent lack of friends. In any social structure, or subculture within such, there will always be a few arseholes. It's also worth noting that most of the nutjobs you see in those videos wouldn't count (and certainly wouldn't identify themselves) as skinheads. This is why, in terms of British culture today, using the term 'Skinhead' to describe this rabble is mostly redundant. These loons are the 'ASBO generation'; more likely to be seen out in packs, wearing black tracksuits, hooded tops and Nike trainers. They have so little intellect, that their political stance mostly consists of "Well..... it's the immigrants takin our jobs....innit?"...... And they know this for truth because their mates down the pub all know it and talk about it too. Contempt comes easy for this lot.

203

Dom Mon, Oct 11, 2010 8:36:34am

wishbone, when describing groups of people it is easy to overgeneralise about the other - people are people of course, and aligning to a movement or adopting a style shouldn't preclude conversation and friendship and the possibility that everyone was full of shit and we will end up getting along.

I appreciate the point about punk culture not being tied to nazi culture. I was just hanging with exactly that sort, great folk. But there are still political currents in that culture and at any BNP or EDL rally there will be a lot of shaven-heads that are steeped in both punk and neo-nazi culture. They are not the same and there are lovely people who happen to shave their heads but they are far from mutually exclusive.

Racism is a nebulous, sneaky thing, fucking with heads like the BNP claiming a pro-Israel stance, or making comments just ambiguous enough to appeal to racists without totally offending anyone; symbols. Hateful sorts are playing a long-game.

204

Wishbone Mon, Oct 11, 2010 2:43:38pm

re: #203 Dom

We certainly agree on the broader points Dom. I'm just pressing the specific point that a skinhead does not a nazi make....... and that, in terms of UK culture, generalisations like that can sting; Especially if you just happen to look just like that generalisation and despise to the core everything it stands for.

I don't think it hurts to give people from other countries a clearer perspective on any subculture here as long as it's relevant. Just as an aside, I note that there are as many nutters in the rock and metal scene who are just as steeped in nazi lore and culture. I'd go so far to say that this kind of thinking goes a bit beyond whichever subculture people would most likely identify as its birthing ground. As you point out, it's a lot more insidious than that.

205

Decatur Deb Mon, Oct 11, 2010 2:54:26pm

re: #202 wishbone

Hi Wishbone--It's just dumb luck that I caught your comment as it scrolled by in "Masterspy". Topics come around again fast these days, and most of us don't spend much time in old threads. (The libertarian slug-out in "Art Robinson" is a rare exception.) You're answering my question, in that there seems to be some self-identity and symbolics that distinguish the nazis from the larger non-violent skins.

We don't see the shades over here. What I know of modern British reality comes from presence on MG and ancient Landrover hobby lists, and watching "Morse" and "Lewis" on BBC. Not many skinheads in video Oxford.

206

Dom Tue, Oct 12, 2010 2:06:09pm

re: #204 Wishbone

We certainly agree on the broader points Dom. I'm just pressing the specific point that a skinhead does not a nazi make... and that, in terms of UK culture, generalisations like that can sting; Especially if you just happen to look just like that generalisation and despise to the core everything it stands for.

Thanks, I have no argument with you.

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