Idaho GOP: If Women Are Raped, It’s ‘The Hand of the Almighty’ At Work

A victory for the GOP in their war on reproductive rights
Wingnuts • Views: 37,461

It’s mind-bogglingly inhuman and heartless, but this, folks, is how the Republican Party views women who are victims of rape: Idaho Rejects Rape Exception In Abortion Bill Because ‘The Hand Of The Almighty’ Was At Work.

Marching in step with the GOP’s nationwide war on a woman’s right to choose, the Idaho legislature gave final approval to a bill that would outlaw abortions after 20 weeks. …

In 1990, Idaho’s anti-abortion Gov. Cecil Andrus (D) vetoed a similar bill expressly because it failed to provide a rape or incest exception. “The bill is drawn so narrowly that it would punitively and without compassion further harm an Idaho woman who may find herself in the horrible, unthinkable position of confronting a pregnancy that resulted from rape or incest,” he said.

But this year during Sexual Assault Awareness Month, state Republican lawmakers found plenty of reasons to advocate for it. State Rep. Shannon McMillan (R) argued that women who were impregnated under “violent circumstances” should have no choice because it’s not the fetus’s fault. State Rep. Brent Crane, the bill’s sponsor, took it a step further. Believing that “tragic, horrific” acts of rape or incest are the “hand of the Almighty,” Crane said women should trust God to turn the consequences of their sexual assault into “wonderful examples”:

“Is not the child of that rape or incest also a victim?” asked Rep. Shannon McMillan, R-Silverton. “It didn’t ask to be here. It was here under violent circumstances perhaps, but that was through no fault of its own.”[…]

The Idaho bill’s House sponsor, state Rep. Brent Crane, R-Nampa, told legislators that the “hand of the Almighty” was at work. “His ways are higher than our ways,” Crane said. “He has the ability to take difficult, tragic, horrific circumstances and then turn them into wonderful examples.”

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614 comments
1 Kragar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:34:44pm

If someone were to bitchslap these bastards into the middle of next week, that would also technically be the hand of the Almighty at work.

2 HappyWarrior  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:34:52pm

What in the fuck is wrong with these people? Great message to women, you fuckwits.

3 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:34:56pm

I guess if you're stupid enough to think that you're stupid enough not to keep your dumbass shit to yourself.

4 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:35:22pm

I am now going to be sick. This also fits very well with a conversation that was on the last thread about where the education centers are (and aren't) in this nation.

5 RurouniKenshin  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:37:00pm

So wait--this is the same god they say I should worship?

Which side is this god on the good vs. evil scale again?

6 Kragar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:37:06pm

It didn't ask to be here, but once its here, you're fucking stuck with taking care of it on your own, and as an unwed mother, you're trash anyways.

7 BishopX  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:37:32pm

You know they've been thinking this stuff for ages. I'm glad that their rhetorical skills have devolved to a level where they feel comfortable saying it.

8 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:38:54pm

re: #5 RurouniKenshin

So wait--this is the same god they say I should worship?

Which side is this god on the good vs. evil scale again?

Yeah this is part of what pisses me off so much. They thump a bible they have not read and profane what is actually in it.

The image of a wrathful God punishing a raped girl (who they no doubt think asked for it) with an unwanted pregnancy is just simply too sick for words.

These people are deranged animals.

9 elisabeth  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:39:22pm

I know it's sort of beside the point but are there even doctors in Idaho who perform abortions?

10 HappyWarrior  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:39:41pm

I'd love just love for that guy to tell a raped woman who is carrying her rapist child that this is God's plan at work. What a terrible thing to say. No one and I mean no one deserves to be raped and if there is a God, it certainly wasn't his hand at work. What kind of sick world do these people live in? I mean goddamn really.

11 goddamnedfrank  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:40:45pm

Isn't abortion also then the Hand of the Almighty? I'm sure he washes it first.

I mean, this logic is kind of a catch all for every single good, bad and neutral event in history, from the Bataan Death March to the invention Tivo. If it actually happens, then God must have wanted it that way.

12 jaunte  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:41:14pm

re: #10 HappyWarrior

They live in a world where being raped is someone else's problem that doesn't concern them.

13 HappyWarrior  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:41:49pm

re: #12 jaunte

They live in a world where being raped is someone else's problem that doesn't concern them.

I know, I am just disgusted to see this out of fellow Americans. This is talk I imagine hearing from the Taliban and groups like that.

14 engineer cat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:42:13pm

Q: who gets to decide what is part of god's inscrutable plan and what is a dreadful sin that must be stopped?

A: not you. not you, not me, not anybody

15 Ming  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:43:33pm

After 20 weeks of pregnancy, I don't think the fetus would be viable at all. Or, it may be that a fetus would be viable in a very unusual case (although I doubt it). But even if, say, a 21-week fetus were viable, the costs of neonatal care would be very, very high, I think at least $50,000 per week.

Also, how can anyone know what the magic 20-week point has been crossed?

I can actually sympathize with restrictions on abortion when the pregnancy is obviously close to term (birth). I have mixed feelings. I'm pro-choice. But after 7.5 months, when the lungs of the fetus are just about ready, MAYBE I could support restrictions on abortion. But all that aside, the current Republican bill, with its 20-week threshold, is simply ridiculous. The only purpose I can see would be to further harass (or one could say terrorize) doctors and nurses who provide abortions. This bill is unenforceable, and the financial costs involved are really astronomical.

16 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:43:34pm

re: #10 HappyWarrior

I'd love just love for that guy to tell a raped woman who is carrying her rapist child that this is God's plan at work. What a terrible thing to say. No one and I mean no one deserves to be raped and if there is a God, it certainly wasn't his hand at work. What kind of sick world do these people live in? I mean goddamn really.

Wasn't it not too long ago where a woman had to carry a child to term that died as soon as it was born due to a similar bill in the Dakotas? I recall one of the bills sponsors saying the bill worked as intended and it was gods will.

17 EdDantes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:44:00pm

Crane is an idiot

18 celticdragon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:45:41pm

I am not going to say what is actually on my mind regarding these unspeakable bastards. This forum is not the venue for it.

19 HappyWarrior  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:46:29pm

re: #16 Dreggas

Wasn't it not too long ago where a woman had to carry a child to term that died as soon as it was born due to a similar bill in the Dakotas? I recall one of the bills sponsors saying the bill worked as intended and it was gods will.

I dop't know. Hadn't heard that. Nothing would shock me. God I can remember when the Republicans were by and large willing to make exceptions for rape and incest. Seems ever since people like Palin became standard bearers for the party that even that is not reasonable. I challenge anyone to tell a woman who was raped that she must carry the rapist's child. I can imagine that being a very traumatic and stressful experience for the woman.

20 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:47:27pm

Fifteen years ago. I was at work, speaking to a woman who was a non-attending member of my faith. She'd had a really, really rough year. Her husband had killee himself. She had met someone online, but then been raped by that person. She was pregnant.

Her decision was to carry the child to term and give it up for adoption. Her decision.

As she was talking to me, she was waffling about keeping the baby, because, you see, she was 37, not likely to marry again, and frankly, this might be her only child. The way she put it was, "What if Heavenly Father sent me this baby?"

I can't remember what non-committal, I'm listening to you thing I said, but I was thinking, "No, no, no. He would never send you a rape. Never. God doesn't work like that."

At that moment, though, I was just trying to be kind to a woman who'd been through a lot. I had my own baby and left that job before I found out what she did.

21 Bubblehead II  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:48:52pm

The urge to move 50 miles South is getting stronger all the time. It's getting to be too much of an embarrassment to admit that I actually live in this State.

22 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:49:46pm

re: #18 celticdragon

I am not going to say what is actually on my mind regarding these unspeakable bastards. This forum is not the venue for it.

Yeaaaaaah...I'm pretty torn between crying, yelling obscenities, and just totally losing it with rage. Deep breaths. Deep breaths...

What kind of heartless bastard can say that sort of thing? It somehow makes the average anti-abortion activist seem thoughtful and civilized.

23 EdDantes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:49:52pm

Never invoke the "Almighty" into a political argument until you have first hand knowledge. Then, don't.

24 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:50:14pm

Tell god to keep his almighty hands off our women.

25 Varek Raith  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:50:44pm

Image: 803205-holy_facepalm_super.jpg

26 FreedomMoon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:51:09pm

I'm sure this "god-fearing" Brent Crane would be singing a much different tune if his own daughter was violently raped. I of course would never wish that on anybody, but these people live in bubbles and are completely naive to reality. On one hand it's a good thing to not have experienced such a tragedy (in a small town in Idaho) but on the other millions have to pay a hefty price for these out of touch, close minded ass-wipes' ignorance. And that in and of itself is just another tragedy.

27 The Mountain That Blogs  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:52:53pm

re: #25 Varek Raith

Can't bare to look? Failposterfail

28 Varek Raith  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:53:31pm

re: #27 The Mountain That Blogs

Can't bare to look? Failposterfail

:P
Don't blame me.

29 Shiplord Kirel  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:53:39pm

The hand of the Almighty should smite McMillan and Crane right back to the 8th century where they belong.
Btw, I will go back to church and start praying, and might even consider a tithe, if these two are simultaneously struck by lightning from a clear sky and in widely separated locales.

30 allegro  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:55:49pm

Who says we don't live in a rape culture? In South Dakota rapists are now elevated to the status of angels of the lord.

This is too sick to even be for real.

31 Kragar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:55:58pm

By this logic, wouldn't all criminals technically be innocent of the act because they were acting in accordance with God's will?

"God wanted you to be pregnant, so he had those guys break into your house and gang rape you. They're blameless in all this."

32 celticdragon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:56:06pm

re: #26 tacuba14

I'm sure this "god-fearing" Brent Crane would be singing a much different tune if his own daughter was violently raped. I of course would never wish that on anybody, but these people live in bubbles and are completely naive to reality. On one hand it's a good thing to not have experienced such a tragedy (in a small town in Idaho) but on the other millions have to pay a hefty price for these out of touch, close minded ass-wipes' ignorance. And that in and of itself is just another tragedy.

You can't be sure at this point. The totalitarian strain of Puritan and Calvanist Christianity is utterly pitiless in this regard, and I can easily see this self styled Inquisitor forcing his teen-aged daughter to bear the child of a rape.

I remember Christian radio shows from 25 years ago that talked about how a rape could be turned into a venue to glory God by being obedient to His will and having the baby.

I thought it was pretty fucked up then as well.

33 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:56:10pm

Actually, I'm more concerned about women carrying fatally flawed babies than women who were raped. I would bet women who were raped know right away if they want an abortion. I'm not saying they should lose that right, I'm saying I wouldn't think they wouldn't spend 4 1/2 months thinking about it. And they shouldn't have to pay for it, either. Like I said, I'm not for taking away that right, I just think that not that many women would wait that long.

I'm worried about the woman who, like my friend, go in for their 22 week ultrasound and find that the baby has no kidneys. The baby had no chance of survival. A few weeks later she was induced to give birth, they named the baby and held the little girl until she died.

Why prolong their grief?

34 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:56:14pm

Where the frak is this kind and forgiving God that I grew up hearing so much about? Because he's obviously not the God who's talking to these jackholes. A God who would allow women to be raped, and then carry their rapists child to term, is not a God I could ever have any faith in. If this is his "plan," then I want no part of it.

35 EdDantes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:56:19pm

re: #25 Varek Raith

He's got that, "Oy" look.

36 HappyWarrior  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:57:36pm

People like this are exactly why we need to fight tooth and nail to keep church and state separated. Who the hell knows what they'd do if they ever got rid of that gap.

37 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:57:53pm

BTW, I wouldn't be surprised if the number was set so early to pre-empt those 22 week ultrasounds. They're standard, and they catch a lot of stuff.

38 Fozzie Bear  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:58:10pm

re: #8 LudwigVanQuixote

Yeah this is part of what pisses me off so much. They thump a bible they have not read and profane what is actually in it.

The image of a wrathful God punishing a raped girl (who they no doubt think asked for it) with an unwanted pregnancy is just simply too sick for words.

These people are deranged animals.

Animals would never be so needlessly cruel.

39 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:58:33pm

re: #38 Fozzie Bear

Animals would never be so needlessly cruel.

Chimps are real mean little bastards.

40 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:58:46pm

It just depresses me to no end to see how rampant and mainstream anti-female thoughts remain today. Maybe I've been somewhat isolated, growing up in Massachusetts and going to college in a liberal area, but I just find myself constantly shocked at what I hear out of the mouths of elected representatives in 21st century America. And that's not even counting how they treat the poor, the non-whites, the non-Christians, homosexuals, transgendered/etc., disabled, and I could go on.

41 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:00:17pm

re: #8 LudwigVanQuixote

These people are deranged animals.

QFT.

42 celticdragon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:01:16pm

re: #33 EmmmieG

Actually, I'm more concerned about women carrying fatally flawed babies than women who were raped. I would bet women who were raped know right away if they want an abortion. I'm not saying they should lose that right, I'm saying I wouldn't think they wouldn't spend 4 1/2 months thinking about it. And they shouldn't have to pay for it, either. Like I said, I'm not for taking away that right, I just think that not that many women would wait that long.

I'm worried about the woman who, like my friend, go in for their 22 week ultrasound and find that the baby has no kidneys. The baby had no chance of survival. A few weeks later she was induced to give birth, they named the baby and held the little girl until she died.

Why prolong their grief?

That is another sore point for me. Rod Dreher wrote about how wonderful it was that a couple had a baby girl they knew would live only an hour at most after birth from a horrible fatal defect. They said they treasured the time they had with her and then gave her back to God.

Uh huh.

The gist of it was that the rest of us selfish assholes needed to get on board and let all of those terminal children suffer in agonizing pain (or be doped to the point of senselessness) so that we could all have an epiphany and then give them back to God.

I thought it was one of the sickest damned things I had ever read, and I cannot believe that these people would actually force this upon parents who are already grieving over the knowledge that their baby will not live.

It is fucking sickening.

43 FreedomMoon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:01:17pm

I think the real sin here is the speaking in God's name, and the presumption that if someone is raped, it was because of the "Almighty Hand" as if God somehow smiles with approval every time some poor little girl gets raped and knocked up. Ugh, not only is that blasphemy, it's flat-out sickening to the stomach.

44 Fozzie Bear  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:02:23pm

I'm sure rapists the world over will be happy to know that they are enacting God's will. Why don't we just redefine the word "rapist" to the word "angel".

In other news, I'm going to go gun down some strangers. Why the hell not? No matter what happens, it's God's will! It's refreshing to be relieved of the need for a conscience by scripture.

Oh, and fuck their evil God and his perpetual infantile rage. I'd rather burn in hell for eternity than be in the good graces of that kind of God.

45 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:03:09pm

re: #40 Simply Sarah

I think it's two things, mainly.

1. A lot of guys are scared of women. They desire them, and this makes them scary, so they come up with ways to try to belittle them. The interpret their religion in a way that puts them above women, they make jokes about the emotionality of women (while being butthurt monkeys themselves), etc. etc. A lot of the myths of female behavior come from this. Women reject you a lot? They must not like sex as much as men! Women think your jokes are stupid? Women are overly sensitive!

2. A lot of people, baboon-like, want to gain social status by forcing lower social status on others. Whether it's women, blacks, gays, or what have you, anyone they can come up with a systemic reason to demean means that their social rank is one higher. This is the "Mississippi Burning" explanation.

Youtube Video
46 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:03:37pm

County Clerk finds 7,000 Prosser votes in WI Supreme Court election...

[Link: www.jsonline.com...]

Well, wasn't that a fortunate find? The hand of the almighty at work, I'm sure.

47 jaunte  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:03:59pm

re: #43 tacuba14

McMillan and Crane are diminishing their humanity to service a fetus fetish.

48 HappyWarrior  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:04:54pm

re: #46 darthstar

County Clerk finds 7,000 Prosser votes in WI Supreme Court election...

[Link: www.jsonline.com...]

Well, wasn't that a fortunate find? The hand of the almighty at work, I'm sure.

Just like Obama's election was "proof" of the end times. So, my question to your story is this, is FoxNation still going to be hammering on about voter fraud or is voter fraud only an issue for sore loser liberals now that Prosser seems to have this.

49 JAFO  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:05:29pm

Somebody ought to tell God to keep his dick in his pants.

50 dragonfire1981  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:05:31pm

Victimized by the GOP for life...

- Woman gets raped, law says she can't have an abortion, gives birth to baby

- Sorry, Republicans have cut funding to social programs, mother cannot afford to feed baby or give it medical care.

- Mother gets stuck in halfway house or living in an alley, selling her body to make ends meet because there are no jobs available that will pay her a decent wage

- Mother contracts a treatable STD but later dies in a hospital ER because she could not afford or get access to adequate medical care.

- Child goes "into the system", bounces from foster home to foster home.

- Child graduates high school and wants to go to college, child cannot afford college since all government grants have been eliminated

- Child takes a menial job at just above minimum wage, ends up stuck in similar jobs for years.

- Child develops an illness due to air pollution brought about by removal of clean air laws and is in and out of ERs.

- Child loses his job and cannot get private insurance because of his pre-existing condition

- GOP politician anxious to get elected holds child up as "an example of someone the Liberal system of government has failed."

Pretty scary, isn't it?

51 Fozzie Bear  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:06:02pm

re: #45 Obdicut

That's all totally great and all, but women who don't want to have sex with me immediately are clearly lesbians. Did you never read the dude manual? /

52 simoom  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:07:17pm

re: #46 darthstar

I'm listening to the live press conference. The County Clerk is saying she maybe didn't enable a macro on her Excel spreadsheet on her computer or and perhaps didn't click save at the right time. There's a local county democrat there too who says she looked over the new numbers and supports them.

See also:
[Link: www.jsonline.com...]

53 celticdragon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:07:57pm

re: #50 dragonfire1981

Victimized by the GOP for life...

- Woman gets raped, law says she can't have an abortion, gives birth to baby

- Sorry, Republicans have cut funding to social programs, mother cannot afford to feed baby or give it medical care.

- Mother gets stuck in halfway house or living in an alley, selling her body to make ends meet because there are no jobs available that will pay her a decent wage

- Mother contracts a treatable STD but later dies in a hospital ER because she could not afford or get access to adequate medical care.

- Child goes "into the system", bounces from foster home to foster home.

- Child graduates high school and wants to go to college, child cannot afford college since all government grants have been eliminated

- Child takes a menial job at just above minimum wage, ends up stuck in similar jobs for years.

- Child develops an illness due to air pollution brought about by removal of clean air laws and is in and out of ERs.

- Child loses his job and cannot get private insurance because of his pre-existing condition

- GOP politician anxious to get elected holds child up as "an example of someone the Liberal system of government has failed."

Pretty scary, isn't it?

I think the modern GOP would view all of those as features and not bugs in the system. It's all God's Will and the free market (which increasingly are being interpreted as the same thing), so what's the problem?
/(do I have to?)

54 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:09:24pm

re: #45 Obdicut

I think it's two things, mainly.

1. A lot of guys are scared of women. They desire them, and this makes them scary, so they come up with ways to try to belittle them. The interpret their religion in a way that puts them above women, they make jokes about the emotionality of women (while being butthurt monkeys themselves), etc. etc. A lot of the myths of female behavior come from this. Women reject you a lot? They must not like sex as much as men! Women think your jokes are stupid? Women are overly sensitive!

2. A lot of people, baboon-like, want to gain social status by forcing lower social status on others. Whether it's women, blacks, gays, or what have you, anyone they can come up with a systemic reason to demean means that their social rank is one higher. This is the "Mississippi Burning" explanation.

[Video]

On 1. If men keep treating women in this way, they had damn well better be afraid of them.

55 Bob Dillon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:09:53pm

re: #46 darthstar

Well, wasn't that a fortunate find? The hand of the almighty at work, I'm sure.

Naw ... simply those entrusted with the task - D or R - don't know how to count. Its a basic problem shared by most of them.

56 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:09:56pm
“Is not the child of that rape or incest also a victim?” asked Rep. Shannon McMillan, R-Silverton. “It didn’t ask to be here. It was here under violent circumstances perhaps, but that was through no fault of its own.”[…]

Don't blame the chestburster. It didn't ask to be here. Blame the human for taunting the facehugger.

57 allegro  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:10:49pm

re: #54 Simply Sarah

On 1. If men keep treating women in this way, they had damn well better be afraid of them.

If only I had more than one upding to give...

Women of South Dakota need to get bus tickets outa there or at least go all Lysistrata on their men's asses.

58 Bubblehead II  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:11:58pm

On the bright side, The Idaho Attorney General thinks this law is Unconstitutional.

"Two legal opinions from the Idaho attorney general said the bill is unconstitutional because it violates the Roe v. Wade decision regarding state restrictions on abortions prior to the point of fetal viability."

Hopefully Gov. Otter will veto it, perhaps out of simple decency or fiscal responsibility.

"Idaho spent nearly three-quarters of a million dollars defending unconstitutional anti-abortion state legislation passed in the 1990s, including $380,000 in attorney fees the state was ordered to pay in 2007 to Planned Parenthood of Idaho after that group challenged unconstitutional provisions in a 2005 abortion parental consent law."

59 CSKapper  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:12:10pm

Didn't you know, God not only condones rape, he orders it? Read Numbers 31 where 32,000 young virgins were listed amongst the spoils of war for the Israelite soldiers to do with as they wished...

60 FreedomMoon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:12:43pm

re: #50 dragonfire1981

The Grand ol' Party sure is an exclusive bunchre: #53 celticdragon

I think the modern GOP would view all of those as features and not bugs in the system. It's all God's Will and the free market (which increasingly are being interpreted as the same thing), so what's the problem?
/(do I have to?)

God's will (GOP/Tea Party) seams to mimic and hearken back more and more to the feudal, master-slave periods. If you're born a slave or poor, that's just the way God intended, that's where you gotta stay; God's will is indisputable.

61 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:13:19pm

re: #58 Bubblehead II

On the bright side, The Idaho Attorney General thinks this law is Unconstitutional.

"Two legal opinions from the Idaho attorney general said the bill is unconstitutional because it violates the Roe v. Wade decision regarding state restrictions on abortions prior to the point of fetal viability."

Hopefully Gov. Otter will veto it, perhaps out of simple decency or fiscal responsibility.

"Idaho spent nearly three-quarters of a million dollars defending unconstitutional anti-abortion state legislation passed in the 1990s, including $380,000 in attorney fees the state was ordered to pay in 2007 to Planned Parenthood of Idaho after that group challenged unconstitutional provisions in a 2005 abortion parental consent law."

Oh, I'm sure they're counting on it being challenged in court. This is all part of the plan to get Roe v. Wade overturned or, at least, continue the slow deconstruction of it.

62 allegro  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:13:24pm

re: #58 Bubblehead II

Hopefully Gov. Otter will veto it, perhaps out of simple decency or fiscal responsibility.

"Idaho spent nearly three-quarters of a million dollars defending unconstitutional anti-abortion state legislation passed in the 1990s, including $380,000 in attorney fees the state was ordered to pay in 2007 to Planned Parenthood of Idaho after that group challenged unconstitutional provisions in a 2005 abortion parental consent law."

There ya go, put it in terms they understand - the almighty fucking dollar.

63 Renaissance_Man  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:15:40pm

re: #46 darthstar

County Clerk finds 7,000 Prosser votes in WI Supreme Court election...

[Link: www.jsonline.com...]

Well, wasn't that a fortunate find? The hand of the almighty at work, I'm sure.

I thought we were told just yesterday that no recount had ever overturned an election in favour of a Republican?

64 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:16:30pm

re: #60 tacuba14

The Grand ol' Party sure is an exclusive bunchre: #53 celticdragon

God's will (GOP/Tea Party) seams to mimic and hearken back more and more to the feudal, master-slave periods. If you're born a slave or poor women or poor then you're a slave, that's just the way God intended, that's where you gotta stay; God's will is indisputable.

FTFY

65 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:16:35pm

re: #38 Fozzie Bear

Animals would never be so needlessly cruel.

No, they just have larvae that eat out their hosts' brain and then drive the body like a cheap car. lol.

66 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:17:40pm

re: #63 Renaissance_Man

I thought we were told just yesterday that no recount had ever overturned an election in favour of a Republican?

As we see... elections have consequences.

67 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:18:52pm

re: #63 Renaissance_Man

I thought we were told just yesterday that no recount had ever overturned an election in favour of a Republican?

This isn't a recount, it's finalizing the initial vote. That totally doesn't count!
/(only on the second half)

68 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:21:06pm

re: #63 Renaissance_Man

I thought we were told just yesterday that no recount had ever overturned an election in favour of a Republican?

There hasn't been a recount. They're still working on getting the official count. A recount has to be requested by a candidate.

69 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:21:40pm

re: #67 Simply Sarah

Doh! Should have refreshed first.

70 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:23:08pm

re: #69 RogueOne

Doh! Should have refreshed first.

Heh. It happens.

71 Kragar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:24:54pm

Openly gay soldiers to begin serving in summer: Pentagon; GOP critic compares DADT repeal to Alamo


testifying alongside the chiefs of the Navy, Army and Air Forces Thursday, Amos told the House Armed Services Committee that training of the rank and file was going smoothly.

"There hasn't been the recalcitrant pushback," Amos said.

"Young Marines," he said, "quite honestly, they're focused on the enemy."

Army Gen. Norton Schwartz said he was "more comfortable than I was" last year about the new policy.

Navy Admiral Gary Roughead said the change would not be that dramatic.

"Repeal will not change who we are or what we do," he said. "The same regulations and standards of conduct will apply."

President Obama repealed the ban in December's lame-duck congressional session while the newly-elected Republican majority could only watch fuming from the sidelines.

Thursday's hearing was an attempt to revisit the issue and slam on the brakes if possible.

"These are people that had actually been rejected by the voters," Rep Joe Wilson (R-S.C.) said of the Democrats who passed the repeal. "It's amazing that they could have made such a decision."

Freshman Rep. Steven Palazzo (R-Miss.) said he felt like he was arriving after the massacre at the Alamo and being unable to help the victims.

Palazzo said he worried that people enlisted in what "they thought was a good military, a correct military, and this Congress comes and tinkers with it."

"I just apologize to our veterans," he said. "I have yet to find anybody that is in support of repealing Don't Ask Don't Tell."

72 HappyWarrior  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:26:48pm

re: #71 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Openly gay soldiers to begin serving in summer: Pentagon; GOP critic compares DADT repeal to Alamo

Fucking assholes. I am sorry but this guy Palazzo has some goddmaned nerve of suing hte name of the troops to justify his bigotry against gay and lesbian Americans who want to serve their country.

73 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:27:49pm

re: #71 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Openly gay soldiers to begin serving in summer: Pentagon; GOP critic compares DADT repeal to Alamo

Well, it's hard to find someone in support of it if you refuse to look. Taking his head out of his rear might also aid in his search.

74 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:29:11pm

re: #68 RogueOne

There hasn't been a recount. They're still working on getting the official count. A recount has to be requested by a candidate.

This may be a non-story. CNN has nothing about it on it's front page. MSNBC has nothing about it on their front page. ABC News has nothing about it on their front page.

I think it's a phony story. If it's not covered, it didn't happen.

75 nines09  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:29:42pm

Will of God. Covers everything. I'm off to the bank.
/

76 allegro  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:32:43pm

Well this is interesting... from August 2010:

Waukesha — Waukesha County Clerk Kathy Nickolaus' decision to go it alone in how she collects and maintains election results has some county officials raising a red flag about the integrity of the system.

Nickolaus said she decided to take the election data collection and storage system off the county's computer network - and keep it on stand-alone personal computers accessible only in her office - for security reasons.

77 Varek Raith  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:34:44pm

re: #75 nines09

Will of God. Covers everything. I'm off to the bank.
/

Don't bother. I already tried.
Didn't work.
Posing from a cell phone in I-95 going 100mph.
Damn cops.
/

78 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:35:31pm

Libyan rebels near Ajdabiya 'killed in Nato air strike'

Rebels said five died, while doctors in Ajdabiya told the BBC at least 13 rebel fighters had been killed in the strike.

Since NATO has taken over, Gaddafi has nothing to worry about... NATO should be able to wrap things up for him in about a week.

[Link: www.bbc.co.uk...]

79 Bubblehead II  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:35:39pm

re: #61 Simply Sarah

re: #62 allegro

Which is why they put in a provision for a Legal defense Fund. They know that if the Governor does sign it into Law, it will be challenged and the Attorney Generals office will most likely decline to defend it due to the certainty of it being declared unconstitutional.

Unfortunately, Bryan Fischer (another Idaho caveman) and the AFA will probably give generously to the fund. :-(

80 Fozzie Bear  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:36:14pm

re: #65 prononymous

No, they just have larvae that eat out their hosts' brain and then drive the body like a cheap car. lol.

Yeah but they totally needed to do that! (ok that's weak, I admit)

81 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:36:17pm

If men could get pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament...

82 Varek Raith  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:37:30pm

re: #78 Walter L. Newton

Libyan rebels near Ajdabiya 'killed in Nato air strike'

Since NATO has taken over, Gaddafi has nothing to worry about... NATO should be able to wrap things up for him in about a week.

[Link: www.bbc.co.uk...]

The rebels shot down one of their own jets a few weeks ago.
No surprise they got hit by Nato. They aren't exactly the soldier types.

83 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:42:40pm

superstitious animals

84 CuriousLurker  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:42:56pm

This is "The Hand of the Almighty" at work??

She was raped and beaten almost to death. When found about four hours later, she was suffering from severe hypothermia and blood loss from multiple lacerations and internal bleeding, and her skull had been fractured so badly that her left eye was removed from the socket. The initial medical prognosis was that she would die or, at best, remain in a permanent coma due to her injuries. Remarkably, she largely recovered, with some lingering disabilities related to balance and loss of vision. As a result of the severe trauma, she had no memory of the attack or of any events up to an hour preceding the assault.

Central Park Jogger case

How about the asshats making these laws go read these stories—close to 50 of them involving rape & murder in Texas. And these are just the the cases where the offenders have been executed. We could start with the first one on the list:

On 27 March 1995, Johnson, then 37, offered to give Leah Smith, a crack addict, some of his crack cocaine in exchange for sex. According to Johnson, after Smith smoked the crack, she refused to have sex with him. He then became angry, grabbed her, ripped her clothes off, and threw her to the ground. When she fought back with a wooden board, Johnson struck her head against a concrete curb until she stopped fighting, then he raped her. Johnson then stomped on Smith's face five or six times. He then left, but after realizing he had left his wallet at the scene, he returned and raped Smith again. He then picked up his wallet and her boots and left Smith on the ground to die.

The victim sustained severe injuries to her mouth, face, head, and neck. Her teeth were knocked out, her tongue was displaced, both sides of her jawbone were fractured, and she sustained head injuries. The medical examiner testified that the victim died from swallowing her own blood as it accumulated in the back of her throat while she was lying face up.

After his arrest, Johnson confessed to raping and murdering Smith. He said that he killed her because she made him angry while he was raping her by threatening to file rape charges against him.

Johnson also confessed to numerous other rapes and murders. He confessed to raping a total of 13 other women, including his 8-year-old niece. Many of these rapes included brutal beatings or chokings, and at least two of them resulted in the victim's death. Johnson gave detailed confessions about these murders and directed police to the scenes where they occurred. Johnson also confessed to a third murder, but authorities concluded that Johnson must have been mistaken in that case, wrongly believing that an injured victim died. Some of Johnson's surviving victims testified against him at his punishment hearing.

This? THIS is what you call "The Hand of the Almighty" at work you sick POS? Oh, right, she was just a crack whore, so she must've deserved to have her face bashed in and choke to death on her own blood, right? This was a human being, yet if a dog ran into the street and got hit by a car, I'd be willing to wager that you'd probably be more inclined to cry over the dog. After all, life is pretty much worthless to you once it's out of the womb, especially if it's female, so the little 8-year-old girl he raped probably doesn't count for shit either, does it?

I can't even spit at this. It's beyond....I don't know what it's beyond, I don't even have words for it.

85 JeffM70  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:44:51pm

What the fuck is wrong with these people?

86 Bubblehead II  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:45:38pm

Crap. Just Googled the Governors stand on abortion.

The Women of Idaho are indeed screwed. As well as the Tax Payers.

87 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:47:07pm

re: #83 WindUpBird

superstitious animals

Did you get that thing I sent you?

88 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:48:19pm

re: #30 allegro

Who says we don't live in a rape culture? In South Dakota rapists are now elevated to the status of angels of the lord.

This is too sick to even be for real.

It's legal to rape there I guess. Should the church require rape from its leaders?

89 Varek Raith  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:48:23pm

re: #87 Obdicut

Did you get that thing I sent you?

Mopey, mopey hippo!

90 allegro  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:49:58pm

re: #88 b_sharp

It's legal to rape there I guess. Should the church require rape from its leaders?

Not only legal but fucking holy. Do these asswipes even think about what they're saying? Or are they just too depraved to recognize the implications?

91 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:50:00pm

re: #39 LudwigVanQuixote

Chimps are real mean little bastards.

Yes, yes we are.

92 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:51:38pm

re: #90 allegro

Not only legal but fucking holy. Do these asswipes even think about what they're saying? Or are they just too depraved to recognize the implications?

False dichotomy. ;)

93 Fozzie Bear  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:52:25pm

re: #76 allegro

Well this is interesting... from August 2010:

Oh snap. I smell an impending court battle. That's not the kind of thing that inspires confidence in the accuracy of the election process.

94 allegro  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:55:38pm

re: #93 Fozzie Bear

Oh snap. I smell an impending court battle. That's not the kind of thing that inspires confidence in the accuracy of the election process.

It certainly does legitimize questions of the integrity of the system.

95 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:56:26pm

re: #76 allegro

Well this is interesting... from August 2010:

I would not shed a tear in the least if those extra 7,000 votes she found for Prosser ended up not being allowed to count.

I mean election results kept on one persons personal laptop? That's the kind of thing that you'd expect to see us hire out UN people to PREVENT from happening in a third world banana republic!

96 Varek Raith  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:57:24pm

re: #95 jamesfirecat

I would not shed a tear in the least if those extra 7,000 votes she found for Prosser ended up not being allowed to count.

I mean election results kept on one persons personal laptop? That's the kind of thing that you'd expect to see us hire out UN people to PREVENT from happening in a third world banana republic!

HEY LOOKIT ACORN!

97 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 4:58:33pm

re: #78 Walter L. Newton

Libyan rebels near Ajdabiya 'killed in Nato air strike'

Since NATO has taken over, Gaddafi has nothing to worry about... NATO should be able to wrap things up for him in about a week.

[Link: www.bbc.co.uk...]

Of course the US never does anything like that.

98 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:00:09pm

re: #87 Obdicut

Did you get that thing I sent you?

You're sending people things now? I didn't get any thing.

99 reine.de.tout  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:03:06pm

re: #98 b_sharp

You're sending people things now? I didn't get any thing.

I didn't either, and I've been wanting a thing for a looong time!

100 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:03:29pm

re: #54 Simply Sarah

On 1. If men keep treating women in this way, they had damn well better be afraid of them.

I do ask myself why women put up with the behavior of this sort of man-as in actually marry them and stuff. What is wrong with us?

101 simoom  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:04:00pm

60 Plus Association, which bills itself as "the conservatives' alternative to the AARP" flips on Medicare cuts. Here's one of their Anti-Healthcare Reform ads:

Youtube Video

And here they are on Rep. Paul Ryan's budget:
[Link: 60plus.org...]

Ryan Budget Saves Entitlements
60 Plus Association Chairman Jim Martin’s statement

“A breath of reality—not rhetoric—is how I describe Congressman Paul Ryan’s budget blueprint to slash $6.2 trillion in deficit spending over the next ten years, reform entitlements to keep them solvent, and put our nation on a path to balanced budgets.

“This is what the people have been waiting for, true leadership to deliver on the promises that swept Republicans to historic gains last November. We have no time to spare before the disastrous realities of Washington’s massive deficit spending come to bear. To quote Ronald Reagan – ‘the time is now.’

“Democrats attacked Congressman Ryan’s brave proposals in 2010, and made a huge push in the media to turn public sentiment back to their favor. The word ‘draconian’ comes to mind. It was overused by Democrats who tried to demonize spending cuts and to scare seniors as they do every reelection cycle. It no longer works. The result is they suffered a historic defeat, demonstrating that Americans prefer to cut spending and put our nation on a path to economic growth and balanced budgets.

“The time for empty rhetoric is over. It’s time for leadership to address the serious problems our nation faces. We cannot wish our problems away, we must take action. Everyone, except the President and liberals in Congress, understand that America cannot endure on this current path. Further delay only makes the inevitable pain much more severe, which is why we urge every American to support the priorities Congressman Ryan has so thoughtfully articulated.”

(h/t) Greg Sargent

102 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:05:25pm

Why is God's will expressed by rape and not theft? Yes, we need to punish the thief, but you don't get your stuff back because it's God's will? Haven't seen that lately.
Do these folks get treatment for their cancer? I thought illness was God's will as well.

103 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:06:27pm

re: #99 reine.de.tout

I didn't either, and I've been wanting a thing for a looong time!

Same here. I once asked Santa for a thing, but never got it. I've been damaged goods ever since.

104 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:07:56pm

re: #101 simoom

60 Plus Association, which bills itself as "the conservatives' alternative to the AARP" flips on Medicare cuts. Here's one of their Anti-Healthcare Reform ads:

[Video]And here they are on Rep. Paul Ryan's budget:
[Link: 60plus.org...]

(h/t) Greg Sargent

It's really the alternative to the AARP for people that don't actually care about the elderly.

105 CuriousLurker  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:08:05pm

When boys or men are raped by men is that also the Hand of the Almighty at work, or is it only when women & little girls are raped?

Just wondering... //

106 Joanne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:08:10pm

re: #58 Bubblehead II

I was about to write that; how does this pass separation of church and state? Not that that seems to matter anymore. We don't need to worry about Sharia, we need to worry about these American Taliban. The GOP disgusts me.

107 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:08:15pm

re: #100 calochortus

I do ask myself why women put up with the behavior of this sort of man-as in actually marry them and stuff. What is wrong with us?

Men like that fit a perceived need. Get rid of that perception and women will marry men who are good for them.

108 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:09:21pm

re: #102 calochortus

Why is God's will expressed by rape and not theft? Yes, we need to punish the thief, but you don't get your stuff back because it's God's will? Haven't seen that lately.
Do these folks get treatment for their cancer? I thought illness was God's will as well.

Cherry picking God's will. I wonder if he's OK with that?

109 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:10:01pm

re: #107 b_sharp

Men like that fit a perceived need. Get rid of that perception and women will marry men who are good for them.

I must lack imagination. What possible need could an intelligent woman have that... Oh. Never mind.

110 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:10:23pm

re: #100 calochortus

I do ask myself why women put up with the behavior of this sort of man-as in actually marry them and stuff. What is wrong with us?

I wish I knew the answer. It perplexes me in the same way as seeing women that support this kind of thin. There are plenty of men and women I could pick from that actually, uh, care about women.

111 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:10:41pm

re: #105 CuriousLurker

When boys or men are raped by men is that also the Hand of the Almighty at work, or is it only when women & little girls are raped?

Just wondering... //

That's just practice for the real event, making unwanted babies.

112 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:10:54pm

re: #105 CuriousLurker

When boys or men are raped by men is that also the Hand of the Almighty at work, or is it only when women & little girls are raped?

Just wondering... //

To be fair to these idiots, I don't think they're endorsing the rape per se, just the resulting pregnancy.

113 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:11:12pm

re: #101 simoom

60 Plus Association, which bills itself as "the conservatives' alternative to the AARP" flips on Medicare cuts. Here's one of their Anti-Healthcare Reform ads:

[Video]And here they are on Rep. Paul Ryan's budget:
[Link: 60plus.org...]

(h/t) Greg Sargent

Anything that bills itself as "The conservative alternative to X" Is all but automatically worthy of derision.

114 engineer cat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:13:47pm

60 Plus Association, which bills itself as "the conservatives' alternative to the AARP"

can there be any clearer demonstration of how out of touch the wingnuts are with the mainstream of american opinion?

i mean aside from the condemnation of disneyland for its positive recognition of its many gay employees... and of course now we know that chrysler and general motors have been taken over by socialists...

115 celticdragon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:13:48pm

re: #76 allegro

Well this is interesting... from August 2010:

Yeah, I read about that as well. Something seems real rotten in Denmark with this.

116 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:13:50pm

re: #110 Simply Sarah

I wish I knew the answer. It perplexes me in the same way as seeing women that support this kind of thin. There are plenty of men and women I could pick from that actually, uh, care about women.

My husband wonders why men pick some of the women they do.

The sad thing is when something like this comes up and I ask any male friend or relative (including those I'm related to by marriage) why men do thus and such, they look at me blankly and have no explanation. But I guess I'm better off not knowing people who understand those sorts of things.

117 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:14:20pm

re: #113 jamesfirecat

Anything that bills itself as "The conservative alternative to X" Is all but automatically worthy of derision.

Especially when it seems to be implying that looking out for those over 50 is a specifically liberal cause.

118 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:14:43pm
The Idaho bill’s House sponsor, state Rep. Brent Crane, R-Nampa, told legislators that the “hand of the Almighty” was at work. “His ways are higher than our ways,” Crane said. “He has the ability to take difficult, tragic, horrific circumstances and then turn them into wonderful examples.”

re: #71 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Openly gay soldiers to begin serving in summer: Pentagon; GOP critic compares DADT repeal to Alamo

Is it OK to say that I hate Teabagger Conservatives with the force of 1000 burning suns and want to slap them upside the head with my hand bag without being called shrill?

119 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:16:02pm

IMO, the story of Sodom and Gomorrah wasn't about homosexuality. It was about the (attempted) rape of angels. Maybe Rep. Crane and Rep. McMillan should stop and suck on that pearl for a bit.

120 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:16:14pm

re: #118 webevintage

Of course you can-just keep your voice at a low pitch.

121 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:16:15pm

re: #116 calochortus

My husband wonders why men pick some of the women they do.

The sad thing is when something like this comes up and I ask any male friend or relative (including those I'm related to by marriage) why men do thus and such, they look at me blankly and have no explanation. But I guess I'm better off not knowing people who understand those sorts of things.

Well, even from my own limited personal experience, I can say that romantic (Or what people think are romantic) relationships can result from and cause all sorts of insanity that makes no sense.

122 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:16:42pm

re: #112 calochortus

To be fair to these idiots, I don't think they're endorsing the rape per se, just the resulting pregnancy.

If the pregnancy is god's will then the cause of the pregnancy is god's will.

We don't have virginal conceptions any more.

123 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:17:34pm

re: #122 b_sharp

If the pregnancy is god's will then the cause of the pregnancy is god's will.

We don't have virginal conceptions any more.

We've never had virginal conceptions.

124 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:17:41pm

re: #97 b_sharp

Of course the US never does anything like that.

My Grandfather used to say about WW2 -

British planes come over and the Germans duck.
German planes come over and the British duck.

American planes come over and everyone ducks/

125 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:17:44pm

re: #115 celticdragon

Yeah, I read about that as well. Something seems real rotten in Denmark with this.

Waukesha is in Denmark?

126 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:17:51pm

re: #122 b_sharp

If the pregnancy is god's will then the cause of the pregnancy is god's will.

We don't have virginal conceptions any more.

How do we know that?//

127 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:18:31pm

re: #105 CuriousLurker

When boys or men are raped by men is that also the Hand of the Almighty at work, or is it only when women & little girls are raped?

Just wondering... //

I think the Vatican's accountants and lawyers are working those equations out/

128 CuriousLurker  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:18:58pm

re: #112 calochortus

To be fair to these idiots, I don't think they're endorsing the rape per se, just the resulting pregnancy.

They may not be endorsing the rape itself, but they're endorsing forcing women & girls to live with the results. I'll guaran-damn-tee you if men & boys could get pregnant then abortion would be a sacrament, as jamesfirecat said.

129 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:20:09pm

re: #121 Simply Sarah

Well, even from my own limited personal experience, I can say that romantic (Or what people think are romantic) relationships can result from and cause all sorts of insanity that makes no sense.

Well, yeah, but how do you allow a relationship to develop when you don't actually like the other person involved? I realize that men who really hate women but want to reproduce still have to try to get close enough to a woman to do that, but once again, why aren't women more selective?

130 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:20:13pm

re: #124 wozzablog

My Grandfather used to say about WW2 -

British planes come over and the Germans duck.
German planes come over and the British duck.

American planes come over and everyone ducks/

That really quacks me up.

131 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:20:43pm

re: #125 b_sharp

Hi hi.

Enjoying the election so far?

132 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:20:45pm

re: #126 calochortus

How do we know that?//

I've been peeking.

133 engineer cat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:20:45pm

re: #115 celticdragon

Yeah, I read about that as well. Something seems real rotten in Denmark with this.

it's just "the conservative alternative" to publicly accountable election tabulation

134 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:20:55pm

re: #128 CuriousLurker

They may not be endorsing the rape itself, but they're endorsing forcing women & girls to live with the results. I'll guaran-damn-tee you if men & boys could get pregnant then abortion would be a sacrament, as jamesfirecat said.

I'm sure a rapist that for some reason decided to use protection would be an even greater criminal to them than one that got the victim pregnant.

135 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:21:29pm

re: #128 CuriousLurker

They may not be endorsing the rape itself, but they're endorsing forcing women & girls to live with the results. I'll guaran-damn-tee you if men & boys could get pregnant then abortion would be a sacrament, as jamesfirecat said.

Agreed absolutely, I'm not supporting them in any way, but I don't think we need to even slightly stretch their utterances to make them cringe-worthy.

136 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:21:47pm

re: #133 engineer dog

it's just "the conservative alternative" to publicly accountable election tabulation

i thought that was Diebold...........

137 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:22:15pm

re: #129 calochortus

Well, yeah, but how do you allow a relationship to develop when you don't actually like the other person involved? I realize that men who really hate women but want to reproduce still have to try to get close enough to a woman to do that, but once again, why aren't women more selective?

OK, that's one I really can't answer, since every time I've been in a relationship where I realized things were a bad match, I either left it or did what I could to push it towards ending.

138 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:23:13pm

re: #120 calochortus

Of course you can-just keep your voice at a low pitch.

OK. Is this low enough?

Astronomers using NASA's Chandra X-ray Observatory have found, for the first time, sound waves from a supermassive black hole. The "note" is the deepest ever detected from any object in our Universe.

139 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:23:22pm

re: #137 Simply Sarah

OK, that's one I really can't answer, since every time I've been in a relationship where I realized things were a bad match, I either left it or did what I could to push it towards ending.

Possibly because you are an intelligent person who thinks ahead. :-)

140 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:24:01pm

re: #138 prononymous

I hope so.

141 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:24:41pm

re: #131 Jadespring

Hi hi.

Enjoying the election so far?

I have a large lump on my forehead from all the head-desks I've been doing. Harper booting people out of public meetings and refusing to take more than 4 questions makes him sound like a tyrant.

I'm just glad we don't have our own Fox News.

142 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:25:33pm

re: #139 calochortus

Possibly because you are an intelligent person who thinks ahead. :-)

Well, I try to be. I often find that I act like one less than I should, though. >.>

143 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:25:48pm

re: #138 prononymous

OK. Is this low enough?

Isn't that just totally cool.

144 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:25:53pm

re: #129 calochortus

Well, yeah, but how do you allow a relationship to develop when you don't actually like the other person involved? I realize that men who really hate women but want to reproduce still have to try to get close enough to a woman to do that, but once again, why aren't women more selective?

Financial security, weird co-dependent dynamics, guy offers something socially like status and power....

Those are a few reasons off the top of my head.

145 Sionainn  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:26:49pm

re: #34 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Where the frak is this kind and forgiving God that I grew up hearing so much about? Because he's obviously not the God who's talking to these jackholes. A God who would allow women to be raped, and then carry their rapists child to term, is not a God I could ever have any faith in. If this is his "plan," then I want no part of it.

I spent most of my life not being sure if I believed in a god. What sent me over to the "I absolutely do not believe" side was just exactly this kind of crap over the past four years or so.

146 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:26:56pm

re: #141 b_sharp

I have a large lump on my forehead from all the head-desks I've been doing. Harper booting people out of public meetings and refusing to take more than 4 questions makes him sound like a tyrant.

I'm just glad we don't have our own Fox News.

In the UK we have Sky - which is also newscorp - and credit to their newspeople they stood up to murdoch repeatedly.
They also have far fewer news models and no-one even vaguely approaching the mental density of Brian Kilmeade.

147 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:27:11pm

re: #144 Jadespring

There must be something, but if a man doesn't like women, I wouldn't trust him for that financial security.

148 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:27:39pm

re: #141 b_sharp

I have a large lump on my forehead from all the head-desks I've been doing. Harper booting people out of public meetings and refusing to take more than 4 questions makes him sound like a tyrant.

I'm just glad we don't have our own Fox News.

"You can't come to my rally because you're a Facebook friend with the other guy!"

I thought that whole thing was an Onion type joke when I first heard it.

149 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:28:38pm

re: #138 prononymous

OK. Is this low enough?

That's lower than Phil's bass or Mickey's beam.

150 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:28:40pm

re: #148 Jadespring

"You can't come to my rally because you're a Facebook friend with the other guy!"

I thought that whole thing was an Onion type joke when I first heard it.

Politics through the mindset of a 14 year old girl.

151 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:28:42pm

re: #143 b_sharp

Isn't that just totally cool.

A) What are you playing?
B) "Black Hole".
A) I don't hear anything.
B) That's because you are about to be obliterated by its awesomeness.

152 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:28:43pm

re: #148 Jadespring

"You can't come to my rally because you're a Facebook friend with the other guy!"

I thought that whole thing was an Onion type joke when I first heard it.

Oh it was but nobody told Harper.

153 talking point detective  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:29:22pm

I can understand why some people have questions about the morality of abortions. As long as fetus isn't viable, I don't - but I can understand why some people do.

This, on the other hand, is just flat out fucking insane.

154 Achilles Tang  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:29:39pm

re: #141 b_sharp

I have a large lump on my forehead from all the head-desks I've been doing.

That's not good. It will make you look like a Shiite Muslim, whether you care or not.

155 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:29:47pm

re: #151 prononymous

A) What are you playing?
B) "Black Hole".
A) I don't hear anything.
B) That's because you are about to be obliterated by its awesomeness.

I just want a car stereo speaker that can play the note so I can point it at annoying vehicles on the road and make them disappear.

156 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:30:45pm

re: #141 b_sharp

I have a large lump on my forehead from all the head-desks I've been doing. Harper booting people out of public meetings and refusing to take more than 4 questions makes him sound like a tyrant.

I'm just glad we don't have our own Fox News.

Wow, he'd really have to worry about the elections coming up if he actually had an opposition to be concerned about.
/

157 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:31:21pm

re: #147 calochortus

There must be something, but if a man doesn't like women, I wouldn't trust him for that financial security.

Well sadly with some women if they grew up being treated badly or have only seen bad relationsips then sometimes they just tend to repeat that with their relationships.

Negative attention is still attention and if you don't have good relationships as examples then some don't even realize it shouldn't be that way.

I've know women like this. I expect it happens with men too.

158 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:31:36pm

re: #151 prononymous

A) What are you playing?
B) "Black Hole".
A) I don't hear anything.
B) That's because you are about to be obliterated by its awesomeness.

I want to be spaghetti-ized by a black hole when I die.

159 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:32:11pm

re: #155 darthstar

I just want a car stereo speaker that can play the note so I can point it at annoying vehicles on the road and make them disappear.

Another one of those "all bass" guys huh? ;)

160 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:32:26pm

re: #158 b_sharp

I want to be spaghetti-ized by a black hole when I die.

I'd like it to happen just before I die. Would make an awesome last thought.

161 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:33:10pm

re: #159 prononymous

Another one of those "all bass" guys huh? ;)

Those are exactly the ones I want to point the speaker at when they drive by me on the road.

162 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:33:18pm

re: #160 darthstar

I'd like it to happen just before I die. Would make an awesome last thought.

Yes, that.

163 CuriousLurker  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:33:49pm

re: #135 calochortus

Agreed absolutely, I'm not supporting them in any way, but I don't think we need to even slightly stretch their utterances to make them cringe-worthy.

Well, I guess you could say I'm not feeling like being particularly fair to male politicians who want to spout off about God making things better when they're imposing that belief on others, and when they know they'll never find themselves in that situation.

164 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:34:07pm

Bleh my dog has stinky butt again.

165 celticdragon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:34:29pm

re: #125 b_sharp

Waukesha is in Denmark?

Old Shakespeare quote...Hamlet.
;)

166 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:34:47pm

re: #162 b_sharp

Yes, that.

Seriously, though...if you have to die (and we all have to die) wouldn't it be sweet to experience the most intense entity in the known universe?

167 engineer cat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:35:04pm

re: #164 Jadespring

Bleh my dog has stinky butt again.

"i thought i heard
buddy bolden say
'funky butt, funky butt, take it away'"

168 Wozza Matter?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:35:09pm

G'night all. Workmen starting back up in the morning and a call to the tax office to make.

What a great Friday I have lined up/

You all make sure you have a good one.

169 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:35:13pm

This is kinda funny (probably already mentioned, but I'm beehind)

Rush Limbaugh earlier today: “Does anyone really believe that fraud didn’t happen in Wisconsin?”

170 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:35:35pm

re: #164 Jadespring

Bleh my dog has stinky butt again.

Bathtub and shower head on an extension.

171 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:36:46pm

re: #169 Stanley Sea

This is kinda funny (probably already mentioned, but I'm beehind)

Rush Limbaugh earlier today: “Does anyone really believe that fraud didn’t happen in Wisconsin?”

It's only FRAWD when the TPGOP loses.

172 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:36:58pm

re: #170 b_sharp

Bathtub and shower head on an extension.

It takes an... interesting mind to recommend masturbation at a time like this.

173 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:37:17pm

re: #170 b_sharp

Bathtub and shower head on an extension.

I don't think that will help with the air that's wafting out of it.

174 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:37:34pm

re: #164 Jadespring

Bleh my dog has stinky butt again.

You're kissing the wrong side.

175 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:37:35pm

re: #172 negativ

It takes an... interesting mind to recommend masturbation at a time like this.

LOL

176 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:38:19pm

re: #172 negativ

It takes an... interesting mind to recommend masturbation at a time like this.

My dog's butt still stinks, but god I feel GREAT!!

Funny fuckin' comment, by the way...seriously laughing out loud right now.

177 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:38:51pm

re: #173 Jadespring

I don't think that will help with the air that's wafting out of it.

Plug it.

178 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:39:56pm

re: #173 Jadespring

I don't think that will help with the air that's wafting out of it.

I hate it when my dogs get the farts. It's even worse when it's so bad they fart and then give me a dirty look and go to the other side of the room because it stank so bad. I always say, "Hey, that was you!"

179 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:40:21pm

re: #177 b_sharp

Plug it.

Yeah, that would be a good story for the ER nurses:

So, Jadespring, how exactly did you get a wine cork jammed into your eye?

Well, uh, you see...

180 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:40:52pm

re: #178 darthstar

I hate it when my dogs get the farts. It's even worse when it's so bad they fart and then give me a dirty look and go to the other side of the room because it stank so bad. I always say, "Hey, that was you!"

Always blaming the dog, eh?

181 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:41:09pm

re: #180 b_sharp

Always blaming the dog, eh?

They blame me!

182 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:41:40pm

re: #181 darthstar

They blame me!

Sure, sure.

183 PhillyPretzel  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:42:24pm

re: #173 Jadespring
That sounds like the dog needs a good "airing." Translation: send the dog outside.

184 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:42:45pm

re: #180 b_sharp

Always blaming the dog, eh?

re: #181 darthstar

They blame me!

Okay...to be perfectly honest, I do blame the dogs (or cat if he's closer) quite frequently. My wife, I will say, is a very understanding woman...and she has a good sense of humor...as she also blames me when the dogs fart.

185 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:42:45pm

Fuck these people. I hope their kidneys fail.

186 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:43:52pm

Donald trump looks gawdawful on HD tv...remind me to go back to standard signal next time I have the news on.

187 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:44:17pm

re: #163 CuriousLurker

Well, I guess you could say I'm not feeling like being particularly fair to male politicians who want to spout off about God making things better when they're imposing that belief on others, and when they know they'll never find themselves in that situation.

I'm not going to get all outraged about your doing that or anything, I'm just being nit-picky. :-)

188 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:45:00pm

What a DISGUSTING position the Idaho Republicans have taken.
*spit*

189 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:45:23pm

re: #186 darthstar

Donald trump looks gawdawful on HD tv...remind me to go back to standard signal next time I have the news on.

Okay, even Meredith "Is that your final answer" Viera can't hide her shock at how fucking batshit crazy Trump sounds when he talks.

190 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:45:34pm

re: #178 darthstar

I hate it when my dogs get the farts. It's even worse when it's so bad they fart and then give me a dirty look and go to the other side of the room because it stank so bad. I always say, "Hey, that was you!"

We had a dog that if he ate popcorn would get gas that was absolutely deadly.

We thought about sending him in a box to Iraq (this was during the 1st Iraq war) with him at one end and popcorn at the other.

It was the binary popcorn fart weapon and we thought if we could send enough of dogs and enough popcorn, we could gas Saddam right out of power.

191 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:46:57pm

re: #186 darthstar

Donald trump looks gawdawful on HD tv...remind me to go back to standard signal next time I have the news on.

I want to throw something at my TV.

192 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:47:20pm

re: #183 PhillyPretzel

That sounds like the dog needs a good "airing." Translation: send the dog outside.

I did and now he's staring at me through the door with that sad, no one wuvs me, pitiful dog expression.

193 PhillyPretzel  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:47:39pm

re: #188 Floral Giraffe
It is a pity that some Republicans have not learned the meaning of the word "moderate."

194 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:47:40pm

re: #191 webevintage

I want to throw something at my TV.

He's so fucking stupid. He is quoting a dead woman over a government document?

195 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:48:18pm

re: #188 Floral Giraffe

What a DISGUSTING position the Idaho Republicans have taken.
*spit*

Those @#$@#! *#$%!! Need to have their intestines ##%^#% with a red hot @!#$#@!@ and twirled around a #@!$!@!

It's a good thing Charles put in that new profanity filter, or I'd be getting myself in trouble because I've had a very bad day and need to vent.

That being said, I hope the entire GOP caucus in the house get incurable sinus infections combined with dysentery. Let's see em run on that.

196 PhillyPretzel  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:48:27pm

re: #192 Jadespring

I wonder if dogs can take beano.

197 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:49:05pm

re: #192 Jadespring

I did and now he's staring at me through the door with that sad, no one wuvs me, pitiful dog expression.

I just tell mine "You can't use your Jedi mind tricks on me"

198 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:49:16pm

deja vu all over again...just shuffle some names around

199 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:49:19pm

re: #194 darthstar

He's so fucking stupid. He is quoting a dead woman over a government document?

That Obama...as a FETUS he was able to pull "one of the greatest cons in this country"...

200 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:49:37pm

re: #193 PhillyPretzel

They don't WANT to be moderate, they want to "take back the country".
(From a black President that they're afraid of, but they won't say that part, or most of them won't.)

201 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:49:45pm

I'm trying to imagine trump as president....

Nope.

Doesn't work.

202 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:50:14pm

re: #195 PT Barnum


It's a good thing Charles put in that new profanity filter, or I'd be getting myself in trouble because I've had a very bad day and need to vent.


Don't even fuckin' joke about profanity filters. When those start, I stop blogging.

203 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:50:14pm

re: #199 webevintage

That Obama...as a FETUS he was able to pull "one of the greatest cons in this country"...

The whole birther thing is a tribute to the need to teach critical thinking skills in the schools. However, the GOP is completely against this, as it would decimate their base.

204 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:50:25pm

re: #201 Jadespring

Visualize his hair, running on it's own!
LOL!

205 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:50:52pm

re: #202 darthstar

Don't even fuckin' joke about profanity filters. When those start, I stop blogging.

WEll then fuck you!

:)

206 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:51:02pm

re: #205 PT Barnum

WEll then fuck you!

:)

Thanks.

207 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:51:25pm

I wish Meredith Viera had taken out her particle blaster and put us all out of our misery....

208 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:51:26pm

re: #204 Floral Giraffe

Visualize his hair, running on it's own!
LOL!

I want to visualize him running down 42nd Avenue with his hair on fire.

209 PhillyPretzel  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:51:53pm

re: #201 Jadespring
I need some brain bleach after that suggestion.

210 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:51:58pm

Reading that the program used by the WI Waukesha Clerk was Microsoft Access.

Really? Really?

Remember GIGO?

211 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:52:04pm

re: #208 PT Barnum

Did we ever confirm it's REALLY his hair?
It looks like a rug to me.

212 CuriousLurker  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:52:11pm

re: #187 calochortus

I'm not going to get all outraged about your doing that or anything, I'm just being nit-picky. :-)

You're perfectly entitled to be nit-picky. I guess I'm a little bit like LVQ in the sense that some things send the needle on my Injustice Meter™ right off the charts. When that happens I have to vent lest I spontaneously combust and leave nothing behind but a pile of ashes in my chair. ;o)

213 Jadespring  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:52:40pm

re: #208 PT Barnum

I want to visualize him running down 42nd Avenue with his hair on fire.

Well his campaign could be really funny if he got Gary Busey to be his campaign manager.

214 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:52:41pm

re: #208 PT Barnum

I want to visualize him running down 42nd Avenue with his hair on fire.

I would have given money to see her take off one of her 4 inch heels and stab him in the eye with it, applying a lobotomy the hard way. Sadly, it would have made no difference in Trump's intellect.

215 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:53:14pm

re: #207 webevintage

I wish Meredith Viera had taken out her particle blaster and put us all out of our misery...

The only way to get Trump to stop spewing bullshit would be to make it financially detrimental to him to continue to do so. And right now it's making him money.

216 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:53:37pm

re: #214 PT Barnum

I would have given money to see her take off one of her 4 inch heels and stab him in the eye with it, applying a lobotomy the hard way. Sadly, it would have made no difference in Trump's intellect.

you are a violent sounding guy

217 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:53:58pm

re: #211 Floral Giraffe

Did we ever confirm it's REALLY his hair?
It looks like a rug to me.

Oh it is his hair....wrapped from one side to the other.
I bet it hangs to his shoulder when not all sprayed and swirled.

218 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:54:11pm

re: #210 Stanley Sea

Reading that the program used by the WI Waukesha Clerk was Microsoft Access.

Really? Really?

Remember GIGO?

Access is perfectly fine, it's the people that never learn how to use it properly that are the problem.

219 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:54:32pm

re: #216 albusteve

you are a violent sounding guy

You can bite me too.

220 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:54:40pm

re: #20 EmmmieG

Fifteen years ago. I was at work, speaking to a woman who was a non-attending member of my faith. She'd had a really, really rough year. Her husband had killee himself. She had met someone online, but then been raped by that person. She was pregnant.

Her decision was to carry the child to term and give it up for adoption. Her decision.

As she was talking to me, she was waffling about keeping the baby, because, you see, she was 37, not likely to marry again, and frankly, this might be her only child. The way she put it was, "What if Heavenly Father sent me this baby?"

I can't remember what non-committal, I'm listening to you thing I said, but I was thinking, "No, no, no. He would never send you a rape. Never. God doesn't work like that."

At that moment, though, I was just trying to be kind to a woman who'd been through a lot. I had my own baby and left that job before I found out what she did.

God, that's rough.

221 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:54:53pm

re: #214 PT Barnum

I would have given money to see her take off one of her 4 inch heels and stab him in the eye with it, applying a lobotomy the hard way. Sadly, it would have made no difference in Trump's intellect.

OMG!!!!
SO SHRILL and VIOLENT!!!111!!!!!
/

222 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:55:15pm

re: #218 PT Barnum

Access is perfectly fine, it's the people that never learn how to use it properly that are the problem.

Yeah, my point entirely. Primitive way to do an election imo. No one I have ever come across had a successful Access program.

223 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:55:44pm

OK, it is time for O'Donnell to stop with The Donald clips before I break something.

224 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:55:44pm

I find it amusing that Ann Coulter's ad is just below the copy of this post.

225 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:55:47pm

re: #217 webevintage

Oh it is his hair...wrapped from one side to the other.
I bet it hangs to his shoulder when not all sprayed and swirled.

There was a salon article about it recently. There's a comb forward from the back, crossed with a comb over from the side. A high-res photo shows the two layers clearly, and the spotted scalp beneath it.

226 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:56:03pm

re: #219 PT Barnum

You can bite me too.

burn, stab, bite
okay

227 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:56:37pm

re: #212 CuriousLurker

You're perfectly entitled to be nit-picky. I guess I'm a little bit like LVQ in the sense that some things send the needle on my Injustice Meter™ right off the charts. When that happens I have to vent lest I spontaneously combust and leave nothing behind but a pile of ashes in my chair. ;o)

Don't worry about it. I'd hate to think of you spontaneously combusting.

It has just been my observation that a little moderation is more likely to convince someone of the truth of a given position than ranting and or name calling (not that you were doing either.) I have no hope of convincing the True BelieversTM so I try to stick with swaying the middle. It is less satisfying than a good rant, however.

228 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:56:54pm

re: #222 Stanley Sea

Yeah, my point entirely. Primitive way to do an election imo. No one I have ever come across had a successful Access program.

I've had several, but I also know how to model data, put together a good table design and all the other things you should know how to do. I also use VBA instead of macros and some of the other god awful things MS inflicted on people who use Access.

229 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:57:26pm

re: #225 darthstar

There was a salon article about it recently. There's a comb forward from the back, crossed with a comb over from the side. A high-res photo shows the two layers clearly, and the spotted scalp beneath it.

ewwwwww
Why do men think that is more attractive then just going bald?

Guys really, just let yourself go bald, stop with the bad comb overs.

230 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:58:12pm

re: #226 albusteve

burn, stab, bite
okay

Like I said, I've had a very bad day, and I am not to be held responsible for any violent fantasies I might have today as I will be completely ashamed of them come tomorrow.

231 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:58:23pm

re: #229 webevintage

ewww
Why do men think that is more attractive then just going bald?
Guys really, just let yourself go bald, stop with the bad comb overs.

Another one of Life's Great Mysteries.

232 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:58:23pm

re: #225 darthstar

There was a salon article about it recently. There's a comb forward from the back, crossed with a comb over from the side. A high-res photo shows the two layers clearly, and the spotted scalp beneath it.

The other option was a woodgrain tattoo.

233 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:58:48pm

re: #229 webevintage

ewww
Why do men think that is more attractive then just going bald?

Guys really, just let yourself go bald, stop with the bad comb overs.

I keep trying to talk my wife into letting me shave my head, but she hasn't gone for it yet.

234 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:58:57pm

re: #46 darthstar

County Clerk finds 7,000 Prosser votes in WI Supreme Court election...

[Link: www.jsonline.com...]

Well, wasn't that a fortunate find? The hand of the almighty at work, I'm sure.

Wait, but we were ASSURED that even a shift of a few hundred votes is impossible, and indicates voter fraud.

DAMNIT, why did LostLakeHiker have to go on hiatus today?

235 PhillyPretzel  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:59:09pm

re: #229 webevintage
Well my sister's Father in law stopped the comb over and now he looks like Bozo the clown without the loud colors.

236 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:59:19pm

re: #227 calochortus

Don't worry about it. I'd hate to think of you spontaneously combusting.

It has just been my observation that a little moderation is more likely to convince someone of the truth of a given position than ranting and or name calling (not that you were doing either.) I have no hope of convincing the True BelieversTM so I try to stick with swaying the middle. It is less satisfying than a good rant, however.

Moderation in language is critical at this time--we're still 16 months out from the height of the freakin' campaign. I'll sound like a one-legged drill sergeant after the primaries.

237 Petero1818  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:59:23pm

re: #230 PT Barnum

Like I said, I've had a very bad day, and I am not to be held responsible for any violent fantasies I might have today as I will be completely ashamed of them come tomorrow.

Of course you can't be held responsible for whatever the hand of the almighty wants from you tonight.//

238 CuriousLurker  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:59:23pm

re: #227 calochortus

Don't worry about it. I'd hate to think of you spontaneously combusting.

It has just been my observation that a little moderation is more likely to convince someone of the truth of a given position than ranting and or name calling (not that you were doing either.) I have no hope of convincing the True BelieversTM so I try to stick with swaying the middle. It is less satisfying than a good rant, however.

You're welcome to try to talk me down any time. Heh.

239 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:59:28pm

re: #229 webevintage

ewww
Why do men think that is more attractive then just going bald?

Guys really, just let yourself go bald, stop with the bad comb overs.

My Stepdad wears a toupee. For the last 30 fricken years. GAH

240 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:00:00pm

re: #234 SanFranciscoZionist

Wait, but we were ASSURED that even a shift of a few hundred votes is impossible, and indicates voter fraud.

DAMNIT, why did LostLakeHiker have to go on hiatus today?

He knew this was coming and wanted to get as far away as possible from the incessant taunting, clearly!

241 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:00:33pm

re: #232 Stanley Sea

The other option was a woodgrain tattoo.

I suspect He just got a bad can of that spray on hair crap.

242 engineer cat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:01:12pm

re: #225 darthstar

There was a salon article about it recently. There's a comb forward from the back, crossed with a comb over from the side. A high-res photo shows the two layers clearly, and the spotted scalp beneath it.

which means there's nothing more needed to stop the trump for president movement than a strong gust of air in the teevee studio at the right time and place

243 calochortus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:01:22pm

My husband has just announce that dinner is ready.
I chose my life partner well. Its nice to trade off the cooking now and then.

BBL

244 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:02:13pm

re: #66 Walter L. Newton

As we see... elections have consequences.

Yes. Someone wins.

??

245 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:02:47pm

re: #228 PT Barnum

I've had several, but I also know how to model data, put together a good table design and all the other things you should know how to do. I also use VBA instead of macros and some of the other god awful things MS inflicted on people who use Access.

And Access is one of the favorite platforms for designing custom applications for small to medium sized business. There is absolutely nothing wrong or weak about Access, the biggest problem is it was originally marketed to non-programming end users who saw it as nothing more than Xcel on steroids.

A capable Visual Basic programmer (and .Net Programmer) can design almost anything using Access. I've been doing Access contract work off and on for years, and I know million dollar plus companies who's primary installed base of applications are custom written in Access.

Combined with SQL Server, it's a very robust database platform.

246 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:03:46pm

re: #242 engineer dog

which means there's nothing more needed to stop the trump for president movement than a strong gust of air in the teevee studio at the right time and place

Funny you should say that. They showed a clip from his Apprentice show shot outside. Everyone's hair is blowing wildly, but his is remarkably stable. Either they put up a plexiglass barrier to block his hair from the wind (he was on a little stage and all the "contestants" were standing below him in the gusts), or his hair has a clear shell around it.

247 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:05:04pm

re: #246 darthstar

Funny you should say that. They showed a clip from his Apprentice show shot outside. Everyone's hair is blowing wildly, but his is remarkably stable. Either they put up a plexiglass barrier to block his hair from the wind (he was on a little stage and all the "contestants" were standing below him in the gusts), or his hair has a clear shell around it.

Or Donald Trump only weakly interacts with reality.

248 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:05:30pm

re: #100 calochortus

I do ask myself why women put up with the behavior of this sort of man-as in actually marry them and stuff. What is wrong with us?

Hormones.

249 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:06:10pm

re: #245 Walter L. Newton

And Access is one of the favorite platforms for designing custom applications for small to medium sized business. There is absolutely nothing wrong or weak about Access, the biggest problem is it was originally marketed to non-programming end users who saw it as nothing more than Xcel on steroids.

A capable Visual Basic programmer (and .Net Programmer) can design almost anything using Access. I've been doing Access contract work off and on for years, and I know million dollar plus companies who's primary installed base of applications are custom written in Access.

Combined with SQL Server, it's a very robust database platform.

I actually learned SQL using it to interact with Access at a summer internship. It, indeed, works fine if you use it right.

250 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:07:57pm

Screw SQL. Object databases 4 lyfe, yo!

:p

251 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:08:14pm

re: #186 darthstar

Donald trump looks gawdawful on HD tv...remind me to go back to standard signal next time I have the news on.

Bill Cosby thinks Donald Chump should STFD and STFU.

[Link: www.balloon-juice.com...]

252 engineer cat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:08:18pm

access if fine except that it is one of those windoze-only things, and it isn't necessarily easy to find an access editor that isn't the one that ms wants you to pay like $400 for

i use it for small scale private purposes but businesses and commerical applications tend to use sybase or oracle or something like that

if you cooperate with windoze you can run sql queries on it which is helpful...

253 Nervous Norvous  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:08:46pm

re: #249 Simply Sarah

I actually learned SQL using it to interact with Access at a summer internship. It, indeed, works fine if you use it right.

Nothing better for Rapid Application Development against a robust SQL engine. As I said, most Access users don't understand normalization or programming for shit, and thus give Access it's bad reputation. I think it's also a matter of a lot of IT departments not wanting to support applications they didn't write themselves. The place I'm working now just says "You can't use it. We don't care if it's in your Office installation, you're not allowed to use it for any purpose whatsoever."

254 engineer cat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:09:37pm

re: #247 prononymous

Or Donald Trump only weakly interacts with reality.

it still isn't clear which dimensions the beginning and ends of his hair are located in

255 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:09:38pm

re: #250 prononymous

Screw SQL. Object databases 4 lyfe, yo!

:p

the number of squirrel identified furries that have SQL puns in their names, there's more than you'd expect

256 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:10:23pm

re: #153 talking point detective

I can understand why some people have questions about the morality of abortions. As long as fetus isn't viable, I don't - but I can understand why some people do.

This, on the other hand, is just flat out fucking insane.

I completely understand the reasoning behind opposing abortion, either morally or legally.

Getting up in company to chirp about how God's ways are not our ways, OTOH, when discussing such a thing, puts you beyond the pale.

257 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:10:52pm

re: #255 WindUpBird

the number of squirrel identified furries that have SQL puns in their names, there's more than you'd expect

Do they go around looking for people they can inject into?

258 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:10:52pm

re: #224 ilzito guacamolito

Quite frankly, I find it amusing that an advertisement for Ann Coulter would appear anywhere on this blog.

259 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:11:06pm

re: #154 Naso Tang

That's not good. It will make you look like a Shiite Muslim, whether you care or not.

Or, it will make you look like one of my students, who got a little too carried away playing with the suction experiment in science class.

260 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:11:14pm

re: #201 Jadespring

I'm trying to imagine trump as president...

Nope.

Doesn't work.

Perhaps if he was relieved of the mind controlling alien parasite sitting on his head?

261 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:11:16pm

re: #248 SanFranciscoZionist

Hormones.

Wife's Kentucky family has a story of an ancestor who 'solved' an abusive husband. When he was in a drunken coma she folded the sheet over him, then stitched if up. Then she went over him with a logging chain. They story seems to have elements of myth, but wife repeats it occasionally for its didactic value.

262 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:12:14pm

re: #169 Stanley Sea

This is kinda funny (probably already mentioned, but I'm beehind)

Rush Limbaugh earlier today: “Does anyone really believe that fraud didn’t happen in Wisconsin?”

I have no idea, but I'm willing to bet that Rush doesn't believe it any more...

263 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:13:15pm

re: #210 Stanley Sea

Reading that the program used by the WI Waukesha Clerk was Microsoft Access.

Really? Really?

Remember GIGO?

In this case it isn't the data that's the problem, it's the tool.

264 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:13:41pm

re: #185 moderatelyradicalliberal

Fuck these people. I hope their kidneys fail.

Well, it would be God's will.

Except that I have a good friend whose kidneys are in the last act of failing, and if I suggested that was God's will, she'd probably deck me. Or cry. It's been a rough couple of months.

265 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:14:29pm

Well now here's an awesome video for Democratic campaign ads in 2012

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

Pence Lets Truth Slip On Uncompromising Stance: ‘We’re Trying To Score A Victory For The Republican People’

PENCE: Well, I don’t know if we’re checkmating. But we’re trying — we’re trying to score a victory for the Republican people, for — for the American — for the Republican people — trying to score a victory for the American people, not for the Republican Party. That victory is going to come in stages here.

That's all they need.

266 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:14:49pm

re: #190 PT Barnum

We had a dog that if he ate popcorn would get gas that was absolutely deadly.

We thought about sending him in a box to Iraq (this was during the 1st Iraq war) with him at one end and popcorn at the other.

It was the binary popcorn fart weapon and we thought if we could send enough of dogs and enough popcorn, we could gas Saddam right out of power.

I'm envisioning a G.I. in a gas mask petting a golden retriever now. Other hand is full of yummy popcorn.

267 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:15:26pm

re: #222 Stanley Sea

Yeah, my point entirely. Primitive way to do an election imo. No one I have ever come across had a successful Access program.

'Cept me.

268 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:16:30pm

re: #228 PT Barnum

I've had several, but I also know how to model data, put together a good table design and all the other things you should know how to do. I also use VBA instead of macros and some of the other god awful things MS inflicted on people who use Access.

Same here.

269 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:16:31pm

re: #196 PhillyPretzel

I wonder if dogs can take beano.

Someone asked that a while ago. I think, and do not give your dog Beano on my say-so until asking your own vet, that I found a site that suggested it was OK if you gave them half-tabs (to allow for their smaller weight).

I'm a little skeptical, since their digestive systems evolved to deal with rather different stuff than ours, and I'm not sure how Beano works.

270 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:17:16pm

re: #267 b_sharp

'Cept me.

Heya, if telling yourself that helps you sleep at night...
/

271 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:17:29pm

re: #230 PT Barnum

Like I said, I've had a very bad day, and I am not to be held responsible for any violent fantasies I might have today as I will be completely ashamed of them come tomorrow.

Just keep your chain and your legs away from Steve.

272 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:17:38pm

re: #248 SanFranciscoZionist

Hormones.

When asked, a huge proportion of women say, "oh, looks aren't THAT important. What really turns me on is a guy who's smart and has a good sense of humor." Then they just end up giggling at everything the good-looking dumb guy says.

273 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:18:09pm

re: #233 PT Barnum

I keep trying to talk my wife into letting me shave my head, but she hasn't gone for it yet.

You want me to get my wife to talk to her?

274 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:19:18pm

re: #264 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, it would be God's will.

Except that I have a good friend whose kidneys are in the last act of failing, and if I suggested that was God's will, she'd probably deck me. Or cry. It's been a rough couple of months.

Sorry about your friend. But sometimes evil thoughts are good stress relievers. And the truth is some of these people have a better chance of kidney failure then being voted out of office. Some of these people could beat a nun to death with a bag full of dead puppies that they also killed and the TP/GOP base wouldn't care as long as they keep seeming to hate the same people they hate.

275 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:19:19pm

re: #240 Simply Sarah

He knew this was coming and wanted to get as far away as possible from the incessant taunting, clearly!

Ah, but HOW did he know? Was he in on it too?

//Enquiring minds want to know!

276 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:20:27pm

re: #257 Simply Sarah

Do they go around looking for people they can inject into?

I think you were looking for the sql command "insert?"

277 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:21:28pm

re: #258 ilzito guacamolito

Quite frankly, I find it amusing that an advertisement for Ann Coulter would appear anywhere on this blog.

The feed appears to operate off key words appearing in the blog. We also get a lot of Muslim dating site ads.

278 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:21:56pm

re: #233 PT Barnum

I keep trying to talk my wife into letting me shave my head, but she hasn't gone for it yet.

It looks really great on a lot of men!

279 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:22:00pm

re: #276 Walter L. Newton

I think you were looking for the sql command "insert?"

I was referring to SQL injection!

280 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:22:37pm

re: #261 Decatur Deb

Wife's Kentucky family has a story of an ancestor who 'solved' an abusive husband. When he was in a drunken coma she folded the sheet over him, then stitched if up. Then she went over him with a logging chain. They story seems to have elements of myth, but wife repeats it occasionally for its didactic value.

Willie Nelson's daughter claims a variation of this in her biography of Willie.

She also claims a lot of other things that may or may not be true, but I *think* that's the origin of the tied-into-sheets-and-beaten-while-passed-out-drunk meme.

281 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:22:38pm

re: #279 Simply Sarah

I was referring to SQL injection!

Don't worry, some of us got it. ;)

282 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:23:40pm

re: #276 Walter L. Newton

I think you were looking for the sql command "insert?"

Image: exploits_of_a_mom.png

283 Mr Pancakes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:23:58pm

re: #233 PT Barnum

I keep trying to talk my wife into letting me shave my head, but she hasn't gone for it yet.

She probably won't like the inner thigh razor burn from your stubbly Q-Tip head, just shave religiously everyday.

284 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:23:59pm

re: #261 Decatur Deb

Wife's Kentucky family has a story of an ancestor who 'solved' an abusive husband. When he was in a drunken coma she folded the sheet over him, then stitched if up. Then she went over him with a logging chain. They story seems to have elements of myth, but wife repeats it occasionally for its didactic value.

Woman my grandmother used to work with, back in the 50s or 60s, had an abusive husband problem. She kicked him out, but he came back, drunk and armed. He told her to get her ass in the kitchen and make him dinner, because he was the man, and he ran things in his house.

She, reportedly, told him that she was going to go into the kitchen and make him dinner, because he was the man, and he ran things. Then she hefted an iron skillet and said, "But one more thing, Fred. Do not go to sleep. Do not ever go to sleep."

He had packed his clothes and left by the time dinner was done, so she sent over the extra to the neighbor's place.

285 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:24:05pm

re: #277 SanFranciscoZionist

Ouch.

286 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:24:28pm

re: #280 negativ

Willie Nelson's daughter claims a variation of this in her biography of Willie.

She also claims a lot of other things that may or may not be true, but I *think* that's the origin of the tied-into-sheets-and-beaten-while-passed-out-drunk meme.

That, or it was a lot more common than a restraining order in KY. All great myths are lessons.

287 Simply Sarah  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:25:26pm

re: #277 SanFranciscoZionist

The feed appears to operate off key words appearing in the blog. We also get a lot of Muslim dating site ads.

Yeah, it seems they're all either ultra-right wing or Muslim dating. It's kinda weird in that way, although I understand why it would happen.

288 Querent  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:25:38pm

re: #1 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

If someone were to bitchslap these bastards into the middle of next week, that would also technically be the hand of the Almighty at work.

And i've got a pair of steel-toed boots that would like to volunteer to kick them there...

289 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:25:40pm

re: #258 ilzito guacamolito

Charles gets paid, whatever the ads, the Google keywords drive to his site.
Just point & laugh!

290 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:25:49pm

re: #282 negativ

Image: exploits_of_a_mom.png

A lot of my co-workers have signed copies of that strip (I work for a software security company).

291 PhillyPretzel  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:27:22pm

Good Night to my fellow Lizards.

292 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:27:48pm

re: #289 Floral Giraffe

Kinda like gubmint woik. Huh?

293 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:28:14pm

re: #280 negativ

Willie Nelson's daughter claims a variation of this in her biography of Willie.

She also claims a lot of other things that may or may not be true, but I *think* that's the origin of the tied-into-sheets-and-beaten-while-passed-out-drunk meme.

Checked the publication date--1987. The story was going around before we were married in '67. Probably a common bit of folklore.

294 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:28:44pm

Hello scaly bloggers!

295 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:28:55pm

re: #267 b_sharp

'Cept me.

I am talking about the GIGO factor.

296 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:29:00pm

re: #277 SanFranciscoZionist

The feed appears to operate off key words appearing in the blog. We also get a lot of Muslim dating site ads.

I'd be down for dating some Muslims. *oscillates eyebrows*

297 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:29:02pm

It's the fifth anniversary of the death of a good friend's husband.

I'll tell you folks, God sure does work in mysterious ways, and I really hope to get a good and full explanation of what the hell they are at some stage...

He would have been forty-one this year.

298 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:30:12pm

re: #296 prononymous

I'd be down for dating some Muslims. *oscillates eyebrows*

Well, feel free to try some of these sites out. I'm assuming that most of the ladies who sign up are probably looking for other Muslims, but you might find a girl whose mom signed her up, who's looking to get even.

299 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:30:27pm

re: #297 SanFranciscoZionist

It's the fifth anniversary of the death of a good friend's husband.

I'll tell you folks, God sure does work in mysterious ways, and I really hope to get a good and full explanation of what the hell they are at some stage...

He would have been forty-one this year.

{{SanFranciscoZionist}}

300 darthstar  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:30:46pm

Time to take a break from the internets. Play nice, everyone.

301 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:31:25pm

re: #297 SanFranciscoZionist

It's the fifth anniversary of the death of a good friend's husband.

I'll tell you folks, God sure does work in mysterious ways, and I really hope to get a good and full explanation of what the hell they are at some stage...

He would have been forty-one this year.

If there is a God who invented the universe, the second thing he invented was the statisticians--then he handed the whole mess over to them.

302 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:32:05pm

re: #298 SanFranciscoZionist

Yeah, I'm probably not their type. :(

It will have to be a stealth mission. :D

303 b_sharp  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:33:16pm

'Night peeps.

304 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:34:17pm

re: #297 SanFranciscoZionist

It's the fifth anniversary of the death of a good friend's husband.

I'll tell you folks, God sure does work in mysterious ways, and I really hope to get a good and full explanation of what the hell they are at some stage...

He would have been forty-one this year.

Oh so young! I'm sorry to hear it :(

305 recusancy  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:34:52pm

re: #63 Renaissance_Man

I thought we were told just yesterday that no recount had ever overturned an election in favour of a Republican?

Yeah. I think he flounced earlier today though. haha Was it lostlakehiker?

306 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:36:02pm

I've been working all day, what did I miss?

307 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:36:25pm

re: #305 recusancy

Yeah. I think he flounced earlier today though. haha Was it lostlakehiker?

Did you notice... this wasn't a recount... haha?

308 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:36:39pm

re: #305 recusancy

Yeah. I think he flounced earlier today though. haha Was it lostlakehiker?

I missed a flounce?

309 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:36:57pm

re: #305 recusancy

Yeah. I think he flounced earlier today though. haha Was it lostlakehiker?

lol Really?

What about that little presidential election in 2000?

310 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:37:03pm

re: #308 NJDhockeyfan

I missed a flounce?

Vulture.

311 Walter L. Newton  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:37:38pm

re: #309 marjoriemoon

lol Really?

What about that little presidential election in 2000?

Did you notice... this wasn't a recount.

312 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:37:47pm

re: #297 SanFranciscoZionist

Who is God?

313 Mr Pancakes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:38:39pm

re: #312 ilzito guacamolito

Who is God?

Bono

314 recusancy  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:38:46pm

re: #307 Walter L. Newton

Did you notice... this wasn't a recount... haha?

haha

315 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:38:58pm

re: #312 ilzito guacamolito

Who is God?

The biggest baddest motherfucker of all time. Don't fuck with God.

316 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:39:04pm

re: #311 Walter L. Newton

Did you notice... this wasn't a recount.

I didn't catch the initial discussion. I was responding to "no recount had ever overturned an election in favour of a Republican."

317 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:39:04pm

re: #313 Mr Pancakes

Sonny?

318 recusancy  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:39:14pm

re: #312 ilzito guacamolito

Who is God?

Alanis Morrisette

319 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:39:34pm

re: #318 recusancy

Yikes!

320 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:39:52pm

re: #312 ilzito guacamolito

Who is God?

currently it's Kieth Richards

321 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:39:56pm

re: #318 recusancy

Alanis Morrisette

LOL

Just a slob like one of us.

322 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:40:02pm

re: #308 NJDhockeyfan

I missed a flounce?

Didn't read quite like a flounce--more like a voluntary exile.

323 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:40:13pm

re: #312 ilzito guacamolito

Who is God?

A monk asked Dongshan Shouchu, "What is Buddha?" Dongshan said, "Three pounds of flax."

324 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:40:44pm

re: #322 Decatur Deb

Didn't read quite like a flounce--more like a voluntary exile.

Who was it?

325 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:40:51pm

re: #321 marjoriemoon

LOL

Just a slob like one of us.

that was Joan Osborne

326 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:41:27pm

This is awesome!

Israeli system intercepts Gaza rocket for first time: AFP

ASHKELON, Israel (AFP) – Israel's Iron Dome short-range missile defence system on Thursday intercepted a rocket fired from Gaza for the first time, over the city of Ashkelon, an AFP correspondent said.

A military source confirmed the rocket had been brought down by the unique multi-million-dollar system, which came into operation on March 27, the first time a short-range interceptor has been deployed anywhere.

As the rocket came in from Gaza, the interceptor missile streaked into the sky to hit it with the two trails converging in an explosion, said the AFP correspondent.

A military source told AFP this was the first time that Iron Dome had hit a rocket in an actual combat operation.

327 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:41:29pm

re: #324 NJDhockeyfan

Who was it?

Lostlake, if we're talking about the same thing.

328 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:42:16pm

re: #326 NJDhockeyfan

This is awesome!

Israeli system intercepts Gaza rocket for first time: AFP

yeah, a game changer

329 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:42:56pm

You guys will love this exchange I just read over at Ezra Klien's blog about Planned Parenthood:

Poster #1:
Planned Parenthood is about so much more than abortion. Besides, there is already a federal law that government funds cannot be used for abortion.

Idiot Reply #2:
They use that 'so much more' to increase their abortion business. They promote promiscuous behaviors and reliance upon contraceptives. Over 50% of the women that come back to them for abortions had relied on contraceptives during the period of conception.

I had no idea that cheap birth control and pap smears entices woman into later unsafe sex and abortions.
I have no way to describe how fucking sick and tired I am of women being treated like children by these people.

330 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:43:04pm

re: #320 albusteve

Double yikes.
BTW, it's Keith

331 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:43:06pm

re: #305 recusancy

Yeah. I think he flounced earlier today though. haha Was it lostlakehiker?

I don't think he flounced. He's backing off for a bit.

332 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:43:52pm

re: #315 NJDhockeyfan

Certainly not badder that Tim Kerr or Denis Potvin...

333 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:43:56pm

re: #330 ilzito guacamolito

Double yikes.
BTW, it's Keith

yes Keith, I said that

334 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:44:00pm

re: #312 ilzito guacamolito

Who is God?

God is dead.

I think that Nietzsche quote works well here. The idea isn't that God once existed and subsequently perished. But rather that we, as humans, can't any longer slough off responsibility for our actions onto a divine entity to absolve ourselves of them. I think that fits well with the topic.

335 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:44:49pm

re: #307 Walter L. Newton

Did you notice... this wasn't a recount... haha?

Recount, discovery of counting error...eh.

336 HappyWarrior  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:45:08pm

re: #329 webevintage

You guys will love this exchange I just read over at Ezra Klien's blog about Planned Parenthood:

I had no idea that cheap birth control and pap smears entices woman into later unsafe sex and abortions.
I have no way to describe how fucking sick and tired I am of women being treated like children by these people.

Hahahaha you can't make that kind of shit up, "they promote premiscious behavior." And by the way if keith is God, that's a good God to have. He always was my favorite Stone. Hear his autobio is awesome.

337 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:45:12pm

re: #323 negativ

So if I convert that to English or Metric that equals...

338 Mr Pancakes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:45:22pm

re: #330 ilzito guacamolito

Double yikes.
BTW, it's Keith

Yes it's Keith, but those in the know spell it Kieth in reverence..... it's equivalent to G-d. You didn't know that?

339 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:45:29pm

re: #331 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't think he flounced. He's backing off for a bit.

but it needs to be a flounce, so consider it a flounce and people will be happy

340 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:46:28pm

re: #338 Mr Pancakes

Yes it's Keith, but those in the know spell it Kieth in reverence... it's equivalent to G-d. You didn't know that?

I get it...I had a typo, my bad
and good one btw

341 Mr Pancakes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:47:14pm

re: #340 albusteve

I get it...I had a typo, my bad
and good one btw

Dude I was trying to recover for ya........

342 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:47:35pm

re: #329 webevintage

You guys will love this exchange I just read over at Ezra Klien's blog about Planned Parenthood:

I had no idea that cheap birth control and pap smears entices woman into later unsafe sex and abortions.
I have no way to describe how fucking sick and tired I am of women being treated like children by these people.

They promote promiscuous behaviors and reliance upon contraceptives. Over 50% of the women that come back to them for abortions had relied on contraceptives during the period of conception.

Oyyyyy.

343 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:47:46pm

re: #341 Mr Pancakes

Dude I was trying to recover for ya...

and you did

344 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:48:11pm

re: #338 Mr Pancakes

Sorry. Sarcasm is my religion. And I am devout.

345 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:48:18pm

re: #339 albusteve

but it needs to be a flounce, so consider it a flounce and people will be happy

I won't be happy. Lostlake is good people.

346 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:48:39pm

re: #329 webevintage

You guys will love this exchange I just read over at Ezra Klien's blog about Planned Parenthood:

I had no idea that cheap birth control and pap smears entices woman into later unsafe sex and abortions.
I have no way to describe how fucking sick and tired I am of women being treated like children by these people.

A dude typed that, guaranteed.

347 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:48:52pm

re: #312 ilzito guacamolito

Who is God?

Who isn't?

348 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:49:13pm

re: #345 SanFranciscoZionist

I won't be happy. Lostlake is good people.

Maybe Lostlake will return as Foundlake.

349 Mr Pancakes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:49:43pm

re: #343 albusteve

and you did

Steve, a friend of mine just told me about a Keith Richards autobiography (methinks) that he said was really good. If you want me to dig deeper I will. I don't recall the details.

350 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:49:43pm

re: #347 SanFranciscoZionist

Certainly not me.

351 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:49:45pm

re: #345 SanFranciscoZionist

I won't be happy. Lostlake is good people.

agreed X2

352 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:50:40pm

re: #338 Mr Pancakes

Sorry. Missed the memo.

353 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:51:11pm

re: #349 Mr Pancakes

Steve, a friend of mine just told me about a Keith Richards autobiography (methinks) that he said was really good. If you want me to dig deeper I will. I don't recall the details.

brand new, out late last year....he called Jagger a pin dick and was lambasted for it....hahaha!....they're cool

354 Mr Pancakes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:51:45pm

re: #352 ilzito guacamolito

Sorry. Missed the memo.

There was no memo..... it's just known to the enlightened.

/

355 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:51:54pm

re: #329 webevintage

You guys will love this exchange I just read over at Ezra Klien's blog about Planned Parenthood:

I had no idea that cheap birth control and pap smears entices woman into later unsafe sex and abortions.
I have no way to describe how fucking sick and tired I am of women being treated like children by these people.

Indeed. To me, the whole thing revolves around choice. The least of which is a woman's right to chose who will father her children and not having to accept a violent man as one of those choices.

356 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:52:38pm

re: #354 Mr Pancakes

Just call me unlightened.

357 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:52:41pm

re: #320 albusteve

currently it's Kieth Richards

Huh, here I thought it was Elmer Keith after he got done down here.

///

358 Mr Pancakes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:52:52pm

re: #353 albusteve

brand new, out late last year...he called Jagger a pin dick and was lambasted for it...hahaha!...they're cool

Great.... I might have to pick that up myself.

359 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:53:06pm

re: #348 NJDhockeyfan

Maybe Lostlake will return as Foundlake.

Or Handsome Lake.

[Link: www.crookedlakereview.com...]

360 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:53:44pm

re: #334 prononymous

God is dead.

I think that Nietzsche quote works well here. The idea isn't that God once existed and subsequently perished. But rather that we, as humans, can't any longer slough off responsibility for our actions onto a divine entity to absolve ourselves of them. I think that fits well with the topic.

hehe... I like to put it a little differently. I think we lay a lot on God that has nothing to do with Him. He's done his job, part of which is creating us - life - with the potential to be the best we can be. Sadly, we often fall short.

361 Querent  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:56:00pm

re: #24 darthstar

i regret that i have but one upding, etc.

News Flash to GOP: that is NOT why she's screaming "oh God" during sex...

362 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:58:24pm

Blessed St. Janice had it right

Youtube Video
363 ilzito guacamolito  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:59:34pm

re: #360 marjoriemoon

wow

364 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:59:41pm

What in the world? This is almost straight out of the Dark Ages. Pre-reformation and what not.

365 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:00:16pm

re: #360 marjoriemoon

hehe... I like to put it a little differently. I think we lay a lot on God that has nothing to do with Him. He's done his job, part of which is creating us - life - with the potential to be the best we can be. Sadly, we often fall short.

I would agree. As an atheist I approach the subject from a different angle. But we are essentially agreeing on the point that people are putting responsibility on god that is in fact their own responsibility.

366 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:00:27pm

I don't care if it rains or freezes 'long as I got my plastic fetus riding on the dashboard of my car.

367 Mr Pancakes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:00:31pm

re: #362 albusteve

Blessed St. Janice had it right

[Video]

I can sing that song after 40 years without even seeing the video. I probably haven't heard it for 30 of them years.

368 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:02:35pm

re: #366 Gus 802

Youtube Video
369 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:03:45pm

Annals of Online Dating:

"I have no idea why this guy is single"
[Link: annalsofonlinedating.tumblr.com...]

370 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:03:53pm

re: #364 Gus 802

What in the world? This is almost straight out of the Dark Ages. Pre-reformation and what not.

these archaic laws need to be collectively struck down by the USSC...get off their asses and do the right thing

371 Querent  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:04:02pm

re: #90 allegro

Not only legal but fucking holy. Do these asswipes even think about what they're saying? Or are they just too depraved to recognize the implications?

Moral Derpitude.

372 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:04:54pm

re: #360 marjoriemoon

hehe... I like to put it a little differently. I think we lay a lot on God that has nothing to do with Him. He's done his job, part of which is creating us - life - with the potential to be the best we can be. Sadly, we often fall short.

Sometimes, though, there are awesome stories of folks who rise above all the horror in the world and do really good work.

My mother recently attended an award's luncheon for a very special lady, Jill Rich, who gave a home to dozens of Lost Boys of the Sudan. She clothed them, fed them and helped them get through college. She's a human dynamo, rarely thinking of herself and only of others. Very inspirational.

More on Jill Rich [Link: www.realtor.org...]

Thousands of Lost Boys fled their country amid a violent civil war after being separated from their family members, many of whom were murdered or forced into slavery. After grueling years of wandering the desert on foot, they sought refuge at a camp in Kenya and then were brought to the United States in 2001 with the permission of the U.S. government. About 60 of them settled in Tucson.

The young men, who grew up in tribal communities, needed help adapting to American life. “They had no knowledge of technology,” Rich says. “They didn’t know how to use a refrigerator. They’d go into a grocery store and wouldn't know what was food and what wasn’t.”

Rich helped them find housing, get jobs, finish high school, attend and pay for college, and get medical and dental care. Many of them even lived with Rich while they settled into their new lives. Her motherly guidance and love earned her the nickname “Mama Jill.”

373 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:05:25pm

re: #363 ilzito guacamolito

wow

I amaze you?

374 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:05:51pm

It's looking like the government might get shut down if these idiots we've elected can't come to an agreement. What really pisses me off is this:

Who gets paid if there's a shutdown? Members of Congress still will

From NBC's Luke Russert
On the eve of a possible government shutdown, hundreds of thousands of federal workers and members of the military are at risk of not collecting a paycheck until after Congress reaches a deal to fund the government.

But as of now, the people directly involved in bringing about a shutdown -- members of Congress -- will still continue to receive their pay as scheduled even if scores of other workers are furloughed.

Stand-alone legislation has been proposed -- but not passed in both the House and the Senate -- that would prohibit members of Congress from receiving their pay in the event of a shutdown. Members of Congress make, on average, $174,000 per year.

Fuckers...
[grown]

375 jaunte  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:07:21pm

re: #373 marjoriemoon

The guacamolito has left the building.

376 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:07:29pm

re: #373 marjoriemoon

Who isn't when observing the Loc-nar?

377 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:07:48pm

re: #374 NJDhockeyfan

It's looking like the government might get shut down if these idiots we've elected can't come to an agreement. What really pisses me off is this:

Who gets paid if there's a shutdown? Members of Congress still will

Fuckers...
[grown]

a major insult to the people

378 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:08:10pm

Can I barf now?

The Almighty doesn't play dice with the life of a child.

379 Querent  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:08:13pm

re: #138 prononymous

OK. Is this low enough?

Auuummm...

380 jaunte  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:08:41pm

re: #374 NJDhockeyfan

Aren't most Congress members rich enough to get along without a paycheck for a few months?

381 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:08:52pm

re: #374 NJDhockeyfan

It's looking like the government might get shut down if these idiots we've elected can't come to an agreement. What really pisses me off is this:

Who gets paid if there's a shutdown? Members of Congress still will

Fuckers...
[grown]

It's horseshit. We've got a shut down coming and Harry Reid wants it to happen. He wants it because he wants to be able to say how evil Republicans are.

382 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:09:21pm

re: #377 albusteve

a major insult to the people

didn't you know, Congress is our new royalty.

Seriously, they've set themselves up as the Lords of the Manor. We serfs have to take what we get.

Can you tell I'm pissed?

383 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:09:44pm

re: #381 Dark_Falcon

It's horseshit. We've got a shut down coming and Harry Reid wants it to happen. He wants it because he wants to be able to say how evil Republicans are.

Dark, what drives you to this conclusion?

384 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:10:00pm

re: #381 Dark_Falcon

It's horseshit. We've got a shut down coming and Harry Reid wants it to happen. He wants it because he wants to be able to say how evil Republicans are.

Yeah. It's just Harry Reid. Yep.

385 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:10:06pm

re: #381 Dark_Falcon

It's horseshit. We've got a shut down coming and Harry Reid wants it to happen. He wants it because he wants to be able to say how evil Republicans are.

I forgot, serfs couldn't carry arms.

OK, I feel better.

386 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:10:54pm

re: #381 Dark_Falcon

It's horseshit. We've got a shut down coming and Harry Reid wants it to happen. He wants it because he wants to be able to say how evil Republicans are.

He's right.

387 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:11:06pm

re: #375 jaunte

The guacamolito has left the building.

Oh darn.

388 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:11:28pm

re: #376 prononymous

Who isn't when observing the Loc-nar?

Fear the Loc-nar!!

389 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:11:49pm

re: #381 Dark_Falcon

It's horseshit. We've got a shut down coming and Harry Reid wants it to happen. He wants it because he wants to be able to say how evil Republicans are.

Harry Read could rightfully say a whole lot worse than that about Republicans

390 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:12:05pm

re: #377 albusteve

a major insult to the people

The real American heroes who are laying in a foxhole somewhere dodging bullets won't get a paycheck but these imbeciles in Washington will continue to get paid. That's way out of line.

Clinton signed a measure to make sure the members of the military continued to get paid when the government was shut down. Obama hopefully will do the right thing and follow Bill's example.

391 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:12:15pm

re: #376 prononymous

Who isn't when observing the Loc-nar?

Stupid bitch, get away from me! it's mine! it's my Loc-Nar!

392 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:12:39pm

re: #388 marjoriemoon

Fear the Loc-nar!!

No!

*invites the Loc-nar to dinner*

393 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:13:05pm

re: #391 WindUpBird

Stupid bitch, get away from me! it's mine! it's my Loc-Nar!

*riding pterodactyl screams as guy in kiss makeup and a michael jackson coat shoots it with a harpoon gun*

394 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:13:24pm

re: #392 prononymous

No!

*invites the Loc-nar to dinner*

You saw it what it did to those guys in WW2!

395 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:13:31pm

re: #391 WindUpBird

Stupid bitch, get away from me! it's mine! it's my Loc-Nar!

I have that, too! But it isn't safe for the children :>

396 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:13:56pm

re: #393 WindUpBird

didn't he have horns too? I should go as that guy for halloween

397 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:13:57pm

re: #381 Dark_Falcon

It's horseshit. We've got a shut down coming and Harry Reid wants it to happen. He wants it because he wants to be able to say how evil Republicans are.

First get rid of the log in your own base...

A Gallup poll of adult Americans, also released on Wednesday, found a similar result. In that poll, 58% of all respondents said they hoped for a compromise, compared to 30% who said they'd rather see a shutdown than a compromise bill they didn't completely agree with.

Among that sample, 68% of Democrats and 60% of independents said they wanted Congress to, "Agree to a budget compromise, even if that means they pass a bill you don't agree with." But 51% of Republicans said they'd rather see GOP leaders in Congress hold out for the deal they want, even if that meant shutting down the government. Forty-four percent of Republicans said they'd accept a compromise they didn't fully agree with to avoid a shutdown.'

....


Over all, 55 percent of Americans, including 53 percent of independents and 69 percent of Democrats, want lawmakers whose views they agree with to compromise. But 50 percent of Republicans, including 56 percent of conservative Republicans, want lawmakers who share their views to stand by their principles, even if that means the government will shut down. Among Republicans and Republicans-leaning independents who agree with the Tea Party, 68 percent want lawmakers who share their views to stand on principle.


then you will see well enough to deal with the speck in the eye of the other party's senate majority leader.

398 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:14:31pm

re: #395 marjoriemoon

I have that, too! But it isn't safe for the children :>

NO IT IS NOT :D

A couple of the vignettes are sorrrta okay, most not so much *_*

399 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:14:33pm

re: #390 NJDhockeyfan

The real American heroes who are laying in a foxhole somewhere dodging bullets won't get a paycheck but these imbeciles in Washington will continue to get paid. That's way out of line.

Clinton signed a measure to make sure the members of the military continued to get paid when the government was shut down. Obama hopefully will do the right thing and follow Bill's example.

Typically, few shutdowns have lasted long enough for anyone to miss a check. The soldiers will still earn because they are essential. They just won't get paid on time if it goes very long.

400 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:15:08pm

encore
Station Man
Fleetwood Mac

Youtube Video
401 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:15:19pm

re: #383 jamesfirecat

Dark, what drives you to this conclusion?

Reid insists on trying to cut defense funding, even after Boener had agreed to the level of defense spending. Reid also refuses to allow the Republicans one of their high profile targets. If he'd defund NPR, I think we could get a deal. But as it is, we have him calling Boener a "hostage" while Chuckie Schumer and San Fran Nan takes turns saying that Paul Ryan wants to kill old people.

They don't want a deal, they want to blame and attack the GOP. They want to force Boener to use Democratic votes to pass the budget, in order to split the Republican Party.

402 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:15:46pm

re: #382 ggt

didn't you know, Congress is our new royalty.

Seriously, they've set themselves up as the Lords of the Manor. We serfs have to take what we get.

Can you tell I'm pissed?

yup, I hate the feds

403 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:16:05pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Reid insists on trying to cut defense funding, even after Boener had agreed to the level of defense spending. Reid also refuses to allow the Republicans one of their high profile targets. If he'd defund NPR, I think we could get a deal. But as it is, we have him calling Boener a "hostage" while Chuckie Schumer and San Fran Nan takes turns saying that Paul Ryan wants to kill old people.

They don't want a deal, they want to blame and attack the GOP. They want to force Boener to use Democratic votes to pass the budget, in order to split the Republican Party.


ahahahah San Fran nan

are you just cutting and pasting this from a blog?

404 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:16:39pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

If he'd defund NPR, I think we could get a deal.

Dark, do you support defunding NPR?

405 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:17:06pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Reid insists on trying to cut defense funding, even after Boener had agreed to the level of defense spending. Reid also refuses to allow the Republicans one of their high profile targets. If he'd defund NPR, I think we could get a deal. But as it is, we have him calling Boener a "hostage" while Chuckie Schumer and San Fran Nan takes turns saying that Paul Ryan wants to kill old people.

They don't want a deal, they want to blame and attack the GOP. They want to force Boener to use Democratic votes to pass the budget, in order to split the Republican Party.

Reid is a whiner. He whined when Bush was in office and he is whining now.

It's always the other guys fault, it could be Quasimodo if he didn't let Reid get his way.

406 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:17:28pm

re: #399 Decatur Deb

Typically, few shutdowns have lasted long enough for anyone to miss a check. The soldiers will still earn because they are essential. They just won't get paid on time if it goes very long.

I don't trust those assholes in Washington to get a deal done in a few days after shutting down the government. Out best & brightest in uniform shouldn't have to wait for their checks to come in unless the government can promise that their bills will also be late.

407 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:17:29pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Reid insists on trying to cut defense funding, even after Boener had agreed to the level of defense spending. Reid also refuses to allow the Republicans one of their high profile targets. If he'd defund NPR, I think we could get a deal. But as it is, we have him calling Boener a "hostage" while Chuckie Schumer and San Fran Nan takes turns saying that Paul Ryan wants to kill old people.

They don't want a deal, they want to blame and attack the GOP. They want to force Boener to use Democratic votes to pass the budget, in order to split the Republican Party.

Oh brother. Did you get hired by the RNC overnight?

408 Four More Tears  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:17:33pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

It's funny watching you twist to pin this on Reid.

409 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:17:40pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Reid insists on trying to cut defense funding, even after Boener had agreed to the level of defense spending. Reid also refuses to allow the Republicans one of their high profile targets. If he'd defund NPR, I think we could get a deal. But as it is, we have him calling Boener a "hostage" while Chuckie Schumer and San Fran Nan takes turns saying that Paul Ryan wants to kill old people.

They don't want a deal, they want to blame and attack the GOP. They want to force Boener to use Democratic votes to pass the budget, in order to split the Republican Party.

Considering the number of riders on the bill they passed today to keep things running for one week, NPR is the tip of the iceberg of the things the GOP wants to ram down the Senate Dems throats.

410 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:17:40pm

My best friend just moved to the bay, apparently what they consider a bad neighborhood looks like a pretty good neighborhood if you're used to SE Portland

411 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:17:41pm

re: #404 jamesfirecat

Dark, do you support defunding NPR?

is NPR the litmus test for everything these days?

412 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:18:04pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Dark, in the thread the other night you never actually answered how Ryan's plan wouldn't wind up with seniors having to shoulder a much higher level of their medical costs, or how the plan would save the US government money.

413 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:18:31pm

re: #397 jamesfirecat

First get rid of the log in your own base...

A Gallup poll of adult Americans, also released on Wednesday, found a similar result. In that poll, 58% of all respondents said they hoped for a compromise, compared to 30% who said they'd rather see a shutdown than a compromise bill they didn't completely agree with.

Among that sample, 68% of Democrats and 60% of independents said they wanted Congress to, "Agree to a budget compromise, even if that means they pass a bill you don't agree with." But 51% of Republicans said they'd rather see GOP leaders in Congress hold out for the deal they want, even if that meant shutting down the government. Forty-four percent of Republicans said they'd accept a compromise they didn't fully agree with to avoid a shutdown.'

...

Over all, 55 percent of Americans, including 53 percent of independents and 69 percent of Democrats, want lawmakers whose views they agree with to compromise. But 50 percent of Republicans, including 56 percent of conservative Republicans, want lawmakers who share their views to stand by their principles, even if that means the government will shut down. Among Republicans and Republicans-leaning independents who agree with the Tea Party, 68 percent want lawmakers who share their views to stand on principle.

then you will see well enough to deal with the speck in the eye of the other party's senate majority leader.

I think the Republicans are right on this. We've compromised enough already. I'm not prepared to go to the party base hat in hand like that. If the Dems refuse to budge and persist in flinging insults, then they've forced the shutdown.

414 Four More Tears  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:18:37pm

re: #407 Gus 802

Oh brother. Did you get hired by the RNC overnight?

I think he just can't bring himself to blame the GOP, so it has to be the Left's fault, right?

415 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:18:43pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Reid insists on trying to cut defense funding, even after Boener had agreed to the level of defense spending. Reid also refuses to allow the Republicans one of their high profile targets. If he'd defund NPR, I think we could get a deal. But as it is, we have him calling Boener a "hostage" while Chuckie Schumer and San Fran Nan takes turns saying that Paul Ryan wants to kill old people.

They don't want a deal, they want to blame and attack the GOP. They want to force Boener to use Democratic votes to pass the budget, in order to split the Republican Party.

So the only thing hanging up a deal is NPR? And somehow this is a blunder for Reid?

Lol. Republicans are getting hung up over a minor political point, are going to let themselves get grilled and eaten over it, and somehow it is still the democrats fault.

416 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:18:48pm

re: #412 Obdicut

t answer earlier, I have to look on my thing to see if I got your thing :D

417 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:18:53pm

re: #398 WindUpBird

NO IT IS NOT :D

A couple of the vignettes are sorrrta okay, most not so much *_*

I have the DVD, but saw the movie when it first came out. It has a kind of awesome history. Apparently, the producers (?) didn't have rights to all the music. Like 8 different artists? So soon after the movie hit the theaters, it was pulled into litigation for some 15 years. It finally settled and came out on DVD in the 90s (I think).

Anyhoo, you can watch it for free here [Link: www.crackle.com...] (Heavy Metal)

418 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:18:57pm

re: #406 NJDhockeyfan

I don't trust those assholes in Washington to get a deal done in a few days after shutting down the government. Out best & brightest in uniform shouldn't have to wait for their checks to come in unless the government can promise that their bills will also be late.

You know, I love our soldiers. I believe they are the best of us.

But they are still human, with bills to pay. And, they are the guys with the big guns.

I just wouldn't mess with their pay. Mostly because I love them. Partly because I'm not stupid.

419 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:19:07pm

re: #413 Dark_Falcon

I think the Republicans are right on this. We've compromised enough already. I'm not prepared to go to the party base hat in hand like that. If the Dems refuse to budge and persist in flinging insults, then they've forced the shutdown.

What the frak has the GOP compromised on recently? Do tell.

420 Bubblehead II  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:19:09pm

Lizards time to call it a night. For those of you who pray to a higher power, please include this woman.in your prayers. While not an employee with my company, I have worked with her on several projects. She was/is fun loving person. But she fucked up and made a mistake that she is now is paying the price for.

She should have opened the mains to the HVAC unit. Instead She opted to open individual breakers for each motor. She missed one and it cost her.

421 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:19:20pm

re: #390 NJDhockeyfan

The real American heroes who are laying in a foxhole somewhere dodging bullets won't get a paycheck but these imbeciles in Washington will continue to get paid. That's way out of line.

Clinton signed a measure to make sure the members of the military continued to get paid when the government was shut down. Obama hopefully will do the right thing and follow Bill's example.

If Obama did that, then he'd be accused of being an Imperial President ruling by fiat who's trying to turn America into a Military dictatorship.

Hell, he's already being accused trying to turn the presidency into a Imperialist fiat rule for the Libya strikes.

422 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:19:36pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

San Fran Nan - lol, argument fail.

423 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:19:46pm

re: #406 NJDhockeyfan

I don't trust those assholes in Washington to get a deal done in a few days after shutting down the government. Out best & brightest in uniform shouldn't have to wait for their checks to come in unless the government can promise that their bills will also be late.

Yes--The new element is the TP push. If they yell 'RINO' enough, this one could be longer than usual.

424 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:19:52pm

re: #413 Dark_Falcon

I think the Republicans are right on this. We've compromised enough already. I'm not prepared to go to the party base hat in hand like that. If the Dems refuse to budge and persist in flinging insults, then they've forced the shutdown.

Umm... Dark you started out asking for 30 Billion, and the Dems offered you 33 Billion....

In what way have you compromised?

425 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:20:11pm

re: #413 Dark_Falcon

I think the Republicans are right on this. We've compromised enough already. I'm not prepared to go to the party base hat in hand like that. If the Dems refuse to budge and persist in flinging insults, then they've forced the shutdown.

And the Planned Parenthood question?

426 prairiefire  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:20:22pm

inconveniencere: #413 Dark_Falcon

I think the Republicans are right on this. We've compromised enough already. I'm not prepared to go to the party base hat in hand like that. If the Dems refuse to budge and persist in flinging insults, then they've forced the shutdown.

But your base is cwazy.

427 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:20:22pm

re: #413 Dark_Falcon

I think the Republicans are right on this. We've compromised enough already. I'm not prepared to go to the party base hat in hand like that. If the Dems refuse to budge and persist in flinging insults, then they've forced the shutdown.

Ah. So you want the GOP to not compromise, leading to a shutdown, but you want to say it was the Democrats fault that the shutdown happened-- for not compromising.

Seriously?

428 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:20:49pm

DF, significant cuts need to be made in the defense budget. It's completely out of wack as it is and it's bleeding this nation dry. We need to have a big battle, declare victory and bring the troops home and let them go back to killing each other. As for terrorists, the drones & FBI have always been more effective.

Then we can start having real discussions about the F22 & F35 projects and other defense pork.

429 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:20:58pm

re: #413 Dark_Falcon

I think the Republicans are right on this. We've compromised enough already. I'm not prepared to go to the party base hat in hand like that. If the Dems refuse to budge and persist in flinging insults, then they've forced the shutdown.

There would have been no Franco-Prussian War if the French had been quick to surrender.

430 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:21:03pm

re: #414 JasonA

I think he just can't bring himself to blame the GOP, so it has to be the Left's fault, right?

Something. I think if one were to look at this from the middle then they could say that both parties are trying to force each other's hand. So the Democrats want 30 billion and the Republicans 60 billion. Split the difference and find 45 billion. However, yep, take NPR off the table.

Anywho, I voted Republican for several years during this bullshit GWOT and won't ever vote for a Republican ever again until the day I die.

431 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:21:27pm

re: #414 JasonA

I think he just can't bring himself to blame the GOP, so it has to be the Left's fault, right?

hahah i don't care


it's all just chess movements at this point and mickey mouse bullshit, it's inside baseball to the point of ridiculousness


what is ACTUALLY true is there are a bunch of animals in the Republican party who are trying to steer it, and us, and our country, and our rights, right back to the dark ages. Shutdown, shmutdown, take the long view. They are evil for ways far more important than some defense spending penis duel

432 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:21:32pm

re: #419 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

What the frak has the GOP compromised on recently? Do tell.

We came down from $61 Billion in cuts to around $40 Billion. Boener has signaled he'd go lower, but he needs to show he's following the party's priorities. and those are to take the cuts out of NPR and Planned Parenthood, not the Military.

433 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:21:42pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Reid insists on trying to cut defense funding, even after Boener had agreed to the level of defense spending. Reid also refuses to allow the Republicans one of their high profile targets. If he'd defund NPR, I think we could get a deal. But as it is, we have him calling Boener a "hostage" while Chuckie Schumer and San Fran Nan takes turns saying that Paul Ryan wants to kill old people.

They don't want a deal, they want to blame and attack the GOP. They want to force Boener to use Democratic votes to pass the budget, in order to split the Republican Party.

"San Fran Nan"

Really?

Dark I like you, I respect you... this is beneath you.

WAY BENEATH YOU!

Would you take me seriously if I referred to the senate minority leader as Big Baby Boehner?

434 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:22:12pm

re: #414 JasonA

I think he just can't bring himself to blame the GOP, so it has to be the Left's fault, right?

I blame both sides. Anyone who doesn't is obviously towing their own party line.

435 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:22:30pm

re: #417 marjoriemoon

I have the DVD, but saw the movie when it first came out. It has a kind of awesome history. Apparently, the producers (?) didn't have rights to all the music. Like 8 different artists? So soon after the movie hit the theaters, it was pulled into litigation for some 15 years. It finally settled and came out on DVD in the 90s (I think).

Anyhoo, you can watch it for free here [Link: www.crackle.com...] (Heavy Metal)

Yeah, I knew that because I had to see it as a VHS bootleg passed form a friend of mine, because it wasn't out then :D I own the newer DVD edition, I'll just sorta throw it on in the background and recite the dialogue :D

436 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:22:42pm

re: #360 marjoriemoon

hehe... I like to put it a little differently. I think we lay a lot on God that has nothing to do with Him. He's done his job, part of which is creating us - life - with the potential to be the best we can be. Sadly, we often fall short.

Religious people seem to create their own idea of what they want God to be.

Sincere question from an atheist to observant Jews: How do you reconcile the God that sent plagues of frogs, flies, mosquitos, locusts, etc. against Pharaoh and even went so far as to kill all the firstborn children (who by definition had nothing to do with it), and enabled Moses to perform all sorts of magic tricks to get the Hebrews out of slavery, with the God who later on sat by and didn't do jack shit while the Nazis (wearing beltbuckles reading "Gott Mit Uns") inflicted far worse on their descendants?

I can't understand why people can read the Bible and see that God as anything other than a purely malevolent figure. I can't understand how any modern person can read it and think that it has any closer relationship to reality than Jason and the Argonauts or Star Wars.

I'd like to be able to wrap my mind around that thinking, but I fail.

437 prairiefire  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:23:00pm

re: #434 NJDhockeyfan

I blame both sides. Anyone who doesn't is obviously towing their own party line.

The dems should have passed a budget last year. I agree with that.

438 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:23:08pm

re: #432 Dark_Falcon

We came down from $61 Billion in cuts to around $40 Billion. Boener has signaled he'd go lower, but he needs to show he's following the party's priorities. and those are to take the cuts out of NPR and Planned Parenthood, not the Military.

NPR and Planned Parenthood are pocket change, hell you could find enough money to fund them between the couch cushions at the Pentagon. The US defense budget for 2012, Iraq & Afghanistan included, is $671 billion. If you think that there are no cuts that can come from that, then you're not serious about getting the deficit under control.

439 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:23:11pm

re: #432 Dark_Falcon

We came down from $61 Billion in cuts to around $40 Billion. Boener has signaled he'd go lower, but he needs to show he's following the party's priorities. and those are to take the cuts out of NPR and Planned Parenthood, not the Military.

What with all the bullshit Biblle Thumper amendments that the Republicans added to it? Republicans and their abortion, abortion, abortion. Yawn.

440 Four More Tears  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:23:21pm

re: #434 NJDhockeyfan

I blame both sides. Anyone who doesn't is obviously towing their own party line.

Yeah. I hear you criticizing the Right all the time.

441 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:24:53pm

re: #418 ggt

You know, I love our soldiers. I believe they are the best of us.

But they are still human, with bills to pay. And, they are the guys with the big guns.

I just wouldn't mess with their pay. Mostly because I love them. Partly because I'm not stupid.

The choice to pay them or not after the government shuts down is in Obama's fingers. Will he or won't he keep their paychecks flowing?

442 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:25:00pm

re: #434 NJDhockeyfan

I blame both sides. Anyone who doesn't is obviously towing their own party line.

there is a generalized climate of irrational paranoia and fear and uninformed anger that is building in this country, that is what I "blame"

And it is a simple fact that the Republican party has far more to gain by exploiting this climate and feeding it and aiming its fury at their usual targets.

Which they are, to some success.

Thanks, Republicans! Thanks for helping our country be just a little more shitty!

443 Killgore Trout  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:25:18pm

re: #432 Dark_Falcon

We came down from $61 Billion in cuts to around $40 Billion. Boener has signaled he'd go lower, but he needs to show he's following the party's priorities. and those are to take the cuts out of NPR and Planned Parenthood, not the Military.

I think that's part of the reason I don't take them seriously. Republicans are willing to stop paychecks for servicemen if they aren't allowed to destroy NPR and planned parenthood. NPR and planned parenthood aren't serious fiscal issues. If they were holding out over something serious I could understand although I might not agree. I don't see the Republican demands as being serious financial issues and I don;t think we should cave in to them.

444 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:25:45pm

Yeah. Just sign on the dotted line and kill Planned Parenthood and NPR.

Here's part of what the Republican creeps want to also do...

Image: 311.jpg

445 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:26:02pm

re: #441 NJDhockeyfan

The choice to pay them or not after the government shuts down is in Obama's fingers. Will he or won't he keep their paychecks flowing?


lol politics lol

446 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:26:12pm

re: #441 NJDhockeyfan

The choice to pay them or not after the government shuts down is in Obama's fingers. Will he or won't he keep their paychecks flowing?

He'd have to make some sort of deal with the Joint Chiefs to NOT pay them.

Seriously, he can't be that stupid.

447 prairiefire  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:26:26pm

re: #441 NJDhockeyfan

The choice to pay them or not after the government shuts down is in Obama's fingers. Will he or won't he keep their paychecks flowing?

The Republicans need to send him a clean bill.

448 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:26:27pm

re: #373 marjoriemoon

I amaze you?

Replace "amuse" with "amaze". Fun times!

Youtube Video
449 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:26:42pm

re: #432 Dark_Falcon

The GOP's budget also cuts almost everything related to regulation of greenhouse gases, including climate-tracking funding.

How do you reconcile your knowledge that AGW is real and going to cause immense harm to the world with your support for the GOP, who deny AGW and are sabotaging our ability to combat it?

450 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:26:52pm

re: #431 WindUpBird

Colorful! Love it.

451 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:27:07pm

re: #421 bloodstar

If Obama did that, then he'd be accused of being an Imperial President ruling by fiat who's trying to turn America into a Military dictatorship.

Hell, he's already being accused trying to turn the presidency into a Imperialist fiat rule for the Libya strikes.

That's bullshit. Bill Clinton did it. WTF is your source for that?

452 Varek Raith  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:27:15pm

Don't try to switch sides because the Government shut down doesn't make your party look good anymore. This is what the GOP base wants.
Be proud of it!
You're shutting down the eeevil Feds!

453 Shiplord Kirel  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:27:19pm

OT

I just finished watching the final installment of Ken Burns's The Civil War on our local PBS station. This monumental series has been praised to the rafters since it first came out, and justly so.
I can't add much to that, except how proud I am of my own "blue uniform, with 'US' on the collar, and brass buttons with eagles," as a recently enlisted former slave put it in about 1863.

454 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:27:23pm

re: #443 Killgore Trout

I think that's part of the reason I don't take them seriously. Republicans are willing to stop paychecks for servicemen if they aren't allowed to destroy NPR and planned parenthood. NPR and planned parenthood aren't serious fiscal issues. If they were holding out over something serious I could understand although I might not agree. I don't see the Republican demands as being serious financial issues and I don;t think we should cave in to them.


if people wish to be mindless tribalistic children, who am I to deny them their fondest wish

455 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:27:46pm

re: #447 prairiefire

The Republicans need to send him a clean bill.

The Dems can propose their own Senate bill first.

456 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:27:56pm

re: #451 NJDhockeyfan

That's bullshit. Bill Clinton did it. WTF is your source for that?

You're betting against how crazy republicans can be in regards to Obama NJD? Not a smart move....

457 Killgore Trout  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:28:04pm

I guess this is what everybody's talking about.Latest White House huddle fails to yield budget deal; shutdown nears

458 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:28:25pm

re: #452 Varek Raith

Don't try to switch sides because the Government shut down doesn't make your party look good anymore. This is what the GOP base wants.
Be proud of it!
You're shutting down the eeevil Feds!

Exactly. It's hilarious. The wingnuts have been threatening to shut down the government for several months now and now it's the Democrats fault?

Too. Fucking. Funny.

Pardon my French.

459 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:28:30pm

re: #455 Dark_Falcon

The Dems can propose their own Senate bill first.

They did it's the one where we only cut $31 billion dollars and don't defund planned parenthood or NPR.

460 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:28:32pm

re: #430 Gus 802

Something. I think if one were to look at this from the middle then they could say that both parties are trying to force each other's hand. So the Democrats want 30 billion and the Republicans 60 billion. Split the difference and find 45 billion. However, yep, take NPR off the table.

Anywho, I voted Republican for several years during this bullshit GWOT and won't ever vote for a Republican ever again until the day I die.

makes a nice blues riff

461 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:28:35pm

re: #397 jamesfirecat

+/- 4 makes that poll pretty worthless. According to their numbers the only people who care about a compromise are the dems with the repubs/independents being 50/50.

462 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:28:37pm

You know, let the GOP get their way --it won't last past 2012 and they'll never be in power again.

463 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:29:00pm

re: #390 NJDhockeyfan

The real American heroes who are laying in a foxhole somewhere dodging bullets won't get a paycheck but these imbeciles in Washington will continue to get paid. That's way out of line.

Clinton signed a measure to make sure the members of the military continued to get paid when the government was shut down. Obama hopefully will do the right thing and follow Bill's example.

Democrats tried to get that passed in the House today and only one Republican voted for it.

464 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:29:01pm

re: #432 Dark_Falcon

We came down from $61 Billion in cuts to around $40 Billion. Boener has signaled he'd go lower, but he needs to show he's following the party's priorities. and those are to take the cuts out of NPR and Planned Parenthood, not the Military.

And THAT is a joke to any thinking American. PP? NPR? Those 2 entities have really fucked the US of A.

Biggest GAH in awhile.

465 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:29:38pm

re: #437 prairiefire

The dems should have passed a budget last year. I agree with that.

Exactly. The had total control of the Senate & the WH. Why didn't they pass it last fall?

466 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:29:50pm

re: #433 jamesfirecat

"San Fran Nan"

Really?

Dark I like you, I respect you... this is beneath you.

WAY BENEATH YOU!

Would you take me seriously if I referred to the senate minority leader as Big Baby Boehner?

oh bullshit, so much drama

467 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:29:59pm

The metaphorical elephant in the room on this entire mess, The spending cuts being demanded are going to absolutely screw the economy. Austerity measures can work in certain circumstances but not during a Demand side Recession. Yes, we're coming out of it, but there is still a lot of slack in the economy. Taking money out of the system is one of the single worst things you could possibly do at this moment.

There are three major factors for the size of the deficits the last few years. First the reduction in the marginal rate at the upper end. The second was a serious recession that got unemployment skyrocketing (and therefore tax revenue) And third there was these conflicts that we've been engaged in for the last 9 years or so.

None of the points for austerity address any of these three major points. Inflation remains low, Deflation is still a danger that most people don't understand, and bringing in austerity is more likely to bring about another recession a la 1937 - 1938.

Yes, there are issues with Medicare and retirement funding, but that should be a separate question that has nothing to do with the entire austerity now debate.

468 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:30:20pm

re: #438 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Did I call your suggestion that Obama would send troops into libya crazy talk? Was that you or TalkingPointsDetective?

469 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:30:20pm

Why we never said anything about shutting down the government. Ever. -- Republican

//

470 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:30:25pm

re: #451 NJDhockeyfan

That's bullshit. Bill Clinton did it. WTF is your source for that?

DoD has a good bit of slack for re-programming and creative accounting. The trouble is that it takes months to straighten out the appropriations and contracting afterwards. Once or twice I was furloughed from the civilian side of the Army, but paid for it later because it would have been a nightmare to treat us as unemployed.

471 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:30:27pm

re: #442 WindUpBird

there is a generalized climate of irrational paranoia and fear and uninformed anger that is building in this country, that is what I "blame"

And it is a simple fact that the Republican party has far more to gain by exploiting this climate and feeding it and aiming its fury at their usual targets.

Which they are, to some success.

Thanks, Republicans! Thanks for helping our country be just a little more shitty!

Yawn

472 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:30:28pm

I gotta go.

I'll try to check-in later.

Have a great eveing all.

473 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:30:34pm

The government slowdown is all the Democrats fault! Damn those small government democrats!

474 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:30:45pm

re: #459 jamesfirecat

They did it's the one where we only cut $31 billion dollars and don't defund planned parenthood or NPR.

No, they didn't. No bill has been introduced or passed.

Put it in writing, Harry, show us what you'd cut.

475 Killgore Trout  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:30:48pm

re: #458 Gus 802

Exactly. It's hilarious. The wingnuts have been threatening to shut down the government for several months now and now it's the Democrats fault?

Too. Fucking. Funny.

Pardon my French.

Not just months. I realized this morning that wingnuts have been trying to pull the plug on all government since Obama's election. A government shutdown is the pinnacle of their dreams. I think they're really going to do it.

476 prairiefire  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:30:54pm

re: #430 Gus 802

If they would let up on their war on women, I would not be so adamantly agin' them. But they don't.

477 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:31:05pm

re: #473 prononymous

The government slowdown is all the Democrats fault! Damn those small government democrats!

Don't tread on me!

Next time we come armed!

Shut her down!

//

478 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:31:08pm

re: #468 RogueOne

Did I call your suggestion that Obama would send troops into libya crazy talk? Was that you or TalkingPointsDetective?

Think it was probably TalkingPoints, I've been ambivalent to negative towards the idea of sending troops there.

479 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:31:20pm

re: #443 Killgore Trout

I think that's part of the reason I don't take them seriously. Republicans are willing to stop paychecks for servicemen if they aren't allowed to destroy NPR and planned parenthood. NPR and planned parenthood aren't serious fiscal issues. If they were holding out over something serious I could understand although I might not agree. I don't see the Republican demands as being serious financial issues and I don;t think we should cave in to them.

but, but but PP forces women to come to them for abortions by providing pap smears and low cost birth control.....

480 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:31:43pm

re: #461 RogueOne

+/- 4 makes that poll pretty worthless. According to their numbers the only people who care about a compromise are the dems with the repubs/independents being 50/50.

Try these numbers on for size.

[Link: themoderatevoice.com...]

481 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:32:40pm

re: #465 NJDhockeyfan

Exactly. The had total control of the Senate & the WH. Why didn't they pass it last fall?

Because by last fall Scott Walker had been elected so the Republicans could have filibustered any democratic budget they didn't like.

482 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:32:41pm

re: #420 Bubblehead II

Lizards time to call it a night. For those of you who pray to a higher power, please include this woman.in your prayers. While not an employee with my company, I have worked with her on several projects. She was/is fun loving person. But she fucked up and made a mistake that she is now is paying the price for.

She should have opened the mains to the HVAC unit. Instead She opted to open individual breakers for each motor. She missed one and it cost her.

Oh crap. HVAC is my second building nightmare.

Elevator shafts are my first.

Prayers going out.

483 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:33:00pm

re: #441 NJDhockeyfan

The choice to pay them or not after the government shuts down is in Obama's fingers. Will he or won't he keep their paychecks flowing?

Why just the military GOP sacred cow? You guys are so transparent. What about thar single mom gov worker? Not American enough?

484 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:33:15pm

re: #451 NJDhockeyfan

That's bullshit. Bill Clinton did it. WTF is your source for that?

Like them or not, you've had that argument coming from Sullivan, George Will, Mickey Klaus Just to name three.

The point I'm making is that no matter what Obama does, There is a chunk of the Republican party (and in this case, I'm willing to say the majority) who are willing to try to tar him in any way shape or form to further their agenda.

485 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:33:16pm

re: #478 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Think it was probably TalkingPoints, I've been ambivalent to negative towards the idea of sending troops there.

Someone said it would end up that way and I thought it was crazy talk. Musta been TPD.

486 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:33:36pm

re: #475 Killgore Trout

Not just months. I realized this morning that wingnuts have been trying to pull the plug on all government since Obama's election. A government shutdown is the pinnacle of their dreams. I think they're really going to do it.

They'd do it too. They'd shutdown the government and then pretend they never said anything or had anything to do with it. They'll go ahead an cynically play the victim which something they're good at these days.

And this GOP bologna is far more than just cutting spending. The GOP is intent on cutting the budget while performing their own version of right wing religious social engineering."

487 Varek Raith  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:34:02pm

Shut the government down! Shut em down!
...
...
...
OH SHIT! WE'RE GOING TO BE BLAMED FOR IT...AGAIN!
...
...
It's the Dems fault! It's the Dems fault!

488 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:34:06pm

re: #474 Dark_Falcon

No, they didn't. No bill has been introduced or passed.

Put it in writing, Harry, show us what you'd cut.

Dark what do you make of the fact that Bohner was originally asking for 30 Billion in cuts, then uped it to 60 when the Democrats agreed?

489 prairiefire  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:34:09pm

re: #479 webevintage

but, but but PP forces women to come to them for abortions by providing pap smears and low cost birth control...

One of the first things I always did when moving to a new town was finding out where the dmned Planned Parenthood was.
If men had to exert as much energy trying to keep from being pregnant, I don't think anything would ever get done.

490 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:34:09pm

re: #453 Shiplord Kirel

OT

I just finished watching the final installment of Ken Burns's The Civil War on our local PBS station. This monumental series has been praised to the rafters since it first came out, and justly so.
I can't add much to that, except how proud I am of my own "blue uniform, with 'US' on the collar, and brass buttons with eagles," as a recently enlisted former slave put it in about 1863.

I've been wanting to watch that since I'm surrounded with Civil War history. Unfortunately DirecTV won't turn it on and I was denied by a PBS station on Roanoke. My taxes are paying for PBS and I can't watch it.

Bastards!

491 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:35:02pm

re: #457 Killgore Trout

I guess this is what everybody's talking about.Latest White House huddle fails to yield budget deal; shutdown nears

Another thing that could be done is to agree on longer term caps for mandatory spending programs to control costs. Such spending does have to be reformed, and John Boener is right to be skeptical of Dems talk of cutting it. It's a point of potential compromise, and I hope a deal can be reached on it.

492 albusteve  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:35:35pm

the best part is the blind partisanship....great stuff!

493 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:35:45pm

re: #456 jamesfirecat

You're betting against how crazy republicans can be in regards to Obama NJD? Not a smart move...

Obama can sign it and the GOP can't stop him.

494 jaunte  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:36:10pm

re: #486 Gus 802

The GOP is intent on cutting the budget while performing their own version of right wing religious social engineering."

Cutting 1.59% of the budget.
[Link: www.investors.com...]

495 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:36:13pm

re: #463 webevintage

Democrats tried to get that passed in the House today and only one Republican voted for it.

Just in case someone needs links:
[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

Slate’s Dave Weigel noted that five minutes after the White House declared H.R. 1363 unacceptable, House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R-VA) slammed President Obama for threatening to veto a bill to “ensure that our troops are paid.” Minutes later, Rep. Tom Latham (R-IA) ripped Democrats for “girding to oppose a ‘troop-funding bill.’” Republican lawmakers quickly picked up the rallying cry. Reps. Mike Pence (R-IN) and Harold Rodgers (R-KY) called it “astonishing” and “inexplicable” that Obama would, as GOP shutdown architect Newt Gingrich put it, use the troops as “bargaining chips for budget negotiations.”
There’s only one problem with this talking point — it’s the opposite of true. Today, the House Democrats tried three times to pass a measure that would ensure the troops received pay. The Republicans overwhelmingly opposed every single “troop-funding” opportunity:

496 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:36:15pm

re: #488 jamesfirecat

Dark what do you make of the fact that Bohner was originally asking for 30 Billion in cuts, then uped it to 60 when the Democrats agreed?

I don't believe that's a fact at all. And I'd like your source.

497 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:36:36pm

re: #488 jamesfirecat

Dark what do you make of the fact that Bohner was originally asking for 30 Billion in cuts, then uped it to 60 when the Democrats agreed?

Funny, that's not the way I remember it. I remember Boehner originally proposing $30 billion, then bumping it to $60 billion when the Tea Party made their "displeasure" unknown. And even then they were not happy, demanding the $100 billion they'd been promised.

498 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:37:07pm

re: #493 NJDhockeyfan

Obama can sign it and the GOP can't stop him.

Sorry I think I misread you.

I thought you were saying that if he did it then Obama wouldn't "be accused of being an Imperial President ruling by fiat who's trying to turn America into a Military dictatorship."

I have no doubt that he can do it and I stand right along side you hoping that he does it.

I just expect the right wing to go crazy when he does it...

499 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:37:22pm

re: #496 Dark_Falcon

Dark, are you simply ignoring my question, or do you not have an answer for it?

500 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:38:06pm

re: #494 jaunte

Cutting 1.59% of the budget.
[Link: www.investors.com...]

Amazing. Ramirez has some good thought provoking toons.

My thoughts right now would be simple. Just find an amount and skim it off the top of every department. Pro-rated of course depending on the current budget for that department. So if it's 1.59 percent then cut 1.59 percent from each department. I think that would be fairest route.

501 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:38:11pm

re: #497 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Funny, that's not the way I remember it. I remember Boehner originally proposing $30 billion, then bumping it to $60 billion when the Tea Party made their "displeasure" unknown. And even then they were not happy, demanding the $100 billion they'd been promised.

That's what happens when you pander to people in fantasy land. Nothing is going to be good enough for them.

502 celticdragon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:38:45pm

re: #420 Bubblehead II

Lizards time to call it a night. For those of you who pray to a higher power, please include this woman.in your prayers. While not an employee with my company, I have worked with her on several projects. She was/is fun loving person. But she fucked up and made a mistake that she is now is paying the price for.

She should have opened the mains to the HVAC unit. Instead She opted to open individual breakers for each motor. She missed one and it cost her.

Jesus Christ.

I will pray for her tonight. Thanks for the tip.

503 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:38:54pm

re: #480 jamesfirecat

Try these numbers on for size.

[Link: themoderatevoice.com...]

The numbers are certainly different and it looks a lot better for the dems on that one . Still +/- 4. My own personal ratings for polls says +/- 3 might be accurate, +/- 4 iffy, +/-5 bullshit.//

504 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:39:28pm

re: #481 jamesfirecat

Because by last fall Scott Walker had been elected so the Republicans could have filibustered any democratic budget they didn't like.

Well they could have passed a budget bill and let the Republicans look bad by filibustering it. Why didn't they do it? No guts?

505 celticdragon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:39:46pm

re: #488 jamesfirecat

Dark what do you make of the fact that Bohner was originally asking for 30 Billion in cuts, then uped it to 60 when the Democrats agreed?

Moving the goal posts IOKIYAAR.

506 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:40:37pm

re: #467 bloodstar

You have to understand - the cuts are designed to trash the economy because then they can blame it on Obama during the 2012 elections.

There is nothing here about fiscal responsibility any more than there is in Scott Walker's state budget. It's all about power and ideology.

507 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:40:42pm

re: #484 bloodstar

Like them or not, you've had that argument coming from Sullivan, George Will, Mickey Klaus Just to name three.

The point I'm making is that no matter what Obama does, There is a chunk of the Republican party (and in this case, I'm willing to say the majority) who are willing to try to tar him in any way shape or form to further their agenda.

Whatever....
?

508 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:41:17pm

re: #501 prononymous

That's what happens when you pander to people in fantasy land. Nothing is going to be good enough for them.

Too tired to find the link, but a libertarian commenter today (at Politico I think) said 100 billion was just for show, and that nothing less than 500B would do.

509 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:41:23pm

re: #458 Gus 802

Too. Fucking. Funny.

Pardon my French.

True fact:

One universal human constant is that in all languages, across all cultures, taboo "dirty words" are invariably religious, excretory, or reproductive in nature.

GOD DAMMIT.
OH, SHIT
FUCK YOU, MOTHERFUCKER

510 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:41:44pm

re: #436 negativ


Sincere question from an atheist to observant Jews: How do you reconcile the God that sent plagues of frogs, flies, mosquitos, locusts, etc. against Pharaoh and even went so far as to kill all the firstborn children (who by definition had nothing to do with it), and enabled Moses to perform all sorts of magic tricks to get the Hebrews out of slavery, with the God who later on sat by and didn't do jack shit while the Nazis (wearing beltbuckles reading "Gott Mit Uns") inflicted far worse on their descendants?

From my perspective, and I don't know if I count as an observant Jew--quasi-observant, perhaps--the story of the Exodus is about a God who leads to freedom. I don't take the Biblical account literally, I take it as a tribal record of a group experience. I don't take miracles literally. I believe that this approach is entirely in keeping with a very old and authentic approach to Judaism. (And there's a reason we pour out wine at the seder when the Plagues are read.)

My mother taught me when I was a child, that God has no hands but ours, and in the case of the Shoah, those hands were ultimately those of boys from London and Iowa, who answered the call to fight for a better world.

I don't know why evil exists in the world. I hope to one day find out, although I have God on warning that I may not accept the answer.

Greek mythology is also about essential truths, BTW. The guy who teaches seventh grade religion at my school likes to tell the kids that there is a different between "The Bible is true", ie, there was a garden, and only two people in the world, and a snake, and "The Bible is truth", ie, we abandon God through disobedience. That's not my person interpretation of that passage, but I like the essential approach.

And he's got a degree in Catholic theology.

511 celticdragon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:41:49pm

re: #493 NJDhockeyfan

Obama can sign it and the GOP can't stop him.

If the GOP wanted the troops funded, they wouldn't put culture warfare riders on the bill to poison it.

They can put a clean bill to fund the troops forward any time they like, and it will be approved unanimously.

512 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:42:09pm

re: #496 Dark_Falcon

I don't believe that's a fact at all. And I'd like your source.

Will this do?


"Some of you might be thinking, "Wait, $30 billion in cuts sounds kind of familiar." That's because we've seen this figure before -- back in February, House Republican leaders had no intention of keeping their campaign promise, and instead proposed about $30 billion in cuts."


[Link: www.washingtonmonthly.com...]

513 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:42:14pm

re: #499 Obdicut

Dark, are you simply ignoring my question, or do you not have an answer for it?

I didn't give it any thought today. I was busy and worrying about money. I'll research it over the weekend.

514 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:42:24pm

re: #436 negativ

Religious people seem to create their own idea of what they want God to be.

Sincere question from an atheist to observant Jews: How do you reconcile the God that sent plagues of frogs, flies, mosquitos, locusts, etc. against Pharaoh and even went so far as to kill all the firstborn children (who by definition had nothing to do with it), and enabled Moses to perform all sorts of magic tricks to get the Hebrews out of slavery, with the God who later on sat by and didn't do jack shit while the Nazis (wearing beltbuckles reading "Gott Mit Uns") inflicted far worse on their descendants?

I can't understand why people can read the Bible and see that God as anything other than a purely malevolent figure. I can't understand how any modern person can read it and think that it has any closer relationship to reality than Jason and the Argonauts or Star Wars.

I'd like to be able to wrap my mind around that thinking, but I fail.

I'm not a Torah scholar, and there are a few on this board who can answer those questions far better than me. But as I see that particular story, the Pharaoh was evil and enslaved 100s of 1000s of people cruelly. So the plagues were meant to help stop it by empowering Moses. In the end, the people were freed.

There is quite a bit of discussion about some "proof" to the story, in that Vesuvius erupted sometime during the time period which, with a ensuing tsunami-type incident, could have caused many of those plagues and the parting of the Sea of Reeds.

But that still doesn't suffice because much of those stories are taken on faith of a greater thing outside ourselves and the idea of some wisdom behind it. And of course, as yet to be proven. Also, others don't believe the stories just as they're told, and liken them to parables to illustrate ideas. I do think they happened. I don't understand it completely because of my own lack of knowledge of the greater parts of our holy books, the deeper, more allegorical parts.

God is also merciful and I believe much more so than vengeful. Also, Judaism is not just a matter of blind faith, but following the law which deals with how we treat each other, the planet, animals, etc. The religion is based on charity, actually. Doing for otherwise to make the world a better place.

I don't know if that answers your question :)

515 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:42:44pm

re: #438 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

NPR and Planned Parenthood are pocket change, hell you could find enough money to fund them between the couch cushions at the Pentagon. .

I have to visit someone at the Pentagon, and see if I can sit on the couch.

//Basic point agreed, but even a little of that money would go a long way toward the student loans...

516 webevintage  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:42:49pm

The real sticking point in the Budget is not the budget (that much) but the policy riders that the House TEAGOP insist on.
You can see them:
[Link: www.ombwatch.org...]

517 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:43:07pm

re: #497 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Funny, that's not the way I remember it. I remember Boehner originally proposing $30 billion, then bumping it to $60 billion when the Tea Party made their "displeasure" unknown. And even then they were not happy, demanding the $100 billion they'd been promised.

That's how I remember it as well. Boener had to fight just to keep it at $61 billion.

518 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:43:18pm

re: #508 Decatur Deb

Too tired to find the link, but a libertarian commenter today (at Politico I think) said 100 billion was just for show, and that nothing less than 500B would do.

Exactly. Fantasy land.

519 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:43:32pm

re: #471 NJDhockeyfan

Yawn

I, for one, find your rebuttal resoundingly convincing.

520 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:43:50pm

re: #498 jamesfirecat

Sorry I think I misread you.

I thought you were saying that if he did it then Obama wouldn't "be accused of being an Imperial President ruling by fiat who's trying to turn America into a Military dictatorship."

I have no doubt that he can do it and I stand right along side you hoping that he does it.

I just expect the right wing to go crazy when he does it...

I would hope the President doesn't give a shit who is against it. It's the right thing to do and he should do it.

521 jaunte  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:43:53pm

re: #500 Gus 802

Based on the 80-20 rule of productivity, we could probably afford even deeper cuts, but only each departments' long-time insiders know where they can be made.

522 prairiefire  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:44:03pm

re: #514 marjoriemoon

I read it as a lesson in a Faithful God.

523 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:44:14pm

re: #504 NJDhockeyfan

Well they could have passed a budget bill and let the Republicans look bad by filibustering it. Why didn't they do it? No guts?

No desire to waste America's time.

524 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:44:27pm

I see. So that's the latest publicity stunt from the GOP. Just say, "if the Democrats don't sign on the American Taliban line then they won't be paying the troops!"

They're unpatriotic! Freedom fries! Down with the Dixie Chicks and Michael Moore!

Eleventy!

Yawn.

525 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:44:28pm

re: #511 celticdragon

CD, please check out the next thread in a few minutes. I'll be posting your D&D/LGF Crossover character, and I want to know what you think of it.

526 bratwurst  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:44:44pm

re: #432 Dark_Falcon

We came down from $61 Billion in cuts to around $40 Billion. Boener has signaled he'd go lower, but he needs to show he's following the party's priorities. and those are to take the cuts out of NPR and Planned Parenthood, not the Military.

Yes, removing those drops from the bucket is going to make a MASSIVE difference.

527 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:45:20pm

re: #510 SanFranciscoZionist

And what she said :)

528 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:45:31pm

re: #521 jaunte

Based on the 80-20 rule of productivity, we could probably afford even deeper cuts, but only each departments' long-time insiders know where they can be made.

It could probably be as simple as turning the thermostat either up or down. If we're talking just 1.59 percent.

529 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:46:19pm

re: #515 SanFranciscoZionist

I have to visit someone at the Pentagon, and see if I can sit on the couch.

//Basic point agreed, but even a little of that money would go a long way toward the student loans...

Our Pentagon-level program once asked for that 7,000,000 unfunded requirement be filled. The fiscal whiz came back: "7 million? That's 'budget dust'.

530 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:46:41pm

re: #504 NJDhockeyfan

Well they could have passed a budget bill and let the Republicans look bad by filibustering it. Why didn't they do it? No guts?

Guts? Guts? Have you MET the Democratic Party?

531 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:46:43pm

re: #519 negativ

I, for one, find your rebuttal resoundingly convincing.

Boring gibberish makes me tired.
;)

532 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:47:06pm

1.59 percent is probably within OMB statistical errors.

533 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:47:31pm

re: #524 Gus 802

I see. So that's the latest publicity stunt from the GOP. Just say, "if the Democrats don't sign on the American Taliban line then they won't be paying the troops!"

They're unpatriotic! Freedom fries! Down with the Dixie Chicks and Michael Moore!

Eleventy!

Yawn.

It's not just the troops caught in the lurch. My old man's doing contract work for the Coast Guard, working on their rescue choppers. He just informed today that, should the shutdown occur, he and all his buddies can expect to be handed furlough papers come Monday morning.

This isn't just about the troops, it's about a whole lot of government contractors, people who are not going to be able to put food on the table, pay their bills, or spend any money so long as this shutdown goes on. That's going to kick the economy in the jimmies and may put us back in a recession.

534 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:47:35pm

re: #522 prairiefire

I read it as a lesson in a Faithful God.

Yes indeed! At the Passover Seders I attend, we talk a lot about freedom and tie it back to modern times and all the causes of freedom for so many people.

535 jaunte  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:47:41pm

re: #532 Gus 802

What could we save if the Army quit painting rocks?

536 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:47:48pm

Well that's our budget.

Plus or minus 4-6 percent.

But we're cutting 2 percent.

;)

537 prairiefire  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:48:02pm

re: #510 SanFranciscoZionist

This is beautiful.
"My mother taught me when I was a child, that God has no hands but ours, and in the case of the Shoah, those hands were ultimately those of boys from London and Iowa, who answered the call to fight for a better world."

538 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:48:23pm

re: #535 jaunte

What could we save if the Army quit painting rocks?

And trees. And grass. They have a lot of green paint.

Just no more color copies.

//

539 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:49:14pm

re: #535 jaunte

What could we save if the Army quit painting rocks?

For a decade or so few soldiers have time to paint rocks, It was cheaper before we contracted it out.

540 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:50:26pm

re: #539 Decatur Deb

For a decade or so few soldiers have time to paint rocks, It was cheaper before we contracted it out.

Only Haliburton paints the rocks.

No blood for green paint!

//

541 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:50:57pm

re: #520 NJDhockeyfan

I would hope the President doesn't give a shit who is against it. It's the right thing to do and he should do it.

Sorry if I didn't say this, but I'm totally in agreement with you on this. Mind you, If someone wanted to be really nasty, they could argue that it would be unconstitutional for the President to perform any spending without the express permission of Congress.

No one had the gall to do it with Clinton, This time around, there might be some clowns out there who would be dumb enough to try that argument.

542 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:52:13pm

re: #537 prairiefire

This is beautiful.
"My mother taught me when I was a child, that God has no hands but ours, and in the case of the Shoah, those hands were ultimately those of boys from London and Iowa, who answered the call to fight for a better world."

Truly.

People complain they can't see God, but they don't know where to look.

543 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:52:44pm

re: #540 Gus 802

Only Haliburton paints the rocks.

No blood for green paint!

//

Haliburton only manages it through KBR, who award it to a host-nation affilliate, who pays the local terrorist's uncle the local rate to paint them.

544 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:57:10pm

re: #510 SanFranciscoZionist

My mother taught me when I was a child, that God has no hands but ours, and in the case of the Shoah, those hands were ultimately those of boys from London and Iowa, who answered the call to fight for a better world.

Beautifully put.

Someday, someone is going to look at my prayer book and wonder where all these marvelous things attributed to "SFZ" come from :)

545 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:57:10pm

re: #401 Dark_Falcon

Reid insists on trying to cut defense funding, even after Boener had agreed to the level of defense spending. Reid also refuses to allow the Republicans one of their high profile targets. If he'd defund NPR, I think we could get a deal. But as it is, we have him calling Boener a "hostage" while Chuckie Schumer and San Fran Nan takes turns saying that Paul Ryan wants to kill old people.

They don't want a deal, they want to blame and attack the GOP. They want to force Boener to use Democratic votes to pass the budget, in order to split the Republican Party.

Keep fighting for what you believe in.
I admire your stance on your beliefs.
Downdings, or no!

546 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 7:59:57pm

re: #510 SanFranciscoZionist

My mother taught me when I was a child, that God has no hands but ours, and in the case of the Shoah, those hands were ultimately those of boys from London and Iowa, who answered the call to fight for a better world.

That's a very short step from my own perspective which is that there is no heaven, hell, nor justice apart from that which we make for ourselves.

Greek mythology is also about essential truths, BTW. The guy who teaches seventh grade religion at my school likes to tell the kids that there is a different between "The Bible is true", ie, there was a garden, and only two people in the world, and a snake, and "The Bible is truth", ie, we abandon God through disobedience. That's not my person interpretation of that passage, but I like the essential approach.

As I'm sure you are aware, that perspective requires an awful lot of mental gymnastics that weren't available prior to the works of philosophers who were born centuries after the events of the Bible.

And he's got a degree in Catholic theology.

547 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:02:21pm

CD's character is up on the next thread! James, please also take a look and comment if you will.

548 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:03:00pm

re: #546 negativ


As I'm sure you are aware, that perspective requires an awful lot of mental gymnastics that weren't available prior to the works of philosophers who were born centuries after the events of the Bible.

But that's how the tradition works. As we change, we understand it in new and different ways. I have different theological needs than a Bronze Age tribeswoman herding sheep on Mt. Gilead. I see the world differently. Luckily, the tradition did not stop in the Bronze Age.

549 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:04:09pm

re: #524 Gus 802

I see. So that's the latest publicity stunt from the GOP. Just say, "if the Democrats don't sign on the American Taliban line then they won't be paying the troops!"

They're unpatriotic! Freedom fries! Down with the Dixie Chicks and Michael Moore!

Eleventy!

Yawn.

I get so sick of the TROOPS bullshit. No one else in this fucking country matters to the warmongers.

PULEEZE. Many many people will be affected. All our neighbors. All real Americans.

550 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:05:22pm

re: #530 SanFranciscoZionist

Guts? Guts? Have you MET the Democratic Party?

My FAVORITE FAVORITE.

551 freetoken  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:07:13pm

re: #548 SanFranciscoZionist

I have different theological needs than a Bronze Age tribeswoman herding sheep on Mt. Gilead.

I take it then that my idea to bring back the Asherah pole as a marketing gimmick might back fire?

552 Mr Pancakes  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:08:12pm

re: #511 celticdragon


I read on an earlier thread that you were from Yuciapa. My folks lived in Yuciapa for years and then moved to Calimesa. My sister lives in Redlands.... what a beautiful area with the San Gorgonio mountains in the background.

Ever been to Oak Glen?

553 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:08:37pm

re: #508 Decatur Deb

Too tired to find the link, but a libertarian commenter today (at Politico I think) said 100 billion was just for show, and that nothing less than 500B would do.

I'm way behind but the president proposed $3.7T in spending and that crazy eyed budget slashing proposal put out by ryan calls for $3.5T in '12.

554 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:08:39pm

re: #549 Stanley Sea

I get so sick of the TROOPS bullshit. No one else in this fucking country matters to the warmongers.

PULEEZE. Many many people will be affected. All our neighbors. All real Americans.

We could call it argumentum ad militarism or argumentum ad patriotism.

Yeah, I guess they forgot about the hero -- a way overused word since 911 -- part when they got to the first responders health care needs last year.

555 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:10:49pm

re: #553 RogueOne

I'm way behind but the president proposed $3.7T in spending and that crazy eyed budget slashing proposal put out by ryan calls for $3.5T in '12.

Yeah--this guy wanted half a trillion from this year's budget, basically an abdication.

556 jamesfirecat  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:11:06pm

re: #547 Dark_Falcon

CD's character is up on the next thread! James, please also take a look and comment if you will.

I really liked it Dark and would love to see you do one of me sometimes, sorry that I had to drag our fight in this thread over to that one, but I do think that you're mistaken about something important and need to be enlightened on the subject to realize who has done more giving in the current budget debate...

557 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:12:46pm

re: #549 Stanley Sea

I get so sick of the TROOPS bullshit. No one else in this fucking country matters to the warmongers.

PULEEZE. Many many people will be affected. All our neighbors. All real Americans.

Seriously? Do your neighbors get shot, deployed overseas for years, risk and lose life and limb in service to their country? We're talking about people who volunteered to be abused for years and we offered them not much more than a crappy paycheck and maybe we'll kick in for their college.

558 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:12:51pm

re: #546 negativ

At my grandad's 90th birthday (he passed in 2000 at 97), he and I took a walk after dinner and he started talking about death. It was really weird, because he never talked about it, but he said he was feeling ready.

He said he didn't believe in hell or rather that hell was living with her (pointing to the house and my grandmother), and laughed (his little joke), but that he hoped heaven would be a place where he could meet all the great minds that have passed and sit for eternity discussing philosophy and ideas. I thought that was pretty groovy.

559 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:14:12pm

re: #556 jamesfirecat

I really liked it Dark and would love to see you do one of me sometimes, sorry that I had to drag our fight in this thread over to that one, but I do think that you're mistaken about something important and need to be enlightened on the subject to realize who has done more giving in the current budget debate...

You'll get your in time, James. and yours will be immune to fire damage. And if you like it, put a ding on it.

560 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:15:05pm

re: #557 RogueOne

Yeah. Which makes the number of times the GOP has cut veteran's benefits during the Iraq war especially shameful.

But yes, there are federal employees who have jobs where they risk their lives. Like the smoke jumpers.

561 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:15:25pm

re: #557 RogueOne

Seriously? Do your neighbors get shot, deployed overseas for years, risk and lose life and limb in service to their country? We're talking about people who volunteered to be abused for years and we offered them not much more than a crappy paycheck and maybe we'll kick in for their college.

It's the MEME. The only regret the GOP has about people not getting paychecks is of course the military. Like I said before, so transparent.

562 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:16:05pm

re: #560 Obdicut

Yeah. Which makes the number of times the GOP has cut veteran's benefits during the Iraq war especially shameful.

But yes, there are federal employees who have jobs where they risk their lives. Like the smoke jumpers.

Transparent patriot bullshit.

563 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:16:22pm

re: #557 RogueOne

Seriously? Do your neighbors get shot, deployed overseas for years, risk and lose life and limb in service to their country? We're talking about people who volunteered to be abused for years and we offered them not much more than a crappy paycheck and maybe we'll kick in for their college.

Those damn warmongers!
//

564 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:17:56pm

re: #557 RogueOne

Seriously? Do your neighbors get shot, deployed overseas for years, risk and lose life and limb in service to their country? We're talking about people who volunteered to be abused for years and we offered them not much more than a crappy paycheck and maybe we'll kick in for their college.

That's not the point Sherlock. But yeah, go ahead and distort what Stanley Sea meant. It even fits the militarist pablum.

565 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:18:51pm

re: #558 marjoriemoon

At my grandad's 90th birthday (he passed in 2000 at 97), he and I took a walk after dinner and he started talking about death. It was really weird, because he never talked about it, but he said he was feeling ready.

He said he didn't believe in hell or rather that hell was living with her (pointing to the house and my grandmother), and laughed (his little joke), but that he hoped heaven would be a place where he could meet all the great minds that have passed and sit for eternity discussing philosophy and ideas. I thought that was pretty groovy.

I recommend checking out What Dreams May Come, the novel rather than the film. I found reading it gave me a much different viewpoint on the hereafter.

566 abolitionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:19:16pm

re: #558 marjoriemoon

Sounds like your granddad was a fan of Steve Allen's Meeting of the Minds.

567 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:20:46pm

re: #560 Obdicut

Yeah. Which makes the number of times the GOP has cut veteran's benefits during the Iraq war especially shameful.

But yes, there are federal employees who have jobs where they risk their lives. Like the smoke jumpers.

That would be a good argument if we were talking about veteran benefits but we're talking about 18-22 yr old kids who get paid shit every month and now we aren't going to be giving them anything. It's going to suck for every federal employee that doesn't get paid but the guys lowest on the totem pole (in terms of pay) are all wearing a military uniform and they don't have the option to check out and come back when it's all settled.

Smoke jumpers? (Really?) My guess is their on the essential list and they'll still be getting their pay.

568 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:22:06pm

re: #565 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I recommend checking out What Dreams May Come, the novel rather than the film. I found reading it gave me a much different viewpoint on the hereafter.

I will look into it!

569 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:22:46pm

re: #564 Gus 802

That's not the point Sherlock. But yeah, go ahead and distort what Stanley Sea meant. It even fits the militarist pablum.

The point was

"I get so sick of the TROOPS bullshit. No one else in this fucking country matters to the warmongers."

was ill considered and completely out of line.

How often do I get on someone around here? Rarely if ever, but that statement was crap.

570 What, me worry?  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:22:50pm

re: #566 abolitionist

Sounds like your granddad was a fan of Steve Allen's Meeting of the Minds.

Wow. I have no idea, but he if not, he sure would have enjoyed it.

571 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:23:20pm

re: #567 RogueOne

It's going to suck for every federal employee that doesn't get paid but the guys lowest on the totem pole (in terms of pay) are all wearing a military uniform and they don't have the option to check out and come back when it's all settled.

Yeah. So the GOP should stop sticking it's social conservative agenda into the fudnign for the military.

But I don't think they're going to, because the crazy social conservative agenda has finally taken over the GOP.

Yay.

572 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:23:42pm

re: #561 Stanley Sea

It's the MEME. The only regret the GOP has about people not getting paychecks is of course the military. Like I said before, so transparent.

Yeah, I hate to be a bit of a buzzkill, but the soldiers not getting their pay at this time is the least of my concerns. There's millions of federal employees, here in the States right now, who are gonna come to work on Monday morning and find that they've been furloughed for the duration.

If they're lucky, when the lights turn back on, they'll get some sort of compensation for the time lost. Otherwise that's money coming out of their pockets, money that's gonna mean less commerce, gonna mean bills not paid, gonna mean mortgages that might go into foreclosure. Too many people are living from paycheck to paycheck right now for the government to be putting them in limbo.

573 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:23:50pm

re: #569 RogueOne

The point was

was ill considered and completely out of line.

How often do I get on someone around here? Rarely if ever, but that statement was crap.

Bullshit.

574 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:24:12pm

re: #569 RogueOne

So you don't think that the GOP are just using the "But what about the troops?" as a transparent and cynical ploy?

If they care so much about the troops, why not drop the social conservative and anti-science cuts so that we can pay the troops?

575 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:25:01pm

re: #569 RogueOne

The point was

was ill considered and completely out of line.

How often do I get on someone around here? Rarely if ever, but that statement was crap.

Hello? Earth to base. By saying "the troops" she's talking about the chock full of hubris and populist laden bullshit that the Republicans keep trotting out. Not "the troops" themselves.

Now remind me of what was going on at Walter Reed Hospital while King George was president?

576 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:25:49pm

re: #575 Gus 802

Hello? Earth to base. By saying "the troops" she's talking about the chock full of hubris and populist laden bullshit that the Republicans keep trotting out. Not "the troops" themselves.

Now remind me of what was going on at Walter Reed Hospital while King George was president?

Thanks Gus and Obdi.

I get so sick of it, selective caring.

577 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:26:10pm

re: #567 RogueOne

That would be a good argument if we were talking about veteran benefits but we're talking about 18-22 yr old kids who get paid shit every month and now we aren't going to be giving them anything. It's going to suck for every federal employee that doesn't get paid but the guys lowest on the totem pole (in terms of pay) are all wearing a military uniform and they don't have the option to check out and come back when it's all settled.

Smoke jumpers? (Really?) My guess is their on the essential list and they'll still be getting their pay.

It usually took one or two weeks for clear information on the rules of a particular shutdown to hit the installation level. The problem isn't the immediate dollar cost as much as the tremendous chaos that follows. For example, what do you do with the 100,000 or so effected personnel (DoD, State, Law Enforcement) who are stationed overseas. The local landlord wants hois rent and the thousands of folks who are in a travel status are in limbo.

578 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:26:19pm

re: #574 Obdicut

Of course they are but so what? Clinton managed to get them their pay and so should Obama. He's the commander-in-chief, that's his job.

579 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:27:26pm

re: #575 Gus 802

Hello? Earth to base. By saying "the troops" she's talking about the chock full of hubris and populist laden bullshit that the Republicans keep trotting out. Not "the troops" themselves.

Now remind me of what was going on at Walter Reed Hospital while King George was president?

Another strawman, we aren't talking about walter reed. We're talking about people who are about to stop getting paid while they still have to dodge bullets.

580 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:27:31pm

re: #576 Stanley Sea

Thanks Gus and Obdi.

I get so sick of it, selective caring.

Well. As you can it's working. That's the Republican plan. Just pull out "the troops" card and you have all your bases covered. Say anything against the Republican budget now and "you hate the American troops!"

"You're either with us or against us." Same old neocon ploy they've been using since 9/11.

581 Talking Point Detective  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:27:48pm

re: #574 Obdicut

So you don't think that the GOP are just using the "But what about the troops?" as a transparent and cynical ploy?

Gee, I hadn't thought of that. I mean I know that Dems cynically exploit the military for political expediency, but it never occurred to me that maybe Republicans might do that.

/s

582 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:27:50pm

re: #578 RogueOne

Of course they are but so what? Clinton managed to get them their pay and so should Obama. He's the commander-in-chief, that's his job.

So then, why bring them up as a talking point? To rile up the Real American Patriots. Again, transparent as hell.

583 Obdicut  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:28:24pm

re: #578 RogueOne

Glad you agree it's stupid posturing by the GOP.

584 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:28:33pm

re: #578 RogueOne

Of course they are but so what? Clinton managed to get them their pay and so should Obama. He's the commander-in-chief, that's his job.

He's got some other responsibilities as well, ones he will not be able to carry out if he lets himself be held hostage by threats that Congress will take their ball and go home.

585 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:28:43pm

re: #578 RogueOne

Of course they are but so what? Clinton managed to get them their pay and so should Obama. He's the commander-in-chief, that's his job.

Got a great solution, think both sides can agree: Take Congress' pay and give it to the troops.

586 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:28:49pm

Duh-e.

587 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:29:22pm

re: #578 RogueOne

Of course they are but so what? Clinton managed to get them their pay and so should Obama. He's the commander-in-chief, that's his job.

Exactly. The President should also tell the Congress not to pay themselves until they pass a budget bill.

588 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:30:58pm

re: #584 SanFranciscoZionist

He's got some other responsibilities as well, ones he will not be able to carry out if he lets himself be held hostage by threats that Congress will take their ball and go home.

His first job is commander-in-chief. Sec. 2 Clause 1. He needs to find a way to get it done.

589 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:31:26pm

re: #585 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Got a great solution, think both sides can agree: Take Congress' pay and give it to the troops.

Win. I feel better now. Have a good nite people.

590 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:31:48pm

re: #588 RogueOne

His first job is commander-in-chief. Sec. 2 Clause 1. He needs to find a way to get it done.

Well hell, if anybody is allowed since he's CinC, then bring those troops home. If we can't afford to keep them over there, then they shouldn't be over there.

591 RogueOne  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:31:51pm

re: #587 NJDhockeyfan

Exactly. The President should also tell the Congress not to pay themselves until they pass a budget bill.

They aren't exactly "essential"

592 Talking Point Detective  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:32:21pm

A former student of mine works at the CDC. She was telling me how they're going to have to shut down everything they're working on - possibly they won't even be allowed to work from home.

The cynicism about the importance of governmental functions such as epidemiological research, vaccination programs, and the like, is a pathetic statement on the willingness of politicians to whatever under the bus to pander for votes.

593 Talking Point Detective  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:35:56pm

re: #588 RogueOne

His first job is commander-in-chief. Sec. 2 Clause 1. He needs to find a way to get it done.

I'm having some trouble figuring this out - you would blame him for not being able to resolve a problem that has come about as the result of politicians using the military for the purpose of political posturing. Why not point the finger at the politicians that created an unnecessary problem and then used it cynically to go after Obama?

Strange logic on that one.

594 Decatur Deb  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:37:39pm

'Nite, all.

596 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:43:33pm

re: #592 Talking Point Detective

A former student of mine works at the CDC. She was telling me how they're going to have to shut down everything they're working on - possibly they won't even be allowed to work from home.

The cynicism about the importance of governmental functions such as epidemiological research, vaccination programs, and the like, is a pathetic statement on the willingness of politicians to whatever under the bus to pander for votes.

A government shutdown also means no tax refunds get processed. Why does the GOP hate taxpayers?

598 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:48:35pm

Fucking A.

599 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:50:23pm

Gotta love the GOP. If you're a fetus or a soldier overseas, you're golden. But the moment you leave the womb or get discharged, you're SOL.

600 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:51:33pm

re: #599 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Gotta love the GOP. If you're a fetus or a soldier overseas, you're golden. But the moment you leave the womb or get discharged, you're SOL.

Precisely.

601 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:52:20pm

re: #599 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Gotta love the GOP. If you're a fetus or a soldier overseas, you're golden. But the moment you leave the womb or get discharged, you're SOL.

I don't know about golden. When Iraq began, people were having goddamn bake sales to buy body armor for the guys we were sending overseas.

I like brownies as much as the next person, but HELL, if it was to be had, pray tell why we couldn't buy it as a nation and get a freaking bulk discount?

602 Stanghazi  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:53:57pm

re: #601 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't know about golden. When Iraq began, people were having goddamn bake sales to buy body armor for the guys we were sending overseas.

I like brownies as much as the next person, but HELL, if it was to be had, pray tell why we couldn't buy it as a nation and get a freaking bulk discount?

Thus the hypocrisy.

603 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:54:35pm

re: #601 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't know about golden. When Iraq began, people were having goddamn bake sales to buy body armor for the guys we were sending overseas.

I like brownies as much as the next person, but HELL, if it was to be had, pray tell why we couldn't buy it as a nation and get a freaking bulk discount?

Come now, don't you remember the words of Saint Rummy, who told us that you go to war with the military have, not the one you want? So what if we were sending them into harms way with old body armor, thin-skinned Humvees, and weapons built by the lowest bidder? Damnit, we couldn't wait any longer to kick Saddam's ass!

//

604 Lidane  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:54:48pm

I'm in a good mood so I won't say what I think about these primitive, inbred, ignorant assholes.

Fuck these people.

605 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:55:19pm

re: #601 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't know about golden. When Iraq began, people were having goddamn bake sales to buy body armor for the guys we were sending overseas.

I like brownies as much as the next person, but HELL, if it was to be had, pray tell why we couldn't buy it as a nation and get a freaking bulk discount?

Body armor? We didn't need any body armor because a) we'd be welcome with open arms and b) we were only looking for WMDs.

//

606 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 8:57:04pm

And we didn't even touch on how these very same politicians feel about gays in the military.

607 Targetpractice  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 9:00:44pm

re: #606 Gus 802

And we didn't even touch on how these very same politicians feel about gays in the military.

You mean the ones currently shitting a brick because the expected apocalypse has, in fact, not happened? The ones who, even as the Joint Chiefs say that there's been no outbreak on the battlefield of homophobia, believe that this is a "travesty" that has befallen our boys in uniform?

Yeah, I got a few choice words for them, but bein' this is polite company, I won't utter them.

608 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 9:00:56pm

re: #601 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't know about golden. When Iraq began, people were having goddamn bake sales to buy body armor for the guys we were sending overseas.

I like brownies as much as the next person, but HELL, if it was to be had, pray tell why we couldn't buy it as a nation and get a freaking bulk discount?

See "No End in Sight".

609 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 9:02:05pm

re: #605 Gus 802

Body armor? We didn't need any body armor because a) we'd be welcome with open arms and b) we were only looking for WMDs.

//

You go to war with the army you have. Some of these suggestions are good ones; maybe we'll use them in the next war.

610 Gus  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 9:04:12pm

re: #609 negativ

You go to war with the army you have. Some of these suggestions are good ones; maybe we'll use them in the next war.

Shit happens. I'm not really blaming the Republicans for that. If anything the Pentagon should have known better. Rumsfeld was terrible and Gates was a massive improvement.

611 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 9:26:53pm

re: #603 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Come now, don't you remember the words of Saint Rummy, who told us that you go to war with the military have, not the one you want? So what if we were sending them into harms way with old body armor, thin-skinned Humvees, and weapons built by the lowest bidder? Damnit, we couldn't wait any longer to kick Saddam's ass!

//

I recall.

'You're giving aid and comfort to the couch!'

612 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Apr 7, 2011 9:29:07pm

re: #611 SanFranciscoZionist

LOL!
Couching your comfort.
What a joy!
///

613 theheat  Fri, Apr 8, 2011 12:16:02am

If we as a nation are supposed to believe that everything that happens, happens because of events being personally orchestrated the One True Christian God™, by that same rationale, I'd like to hold the One True Christian God™ accountable for all the unthinkably heinous and stupid shit that happens by divine orchestration.

In fact, I'd like to kick his ass for it. Maybe a class action lawsuit. Let's try him at the Hague. Let's sue for unanswered prayers. How about all the mental anguish caused by gravity and the tides?
//

Knife cuts both ways, dumbasses.

Sick to fucking death of an infantile attribution to scripture being suggested to replace rational thought.

614 S'latch  Fri, Apr 8, 2011 8:48:22am

I am praying that G-d does not make my life into a wonder example of difficulty, tragedy, or circumstantial horror.


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