Flashback: Pamela Geller Proved Over and Over That Obama’s Birth Certificate Was a Fraud

Geller’s years-long deluge of Birther fail
Wingnuts • Views: 48,506
MEGA DERP

Of all the right wing conspiracy loons who promote the Birther garbage, few are as persistently idiotic and ridiculous as Pamela “Shrieking Harpy” Geller. For a while Birtherism actually vied with anti-Muslim bigotry for space at her site, which shows you how important it is to her.

In countless posts, Geller proved over and over and over, irrefutably, that President Obama’s birth certificate was a total fraud. She had “forensics experts” such as “techdude” who analyzed the pixels in Obama’s “certificate of live birth.” She performed a very scientific “heat map analysis.”

She announced BOMBSHELL after BOMBSHELL, and took credit for BREAKING THE STORY! “Read it here first! Atlas EXCLUSIVE!” She called President Obama a liar and a usurper and a “Mansourian candidate,” she promoted petitions, she covered every bogus lawsuit, she railed at the media for ignoring the story.

Since 2008, Pamela Geller has been a one-woman Birther conspiracy factory, never expressing even one iota of doubt. Every post came to the inescapable conclusion that Barack Obama had perpetrated a gigantic fraud.

Some of Geller’s greatest fails:

EXCLUSIVE: Atlas Tech Expert Declares Obama Birth Certificate Forgery - Atlas Shrugs

ATLAS EXCLUSIVE: FORENSIC EXPERT: ‘the [birth] certificate is still a horrible forgery’ - Atlas Shrugs

Previous Owner of Obama’s Birth Certificate was ‘Female’ - Atlas Shrugs

FRAUD: OBAMA’S CERTIFICATE OF LIVE BIRTH - Atlas Shrugs

Another day ….another Obama Birth Certificate Lawsuit - Atlas Shrugs

ANOTHER OBAMA BIRTH CERTIFICATE LAWSUIT - Atlas Shrugs

A BIRTH CERTIFICATE LAWSUIT in good standing - Atlas Shrugs

OBAMA BIRTH CERTIFICATE: ANOTHER DAY, ANOTHER LAWSUIT UPDATE: SCOTUS WON’T REVIEW - Atlas Shrugs

COLB/BIRTH CERTIFICATE ACTION: CALL JESSE WHITE [phone number redacted] FILE A LAWSUIT IN YOUR STATE - Atlas Shrugs

TECHDUDE, THE COLB and ‘Reasonable Suspicion’ - Atlas Shrugs

BIRTH CERTIFICATE RULING: HAWAII JUDGE IN THE TANK FOR OBAMA - Atlas Shrugs

OBAMA ‘NOT QUALIFIED’ FAILURE TO RESPOND, PRODUCE VAULT BIRTH CERTIFICATE - Atlas Shrugs

SUPERMARKET TABS PICK UP ON OBAMA BIRTH CERTIFICATE - Atlas Shrugs

HOW COULD STANLEY ANN DUNHAM HAVE DELIVERED BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA JR. IN AUGUST OF 1961 IN HONOLULU, WHEN OFFICIAL UNIVERSITY OF WASHINGTON RECORDS SHOW HER 2680 MILES AWAY IN SEATTLE ATTENDING CLASSES THAT SAME MONTH? - Atlas Shrugs

ANNENBERG COLB FOTO FORENSICS: BIRTH DOCS ALTERED - MORE CHANGE YOU CAN BELIEVE IN - Atlas Shrugs

A New Twist in Obama Birth Certificate Mystery - Atlas Shrugs

I could go on like this nearly forever. There are literally hundreds of posts on the Nirth Certificate (as she misspelled it once) at Geller’s hate site.

And now that the President has made a monumental fool out of her, does she take any responsibility for her years and years of false allegations? Of course not.

Geller’s response: WHAT TOOK SO LONG?

Today Obama announced he would finally release the long of his birth certifcate.as Obama continues to toy and taunt the American people, you have to scratch your head and say, what took so long?

Pamela Geller: the heroine of the right wing. Writer for Newsmax, Human Events, and Andrew Breitbart’s Big Government.

Jump to bottom

495 comments
1 recusancy  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:34:54am

Doesn't matter. The morons will move on to school records or whatever next.

2 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:35:03am

How long before Geller bederps herself once again?

3 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:35:11am

Baby Walrus has puked up Teh Nirth Sertifikat!

4 albusteve  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:35:12am

she needs an open invitation to respond...one offered with a bit of hostility, but not enough to decline....time to play offense

5 iossarian  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:35:13am

Silly nirthers.

6 HappyWarrior  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:35:25am

For Pam and her friends, the hardest words in the English language are "I was wrong and I acted like a complete shit."

7 darthstar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:35:35am

As long as she has your attention, she'll be happy.

8 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:35:54am

And I'm sure she'll appreciate the link-love you just sent her way for anyone so inclined to view the idiocy for themselves.

9 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:36:14am

What took so long was Obama and his handlers waiting for the wingnuts to gather enough rope to hang themselves higher than Haman. They have obligingly done so.

10 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:36:16am

Pamela's blog is now being Lizardlanched.

11 iossarian  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:36:56am

re: #6 HappyWarrior

For Pam and her friends, the hardest words in the English language are "I was wrong and I acted like a complete shit."

To be fair, those words are hard for anyone.

The key (as applied to the present situation) is to not be a racist headcase in the first place.

12 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:37:20am

Pamela Geller Proved Over and Over That Obama's Birth Certificate Was a Fraud

FTFY

13 AK-47%  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:37:56am

too many people have too much invested in this issue to just let it die quietly. They will be portraing themselves the victims of a complex left-wing plot by the time it is over.

14 Mocking Jay  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:38:07am
Pamela Geller was a one-woman Birther conspiracy factory, and never expressed even one iota of doubt.


Charles? Why did you write all of this in the past tense? ;o)

15 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:38:33am

Well. I for one am glad that today's release will FINALLY put this birtherism insanity to rest.

//

16 makeitstop  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:38:40am

re: #13 ralphieboy

too many people have too much invested in this issue to just let it die quietly. They will be portraing themselves the victims of a complex left-wing plot by the time it is over.

I think Glenn Beck has already advanced that theory.

17 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:38:47am

re: #7 darthstar

As long as she has your attention, she'll be happy.

Agreed. We would like to think we have reached a tipping point in the political debate, where some of the worst stupidity will be washed away by facts. But that would mean ignoring the real issue: Geller et al hate that a non-White Harvard lawyer is President. End of story. Anything that puts BHO on defense or distracts him from the business of government is good, because any failure of BHO is proof of white superiority. Let's call it as we see it.

18 Winny Spencer  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:39:07am

Listening to the President's press conference.

Seriously, this is "ownage" of epic proportions.

19 recusancy  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:39:34am

I like how Obama called them 'carnival barkers'.

20 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:39:57am

Here's why the White House decided to give in to Trump's emands to release the Birth Cert....
Trump highly unpopular in swing states


I guess Donald Trump can claim 'victory' with the release of Barack Obama's birth certificate this morning but his shenanigans over the last month haven't done much to endear him with swing state voters.
...
Trump is completely toxic to independent voters. His favorability with them in Nevada is 35/57, in Iowa it's 29/58, in New Hampshire it's 23/63, and in North Carolina it's 28/61. His recent antics have ingratiated him to a meaningful chunk of the far right Republican base, but he's completely turned off the folks in the center whose votes often determine who comes out on top in Presidential contests.

The more the Republican base loves him the more independents hate him. Giving Trump a "victory" by releasing the Birth Cert increases the chance of him getting the nomination and decreases his already miserable chance of winning the election.

21 blueraven  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:40:20am

I think it is high time we start demanding to see Trump's financial records, including his past 10 years of tax returns.

22 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:41:13am

I just can't get excited about this. Most people will have too much hatred and/or too much stupidity to take notice of this before moving on to another mindless angle. It's easy for those that have actually spent any time thinking or researching this issue that Obama was born in Hawaii, so this is just further proof (On top of the massive amounts already existing) that we were right.

The fact that the administration thought this necessary to release, however, seem to me to just be a testament to just how large a mess our public and political discourse has become. That three years after the fact, it was seen to be important to put this out there makes me feel that the public at large is too polarized or clueless to care. They won't see that this shows how stupid the birther talking points have been, since they didn't see how stupid they were before.

23 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:41:39am

re: #21 blueraven

I think it is high time we start demanding to see Trump's financial records, including his past 10 years of tax returns.

He didn't pay taxes because he did not actually make any money. I bet the guy is worth a tiny fraction of what he claims.

24 darthstar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:41:39am

re: #20 Killgore Trout

Trump won't run. Running requires opening yourself to public scrutiny. Tax returns, anyone?

25 darthstar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:42:06am

re: #21 blueraven

I think it is high time we start demanding to see Trump's financial records, including his past 10 years of tax returns.

Exactly. End of campaign.

26 Winny Spencer  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:42:45am

re: #21 blueraven

I think it is high time we start demanding to see Trump's financial records, including his past 10 years of tax returns.

Trump: My tax returns for Obama birth certificate

"Maybe I'm going to do the tax returns when Obama does his birth certificate ... I'd love to give my tax returns. I may tie my tax returns into Obama's birth certificate," Trump said."

27 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:42:48am

Just think. LGF and Charles started by warning the Republicans about this birth certificate nonsense in 2008. For that he received much flack amongst other actions of wingnut derpitude. And here we are 3 years later...

28 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:44:02am

Crazy Pam sez....
Obama Gaslights the American People

I will be on Eric Bolling's show on FOX Business tonight to discuss the release of Obama's birth certificate.

Why is Obama gaslighting the American people? Why is he toying with, gaming the American people? I broke the story of the altered COLB back in June and July of 2008 -- the COLB he posted to his farcically-titled blog, "Fight the Smears," was an altered document. He subsequently admitted to dual citzenship for close to half his life. The question was a real one, and the American people have a right to know who and what is serving them at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

We owe Trump a debt of gratitude.
....
The stark-raving madness of the media is made plain in the Obama document scandal and the CBS Bush document crime.

Where are Obama's Bc2...........

Occidental College records

Columbia College records

Columbia Thesis paper

Harvard College records

Selective Service Registration

Medical records

Illinois State Senate records

Illinois State Senate schedule

Law practice client list

Harvard Law Review articles that were published

University of Chicago scholarly articles

Record of baptism

I hope that Trump can get to the bottom of this void in Obama's mysterious past.
Winning!

29 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:44:13am

Today's word is derp.

[Done with a "Password" voice.]

//

30 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:45:37am

re: #24 darthstar

Trump won't run. Running requires opening yourself to public scrutiny. Tax returns, anyone?

I doubt he'll run too. But he's going to leave one hell of a vacuum in the gop field when he drops out.

31 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:47:27am

re: #3 Alouette

Baby Walrus has puked up Teh Nirth Sertifikat!

I guess so. What about this time finally got through to them?

32 AK-47%  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:48:27am

Salon.com just ran an article about how Trump's line of designer clothes are manufactured in China.

His days are numbered.

33 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:48:31am

re: #19 recusancy

I like how Obama called them 'carnival barkers'.

The carnival barkers of America won't like that.

34 ihateronpaul  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:48:39am

the listing of her BOMBSHELL EXCLUSIVES had me almost rolling in laughter

why do the republicans tolerate her?
because they tolerate racism.

You know how closeted homophobic people get really defensive about their sexuality, because they are deflecting from their inner shame?

Well the republican party is EXACTLY like that with racism.
Republicans BRISTLE at the very mention of the fact that a HUGE amount of republicans are racist. They get REALLY mad. You know why? Because you touched a fucking nerve. They know that for every well meaning conservative mother, you have a former klan member that just really hates N******s (their usage, not mine) but is afraid to say so, so he rails against welfare queens (Reagans term for "Stupid Black Women that Don't Deserve Anything More Than Basic Sustinence").

When you point out to Republicans how David Duke was elected to congress by a majority of the white vote, their eyes glaze over. They don't respond, or they just mutter "oh." and then they try to be like OH MY GOD 10 PEOPLE ARE IN THE NEW BLACK PANTHER PARTY IT IS AN OUTRAGE THE TEA PARTY ISN'T RACIST YOU ARE THE REAL RACISTS

I know this was a lot of rambling but I think it was worth it. We all have a republican "friend" that has a bunch of shocking info about how the anti-racists are the real racists and there is no such thing as a racist republican

35 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:48:52am

re: #28 Killgore Trout

Wait - how much of your post was quoted from PG?

36 darthstar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:48:54am

re: #30 Killgore Trout

I doubt he'll run too. But he's going to leave one hell of a vacuum in the gop field when he drops out.

Isn't that a bit redundant? The GOP field IS a vacuum.

37 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:48:54am

re: #29 Gus 802

Today's word is derp.

Deranged Erratic Republican Party.

38 iossarian  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:49:48am

re: #28 Killgore Trout

Apparently Obama did some pictures in Kindergarten that made Indonesia look prettier than the USA.

WHY DOES THE WHITE HOUSE NOT RELEASE THE FULL PRESIDENTIAL KIDDIE ART ARCHIVE?

39 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:50:16am

re: #30 Killgore Trout

Well, he's known to suck all the air out of a room (after all, his casinos did manage to go belly up 3x). As for him ever releasing his tax returns, I don't think we'd find anything all that interesting in his personal returns since all of his business ventures are incorporated and wouldn't show on his personal tax returns except as investments (cap gains/losses). With those businesses passing through bankruptcy as many times as they have, there's been serious scrutiny on his business dealings by the courts so there isn't much room for him to screw around - and if he does, the IRS would have a field day.

I just don't think he's making a serious run because once you start taking a closer look at his positions on issues you'd find a schism between what he is saying now, and what he was saying just a few years ago (as in calling for a surtax on the rich to eliminate the national deficit in one year - something he now says would send the rich fleeing the US).

40 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:50:17am

re: #27 Gus 802

Just think. LGF and Charles started by warning the Republicans about this birth certificate nonsense in 2008. For that he received much flack amongst other actions of wingnut derpitude. And here we are 3 years later...

When they first appeared, we really did analyze the birther claims fairly and objectively. On the weight of evidence it was obvious bullshit. At the time, most of us here opposed Obama but we were wanting to stay on the reality track. It was a big part of our final break with the right that many of our erstwhile allies moved in a different direction.

41 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:50:24am

re: #37 publicityStunted

Deranged Erratic Republican Party.

"Driving Everyone to Ron Paul"

Cuz if you want a conspiracy - I think that the ultimate goal of the Derpublicans is to make Paul look sane.

42 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:50:38am

Obama has awakened a sleeping giant derpstorm.

43 iossarian  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:51:03am

re: #34 ihateronpaul

This is so true. It's also why they're all going nuts over Obama's Easter ceremony with the "racist" pastor.

44 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:51:36am

re: #35 imp_62

Wait - how much of your post was quoted from PG?

all except "winning"

45 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:54:28am

re: #44 Killgore Trout

all except "winning"

I don't know whether to laugh, cry, or drink myself into a stupor.

46 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:55:59am

re: #45 imp_62

I don't know whether to laugh, cry, or drink myself into a stupor.

You can do all 3!

47 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:56:20am

The self-proclaimed Coalition of Virtue and Vice in the US is now going State-to-State to defund Planned Parenthood. They are also trying to wedge anti-science legislation.

The longer their delusions go on the more convoluted they become.

49 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:57:11am

Coalition of the willing derps.

50 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:57:12am

re: #42 Gus 802

Obama has awakened a sleeping giant derpstorm.

The derplicity of the GOP....

51 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:57:37am

re: #37 publicityStunted

Deranged Erratic Republican Party.

Which I learned is NOT an acceptable word on Words With Friends.

I posted a couple of days ago, I've been haning around you guys too much.

LOL

52 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:58:27am

re: #48 darthstar

Trump unable to produce certificate proving he's not a festering pile of shit.

But what about his hair, did it origninate in this country, or did he have a "cosmetic" enhancement in another country?

53 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:59:25am

It's fascinating to watch the right wing talking points develop on Twitter's #tcot feed.

Far from destroying Donald Trump's credibility, they now are talking themselves into believing Trump is a hero -- the only Republican who has put Obama on the "defensive."

54 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 10:59:54am

re: #52 ggt

But what about his hair, did it origninate in this country, or did he have a "cosmetic" enhancement in another country?

How many Chinese foxes had to die for Donald's hair derp?

55 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:00:07am

re: #52 ggt

But what about his hair, did it origninate in this country, or did he have a "cosmetic" enhancement in another country?

I think I have mentioned previously my conviction that the hair is in control, Trump is the host. Like Men in Black.

56 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:00:17am

re: #52 ggt

But what about his hair, did it origninate in this country, or did he have a "cosmetic" enhancement in another country?

I believe they are domestic partners.

57 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:00:48am

re: #46 Alouette

You can do all 3!

I can now - just got a case of wine delivered!

58 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:00:50am

re: #55 imp_62

I think I have mentioned previously my conviction that the hair is in control, Trump is the host. Like Men in Black.

I thought that was the case with Blagostupid. I don't know about Trump.

59 AK-47%  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:01:01am

re: #53 Charles

Yes, at times it seems like giving and buying candy for screaming kid at the check out counter...

60 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:01:44am

re: #53 Charles

It's fascinating to watch the right wing talking points develop on Twitter's #tcot feed.

Far from destroying Donald Trump's credibility, they now are talking themselves into believing Trump is a hero -- the only Republican who has put Obama on the "defensive."

Trump's stock has risen, which makes the possibility of his choosing not to run even more amusing. At this point, he pretty much has to, otherwise the Right's gonna haul out the torches and pitchforks.

61 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:02:06am

re: #58 ggt

I thought that was the case with Blagostupid. I don't know about Trump.

It's an alien hair race. Blago's and Trump's hair are members of the advance scouting troop.

62 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:02:15am

re: #53 Charles

It's fascinating to watch the right wing talking points develop on Twitter's #tcot feed.

Far from destroying Donald Trump's credibility, they now are talking themselves into believing Trump is a hero -- the only Republican who has put Obama on the "defensive."

"Look, Trump finally got him to release it!"

I'm going to go shout at the sky until I have proof that I can make it rain.

63 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:02:22am

re: #43 iossarian

This is so true. It's also why they're all going nuts over Obama's Easter ceremony with the "racist" pastor.

I'll say, as a pro-Israel activist, I am not pleased that Obama went to a church that hosted Sabeel. Sabeel is horrible.

I'm not drawing any grand conclusions from this, I'm just personally pissed off. I assume they were chosen because of the history of the church itself, rather than its history of guest speaker invitations.

Still irritating as shit, because it indicates to me the degree to which the Israel delegitimization movement has burrowed its way into American religious life.

64 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:02:38am

re: #53 Charles

It's fascinating to watch the right wing talking points develop on Twitter's #tcot feed.

Far from destroying Donald Trump's credibility, they now are talking themselves into believing Trump is a hero -- the only Republican who has put Obama on the "defensive."

Anyone have a copy of the DSM-IV-TR manual handy?

65 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:02:41am

Trump's full of it - and he rails against China even as his clothing line is produced... wait for it....

wait for it....


in China.

66 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:02:42am

re: #61 imp_62

It's an alien hair race. Blago's and Trump's hair are members of the advance scouting troop.

Traficant was a rogue agent.

67 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:04:26am

re: #65 lawhawk

Trump's full of it - and he rails against China even as his clothing line is produced... wait for it...

wait for it...

in China.

An enormous proportion of all the manufactured items sold in the U.S. are made in China. Any 'git tuff' talk, as Molly Ivins called it, that doesn't acknowledge how eagerly we participate in this, is worthless.

68 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:04:51am

re: #61 imp_62

It's an alien hair race. Blago's and Trump's hair are members of the advance scouting troop.

Invasion of the Scalp Huggers . . .

69 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:06:13am

re: #61 imp_62

It's an alien hair race. Blago's and Trump's hair are members of the advance scouting troop.

The Hair Club for Men!

70 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:06:21am

So...we have one GOP candidate who used to eat squirrel, and one who appears to have a pet squirrel...

71 Mocking Jay  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:06:45am

OT: New Google Docs app for Android allows you to take a picture of a document and converts it to text. It's still rough around the edges, but I'm having a blast with it.

72 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:06:59am

re: #68 ggt

Invasion of the Scalp Huggers . . .

Sector General Sy Sperling will be dispatching club agents to your location at once.

73 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:07:02am

re: #65 lawhawk

Trump's full of it - and he rails against China even as his clothing line is produced... wait for it...

wait for it...

in China.

The One World Government phobics need to realize that we are ALREADY One World in so many aspects --Economic, Communication, Transportation. . . .. The clock is not going to move back-wards. Better to try to create a One World Government we can all live-with then to fight it all together.

74 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:07:43am

re: #63 SanFranciscoZionist

I'll say, as a pro-Israel activist, I am not pleased that Obama went to a church that hosted Sabeel. Sabeel is horrible.

I'm not drawing any grand conclusions from this, I'm just personally pissed off. I assume they were chosen because of the history of the church itself, rather than its history of guest speaker invitations.

Still irritating as shit, because it indicates to me the degree to which the Israel delegitimization movement has burrowed its way into American religious life.

Concurring in part, dissenting in part. Anti-semitic notions have always been part of many of even the most mainstream Christian denominations. Historical events (post-Holocaust, 6 Day War, Entebbe) have often worked to suppress these sentiments - but they are there, expressed also in other forms of racism. Some few individuals rise above this, but that does not change the underlying historical agar on which it grows.

75 mr.fusion  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:07:43am
you have to scratch your head and say, what took so long?

No.....really........you don't

76 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:08:33am

re: #68 ggt

Invasion of the Scalp Huggers . . .

Rick Perry is obviously THEIR shiplord......

77 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:08:38am

re: #70 EmmmieG

So...we have one GOP candidate who used to eat squirrel, and one who appears to have a pet squirrel...

Oh dear. First GOP debate. Hucakbee attempts to catch, fry, and eat Trump's hair piece.

78 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:08:57am

re: #75 mr.fusion

No...really...you don't

Plus, if Trump scratches his hair, it bites him.

79 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:09:04am

Well, fair's fair, the president's shown his. Now, GOP, ya'll show yours. We'll start with you, Mr. Boehner. Produce for us your "long form."

80 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:09:44am

re: #79 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Well, fair's fair, the president's shown his. Now, GOP, ya'll show yours. We'll start with you, Mr. Boehner. Produce for us your "long form."

His long form is short and yellowish.

81 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:09:58am

re: #79 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Well, fair's fair, the president's shown his. Now, GOP, ya'll show yours. We'll start with you, Mr. Boehner. Produce for us your "long form."

/sob

82 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:10:49am

The first satellite photos of the round Earth were released back in 1959. The International Flat Earth Society instantly denounced them as fakes. It has maintained that position ever since.

Birthers, flat Earthers of the political planet.

83 AntonSirius  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:10:56am

re: #41 imp_62

"Driving Everyone to Ron Paul"

Cuz if you want a conspiracy - I think that the ultimate goal of the Derpublicans is to make Paul look sane.

Would Derpublicans be lead by Derfuhrer?

(Sorry to Godwin the thread, but the pun was set up on a tee there...)

84 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:11:29am

Gotta go take my nap

Have a great day all!

85 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:11:35am

Politico posted a link to the immigration file of Barack Obama Sr.

It mentions he had 2 wives , baracks mom and one in kenya, it also mentions someones father was upset that his daughter wanted to marry him in '64. I hadn't heard any of this before. Out of curiosity, did he end up divorcing baracks mom or was she a widow?

86 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:12:44am

re: #83 AntonSirius

Would Derpublicans be lead by Derfuhrer?

(Sorry to Godwin the thread, but the pun was set up on a tee there...)

"Derphuhrer" would be the correct spelling.

87 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:13:05am

re: #85 RogueOne

Politico posted a link to the immigration file of Barack Obama Sr.

[Link: www.scribd.com...]
...... it also mentions someones father MOM was upset that his daughter wanted to marry him in '64. ......

88 blueraven  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:14:33am

re: #53 Charles

It's fascinating to watch the right wing talking points develop on Twitter's #tcot feed.

Far from destroying Donald Trump's credibility, they now are talking themselves into believing Trump is a hero -- the only Republican who has put Obama on the "defensive."

And dont think Obama's re-election campaign people didn't know this would happen. Elevate Trump to hyperbolic proportions. Marginalize the rational republicans (what few there are) Voila...Trump has a better chance to win at least one primary, divide the party even more.

89 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:14:58am

Back to other things. Later.

90 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:16:34am

re: #85 RogueOne

Politico posted a link to the immigration file of Barack Obama Sr.

[Link: www.scribd.com...]

It mentions he had 2 wives , baracks mom and one in kenya, it also mentions someones father was upset that his daughter wanted to marry him in '64. I hadn't heard any of this before. Out of curiosity, did he end up divorcing baracks mom or was she a widow?

They divorced, and a few years later she married the sister's dad.

91 gehazi  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:16:35am

re: #79 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I thought we all agreed to stop talking about political penises?

Oh we didn't? Well we should.

92 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:16:44am

re: #88 blueraven

And dont think Obama's re-election campaign people didn't know this would happen. Elevate Trump to hyperbolic proportions. Marginalize the rational republicans (what few there are) Voila...Trump has a better chance to win at least one primary, divide the party even more.

Yep, Trump's in one hell of a pickle now. How does he abandon ship in a manner that won't do more harm to his reputation than good?

93 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:17:24am

re: #89 Gus 802

Back to other things. Later.

i'll email you later gus-- I visited the harpy's site and it crashed my computer. Good luck!

94 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:18:05am

re: #90 SanFranciscoZionist

They divorced, and a few years later she married the sister's dad.

Which sister?..and thanks, for some reason I was thinking he had died before '64.

95 Mocking Jay  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:18:48am

And now we have more evidence that Obama was born in Hawaii than we do that Trump has "investigators" there...

96 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:19:10am

re: #93 iceweasel

i'll email you later gus-- I visited the harpy's site and it crashed my computer.

1. Clean cache
2. Run malware scan
3. Open window and air out room.

97 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:19:27am

re: #94 RogueOne

Which sister?..and thanks, for some reason I was thinking he had died before '64.

Maya Soetoro

98 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:20:31am

re: #93 iceweasel

i'll email you later gus-- I visited the harpy's site and it crashed my computer. Good luck!

Did you get a bunch of script errors? Seems like every time I drop in over there it loads slower than snot and never fails to time out on script errors.

99 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:20:39am

re: #97 EmmmieG

Maya Soetoro

Thanks. Just looked it up. I had heard the name soetoro before but had no idea where it came from. For a second there I thought she got remarried to her ex-husbands step-father. I was confused!

100 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:21:50am

re: #99 RogueOne


She appears to being a good job of being the president's sibling, which is, primarily, NOT to be Billy Carter.

101 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:23:07am

Another thought on the timing of the Birth Cert release: Trump is not going to run but giving him the publicity now may make him stay around longer. Trump has made this the central issue for the GOP and releasing the Birth cert after Trump bails wouldn't do as much damage. It also encourages him to pursue other nutty conspiracies about Obama's education.

102 leftynyc  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:23:26am

re: #53 Charles

It's fascinating to watch the right wing talking points develop on Twitter's #tcot feed.

Far from destroying Donald Trump's credibility, they now are talking themselves into believing Trump is a hero -- the only Republican who has put Obama on the "defensive."

Then Obama is even smarter than I thought. If this catapults him into the lead for the nomination, nobody will be happier than Barack Obama.

103 makeitstop  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:23:31am

re: #95 JasonA

And now we have more evidence that Obama was born in Hawaii than we do that Trump has "investigators" there...

I'll bring up a point again that was brought up earlier today by someone.

Trump's talking point last week was that the presidential long-form was 'missing' from the files in Hawaii.

Now, given that the WH handed out copies this morning, it's conceivable that they requested it be taken out of the file and sent to the WH for this purpose.

So... Trump's investigator may have been right - that it was 'missing' from the hospital files. The big question is how did his investigator know that?

Did Trump hire himself some 'plumbers?' Hmm...

104 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:23:45am

re: #98 Bubblehead II

Did you get a bunch of script errors? Seems like every time I drop in over there it loads slower than snot and never fails to time out on script errors.

Yes and then everything crashed. Had to just shutdown and restart.

105 mr.fusion  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:24:10am

re: #92 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yep, Trump's in one hell of a pickle now. How does he abandon ship in a manner that won't do more harm to his reputation than good?

This assumes that he has a reputation to speak of

But on a serious note, he'll do what all of Bag Nation does when they're proven to be dopes. First he'll take credit for something, then he'll pivot to the next outrageous outrage.......

106 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:24:51am

New York Times tricked by The Onion on Obama story


The Onion article, titled "Barack Obama Tiger Beat Cover Clinches Slumber Party Vote," had Obama admitting "I sing in the shower" and included the following quote:

"Barack is sooooo hot!" said 12-year-old Tiger Beat subscriber Beth Majors upon reading the issue, which included a "supercute" poster of Obama leaning against the Lincoln Memorial and an interview in which he revealed that his most inspirational hero is "you." "He so totally has my support. Obama in '08!"

107 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:25:58am

re: #94 RogueOne

Which sister?..and thanks, for some reason I was thinking he had died before '64.

Obama's sister, Maya Soetoro. The father didn't die until 1982.

108 mr.fusion  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:26:07am

re: #101 Killgore Trout

Another thought on the timing of the Birth Cert release: Trump is not going to run but giving him the publicity now may make him stay around longer. Trump has made this the central issue for the GOP and releasing the Birth cert after Trump bails wouldn't do as much damage. It also encourages him to pursue other nutty conspiracies about Obama's education.

Good point......Obama has seriously shown his Jedi tendencies on this issue.

I'd also say that doing it now while Trump is basically the unofficial GOP nominee is a helluva better move politically than doing it after he announces he's not going to run (I'd still be shocked if he did)

109 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:26:08am

re: #104 iceweasel

Yes and then everything crashed. Had to just shutdown and restart.

Firefox 4 with AdBlock add-in will hard crash if some ad that it's trying to block fights back.

It may be the "weird tip" ad.

110 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:27:18am

re: #107 SanFranciscoZionist

Obama's sister, Maya Soetoro. The father didn't die until 1982.

Didn't know that either. Can you tell how closely I haven't followed any of this?

111 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:27:36am

re: #109 Alouette

Hey? Want a weird tip for weight loss? Try eating an apple of instead of cookie dough straight out of the fridge.

(This is my personal goal this year, but I have one son that eats three apples a day, so they're hard to keep around.)

112 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:27:47am

re: #110 RogueOne

Didn't know that either. Can you tell how closely I haven't followed any of this?

Why do you hate America?
///

113 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:28:07am

re: #99 RogueOne

Thanks. Just looked it up. I had heard the name soetoro before but had no idea where it came from. For a second there I thought she got remarried to her ex-husbands step-father. I was confused!

Blended families will do that to ya. No, Lolo Soetoro was Ann Dunham's second husband, Barack's stepfather, and his little sister Maya's father. He is where the Indonesian connection comes in. He also donated the surname that various nuts keep insisting is Obama's real name--"His REAL name is Barry Soetoro!!! HAHAHAHAHA!!!!"

114 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:28:53am

re: #100 EmmmieG

She appears to being a good job of being the president's sibling, which is, primarily, NOT to be Billy Carter.

Yes. She has a real job, and aside from speaking at a couple of campaign events, appears to be keeping well out of the limelight. This is positive.

115 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:29:15am
116 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:29:25am

re: #110 RogueOne

Didn't know that either. Can you tell how closely I haven't followed any of this?

I read People Magazine.

117 Sully33  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:29:33am

I'm glad he released the damn thing. This clearly puts the nail in the coffin of this story for any fair minded person.

I've heard hundreds of people say ,"What's the big deal with releasing it?"
and I agreed. These people voted for him, against him or didn't even vote. The president allowed this to continue because he saw that it was making the harshest critics look like loons. (He was correct... for a while...)

Trump is clearly not a racist. You can't be a public figure for so long and hide a character flaw like that. He is however savvy enough to turn a non-story into self promoting media blitz.

All in all, I think Obama overplayed his hand and Trump called him on it.
Obama wins the fact war, Trump won the self promotion war.

118 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:30:07am

re: #115 publicityStunted

Discuss.

What has Tim McGraw done to be at #7? New album or something?

119 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:30:32am

re: #115 publicityStunted

Discuss.

I'm excited about the draft. I know more about that than I do the presidents lineage. Priorities!

120 AntonSirius  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:31:35am

re: #117 Sully33

All in all, I think Obama overplayed his hand and Trump called him on it.
Obama wins the fact war, Trump won the self promotion war.

The sad thing is, you might actually believe that.

121 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:31:56am

re: #117 Sully33

Trump is clearly not a racist. You can't be a public figure for so long and hide a character flaw like that.

I disagree. He can hide it from some people, but not everyone.

122 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:32:52am

re: #105 mr.fusion

This assumes that he has a reputation to speak of

But on a serious note, he'll do what all of Bag Nation does when they're proven to be dopes. First he'll take credit for something, then he'll pivot to the next outrageous outrage...

Thing is, I've hard the opinion expressed that Trump didn't intend to seriously run for the nomination, but instead was just using the "bait" of his doing so and his blowing so loud on the birtherism dog whistle to shore up his name and ratings for his show in an effort to get it renewed. That he wasn't in this for the long game, but just intended to use the lack of real star power in the GOP field to tap it for his own benefit.

If that's the case, then Obama's move here is absolutely brilliant. The GOP was in the process of marginalizing Trump, of trying to talk down the birther boom in the hopes of retaking the message. Now? Trump's stock just skyrocketed, as he "succeeded" where so many others have failed. Now, not only is he locked into this few at least a couple more months, but the GOP now has no way of muzzling him that won't enrage their base.

123 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:33:03am

re: #109 Alouette

Firefox 4 with AdBlock add-in will hard crash if some ad that it's trying to block fights back.

It may be the "weird tip" ad.

Thanks alouette. :)

124 jaunte  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:33:25am

re: #117 Sully33

The more everyone finds out about Trump, the more he stands to lose.
He's made the mistake of buying what he's selling.

125 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:34:41am
126 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:35:48am

re: #125 publicityStunted

Halp! I can't tell if this is a birther troll or someone simply guilty of breaking Poe's Law.

I vote birther troll.

127 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:35:57am

re: #124 jaunte

The more everyone finds out about Trump, the more he stands to lose.
He's made the mistake of buying what he's selling.

Trump is a spotlight whore. He wins, no matter what is said about him or by him. He long ago realized that brand recognition is everything. He is Trump, Trump is him, and it all equals cash in the end. Just not as much as he wants us to believe.

128 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:36:33am

re: #104 iceweasel

Yes and then everything crashed. Had to just shutdown and restart.

Have you tried using Safari. Seems to pretty robust.

129 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:36:34am

re: #111 EmmmieG

Hey? Want a weird tip for weight loss? Try eating an apple of instead of cookie dough straight out of the fridge.

(This is my personal goal this year, but I have one son that eats three apples a day, so they're hard to keep around.)

That's not a "weird tip," that's just common sense.

The "weird tip" is: Give us your credit card information and sign up for a subscription to our "weird tip newsletter" for $79/month. You can never unsubscribe from this newsletter! The only way you can stop the $79/month charge is to report your CC stolen.

130 Winny Spencer  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:36:57am

re: #125 publicityStunted

Halp! I can't tell if this is a birther troll or someone simply guilty of breaking Poe's Law.

Angling for the downding record.

131 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:37:24am

re: #125 publicityStunted

Halp! I can't tell if this is a birther troll or someone simply guilty of breaking Poe's Law.

Barring other comments or evidence, I'll err on the side of troll.

132 jaunte  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:37:37am

re: #127 imp_62

More people now realize the Trump brand is bullshit. That's not smart marketing.

133 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:37:51am

re: #125 publicityStunted

Halp! I can't tell if this is a birther troll or someone simply guilty of breaking Poe's Law.

Troll.

Karma: -6

aracona69
(Logged in)
Registered since: May 3, 2010 at 4:15 pm
No. of comments posted: 5
No. of Pages posted: 0

134 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:38:20am

re: #130 Winny Spencer

Angling for the downding record.

I think s/he has a long way to go. Buck holds the record, IIRC somewhere in the 30s.

135 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:38:27am

Orly Taitz still has doubts. Gee, what a surprise. There are none so blind as those who choose not to see.

Contacted just hours after the president condemned "carnival barkers" who have propogated conspiracies about his past, Taitz said his Hawaiian birth was only one of a several questions she has, also alleging she has proof that he committed Social Security fraud and lied about his studies at Columbia University.

Still, she compared the decision to release the more detailed birth record "a step in the right direction, just like the release of the Watergate tapes was a step in the right direction by Richard Nixon."

"We have to continue with transparency that Barack Obama has promised the nation, and continue working on this issue, getting to the bottom of the facts," said Taitz, a California lawyer and dentist.

Taitz said she's been bombarded with media requests after the White House announcement, and has only briefly inspected the document released Wednesday morning. Based on that initial glance she said she has some questions as to its veracity. For instance, she wondered why Obama’s father's race was listed as "African," when she says the contemporary term used would have been "Negro."

Taitz has originated a raft of legal challenges against Obama. She has three court hearings in just the coming month, including one next week in the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals Pasadena division in the case of Drake vs. Obama.

Yet the same LA Times report doesn't note that each time her case has come before the court, she's received a smackdown - including the judge finding that she may have suborned perjury. She's been smacked with sanctions for violating the attorney code of ethics, and could lose her license to practice law in CA.

136 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:39:13am

re: #134 imp_62

I think s/he has a long way to go. Buck holds the record, IIRC somewhere in the 30s.

I'm sure there was one much lower than that.

137 Winny Spencer  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:39:14am

re: #134 imp_62

I think s/he has a long way to go. Buck holds the record, IIRC somewhere in the 30s.

But that post has potential.

138 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:39:27am

re: #134 imp_62

I think s/he has a long way to go. Buck holds the record, IIRC somewhere in the 30s.

annefrance still has the downding record, < -600.

139 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:40:10am

re: #136 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I'm sure there was one much lower than that.

Anna France or something like that still holds that record I believe.

140 mr.fusion  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:40:38am

re: #122 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds


If that's the case, then Obama's move here is absolutely brilliant. The GOP was in the process of marginalizing Trump, of trying to talk down the birther boom in the hopes of retaking the message. Now? Trump's stock just skyrocketed, as he "succeeded" where so many others have failed. Now, not only is he locked into this few at least a couple more months, but the GOP now has no way of muzzling him that won't enrage their base.

Remember how after the '08 election we were hearing there were no leaders in the GOP? Same thing with the summer of '09 Bagger town halls......no leader and proud of it. Everyone was talking about the so-called "power vacuum." Donald Trump and birtherism is the result. The nastyness we've heard from Limbaugh, the idiocy from Palin, the lunacy from Beck....they were all precursors, but Donald Trump is the result

141 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:40:47am

re: #138 Alouette

annefrance still has the downding record, < -600.

You have a much longer institutional memory than I.

142 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:40:50am

re: #138 Alouette

annefrance still has the downding record, < -600.

Thanks. I can never remember the proper spelling of that one.

143 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:41:09am

re: #138 Alouette

annefrance still has the downding record, < -600.

Yeah, forgot the name, I remember it being in the mid 200s at the time.

144 albusteve  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:41:11am

re: #135 lawhawk

"just like the Watergate tapes!"....yeah, exactly the same you twit...no sense of historical proportion at all or a grasp of legal issues

145 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:41:54am

re: #134 imp_62

I think s/he has a long way to go. Buck holds the record, IIRC somewhere in the 30s.

Doesn't AnneFrance (who was before my time) still hold the record?

146 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:42:11am

re: #138 Alouette

And most of that in a single horrendous post.

147 Achilles Tang  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:44:20am

re: #111 EmmmieG

Hey? Want a weird tip for weight loss? Try eating an apple of instead of cookie dough straight out of the fridge.

(This is my personal goal this year, but I have one son that eats three apples a day, so they're hard to keep around.)

What happens if one eats neither the cookie dough (chilled) nor the apple?

148 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:44:25am

re: #146 lawhawk

And most of that in a single horrendous post.

How the hell do you get hundreds of downdings on a single post? Were people signing up just to knock it down? o_O

149 reine.de.tout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:44:50am

". . . the long of his birth certifcate."

oooh-kay.

150 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:45:19am

And...WHAMMY

Robert Gibbs to Donald Trump: Where are the tax returns?

Former White House press secretary and Obama confidante Robert Gibbs is throwing down the gauntlet on Donald Trump.

"Donald Trump said he’d release his tax returns as soon as the president released his birth certificate, so the ball is in his court now and I know everybody is anxious to see his tax returns over the last 10 years," Gibbs told POLITICO.

Trump first floated the trade-off in an interview with ABC earlier this month.

"Maybe I’m going to do the tax returns when Obama does his birth certificate," said the real estate mogul, whose wealth has long been a matter of dispute. "I may tie my tax returns [to the birth certificate]. I’d love to give my tax returns."

151 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:45:19am

re: #148 Simply Sarah

How the hell do you get hundreds of downdings on a single post? Were people signing up just to knock it down? o_O

I imagine it was like that scene in "Airplane" where passengers line up to smack that woman.

152 Achilles Tang  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:45:33am

re: #117 Sully33

I'm glad he released the damn thing. This clearly puts the nail in the coffin of this story for any fair minded person.

There were no fair minded people that had an issue with this to begin with.

Want to try again?

153 jaunte  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:46:16am

re: #149 reine.de.tout

Know what mean?

154 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:46:42am

re: #146 lawhawk

And most of that in a single horrendous post.

Yep. If I remember correctly it was a post about how Pallin should have aborted Trig when She found out he was a Downs Syndrome.

155 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:47:40am

re: #146 lawhawk

And most of that in a single horrendous post.

It was -482

At a time where there was 482 fans of Sarah Palin here:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Host of what she said about here seems not worthy of a downding-gasm in retrospect.

156 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:47:53am

re: #154 Bubblehead II

Has anne france been back since?

157 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:48:43am

re: #156 imp_62

Has anne france been back since?

She was banned about a week *after* that post I think.

158 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:49:26am

re: #145 SanFranciscoZionist

Doesn't AnneFrance (who was before my time) still hold the record?

Annefrance, -482.

159 albusteve  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:49:44am

re: #156 imp_62

Has anne france been back since?

only in the spirit of her monumental IQ

160 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:50:03am

re: #157 ArchangelMichael

It is often a slippery slope once you get hammered like that.

161 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:50:18am

re: #150 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

And...WHAMMY

Robert Gibbs to Donald Trump: Where are the tax returns?

Now it's time to watch The Donald weasel out by pointing out that he said "Maybe" he'd release them if Obama released his birth certificate. Or try to continue arguing that the release today wasn't the "real" certificate and so he's not obligated to put out his tax returns yet.

162 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:50:21am

'Atlas Shrugged' producer: 'Critics, you won.' He's going 'on strike.'

Twelve days after opening "Atlas Shrugged: Part 1," the producer of the Ayn Rand adaptation said Tuesday that he is reconsidering his plans to make Parts 2 and 3 because of scathing reviews and flagging box office returns for the film.

"Critics, you won," said John Aglialoro, the businessman who spent 18 years and more than $20 million of his own money to make, distribute and market "Atlas Shrugged: Part 1," which covers the first third of Rand's dystopian novel. "I’m having deep second thoughts on why I should do Part 2."

163 engineer cat  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:51:14am

Americans Line Up To Touch Obama's Birth Certificate In Situ In State Of Hawaii Records Room

chemical testing kits for ink and paper sold at door

Some Asking Why Obama Page Tastes Different Than Other Pages

epistomologists and theologians brought in to ponder question "how do we know what we know???"

Bust Of President Truman In Lobby Seen To Weep Real Tears

164 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:51:26am

re: #150 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

And...WHAMMY

Robert Gibbs to Donald Trump: Where are the tax returns?

Nice. Keeping Trump in the spotlight is probably the best thing to do.

165 reine.de.tout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:51:31am

re: #159 albusteve

only in the spirit of her monumental IQ

That was charlye sarte.

166 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:51:32am

re: #156 imp_62

Has anne france been back since?

Nope. Got herself banned.

167 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:51:54am

re: #159 albusteve

only in the spirit of her monumental IQ

That was Charlye Sartre, with the 167 IQ.

168 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:51:58am

re: #162 Killgore Trout

'Atlas Shrugged' producer: 'Critics, you won.' He's going 'on strike.'

Too bad he wasn't having those second thoughts before he sunk $20 million of his own money into a film that Hollywood has dubbed "unfilmable" for decades.

169 jaunte  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:52:03am

re: #162 Killgore Trout

I think he should ignore the critics, and his deep thoughts, and just go for it.

170 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:52:32am

re: #155 ArchangelMichael

PIMF

Most of what she said about her seems not worthy of a downding-gasm in retrospect.

(although the stuff about Trig was was out of line)

171 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:53:14am

re: #168 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Too bad he wasn't having those second thoughts before he sunk $20 million of his own money into a film that Hollywood has dubbed "unfilmable" for decades.

Let's be honest amongst educated people here. The novel is also "unreadable". It's like Finnegan's Wake without the literary merit.

172 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:53:23am

Well, reading Obama's fathers passport file is very interesting, although mostly it's just making me feel pity for Ann Dunham.

173 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:53:31am

re: #155 ArchangelMichael

It was -482

At a time where there was 482 fans of Sarah Palin here:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Host of what she said about here seems not worthy of a downding-gasm in retrospect.

Yikes. That is quite a lot of downdings. The box listing users doesn't even fit on my screen.

174 BongCrodny  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:53:50am

re: #162 Killgore Trout

'Atlas Shrugged' producer: 'Critics, you won.' He's going 'on strike.'


Yeah, blame the critics, not the big festering pile of blargh you put up there on the screen.

175 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:53:59am

re: #170 ArchangelMichael

PIMF

Most of what she said about her seems not worthy of a downding-gasm in retrospect.

(although the stuff about Trig was was out of line)

I don't care if someone is pro-choice or not, but saying the someone else should abort a Down's baby is just wrong.

176 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:54:04am

GOP pivots away from birthers

Brian Patrick, a spokesman for House Majority Leader Eric Cantor: “Yesterday, White House Press Secretary Jay Carney called this issue a sideshow. We fully agree. The White House shouldn’t engage political sideshows, particularly at a time when the challenges facing our country are so immense. Despite the excitement caused by the media circus this morning, House Republicans remain squarely focused on the things that truly matter to families and business owners throughout our country.”

Stop making us look crazy!

177 albusteve  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:54:21am

re: #165 reine.de.tout

That was charlye sarte.

oh my, I'm off to a bad start....better shut up

179 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:54:24am

re: #170 ArchangelMichael

PIMF

Most of what she said about her seems not worthy of a downding-gasm in retrospect.

(although the stuff about Trig was was out of line)

I was thinking the same. It reads ok until the Trig comments. It's like s/he got carried away and failed to review before posting. PIMF indeed.

180 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:54:27am

re: #171 imp_62

Let's be honest amongst educated people here. The novel is also "unreadable". It's like Finnegan's Wake without the literary merit.

I'll be honest, I've never managed to finish it. I got maybe 1/16th of the way, then gave up because I valued my sanity.

181 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:54:49am

re: #148 Simply Sarah

How the hell do you get hundreds of downdings on a single post? Were people signing up just to knock it down? o_O

Well, she insulted Sarah Palin, at a time when Palin was still a major icon around here...and I think she said that she should have aborted her youngest child, or something...anyway, the downdinging was awesome to behold.

182 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:54:56am

re: #174 BongCrodny

Yeah, blame the critics, not the big festering pile of blargh you put up there on the screen.

And this was just "Part One." And let's face facts, LOTR this isn't.

183 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:55:08am

re: #78 imp_62

Plus, if Trump scratches his hair, it bites him.

Dunno how I missed this earlier, but lord I am LAUGHING!

184 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:55:21am

re: #170 ArchangelMichael

PIMF

Most of what she said about her seems not worthy of a downding-gasm in retrospect.

(although the stuff about Trig was was out of line)

The part about Trig was *extremely* out of line and pretty disgusting. Granted, I have no idea how many of those downdings were for that and how many were just for going after Sarah.

185 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:55:30am

re: #177 albusteve

oh my, I'm off to a bad start...better shut up

Carry on. Nothing to see here.

186 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:55:39am

re: #178 publicityStunted

Needs moar gloating ;)

The wingnut fails are coming fast and furious these days.

187 Sully33  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:56:32am

re: #152 Naso Tang

Sure, I never had a problem with this issue in the first place. I had a big issue with how the President didn't cut the nuts off of the story before it came to this. I think he used poor strategy and it looks like Trump forced his hand.

...and there are fair minded people out there who just might disagree with you once in a while. (unless you're right all the time that is...)

188 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:56:55am

re: #186 Killgore Trout

The wingnut fails are coming fast and furious these days.

The coming 18 months look to be one long carnival of fail from the Right. I'm stocking up on popcorn in anticipation.

189 jaunte  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:56:56am

Randians need their "Ishtar, Part 2."

190 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:57:15am

re: #162 Killgore Trout

'Atlas Shrugged' producer: 'Critics, you won.' He's going 'on strike.'

Another rule of the Rand Universe--stupid shit by Objectivetarians doesn't rise or fall on its own merits, it is cut down by 'the critics'.

191 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:57:39am

re: #163 engineer dog

Americans Line Up To Touch Obama's Birth Certificate In Situ In State Of Hawaii Records Room

chemical testing kits for ink and paper sold at door

Some Asking Why Obama Page Tastes Different Than Other Pages

epistomologists and theologians brought in to ponder question "how do we know what we know???"

Bust Of President Truman In Lobby Seen To Weep Real Tears

Bust of LBJ Curses Blue Streak

192 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:57:51am

Hot Air Green Room: Is the Birth Certificate Fake? The Games Have Begun

Will the document turn out to be a forgery? I wouldn’t bet on it. Dan Rather and his producer Mary Mapes may have thought they could pass off an obvious fake as authentic, but the Obama White House team is made up of members of a younger generation. Even if they were to attempt to “create” a long-form birth certificate—which would be an absurdly costly gamble for the president—they would be sure the end-product of their labors was unimpeachable.


Keep digging!

193 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:58:25am

re: #190 SanFranciscoZionist

Another rule of the Rand Universe--stupid shit by Objectivetarians doesn't rise or fall on its own merits, it is cut down by 'the critics'.

I'm sure "Part II" and "Part III" will be big hits in the Gulch.

194 simoom  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:59:00am

re: #117 Sully33

All in all, I think Obama overplayed his hand and Trump called him on it.
Obama wins the fact war, Trump won the self promotion war.

I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. The President already bore the humiliation of having to be the only presidential candidate in history who's legitimacy was so questioned that he publicly released his Birth certificate to the entire world's scrutiny. This was during the 2008 campaign and it was the the one and only Birth Certificate Hawaii offers.

It must be an additional humiliation to be forced by by a craven media and unscrupulous opposition to now release a document that has less value as proof of Hawaiian and US citizenship than what he'd previously released (the pre-digital certificate is no longer supposed to be used for official purposes). IMO, the release of the document, by some extrodinary means (as there wasn't a clear path through Hawaiian law) is an acknowledgement the bigots and crazies, to some extent, have won. The media should be ashamed that they so failed to quash this, with their wallowing in the muck, that releasing an irrelevant document became necessary:[Link: www.usatoday.com...]

A USA TODAY/Gallup Poll released Monday showed the issue gaining surprising traction, given that investigations by news outlets and non-partisan organizations consistently concluded there was no question about Obama's place of birth. In the poll, taken last week, only 38% of Americans said they thought the president was "definitely" born in the United States; 18% said he "probably" was.
195 BongCrodny  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 11:59:45am

re: #189 jaunte

Randians need their "Ishtar, Part 2."


"Battlefield: Derp."

196 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:00:13pm

BTW has anyone read "Ghost Dancer" by John Case? It's about an Ayn-Rand objectivist supervillain who plans to release an EMP bomb on "collectivist" civilization, while he hides in his gulch.

197 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:00:31pm

re: #184 Simply Sarah

The part about Trig was *extremely* out of line and pretty disgusting. Granted, I have no idea how many of those downdings were for that and how many were just for going after Sarah.

I would hope if anyone were to start being as mean about the Obama girls as she was about the Palin kids we would downding that person.

Kids should be off-limits.

198 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:01:03pm

re: #187 Sully33

Sure, I never had a problem with this issue in the first place. I had a big issue with how the President didn't cut the nuts off of the story before it came to this. I think he used poor strategy and it looks like Trump forced his hand.

...and there are fair minded people out there who just might disagree with you once in a while. (unless you're right all the time that is...)

He did address this...3 years ago when he released his official birth certificate that was provided by the State of Hawaii.

199 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:01:19pm

re: #184 Simply Sarah

The part about Trig was *extremely* out of line and pretty disgusting. Granted, I have no idea how many of those downdings were for that and how many were just for going after Sarah.

Mine was for the comment about Trig.

200 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:01:35pm

re: #190 SanFranciscoZionist

Another rule of the Rand Universe--stupid shit by Objectivetarians doesn't rise or fall on its own merits, it is cut down by 'the critics'.

It is odd. They claim to be free-marketeers, but they get very angry if the free market, propelled by the needs and wishes of ordinary boring people, doesn't reward them as they see fit.

201 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:01:50pm

Fox: Obama Birth Certificate Moved to More Secure Location Months Ago

More than a month before Donald Trump began his media blitzkrieg over the issue of President Obama's birth certificate, the document was quietly moved to a more secure location within a dual combination-key lock safe inside the state's health department vault.

The certificate was moved there by Alvin Onaka, Hawaii's State Registrar, in response to what had already become an increasing number of media requests by FoxNews.com and others, according to sources.


Al Capone's vault!

203 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:02:45pm

re: #201 Killgore Trout

Fox: Obama Birth Certificate Moved to More Secure Location Months Ago


Al Capone's vault!

Perfect! No one would ever think to look there!

204 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:02:50pm

Currently, MSNBC is polling on the president's birth certificate. The results thus far are (based on 107,716 votes)
10% Yes. It is irrefutable proof he was born in Hawaii. 10,821 votes
36.5% No. There will always be doubt in my mind. 39,267 votes
53.5% I never questioned his citizenship in the first place. 57,628 votes

So, more than 1/3 of the polled still doubt the President's citizenship, regardless of the evidence.

And I don't think anything will ever change their minds.

Awful.

205 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:03:04pm

re: #201 Killgore Trout

OMG. Is that an objective news factoid?

206 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:03:19pm

re: #199 Bubblehead II

Mine was for the comment about Trig.

That was way over the line. Also, personally annoying to me since at the time there was a cottage industry in insisting that all female Obama voters thought Palin should have aborted Trig.

However, just saying that Sarah was a bad candidate would get you downdinged at the time. Not nearly that much, though.

207 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:04:09pm
208 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:04:48pm

re: #204 lawhawk

Yeah that's pretty much it.

There's absolutely nothing that will work with these people except maybe excising parts of the country. (I kid, I kid!)

209 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:05:00pm

What the loud-mouth Randistas don't understand about Atlas Shrugged: They themselves are not the counterparts of John Galt and the movers, shakers, and creators who go on strike in the novel. They are parasites living off the fat of the land in the tawdry media construct of suburban middle America. Their bullshit is only effective within the intellectually blighted universe that they themselves inhabit. Unable to see this from the outside, they over-estimate how convincing their bullshit really is.
The real creators in society, people like Paul Allen, have a far more egalitarian and flexible worldview.

210 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:05:28pm

re: #202 Killgore Trout

Via Instapundit: This document has been altered and whoever did it wasn't even very clever in doing so.

Yeah, they don't believe it's the authentic document, imagine that. *rolls eyes*

211 AntonSirius  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:05:42pm

re: #187 Sully33

Sure, I never had a problem with this issue in the first place. I had a big issue with how the President didn't cut the nuts off of the story before it came to this. I think he used poor strategy and it looks like Trump forced his hand.

...and there are fair minded people out there who just might disagree with you once in a while. (unless you're right all the time that is...)

Yes, let's blame the president for not squashing in what you consider a timely fashion an obvious lie that no one sane or non-racist would believe and that he shouldn't have had to squash at all, rather than the scumbags pimping said lie.

Good job.

212 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:05:57pm

re: #207 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

He's going Galt on us!

And now America will fall apart!

213 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:06:03pm

re: #206 SanFranciscoZionist

That was way over the line. Also, personally annoying to me since at the time there was a cottage industry in insisting that all female Obama voters thought Palin should have aborted Trig.

However, just saying that Sarah was a bad candidate would get you downdinged at the time. Not nearly that much, though.

I didn't like the line of thinking that Palin shouldn't be running because she young kids (Trig especially), either. There were *plenty* of reasons to say Palin shouldn't be VP without having to, essentially, bring out "because she's a woman".

214 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:06:06pm

re: #209 Shiplord Kirel

What the loud-mouth Randistas don't understand about Atlas Shrugged: They themselves are not the counterparts of John Galt and the movers, shakers, and creators who go on strike in the novel. They are parasites living off the fat of the land in the tawdry media construct of suburban middle America. Their bullshit is only effective within the intellectually blighted universe that they themselves inhabit. Unable to see this from the outside, they over-estimate how convincing their bullshit really is.
The real creators in society, people like Paul Allen, have a far more egalitarian and flexible worldview.

Damn, SK. You should simply retire your nic now. You will never write a better post.

215 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:06:08pm

re: #189 jaunte

Randians need their "Ishtar, Part 2."

Battlefield Earth 2

216 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:07:21pm

re: #206 SanFranciscoZionist

"However, just saying that Sarah was a bad candidate would get you downdinged at the time. Not nearly that much, though."

True. Iirc, Walter took a beating on a regular basis during that time.

217 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:07:44pm

re: #212 SanFranciscoZionist

And now America will fall apart!

Fuckin' civilization! How does it work?!

218 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:08:04pm

re: #202 Killgore Trout

Via Instapundit: This document has been altered and whoever did it wasn't even very clever in doing so.

Idiots again.

People who don't understand how JPEG compression works. The usual. "Look, there are funny pixels around the edges!!?! It was obviously FAKED!!eleventy1"

No matter how many times JPEG artifacts are explained to these derfs, they do this every damned time.

219 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:08:10pm

re: #217 ArchangelMichael

Fuckin' civilization! How does it work?!

Juggalos.

220 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:08:42pm

re: #213 Simply Sarah

I didn't like the line of thinking that Palin shouldn't be running because she young kids (Trig especially), either. There were *plenty* of reasons to say Palin shouldn't be VP without having to, essentially, bring out "because she's a woman".

I got into that line of thought for a little, and my mother pulled me up real short.

The carrying-on as though no Democratic woman had ever reproduced was effing annoying, though.

221 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:08:45pm

re: #217 ArchangelMichael

Fuckin' civilization! How does it work?!

People seeking freedom from tyranny go in, Birthers come out. You can't explain that!

222 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:08:56pm

theonlyadult BWD
by AngryBlackLady

"A level of personal humiliation no previous president has ever been asked to endure. An embarrassment to the country" [Link: wapo.st...]

Read this article by Adam Serwer.

223 SpaceJesus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:09:27pm

I want to see the drawings Barack HUSSEIN Obama made in kindergarten

224 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:10:03pm

re: #214 imp_62

Damn, SK. You should simply retire your nic now. You will never write a better post.

Many thanks, high praise indeed coming from you. I've been wrestling with my life-long opposition to elitism lately. I am just fed up with pretending that morons and liars are anything other than what they are. They seem to imagine they have actually fooled someone if nobody knocks their teeth out or puts them in jail. They are depraved and worthless people and their numbers have created a worthless and depraved culture to sustain them.

225 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:10:08pm

re: #216 Bubblehead II

"However, just saying that Sarah was a bad candidate would get you downdinged at the time. Not nearly that much, though."

True. Iirc, Walter took a beating on a regular basis during that time.

Cato

226 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:10:44pm

re: #225 Stanley Sea

To my memory, he was more than a little creepy about it tho' >>

227 darthstar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:11:13pm

YES!

Sam Stein
@samsteinhp Sam Stein
harry reid just announced he will hold a vote on the ryan budget
57 minutes ago via TweetDeck


[Link: twitter.com...]

228 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:11:33pm

re: #225 Stanley Sea

Thanks.

229 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:12:50pm

Stay classy Sarah

Palin mocks Couric over CBS exit

At least she stayed for her entire contract.

230 3CPO  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:13:07pm

Comment from TMZ:

"Nice try Mr "President" But if this birth certificate is from 1961 then WHY IS IT IN PDF FORMAT!!!?????!!!???"

I'm sure it's snark, but it was too good not to share.

231 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:13:11pm

re: #227 darthstar

YES!


[Link: twitter.com...]

First Obama puts the birthers on the defense, now Reid's going to put the Ryan bill up to a vote. Did the Dems grow a set while I wasn't watching?

232 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:13:19pm

re: #227 darthstar

This should be exciting >

233 simoom  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:13:42pm

re: #222 Stanley Sea

"A level of personal humiliation no previous president has ever been asked to endure. An embarrassment to the country" [Link: wapo.st...]

Thanks. That quote pretty much sums up my feelings on this matter too.

234 Mocking Jay  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:13:48pm

re: #223 SpaceJesus

I want to see the drawings Barack HUSSEIN Obama made in kindergarten

Unless he can produce a drawing of Mohammed I refuse to believe he is not a Muslim!!1!

235 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:14:26pm

The German writer Peter Bichsel wrote a story "Amerika gibt es nicht" ("America doesn't exist"). Essentially, it tells the story of a man who believes that people who are tricked into believing in America try to go there, discover it absent, and then come back embarrassed; so they fabricate stories of America. The moral is that you cannot have a world in which only first-hand experience counts as objective truth. Not everyone will walk on the moon, not everyone will see the orignal COLB. Doesn't mean the moon is made of cheese and the COLB is a fake. At the same time, there is no talking to people who insist on either.

236 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:14:52pm

re: #223 SpaceJesus

Upding on the meta.

237 engineer cat  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:15:15pm

re: #187 Sully33

Sure, I never had a problem with this issue in the first place. I had a big issue with how the President didn't cut the nuts off of the story before it came to this.

easy - obama knows that old rule of war: never interfere with your enemies when they are in the process of committing suicide

238 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:15:18pm

re: #224 Shiplord Kirel

Many thanks, high praise indeed coming from you. I've been wrestling with my life-long opposition to elitism lately. I am just fed up with pretending that morons and liars are anything other than what they are. They seem to imagine they have actually fooled someone if nobody knocks their teeth out or puts them in jail. They are depraved and worthless people and their numbers have created a worthless and depraved culture to sustain them.

We live in frustrating times. Don't let it get to you.

239 SpaceJesus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:16:13pm

also, today is my last day of law school. onwards to the bar(s)!

241 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:17:40pm

re: #240 darthstar

Iowa's Palin for President operation pretty much consists of one guy with a computer in Storm Lake and another who is crisscrossing Iowa in a rental car, armed with a laptop and a sunny attitude.

Leading me further to believe that she's not serious about running, just going for the name recognition to keep the money flowing in.

242 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:17:46pm
Appearing on Fox News Tuesday, Palin mocked the CBS newswoman who told People Magazine she is looking forward to a new position that will facilitate "multi-dimensional storytelling." "Yeah, and I hear that she wants to now engage in more 'multi-dimensional story telling' versus I guess just the 'straight on, read into the, that teleprompter screen story telling,'" Palin said. "More power to her. I wish her well in her - 'multi-dimensional story telling.'"

I wonder if Palin read her comments from her teleprompter hand.

243 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:17:53pm

re: #239 SpaceJesus

also, today is my last day of law school. onwards to the bar(s)!

Just remember that you want to pass them, not pass out in one.

244 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:18:46pm
245 darthstar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:20:21pm

If you're a fan of Headcount.org on facebook, they're giving away two tickets to see Warren Haynes at the Beacon May 12. Just post a comment telling them why you deserve to go to the show.

I'm on the wrong coast, so I won't bother.

246 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:21:05pm

For almost a hundred years after Reconstruction (1877 to ca. 1960), racism and the legacy of slavery were swept under the rug in this country. This was done in the interest of national unity: Reconciling the defeated south was far more important that righting the wrongs that caused the Civil War in the first place.
Since the 1960s, we have been gradually moving toward a more realistic appraisal but the process has been halting and incomplete.
Now, though, with the election of a black president and with some help from the Civil War sesquicenteniel, the real issues have burst into the open, as though they had been in suspended animation somewhere. It is getting ugly and it will get uglier yet.

247 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:21:31pm

OT: This is funny. I am a financial markets expert and I have experience with financial metadata and data taxonomies. This inquiry came from a search of qualifications in a consultants' database:


Seeking Experts for Partnership re: Forest Technology

Zintro (www.zintro.com) connects Clients (expert-seekers) with Experts. A Zintro Client is currently seeking Experts re: Forest Technology.

Description: CDA, Collaborative Development to Accelerate Markets. Barthelemy E.N. Lokoka, Consultant – International Business Development CDA, is an advisory and exchange organisation operating in two main areas of activities: - Promotion of products and services, both inside and outside Canada: CDA contributes to increasing the volume in global trades, especially between developing countries and developed countries - Incubator of development projects, more specifically in Africa, by implementing development strategic partnerships that will facilitate and accelerate global equilibrium. Currently, CDA is involved in a project to study tropical biodiversity in Africa, in the region of Boende, Equateur Province, in The Democratic Republic of Congo: The project focuses on taxonomic identification of medicinal plants and traditional pathologies in this context. N.B.: Right now, we are in search of partners mainly preoccupied by forestry problems, biomass, as well as social and sustainable development of equatorial and tropical forests.

Areas of Expertise: Seeking Experts with knowledge of Forest Technology; Forestry; Forestry In Africa; Tropical Biodiversity; Taxonomy; Tropical Forests

Zintro Client: Consulting Firm - - Pt/CO

Fee Offered: Not Specified

Next Steps: Click here to see additional details about or to reply to this Inquiry.

Feel free to forward this e-mail to others. If you want to be compensated for making referrals, follow the link above to go into the Inquiry and click on the "Refer" button at the bottom of the Inquiry.

Click here to see your Inquiries, Proposals, and zNotes conveniently organized.

That said, of anybody here is qualified, let me know and I will forward the email

248 subsailor68  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:23:34pm

re: #240 darthstar

Iowa's Palin for President operation pretty much consists of one guy with a computer in Storm Lake and another who is crisscrossing Iowa in a rental car, armed with a laptop and a sunny attitude.

Cool! It's the first time I've seen a zeugma in its natural habitat!

;-)

Zeugma

249 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:23:42pm

Not to forget the Malcolm X thing…

250 darthstar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:24:01pm

Heh...

Atlas Shrugged currently ‘boasts’ a mere 8% positive rating on Rotten Tomatoes; by way of comparison, Ishtar has a fairly celebratory 19%

251 Sully33  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:24:20pm

re: #198 Simply Sarah

Yeah, that worked out well.

252 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:24:23pm

re: #250 darthstar

Heh...

I'm still disappointed it moved off of 0%.

253 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:25:53pm

re: #252 Simply Sarah

I'm still disappointed it moved off of 0%.

Probably the movie reviewer at "The Objectivist Newsletter" liked it.

254 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:27:22pm

re: #251 Sully33

Yeah, that worked out well.

Look, it's not really Obama's fault that there are people determined to ignore reality. It was like if a cop pulled you over, refused to take your license, and instead demanded a passport and Social Security card.

255 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:27:27pm

re: #253 Alouette

Probably the movie reviewer at "The Objectivist Newsletter" liked it.

Only two are listed as "fresh," one from MovieCritic.com, the other from (surprise, surprise!) the New York Post.

256 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:27:43pm

re: #253 Alouette

Probably the movie reviewer at "The Objectivist Newsletter" liked it.

What I'd like to see is some Ayn Rand fan who says that it's a bad adaptation.

257 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:28:20pm

re: #255 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Only two are listed as "fresh," one from MovieCritic.com, the other from (surprise, surprise!) the New York Post.

Yeah. I was absolutely shocked (shocked!) when I saw the Post was one of them.

258 mr.fusion  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:30:12pm

re: #231 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

First Obama puts the birthers on the defense, now Reid's going to put the Ryan bill up to a vote. Did the Dems grow a set while I wasn't watching?

They've been on a full court press the last couple of weeks. Ever since Obama's budget speech.

Here's hoping they keep it up

259 makeitstop  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:30:14pm

re: #250 darthstar

Heh...

Call me weird, but I loved 'Ishtar.'

260 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:30:55pm

re: #242 imp_62

I wonder if Palin read her comments from her teleprompter hand.

I betcha it was multi deminsional storytelling she had written down. She couldn't remember that.

261 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:31:46pm

re: #258 mr.fusion

They've been on a full court press the last couple of weeks. Ever since Obama's budget speech.

Here's hoping they keep it up

I give them another month or two before they realize what they're doing and recoil in terror.

262 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:31:51pm

re: #259 makeitstop

Call me weird, but I loved 'Ishtar.'

Ok. Weird :)

263 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:32:46pm

re: #261 Simply Sarah

I give them another month or two before they realize what they're doing and recoil in terror.

Cynic. But true.

264 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:34:39pm

re: #260 Stanley Sea

I betcha it was multi deminsional storytelling she had written down. She couldn't remember that.

Teleprompter Hand. How does that get there?

265 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:35:10pm

Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans


A veteran Afghan military pilot said to be distressed over his personal finances opened fire at Kabul airport after an argument Wednesday, killing eight U.S. troops and an American civilian contractor.

Those killed were trainers and advisers for the nascent Afghan air force. The shooting was the deadliest attack by a member of the Afghan security forces, or an insurgent impersonating them, on coalition troops or Afghan soldiers or policemen. There have been seven such attacks so far this year.

266 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:35:45pm

re: #258 mr.fusion

They've been on a full court press the last couple of weeks. Ever since Obama's budget speech.

Here's hoping they keep it up

Indeed. It's like they've been yanking one talking point after another out of the GOP's hands. With the speech, Obama took the "There's no alternative to the Ryan Plan!" point off the table. Yesterday, he got Boehner to walk back the "We're open to cutting oil subsidies" by sending him a letter expressing his happiness that they agreed on the issue, killing another point. And now he's taken the "No long form!" point at least off the table for anybody other than the most ardent birthers, while Reid may take the "The Senate Dems won't allow a vote on the plan!" point off the table before week's end.

One by one, they're neutralizing the GOP's plans before they gain real traction next year.

267 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:36:08pm

Current poll at KCBD TV in Lubbock:

Are you satisfied that President Obama was born in the US?
Yes
No

Thank you for participating in our poll. Here are the results so far:

Yes
43%
No
57%

268 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:36:49pm

re: #213 Simply Sarah

I didn't like the line of thinking that Palin shouldn't be running because she young kids (Trig especially), either. There were *plenty* of reasons to say Palin shouldn't be VP without having to, essentially, bring out "because she's a woman".

That line of thinking would NEVER be deployed against a male candidate, and that was my problem with it. And as you say, there were already many proper criticisms to make of her.

269 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:37:07pm

re: #267 Shiplord Kirel

[Insert Texas Joke here]

270 makeitstop  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:37:32pm

re: #267 Shiplord Kirel

Current poll at KCBD TV in Lubbock:

* Bangs head on desk *

271 albusteve  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:38:12pm

re: #265 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

was just setting up this post....makes my sick, we gotta get the fuck outa there

272 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:38:18pm

Current poll at KCBD TV in Lubbock:

Are you satisfied that all people are created equal, including blacks, muslims, jews and homosexuals?
Yes
No

Thank you for participating in our poll. Here are the results so far:

Yes
43%
No
57%

FTFY

273 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:38:25pm

re: #267 Shiplord Kirel

Current poll at KCBD TV in Lubbock:

Eh, it's a web poll. Those are pretty much the very definition of unscientific and biased. Half the time they let you vote more than once.

274 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:39:06pm

Oh, I'm sure that the birthers are mobbing every online poll they can find right now, in hopes of keeping this "issue" alive at least a little bit longer. I'd wait at least a week, preferably two, and then take a measure of where the issue stands.

275 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:39:49pm

re: #269 windsagio

[Insert Texas Joke here]

Since Lubbockites tolerate chronic flooding in one of the driest and flattest cities in the world, and traffic jams when they have the lowest traffic density in the country, they are liable to do or believe almost anything.

276 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:40:09pm

re: #268 iceweasel

That line of thinking would NEVER be deployed against a male candidate, and that was my problem with it. And as you say, there were already many proper criticisms to make of her.

Exactly. It plays directly into the "Women should stay at home and raise the kids while the men are out doing real jobs" concept that needs to be opposed at every turn.

277 albusteve  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:40:20pm

9 more dead in Astan while the country dwiddles over a goddamned birth cert

278 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:42:48pm

re: #277 albusteve

"dwiddle"?

279 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:43:27pm

re: #276 Simply Sarah

Exactly. It plays directly into the "Women should stay at home and raise the kids while the men are out doing real jobs" concept that needs to be opposed at every turn.

Of course. My next least favourite smear from the right was "Liberal women hate her because she's a mother"-- which feeds right into that crap from Robertson about how the 'liberal agenda' and the 'feminist agenda' is to keep women from having children.
Of course, the true meaning of choice in the prochoice movement means supporting women in their choices-- including Palin's choice to have kids, including Trig.

280 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:46:06pm

Congratulations, America, Donald Trump Is the Boss of You

Today, with a precarious economy, rising gas prices and three wars under way, the President of the United States of America held a press conference to announce the release of his original birth certificate, to prove that he is eligible to hold his office and quell a controversy fomented by a reality-show judge who by some polls is the leading candidate to oppose him in the 2012 election.

[Pause to allow those readers, who so desire, to kill themselves.]

The release of the certificate—shockingly!—revealed that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii, in 1961, as a human baby. It, and the subsequent press conference, drew saturation coverage from cable news. But not before Apprentice boss Donald Trump held a press conference in New Hampshire on the appearance of the birth certificate he declared "missing" on Anderson Cooper, um, two days ago. His humbled response: You're welcome, America!

Trump's remarks literally began, "I am very proud of myself." Because of course he is. Because who wouldn't be proud to have cynically embraced a toxic nutjob theory, on the basis of no good evidence, questioning the President's legitimacy, then having his suspicions shown to be an Al Capone's vault? Who wouldn't be proud to have turned himself from a national punchline into a national punchline with a shot at a Presidential nomination, through sheer, up-by-the-bootstraps pandering to Internet conspiracists? That takes talent, folks!

281 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:47:22pm

re: #277 albusteve

+1 for 'dwiddle' that's a helluva verb.

282 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:49:58pm

re: #279 iceweasel

Of course. My next least favourite smear from the right was "Liberal women hate her because she's a mother"-- which feeds right into that crap from Robertson about how the 'liberal agenda' and the 'feminist agenda' is to keep women from having children.
Of course, the true meaning of choice in the prochoice movement means supporting women in their choices-- including Palin's choice to have kids, including Trig.

In some ways, I have more trouble responding to that one, simply because it is so absolutely bizarre. Liberal women hate themselves so much that they want to prevent anyone from having children? Like, what the hell? I suppose the only way they can justify their positions are by making it so the majority of women that don't support them don't count.

283 darthstar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:51:45pm

re: #231 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

First Obama puts the birthers on the defense, now Reid's going to put the Ryan bill up to a vote. Did the Dems grow a set while I wasn't watching?

Watching McConnell squirm will make this whole charade worth it. It's your policy, you support it, asshole. Vote. (Of course, he will because he runs about zero risk of losing his seat in the next 20 years.)

284 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:52:19pm

re: #282 Simply Sarah

Someone was looking at childfree hardcore communities and generalizing :p

It's not a huge group, but women that think that way certainly exist.

285 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:53:58pm
286 zora  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:54:09pm

from the new yorker:

Trump, Birtherism, and Race-Baiting
Posted by David Remnick

Not long after the White House released the President’s birth certificate this morning, Donald Trump stepped off a helicopter, ambled up to a bank of microphones, and declared, “Today, I’m very proud of myself.” (One assumes this is a daily ritual for Trump, but today there were more cameras than usual.) Trump also declared himself relieved that “the press can stop asking me questions” about the birther issue and we can now move on to more important ones, such as “China ripping off this country.” What is there to say anymore about Donald Trump? That he is an irrepressible jackass who thinks of himself as a sly fox? That he is a buffoon with bathroom fixtures of gold? Why bother, after so many decades? There is no insulting someone who lives in a self-reinforcing fantasy world...

Read more [Link: www.newyorker.com...]

287 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:54:26pm

re: #283 darthstar

Watching McConnell squirm will make this whole charade worth it. It's your policy, you support it, asshole. Vote. (Of course, he will because he runs about zero risk of losing his seat in the next 20 years.)

Even if the Senate Repubs somehow manage to win over the handful of Senate Dems necessary to pass the bill, there's no way they're going to pull together a the votes in either chamber to override a veto. This bill is as good as dead, but it will be an excellent weapon to put Senate Repubs on record as supporting the dismantling of Medicare to finance yet another tax giveaway to the top 1%.

288 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:54:42pm

Atheists Seek Chaplain Role in the Military

Strange as it sounds, groups representing atheists and secular humanists are pushing for the appointment of one of their own to the chaplaincy, hoping to give voice to what they say is a large — and largely underground — population of nonbelievers in the military.

Joining the chaplain corps is part of a broader campaign by atheists to win official acceptance in the military. Such recognition would make it easier for them to raise money and meet on military bases. It would help ensure that chaplains, religious or atheist, would distribute their literature, advertise their events and advocate for them with commanders.

But winning the appointment of an atheist chaplain will require support from senior chaplains, a tall order. Many chaplains are skeptical: Do atheists belong to a “faith group,” a requirement for a chaplain candidate? Can they provide support to religious troops of all faiths, a fundamental responsibility for chaplains?

Jason Torpy, a former Army captain who is president of the Military Association of Atheists and Freethinkers, said humanist chaplains would do everything religious chaplains do, including counsel troops and help them follow their faiths. But just as a Protestant chaplain would not preside over a Catholic service, a humanist might not lead a religious ceremony, though he might help organize it.

“Humanism fills the same role for atheists that Christianity does for Christians and Judaism does for Jews,” Mr. Torpy said in an interview. “It answers questions of ultimate concern; it directs our values.”

289 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:55:13pm

re: #284 windsagio

Someone was looking at childfree hardcore communities and generalizing :p

It's not a huge group, but women that think that way certainly exist.

Sure, and the Duggars also exist, but that doesn't mean that most religious conservative women believe they should have twenty children.

290 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:56:04pm

re: #289 SanFranciscoZionist

oh absolutely. Not justifying the terrible in any way :p

291 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:56:25pm

re: #289 SanFranciscoZionist

Sure, and the Duggars also exist, but that doesn't mean that most religious conservative women believe they should have twenty children.

Curses! Beat me to giving that sort of response!

292 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:56:42pm

re: #288 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

oops pseudo-double. I've gotta admit, I'm salivating at the idea of atheists defining themselves as a 'faith group' ;)

293 darthstar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:56:58pm

re: #287 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Even if the Senate Repubs somehow manage to win over the handful of Senate Dems necessary to pass the bill, there's no way they're going to pull together a the votes in either chamber to override a veto. This bill is as good as dead, but it will be an excellent weapon to put Senate Repubs on record as supporting the dismantling of Medicare to finance yet another tax giveaway to the top 1%.

I hope Reid gives him six voters so Obama CAN veto it. Imagine campaigning against a president who used his veto power to "save Medicare." Good night, opponents.

294 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:57:12pm

Drudge linking to 9-11 Truther Alex Jones again today: REPORT: Former Miss USA Sexually Molested by TSA...
He's also still promoting Jemore Corsi's Birth Cert book:Obama blinked. Now game begins'

295 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:57:32pm

Interesting - Tornado Watch for Western NY - that's a new one...
NOAA Map

296 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 12:59:58pm

Guys, I can't watch this at work, must wait till later, but it's making the rounds of twitter right now. A black man's response to this morning, and specifically the Trump statement.

[Link: www.baratunde.com...]

It was during my viewing of this video that I began to cry. I thought of my ancestors, both direct and collective, who had fought and died so that I might be treated as an American. I then thought of this fetid, smug, hate-filled, wealthy white man taking credit for the release and yet still not being satisfied.

297 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:00:58pm

My daughter suggests we should move to Canada. Being necessarily older than she, and very stubborn besides, I would prefer to stay in this country.

What is the most wingnut-free part of the USA? Suggestions?

298 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:01:25pm

re: #295 imp_62

Interesting - Tornado Watch for Western NY - that's a new one...
NOAA Map

No it's not... I've sat through tornado's in Northern New Jersey... early 70's. It does happen.

299 engineer cat  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:01:32pm

re: #231 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

First Obama puts the birthers on the defense, now Reid's going to put the Ryan bill up to a vote. Did the Dems grow a set while I wasn't watching?

i have some questions for anybody here who might care to defend the ryan plan:

as far as i know there have been no basic health insurance policies offered for senior citizens in this country for at least 40 years - only supplementary policies. senior citizens would seem to be very undesirable for insurance companies to cover

the ryan plan gives specific dollar amounts to supply to seniors to buy private insurance with. i see no indication that those who wrote and passed this plan have secured any guarantee from private health insurance companies that they will offer coverage at these rates at all, much less the same level of coverage as medicare. also, i don't any provisions in the plan that cover what would happen if an individual was unable to obtain coverage

300 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:01:46pm

re: #297 Shiplord Kirel

My daughter suggests we should move to Canada. Being necessarily older than she, and very stubborn besides, I would prefer to stay in this country.

What is the most wingnut-free part of the USA? Suggestions?

My house. All are welcome - bring booze.

301 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:02:14pm

re: #297 Shiplord Kirel

My daughter suggests we should move to Canada. Being necessarily older than she, and very stubborn besides, I would prefer to stay in this country.

What is the most wingnut-free part of the USA? Suggestions?

Canada has been slipping in the same direction as the U.S. over the last few years, anyway, so it probably wouldn't be the best option even if you were willing.

302 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:02:16pm

re: #295 imp_62

Interesting - Tornado Watch for Western NY - that's a new one...
NOAA Map

This is why it's imperative that we support the GOP when they forbid the NOAA from spending hard-earned tax dollars on climate research

303 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:02:28pm

re: #298 Walter L. Newton

No it's not... I've sat through tornado's in Northern New Jersey... early 70's. It does happen.

Hiya Walter. Also under a gale warning for tomorrow. Should get my shopping done before long, methinks.

304 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:02:40pm

Related Scots word of the day: stooshie.

Stooshie, whose spelling indicates its pronunciation, means an uproar, a commotion, a fuss, a row or a brawl.

It is often used in connection with protest. In this context it is often attached to the verb raise or the verb create. People can create a stooshie about anything that displeases them, from the major to the trivial.

Usage: I wonder what stooshie the wingnuts will raise next about the nirth certificate?

A Stooshie: Abraham Diepraam

305 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:03:01pm

re: #297 Shiplord Kirel

My daughter suggests we should move to Canada. Being necessarily older than she, and very stubborn besides, I would prefer to stay in this country.

What is the most wingnut-free part of the USA? Suggestions?

Come on out to Northern California. We have a moonbat infestation in parts, but relatively few wingnuts.

306 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:03:09pm

re: #302 publicityStunted

Exactly. Cause if they don't report it or predict it, it doesn't happen!

307 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:03:27pm

re: #297 Shiplord Kirel

My daughter suggests we should move to Canada. Being necessarily older than she, and very stubborn besides, I would prefer to stay in this country.

What is the most wingnut-free part of the USA? Suggestions?

Pacific Northwest, seriously... well west of the Sierras/Coast/Cascades anyways.

The San Fransico - Bellingham corridor. Get used to Seasonal Affective Disorder tho' >

308 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:03:41pm

re: #293 darthstar

I hope Reid gives him six voters so Obama CAN veto it. Imagine campaigning against a president who used his veto power to "save Medicare." Good night, opponents.

Yeah, what better to add to the "one-two punch" of the recent shellacking Repubs got from their constituents than to come back, get the bill voted on and passed in the Senate, and then vetoed the very next day. How exactly do you make those lemons into lemonade?

309 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:04:41pm

re: #303 imp_62

Hiya Walter. Also under a gale warning for tomorrow. Should get my shopping done before long, methinks.

Don't rush... otrnado happen fast... all over in minutes... you don't have to wait and sit it out... not much you can do if it comes your way... except take cover... I lived in tornado alley for 20 years... we just be careful and live normally.

310 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:04:50pm

re: #295 imp_62

There are tornado watches all along the front that stretches from the Buffalo area down through the South, into Georgia and Tennessee. Tornadoes this far north are uncommon, but they do happen from time to time. A couple hit in the NYC metro area last year - including a macroburst in Queens that turned thousands of street trees into kindling and parts of the borough impassable for days. It turned out that the bulk of damage was done not by the tornadoes but by the macroburst that packed 125 mph winds and hit a much wider area (1.5 miles x 5 miles long) than one usually associates with a tornado that can be anywhere from a few yards to hundred yards wide or more.

311 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:05:24pm

re: #297 Shiplord Kirel

My daughter suggests we should move to Canada. Being necessarily older than she, and very stubborn besides, I would prefer to stay in this country.

What is the most wingnut-free part of the USA? Suggestions?

Serious answer: Ithaca, NY. Run by centre lefties, good public transport, Cornell, Ithaca College, good food and recreation.

312 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:05:48pm

re: #310 lawhawk

How many 'God is purging the haven of sin!' comments did we get?

313 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:05:52pm

re: #299 engineer dog

i have some questions for anybody here who might care to defend the ryan plan:

as far as i know there have been no basic health insurance policies offered for senior citizens in this country for at least 40 years - only supplementary policies. senior citizens would seem to be very undesirable for insurance companies to cover

the ryan plan gives specific dollar amounts to supply to seniors to buy private insurance with. i see no indication that those who wrote and passed this plan have secured any guarantee from private health insurance companies that they will offer coverage at these rates at all, much less the same level of coverage as medicare. also, i don't any provisions in the plan that cover what would happen if an individual was unable to obtain coverage

That's because the GOP, in their rush to put something "on the table," didn't bother to flesh out the Ryan Plan as anything more than a bare bones proposal. The latest "proposal" I heard was that the Ryan Plan would lead to a Medicare Exchange, run by the government, where seniors could take their vouchers to find a plan that worked for them. Hmm, where have I heard this before...

314 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:05:55pm

re: #297 Shiplord Kirel

My daughter suggests we should move to Canada. Being necessarily older than she, and very stubborn besides, I would prefer to stay in this country.

What is the most wingnut-free part of the USA? Suggestions?

WindUpBird seems to be slightly biased toward Portland ;)

315 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:06:03pm

re: #310 lawhawk

There are tornado watches all along the front that stretches from the Buffalo area down through the South, into Georgia and Tennessee. Tornadoes this far north are uncommon, but they do happen from time to time. A couple hit in the NYC metro area last year - including a macroburst in Queens that turned thousands of street trees into kindling and parts of the borough impassable for days. It turned out that the bulk of damage was done not by the tornadoes but by the macroburst that packed 125 mph winds and hit a much wider area (1.5 miles x 5 miles long) than one usually associates with a tornado that can be anywhere from a few yards to hundred yards wide or more.

Thanks. Not making me feel any better, though.

316 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:06:53pm

re: #314 publicityStunted

WindUpBird seems to be slightly biased toward Portland ;)

Funny thing is he is and will always be a Seattlite. You can't wash the stink out of your soul ;)

317 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:06:55pm

Newt Gingrich: Creeping secularism replacing Christianity

Speaking at the National Catholic Prayer breakfast, Newt Gingrich on Wednesday warned Catholics that Europe’s “crisis of secularism” — spawning a “government-favored culture to replace Christianity” — has seized the United States.

“The American elites are guided by their desire to emulate the European elites and, as a result, anti-religious values and principles are coming to dominate the academic, news media and judicial class in America,” he said in Washington.

Gingrich lashed out against the “secular pressures” that have led scientific publications to replace Anno Domini (A.D.) with the Common Era (C.E.), banned school prayer and struck out “one nation under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance.

318 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:08:03pm

re: #317 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Newt Gingrich: Creeping secularism replacing Christianity

The Creeping Secularists probably provide better food after services. Or does that only motivate synagogue attendance?

319 engineer cat  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:08:41pm

re: #313 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

That's because the GOP, in their rush to put something "on the table," didn't bother to flesh out the Ryan Plan as anything more than a bare bones proposal. The latest "proposal" I heard was that the Ryan Plan would lead to a Medicare Exchange, run by the government, where seniors could take their vouchers to find a plan that worked for them. Hmm, where have I heard this before...

astonishing that this sketchy plan was actually passed by the house and proposed to be signed into law as is

320 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:08:52pm

re: #317 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Newt Gingrich: Creeping secularism replacing Christianity

Creeping Sharia to the left of me, Creeping Secularism to the right, here I am, stuck in the middle with you...

/

321 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:09:48pm

re: #313 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

That's because the GOP, in their rush to put something "on the table," didn't bother to flesh out the Ryan Plan as anything more than a bare bones proposal. The latest "proposal" I heard was that the Ryan Plan would lead to a Medicare Exchange, run by the government, where seniors could take their vouchers to find a plan that worked for them. Hmm, where have I heard this before...

You haven't heard it before... Quick! Look! OVER THERE! A NIRTH CERTIFICATE!!!

322 brennant  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:10:34pm

re: #320 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Creeping Sharia to the left of me, Creeping Secularism to the right, here I am, stuck in the middle with you...

/

Creeping Secularism? Creeping Death!

YouTube

323 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:11:43pm

re: #322 brennant

Metallica-upding.

324 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:12:13pm

re: #312 windsagio

Considering that there are more tornadoes in the Bible Belt than the NYC metro area, making those kind of comments could be hypocritical.

The Dixie Alley gets more long lasting tornadoes than the Tornado Alley, which sees more funnels than other parts of the country (or the world for that matter).

Tornado outbreaks like the ones we've been seeing are the result of highly unstable airmasses colliding from different directions and different levels within the atmosphere causing wind shears and cyclonic activity. It just happens that this happens more in the early spring over the Southeast (places like GA, TN, AR) before shifting into the traditional Tornado Alley in the Midwest/Plains States.

325 Summer Seale  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:13:14pm

This comment is posted on the Harpy's latest thread, and only has to include Elvis and JFK to be complete:

Dean M. said...
Pamela--something to check on: Ian Johnson's book, A MOSQUE IN MUNICH. The CIA cultivated the Muslim Brotherhood during the Cold War. The Agency took over where the Nazis left off in using Muslims against the Soviets. Obama worked for BIC (Business International Corporation) used as a front for CIA operatives. His real birth certificate is classified as are all his personal documents. This fake one just released is justified on the basis of protecting national security. "Obama" is an identity created by the CIA for Barry Soetoro. He continues to use this identity for the wedge and advantage it gives him. Also, it conceals his true paternity and strong Muslim connection. You came close to showing this in your previous article suggesting Macolm Little (Malik Shabazz), also known as Malcolm X, was the true biological father of Obama/Soetoro. A very complex situation that may be about to explode. . .

326 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:13:31pm

re: #319 engineer dog

astonishing that this sketchy plan was actually passed by the house and proposed to be signed into law as is

What's truly astonishing about it is that the Ryan Plan, in one form or another, has been put forward at least twice before. The first, it didn't even make it out of committee. The second time, it died a silent death when members of his own party voted it down. Now, suddenly it's the best thing the GOP has ever proposed, the "only" proposal out there, or conversely the "only" proposal that will "work."

327 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:14:01pm

re: #324 lawhawk

That's substantially less fun and emotionally satisfying :(

PS: If you have a PS3, Lawsuit!

328 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:15:09pm

re: #325 Summer

This comment is posted on the Harpy's latest thread, and only has to include Elvis and JFK to be complete:

Another reader suggests literacy tests to prevent Obama supporters from voting.

329 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:15:15pm

Why does the GOP have such a problem reading the document they profess to love so much?

"no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States."

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

330 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:15:22pm

re: #325 Summer

This comment is posted on the Harpy's latest thread, and only has to include Elvis and JFK to be complete:

Really? The whole Wingnut constellation is akin to a self-gratifying daisy chain.

331 BishopX  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:15:58pm

re: #297 Shiplord Kirel

I would suggest Massachuesetts, probably the only state in the union where people dressed up in colonial gear are more likely to be reenactors than tea party fools. We also have a democratic super-majority in both the house and senate, and have only sent 1 republican to Washington in the past twenty five years.

332 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:16:24pm

re: #328 Killgore Trout

Another reader suggests literacy tests to prevent Obama supporters from voting.

A history exam would prevent the GOP from voting.

333 makeitstop  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:16:38pm

That Baratrunde video is worth a look. Trump should hope he someday has a fraction of that man's dignity.

334 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:17:19pm

re: #328 Killgore Trout

Another reader suggests literacy tests to prevent Obama supporters from voting.

Are they just not bothering to hide it anymore, or are they actually so stupid not to know what they're saying?

335 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:17:24pm

re: #311 imp_62

Serious answer: Ithaca, NY. Run by centre lefties, good public transport, Cornell, Ithaca College, good food and recreation.

Very familiar with it. It might be a good choice, seriously, not least because I am a Cornell alumnus.

336 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:18:30pm

re: #332 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

A history exam would prevent the GOP from voting.

Hell, a civics exam would work.

"What qualifications does a presidential candidate have to meet?"
"He has to be a Real American!"

337 Summer Seale  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:19:11pm

re: #329 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Why does the GOP have such a problem reading the document they profess to love so much?

"no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States."

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Because they claim that Islam is not a religion but a political ideology.

Most here know that I am an anti-theist to the core and I agree with Sam Harris about criticism of Islam as well as other religions based on their particular claims and effects, however I wouldn't go so far (and neither would Harris) as to say that Islam is not a religion or that Muslims are not citizens, etc.....

That's just plain nuts and offensive. No sane atheist is saying it, only the right wing nutjobs are saying that.

338 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:19:25pm

re: #336 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Hell, a civics exam would work.

"What qualifications does a presidential candidate have to meet?"
"He has to be a Real American!"

What caused the Civil War?

Anyone who answers States Rights fails.

339 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:19:27pm

re: #331 BishopX

I would suggest Massachuesetts, probably the only state in the union where people dressed up in colonial gear are more likely to be reenactors than tea party fools. We also have a democratic super-majority in both the house and senate, and have only sent 1 republican to Washington in the past twenty five years.

Well, the Berkshires or Five College area or the PRoC and environs, sure. Other places can get a bitch sketchy, though.

340 Renaissance_Man  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:20:16pm

re: #338 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

What caused the Civil War?

Easy, Northern aggression.

341 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:20:39pm

This is why I think AllahPundit is quietly mocking his readers....
“Atlas Shrugged” producer on slow start: I don’t know if we’ll make parts two and three now
by Allahpundit

The obvious Plan B here would be to reach out to prominent libertarians, starting with the Paul family, natch, and do whatever the producers are legally able to do to get them to help promote it. Rand Paul’s already regaling Senate committee hearings with paeans to his favorite Rand books; maybe it’s as simple as sending him a copy of the film (assuming he hasn’t seen it yet) and asking him to put out the word among the Paul army if he likes it. Say what you will about them, but devoted libertarians aren’t stingy when it comes to donating to causes they believe in. Or, if the Pauls are unavailable, the producers could wait a few months and then try to hire Gary Johnson to promote it. He should have plenty of free time by then.


He's calling for government intervention to promote the movie which failed in the free market.

342 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:20:53pm

re: #328 Killgore Trout

Another reader suggests literacy tests to prevent Obama supporters from voting.

Because if there's one quality at which wingnuts excel, it's literacy.

343 BishopX  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:20:55pm

re: #339 Simply Sarah

I'd add JP to that list as well.

344 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:21:04pm

re: #328 Killgore Trout

Another reader suggests literacy tests to prevent Obama supporters from voting.

Nope, nothing historically racist about that at all.

345 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:21:09pm

re: #334 SanFranciscoZionist

Are they just not bothering to hide it anymore, or are they actually so stupid not to know what they're saying?

It's hard to tell.

346 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:21:17pm

re: #336 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Cue the Hulkster....

347 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:21:45pm

re: #338 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

What caused the Civil War?

Communist aggression, atheism, and the theory of evolution.

348 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:22:22pm

re: #334 SanFranciscoZionist

Are they just not bothering to hide it anymore, or are they actually so stupid not to know what they're saying?

This is a trick question, right teacher? They're not mutually exclusive. ;)

350 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:23:23pm
It was during my viewing of this video that I began to cry. I thought of my ancestors, both direct and collective, who had fought and died so that I might be treated as an American. I then thought of this fetid, smug, hate-filled, wealthy white man taking credit for the release and yet still not being satisfied. It does not matter how long we've been in these United States. We will never be American.


From the Baratunde post. Very moving. Also applicable to being Jewish, or Muslim - without making this about "me".

351 Ericus58  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:24:07pm

re: #317 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Newt Gingrich: Creeping secularism replacing Christianity

Damn Newt.
Damn Theocrats.

Last time I checked, this wasn't China or other countries that round up their Christian-worshiping citizens...
I respect the rights of ALL peaceful citizens to practice and observe their beliefs.
Just DON'T expect me to have to also live under them and allow them to become the law of the land.

352 Simply Sarah  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:24:26pm

re: #343 BishopX

I'd add JP to that list as well.

JP works, too. The whole Greater Boston area is patchworked, really.

353 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:25:09pm

re: #352 Simply Sarah

Except you have to live on the East Coast then >>

354 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:25:58pm

re: #347 Shiplord Kirel

Communist aggression, atheism, and the theory of evolution.

Don't forget!

The gay agenda.

/

355 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:26:24pm

"It's a trap!"
Reid will hold Senate vote on Ryan budget

"Republicans seem to be in love with the Ryan budget. And so they are going to have an opportunity here in the Senate to vote on the Ryan budget and see [how many] Republican senators like the Ryan budget as much as their House colleagues did," he said.

356 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:26:36pm

re: #351 Ericus58

Damn Newt.
Damn Theocrats.

Last time I checked, this wasn't China or other countries that round up their Christian-worshiping citizens...
I respect the rights of ALL peaceful citizens to practice and observe their beliefs.
Just DON'T expect me to have to also live under them and allow them to become the law of the land.

Any opposition to the Christian agenda is persecution.

357 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:27:34pm

That video on the Baratunde blog needs to be made to go viral.
Your text to link...

358 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:28:55pm

Ha!

@thinkprogress ThinkProgress
How can @DRUDGE peddle birtherism, Alex Jones conspiracy theories and still maintain credibility with the media?

360 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:30:57pm

re: #359 darthstar

25 Abandoned Soviet monuments that look like they're from the future...

The first one looks like what would happen if a giant steel anus swallowed a Stargate.

361 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:31:26pm

re: #356 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Any opposition to the Christian agenda is persecution.

What Christian agenda?

/

362 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:32:03pm

re: #360 imp_62

The first one looks like what would happen if a giant steel anus swallowed a Stargate.

O...kay...

/backs away making no sudden movements

363 reine.de.tout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:32:08pm

re: #325 Summer

This comment is posted on the Harpy's latest thread, and only has to include Elvis and JFK to be complete:

gawd.

See, what I said earlier is true - "the press" doesn't have to make these "curious" people seem crazy, they're doing fine all on their own.
sheesh.

364 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:32:40pm

went and read the 2 positive 'atlas' reviews on RT.

"Atlas Shrugged," a mega-fable that is to capitalists roughly what "To Kill a Mockingbird" is to liberals,

If I were a capitalist I would be so mad right now.

365 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:32:50pm

re: #360 imp_62

The first one looks like what would happen if a giant steel anus swallowed a Stargate.

What weird shit goes on in your mind you could think of something like that?

366 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:33:04pm

re: #362 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

O...kay...

/backs away making no sudden movements

Yeah, you should back away slowly. The giant steel anus is coming for you, next.

367 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:33:24pm

re: #365 b_sharp

What weird shit goes on in your mind you could think of something like that?

You could not BEGIN to imagine.

368 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:33:36pm

re: #359 darthstar

I'm pretty sure I've seen this one on an album cover.

369 AK-47%  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:33:48pm

re: #356 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Any opposition to the Christian agenda is persecution.

We still propagate the myth that the Pilgrims came here to find religious freedom. They came here to be able to practice their oppressive brand of theocracy without anyone to disturb them over it.

They are still with us.

370 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:34:30pm

re: #366 imp_62

Yeah, you should back away slowly. The giant steel anus is coming for you, next.

Giant Steel Anus sounds like a college punk band.

371 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:34:57pm

re: #368 Conservative Moonbat

[Link: www.tineye.com...]

372 AntonSirius  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:35:05pm

re: #333 makeitstop

That Baratrunde video is worth a look. Trump should hope he someday has a fraction of that man's dignity.

I can't wait for Breitbart's 'expose' on Baratrunde.

And by "can't wait" I mean "clenching my teeth and fists in apoplectic rage at the mere thought."

373 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:35:30pm

re: #369 ralphieboy

We still propagate the myth that the Pilgrims came here to find religious freedom. They came here to be able to practice their oppressive brand of theocracy without anyone to disturb them over it.

They are still with us.

Isn't that the very definition of religious freedom?

Religion free from all controls.

374 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:35:35pm

re: #364 windsagio

went and read the 2 positive 'atlas' reviews on RT.

If I were a capitalist I would be so mad right now.

Several commenters were upset by that--they didn't like being told that To Kill A Mockingbird belonged to liberals.

375 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:35:51pm

re: #369 ralphieboy

Those two statements are not mutually exclusive.

376 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:36:13pm

re: #370 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Giant Steel Anus sounds like a college punk band.

What do they sound like?

377 brennant  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:36:32pm

re: #376 b_sharp

What do they sound like?

Shitty.

378 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:36:35pm

re: #370 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Giant Steel Anus sounds like a college punk band.

Presenting! Giant Anuses of Steel!

G.A.S.

//

379 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:36:37pm

re: #359 darthstar

The second one looks like something Gehry would have done (or cribbed) depending on which came first.

380 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:36:50pm

re: #376 b_sharp

What do they sound like?

Like shit.

381 AntonSirius  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:37:30pm

re: #344 iceweasel

Nope, nothing historically racist about that at all.


Why, that's no more historically racist than a doctored photo suggesting Obama and his parents are chimpanzees!

382 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:37:52pm

re: #379 lawhawk

The second one looks like something Gehry would have done (or cribbed) depending on which came first.

Oh, sure. You would intellectualize the conversation.

383 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:38:10pm

re: #357 imp_62

That video on the Baratunde blog needs to be made to go viral.
Your text to link...

I can understand the feeling but Obama is using this to his advantage.

384 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:38:41pm

re: #380 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Like shit.

You're just being a poopy head.

385 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:38:41pm

re: #381 AntonSirius

Why, that's no more historically racist than a doctored photo suggesting Obama and his parents are chimpanzees!

THEY called Bush Chimpy, so how is it racist?

386 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:38:46pm

re: #383 Killgore Trout

I can understand the feeling but Obama is using this to his advantage.

QFE.

387 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:39:04pm

re: #358 Gus 802

Ha!

@thinkprogress ThinkProgress
How can @DRUDGE peddle birtherism, Alex Jones conspiracy theories and still maintain credibility with the media?

It's very nice to see that getting attention.

388 AK-47%  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:39:10pm

re: #375 imp_62

Those two statements are not mutually exclusive.


Is Sharia in keeping with our notion of "religious freedom"?

Theirs was a Christian Shariah.

389 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:39:27pm

Next on World Net Daily...

"Hawaii state ratification papers forged... not really part of the United States of America."

390 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:39:41pm

re: #382 imp_62

Oh, sure. You would intellectualize the conversation.

Bummer!.

391 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:39:42pm

re: #383 Killgore Trout

I can understand the feeling but Obama is using this to his advantage.

Naught to do with Obama. This is the pus squeezed from the open wound of racism. Baratunde comments on Trump and his ilk, not really on BHO.

392 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:39:44pm

re: #387 Killgore Trout

It's very nice to see that getting attention.

Especially if you also consider the Drudge/Andrew Breitbart connection.

393 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:40:31pm

re: #389 Walter L. Newton

Next on World Net Daily...

"Hawaii state ratification papers forged... not really part of the United States of America."

"They're not even attached."

394 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:41:15pm

re: #389 Walter L. Newton

Isn't that Iowa?

The one the income tax people always rant about.

395 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:41:16pm

re: #393 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"They're not even attached."

Everyone knows Alaska is the real Amurcan Heartland./

396 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:41:35pm

re: #388 ralphieboy

Is Sharia in keeping with our notion of "religious freedom"?

Theirs was a Christian Shariah.

Shari'a is a legal and judicial framework, not a religious practice or belief. The Puritans would be free to believe as they wish, today, but not free to impose their fundamentalist Christian judicial concepts on society.

397 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:42:42pm

re: #396 imp_62

Shari'a is a legal and judicial framework, not a religious practice or belief. The Puritans would be free to believe as they wish, today, but not free to impose their fundamentalist Christian judicial concepts on society.

Why would they? It's already done. Cf Roy Moore, antiabortion legislation and more!

398 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:43:04pm

re: #382 imp_62

Heh...

399 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:43:22pm

re: #396 imp_62

Shari'a is a legal and judicial framework, not a religious practice or belief. The Puritans would be free to believe as they wish, today, but not free to impose their fundamentalist Christian judicial concepts on society.

"BUT SHE'S A WITCH!"
/

400 AK-47%  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:43:33pm

re: #396 imp_62

Shari'a is a legal and judicial framework, not a religious practice or belief. The Puritans would be free to believe as they wish, today, but not free to impose their fundamentalist Christian judicial concepts on society.

The original settlers had their own Christian Sharia in the colonies: they fined people for failure to attend services or for behavior that the church elders found unfitting. That is the "religious freedom" they came to AMerica to be able to practive: Europe was not about to put up with such a bunch of fanatics.

401 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:43:41pm

re: #398 lawhawk

;]

402 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:43:44pm

re: #399 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"BUT SHE'S A WITCH!"
/

She turned me into a Newt!

/

403 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:44:31pm

re: #399 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

re: #402 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Autoupdings for all who are so wise in the ways of science.

404 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:44:49pm

re: #402 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

She turned me into a Newt!

/

So you feel the raging need to shag when you watch CSPAN now?

405 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:44:51pm

re: #395 iceweasel

Everyone knows Alaska is the real Amurcan Heartland./

The real Murica!

No wait...

406 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:45:47pm

re: #404 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

So you feel the raging need to shag when you watch CSPAN now?

Yup, as well as get a divorce at the first sign of illness. Hey may, that whole "in sickness and in health" biz wasn't in writing!

//

407 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:46:15pm

re: #397 iceweasel

Why would they? It's already done. Cf Roy Moore, antiabortion legislation and more!

Umm... theoretically speaking. But in all seriousness, laws like those can be undone subsequently or found unconstitutional. In a Puritan or Shari'a world, the dictat would be religious in nature from a central authority with no First Amendment protections.

408 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:46:51pm

re: #405 Gus 802

The real Murica!

No wait...

Yeah, some of Virginia there is not the REAL Virginia!

409 shutdown  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:47:37pm

OK, it' daddy taxi time. Picking up kids after practice. BBL

410 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:47:38pm

re: #408 iceweasel

Yeah, some of Virginia there is not the REAL Virginia!

Oh brudder.

411 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:47:55pm

re: #406 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yup, as well as get a divorce at the first sign of illness. Hey may, that whole "in sickness and in health" biz wasn't in writing!

//

"Honey, could you pass the sudafed?"
"Should I call the lawyer?"

412 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:48:18pm

re: #410 Gus 802

Oh brudder.

One of my fave moments of the last election cycle, that was.

413 Mark Winter  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:49:34pm

Oh come on that certificate is clearly a fake.
Where's the signature of the baby?

414 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:49:44pm

re: #412 iceweasel

One of my fave moments of the last election cycle, that was.

Let's go to the video tape!

415 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:50:44pm

re: #414 Gus 802

Let's go to the video tape!

[Video]

I can always count on you to do the research and find the goods. ;-)

416 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:51:01pm

"Real Virginia. Where they ain't got no Synagogues."

//The Real wingnut.

//

417 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:51:43pm

That could be fun. Sayings by "real wingnuts."

//

418 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:52:04pm

re: #414 Gus 802

damn, youtube comments disabled. That would have been Godlike.

420 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:52:15pm

"Did Mel Gibson say that?"

"No, that was some wingnut at a Tea Klux Klan rally."

//

421 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:52:22pm

re: #417 Gus 802

That could be fun. Sayings by "real wingnuts."

//

ROn PaUL!

422 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:53:13pm

OK. In fairness it probably shoult be the Tea Klutz Klan.

//

423 The Left  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:53:59pm

re: #422 Gus 802

OK. In fairness it probably shoult be the Tea Klutz Klan.

//

Ahahahahaha== love it.

Dinner! Back later, probably.

424 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:55:39pm

Not everyone on the right swallowed the Birther kool-aid. Fred Pruitt's Rantburg site will BAN posters for birther advocacy for example.

Rantburg editorial policy is that we don't permit or put up with the Birther nonsense. I'm letting this one go because, after all, it provides a link to the president's long-form BC.

But keep in mind that we will NOT tolerate birther advocacy. Posts and and comments that do that WILL be deleted.

425 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:57:46pm

re: #419 Killgore Trout

After Fox News Promotes Birtherism, Fox's Smith Tells Media To "Just Freaking Stop It"
Heh.

Interesting clip. Juan Williams acknowledges the racial aspect to birtherism and blames Tea Party leaders and Republicans for allowing crazy conspiracies. They are starting to get close to the truth about what has happened but they still aren't ready to see it yet.

426 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 1:59:03pm
Yeah, my blood's so mad feels like coagulatin'
I'm sitting here just contemplatin'
I can't twist the truth, it knows no regulation.
Handful of senators don't pass legislation
And marches alone can't bring integration
When human respect is disintegratin'
This whole crazy world is just too frustratin'

And you tell me
Over and over and over again, my friend
Ah, you don't believe
We're on the eve
of destruction.

427 Achilles Tang  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:00:32pm

re: #159 albusteve

only in the spirit of her monumental IQ

I'm just back; but wasn't that 167?

428 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:01:19pm
429 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:03:58pm

re: #428 b_sharp

Man do you feel like this every day lately? It's kind of depressing >>

430 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:05:11pm

re: #429 windsagio

Man do you feel like this every day lately? It's kind of depressing >>

Pretty much.

431 brennant  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:05:22pm

re: #413 Mark Winter

Oh come on that certificate is clearly a fake.
Where's the signature of the baby?

[golf clap]Well done![/golf clap]

432 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:05:40pm

Leon Panetta doesn't have any military service experience in his background!!11ty

//Wingnut

Por ejemplo:

‎ TXCupCake‎ RT @ag_conservative: or how about the fact that he is moving an Army general to run the CIA and making someone with 0 military experience Defense Secretary ...

Oops. He served two years just like Gates. Cheney of course had zero, count 'em, zero years of service.

/

433 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:05:50pm

Dorks.

434 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:09:34pm

Let's put it up on the screen...

Leon Panetta:

In 1956, he entered Santa Clara University, and in 1960 he graduated magna cum laude with a Bachelor of Arts in Political Science. He also received a Juris Doctor in 1963 from the Santa Clara University School of Law, and soon after began practicing law. In 1964, he joined the United States Army as a Second Lieutenant. There he received the Army Commendation Medal, and was discharged in 1966 as a First Lieutenant.

Robert Gates:

While at Indiana University, Gates was recruited by the Central Intelligence Agency and joined the agency in 1966. On January 4, 1967, he was commissioned as a second lieutenant in the United States Air Force. From 1967 to 1969, he was assigned to the Strategic Air Command as an intelligence officer which included a stint at Whiteman Air Force Base in Missouri, where he delivered intelligence briefings to Intercontinental Ballistic Missile crews. After fulfilling his military obligation, he rejoined the CIA.

Dick Cheney:

[This space left intentionally blank.]

435 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:09:52pm

re: #432 Gus 802

Don't cloud the issue with facts!

436 researchok  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:10:01pm

re: #432 Gus 802

Leon Panetta doesn't have any military service experience in his background!!11ty

//Wingnut

Por ejemplo:

Oops. He served two years just like Gates. Cheney of course had zero, count 'em, zero years of service.

/

Reagan made movies for the military during the war.

Front line duty.

FDR had no military service either and it showed.

All he did was save Europe.

437 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:10:41pm

re: #435 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Don't cloud the issue with facts!

Googling is teh hard!

UTC

/

438 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:12:28pm

re: #436 researchok

Reagan made movies for the military during the war.

Front line duty.

FDR had no military service either and it showed.

All he did was save Europe.

Yep. What with FDR choosing people like Marshall and effectively Eisenhower who kept things together in the ETO.

//

439 Obdicut  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:13:34pm

re: #424 Shiplord Kirel

Not everyone on the right swallowed the Birther kool-aid. Fred Pruitt's Rantburg site will BAN posters for birther advocacy for example.

He may say that, but opening it up I saw five birther comments on one page.

Maybe they just haven't been deleted yet.

440 Killgore Trout  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:16:30pm

re: #439 Obdicut

He may say that, but opening it up I saw five birther comments on one page.

Maybe they just haven't been deleted yet.

Looks like the Birthers are still ranting. I think Free Republic tried to bad the birthers once. It didn't work. AP and Ed Morrisey aren't even attempting to educate the birthers over at hot air.

441 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:16:50pm

Out of Left Field: Massachusetts House Votes to End Collective Bargaining for Public Workers

In a surprise move yesterday, House lawmakers in Massachusetts voted overwhelmingly to strip public workers of their collective bargaining rights over healthcare decisions. The move would strip police officers, teachers, and other municipal workers of their bargaining rights over changes made to healthcare benefits, including premiums, co-payments and other benefits.

The really surprising thing is that Massachusetts is a deep-blue state, and the House is controlled by Democrats. Far from the Tea Party governments of Wisconsin and elsewhere, Massachusetts has one of the most progressive healthcare systems in the country, thanks to former governor Mitt Romney.

Even so, the House voted 11-to-42 to strip healthcare bargaining from public workers. The move was spearheaded by Democratic House Speaker Robert A DeLeo who claimed it would save cities and the state millions of dollars.

442 Kragar  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:18:49pm

re: #440 Killgore Trout

Looks like the Birthers are still ranting. I think Free Republic tried to bad the birthers once. It didn't work. AP and Ed Morrisey aren't even attempting to educate the birthers over at hot air.

No evidence provided will dissuade the Birthers. They'll simply ignore it or reframe the question.

443 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:19:53pm

re: #441 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Out of Left Field: Massachusetts House Votes to End Collective Bargaining for Public Workers

Somebody who simply votes on their own wage level has moved to restrict others from negotiating their wages.

Irony is thick today.

444 AK-47%  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:20:28pm

re: #442 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)


They are already moving on and will focus now on his educational background. Remember how he managed to get out of military service by joining the Air National Guard and then never even showed up for duty?

445 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:20:33pm

re: #442 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

No evidence provided will dissuade the Birthers. They'll simply ignore it or reframe the question.

Why? It worked with 9/11 truthers and moon hoaxers.

//

446 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:20:43pm

re: #443 b_sharp

in fairness,

...collective bargaining rights over healthcare decisions.

It's still a bad scene, but not quite the same thing... in fact not remotely the same thing.

447 Obdicut  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:22:45pm

re: #443 b_sharp

Somebody who simply votes on their own wage level has moved to restrict others from negotiating their wages.

Irony is thick today.

Nah, it's 'just' for negotiations on health care plans. It's not nearly as bad.

But it's still crappy, and still very stupidly-timed.

A good reminder that the Democrats are not, no matter what the GOP would like to say, progressives.

448 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:24:05pm

You know, I'm pretty damn pro-union (we need one at my job so bad), but I've also always been really glad that I don't live on the East Coast or the midwest partially due to the big cities insoluable union problems.

449 Achilles Tang  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:25:31pm

re: #447 Obdicut

Nah, it's 'just' for negotiations on health care plans. It's not nearly as bad.

But it's still crappy, and still very stupidly-timed.

A good reminder that the Democrats are not, no matter what the GOP would like to say, progressives.

As I read it, if they don't agree to something within 30 days conditions can be imposed unilaterally.

That is as good as denying all negotiation, since all one has to do is stall for 30 days.

450 BishopX  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:25:35pm

re: #441 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Out of Left Field: Massachusetts House Votes to End Collective Bargaining for Public Workers

There are a lot of people who are really pissed at him right now. The senate president and governor have both come out against it.

451 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:26:29pm

re: #440 Killgore Trout

Looks like the Birthers are still ranting. I think Free Republic tried to bad the birthers once. It didn't work. AP and Ed Morrisey aren't even attempting to educate the birthers over at hot air.


We spend too much on education!!1!

452 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:27:57pm

All edumication does is produce no-nothing elitists like scientists and Psychologists.

453 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:28:06pm

Drudge linking to Infowars BS today. Some crap about "Miss America Sexually Molested by TSA." How does one get "sexually molested" by a whole government department?

454 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:28:29pm

I just realized I've been listening to Hawaiian music all day. I must be celebrating the Certifikit.

455 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:28:42pm

re: #453 Gus 802

Drudge linking to Infowars BS today. Some crap about "Miss America Sexually Molested by TSA." How does one get "sexually molested" by a whole government department?

Incrementally?

456 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:29:01pm

re: #434 Gus 802

You missed the important part where Gates worked for 26 years in the CIA before being tagged as def. secretary. I asked earlier why Panetta was moving to the defense department, an area where he has zero expertise. It may work out but you touting his 2 years experience as a low level officer 40 years ago isn't making the case. It's the presidents decision to make, I'd like to hear why he chose Panetta and not someone more familiar with the work.

457 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:30:13pm

This had multiple retweets on it, so I just stripped 'em all off:

A birther and a truther walk into a bar. The bartender says, "Get out of here you annoying assholes".
458 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:33:00pm

re: #456 RogueOne

You missed the important part where Gates worked for 26 years in the CIA before being tagged as def. secretary. I asked earlier why Panetta was moving to the defense department, an area where he has zero expertise. It may work out but you touting his 2 years experience as a low level officer 40 years ago isn't making the case. It's the presidents decision to make, I'd like to hear why he chose Panetta and not someone more familiar with the work.

Leon Panetta has been with the CIA for two years. Far more than Cheney who was only a congressman before being nominated as SecDef. John Tower who was selected but rejected by the Senate was largely a Senator and having been only a Seaman during WWII. Nope. I don't see a problem here.

459 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:33:14pm

re: #457 wrenchwench

This had multiple retweets on it, so I just stripped 'em all off:

Well don't stop there, you're still wearing clothes.

460 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:33:39pm

re: #453 Gus 802

Drudge linking to Infowars BS today. Some crap about "Miss America Sexually Molested by TSA." How does one get "sexually molested" by a whole government department?

"In a row?"

461 Obdicut  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:33:44pm

re: #456 RogueOne

If you like Gates, and think he was well-experienced for the job, then you should like Panetta, given that Gates wanted him to succeed him.


Defense Secretary Gates Pushed for Panetta to Be His Successor

That should alleviate your concern. Unless, of course, you don't think Gates is qualified to say who would make a good Secretary of Defense.

462 BishopX  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:34:24pm

re: #456 RogueOne

My guess is that he's backing Panetta becuase he's trying to transition all three of our current conflicts into situations where the US can pull troops out (or never send them in the first place in Libya) and continue to maintain control of the battle space though local contacts and drone strikes.

The CIA has been a terrifically strong force behind the adoption of UAV air power, and Obama is hoping that Panetta can keep the DOD in line during the transition.

463 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:36:10pm

re: #459 b_sharp

Well don't stop there, you're still wearing clothes.

I took my sweatshirt off.

464 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:37:00pm

re: #461 Obdicut

If you like Gates, and think he was well-experienced for the job, then you should like Panetta, given that Gates wanted him to succeed him.

Defense Secretary Gates Pushed for Panetta to Be His Successor

That should alleviate your concern. Unless, of course, you don't think Gates is qualified to say who would make a good Secretary of Defense.

And here's Saint Cheney's fabulous experience prior to becoming SecDef:

Cheney's political career began in 1969, as an intern for Congressman William A. Steiger during the Richard Nixon Administration. He then joined the staff of Donald Rumsfeld, who was then Director of the Office of Economic Opportunity from 1969–70. He held several positions in the years that followed: White House Staff Assistant in 1971, Assistant Director of the Cost of Living Council from 1971–73, and Deputy Assistant to the president from 1974–1975. As deputy assistant, Cheney suggested several options in a memo to Rumsfeld, including use of the US Justice Department, that the Ford administration could use to limit damage from an article, published by The New York Times, in which investigative reporter Seymour Hersh reported that Navy submarines had tapped into Soviet undersea communications as part of a highly classified program.

465 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:38:04pm

Leon Panetta - Democrat - Bad
Dick Cheney - Republican - Good

Mongo not like Panetta.

//

466 b_sharp  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:39:16pm

I seem to have lost some sleep. I have to go get the wifey so if it shows up here before I get back, could someone just shoe shew send it home?

467 brookly red  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:39:25pm

re: #462 BishopX

My guess is that he's backing Panetta becuase he's trying to transition all three of our current conflicts into situations where the US can pull troops out (or never send them in the first place in Libya) and continue to maintain control of the battle space though local contacts and drone strikes.

The CIA has been a terrifically strong force behind the adoption of UAV air power, and Obama is hoping that Panetta can keep the DOD in line during the transition.

interesting...

468 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:39:36pm

re: #458 Gus 802

Leon Panetta has been with the CIA for two years. Far more than Cheney who was only a congressman before being nominated as SecDef. John Tower who was selected but rejected by the Senate was largely a Senator and having been only a Seaman during WWII. Nope. I don't see a problem here.

I don't necessarily have a problem either but I would like to hear the presidents reasoning beyond a soundbite. According to Politico the problem seems to be there aren't a whole lot of defense minded dems. I can think of at least 2 off the top of my head with Jim Webb being the best option.

469 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:40:00pm

re: #466 b_sharp

I seem to have lost some sleep. I have to go get the wifey so if it shows up here before I get back, could someone just shoe shew send it home?

If I find it, I'm keeping it. I'm quite a bit short myself.

470 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:40:33pm

AdamSerwer AdamSerwer

Not a joke...they found the widow of the doctor who delivered the president [Link: ampro.me...] #wherestheplacenta

471 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:41:24pm

re: #468 RogueOne

I don't necessarily have a problem either but I would like to hear the presidents reasoning beyond a soundbite. According to Politico the problem seems to be there aren't a whole lot of defense minded dems. I can think of at least 2 off the top of my head with Jim Webb being the best option.

What's a defense mind Dem? I already showed that Cheney was largely "defense minded" when he was watching John Wayne war movies.

472 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:43:04pm

re: #470 Stanley Sea

AdamSerwer AdamSerwer

Not a joke...they found the widow of the doctor who delivered the president [Link: ampro.me...] #wherestheplacenta

From there:

"She continues, 'I know my husband is just looking down on us smiling. We had no idea that he delivered President Obama until this morning when we saw the birth certificate ... It is very exciting. I just can't believe it. We had no way of knowing. Everyone is calling us and I'm looking forward to calling all of the family back and informing them that it is true.'"

See!!1! Even she can't believe it!!!1!

473 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:45:50pm

re: #462 BishopX

My guess is that he's backing Panetta becuase he's trying to transition all three of our current conflicts into situations where the US can pull troops out (or never send them in the first place in Libya) and continue to maintain control of the battle space though local contacts and drone strikes.

The CIA has been a terrifically strong force behind the adoption of UAV air power, and Obama is hoping that Panetta can keep the DOD in line during the transition.

I think he was sent there to do what he does best, crunch numbers. They're looking for ways to cut their budget and in that Panetta would be a big help.

474 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:47:52pm

Speaking of which...

Condoleezza Rice on Donald Rumsfeld: Wrong, 'grumpy'

After months of silence, former Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice finally has her review ready of the charges in former Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld’s memoir that she was never critical of George W. Bush’s positions and was ill-equipped for a senior administration role: “He doesn’t know what he’s talking about.”

...

“I don’t think he was ever in the room with the president and me when I would follow the president from a national security meeting and tell him precisely what was going on in that room,” Rice told the Times. “We tended to do it privately.”

...

Boom!

475 McSpiff  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:48:37pm

re: #471 Gus 802

What's a defense mind Dem? I already showed that Cheney was largely "defense minded" when he was watching John Wayne war movies.

Was Cheney a particularly successful SecDef or something?

476 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:48:53pm

re: #474 Gus 802

There's a subtext there, lol...

I feel like an ass for even thinking of it >>

477 tnguitarist  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:50:20pm

re: #471 Gus 802

What's a defense mind Dem? I already showed that Cheney was largely "defense minded" when he was watching John Wayne war movies.

A defense-minded "anything" is someone who will spend a bottomless pit of money on the military.

478 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:50:31pm

re: #471 Gus 802

What's a defense mind Dem? I already showed that Cheney was largely "defense minded" when he was watching John Wayne war movies.

Why do you keep talking about cheney and 1991? Does that have anything to do with what's going on right now? Do you want to go into the military backgrounds of the president in '91 and today and how that factors in to their decision making? I hope not because I don't.

The question is why does the president want panetta as def. secretary. He's going to get him through, I don't even think that's a question, the question is why him and not someone else with a little experience when we're in the middle of 2 1/2 wars and a very real possibility of more? I don't think that's a crazy question to ask.

479 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:50:40pm

re: #475 McSpiff

Was Cheney a particularly successful SecDef or something?

Yep. He was SecDef during Operation Desert Storm!

480 McSpiff  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:51:48pm

re: #479 Gus 802

Yep. He was SecDef during Operation Desert Storm!

TIL (Today I learned..)

481 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:52:14pm

re: #478 RogueOne

Why do you keep talking about cheney and 1991? Does that have anything to do with what's going on right now? Do you want to go into the military backgrounds of the president in '91 and today and how that factors in to their decision making? I hope not because I don't.

The question is why does the president want panetta as def. secretary. He's going to get him through, I don't even think that's a question, the question is why him and not someone else with a little experience when we're in the middle of 2 1/2 wars and a very real possibility of more? I don't think that's a crazy question to ask.

Wait and find out. Obdicut already pointed to a link showing that Secretary Gate pushed for him as a replacement.

482 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:52:34pm

Gates that is.

483 Gus  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:53:37pm

Anywho. Got to get back to something here. Later.

484 Obdicut  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:54:16pm

re: #478 RogueOne


The question is why does the president want panetta as def. secretary.

Maybe because, as above, Gates promoted him as his successor?

Why are you skipping over that?

485 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 2:54:18pm

re: #475 McSpiff

Was Cheney a particularly successful SecDef or something?

He was in charge when the military started moving to lighter units and started serious cut backs. He wasn't very popular within the upper ranks as you can imagine. He was also in charge during desert storm.

486 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:00:42pm

re: #484 Obdicut

Maybe because, as above, Gates promoted him as his successor?

Why are you skipping over that?

I'm not skipping over anything. Gates likes him, that's a decent recommendation, but so what. Let me repeat myself, I don't have any idea if he'll do a great job or a crappy one and having experience in military issues may not be the most important factor...BUT when we're in the middle of a mess like the ME right now I would like to hear the presidents reasoning beyond a soundbite. That isn't asking too much. If Panetta was doing a bang-up job at CIA why not keep him there and move Petraeus into the defense slot. These are legitimate questions.

487 Obdicut  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:05:07pm

re: #486 RogueOne

I'm not skipping over anything. Gates likes him, that's a decent recommendation, but so what.

Huh? So the guy who probably knows best who'd make a good Secretary of Defense thinks he'd make a good secretary of defense. That's what.

Not hard to figure out.

UT when we're in the middle of a mess like the ME right now I would like to hear the presidents reasoning beyond a soundbite.

Maybe you could wait until he actually nominates him? Jesus.

These are legitimate questions.

Again: Has Pannetta been nominated? No. So why not wait until he has until you get all 'concerned' about this?

488 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:05:50pm

re: #486 RogueOne

I'm not skipping over anything. Gates likes him, that's a decent recommendation, but so what. Let me repeat myself, I don't have any idea if he'll do a great job or a crappy one and having experience in military issues may not be the most important factor...BUT when we're in the middle of a mess like the ME right now I would like to hear the presidents reasoning beyond a soundbite. That isn't asking too much. If Panetta was doing a bang-up job at CIA why not keep him there and move Petraeus into the defense slot. These are legitimate questions.

No they aren't. Do your homework, Petraeus is ineligible for the position. By law the SecDef needs to be a civilian for seven years prior to taking the job.

489 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:10:41pm

re: #487 Obdicut

Did you see anywhere where I suggested I was concerned? Did you skip the part where I said I don't know if he'll do well or not, or where I said I don't really have a problem with this? I'm arguing there are legitimate questions to ask and it isn't crazy to suggest the president should offer up his reasoning.

490 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:12:30pm

re: #488 goddamnedfrank

That's a stupid law but it's a good answer as to why Petraeus isn't getting the defense slot. That doesn't answer the actual question as to why panetta.

491 Obdicut  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:13:19pm

re: #489 RogueOne

Did you see anywhere where I suggested I was concerned?

Yep.


I'm arguing there are legitimate questions to ask and it isn't crazy to suggest the president should offer up his reasoning.

I'm betting when he nominates him, you'll hear his reasoning. You think Obama's just going to nominate him in silence? Maybe just pointing at him and nodding?

492 BongCrodny  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:13:32pm

re: #454 wrenchwench

I just realized I've been listening to Hawaiian music all day. I must be celebrating the Certifikit.


Pimp time!

Warren Zevon - The Hula Hula Boys

493 windsagio  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:14:16pm

re: #490 RogueOne

That's a stupid law...

It's a good law :p One of the basic ideas behind our governance is civilian control of the Military.

494 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:18:35pm

re: #493 windsagio

It's a good law :p One of the basic ideas behind our governance is civilian control of the Military.

Good point. It's from either '47 or '56 (I can't really tell), It might be time to re-look at the issue. If the president wants to nominate a general/admiral to be sec. of defense I don't see a conflict with the civilian control. If Eisenhower was allowed to be president after only a couple years out what's the harm in allowing the civilian president and congress put in a military person in the sec. of defense slot.

495 RogueOne  Wed, Apr 27, 2011 3:21:55pm

re: #493 windsagio

BTW, good to see you around.

I'm gone for the night folks. Enjoy your evening.


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