Michele Bachmann: Public Schools Should Teach Creationism

Michele Bachmann wants your children to be ignorant

WingnutsJune 2011 • Views: 45,251

Michele Bachmann (R-Mars), rising star of the 2012 GOP presidential contest, absolutely epitomizes the anti-science, theocratic wing of today’s Republican Party. Not only does she totally reject the voluminous scientific evidence for climate change, she’s also an open, unapologetic creationist.

And she doesn’t just want to teach creationism to her Quiverfull of kids.

She wants your children to be ignorant too: Bachmann: Schools should teach intelligent design.

New Orleans, Louisiana (CNN) – Republican presidential candidate Michele Bachmann explained her skepticism of evolution on Friday and said students should be taught the theory of intelligent design.

Bachmann, a congresswoman from Minnesota, also proposed a major overhaul of the nation’s education system and said state administrators should be able to decide how they spend money allocated to them by the federal government.

“I support intelligent design,” Bachmann told reporters in New Orleans following her speech to the Republican Leadership Conference. “What I support is putting all science on the table and then letting students decide. I don’t think it’s a good idea for government to come down on one side of scientific issue or another, when there is reasonable doubt on both sides.” …

“I would prefer that students have the ability to learn all aspects of an issue,” Bachmann said. “And that’s why I believe the federal government should not be involved in local education to the most minimal possible process.”

Bachmann is hauling out the long-discredited zombie of “intelligent design” again purely for cover, because it gives a pseudo-science sheen to her hooey.

The only real difference between “intelligent design” and creationism is that ID is deliberately deceptive.

Young earth creationists aren’t trying to fool anyone; they really believe that everything in the Bible is literally factual, and they’re completely up front about it. They may be goofy and determinedly ignorant of science, but they’re usually not liars.

But the hucksters who promote intelligent design claim a scientific rationale that’s completely unsupported by evidence; they have no peer-reviewed papers, no studies, no scientific data at all. And their “scientist” masks often slip, in embarrassing moments that reveal their hidden religious fanaticism.

The most famous example of this was the Dover trial, in which the creationist roots of “intelligent design” were conclusively proven, and biologist Michael Behe, star of the ID public relations campaign, was humiliated on the witness stand. Anyone interested in this subject should read the decision by Judge John E. Jones, a Republican appointed by George W. Bush; it’s highly readable and utterly scathing in its criticisms of the charlatans who promote ID.

Of course, none of this matters to Michele Bachmann or her reactionary religious fanatic supporters. They’ll continue parroting “intelligent design” talking points, even though they know it’s discredited non-scientific nonsense, for a simple reason: they’re using this scam as a Trojan Horse to sneak creationism back into public schools.

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139 comments

makeitstop Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:19:52pm

I remain flabbergasted that this woman is regarded as a serious candidate by anyone outside of the Crazy Base.

Having said that, I expect her to be the Republican VP candidate when all is said and done.

reine.de.tout Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:20:49pm

they’re using “intelligent design” as a Trojan Horse to sneak creationism back into public schools.

And the faith-based creation story they'll be sure to teach, may not be the one you want taught to your children. Isn't it a parent's prerogative, not that of a public school, to decide which faith the children will be brought up observing?

Why would any parent want to hand that huge responsibility, that obligation, over to the schools?

Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:21:08pm

cdesign proponentsists aren't transparent at all. Nope.

wrenchwench Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:21:17pm

"I don’t think it’s a good idea for government to come down on one side of scientific issue or another, when there is reasonable doubt on both sides.”

Reasonable doubt is a legal term, not a scientific one.

Political Atheist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:22:45pm

re: #2 reine.de.tout

The potential irony of someone deciding to home school to make sure their young get a good scientific view of evolution and the world around us is remarkable.

engineer cat Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:24:10pm

a Trojan Horse to sneak creationism

or to perpetuate an agenda of increased ignorance, and therefore increased gullibility, in the american people

wrenchwench Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:24:24pm

“I would prefer that students have the ability to learn all aspects of an issue,”

Unless it involves their own body. Leave that alone, it's God's Temple!

allegro Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:28:56pm

re: #5 Rightwingconspirator

The potential irony of someone deciding to home school to make sure their young get a good scientific view of evolution and the world around us is remarkable.

I have a group of acquaintances who did exactly that. One of the dads was a math prof who was disgusted with the deterioration of the Texas school system, especially in science and math ed. Every summer we did a week-long camping trip with the group of kids to do field observations, experiments, and projects. There was the dad, a mathematician, me (wildlife biologist), and two other profs from the university, a geologist and a botanist. Those camping trips were a blast. Oh, the kids enjoyed them too.

Iwouldprefernotto Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:29:51pm

This is the reason they made her foster kids go to public school.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:30:35pm

They want to teach creationism from a Christian, Protestant, evangelical and literalist perspective in the schools so bad it hurts.

It always baffles me, because I sort of think of myself as an intelligent design thinker, in my own way. I look at creation, and evolution, and all that jazz, and assume that God's hand is in there, or that that IS God's hand. But that's not what they mean. They want to use faith to skew science, not use science to expand faith.

Because they are jerks.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:31:08pm

re: #9 Iwouldprefernotto

This is the reason they made her foster kids go to public school.

Bet she was fun at parent conferences.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:32:02pm

re: #10 SanFranciscoZionist

They want to teach creationism from a Christian, Protestant, evangelical and literalist perspective in the schools so bad it hurts.

It always baffles me, because I sort of think of myself as an intelligent design thinker, in my own way. I look at creation, and evolution, and all that jazz, and assume that God's hand is in there, or that that IS God's hand. But that's not what they mean. They want to use faith to skew science, not use science to expand faith.

Because they are jerks.

Except that the very phrase 'intelligent design' is faintly blasphemous. God is not some 'intelligence' from outer space. People have intelligence, and gender, and personality traits. God is just God.

Obdicut Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:33:23pm

re: #2 reine.de.tout

Why would any parent want to hand that huge responsibility, that obligation, over to the schools?

To me, doing this sort of thing is more identification than anything else. They want mainstream US to be conservative protestant theology; they want that to be the norm. They want to ostracize and exclude Catholics, Jews, Hindus, and any non-conservative protestants. The best way of doing that is to make that the state religion, which is really, honestly, what they're trying to do.

They are unsure of their ability to bring their children up in their faith if their children are exposed to information which challenges that faith; no Jesuit 'faith-through-doubt' for them, but rather faith through eschewing all information that even challenges their worldview.

allegro Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:34:23pm

re: #12 SanFranciscoZionist

Except that the very phrase 'intelligent design' is faintly blasphemous. God is not some 'intelligence' from outer space. People have intelligence, and gender, and personality traits. God is just God.

I'm an atheist but I've always kinda wondered about that, too. I mean to me intelligent design is a watch or something. Nature would be defined as a miracle.

reine.de.tout Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:36:22pm

re: #10 SanFranciscoZionist

They want to teach creationism from a Christian, Protestant, evangelical and literalist perspective in the schools so bad it hurts.

Exactly.

It always baffles me, because I sort of think of myself as an intelligent design thinker, in my own way. I look at creation, and evolution, and all that jazz, and assume that God's hand is in there, or that that IS God's hand. But that's not what they mean. They want to use faith to skew science, not use science to expand faith.

Because they are jerks.

Exactly, again. And it's the ultimate insult to God, IMO, to refuse to see and appreciate and learn avout the wonder of all His creation.

Obdicut Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:38:10pm

re: #12 SanFranciscoZionist

Intelligent design represents a profound, stupefying ignorance of biology not just at the evolutionary level, but of the actual types of animals and what they do. The animal kingdom is full of wanton cruelty. From the simplest tiny gazelle being chased down and choked to death by a cheetah to the insanely gruesome parasites and fungal infections, the natural world is a terrifying place. The mechanisms of predation are legion in their horrific tortures.

What concept of god is it that intelligently designs things that way? I mean, to me, the cruelty of the animal kingdom challenges the idea of any sort of god-- at least a kind one-- but especially if you think that, somehow, god is hand-designing each of those animals, that he decided to create Killer Whales and have them torture seal pups. What sort of sense does that make?

To me, that belief in god is a very scary one, it's like the woman who thought god had caused the earthquake in Japan; a god who's mystery mainly lies in his enormous capacity for the infliction of pain and suffering.

sod Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:41:23pm

Thank God I'm an atheist!

The telling question should be:
"What's the first thing that comes into your mind when you see the term ID?"

I think Inside Diameter, so they haven't gotten to me yet.

reine.de.tout Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:41:55pm

re: #13 Obdicut

To me, doing this sort of thing is more identification than anything else. They want mainstream US to be conservative protestant theology; they want that to be the norm. They want to ostracize and exclude Catholics, Jews, Hindus, and any non-conservative protestants. The best way of doing that is to make that the state religion, which is really, honestly, what they're trying to do.

They are unsure of their ability to bring their children up in their faith if their children are exposed to information which challenges that faith; no Jesuit 'faith-through-doubt' for them, but rather faith through eschewing all information that even challenges their worldview.

If a person can come through everything that challenges their worldview with their faith intact, their faith is stronger for it.

Our parish has a couple of weekends a year where we are encouraged to reach out and invite & welcome lapsed members back to Mass, especially young folks. The priest there has talked about this period of time in the lives of many young folks where they go off and sort of disappear from church life, which is quite normal for many young 'uns. It isn't something to be feared, necessarily - but something to recognize and deal with (and in our case, the return invitation is one way to deal with it, and to get a person back).

Targetpractice Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:43:46pm

Well shit, why stop at just creationism? Why not force science classes to also give equal weight to the Ptolemaic model of the universe? Or bring back teaching of the four humors? And up on the wall, next to the periodic table, put up a poster showing the four "elements" of fire, water, air, and earth!

We must not let students go without hearing the opposing "theories"!

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:44:11pm

re: #16 Obdicut

Intelligent design represents a profound, stupefying ignorance of biology not just at the evolutionary level, but of the actual types of animals and what they do. The animal kingdom is full of wanton cruelty. From the simplest tiny gazelle being chased down and choked to death by a cheetah to the insanely gruesome parasites and fungal infections, the natural world is a terrifying place. The mechanisms of predation are legion in their horrific tortures.

What concept of god is it that intelligently designs things that way? I mean, to me, the cruelty of the animal kingdom challenges the idea of any sort of god-- at least a kind one-- but especially if you think that, somehow, god is hand-designing each of those animals, that he decided to create Killer Whales and have them torture seal pups. What sort of sense does that make?

To me, that belief in god is a very scary one, it's like the woman who thought god had caused the earthquake in Japan; a god who's mystery mainly lies in his enormous capacity for the infliction of pain and suffering.

I must invoke Monty Python here. Sung, of course, to the lovely tune of "All Things Bright And Beautiful".

All things dull and ugly,
All creatures short and squat,
All things rude and nasty,
The Lord God made the lot.

Each little snake that poisons,
Each little wasp that stings,
He made their brutish venom,
He made their horrid wings.

All things sick and cancerous,
All evil great and small,
All things foul and dangerous,
The Lord God made them all.

Each nasty little hornet,
Each beastly little squid,
Who made the spikey urchin,
Who made the sharks, He did.

All things scabbed and ulcerous,
All pox both great and small,
Putrid, foul and gangrenous,
The Lord God made them all.

AMEN.

Obdicut Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:44:46pm

re: #18 reine.de.tout

Back when I was Catholic and religious, the only part of it that really spoke to me strongly was faith through doubt. I didn't feel connected to the warm, self-satisfied part of religion where, it seems, some people bask, but rather the idea of God as something calling to me to improve myself, to live up to a Platonic ideal of humanity. And that included a lot of doubt.

My favorite priest, Monsignor West, who was not a highly intellectual man, nonetheless had great things to say about that. He said "Every time I pray, I have to ask myself what I'm really praying for. And that question normally occupies most of the time that I've set aside for prayer, and that helps me to understand myself and my motives."

He was a nifty guy. If everyone spent time every day trying to figure out their desires and where they really stemmed from, the world would be a better place.

allegro Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:45:36pm

re: #18 reine.de.tout

If a person can come through everything that challenges their worldview with their faith intact, their faith is stronger for it.

Our parish has a couple of weekends a year where we are encouraged to reach out and invite & welcome lapsed members back to Mass, especially young folks. The priest there has talked about this period of time in the lives of many young folks where they go off and sort of disappear from church life, which is quite normal for many young 'uns. It isn't something to be feared, necessarily - but something to recognize and deal with (and in our case, the return invitation is one way to deal with it, and to get a person back).

I think the epitome of this is the Amish Rumspringa. I have such respect for the Amish and this is one reason why.

Varek Raith Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:51:46pm

Breathing pipe and eating pipe are the same.
ID my ass!
:)

engineer cat Sat, Jun 18, 2011 12:58:26pm

eriK eriksson or some other person bedevilled by erics:

Michele Bachmann was scheduled to speak for 17 minutes at Right Online. She took an extra 18 minutes and 30 seconds.

The whole speech felt like it was only a few minutes. It was funny, fascinating, informative, and powerful. She set the bar very, very high for other candidates.

Her tax lawyer background showed in her speech, as did her faith. She used a dollar bill, folding it to show how Barack Obama’s policies have devalued it 14% and how the federal government borrows 42% of every dollar spent. She had the audience join her so they too can show others.

She hit Obama on something few Republicans ever do — unemployment in the Hispanic and black communities, noting how his policies have hurt the very groups he pledged to help. She focused as well on youth unemployment. Black youth in this country face 40% unemployment this summer and Hispanic youth face over 20%. Astonishing.

Bachmann brought the crowd to its feet multiple times. She pledged that she would not fight until Obamacare is repealed. She tackled medicare reform too. She pointed out that while the Democrats are scaring old people about Republican reforms, the Democrats took $500 billion from Medicare to fund healthcare for the young. She says the GOP needs to start pointing out that Barack Obama intends to bankrupt medicare and force senior citizens into Obamacare.

The speech really was dazzling and not because of the zingers and one liners. It was an extremely substantive speech about how Obama’s policies are hurting the country. Its substance, facts, and figures sets a very high bar for the other Presidential candidates who will be speaking at Right Online.

be careful boys and girls this could happen to you too if you don't learn how to avoid poisoning from too much erick

charleston chew Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:01:43pm

The most famous example of this was the Dover trial, in which the creationist roots of “intelligent design” were conclusively proven, and biologist Michael Behe, star of the ID public relations campaign, was humiliated on the witness stand. Anyone interested in this subject should read the decision by Judge John E. Jones, a Republican appointed by George W. Bush; it’s highly readable and utterly scathing in its criticisms of the charlatans who promote ID.

There's a good episode of the PBS series NOVA about this called Judgement Day: Intelligent Design On Trial available for viewing on their website.

dragonfire1981 Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:03:33pm

When I was in Gatlinburg, Tennessee about a month ago I visited some of the souvenir and "as seen on TV" shops. One of the things I found was a "Public Schools need God" T-shirt.

Charleston Chew Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:06:48pm

re: #23 Varek Raith

Similarly, human embryos have a tail that measures about one-sixth of the size of the embryo itself. As the embryo develops into a fetus, the tail is absorbed by the growing body. The developmental tail is thus a human vestigial structure.

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:07:01pm

re: #26 dragonfire1981

When I was in Gatlinburg, Tennessee about a month ago I visited some of the souvenir and "as seen on TV" shops. One of the things I found was a "Public Schools need God" T-shirt.

Alabama Public schools need toilet paper.

[Link: www.helpingschoolstags.org...]

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:09:06pm

re: #28 Decatur Deb

Alabama Public schools need toilet paper.

[Link: www.helpingschoolstags.org...]

Perhaps they could fundraise enough to buy toilet paper if God would do a loaves-and-fishes type miracle with their bakesales.

Charles Johnson Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:15:31pm

re: #25 charleston chew

There's a good episode of the PBS series NOVA about this called Judgement Day: Intelligent Design On Trial available for viewing on their website.

Here's the complete show on Google Video (which is supposed to be shutting down pretty soon...):

Google Video

(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:17:43pm

re: #8 allegro

I have a group of acquaintances who did exactly that. One of the dads was a math prof who was disgusted with the deterioration of the Texas school system, especially in science and math ed. Every summer we did a week-long camping trip with the group of kids to do field observations, experiments, and projects. There was the dad, a mathematician, me (wildlife biologist), and two other profs from the university, a geologist and a botanist. Those camping trips were a blast. Oh, the kids enjoyed them too.

Something all too-often ignored: Home schooling is the last refuge not just for parents who want to raise their children in a certain religious way, but also for parents who want their children to have a decent education in science but whose local schools are too incompetent.

lostlakehiker Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:18:52pm

re: #1 makeitstop

I remain flabbergasted that this woman is regarded as a serious candidate by anyone outside of the Crazy Base.

Having said that, I expect her to be the Republican VP candidate when all is said and done.

Betcha not. Romney will be the nominee, and he is not crazy enough to name her. A look at what Palin contributed (or, more accurately put, subtracted), in 2008, would suffice.

Republicans will back Romney over Obama in 2012, no matter who Romney chooses as his running mate. Independents will not be so forgiving. So the logical thing for Romney is to steer a middle course and hope that the economic situation in 2012 plays no better for Obama than 2008 did for McCain.

Not to say that Romney will be hoping for lots of bad news. Just, hoping that the expected bad news will stick to Obama.

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:20:42pm

re: #17 sod

The telling question should be:
"What's the first thing that comes into your mind when you see the term ID?"

Depends on how it's presented.

ID = Identification.

id = The part of my brain that whispers "Fuck it, drink another one".

(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:24:00pm

re: #10 SanFranciscoZionist

They want to teach creationism from a Christian, Protestant, evangelical and literalist perspective in the schools so bad it hurts.

It always baffles me, because I sort of think of myself as an intelligent design thinker, in my own way. I look at creation, and evolution, and all that jazz, and assume that God's hand is in there, or that that IS God's hand. But that's not what they mean. They want to use faith to skew science, not use science to expand faith.

Because they are jerks.

I think it has a lot to do with the heavy emphasis on proselytizing that exists in Christianity, especially Evangelical Christinianity. Getting others to acquire the same faith as yours to them is the only way they think they can save those others from eternal damnation. And they don't care whether they tear down the secular wall between state and religion or whether they have to throw naturalism and empiricism out of the window to wedge their faith into schools as "science". They don't care because the ends, saving souls, justify the means.

All I know is that life often was hell on earth when certain religions took stronghold in governments. Religious people too often think that that won't happen as long as it's their religion. Which is a bunch of baloney. Religion could only prosper so powerfully and peacefully at the same time in the United States precisely because of the strong secular tradition of its Constitution.

Charleston Chew Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:24:56pm

re: #32 lostlakehiker

Not to say that Romney will be hoping for lots of bad news.

Agree with everything you said except this. Romney and the GOP will be praying for as much bad news as possible. If the USA has to go down the crapper to hurt the President's re-election chances, they will just consider that collateral damage.

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:26:07pm

Oddly, the literalist YEC types who insist each animal was created 'as is' on a couple slow afternoons don't go after Michele and the IDers for heresy.

Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:28:08pm

IMO, if there is a god he is really fond of microorganisms, arthropods, annelids, etc.

Whenever I am feeling or acting like I am the center of the universe I find it is helpful to reflect on that. Humans have associations with a number of organisms that live on and in us. Some are pathogenic and some are symbiotic. From organisms that live in our pores, hair, and under our toenails to the massive population of bacterial cells living in our gut that outnumbers our own human cells. It feels like if a god created humans it was as convenient sacks to carry around his favorite creatures.

Killgore Trout Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:33:23pm

Ron Paul wins Republican Leadership Conf. straw poll; Jon Huntsman second
Ron Paul!

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:34:22pm

re: #36 Decatur Deb

Oddly, the literalist YEC types who insist each animal was created 'as is' on a couple slow afternoons don't go after Michele and the IDers for heresy.

They know it's just heavenly deception.

Varek Raith Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:34:59pm

re: #38 Killgore Trout

Ron Paul wins Republican Leadership Conf. straw poll; Jon Huntsman second
Ron Paul!

Image: ron-paul-dollar_web.jpg

PhillyPretzel Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:35:18pm

There are many students who still do not understand the basics of reading, writing and arithmetic and now Ms Bachmann wants to add her version of how we came to be. That is how to really screw things up.

(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:38:13pm

re: #38 Killgore Trout

Ron Paul wins Republican Leadership Conf. straw poll; Jon Huntsman second
Ron Paul!

Who won it in previous years?

Interesting Times Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:38:52pm

re: #41 PhillyPretzel

There are many students who still do not understand the basics of reading, writing and arithmetic

You can add history to that list as well. No, our children is not learning :(

Jeff In Ohio Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:39:47pm

re: #9 Iwouldprefernotto

This is the reason they made her foster kids go to public school.

Minnesota passed a state law before Michelle Bachman ever had foster kids requiring foster kids to go to public school because Michelle Bachman is a creationist? That's pretty amazing!

PhillyPretzel Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:39:54pm

re: #43 publicityStunted
I know. :(

wrenchwench Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:41:45pm

re: #32 lostlakehiker

Romney will be the nominee, and he is not crazy enough to name her.

Which is why he won't be the nominee.

Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:42:03pm

re: #36 Decatur Deb

Oddly, the literalist YEC types who insist each animal was created 'as is' on a couple slow afternoons don't go after Michele and the IDers for heresy.

You'd think. But it's the "god created" part that is the key for them. The time frame is just a minor point of doctrine.

A video like this should work equally well on either group:

Youtube Video

Interesting Times Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:43:13pm

re: #46 wrenchwench

Which is why he won't be the nominee.

Romney/Bachmann
Romney/Cain
Or else the base screws him again.

darthstar Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:44:08pm

Bachmann's hooey is the hooeyest!

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:46:53pm

re: #47 prononymous

What a coincidence, I just embedded one of his latest vids in the pages.
/pimp

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:48:47pm

re: #48 publicityStunted

Romney/Bachmann
Romney/Cain
Or else the base screws him again.

The base wouldn't vote for McCain with a charismatic nutjob attached to him. What makes this different?

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:51:09pm

re: #47 prononymous

You'd think. But it's the "god created" part that is the key for them. The time frame is just a minor point of doctrine.

A video like this should work equally well on either group:

[Video]

Needs moar arks.

Interesting Times Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:51:12pm

re: #51 SanFranciscoZionist

The base wouldn't vote for McCain with a charismatic nutjob attached to him.

Is there real evidence they stayed away in droves, though? I do recall Limbaugh saying people who didn't like McCain should vote for him anyway due to Palin. I was under the impression she cost McCain most among moderates/independents.

Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:51:14pm

re: #50 Slumbering Behemoth

What a coincidence, I just embedded one of his latest vids in the pages.
/pimp

I love his videos. They are a great resource. He clearly and concisely smacks down the BS.

Targetpractice Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:52:30pm

GOP's in a serious bind. Romney's the guy they'd rather run, as he holds an actual chance of being a challenge for Obama in the general election. But there's that nagging fear in the back of their minds that the Tea Party may "go rogue" and even establish a third-party run if one of their own isn't at the top of the ticket.

Clowns to the left, jokers to the right...

kirkspencer Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:55:16pm

re: #46 wrenchwench

Which is why he won't be the nominee.

Actually, there are three possibilities, of which we won't know any for certain till about mid-March next year.

a) The tea party is a strident minority. Given only one non-TP candidate in the race, Romney pulls away from the majority.

b) The tea party is a strident majority, but is split between its favorites. No candidate gets a clear majority, and we go into the convention with Romney holding the plurality but needing the delegates of at least one TP to win. In this case we'll see two battles possible: either Romney picks a TP VP who brings enough delegates to move over the top, OR there's a smoky room deal between two or three TP leaders that bypasses Romney.

c) The tea party is a strident majority, and they mostly coalesce around one favorite. In this case we wind up with the Republicans in 2012 looking a lot like the 2008 Obama-Clinton race. It becomes a close run thing between Romney and TP (too close for me to call at this time) but the winner is obvious before the convention. The bad news for the Republicans is that it does for them what 2008's race did for the Democrats and gives the voters a long, long look at just who the candidates are and where they stand.

My personal guess is we see (b) above, but I could easily be wrong. Thing is we won't know till we actually start seeing primary votes.

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:55:51pm

re: #54 prononymous

He knows his stuff.

I've been a journalist for 20 years, 14 years as a science correspondent. My degree is in geology, but while working for a science magazine and several science programs I had to tackle a number of different fields, from quantum physics to microbiology.

Dark_Falcon Sat, Jun 18, 2011 1:59:47pm

re: #10 SanFranciscoZionist

They want to teach creationism from a Christian, Protestant, evangelical and literalist perspective in the schools so bad it hurts.

It always baffles me, because I sort of think of myself as an intelligent design thinker, in my own way. I look at creation, and evolution, and all that jazz, and assume that God's hand is in there, or that that IS God's hand. But that's not what they mean. They want to use faith to skew science, not use science to expand faith.

Because they are jerks.

And butthurt jerks at that.

Sol Berdinowitz Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:00:04pm

re: #55 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

GOP's in a serious bind. Romney's the guy they'd rather run, as he holds an actual chance of being a challenge for Obama in the general election. But there's that nagging fear in the back of their minds that the Tea Party may "go rogue" and even establish a third-party run if one of their own isn't at the top of the ticket.

Clowns to the left, jokers to the right...

That is the very bind that McCain found himself in with the Religious Right over his all-too-moderate stands on social issues. They foisted their choice of VP candidate on him as a quid-pro-quo for their support, and we see how that turned out...

Dark_Falcon Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:00:37pm

re: #56 kirkspencer

Actually, there are three possibilities, of which we won't know any for certain till about mid-March next year.

a) The tea party is a strident minority. Given only one non-TP candidate in the race, Romney pulls away from the majority.

b) The tea party is a strident majority, but is split between its favorites. No candidate gets a clear majority, and we go into the convention with Romney holding the plurality but needing the delegates of at least one TP to win. In this case we'll see two battles possible: either Romney picks a TP VP who brings enough delegates to move over the top, OR there's a smoky room deal between two or three TP leaders that bypasses Romney.

c) The tea party is a strident majority, and they mostly coalesce around one favorite. In this case we wind up with the Republicans in 2012 looking a lot like the 2008 Obama-Clinton race. It becomes a close run thing between Romney and TP (too close for me to call at this time) but the winner is obvious before the convention. The bad news for the Republicans is that it does for them what 2008's race did for the Democrats and gives the voters a long, long look at just who the candidates are and where they stand.

My personal guess is we see (b) above, but I could easily be wrong. Thing is we won't know till we actually start seeing primary votes.

That's a fair, realistic analysis. Upding.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:01:20pm

re: #53 publicityStunted

Is there real evidence they stayed away in droves, though? I do recall Limbaugh saying people who didn't like McCain should vote for him anyway due to Palin. I was under the impression she cost McCain most among moderates/independents.

OK, point. I think I actually meant "He couldn't win the election with her", so why would it work for Romney now?

Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:02:32pm

re: #57 Slumbering Behemoth

Indeed. The world needs more good science advocates like him.

Science advocates with a British accent. / :p

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:03:15pm

Wayne Slater is senior political writer for the Dallas Morning News.

[Link: twitter.com...]

and

[Link: twitter.com...]

and

[Link: twitter.com...]

Rick Perry's about to start blathering....

wrenchwench Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:03:19pm

re: #56 kirkspencer

My personal guess is we see (b) above, but I could easily be wrong. Thing is we won't know till we actually start seeing primary votes.

That sounds entirely possibly. So does (c). I don't see (a) happening.

Targetpractice Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:03:45pm

re: #61 SanFranciscoZionist

OK, point. I think I actually meant "He couldn't win the election with her", so why would it work for Romney now?

Only way it really works this time around is if the economic situation in this country is so bad, that people vote against Obama rather than for Romney. Hence the growing worry that the GOP may allow a default in the hopes that they can successfully pin it on Obama and run on "fixing" the resulting disaster.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:03:54pm

re: #55 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

GOP's in a serious bind. Romney's the guy they'd rather run, as he holds an actual chance of being a challenge for Obama in the general election. But there's that nagging fear in the back of their minds that the Tea Party may "go rogue" and even establish a third-party run if one of their own isn't at the top of the ticket.

Clowns to the left, jokers to the right...

Romney is probably one of their best shots for challenging Obama. He's DEFINITELY one of their best shots for having a good, stimulating campaign in which they effectively promote a GOP platform a normal person might want to vote for--if not this time, then next time.

However, there's an element in town that objects to that, and they have a lot of yelling power.

Right now, I think that even if they run Romney and all goes well, Obama takes a second term.

If they run a lunatic like Bachmann, or if the Tea Party comes up with a third party campaign, it's just going to be painful all around.

watching you tiny alien kittens are Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:05:58pm

re: #37 prononymous

IMO, if there is a god he is really fond of microorganisms, arthropods, annelids, etc.

No it is Beetles that God likes!

The distinguished British biologist, J.B.S. Haldane, found himself in the company of a group of theologians. On being asked what one could conclude as to the nature of the Creator from a study of his creation, Haldane is said to have answered, “An inordinate fondness for beetles.”

Note: At the time naturalists had identified over 300,000 varieties of Beetles, and only 8,000 varieties of Mammals. The numbers have obviously changed somewhat since then, but the ratio of Beetles to Mammals has remained pretty constant.

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:06:20pm

Lawrence O'Donnell - Rick Perry Teams Up With AFA For Prayer Rally

Youtube Video

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:06:42pm

re: #65 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Only way it really works this time around is if the economic situation in this country is so bad, that people vote against Obama rather than for Romney. Hence the growing worry that the GOP may allow a default in the hopes that they can successfully pin it on Obama and run on "fixing" the resulting disaster.

The economy is Obama's biggest weak spot, and we'll have to see how voters actually respond to it once they've got a GOPer to consider seriously. Will depend on the GOP-er.

Dark_Falcon Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:07:02pm

re: #65 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Only way it really works this time around is if the economic situation in this country is so bad, that people vote against Obama rather than for Romney. Hence the growing worry that the GOP may allow a default in the hopes that they can successfully pin it on Obama and run on "fixing" the resulting disaster.

That's unlikely, since the GOP would catch blame for the default. The debt ceiling is likely to be raised but beyond that their isn't much incentive for proactive behavior on the part of Republicans. Any major jobs growth would be credited to Obama, leaving Congress little incentive to act. Nobody wants to create a win they don't get rewarded for, or at least no one in politics does.

Interesting Times Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:07:45pm

re: #61 SanFranciscoZionist

OK, point. I think I actually meant "He couldn't win the election with her", so why would it work for Romney now?

1) Massive Citizens United propaganda dump
2) GOP House does everything it can to blow up economy in hopes Obama gets blamed
3) Anyone-but-Obama sentiment
4) Voter suppression efforts in key swing states like Florida

I'd like to think it couldn't work, but too many voters have the attention span and long-term memory of goldfish in a meth-contaminated bowl.

Sol Berdinowitz Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:08:31pm

re: #65 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Only way it really works this time around is if the economic situation in this country is so bad, that people vote against Obama rather than for Romney. Hence the growing worry that the GOP may allow a default in the hopes that they can successfully pin it on Obama and run on "fixing" the resulting disaster.

Count on gas prices creeping up steadily next summer, reaching a peak in September, accompanied by a slew of articles and news reports pinning the blame on Obama for not encouraging more domestic production...

Dark_Falcon Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:11:02pm

re: #71 publicityStunted

Sounds like HuffPo talking points to me.

Killgore Trout Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:11:27pm

Since we has a lot of thoughtful political analysis going on: I think it's a fairly safe assumption the Republicans lose the Presidential election and possibly even lose control of the House. Where do Republicans turn next? Back to the religious right and forget the Tea Party/Glenn Beck thing ever happened? Do they get serious and work on realistic policies about the economy, environment, science, etc? Will they learn their lesson?

Lidane Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:12:06pm

Coming into the thread late since I've been out all day.

I'm so sick of all this anti-science, anti-reason creationist garbage trying to pass itself off as an "alternative" to evolution and to real, hard science. It's not. It's a bunch of magical thinking by people using the words of shepherds from 2000 years ago as the basis for everything. That's not good enough, especially if we expect this country to be competitive.

I find it amazing that so many people want to make our kids as stupid and uniformed as they are by teaching creationism or altering history or otherwise giving them a short shrift in education. How the fuck does that encourage the "American Exceptionalism" these lunatics are always raving about?

Anyone? Bueller?

Targetpractice Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:12:24pm

re: #66 SanFranciscoZionist

Romney is probably one of their best shots for challenging Obama. He's DEFINITELY one of their best shots for having a good, stimulating campaign in which they effectively promote a GOP platform a normal person might want to vote for--if not this time, then next time.

However, there's an element in town that objects to that, and they have a lot of yelling power.

Right now, I think that even if they run Romney and all goes well, Obama takes a second term.

If they run a lunatic like Bachmann, or if the Tea Party comes up with a third party campaign, it's just going to be painful all around.

The leader of the Tea Party Express was just recently on Fox, declaring that the TPers would endorse whoever the party nominates. Almost immediately after it hit the net, several other Tea Party groups came out with statements saying she didn't speak for them and that they wouldn't endorse anybody who they didn't approve of.

I'm convinced that what you're going to see, come next summer, is a Tea Party schism. Romney's going to come out ahead in the primaries, due to the other nutbars splitting the votes. With his nomination all but assured, there's going to be a breakaway of TPers who refuse to endorse a "RINO." That might lead to a third-party run, or it might result in a large contingent of voters simply staying home. Either way, it could be the sort of spoiler that sinks the GOP.

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:12:26pm

re: #62 prononymous

Indeed. The world needs more good science advocates like him.

Science advocates with a British accent. / :p

Lord Monckton isn't good enough for you?

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:13:10pm

I have this theory, as I think I've said before, that Obama will lose some small chunk of voters on the fringe left, but pick up more centrists and independents who approve of his record thus far, plus centrists who've traditionally voted Republican but are upset by the Crazytown element at the moment.

The economy is going to be the key, key thing, though.

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:13:58pm

re: #74 Killgore Trout

Since we has a lot of thoughtful political analysis going on: I think it's a fairly safe assumption the Republicans lose the Presidential election and possibly even lose control of the House. Where do Republicans turn next? Back to the religious right and forget the Tea Party/Glenn Beck thing ever happened? Do they get serious and work on realistic policies about the economy, environment, science, etc? Will they learn their lesson?

That kind of 'learning' takes a career generation. Mid-course conversions are very rare.

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:15:09pm

re: #75 Lidane

Anyone? Bueller?

For some, being the world leader in science and industry is no where near as important as being the world leader in loving baby Jebus.

Targetpractice Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:15:10pm

re: #70 Dark_Falcon

That's unlikely, since the GOP would catch blame for the default. The debt ceiling is likely to be raised but beyond that their isn't much incentive for proactive behavior on the part of Republicans. Any major jobs growth would be credited to Obama, leaving Congress little incentive to act. Nobody wants to create a win they don't get rewarded for, or at least no one in politics does.

Way I see it, the GOP's going to drag things out til the last minute, presenting a very real danger of default. When that happens, they're going to make a "modest proposal," a series of cuts that are played up as "less painful" that ones presented before, but viewed as a "first step." Obama will cave, afraid of a default, and the trap will be sprung.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:15:24pm

re: #78 SanFranciscoZionist

I have this theory, as I think I've said before, that Obama will lose some small chunk of voters on the fringe left, but pick up more centrists and independents who approve of his record thus far, plus centrists who've traditionally voted Republican but are upset by the Crazytown element at the moment.

The economy is going to be the key, key thing, though.

And, of course, the fringe left will vote Green or stay home, not vote for Obama's serious opponent. The question is what the Religious right is in the mood to do. Sometimes they stay home if they don't care for the Republican candidate, sometimes they turn out in large numbers for various reasons. And there are a lot more of them than the fringe lefties.

Varek Raith Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:15:27pm

Sponsor Of Alabama Immigration Law Scott Beason Refers To Blacks As ‘Aborigines’

In one transcript, Beason and two other Republican legislators were talking about economic development in predominantly black Greene County and the customers at one of the county’s largest employers, the Greenetrack casino in Eutaw.
“That’s y’all’s Indians,” one Republican said.

“They’re aborigines, but they’re not Indians,” Beason replied. [...]

The transcripts also showed Beason and other Republicans talking about what would happen if the legislation to protect electronic bingo casinos were approved by the Legislature and placed before voters in the election in November 2010. They speculated that casino owners would offer free meals and free bus rides to get black voters to the polls.

Under questioning, Beason said they were concerned that a large black turnout would hurt Republican candidates.

wrenchwench Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:15:47pm

re: #73 Dark_Falcon

Sounds like HuffPo talking points to me.

I don't read HuffPo, but all four of those things are happening now.

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:15:55pm

re: #80 Slumbering Behemoth

For some, being the world leader in science and industry is no where near as important as being the world leader in loving baby Jebus.

You know that someone's grandma has that already, so why even compete?

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:16:14pm

re: #78 SanFranciscoZionist

I have this theory, as I think I've said before, that Obama will lose some small chunk of voters on the fringe left, but pick up more centrists and independents who approve of his record thus far, plus centrists who've traditionally voted Republican but are upset by the Crazytown element at the moment.

The economy is going to be the key, key thing, though.

Before he loses the left, he loses the left's enthusiasm. He needs to do some real explaining about the wars, Guantanamo, and the unicorns.

Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:16:18pm

re: #67 ausador

No it is Beetles that God likes!

Note: At the time naturalists had identified over 300,000 varieties of Beetles, and only 8,000 varieties of Mammals. The numbers have obviously changed somewhat since then, but the ratio of Beetles to Mammals has remained pretty constant.

That's actually where my perspective started. I just apply it to what I am doing. For every cilliate I see under the microscope I see a hundred bacteria and archea living around, on, and in them. At every level you look life lives on, in, and with other life to the point that our interrelationships can't be undone. Nor would I want them to be. You don't want to find out if you can live without your intestinal microbiota. Everything on this planet depends on each other, and right now they are depending on us to not screw it all up.

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:17:03pm

re: #85 SanFranciscoZionist

Heh, prolly mine even.

Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:17:26pm

re: #77 Decatur Deb

Lord Monckton isn't good enough for you?

I said advocate not ignoramus. :D

Lidane Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:17:53pm

re: #74 Killgore Trout

Since we has a lot of thoughtful political analysis going on: I think it's a fairly safe assumption the Republicans lose the Presidential election and possibly even lose control of the House. Where do Republicans turn next? Back to the religious right and forget the Tea Party/Glenn Beck thing ever happened? Do they get serious and work on realistic policies about the economy, environment, science, etc? Will they learn their lesson?

Depends on how badly they lose, I think.

If someone like Romney gets the nod and loses by a slight margin, expect even more yelling from the teabaggers about purging the RINOs from the party and a shift further to the right.

If a raving lunatic like Bachmann or Palin gets the nod and gets slaughtered Mondale-style, then the GOP might consider having the same kind of come-to-Jesus moment the Dems did back in the 80's when they marginalized the hippies and far left kooks and took a more centrist tack.

wrenchwench Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:18:08pm

re: #79 Decatur Deb

That kind of 'learning' takes a career generation. Mid-course conversions are very rare.

If Republicans do change direction, I think it will be with different people coming to the fore (don't ask me who) rather than current ones altering their views.

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:18:15pm

re: #83 Varek Raith

Sponsor Of Alabama Immigration Law Scott Beason Refers To Blacks As ‘Aborigines’

This was the Dixie Demosthenes who told his followers to "empty the clip".

Varek Raith Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:19:21pm

re: #92 Decatur Deb

This was the Dixie Demosthenes who told his followers to "empty the clip".

Demosthenes.
Had to google it.
:)

Lidane Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:20:11pm

VIDEO: At Republican Leadership Conference, Obama Impersonator Tells Racist Jokes; Audience Laughs

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:21:21pm

re: #91 wrenchwench

If Republicans do change direction, I think it will be with different people coming to the fore (don't ask me who) rather than current ones altering their views.

It's gonna have to be that way. The current ones claim god as their ally, and therefore will never compromise. They are also too toxic now, if they claimed to change/alter their views I would not be likely to believe them.

Dark_Falcon Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:21:49pm

re: #74 Killgore Trout

Since we has a lot of thoughtful political analysis going on: I think it's a fairly safe assumption the Republicans lose the Presidential election and possibly even lose control of the House. Where do Republicans turn next? Back to the religious right and forget the Tea Party/Glenn Beck thing ever happened? Do they get serious and work on realistic policies about the economy, environment, science, etc? Will they learn their lesson?

It's unlikely the GOP will lose the House, if only because the 2012 redistricting favors Republicans so heavily. Also in the Senate, the sheer number more seats the Dems have to defend compared to the GOP makes Democratic losses likely.

Varek Raith Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:23:17pm

re: #94 Lidane

VIDEO: At Republican Leadership Conference, Obama Impersonator Tells Racist Jokes; Audience Laughs

Oh geez.

watching you tiny alien kittens are Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:24:30pm

re: #77 Decatur Deb

Lord Monckton isn't good enough for you?

You forgot your "sarc" tag. :p

How many Americans who are not hip deep in the AGW wars even know who "Lord" Monckton is?

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:24:49pm

re: #94 Lidane

Oh sure, they "boo" the Barbra Bush joke.

100

Varek Raith Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:25:14pm

re: #94 Lidane

VIDEO: At Republican Leadership Conference, Obama Impersonator Tells Racist Jokes; Audience Laughs

Bingo!

Doug Heye, the RNC’s communication director in 2010 tweeted: “Wonder why many minorities have problems with GOP? Hiring Obama impersonator to tell ‘black jokes’ at SRLC, for starters.”

101

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:25:32pm

re: #98 ausador

You forgot your "sarc" tag. :p

How many Americans who are not hip deep in the AGW wars even know who "Lord" Monckton is?

Very, very few.

102

Varek Raith Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:26:05pm

re: #98 ausador

You forgot your "sarc" tag. :p

How many Americans who are not hip deep in the AGW wars even know who "Lord" Monckton is?

He's funny!
/

103

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:26:16pm

re: #100 Varek Raith

What?!?! It's satire.
/

104

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:26:38pm

re: #102 Varek Raith

He's funny!
/

Haw Haw.

105

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:27:04pm

re: #98 ausador

You forgot your "sarc" tag. :p

How many Americans who are not hip deep in the AGW wars even know who "Lord" Monckton is?

My nic is my sarc tag.

106

Varek Raith Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:27:22pm

re: #105 Decatur Deb

My nic is my sarc tag.

Was that sarc???
:P

107

wrenchwench Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:27:25pm

re: #95 Slumbering Behemoth

It's gonna have to be that way. The current ones claim god as their ally, and therefore will never compromise. They are also too toxic now, if they claimed to change/alter their views I would not be likely to believe them.

Which is one of Romney's problems.

108

Varek Raith Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:29:48pm

Beck Conspiracy Theory: U.N.'s Agenda 21 Will Result In "Centralized Control Over All Of Human Life"

Dammit!
He's on to my plans!

109

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:31:39pm

re: #107 wrenchwench

It's difficult to tell where he stands, 'cuz he doesn't seem to stand in one place for long.

But with the Bachmann's and the Perry's of the GOP, I can feel pretty confident in the idea that one day they won't turn around and say "We were wrong about all that creationism hooey. Real science is cool"!

110

moderatelyradicalliberal Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:31:46pm

Did you guys hear about this shit?

[Link: www.balloon-juice.com...]

A President Obama impersonator brought down the house Saturday at the Republican Leadership Conference, telling a string of racially themed jokes about the president.
The impersonator, Reggie Brown, took the stage at the annual presidential cattle call to the Bruce Springsteen song “Born in the USA” — an allusion to the birther controversy.

A sampling of what followed:

• On Black History Month: “Michelle celebrates the full month. I celebrate half.”

• “My mother loved a black man,” but “she was not a Kardashian.”

• A picture was shown of Obama and the first lady when he took office. The impersonator then showed a picture of what the Obamas will look like when the president leaves office, and it was the characters of Fred Sanford and his sister-in-law, Ethel, from the show “Sanford and Son.”

Race wasn’t the only subject where the impersonator pushed the envelope.

• Of Tim Pawlenty’s decision not to criticize Mitt Romney at Monday’s debate: “[CNN’s] John King served him up a ball softer than Barney Frank’s backside.” (Frank is a gay member of Congress from Massachusetts.)

• Of Newt Gingrich’s approval ratings: Dropping “faster than Anthony Weiner’s pants in an AOL chat room.”

• There was also one moment where the original Weiner twitpic was shown on the large screens on either side of the impersonator, with no blurring.

Wow. I predict that the GOP's percent of the non-white, non-straight, non-Christian, minority of any kind vote will be historic. Historically low, that it.

111

Lidane Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:33:45pm

re: #110 moderatelyradicalliberal

Did you guys hear about this shit?

[Link: www.balloon-juice.com...]

Wow. I predict that the GOP's percent of the non-white, non-straight, non-Christian, minority of any kind vote will be historic. Historically low, that it.

I just put up a Page about it with an article from ThinkProgress. There's video, too.

112

moderatelyradicalliberal Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:33:46pm

re: #100 Varek Raith

Bingo!

I hope the impersonator enjoys his thirty pieces of silver.

113

moderatelyradicalliberal Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:34:37pm

re: #111 Lidane

I just put up a Page about it with an article from ThinkProgress. There's video, too.

Thanks, I missed it. The GOP almost leaves me speechless these days. Almost.

114

wrenchwench Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:36:24pm

re: #111 Lidane

I just put up a Page about it with an article from ThinkProgress. There's video, too.

Consider linking your nic to your Pages, so we can just click it to see 'em.

115

Killgore Trout Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:36:48pm

re: #94 Lidane

VIDEO: At Republican Leadership Conference, Obama Impersonator Tells Racist Jokes; Audience Laughs

Meh, it's not that bad. I have no problem with racial humor but it gets very dangerous in a political setting like that. I don't think any of those jokes crossed the line but it's a line that they probably should be messing with.

116

SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:37:44pm

re: #110 moderatelyradicalliberal

Did you guys hear about this shit?

[Link: www.balloon-juice.com...]

Wow. I predict that the GOP's percent of the non-white, non-straight, non-Christian, minority of any kind vote will be historic. Historically low, that it.

Oh Lud, I shall die of laughing. Or bust out of my corsets. Or something. How did this droll young man ever become such a cleverboots?

///

117

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:39:59pm

re: #116 SanFranciscoZionist

Oh Lud, I shall die of laughing. Or bust out of my corsets. Or something. How did this droll young man ever become such a cleverboots?

///

That's the GOP version of Stephen Colbert? (Check the blogs for Colbert's 20 minute graduation address at Northwestern.)

118

Lidane Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:41:31pm

re: #115 Killgore Trout

Meh, it's not that bad. I have no problem with racial humor but it gets very dangerous in a political setting like that. I don't think any of those jokes crossed the line but it's a line that they probably should be messing with.

It's at the Republican Leadership Conference.

Whoever decided it was a good idea to book that guy, especially when there was going to be video is completely politically tone deaf. Doesn't matter if the jokes are harmless at all. Telling racial jokes with an impersonator of a black president while a bunch of rich white Republicans laugh? Fastest way to lose all your minority voters.

119

moderatelyradicalliberal Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:42:59pm

re: #118 Lidane

It's at the Republican Leadership Conference.

Whoever decided it was a good idea to book that guy, especially when there was going to be video is completely politically tone deaf. Doesn't matter if the jokes are harmless at all. Telling racial jokes with an impersonator of a black president while a bunch of rich white Republicans laugh? Fastest way to lose all your minority voters.

Great quote from a commenter at the Washington Post article

capmbillie
The base of the GOP doesn't find it the least bit funny that a black man was elected president.

That's it in a nutshell.

120

watching you tiny alien kittens are Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:44:45pm

re: #108 Varek Raith

Beck Conspiracy Theory: U.N.'s Agenda 21 Will Result In "Centralized Control Over All Of Human Life"

Dammit!
He's on to my plans!

Beck is just now getting around to that one? Damn he needs better staff researchers, that is just SO 2010 already.

121

Decatur Deb Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:45:39pm

re: #118 Lidane

It's at the Republican Leadership Conference.

...snip. Fastest way to lose all your minority voters.

'S OK. Neither of them could make it.

122

BongCrodny Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:48:12pm

re: #110 moderatelyradicalliberal

The impersonator, Reggie Brown, took the stage at the annual presidential cattle call to the Bruce Springsteen song “Born in the USA” — an allusion to the birther controversy.

How honorable of them to steal a man's property.

123

Killgore Trout Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:50:04pm

re: #118 Lidane

It's at the Republican Leadership Conference.

Whoever decided it was a good idea to book that guy, especially when there was going to be video is completely politically tone deaf. Doesn't matter if the jokes are harmless at all. Telling racial jokes with an impersonator of a black president while a bunch of rich white Republicans laugh? Fastest way to lose all your minority voters.

The video cuts out early but they reportedly yanked him off stage...
Obama impersonator crosses the line at RLC

A comedian impersonating President Obama made racially tinged jokes Saturday at the Republican Leadership Conference before being pulled off the stage by an event organizer.

The Obama impersonator, Reggie Brown, said that while the First Lady celebrated all of Black History Month, the bi-racial president only celebrated half the month.
,,,,
Brown didn’t just limit his jokes to Obama, though. He also mocked Mitt Romney’s Mormon faith, ridiculed Newt Gingrich’s faltering campaign and suggested Tim Pawlenty needed a spinal transplant.

As Brown was preparing to make a Michele Bachmann joke, one of the conference’s officials came out to the lectern and told the comedian to leave the stage.

I guess the Bachmann joke was too much.

124

Lidane Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:51:49pm

re: #122 BongCrodny

How honorable of them to steal a man's property.

Especially when that guy has already made it known he doesn't want them to use his music. Springsteen's a Democrat. Always has been. And "Born in the USA" is one of those songs that people always get wrong, like they did here.

125

Killgore Trout Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:56:27pm

re: #123 Killgore Trout

Here;s a more complete video....

Youtube Video

It doesn't show him getting pulled of stage but most of his act was goofing on Republicans. That's why they pulled him off stage.

126

Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sat, Jun 18, 2011 2:59:10pm

What your kids' creationist school teacher might look like:

Youtube Video

127

kirkspencer Sat, Jun 18, 2011 3:13:02pm

re: #64 wrenchwench

That sounds entirely possibly. So does (c). I don't see (a) happening.

Well, it depends on how many moderate republicans aren't talking right now. It's easy to get to thinking all that's there is the noise, but the reality is there is more to the Republican party than the noisemakers.

We won't know how many there are who aren't TP but haven't washed their hands of the party till the rubber meets the road. Heck, just look at how many speak up here as a test case.

I don't know, and I don't think any of us will know till the voting starts.

128

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 3:16:28pm

re: #125 Killgore Trout

They clearly did not care for the jokes made at the GOP's expense. That humorous bunch should be forced, Huckabee style(/), to witness a full-on roast of the GOP, hosted by Jeff Ross.

129

Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Sat, Jun 18, 2011 3:17:08pm

re: #128 Slumbering Behemoth

They clearly did not care for the jokes made at the GOP's expense. That humorous bunch should be forced, Huckabee style(/), to witness a full-on roast of the GOP, hosted by Jeff Ross.

HUMORLESS!!! DAMNIT!

130

jaunte Sat, Jun 18, 2011 4:20:32pm

Coming soon: Bible Math.
From Ken Ham's Facebook page [Link: yfrog.com...]

131

Achilles Tang Sat, Jun 18, 2011 4:23:44pm

re: #75 Lidane

I find it amazing that so many people want to make our kids as stupid and uniformed as they are by teaching creationism or altering history or otherwise giving them a short shrift in education. How the fuck does that encourage the "American Exceptionalism" these lunatics are always raving about?

Anyone? Bueller?

It is not only creationism as far as education is concerned, it can also be be summarized by pants held up by the knees.

I have the dubious pleasure of owning a rental house in a neighborhood that was not bad at all two years ago. Now when it has been vacated I find myself watching continuous drug deals on the street two houses down (involving 5 houses down). Yes the police know about it and make promises, and have my videos, and I will remain hopeful for a while even though the mayor has not returned my phone calls.

However, the thing that really strikes me aside from obvious indication of neighborhood destruction is that these yahoos, always yelling at each other while waving arms as if they think they might fly, can't hold up their pants, throw trash on the ground even though there is a large garbage can 10 feet away, bring their small children to attend while they sell drugs, to Americans, is that THEY ARE AMERICANS!!

Education has failed at least one generation, and we will be living with it for a few more.

Shit.

132

teleskiguy Sat, Jun 18, 2011 7:53:29pm

Good post. Thanks Charles.

Science. It's not DOY!

133

labman57 Sat, Jun 18, 2011 8:36:41pm

Forgive her, America ... for she knows not what she speaks.

Evolution is a verifiable fact. It is the mechanism through which it occurs -- natural selection -- that comprises the theory.

People who do not understand how science works seem to think that a "theory" is somehow lacking in power and validity. Scientific theories are our best explanation for an event or phenomenon based on the available evidence, i.e., a theory tells us HOW it happens. Theories have generally been subjected to rigorous testing and represent the consensus of the scientific community, whereas a hypothesis is a possible explanation and has not necessarily been extensively tested.

Calling something a theory does not cheapen or weaken it. On the contrary, the term "theory" gives it legitimacy as something that is scientifically testable and that has been rigorously examined either mathematically or empirically to the point that the available evidence overwhelming supports it.

Theories are based on the best empirical EVIDENCE available, not PROOF. There is an incredible wealth of evidence--both geological and biochemical--to support evolution by natural selection.

Creationism and ID are faith-based concepts. Their "evidence" consists of the allegories provided in the Bible, nothing more.

I actually have no problem with the idea of discussing the merits of Creationism or ID in the public school classroom. It would make a fine topic in a social studies course on Religions in Society. But this topic has no business in a biology classroom, since science is based on verifiable evidence along with empirically and mathematically testable hypotheses, whereas religious beliefs are by definition faith-based.

134

SidewaysQuark Sun, Jun 19, 2011 7:36:37am

re: #133 labman57

I actually have no problem with the idea of discussing the merits of Creationism or ID in the public school classroom.

I do, given that these "merits" are non-existent.

135

studentpatriot Sun, Jun 19, 2011 11:29:31am

Tucker Carlson interviews Francis Collins (Director of the National Institute of Health, $30 billion/year granting agency for most biomedical research in US):

Carlson: Does evolution even imply that there's no god?

Collins: Of course not. Evolution, although it's called a theory, in science a theory is a collection of observations that are pulled together into a consistent view of things. Electromagnetic theory, for instance. It doesn't mean it's still hypothetical and people don't think it's right. Biology makes almost no sense without evolution to undergird it. Saying as the opening statement did evolution is a theory, not a fact, that's not really quite an adequate explanation of the solidity of information we have that --

Carlson: Do we need a new term?

Collins: We need a new term. Evolution has reached the point it's not going to be discarded.

Carlson: Why don't we call it a law?

Collins: Law in science, perhaps a little different. You're talking about physical laws, say, of gravitation. This is in fact a way of understanding how biological things came into being. But it in no way excludes god. Let me come to that. Science investigates the natural world. It is the way to investigate the natural world. But if god exists, god must be outside the natural world and so science really is silent in terms of answering that question. In that regard, athiests, who say there is no god. Where does god fit in to this, if you think evolution explains life forms including our own? I think it's fairly straightforward. I'm what's called a theistic evolutionist. I believe god had a purpose that involved you and me as individuals, people that he wished to have fellowship with. I believe that the way he decided to do that creative step utilized the mechanism of evolution. I don't think that requires god to step in and fill in these gaps in the development of the eye. I think evolution is self-sufficient. I think god is basically the mind that is behind it.

Full transcript here: [Link: webcache.googleusercontent.com...]

Nuance/compromise???

136

Obdicut Sun, Jun 19, 2011 12:30:48pm

re: #135 studentpatriot

That's not compromise. That's saying intelligent design is utter bullshit.

137

studentpatriot Sun, Jun 19, 2011 2:14:20pm

re: #136 Obdicut

I agree intelligent design is bullshit.

I didn't clearly state the question - could "theistic evolution" (as described by Collins) be a sort of compromise? Pointing out where science ends and leaving a place for faith traditions?

It didn't seem to impair Francis Collins, scientific ability...

138

Obdicut Sun, Jun 19, 2011 2:30:30pm

re: #137 studentpatriot

I agree intelligent design is bullshit.

I didn't clearly state the question - could "theistic evolution" (as described by Collins) be a sort of compromise? .

No. He clearly states that intelligent design doesn't exist. All he's saying is that evolution occurs and he thinks that was god's plan. Which has no actual effect.

139

wheat-dogghazi Sun, Jun 19, 2011 4:23:21pm

re: #24 engineer dog

I confess I have never read Eric Ericsson's stuff, so pardon this question. Does he always write like this? It reads like a high school essay, or an especially long-winded version of "One night, at band camp ..." (with appropriate Valley Girl uptones).

To be fair, my students wrote better than this example, so perhaps I'll demote Ericsson writing style to middle-school level.

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