Tech Note: LGF Pages Posting Bookmarklet Updated

Better support for Internet Explorer
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The bookmarklet that lets registered LGF users post LGF Pages has been updated, to provide better support for automatically grabbing selected text from a web page in Internet Explorer.

Here’s the new version of the bookmarklet:

LGF Pages Bookmarklet

To install this in Safari, Chrome, or Firefox, you can just drag the link to your Bookmarks Bar, then name it “LGF Pages.”

To install in Internet Explorer, right-click the link, then choose “Add to Favorites,” and add it to your “Favorites Bar.” You may also need to modify IE’s security settings to allow Explorer to open popup windows from the littlegreenfootballs.com domain.

(The bookmarklet link in the right sidebar of the LGF Pages index has also been updated with the new code.)

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760 comments
1 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:02:47pm

I really cant believe how much Perry sounds like Bush. I heard someone on RedState say that its because Bush actually copied Perry.

2 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:04:08pm

That sounds like work.

;)

3 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:04:52pm

re: #2 ggt

Hitting the tip jar?

4 Kragar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:05:45pm

re: #1 Alexzander

I really cant believe how much Perry sounds like Bush. I heard someone on RedState say that its because Bush actually copied Perry.

They grow them from cloned embryos. Ever seen "The Boys from Brazil"?

5 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:06:39pm

re: #3 Alexzander

Hitting the tip jar?

huh?

6 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:07:07pm

They are talking about Paul Ryan entering to GOP race soon on FOX right now.

I really hope so.

7 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:07:52pm

Annnnnnd... a new Ron Paul commercial!!
Watch it for the lulz

Youtube Video
8 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:08:21pm

re: #5 ggt

huh?

Ohh I assumed thats what the winking smily face was about. I fail.

9 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:09:37pm

re: #6 Alexzander

They are talking about Paul Ryan entering to GOP race soon on FOX right now.

I really hope so.

That's "the end of Medicaid" ads running in every state by the end of the week then.........

10 Lidane  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:09:37pm

re: #6 Alexzander

They are talking about Paul Ryan entering to GOP race soon on FOX right now.

I really hope so.

That would be hilarious if true. The more crazy the better.

11 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:11:29pm

re: #10 Lidane

That would be hilarious if true. The more crazy the better.

Agreed.
I think I'm still surprised that Pawlenty got no steam and bowed out so early. He was probably the sort of candidate that would have been able to appeal to the middle. Now the whole field is just swinging so far to the right that Rove is worried.

12 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:12:22pm

re: #10 Lidane

That would be hilarious if true. The more crazy the better.

Ryan has a veneer of sanity that only Romney and Huntsman possess in the current crop.

Bachmann and Gingrich's personalities make them scary - Ryan's manufacture of numbers to form into counter budget proposals is what scares the bejeezus out of me about him.

13 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:13:06pm

I'm off. I have to be productive.

Have a great evening all!

14 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:13:17pm

Anyone watch that Ron Paul ad I posted?

It is basically casting him as "THE ONE" which is amusing as that was one of the first attack memes against Obama.

15 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:13:29pm

re: #11 Alexzander

Agreed.
I think I'm still surprised that Pawlenty got no steam and bowed out so early. He was probably the sort of candidate that would have been able to appeal to the middle. Now the whole field is just swinging so far to the right that Rove is worried.

Which he walks back in...........
5....
4....
3....
2....
1.....Fox News Sunday

16 Kragar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:18:03pm

Bachmann asks crowd if they want to shag...


"If you want to shag a little bit, that’s what we’ll do.”
17 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:18:10pm

Charlie Veitch vs EDL Cambridge

Youtube Video
18 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:18:49pm

re: #16 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

*Facepalm*

19 Lidane  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:22:11pm

re: #16 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Bachmann asks crowd if they want to shag...

It's going to be a long campaign season.

20 makeitstop  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:24:30pm

From Think Progress' Twitter feed:

RT @MPOTheHill Bachmann: "Under President Bachmann you will see the price of gasoline come down under $2/gallon again. That. Will. Happen."

How in the world does she intend to get that done?

21 makeitstop  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:26:19pm

re: #16 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Bachmann asks crowd if they want to shag...

That woman is so out of touch. I realize that Bible-humpers are a sheltered bunch, but come on...

22 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:30:00pm

Andrew Breitbart, impervious to irony, is accusing MSNBC's Ed Schultz of "selectively editing" a video.

Here's the clip Breitbart posted: [Link: www.breitbart.tv...]

Watch carefully, because you'll see that Ed Schultz played the FULL video clip of Rick Perry, including the part Breitbart says was edited!

It's right there in the clip -- the first segment with Schultz.

Then the rest of Breitbart's video does a bizarre repetition over and over that Ed Schultz edited the video (he didn't) and misrepresented it (he didn't!), ending with "Ed Schultz Should Be Fired."

It's utterly bizarre. It's like Breitbart is trying to hypnotize people into believing the exact opposite of reality.

23 Lidane  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:32:07pm

re: #22 Charles

It's like Breitbart is trying to hypnotize people into believing the exact opposite of reality.

Hasn't that been his MO all along? ACORN, Shirley Sherrod, etc.

24 laZardo  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:32:26pm

re: #22 Charles

It worked for ACORN.

As it were.

25 zora  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:32:42pm

re: #22 Charles

so he's claiming that shultz "breitbarted" perry. priceless.

26 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:32:44pm

re: #23 Lidane

Hasn't that been his MO all along? ACORN, Shirley Sherrod, etc.

Really, though - wait 'til you see this one. It's creepy.

27 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:33:11pm

More video from our dear friend Glenn Beck on his tour to Israel:


Helen on The Road to Restoring Courage

Youtube Video

"If anybody is going to get her moving, it's Glenn Beck."

28 makeitstop  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:36:48pm

re: #26 Charles

Really, though - wait 'til you see this one. It's creepy.

It was almost as though he had to fill two and a half minutes with a minute's worth of video. Very weird.

29 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:38:03pm

Breitbart complaining about selectively editing hahahahaha. Oh the irony is rich with that one.

30 Lidane  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:39:32pm

re: #26 Charles

Really, though - wait 'til you see this one. It's creepy.

What. The. Fuck. It's right there in the first segment.

And judging by the comments, the idiots who follow Breitbart believe what he's telling them, and they're trotting out all the usual nonsense about how liberals are scared and about the lamestream media. Unbelievable.

It's a sad commentary about the current right wing blogosphere.

31 jaunte  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:50:19pm

It's only a "big black cloud of debt" now that a black Democratic president is in office.

When a Republican held the office, it was a big "deficits don't matter" cloud of debt.

32 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:53:29pm

re: #31 jaunte

It's only a "big black cloud of debt" now that a black Democratic president is in office.

When a Republican held the office, it was a big "deficits don't matter" cloud of debt.

Yep.

33 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:57:19pm

Holy shit did you guys know there are a ton of free movies hosted officially on youtube?

Classics like Franz Lang's M, The Man who Knew Too Much, etc. Also contemporary films like Pineapple Express.

[Link: www.youtube.com...]

34 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 3:59:39pm

About to begin preparing to dough for some epic pizza tonight.

Where is everyone? There are 96 people logged in but everyone's dead silent.

35 laZardo  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:00:52pm

re: #33 Alexzander

Holy shit did you guys know there are a ton of free movies hosted officially on youtube?

Classics like Franz Lang's M, The Man who Knew Too Much, etc. Also contemporary films like Pineapple Express.

[Link: www.youtube.com...]

OH MY GOD

PLAN 9 FROM OUTER SPACE

IN COLOR

36 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:03:57pm

re: #33 Alexzander

Holy shit did you guys know there are a ton of free movies hosted officially on youtube?

Classics like Franz Lang's M, The Man who Knew Too Much, etc. Also contemporary films like Pineapple Express.

[Link: www.youtube.com...]

Cool, thanks for the heads up.

37 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:05:27pm

re: #35 laZardo

OH MY GOD

PLAN 9 FROM OUTER SPACE

IN COLOR

Have you seen the film about Plan 9? I forget the title right now but, the one staring Johnny Dep.

38 makeitstop  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:06:45pm

re: #34 Alexzander

Where is everyone? There are 96 people logged in but everyone's dead silent.

I was wondering that myself. Too quiet in here...

I've been ducking in and out over the past hour or so, catching stuff on some other blogs. This post addresses in depth the initial point in that Schultz video - the point of racism.

Hiding in Plain Sight: Racism's Role in the Tea Party GOP's Efforts to Destroy Barack Obama and the U. S. Economy

Good read.

39 wrenchwench  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:08:36pm

OK, I gave it a test drive. It works great, just like it did before. But the categories-- they're HUGE!

Only drawback: the subheading line for snark doesn't show up in the Preview. And you know I'm Preview-dependent. (We're no longer just friends.)

Other than that, it's perfect, just like it was before.

40 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:11:51pm

re: #39 wrenchwench

OK, I gave it a test drive. It works great, just like it did before. But the categories-- they're HUGE!

Only drawback: the subheading line for snark doesn't show up in the Preview. And you know I'm Preview-dependent. (We're no longer just friends.)

Other than that, it's perfect, just like it was before.

very nice...thanks

41 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:21:14pm

the Ents are considering....

42 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:23:10pm

re: #37 Alexzander

Have you seen the film about Plan 9? I forget the title right now but, the one staring Johnny Dep.

Ed Wood. Instant classic. Love him!

43 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:23:28pm

re: #41 albusteve

the Ents are considering...


eeeeek

was so quiet in here you scared me................

44 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:24:43pm

re: #43 wozzablog

eeek

was so quiet in here you scared me...

harrrooommm

45 jamesfirecat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:30:41pm

re: #21 makeitstop

That woman is so out of touch. I realize that Bible-humpers are a sheltered bunch, but come on...

Clearly she means that if you want her to that badly she'll come to your home and redecorate it for you....

46 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:41:24pm

re: #42 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Ed Wood. Instant classic. Love him!

I knew I could count on you to remember the title!

47 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:43:55pm

the group needs a nap

48 Kragar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:45:19pm

re: #47 albusteve

the group needs a nap

GRAHAM CRACKERS AND APPLE JUICE TIME!

49 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:47:01pm

WOW I have missed this place.

this working for a living crap is sooo wearing thin.

50 Alexzander  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:47:40pm

re: #49 Aceofwhat?

WOW I have missed this place.

this working for a living crap is sooo wearing thin.

What kind of work?

51 Varek Raith  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:47:50pm

re: #49 Aceofwhat?

WOW I have missed this place.

this working for a living crap is sooo wearing thin.

Sup man???

52 Kragar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:48:37pm

13 Assassins now on Netflix instant queue

Youtube Video
53 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:48:47pm

re: #48 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

GRAHAM CRACKERS AND APPLE JUICE TIME!

all that aggressive negative energy takes it's toll...a little rest and a couple of drinks and we'll be back to knocking the shit out of the GOP pronto

54 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:49:03pm

re: #45 jamesfirecat

Yeah no. Bible bumpers have awful taste in drapes.

55 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:49:27pm

re: #49 Aceofwhat?

WOW I have missed this place.

this working for a living crap is sooo wearing thin.

you can't post from work?

56 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:50:02pm

re: #37 Alexzander

Have you seen the film about Plan 9? I forget the title right now but, the one staring Johnny Dep.

Martin Freakin' Landau stole that movie.

57 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:50:55pm

re: #50 Alexzander

I live in Florida but work in Ohio. Weekends spent reconnecting with wife and kids...lgf time cut painfully short. It's not ideal.

58 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:52:21pm

re: #57 Aceofwhat?

I live in Florida but work in Ohio. Weekends spent reconnecting with wife and kids...lgf time cut painfully short. It's not ideal.

get rid of the wife and kids, primo LGF time....problem solved

59 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:52:26pm

re: #55 albusteve

Not in the past...yikes...how long has it been? Four months? Too busy.

60 engineer cat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:53:12pm

re: #37 Alexzander

Have you seen the film about Plan 9? I forget the title right now but, the one staring Johnny Dep.

talking about movies about movies, i also love the one about the making of nosferatu

makes me want to eat a raw bat

61 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:53:55pm

re: #59 Aceofwhat?

Not in the past...yikes...how long has it been? Four months? Too busy.

so you can't rip off your employer?....that's cool

62 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:55:09pm

re: #51 Varek Raith

Sup man???

Dude. Video game time is down nearly as much as lgf time. It's been an itchy few months. The one game I've played in the past month? Catherine. What a head trip.

63 wrenchwench  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:55:09pm

re: #57 Aceofwhat?

I live in Florida but work in Ohio. Weekends spent reconnecting with wife and kids...lgf time cut painfully short. It's not ideal.

That's a heck of a commute. Is this a long-term situation?

64 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 4:58:54pm

re: #63 wrenchwench

We will see. However, wife and kids are fairly adamant that the current situation is better than actually moving to Ohio. My folks and my sister are only a few minutes away from our house in Florida, and I do work from home one day per week. So it's been pretty easy for them, and I feel like a tool complaining that my lack of lgf and xbox time is really breaking me down...so I don't complain.

65 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:00:41pm

re: #49 Aceofwhat?

WOW I have missed this place.

this working for a living crap is sooo wearing thin.

ACE! Missed seeing you around.

66 garhighway  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:01:01pm

re: #64 Aceofwhat?

We will see. However, wife and kids are fairly adamant that the current situation is better than actually moving to Ohio. My folks and my sister are only a few minutes away from our house in Florida, and I do work from home one day per week. So it's been pretty easy for them, and I feel like a tool complaining that my lack of lgf and xbox time is really breaking me down...so I don't complain.

Fly back and forth on Delta: they have wi-fi on their planes.

67 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:02:40pm

re: #64 Aceofwhat?

We will see. However, wife and kids are fairly adamant that the current situation is better than actually moving to Ohio. My folks and my sister are only a few minutes away from our house in Florida, and I do work from home one day per week. So it's been pretty easy for them, and I feel like a tool complaining that my lack of lgf and xbox time is really breaking me down...so I don't complain.

You on a plane a lot then? gah

68 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:04:29pm

re: #66 garhighway

Fly back and forth on Delta: they have wi-fi on their planes.

I have gone from nobody to near-platinum status on Delta in about nine months. I didn't buy the wifi but the delta sky club lounges...yeah. Those are niiice...

69 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:05:26pm

re: #64 Aceofwhat?

We will see. However, wife and kids are fairly adamant that the current situation is better than actually moving to Ohio. My folks and my sister are only a few minutes away from our house in Florida, and I do work from home one day per week. So it's been pretty easy for them, and I feel like a tool complaining that my lack of lgf and xbox time is really breaking me down...so I don't complain.

my business was building or rebuilding houses...LGF and Xboxes were an unthinkable diversion...I just can't imagine the typical workplace today...if I found anybody on my office surfing the net, they would be instantly fired...old fashioned eh?

70 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:05:42pm

re: #65 Stanley Sea

Girlfriend! Brantley + Weis = championship! I can feel it!

71 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:08:49pm

re: #69 albusteve

Nah, I think that it's more about the kind of work that a lot of people do. Folks who are computer-bound have an easier time getting work done while keeping an eye on the net. I'm helping to manage a small business, so I am rarely sitting still long enough to check the weather, much less lgf.

72 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:13:29pm

re: #67 Stanley Sea

Eh, I don't mind as much as other people. On the plane, i have peace and quiet! I read...it's so nice to have a few hours to read each week.

And then during the week, my father (who works in Columbus as well, his contacts led to my job) and I have been working on a cabin and land that he bought outside of town. my brother goes to Ohio state, so when i take a break from landscaping or building, I play tennis with my brother. Lgf time suffers...

73 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:13:49pm

Heh...

74 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:16:07pm

Oh, and for the record, this moderate republican (I know, it's like saying I'm a wooly mammoth) thinks that Rick Perry can suck it.

75 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:16:24pm

re: #73 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Dude!

76 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:18:55pm

re: #75 Aceofwhat?

How's it going? Nice to see ya!

It's my birthday! Send me money!

77 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:19:34pm

re: #69 albusteve

my business was building or rebuilding houses...LGF and Xboxes were an unthinkable diversion...I just can't imagine the typical workplace today...if I found anybody on my office surfing the net, they would be instantly fired...old fashioned eh?

We had a crackdown at my job. Sad, but we all use our smartphones now. It's better for them, but not quite.

Yeah, I understand the productivity issue. It's pretty fucked. I remember after 911 we didn't work at all, just surfed the web.

78 Varek Raith  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:21:46pm

re: #68 Aceofwhat?

I have gone from nobody to near-platinum status on Delta in about nine months. I didn't buy the wifi but the delta sky club lounges...yeah. Those are niiice...

Look at you Mr Fancypants.
:P

79 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:21:52pm

re: #70 Aceofwhat?

Girlfriend! Brantley + Weis = championship! I can feel it!

Oh I dont at all! I haven't checked other polls, but ESPN doesn't even have us in the top 25. Ugh.

Oh and FSU is #5. My hate will flow.

80 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:22:46pm

re: #72 Aceofwhat?

Eh, I don't mind as much as other people. On the plane, i have peace and quiet! I read...it's so nice to have a few hours to read each week.

And then during the week, my father (who works in Columbus as well, his contacts led to my job) and I have been working on a cabin and land that he bought outside of town. my brother goes to Ohio state, so when i take a break from landscaping or building, I play tennis with my brother. Lgf time suffers...

That doesn't sound too bad. Especially the handy tennis partner.

81 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:22:49pm

re: #76 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

How's it going? Nice to see ya!

It's my birthday! Send me money!

Happy birthday! Where's the cake? Oh, and if you'll just send me your bank account and routing numbers, I'll wire the birthday money. Really. I am not in Nigeria right now.

82 Varek Raith  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:23:48pm

re: #76 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

How's it going? Nice to see ya!

It's my birthday! Send me money!

You're are such a wh...
Nevermind.
/

83 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:24:01pm

re: #76 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

How's it going? Nice to see ya!

It's my birthday! Send me money!

Really, AGAIN? Wasn't your birthday a month ago? Or did the year fricking pass that fast?

84 Varek Raith  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:24:25pm

re: #82 Varek Raith

You're are such a wh...
Nevermind.
/

And I can't spell!

85 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:24:49pm

re: #78 Varek Raith

It's dangerous in there. Open bar plus tanqueray equals danger zone...

86 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:25:31pm

re: #83 Stanley Sea

Nah. It took a full year.

87 Varek Raith  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:26:00pm

re: #85 Aceofwhat?

It's dangerous in there. Open bar plus tanqueray equals danger zone...

Get..hic. outtatheway, I cahicn fly!

88 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:26:46pm

re: #86 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Nah. It took a full year.

Happy Birthday from your memory plagued friend!

Chocolate icing!!!

89 shai_au  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:28:04pm

re: #14 Alexzander

Anyone watch that Ron Paul ad I posted?

It is basically casting him as "THE ONE" which is amusing as that was one of the first attack memes against Obama.

I know that Ron Paul isn't particularly well-liked on here, but it is a bit weird just how completely he gets ignored by the media - even after doing so well in the Iowa straw poll. The Tea Party should love him!

90 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:28:30pm

re: #79 Stanley Sea

Oh I dont at all! I haven't checked other polls, but ESPN doesn't even have us in the top 25. Ugh.

Oh and FSU is #5. My hate will flow.

Don't we play this year? OU vs. FSU..Should be great.. I bought Ball State and OU tickets this year..The 4th game here in Norman..
I can't wait to see Ball State (Indiana college) play here in Norman...
We call Ball State Testicle Tech in Indiana...

91 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:28:37pm

re: #79 Stanley Sea

Oh I dont at all! I haven't checked other polls, but ESPN doesn't even have us in the top 25. Ugh.

Oh and FSU is #5. My hate will flow.

Seriously. At least when they had Bowden there was a little human part of me that thought "well, it's hard to hate the Paternos and Bowdens of the world."

That little voice is gone now. I am alone with my hate;)

92 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:29:13pm

re: #90 HoosierHoops

Dude, I hate FSU with the white hot fire thingy. Kill em.

93 Varek Raith  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:29:48pm

re: #92 Stanley Sea

Dude, I hate FSU with the white hot fire thingy. Kill em.

Ok...
You are clearly crazy.
:)

94 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:29:51pm

re: #91 Aceofwhat?

Seriously. At least when they had Bowden there was a little human part of me that thought "well, it's hard to hate the Paternos and Bowdens of the world."

That little voice is gone now. I am alone with my hate;)

No you are not.

I have some friends in a mixed marriage. UF/FSU. The horror.

95 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:29:54pm

re: #84 Varek Raith

And I can't spell!

Ya, you didnt even try to finish "whelp". Have another gin & tonic...

96 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:31:57pm

re: #90 HoosierHoops

Don't we play this year? OU vs. FSU..Should be great.. I bought Ball State and OU tickets this year..The 4th game here in Norman..
I can't wait to see Ball State (Indiana college) play here in Norman...
We call Ball State Testicle Tech in Indiana...

Hoopster! I am with my girl Stanley on this one. I'll be rooting for OU mainly out of a nasty urge to see FSU fail.

97 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:34:11pm

re: #89 shai_au

I know that Ron Paul isn't particularly well-liked on here, but it is a bit weird just how completely he gets ignored by the media - even after doing so well in the Iowa straw poll. The Tea Party should love him!

Believe he's the one who started the whole TP movement. Heck, I remember when Paul was having Tea Parties, the conservatives I knew shrugged them off because of Paul's involvement since they had no use for his interventionist or there lack of views. I think it's fair to say Paul's been ignored by the media and I am not a fan of the man. Bachmann gets more attention and she's got less of a congressional track record than he does since I believe Paul unlike Bachmann has actually gotten stuff passed.

98 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:34:36pm

re: #94 Stanley Sea

No you are not.

I have some friends in a mixed marriage. UF/FSU. The horror.

Frickin hormones. Bumbling merrily along in life, and then BOOM. You wake up next to the devil.

99 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:36:08pm

For some reason, I always disliked FSU. Now, it may sound silly because he's pretty much revilled but I remember rooting for Virginia Tech with a Freshman Michael Vick at QB (I'm a Virginia native after all) against FSU for the 2001 National Championship. I think what annoyed me about FSU was that they had 29 year old Chris Weinke at QB. Just seemed oh so lame.

100 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:36:33pm

re: #71 Aceofwhat?

Nah, I think that it's more about the kind of work that a lot of people do. Folks who are computer-bound have an easier time getting work done while keeping an eye on the net. I'm helping to manage a small business, so I am rarely sitting still long enough to check the weather, much less lgf.

sorry, phone calls...
anyway I guess I live in the Old World...I assume that productivity requires a certain focus, like on the job you were hired for...I only have my own thing to judge it from

101 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:37:02pm

re: #92 Stanley Sea

Dude, I hate FSU with the white hot fire thingy. Kill em.

You know what is funny? Every College plays a few non-conference games every year.. They make tons of money off of those games..
This year..The #1 football team in America is playing a small little college from Indiana..They will destroy Ball State but Ball State will make millions from the game...How would you like to be the Coach.. Look Kids..You are going to get the holy shit beat out you tonight.. But don't worry.. The College will make out like Bandits..Thank you for being hurt and destroyed for 2 million...College Sports...All about the money

102 wrenchwench  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:38:18pm

re: #74 Aceofwhat?

Oh, and for the record, this moderate republican (I know, it's like saying I'm a wooly mammoth) thinks that Rick Perry can suck it.

Somebody drew you a picture, didn't they...

103 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:38:55pm

re: #99 HappyWarrior

For some reason, I always disliked FSU. Now, it may sound silly because he's pretty much revilled but I remember rooting for Virginia Tech with a Freshman Michael Vick at QB (I'm a Virginia native after all) against FSU for the 2001 National Championship. I think what annoyed me about FSU was that they had 29 year old Chris Weinke at QB. Just seemed oh so lame.

for some reason I always hated Ohio State...I hate those fuckers...I'm a UM drone I guess

104 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:40:17pm

re: #98 Aceofwhat?

Frickin hormones. Bumbling merrily along in life, and then BOOM. You wake up next to the devil.

LOL! For real. I haven't talked to them in about a year, wonder if they made it.

Good tidbit about them, she was FSU band. Got to go to every game, basketball & football. She was a rabid fan because. Oh well.

105 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:41:07pm

re: #101 HoosierHoops

You know what is funny? Every College plays a few non-conference games every year.. They make tons of money off of those games..
This year..The #1 football team in America is playing a small little college from Indiana..They will destroy Ball State but Ball State will make millions from the game...How would you like to be the Coach.. Look Kids..You are going to get the holy shit beat out you tonight.. But don't worry.. The College will make out like Bandits..Thank you for being hurt and destroyed for 2 million...College Sports...All about the money

my school Western Mi University would go over to A2 and get crushed every time...the constant humiliation for money gets old fast....fuck that

106 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:41:25pm

re: #103 albusteve

for some reason I always hated Ohio State...I hate those fuckers...I'm a UM drone I guess

I don't blame ya. OSU always rubbed me the wrong way too and now as you know they're in trouble with the NCAA.

107 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:41:57pm

re: #99 HappyWarrior

For some reason, I always disliked FSU. Now, it may sound silly because he's pretty much revilled but I remember rooting for Virginia Tech with a Freshman Michael Vick at QB (I'm a Virginia native after all) against FSU for the 2001 National Championship. I think what annoyed me about FSU was that they had 29 year old Chris Weinke at QB. Just seemed oh so lame.

It WAS lame. Didn't Weinke become a member of the Heisman hall of shame? gah

108 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:42:22pm

re: #100 albusteve

You're a self-made dude, which isn't a common trait. On the other hand, sometimes folks are hired for a job where the work comes in fits and starts. In that case, the manager bears responsibility for lining up secondary tasks for people when there isnt anything else to do. Being on the Internet isn't much different than hanging around the water cooler, IMHO. Just a different medium. And water is bad for the computer.

109 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:43:07pm

If my university (George Mason) ever adopted a football program, it probably would be one of those bottom feeders like what is being talked about. I've never had a college football team that I root for but I like teams that have strong D's and smashmouth offense. Probably why I adopted the Steelers with Bettis as my NFL team in the 90's when I was a kid. Didn't hurt that I have loads of family ties to Pittsburgh either.

110 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:43:17pm

re: #102 wrenchwench

Somebody drew you a picture, didn't they...

That is so wrong, it's right. Nicely done.

111 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:43:22pm

re: #101 HoosierHoops

You know what is funny? Every College plays a few non-conference games every year.. They make tons of money off of those games..
This year..The #1 football team in America is playing a small little college from Indiana..They will destroy Ball State but Ball State will make millions from the game...How would you like to be the Coach.. Look Kids..You are going to get the holy shit beat out you tonight.. But don't worry.. The College will make out like Bandits..Thank you for being hurt and destroyed for 2 million...College Sports...All about the money

Yeah, you are correct. Ball State = Letterman, correct?

112 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:44:00pm

re: #106 HappyWarrior

I don't blame ya. OSU always rubbed me the wrong way too and now as you know they're in trouble with the NCAA.

big time trouble, even epic
fuck them...I hate those guys
btw I hate Notre Dame too

113 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:44:21pm

re: #103 albusteve

for some reason I always hated Ohio State...I hate those fuckers...I'm a UM drone I guess

Heh. It's been a bad decade to be a wolverine...

114 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:44:27pm

re: #105 albusteve

my school Western Mi University would go over to A2 and get crushed every time...the constant humiliation for money gets old fast...fuck that

It has become all about the money in College Sports these days...

115 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:44:29pm

re: #102 wrenchwench

Somebody drew you a picture, didn't they...

The trifecta.

116 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:44:54pm

re: #107 Stanley Sea

It WAS lame. Didn't Weinke become a member of the Heisman hall of shame? gah

I am not sure. I just remember finding it pathetic that here's this 29 year old QB older than many NFL players going against Mike Vick who was fresh out of high school and as I said, it didn't hurt that Virginia Tech was representing my state either. And this was of course before we found out Vick was a bit of a dick.

117 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:45:16pm

re: #39 wrenchwench

OK, I gave it a test drive. It works great, just like it did before. But the categories-- they're HUGE!

Only drawback: the subheading line for snark doesn't show up in the Preview. And you know I'm Preview-dependent. (We're no longer just friends.)

Other than that, it's perfect, just like it was before.

You reminded me that I've been meaning to debug the preview function, and it should be much better now. Much closer to what it looks like when posted.

118 wrenchwench  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:45:20pm

re: #110 Aceofwhat?

That is so wrong, it's right. Nicely done.

I stole it from a Killgore comment on a previous thread. You provided the opportunity for a repost.

SEE, YOU ARE NEEDED HERE!

119 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:45:42pm

re: #106 HappyWarrior

I don't blame ya. OSU always rubbed me the wrong way too and now as you know they're in trouble with the NCAA.

OSU is TOAST with the NCAA. And sweatervest is finis. (which was huge)

120 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:46:06pm

re: #112 albusteve

big time trouble, even epic
fuck them...I hate those guys
btw I hate Notre Dame too

Yeah I find Notre Dame annoying because it seems they get special perks and they've done nothing to deserve it in recent years.

121 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:46:27pm

re: #104 Stanley Sea

LOL! For real. I haven't talked to them in about a year, wonder if they made it.

Good tidbit about them, she was FSU band. Got to go to every game, basketball & football. She was a rabid fan because. Oh well.

One of my cousins was a Marching 100.

122 wrenchwench  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:46:36pm

re: #117 Charles

You reminded me that I've been meaning to debug the preview function, and it should be much better now. Much closer to what it looks like when posted.

Off for another test drive...is the tank full?

123 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:48:14pm

re: #107 Stanley Sea

It WAS lame. Didn't Weinke become a member of the Heisman hall of shame? gah

seriously. And if I may be petty (it's FSU after all), dude looked like he was 29 going on 40. Looked like Trent Dilfer had put the pads back on for one more frat party...

124 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:48:53pm

re: #108 Aceofwhat?

You're a self-made dude, which isn't a common trait. On the other hand, sometimes folks are hired for a job where the work comes in fits and starts. In that case, the manager bears responsibility for lining up secondary tasks for people when there isnt anything else to do. Being on the Internet isn't much different than hanging around the water cooler, IMHO. Just a different medium. And water is bad for the computer.

I'd go nuts...I love a lot of activity and pressure...there is always stuff to do in the construction racket...and if you pounded it out for me for a full day and then some, I treated you like a prince, or princess....we made money, and lots of it toward the end for me, and I spread it around as best I could

125 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:49:11pm

re: #116 HappyWarrior

I am not sure. I just remember finding it pathetic that here's this 29 year old QB older than many NFL players going against Mike Vick who was fresh out of high school and as I said, it didn't hurt that Virginia Tech was representing my state either. And this was of course before we found out Vick was a bit of a dick.

I may incur the wrath of those here, but Vick has been redeemed in my eyes. Did his time and working on the rehab. I love the Eagles.

126 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:50:41pm

re: #119 Stanley Sea

OSU is TOAST with the NCAA. And sweatervest is finis. (which was huge)

You know..They did get penalties and stuff..But they didn't get the death Penalty like SMU..They will be back in a few years..
I will never forgive Greg Odem leaving Indy to play ball at OSU...This may sound mean.But he has been hurt every year.. I love him as an athlete..But I don't care..It's called Karma bitch...
/

127 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:50:44pm

re: #113 Aceofwhat?

Heh. It's been a bad decade to be a wolverine...

yeah...and easily the coolest helmets in all of football...but the cool helmet guys suck

128 PhillyPretzel  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:50:45pm

re: #125 Stanley Sea
I am not a big Eagles fan, but when the Eagles win it is a good thing. :)

129 Varek Raith  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:51:08pm

re: #125 Stanley Sea

I may incur the wrath of those here, but Vick has been redeemed in my eyes. Did his time and working on the rehab. I love the Eagles.

We found a witch Sire, may we burn her?
/

130 PhillyPretzel  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:52:38pm

re: #129 Varek Raith
::: pulling out the fire hose which is connected to a hydrant :::

131 Varek Raith  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:53:29pm

re: #130 PhillyPretzel

::: pulling out the fire hose which is connected to a hydrant :::

Fine.
*Drops 20 megaton bomb*
I know, I don't play fair.
;)

132 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:54:02pm

re: #126 HoosierHoops

You know..They did get penalties and stuff..But they didn't get the death Penalty like SMU..They will be back in a few years..
I will never forgive Greg Odem leaving Indy to play ball at OSU...This may sound mean.But he has been hurt every year.. I love him as an athlete..But I don't care..It's called Karma bitch...
/

Greg Odem was such a bust. Kevin Durant all the way.

133 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:54:16pm

re: #118 wrenchwench

I stole it from a Killgore comment on a previous thread. You provided the opportunity for a repost.

SEE, YOU ARE NEEDED HERE!

Normally this would be the spot where a republican protests about providing a platform for the ridicule of another republican...but frickin Rick Perry...the creationist stench is offensive from halfway across the nation. What a nincompoop.

134 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:54:17pm

re: #128 PhillyPretzel

I am not a big Eagles fan, but when the Eagles win it is a good thing. :)

Eagles fans are like millions of Charles Mansons...
they should all be locked up

135 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:55:18pm

re: #129 Varek Raith

We found a witch Sire, may we burn her?
/

We did do the nose...

136 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:55:48pm

re: #128 PhillyPretzel

I am not a big Eagles fan, but when the Eagles win it is a good thing. :)

Boy did they load up this year! People are calling them possible SuperBowl Winners..What the heck was that movie about the Eagles with Mark Walberg? Invincible or something..Great football movie..Not as good as the Blind Side..Which I think is the top 5 football movie of all time

137 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:56:05pm

re: #128 PhillyPretzel

I am not a big Eagles fan, but when the Eagles win it is a good thing. :)

Steelers eh? My Dad is from Allentown. He dies for the Eagles. It's been kinda hilarious to watch my very racist Fox News watching Dad cheer Michael Vick. He;s a pure fan.

138 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:56:22pm

re: #126 HoosierHoops

You know..They did get penalties and stuff..But they didn't get the death Penalty like SMU..They will be back in a few years..
I will never forgive Greg Odem leaving Indy to play ball at OSU...This may sound mean.But he has been hurt every year.. I love him as an athlete..But I don't care..It's called Karma bitch...
/

It's a shame, though. Oden's commercials were gold. Pure gold.

139 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:56:23pm

Eagles fans are the worst human beings since people were invented...there is no close second

140 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:57:30pm

re: #126 HoosierHoops

You know..They did get penalties and stuff..But they didn't get the death Penalty like SMU..They will be back in a few years..
I will never forgive Greg Odem leaving Indy to play ball at OSU...This may sound mean.But he has been hurt every year.. I love him as an athlete..But I don't care..It's called Karma bitch...
/

How bout Dennis Rodman on Friday in Springfield? He still knows how to grab attention.

141 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:57:46pm

re: #136 HoosierHoops

Boy did they load up this year! People are calling them possible SuperBowl Winners..What the heck was that movie about the Eagles with Mark Walberg? Invincible or something..Great football movie..Not as good as the Blind Side..Which I think is the top 5 football movie of all time

they have to get past the Cowboys first....Vick will not play 16 games

142 PhillyPretzel  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:57:58pm

re: #134 albusteve
That is why there is "Eagles Court." Judge Seamus Patrick McCaffrey started it. He gets to watch the game and fine unruly fans.

143 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:58:44pm

I remember the Durant-Oden debates. So many analysts thought that Oden would be this once in a generation type guy and I remember not being too sure. Granted, basketball is a sport I merely enjoy playing and am not the best at analyzing talent in but I thought Kevin Durant was a pretty special guy based on what I had seen in that year's NCAAs. I like Kevin though. He's form the DC area. Now, I was really disappointed that my high school classmate Scottie Reynolds didn't make it to the NBA. He had that big shot against Pitt that got Nova in to the Final Four and I thought that would really help his profile (And boy oh boy did I feel conflicted about that game since my grandfather and godmother were both Pitt alums). He's now in the Phillipine league. I really hope he can make the pros someday. A nice guy and truly humble. You see some jocks in high school who act like they're top shit but Scottie was never that guy.

144 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:59:04pm

re: #139 albusteve

Eagles fans are the worst human beings since people were invented...there is no close second

OK, I hate the Michael Irvin fan reaction. HATE IT. But come on. It's been a few years.

145 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:59:15pm

Back in a min. dad and brother have been working on the big 1966 John Deere, and I am bartending.

146 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:59:29pm

re: #142 PhillyPretzel

That is why there is "Eagles Court." Judge Seamus Patrick McCaffrey started it. He gets to watch the game and fine unruly fans.

imagine...a jail inside the stadium...
neanderthals

147 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 5:59:57pm

Hey B_Sharp, are you at the keyboard?

148 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:00:32pm

re: #140 _RememberTonyC

Nice to see you. I've been hanging recently with some Bostonians. Oh you guys are a bunch. They are still watching the Bruins replays. Daily.

149 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:01:57pm

re: #144 Stanley Sea

OK, I hate the Michael Irvin fan reaction. HATE IT. But come on. It's been a few years.

Eagles fans have always been subhuman...always, for decades...centuries even...vile people

150 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:02:03pm

The Red Sox turned a triple play tonight ... Last night the Brewers turned one too. And Jacoby Ellsbury just went deep ... He is a dark horse MVP candidate.

151 wrenchwench  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:02:24pm

re: #117 Charles

You reminded me that I've been meaning to debug the preview function, and it should be much better now. Much closer to what it looks like when posted.

It's great! Seems a bit faster, too, but slowness is usually on my end.

152 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:02:58pm

re: #146 albusteve

imagine...a jail inside the stadium...
neanderthals

There's a jail inside Qualcomm (Chargers) I'm sure there's one in every stadium. How do I know? My 4'11" girlfriend ended up there. Too many tequila shots, oh and she lit a cig in the stands.

153 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:03:36pm

re: #133 Aceofwhat?

Normally this would be the spot where a republican protests about providing a platform for the ridicule of another republican...but frickin Rick Perry...the creationist stench is offensive from halfway across the nation. What a nincompoop.

Hey Ace. Long time no see.

154 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:03:50pm

re: #148 Stanley Sea

Nice to see you. I've been hanging recently with some Bostonians. Oh you guys are a bunch. They are still watching the Bruins replays. Daily.

Thanks ... same to you ... Most of us Bostonians are a bunch of drunk sports fans. Kind of like Philly fans, but we're toilet trained :)

155 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:04:19pm

re: #150 _RememberTonyC

The Red Sox turned a triple play tonight ... Last night the Brewers turned one too. And Jacoby Ellsbury just went deep ... He is a dark horse MVP candidate.

a triple play...how cool is that!...I'm so old fashioned I miss the squeeze play...when was the last time home was stolen on the pitch?

156 PhillyPretzel  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:04:34pm

re: #154 _RememberTonyC
LOL

157 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:04:58pm

re: #140 _RememberTonyC

How bout Dennis Rodman on Friday in Springfield? He still knows how to grab attention.

The worst speeches of all time are the HOF NBA inductees..Just the worst..unbearable and like Oscar speeches thanking everyone in the world.. I'd like to thank my mother's Brothers best friend and my step dad..
Oh just shut the hell up..Who Cares!
Every year I watch the NFL HOF speeches and cry at least once..I am so inspired by them..It is agreed generally that the greatest HOF speech of all Time was this year's Shannon Sharp.. I was so inspired...I had tears flowing down my face.. It made me want to be a better Man.. I went to work Monday Morning convinced I would be the best there was.. The best I could be.. Every year I get so inspired..What stories

158 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:05:19pm

re: #152 Stanley Sea

There's a jail inside Qualcomm (Chargers) I'm sure there's one in every stadium. How do I know? My 4'11" girlfriend ended up there. Too many tequila shots, oh and she lit a cig in the stands.

in Philly it's a court with a judge and prosecutors...not just a brig

159 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:05:23pm

re: #153 b_sharp

Thanks for the CPUID utility. Interesting info there.

160 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:05:46pm

re: #155 albusteve

a triple play...how cool is that!...I'm so old fashioned I miss the squeeze play...when was the last time home was stolen on the pitch?

Ellsbury stole home on a regular pitch 2 or 3 years ago ...

161 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:06:44pm

By the way: a tip on using blockquotes, for all LGF Page authors!

When you include a quote from an article, please make sure to surround it with <blockquote> tags, to make it clear what part of the post is your writing, and what part came from the linked article.

And when you use a blockquoted section, put blank lines before and after the blockquote. This helps our CSS apply the proper styles to everything.

162 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:06:45pm

re: #154 _RememberTonyC

Thanks ... same to you ... Most of us Bostonians are a bunch of drunk sports fans. Kind of like Philly fans, but we're toilet trained :)

I was shown those commercials with the Bruin (Bear) "Rules" This one is the best ever. I'm dying laughing now after PIMF!!

Youtube Video
163 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:07:14pm

re: #147 Rightwingconspirator

Hey B_Sharp, are you at the keyboard?

I am now.

You need to do something before it can be assumed your system is OC'd. Right after your system shuts down, check the temp of the heat sink. If you touch it with your finger and it's working correctly it should burn.

164 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:07:43pm

re: #153 b_sharp

Hey Ace. Long time no see.

Yeah, seriously. I miss this place something fierce. Good to bump in to you.

165 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:07:53pm

re: #160 _RememberTonyC

Ellsbury stole home on a regular pitch 2 or 3 years ago ...

maybe the greatest play there is in that game...

166 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:08:17pm

re: #157 HoosierHoops

The worst speeches of all time are the HOF NBA inductees..Just the worst..unbearable and like Oscar speeches thanking everyone in the world.. I'd like to thank my mother's Brothers best friend and my step dad..
Oh just shut the hell up..Who Cares!
Every year I watch the NFL HOF speeches and cry at least once..I am so inspired by them..It is agreed generally that the greatest HOF speech of all Time was this year's Shannon Sharp.. I was so inspired...I had tears flowing down my face.. It made me want to be a better Man.. I went to work Monday Morning convinced I would be the best there was.. The best I could be.. Every year I get so inspired..What stories

Michael Irvin's speech in 2007 was even better. Watch it on You Tube ... It was amazing. Sharpe was great this year ... So was Deion.

Chris Mullin's HOF speech on Friday was perfect. He is a great man and he did it exactly right.

167 wrenchwench  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:09:18pm

Time to feed the kittehs.

Later, lizards.

Image: funny-pictures-fuck-yeah-bro.jpg

168 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:09:26pm

re: #162 Stanley Sea

I was shown those commercials with the Bruin (Bear) "Rules" This one is the best ever. I'm dying laughing now after PIMF!!

[Video]

Watch it! I'm off to vons for some avocados and burrito fixins.

169 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:10:09pm

re: #162 Stanley Sea

I was shown those commercials with the Bruin (Bear) "Rules" This one is the best ever. I'm dying laughing now after PIMF!!

[Video]

Ugh ... The iPad won't let me play it ...

170 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:10:20pm

re: #163 b_sharp

Okay I can do that in a moment. On CPUID it says the multiplier is x 24,0, and CPU speed is 3211.6 MHZ or a little higher. Idle temp is 49c. In a air conditioned room 75F.

171 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:10:38pm

re: #168 Stanley Sea

Watch it! I'm off to vons for some avocados and burrito fixins.

Stay down wind, 'K?

172 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:11:10pm

BRB shutting down a sec...

173 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:12:13pm

re: #166 _RememberTonyC

Michael Irvin's speech in 2007 was even better. Watch it on You Tube ... It was amazing. Sharpe was great this year ... So was Deion.

Chris Mullin's HOF speech on Friday was perfect. He is a great man and he did it exactly right.

I saw Chris play live at Golden State and with the Pacers...Amazing player..
Think we need a top five list of all the greatest players that WE have seen live..Kobe..Shaq..King..Sprelwell...Bird..The Chief was amazing

174 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:12:40pm

re: #169 _RememberTonyC

So I'm surfing on my brothers iPad tonight...I kinda like typing on a flat surface. But I think I'm in the minority on that subject.

175 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:12:43pm

re: #170 Rightwingconspirator

Okay I can do that in a moment. On CPUID it says the multiplier is x 24,0, and CPU speed is 3211.6 MHZ or a little higher. Idle temp is 49c. In a air conditioned room 75F.

What i7 is it?

Your idle temp is a bit high, but nothing outrageous. Max temp on an i7 is about 100c.

176 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:13:18pm

re: #174 Aceofwhat?

So I'm surfing on my brothers iPad tonight...I kinda like typing on a flat surface. But I think I'm in the minority on that subject.

I hate typing on my iPad.

177 Interesting Times  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:13:31pm

re: #71 Aceofwhat?

Nah, I think that it's more about the kind of work that a lot of people do. Folks who are computer-bound have an easier time getting work done while keeping an eye on the net.

And it actually makes them *more* productive!

Bosses may have it all wrong when they assume that funny cat videos and FAIL slideshows are a drain on the workplace. Some new research finds that a moderate amount of mindless web surfing actually makes workers more productive at their jobs.

And the more mindless the surfing, the better.

"Employees who browse the web more end up being more engaged at work, so why fight that if it's in moderation?" says Don J.Q. Chen, a researcher at the National University of Singapore and a co-author of the new report, presented Tuesday at the annual meeting of the Academy of Management.

Although personal web browsing is generally seen as a workplace problem, Chen and his colleague, Vivien K. G. Lim, set out to determine if so-called "cyberloafing" had any benefits. They found that not only did it refresh workers after long work stretches, it made workers more productive than if they'd been given time to talk or text with friends or send personal emails.

178 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:13:40pm

re: #173 HoosierHoops

I saw Chris play live at Golden State and with the Pacers...Amazing player..
Think we need a top five list of all the greatest players that WE have seen live..Kobe..Shaq..King..Sprelwell...Bird..The Chief was amazing

Reggie Miller. Madison Square Garden. eight seconds I'll never forget...

179 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:14:13pm

re: #173 HoosierHoops

I saw Chris play live at Golden State and with the Pacers...Amazing player..
Think we need a top five list of all the greatest players that WE have seen live..Kobe..Shaq..King..Sprelwell...Bird..The Chief was amazing

MJ ... Timmy ... Pippen

... I gotta run for now ... Will try to BBL.

180 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:14:27pm

re: #173 HoosierHoops

I saw Chris play live at Golden State and with the Pacers...Amazing player..
Think we need a top five list of all the greatest players that WE have seen live..Kobe..Shaq..King..Sprelwell...Bird..The Chief was amazing

Jabbar, Jordan, MJ, Thomas, Ewing, on and on

181 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:15:14pm

re: #178 Aceofwhat?

Reggie Miller. Madison Square Garden. eight seconds I'll never forget...

I saw Reggie's retirement game.. He was great

182 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:16:26pm

re: #178 Aceofwhat?

Reggie Miller. Madison Square Garden. eight seconds I'll never forget...

Miller was a back breaker...the opposing O would work so hard then Reggie would take it away in a blink

183 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:16:27pm

re: #177 publicityStunted

No question that intense work needs frequent breaks, or it can't be sustained. People are a little like engines...you cant redline them all day.

184 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:19:45pm

re: #175 b_sharp

I have the 950. 4 core 8 thread.

185 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:22:46pm

Bert and Ernie

Youtube Video
186 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:23:29pm

re: #176 b_sharp

I hate the different feedback sensitivities of different physical keyboards. My dream keyboard has always been an outline on a table that could respond to touch. A little bigger and this screen thingy is going to be the balls.

187 laZardo  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:26:11pm

re: #173 HoosierHoops

Shaq will never return to the Lakers.

;_;

188 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:26:49pm

re: #186 Aceofwhat?

once it's a little bigger, this screen thingy is going to be the balls.

pimf. I should know better than to talk and type.

189 Interesting Times  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:27:05pm

re: #183 Aceofwhat?

Exactly. And welcome back, by the way :) I wished you were around during all the Fukushima discussions, because if there was ever a blunt reminder on the benefits of Thorium vs legacy nuclear energy, that was it :/

190 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:28:35pm

re: #184 Rightwingconspirator

I have the 950. 4 core 8 thread.

Your multiplier should be 23, clock speed should be 3.06 GHz with a max of 3.33 GHz boost (turbo).

How is the temp of your heat sink?

191 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:30:03pm

Cool - I just won the 2500 followers badge.

192 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:30:20pm

re: #186 Aceofwhat?

I hate the different feedback sensitivities of different physical keyboards. My dream keyboard has always been an outline on a table that could respond to touch. A little bigger and this screen thingy is going to be the balls.

I guess I'm too old school. I much prefer the feel of a real keyboard.

I do believe the keyboard and mouse will disappear within a very few years.

193 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:32:55pm

re: #190 b_sharp

Just warm, but at a CPU temp of 46c I would not expect it to be really hot. I'll fire up adobe media encoder and let it get to 90c and then touch the heat sink. I have a temp data logger I may rig a thermocouple to the heat sink and track it for a day or two. Or maybe in the air from that fan.

194 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:33:23pm

re: #191 Charles

Cool - I just won the 2500 followers badge.

I have the fire starter's badge.

195 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:33:44pm

re: #189 publicityStunted

Exactly. And welcome back, by the way :) I wished you were around during all the Fukushima discussions, because if there was ever a blunt reminder on the benefits of Thorium vs legacy nuclear energy, that was it :/

Right??? Passive feedback / safety built-in to the system, and the fuel is proliferation-proof? I'm quivering with frustration over here!

(and thanks for the nice thing you said there)

196 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:36:02pm

re: #73 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Heh...

[Link: www.cardcow.com...]

[Link: www.boredstop.com...]

[Link: www.doheth.co.uk...]

197 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:36:24pm

re: #193 Rightwingconspirator

Just warm, but at a CPU temp of 46c I would not expect it to be really hot. I'll fire up adobe media encoder and let it get to 90c and then touch the heat sink. I have a temp data logger I may rig a thermocouple to the heat sink and track it for a day or two. Or maybe in the air from that fan.

There is a problem with i7 and the Intel heat sink where the heat sink does not seat perfectly. I've never had the problem, but I was talking to a friend who has had the problem.

It does look like you are a bit OC'd, btw.

198 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:36:44pm

re: #187 laZardo

Shaq will never return to the Lakers.

;_;

Maybe to whoop Kobe's ass one good time and then retire.

199 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:38:23pm

re: #189 publicityStunted

Exactly. And welcome back, by the way :) I wished you were around during all the Fukushima discussions, because if there was ever a blunt reminder on the benefits of Thorium vs legacy nuclear energy, that was it :/

Although all gen-III+ legacy nuke reactors have passive safety systems, so half of the debate is about the folly of what Germany did. Halting the construction of new reactors is batty. The safest reactor is a new reactor.

200 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:40:37pm

Ghost Riders

Youtube Video
201 Obdicut  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:40:53pm

re: #199 Aceofwhat?

Well, the safest reactor is a well-regulated one that actually gets inspected and follows safety protocols. Cutting corners (as well as bad design) was a big problem at Fukushima, and it's a problem at a lot of plants here in the US. Hopefully those companies can be prodded into compliance before we have a major accident that really sours the public on it.

202 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:41:02pm

re: #193 Rightwingconspirator

Just warm, but at a CPU temp of 46c I would not expect it to be really hot. I'll fire up adobe media encoder and let it get to 90c and then touch the heat sink. I have a temp data logger I may rig a thermocouple to the heat sink and track it for a day or two. Or maybe in the air from that fan.

You might be interested in this site.

203 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:41:47pm

re: #197 b_sharp

There is a problem with i7 and the Intel heat sink where the heat sink does not seat perfectly. I've never had the problem, but I was talking to a friend who has had the problem.

It does look like you are a bit OC'd, btw.

Well then maybe a swap far a water cooling is best. I do not want to slow this thing down, it adds too much time to the work. Nor do I want to have to cool the room to 60F! We have our heat waves here we expect 100 degrees tomorrow.

Interestingly, if I use Adobe Premier to encode the media this does not happen quite so severely. The CPUs run at a varying capacity, apparently enough to avoid a severe overheat. But Adobe Media Encoder just racks all 4 to 100 % with a few breaks down to 98%. I guess the software and hardware are just maxing out the resources.

204 albusteve  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:41:47pm

whoops...
Ghost Riders In The Sky
Outlaws

Youtube Video
205 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:42:54pm

re: #201 Obdicut

Well, the safest reactor is a well-regulated one that actually gets inspected and follows safety protocols. Cutting corners (as well as bad design) was a big problem at Fukushima, and it's a problem at a lot of plants here in the US. Hopefully those companies can be prodded into compliance before we have a major accident that really sours the public on it.

Nothing to argue with there. Good to see you. Hope you're doing well. I've made an improvement to my backhand, so on balance I'd say that things are looking up for me...

206 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:44:23pm

re: #192 b_sharp

I guess I'm too old school. I much prefer the feel of a real keyboard.

I do believe the keyboard and mouse will disappear within a very few years.

I'm not so sure.I think you shoul look differently at the future.We had a geek meeting in the cubes this morning drinking coffee..
We think the future is the smartphone...The phone in your pocket will drive a Big screen Hi-Def, Bluetooth mouse and keyboard...You could dock it for TB's of space..But Why bother? You have near unlimited space in the cloud available on demand..You could drive an iPad device from the phone in your pocket...Imagine bluetooth 5 years from now..It could drive a lot of devices..The future is bright
/Hey who stole my sunglasses?

207 Interesting Times  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:45:26pm

re: #199 Aceofwhat?

Although all gen-III+ legacy nuke reactors have passive safety systems, so half of the debate is about the folly of what Germany did. Halting the construction of new reactors is batty. The safest reactor is a new reactor.

It just kills me to think that, if Fukushima had been thorium-based, the entire meltdown (and the increasingly desperate, absurd measures to halt it) would never have taken place:

The reactor that saves itself

“The reactor has an amazing safety feature,” said Kirk Sorensen, a former NASA engineer at Teledyne Brown and a thorium expert.

“If it begins to overheat, a little plug melts and the salts drain into a pan. There is no need for computers, or the sort of electrical pumps that were crippled by the tsunami. The reactor saves itself,” he said.

“They operate at atmospheric pressure so you don't have the sort of hydrogen explosions we've seen in Japan. One of these reactors would have come through the tsunami just fine. There would have been no radiation release.”

208 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:45:28pm

re: #202 b_sharp

You might be interested in this site.

That's a lot of choices! Thanks for the advice.

209 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:47:00pm

re: #206 HoosierHoops

I'm not so sure.I think you shoul look differently at the future.We had a geek meeting in the cubes this morning drinking coffee..
We think the future is the smartphone...The phone in your pocket will drive a Big screen Hi-Def, Bluetooth mouse and keyboard...You could dock it for TB's of space..But Why bother? You have near unlimited space in the cloud available on demand..You could drive an iPad device from the phone in your pocket...Imagine bluetooth 5 years from now..It could drive a lot of devices..The future is bright
/Hey who stole my sunglasses?

My thunderbolt is the shizniggity. Verizon's 4g is so fast that I often forget I'm not on wifi. You're on target, IMHO.

210 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:49:57pm

re: #207 publicityStunted

It just kills me to think that, if Fukushima had been thorium-based, the entire meltdown (and the increasingly desperate, absurd measures to halt it) would never have taken place:

The reactor that saves itself

And thorium is so plentiful...*sob*

211 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:51:39pm

re: #207 publicityStunted

It just kills me to think that, if Fukushima had been thorium-based, the entire meltdown (and the increasingly desperate, absurd measures to halt it) would never have taken place:

The reactor that saves itself

Evening all.

And the amount of thorium is huge. No nasty waste products during fuel prep. There really is no downside to the stuff.

(But, A_B, it's radioactive!)

So is your granite counter top. Quitcherbitchin.

Oh and I see that Juggs has now equated the SPLC and Soros to Al Queda downstairs.

Just when you think the gaspers can't get any nuttier, a truckload of Macadamias gets dumped on the street.

212 Interesting Times  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:54:22pm

re: #211 austin_blue

And the amount of thorium is huge. No nasty waste products during fuel prep. There really is no downside to the stuff.

It can't be used to produce metric shit-tons of weapons-grade nuclear material. Which is why it was never developed, and we got stuck with ThreeMileChernoShima instead :(

213 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:58:16pm

re: #211 austin_blue

re: #212 publicityStunted

You are playing my song. I'm gonna go find my guitar...let's sing some Cat Stevens together or something!

214 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 6:59:09pm

re: #208 Rightwingconspirator

That's a lot of choices! Thanks for the advice.

Water cooling is not necessarily the best or the quietest. Here is a review of a water cooler. If you look down the list you'll see the Corsair H50 water cooler.

215 Aceofwhat?  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:01:03pm

Alrighty. God bless you all...I'm gonna do my best to make it back in less than three months...bedtime here.

216 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:01:18pm

re: #213 Aceofwhat?

re: #212 publicityStunted

You are playing my song. I'm gonna go find my guitar...let's sing some Cat Stevens together or something!

Did anyone mention to you we're putting together the LGF band? It has 17 guitarists, 1 keyboardist, 1 drummer and no bass player.

217 prairiefire  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:01:38pm

re: #215 Aceofwhat?

Alrighty. God bless you all...I'm gonna do my best to make it back in less than three months...bedtime here.

Night, Ace.

218 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:02:00pm

re: #212 publicityStunted

It can't be used to produce metric shit-tons of weapons-grade nuclear material. Which is why it was never developed, and we got stuck with ThreeMileChernoShima instead :(

Pitiful, isn't it?

Hey, Dinnerjacket! We're calling your bluff! We will *build* you a nice shiny reactor and supply you with all of the fuel you need to run it, 4evah! We'll even teach you how to process it yourself and give you the engineering plans so you can build as many as you want on your own!

You say your atomic enrichment program is for peaceful purposes? Okey dokey, then. Time to fish or cut bait.

219 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:02:48pm

re: #211 austin_blue

This reactor type is where energy money should go.

Once this design is perfected, start spamming the buggers.

220 Kragar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:03:30pm

Finally got to watch the whole movie 13 Assassins.

Fucking awesome. Every movie needs to have a flaming cattle stampede thru samurais.

221 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:03:33pm

re: #218 austin_blue

Heck, they probably have some thorium themselves.

222 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:04:33pm

re: #207 publicityStunted

It just kills me to think that, if Fukushima had been thorium-based, the entire meltdown (and the increasingly desperate, absurd measures to halt it) would never have taken place:

The reactor that saves itself

The problem with thorium is that when you're out in Silithus trying to mine it, it could be 3:00AM and not a soul in sight, but as soon as you spot a node, some Chinese assclown swoops in on his epic mount and ganks it.

223 Kragar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:05:29pm

re: #222 negativ

The problem with thorium is that when you're out in Silithus trying to mine it, it could be 3:00AM and not a soul in sight, but as soon as you spot a node, some Chinese assclown swoops in on his epic mount and ganks it.

I almost said something like that, but thought better of it.

224 laZardo  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:09:57pm

re: #222 negativ

The problem with thorium is that when you're out in Silithus trying to mine it, it could be 3:00AM and not a soul in sight, but as soon as you spot a node, some Chinese North Korean assclown swoops in on his epic mount and ganks it.

ftfy

225 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:10:15pm

re: #219 ProLifeLiberal

This reactor type is where energy money should go.

Once this design is perfected, start spamming the buggers.

Depends. It's not for every country or every part of a country. Any turbine system uses a tremendous amount of water for coolant. A reactor uses as much as a coal-fired plant of similar output (Heat is heat- there oughta be a law! Oh, wait.). Seawater *sucks* as a coolant. Chews cooling pipes to shit and gone. Now you *could* use a portion of the power produced by the reactor to desalinate sea water to cool the reactor that is producing the power to desalinate the the sea water that is....

Oh, dear. Circular firing squad.

226 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:11:22pm

re: #221 ProLifeLiberal

Heck, they probably have some thorium themselves.

Do you have granite? You have thorium.

227 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:14:38pm

re: #222 negativ

The problem with thorium is that when you're out in Silithus trying to mine it, it could be 3:00AM and not a soul in sight, but as soon as you spot a node, some Chinese assclown swoops in on his epic mount and ganks it.

Aw, you rotten little kids and your video games. Pong was good enough for us!

And by the way, Get The Hell Off Of My Lawn!!

(shakes withered virtual fist)

228 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:19:45pm

re: #214 b_sharp

Water cooling is not necessarily the best or the quietest. Here is a review of a water cooler. If you look down the list you'll see the Corsair H50 water cooler.

Okay, that is very helpful. I'm not concerned with quiet, I just want to let the thing run at 100% for an hour or two without damage or a shut down. Looks like a new heat sink in any case.

229 Killgore Trout  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:20:13pm

re: #191 Charles

Cool - I just won the 2500 followers badge.

Rock on!

230 Obdicut  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:20:48pm

re: #228 Rightwingconspirator

Honestly it sounds like your heatsink isn't sitting right or it has come loose or the paste has dried up. Might want to try just reseating it with some arctic silver before doing the LC.

231 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:23:40pm

re: #161 Charles

By the way: a tip on using blockquotes, for all LGF Page authors!

When you include a quote from an article, please make sure to surround it with <blockquote> tags, to make it clear what part of the post is your writing, and what part came from the linked article.

And when you use a blockquoted section, put blank lines before and after the blockquote. This helps our CSS apply the proper styles to everything.

Is there a shortcut for

like for bold?

232 Kragar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:24:28pm

And Romney decides the Tea party is a good thing;

One woman here pointedly questioned Romney several times about how he would distance himself from the Tea Party movement, which she called an uncompromising “right wing fringe.” Romney has tried to embrace some of philosophy of the Tea Party, but is distrusted by some of the movement’s activists.

“The great thing about the Tea Party movement is that Republicans of all backgrounds and interests have all coalesced around a few common themes, which is government is too big and spending too much,” Romney said. “I happen to agree with that. You’re seeing the Republican Party united in a way that I haven’t seen before.”

Yeah, united in driving all the sane members out of their ranks. You just lost those people who were holding out betting on you as the sane alternative Mitt.

233 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:26:52pm

re: #227 austin_blue

Aw, you rotten little kids and your video games. Pong was good enough for us!

And by the way, Get The Hell Off Of My Lawn!!

(shakes withered virtual fist)

Bah. I had a Pong, and it was not good enough for anyone.

My dad's company had some ridiculous contract with Texas Instruments, so he bought a "TI Professional", which was TI's competitor to the IBM XT. It had two - count 'em, two - 360k floppy drives, MS-DOS 1.12, a green monochome CRT...

and Zork.

And Zork is good enough for anyone.

234 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:26:59pm

re: #232 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

And Romney decides the Tea party is a good thing;

Yeah, united in driving all the sane members out of their ranks. You just lost those people who were holding out betting on you as the sane alternative Mitt.

And so, one of the two adults exits the room. Come on Huntsman! Give this Dem a worthy opponent, someone I can respect, for '12!

235 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:27:44pm

re: #233 negativ

Bah. I had a Pong, and it was not good enough for anyone.

My dad's company had some ridiculous contract with Texas Instruments, so he bought a "TI Professional", which was TI's competitor to the IBM XT. It had two - count 'em, two - 360k floppy drives, MS-DOS 1.12, a green monochome CRT...

and Zork.

And Zork is good enough for anyone.

PLUGH.

236 Kragar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:28:57pm

re: #234 austin_blue

And so, one of the two adults exits the room. Come on Huntsman! Give this Dem a worthy opponent, someone I can respect, for '12!

Yeah, I'm sure Huntsman will be able to pull thru and knock Romney, Bachmann, Perry, and Paul out of the running to get the nomination.
/

237 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:29:39pm

re: #232 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

And Romney decides the Tea party is a good thing;

Yeah, united in driving all the sane members out of their ranks. You just lost those people who were holding out betting on you as the sane alternative Mitt.

Anything for a vote eh Mitt.

238 Sheila Broflovski  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:30:19pm

re: #233 negativ

Bah. I had a Pong, and it was not good enough for anyone.

My dad's company had some ridiculous contract with Texas Instruments, so he bought a "TI Professional", which was TI's competitor to the IBM XT. It had two - count 'em, two - 360k floppy drives, MS-DOS 1.12, a green monochome CRT...

and Zork.

And Zork is good enough for anyone.

I received an IBM AT for a graduation present. Zedushka was not satisfied with its 10MB hard drive, so he bought a 40MB HD from the CompUSA catalog, for $500!

Do you know what you can get, today, for $500 worth of storage?

This was in 1987.

239 Kragar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:30:30pm

re: #237 HappyWarrior

Anything for a vote eh Mitt.

That statement is going to lose him a lot more votes that it gained.

240 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:31:05pm

re: #230 Obdicut
Could well be. But all 4 processors at 100% for an hour or more is pretty demanding. Nothing heats it up like encoding media. Even 90% does not present a problem.
I'm still under my builders warranty, I'll see what he wants to do. If he can re-install the stock intel and keep it cool great. If it needs a better heat sink, no big deal. I mean any of them cost what I bill for an hour or so of edit time or less. To me it's smart to make sure it runs as fast as possible and cool. HD editing seems to be at least as demanding as 3d gaming.

241 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:31:39pm

re: #239 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

That statement is going to lose him a lot more votes that it gained.

You're right, but Mitt thinks pandering to the TP's whelms will mean votes for him.

242 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:31:52pm

re: #227 austin_blue

Aw, you rotten little kids and your video games. Pong was good enough for us!

And by the way, Get The Hell Off Of My Lawn!!

(shakes withered virtual fist)

At OMSI right now is the exhibit on the history of the video game.

You can play PONG again. And Pac Man. And...just about everything, really.

I was this close to digging out some quarters and putting them on the Pac Man game, but I figured the kids wouldn't get it.

243 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:33:37pm

re: #238 Alouette

I received an IBM AT for a graduation present. Zedushka was not satisfied with its 10MB hard drive, so he bought a 40MB HD from the CompUSA catalog, for $500!

Do you know what you can get, today, for $500 worth of storage?

This was in 1987.

I just downloaded 40 MB of a game in the last five minutes. It's about 12% of the entire game.

244 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:37:10pm

Oh, sure, I show up and everyone decides it's a good time to walk the dog.

245 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:39:32pm

In other news, it got hot enough in Oregon for me to turn the A/C on today.

*Crickets*

246 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:40:14pm

re: #245 EmmmieG

In other news, it got hot enough in Oregon for me to turn the A/C on today.

*Crickets*

Boo!

247 HappyWarrior  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:41:52pm

The musical revolution is something that has intrigued me for some time. I remember when I was a kid in the mid 90's and my best friend's older sister had a CD player that could hold six CDs at once and that seemed so awesome. Now nearly fifteen years later, my iPod is less than 10 songs away from 19,000 and there's still nearly 50 gigs left. And the role of social networks in spreading music is just amazing.Great away for artists to keep their fans updated.

248 jaunte  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:42:01pm

re: #245 EmmmieG

*Crickets*

Image: Crickets.jpg

249 darthstar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:43:05pm

re: #248 jaunte

Image: Crickets.jpg

That's a batsman.

250 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:44:05pm

re: #249 darthstar

That's a batsman.

Nananananananananana....Crickets!

No, missing something.

251 jaunte  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:44:33pm

re: #249 darthstar

People are wicket precise around here.

252 darthstar  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:45:04pm

re: #251 jaunte

People are wicket precise around here.

You'll get overs it.

253 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:45:10pm

re: #241 HappyWarrior

You're right, but Mitt thinks pandering to the TP's whelms will mean votes for him.

Well, until the general, anyway. I'm curious to see how far the "moderate wing" wing of the Rs (does that mean anything anymore?) are willing to careen to the right to get the nom. And I will be absolutely *fascinated* to see them try to scratch and claw the Indies into their camp.

Famous Groucho exchange:

"You are a beautiful young woman. Would you sleep with me for $10,000?"

"Why, sure, Groucho!"

"How about a dollar?"

"What do you think I am?!?!"

"My dear, we have already determined that. We are just haggling over the price."

254 b_sharp  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:45:17pm

re: #251 jaunte

People are wicket precise around here.

Boo!

255 jaunte  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:45:33pm

re: #254 b_sharp

Yah!

256 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:46:16pm

re: #243 EmmmieG

I just downloaded 40 MB of a game in the last five minutes. It's about 12% of the entire game.

Nerdstalgia overload:

Youtube Video

The whole thing can be found by using the googles, if one is so inclined.

Early history of the Free (as in "speech") Software movement; nerds galore (Torvalds, Stallman, et al) - desperately needs a sequel / follow-up, as this is a decade old now:

Google Video
257 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:49:31pm

re: #249 darthstar

That's a batsman.

No, this is.

258 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:49:40pm

re: #245 EmmmieG

In other news, it got hot enough in Oregon for me to turn the A/C on today.

*Crickets*

Here's August, so far:

1 107 78 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 2.9 10 140 M M 0 18 120
2 107 80 94 8 0 29 0.00 0.0 0 4.3 13 150 M M 0 20 150
3 106 79 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 4.6 14 160 M M 0 25 160
4 107 79 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 4.5 13 150 M M 0 22 160
5 106 78 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 6.3 15 160 M M 0 28 160
6 104 78 91 5 0 26 0.00 0.0 0 6.0 13 160 M M 1 23 150
7 103 79 91 5 0 26 0.00 0.0 0 5.8 14 160 M M 1 26 160
8 106 79 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 7.9 17 150 M M 1 32 150
9 106 78 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 6.8 15 150 M M 2 24 170
10 104 79 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 7.5 17 140 M M 2 25 150
11 104 82 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 6.9 16 140 M M 4 25 150
12 103 81 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 6.0 14 150 M M 2 25 140
13 97 79 88 2 0 23 0.00 0.0 0 3.8 10 210 M M 2 18 160
14 105 79 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 4.2 13 100 M M 1 21 80
15 105 79 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 5.0 15 150 M M 1 24 180
================================================================================
SM 1570 1187 0 406 0.00 0.0 82.5 M 17
================================================================================
AV104.7 79.1 5.5 FASTST M M 1 MAX(MPH)

259 jaunte  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:51:02pm

re: #258 austin_blue

Just three degrees cooler today in Houston. The crickets have all left town, vacationing in the northwest somewhere.

260 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:52:02pm

re: #258 austin_blue

Here's August, so far:

1 107 78 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 2.9 10 140 M M 0 18 120
2 107 80 94 8 0 29 0.00 0.0 0 4.3 13 150 M M 0 20 150
3 106 79 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 4.6 14 160 M M 0 25 160
4 107 79 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 4.5 13 150 M M 0 22 160
5 106 78 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 6.3 15 160 M M 0 28 160
6 104 78 91 5 0 26 0.00 0.0 0 6.0 13 160 M M 1 23 150
7 103 79 91 5 0 26 0.00 0.0 0 5.8 14 160 M M 1 26 160
8 106 79 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 7.9 17 150 M M 1 32 150
9 106 78 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 6.8 15 150 M M 2 24 170
10 104 79 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 7.5 17 140 M M 2 25 150
11 104 82 93 7 0 28 0.00 0.0 0 6.9 16 140 M M 4 25 150
12 103 81 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 6.0 14 150 M M 2 25 140
13 97 79 88 2 0 23 0.00 0.0 0 3.8 10 210 M M 2 18 160
14 105 79 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 4.2 13 100 M M 1 21 80
15 105 79 92 6 0 27 0.00 0.0 0 5.0 15 150 M M 1 24 180
===
SM 1570 1187 0 406 0.00 0.0 82.5 M 17
===
AV104.7 79.1 5.5 FASTST M M 1 MAX(MPH)

I lived in Puh-flugerville for 5 years. I remember August.

(Although, it isn't August that gets you. It's October, when it's still really hot, and it's stupid October already.)

261 freetoken  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:53:06pm

re: #258 austin_blue

In a hundred years that will be considered a cool summer.

262 Interesting Times  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:54:29pm

re: #258 austin_blue

Here's August, so far:

And it's even more hilarious when you consider who gets first dibs on what little water the Lone-star state has left...

263 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:54:48pm

re: #258 austin_blue

There is no end in site for Oklahoma..Temps are high..over 100 degrees since it seems years ago...I have to give the locals their props.. It's hell here and they all smile and carry on.. I think it sucks

264 Cheechako  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 7:57:20pm

re: #258 austin_blue


Want to trade places? Last week we had 3.5"+ of rain. Just today we've had 1.75" just since last midnight. Of course it's been cool, right now 52 outside. Just enough coolness to have to turn on the furnace to take the chill out of the house. Sunshine? Last Saturday was sunny and even got up to 68!!!

I am jealous!

265 Cheechako  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:01:06pm

BBIAB (supper)

266 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:07:22pm

re: #260 EmmmieG

I lived in Puh-flugerville for 5 years. I remember August.

(Although, it isn't August that gets you. It's October, when it's still really hot, and it's stupid October already.)

Well, yeah, but last year we had, like five days over 100 (granted, cool for us, we average around twelve). But this year has been really extraordinary, both for the number of days over 100 (62- record is 69), but by *how much over 100* the average has been. July of this year was the hottest month (not just the hottest July) ever recorded in Austin. August is blowing it away.

In addition, when we get a La Nina, it doesn't rain. We were in a strong La Nina from last October to July, when the ENSO went neutral. Driest ten months Evah! Usually La Ninas are followed by an El Nino cycle. Here's the forecast from the Climate Prediction Center for this fall for the ENSO:

Image: figure7.gif

If that comes true, the SW is truly fucked.

267 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:10:55pm

re: #171 b_sharp

Stay down wind, 'K?

LOL

268 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:20:19pm

re: #264 Cheechako

Want to trade places? Last week we had 3.5"+ of rain. Just today we've had 1.75" just since last midnight. Of course it's been cool, right now 52 outside. Just enough coolness to have to turn on the furnace to take the chill out of the house. Sunshine? Last Saturday was sunny and even got up to 68!!!

I am jealous!

Well that's the trade-off, innit? But here's the thing. Rain and cool isn't going to kill your state. Heat and drought might kill mine.

And as to your actual question, yes, I would trade places with you. Once the temp gets over 103 or so, your body has a real tough time shedding heat. At an average of 104.7 for August, people are starting to die. It's just brutal.

269 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:37:54pm

re: #268 austin_blue

Well that's the trade-off, innit? But here's the thing. Rain and cool isn't going to kill your state. Heat and drought might kill mine.

And as to your actual question, yes, I would trade places with you. Once the temp gets over 103 or so, your body has a real tough time shedding heat. At an average of 104.7 for August, people are starting to die. It's just brutal.

All due crap given to The Reponse, I'm praying for rain. You guys are getting it in the throat.

270 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:43:05pm

oooooh, it's a Potoroo!

271 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:44:59pm

re: #233 negativ

Bah. I had a Pong, and it was not good enough for anyone.

My dad's company had some ridiculous contract with Texas Instruments, so he bought a "TI Professional", which was TI's competitor to the IBM XT. It had two - count 'em, two - 360k floppy drives, MS-DOS 1.12, a green monochome CRT...

and Zork.

And Zork is good enough for anyone.


these were pretty good for me

Youtube Video

(this came out in 1985)
Youtube Video

(this came out in 1987)
272 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:53:43pm

WHERE IS EVERYBODY???


hello, HELLO, hellll ooooooo

273 Obdicut  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:54:29pm

re: #272 ggt

I'm in bed.

274 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:55:32pm

News finally reaches Marvin on Mars...

275 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:56:04pm

re: #274 CuriousLurker

News finally reaches Marvin on Mars...

Think it makes him angry?

276 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:56:14pm

re: #273 Obdicut

I'm in bed.

in bed?

277 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:57:02pm

re: #275 ggt

Think it makes him angry?

Everything makes Marvin very, very angry, heh.

278 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:57:30pm

Stupid Photoshop, sometimes I just can't resist.

279 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:57:48pm

ok, this beebee is much cuter.

Fishing Cat

280 jaunte  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:58:22pm

re: #277 CuriousLurker

CL, I recall you enjoy calligraphy; check out these photos/writings:
[Link: www.grist.org...]

281 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:59:12pm

re: #278 CuriousLurker

Need to do some kind of interactive "eyebrow of the day" feature, since hers and Palin's are never drawn the same twice.

282 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 8:59:31pm

re: #280 jaunte

CL, I recall you enjoy calligraphy; check out these photos/writings:
[Link: www.grist.org...]

Yes, I do—oooh, tahnks!

283 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:00:30pm

re: #281 theheat

Need to do some kind of interactive "eyebrow of the day" feature, since hers and Palin's are never drawn the same twice.

LOL, true that.

284 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:02:26pm

re: #269 SanFranciscoZionist

All due crap given to The Reponse, I'm praying for rain. You guys are getting it in the throat.

We'd be bleeding out, but the blood clots instantly.

Praying for rain, is of course, BS.

It rains or it doesn't. It's nature.

We had an odd shift of the dominant high pressure over Texas last Thursday that let a little disturbance move from SW to NE over the high plains. Take a look at how much *potential* moisture is out there if the instability is right:

[Link: www.intellicast.com...]

285 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:03:47pm

re: #284 austin_blue

We'd be bleeding out, but the blood clots instantly.

Praying for rain, is of course, BS.

It rains or it doesn't. It's nature.

We had an odd shift of the dominant high pressure over Texas last Thursday that let a little disturbance move from SW to NE over the high plains. Take a look at how much *potential* moisture is out there if the instability is right:

[Link: www.intellicast.com...]

You could, at least, acknowledge and appreciate the thought.

286 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:04:00pm

re: #283 CuriousLurker

Come to think of it, Shrieking Harpie's are pretty wild, too.

287 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:04:26pm

re: #286 theheat

Come to think of it, Shrieking Harpie's are pretty wild, too.

You notice eyebrows?

288 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:05:48pm

re: #272 ggt

WHERE IS EVERYBODY???

hello, HELLO, helll ooo

Hey..So it was bill paying day..about the 15th.. Paper everywhere..Dinner on the table..Writing checks..Watching Leno...And you know what?
In the morning it's Weds. The worst day of the week..All day misery..If you elect me President I promise to outlaw Weds..
There shall be no more hump day..Everybody is off for the day...
So shall it be written..So shall it be done..
You know.. Some day the mid week off-day will be considered a human right by the UN..And I'd vote for if they only let me...

289 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:06:54pm

re: #286 theheat

Come to think of it, Shrieking Harpie's are pretty wild, too.

I never could stand the eyebrow stuff. I remember when I was a kid watching my mom do hers with a black pencil. I was never big on the whole make-up & hair thing period. Too much hassle. There are more interesting things to do.

290 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:07:49pm

re: #287 ggt

Some people do handwriting analysis or body language - I do eyebrows. I know nuts when I see it.

291 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:07:58pm

re: #289 CuriousLurker

I never could stand the eyebrow stuff. I remember when I was a kid watching my mom do hers with a black pencil. I was never big on the whole make-up & hair thing period. Too much hassle. There are more interesting things to do.

But, being a girl is sooooo much fun.

Make-up, hair, nails and SHOES!

292 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:08:15pm

lol...sarc at it's best...

Spelling out what is likely to be a key theme in his bid for the Presidency, Texas Governor Rick Perry told an audience in Houston today that as President he would establish universal hair care for all Americans.

In his first major policy address, Gov. Perry singled out “bad hair” as the principal cause of the country’s problems, from jobs to crime to the national debt.

“Let’s say you try to get a job,” Mr. Perry told his audience. “The first thing the employer will notice is if your hair is droopy and lifeless, and the next thing you know we have nine percent unemployment.”

“Since you didn’t get the job, you then go out and steal stuff and don’t pay taxes,” he said. “And so we have rising crime and debt, all of which could have been fixed with a simple shampoo and cut.”

Gov. Perry said that as President he would establish a Cabinet-level “Hair Club for America,” which would provide every man, woman and child in the country with a Federally mandated twenty hours of hairstyling per year.

“If America is going to stay competitive with China and India, our hair is going to have to look a lot better than it does now,” he said.

Gov. Perry’s hair-driven solutions to the country’s problems drew praise from audience members, including car salesman Tracy Klugian from Beaumont.

“I think Gov. Perry definitely has the hair to solve our country’s problems,” he said. “I didn’t feel that way about Trump.”

[Link: www.borowitzreport.com...]

293 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:08:34pm

re: #290 theheat

Some people do handwriting analysis or body language - I do eyebrows. I know nuts when I see it.

Like the little old ladies who draw their eyebrows about 1/2 above their real ones?

294 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:09:05pm

re: #291 ggt

Me: nails. And hair color. I have pale blond eyebrows that are almost transparent (ick) but I can have fun with the other stuff.

295 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:09:26pm

re: #292 ausador

lol...sarc at it's best...

[Link: www.borowitzreport.com...]

is Bad Hair on the Nearly Treasonable Offense™ list?

296 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:09:51pm

re: #291 ggt

But, being a girl is sooo much fun.

Make-up, hair, nails and SHOES!

Yuck. *grimace*.

I was never a girly girl. I'll take comfort over cute any day. (Too old for cute now anyway.)

297 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:10:31pm

re: #293 ggt

That's usually poor eyesight and not staying current on fashion (old bad habits that never die). Not always an indication of crazy.

298 jaunte  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:11:41pm

re: #295 ggt

For a conservative, Perry is pretty free with the Grecian Formula.

299 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:11:43pm

re: #297 theheat

That's usually poor eyesight and not staying current on fashion (old bad habits that never die). Not always an indication of crazy.

I always have to wonder about the children of those old ladies. I'd be embarrased if my Mom looked like that. I hope my kid doesn't let me do that.

300 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:11:56pm

re: #296 CuriousLurker

Yuck. *grimace*.

I was never a girly girl. I'll take comfort over cute any day. (Too old for cute now anyway.)

Romeos and menthols ;-)

301 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:12:40pm

re: #300 theheat

Romeos and menthols ;-)

Just call me Wanda. ;)

302 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:12:52pm

re: #297 theheat

That's usually poor eyesight and not staying current on fashion (old bad habits that never die). Not always an indication of crazy.

What about the ladies who shave off their real ones and draw a very thin line instead?

303 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:13:38pm

re: #299 ggt

Little Heat's too mean. He'd banish me to a rest home before he'd let me be seen like that. "Ma, what the hell's the matter with you?!"

304 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:13:47pm

re: #301 CuriousLurker

Just call me Wanda. ;)

Wanda Who

Wanda Where

Wanda Why?

305 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:14:28pm

no, no

Wanda, Wanda, Wanda Who, Who wrote the book of Love . . . .

306 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:14:54pm

re: #304 ggt

Wanda Sykes. Only about the coolest, funniest womens out there.

307 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:15:30pm

re: #304 ggt

Wanda Who

Wanda Where

Wanda Why?

Wanda Sykes. Because she just doesn't give a ∗∗∗∗.

308 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:15:35pm

re: #306 theheat

Wanda Sykes. Only about the coolest, funniest womens out there.

She has good eyebrows.

309 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:15:49pm

re: #307 CuriousLurker

Wanda Sykes. Because she just doesn't give a ∗∗∗∗.

There is a honey badger named Wanda Sykes?

310 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:16:26pm

re: #308 ggt

Yes, she does. She keeps it real.

311 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:16:38pm

re: #309 ggt

There is a honey badger named Wanda Sykes?

LOL! Why, yes, as a matter of fact there is.

312 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:18:15pm

Where are Slumbering Behemoth and Gus?

313 CuriousLurker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:18:52pm

Okay, ladies, I've gotta drag my carcass off to bed and try to get some shut-eye. Have a great night. ;o)

314 theheat  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:19:07pm

Sleep, then work. The terrier's already under the blankies waiting for me. Later.

315 Digital Display  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:19:31pm

re: #313 CuriousLurker

Okay, ladies, I've gotta drag my carcass off to bed and try to get some shut-eye. Have a great night. ;o)

weet dreams

316 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:19:58pm

re: #285 ggt

You could, at least, acknowledge and appreciate the thought.

Hey, I appreciate it! I'd just prefer a freshwater pipeline, ice, and an atmospheric upgrade!

317 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:20:41pm

huh?

318 Achilles Tang  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:21:09pm

re: #304 ggt

Wanda Who

Wanda Where

Wanda Why?

Wanda why I am here?

It's boring.

Goodnight.

319 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:21:28pm

re: #318 Naso Tang

Wanda why I am here?

It's boring.

Goodnight.

Sorry we couldn't keep you awake.

320 Achilles Tang  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:22:40pm

re: #319 ggt

Me too. Nite.

321 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:23:54pm

Stupid, Stupid, Stupid.

The internet is not a means of secure communications.

322 Cheechako  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:26:55pm

re: #268 austin_blue

I guess that's why we're called the rain-forest. The area is used to this heavy rain so we have very little flooding.

It's that high pressure system that's stuck over the central US. It forces the jet stream to remain on a northerly route thus sending every wave of low pressure and rain directly into SE Alaska. Once the jet stream changes everything will change.

323 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:27:04pm

I kinda have to agree.

The government can require warnings which are straightforward and essentially uncontroversial, but they can't require a cigarette pack to serve as a mini-billboard for the government's anti-smoking campaign," Floyd Abrams, a lawyer representing the cigarette makers, said in a statement.

324 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:35:33pm

re: #288 HoosierHoops

Hey..So it was bill paying day..about the 15th.. Paper everywhere..Dinner on the table..Writing checks..Watching Leno...And you know what?
In the morning it's Weds. The worst day of the week..All day misery..If you elect me President I promise to outlaw Weds..
There shall be no more hump day..Everybody is off for the day...
So shall it be written..So shall it be done..
You know.. Some day the mid week off-day will be considered a human right by the UN..And I'd vote for if they only let me...

Hoops! How are you and Winston getting along? I hear you guys had a reprieve over the weekend.

325 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:40:50pm

re: #322 Cheechako

I guess that's why we're called the rain-forest. The area is used to this heavy rain so we have very little flooding.

It's that high pressure system that's stuck over the central US. It forces the jet stream to remain on a northerly route thus sending every wave of low pressure and rain directly into SE Alaska. Once the jet stream changes everything will change.

Juneau?

326 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:44:10pm

Ok, I swear this is not from the Onion.

A new Tea Party group in Florida is boldly going where no Tea Parties have gone before – space.

Tea Party in Space, an offshoot of the South Florida Tea Party, is, of all things, pushing to end the government’s supposed monopoly on space exploration.

327 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:45:59pm

re: #326 ggt

Ok, I swear this is not from the Onion.

Well they're only about ten years behind the curve. Stupid is as stupid does.

328 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:50:08pm

re: #22 Charles

Andrew Breitbart, impervious to irony, is accusing MSNBC's Ed Schultz of "selectively editing" a video.

Here's the clip Breitbart posted: [Link: www.breitbart.tv...]

Watch carefully, because you'll see that Ed Schultz played the FULL video clip of Rick Perry, including the part Breitbart says was edited!

It's right there in the clip -- the first segment with Schultz.

Then the rest of Breitbart's video does a bizarre repetition over and over that Ed Schultz edited the video (he didn't) and misrepresented it (he didn't!), ending with "Ed Schultz Should Be Fired."

It's utterly bizarre. It's like Breitbart is trying to hypnotize people into believing the exact opposite of reality.

Schultz is an ass, but he's not a forger and liar like Breitbart is.

329 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:50:13pm

re: #327 austin_blue

Well they're only about ten years behind the curve. Stupid is as stupid does.

Yeah, I've noticed that it is about 10 years.

In every issue. Conservatives are slow to recognize the change they dislike.

330 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:51:41pm

re: #326 ggt

Ok, I swear this is not from the Onion.

Private spacecraft are already being built. This bunch is fighting a battle that's already been won. Fools.

331 Cheechako  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:51:57pm

re: #325 austin_blue


Yes. I just read on a wild-land fire-fighting forum that next winter is starting to shape up as another La Nina year.

Not good at all.

332 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:52:30pm

re: #329 ggt

Yeah, I've noticed that it is about 10 years.

In every issue. Conservatives are slow to recognize the change they dislike.

That ought to be a rotating title.

Quoted for truth. Well said.

333 Lidane  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:52:39pm

I saw a Palin 2012 sticker tonight and laughed. That made me wonder how they would try to position Caribou Barbie as a serious candidate for POTUS. Then I saw this:

[Link: pa4palin.blogspot.com...]

LOL. I hope she runs, just to see someone legitimately try to make this argument.

334 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:57:42pm

Pammy has hit the big-time!!!!

335 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 9:58:53pm

re: #333 Lidane

I saw a Palin 2012 sticker tonight and laughed. That made me wonder how they would try to position Caribou Barbie as a serious candidate for POTUS. Then I saw this:

[Link: pa4palin.blogspot.com...]

LOL. I hope she runs, just to see someone legitimately try to make this argument.

The background of that site is annoying.

336 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:01:21pm

re: #333 Lidane

I saw a Palin 2012 sticker tonight and laughed. That made me wonder how they would try to position Caribou Barbie as a serious candidate for POTUS. Then I saw this:

[Link: pa4palin.blogspot.com...]

LOL. I hope she runs, just to see someone legitimately try to make this argument.

Oh, dear! If Sarah bails, it's a Del Rio Dogfight between Pointy Boots and Magic Underwear, Part II.

Wherever shall I go? Whatever shall I do?

(puts virtual hand to mouth and quails like Scarlet)

337 Cheechako  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:02:53pm

re: #333 Lidane

Palin didn't have anything to do with this. A combination of high crude oil prices and federal spending is responsible for the growth.

338 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:03:45pm

re: #337 Cheechako

Palin didn't have anything to do with this. A combination of high crude oil prices and federal spending is responsible for the growth.

Was she governor long enough to claim anything? Wasn't she even on maternity leave for part of it?

339 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:10:18pm

re: #334 ggt

Pammy has hit the big-time!!!

Tomorrow at Atlas Shrieks:

Morris Dees: AGENT OF JIHAD!!!11

340 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:11:31pm

re: #338 ggt

Was she governor long enough to claim anything? Wasn't she even on maternity leave for part of it?

I don't think it matters. Since McCain tapped her, it's been the Wasilla Teabillies Reality Show.

In which a former VP candidate rolls around the country making enough money to, hopefully, provide for her incredibly disfunctional children.

(Family values!)

341 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:13:43pm

re: #340 austin_blue

I don't think it matters. Since McCain tapped her, it's been the Wasilla Teabillies Reality Show.

In which a former VP candidate rolls around the country making enough money to, hopefully, provide for her incredibly disfunctional children.

(Family values!)

she doesn't really do that for her two eldest anymore. Track is emplyed and has his own family now, and Bristol has been able to play her teen pregnancy and her mother's name into a good deal of money.

342 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:15:14pm

I think I may puke after reading about this wonderful (*ack*) group.

The Church of the Creator was founded in 1973 by Klassen, a one-time Florida state legislator born in the Ukraine and raised in Canada. For almost a decade before establishing the group, Klassen drifted among far-right causes, first as a member of the John Birch Society -- which he later denounced as a "smokescreen for the Jews" -- and later as Florida chairman of George Wallace's 1968 independent presidential campaign. In 1973, Klassen formed the COTC with the publication of a 511-page tome entitled Nature's Eternal Religion. The book was a call to "completely reject the Judeo-democratic-Marxist values of today and supplant them with new and basic values, of which race is the foundation." As his title indicates, Klassen believed that race had transcendent meaning. It embodied absolute truth; Christianity, by contrast, he disdained as a "suicidal religion."

I feel dirty

343 austin_blue  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:16:13pm

Well, that's it for me. I am for the rack. Sweet dreams, all.

344 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:16:41pm

re: #343 austin_blue

Well, that's it for me. I am for the rack. Sweet dreams, all.

weet dreams, blue

345 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:17:13pm

re: #342 ggt

I think I may puke after reading about this wonderful (*ack*) group.

I feel dirty

Don't. It's important to know how these dirtbags think, and you're doing what must be done.

346 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:17:41pm

Breivik: I killed 20 more after cops ignored my call

The 32-year-old Right-wing fanatic halted his gun rampage on the Norwegian island of Utoya to ring police and give himself up.

But when officers failed to return his call, he carried on shooting on "autopilot" - taking the final shocking death toll to 69.

Lawyer Geir Lippe said: "He wanted to capitulate. If he had received confirmation that his message was understood, he would have stopped his mission."

Breivik supposedly asked to speak to the armed fast-response Delta unit in his emergency call.

But the solicitor said he got a garbled reply, which left him assuming someone would ring him back.

Northern Buskerud police chief Magne Rustad said cops DID try to return the call, but the phone was switched off.

The Sun

347 Cheechako  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:18:25pm

re: #338 ggt

Was she governor long enough to claim anything? Wasn't she even on maternity leave for part of it?

She did get the Alaska Gasline Inducement Act passed. This act finally gets the State moving forward getting natural gas developed and moved to the lower 48.

She managed to indict and convict several Republicans for being in the pocket of the oil and gas companies.

Now that's she's gone it's very visible that the oil and gas politicians are back trying to influence the politicians. Several politicians and the Governor are trying to reduce the oil tax increase that Sara pushed through the Legislature. That increased tax added several billion to the State treasury and and several billion more to the Permanent Fund. Yet several oil companies are reporting record profits on their Alaska operations.

By the way, that first deep drop in the Dow Jones index cost the Permanent Fund about 2 billion dollars in value. I guess a lot of that has been made up by now. (I hope!)

348 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:20:15pm

FBI warns of "Lone Wolf" Norway-style attacks

In a joint FBI/Department of Homeland Security memo (PDF), it states:

"Small-arms operations could be employed through a range of tactics from a lone offender--as illustrated by the recent 22 July 2011 lone shooter attack that took place in Norway--to a coordinated small-unit attack involving several operatives. Recent lone offender attacks and plots in the United States and abroad illustrate the effectiveness of the small-arms tactic and the need for continued vigilance and awareness of this tactic. Attacks by lone offenders--which by definition lack co-conspirators, and therefore provide fewer opportunities for detection--may be more difficult for law enforcement and homeland security authorities to disrupt."

Examples cited by the memo include the soldier from Fort Hood arrested on July 27 of this year with materials to produce a bomb; The lone gunmen who killed two U.S. Airmen at the Frankfurt, Germany, airport on March 2 of this year; and the Fort Hood shooter, Maj. Nadal Hassan, who killed 12 with two pistols in a late 2009 rampage.

The domestic "Lone Wolf" threat is far from limited to Islamic-linked individuals, too. As reported by "60 Minutes," the "Sovereign Citizens" movement - a loosely knit group that doesn't pay taxes, carry driver's licenses or hold Social Security cards - has shown a violent and sometimes murderous dislike of law enforcement. Oklahoma City bomber Timothy McVeigh had only two known co-conspirators.

CBS

349 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:20:47pm

re: #347 Cheechako

She did get the Alaska Gasline Inducement Act passed. This act finally gets the State moving forward getting natural gas developed and moved to the lower 48.

She managed to indict and convict several Republicans for being in the pocket of the oil and gas companies.

Now that's she's gone it's very visible that the oil and gas politicians are back trying to influence the politicians. Several politicians and the Governor are trying to reduce the oil tax increase that Sara pushed through the Legislature. That increased tax added several billion to the State treasury and and several billion more to the Permanent Fund. Yet several oil companies are reporting record profits on their Alaska operations.

By the way, that first deep drop in the Dow Jones index cost the Permanent Fund about 2 billion dollars in value. I guess a lot of that has been made up by now. (I hope!)

I still don't want he as president, but those were worthy achievements.

350 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:23:12pm

In other news: Almost a month after, Iran gets numbers of deaths in Norway massacre wrong, plays "Breivik was a Zionist" angle:

Norway was last month coming to terms with one of the worst atrocities in recent European history as police revealed that 91 people died in the deadly attacks in the center of Oslo and on a nearby island summer camp.

The killings, it now seems clear, were carried out by a 32-year old Norwegian, named by local media as Anders Behring Breivik, who had expressed far-right views, and had dressed as a policeman to carry out his bomb attack on government buildings in central Oslo before heading to the island of Utoya, where he shot at least 84 people.

In several online postings, Anders Behring Breivik, the confessed perpetrator of the attack, promoted fiercely anti-Islamic and far-right Zionist views, calling for "the deportation of all Muslims from Europe" as well as from "the West Bank and the Gaza Strip".

Fars News Agency

351 Cheechako  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:25:00pm

re: #349 Dark_Falcon


I voted for her for Governor and with McCain. Never again. She's turned int nothing but a joke. I wouldn't vote for her to be sewer inspector. (Well, maybe for that.)

352 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:25:32pm

re: #350 000G

In other news: Almost a month after, Iran gets numbers of deaths in Norway massacre wrong, plays "Breivik was a Zionist" angle:

Fars News Agency

Fars can join Pam Geller in the "Assholes who deliberately miss the point" section.

353 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:29:02pm

Goodnight, all.

354 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:30:39pm

re: #345 Dark_Falcon

Don't. It's important to know how these dirtbags think, and you're doing what must be done.

I've gone from feeling dirty to feeling totally impotent.


Today, an estimated 100,000 children and teens are locked up in juvenile facilities across the country, and thousands more are incarcerated in adult prisons. Children in adult prisons and jails face even worse conditions than those in the juvenile justice system.

&

SPLC Files Suit After New Orleans First-Grader Handcuffed

355 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 10:39:43pm

Ok, now that I am feeling totally dismal, I'm going to bed.

Night all!

356 lostlakehiker  Tue, Aug 16, 2011 11:16:01pm

re: #38 makeitstop

I was wondering that myself. Too quiet in here...

I've been ducking in and out over the past hour or so, catching stuff on some other blogs. This post addresses in depth the initial point in that Schultz video - the point of racism.

Hiding in Plain Sight: Racism's Role in the Tea Party GOP's Efforts to Destroy Barack Obama and the U. S. Economy

Good read.

If the national debt were not at record levels relative to GDP, the fuss over the debt ceiling would have been inconsequential to our rating.

It's a mistake to think that the only problem with running up a debt is that you might hit your credit card limit, and that if that can be boosted, spend away.

The GOP isn't trying to wreck the economy. Nor is the TP. They are allergic to higher taxes. They think, with some justification, that the revenue would never be dedicated to deficit reduction anyhow.

And then, they both think, [well, one faction of the GOP thinks] though Democrats will disagree, that the debt itself is so serious a problem that some brinksmanship, if it leads to spending cuts, is justified.

That it won't, after all, come to a default in the end.

It didn't, as I expected and as evidently most of the world expected.

The economy is doing badly enough under Democrat management as it is. The Republican stand on the deficit has not served their immediate political cause. They've just given the Democrats an excuse.

Not that the economy did any better under Republican management. Before today's Democrats engaged in reckless spending, well, umm, right. Republicans did. And reckless encouragement of lending to people who would never be able to repay the mortgage loans they were taking on. And when the Republicans were doing that, the Democrats were calling for more of the same folly.

We have real problems that go deeper than who's on first. And it is those problems that lie at the heart of our credit rating troubles. If the debt ceiling had been lifted without incident, we'd still have our AAA rating, for the moment. But it would still be shaky, and a downgrade would have happened all the same, except at a different point in time.

357 freetoken  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 1:02:10am

CT:

MP3 Audio
358 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 1:22:39am

Morning Honcos.

359 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 1:30:45am

Marriage kills.

360 simoom  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:05:12am

re: #233 negativ

And Zork is good enough for anyone.

"It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue."

361 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:12:28am

Drink. Check.
Steal a piece of machinery. Check.(not a forklift, a telehandler)
Drive shirtless. Check.
Toss beer cans while being chased. Check.
Get tazed. M'kay.

Youtube Video
362 freetoken  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:21:13am
MP3 Audio
363 sattv4u2  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:30:20am

heh

My "hometown" (where I visiting just was last week) may be the new Argentina!!
[Link: www.boston.com...]

364 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:32:50am

New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo signed a law Tuesday banning convicted sex offenders, sex traffickers, those who have lured children and people convicted of manslaughter, among others, from being school bus drivers. Capital Tonight reported the bill signing on its State of Politics blog.

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

You have GOT to be fucking kidding me. This is where I get in trouble for using common sense.

365 researchok  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:34:43am

morning, all

366 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:41:05am

If you call Michael Jackson a child molester, we'll uninvite you from a tribute to him. (PS. Read the comments. KISS sucks but MJ rules!!)
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

367 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:41:59am

re: #139 albusteve

Eagles fans are the worst human beings since people were invented...there is no close second

Scrabble tournament players and Walmart managers come close. The former may require some exposition. Back in the old days, when I was a hotel security guard and not a scientist, the worst guests we had by a huge margin were the mob who came here for a national Scrabble tournament. I would describe them as "redneck nerds." They didn't get drunk and make noise, they got straight to world-class assholery by assaulting the employees and other guests.
There were three different incidents that led to arrests. In one of them a courtesy driver was loading a Scrabble freak's luggage into his van and picked up the man's custom made Scrabble set. The freak was incensed at this, even though he had given no indication that it was not to be touched. He grabbed the wooden box from the driver's hands and hit him over the head with it. The injury required 5 stitches to close. I kicked the offender across the driveway, handcuffed him and waited for the cops, who roughed him up some more and took him to jail. Another Scrabbler shoved a maid, knocking her down, because she did not jump out of his way fast enough. He denied it to the cops, no doubt having forgotten about the existence of video cameras. Finally, one of the Scrabblers, a chubby chap with a black cowboy hat, shoved me as he was passing by, for no apparent reason other than that he likes to abuse people. He too went to jail after the mandatory beating administered to everyone in Texas who attacks a badge.
Other major assholes I've encountered include the executives of Michael's Art Supply. A friend of mine who owns a temp agency contracted to supply extra help for these clowns when they were moving their store in this area. He pulled his people off the job before noon the first day after repeated reports of cursing, threats, and physical abuse directed at the temps. I went with him to check these reports and it didn't take 2 minutes to verify they were true and then some. He has been in the business 40 years and this was the only time he ever quit a job in progress because of a client's behavior.

368 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:42:04am

re: #356 lostlakehiker

The GOP isn't trying to wreck the economy. Nor is the TP. They are allergic to higher taxes. They think, with some justification, that the revenue would never be dedicated to deficit reduction anyhow.

And then, they both think, [well, one faction of the GOP thinks] though Democrats will disagree, that the debt itself is so serious a problem that some brinksmanship, if it leads to spending cuts, is justified.

Oh, bullshit. The reason they oppose higher taxes is not because they think it wouldn't reduce the debt.

They also clearly don't feel like the debt itself is so serious a problem, or they would be shouting for higher taxes and then riding herd to make sure they were applied to the debt.

Why on earth you give them this enormous amount of moral and fiscal credit, I have no idea.

369 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:45:12am

re: #366 Cannadian Club Akbar

Logic! //

PS: I don't really get people who claim that he was a molester without any credible evidence. Sure, where there's smoke there's fire, but in his case it seems more likely that the smoke was the (probable) leeches who tried to feed off him, and the fire was his wealth.

370 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:50:41am

re: #369 Sergey Romanov

He was a deeply screwed up dude, and I wouldn't let my (hypothetical kids) anywhere near him, but that's not because he was a child molestor, but that he might have been a child molestor.

A friend of mine who actually got to interview him repeatedly, including before the accident, said that he thought that was actually the trigger for his bizarre behavior. Before getting so badly burned, he was quirky and odd, but not nearly as strange. After it, he was addicted to painkillers and still in residual pain. My friend felt all his bizarre escapist crap was wanting to get away from that pain and the burn, get back to before it happened.

Makes kind of sense to me.

Have you seen this?

Youtube Video
371 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:51:54am

Shiropayev published a long article about his trip to Israel:

[Link: nazdem.info...]

Says that before that he corresponded at length with certain Rami Suris, co-chair of the far-right Israeli org "House of David".

Suris is on facebook and his last post is a defense of Shiropayev and Lazarenko against the 10th channel charges:

[Link: ru-ru.facebook.com...]

What is displayed on the television show is a blatant lie. These people, representatives of "national democratic alliance" in Russia. "Alliance" was founded in 2010. This organization is a struggle against the legacy of empire and communism in Russia and also against illegal immigration of Muslim workers. "Alliance" requires separate Moslem republics of the Caucasus from Russia. .. The images are presented in the exhibition on the TV made in 2001 "when the leaders have not deal with politics and fumbled on" Church of Nawi ", the direction of religion ancient Indian and has no connection to Nazism. Edit the channel had to first contact the office of the" alliance "and request explanations. before showing on TV the lies.

372 researchok  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:53:07am

re: #367 Shiplord Kirel

See this: Word Wars

Here's a trailer:

Youtube Video
373 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:54:20am

re: #370 Obdicut

He was a deeply screwed up dude, and I wouldn't let my (hypothetical kids) anywhere near him, but that's not because he was a child molestor, but that he might have been a child molestor.

A friend of mine who actually got to interview him repeatedly, including before the accident, said that he thought that was actually the trigger for his bizarre behavior. Before getting so badly burned, he was quirky and odd, but not nearly as strange. After it, he was addicted to painkillers and still in residual pain. My friend felt all his bizarre escapist crap was wanting to get away from that pain and the burn, get back to before it happened.

Makes kind of sense to me.

Have you seen this?

[Video]

Obviously I wouldn't let my (hypothetical) kids near any weirdos either, potential cm's or not. But I followed the last case and it was really a sham, IMHO. The kids were lying their asses off and knew what they were doing.

374 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 2:57:40am

re: #369 Sergey Romanov

A judge ordered pics of his junk. He paid millions, hot hundreds of thousands, to shut people up. But either way, I mentioned to read the comments. Here's one:
KISS is awful-talk about has-beens. They can't sing, they dress like homosexual­s, put on make-up...­yeah, really 'cool.'
Secondly, KISS' leader is a staunch Zionist. He doesn't mind disrespect­ing women, having kids out of wedlock, but he worships Israel and he does believe American lives should be sacrificed for Israel (I don't think any life should be sacrificed for that Zionist pariah state).

I am happy they cancelled it-Michael wasn't a bad person. I don't believe he ever actually molested anybody. I'm not even a fan of his music, except for Thriller and some of the singles later on.

KISS is disgusting­-I think a whorehouse has too much class to host those Zionist racists.

Heh.

375 sattv4u2  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:00:20am

And on that note, the long quiet drive home beckons as I start my "weekend"

376 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:02:20am

re: #371 Sergey Romanov

Another interesting thing about Suris' FB is that he likes ARI. ARI is "Agency of Russian Information" with an obvious play in "Aryan" ("ariets", "arijskij"). They're an odd bunch, anti-"Russian elite", anti-Commie, even "functionally" pro-Israel and pro-West (like Shiro and Laza), but if you dig deeper, you'll find all the usual Talmud citations and whatnot.

377 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:05:08am

re: #374 Cannadian Club Akbar

A judge ordered pics of his junk. He paid millions, hot hundreds of thousands, to shut people up.

If there was anything in the first case (to which the pics are related) he would have been prosecuted regardless of the settlement. It's like, you cannot settle for committing murder, is there any diff with molesting? If the detectives had any evidence, they would have proceeded. We only have Sneddon's word that the description allegedly matched the pictures, and we know how Sneddon hated J.

378 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:15:42am

re: #377 Sergey Romanov

Here's a bit on those photos and descriptions:

[Link: books.google.com...]

Jordy said the singer then took off his clothes and the boy noticed that he had very little pubic hair and had been circumcised.

Of course, the autopsy showed that MJ was uncircumcised.

379 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:18:55am

re: #378 Sergey Romanov

Here's a bit on those photos and descriptions:

[Link: books.google.com...]

Of course, the autopsy showed that MJ was uncircumcised.

I missed the sign that said "Dead man's penis discussion" when I came into the thread.

380 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:19:36am

re: #379 Obdicut

Nobody promised it would be easy.

381 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:24:34am

You two are killing me.....

382 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:30:01am

re: #379 Obdicut

"Dead Man's Penis" would be a good name for a rock band.

383 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:42:42am

re: #382 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

"Dead Man's Penis" would be a good name for a rock band.

All right. I had to Googly "Dead Man's Penis" and I came across this:
THE GREATEST NAME FOR A BAND EVAH!!!

384 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:44:14am

re: #383 Cannadian Club Akbar

I had to Googly "Dead Man's Penis"

You're a brave man, sir.

385 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:49:56am

Freestajlo

Youtube Video
386 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:54:40am

So, Drudge has a link to a story about how Obama Merchandising has taken a tail-spin. This is not about Obama, but I wanted to share Obama merchandise that I have actually seen in a customer's house since his nomination and election. I have seen;

Barack Obama Pillows
Barack Obama's books
Books about Barack Obama
Books about Michelle Obama
Barack Obama Calendars
Barack Obama's Family Calendars
Barack and Michelle Obama Calendars
Barack Obama Throw blankets (mounted on walls and over the back of couches and chairs)
Barack Obama inauguration commemorative decorative plates
Barack Obama Presidential Photos
Barack Obama Coffee Mugs
Barack Obama Chia Pet
Barack Obama Figurines (assorted)
Barack Obama Posters (assorted)
Obama Mints (Yes We Candy) (kidding!)
And other stuff I don't remember, or I'm not sure, so I left it off.

387 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:55:56am

<spam>
Sandefur: 'No, we shouldn't take Ron Paul more seriously'
</spam>

388 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:56:50am

re: #386 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You forgot these:
[Link: www.knoxnews.com...]

389 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:57:36am

Well, this sucks.

[Link: www.courthousenews.com...]

An enlisted man at Fort Bragg repeatedly told officers that he wanted to kill a dozen men in his unit, and himself, but they discouraged him from seeking help "because it would 'mess up' his military career," a woman says. After months of this negligence, she says, he broke into her home on base and raped her under threat of killing her children.

Plaintiff M.N.D. sued the United States of America for negligence, in Federal Court. The United States is the only defendant.

M.N.D. says she was raped by "Specialist Pernell." The 6-page complaint does not state his first name. News-14 Carolina, a Time Warner station, reported in December 2010 that Army Specialist Aaron Pernell pleaded guilty to raping a woman at Fort Bragg and was sentenced to 50 years in military prison. He also pleaded guilty to battery and burglary, according to the Dec. 9 TV news report.

A specialist is an enlisted rank, just above private first class.

According to M.N.D.'s complaint: "In March 2009, Specialist Pernell informed Staff Sergeant Rangel that he wanted to kill 11 current or former members of his unit, and that he also wanted to kill himself. Sergeant Rangel responded by telling Specialist Pernell that he should not seek mental health assistance because it would 'mess up' his military career."

What a fucking idiot. I can't even. Jeez.

390 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:58:06am

re: #383 Cannadian Club Akbar

For quite a while I tried to convince my son that a good name for a band would be "Sucking Chest Wound". He didn't buy it.

The first guy I ever saw take a random phrase and say "That would be a good name for a Rock Band" was Dave Barry.

Just giving credit.

391 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:58:38am

re: #386 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

[Link: www.google.com...]

392 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 3:59:53am

re: #388 Cannadian Club Akbar

I wasn't talking about Anti-Obama stuff.

These are things in black folks homes that shows the pride that they have in the man.

393 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:00:05am

re: #389 Obdicut

And people wonder why Islamist fanatics seem to (almost) slip through the cracks. Seems like a systemic problem.

394 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:01:26am

re: #390 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Love Dave Barry.

395 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:04:02am

re: #393 Sergey Romanov

We've become comfortable with a very high level of dysfunction in our armed services, and that is a disservice both to the country and to those men and women in uniform.

Especially given the wringer they've been put through for the past nine years.

396 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:05:57am

Skimming through Zombie's diatribe "Deconstructing SlutWalk", I don't even know what to say. What a mess of a writer.

397 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:07:53am

re: #389 Obdicut

I agree a thousand percent. It completely sucks, but, it is entirely accurate.

If you're a soldier? And you seek mental help because you want to put your commanding officer's, your fellow enlisted soldier's, your sergeant's, your (insert other person's) head on a pike after pissing down their severed necks?

It could damage your military career.

That being said, the person that he asked about it? Should've turned him in and they should have rubber roomed the fucker until they got him the help he needed.

398 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:08:17am

BTW, I wanted to ask - what with Zombie's Folsom street fair essay once proudly featured here? Is this a distortion?

399 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:09:49am

re: #398 Sergey Romanov

BTW, I wanted to ask - what with Zombie's Folsom street fair essay once proudly featured here? Is this a distortion?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

400 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:10:07am

re: #398 Sergey Romanov

Is what a distortion?

401 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:10:55am

re: #400 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Is what a distortion?

The photo essay. Is that what really happens there, or are those scenes marginal and not really what happens there most of the time?

402 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:11:26am

How is the morning going all?

403 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:14:58am

re: #401 Sergey Romanov

The photo essay. Is that what really happens there, or are those scenes marginal and not really what happens there most of the time?

It's the most extreme of what happens there.

I've been to Folsom three times. It is mainly a merchandising fair, with tons of leather, bondage, etc. equipment around. The street is blocked off for the event and entrance is controlled, though anyone is free to enter they're all warned what's coming up.

There's lots of public nudity, but very little actual public sex. You could probably find more going on on Lover's Lane or out at a nude beach.

I've never seen Zombie's photos, so I don't really know what it shows.

404 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:15:20am

re: #401 Sergey Romanov

I don't recall that being discredited.

405 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:15:47am

re: #401 Sergey Romanov

Oh. Don't know. During the "celebration" the pictorial depiction appeared to be pretty wide spread.

I think that getting a blow job while standing in front of a crowd would take an Olympic level of concentration.

406 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:16:45am

re: #403 Obdicut

It's the most extreme of what happens there.

I've been to Folsom three times. It is mainly a merchandising fair, with tons of leather, bondage, etc. equipment around. The street is blocked off for the event and entrance is controlled, though anyone is free to enter they're all warned what's coming up.

There's lots of public nudity, but very little actual public sex. You could probably find more going on on Lover's Lane or out at a nude beach.

I've never seen Zombie's photos, so I don't really know what it shows.

Her older photos are compelling. Although, the SlutWalk report is pretty lame, IMHO. I just checked them out. I have been to her site in probably 2 years.

407 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:17:18am

re: #405 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Oh. Don't know. During the "celebration" the pictorial depiction appeared to be pretty wide spread.

I think that getting a blow job while standing in front of a crowd would take an Olympic level of concentration.

It would be a turn-on for some.

408 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:17:43am

re: #406 ggt

Her older photos are compelling. Although, the SlutWalk report is pretty lame, IMHO. I just checked them out. I haven't been to her site in probably 2 years.

pimf

409 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:18:19am

re: #403 Obdicut

Thanks, that's why I asked, you being from SF. Could be that he indeed tried to seek out the most extreme situations.

410 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:19:23am

re: #403 Obdicut

Cop to Tea Partier: "Ahem. Sir? You really don't want to bring your ten year old daughter/son in here."
Tea Partier to Cop: "IT'S A FREE COUNTRY! YOU CAN'T INFRINGE ON MY RIGHTS! THIS IS AMERICA! NOT NAZI GERMANY!"
Cop to Tea Partier: "Of course, sir. Here's a Folsom Street Commemorative Lollypop for your little angel."

411 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:20:45am

re: #409 Sergey Romanov

Thanks, that's why I asked, you being from SF. Could be that he indeed tried to seek out the most extreme situations.

Let me put it this way: there's another event that some friends of mine go to because Folsom is way too tame for them.

In the three times I went, I once saw an incidence of public sex. The other times, I saw crowds indicating there was probably some sort of public sex thingy going on, but I wasn't all that interested so I didn't mosey over.

The gear that people wear can definitely be extreme for some. Oh, and nobody at all minded that I was just a straight dude dressed totally normally checking out the place.

There's also lots of sexual information and health booths, distributing condoms, getting people to sign up for AIDs tests, etc.

412 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:22:42am

re: #364 Cannadian Club Akbar

New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo signed a law Tuesday banning convicted sex offenders, sex traffickers, those who have lured children and people convicted of manslaughter, among others, from being school bus drivers. Capital Tonight reported the bill signing on its State of Politics blog.

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

You have GOT to be fucking kidding me. This is where I get in trouble for using common sense.

You'd think there would be a restriction against all felons, not just those of a certain flavor.

413 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:23:15am

Bay To Breakers is my preferrred transgressive event, though.

And it's so patriotic. See, Tea Partiers? you'd fit right in!

Image: Bay_to_Breakers_winners_02.jpg

414 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:23:45am

re: #413 Obdicut

Wazzat?

415 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:25:12am

re: #411 Obdicut

Without regard to the occasion, in my opinion, one or more people, straight or gay, having sex on a public street; should be arrested.

416 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:26:38am

re: #414 Sergey Romanov

It's a race from the bay to the ocean through San Francisco, where people dress up in costumes, get naked, get drunk, etc. Like a mobile Halloween party with exercise involved.

417 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:27:24am

re: #415 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Without regard to the occasion, in my opinion, one or more people, straight or gay, having sex on a public street; should be arrested.

I feel the same way. I understand some see it as a big turn-on and think they should be able to under controlled circumstances.

I just can't get my mind to wrap around that.

So, it's probably good I am not Queen.

418 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:28:01am

re: #412 ggt

You'd think there would be a restriction against all felons, not just those of a certain flavor.

Some felonies don't harm anyone but the felon, but, I'll agree when it comes to dealing with children. That story is a giant "No Fucking Kidding" piece. WTF are they doing up there where this wasn't already law?

419 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:29:15am

re: #415 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Without regard to the occasion, in my opinion, one or more people, straight or gay, having sex on a public street; should be arrested.

I think it's situational. Ironically enough, there's a gay parents group in the Castro that's ran a 'clean Castro' campaign for awhile to get people to consider that, now that a lot of gay couples had kids, the old frat-house atmosphere should be moderated slightly.

It's a community thing, that ineffable local standards deal.

I'd say just put the hose on them, or a big bucket of water.

420 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:29:38am

re: #415 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Without regard to the occasion, in my opinion, one or more people, straight or gay, having sex on a public street; should be arrested.

Also, nudity isn't exactly a right just because you're having a street fair. See: Mardi Gras.

421 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:31:00am

re: #420 Cannadian Club Akbar

I am very far from a nudist myself, but I'm totally undisturbed by the nudity of others. I'm more offended by people who wear terrible outfits.

I don't care if the person making my bagel is naked as long as he wears two hairnets.

422 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:32:09am

re: #421 Obdicut

I am very far from a nudist myself, but I'm totally undisturbed by the nudity of others. I'm more offended by people who wear terrible outfits.

I don't care if the person making my bagel is naked as long as he wears two hairnets.

Depends on who is nude.

423 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:32:56am

re: #422 ggt

Depends on who is nude.

And how he's holding the bagel.

424 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:33:54am

re: #403 Obdicut

It's the most extreme of what happens there.

I've been to Folsom three times. It is mainly a merchandising fair, with tons of leather, bondage, etc. equipment around. The street is blocked off for the event and entrance is controlled, though anyone is free to enter they're all warned what's coming up.

There's lots of public nudity, but very little actual public sex. You could probably find more going on on Lover's Lane or out at a nude beach.

I've never seen Zombie's photos, so I don't really know what it shows.

zombie found another event which was supposedly "even more extreme" than Folsom and of course, posted photos. I don't recall the name of that event.

425 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:34:06am

Not every human body is a work of art, IMHO.

Somethings I just don't need to see.

426 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:34:20am

re: #424 Alouette

zombie found another event which was supposedly "even more extreme" than Folsom and of course, posted photos. I don't recall the name of that event.

Up Your Alley.

427 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:34:57am

re: #422 ggt

Depends on who is nude.

Yeah, for some there has to be a whole hairnet outfit /

428 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:36:12am

re: #427 Sergey Romanov

Yeah, for some there has to be a whole hairnet outfit /

ewwwww

429 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:36:41am

re: #426 ggt

Up Your Alley.

That's when I realized that zombie was just using outrageous outrage as an excuse to view gay pr0n.

430 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:37:01am

I"ve seen some of those bodies on zombie's site.

A tent wouldn't be enough.

431 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:37:45am

re: #427 Sergey Romanov

Yeah, for some there has to be a whole hairnet outfit /

[Link: media.photobucket.com...]

432 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:38:03am

Uh oh, SPLC fumbled here:

In February 2011, she spoke favorably of Soviet leader Josef Stalin's forced relocation and genocide of Chechen Muslims after World War II, arguing – wrongly – that they were allied with Adolf Hitler. Historians say Chechens were fighting to preserve their own freedom and culture.

The reason the deportation of Chechens was wrong because it was done for the sins of the few. Not because those Chechens who collaborated with the Nazis were "fighting to preserve their own freedom and culture". That's apology of collaborationism right there.

433 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:38:43am

re: #428 ggt

ewww

I meant Chewbacca, of course. What did you have in mind? /

434 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:39:08am

re: #429 Alouette

I thought Zombie is a chick?

435 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:39:36am

re: #433 Sergey Romanov

I meant Chewbacca, of course. What did you have in mind? /

Klingons.

436 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:39:43am

re: #434 Cannadian Club Akbar

I thought Zombie is a chick?

Nah, he's a dick.

437 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:40:30am

re: #435 ggt

Klingons.

Hairy people have Klingons.
/

438 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:41:55am

re: #437 Cannadian Club Akbar

Hairy people have Klingons.
/

What do Furries have?

439 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:42:52am

re: #438 ggt

What do Furries have?

Issues.

440 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:48:12am

OMG! I get lots of email, much I don't read and am too lazy to "desubscribe". I think I may have to compose a rebuttal to this one tho:


From the desk of David Horowitz.

Dear Fellow Conservative,

A woman of extraordinary courage and vision is under attack.

Pamela Geller, who was awarded last year by the Freedom Center for her courage in the war against tyranny, is the target of a $10 million intimidation lawsuit designed to silence, once and for all, one of America's most vibrant voices speaking out in defense of the freedom of speech, the freedom of conscience, and the equality of rights of all people.

And it's all because she rushed to the defense of a young girl in fear for her life.

In July 2009, a seventeen-year-old girl named Rifqa Bary ran away from her home in Ohio, saying that her father threatened to kill her upon discovering that she had converted from Islam to Christianity. There followed a bitter custody battle: Rifqa fought hard to stay out of her parents' home while the Islamic supremacists such as the Hamas-linked Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) did all they could to force her to go back. Due in large part to Pamela Geller's efforts, the Islamic supremacists lost, and Rifqa remained free and able to exercise her freedom of conscience. But now the losers are determined to exact revenge upon the freedom fighter who protected Rifqa from harm.

Omar Tarazi, the lawyer for the parents of Rifqa Bary, is suing Pamela for ten million dollars for libel, for things she wrote in good faith about the case at her acclaimed and award-winning blog AtlasShrugs.com. The great lawyer David Yerushalmi is representing Pamela Geller in this frivolous lawsuit, and he is generously donating his time and expertise pro bono. Nonetheless, Pamela's ancillary legal expenses relating to this suit are spiraling. The Freedom Center has offered to help raise the funds needed for her legal defense. That means we need to raise a minimum of $30,000 in the next 48 hours to cover the first set of legal fees. Will you help us?

Please follow this link right away to make a generous tax-deductible contribution to the Freedom Center Legal Defense Fund, so we can continue to support Pamela.

441 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:50:05am

I posted this Page about Pammy earlier.

So, Pammy is getting sued. Big surprise.

442 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:50:09am

This will never pass. One of the reasons people go into the military at a young age is because they're still young when they receive (earned) financial benefits. And tell me this; How much will an E1 put toward a 401K style savings account?
[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]

443 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:51:53am

re: #442 Cannadian Club Akbar

This will never pass. One of the reasons people go into the military at a young age is because they're still young when they receive (earned) financial benefits. And tell me this; How much will an E1 put toward a 401K style savings account?
[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]

I have a hard time with this.

I see so many old vets, shuffling around with their baseball caps on. The caps proudly announce what ship or batallion they served in. Veteran's benefits are what these men depend on.

444 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:52:58am

re: #420 Cannadian Club Akbar

Also, nudity isn't exactly a right just because you're having a street fair. See: Mardi Gras.

BJs or sex on the street? Jail.

Flash a boobie? Well... I like boobies so that's okay. I like sex and BJs too(umm... getting BJs) but NOT okay in public.

445 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:54:02am

Geller does indeed apologize Stalin's ethnic cleansing:

[Link: atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com...]

Approvingly quotes someone else:

This region (North Caucasus) was a big source of the Muslim Waffen SS Divisions during World War II. The Waffen SS Divisions fought with the Nazis against the Russians on the eastern front during WW2. For that reason Stalin relocated most Muslims in the region to Siberia. Khrushchev brought them back in 1956. Khrushchev made a mistake in doing that.

[Link: atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com...]

These are the same soulless Islamic savages who ripped through the children's school in Beslan -- murder, rape, torture.

Joseph Stalin deported the entire Chechen (Muslim) people from their homeland in 1944 as punishment for their collaborating with the Nazi invaders during the Second World War. The whole Muslim world aligned with Hitler, and they continue with their evil imperialist goals.

446 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:54:59am

re: #425 ggt

Not every human body is a work of art, IMHO.

Somethings I just don't need to see.

Spandex/Nudity/Mini-skirt/Muscle Shirt is a privilege, not a right.

447 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:55:15am

re: #443 ggt

I have a hard time with this.

I see so many old vets, shuffling around with their baseball caps on. The caps proudly announce what ship or batallion they served in. Veteran's benefits are what these men depend on.

Well, someone having 20 or so years in at age 40 shouldn't have to wait for 25 (+/-) more years to receive bennies. Plus, anyone who tries to get elected using this as a platform will be known as a failed politician.

448 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 4:55:16am

re: #441 ggt

I posted this Page about Pammy earlier.

So, Pammy is getting sued. Big surprise.

BWAHAHAHA!

449 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:03:06am

If Palin is every conservative man's fantasy wife, what is Geller?

450 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:04:49am

re: #445 Sergey Romanov

Imagine that, an ostensibly right-wing, conservative, pro-Western writer takes Stalinist claims at face value.

451 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:07:40am

What really pisses-me-off is that if Geller and her ilk would put their resources in imagined threats. If they put 1/2 on REAL threats to the children (future) of this country, think what could be done.

See my #354


grrrrr

452 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:13:10am

Puppies are taking their morning nap.

I think I'll join them.

Have a great morning all!

453 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:20:35am

bbiab

454 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:22:06am

Morning Lizardim. Happy Hump Day. Following a series of spectacular thunderstorms, looks like today is going to be the perfect day to finish hacking down the rest of my lawn. Maybe if I have enough time, I'll even bust out the weed eater.

455 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:22:38am

re: #419 Obdicut

If your kids weren't so hypothetical, you'd feel differently.
/

456 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:24:58am

re: #454 thedopefishlives

How I love a spectacular thunderstorm.

457 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:28:46am

re: #454 thedopefishlives

Morning Lizardim. Happy Hump Day. Following a series of spectacular thunderstorms, looks like today is going to be the perfect day to finish hacking down the rest of my lawn. Maybe if I have enough time, I'll even bust out the weed eater.

Weed wacker:
[Link: www.nbcchicago.com...]

458 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:30:41am

re: #455 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I really don't think so. I don't think that seeing sex is really harmful to kids just confusing and weird.

Back in ye bad olde days, the poor generally couldn't avoid having sex in front of their kids. Some medieval writing on the subject is kind of funny, in a very uncomfortable way.

I'm not saying that I'd in any way intentionally expose my kids to anyone having sex, but I don't think it causes any sort of real damage or harm.

I came across people having sex in the park when I was a kid, and I don't remember it being anything more than a 'what the hell is that, adults are weird' moment.

459 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:31:20am

re: #456 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

How I love a spectacular thunderstorm.

And I as well. The best ones are where the lightning begins well before the rain arrives; my wife and I will go out on our deck and watch God's fireworks show for a while.

460 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:31:30am

re: #456 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

How I love a spectacular thunderstorm.

As long as:

1. I am not driving through it.
2. The power stays on.

461 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:35:03am

I was watching a PBS documentary last night about the life of Dolley Madison, who pretty much defined the role of "First Lady" in American life. Zedushka came into the room and said, "What are you watching?" I said, "a documentary about Dolley Madison," he said, "Ice cream or cupcakes?"

462 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:35:12am

re: #458 Obdicut

I guess it's cultural. It's probably only American kids who freak out when they figure out that their parents have even had sex.

463 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:36:25am

re: #460 Alouette

As long as:

1. I am not driving through it.
2. The power stays on.

Heh. I actually like driving in thunderstorms. I enjoy blizzards even more. Yes, I know I'm crazy, but I live for the challenge.

464 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:36:32am

re: #458 Obdicut

You're so enlightened.

You make me sick.

I'm just sayin'...

465 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:38:43am

re: #450 Sergey Romanov

Imagine that, an ostensibly right-wing, conservative, pro-Western writer takes Stalinist claims at face value.

Not that uncommon, really. Goes together with the whole extremist, Ayn-Rand, "pro-capitalism", "anti-left" bent. I've written about this before: In their anti-communist haze, a lot of conservatives try to resemble the villains in the anti-capitalist propaganda of their actual communist enemies, thus adopting key narrative elements of that propaganda (if only to oppose them by switching "good" and "evil"). Their pro-capitalism is just an extreme anti-anti-capitalism.

466 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:39:36am

re: #463 thedopefishlives

Heh. I actually like driving in thunderstorms. I enjoy blizzards even more. Yes, I know I'm crazy, but I live for the challenge.

Let me guess: you drive a big truck or SUV.

467 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:40:48am

re: #466 Alouette

Let me guess: you drive a big truck or SUV.

After the accident I was in 6 years ago, I have a very hard time driving anything smaller. I was rear-ended by a fully loaded gravel truck and it tore my full-size pickup literally in half.

468 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:41:25am

re: #465 000G

Expanding on that: Zombie in his/her slutwalk article seems to imply that it is okay to state the following: "It is perfectly fine that women should expect to be raped when dressed in an immodest way".

The irony is that that could be taken right out of the pro-burqa sharia playbook they pretend to oppose.

STOP DRESSING LIKE A FLOOZY OR ELSE!!1

469 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:41:27am

I was gonna mention this cereal sucks, but someone beat me to it. Fuckin' garbage.
[Link: www.theimpulsivebuy.com...]

470 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:42:00am

re: #464 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

A totally real picture of me to prove it!

Image: bay4.jpg

(not).

471 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:42:53am

re: #465 000G

Didn't you find a quote by Fjordy calling exactly for deportations?

472 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:43:30am

re: #471 Sergey Romanov

Didn't you find a quote by Fjordy calling exactly for deportations?

Lots of them. Want some examples?

473 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:44:21am

re: #472 000G

Lots of them. Want some examples?

Yeah, I'll "favorite" them, which I failed to do last time.

474 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:45:34am

MUSLIM FANATICS SPANKED THEIR CHILD TO DEATH IN THE NAME OF THEIR GOD!!!!!

[Link: www.rawstory.com...]

CNN’s Gary Tuchman reported Monday on a fundamentalist Christian couple who killed their 7-year-old adopted daughter while practicing a violent form of discipline.

They reportedly beat their nine children regularly because they thought God wanted them to. Both parents were jailed after pleading guilty to the crime and the surviving children are now in foster homes.

Wait... nevermind.

475 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:46:48am

re: #474 Sergey Romanov

Not to mention the preventable deaths of the children of Jehovah's Witnesses every year..........

476 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:47:23am

re: #473 Sergey Romanov

Yeah, I'll "favorite" them, which I failed to do last time.

Oh, now I remember. You probably mean the quote I found on MetaFilter. The actual LGF thread is gone (or hidden). You may find the full quote elsewhere… That is the only one I know from Fjordman here on LGF.

477 wiffersnapper  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:47:35am

All that work for a browser no one should be using anymore?

478 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:47:57am

re: #475 wozzablog

Not to mention the preventable deaths of the children of Jehovah's Witnesses every year...

There was a Babylon 5 episode on illustrating this... basically arguing for the "freedom of religion/tradition". Not sure I agreed with that.

479 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:51:20am

re: #478 Sergey Romanov

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

480 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:51:29am

re: #478 Sergey Romanov

There was a Babylon 5 episode on illustrating this... basically arguing for the "freedom of religion/tradition". Not sure I agreed with that.

The episode presented both sides, and showed the parents as monsters, afterwards, since they then killed their son out of religious belief.

481 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:51:45am

As for Norwegian Kafir, Fjordman's alter ego from June 2003 to May 2005:

7/23/2004 3:16:28 pm PDT
#30 happycynic:

I don't think Islam will succeed in taking over the west. Basically, given how the muslim populations act now towards their hosts, they will sufficiently provoke europe into a drastic "expel the Moors part II" before gaining enough power to take over.

This is what I have been arguing for a long time now. I live in a small, sleepy and naive little nation on Europe's Northern fringe. Muslims make up no more than 2% of the population, and I can already sense a hostility in the native population towards the Muhammedan newcomers that is pretty remarkable for such a soft country. I can only imagine what is stirring in the UK or other places.

This thing about Europe not being "Christian enough" to fight is crap. I am an agnostic or atheist myself. I have never been religious in any way, and I HATE Islam. I would second using almost ANY means to keep Islam out of my children's continent. That includes the use of strategic nuclear weapons, if it comes to that.


9/11/2004 10:13:28 pm PDT

I don't want these people in jail. I want them expelled. Europe needs to repatriate most, if not all, of her Muslim immigrants. Or the entire continent will slowly collapse. The USA is in a stronger position still, but you are not immune to this problem, either.

Muslims out of the West. Now!


9/11/2004 10:34:45 pm PDT

Well, expelling only delays the day of reckoning we'll have with these Islamic sociopaths.


Yes, it does. But it is a necessary start. It is hard to fight a war in the Middle East at the same time as you are fighting a war in your own major cities.

But it's true: An Islamic "retreat" to the Middle East just isn't good enough anymore. Islam will still be around to kill more innocent people at a later stage. Islam needs to be destroyed on a global basis, not in the West only. Ali Sina is right: Islam cannot be reformed. It needs to be eradicated. The only thing we should discuss is HOW to do it, and in a manner killing as few people as possible.

There is a lot more of these…

482 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:53:17am

re: #480 Obdicut

Sinclair was a paragon of a "good guy", so seeing him argue for "freedom of religion" in this case was disturbing.

483 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:53:29am

re: #481 000G

Context:

I’ve posted this many times in LGF comments, but with the increasing extremism of the so-called “anti-jihad movement,” it’s time to make it a front page post.

If you argue that it’s vitally necessary to deport the entire Muslim population of the United States, you are ADVOCATING MASS MURDER.

Yes, I’m shouting.

There is no way in hell that you can uproot millions of people, most of whom have done nothing wrong, and throw them all out of the country, without committing mass violence. People will resist this with all their hearts.

No decent American would stand for it. It’s an un-American, evil idea to its very core.

And not only that, it’s a stupid, empty, meaningless fantasy that will never happen. When you start ranting about it at LGF, you achieve nothing but to drag everyone here into the muck, and make us all look like extremists, fascists, and brain-dead morons. Only a very few comments like this appear at LGF, but they can tar the whole site by association.

Unfortunately, there are quite a few “anti-jihad” blogs that have no problem whatsoever with this kind of hate speech, and some that actually invite it, so if you really want to rave like a lunatic about it you can easily find somewhere that will let you. But I won’t tolerate it here, and if you post a comment advocating this reeking garbage heap of an idea, your comment will be deleted and your account will be history.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

484 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:56:38am

re: #482 Sergey Romanov

Sinclair was a paragon of a "good guy", so seeing him argue for "freedom of religion" in this case was disturbing.

I didn't see him arguing for that, so much, as "You can't change their entire culture, so fighting this one fight will not win you anything."

In the end, he was right, in so far as the parents killed their child after the operation was performed, convinced he was now a demon.

Unless you're going to forcibly take all the children who need surgical attention from those parents and then raise them yourself, performing life-saving surgery is not actually going to save lives.

It's a tricky bunch of stuff to deal with. Children complicate governmental ethics in an extreme way.

485 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:56:47am

re: #467 thedopefishlives

After the accident I was in 6 years ago, I have a very hard time driving anything smaller. I was rear-ended by a fully loaded gravel truck and it tore my full-size pickup literally in half.

After my accident in January in the Mazda RX7 (which is a totally shitty car for driving in bad weather), I went out and bought a Ford SUV. If I had not had that accident and bought the new car in the spring like I had been planning, I would probably have bought a midsize car like the Fusion.

Anyway I like my SUV. Can't imagine driving something smaller.

486 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:57:21am

re: #469 Cannadian Club Akbar

I was gonna mention this cereal sucks, but someone beat me to it. Fuckin' garbage.
[Link: www.theimpulsivebuy.com...]

Bowl O' Sawdust!

487 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:57:26am

re: #483 000G

Also notice the hefty evolution LGF has undergone (a 2004 front page post like this, citing the NY Post, was not uncommon) – while Fjordman has not, and the place he hides out today, GoV, these days posts press releases by the fascist French Front National. Fjordman & co openly align themselves with well-established racists and fascists (post-Breivik, mind you), while Charles had the foresight to pull the emergency break.

488 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:57:36am

re: #484 Obdicut

Well, that's a clusterfuck alright.

489 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:58:47am

re: #485 Alouette

After my accident in January in the Mazda RX7 (which is a totally shitty car for driving in bad weather), I went out and bought a Ford SUV. If I had not had that accident and bought the new car in the spring like I had been planning, I would probably have bought a midsize car like the Fusion.

Anyway I like my SUV. Can't imagine driving something smaller.

Yeah. I miss my truck. Currently, with the 73.5 mile round trip commute to work, I had to downgrade to a little rolling deathtrap for financial reasons. Spending $600/mo on gas was getting to be just a tad bit too much.

490 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:01:26am

re: #487 000G

That's basically why I'm annoyed by "LGF hasn't changed, the right has gone crazy" meme ;)

491 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:02:51am

re: #490 Sergey Romanov

That's basically why I'm annoyed by "LGF hasn't changed, the right has gone crazy" meme ;)

Right. LGF has changed, AND the right has gone crazy. Well, crazier, anyway.

492 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:03:30am

bbl

493 iossarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:05:23am

re: #484 Obdicut


It's a tricky bunch of stuff to deal with. Children complicate governmental ethics in an extreme way.

One of the things I think about the "right-wing"/"left-wing" divide is that it hinges largely on the extent to which you believe that parents/governments are responsible for bringing a child from birth to adulthood.

494 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:10:09am

re: #493 iossarian

One of the things I think about the "right-wing"/"left-wing" divide is that it hinges largely on the extent to which you believe that parents/governments are responsible for bringing a child from birth to adulthood.

Er, how so? Many on the 'right-wing' want the government to intervene in all sorts of ways to prevent the child from being exposed to various influences.

495 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:11:15am

re: #491 thedopefishlives

Right. LGF has changed, AND the right has gone crazy. Well, crazier, anyway.

Not the guy with two thumbs (this guy). I've gone more moderate.

496 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:13:40am

re: #494 Obdicut

Er, how so? Many on the 'right-wing' want the government to intervene in all sorts of ways to prevent the child from being exposed to various influences.

Like naked people. :-)

497 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:13:49am

re: #495 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Not the guy with two thumbs (this guy). I've gone more moderate.

I think the ebb and flow of some ideas are natural, unless a person is a hard right or left kook.

498 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:13:56am

re: #495 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Not the guy with two thumbs (this guy). I've gone more moderate.

Well, me too. But we're counted among the lizardoid people and not the crazies, I think.

499 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:14:09am

So, I have an appointment with a customer this morning that lives in a double wide and is about to move it.

What the fuck? Who puts a new floor in a house before they load it on a fucking truck?

500 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:14:41am

re: #494 Obdicut

Er, how so? Many on the 'right-wing' want the government to intervene in all sorts of ways to prevent the child from being exposed to various influences.

Or punish/threaten to keep it from going off the straight and narrow.

Big Daddy/Fingerwagging Mommy Government.

501 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:14:58am

re: #499 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

So, I have an appointment with a customer this morning that lives in a double wide and is about to move it.

What the fuck? Who puts a new floor in a house before they load it on a fucking truck?

Rich people, obviously!!

502 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:15:01am

re: #495 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Long before I was on LGF, I was a pretty hardcore Randian libertarian.

Then I actually thought about the logic of it, the assumptions it made, ran the numbers, and realized it was a load of bullshit.

503 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:19:05am

re: #502 Obdicut

Long before I was on LGF, I was a pretty hardcore Randian libertarian.

Then I actually thought about the logic of it, the assumptions it made, ran the numbers, and realized it was a load of bullshit.

Petitioning for a page recounting this in detail.

504 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:20:37am

re: #503 000G

Petitioning for a page recounting this in detail.

Men. At the moment, dieting on my 1400 calorie a day ration, I'm not expressing myself all that well. Remind me in a couple of weeks, would you?

505 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:22:00am

re: #504 Obdicut

Men. At the moment, dieting on my 1400 calorie a day ration, I'm not expressing myself all that well. Remind me in a couple of weeks, would you?

1400 a day? See my #469.

506 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:23:12am

re: #504 Obdicut

Men. At the moment, dieting on my 1400 calorie a day ration, I'm not expressing myself all that well. Remind me in a couple of weeks, would you?

Sure thing. What's this diet about anyhow?

507 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:23:37am

re: #505 Cannadian Club Akbar

The odd part is I'm really enjoying what I eat. It's brought me back to a sort of minimalism. A poached egg and a diced potato with paprika, garlic is a very nice breakfast.

508 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:24:39am

re: #507 Obdicut

The odd part is I'm really enjoying what I eat. It's brought me back to a sort of minimalism. A poached egg and a diced potato with paprika, garlic is a very nice breakfast.

I eat "breakfast stew". Poached eggs and grits.

509 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:25:09am

re: #506 000G

Sure thing. What's this diet about anyhow?

I was slowly gaining weight, so I wanted to get control over it, bring myself back down to an ideal weight. Then I'm going to get back into an exercise routine. Basically, my fifteen or so extra pounds were getting in the way of both my pants fitting and my exercise, since I find it off-putting to run along with that tube of lard strapped to my waist.

It's also to help my wife diet at the same time. Always easier with two.

510 iossarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:26:16am

re: #494 Obdicut

Er, how so? Many on the 'right-wing' want the government to intervene in all sorts of ways to prevent the child from being exposed to various influences.

I don't think they particularly want the government to intervene as much as they want the power, as parents, to decide what their kids are exposed to. Maybe I'm getting a bit too clever there, I admit.

I just think that, psychologically, a large part of the "free market/low tax" ethos stems from the idea that I, as an individual, should be able to decide how to dispose of the fruit of my achievements, which is very often expressed as a parent-child transfer.

Whereas, equally, a large part of the "shared resources/redistribution" ethos stems from the idea that poor and vulnerable individuals should be protected and nurtured regardless of their circumstances, which is often expressed as looking out for at-risk children.

511 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:30:25am

re: #510 iossarian

I don't think they particularly want the government to intervene as much as they want the power, as parents, to decide what their kids are exposed to. Maybe I'm getting a bit too clever there, I admit.

I think you are, given that social conservatives strongly favor the FCC intervening to censor shows, books being limited in libraries, and the teaching of creationism in schools. That may be "I want to decide what my kid is exposed to", but it's the government that is the agent of that.

I just think that, psychologically, a large part of the "free market/low tax" ethos stems from the idea that I, as an individual, should be able to decide how to dispose of the fruit of my achievements, which is very often expressed as a parent-child transfer.

I'm sorry, I don't get the connection between 'fruit of my achievements' and kids. Are you saying that those sort of individualistic conservatives view their kids as 'theirs', their creation, and theirs to do with as they will?

512 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:33:13am

re: #500 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Or punish/threaten to keep it from going off the straight and narrow.

Big Daddy/Fingerwagging Mommy Government.

Do remember that both parties have that problem, and they both display it often enough that to say so is not MBF material. "Big Brother" knows best is a serious problem for America.

513 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:35:02am

re: #510 iossarian

I don't think they particularly want the government to intervene as much as they want the power, as parents, to decide what their kids are exposed to. Maybe I'm getting a bit too clever there, I admit.

I just think that, psychologically, a large part of the "free market/low tax" ethos stems from the idea that I, as an individual, should be able to decide how to dispose of the fruit of my achievements, which is very often expressed as a parent-child transfer.

Whereas, equally, a large part of the "shared resources/redistribution" ethos stems from the idea that poor and vulnerable individuals should be protected and nurtured regardless of their circumstances, which is often expressed as looking out for at-risk children.

You summed up the conservative view correctly in that bolded portion, and that's how I think.

514 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:35:30am

re: #513 Dark_Falcon

Well, can you explain it to me, then?

Do you think kids 'belong' to their parents?

515 iossarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:38:55am

re: #511 Obdicut

I think you are, given that social conservatives strongly favor the FCC intervening to censor shows, books being limited in libraries, and the teaching of creationism in schools. That may be "I want to decide what my kid is exposed to", but it's the government that is the agent of that.

Sure, they want government intervention. I'm more thinking about why they want it, though. My thought (and it is just a thought) is that if you have a school curriculum on which society broadly agrees (assume it includes a range of potentially objectionable items such as saluting the flag vs. sex education), then left-wing parents in general are more likely to take the view that it's worth going along with the whole curriculum since it may lead to a cohesive society, whereas right-wing parents in general are more likely to object to specific items if they feel they undermine the parents' role in raising their children.


I'm sorry, I don't get the connection between 'fruit of my achievements' and kids. Are you saying that those sort of individualistic conservatives view their kids as 'theirs', their creation, and theirs to do with as they will?

I'm saying that the right-wing economic view is that society functions best when the individual has freedom to decide how to allocate her resources, and that this view (I suspect) stems at least in part from the more primitive concept of the individual taking more responsibility for its offspring than the herd.

516 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:40:57am

re: #515 iossarian

Sure, they want government intervention. I'm more thinking about why they want it, though.

Ah. And I'm more concerned with the mechanism of action. So, just different perspectives.


I'm saying that the right-wing economic view is that society functions best when the individual has freedom to decide how to allocate her resources, and that this view (I suspect) stems at least in part from the more primitive concept of the individual taking more responsibility for its offspring than the herd.

Oh, I absolutely think parents have more responsibilities towards their children. I don't think that translates very easily into them having ultimate discretion on how to raise their kids, since many of those methods of raising them are, in fact, failing in those responsibilities.

517 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:45:26am

re: #514 Obdicut

Well, can you explain it to me, then?

Do you think kids 'belong' to their parents?

No I don't, but neither do they belong to the state either (I'm not suggesting that you argued that). Parents should take the lead in determining what is right for their children. Not only should they, but if they can't it's unlikely anyone else can. There are, to be sure, many cases where teachers or social workers have helped children get past the problems of a parent who didn't or couldn't really do their part, but those cases are the exceptions. Most often Children flounder without proper parenting. Thus, I think the conservative view correct and argue that the law should allow parents the choices proper to the primacy of their role.

518 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:47:24am

re: #517 Dark_Falcon

Parents should take the lead in determining what is right for their children.

And what if those parents are bigoted against gays, and their child is gay?

Not only should they, but if they can't it's unlikely anyone else can.

I'm not really sure what you mean by this, but while nobody replaces a parent, kids look in a lot of places for support-- including other family members.

Most often Children flounder without proper parenting. Thus, I think the conservative view correct and argue that the law should allow parents the choices proper to the primacy of their role.

Again: What about gay kids with socially conservative parents? Just as one example?

519 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:51:16am

re: #512 Dark_Falcon

Do remember that both parties have that problem, and they both display it often enough that to say so is not MBF material. "Big Brother" knows best is a serious problem for America.

The post wasn't about "parties", it was about the rightwing. "Straight and narrow" is just shorthand for rightwing anxiety over controlling the morality of others using the power of the state. It's why so many rightwingers despise and resent non-cons in the first place, because generally, we do not have that anxiety, and resist their attempts to impose it on everyone else around them.

520 iossarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:56:24am

re: #516 Obdicut


Oh, I absolutely think parents have more responsibilities towards their children. I don't think that translates very easily into them having ultimate discretion on how to raise their kids, since many of those methods of raising them are, in fact, failing in those responsibilities.

I very much agree with this, which is in large part why I tend towards the "left-wing", government-responsibility view of childrearing.

A further connection between childrearing and politics is the obvious psychological relationship between parent-induced toy sharing and government-induced wealth redistribution.

"Now, Mr. Koch, it's time for Mr. Razinski to have a turn with the mountains of money."

521 iossarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:56:58am

BBL

522 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:58:49am

re: #517 Dark_Falcon

Thus, I think the conservative view correct and argue that the law should allow parents the choices proper to the primacy of their role.

Right, and slave children at least had two-parent families e_e.

Conservative/repressive parenting has little to do with choices. People intimidated by the idea of choices for their children are certainly free to impose conservative repression on their children; no one is stopping them. But you should be aware that it can often result in children who grow up to think for themselves, the worst case scenario for control-freak parents.

523 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 6:59:08am

re: #518 Obdicut

And what if those parents are bigoted against gays, and their child is gay?

I'm not really sure what you mean by this, but while nobody replaces a parent, kids look in a lot of places for support-- including other family members.

Again: What about gay kids with socially conservative parents? Just as one example?

Children should have means of reaching out if parents become abusive. Parents should have a right to disapprove of the choices their children make, but not to engage in abuse.

There is, of course, the issue of what constitutes abuse (beyond the kinds of physical and sexual sorts of abuse that we here would all condemn). But the specifics of that question is not matter where I feel competent to set the limits. I can define general parameters, but don't have the expertise for specifics.

524 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:01:13am

re: #522 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Right, and slave children at least had two-parent families e_e.

Don't you dare try to run that shit in on me! Nothing I said was racist nor merited that kind of ugly response.

525 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:01:38am

re: #523 Dark_Falcon

Children should have means of reaching out if parents become abusive.

Lol reaching out to whom?

Socon environments are often closed systems with nowhere for a child or young adult to turn. It's that way by design.

But the specifics of that question is not matter where I feel competent to set the limits. I can define general parameters, but don't have the expertise for specifics.

In other words...clueless and just guessing.

526 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:03:14am

re: #523 Dark_Falcon

Children should have means of reaching out if parents become abusive. Parents should have a right to disapprove of the choices their children make, but not to engage in abuse.

I'm not talking about rights. I'm talking about what is best for the kid.

Can you explain how parents who are bigoted against gays are the best people to make decisions for the well-being of a gay child?

527 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:03:47am

re: #522 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Conservative/repressive parenting has little to do with choices. People intimidated by the idea of choices for their children are certainly free to impose conservative repression on their children; no one is stopping them.

I don't see why conservative parenting would have little to do with choices. I can certainly see that a conservative parent would have other ideas of the choices that were actually available to their children than a liberal parent, and would thus strive to make their children aware of other sets of choices, but I think in general the idea of making your children aware of the choices they got (even though the parental recognition of what choices are available or what ammounts to a good choice or a bad choice might differ according to political pov) is a rather "bipartisan" one.

528 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:03:59am

Perry wants the Fed to open their books. They're open. This clown is a passionate warrior against abuses that exist largely in his head.

[Link: www.reuters.com...]

529 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:04:45am

re: #528 Decatur Deb

Perry wants the Fed to open their books. They're open. This clown is a passionate warrior against abuses that exist largely in his head.

[Link: www.reuters.com...]

Isn't that the sort of thing that Luap Nor is big on?

530 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:04:55am

re: #523 Dark_Falcon

Children should have means of reaching out if parents become abusive. Parents should have a right to disapprove of the choices their children make, but not to engage in abuse.

You're not seriously calling being gay a choice are you?

531 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:06:27am

re: #529 thedopefishlives

Isn't that the sort of thing that Luap Nor is big on?

Since the Pleistocene.

532 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:07:27am

re: #524 Dark_Falcon

Don't you dare try to run that shit in on me! Nothing I said was racist nor merited that kind of ugly response.

I didn't say anything about race and I didn't say anything about you personally, so save the Poor Me act.

It's not a mistake that it's a group of stupid, thought-stopped socon bigots that made the connection between their own supposed "values" of what constitutes an ideal family and nostalgia for states rights government.

As the rest of the post suggested -- I guess you stopped reading in an effort to twist yourself into a victim -- conservative parenting has less to do with choices than imposing compulsory behavior, ideally with backing by state power.

533 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:07:49am

re: #526 Obdicut

I'm not talking about rights. I'm talking about what is best for the kid.

Can you explain how parents who are bigoted against gays are the best people to make decisions for the well-being of a gay child?

Because they do love their children and because I don't think it proper for the government to intervene, absent evidence of abuse. The situation you describe is uncommon and normally does not lead to abuse even then. I'm not prepared to declare someone unfit because they disapprove of homosexuality.

534 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:11:00am

re: #533 Dark_Falcon

Because they do love their children and because I don't think it proper for the government to intervene, absent evidence of abuse.

I didn't mention governmental intervention, Dark. Please stick to the actual question.

The situation you describe is uncommon and normally does not lead to abuse even then

Of course it's not uncommon. Why on earth do you believe it is? There's a very high percentage of bigotry against gays in the US, and gay people are quite common as well.

The number of children kicked out or running away from home specifically because they are gay and their parents can't deal is large. I saw them first-hand when I worked with homeless kids.

. I'm not prepared to declare someone unfit because they disapprove of homosexuality.

Unfit in general, maybe not. But surely their disapproval, antipathy, et al. towards gays makes them not the best person to raise a gay child?

535 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:12:24am

re: #532 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

It's not a mistake that it's a group of stupid, thought-stopped socon bigots that made the connection between their own supposed "values" of what constitutes an ideal family and nostalgia for states rights government.

Nevermind the big logical gap in this paragraph: That still begs the question how approving of conservative parenting ammounts to approving the canard platitude of slave children having had at least two-parent families. Which is what you implied in your answer to DF.

536 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:12:34am

re: #530 Conservative Moonbat

You're not seriously calling being gay a choice are you?

No, I'm not. I don't think it is, not anymore. But I can understand how someone could think it was and I understand how a parent could disapprove of gayness if they saw it that way. Moreover, if they did see it as part of someone's nature (born, not made as it were), they might still argue without being abusive that their child should not act on those feelings, as God did not want them to. Again, I'm not saying I'd do that, but I can understand how someone could and could do so without being abusive.

537 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:14:17am

re: #536 Dark_Falcon

You're bringing 'abuse' into this when it isn't the issue. My question is not about abuse. It's about whether or not they are the person best equipped to make decisions for that child.

Obviously, the decision they'd make is that the child should refrain from any sort of sexual activity, including fantasy, and fight against their actual nature.

Do you think that is the decision that would benefit the gay child the best?

538 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:15:02am

re: #534 Obdicut


Unfit in general, maybe not. But surely their disapproval, antipathy, et al. towards gays makes them not the best person to raise a gay child?

The problem in this debate is partially due to the fact that people assume static parental attitudes. Why couldn't a parent overcome their own anti-gay bigotry out of love for their children? Is that more uncommon than them hating on their kids until it crosses the line to actual abuse? Statistics, please!

539 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:16:03am

re: #538 000G

The problem in this debate is partially due to the fact that people assume static parental attitudes. Why couldn't a parent overcome their own anti-gay bigotry out of love for their children? Is that more uncommon than them hating on their kids until it crosses the line to actual abuse? Statistics, please!

This is the Internets--we don' need no stinking statistics.

540 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:16:13am

re: #538 000G

The problem in this debate is partially due to the fact that people assume static parental attitudes. Why couldn't a parent overcome their own anti-gay bigotry out of love for their children?

They can. It happens. They would then be less socially conservative.

Is that more uncommon than them hating on their kids until it crosses the line to actual abuse? Statistics, please!

Such statistics are pretty much impossible to obtain. We do know, however, that rejection of children for being gay is a very real thing.

541 Lidane  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:16:23am

First Karl Rove, now the Frothy Mixture. Man, Rick Perry is just not making any friends these days:

Rick Santorum: Rick Perry’s Attack On Ben Bernanke ‘Completely Out Of Bounds’

542 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:16:38am

re: #538 000G

The problem in this debate is partially due to the fact that people assume static parental attitudes. Why couldn't a parent overcome their own anti-gay bigotry out of love for their children? Is that more uncommon than them hating on their kids until it crosses the line to actual abuse? Statistics, please!

Well, if more kids were comfotable enough to come out instead of living in fear of the reaction of their parents............then proper statistics may be available,

543 darthstar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:16:54am

"Gee, Ward...don't you think you were a little hard on the Beaver last night?"

Holy fuck, people.

544 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:17:25am

re: #543 darthstar

Say what now?

545 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:17:36am

re: #541 Lidane

First Karl Rove, now the Frothy Mixture. Man, Rick Perry is just not making any friends these days:

Rick Santorum: Rick Perry’s Attack On Ben Bernanke ‘Completely Out Of Bounds’

mmmmm thats good santorum..........

546 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:17:56am

re: #537 Obdicut

You're bringing 'abuse' into this when it isn't the issue. My question is not about abuse. It's about whether or not they are the person best equipped to make decisions for that child.

If it's less than abuse but rather a bad attitude, what consequence should this have, if any? If uncle Eddy and aunt Martha can be reasonably assumed to be better parents than the actual biological ones, would it be the right of the government to assign Eddy and Martha as actual guardians and take them away from their biological parents, simply because the latter haven't gotten over their anti-gay attitudes, yet?

This is getting awfully murky.

547 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:18:17am

re: #527 000G

I don't see why conservative parenting would have little to do with choices. I can certainly see that a conservative parent would have other ideas of the choices that were actually available to their children than a liberal parent, and would thus strive to make their children aware of other sets of choices, but I think in general the idea of making your children aware of the choices they got (even though the parental recognition of what choices are available or what ammounts to a good choice or a bad choice might differ according to political pov) is a rather "bipartisan" one.

In my book, there are a lot more partisans than just two. Since the topic has turned to primarily social conservatism, that way of life is concerned with minting vulnerable children into conformist adults. If the concept of "choice" enters the picture, it's along the lines of, these are the choices and you better make the choice we approve of, and this "choice", only.

Witness their regressive idea of "lifestyle choices" and homosexuality, or "choosing" any other religious lifestyle than some conservative form of Christianity.

The very idea of "choice" is extremely threatening to authoritarians and totalitarians, and I put socons squarely in the former category. That's why they must back up their "choice" by threats of force and violence. Otherwise, what normal people would choose it in any large numbers?

548 darthstar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:18:52am

re: #541 Lidane

First Karl Rove, now the Frothy Mixture. Man, Rick Perry is just not making any friends these days:

Rick Santorum: Rick Perry’s Attack On Ben Bernanke ‘Completely Out Of Bounds’

They're both a couple of Ricks.

Sorry, Santorum, but this isn't going to lift you above 4% in the polls. And it's not going to score you a job on MSNBC or CNN, either. Fox, you still have a chance with, but the others, forget it.

549 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:19:05am

re: #546 000G

If it's less than abuse but rather a bad attitude, what consequence should this have, if any?

I have not brought up the idea of consequences at all. It's not what I'm talking about. I don't know why you think it is.

550 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:19:16am

re: #546 000G

If it's less than abuse but rather a bad attitude, what consequence should this have, if any? If uncle Eddy and aunt Martha can be reasonably assumed to be better parents than the actual biological ones, would it be the right of the government to assign Eddy and Martha as actual guardians and take them away from their biological parents, simply because the latter haven't gotten over their anti-gay attitudes, yet?

This is getting awfully murky.

IF the kid is threatening to take their own life, or if the kids behaviour is being affected - maybe removal is a good answer.

551 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:19:56am

re: #549 Obdicut

I have not brought up the idea of consequences at all. It's not what I'm talking about. I don't know why you think it is.

If it's inconsequential, why bother talking about it?

552 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:20:59am

Burger King has much better coffee than the last time I had any from there.

553 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:21:16am

re: #533 Dark_Falcon

The situation you describe is uncommon and normally does not lead to abuse even then.

How do you know?

I'm not prepared to declare someone unfit because they disapprove of homosexuality.

Straw man. No one has said anything about declaring parents unfit, or government intervention.

Why do you think it's socially conservative parents are capable of making the best decisions for gay or otherwise non-conformist children?

554 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:21:30am

re: #547 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

In my book, there are a lot more partisans than just two. Since the topic has turned to primarily social conservatism, that way of life is concerned with minting vulnerable children into conformist adults. If the concept of "choice" enters the picture, it's along the lines of, these are the choices and you better make the choice we approve of, and this "choice", only.

Witness their regressive idea of "lifestyle choices" and homosexuality, or "choosing" any other religious lifestyle than some conservative form of Christianity.

The very idea of "choice" is extremely threatening to authoritarians and totalitarians, and I put socons squarely in the former category. That's why they must back up their "choice" by threats of force and violence. Otherwise, what normal people would choose it in any large numbers?

You are talking about extremists and projecting that onto a rather populace at large. I think you are gravely mistaken. Personal experiences, I guess…

555 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:22:19am

re: #551 000G

If it's inconsequential, why bother talking about it?

Those words are not actually inverses in English.

I'm not talking about the consequences of concluding that a certain set of parents aren't the best possible people to raise their children. My main thrust is to demonstrate that this is true-- which is a rather obvious fact, but still needs doing.

The 'consequences' that I'm after are not "Therefore we take the kid away and have them raised by someone else", but more "Therefore we realize that rights for the child themselves are important."

I'm a very big advocate of rights for children. Not so much with the government deciding to take kids away from their parents.

556 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:22:48am

re: #550 wozzablog

IF the kid is threatening to take their own life, or if the kids behaviour is being affected - maybe removal is a good answer.

Well, yeah if those are effects of what would ammount to psychological abuse… sure.

557 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:23:28am

re: #550 wozzablog

IF the kid is threatening to take their own life, or if the kids behaviour is being affected - maybe removal is a good answer.

That line of thinking could cause you problems in Amish country.

558 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:24:00am

re: #537 Obdicut

You're bringing 'abuse' into this when it isn't the issue. My question is not about abuse. It's about whether or not they are the person best equipped to make decisions for that child.

Obviously, the decision they'd make is that the child should refrain from any sort of sexual activity, including fantasy, and fight against their actual nature.

Do you think that is the decision that would benefit the gay child the best?

No, it isn't. I'll elaborate if asked.

559 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:27:21am

re: #558 Dark_Falcon

No, it isn't. I'll elaborate if asked.

Thank you. That's what I was after. So, you don't think those parents will actually make the best decisions for that child; there are cases where parents are not the ones best suited to make decisions for their children.

As I said above, I think that we should expand the rights of children. Our society is rather deranged in our attitude towards kids; we're at once fearful of them and act as though their innocence-- something inevitably lost-- must be protected at all costs. We're terrified of them and claim that we do all sorts of things for their own good.

There are some problems that are not governmentally solvable and represent a cultural problem. Our attitude towards kids is one of them. We eventually need to give more freedom to kids, but first we need to change our attitude about them.

Unfortunately, we're rather moving in the opposite direction right now.

560 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:28:56am

re: #550 wozzablog

IF the kid is threatening to take their own life, or if the kids behaviour is being affected - maybe removal is a good answer.

In general I agree with where you're coming from, but where do you draw the line?

My brother is a Pagan. He goes and dances around naked in the woods on solstices and shit like that. A lot of his friends are estranged from their families because of their religious beliefs. Would you support the course of action for a kid who was being hounded by his or her parents because of differing religious beliefs?

561 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:29:08am

re: #540 Obdicut

They can. It happens. They would then be less socially conservative.

Such statistics are pretty much impossible to obtain. We do know, however, that rejection of children for being gay is a very real thing.

Or, know people for whom that's the case, or simply be one ourselves.

But see, this would require that people like DF who talk out of their butt on these issues earn the trust of actual gay people who might be comfortable enough with them to tell those kinds of stories. Ignorance is bliss. In the socon universe, it's a holy sacrament.

562 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:30:45am

re: #554 000G

You are talking about extremists and projecting that onto a rather populace at large. I think you are gravely mistaken.

I'm going by socon groups' own rhetoric and stated goals.

Personal experiences, I guess…

I suppose that's a question.

563 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:30:46am

re: #549 Obdicut

I have not brought up the idea of consequences at all. It's not what I'm talking about. I don't know why you think it is.

Because after a problem is defined, the next step is to propose a solution. And speaking only for myself, I must say that I worry about what solutions might be proposed. That's the reason I speak as I do. I'm trying to lay out my spadework in advance, so as to be prepared when the discussion moves to the next phase.

564 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:30:59am

re: #555 Obdicut

I'm not talking about the consequences of concluding that a certain set of parents aren't the best possible people to raise their children. My main thrust is to demonstrate that this is true-- which is a rather obvious fact, but still needs doing.

Of course it's true. But again, "not the best possible people" assumes a lot, "not the best people" could mean "not the best people yet". Conflict in families are common and usually parents (yes, even liberal parents) are used to "getting their way". Sometimes it takes time to work out conflicts so that children do not suffer from their parents' misconceptions. (I know, I know, it sounds awfully like "it depends on what your definition of 'is' is", but assuming static attitudes and non-temporal, eternal personalities can be more harmful than useful in debates like these.)

Sometimes it might take a little more than that, which leads to the next point.

The 'consequences' that I'm after are not "Therefore we take the kid away and have them raised by someone else", but more "Therefore we realize that rights for the child themselves are important."

Then you should have talked about that. I see you mentioning children's rights here for the first time in this debate.

I'm a very big advocate of rights for children. Not so much with the government deciding to take kids away from their parents.

Then we agree.

565 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:32:08am

re: #559 Obdicut

Thank you. That's what I was after. So, you don't think those parents will actually make the best decisions for that child; there are cases where parents are not the ones best suited to make decisions for their children.

As I said above, I think that we should expand the rights of children. Our society is rather deranged in our attitude towards kids; we're at once fearful of them and act as though their innocence-- something inevitably lost-- must be protected at all costs. We're terrified of them and claim that we do all sorts of things for their own good.

There are some problems that are not governmentally solvable and represent a cultural problem. Our attitude towards kids is one of them. We eventually need to give more freedom to kids, but first we need to change our attitude about them.

Unfortunately, we're rather moving in the opposite direction right now.

That bolded section just relieved a good bit of my concern here. Thank you for that.

566 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:32:18am

re: #559 Obdicut

Our society is rather deranged in our attitude towards kids; we're at once fearful of them and act as though their innocence-- something inevitably lost-- must be protected at all costs. We're terrified of them and claim that we do all sorts of things for their own good.

QFT.

Victoria lives.

567 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:32:59am

re: #563 Dark_Falcon

Because after a problem is defined, the next step is to propose a solution. And speaking only for myself, I must say that I worry about what solutions might be proposed.

And I think that colors your thinking about the original subject in an unhelpful way.

That's the reason I speak as I do. I'm trying to lay out my spadework in advance, so as to be prepared when the discussion moves to the next phase.

Well, I think instead it's hobbling your actual argument. You assumed things that weren't true about where I was going with the argument.

568 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:34:15am

re: #565 Dark_Falcon

That bolded section just relieved a good bit of my concern here. Thank you for that.

Governmental agencies can still keep an eye on things and act as mediators when there are conflicts though. Issues like this are part of why I want to get a MSW after I get around to finishing my BA.

569 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:35:18am

re: #566 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

QFT.

Victoria lives.

Victoria has very few secrets.

570 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:35:59am

re: #560 Conservative Moonbat

In general I agree with where you're coming from, but where do you draw the line?

My brother is a Pagan. He goes and dances around naked in the woods on solstices and shit like that. A lot of his friends are estranged from their families because of their religious beliefs. Would you support the course of action for a kid who was being hounded by his or her parents because of differing religious beliefs?

It's not an easy topic.

Removal is a last resort and should only be considered when immediate or potentially lasting psychical or psychological harm would be done to the child by leaving them in that environment.

Depends on the child, family and circumstance.

If the "hounding" was on a level of psychological abuse or bullying then removal should take place - or at the very least external counselling or conflict resolution.

571 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:36:43am

re: #564 000G

Of course it's true. But again, "not the best possible people" assumes a lot, "not the best people" could mean "not the best people yet". Conflict in families are common and usually parents (yes, even liberal parents) are used to "getting their way". Sometimes it takes time to work out conflicts so that children do not suffer from their parents' misconceptions. (I know, I know, it sounds awfully like "it depends on what your definition of 'is' is", but assuming static attitudes and non-temporal, eternal personalities can be more harmful than useful in debates like these.)

This doesn't have anything to do with what I'm talking about, I'm afraid.


Then you should have talked about that. I see you mentioning children's rights here for the first time in this debate.

No, my argument was fine on its own, thanks. It's much better to accurately identify a problem first before moving on to any consequential solutions. Definition of a problem is not inconsequential.

You may prefer for me to lay out my arguments in the other way, but it's quite an inferior way.

572 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:36:46am

re: #561 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

people like DF who talk out of their butt on these issues

I think you are being unneccessary personal. It doesn't help whatever argument you are trying to make.

573 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:39:01am

re: #572 000G

I think you are being unneccessary personal. It doesn't help whatever argument you are trying to make.

He is indeed talking out of his butt on the issue. Consider my argument or don't based on whatever criteria you please; makes no difference to me.

574 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:39:11am

re: #570 wozzablog

And unfortunately, the problem is often in the opposite direction; kids are kicked out, forced to leave, abandoned, or run away due to the rejection. And the streets are a very, very, very rough fucking place for kids. That, to me, is an utter abdication of parental responsibility, either forcing or letting your kid go out into that cruel land.

Very, very few of the runaways I worked with hadn't been raped or forced into prostitution at some point.

575 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:39:12am

re: #570 wozzablog

It's not an easy topic.

Removal is a last resort and should only be considered when immediate or potentially lasting physical or psychological harm would be done to the child by leaving them in that environment.

Depends on the child, family and circumstance.

If the "hounding" was on a level of psychological abuse or bullying then removal should take place - or at the very least external counseling or conflict resolution.

PIMF

576 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:39:24am

re: #570 wozzablog

It's not an easy topic.

Removal is a last resort and should only be considered when immediate or potentially lasting psychical or psychological harm would be done to the child by leaving them in that environment.

Depends on the child, family and circumstance.

If the "hounding" was on a level of psychological abuse or bullying then removal should take place - or at the very least external counselling or conflict resolution.

Since we are in a statistics-free zone, I'll say that a very large proportion of each generation will define its upbringing as 'psychological abuse or bullying'. The stand-up comic industry depends on it.

577 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:40:25am

re: #571 Obdicut

This doesn't have anything to do with what I'm talking about, I'm afraid.

Yes, it does. See #538, #540.

No, my argument was fine on its own, thanks. It's much better to accurately identify a problem first before moving on to any consequential solutions. Definition of a problem is not inconsequential.

Then I think you took an awfully long time to define the blatantly obvious: That an anti-gay parent is not always the best parent towards a gay child.

578 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:41:10am

re: #573 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

He is indeed talking out of his butt on the issue. Consider my argument or don't based on whatever criteria you please; makes no difference to me.

Heh. No wonder you and albusteve get into squabbles.

579 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:41:40am

re: #576 Decatur Deb

This is why it isn't the child's decision to leave, there are professionals who look at this stuff - reports from teachers, other relatives, counselors and support workers go into action plans for making choices available for parents betterment or for child safety.

580 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:41:47am

re: #577 000G

Yes, it does. See #538, #540.

I've seen them, thanks.

Then I think you took an awfully long time to define the blatantly obvious: That an anti-gay parent is not always the best parent towards a gay child.

That's nice.

581 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:42:52am

re: #578 000G

Heh. No wonder you and albusteve get into squabbles.

Image: Sam_and_Ralph_clock.png

582 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:44:58am

re: #574 Obdicut

And unfortunately, the problem is often in the opposite direction; kids are kicked out, forced to leave, abandoned, or run away due to the rejection. And the streets are a very, very, very rough fucking place for kids. That, to me, is an utter abdication of parental responsibility, either forcing or letting your kid go out into that cruel land.

To me, this is one of the follies of socon chest-beating on their supposedly superior "family values". Those values can lead to broken up families with estranged parents and offspring.

Anything for ideological purity, I guess. I think it should also be stressed that it's not just homosexuality; people defending socon childrearing should really be thanking you for broaching the easiest, most obvious topic.

583 Interesting Times  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:45:49am

Apropos of nothing...

"All behold...the Octangulator!™"

584 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:46:55am

re: #577 000G

Yes, it does. See #538, #540.

Then I think you took an awfully long time to define the blatantly obvious: That an anti-gay parent is not always the best parent towards a gay child.

They're not. A bigot parent is the worst kind of parent for an open-minded child. The goal is to churn out another bigoted, conformist adult.

585 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:47:05am

re: #582 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

To me, this is one of the follies of socon chest-beating on their supposedly superior "family values". Those values can lead to broken up families with estranged parents and offspring.

Anything for ideological purity, I guess. I think it should also be stressed that it's not just homosexuality; people defending socon childrearing should really be thanking you for broaching the easiest, most obvious topic.

If that's a purdy word filled way of saying more gay children have fled SoCon homes, than Christian kids have runaway from trippydippy hippy homes - you may well be right.

586 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:48:23am

re: #573 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

He is indeed talking out of his butt on the issue. Consider my argument or don't based on whatever criteria you please; makes no difference to me.

Flinging insults is not the best way to conduct a conversation. It puts the target in a hostile mood where you are concerned. What you should do is try to make you point or criticism without using provocative language. I'm quite civil and respectful when people do that, as Wozza and Obdi will attest.

587 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:48:31am

re: #582 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

On the other hand, the Amish (who someone referenced previously), have an insanely high in-group retention rate. They have immensely conservative social values. However, they're a closed in-group, which helps. That is part of the reason why the strict social conservatives want creationism taught in school, want homosexuality taught as an evil, etc. ; they're trying to make the larger community their in-group.

So highly socially conservative upbringing can be done in such a way that leads to very little estrangement and breakup of families, but it's at the cost of interaction with the rest of society.

588 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:49:08am

re: #584 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

They're not. A bigot parent is the worst kind of parent for an open-minded child. The goal is to churn out another bigoted, conformist adult.

Again: You are assuming that parents cannot change, that their socon attitudes will always prevail over their love for their children as actual persons instead of material to mold and shape. You are also lumping all socons together into one large authoritarian-totalitarian proto-fascist blob.

589 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:50:19am

re: #578 000G

Heh. No wonder you and albusteve get into squabbles.

Twins!

///

590 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:50:27am

re: #588 000G

By the way, the image of a sensible socon I have in mind is our own reine. The story she told about her daughter was heartbreaking.

591 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:51:38am

re: #583 publicityStunted

Apropos of nothing...

"All behold...the Octangulator!™"

If he just took that one step further and found a way to show Jar-Jar Binks publicly executed he'd get a good poll bump.

/Stay on Target!

592 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:52:12am

re: #587 Obdicut

On the other hand, the Amish (who someone referenced previously), have an insanely high in-group retention rate. They have immensely conservative social values. However, they're a closed in-group, which helps. That is part of the reason why the strict social conservatives want creationism taught in school, want homosexuality taught as an evil, etc. ; they're trying to make the larger community their in-group.

So highly socially conservative upbringing can be done in such a way that leads to very little estrangement and breakup of families, but it's at the cost of interaction with the rest of society.

And the crude popular wisdom (and there really is such a thing) demands that the Amish be largely allowed to raise their children in peace, and that the FLDS should not. It works societally, with some horrible individual tragedies.

593 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:52:19am

re: #585 wozzablog

If that's a purdy word filled way of saying more gay children have fled SoCon homes, than Christian kids have runaway from trippydippy hippy homes - you may well be right.

I'd also add in my $4 word way, that it's not just kids running away. They also get kicked out, threatened and estranged.

I don't doubt the possibility of a kid who chooses the conservative Christian-supremacist lifestyle getting abused, kicked out and estranged by hippy dippy parents, at all. The shelters probably tell a much different story, though.

594 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:52:53am

re: #585 wozzablog

If that's a purdy word filled way of saying more gay children have fled SoCon homes, than Christian kids have runaway from trippydippy hippy homes - you may well be right.

I came from a trippy dippy hippy home. I didn't really have anything to rebel against. "Don't smoke pot in the house" was about as far as it went. "No your girlfriend can't move in. You're 16." re: #587 Obdicut

On the other hand, the Amish (who someone referenced previously), have an insanely high in-group retention rate. They have immensely conservative social values. However, they're a closed in-group, which helps. That is part of the reason why the strict social conservatives want creationism taught in school, want homosexuality taught as an evil, etc. ; they're trying to make the larger community their in-group.

So highly socially conservative upbringing can be done in such a way that leads to very little estrangement and breakup of families, but it's at the cost of interaction with the rest of society.

The Amish also encourage their young people to go spend a year living in the outside world and doing whatever they want and then come back if they want. Almost all come back.

595 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:53:32am

re: #587 Obdicut

On the other hand, the Amish (who someone referenced previously), have an insanely high in-group retention rate. They have immensely conservative social values. However, they're a closed in-group, which helps. That is part of the reason why the strict social conservatives want creationism taught in school, want homosexuality taught as an evil, etc. ; they're trying to make the larger community their in-group.

So highly socially conservative upbringing can be done in such a way that leads to very little estrangement and breakup of families, but it's at the cost of interaction with the rest of society.

You can substitute "Hasidic Jews" for "Amish" without changing the conclusion. However interaction with society at large is very important and if that is lacking in a child's upbringing they can grow up to be a dysfunctional adult. As long as the closed-off society remains small, they can all look after one another, but once the population begins to skyrocket, there has to be a greater degree of integration with the outside world.

596 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:54:24am

re: #588 000G

Again: You are assuming that parents cannot change, that their socon attitudes will always prevail over their love for their children as actual persons instead of material to mold and shape. You are also lumping all socons together into one large authoritarian-totalitarian proto-fascist blob.

Some people do that. Lumping the other side into a mob makes them easier to oppose. I have yet to see OCSP concede anything where any sort of conservative is concerned.

597 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:55:04am

re: #593 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin


No doubt.

598 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:55:13am

re: #593 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I'd also add in my $4 word way, that it's not just kids running away. They also get kicked out, threatened and estranged.

I don't doubt the possibility of a kid who chooses the conservative Christian-supremacist lifestyle getting abused, kicked out and estranged by hippy dippy parents, at all. The shelters probably tell a much different story, though.

I tried going to church and my hippy dippy parents encouraged it. That took all the fun out of it.

599 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:55:33am

re: #594 Conservative Moonbat

The Amish also encourage their young people to go spend a year living in the outside world and doing whatever they want and then come back if they want. Almost all come back.

Yes, but by that point they've been inculcated in it for 16 years. (18 in some places). They've been taught that their religion is the only path to heaven, and they know that if they decide to leave, everyone they've ever known will shun them and never talk to them again.

I think it's better than not letting them experience that year, but it really isn't a free choice at that point.

600 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:55:37am

re: #588 000G

Again: You are assuming that parents cannot change, that their socon attitudes will always prevail over their love for their children as actual persons instead of material to mold and shape. You are also lumping all socons together into one large authoritarian-totalitarian proto-fascist blob.

Well, you're wrong about that. First of all, I don't presume "love for their children"; I think that's a cliché that leads to excuses and rationalizations.

601 wrenchwench  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:56:50am

re: #561 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Ignorance is bliss. In the socon universe, it's a holy sacrament.

I'm stealing that.

Is that a sin?

602 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:57:25am

re: #595 Alouette

You can substitute "Hasidic Jews" for "Amish" without changing the conclusion. However interaction with society at large is very important and if that is lacking in a child's upbringing they can grow up to be a dysfunctional adult. As long as the closed-off society remains small, they can all look after one another, but once the population begins to skyrocket, there has to be a greater degree of integration with the outside world.

Absolutely. And it will be a natural consequence that more kids will decide that life isn't for them. I know this is probably painful for those in the community, but surely a path freely chosen is superior to one that is taken only because the child knew no other choice.

603 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:58:03am

re: #596 Dark_Falcon

Some people do that. Lumping the other side into a mob makes them easier to oppose. I have yet to see OCSP concede anything where any sort of conservative is concerned.

The only thing you need to remember about my posts is that you are not a victim of them.

604 Killgore Trout  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:59:12am

Feds join probe of alleged Mississippi hate killing

The U.S. Justice Department is investigating a hit-and-run killing that took place after white teens allegedly set out to kill a black man because of his color.


Get ready for the wingnuts to start claiming the is part of Obama's persecution of white people.

605 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:59:30am

re: #598 Conservative Moonbat

I tried going to church and my hippy dippy parents encouraged it. That took all the fun out of it.

Hippy-dippy here. Two of my kids are atheist/agnostic, one a Baptist of some sort, one goes to a (puke) megachurch. None practices my wife's RC. Has to be that way.

606 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:59:39am

re: #601 wrenchwench

I'm stealing that.

Is that a sin?

Lol well, you're talking to someone for whom the idea of "sin" is just more control-freakery. So as the old Negro Spiritual goes, steal away. :D

607 wrenchwench  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 7:59:44am

re: #581 Decatur Deb

Image: Sam_and_Ralph_clock.png

That picture is worth 1,0002 words.

Or more.

608 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:00:06am

re: #592 Decatur Deb

And the crude popular wisdom (and there really is such a thing) demands that the Amish be largely allowed to raise their children in peace, and that the FLDS should not. It works societally, with some horrible individual tragedies.

The thing there is that the Amish don't engage in statutory rape and polygamy, practices which America society strongly opposes (mostly its the former, of course). Also, though, is the fact that while the Amish use strong social pressure, they do not use force retain their adherents, while the FLDS does use force. Those two facts explain the differing attitudes. A young woman who wants out of the Amish world may leave, whereas a young person (especially a girl) who wants to leave the FLDS may well be forcibly prevented from doing so.

609 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:00:25am

re: #604 Killgore Trout

Feds join probe of alleged Mississippi hate killing


Get ready for the wingnuts to start claiming the is part of Obama's persecution of white people.

It's going to get in the way of the headlines about how blacks are the real racists because they're flash-mobbing white people.

610 darthstar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:01:49am

This is awesome, if only for the fact that it shows some people still carry portable CD players with them.

8am - commuter bus - New Jersey (This may be NJDHF himself!)

Youtube Video
611 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:02:03am

re: #605 Decatur Deb

Hippy-dippy here. Two of my kids are atheist/agnostic, one a Baptist of some sort, one goes to a (puke) megachurch. None practices my wife's RC. Has to be that way.

After being allowed to experiment freely with religion I came out a unitarian atheist. I really wish more parents would encourage their kids to do that.

612 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:02:25am

re: #600 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Well, you're wrong about that. First of all, I don't presume "love for their children"; I think that's a cliché that leads to excuses and rationalizations.

So you're basically saying that maintaining socon attitudes turns a parent into an unloving, at best indifferent manipulator who cares about their child only to the extent that it allows them to live out their control freak fetish.

613 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:02:59am

re: #603 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

The only thing you need to remember about my posts is that you are not a victim of them.

You don't victimize me, you just annoy and sometimes mischaracterize me.

614 Lidane  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:04:18am

What an utterly charming fellow.

///

615 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:04:31am

re: #610 darthstar

I'm pretty sure that individual is mentally disabled and shouldn't be made the object of ridicule.

616 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:04:52am

Wednesday -
Laundry. Coffee. Sports club for the volunteer bar shift.


Laters all.

617 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:05:00am

re: #612 000G

In some ways, I think it's a reverse of the "no true Scotsman". The "Only True Scotsman".

I personally wouldn't consider Reine a social conservative, precisely because she doesn't want her views that are such reflected in governmental policy. So, to me the Only True Socon is one who wants the government to aid and abet their conservatism.

Others may say that anyone who holds the conservative views is a socon, regardless of how they view that interaction with government. But the distinction between those two flavors is an important one.

618 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:06:05am

re: #609 Obdicut

It's going to get in the way of the headlines about how blacks are the real racists because they're flash-mobbing white people.

easy answer: beating someone for fun is wrong, so is running someone down because you want to kill someone who doesn't look like you. People who engage in those behaviors are dirtbags and should prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. No to explain that to Fox (if only they would listen).

619 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:08:03am

re: #617 Obdicut

In some ways, I think it's a reverse of the "no true Scotsman". The "Only True Scotsman".

I personally wouldn't consider Reine a social conservative, precisely because she doesn't want her views that are such reflected in governmental policy. So, to me the Only True Socon is one who wants the government to aid and abet their conservatism.

Others may say that anyone who holds the conservative views is a socon, regardless of how they view that interaction with government. But the distinction between those two flavors is an important one.

Colloquially there is a crude shorthand for the socons who wish to push the Xtian Conservative total package into the constitution and throughout all levels of government = American Taliban.

620 Killgore Trout  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:09:55am

Tea Party Confidential.....
What I Learned in Two Years at the Tea Party


When I started going to Tea Party meetings two years ago, I was sympathetic.
...
Two years of Tea Party functions later, and I finally know what the Tea Party wants: A Christian nation.
....

Back in 2009, the movement appeared genuinely stumped with a conundrum of its key documents. Subservience to the Constitution of the United States of America was paramount, but then what to do about the Bible?

So they've engineered a backstory that essentially proves the nation's founders were just conduits for God. Essentially, the Constitution is just the word of God passed down through guys who wore wigs and snazzy cuffed jackets.

That the Tea Party is just a way to repackage the religious right has no better proof than Ralph Reed. Reed has taken the tenets of the 1990s Christian Coalition that he directed for the "Faith and Freedom Coalition," which is now a major player at Tea Party events.

621 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:09:55am

re: #617 Obdicut

I personally wouldn't consider Reine a social conservative, precisely because she doesn't want her views that are such reflected in governmental policy. So, to me the Only True Socon is one who wants the government to aid and abet their conservatism.

It was an interaction with her daughter as part of her family, albeit not one of force, government or other. And the intent and outcome of the interaction was one for what I consider socon ends ("pro-life"). To me, that's socially conservative.

622 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:10:05am

re: #587 Obdicut

On the other hand, the Amish (who someone referenced previously), have an insanely high in-group retention rate. They have immensely conservative social values. However, they're a closed in-group, which helps.

There are many examples. Holiness- and Sanctified-style Pentecostals are a Black Community™ example. Minorities among minorities, but what's obscure to some, is quite familiar to others.

That is part of the reason why the strict social conservatives want creationism taught in school, want homosexuality taught as an evil, etc. ; they're trying to make the larger community their in-group.

Nicely put. They want state power to impose their own lifestyle on everyone else, and punish those who cannot or do not conform. States rights government in a nutshell.

So highly socially conservative upbringing can be done in such a way that leads to very little estrangement and breakup of families, but it's at the cost of interaction with the rest of society.

I think the best response is to give and volunteer for organizations that help young people escaping and/or thrown out of those environments, to make a softer place for them to land.

623 Shropshire_Slasher  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:10:13am

I see the Jehovah's Witnesses stopped by and left some reading material on my desk, I really should lock that office door. I aint going back to organized religion, catholicism left a bad taste in my mouth.

624 Interesting Times  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:10:25am

re: #619 wozzablog

Colloquially there is a crude shorthand for the socons who wish to push the Xtian Conservative total package into the constitution and throughout all levels of government = American Taliban.

Or if portmanteaus are your thing, "Talibangelicals"

625 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:10:35am

re: #614 Lidane

What an utterly charming fellow.

///

Even the Marines have a small number of dirtbags. Hopefully, they catch this one before he does any further misdeeds.

626 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:11:14am

re: #608 Dark_Falcon

The thing there is that the Amish don't engage in statutory rape and polygamy, practices which America society strongly opposes (mostly its the former, of course). Also, though, is the fact that while the Amish use strong social pressure, they do not use force retain their adherents, while the FLDS does use force. Those two facts explain the differing attitudes. A young woman who wants out of the Amish world may leave, whereas a young person (especially a girl) who wants to leave the FLDS may well be forcibly prevented from doing so.

Don't be a young man (i.e. the competition) in that millieu. You'll end up in the shelter with the gay kids.

627 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:11:30am

re: #622 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Have you seen "But I'm a Cheerleader?"

628 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:11:48am

re: #608 Dark_Falcon

The thing there is that the Amish don't engage in statutory rape and polygamy, practices which America society strongly opposes (mostly its the former, of course). Also, though, is the fact that while the Amish use strong social pressure, they do not use force retain their adherents, while the FLDS does use force. Those two facts explain the differing attitudes. A young woman who wants out of the Amish world may leave, whereas a young person (especially a girl) who wants to leave the FLDS may well be forcibly prevented from doing so.

The FLDS would also forcibly expel teenage boys because they represented a competitive threat to the dominant males in the sect, and these young men were totally unprepared to fend for themselves.

629 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:12:26am

My favorite video out of all the "It Gets Better" videos:

Youtube Video
630 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:14:56am

re: #626 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

re: #628 Alouette

I do know about that, though I only learned about that in the last year. It's another difference between the FDLS and Amish that explains why they should be treated differently, though it is not nearly as well known.

631 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:15:09am

re: #626 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

re: #628 Alouette

One of my old bosses was a 'Lost Boy'. He never quite recovered, and never quite stopped believing.

633 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:16:51am

re: #613 Dark_Falcon

You don't victimize me, you just annoy and sometimes mischaracterize me.

I know I don't victimize you. I do notice you often placing yourself in the trajectory of what is typically a Rather Narrow brush. Not always, but often.

634 Killgore Trout  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:17:07am

Poll: Tea Party Less Popular Than Muslims, Atheists, 21 Other Groups


Ironically, the conservative movement is now more unpopular than two often-marginalized groups it sometimes rails against — Muslims and atheists — and is the least popular of the 23 groups the poll asked about:
635 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:17:42am

re: #631 Decatur Deb

re: #628 Alouette

One of my old bosses was a 'Lost Boy'. He never quite recovered, and never quite stopped believing.

My dad grew up in The People's Temple listening to Jim Jones. My great aunt gave what would now be over a million bucks in old Indiana steel money to him, pretty much cleaned out the family. My dad was done with organized religion after that but I don't think he ever really gave up on all of it.

637 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:17:56am

re: #632 Killgore Trout

No surprise here...
Rick Perry: Climate Change Is A Hoax Drummed Up By Scientists Looking To Make Money

How are these scientists making money, as opposed to BP, Exxon & the Koch Brothers who deny AGW in order to continue making huge amounts of money?

638 Lidane  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:18:02am

re: #625 Dark_Falcon

Even the Marines have a small number of dirtbags. Hopefully, they catch this one before he does any further misdeeds.



There are dirtbags everywhere. This one just happened to make a name for himself on the intertubes as an Oathkeeper and ex-Marine.

I hope they catch him. He doesn't need to be on the streets.

639 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:18:14am

I'll just leave this here:

Youtube Video
640 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:18:49am

re: #627 Obdicut

Have you seen "But I'm a Cheerleader?"

I haven't, for the same reason I haven't seen Jesus Camp have seen only a half episode of Glee. High school, brrr. lol

641 Killgore Trout  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:19:20am

re: #637 Alouette

How are these scientists making money, as opposed to BP, Exxon & the Koch Brothers who deny AGW in order to continue making huge amounts of money?

Oil money is a gift from god, research grants are a communist plot.
/Tea Partier

642 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:19:28am

re: #635 Conservative Moonbat

My dad grew up in The People's Temple listening to Jim Jones. My great aunt gave what would now be over a million bucks in old Indiana steel money to him, pretty much cleaned out the family. My dad was done with organized religion after that but I don't think he ever really gave up on all of it.

How did he escape the massacre of '78?

643 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:20:02am

re: #640 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I haven't, for the same reason I haven't seen Jesus Camp have seen only a half episode of Glee. High school, brrr. lol

It's a really good movie, about an ex-gay camp, and two subversive gay guys who live nearby and sneak the campers out at night to provide them with an alternative perspective.

644 jaunte  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:20:13am

re: #632 Killgore Trout

No surprise here...
Rick Perry: Climate Change Is A Hoax Drummed Up By Scientists Looking To Make Money

Here's the video: [Link: www.therightscoop.com...]

645 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:21:04am

re: #640 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I haven't, for the same reason I haven't seen Jesus Camp have seen only a half episode of Glee. High school, brrr. lol

Jesus Camp is really important. It gets its strength from the fact that the Dominionists featured in it do not reject it.

646 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:21:25am

re: #642 Alouette

How did he escape the massacre of '78?

The family didn't follow the church when it left Indiana. Most people in the church didn't, actually.

647 Interesting Times  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:21:45am

re: #641 Killgore Trout

Oil money is a gift from god, research grants are a communist plot.

I am disturbed and depressed by the fact you could post that on redstate or freerepublic and have 99% of commenters earnestly agree with it.

648 jaunte  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:22:32am

I've heard that 'only a theory' line somewhere before.

649 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:22:44am

re: #635 Conservative Moonbat

My dad grew up in The People's Temple listening to Jim Jones. My great aunt gave what would now be over a million bucks in old Indiana steel money to him, pretty much cleaned out the family. My dad was done with organized religion after that but I don't think he ever really gave up on all of it.

Your dad is still lucky, though. Hundreds of Jones' followers ended up dead when Jones decided he'd rather see them die than lose his control over them. And even then the coward couldn't kill himself. He had to have someone else do it. I'm glad your dad was clear of that nightmarish place of death.

650 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:23:23am

re: #635 Conservative Moonbat

My dad grew up in The People's Temple listening to Jim Jones. My great aunt gave what would now be over a million bucks in old Indiana steel money to him, pretty much cleaned out the family. My dad was done with organized religion after that but I don't think he ever really gave up on all of it.

Well, even I haven't given up on all of it, at least not the cultural part. When you are Black in America, there are things you get at church that you cannot get anywhere else....or that would take 3x as long to get and probably cost you money on top of it. I do not attend, myself. But I understand fully why people do, even if they don't accept the beliefs.

Re: People's Temple, I shop at Woori market, the Korean grocery right around the corner from where it was, and know people whose family members went there. San Francisco has tried its best to obliterate the memory of Jim Jones, but people's memories don't just disappear.

651 Lidane  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:26:18am

re: #647 publicityStunted

I am disturbed and depressed by the fact you could post that on redstate or freerepublic and have 99% of commenters earnestly agree with it.

You could also post it on HuffPo, Politico, Fox Nation, Yahoo!, and any other number of places and have people agree with it. It's the consequence of having shitty science education in this country.

652 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:26:59am

re: #643 Obdicut

It's a really good movie, about an ex-gay camp, and two subversive gay guys who live nearby and sneak the campers out at night to provide them with an alternative perspective.

Yeah, I've been through some ex-gay stuff, myself. Can't say I recommend the experience lol

Ex-gay camps seem to me the best places for potential samesex hookups. rotfl

653 darthstar  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:27:23am

Tea Party less popular than Athiests, Muslims, and even Democrats!

The Tea Party ranks lower than any of the 23 other groups we asked about — lower than both Republicans and Democrats. It is even less popular than much maligned groups like “atheists” and “Muslims.” Interestingly, one group that approaches it in unpopularity is the Christian Right.


Well, at least they're in good company.

654 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:28:05am

re: #650 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Well, even I haven't given up on all of it, at least not the cultural part. When you are Black in America, there are things you get at church that you cannot get anywhere else...or that would take 3x as long to get and probably cost you money on top of it. I do not attend, myself. But I understand fully why people do, even if they don't accept the beliefs.

Re: People's Temple, I shop at Woori market, the Korean grocery right around the corner from where it was, and know people whose family members went there. San Francisco has tried its best to obliterate the memory of Jim Jones, but people's memories don't just disappear.

San Francisco would like to forget not just because of the people that died, but because they'd also like to forget the hold Jones had on the city's politics (because his followers voted as a bloc as Jones told them to). Many were the San Fran politicians who kissed Jones' ring, including Harvey Milk. That, however, is all too typical and they were just doing what politicians do: lining up the voting blocks to win elections.

655 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:28:21am

I'll just leave this here:

Youtube Video
re: #652 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Ex-gay camps seem to me the best places for potential samesex hookups. rotfl

Heh. It's a socon conundrum.

656 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:28:43am

oops. repackaged code. nvm.

657 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:29:50am

re: #638 Lidane

There are dirtbags everywhere. This one just happened to make a name for himself on the intertubes as an Oathkeeper and ex-Marine.

I hope they catch him. He doesn't need to be on the streets.

Oathkeepers, pfft. Gun-clutching militia-lite big babies.

658 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:29:55am

re: #649 Dark_Falcon

Your dad is still lucky, though. Hundreds of Jones' followers ended up dead when Jones decided he'd rather see them die than lose his control over them. And even then the coward couldn't kill himself. He had to have someone else do it. I'm glad your dad was clear of that nightmarish place of death.

It apparently started off as a really progressive movement with lots of emphasis on social justice. It was one of the first churches in the US to try and integrate races and a lot of what Jones was preaching was informed by Marxism.

It's been speculated that Jones had some form of mental illness that grew worse and worse over the years. Before he went nutso it was a really positive movement. I think calling all former members cultists does them a great disservice. Many were liberal progressive activists drawn in by the social justice messages.

659 RogueOne  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:30:03am

re: #610 darthstar

This is awesome, if only for the fact that it shows some people still carry portable CD players with them.

8am - commuter bus - New Jersey (This may be NJDHF himself!)

[Video]

There's a young man in town that walks up and down a main street singing and dancing with a portable cd player. I see him a couple times a day. I don't know who he is but I owe him a beer for all the chuckles he's given me.

660 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:31:03am

re: #649 Dark_Falcon

You're acting like Jones started out crazy. The reason he was successful is that at first he was just a charismatic preacher doing good works in the community.

661 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:32:08am

re: #653 darthstar

Tea Party less popular than Athiests, Muslims, and even Democrats!


Well, at least they're in good company.

Hope that's a rigorous poll.

662 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:32:23am

re: #658 Conservative Moonbat

It apparently started off as a really progressive movement with lots of emphasis on social justice. It was one of the first churches in the US to try and integrate races and a lot of what Jones was preaching was informed by Marxism.

It's been speculated that Jones had some form of mental illness that grew worse and worse over the years. Before he went nutso it was a really positive movement. I think calling all former members cultists does them a great disservice. Many were liberal progressive activists drawn in by the social justice messages.

A lot of their policies and beliefs fall squarely into the "liberal" camp, but history has relegated them to the category of "insane fundamentalist religious fanatic cult freaks"

663 Velvet Elvis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:35:15am

re: #662 Alouette

A lot of their policies and beliefs fall squarely into the "liberal" camp, but history has relegated them to the category of "insane fundamentalist religious fanatic cult freaks"

The people who followed him to South America after he'd begun to show mental instability might be aptly characterized as such. I don't mean to blame the victims or anything like that. I'm just stating that the people who ended up in Jonestown were not the same kind of people who followed him in the early days.

664 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:35:26am

re: #657 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Oathkeepers, pfft. Gun-clutching militia-lite big babies.

Might be true of most, but they'll have some number of proficient and insane killers. Don't rely on cartoon versions of the Militias or the Klan.

665 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:35:32am

re: #660 Obdicut

You're acting like Jones started out crazy. The reason he was successful is that at first he was just a charismatic preacher doing good works in the community.

I'm sorry if I gave off that impression. I'm aware Jones didn't start out crazy. He always had issues, but he did start his church for the right reasons. That's part of what makes his story a tragedy.

666 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:35:39am

re: #654 Dark_Falcon

San Francisco would like to forget not just because of the people that died, but because they'd also like to forget the hold Jones had on the city's politics (because his followers voted as a bloc as Jones told them to). Many were the San Fran politicians who kissed Jones' ring, including Harvey Milk. That, however, is all too typical and they were just doing what politicians do: lining up the voting blocks to win elections.

It was a lot more than just Harvey Milk. Feinstein, who took Moscone's place, and Willie Brown were among them, too. The topic came up as smear tactics during both of Brown's successful runs for mayor. But that's not why "San Francisco" would like to forget.

667 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:37:42am

re: #662 Alouette

A lot of their policies and beliefs fall squarely into the "liberal" camp, but history has relegated them to the category of "insane fundamentalist religious fanatic cult freaks"

Don't think he'd be 'fundamentalist' as much as 'authoritarian'. They played pretty fast and loose with the texts, IIRC.

668 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:38:45am

re: #664 Decatur Deb

Might be true of most, but they'll have some number of proficient and insane killers. Don't rely on cartoon versions of the Militias or the Klan.

Agreed. Someone with a Marine's skill set (every Marine being a rifleman) is the kind of person who teach some of those skills and transform a militia band from pretenders into something dangerous.

669 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:39:13am

re: #665 Dark_Falcon

I'm sorry if I gave off that impression. I'm aware Jones didn't start out crazy. He always had issues, but he did start his church for the right reasons. That's part of what makes his story a tragedy.

Thanks for that. It is indeed what makes it a tragedy, and what reminds us to be on our guard against people who seem to good to be true.

670 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:40:47am

re: #666 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

It was a lot more than just Harvey Milk. Feinstein, who took Moscone's place, and Willie Brown were among them, too. The topic came up as smear tactics during both of Brown's successful runs for mayor. But that's not why "San Francisco" would like to forget.

I think it is a reason, but the deaths are still the main reason. People often want to wall themselves off from horrors like Jonestown. It's a defense mechanism.

671 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:43:22am

Did anyone else just feel that? Like a little shudder, a wave of gestalt passing through as everyone decided to band together in a community and face our problems head-on?

No?

Just me, then.

672 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:44:30am

re: #658 Conservative Moonbat

It apparently started off as a really progressive movement with lots of emphasis on social justice. It was one of the first churches in the US to try and integrate races and a lot of what Jones was preaching was informed by Marxism.

That's actually not true. The Pentecostal movement began as an integrated movement. Like the rest of American Protestantism, most of their denominations separated along those lines.

But the Church of God in Christ, one of the fastest growing Black denominations, started out as racially integrated, about a 100 or so years ago.

It's been speculated that Jones had some form of mental illness that grew worse and worse over the years. Before he went nutso it was a really positive movement. I think calling all former members cultists does them a great disservice. Many were liberal progressive activists drawn in by the social justice messages.

A friend of mine who is a historian was commissioned by the California Historical Society to go through their administrative papers. Totally depressing. What happened at People's Temple, or why it became so prominent in SF politics, can't be understood without understanding the Redevelopment Agency/gentrification and the Western Addition and especially the Fillmore and what was to become Japantown.

Anyone interested can start here: [Link: www.pbs.org...]

My friend said most of what he saw was a lot of older widows looking for some social stability later in life. Very depressing.

673 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:45:16am

re: #671 Obdicut

Did anyone else just feel that? Like a little shudder, a wave of gestalt passing through as everyone decided to band together in a community and face our problems head-on?

No?

Just me, then.

It's just people trying to deal honestly with the issues. That's a rare phenomenon these days.

674 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:45:32am

re: #664 Decatur Deb

Might be true of most, but they'll have some number of proficient and insane killers. Don't rely on cartoon versions of the Militias or the Klan.

I cannot afford to rely on cartoon versions of either.

675 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:49:29am

re: #667 Decatur Deb

Don't think he'd be 'fundamentalist' as much as 'authoritarian'. They played pretty fast and loose with the texts, IIRC.

Yeah, different set of authoritarians. There was nothing fundamentalist about JJ or PT. His ordination was in the Disciples of Christ (Christian) - mainline Protestant, and he went off on his own thing from there.

676 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:53:59am

re: #631 Decatur Deb

re: #628 Alouette

One of my old bosses was a 'Lost Boy'. He never quite recovered, and never quite stopped believing.

The "Lost Boy" route is one of the most f'ed up things I've ever heard of. And I've seen just about the worst of everything social conservatism has to offer. At least these foster kids who keep getting killed by their homeschooling Christians-first parents can ftmp said to be accidents.

Lost Boys are litearally thrown to the wolves.

677 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:54:53am

re: #676 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

The "Lost Boy" route is one of the most f'ed up things I've ever heard of. And I've seen just about the worst of everything social conservatism has to offer. At least these foster kids who keep getting killed by their homeschooling Christians-first parents can ftmp said to be accidents.

Lost Boys are literally thrown to the wolves.

FTMP?

678 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:56:08am

re: #677 Dark_Falcon

FTMP?

For the most part

679 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:57:48am

Sent this to a judge... Think it'll work?

I would greatly appreciate being considered to be removed from the jury pool consideration.

I am a commission only salesperson for (company). I am the only person in my position in Western Virginia (west of Richmond) at this time. That means that as a company, we will have to shut down business in this end of the state for an unforeseeable amount of time. Personally, I cannot afford to take two weeks off because I might have to be in court on September 1 from where I might be expected to serve on a jury at some point during the month or not.

I take civil duty seriously, and will, of course, cede to the wishes of the Court. I also take my fiscal and corporate responsibilities seriously, and therefore throw my family’s financial well-being on the tender mercies of the Court.

Or do you think the judge will put me in Bankruptcy court instead?

680 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 8:58:12am

re: #676 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

The "Lost Boy" route is one of the most f'ed up things I've ever heard of. And I've seen just about the worst of everything social conservatism has to offer. At least these foster kids who keep getting killed by their homeschooling Christians-first parents can ftmp said to be accidents.

Lost Boys are litearally thrown to the wolves.

Not literally. I don't think any FLDS keep wolf kennels in their compounds.

681 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:00:27am

re: #680 Alouette

Not literally. I don't think any FLDS keep wolf kennels in their compounds.

Being thrown in wolf kennels might be preferable to getting f'd by Warren Jeffs. Death might be preferable, dunno.

682 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:01:28am

re: #681 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Being thrown in wolf kennels might be preferable to getting f'd by Warren Jeffs. Death might be preferable, dunno.

It might have been better if those girls died instead?

683 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:03:32am

re: #682 Sergey Romanov

It might have been better if those girls died instead?

It wasn't just girls. It would have been better if no one was subjected to that person in any form, at all.

684 wrenchwench  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:04:31am

re: #679 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Sent this to a judge... Think it'll work?

Or do you think the judge will put me in Bankruptcy court instead?

I have been let off for very similar economic reasons in the past. It may depend on how desperate they are for jurors.

It would be so nice if we didn't have to choose between eating and serving, wouldn't it?

685 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:05:03am

re: #681 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Being thrown in wolf kennels might be preferable to getting f'd by Warren Jeffs. Death might be preferable, dunno.

We were talking about the boys. They are "literally" thrown out into the streets to fend for themselves, but not into actual wild animal canis lupus packs.

Just being a grammar nanny.

686 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:05:25am

re: #678 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

For the most part

OK, thanks for clearing that up.

687 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:05:35am

re: #683 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

It wasn't just girls. It would have been better if no one was subjected to that person in any form, at all.

Sure, but that's not what I asked.

688 allegro  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:05:35am

re: #676 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

The "Lost Boy" route is one of the most f'ed up things I've ever heard of. And I've seen just about the worst of everything social conservatism has to offer. At least these foster kids who keep getting killed by their homeschooling Christians-first parents can ftmp said to be accidents.

Lost Boys are litearally thrown to the wolves.

I watched part of a program the other night - can't for the life of me remember the host - that had 4 women from Jeff's community talking about the horrors of this cult. They talked more about the girls being given to older men as "wives" but did touch on the lost boys a bit. I sat there wondering how in the hell any mother could stand by and watch this happen to her children. I realize they're awfully brainwashed and kept helpless... but damn.

I remembered some interviews with women when the raids went down and the children were temporarily taken away. They appeared to be all for their "idyllic" lives talking about how much they loved their children and how wrong it was for those poor kids to be so traumatized by being removed. There was quite a general backlash against it as well. I don't think kids should be taken away without a lot of very serious consideration - it seemed to me then and now that this was a situation where it was appropriate.

689 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:06:30am

re: #685 Alouette

We were talking about the boys. They are "literally" thrown out into the streets to fend for themselves, but not into actual wild animal canis lupus packs.

Just being a grammar nanny.

Oh, I know. I was playing along.

690 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:06:55am

re: #687 Sergey Romanov

Sure, but that's not what I asked.

Dunno, ask the people subjected to him.

691 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:13:22am

re: #688 allegro

I watched part of a program the other night - can't for the life of me remember the host - that had 4 women from Jeff's community talking about the horrors of this cult. They talked more about the girls being given to older men as "wives" but did touch on the lost boys a bit. I sat there wondering how in the hell any mother could stand by and watch this happen to her children. I realize they're awfully brainwashed and kept helpless... but damn.

I remembered some interviews with women when the raids went down and the children were temporarily taken away. They appeared to be all for their "idyllic" lives talking about how much they loved their children and how wrong it was for those poor kids to be so traumatized by being removed. There was quite a general backlash against it as well. I don't think kids should be taken away without a lot of very serious consideration - it seemed to me then and now that this was a situation where it was appropriate.

Kids should never be taken away without serious consideration and a mountain of documentation to back it up. It's one reason socons like that resent state agencies and the general idea of accountability in the first place. The government is supposed to back up their family- and personality-destroying behavior and give them money for homeschool.

That said, there are a lot of children and youth who fall through the cracks. Those stories could make a glibbertarian out of anyone, real quick.

692 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:15:06am

Gotta pick up some laundry, BBIAB

693 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:16:44am

Kitty just had a sneezing fit. I should not laugh at her, but omg it was cute.

694 Lidane  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:18:13am

Can I rant about the textbook racket for a moment? I just priced my books for the fall.

Buying the textbooks I still need from the university = $827, and that's if I manage to get them all used.

Buying a mix of new and used books from Amazon.com = $419.

What. The. Fuck. The markup is ridiculous. I'll be ordering online for sure.

695 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:20:08am

re: #694 Lidane

It might even be cheaper in some cases to borrow them from public libraries and xerox and bind them.

696 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:21:19am

re: #695 000G

It might even be cheaper in some cases to borrow them from public libraries and xerox and bind them.

Cheaper, but probably not legal.

697 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:21:23am

re: #695 000G

It might even be cheaper in some cases to borrow them from public libraries and xerox and bind them.

Technically, this is illegal, copying the whole book that is. Even copies available from the public library are subject to copyright restrictions.

698 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:21:32am

re: #694 Lidane

I'm waiting for the day when students can just download the chapters needed onto Kindle, iPad or smartphone. I know of a company working on a model that will work for publishers and authors. I hope they can work it out.

699 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:21:47am

re: #694 Lidane

Can I rant about the textbook racket for a moment? I just priced my books for the fall.

Buying the textbooks I still need from the university = $827, and that's if I manage to get them all used.

Buying a mix of new and used books from Amazon.com = $419.

What. The. Fuck. The markup is ridiculous. I'll be ordering online for sure.

Do you object against pirated lit? ;)

700 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:22:47am

re: #697 thedopefishlives

Technically, this is illegal, copying the whole book that is. Even copies available from the public library are subject to copyright restrictions.

Even if you do not distribute them and/or make a profit off of them? Fair use for educational purposes does not apply?

If that's true, then, with all due respect, your copyright laws are shit.

701 iossarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:23:00am

re: #694 Lidane

Can I rant about the textbook racket for a moment? I just priced my books for the fall.

[...]

Textbooks are one area where government regulation could instantly drive down the cost of attending college by a significant amount, simultaneously increasing the overall efficiency of the economy (by eliminating a largely useless function: that of printing minor "updates" to perfectly usable books).

702 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:23:52am

re: #698 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

[Link: www.inkling.com...]

[Link: www.coursesmart.com...]

703 Lidane  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:24:34am

re: #699 Sergey Romanov

Do you object against pirated lit? ;)

I'm pretty sure my Digital Law professor would have a few words to say about that. Heh.

704 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:25:01am

re: #703 Lidane

I'm pretty sure my Digital Law professor would have a few words to say about that. Heh.

Those old farts ;)

705 allegro  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:32:46am

re: #701 iossarian

Textbooks are one area where government regulation could instantly drive down the cost of attending college by a significant amount, simultaneously increasing the overall efficiency of the economy (by eliminating a largely useless function: that of printing minor "updates" to perfectly usable books).

I'm not all for government regulation in this regard since who is to decide what updates are important - some of them very much are important especially in the sciences with emerging technologies and information. I tried to make it easier on students by allowing for a pretty wide range of editions they could use, encouraging them to get used books. I made copies of added information not included in earlier additions, or pointed them out in lectures. Not hard to do.

706 RogueOne  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:34:34am

re: #698 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I'm waiting for the day when students can just download the chapters needed onto Kindle, iPad or smartphone. I know of a company working on a model that will work for publishers and authors. I hope they can work it out.

The hardware has to comply with the ADA or the school can't recommend their use:
[Link: www2.ed.gov...]

707 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:35:45am

Penn Jilette @ CNN.com: [Link: www.cnn.com...]

It's amazing to me how many people think that voting to have the government give poor people money is compassion. Helping poor and suffering people is compassion. Voting for our government to use guns to give money to help poor and suffering people is immoral self-righteous bullying laziness.

People need to be fed, medicated, educated, clothed, and sheltered, and if we're compassionate we'll help them, but you get no moral credit for forcing other people to do what you think is right. There is great joy in helping people, but no joy in doing it at gunpoint.

People try to argue that government isn't really force. You believe that? Try not paying your taxes. (This is only a thought experiment -- suggesting on CNN.com that someone not pay his or her taxes is probably a federal offense, and I'm a nut, but I'm not crazy.). When they come to get you for not paying your taxes, try not going to court. Guns will be drawn. Government is force -- literally, not figuratively.

I don't believe the majority always knows what's best for everyone. The fact that the majority thinks they have a way to get something good does not give them the right to use force on the minority that don't want to pay for it. If you have to use a gun, I don't believe you really know jack. Democracy without respect for individual rights sucks. It's just ganging up against the weird kid, and I'm always the weird kid.

I guess this is what Obdicut refered to in #502.

708 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:36:18am

An interesting interview (in Russian) with a Chechen-Russian writer German Sadullayev (currently lives in Germany):

"Chechens in Europe":

[Link: russ.ru...]

709 RogueOne  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:37:33am

re: #707 000G

Just finished reading that.

710 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:38:23am

re: #612 000G

So you're basically saying that maintaining socon attitudes turns a parent into an unloving, at best indifferent manipulator who cares about their child only to the extent that it allows them to live out their control freak fetish.

Well no, you said that, based on your own fantasies. Clutch the pearls, someone dares criticize socon lifestyle choices. /

711 allegro  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:39:41am

re: #706 RogueOne

The hardware has to comply with the ADA or the school can't recommend their use:
[Link: www2.ed.gov...]

This isn't making much sense to me. The blind can't read books either that are not Brail adapted... right? Are any universities requiring the use of Kindles?

Color me confusled.

712 Killgore Trout  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:40:07am

re: #707 000G

Penn Jilette @ CNN.com: [Link: www.cnn.com...]

I guess this is what Obdicut refered to in #502.

As much as I admire Penn's wit and occasional wisdom I still consider him a political idiot. It's pretty common with skeptics. The Amazing Randy forums are full of Ron Paul supporters. Penn was an early Tea Party supporter but has since backed off once he started getting angry comments from fans.

713 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:40:28am

re: #710 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Well no, you said that, based on your own fantasies. Clutch the pearls, someone dares criticize socon lifestyle choices. /

Not based on my own fantasies, based on what you said:

000G: Again: You are assuming that parents cannot change, that their socon attitudes will always prevail over their love for their children as actual persons instead of material to mold and shape. You are also lumping all socons together into one large authoritarian-totalitarian proto-fascist blob.

OhCrap: Well, you're wrong about that. First of all, I don't presume "love for their children"; I think that's a cliché that leads to excuses and rationalizations.

714 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:42:40am

re: #712 Killgore Trout

As much as I admire Penn's wit and occasional wisdom I still consider him a political idiot. It's pretty common with skeptics. The Amazing Randy forums are full of Ron Paul supporters. Penn was an early Tea Party supporter but has since backed off once he started getting angry comments from fans.

Penn and Randi were AGW deniers for a very long time. I don't know if they still are.

715 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:43:14am

re: #700 000G

Even if you do not distribute them and/or make a profit off of them? Fair use for educational purposes does not apply?

If that's true, then, with all due respect, your copyright laws are shit.

Distribution and profit have nothing to do with copyright. Technically, it's illegal to rip a CD to your computer if the copyright holder does not want you to. Fair use is a nebulous and vague defense to copyright infringement, but in the case of copying a whole book, it would almost certainly not apply. It also matters not the nobility of the purpose, as federal copyright statutes do not consider intent. Long story short, yes, American copyright laws are rather draconian, and certainly behind the times with respect to digital media such as the aforementioned CD ripping.

716 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:43:43am

re: #707 000G

Yeah, that's the amazingly short-sighted way I used to think, except I was even worse.

Luckily, figuring out some basic economics and ways that human beings actually work in the real world cured me of that.

The thing is, in that silly rant, Penn gets close to the truth. When he says:

People need to be fed, medicated, educated, clothed, and sheltered, and if we're compassionate we'll help them, but you get no moral credit for forcing other people to do what you think is right.

He's got it just slightly backwards. You get no moral credit for having a society that does help to ensure the well-being of its citizens, because it's the basic level we should operate at. We're operating well below that these days.

717 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:44:34am

re: #713 000G

Not based on my own fantasies, based on what you said:

OhCrap: Well, you're wrong about that. First of all, I don't presume "love for their children"; I think that's a cliché that leads to excuses and rationalizations.

Yes, I said I believe presuming "love for their children" is a cliché that leads to excuses and rationalizations. And?

718 makeitstop  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:44:41am

Today's Wingnut Birther fun...

An Air Force staff sergeant based in Germany says he's been AWOL since last week because he read on the Internet that President Barack Obama's long form birth certificate is a fraud.

Inspired by fellow birther, Army doctor Terrence Lakin, Staff Sgt. Daryn J. Moran has plastered the Internet with the news that he's deserting his post as an ophthalmology technician overseas.

"In identifying [Obama] as my enemy and proclaiming him to be the enemy of the entire country, I squarely place myself in the same situation as himself," Moran says in a video posted by a birther website.

"The reason I no longer obey the Commander-in-Chief is not because he's Black, but because he has no credible proof that he is an American," Moran wrote in the comment section of Glenn Beck's The Blaze. "It's simple. Arrest B. Obama or arrest me."

Moran. A perfectly fitting name.

719 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:44:46am

re: #715 thedopefishlives

In fact, regarding the CD ripping case, these days you would probably also get nailed on a DMCA charge for defeating the CD's copy protection. It's amazing how badly American intellectual property laws have scaled to meet the digital era, but then again, I can't think of any places in the world that are doing any better (and some are actively getting worse, like the EU).

720 RogueOne  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:45:30am

re: #711 allegro

This isn't making much sense to me. The blind can't read books either that are not Brail adapted... right? Are any universities requiring the use of Kindles?

Color me confusled.

Not sure. I only remembered it because of 2 of the original complaints. IIRC, the kindle program wasn't a mandate that the students use them just an offering as a test. Because it wasn't accessible to all the students the DOJ said no one was allowed to use them. For some reason I'm thinking UNC and U of Az were the 2 I read about but I wouldn't put money on that part.

721 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:46:31am

re: #718 makeitstop

Today's Wingnut Birther fun...

Moran. A perfectly fitting name.

I love how out of nowhere he says "It's not because he's Black."

Methinks the opthamologist doth protest too much.

722 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:47:52am

re: #706 RogueOne

The hardware has to comply with the ADA or the school can't recommend their use:
[Link: www2.ed.gov...]

A friend of mine is in the ADA compliance dept of a U. I'll ask her what she knows about it.

723 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:48:19am

re: #715 thedopefishlives

Distribution and profit have nothing to do with copyright.

It does in some jurisdictions. Apparently not in the US. More's the pity.

Technically, it's illegal to rip a CD to your computer if the copyright holder does not want you to.

Yeah, DRM is a truly evil concept.

Fair use is a nebulous and vague defense to copyright infringement, but in the case of copying a whole book, it would almost certainly not apply. It also matters not the nobility of the purpose, as federal copyright statutes do not consider intent.

Mkay, I am taking you at face value here.

Long story short, yes, American copyright laws are rather draconian, and certainly behind the times with respect to digital media such as the aforementioned CD ripping.

Not just digital. Geez. Now I wouldn't be surprised to hear that publishers can forbid public libraries from carrying their books.

724 Decatur Deb  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:48:19am

re: #718 makeitstop

So arrest him.

725 iossarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:48:28am

re: #705 allegro

I'm not all for government regulation in this regard since who is to decide what updates are important - some of them very much are important especially in the sciences with emerging technologies and information. I tried to make it easier on students by allowing for a pretty wide range of editions they could use, encouraging them to get used books. I made copies of added information not included in earlier additions, or pointed them out in lectures. Not hard to do.

I'm all for your personal approach, but unfortunately the no-regulation system is what leads to $800 textbook bills. Not everyone is as student-conscious as you.

726 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:48:30am

re: #694 Lidane

Can I rant about the textbook racket for a moment? I just priced my books for the fall.

Buying the textbooks I still need from the university = $827, and that's if I manage to get them all used.

Buying a mix of new and used books from Amazon.com = $419.

What. The. Fuck. The markup is ridiculous. I'll be ordering online for sure.

That final price is still ridiculous. And the publishers wonder why so many people pirate these books?

727 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:49:15am

re: #720 RogueOne

Because it wasn't accessible to all the students the DOJ said no one was allowed to use them. For some reason I'm thinking UNC and U of Az were the 2 I read about but I wouldn't put money on that part.

I didn't see that in what was linked. Have another link for that?

728 allegro  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:49:32am

re: #720 RogueOne

Not sure. I only remembered it because of 2 of the original complaints. IIRC, the kindle program wasn't a mandate that the students use them just an offering as a test. Because it wasn't accessible to all the students the DOJ said no one was allowed to use them. For some reason I'm thinking UNC and U of Az were the 2 I read about but I wouldn't put money on that part.

I remember back in the dark ages when I was an undergrad. Calculators were new and very expensive so only a few students could afford them. The rest of us had to depend on our trusty slide rules. I don't see this is any different. Those who can afford stuff always have a bit of advantage in some ways. The students who can afford Kindles have fewer heavy books to carry around - that's the only advantage I see here.

729 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:49:34am

re: #717 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Yes, I said I believe presuming "love for their children" is a cliché that leads to excuses and rationalizations. And?

And so it follows that you presume that socon parents in general do not have love for their children. Etcetera. What do you have problems with here?

730 iossarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:50:48am

re: #728 allegro

The students who can afford Kindles have fewer heavy books to carry around - that's the only advantage I see here.

The other "advantage" is that it's much easier for publishers to prevent the resale of books on devices like the Kindle.

731 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:50:54am

re: #700 000G

Even if you do not distribute them and/or make a profit off of them? Fair use for educational purposes does not apply?

If that's true, then, with all due respect, your copyright laws are shit.

Copyright law in the US has been fubared 16 ways, squared, to Sunday. The final straw for me was the Bono/Disney "copyright is forever" law that, despite being blatantly unconstitutional was passed and upheld by SCOTUS.

732 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:51:24am

re: #526 Obdicut

I'm not talking about rights. I'm talking about what is best for the kid.

Can you explain how parents who are bigoted against gays are the best people to make decisions for the well-being of a gay child?

They probably aren't, but then, parents who are obsessed with the need to be skinny for success probably aren't the best people to make decisions for the well-being of a pudgy child. There are limits to how much we can protect people from their parents.

There are also limits to how much we can NOT protect people from their parents.

It is complicated.

733 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:51:47am

re: #719 thedopefishlives

In fact, regarding the CD ripping case, these days you would probably also get nailed on a DMCA charge for defeating the CD's copy protection. It's amazing how badly American intellectual property laws have scaled to meet the digital era, but then again, I can't think of any places in the world that are doing any better (and some are actively getting worse, like the EU).

Errr, a lot of digital copyright laws outside of the US these days are crafted by direct lobbying influence of the US.

Also, I am pretty sure that German Urheberrecht is more sensible than American copyright law.

734 Gus  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:51:47am

re: #714 Alouette

Penn and Randi were AGW deniers for a very long time. I don't know if they still are.

Can't have everything in one person or "thinker" in this case. I know I don't agree 100 percent with everything that Christopher Hitchens says or writes but that's no reason for me to discard him as a whole. I do much the same with James Randi. If we had to apply a strict litmus test on everyone we read or listen to it would severely limit who we read or listen to almost to the point where we'd only listen to ourselves.

735 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:51:59am

re: #729 000G

And so it follows that you presume that socon parents in general do not have love for their children. Etcetera. What do you have problems with here?

I should be asking you.

Can you tell the difference between "I don't assume every _______ parent does what they do out of love for their children" and "no _______ parent loves their children"?

736 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:52:09am

re: #723 000G

Not just digital. Geez. Now I wouldn't be surprised to hear that publishers can forbid public libraries from carrying their books.

Actually, I believe they've tried. I can't find the reference offhand. Copyrights here in the US are severely slanted in favor of the copyright holders, as patent law is in favor of the patent holders, both of which are severely detrimental to the American software industry.

737 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:52:54am

re: #733 000G

Errr, a lot of digital copyright laws outside of the US these days are crafted by direct lobbying influence of the US.

Also, I am pretty sure that German Urheberrecht is more sensible than American copyright law.

Your copyright laws are, sure, but EU software patent law is a nightmare.

738 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:53:12am

re: #537 Obdicut

You're bringing 'abuse' into this when it isn't the issue. My question is not about abuse. It's about whether or not they are the person best equipped to make decisions for that child.

Obviously, the decision they'd make is that the child should refrain from any sort of sexual activity, including fantasy, and fight against their actual nature.

Do you think that is the decision that would benefit the gay child the best?

Who is better, and how do we appoint them to make decisions for this child?

739 allegro  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:53:15am

re: #730 iossarian

The other "advantage" is that it's much easier for publishers to prevent the resale of books on devices like the Kindle.

A very good point I had not considered. Thankee.

740 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:54:19am

re: #735 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I should be asking you.

Can you tell the difference between "I don't assume every ___ parent does what they do out of love for their children" and "no ___ parent loves their children"?

Nevermind that I never assumed that every ___ parent does what they do out of love for their children but that you assumed that they generally do not.

741 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:54:28am

re: #714 Alouette

Penn and Randi were AGW deniers for a very long time. I don't know if they still are.

I read they would address this question in a special episode of "Bullshit" reviewing their own claims in earlier episodes. Don't know if they ever did this (never saw a single episode either ;).

742 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:55:03am

re: #553 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

How do you know?

Straw man. No one has said anything about declaring parents unfit, or government intervention.

Why do you think it's socially conservative parents are capable of making the best decisions for gay or otherwise non-conformist children?

Not that much of a straw man. I'm pretty firmly on the liberal side of the fence, but even I am going to the next logical step with 'if these aren't the best people to make decisions for this child'--well, who is? And that's a legal issue.

743 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:55:18am

re: #738 SanFranciscoZionist

Who is better, and how do we appoint them to make decisions for this child?

Might want to read through the rest of my comments.

744 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:56:01am

re: #555 Obdicut

Those words are not actually inverses in English.

I'm not talking about the consequences of concluding that a certain set of parents aren't the best possible people to raise their children. My main thrust is to demonstrate that this is true-- which is a rather obvious fact, but still needs doing.

The 'consequences' that I'm after are not "Therefore we take the kid away and have them raised by someone else", but more "Therefore we realize that rights for the child themselves are important."

I'm a very big advocate of rights for children. Not so much with the government deciding to take kids away from their parents.

But that has very little to do with being gay, specifically.

745 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:56:44am

re: #740 000G

Nevermind that I never assumed that every ___ parent does what they do out of love for their children

There is no reason to be so defensive about it.

but that you assumed that they generally do not.

No, I did not. Reread the post.

746 wrenchwench  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:56:51am

re: #743 Obdicut

Might want to read through the rest of my comments.

She'll get there. She's doin' it SFZ style.

747 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:57:08am

re: #737 thedopefishlives

Your copyright laws are, sure, but EU software patent law is a nightmare.

True.

748 iossarian  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:57:20am

re: #739 allegro

A very good point I had not considered. Thankee.

It's really sad, because obviously, used the "right" way, devices like the Kindle are a massive potential gain for universities. With text-to-speech you can even use them make the situation better for people unable to read.

But the advantages are mostly nullified if you don't have some kind of robust open-access policy in place (i.e., the content is open access, or at least you have some kind of access protection).

I just think that, in much the same way as primary research is largely funded by the government, there is enormous potential for the same government to step in and fund an open-access teaching materials system, which would be a lot cheaper to the end user than the current publishing industry-driven setup, without any real loss of quality.

749 Obdicut  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:59:03am

re: #744 SanFranciscoZionist

But that has very little to do with being gay, specifically.

Sure. It was an example. It's useful because it's a clear and common one.

750 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:59:11am

re: #582 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

To me, this is one of the follies of socon chest-beating on their supposedly superior "family values". Those values can lead to broken up families with estranged parents and offspring.

Anything for ideological purity, I guess. I think it should also be stressed that it's not just homosexuality; people defending socon childrearing should really be thanking you for broaching the easiest, most obvious topic.

I've seen a hell of a lot of families with similar problems who are not 'social conservatives'. You don't have to be a socon to be an asshole or an abuser.

751 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:59:28am

re: #745 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

There is no reason to be so defensive about it.

I am not being defensive. I am just responding to inanity. Very politely, I might add. No reason to be passive-agressive. //

No, I did not. Reread the post.

Yes, you did.

752 Kronocide  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 10:00:58am

re: #716 Obdicut


Luckily, figuring out some basic economics and ways that human beings actually work in the real world cured me of that.

I've said that same thing to myself 129 times over the last 3 years.... LOL.

753 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 10:01:28am

Ahoy! Arrr, copyright, schmopyright. Respect that? No, never, me hearties! Cat o' nine tails awaits any scallywag who wants me pieces o'eight!

754 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 10:02:20am

re: #742 SanFranciscoZionist

Not that much of a straw man. I'm pretty firmly on the liberal side of the fence, but even I am going to the next logical step with 'if these aren't the best people to make decisions for this child'--well, who is? And that's a legal issue.

At that point in the convo, the matter of whether socon parents vs gay children was an abstraction. I still say the best we can do is support organizations like Trevor Project, to provide a softer place for those kids to land. That's specific to gay stuff, but gay children are not the only ones at risk, by any means.

755 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 10:06:55am

re: #750 SanFranciscoZionist

I've seen a hell of a lot of families with similar problems who are not 'social conservatives'. You don't have to be a socon to be an asshole or an abuser.

Nope, you don't. But the conversation was started with a logical slippage between socon parenting "choices" and whether it's best for young people if government "allows" them.

756 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 10:08:00am

re: #755 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Nope, you don't. But the conversation was started with a logical slippage between socon parenting "choices" and whether it's best for young people if government "allows" them.

There's no way I can see to distinguish that from a discussion of parental rights in general.

757 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 10:10:04am

re: #751 000G

I am not being defensive. I am just responding to inanity. Very politely, I might add. No reason to be passive-agressive. //

Yes, you did.

You were eager for me to say that, but I didn't, because it's not what I think.

I'm only going to state this again, once, so listen up. I don't go by the presumption of "they do it out of love for their children". I think it leads to excuses and rationalizations for abusive, damaging behavior. Twist it into "SHE SAID SOCIAL CONSERVATIVES DON'T LOVE THEIR CHILDREN!!" as many times as you like, doesn't change what was actually said.

758 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 10:14:29am

re: #756 SanFranciscoZionist

There's no way I can see to distinguish that from a discussion of parental rights in general.

It's a false dilemma. I know of no government statutes that force parents of any stripe to raise their children the way "government" says they must. I do know of a lot of children that slip through the cracks of those state agency mechanisms set up to protect them, though.

759 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 12:04:40pm

re: #757 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I don't go by the presumption of "they do it out of love for their children".

Nice of you to add the "they do it out of" there, now. Because that is not what you originally said and what I responded to. What you originally said was:

First of all, I don't presume "love for their children"; I think that's a cliché that leads to excuses and rationalizations.

So, what you originally said was that parents (or a certain, socon subset of parents) could be reasonably excluded from being presumed that they love their children. That you rationalize this exclusion of a very reasonable presumtion with "it's a cliché and that leads to excuses and rationalizations" does not change the fact that you deem it perfectly fine to not presume the presence of parental love (hence: to presume, at the very least, absence of parental love). That's not "twisting" your words, that's acurrately summing up their logical and semantical content. Deal with it, and drop the trite "pear clutching" phrase already.

I think it leads to excuses and rationalizations for abusive, damaging behavior.

How on earth does the reasonable premise that parents in general love their children "lead" to excuses and rationalizations for abusive, damaging behavior? Seems to me that the one making excuses and rationalizations is you so that you can continue to cling to your caricature version of never-changing, eternal and absolute evil socon parents.

760 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Aug 17, 2011 5:30:56pm

re: #759 000G

Nice of you to add the "they do it out of" there, now. Because that is not what you originally said and what I responded to. What you originally said was:

And I'll say it again, too.

I don't presume "love for their children". It leads to excuses and rationalizations for heinous behavior.

Seems to me that the one making excuses and rationalizations is you so that you can continue to cling to your caricature version of never-changing, eternal and absolute evil socon parents.

Incorrect. "Eternal, never changing, absolute" are all your terms, so don't ascribe them to me because I haven't said that or anything like it.

But yes, do keep reading, and keep searching, and keep yearning for that broad brush that will enable you to cast poor little social conservatives as victimized by some critic on the internet. Even if you have to cram words in my posts to get it.

In fact, since you're another one obviously looking to feel offended abou stuff I say about social/cultural conservative nastiness, simply stick around. You'll find plenty more to gripe about, I can guarantee it.


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