Marcus Bachmann Denies Calling Gays 'Barbarians'

Marcus Bachmann Denies Calling Gays ‘Barbarians’

They’re not ‘anti-gay’ - they’re pro-not being gay

WingnutsJuly 2011 • Views: 27,020

Michele Bachmann’s husband Marcus is doing some desperate damage control today, insisting that his clinics are not anti-gay, and denying he ever called gay people “barbarians”.

An audiotape circulating on the Internet depicts Bachmann as calling gays barbarians in a 2010 interview he gave to the “Point of View” Christian radio talk show.

“We have to understand: Barbarians need to be educated,” Bachmann’s voice is heard saying on the tape. “They need to be disciplined. Just because someone feels it or thinks it doesn’t mean that we are supposed to go down that road.”

Bachmann said that someone must have doctored the recording of the interview, in which he addressed child discipline as well as homosexuality and sex education. …

“I was talking in reference to children. Nothing, nothing to do with homosexuality. That’s not my mindset. That’s not my belief system. That’s not the way I would talk,” Bachmann said.

Judge for yourself whether he’s telling the truth; here’s the audio recording posted by ThinkProgress, from a 2010 interview on a Christian radio show:

Youtube Video

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93 comments

Alexzander Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:17:04am

Seems like a nice man.

laZardo Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:21:27am

And who says religion isn't all about this kind of bigotry?

New thread, time for bed. Nighty.

Locker Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:21:33am

See this all the time on The First 48...

I didn't say that!
I wasn't even there!
I was home asleep!
No that's not me on that security video tape!
I don't care if you've got 5 independent witnesses... they are lying!

Right.

darthstar Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:22:41am

He didn't say "Barbarians"...he said that gays are "ba-bar-bar-BEARLICIOUS!"

ElCapitanAmerica Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:22:46am

Raise your hand if you think this man is in the closet.

CarleeCork Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:23:11am

So, in addition to being a closet homosexual he's a liar.

makeitstop Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:23:23am

Ah, the old 'they doctored the tape' dodge.

And am I clear that he said he was calling children 'barbarians' and not gays? Is this a guy who should have had 23 foster kids in his stewardship if he thinks kids are barbarians?

Alexzander Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:27:24am

re: #5 ElCapitanAmerica

Raise your hand if you think this man is in the closet.

That possibility is discussed here on Olbermann:

Youtube Video

They also review the chutzpah blunder. Still not really keen on Olbermann though.

Kronocide Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:29:45am

For being such a small minority of the population gays sure seem to be a big focus with religious nutters. It must be because they love them so much, no?

simoom Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:36:05am

Sarah Palin tweets her analysis of the White House presser:

Obama lies, economy dies. He says "default's catastrophic" then opposes deal to avert it. Nonsense. Gold stars to GOP trying to deal w/this.

Gold stars for everyone!

Kragar Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:37:17am

re: #10 simoom

Sarah Palin tweets her analysis of the White House presser:

Gold stars for everyone!

What a twit.

ProMayaLiberal Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:38:43am

re: #11 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I can think of other words to describe her, but that is good too.

Obdicut Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:39:16am

re: #5 ElCapitanAmerica

There's plenty of incredibly effeminate straight dudes out there.

I don't think there are many straight people who run anti-gay programs, though. Most of the founders of anti-gay stuff are now openly gay.

And yeah. He seems to really have been calling children barbarians, but talking about homosexual desire as something that needs to be stomped out of them by parents and/or educators. So, what he's really saying is that gay children are barbarians.

Weee.

It's possible that someone has spliced together two bits of audio, one him talking vaguely about bad desires, and another about the 'real' percentage of homosexuals in the population, but it's unlikely. And the latter shows him ignorant and homophobic anyway.

thatthatisis Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:39:20am

It seemed kind of par for the course to me when a far right fanatic calls gay people "barbarians". The part that put chills up my spine was his reference to them needing "discipline". I really think we should interview some of those foster kids.

makeitstop Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:40:26am

re: #11 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

What a twit.

I'd like to buy a(nother) vowel, Pat.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:40:57am

I believe him when he says he's referring to children, rather than gays, as barbarians who need discipline. This does not endear him to me, but I do believe it.

Clearly, though, the point is that you should not allow your child to be gay, and that you should, through discipline and right teaching, make that kid straight.

I've seen the results of this, and they are not pretty.

There's some evidence that trying to make a lefty right-handed actually messes up their brain function in some small ways, IIUC. Wonder what happens when you try to rewire someone's sexuality behaviorally?

BongCrodny Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:41:11am

re: #2 laZardo

And who says religion isn't all about this kind of bigotry?

New thread, time for bed. Nighty.

My sister and her partner had their ceremony at a Unitarian Universalist church. The minister, a woman, gave us lots of talk about love and peace and respect and how the Creator gave us wonderful gifts.

I felt like I was at a hippiefest.

But that's not a bad thing -- were I a religious man, I'd much rather go to a "rising spirits" type of church than a "GOD WILL SMITE THEE" church.

Point being, of course, that not all churches are like the Bachman (stomach)Turner Overdrive -- but then again, I wouldn't argue percentages with you.

allegro Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:41:29am

re: #8 Alexzander

That possibility is discussed here on Olbermann:

[Video]They also review the chutzpah blunder. Still not really keen on Olbermann though.

Chitzbuh? LOL!

The moment I heard Dr. Bachman's voice my gaydar siren started to scream. Add that to his comments and serious loathing, it certainly supports the in-the-closet hypothesis.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:41:55am

re: #13 Obdicut

There's plenty of incredibly effeminate straight dudes out there.

I don't think there are many straight people who run anti-gay programs, though. Most of the founders of anti-gay stuff are now openly gay.

And yeah. He seems to really have been calling children barbarians, but talking about homosexual desire as something that needs to be stomped out of them by parents and/or educators. So, what he's really saying is that gay children are barbarians.

Weee.

It's possible that someone has spliced together two bits of audio, one him talking vaguely about bad desires, and another about the 'real' percentage of homosexuals in the population, but it's unlikely. And the latter shows him ignorant and homophobic anyway.

And the former shows him to be a proponent of ham-handed discipline of children with wrong thoughts and ideas.

So, basically, I'm not seeing a way out of this where I go OH, OK, he's a cool dude.

Kragar Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:42:11am

re: #15 makeitstop

I'd like to buy a(nother) vowel, Pat.

Twiit?

makeitstop Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:43:56am

re: #20 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Twiit?

Eh, that'll work. I had a different vowel in mind, though.

Obdicut Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:44:30am

re: #19 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, I think it's safe to say that he called gay people barbarians, because of the following syllogism:

1. Children are barbarians who feel bad desires.

2. You've got to discipline that out of them so that they stop being barbarians.

3. Gay desires are one of those bad desires.

4. Any adult gay must not have gotten the discipline they needed to make them not a barbarian.

5. Adult gays are barbarians.

Vicious Babushka Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:44:55am

re: #19 SanFranciscoZionist

And the former shows him to be a proponent of ham-handed discipline of children with wrong thoughts and ideas.

So, basically, I'm not seeing a way out of this where I go OH, OK, he's a cool dude.

How fucked up are their 23 kids?

makeitstop Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:45:08am

If his wife has no problem saying that gays are 'of Satan,' then it's not that far of a throw to get to 'gays are barbarians.'

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:45:31am

re: #23 Alouette

How fucked up are their 23 kids?

I honestly do not think they had most of them long enough. Who knows?

Obdicut Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:45:48am

re: #24 makeitstop

If his wife has no problem saying that gays are 'of Satan,' then it's not that far of a throw to get to 'gays are barbarians.'

No, it's claiming that gays are happy that's "Of Satan". That's the satanic thing, to dare to assert gay people might enjoy life and not live in constant, guilt-ridden misery.

Kinda telling.

makeitstop Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:47:49am

re: #26 Obdicut

No, it's claiming that gays are happy that's "Of Satan". That's the satanic thing, to dare to assert gay people might enjoy life and not live in constant, guilt-ridden misery.

Kinda telling.

To close the circle - maybe she's looking at the closest example?

BongCrodny Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:49:01am

re: #22 Obdicut

6. Profit!

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:49:02am

re: #27 makeitstop

To close the circle - maybe she's looking at the closest example?

That is a truly sad thought.

Maybe so.

Obdicut Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:49:11am

re: #27 makeitstop

To close the circle - maybe she's looking at the closest example?

Honestly, speculating about his sexuality seems mean-spirited and makes me uncomfortable, and I'd have an ethical problem with it if it weren't for that anti-gay clinic he runs. I always feel torn about 'outing' repressed and anti-gay gays.

Petero1818 Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:50:10am

There is a lot in that quote. On the one hand he clearly calls gays Barbarians or at least clearly says gays are like Barbarians in that they are acting on every desire. For that he is a total douche. But there are a few more interesting tidbits.
I believe he implicitly recognizes that while there are some people who identify as gay by choice (he views this as a product of a godless education system that says its alright if you are gay), he seems to also suggest that there are some who are gay by their nature, that they have these thoughts and desires. He just thinks you shouldn't act on them.
This goes back to the most basic and repressive aspects of the Church IMHO. A system that is set up to discourage independent thought, encourage a group mentality and oppress any who dissent.

And yes, I believe this man has those desires as well, and my guess is he has acted on them at some point.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:50:59am

re: #30 Obdicut

Honestly, speculating about his sexuality seems mean-spirited and makes me uncomfortable, and I'd have an ethical problem with it if it weren't for that anti-gay clinic he runs. I always feel torn about 'outing' repressed and anti-gay gays.

I honestly don't know, and don't much care, what his sexuality is. I don't plan to out the man...but I would like some serious attention paid to how ugly his agenda really is.

wrenchwench Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:51:22am

He's saying kids should be taught not to act upon their thoughts and feelings. In other words, 'stay in the closet'. He also said "What truly is a percentage of homosexuals in this country is small, but by these open doors, I can see, we are experiencing, that it is starting to increase." That implies that he believes that SOME homosexuals are 'truly' homosexuals, and others are being encouraged to act that way. He presents no differentiation in how 'true' homosexuals should be treated, just implies that they also should stay in the closet.

allegro Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:51:27am

re: #30 Obdicut

Honestly, speculating about his sexuality seems mean-spirited and makes me uncomfortable, and I'd have an ethical problem with it if it weren't for that anti-gay clinic he runs. I always feel torn about 'outing' repressed and anti-gay gays.

When a guy is doing real harm - as I feel this cure the gay shit does - then it seems an obligation to out him. Otherwise, I agree that outing someone who doesn't want to be outed is a wrong thing to so.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:52:58am

re: #34 allegro

When a guy is doing real harm - as I feel this cure the gay shit does - then it seems an obligation to out him. Otherwise, I agree that outing someone who doesn't want to be outed is a wrong thing to so.

I don't think that outing him proves anything, except that he believes this crap enough to marry a woman, have children with her, and desperately try to 'help' other gay men screw themselves over similarly.

Focus on the 'therapy', and why it does not work, and does not help either the patient or society. That's my thought.

Petero1818 Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:53:40am

re: #24 makeitstop

If his wife has no problem saying that gays are 'of Satan,' then it's not that far of a throw to get to 'gays are barbarians.'

To be fair to her, and trust me it pains me to no end to do so, she said that it was of Satan to brand homosexuality as "gay" as in her opinion it is homosexuality is essentially an illness and there is nothing "gay" or happy about being sick in that way.

She is still a douche bag.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:54:14am

I don't get it. On the one hand you have GOProud, Log Cabin Republicans, the inclusion of GOProud at CPAC. Then you have all of this prime anti-gay rhetoric being touted by GOP members and their affiliates. How, if they're supposedly trying to attract conservative gays, which there are plenty of around the country, yet embrace the anti-gay rhetoric at the same time. They need to decide what in hell it is they want to do and stick with it. The way to accomplish that would be for mainstream Republican candidates and politicians to condemn this type of rhetoric, in public, once and for all.

makeitstop Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:54:32am

re: #30 Obdicut

Honestly, speculating about his sexuality seems mean-spirited and makes me uncomfortable, and I'd have an ethical problem with it if it weren't for that anti-gay clinic he runs. I always feel torn about 'outing' repressed and anti-gay gays.

Understood. I've resisted the urge to take the cheap shot (as have most Lizards), and my intent with that post was not to mock.

But it does seem like a possibility to me.

wrenchwench Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:55:48am

re: #33 wrenchwench

Maybe they can make their closets fabulous.

If Dr. Bachmann believes there are 'true' gays, all that follows from him seems cruel, and very illogical.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:57:02am

re: #37 Gus 802

I don't get it. On the one hand you have GOProud, Log Cabin Republicans, the inclusion of GOProud at CPAC. Then you have all of this prime anti-gay rhetoric being touted by GOP members and their affiliates. How, if they're supposedly trying to attract conservative gays, which there are plenty of around the country, yet embrace the anti-gay rhetoric at the same time. They need to decide what in hell it is they want to do and stick with it. The way to accomplish that would be for mainstream Republican candidates and politicians to condemn this type of rhetoric, in public, once and for all.

I think the Log Cabin guys, and GOProud, are basically sticking around without much support from the GOP. They're conservatives, they're proud, they raise money, and they're not going anywhere.

I'm not that the GOP has any real gay-attracting agenda at all.

Petero1818 Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:57:48am

re: #30 Obdicut

Honestly, speculating about his sexuality seems mean-spirited and makes me uncomfortable, and I'd have an ethical problem with it if it weren't for that anti-gay clinic he runs. I always feel torn about 'outing' repressed and anti-gay gays.

To my mind it is always ok to point out the apparent contradiction in someone's argument. I don't believe anyone here (well I should not speak for everyone) was implying anything negative with respect to his sexuality. I think they were simply questioning the logic of a perhaps gay man being so critical of homosexuality. Just because he might be offended doesn't mean it was meant to be so.

Alexzander Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:58:42am

re: #40 SanFranciscoZionist

I think the Log Cabin guys, and GOProud, are basically sticking around without much support from the GOP. They're conservatives, they're proud, they raise money, and they're not going anywhere.

I'm not that the GOP has any real gay-attracting agenda at all.

Wasn't there a huge controversy surrounding the GOProud at the latest CPAC (or some other conservative event)?
Others protested the event and eventually the ogranizers said GOProud wouldn't be invited next year. Well thats how I remember it.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:58:44am

re: #30 Obdicut

Honestly, speculating about his sexuality seems mean-spirited and makes me uncomfortable, and I'd have an ethical problem with it if it weren't for that anti-gay clinic he runs. I always feel torn about 'outing' repressed and anti-gay gays.

People can be conflicted in either direction. We should respect that in all people. With regards to the means to the end of mitigating that conflict, that's a different issue. But we should respect people's privacy IMO. Others will thing to the contrary but that's their choice if they want to play in the mud.

wrenchwench Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:58:55am

re: #37 Gus 802

I don't get it. On the one hand you have GOProud, Log Cabin Republicans, the inclusion of GOProud at CPAC. Then you have all of this prime anti-gay rhetoric being touted by GOP members and their affiliates. How, if they're supposedly trying to attract conservative gays, which there are plenty of around the country, yet embrace the anti-gay rhetoric at the same time. They need to decide what in hell it is they want to do and stick with it. The way to accomplish that would be for mainstream Republican candidates and politicians to condemn this type of rhetoric, in public, once and for all.

It's a big tent, with lots of closets to make everyone comfortable.

S'latch Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:59:09am

I don't believe Marcus Bachmann that his statement had "nothing to do with homosexuality." However, it would be better to have the whole interview available to judge it more fairly.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 10:59:20am

re: #43 Gus 802

People can be conflicted in either direction. We should respect that in all people. With regards to the means to the end of mitigating that conflict, that's a different issue. But we should respect people's privacy IMO. Others will ~~thing~~ THINK to the contrary but that's their choice if they want to play in the mud.

PIMF

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:01:22am

re: #39 wrenchwench

Maybe they can make their closets fabulous.

If Dr. Bachmann believes there are 'true' gays, all that follows from him seems cruel, and very illogical.

The underlying issue that he believes that homosexuality damages people and society.

I accept that there may be people who are 'true' psychopaths. They are going to kill, and we can't fix them, or pray it away, or treat them medically. But I don't say that that because they're like this we have to let them run around and be serial killers. I feel bad for them, because unlike people who had a choice, and chose to kill folks, these guys probably never had a chance. But we still gotta lock 'em away.

I suspect that this schmuck thinks of homosexuality EXACTLY LIKE THAT.

Fozzie Bear Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:02:42am

re: #16 SanFranciscoZionist

There's some evidence that trying to make a lefty right-handed actually messes up their brain function in some small ways, IIUC. Wonder what happens when you try to rewire someone's sexuality behaviorally?

You end up with somebody like Marcus Bachmann.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:03:00am

re: #44 wrenchwench

It's a big tent, with lots of closets to make everyone comfortable.

Same as it ever was. I suppose that's true about most ideologically driven groups. A big tent with a whole bunch of tiny little tents inside.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:04:24am

re: #41 Petero1818

To my mind it is always ok to point out the apparent contradiction in someone's argument. I don't believe anyone here (well I should not speak for everyone) was implying anything negative with respect to his sexuality. I think they were simply questioning the logic of a perhaps gay man being so critical of homosexuality. Just because he might be offended doesn't mean it was meant to be so.

I think if he's actually gay, or aware of homoerotic feelings, or whatever--which I have no actual proof of, BTW--it just reenforces, to me, how seriously he believes this crap.

And if true, it probably skews his view of out gay men no end. "I suppressed my feelings successfully. I married Michele. I had sex with her. I help other gay men do the same thing. What the hell is the matter with you, and how DARE you act like you're having a good time in life, and your homosexuality isn't a burden you have to tote every day?"

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:04:25am

re: #42 Alexzander

Wasn't there a huge controversy surrounding the GOProud at the latest CPAC (or some other conservative event)?
Others protested the event and eventually the ogranizers said GOProud wouldn't be invited next year. Well thats how I remember it.

That's pretty close. Some are trying to kill CPAC because of this. I'd Google it up but I'm about up to my limit for monthly usage on my wireless connection.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:04:45am

re: #42 Alexzander

Wasn't there a huge controversy surrounding the GOProud at the latest CPAC (or some other conservative event)?
Others protested the event and eventually the ogranizers said GOProud wouldn't be invited next year. Well thats how I remember it.

Something happened with CPAC. I don't know where they left it.

ProMayaLiberal Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:06:18am

Off Topic, but after seeing some Pakistanis trying to whitewash the Bengali Genocide in 1971 (saying it is exaggerated/didn't happen), I reactivated my Wikipedia account.

Killgore Trout Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:06:40am

Hot Air prepares readers to throw Murdoch under the bus.....
Murdoch’s right-hand woman in Britain resigns

It’s possible the poor decision-making began and ended with individual journalists, but it could also be a sign of low journalistic standards companywide. That’s always been the criticism of Murdoch’s empire, after all — that it’s based on brilliant business strategies, but questionable journalism. Murdoch stands by News Corp. and says he’ll defend it from outright lies when he appears before Parliament. And at least one friend of Murdoch defends him as “a very honorable, honest man” who couldn’t possibly have had knowledge of the phone hacking. But competitors haven’t hesitated to try to drum up backlash to the growing story. Murdoch has a fight with few allies ahead, no doubt.

So far most readers think it's a non-story or conservative persecution.

Petero1818 Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:06:59am

re: #47 SanFranciscoZionist

I accept that there may be people who are 'true' psychopaths. They are going to kill, and we can't fix them, or pray it away, or treat them medically. But I don't say that that because they're like this we have to let them run around and be serial killers. I feel bad for them, because unlike people who had a choice, and chose to kill folks, these guys probably never had a chance. But we still gotta lock 'em away.

I suspect that this schmuck thinks of homosexuality EXACTLY LIKE THAT.

I agree, that is pretty much his opinion of it. Though his career path suggests also that he believes the godless school system has created a situation where we have made this "lifestyle" look so attractive as an option that we have created some "fake" psychopaths if you will who can be redeemed.

Decatur Deb Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:07:50am

I don't have much faith in gaydar. When I was in the draft Army, as I later found out, my unit gave me a gay rep and then rescinded it. All of that was without my ever knowing it, and all for totally absurd 'signals'.

Fozzie Bear Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:08:24am

re: #30 Obdicut

Honestly, speculating about his sexuality seems mean-spirited and makes me uncomfortable, and I'd have an ethical problem with it if it weren't for that anti-gay clinic he runs. I always feel torn about 'outing' repressed and anti-gay gays.

Repressed gays, it's not nice to out. But anti-gay gays... they deserve no such consideration. Self loathing is what it is, but when it becomes hostility toward others, my sympathy dries up.

The guy is probably a closeted gay.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:11:37am

re: #55 Petero1818

I agree, that is pretty much his opinion of it. Though his career path suggests also that he believes the godless school system has created a situation where we have made this "lifestyle" look so attractive as an option that we have created some "fake" psychopaths if you will who can be redeemed.

Bingo.

S'latch Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:15:02am

Maybe he is saying that he doesn't have anything against homosexuals, per se, but he just doesn't think that it is appropriate for Barbarians to be gay.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:15:20am

re: #56 Decatur Deb

I don't have much faith in gaydar. When I was in the draft Army, as I later found out, my unit gave me a gay rep and then rescinded it. All of that was without my ever knowing it, and all for totally absurd 'signals'.

Agreed. There are people who give you 'tells' (a man wearing leather chaps in a bar on Folsom is probably gay), but I think the 'gaydar' thing gets built up by newly out college kids forming their tribal affiliations.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:15:26am

re: #56 Decatur Deb

I don't have much faith in gaydar. When I was in the draft Army, as I later found out, my unit gave me a gay rep and then rescinded it. All of that was without my ever knowing it, and all for totally absurd 'signals'.

Used to be if you weren't married by a certain age. Having been in the civilian world all my life it never bothered me. People will think whatever it is they want to think based on their "feelings". 5 times out of 10 those "feelings" are off by several thousand yards. I will say though that this shit can also happen in office environments in the civilian world.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:16:26am

re: #61 Gus 802

Used to be if you weren't married by a certain age. Having been in the civilian world all my life it never bothered me. People will think whatever it is they want to think based on their "feelings". 5 times out of 10 those "feelings" are off by several thousand yards. I will say though that this shit can also happen in office environments in the civilian world.

My father was apparently IDed as gay by the entire congregation of a Catholic church he attended for a time. Because he came alone on Sunday mornings.

When he introduced my mother to them at Easter, their brains scrambled.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:16:58am

Office, factory, construction site, chemical plant, etc. ;)

Decatur Deb Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:17:38am

re: #59 Lawrence Schmerel

Maybe he is saying that he doesn't have anything against homosexuals, per se, but he just doesn't think that it is appropriate for Barbarians to be gay.

What does he think about cowboys, bikers,indians and construction workers?

Obdicut Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:17:57am

re: #62 SanFranciscoZionist

Until marriage, every few months my parents would get intensely worried that I was gay.

I just tended to keep my girlfriends away from them because they're crazy; i.e., randomly thinking their son is gay.

S'latch Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:19:07am

re: #64 Decatur Deb

Well, you would have to ask him. But, clearly, he does not think that Barbarians should be gay.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:19:18am

re: #62 SanFranciscoZionist

My father was apparently IDed as gay by the entire congregation of a Catholic church he attended for a time. Because he came alone on Sunday mornings.

When he introduced my mother to them at Easter, their brains scrambled.

Now that's pretty subtle. Another one used to be having long hair. Some people still think that way. That men with long hair "have to be gay". Or something. They're highly confused but most likely very isolated.

Fozzie Bear Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:19:36am

re: #65 Obdicut

Until marriage, every few months my parents would get intensely worried that I was gay.

I just tended to keep my girlfriends away from them because they're crazy; i.e., randomly thinking their son is gay.

LOL!!! That's hilarious!

Decatur Deb Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:20:20am

re: #66 Lawrence Schmerel

Well, you would have to ask him. But, clearly, he does not think that Barbarians should be gay.

I always thought the whole Capitol One crew were a little light in their leg-wrappings.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:20:20am

OMG he's not married! He has to be gay!

Obdicut Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:20:46am

re: #60 SanFranciscoZionist

Agreed. There are people who give you 'tells' (a man wearing leather chaps in a bar on Folsom is probably gay), but I think the 'gaydar' thing gets built up by newly out college kids forming their tribal affiliations.

I think that it's at least partially cultural. I had pretty good San Francisco gaydar. But tons of guys in New York ping it who are just massively metrosexual.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:22:50am

Mom, dad. I'm not gay. But I am a barbarian.

Fozzie Bear Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:23:07am

re: #71 Obdicut

The NYC hipster scene's aesthetic seems perfectly designed to convince a maximum number of people that they are gay.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:27:23am

re: #66 Lawrence Schmerel

Well, you would have to ask him. But, clearly, he does not think that Barbarians should be gay.

Barbarians are supposed to be MANLY men!!!

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:27:43am

re: #66 Lawrence Schmerel

Well, you would have to ask him. But, clearly, he does not think that Barbarians should be gay.

It's the civilized people--Greeks, Romans, ya know...that are supposed to be gay.

Gus Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:28:06am

re: #69 Decatur Deb

I always thought the whole Capitol One crew were a little light in their leg-wrappings.

Yeah. When we waz paintin' da camo on dat jeep he kept sayin' Chartreuse instead of yellow-green.

Decatur Deb Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:31:09am

re: #76 Gus 802

Yeah. When we waz paintin' da camo on dat jeep he kept sayin' Chartreuse instead of yellow-green.

//

That's scary-funny. I actually know what "taupe" is, not because I'm a decorator but because I loaded boxes in a garment-district warehouse. Maybe the guys in C Company were right...

Sol Berdinowitz Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:34:47am

re: #30 Obdicut

Honestly, speculating about his sexuality seems mean-spirited and makes me uncomfortable, and I'd have an ethical problem with it if it weren't for that anti-gay clinic he runs. I always feel torn about 'outing' repressed and anti-gay gays.

Check out Wednesday Daily Show in which John Steward calls for help from Jerry Seinfeld to keep him from making Marcus Bachmann gay jokes...

wrenchwench Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:35:15am

re: #56 Decatur Deb

I don't have much faith in gaydar. When I was in the draft Army, as I later found out, my unit gave me a gay rep and then rescinded it. All of that was without my ever knowing it, and all for totally absurd 'signals'.

I visited my boyfriend when he lived in NYC. He had men flirting with him all the time. His roommate, a childhood friend, was gay, so there were lots of assumptions being made.

Decatur Deb Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:37:07am

re: #79 wrenchwench

I visited my boyfriend when he lived in NYC. He had men flirting with him all the time. His roommate, a childhood friend, was gay, so there were lots of assumptions being made.

Unless he was researching a sitcom, that's fairly understandable.

allegro Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:37:08am

re: #71 Obdicut

I think that it's at least partially cultural. I had pretty good San Francisco gaydar. But tons of guys in New York ping it who are just massively metrosexual.

A big part of it for me these days isn't mannerisms - I've known many totally het men who have, let's say, expressive mannerisms that many think to be gay. It's when there's a seemingly obsessive preoccupation with gays, spitting about the "gay agenda" and such with vivid descriptions of gay sexual activities, that's when the gaydar dings loudly. Combined with the mannerisms and it's off the charts.

zora Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:37:13am

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Granville Stanley Hall (February 1, 1844 – April 24, 1924) was a pioneering American psychologist and educator. His interests focused on childhood development and evolutionary theory. Hall was the first president of the American Psychological Association and the first president of Clark University.

Hall argued that child development recapitulates his highly racialized conception of the history of human evolutionary development. He characterized pre-adolescent children as savages and therefore rationalized that reasoning was a waste of time with children. He believed that children must simply be led to fear God, love country and develop a strong body. As the child burns out the vestiges of evil in his nature, he needs a good dose of authoritarian discipline, including corporal punishment. For adolescents, who he believed were characterized by more altruistic natures, high schools should indoctrinate students into selfless ideals of service, patriotism, body culture, military discipline, love of authority, awe of nature and devotion to the state and well being of others. Hall consistently argued against intellectual attainment at all levels of public education. Open discussion and critical opinions were not to be tolerated. Students needed indoctrination to save them from the individualism that was so damaging to the progress of American culture.

adolescent children are referred to as savages and teenagers as barbarians. sound like marcus bachmann may have been referring to children as barbarians. i have no doubt he considers himself a success story as he has been cured of the gay.

Decatur Deb Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:39:45am

re: #82 zora

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

adolescent children are referred to as savages and teenagers as barbarians. sound like marcus bachmann may have been referring to children as barbarians. i have no doubt he considers himself a success story as he has been cured of the gay.

Stanley Hall sounds like an entire generation of vice-principals.

Jaerik Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:40:02am

So when he's talking about barbarians that need to be educated to suppress their feelings, he's talking about children, not teh gays?

That makes it all better.

BongCrodny Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:41:07am

Take Hagar the Horrible, for example.

Ostensibly your typical suburban Viking; wife two kids, pet dog, pet duck.

Straight, right?

Then why the hell is he always away from home, hanging out with other manly men, ransacking Europe and England?

Decatur Deb Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:42:38am

re: #85 BongCrodny

Take Hagar the Horrible, for example.

Ostensibly your typical suburban Viking; wife two kids, pet dog, pet duck.

Straight, right?

Then why the hell is he always away from home, hanging out with other manly men, ransacking Europe and England?

Duck is a give-away.

SanFranciscoZionist Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:59:55am

re: #86 Decatur Deb

Duck is a give-away.

I love Kvack!

OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin Fri, Jul 15, 2011 12:44:43pm

re: #16 SanFranciscoZionist

I've seen the results of this, and they are not pretty.

I'd add they don't work, and only make for angry and frustrated families. That's the "family value"..really f'd up families.

Mattand Fri, Jul 15, 2011 12:49:36pm

re: #85 BongCrodny

Take Hagar the Horrible, for example.

Ostensibly your typical suburban Viking; wife two kids, pet dog, pet duck.

Straight, right?

Then why the hell is he always away from home, hanging out with other manly men, ransacking Europe and England?

It definitely keeps him from being funny.

Mattand Fri, Jul 15, 2011 12:55:57pm

re: #37 Gus 802

I don't get it. On the one hand you have GOProud, Log Cabin Republicans, the inclusion of GOProud at CPAC. Then you have all of this prime anti-gay rhetoric being touted by GOP members and their affiliates. How, if they're supposedly trying to attract conservative gays, which there are plenty of around the country, yet embrace the anti-gay rhetoric at the same time. They need to decide what in hell it is they want to do and stick with it. The way to accomplish that would be for mainstream Republican candidates and politicians to condemn this type of rhetoric, in public, once and for all.

I asked a gay woman to explain how a group like the Log Cabin Republicans could exist, given the state of the GOP. She was just as baffled as me.

I just don't get it. It's like African-Americans for the Klan. Why would anyone want to join a group that so clearly wants no part of them?

Eclectic Infidel Fri, Jul 15, 2011 3:07:03pm

re: #90 mattand

Good question. Log Cabin Republicans are like the stepchildren who are tolerated out of familial respect, rather than genuine love.

Either they see this and ignore it, or see it and are hoping for the best.

Jaerik Fri, Jul 15, 2011 6:30:47pm

A gay ex-Republican friend of mine explained it as empowerment through exception.

Being the guy who voluntarily stays within the group despite one shockingly incompatible existential viewpoint instantly gives you points within that group. It makes your dedication to the other group's other shared principles seem more pure by comparison, as you're evidently willing to let them trump the other primary point of concern. And it immediately makes your contributions seem more like the product of serious, balanced contemplation, than simple partisan loyalty.

Mattand Fri, Jul 15, 2011 11:04:21pm

re: #92 Jaerik

A gay ex-Republican friend of mine explained it as empowerment through exception.

Being the guy who voluntarily stays within the group despite one shockingly incompatible existential viewpoint instantly gives you points within that group. It makes your dedication to the other group's other shared principles seem more pure by comparison, as you're evidently willing to let them trump the other primary point of concern. And it immediately makes your contributions seem more like the product of serious, balanced contemplation, than simple partisan loyalty.

That's fascinating. Personally, I view the anti-gay stuff as more 'civil rights' than 'existential', but I get your point. Still, things like Bob Dole accepting than rejecting Log Cabin donations don't quite send a "We're all on the same team" vibe.

I'd be interested to know why your friend fled the Big Tent.

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Marcus Bachmann Denies Calling Gays ‘Barbarians’

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