Religious Right Spokeshole: Time to Destroy Public Education

CNS News editor-in-chief says religious indoctrination is more important than reading and math
Wingnuts • Views: 33,606

At townhall.com (home of the execrable Pat Buchanan and a host of other deranged throwbacks), we find religious fanatic Terry Jeffrey (editor-in-chief of the religious right propaganda site CNS News) openly calling for the destruction of the public school system: Do Wisconsin’s Public Schools Deserve to Survive?

With the entire nation watching, Wisconsinites are now debating whether the state’s public school teachers ought to be required to pay 5.8 percent of their wages to support their own retirement plans and 12.6 percent of their own health-insurance premiums, and also whether their union ought to be able to negotiate a pay increase on their behalf that exceeds the rate of inflation without letting voters approve or disapprove that raise in a referendum.

What Wisconsin ought to be debating is whether these public school teachers should keep their jobs at all.

Then every state ought to follow Wisconsin in the same debate.

It is time to drive public schools out of business by driving them into an open marketplace where they must directly compete with schools not run by the government or staffed by members of parasitic public employees’ unions.

The well-documented incompetence of America’s public schools — including Wisconsin’s — is damaging our nation. Their educational product is simply not good enough for our children. In some cases, it is toxic.

Ugh. And if you need to know where this nutjob is headed, here’s the money graf:

In addition to being less expensive and better than public schools at teaching math and reading, Catholic schools — like any private schools — can also teach students that there is a God, that the Ten Commandments are true and must be followed, that the Founding Fathers believed in both and that, ultimately, American freedom depends on fidelity to our Judeo-Christian heritage even more than it depends on proficiency in reading and math.

That’s right — he puts religious indoctrination above reading and math.

Which shouldn’t surprise anyone.

Jump to bottom

598 comments
1 jamesfirecat  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:45:35pm

I have neither a big enough face, or palm to properly reply to this.

2 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:47:09pm

Not a surprise. This has been a long time coming.

3 drool  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:47:15pm

I wonder if Mr Jeffrey can tell us which great world powers do not have public education.

4 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:48:04pm

re: #1 jamesfirecat

I have neither a big enough face, or palm to properly reply to this.

Lemme help you.

Image: tumblr_l9s7njkDgP1qzmowao1_500.jpg

5 Varek Raith  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:48:19pm

re: #3 drool

I wonder if Mr Jeffrey can tell us which great world powers do not have public education.

I bet he thinks god gave the US that power.

6 Idle Drifter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:49:13pm
….that the Founding Fathers believed in both and that, ultimately, American freedom depends on fidelity to our Judeo-Christian heritage even more than it depends on proficiency in reading and math.

I’d like to keep these guys away from the history books as much as the science books.

7 drool  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:49:26pm

He just doesn’t want to go back to the Guilded Age…he is advocating the middle ages.

8 Varek Raith  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:49:41pm

re: #1 jamesfirecat

I have neither a big enough face, or palm to properly reply to this.

Image: epic-facepalm-when-you-just-know-you-messed-up-demotivational-poster-1253705267.jpg

9 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:49:51pm

re: #2 SanFranciscoZionist

Not a surprise. This has been a long time coming.

right…they said they would and they are trying so all this nonsense about shocking craziness is two years old now…buckle up

10 elizajane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:50:18pm

One revision to that last line: try “Our vision of American freedom depends on your fidelity to the wealthy oligarchy who always know best, secured by your complete ignorance of math and your inability to read or think critically.

11 Kronocide  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:50:34pm

Funny, he didn’t mention creationism. I guess it should be assumed that Catholic schools teach it better than anybody else.

12 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:51:12pm

re: #11 BigPapa

Funny, he didn’t mention creationism. I guess it should be assumed that Catholic schools teach it better than anybody else.

They don’t teach it at all. The Church accepts evolution as scientific fact.

13 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:51:18pm

More sources on daddy Koch.

[Link: www.scribd.com…]

14 drool  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:51:27pm

@6 Drifter,

“I’d like to keep these guys away from the history books”

No kidding. They are already doing their revisionist stuff on the Civil War.

15 Kid Skeeter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:52:25pm

Professor Beck says Obama loves “instability and revolution;” which is the “antithesis to Social Security.” Maybe you all can figure it out. By the way, nice elbow patches, Professor.

16 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:52:26pm

re: #14 drool

@6 Drifter,

“I’d like to keep these guys away from the history books”

No kidding. They are already doing their revisionist stuff on the Civil War.

the south won?

17 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:53:14pm

re: #16 brookly red

the south won?

Well, that guy in Georgia who thinks that Roe v. Wade doesn’t apply to his state because they weren’t a party to it appears to think so.

18 Kid Skeeter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:53:17pm

Oops. Wrong paste.

19 Idle Drifter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:53:45pm

re: #16 brookly red

the south won?

Abraham Lincoln was really a Lizard Person sent by the Devil.

20 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:55:50pm

re: #19 Idle Drifter

Abraham Lincoln was really a Lizard Person sent by the Devil.

/a Lizard Person sent by the Devil? interesting choice of words…

21 EastSider  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:55:56pm

How does this jive with the “you can’t make us by healthcare.” meme? Essentially you’re mandating that everyone buy education from private institutions. Want to bet how long it will take for some major corporations to start creating school/factories where education is placed below profits? “Sorry folks, looks like education premiums are going up again this year….oh and, your deductible on optional items like “Sports” and “Music” will be doubled as well.”

22 abbyadams  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:56:23pm

I started to write a reply to this post. It had stuff about how teachers accept the job with lower pay because of the benefits; it had a couple of quotes from thing that’s going around on Facebook about how babysitters actually make more money than do teachers; it contained a bit of righteous rant about how my husband can be fired because of an accusation made by a person literally incapable of reason, and how he has no recourse against such an accusation;

and then I thought, “screw it.” Because it’s becoming increasingly and disturbing clear that union busting and dismantling public schools aren’t about those things.

And honestly, I thought that, after a long time of being considered UnAmerican by certain members of the Right because I’m on the liberal side of things, that it would get better once America elected a different guy. Holy cow, was I off. :-)

23 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:57:24pm

re: #21 EastSider

How does this jive with the “you can’t make us by healthcare.” meme? Essentially you’re mandating that everyone buy education from private institutions. Want to bet how long it will take for some major corporations to start creating school/factories where education is placed below profits? “Sorry folks, looks like education premiums are going up again this year…oh and, your deductible on optional items like “Sports” and “Music” will be doubled as well.”

School deserts will show up in the same spots as food deserts.

But you’re paying for your kid to go to a shitty private urban school, instead of not paying for them to go to a shitty public urban school, so all of your rights are being protected. Or something.

24 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:57:43pm

re: #21 EastSider

How does this jive with the “you can’t make us by healthcare.” meme? Essentially you’re mandating that everyone buy education from private institutions. Want to bet how long it will take for some major corporations to start creating school/factories where education is placed below profits? “Sorry folks, looks like education premiums are going up again this year…oh and, your deductible on optional items like “Sports” and “Music” will be doubled as well.”

/I think they call those private schools, no?

25 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:59:41pm

re: #23 SanFranciscoZionist

School deserts will show up in the same spots as food deserts.

But you’re paying for your kid to go to a shitty private urban school, instead of not paying for them to go to a shitty public urban school, so all of your rights are being protected. Or something.

my public school had the best deserts! the canolies were to did for…

ooh, actually I think one kid did..

26 Kronocide  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 3:59:47pm

re: #12 SanFranciscoZionist

They don’t teach it at all. The Church accepts evolution as scientific fact.

I’m surprised by that. I guess maybe the Catholic schools are under the guidance of ‘the Church?’

27 EastSider  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:00:52pm

re: #23 SanFranciscoZionist

School deserts will show up in the same spots as food deserts.

But you’re paying for your kid to go to a shitty private urban school, instead of not paying for them to go to a shitty public urban school, so all of your rights are being protected. Or something.

except its being paid for by vouchers, which are stilll generated from tax dollars. But now you can send your kid wherever you want! Provided you can afford to transport him/her there, and that this kid can get into a school that is unregulated an therefore can reject you because you don’t fit in with their model.

28 CarleeCork  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:00:53pm

Of course they put religion before education. They want ignorant, obedient workers.

29 Targetpractice  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:00:58pm

re: #2 SanFranciscoZionist

Not a surprise. This has been a long time coming.

Hell, I hear it from the Right every time the subject of public schools comes up. “We should have a choice! If I wanna send my kid to a religious school, that should be my choice!” And, personally, I say let them do it. If they want to raise the next generation of trailer park trash, who can’t do long division but can tell me how old the Earth is according to Biblical scholars, more power to them. Just so long as it ain’t on my dime.

30 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:01:33pm

He’s comparing Catholic school test score results with public school results or in the case below, math:

On the math test, eighth-graders in Catholic schools averaged 297 out of 500, compared to an average of 282 for eighth-graders in public schools nationwide and 288 for public school eighth-graders in Wisconsin.

That’s a mere advantage of only 9 points for the Catholic schools over Wisconsin and 15 overall. But what is the point? Public schools represent a vast range of demographics and economic classes. And another thing that isn’t factored in here is that Catholic schools are not a true private enterprise (i.e. based on a free market) since they do not pay taxes.

31 EastSider  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:01:44pm

re: #23 SanFranciscoZionist

re: #25 brookly red

Guys: “Desserts” are edible, “Deserts” are Libyan dictators favorite hiding spots.

/grammar nazi

32 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:02:16pm

re: #26 BigPapa

I’m surprised by that. I guess maybe the Catholic schools are under the guidance of ‘the Church?’

Yes. I’ve taught at three Catholic schools. All of the ones I am aware of teach evolution as scientific fact, and teach it well. The only Catholics who think evolution theory contradicts the teachings of the Church are those who think they know better than the Holy Father what the teaching of the Church is.

This is not new. My dad went to Our Lady of Victory Elementary School in Fresno, CA in the 1950s, and the nuns in their old-fashioned habits taught him that ‘evolution appears to be the means by which God chose to create’.

33 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:02:40pm

re: #31 EastSider

re: #25 brookly red

Guys: “Desserts” are edible, “Deserts” are Libyan dictators favorite hiding spots.

/grammar nazi

piss off! I went to public school ;)

34 EastSider  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:03:07pm

I’m actually a bit surprised that he used data from the DOE. Shouldn’t he be trying to de-fund the DOE?

35 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:03:54pm

re: #29 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Hell, I hear it from the Right every time the subject of public schools comes up. “We should have a choice! If I wanna send my kid to a religious school, that should be my choice!” And, personally, I say let them do it. If they want to raise the next generation of trailer park trash, who can’t do long division but can tell me how old the Earth is according to Biblical scholars, more power to them. Just so long as it ain’t on my dime.

Oddly, these same groups do NOT pop up demanding that people be allowed to send their children to any school in the district in which they reside. They’ve done that in Long Beach, as part of their major overhaul, and apparently it’s been a popular move.

36 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:04:11pm

It’s somewhat telling that Fred Koch’s “one of original architects of the Communist plan of subversion of the U.S.A.” is “Jerome Livshitz”, a Jewish man, judging by the surname.

37 EastSider  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:04:12pm

re: #33 brookly red

piss off! I went to public school ;)

So did I, and apparently I’ve forgotten lessons on possessive apostrophes.

38 jamesfirecat  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:04:28pm

re: #34 EastSider

I’m actually a bit surprised that he used data from the DOE. Shouldn’t he be trying to de-fund the DOE?

That comes after he gets rid of the Public schools since clearly it would serve no purpose….

39 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:04:43pm

re: #31 EastSider

re: #25 brookly red

Guys: “Desserts” are edible, “Deserts” are Libyan dictators favorite hiding spots.

/grammar nazi

I said deserts. Didn’t I?

40 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:05:43pm

re: #37 EastSider

So did I, and apparently I’ve forgotten lessons on possessive apostrophes.

/watch your mouth!

41 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:05:49pm

re: #37 EastSider

So did I, and apparently I’ve forgotten lessons on possessive apostrophes.

No matter how possessive you feel about apostrophes, you don’t own them. Anyone can use them.

42 Tigger2005  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:06:00pm

re: #15 Kid A

Professor Beck says Obama loves “instability and revolution;” which is the “antithesis to Social Security.” Maybe you all can figure it out. By the way, nice elbow patches, Professor.

[Video]

The impression I got of Bush 2 was that he WANTED “instability and revolution” in the Middle East. He wanted the ME to throw off the dictators and join the modern world.

But if Obama wants the same thing, it’s bad.

Meanwhile, Beck and his ilk do their best to pull American into the Dark Ages.

43 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:06:26pm

re: #39 SanFranciscoZionist

I said deserts. Didn’t I?

yes you did, I pick up on it & made a joke…

44 EastSider  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:07:09pm

re: #39 SanFranciscoZionist

I said deserts. Didn’t I?

so you did. And your comment actually makes significantly more sense now.

45 calochortus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:07:40pm

I’ve seen more and more in the way of attacks on public education at all levels over the past few months. That would include some maroon from the Hoover Institute saying that public higher education benefits only the person educated and not society at large. (No evidence provided.) Right. I guess his kids won’t be seeing my publicly-educated pediatrician daughter? A cheaper public education means her debt is not forcing her into a higher paying specialty.

46 engineer cat  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:08:10pm

re: #37 EastSider

So did I, and apparently I’ve forgotten lessons on possessive apostrophes.

my apostrophes and i are working on our possesiveness and jealousy issues

47 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:08:59pm

re: #43 brookly red

yes you did, I pick up on it & made a joke…

Yes you did Brookly.

You are learning fast, young padawan.

48 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:09:13pm

The funny thing is, Catholic schools really don’t teach any of the things he said they do. In my experience, they basically teach the same things most public schools do.

My nieces, who aren’t Catholic, go to a Catholic school. They learned more about the secular nature of our political process than I did at that age. And yes, they were taught about the importance of the establishment clause, and how it is best for everyone if religion and government are kept separate. They also taught about the importance of religious tolerance.

49 Targetpractice  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:09:23pm

re: #35 SanFranciscoZionist

Oddly, these same groups do NOT pop up demanding that people be allowed to send their children to any school in the district in which they reside. They’ve done that in Long Beach, as part of their major overhaul, and apparently it’s been a popular move.

Of course not. Because the ranting against public schooling, like so much else, stems from the “It’s MY Money And I Want It NOW!” mentality pervading the Right of late. They don’t care about test scores or graduation rates, they care about “keeping their money.” There’s not a doubt in my mind that, if public schools were privatized, we’d hear a great deal of bitching about tuition fees, selection committees, and all about how the “free market” is keeping kids from getting quality education.

50 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:10:48pm

re: #47 b_sharp

Yes you did Brookly.

You are learning fast, young padawan.

Padawan? your calling me a town in New Jersey? wtf?

51 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:11:13pm

re: #50 brookly red

Padawan? your calling me a town in New Jersey? wtf?

At least you weren’t called Camden. *shudder*

52 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:13:33pm

re: #50 brookly red

Padawan? your calling me a town in New Jersey? wtf?

I could have called you ‘Fruit of the Loon’.

As it is, I called you a ‘Jedi Apprentice’.

53 SpaceJesus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:14:04pm

2/23/11

this day will serve as a microcosm for future history teachers to show just how stupid the “tea party” and conservatives of the 21st were.

54 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:15:50pm

re: #52 b_sharp

I could have called you ‘Fruit of the Loon’.

As it is, I called you a ‘Jedi Apprentice’.

nerd.

55 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:15:58pm
56 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:16:43pm

re: #54 brookly red

nerd.

That should be ‘NERD!!1!’.

57 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:17:32pm

Aha, found Koch’s complete brochure:

[Link: digilib.usm.edu…]

58 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:17:51pm

re: #56 b_sharp

That should be ‘NERD!!1!’.

no you are a lower case nerd…

59 Targetpractice  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:18:15pm

re: #56 b_sharp

That should be ‘NERD!!1!’.

Image: revenge-of-the-nerds.jpg

60 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:18:35pm

Terry Jeffrey, god that guy is just a backed up toilet

61 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:19:22pm

Mike Huckabee Expresses Deep Doubts About Afghan End Game, Karzai’s Corruption

WASHINGTON — Former Gov. Mike Huckabee (R-Ark.) became one of the most high-profile Republicans to express skepticism with the war in Afghanistan, telling reporters on Wednesday that he sees no “end game” in sight, has no confidence in President Hamid Karzai, thinks the country looks “like the surface of the moon” and believes the time has come for an honest, non-political conversation about the next steps.

“I don’t know [what to do next],” Huckabee said at an afternoon talk organized by the Christian Science Monitor. “I don’t think any of us know exactly. We are there. The question is, I’m asking people, ‘Tell me, what is it we do to say we are done? Help me to understand that because I’m not sure.’”

“My doubts about Afghanistan happen from being there in January 2006,” he said earlier. “And when I say my doubts I believe our military is capable of doing whatever they are assigned to do given the resources to do it. But I came away from that experience wondering: What does the end game look like here? I can’t see a conclusion.”

This is the thing about Huckabee which gives me fits. He says some things that resonate with me so strongly, such as this, and then he turns around and says something bugfuck insane. I mean, I really, really respect the rhetorical honesty with which he approached the issue of the war in Afghanistan. It’s downright refreshing to see someone say what I am thinking.

And yet, he has some some really frightening things.

He is on a different level from most other wingnuts. I like him. My gut says he’s just not a bad guy. But he also scares the shit out of me. Does anybody else feel that way about him?

62 kirkspencer  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:20:15pm

re: #36 Sergey Romanov

It’s somewhat telling that Fred Koch’s “one of original architects of the Communist plan of subversion of the U.S.A.” is “Jerome Livshitz”, a Jewish man, judging by the surname.

Nah. Daddy Koch was a Birch founder.

63 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:21:03pm

re: #62 kirkspencer

Nah.

?

64 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:21:14pm
In addition to being less expensive and better than public schools at teaching math and reading, Catholic schools — like any private schools — can also teach students that there is a God, that the Ten Commandments are true and must be followed, that the Founding Fathers believed in both and that, ultimately, American freedom depends on fidelity to our Judeo-Christian heritage even more than it depends on proficiency in reading and math.


What’s more important to these know-nothing fools than our educational standing in the world, our competitiveness, and the brain trust of our society?

MYSTICISM!

Thanks, Townhall.com! Maybe next you’ll publish an editorial about how to scry the future from the entrails of a chicken

65 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:21:19pm

re: #55 Dreggas

“Couple” turned away at creation museum event for being thought to be gay

The way the ‘Ham’ster walks around with his hand in everyone’s pocket, he could be mistaken for gay.

66 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:22:11pm

re: #58 brookly red

no you are a lower case nerd…

In any case, I am a nerd’s nerd.

67 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:22:53pm

re: #59 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Image: revenge-of-the-nerds.jpg

Brookly, is that you?

68 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:23:20pm

re: #66 b_sharp

In any case, I am a nerd’s nerd.

Yes, but perhaps not quite yet over 9000 on the nerdometer./

69 kirkspencer  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:23:28pm

re: #63 Sergey Romanov

?

I always semantically load “telling” with “unexpectedly”. So instead of “nah” I should have “not really a surprise, given that Daddy Koch was a Birch founder.”

mea culpa

70 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:23:46pm

re: #67 b_sharp

Brookly, is that you?

no that’s my sister…

71 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:23:59pm

re: #61 Fozzie Bear

Mike Huckabee Expresses Deep Doubts About Afghan End Game, Karzai’s Corruption

This is the thing about Huckabee which gives me fits. He says some things that resonate with me so strongly, such as this, and then he turns around and says something bugfuck insane. I mean, I really, really respect the rhetorical honesty with which he approached the issue of the war in Afghanistan. It’s downright refreshing to see someone say what I am thinking.

And yet, he has some some really frightening things.

He is on a different level from most other wingnuts. I like him. My gut says he’s just not a bad guy. But he also scares the shit out of me. Does anybody else feel that way about him?

I think his socially extreme right wing positions make him unfit to be president, but he A) doesn’t seem plugged into the big money in the GOP and B) seems like he’d be a nice guy


basically, to me Huckabee is like the republican equivalent of a really neato democratic candidate who was nice! and smart! and moderate! and exciting! and then he turned out to be an anti-vaxxer. DEAL. BREAKER. Not qualified.

72 blueraven  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:24:00pm

re: #61 Fozzie Bear

Mike Huckabee Expresses Deep Doubts About Afghan End Game, Karzai’s Corruption

This is the thing about Huckabee which gives me fits. He says some things that resonate with me so strongly, such as this, and then he turns around and says something bugfuck insane. I mean, I really, really respect the rhetorical honesty with which he approached the issue of the war in Afghanistan. It’s downright refreshing to see someone say what I am thinking.

And yet, he has some some really frightening things.

He is on a different level from most other wingnuts. I like him. My gut says he’s just not a bad guy. But he also scares the shit out of me. Does anybody else feel that way about him?

I really do not like him at all. Sorry. He can be quite mean spirited. I will never get over his “joke” at that NRA convention at Obama expense. I think it revealed his true nature.

I think he is an opportunist. That said, he is not as bad as a lot of them.

73 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:24:39pm

re: #66 b_sharp

In any case, I am a nerd’s nerd.

is this going to turn into a discussion about nerd versus geek versus dork

74 sizzleRI  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:25:35pm

re: #17 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, that guy in Georgia who thinks that Roe v. Wade doesn’t apply to his state because they weren’t a party to it appears to think so.

This is very weird because Doe v. Bolton, the sister case to Roe v. Wade and the one that includes the exemption for a mother’s help including mental health, overturned Georgia’s abortion law.

Why do I expect them to ever know what they are talking about?

75 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:25:37pm

re: #61 Fozzie Bear

Mike Huckabee Expresses Deep Doubts About Afghan End Game, Karzai’s Corruption

This is the thing about Huckabee which gives me fits. He says some things that resonate with me so strongly, such as this, and then he turns around and says something bugfuck insane. I mean, I really, really respect the rhetorical honesty with which he approached the issue of the war in Afghanistan. It’s downright refreshing to see someone say what I am thinking.

And yet, he has some some really frightening things.

He is on a different level from most other wingnuts. I like him. My gut says he’s just not a bad guy. But he also scares the shit out of me. Does anybody else feel that way about him?

Sure. Huckabee is smart, sensible, likable, he has a good sense of humor, and he doesn’t take himself too seriously. I really like the man.

And he thinks the Constitution should be altered to align more closely with the Bible.

He’s not a wingnut. He’s not stupid. He’s not crazy. He is miles beyond the current crop of deranged so-con Tea-Party petulant rebels with a dumb cause. I am sure he is a good husband, a good father, and a good friend. I believe that his religious beliefs are sincere, and I will be genuinely surprised and sorry if he is ever caught sniffing coke off a hooker.

But he is, in the truest sense of the word, a theocrat.

76 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:25:43pm

re: #73 WindUpBird

is this going to turn into a discussion about nerd versus geek versus dork

only a dork would spell out versus…
just saying.

77 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:25:59pm

re: #72 blueraven

I really do not like him at all. Sorry. He can be quite mean spirited. I will never get over his “joke” at that NRA convention at Obama expense. I think it revealed his true nature.

I think he is an opportunist. That said, he is not as bad as a lot of them.

I read him as very unsophisticated, not stupid but simple, if that makes any sense


which explains both why I think he’d be nice, but also say really creepy and jerky things because he’s really unsophisticated and small minded. because I often get drunk in bars with friends who are sorta like that

78 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:26:39pm

re: #69 kirkspencer

I always semantically load “telling” with “unexpectedly”. So instead of “nah” I should have “not really a surprise, given that Daddy Koch was a Birch founder.”

mea culpa

Ah, got ya.

79 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:26:56pm

re: #73 WindUpBird

is this going to turn into a discussion about nerd versus geek versus dork

We’re all nergeorks.

80 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:27:21pm

re: #75 SanFranciscoZionist

Sure. Huckabee is smart, sensible, likable, he has a good sense of humor, and he doesn’t take himself too seriously. I really like the man.

And he thinks the Constitution should be altered to align more closely with the Bible.

He’s not a wingnut. He’s not stupid. He’s not crazy. He is miles beyond the current crop of deranged so-con Tea-Party petulant rebels with a dumb cause. I am sure he is a good husband, a good father, and a good friend. I believe that his religious beliefs are sincere, and I will be genuinely surprised and sorry if he is ever caught sniffing coke off a hooker.

But he is, in the truest sense of the word, a theocrat.


Right. he’s a total extremist compared to the average American. probably wouldn’t be extremist at all in any society with a religious monoculture. But he’s one who you’d like! If you never had to bring up the extremism.

81 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:27:49pm

re: #77 WindUpBird

I read him as very unsophisticated, not stupid but simple, if that makes any sense

which explains both why I think he’d be nice, but also say really creepy and jerky things because he’s really unsophisticated and small minded. because I often get drunk in bars with friends who are sorta like that

and he is not a serious contender…

82 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:27:56pm

re: #76 brookly red

only a dork would spell out versus…
just saying.

whenever I type vs. I think of Nintendo games

83 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:28:03pm

re: #72 blueraven

I really do not like him at all. Sorry. He can be quite mean spirited. I will never get over his “joke” at that NRA convention at Obama expense. I think it revealed his true nature.

I think he is an opportunist. That said, he is not as bad as a lot of them.

Even taking those comments into account, he doesn’t seem as craven as the rest of the GOP frontrunners, to me. He doesn’t creep me out the same way. He doesn’t seem as malicious to me.

I’d rather have a president Huckabee than a president Palin or Gingrich. Not that this is saying much, but still. I know, it’s kind of like saying i’d rather have face cancer than ebola.

84 calochortus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:28:08pm

So if we privatize education, will we have group plans at work for the employees’ children? Will those without group plans be thrown onto the “individual” market? Will it be difficult to find a school that will accept a student with problems of one sort or another? Or will we just solve the problem by not requiring children to go to school?

85 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:28:18pm

re: #76 brookly red

only a dork would spell out versus…
just saying.

A TPer would have spelled it ‘verses’.

86 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:28:19pm

*reading daddy Koch booklet*
*don’t wanna whatever he was inhaling*

87 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:28:32pm

re: #81 brookly red

and he is not a serious contender…

Oh i’m aware! he has zero chance, he doomed himself by being unambiguously for helping the poor, which is a nono in todays GOP

88 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:28:46pm

re: #82 WindUpBird

whenever I type vs. I think of Nintendo games

now that is geeky…

89 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:29:18pm

re: #84 calochortus

So if we privatize education, will we have group plans at work for the employees’ children? Will those without group plans be thrown onto the “individual” market? Will it be difficult to find a school that will accept a student with problems of one sort or another? Or will we just solve the problem by not requiring children to go to school?

These people are basically trying to create a serf class, an untouchable classwith no upward social mobility, that is the end of the road of the destruction of public education

90 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:29:35pm

About the Assessment: Participation Rates

School and student participation rates in NAEP reading at grade 8, by state/jurisdiction: 2009

Public: 155,400
Private: 3,100

How is this weighted? By average numbers? This is like comparing test results between Princeton Day School and a Trenton school district. Technical details here.

Also this is a good point:

We already know, for instance, that private schools outscore public schools on NAEP. But private schools also serve more-advantaged students, with characteristics that are associated with higher test scores…

Even if it is accurately weighted as possible the public pool is already at a disadvantage to private schools. Troubled children from broken homes do not attend the Princeton Day Schools of the world.

91 Pacific moderate  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:30:32pm

Well as long as we’re into the Old Testament, how about Leviticus 19:28: “Do not…put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the Lord.” An awful lot of the thuggish Christian militants, like the anti-gay rabble-rousers, are tatted-up males. Then again, they probably eat clams too…

92 calochortus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:30:50pm

re: #65 b_sharp

The way the ‘Ham’ster walks around with his hand in everyone’s pocket, he could be mistaken for gay.

Please do not insult upstanding rodents by comparing that jerk to them. /

93 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:31:37pm

re: #88 brookly red

now that is geeky…

please, people ten years younger than I am are Nintendo game fans

geeky is the Bally Astrocade, the Fairchild Channel F, the Vectrex, the Sears version of the Atari 2600 called the Telegames, the Atari XE GS, the Coleco Adam, and all those game and watch high-end portable LCD games Nintendo made years and years before talking to Atari to release the Famicom here


THAT is geeky

94 blueraven  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:31:37pm

re: #83 Fozzie Bear

I’d rather have a president Huckabee than a president Palin or Gingrich.

Amen.

95 wrenchwench  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:31:42pm

re: #89 WindUpBird

These people are basically trying to create a serf class, an untouchable classwith no upward social mobility, that is the end of the road of the destruction of public education

That’s exactly thought I had.

Maybe I didn’t use the word “serf” in my thought.

96 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:31:56pm

re: #91 Pacific moderate

Well as long as we’re into the Old Testament, how about Leviticus 19:28: “Do not…put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the Lord.” An awful lot of the thuggish Christian militants, like the anti-gay rabble-rousers, are tatted-up males. Then again, they probably eat clams too…

Clams? damn I’m hungry…

97 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:32:48pm

re: #90 Gus 802

About the Assessment: Participation Rates

How is this weighted? By average numbers? This is like comparing test results between Princeton Day School and a Trenton school district. Technical details here.

Also this is a good point:

Even if it is accurately weighted as possible the public pool is already at a disadvantage to private schools. Troubled children from broken homes do not attend the Princeton Day Schools of the world.


Also, private schools don’t have to deal with the disabled

98 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:33:53pm

re: #95 wrenchwench

That’s exactly thought I had.

Maybe I didn’t use the word “serf” in my thought.

serf, haelot, underclas,s untouchable, all basically the same

Ending the “USA” as we know it, the land of opportunity, bringing in a new USA where you are trapped and born into a society which will not educate you or give you any route to better your station

99 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:34:44pm

re: #80 WindUpBird

Right. he’s a total extremist compared to the average American. probably wouldn’t be extremist at all in any society with a religious monoculture. But he’s one who you’d like! If you never had to bring up the extremism.

I used to work for a guy who was a stone evangelical fundamentalist. He was actually a member of the Promise Keepers, and used to wear their polo shirts on Casual Friday. Read the Left Behind series, and not ironically.

He was a great boss, a good person, had a wonderful family. He’d be an ideal guy to have next door. He was ex-Navy, and when people got nasty about Islam in the office after 9/11, he spoke up and said that terrorism was not a valid expression of Islam. Great boss.

There was a whole world of stuff we mutually understood we shouldn’t get into, so we didn’t. Huckabee’s from the same model, I think.

Good guy. Must never be allowed to be president, because he is clear about his beliefs, and they are not, in my opinion, compatible with the spirit and letter of the U.S. Constitution.

100 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:35:49pm

re: #84 calochortus

So if we privatize education, will we have group plans at work for the employees’ children? Will those without group plans be thrown onto the “individual” market? Will it be difficult to find a school that will accept a student with problems of one sort or another? Or will we just solve the problem by not requiring children to go to school?

Please note, almost no Catholic schools, and most private school in general, have adequate services for students with IEPs, let alone special ed class needs.

101 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:36:16pm

re: #87 WindUpBird

Oh i’m aware! he has zero chance, he doomed himself by being unambiguously for helping the poor, which is a nono in todays GOP

Being a Christian can be inconvenient in politics.

102 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:36:27pm

re: #99 SanFranciscoZionist

I used to work for a guy who was a stone evangelical fundamentalist. He was actually a member of the Promise Keepers, and used to wear their polo shirts on Casual Friday. Read the Left Behind series, and not ironically.

He was a great boss, a good person, had a wonderful family. He’d be an ideal guy to have next door. He was ex-Navy, and when people got nasty about Islam in the office after 9/11, he spoke up and said that terrorism was not a valid expression of Islam. Great boss.

There was a whole world of stuff we mutually understood we shouldn’t get into, so we didn’t. Huckabee’s from the same model, I think.

Good guy. Must never be allowed to be president, because he is clear about his beliefs, and they are not, in my opinion, compatible with the spirit and letter of the U.S. Constitution.

bravo….agreed

103 theheat  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:36:48pm

re: #91 Pacific moderate

Cherry picking scripture is a matter of convenience. Most Christians I know only refer to Old Testament stuff when it suits them. Sane Christians ignore an awful lot of it. Nostalgic fundies memorize and recite parts to seem all Godly an’ stuff, especially as it might pertain to people they want to demean or marginalize. Interestingly enough, most anti-Muslim Christians practice a collective sort of amnesia when it comes to the OT.

104 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:36:49pm

re: #86 Sergey Romanov

“Through the medium of student riots the Communists have knocked over Synghman Rhee in Korea, Menderes in Turkey, and are working on the Shah of Iran. Our State Department is very critical of the undemocratic methods of the dictators friendly to our side, but has seldom an unkind word for the bloody acts of Khrushchev, Kassem, or Castro.

Deja vu…

105 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:36:54pm

re: #99 SanFranciscoZionist

I used to work for a guy who was a stone evangelical fundamentalist. He was actually a member of the Promise Keepers, and used to wear their polo shirts on Casual Friday. Read the Left Behind series, and not ironically.

He was a great boss, a good person, had a wonderful family. He’d be an ideal guy to have next door. He was ex-Navy, and when people got nasty about Islam in the office after 9/11, he spoke up and said that terrorism was not a valid expression of Islam. Great boss.

There was a whole world of stuff we mutually understood we shouldn’t get into, so we didn’t. Huckabee’s from the same model, I think.

Good guy. Must never be allowed to be president, because he is clear about his beliefs, and they are not, in my opinion, compatible with the spirit and letter of the U.S. Constitution.

Yep! Tribe. Christian before Country. (country in its current form, that is) And that’s just how some people are! And they’re welcome to their beliefs. But yeah. Not qualified.

106 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:37:22pm

re: #101 SanFranciscoZionist

Being a Christian can be inconvenient in politics.

well don’t expect a President Goldberg anytime soon either…

107 wrenchwench  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:37:23pm

re: #98 WindUpBird

serf, haelot, underclas,s untouchable, all basically the same

Ending the “USA” as we know it, the land of opportunity, bringing in a new USA where you are trapped and born into a society which will not educate you or give you any route to better your station

“Underclass”. That was it. Made up of those who couldn’t get a good education, those who can’t get citizenship, those who can’t get an abortion. That underclass. Somebody to do lots of work for little money. And preferably they can’t vote for one reason or another.

108 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:38:11pm

re: #98 WindUpBird

serf, haelot, underclas,s untouchable, all basically the same

Ending the “USA” as we know it, the land of opportunity, bringing in a new USA where you are trapped and born into a society which will not educate you or give you any route to better your station

We need to restore America back to the proper social organization recorded in the bible.

109 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:38:14pm

re: #98 WindUpBird

serf, haelot, underclas,s untouchable, all basically the same

Ending the “USA” as we know it, the land of opportunity, bringing in a new USA where you are trapped and born into a society which will not educate you or give you any route to better your station

Worse. Being a serf didn’t reflect poorly on you, you were merely in the role that God had given you in this world.

We’d create the underclass and then lecture them continuously about how they could have all the goodies if they would only work HARDER.

110 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:38:31pm

re: #101 SanFranciscoZionist

Being a Christian can be inconvenient in politics.

That;s just it! I believe he’s ACTUALLY Christian. Not a scumbag using the religion as a tool to manipulate people. he’s a true believer.

He plays bass in a garage band, for chrissake! The dude is just a average aw shucks guy, with intense religious views that are out of sight

111 reine.de.tout  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:38:45pm

re: #29 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Hell, I hear it from the Right every time the subject of public schools comes up. “We should have a choice! If I wanna send my kid to a religious school, that should be my choice!” And, personally, I say let them do it. If they want to raise the next generation of trailer park trash, who can’t do long division but can tell me how old the Earth is according to Biblical scholars, more power to them. Just so long as it ain’t on my dime.

Oh, yeah.
That describes my daughter perfectly (product of 12 years of Catholic school).

Education in math, reading, science, etc. is important.

For those of us of faith, educating our children in faith is also important.

I’m not sure I could say one is MORE important than the other; they are both important in different realms. One for getting along in the real world, the other for understanding their faith, and yes, that is important.

As to the main post - I really don’t think I would have used the word indoctrinate to describe teaching children about faith. That’s a bit of a loaded sort of a word.
Just my .02.

112 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:39:12pm

re: #106 brookly red

well don’t expect a President Goldberg anytime soon either…

Yep. You absolutely cannot win the presidency without openly expressing a strong Christian faith. it’s not even remotely possible. No atheists, Muslims, or Jews need apply.

It is what it is.

Sigh.

113 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:39:15pm

re: #109 SanFranciscoZionist

Worse. Being a serf didn’t reflect poorly on you, you were merely in the role that God had given you in this world.

We’d create the underclass and then lecture them continuously about how they could have all the goodies if they would only work HARDER.

Yeah, pretty much *_*

115 sagehen  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:39:44pm

re: #72 blueraven

I really do not like him at all. Sorry. He can be quite mean spirited. I will never get over his “joke” at that NRA convention at Obama expense. I think it revealed his true nature.

I think he is an opportunist. That said, he is not as bad as a lot of them.

During the Rev Wright froofaraw, Huckabee stood up for both Obama and the Rev, I remember being pleasantly surprised. He said “hey, i grew up in the South, before desegregation, I remember what it was like for them, what they had to go through, how they were treated. If it had happened to me, I’d be a whole lot angrier and more bitter about it than either of them seem to be.”

He’s also stood up for the Clintons during family values discussions: “They worked through their problems, saved their marriage, they raised a very fine daughter they remain close to. That puts them way ahead of a lot of the people who are casting stones.”

116 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:40:18pm

re: #111 reine.de.tout

I got no problems with catholic private school, there’s a montessori school nearby that some friends are gearing up to send their kid to, it sounds like the most amazing school on the face of earth

117 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:40:27pm

re: #116 WindUpBird

it is QUITE CATHOLIC

118 sizzleRI  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:40:47pm

re: #97 WindUpBird

Also, private schools don’t have to deal with the disabled

That never gets mentioned enough. U.S. public schools take everyone. Not just across socio-economic and racial lines but also across all abilities. Not only is that unique compared to private schools but it is also unique when compared to school systems in other countries especially climbers like China and India whose test scores look awesome because a limited percentage of school aged children attend school, especially secondary ed, and that percentage does not include the disabled. Or poor for the most part.

119 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:40:51pm

re: #115 sagehen

He’s a REAL CHRISTIAN

and all that implies :D

120 theheat  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:40:58pm

re: #83 Fozzie Bear

I’d rather have a president Huckabee than a president Palin or Gingrich. Not that this is saying much, but still. I know, it’s kind of like saying i’d rather have face cancer than ebola.

A bible-thumping theocrat is a bible-thumping theocrat, any way you cut it. Huckabee has a likable enough veneer, but he’s all about the same talking points as other wingnuts, and he faithfully attends functions that echo the same stoneage mentality. It’s what he is.

121 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:41:27pm

re: #112 Fozzie Bear

Yep. You absolutely cannot win the presidency without openly expressing a strong Christian faith. it’s not even remotely possible. No atheists, Muslims, or Jews need apply.

It is what it is.

Sigh.

it is just so ironic that people insist on voting for strong Christians, & get really scared when they act like one… weird.

122 TedStriker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:41:28pm

re: #114 Killgore Trout

Christchurch building collapse exposes crop. Oh dear.

I think, given the dire circumstances, that person’s not gonna get busted for growing bud. I think the authorities have more pressing matters right now…

123 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:41:42pm

re: #118 sizzleRI

That never gets mentioned enough. U.S. public schools take everyone. Not just across socio-economic and racial lines but also across all abilities. Not only is that unique compared to private schools but it is also unique when compared to school systems in other countries especially climbers like China and India whose test scores look awesome because a limited percentage of school aged children attend school, especially secondary ed, and that percentage does not include the disabled. Or poor for the most part.

They take everyone and Republicans want to use that against them as proof of their failure.

THAT THEY TAKE EVERYONE.

124 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:42:06pm

Ohhhh. That crop.

125 jamesfirecat  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:42:29pm

re: #105 WindUpBird

Yep! Tribe. Christian before Country. (country in its current form, that is) And that’s just how some people are! And they’re welcome to their beliefs. But yeah. Not qualified.

Dare I say that Dark Falcon is cut from the same cloth as well?

I mean he’s a nice guy I want to like him, but every so often when we get into issues of Unions or worse yet torture… he scares me….

126 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:42:29pm

re: #99 SanFranciscoZionist

I used to work for a guy who was a stone evangelical fundamentalist. He was actually a member of the Promise Keepers, and used to wear their polo shirts on Casual Friday. Read the Left Behind series, and not ironically.

He was a great boss, a good person, had a wonderful family. He’d be an ideal guy to have next door. He was ex-Navy, and when people got nasty about Islam in the office after 9/11, he spoke up and said that terrorism was not a valid expression of Islam. Great boss.

There was a whole world of stuff we mutually understood we shouldn’t get into, so we didn’t. Huckabee’s from the same model, I think.

Good guy. Must never be allowed to be president, because he is clear about his beliefs, and they are not, in my opinion, compatible with the spirit and letter of the U.S. Constitution.

This is, BTW, the same guy whose six-year-old son was pursued down a hallway at San Francisco Airport by the National Guard.

127 researchok  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:42:58pm

re: #112 Fozzie Bear

Yep. You absolutely cannot win the presidency without openly expressing a strong Christian faith. it’s not even remotely possible. No atheists, Muslims, or Jews need apply.

It is what it is.

Sigh.

Even Romney’s Mormonism is suspect.

128 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:43:00pm

re: #121 brookly red

it is just so ironic that people insist on voting for strong Christians, & get really scared when they act like one… weird.

Tribalists aren’t always devout

the two are incredibly different, you can be a tribalist christian and never give a crap what’s in the bible

Huckabee is devout, which is the difference

129 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:43:32pm

re: #106 brookly red

well don’t expect a President Goldberg anytime soon either…

Oh, I ain’t.

Then again, I wasn’t expecting a President Obama. When things change, they change fast.

130 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:43:40pm

re: #125 jamesfirecat

Dare I say that Dark Falcon is cut from the same cloth as well?

I mean he’s a nice guy I want to like him, but every so often when we get into issues of Unions or worse yet torture… he scares me…

he doesn’t scare me, he’s a guy with bizarre and unyielding opinions to me

Ask me about my friends who believe in crystal power and astrology 9_9 Just as frustrating

131 calochortus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:44:04pm

re: #120 theheat

A bible-thumping theocrat is a bible-thumping theocrat, any way you cut it. Huckabee has a likable enough veneer, but he’s all about the same talking points as other wingnuts, and he faithfully attends functions that echo the same stoneage mentality. It’s what he is.

There are things I like about Huckabee and things I don’t. The biggest problem is that I think his faith makes him absolutely sure of what he believes. With the good things, this is good. With say, same sex marriage, women’s issues, etc. it means there is no evidence that will change his mind. That is dangerous.

132 researchok  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:44:10pm

re: #101 SanFranciscoZionist

Being a Christian can be inconvenient in politics.

Being a rich Christian can be a very good thing.

133 kirkspencer  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:44:28pm

re: #103 theheat

Cherry picking scripture is a matter of convenience. Most Christians I know only refer to Old Testament stuff when it suits them. Sane Christians ignore an awful lot of it. Nostalgic fundies memorize and recite parts to seem all Godly an’ stuff, especially as it might pertain to people they want to demean or marginalize. Interestingly enough, most anti-Muslim Christians practice a collective sort of amnesia when it comes to the OT.

Yep. I think you all can appreciate the times I use this one:

If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth; Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die; because he hath sought to thrust thee away from the Lord thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage. Deuteronomy 13:6-10.
134 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:44:32pm

new rule….
atheists only for president

135 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:44:52pm

re: #129 SanFranciscoZionist

Oh, I ain’t.

Then again, I wasn’t expecting a President Obama. When things change, they change fast.

/Bloomberg? muhahahaha!

136 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:44:57pm

re: #131 calochortus

There are things I like about Huckabee and things I don’t. The biggest problem is that I think his faith makes him absolutely sure of what he believes. With the good things, this is good. With say, same sex marriage, women’s issues, etc. it means there is no evidence that will change his mind. That is dangerous.

social policy matters

An extremist can do a lot of damage to health care infrastructure if they weild a lot of power

137 sagehen  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:45:19pm

re: #97 WindUpBird

Also, private schools don’t have to deal with the disabled

And private schools can expel anybody whose test scores they don’t like, anybody with behavioral issues, anybody whose clothing or hygiene or meal choices might make you question their home situation….

138 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:45:47pm

re: #134 albusteve

new rule…
atheists only for president

naw, then we’ll get some guy who collects bud-K swords and wears a fedora with a t-shirt

139 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:46:00pm

re: #137 sagehen

And private schools can expel anybody whose test scores they don’t like, anybody with behavioral issues, anybody whose clothing or hygiene or meal choices might make you question their home situation…

eggggs zactly!

140 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:46:07pm

re: #108 prononymous

We need to restore America back to the proper social organization recorded in the bible.

Aside from polygamy and slavery, what about our social organization is incompatible with the Bible?

I guess we could take up being nomads and small farmers in greater numbers, but that seems more a descriptive than prescriptive detail to me.

141 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:46:25pm

re: #137 sagehen

And private schools can expel anybody whose test scores they don’t like, anybody with behavioral issues, anybody whose clothing or hygiene or meal choices might make you question their home situation…

Killing public schools = turning your back on the majority of America, simple as that

142 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:46:26pm

re: #138 WindUpBird

naw, then we’ll get some guy who collects bud-K swords and wears a fedora with a t-shirt

Beardo comic book guy?

143 wrenchwench  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:46:35pm

re: #111 reine.de.tout

As to the main post - I really don’t think I would have used the word indoctrinate to describe teaching children about faith. That’s a bit of a loaded sort of a word.
Just my .02.

But the classes I went to on Saturday were called CCD: Confraternity of Christian Doctrine, so the root of the word is already there. Does sound different in different contexts, though.

144 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:46:56pm

re: #134 albusteve

new rule…
atheists only for president

We will have woman and Latino presidents before atheist. Atheism is the political kiss of death usually.

145 calochortus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:47:13pm

re: #140 SanFranciscoZionist

Aside from polygamy and slavery, what about our social organization is incompatible with the Bible?

I guess we could take up being nomads and small farmers in greater numbers, but that seems more a descriptive than prescriptive detail to me.

If we destroy the economy we will have more nomads. Progress!/

146 Killgore Trout  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:47:23pm

re: #134 albusteve

new rule…
atheists only for president

Good luck with that. The last poll I recall on the topic had atheists ranked below Muslims and gays.

147 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:47:27pm

re: #134 albusteve

new rule…
atheists only for president

Aide: President Atheist! the Russian have opened their silos!
President Atheist: Oh my God!

148 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:47:49pm

re: #125 jamesfirecat

Dare I say that Dark Falcon is cut from the same cloth as well?

I mean he’s a nice guy I want to like him, but every so often when we get into issues of Unions or worse yet torture… he scares me…

re: #130 WindUpBird

Let’s discuss Lizards when they’re logged into the thread.

149 theheat  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:48:07pm

re: #131 calochortus

Plus, his ass belongs to the religious right, and he owes them. We’re already seeing that agenda at work right now in spite of a Dem POTUS in the WH. I don’t even want to consider what would happen with a dyed in the wool theocrat as POTUS.

150 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:48:07pm

re: #142 Gus 802

Beardo comic book guy?

Sorta! Some of them are sorta like snarky younger types, the HAR HAR I HAVE DEFEATED YOU WITH MY RAPIER WIT 30-something mensa asshole who never passes up the opportunity to make anyone in the room who isn’t an athiest feel like shit


(can you tell I knew these guys)

151 jamesfirecat  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:48:33pm

re: #148 Decatur Deb

re: #130 WindUpBird

Let’s discuss Lizards when they’re logged into the thread.

Sorry I have a bad habit of doing that…

152 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:48:46pm

re: #148 Decatur Deb

re: #130 WindUpBird

Let’s discuss Lizards when they’re logged into the thread.

to be fair I do unto others, anyone wants to talk about me when i’m not here, go ahead. :D But I’ll cool it

153 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:48:50pm

re: #140 SanFranciscoZionist

Aside from polygamy and slavery, what about our social organization is incompatible with the Bible?

I guess we could take up being nomads and small farmers in greater numbers, but that seems more a descriptive than prescriptive detail to me.

Committing genocide on God’s orders. And stoning. Don’t forget the stoning.

/

154 sizzleRI  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:48:58pm

re: #123 WindUpBird

They take everyone and Republicans want to use that against them as proof of their failure.

THAT THEY TAKE EVERYONE.

I think its one of the best things we do as a country. I think we can do it better. But instead of always criticizing the education system, and there is much to criticize, I try to appreciate what we are trying to do. It is a truly huge task.

155 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:49:26pm

re: #147 brookly red

Aide: President Atheist! the Russian have opened their silos!
President Atheist: Oh my God!

Well, sometimes they say Zounds

156 reine.de.tout  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:49:36pm

re: #116 WindUpBird

I got no problems with catholic private school, there’s a montessori school nearby that some friends are gearing up to send their kid to, it sounds like the most amazing school on the face of earth

Those are absolutely amazing schools. I have a friend who went to a montessori school, HIGHLY recommended.

157 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:49:47pm

all good reasons that support my atheists only rule….unelectability should be the prime directive of a good president

158 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:50:00pm

re: #154 sizzleRI

I think its one of the best things we do as a country. I think we can do it better. But instead of always criticizing the education system, and there is much to criticize, I try to appreciate what we are trying to do. It is a truly huge task.

Right, not only are we devaluing educators, we’re now dealing with a party that just wants to wipe the whole system out

159 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:50:01pm

re: #147 brookly red

Is President Atheist from the same movie as Doctor Baby?

160 calochortus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:50:32pm

re: #155 WindUpBird

Well, sometimes they say Zounds

Same deal-derived from “God’s wounds”.

161 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:50:34pm

re: #140 SanFranciscoZionist

Aside from polygamy and slavery, what about our social organization is incompatible with the Bible?

I guess we could take up being nomads and small farmers in greater numbers, but that seems more a descriptive than prescriptive detail to me.

I don’t think it is necessarily incompatible. If you look at it with some flexibility and realism.

I did say though, as it was recorded in the bible. Would you really want to go back to that way, with kings, slaves, etc? I know I wouldn’t.

162 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:50:46pm

re: #156 reine.de.tout

Those are absolutely amazing schools. I have a friend who went to a montessori school, HIGHLY recommended.

I’m seriously jealous, they look like heaven

163 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:50:55pm

re: #160 calochortus

Same deal-derived from “God’s wounds”.

SHOWOFF!

164 calochortus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:51:37pm

re: #163 WindUpBird

Guilty! :-)

165 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:51:46pm

re: #159 Sergey Romanov

Is President Atheist from the same movie as Doctor Baby?

didn’t see that one…

166 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:51:58pm

re: #114 Killgore Trout

Christchurch building collapse exposes crop. Oh dear.

OK, I had to click on that, because the title didn’t mean anything to me.

I see.

Oh well.

167 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:51:59pm

I’ve got to say if your kids are somewhat smart and you as a parent are active in their education process, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a public education. I’ll match my daughters abilities with any private schooled kid.

168 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:52:02pm

re: #160 calochortus

Same deal-derived from “God’s wounds”.

And that’s why “Bloody” is strong talk for the British.

169 reine.de.tout  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:52:25pm

re: #143 wrenchwench

But the classes I went to on Saturday were called CCD: Confraternity of Christian Doctrine, so the root of the word is already there. Does sound different in different contexts, though.

Ah.
But does Judaism use that word? Islam? Other faiths?

If I told you my neighbor was recently widowed, you would probably murmur appropriate words expressing how terrible a thing for her.

Then I would reveal that she was recently widowed because she murdered her husband, and then you might get that I was using “widow” neutrally, without it’s implied meaning (separate from its dictionary meaning)

“Indoctrination” is one of those words that triggers a bad reaction in me.

170 jamesfirecat  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:52:26pm

re: #155 WindUpBird

Well, sometimes they say Zounds

But as Ned Flanders would have us know… “Zounds” is a renaissance English word short for “God’s wounds”

171 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:52:46pm

re: #166 SanFranciscoZionist

OK, I had to click on that, because the title didn’t mean anything to me.

I see.

Oh well.

YOU LIVE IN SAN FRANCISCO

172 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:52:54pm

re: #165 brookly red

didn’t see that one…

[Link: www.explosm.net…]

173 calochortus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:53:02pm

re: #168 Decatur Deb
Yup. Those Brits are wild and crazy.

174 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:53:03pm

re: #157 albusteve

all good reasons that support my atheists only rule…unelectability should be the prime directive of a good president

prime directive… prime directive?

Nerd!

175 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:53:18pm

re: #147 brookly red

Aide: President Atheist! the Russian have opened their silos!
President Atheist: Oh my God!

There isn’t a grain of truth in that fictitious scenario.

176 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:53:21pm

re: #150 WindUpBird

Sorta! Some of them are sorta like snarky younger types, the HAR HAR I HAVE DEFEATED YOU WITH MY RAPIER WIT 30-something mensa asshole who never passes up the opportunity to make anyone in the room who isn’t an athiest feel like shit

(can you tell I knew these guys)

I’ve actually never interacted much with atheists even though I am one. I have seen many on Youtube though but that’s a hyper medium regardless. For me it’s just an occasional hobby. For others it’s a lifestyle and an attitude. I never felt smarter than anyone because I am an atheist.

But I’ve seen a lot of stupidity on Youtube and they can be just as misogynistic, sexist, ignorant, racist, and so on, just like everyone else.

177 reine.de.tout  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:53:35pm

re: #162 WindUpBird

I’m seriously jealous, they look like heaven

I believe, for someone creative like you - it would have been heaven on earth.

178 Killgore Trout  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:53:36pm

re: #171 WindUpBird

YOU LIVE IN SAN FRANCISCO

Why do earthquakes hate weed?

179 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:53:39pm

re: #140 SanFranciscoZionist

Aside from polygamy and slavery, what about our social organization is incompatible with the Bible?

I guess we could take up being nomads and small farmers in greater numbers, but that seems more a descriptive than prescriptive detail to me.

I tend to think that is the issue with much of religion in general. I mean, from my point of view, every statement in the bible that is attributed directly to God is really just a person writing down something he heard from someone else. It’s all descriptive to me.

Unless you really think people can talk to God like you can talk to a human, you have to conclude that it has always been this way, and even if there is a God, he doesn’t go around actually talking to people, per se. So somebody had to write it. And that somebody, if they write that God literally said something to someone, you kind of have to come to one of three conclusions:
1. The writer is spinning a story. (i.e., fiction)
2. The writer is passing on what he heard/read from another source.
3. The writer is suffering from schizophrenia.

This kind of line of thinking is what ultimately makes me an atheist.

180 Skeetghazi  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:54:13pm

I need to hire people to pack for me. This is hell. I’m doing the LGF avoidance dance.

181 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:54:23pm

It’s like Chick Corea is a Scientologist. But guess what? The man is a musical genius.

182 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:54:30pm

re: #167 mracb

I’ve got to say if your kids are somewhat smart and you as a parent are active in their education process, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a public education. I’ll match my daughters abilities with any private schooled kid.

I had a public education! it was in fact awesome, because I was in accelerated classes in a good district, had some brilliant teachers, crazy smart

183 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:55:14pm

re: #176 Gus 802

I’ve actually never interacted much with atheists even though I am one. I have seen many on Youtube though but that’s a hyper medium regardless. For me it’s just an occasional hobby. For others it’s a lifestyle and an attitude. I never felt smarter than anyone because I am an atheist.

But I’ve seen a lot of stupidity on Youtube and they can be just as misogynistic, sexist, ignorant, racist, and so on, just like everyone else.

I know a TON OF ATHIESTS, some are nice about it, some aren’t. :P They’re all similary in demeanor to me, snarky internet 30-somethings

184 compound idaho  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:55:32pm

re: #137 sagehen

And private schools can expel anybody whose test scores they don’t like, anybody with behavioral issues, anybody whose clothing or hygiene or meal choices might make you question their home situation…

It probably happens, but not in my experience. Mrs. Compound was the lay director at the local Lutheran school for a number of years. If a family did not have the resources, they were found. We had troubled kids from problem homes. Every effort was made to get them the help that was needed. Try to avoid stereotypes unless you have specifics, then try to avoid stereotypes because the probably won’t hold up to reality.

185 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:55:43pm

re: #181 Gus 802

It’s like Chick Corea is a Scientologist. But guess what? The man is a musical genius.

We listen to musicians who are rank criminals all the time :D

186 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:55:54pm

re: #178 Killgore Trout

Why do earthquakes hate weed?

/I thought it was sodomy?

187 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:56:04pm

re: #183 WindUpBird

I know a TON OF ATHIESTS, some are nice about it, some aren’t. :P They’re all similary in demeanor to me, snarky internet 30-somethings

Head trips always suck. And it never mattered what they identified themselves as.

188 calochortus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:56:32pm

Its been fun, but its time to make dinner. Have a good evening all.

189 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:57:04pm

re: #181 Gus 802

It’s like Chick Corea is a Scientologist. But guess what? The man is a musical genius.

so Carlos Santana is a born again? Shut up & sing ;)

190 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:57:21pm

re: #177 reine.de.tout

I believe, for someone creative like you - it would have been heaven on earth.

I had classes in K-6 along the montessori format, project-based, integrated cirriculum, but I don’t think it was called anything in particular

191 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:57:34pm

re: #169 reine.de.tout

Ah.
But does Judaism use that word? Islam? Other faiths?

If I told you my neighbor was recently widowed, you would probably murmur appropriate words expressing how terrible a thing for her.

Then I would reveal that she was recently widowed because she murdered her husband, and then you might get that I was using “widow” neutrally, without it’s implied meaning (separate from its dictionary meaning)

“Indoctrination” is one of those words that triggers a bad reaction in me.

It’s lost its old innocence, as has “propaganda”. Both would be good or evil depending on the honesty of the content. (US Army runs TRADOC—TRAining and DOCtrine Command.)

192 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:57:48pm

re: #183 WindUpBird

I know a TON OF ATHIESTS, some are nice about it, some aren’t. :P They’re all similary in demeanor to me, snarky internet 30-somethings

30 something? Damn, that’s pretty old and wise.

//

193 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:58:04pm

re: #180 stanley sea

I need to hire people to pack for me. This is hell. I’m doing the LGF avoidance dance.

going somewhere?

194 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:58:24pm

re: #184 compound idaho

It probably happens, but not in my experience. Mrs. Compound was the lay director at the local Lutheran school for a number of years. If a family did not have the resources, they were found. We had troubled kids from problem homes. Every effort was made to get them the help that was needed. Try to avoid stereotypes unless you have specifics, then try to avoid stereotypes because the probably won’t hold up to reality.

I think the point is, a private school does not have a duty to accept everyone, a private school CAN be choosy, if they wish. Some are, some aren’t.

Public school does.

195 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:58:44pm

re: #192 Gus 802

30 something? Damn, that’s pretty old and wise.

//

hahahaha tell me about it

196 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:58:53pm

Anyway. I would never vote for a candidate just because s/he was an atheist.

197 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:58:57pm

It’s funny even referring to being “an atheist”, as though it were a self-identification of a sort. I mean, the thing I don’t believe exists doesn’t take up a lot of my cognitive time, nor do I think of myself as defined by the thing that I don’t do.

198 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:59:07pm

re: #123 WindUpBird

They take everyone and Republicans want to use that against them as proof of their failure.

THAT THEY TAKE EVERYONE.

My dad, as I’ve mentioned, went to Our Lady of Victory in Fresno, back in the 50s. There was a little boy in his class who was retarded.

The kid’s parents weren’t Catholic, which was less common then, but they had been told they couldn’t enroll him in public school, so they went to the nuns, and the nuns said they’d take the child.

Kid made fun of the retarded kid. Once. Sister talked to him, and he promised not to do it again. Then he did it again. After school, Sister took him to the convent, and told him to kneel and say the rosary.

“For how long?” said the kid.

“I’ll tell you when you can stop,” said Sister.

No one messed with the retarded kid again.

Today, thank God, that kid would be entitled to be in public school, and get appropriate services. Of course, he’d also be required to take the state standardized tests. That’s one thing when you’re talking about a kid with Down Syndrome, or a kid who doesn’t speak much English, but I had a chat with one guy who taught a SED classroom (that’s Severely Emotionally Disturbed, y’all). One of his students tried to eat the test form. There’s a whole procedure for that, BTW. You have to put whatever fragments of the test you can pry out of the kid’s mouth in a plastic bag and return them, with a report.

199 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:59:09pm

re: #176 Gus 802

I’ve actually never interacted much with atheists even though I am one. I have seen many on Youtube though but that’s a hyper medium regardless. For me it’s just an occasional hobby. For others it’s a lifestyle and an attitude. I never felt smarter than anyone because I am an atheist.

But I’ve seen a lot of stupidity on Youtube and they can be just as misogynistic, sexist, ignorant, racist, and so on, just like everyone else.

I don’t believe in a deity manipulating events. I never liked to go to meetings so I don’t bother to hang out with other atheists to discuss how we can prove there is no god. I just don’t care.

200 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 4:59:58pm

re: #197 Fozzie Bear

It’s funny even referring to being “an atheist”, as though it were a self-identification of a sort. I mean, the thing I don’t believe exists doesn’t take up a lot of my cognitive time, nor do I think of myself as defined by the thing that I don’t do.

I know the kind who never bring it up, or who just have no strong opinion, but don’t believe in God, and then I know the chip on their shoulder ones as well who just like arguing :D

201 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:00:23pm

re: #199 mracb

I don’t believe in a deity manipulating events. I never liked to go to meetings so I don’t bother to hang out with other atheists to discuss how we can prove there is no god. I just don’t care.

I’d rather join a model airplane club or take a language class.

202 Charles Johnson  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:00:52pm

Lawrence O’Donnell has the guy who pranked Scott Walker on his show. Starting now.

203 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:00:57pm

re: #137 sagehen

And private schools can expel anybody whose test scores they don’t like, anybody with behavioral issues, anybody whose clothing or hygiene or meal choices might make you question their home situation…

Even with Catholic schools, lemme tell you, you can see the difference between a rich parish and a less-than-rich parish.

204 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:01:03pm

re: #198 SanFranciscoZionist

Today, thank God, that kid would be entitled to be in public school, and get appropriate services. Of course, he’d also be required to take the state standardized tests. That’s one thing when you’re talking about a kid with Down Syndrome, or a kid who doesn’t speak much English, but I had a chat with one guy who taught a SED classroom (that’s Severely Emotionally Disturbed, y’all). One of his students tried to eat the test form. There’s a whole procedure for that, BTW. You have to put whatever fragments of the test you can pry out of the kid’s mouth in a plastic bag and return them, with a report.

I had a similar experience once at work *_*

205 Skeetghazi  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:01:30pm

re: #193 brookly red

going somewhere?

I’ve already gone, it’s all my possessions that need to leave now. And I’ve been w/out them for 4 months, so the hassle is at this moment questionable. But no pain no gain and all that shit.

206 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:01:51pm

re: #140 SanFranciscoZionist

Aside from polygamy and slavery, what about our social organization is incompatible with the Bible?

I guess we could take up being nomads and small farmers in greater numbers, but that seems more a descriptive than prescriptive detail to me.

And neither polygamy nor slavery is described as a requirement, you’re just told how to do it correctly.

207 Professional Poo Flinger  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:01:58pm

re: #197 Fozzie Bear

It’s funny even referring to being “an atheist”, as though it were a self-identification of a sort. I mean, the thing I don’t believe exists doesn’t take up a lot of my cognitive time, nor do I think of myself as defined by the thing that I don’t do.

We have been defined by a-atheists, who tend to define things they dislike in a manner advantageous to them. I would prefer to define myself, thank you.

208 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:02:02pm

re: #201 Gus 802

I’d rather join a model airplane club or take a language class.

I think i’d sooner stay at home and eat cheetoes than leave my home to meet with other people to discuss the absence of something :D

209 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:02:16pm

re: #205 stanley sea

I’ve already gone, it’s all my possessions that need to leave now. And I’ve been w/out them for 4 months, so the hassle is at this moment questionable. But no pain no gain and all that shit.

happy landings.

210 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:02:21pm

The nut-right has had a growing movement to abolish public education for some time. My brother “Judas;” adulterer, traitor, church deacon, and world-class hypocrite; is a leading member of an anti-public education group in Massachusetts.
Georgia legislature nutcase Bobby Franklin, who wants to investigate miscarriages and abolish driver’s licenses, is also opposed to public education:

“The State Has No Jurisdiction To Educate Our Children — Period”

The real background here is the billions in school vouchers these agitators hope to divert into fundy coffers. Demonizing public education in every way possible, from libeling teachers to crackpot legal theorizing, helps to advance that goal.

211 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:03:16pm

re: #210 Shiplord Kirel

The nut-right has had a growing movement to abolish public education for some time. My brother “Judas;” adulterer, traitor, church deacon, and world-class hypocrite; is a leading member of an anti-public education group in Massachusetts.
Georgia legislature nutcase Bobby Franklin, who wants to investigate miscarriages and abolish driver’s licenses, is also opposed to public education:

The real background here is the billions in school vouchers these agitators hope to divert into fundy coffers. Demonizing public education in every way possible, from libeling teachers to crackpot legal theorizing, helps to advance that goal.

adulterer, traitor, deacon, CANNIBAL!

Sorry, i’m listening to grindhouse movie trailers

212 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:03:26pm

re: #153 Sergey Romanov

Committing genocide on God’s orders. And stoning. Don’t forget the stoning.

/

I don’t know where you’d find any Amalekites these days, but the stoning is an issue.

213 sizzleRI  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:03:27pm

re: #182 WindUpBird

I had a public education! it was in fact awesome, because I was in accelerated classes in a good district, had some brilliant teachers, crazy smart

I was public school all the way and then college too. My school district wasn’t considered great and I’d say half the kids I went to elementary school with went to private school for high school (I lived in the more affluent part of town). My parents figured the school had accelerated classes and they could be involved so why not. And maybe their daughters would go to school with kids that weren’t white or upper middle class which wasn’t really an option at any of the private schools. I think it was awesome. Made law school quite a culture shock. In the minority for students that went to public school, and it is pretty obvious by attitude.

214 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:03:54pm

re: #211 WindUpBird

adulterer, traitor, deacon, CANNIBAL!

Sorry, i’m listening to grindhouse movie trailers

eating people is bad?

215 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:04:04pm

re: #208 WindUpBird

I think i’d sooner stay at home and eat cheetoes than leave my home to meet with other people to discuss the absence of something :D

Yeah. Mind you I do “dabble” in atheism. I’ve read a few books and if Hitchens ever came to town I’d go see him in an instant. My interest however is not strong enough to join a club. Heck, I don’t belong to any clubs.

216 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:04:10pm

re: #157 albusteve

all good reasons that support my atheists only rule…unelectability should be the prime directive of a good president

But how could you tell if a presidential candidate really didn’t believe in God, or just pretended not to?

217 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:04:33pm

re: #140 SanFranciscoZionist

Aside from polygamy and slavery, what about our social organization is incompatible with the Bible?

I guess we could take up being nomads and small farmers in greater numbers, but that seems more a descriptive than prescriptive detail to me.

Doubleknit polyester blends.

218 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:04:45pm

re: #206 SanFranciscoZionist

And neither polygamy nor slavery is described as a requirement, you’re just told how to do it correctly.

They’re allowed is all that matters.

219 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:05:12pm

I only collect Lizards™.

//

220 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:05:15pm

re: #214 brookly red

eating people is bad?

Shouldn’t be done casually.

221 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:05:44pm

re: #212 SanFranciscoZionist

I don’t know where you’d find any Amalekites these days, but the stoning is an issue.

New orders may always arrive, that’s the problem.

222 celticdragon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:05:55pm

re: #108 prononymous

We need to restore America back to the proper social organization recorded in the bible.

I hope you just forgot the snark tag.

223 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:06:00pm

re: #216 SanFranciscoZionist

But how could you tell if a presidential candidate really didn’t believe in God, or just pretended not to?

you can’t tell until they are elected, and try to fill the role…

224 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:06:15pm

re: #161 prononymous

I don’t think it is necessarily incompatible. If you look at it with some flexibility and realism.

I did say though, as it was recorded in the bible. Would you really want to go back to that way, with kings, slaves, etc? I know I wouldn’t.

Would I want to live in the cultures described in the Bible? As tempting as certain aspects of it might be from a religious or historical standpoint, no. They didn’t have penicillin, or enough women’s rights, or chocolate, or Chinese food. Except in China, but you get the idea.

225 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:06:16pm

re: #214 brookly red

eating people is bad?

I dunno, there’s that german who agreed to it

226 justaminute  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:06:22pm

I saw this post today and thought you might like it. A teacher was told by a Walker supporter that she was a glorified babysitter, she wrote a reply:

Are you sick of highly paid teachers? Teachers’ hefty salaries are driving up taxes, and they only work 9 or10 months a year! It’s time we put things in perspective and pay them for what they do - babysit!

We can get that for less than minimum wage.

That’s right. Let’s give them $3.00 an hour and only the hours they worked; not any of that silly planning time, or any time they spend before or after school. That would be $19.50 a day (7:45 to 3:00 PM with 45 min. off for lunch and plan— that equals 6 1/2 hours).

Each parent should pay $19.50 a day for these teachers to baby-sit their children. Now how many students do they teach in a day…maybe 30? So that’s $19.50 x 30 = $585.00 a day.
However, remember they only work 180 days a year!!! I am not going to pay them for any vacations.
That’s $585 X 180= $105,300 per year. Hm.

What about those special education teachers and the ones with Master’s degrees? Well, we could pay them minimum wage ($7.75), and just to be fair, round it off to $8.00 an hour. That would be $8 X 6 1/2 hours X 30 children X 180 days = $280,800 per year.
Wait a minute — there’s something wrong here! There sure is! The average teacher’s salary (nation wide) is $50,000. $50,000/180 days = $277.77/per day/30
students=$9.25/6.5 hours = $1.42 per hour per student—a very inexpensive baby-sitter and they even EDUCATE your kids!) WHAT A DEAL!!!!

227 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:06:31pm

re: #211 WindUpBird

adulterer, traitor, deacon, CANNIBAL!

Sorry, i’m listening to grindhouse movie trailers

Certainly, if you count my ex-wife’s…..

No, not going to go there.

(As old-time Lizards already know, my ex, aka Jezebel and Jabba the Slutt, is married to brother Judas.)

228 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:07:17pm

re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist

Would I want to live in the cultures described in the Bible? As tempting as certain aspects of it might be from a religious or historical standpoint, no. They didn’t have penicillin, or enough women’s rights, or chocolate, or Chinese food. Except in China, but you get the idea.

Without rock and roll, I’m simply not interested

229 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:07:37pm

re: #220 Decatur Deb

Shouldn’t be done casually.

but what if they really, really want to be eaten?

230 Simply Sarah  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:07:45pm

re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist

Would I want to live in the cultures described in the Bible? As tempting as certain aspects of it might be from a religious or historical standpoint, no. They didn’t have penicillin, or enough women’s rights, or chocolate, or Chinese food. Except in China, but you get the idea.


Well, except they had real Chinese food in China, not Chinese food Chinese food!

231 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:08:25pm

re: #227 Shiplord Kirel

Certainly, if you count my ex-wife’s…

No, not going to go there.

(As old-time Lizards already know, my ex, aka Jezebel and Jabba the Slutt, is married to brother Judas.)

wow ._.

232 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:08:31pm

re: #171 WindUpBird

YOU LIVE IN SAN FRANCISCO

East Bay now! And I thought ‘crop’ was some kind of building defect!

233 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:08:48pm

re: #230 Simply Sarah

Well, except they had real Chinese food in China, not Chinese food Chinese food!

I prefer the poser chinese food at my karaoke bar :D

234 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:09:07pm

re: #232 SanFranciscoZionist

East Bay now! And I thought ‘crop’ was some kind of building defect!

Had me searching.

235 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:09:12pm

re: #232 SanFranciscoZionist

East Bay now! And I thought ‘crop’ was some kind of building defect!

XDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXD

236 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:09:23pm

re: #225 WindUpBird

I dunno, there’s that german who agreed to it

and my fava beans are just sprouting…

237 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:09:38pm

re: #229 brookly red

but what if they really, really want to be eaten?

Catholics don’t prohibit it in extreme circumstances, so volunteers would be best. (Don’t eat the brains and spinal tissues—produces Koro, a BSE-like disease.)

238 compound idaho  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:10:22pm

re: #194 WindUpBird

I think the point is, a private school does not have a duty to accept everyone, a private school CAN be choosy, if they wish. Some are, some aren’t.

Public school does.

You are not wrong. However, at one time, Mrs Compound was leading the Lutheran school. My best man held a similar position at the Catholic school and a close friend was the director at the local Montessori school. All very dedicated volunteers. I find the presumption that these people do not care for the education of our young people, all of them, in the same way as a paid professional insulting. We all need to be careful about assuming too much.

PS The Catholic school had a hell of a time getting rid of an incompetent teacher. No union involved. It is particularly tough to deal with the politics when you sit next to them in the pew Sunday morning.

239 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:12:05pm

re: #237 Decatur Deb

Catholics don’t prohibit it in extreme circumstances, so volunteers would be best. (Don’t eat the brains and spinal tissues—produces Koro, a BSE-like disease.)

even if cooked throughly?

240 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:12:27pm

re: #238 compound idaho

Before Vatican II, most Catholic school staffs were nuns or brothers—ultimate volunteers. Ours were very highly trained.

241 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:13:18pm

re: #233 WindUpBird

I prefer the poser chinese food at my karaoke bar :D

infidel

242 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:13:33pm

re: #217 Decatur Deb

Doubleknit polyester blends.

Polyester blends are fine (in God’s eyes, not necessarily in mine). The only combination that’s forbidden is wool and linen. For convenience’s sake, the principle is not extended, as it is in some areas.

243 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:14:21pm

re: #218 Sergey Romanov

They’re allowed is all that matters.

Not around here. And Dina d’malchut dina. (The law of the land is law.)

244 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:15:48pm

re: #222 celticdragon

I hope you just forgot the snark tag.

I thought it would be unnecessary.

re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist

Would I want to live in the cultures described in the Bible? As tempting as certain aspects of it might be from a religious or historical standpoint, no. They didn’t have penicillin, or enough women’s rights, or chocolate, or Chinese food. Except in China, but you get the idea.

Well I suppose there might be some cultures from around that time I wouldn’t mind living in, from a cultural standpoint. But most from the Bible aren’t my cup of tea. Some places in ancient Greece or Rome as a non-slave would have been interesting. Various places in India, Asia, etc.

245 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:15:52pm

Soooo, what’s for dinner?

246 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:16:24pm

re: #239 brookly red

even if cooked throughly?

Yeah—the pathology is linked to very small molecules, not destroyed by heat. The book for it is “The Virus That Ate Cannibals”. Anthropologists need to question their hosts very gently about the menu.

[Link: www.amazon.com…]

247 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:16:29pm

re: #230 Simply Sarah

Well, except they had real Chinese food in China, not Chinese food Chinese food!

THat’s OK!

248 researchok  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:16:55pm

re: #245 brookly red

Sooo, what’s for dinner?

Burrito.

A Macho Burrito.

249 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:17:01pm

re: #243 SanFranciscoZionist

Not around here. And Dina d’malchut dina. (The law of the land is law.)

Which is not a Biblical principle. So another incompatibility :P

250 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:17:28pm

re: #242 SanFranciscoZionist

Ah. Knew the theology, not the textiles.

251 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:17:39pm

re: #246 Decatur Deb

Yeah—the pathology is linked to very small molecules, not destroyed by heat. The book for it is “The Virus That Ate Cannibals”. Anthropologists need to question their hosts very gently about the menu.

[Link: www.amazon.com…]

ehhh, that’s OK I only like the legs and breasts any way…

252 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:18:07pm

re: #237 Decatur Deb

Catholics don’t prohibit it in extreme circumstances, so volunteers would be best. (Don’t eat the brains and spinal tissues—produces Koro, a BSE-like disease.)

I assume, however, that the people you eat in extreme circumstances must have already frozen to death or whatever? Volunteering to die for purposes of getting eaten seems to violate other regulations of the Church.

253 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:18:55pm

re: #243 SanFranciscoZionist

Then of course there is a whole slew of other minor laws, like levirate, testing women for adultery, etc.

254 celticdragon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:19:24pm

re: #244 prononymous

I thought it would be unnecessary.

re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist

Well I suppose there might be some cultures from around that time I wouldn’t mind living in, from a cultural standpoint. But most from the Bible aren’t my cup of tea. Some places in ancient Greece or Rome as a non-slave would have been interesting. Various places in India, Asia, etc.

You can never be sure these days. I didn’t think I would read of a deputy DA calling for the mass murder of union protesters.

255 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:19:46pm

re: #252 SanFranciscoZionist

I assume, however, that the people you eat in extreme circumstances must have already frozen to death or whatever? Volunteering to die for purposes of getting eaten seems to violate other regulations of the Church.

Don’t think so—the purpose would be self-sacrifice, not suicide. You’re allowed to jump on a granade.

256 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:20:16pm

re: #255 Decatur Deb

PIMF “grenade”

257 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:20:26pm

re: #243 SanFranciscoZionist

Not around here. And Dina d’malchut dina. (The law of the land is law.)

Also, since the tenth century, the Ashkenazim have had a ban on polygamy.

258 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:21:28pm

Voluntary post-mortem cannibalism? Is that from Germany?

//

259 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:21:30pm

re: #257 SanFranciscoZionist

Also, since the tenth century, the Ashkenazim have had a ban on polygamy.

Even in 19th century Utah?

260 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:21:38pm

re: #244 prononymous

I thought it would be unnecessary.

re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist

Well I suppose there might be some cultures from around that time I wouldn’t mind living in, from a cultural standpoint. But most from the Bible aren’t my cup of tea. Some places in ancient Greece or Rome as a non-slave would have been interesting. Various places in India, Asia, etc.

We used to discuss, in college, times and places you would have liked to live. I opted to be a nineteenth century Californio, but only if I got to be male, Catholic, and Spanish. And of good natural health.

261 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:21:57pm

“I hear it’s really popular in Berlin.”

/

262 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:22:22pm

re: #249 Sergey Romanov

Which is not a Biblical principle. So another incompatibility :P

That’s the problem. I have trouble seeing the text in isolation, the way many Protestants do.

263 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:22:29pm

re: #257 SanFranciscoZionist

Also, since the tenth century, the Ashkenazim have had a ban on polygamy.

Good call!/

The Bible still allows it though.

264 Simply Sarah  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:22:51pm

re: #255 Decatur Deb

Don’t think so—the purpose would be self-sacrifice, not suicide. You’re allowed to jump on a granade.

I dunno. With a grenade, the it is the act of self-sacrifice that is killing you, rather than killing yourself in an act of self-sacrifice. I mean, I’m not exactly a canon law scholar, but I think the subtle difference may be enough to make one OK and the other not.

265 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:22:54pm

re: #262 SanFranciscoZionist

That’s the problem. I have trouble seeing the text in isolation, the way many Protestants do.

Isolation from what?

266 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:23:38pm

re: #259 Decatur Deb

Even in 19th century Utah?

I don’t expect Mormons to return to polygamy when it is allowed ;)

267 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:24:35pm

re: #253 Sergey Romanov

Then of course there is a whole slew of other minor laws, like levirate, testing women for adultery, etc.

Well, you’d need a Cohen for the Sotah ritual. Which was outlawed in the First century anyway, and possibly never performed before then. (Dang. Not being literal, ahistorical or acontextual enough again.)

268 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:25:07pm

re: #264 Simply Sarah

I dunno. With a grenade, the it is the act of self-sacrifice that is killing you, rather than killing yourself in an act of self-sacrifice. I mean, I’m not exactly a canon law scholar, but I think the subtle difference may be enough to make one OK and the other not.

I’ve mercifully forgotten the Jesuitical causuitry that got me there, but the simple answer is to kill and eat the atheist, for the good of his soul.

269 compound idaho  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:25:33pm

re: #226 justaminute

I saw this post today and thought you might like it. A teacher was told by a Walker supporter that she was a glorified babysitter, she wrote a reply:

Are you sick of highly paid teachers? Teachers’ hefty salaries are driving up taxes, and they only work 9 or10 months a year! It’s time we put things in perspective and pay them for what they do - babysit!

We can get that for less than minimum wage.

That’s right. Let’s give them $3.00 an hour and only the hours they worked; not any of that silly planning time, or any time they spend before or after school. That would be $19.50 a day (7:45 to 3:00 PM with 45 min. off for lunch and plan— that equals 6 1/2 hours).

Each parent should pay $19.50 a day for these teachers to baby-sit their children. Now how many students do they teach in a day…maybe 30? So that’s $19.50 x 30 = $585.00 a day.
However, remember they only work 180 days a year!!! I am not going to pay them for any vacations.
That’s $585 X 180= $105,300 per year. Hm.

What about those special education teachers and the ones with Master’s degrees? Well, we could pay them minimum wage ($7.75), and just to be fair, round it off to $8.00 an hour. That would be $8 X 6 1/2 hours X 30 children X 180 days = $280,800 per year.
Wait a minute — there’s something wrong here! There sure is! The average teacher’s salary (nation wide) is $50,000. $50,000/180 days = $277.77/per day/30
students=$9.25/6.5 hours = $1.42 per hour per student—a very inexpensive baby-sitter and they even EDUCATE your kids!) WHAT A DEAL!!!

Public school teachers do alright. The US average teacher salary is $ 49,630. For a household made up of two teachers (weakest part of the argument), that income places them in the top quintile of all US households ($88K). They receive a good benefit package and 15 weeks off each year. Compared to private school teachers, they rock. Compared to all Bachelor’s degrees not so much but still not too bad. Besides a degree in teaching is not as rigorous as math, physics, or engineering. To those earning the median household income of $52K a household income of $90K seems like a lot of money.
[Link: nces.ed.gov…]

270 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:26:05pm

re: #267 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, you’d need a Cohen for the Sotah ritual. Which was outlawed in the First century anyway, and possibly never performed before then. (Dang. Not being literal, ahistorical or acontextual enough again.)

Well, the Bible didn’t outlaw it and we’re discussing the Bible, not later changes in one of the religions following the Bible.

271 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:26:40pm

re: #260 SanFranciscoZionist

We used to discuss, in college, times and places you would have liked to live. I opted to be a nineteenth century Californio, but only if I got to be male, Catholic, and Spanish. And of good natural health.

You are picky. Lol.

In those circumstances I prefer to frame it as “Where would I go if I was a time traveler from now”. Because at least I’d still know about leavers, gears, hydraulics, etc. The second obvious question following usually being “what would I do to change history”.

272 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:27:30pm

re: #271 prononymous

You are picky. Lol.

In those circumstances I prefer to frame it as “Where would I go if I was a time traveler from now”. Because at least I’d still know about leavers, gears, hydraulics, etc. The second obvious question following usually being “what would I do to change history”.

There are severe penalties for time travelers who try to kill Hitler.

273 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:27:38pm

re: #268 Decatur Deb

I’ve mercifully forgotten the Jesuitical causuitry that got me there, but the simple answer is to kill and eat the atheist, for the good of his soul.

I prefer Presbyterians myself.

274 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:27:40pm

re: #259 Decatur Deb

Even in 19th century Utah?

Yes. Any Ashkenazim in nineteenth century Utah would still have been required to stick to a single wife, regardless of what the Gentiles might be doing. Of course, the question of who gets to be called Gentiles in this case is a rather tricky one…

Ashkenazim still accept the ruling of Rabbenu Gershenon (the Light of the Tenth Century, as he is fondly known), banning polygamy. Sephardim, Mizrahim, Italkim, etc., don’t accept the ban, although plural marriage is almost unheard of in the Jewish world these days.

275 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:28:40pm

re: #265 Sergey Romanov

Isolation from what?

Commentary, rulings, history, Gemara, midrash, interpretations…

276 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:29:05pm

re: #267 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, you’d need a Cohen for the Sotah ritual. Which was outlawed in the First century anyway, and possibly never performed before then. (Dang. Not being literal, ahistorical or acontextual enough again.)

It’s like discussing whether or not the original Mormon practices would be compatible with today’s society and pointing out that they eventually outlawed polygamy. True, but this outlawing was not the part of the original practices (and went opposite to them, since polygamy was thought of as the eternal principle of celestial marriage etc.).

277 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:29:38pm

re: #272 Decatur Deb

There are severe penalties for time travelers who try to kill Hitler.

[Link: www.viruscomix.com…]

278 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:29:46pm

re: #270 Sergey Romanov

Well, the Bible didn’t outlaw it and we’re discussing the Bible, not later changes in one of the religions following the Bible.

You’re still gonna need a Cohen, I think.

279 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:30:49pm

Good evening, all. Productive day at work saw me get a deal in, but I have to do some research tonight. So if I drop out of a conversation, it may be because I’m doing research.

280 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:31:20pm

re: #276 Sergey Romanov

It’s like discussing whether or not the original Mormon practices would be compatible with today’s society and pointing out that they eventually outlawed polygamy. True, but this outlawing was not the part of the original practices (and went opposite to them, since polygamy was thought of as the eternal principle of celestial marriage etc.).

Well yes, but the fact remains that they did outlaw it. So we could discuss whether it might come back, but the change in the religion did actually happen.

281 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:32:15pm

re: #269 compound idaho

Public school teachers do alright. The US average teacher salary is $ 49,630. For a household made up of two teachers (weakest part of the argument), that income places them in the top quintile of all US households ($88K). They receive a good benefit package and 15 weeks off each year. Compared to private school teachers, they rock. Compared to all Bachelor’s degrees not so much but still not too bad. Besides a degree in teaching is not as rigorous as math, physics, or engineering. To those earning the median household income of $52K a household income of $90K seems like a lot of money.
[Link: nces.ed.gov…]

A few nights ago, I said that Alabama teachers started at 42,000. That was wrong—that money would be somewhat above average. Speaking of which, my daughter has just found she was the National Teacher of the Year for this professional organization:

[Link: www.npjs.org…]

On the down side, she was mildly maced by a corrections officer during a minor scuffle yesterday.

282 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:33:25pm

re: #281 Decatur Deb

A few nights ago, I said that Alabama teachers started at 42,000. That was wrong—that money would be somewhat above average. Speaking of which, my daughter has just found she was the National Teacher of the Year for this professional organization:

[Link: www.npjs.org…]

On the down side, she was mildly maced by a corrections officer during a minor scuffle yesterday.

corrections?

283 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:34:09pm

re: #275 SanFranciscoZionist

Commentary, rulings, history, Gemara, midrash, interpretations…

They may be useful. But if the set topic of the discussion is how the modern society is compatible with the Bible then whatever happened after the Bible was written (like later abandonment of certain practices) cannot in principle be relevant.

284 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:35:01pm

Hmm. Another guy from “Deadliest Catch” died.

285 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:35:36pm

Hanging out with a good friend in my hotel room. Mind if he joins in the conversation?

Friends? Met my good friend, Captain Morgan.

286 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:35:51pm

re: #280 SanFranciscoZionist

Well yes, but the fact remains that they did outlaw it. So we could discuss whether it might come back, but the change in the religion did actually happen.

But if the topic of the discussion is about the compatibility of the original practices, then the fact of the changes actually shows that they were incompatible with the contemporary society. So yes, this proves my point :P

287 compound idaho  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:36:01pm

re: #281 Decatur Deb

As I looked up the numbers, apart from the issue of teacher pay, the part that honestly surprised me was how little the average American get by on.

288 avanti  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:36:05pm

This explains why the rich need more wealth distribution and tax breaks/:

Wealth.

“• According to this chart, most income groups have barely grown richer since 1979. But the top 1 percent has seen its income nearly quadruple:”

289 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:36:12pm

re: #282 brookly red

corrections?

She’s one of the 3 teachers in a serious youth jail. (English and Bio). She spends her time making little druggies, murderers and rapists really care about Wuthering Heights.

290 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:36:33pm

the guy on the radio is saying that Libya has brought in a bunch of mercenaries… me thinks this will not end well.

291 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:37:04pm

re: #277 prononymous

[Link: www.viruscomix.com…]

That is absolutely brilliant.

292 Simply Sarah  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:37:30pm

re: #289 Decatur Deb

She’s one of the 3 teachers in a serious youth jail. (English and Bio). She spends her time making little druggies, murderers and rapists really care about Wuthering Heights.

But…that’s cruel and unusual!
/maybe

293 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:37:51pm

re: #290 brookly red

Ya think?

294 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:37:59pm

re: #278 SanFranciscoZionist

You’re still gonna need a Cohen, I think.

A priest, that is. There are lots.

295 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:38:10pm

re: #277 prononymous

[Link: www.viruscomix.com…]

And then came Christine O’Donnell…

/

296 sizzleRI  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:38:33pm

re: #269 compound idaho

Public school teachers do alright. The US average teacher salary is $ 49,630. For a household made up of two teachers (weakest part of the argument), that income places them in the top quintile of all US households ($88K). They receive a good benefit package and 15 weeks off each year. Compared to private school teachers, they rock. Compared to all Bachelor’s degrees not so much but still not too bad. Besides a degree in teaching is not as rigorous as math, physics, or engineering. To those earning the median household income of $52K a household income of $90K seems like a lot of money.
[Link: nces.ed.gov…]

Except for math and physics teachers. Like my roommate whose primary degree is in math and takes a huge pay cut every day she enters her high school to teach.

297 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:38:47pm

re: #61 Fozzie Bear

He is on a different level from most other wingnuts. I like him. My gut says he’s just not a bad guy. But he also scares the shit out of me. Does anybody else feel that way about him?

The fact that he’s likable is what makes him dangerous. The guy’s a full-blown theocrat, but he also has that whole “aw, shucks” vibe, which makes people want to like him.

Screw that. He’s a raving religious loon. Thanks, but no.

298 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:39:15pm

re: #289 Decatur Deb

She’s one of the 3 teachers in a serious youth jail. (English and Bio). She spends her time making little druggies, murderers and rapists really care about Wuthering Heights.

no disrespect to her, but perhaps vocational skills might be more beneficial?

299 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:39:40pm

re: #277 prononymous

[Link: www.viruscomix.com…]

Ahahah!

300 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:39:45pm

re: #269 compound idaho

School administrators make a freakin’ bundle.

301 sproingie  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:40:13pm

re: #21 EastSider

How does this jive with the “you can’t make us by healthcare.” meme?

Lawdy, lawdy, lawdy, why do people insist on every attempting to find rationality and consistency with these people? Calling them out on hypocrisy simply does not WORK. When they scream about their freedoms, they are making noises for the occasion, not attempting to establish some sort of factual basis for future argument.

You are reading poetry to pigs. You are playing chess and they are playing checkers.

302 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:41:14pm

re: #290 brookly red

the guy on the radio is saying that Libya has brought in a bunch of mercenaries… me thinks this will not end well.

He’s been involved in other African nations for decades, and he’s been using his oil money to buy mercs. He’s not going quietly, he’s gonna have to go feet first.

303 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:41:35pm

re: #293 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Ya think?

yeah kinda…see the thing about mercenaries is they don’t have a conscious issue with slaughter, while the homegrown military might.

304 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:42:48pm

re: #298 brookly red

no disrespect to her, but perhaps vocational skills might be more beneficial?

That might involve sharp objects. Her task is to keep them on the academic track they were following, in case they get out. Most do, or move on to permanent prison after sentencing.

305 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:43:37pm

Oh buoy…

Lawsuit alleges solar projects would harm sacred Native American sites

Native American group and its allies sue to stop six solar facilities from being built in the Southern California desert, arguing that they would impact treasured geoglyphs, burial sites and relics…

306 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:43:44pm

re: #301 sproingie

Lawdy, lawdy, lawdy, why do people insist on every attempting to find rationality and consistency with these people? Calling them out on hypocrisy simply does not WORK. When they scream about their freedoms, they are making noises for the occasion, not attempting to establish some sort of factual basis for future argument.

You are reading poetry to pigs. You are playing chess and they are playing checkers.

Yep, that’s the Dems all right. >:D

307 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:44:44pm

re: #296 sizzleRI

Except for math and physics teachers. Like my roommate whose primary degree is in math and takes a huge pay cut every day she enters her high school to teach.

Even in Alabama, a career teacher is expected to have a Master’s.

308 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:47:14pm

re: #281 Decatur Deb

A few nights ago, I said that Alabama teachers started at 42,000. That was wrong—that money would be somewhat above average. Speaking of which, my daughter has just found she was the National Teacher of the Year for this professional organization:

[Link: www.npjs.org…]

On the down side, she was mildly maced by a corrections officer during a minor scuffle yesterday.

The money is not terrible. It’s not great, but most districts will pay middle-class money—it’s basically what you might get for being an office administrator in a not-too-chichi company. Most districts have reasonably good benefits. I have never been dissatisfied with the money I’ve made teaching. It’s enough to live on, and none of my interests were going to lead me into really high-paying fields.

What gets teachers up in arms is a combination of the hystrionic attacks on teachers’ unions, the endless blame game, the fantasies about the legions of bad teachers getting away with stuff, and the whining that teachers don’t really care about The Children if they try to negotiate a pay raise or a 401k for themselves.

We’re well-trained professionals. We could make the same money or better elsewhere for less work and less stress. Most teachers teach because they want to. But being treated like shit by politicians is not fun.

309 justaminute  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:47:23pm

I have to wonder with all the stink about teacher wages; what makes anyone want to enter the profession? My son has graduated college and my daughter will graduate college in the fall 2011. All their friends and our friends kids have gone to college and not one (estimate 50) wanted to enter the teaching profession.

310 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:47:24pm

re: #281 Decatur Deb

A few nights ago, I said that Alabama teachers started at 42,000. That was wrong—that money would be somewhat above average. Speaking of which, my daughter has just found she was the National Teacher of the Year for this professional organization:

[Link: www.npjs.org…]

On the down side, she was mildly maced by a corrections officer during a minor scuffle yesterday.

And I’m sorry about the macing.

311 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:47:38pm

re: #303 brookly red

Seriously. 10 years ago, I wanted the Middle East leveled.

Today, I’m praying like heck for the brave folks who are standing up to the “leadership”.

My, how things change…

312 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:47:49pm

re: #303 brookly red

yeah kinda…see the thing about mercenaries is they don’t have a conscious issue with slaughter, while the homegrown military might.

Depends on the mercs. Some might avoid ‘murder missions’, but I wouldn’t expect that of anyone who’d hire on with a monster like Gadaffi.

313 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:47:50pm

re: #283 Sergey Romanov

They may be useful. But if the set topic of the discussion is how the modern society is compatible with the Bible then whatever happened after the Bible was written (like later abandonment of certain practices) cannot in principle be relevant.

Perhaps, but I think the set topic is rather silly.

314 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:48:37pm

re: #287 compound idaho

As I looked up the numbers, apart from the issue of teacher pay, the part that honestly surprised me was how little the average American get by on.

I do have to remind myself when I look at those things that I live in an incredibly expensive area, particularly in terms of housing.

315 Bubblehead II  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:49:03pm

re: #284 Gus 802

Hmm. Another guy from “Deadliest Catch” died.

It’s a rough profession. Untreated/ignored injuries can come back to haunt or kill you. Being a tough Guy can, end the end, be fatal,

316 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:49:09pm

re: #294 Sergey Romanov

To elaborate: “kohen” is an all-purpose designation in the Bible. It doesn’t have the same very specific meaning “Cohen” now does in Judaism, i.e. purported descendants of Aaron. Melchizedek was a “kohen”, so was Potipherah, priest of On. So the passage in Num. 5 can be easily applied even if descendants of Aaron are lacking ;)

317 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:49:23pm

re: #312 Dark_Falcon

Depends on the mercs. Some might avoid ‘murder missions’, but I wouldn’t expect that of anyone who’d hire on with a monster like Gadaffi.

You hire on with Gadaffi for one reason. You want to taste blood of innocents.

318 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:49:33pm

re: #298 brookly red

no disrespect to her, but perhaps vocational skills might be more beneficial?

They don’t normally hire you and ask what you’d like to teach.

319 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:51:01pm

re: #313 SanFranciscoZionist

Perhaps, but I think the set topic is rather silly.

OK, you asked (#140), I replied in the way I see it. I agree that it’s nothing in the end.

320 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:51:58pm

re: #317 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You hire on with Gadaffi for one reason. You want to taste blood of innocents.

True, but the money does also play a role. Sadly, the long wars of places like Chad have left in their wake a number of men without roots who don’t have a problem with killing. And those can easily be the worst sort of mercenary.

321 Bubblehead II  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:52:02pm

re: #285 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hanging out with a good friend in my hotel room. Mind if he joins in the conversation?

Friends? Met my good friend, Captain Morgan.

Is he spiced? If so, meet my good friend, Crown Royal.

Sounds like we are both getting drunk.

322 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:52:03pm

re: #308 SanFranciscoZionist

re: #309 justaminute

That’s why a lot of teachers don’t stay with it long enough to make those obscenely adequate salaries. Daughter quit the “normal” county school system after her second trip to the emergency room.

323 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:52:12pm

re: #309 justaminute

My son went to college with the idea of teaching. Several of his friends got into teaching and GOT OUT OF IT WITHIN TWO YEARS LIKE THEIR HAIR WAS ON FIRE!

He said…”On second thought?”…

And it wasn’t the money that made them run.

324 Simply Sarah  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:53:34pm

re: #323 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My son went to college with the idea of teaching. Several of his friends got into teaching and GOT OUT OF IT WITHIN TWO YEARS LIKE THEIR HAIR WAS ON FIRE!

He said…”On second thought?”…

And it wasn’t the money that made them run.

Teaching is rough. Most people don’t seem to appreciate what goes into it. All many seem to see are lazy teachers who must be pulling six figures to slack off all day.

325 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:53:48pm

E.P.A. Scales Back Emissions Rules for Industry

Responding to a changed political climate and a court-ordered deadline, the Obama administration issued significantly revised new air pollution rules on Wednesday that will make it easier for operators of thousands of industrial boilers and incinerators to meet federal air quality standards…

326 sizzleRI  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:53:53pm

re: #307 Decatur Deb

Even in Alabama, a career teacher is expected to have a Master’s.

Here in Massachusetts you have to have one within 5 years of teaching. My roommate is attending Harvard for hers now. Which will have to be paid back with her crazy high salary of course.

And your daughter sounds absolutely awesome.

327 austin_blue  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:55:08pm

I was taught by nuns in Elementary school (most of it, anyway). Easy to keep costs down if you’ve got 50 kids in a class and the teacher is making food, board, and a small stipend.

328 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:55:35pm

re: #319 Sergey Romanov

The truth IMHO is that even most of the last century’s standard are incompatible with the modern Western world. What to say then about the world as it was thousands of years ago!

329 Robert O.  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:56:44pm

This article merely confirms what I have long theorized. The GOP, broadly, consists of two factions, the religious faction and the libertarian faction. Ordinarily, there is no reason to believe these two groups have anything in common. Indeed, I suspect most of the religious folks would wholeheartedly support public education if religious indoctrination was part of the curriculum. The religious freak show is angry because the power of secular government vs the power of religious authority is a zero-sum game. Nowhere is this dichotomy more evident than in the failing states of the Muslim world - like in Pakistan, where successive secular governments have failed to provide basic necessities for their people. It is in this void that religious institutions step in. After all, if education is not provided by the State, then churches and mosques must provide it. Where religion advances, civil society retreats. It is no coincidence that religious participation is lowest in the countries where secular governments function - e.g., most of Europe, Canada, Japan, etc. The rate of religious participation is highest in Third World countries with the lowest socioeconomic statistics. Religion is nothing more than a power game predicated on the gullibility of the superstitious.

330 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:57:18pm

re: #305 Gus 802

Oh buoy…

Lawsuit alleges solar projects would harm sacred Native American sites

As a lefty, I just gotta say that’s not their land any more. I’m still pissed they bulldozed all the orchards to put up housing tracts in my valley, but you just have to move along.

331 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:58:13pm

In the UK teachers don’t need a masters - and if they have sufficient vocational qualifications or have been through teacher training programs they don’t always need a degree.

332 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 5:58:14pm

[Link: www.bbc.co.uk…]

A former Serbian chief of police has been jailed for 27 years for his role in the murder of more than 700 ethnic Albanians in Kosovo in 1999.

Another hero of the ultra-conservatives goes down.

333 Interesting Times  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:00:31pm

re: #325 Gus 802

E.P.A. Scales Back Emissions Rules for Industry

In related news, the measure was heartily endorsed by surgical mask makers.

334 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:00:58pm

re: #330 mracb

As a lefty, I just gotta say that’s not their land any more. I’m still pissed they bulldozed all the orchards to put up housing tracts in my valley, but you just have to move along.

Or mitigate. Build them a monument of sorts. Technically speaking most every square inch of this Earth is sacred site. Still, if we couldn’t build in the vicinity of every sacred site we’d never advance as a civilization. The solar energy production is more important in the general scheme of things.

335 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:01:28pm

re: #329 Robert O.

You put so much thought into a post. Then, you call religious people “idiots”. Working on the offensive? You’re doing well.

336 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:01:39pm

re: #311 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Seriously. 10 years ago, I wanted the Middle East leveled.

Today, I’m praying like heck for the brave folks who are standing up to the “leadership”.

My, how things change…

History will be kind to Bush. I know that is not popular here & yes there are issues… but once people taste freedom you can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

337 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:03:10pm

re: #332 Sergey Romanov

[Link: www.bbc.co.uk…]

Another hero of the ultra-conservatives goes down.

Hero of the Stalkers, truth to tell. Rodan is sure to be angry over this, since one of his murderous idols just got justice. He’ll claim the judges “kowtowed to Islam”.

[waves to the Stalkers]

338 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:04:00pm

re: #331 wozzablog

In the UK teachers don’t need a masters - and if they have sufficient vocational qualifications or have been through teacher training programs they don’t always need a degree.

It’s hard to generalize with 50+ state systems, but we have some back-door programs like one designed to turn veteran soldiers into teachers. Eventually almost everyone would shoot for a (devalued?) degree.

339 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:04:13pm

re: #337 Dark_Falcon

I added “ultra” so as not to smear conservatives in general.

340 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:05:13pm

re: #337 Dark_Falcon

Hero of the Stalkers, truth to tell. Rodan is sure to be angry over this, since one of his murderous idols just got justice. He’ll claim the judges “kowtowed to Islam”.

[waves to the Stalkers]

27 years for 700 hundred lives… kind of a slap on the wrist.

341 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:05:45pm

re: #339 Sergey Romanov

I added “ultra” so as not to smear conservatives in general.

the drone has been recalled.

342 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:06:01pm

re: #333 publicityStunted

In related news, the measure was heartily endorsed by surgical mask makers.

Right. It was scaled back though and not scraped. So the emissions rules will still be stricter than they are now although not as much as first proposed.

343 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:06:45pm

re: #341 brookly red

the drone has been recalled.

That’s why I like old-fashioned tube artillery.

344 austin_blue  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:07:14pm

re: #336 brookly red

History will be kind to Bush. I know that is not popular here & yes there are issues… but once people taste freedom you can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

Meh, We’ll see. if North Africa and the ME devolve into utter chaos, not so much. Americans, as a rule, simply have no idea how carbon dependent our society is. If there was a significant, long-term decrease in crude output, we would all starve in the dark. Literally.

345 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:07:18pm

re: #340 brookly red

27 years for 700 hundred lives… kind of a slap on the wrist.

How about 4.5 years for hundreds of thousands lives?

[Link: www1.jur.uva.nl…]

346 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:07:42pm

re: #323 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My son went to college with the idea of teaching. Several of his friends got into teaching and GOT OUT OF IT WITHIN TWO YEARS LIKE THEIR HAIR WAS ON FIRE!

He said…”On second thought?”…

And it wasn’t the money that made them run.

It’s a really, really hard job. And people are really, really judgmental about teachers. Even other teachers.

347 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:08:25pm

re: #345 Sergey Romanov

Forgot to add: he was a commandant.

348 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:09:09pm

re: #330 mracb

As a lefty, I just gotta say that’s not their land any more. I’m still pissed they bulldozed all the orchards to put up housing tracts in my valley, but you just have to move along.

wow a liberal dilemma… the rights of the poor and oppressed or green energy. I feel your pain.

349 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:09:12pm

re: #340 brookly red

27 years for 700 hundred lives… kind of a slap on the wrist.

He’s 62. So he’ll get out when he’s 89. If he makes it.

350 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:09:31pm

re: #336 brookly red

History will be kind to Bush. I know that is not popular here & yes there are issues… but once people taste freedom you can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

I agree that Bush will be treated kinder by history than he might otherwise have been - that will largely come from the spectacle the GOP became after he left though (next to Palin, et.al).

The freedom thing though - many of the images from the Egyptian protests…..Bush?. Not so much,

[Link: blackwaterdog.wordpress.com…]

351 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:10:50pm

re: #337 Dark_Falcon

Hero of the Stalkers, truth to tell. Rodan is sure to be angry over this, since one of his murderous idols just got justice. He’ll claim the judges “kowtowed to Islam”.

[waves to the Stalkers]

Pathetic, the way they’re going back and trying to rewrite history.

352 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:10:52pm

re: #344 austin_blue

Meh, We’ll see. if North Africa and the ME devolve into utter chaos, not so much. Americans, as a rule, simply have no idea how carbon dependent our society is. If there was a significant, long-term decrease in crude output, we would all starve in the dark. Literally.

well we could drill here, I can survive the downdings…

353 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:11:05pm

Tweeted earlier just for my imaginary audience and to create butthurt with the usual suspects.

354 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:11:21pm

re: #352 brookly red

well we could drill here, I can survive the downdings…

It’s not the drilling - it’s the refinery capacity.

355 Skeetghazi  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:11:39pm

re: #346 SanFranciscoZionist

It’s a really, really hard job. And people are really, really judgmental about teachers. Even other teachers.

My housemate=special Ed @ public HS. I see it. They went to union rally yesterday.

356 laZardo  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:11:43pm

Driveby post before I head off to college:

For the record, whenever I see articles like these I am reminded not to consider retracting the things I’ve said about conservatives in articles past.

Have a good day, everyone.

357 CarleeCork  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:12:05pm

re: #351 SanFranciscoZionist

Pathetic, the way they’re going back and trying to rewrite history.


Trying? They’re doing it; look at the Texas BOE.

358 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:12:16pm

re: #352 brookly red

well we could drill here, I can survive the downdings…

We do drill here.

359 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:12:23pm

re: #354 wozzablog

It’s not the drilling - it’s the refinery capacity.

that too

360 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:13:03pm

re: #357 CarleeCork

Trying? They’re doing it; look at the Texas BOE.

Well, yes. I was specifically talking about the stalkers and their love affair with nominally-Christian mass murderers.

361 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:13:47pm

re: #352 brookly red

well we could drill here, I can survive the downdings…

We will, sooner or later. I’d rather drill our oil for 400.00 per barrel than 100.00.

362 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:14:11pm

re: #358 SanFranciscoZionist

We do drill here.

(insert something about the view of the Kennedy’s yachts, or some such)

363 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:14:41pm

If anyone is watching “Modern Family”. I’d love to get my hair cut by Sofia Vergara.

364 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:15:01pm

re: #361 Decatur Deb

We will, sooner or later. I’d rather drill our oil for 400.00 per barrel than 100.00.

shut up!

365 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:15:14pm

re: #361 Decatur Deb

We will, sooner or later. I’d rather drill our oil for 400.00 per barrel than 100.00.

You do realise at that point Americans will then have to start paying realistic prices for petrol?

366 austin_blue  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:15:20pm

re: #352 brookly red

well we could drill here, I can survive the downdings…

Good idea! We have two percent of world reserves, most of it extremely difficult to produce. With a five-year timeline from the first exploration well to actually producing significant quantities from a new play, that would leave us…

Oh, wait. Starving in the dark. Literally.

I’m not going to downding ya, boyo. I just want you to understand the intricacies of energy production.

367 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:15:22pm

I have this crazy idea that if less people drove around in gigantic vehicle and we increased fuel efficiency overall by increasing CAFE standards we wouldn’t have to drill or use as much oil. Yeah, it’s really crazy and radical.

368 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:15:44pm

re: #363 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

If anyone is watching “Modern Family”. I’d love to get my hair cut by Sofia Vergara.

do you have enough hair to matter?

369 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:16:03pm

re: #363 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

If anyone is watching “Modern Family”. I’d love to get my hair cut by Sofia Vergara.

I cut my own. It’s not pretty.

370 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:16:33pm

re: #329 Robert O.

Throwing insults at religion merits a downding.

371 bratwurst  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:16:37pm

re: #366 austin_blue

I’m not going to downding ya, boyo. I just want you to understand the intricacies of energy production.


But right wing platitudes are so much easier.

372 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:16:58pm

re: #368 brookly red

Yep.

373 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:17:09pm

re: #367 Gus 802

I have this crazy idea that if less people drove around in gigantic vehicle and we increased fuel efficiency overall by increasing CAFE standards we wouldn’t have to drill or use as much oil. Yeah, it’s really crazy and radical.

That’s going to have to be the way it will happen.

Subarus 4wd estate car does everything an suv does with 3 times the mileage.

374 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:17:13pm

re: #365 wozzablog

You do realise at that point Americans will then have to start paying realistic prices for petrol?

And I’ll have to put a bullet through my 10 mpg LandRover’s block. Then I’ll convert it to electric.

375 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:17:22pm

Why do you drive around in such a big SUV?

I need it for my kids.

How much do your kids weigh? 400 pounds each?

//

376 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:17:28pm

re: #366 austin_blue

Good idea! We have two percent of world reserves, most of it extremely difficult to produce. With a five-year timeline from the first exploration well to actually producing significant quantities from a new play, that would leave us…

Oh, wait. Starving in the dark. Literally.

I’m not going to downding ya, boyo. I just want you to understand the intricacies of energy production.

I have seen other figures…

377 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:17:43pm

re: #340 brookly red

27 years for 700 hundred lives… kind of a slap on the wrist.

Agreed. He should have gotten life in Supermax, since Europe does not accept capital punishment.

378 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:19:04pm

re: #373 wozzablog

I hate to admit this.

I HATE (with the white hot heat of a million suns) SUBARU DRIVERS!

379 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:19:24pm

re: #375 Gus 802

Why do you drive around in such a big SUV?

I need it for my kids.

How much do your kids weigh? 400 pounds each?

//

Have you seen “The Biggest Loser”?……………

;)

380 Simply Sarah  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:19:42pm

re: #375 Gus 802

Why do you drive around in such a big SUV?

I need it for my kids.

How much do your kids weigh? 400 pounds each?

//

These days? Probably.

381 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:20:03pm

re: #373 wozzablog

That’s going to have to be the way it will happen.

Subarus 4wd estate car does everything an suv does with 3 times the mileage.

Right. Instead some folks want something that may someday be used to tow that cigarette boat they’re going to buy once the hit the lottery. The fact is that these vehicles far exceed the actual use in horsepower, torque, and towing capacity. And by “far exceed” we’re talking a rather humongous factor.

382 prairiefire  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:20:33pm

Crazy amount of threads today!

383 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:21:20pm

re: #378 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I hate to admit this.

I HATE (with the white hot heat of a million suns) SUBARU DRIVERS!

Some of my best friends are subaru drivers.

From the very burly and rather manly construction worker in CO (where the Scubys outclass the generic homegrown suvs on the ice)……….to the lovely texan mom in her Forrester (Forresters are awesome)

:-)

I

384 sagehen  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:21:32pm

re: #260 SanFranciscoZionist

We used to discuss, in college, times and places you would have liked to live. I opted to be a nineteenth century Californio, but only if I got to be male, Catholic, and Spanish. And of good natural health.

Pre-columbian Aztec (of a category not eligible for human sacrifice.)

They had tequila, chocolate, popcorn, cocaine, and clothes made of feathers.

385 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:22:05pm

re: #382 prairiefire

Crazy amount of threads today!

Pull a loose one and watch them unravel……..

386 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:23:56pm

re: #370 Dark_Falcon

Throwing insults at religion merits a downding.

I have a slightly different standard……

Throwing blanket insults at religion merits a downding.

387 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:24:02pm

off to pick up dinner, see ya

388 austin_blue  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:24:46pm

re: #376 brookly red

I have seen other figures…

They’re bullshit. If you are talking about potential oil *equivalents*, like gas and condensates, yeah, it may be a little higher. But crude? Nope. 2%.

And by the way, give me the links on these “other figures”. I used to be a wellhead geologist. I’d love to check the peer reviewed citations.

Get crackin’, boyo! Justify!

389 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:25:13pm

re: #367 Gus 802

I have this crazy idea that if less people drove around in gigantic vehicle and we increased fuel efficiency overall by increasing CAFE standards we wouldn’t have to drill or use as much oil. Yeah, it’s really crazy and radical.

Why do you hate America?

/wingnut

390 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:25:57pm

re: #379 wozzablog

Have you seen “The Biggest Loser”?…

;)

Does glancing at the Stalker Blog count?

391 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:26:03pm

re: #383 wozzablog

Forresters are the worst.

392 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:26:47pm

re: #388 austin_blue

They’re bullshit. If you are talking about potential oil *equivalents*, like gas and condensates, yeah, it may be a little higher. But crude? Nope. 2%.

And by the way, give me the links on these “other figures”. I used to be a wellhead geologist. I’d love to check the peer reviewed citations.

Get crackin’, boyo! Justify!

of course, total bullshit… gosh your so smart :)

393 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:27:06pm

re: #389 Lidane

Why do you hate America?

/wingnut

500 hp vehicles are guaranteed in the Constitution!

/

394 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:27:26pm

re: #338 Decatur Deb

It’s hard to generalize with 50+ state systems, but we have some back-door programs like one designed to turn veteran soldiers into teachers. Eventually almost everyone would shoot for a (devalued?) degree.

Ugh.

Don’t get me started on devalued degrees.

395 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:27:37pm

re: #393 Gus 802

500 hp vehicles are guaranteed in the Constitution!

/

FREE MARKETS SOLVE EVERYTHING!!!11ty!!1!!1

/Luap Nor

396 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:27:48pm

re: #345 Sergey Romanov

How about 4.5 years for hundreds of thousands lives?

[Link: www1.jur.uva.nl…]

BTW, this guy can be seen here at around 4:50.

397 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:27:57pm

re: #390 Dark_Falcon

Does glancing at the Stalker Blog count?


meeow.

398 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:28:40pm

re: #386 wozzablog

I have a slightly different standard…

Well, he did throw a blanket insult. And I don’t downdig over a simple criticism. But what that guy was doing was in insulting religion in general as religious people as well. As I count myself as a believer, I viewd his post as an insult and dinged accordingly.

399 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:28:41pm

A well oiled recreational vehicle industry being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and drive 500 hp SUVs and trucks shall not be infringed.

400 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:29:26pm

re: #391 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Forresters are the worst.

Why do you hate american moms, orphans and apple pie?……………

;)

401 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:29:50pm

SUVs don’t use oil. People use oil.

/

402 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:30:21pm

Um. Footnote. I’m not some anti-SUV nut. Just sayin’.

403 Targetpractice  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:31:18pm

re: #401 Gus 802

SUVs don’t use oil. People use oil.

/

Who needs oil? I ride the bus!

/

404 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:31:18pm

re: #400 wozzablog

Why do you hate american moms, orphans and apple pie?…

;)

and filthy nasty failed hippies who ALL drive ten to fifteen miles UNDER the FUCKING speed limit EVERYWHERE they FUCKING go.

405 austin_blue  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:31:26pm

re: #392 brookly red

of course, total bullshit… gosh your so smart :)

It’s “you’re”.

Knowing English is important.

406 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:32:05pm

re: #398 Dark_Falcon

Well, he did throw a blanket insult. And I don’t downdig over a simple criticism. But what that guy was doing was in insulting religion in general as religious people as well. As I count myself as a believer, I viewd his post as an insult and dinged accordingly.

Mate, I’m not saying he didn’t make a blanket insult.
I respect people of sincere faith and don’t wish them any more offended than anyone else.

407 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:34:26pm

re: #406 wozzablog

Mate, I’m not saying he didn’t make a blanket insult.
I respect people of sincere faith and don’t wish them any more offended than anyone else.

I know, wozza. I’m not irritated with you, not at all.

408 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:34:27pm

re: #403 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Who needs oil? I ride the bus!

/

I knew people who said this, and who suggested that $4 and $5/gallon gasoline didn’t affect them because they take the bus or ride a bike or carpool. I wanted to hit them. Hard.

409 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:35:32pm

re: #403 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Who needs oil? I ride the bus!

/

Everytime you ride the bus a kitten dies.

//

410 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:36:08pm

re: #400 wozzablog

Why do you hate american moms, orphans and apple pie?…

;)

I. HATE. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. OF. THEM. eleventy.

411 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:36:20pm

re: #404 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

and filthy nasty failed hippies who ALL drive ten to fifteen miles UNDER the FUCKING speed limit EVERYWHERE they FUCKING go.

But you have to drive slow to get the most efficient mileage from the hybrid! ZOMG!

///

412 Bubblehead II  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:36:28pm

Lizards, time to call it a day (of lurking).

May the Deity of your choice smile down upon you.

And to the Love of my life a song,

To my Wife (I know you are watching).

413 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:36:37pm

The price of one round trip metro bus ticket can help feed a family of 24 in Sri Lanka for 30 days.

//

414 Targetpractice  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:37:04pm

re: #409 Gus 802

Everytime you ride the bus a kitten dies.

//

And here, all this time, I thought it was another, more…private activity, that killed kittens. This will certainly put my mind to rest!

/

415 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:37:48pm

re: #414 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And here, all this time, I thought it was another, more…private activity, that killed kittens. This will certainly put my mind to rest!

/

Dr. Ruth’s favorite activity.

/

416 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:40:42pm

re: #329 Robert O.

Maaan. I view religion as mostly a negative phenomenon (with varying degrees of negativity). But even for me your conclusions are just sweeping.

417 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:40:52pm

re: #415 Gus 802

Dr. Ruth’s favorite activity.

/

mine too

418 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:43:24pm

G’night y’all.

419 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:44:36pm

Hey, somebody had to cop to it.

420 Targetpractice  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:46:54pm

re: #419 mracb

Hey, somebody had to cop to it.

Yeah, because if we don’t, who will? Christine O’Donnell?

421 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:48:38pm

Small explosion…

Newt Gingrich Affair Questioned By College Student

You adamantly oppose gay rights… but you’ve also been married three times and admitted to having an affair with your current wife while you were still married to your second,”

Isabel Friedman, president of the Penn Democrats, asked Gingrich after a speech at the University of Pennsylvania, according to Politico.

“As a successful politician who’s considering running for president, who would set the bar for moral conduct and be the voice of the American people, how do you reconcile this hypocritical interpretation of the religious values that you so vigorously defend?”

And the Newt responds…

“I’ve had a life which, on occasion, has had problems,” Gingrich said. “I believe in a forgiving God, and the American people will have to decide whether that their primary concern. If the primary concern of the American people is my past, my candidacy would be irrelevant. If the primary concern of the American people is the future… that’s a debate I’ll be happy to have with your candidate or any other candidate if I decide to run.”

422 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:49:23pm

See folks. God will forgive Newt but he won’t forgive gays.

423 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:49:36pm

re: #413 Gus 802

The price of one round trip metro bus ticket can help feed a family of 24 in Sri Lanka for 30 days.

//

don’t laugh it is probably pretty close to true…

424 jaunte  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:50:28pm

re: #421 Gus 802

“It wasn’t me misbehaving, it was my life having problems, and if you don’t forgive me, you’re not being Godly.”

425 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:51:07pm

re: #260 SanFranciscoZionist

We used to discuss, in college, times and places you would have liked to live. I opted to be a nineteenth century Californio, but only if I got to be male, Catholic, and Spanish. And of good natural health.

I would like to have been a teenager in 1981 so i could have seen Pink Floyd perform The Wall live

That’s pretty much the only one I can think of :D

426 Targetpractice  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:51:40pm

re: #421 Gus 802

Small explosion…

Newt Gingrich Affair Questioned By College Student

And the Newt responds…

Gotta love guys like Newt. According to them, God hates gays, abortion, and Democrats that force them to vote instead of leaving early for Christmas. But he’ll forgive them for every mistress they bugger behind their wife’s back.

427 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:52:11pm

re: #421 Gus 802

I believe in a Forgiving God also Fuck You Homo

428 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:52:31pm

re: #421 Gus 802

Small explosion…

Newt Gingrich Affair Questioned By College Student

And the Newt responds…

I like Newt.
He has no chance & I wouldn’t consider him.

429 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:54:12pm

re: #427 WindUpBird

I believe in a Forgiving God also Fuck You Homo

close to hate speech, but then again… whatever.

430 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:54:30pm

re: #428 brookly red

I like Newt.
He has no chance & I wouldn’t consider him.

I like his comedy


He’s sorta like a dadaist candidate, the guy running for president almost as a theoretical exercise because he’s one of the slimiest guys ever to hold office

he’s an art-candidate. His candidacy would be a comment on the human condition. The guy with nothing whatsoever likable about him who runs anyway

431 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:54:45pm

re: #422 Gus 802

See folks. God will forgive Newt but he won’t forgive gays.

“There’s no one else who can say what I can say. It doesn’t matter what I live.”

432 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:54:47pm

Democrat’s decided he’s not so cool with the New Civility.
[Link: thehill.com…]

433 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:54:50pm

re: #428 brookly red

I like Newt.
He has no chance & I wouldn’t consider him.

I was starting to like Newt after almost 20 years. Then he started talking again.

434 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:54:53pm

re: #429 brookly red

close to hate speech, but then again… whatever.

I hate myself daily whenever I deny myself that fourth beer, I think I’m allowed

435 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:55:05pm

re: #422 Gus 802

See folks. God will forgive Newt but he won’t forgive gays.

I don’t want to be forgiven…gag me

436 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:55:15pm

re: #432 tradewind

Democrat’s decided he’s not so cool with the New Civility.
[Link: thehill.com…]

Hay whassup

437 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:55:58pm

re: #435 albusteve

I don’t want to be forgiven…gag me

Can’t say that I don’t want to be forgiven from time to time but only by people.

438 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:56:14pm

re: #432 tradewind

Gee, you mean idiocy exists on both sides? STOP THE PRESSES!

439 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:57:07pm

re: #436 WindUpBird
Yeah, good alfalfa’s gone through the roof.
Horses getting more expensive to feed than kids.

440 Skeetghazi  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:57:22pm

re: #373 wozzablog

That’s going to have to be the way it will happen.

Subarus 4wd estate car does everything an suv does with 3 times the mileage.

Ah but American status!!!

441 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:57:30pm

re: #430 WindUpBird

I like his comedy

He’s sorta like a dadaist candidate, the guy running for president almost as a theoretical exercise because he’s one of the slimiest guys ever to hold office

he’s an art-candidate. His candidacy would be a comment on the human condition. The guy with nothing whatsoever likable about him who runs anyway

true but that is most candidates, as I have said here many times before the GOP will run someone new & shiny with no baggage.

442 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:57:57pm

re: #437 Gus 802

Can’t say that I don’t want to be forgiven from time to time but only by people.

I don’t put myself into the position to need forgiveness….the Pope should bow at my feet and beg for his own

443 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:58:08pm

re: #438 Lidane

Gee, you mean idiocy exists on both sides? STOP THE PRESSES!

union guys like the tough stuff?

Well, plant me in the ground and call me a daisy, Annabelle May, I think we got ourselves a revelation!

444 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:58:34pm

re: #439 tradewind

Yeah, good alfalfa’s gone through the roof.
Horses getting more expensive to feed than kids.

well, you feed the kids to the horses, problem solved

445 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:58:52pm

re: #434 WindUpBird

I hate myself daily whenever I deny myself that fourth beer, I think I’m allowed

go for it, it’s not like anyone listens anyway.

446 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:58:54pm

re: #441 brookly red

the GOP will run someone new & shiny with no baggage.

…who will then have to immediately bend over and grab their ankles for all the wingnuts and lunatics that DO have baggage in order to get the nomination.

447 Charles Johnson  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:59:07pm

re: #432 tradewind

Democrat’s decided he’s not so cool with the New Civility.
[Link: thehill.com…]

Oh, I always love these triumphal announcements of left wing bad behavior! I never get tired of the endless attempts to whitewash the incredibly sick behavior of the right wing with false equivalence! What fun!

448 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:59:18pm

re: #432 tradewind

Democrat’s decided he’s not so cool with the New Civility.
[Link: thehill.com…]

Not as bad as the “live ammunition” line, but still very bad. That has to be read as a call for violence. It’s on a par with the Tea Party calls for the “Tree of Liberty to be refreshed from time to time with the blood of Patriots and Tyrants.”

449 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:59:41pm

re: #438 Lidane
There was doubt?
(For proof, see Matthews, Chris.
Boy’s gone ‘round the bend).

450 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 6:59:46pm

re: #447 Charles

Oh, I always love these triumphal announcements of left wing bad behavior! I never get tired of the endless attempts to whitewash the incredibly sick behavior of the right wing with false equivalence! What fun!

The Magical Balance Fairy is getting a hell of a workout these days.

451 Skeetghazi  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:00:14pm

re: #392 brookly red

of course, total bullshit… gosh your so smart :)

Typical.

452 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:00:28pm

re: #442 albusteve

I don’t put myself into the position to need forgiveness…the Pope should bow at my feet and beg for his own

awesome

453 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:00:29pm

re: #449 tradewind

Last I checked, Tweety hadn’t called for live ammo to be used on protesters, so despite his idiocy, that doesn’t balance out the douchebag from Indiana.

454 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:00:49pm

re: #441 brookly red

true but that is most candidates, as I have said here many times before the GOP will run someone new & shiny with no baggage.

Why would they run a non-Republican nobody knows?

455 Charles Johnson  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:01:10pm

re: #450 Lidane

Every time one of these phony outrages gets hyped by the right wing blogs, we can always count on tradewind to bring it up here.

456 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:01:11pm

re: #449 tradewind

There was doubt?
(For proof, see Matthews, Chris.
Boy’s gone ‘round the bend).

He’s got at least 42,000 trips before he reaches the level of Rush Limbaugh or even worse, Glenn Beck.

457 Targetpractice  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:01:53pm

re: #441 brookly red

true but that is most candidates, as I have said here many times before the GOP will run someone new & shiny with no baggage.

The GOP is likely to go governor shopping this time around, since they got burned on Senatorial experience last time. Senators can try, but being in any way connected to the “Old Guard” is gonna cost them brownie points. I honestly figure that it’s gonna end up being another “moderate” Pres nominee, with a Tea Party VP nominee to “balance” the ticket.

458 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:02:09pm

re: #447 Charles

Oh, I always love these triumphal announcements of left wing bad behavior! I never get tired of the endless attempts to whitewash the incredibly sick behavior of the right wing with false equivalence! What fun!

Unions talk tough when their existence is threatened?

people don’t like being made into serfs and treated like shit by their employers?

There’s a thing that should not be a surprise to anyone who walks upright in the united states of america

459 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:03:07pm

re: #453 Lidane

Last I checked, Tweety hadn’t called for live ammo to be used on protesters, so despite his idiocy, that doesn’t balance out the douchebag from Indiana.

No, it doesn’t. But neither spout-off is defensible.

“You don’t rationalize bad behavior by pointing to other bad behavior.”

-Bill O’Reilly

460 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:04:27pm

re: #459 Dark_Falcon

No, it doesn’t. But neither spout-off is defensible.

“You don’t rationalize bad behavior by pointing to other bad behavior.”

-Bill O’Reilly

Coming from BillO, that’s hilarious in its total lack of self-awareness. And I never defended the Democratic union guy calling for blood.

461 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:04:30pm

re: #448 Dark_Falcon

Not as bad as the “live ammunition” line, but still very bad. That has to be read as a call for violence. It’s on a par with the Tea Party calls for the “Tree of Liberty to be refreshed from time to time with the blood of Patriots and Tyrants.”

Nice follow up post to Charles.

462 Girth  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:04:50pm

re: #421 Gus 802

If the primary concern of the American people is my past, my candidacy would be irrelevant. If the primary concern of the American people is the future… that’s a debate I’ll be happy to have with your candidate or any other candidate if I decide to run.

Translation:

This isn’t about who I fucked in the past, it’s about who I don’t want you to fuck in the future.

463 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:05:01pm

Democrat tells union members that they’re going to have to shed a lot of blood, sweat, and tears!

Michelle Malkin is incensed!

Film @ 11.

464 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:05:13pm

Unintentionally funniest comment of the day. This is from Freeper land in reference to the Tennessee proposal to “ban” the constitutionally banned (since 1789) practice of Shariah law in this country:

Could not have stated it better, the solution is complete , and udder extermination . PERIOD. (emphasis added)

Could this be the springboard for another boob thread?

465 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:05:21pm

re: #457 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
Obama was an exception that proves the no-senators-need apply rule. They don’t usually make it through the primary shakeout.

466 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:05:54pm

re: #459 Dark_Falcon

No, it doesn’t. But neither spout-off is defensible.

“You don’t rationalize bad behavior by pointing to other bad behavior.”

-Bill O’Reilly

Bill said that right after calling George Tiller a baby killer for the hundredth time.

467 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:06:25pm

re: #459 Dark_Falcon
If a Republican rep had said it, we’d be deep in serious discussion about how dangerous this rhetoric is to a free society.

468 Charles Johnson  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:06:52pm

re: #448 Dark_Falcon

Not as bad as the “live ammunition” line, but still very bad. That has to be read as a call for violence. It’s on a par with the Tea Party calls for the “Tree of Liberty to be refreshed from time to time with the blood of Patriots and Tyrants.”

Actually, no, it’s nothing like that.

Here we have one person who said “go out in the streets and get a little bloody.”

On the Tea Party side, we have thousands and thousands of people parroting the “tree of liberty” line, even Republican politicians.

Not. Even. Close.

469 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:07:23pm

re: #467 tradewind

If a Republican rep had said it, we’d be deep in serious discussion about how dangerous this rhetoric is to a free society.

shit, if you had said it here you might get, you know…

470 Girth  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:07:32pm

re: #442 albusteve

I don’t put myself into the position to need forgiveness…the Pope should bow at my feet and beg for his own

That’s about the coolest thing I’ve ever read at this blog or any other.

471 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:07:36pm

re: #468 Charles

One person who immediately apologized publicly.

472 webevintage  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:07:42pm

re: #308 SanFranciscoZionist

The money is not terrible.


But you have to put up with other people’s kids and their parents.
I think teachers are saints….

473 Targetpractice  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:07:54pm

re: #465 tradewind

Obama was an exception that proves the no-senators-need apply rule. They don’t usually make it through the primary shakeout.

Yep. IIRC, last Senator to make it to the Big Chair with no governorship in-between was JFK.

474 Varek Raith  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:07:59pm

re: #467 tradewind

If a Republican rep had said it, we’d be deep in serious discussion about how dangerous this rhetoric is to a free society.

Considering that you don’t believe this, why bother?
Oh, yeah, to deflect.

475 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:08:08pm

re: #466 goddamnedfrank

Bill said that right after calling George Tiller a baby killer for the hundredth time.

Well, its a true statement. I only put it as a quote because he uses the line quite often. I try to not use people’s maxims without giving them credit.

476 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:08:17pm

re: #456 Gus 802
I don’t agree, since his spiral seems so much shorter.
I remember when he used to be sane.

477 Charles Johnson  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:08:37pm

re: #474 Varek Raith

Considering that you don’t believe this, why bother?
Oh, yeah, to deflect.

Exactly. Tradewind is parroting the latest right wing talking point, and we’re not supposed to notice.

478 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:08:41pm

re: #473 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yep. IIRC, last Senator to make it to the Big Chair with no governorship in-between was JFK.

Nixon?

479 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:08:44pm

re: #457 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

The GOP is likely to go governor shopping this time around, since they got burned on Senatorial experience last time. Senators can try, but being in any way connected to the “Old Guard” is gonna cost them brownie points. I honestly figure that it’s gonna end up being another “moderate” Pres nominee, with a Tea Party VP nominee to “balance” the ticket.

They should go with Walker form Wisconsin—he’s got high name recognition.

480 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:08:47pm

re: #465 tradewind

Obama was an exception that proves the no-senators-need apply rule. They don’t usually make it through the primary shakeout.

You’re a real student of American History, you know that? Obama is hardly the first Senator to win the Presidency:

Nixon
LBJ
JFK
Truman
Harding
Harrison
Johnson
Buchanan
Pierce
Tyler
Harrison
Van Buren
Jackson
John Quincy Adams
Monroe

ALL served as Senators before becoming POTUS.

481 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:09:23pm

re: #468 Charles

Actually, no, it’s nothing like that.

Here we have one person who said “go out in the streets and get a little bloody.”

On the Tea Party side, we have thousands and thousands of people parroting the “tree of liberty” line, even Republican politicians.

Not. Even. Close.


“get a little bloody” sounds like my friends’ rugby coach in high school, a guy who looked like Wolverine, the comic book character. Like an actual man, but built the way they draw Wolverine, just a cube of pure muscle, even with sorta spiky hair

the one who gave the whole team t-shirts that read in block letters “GIVE BLOOD. PLAY RUGBY”

Anyway, when they say that, that’s what I think of


What I don’t think of is “The government should attempt to murder protestors”. Which is what Mr Cox said in his own tweetey way

482 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:09:41pm

re: #468 Charles

Actually, no, it’s nothing like that.

Here we have one person who said “go out in the streets and get a little bloody.”

On the Tea Party side, we have thousands and thousands of people parroting the “tree of liberty” line, even Republican politicians.

Not. Even. Close.

The lines are equally bad. What makes the ring-wing one worse is the number of people who subscribe to it.

483 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:09:45pm

re: #470 Girth

That’s about the coolest thing I’ve ever read at this blog or any other.

+1

484 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:10:24pm

re: #474 Varek Raith
Your computer has that mind-read-y-app I’ve been wanting. No fair.
Do you have smell-o-ware as well?

485 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:10:34pm

re: #482 Dark_Falcon

The lines are equally bad. What makes the ring-wing one worse is the number of people who subscribe to it.

quizzical_dog.jpg

486 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:11:07pm

re: #478 mracb
Well, he had that little Veep thing in between.
:)

487 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:11:07pm

re: #480 Lidane

You’re a real student of American History, you know that? Obama is hardly the first Senator to win the Presidency:

Nixon
LBJ
JFK
Truman
Harding
Harrison
Johnson
Buchanan
Pierce
Tyler
Harrison
Van Buren
Jackson
John Quincy Adams
Monroe

ALL served as Senators before becoming POTUS.

I always wonder about that, I think being a Senator looks pretty good on a resume, no?

488 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:11:47pm

re: #476 tradewind

I don’t agree, since his spiral seems so much shorter.
I remember when he used to be sane.

Not even close. Matthews has always been hyper but he’s still not down to the level of Beck and Limbaugh.

489 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:12:13pm

re: #475 Dark_Falcon

Well, its a true statement.

Great, so is this, rationalizing bad behavior by pointing to other people’s bad behavior is exactly how you justify advocating torture.

I now return you to your regularly scheduled cognitive dissonance.

490 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:12:18pm

re: #486 tradewind

Well, he had that little Veep thing in between.
:)

oh yeah, sorry I was a child in Canada at the time.

491 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:12:26pm

re: #487 brookly red

I always wonder about that, I think being a Senator looks pretty good on a resume, no?

16 out of the 44 presidents we’ve had so far have been Senators. That’s a pretty good average for a position that supposedly keeps people from getting out of the primaries.

492 brookly red  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:16:08pm

re: #491 Lidane

16 out of the 44 presidents we’ve had so far have been Senators. That’s a pretty good average for a position that supposedly keeps people from getting out of the primaries.

true, a Governor does have more executive experience, but a Senator has more foreign policy experience… hard to say, let’s see what we get next year, yes?

493 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:16:55pm

re: #476 tradewind

I don’t agree, since his spiral seems so much shorter.
I remember when he used to be sane.

You mean when he liked Bush? “Sunny Nobility” Bush?

Matthews has a hardon for presidents, that’s what he is, he’s a geek for the presidency, he’s the guy who watches reruns of the west wing with a box of tissues

problem is now he’s A) a geek for a president you hate and B) he hates the tea party’s guts, because they’re stupid and crazy and an embarrassment to America, they make America look like a bunch of idiot savages

so yeah i could see why you wouldn’t be a fan of Chris Matthews these days

494 Charles Johnson  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:17:23pm

I understand why it’s important to do everything possible to promote the false equivalence — it’s because the modern right wing is a depraved reactionary force in American politics, and if you’re still loyal to that you’ve got to be feeling a little desperate if you’re still posting comments at LGF.

495 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:17:57pm

re: #485 mracb

quizzical_dog.jpg

What I meant was while both lines are equally bad, the right-wing one has many people who spout it, while the left-wing one has far fewer.

496 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:18:16pm

re: #480 Lidane
And you’re a real student of ancient history.
Obama is the first Senator to have been elected president since JFK, and your list is mainly comprised of pre-20th century names.
Johnson was vice president, not elected directly from the Senate. Nixon was obviously veep first as well.

497 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:20:11pm

People will get a little bloody from the cancerous tumors they’ll start growing in a Koch brothers industrial world.

498 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:20:18pm

re: #496 tradewind

And you’re a real student of ancient history.
Obama is the first Senator to have been elected president since JFK, and your list is mainly comprised of pre-20th century names.
Johnson was vice president, not elected directly from the Senate. Nixon was obviously veep first as well.

in America we think that’s a really long time

499 Girth  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:20:33pm

re: #493 WindUpBird

You mean when he liked Bush? “Sunny Nobility” Bush?

Matthews has a hardon for presidents, that’s what he is, he’s a geek for the presidency, he’s the guy who watches reruns of the west wing with a box of tissues

problem is now he’s A) a geek for a president you hate and B) he hates the tea party’s guts, because they’re stupid and crazy and an embarrassment to America, they make America look like a bunch of idiot savages

so yeah i could see why you wouldn’t be a fan of Chris Matthews these days

Pretty much this. Matthews loves the institutions of Washington. He’s annoying to watch when he’s going gaga over someone but I like it when he gets fired up about things, usually because someone is lying to him or being just plain stupid and everyone knows it.

500 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:21:09pm

re: #496 tradewind


Obama is the first Senator to have been elected president since JFK

I guess you missed both LBJ and Nixon on that list? It’s okay. Reading isn’t everyone’s strong suit.

BTW, your facts are off. Again. Obama is the first sitting Senator to be elected POTUS since JFK and Warren G. Harding. But he’s not the first Senator to be elected.

501 researchok  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:22:33pm

re: #494 Charles

I understand why it’s important to do everything possible to promote the false equivalence — it’s because the modern right wing is a depraved reactionary force in American politics, and if you’re still loyal to that you’ve got to be feeling a little desperate if you’re still posting comments at LGF.

Not all conservatives do or even condone that.

Still, as a movement, I’d have to agree

502 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:22:43pm

re: #496 tradewind

And you’re a real student of ancient history.
Obama is the first Senator to have been elected president since JFK, and your list is mainly comprised of pre-20th century names.
Johnson was vice president, not elected directly from the Senate. Nixon was obviously veep first as well.

Truman was also elevated from VP when FDR died and subsequently won a second term in 1948. just to further flesh out the point. It is true to say that Obama is the first Democratic president since JFK who is not from one of the former confederate states. Indeed after Johnson and before Obama, both Democratic presidents were southern governors who ran as centrists.

503 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:22:45pm

re: #500 Lidane

I guess you missed both LBJ and Nixon on that list? It’s okay. Reading isn’t everyone’s strong suit.

BTW, your facts are off. Again. Obama is the first sitting Senator to be elected POTUS since JFK and Warren G. Harding. But he’s not the first Senator to be elected.

the idea had to do with being elected straight out of the senate….even I caught that drift

504 Spocomptonite  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:22:56pm

re: #373 wozzablog

That’s going to have to be the way it will happen.

Subarus 4wd estate car does everything an suv does with 3 times the mileage.

Ha ha, “estate”. I should call my Volvo that. Makes it sound so much fancier than the North American “wagon”. Europe does good wagons (I mean, estates), but stupid America has poor demand for them, and stupid rules that make it impossible to import EU cars. I am in particular a fan of the new BMW 5 series wagon. Diesel with the basic engine = >50 mpg. Even the performance M engine with 300hp gets over 40 mpg. And, of course, it’s not available in North America. And EU has tons more cars like that, that just blow American cars out of the water for the combination of practicality and efficiency.

505 tradewind  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:23:02pm

Out.
And hopefully, so soon and safely are all the Americans who are still left in Libya…( or , as the WH press office release has renamed it, Lybia.

506 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:23:38pm

re: #504 Spocomptonite

Ha ha, “estate”. I should call my Volvo that. Makes it sound so much fancier than the North American “wagon”. Europe does good wagons (I mean, estates), but stupid America has poor demand for them, and stupid rules that make it impossible to import EU cars. I am in particular a fan of the new BMW 5 series wagon. Diesel with the basic engine = >50 mpg. Even the performance M engine with 300hp gets over 40 mpg. And, of course, it’s not available in North America. And EU has tons more cars like that, that just blow American cars out of the water for the combination of practicality and efficiency.

I love wagons, i have a Volvo 850R :D

507 Varek Raith  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:24:03pm

re: #505 tradewind

Out.
And hopefully, so soon and safely are all the Americans who are still left in Libya…( or , as the WH press office release has renamed it, Lybia.

Always with a parting diss.
;)
NUCULAR

508 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:25:03pm

re: #499 Girth

Pretty much this. Matthews loves the institutions of Washington. He’s annoying to watch when he’s going gaga over someone but I like it when he gets fired up about things, usually because someone is lying to him or being just plain stupid and everyone knows it.

He got his start under Tip O’Neill. When you start off in DC under a formidable and famous leader, it can leave a lifetime impression. But it also gives Matthews a good understanding of the nature of Congress, which many journalists lack.

509 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:25:08pm

But hey. Ignore the fact that we’re even thinking about “get a little bloody”. You think they mentioned Jeff Cox over at Hot Air and his “live ammo” stunt that got him fired? Not even once. Do you think Malkin even mention it? Not even once.

510 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:25:16pm

re: #504 Spocomptonite

Ha ha, “estate”. I should call my Volvo that. Makes it sound so much fancier than the North American “wagon”. Europe does good wagons (I mean, estates), but stupid America has poor demand for them, and stupid rules that make it impossible to import EU cars. I am in particular a fan of the new BMW 5 series wagon. Diesel with the basic engine = >50 mpg. Even the performance M engine with 300hp gets over 40 mpg. And, of course, it’s not available in North America. And EU has tons more cars like that, that just blow American cars out of the water for the combination of practicality and efficiency.

You seem to be the other hotrod wagon enthusiast in this thread besides me :D


personally, i want that CTS-V wagon, but I don’t think I can sell enough plasma to make the payments. Also, my commute is zero, so mileage is not my concern

511 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:27:04pm

re: #507 Varek Raith

NUCULAR

Heh. One of my favorite signs back in Dubya’s presidency was the proper pronunciation of nuclear. It was simple and to the point.

512 bratwurst  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:27:50pm

re: #459 Dark_Falcon

No, it doesn’t. But neither spout-off is defensible.

“You don’t rationalize bad behavior by pointing to other bad behavior.”

-Bill O’Reilly

Yet that is exactly what trade does here much of the time, including in this very thread.

513 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:28:15pm

re: #509 Gus 802

But hey. Ignore the fact that we’re even thinking about “get a little bloody”. You think they mentioned Jeff Cox over at Hot Air and his “live ammo” stunt that got him fired? Not even once. Do you think Malkin even mention it? Not even once.

politics is politics


I feel bad for someone like Malkin, who is obviously smart and obviously gaming this thing, she’s sorta Coulter jr, looking for a cynic’s payday.

You gotta wonder what someone like that would be if they weren’t so invested in nastiness

514 jaunte  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:28:23pm

re: #509 Gus 802

They didn’t mention much about Jesse Kelly’s M-16 event, either.

515 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:28:26pm

re: #510 WindUpBird

You seem to be the other hotrod wagon enthusiast in this thread besides me :D

personally, i want that CTS-V wagon, but I don’t think I can sell enough plasma to make the payments. Also, my commute is zero, so mileage is not my concern

don’t forget me…anyway no friggin Euro ever had one of these…a real hot rod wagon

Image: 256376-bigthumbnail.jpg

516 Decatur Deb  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:28:26pm

Since there has been no report on the Atlanta SEIU rally, bloody or not, the Waffen TP group didn’t rouse much local press. The call to attend arm goes bach through the freepers to this group, which seems to make 2nd Amendment street fairs its specialty.

Note: this is a cache link.

[Link: webcache.googleusercontent.com…]

517 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:28:35pm

re: #505 tradewind

Out.
And hopefully, so soon and safely are all the Americans who are still left in Libya…( or , as the WH press office release has renamed it, Lybia.

Potatoe

518 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:29:24pm

re: #513 WindUpBird

politics is politics

I feel bad for someone like Malkin, who is obviously smart and obviously gaming this thing, she’s sorta Coulter jr, looking for a cynic’s payday.

You gotta wonder what someone like that would be if they weren’t so invested in nastiness

I sorta want to rate the conservative bloggers on what I believe their IQ to be

519 Girth  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:29:29pm

re: #504 Spocomptonite

Ha ha, “estate”. I should call my Volvo that. Makes it sound so much fancier than the North American “wagon”. Europe does good wagons (I mean, estates), but stupid America has poor demand for them, and stupid rules that make it impossible to import EU cars. I am in particular a fan of the new BMW 5 series wagon. Diesel with the basic engine = >50 mpg. Even the performance M engine with 300hp gets over 40 mpg. And, of course, it’s not available in North America. And EU has tons more cars like that, that just blow American cars out of the water for the combination of practicality and efficiency.

We don’t do wagons here anymore, we have crossovers.

Fucking yuppie douchebags and their crossovers because they’re too hip to have a wagon but too environmentally friendly to drive an SUV. Fuck em.

/Carlin

520 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:30:15pm

re: #515 albusteve

don’t forget me…anyway no friggin Euro ever had one of these…a real hot rod wagon

Image: 256376-bigthumbnail.jpg

Oh man *_*

I like American wagons! CTS-V! But I will say, Audi and their witchcraft AWD, that’s gotta be fun with 400+HP

521 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:30:58pm

re: #519 Girth

We don’t do wagons here anymore, we have crossovers.

Fucking yuppie douchebags and their crossovers because they’re too hip to have a wagon but too environmentally friendly to drive an SUV. Fuck em.

/Carlin

Fuck crossovers


Crossovers are all high center of gravity, worst aspects of everything. The BMW X6 is a crossover. Top Gear bent it over a barrel :D

522 Charles Johnson  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:31:07pm

re: #505 tradewind

Out.
And hopefully, so soon and safely are all the Americans who are still left in Libya…( or , as the WH press office release has renamed it, Lybia.

You’re really the last one who should be bashing other people’s spelling errors.

523 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:31:39pm

re: #520 WindUpBird

Oh man *_*

I like American wagons! CTS-V! But I will say, Audi and their witchcraft AWD, that’s gotta be fun with 400+HP

I’m just an old, uncultured American race car fan

524 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:31:42pm

re: #508 Dark_Falcon

He got his start under Tip O’Neill. When you start off in DC under a formidable and famous leader, it can leave a lifetime impression. But it also gives Matthews a good understanding of the nature of Congress, which many journalists lack.

He’s still an idiot. We have a local talk show host Ronn Owens, a moderate. He and Chris are friends, he seems to never see Chris’s ‘blatant anomalies’ that happen on a regular basis. He thinks Chris is a great guy and without fault.

525 CuriousLurker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:31:50pm

re: #515 albusteve

don’t forget me…anyway no friggin Euro ever had one of these…a real hot rod wagon

Image: 256376-bigthumbnail.jpg

Wow, I had no idea a station wagon could look cool.

526 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:32:32pm

re: #521 WindUpBird

Fuck crossovers

Crossovers are all high center of gravity, worst aspects of everything. The BMW X6 is a crossover. Top Gear bent it over a barrel :D

My last car was a crossover Saturn VUE. It got totaled in an accident, but to their credit, it held up well and I walked away from everything.

Never again, though. My next vehicle will be a regular car or hatchback. No more SUV or SUV wannabe vehicles for me.

527 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:32:45pm

re: #519 Girth

We don’t do wagons here anymore, we have crossovers.

Fucking yuppie douchebags and their crossovers because they’re too hip to have a wagon but too environmentally friendly to drive an SUV. Fuck em.

/Carlin


In Portland, we are WAGON CENTRAL. 240’s slammed to the pavement, VW squarebacks, beater Celebritys and Pontiac 6000s, Subie GLs jacked up on balloon tires, you name it

Five of my good friends locally have wagons. Five!

528 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:33:49pm

re: #525 CuriousLurker

Wow, I had no idea a station wagon could look cool.

That’s no wagon. It’s a battle station.

529 Jalal bin Smokin?  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:34:22pm

re: #526 Lidane

My last car was a crossover Saturn VUE. It got totaled in an accident, but to their credit, it held up well and I walked away from everything.

Never again, though. My next vehicle will be a regular car or hatchback. No more SUV or SUV wannabe vehicles for me.

My last car was a Nissan PAthfinder that lasted me 19 years before some idiot spun out on the freeway and we crossed paths. My latest car is an X-terra. I love the SUV style.

530 CuriousLurker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:34:32pm

re: #528 goddamnedfrank

That’s no wagon. It’s a battle station.

LOL, indeed!

531 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:34:39pm

re: #523 albusteve

I’m just an old, uncultured American race car fan

I don’t even like racing so much as I like fast cars and hooliganism regarding such :D I like novelty drag races between guys with weirdo street legal cars they’ve done monstrous things to, I like the ingenuity to make something roadworthy and cheap and also unbelievable in a 1/4 mile, it makes me wish i knew anything about fixing or building cars

532 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:35:10pm

re: #525 CuriousLurker

Wow, I had no idea a station wagon could look cool.

This looks cool!

Image: Cadillac-CTS-V-Sportwagon.jpg

533 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:35:30pm

re: #514 jaunte

They didn’t mention much about Jesse Kelly’s M-16 event, either.

That’s different. That shooting event was not a threat to anyone.

534 CuriousLurker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:36:50pm

re: #532 WindUpBird

This looks cool!

Image: Cadillac-CTS-V-Sportwagon.jpg

It looks like some kind of shapeshifter that’s gonna morph into something else any minute! O_o

535 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:37:11pm

re: #532 WindUpBird

This looks cool!

Image: Cadillac-CTS-V-Sportwagon.jpg

my BIL is considering that very car, supercharged to 540hp

536 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:37:24pm

re: #529 mracb

My last car was a Nissan PAthfinder that lasted me 19 years before some idiot spun out on the freeway and we crossed paths. My latest car is an X-terra. I love the SUV style.

I had a real 21st century accident— some jackass crossed the center line while he was texting his friends and hit me head on. My car was mostly intact, but the frame got bent, rendering it a loss.

Sucks. I’ve been on foot or taking public transport since, because all the money I got from the insurance settlement has had to go to paying bills and basic survival since I started grad school. I’m hoping to be mobile again by this summer.

537 RadicalModerate  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:37:40pm

The part that bugs me the most about the MBF argument about who is advocation (and committing) violence is that it is so unbalanced that it is laughable. Honestly - for every one of these that FoxNews, Brietbart or someone trumpet about how leftists are committing violence, there’s at least FIVE from the rightwingers.

And strangely enough, very, very few of those are reported by Fox, HotAir, etc.
Case in point: try to find any stories from rightwing sites regarding things like the Shawna Forde trial, today’s firing of the Wisconsin assistant AG who advocating using live ammunition on protestors (to be fair, that one got a passing mention at Fox - one sentence buried in a 20-paragraph “leftwing violence in Wisconsin” story), the call for Tea Party counterprotestors in Atlanta to come armed - just a few from this week alone.

538 researchok  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:38:22pm

re: #525 CuriousLurker

Wow, I had no idea a station wagon could look cool.

I’m impressed with practicality aspect.

539 CuriousLurker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:38:25pm

re: #536 Lidane

I had a real 21st century accident— some jackass crossed the center line while he was texting his friends and hit me head on.

Yikes! Glad you’re still here to talk about it.

540 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:38:36pm

re: #531 WindUpBird

I don’t even like racing so much as I like fast cars and hooliganism regarding such :D I like novelty drag races between guys with weirdo street legal cars they’ve done monstrous things to, I like the ingenuity to make something roadworthy and cheap and also unbelievable in a 1/4 mile, it makes me wish i knew anything about fixing or building cars

ABQ has it all….tons of tricked up rice burners the younger kids drive…speed is a NM pastime

541 jaunte  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:38:42pm

re: #533 Dark_Falcon

The language in the announcement for the event was:

Get on target for victory in November. Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office. Shoot a fully automatic M16 with Jesse Kelly
542 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:39:00pm

re: #533 Dark_Falcon

That’s different. That shooting event was not a threat to anyone.

Right, it just directly associated the idea of removing Giffords from office with an opportunity to shoot an M16 on full auto. Totally innocent.

543 jaunte  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:40:00pm

New registration bug hits buglight.

544 lostlakehiker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:40:02pm

The text of the post asserts that the author of the piece “puts religious indoctrination above reading and math.”

But the quote goes

In addition to being less expensive and better than public schools at teaching math and reading, Catholic schools — like any private schools — can also teach students that there is a God…


The author LITERALLY puts teaching math and reading above religious indoctrination.

545 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:40:25pm

re: #539 CuriousLurker

Yikes! Glad you’re still here to talk about it.

Same here. I got bruised up nicely, but nothing broke, thank goodness.

The most annoying thing has been the loss of my car. I hate getting around on the bus. It’s a pain in the ass, just from all the time wasted. I’ll be driving again by this summer, though, thank goodness.

546 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:41:14pm
547 jaunte  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:41:40pm

re: #544 lostlakehiker

“ultimately, American freedom depends on fidelity to our Judeo-Christian heritage even more than it depends on proficiency in reading and math.”

548 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:42:02pm

I love how we just send the wingnuts into a frenzy.

549 albusteve  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:42:09pm

re: #546 Gus 802

Douche bag alert.

maybe he will hang out for awhile

550 HappyWarrior  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:42:18pm

This isn’t surprising. The religious right has hated on public schools for years.

551 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:42:34pm

re: #544 lostlakehiker

The text of the post asserts that the author of the piece “puts religious indoctrination above reading and math.”

But the quote goes


The author LITERALLY puts teaching math and reading above religious indoctrination.

From the article:

[…]American freedom depends on fidelity to our Judeo-Christian heritage even more than it depends on proficiency in reading and math.

552 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:42:47pm

re: #546 Gus 802

I have a feeling we won’t even be able to get the grill ready before they’re gone.

553 Varek Raith  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:42:59pm

re: #546 Gus 802

Douche bag alert.

All the subtlety of a supernova.

554 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:43:10pm

re: #541 jaunte

The language in the announcement for the event was:

He made no direct threat, nor did he ever use or display the rifle in question in an unsafe or threatening manner.

555 Lidane  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:43:26pm

re: #551 Fozzie Bear

Pfft. You and your facts. Why do you hate America?

/wingnut

556 jaunte  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:44:20pm

re: #554 Dark_Falcon

I think it’s a poor choice of prop for a political campaign.

557 Gus  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:44:40pm

re: #549 albusteve

maybe he will hang out for awhile

I have to admit sometimes it’s fun toying with the wingnut trolls. They’re so, dumb.

558 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:44:52pm

re: #552 Lidane

I have a feeling we won’t even be able to get the grill ready before they’re gone.

Well, I’ve got notice, so I’ll try. I wonder which Stalker this is.

559 Querent  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:45:30pm

the Moral Derpitude is strong in this one…

560 HappyWarrior  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:45:51pm

re: #556 jaunte

I think it’s a poor choice of prop for a political campaign.

Agreed. Not saying he’s responsible for her shooting but the gun rhetoric that many candidates use does bother me. These things aren’t toys and they act like they are. I know that there are many reasonable gun owners out there and I guess that’s why in part it bothers me.

561 Interesting Times  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:45:56pm

re: #554 Dark_Falcon

He made no direct threat, nor did he ever use or display the rifle in question in an unsafe or threatening manner.

WTF? Do you not see how these lines:

Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office. Shoot a fully automatic M16

…are, if nothing else, in disgustingly bad taste? And it most definitely does sound like a not-so-subtle reference to her getting shot.

562 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:46:37pm

re: #556 jaunte

I think it’s a poor choice of prop for a political campaign.

He was running on partially on his military service, and he was appealing to those who enjoy shooting sports. A full-auto shoot is a rare treat for some such people.

563 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:48:39pm

re: #467 tradewind

If a Republican rep had said it, we’d be deep in serious discussion about how dangerous this rhetoric is to a free society.

If a Republican rep had said it, you’d be pointing to Obama’s line about bringing a knife to a gunfight.

564 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:49:29pm

re: #476 tradewind

I don’t agree, since his spiral seems so much shorter.
I remember when he used to be sane.

Was that when he announced that Bush had ‘sunny nobility’?

565 CuriousLurker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:51:20pm

re: #562 Dark_Falcon

He was running on partially on his military service, and he was appealing to those who enjoy shooting sports. A full-auto shoot is a rare treat for some such people.

Quick question, DF: If one of your family members had been the the incumbent and the wording was exactly the same except for the name, would you still feel the same way?

566 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:52:46pm

re: #562 Dark_Falcon

He was running on partially on his military service, and he was appealing to those who enjoy shooting sports. A full-auto shoot is a rare treat for some such people.

These people are letting themselves be bought too easily. I would demand to shoot at least a shoulder-fired RPG before you can get my vote.

567 jaunte  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:53:27pm

re: #566 Fozzie Bear

I want to drive a tank. Don’t need to shoot it, just drive it through something.

568 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:54:04pm

re: #544 lostlakehiker

The text of the post asserts that the author of the piece “puts religious indoctrination above reading and math.”

But the quote goes


The author LITERALLY puts teaching math and reading above religious indoctrination.

Er, he also writes:

“ultimately, American freedom depends on fidelity to our Judeo-Christian heritage even more than it depends on proficiency in reading and math.”

569 jaunte  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:54:55pm

re: #568 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, that was all the way at the end.

570 CuriousLurker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:55:39pm

re: #569 jaunte

Well, that was all the way at the end.

*snort*

571 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:56:19pm

re: #561 publicityStunted

WTF? Do you not see how these lines:

Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office. Shoot a fully automatic M16

…are, if nothing else, in disgustingly bad taste? And it most definitely does sound like a not-so-subtle reference to her getting shot.

We switched D_F’s regular cup of derp-garble with Sanka brand garble-derp, let’s see if he notices:

“Help remove John Boehner from office, garrote a fully anesthetized pumpkin with SEIU and the AFL-CIO.”

//////11ty

572 Skeetghazi  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:56:34pm

re: #436 WindUpBird

Hay whassup

LOL

573 Charles Johnson  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:56:34pm

re: #544 lostlakehiker

The text of the post asserts that the author of the piece “puts religious indoctrination above reading and math.”

But the quote goes


The author LITERALLY puts teaching math and reading above religious indoctrination.

Wrong.

The quote:

…ultimately, American freedom depends on fidelity to our Judeo-Christian heritage even more than it depends on proficiency in reading and math.

574 HappyWarrior  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:57:07pm

re: #568 SanFranciscoZionist

Er, he also writes:

“ultimately, American freedom depends on fidelity to our Judeo-Christian heritage even more than it depends on proficiency in reading and math.”

I am glad his “priorities” in order. I’m beginning ot subscribe more and more to the thought that these people are true theocrats who would if they ever got power would try to turn this in to a country where it would be illegal not to be a Christian.

575 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:58:23pm

re: #565 CuriousLurker

Quick question, DF: If one of your family members had been the the incumbent and the wording was exactly the same except for the name, would you still feel the same way?

Yep. The guy is served as a Marine and he’s not a nutcase; I’m not afraid of violence from such a person unless I were actually to engage in violence myself, since I know that they are disciplined enough not to misuse their skills.

576 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 7:59:52pm

re: #566 Fozzie Bear

These people are letting themselves be bought too easily. I would demand to shoot at least a shoulder-fired RPG before you can get my vote.

Too expensive. Each individual round of RPG-7 ammo would have to be registered as a destructive device. Very costly to do.

577 CuriousLurker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:01:14pm

re: #575 Dark_Falcon

Yep. The guy is served as a Marine and he’s not a nutcase; I’m not afraid of violence from such a person unless I were actually to engage in violence myself, since I know that they are disciplined enough not to misuse their skills.

Interesting. I would bother me greatly if it was one of my loved ones (and Jesse Kelly wouldn’t be the one I’d be worried about).

578 Fozzie Bear  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:01:24pm

re: #576 Dark_Falcon

Too expensive. Each individual round of RPG-7 ammo would have to be registered as a destructive device. Very costly to do.

Just one more reason the government must be eliminated. /

579 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:02:38pm

re: #575 Dark_Falcon

Yep. The guy is served as a Marine and he’s not a nutcase; I’m not afraid of violence from such a person unless I were actually to engage in violence myself, since I know that they are disciplined enough not to misuse their skills.

I’m not afraid of violence from such a person, personally, but I seriously question what kind of message he is attempting to send with that sort of promotion.

580 Skeetghazi  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:02:58pm

re: #466 goddamnedfrank

Bill said that right after calling George Tiller a baby killer for the hundredth time.

Cya

581 Spocomptonite  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:03:59pm

re: #532 WindUpBird

Call me crazy, but I don’t like that D-pillar. It’s just weird and ugly.

By looks alone, I prefer Holden’s Commodore. Image: holden-commodore-wagon1.jpg

Interestingly enough, it’s owned by American GM, yet not available in America.

582 Skeetghazi  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:04:02pm

re: #467 tradewind

If a Republican rep had said it, we’d be deep in serious discussion about how dangerous this rhetoric is to a free society.

Sucks to be you.

583 HappyWarrior  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:05:11pm

The issue really isn’t to me who’s sending the message, it’s about what that message is. I mean yeah I get that people like shooting guns as a hobby. Not my cup of tea but I can understand that. But what I don’t get is when you hear candidates talking about “second amendment solutions” or saying crap like “this time we came unarmed.” How is someone supposed to interpret that?

584 Skeetghazi  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:09:57pm

re: #505 tradewind

Out.
And hopefully, so soon and safely are all the Americans who are still left in Libya…( or , as the WH press office release has renamed it, Lybia.

WTF ? Oh yeah the bomb called trade

585 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:12:55pm

re: #579 SanFranciscoZionist

I’m not afraid of violence from such a person, personally, but I seriously question what kind of message he is attempting to send with that sort of promotion.

The message I saw was “I’ve been a fearless defender of this nation and that makes me suited for public office. And here’s a fun shooting event to help me raise money.”

586 dragonfire1981  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:28:41pm

From Matthew 7:21-23

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

Just because you think you are doing the right thing doesn’t mean you are.

I didn’t realize until I came to the U.S. how vast the differences were in the Canadian and U.S. education systems. I did plenty of science and math courses all the way through High School with a focus on practical knowledge. At this time we had no standardized testing in Canada.

I remember studying evolution in Grade 10 history and learning about Homo erectus and austrilopithecene and all of that.

I do substitute teaching on the side sometimes. In one instance the teacher didn’t leave much classwork behind for the kids so there was time to fill. I decided to run a simple trivia quiz game. It astounded me how much they didn’t know. Not one student could tell me what event caused the first Gulf War (Iraq invading Kuwait) or what the worlds largest countries are in terms of landmass (Russia and Canada), among others.

Some of the students told me they have a hard time writing by hand. They’ve been so spoiled by texting and computers that have a hard time doing something that should be second nature to them by now.

I can’t help but feel bad for these kids because they aren’t learning what they should be and our future is jeopardized because of it.

587 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:29:07pm

re: #585 Dark_Falcon

The message I saw was “I’ve been a fearless defender of this nation and that makes me suited for public office. And here’s a fun shooting event to help me raise money.”

Why do you ignore the actual quote advertising his event, which literally associated removing her from office with firing an M16, and then put quote marks around your own convenient interpretation? What you saw is simply what you wanted to see, but what he put out there was something completely different.

588 prairiefire  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:36:10pm

Indiana official who encouraged live ammo retaliation on protesters is fired:[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com…]

589 Boyo  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 8:52:55pm

re: #388 austin_blue

Get crackin’, boyo! Justify!


whatd I do?
/

590 McSpiff  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 9:07:18pm

re: #97 WindUpBird

Also, private schools don’t have to deal with the disabled

Or anyone who fails a grade. That was more or less policy at the school I went to. Each class was usually at capacity, those on the waiting list got priority over those who were being held back a year. Hell, the entire idea of “no sorry, we’re full” is something public schools don’t get to say.

591 lostlakehiker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 9:16:04pm

re: #61 Fozzie Bear

Mike Huckabee Expresses Deep Doubts About Afghan End Game, Karzai’s Corruption

This is the thing about Huckabee which gives me fits. He says some things that resonate with me so strongly, such as this, and then he turns around and says something bugfuck insane. I mean, I really, really respect the rhetorical honesty with which he approached the issue of the war in Afghanistan. It’s downright refreshing to see someone say what I am thinking.

And yet, he has some some really frightening things.

He is on a different level from most other wingnuts. I like him. My gut says he’s just not a bad guy. But he also scares the shit out of me. Does anybody else feel that way about him?

I don’t like him. I never liked him, but now I have a reason…he pardoned the unpardonable, just because they’d came to Jesus.

Yeah. Tell it to the marines.

Those guys knew a sap when they saw one. So, that’s that. He’s a sap.

They went forth and went right back to crime. Including murder.

592 lostlakehiker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 9:21:00pm

re: #573 Charles

Wrong.

The quote:

Not wrong. It’s right there in the piece. In black and white. He FIRST talks about doing a better job at teaching reading and math. And then, below that on the text, which is what I meant by “literally”, because the talk about teaching reading and math comes above the talk about the other, he talks about religious indoctrination.

So, it’s literally true what I wrote. And I said “literally” because that’s what I meant to say.

593 lostlakehiker  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 9:28:48pm

re: #118 sizzleRI

That never gets mentioned enough. U.S. public schools take everyone. Not just across socio-economic and racial lines but also across all abilities. Not only is that unique compared to private schools but it is also unique when compared to school systems in other countries especially climbers like China and India whose test scores look awesome because a limited percentage of school aged children attend school, especially secondary ed, and that percentage does not include the disabled. Or poor for the most part.

This is false to fact almost across the board. First, while private schools maybe don’t absolutely have to take every disabled child, they do take quite a few, especially those with disabilities that are not so extreme as to make any sort of standard school education impossible.

Parochial schools don’t draw a class or color line. They may screen out those who will not try, but they accept those who try but have little knack for academic learning. They get better results, too.

Second, at least when it comes to China, we delude ourselves if we think that their results are not “for real”. There’s news articles about an international study comparing schools in Shanghai with schools in the west. Chinese ten-year olds are pretty much all in school, and they’re years ahead of their European counterparts, let alone their American counterparts. Even if you adjusted the statistics and factored in zero educational achievement by their disabled, it wouldn’t budge the overall disparity.

As to India, I make no challenge. For all I know, you might be on to something there.

594 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Feb 23, 2011 11:15:16pm

re: #482 Dark_Falcon

The lines are equally bad. What makes the ring-wing one worse is the number of people who subscribe to it.

“Bloody” line is bad, but is not nearly enough bad as the “live ammunition” one.

595 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Feb 24, 2011 12:15:11am

re: #564 SanFranciscoZionist

Was that when he announced that Bush had ‘sunny nobility’?

jinx

596 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Feb 24, 2011 12:16:39am

re: #581 Spocomptonite

Call me crazy, but I don’t like that D-pillar. It’s just weird and ugly.

By looks alone, I prefer Holden’s Commodore. Image: holden-commodore-wagon1.jpg

Interestingly enough, it’s owned by American GM, yet not available in America.

We’re still friends :D My friend has a G8 GXP, and I want a Pontiac GTO aka Holden Monaro

597 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Feb 24, 2011 12:19:33am

re: #593 lostlakehiker

This is false to fact almost across the board. First, while private schools maybe don’t absolutely have to take every disabled child, they do take quite a few, especially those with disabilities that are not so extreme as to make any sort of standard school education impossible.

Parochial schools don’t draw a class or color line. They may screen out those who will not try, but they accept those who try but have little knack for academic learning. They get better results, too.

Second, at least when it comes to China, we delude ourselves if we think that their results are not “for real”. There’s news articles about an international study comparing schools in Shanghai with schools in the west. Chinese ten-year olds are pretty much all in school, and they’re years ahead of their European counterparts, let alone their American counterparts. Even if you adjusted the statistics and factored in zero educational achievement by their disabled, it wouldn’t budge the overall disparity.

As to India, I make no challenge. For all I know, you might be on to something there.

“quite a few” is charity

Public schools aren’t charity, they’re society

598 morrisab  Thu, Feb 24, 2011 5:18:19am

Again I say, what schools *are* these people talking about? My kid goes to a private Catholic school and thus far hasn’t been taught a single one of the commandments. She has, however, been taught that evolution is a fact and anyone who denies it is jut crazycakes.


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