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1 yoshicastmaster  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:22:40am

For a comedian, John Stewart has been a fantastic truth detector recently. He has really matured as a commentator and I'm increasingly enthusiastic about his program.

2 MurphysMom  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:25:03am

Well, at least now we can put a face to the Magical Balance Fairy. Although I always imagined someone in sparkly tights.

3 Kronocide  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:26:33am

'And he rolls... NAZI!'

4 joe g.  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:27:00am

Megyn Kelly is the perfect hybrid of Fox newscasters and opinion personalities -- blonde, attractive, dissembling, and perpetually outraged.

5 Ericus58  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:27:58am

"And he rolls..... Nazi!"
and
"It's like Charlie Sheen showing up are your intervention to take it down a notch."

Spot on by calling out both sides.
Don't be weaksauce on the facts, Fox.

Seriously, John is just hitting his subjects out of the park. Factual and witty. He's got a great team.

6 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:29:12am

Once again, the reason you really can't make a Hitler/Nazi comparison is because anybody who could be legitimately compared to Hitler, like, say, Pol Pot, doesn't need it.

We don't say "Pol Pot was another Hitler." We just say "Pol Pot" and you know all you need to know.

If you are comparing, you automatically are admitting the accusee isn't as bad as Hitler.

7 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:31:58am

re: #6 EmmmieG

The comparison can be made to the early stage of Nazism/Hitler to make a point about possible future.

8 Ericus58  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:33:49am

Glenn Beck.... the nut continues to grow - into the Madrona tree of hard wood. Constantly shedding his bark.

9 Kronocide  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:38:41am

That was brilliant, biting.

10 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:39:43am

re: #7 Sergey Romanov

The comparison can be made to the early stage of Nazism/Hitler to make a point about possible future.

Do you think it has been done accurately? And when?

11 darthstar  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:39:59am

Megyn Kelly doesn't have a faulty memory. She's just giving Fox viewers what they want to hear.


Oh, and Rahm's back on the ballot in Chicago. heh.

12 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:47:20am

re: #10 EmmmieG

Do you think it has been done accurately? And when?

I think it was not out of place when such comparisons were made in regard to, say, Ahmadinejad. I also think it's apt to describe the current Russia as Weimar Russia. Not meaning that there will necessary be an ultranationalist power with bloody consequences, but to denote that there is such a serious possibility if the current regime crumbles.

13 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:49:37am

re: #5 Ericus58

"And he rolls... Nazi!"
and
"It's like Charlie Sheen showing up are your intervention to take it down a notch."

Spot on by calling out both sides.
Don't be weaksauce on the facts, Fox.

Seriously, John is just hitting his subjects out of the park. Factual and witty. He's got a great team.

I'd like to also point out that Jon Stewart absolutely gutted Steve Cohen for calling the Republicans in Congress Nazis.

He has an angle and a bias, but he doesn't let people get away with shit because they're Democrats.

14 Kragar  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:55:00am

Tomorrow night's Show is going to be great.

So, is Michelle Bachman delivering the official GOP response to the SotU or is she just doing a Tea Party one in addition to the GOP one?

15 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:55:32am

re: #12 Sergey Romanov

I think it was not out of place when such comparisons were made in regard to, say, Ahmadinejad. I also think it's apt to describe the current Russia as Weimar Russia. Not meaning that there will necessary be an ultranationalist power with bloody consequences, but to denote that there is such a serious possibility if the current regime crumbles.

I agree with #2, but not #1. Ahmadinejad may be dangerous, but he is not a radical change from the immediate past in his country.

16 Obdicut  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:56:47am

re: #14 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

She's doing the Tea Party one. Ryan-- a guy who believes all unearned income should be untaxed-- is giving the GOP one. He's the right choice. If someone makes $50,000 from sitting on his ass and collecting dividends, Ryan wants him to pay not tax. If someone makes $30,000 digging ditched, Ryan wants him to pay tax. That's the face of the GOP today.

17 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:58:13am

re: #14 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Tomorrow night's Show is going to be great.

So, is Michelle Bachman delivering the official GOP response to the SotU or is she just doing a Tea Party one in addition to the GOP one?

Paul Ryan is doing the actual GOP response. I'm sure he will do a fine job.

Bachmann is delivering the Tea Party response, courtesy of the TP Express.

I still can't believe the leadership is allowing her to do this.

Dark days.

18 Feline Fearless Leader  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:59:26am

OT - While you're preparing for the upcoming collapse of civilization, why not use it as a tourist destination to help keep things funded?

[Link: www.ozarkmedievalfortress.com...]

I personally find this a lot more interesting and educational a concept than a Noah's Ark-based amusement park in Kentucky.

19 McSpiff  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 10:59:43am

re: #16 Obdicut

She's doing the Tea Party one. Ryan-- a guy who believes all unearned income should be untaxed-- is giving the GOP one. He's the right choice. If someone makes $50,000 from sitting on his ass and collecting dividends, Ryan wants him to pay not tax. If someone makes $30,000 digging ditched, Ryan wants him to pay tax. That's the face of the GOP today.

That's...but...who...not rational...GAHHHH

20 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:00:00am

re: #15 EmmmieG

I agree with #2, but not #1. Ahmadinejad may be dangerous, but he is not a radical change from the immediate past in his country.

Radical change is not necessary for the comparison - ideology coupled with potential for destruction is enough IMHO. And yes, he's not Hitler, but the danger is there.

21 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:00:08am

When Ryan is the saner of two rebuttals, the party has fallen into a deep abyss indeed.

22 Jack Burton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:01:30am

re: #17 SanFranciscoZionist

Paul Ryan is doing the actual GOP response. I'm sure he will do a fine job.

Bachmann is delivering the Tea Party response, courtesy of the TP Express.

I still can't believe the leadership is allowing her to do this.

Dark days.

Does this mean it will say "Michelle Bachmann (TP - Mars)" on the screen when she's speaking?

23 Obdicut  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:01:38am

re: #17 SanFranciscoZionist

I almost prefer Bachmann to Ryan. At least Bachmann is honest about her nutty ideas.


In late January 2010, Ryan released a new version of his "Roadmap." It would give across the board tax cuts by reducing income tax rates; eliminating income taxes on capital gains, dividends, and interes; and abolishing the corporate income tax, the estate tax, and the alternative minimum tax. The plan would privatize a portion of Social Security,eliminate the tax exclusion for employer-sponsored health insurance, and end traditional Medicare and most of Medicaid. The plan would replace these health programs with a system of vouchers whose value would decrease over time.

That's Ryan's economic plan. Zero taxes for unearned income. Zero taxes for corporations, for inheritances. The only income taxed would be from people who work for a living. And no more Medicare or Medicaid.

And he's serious, and he's taken seriously, unlike Bachmann.

24 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:01:59am

re: #20 Sergey Romanov

Radical change is not necessary for the comparison - ideology coupled with potential for destruction is enough IMHO. And yes, he's not Hitler, but the danger is there.

I don't think that Ahm- has the populace. Hitler had the majority of the people.

25 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:02:25am

I don't know why people can't just say what they need to say in direct terms without absurd historical comparison. To say "the GOP is engaging in hyperbolic demagoguery" is more accurate, and less likely to get the speaker lambasted than comparisons to genocidal regimes.

26 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:02:26am

re: #22 ArchangelMichael

Does this mean it will say "Michelle Bachmann (TP - Mars)" on the screen when she's speaking?

I swear to God, it's like the Greens hijacked the Democrats.

The crazier Greens, not the small-town sensible ones.

27 cab305  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:02:49am

Does Megyn Kelly see this. I hope someone brings this to her attention, same goes for Oh'really. They have to feel downright stupid when caught in headlights like this.

I wish i could see her reaction, priceless.

28 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:03:17am

re: #24 EmmmieG

I don't think that Ahm- has the populace. Hitler had the majority of the people.

That's a myth. Hitler never had majority popular support.

29 Jack Burton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:05:47am

re: #28 Fozzie Bear

That's a myth. Hitler never had majority popular support.

Yep. Hitler basically spooked the political class into handing him power little by little. He never once won an election despite all the people who swear up and down that "Hitler was elected! It can happen here!11!!1".

30 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:06:03am

re: #28 Fozzie Bear

That's a myth. Hitler never had majority popular support.

A summary gleaned from The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich.

31 uncle meat  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:06:03am

If I were interviewed on Fox I'd show up with a pre-loaded portable DVD player in pocket, ready to cue the video of what you know they'll deny, whip it out on cue and relish the look on their face as they rush to commercial.

32 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:07:47am

re: #29 ArchangelMichael

Hitler got about 30% of the vote initially, then 36% in a 3-way runoff. The collapse of democratic institutions never happens the same way twice.

33 Slap  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:08:03am

re: #31 uncle meat

If I were interviewed on Fox I'd show up with a pre-loaded portable DVD player in pocket, ready to cue the video of what you know they'll deny, whip it out on cue and relish the look on their face as they rush to commercial.

HEY -- no whipping it out on Fox allowed.

Even if yer name's Ian Underwood.

(Nice nic, btw.....)

34 Jack Burton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:10:52am

re: #32 Fozzie Bear

Hitler got about 30% of the vote initially, then 36% in a 3-way runoff. The collapse of democratic institutions never happens the same way twice.

Yes but IIRC that still did not result in him winning an office. Everywhere he got in government he was appointed to as part of a compromise to keep the Nazis in the Reichtag seats rather than out on the street burning shit.

35 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:14:55am

re: #34 ArchangelMichael

Yes but IIRC that still did not result in him winning an office. Everywhere he got in government he was appointed to as part of a compromise to keep the Nazis in the Reichtag seats rather than out on the street burning shit.

The first chapter is quite chilling, and describes the process in some detail.

EVERYBODY should read this book, imo. It's not only incredibly well written, it is widely considered the best history of the third reich to date.

36 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:15:34am

re: #35 Fozzie Bear

[Link: books.google.com...]

woops forgot the link.

37 Stephen T.  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:15:52am

What I would like to see is Megyn Kelly as a guest on Jon Stewart's show, have a little witty banter for a bit, then roll the tape of this piece for her and the audience, then come back for her response.

Making fun of Fox News is easy. Pointing out their flaws to the flawed is the part that needs to be done more often.

38 Summer Seale  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:16:12am

In response to Megyn Kelly's moronic assertions that Fox News and her ilk are clean as whistles, I shall quote something which I wrote back in June of last year, particularly prescient when it comes to her commentaries, and those of her colleagues:

On the subject of platforms, one last statement: The Tea Party is National Socialism. It is a “grass roots” movement which has been inundated with flag-waving separatism by the “common man” who is rejecting the “elite” politician for a Utopian ideal from the past which never was. And it is being used by skillful politicians who talk up a great deal about race and a “new science” which rejects “junk science” for what they consider to be “science” in their favor. It wants to chase away scientists it considers to be a threat. It talks consistently about how elites have destroyed what they consider to be “real American values” and rejects anything outside of their inner circle as “unamerican”. It uses the terms which agrees with the idea of “God With Us” emblazoned on the sleeves of many of its participants. It talks about guns and revolution, and the legitimacy of certain Americans to call themselves American. It favors conspiracy theories about dark “cabals” controlling the world banks and government. And all done under an economic depression where the dollar has been devalued and frustrated people are easily manipulated.

If that description doesn’t agitate and disturb you in a very explicit way, then you really have no business marching, or making any political commentary until it does. Because that is where our country is currently headed, and that is what the Republicans have now pandered to and made “Mainstream”.

Time for the rest of us to wake up.

And I still stand by it.

39 Talking Point Detective  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:16:17am

re: #12 Sergey Romanov

I think it was not out of place when such comparisons were made in regard to, say, Ahmadinejad. I also think it's apt to describe the current Russia as Weimar Russia. Not meaning that there will necessary be an ultranationalist power with bloody consequences, but to denote that there is such a serious possibility if the current regime crumbles.

That seems to me, by definition, to be unsupportably subjective. Obviously, there's more validity to saying that Ahmadinegad is more on the road to Nazism than Barack Obama - but still, some objective system of criteria, you open up the door to a Glenn Beck when you start leveling the charge against others.

Why not just call Ahmadinegad a theocratic despot, and call a Nazi-saluting rightwinger a Nazi?

40 Jaerik  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:18:38am

re: #31 uncle meat

If I were interviewed on Fox I'd show up with a pre-loaded portable DVD player in pocket, ready to cue the video of what you know they'll deny, whip it out on cue and relish the look on their face as they rush to commercial.

I don't think live recordings are terribly standard in cable opinio-tainment on either side. They're about as rigged and edited as the callers on talk radio.

41 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:21:56am

Still thinking about this. The use of the term in US (and, ironically, Europe) political rhetoric is usually overblown and ridiculous.

Not so much elsewhere, where the possibility of a nation's collapse and mass killings is still real.

Still not sure about Ahm-

42 Kronocide  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:22:47am

And on queue, Fox News contributor Andrea Tantaros writes an OpEd about Obama's SOTU speech tonight.... before it happens.

Posted by some aquaintances on Facebook who obviously think it's some compelling commentary.

43 uncle meat  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:24:22am

re: #33 Slap

Thanks, and yes inevitably this did come to mind when writing that:

Youtube Video
44 Talking Point Detective  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:26:39am

re: #23 Obdicut

I almost prefer Bachmann to Ryan. At least Bachmann is honest about her nutty ideas.

That's Ryan's economic plan. Zero taxes for unearned income. Zero taxes for corporations, for inheritances. The only income taxed would be from people who work for a living. And no more Medicare or Medicaid.

And he's serious, and he's taken seriously, unlike Bachmann.

How far can the rightwing media carry the voting public? Will they be able to paint this "roadmap," which will undoubtedly raise taxes for the middle class, that they will benefit from this kind of "deficit reduction?"

In a way, I'm glad to see this playing out. It's time for people to actually make some choices. It's time to reconcile the polls that show that people care passionately about reducing the deficit but refuse to accept the loss of government services.

I guess the wildcard is how far, short of their stated goals, Republicans like Ryan will be able to push Obama and the Dems to compromise.

45 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 11:31:24am

re: #23 Obdicut

I almost prefer Bachmann to Ryan. At least Bachmann is honest about her nutty ideas.

That's Ryan's economic plan. Zero taxes for unearned income. Zero taxes for corporations, for inheritances. The only income taxed would be from people who work for a living. And no more Medicare or Medicaid.

And he's serious, and he's taken seriously, unlike Bachmann.

Ryans district in Wisconsin has consistently had the highest unemployment rate in the state. He's a liar and the people in his district are as dumb as a box of rocks.

46 Charleston Chew  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 12:13:08pm

re: #12 Sergey Romanov

I think it was not out of place when such comparisons were made in regard to, say, Ahmadinejad.

This is why I don't like "like Hitler" comparrisons, because Ahmadinejad is not like Hitler. Ahmadinejad does not have power over the nation of Iran; he's kind of a figurehead. Hitler, on the other hand, had total personal control of his nation.

47 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 12:56:14pm

re: #39 Talking Point Detective

No, Glenn Beck's door is closed. Obama is not a xenophobe which is a requirement.

48 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 12:57:07pm

re: #46 Charleston Chew

This is why I don't like "like Hitler" comparrisons, because Ahmadinejad is not like Hitler. Ahmadinejad does not have power over the nation of Iran; he's kind of a figurehead. Hitler, on the other hand, had total personal control of his nation.

Read #7 carefully.

49 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 12:58:11pm

To add to my 7: on a personal level "Nazi" can easily be applied to someone who promotes Nazi-like ideas. E.g. "all [bigoted word]s should be put in concentration camps" etc.

50 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 1:08:03pm

re: #16 Obdicut

She's doing the Tea Party one. Ryan-- a guy who believes all unearned income should be untaxed-- is giving the GOP one. He's the right choice. If someone makes $50,000 from sitting on his ass and collecting dividends, Ryan wants him to pay not tax. If someone makes $30,000 digging ditched, Ryan wants him to pay tax. That's the face of the GOP today.

Good times!

Let's just go back to a serf-based economy, hell, why not

51 Talking Point Detective  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 1:08:22pm

re: #47 Sergey Romanov

No, Glenn Beck's door is closed. Obama is not a xenophobe which is a requirement.

Sure. But that doesn't stop the claim from being made. One man's Nazi is another man's honored leader.

It just seems to me to be unnecessary. Refer to people with terms which are more easily provable, factually. If someone's saluting the Nazi flag, speaking of Hitler in favorable terms, they're a Nazi. When they're despotic and theocratic, they're a theocratic despot.

I hear you - but I just think that you open yourself up, unnecessarily, for the magic balance fairy - which, given the frightwing media megaphone - has political resonance these days.

52 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 1:11:19pm

re: #51 Talking Point Detective

Sure. But that doesn't stop the claim from being made.

Sure, but this has nothing to do with the argument I'm making. Beck will be Beck.

It just seems to me to be unnecessary.

That's what everyone will decide for themselves. If it backfires, it backfires.

53 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 1:24:38pm

re: #40 Jaerik

I don't think live recordings are terribly standard in cable opinio-tainment on either side. They're about as rigged and edited as the callers on talk radio.

You can't really "edit" on live radio, what they do is they have "starters" which are callers who are in on the show who get the conversation moving and picking up momentum

Also, callers are heavily screened for their content

54 mr.fusion  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 1:50:09pm

re: #45 Amory Blaine

Ryans district in Wisconsin has consistently had the highest unemployment rate in the state. He's a liar and the people in his district are as dumb as a box of rocks.

I actually liked Ryan a lot a few years ago. I think he was reasonable, smart, substantive......a good conservative that had the ability to bring some sense and intellectualism back into the GOP

Then McConnell, Boehner, and the ridiculousness of the past 2 years came into play and being a Republican he had no choice but to go along with it. You are what you are....and right now Paul Ryan is basically an economic fundamentalist. But I still haven't given up hope on the guy.

55 tradewind  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 1:50:59pm

re: #53 WindUpBird
The seven-second delay.
On-air equivalent of the panic button.

56 tradewind  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 1:52:34pm

re: #42 BigPapa
He test-drove it at the Democratic retreat.
The media has most of it already. Undoubtedly there will be tweaks.

57 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 2:15:12pm

re: #21 Fozzie Bear

When Ryan is the saner of two rebuttals, the party has fallen into a deep abyss indeed.

oh man, no doubt

"Well, this guy's crazy, but at least he's not eating paint."

58 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 2:20:14pm

Funny that each nation has its own Historikerstreit.

59 tigger2005  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 3:12:23pm

re: #54 mr.fusion

Then McConnell, Boehner, and the ridiculousness of the past 2 years came into play and being a Republican he had no choice but to go along with it.

Of course he had a choice. He didn't have to go along with it.

60 Jaerik  Tue, Jan 25, 2011 4:07:12pm

re: #53 WindUpBird

You can't really "edit" on live radio, what they do is they have "starters" which are callers who are in on the show who get the conversation moving and picking up momentum

Also, callers are heavily screened for their content

Sure, but I was making a general comparison. In both cases, the guests and callers are heavily "produced" so that only the correct messages, even those purportedly in opposition, get to air.

If you showed up with a portable DVD player of clips debunking Kelly on her own show, it's highly unlikely you would ever get broadcast. It's not a live show, so chances of you actually making it to air with material that's damaging to the network's reputation are vanishingly slim.

They would cut your segment, re-tape the episode with a "filler" guest (like another pundit in the same building), or whatever. But we can dream I guess.


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