Here’s an open thread for Oscar night, as the Onion reports on an erupting controversy around the method used to pick the winners.
Youtube VideoPssst… mum’s the word, but registration’s open for a little while.
3 |
darthstar Sun, Feb 27, 2011 5:57:32pm |
Who is wearing the dress made from guinea pig saliva? That’s the only important question of the night.
| 4 |
Feline Fearless Leader Sun, Feb 27, 2011 5:58:45pm |
Is LadyGaga there dressed as another breakfast item in her quest to become a Denny’s GrandSlam?
| 5 |
brookly red Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:00:11pm |
re: #4 oaktree
Is LadyGaga there dressed as another breakfast item in her quest to become a Denny’s GrandSlam?
/I heard she just bought Denny’s…
| 6 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:02:07pm |
re: #1 The Shadow Do
Kirk Douglas does not look a day over 95
And obviously still horny.
By the way, “The Ragman’s Son” was very good.
| 7 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:04:50pm |
re: #6 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
And obviously still horny.
By the way, “The Ragman’s Son” was very good.
Props for still horny
Had to Google Ragman’s Son. Looks worthwhile. thanks
| 8 |
brookly red Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:09:27pm |
OK, now this from National Geographic…
[Link: news.nationalgeographic.com…]
have fun with this one y’all
| 9 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:12:44pm |
re: #7 The Shadow Do
Had to Google Ragman’s Son. Looks worthwhile. thanks
My favorite of all of the Hollywood “Autobiographies”.
| 10 |
Political Atheist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:12:50pm |
re: #8 brookly red
One nuke will ruin your whole day.
| 11 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:12:53pm |
re: #8 brookly red
OK, now this from National Geographic…
[Link: news.nationalgeographic.com…]
have fun with this one y’all
It would seem to argue that a nuclear war would be a bad thing. Go figure.
| 12 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:14:00pm |
re: #9 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
My favorite of all of the Hollywood “Autobiographies”.
Never found him particularly talented but I was a kid and sure loved “The Vikings”. He was a terrific Viking!
| 13 |
brookly red Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:14:26pm |
| 14 |
recusancy Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:15:01pm |
| 15 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:15:23pm |
Kill chickens rather than force them to pick best actress! — PETA
| 16 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:19:10pm |
Anyone see Black Swan? Hell of a sports movie.
| 17 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:21:21pm |
Cool,
Little bit of Auntie bragging here.
My nephew is 7 and he’s a pretty neat kid. He’s already organized two community events one with 350.org and a ivy pull at his school. He loves science and his favorite show is Myth Busters. So now he’s doing his own science experiments and with some technical help from his Mom is blogging them on his very own science blog. His first experiment is seeing what happens with pussy willows in dirt and water. He even has a control and chart on the wall. His second experiment is to see if there is any difference in how snowmen melt, one just normal and one with huge parka on it.
He also made a prototype of a jet pack out of lego. LOL
| 18 |
Decatur Deb Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:21:25pm |
re: #16 The Shadow Do
Anyone see Black Swan? Hell of a sports movie.
Is that the one with Terry Bradshaw?
| 19 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:21:46pm |
re: #15 Gus 802
Kill chickens rather than force them to pick best actress! — PETA
Gus, you are clever beyond my ken. Huh?
| 21 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:22:33pm |
re: #13 brookly red
re: #11 The Shadow Do
but from National Geographic? sheesh!
Yeah, I know. But given the likelihood of a small nuclear exchange at some point down the road, it might be better to figure out a way to survive the ozone loss. Sunblock 3000, anyone?*
*First one to name the movie I borrowed that from gets 4 updings.
| 22 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:22:38pm |
| 23 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:23:11pm |
Pam declares that the civil war has arrived…..
The Overthrowers are Outta ControlO-Armies get Violent, Hit Reporter, Activists
The left’s thug armies are getting more hostile, more violent and more brazen, knowing that their man in the White House will not uphold the rule of law. Taking a page from Egypt, Iran and Libya, the lefty moochers, looters and freeloaders are now going around attacking journalists and those they don’t agree with.
….
America descends into chaos, with the destroyers given sanction by a runaway White House. This is war, my friends.
| 24 |
Political Atheist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:25:06pm |
re: #23 Killgore Trout
Oh good grief. I’m starting to want to ignore her as I prefer to ignore the stalkers. I just have no interest in their peculiar hateful point of view any more.
| 26 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:26:58pm |
re: #21 Dark_Falcon
Yeah, I know. But given the likelihood of a small nuclear exchange at some point down the road, it might be better to figure out a way to survive the ozone loss. Sunblock 3000, anyone?*
*First one to name the movie I borrowed that from gets 4 updings.
Robocop…. I think
| 27 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:29:11pm |
re: #26 Jadespring
Robocop… I think
Robocop 2, to be exact. But you still get this post and your next two updinged for getting so close.
| 28 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:30:20pm |
re: #24 Rightwingconspirator
Oh good grief. I’m starting to want to ignore her as I prefer to ignore the stalkers. I just have no interest in their peculiar hateful point of view any more.
Sadly, Killgore, we can’t afford to ignore someone with a following who is talking like that. They may well be dangerous, and they need to be monitored on that basis.
| 29 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:30:23pm |
re: #27 Dark_Falcon
Robocop 2, to be exact. But you still get this post and your next two updinged for getting so close.
Woo!
| 30 |
Political Atheist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:33:33pm |
re: #28 Dark_Falcon
Good point. Kinda like dog crap on my lawn.
It stinks but needs to be dealt with.
| 31 |
ProBosniaLiberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:34:34pm |
Oh boy, I just stumbled on a bad story from Oklahoma. The OKC municipal elections are in the next week, for some background.
Activities of council candidates’ church draw criticism
Two Oklahoma City Council candidates attend a church observers have criticized for flying the Confederate flag, making political commentary from the pulpit and training children to use automatic weapons at a church camp.
Fortunately, I am in the much more sane Norman.
| 32 |
researchok Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:35:46pm |
| 33 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:36:46pm |
| 34 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:37:30pm |
re: #31 ProLifeLiberal
Oh boy, I just stumbled on a bad story from Oklahoma. The OKC municipal elections are in the next week, for some background.
Activities of council candidates’ church draw criticism
Fortunately, I am in the much more sane Norman.
In Dallas we have a new mayor. He awarded a key to the city to Michael Vick. Said kids needed someone to look up to.
| 35 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:38:36pm |
I forget Christian Bale was British. He sounds weird.
| 36 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:39:25pm |
re: #32 researchok
Only three failures since 1998 eh? I guess those were the times the aliens figured out they could just take the probee’s helmet off.
| 37 |
Velvet Elvis Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:44:42pm |
re: #32 researchok
You just can’t make this stuff up.
Great head wear fashion, too.
How is it better than a tinfoil hat?
| 39 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:45:38pm |
Ann Althouse and Instapundit are promoting this outrageous video showing police collusion with the protesters because their reporter was told to wait in line like everybody else….
| 40 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:46:04pm |
Trent Reznor wins an Oscar. Don’t sell heavy metal guys short. Many of them are great musicians.
| 41 |
Velvet Elvis Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:47:10pm |
re: #40 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Trent Reznor wins an Oscar. Don’t sell heavy metal guys short. Many of them are great musicians.
He’s industrial, not metal.
| 42 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:47:58pm |
re: #35 Jadespring
I forget Christian Bale was British. He sounds weird.
Forgot his wife’s name in his speech. He’ll never have sex again. At least not without “Charlie Sheen” help.
| 43 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:48:16pm |
re: #37 Conservative Moonbat
How is it better than a tinfoil hat?
Well, it looks more like a normal hat (well, not really, but more normal than tin foil). All those people who have problem with alien telepathy don’t want to walk around looking like crazy people, now do they?
| 44 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:48:47pm |
re: #42 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Forgot his wife’s name in his speech. He’ll never have sex again. At least not without “Charlie Sheen” help.
Ha ha. I missed that.
| 45 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:48:51pm |
re: #41 Conservative Moonbat
Heavy in general. But you are correct, of course.
| 46 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:49:18pm |
re: #42 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Forgot his wife’s name in his speech. He’ll never have sex again. At least not without “Charlie Sheen” help.
I thought that at first too, but I think he stopped because he got choked up, not because he forgot her name.
| 48 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:50:29pm |
I need to see some of these movies.
I’ve seen Inception, Social Network, Winter’s Bone (that one was awesome) and that’s about it.
| 49 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:51:03pm |
re: #46 Soap_Man
I thought that at first too, but I think he stopped because he got choked up, not because he forgot her name.
“ACTING!!”
-Master Thespian
| 50 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:51:07pm |
re: #47 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Mmmhmm.
I understand your skepticism, but who the hell forgets his wife’s name?
| 51 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:51:54pm |
| 52 |
Ojoe Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:52:23pm |
Oscar Oscar
Bo boscar
Banana fanana
Fo foscar
&ct.
| 53 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:52:32pm |
re: #48 Jadespring
I only saw “Inception” and “Toy Story III”.
Have to see “Black Swan” and “Winter’s Bone”.
| 54 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:53:02pm |
re: #48 Jadespring
I need to see some of these movies.
I’ve seen Inception, Social Network, Winter’s Bone (that one was awesome) and that’s about it.
Same here. I do plan to see Inception and Black Swan when I get a chance.
| 56 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:53:57pm |
re: #54 Dark_Falcon
Watch Inception with an interpreter.
I still don’t know what the fuck happened (tho, it looked really cool).
| 57 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:56:24pm |
Winter’s Bone is great. I had never even heard of it until I saw it at the video store. It was one of those ‘What the hell, there’s nothing else I haven’t seen movies.’
Was totally surprised and even thought that if the universe was right that the lead should get a nomination. I never figured she actually would or that it would get a best picture nod.
I’d like to see Kings Speech and Black Swan.
| 58 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:56:42pm |
Achievement in make-up? Well that gotten to the part of the broadcast when it is a great time to run out for a pack of smokes.
BRB
| 59 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:57:04pm |
re: #56 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Watch Inception with an interpreter.
I still don’t know what the fuck happened (tho, it looked really cool).
I liked it. It was a total trip though.
| 60 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:58:31pm |
re: #59 Jadespring
Visually it was stunning.
However, I am hearing impaired, and those fucking “whispery dialogue” movies make me freakin’ nuts!
| 61 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 6:58:41pm |
re: #54 Dark_Falcon
Same here. I do plan to see Inception and Black Swan when I get a chance.
If you haven’t seen Winters Bone yet, do. It’s one of those movies that doesn’t seem like much but it ends up just sucking you right in.
| 62 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:00:25pm |
re: #60 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Visually it was stunning.
However, I am hearing impaired, and those fucking “whispery dialogue” movies make me freakin’ nuts!
Yes I can see why that would be aggravating with that movie.
| 63 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:02:36pm |
Obama’s right. “As Time Goes By”.
| 66 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:04:43pm |
re: #64 Jadespring
Ooo Obama makes an appearance.
Outrage!
Glad I’m not watching. I don’t like to hear from him. He’s not evil, I do know that, but I’ll never be a fan of his.
| 67 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:05:13pm |
re: #65 Gus 802
Fire up the wingnut conspiracy presses!
He’s campaigning through the Oscars!!
And using an all time classic movie that everyone loves to swing voters!!!
That’s the best I can come up with….
| 68 |
HoosierHoops Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:05:56pm |
I like Randy Newman.. But always thought he was really quirky
| 69 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:06:48pm |
re: #66 Dark_Falcon
Glad I’m not watching. I don’t like to hear from him. He’s not evil, I do know that, but I’ll never be a fan of his.
Interesting. I never knew one had to be a “fan” of president. During the Reagan administration I was not a supported of his but I did think I had to be a “fan” in order to listen to what he had to say. I think it’s a sad in America when the president is, a president, is relegated to “fan status” in order to not only listen to what he has to say but also consider him our president.
| 70 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:07:40pm |
re: #66 Dark_Falcon
Glad I’m not watching. I don’t like to hear from him. He’s not evil, I do know that, but I’ll never be a fan of his.
He was in a montage about favorite movie songs and was shown for a couple of seconds. All he said was ” There are a lot of great songs but if it’s just one song you have to go with “As time goes By”.
| 71 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:08:02pm |
re: #32 researchok
You just can’t make this stuff up.
Great head wear fashion, too.
I like it that they tell you how to make your own.
| 72 |
Vicious Babushka Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:08:33pm |
re: #56 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Watch Inception with an interpreter.
I still don’t know what the fuck happened (tho, it looked really cool).
Was Inception ripped off from a Donald Duck comic?
| 73 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:08:39pm |
re: #69 Gus 802
Interesting. I never knew one had to be a “fan” of a president. During the Reagan administration I was not a
supportedsupporter of his but I did think I had to be a “fan” in order to listen to what he had to say. I think it’s a sad in America when the president is, a president, isrelegated to “fan status” in order to not only listen to what he has to say but also to consider him our president.
Garbled grammar with coffee cup in hand.
| 74 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:09:26pm |
re: #56 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Watch Inception with an interpreter.
I still don’t know what the fuck happened (tho, it looked really cool).
Watching Inception gave me a headache.
| 75 |
Varek Raith Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:09:28pm |
re: #71 SanFranciscoZionist
I like it that they tell you how to make your own.
Unless it generates an insanely powerful magnetic field, it ain’t stopping my ship’s tractor beam.
:P
| 76 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:09:58pm |
re: #68 HoosierHoops
I like Randy Newman.. But always thought he was really quirky
Yeah, but everything feels like “Short People” or the “Garry Shandling’s Show” theme song.
But I do like the guy. He’d be fun to hang out with.
| 77 |
Lidane Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:10:22pm |
I love the fact that Trent Reznor is now an Oscar winner. He’s come a long way since “Closer”. Heh.
| 78 |
Political Atheist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:10:31pm |
re: #71 SanFranciscoZionist
I suck at the LGF search but LWC and I once did a page on gold foil hats…
| 79 |
researchok Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:11:04pm |
| 80 |
researchok Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:11:48pm |
re: #72 Alouette
Was Inception ripped off from a Donald Duck comic?
And in these tight economic times, savings matter.
| 81 |
Political Atheist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:12:02pm |
| 82 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:12:02pm |
re: #54 Dark_Falcon
Same here. I do plan to see Inception and Black Swan when I get a chance.
Black Swan is pretty good, although I think the first 90 minutes could have been condensed down to 60 or 70. It dragged a bit.
| 84 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:12:41pm |
re: #69 Gus 802
Interesting. I never knew one had to be a “fan” of president. During the Reagan administration I was not a supported of his but I did think I had to be a “fan” in order to listen to what he had to say. I think it’s a sad in America when the president is, a president, is relegated to “fan status” in order to not only listen to what he has to say but also consider him our president.
My grandmother was irked that the president was mentioned during my grandfather’s funeral when the flag was presented. This was during the Bush years.
We calmed her down by telling her they meant Roosevelt, under whom my grandfather actually served. Or maybe President Bartlet.
| 85 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:12:45pm |
| 86 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:12:57pm |
Black Swan is a truly gripping trip inside obsession and insanity. Don’t write it off as a simple melodrama. The last seen is unforgettable. Beautiful really.
I haven’t seen the other Oscar movies.
| 87 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:13:22pm |
I love how Jake Gyllenhaal held for applause when they mentioned George Lucas, but no applause came…
| 88 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:15:44pm |
re: #77 Lidane
I love the fact that Trent Reznor is now an Oscar winner. He’s come a long way since “Closer”. Heh.
For some reason, I remembered this video, but it’s Jared Leto, not Trent Reznor. Amazing makeup work, anyway. I can barely line my eyes without incident.
| 89 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:16:34pm |
re: #70 Jadespring
He was in a montage about favorite movie songs and was shown for a couple of seconds. All he said was ” There are a lot of great songs but if it’s just one song you have to go with “As time goes By”.
Thanks for details. He’s not the main reason I’m glad I’m not watching. The Oscars are bit on the boring side for me. CSI: Miami has a new episode tonight, and I’d rather watch that.
| 90 |
Ojoe Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:16:47pm |
| 91 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:17:11pm |
re: #85 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Natalie and Mila in the same movie.
HECK YEAH!
Yeah, but the “sex scene” was a cop out. I hate to sound crass, but all my male friends who thought I was being dragged to see Black Swan (not true, I wanted to see it) said “oh man, there is a sex scene with Natalie Portman and Mila Kunis!!!11!!1!”
I got pretty excited, but you know what Mr. Director? Having a sex scene without nudity just comes off as unrealistic and cheap.
| 92 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:18:03pm |
AutoTune is never even a funny joke.
| 93 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:18:46pm |
re: #85 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Natalie and Mila in the same movie.
HECK YEAH!
It also got Natalie Portman her fiance and her first child.
| 94 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:18:47pm |
re: #89 Dark_Falcon
Thanks for details. He’s not the main reason I’m glad I’m not watching. The Oscars are bit on the boring side for me. CSI: Miami has a new episode tonight, and I’d rather watch that.
I have them on while I’m working on a proposal and while procrastinating on working on the proposal while chatting here and surfing. :D
| 95 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:18:55pm |
That being said. I can’t watch the Oscors. After about 10 minutes my head will explode from all of the oozing self importance. I like to watch movies though and have my favorite actors and such. Just can’t do any awards ceremonies.
| 97 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:19:35pm |
re: #91 Soap_Man
Yeah, but the “sex scene” was a cop out. I hate to sound crass, but all my male friends who thought I was being dragged to see Black Swan (not true, I wanted to see it) said “oh man, there is a sex scene with Natalie Portman and Mila Kunis!!!11!!1!”
I got pretty excited, but you know what Mr. Director? Having a sex scene without nudity just comes off as unrealistic and cheap.
If they’d required nudity, Portman might not have done it.
| 99 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:20:09pm |
Trolling the Oscars…
| 100 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:20:19pm |
re: #96 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
But, with nudity… it’s porn.
I didn’t even get side-boob. Meet me half-way here!
| 101 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:20:22pm |
| 102 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:20:54pm |
What gauge wire has Oprah’s waist strapped in? Holy cow. They have her pulled down to a twenty five!
OUCH!
| 103 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:21:22pm |
re: #95 Gus 802
That being said. I can’t watch the Oscors. After about 10 minutes my head will explode from all of the oozing self importance. I like to watch movies though and have my favorite actors and such. Just can’t do any awards ceremonies.
I don’t think I’d even be able to locate my remote control to turn the tv on. Haven’t seen that thing in ages.
| 104 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:21:41pm |
re: #96 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
But, with nudity… it’s porn.
Not necessarily. But its been argued that the mainstreaming of porn has led to reduction of nudity in movies. The argument being that porn took the sex niche over for the most part.
| 105 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:22:36pm |
re: #97 Dark_Falcon
If they’d required nudity, Portman might not have done it.
Oh, I know. It just seems silly to me, a sex scene with no nudity, especially in a movie obviously made for adults.
| 106 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:22:40pm |
re: #100 Soap_Man
I didn’t even get side-boob. Meet me half-way here!
(uh… neither of them have side-boobs.)
| 107 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:23:04pm |
re: #103 Killgore Trout
I don’t think I’d even be able to locate my remote control to turn the tv on. Haven’t seen that thing in ages.
Maybe it’s out in your garden under a leafy green being eaten by snails.
| 109 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:24:03pm |
re: #91 Soap_Man
Yeah, but the “sex scene” was a cop out. I hate to sound crass, but all my male friends who thought I was being dragged to see Black Swan (not true, I wanted to see it) said “oh man, there is a sex scene with Natalie Portman and Mila Kunis!!!11!!1!”
I got pretty excited, but you know what Mr. Director? Having a sex scene without nudity just comes off as unrealistic and cheap.
Movies before nudity was common were unrealistic and cheap?
| 110 |
Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:24:18pm |
Inception was not bad but I honestly didn’t understand what all the noise around it was about. Just an entertaining movie. Same with the Black Swan.
| 111 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:24:43pm |
Sometimes it’s a whooole lot more sexy when nudity isn’t so blatant.
| 112 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:24:48pm |
re: #95 Gus 802
That being said. I can’t watch the Oscors. After about 10 minutes my head will explode from all of the oozing self importance. I like to watch movies though and have my favorite actors and such. Just can’t do any awards ceremonies.
I’m debating whether to keep watching or get back to killing the space zombies that live in my XBox.
| 113 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:26:40pm |
re: #107 Mr Pancakes
Maybe it’s out in your garden under a leafy green being eaten by snails.
Maybe I’ll find it in the spring.
| 114 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:27:16pm |
re: #111 Jadespring
Sometimes it’s a whooole lot more sexy when nudity isn’t so blatant.
Chicks are so silly.
| 115 |
HoosierHoops Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:27:36pm |
re: #111 Jadespring
Sometimes it’s a whooole lot more sexy when nudity isn’t so blatant.
That is true…Art
Then again I know that Nicole Kidman is a true redhead..
| 116 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:28:44pm |
re: #114 Killgore Trout
Chicks are so silly.
Yes well sometimes leaving what’s under the boxers to the imagination is a lot nicer then the reality of what’s actually under the boxers. ;)
| 117 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:30:13pm |
re: #116 Jadespring
Yes well sometimes leaving what’s under the boxers to the imagination is a lot nicer then the reality of what’s actually under the boxers. ;)
Nipples are better than imagination.
| 118 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:30:55pm |
re: #109 The Shadow Do
Movies before nudity was common were unrealistic and cheap?
No. You can have a sex scene without nudity and have it work (where the sex is more implied than shown.) But, if you saw the scene, it was really intense and graphic. Ramping it up to that level and being like “oh, they both kept their bras on” seems, yes, unrealistic. In that scene it’s distracting.
I’m not complaining that I went to the movies and didn’t get any T&A. (The side-boob comment was a joke.) I just thought the scene came off as an unsuccessful mix of sauciness and timidity.
| 119 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:31:41pm |
re: #115 HoosierHoops
That is true…Art
Then again I know that Nicole Kidman is a true redhead..
That was in Billy Bathgate as I remember. Fairly accurate depiction of Dutch Schultz’s life, though Dustin Hoffman portrayed him wrong. By way of contrast, Hoodlum got the history wrong but Tim Roth’s portrayal of Schultz was spot on.
| 120 |
The Shadow Do Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:32:56pm |
re: #118 Soap_Man
No. You can have a sex scene without nudity and have it work (where the sex is more implied than shown.) But, if you saw the scene, it was really intense and graphic. Ramping it up to that level and being like “oh, they both kept their bras on” seems, yes, unrealistic. In that scene it’s distracting.
I’m not complaining that I went to the movies and didn’t get any T&A. (The side-boob comment was a joke.) I just thought the scene came off as an unsuccessful mix of sauciness and timidity.
I thought it went quite far enough, but that is just me.
| 121 |
Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:33:13pm |
re: #117 Mr Pancakes
Nipples are better than imagination.
Well, I hope my dates have a good imagination, because there are no nipples in my boxers. :(
| 122 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:33:33pm |
In a movie I saw today I saw Jeffery Morgan’s bare ass though. That was pretty awesome.
| 123 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:33:35pm |
It looks like the new fashion statement for Hollywood actors is a sparse and patchy 5:00 shadow.
| 124 |
HoosierHoops Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:33:42pm |
re: #119 Dark_Falcon
That was in Billy Bathgate as I remember. Fairly accurate depiction of Dutch Schultz’s life, though Dustin Hoffman portrayed him wrong. By way of contrast, Hoodlum got the history wrong but Tim Roth’s portrayal of Schultz was spot on.
The only thing I remember of that movie was Nicole skinny dipping.. I love Art
/
| 125 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:34:37pm |
re: #119 Dark_Falcon
Only because Roth is brilliant.
| 126 |
Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:35:45pm |
1234.
Now that sure doesn’t sound like a sock username. /
| 128 |
sizzleRI Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:37:55pm |
re: #118 Soap_Man
No. You can have a sex scene without nudity and have it work (where the sex is more implied than shown.) But, if you saw the scene, it was really intense and graphic. Ramping it up to that level and being like “oh, they both kept their bras on” seems, yes, unrealistic. In that scene it’s distracting.
I’m not complaining that I went to the movies and didn’t get any T&A. (The side-boob comment was a joke.) I just thought the scene came off as an unsuccessful mix of sauciness and timidity.
I’m in between agreeing with you and wondering if that was the point. Portman’s character is all sorts of twisted around sexuality so I kind of wonder if a mix of sauciness and timidity is what the director was intending.
| 129 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:39:03pm |
re: #124 HoosierHoops
The only thing I remember of that movie was Nicole skinny dipping.. I love Art
/
[DF throws a bucket of cold water on HH]
| 130 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:39:59pm |
Otherwise I find most sex scenes on mainstream movies to be far too long, contrived, schmaltzy, goofy and boring. When they’re out of ideas or stuck with poor writing they usually rely on long “deus ex machina” sex scenes.
| 131 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:40:30pm |
re: #125 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Only because Roth is brilliant.
I love Tim Roth…… I first saw him in Rob Roy…… what a performance. Then Reservoir Dogs…. I was hooked.
I was sorry to see him go “TV”.
| 132 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:41:27pm |
re: #128 sizzleRI
I’m in between agreeing with you and wondering if that was the point. Portman’s character is all sorts of twisted around sexuality so I kind of wonder if a mix of sauciness and timidity is what the director was intending.
Hmm, hadn’t thought about it that way. Up-ding.
| 133 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:41:29pm |
Or a period piece with modern music. If the movie is taking place in the 1940s for example please don’t use rock and roll. The music has to match the period being represented.
| 134 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:45:18pm |
Gwyneth Paltrow is country music’s biggest new star? That slipped by me.
| 135 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:45:54pm |
re: #134 Soap_Man
Gwyneth Paltrow is country music’s biggest new star? That slipped by me.
Roy Acuff is rolling in his grave.
| 136 |
Skeetghazi Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:46:01pm |
re: #134 Soap_Man
Gwyneth Paltrow is country music’s biggest new star? That slipped by me.
She sucks.
| 137 |
sagehen Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:49:09pm |
re: #66 Dark_Falcon
Glad I’m not watching. I don’t like to hear from him. He’s not evil, I do know that, but I’ll never be a fan of his.
I am.
| 138 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:49:39pm |
re: #134 Soap_Man
Gwyneth Paltrow is country music’s biggest new star? That slipped by me.
She’s a movie star first, who’s done some singing in her movies.
| 139 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:51:18pm |
The next part coming up is what I call the “Hey I didn’t know that he died… Oh no SHE died? ” segment.
| 140 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:51:33pm |
re: #137 sagehen
I am.
[Video]
I can’t sit in a Carabou Coffee without hearing that damn song four times. Also, Obama is a very awkward dancer.
| 142 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:52:59pm |
re: #139 Jadespring
The next part coming up is what I call the “Hey I didn’t know that he died… Oh no SHE died? ” segment.
They left Farrah out last year.
| 146 |
Soap_Man Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:55:56pm |
| 147 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:56:39pm |
Okay. I didn’t know Dennis Hopper died. When did that happen? :(
| 148 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:57:01pm |
re: #147 Jadespring
Okay. I didn’t know Dennis Hopper died. When did that happen? :(
Couple of months ago.
| 149 |
Varek Raith Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:57:18pm |
| 152 |
sagehen Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:57:45pm |
re: #140 Soap_Man
I can’t sit in a Carabou Coffee without hearing that damn song four times. Also, Obama is a very awkward dancer.
Jamie Foxx mentioned that at the Motown thing earlier this week — “I saw you on Ellen, that’s the white side of your heritage.”
| 153 |
Varek Raith Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:57:49pm |
| 154 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 7:58:18pm |
re: #147 Jadespring
Okay. I didn’t know Dennis Hopper died. When did that happen? :(
Bookmark Life In Legacy …….. check it weekly.
| 157 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:03:02pm |
I like Hilary Swank. She’s one of my favourites.
| 158 |
HoosierHoops Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:04:15pm |
re: #157 Jadespring
I like Hilary Swank. She’s one of my favourites.
I loved her in million dollar baby
| 159 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:06:30pm |
Yike. What’s up with Twitter. Taking a million years to load all the time.
| 160 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:07:08pm |
Yikes that is. Took a nap before and my brain is still trapped somewhere in a dream I had.
| 161 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:08:53pm |
re: #160 Gus 802
Yikes that is. Took a nap before and my brain is still trapped somewhere in a dream I had.
What was your dream?
| 163 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:10:35pm |
re: #162 Gus 802
Oh, I already forgot it. ;)
I hate to break it to you but you are still asleep. This is a dream. I am a dream…..
| 164 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:11:01pm |
re: #163 Jadespring
I hate to break it to you but you are still asleep. This is a dream. I am a dream…
We are in a dream within a dream!
| 165 |
Varek Raith Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:11:56pm |
| 166 |
Gus Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:12:13pm |
re: #164 Gus 802
We are in a dream within a dream!
Take this kiss upon the brow!
And, in parting from you now,
Thus much let me avow-
You are not wrong, who deem
That my days have been a dream;
Yet if hope has flown away
In a night, or in a day,
In a vision, or in none,
Is it therefore the less gone?
All that we see or seem
Is but a dream within a dream.
I stand amid the roar
Of a surf-tormented shore,
And I hold within my hand
Grains of the golden sand-
How few! yet how they creep
Through my fingers to the deep,
While I weep- while I weep!
O God! can I not grasp
Them with a tighter clasp?
O God! can I not save
One from the pitiless wave?
Is all that we see or seem
But a dream within a dream?
Edgar Allan Poe
| 167 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:12:35pm |
I’m watching last week’s Daily Shows. John Oliver is gently upbraiding a man for having a sign with a swastika on it, and telling people who call Walker a tyrant that they’re getting over the top.
The Magical Balance Fairy’s got nothing.
| 169 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:18:17pm |
SFZ—so, familysearch is bringing up 145,000 Peter and Mary Mullers.
Where did they settle (will help to narrow things down.)
| 171 |
Varek Raith Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:19:23pm |
| 172 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:19:49pm |
I just read the best comment ever on that Oregonian article about that congressman who sent a picture of himself dressed as a tiger to his staff.
Charade of journalism, worse than David, Wu, the movie, “the man that shot Liberty Valance” journalism, “The Shin Bone Star”, and the Oregonian, in so many case’s as now with Mr.Wu. Because of the aggravation, of staff, pink, pink, behaving staff, your not affiliated with the communist party, your affiliated, and entrenched, with a worse, of the same thinking, NOT, about what ever you are involved with, you are worse than the catholic church, and molesting some thing more personal, than the human groin, and there are things more personal, than the human groin, around here phony journalist, can never understand, or staff members out of the image of livings charade’s.
[Link: www.oregonlive.com…]
| 173 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:20:46pm |
re: #172 Obdicut
“molesting something more personal than the human groin” is my new motto.
| 174 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:21:07pm |
re: #172 Obdicut
I just read the best comment ever on that Oregonian article about that congressman who sent a picture of himself dressed as a tiger to his staff.
[Link: www.oregonlive.com…]
Wow. This person obviously takes it personally that the Oregonian exposed a little mental unbalanced-ness in Mr. Wu. Wonder why?
| 175 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:21:43pm |
re: #174 EmmmieG
Possibly because he can’t stop thinking about staff, pink, pink, behaving staff.
| 176 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:22:42pm |
This is the picture of the congressman.
Image: david-wu-tiger-300x225.jpg
He looks like a fun guy who may also be bugnuts.
| 177 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:23:20pm |
re: #172 Obdicut
I just read the best comment ever on that Oregonian article about that congressman who sent a picture of himself dressed as a tiger to his staff.
[Link: www.oregonlive.com…]
Talk about your stream-of-consciousness. I can’t make heads or tails of that comment. About the only clear thing is that the person who wrote it is in serious need of medication.
| 178 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:23:42pm |
re: #169 EmmmieG
SFZ—so, familysearch is bringing up 145,000 Peter and Mary Mullers.
Where did they settle (will help to narrow things down.)
I’d have to pull out the book. Get back to you on that?
| 179 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:24:51pm |
re: #174 EmmmieG
Wow. This person obviously takes it personally that the Oregonian exposed a little mental unbalanced-ness in Mr. Wu. Wonder why?
I think because the commentator is him/herself unbalanced.
| 180 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:25:45pm |
Well, I’m going to go to bed and molest something more personal than the human groin.
Take care, all.
| 181 |
Varek Raith Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:26:42pm |
re: #180 Obdicut
Well, I’m going to go to bed and molest something more personal than the human groin.
Take care, all.
What ever floats your boat???
/
| 182 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:29:17pm |
re: #178 SanFranciscoZionist
I’d have to pull out the book. Get back to you on that?
Sure. I was doing indexing tonight, so I thought about it. If you know where they settled, you have that as a starting point. Or even if you know where they lived in a census year.
| 183 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:35:29pm |
re: #140 Soap_Man
I can’t sit in a Carabou Coffee without hearing that damn song four times. Also, Obama is a very awkward dancer.
It’s his half-whiteness.
| 185 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:42:25pm |
re: #184 Mr Pancakes
The King’s Speech won… well deserved.
I agree. Been in love with Colin Firth since Bridget Jones Diary.
| 186 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:43:56pm |
re: #184 Mr Pancakes
The King’s Speech won… well deserved.
It seemed good, I’ll try to see it when it gets to HBO.
| 187 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:46:10pm |
Huh. Who knew. Gaddifi has multi-millions in Canadian banks and was planning on withdrawing it all tomorrow.
Not anymore though. The doors have been shut.
| 188 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:48:24pm |
re: #186 Dark_Falcon
It seemed good, I’ll try to see it when it gets to HBO.
I saw it Friday night….. don’t tell anyone one, but it brought a tear to my eye at the end…… quite moving.
Inception also made me cry, only because it seemed to never end.
| 189 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:48:49pm |
Evening all!
I am blissfully ignorant of what happened at the Oscars tonite.
How is everyone?
| 190 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:50:05pm |
re: #189 ggt
Evening all!
I am blissfully ignorant of what happened at the Oscars tonite.
How is everyone?
I’m good.
re: #187 Jadespring
Huh. Who knew. Gaddifi has multi-millions in Canadian banks and was planning on withdrawing it all tomorrow.
Not anymore though. The doors have been shut.
And i’m glad Canada caught on in time keep Gaddafi from getting out his ill-gotten gains.
| 191 |
Jadespring Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:50:16pm |
re: #189 ggt
Evening all!
I am blissfully ignorant of what happened at the Oscars tonite.
How is everyone?
Well you missed a lot. Anne Hathaway had a wardrobe malfunction and we saw her boobs.
| 192 |
jaunte Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:51:00pm |
“Everything is calm. Everything is peaceful. The point is there’s a big gap between reality and the media reports.”
— Seif al-Islam, reprising the role of Baghdad Bob, originally played by Mohammed Saeed al-Sahhaf.
| 193 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:52:13pm |
re: #192 jaunte
“Everything is calm. Everything is peaceful. The point is there’s a big gap between reality and the media reports.”
— Seif al-Islam, reprising the role of Baghdad Bob, originally played by Mohammed Saeed al-Sahhaf.
[snicker]
| 194 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:52:22pm |
| 195 |
Varek Raith Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:53:54pm |
| 196 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:54:27pm |
Almost forgot *snicker*:
FABLE OF THE PORCUPINE
Fable of the porcupine It was the coldest
winter ever. Many animals died because of the
cold. The porcupines, realizing the situation, decided
to group together. This way they covered and protected
themselves; but the quills of each one wounded their closest
companions even though they gave off heat to each other.
After awhile, they decided to distance themselves one
from the other and they began to die, alone and frozen.
So they had to make a choice:
Either accept the quills of
their companions or disappear from the Earth. Wisely,
they decided to go back to being together. This way they
learned to live with the little wounds that were caused by the
close relationship with their companion, but the most
important part of it, was the heat that came from the others.
This way they were able to survive.
Moral of the story:
The best relationship is not the one that brings
together perfect people, but the best is when each individual
learns to live with the imperfections of others and can admire
the other person’s good qualities.
Or in other words …
LEARN TO LOVE THE PRICKS IN YOUR LIFE.
| 197 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:54:37pm |
| 198 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:55:20pm |
re: #197 Dark_Falcon
Well, once its ready, you can see if any of the local Canada Geese want to play the sacred geese of the temple.
//
They could be roasted over the eternal flame to feed the homeless.
| 199 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:55:30pm |
re: #185 moderatelyradicalliberal
I agree. Been in love with Colin Firth since Bridget Jones Diary.
I guess I need to check that movie out…. I saw him in some marginal movies.
Mamma Mia!
The Accidental Husband
Then She Found Me
I did like him a lot in Easy Virtue though.
| 200 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:56:05pm |
re: #192 jaunte
“Everything is calm. Everything is peaceful. The point is there’s a big gap between reality and the media reports.”
— Seif al-Islam, reprising the role of Baghdad Bob, originally played by Mohammed Saeed al-Sahhaf.
Tee hee
| 201 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:56:36pm |
re: #195 Varek Raith
Heh.
I put my current project on hold. That damn rotating section just won’t come out right!
I prefer architecture. The only moving parts to deal with are doors and windows.
| 202 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:57:19pm |
re: #199 Mr Pancakes
I guess I need to check that movie out… I saw him in some marginal movies.
Mamma Mia!
The Accidental Husband
Then She Found MeI did like him a lot in Easy Virtue though.
He was also really good in A Single Man with Julianne Moore.
| 203 |
jaunte Sun, Feb 27, 2011 8:59:58pm |
Telling Libya’s story over the Internet
Reporting from Umm Saad, Libya —
Suleiman Zjailil is a modern-day town crier. He spends his days driving his battered car back and forth across the border with Egypt, smuggling out grainy cellphone videos so the world can see the news from his quarantined land.Zjailil, an engineer in the Libyan coastal city of Tobruk, is determined to deliver visual proof of President Moammar Kadafi’s bloody tactics against a mounting populist rebellion.
Armed only with thumb drives and CDs, he downloads videos taken by Libyans and makes the 95-mile trip from Tobruk to Egypt.
………
Zjailil said the defining purpose of his video-smuggling efforts is to expose and publicize the killings by Libyan soldiers and militias, and especially the mercenaries.“If you want to enrage a Libyan, just bring in a foreigner against him,” Zjailil said.
| 204 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:02:37pm |
re: #202 moderatelyradicalliberal
He was also really good in A Single Man with Julianne Moore.
That’s right….. I believe it was nominated last year and I never saw it…. I will add that to my Netflix que as well.
If you want to see Julianne Moore in a truly disturbing movie….. check out Savage Grace.
| 205 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:03:26pm |
I’m waiting anxiously for Fast and Furious 5 to be released. I might actually see it in the theatre.
| 206 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:03:32pm |
re: #203 jaunte
Tobruk. First time I’ve heard a story of that city that wasn’t of WWII vintage. And its a tough 95 miles to Sollum in Egypt, too. You have to drive through Halfaya Pass, the heat is intense. But that man is doing the Lord’s Work, and I wish him every success.
| 208 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:07:57pm |
| 209 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:08:24pm |
re: #207 ggt
I’m pretty much done with car chases but I might show up for a Road Warrior flick if it had Mad Mel in it.
| 210 |
jaunte Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:10:09pm |
re: #208 ggt
China seems like a much, much tougher power structure for another revolution to overcome.
| 211 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:10:27pm |
| 212 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:10:52pm |
A Tale Of Two Flags: Libya’s Battle Of Symbols
“As of Friday, the flag flying at the Washington residence of former Libyan ambassador Ali Aujali is the same flag being touted by Libyans seeking the removal of Moammar Gadhafi from power.The move is purely symbolic — Aujali resigned his official post Tuesday, to protest Gadhafi’s violent crackdown on opposition protesters. But flying what is now known as the “pre-Gadhafi flag” reveals how deep the schism is between the government and the protesters.
In 1977, Gadhafi’s Libya officially adopted a solid-green flag, abandoning an older design that featured three horizontal stripes of red, black and green.
The mid-70s seem to have been the enigmatic ruler’s “Green Period” — in that era, Gadhafi also printed The Green Book, his own political doctrine that’s often described as a blend of socialism and nationalism, along with spiritual elements.
The book’s first volume also had a subtitle which can now only seem inauspicious: “The Solution of the Problem of Democracy.”
Has anything like this ever happened before. Diplomats taking such a strong stand?
| 213 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:11:49pm |
re: #209 Killgore Trout
I’m pretty much done with car chases but I might show up for a Road Warrior flick if it had Mad Mel in it.
Old Mel in a Road Warrior flick?
How would they write it for Grandpa?
| 214 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:12:38pm |
re: #210 jaunte
China seems like a much, much tougher power structure for another revolution to overcome.
I don’t think it be a big violent revolution. Just perhaps, Chinese getting the true information to other Chinese in country.
| 217 |
freetoken Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:14:29pm |
re: #210 jaunte
China seems like a much, much tougher power structure for another revolution to overcome.
And, we shouldn’t presume that any given group of Chinese protesters really are wanting what Western observers may wish they wanted.
| 218 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:14:35pm |
re: #197 Dark_Falcon
Well, once its ready, you can see if any of the local Canada Geese want to play the sacred geese of the temple.
//
Are there going to be figures of Vestal Virgins?
| 219 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:15:25pm |
re: #199 Mr Pancakes
I guess I need to check that movie out… I saw him in some marginal movies.
Mamma Mia!
The Accidental Husband
Then She Found MeI did like him a lot in Easy Virtue though.
I don’t really get Bridget Jones, but I do enjoy the movies. The fight scene in each of them is the high point for me.
| 220 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:15:46pm |
re: #213 ggt
Old Mel in a Road Warrior flick?
How would they write it for Grandpa?
I’m sure they’d fuck it up but it should be a story about what happens to hard men who get old in a hard world.
| 222 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:16:37pm |
re: #220 Killgore Trout
I’m sure they’d fuck it up but it should be a story about what happens to hard men who get old in a hard world.
We saw that tonight with Kirk Douglas.
| 223 |
jaunte Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:16:45pm |
re: #219 SanFranciscoZionist
That is possibly the beat incompetent fighting ever filmed.
| 224 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:16:49pm |
re: #210 jaunte
China seems like a much, much tougher power structure for another revolution to overcome.
Also, despite many, many problems, I think China is optimistic about the future. Makes a difference.
| 225 |
jaunte Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:18:30pm |
re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist
Right, there are a lot of people there getting rich now, though there isn’t much to put your money in safely.
| 226 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:18:47pm |
re: #223 jaunte
That is possibly the beat incompetent fighting ever filmed.
It’s perfect. They’re mad as hell, but neither of them has been in a fist fight since they were eleven, and then, also, with another upper-middle-class British classmate. They have no idea what they’re doing, but they’re trying really, really hard.
| 227 |
stevemcg Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:19:13pm |
I know people like to poke holes in movies about historic events, but is there any chance the queen mother in real life was as hot as Helena Bonham Carter?
| 228 |
freetoken Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:19:27pm |
China says its population passed 1.34 billion people last year
That’s a lot of mouths to feed.
| 229 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:22:34pm |
re: #227 stevemcg
I know people like to poke holes in movies about historic events, but is there any chance the queen mother in real life was as hot as Helena Bonham Carter?
No….. in fact, Rosalynn Carter would have been hotter.
| 230 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:22:47pm |
re: #227 stevemcg
I know people like to poke holes in movies about historic events, but is there any chance the queen mother in real life was as hot as Helena Bonham Carter?
She was a pretty girl, although not of Helena Bonham Carter caliber.
But Hitler did call her ‘the most dangerous woman in Europe’, which is something.
| 232 |
Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:27:44pm |
re: #208 ggt
How long before we start seeing things like this from China?
I think China has a potential for further evolution towards a more open society, unlike the countries which have the revolutions now.
| 233 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:29:02pm |
re: #232 Sergey Romanov
I think China has a potential for further evolution towards a more open society, unlike the countries which have the revolutions now.
Hopefully they demand higher wages soon.
| 234 |
freetoken Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:30:00pm |
re: #232 Sergey Romanov
However, given that China can be thought of as an “empire” today - with parts of traditional Mongolia, central Asian tribal nations, and of course Tibet - I wonder how a more “open” China could hold onto breakaway movements in those areas.
| 235 |
Political Atheist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:30:08pm |
re: #232 Sergey Romanov
I agree but time will abide this. Perhaps a decade or more.
| 236 |
ProBosniaLiberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:31:54pm |
re: #234 freetoken
The biggest issue for me with China is the Uyghurs. The government there pisses me off to no end, by nobody in the US seems to actually know about them, or the treatment they get.
| 237 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:33:29pm |
re: #235 Rightwingconspirator
I agree but time will abide this. Perhaps a decade or more.
You’re right…… I’ve always said things will swing back, but perhaps not in my lifetime. The playing field is not level right now.
| 238 |
freetoken Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:33:42pm |
re: #236 ProLifeLiberal
Well, we have given asylum to some Uyghurs, IIRC.
China is a large and complex conglomeration of peoples, something that Americans tend to ignore.
| 239 |
Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:33:59pm |
re: #234 freetoken
No idea, however evolution is preferable to a violent revolution, unless there are no more chances for the former. I think China has chances, so hopefully there will be a peaceful, though slow, transition rather than a traumatic jolt with unpredictable consequences.
| 240 |
Political Atheist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:34:24pm |
re: #237 Mr Pancakes
China must rise further before it will fall to real change.
| 241 |
ProBosniaLiberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:38:11pm |
re: #238 freetoken
Yeah, unfortunately, that agglomeration of people has one group on top, with the rest getting varying levels of worse treatment. But as the the bible (and Bomber Harris during the Blitz) said
They sowed the wind, and now they are going to reap the whirlwind.
The eventual whirlwind will be brutal. 60 years of vicious repression will eventually vent.
| 242 |
lostlakehiker Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:38:56pm |
re: #11 The Shadow Do
It would seem to argue that a nuclear war would be a bad thing. Go figure.
There’s more to it than just “bad thing”. We already know that war, any war, means many people dying, much treasure squandered, and directly or indirectly, as a result, many more deaths.
Why, then, does war even exist? Because there are other bad things. Tyranny, aggression, etc. etc. Sometimes, every choice is bad, and sometimes, war isn’t as bad as the others.
But now we’re into comparisons. When we compare, we must size up just how bad the war figures to be. This must be done soberly, and with an eye to war’s tendency to get out of hand.
Once these kinds of costs are taken into account, war between nuclear powers, or war that may draw in nuclear powers, can be seen in a clearer light. The human costs associated with the immediate destruction are, however great they may be, almost irrelevant. They’re rounding errors compared to the secondary toll from famine.
| 243 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:38:57pm |
| 244 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:39:24pm |
re: #220 Killgore Trout
I’m sure they’d fuck it up but it should be a story about what happens to hard men who get old in a hard world.
Wasn’t that called No Country for Old Men?
| 245 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:40:42pm |
| 246 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:41:18pm |
re: #230 SanFranciscoZionist
She was a pretty girl, although not of Helena Bonham Carter caliber.
But Hitler did call her ‘the most dangerous woman in Europe’, which is something.
From what I understand, the Queen Mum was something quite special. The kind of women who would walk away from a gun fight, if one actually had the guts to confront her.
| 247 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:41:28pm |
re: #236 ProLifeLiberal
The biggest issue for me with China is the Uighur. The government there pisses me off to no end, by nobody in the US seems to actually know about them, or the treatment they get.
They are a really interesting culture. I was in the region about 8 years ago. They look like turks but the culture is part Mongolian, part Tibetan, a little bit of Islam all combined with a cultural sexual permissiveness which was quite surprising. I had a tour Uighur tour guide and I asked her to sing me a song one day on a long car ride. After she sang the song I asked her what the words meant. It was something like ” I like when you walk by my tent, please beat me gently with a whip”. Young girls are given their own courting quarters in traditional homes to accept suitors late at night. Very interesting people. Also the mosques in far western China don’t adhere to the restrictions on graven images. They are decorated with carvings of people and animals.
| 248 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:41:41pm |
re: #232 Sergey Romanov
I think China has a potential for further evolution towards a more open society, unlike the countries which have the revolutions now.
That is a good way to put it, evolution not revolution!
| 249 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:42:22pm |
re: #238 freetoken
Well, we have given asylum to some Uyghurs, IIRC.
China is a large and complex conglomeration of peoples, something that Americans tend to ignore.
A lot like us?
| 250 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:42:37pm |
| 251 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:43:35pm |
re: #244 ggt
Wasn’t that called No Country for Old Men?
They could go that route or they could do something like Unforgiven where Mad Mel is still a sociopath in a world of wanabees. There is a lot of potential.
| 252 |
Varek Raith Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:44:30pm |
re: #8 brookly red
OK, now this from National Geographic…
[Link: news.nationalgeographic.com…]
have fun with this one y’all
| 253 |
ProBosniaLiberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:44:57pm |
re: #247 Killgore Trout
They are a really interesting culture. I was in the region about 8 years ago. They look like turks but the culture is part Mongolian, part Tibetan, a little bit of Islam all combined with a cultural sexual permissiveness which was quite surprising. I had a tour Uighur tour guide and I asked her to sing me a song one day on a long car ride. After she sang the song I asked her what the words meant. It was something like ” I like when you walk by my tent, please beat me gently with a whip”. Young girls are given their own courting quarters in traditional homes to accept suitors late at night. Very interesting people. Also the mosques in far western China don’t adhere to the restrictions on graven images. They are decorated with carvings of people and animals.
o_O
That seems a little kinky. Whatever floats your boat I guess.
I notice some of the Muslims on campus have their pet areas. Some have Palestine, one person Kashmir. I have the Uyghurs. Part of this is that I love the Turks. When I meant a Turkish exchange student on campus this year, they were surprised by my reaction. Which was shouting awesome. And squeeing.
| 254 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:45:04pm |
re: #251 Killgore Trout
They could go that route or they could do something like Unforgiven where Mad Mel is still a sociopath in a world of wanabees. There is a lot of potential.
The best old man serious movie, I think, was Gran Torino with Clint.
| 255 |
ProBosniaLiberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:46:31pm |
re: #253 ProLifeLiberal
I had a similar reaction to a Moroccan exchange student.
| 256 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:46:39pm |
BTW, Somebody has finally had the god damned decency to release the original Mad Max without the fucking annoying American accent overdubs….
| 257 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:47:20pm |
re: #256 Killgore Trout
BTW, Somebody has finally had the god damned decency to release the original Mad Max without the fucking annoying American accent overdubs…
[Video]
Is it the one where Mel looks like he is about 18?
| 258 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:49:17pm |
It’s going to freeze tonite in the Chicagoland area. AND it’s been raining. I left my car out for about an hour and the windows were ice when I returned. Melted easily once I started the care and ran the wipers and such.
Won’t be nice for those who have to get out early in the am. Roads will be slick. Nice for a Monday morning.
Be careful everyone!
| 259 |
Mr Pancakes Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:49:54pm |
re: #253 ProLifeLiberal
o_O
That seems a little kinky. Whatever floats your boat I guess.
I notice some of the Muslims on campus have their pet areas. Some have Palestine, one person Kashmir. I have the Uyghurs. Part of this is that I love the Turks. When I meant a Turkish exchange student on campus this year, they were surprised by my reaction. Which was shouting awesome. And squeeing.
I shout and squeal when the Jehovah Witness’s show up at my door.
| 260 |
lostlakehiker Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:50:16pm |
re: #238 freetoken
Well, we have given asylum to some Uyghurs, IIRC.
China is a large and complex conglomeration of peoples, something that Americans tend to ignore.
China is large, and there are many ethnic minorities, but even in aggregate, they are a very small part of the whole. There can’t be any whirlwind. The Uyghur’s likely fate is to intermarry into the Han population, somewhat, and to be swamped by them and marginalized and dwindle in numbers, somewhat. The Han tend to be better educated, they speak and read the national dialects better, and there’s nothing wrong with their work ethic. Plus, they’re kind of clannish and they favor their own. Add that up, and the likely demographic fate of ethnic minorities is easy enough to see.
In a few decades, China will have the largest GDP of any single nation. We’re going to have to get used to China having a big voice in world affairs, and we’re not going to have the option to hector them over their treatment of minorities. Their commercial and military weight will be such that they will be able to shrug it off with impunity, and even scores at their leisure.
Plus, we really need China on board for the human effort to mitigate and contain global warming. China will be gravely hurt by AGW, and might come on board the effort to limit it if the rest of the big economies can be persuaded. Side irritants will have to be put to the side.
| 261 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:51:06pm |
re: #257 ggt
Is it the one where Mel looks like he is about 18?
He’s young, maybe mid 20’s. It’s amazingly stupid that it took so long for them to ditch the overdubbed version of that movie.
| 262 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:52:47pm |
re: #260 lostlakehiker
Isn’t their goal for all people to be assimilated by the Han?
Trying to get the “international community” to turn a blind eye to the Human Rights violations to get actual work done isn’t going to be easy. I’m not sure it should be.
I’m already pretty tired of the US getting beat-up over stuff and the Chinese getting a pass.
| 263 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:53:24pm |
re: #261 Killgore Trout
He’s young, maybe mid 20’s. It’s amazingly stupid that it took so long for them to ditch the overdubbed version of that movie.
That was such a “B” movie.
| 264 |
lostlakehiker Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:57:33pm |
re: #32 researchok
You just can’t make this stuff up.
Great head wear fashion, too.
No. This is all wrong. The hats have to be made of tin foil. The Faraday effect then prevents long frequency electromagnetic radiation from penetrating the hat.
And what’s more, tin foil alien abduction prevention hats have NEVER, EVER, failed. There is not one single confirmed incident of an alien abducting someone who was wearing one of those hats.
///
| 265 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:57:44pm |
New Irish Government Yet Unclear After Vote
“The Green Party, which had six seats in the Dail and was Fianna Fail’s junior partner in government, lost all its seats.
Sinn Fein president Gerry Adams, who resigned his seat in the British parliament to run for the Dail, was among the winners.
Irish voters punished Fianna Fail for 13 percent unemployment, tax hikes, wage cuts and a humiliating bailout that Ireland had to accept from the European Union and the International Monetary Fund. In elections going back to 1932, Fianna Fail had never won less than 39 percent of the vote and had always been the largest party in the Dail.
Fine Gael (“tribe of the Irish”) and Fianna Fail (“soldiers of destiny”) were born from opposing sides in Ireland’s civil war of the 1920s, and many see little difference between them on the issues. Fianna Fail, however, was leading the government when the property boom collapsed in 2007, and it put taxpayers on the hook to bail out Ireland’s failing banks.”
If I tried to pronounce the party names, I’d get laughed at.
| 266 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:58:29pm |
re: #264 lostlakehiker
No. This is all wrong. The hats have to be made of tin foil. The Faraday effect then prevents long frequency electromagnetic radiation from penetrating the hat.
And what’s more, tin foil alien abduction prevention hats have NEVER, EVER, failed. There is not one single confirmed incident of an alien abducting someone who was wearing one of those hats.
///
Nowadays, they have to be gold-plated tin-foil hats.
| 267 |
ProBosniaLiberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 9:59:27pm |
re: #262 ggt
Yeah, same here. I do honestly hope that what the PRC has been sowing bites them in the ass. China has also pissed off alot of countries recently. Most notably when they pissed of Turkey a year or two ago over the uprising. The Uyghurs are Turks, though distantly related. What makes this strange is the fact that some Muslims complain about Kashmir, but don’t raise a peep about the Uyghurs. While the Kashmiris are being treated poorly, culturally they are allowed to exist. The Chinese government on the other hand, has been trying to bury and destroy the culture of the Uyghurs. They (the PRC) are a much bigger menace to Muslims than any other nation in my view.
| 268 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:01:41pm |
re: #267 ProLifeLiberal
Yeah, same here. I do honestly hope that what the PRC has been sowing bites them in the ass. China has also pissed off alot of countries recently. Most notably when they pissed of Turkey a year or two ago over the uprising. The Uyghurs are Turks, though distantly related. What makes this strange is the fact that some Muslims complain about Kashmir, but don’t raise a peep about the Uyghurs. While the Kashmiris are being treated poorly, culturally they are allowed to exist. The Chinese government on the other hand, has been trying to bury and destroy the culture of the Uyghurs. They (the PRC) are a much bigger menace to Muslims than any other nation in my view.
China must learn to embrace individuality.
Freedom demands it.
| 269 |
lostlakehiker Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:02:55pm |
| 270 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:03:50pm |
re: #265 ggt
From my link above:
“Fine Gael said it would seek to balance public finances mainly through cuts, not tax hikes; it would also reform the health service and abolish 150 public bodies.”
I’m not sure how to read that …
:0
| 271 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:07:06pm |
China Uses Whistles And Water On Protests
“Police have questioned, placed under house arrest and detained more than 100 people, according to rights groups. At least five have been detained on subversion or national security charges, in some cases for passing on information about the protest calls.Pressure to tamp down protest is higher in Beijing. Senior politicians from around the country converge on the capital this week for the legislature’s annual session and a simultaneous meeting of a top advisory body — events that always bring high security.
Police seemed to outnumber pedestrians at Wangfujing. Groups of men with earpieces crowded the seats near the window of a KFC outlet scanning the street outside.
After blocking entrance to Wangfujing, police took away foreign news photographers, camera crews and reporters from The Associated Press, the BBC, Voice of America, German state broadcasters ARD and ZDF, and others. They were taken to an office where they were told special permission was needed to report from Wangfujing. In doing so, the government appears to be extending a ban on reporting at Tiananmen Square and reinterpreting more relaxed rules put in place ahead of the 2008 Beijing Olympics.”
| 272 |
compound idaho Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:07:23pm |
I want to propose a toast!
Please listen and maybe dance if someone is close by. In honor of my parents 60th wedding anniversary; Mr. Compound Sr. would push the kitchen table to the side of the room and dance with my mother to this tune. They are now both 80+. What they found with each other is something special. It is funny how the perception of our parents changes with time, from all knowing, to nice folks, to just goofy kids like ourselves trying to get by. I wish everybody could be so lucky. I wish to be so lucky.
Drink!
| 274 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:08:35pm |
re: #272 compound idaho
[Video]I want to propose a toast!
Please listen and maybe dance if someone is close by. In honor of my parents 60th wedding anniversary; Mr. Compound Sr. would push the kitchen table to the side of the room and dance with my mother to this tune. They are now both 80+. What they found with each other is something special. It is funny how the perception of our parents changes with time, from all knowing, to nice folks, to just goofy kids like ourselves trying to get by. I wish everybody could be so lucky. I wish to be so lucky.
Drink!
very cool!
| 275 |
Usually refered to as anyways Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:10:34pm |
re: #272 compound idaho
To your parents, happy 60th anniversary.
Cheers…
| 276 |
lostlakehiker Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:11:33pm |
re: #267 ProLifeLiberal
Yeah, same here. I do honestly hope that what the PRC has been sowing bites them in the ass. China has also pissed off alot of countries recently. Most notably when they pissed of Turkey a year or two ago over the uprising. The Uyghurs are Turks, though distantly related. What makes this strange is the fact that some Muslims complain about Kashmir, but don’t raise a peep about the Uyghurs. While the Kashmiris are being treated poorly, culturally they are allowed to exist. The Chinese government on the other hand, has been trying to bury and destroy the culture of the Uyghurs. They (the PRC) are a much bigger menace to Muslims than any other nation in my view.
There are other sources of friction. The Indonesian treatment of ethnic Chinese has included some fairly serious pogroms. As China becomes more powerful, she will be less likely to look away. In Malaysia, Prime Minister Mahathir proclaimed discriminatory laws to hold down that nation’s Chinese. And now, there are Chinese workers all around the world, including, unless they just now made good their escape, Libya.
China isn’t going to convert to Islam, ever. She might insist on better treatment of ethnic Chinese in her neighborhood. But she isn’t going to go looking for trouble either. She’s not a threat to Turkey, or Pakistan, or Indonesia. Or to Islam.
| 277 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:14:34pm |
re: #276 lostlakehiker
There are other sources of friction. The Indonesian treatment of ethnic Chinese has included some fairly serious pogroms. As China becomes more powerful, she will be less likely to look away. In Malaysia, Prime Minister Mahathir proclaimed discriminatory laws to hold down that nation’s Chinese. And now, there are Chinese workers all around the world, including, unless they just now made good their escape, Libya.
China isn’t going to convert to Islam, ever. She might insist on better treatment of ethnic Chinese in her neighborhood. But she isn’t going to go looking for trouble either. She’s not a threat to Turkey, or Pakistan, or Indonesia. Or to Islam.
Not yet, perhaps.
China’s “one child unless you can pay the xtra child tax” isn’t stopping or lessing their overpopulation issues. More people need more land. They have millions of men without wives. China does not care about her people.
China is a serious concern, something to be watched carefully.
| 278 |
ProBosniaLiberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:18:07pm |
re: #276 lostlakehiker
China’s already been looking for trouble. In many places in the world, the nation is now seen as aggressive. Alot of the world right now is not happy with either China or the US government.
re: #277 ggt
Exactly. I cannot see them as an ally or partner with the way they treat their minorities and the nations around them. Alot of the neighboring states have begun aligning with each other too. Frankly, China will become a menace.
| 279 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:18:39pm |
Did we get any hatchlings?
hatchliinnngs, come-out, come-out wherever you are …
| 280 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:19:33pm |
re: #278 ProLifeLiberal
China’s already been looking for trouble. In many places in the world, the nation is now seen as aggressive. Alot of the world right now is not happy with either China or the US government.
re: #277 ggt
Exactly. I cannot see them as an ally or partner with the way they treat their minorities and the nations around them. Alot of the neighboring states have begun aligning with each other too. Frankly, China will become a menace.
China is Imperialistic.
| 281 |
ProBosniaLiberal Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:23:23pm |
re: #280 ggt
An example of this is the name of the Uyghur area. Xinjiang translated means “New Territory.” That’s pretty blatant to me.
| 282 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:30:27pm |
“”You’d think spiral-induced mortality would be selected against, that ants would have evolved a counter-measure to such obviously maladaptive behavior.” [Meaning natural selection would favor the ant that randomly learned to say: ‘Hey, here’s an idea! How about let’s stop circling?’]
But apparently these army ants haven’t learned to do that.”
And you know, if all should go to shit, it will be the ant that survives. Go figure.
| 283 |
Kibitzer 2006 Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:44:45pm |
Just trying out my brand new account :)
—Kibitzer
| 284 |
FemNaziBitch Sun, Feb 27, 2011 10:46:28pm |
Welcome!
there are rules,
Mostly, be nice, don’t forget to use the sarc tag and first drinks on you.
I take fresh coffee with cream and sugar.
| 285 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Feb 27, 2011 11:02:31pm |
| 286 |
Kronocide Sun, Feb 27, 2011 11:04:04pm |
Don’t put a lime or any fucking salt in my tequila.
Smooches!
| 289 |
Kibitzer 2006 Mon, Feb 28, 2011 1:12:17am |
re: #284 ggt
Welcome!
there are rules,
Mostly, be nice, don’t forget to use the sarc tag and first drinks on you.
I take fresh coffee with cream and sugar.
Still trying to figure out all the buttons, so who knows how this will come out.
I’m always nice, but snarc can be assumed :). As a first example, there were at least two things that God got right the first time: coffee and beef. Neither requires additional flavoring (other than cooking).
—Kibitzer
| 290 |
Kibitzer 2006 Mon, Feb 28, 2011 1:18:40am |
| 291 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 1:24:33am |
re: #289 Kibitzer 2006
Still trying to figure out all the buttons, so who knows how this will come out.
I’m always nice, but snarc can be assumed :). As a first example, there were at least two things that God got right the first time: coffee and beef. Neither requires additional flavoring (other than cooking).
—Kibitzer
The best coffee beans are said to those that have passed through a civet cat’s intestines:
[Link: www.truthorfiction.com…]
Oh yeah, and always cite sources for anything other than personal anecdotes…
| 292 |
Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 2:21:13am |
test, test
............................
| 293 |
Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 2:22:25am |
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
| 294 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 2:37:46am |
I think it looks more like this:
—————————————————————————————————-
(as in flatline)
| 295 |
laZardo Mon, Feb 28, 2011 2:53:36am |
So I’ve been dealing with someone who’s all praises for a parliamentary system, and I’ve come to the realization that if America used the Westminster system then our Prime Minister would probably be John Boehner right now.
Also good evening.
| 297 |
researchok Mon, Feb 28, 2011 3:10:15am |
re: #293 Sergey Romanov
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Might I suggest some warm milk and a pillow?
//
| 298 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Feb 28, 2011 3:48:42am |
re: #283 Kibitzer 2006
Just trying out my brand new account :)
—Kibitzer
Welcome
(and ,, umm,, you do know that it’s 2011, no !?!?)
/
| 299 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 3:51:58am |
I assume kibbitzer has been trying to register since 2006…I got lucky in 2007.
| 300 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 3:52:52am |
re: #299 ralphieboy
I assume kibbitzer has been trying to register since 2006…I got lucky in 2007.
Insert joke here.
| 301 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Feb 28, 2011 3:52:59am |
re: #297 researchok
Might I suggest some warm milk and a pillow?
//
I think cookies are tastier with warm milk!
PLUS ,, when you dunk a pillow, it soaks ALL the milk up!
| 302 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 3:55:30am |
re: #300 Obdicut
Insert joke here.
Yes, that was about the last time I inserted anything, if you wanna rub it in…
| 303 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Feb 28, 2011 3:56:22am |
re: #302 ralphieboy
Yes, that was about the last time I inserted anything, if you wanna rub it in…
and you’ve been self rubbing ever since!!?!?
| 304 |
laZardo Mon, Feb 28, 2011 3:59:14am |
re: #302 ralphieboy
Hey, there’s nothing wrong with coming clean about the first time.
| 305 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:00:05am |
I remember Christine O’Donnel’s famous quote about masturbation being sinful because it arises from lust.
Does that mean it is not sinful you are simply doing it out of force of habit?
| 306 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:00:58am |
I saw that “The King’s Speech” won everything last night.
I haven’t seen it, but, to me, every clip I saw made it looked pretty pretentious.
| 307 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:01:36am |
re: #305 ralphieboy
Let him with a free hand cast the first stone.
-Dennis Miller
| 308 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:01:47am |
re: #305 ralphieboy
I remember Christine O’Donnel’s famous quote about masturbation being sinful because it arises from lust.
Does that mean it is not sinful you are simply doing it out of force of habit?
or boredom!
“lets see,, nothing good on TV tonight ,,, it’s raining outside so there goes my walk,,,,internet is down ,,,, what to do,, what to do!?!”
| 309 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:12:16am |
re: #308 sattv4u2
or boredom!
“lets see,, nothing good on TV tonight ,,, it’s raining outside so there goes my walk,,,internet is down ,,, what to do,, what to do!?!”
You can manage it without Internet support?
| 310 |
rwdflynavy Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:16:50am |
re: #309 ralphieboy
You can manage it without Internet support?
He’s got a completely analog system.//
Also, Good Morning Lizards!
| 311 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:17:12am |
Que sera, sera.
| 313 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:35:54am |
| 314 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:43:35am |
re: #311 Obdicut
Well. I hated that cover.
And now, here’s something we hope you’ll really like!
-Moose and Squirrel
| 315 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:43:54am |
China Bans Reincarnation Without Government Permission
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com…]
According to a statement issued by the State Administration for Religious Affairs, the law, which goes into effect next month and strictly stipulates the procedures by which one is to reincarnate, is “an important move to institutionalize management of reincarnation.”
| 316 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:49:02am |
re: #315 RogueOne
That was a “related” item on another story on HuffPo I was reading, didn’t notice it’s 2 damn years old!
| 317 |
laZardo Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:50:24am |
re: #315 RogueOne
Okay, who else here thought it was an Onion article at first glance?
| 318 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:52:48am |
Or a Dilbert cartoon:
[Link: www.dilbert.com…]
| 319 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 28, 2011 4:58:48am |
Sneaky scientists—they know how large moons are made. Someone tweet O’reilly:
[Link: www.newscientist.com…]
| 320 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:05:37am |
re: #319 Decatur Deb
Oh, Happy Day when miracles take place;
And scientists control the human race;
When we assume authority of human chromosomes;
And assembly line women;
conveyor belt men,
Settle down in push button homes.
-‘Lil Abner
| 321 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:07:16am |
Science is the chief weapon in the War on Religion…
| 322 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:07:57am |
re: #321 ralphieboy
Science is the chief weapon in the War on Religion…
Religion is the chief weapon in the War on Science.
FTFY
| 325 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:13:52am |
The point is, if you believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible, you are required to reject science.
There is nothing inherent in science that rejects religion as such, just the fundamentalist/literalist interpretation of it.
| 326 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:18:30am |
re: #325 ralphieboy
If you believe in a literal translation of the bible a lot of things don’t work, even if you take them by faith.
So, me? I’m just a simple Christian who believes that scientists dig into the mysteries and nature of God more than scholars and theologians are able to do.
| 327 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:24:07am |
In Indiana, Clues to Future of Wisconsin Labor
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
The experience of a nearby state, Indiana, where Gov. Mitch Daniels eliminated bargaining for state employees six years ago, shows just how much is at stake, both for the government and for workers. His 2005 executive order has had a sweeping impact: no raises for state employees in some years, a weakening of seniority preferences and a far greater freedom to consolidate state operations or outsource them to private companies.
Indiana, and Mitch Daniels, leading the way!
| 328 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:32:39am |
City Details Worst-Case School Layoffs
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
The New York City Department of Education made public on Sunday a list that estimates the number of teachers each school will lose to layoffs if the state does not allocate more money for schools and seniority rules are not changed.The layoffs, totaling 4,675 teachers, 6 percent of the active teachers in the system, would spare virtually no academic subject or neighborhood, and they would affect 80 percent of the approximately 1,600 public schools in the city. Most would lose one to five teachers; nine would lose half of the teachers they have.
The list details the worst case, and its projections may never materialize. City Hall chose to release it as the State Senate prepared to vote on a bill that would allow the city to lay off teachers based on factors like performance and disciplinary records, rather than seniority. By releasing the list, the department hopes to draw more parents to its corner by reminding them that virtually no school would be untouched.
| 329 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:43:51am |
re: #326 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Check out “Rescuing the Bible from Fundamentalism” by Anglican bishop Shelby Spong:
[Link: www.amazon.de…]
It makes the case that the Bible is not meant to be interpreted literally, and that doing so isactually injurious to faith and understanding of God.
| 330 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:49:21am |
re: #329 ralphieboy
Reading anything by Bishop Spong is worthwhile. He makes some interesting arguments. Same goes for John Dominic Crossan. Hell, Hans Kung is interesting too. Kung is a Catholic priest, but had his authority to teach Catholic theology revoked by the Vatican because he pissed them off by rejecting papal infallibility, among other things.
| 331 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:51:42am |
These union strikes are starting to get serious. Detroit’s mayor crosses the picket line:
Striking musicians protest Detroit mayor’s speech
[Link: topnews360.tmcnet.com…]
DETROIT (AP) — In a town where hard hats — not concert tuxedoes — have been the marks of union street credibility, striking Detroit Symphony Orchestra musicians protested Mayor Dave Bing’s decision to deliver his State of the City address inside an orchestra hall that hasn’t heard a note from them in months.The picket — one of the biggest public displays for the musicians since they walked off the job Oct. 4 in black concert dress — illustrated the rising stakes for the workers and the symphony, which suspended its full season Saturday after the musicians rejected what management had said was its final offer. No new negotiations are scheduled.
| 332 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 5:58:05am |
re: #330 Lidane
Especially where Rev. Spong presents arguments indicating that St. Paul was a repressed, self-loathing homosexual.
I read two of Küng’s major works, “On Being a Christian” and “Does God Exist”.
They did not make a believer out of me, but they taught me a lot about the nature of Christianity.
| 333 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:01:57am |
(Reuters) - The massive U.S. budget deficit is the gravest threat facing the economy, topping high unemployment and the risk of inflation or deflation, according to a survey of forecasters released on Monday. (Paul Krugman hardest hit.)
Economists list U.S. budget deficit as No. 1 worry
[Link: www.reuters.com…]
| 334 |
William Barnett-Lewis Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:03:44am |
re: #327 RogueOne
In Indiana, Clues to Future of Wisconsin Labor
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]Indiana, and Mitch Daniels, leading the way!
Racing to the bottom of the third world!
| 335 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:04:19am |
re: #333 RogueOne
Especially because a democratic President is “responsible” for it.
I remember back in those heady days of a budget surplus under Clinton that Rush Limbaugh criticized it, maintaining that the government was simply taking more money from us than it needed to meet its expenses, which was unfair and unconstitutional…
| 336 |
William Barnett-Lewis Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:04:55am |
re: #330 Lidane
Reading anything by Bishop Spong is worthwhile. He makes some interesting arguments. Same goes for John Dominic Crossan. Hell, Hans Kung is interesting too. Kung is a Catholic priest, but had his authority to teach Catholic theology revoked by the Vatican because he pissed them off by rejecting papal infallibility, among other things.
Matthew Fox belongs on this list too - Original Blessing if nothing else. I have a copy of the Book of Common Prayer I had him autograph ;)
| 337 |
garhighway Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:05:20am |
re: #333 RogueOne
(Reuters) - The massive U.S. budget deficit is the gravest threat facing the economy, topping high unemployment and the risk of inflation or deflation, according to a survey of forecasters released on Monday. (Paul Krugman hardest hit.)
Economists list U.S. budget deficit as No. 1 worry
[Link: www.reuters.com…]
Gee, I thought we were worried about jobs. Did something change?
| 338 |
William Barnett-Lewis Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:07:28am |
re: #337 garhighway
Gee, I thought we were worried about jobs. Did something change?
Nah, they just polled the Chicago school only. They get scared by the ebil Keynes. //
| 339 |
garhighway Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:07:47am |
re: #333 RogueOne
(Reuters) - The massive U.S. budget deficit is the gravest threat facing the economy, topping high unemployment and the risk of inflation or deflation, according to a survey of forecasters released on Monday. (Paul Krugman hardest hit.)
Economists list U.S. budget deficit as No. 1 worry
[Link: www.reuters.com…]
From this morning’s Morning Edition, a discussion of why US deficit levels aren’t as alarming as some think:
[Link: www.npr.org…]
(Scroll down to “Economist Argues The Deficit Isn’t Issue No. 1” to get the clip.)
| 340 |
garhighway Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:10:12am |
And since someone mentioned him, here’s today’s Krugman, looking at the budget mess in Texas:
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
It seems that the party of “we have to do this for the children!” really doesn’t seem to give a shit about children. Unless they think that leaving “the children” with a little more public debt is worse than not educating them.
| 341 |
palomino Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:23:21am |
re: #339 garhighway
From this morning’s Morning Edition, a discussion of why US deficit levels aren’t as alarming as some think:
[Link: www.npr.org…]
(Scroll down to “Economist Argues The Deficit Isn’t Issue No. 1” to get the clip.)
Don’t you understand that deficits are OK as long as the gop is in charge? From 2001-2008 we ran huge deficits and the only right wingers who really complained were the Paulians. Then Obama gets elected and conservatives immediately argue that debt means the end of America as we know it. It’s purely political.
| 342 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:26:08am |
re: #338 wlewisiii
Nah, they just polled the Chicago school only. They get scared by the ebil Keynes. //
Are you arguing that they Keynesian model is working? I would argue all the evidence points to a much different conclusion.
| 343 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:26:32am |
re: #340 garhighway
I read that earlier. That’s why I tossed in the Krugman snark on the previous post.
| 344 |
darthstar Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:26:35am |
Woke up, turned on my computer, saw my paycheck was deposited, and immediately scheduled my first mortgage payment for midnight tonight.
Fuck that feels good.
Boy am I broke.
But fuck that feels good.
| 345 |
Romantic Heretic Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:26:44am |
re: #317 laZardo
Okay, who else here thought it was an Onion article at first glance?
Me. It seemed too silly to be true.
Then I remembered Tom Clancy.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction has to make sense.
| 346 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:28:19am |
re: #344 darthstar
Woke up, turned on my computer, saw my paycheck was deposited, and immediately scheduled my first mortgage payment for midnight tonight.
Fuck that feels good.
Boy am I broke.
But fuck that feels good.
You lost me. Did you get a new job or a new house?
| 347 |
Achilles Tang Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:29:50am |
re: #329 ralphieboy
It makes the case that the Bible is not meant to be interpreted literally, and that doing so is actually injurious to faith and understanding of God.
Really? Without forcing me to read it, is there an actual coded instruction somewhere that says it is “not meant”, or is that simply the obvious conclusion that there is no other way for any of it to make sense, except by interpreting according to whatever reality one lives in?
| 348 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:30:25am |
The rallying cry often heard is “We have to run America like a business!”
Which is not at all what we are doing, we bailed out our failing financial and automotive, which was in effect running our businesses like we run the government….
| 349 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:33:32am |
re: #347 Naso Tang
There are plenty of fundamentalists in many religions who insist that since their Holy Scriptures are the True and Unchanging word of God, they must be interpreted literally.
And within each religion, there are those prepared to fight over their insistence that only their own interpretation is the true one…
| 350 |
Romantic Heretic Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:35:01am |
re: #348 ralphieboy
The rallying cry often heard is “We have to run America like a business!”
Considering the number of businesses that fail compared to the number of governments, I don’t believe that would be a good thing.
I never worked for anything but the private sector when I could work, and the stupidity, greed, fear, prejudice, courtly behaviour and outright bullying were always at near toxic levels.
| 351 |
Political Atheist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:35:56am |
re: #341 palomino
re: #340 garhighway
The budget discussions and policy debates are all tied up in “nots”
It is oft repeated we can not cut education spending, we can not borrow our way out, we can not raise taxes and we can not increase debts and the deficit.
I guess we can not wait for recovery to up revenues either….
Will we “not” be able to beak the partisan divide?
| 352 |
Achilles Tang Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:36:03am |
re: #348 ralphieboy
The rallying cry often heard is “We have to run America like a business!”
That comes from the same people who think Democracy means winner take all.
| 353 |
Political Atheist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:36:18am |
re: #351 Rightwingconspirator
Umm break the partisan divide.
| 354 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:36:52am |
re: #350 Romantic Heretic
The Free Market (TM) is supposed to weed out that sort of behavior, or at least lessen it by allowing poorly run companies to fail.
But they have learned that all they have to do is become Too Big To Fail(TM) and their continued existence is guaranteed by the government.
| 355 |
laZardo Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:37:53am |
re: #349 ralphieboy
There are plenty of fundamentalists in many religions who insist that since their Holy Scriptures are the True and Unchanging word of God, they must be interpreted literally.
And within each religion, there are those prepared to fight over their insistence that only their own interpretation is the true one…
Nobody’s right if everybody’s wrong is my take on it.
| 356 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:38:18am |
re: #333 RogueOne
(Reuters) - The massive U.S. budget deficit is the gravest threat facing the economy, topping high unemployment and the risk of inflation or deflation, according to a survey of forecasters released on Monday. (Paul Krugman hardest hit.)
Economists list U.S. budget deficit as No. 1 worry
[Link: www.reuters.com…]
Right. They’re misquoting NABE — National Association of Business Economics. First, that’s the group that in May of 2008 gave an outlook that a recession, if there was one, would be short and shallow, and that housing was experiencing a minor downturn because credit was strong. That outlook is at this link.
Second and more importantly, they’re NOT quoting NABE. The February 2011 outlook doesn’t say anything like what Reuters claims. (see current outlook at http://www.nabe.com/press/1102outlook.pdf.) What they’re paraphrasing instead is the news release for the upcoming policy conference. From that release:
“With the recovery firmly in place, NABE’s Economic Policy Conference will examine the difficult challenge of assuring continued economic growth as we reduce our monetary and fiscal intervention in the economy,” said NABE President Richard Wobbekind, associate dean of the Leeds School of Business at the University of Colorado-Boulder. “While this fiscal rebalancing is essential for long-term economic prosperity, the process, timing, and implications of these adjustments are topics of considerable debate. Our domestic policy presentations will cover many areas which are key to restoring this fiscal balance, including healthcare provision and costs, pension funding, and the fiscal stability of state
government finance.”
(see http://www.nabe.com/press/pr110126.pdf.
The Reuters article tag says Reporting by Rachelle Younglai; Editing by Dan Grebler. As of right now they’re both on my low-trust list for this little exercise.
| 357 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:38:29am |
We need to run America like a republic with a bill of rights!
Businesses can fire people. We don’t have that option.
Businesses can quit and throw in the towel. We don’t have that option.
Businesses don’t have to worry about education…
| 358 |
palomino Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:38:32am |
re: #342 RogueOne
Are you arguing that they Keynesian model is working? I would argue all the evidence points to a much different conclusion.
Screw the Keynesian model. Let’s just go back to whatever you’d call the model we had during Bush’s second term. That one was a real winner.
| 359 |
darthstar Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:38:34am |
| 360 |
Achilles Tang Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:39:33am |
re: #349 ralphieboy
There are plenty of fundamentalists in many religions who insist that since their Holy Scriptures are the True and Unchanging word of God, they must be interpreted literally.
And within each religion, there are those prepared to fight over their insistence that only their own interpretation is the true one…
I am well aware of that, but “the Bible is not meant to be interpreted literally” suggests evidence for an implied command of a very broad nature. That is not the same thing as disagreement about this or that interpretation of a sentence, word, letter, comma after countless language translations.
| 361 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:42:15am |
| 362 |
Political Atheist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:44:06am |
Has anyone seen the contrary view to Rolling Stones accusations on psyops?
From Wired
| 363 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:44:25am |
re: #342 RogueOne
Are you arguing that they Keynesian model is working? I would argue all the evidence points to a much different conclusion.
I would argue the keynesian model isn’t being used. Just about every Keynesian said the stimulus was too small, and then it was made less effective by coming in low-impact, delayed release tax credits instead of immediate direct payments.
Bluntly, the predictions of the keynesians have still been on: slow to stagnant growth with fragilities that make a second severe recession possible.
| 364 |
Achilles Tang Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:49:40am |
Does anyone know if there is a problem with VOANEWS (Voice of America) website?
The last few days I have been unable to access some news links from them via news.google, and then I notice that I can’t get any VOA website pages at all.
| 365 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:50:09am |
re: #341 palomino
Don’t you understand that deficits are OK as long as the gop is in charge? From 2001-2008 we ran huge deficits and the only right wingers who really complained were the Paulians. Then Obama gets elected and conservatives immediately argue that debt means the end of America as we know it. It’s purely political.
That isn’t how I remember it. I remember many, many fiscal conservatives very unhappy with the previous administration and it was one of the reasons the repubs started losing seats in ‘06 (back when the dems thought deficits were a problem, remember Paygo?).
In Shift, Bush Emerges as a Budget Warrior
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
Published: September 22, 2007
….But the president’s new tough talk on spending has also caught some fiscal conservatives in his own party off guard. After years lambasting Mr. Bush for letting government spending run out of control, they wonder what has gotten into him.
…..
Others see Mr. Bush reacting to Republican losses in the midterm elections of 2006.“All of us are smarting from the lessons of 2006, and while people are right to point to factors like the war and scandal, I hold the view that the biggest scandal in Washington, D.C., was runaway federal spending under Republican control,” said Representative Mike Pence, Republican of Indiana.
| 367 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:51:18am |
re: #358 palomino
Screw the Keynesian model. Let’s just go back to whatever you’d call the model we had during Bush’s second term. That one was a real winner.
How about the “Kenyan model”?
| 368 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:51:22am |
re: #364 Naso Tang
Does anyone know if there is a problem with VOANEWS (Voice of America) website?
The last few days I have been unable to access some news links from them via news.google, and then I notice that I can’t get any VOA website pages at all.
It’s working here—SecState featured.
| 369 |
Sol Berdinowitz Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:54:47am |
re: #360 Naso Tang
I am well aware of that, but “the Bible is not meant to be interpreted literally” suggests evidence for an implied command of a very broad nature. That is not the same thing as disagreement about this or that interpretation of a sentence, word, letter, comma after countless language translations.
Lemme rephrase that before I get taken too, well, literally…
Rev. Spong is saying that it makes no sense to intepret the Bible literally, as it is a) full of contradictions within itself, b) it was written at a time when people’s understanding of the workings of nature and human psychology were very different from ours, and that c) many parts of the Bible (Job, Ruth, Jonah and the Parables of Christ) were written as fiction and merrely served to illustrate various points or debates on belief and doctrine.
| 370 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 6:57:39am |
re: #365 RogueOne
Ahh, 2006. The good ol’ days when people realized to problems of carrying too much debt:
Democrats and the Deficit
By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: December 22, 2006
Now that the Democrats have regained some power, they have to decide what to do. One of the biggest questions is whether the party should return to Rubinomics — the doctrine, associated with former Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin, that placed a very high priority on reducing the budget deficit.The answer, I believe, is no. Mr. Rubin was one of the ablest Treasury secretaries in American history. But it’s now clear that while Rubinomics made sense in terms of pure economics, it failed to take account of the ugly realities of contemporary American politics.
……
In the long run, something will have to be done about the deficit. But given the state of our politics, now is not the time.
To paraphrase: “Reducing the debt makes perfect sense but politically it’s suicide. People love “free” stuff.”
| 371 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:02:46am |
re: #364 Naso Tang
Speaking of VOANews:
Egypt Bans Mubarak, Family From Travel Abroad
[Link: blogs.voanews.com…]
Egypt’s top prosecutor has issued a travel ban on former President Hosni Mubarak and his family.A government spokesman said Monday the order has also frozen the Mubarak family’s money and assets.
Media reports suggest Mubarak’s wealth may total billions of dollars.
Mubarak stepped down February 11 after 18 days of massive protests, demanding his ouster.
The Egyptian protests sent shockwaves through the Middle East, threatening entrenched dynasties from Libya to Bahrain.
| 372 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:03:59am |
re: #370 RogueOne
Ahh, 2006. The good ol’ days when people realized to problems of carrying too much debt:
Democrats and the Deficit
By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: December 22, 2006To paraphrase: “Reducing the debt makes perfect sense but politically it’s suicide. People love “free” stuff.”
Alternate paraphrase: “Worry about being overweight after you stop the bleeding.”
| 373 |
Ericus58 Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:04:58am |
“1459: Pro-Gaddafi jets have struck ammunition depots near Libya’s second city of Benghazi, witnesses tell AFP news agency.”
| 374 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:07:39am |
re: #372 kirkspencer
Alternate paraphrase: “Worry about being overweight after you stop the bleeding.”
Sorry, I just noticed I neglected to leave a link to the entire article:
[Link: select.nytimes.com…]
His article wasn’t about bleeding. It was about how the repubs used the surplus to wage a “right-wing class war”.
| 375 |
palomino Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:09:39am |
re: #365 RogueOne
That isn’t how I remember it. I remember many, many fiscal conservatives very unhappy with the previous administration and it was one of the reasons the repubs started losing seats in ‘06 (back when the dems thought deficits were a problem, remember Paygo?).
In Shift, Bush Emerges as a Budget Warrior
[Link: www.nytimes.com…]
Published: September 22, 2007
The gop lost seats in 2006 because the gop was mad at the gop? Huh? The War was the big issue at the time. Debt had been piling up since 2001, and the gop had done fine in the elections of 2002 and 2004, its members staying very loyal…no gigantic rallies with tricornered hats and cries of “revolution” during that period of time.
My point is that the tea party movement gathered no steam until Obama took office, ie, conservatives kept their powder dry from 2001-2008 because “one of their own” was in office. But when Obama took over, then suddenly the right found its voice to criticize the very things it had helped to create. Pure politics.
| 376 |
palomino Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:09:59am |
| 377 |
Achilles Tang Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:13:15am |
| 378 |
palomino Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:14:12am |
re: #370 RogueOne
Ahh, 2006. The good ol’ days when people realized to problems of carrying too much debt:
Democrats and the Deficit
By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: December 22, 2006To paraphrase: “Reducing the debt makes perfect sense but politically it’s suicide. People love “free” stuff.”
When either side starts talking about significant cuts to defense and entitlements, you’ll know they’re serious about deficit reduction. Til then, it’s safe to say that both parties see it as political suicide.
| 379 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:15:07am |
re: #374 RogueOne
Sorry, I just noticed I neglected to leave a link to the entire article:
[Link: select.nytimes.com…]His article wasn’t about bleeding. It was about how the repubs used the surplus to wage a “right-wing class war”.
Ah. So your paraphrase is just as bad. A better one would be: “Reducing the debt makes perfect sense, but if you do the Republicans will spend the savings — so Dems should spend the savings first.”
| 380 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:17:50am |
Jonathan martin at Politico has an article up, “GOP reality check: Obama looking tougher to beat in 2012.”
The conservative commentators are frothing with rage.[Link: www.politico.com…]
| 381 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:18:31am |
re: #375 palomino
You won’t get much of an argument from me on most of those contentions. Where I would argue is the nations response to the Iraq war. In 2006 3/5ths of the voters who said the Iraq war was a mistake voted for the dems. That means that 40% of the people who thought there was a problem still voted for repubs.
IMO, what that really hurt the repubs was the spending issue since it kept fiscal conservative voters from either coming out to vote or switching to dems. You may not have been paying much attention to internal republican squabbles but spending issues had been boiling since 2005 with the porkbusters vs. trent lott. It doesn’t surprise me that people upset with bush spending got very upset when obama doubled down on the issue.
| 382 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:19:26am |
re: #379 kirkspencer
Ah. So your paraphrase is just as bad. A better one would be: “Reducing the debt makes perfect sense, but if you do the Republicans will spend the savings — so Dems should spend the savings first.”
My paraphrase was much better.//
| 383 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:21:04am |
re: #380 prairiefire
Jonathan martin at Politico has an article up, “GOP reality check: Obama looking tougher to beat in 2012.”
The conservative commentators are frothing with rage.[Link: www.politico.com…]
He’s the president, the champ. You have to knock the champ out to win and it’s going to be very hard for a republican challenger to do it. It’s going to be much easier to take the senate. If the repubs take both houses and obama wins re-election the next 4 years should be a blast.
| 384 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:27:18am |
Student Uses Smart Phone To Beat Speeding Ticket
[Link: consumerist.com…]
The cop cited him for going over 40 mph in a 25 zone, which he was too frazzled to contest at the time. After he had cooled down and parked his car later, he remembered that he had been running the My Tracks app by Google which records your GPS info and speed. Pulling up the data, he found that he hadn’t been speeding. When his court date arrived, he plead not guilty, presented his GPS data, and successfully got out of the ticket. Nice!
Original story: [Link: skattertech.com…]
| 385 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:31:45am |
re: #383 RogueOne
He’s the president, the champ. You have to knock the champ out to win and it’s going to be very hard for a republican challenger to do it. It’s going to be much easier to take the senate. If the repubs take both houses and obama wins re-election the next 4 years should be a blast.
Agreed. However, it’s actually harder for the Republicans when there isn’t a good Republican challenger. There’s a degree of reflection down-stream of the top ticket, and it’s made worse when the party is trying to argue a national platform. (He’s bad, but “we” aren’t good enough to field a viable opponent?)
Add Wisconsin (and Indiana and Ohio so far) and the (probable) shutdown that’s specifically from the Republicans, and the Republicans might find it’s them, not the president, being blamed for the bad economy — which right now is the centerpiece of their campaign. If that happens (and I think there’s a strong chance) we might again see the Dems controlling both houses as well as the presidency.
| 386 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:32:04am |
re: #383 RogueOne
He’s the president, the champ. You have to knock the champ out to win and it’s going to be very hard for a republican challenger to do it. It’s going to be much easier to take the senate. If the repubs take both houses and obama wins re-election the next 4 years should be a blast.
If “Blast” you mean non stop impeachment/Subpoena fest than yeah….
| 387 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:35:45am |
re: #385 kirkspencer
Agreed. However, it’s actually harder for the Republicans when there isn’t a good Republican challenger. There’s a degree of reflection down-stream of the top ticket, and it’s made worse when the party is trying to argue a national platform. (He’s bad, but “we” aren’t good enough to field a viable opponent?)
Add Wisconsin (and Indiana and Ohio so far) and the (probable) shutdown that’s specifically from the Republicans, and the Republicans might find it’s them, not the president, being blamed for the bad economy — which right now is the centerpiece of their campaign. If that happens (and I think there’s a strong chance) we might again see the Dems controlling both houses as well as the presidency.
It’s real early (obviously) but I’m calling IN and OH for the repub candidate already. That’s 2 states Obama won last time that he won’t get again. The IN fight is completely different than the argument going on in WI and the dems have misplayed their hand here.
| 388 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:36:32am |
re: #386 jamesfirecat
That ain’t gonna solve any of our problems. But who wants to do that? That part’s hard.
Hell, a bunch of lawyers know how to do some lawyerin’!
| 389 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:40:23am |
re: #386 jamesfirecat
If “Blast” you mean non stop impeachment/Subpoena fest than yeah…
I don’t think it will be that bad. The dems didn’t try that when they gained control and so far the repubs are keeping their target on their role as “oversight”. If they do make that kind of argument (Impeach!) during the election cycle next year the dems will cruise to a win.
| 390 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:41:32am |
re: #389 RogueOne
I don’t think it will be that bad. The dems didn’t try that when they gained control and so far the repubs are keeping their target on their role as “oversight”. If they do make that kind of argument (Impeach!) during the election cycle next year the dems will cruise to a win.
As Scott Walker proved, just because you don’t run on something doesn’t mean you’re forbidden from doing it once you’re elected….
| 391 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:45:55am |
ARGH.
I was hoping to avoid doing a presentation today because one of my group mates is delayed getting back into town because she ended up stuck in Chicago after her connecting flight from NYC was canceled.
No such luck. The prof thinks we should just do it anyway without her even if she’s not here. Oh well.
| 392 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:46:26am |
re: #387 RogueOne
It’s real early (obviously) but I’m calling IN and OH for the repub candidate already. That’s 2 states Obama won last time that he won’t get again. The IN fight is completely different than the argument going on in WI and the dems have misplayed their hand here.
Until I know the candidate, I’ll neither argue nor agree. I will ask how you think the dems have misplayed their hand. From what I read Kasich is talking about dropping the right-to-work portion of his bill.
| 393 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:47:43am |
re: #387 RogueOne
It’s real early (obviously) but I’m calling IN and OH for the repub candidate already. That’s 2 states Obama won last time that he won’t get again. The IN fight is completely different than the argument going on in WI and the dems have misplayed their hand here.
That depends on who the GOP nominate. If they lose their damn minds and go with Gingrich or Palin, it might not be as simple as all that.
| 394 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:51:42am |
re: #393 Lidane
That depends on who the GOP nominate. If they lose their damn minds and go with Gingrich or Palin, it might not be as simple as all that.
Ironically I think it will be “as simple as that” if by “”it” you mean Obama getting re-elected to serve another four years.
If the GOP runs Gingrich (rich old white guy with philandering in his pass, he’s like John McCain except without being a war hero!) or Sarah Palin, Obama’s campaign will be a cakewalk…
| 395 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:55:13am |
re: #392 kirkspencer
Until I know the candidate, I’ll neither argue nor agree. I will ask how you think the dems have misplayed their hand. From what I read Kasich is talking about dropping the right-to-work portion of his bill.
In IN the dems bolted, they said, to oppose the RTW bill. The gov was already against the bill coming up during this cycle and got the repubs to drop it. In response the dems came back with a list of 11 other bills they want dropped before they’ll come back. The 11 bills were all issues the state repubs (and the gov) pushed during the last election cycle. We’ve already had the argument and the dems lost. One of the dem bailers is my rep, a guy I voted for and who barely won, who is going to have a hard time explaining why he thought it was important to run to IL.
| 396 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:55:26am |
re: #394 jamesfirecat
Ironically I think it will be “as simple as that” if by “”it” you mean Obama getting re-elected to serve another four years.
If the GOP runs Gingrich (rich old white guy with philandering in his pass, he’s like John McCain except without being a war hero!) or Sarah Palin, Obama’s campaign will be a cakewalk…
I was talking about IN and OH going red next time around. That all depends on who the GOP nominate. If it’s Palin or Gingrich, I wouldn’t bet the farm on anything being a sure bet.
| 397 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:58:14am |
re: #393 Lidane
That depends on who the GOP nominate. If they lose their damn minds and go with Gingrich or Palin, it might not be as simple as all that.
Obama barely won IN and OH (by 1% in OH IIRC) and I don’t see unemployment coming down enough to cover him even if the nominee is Palin. I don’t feel like I’m really going out on a limb. I think IN, OH, and FL are going to flip on him but he still has more than enough electoral votes to win again.
| 399 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:59:27am |
I think North Carolina is interesting. R’s there say it was all the business transplants that voted for Obama. I think it could be a bellweather state for Obama as far as polling goes.
| 400 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:59:38am |
re: #398 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Not gonna happen.
I said McCain would never get nominated because the GOP base hated him, and I was wrong there. At this point, I’m not ruling anything out until I see the full field of candidates that is running.
| 401 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 7:59:44am |
re: #395 RogueOne
In IN the dems bolted, they said, to oppose the RTW bill. The gov was already against the bill coming up during this cycle and got the repubs to drop it. In response the dems came back with a list of 11 other bills they want dropped before they’ll come back. The 11 bills were all issues the state repubs (and the gov) pushed during the last election cycle. We’ve already had the argument and the dems lost. One of the dem bailers is my rep, a guy I voted for and who barely won, who is going to have a hard time explaining why he thought it was important to run to IL.
Because he couldn’t get a hotel reservation in Tahiti on that short a notice!
| 402 |
Achilles Tang Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:00:20am |
re: #364 Naso Tang
Does anyone know if there is a problem with VOANEWS (Voice of America) website?
The last few days I have been unable to access some news links from them via news.google, and then I notice that I can’t get any VOA website pages at all.
Flushed my PC DNS cache and it came back. Weird. Never had that happen before.
| 403 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:00:41am |
re: #393 Lidane
That depends on who the GOP nominate. If they lose their damn minds and go with Gingrich or Palin, it might not be as simple as all that.
One of the interesting things to watch right now is the entry dance. It’s reminiscent of penguins on the ice flow. First into the water gets the best fish — or eaten if Orca’s about. First to announce gets a big boost, but also gets savaged by the press.
Worth pointing out — by Feb 28, 2007 the following people had formally declared their candidacy:
- Rudy Guiliani (Feb 15)
- Duncan Hunter (Jan 25)
- Mike Huckabee (Jan 28)
- Mitt Romney (Feb 7)
Mccain announced he would run on the 28th of Feb, but he didn’t formally announce (file the papers) till April 25. Paul’s declaration was the 12th of March, and the only other formal declaration, Fred Thompson, wasn’t till September 22.
| 404 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:01:15am |
re: #398 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Not gonna happen.
I’m starting to think it will be Pawlenty as there is a strong anti Romney R voting block.
| 405 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:01:16am |
re: #399 prairiefire
I think North Carolina is interesting. R’s there say it was all the business transplants that voted for Obama. I think it could be a bellweather state for Obama as far as polling goes.
VA too.
| 406 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:02:35am |
re: #404 prairiefire
I’m starting to think it will be Pawlenty as there is a strong anti Romney R voting block.
RomneyCare. This cycle might be a horrible time for Mitt.
| 407 |
garhighway Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:03:18am |
re: #342 RogueOne
Are you arguing that they Keynesian model is working? I would argue all the evidence points to a much different conclusion.
I’m not sure what your evidence is, but if you can show me a comparable hole on our economy to use as a control and compare to, I am dying to hear it.
The non-Keynesian argument seems to be “you did stimulus, it didn’t work in the first 15 minutes, therefore it failed”, which doesn’t seem to me like a terribly powerful argument.
I get that the electoral math has changed, and therefore BHO is being a smart politician and reacting to it, but I think it is the wrong economic course.
| 408 |
Achilles Tang Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:03:20am |
re: #369 ralphieboy
Lemme rephrase that before I get taken too, well, literally…
Rev. Spong is saying that it makes no sense to intepret the Bible literally, as it is a) full of contradictions within itself, b) it was written at a time when people’s understanding of the workings of nature and human psychology were very different from ours, and that c) many parts of the Bible (Job, Ruth, Jonah and the Parables of Christ) were written as fiction and merrely served to illustrate various points or debates on belief and doctrine.
Which all comes back to what atheists say, and has no relevance to whether there is a god or not, which makes Spong sound like he is just spouting spong..
;=)
| 409 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:03:32am |
Morning all!
How is it in your part of the world?
| 410 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:03:33am |
re: #400 Lidane
I said McCain would never get nominated because the GOP base hated him, and I was wrong there. At this point, I’m not ruling anything out until I see the full field of candidates that is running.
You are right about that. My hard right friend thought he was not conservative at all. Of course, he is now.[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com…]
| 411 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:04:00am |
re: #397 RogueOne
Obama barely won IN and OH (by 1% in OH IIRC) and I don’t see unemployment coming down enough to cover him even if the nominee is Palin. I don’t feel like I’m really going out on a limb. I think IN, OH, and FL are going to flip on him but he still has more than enough electoral votes to win again.
I emphasized the line in your quote. There’s a strong possibility that the Republicans are about to buy that problem given the stupid statements they’ve been making to the press over the past couple of weeks. If they actually shut down government and (as I expect) unemployment goes up, they’ll have bought part of the blame. Not all, mind you, but part. If they actually keep it going long enough to kick us back to a recession they’ll buy almost all of it.
| 412 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:05:24am |
re: #406 RogueOne
RomneyCare. This cycle
mightwill be a horrible time for Mitt.
Mitt Romney would be a much better candidate if only he actually stood for the things he says he stands for, and understood the things he says he stands for (observe that idiotic piece he wrote about New START a while back…)
| 414 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:06:15am |
re: #406 RogueOne
RomneyCare. This cycle might be a horrible time for Mitt.
The last one was a horrible one for Mitt as well. He fell short very quickly, and now with the”RomneyCare” albatross around his neck, he’s even less likely to win.
Pawlenty sucks, though. He’s got zero charisma. He’ll bore people to tears.
| 415 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:08:09am |
re: #407 garhighway
I’m not sure what your evidence is, but if you can show me a comparable hole on our economy to use as a control and compare to, I am dying to hear it.
The non-Keynesian argument seems to be “you did stimulus, it didn’t work in the first 15 minutes, therefore it failed”, which doesn’t seem to me like a terribly powerful argument.
I get that the electoral math has changed, and therefore BHO is being a smart politician and reacting to it, but I think it is the wrong economic course.
I think a good metric in measuring the pros or cons of the stimulus and whether or not it was effective would be simple. As soon as the Dems stop blaming Bush for everything from the economy to the condition of the toilets in the White House, at that point we can start deciding if the stimulus had the desired effect that we were promised.
In that case, when pigs fly.
| 416 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:09:08am |
re: #407 garhighway
The non-Keynesian argument seems to be “you did stimulus, it didn’t work in the first 15 minutes, therefore it failed”, which doesn’t seem to me like a terribly powerful argument.
It isn’t the first 15 minutes, it’s been 3 years starting with Bush.
| 417 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:10:16am |
European Union Will Impose Sanctions On Libya
The EU’s asset freeze and visa ban target Gadhafi and some two dozen of his closest family and government associates. The measures also ban the sale of tear gas and riot-control gear and other equipment that might be used for repression by Gadhafi. Germany went further, proposing to cut off all oil and other payments to Libya for 60 days to make sure the regime does not get more money to hire mercenaries to repress anti-government critics.
EU foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton, speaking in Geneva, said the world powers also were discussing the “complex issue” of creating a no-fly zone over Libya. She said the European measures were intended to reinforce U.N. Security Council sanctions against Libya approved over the weekend.
Europe’s action was significant because it has much more leverage over Libya than the United States — 85 percent of Libyan oil goes to Europe, and Gadhafi and his family are thought to have significant assets in Britain, Switzerland and Italy. Switzerland and Britain have already hit Libya with a freeze on assets.
British Prime Minister David Cameron told the country’s Parliament on Monday that he has not ruled out the “use of military assets” against Libya.
| 418 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:10:43am |
re: #416 RogueOne
It isn’t the first 15 minutes, it’s been 3 years starting with Bush.
Yeah and it took Bush 8 years to get us where we are.
Surprise! It takes longer to fix an economy than to break it… how was America doing in 1932?
| 419 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:10:52am |
re: #415 Walter L. Newton
I think a good metric in measuring the pros or cons of the stimulus and whether or not it was effective would be simple. As soon as the Dems stop blaming Bush for everything from the economy to the condition of the toilets in the White House, at that point we can start deciding if the stimulus had the desired effect that we were promised.
In that case, when pigs fly.
Hey James, is your fucking humor meter busted today, or are you just feeling frisky.
| 420 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:12:01am |
re: #413 ggt
How’s the diorama going?
I’ve found one piece of cardboard for the sea, need another one for the rocky mountain. I’m thinking of putting brown paper over a shoe box that he can paint white and green for the rocky craigs, brown at the bottom for the sand.
He could make some buildings to glue on out of sculpey clay.
What medium is your guy using for the Temple?
| 421 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:12:13am |
re: #416 RogueOne
It isn’t the first 15 minutes, it’s been 3 years starting with Bush.
Again: they aren’t following a Keynesian model. If they were the stimulus would have been larger and in immediate/direct instead of delayed/indirect avenues.
Again, the Keynesian economists said that what was put out would result in stagnant to extremely slow growth.
Cut off the tail and paint it yellow, but a gator still isn’t a dog whatever you call it.
| 422 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:12:19am |
re: #419 Walter L. Newton
Hey James, is your fucking humor meter busted today, or are you just feeling frisky.
Busted. Remind me never to play poker with you though…
| 423 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:12:24am |
re: #418 jamesfirecat
Yeah and it took Bush 8 years to get us where we are.
Surprise! It takes longer to fix an economy than to break it… how was America doing in 1932?
You’re so predictable. It didn’t take you 2 comments to prove the point I made in comment re: #415 Walter L. Newton
Right on schedule.
| 424 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:13:29am |
re: #415 Walter L. Newton
I think a good metric in measuring the pros or cons of the stimulus and whether or not it was effective would be simple. As soon as the Dems stop blaming Bush for everything from the economy to the condition of the toilets in the White House, at that point we can start deciding if the stimulus had the desired effect that we were promised.
In that case, when pigs fly.
Walter, I agree. The “it’s my playground” attitude of each Party is killing us.
Democrats, GOP Try To Be Penny-Wise And Political
“My sense is both sides think they have the upper hand, which is why they’re in this stalemate pattern,” said political analyst Sarah Binder of the Brookings Institution. “That’s why I think it’s really the White House who has to come in and force a solution here.”
| 425 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:13:44am |
| 426 |
dmon Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:14:32am |
I wouldnt count on Ohio going red, the legislature and the Governor have outraged labor, long time conservatives I work with cant look at Kasich without their blood boiling.
In Ohio polls show that up to 70% of the rank and file voted republican in 2010
| 427 |
laZardo Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:14:52am |
re: #417 ggt
For some reason I imagined CoD:MW’s Captain Price doing the dirty work.
/i miss my ps3 ;_;
| 429 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:16:41am |
re: #420 prairiefire
I’ve found one piece of cardboard for the sea, need another one for the rocky mountain. I’m thinking of putting brown paper over a shoe box that he can paint white and green for the rocky craigs, brown at the bottom for the sand.
He could make some buildings to glue on out of sculpey clay.
What medium is your guy using for the Temple?
I love Sculpy!
The Temple is Styrofoam, dowel, card stock and Celluclay —mixed with plaster of Paris. Celluclay, I am finding, is marvelously versatile. The whole thing will be spray painted gloss white. With Bronze Leaf painted tiles on the roof.
| 430 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:18:13am |
re: #424 ggt
Walter, I agree. The “it’s my playground” attitude of each Party is killing us.
That’s why I’ve never been registered with either the GOP or the Democrats. I’m one of those Independents that everyone is always fawning over. How can I be otherwise, I’m for gay marriages, pro-choice, atheist, in love with rich people, old fashioned, family orientated, can’t stand many of the policies of either side, a real mutt I am.
| 431 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:18:38am |
re: #422 jamesfirecat
Everybody wants to play with poker with me.
Sure fire way to extend my riches to you.
I am the worst player in history.
| 433 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:19:53am |
re: #430 Walter L. Newton
That’s why I’ve never been registered with either the GOP or the Democrats. I’m one of those Independents that everyone is always fawning over. How can I be otherwise, I’m for gay marriages, pro-choice, atheist, in love with rich people, old fashioned, family orientated, can’t stand many of the policies of either side, a real mutt I am.
Yeah, me too.
I’m rather upset about the the Reproductive Rights issue this year. May cause me to register with the Democrats.
| 434 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:21:33am |
| 435 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:22:19am |
One of the upsides of living in Texas, aside from the food — I don’t have to register with a political party.
The only thing that makes someone a Republican or Democrat in this state is whichever primary they choose to vote in. You’re locked out of the other party’s primary for the next two years, but when your voter registration renews after that, you’re a tabula rasa all over again.
| 436 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:22:47am |
re: #426 dmon
I wouldnt count on Ohio going red, the legislature and the Governor have outraged labor, long time conservatives I work with cant look at Kasich without their blood boiling.
In Ohio polls show that up to 70% of the rank and file voted republican in 2010
Does Kasich consistently come off as combative as I think he is?
| 437 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:23:15am |
Someone motivate me to finish this paper on HTML5. I’m bored just thinking about it.
| 438 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:23:40am |
re: #429 ggt
Cool. Does the Celluclay adhere to surfaces well?
| 439 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:24:44am |
re: #432 laZardo
Just go Green! :D
/braces for impact
Clever. I’m already green. I spent 15 years working for the National Renewable Energy Lab, a Department of Energy lab. I’m green, but not starry eyed about the whole thing. I worked around scientists for 15 years. I learned from them what is possible for the future and what is pipe dreams. I know from experience that there are solutions, but no magic bullets. A lot of greens I know expect miracles instead of real progress.
| 441 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:27:05am |
re: #438 prairiefire
Cool. Does the Celluclay adhere to surfaces well?
Yes, the more porous seems to be better, but I think you could use a think layer of watered down Elmers to make it stick to anything. I haven’t tried, but I think you could mix pigment with it.
We processed it just like pasta dough. I couldn’t get the plaster-celluclay mixture to go thru the pasta machine (one we have just for art stuff), but we layed it between two sheets of Saran Wrap with two paint sticks on either side and rolled it to the thickness of the paint sticks. Over and over again, like pasta dough. It make consistent strips for covering the styrofoam.
Once it is dry you can saw it, sand it, paint it whatever.
| 442 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:27:54am |
| 443 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:28:18am |
Breaking news!
Louis Farrakhan said something stupid.
Well I’ll be darned.
| 446 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:29:41am |
I had never even heard of this guy until his dust up last week in a cafe in Paris…
FASHION guru John Galliano was filmed having a vile racist rant during which he declared: “I love Hitler.”
Take a look at his mug… is he going for a living Guy Falkes look?
| 447 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:29:55am |
| 448 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:30:47am |
re: #445 Gus 802
Wow. A news story about the Oscars. Maybe I’ll read it.
//
It will be wall to wall discussions on all my favorite radio talk show for the next 24 hours… I may as well turn off the radio… boring.
| 449 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:31:19am |
re: #446 Walter L. Newton
I had never even heard of this guy until his dust up last week in a cafe in Paris…
FASHION guru John Galliano was filmed having a vile racist rant during which he declared: “I love Hitler.”
Take a look at his mug… is he going for a living Guy Falkes look?
Er… the link maybe would help…
[Link: www.thesun.co.uk…]
| 450 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:31:27am |
re: #446 Walter L. Newton
I had never even heard of this guy until his dust up last week in a cafe in Paris…
FASHION guru John Galliano was filmed having a vile racist rant during which he declared: “I love Hitler.”
Take a look at his mug… is he going for a living Guy Falkes look?
Sorta. He makes amazing clothes, but this does not look good.
| 452 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:32:04am |
re: #446 Walter L. Newton
I had never even heard of this guy until his dust up last week in a cafe in Paris…
FASHION guru John Galliano was filmed having a vile racist rant during which he declared: “I love Hitler.”
Take a look at his mug… is he going for a living Guy Falkes look?
| 453 |
Romantic Heretic Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:32:46am |
re: #435 Lidane
One of the upsides of living in Texas, aside from the food — I don’t have to register with a political party.
The only thing that makes someone a Republican or Democrat in this state is whichever primary they choose to vote in. You’re locked out of the other party’s primary for the next two years, but when your voter registration renews after that, you’re a tabula rasa all over again.
As a Canadian I’ve never understood the purpose of registering with a particular party. Here in Canada they simply make sure you live in the area you vote in and that you are of voting age.
What’s the purpose of registering as a member of a particular party?
| 454 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:33:25am |
re: #453 Romantic Heretic
As a Canadian I’ve never understood the purpose of registering with a particular party. Here in Canada they simply make sure you live in the area you vote in and that you are of voting age.
What’s the purpose of registering as a member of a particular party?
money
| 455 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:33:51am |
re: #448 Walter L. Newton
It will be wall to wall discussions on all my favorite radio talk show for the next 24 hours… I may as well turn off the radio… boring.
Yes but what about “The King’s Speech”? Don’t you care about people with speech disabilities?
//
| 457 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:34:38am |
re: #453 Romantic Heretic
As a Canadian I’ve never understood the purpose of registering with a particular party. Here in Canada they simply make sure you live in the area you vote in and that you are of voting age.
What’s the purpose of registering as a member of a particular party?
In some states it affects how you vote in the primaries. Closed primaries are for only those registered to the party running the primary.
| 458 |
lawhawk Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:34:46am |
re: #453 Romantic Heretic
Some states have a closed primary system, where you can vote in primary elections only between those candidates for the party with which you’re registered.
That way, if you’re a Democrat, you can’t pick GOP candidates, and vice versa.
| 459 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:34:58am |
re: #455 Gus 802
Yes but what about “The King’s Speech”? Don’t you care about people with speech disabilities?
//
Yesh I doe.
| 460 |
Romantic Heretic Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:35:07am |
re: #454 ggt
money
Ah. Once again my inability to care about money as other than a useful but limited tool keeps me from understanding.
| 461 |
dmon Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:35:17am |
re: #436 prairiefire
Yes he does, his first statement after the election was that the teachers should take ot a full page ad apologizing for baking his opponent, 2 months later hes backing a union busting bill that is actually as bad or worse than Wisconsin, the private sector unions have joined the fight
| 462 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:35:29am |
re: #443 Gus 802
In other news, Ronald Reagan is still dead. And water is still wet.
| 463 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:35:41am |
re: #421 kirkspencer
Again: they aren’t following a Keynesian model. If they were the stimulus would have been larger and in immediate/direct instead of delayed/indirect avenues.
Again, the Keynesian economists said that what was put out would result in stagnant to extremely slow growth.
Cut off the tail and paint it yellow, but a gator still isn’t a dog whatever you call it.
Isn’t that the same argument people use to explain how another economic theory didn’t fail? It wasn’t implemented correctly”. We were told that a trillion dollars in spending, on shovel-ready projects, would keep unemployment from hitting 8%. We were told that for every dollar of spending we would get a return of $1.60. The multiplier never showed up, our growth rate was just downgraded “unexpectedly” again, unemployment is still 10%, and we’re running a very real risk of having our bond rating dropped. I don’t see the argument for more spending with those results.
| 464 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:35:53am |
re: #455 Gus 802
Yes but what about “The King’s Speech”? Don’t you care about people with speech disabilities?
//
Kirk Douglas was having some difficulty speaking. Has he had a stroke?
| 465 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:36:49am |
| 466 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:36:59am |
re: #464 Alouette
Kirk Douglas was having some difficulty speaking. Has he had a stroke?
I’d have to look that up. He’s been in pretty bad shape ever since that helicopter accident.
| 467 |
lawhawk Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:37:27am |
re: #445 Gus 802
I fell asleep to the awards show… there was a time when I’d be interested, but no longer. Maybe, if I were up for an award or two I’d be interested, but I set aside writing a screenplay long ago. Reality (9/11) overtook the fiction I dreamed up.
For the bits I was awake for, it seemed that the best moment of the show was Kurt Douglas’ intro of best supporting actress, and it was all downhill from there.
| 468 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:37:38am |
re: #463 RogueOne
Isn’t that the same argument people use to explain how another economic theory didn’t fail? It wasn’t implemented correctly”. We were told that a trillion dollars in spending, on shovel-ready projects, would keep unemployment from hitting 8%. We were told that for every dollar of spending we would get a return of $1.60. The multiplier never showed up, our growth rate was just downgraded “unexpectedly” again, unemployment is still 10%, and we’re running a very real risk of having our bond rating dropped. I don’t see the argument for more spending with those results.
One third of the stimulus was spent on tax breaks, and examination of how the money was spent against the returns it got showed that tax breaks were among the least efficient form of governmental “spending” we could come up with.
So if you’re looking for somebody to blame for why all the money didn’t get as high a level of return as predicted, why not focus in on the GOP senators who insisted such a large portion of it be in tax cuts?
| 469 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:37:41am |
re: #464 Alouette
Kirk Douglas was having some difficulty speaking. Has he had a stroke?
He had a stroke back in the 90s, I believe.
| 470 |
Romantic Heretic Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:38:01am |
re: #457 prairiefire
re: #458 lawhawk
I see. That makes sense.
We don’t have a primary system here. The various parties decides who runs, at least at a provincial (state) and federal level. No formal party participation at the municipal level though.
The closest we come to primaries is when the leader of a political party steps down and the party has a convention to elect a new leader.
| 471 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:39:22am |
re: #435 Lidane
One of the upsides of living in Texas, aside from the food — I don’t have to register with a political party.
The only thing that makes someone a Republican or Democrat in this state is whichever primary they choose to vote in. You’re locked out of the other party’s primary for the next two years, but when your voter registration renews after that, you’re a tabula rasa all over again.
Sort of the same in IN. You have to choose a party if you want to vote in the primary but you can still vote for non-political seats if you would rather not pick a team.
| 472 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:39:56am |
re: #464 Alouette
Kirk Douglas was having some difficulty speaking. Has he had a stroke?
It reminded me of Dick Clark on New years eve this year.
| 473 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:40:00am |
re: #463 RogueOne
Isn’t that the same argument people use to explain how another economic theory didn’t fail? It wasn’t implemented correctly”.
It’s not an argument. It’s a statement of fact. The stimulus wasn’t as large as it should have been, and way too much of it was tax cuts to appease the GOP.
There is nobody— outside Paulian kooks- who thinks actual Keynesian economics is just wrong . There are people who don’t think that you can use Keynesian economics to actually craft policy responses. The two things are very, very different.
| 474 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:40:21am |
re: #467 lawhawk
I fell asleep to the awards show… there was a time when I’d be interested, but no longer. Maybe, if I were up for an award or two I’d be interested, but I set aside writing a screenplay long ago. Reality (9/11) overtook the fiction I dreamed up.
For the bits I was awake for, it seemed that the best moment of the show was Kurt Douglas’ intro of best supporting actress, and it was all downhill from there.
The only times I ever saw the Osacrs was when I was “forced” to watch it while I was with my live-in girlfriend. I’d rather watch NASCAR or a sewing show on PBS.
| 475 |
dmon Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:41:03am |
It will be interesting to see how the open primaries will work in California…… I think its a good idea, but have been known to be wrong
| 476 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:41:26am |
re: #468 jamesfirecat
One third of the stimulus was spent on tax breaks, and examination of how the money was spent against the returns it got showed that tax breaks were among the least efficient form of governmental “spending” we could come up with.
So if you’re looking for somebody to blame for why all the money didn’t get as high a level of return as predicted, why not focus in on the GOP senators who insisted such a large portion of it be in tax cuts?
It was the republicans fault? Seriously? How many repubs ended up voting for the stimulus bill?
| 477 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:41:28am |
re: #474 Gus 802
The only times I ever saw the Osacrs was when I was “forced” to watch it while I was with my live-in girlfriend. I’d rather watch NASCAR or a sewing show on PBS.
I used to watch, mostly to see the gowns and how the actresses did their hair and make-up.
Girly stuff.
| 478 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:41:46am |
re: #462 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
In other news, Ronald Reagan is still dead. And water is still wet.
No offense to our Lizards in Indiana. Helluva thing out there. Stay dry!
| 479 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:41:58am |
re: #474 Gus 802
The only times I ever saw the Osacrs was when I was “forced” to watch it while I was with my live-in girlfriend. I’d rather watch NASCAR or a sewing show on PBS.
I swear that James Franco was baked out of his mind last night. He just seemed so stoned. Anne Hathaway did her best, bless her heart, and she can sing, but she was carrying the weight for both of them.
| 480 |
lawhawk Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:42:25am |
re: #463 RogueOne
Most of the stimulus package was actually transfer payments to the states to keep them solvent and give them a chance to balance their budgets without having to make even more drastic cuts.
Problem was that many states didn’t change things one iota. They kept spending, even as tax revenues dropped further still - and are facing gaping deficits due to a drop in revenues and a cessation of stimulus funds - meaning that the doomsday budgets are arriving this year, rather than in the midst of the recession. In that sense, the stimulus prolonged the consequences of the recession but kept it from being even deeper.
Had the focus really been on infrastructure, those hundreds of billions could have resulted in real and lasting improvements to the nation’s infrastructure for generations to come - with projects across the nation getting needed funding - whether it was highway improvements, rail upgrades, tunnel projects, etc.
| 481 |
garhighway Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:42:37am |
re: #370 RogueOne
Ahh, 2006. The good ol’ days when people realized to problems of carrying too much debt:
Democrats and the Deficit
By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: December 22, 2006To paraphrase: “Reducing the debt makes perfect sense but politically it’s suicide. People love “free” stuff.”
Would you expect an intelligent, fact-based economist to give the same answer now as in 206?
| 482 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:43:20am |
re: #479 Lidane
I swear that James Franco was baked out of his mind last night. He just seemed so stoned. Anne Hathaway did her best, bless her heart, and she can sing, but she was carrying the weight for both of them.
And his dress was awful!
| 483 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:43:24am |
re: #480 lawhawk
Had the focus really been on infrastructure, those hundreds of billions could have resulted in real and lasting improvements to the nation’s infrastructure for generations to come - with projects across the nation getting needed funding - whether it was highway improvements, rail upgrades, tunnel projects, etc.
Yep. The insistence that so much of the stimulus be in tax cuts was a really goddamn bad idea.
| 484 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:43:30am |
re: #479 Lidane
I still think the “boxer” actor… name? was drunk off his ass.
Forgot his wife’s name. (not choked up… FORGOT!)
| 485 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:43:35am |
re: #479 Lidane
I swear that James Franco was baked out of his mind last night. He just seemed so stoned. Anne Hathaway did her best, bless her heart, and she can sing, but she was carrying the weight for both of them.
Ah yes. James Franco the former teen heart throb. Think I only saw him once or twice. “Fly Boys”, and I had to look that up on Wiki.
| 486 |
garhighway Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:44:05am |
re: #415 Walter L. Newton
I think a good metric in measuring the pros or cons of the stimulus and whether or not it was effective would be simple. As soon as the Dems stop blaming Bush for everything from the economy to the condition of the toilets in the White House, at that point we can start deciding if the stimulus had the desired effect that we were promised.
In that case, when pigs fly.
To be expected from an economic illiterate.
| 487 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:44:09am |
re: #476 RogueOne
It was the republicans fault? Seriously? How many repubs ended up voting for the stimulus bill?
So now it’s Obama’s/The Dems fault for assuming the GOP was negotiating in good faith?
Weak tea.
| 489 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:44:34am |
re: #484 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
I still think the “boxer” actor… name? was drunk off his ass.
Forgot his wife’s name. (not choked up… FORGOT!)
Christian Bale? Yeah, probably drunk. I would be too if I had to sit through all that to the end.
Also, he clearly dyes his hair black, given the mismatch between his hair and his beard. Heh.
| 490 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:45:11am |
re: #479 Lidane
I swear that James Franco was baked out of his mind last night. He just seemed so stoned. Anne Hathaway did her best, bless her heart, and she can sing, but she was carrying the weight for both of them.
I realize the people featured are the best in their craft, but I get tired of Hollywood boasting. It’s really a marketing ploy to sell more movie tickets and licensed goods.
There are many other professions in which people make truly great accomplishments. …
| 491 |
iossarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:45:15am |
re: #463 RogueOne
I’ve made the argument before on here that, outside of truly massive government intervention such as WWII armament or Soviet-style planned economies, you can’t really measure the impact of economic policy in the short term.
What you can do is point to longer-term trends. In the past 100 years, there have been two peaks of wealth concentration in the US: 1929 and 2007. In addition to that, the past 30 years have seen a massive disinvestment in both infrastructure and education, both of which are vital to long-term prosperity.
If no-one has any money, no-one can buy anything and the economy goes in the shitter. Currently, the bottom 40% of households in the US control, I believe, 0.3% of the total wealth.
If you want a truly robust economy, you need to give more or less everyone a stake in it. When people are asked to define the “American Dream”, this is what they usually come up with: that if you work hard and play fair, you get to live a pretty decent life. You can’t tell me that no-one in that bottom 40% is working hard and playing fair, and yet, if something relatively minor happens (they go to hospital for a minor procedure and get a staph infection) they are literally fucked, and their families too.
The Republicans want to transfer yet more wealth to the top 0.1%. The Democrats, for all their flaws, are not quite as bad. If you make less than $250K a year and vote Republican, you are being played for a fool.
| 492 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:45:44am |
re: #486 garhighway
To be expected from an economic illiterate.
FU. Was that literate enough for you? It was a fucking joke. Lighten up.
| 493 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:47:30am |
re: #485 Gus 802
Ah yes. James Franco the former teen heart throb. Think I only saw him once or twice. “Fly Boys”, and I had to look that up on Wiki.
Oh yeah. “The Great Raid”. I think I only made through 20 minutes before I decided to watch “Teletubbies” reruns instead.
/
| 494 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:47:36am |
re: #491 iossarian
I’ve made the argument before on here that, outside of truly massive government intervention such as WWII armament or Soviet-style planned economies, you can’t really measure the impact of economic policy in the short term.
What you can do is point to longer-term trends. In the past 100 years, there have been two peaks of wealth concentration in the US: 1929 and 2007. In addition to that, the past 30 years have seen a massive disinvestment in both infrastructure and education, both of which are vital to long-term prosperity.
If no-one has any money, no-one can buy anything and the economy goes in the shitter. Currently, the bottom 40% of households in the US control, I believe, 0.3% of the total wealth.
If you want a truly robust economy, you need to give more or less everyone a stake in it. When people are asked to define the “American Dream”, this is what they usually come up with: that if you work hard and play fair, you get to live a pretty decent life. You can’t tell me that no-one in that bottom 40% is working hard and playing fair, and yet, if something relatively minor happens (they go to hospital for a minor procedure and get a staph infection) they are literally fucked, and their families too.
The Republicans want to transfer yet more wealth to the top 0.1%. The Democrats, for all their flaws, are not quite as bad. If you make less than $250K a year and vote Republican, you are being played for a fool.
A quarter-of a million a year is working class.
Who’d of thunk it growing-up? Remember when 200K was considered rich?
| 495 |
garhighway Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:48:05am |
re: #480 lawhawk
Most of the stimulus package was actually transfer payments to the states to keep them solvent and give them a chance to balance their budgets without having to make even more drastic cuts.
Problem was that many states didn’t change things one iota. They kept spending, even as tax revenues dropped further still - and are facing gaping deficits due to a drop in revenues and a cessation of stimulus funds - meaning that the doomsday budgets are arriving this year, rather than in the midst of the recession. In that sense, the stimulus prolonged the consequences of the recession but kept it from being even deeper.
Had the focus really been on infrastructure, those hundreds of billions could have resulted in real and lasting improvements to the nation’s infrastructure for generations to come - with projects across the nation getting needed funding - whether it was highway improvements, rail upgrades, tunnel projects, etc.
The problem with infrastructure spending as stimulus is that it is very slow. A big project takes a long time to get off the ground. As a result, most of the stimulus dollars that went for infrastructure were for things like road repaving: stuff that was in the pipeline or easy to fire up without a huge engineering front end. By design, you would want that 2009 stimulus money to recirculate quickly, which a lot of it did. The transfer payments to the states were like that: that money moved quickly, and saved jobs, at least in the short term. Which was the point. Did it delay a day of reckoning? You bet. Would it have been a good thing for our economy to have that day in 2009? Not hardly.
| 496 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:48:08am |
re: #463 RogueOne
Isn’t that the same argument people use to explain how another economic theory didn’t fail? It wasn’t implemented correctly”. We were told that a trillion dollars in spending, on shovel-ready projects, would keep unemployment from hitting 8%. We were told that for every dollar of spending we would get a return of $1.60. The multiplier never showed up, our growth rate was just downgraded “unexpectedly” again, unemployment is still 10%, and we’re running a very real risk of having our bond rating dropped. I don’t see the argument for more spending with those results.
“we were told that”… by whom? Keynesians, or the politicians who decided to do this?
Once more I point out that the Keynesians were saying it wasn’t enough IN ADVANCE. That’s a critical qualifier. If people are explaining after the fact why their plan didn’t work, you should examine the record to see if they knew of and dismissed the element they now use or if they were surprised by unanticipated events. If people are saying in advance that ‘this isn’t going to work’ and explain why, then when it doesn’t work it means they were (probably) right.
Keynesians such as Brad DeLong and Paul Krugman (just to list two most well known examples) were saying the best we’d get from the trillion (that was heavily distributed as tax credits and other delayed injections) was a very slow growth. It would stop the plunge, but wouldn’t be enough to start a rebuild. Lo and behold that’s what we got.
| 497 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:48:23am |
re: #491 iossarian
Yep. Economies are all about money moving. Not just moving on paper, but actually circulating. They’re all about wealth actually being created, not just abstractly envisioned on paper.
The only way that we can have a robust economy is to have a lot of consumers with expendable income. If we don’t have that, the only industries with any potential are the ones that people have to spend money on— food, housing, medical care, transportation. The real economy stagnates in those circumstances, as less real wealth is created, no matter how much paper wealth there is.
| 498 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:49:48am |
re: #495 garhighway
The spending for the states was quite good usage of stimulus money, as was the food stamp, etc. stuff. Spending that went right back into the economy is obviously best, followed by spending on things of lasting worth, like scientific research, infrastructure spending, etc. Absolute worst are tax cuts, especially those prolonging systemic problems— like the tax break for outsourcing jobs the GOP defended so adroitly.
| 499 |
garhighway Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:49:50am |
re: #492 Walter L. Newton
FU. Was that literate enough for you? It was a fucking joke. Lighten up.
It was equally meaningful.
| 500 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:49:52am |
re: #482 Alouette
And his dress was awful!
I was more offended by the bad wig they put on him. It’s the Oscars. At least spend a few bucks on a decent Marilyn Monroe wig. Surely there’s a drag queen somewhere that can loan theirs out for the night?
| 501 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:51:12am |
off for a while.
Have a great morning and I’ll be back … .
| 502 |
lawhawk Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:51:47am |
re: #483 Obdicut
The breakdown of the ARRA of 2009 shows that of the $787 billion, $288 billion was tax breaks, including $70 billion for the annual AMT adjustment, a $116 billion payroll tax break, $6.6 billion homebuyer tax break, and $51 billion in corp tax breaks.
Only $111 billion went for what was characterized as infrastructure (roughly 1/7 of the total). The amount that was spent to date is open to debate - as some of that money was in the form of grants (like for HSR - which may have been initially approved at the state level, but rejected by new incoming governors in 2010/2011).
And at least $144 billion went as transfer payments to the states, which includes Medicaid and education transfer payments.
| 503 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:52:13am |
re: #473 Obdicut
There is nobody— outside Paulian kooks- who thinks actual Keynesian economics is just wrong . There are people who don’t think that you can use Keynesian economics to actually craft policy responses. The two things are very, very different.
I would argue that the 2 times it’s been tried in this country, it failed to get the intended response. If you’re argument is going to be based on the idea that it would have worked if we had spent more then shouldn’t we have at least a hint that it might work in our 2 attempts?
According to Keynes:
The theory of aggregated production, which is the point of the following book, nevertheless can be much easier adapted to the conditions of a totalitarian state [eines totalen Staates] than the theory of production and distribution of a given production put forth under conditions of free competition and a large degree of laissez-faire. This is one of the reasons that justifies the fact that I call my theory a general theory.
In theory it will work. In the real world we get the results we’ve already seen, failure.
| 504 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:53:02am |
re: #487 jamesfirecat
So now it’s Obama’s/The Dems fault for assuming the GOP was negotiating in good faith?
Weak tea.
You’re the one who blamed the tax cuts on the republicans. I was pointing out that is a mistaken meme.
| 505 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:53:18am |
re: #503 RogueOne
I would argue that the 2 times it’s been tried in this country, it failed to get the intended response. If you’re argument is going to be based on the idea that it would have worked if we had spent more then shouldn’t we have at least a hint that it might work in our 2 attempts?
According to Keynes:
In theory it will work. In the real world we get the results we’ve already seen, failure.
Did WW2 end the great depression?
| 506 |
iossarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:53:26am |
re: #503 RogueOne
I think Keynsian economics worked pretty well during and after WWII.
| 509 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:55:25am |
re: #503 RogueOne
I would argue that the 2 times it’s been tried in this country, it failed to get the intended response.
The two times ‘what’ has been tried? What do you think Keynesian economics actually is?
In theory it will work. In the real world we get the results we’ve already seen, failure.
Yeah, you’re mixing up Keynesian economic analysis with policy taken from a Keynesian point of view. That was my point.
| 510 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:55:33am |
| 511 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:57:30am |
re: #503 RogueOne
I would argue that the 2 times it’s been tried in this country, it failed to get the intended response. If you’re argument is going to be based on the idea that it would have worked if we had spent more then shouldn’t we have at least a hint that it might work in our 2 attempts?
According to Keynes:
In theory it will work. In the real world we get the results we’ve already seen, failure.
What 2 attempts?
Its half-stepped application was working through the 1930s, and the almost entire application via our entry in WWII worked extremely well. Its guidance worked well for almost every recession since, with the exception of the stagflation in the 1970s — and the monetarists were just as wrong in their predictions. Again, the predicted effect of our half-step measure this time was to stop the plunge and go into a stagnant-to-slow increase; as is happening.
| 512 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:58:15am |
re: #503 RogueOne
Do you even understand the context of that quote, Rogue?
Here’s the whole thing, to help you out.
[Link: tmh.floonet.net…]
Or did you just read it on the Mises institute, and repeat it without actually knowing what he was talking about?
[Link: mises.org…]
| 513 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:59:10am |
re: #511 kirkspencer
I’m not sure where you’re getting numbers showing how it was working during the ‘30’s. The argument for why it didn’t work is the same one we’re hearing today, that we didn’t spend enough money.
| 514 |
lawhawk Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:59:10am |
re: #495 garhighway
Yet, the administration was touting infrastructure spending on shovel ready projects that proved to be anything but - and those projects that were truly shovel ready couldn’t get appropriate funding/financing.
I can think of several in the NYC metro area that were shovel ready and couldn’t get the needed financing, including building out at Ground Zero, the Hudson River tunnels, Portal Bridge, and other mass transit capital projects around the City that had to fight for financing despite the plans being in place for construction. Delays in financing added to the costs for those projects.
| 515 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 8:59:36am |
Genius!
Texas landowners stuck on wrong side of border fence
In and around Brownsville, Rio Grande farm and pastureland — even some homes — end up on the ‘Mexican’ side of the Homeland Security Department’s border barrier.
| 516 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:00:34am |
re: #512 Obdicut
Do you even understand the context of that quote, Rogue?
Here’s the whole thing, to help you out.
[Link: tmh.floonet.net…]
Thanks but that’s where I got it, from the forward of General Theory.
| 517 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:00:51am |
re: #513 RogueOne
I’m not sure where you’re getting numbers showing how it was working during the ‘30’s. The argument for why it didn’t work is the same one we’re hearing today, that we didn’t spend enough money.
But it was working. Our recovery from the Great Depression started before WWII, on the back of the New Deal spending programs.
| 518 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:01:32am |
With “economics” it doesn’t matter what you call it. The super rich will always hold a monopoly on wealth, power, and the means of production.
| 519 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:01:41am |
re: #516 RogueOne
Thanks but that’s where I got it, from the forward of General Theory.
Yeah, but what on earth do you think it means? All he’s saying is that his theory can be applied to totalitarian economies more easily than the orthodox theory can. You appear to think it means something entirely different. Why?
| 520 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:01:52am |
re: #513 RogueOne
I’m not sure where you’re getting numbers showing how it was working during the ‘30’s. The argument for why it didn’t work is the same one we’re hearing today, that we didn’t spend enough money.
Luckily during the 40’s we did spend enough money what with how the government had to pay all the people it was drafting into the army.
And lo and be hold, when the MASSIVE GOVERNMENT EMPLOYMENT of having to pay everyone in the army we drafted, and the MASSIVE GOVERNMENT SPENDING on tanks, planes and ships, were injected into the economy and the dust settled lo and behold the great depression was but a memory…
Doesn’t this qualify as a clear victory for Keynesian economics?
| 521 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:02:15am |
re: #480 lawhawk
Most of the stimulus package was actually transfer payments to the states to keep them solvent and give them a chance to balance their budgets without having to make even more drastic cuts.
…..
That is exactly right. All the spending did was to push the problem further down the road so we can continue having this argument at the state level.
| 522 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:03:32am |
Threw in “means of production” just to add some Marxist flavor.
//
| 523 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:04:30am |
re: #519 Obdicut
Yeah, but what on earth do you think it means? All he’s saying is that his theory can be applied to totalitarian economies more easily than the orthodox theory can.
Which is exactly the point I was making. “in theory it will work” given all the right set of facts but we don’t live in a theoretical world.
| 524 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:06:17am |
Oh well. Here’s the run down on the American life. We just got over Thanksgiving - get drunk. December and the Christmas Holidays - get drunk. Footballs season which lasts through February - get drunk. New Years Eve - get drunk. Valentines Day - get drunk. President’s Day Weekend - get drunk. So, now we go into March Madness and once again we have a new task at hand: get drunk.
| 525 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:06:40am |
re: #523 RogueOne
Which is exactly the point I was making. “in theory it will work” given all the right set of facts but we don’t live in a theoretical world.
No, Rogue, that’s not what that paragraph means. What that paragraph is saying is that, opposed to orthodox economic theory, his theory depends on fewer assumptions, and so can be more easily (than the orthodox theory) applied to a totalitarian economy as well.
Again, you’re continually mixing ‘work’ as in the application in policy of Keynesian theory with the analysis of an economy by Keynesian theory.
What do you think Keynesian economics actually is?
| 526 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:07:51am |
re: #524 Gus 802
Oh well. Here’s the run down on the American life. We just got over Thanksgiving - get drunk. December and the Christmas Holidays - get drunk. Footballs season which lasts through February - get drunk. New Years Eve - get drunk. Valentines Day - get drunk. President’s Day Weekend - get drunk. So, now we go into March Madness and once again we have a new task at hand: get drunk.
To alcohol, the cause of, and solution to, all of life’s problems!
| 527 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:08:04am |
re: #513 RogueOne
I’m not sure where you’re getting numbers showing how it was working during the ‘30’s. The argument for why it didn’t work is the same one we’re hearing today, that we didn’t spend enough money.
See this chart, which uses BEA data (to which it links). Notice that GDP recovered a large proportion of the plunge by 1937, at which point the “austerity” party got a balanced budget passed through and there were overseas effects as WWII started for Europe — and we had a double dip. Deficit spending was re-initiated in 1938 and a recovery started, with a sharp spike upward when we actually got massive government injections starting in 1940.
| 528 |
RogueOne Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:08:15am |
re: #520 jamesfirecat
It’s easy to drop the unemployment level when you enlist every healthy male under the age of 40 in a government job. That isn’t possible without a massive WW.
I’ve enjoyed the debate this morning (even though it got off to a late start) but I’m afraid I need to take off. I hate leaving just when it’s getting good but I have a “shovel ready project” that’s calling my name. We’ll have the next 2 years to argue this through though.//
| 529 |
lawhawk Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:09:16am |
Al Qaeda’s Zawahiri decides to issue a presser to incite Tunisians and Egyptians to revolt against the newly forming governments.
He’s hoping to benefit from the ongoing turmoil. Failed states make for a breeding ground for jihadis, and a failed state along North Africa would be a tremendous base of operations for al Qaeda to strike at Europe or elsewhere in the Middle East.
| 530 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:09:47am |
re: #526 jamesfirecat
To alcohol, the cause of, and solution to, all of life’s problems!
America doesn’t have a drinking problem! We have a drug problem!
//
| 531 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:10:18am |
re: #528 RogueOne
It’s easy to drop the unemployment level when you enlist every healthy male under the age of 40 in a government job. That isn’t possible without a massive WW.
I’ve enjoyed the debate this morning (even though it got off to a late start) but I’m afraid I need to take off. I hate leaving just when it’s getting good but I have a “shovel ready project” that’s calling my name. We’ll have the next 2 years to argue this through though.//
Why isn’t it possible exactly?
Because there aren’t enough jobs to be done?
| 532 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:10:19am |
re: #528 RogueOne
Next time, we can hear what on earth you think Keynesian economics actually is. That should be fun.
| 533 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:10:50am |
re: #530 Gus 802
America doesn’t have a drinking problem! We have a drug problem!
//
//Two hands, two bottles, one mouth, sounds like a drinking problem to me!
| 534 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:11:35am |
re: #529 lawhawk
Al Qaeda’s Zawahiri decides to issue a presser to incite Tunisians and Egyptians to revolt against the newly forming governments.
He’s hoping to benefit from the ongoing turmoil. Failed states make for a breeding ground for jihadis, and a failed state along North Africa would be a tremendous base of operations for al Qaeda to strike at Europe or elsewhere in the Middle East.
Makes sense. They should heed their advice because nothing says “non-oppressive government” like Al Qaeda and their friends.
//
| 535 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:13:14am |
re: #532 Obdicut
Unfortunately Keynesian economics has become a talking point boogey man like “socialism”. The vast majority of the people claiming that Keynesian economics has been discredited have no clue what they’re talking about.
| 536 |
iossarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:14:02am |
re: #531 jamesfirecat
Why isn’t it possible exactly?
Because there aren’t enough jobs to be done?
Because you’d have to tap some of the wealth currently controlled by the top 0.1% of the population in order to pay for it.
And so instead they’ll pay advertising companies to persuade lower-income voters to oppose it.
| 537 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:14:36am |
re: #528 RogueOne
It’s easy to drop the unemployment level when you enlist every healthy male under the age of 40 in a government job. That isn’t possible without a massive WW.
I’ve enjoyed the debate this morning (even though it got off to a late start) but I’m afraid I need to take off. I hate leaving just when it’s getting good but I have a “shovel ready project” that’s calling my name. We’ll have the next 2 years to argue this through though.//
Sorry to see you go. When you come back, consider that there are other opportunities besides war for massive injections and hirings by the government.
My favorite proposal was to select three Massive Infrastructure Projects and run them as Independent Government Agencies: agencies provided oversight and contracted out the work as much as possible. (Worked for TVA, to give one example). The three MIPs I liked were a national (fast) rail redevelopment, a national broadband distribution, and an upgraded/replaced energy distribution network. They’d each take about a decade to finish if pushed as major models, and all three would have significant spinoffs to the private side. Note that there were and are other suggested MIPs, just those are the three I liked best.
| 538 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:14:53am |
re: #533 jamesfirecat
//Two hands, two bottles, one mouth, sounds like a drinking problem to me!
Yeah but the Irish consume more alcohol than Americans. Nothing to worry about.
//
| 540 |
lostlakehiker Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:18:23am |
re: #531 jamesfirecat
Why isn’t it possible exactly?
Because there aren’t enough jobs to be done?
Because the government doesn’t have enough information about what needs to be done.
The baker can judge, by sales of this or that type of cookie, which cookies need to be produced in greater number, and which, in lesser. The government has a satellite’s eye view of the economy. There aren’t enough bureaucrats to take care of every cookie decision, every leaky faucet, and so forth.
Socialist economies have tended to resolve this problem by setting quotas. But if a nail factory gets credited for nails by count, they’ll produce many small nails and no big ones. If it’s credited for kg’s of nails, it’ll produce big nails. This was exactly what happened in the Soviet Union.
Changing topics big time, here’s a flying pig moment: a couple of heavily conservative Republicans have stepped up to defend Michelle Obama’s campaign against childhood obesity. Republican heavy hitters step up to the plate for Michelle.
| 541 |
William Barnett-Lewis Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:22:12am |
re: #342 RogueOne
Are you arguing that they Keynesian model is working? I would argue all the evidence points to a much different conclusion.
The Keynesian economic model is rather like Democracy, A really crappy system/model that just happens to be better than any of the alternatives.
| 542 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:25:09am |
re: #535 Killgore Trout
Unfortunately Keynesian economics has become a talking point boogey man like “socialism”. The vast majority of the people claiming that Keynesian economics has been discredited have no clue what they’re talking about.
Yep. At it’s most basic, Keynesian economics says a lot of things that almost nobody contends with: That spending of money, rather than the price of labor, determines the level of employment (which we can see proved very well right now), at least in any short term, and that capital has marginal utility.
People basically pretend that Keynesian theory boils down to ‘government spending is always good’, and ignore the actual theory and what came after it.
Further, like any economic theory, it didn’t stop with Keynes. Just as Darwin had no clue what DNA was, Keynes didn’t write a be-all and end-all of economics. He wrote an excellent critique of orthodox theory, and moved the field forwards.
| 543 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:25:57am |
| 544 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:29:17am |
re: #543 Killgore Trout
The picture on the article is awesome. Some guy has a large gun (not good with identifying gun type from that angle) in each hand. He is very prepared. :)
| 545 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:31:27am |
re: #542 Obdicut
Further, like any economic theory, it didn’t stop with Keynes. Just as Darwin had no clue what DNA was, Keynes didn’t write a be-all and end-all of economics. He wrote an excellent critique of orthodox theory, and moved the field forwards.
I think the comparison to Darwin is very appropriate. One of the big differences is that we all learned about evolution in high school and it’s a fairly easy concept. Economics is not very well covered and most people have a very limited understanding. It makes an easy target for loons and quacks like Ron Paul and the Mises Institute. Unfortunately, the Tea Party and Republicans have adopted quack economics into their agenda because it’s easy to get the wingnuts excited with talking points about a subject they don’t understand.
| 546 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:32:23am |
re: #544 ProLifeLiberal
The picture on the article is awesome. Some guy has a large gun (not good with identifying gun type from that angle) in each hand. He is very prepared. :)
Rambo!
| 547 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:32:55am |
re: #540 lostlakehiker
Because the government doesn’t have enough information about what needs to be done.
The baker can judge, by sales of this or that type of cookie, which cookies need to be produced in greater number, and which, in lesser. The government has a satellite’s eye view of the economy. There aren’t enough bureaucrats to take care of every cookie decision, every leaky faucet, and so forth.
Socialist economies have tended to resolve this problem by setting quotas. But if a nail factory gets credited for nails by count, they’ll produce many small nails and no big ones. If it’s credited for kg’s of nails, it’ll produce big nails. This was exactly what happened in the Soviet Union.
Actually, that’s a flaw of authoritarian governments, of which there are capitalistic as well as socialist economic examples.
What a government calls itself (socialist or democratic) is propaganda and may have nothing to do with its actual operation.
| 548 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:33:06am |
re: #544 ProLifeLiberal
The picture on the article is awesome. Some guy has a large gun (not good with identifying gun type from that angle) in each hand. He is very prepared. :)
This one?
| 549 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:34:27am |
| 550 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:34:54am |
re: #547 kirkspencer
Actually, that’s a flaw of authoritarian governments, of which there are capitalistic as well as socialist economic examples.
What a government calls itself (socialist or democratic) is propaganda and may have nothing to do with its actual operation.
Sorry, I should have given an example.
By most descriptors, Sweden is a socialist state as it heavily taxes to provide a strong welfare system for its citizens and residents. It does not, however, micromanage its industries.
| 552 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:36:01am |
re: #548 Gus 802
Yeah that one. This needs to be a meme or something. That picture is awesome.
| 553 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:36:19am |
re: #545 Killgore Trout
Hell, most people treat spending as though the money just gets vaporized. “The government is spending all this money!” as though they’re just burning it in a big pit.
This is why salary cutting is one of the stupider moves for austerity; low and middle-income people spend their money domestically at a high rate. And they spend it. Likewise with pensions. Those retirees spend that money in the economy. It keeps moving.
There is wasted money. Some of those salaries are probably paying for people who do nothing much, or do redundant jobs.
But the government in no way, shape, or form is the leader in wasting money. Advertising, I’d say, is the biggest waster of funds we’ve got— billions of bucks spent to gain competitive advantage, having nothing to do with the actual quality or aspects of the products. That’s a lot of digging of ditches and filling it back in.
| 554 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:37:54am |
re: #552 ProLifeLiberal
Yeah that one. This needs to be a meme or something. That picture is awesome.
Looks like two shot guns. The one on the right is a double barrel. Although the one on the left could be a high caliber rifle.
| 555 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:41:39am |
See like this one. Looks “home made”.
Although I’m sure some Comic Book Guy gun expert can identify it.
| 556 |
CuriousLurker Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:42:07am |
re: #544 ProLifeLiberal
The picture on the article is awesome. Some guy has a large gun (not good with identifying gun type from that angle) in each hand. He is very prepared. :)
Heh, yeah, if I didn’t know better I’d think he was straight out of Hollywood—the big ‘scatche & axe really top off the look. Not a guy whose bad side I’d want to be on. I want to see him go mano a mano with Gaddafi… steel cage death match.
| 558 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:44:46am |
re: #544 ProLifeLiberal
The picture on the article is awesome. Some guy has a large gun (not good with identifying gun type from that angle) in each hand. He is very prepared. :)
When did the Tea Party Nostalgic Costume party go international?
| 561 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:48:19am |
re: #544 ProLifeLiberal
I am an expert at identifying a gun type.
“HOLY SHIT! THAT GUY HAS A GUN POINTED AT ME! RUN!”
Only one type, as far as I am concerned.
| 562 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:48:36am |
re: #560 Gus 802
He kind of looks like that Most Intersting Man in the World Guy.
| 563 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:49:13am |
This has nothing to do with anything and is awesome.
| 564 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:49:31am |
re: #562 Obdicut
He kind of looks like that Most Intersting Man in the World Guy.
Or an extra for Lawrence of Arabia.
/
| 565 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:50:28am |
re: #562 Obdicut
I would certainly want to meet this guy. Be interesting to talk to. He probably is one of the mannliest men ever.
This picture was added to my Facebook for all to my friends to see.
| 566 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:52:46am |
Last American WWI Veteran dies.
Can’t believe there were any left.
Rest in peace.
| 567 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:54:21am |
re: #295 laZardo
So I’ve been dealing with someone who’s all praises for a parliamentary system, and I’ve come to the realization that if America used the Westminster system then our Prime Minister would probably be John Boehner right now.
Also good evening.
Don’t get my father going on the parliamentary system. He is convinced, with every fiber of his being, that if the Israelis were not crippled by ‘that stupid colonialist English system’, they could elect a prime minister for a stable term, and that person could ‘finally get something done’.
He blames the Brits for ‘the situation’ having gone on so long. But then, he’s Irish-American, he blames ‘em for most things.
| 568 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:55:36am |
| 569 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:55:46am |
re: #545 Killgore Trout
I think the comparison to Darwin is very appropriate. One of the big differences is that we all learned about evolution in high school and it’s a fairly easy concept. Economics is not very well covered and most people have a very limited understanding. It makes an easy target for loons and quacks like Ron Paul and the Mises Institute. Unfortunately, the Tea Party and Republicans have adopted quack economics into their agenda because it’s easy to get the wingnuts excited with talking points about a subject they don’t understand.
Economics is one of those very simple things that quickly becomes very complex.
I find myself constantly returning to: “Economics is the Study of the Use of Resources”
| 570 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:55:46am |
Here’s you go. Bigger image of Lawrence of Arabia guy with sneakers…
Image: pb-110228-libya-da-01.photoblog900.jpg
Page link here…
[Link: photoblog.msnbc.msn.com…]
| 571 |
Simply Sarah Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:56:35am |
re: #567 SanFranciscoZionist
Don’t get my father going on the parliamentary system. He is convinced, with every fiber of his being, that if the Israelis were not crippled by ‘that stupid colonialist English system’, they could elect a prime minister for a stable term, and that person could ‘finally get something done’.
He blames the Brits for ‘the situation’ having gone on so long. But then, he’s Irish-American, he blames ‘em for most things.
What system does he think they should be using in place of the current one?
| 572 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:57:09am |
re: #553 Obdicut
Hell, most people treat spending as though the money just gets vaporized. “The government is spending all this money!” as though they’re just burning it in a big pit.
This is why salary cutting is one of the stupider moves for austerity; low and middle-income people spend their money domestically at a high rate. And they spend it. Likewise with pensions. Those retirees spend that money in the economy. It keeps moving.
There is wasted money. Some of those salaries are probably paying for people who do nothing much, or do redundant jobs.
But the government in no way, shape, or form is the leader in wasting money. Advertising, I’d say, is the biggest waster of funds we’ve got— billions of bucks spent to gain competitive advantage, having nothing to do with the actual quality or aspects of the products. That’s a lot of digging of ditches and filling it back in.
Campaign contributions —biggest waste of money!
| 573 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:57:10am |
re: #569 ggt
Economics is one of those very simple things that quickly becomes very complex.
I find myself constantly returning to: “Economics is the Study of the Use of Resources”
Interesting. I keep returning to “Economics is the Study of Trade.”
| 574 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:57:31am |
re: #548 Gus 802
Did everyone in the Middle East learn fire arm safety from El Guapo?
It must rain bullets there all of the damn time.
| 576 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:59:10am |
re: #352 Naso Tang
That comes from the same people who think Democracy means winner take all.
Which is baffling, because they are ALSO the same people who insist that it’s important to explain that we’re a Republic, NOT a Democracy.
| 577 |
Gus Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:59:46am |
re: #574 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Did everyone in the Middle East learn fire arm safety from El Guapo?
It must rain bullets there all of the damn time.
Remove the head gear and give him some boleros and he can be in the Pampas. Although I just noticed that his ammo belt looks empty.
| 578 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 9:59:51am |
re: #357 EmmmieG
We need to run America like a republic with a bill of rights!
What a novel concept!!!
| 579 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:03:14am |
re: #403 kirkspencer
One of the interesting things to watch right now is the entry dance. It’s reminiscent of penguins on the ice flow. First into the water gets the best fish — or eaten if Orca’s about. First to announce gets a big boost, but also gets savaged by the press.
Worth pointing out — by Feb 28, 2007 the following people had formally declared their candidacy:
- Rudy Guiliani (Feb 15)
- Duncan Hunter (Jan 25)
- Mike Huckabee (Jan 28)
- Mitt Romney (Feb 7)Mccain announced he would run on the 28th of Feb, but he didn’t formally announce (file the papers) till April 25. Paul’s declaration was the 12th of March, and the only other formal declaration, Fred Thompson, wasn’t till September 22.
Read something by a woman writing for the WSJ—Noemie something? Can’t recall—who basically said that the up-and-coming class, which will be ready to run in the next round, is so much a better line-up that basically, the Republicans’ best shot is to run someone neutral, hope he doesn’t win, and then come back hard for 2016.
| 580 |
rwdflynavy Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:05:52am |
re: #571 Simply Sarah
What system does he think they should be using in place of the current one?
I recommend a Chucktatorship /Chuck Norris/
| 581 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:07:23am |
re: #446 Walter L. Newton
I had never even heard of this guy until his dust up last week in a cafe in Paris…
FASHION guru John Galliano was filmed having a vile racist rant during which he declared: “I love Hitler.”
Take a look at his mug… is he going for a living Guy Falkes look?
I’ve heard his name before, attached to his clothes.
| 582 |
Slap Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:09:02am |
re: #479 Lidane
For me, the best moment of the whole gig (one of the strangest Oscar telecasts I can remember, incidentally) was when Tom Hooper credited his mother while accepting his Best Director award. “Listen to your mother!”
| 583 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:11:01am |
re: #446 Walter L. Newton
I had never even heard of this guy until his dust up last week in a cafe in Paris…
FASHION guru John Galliano was filmed having a vile racist rant during which he declared: “I love Hitler.”
Take a look at his mug… is he going for a living Guy Falkes look?
Well, having read the whole article, I suppose I won’t be spending ten thousand dollars on any of his dresses any time soon.
| 584 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:11:46am |
re: #453 Romantic Heretic
As a Canadian I’ve never understood the purpose of registering with a particular party. Here in Canada they simply make sure you live in the area you vote in and that you are of voting age.
What’s the purpose of registering as a member of a particular party?
Primaries.
| 586 |
albusteve Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:13:13am |
re: #544 ProLifeLiberal
The picture on the article is awesome. Some guy has a large gun (not good with identifying gun type from that angle) in each hand. He is very prepared. :)
shotguns, one semi auto, the other a double barrel
| 587 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:15:13am |
re: #579 SanFranciscoZionist
Read something by a woman writing for the WSJ—Noemie something? Can’t recall—who basically said that the up-and-coming class, which will be ready to run in the next round, is so much a better line-up that basically, the Republicans’ best shot is to run someone neutral, hope he doesn’t win, and then come back hard for 2016.
That, and the nation will probably be tired of a Democratic president. (We tend to do that.) On the other hand a lot of current issues will be dead or tired by then.
Gay marriage is coming to a head and will be four years past.
Health care reform will be almost entirely in place in 2014.
/Maybe/ we’ll still be engaged in Iraq and Afghanistan, but if so it’ll be after four more years of the current sort of thing.
We’re beginning to see climate change effects, and they’re likely to be more significant over the upcoming four years.
Regardless of whether we crash like a rock this year or just doldrum (keep on keeping on), the economy will have gone a fair ways toward recovery before 2016.
All not to say the opponents can’t come up with something, but right now is a high point for counter-party rage.
| 589 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:21:32am |
re: #538 Gus 802
Yeah but the Irish consume more alcohol than Americans. Nothing to worry about.
//
We are #20 on the NationMaster list. Ireland is #3, beat out by Luxembourg and France.
I think the problem with American drinking is that we’re prone to binging, more than how much we’re actually drinking over the course of the year.
| 590 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:22:34am |
re: #540 lostlakehiker
Because the government doesn’t have enough information about what needs to be done.
The baker can judge, by sales of this or that type of cookie, which cookies need to be produced in greater number, and which, in lesser. The government has a satellite’s eye view of the economy. There aren’t enough bureaucrats to take care of every cookie decision, every leaky faucet, and so forth.
Socialist economies have tended to resolve this problem by setting quotas. But if a nail factory gets credited for nails by count, they’ll produce many small nails and no big ones. If it’s credited for kg’s of nails, it’ll produce big nails. This was exactly what happened in the Soviet Union.
Changing topics big time, here’s a flying pig moment: a couple of heavily conservative Republicans have stepped up to defend Michelle Obama’s campaign against childhood obesity. Republican heavy hitters step up to the plate for Michelle.
Both guys who struggle with their own weight—and Huckabee’s been supporting her all along.
It’s good to see them injecting a little common sense into this.
| 591 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:23:32am |
re: #545 Killgore Trout
I think the comparison to Darwin is very appropriate. One of the big differences is that we all learned about evolution in high school and it’s a fairly easy concept. Economics is not very well covered and most people have a very limited understanding. It makes an easy target for loons and quacks like Ron Paul and the Mises Institute. Unfortunately, the Tea Party and Republicans have adopted quack economics into their agenda because it’s easy to get the wingnuts excited with talking points about a subject they don’t understand.
I took Econ in high school.
I didn’t understand a damn word that was said in that class.
I somehow got a very high score on the Golden State Exam for it, though.
I think they must have graded on a curve.
| 592 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:25:42am |
re: #571 Simply Sarah
What system does he think they should be using in place of the current one?
The one we use in the U.S., of course.
;)
| 593 |
Simply Sarah Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:26:50am |
re: #592 SanFranciscoZionist
The one we use in the U.S., of course.
;)
That…would make it rather hard to elect a PM. >_>
| 594 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:28:20am |
re: #593 Simply Sarah
That…would make it rather hard to elect a PM. >_>
True. He doesn’t have an entire program worked out, he simply feels that a system that didn’t use coalition governments would be more stable. Essentially, he’d like to see them hold presidential elections.
| 595 |
Achilles Tang Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:30:34am |
re: #576 SanFranciscoZionist
Which is baffling, because they are ALSO the same people who insist that it’s important to explain that we’re a Republic, NOT a Democracy.
To be honest, while I find the concept of rights of the minority to be self evident (to use a term I’ve heard), the legal distinctions between a Democracy and a Republic are not something I expect a tea party member to understand any better than I do.
| 596 |
Achilles Tang Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:34:24am |
re: #590 SanFranciscoZionist
Both guys who struggle with their own weight—and Huckabee’s been supporting her all along.
It’s good to see them injecting a little common sense into this.
I note that Huckabee also covers his ass by saying “I didn’t say they’re all wrong,” meaning the Palins and other fruits. .
| 597 |
palomino Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:41:09am |
re: #381 RogueOne
You won’t get much of an argument from me on most of those contentions. Where I would argue is the nations response to the Iraq war. In 2006 3/5ths of the voters who said the Iraq war was a mistake voted for the dems. That means that 40% of the people who thought there was a problem still voted for repubs.
IMO, what that really hurt the repubs was the spending issue since it kept fiscal conservative voters from either coming out to vote or switching to dems. You may not have been paying much attention to internal republican squabbles but spending issues had been boiling since 2005 with the porkbusters vs. trent lott. It doesn’t surprise me that people upset with bush spending got very upset when obama doubled down on the issue.
The gop did a great job of pushing the mute button on these internal squabbles you mention. Fact is the whole tea party didn’t get going until they saw a prez who isn’t “one of us.” They can couch it in terms of the constitution, state sovereignty, federal spending, whatever. But it really comes down to a culture war that boiled over when Bush left office. While he was still there, the TP was nothing more than a gleam in Ron Paul’s eye.
As for Obama doubling down, this is just more gop spin. Debt was already spiraling out of control when he took office; the only addition was a stimulus, which even a lot of moderate to conservative economists agreed was necessary on a one-time basis. You probably oppose raising taxes over 250k, but it’s more of a deficit reduction plan than anything Bush ever did.
| 598 |
palomino Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:42:05am |
re: #383 RogueOne
He’s the president, the champ. You have to knock the champ out to win and it’s going to be very hard for a republican challenger to do it. It’s going to be much easier to take the senate. If the repubs take both houses and obama wins re-election the next 4 years should be a blast.
Just like 1996-2000, the proverbial good old days.
| 599 |
palomino Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:45:37am |
re: #397 RogueOne
Obama barely won IN and OH (by 1% in OH IIRC) and I don’t see unemployment coming down enough to cover him even if the nominee is Palin. I don’t feel like I’m really going out on a limb. I think IN, OH, and FL are going to flip on him but he still has more than enough electoral votes to win again.
Here’s a prediction: if Obama loses OH and FL, he loses the election. JFK was the last prez to win without OH, and that’s only because he essentially stole IL.
| 600 |
kirkspencer Mon, Feb 28, 2011 10:56:19am |
re: #599 palomino
Here’s a prediction: if Obama loses OH and FL, he loses the election. JFK was the last prez to win without OH, and that’s only because he essentially stole IL.
Actually, this might not turn out completely true this time around. Ohio is losing two seats in the house and two votes in the electoral college. (Of course, Florida is GAINING two seats.)
For what it’s worth there are six seats leaving traditional Democratic strongholds and going to traditionally Republican strongholds. (Texas is gaining 4 of them.) In the more or less swing states, in addition to OH/FL, Iowa is giving one up and Nevada is gaining one.
Subtle changes.
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