Pat Robertson’s Murky Lesbian Fantasy

Wait. What?
Wingnuts • Views: 35,329

Pat Robertson has figured out why the left is so “livid” about killing babies: because they want to make straight women more like lesbians.

I’m not making this up.

Youtube Video

Meeuwsen: There are lots of government-funded agencies in this country. Why do you think the President picked that one above all else to say, ‘not one penny’?

Robertson: Well it’s the left; it’s this culture of death. The far-left is livid about killing babies. They want to kill do this, they want to destroy. You go back, and I don’t want to play all this psychological stuff but nevertheless, if a woman is a lesbian, what advantage does she have over a married woman? Or what deficiency does she have?

Meeuwsen: Well she can’t have children.

Robertson: That’s exactly right. And so if these married women don’t have children, if they abort their babies, then that kind of puts them on a level playing field. And you say, nobody’s there to express that? Isn’t that shocking, well think about it a little bit ladies and gentlemen.

Jump to bottom

743 comments
1 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:29:23pm

I love pat so much, he's the gift that's been giving for 50 years.

2 Killgore Trout  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:29:39pm

Lamest lesbian fantasy ever.

3 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:30:27pm

Wait, what?

4 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:30:43pm

I'm almost inclined at this point to chalk this up to senile dementia, because that's the only way it makes the least bit of sense.

5 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:30:58pm

I'd like to think he's just gone senile, but he's always been messed up in the head.

6 Mocking Jay  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:31:57pm

No comprende.

7 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:32:22pm

I think we'll need to go the judges for that response

Youtube Video
8 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:33:07pm

Most of the lesbians I know have kids.

9 Mocking Jay  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:33:08pm

re: #7 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I knew that was the link before I even clicked on it.

10 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:33:44pm

Off topic, but I accidentally found a site that is talking about the stolen antiquities in Egypt. Here it is.

11 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:33:46pm

re: #8 SanFranciscoZionist

Most of the lesbians I know have kids.

BUT HOW!?!?
/

12 Lidane  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:33:54pm

Oh, Pat. You're as delusional as always. HAHAHA!

Anyone who thinks a lesbian can't have children is an idiot.

13 jaunte  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:34:13pm

How bizarre.
"Think about it a little bit, ladies and gentlemen."

14 elisabeth  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:34:21pm

Hey, Pat, some Lefty women can't have babies for medical reasons so, "fuck you." Seriously, fuck you.

I'm tired of these intolerant assholes making assumptions about what "lefties" think or want.

15 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:34:26pm

Pat needs to be mounted on a wall somewhere over a fireplace....a relic

16 Mocking Jay  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:34:44pm

re: #8 SanFranciscoZionist

Most of the lesbians I know have kids.

Fucking lesbians, how do they reproduce?

17 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:35:26pm

re: #13 jaunte

How bizarre.
"Think about it a little bit, ladies and gentlemen."

If they would actually think for a little bit, Pat wouldn't have an audience.

18 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:35:42pm

re: #16 JasonA

Fucking lesbians, how do they reproduce?

College.

19 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:36:17pm

Lesbians can't have babies.

//

Best one liner I've heard in years.

20 HappyWarrior  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:36:21pm

Why, he's no different from the Taliban. Fuck Pat Robertson. I am sick of this dick.

21 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:36:22pm

re: #16 JasonA

Fucking lesbians, how do they reproduce?

I wonder that about politicians

22 uncah91  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:36:27pm

Think about it ...

We don't like killing fetuses
We don't like lesbians
We don't like liberals

Therefore they are all the same thing.

/my brain hurts

23 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:36:32pm

re: #13 jaunte

How bizarre.
"Think about it a little bit, ladies and gentlemen."

Thinking being exactly what Pat Robertson does not do.

24 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:36:56pm

By Pat's own "logic," infertile women are at the same level on the "playing field" as lesbians. I'm sure that they'll be thrilled to hear that. *rolls eyes*

25 uncah91  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:37:03pm

re: #16 JasonA

Fucking lesbians, how do they reproduce?

You can't explain that.

26 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:37:22pm

re: #25 uncah91

You can't explain that.

Magnets

27 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:37:39pm

re: #8 SanFranciscoZionist

Most of the lesbians I know have kids.

Witchcraft.

28 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:37:43pm

re: #26 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Magnets

Friction

29 Mocking Jay  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:37:54pm

re: #25 uncah91

You can't explain that.

Miracles, all around us...

30 jaunte  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:38:24pm

Looking at his projection suggests that Pat's a dog in the manger.

31 HappyWarrior  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:38:28pm

Needs to be pointed out that this is the same man who said we deserved 9-11 because we tolerate gays/lesbians and abortion. He's always been a miserable human being.

32 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:38:31pm

re: #28 albusteve

Friction

Sweaty oily friction.

33 uncah91  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:38:37pm

re: #28 albusteve

Friction

Lesbians plus friction = ?

34 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:38:52pm

re: #11 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

BUT HOW!?!?
/

Funny you should ask that. My father was once talking up Roberta Achtenberg to a friend of his when she was running for mayor of San Francisco. He pointed out to his somewhat cranky and not-too-enthused-about-lesbians friend that she was a good family values candidate--she had a son!

"Oh yeah? How'd she get him?" this gentleman snarled.

"Irv," my father replied, "You're a doctor. Are you really asking me where babies come from?"

35 Killgore Trout  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:38:55pm

re: #6 JasonA

No comprende.

It's like this with more Jesus....

Youtube Video
36 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:38:58pm

re: #29 JasonA

Miracles, all around us...

Yeah, it's a miracle that Pat has dodged the Grim Reaper this long.

37 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:39:14pm

Pat Pat
mo Mat
fanananana fo fat
etc

38 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:39:25pm

re: #32 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Sweaty oily friction.

...I'll be in my bunk.

/

39 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:39:55pm

re: #26 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Magnets

Then can we just have the Insane Clown Posse beat Pat into bean paste?

/kidding

40 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:40:10pm

re: #24 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

By Pat's own "logic," infertile women are at the same level on the "playing field" as lesbians. I'm sure that they'll be thrilled to hear that. *rolls eyes*

A woman's social status, in Pat's mind, is based on her reproductive abilities.

41 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:41:00pm

Fucking magnets uterus. How do they work? -- Pat Robertson

42 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:41:04pm

re: #33 uncah91

Lesbians plus friction = ?

Well, an old term for 'lesbian' was 'fricatrice'.

43 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:41:13pm

Give me that old time religion.

44 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:41:28pm

regardless, I would drink with Pat Pat
what a hoot
he can't be all bad, can he?

45 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:41:47pm

re: #39 Dark_Falcon

Juggalos need/deserve their own country >

46 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:41:48pm

re: #40 SanFranciscoZionist

A woman's social status, in Pat's mind, is based on her reproductive abilities.

So he's a Nietzschean now?

47 HappyWarrior  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:42:01pm

Before my parents moved, one of my youngest brother's good friends was the child of a lesbian couple. The kid as I recall was well behaved and his parents loved him very much. I am thinking that Pat didn't get too much love from his daddy, an old time segregationist who got elected here using race baiting.

48 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:42:09pm

re: #44 albusteve

regardless, I would drink with Pat Pat
what a hoot
he can't be all bad, can he?

He and Hunter S Thompson were good friends for quite a while. I think it all went bad tho'

49 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:42:18pm

re: #40 SanFranciscoZionist

A woman's social status, in Pat's mind, is based on her reproductive abilities.

Don't be silly, I'm sure he factors in their sammich making skills.

50 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:42:29pm

re: #43 Stanley Sea

Give me that old time religion.

Which "old time"? The Dark Ages?

This fossil should be sent off to the tar pits with the rest of the dinosaurs.

51 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:42:51pm

re: #41 Gus 802

Fucking magnets uterus. How do they work? -- Pat Robertson

You called?

52 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:43:11pm

The uterus. How did it get there? -- Bill O'Reilly

53 engineer cat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:43:12pm

livid

what a peculiar word

1. Discolored, as from a bruise; black-and-blue.
2. Ashen or pallid: "a face livid with shock."
3. Extremely angry; furious.

[Middle English livide, from Old French, from Latin lividus, from livere, to be bluish; see slei- in Indo-European roots.]

54 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:43:27pm

Parody is dead.

55 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:43:38pm

re: #48 windsagio

He and Hunter S Thompson were good friends for quite a while. I think it all went bad tho'

Crap, wrong pat, I was thinking Pat Buchanon.

Also Robertson's never been elected to anything.

56 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:44:22pm

re: #50 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Which "old time"? The Dark Ages?

This fossil should be sent off to the tar pits with the rest of the dinosaurs.

Actually, Pat's brother Larry was the only caveman dumb enough to fall into the tarpits.

/ And now you know the rest of the story. :D

57 HappyWarrior  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:44:36pm

re: #55 windsagio

Crap, wrong pat, I was thinking Pat Buchanon.

Also Robertson's never been elected to anything.

His father was a senator here in Virginia. Huge part of the Byrd Machine.

58 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:44:52pm

I'm still wondering how that woman seated next to him could have come up with that suggestion and with a straight face.

59 Simply Sarah  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:44:58pm

re: #55 windsagio

Crap, wrong pat, I was thinking Pat Buchanon.

Also Robertson's never been elected to anything.

I was gonna say, I don't see Hunter S and Robertson having had even the most remote chance of not hating each other.

60 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:44:59pm

is he related to Oral Robertson?...I think so

61 uncah91  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:45:44pm

re: #58 Gus 802

straight face.


get it?

62 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:46:03pm

re: #56 Dark_Falcon

Actually, Pat's brother Larry was the only caveman dumb enough to fall into the tarpits.

/ And now you know the rest of the story. :D

Paul Harvey!
2pts

63 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:46:18pm

re: #52 Gus 802

The uterus. How did it get there? -- Bill O'Reilly

This is not my beautiful house. -- David Byrne

64 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:46:35pm

re: #60 albusteve

is he related to Oral Robertson?...I think so

Or to Fundamentally Oral Bill

65 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:46:54pm

re: #12 Lidane

Oh, Pat. You're as delusional as always. HAHAHA!

Anyone who thinks a lesbian can't have children is an idiot.

I hear science is getting better and better at working on figuring out how to make faux sperm based on bone marrow/blood samples.

Face it guys, we males are only going to be "obsolete" before we ring in the 22nd century...

66 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:47:28pm

re: #60 albusteve

is he related to Oral Robertson?...I think so

Did they meet at the Santorum?

/

67 Simply Sarah  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:47:59pm

re: #65 jamesfirecat

I hear science is getting better and better at working on figuring out how to make faux sperm based on bone marrow/blood samples.

Face it guys, we males are only going to be "obsolete" before we ring in the 22nd century...

Nah. You guys have your uses. We'll probably keep you around for a bit.

68 elisabeth  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:48:26pm

re: #65 jamesfirecat

Nah ~ there will always be pest control.

69 SpaceJesus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:48:49pm

lol

70 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:50:09pm

re: #65 jamesfirecat

I hear science is getting better and better at working on figuring out how to make faux sperm based on bone marrow/blood samples.

Face it guys, we males are only going to be "obsolete" before we ring in the 22nd century...

We'll build robots to do all the menial stuff, they'll learn how to maintain, repair, redesign, and build themselves. We're done.

71 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:50:10pm

re: #67 Simply Sarah

Nah. You guys have your uses. We'll probably keep you around for a bit.

go clean the house while I invent duct tape

72 kreyagg  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:50:20pm

re: #38 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

...I'll be in my bunk.

/

Updinged for Firefly ref!
And it is official , the default browser for the HTC Incredible is not compatible with the comments portion of the site.

73 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:50:34pm

re: #67 Simply Sarah

Nah. You guys have your uses. We'll probably keep you around for a bit.

Yeah, somebody has to be wrong, after all.

0.5x /

74 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:50:57pm

re: #67 Simply Sarah

Nah. You guys have your uses. We'll probably keep you around for a bit.

Pack mules for shopping trips?

75 jaunte  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:51:25pm

re: #73 negativ

I was told there would be no sarcastic math.

76 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:52:31pm

re: #74 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Pack mules for shopping trips?

not me

Youtube Video
77 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:52:35pm

Who cares. Males are redundant anyway. Just wait till science starts fusing two eggs from lesbian couples. Explodey head time.

78 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:52:57pm

re: #67 Simply Sarah

Nah. You guys have your uses. We'll probably keep you around for a bit.

"Birds these days think that blokes are only good for two things, and the other one is mending the electricity."

79 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:53:26pm

Twitter genius responds!

@Gus_802 LOL, Funny && True

80 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:53:32pm

re: #77 prononymous

Who cares. Males are redundant anyway. Just wait till science starts fusing two eggs from lesbian couples. Explodey head time.

Then watch as they can't change a car's oil.
And those female robots can't either.
/MUHAHAHAHA!

81 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:53:49pm

A dweeb is born every minute. -- PT Gus

82 Mocking Jay  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:54:50pm

re: #72 kreyagg

Updinged for Firefly ref!
And it is official , the default browser for the HTC Incredible is not compatible with the comments portion of the site.

Try Dolphin HD.

83 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:56:07pm

re: #80 Varek Raith

Then watch as they can't change a car's oil.
And those female robots can't either.
/MUHAHAHAHA!

[snicker]

84 albusteve  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:56:25pm

Tumblin Dice
men suck

Youtube Video
85 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:56:25pm

I Tweeted this to #medicine. Thought they might want to take a look at it.

//

86 Simply Sarah  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:57:06pm

re: #80 Varek Raith

Then watch as they can't change a car's oil.
And those female robots can't either.
/MUHAHAHAHA!

Oh please. Women "change the oil" about once a month.

87 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 7:57:19pm

re: #80 Varek Raith

Then watch as they can't change a car's oil.
And those female robots can't either.
/MUHAHAHAHA!

Come now, it'll be a virtual utopia...until they have to kill a spider...or a cockroach.

88 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:00:16pm

I have killed the thread. Bow before my power!

/

89 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:01:02pm

re: #87 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Come now, it'll be a virtual utopia...until they have to kill a spider...or a cockroach.

"No can dunk. But have good fundamentals, and that what people want to watch."

90 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:01:10pm

I don't understand what these peoples problem with lesbians is. They have made some of the best porn ever!

///

91 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:02:40pm

re: #80 Varek Raith

Then watch as they can't change a car's oil.
And those female robots can't either.
/MUHAHAHAHA!

Cars are redundant too.

Youtube Video
92 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:02:43pm

Pat Robertson, you dried up old Klan Cyclops

You wouldn't know a culture of death if it emptied your bowels with a drop-C riff

Youtube Video
93 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:03:17pm

re: #88 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I have killed the thread. Bow before my power!

/

the thread is now...

Youtube Video
94 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:03:47pm

re: #88 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I have killed the thread. Bow before my power!

/

Its not quite dead yet.

95 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:04:06pm

still one of the most important metal bands ever

Youtube Video
96 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:04:09pm

re: #92 WindUpBird

That's a visual I don't need.

97 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:06:32pm

re: #96 Dark_Falcon

That's a visual I don't need.

just close your eyes and listen to the music


Imagine Pat Robertson receding into the background as he finally shuffles off this mortal coil, gets to the afterlife, and figures out he's in a cosmic jail for evil fossils, serenaded by all the members of Death, from their iconic technical death metal album Human, for eternity

have fun, pat!

98 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:07:03pm

Off topic, but does anyone know where I can find information on the Ethnic Breakdown of Afghanistan by Province? It's for a project I'm doing.

99 jaunte  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:09:23pm

re: #98 ProLifeLiberal

How much info do you need? Here's a map with some notes:
[Link: afghanistan.foreignpolicyblogs.com...]

100 Achilles Tang  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:09:44pm

re: #98 ProLifeLiberal

Off topic, but does anyone know where I can find information on the Ethnic Breakdown of Afghanistan by Province? It's for a project I'm doing.

They're all broken down.//

101 Killgore Trout  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:09:52pm

Careful With That Axe Eugene

Youtube Video
102 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:10:40pm

re: #97 WindUpBird

just close your eyes and listen to the music

Imagine Pat Robertson receding into the background as he finally shuffles off this mortal coil, gets to the afterlife, and figures out he's in a cosmic jail for evil fossils, serenaded by all the members of Death, from their iconic technical death metal album Human, for eternity

have fun, pat!

I still don't really get it. I guess its just me. [shrugs]

Sorry I'm lurking, I'm painting minis tonight.

103 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:12:58pm

re: #99 jaunte

Need numbers, estimates okay, for the make up this province. I'm doing a project for GIS, and want to show two things.

1: The diversity of Afghanistan
2: The fact that, for everything we can do in Afghanistan, there is one thing that the US can't fix that Soviets broke-A sense of national unity (to a point) and its soul.

104 jaunte  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:14:36pm

re: #103 ProLifeLiberal

Here's a page that alludes to that, with some bibliography attached:

Afghanistan is not a self-contained ethnic unit, nor is its national culture uniform. Few of its ethnic groups are totally indigenous: The number of Paṧtūn who live in Pakistan’s tribal agencies and North-West Frontier Province is almost equal to the number of those who are Afghan citizens.
[Link: www.iranica.com...]
105 jaunte  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:16:08pm

re: #103 ProLifeLiberal

This is interesting:

Moḡol. Language: Darī, incorporating much Mongol vocabulary; some southern Moḡol speak Paṧtō. They are basically Mongoloid, but occasional Mediterranean admixture occurs. Several thousand are scattered throughout central and north Afghanistan as highland agriculturalists and transhumants. They were originally concentrated in Ḡōr province, their dispersion occurring at least 125 years ago; they may be descended from troops that accompanied Genghis Khan.
[Link: www.iranica.com...]
106 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:16:31pm

re: #92 WindUpBird

Pat Robertson, you dried up old Klan Cyclops

You wouldn't know a culture of death if it emptied your bowels with a drop-C riff

[Video]

I was expecting a scene from Bubba Ho-Tep.

107 jaunte  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:18:20pm

re: #103 ProLifeLiberal

Ah, here's good one: Library of Congress:
[Link: lcweb2.loc.gov...]

108 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:18:35pm

re: #103 ProLifeLiberal

Need numbers, estimates okay, for the make up this province. I'm doing a project for GIS, and want to show two things.

1: The diversity of Afghanistan
2: The fact that, for everything we can do in Afghanistan, there is one thing that the US can't fix that Soviets broke-A sense of national unity (to a point) and its soul.

Uhh...

2: never existed, there is no "national unity," they have NEVER had a national government except under short (comparatively considering their history) stints of occupation. It is a tribal society based on clans, much more so than religion. If anything uniting against the Soviets and to a lesser extant against us have made then leave off the tribal warfare to concentrate on a larger threat.

109 Iwouldprefernotto  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:21:10pm

time for some DADA

A friend of Pat Robertson says I’m going to hell
for falling in love as far as I can tell
Something ’bout miracles and wishing wells
and saving babies

Great song.

110 shiplord kirel  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:21:29pm

Picking the wackiest televangelist is kind of like selecting the ugliest warthog but I think this is the single most deranged thing I have ever heard from any of them. It's right up there with evolution being motivated being a plot to promote illicit sex.

111 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:22:06pm

re: #108 ausador

Things weren't great before the Soviets, but the nation wasn't nearly this shattered and fragmented before that war.

112 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:22:57pm

Just FYI for those following our Wisconsin entertainments.

Two recall efforts against Democratic Senators official failed today.
[Link: host.madison.com...]

We now have 5 recalls against Republican Senators pending.
We now have 3 recalls against Democratic Senators pending.
There are 3 recall petitions outstanding against Republican Senators (one is expected to be turned in tomorrow)
There are 3 recall petitions outstanding against Democratic Senators.

As the saying goes, we live in interesting times.

113 theheat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:24:30pm

I hope Pat's gay male fantasies are better than his lesbian fantasies, because his lesbian fantasies are pretty tepid.

114 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:24:30pm

re: #108 ausador

Uhh...

2: never existed, there is no "national unity," they have NEVER had a national government except under short (comparatively considering their history) stints of occupation. It is a tribal society based on clans, much more so than religion. If anything uniting against the Soviets and to a lesser extant against us have made then leave off the tribal warfare to concentrate on a larger threat.

Based on my own reading, I'd have to agree with this. The 1970's in Afganistan was an aberration that is unlikely to happen again anytime soon.

115 jaunte  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:24:32pm

re: #109 Iwouldprefernotto

time for some DADA

A friend of Pat Robertson says I’m going to hell
for falling in love as far as I can tell
Something ’bout miracles and wishing wells
and saving babies

Great song.

Live at Joes Bar in Chicago, IL

Youtube Video
116 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:26:02pm

re: #112 wlewisiii

It's kind of fascinating watching everything disintigrate.

117 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:26:05pm

re: #108 ausador

Uhh...

2: never existed, there is no "national unity," they have NEVER had a national government except under short (comparatively considering their history) stints of occupation. It is a tribal society based on clans, much more so than religion. If anything uniting against the Soviets and to a lesser extant against us have made then leave off the tribal warfare to concentrate on a larger threat.

Actually, we're really only fighting the Pashtuns. Other tribes like the Tajiks don't have a major problem with us.

118 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:28:13pm

re: #117 Dark_Falcon

That's basically correct. The Pashtuns are the largest group in the nation, but only at 37-42% of total population. The other groups will cooperate against the Pashtun. And then the Pashtuns have an issue.

119 dragonfire1981  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:28:21pm

re: #43 Stanley Sea

Give me that old time religion.

Just take those holy bibles off the shelf,
I like to sit and read them by myself,
Todays women have just got to go,
I miss that old time all male control.

Call me a relic call me what you will,
You know I truly hate that birth control pill,
Now those women want abortions? Oh no!
I miss that old time all male control.

120 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:28:32pm

re: #111 ProLifeLiberal

Things weren't great before the Soviets, but the nation wasn't nearly this shattered and fragmented before that war.

When was that? After they were created artificially as a nation after WWI under British rule when the old Turkish/Ottoman empire was partitioned? Or perhaps after the British left and the government changed about as often as the direction the wind was blowing?

At what point in recorded history did Afghanistan actually have a stable and unified government/population?

121 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:29:15pm

re: #120 ausador

When was that? After they were created artificially as a nation after WWI under British rule when the old Turkish/Ottoman empire was partitioned? Or perhaps after the British left and the government changed about as often as the direction the wind was blowing?

At what point in recorded history did Afghanistan actually have a stable and unified government/population?

Alexander the Great?

122 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:30:53pm

re: #102 Dark_Falcon

metal, you either feel it or ya don't

123 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:31:21pm

re: #112 wlewisiii

Just FYI for those following our Wisconsin entertainments.

Two recall efforts against Democratic Senators official failed today.
[Link: host.madison.com...]

We now have 5 recalls against Republican Senators pending.
We now have 3 recalls against Democratic Senators pending.
There are 3 recall petitions outstanding against Republican Senators (one is expected to be turned in tomorrow)
There are 3 recall petitions outstanding against Democratic Senators.

As the saying goes, we live in interesting times.

TOTAL RECALL!


Recall, recall, recallll

124 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:33:12pm

re: #121 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Alexander the Great?

Nope. Alexander devastated Afghanistan, as did Ghangis Khan. Both controlled the area by means of mass slaughter. The Soviets tried that to a good extend, but the evolution in agriculture that his reached even remote villages meant that by the 1970's Afghanistan had far more people than it had in the past. So the same murder totals in raw numbers no longer had the same effect.

125 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:35:32pm

drudge headlines about the mcdonalds incident refuse to mention the Tg nature of the crime

Gosh, I wonder why 9_9

126 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:36:00pm

re: #121 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Alexander the Great?

2: never existed, there is no "national unity," they have NEVER had a national government except under short (comparatively considering their history) stints of occupation.

I thought I had that covered already? Considering that Alexander was a Persian Occupier.

127 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:36:39pm

re: #126 ausador

I thought I had that covered already? Considering that Alexander was a Persian Occupier.

Persian?

128 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:36:40pm

re: #121 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

At one point, Afghanistan was powerful enough to control not just of all its own territory, but also most of Pakistan and a chunk of Iran. That was the Durrani Empire, which ended about 200 years ago. And the country never fully fell to any of the colonial powers, something only Iran accomplished.

129 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:36:45pm

re: #125 WindUpBird

drudge headlines about the mcdonalds incident refuse to mention the Tg nature of the crime

Gosh, I wonder why 9_9

Ignoring inconvenient facts is every American's god given right.

130 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:37:01pm

re: #125 WindUpBird

drudge headlines about the mcdonalds incident refuse to mention the Tg nature of the crime

Gosh, I wonder why 9_9

This is why.

131 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:37:43pm

re: #127 windsagio

Alexander may not have been Persian, but several times, Afghanistan has been occupied by various Iranian dynasties.

132 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:38:16pm

re: #131 ProLifeLiberal

Alexander may not have been Persian, but several times, Afghanistan has been occupied by various Iranian dynasties.

True enough, was just a weird/confusing thing to say >

133 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:39:14pm

re: #123 WindUpBird

TOTAL RECALL!

Recall, recall, recalll

That will be in January 2012 when Scooter hits 365 days in office and petitions can legally circulate. It will be interesting to see what happens then. And I believe that will be determined by what happens in these earlier recalls.

If the State Senate flips and is a road block to his further goals, I think he'll palin out like the moral coward that he is. Even if he doesn't quit, I doubt people will bother with recalling him since he'll be unable to advance anything.

OTOH, if things play out with a smaller but still Republican majority, I would be willing to bet on a recall effort that would be just barely less, shall we say, intense than the one started recently in Benghazi :O_o: ?

134 Ojoe  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:39:34pm

Somebody post that life of brian scene where the guy wants to have babies.

135 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:40:54pm

re: #134 Ojoe

Somebody post that life of brian scene where the guy wants to have babies.

I don't do requests.

136 CuriousLurker  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:41:24pm

Hi, everyone. I can't stay long, but I couldn't resist this one.

I see the underlying theme now: Liberal Envy

The Left, meaning anyone more liberal than Michelle Bachmann, is envious of what the Right has and wants to deprive them of it.

Lesbians are envious of Real Women™ and want to kill their babies.

Gays are envious of straight people and want to destroy their institution of Real Marriage™.

Secularists, Atheists, Muslims, liberal Jews, etc. are envious of their piety & righteousness and want to stop them from practicing the One True Religion™, evangelical Christianity.

Minorities & immigrants are envious of their status as the WASP standard bearers of Real American Culture™ and want to pollute it with their inferior races & cultures.

Liberal women are envious of Real Women™ and want to stop them from being the chaste & obedient foundation of the family. They want to make them promiscuous & uppity in order to undermine the Real Family™, which is naturally headed by Real Men™ (the way God intended). Like lesbians, they also want to kill babies.

Poor people are envious of their financial success and want to steal the money they make because they are too lazy to do Real Work™ and think they’re entitled to hand-outs from the government. They need to be more patient and wait for people to feel like giving charity. If no one feels like giving charity, then they should beg for it in a humble manner suitable to their lowly station in life.

Liberals are actually socialists/communists who are envious of the freedoms granted by the Real U.S. Constitution™ (the one God wrote based on the Bible, not the neutered secular one). They want to tear it down and, with the help of their Islamist pals in the Muslim Brotherhood, replace it with Sharia or….something un-American.

Did I miss anything? //

137 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:42:31pm

re: #136 CuriousLurker

can't say you missed it, but its exactly the same as how white men are the most truly disenfranchised class of them all.

138 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:42:35pm

re: #134 Ojoe

Somebody post that life of brian scene where the guy wants to have babies.

Youtube Video
139 CuriousLurker  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:43:37pm

re: #137 windsagio

Hey, Windy! Good to see you back. ;o)

140 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:43:51pm

And I've finished painting my Lineholder for Saturday's game. It's not perfect, but its decent and I hold my gaming group likes the work.

141 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:45:33pm

re: #140 Dark_Falcon

And I've finished painting my Lineholder for Saturday's game. It's not perfect, but its decent and I hold my gaming group likes the work.

What techniques did you use?

142 kreyagg  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:45:40pm

re: #82 JasonA

Try Dolphin HD.

I do use Dolphin but Tweetdeck launches the default browser...

143 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:45:57pm

re: #133 wlewisiii

That will be in January 2012 when Scooter hits 365 days in office and petitions can legally circulate. It will be interesting to see what happens then. And I believe that will be determined by what happens in these earlier recalls.

If the State Senate flips and is a road block to his further goals, I think he'll palin out like the moral coward that he is. Even if he doesn't quit, I doubt people will bother with recalling him since he'll be unable to advance anything.

OTOH, if things play out with a smaller but still Republican majority, I would be willing to bet on a recall effort that would be just barely less, shall we say, intense than the one started recently in Benghazi :O_o: ?

I doubt it. I think the Dems gain two seats and lose one. Walker easily survives a petition drive that fails to gain the needed number of signatures, having mended fences in the meantime. The teacher's union in busted and the quality of education in Wisconsin improves.

144 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:46:23pm

re: #127 windsagio

Persian?

Ok sorry, he just used Persian muscle for his central asian conquests, once he gained control of Persia, I tend to Identify him as Persian and with Persia, as did quite a few of his detractors at the time, my bad.

145 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:46:50pm

More right place-right time music

Youtube Video

Totally unrelated to any subject, but wonderful.

Also hi curious, long time :P

146 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:47:24pm

re: #143 Dark_Falcon

I doubt it. I think the Dems gain two seats and lose one. Walker easily survives a petition drive that fails to gain the needed number of signatures, having mended fences in the meantime. The teacher's union in busted and the quality of education in Wisconsin improves.

How will he mend fences exactly Dark?

And what about all those other unions in Wisconsin?

Are all of them just as bad for the service they provide as the teacher's union?

147 Iwouldprefernotto  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:47:25pm

re: #143 Dark_Falcon

I doubt it. I think the Dems gain two seats and lose one. Walker easily survives a petition drive that fails to gain the needed number of signatures, having mended fences in the meantime. The teacher's union in busted and the quality of education in Wisconsin improves.

How does paying teachers less improve education?

148 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:47:41pm

What is apple doing selling apps for people trying to stalk the Twilight star, Jesus Christ

During his promo stop for “Water for Elephants” at The Ellen DeGeneres Show, Robbert Pattinson of the “Twilight” fame did not hide the fact that he thought the iPhone application called “Where is Robert” is “terrifying.”

Amping up the creepy factor, the app would actually allow fans to get information on his whereabouts by creating a forum. And did we say fans would actually be the ones suppling “real–time location intelligence” for the forum?

When DeGeneres asked him how it works—noting, “Someone says, ‘He’s here’ and then they show up...?’”—the actor said, “I don’t know, but I hope that’s not the case.”

Released in January 2010, the app has been described on iTunes as such: “Over 1000 fan submitted pictures! Where is Robert Pattinson right now? Get location news about Robert and find out with this fan app. Get notifications from other fans when he moves!” It sells of $0.99.

Apparently, there are several versions of the app for celebrities like Justin Bieber, Adam Lambert and Lady Gaga, to name a few. All apps were created by a seller listed as Tim Shephard. Techo-stalking, anyone?

149 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:48:45pm

re: #141 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

What techniques did you use?

Reaper Uniform Brown and Games Workshop Skull White. Standard brushes fort he main work and fine detail brushes for the finishing touches. Easy coating in not-too-thick layers, needing two coats. The color scheme being used for the Lineholder and Grand Crusader (a name even the Inquisitors could accept) is brown limbs and a white head and torso.

150 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:48:45pm

re: #148 WindUpBird

What is apple doing selling apps for people trying to stalk the Twilight star, Jesus Christ

Apple's Evil, we've been over this.

151 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:48:51pm

re: #148 WindUpBird

I wonder if there's an app for how to find cocaine dealers

maybe there's app to instruct you how to kidnap an 8 year old

The Dark Future! it's here, we're living it, Soylent Green, Silent Running, eat your hearts out

152 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:48:55pm

re: #147 Iwouldprefernotto

How does paying teachers less improve education?

///It frees up government money to spend elsewhere, and it makes your child's private education a better investment due to the deteriorating value public education.

Education "Improved!" So long as you're rich at least...

153 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:49:13pm

re: #150 windsagio

Apple's Evil, we've been over this.

hahahahahaha

Man, our iphone developer friends


they've seen the eye of sauron, they have :D

154 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:49:46pm

re: #153 WindUpBird

hahahahahaha

Man, our iphone developer friends

they've seen the eye of sauron, they have :D

hahaha ;D

There are starting to be a number of apps that use your GPS chip in various ways.

MARK OF THE BEAST!

155 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:50:17pm

re: #151 WindUpBird

I wonder if there's an app for how to find cocaine dealers

maybe there's app to instruct you how to kidnap an 8 year old

The Dark Future! it's here, we're living it, Soylent Green, Silent Running, eat your hearts out

Wanna rob a bank? There's an app for that!

Want to build a death ray? There's an app for that!

Want to take over the world? There's an app for that!

156 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:51:28pm

re: #150 windsagio

I mean, i'm sure Google doens't care either!

But Apple runs their own store, you'd think maaaaaybe they'd want to avoid liability. They axed that "shaken baby" app, and that was just like 3 lines of novelty code


But encouraging people to commit felonies in an app, that's getting national attention and is horrifying the actor himself, yowsa yowsa

157 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:51:32pm

re: #117 Dark_Falcon

Actually, we're really only fighting the Pashtuns. Other tribes like the Tajiks don't have a major problem with us.

A family friend is married to a Tadjik.

This is apropos of absolutely nothing.

158 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:51:48pm

re: #154 windsagio

hahaha ;D

There are starting to be a number of apps that use your GPS chip in various ways.

MARK OF THE BEAST!

As for me, I'm on the Devil's side, because it's more fun to watch

159 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:52:17pm

re: #155 jamesfirecat

Wanna rob a bank? There's an app for that!

Want to build a death ray? There's an app for that!

Want to take over the world? There's an app for that!

want to carve up a couple cheerleaders in the woods and bake them into a stew? Your recipe is one click away! :D

160 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:53:06pm

re: #159 WindUpBird

want to carve up a couple cheerleaders in the woods and bake them into a stew? Your recipe is one click away! :D

Oh christ, somebody with an iphone go see if there's a 'cop avoiding app'.

The technology is there already! Imagine using that on the freeway >

161 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:53:59pm

re: #143 Dark_Falcon

The teacher's union in busted and the quality of education in Wisconsin improves is decimated.

Alas, DF. I feel I fixed that for you.

162 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:54:13pm

re: #149 Dark_Falcon

Reaper Uniform Brown and Games Workshop Skull White. Standard brushes fort he main work and fine detail brushes for the finishing touches. Easy coating in not-too-thick layers, needing two coats. The color scheme being used for the Lineholder and Grand Crusader (a name even the Inquisitors could accept) is brown limbs and a white head and torso.

What did you use for a primer? white or black?

Personally, I've found a black primer looks best for armored units, fills in the recessed regions nicely. Using a light brown wash fills in gaps nicely and give it a slightly weathered look, especially on light paints. Dry brushing raised areas with a dark metallic paint also brings out some nice details.

163 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:55:23pm

re: #160 windsagio

Oh christ, somebody with an iphone go see if there's a 'cop avoiding app'.

The technology is there already! Imagine using that on the freeway >

Oh there totally is, as of last month [Link: www.macnn.com...]

This sorta social experiment with easily coded and sold apps on massively powerful portable devices that can connect to anywhere on earth

fascinating. I love it when laws are like five beats behind technology, it's like cops are bewildered, going "WHAT? Can they levitate now? Are they sorcerers? The hell!"

164 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:56:46pm

re: #160 windsagio

Oh christ, somebody with an iphone go see if there's a 'cop avoiding app'.

The technology is there already! Imagine using that on the freeway >

not only is it a cop avoiding app

it's a DRUNK DRIVING CHECKPOINT AVOIDING APP

165 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:56:50pm

re: #157 SanFranciscoZionist

A family friend is married to a Tadjik.

This is apropos of absolutely nothing.

Late last year I spoke to a Tadjik gentleman whose family fled Afghanistan as refugees in the late 1970's and now own a firm that is a reconstruction contractor in Afghanistan. Excellent fellow, and it was great to hear his projects and ideas. He had very strong words about Karzai and his circle, calling them "The Corruption Crew".

166 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:57:15pm

re: #165 Dark_Falcon

Late last year I spoke to a Tadjik gentleman whose family fled Afghanistan as refugees in the late 1970's and now own a firm that is a reconstruction contractor in Afghanistan. Excellent fellow, and it was great to hear his projects and ideas. He had very strong words about Karzai and his circle, calling them "The Corruption Crew".

Karzai is our oil man

167 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:57:30pm

Transgender - Putting the T back in LGBT

Youtube Video

From "The Peach." Mongo have crush on "The Peach".

168 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:58:01pm

re: #143 Dark_Falcon

I doubt it. I think the Dems gain two seats and lose one. Walker easily survives a petition drive that fails to gain the needed number of signatures, having mended fences in the meantime. The teacher's union in busted and the quality of education in Wisconsin improves.

Dark, serious question here...

We can all agree that a union job with collective bargaining over wages, benefits and so on is better than a union job without those things, or a non union job, maybe too good at times, but we can agree it is on average better....

Thus wouldn't any teacher with an interest in getting rewarded for their hard work going to flee Wisconsin to get a job in a state where they can still be a part of a union that will support them?

Do you not see that happening, and if you do how does this improve education?

169 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:58:22pm

re: #162 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

What did you use for a primer? white or black?

Personally, I've found a black primer looks best for armored units, fills in the recessed regions nicely. Using a light brown wash fills in gaps nicely and give it a slightly weathered look, especially on light paints. Dry brushing raised areas with a dark metallic paint also brings out some nice details.

Grey primer. The Grand Crusader was already primed when I got it, and I primer the Lineholder grey as well. I don't use washes much, do to lack of work space.

170 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:58:45pm

re: #167 Gus 802

there's always been push and pull with TG folks being the underdogs in LGBT groups, it gets kinda ugly :P

171 shiplord kirel  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:59:06pm

re: #120 ausador

When was that? After they were created artificially as a nation after WWI under British rule when the old Turkish/Ottoman empire was partitioned? Or perhaps after the British left and the government changed about as often as the direction the wind was blowing?

At what point in recorded history did Afghanistan actually have a stable and unified government/population?

Afghanistan? You have it confused with a different country, perhaps Iraq or Jordan. Afghanistan was never part of the Ottomon Empire. It had existed as a united and internationally recognized nation-state since at least the 18th century. Afghanistan was neutral during World War 1 and was not part of any post-war partition or re-alignment. The last king of Afghanistan, Mohammed Zahir Shah, was a member of the Barakzai dynasty that had ruled the country since 1826.

172 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 8:59:29pm

re: #168 jamesfirecat

I'm still painting, James. I can't closely debate right now. I'm only posting during pauses.

173 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:00:04pm

re: #169 Dark_Falcon

Grey primer. The Grand Crusader was already primed when I got it, and I primer the Lineholder grey as well. I don't use washes much, do to lack of work space.

Washes are easy. All you need is a brush and some water.

174 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:00:07pm

re: #170 WindUpBird

there's always been push and pull with TG folks being the underdogs in LGBT groups, it gets kinda ugly :P

Yeah. Most people aren't aware of the "inner battles" within the LGBT "community". It's gotten better though over the years.

175 CuriousLurker  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:00:09pm

re: #157 SanFranciscoZionist

A family friend is married to a Tadjik.

This is apropos of absolutely nothing.

I've known several Pathans. They'll never give up or give in. Their code of Pukhtunwali (Word doc) is their first loyalty—it comes before God, country, everything.

176 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:00:30pm

ok anyways time to get ready for work, I thought I'd leave you all with what I've been doing lately

Youtube Video
177 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:01:04pm

re: #174 Gus 802

Yeah. Most people aren't aware of the "inner battles" within the LGBT "community". It's gotten better though over the years.

my old blog, when I was really just a vessel for flamewars *_* One of the biggies was a multi-blog skirmish about the Human Rights Campaign and whether they were anti-trans

I was the political realist, so EVERYONE was mad at me :/

178 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:03:05pm

re: #177 WindUpBird

my old blog, when I was really just a vessel for flamewars *_* One of the biggies was a multi-blog skirmish about the Human Rights Campaign and whether they were anti-trans

I was the political realist, so EVERYONE was mad at me :/

ok one more. I'll blow the classy exit to say this;

I still believe that a lot of the people in those old discussions who claimed to be TG really weren't :p

179 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:03:24pm

re: #172 Dark_Falcon

I'm still painting, James. I can't closely debate right now. I'm only posting during pauses.

Sorry Dark, it's just you know that given how (let me say it again) MY FATHER, MY MOTHER, AND MY BROTHER all belong to a PUBLIC SECTOR UNIONS in fact my mom IS A MEMBER OF A TEACHERS UNION! (she's a network systems admin but she works in a high school and so) I don't much care to listen to you talking about how she's a part of an organization that's a greedy leach on state funds rather than necessary staple for insuring the middle class keeps getting paid enough to still be the middle class.

180 CuriousLurker  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:04:25pm

Gotta run. Have a nice night, lizards.

181 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:04:50pm

re: #180 CuriousLurker

Gotta run. Have a nice night, lizards.

Later CL. Hope you feel better after... you know.

182 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:05:20pm

re: #143 Dark_Falcon

The teacher's union in busted and the quality of education in Wisconsin improves.

The anti-union bill is under a restraining order and won't be ruled on until the end of May at the earliest. Considering the lies and blatant deception it was passed under and how blatantly unconstitutional it is I wouldn't count on it ever going into effect.

183 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:05:23pm

re: #178 windsagio

ok one more. I'll blow the classy exit to say this;

I still believe that a lot of the people in those old discussions who claimed to be TG really weren't :p

haha I am not getting into that, that shit got ugly and was one of the reasons I lost my taste for blogging, it was just making me mad and making my friends mad for no reason

184 Digital Display  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:05:30pm

Halftime.. OKC vs. Denver Looking for a sweep but the Thunder is making to many jump shots and missing....Should be a great 2nd half.. I hope

185 CuriousLurker  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:05:30pm

Thanks {{Gus}}.

186 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:05:31pm

re: #180 CuriousLurker

cheers CL

187 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:05:51pm

re: #185 CuriousLurker

Thanks {{Gus}}.

{{CL}}

188 3CPO  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:07:19pm

Wow. All these years using various contraceptives, when all I really needed to do was become a lesbian. Who knew?

189 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:07:48pm

re: #177 WindUpBird

my old blog, when I was really just a vessel for flamewars *_* One of the biggies was a multi-blog skirmish about the Human Rights Campaign and whether they were anti-trans

I was the political realist, so EVERYONE was mad at me :/

You know it's pretty ironic (I know it's an overused word) considering what was part of what led to Stonewall.

190 CuriousLurker  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:08:36pm

re: #186 WindUpBird

cheers CL

re: #187 Gus 802

{{CL}}

BTW, before I leave—WindUpBird, I sent you an email form a different account today, so it might end up in your spam folder.

Man I love you guys.

~~~Gone~~~

191 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:09:02pm

re: #179 jamesfirecat

Sorry Dark, it's just you know that given how (let me say it again) MY FATHER, MY MOTHER, AND MY BROTHER all belong to a PUBLIC SECTOR UNIONS in fact my mom IS A MEMBER OF A TEACHERS UNION! (she's a network systems admin but she works in a high school and so) I don't much care to listen to you talking about how she's a part of an organization that's a greedy leach on state funds rather than necessary staple for insuring the middle class keeps getting paid enough to still be the middle class.

I am pro union forever

because the corruption in the Republican party is more evil, more cancerous, more sick, more vile, more a danger to America itself than any union

Unions don't call for the heads of minorities, unions don't tell women they have to be sexually violated and intimidated into silence for medical procedures

192 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:11:39pm

re: #189 Gus 802

You know it's pretty ironic (I know it's an overused word) considering what was part of what led to Stonewall.

yeah i know

Stonmewall CAME UP


EVERYTHING came up, I just sorta stumbled into this fireworks factory of repressed resentment and fury, trans people versus mainstream gay people. have nots versus haves.

This was the wrong side of the tracks of the internet. It got to the point where every fifth comment on that thread would have been the equivalent of a bannable offense on LGF

There's a reason I don't blog anymore. it's not worth the heartache. There's a reason my only political discussions are here. getting into arguments with people who actually know me, in my own online communities, it's like me taking a crap in my refrigerator

193 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:13:37pm

re: #191 WindUpBird

we need a real labor movement in America, one with teeth, not this weak cowering shit we have now

we have nothing of the sort, the pigs are trying to create a servant class, and by and large they've already done it

194 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:14:07pm

re: #182 goddamnedfrank

The anti-union bill is under a restraining order and won't be ruled on until the end of May at the earliest. Considering the lies and blatant deception it was passed under and how blatantly unconstitutional it is I wouldn't count on it ever going into effect.

It violates the Constitution not at all. There's no right to collective bargaining to be found there.

195 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:15:19pm

re: #194 Dark_Falcon

It violates the Constitution not at all. There's no right to collective bargaining to be found there.

I'm pretty sure it violates the state constitution on the grounds of how it was passed without proper forewarning Dark....

(But I stand ready to be corrected on this...)

196 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:17:06pm

re: #179 jamesfirecat

Sorry Dark, it's just you know that given how (let me say it again) MY FATHER, MY MOTHER, AND MY BROTHER all belong to a PUBLIC SECTOR UNIONS in fact my mom IS A MEMBER OF A TEACHERS UNION! (she's a network systems admin but she works in a high school and so) I don't much care to listen to you talking about how she's a part of an organization that's a greedy leach on state funds rather than necessary staple for insuring the middle class keeps getting paid enough to still be the middle class.

Let's not start basing arguments on defense of family / familial loyalty, I can't stand it when Dark pulls that stunt and I'm not interested in hearing it from people I agree with. The fact is that unions can be defended in principle, feel free to get pissed but be smart about it, openly relying on personal references and emotion doesn't make for a strong argument.

197 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:17:10pm

re: #195 jamesfirecat

Wisconsin smells like a flashpoint

We need flashpoints. We're dumb cows these days, we need some more real anger

198 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:17:24pm

re: #194 Dark_Falcon

It violates the Constitution not at all. There's no right to collective bargaining to be found there.

Interesting. There is freedom of association. But here's the gig too. There is no prohibition of collective bargaining in the constitution either. There are plenty of rights not defined in the constitution.

199 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:17:34pm

re: #197 WindUpBird

Wisconsin smells like a flashpoint

We need flashpoints. We're dumb cows these days, we need some more real anger

Or more cowbells.
;)

200 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:18:33pm

re: #195 jamesfirecat

I'm pretty sure it violates the state constitution on the grounds of how it was passed without proper forewarning Dark...

(But I stand ready to be corrected on this...)

So the State senate should have just waited while the demos continued to not show up and summoned a unionist mob again. The Dems had acted in bad faith, and had tried to disrupt legislative proceedings. The hurry-up vote was on their heads. Had they not acted in bad faith it would not have been needed.

201 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:19:15pm

re: #196 goddamnedfrank

We have a center-right party (Democrats) and a nativist racist party (republicans as they stand now)

We need a real left wing, a labor left wing, a real push towards socialism. of course it won't succeed, but we need the POV

202 engineer cat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:19:40pm

re: #143 Dark_Falcon

I doubt it. I think the Dems gain two seats and lose one. Walker easily survives a petition drive that fails to gain the needed number of signatures, having mended fences in the meantime. The teacher's union in busted and the quality of education in Wisconsin improves.

and water will flow upward

seriously, dark - you know how the republican party was talking in 2010 about how the democratic party had overreached and misread its mandate?

i think the republican party is going to find out what that feels like, in spades

203 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:19:41pm

re: #199 Varek Raith

Or more cowbells.
;)

haha sorry dude, I'm serious about this

204 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:20:10pm

re: #203 WindUpBird

haha sorry dude, I'm serious about this

I know.
:)

205 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:20:19pm

re: #202 engineer dog

I hope the Republican Party feels a lot worse than that

it's now become a cancer, it's now just naked horror and evil

206 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:20:48pm

re: #198 Gus 802

Interesting. There is freedom of association. But here's the gig too. There is no prohibition of collective bargaining in the constitution either. There are plenty of rights not defined in the constitution.

A 9th Amendment argument? Interesting. Normally those don't get too far in court.

207 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:20:49pm

re: #201 WindUpBird

We have a center-right party (Democrats) and a nativist racist party (republicans as they stand now)

We need a real left wing, a labor left wing, a real push towards socialism. of course it won't succeed, but we need the POV

Makes my head hurt the way Americans are so stuck on Democrats and Republicans. And the only other option is typically, bleh, Libertarians who are only Republicans that smoke pot. ;)

208 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:21:12pm

at what point do people say that

A party advocating that women be raped in order to have an abortion, is evil?

209 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:21:24pm

re: #196 goddamnedfrank

Let's not start basing arguments on defense of family / familial loyalty, I can't stand it when Dark pulls that stunt and I'm not interested in hearing it from people I agree with. The fact is that unions can be defended in principle, feel free to get pissed but be smart about it, openly relying on personal references and emotion doesn't make for a strong argument.

For me its not just about family, (though that does make it personal)

But the one of the main real reason I support unions is this chart....

[Link: money.cnn.com...]

Correlation does not imply causation, but I don't know anyone who would argue that people get better compensation on average if they aren't part of a union than if they are part of one....

Right now, when there are charts like this, you'd be a fool not to support something like unions which are a tried and tested way of putting more power in the hands of the middle class...

210 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:21:29pm

re: #200 Dark_Falcon

So the State senate should have just waited while the demos continued to not show up and summoned a unionist mob again. The Dems had acted in bad faith, and had tried to disrupt legislative proceedings. The hurry-up vote was on their heads. Had they not acted in bad faith it would not have been needed.

Uh no, they only had to wait 24 hours from posting the bill before holding the vote, which is what the state constitution says. But thanks for playing.

211 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:21:59pm

re: #207 Gus 802

Makes my head hurt the way Americans are so stuck on Democrats and Republicans. And the only other option is typically, bleh, Libertarians who are only Republicans that smoke pot. ;)

the game is rigged!

people are sheep, people are easily led

I just put all the frustration into art

If I'm ever rich, the people I'd donate to would make any conservative pee themselves, hah

212 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:22:32pm

re: #200 Dark_Falcon

So the State senate should have just waited while the demos continued to not show up and summoned a unionist mob again. The Dems had acted in bad faith, and had tried to disrupt legislative proceedings. The hurry-up vote was on their heads. Had they not acted in bad faith it would not have been needed.

How did they act in bad faith Dark?

I think you've got this mixed up.

Scott Walker was the one who said on a phone call that he'd invite the Dem's back and say that he'd be willing to compromise, then once they were in the building lock the doors and have them counted as present while passing his bill.

Now THAT IS ACTING IN BAD FAITH

213 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:23:25pm

re: #207 Gus 802

Makes my head hurt the way Americans are so stuck on Democrats and Republicans. And the only other option is typically, bleh, Libertarians who are only Republicans that smoke pot. ;)

Libertarians are not a movement or a party

Libertarian 'thought" is the equivalent of a temper tantrum for alienated loners who gave up, its just damaged personalities who want revenge

214 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:23:39pm

re: #211 WindUpBird

the game is rigged!

people are sheep, people are easily led

I just put all the frustration into art

If I'm ever rich, the people I'd donate to would make any conservative pee themselves, hah

I need to get another PRS Custom 22 right. I've been guitarless for years! Years! Argh. Used to draw a lot but then I got hooked on the computer stuff. But nothing beat the guitar for expressing my rage or whatever it was I was feeling.

215 Iwouldprefernotto  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:23:57pm

re: #200 Dark_Falcon

So the State senate should have just waited while the demos continued to not show up and summoned a unionist mob again. The Dems had acted in bad faith, and had tried to disrupt legislative proceedings. The hurry-up vote was on their heads. Had they not acted in bad faith it would not have been needed.

Hey Dark,

Is it possible for you to use the word "union" without the word mob (or thugs)?????

We are talking about working folks here. They had days and days of protests without violence. It's your right to have an opinion, but please keep to the facts.

PS. Mayor Bloomberg has been quoted as saying the unions are NOT the problem with New York City. (A city with more people than the entire state of WI.) You can blame the unions all you want, but the facts don't support the case.

216 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:24:01pm

re: #194 Dark_Falcon

It violates the Constitution not at all. There's no right to collective bargaining to be found there.

It violates the State Constitution to have the reconciliation committee draft a compromise bill that has no basis in a full Senate vote.

217 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:24:37pm

WUB spent 15 years in a place that desperately desperately needed a union, it turns bizarrely evil. And this was a charitable organization!

218 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:25:37pm

Hey. Take apart the unions? How about we take apart the oil company influence first? Oh right. People are happy to pay 4 bucks a gallon every 3 years. Yeah. That's cheap compared to world wide prices but most people have to drive in the USA.

219 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:25:44pm

re: #214 Gus 802

I need to get another PRS Custom 22 right. I've been guitarless for years! Years! Argh. Used to draw a lot but then I got hooked on the computer stuff. But nothing beat the guitar for expressing my rage or whatever it was I was feeling.

I have.. a shitty epiphone and an Ibanez EX bass I bought for fifty bucks from my brother :D And OH YES guitar is great for rage. As are drums! I turn the lights off, plug into my Line 6 Pod (Best guitar tone for $100 you'll ever hear) get the nastiest doom metal tone I can muster, tune to drop D, and just rock for an hour or three

PRS guitars are heaven on earth, Jim Matheos of OSI/fates warning plays one

220 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:26:00pm

re: #215 Iwouldprefernotto

He misspoke anyways, its SEIU thugs.

221 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:26:16pm

Who ripped off America more? Public unions of mortgage companies? Who caused the meltdown of 2008?

222 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:26:48pm

re: #221 Gus 802

Who ripped off America more? Public unions of mortgage companies? Who caused the meltdown of 2008?

SOCIALISM AND 9/11!!!

223 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:26:55pm

re: #221 Gus 802

Who ripped off America more? Public unions of mortgage companies? Who caused the meltdown of 2008?

Barney Frank!

///

224 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:26:55pm

re: #200 Dark_Falcon

So the State senate should have just waited while the demos continued to not show up and summoned a unionist mob again. The Dems had acted in bad faith, and had tried to disrupt legislative proceedings. The hurry-up vote was on their heads. Had they not acted in bad faith it would not have been needed.

Also... Dark, do not you support the right of legislative bodies to establish their own rules?


Because if you do support that right, please explain to me why they include rules about quorums being needed for important budget votes if not so that situations like this could take place?

The last time people fled their state to avoid one of those votes was in Texas while Bush was President.

They had plenty of time to change their rules if they didn't want to have something like this happen legally.

But they didn't...

It sucks when you have a majority but need a super majority, but hey we're a Republic not a Democracy.

225 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:26:55pm

We're still going through this crap since 2008. And what about ENRON? And what about the Savings and Loan meltdown?

226 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:27:05pm

re: #217 windsagio

WUB spent 15 years in a place that desperately desperately needed a union, it turns bizarrely evil. And this was a charitable organization!

yep!

The abuse that went on in that place, made windy cry, made me throw a chair out a window

I wish i was fucking kidding

I smashed about three phones over the years at that place

I once stacked up all the furniture in the kitchen, all the tables and chairs, and did a spin kick at the whole pile

I was so furious

if my evil abusive boss had come in at that moment, i'd probably have punched her teeth in, and I would have gone to jail

227 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:27:56pm

re: #217 windsagio

Ah, memories.

228 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:28:22pm

re: #215 Iwouldprefernotto

I seldom use the word 'thugs' when talking about unions and 'mob' only when describing the goings on in Madison. But given the hostility of those crowds, their trying to prevent a vote was a real possibility. Given that, I think the hurry-up vote justified.

229 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:28:27pm

re: #223 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Barney Frank!

///

Jimmy Carter, Fannie and Freddie and those people in the "inner city" that got those easy loans because it was mandated to them by people running banks with masters in black studies!!11ty

//Wingnut

230 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:29:07pm

re: #217 windsagio

remember when i called our little-old-lady-liar boss a liar to her face? that staff meeting in 98 or so? the Opera incident? They had no idea how to deal with me. i screamed at the top of my lungs at her

Good times!

231 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:29:29pm

OOPS!

232 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:29:33pm

re: #225 Gus 802

We're still going through this crap since 2008. And what about ENRON? And what about the Savings and Loan meltdown?

In a better country, those Enron guys would have been

Well, they would be worse off than they are :)

233 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:29:49pm

re: #228 Dark_Falcon

I seldom use the word 'thugs' when talking about unions and 'mob' only when describing the goings on in Madison. But given the hostility of those crowds, their trying to prevent a vote was a real possibility. Given that, I think the hurry-up vote justified.

How did the Dem's act in bad faith Dark?

You still haven't answered that question?

(Sorry I Know that everyone is piling on you at the moment but I really want an answer to this...)

234 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:29:52pm

re: #228 Dark_Falcon

I seldom use the word 'thugs' when talking about unions and 'mob' only when describing the goings on in Madison. But given the hostility of those crowds, their trying to prevent a vote was a real possibility. Given that, I think the hurry-up vote justified.

Except the "hurry-up vote" was in violation of the state constitution.

235 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:29:58pm

re: #229 Gus 802

Jimmy Carter, Fannie and Freddie and those people in the "inner city" that got those easy loans because it was mandated to them by people running banks with masters in black studies!!11ty

//Wingnut

KKK talking point!

236 Iwouldprefernotto  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:30:16pm

re: #228 Dark_Falcon

I seldom use the word 'thugs' when talking about unions and 'mob' only when describing the goings on in Madison. But given the hostility of those crowds, their trying to prevent a vote was a real possibility. Given that, I think the hurry-up vote justified.

the point is not whether it was "justified," the hurry up vote violated the laws of the state of WI. Walker is not above the law (although he often acts like he is).

237 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:30:25pm

Pffft. We even have black budgets. Black as in Homeland Fatherland Security crap.

238 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:30:39pm

re: #222 windsagio

SOCIALISM AND 9/11!!!

9/11 gave Bin Laden more than he could have dreamed of

we played right into his hands

Now we're fucked in afghanistan, collapsing under the weight of our own hubris

239 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:31:02pm

re: #236 Iwouldprefernotto

the point is not whether it was "justified," the hurry up vote violated the laws of the state of WI. Walker is not above the law (although he often acts like he is).

everyone in power is as above the law as he can be

240 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:31:12pm

re: #231 Gus 802

OOPS!

Hey, you're focusing on the wrong thing! It's Medicare and Social Security that are drivin' this country into the ground!

///

241 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:31:17pm

re: #235 WindUpBird

KKK talking point!

I watered it down. Whew. You should have seen what I had all thought up. I'll save that for my live performance. ;) I even do several American dialects.

242 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:31:31pm

re: #240 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Hey, you're focusing on the wrong thing! It's Medicare and Social Security that are drivin' this country into the ground!

///

hahahahaha

243 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:31:38pm

re: #230 WindUpBird

remember when i called our little-old-lady-liar boss a liar to her face? that staff meeting in 98 or so? the Opera incident? They had no idea how to deal with me. i screamed at the top of my lungs at her

Good times!

I do! I also remember being forced to stay at work for over 24 hours straight at least twice!

244 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:31:52pm

re: #241 Gus 802

I watered it down. Whew. You should have seen what I had all thought up. I'll save that for my live performance. ;) I even do several American dialects.

You need to go on tour, do an Ivan Stang Ha Ha Only serious thing :D

245 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:32:22pm

I'm pretty tired of being objectified by MEN talking about women as a homogenius group.

I am a person, all by myself. Just me. I can make decision about my own personal decisions, Thank you.

I don't need to be lumped in to a group, given a label and then have my decisions made for me.

I'll be just fine, JUST LEAVE ME ALONE.

And how are you-all tonite?

246 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:32:45pm

re: #243 windsagio

But seriously, unions = evil. Totally unneccesary. Companies would never exploit their employees or make a dangerous working environment.

247 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:32:49pm

re: #228 Dark_Falcon

I seldom use the word 'thugs' when talking about unions and 'mob' only when describing the goings on in Madison. But given the hostility of those crowds, their trying to prevent a vote was a real possibility. Given that, I think the hurry-up vote justified.

You do realize that the full Senate never voted on the bill, right? Never. The reconciliation committee just skipped over that little formality and submitted a reconciliation bill based on zero action by the Senate. That's how they got around the quorum, it's never been done before and it's blatantly unconstitutional.

248 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:32:58pm

re: #243 windsagio

I do! I also remember being forced to stay at work for over 24 hours straight at least twice!

remember when we were threatened by management for not putting abusive practices into play?

For years?


But you know, UNIONS are the problem.

Not management!


There's people in management at my old job, that should go to prison for life.

That's why im' pro union :)

249 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:33:11pm

re: #246 windsagio

But seriously, unions = evil. Totally unneccesary. Companies would never exploit their employees or make a dangerous working environment.

Not at all!

GOp says so!

250 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:33:21pm

re: #245 ggtAnd how are you-all tonite?

In a fightin' mood, apparently.

251 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:33:27pm

re: #240 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Hey, you're focusing on the wrong thing! It's Medicare and Social Security that are drivin' this country into the ground!

///

Yikes. The amount of money we spend on "other things" is still rather amazing. Nope. Can't touch the defense budget. Hell. If they still had the F-104 Starfighter around congress would still support it. If you know what I mean.

252 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:34:14pm

homogenius = homogenous or homogeneous?

PIMF if I knew how to spell it in the first place.

253 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:34:49pm

re: #243 windsagio

I do! I also remember being forced to stay at work for over 24 hours straight at least twice!

remember when they tried to cover up that faulty transfer equipment, and our friend got the back injury? And then they tried to lean on her not to report the injury?


What you are reading, dark falcon and anyone who is anti union, is the truth. Not that it matters to you. not that you'll ever learn

254 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:34:58pm

re: #250 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And how are you-all tonite?

In a fightin' mood, apparently.

Pat Robertson and is homoerotic fantasy phobia.

255 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:35:12pm

re: #251 Gus 802

Yikes. The amount of money we spend on "other things" is still rather amazing. Nope. Can't touch the defense budget. Hell. If they still had the F-104 Starfighter around congress would still support it. If you know what I mean.

Nah, you're behind the times, Gus. Nowadays it's the F-35, the plane of a million redesigns, weight reductions, and software fixes. You know, the ones whose cost continue to rise every month, so that by the time they're actually in service, each one could fund PP for a year.

256 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:35:27pm

re: #251 Gus 802

Yikes. The amount of money we spend on "other things" is still rather amazing. Nope. Can't touch the defense budget. Hell. If they still had the F-104 Starfighter around congress would still support it. If you know what I mean.

But it had sharp wings!

257 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:35:34pm

re: #252 ggt

homogenius = homogenous or homogeneous?

PIMF if I knew how to spell it in the first place.

Heheheheheh, you said 'homo'
///Beavis

258 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:36:05pm

re: #255 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Nah, you're behind the times, Gus. Nowadays it's the F-35, the plane of a million redesigns, weight reductions, and software fixes. You know, the ones whose cost continue to rise every month, so that by the time they're actually in service, each one could fund PP for a year.

///So what you're saying is that we need to design a jet fighter that preforms abortions... or maybe some kind of fetus seeking missile....

259 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:36:11pm

re: #243 windsagio

remember when the regional director was fired for embezzling?


remember when my first boss at [redacted] house went to jail for stealing a client's money and gambling it all at the Muckleshoot casinos?

260 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:36:17pm

re: #255 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Nah, you're behind the times, Gus. Nowadays it's the F-35, the plane of a million redesigns, weight reductions, and software fixes. You know, the ones whose cost continue to rise every month, so that by the time they're actually in service, each one could fund PP for a year.

Overdesigned. Too much BS. Could have just kept the Harrier going and do an advanced F-15. The Navy already got the Super Hornet. What more do they want?

261 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:36:45pm

re: #260 Gus 802

Overdesigned. Too much BS. Could have just kept the Harrier going and do an advanced F-15. The Navy already got the Super Hornet. What more do they want?

more money and death of course

262 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:36:53pm

re: #259 WindUpBird

remember when the regional director was fired for embezzling?

remember when my first boss at [redacted] house went to jail for stealing a client's money and gambling it all at the Muckleshoot casinos?

The hell kind of shithole did you two work for?!
:/

263 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:36:53pm

And Blackwater. And KBR. And yes, Haliburton. And not bid contracts.

Hang on. Where's my vomit bag?

264 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:37:50pm

re: #243 windsagio

I do! I also remember being forced to stay at work for over 24 hours straight at least twice!

I remember redwood trees, bumpercars and wolverines.

Just trying to join in.

Youtube Video
265 windsagio  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:37:50pm

re: #259 WindUpBird

remember when the regional director was fired for embezzling?

remember when my first boss at [redacted] house went to jail for stealing a client's money and gambling it all at the Muckleshoot casinos?

Remember when we were told to actively abuse residents not trained in any way and had no recourse except internal channels?!

Now I ironically have to go to work >

266 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:37:54pm

re: #262 Varek Raith

The hell kind of shithole did you two work for?!
:/

I'll tell you off this place on a messgning client with Windy sometime, if you truly wish to know

The stories I have to tell really could go in a book

267 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:38:03pm

Speaking of which. Do Americans understand how much UAVs make us look like douche bags?

268 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:38:26pm

re: #260 Gus 802

Overdesigned. Too much BS. Could have just kept the Harrier going and do an advanced F-15. The Navy already got the Super Hornet. What more do they want?

An excuse to give the Air Force yet another overly expensive toy, to the detriment of the Marines and Navy.

269 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:38:27pm

re: #265 windsagio

Remember when we were told to actively abuse residents not trained in any way and had no recourse except internal channels?!

Now I ironically have to go to work >


and
he

BRINGS IT ALL HOME!

270 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:39:16pm

re: #130 Gus 802

This is why.

Bryan Fischer...if I said what I thought about Bryan Fischer, my account would be in serious jeopardy.

271 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:39:30pm

re: #268 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

An excuse to give the Air Force yet another overly expensive toy, to the detriment of the Marines and Navy.

The generals get their way yet again. And the generals don't even listen to the boots on the ground or the people in the air. Generals basically become political animals. As do admirals.

272 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:39:36pm

re: #262 Varek Raith

this isn't unusual. if you are a low paid health care worker? Working with the disadvantaged for sub ten bucks an hour? You will know. period. You will see this first hand.

273 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:39:46pm

Quick, what part of the Constitution says the bit about --"rights not listed are delegated to the states or to the individual"?

Remember when the Constitution was used to limit the power of government, and not the individual?

Damn, I am so tired of Pat Robertson, Lila Rose, etc etc etc.

274 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:39:58pm

re: #267 Gus 802

Speaking of which. Do Americans understand how much UAVs make us look like douche bags?

I was just reading earlier today that our enemies abroad are already made hay out of the increasing usage of UCAVs in our wars, declaring us "cowards" for sending toys to do our fighting.

275 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:40:11pm

re: #238 WindUpBird

9/11 gave Bin Laden more than he could have dreamed of

we played right into his hands

Now we're fucked in afghanistan, collapsing under the weight of our own hubris

9/11 brought nothing but ruin to bin Laden. Al Qaeda lost its training camps and most of its manpower. It's funding is disrupted and its attempt to enter Iraq ended in defeat. And things aren't going well for them in Afghanistan, either:

It's Time This Beast Got Put Down

April 24, 2011: The Taliban are entering the death-spiral phase of their comeback campaign. This can be seen by sharply reduced activity in the countryside (where the surge in NATO and Afghan troops has broken the fighting spirit of the Taliban), and the increased reliance on high-profile terror attacks. NATO casualties are down from the same period last year, although the media coverage of Taliban terror attacks might make you think otherwise. The fighting through the Winter was particularly damaging to the Taliban, and recruiting for this year's "Spring Offensive" has been difficult. It's been known for over two years that this switch in tactics was coming. It's the same pattern seen in Iraq. Moreover, many Taliban leaders are trying to negotiate some kind of deal with the government. Some of these settlements have already been made, and now the Taliban have one less ally and one more target. The terror campaign could go on, intensely, for a year or two. But eventually, the "fighting" Taliban are going to run out of money, men and places to hide.

276 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:40:13pm

re: #256 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

But it had sharp wings!

You can peel a potato with it!

277 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:41:02pm

re: #275 Dark_Falcon

please never link me to creepy military jizz sites

Those people are fucked

278 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:41:11pm

re: #267 Gus 802

Speaking of which. Do Americans understand how much UAVs make us look like douche bags?

Yeah sending robots to blow people up from the air is so impersonal and makes us look like a nation that treats war as a videogame. I have a plan to fix that though! Once we can replace all of our "meatbag" soldiers on the ground with these bad boys we won't look like douchebags anymore, we'll be James Bond Villains!

279 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:41:23pm

re: #268 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

An excuse to give the Air Force yet another overly expensive toy, to the detriment of the Marines and Navy.

The Marines can cover up their own budget sinkholes!

I remember the fun when NCIS grabbed some of my Dept to secure the computers over at New River air station when the Ospreys were dropping out of the air.

280 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:41:38pm

re: #271 Gus 802

The generals get their way yet again. And the generals don't even listen to the boots on the ground or the people in the air. Generals basically become political animals. As do admirals.

Yep, the higher you get in rank, the less of a soldier/sailor you are and the more of a politician you become.

281 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:42:00pm

re: #274 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I was just reading earlier today that our enemies abroad are already made hay out of the increasing usage of UCAVs in our wars, declaring us "cowards" for sending toys to do our fighting.

That's exactly it. It also makes us look like arrogant aliens. Fighting a "war" without putting our own men on the line? I'm sorry but there's something really distasteful about that. We should be willing to die because it will keep us from starting another war every 5 seconds. Which we seem to be doing anyway.

282 Interesting Times  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:42:07pm

re: #246 windsagio

But seriously, unions = evil. Totally unneccesary. Companies would never exploit their employees or make a dangerous working environment.

And if they do, the invisible yet flawlessly manicured hand of the free market simply dictates their employees will quit and work for someone else. If they can't find another job in the area, and lack the funds to move, their financial woes shall nonetheless be healed through the divine power of prayer, private charity, and Paulian pixie dust.

283 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:42:08pm

re: #171 shiplord kirel

Afghanistan? You have it confused with a different country, perhaps Iraq or Jordan. Afghanistan was never part of the Ottomon Empire. It had existed as a united and internationally recognized nation-state since at least the 18th century. Afghanistan was neutral during World War 1 and was not part of any post-war partition or re-alignment. The last king of Afghanistan, Mohammed Zahir Shah, was a member of the Barakzai dynasty that had ruled the country since 1826.

Mohammed Zahir Shah, is he the guy they tell the story about, where he asks his wife to unveil in front of the tribal council?

284 shiplord kirel  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:42:28pm

Just watching Gettysburg on TCM. It is just past the lengthy segment dealing with Joshua Lawrence Chamberlain's successful defense of Little Round Top against a Confederate flanking maneuver. What a dramatic and heroic moment in history. If the Confederates had carried Chamberlain's position, they almost certainly would have won the battle and with it, the war.

285 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:42:28pm

re: #276 Gus 802

You can peel a potato with it!

Youtube Video
286 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:43:04pm

re: #280 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yep, the higher you get in rank, the less of a soldier/sailor you are and the more of a politician you become.

Watch this if you have a strong stomach, and as they say... your tax dollars at work!

287 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:43:09pm

Are we people or are we Borg? Heck, it's not even like the Borg. We're sending in robots while we sit here in the USA watching, Snooki (sorry SFZ) on TV. We're not there yet but it's coming.

288 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:43:12pm

re: #262 Varek Raith

the friend of mine with a psych degree, made oh, 13 an hour? Saw his clients ejected from their respite home because of cuts, management doing a divide and conquer, abusive practices never reported, staff made to snitch on each other for doing their jobs. and he poor clients? Schizophrenic guys who needed their meds? back on the streets on heroin.

FOUND one of them on the streets on heroin.

heratbreaking and evil


And people wounder why I'm a pain in the ass about politics :)

289 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:43:20pm

re: #279 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

The Marines can cover up their own budget sinkholes!

I remember the fun when NCIS grabbed some of my Dept to secure the computers over at New River air station when the Ospreys were dropping out of the air.

At least the Osprey has made it to service. The F-35's earliest service date is 2016, and I have serious doubts that they'll even reach that.

290 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:43:59pm

re: #274 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I was just reading earlier today that our enemies abroad are already made hay out of the increasing usage of UCAVs in our wars, declaring us "cowards" for sending toys to do our fighting.

Let them. The UAVs get the job done. In Libya they let us destroy vehicles hiding in towns without risking our pilots. They are a very good part of our arsenal. The enemy can say whatever they want, we'll blow them away just the same. MQ-9 Reaper, FUCK YEAH!

291 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:44:20pm

re: #288 WindUpBird

that friend got a nursing degree later, is now working with rich people in a richie rich nursing home. Stable, easy, money. Gave up on being abused by management and seeing his hard work undone. Couldn't do it.

292 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:44:47pm

I'll leave you guys to the military fetishization


To me, it feels like masturbating to a corpse, later folks

293 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:45:15pm

re: #289 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

At least the Osprey has made it to service. The F-35's earliest service date is 2016, and I have serious doubts that they'll even reach that.

3 letters, EFV.

The vehicle was planned to be deployed in 2015;[4] however, on 6 January 2011, SECDEF Robert Gates announced that he recommends the EFV program be canceled.[5][6] The program, which is projected to cost $15 billion, has thus far cost $3 billion.[7][8]

The Marines have asked for the EFV to be canceled in favor of the Assault Amphibian Vehicle Service Life Extension Program, the Marine Personnel Carrier and the Amphibious Combat Vehicle.[9]

294 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:45:28pm

re: #289 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

At least the Osprey has made it to service. The F-35's earliest service date is 2016, and I have serious doubts that they'll even reach that.

I find it interesting that the Osprey's chin turret is the only piece of gear project by author Dale Brown that has actually made it into regular service.

295 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:45:47pm

re: #292 WindUpBird

I'll leave you guys to the military fetishization

To me, it feels like masturbating to a corpse, later folks

Hey. It's good to know even you don't like it. Makes for better decisions. Helps to know where we're getting ripped off, etc.

296 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:46:05pm

re: #286 jamesfirecat

Watch this if you have a strong stomach, and as they say... your tax dollars at work!

Yeah, remember watching that back in the day. Been meaning to one day track down the book itself and have a gander. Anybody who wants a look at how screwed up weapons procurement is in this country should find a copy and watch that film.

297 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:46:39pm

re: #178 windsagio

ok one more. I'll blow the classy exit to say this;

I still believe that a lot of the people in those old discussions who claimed to be TG really weren't :p

On the Internet, you can be anyone you want to be.

298 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:46:43pm

re: #285 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

[Video]

The Sean Penn story! lol

299 palomino  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:46:46pm

re: #228 Dark_Falcon

I seldom use the word 'thugs' when talking about unions and 'mob' only when describing the goings on in Madison. But given the hostility of those crowds, their trying to prevent a vote was a real possibility. Given that, I think the hurry-up vote justified.

Thugs and mobs? What a load of bullshit.

I saw a bunch of middle aged mild mannered people who were already willing to make concessions. I guess the MSM didn't inform me of all the fisticuffs, flying bullets, people getting spit on, and use of ethnic slurs.

Admit it: your side (the anti-union, pro-top 1%) won this battle. So you continue to spin the whole issue to make it seem like they deserved to win.

300 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:48:07pm

re: #284 shiplord kirel

Just watching Gettysburg on TCM. It is just past the lengthy segment dealing with Joshua Lawrence Chamberlain's successful defense of Little Round Top against a Confederate flanking maneuver. What a dramatic and heroic moment in history. If the Confederates had carried Chamberlain's position, they almost certainly would have won the battle and with it, the war.

Amen.

I've often argued that JL Chamberlain was one of the greatest heros of the war.

301 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:48:25pm

re: #188 3CPO

Wow. All these years using various contraceptives, when all I really needed to do was become a lesbian. Who knew?

Well, if you're a woman, I would say, anyone who had high school sex ed. Same-sex pairings are very good for not getting pregnant.

(Although I do have a vivid memory of rushing my recently-ex girlfriend to the ER, junior year of college, and being in the room when the nurse asked if she might be pregnant. We locked eyes and then could not stop laughing, which worried the nurse, I think.)

302 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:48:29pm

re: #277 WindUpBird

What's creepy? Strategy Page isn't DEBKA. They don't make off-the-wall predictions and their analysis is quite solid. It's a good site.

303 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:49:33pm

On a happier note. I got an electric staple gun tonite. :)

Upholsterer wants $50 to recover each dining room chair. F-that! I have the fabric, my Dad taught me how to do it. Just that my hands don't work well enough to handle the regular staple gun.

I only have 8 chairs to do, so I didn't spend a lot of money. The one I go also shoots brads. How cool is that.

Not quite Lethal Weapon Danny Glover material, but I still feel pretty cool.

Oh no, in Pat Robertson's universe does drooling in the tool section of Home Depot make me a lesbian? :0

304 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:49:39pm

re: #293 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

3 letters, EFV.

Okay, you got me on that one. The brass once again letting their eyes get bigger than their stomachs.

305 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:50:10pm

re: #299 palomino

I have not used the words 'thugs' in reference to unions all month, to say nothing of tonight. I only put that word in my post to clarify what I had said.

306 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:50:34pm

re: #296 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yeah, remember watching that back in the day. Been meaning to one day track down the book itself and have a gander. Anybody who wants a look at how screwed up weapons procurement is in this country should find a copy and watch that film.

I decided along time ago, they hide the black ops expenditures in overpriced war toys.

307 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:52:03pm

re: #303 ggt

On a happier note. I got an electric staple gun tonite. :)

Upholsterer wants $50 to recover each dining room chair. F-that! I have the fabric, my Dad taught me how to do it. Just that my hands don't work well enough to handle the regular staple gun.

I only have 8 chairs to do, so I didn't spend a lot of money. The one I go also shoots brads. How cool is that.

Not quite Lethal Weapon Danny Glover material, but I still feel pretty cool.

Oh no, in Pat Robertson's universe does drooling in the tool section of Home Depot make me a lesbian? :0

Youtube Video
308 MittDoesNotCompute  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:52:57pm

re: #72 kreyagg

Updinged for Firefly ref!
And it is official , the default browser for the HTC Incredible is not compatible with the comments portion of the site.

Get Dolphin Browser HD...it's better than the stock Android browser.

309 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:53:22pm

re: #290 Dark_Falcon

Let them. The UAVs get the job done. In Libya they let us destroy vehicles hiding in towns without risking our pilots. They are a very good part of our arsenal. The enemy can say whatever they want, we'll blow them away just the same. MQ-9 Reaper, FUCK YEAH!

I don't exactly like the idea of warfare becoming a video game for us. We're working on more advanced land-based and eventually sea-based UCAVs, alongside unmanned warships, subs, and tanks. We're working towards taking the human element out of warfare, such that we risk losing sight of the human cost of war.

310 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:54:54pm

re: #307 Gus 802

I actually tried to play "derp" in Words With Friends the other day. Game wouldn't accept it.

I've been hanging-out with you guys too much. LOL

311 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:55:06pm

re: #309 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I don't exactly like the idea of warfare becoming a video game for us. We're working on more advanced land-based and eventually sea-based UCAVs, alongside unmanned warships, subs, and tanks. We're working towards taking the human element out of warfare, such that we risk losing sight of the human cost of war.

When in the end there is nothing to sacrifice...

312 blueraven  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:55:29pm

re: #303 ggt

On a happier note. I got an electric staple gun tonite. :)

Upholsterer wants $50 to recover each dining room chair. F-that! I have the fabric, my Dad taught me how to do it. Just that my hands don't work well enough to handle the regular staple gun.

I only have 8 chairs to do, so I didn't spend a lot of money. The one I go also shoots brads. How cool is that.

Not quite Lethal Weapon Danny Glover material, but I still feel pretty cool.

Oh no, in Pat Robertson's universe does drooling in the tool section of Home Depot make me a lesbian? :0

Actually 50 dollars per chair sounds pretty reasonable for a professional upholstery job.

313 shiplord kirel  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:55:42pm

re: #283 SanFranciscoZionist

Mohammed Zahir Shah, is he the guy they tell the story about, where he asks his wife to unveil in front of the tribal council?

That was Soraya Tarzi, the ultra modern wife of the reform minded King Amanullah Khan in the 1920s. Khan was overthrown by conservatives in 1929 and the tyrant Nadir Shah became king. Mohammed Zahir Shah, the last king, was Nadir Shah's son. He reigned from 1933 until the dissolution of the monarchy in 1973, and lived to see both the communists and the Taliban overthrown. He died in 2007 at the age of 92.

314 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:56:11pm

Weird Al Yankovic - "Craigslist"

Youtube Video
315 sagehen  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:56:16pm

re: #275 Dark_Falcon

9/11 brought nothing but ruin to bin Laden. Al Qaeda lost its training camps and most of its manpower. It's funding is disrupted and its attempt to enter Iraq ended in defeat. And things aren't going well for them in Afghanistan, either:

It's Time This Beast Got Put Down

Did you hear about the jailbreak in Afghanistan over the weekend? All the Taliban who'd been captured... they're out again.

316 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:56:52pm

re: #217 windsagio

WUB spent 15 years in a place that desperately desperately needed a union, it turns bizarrely evil. And this was a charitable organization!

Nonprofits can be brutal. Nastier and weirder than corporate offices would dream of getting.

317 palomino  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:57:32pm

re: #305 Dark_Falcon

I have not used the words 'thugs' in reference to unions all month, to say nothing of tonight. I only put that word in my post to clarify what I had said.

Wow, you've gone almost a whole month without calling union members thugs. Congrats on the good form.

As for substance, you don't have much of a response to the ass-backwardness of asking the middle class to sacrifice longstanding modest benefits in order to finance tax cuts for the top 1%.

318 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:57:42pm

re: #309 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I don't exactly like the idea of warfare becoming a video game for us. We're working on more advanced land-based and eventually sea-based UCAVs, alongside unmanned warships, subs, and tanks. We're working towards taking the human element out of warfare, such that we risk losing sight of the human cost of war.

While I don't doubt that you are right... that it will harm our ability to keep in mind the human cost of war, if we do manage to fully "unman" our fighting forces...

I also have to wonder how much of a demoralizing effect will this have on our foes?

Besides, ironically given that we wouldn't have to worry about paying for them wages or spend time training them I'm amused by contemplating the possibility that it will eventually cost less money to field robots than human soldiers...

319 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:58:02pm

re: #312 blueraven

Actually 50 dollars per chair sounds pretty reasonable for a professional upholstery job.

for just the seat insert thingy?

$400? When I got the fabric on-sale for $50 and the staple gun for $30?

I know that if I were the upholsterer, I'd charge at least $50 also, but I'm not and I can do it myself for $10 a chair.

It just isn't that difficult. screwdriver, staple gun, fabric and time. Oh, well, I guess it really takes two people to do it right. It still isn't that difficult.

320 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:58:59pm

re: #315 sagehen

Did you hear about the jailbreak in Afghanistan over the weekend? All the Taliban who'd been captured... they're out again.

470 of them. That's approximately worth about 470 million dollars to recapture or "eliminate". My guess is that it would probably cost another 50 to 100 American lives at the same time. Probably take another year to accomplish as well.

[Link: www.bbc.co.uk...]

321 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:59:07pm

re: #315 sagehen

Did you hear about the jailbreak in Afghanistan over the weekend? All the Taliban who'd been captured... they're out again.

I understand that this man is wanted for questioning.

//

322 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:59:30pm

re: #315 sagehen

Did you hear about the jailbreak in Afghanistan over the weekend? All the Taliban who'd been captured... they're out again.

No, some of them are. That was one prison and not everyone escaped. Further, don't assume that all of them will take up arms again. The Talibs got maybe 300 guys back, and they're short a couple thousand. They're still losing,

323 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 9:59:51pm

Lol

Youtube Video
324 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:00:23pm

re: #323 Varek Raith

Lol

[Video]

Classic.

325 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:00:50pm

re: #316 SanFranciscoZionist

Nonprofits can be brutal. Nastier and weirder than corporate offices would dream of getting.

The need of profit demands a accountability. IMHO, for-profit companies are more transparent and ethical simply because they know big brother is looking over their shoulders at the books.

326 blueraven  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:00:55pm

re: #319 ggt

for just the seat insert thingy?

$400? When I got the fabric on-sale for $50 and the staple gun for $30?

I know that if I were the upholsterer, I'd charge at least $50 also, but I'm not and I can do it myself for $10 a chair.

It just isn't that difficult. screwdriver, staple gun, fabric and time. Oh, well, I guess it really takes two people to do it right. It still isn't that difficult.

I didn't say you shouldn't do it to save money. Just that the price sounded reasonable. Yes, just for the seat insert thingy.

327 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:01:06pm

re: #262 Varek Raith

The hell kind of shithole did you two work for?!
:/

Oh, hell, that's nothing. I worked for a nice little Catholic elementary school. Couple of years after I left, they fired the science teacher midyear on trumped-up charges having to do with her opposition to Prop 8. Then the bitch who was running the school got her ass fired for embezzling, and vanished with twenty-five thousand dollars of the school's money.

(But did they hire back the woman she lied about, harassed, and ultimately got fired? Did they even say, "Sorry, we might have been wrong about her"? Why, no, they did not.)

328 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:01:17pm

re: #318 jamesfirecat

While I don't doubt that you are right... that it will harm our ability to keep in mind the human cost of war, if we do manage to fully "unman" our fighting forces...

I also have to wonder how much of a demoralizing effect will this have on our foes?

Besides, ironically given that we wouldn't have to worry about paying for them wages or spend time training them I'm amused by contemplating the possibility that it will eventually cost less money to field robots than human soldiers...

I sincerely doubt we'll ever see that situation in the near future. You have to take into consideration that such machines would need constant maintenance, even when in storage, in order to keep ready for war. I remember reading that there are something on the order of 180 people involved in every UCAV mission right now, from beginning to end.

329 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:01:29pm

re: #322 Dark_Falcon

No, some of them are. That was one prison and not everyone escaped. Further, don't assume that all of them will take up arms again. The Talibs got maybe 300 guys back, and they're short a couple thousand. They're still losing,

"This I can promise, Sammael, for every one of you that falls, two shall arise."

330 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:01:34pm

re: #315 sagehen

Did you hear about the jailbreak in Afghanistan over the weekend? All the Taliban who'd been captured... they're out again.

You know... if memory serves, back in World War two, we actually transported German POWs, including the SS, back to America to prevent this kind of thing from happening...

[Link: mshistory.k12.ms.us...]

///Too bad we can't live up to the standards set by our forefathers, but they were the greatest generation I suppose...

331 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:02:16pm

re: #327 SanFranciscoZionist

Oh, hell, that's nothing. I worked for a nice little Catholic elementary school. Couple of years after I left, they fired the science teacher midyear on trumped-up charges having to do with her opposition to Prop 8. Then the bitch who was running the school got her ass fired for embezzling, and vanished with twenty-five thousand dollars of the school's money.

(But did they hire back the woman she lied about, harassed, and ultimately got fired? Did they even say, "Sorry, we might have been wrong about her"? Why, no, they did not.)

It takes at least 75 years for the Church to admit fault. Usually more like 500.

332 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:03:20pm

Pfft. The Phoenix barely worked in combat conditions. The Sparrow barely worked in Vietnam and I doubt it's any better now. That leaves the Sidewinder which is an old heat seeker that still works.

333 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:03:28pm

re: #313 shiplord kirel

That was Soraya Tarzi, the ultra modern wife of the reform minded King Amanullah Khan in the 1920s. Khan was overthrown by conservatives in 1929 and the tyrant Nadir Shah became king. Mohammed Zahir Shah, the last king, was Nadir Shah's son. He reigned from 1933 until the dissolution of the monarchy in 1973, and lived to see both the communists and the Taliban overthrown. He died in 2007 at the age of 92.

Ah. Thank you. I had this story floating around in my head.

334 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:04:55pm

Which means you still have to turn and burn. An F-35 can't turn and burn with an SU-30. That is if you're paranoid enough to think we'll be fighting the Russians, Venezuela, or whomever anytime soon. Right now we're just fighting an 18th century enemy with 21st century weapons.

335 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:05:27pm

re: #326 blueraven

I didn't say you shouldn't do it to save money. Just that the price sounded reasonable. Yes, just for the seat insert thingy.

Honestly, because my Dad always did it and I knew what it entailed, and I was providing the fabric, I thought it would be about $25 a chair. I mean, someone who knows how to do it, could easily do all 8 in an hour. $200/hr. and I'm unscrewing the seat insert thingy and delivering it to them.

Me, it will take a couple of hours.

Now, If they had to come get the chairs, take them back to the shop and do it--well, that would be different. Pick-up and Delivery sucks.

336 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:06:21pm

re: #332 Gus 802

Pfft. The Phoenix barely worked in combat conditions. The Sparrow barely worked in Vietnam and I doubt it's any better now. That leaves the Sidewinder which is an old heat seeker that still works.

The Sparrow is no longer in front-line service. The AMRAAM replaced it, and AMRAAM does work.

337 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:06:32pm

Plus we invaded the wrong country. We should have invaded Pakistan. Not Iraq.

338 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:07:03pm

re: #331 ggt

It takes at least 75 years for the Church to admit fault. Usually more like 500.

So, like Galileo, the science teacher will eventually have her name cleared?

Good to know.

//

339 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:07:52pm

re: #337 Gus 802

Plus we invaded the wrong country. We should have invaded Pakistan. Not Iraq.

Each country should get its own planet.
Problem solved.

340 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:08:12pm

re: #329 goddamnedfrank

"This I can promise, Sammael, for every one of you that falls, two shall arise."

It's not working out that way. Other Afghans see that its the Taliban that's killing more Afghans than the Americans, and they see the Talibs getting pounded. And the resort to terror attacks has backfired on the Taliban, badly. It's mostly earned them ill-will and gotten us tipsters.

341 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:08:19pm

re: #338 SanFranciscoZionist

So, like Galileo, the science teacher will eventually have her name cleared?

Good to know.

//

Well, if enough of her supporters are still making a case for her in the future--yeah, it can happen.

342 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:09:10pm

re: #336 Dark_Falcon

The Sparrow is no longer in front-line service. The AMRAAM replaced it, and AMRAAM does work.

I'm a little behind. OK. Yeah. They shot down 9 enemy aircraft so far. Billions and billions just to shoot down 9 aircraft. I'm sorry but there's something wrong with this picture.

343 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:09:45pm

re: #339 Varek Raith

Each country should get its own planet.
Problem solved.

No, that doesn't work either.

Some fanatic leader would say that some other planet's ideology or primitive nature is a threat because they are in the same solar system . . .when really they'd just have the spice. . . .

344 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:09:55pm

re: #334 Gus 802

Which means you still have to turn and burn. An F-35 can't turn and burn with an SU-30. That is if you're paranoid enough to think we'll be fighting the Russians, Venezuela, or whomever anytime soon. Right now we're just fighting an 18th century enemy with 21st century weapons.

Have a gander here to see a fairly comprehensive analysis of just how poor a fighter the F-35 is.

345 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:10:26pm

re: #344 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Have a gander here to see a fairly comprehensive analysis of just how poor a fighter the F-35 is.

But is it fun to fly?

346 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:10:30pm

Same thing with the F-14. Billions and billions just to shoot down two or three Libyan rust buckets. And now? It's gone.

347 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:10:57pm

re: #342 Gus 802

I'm a little behind. OK. Yeah. They shot down 9 enemy aircraft so far. Billions and billions just to shoot down 9 aircraft. I'm sorry but there's something wrong with this picture.

We haven't had much occasion to use AMRAAM yet, but we have it and it works. Isn't the best thing to have a weapons that works and to not need it much? That's not a bad picture at all.

348 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:11:09pm

Oy! Gotta chrash! G'night all!!!!

349 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:12:44pm

re: #345 ggt

But is it fun to fly?

Sure, if you enjoy spending roughly $150 million to fly one.

350 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:12:58pm

re: #347 Dark_Falcon

We haven't had much occasion to use AMRAAM yet, but we have it and it works. Isn't the best thing to have a weapons that works and to not need it much? That's not a bad picture at all.

Good. Then let's keep it and stop re-inventing the wheel every 15 years just to shoot down more 3rd world rust buckets.

351 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:13:33pm

And I'm not angry. :)

352 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:14:09pm

re: #351 Gus 802

And I'm not angry. :)

What are you?

353 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:14:11pm

re: #346 Gus 802

Same thing with the F-14. Billions and billions just to shoot down two or three Libyan rust buckets. And now? It's gone.

Quit griping, Gus. It was built to meet a valid threat, that being the MiG-25. It outclassed that threat and its enemies were afraid to fly against it. Not a failure at all.

354 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:14:15pm

re: #347 Dark_Falcon

We haven't had much occasion to use AMRAAM yet, but we have it and it works. Isn't the best thing to have a weapons that works and to not need it much? That's not a bad picture at all.

There are a couple really amazing weapons designs out there with their chief limitation being they're really only cost effective if you actually use them.

355 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:14:47pm

re: #352 ggt

What are you?

Just shooting the shit.

356 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:15:28pm

re: #353 Dark_Falcon

Quit griping, Gus. It was built to meet a valid threat, that being the MiG-25. It outclassed that threat and its enemies were afraid to fly against it. Not a failure at all.

It's not griping DF. It's just the way I've seen history play out. Please, show me were the Mig-25s have been a serious threat in Libya. Or Iraq.

357 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:15:38pm

re: #354 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

There are a couple really amazing weapons designs out there with their chief limitation being they're really only cost effective if you actually use them.

What price deterrence? Lives not lost in battle, property not destroyed, families not displaced?

The business of keeping the peace costs money either way.

358 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:16:10pm

Where.

359 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:16:35pm

re: #346 Gus 802

Same thing with the F-14. Billions and billions just to shoot down two or three Libyan rust buckets. And now? It's gone.

The F-14 might have stayed in business if the suits at Grumman hadn't pissed off Cheney in the early 90's. They were working on several plans for upgrades to the design, keeping it in service into the 21st century, but quoted the Navy an outrageous price. Cheney's response was to order them to destroy all the tooling and molds for the plane. Then they got bought out by Northrop and that was all she wrote.

360 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:17:59pm

re: #350 Gus 802

Good. Then let's keep it and stop re-inventing the wheel every 15 years just to shoot down more 3rd world rust buckets.

The thing about aircraft is they don't last and technology doesn't stand still. China is working on fighters that can outclass the F-16. That means we need fighters that can face their machines. Doesn't mean we have to fight them or that we should want to, but we need to be able to.

361 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:18:10pm

Heck. I'm really an air war buff. But enough is enough. I'm tired of all the BS and the hyped up fears we build just to spend billions more on stuff we really don't need. If you want to fight this so called GWOT you need A-10s or even less. Even an A-1 Skyraider can do the job.

362 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:18:42pm

re: #360 Dark_Falcon

The thing about aircraft is they don't last and technology doesn't stand still. China is working on fighters that can outclass the F-16. That means we need fighters that can face their machines. Doesn't mean we have to fight them or that we should want to, but we need to be able to.

Again with China? How many more decades are we going to use the fear of China as the basis for spending trillions more?

363 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:18:46pm

re: #357 ggt

What price deterrence? Lives not lost in battle, property not destroyed, families not displaced?

The business of keeping the peace costs money either way.

Neutron bombs for instance. Vastly superior to a standard nuclear warhead, except they have a vastly reduced shelf life in comparison, meaning the cost to replace and maintain them over a long term in impractical.

364 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:20:35pm

Why in the world would China even attack their best customer. For what? Taiwan? We'd start WWIII just to defend Taiwan? Sorry but no can do. What's next? North Korea and defending South Korea since we've been doing since the mid 1850s I mean 1950s?

365 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:21:49pm

Who died and made us king? Where in the Constitution does it say... OK USA.... You have to defend the world and keep the best and most modern military over anybody in the whole wide worldz!!!!! Nope. Can't find it. Just mentions something about Militias and muskets.

366 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:22:04pm

re: #364 Gus 802

Why in the world would China even attack their best customer. For what? Taiwan? We'd start WWIII just to defend Taiwan? Sorry but no can do. What's next? North Korea and defending South Korea since we've been doing since the mid 1850s I mean 1950s?

Back when I was in Sunday school in the 80s, I remember being asked what we would do if Israel was at war with the United States.

Why this would happen was never much gone into.

367 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:22:43pm

re: #356 Gus 802

It's not griping DF. It's just the way I've seen history play out. Please, show me were the Mig-25s have been a serious threat in Libya. Or Iraq.

The MiG-25's high speed was reckoned a major threat, both in a recon role and as a high speed bomber. Iran, before the fall of the Shah, provided a test case of that. In the early 70's, the USSR used MiG-25R recon aircraft to conduct surveillance of Iranian airfield and army bases. The MiG's speed meant the F-4 Phantom could not intercept it. Once Iran received F-14s and they started running patrols, a few warning lock-on from the F-14's radar sufficed to stop the illegal recon. Real threat, countered.

/Though it did bite us when the Shah fell, but that's a separate issue.

368 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:22:45pm

re: #363 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Neutron bombs for instance. Vastly superior to a standard nuclear warhead, except they have a vastly reduced shelf life in comparison, meaning the cost to replace and maintain them over a long term in impractical.

And then we can show the world we have it, let it expire and let them think we are still keeping up-to-date, until some journalist exposes the truth. Then we invent some other big bad thingy and spend more money.

It's also such a game of smoke and mirrors. Out psyching the competition. I'm just glad I'm not in charge, I wouldn't be very good at it.

369 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:24:30pm

re: #362 Gus 802

Again with China? How many more decades are we going to use the fear of China as the basis for spending trillions more?

How about China selling aircraft to other nations, huh? We don't have to fight them to end up fighting their equipment. Don't assume we're only going to be fighting insurgents.

370 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:24:49pm

re: #364 Gus 802

Why in the world would China even attack their best customer. For what? Taiwan? We'd start WWIII just to defend Taiwan? Sorry but no can do. What's next? North Korea and defending South Korea since we've been doing since the mid 1850s I mean 1950s?

China is imperialistic, China doesn't care about it's own people and they have ALOT of men without women, homosexuality is punishable by death. They have ALOT of people, period.

China is a long-term threat.

Although I think it is more economic for us than military. We may be called to participate in other parts of the world.

Personally, I think China will win in actual numbers, but we will win in Culture. Like Rome.

371 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:25:07pm

re: #369 Dark_Falcon

How about China selling aircraft to other nations, huh? We don't have to fight them to end up fighting their equipment. Don't assume we're only going to be fighting insurgents.

What like 30 fighters to some rogue nation? That's not a credible threat.

372 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:25:20pm

re: #360 Dark_Falcon

The thing about aircraft is they don't last and technology doesn't stand still. China is working on fighters that can outclass the F-16. That means we need fighters that can face their machines. Doesn't mean we have to fight them or that we should want to, but we need to be able to.

Hell, I'd shake and shiver if the ChiComs could build an indigenous fighter that wasn't heavily cribbed from Soviet designs and in sufficient numbers to be anything more than a toy.

373 engineer cat  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:25:36pm

we shouldn't be spending so much money to prepare for 20th century wars - we'll end up like the ussr, getting bled dry building expensive hardware while getting beat on the real 21st century battlefields:

the economy

374 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:27:38pm

re: #371 Gus 802

What like 30 fighters to some rogue nation? That's not a credible threat.

Doesn't take many fighters to do some serious damage. I don't want to lose planes and pilots if we don't have to. I'd rather have better fighters than the other guy.

375 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:27:43pm

re: #370 ggt

China is imperialistic, China doesn't care about it's own people and they have ALOT of men without women, homosexuality is punishable by death. They have ALOT of people, period.

China is a long-term threat.

Although I think it is more economic for us than military. We may be called to participate in other parts of the world.

Personally, I think China will win in actual numbers, but we will win in Culture. Like Rome.

When was the last time China practiced an imperial role? Vietnam. Vietnam is independent from China. They have influence with Sudan yet Sudan still remain an independent state. Not seeing it. In fact. I think the USA is currently occupying more nations than China at this time. Which I know is probably better than being occupied by China but only in theory.

376 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:28:04pm

re: #374 Dark_Falcon

Doesn't take many fighters to do some serious damage. I don't want to lose planes and pilots if we don't have to. I'd rather have better fighters than the other guy.

Pearl Harbor paranoia.

377 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:28:52pm

re: #375 Gus 802

When was the last time China practiced an imperial role? Vietnam. Vietnam is independent from China. They have influence with Sudan yet Sudan still remain an independent state. Not seeing it. In fact. I think the USA is currently occupying more nations than China at this time. Which I know is probably better than being occupied by China but only in theory.

Tibet, Afrika . . .

378 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:28:53pm

We could be attacked at any second! We must be prepared for any threat! Makes me wish we were visited by this massive yet peaceful alien force.

//

379 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:29:28pm

re: #228 Dark_Falcon

I seldom use the word 'thugs' when talking about unions and 'mob' only when describing the goings on in Madison. But given the hostility of those crowds, their trying to prevent a vote was a real possibility. Given that, I think the hurry-up vote justified.

Butt hurt republicans are funny.

380 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:30:09pm

re: #375 Gus 802

When was the last time China practiced an imperial role? Vietnam. Vietnam is independent from China. They have influence with Sudan yet Sudan still remain an independent state. Not seeing it. In fact. I think the USA is currently occupying more nations than China at this time. Which I know is probably better than being occupied by China but only in theory.

China needs land for her people. If she can get it in a non-military way, she will. If she can't she will fight for it.

381 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:30:22pm

re: #376 Gus 802

Pearl Harbor paranoia.

Don't try to run that shit in on me. I'm saying that development of new aircraft is needed, not that we should have a full-on arms race. Would you stop confusing me with a wingnut, please?

382 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:30:48pm

See. This is largely why the USA is always broke. Still dreaming that they're the world cavalry ready to save the day. It's largely a psychological response lingering from their inaction during the early stages of the 3rd Reich invading most of Europe and North Africa. And, then we didn't act until they attacked Pearl Harbor.

383 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:31:05pm

re: #381 Dark_Falcon

Don't try to run that shit in on me. I'm saying that development of new aircraft is needed, not that we should have a full-on arms race. Would you stop confusing me with a wingnut, please?

I win! I got you mad. You down dinged me. LOL

384 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:32:12pm

re: #382 Gus 802

See. This is largely why the USA is always broke. Still dreaming that they're the world cavalry ready to save the day. It's largely a psychological response lingering from their inaction during the early stages of the 3rd Reich invading most of Europe and North Africa. And, then we didn't act until they attacked Pearl Harbor.

"You ain't broke if you got credit" --unknown.

385 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:32:25pm

re: #381 Dark_Falcon

Don't try to run that shit in on me. I'm saying that development of new aircraft is needed, not that we should have a full-on arms race. Would you stop confusing me with a wingnut, please?

Being Pearl Harbor paranoid and a wingnut are two different things DF. Lots of Americans are like that. I'm in the minority. They failed at indoctrinating me fully.

386 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:32:28pm

re: #378 Gus 802

We could be attacked at any second! We must be prepared for any threat! Makes me wish we were visited by this massive yet peaceful alien force.

//

They're busy preparing out in the Kuiper Belt.
They're just gonna chuck city-sized rocks at us.

387 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:33:38pm

re: #386 Varek Raith

They're busy preparing out in the Kuiper Belt.
They're just gonna chuck city-sized rocks at us.

They have to finish mining them first. Which is good for us, they won't cause as much damage that way.

388 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:33:55pm

re: #386 Varek Raith

They're busy preparing out in the Kuiper Belt.
They're just gonna chuck city-sized rocks at us.

Varek doesn't like mass drivers like that, folks. He prefers Superlasers. ;)

389 sagehen  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:34:18pm

re: #365 Gus 802

Who died and made us king? Where in the Constitution does it say... OK USA... You have to defend the world and keep the best and most modern military over anybody in the whole wide worldz!!! Nope. Can't find it. Just mentions something about Militias and muskets.

My view, which I understand is uncommon among lefties:

If we don't have the biggest, toughest military in the world, if we're not the 800-lb gorilla... somebody else will be. And whoever they are, I don't trust them as much as I trust us.

We've used our military very badly on more than one occasion, we've sent them where they shouldn't have been sent and ordered them to do things nobody should have been ordered to do, and we do need to be more careful about not doing that. It would be great if we could spend more time on the moral high ground. But we're not immoral as often as I'm afraid somebody else would be, if they had the power instead of us.

Youtube Video
390 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:35:42pm

re: #389 sagehen

My view, which I understand is uncommon among lefties:

If we don't have the biggest, toughest military in the world, if we're not the 800-lb gorilla... somebody else will be. And whoever they are, I don't trust them as much as I trust us.

We've used our military very badly on more than one occasion, we've sent them where they shouldn't have been sent and ordered them to do things nobody should have been ordered to do, and we do need to be more careful about not doing that. It would be great if we could spend more time on the moral high ground. But we're not immoral as often as I'm afraid somebody else would be, if they had the power instead of us.

[Video]

Quoted for Truth.

391 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:36:06pm

re: #389 sagehen

My view, which I understand is uncommon among lefties:

If we don't have the biggest, toughest military in the world, if we're not the 800-lb gorilla... somebody else will be. And whoever they are, I don't trust them as much as I trust us.

We've used our military very badly on more than one occasion, we've sent them where they shouldn't have been sent and ordered them to do things nobody should have been ordered to do, and we do need to be more careful about not doing that. It would be great if we could spend more time on the moral high ground. But we're not immoral as often as I'm afraid somebody else would be, if they had the power instead of us.

[Video]

Plain and simple. It's how we're indoctrinated by the military-industrial complex. Yes, a cliche. The punch line is that I'm not really a fully fledged moonbat on this and some folks consider me a war monger.

392 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:36:49pm

re: #389 sagehen

My view, which I understand is uncommon among lefties:

If we don't have the biggest, toughest military in the world, if we're not the 800-lb gorilla... somebody else will be. And whoever they are, I don't trust them as much as I trust us.

We've used our military very badly on more than one occasion, we've sent them where they shouldn't have been sent and ordered them to do things nobody should have been ordered to do, and we do need to be more careful about not doing that. It would be great if we could spend more time on the moral high ground. But we're not immoral as often as I'm afraid somebody else would be, if they had the power instead of us.

[Video]

Yeah, it'd be nice if everything would be all kumbaya if WE JUST BEHAVED. But it humans are involved. Kumbaya is a fantasy.

393 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:37:55pm
Robertson: [I]f a woman is a lesbian, what advantage does she have over a married woman? Or what deficiency does she have?

Meeuwsen: Well she can’t have children.

Robertson: That’s exactly right.

The fuck you say? I had no idea that lesbians were sterile. Thanks for clearing that up for me Pat. I guess Evil Assholes are good for something after all.
/

394 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:38:43pm

night all!

Have a great morning!

And yes, it is still raining in the Very Far Western Parts of Chicagoland.

395 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:39:18pm

re: #392 ggt

Yeah, it'd be nice if everything would be all kumbaya if WE JUST BEHAVED. But it humans are involved. Kumbaya is a fantasy.

Yeah. I like the parts where we created Saddam Hussein. The Mujahideen. Destroyed democracy in Iran in the 1950s. Assassinated a president in Chile. Bankrolled death squads in Central and South America. Traded arm/drugs to get hostages. East Timor was another good one.

396 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:39:39pm

Cambodia. Laos.

397 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:39:58pm

So. Should I cue up the Lee Greenwood?

398 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:40:53pm

No wonder we have a hard time attracting liberals at LGF.

399 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:41:13pm

The idiot online Scrabble program accepts "fedex" but not "jello".

I am not pleased with the idiot online Scrabble program.

400 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:41:42pm

re: #389 sagehen

My view, which I understand is uncommon among lefties:

If we don't have the biggest, toughest military in the world, if we're not the 800-lb gorilla... somebody else will be. And whoever they are, I don't trust them as much as I trust us.

We've used our military very badly on more than one occasion, we've sent them where they shouldn't have been sent and ordered them to do things nobody should have been ordered to do, and we do need to be more careful about not doing that. It would be great if we could spend more time on the moral high ground. But we're not immoral as often as I'm afraid somebody else would be, if they had the power instead of us.

[Video]

Being the 800lb gorilla means eventually deciding which is more important: Our foreign policy or our domestic policy. The USSR fell because, ultimately, they tried to have both and spent themselves into the ground. If we dedicate ourselves to trying to build a military that's superior to any potential enemy, then that's money that can't go into the social safety net. It means money that has to be made up through taxes, through fees, through all sorts of means that are going to slowly drain what little lifeblood there is left in the middle class.

401 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:41:48pm

re: #397 Gus 802

So. Should I cue up the Lee Greenwood?

Please don't. It brings back memories.

402 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:41:50pm

re: #399 SanFranciscoZionist

The idiot online Scrabble program accepts "fedex" but not "jello".

I am not pleased with the idiot online Scrabble program.

Lol.

403 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:42:57pm

re: #402 Varek Raith

Lol.

More precisely, it allowed itself to play 'fedex', but now will not let me put 'jello' on a triple word score.

This thing CHEATS.

Also, I have it turned up high, so it's playing stuff like 'jemidar', which makes me stop playing to look up what the hell that means.

404 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:44:01pm

Whew. America is on such a head trip.

405 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:44:14pm

re: #395 Gus 802

Yeah. I like the parts where we created Saddam Hussein. The Mujahideen. Destroyed democracy in Iran in the 1950s. Assassinated a president in Chile. Bankrolled death squads in Central and South America. Traded arm/drugs to get hostages. East Timor was another good one.

I'd argue all those examples you posted speak more to the CIA/Covert-Ops side of the American military-industrial-espionage machine than programs like the F-35. A strong, transparent and civillian controlled military is a good thing for national defense. And pretty much the opposite of what you posted.

406 sagehen  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:44:28pm

re: #403 SanFranciscoZionist

More precisely, it allowed itself to play 'fedex', but now will not let me put 'jello' on a triple word score.

This thing CHEATS.

Also, I have it turned up high, so it's playing stuff like 'jemidar', which makes me stop playing to look up what the hell that means.

Wasn't the jem h'dar the shapeshifters from ST.DS9?

407 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:44:59pm

re: #405 McSpiff

I'd argue all those examples you posted speak more to the CIA/Covert-Ops side of the American military-industrial-espionage machine than programs like the F-35. A strong, transparent and civillian controlled military is a good thing for national defense. And pretty much the opposite of what you posted.

Nope.

408 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:45:06pm

re: #406 sagehen

Wasn't the jem h'dar the shapeshifters from ST.DS9?

Yes.
Jemidar is a rank in India. Similar to Lieutenant.

409 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:45:41pm

re: #407 Gus 802

Nope.

Yes. Do I win or would you like to actually try and argue a point?

410 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:46:27pm

re: #409 McSpiff

Yes. Do I win or would you like to actually try and argue a point?

There's nothing to argue because I believe in a strong and transparent military. Just not this.

411 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:46:45pm

re: #406 sagehen

Wasn't the jem h'dar the shapeshifters from ST.DS9?

No, those were the Founders. The Jem'Hadar were the genetically-engineered soldiers.

412 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:47:06pm

re: #406 sagehen

Wasn't the jem h'dar the shapeshifters from ST.DS9?

No, I think there was one shapeshifter, but the Jem'Hadar were a warrior race of some stereotypical sort.

'Jemidar' it turns out, means 'leader of a band of persons, especially in the native army of India'. It's sort of a lieutenant-type military rank.

413 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:47:15pm

I realize it's difficult to argue because we get the center right Democratic Party point of view and the far right view from the Republicans.

414 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:47:28pm

re: #408 Varek Raith

Yes.
Jemidar is a rank in India. Similar to Lieutenant.

Lol.
Dammit, those were the Founders.
Man, I suck.

415 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:47:40pm

re: #410 Gus 802

There's nothing to argue because I believe in a strong and transparent military. Just not this.

Right, I'm saying the various operations you listed in #405 are the opposite of a strong and transparent military.

416 Lidane  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:49:05pm

*headdesk*


Donald Trump: Obama Wasn't Qualified For Ivy League

Yeah! Because a guy who graduated magna cum laude from Harvard Law and served as the president of its law review is an idiot who can't cut it in the Ivy League.

Derp.

417 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:49:23pm

re: #415 McSpiff

Right, I'm saying the various operations you listed in #405 are the opposite of a strong and transparent military.

Oh well. That shit happened. If you leave the confines of the USA you get to see what a bunch of assholes we've been as country over the years. Americans don't see that while so called foreigners do. And the reality is that America no longer rules the world. It never did. I would also add that I would like to see America have less influence on the world in the coming years.

418 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:49:48pm

But, but. We're perfect!

419 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:50:52pm

re: #416 Lidane

*headdesk*


Donald Trump: Obama Wasn't Qualified For Ivy League

Yeah! Because a guy who graduated magna cum laude from Harvard Law and served as the president of its law review is an idiot who can't cut it in the Ivy League.

Derp.

Perhaps it's just jealousy because daddy's money couldn't get little Donald into an Ivy League school.

420 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:50:59pm

re: #417 Gus 802

Oh well. That shit happened. If you leave the confines of the USA you get to see what a bunch of assholes we've been as country over the years. Americans don't see that while so called foreigners do. And the reality is that America no longer rules the world. It never did. I would also add that I would like to see America have less influence on the world in the coming years.

What the fuck are you ranting about? Leave the confines of the USA? I've never lived there. I was agreeing with you originally, but now you're just being an argumentative asshole.

421 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:51:28pm

LOL Now I pissed off McSpiff.

422 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:51:30pm

re: #417 Gus 802

Oh well. That shit happened. If you leave the confines of the USA you get to see what a bunch of assholes we've been as country over the years. Americans don't see that while so called foreigners do. And the reality is that America no longer rules the world. It never did. I would also add that I would like to see America have less influence on the world in the coming years.

yep

and of course the worst scum in this country think travelling the world means changing channels from Bravo to TLC

Fuck, people watch the history channel and they fancy themselves historians

423 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:52:01pm

re: #420 McSpiff

What the fuck are you ranting about? Leave the confines of the USA? I've never lived there. I was agreeing with you originally, but now you're just being an argumentative asshole.

Funny. A couple of months ago you were siding with Wikileaks. Who are you today McSpiff?

424 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:52:10pm

re: #422 WindUpBird

yep

and of course the worst scum in this country think travelling the world means changing channels from Bravo to TLC

Fuck, people watch the history channel and they fancy themselves historians

Or conspiracy theorists, considering the number of shows these days on the History Channel dealing with everything from aliens to end-of-the-world prophecies.

425 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:52:11pm

re: #421 Gus 802

LOL Now I pissed off McSpiff.

Scotch?

426 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:52:12pm

re: #399 SanFranciscoZionist

The idiot online Scrabble program accepts "fedex" but not "jello".

I am not pleased with the idiot online Scrabble program.

Jell-O is a hyphenated word!

427 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:52:49pm

re: #423 Gus 802

Funny. A couple of months ago you were siding with Wikileaks. Who are you today McSpiff?

I've never sided with Wikileaks. You sure you're thinking of the right poster?

428 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:53:33pm

re: #425 McSpiff

Scotch?

Nah. You just get a little too emotional sometimes. Chill out before I bring up how you were once banned.

429 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:53:52pm

re: #424 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Or conspiracy theorists, considering the number of shows these days on the History Channel dealing with everything from aliens to end-of-the-world prophecies.

ahahah

Hitler's Secret Diaries Inside Hitler's Secret Vaults

The Occult Nephilim: Inside the Vaults of Hitler's Automaton Army

Flying Sorcerers of The Luftwaffe: How Hitler created a psychic air force

430 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:54:14pm

re: #417 Gus 802

Oh well. That shit happened. If you leave the confines of the USA you get to see what a bunch of assholes we've been as country over the years. Americans don't see that while so called foreigners do. And the reality is that America no longer rules the world. It never did. I would also add that I would like to see America have less influence on the world in the coming years.

I'm not sure that I would say that so-called foreigners have a particularly clearer perspective on matters.

431 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:54:31pm

re: #428 Gus 802

Nah. You just get a little too emotional sometimes. Chill out before I bring up how you were once banned.

Was banned once, attempted to flounce once, and was warned a few times. Made a post about it last week actually. No timeouts yet though

432 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:54:33pm

re: #429 WindUpBird

ahahah

Hitler's Secret Diaries Inside Hitler's Secret Vaults

The Occult Nephilim: Inside the Vaults of Hitler's Automaton Army

Flying Sorcerers of The Luftwaffe: How Hitler created a psychic air force

The History Channel: All Hitler, All The Time.

Yegods, how things have changed on TV.

433 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:54:50pm

re: #430 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm not sure that I would say that so-called foreigners have a particularly clearer perspective on matters.

Not all but some do. So I'll ask who made us the moral authority?

434 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:55:16pm

re: #427 McSpiff

I side with Wikileaks.
I'm with Glenn Greenwald.

The news is now a product that masquerades as news, a total sham. And for all of wikileaks transgressions, I am coming to the conclusion that it is more a force for good than CNN, MSNBC, or Fox

or at least, it's not a force for abject evil like cable news and talk radio is

435 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:56:06pm

re: #431 McSpiff

Was banned once, attempted to flounce once, and was warned a few times. Made a post about it last week actually. No timeouts yet though

OK You're honest about that then. That's good. Seriously. I'm not here to talk about you. And you're not here to talk about me. Right? I'm talking about issues no personalities.

436 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:56:06pm

re: #433 Gus 802

Not all but some do. So I'll ask who made us the moral authority?

Rome died, and made us king...well, actually, Britannia did, but who's counting?

Let's say we gave up our delusions of being a great moral force. What would we do then?

437 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:57:10pm

re: #436 SanFranciscoZionist

Rome died, and made us king...well, actually, Britannia did, but who's counting?

Let's say we gave up our delusions of being a great moral force. What would we do then?

Strive to reach the stars...and make first contact with the Vulcans?

/

438 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:57:45pm

re: #432 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

The History Channel: All Hitler, All The Time.

Yegods, how things have changed on TV.

The History channel is three steps away from being Alex Jones:1942

I think I learned more about history from playing computer games, than from watching the hysterical silliness on the History Channel.

Didn't the History channel do some borderline-only-for-children ridiculous show about ninjas versus vikings, the yakuza versus Barry Bonds, Wild West Gunfighter versus Samurai, trying to get some of that Mythbusters bread?


History International has some good shows. You can tell, because you don't hear about Hitler and WW2 every 45 seconds

439 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:58:22pm

re: #436 SanFranciscoZionist

Rome died, and made us king...well, actually, Britannia did, but who's counting?

Let's say we gave up our delusions of being a great moral force. What would we do then?

maybe we'll actually take care of our citizens

440 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:58:43pm

re: #434 WindUpBird

I side with Wikileaks.
I'm with Glenn Greenwald.

The news is now a product that masquerades as news, a total sham. And for all of wikileaks transgressions, I am coming to the conclusion that it is more a force for good than CNN, MSNBC, or Fox

or at least, it's not a force for abject evil like cable news and talk radio is

I think Wikileaks greatly hyped their own importance. I think Bradley Manning violated the UCMJ. I don't think Assange broke any law anywhere by releasing the documents that he did. I liked wikileaks before they went mainstream (wikileaks hipster?). I don't think any of the Manning leaks were among the most interesting things they've released, just that they've gotten better at PR.

Collateral murder I'm still up in the air about.

I think the Abu Grab scandal was still a Bigger Deal than anything wikileaks has done.

441 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:58:50pm

re: #436 SanFranciscoZionist

Rome died, and made us king...well, actually, Britannia did, but who's counting?

Let's say we gave up our delusions of being a great moral force. What would we do then?

We could start bringing jobs back for the American people. We could start inovating again instead of finding new ways to kill people. We could start educating children and young adults. Build high speed trains and light rail trains. We could work more on finding a cure to cancer...

442 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:58:58pm

re: #438 WindUpBird

The History channel is three steps away from being Alex Jones:1942

I think I learned more about history from playing computer games, than from watching the hysterical silliness on the History Channel.

Didn't the History channel do some borderline-only-for-children ridiculous show about ninjas versus vikings, the yakuza versus Barry Bonds, Wild West Gunfighter versus Samurai, trying to get some of that Mythbusters bread?

History International has some good shows. You can tell, because you don't hear about Hitler and WW2 every 45 seconds

Nah, that was Spike TV's Deadliest Warrior. Truly proof that Hollywood is out of ideas.

443 Querent  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:59:35pm

i think my head just asploded...

444 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:59:43pm

re: #435 Gus 802

OK You're honest about that then. That's good. Seriously. I'm not here to talk about you. And you're not here to talk about me. Right? I'm talking about issues no personalities.

You're doing a pretty piss poor job at that then.

445 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:59:49pm

And the above was not to suggest that non-Americans in general do not have good insights into politics--it's just that the only thing more annoying than a stupid teenage European moonbat is the stupid teenage American moonbat who wants to get into the first moonbat's pants, and is overwhelmed by all this STUFF, you know, that no one in America KNOWS about.

446 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:00:34pm

re: #444 McSpiff

You're doing a pretty piss poor job at that then.

Boohoo.

447 garhighway  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:00:52pm

Morning, all.

More on the King and Spalding mess: it seems that Coca-Cola was going to drop the hammer on them.

Also: what was up with the gag order: by taking the assignment, the firm had to forbid its members from criticizing DOMA? That's pretty strange.

[Link: tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

448 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:00:53pm

re: #439 WindUpBird

maybe we'll actually take care of our citizens

Do we let the rest of the world burn? Granted, we mostly do, but are we prepared to sit back and say we'll do jack-shit all the time?

449 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:02:08pm

re: #443 Querent

i think my head just asploded...

Ah, having one of those kinds of headaches?

/

450 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:02:24pm

re: #440 McSpiff

I think Wikileaks greatly hyped their own importance. I think Bradley Manning violated the UCMJ. I don't think Assange broke any law anywhere by releasing the documents that he did. I liked wikileaks before they went mainstream (wikileaks hipster?). I don't think any of the Manning leaks were among the most interesting things they've released, just that they've gotten better at PR.

Collateral murder I'm still up in the air about.

I think the Abu Grab scandal was still a Bigger Deal than anything wikileaks has done.

I agree that wikileaks is very hype-y, and that Assaunge is a megalomaniacal ass. Which puts him in the junior league of the mainstream media ;-) But I'm glad it's around

Abu Ghirab is huge of course, but we just have no news for real anymore. We have nothing but Dark Future Yellow Journalism, candy fed to docile people.

Wikileaks can't touch the evil of the MSM. Wikileaks would have to climb to neptune to get to the damage Fox News has done to our vulnerable and undereducated country

451 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:03:07pm

I've had a change of heart about Wikileaks. America needs Wikileaks. I now support Wikileaks.

452 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:03:24pm

re: #441 Gus 802

We could start bringing jobs back for the American people. We could start inovating again instead of finding new ways to kill people. We could start educating children and young adults. Build high speed trains and light rail trains. We could work more on finding a cure to cancer...

But do we not do those things because we've spent all our money on guns, or because we don't wish to?

453 McSpiff  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:04:00pm

re: #450 WindUpBird

I agree that wikileaks is very hype-y, and that Assaunge is a megalomaniacal ass. Which puts him in the junior league of the mainstream media ;-) But I'm glad it's around

Abu Ghirab is huge of course, but we just have no news for real anymore. We have nothing but Dark Future Yellow Journalism, candy fed to docile people.

Wikileaks can't touch the evil of the MSM. Wikileaks would have to climb to neptune to get to the damage Fox News has done to our vulnerable and undereducated country

I hate to reply to a well thought out post with just "yep", but you've pretty much hit the nail on the head.

454 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:04:14pm

re: #448 SanFranciscoZionist

Do we let the rest of the world burn? Granted, we mostly do, but are we prepared to sit back and say we'll do jack-shit all the time?

I think we need to solve our military industrial complex problem.


We're like the superhero with cancer and dementia, who is trying to do good, but doing bad because we're just broken

455 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:04:47pm

re: #451 Gus 802

I've had a change of heart about Wikileaks. America needs Wikileaks. I now support Wikileaks.

Now, how about the chick who spent $76,000 so her friends could sing to Obama about Bradley Manning?

456 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:04:57pm

Hey DF! Still want to nuke the Arabs like you said the other day?

457 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:05:04pm

Goodnight, All. Feel free to ignore Gus right now, he's engaged in some late night trolling.

458 Lidane  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:05:21pm

re: #442 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Nah, that was Spike TV's Deadliest Warrior. Truly proof that Hollywood is out of ideas.

I can't harsh on Deadliest Warrior. It's great guilty fun. It's the embodiment of every bullshit session that people have when they're drinking -- "Dude, a ninja could totally beat a Spartan soldier!" "No way! The Spartan would totally kill them first!" Etc.

Besides, the guy who hosts that show is a published academic and is getting his doctorate. I thought that was interesting.

459 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:05:55pm

The Scrabble program also won't take "Jew", or "gi".

"Queers" it will accept.

This Scrabble program has issues.

460 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:06:09pm

re: #457 Dark_Falcon

Goodnight, All. Feel free to ignore Gus right now, he's engaged in some late night trolling.

Give me a break. Sorry if I find your neocon war mongering, anti-union rhetoric irritating.

461 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:06:21pm

re: #458 Lidane

I can't harsh on Deadliest Warrior. It's great guilty fun. It's the embodiment of every bullshit session that people have when they're drinking -- "Dude, a ninja could totally beat a Spartan soldier!" "No way! The Spartan would totally kill them first!" Etc.

Besides, the guy who hosts that show is a published academic and is getting his doctorate. I thought that was interesting.

Eh, don't mind me. I'm still sore over the Green Beret losing to the Spetnaz.

462 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:06:27pm

re: #457 Dark_Falcon

Goodnight, All. Feel free to ignore Gus right now, he's engaged in some late night trolling.

Venting, I would say. It's late-night Gus.

463 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:06:35pm

And your obsession with the "stalkers". Boring.

464 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:08:05pm

Well, I'd say we've had an enlightening and productive group session. Same time next week?

465 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:08:26pm

re: #451 Gus 802

I've had a change of heart about Wikileaks. America needs Wikileaks. I now support Wikileaks.

Wikileaks didn't change, Wl and Assange are deeply flawed. But what else do we have? it's that America is getting so much worse that relative to Wikileaks, we now need it. rachel maddow can only scream so loud, and she[s preaching to the choir. Most of America wouldn't trust a lesbian gen-xer to do their laundry, much less trust her (excellent) journalism. They simply do not care.

if all news is lies and garbage and talking heads and Obama-centered racism, what's left? Guerilla journalism. And it's not like you can stop Fox news. The people who believe fox news are lost to us. They simply are lost, done. Minds, cancerous. Ideas, poisoned. Like voluntary dementia, manipulated like puppets

Much like health care, the business model of news has consumed the news.

466 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:08:33pm

Like I said. No wonder we have a hard time attracting liberals to LGF.

467 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:08:44pm

re: #455 SanFranciscoZionist

Now, how about the chick who spent $76,000 so her friends could sing to Obama about Bradley Manning?

we're talking about it, aren't we?

468 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:09:10pm

re: #464 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Well, I'd say we've had an enlightening and productive group session. Same time next week?

No, no, you have to wait to say that until AFTER I've burst into tears and run out of the room.

Which I would do, but this weird homophobic Scrabble program is getting on my nerves.

469 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:09:27pm

re: #457 Dark_Falcon

Goodnight, All. Feel free to ignore Gus right now, he's engaged in some late night trolling.

Sorry it's not 2004 anymore


sorry we don't believe the lies

470 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:09:52pm

And this morning's neo-Kahanism sure didn't help.

Oops.

471 Lidane  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:10:13pm

re: #461 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Eh, don't mind me. I'm still sore over the Green Beret losing to the Spetnaz.

Hehe. And I'm still annoyed that Sun Tzu lost to Vlad the Impaler. We can't always get what we want. ;)

472 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:10:27pm

re: #467 WindUpBird

we're talking about it, aren't we?

I suppose. I guess if I had $76,000 to blow on something political, that wouldn't be it.

473 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:10:35pm

re: #468 SanFranciscoZionist

No, no, you have to wait to say that until AFTER I've burst into tears and run out of the room.

Which I would do, but this weird homophobic Scrabble program is getting on my nerves.

scrabble is only good in person, where you can argue with your competitors about words, hear the rattling tiles, watch the language nerds lose it :D

I never got scrabble online, like chess online. Poker online. if I can't see the person, it's no fun for me

474 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:10:59pm

re: #470 Gus 802

And this morning's neo-Kahanism sure didn't help.

Oops.

Part of me wants to ask about that, and part of me is quite sure I don't want to know.

475 sagehen  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:11:02pm

re: #455 SanFranciscoZionist

Now, how about the chick who spent $76,000 so her friends could sing to Obama about Bradley Manning?

For $76K, you'd think they could have found a chick with a better singing voice.

476 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:11:17pm

re: #470 Gus 802

And this morning's neo-Kahanism sure didn't help.

Oops.

NO FUCKING DOUBT!

What in the hell, you think you know someone and then, apocalyptic death rant and extremist religious fury

477 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:11:40pm

re: #474 SanFranciscoZionist

Part of me wants to ask about that, and part of me is quite sure I don't want to know.

oh man :(

478 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:11:40pm

re: #474 SanFranciscoZionist

Part of me wants to ask about that, and part of me is quite sure I don't want to know.

Some BS about napalming Palestinians. It was deleted.

479 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:12:10pm

re: #478 Gus 802

Some BS about napalming Palestinians. It was deleted.

I h8 all religion!

480 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:12:29pm

re: #473 WindUpBird

scrabble is only good in person, where you can argue with your competitors about words, hear the rattling tiles, watch the language nerds lose it :D

I never got scrabble online, like chess online. Poker online. if I can't see the person, it's no fun for me

Yeah, games of strategy and skill don't really seem to translate well to online play. It's impossible to read the poker face of a guy whose only interaction with you is via text chat.

481 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:12:35pm

re: #453 McSpiff

I hate to reply to a well thought out post with just "yep", but you've pretty much hit the nail on the head.

thanks ^_^;

482 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:13:06pm

re: #479 WindUpBird

I h8 all religion!

But religion never causes conflict!

//

483 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:13:30pm

re: #480 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yeah, games of strategy and skill don't really seem to translate well to online play. It's impossible to read the poker face of a guy whose only interaction with you is via text chat.

the online game I loved most was an FPS mod called Day of defeat. I played with three other guys at PCs in the same room, on my team

versus some guys in SF. It was awesome!

But yeha, board games, I dig board games. In person! with beers, good friends, nothing better

484 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:14:25pm

re: #482 Gus 802

But religion never causes conflict!

//

Never get involved in a land war in Asia.

485 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:14:29pm

re: #482 Gus 802

But religion never causes conflict!

//

I love not being told I have to accept an extremist's idea of God, when it comes to war that might result in a WORLD war.

No different than any other fanatic. No different at all.

486 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:14:39pm

re: #485 WindUpBird

Love BEINg told ;-)

487 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:14:53pm

I'm so glad I slept in this morning so I'd be in good shape for my job interview.

488 Lidane  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:15:05pm

OK. Off to bed. G'night Lizards! :)

489 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:15:26pm

re: #483 WindUpBird

the online game I loved most was an FPS mod called Day of defeat. I played with three other guys at PCs in the same room, on my team

versus some guys in SF. It was awesome!

But yeha, board games, I dig board games. In person! with beers, good friends, nothing better

Never played Day of Defeat, was always either into Medal of Honor or the Battlefield series. At, I was until my computer started choking on online play. Think that was because FiOS around here was still relatively new and between it and a brand new computer, I couldn't get a ping that didn't leave me lurching around like a zombie.

490 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:16:05pm

Since you somewhat asked. I believe in a one-state solution. I oppose the Likud Party. I think Netanyahu is a war monger with a smiley face. I also think that we've seen nothing but trouble since that far-right winger Netanyahu was elected into office.

Any questions?

491 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:17:25pm

re: #490 Gus 802

Since you somewhat asked. I believe in a one-state solution. I oppose the Likud Party. I think Netanyahu is a war monger with a smiley face. I also think that we've seen nothing but trouble since that far-right winger Netanyahu was elected into office.

Any questions?

*raises hand* Will any of this be on the test?

///

492 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:17:41pm

re: #490 Gus 802

Since you somewhat asked. I believe in a one-state solution. I oppose the Likud Party. I think Netanyahu is a war monger with a smiley face. I also think that we've seen nothing but trouble since that far-right winger Netanyahu was elected into office.

Any questions?

Absolutely none, since I'm not touching any of this with a ten-foot pole at eleven fifteen at night.

493 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:18:04pm

re: #452 SanFranciscoZionist

But do we not do those things because we've spent all our money on guns, or because we don't wish to?

we have people in power whoa re in power by manipulating our love and fetishization of war, and machines of war, and military might


That's the beast we need to starve.

it drowns out our humanity as a nation. We can't hear our own failings on our home front, we can't hear about schools, health care, rights

because it's not easy solutions. it's not sexy to fix health care and worry about seniors and medicare and disabled people and bad schools. War is always the shinier object. States elect whoever can get hem the most massive defense contracts.

And then people are put to work! Building more fancy death machines, more waste

494 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:18:24pm

re: #489 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Never played Day of Defeat, was always either into Medal of Honor or the Battlefield series. At, I was until my computer started choking on online play. Think that was because FiOS around here was still relatively new and between it and a brand new computer, I couldn't get a ping that didn't leave me lurching around like a zombie.

ooog I feel ya *_*

495 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:19:38pm

re: #492 SanFranciscoZionist

Absolutely none, since I'm not touching any of this with a ten-foot pole at eleven fifteen at night.

No problem. I just wanted to get that off my chest. I do know that at least 50 percent of Israelis would probably agree with me. Maybe 40 percent.

496 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:19:53pm

re: #489 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Never played Day of Defeat, was always either into Medal of Honor or the Battlefield series. At, I was until my computer started choking on online play. Think that was because FiOS around here was still relatively new and between it and a brand new computer, I couldn't get a ping that didn't leave me lurching around like a zombie.

ever played Operation Flashpoint or ARM-A? Like a hobby kit to put together the most hilarious experimental battles ever

Five guys in tractors versus a biplane! Hunt the dude in the Toyota Celica with fifty tanks!

497 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:21:11pm

I also think that Samson, Reuters News Watch, and Camera are all propagandists of sorts.

498 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:22:41pm

re: #496 WindUpBird

ever played Operation Flashpoint or ARM-A? Like a hobby kit to put together the most hilarious experimental battles ever

Five guys in tractors versus a biplane! Hunt the dude in the Toyota Celica with fifty tanks!

Nah, haven't played any FPS games in awhile, least not of the multiplayer variety. Most recent ones I've played have been Fallout and Bioshock. Not that they aren't great loads of fun, especially if you download plenty of mods.

499 Querent  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:22:48pm

re: #310 ggt

I actually tried to play "derp" in Words With Friends the other day. Game wouldn't accept it.

I've been hanging-out with you guys too much. LOL

Tell the damn game that "Derp" is the newly accepted scientific unit of measure for Stupidity, the way Decibel is for sound. As in, "the stupidity coming out of Pat Robertson's god-bothering piehole these days is registering in the high gigaDerps"

500 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:23:18pm

And Barry Rubin is a big time wingnut.

501 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:23:29pm

re: #497 Gus 802

I assume most news is propaganda now

Drudge links like news, but then the news link goes to an insane Townhall or CBN op ed.

Everyone else does it too, HuffPo is full of Weekly-World-News esque gibberish and misleading headlines, braying commenters fighting for their little badges and privileges and superuser status that are honestly depressing to behold.

502 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:24:04pm

re: #498 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Nah, haven't played any FPS games in awhile, least not of the multiplayer variety. Most recent ones I've played have been Fallout and Bioshock. Not that they aren't great loads of fun, especially if you download plenty of mods.

I haven't played anything in like a year *_* but yeah, Fallout is mighty :D

Bioshock was really good, but it didn't quite get to the glory of System Shock 2.

503 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:25:47pm

And there's a reason why LVQ wasn't banned. I'm not blind.

504 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:26:22pm

re: #502 WindUpBird

I haven't played anything in like a year *_* but yeah, Fallout is mighty :D

Bioshock was really good, but it didn't quite get to the glory of System Shock 2.

Haven't played anything in a year? Have you tried out Fallout: New Vegas? It's still a little buggy, but it's a pretty excellent game. They have one DLC out already and are supposed to have three more out in the next few months.

505 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:27:55pm

re: #327 SanFranciscoZionist

Oh, hell, that's nothing. I worked for a nice little Catholic elementary school. Couple of years after I left, they fired the science teacher midyear on trumped-up charges having to do with her opposition to Prop 8. Then the bitch who was running the school got her ass fired for embezzling, and vanished with twenty-five thousand dollars of the school's money.

(But did they hire back the woman she lied about, harassed, and ultimately got fired? Did they even say, "Sorry, we might have been wrong about her"? Why, no, they did not.)

I'm pretty sure your school didn't cover up a rape or a nearly fatal case of management-encouraged neglect

Maybe they did though!

506 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:29:10pm

re: #505 WindUpBird

I'm pretty sure your school didn't cover up a rape or a nearly fatal case of management-encouraged neglect

Maybe they did though!

Well, there was the place that was venting carbon dioxide into one of the classrooms. No one died, but a teacher did end up in the hospital with a bad case of pneumonia.

507 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:29:37pm

re: #503 Gus 802

And there's a reason why LVQ wasn't banned. I'm not blind.

I don't think he should be banned, but I do think he should be checked FUCKING hard, he used to be a guy I liked, and now I just can't even believe what he says, it's insane

he just brings the whole place down when he shows up

508 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:30:51pm

re: #507 WindUpBird

I don't think he should be banned, but I do think he should be checked FUCKING hard, he used to be a guy I liked, and now I just can't even believe what he says, it's insane

he just brings the whole place down when he shows up

Yeah, but you know what I mean. It was directed at Palestinians.

509 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:32:13pm

re: #506 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, there was the place that was venting carbon dioxide into one of the classrooms. No one died, but a teacher did end up in the hospital with a bad case of pneumonia.

aaaagh that sucks *_*

I think i get so mad about this stuff because it's like right to my face they'd do this. And then they'd threaten us. Each group home was it's own little balkanized fiefdom. far enough from rome, and management can just abuse the poor penniless (almost always minority) employees to the point of tears


i got six or seven people fired at that place. Most of them were my bosses. because they were so evil and so dumb, they just assumed we were dumb and afraid.

Of course it never helped, whoever was fired was replaced with someone else just like em

510 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:33:01pm

The Scrabble game will not accept 'fuck'. I tried.

511 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:34:12pm

re: #508 Gus 802

Yeah, but you know what I mean. It was directed at Palestinians.

I just figure it ain't my blog, I don't get to ban anyone

But I do express myself and I am never going to be bullied around by LudwigVonfanatic ever fucking again. That was the last straw, he's just another psycho fundie to me now.

A fucking insult. that guy is my intellectual inferior

512 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:34:17pm

12 eyes for an eye and 12 teeth for one tooth. It's the Likud way.

513 shiplord kirel  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:34:43pm

re: #361 Gus 802

Heck. I'm really an air war buff. But enough is enough. I'm tired of all the BS and the hyped up fears we build just to spend billions more on stuff we really don't need. If you want to fight this so called GWOT you need A-10s or even less. Even an A-1 Skyraider can do the job.

I saw Skyraiders in action. They can indeed. At the time (1972) they were having a tough time with SA-7s, though not as tough as my fellow chopper drivers and I were having. Modern countermeasures and tactics could pretty well eliminate that though.

514 Querent  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:35:20pm

re: #449 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Ah, having one of those kinds of headaches?

/

Yep.

And it's got MORAL DERPITUDE written all over it...

515 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:35:45pm

Damn. I'm doomed now!

516 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:36:08pm

re: #515 Gus 802

Damn. I'm doomed now!


Hunter S: But the doomed, sir? What about the doomed?
Nixon: Fuck the doomed.

517 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:36:51pm

re: #516 WindUpBird

Hunter S: But the doomed, sir? What about the doomed?
Nixon: Fuck the doomed.

I decided a long time ago not to be afraid of my own shadow.

518 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:37:12pm

re: #515 Gus 802

Damn. I'm doomed now!

I DEFINITELY shouldn't have asked.

And I'm continuing to play Scrabble over here.

519 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:38:26pm

re: #515 Gus 802

Damn. I'm doomed now!

You're as doomed as doomed can be, I must say.

//

520 Querent  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:38:26pm

re: #487 SanFranciscoZionist

Lots of lizardy luck!

521 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:38:46pm

re: #518 SanFranciscoZionist

I DEFINITELY shouldn't have asked.

And I'm continuing to play Scrabble over here.

What's the big deal though. It's not like things are working anyway.

522 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:39:24pm

re: #520 Querent

Lots of lizardy luck!

Thank you. It went pretty well. Just a summer gig, but it would be fun. It's at one of the old buildings in the Presidio--couldn't find a prettier place to have a summer job at.

523 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:39:46pm

re: #521 Gus 802

DOOM!

Youtube Video

there's a reason doom metal is one of my favorite genres (and yes, it is a distinct genre)

524 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:42:50pm

re: #523 WindUpBird

DOOM!

[Video]there's a reason doom metal is one of my favorite genres (and yes, it is a distinct genre)

Not enough booze. Guess I went beyond reading in between the lines tonight. It's the same stuff that scared off Windsagio. Maybe that's why I was thinking about it. It's hard being quiet all the time though. Having to sound like Commentary Magazine, JPost or get ostracized.

525 Querent  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:43:07pm

re: #522 SanFranciscoZionist

very cool.

and if all goes well, i should be starting a new gig too.

posting will be even more sporadic and even less coherent, but at least i'll be a) staying in my industry and b) doing something completely different from what i used to. It'll be a refreshing change of pace.

(of course after 23 months of 'state-funded sabbatical' anything would be a refreshing change of pace...)

526 Querent  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:44:25pm

re: #524 Gus 802

Not enough booze. Guess I went beyond reading in between the lines tonight. It's the same stuff that scared off Windsagio. Maybe that's why I was thinking about it. It's hard being quiet all the time though. Having to sound like Commentary Magazine, JPost or get ostracized.

There's a reason i don't get involved in deep arguments around here...

527 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:44:48pm

And the dinging action at the Overnight Open Thread makes it clear.

528 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:47:09pm

That's the thing about wars. Sooner or later you become just like your enemy.

529 shiplord kirel  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:47:52pm

A-1 Skyraider

Youtube Video

The "exceptional attributes" of this aircraft were likely the result of it having been developed late in World War 2, incorporating all the hard-won lessons of that conflict. It was designed by the great Ed Heinemann, whose other products include the SBD dive-bomber of Midway fame, the A-26 Invader, and the A-4 Skyhawk attack aircraft. Like all Heinemann designs the Skyraider is notable for great simplicity and elegance of design. Skyraiders were too late for WW2 but they saw heavy combat in Korea and Vietnam, as well as with the French in Algeria.

530 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:48:31pm

re: #528 Gus 802

That's the thing about wars. Sooner or later you become just like your enemy.

Dead.

531 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:50:00pm

re: #524 Gus 802

You know a million times more about the subject than I am


I just dislike being talked to like I'm a child, by my intellectual inferior who is telling ME how to feel about spirituality.

If I started forcing my spirtuality on Ludwig, interrupting him like he did me? I'd be downdinged on a logarithmic scale. But that's what he was laying on me. That religious contempt I know so well from growing up being the only kid who never went to church of all my friends. regarded with suspicion! Whee! WHY DON'T YOU BELIEVE?!?!?!?!

Athiests and irreligious people are always crapped on, and never represented in Government. Not here, babe! Been so since I was a kid. My parents have cut off ties with friends when the Jesus talk became too much, when they started trying to get me to go to their church.

I'd rather hang out with NJD. At least i know where he stands. At least he's consistent.

532 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:50:07pm

re: #523 WindUpBird

DOOM!

[Video]there's a reason doom metal is one of my favorite genres (and yes, it is a distinct genre)

Allow me to rebut that

Youtube Video
533 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:50:43pm

re: #526 Querent

There's a reason i don't get involved in deep arguments around here...

this is why I DO. i came here to do it, because it's a closed system. And I don't have friends of friends yelling at me on the phone becaue of a thing I said.

534 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:51:26pm

re: #532 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

ever heard Bolt Thrower? They're the oiginal 'Warhammer fan's metal" :D

535 Targetpractice  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:52:44pm

re: #529 shiplord kirel

A-1 Skyraider

[Video]The "exceptional attributes" of this aircraft were likely the result of it having been developed late in World War 2, incorporating all the hard-won lessons of that conflict. It was designed by the great Ed Heinemann, whose other products include the SBD dive-bomber of Midway fame, the A-26 Invader, and the A-4 Skyhawk attack aircraft. Like all Heinemann designs the Skyraider is notable for great simplicity and elegance of design. Skyraiders were too late for WW2 but they saw heavy combat in Korea and Vietnam, as well as with the French in Algeria.

Ironically enough, all the "experts" of the time declared that the Skyraider would have a short and uneventful life. That the Jet Age had made it obsolete overnight and that it would be on and off carrier decks in only a couple years. Then the Korean War started...

536 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:52:44pm

sorry guys, i'll let it drop

that whole argument brought up a lot of obscure memories

537 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:54:21pm

re: #536 WindUpBird

sorry guys, i'll let it drop

that whole argument brought up a lot of obscure memories

See. That's part of the problem. Any view opposite of the party line calls to be dropped. And I am talking about the Middle East.

538 Kragar  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:54:26pm

re: #534 WindUpBird

ever heard Bolt Thrower? They're the oiginal 'Warhammer fan's metal" :D

Heard of them? I had their tapes!

Youtube Video
539 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:55:34pm

And one of the ironies about that is that it's the same party line of the Republican Party. That's why I laugh sometimes.

540 Gus  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:57:05pm

'Bout time I shut up. I'm ejecting. Later.

541 Querent  Mon, Apr 25, 2011 11:57:43pm

re: #533 WindUpBird

this is why I DO. i came here to do it, because it's a closed system. And I don't have friends of friends yelling at me on the phone becaue of a thing I said.

then by all means carry on, Birdman -- and i'll keep updinging you every time you bust out with a colorful metaphor.

(doing my small part to counteract those serial-down-dinger yutzes...)

542 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:02:20am

re: #537 Gus 802

See. That's part of the problem. Any view opposite of the party line calls to be dropped. And I am talking about the Middle East.

haha I mean in the sense that i'm disappearing up my own ass and just ranting about a guy who's not here ;-)

I won't stop talking, don't worry!

543 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:02:29am

NOW I GO WORK *_*

544 Kragar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:03:12am

Damn it WUB, you made me wake up my wife.

"What the hell is that?"

"Bolt Thrower."

"Huh?"

545 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:04:41am

*sigh* Some days, it's not worth chewing out of the restraints.

546 Kragar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:06:05am

re: #545 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

*sigh* Some days, it's not worth chewing out of the restraints.

I was always partial to..

We come into the world naked, screaming and covered in blood... and there is no reason for the fun to stop there.

547 shiplord kirel  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:06:48am

re: #535 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Ironically enough, all the "experts" of the time declared that the Skyraider would have a short and uneventful life. That the Jet Age had made it obsolete overnight and that it would be on and off carrier decks in only a couple years. Then the Korean War started...

Nearly forgot I had these. This is my model of a French Skyraider from the Algerian war period, about 1960:
Image: skyraider_alg.jpg
This one represents an armed T-6 Texan from the same period:
Image: T6.jpeg
....and a French Navy F-4U7 Corsair from the Suez War period of 1956 (these were also heavily used in Algeria).Image: Corsair_Suez.jpg
The French had plenty of jets by this time, including supersonic ones, but quickly found that prop-planes were more suitable for coinsurgency operations.

548 Kragar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:08:14am

Unfortunate headline with an unfortunate name, I haven't even read the story, but hey, its late

We will come out clean: Dikshit

549 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:08:15am

re: #531 WindUpBird

You know a million times more about the subject than I am

I just dislike being talked to like I'm a child, by my intellectual inferior who is telling ME how to feel about spirituality.

If I started forcing my spirtuality on Ludwig, interrupting him like he did me? I'd be downdinged on a logarithmic scale. But that's what he was laying on me. That religious contempt I know so well from growing up being the only kid who never went to church of all my friends. regarded with suspicion! Whee! WHY DON'T YOU BELIEVE?!?!?!?!

Athiests and irreligious people are always crapped on, and never represented in Government. Not here, babe! Been so since I was a kid. My parents have cut off ties with friends when the Jesus talk became too much, when they started trying to get me to go to their church.

I'd rather hang out with NJD. At least i know where he stands. At least he's consistent.

In Jr. High and High School a good friend's family used to often take me to Overlake Christian Church to listen to this guy. Five years after graduation we learned this:

Moorehead's troubles began in July 1996, when he and another man were arrested in a public restroom in Daytona Beach, Fla., for allegedly masturbating in front of undercover police officers. The case was later dropped, but as word got around the congregation about the incident, allegations began to mount against him.

The accusations were devastating, particularly given Moorehead's public position against homosexuality and gay rights.

An investigation commissioned by Overlake's 13-member board of elders eventually turned up 17 men who alleged Moorehead had inappropriately touched them or tried to. The elders dismissed this report, saying they could find no biblical grounds in the accusations to fire Moorehead.

Moorehead steadfastly denied any wrongdoing, saying he was not guilty "of these horrible, perverted, reprehensible accusations." He resigned, he said, because he had become a liability to the congregation.

After harsh criticism from other pastors on the Eastside for the way they handled the accusations, the elders admitted they had second thoughts about it and told the congregation they may not have shown proper sensitivity toward the accusers. But they stopped short of an apology.

550 dell*nix  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:18:42am

T-28 CoinFrom the back seat.

551 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:36:45am

Trump!

You are

SUCH A TROLL!

Seriously, this isn't politics, this is Trump pulling some Andy Kaufman thing, holy hell

552 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:38:15am

re: #549 goddamnedfrank

BOB MOOREHEAD! Totally remember that guy, didn't se ehim or anything, btu I knew some folks who did, I think

Man oh man, I wonder if we ever crossed paths in Seattle

553 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:38:37am

re: #544 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Damn it WUB, you made me wake up my wife.

"What the hell is that?"

"Bolt Thrower."

"Huh?"

YES

554 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 1:11:27am

re: #95 WindUpBird

still one of the most important metal bands ever

[Video]

Wow, nothing like old school Earache bands.
Napalm Death, Carcass, Entombed, Godflesh, OLD

If you haven't listened to OLD before, they're way way ahead of their time. even today, they're probably still ahead of our time. That's John Zorn playing the Sax.

Youtube Video

Still one of my favorite bands and albums of all time.

555 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 1:13:38am

re: #554 bloodstar

Wow, nothing like old school Earache bands.
Napalm Death, Carcass, Entombed, Godflesh, OLD

If you haven't listened to OLD before, they're way way ahead of their time. even today, they're probably still ahead of our time. That's John Zorn playing the Sax.

[Video]Still one of my favorite bands and albums of all time.

DUDE!

ENTOMBED!!!!

I LOOOVE Entombed, Clandestine just turned my world upside down, so massive

Godflesh and Carcass also mighty

This OLD sound is pretty fantastic, I will be purchasing this, it's full of awesome shrieky power, reminds me of Praxis

556 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 1:15:00am

re: #554 bloodstar

My favorite extreme metal band right now is YOB

Very Oregon, and just heavier than a dwarf star, very much my kind of extreme letal, cosmic midtempo dissonance, thundering 12/8 rhythms

Youtube Video
557 AK-47%  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 1:29:19am

Femininity is under attack by lesbians. Fertility is under attack by right-to-choicers. Masculinity is under attack by the Gay Agenda. The innocence of childhood is under attack by video games and pop music. Heterosexual marriage is under attack by gay marriage advocates. Christmas and Easter are under attack by secularist Islamists.

The Second Amendment is under attack from gun-control advocates. Our border is under attack by illegal immigrants. Our economy is under attack by the Chinese. Our propsperity and lifestyle are under attack by environmentalists.

And we all know that the best defense is a good offense combined with a large arsenal of handguns and assault weapons.


/

558 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 1:30:36am

re: #556 WindUpBird

My favorite extreme metal band right now is YOB

Very Oregon, and just heavier than a dwarf star, very much my kind of extreme letal, cosmic midtempo dissonance, thundering 12/8 rhythms

[Video]

Now that's a long song. It's pretty good though, nice pacing and as you said, it's got a good mid tempo that lets you get into the groove of the song. Reminds me of My Dying Bride.

Of course, I've drifted away from metal, into Gothic/Industrial and Synthpop So I'm a bit out of the loop with quite a bit of the current metal scene.

With that, I'm going to bed, and I leave you some Freezepop :)

Youtube Video

It's so sweet and fun, if you can't love Freezepop, then there's just no hope for you. ;)

559 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 1:33:54am

re: #556 WindUpBird

Awesome. The singer isn't my favorite, but the rest was perfect...

560 AK-47%  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 1:38:32am

The Humans are Dead...

Youtube Video
561 boxhead  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 1:52:44am

Maybe I don't get Pat's concerns, but what do the fine people of Lesbos have to do with a woman's right to own her own body?

//

562 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 2:02:10am

Check out these tits on hot lesbos!1!

563 Decatur Deb  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 2:23:33am

Lez It Be:

Youtube Video
564 AK-47%  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 2:38:49am

re: #561 boxhead

Maybe I don't get Pat's concerns, but what do the fine people of Lesbos have to do with a woman's right to own her own body?

//

I am feeling pedantic this morning and need look no further than the Wiki site you posted to find the answer to the question and point out anohter outrage:

"One meaning of the word lesbian derives from the poems of Sappho, who was born in Lesbos and who wrote with powerful emotional content directed toward other women. It is due to this association that Lesbos and especially the town of Eresos, her birthplace, are visited frequently by lesbian tourists, much to the chagrin of some deeply conservative and traditionalist Greek Orthodox elements of the island's population. In 2008, a group of Lesbian islanders lost a court case against the Homosexual and Lesbian Community of Greece.

The Lesbian islander group had requested a legal injunction to bar homosexual groups from using the word "lesbian" in their names, which the petitioners claim violated their human rights as it is "insulting" and disgraces them around the world.

...

Meanwhile, the protective structures in Holland used to hold back the sea are protesting their use to connotate lesbians...

565 laZardo  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 3:08:48am

So I know it's more than a month late for Saint Paddy's but Obama is a SECRET IRISHMAN.

/dun dun dunnnn

//also good evening

566 boxhead  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 3:14:20am

re: #564 ralphieboy


yep... isn't language fun? All folks need to realize that languages are living and change. Unless you are French and have an official French language committee.

567 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 3:15:46am

re: #564 ralphieboy

Fun fact: The finger-in-the-dike story is American, not Dutch, in origin.

568 AK-47%  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 3:18:40am

re: #566 boxhead


I think it is just an example of the Greek equivalent of our American Tea Party/Fox outrage: Lesbian with a capital L is for inhabitants of the island, lesbian with a small l is for female homosexuals.

Ran across a town in Scotland called Battledykes. Sounds fearsome...

569 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 3:36:09am

re: #568 ralphieboy

There's also:

Spunky Puddle, Ohio
Humptulips, Washington
New Erection, Virginia
Big Beaver, Pennsylvania

570 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 3:38:34am

re: #569 Obdicut

Also:
Intercourse, Pennsylvania

571 AK-47%  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 3:40:13am

Real towns in Germany:

Krostitz (home of Germany's first breast-correction surgery center?)
Groptitz (home of Germany's first drive-in movie theater?)
Wang
Dingolfing (sounds adventurous)
Gumpen (The local forest is called the "Gumpener Wald, or "The Forest of Gumpen")

and a town in Austria called Fucking, which (really) recently marketed a brand of pale ale (helles Bier) called "Fucking Hell".

572 researchok  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 4:04:46am

Morning, all

573 RogueOne  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 4:23:17am

re: #570 prononymous

Also:
Intercourse, Pennsylvania

Gobblers Knob, IN.

Youtube Video
574 laZardo  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 4:27:11am

Meanwhile, in Syria...

"Let Obama come and take Syria, let Israel come and take Syria, let the Jews come - anything is better than Bashar Assad."

...wat

575 RogueOne  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 4:41:17am

The "War on Cops" That Isn't
[Link: reason.com...]


Richard Roberts, spokesman for the International Union of Police Associations, told MSNBC, "It's not a fluke.…There's a perception among officers in the field that there's a war on cops going on." Smith County, Texas, Sheriff J.B. Smith told Tyler's KLTV-TV, "I think it's a hundred times more likely today that an officer will be assaulted compared to 20, 30 years ago. It has become one of the most hazardous jobs in the United States, undoubtedly—in the top five."
....
In fact, the number of on-the-job police fatalities has dropped nearly 50 percent in the last two decades, even as the total number of cops has doubled. According to the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund, 279 cops were killed on the job in 1974, the worst year on record. That number steadily decreased to just 116 in 2009.

The leading cause of death for cops on duty is car accidents, not violence. For the last several years, the number of officers intentionally killed on the job each year has ranged from 45 to 60, out of about 850,000 cops on the beat. (The latter number is from the Fraternal Order of Police; other estimates put the number as low as 550,000.) Contrary to Sheriff Smith's claim, data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics indicate that policing isn't among the 10 most dangerous occupations in the country, let alone "the top five," even if you include traffic accidents.

576 RogueOne  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 4:41:56am

Gotta run, If I'm not back this afternoon...Enjoy the day people

577 Shropshire_Slasher  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 4:45:39am

re: #575 RogueOne
NY just instituted a new law requiring drivers to move to the left on multilane interstate highways when police have someone pulled over, or slow down on two lane roads. Believe it or not, people don't do it.

578 Varek Raith  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 4:48:09am

Hat tip to Charles.

Wash. Times: "Obama To Christians: Forget You"

In an April 25 editorial headlined, "Obama To Christians: Forget You," The Washington Times complained that the White House did not issue "official statements for either Easter or Good Friday" and wrote that "[t]his basket of Easter problems underscores Mr. Obama's continuing problem with perceptions of his religious identity."

As Media Matters has noted, despite assertions by the right-wing media to the contrary, presidential proclamations have not historically marked religious holidays. And as Little Green Footballs blogger Charles Johnson noted, presidents going back through at least 1980 have not released a proclamation about Easter.

579 AK-47%  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 4:55:15am

re: #577 Shropshire_Slasher

NY just instituted a new law requiring drivers to move to the left on multilane interstate highways when police have someone pulled over, or slow down on two lane roads. Believe it or not, people don't do it.

The people in charge of protocol for the Royal wedding issued a directive that tweeting will not be allowed. Because people would...

580 Varek Raith  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 4:59:59am

Forgive me my British friends.
I don't care about the wedding.
Not a single bit.
Nor your 'u's
:)

581 laZardo  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:00:47am

re: #578 Varek Raith

I remember a comment when Charles had an article in the Guardian:

Charles Johnson in the Guardian? Prepare for fisticuffs!

How times have changed...

582 laZardo  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:01:05am

re: #580 Varek Raith

Forgive me my British friends.
I don't care about the wedding.
Not a single bit.
Nor your 'u's
:)

Not their metric system- oh. (;

583 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:01:35am

re: #580 Varek Raith

Forgive me my British friends.
I don't care about the wedding.
Not a single bit.
Nor your 'u's
:)

We don't care either, except that it's an automatic day off. You're forgiven!

584 Varek Raith  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:01:50am

re: #582 laZardo

Not their metric system- oh. (;

Actually I use the metric system.
Architecture class converted me to it.
:)

585 Varek Raith  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:05:23am

re: #583 iceweasel

We don't care either, except that it's an automatic day off. You're forgiven!

Hooray for days off!
The media over here is ridiculous.
Lol.

586 laZardo  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:10:51am

re: #584 Varek Raith

Actually I use the metric system.
Architecture class converted me to it.
:)

I live in one of those countries that juggles both the metric and "old" systems. For example distances between places are in kilometers, but we still use "Letter" size paper for printing.

587 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:12:59am

re: #585 Varek Raith

Hooray for days off!
The media over here is ridiculous.
Lol.

We don't have TV and I only listen to BBC Radio 4, so we're spared the avalanche of bs about the royal wedding. Also Scotland in general cares a whole lot less than England does about it. It'll be a normal day off here for us.

588 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:29:11am

re: #574 laZardo

How about Jordan?

589 Ericus58  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:30:52am

Wow - what a long thread and I don't have the time to fully read it all.
However, I'll capture a few posts from earlier to highlight my thoughts and agreements expressed:

elisabeth

Hey, Pat, some Lefty women can't have babies for medical reasons so, "fuck you." Seriously, fuck you.

I'm tired of these intolerant assholes making assumptions about what "lefties" think or want.

Tell it, Girl.

Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

If they would actually think for a little bit, Pat wouldn't have an audience.

Ain't that the freakin' truth. The suspension of critical thinking has shown itself with anyone still listening to this clown.

Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

By Pat's own "logic," infertile women are at the same level on the "playing field" as lesbians. I'm sure that they'll be thrilled to hear that. *rolls eyes*

Oh, if we only could attribute Robertson's ramblings to having a logical meaning...

HappyWarrior

Needs to be pointed out that this is the same man who said we deserved 9-11 because we tolerate gays/lesbians and abortion. He's always been a miserable human being.

Oh, this point here still makes my blood boil... and he wasn't the only "Preacher" to ascribe to this line of thinking...

SanFranciscoZionist

Most of the lesbians I know have kids.

Once again, SFZ - you make one of the spot on observations that speak to the heart of this Hateful position by Robertson.
A very good friend of mine who I have come to know from work... she and her partner have two wonderful children. They have a family that is a true blessing to know.

They have a Love that Robertson and his ilk will never come to match.

590 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:33:52am

re: #562 prononymous

That's got to be the funniest post in LGF History.

591 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 5:48:33am

re: #590 ProLifeLiberal

I'm glad you enjoyed it. I made that pic 6 years and 3 days ago for occasions just like this one.

Have a good morning lizards. I must sleep now, as all good nocturnal desert reptiles must.

592 prairiefire  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:16:43am

re: #583 iceweasel

We don't care either, except that it's an automatic day off. You're forgiven!

I care! Sunday was chock a block with royalty porn on BBC America.

593 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:26:00am

re: #562 prononymous

welldonesir

594 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:28:13am

re: #569 Obdicut

There's also:

Spunky Puddle, Ohio
Humptulips, Washington
New Erection, Virginia
Big Beaver, Pennsylvania

been to humptulips!


The best name of a town in Washington to smoke out tourists? Make them say Puyallup

595 Interesting Times  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:28:15am

re: #592 prairiefire

I care! Sunday was chock a block with royalty porn on BBC America.

And soon, all the Canadian channels will be as well, much to my annoyance :P

Consider - April 29th (last I checked, anyway) will also be the day of Mark Kelly's shuttle launch, to be attended by Gabrielle Giffords.

Let's just say I know which love story of the day I find more inspiring :)

596 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:28:19am

re: #592 prairiefire

I care! Sunday was chock a block with royalty porn on BBC America.

It's strange. The Brits really love their aristocracy. Chanel 4 has a show called Country House Rescue. It's a reality show of people who open up their ancient mansions to tour groups to make money so the can afford the maintenance. Working class people actually volunteer to do free repairs on someone's mansion. I couldn't imagine that working here in the states.

597 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:28:22am

re: #592 prairiefire

I care! Sunday was chock a block with royalty porn on BBC America.

Hitchens had a good rant at slate about what Kate's getting into. Reine and someone else paged it, IIRC.

598 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:30:56am

On original topic, Robertson and I think Falwell have said this before about lesbians, and the 'feminist agenda'. Basically that feminists are all ugly women who can't find a man and so want to destroy the family and keep women from having babies. I'll look for the original quote when I have more coffee and more tolerance for dumpster diving.

599 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:35:27am

Wake up. Check.
Brush tooth. Check.
Breakfast. Check.
Log on. Check.
Coffee and a smoke. Check.
See a lesbian thread. Huh?
See the bottom 10. Odd.
And good morning Honcos!!

600 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:37:00am

Wow. This is an insane level of corruption from corporations:

[Link: www.courthousenews.com...]


- Three insurance companies forced Houston to mischaracterize massive losses from Hurricane Ike as uninsured, so that city residents, not the insurers, would be left to foot the enormous bill, a property-loss consultant says.
Plaintiff MLA Claims contracted with Houston to help the city in its claims for damages from Hurricane Ike.
But when MLA prepared a claim for the maximum amount of insured damage, Houston's insurers demanded that the city "make the 'smart move'" and "mischaracterize its insured losses as uninsured so certain portions of those losses would be covered by FEMA or by the taxpayers of the City of Houston, rather than defendants," according to the complaint.

The defendant insurers "threatened the city that if plaintiff was permitted to carry out its job ... defendants would punish the city. Defendants threatened that not only would they cancel the city's insurance but they also would never insure the city again. Defendants threatened ... that a lack of insurance would prevent the city from obtaining financing in the future and cause it to lose its bond rating and to default on its outstanding bonds," the complaint states.
"Ultimately, the city bowed to defendants' threats - and adopted defendants' game plan for 'straightening things out,'" MLA says.
That game plan entailed preventing MLA from negotiating directly with the insurers to achieve a maximum claim settlement, and directing MLA "to cease direct communication with insurance representatives," according to the complaint.

601 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:38:19am

re: #600 Obdicut

:(

602 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:39:21am

re: #600 Obdicut

It's like I'm seeing the dark future unfold before our eyes


All those stories about fascist corporate city states, it's like I'm watching them bloom

603 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:39:30am

Here's that as a page:


They grow them bigger in Texas, including massive corruption and fraud cases

604 Randy W. Weeks  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:40:05am

One of my best young friends is a lesbian. She's in a great relationship right now with a really great kid. I love them both dearly. Hell, she got me to go to a gay bar for her 25th birthday and believe me for a old, fundie-raised man that wasn't easy. LOL

I'd gladly entrust my grandchildren to her rather than to this piece of shit "holy man." And if she does have children someday she'll love them to death.

605 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:40:15am

re: #316 SanFranciscoZionist

Nonprofits can be brutal. Nastier and weirder than corporate offices would dream of getting.

it's because the stakes are so low

606 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:40:25am

re: #603 Obdicut

awesome, thanks

607 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:43:01am

Pat Robertson quotes:

"(T)he feminist agenda is not about equal rights for women. It is about a socialist, anti-family political movement that encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism and become lesbians." –Pat Robertson

6. "I know this is painful for the ladies to hear, but if you get married, you have accepted the headship of a man, your husband. Christ is the head of the household and the husband is the head of the wife, and that's the way it is, period." –Pat Robertson

I have no dates for these yet.

608 lawhawk  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:46:03am

Greets and saluts from the NYC metro area on the 25th anniversary of the world's worst nuclear disaster at Chernobyl. That disaster may have helped bring down the Soviet Union and exposed just how ruined the Soviet infrastructure truly was. Based on a poor design that left little room for margin of error during low power operation, reactor 4 was undergoing tests of certain systems and emergency procedures weren't followed and the reactor had a power spike that led to an uncontrolled nuclear reaction and subsequent explosion sent highly radioactive particles and parts of the core into the atmosphere. Indeed, the amount of radiation spewed from Chernobyl exceeded the radiation released from Hiroshima by 400 times.

The Soviets tried to cover up the disaster from everyone - including their own people, and hundreds of thousands in the surrounding region were exposed to radiation - particularly radioactive iodine and cesium (the same concerns now facing the Japanese at Fukushima). Those people were finally relocated, but the health damage was done and tens of thousands of people were affected with thyroid cancer and there have been higher incidences of cancer among those in the region but the true death toll will never quite be known - even among the liquidators who were heroically risking their lives to put out the fires, quench the reactor from spewing more radiation into the environment, and to build the sarcophagus that now shrouds the reactor (and is in need of replacement).

609 jamesfirecat  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:46:51am

re: #607 iceweasel

Pat Robertson quotes:

"(T)he feminist agenda is not about equal rights for women. It is about a socialist, anti-family political movement that encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism and become lesbians." –Pat Robertson

6. "I know this is painful for the ladies to hear, but if you get married, you have accepted the headship of a man, your husband. Christ is the head of the household and the husband is the head of the wife, and that's the way it is, period." –Pat Robertson

I have no dates for these yet.

Heh...

Sorry but I can't help but recall a scene from "My Big Fat Greek Wedding"

Daughter: Ma, Dad is so stubborn. What he says goes. "Ah, the man is the head of the house!"
Her Mother: Let me tell you something, Toula. The man is the head, but the woman is the neck. And she can turn the head any way she wants.

610 Ericus58  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:47:12am

re: #607 iceweasel

Pat Robertson quotes:

"(T)he feminist agenda is not about equal rights for women. It is about a socialist, anti-family political movement that encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism and become lesbians." –Pat Robertson

6. "I know this is painful for the ladies to hear, but if you get married, you have accepted the headship of a man, your husband. Christ is the head of the household and the husband is the head of the wife, and that's the way it is, period." –Pat Robertson

I have no dates for these yet.

You know what's sad?
There are women out there that allow themselves to be subjugated to this moronic thinking.
The word "chattel" comes to mind....

611 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:51:15am

re: #610 Ericus58

You know what's sad?
There are women out there that allow themselves to be subjugated to this moronic thinking.
The word "chattel" comes to mind...

It is sad. and frightening. Curious Lurker and I think Lidane have done some great pages about the Quiverful movement. Spooky.

612 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:51:30am

re: #607 iceweasel

I figure Pat Robertson is already about as evil as humans get, so whatever he says can't possibly live up to the truth of the diamond-mine owning demon that is Pat Robertson

613 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:52:17am

re: #610 Ericus58

You know what's sad?
There are women out there that allow themselves to be subjugated to this moronic thinking.
The word "chattel" comes to mind...

When my neighbors were young (they have been married for about 45 years now) the husband said he was going fishing one day. She said "What I am I supposed to do?" He told her to do laundry. After he left she sewed all his pant legs and shirt sleeves closed. Heh.

614 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:52:54am

re: #610 Ericus58

people want to be led and told what to do, especially when it's dressed up like jesus


the tyranny of choice, simple minds run the other way

615 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:54:36am

re: #612 WindUpBird

I figure Pat Robertson is already about as evil as humans get, so whatever he says can't possibly live up to the truth of the diamond-mine owning demon that is Pat Robertson

That's right-- I'd forgotten about the diamond mines. Thanks for reminding me. Ugh.

616 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:55:11am

re: #614 WindUpBird

people want to be led and told what to do, especially when it's dressed up like jesus

the tyranny of choice, simple minds run the other way

Morality and thinking about ethics is hard! It's easier when someone else just tells you what to do.

617 lawhawk  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:57:02am

re: #603 Obdicut

Speaking of corruption, the nadir of virtue known as Bell, California is again in the news as investigators have uncovered a $4.5 million slush/pension fund for the indicted former leaders of the nearly bankrupted city. The former city leaders saw their city's residents as an unending piggy bank - illegally raising property taxes to line their pockets, both in exceedingly high salaries, and now with a slush/pension fund that investigators are hoping to use to compensate the city and its residents.

The discovery of the money could be a huge boost for the finances of Bell, whose entire operating budget is about $13 million and is faced with major budget cuts in the wake of a corruption scandal. City officials said Monday that they were looking into whether they could use the $4.5 million to reduce the city's budget deficit.

In 2008, Rizzo said he wanted the city to spend $14 million to fund this second retirement account. Lourdes Garcia, the city's director of administrative services, testified that Rizzo said the city needed to place $2 million a year into the account, even as Bell's finances were deteriorating.

"My reaction was 'That's a lot of money,' " Garcia testified. "The city doesn't have that kind of money…. He knew that money was getting tight."

According to the transcripts, even after Rizzo left office last summer following The Times' disclosure of his enormous salary, he called Garcia on her cellphone on a Saturday and told her to move money into the Wells Fargo account set up for his and Spaccia's retirement. Garcia balked, telling him he was on administrative leave.

"I'm still the CAO," Rizzo told her, according to the transcripts.

The revelations come six months after The Times reported that Rizzo had created the supplemental pensions, which allowed employees to circumvent retirement limits set by California. Employees who worked in Bell for 25 years and retired at the age of 55 could get 90% of their salary — far more than most public employees who retire at the age of 60.

But prosecutors allege that Rizzo and Spaccia secretly schemed to give themselves an even richer supplemental pension. Prosecutors allege that they went to great lengths to hide the value of their pensions.

"What's important is that … they didn't just write a plan in which everybody got the same thing," Deputy Dist. Atty. Max Huntsman told the grand jury last month. "They very carefully crafted a plan to benefit themselves.... He planned to receive a heck of a lot of money further down the road. That was always his plan."

618 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:58:28am

re: #615 iceweasel

That's right-- I'd forgotten about the diamond mines. Thanks for reminding me. Ugh.

There was a guy from africa I worked with, he worked graves I worked days, he was just GLUED to the 700 club in the morning, I guess he was a fan.

and he was a fucking prick, he didn't do half his work because it was "women's work" to do laundry or change sheets.

This is laundry for people with incontinence, serious business, lots of procedures, paperwork. it was most of his job, but there he was, nose against the TV worshipping Pat Robertson instead. my embezzler boss was too meek to call him on it, and I was just happy to have a job that would work with my college schedule, so i didn't raise a stink

ahh memories

619 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:58:43am

re: #616 iceweasel

Morality and thinking about ethics is hard! It's easier when someone else just tells you what to do.

yup!

620 wee fury  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:58:59am

I wish Pat Robertson would go back to the planet Boodlefu, from whence he immigrated.

621 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 6:59:32am

re: #620 wee fury

I wish Pat Robertson would go back to the planet Boodlefu, from whence he immigrated.

oh the things I wish :)

622 jamesfirecat  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:03:13am

re: #613 Cannadian Club Akbar

When my neighbors were young (they have been married for about 45 years now) the husband said he was going fishing one day. She said "What I am I supposed to do?" He told her to do laundry. After he left she sewed all his pant legs and shirt sleeves closed. Heh.

Reminds me of a Terry Pratchett Quote about Golems...

"No-one wants them to think, so they get their own back by not thinking."

623 prairiefire  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:06:24am

re: #611 iceweasel

It is sad. and frightening. Curious Lurker and I think Lidane have done some great pages about the Quiverful movement. Spooky.

I've got a step cousin into that. i think they have stopped at 7. They don't have the money for a family that large.

624 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:08:55am

Little Chefs

Youtube Video

Safety first!

625 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:09:34am

re: #623 prairiefire

I've got a step cousin into that. i think they have stopped at 7. They don't have the money for a family that large.

A friend's sister in law is into it too. I think they also had to stop at 7. I can't remember how many now. But it came with a lot more baggage than merely having a lot of children (which is not in itself a bad thing, of course).

626 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:11:45am

re: #624 Killgore Trout

I have worked with those people after they growed up.

627 prairiefire  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:12:27am

Bobby Jindall attacking state employee health care:[Link: tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

628 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:12:32am

re: #611 iceweasel

It is sad. and frightening. Curious Lurker and I think Lidane have done some great pages about the Quiverful movement. Spooky.

Because the Earth can obviously support a population of 25 billion people.

(Either that or we go back to stone ages infant mortality rates. Yippee!)

630 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:14:15am

re: #624 Killgore Trout

Little Chefs

[Video]Safety first!

I had to stop midway through, it was too much for me. Sick but funny!

631 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:16:20am

re: #630 iceweasel

I had to stop midway through, it was too much for me. Sick but funny!

I had to cringe my way through it.

632 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:17:56am

re: #631 Killgore Trout

I had to cringe my way through it.

I left at the preheating of the oven. Partly because I'm making pizza tonight and I'm a klutz myself.

633 Interesting Times  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:21:27am

re: #632 iceweasel

I left at the preheating of the oven. Partly because I'm making pizza tonight and I'm a klutz myself.

That reminds me - how's the finger that went through an unfortunate encounter with the vegetable-slicing thing?

634 The Left  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:24:41am

re: #633 publicityStunted

That reminds me - how's the finger that went through an unfortunate encounter with the vegetable-slicing thing?

See, you remember!

It has a scar but is otherwise ok. The sliced off bit grew back. I guess that's a lizard thing. /

635 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:29:16am

Trump investigating affirmative action...
Trump Investigating How Obama Got Into Harvard: 'He Was a Terrible Student'

636 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:31:46am

re: #635 Killgore Trout

I'm confused. Should I vote for Trump or Luap Nor in the primaries? Or I guess I could just spend the day drinking.

637 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:34:11am

re: #635 Killgore Trout

Trump investigating affirmative action...
Trump Investigating How Obama Got Into Harvard: 'He Was a Terrible Student'

"He was a terrible student. Why, he wasn't even white! Everyone knows that black students have bad grades. I am demanding a full investigation!"

638 lawhawk  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:34:54am

re: #624 Killgore Trout

Sounds like those folks were behind this - and they're lizards to boot.

639 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:35:42am

re: #635 Killgore Trout

Trump investigating affirmative action...
Trump Investigating How Obama Got Into Harvard: 'He Was a Terrible Student'

I still think that guy is trolling the world

he's goofing on Bobert De Niro now

640 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:36:21am

re: #636 Cannadian Club Akbar

I'm confused. Should I vote for Trump or Luap Nor in the primaries? Or I guess I could just spend the day drinking.

DEFINITELY Trump

I wouldn't vote for Ron Paul even as a joke

641 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:37:35am

re: #639 WindUpBird

I still think that guy is trolling the world

he's goofing on Bobert De Niro now

I don't see how he can win in Brooklyn now.

///

642 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:37:47am

re: #638 lawhawk

Sounds like those folks were behind this - and they're lizards to boot.

Ha!

643 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:38:46am

re: #639 WindUpBird

I still think that guy is trolling the world

he's goofing on Bobert De Niro now

Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's a hoax but it's starting to get out of control.

644 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:39:28am
I have friends who have smart sons with great marks, great boards, great everything and they can't get into Harvard.

I AM UNABLE TO PASS MY PRIVILEGED SOCIETAL POSITION ON TO MY FIRST-BORN SON AND THIS MAKES ME ANGRY!!!

645 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:40:20am

re: #637 iossarian

"He was a terrible student. Why, he wasn't even white! Everyone knows that black students have bad grades. I am demanding a full investigation!"

This is th worst of the racism of the right.

You hit it on the head.

I recall at elections the wingnut talking heads were busy lying that the first lady and the president were Affirmative Action cases.

They simply can not accept that a black man and a black woman could earn what they have through hard work, make so much of themselves, be that much smarter, and frankly better in all ways, than them. They can bow down to white people if they are rich enough. They can ignore that W. was a legacy at Yale. But a black person forces them to loose grip on the notion that "at least they are white."

It is the worst sort of racism.

With this, Trump makes himself into the most cynical of showman hucksters. I am not certain whether I am more repulsed by the actual racist, or the creature like Trump who merely and cravenly uses it to his own advantage.

646 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:42:44am

re: #644 iossarian

I AM UNABLE TO PASS MY PRIVILEGED SOCIETAL POSITION ON TO MY FIRST-BORN SON AND THIS MAKES ME ANGRY!!!

Getting into any of the ivy's is a crap shoot. Assuming a student is good enough and would by all metrics be likely to do fabulously, there are still five applicants for each slot. I didn't say ten or twenty because I am pointing out that even amongst the kids who designed reactors in the second grade, it is a crap shoot.

647 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:46:54am

re: #644 iossarian

I AM UNABLE TO PASS MY PRIVILEGED SOCIETAL POSITION ON TO MY FIRST-BORN SON AND THIS MAKES ME ANGRY!!!

I had a high school transcript that was very, um, odd. I had Cs and As. I had an entire year almost missing, when I was in England-- they only do three classes per year in England.

I got into Cornell and University of Chicago. Because schools are often looking for people who are a little on the different style, and I wrote a hell of an essay.

When someone gets into Harvard, the appropriate response is 'congrats', not "Affirmative action blargh".

648 reine.de.tout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:48:57am

re: #627 prairiefire

Bobby Jindall attacking state employee health care:[Link: tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

My page on this a couple of days ago.

This is my insurance plan. I'm not liking Jindal's playing around with it, not one bit.

649 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:51:10am

re: #646 LudwigVanQuixote

Getting into any of the ivy's is a crap shoot. Assuming a student is good enough and would by all metrics be likely to do fabulously, there are still five applicants for each slot. I didn't say ten or twenty because I am pointing out that even amongst the kids who designed reactors in the second grade, it is a crap shoot.

re: #647 Obdicut

I had a high school transcript that was very, um, odd. I had Cs and As. I had an entire year almost missing, when I was in England-- they only do three classes per year in England.

I got into Cornell and University of Chicago. Because schools are often looking for people who are a little on the different style, and I wrote a hell of an essay.

When someone gets into Harvard, the appropriate response is 'congrats', not "Affirmative action blargh".

I think that what gets a lot of even well-meaning folks pissed off is that, even though they went to good schools (albeit a while ago), as an undergraduate and even a graduate student you don't really have much of a clue of how colleges select their student bodies.

Then when their kids and friends' kids are applying, they couple this extremely hazy notion of the selection process with a generally inflated view of their kids' abilities (which is of course natural - we all have that).

Cue disappointment.

650 reine.de.tout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 7:57:15am

re: #627 prairiefire

Bobby Jindall attacking state employee health care:[Link: tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

And there you go. I just finished the story you linked to. The state wants the $500 million the plan has in reserve.

The thing is this - THAT MONEY ISN'T THE STATE'S MONEY. It is money collected from EMPLOYEES IN PREMIUMS. Why is Jindal trying to plug a hole in the state budget using money that belongs to state employees? It's like a tax being levied JUST on state employees. If that money is available, why don't they, instead, lower my premiums (actually, my premium did go down slightly this plan year - an indication, I think, of just how well run the state group benefits agency is doing in managing things, doncha think?).

651 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:00:46am

re: #650 reine.de.tout

It looks a lot like the "punish state employees for having been prudent in their career choices" game again.

Good luck with your situation, Reine.

652 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:03:03am

Great comment from an article at the Guardian website (reporting on the sensational news that Paul Burrell will be covering the royal wedding for Fox TV in the UK):

"Cut him in half and like a stick of Blackpool Rock it would say TWAT all the way down."

653 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:04:39am

re: #650 reine.de.tout

And there you go. I just finished the story you linked to. The state wants the $500 million the plan has in reserve.

The thing is this - THAT MONEY ISN'T THE STATE'S MONEY. It is money collected from EMPLOYEES IN PREMIUMS. Why is Jindal trying to plug a hole in the state budget using money that belongs to state employees? It's like a tax being levied JUST on state employees. If that money is available, why don't they, instead, lower my premiums (actually, my premium did go down slightly this plan year - an indication, I think, of just how well run the state group benefits agency is doing in managing things, doncha think?).

For the same reason that Repub-majority government across the country are doing such stunts: Because the only other choice is to raise taxes and that not only would make them politically unpopular, but would also go against their ideology. So, in cases like this, they figure they can kill two birds with one stone, making up part of the budget deficit by raiding the plan's funds while at the same time throwing state employees to their buddies in the private insurance industry.

654 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:04:45am

re: #649 iossarian

re: #647 Obdicut

I think that what gets a lot of even well-meaning folks pissed off is that, even though they went to good schools (albeit a while ago), as an undergraduate and even a graduate student you don't really have much of a clue of how colleges select their student bodies.

Then when their kids and friends' kids are applying, they couple this extremely hazy notion of the selection process with a generally inflated view of their kids' abilities (which is of course natural - we all have that).

Cue disappointment.

I think that is a great point. So let's break it down:

If you are a total dunce from a wealthy and politically connected family that has made donations in the past to that institution, you are a shoo in provided you make the minimum standard of not drooling too much.

Past that:

The standard way into an Ivy is with advanced academics of some sort above and beyond what is expected. For example, if your essays are about how you wish to write the great American novel, they had better be damn good essays and some short stories that were outstanding. Published is better. If you want to be the next poet laureate, your poetry had better actually be good as opposed to something vaguely like self obsessed song lyrics. If you are interested in mathematics or hard science, why didn't you already take vector calculus and linear algebra?

But even that isn't enough. The kid who is truly different and interesting will beat out the standard smart kid. If your kid spent two years learning Inuit and living in igloos as part of some adventure, your kid is a shoo in, to the extent that irregularities in other areas matter less.

Without something like that though...

The way it works is you get the grades and the test scores and then you hope you have the right mix of extra-curricular activities. You apply to ten schools and you get into 3-5.

If you play tuba and the band needs a tuba player, that will be what edges you in. If they need a tennis player and you wrestled, too bad.

Of course, if you really kick butt, some schools won't offer you a slot because they are certain you will go to the even more prestigious schools that they are sure you applied to.

That is how you get into Princeton and Cornell but rejected from U of P.

It really is a crap shoot.

655 AK-47%  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:05:17am

re: #650 reine.de.tout


There seems to be a warped conservative ideal in which indivicuals must negotiate with corporations for the terms of their employment andinsurance coverage - as individuals. Any form of collective bargainingon the part of employees or customers is seen as creeping socialism.

656 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:08:06am

re: #655 ralphieboy

There seems to be a warped conservative ideal in which indivicuals must negotiate with corporations for the terms of their employment andinsurance coverage - as individuals. Any form of collective bargainingon the part of employees or customers is seen as creeping socialism.

More of that "rugged individualism," combined with a smattering of the "free market is always right." Doing away with collective bargaining supposedly is beneficial to both sides, as it allows good/exceptional employees to shine and negotiate high wages/benefits while allowing employers to weed out poor employees who aren't contributing to the company's success.

It's a nice fantasy, but we already saw where that fantasy went in this country, and it's the reason why unions came to be in the first place. The union employee isn't getting "overpaid," the lone employee is simply getting screwed royally.

657 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:11:38am

re: #654 LudwigVanQuixote

Our institution is really looking at "likelihood of enrolling" very closely now.

Part of it is the somewhat cynical need to get our yield* up, but it is also just good cost-management practice - you spend less on recruiting if you can be smart about who you pursue and who you don't.

* For you non-higher-ed-administration lizards, yield is the ratio of enrolled students to admitted students (i.e., if 1 student enrolls for every 2 you admit, your yield is 50%). The various ranking systems use yield as a measure of desirability, so it behooves institutions to maximize it wherever possible.

658 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:14:51am

re: #647 Obdicut

Were you in England for one of the two A-level years?

(I did A-levels and I think it's a great system for academically-minded kids.)

659 reine.de.tout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:15:29am

re: #653 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

For the same reason that Repub-majority government across the country are doing such stunts: Because the only other choice is to raise taxes and that not only would make them politically unpopular, but would also go against their ideology. So, in cases like this, they figure they can kill two birds with one stone, making up part of the budget deficit by raiding the plan's funds while at the same time throwing state employees to their buddies in the private insurance industry.

Exactly right.
The state used to have a private company administering the plan, and it sucked. Poor coverage, and it declined in quality over time, as premiums went up. So years ago, they created the agency to oversee the state's group insurance. Primary objective - provide good coverage, and make sure no employee wanting/needing coverage was left without coverage. They've done an excellent job, as you can see, I mean hell - they have a reserve of funds. And I know my coverage is excellent.

damn.

660 lawhawk  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:19:12am

re: #654 LudwigVanQuixote

And it helps if you come from a really competitive/notable high school. Some high schools can churn out Ivy League candidates with ease - particularly because they've gained a reputation for being really competitive and great incubators of well prepared students. Schools like Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, Brooklyn Tech, Midwood, LaGuardia, Townsend Harris, and Cardozo in NYC come to mind. Heck, just getting into Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, and Brooklyn Tech is like getting into an Ivy League because they're so highly coveted by city parents for their kids - and that drives home the importance of JHS and preparing for the demands of those schools.

661 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:24:16am

re: #657 iossarian

After teaching many students at a very good research one state school, but having gone to Ivys, I think the best way to say it is:

The smartest kid at a place like Penn State is certainly as smart as the smartest kid at a place like MIT. However, the dumbest kid at MIT would still be in the top 5% at Penn State.

The disparity does very frequently come down to finances. There are all sorts of kids who would have done like gangbusters at any of the top institutions, but never got the chance because of the inequities of our system.

The only good news is that the basic material is the basic material. There is no difference at all between organic chemistry at Harvard and say U. Ohio. It is organic chemistry. The basics have not changed in 50 years. They will not change either. A kid who shines from there can go to the top graduate schools and that is what really counts in academics in any case.

People also don't understand that a school you might never have considered as amazing in general might be at or near the top of a certain field. For example, for nuclear engineering, Penn State is very good.

Ironically, in the job market though, where people usually get jobs that have nothing at all to do with their education, the employer will just see the name on the diploma. This too is an inequity.

The bottom line is that our education system has managed to take the best and the worst of capitalism. It ought to be an investment in the future. Instead it is a business and subject to market forces in ways that damage the whole system.

662 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:24:45am

re: #660 lawhawk

And it helps if you come from a really competitive/notable high school. Some high schools can churn out Ivy League candidates with ease - particularly because they've gained a reputation for being really competitive and great incubators of well prepared students. Schools like Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, Brooklyn Tech, Midwood, LaGuardia, Townsend Harris, and Cardozo in NYC come to mind. Heck, just getting into Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, and Brooklyn Tech is like getting into an Ivy League because they're so highly coveted by city parents for their kids - and that drives home the importance of JHS and preparing for the demands of those schools.

That is a very good point.

663 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:25:05am

re: #660 lawhawk

I would add some nuance to that view of "feeder" high schools. I think that they do convey an advantage, but I think the advantage is due to their experience in preparing kids for competitive college entry rather than "name recognition". It boils down to really trivial stuff like making sure that kids have all their letters of recommendation together (and that the letters actually say the right kind of thing).

If anything, I would even say that a candidate from an unknown school who was equal on paper would be at a slight advantage, since the assumption would be that she had had to work harder to get to that point.

I would also add the exception that, if a school has been identified as a potential feeder, institutions might be more generous to that school for a short period of time in order to develop a pipeline.

College admissions is a wonderfully complex business, and one of the many ways in which the competitive nature of US higher ed imposes costs on institutions that are not really related in any way to quality of education. Free markets FTW!

664 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:25:50am

Ohh and I am not at Penn State or MIT. I just chose them as examples.

665 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:26:52am

re: #659 reine.de.tout

Exactly right.
The state used to have a private company administering the plan, and it sucked. Poor coverage, and it declined in quality over time, as premiums went up. So years ago, they created the agency to oversee the state's group insurance. Primary objective - provide good coverage, and make sure no employee wanting/needing coverage was left without coverage. They've done an excellent job, as you can see, I mean hell - they have a reserve of funds. And I know my coverage is excellent.

damn.

Which is why, if this plan goes through, it's going to be another red mark on the GOP come next year. There's no way to argue that such privatization is in the employee's interests, because it's not meant to help the employees. It's just the GOP helping itself to the agency's funds to make up for past mistakes, while leaving the employees at the mercy of the same companies the agency was created to replace.

666 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:30:20am

re: #658 iossarian

Were you in England for one of the two A-level years?

(I did A-levels and I think it's a great system for academically-minded kids.)

Yes, the first year. Unfortunately, one of the classes I took was a gut. And in my other classes, since I wasn't going to actually take the A level, the teachers didn't really give much of a shit about me.

667 researchok  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:32:11am

re: #664 LudwigVanQuixote

The Prodigal Son has landed

668 lawhawk  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:35:27am

re: #663 iossarian

There's quite a bit of nuance involved in the college prep/selection process, and every little bit of assistance that a school can confer on its students helps.

But with a college admissions office looking at thousands of applications, they're going to use any number of factors to choose from in picking indicators for success. SAT/ACT is considered one such filter, GPA is another, but if they're going to have comparable students with comparable grades, they might be more willing to choose the kid from Stuyvesant than another school because of its legendary reputation. They might opt for the other-than Stuyvesant student if they think that the other student offers a greater chance at geographical diversity (non-NYC).

And then after college - the business world (and grad schools, law schools, and law firms) use the college filter as well - knowing that if you're coming from an Ivy (or top tier school), you're more likely to be successful (but not always).

669 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:38:25am

re: #667 researchok

The Prodigal Son has landed

How is that landing? I was just writing about where I am not.

670 researchok  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:40:24am

re: #669 LudwigVanQuixote

How is that landing? I was just writing about where I am not.

Chop busting.

671 researchok  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:42:19am

Are you at Stanford? Harvard? Yale? Slippery Rock?

672 calochortus  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:44:13am

re: #646 LudwigVanQuixote

re: #661 LudwigVanQuixote

i heard something to that effect the other day in an interview with a college admissions adviser. Kids that are accepted to the Ivies, but are unable to go for some reason and end up at a "lesser" school do just as well in life as the Ivy Leaguers. Its the student, not the school, and you need to find the right fit between student and school.

Just a drive-by, gotta run.

673 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:44:15am

The Donald's Twitter Feed:

[Link: twitter.com...]

674 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:45:52am

re: #668 lawhawk

I completely agree with the post-college impact of where you did your BA or graduate/professional degree. I think the high school picture is less clear. Having said that, the North East is rather different from the Midwest (where I am) and indeed most of the rest of the US, due to the comparative lack of good public options.

People around here complain about their kids not getting into Wisconsin-Madison, Michigan, Penn State or wherever, but the other state colleges are not at all bad either.

675 reine.de.tout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:46:22am

re: #665 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Which is why, if this plan goes through, it's going to be another red mark on the GOP come next year. There's no way to argue that such privatization is in the employee's interests, because it's not meant to help the employees. It's just the GOP helping itself to the agency's funds to make up for past mistakes, while leaving the employees at the mercy of the same companies the agency was created to replace.

I'm trying to get a protest organized.

676 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:46:44am

re: #668 lawhawk

And then after college - the business world (and grad schools, law schools, and law firms) use the college filter as well - knowing that if you're coming from an Ivy (or top tier school), you're more likely to be successful (but not always).

There are a couple confounding factors.

In the general world, despite the inequities and cases of good folks who should have gotten in but didn't, most who get into an ivy (excluding silver spoons) really deserved to be there and are truly top tier people to begin with. Of course you would expect them to do better. In the case of silver spoons - of course you would expect them to do better.

In the academic world past undergraduate though, it is much more about what tier you are n and what connections your institutions has. I mean, if you want to be a biologist for example, you need a school with enough connections in the biology community that you get sent to the good conferences, given the chance to talk to the big people and most importantly, you get a good advisor who can put you onto the right projects.

Almost all the top tier folks came from one of the top tier institutions. It matters less where (once in that tier) and more who and with what equipment.

Let's say a biology rock star picks up her multi million dollar in grants laboratory and moves to university of Podunk for what ever reason. Podunk is now on the map. She still has all of the connections, her students are still students of Doctor X and because of that, they have the chance to work on interesting things. They still have to do their part and actually be brilliant biologists, but, they have a lot more tools to shine if they do.

677 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:47:48am

re: #671 researchok

Are you at Stanford? Harvard? Yale? Slippery Rock?

University of Remulak... You know I am a Zionist overlord.

678 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:48:52am

re: #675 reine.de.tout

I'm trying to get a protest organized.

Good luck with that. Gotta bow out and get some actual work done now. BBL.

679 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:49:22am

re: #672 calochortus

re: #661 LudwigVanQuixote

i heard something to that effect the other day in an interview with a college admissions adviser. Kids that are accepted to the Ivies, but are unable to go for some reason and end up at a "lesser" school do just as well in life as the Ivy Leaguers. Its the student, not the school, and you need to find the right fit between student and school.

Just a drive-by, gotta run.

I agree completely.

I should have added to my last post that the kids at "lesser" schools (as you put it) who should have gotten in to the Ivys are well, amongst the best and brightest by definition. You would expect them to do better.

680 iossarian  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:50:49am

re: #676 LudwigVanQuixote

This is so true.

I heard quite recently about a professor from one of the Ivies who was disappointed that his PhD students did not get accepted to give presentations at a fairly prestigious conference.

So, being on the conference board, he set up a new roundtable and invited his students to submit papers. Miraculously, they were accepted! The crowning irony is that the guy is a sociologist who does research into the effect of entrenched social privilege on professional advancement.

It's all about who you know at the PhD level.

681 RogueOne  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 8:59:56am

Suspect arrested in bomb left at Colorado mall
[Link: hosted.ap.org...]


DENVER (AP) -- Law-enforcement officials say a man suspected of leaving a pipe bomb and propane tanks at a Denver-area shopping mall has been arrested.

Boulder Police spokeswoman Kim Kobel says 65-year-old Earl Albert Moore was captured Tuesday at a grocery store in Boulder, roughly 30 miles northwest of where the bomb was found.

682 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:02:36am

re: #680 iossarian

This is so true.

I heard quite recently about a professor from one of the Ivies who was disappointed that his PhD students did not get accepted to give presentations at a fairly prestigious conference.

So, being on the conference board, he set up a new roundtable and invited his students to submit papers. Miraculously, they were accepted! The crowning irony is that the guy is a sociologist who does research into the effect of entrenched social privilege on professional advancement.

There are all too many cases like that, assuming that the papers in question themselves were not ruled out by whatever politics in the first place.

It is much harder for me to gauge this effect in the humanities. In science, everyone has a story about the paper that could have, should have, would have but... whatever politics happened. However, if it was a good paper, it almost always surfaces somehow. More importantly, it still has to present good enough data or, good enough theory or, both to make the cut.

It's all about who you know at the PhD level.

Again, I know of all sorts of stories in the humanities in the way you are saying it. In science, who you know also means you have that conversation about obscure phenomena x which puts you on path y. It is nearly impossible to overstate how important the company of others to bounce ideas off of is. If there aren't the right folks at your school, you will never have that conversation. It also means having the means to explore path y because you have the right equipment to do so.

683 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:06:47am

re: #681 RogueOne

Suspect arrested in bomb left at Colorado mall
[Link: hosted.ap.org...]

Does anyone know Walter's real name?
///

684 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:10:49am

Wow. Video at the bottom of the page.
[Link: www.dailymail.co.uk...]

685 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:14:01am

re: #684 Cannadian Club Akbar

Wow. Video at the bottom of the page.
[Link: www.dailymail.co.uk...]

Yeah.... stand around and watch...

Sometimes it is very clear we will deserve whatever judgement is coming to this nation.

686 CuriousLurker  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:20:12am

re: #684 Cannadian Club Akbar

Wow. Video at the bottom of the page.
[Link: www.dailymail.co.uk...]

I can't believe no one went to at least comfort him as he died. I understand why they didn't, but still. No one should have to die lying alone in the street like so much rubbish.

687 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:21:17am

re: #686 CuriousLurker

I can't believe no one went to at least comfort him as he died. I understand why they didn't, but still. No one should have to die lying alone in the street like so much rubbish.

I'm no doctor but even I know to apply pressure to a wound.

688 Shropshire_Slasher  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:22:09am

re: #687 Cannadian Club Akbar
I get shivers thinkin about it, I hope he finds peace.

689 RogueOne  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:23:02am

re: #688 Shropshire_Slasher

I get shivers thinkin about it, I hope he finds peace.

He's dead. You don't get much more peaceful than that.

690 RogueOne  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:27:21am

'They tried to cut my arm off': Bitter brawl between worshippers wielding swords and bats caught on camera at New York Sikh temple
[Link: www.dailymail.co.uk...]

Any church service that ends with a swordfight has to be a blast.

691 Shropshire_Slasher  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:28:44am

re: #689 RogueOne

I meant i hope his soul finds peace, haven't you seen Ghost?

692 RogueOne  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:29:27am

re: #691 Shropshire_Slasher

I meant i hope his soul finds peace, haven't you seen Ghost?

wandering the planet making bad pottery? That doesn't sound all that peaceful to me//

693 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:31:00am

re: #511 WindUpBird

Ummm I'm not really going to get into this with you, but I just saw this. Anytime you wish to throw histrionics around kiddo, you have to back them up with facts. Your blinding narcissism and belief that you are special doesn't cut it in any debate. It is also much better to do so when that person is posting rather than bitching about him when he is offline. That is both cowardly and unsupported.

The fact is you made no statements of facts at all. You simply shouted incoherent slogans. I don't like it from the loony left any more than from the loony right. You should perhaps learn about the topic you are bloviating about before making this about you.

694 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:31:56am

re: #690 RogueOne

'They tried to cut my arm off': Bitter brawl between worshippers wielding swords and bats caught on camera at New York Sikh temple
[Link: www.dailymail.co.uk...]

Any church service that ends with a swordfight has to be a blast.

And beer makes it better.:)

695 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:32:36am

re: #574 laZardo

Meanwhile, in Syria...

...wat

I like to think that I'm better than Bashar Assad in many ways. Although I do not have an opthalmalogy degree.

696 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:32:55am

re: #693 LudwigVanQuixote

If you're not going to get into, then don't.

WUB didn't behave at all badly in that discussion, no.

697 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:33:24am

re: #583 iceweasel

We don't care either, except that it's an automatic day off. You're forgiven!

They're giving you the day off for the wedding?

698 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:34:59am

re: #696 Obdicut

If you're not going to get into, then don't.

WUB didn't behave at all badly in that discussion, no.

Obdi please. Don't you start too.

Simple fact. The temple is Jewish. It does not belong to anyone else.

I am only asking for the same consideration that everyone else demands, and shocked that a Jew need even ask. The only thing more shocking is other Jews like you who fail to see that, or that the denial of it is an insult of the gravest sort.

699 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:37:59am

re: #623 prairiefire

I've got a step cousin into that. i think they have stopped at 7. They don't have the money for a family that large.

Practically no one does.

A Lizard here once tried to convince me that it was good that the Duggars' had their reality show--"Because they need the money."

This was after she'd told me how it was OK for them to have such a large family, because they had enough money from the Dad's business to support them all.

But their system doesn't say have all the kids you can afford. It says, have all the kids God sends.

And not everyone can get a successful contracting business or a reality show.

700 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:38:34am

re: #625 iceweasel

A friend's sister in law is into it too. I think they also had to stop at 7. I can't remember how many now. But it came with a lot more baggage than merely having a lot of children (which is not in itself a bad thing, of course).

I'm still waiting for the reality show about the big Chassidic family in New York.

701 Mocking Jay  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:39:31am

And here we go again...

702 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:40:54am

re: #701 JasonA

And here we go again...

No not at all.

I think Obdi took my point.

703 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:41:36am

re: #698 LudwigVanQuixote

Simple fact. The temple is Jewish. It does not belong to anyone else.

There is no temple. There is the temple mount. And on that, there is the Dome of the Rock. Which is not Jewish.

The only thing more shocking is other Jews like you who fail to see that, or that the denial of it is an insult of the gravest sort.

Ludwig, I strongly advise you not start this up again. Really. Just walk the hell away from it. Anytime someone starts talking about "Jews like you", you're on very, very dangerous ground.

704 Shropshire_Slasher  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:42:08am

re: #699 SanFranciscoZionist
I would have had a dozen kids if I could afford them (don't tell my wife) My very Catholic father informed me that he got snipped after five kids, so I did the same after two.

705 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:42:08am

re: #699 SanFranciscoZionist

Practically no one does.

A Lizard here once tried to convince me that it was good that the Duggars' had their reality show--"Because they need the money."

This was after she'd told me how it was OK for them to have such a large family, because they had enough money from the Dad's business to support them all.

But their system doesn't say have all the kids you can afford. It says, have all the kids God sends.

And not everyone can get a successful contracting business or a reality show.

I once saw a corporate style "motivational" poster of them. It said:

"Vagina, it's not a clown car."

706 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:43:13am

re: #703 Obdicut

There is no temple. There is the temple mount. And on that, there is the Dome of the Rock. Which is not Jewish.

Ludwig, I strongly advise you not start this up again. Really. Just walk the hell away from it. Anytime someone starts talking about "Jews like you", you're on very, very dangerous ground.

You had to go there?

Fine. I will walk away from this talk as you have walked from the people. And yes you did.

And yes, I went there.

And yes that is 100% the case.

707 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:43:46am

re: #686 CuriousLurker

Especially since it looks like it was a case of mistaken identity. That's just insane. Killing someone-- and you killed the wrong guy. What a farce street toughness is. More like street idiocy.

708 Shropshire_Slasher  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:43:48am

re: #705 LudwigVanQuixote

But I've heard you can keep your drugs and loose change in there...//

709 Kragar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:43:59am

Why does the GOP Chairman hate the GOP?

GOP chairman: 'Better things' to worry about than 'birther' issue

710 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:44:08am

Dow +119.
Nice!

711 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:44:44am

re: #706 LudwigVanQuixote

Weird definition of walking away you have-- while spitting invective.

Sad that you feel the need to behave that way.

712 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:45:21am

re: #690 RogueOne

'They tried to cut my arm off': Bitter brawl between worshippers wielding swords and bats caught on camera at New York Sikh temple
[Link: www.dailymail.co.uk...]

Any church service that ends with a swordfight has to be a blast.

Oh, holy crap. And I thought the guys at the Kiddush Club were shtark.

713 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:46:39am

re: #709 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Why does the GOP Chairman hate the GOP?

GOP chairman: 'Better things' to worry about than 'birther' issue

It's nice to see an attempt from the leadership to get the wingnut base under control but they've let the crazies run the nuthouse so long that it's going to take time. Having Beck off the air will help things a bit but not enough to help the GOP's election chances in 2012.

714 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:50:09am

Hot tip: Irshad Manji has a new book coming out!

716 Kragar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:50:27am

Michelle Bachmann drops Birtherism

Michele Bachmann admits Obama is US citizen


Good Morning America's George Stephanopoulos confronted Bachmann with an official, certified copy of President Obama's birth certificate on April 21, 2011.

Bachmann tried to skate around admission by repeating, 'all he has to do is submit that', referring to the birth certificate Stephanopoulos held up to the camera. But Bachmann finally caved under the overwhelming evidence staring her in the face.

"Well then that should settle it." Bachmann said.

When someone like Tea Party darling Michele Bachmann admitts on national television that President Obama was born in America, the Birther movement is on it's way to a long-awaited death.

717 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:51:52am

re: #713 Killgore Trout

He's still not slapping the Donald and the others down for saying it, though. Saying "It's a free country".

718 lawhawk  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:51:58am

re: #716 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

It can't come fast enough.

719 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:52:08am

re: #716 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Speaking of birtherism, what ever happened to Oily Tits?

720 Mocking Jay  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:52:29am

re: #716 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Michelle Bachmann drops Birtherism

Michele Bachmann admits Obama is US citizen

"Michelle... you're fired!"

721 Kragar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:53:10am

re: #719 Cannadian Club Akbar

Speaking of birtherism, what ever happened to Oily Tits?

Well, this did start as a lesbian thread...

722 Mocking Jay  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:53:33am

re: #719 Cannadian Club Akbar

Speaking of birtherism, what ever happened to Oily Tits?

Don't want to sound like a prude, but I hate when people call her that.

723 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:54:15am

re: #719 Cannadian Club Akbar

Speaking of birtherism, what ever happened to Oily Tits?

If you're referring to Dr. Orly Taitz, Esq., she's still nuts.

Most recently on CNN.

724 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:54:42am

re: #722 JasonA

Don't want to sound like a prude, but I hate when people call her that.

Another Lizard gave her that name and it stuck with me. That way I don't have to learn how to spell a new name.

725 Kragar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:55:08am

re: #722 JasonA

Don't want to sound like a prude, but I hate when people call her that.

I usually go with chicken lady.

Image: chicken-lady-778538.gif

726 Mocking Jay  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:56:10am

re: #725 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I usually go with chicken lady.

Image: chicken-lady-778538.gif

That was the lady who lost to Engle in the primary, though...

727 Charles Johnson  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:57:20am

Neither Bachmann nor Priebus actually denounced Birtherism. They're doing the same thing Republicans always do with this issue - trying to have it both ways. They "believe" Obama was born in the US, but they never say affirmatively that he was.

And they don't say a single negative word about Birthers. If you're waiting for a sign of courage from the GOP leadership on this issue, don't hold your breath.

728 Kragar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:57:45am

re: #726 JasonA

That was the lady who lost to Engle in the primary, though...

I know, but I was going off of looks, not name, and in my defense, I was using that moniker before the NV primary.

729 Shropshire_Slasher  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 9:58:07am

re: #727 Charles
Just check Drudge right now...

730 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:00:00am

re: #727 Charles

Neither Bachmann nor Priebus actually denounced Birtherism. They're doing the same thing Republicans always do with this issue - trying to have it both ways. They "believe" Obama was born in the US, but they never say affirmatively that he was.

And they don't say a single negative word about Birthers. If you're waiting for a sign of courage from the GOP leadership on this issue, don't hold your breath.

If you butter your bread on both sides, it always lands butter-side up.

Fingers get greasy, though.

731 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:07:24am

re: #730 wrenchwench

Solution:

Image: mobius-bagel.jpg

732 RogueOne  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:09:44am

I have to take off again but before I go:

A Trove of Historic Jazz Recordings has Found a Home in Harlem, But You Can’t Hear Them
[Link: www.abajournal.com...]


It turns out that one man—a jazz musician and technical genius—figured out a way. But during his lifetime, William Savory kept these recordings largely to himself. He refused to reveal how many recordings he had and what performances they contained. He let only a very few of his recordings be heard by a small number of acquaintances. Over time, the Savory collection became a tantalizing enigma to jazz connoisseurs who yearned for access to its treasures.

The mystery ended last summer. Six years after Savory passed away, his collection was acquired by the National Jazz Museum in Harlem. And jazz experts were stunned. The extent and quality of the Savory collection was beyond anything they had imagined.
....
The collection is, in a word, historic. “It is a wonderful addition to our knowledge of a great period in jazz,” says Dan Morgenstern, director of the Institute of Jazz Studies at Rutgers University in Newark, N.J. And, Morgenstern says, “the sound quality of many of these works is amazing. Some of it is of pristine quality. It is a cultural treasure and should be made widely available.”

The question, however, is whether that will happen anytime soon. And if it doesn’t, music fans might be justified in putting the blame on copyright law. “The potential copyright liability that could attach to redistribution of these recordings is so large—and, more importantly, so uncertain—that there may never be a public distribution of the recordings,” wrote David G. Post, a law professor at Temple University in Philadelphia, on the Volokh Conspiracy blog. “Tracking down all the parties who may have a copyright interest in these performances, and therefore an entitlement to royalty payments (or to enjoining their distribution), is a monumental—and quite possibly an impossible—task.”

733 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:13:07am

re: #731 Obdicut

Solution:

Image: mobius-bagel.jpg

That's great! I love mobius strips, for some odd reason.

734 Obdicut  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:17:15am

re: #733 wrenchwench

I've been here:

Image: Mobius-Arch-Incredible-Sunrise-5_Alabama-Hills-California.jpg

735 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:21:59am

re: #734 Obdicut

I've been here:

Image: Mobius-Arch-Incredible-Sunrise-5_Alabama-Hills-Cal ifornia.jpg

Wow, nice. And about as remote as it gets in California.

736 M. Dubious  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:22:47am

re: #705 LudwigVanQuixote

:)

737 Kragar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:26:04am

Christian Network Implicated in Parental Kidnapping Involving Lesbian Partner


An Amish Mennonite pastor charged with helping a woman kidnap her daughter from her lesbian partner may have had help from a network of groups with roots in the Christian and missionary world including Jerry Falwell's Liberty University, according to court documents.

The pastor, Timothy Miller, was arrested last week in Alexandria, Va. A criminal complaint filed by the FBI in a federal court in Vermont alleges that the Amish Mennonite pastor aided in the "international parental kidnapping" of Isabella Miller Jenkins, the daughter of the former lesbian couple Lisa Miller and Janet Jenkins. Isabella is now 9.

Timothy Miller, who is no relation to Lisa Miller, appeared in court Monday and posted a $25,000 bond and is now in the custody of a friend.

Court documents claim that Timothy Miller, 34, left a computer trail that shows family members as well as friends and associates were discussing Lisa Miller's flight to Nicaragua on emails both before and after she disappeared nearly two years ago.

738 Slap  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:29:58am

re: #725 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I usually go with chicken lady.

Image: chicken-lady-778538.gif

As with anything, the photo doesn't do her justice. Here she is in action!

Youtube Video

An inspired bunch, them Kids. Happy head-crushing, all!

739 hellosnackbar  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 10:45:11am

Sometimes I get the impression that religious fruitcakes suffer from
serious mental pathology.
Pat Robertson confirms this suspicion.

740 Aye Pod  Tue, Apr 26, 2011 11:09:12am

re: #580 Varek Raith

Forgive me my British friends.
I don't care about the wedding.
Not a single bit.
Nor your 'u's
:)

I care in that I have the day off. I'll be picnicking with iceweasel somewhere far from the madness (i.e. somewhere in Scotland!)

741 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:26:30am

re: #740 Jimmah

I care in that I have the day off. I'll be picnicking with iceweasel somewhere far from the madness (i.e. somewhere in Scotland!)

One day I'm gonna get both of you live on some messenger thing and we'll geek out about Scotland, I spent 3 months at the Findhorn Foundation, Inverness, Forres, Elgin, travelled down to Aberdeen and then all the way to Nottinghamm to see metal shows :D

742 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:27:03am

re: #739 hellosnackbar

Sometimes I get the impression that religious fruitcakes suffer from
serious mental pathology.
Pat Robertson confirms this suspicion.

When religion meets war, watch the fuck out. That's where it gets ugly

743 Samson  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:12:33pm

re: #497 Gus 802

How did I get into to this thread?

In any case, I'm glad I was mentioned in good company.


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