Wikileaks DOS Attack Tool: Not Anonymous

Technology • Views: 26,885

The software used by the pro-Wikileaks group “Anonymous” to attack visa.com and other websites is known as “Low Orbit Ion Cannon” or LOIC; it was originally a stress-testing program designed to test how websites perform under high traffic loads. LOIC has since morphed into a DDOS attack tool that can form a “botnet” with other systems running the software.

Yesterday researchers at the University of Twente in the Netherlands released an analysis of the LOIC software used by Anonymous, showing that it’s anything but anonymous. In fact, they compare using LOIC to sending hate mail with a real return address on the envelope.

For a number of days the websites of MasterCard, Visa, PayPal and others are attacked by a group of WikiLeaks supporters (hacktivist). Although the group calls itself “Anonymous”, researchers at the DACS group of the University of Twente (UT), the Netherlands, discovered that these hacktivists are easily traceable, and therefore anything but anonymous.

In this report we present an analysis of the two versions of the tool named LOIC (Low Orbit Ion Cannon), which is used by the hacktivists to perform their attacks. The main conclusion is that the attacks generated by the tool are relatively simple and unveil the identity of the attacker. Therefore, the name of this hacktivists group, “Anonymous Operation”, is misleading: the hacktivists’ original IP address is shown in clear.

If hacktivists use this tool directly from their own computers, instead of via anonymization networks such as Tor, the real Internet address of the attacker is included in every Internet message being transmitted, therefore making it easy to be traced back. We also found that these tools do not employ sophisticated techniques, such as IP-spoofing, in which the source address of others is used, or reflected attacks, in which attacks go via third party systems. The current attack technique can therefore be compared to overwhelming someone with letters, but putting your real home address at the back of the envelop.

In addition, hacktivists may not be aware that international data retention laws require that commercial Internet providers store data regarding Internet usage for at least 6 months. This means that hacktivists can still be traced easily after the attacks are over.

Here’s the full report (PDF).

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276 comments
1 Kragar  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:27:02pm

BWAHAHA!

2 BishopX  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:28:14pm

Now it’s just a matter of arresting, charging and trying 31,000 people…in several countries…some of whom may have had their computer compromised by an actual bot-net.

3 Varek Raith  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:30:17pm

Lol.
Script kiddies indeed.
Idiots.

4 Kragar  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:32:06pm

I love the smell of schadenfreude in the morning.

5 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:32:59pm

…and yet the nation state is still standing and capitalism continues. Imagine that.

6 Idle Drifter  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:33:13pm

We are anonymous.
We are idiots.
We are legion.
We perform childlike acts of retribution in causes we don’t understand.
Here’s our home address and phone number.

7 Cineaste  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:33:42pm

re: #2 BishopX

Now it’s just a matter of arresting, charging and trying 31,000 people…in several countries…some of whom may have had their computer compromised by an actual bot-net.

I say go for it. String ‘em up. You break the law, you pay the consequences.

8 Kragar  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:33:51pm

re: #2 BishopX

Now it’s just a matter of arresting, charging and trying 31,000 people…in several countries…some of whom may have had their computer compromised by an actual bot-net.

Every system they track down provides more information they can use to track the hackers.

9 Kragar  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:35:10pm

re: #6 Idle Drifter

We are anonymous.
We are idiots.
We are legion.
We perform childlike acts of retribution in causes we don’t understand.
Here’s our home address and phone number.

You know some of them were dumb enough to use their own PCs.
You bring them in, string them along, then offer them a deal to inform on the others.
They’ll snap it up in a heartbeat.

10 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:35:30pm
For a number of days the websites of MasterCard, Visa, PayPal and others are attacked by a group of WikiLeaks supporters (hacktivist). Although the group calls itself “Anonymous”, researchers at the DACS group of the University of Twente (UT), the Netherlands, discovered that these hacktivists are easily traceable, and therefore anything but anonymous.

Good. Now go round up these stupid, criminal anarchist pukes.

11 Cineaste  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:35:38pm

Also, can we not call these people “hacktivists”? We don’t call people who commit vandalism “vandalists”.

12 Charles Johnson  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:36:01pm

The full report is interesting, if you’re a geek.

13 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:37:55pm

re: #5 Killgore Trout

…and yet the nation state is still standing and capitalism continues. Imagine that.

Once you tear down the walls of capitalism you are able to control the means of informational distribution for the common good much like was done in the revolutionary states of the Soviet Union, North Korea, China, Cuba, Vietnam and Venezuela.

//

14 Varek Raith  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:38:08pm

re: #11 Cineaste

Also, can we not call these people “hacktivists”? We don’t call people who commit vandalism “vandalists”.

Funny enough, they aren’t even hacking. Just using a third party script to attack.
Lol.

15 jamesfirecat  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:38:19pm

re: #11 Cineaste

Also, can we not call these people “hacktivists”? We don’t call people who commit vandalism “vandalists”.

Meh, I feel its for the same reason we call some people “Eco-terrorists” it’s to point out that these people aren’t just f***ing around for no reason, they have an agenda….

16 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:40:50pm

re: #13 Gus 802

Once you tear down the walls of capitalism you are able to control the means of informational distribution for the common good much like was done in the revolutionary states of the Soviet Union, North Korea, China, Cuba, Vietnam and Venezuela.

//

By putting this pen to paper, I have sentenced myself to death. It is not a crime to write, but it is a thought crime to reflect on what you have written. The Party writes for us, and my job at the Ministry of Truth requires me to re-write what they have written. I do not write lies; I simply substitute one bit of nonsense for another. I correct the statements and the Ministry of Truth will see to it that no matter where the original statement appeared; newspaper, book, publication or film, these items will be destroyed and replaced with current copies. Everything fades away into this shadow-world where even the date of the current day will become uncertain.

(1984 - The Play)

17 Idle Drifter  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:41:31pm

re: #9 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

You know some of them were dumb enough to use their own PCs.
You bring them in, string them along, then offer them a deal to inform on the others.
They’ll snap it up in a heartbeat.

The irony of the whole thing is their biggest gripe is the suppression of free speech but failing in that free speech is a two way street while crime is a one way ticket. Not to mention their just too clever for their own good. Deluding themselves that they can troll in the big leagues and get away with it. Roast them all I say I love the smell of BBQ in the morning.

18 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:42:10pm

Meh, rather basic stuff. Of course you don’t run this kind of thing through clear net from your home PC. But the ones dumb enough to do just that probably won’t know anything of real interest.

19 bratwurst  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:43:26pm

re: #16 Walter L. Newton

By putting this pen to paper, I have sentenced myself to death. It is not a crime to write, but it is a thought crime to reflect on what you have written. The Party writes for us, and my job at the Ministry of Truth requires me to re-write what they have written. I do not write lies; I simply substitute one bit of nonsense for another. I correct the statements and the Ministry of Truth will see to it that no matter where the original statement appeared; newspaper, book, publication or film, these items will be destroyed and replaced with current copies. Everything fades away into this shadow-world where even the date of the current day will become uncertain.

(1984 - The Play)

Image: i-toot-my-own-horn.jpg

20 Charles Johnson  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:44:50pm

re: #18 wlewisiii

Meh, rather basic stuff. Of course you don’t run this kind of thing through clear net from your home PC.

I’ll bet a lot of people have, though.

21 webevintage  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:45:03pm

How disappointing.
I thought these guys were some kind of uber-awesome cabal of cyber geniuses and now we find out they are mostly idiot teenagers who couldn’t even make the effort to protect their identities and will end up costing their parents lots of money and heartache.

It will make for some good LOLing though in some quarters of the inter tubes I suspect….

22 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:45:30pm

re: #18 wlewisiii

Meh, rather basic stuff. Of course you don’t run this kind of thing through clear net from your home PC. But the ones dumb enough to do just that probably won’t know anything of real interest.

I thinks that’s the gimmick. The “intellectuals” at Anonymous encourage the morons and children to do these attacks and get themselves arrested while the leadership stays safe.

23 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:45:35pm

Correct me if I’m wrong, but IP spoofing is hard to streamline, so the rest is obvious. Tor is useless for these kind of attacks since the Tor servers would be first to choke, besides it’s slow.

24 Velvet Elvis  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:45:51pm

If they aren’t using compromised 3rd party machines it’s not really even a DDOs. It’s an DOS attack like we used to knock each other off irc in 1996.

25 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:46:27pm

re: #19 bratwurst

Image: i-toot-my-own-horn.jpg

And damn good at it too!

26 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:46:36pm

re: #22 Killgore Trout

I thinks that’s the gimmick. The “intellectuals” at Anonymous encourage the morons and children to do these attacks and get themselves arrested while the leadership stays safe.

Leadership? But I thought anarchists didn’t believe in central control.

//

27 bratwurst  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:47:16pm

re: #25 Walter L. Newton

And damn good at it too!

You have taken it to an art form.

28 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:48:13pm

re: #27 bratwurst

You have taken it to an art form.

Thanks.

29 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:49:25pm

re: #26 Gus 802

Nobody ever accused anarchists of being bright. I mean, they think anarchy is a form of government.
/

30 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:50:11pm

OT: For the gaming geeks….
Minecraft Part 1: How to Survive the First Night (Multiplayer Survival)

Looks like it might be kinda fun. An Alpha version is out now for under $20. Beta launches soon. It could end up being a cool game.

31 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:50:27pm

re: #25 Walter L. Newton

You’re lucky. If I could toot my own horn, I certainly wouldn’t be here right now. :P

32 Velvet Elvis  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:50:50pm

re: #21 webevintage

How disappointing.
I thought these guys were some kind of uber-awesome cabal of cyber geniuses and now we find out they are mostly idiot teenagers who couldn’t even make the effort to protect their identities and will end up costing their parents lots of money and heartache.

It will make for some good LOLing though in some quarters of the inter tubes I suspect…


I know. I’m pretty sure I could do better than that and in the present economy I lack the qualifications to get any kind of sysadmin work in my present location.

33 Idle Drifter  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:51:13pm

re: #26 Gus 802

Leadership? But I thought anarchists didn’t believe in central control.

//

“All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others”

34 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:53:15pm

re: #33 Idle Drifter

“All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others”

Yeah. I’ve been to a few art openings in my life.

35 HoosierHoops  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:53:39pm

re: #24 Conservative Moonbat

If they aren’t using compromised 3rd party machines it’s not really even a DDOs. It’s an DOS attack like we used to knock each other off irc in 1996.

Wasn’t irc fun? It was the wild west of the Internet in the old days..

36 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:54:32pm

re: #29 Slumbering Behemoth

Nobody ever accused anarchists of being bright. I mean, they think anarchy is a form of government.
/

Wut, it’s not so? I thought it was a compound word: an [indefinite article] + archy [rule].

////

37 Kragar  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:55:12pm

re: #26 Gus 802

Leadership? But I thought anarchists didn’t believe in central control.

//

I told you, we’re an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to be a sort of executive officer for the week…

38 jamesfirecat  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:56:00pm

re: #37 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I told you, we’re an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to be a sort of executive officer for the week…

Watery bints distributing scimitars is no basis for a system of government!

39 Lidane  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:56:01pm

re: #29 Slumbering Behemoth

Nobody ever accused anarchists of being bright. I mean, they think anarchy is a form of government.
/

It’s not the anarchists that bother me. Most of them are idiots and goons who don’t think things through at all.

What bothers me more are the anarcho-capitalists. They actually have real influence. Way more than just some idiot kids doing DDOS attacks and bringing websites down.

40 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:56:37pm

re: #30 Killgore Trout

Sorry, there’s some SNFW language in that.

41 Varek Raith  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:57:29pm

re: #40 Killgore Trout

Sorry, there’s some SNFW language in that.

It’s alright.
Most of us aren’t mature anyway!
:P

42 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:57:33pm

re: #40 Killgore Trout

Sorry, there’s some SNFW language in that.

Super-Neutral Friendly Words?/

43 Kragar  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:57:52pm

re: #38 jamesfirecat

Watery bints distributing scimitars is no basis for a system of government!

A real government should be based on tentacle porn and Guy Fawkes masks.

44 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:58:21pm

re: #43 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

A real government should be based on tentacle porn and Guy Fawkes masks.

Or vice versa…

45 Idle Drifter  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:58:46pm

re: #34 Gus 802

Yeah. I’ve been to a few art openings in my life.

Modern art does make pretentiousness an art form. Never wanted to strangle someone to death so badly in a my life.

46 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:58:58pm

re: #37 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I told you, we’re an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to be a sort of executive officer for the week…

In an odd way that reminds me of a certain country that used to put medical doctors in jobs unrelated to their field.

47 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:59:32pm

re: #30 Killgore Trout

A little OT on your OT:

Dara O Briain Live at the Apollo - i love videogames

48 Kragar  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:59:34pm

re: #44 Sergey Romanov

Or vice versa…

Guy Fawkes porn and Tentacles masks?

Sounds like a H.P. Lovecraft slash fiction.

49 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 12:59:35pm

You say you’re doctor! Well, we’ve decided that you will run butcher shop instead.

Next!

50 Idle Drifter  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:00:39pm

re: #45 Idle Drifter

Modern art does make pretentiousness an art form. Never wanted to strangle someone to death so badly in a my life.

pimf all my life

51 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:00:53pm

Sort of like this unicorn thinking…

In [redacted] society, where nobody has one exclusive sphere of activity but each can become accomplished in any branch he wishes, society regulates the general production and thus makes it possible for me to do one thing today and another tomorrow, to hunt in the morning, fish in the afternoon, rear cattle in the evening, criticise after dinner, just as I have a mind, without ever becoming hunter, fisherman, herdsman or critic.

52 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:02:18pm

re: #47 Slumbering Behemoth

A little OT on your OT:

Dara O Briain Live at the Apollo - i love videogames


[Video]

Heh. Very funny.

53 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:02:26pm

re: #48 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Guy Fawkes porn and Tentacles masks?

Sounds like a H.P. Lovecraft slash fiction.

Xactly!

MWAHAHAHA!

54 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:02:28pm

re: #39 Lidane

Jebus. Sounds like the world of Detroit in RoboCop. OCP.

55 Varek Raith  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:05:58pm

re: #47 Slumbering Behemoth

A little OT on your OT:

Dara O Briain Live at the Apollo - i love videogames


[Video]

Lol @ his rant on the crouch button.

56 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:06:06pm

re: #53 Sergey Romanov

I see you’ve heard the Good Word. Nice. Very nice.

57 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:08:38pm

It took a little while but more people are noticinh what’s really going on…..

WikiLeaks is delinquent and anti-democratic

The frenzied hyperbole generated by the latest WikiLeaks episode – an anarchic, but so far remarkably ineffectual, spasm of delinquency – seems peculiarly weak in its understanding of the basic concepts with which its rhetoric is larded. It is, in fact, the precise opposite of what its apologists claim it to be: with its unilateral programme of revealing confidential information, which it boasts is unstoppable and accountable to no one, it is profoundly anti-democratic.

In its self-contradictory maintenance of its own untraceable operations, it effectively declares itself to be the only agency in the world that is entitled to secrecy. Its insistence that it is somehow a voice of open and transparent “freedom of expression” is simply absurd: there is no issue here of any individual or group openly expressing an opinion that would otherwise have been suppressed. The only opinion that is implicitly conveyed by WikiLeaks’ exposures is the boringly prosaic anti-Americanism of the average Guardian comment writer.

58 webevintage  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:09:36pm

re: #48 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Guy Fawkes porn and Tentacles masks?

Sounds like a H.P. Lovecraft slash fiction.

Speaking of fanfiction I am a bit annoyed with my inability to find good Sherlock fanfiction without Holmes and Watson having sex on the kitchen table….or in a cab…or at the morgue…
Really people I get the slash attraction…they very, very pretty men, but DAMN I want my Sherlock asexual thank you very much.

(I was very bored last night)

59 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:10:21pm

re: #57 Killgore Trout

Page it!

60 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:10:23pm

re: #56 Slumbering Behemoth

I see you’ve heard the Good Word. Nice. Very nice.

Ïa, that’s nifty. :-)

61 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:12:22pm

re: #59 Slumbering Behemoth

ok

62 What, me worry?  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:13:15pm

re: #57 Killgore Trout

It took a little while but more people are noticinh what’s really going on…

WikiLeaks is delinquent and anti-democratic

It would seem the only ones who do not know that anarchists are ineffectual and delinquent are anarchists themselves.

63 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:13:52pm

re: #59 Slumbering Behemoth

Sorry. Didn’t mean to yell.

64 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:16:24pm

re: #61 Killgore Trout

Now I feel bad, like I was barking orders at you or something. I promise to keep my exclamation points to myself in the future. Sorry!
/damnit, I did it again.

65 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:16:40pm

re: #57 Killgore Trout

It took a little while but more people are noticinh what’s really going on…

WikiLeaks is delinquent and anti-democratic

Our founding father of the American Revolution should have been more transparent. All papers and letters between these men should have been made public to the world so we can make a better assessment of their planned war against the British! We should shed no blood until we know the truth!

//

66 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:17:07pm

re: #63 Slumbering Behemoth

Sorry. Didn’t mean to yell.

Heh. It was a good idea. I get lazy about paging things sometimes. It’s cold and rainy. I’m feeling lazy and in a bit of a funk.

67 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:18:13pm

re: #64 Slumbering Behemoth

Now I feel bad, like I was barking orders at you or something. I promise to keep my exclamation points to myself in the future. Sorry!
/damnit, I did it again.

Cap says: everybody understands it was just enthusiasm. ;-)

68 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:18:57pm

Screwing up my tenses again. Oh well. I’m grammatically lazy sometimes.

69 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:19:58pm

re: #68 Gus 802

Screwing up my tenses again. Oh well. I’m grammatically lazy sometimes.

My sentence structure sucks. I really need to work on that.

70 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:20:30pm

re: #57 Killgore Trout

It took a little while but more people are noticinh what’s really going on…

WikiLeaks is delinquent and anti-democratic

All that WikiLeaks has done, as its name suggests, is to publish stolen documents that were purloined by a malcontent within the US defence network. As it happens, the leaked material has been almost entirely unsurprising, apart from one rather spectacular own goal in WikiLeaks terms: it turns out that a number of Gulf states have been urging the US to strike at Iran before it succeeds in producing nuclear weapons, and that the US has been resisting this pressure. This tends to undermine both the image of America as trigger-happy warmonger and the idea that the entire Muslim world is united in hatred and distrust of the Great Satan.

Oh, I like this woman.

71 Randall Gross  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:21:53pm

re: #12 Charles

There’s more at ISC as well

[Link: isc.sans.edu…]

72 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:22:07pm

re: #66 Killgore Trout

Sorry to hear it. It’s 61 and partly sunny where I’m at. I’m tempted to go out to the garage and do something. I think I may mount my grinding wheel today.

73 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:23:40pm

re: #69 Killgore Trout

The link in your Page is busted, dude.

74 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:25:10pm

No verification yet but I’m seeing something about “suicide bomber” regarding the Sweden explosions.

[Link: www.aftonbladet.se…]

Swedish to English translation
One blew himself up with grenades
Should have had a backpack full of spikes and bombs

The man who died in Bryggargatan blew himself to death.

He carried six interconnected pipe bombs but only one exploded.

He also had a backpack full of nails and a suspected explosive.

- Had it exploded at Queen Street had been a massacre, “said a source.

Police bomb technicians examined the dead man’s bag by using a bomb robot. Radiographs show that it contained a large quantity of nails and an unknown substance which is suspected to be explosives.
Shouted in Arabic

According to witnesses on the ground should the man have shouted something in Arabic before the bomb detonated.

According to Aftonbladet the man died of a pipe bombs which he carried on the body. On the site they found five pipe bombs believed to have been connected in series. For some reason the cables were torn between charges of leaving only one of the pipe bombs exploded. It was almost certainly the one who took the man’s life.
People were shocked

Some bystanders were shocked and had hearing loss when the explosive charge fired.

75 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:27:03pm

re: #70 Slumbering Behemoth

Oh, I like this woman.

She really nailed it.

76 Idle Drifter  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:27:24pm

re: #47 Slumbering Behemoth

A little OT on your OT:

Dara O Briain Live at the Apollo - i love videogames


[Video]

This is beyond awesome!

77 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:28:33pm

re: #73 Slumbering Behemoth

The link in your Page is busted, dude.

Thanks, Now fixed.

78 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:29:33pm

re: #74 Gus 802

Not really hard to guess what he probably shouted if witnesses understood it’s Arabic.

79 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:29:55pm

re: #74 Gus 802

No verification yet but I’m seeing something about “suicide bomber” regarding the Sweden explosions.

[Link: www.aftonbladet.se…]

Thank god these idiots can’t build bombs correctly.

80 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:30:16pm

re: #78 Sergey Romanov

Not really hard to guess what he probably shouted if witnesses understood it’s Arabic.

Part of it rhymes with snackbar.

81 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:30:52pm

re: #75 Killgore Trout

She definitely has their number.

The fact that it consists virtually entirely of things that were said rather than things that were done has two kinds of significance. One is that private conversations, even when they are not at the level of the diplomatic communiqué, are generally considered to be no-go areas for journalists, because it is recognised that professional life of any kind would be virtually unsustainable without the possibility of confidential communication. The other is that a very different degree of importance attaches to what is said than to what is done. An indiscreet remark or observation is in a different league from a dishonest or disreputable act.

82 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:32:45pm

re: #80 Gus 802

Part of it rhymes with snackbar.

Admiral Ackbar?

83 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:33:04pm

Here’s some interesting info on Anonymity and the Tor Network, if anyone’s interested. It points out how difficult true anonymity is as there’s always risk involved.

84 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:34:50pm

re: #83 CuriousLurker

True. Even if you set up your browser in such a way that avoids any evercookie sub-type (not hard to do for someone who knows what (s)he is doing), browser fingerprinting still leaves a crack.

85 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:36:56pm

Minecraft FIREE WTFFFFFFF!!!!!

86 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:39:20pm

re: #85 Killgore Trout

Is it primarily a sandbox? Or is there a set goal?

87 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:40:07pm

re: #84 Sergey Romanov

True. Even if you set up your browser in such a way that avoids any evercookie sub-type (not hard to do for someone who knows what (s)he is doing), browser fingerprinting still leaves a crack.

Yes, all it takes is one little oversight, one slip-up, and you’re pegged. There are a lot of very smart & highly experienced people involved in network security. I know because I work for one of them—it VERY humbling.

88 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:41:12pm

re: #78 Sergey Romanov

Not really hard to guess what he probably shouted if witnesses understood it’s Arabic.

Google translaton of latest from Aftonbladet

About ten minutes before the explosions sent an email to TT, also addressed to the Security Service, where a man turns to “Sweden and the Swedish people”. He refers to the Swedish silence on Lars Vilks paintings, the Swedish soldiers in Afghanistan, saying that “now is your children, daughters and sisters die same as our brothers and sisters and children are dying.”

- Our actions will speak for themselves. As long as you do not stop your war against Islam and degrading to the Prophet and your stupid support for the pig Vilks, “says the man.

Then the man calls all Muslims in Sweden to “stop suck up and humiliate you.” He ends the message with yet another call for “all the mujahideen in Europe and Sweden”:

- It’s time to turn to, wait no longer. Come up with whatever you are although it is a knife and I know you have more than one knife to come by. Fear not, fear not a prison, do not fear death.

89 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:42:56pm

re: #86 Sergey Romanov

Is it primarily a sandbox? Or is there a set goal?

I think it’s just a sandbox.

90 Kragar  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:43:22pm

re: #82 Slumbering Behemoth

Admiral Ackbar?

ITS A TRAP!

91 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:46:59pm

re: #90 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

ITS A TARP!

92 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:49:40pm

re: #90 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

ITS A TRAP!

Admiral Akbar was just frustrated. The Low Orbit Ion Cannons that were hijacked were intended to boost the defenses of Calamari if that planet came under attack by Imperial Star Destroyers.

/Stay on Target!

93 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:50:31pm

re: #91 Slumbering Behemoth

Nah, it’s a CARP!

94 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:50:31pm

re: #82 Slumbering Behemoth

Admiral Ackbar?

Aloha Snackbar!

95 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:53:20pm

re: #93 Sergey Romanov

Nah, it’s a CARP!

No, no. IT’S A CRAP!

96 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:57:01pm

Suicide bomber in central Stockholm (Sweden News)

Updated 3) First a car exploded at the busy shopping street Drottninggatan in central Stockholm. Then came another explosion some distance away and one man died. According to news agency TT, the man had blown himself to death. He carried six interconnected pipe bombs but only one exploded. He also had a backpack full of nails and a suspected explosive, according to newspaper Aftonbladet.
97 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:57:32pm
98 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:58:24pm

re: #96 Shiplord Kirel

Suicide bomber in central Stockholm (Sweden News)

At least the only death was the terror scum.

BBL

99 Charles Johnson  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:59:00pm

Speaking of games, here’s the most beautiful iPhone/iPad game yet — takes full advantage of the hi-res iPhone 4 Retina display: Infinity Blade. Worth 6 bucks.

100 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:59:04pm

It’s all perception, and whatever Obama did right, people might not see it that way.

[Link: www.mcclatchydc.com…]

WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama’s approval ratings have sunk to the lowest level of his presidency, so low that he’d lose the White House to Republican Mitt Romney if the election were held today, according to a new McClatchy-Marist poll.

101 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 1:59:15pm

This needs more updings.

102 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:01:20pm

re: #98 Dark_Falcon

At least the only death was the terror scum.

BBL

That x 1000000000eleventy0

103 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:01:25pm

re: #98 Dark_Falcon

At least the only death was the terror scum.

BBL

That’s always the best outcome. Aside from intercepting them before they detonate.

104 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:03:29pm

re: #103 SanFranciscoZionist

That’s always the best outcome. Aside from intercepting them before they detonate.

I love the smell of a “work accident” in the morning.

105 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:06:10pm

re: #99 Charles

Speaking of games, here’s the most beautiful iPhone/iPad game yet — takes full advantage of the hi-res iPhone 4 Retina display: Infinity Blade. Worth 6 bucks.

Wow. It’s amazing that can be done on a phone.

106 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:07:11pm

[Link: www.physorg.com…]

Taking a step toward the realization of futuristic quantum technologies, a team of physicists from China and Germany has demonstrated a key element – an entangling gate – of a quantum teleportation scheme proposed more than 10 years ago. The entangling gate serves as a fundamental building block for applications such as long-distance quantum communication and practical quantum computers.

107 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:07:55pm

Wouldn’t it be great if Wikileaks infiltrated Al Qaeda and published their secret documents?

108 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:09:44pm

re: #107 Killgore Trout

Wouldn’t it be great if Wikileaks infiltrated Al Qaeda and published their secret documents?

Wouldn’t it be great if Al Qaeda members suddenly suffered from Exploding Jihadi Head syndrome? About the same probability ;-)

109 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:09:55pm

re: #106 Sergey Romanov

And yet somehow, it’s still more important to some people to teach creationism in science class than it is to support and fund real science. :(

110 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:10:19pm

re: #107 Killgore Trout

Wouldn’t it be great if Wikileaks infiltrated Al Qaeda and published their secret documents?

“Why should we do the establishment’s work for them? Off the pigs! Power to the people! Viva Che!”
-Anonymous

111 Idle Drifter  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:10:55pm

OT and NSFW if crude language creates a “hostile work environment.” Though it seems to have a strange parody M.E. peace talks.

112 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:11:16pm

re: #107 Killgore Trout

Wouldn’t it be great if Wikileaks infiltrated Al Qaeda and published their secret documents?

Hey. Wikileaks is a whistleblower site. They’re just waiting for an al-Qaeda member to com forward.

It’s going to be a long wait.

//

113 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:13:40pm

re: #107 Killgore Trout

Wouldn’t it be great if Wikileaks infiltrated Al Qaeda and published their secret documents?

Yeah, but AQ would be hard to pin down like that. They operate as an amorphous, nearly anonymous, organization. They’re spatially and widely distributed in faceless, nameless cells. They’d be hard to track down.

/Wait, what? Oh snap!

114 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:13:56pm

re: #110 Shiplord Kirel

“Why should we do the establishment’s work for them? Off the pigs! Power to the people! Viva Che!”
-Anonymous

Right on! They are after all freedom fighters and al-Qaeda is only fighting for basic human rights for the people of their dyaspora!

Power to the peoples!

//

115 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:14:58pm

Will the real George Galloway please step forward.

//

116 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:15:15pm

reine.de.tout


re: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

From Australia:
[Link: [Link: www.daylife.com…]…]

“Defend Julian Assange; We Deserve the Truth”.

The truth about what?

If they’re in Australia and want “the truth”, it seems they would be demonstrating because Assange isn’t revealing Australian “truth”, just US “truth”.


This is going to come as a shock to Australians, as we have been reading about our politicians and corporations for weeks now.

Could it be that media from Australia report on the Australian aspects of the leaks and you do not read much Australian press?

117 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:16:05pm

re: #115 Gus 802

Will the real George Galloway please step forward.

//

Did he say something stu something again?

118 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:16:50pm

re: #117 Sergey Romanov

Did he say something stu something again?

I haven’t checked. Listening to him is harmful to my state of mind.

119 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:17:54pm

re: #115 Gus 802

Will the real George Galloway please step forward.

//

You can only see the real George Galloway by viewing a rather twisted, magical oil painting he hides in his attic.

120 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:18:13pm

re: #118 Gus 802

I haven’t checked. Listening to him is harmful to my state of mind.

I tried to listen to his apologies of USSR once. I’ve never been the same.

// (not really, he’s pretty mediocre on that)

121 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:18:53pm

re: #119 Slumbering Behemoth

You can only see the real George Galloway by viewing a rather twisted, magical oil painting he hides in his attic.

Is that the one of him wearing a unitard?

//

122 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:19:19pm

Unitard for the… I better not.

123 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:21:11pm

re: #122 Gus 802

I was way ahead of you on that. I refrained as well.

I’ll just go with BONSAI!!!

124 reine.de.tout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:21:28pm

re: #116 ozbloke

reine.de.tout


This is going to come as a shock to Australians, as we have been reading about our politicians and corporations for weeks now.

Could it be that media from Australia report on the Australian aspects of the leaks and you do not read much Australian press?

No, I do not read much Australian press. You may be correct. I was simply making an assumption from the other photo taken in Australia which, oddly, mentioned the U.S.

125 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:21:49pm

re: #123 Slumbering Behemoth

I was way ahead of you on that. I refrained as well.

I’ll just go with BONSAI!!!

Clearly there’s too much meat in my diet.

//PETA

126 Kragar  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:22:23pm

re: #123 Slumbering Behemoth

I was way ahead of you on that. I refrained as well.

I’ll just go with BONSAI!!!

Or Banzai?

127 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:24:50pm

re: #126 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Or Banzai?

Is that what they do with trolls in the LGF Japanese Section?

128 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:25:01pm

News makes it to Canada.

Blasts rock Swedish capital

At least one person, reportedly a suicide bomber, was killed when two blasts went off Saturday in a busy shopping district in the Swedish capital of Stockholm.

One of the blasts was thought to be related to a car bomb, in which two people were injured.

Swedish media also reported that a suicide bomber blew himself up about 200 metres from the car. The man apparently had canisters on him and shouted in Arabic before the blast.

Swedish media were also reportedly sent a threatening email before the blast, criticizing the role of Swedish soldiers in Afghanistan and urging Muslims to take action.

It is not yet known if the email and the explosions are linked.

129 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:25:16pm

re: #126 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Or Banzai?

Heh, no. I meant Bonsai, as in trees that have had their natural growth retarded.

Bonsais are retarded trees.

130 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:26:18pm

re: #126 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Or Banzai?

Torah, Torah, Torah!

131 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:27:02pm

re: #124 reine.de.tout

No, I do not read much Australian press. You may be correct. I was simply making an assumption from the other photo taken in Australia which, oddly, mentioned the U.S.

Thanks reine,
I was a bit taken back by what you had said.

Be assured, Oprah has been well recieved.
Harbour Bridge lights up for Oprah
We don’t want another ‘Phar Lap’ ending.

And wikileaks are not only releasing cables that are about the USA.
BHP tried to sabotage mining deal: WikiLeaks - ABC News

132 Charles Johnson  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:31:32pm

I know people like to believe “Anonymous” is an anarchic Internet phenomenon unlike anything the world has ever known, but I keep trying to point out that when this decentralized hive mind uses software like LOIC to stage coordinated attacks against single targets, it stops being an amorphous, anonymous cloud of entities and turns into an organized group of easily identifiable individuals, just like any other organized group of human beings. Even if it were feasible to use Tor with this kind of software (and I don’t think it has good enough throughput), they could still be tracked and identified, if the tracker had enough time and money for the job.

In other words, the idealized new state of being turns out to only pertain as long as they don’t try to significantly interact with the rest of the real world.

133 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:33:09pm

Well, the sun in my neck of the woods refuses to acknowledge the fact that it’s winter time, so I’m off to the garage to mount my grinder, sharpen my axe, and then perhaps chop some wood in the event that it actually starts acting like winter around here.

134 Eclectic Infidel  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:33:32pm

re: #122 Gus 802

Unitard for the… I better not.

Oh come on! Say it!

135 albusteve  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:36:19pm

re: #133 Slumbering Behemoth

Well, the sun in my neck of the woods refuses to acknowledge the fact that it’s winter time, so I’m off to the garage to mount my grinder, sharpen my axe, and then perhaps chop some wood in the event that it actually starts acting like winter around here.

get a Dewalt side cutter and some extra blades…very usable for a wide variety of stuff

136 jamesfirecat  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:39:00pm

re: #132 Charles

I know people like to believe “Anonymous” is an anarchic Internet phenomenon unlike anything the world has ever known, but I keep trying to point out that when this decentralized hive mind uses software like LOIC to stage coordinated attacks against single targets, it stops being an amorphous, anonymous cloud of entities and turns into an organized group of easily identifiable individuals, just like any other organized group of human beings. Even if it were feasible to use Tor with this kind of software (and I don’t think it has good enough throughput), they could still be tracked and identified, if the tracker had enough time and money for the job.

In other words, the idealized new state of being turns out to only pertain as long as they don’t try to significantly interact with the rest of the real world.

Ironically the masks they wore while protesting Co$ seem to work a lot better.

Guess sometimes there really is no school like old school…

137 albusteve  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:39:03pm

re: #135 albusteve

get a Dewalt side cutter and some extra blades…very usable for a wide variety of stuff

then don’t….I don’ care

138 wrenchwench  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:40:43pm

I just realized that I also believe in the inevitable fall of the nation state. However, I believe it won’t happen until the majority of our species resides on other planets.

139 BishopX  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:41:19pm

re: #132 Charles

Rather like normal meat space protesters.

140 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:41:25pm

re: #138 wrenchwench

I just realized that I also believe in the inevitable fall of the nation state. However, I believe it won’t happen until the majority of our species resides on other planets.

Ship Minds! [Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

141 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:43:18pm

re: #126 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Or Banzai?

John Bigbooti you are-a the weakest individual I ever know

142 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:43:48pm

at the end of the day most criminals get caught in a very low tech way… someone rats them out. juss saying.

143 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:47:12pm

Thats two,

Police arrest second WikiLeaks ‘hacktivist’

Dutch police arrested a 19-year-old on suspicion of a cyber attack on a government website, marking the second teenage arrest for such offences linked to the WikiLeaks fallout.

Police arrested the man yesterday afternoon in the municipality of Hoogezand-Sappemeer, suspecting him of being one of the people responsible for an attack on the website of the national prosecutor.

An anonymous group claimed responsibility for the attack on microblogging platform Twitter, saying it was to avenge the arrest of a 16-year-old who had attacked opponents of whistleblower website WikiLeaks, the prosecutor said in a statement.

More at link…

144 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:49:31pm

There’s a shocking page on Nixon and Kissinger up.

145 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:51:32pm

re: #138 wrenchwench

I just realized that I also believe in the inevitable fall of the nation state. However, I believe it won’t happen until the majority of our species resides on other planets.

I think I remember the movie… ;)

146 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:52:05pm

re: #144 Sergey Romanov

There’s a shocking page on Nixon and Kissinger up.

Saw that. Jeff Goldberg has some comments up regarding this.

Because it is the Sabbath day, I will use a religious expression to characterize this statement: Holy shit.

147 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:52:08pm

re: #132 Charles

…an organized group of easily identifiable individuals, just like any other organized group of human beings.

And just like any other organized group of human beings, someone is bound to make a mistake sooner or later—all it takes is one weak link. Then that individual’s ISP flags their account and their activities get tracked, probably followed not too long after by law enforcement knocking on the door at 3:00 a.m. It’s not to hard to imagine how things proceed from there. Risky business.

148 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:52:55pm

[Link: www.nytimes.com…]

While previous recordings have detailed Nixon’s animosity toward Jews, including those who served in his administration like Henry A. Kissinger, his national security adviser, these tapes suggest an added layer of complexity to Nixon’s feeling. He and his aides seem to make a distinction between Israeli Jews, whom Nixon admired, and American Jews.

[…]

An indication of Nixon’s complex relationship with Jews came the afternoon Golda Meir, the Israeli prime minister, came to visit on March 1, 1973. The tapes capture Meir offering warm and effusive thanks to Nixon for the way he had treated her and Israel.

But moments after she left, Nixon and Mr. Kissinger were brutally dismissive in response to requests that the United States press the Soviet Union to permit Jews to emigrate and escape persecution there.

“The emigration of Jews from the Soviet Union is not an objective of American foreign policy,” Mr. Kissinger said. “And if they put Jews into gas chambers in the Soviet Union, it is not an American concern. Maybe a humanitarian concern.”

“I know,” Nixon responded. “We can’t blow up the world because of it.”

In his discussion with Ms. Woods, Nixon laid down clear rules about who would be permitted to attend the state dinner for Meir — he called it “the Jewish dinner” — after learning that the White House was being besieged with requests to attend.

“I don’t want any Jew at that dinner who didn’t support us in that campaign,” he said. “Is that clear? No Jew who did not support us.”

Nixon listed many of his top Jewish advisers — among them, Mr. Kissinger and William Safire, who went on to become a columnist at The New York Times — and argued that they shared a common trait, of needing to compensate for an inferiority complex.

“What it is, is it’s the insecurity,” he said. “It’s the latent insecurity. Most Jewish people are insecure. And that’s why they have to prove things.”

149 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:56:01pm

re: #147 CuriousLurker

And just like any other organized group of human beings, someone is bound to make a mistake sooner or later—all it takes is one weak link. Then that individual’s ISP flags their account and their activities get tracked, probably followed not too long after by law enforcement knocking on the door at 3:00 a.m. It’s not to hard to imagine how things proceed from there. Risky business.

Curious, if I may call you that.

I am a small ISP in Australia, we are not allowed to watch where our customers go, as its a violation of their privacy.
So we can’t ‘flag’ someone because we suspect something.

Our federal government can request access to logs.

150 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:57:08pm

re: #148 Sergey Romanov

Nixon listed many of his top Jewish advisers — among them, Mr. Kissinger and William Safire, who went on to become a columnist at The New York Times — and argued that they shared a common trait, of needing to compensate for an inferiority complex.

I fist read that as, become a communist at the NYT… I am switching to decaf now.

151 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:57:31pm

re: #148 Sergey Romanov

[Link: www.nytimes.com…]

Nixon might actually have Archie Bunker beat.

“The Jews have certain traits. The Irish have certain - for example, the Irish can’t drink. What you always have to remember with the Irish is they get mean. Virtually every Irish I’ve known gets mean when he drinks. It’s sort of a natural trait. Particularly the real Irish,” Nixon said.

“The Italians, of course, those people of course don’t have their heads screwed on tight. They are wonderful people, but …” he trailed off, adding later: “The Jews are just a very aggressive and abrasive and obnoxious personality.”

152 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:57:52pm

re: #148 Sergey Romanov

That’s… evil.

153 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 2:59:52pm

re: #151 Gus 802

Nixon might actually have Archie Bunker beat.

More…

During another conversation with his personal secretary, Rose Mary Woods, Nixon expresses doubt about the opinion of William P. Rogers, his secretary of state, about black Africans.

“Bill Rogers has got - to his credit, it’s a decent feeling - but somewhat, sort of, a sort of blind spot on the black thing because he’s been in New York,” Nixon said. “He says, well, ‘They are coming along, and that after all, they are going to strengthen our country in the end because they are strong physically and some of them are smart.’ So forth and so on.

“My own view is I think he’s right if you’re talking in terms of 500 years,” Nixon said. “I think it’s wrong if you’re talking in terms of 50 years. What has to happen is they have be, frankly, inbred. And, you just, that’s the only thing that’s going to do it, Rose.”

154 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:00:12pm

re: #152 CuriousLurker

Hey CL! Hope all’s well w/cha!

155 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:00:23pm

Oops. Forgot to format that as a quote.

156 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:02:06pm

re: #5 Killgore Trout

…and yet the nation state is still standing and capitalism continues. Imagine that.

This was an anti-capitalist action?

157 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:02:38pm

re: #155 Gus 802

Oops. Forgot to format that as a quote.

five yards, repeat first down.

158 bratwurst  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:04:58pm

re: #150 brookly red

I fist read that as, become a communist at the NYT… I am switching to decaf now.

How about laying off the booze? ;-)

159 TedStriker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:05:53pm

One little mistake…

/James T. Kirk

160 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:06:16pm

re: #158 bratwurst

How about laying off the booze? ;-)

you wouldn’t like me sober… I would act on what I think ;)

161 bratwurst  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:07:20pm

re: #160 brookly red

you wouldn’t like me sober… I would act on what I think ;)

I am confident I would like you just as much as I like you now!

162 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:07:52pm

re: #161 bratwurst

I am confident I would like you just as much as I like you now!

on no I assure you…

163 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:10:19pm

re: #149 ozbloke

Curious, if I may call you that.

I am a small ISP in Australia, we are not allowed to watch where our customers go, as its a violation of their privacy.
So we can’t ‘flag’ someone because we suspect something.

Our federal government can request access to logs.

Sure, you can call me Curious.

Our Patriot Act pretty much removed any expectation of privacy I had with regard to the internet (not that I had much to begin with).

But wouldn’t access logs still give them the info they need based on requests? I admit I have no idea what an ISP’s access logs might look like as all I’m familiar with are web server & email logs.

164 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:11:22pm

re: #154 Stanley Sea

Hey CL! Hope all’s well w/cha!

Hey, you! Good to see you. Hope all’s well wichoo too. ;o)

165 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:13:19pm

re: #164 CuriousLurker

Hey, you! Good to see you. Hope all’s well wichoo too. ;o)

???

166 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:14:46pm

re: #164 CuriousLurker

Hey, you! Good to see you. Hope all’s well wichoo too. ;o)

‘tis!

(heh)

167 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:14:58pm

re: #165 b_sharp

???

??? (I’m lost.)

168 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:15:05pm

re: #163 CuriousLurker

Sure, you can call me Curious.

Our Patriot Act pretty much removed any expectation of privacy I had with regard to the internet (not that I had much to begin with).

But wouldn’t access logs still give them the info they need based on requests? I admit I have no idea what an ISP’s access logs might look like as all I’m familiar with are web server & email logs.


I wouldn’t blame the Patriot Act, at worst it could only justify what already was… privacy never was & never will be.

169 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:15:33pm

re: #166 Stanley Sea

‘tis!

(heh)

You two aren’t speaking English are you? Is it some female code thing?

170 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:16:19pm

re: #167 CuriousLurker

??? (I’m lost.)

Have you tried Hare Krishna?

171 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:17:23pm

re: #163 CuriousLurker

Sure, you can call me Curious.

Our Patriot Act pretty much removed any expectation of privacy I had with regard to the internet (not that I had much to begin with).

But wouldn’t access logs still give them the info they need based on requests? I admit I have no idea what an ISP’s access logs might look like as all I’m familiar with are web server & email logs.

Our Federal police can get a lot from logs, though they can not seek the courts permission without cause.

172 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:17:27pm

re: #170 b_sharp

Have you tried Hare Krishna?

flood the forward tubes…

173 Varek Raith  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:18:23pm

re: #172 brookly red

flood the forward tubes…

Aye aye, Cap’n!

174 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:18:40pm

re: #148 Sergey Romanov

[Link: www.nytimes.com…]

“The emigration of Jews from the Soviet Union is not an objective of American foreign policy,” Mr. Kissinger said. “And if they put Jews into gas chambers in the Soviet Union, it is not an American concern. Maybe a humanitarian concern.”

[…]

“What it is, is it’s the insecurity,” he said. “It’s the latent insecurity. Most Jewish people are insecure.

Ya’ think? Can’t imagine why they’d feel insecure.//

175 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:23:29pm

re: #170 b_sharp

Hey, b, are you gonna be around for a while? I have to go finish a calendar layout right now, but I found some links related to what we were talking about last night. Not exactly what I foggily half-remembered—more like I remembered parts of different articles.

Anyway, if you’re still around in a hour or so, I’ll grab them out of my bookmarks & post them.

176 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:24:32pm

For anyone that doesn’t know, ‘have you tried Hare Krishna’ was a ‘The Muppet Movie’ reference.

177 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:24:57pm

re: #169 b_sharp

You two aren’t speaking English are you? Is it some female code thing?

Yep, the code.

178 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:25:14pm

re: #175 CuriousLurker

Hey, b, are you gonna be around for a while? I have to go finish a calendar layout right now, but I found some links related to what we were talking about last night. Not exactly what I foggily half-remembered—more like I remembered parts of different articles.

Anyway, if you’re still around in a hour or so, I’ll grab them out of my bookmarks & post them.

I’ll probably be around on and off for most of the night.

179 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:25:31pm

re: #175 CuriousLurker

Hey, b, are you gonna be around for a while? I have to go finish a calendar layout right now, but I found some links related to what we were talking about last night. Not exactly what I foggily half-remembered—more like I remembered parts of different articles.

Anyway, if you’re still around in a hour or so, I’ll grab them out of my bookmarks & post them.

Calendars? I love calendars…all the days in neat rows & boobs! What could be better?

180 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:27:38pm

re: #177 Stanley Sea

Yep, the code.

That’s what I was afraid of. Men have trouble understanding women at the best of times, this speaking in code thing is going to make females even more inscrutable.

181 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:27:52pm

re: #179 brookly red

Calendars? I love calendars…all the days in neat rows & boobs! What could be better?

*picks up coffee mug, throws it at brookly*

182 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:28:37pm

re: #181 CuriousLurker

*picks up coffee mug, throws it at brookly*

see, you don’t need any codes…

183 CuriousLurker  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:30:41pm

Gotta go finish my BOOBLESS calendar now. BBL…

184 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:31:08pm

re: #179 brookly red

Calendars? I love calendars…all the days in neat rows & boobs! What could be better?

You like your boobs in neat rows? Have you looked in the U.S. Capitol?

185 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:31:29pm

re: #180 b_sharp

That’s what I was afraid of. Men have trouble understanding women at the best of times, this speaking in code thing is going to make females even more inscrutable.

And that my Sir, is the freaking plan.

186 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:31:36pm

re: #181 CuriousLurker

*picks up coffee mug, throws it at brookly*

You throw like a girl.

187 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:33:38pm

re: #183 CuriousLurker

Non-alcoholic beer is a first step to a rubber woman!!! Boobless calendar is part of the same plan!!!! IT’S A TRAP!

///

188 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:34:08pm

re: #184 b_sharp

You like your boobs in neat rows? Have you looked in the U.S. Capitol?

There are somethings even I won’t politicize…

189 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:34:25pm

Oh boy. Something in the LGF pages just went up.

190 Gus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:35:54pm

Um. No one is chasing him away.

191 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:37:40pm

re: #187 Sergey Romanov

Non-alcoholic beer is a first step to a rubber woman!!! Boobless calendar is part of the same plan!!! IT’S A TRAP!

///

back in the day we used to have boob threads… *sigh*

192 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:39:19pm

re: #191 brookly red

back in the day we used to have boob threads… *sigh*

which were even more titillating than pun threads…

193 Four More Tears  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:44:04pm

re: #192 brookly red

which were even more titillating than pun threads…

They were so much more perkier.

194 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:44:12pm

Hey Guys if any one wants to help me this would be a good time…

195 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:47:56pm

re: #194 brookly red

Hey Guys if any one wants to help me this would be a good time…

Nobody should make pun of heart warming mammaries.

196 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:50:14pm

re: #195 b_sharp

Nobody should make pun of heart warming mammaries.

thanks but I am not able to find a pulse… I fear the worst for mister thread.

197 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:50:59pm

re: #196 brookly red

thanks but I am not able to find a pulse… I fear the worst for mister thread.

As long as I’m not the one who killed it this time.

198 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:52:38pm

Change the subject? :)

199 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:53:16pm

re: #198 Stanley Sea

Change the subject? :)

pick one,

200 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:53:51pm

re: #198 Stanley Sea

Change the subject? :)

I guess so, the current subject is a hand full.

201 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:57:25pm

re: #200 b_sharp

I guess so, the current subject is a hand full.


let me try something…

OK this is played… let’s see whats on Drudge.

202 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 3:59:16pm

re: #201 brookly red

let me try something…

OK this is played… let’s see whats on Drudge.

You’re still intent on playing with a boob I see.

203 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:02:00pm

re: #202 b_sharp

You’re still intent on playing with a boob I see.

*sigh*

I guess their will to fight died when O, turned the podium back over to Clinton… well so muh for that, I tried.

204 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:03:16pm

re: #203 brookly red

*sigh*

I guess their will to fight died when O, turned the podium back over to Clinton… well so muh for that, I tried.

I think this afternoon’s second shift is too busy dinging to post.

205 wee fury  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:04:14pm

Without a good sense of humor — life could be unbearable. It is up to us to make it FUN!
/as I shovel 20 inches of snow from my driveway.

206 brookly red  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:08:59pm

re: #205 wee fury

Without a good sense of humor — life could be unbearable. It is up to us to make it FUN!
/as I shovel 20 inches of snow from my driveway.

fuck it. there are beers to be quaffed, skirts to be chased, and pool to be shot…

see you all another time.

207 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:10:12pm

re: #206 brookly red

fuck it. there are beers to be quaffed, skirts to be chased, and pool to be shot…

see you all another time.

Later dude.

208 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:17:23pm

BBL

209 ErikJ76  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:41:23pm

“Suicide bomber in central Stockholm”

Nothing to be worried about.
Nothing to be afraid of.
Simple as that.

If you start worrying or being afraid, then the man who blew himself up has succeeded.
Simple as that.

210 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:41:28pm

Wow, the tread was really killed.

211 Barrett Brown  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:44:55pm

As I noted a few minutes ago, I’ve responded to many of the objections voiced here, and particularly by Kilgore Trout, at [Link: ordinary-gentlemen.com…]

212 Killgore Trout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:45:26pm

re: #210 Stanley Sea

Wow, the tread was really killed.

Everybody must be out drinking.

213 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:46:08pm

re: #212 Killgore Trout

Everybody must be out drinking.

Yeah, tread. I’ve got to start because that’s embarrassing.

214 SpaceJesus  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:49:15pm

lol prison

215 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:55:19pm

Killgore,

Have an upding, for your upding on Barrett’s page.

216 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:57:00pm

re: #215 ozbloke

Killgore,

Have an upding, for your upding on Barrett’s page.

Ditto

217 Barrett Brown  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 4:59:13pm

re: #215 ozbloke

Killgore,

Have an upding, for your upding on Barrett’s page.

Ditto.

218 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:02:07pm
219 Varek Raith  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:03:03pm

re: #218 Sergey Romanov

*Hits Sergey with a chair WWF style*
That takes care of all this…mushiness.
/

220 Ojoe  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:04:24pm
221 Varek Raith  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:04:43pm
222 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:05:22pm

re: #217 Barrett Brown

Ditto.

Barrett,

Here have an upding, for your upding on Killgore’s comment.

This, this is what the trolls and stalkers hate, they have a single mindset, they could not get to a place where they could accept differing opinions, so they would up leaving.

Now by day they are found in echo chambers, and at night they cry alone.

LFG thoughtful and civilized, thanks Charles.

223 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:05:52pm

Something to dilute the mushiness:

224 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:06:14pm

re: #222 ozbloke

s/would/wound/1

225 webevintage  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:07:21pm

Damn, Cam Newton is one lovely looking man…..

226 HoosierHoops  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:08:39pm

re: #225 webevintage

Damn, Cam Newton is one lovely looking man…

And he is one a hell of an athlete

227 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:09:16pm

re: #226 HoosierHoops

And he is one a hell of an athlete

Hoops!

Tebow just tweeted:

TimTebow

Welcome to the Gator family Coach Muschamp! You’ll soon find out why it’s great to be a Florida Gator! God bless and Go Gators!!!

228 bratwurst  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:10:44pm

re: #227 Stanley Sea

Hoops!

Tebow just tweeted:

TimTebow

Welcome to the Gator family Coach Muschamp! You’ll soon find out why it’s great to be a Florida Gator! God bless and Go Gators!!!

As an Oklahoma fan, I am breathing a major sigh of relief right about now!

229 wrenchwench  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:13:19pm

re: #220 Ojoe

Extra COOL Towercam sunset worth making into a desktop.

Look Now!

I thought you might be by. Wil Wheaton just Tweeted this. Then he posted a photo from his phone. Towercam is better.

230 HoosierHoops  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:13:49pm

re: #228 bratwurst

As an Oklahoma fan, I am breathing a major sigh of relief right about now!

I see ESPN is reporting it..whew!

231 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:16:37pm

re: #228 bratwurst

As an Oklahoma fan, I am breathing a major sigh of relief right about now!

I know you are! I’ve got to read up on Muschamp now.

Nice name though.

232 reine.de.tout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:18:23pm
233 webevintage  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:21:15pm

re: #226 HoosierHoops

And he is one a hell of an athlete

whatever.
I’m just glad for the eyecandy since the hubby refuses to watch something else….

234 HoosierHoops  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:29:55pm

re: #232 reine.de.tout

Details emerge in Madoff suicide.

Very sad story.

Hope this doesn’t come off wrong…
Dude..Sell your 6 million dollar loft, Change your name and move to Paris and raise your 2 year old that will never know his daddy you selfish son of a bitch..Poor Baby has a dad in prison like that never happens in America…
/too harsh? probably

235 Varek Raith  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:31:16pm

re: #234 HoosierHoops

Hope this doesn’t come off wrong…
Dude..Sell your 6 million dollar loft, Change your name and move to Paris and raise your 2 year old that will never know his daddy you selfish son of a bitch..Poor Baby has a dad in prison like that never happens in America…
/too harsh? probably

Some need a kick in the pants like that.

236 jamesfirecat  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:31:24pm

re: #234 HoosierHoops

Hope this doesn’t come off wrong…
Dude..Sell your 6 million dollar loft, Change your name and move to Paris and raise your 2 year old that will never know his daddy you selfish son of a bitch..Poor Baby has a dad in prison like that never happens in America…
/too harsh? probably

No fucking question its too harsh when he’s just gone and killed himself man…

237 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:32:11pm

re: #234 HoosierHoops

Hope this doesn’t come off wrong…
Dude..Sell your 6 million dollar loft, Change your name and move to Paris and raise your 2 year old that will never know his daddy you selfish son of a bitch..Poor Baby has a dad in prison like that never happens in America…
/too harsh? probably

Oh I agree. They didn’t notice the abnormal % of return? Puleeze. It’s probably deeper than we will know.

238 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:33:57pm

GatorZoneScott

“This is a dream come true to be the head coach of the Florida Gators,” said Muschamp,. “I grew up watching the Gators.”

239 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:37:04pm

Oh, may I puke now?

“I’ve really enjoyed meeting this community,” Gov. Palin said. “They are so full of joy. We are so fortunate in America and we are responsible for helping those less fortunate. Samaritan’s Purse is still here doing the tough work.””

Full of joy and cholera.

What a freaking out of touch person.

240 HoosierHoops  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:38:39pm

re: #236 jamesfirecat

No fucking question its too harsh when he’s just gone and killed himself man…

Probably..Ask his 2 year every day how much pain he will endure for the rest of his life not having his daddy around because he was a coward and hung himself in a 6 million dollar loft..
I’m deeply sorry for saying that…But life is hard and parents don’t take the easy way out…Man I feel bad but that’s how I feel

241 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:40:50pm

re: #239 Stanley Sea

Oh, may I puke now?

Full of joy and cholera.

What a freaking out of touch person.

Black people who smile Sr. Sarah.

I hate her too ww.

242 jamesfirecat  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:41:21pm

re: #240 HoosierHoops

Probably..Ask his 2 year every day how much pain he will endure for the rest of his life not having his daddy around because he was a coward and hung himself in a 6 million dollar loft..
I’m deeply sorry for saying that…But life is hard and parents don’t take the easy way out…Man I feel bad but that’s how I feel

I feel horrible for the 2 year old also…

But at this point the fact that the guy is dead, means you’re effectively trying to give a motivational kick in the seat of the pants, to a dead man, which means that you’re just pummeling a dead body.

If he had attempted and failed at it I would take your post in better stride.

As it is… I’d like to wish all the remaining innocent members of the Madoff family all the best.. and I don’t think there’s anything more we can do than that really…

243 jaunte  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:41:30pm

re: #239 Stanley Sea

Shouldn’t her title actually be ‘Former partial-Governor Palin?’

244 BishopX  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:43:42pm

re: #243 jaunte

Nah, They let her keep the title, just like Bill Clinton is still President Clinton.

245 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:44:39pm

re: #243 jaunte

Shouldn’t her title actually be ‘Former partial-Governor Palin?’

Greta Van Susteren (Fox) was the reporter. Enough said.

puke

246 wrenchwench  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:44:55pm
247 HoosierHoops  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:46:34pm

re: #242 jamesfirecat

I feel horrible for the 2 year old also…

But at this point the fact that the guy is dead, means you’re effectively trying to give a motivational kick in the seat of the pants, to a dead man, which means that you’re just pummeling a dead body.

If he had attempted and failed at it I would take your post in better stride.

As it is… I’d like to wish all the remaining innocent members of the Madoff family all the best.. and I don’t think there’s anything more we can do than that really…

I feel ya brother..You make a good point…It’s how I feel and am being honest here…

248 jaunte  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:46:41pm

re: #244 BishopX

This is an interesting distinction:

The term Honorable is usually reserved for those still in office.
How Do I Address Officials No Longer in Office?
249 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:48:49pm

The last time I noticed people consistently referring to someone with an outdated title it was “Rep. Duke”.

250 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:49:32pm

re: #248 jaunte
Hmm. That is interesting. I was told many years ago to use the highest office title they achieved.

251 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:50:32pm

re: #242 jamesfirecat

I feel horrible for the 2 year old also…

But at this point the fact that the guy is dead, means you’re effectively trying to give a motivational kick in the seat of the pants, to a dead man, which means that you’re just pummeling a dead body.

If he had attempted and failed at it I would take your post in better stride.

As it is… I’d like to wish all the remaining innocent members of the Madoff family all the best.. and I don’t think there’s anything more we can do than that really…

James, your a good guy, I’d ask you to consider the following.
Tony Campolo writes:
“Some years ago I saw Lorraine Hansberry’s play, A Raisin in the Sun, and heard a passage that still haunts me.
In it an African-American family inherits $10,000 from their father’s insurance.
The mother sees the chance to escape ghetto life. The brilliant daughter sees a chance to go to medical school.
But the older brother begs for the money so that he and his friend can go into business together, and make things good for the rest of them.
The mother gives in. Well, the “friend” skips town with the money, and the desolate son has to break the news to the family.
Immediately his sister lashes him with ugly words. Her contempt has no limits.
Suddenly the mother interrupts her, “I thought I taught you to love him.” The daughter answers, “Love him? There’s nothing left to love.”
The mother responds: “There’s always something left to love.
And if you ain’t learned that, you ain’t learned nuthin’! Have you cried for that boy today? I don’t mean for yourself and the family.
I mean for him: for what he’s been through and what it done to him.
Child, when do you think is the time to love somebody the most? When they done good? Well then you ain’t through learning, because that ain’t the time at all.
It’s when he’s at his lowest and can’t believe in himself ’cause the world has done whipped him so.
When you starts measurin’ somebody, measure him right, child, measure him right.
Make sure you’ve taken into account what hills and valleys he’s done come through before he got to wherever he is.”

252 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:55:27pm

re: #244 BishopX

Nah, They let her keep the title, just like Bill Clinton is still President Clinton.

Is that customary for governors? I hear it all the time with presidents, but I thought it was unique to that office.

253 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:55:28pm

re: #251 ozbloke

Chills.

That is such a passage. Favorited, just for me to go back to as needed.

254 jamesfirecat  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 5:59:26pm

re: #250 PhillyPretzel

Hmm. That is interesting. I was told many years ago to use the highest office title they achieved.

Very good point.

HoosierHoops, what you said is what you feel and while I find it the wrong thing to say at this place and time, none the less I don’t plan to start gazing or stalking you any time soon.

Share the scales bro!

255 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:00:06pm

re: #253 Stanley Sea

Chills.

That is such a passage. Favorited, just for me to go back to as needed.

An incredible understanding, love and grace.

256 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:00:27pm

Oooh! I see Flutie!

Congratulations Cam!

257 jaunte  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:00:52pm

Space Cheeses:
[Link: www.newscientist.com…]

258 reine.de.tout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:00:56pm

re: #234 HoosierHoops

Hope this doesn’t come off wrong…
Dude..Sell your 6 million dollar loft, Change your name and move to Paris and raise your 2 year old that will never know his daddy you selfish son of a bitch..Poor Baby has a dad in prison like that never happens in America…
/too harsh? probably

Not too harsh at all, IMO.
The story is saddest for the wife he left who will now be the one to deal with any pending lawsuits; the children who will grow up without a father.

Most of us never get to experience the wealth this guy did. If he had to live on even one-sixth of it, he would be wealthier than I am. And I know that it’s quite possible to have a good, full, exciting life on less than rich.

259 Dancing along the light of day  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:01:07pm

re: #232 reine.de.tout

Suicide is such an awful burden on the living.
You never get over it, in my opinion.

260 reine.de.tout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:02:35pm

re: #259 Floral Giraffe

Suicide is such an awful burden on the living.
You never get over it, in my opinion.

I’ve known families of suicide victims.
And no - the families never get over it.

261 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:07:42pm

re: #260 reine.de.tout

I’ve known families of suicide victims.
And no - the families never get over it.

This whole thing reminds me of those melodramatic disasters that are always happening in nineteenth-century children’s books, where someone’s papa loses all his money in some shameful way and is in disgrace.

Madoff has a hell of a lot to answer for.

262 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:09:08pm

re: #261 SanFranciscoZionist
He sure does.

263 prairiefire  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:09:36pm

re: #258 reine.de.tout

I am not excusing his actions, but I don’t think he was raised with a healthy set of values. This should cause real pain for his mother and father, but one never knows.

264 reine.de.tout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:10:11pm

re: #261 SanFranciscoZionist

This whole thing reminds me of those melodramatic disasters that are always happening in nineteenth-century children’s books, where someone’s papa loses all his money in some shameful way and is in disgrace.

Madoff has a hell of a lot to answer for.

He’s the one who deserves the harshest words.

A father should not set up his business and his life to leave such a mess to his children to fix. Ever, ever, ever. He committed crimes against his family as well as those he cheated.

265 Dancing along the light of day  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:13:55pm

re: #260 reine.de.tout

Neither do the friends.
For me it was SUCH a shock.
Never thought of it as an option.
Hit a brick wall with it.
Very very hard.

266 BishopX  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:15:31pm

re: #261 SanFranciscoZionist


In 19th century England, suicide was sometimes a reasonable answer to criminal charges, because certain crimes stripped your family of their inheritance if you were found guilty. So in order to care for your family, you either had to successfully defend yourself (hard) or kill yourself before entering a plea.

267 reine.de.tout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:15:36pm

re: #265 Floral Giraffe

Neither do the friends.
For me it was SUCH a shock.
Never thought of it as an option.
Hit a brick wall with it.
Very very hard.

{{flo}}

268 Dancing along the light of day  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:15:55pm

re: #234 HoosierHoops

Hope this doesn’t come off wrong…
Dude..Sell your 6 million dollar loft, Change your name and move to Paris and raise your 2 year old that will never know his daddy you selfish son of a bitch..Poor Baby has a dad in prison like that never happens in America…
/too harsh? probably

No, it comes off very right.
I do not KNOW whether the sons knew of the fraud before Dad told them.
Either way, his suicide was the sign of a weak man.

269 Dancing along the light of day  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:19:28pm

re: #267 reine.de.tout

It’s been a long time, and I still wonder if I could have done something to change his decision. But the answer is no, since I didn’t know what he was thinking about. And it had to come from him, nothing that I could have done, would have changed his mind. Strength or weakness, comes from within.

270 prairiefire  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:20:55pm

re: #72 Slumbering Behemoth

Sorry to hear it. It’s 61 and partly sunny where I’m at. I’m tempted to go out to the garage and do something. I think I may mount my grinding wheel today.

Please be careful!

271 reine.de.tout  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:22:07pm

re: #269 Floral Giraffe

It’s been a long time, and I still wonder if I could have done something to change his decision. But the answer is no, since I didn’t know what he was thinking about. And it had to come from him, nothing that I could have done, would have changed his mind. Strength or weakness, comes from within.

Absolutely!

But that’s the question that lingers, isn’t it? For friends and especially family, and it’s a cruel burden for a family to have to bear it.

272 Dancing along the light of day  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:23:50pm

re: #271 reine.de.tout

Cruel burden is the right way to look at it.

273 Stanghazi  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 6:47:33pm

re: #268 Floral Giraffe

No, it comes off very right.
I do not KNOW whether the sons knew of the fraud before Dad told them.
Either way, his suicide was the sign of a weak man.

See, this is what I’m thinking too. He was in a really bad circumstance, but to commit suicide is the sign of deeper issues.

274 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 7:31:05pm

re: #251 ozbloke

James, your a good guy, I’d ask you to consider the following.
Tony Campolo writes:
“Some years ago I saw Lorraine Hansberry’s play, A Raisin in the Sun, and heard a passage that still haunts me.
In it an African-American family inherits $10,000 from their father’s insurance.
The mother sees the chance to escape ghetto life. The brilliant daughter sees a chance to go to medical school.
But the older brother begs for the money so that he and his friend can go into business together, and make things good for the rest of them.
The mother gives in. Well, the “friend” skips town with the money, and the desolate son has to break the news to the family.
Immediately his sister lashes him with ugly words. Her contempt has no limits.
Suddenly the mother interrupts her, “I thought I taught you to love him.” The daughter answers, “Love him? There’s nothing left to love.”
The mother responds: “There’s always something left to love.
And if you ain’t learned that, you ain’t learned nuthin’! Have you cried for that boy today? I don’t mean for yourself and the family.
I mean for him: for what he’s been through and what it done to him.
Child, when do you think is the time to love somebody the most? When they done good? Well then you ain’t through learning, because that ain’t the time at all.
It’s when he’s at his lowest and can’t believe in himself ’cause the world has done whipped him so.
When you starts measurin’ somebody, measure him right, child, measure him right.
Make sure you’ve taken into account what hills and valleys he’s done come through before he got to wherever he is.”

You got me tearing up dude.

275 b_sharp  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 7:42:02pm

re: #269 Floral Giraffe

It’s been a long time, and I still wonder if I could have done something to change his decision. But the answer is no, since I didn’t know what he was thinking about. And it had to come from him, nothing that I could have done, would have changed his mind. Strength or weakness, comes from within.

Although you may see it as a sign of weakness, for the person actively contemplating suicide there are no other options, and such is the disease it looks to be in the best interest of the family and friends. Unless you’ve been there it is difficult to understand, but you have to realize most suicide is the result of severe depression which either causes or is caused by biochemical changes in the brain. Logic and rational thought are not part of the equation.

276 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Dec 11, 2010 9:52:02pm

re: #274 b_sharp

I was fairly moved when I first heard it over a decade ago.
It has stuck with me over the years.


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