Report: Gun Manufacturers ‘Lost’ More Than 16,000 Weapons in 2 Years

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US News • Views: 33,171

A new study from the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence shows that over the past two years, US gun manufacturers have ‘lost’ more than 16,000 guns.

The report, released by the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence, pulled data from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF) and found that 16,485 guns left the inventories of nearly 4,500 licensed gun manufacturers throughout the country without a record of them ever being sold.

In 2004 Congress passed the Tiahrt amendment – named for its sponsor then-Rep. Todd Tiahrt (R-Kansas) – which prohibited the ATF from requiring gun manufacturers to track their inventory. The Brady Campaign has long advocated for a repeal of the Tiahrt amendment.

“It is shocking that gun makers are so oblivious to public safety that they lose track of thousands of guns every year,” said Dennis Henigan, the acting president of the Brady Center. “ Given the lethality of its product, the gun industry has a special duty to act responsibly.  Instead, it has a scandalous record of carelessness.”

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569 comments
1 Obdicut  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:03:25pm

Gus had a great link in the last thread relevant to this. Highly advise reading.

[Link: www.pbs.org...]

2 Obdicut  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:10:18pm

And Gus, post something so I can upding you because now I feel bad about stealing your updings.

Here's a key part from that report:

ATF officials say that only about 8% of the nation's 124,000 retail gun dealers sell the majority of handguns that are used in crimes. They conclude that these licensed retailers are part of a block of rogue entrepreneurs tempted by the big profits of gun trafficking. Cracking down on these dealers continues to be a priority for the ATF. What's needed, according to Wachtel, is better monitoring of the activities of legally licensed gun dealers. This means examining FFL paperwork to see where their guns are coming from, and making sure that those guns are being sold legally.

I don't understand why the rest of the FFL license holders aren't asking for the ATF to regulate them harder. If I were one, I'd want to be separated out from that 8% that's supplying criminals with weapons. Not the least because they'd be rather unfair competition.

3 Killgore Trout  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:13:27pm

Fast and furious lost 2,500 guns but the most outrageous estimates.Where's the wingnut outrage?

4 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:16:08pm

re: #2 Obdicut

And Gus, post something so I can upding you because now I feel bad about stealing your updings.

Here's a key part from that report:

I don't understand why the rest of the FFL license holders aren't asking for the ATF to regulate them harder. If I were one, I'd want to be separated out from that 8% that's supplying criminals with weapons. Not the least because they'd be rather unfair competition.

A lot of it is private sellers and gun shows no? Less so the latter.

5 jamesfirecat  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:17:00pm

16,000 in two years is 8,000 per year or 667 per month (rounding up from two thrids) or 22 per day (rounding down from 22.2 repeating) or a little less than one an hour....

Its funny, never before has math made me want to curl up in a kevlar sleeping bag before....

6 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:17:19pm

re: #3 Killgore Trout

Fast and furious lost 2,500 guns but the most outrageous estimates.Where's the wingnut outrage?

You don't understand how the invisible hand of the free market works.

7 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:17:22pm

re: #3 Killgore Trout

Fast and furious lost 2,500 guns but the most outrageous estimates.Where's the wingnut outrage?

They aren't worried because they know that the guys up there in the "black helicopters" know exactly where each one of those guns are...

///

8 jaunte  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:17:56pm

Citizens will have to buy guns to protect themselves./

(Before WW1, Krupp used to sell improved armor-piercing shells to the French army, then use the French demonstrations as a sales tool to sell better armor to the German army. And so on.)

9 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:18:00pm

re: #3 Killgore Trout

Fast and furious lost 2,500 guns but the most outrageous estimates.Where's the wingnut outrage?

Businesses fucking up gets a pass from them.

10 jamesfirecat  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:18:13pm

re: #6 Atlas Fails

Especially when the invisible trigger finger is doing its thing.

11 Interesting Times  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:19:21pm

re: #3 Killgore Trout

Fast and furious lost 2,500 guns but the most outrageous estimates.Where's the wingnut outrage?

Those guns were lost by the illegitimate presidency of Kenyan Marxist B. Hussein Obama. The other ones were differently placed by red-blooded Real American™ gun manufacturers, and only a gun-grabbing socialist would want to burden them with tyrannical regulations like inventory tracking anyway.

12 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:21:18pm

re: #11 publicityStunted

From the people who brought you small government AND sodomy laws!

13 Charles Johnson  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:23:28pm

But remember, since only people can kill other people, these missing guns are completely harmless.

/

14 Wozza Matter?  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:23:49pm

re: #12 Atlas Fails

From the people who brought you small government AND sodomy laws!

government small enough to be lubed up and..........(no, just no)

15 Obdicut  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:24:31pm

And to repost another relevant thing from last thread:

Double standard for McCain and Obama on gun law

Obama's time in office has completely borne this out. His administration has not been in any particular way hostile to gun ownership. Yet the gun industry and the right-wing scare machine has continually blown up scares about guns being banned that's actually led to mass ammo purchases, etc.

Someone's making money off that hysteria. And it ain't Obama.

16 Interesting Times  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:25:02pm

re: #13 Charles

Did you intend to downding this comment by Obdicut? I can't see what's wrong with it...

17 jamesfirecat  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:25:45pm

re: #13 Charles

But remember, since only people can kill other people, these missing guns are completely harmless.

/


I think the gun helps. Just standing there going "BANG"... that's not going to kill too many people is it?

18 Obdicut  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:28:09pm

re: #17 jamesfirecat

Guns don't kill people, people kill people, and so do monkeys, if they've got a gun.

God I love Eddie.

19 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:28:32pm

re: #9 HappyWarrior

Businesses fucking up gets a pass from them.

24 year-old dies from an infected tooth-

Well maybe if people didn't rely on the government for everything...

20 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:29:49pm

OT: After reading the introduction and first few chapters of "Three Cups of Tea" it has become apparent to me that David Oliver Relin (the author) wishes that he was a female so that he could have Greg Mortenson's babies...

"Yeah I am an independent and objective journalist, but...OMG!!!, Greg Mortenson is the most awesome man to ever breathe air upon this entire planet!" (interpretive paraphrase)

This pile of crap made number 1 on the NYT bestseller list before being exposed as a fraud? Hell all you had to do was read the introduction and you should have twigged that something was very, very, wrong with this book...sigh. :(

21 Obdicut  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:30:40pm

re: #4 Gus 802

A lot of it is private sellers and gun shows no? Less so the latter.

I think what the ATF is alleging there is that a small percentage of gun shops knowingly sell large amounts to straw buyers who then turn around and sell the guns to the criminals, or to fixers or other middle men.

There's obviously a huge, gaping leak in the gun industry, or we wouldn't have so many guns on the street. I would think, if they were a responsible industry, plugging that hole would be priority number one for them.

22 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:32:47pm

re: #19 Atlas Fails

24 year-old dies from an infected tooth-

I read that story earlier. Broke my heart. Guy was my age and a father too.There is no reason that a 24 year old should die in this country or any for that matter due to a toothache. It's 20 fucking 11.

23 Wozza Matter?  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:32:55pm

re: #21 Obdicut

I would think, if they were a responsible industry, plugging that hole would be priority number one for them.

The only responsibility they have is to make money for their shareholders, if the judgment is they make more money from selling guns around the ensuing panic - then that is the responsible thing to do.

24 Charles Johnson  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:33:15pm

re: #21 Obdicut

I think what the ATF is alleging there is that a small percentage of gun shops knowingly sell large amounts to straw buyers who then turn around and sell the guns to the criminals, or to fixers or other middle men.

There's obviously a huge, gaping leak in the gun industry, or we wouldn't have so many guns on the street. I would think, if they were a responsible industry, plugging that hole would be priority number one for them.

This is why I said in the previous thread that murder is good for the gun business.

Those missing guns made money for someone. That's the only thing that matters to the gun industry, and if it weren't true, we wouldn't be discussing this.

25 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:33:22pm

re: #3 Killgore Trout

Fast and furious lost 2,500 guns but the most outrageous estimates.Where's the wingnut outrage?

It's everywhere.

I hear about it everyday. I get links on my facebook too.

26 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:35:40pm

re: #21 Obdicut

I think what the ATF is alleging there is that a small percentage of gun shops knowingly sell large amounts to straw buyers who then turn around and sell the guns to the criminals, or to fixers or other middle men.

There's obviously a huge, gaping leak in the gun industry, or we wouldn't have so many guns on the street. I would think, if they were a responsible industry, plugging that hole would be priority number one for them.

They just did a raid on one in Arizona (?). I think it was in the Pages.

I'll see if I can find it.

27 Obdicut  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:35:46pm

re: #24 Charles

Are there any gun companies that go beyond what's required in making their guns traceable, doing inventory counts, etc?

I'm seriously thinking of purchasing a gun (though, it being New York, that gun will remain at the shooting range) and I'd prefer to give my business to an actually responsible company.

I kind of doubt there are, though.

28 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:35:53pm

re: #25 ggt

It's everywhere.

I hear about it everyday. I get links on my facebook too.

Reminds me of the loons who tried to blame Clinton for Waco and Ruby Ridge.

29 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:36:13pm

re: #21 Obdicut

I think what the ATF is alleging there is that a small percentage of gun shops knowingly sell large amounts to straw buyers who then turn around and sell the guns to the criminals, or to fixers or other middle men.

There's obviously a huge, gaping leak in the gun industry, or we wouldn't have so many guns on the street. I would think, if they were a responsible industry, plugging that hole would be priority number one for them.

There's multiple sources. I really don't know enough about this topic. But the private sellers are barely regulated. It's more like an honor system. Losing 16K guns is one example. Then you have internet sales and interstate trading. Cops can't stop everyone driving across state borders. The market is saturated to say the least. In some states it's as simple as putting an ad in the paper it on Craigslist and selling it to the first buyer. It's rather difficult since this has been going on for a very long time. Trying to control these sales that is.

30 Mocking Jay  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:36:56pm

I'll bet their accountants didn't miss them...

31 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:37:43pm

re: #28 Atlas Fails

Reminds me of the loons who tried to blame Clinton for Waco and Ruby Ridge.

Lately, from what I've been hearing it's more against the ATF than Holder or Obama.

There are those who want Obama to take the fall, they are going to try to make it a campaign issue . . .. I think Holder is the one truly responsible. As I understand it, he was the one that signed-off on it.

32 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:40:27pm

And frankly. The NRA doesn't give a crap. I know they claim to be about gun safety and all that. Some of which is good. But the primary function of the NRA if to lobby for gun manufacturers. The bottom line is sales. Anything that interferes with those sales negates their profits. I'm not saying they're consciously supporting the sales to hoodlums but they by and large look the other way. It's sort of like selling Everclear or being a drug dealer.

33 RadicalModerate  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:40:41pm

Given our current level of technology, why in the hell are all sales of guns not registered/reported? The idea that gun shows and individual sales are exempt from background checks is absolutely ludicrous.

34 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:40:54pm

re: #15 Obdicut

And to repost another relevant thing from last thread:

Double standard for McCain and Obama on gun law

Obama's time in office has completely borne this out. His administration has not been in any particular way hostile to gun ownership. Yet the gun industry and the right-wing scare machine has continually blown up scares about guns being banned that's actually led to mass ammo purchases, etc.

Someone's making money off that hysteria. And it ain't Obama.

OMG! There is a black *marxist* in the Oval Office.

I'm amazed at how much gun sales have gone up because of that perception.

What is going to spur violence (if anything) in this country is THE LACK OF JOBS. Not who is in office. But, Perception seems to be everything.

35 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:42:24pm

re: #31 ggt

Lately, from what I've been hearing it's more against the ATF than Holder or Obama.

There are those who want Obama to take the fall, they are going to try to make it a campaign issue . . .. I think Holder is the one truly responsible. As I understand it, he was the one that signed-off on it.

You'd be surprised by some of the idiocy pushed by supposedly mainstream right-wing sites like Fox Nation. They pushed Fast and Furious as a potential impeachment issue for weeks, before even they realized the whole "scandal" had completely fizzled. Even crazier sites like WND are still in ZOMG mode over it.

36 RadicalModerate  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:42:31pm

re: #34 ggt

OMG! There is a black *marxist* in the Oval Office.

I'm amazed at how much gun sales have gone up because of that perception.

What is going to spur violence (if anything) in this country is THE LACK OF JOBS. Not who is in office. But, Perception seems to be everything.

Keep in mind that these same loons thought (and some still do) that Obama was going to make sport fishing illegal.

37 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:42:34pm

re: #33 RadicalModerate

Given our current level of technology, why in the hell are all sales of guns not registered/reported? The idea that gun shows and individual sales are exempt from background checks is absolutely ludicrous.

It depends on the State Laws.

38 RadicalModerate  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:46:53pm

re: #37 ggt

It depends on the State Laws.

Yeah. And said state laws are severely broken.
I'm not advocating taking away of anyone's guns. However the idea of "personal responsibility" that so many libertarian-types love espousing so much seems to have a gaping hole when it regards gun ownership.

39 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:46:53pm

re: #35 Atlas Fails

You'd be surprised by some of the idiocy pushed by supposedly mainstream right-wing sites like Fox Nation. They pushed Fast and Furious as a potential impeachment issue for weeks, before even they realized the whole "scandal" had completely fizzled. Even crazier sites like WND are still in ZOMG mode over it.

People (mostly men) seem to have a knee-jerk reaction at any idea that they won't be able to defend themselves, or their families.

At least, that has been my personal experience. My father and my husband both feel a deep, deep (primal) responsibility on those fronts.

And, as our laws are written, it is the individual responsibility to do so. Not the police or the government. Some people seem to really take it to heart more than others.

Add to that the whole gun-nut thing. The skeet, the birds, the hunting dogs --it is it's own culture.

But, I've been surrounded by responsible firearm owners. Not a beer can is cracked until the guns are cleaned and locked in the safe. Not even an antihistime is allowed. Seriously.

40 Obdicut  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:47:33pm

re: #32 Gus 802

It's sort of like selling Everclear

Hilarity.

I'm off to bed. With a final sip of some nice scotch. No everclear.

41 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:48:11pm

There is also a nice loop-hole regarding elected officials. Upon taking the oath of office, they automatically are eligible to carry.

That is a big, big flaw in the system. IMHO.

42 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:48:54pm

re: #40 Obdicut

Hilarity.

I'm off to bed. With a final sip of some nice scotch. No everclear.

That shit has a skull and crossbones warning, doesn't it?

43 Charles Johnson  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:49:12pm

re: #32 Gus 802

And frankly. The NRA doesn't give a crap. I know they claim to be about gun safety and all that. Some of which is good. But the primary function of the NRA if to lobby for gun manufacturers. The bottom line is sales. Anything that interferes with those sales negates their profits. I'm not saying they're consciously supporting the sales to hoodlums but they by and large look the other way. It's sort of like selling Everclear or being a drug dealer.

Absolutely - the NRA is a hard right wing lobby for the gun industry, and they could not possibly care less about public safety or crime.

44 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:50:49pm

Lulz. I'm tempted to register just to vote for option #2.

45 laZardo  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:51:04pm

Evening folks. Any reason for me to not be completely snarky tonight?

46 Mocking Jay  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:52:10pm

Okay, this headline really made me laugh.


Rome monuments attacked by vandals

My first thought was "Again???"

47 b_sharp  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:52:18pm

re: #34 ggt

OMG! There is a black *marxist* in the Oval Office.

I'm amazed at how much gun sales have gone up because of that perception.

What is going to spur violence (if anything) in this country is THE LACK OF JOBS. Not who is in office. But, Perception seems to be everything.

That is quite perceptive of you.

48 Digital Display  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:53:36pm

re: #45 laZardo

Evening folks. Any reason for me to not be completely snarky tonight?

Have you had your shots?
/

49 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:53:58pm

re: #33 RadicalModerate

Given our current level of technology, why in the hell are all sales of guns not registered/reported? The idea that gun shows and individual sales are exempt from background checks is absolutely ludicrous.

Amazing isn't it? What's the big deal? No one is going to take away their guns. What do they think they're going to protect us from tyrants? The irony here is that a lot of these paranoid folks are closet tyrants themselves.re: #43 Charles

Absolutely - the NRA is a hard right wing lobby for the gun industry, and they could not possibly care less about public safety or crime.

It's a damn shame too. The NRA practically owns all of congress. They have unbelievable influence. This issue is the sacred cows of sacred cows. You can't even mention one tiny inkling of regulation with the industry without the NRA freaking out.

50 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:54:10pm

re: #46 JasonA

Okay, this headline really made me laugh.

Rome monuments attacked by vandals

My first thought was "Again???"

Ugh on the American student trying to chip off pieces of the coliseum.

Maybe we should put a page in our passports: Please do not behave like a complete jerk in foreign countries. You aren't the last American to want to visit there, you know.

51 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:55:52pm

And I'm saying this as a supporter of concealed carry.

52 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:57:26pm

re: #51 Gus 802

And I'm saying this as a supporter of concealed carry.

I support concealed carry, but I also support concealed carry licenses.

53 laZardo  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:57:46pm

re: #48 HoosierHoops

Have you had your shots?
/

$30 cash at the pharmacy, free if I've worked there long enough to get benefits.

54 RadicalModerate  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:58:03pm

re: #44 Atlas Fails

Lulz. I'm tempted to register just to vote for option #2.

Here's the current vote totals - pretty much what you'd expect from the WorldNut crazies. A bonus is their "protecting our culture" phraseology.
[Link: forums.wnd.com...]

Shariah is utterly alien and foreign to our Constitution and a threat to our liberties - it has no place here 58% (862)

It's part and parcel of the effort to Islamize America 17% (251)

For those who don't believe it's possible, just look at what's happening in Europe 10% (143)

Efforts by activist judges to chip away at the Constitution weaken the very tool we have to protect ourselves from imposition of Shariah or other foreign law 8% (118)

The attempt to introduce Shariah in the U.S. indicates Muslim immigrants do not wish to integrate into American culture - that's a big problem 3% (52)

Years of trashing American and Judeo-Christian exceptionalism have left a spiritual void in our culture that those without such self doubts are only too willing to fill 3% (41)

Not at all - this is just the latest so-called threat being pedaled by fear-mongering, Islamophobic, right-wing bigots 1% (9)

While the prospect of Shariah in the U.S. frightens me, the likelihood of it ever happening seems very small 0% (4)

I see no problem with Shariah being used to resolve non-criminal disputes if all parties are in agreement - it's no different than mediation which is already practiced 0% (3)

I'm more worried about militant Christian fundamentalists imposing their morality on everyone in the name of their religion 0% (3)

Other 0% (3)

Shariah has no chance of establishing a foothold in America's decadent culture where "gay" marriage is increasingly being legalized and accepted 0% (3)

Shariah does not need to be imposed - when Americans understand the beauty, wisdom and truth of Islam, they will beg for their country to be governed by it 0% (1)

55 laZardo  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 8:58:20pm

re: #52 Atlas Fails

I support concealed carry, but I also support concealed carry licenses.

I support concealed carry licenses based on a thorough psychiatric and criminal record evaluation.

56 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:00:34pm

re: #55 laZardo

I support concealed carry licenses based on a thorough psychiatric and criminal record evaluation.

Strangely enough, I've heard several people who have gone thru the concealed carry classes and decided not to carry.

57 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:02:20pm

re: #52 Atlas Fails

I support concealed carry, but I also support concealed carry licenses.

For sure. Fingerprints and the whole ball of wax. Through background check and no licenses for those with violent criminal records, mental health records taken into consideration, etc. I cashed a check the other day and gave them my fingerprint. What was I going to say no? But you have people that refuse to get a Safeway card and are paranoid about throwing out their address from mail in the garbage. I never understood that.

58 Mocking Jay  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:03:33pm

re: #57 Gus 802

For sure. Fingerprints and the whole ball of wax. Through background check and no licenses for those with violent criminal records, mental health records taken into consideration, etc. I cashed a check the other day and gave them my fingerprint. What was I going to say no? But you have people that refuse to get a Safeway card and are paranoid about throwing out their address from mail in the garbage. I never understood that.

You know my mom?

/

59 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:03:45pm

re: #56 ggt

Strangely enough, I've heard several people who have gone thru the concealed carry classes and decided not to carry.

I might think twice about jamming the business end of handgun next my baby-making parts.

60 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:04:09pm

re: #58 JasonA

You know my mom?

/

I know one guy that blacks out his address on all of his mail before tossing it in the trash. Then to my surprise I found out my sister does the same thing? What in hell?

61 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:04:43pm

re: #54 RadicalModerate

Here's the current vote totals - pretty much what you'd expect from the WorldNut crazies. A bonus is their "protecting our culture" phraseology.
[Link: forums.wnd.com...]

M-M-My Shariah. What a bunch of dopes. The Shariah fear industry is the stupidest thing I've seen in politics. It amazes me that it works.

62 Mocking Jay  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:04:49pm

re: #60 Gus 802

I know one guy that blacks out his address on all of his mail before tossing it in the trash. Then to my surprise I found out my sister does the same thing? What in hell?

Amateurs. My mom uses a shredder.

63 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:05:14pm

re: #60 Gus 802

I know one guy that blacks out his address on all of his mail before tossing it in the trash. Then to my surprise I found out my sister does the same thing? What in hell?

We shred everything.

Hubby already has his identity stolen once.

64 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:05:34pm

re: #52 Atlas Fails

I support concealed carry, but I also support concealed carry licenses.

Ugh, I didn't realize how clumsily that read until just now.

65 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:06:12pm

re: #62 JasonA

Amateurs. My mom uses a shredder.

He's got one too. But junk mail? He's been there since the 70s.

66 laZardo  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:06:24pm

re: #60 Gus 802

I know one guy that blacks out his address on all of his mail before tossing it in the trash. Then to my surprise I found out my sister does the same thing? What in hell?

I just burn mine.

/

67 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:06:51pm

re: #66 laZardo

I just burn mine.

/

I just ignore my mail.

//

68 Mocking Jay  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:07:18pm

re: #63 ggt

We shred everything.

Hubby already has his identity stolen once.

I hear ID theft stays with you for life. Kind of like herpes.

69 Wozza Matter?  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:08:26pm

G'night (again)

70 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:08:59pm

Sorry I've largely dropped out of this debate tonight. It's that same stuff I've been dealing with, and I've been talking to someone about it.

71 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:09:10pm

re: #68 JasonA

I hear ID theft stays with you for life. Kind of like herpes.

Nice isn't it? What's up with that? You would think we'd have a system to fix that. And easily. Too weird. Someone can file taxes using your SSN and the IRS will take years to "figure it out." I tell you what. We're still living in the 20th century. Maybe the 19th century.

72 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:10:20pm

re: #57 Gus 802

For sure. Fingerprints and the whole ball of wax. Through background check and no licenses for those with violent criminal records, mental health records taken into consideration, etc. I cashed a check the other day and gave them my fingerprint. What was I going to say no? But you have people that refuse to get a Safeway card and are paranoid about throwing out their address from mail in the garbage. I never understood that.

They should protect themselves with IdentityHawk.

Youtube Video

Personally, I would never trust a company that thinks so little of its costumers that it tries to impress them with that.

73 Mocking Jay  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:10:59pm

re: #71 Gus 802

Nice isn't it? What's up with that? You would think we'd have a system to fix that. And easily. Too weird. Someone can file taxes using your SSN and the IRS will take years to "figure it out." I tell you what. We're still living in the 20th century. Maybe the 19th century.

I don't think there's a whole lot of incentive for the credit bureaus to do anything about it. Enter the hand of the free market to offer us products like Lifelock...

74 Randall Gross  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:11:32pm

It's sad but true that they track boxes of cereal better than they track guns. Same holds true for lots of medicine, and pretty much anything else people legally sell for ingestion.

75 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:11:42pm

re: #72 Atlas Fails

They should protect themselves with IdentityHawk.

[Video]Personally, I would never trust a company that thinks so little of its costumers that it tries to impress them with that.

Meh. We're all naked. If someone wants to really know who you are, what you do, where you live, etc... it's really not that hard to figure out.

76 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:12:08pm

We shred legit bills. Offers I just tear in two.

77 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:12:51pm

Honestly if we require to people to register their vehicles than I don't see the harm in registering guns. I think that would help solve crimes. I am not against gun ownership at all but as I said earlier the way gun politics is used to glamorize guns si something that disgusts me. Plus there's the fearmongreling that the gun industry and gun rights industry uses to scare gun owners. I saw it in the Clinton years and I see it now under Obama.

79 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:15:59pm

re: #73 JasonA

I don't think there's a whole lot of incentive for the credit bureaus to do anything about it. Enter the hand of the free market to offer us products like Lifelock...

Yep. They snake oil salesmen always have something to sell. It's like going from one line to another trying to get financial aid. To me this sounds like something that should be taken care of within 20 working days. But it's not. There's almost an incentive to steal people's identities with the free market. My old Colorado DL used to have my SSN. I still give that out like I'm giving out water. Old serial numbers used to be SSNs. My sister called up ATT customer service and they asked her for her SSN. Typically it's the last four digits. Strange.

80 freetoken  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:16:03pm

I see that AmericanPower is whining about KT and Gus:

[Link: americanpowerblog.blogspot.com...]

81 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:16:42pm

re: #80 freetoken

I see that AmericanPower is whining about KT and Gus:

[Link: americanpowerblog.blogspot.com...]

LOL Still? What the hell is up with that guy. Seriously. I don't think about him that often.

82 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:16:55pm

re: #80 freetoken

I see that AmericanPower is whining about KT and Gus:

[Link: americanpowerblog.blogspot.com...]

Congrats Killgore and Gus!

83 Obdicut  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:17:52pm

re: #80 freetoken

Heh.

Keeping an eye on the communist-left so you don't have to!

What about the non-communist-left? That'd be about 99.9% of them.

Except in crazy paranoid right-wing land, of course.

/really going to bed now.

84 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:19:21pm

There's commies in the bathroom and just below the stairs.

85 Mocking Jay  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:19:38pm

Can't wait to celebrate Labor Day by... working.

86 Varek Raith  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:19:51pm

re: #84 HappyWarrior

There's commies in the bathroom and just below the stairs.

BUT I GOT TO PEE!

87 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:20:15pm

re: #86 Varek Raith

BUT I GOT TO PEE!

Go outside, it's still warm.

88 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:20:17pm

And that's a load of crap too. I'm no sycophant. Charles knows this. I'm a free thinker as is Charles. Heck. I post some shit sometimes that I can even see Charles's eyebrow arch like Spock's. I do that too.

89 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:20:32pm

re: #85 JasonA

Can't wait to celebrate Labor Day by... working.

I worked today, so tomorrow I don't have to.

90 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:21:33pm

re: #84 HappyWarrior

There's commies in the bathroom and just below the stairs.

Nope, sorry, just checked. There's damp towels in the bathroom and the vacuum cleaners are below the stairs.

91 sattv4u2  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:21:33pm

re: #86 Varek Raith

BUT I GOT TO PEE!

No trees where you are?

92 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:22:36pm

re: #80 freetoken

I see that AmericanPower is whining about KT and Gus:

[Link: americanpowerblog.blogspot.com...]

I'm not even going to click on that link. Don't care. Seriously don't care. The Donald needs to smoke a fatty. Or something.

93 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:22:49pm

re: #90 EmmmieG

Nope, sorry, just checked. There's damp towels in the bathroom and the vacuum cleaners are below the stairs.

I'll bet that vacuum has parts made in *China*!

94 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:23:21pm

re: #90 EmmmieG

Nope, sorry, just checked. There's damp towels in the bathroom and the vacuum cleaners are below the stairs.

Well, that's a relief. I'll let Mr. Lennon that was a false alarm. Seriously though the Red Scare 3.0 amuses the shit out of me. You got nuts like Frank "Shariah" Gaffney who want to bring back HUAC.

95 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:23:32pm

re: #93 ggt

I'll bet that vacuum has parts made in *China*!

Oh, probably. It's got a lot of dirt in it made in the good old USA, though.

96 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:24:15pm

re: #94 HappyWarrior

Well, that's a relief. I'll let Mr. Lennon that was a false alarm. Seriously though the Red Scare 3.0 amuses the shit out of me. You got nuts like Frank "Shariah" Gaffney who want to bring back HUAC.

I heard that Frank Gaffney needs to get laid.

97 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:24:55pm

re: #80 freetoken

I see that AmericanPower is whining about KT and Gus:

[Link: americanpowerblog.blogspot.com...]

I love how he tries to say that working for the government is different than living off the government. Maybe if you didn't teach at a community (public) college, your argument would hold more water. Just another teabagger who thinks he's the only one entitled to social security.

98 Digital Display  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:25:30pm

re: #92 Gus 802

I'm not even going to click on that link. Don't care. Seriously don't care. The Donald needs to smoke a fatty. Or something.

Well he claims to have 3 college degrees so he is a lot smarter than you or pretty much anybody...
/College Prof on a childish rant?
Never saw that coming

99 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:25:53pm

re: #96 Gus 802

I heard that Frank Gaffney needs to get laid.

Getting laid is a Muslim Brotherhood plot or so I am told.

100 Lidane  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:25:55pm

re: #61 HappyWarrior

M-M-My Shariah. What a bunch of dopes. The Shariah fear industry is the stupidest thing I've seen in politics. It amazes me that it works.

Of course it works. It's the same fear industry that spent decades convincing the ignorant and paranoid that the Russians were going to break into your house, steal everything you owned, shoot you, burn your house down, and brainwash your kids and your dogs into becoming commies.

101 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:26:20pm

re: #98 HoosierHoops

Well he claims to have 3 college degrees so he is a lot smarter than you or pretty much anybody...
/College Prof on a childish rant?
Never saw that coming

3 degrees in what?

102 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:26:24pm

re: #97 Atlas Fails

I love how he tries to say that working for the government is different than living off the government. Maybe if you didn't teach at a community (public) college, your argument would hold more water. Just another teabagger who thinks he's the only one entitled to social security.

Ha! I knew it had something to do with that. He freaked out because I brought up his employee package with Long Beach City College. I must have stung him hard. But only because he's been reading the comments here. I must be really important.

103 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:26:59pm

re: #100 Lidane

Of course it works. It's the same fear industry that spent decades convincing the ignorant and paranoid that the Russians were going to break into your house, steal everything you owned, shoot you, burn your house down, and brainwash your kids and your dogs into becoming commies.

Yeah I guess it's harder for me to see it since I was only two when the wall came down.

104 Lidane  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:28:28pm

re: #103 HappyWarrior

Yeah I guess it's harder for me to see it since I was only two when the wall came down.

I was in high school when the Berlin Wall fell. The paranoid right has never recovered from the end of the Cold War.

105 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:28:29pm

re: #98 HoosierHoops

Well he claims to have 3 college degrees so he is a lot smarter than you or pretty much anybody...
/College Prof on a childish rant?
Never saw that coming

Ooooh, but he teaches at a community college, so that makes him smarter than you!/ Half my high school teachers taught part time at our local CC, and they managed to avoid acting like insufferable dicks about it.

106 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:29:57pm

re: #104 Lidane

I was in high school when the Berlin Wall fell. The paranoid right has never recovered from the end of the Cold War.

And it won't. WWII was serious shit.

107 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:30:30pm

Brilliant.

108 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:30:51pm

re: #98 HoosierHoops

Well he claims to have 3 college degrees so he is a lot smarter than you or pretty much anybody...
/College Prof on a childish rant?
Never saw that coming

Amazing isn't it? Donald pisses on some poor guy's grave yet he finds a way to fault everyone else even after being a total douche. He makes fun out of dead guy yet "he's smarter than all of the internets" and it's all Killgore's and my fault for pointing out that he's a pampered employee with the government of the City of Long Beach.

"Down with government! Now if you'll excuse me I'm going to be late for my government job!"

Lame.

109 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:31:13pm

re: #101 ggt

3 degrees in what?

"When I get back to work on Tuesday, I'm won't to be surprised to find that these lowlifes contacted my college."

Apparently not English.

110 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:32:15pm

re: #109 Atlas Fails

Apparently not English.

A college degree isn't proof that a person can think.

A degree in Physics, Philosophy, what?

111 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:32:21pm

re: #109 Atlas Fails

Apparently not English.

Me teach English? That's unpossible.
Image: RalphWiggum2.gif

112 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:33:47pm

re: #110 ggt

A college degree isn't proof that a person can think.

A degree in Physics, Philosophy, what?

According to him, poli sci. Probably a bitter law school reject.

113 Digital Display  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:34:51pm

re: #110 ggt

A college degree isn't proof that a person can think.

A degree in Physics, Philosophy, what?

Poly Sci...
You know the most common expression is with Poly-Sci grads?
Refill sir?

114 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:37:54pm

re: #109 Atlas Fails

Apparently not English.

He said that? Why the feck would I call his employer? He's projecting. I'm a free agent. Actually I've been packing most of the weekend and thinking about other things. I probably thought about that asshole for a total of 5 minutes during the weekend. He's free to be an idiot I could care less.

115 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:38:20pm

What a fucking nerd.

116 ConservativeMe  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:38:44pm

re: #74 Thanos

Does it hold true for medicine?

Do you know what it's like in Appalachia?

"Medicine", if it is being tracked as you say, if far more deadly than guns in my neck of the woods.

117 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:39:06pm

re: #115 Atlas Fails

What a fucking nerd.

lol progressive ayatollahs. Classic.

118 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:39:11pm

re: #115 Atlas Fails

What a fucking nerd.

Zero comments.

119 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:40:47pm

re: #118 Gus 802

Zero comments.

Their keys are too sticky.

120 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:43:33pm

re: #117 HappyWarrior

lol progressive ayatollahs. Classic.

OMG! Sex! Soft porn! Damn he's really on the cutting edge here.

//

121 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:46:38pm

re: #120 Gus 802

OMG! Sex! Soft porn! Damn he's really on the cutting edge here.

//

Hey everyone, let's look at scantily-clad hot chicks! Man, I love looking at chicks. Chicks are awesome. I'd so rather look at chicks than dudes because I'm totally not gay. BOOOOBS!!!1one

122 HappyWarrior  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:48:25pm

Well I am calling it a day people. Enjoy your labor days.

123 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:48:25pm

Bottom line is that our health care system sucks. It's sucked for a very long time. This guy died because he was intimidated by the system. Maybe he made the wrong choice but I can understand. We've all been down that road before. All of us. Left, right, center, it doesn't matter. It's not just a matter of some stupid right wing meme about "personal responsibility." People shouldn't have to die because they can't afford medicine. Not even one person should die. And to ridicule someone who made the wrong choice is the lowest of the low.

124 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:48:26pm

Is it just me or does "soft-porn" seem to be like "a little bit pregnant"

125 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:50:06pm

re: #123 Gus 802

Bottom line is that our health care system sucks. It's sucked for a very long time. This guy died because he was intimidated by the system. Maybe he made the wrong choice but I can understand. We've all been down that road before. All of us. Left, right, center, it doesn't matter. It's not just a matter of some stupid right wing meme about "personal responsibility." People should have to die because they can't afford medicine. Not even one person should die. And to ridicule someone who made the wrong choice is the lowest of the low.

I agree

Yet, even with a perfect system, humans will find a way to fuck-it-up.

I don't have the answer and I'm getting depressed enough over current events.

I may be leaving the intertoobs again for my refuge of Sci-fi

126 jaunte  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:50:15pm
to ridicule someone who made the wrong choice is the lowest of the low

qft

127 laZardo  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:51:56pm

re: #125 ggt

I agree

Yet, even with a perfect system, humans will find a way to fuck-it-up.

I don't have the answer and I'm getting depressed enough over current events.

I may be leaving the intertoobs again for my refuge of Sci-fi

Look on the bright side.

At least you won't end up with my mood.

128 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:52:36pm

re: #126 jaunte

qft

That's why Frank Zappa died. He took their word for it. So have many others. I had a tooth pulled and went through 2 days of a fever and was miserable. I called the dentist and they blew it off. "That's sometimes normal." Assholes. I had an infection. That shit can kill you.

129 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:53:02pm

re: #127 laZardo

Look on the bright side.

At least you won't end up with my mood.

That would be difficult. I've never been in someone else's mood. I don't even know how to get there.

130 laZardo  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:54:09pm

re: #129 ggt

That would be difficult. I've never been in someone else's mood. I don't even know how to get there.

Or mood equivalent. ;p You don't want directions to Snarkville in LaZardo County.

131 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:54:37pm

re: #128 Gus 802

That's why Frank Zappa died. He took their word for it. So have many others. I had a tooth pulled and went through 2 days of a fever and was miserable. I called the dentist and they blew it off. "That's sometimes normal." Assholes. I had an infection. That shit can kill you.

Same thing happened to my husband. He ended up at the M.D.

A DDS is not the same.

Dentistry is a wierd profession. Some of them are great, others not so much. Some are downright whacky. More so than M.D's, In my experience.

132 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:55:16pm

re: #130 laZardo

Or mood equivalent. ;p You don't want directions to Snarkville in LaZardo County.

I'll take your word for it.

133 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:57:03pm

I can understand why so many people are turning to mysticism and religion. I'm just not that programmable. I see too much humor in the BS.

Sci-Fi, at least, could come true.

134 laZardo  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:57:22pm

re: #128 Gus 802

That's why Frank Zappa died. He took their word for it. So have many others. I had a tooth pulled and went through 2 days of a fever and was miserable. I called the dentist and they blew it off. "That's sometimes normal." Assholes. I had an infection. That shit can kill you.

Current Frank Says:

It's f*cking great to be alive, ladies and gentlemen, and if you do not believe it is f*cking great to be alive, you better go now, because this show will bring you down so much -- from Just Another Band From L.A.

135 laZardo  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 9:58:41pm

re: #133 ggt

I can understand why so many people are turning to mysticism and religion. I'm just not that programmable. I see too much humor in the BS.

Sci-Fi, at least, could come true.

People turn to mysticism and religion because Sci-Fi futures don't exactly come true in the nicest of ways.

Edit: Revelations notwithstanding...though maybe that was Sci-Fi's equivalent circa 400 AD.

:B

136 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:00:04pm

Monster puppy has almost figured-out how to get ice from the ice-maker in the freezer door. He just needs to stretch about one more inch.

137 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:01:11pm

Night all!

Have a great night and a better tomorrow.

138 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:02:21pm

re: #131 ggt

Same thing happened to my husband. He ended up at the M.D.

A DDS is not the same.

Dentistry is a wierd profession. Some of them are great, others not so much. Some are downright whacky. More so than M.D's, In my experience.

This country is like the Wild West still. Trying to get matters cleared up even with a service company is difficult and requires hours of waiting on the phone. You have to call up everybody and their uncle to figure things out with government services. There is no had and steadfast rules. Everything changes within each state we live in and that includes both private and public services. There is no uniformity.

139 Atlas Fails  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:03:27pm

Lol, someone named rykelee downdinged me for this.

re: #12 Atlas Fails

From the people who brought you small government AND sodomy laws!

Serial downdinger or self-loathing closet case?

140 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:11:58pm

Oh dear, really late to this thread. I certainly support ATF being able to require strict inventory checks at manufacturers. When a gun went missing where Dragon_Lady worked it was instantly a big deal. A guy from ATF was there to investigate within a day.

Brady of course implies we have large numbers of guns out there without serial numbers. Apart from their one lawsuit, which only proves a small number would be out there, they have no evidence.

And ATF has evidence to the contrary. The vast majority of guns recovered have serial numbers or numbers that were removed by a criminal; after manufacturing.
This applies to dealers-
Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL) Theft/Loss Program:

FFLs are required by law to report to ATF the theft or loss of firearms inventory. In turn, ATF investigates such thefts, seeks prosecution where appropriate and manages the recovery of firearms. Each year, thousands of firearms are reported as lost or stolen. The Stolen Firearms Program works to identify and track firearms recoveries. ATF’s program ensures that appropriate notifications are provided, firearms are identified, and support is available. The program supports affected FFLs and investigators of firearms thefts, including those within ATF, the U.S. military and domestic and international law enforcement agencies.

141 TNChuckster  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:12:06pm

4,500 manufacturers... really? there were only 238 manufacturers in the country in 1998. has there been a 19-fold increase in the number of manufacturers, or did they mean distributors???

142 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:16:55pm

re: #27 Obdicut

Are there any gun companies that go beyond what's required in making their guns traceable, doing inventory counts, etc?

I'm seriously thinking of purchasing a gun (though, it being New York, that gun will remain at the shooting range) and I'd prefer to give my business to an actually responsible company.

I kind of doubt there are, though.

Starting next year Chiappa Firearms of Italy will be the first to start using RFID chips for inventory control and will ship their guns that way. Here's a press release where they responded to the inevitable backlash.

They make some nice looking reproduction lever actions and falling block rifles like the 1886 & '92 Winchester and the 1874 Sharps. They also make a decent looking 1911 in .22 lr but the rest of their handguns appear to be ... highly unconventional.

143 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:17:27pm

The Beatles - Ticket To Ride

Youtube Video
144 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:25:59pm

BTW check out the form you fill out if you want to sell guns...

145 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:28:16pm

Way OT but when you go out to take some pictures, you really do not expect to come home with pictures of rainbows, sunsets and lightning bolts all from the same session! Wow what a lucky evening for D_L & I

146 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:29:44pm

re: #144 Rightwingconspirator

BTW check out the form you fill out if you want to sell guns...

In accordance with the Paperwork Reduction Act, I see.

147 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:35:29pm

re: #141 TNChuckster

4,500 manufacturers... really? there were only 238 manufacturers in the country in 1998. has there been a 19-fold increase in the number of manufacturers, or did they mean distributors???

Where did you get that number?

148 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:39:17pm

Mas photographia desde Watsonville!

Image: Watsonville-13.jpg
Image: Watsonville-14.jpg
Image: Watsonville-15.jpg
Image: Watsonville-16.jpg

149 TNChuckster  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:40:06pm

re: #147 Rightwingconspirator

[Link: www.vpc.org...]

150 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:42:28pm

re: #149 TNChuckster

[Link: www.vpc.org...]

I'm too spaced to read closely. Is it possible that we're defining 'manufacturer' in one context as meaning 'the company', and in the other as 'the manufacturing site'?

151 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:43:47pm

re: #149 TNChuckster

[Link: www.vpc.org...]

That is astonishing. I was all over ATF Google there for a bit. Does make ya wonder about who they call a gun manufacturer.

152 freetoken  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:46:04pm

While TD Lee spins away in SW Mississippi, deluging that part of the South, central TX is under a Red Flag warning - critical risk of fires. With a large fire already going, it could be spread as the winds pick up (as TD Lee moves northeastward.)

153 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:47:43pm

re: #151 Rightwingconspirator

That is astonishing. I was all over ATF Google there for a bit. Does make ya wonder about who they call a gun manufacturer.

The Brady Center has a reference on the ATF site for their number, but I can't get the page to work.

I got no clue.

154 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:49:57pm

Meanwhile, The Gun Guy tells us: The BATF reports there are currently more than 1,700 licensed U.S. firearms manufacturers
and nearly 750 licensed importers. If I don't list them all, it's not an intentional oversight.

[Link: 130.94.182.159...]

155 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:49:58pm

re: #153 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm not holding my breath on this one but Brady has been known to run away with a fact or two. Advocacy and all that....

156 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:50:32pm

re: #155 Rightwingconspirator

I'm not holding my breath on this one but Brady has been known to run away with a fact or two. Advocacy and all that...

The other site looks a tad advocative as well, though.

157 TNChuckster  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:50:37pm

re: #151 Rightwingconspirator

yeah, the data is old, but the numbers still didn't make sense. i think calling them all manufacturers is intended to inflate the supposed number of unserialized guns that are out and about.

158 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:51:24pm

re: #156 SanFranciscoZionist

The other site looks a tad advocative as well, though.

Oh yes goes without saying. It's one of my frustrations with gun issues. It's hard to get good numbers from non advocates.

159 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:52:28pm

Mas.

Image: Watsonville-17.jpg
Image: Watsonville-18.jpg
Image: Watsonville-19.jpg
Image: Watsonville-20.jpg

The Mustang is "Comfortably Numb". Used to be owned by David Gilmour of Pink Floyd. Got a bunch of shots of it. Almost a "walk around."

160 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:53:37pm

re: #157 TNChuckster

If all the gun crimes that occurred at all were from guns that never got serialized, I think we would have a very tiny number of gun crimes. Practically all guns have them or the number was removed after the fact of mfg.

161 Mocking Jay  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:54:09pm

re: #146 SanFranciscoZionist

In accordance with the Paperwork Reduction Act, I see.

I adore the checkboxes that say (If yes, do not submit application). I mean, why check it if I'm not submitting it?!?

162 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:55:23pm

re: #157 TNChuckster

yeah, the data is old, but the numbers still didn't make sense. i think calling them all manufacturers is intended to inflate the supposed number of unserialized guns that are out and about.

I'd like to know who the single manufacture in the State of New Mexico was and how they only made 4 rifles that year. That's either a really poor business model or those are some seriously swank long arms.

163 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:55:45pm

re: #158 Rightwingconspirator

Oh yes goes without saying. It's one of my frustrations with gun issues. It's hard to get good numbers from non advocates.

Hunting the AFT site is getting me nowhere. They have an annual report on how many guns manufactured and exported, but nothing on how many manufacturers.

I have learned a lot about gas mask imports and sales, though, and also Glock conversion devices and their legality.

164 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:57:36pm

re: #162 goddamnedfrank

I'd like to know who the single manufacture in the State of New Mexico was and how they only made 4 rifles that year. That's either a really poor business model or those are some seriously swank long arms.

I'm guessing tiny company, but this guy's a part-time craftsman who got a license so he can make a few collector's weapons a year and sell them word of mouth.

Probably the rest of his business is gun retail, or repairs, or ammo and bait.

165 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:59:08pm

re: #163 SanFranciscoZionist

It occurs to me how careful jewelry makers are about inventory, for obvious reasons. Cameras, metal detectors, extensive background checks... Yet theft from jewelry shops is significant. Especially diamonds. I'd surmise these thefts exceed these gun thefts by a wide margin, despite diligence.

166 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 10:59:56pm

re: #164 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm guessing tiny company, but this guy's a part-time craftsman who got a license so he can make a few collector's weapons a year and sell them word of mouth.

Probably the rest of his business is gun retail, or repairs, or ammo and bait.

I'm guessing he specializes in guns that fire bait. Niche market that.

167 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:00:09pm

re: #162 goddamnedfrank

Has to be a custom high dollar gun guy.

168 TNChuckster  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:02:03pm

re: #162 goddamnedfrank

I'd like to know who the single manufacture in the State of New Mexico was and how they only made 4 rifles that year. That's either a really poor business model or those are some seriously swank long arms.

even if they were making Olympic Biathalon rifles, four isn't very many. maybe that's the Brady reports culprit... the other 15,996 firearms just...dissapeared? mwahahaha

169 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:02:11pm

re: #152 freetoken

While TD Lee spins away in SW Mississippi, deluging that part of the South, central TX is under a Red Flag warning - critical risk of fires. With a large fire already going, it could be spread as the winds pick up (as TD Lee moves northeastward.)

Texas has been cursed by Rick Perry's dishonest invocation of God. Only through Rick Perry can the curse be broken: He must leave Texas and in another state he must stand in a rainstorm. Only with the wetting down and messing up of Rick Perry's hair will the curse be lifted.

/lol

170 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:02:53pm

re: #169 Dark_Falcon

Texas has been cursed by Rick Perry's dishonest invocation of God. Only through Rick Perry can the curse be broken: He must leave Texas and in another state he must stand in a rainstorm. Only with the wetting down and messing up of Rick Perry's hair will the curse be lifted.

/lol

It's worth a try. I say, if he loves Texas he will go and give it a shot.

171 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:05:12pm

re: #166 goddamnedfrank

I'm guessing he specializes in guns that fire bait. Niche market that.

Some fairly big places that sell guns also sell bait. There's a very large such store in southern Wisconsin at Route 50 and I-94, my family passes it on the way up to Wisconsin. People who shoot often fish as well.

172 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:05:17pm

re: #166 goddamnedfrank

I'm guessing he specializes in guns that fire bait. Niche market that.

"I don't want to catch fish, I just want to feed them at impossibly high velocities".

173 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:05:36pm

re: #170 SanFranciscoZionist

It's worth a try. I say, if he loves Texas he will go and give it a shot.

I fear he loves his hair even more.

174 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:05:47pm

The Beatles - Hey Jude

Youtube Video
175 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:08:35pm

re: #170 SanFranciscoZionist

It's worth a try. I say, if he loves Texas he will go and give it a shot.

If it worked, I'd put Rick Perry to work lifting the Curse of the Goat from the Cubs. And if he could do that, then I'd vote for him. Because to see the Cubs make the World series would be worth a lot of Bad Craziness.

/kidding, but not sarc. If someone could reverse that curse, they could be a raving lunatic and every Cubs fan in Chicago would still vote for them.

176 Lidane  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:08:51pm

re: #128 Gus 802

I had some dental work done and got both Vicodin and penicillin for my troubles. I'm useless on Vicodin, so I would save that for bedtime and just took Advil during the day. That wasn't the problem, though. After three days of taking the penicillin, I ended up breaking out in hives and my hands felt like they were on fire they itched so much.

My dentist, who I think is otherwise a really cool guy that does great work, suggested Benadryl. The Benadryl got me through the few days of antibiotics I had left, but every doctor I've told about it since then has written it down in my medical records as a reason to avoid penicillin in the future. I guess it's a sensitivity or an allergy or something.

177 Lidane  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:13:17pm

re: #173 Dark_Falcon

I fear he loves his hair even more.

His hair, his career, beating Mitt Romney, who he despises, etc...

All of Rick Perry's prayers for rain haven't done shit. My state is still on fire. The local news tonight was nothing but listing what areas were evacuated and updates on the fires. Lucky for me, they're all further out from my part of Austin, but still. That shit is scary.

178 TNChuckster  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:13:33pm

re: #175 Dark_Falcon

...If someone could reverse that curse, they could be a raving lunatic and every Cubs fan in Chicago would still vote for them.

Brother Theodore is safely dead, isn't he?

179 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:13:43pm

re: #176 Lidane

I had some dental work done and got both Vicodin and penicillin for my troubles. I'm useless on Vicodin, so I would save that for bedtime and just took Advil during the day. That wasn't the problem, though. After three days of taking the penicillin, I ended up breaking out in hives and my hands felt like they were on fire they itched so much.

My dentist, who I think is otherwise a really cool guy that does great work, suggested Benadryl. The Benadryl got me through the few days of antibiotics I had left, but every doctor I've told about it since then has written it down in my medical records as a reason to avoid penicillin in the future. I guess it's a sensitivity or an allergy or something.

I went to Comfort Dental once. They prescribed Vicodin for me. Anyway. They did such a lousy job I was in massive pain when I got home. I ended up dropping 6 Vicodin that afternoon. I was still in intense pain. It didn't even phase me. That was about 3,000 mg of Vicodin. The shit barely works on me. I freaked them out when I told then what I did. Not that it mattered because they really didn't care. They were just paranoid about me possibly becoming addicted to them. No chance. I didn't even finish the scrip. I'm not into drugs. It does provide a mellow high though of sorts. A glass of wine and some Vicodin and you're mildly mellow and then you go to sleep.

180 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:17:54pm

Shakira - Ciega Sordomuda

Youtube Video
181 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:22:20pm

re: #178 TNChuckster

Brother Theodore is safely dead, isn't he?

I do not know who he was.

182 Lidane  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:22:34pm

re: #180 Gus 802

Shakira - Ciega Sordomuda

I loved that whole era for her music. That's probably my favorite album she's done.

183 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:24:27pm

re: #182 Lidane

I loved that whole era for her music. That's probably my favorite album she's done.

Big time. Old school Shakira. I have the CD in the laptop right now. Thought I'd share. That's her best work IMO.

184 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:26:26pm

Pedazos de quero. :)

185 TNChuckster  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:26:42pm

re: #181 Dark_Falcon

Youtube Video
186 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:27:31pm

It's actually cuero. No "q".

187 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:29:46pm

Ugh. I love this song.

Shakira - Moscas en la casa

Youtube Video
188 prairiefire  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:38:12pm

This stuff is at an estate sale tomorrow. Are the "halliburtons" guns?9270 Metcalf Ave
Overland Park, KS 66212
Halliburton 26"x8"x16" Aluminum Hard Case
Halliburton 24"x8"x18" Aluminum Hard Case
Halliburton 26"x9"x16" Aluminum Hard Case
Antilque spinning wheel 55 inches diameter
Wicker dressar matching table and mirror
Ratton sofa and chair
Lucite easel
Brass easel
50s kitchen table white streak by Howell Co. w/4 chairs
Many lamp tables Broyhill and other furniture makers
Delux super coin game
Bookshelf cases
many pictures
Kitchen Items
Linens
vintage clothing
sofa table with glass 54 inches Ethan Allen
Large side board 60 inches wide Ethan Allen 8 drawers 4 cabinets, 2 piece
China Cabinets
Chandaliers
2 chairs by Statesvill chair Co.
four 18X36 inch panels
Round glass top table nice appro 37 inches diamater
Pink classic leather chair
Round pedastal table 48 inches diameter plus two 12 inch leaves
Empire cabinets
slant top desk
Lamps
chairs
Decortive items
Dishes, China
silverplate serving dishes
much more
Building packed

189 Gus  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:39:55pm

Tired of the hate.

190 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:40:09pm

re: #188 prairiefire

This stuff is at an estate sale tomorrow. Are the "halliburtons" guns?

No. Halliburtons are insanely tough and tamper proof briefcases.

191 prairiefire  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:41:18pm

I think the "pink classic leather chair" sounds interesting.. Maybe James Bond died.

192 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:43:15pm

re: #188 prairiefire

This stuff is at an estate sale tomorrow. Are the "halliburtons" guns?9270 Metcalf Ave
Overland Park, KS 66212
Halliburton 26"x8"x16" Aluminum Hard Case
Halliburton 24"x8"x18" Aluminum Hard Case
Halliburton 26"x9"x16" Aluminum Hard Case
Antilque spinning wheel 55 inches diameter
Wicker dressar matching table and mirror
Ratton sofa and chair
Lucite easel
Brass easel
50s kitchen table white streak by Howell Co. w/4 chairs
Many lamp tables Broyhill and other furniture makers
Delux super coin game
Bookshelf cases
many pictures
Kitchen Items
Linens
vintage clothing
sofa table with glass 54 inches Ethan Allen
Large side board 60 inches wide Ethan Allen 8 drawers 4 cabinets, 2 piece
China Cabinets
Chandaliers
2 chairs by Statesvill chair Co.
four 18X36 inch panels
Round glass top table nice appro 37 inches diamater
Pink classic leather chair
Round pedastal table 48 inches diameter plus two 12 inch leaves
Empire cabinets
slant top desk
Lamps
chairs
Decortive items
Dishes, China
silverplate serving dishes
much more
Building packed

Most likely those are just the hard cases they are listed as, with the Haliburton name on them. Haliburton is in the oil industry, and such firms have need for hard cases to enable sensitive equipment to survive a hard impact.

193 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:50:12pm

re: #192 Dark_Falcon

Most likely those are just the hard cases they are listed as, with the Haliburton name on them. Haliburton is in the oil industry, and such firms have need for hard cases to enable sensitive equipment to survive a hard impact.

Zero Haliburton is the name of the company. They bought the luggage subsidiary of Haliburton's business in 1952. Whenever you see someone in the movies hauling around a metric shit ton of cash or gold, it's usually in one of these cases. They ain't cheap.

194 prairiefire  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:53:18pm

26x9x16. That would hold a lot of Benjamins.

195 Fozzie Bear  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:55:51pm

Buy the Halliburtons. They make some ridiculously awesome extremely secure cases. Then handcuff one to your hand, wear a suit and sunglasses, and walk around talking to yourself with a bluetooth headset on.

No but really, buy a Halliburton case if you can and they are cheap. They are really freaking sweet.

196 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:57:26pm

re: #193 goddamnedfrank

Zero Haliburton is the name of the company. They bought the luggage subsidiary of Haliburton's business in 1952. Whenever you see someone in the movies hauling around a metric shit ton of cash or gold, it's usually in one of these cases. They ain't cheap.

Thank you for that information.

197 prairiefire  Sun, Sep 4, 2011 11:59:17pm

Wicker, rattan and lucite. It would be like the 1960's in amber.

198 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:06:28am

Goodnight, all.

199 Targetpractice  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:23:42am

So...anyone still alive in this godforsaken thread?

200 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:40:40am

re: #199 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Lurking in background. I get tired of all the gun control bs as though there are no laws or regs about them. Worse than all the rules about the levees in Louisiana, and that is saying a lot.

I would suggest that anyone who wants data on the subject contact their local gun shops and DAs' for what applies in their areas.

Am checking back here once in a while from ancestry and youtube.

201 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:46:05am

This is what I get for going to bed early. Again.
Morning honcos.

202 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:49:02am

re: #201 Cannadian Club Akbar

Good morning Akbar

203 Targetpractice  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:49:02am

re: #200 dell*nix

Lurking in background. I get tired of all the gun control bs as though there are no laws or regs about them. Worse than all the rules about the levees in Louisiana, and that is saying a lot.

I would suggest that anyone who wants data on the subject contact their local gun shops and DAs' for what applies in their areas.

Am checking back here once in a while from ancestry and youtube.

True enough. Gun control seems to be one of those issues that I could truly care less about.

204 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:52:04am

re: #203 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

True enough. Gun control seems to be one of those issues that I could truly care less about.

Three subjects I don't usually get involved in: guns, abortion, climate change. Not because I don't care, I just bring nothing new to the debate.

205 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:52:59am

re: #203 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I do care about gun control, but it gets pretty damn tiresome hearing the same old arguments from all sides repeated over and over again.

Kind of like listening to the tired arguments from the creationists and the counter-arguments from the non-creationists.

A whole lot like the Chinese water torture routine.

206 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:59:23am

re: #205 dell*nix

Some people's minds are just set and can't/won't be changed in regards to certain beliefs.

207 Targetpractice  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:03:08am

re: #205 dell*nix

I do care about gun control, but it gets pretty damn tiresome hearing the same old arguments from all sides repeated over and over again.

Kind of like listening to the tired arguments from the creationists and the counter-arguments from the non-creationists.

A whole lot like the Chinese water torture routine.

It seems that all political discourse is becoming that way these days. Almost Napoleonic in its nature: Both sides line up, begin firing off talking points, and the "winner" is the one that can go the longest without breaking down into four letter words or dropping dead of an aneurysm popping in their skull.

208 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:03:43am

re: #206 Cannadian Club Akbar

I started paying attention to gun control in the early 1960's. Did not pay too much attention to abortion until the 1970's. Religion was a pain starting at least in the 1950's with close kin.

At least now I have meds to ease some of the ulcers those subjects can produce.

209 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:06:40am

re: #207 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Personal arms and self defence arguments most likely go back to before recorded history. And has not let up since.

210 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:07:48am

re: #207 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

It seems that all political discourse is becoming that way these days. Almost Napoleonic in its nature: Both sides line up, begin firing off talking points, and the "winner" is the one that can go the longest without breaking down into four letter words or dropping dead of an aneurysm popping in their skull.

Ding. And everyone is an expert on "add subject here" because they do a quick google search or parrot a talking head. And I blame the intertubes. But on the flip side, if someone talks in half troofs, they can quickly be discredited because of the intertubes. Frankly, I only have it for the free porn.:)

211 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:09:26am

re: #210 Cannadian Club Akbar

Free porn only leads to trojans and viruses :)

212 Targetpractice  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:12:46am

re: #210 Cannadian Club Akbar

Ding. And everyone is an expert on "add subject here" because they do a quick google search or parrot a talking head. And I blame the intertubes. But on the flip side, if someone talks in half troofs, they can quickly be discredited because of the intertubes. Frankly, I only have it for the free porn.:)

I was pretty sure that was what the Internet exists today for: pr0n and Wikipedia. Everything else is just there to take up space. /

Seriously, it seems like every political board I go to these days has dissolved into trench warfare, with neither side willing to budge and any "wins" quickly being swallowed up by the "losses."

213 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:14:24am

And looky here. New footage of Flight 93. Right before the 10 year anniversary. I thought this would bring out the kooks. And I looked at the first comment and was right.
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

214 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:17:22am

re: #212 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I was pretty sure that was what the Internet exists today for: pr0n and Wikipedia. Everything else is just there to take up space. /

Seriously, it seems like every political board I go to these days has dissolved into trench warfare, with neither side willing to budge and any "wins" quickly being swallowed up by the "losses."

I can't even go onto a sports discussion board without some yahoo turning it political. But the one thing I do get out of it is that I can argue both sides of a point, because I often see both sides, which makes me fun at parties. That and I just like fucking with people.

215 Targetpractice  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:20:31am

re: #214 Cannadian Club Akbar

I can't even go onto a sports discussion board without some yahoo turning it political. But the one thing I do get out of it is that I can argue both sides of a point, because I often see both sides, which makes me fun at parties. That and I just like fucking with people.

Yeah, I try to keep an open mind and at least give both sides a listen before I make any conclusions. At the same time, it's hard to listen to both sides on some issues simply due to who the "spokespeople" are. Like I said earlier today, it's hard to take the "pro-life" argument seriously when the guy making it is holding up a picket sign declaring "Abortion Doctors Are Going To Hell."

216 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:23:56am

re: #215 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yeah, I try to keep an open mind and at least give both sides a listen before I make any conclusions. At the same time, it's hard to listen to both sides on some issues simply due to who the "spokespeople" are. Like I said earlier today, it's hard to take the "pro-life" argument seriously when the guy making it is holding up a picket sign declaring "Abortion Doctors Are Going To Hell."

I was watching Phil Donahue years ago, before cable, and he had on about 6 different priest, preachers, etc. One of them, regardless of what you did said you're going to hell. Some were moderate (confess your sins and you're good) and one was "Meh, ya fucked up. It's cool, you're a human".

217 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:28:22am

re: #216 Cannadian Club Akbar

My Southern Baptist kin really put doubt in my mind about religion and what it was used for. Also, being exposed to the history of religion in europe really put me off.

218 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:32:05am

re: #217 dell*nix

My Southern Baptist kin really put doubt in my mind about religion and what it was used for. Also, being exposed to the history of religion in europe really put me off.

What hacks me off is "Born Again Whatever". Those people need to be put on an island for about 2 years. Same with ex smokers who feel the need to preach. And dry drunks.

219 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:38:10am

re: #218 Cannadian Club Akbar

I was lucky with the smoking bit. Never did get to the point where I could not quit. Same with the drinking. More of the social expectation kind of consumer.

Of course, when the doc's tell you quit because it will only make your problems worse then you should pay attention. COPD should be a clue.

220 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:45:02am

re: #219 dell*nix

I know a little about the CODP thing. My dad's friend was diagnosed with it even years after he quit. But I wonder if there is a study that shows people with COPD who exercised regularly vs. people who just sat in a chair or on a bar stool. Many smokers I know do zero exercise. They think doing yard work once a week or lifting something heavy is exercise.

221 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:50:44am

re: #220 Cannadian Club Akbar

A close friend and co-worker was a smoker until she got diagnosed with it. She only lasted about three years after she started the breathing treatments. She did have some other health problems, but it seems the COPD was the major one.

The quitting and proper exercise does seem to hold it off longer.

222 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 2:02:13am

re: #221 dell*nix

I just looked at a couple articles. Both (obviously) said don't smoke or quit. Both said to exercise and watch your diet. One made the point that people already diagnosed will have a harder time exercising (again, obviously). Also to avoid fireplaces and wood burning stoves. One also said if you are at risk of getting COPD, get a regular flu shot, which I won't do.

223 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 2:04:11am

re: #54 RadicalModerate

Here's the current vote totals - pretty much what you'd expect from the WorldNut crazies. A bonus is their "protecting our culture" phraseology.

And this differs from Breivik, how? /

Dumb confederates.

224 researchok  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 2:20:37am

Morning, all

225 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 2:33:51am

Story #5 is effing sad and awesome. All in one.
[Link: www.cracked.com...]
(I know it's Cracked, but it seems plausible)

226 MittDoesNotCompute  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 2:54:03am

re: #193 goddamnedfrank

Zero Haliburton is the name of the company. They bought the luggage subsidiary of Haliburton's business in 1952. Whenever you see someone in the movies hauling around a metric shit ton of cash or gold, it's usually in one of these cases. They ain't cheap.

From their website:

Brand Statement 2011

Since 1938 Zero Halliburton is synonymous with exquisite strength, and is recognized for its characteristic, sleek aluminum design, durability, and superior performance. In fact, a Zero Halliburton case was taken to the Moon on the Apollo Mission to carry back to Earth Moon Rocks. Sold in nearly every country in the world, the appeal of this American icon is truly global. These design elements, combined with the use of premium materials, make up the Zero Halliburton "Brand DNA”. The same exquisite styling has been expanded to the use of new materials, including carbon fiber, and polycarbonate, creating unique products that are sophisticated, and highly functional. Often seen on the Silver Screen as Zero Halliburton products have appeared in more than 250 movies and television shows in the last decade alone, including many of the top-grossing films like “Independence Day,” “Men in Black,” “Eagle Eye,” “Quantum of Solace,” and “Inception”. Also the iconic Aluminum Attaché cases are featured on TV shows “Lost” & “CSI Las Vegas”.

They've been to the freakin' Moon...how's that for tough?

227 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 2:57:44am

re: #226 talon_262

From their website:

They've been to the freakin' Moon...how's that for tough?

This tough?
/

Youtube Video
228 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:10:48am

re: #142 goddamnedfrank

RFID Removal: For those still concerned you can simply remove the grip and remove the hot glued RFID from the frame in the grip area when (over a year from now) these begin to appear. Others may prefer to wrap the revolver and their head in aluminum foil, curl in a ball and watch reruns of Mel Gibson's 1997 film, Conspiracy Theory. Well, that's a plan too!

Hilarity.

229 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:40:41am

re: #227 Cannadian Club Akbar

This tough?
/

[Video]

Delta charges $20 per bag for that service!

230 AK-47%  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:41:04am

re: #60 Gus 802

I know one guy that blacks out his address on all of his mail before tossing it in the trash. Then to my surprise I found out my sister does the same thing? What in hell?

get a paper shredder

231 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:42:28am

re: #230 ralphieboy

get a paper shredder

Or a match

232 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:44:07am

re: #229 sattv4u2

Delta charges $20 per bag for that service!

Which is why I fly Jet Blue.

233 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:45:42am

re: #232 Cannadian Club Akbar

Which is why I fly Jet Blue.

Poetic justice would have one joining the Mile High Club only when flying United!

234 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:46:38am

Yay, I just got a new twitter follower, Veronica. ooh, she has a website, let's take a look:

[Link: talkingwiththeclover.blogspot.com...]

Um, yeah.

235 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:47:02am

re: #233 sattv4u2

Poetic justice would have one joining the Mile High Club only when flying United!

I'm a member of the Mile High cub. Unfortunately, I was flying solo.
/

236 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:48:17am

re: #235 Cannadian Club Akbar

And people who live in Denver wonder what all the fuss is about.

237 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:49:05am

re: #234 Obdicut

Yay, I just got a new twitter follower, Veronica. ooh, she has a website, let's take a look:

[Link: talkingwiththeclover.blogspot.com...]

Um, yeah.

That girl needs a box of crayons.

238 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:49:05am

re: #234 Obdicut

Yay, I just got a new twitter follower, Veronica. ooh, she has a website, let's take a look:

[Link: talkingwiththeclover.blogspot.com...]

Um, yeah.

WhatamImissin!?!?

She's a Web Site design creator/ illustrator/ sumfins

239 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:49:42am

re: #236 Obdicut

And people who live in Denver wonder what all the fuss is about.

They don't get to join until they're two miles up

240 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:51:03am

re: #238 sattv4u2

WhatamImissin!?!?

She's a Web Site design creator/ illustrator/ sumfins

[Link: www.theartcollaboration.com...]

241 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:52:09am

That's like the 11tyth time in the last couple of weeks I forgot to add a link to a post!

242 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:52:56am

re: #240 sattv4u2

[Link: www.theartcollaboration.com...]

OMG!! I get spam from the National Association of Professional Women asking me to join. Too funny!!!

243 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:54:30am

re: #242 Cannadian Club Akbar

OMG!! I get spam from the National Association of Professional Women asking me to join. Too funny!!!

Will they pay for the flight to Sweden and the operation for you!?!?!

244 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:55:25am

re: #243 sattv4u2

Will they pay for the flight to Sweden and the operation for you!?!?!

I'll just tape it to my leg.

245 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:56:43am

Dick Duct tape?

246 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:58:23am

:(
[Link: miami.cbslocal.com...]

90-Year Old Woman In Serious Condition After Gator Attack

Geezzz,,,, I can't even fathom how frightened she must have been

247 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:59:31am

re: #246 sattv4u2

:(
[Link: miami.cbslocal.com...]

90-Year Old Woman In Serious Condition After Gator Attack

Geezzz,,, I can't even fathom how frightened she must have been

I posted this yesterday morning. They were gonna hunt the gator to see if they could find her legs and reattach them.

248 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:00:51am

re: #247 Cannadian Club Akbar

That article says she still had her legs. Somebody please make up my mind.

249 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:01:47am

re: #248 Cannadian Club Akbar

That article says she still had her legs. Somebody please make up my mind.


Wildlife officials at the time said the leg was “barely attached” after the attack and had to amputated.

250 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:02:34am

re: #249 sattv4u2

I'll see your gator and raise you.
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

251 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:02:37am

re: #248 Cannadian Club Akbar

Roughly five people are bitten each year in Florida by unprovoked alligators.

Start doing the math, CCA!

252 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:03:25am

re: #251 sattv4u2

Roughly five people are bitten each year in Florida by unprovoked alligators.

Start doing the math, CCA!

Not gonna happen. I provoke them.

253 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:03:55am

re: #252 Cannadian Club Akbar

Not gonna happen. I provoke them.

Us too!

254 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:06:55am

Oh, goody

I fly often, about 75% for business and the rest personal, but by far the most frequent is from (somewhere) to Boston

Air traffic controller operational errors - in which planes get too close to each other or to another object - skyrocketed 81 percent between 2007 and 2010, according to federal data, while errors in the Boston region shot up even more, 114 percent.

[Link: www.boston.com...]

Calling HERTZ!

255 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:09:22am
Breivik won’t name names

Terrorist defendant Anders Behring Breivik, who has confessed to carrying out the July 22 attacks on Norway, has claimed he has met many like-minded right-wing extremists but won’t reveal their identities.

[...]

Most recently, police have been questioning Breivik about how he built the bomb, along with what he’s done and who he has met during a long string of overseas trip made before he carried out the attacks that killed 77 persons. In the so-called manifesto he sent out just before the attacks began, Breivik wrote that he met a Serbian war hero and crusader on a trip to Liberia.

“He has confirmed he has been in Great Britain and Liberia,” his defense attorney, Geir Lippestad, told reporters last week. A trip to Africa, reported Aftenposten, was part of entry requirements into a group called Knights Templar, but Lippestad said Breivik won’t reveal any information about persons he has met.

Police do now seem to believe that Breivik built the bomb alone. Breivik also has claimed there are two more right-wing Christian terrorist cells in Norway, and more in other countries, but Lippestad told Aftenposten that he won’t elaborate.

[Link: www.newsinenglish.no...]

256 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:12:25am

Heh.
[Link: worstgovernorever.com...]

257 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:15:52am

Rippingale's body was then moved to the crew rest area behind a curtain and covered with a blanket. The crew allowed Preechakul to sit with him for the remaining nine hours of the flight.
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

258 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:20:47am

re: #257 Cannadian Club Akbar

Rippingale's body was then moved to the crew rest area behind a curtain and covered with a blanket. The crew allowed Preechakul to sit with him for the remaining nine hours of the flight.
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

most of the people that sit next to me want to tell me their life stories

259 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:23:12am

re: #258 sattv4u2

most of the people that sit next to me want to tell me their life stories

The money quote:
Preechakul said that Rippingale chose the beef meal over chicken on the flight.

Well, that makes things easier for Quincy.

260 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:28:47am

re: #259 Cannadian Club Akbar

The money quote:
Preechakul said that Rippingale chose the beef meal over chicken on the flight.

Well, that makes things easier for Quincy.

Youtube Video
261 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:33:31am

re: #260 sattv4u2

I can't remember the scene in Airplane!! but it was something like "We served chicken and fish". "Yes, I remember. I had the lasagna".

262 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:36:39am

Morning folks!

263 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:40:16am

re: #261 Cannadian Club Akbar

I can't remember the scene in Airplane!! but it was something like "We served chicken and fish". "Yes, I remember. I had the lasagna".

Maybe FBV is on to something!

264 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:40:45am

re: #262 RogueOne

Morning folks!

hey,,,

Are you (like me) laboring today?

265 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:42:03am

re: #264 sattv4u2

Not really. I have some paperwork stuff to get out of the way but otherwise I'm taking it easy.

266 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:42:19am

re: #265 RogueOne

Not really. I have some paperwork stuff to get out of the way but otherwise I'm taking it easy.

Good for you

Enjoy

267 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:51:42am

re: #265 RogueOne

Hey, Lee Roy Selmon did end up dying.:(
[Link: www.tampabay.com...]

268 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:56:13am

re: #267 Cannadian Club Akbar

Told you he was dead.

269 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:56:47am

Image: 2011-09-05-Evidence-Schmevidence.png

Alternate universe tea party.

270 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:57:10am

re: #268 RogueOne

Told you he was dead.

No, you said I said he was dead, then you told me he was getting better. Why did you lie to me?

271 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:59:19am

re: #268 RogueOne

re: #270 Cannadian Club Akbar

I have a black and white photo of a headstone hanging in our downstairs bathroom (no idea why we decided to put it there)

Anywho,,, the inscription on the headstone says

I TOLD YOU I WAS SICK

272 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 5:03:19am

re: #271 sattv4u2

Image: 540490_f520.jpg

273 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 5:06:26am

re: #272 Cannadian Club Akbar

Image: 540490_f520.jpg

Different name, but thats it

274 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 5:13:14am

"I'm feeling better. I think I'll take a walk."

275 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 5:24:48am

These pretzels are making me thirsty.

276 makeitstop  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:11:48am

Nice work if you can get it...

Gov. Barbour's 'Disadvantaged' Relative Masterminded $100 Million (Theft) of Post-Katrina FEMA Fraud

Found guilty, she had to pay $350K in fines.

277 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:24:57am

re: #276 makeitstop

Nice work if you can get it...

Gov. Barbour's 'Disadvantaged' Relative Masterminded $100 Million (Theft) of Post-Katrina FEMA Fraud

Found guilty, she had to pay $350K in fines.

She should have received lodging for awhile courtesy of the US gov't

278 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:26:48am

re: #277 sattv4u2

She should have received lodging for awhile courtesy of the US gov't

In a FEMA trailer.
/

MSNBC Video
279 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:29:05am

re: #278 Cannadian Club Akbar

In a FEMA trailer.
/
[Link: www.msnbc.msn.com...]

"We're the gov't. We're here to help you. Just breath deeply!"
///

280 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:33:43am

re: #279 sattv4u2

At my last real job we had to travel the interstate. There was a spot in Venice that had a shitload of those trailers just sitting after Charlie. (not sure they were the EXACT same ones) A guy I worked with said you could actually buy one with the right paperwork. Cheap. I think they were offered for sale after the allotted time to be in one.

281 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:34:06am

Morning all!

This week in the Kewl department.

Electric motor made from a single molecule

How is everyone this morning?

282 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:35:45am

re: #280 Cannadian Club Akbar

At my last real job we had to travel the interstate. There was a spot in Venice that had a shitload of those trailers just sitting after Charlie. (not sure they were the EXACT same ones) A guy I worked with said you could actually buy one with the right paperwork. Cheap. I think they were offered for sale after the allotted time to be in one.

I'd be interested in buying one

283 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:35:53am

Lavanbula?

or

Shrike Nightmares?

284 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:36:58am

re: #281 ggt

Morning all!

This week in the Kewl department.

Electric motor made from a single molecule

How is everyone this morning?

heh,, I don't even like the 4 cylinder car I have!!
/

285 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:37:37am

re: #284 sattv4u2

heh,, I don't even like the 4 cylinder car I have!!
/

No get-up and go?

286 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:38:01am

re: #285 ggt

No get-up and go?

At my age, my get up and go got up and went!

:(

287 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:38:53am

So an old friend who is also a fb friend posted today to me that she decided to learn about Planned Parenthood and ended-up writing her congress critter in favor of PP BECAUSE OF MY POSTS.

Nice to know when your work reaches someone.

288 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:38:57am

re: #282 sattv4u2

I'd be interested in buying one

[Link: discountfematrailers.com...]

289 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:38:59am

re: #277 sattv4u2

She should have received lodging for awhile courtesy of the US gov't

You have to read the original reporting. Someone is playing fast and loose with the headline, there was no "$100million fraud". C&L found it necessary to exaggerate when the underlying crime should be bad enough.

290 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:39:59am

re: #286 sattv4u2

At my age, my get up and go got up and went!

:(

Where'd it go?

291 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:41:24am

Eye catching pictures.

I love this Dragon!

292 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:46:15am

re: #289 RogueOne

You have to read the original reporting. Someone is playing fast and loose with the headline, there was no "$100million fraud". C&L found it necessary to exaggerate when the underlying crime should be bad enough.

Thanks

I did scan the article posted just to see if there was any mention of jailtime and/or paying back the "100 million"

Also googled her name and found the "fraud" was committed in 2005/ 06.
Rosemary Barbour initially filed a claim against FEMA in 2008 for $3.8 million of the unpaid balance of an initial $6.1 million contract the company received in 2006 to periodically inspect the trailers. The agency had reduced the amount of the contract it said it would pay and later terminated the contract.

looks as if FEMA decided to pay her (maybe for work her company actually did!?!) 2.3 million denying the other 3.8 mil

Terrible, but as you stated, a far cry from "100 million"

I still say she should do time

293 Shropshire_Slasher  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:46:23am

Getting my copy of Dead Island tomorrow, can't wait, zombies are gonna re-die, if I can break my chillin away from it...

294 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:46:56am

re: #289 RogueOne

You have to read the original reporting. Someone is playing fast and loose with the headline, there was no "$100million fraud". C&L found it necessary to exaggerate when the underlying crime should be bad enough.

Rosemary Barbour initially filed a claim against FEMA in 2008 for $3.8 million of the unpaid balance of an initial $6.1 million contract the company received in 2006 to periodically inspect the trailers. The agency had reduced the amount of the contract it said it would pay and later terminated the contract.
...
Miller also wrote, "what the court did not appreciate was Ms. Barbour's bumble-headed game of eluding defense counsel's questions." The judge also criticized FEMA for its "inexcusable mismanagement" of the contract.
...
The Guatemalan-born Barbour, 44, qualified for government preference programs as a woman and as a Hispanic. Her company is still operating and is listed as being "in good standing" by the Mississippi secretary of state.
[Link: www.miamiherald.com...]

295 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:47:01am

re: #290 ggt

Where'd it go?

d'know

AND ,, i'm too tired to go look!

296 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:51:25am

I can't even get my kid to clean his room/ make his bed!!

Jesse loves helping around the house,
[Link: animalvideos.yahoo.com...]

297 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:52:53am

re: #288 Cannadian Club Akbar

[Link: discountfematrailers.com...]

Are these the toxic trailers?

298 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:53:18am

re: #296 sattv4u2

I can't even get my kid to clean his room/ make his bed!!

Jesse loves helping around the house,
[Link: animalvideos.yahoo.com...]

I own that coffee pot.

299 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:53:56am

re: #297 ggt

Are these the toxic trailers?

You have to pay extra fro those!

300 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:54:18am

re: #297 ggt

Are these the toxic trailers?

No idea. Put Satt in one for a few days. If he's seeing things, then no.

301 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:54:41am

re: #296 sattv4u2

I can't even get my kid to clean his room/ make his bed!!

Jesse loves helping around the house,
[Link: animalvideos.yahoo.com...]

Yeah, but that is a Jack Russell Terrier. They have to work or they die. It's in there genetic coding.

:)

302 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:54:47am

re: #298 Cannadian Club Akbar

I own that coffee pot.

Thank God you told me that. Not knowing has been keeping me up for years

303 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:55:37am

re: #301 ggt

Yeah, but that is a Jack Russell Terrier. They have to work or they die. It's in there genetic coding.

:)

Because of Electric Motor Molecules?
/

304 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:55:50am

re: #301 ggt

Yeah, but that is a Jack Russell Terrier. They have to work or they die. It's in there genetic coding.

:)

I know

My mutt (Einstein) is part Jack Russell

(other parts,, West Highland and Garbage Disposal)

305 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:56:27am

re: #303 Cannadian Club Akbar

Because of Electric Motor Molecules?
/

You'd have to ask the creationists about that.

306 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:57:56am

re: #288 Cannadian Club Akbar

[Link: discountfematrailers.com...]

Many are like new and in perfect condition.

Others, not so much

307 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:59:04am

re: #288 Cannadian Club Akbar

re: #306 sattv4u2

Many are like new and in perfect condition.

Others, not so much

Modular Homes are
12ft by 35 ft 3 axles
2 bedrooms 1 bathroom

Oxygen Tanks optional

308 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:00:22am

re: #296 sattv4u2

I can't even get my kid to clean his room/ make his bed!!

Jesse loves helping around the house,
[Link: animalvideos.yahoo.com...]

If you keep watching they show more videos.

The kittens on the turntable is LOL!

309 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:01:28am

OMG, the curly headed toddler and the Lab with the water bowl.

How cute!

310 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:01:32am

re: #307 sattv4u2

re: #306 sattv4u2

Modular Homes are
12ft by 35 ft 3 axles
2 bedrooms 1 bathroom

Oxygen Tanks optional

"Perfect for the amateur meth Chef"!!!

311 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:05:22am

The Great Dane and the returning Soldier.

*sniff*

312 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:06:08am

It's 50 degrees right now in Lubbock. Overnight low was 49. This is the lowest temperature since April 25th. It is not quite a record low for this date, however (46 in 1961). Yesterday's high was 82, the first day since May 25th that the temperature has not reached 90 degrees. That is 100 consecutive days over 90 degrees. It was over 100 on 63 of those days. The previous record for 100+ days in an entire year was 29.

313 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:08:00am

Alrighty. gotta run. Got me a paying job!! (just for the day) bbl

314 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:08:07am

re: #312 Shiplord Kirel


Al Roker, it that you?

315 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:10:38am

I had to turn off PetTV. I could watch that all day.

It might be more addictive than LGF.

316 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:11:48am

re: #312 Shiplord Kirel

It's 50 degrees right now in Lubbock. Overnight low was 49. This is the lowest temperature since April 25th. It is not quite a record low for this date, however (46 in 1961). Yesterday's high was 82, the first day since May 25th that the temperature has not reached 90 degrees. That is 100 consecutive days over 90 degrees. It was over 100 on 63 of those days. The previous record for 100+ days in an entire year was 29.

And I thought happiness
Was Lubbock, Texas
In my rear view mirror
My momma kept calling me home
But I just did not want to hear her
And the vision was getting clearer
In my dreams

Mac Davis
[Link: www.lyricsmode.com...]

317 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:12:04am

re: #315 ggt

I had to turn off PetTV. I could watch that all day.

It might be more addictive than LGF.

:)

318 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:15:10am

Monster Puppy is full of vim and vigor today.

He figured-out how to circumvent one of the gates and seems to be *high* from the discovery.

319 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:29:19am

Mentally Ill end up in prison because there is no place else for them to go.

System if FUBAR.

320 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:38:06am

Gym time, BBL

321 Gretchen G.Tiger  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:44:43am

I'm off too!

Have a great morning all!

322 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:59:07am

Good morning lizards.

My hands are burning from washing a load of habanero peppers.

323 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:06:38am

Goodnight, all.re: #322 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards.

My hands are burning from washing a load of habanero peppers.

Well, use 'em to light a cigar before they go out. :D

324 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:08:19am

re: #322 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards.

My hands are burning from washing a load of habanero peppers.

Either wash them thoroughly, or else do NOT try to aim when you have to pee!!
/

325 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:09:35am

re: #324 sattv4u2

Either wash them thoroughly, or else do NOT try to aim when you have to pee!!
/

That's a lesson learned years ago.

326 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:10:11am

re: #325 NJDhockeyfan

That's a lesson learned years ago.

How many times!?!?!

327 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:14:27am

re: #326 sattv4u2

How many times!?!?!

Once was enough. I will never forget.

328 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:15:45am

Gotta go. The peppers are calling.

329 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:16:46am

re: #328 NJDhockeyfan

Gotta go. The peppers are calling.

Didn't know you understood Spanish!
/

330 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:26:34am

re: #319 ggt

Mentally Ill end up in prison because there is no place else for them to go.

System if FUBAR.

Thank you, Saint Ronald.

331 sattv4u2  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:42:55am

And on that note, the long quiet drive home beckons

332 Kronocide  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:44:52am

Climate sceptic science: read with caution

333 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 8:59:44am

Last call for alcohol! Last call for freedom of speech...

334 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:01:50am

Dead Kennedys - California Über Alles

Youtube Video
335 austin_blue  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:02:05am

Not a good day in the Austin metroplex yesterday:

[Link: interactives.kxan.com...]

At the tail end of a summer of killing heat and brutal drought, why *not* get a dose of wildfires? Makes perfect sense! Hundreds of homes destroyed.

Sigh...

337 RadicalModerate  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:05:36am

Expect to see this sort of thing a lot during campaign season.

Perry to Skip DeMint Forum

(CNN) - Republican presidential candidate and Texas Gov. Rick Perry will not attend the Palmetto Freedom Forum of GOP candidates Monday night, sponsored by Sen. Jim DeMint, and will instead return to Texas to deal with the wildfires in the state, DeMint and the Perry campaign told CNN.

The South Carolina senator's office said they learned of Perry's plans not to attend the Columbia, South Carolina event Monday morning.

The current wildfires in Texas are mostly under control, and the latest round were not nearly as bad as those early in the year. Perry simply doesn't do debates.

338 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:07:20am

Experts Question Ratings After S&P Gives Subprime Bonds Higher Rating Than U.S. Debt

Influential investors are scratching their heads over a little-noticed development: After downgrading the country's credit rating, Standard & Poors is continuing to award AAA status to the same class of assets that nearly blew up the world economy three years ago.

From Bloomberg: "S&P is poised to provide AAA grades to 59 percent of Springleaf Mortgage Loan Trust 2011-1, a set of bonds tied to $497 million lent to homeowners with below-average credit scores and almost no equity in their properties."

In other words: U.S. Treasuries -- widely believed to be the safest investment in the world -- don't make the cut, but subprime mortgage investments do? What gives?

...

Hilarious.

339 Kronocide  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:15:05am

re: #338 Gus 802

Experts Question Ratings After S&P Gives Subprime Bonds Higher Rating Than U.S. Debt

Hilarious.

But but but CRA! CRA!

I suspect the CRA boogeyman will bubble back up from the bottom pretty soon.

340 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:19:01am

re: #339 BigPapa

I suspect the CRA boogeyman will bubble back up from the bottom pretty soon.

When all else fails, blame the blacks and the Mexicans for one's own troubles. We can set our watches by it.

341 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:22:46am

re: #330 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Thank you, Saint Ronald.

Why would you blame Reagan?

342 Kronocide  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:23:06am

Tea Party Forces Influence In GOP 2012 Race
"The tea party isn't a diversion from mainstream Republican thought. It is within mainstream Republican thought," Mitt Romney told a New Hampshire newspaper recently, defending the activists he's done little to woo, until now.

The former Massachusetts governor is starting to court them more aggressively as polls suggest he's being hurt by weak support within the movement, whose members generally favor rivals such as Texas Gov. Rick Perry and Minnesota Rep. Michele Bachmann.

Hah, no shit Sherlock. Mainstream GOP = Bachmann/Perry supporters.

343 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:24:26am

Quick refresher:
NY Times: HOW RELEASE OF MENTAL PATIENTS BEGAN
By RICHARD D. LYONS
Published: October 30, 1984
[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

344 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:24:34am

re: #340 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

When all else fails, blame the blacks and the Mexicans for one's own troubles. We can set our watches by it.

I seem to remember a certain president pushing home buying for everyone. Saying something about "an ownership society." Of course all of that is ignored in this current political climate and the history of the CRA jumps from Carter straight to Obama. Everyone else in the middle is ignored including Reagan, Bush the Elder, and Bush the Younger. Anyway. CRA mortgages played a small role in the meltdown of 2008 and is simply being used as a "scapegoat" with Rush Limbaugh being the origin of this meme.

345 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:24:37am

re: #338 Gus 802

Yeah. S&P I think are going to regret having thrust themselves into the spotlight like this. People are going to remember the hand they had in the financial crisis.

346 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:26:02am

re: #340 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

When all else fails, blame the blacks and the Mexicans for one's own troubles. We can set our watches by it.

And Jews, and other non-Christians. And even Catholics and Unitarians.

347 Kronocide  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:26:46am

re: #340 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

When all else fails, blame the blacks and the Mexicans for one's own troubles. We can set our watches by it.

The CRA seems to be more about those damn social engineering liberals trying to help the darkies. You get them all in one fell swoop.

See what happens when you try to help lame asses? You become a lame ass! Hahahaha fookin libruls.

348 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:26:51am

re: #345 Obdicut

Yeah. S&P I think are going to regret having thrust themselves into the spotlight like this. People are going to remember the hand they had in the financial crisis.

Yep. The same financial institutions they gave a triple-A rating right before October of 2008. I think it's pretty clear that they're probably stacking the deck for their unofficial business partners and golf buddies.

349 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:28:20am

re: #342 BigPapa

Tea Party Forces Influence In GOP 2012 Race
"The tea party isn't a diversion from mainstream Republican thought. It is within mainstream Republican thought," Mitt Romney told a New Hampshire newspaper recently, defending the activists he's done little to woo, until now.

The former Massachusetts governor is starting to court them more aggressively as polls suggest he's being hurt by weak support within the movement, whose members generally favor rivals such as Texas Gov. Rick Perry and Minnesota Rep. Michele Bachmann.

Hah, no shit Sherlock. Mainstream GOP = Bachmann/Perry supporters.

This has to be giving huge headaches to Republican strategists. The Tea Party is hugely unpopular and running campaigns on the Tea Party agenda makes the entire GOP field unelectable.

350 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:29:07am

re: #346 Obdicut

And Jews, and other non-Christians. And even Catholics and Unitarians.

Those damn Unitarians! Always causing trouble.

//

351 Kronocide  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:31:27am

re: #349 Killgore Trout

This has to be giving huge headaches to Republican strategists. The Tea Party is hugely unpopular and running campaigns on the Tea Party agenda makes the entire GOP field unelectable.

I keep thinking of the tired adage of Limbaugh's: GOP candidates do better when they run more to the right.

It's about to be disproven to some degree.

352 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:32:32am

re: #351 BigPapa

I keep thinking of the tired adage of Limbaugh's: GOP candidates do better when they run more to the right.

It's about to be disproven to some degree.

Let's hope. I'm going to be working on campaigns this season, because I'm really worried about what would happen if the Senate and House both went GOP.

353 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:32:51am

Mitt Romney doesn't pander to New Hampshire tea partiers

If former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney came in search of elusive tea party mojo, he didn’t find it here at a small Tea Party Express rally, where a few dozen conservatives sat in lawn chairs and argued about Romney’s conservative bona fides.

Romney made no attempt to out-tea-party his conservative rival Rick Perry, and, in fact, the words “tea party” didn’t cross his lips in a stump speech that ran less than 15 minutes.

“I thought he’d pander a bit more,” remarked Jerry DeLemus, a local tea party leader ....

Wingnuts are getting fed up with Palin's nonsense......

One speaker, Corey Lewandowski, leader of the New Hampshire chapter of the conservative group Americans for Prosperity, offered a challenge for Sarah Palin, who will speak to the group tomorrow.

“It is time to determine: Are you here to sell books, are you here to run for president of the United States?” he said. “If you’re not serious, get out of the way.”

354 Kronocide  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:34:02am

re: #352 Obdicut

Let's hope. I'm going to be working on campaigns this season, because I'm really worried about what would happen if the Senate and House both went GOP.

I do hope, but acknowledge the risk that the worst could happen.

355 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:34:46am

re: #351 BigPapa

I keep thinking of the tired adage of Limbaugh's: GOP candidates do better when they run more to the right.

It's about to be disproven to some degree.

I think so too.

356 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:35:52am

re: #351 BigPapa

I keep thinking of the tired adage of Limbaugh's: GOP candidates do better when they run more to the right.

It's about to be disproven to some degree.

Hence the smashing success of Barry Goldwater!

357 Kronocide  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:38:28am

re: #352 Obdicut

Let's hope. I'm going to be working on campaigns this season, because I'm really worried about what would happen if the Senate and House both went GOP.

My respects for you doing something. I've been rethinking my ways of 'doing something' beyond dealing with mindless fucktardery in a tactful way in person or on Facebook.

The GOP is severely marginalized in Hawaii so I wonder if I might just be better off giving $ to a national campaign, or just blogging. The few GOP candidates here are pretty centrist and non-TP, though there are many extremists of all stripes living here.

358 Renaissance_Man  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:40:16am

re: #351 BigPapa

I keep thinking of the tired adage of Limbaugh's: GOP candidates do better when they run more to the right.

It's about to be disproven to some degree.

Not sure about that. Far right radical propaganda makes Limbaugh's statement more and more likely to be true, little by little, every day.

359 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:40:49am

re: #356 Atlas Fails

Hence the smashing success of Barry Goldwater!

Silence!

//

360 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:42:54am

re: #344 Gus 802

I seem to remember a certain president pushing home buying for everyone. Saying something about "an ownership society." Of course all of that is ignored in this current political climate and the history of the CRA jumps from Carter straight to Obama. Everyone else in the middle is ignored including Reagan, Bush the Elder, and Bush the Younger. Anyway. CRA mortgages played a small role in the meltdown of 2008 and is simply being used as a "scapegoat" with Rush Limbaugh being the origin of this meme.

The right has had a hardon against the CRA from its inception.

Same old bigots, different millenium.

361 Kronocide  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:44:07am

re: #358 Renaissance_Man

Not sure about that. Far right radical propaganda makes Limbaugh's statement more and more likely to be true, little by little, every day.

If you parse Rush's adage, it might be true: Bachmann is doing better by cranking up the crazy, but she's doing better moving farther to the right within a narrower group of people.

If you enlarge the spectrum of voters, the opposite happens: you do worse.

I think Rush spoke to the later, which if TP candidates crash and burn in 2012, would make him wrong.

I hope this is what happens. I have to run off with Wifey for beach walking and such, happy Labor Day and don't overcook any asparagus.

362 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:48:52am

You know what's bullshit? We got into this recession under a Republican White House. It was by and large caused by the "free market" financial institutions on Wall Street: Bear Stearns, AIG, Goldman Sach, Citibank, etc. It was the policy of Free Market Jesus that caused this. It's the policy of greed that led to stagnant wage increases and outsourcing. It was capitalism eating itself, as it is continuing to do, that brought us here. It wasn't liberal policies. It didn't happen under a Democratic Party White House. It happened because of conservative free market deregulation, the "free market" banking system and under a Republican president.

363 Renaissance_Man  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:50:00am

re: #361 BigPapa

If you parse Rush's adage, it might be true: Bachmann is doing better by cranking up the crazy, but she's doing better moving farther to the right within a narrower group of people.

If you enlarge the spectrum of voters, the opposite happens: you do worse.

I think Rush spoke to the later, which if TP candidates crash and burn in 2012, would make him wrong.

I hope this is what happens. I have to run off with Wifey for beach walking and such, happy Labor Day and don't overcook any asparagus.

What is true is that the majority will never subscribe entirely to an insane hate cult. More pertinently, if more voters voted, or if by some happy miracle the US went to mandatory voting, the Conservative cult would be rapidly exposed as the bizarre radical ideology it is.

That said, that's not the case in America. Elections are heavily determined not by facts, but by public perception and common knowledge. And common knowledge doesn't have to intersect with reality. The power of Conservative cult propaganda is that it inexorably infects more and more of the media, and thus shapes common knowledge, spreading its poison far further than the small cult of true believers. And before too long, you'll have the situation where repetition of crazy non-facts doesn't harm a candidate, because the pool of common knowledge has already been primed to agree that they're true.

364 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:55:50am

re: #341 RogueOne

Why would you blame Reagan?

Better than blaming all of "kick em out, stop giving them MY MUNNY, let god the community sort em out" soconnism. /

365 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:56:59am

re: #362 Gus 802

You know what's bullshit? We got into this recession under a Republican White House. It was by and large caused by the "free market" financial institutions on Wall Street: Bear Stearns, AIG, Goldman Sach, Citibank, etc. It was the policy of Free Market Jesus that caused this. It's the policy of greed that led to stagnant wage increases and outsourcing. It was capitalism eating itself, as it is continuing to do, that brought us here. It wasn't liberal policies. It didn't happen under a Democratic Party White House. It happened because of conservative free market deregulation, the "free market" banking system and under a Republican president.

To be fair there is a lot of blame to go around. Glass Steagall was repealed under Clinton which allowed the cross contamination and made the banking crisis much worse. Neither side has offered any solutions to keep the financial infrastructure in check. The Banks have lots of money and that buys a lot of influence on both sides of the isle.

366 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:57:54am

Then you have the Fortune 500 companies. They keep claiming "uncertainty" as a basis for not creating jobs. Yet while they're claiming this so called uncertainty they're still setting record profits. How can they claim both uncertainty and rake in the cash as they do? You can't have both. There is no uncertainty. It is certain enough for them to make record profits and continue to live like kings and queens.

367 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 9:58:51am

re: #359 Gus 802

Silence!

//

To be fair, Goldwater ran in a different time. Look at the mainstream appeal of teabagger darlings like Sharon Angle and Christine O'Donnell.

368 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:01:18am

re: #362 Gus 802

You know what's bullshit? We got into this recession under a Republican White House. It was by and large caused by the "free market" financial institutions on Wall Street: Bear Stearns, AIG, Goldman Sach, Citibank, etc. It was the policy of Free Market Jesus that caused this. It's the policy of greed that led to stagnant wage increases and outsourcing. It was capitalism eating itself, as it is continuing to do, that brought us here. It wasn't liberal policies. It didn't happen under a Democratic Party White House. It happened because of conservative free market deregulation, the "free market" banking system and under a Republican president.

A good DKos article on "free trade" here.

369 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:01:28am

re: #367 Atlas Fails

To be fair, Goldwater ran in a different time. Look at the mainstream appeal of teabagger darlings like Sharon Angle and Christine O'Donnell.

They are the whackjob conservative ideal -- deliberately miseducated, willfully stupid about the world they live in, will say and do ANYTHING, easily manipulated, easily manipulatable.

They represent social/cultural cons very well.

370 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:03:21am

I think Ron Paul took advantage of me

371 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:03:28am

re: #365 Killgore Trout

To be fair there is a lot of blame to go around. Glass Steagall was repealed under Clinton which allowed the cross contamination and made the banking crisis much worse. Neither side has offered any solutions to keep the financial infrastructure in check. The Banks have lots of money and that buys a lot of influence on both sides of the isle.

I didn't vote for Clinton the second time around -- I stayed home. As a liberal, I had already seen enough from him, Al Gore, and Tipper Gore. In any case the portion that was repealed was drafted by Republicans:

Provisions that prohibit a bank holding company from owning other financial companies were repealed on November 12, 1999, by the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act, named after its co-sponsors Phil Gramm (R, Texas), Rep. Jim Leach (R, Iowa), and Rep. Thomas J. Bliley, Jr. (R, Virginia).

It got to the point where Clinton was signing anything Republicans put in front of his face. That's probably why Obama's making a lot of people nervous. They fear he'll do the same thing.

372 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:03:36am

re: #346 Obdicut

And Jews, and other non-Christians. And even Catholics and Unitarians.

Same old know-nothings, different...

373 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:05:03am

re: #371 Gus 802

I didn't vote for Clinton the second time around -- I stayed home. As a liberal, I had already seen enough from him, Al Gore, and Tipper Gore. In any case the portion that was repealed was drafted by Republicans:

It got to the point where Clinton was signing anything Republicans put in front of his face. That's probably why Obama's making a lot of people nervous. They fear he'll do the same thing.

Please don't do the same this time around!

374 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:08:28am

re: #364 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Better than blaming all of "kick em out, stop giving them MY MUNNY, let god the community sort em out" soconnism. /

The Lanterman-Petris-Short Act was a liberal policy, and one that had the right intent. Blaming reagan for not ignoring the problems with public mental health facilities in the 50's and 60's seems a bit disingenuous. I think it's weird to hear liberals say we should pick people up off the street and toss them in state mental hospitals against their will when they haven't done anything wrong.

If you're interested you might want to read up on "Least Restrictive Environment" clauses:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

There are a lot of reasons why there are so many mentally ill people on the streets. The biggest is we've decided they actually have rights.

375 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:09:04am

re: #368 Atlas Fails

A good DKos article on "free trade" here.

From your article....

Both parties appear to be on the wrong side of the public. There is a large block of the population that feels that free trade hurts the country and an even strong majority that feels it costs jobs. With the small number of Americans who are actually supportive of free trade being so small, it is rather interesting mystery as to how both parties have seem to come to a consensus in favor of it.

I think this is a little like the public opinion of the debt limit. The public isn't very well informed on the topic. The lefties hate free trade because of globalization, neo-colinialism, etc. The right hates free trade because of fears of the New World Order and global government.
The reality is the world is changing, it's getting smaller, we're more closely connected now than any other time in history. That's not going to change and protectionism is never going to work as the world continues to get smaller. those countries who can't compete in the global marketplace will not prosper.

376 austin_blue  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:14:23am

re: #365 Killgore Trout

To be fair there is a lot of blame to go around. Glass Steagall was repealed under Clinton which allowed the cross contamination and made the banking crisis much worse. Neither side has offered any solutions to keep the financial infrastructure in check. The Banks have lots of money and that buys a lot of influence on both sides of the isle.

That's a good point. However, if you look at the facts on the ground, you will find that the Community Reinvestment Act has served as a scapegoat for the Housing collapse. It wasn't CRA banking that invented the Mortgage Backed Securities and tranches:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

(refer to the 2008 Section).

As the article states, it wasn't so much a problem of CRA loans, as the bubble was mostly in exurban properties. The problem was the instruments created to make "money" off of all loans. That "money" only existed if the value of the homes continued to increase. The crash wasn't a mortgage problem. It was a liquidity problem that was entirely predictable. The instruments invented out of whole cloth were based on an assumption that was false. It was 1986 on steroids.

377 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:14:32am

re: #374 RogueOne

The Lanterman-Petris-Short Act was a liberal policy, and one that had the right intent. Blaming reagan for not ignoring the problems with public mental health facilities in the 50's and 60's seems a bit disingenuous. I think it's weird to hear liberals say we should pick people up off the street and toss them in state mental hospitals against their will when they haven't done anything wrong.

Mmm, touchy-touchy. This liberal has said nothing of the sort. I certainly have heard that argument from no one.

BTW, it wasn't just the LPS Act, either. It's an entire cutthroat mentality that says drown state institutions instead of fixing them; let god the community sort them out.

Lol tossing people out on the streets because conservatives care about the rights of our most vulnerable citizens gives me a hearty laugh. The very idea is written off as "group rights", today.

378 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:17:12am

re: #375 Killgore Trout

From your article...

I think this is a little like the public opinion of the debt limit. The public isn't very well informed on the topic. The lefties hate free trade because of globalization, neo-colinialism, etc. The right hates free trade because of fears of the New World Order and global government.
The reality is the world is changing, it's getting smaller, we're more closely connected now than any other time in history. That's not going to change and protectionism is never going to work as the world continues to get smaller. those countries who can't compete in the global marketplace will not prosper.

KT, you really need to be more consistent here. If you say lefties, then you should also say righties. If you say 'the right' then you should say 'the left', but most importantly, if you say wingnuts, you should say moonbats or loonies.

Fairness in journalism and all that, eh.

379 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:17:21am

re: #376 austin_blue

That's a good point. However, if you look at the facts on the ground, you will find that the Community Reinvestment Act has served as a scapegoat for the Housing collapse. It wasn't CRA banking that invented the Mortgage Backed Securities and tranches:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

(refer to the 2008 Section).

As the article states, it wasn't so much a problem of CRA loans, as the bubble was mostly in exurban properties. The problem was the instruments created to make "money" off of all loans. That "money" only existed if the value of the homes continued to increase. The crash wasn't a mortgage problem. It was a liquidity problem that was entirely predictable. The instruments invented out of whole cloth were based on an assumption that was false. It was 1986 on steroids.

Agreed. The CRA had very little, if anything, to do with the financial crisis.

380 Lidane  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:18:31am

re: #375 Killgore Trout

The reality is the world is changing, it's getting smaller, we're more closely connected now than any other time in history. That's not going to change and protectionism is never going to work as the world continues to get smaller. those countries who can't compete in the global marketplace will not prosper.

Exactly.

Things like free trade, globalization, outsourcing, off-shoring, etc. are pretty much our new reality. Everything is so deeply intertwined and connected now that we can't go back to the way things were. No amount of protectionist laws will change the fact that the fundamental paradigms of business and communications have shifted.

381 Daniel Ballard  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:19:39am

re: #362 Gus 802

That free market deregulation happened over several administrations, each trying to soften or shorten a recession. Trace it back as far as the removal of barriers to investing in stocks. Like 3 months savings in the bank etc. Or removing the downtick rule. Or this facet (not the whole thing but a significant factor)

[Link: articles.moneycentral.msn.com...]

We had weakly regulated markets when Clinton took office, but by the time he left, they were an invitation to lawless dealing. For the ease of it, Willie Sutton would have traded his gun and mask for a briefcase and necktie.

Clinton created a fertile environment for home-lending charlatans and hiding places for Wall Street swindlers, and upset a regulatory structure that had served the financial marketplace so well for more than six decades.

382 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:20:17am

Will Bachmann credit god for the Texas fires? Is god telling Texas something we should know about?

383 Mocking Jay  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:21:14am

re: #382 Killgore Trout

Will Bachmann credit god for the Texas fires? Is god telling Texas something we should know about?

Hell: the trailer.

384 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:22:48am

re: #374 RogueOne

The Lanterman-Petris-Short Act was a liberal policy, and one that had the right intent. Blaming reagan for not ignoring the problems with public mental health facilities in the 50's and 60's seems a bit disingenuous. I think it's weird to hear liberals say we should pick people up off the street and toss them in state mental hospitals against their will when they haven't done anything wrong.

If you're interested you might want to read up on "Least Restrictive Environment" clauses:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

There are a lot of reasons why there are so many mentally ill people on the streets. The biggest is we've decided they actually have rights.

I'm really impressed with the size of your straw structures. When you fire them up they really light up the neighbourhood.

385 Lidane  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:24:28am

Because nothing could possibly go wrong here:

Perry Courts Radical Arizona Sheriff Joe Arpaio, Continues Rightward Move On Immigration

386 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:25:48am

re: #377 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Funding is a very small part of the problem. You can place blame where you choose but you don't get to make your own version of history. Until CA set the standard, states took it upon themselves to lock people up indefinitely for any variety of "mental health" issues they saw fit. I even supplied you with a NYT link from '84 that explained the problem in great detail. Unless you believe the state has the right to institutionalize people on a whim when they haven't committed a crime or they can't prove they are a danger to themselves there isn't an answer to the issue.

I have a cousin who is schizophrenic. He hates the meds so he refuses to take them. He gets weird, does something stupid, they arrest him, put him back on his meds and then....release him because they have no other choice. If he's on his meds he's fine and the state can't hold him. It's a vicious cycle. Until he actually tries to kill someone they'll continue to let him go.

387 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:25:52am

re: #382 Killgore Trout

Will Bachmann credit god for the Texas fires? Is god telling Texas something we should know about?

God is just helping out with global warming by showing us how to load the atmosphere up with sun reflecting particulates.

388 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:26:58am

re: #384 b_sharp

I'm really impressed with the size of your straw structures. When you fire them up they really light up the neighbourhood.

The claim was there are so many mentally ill people in jail due to lack of funding or zombie-reagan. My answer wasn't a straw man.


Next time you visit the doctor have them check your eyes!//

389 Mocking Jay  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:27:08am

So this is what we've come to...

USA Today Is Too Dumb for Words When It Comes to Taxes

"That raise actually might not be as good as it looks. The extra money is nice, but it could very well bump you into the next tax bracket, possibly leaving you with less money than you had before the raise."

390 Mocking Jay  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:28:13am

re: #388 RogueOne

The claim was there are so many mentally ill people in jail due to lack of funding or zombie-reagan. My answer wasn't a straw man.

Next time you visit the doctor have them check your eyes!//

I could have sworn the whole point was that we should be putting the mentally ill who are imprisoned into actual care facilities. Not sure where "rounding people up" came from.

391 Lidane  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:28:43am

re: #389 JasonA

So this is what we've come to...

USA Today Is Too Dumb for Words When It Comes to Taxes

In fairness, USA Today has been too dumb for words since it started.

392 jaunte  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:28:44am

re: #382 Killgore Trout

Will Bachmann credit god for the Texas fires? Is god telling Texas something we should know about?

At the next 'Response' pep rally, we can pray to be better educated than the foreign competition.

393 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:30:01am

re: #381 Rightwingconspirator

That free market deregulation happened over several administrations, each trying to soften or shorten a recession. Trace it back as far as the removal of barriers to investing in stocks. Like 3 months savings in the bank etc. Or removing the downtick rule. Or this facet (not the whole thing but a significant factor)

[Link: articles.moneycentral.msn.com...]

We had weakly regulated markets when Clinton took office, but by the time he left, they were an invitation to lawless dealing. For the ease of it, Willie Sutton would have traded his gun and mask for a briefcase and necktie.

Clinton created a fertile environment for home-lending charlatans and hiding places for Wall Street swindlers, and upset a regulatory structure that had served the financial marketplace so well for more than six decades.

I know that. But I'm comparing this to the platitudes we're hearing from the GOP. They're essentially claiming that Obama, Democrats, and liberals created this recession. That is simply not true. The last marker was set when the official meltdown occurred in 2008 under Bush's watch. However, given the governments influence in these events the primary responsibility lies with the financial institutions themselves.

394 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:30:13am

re: #389 JasonA

So this is what we've come to...

USA Today Is Too Dumb for Words When It Comes to Taxes

This is undoubtedly the reason all those poor financial high-flyers are obligated to turn down their lavish bonuses.

Arrrrrgh.

395 austin_blue  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:33:19am

re: #381 Rightwingconspirator

That free market deregulation happened over several administrations, each trying to soften or shorten a recession. Trace it back as far as the removal of barriers to investing in stocks. Like 3 months savings in the bank etc. Or removing the downtick rule. Or this facet (not the whole thing but a significant factor)

[Link: articles.moneycentral.msn.com...]

We had weakly regulated markets when Clinton took office, but by the time he left, they were an invitation to lawless dealing. For the ease of it, Willie Sutton would have traded his gun and mask for a briefcase and necktie.

Clinton created a fertile environment for home-lending charlatans and hiding places for Wall Street swindlers, and upset a regulatory structure that had served the financial marketplace so well for more than six decades.

Actually, let's be clear. Clinton *signed* legislation created by others. He created nothing.

396 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:33:45am

Got some big fish in Pakistan....
Pakistan Points to Cooperation With U.S. in Terror Arrests

One of the men arrested was identified as Younis al-Mauritani who was captured in southwestern city of Quetta, which has long been thought of as a safe haven for Taliban and Qaeda leadership. The Pakistan military said he was “responsible for planning and conduct of international operations” for Al Qaeda.

“Al Mauritani was tasked personally by Osama bin Laden to focus on hitting targets of economical importance in United States of America, Europe and Australia,” the military said. “He was planning to target United States economic interests including gas/oil pipelines, power generating dams and strike ships/oil tankers through explosive-laden speed boats in international waters.”

Well, at least he won't be waterboarded and sent to Gitmo for trial. I'm sure the Pakistanis will be nice to him.
/

397 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:33:52am

April: High Gas Prices Mean Record Profits for Big Oil

August: Corporate Profits Surge To Record High In Q2

Uncertainty my ass.

398 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:34:20am

re: #390 JasonA

I could have sworn the whole point was that we should be putting the mentally ill who are imprisoned into actual care facilities. Not sure where "rounding people up" came from.

They are, prison/jail mental health facivilities. Hence the problem.

399 freetoken  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:34:20am

re: #336 Gus 802

Bachmann Dodges Question On Whether God Uses Weather To Send Messages (VIDEO)

The CBS interview is here:
[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]

CBS fact checks their guest:
[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]

400 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:34:57am

OT, but I'm gonna have an interesting semester, roommate wise.

401 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:36:16am

re: #399 freetoken

The CBS interview is here:
[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]

CBS fact checks their guest:
[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]

Nice to see some fact checking from the MSM.

402 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:37:02am

re: #400 ProLifeLiberal

OT, but I'm gonna have an interesting semester, roommate wise.

I'm sorry to hear that. I hated having dorm roommates.

403 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:39:21am

re: #388 RogueOne

The claim was there are so many mentally ill people in jail due to lack of funding or zombie-reagan. My answer wasn't a straw man.

Next time you visit the doctor have them check your eyes!//

"I think it's weird to hear liberals say we should pick people up off the street and toss them in state mental hospitals against their will when they haven't done anything wrong."

^^^That be the straw.

"The biggest is we've decided they actually have rights."

^^^That be the match.


My eyes are shot. That's why I wear 3 sets of glasses. (One is full of beer)

404 jaunte  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:42:41am

Decision time for GOP elites

"...one former senior aide to President George W. Bush gave Romney only a short window to turn back the Perry surge.
“I believe that if Perry survives September that most people will jump to Perry,” the aide said. “They’ll see him as lead dog and he’ll have shaken off the notion that he’s a complete boob.”
[Link: www.politico.com...]

Optimist!

405 freetoken  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:43:07am

Bachmann is not just an idiot, she is a two-faced idiot. She just refuses to own what she said, even if someone like Schieffer tries oh so gently to illustrate to her how silly she is.

406 wrenchwench  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:43:31am

re: #385 Lidane

Because nothing could possibly go wrong here:

Perry Courts Radical Arizona Sheriff Joe Arpaio, Continues Rightward Move On Immigration

I am happy to see Perry running farther to the right and attaching himself to someone who is being investigated for numerous offenses.

407 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:44:22am

re: #403 b_sharp

That isn't the straw, that's the "problem". The state isn't allowed to pick people up and force them on meds because they think it's best. Unless the person has actually done something they're at a loss to do anything about it. People with mental health issues have the same rights as everyone else, they can't be forced into treatment centers or carted off to state institutions just because we don't want to have to deal with them.

408 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:46:57am

re: #402 Killgore Trout

It's at the university apartments. One of them (there's three) is a Teabagger.

He also belong to one of the "5 Civilized Tribes," (I think the Chickasaw tribe), and shown racist tendencies (believing African-Americans to be criminals, and also saying he doesn't want to help inner-city schools).

He does get the irony that he will get government help his whole life while many inner city people don't, right?

409 Lidane  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:48:09am

re: #404 jaunte

Decision time for GOP elites

There isn't a damn thing that Rick Perry could do that would shake off the notion that he’s a complete boob. The guy's been a worse governor than Dubya ever was, and for a lot longer.

410 Lidane  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:49:22am

re: #408 ProLifeLiberal

He does get the irony that he will get government help his whole life while many inner city people don't, right?

Of course not. It's like the teabagger morons who rant and rave against government interference in their Medicare and Social Security. Herp derp.

411 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:49:59am

re: #408 ProLifeLiberal

It's at the university apartments. One of them (there's three) is a Teabagger.

He also belong to one of the "5 Civilized Tribes," (I think the Chickasaw tribe), and shown racist tendencies (believing African-Americans to be criminals, and also saying he doesn't want to help inner-city schools).

He does get the irony that he will get government help his whole life while many inner city people don't, right?

Probably not--irony is not the strongest suit of the People of the Tea.

What are the other roomies like?

412 jaunte  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:50:14am

300 homes destroyed, so far

BASTROP, Texas (AP) — A wildfire burning southeast of Austin, Texas, destroyed about 300 homes and was advancing unchecked on Monday through parched ranchland along a 16-mile (26-kilometer) front, authorities said.

The fire, one of dozens that crews were battling throughout the drought-stricken state, had blackened some 17,500 acres (7,080 hectares) but was not threatening the state capital, as it was about 30 miles (50 kilometers) from the city and headed the opposite way. But the ferocity and speed with which it was moving made it unsafe to fight from the ground, Texas Forest Service spokeswoman Jan Amen said.

"It's a monster, and it's zero percent contained" Amen said.[Link: hosted2.ap.org...]

413 zora  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:50:18am

re: #382 Killgore Trout

if she does, it's just a joke or metaphor.

414 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:50:35am

re: #410 Lidane

There's a good possibility I will be giving him a "The Reason You Suck Speech" before the end of the year.

415 RogueOne  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:52:01am

Gotta run, enjoy the day people!

416 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:53:50am

re: #412 jaunte

How's that Prayer working for ya Perry?

417 Renaissance_Man  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:55:09am

re: #395 austin_blue

Actually, let's be clear. Clinton *signed* legislation created by others. He created nothing.

Presidents need to take responsibility for the governing that occurs when they're leading. That's what leadership entails. Yes, I'm well aware of how the US system stacks things in favour of an obstructionist minority, especially with a complicit media driving the narrative. Still, Presidents have to lead - we cannot give Obama or anyone else passes for failing to lead on the key issues.

418 Lidane  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 10:57:58am

re: #416 ProLifeLiberal

How's that Prayer working for ya Perry?

Apparently, God knows that Rick Perry is full of shit, given that Texas is still on fire and it's not raining.

419 jaunte  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:01:03am

re: #416 ProLifeLiberal

He gets to avoid his first public debate, and go for a fire-fightin' photo-op.

420 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:01:04am

re: #418 Lidane

Believe me, I have no problem kicking someone when they are down. I received the same treatment in the past, so when possible, I reciprocate.

I've tried to forgive the conservatives in the past.

Right after the first attempt, the attempted assassination of Giffords happened.

During the Second Attack, the Norwegian Terrorist Attack occurred.

There will not be a third time.

421 allegro  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:06:35am

re: #419 jaunte

He gets to avoid his first public debate, and go for a fire-fightin' photo-op.

It's going to be increasingly amusing to see how he avoids presidential debates coming up. He's managed to avoid them in Tx elections - I think he's going to have to really do some tap dancing on the national level.

I would so enjoy seeing him debate Obama. Though I kinda doubt "debate" is a right word for what I suspect would result.

422 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:08:31am

re: #421 allegro

What do you think the right word will be?

423 The Ghost of a Flea  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:08:56am

re: #209 dell*nix

Personal arms and self defence arguments most likely go back to before recorded history. And has not let up since.

If Thog no have pointy rock on stick, only Neanderthals have pointy rock on stick!

424 allegro  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:09:17am

re: #422 ProLifeLiberal

What do you think the right word will be?

Slaughter comes to mind.

425 austin_blue  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:10:22am

re: #412 jaunte

300 homes destroyed, so far

We've got fires all over the place right now. Dripping Springs, Lake Travis, Cedar Ranch, Steiner Ranch, &c. Total homes destroyed is now over 400. The State Office of Emergency Response has been activated and they are calling in Fire tankers and Blackhawks from the Guard and Fort Hood. The area has had .05" of rain since mid-June. A disaster waiting to happen, and yesterday it did.

426 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:10:40am

A girlfriend of one the the roommates didn't like my semi-gloating about the fact that Perry's prayers failed.

427 Mocking Jay  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:15:16am

re: #426 ProLifeLiberal

A girlfriend of one the the roommates didn't like my semi-gloating about the fact that Perry's prayers failed.

Can't wait to hear the "what's 0bama doing about this?!?" choir. It's more poignant after Perry did nothing but pray.

428 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:16:11am

re: #427 JasonA

Again, I'm going to be doing the 'kicking them while their down' routine.

429 jaunte  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:16:45am

A reporter should ask Perry what he thinks of the Aggies' plans to light up a huge bonfire this year.
[Link: www.studentbonfire.com...]

430 Mocking Jay  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:17:19am

re: #429 jaunte

A reporter should ask Perry what he thinks of the Aggies' plans to light up a huge bonfire this year.
[Link: www.studentbonfire.com...]

Perry's response: "Which books will they be using for fuel?"

431 austin_blue  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:18:29am

This takes forever to load, but to get an idea of the magnitude of these fires, pull back to a twenty mile scale in the lower left corner:

[Link: www.wunderground.com...]

433 laZardo  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:25:15am

GREETINGS COMRADES

HOW GOES GLORIOUS DAY OF LABOR

O:

[also have job from 3-7 today. no holiday pay because it's a temp, but it's better than nothing :B ]

434 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:26:12am

re: #429 jaunte

A reporter should ask Perry what he thinks of the Aggies' plans to light up a huge bonfire this year.
[Link: www.studentbonfire.com...]

Perry was a Redpot, basically one of the 18 high priests of the bonfire cult, during his days as a C student at A&M. The chief Redpot, the Grand Panjundram himself, is known as Head Stack, though Perry never achieved that august status.

435 Mocking Jay  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:26:16am

re: #433 laZardo

GREETINGS COMRADES

HOW GOES GLORIOUS DAY OF LABOR

O:

[also have job from 3-7 today. no holiday pay because it's a temp, but it's better than nothing :B ]

Bah. It's just another shopping day. As are all our holidays now. It's just about shopping. None of these days mean shit anymore.

436 laZardo  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:28:02am

re: #435 JasonA

Bah. It's just another shopping day. As are all our holidays now. It's just about shopping. None of these days mean shit anymore.

ACCURSED CAPITALISTS!

/ah, the more people that drop by my free samples table at Safeway, the quicker time tends to fly. ;p

437 freetoken  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:34:38am

re: #431 austin_blue

Here's the latest satellite image:
Image: single.cgi?image=crefl1_143.A2011248170500-2011248171000.2km.jpg

You can change the scale by clicking on the "pixel sizes" numbers on the left, though I warn you that the 250meter resolution is a big file. The fires are shown in red.

438 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:34:44am

re: #420 ProLifeLiberal

Believe me, I have no problem kicking someone when they are down. I received the same treatment in the past, so when possible, I reciprocate.

I've tried to forgive the conservatives in the past.

Right after the first attempt, the attempted assassination of Giffords happened.

During the Second Attack, the Norwegian Terrorist Attack occurred.

There will not be a third time.

I'm sure they don't care that you won't forgive them.

439 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:39:26am

re: #432 recusancy

To all the progressives that were "outraged" at Obama for his smog ruling.

You mean headlines and sound bytes don't always illustrate all the facts and nuances of complex issues? Color me shocked.///

Seriously, the same people pushing this ridiculous "sellout" meme are the ones who are convinced Kucinich primarying Obama would somehow help the progressive movement. One of the reasons Daily Kos lost a lot of credibility with me (although I do still occasionally check them out; see my link to one of their posts earlier in this thread) was because of how hard they shilled for Obama in the '08 primary, and then started harping on him relentlessly for following through things he said he'd do during his campaign (like refocusing on Afghanistan), or for daring to compromise on issues like healthcare, an issue that most sane people would agree the left won on. Even though I was an Obama supporter in '08, their attacks against Hillary were another major turnoff. The fact that so many over there are intent on primarying Obama just shows how far out of touch with reality they've become.

440 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:39:55am

re: #386 RogueOne

Funding is a very small part of the problem. You can place blame where you choose but you don't get to make your own version of history.

e_e kneejerk.

Well, I didn't. I barely said anything about "funding", if anything at all.

441 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:41:54am

re: #389 JasonA

So this is what we've come to...

USA Today Is Too Dumb for Words When It Comes to Taxes

It's totally anecdotal, but I've met more than a few fiscal conservatives who absolutely had no fucking clue what progressive taxation meant, or how the above isn't true (except in rare cases involving specific tax breaks etc.).

442 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:42:55am

re: #439 Atlas Fails

You mean headlines and sound bytes don't always illustrate all the facts and nuances of complex issues? Color me shocked.///

Seriously, the same people pushing this ridiculous "sellout" meme are the ones who are convinced Kucinich primarying Obama would somehow help the progressive movement. One of the reasons Daily Kos lost a lot of credibility with me (although I do still occasionally check them out; see my link to one of their posts earlier in this thread) was because of how hard they shilled for Obama in the '08 primary, and then started harping on him relentlessly for following through things he said he'd do during his campaign (like refocusing on Afghanistan), or for daring to compromise on issues like healthcare, an issue that most sane people would agree the left won on. Even though I was an Obama supporter in '08, their attacks against Hillary were another major turnoff. The fact that so many over there are intent on primarying Obama just shows how far out of touch with reality they've become.

Which is one of the reasons I mentioned fact checking the ozone regulation decision in the thread regarding this topic. Just to simply state that Obama decided to delay this regulation until 2013 doesn't paint the whole picture of the administrations overall policy regarding clean air and the environment.

443 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:42:55am

re: #426 ProLifeLiberal

A girlfriend of one the the roommates didn't like my semi-gloating about the fact that Perry's prayers failed.

Lol ehh, I love rubbing their noses in that crap. They can take a bit of pointing and laughing; their plans for the rest of us entail far worse than simple ridicule.

444 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:44:05am

re: #439 Atlas Fails

You mean headlines and sound bytes don't always illustrate all the facts and nuances of complex issues? Color me shocked.///

Seriously, the same people pushing this ridiculous "sellout" meme are the ones who are convinced Kucinich primarying Obama would somehow help the progressive movement. One of the reasons Daily Kos lost a lot of credibility with me (although I do still occasionally check them out; see my link to one of their posts earlier in this thread) was because of how hard they shilled for Obama in the '08 primary, and then started harping on him relentlessly for following through things he said he'd do during his campaign (like refocusing on Afghanistan), or for daring to compromise on issues like healthcare, an issue that most sane people would agree the left won on. Even though I was an Obama supporter in '08, their attacks against Hillary were another major turnoff. The fact that so many over there are intent on primarying Obama just shows how far out of touch with reality they've become.

People find that bitching on the Internet gets them attention, so they'll bitch the most about inconsequential things.

Case in point, I'm bitching about bitching.

445 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:44:12am

re: #432 recusancy

I really feel like Obama doesn't trumpet his successes enough.

446 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:44:51am

re: #442 Gus 802

My comment in the thread was "I hope he got something for it".

And he did. He got a lot. He did very well, and didn't give away much for what he got.

447 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:45:07am

Arcade Fire, anyone?

Youtube Video
448 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:45:08am

re: #441 Obdicut

It's totally anecdotal, but I've met more than a few fiscal conservatives who absolutely had no fucking clue what progressive taxation meant, or how the above isn't true (except in rare cases involving specific tax breaks etc.).

Doesn't progressive taxation mean liberal taxation?

449 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:45:13am

re: #439 Atlas Fails

Oh I know. Same for HP, and the rest. Feh, to all....Robert Gibbs was right in calling them the Professional Left.

450 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:46:40am

re: #448 b_sharp

Doesn't progressive taxation mean liberal taxation?

It's really goddamn depressing to me that Huntsman, a person who's campaign I was willing to work for if he took a sane and sensible stance on issues, came out with a tax plan straight out of Dick Armey's ass, with 0% taxes on unearned income. Only labor would be taxes as income.

It's like a joke how bad the GOP is now fiscally, and it's the punchline that so many of the American people aren't really educated enough in taxation and fiscal policy to be able to understand that.

451 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:47:02am

re: #449 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Oh I know. Same for HP, and the rest. Feh, to all...Robert Gibbs was right in calling them the Professional Left.

Youtube Video
452 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:48:46am

re: #449 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Oh I know. Same for HP, and the rest. Feh, to all...Robert Gibbs was right in calling them the Professional Left.

HP lost me when they started bashing Obama on Libya. Their abundance of Troofers didn't help their case either.

453 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:48:51am

On a more positive track:

I figured out a habit that works for me, and I'm writing three pages of the novel I'm working on every morning. So, in four or so months, I should have a book.

Maybe even faster.

Only took me about eighteen years to figure out what i needed to do to able to write consistently.

454 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:49:49am

re: #450 Obdicut

It's really goddamn depressing to me that Huntsman, a person who's campaign I was willing to work for if he took a sane and sensible stance on issues, came out with a tax plan straight out of Dick Armey's ass, with 0% taxes on unearned income. Only labor would be taxes as income.

It's like a joke how bad the GOP is now fiscally, and it's the punchline that so many of the American people aren't really educated enough in taxation and fiscal policy to be able to understand that.

Seriously? Investment income isn't income as far as taxation is concerned?

455 laZardo  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:49:55am

re: #453 Obdicut

Better late than when you're dying. q;

456 austin_blue  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:50:38am

re: #417 Renaissance_Man

Still, Presidents have to lead - we cannot give Obama or anyone else passes for failing to lead on the key issues.

How can you lead when it's a herd of cats?

457 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:50:55am

UT fan(anatics) try every year to ruin the Aggie bonfire by lighting it prematurely. Legend has it that at least 3 such attempts have involved preemptive air strikes. The first such attempt, in the late 40s, used a light plane, either a Taylorcraft or a Piper Cub. The daring, if incompetent, Longhorn aviators missed the stack with their improvised firebombs. A violation of FAA alcohol policy was probably a factor in their low proficiency. They then suffered the indignity of running out of fuel, having possibly used their extra gas to make Molotov cocktails. Even worse for them, they crash-landed in Aggie held territory. The crew escaped but the plane was stripped of usable parts and its wooden structural components triumphantly consigned to the bonfire.

The second attempt, in the early 60s, came to an early end when DPS investigators caught up with the aerial arsonists before they could even take off.

In 1999, UT partisans were reportedly moving to the cutting edge of technology by planning a drone strike. They had acquired a large RC model and armed it with some kind of incendiary device. This plan was canceled after the fatal collapse of the stack during construction.

458 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:51:11am

re: #454 b_sharp

Seriously? Investment income isn't income as far as taxation is concerned?

That's Huntsman's plan. It also enshrines dividends in that status. 0% taxation on all capital gains income, including dividends.

It's fucking insane.

459 freetoken  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:52:32am

re: #458 Obdicut

It's fucking insane.

I'd rather use the term "immoral".

460 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:52:51am

re: #456 austin_blue

I'm honestly a little disappointed that Pelosi hasn't kept herself in the news more. Maybe it's some strategy, but I think the way she causes mass panic and fear on the right makes her presence useful.

She probably knows better than I how to play this game, though I'll admit to a basic distrust on her, based on how thoroughly corporate she is.

461 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:53:53am

re: #459 freetoken

I'd rather use the term "immoral".

You could always use their language. Just say it's "un-Christian".

462 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:54:27am

re: #453 Obdicut

On a more positive track:

I figured out a habit that works for me, and I'm writing three pages of the novel I'm working on every morning. So, in four or so months, I should have a book.

Maybe even faster.

Only took me about eighteen years to figure out what i needed to do to able to write consistently.

It's so easy to get overwhelmed by big projects and avoid them completely. To avoid being discouraged I try to avoid looking for signs of progress and just mindlessly plug along and knock out small chunks, Before you know it you'll be almost done.

463 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:55:40am

re: #452 Atlas Fails

HP lost me when they started bashing Obama on Libya. Their abundance of Troofers didn't help their case either.

For me it was a couple years ago. I used to do a thing on the blog called "Headline Does Not Match Story", but then I stopped because MOST headlines were like that lol Dumped them completely during/after the Mavi Marmara crap (I was on HP the night it happened. Nauseating.)

Then people figured out generating content for free for someone else can be really terrible for morale. 9_9

464 freetoken  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:55:51am

re: #461 Gus 802

You could always use their language. Just say it's "un-Christian".

Gus, you just don't understand... God wants rich people to keep more of their money, after all, He is the one who gave it to them!

Are you trying to steal the blessings of God, which He so richly has poured out onto the rich?

465 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:57:48am

re: #462 Killgore Trout

Yeah, it's really making me happy. And coincidentally making my wife happy.

I'm a huge morning person. To an almost alarming degree. I leap out of bed in the morning bursting with energy and in love with the universe.

My wife, a sane person, is not like this, and is rather grumpy and touchy in the morning and, well, finds me pretty unbearable like that.

I previously used that energy to do little household things to try to get her happy before class, but I've come to realize her mood just improves with time.

So I decided to start writing in the morning. She loves it. I'm out of her hair, focusing while she comes to grips with the world, and by nine o'clock I've got three pages done. Any more I do than that is gravy.

It's really made me happy. You're exactly right that i used to approach writing like a big project and had the terror of the blank page. Now I just surf that early wave of enthusiasm.


As a counterpoint, the poet Schiller couldn't write anything unless he had his feet on a block of ice and was inhaling the scent of rotting apples.

466 recusancy  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:59:02am

re: #445 Obdicut

I really feel like Obama doesn't trumpet his successes enough.

Yup

467 freetoken  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 11:59:21am

Courtesy of ... Fox (heh):

Don't Let Your Kids Watch Chaz Bono On 'Dancing With the Stars'

I advise parents to not allow their children to watch the episodes in which Chaz appears.

Here’s why: Many of the children who might be watching will be establishing a sense of self which includes, of course, a sexual/gender identity. Some will be girls becoming comfortable with dramatic changes in their bodies. Some will be boys coming to terms with integrating the dawn of manhood with exquisite feelings of vulnerability. Young viewers will include tomboyish girls and sensitive, less stereotypically “masculine” boys. They will also include children who have sustained the losses of loved ones and are wrestling with depression, perhaps wondering who they are absent their deceased mothers or fathers.
The last thing vulnerable children and adolescents need, as they wrestle with the normal process of establishing their identities, is to watch a captive crowd in a studio audience applaud on cue for someone whose search for an identity culminated with the removal of her breasts, the injection of steroids and, perhaps one day soon, the fashioning of a make-shift phallus to replace her vagina.

[...]

468 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:00:36pm

re: #453 Obdicut

On a more positive track:

I figured out a habit that works for me, and I'm writing three pages of the novel I'm working on every morning. So, in four or so months, I should have a book.

Maybe even faster.

Only took me about eighteen years to figure out what i needed to do to able to write consistently.

Way to go. I have several novels in me that will never come out. I respect anyone who has the discipline to complete writing a book.

469 Renaissance_Man  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:01:06pm

re: #456 austin_blue

How can you lead when it's a herd of cats?

You're the President. You have the biggest bully pulpit in the world. Even without going that far, everything you say and do is news. Yes, it can then be filtered and distorted by the prism of cult propaganda, but the cult is still a minority.

The saddest part of his Presidency is that he came into office with a historic, epic mandate. The moment was then. That was the time to truly redefine the United States, to reaffirm its place as the world's greatest nation. Never again would the colour of a man's skin be a barrier to the highest political office in the world. Despite the ever-increasing stranglehold of cult propaganda, here was a historic win that completely refuted the paradigm that thirty years of far right insanity had tried to corrupt this great nation with. Instead there was a year of hesitancy, laissez-faire leadership. And the moment was lost.

I don't fault Obama for not being a truly great statesman. Some of my friends 'blame' him for not being one of history's great leaders, which I think is unfair. Still, it is sad to see a once in a generation opportunity lost.

470 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:01:17pm

re: #465 Obdicut

Random side note: Schiller's philosophy and economics are what the LaRouchites grabbed and then perverted. So if someone talks to you about how great Schiller is, they may be, like me, a huge fan of his plays and his philosophy, or they may be a gibbering LaRouchite who doesn't understand a fucking thing about Schiller.

They even run some goddamn Schiller institute. Shouldn't be allowed.

471 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:01:35pm

re: #465 Obdicut

As a counterpoint, the poet Schiller couldn't write anything unless he had his feet on a block of ice and was inhaling the scent of rotting apples.

Noel Coward, OTOH, reportedly said: "I adore professionalism. I loathe writers who can only write when it's raining."

NANOWRIMO helped me last year. I'm going to do it again this fall. It's hokey, but it forces you to MOVE FORWARD.

(Where the hell did Schiller get all this ice from?)

472 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:02:56pm

re: #470 Obdicut

Random side note: Schiller's philosophy and economics are what the LaRouchites grabbed and then perverted. So if someone talks to you about how great Schiller is, they may be, like me, a huge fan of his plays and his philosophy, or they may be a gibbering LaRouchite who doesn't understand a fucking thing about Schiller.

They even run some goddamn Schiller institute. Shouldn't be allowed.

I also love Schiller. The LaRouchies ruin everything they touch, including Schiller's name.

473 zora  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:03:12pm

re: #467 freetoken

yeah, remember when everyone's teenage daughter got pregnant after seeing bristol on dwts.

474 freetoken  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:04:58pm

Here's what I say:

I advise parents to not allow their children to watch Fox News or Fox Network, especially when the Simpsons or any one of the many derivatives of X-files are on.

Here’s why: Many of the children who might be watching will be establishing a sense of self which includes, of course, a moral identity. Some will be girls becoming comfortable with dramatic changes in their bodies and will try to be like Lisa Simpson, overly smart but yellow covered.

Some will be boys coming to terms with integrating the dawn of manhood with exquisite feelings of vulnerability. Some of these boys will try to imitate the antics of Bart Simpson.

Young viewers will include tomboyish girls and sensitive, less stereotypically “masculine” boys. They will also include children who have sustained the losses of loved ones and are wrestling with depression, perhaps wondering who they are absent their deceased mothers or fathers. Having these children excessively exposed to Newt Gingrich on Fox News will confuse them about how to be a good spouse.

The last thing vulnerable children and adolescents need, as they wrestle with the normal process of establishing their identities, is to watch a captive crowd in a studio audience applaud on cue for someone whose search for an identity culminated with them running for the office of President, quitting their terms of Governorship prematurely, and the fashioning of a make-shift political career to replace their earlier failed careers.

475 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:05:07pm

re: #467 freetoken

Courtesy of ... Fox (heh):

Don't Let Your Kids Watch Chaz Bono On 'Dancing With the Stars'

A 'captive crowd' in a studio audience.

Yes, I hear they march people in to DWTS filmings at gunpoint, and no matter how much you cry as Chaz twirls his lady around the floor, they won't let you leave.

Why are these people letting their kids watch DWTS anyway, with or without Chaz? It's a ridiculous show, and extremely immodest.

476 laZardo  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:05:15pm

re: #472 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I also love Schiller. The LaRouchies ruin everything they touch, including Schiller's name.

Someone once passed me a classic LaRouche about the Philippines, how former president Fidel Ramos was secretly plotting to overthrow Gloria Arroyo.

Turns out the so-called "attempted coups" were from disgruntled young officers, and Ramos' real friends actually supported Gloria's party successor in the 2010 election.

XD

477 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:05:24pm

re: #473 zora

I love that they're literally afraid of ideas and information.

It's hard to parody. Explaining concepts to them terrifies them.

"See, and some people, though born as one gender, feel and identify more with the other gender to the point that it makes them really unhappy to be inside what they feel is the 'wrong' body."


"Ahhh shield the children's ears! A reasonable explanation is being given to them!"

478 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:05:38pm

re: #469 Renaissance_Man

I don't fault Obama for not being a truly great statesman. Some of my friends 'blame' him for not being one of history's great leaders, which I think is unfair. Still, it is sad to see a once in a generation opportunity lost.

Eh, term's not even over yet, and not lost. I'm just not sure where people looked at him and saw Superman when he's just a man. I know I didn't.

479 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:05:38pm

re: #467 freetoken

Courtesy of ... Fox (heh):

Don't Let Your Kids Watch Chaz Bono On 'Dancing With the Stars'

And someone is giving Chaz Bono's junk way too much thought.

480 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:06:30pm

OT.
My daughter just told us we'll be grandparents for the second time. The first time was 15 years ago, so we've been very patient with our kids.

481 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:07:19pm

re: #480 b_sharp

Congratulations. My parents have zero grandkids so far. I have two older brothers, so I really don't feel that it's my job to lead the way.

482 HappyWarrior  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:12:23pm

The Chaz hatred is just so stupid to me.

483 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:12:32pm

re: #479 SanFranciscoZionist

And someone is giving Chaz Bono's junk way too much thought.

I am really curious how they build that junk. Going physically from man to woman would be fairly straightforward, but woman to man would be a lot tougher. I don't think there is a saline or silicone penis insert.

484 engineer cat  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:13:31pm

re: #469 Renaissance_Man

I don't fault Obama for not being a truly great statesman. Some of my friends 'blame' him for not being one of history's great leaders, which I think is unfair. Still, it is sad to see a once in a generation opportunity lost.

before the election, obama voted for retroactive immunity for telecom companies that had been violating our privacy even under the relaxed privacy standards of the "patriot" act. hillary voted against it. i expected him to express regret for having to vote for that part of the bill, but no, he said he was definitely in favor of ot

i had regarded obama as a centrist democrat of no particular career distinction before then. after the vote i knew he could not be relied on to repeal the damage done to the fourth amendment by the bush administration. i voted for him anyway

i like him and support him anyway despite the fact that i regard him as a conservative democrat. i'm not terribly disappointed

i will do anything i can to hold back the tidal wave of ignorance and lies being perpetrated by those who would make the federal government the tame lapdog of multinational corporations

485 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:14:16pm

re: #482 HappyWarrior

The Chaz hatred is just so stupid to me.

They only despise him because he proves what they already know for a fact: all the forced frilly pantaloons, forced white patent leather shoes, and forced pipe curls in the world will not a woman make.

486 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:15:50pm

Folks, can anyone clarify to me the role of Jalil in the HIV trial? From what I read, he twice sentenced the Bulgarian nurses to death (as a part of the appeal?), what is his position on the trial and his role now (beyond declaring the innocence of the nurses)?

487 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:15:52pm

re: #481 Obdicut

Congratulations. My parents have zero grandkids so far. I have two older brothers, so I really don't feel that it's my job to lead the way.

Thanks. We only have two kids and our oldest has dropped the ball, so our daughter has to take up the slack.

488 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:16:41pm

re: #467 freetoken

Courtesy of ... Fox (heh):

Don't Let Your Kids Watch Chaz Bono On 'Dancing With the Stars'

Right. Fox. Again, the station that runs Family Guy and American Dad. This crap pisses me off. Why don't they crawl back into their holes and STFU.

489 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:16:47pm

re: #467 freetoken

Courtesy of ... Fox (heh):

Don't Let Your Kids Watch Chaz Bono On 'Dancing With the Stars'

They must be pretty insecure in their own sexuality if they really think seeing a transgender person on TV will infect them/their kids with teh gay.

490 laZardo  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:17:24pm

re: #489 Atlas Fails

They must be pretty insecure in their own sexuality if they really think seeing a transgender person on TV will infect them/their kids with teh gay.

That's what furries are supposed to do.

///braces for impact

491 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:18:47pm

re: #486 Sergey Romanov

Folks, can anyone clarify to me the role of Jalil in the HIV trial? From what I read, he twice sentenced the Bulgarian nurses to death (as a part of the appeal?), what is his position on the trial and his role now (beyond declaring the innocence of the nurses)?

Wow, good question. I haven't heard of the Libyan HIV trials in a very long time.

492 Killgore Trout  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:19:46pm

re: #467 freetoken

Courtesy of ... Fox (heh):

Don't Let Your Kids Watch Chaz Bono On 'Dancing With the Stars'

Don't let your parents watch Fox News.

493 laZardo  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:20:05pm

re: #492 Killgore Trout

Don't let your parents watch Fox News.

...too late for mine ;_;

494 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:21:09pm

re: #489 Atlas Fails

They must be pretty insecure in their own sexuality if they really think seeing a transgender person on TV will infect them/their kids with teh gay.

Well, one they know is transgender, anyway.

Same as DADT mentality -- some person has been lgb for 50 years yet somehow, everything on planet earth shifts the minute their ignorant selves find out. /eyeroll

495 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:21:18pm

re: #483 b_sharp

I am really curious how they build that junk. Going physically from man to woman would be fairly straightforward, but woman to man would be a lot tougher. I don't think there is a saline or silicone penis insert.

I'm sure it's all out there somewhere how it's done. The field is still pretty crude though, from what I understand. The people who figure out how to do serious 'like you were born with it' genital reworking are going to make a fortune.

496 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:21:20pm

re: #491 Killgore Trout

Wow, good question. I haven't heard of the Libyan HIV trials in a very long time.

That tends to be glossed over since the West supports the rebels. Yet this is a sticking point. Was he a somewhat principled judge and minister of justice, sort of a soft dissident? Or was he the mad dog's yes man on the most important matters (which might explain how he got to those high offices in the first place, despite the alleged dissent)?

497 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:22:26pm

re: #488 Gus 802

Right. Fox. Again, the station that runs Family Guy and American Dad. This crap pisses me off. Why don't they crawl back into their holes and STFU.

Huge disconnect between the shows on Fox E. and the op-eds on Fox. N. GIANT.

498 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:23:39pm

re: #494 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Well, one they know is transgender, anyway.

Same as DADT mentality -- some person has been lgb for 50 years yet somehow, everything on planet earth shifts the minute their ignorant selves find out. /eyeroll

Did you read the article? I glanced through it. The moron "doctor" calls Chaz a transsexual woman. Um, Chaz would be a transsexual man.

499 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:24:59pm

re: #484 engineer dog

i like him and support him anyway despite the fact that i regard him as a conservative democrat. i'm not terribly disappointed

Agree fully. Since when did we start pinning all our politics on one person, and then when they falter against impossible expectations, then they're a complete failure, wtf. To me, it's just another form of scapegoating.

500 jaunte  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:25:46pm

re: #488 Gus 802

Murdoch gets paid on both ends, to create 'scandal' and to tut-tut at it.
"Page Three" and "Page 3" are registered trademarks of News International Ltd.

501 Digital Display  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:26:28pm

Happy Labor day Lizards!
It is a beautiful day in Oklahoma...I'd forgotten there were nice days here..

502 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:26:37pm

re: #498 Gus 802

I read it when it was posted. Keith Blow Hole needs to go sit down somewhere.

503 engineer cat  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:26:45pm

...for example, michelle bachmann has just asserted "that the founding fathers knew" that congress is the most important branch of government, the executive is less important, and the supreme court is "a distant third"

this apparently is the meaning of the theory of 'balance of powers' and 'the three co-equal branches of government'

after all, wasn't it thomas jefferson or somebody famous like that who said in those deathless words "you're not the boss of me!"

504 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:27:23pm

re: #498 Gus 802

Did you read the article? I glanced through it. The moron "doctor" calls Chaz a transsexual woman. Um, Chaz would be a transsexual man.

Calling him a man would be giving in, and they are fully determined to hold out.

505 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:27:43pm

re: #495 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm sure it's all out there somewhere how it's done. The field is still pretty crude though, from what I understand. The people who figure out how to do serious 'like you were born with it' genital reworking are going to make a fortune.

I agree. I hope it's soon, I've been thinking about getting a second penis.

506 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:28:49pm

re: #503 engineer dog

...for example, michelle bachmann has just asserted "that the founding fathers knew" that congress is the most important branch of government, the executive is less important, and the supreme court is "a distant third"

That will last until there's a Republican in the White House and a Democrat-majority Congress. Or until the Supremes rule her way on something.

Bachmann's type doesn't have political theory, they have momentary convictions of convenience.

507 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:29:21pm

re: #498 Gus 802

Did you read the article? I glanced through it. The moron "doctor" calls Chaz a transsexual woman. Um, Chaz would be a transsexual man.

That would be Dr. Keith "I Am Not A Pedophile" Ablow.

508 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:30:03pm

re: #503 engineer dog

...for example, michelle bachmann has just asserted "that the founding fathers knew" that congress is the most important branch of government, the executive is less important, and the supreme court is "a distant third"

[Link: www.anothermiseducatedconservative.com...]

509 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:30:07pm

Wow, Mr. Hoffa. Those are pretty feisty words.

Words mean things even if you're on the left, you asshole.

510 HappyWarrior  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:30:46pm

re: #503 engineer dog

...for example, michelle bachmann has just asserted "that the founding fathers knew" that congress is the most important branch of government, the executive is less important, and the supreme court is "a distant third"

this apparently is the meaning of the theory of 'balance of powers' and 'the three co-equal branches of government'

after all, wasn't it thomas jefferson or somebody famous like that who said in those deathless words "you're not the boss of me!"

Damn commie Montesquieu for thinking that powers should be balanced. Somehow, I doubt she was saying this when the Dems had a huge majority in 2006-10 in Congress. Typical fickle crap.

511 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:31:04pm

re: #505 b_sharp

I agree. I hope it's soon, I've been thinking about getting a second penis.

Spit coffee on the keyboard, dammnit!

512 jaunte  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:31:36pm

re: #507 Atlas Fails

TV Shrink Keith Ablow to Crank Out Quickie Casey Anthony Book
"Inside the Mind of Casey Anthony"

Talk about an artificial dick.

513 austin_blue  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:32:44pm

re: #469 Renaissance_Man

The saddest part of his Presidency is that he came into office with a historic, epic mandate. The moment was then. That was the time to truly redefine the United States, to reaffirm its place as the world's greatest nation. Never again would the colour of a man's skin be a barrier to the highest political office in the world. Despite the ever-increasing stranglehold of cult propaganda, here was a historic win that completely refuted the paradigm that thirty years of far right insanity had tried to corrupt this great nation with. Instead there was a year of hesitancy, laissez-faire leadership. And the moment was lost.

He got the biggest stimulus he could get. He raised CAFE standards with the agreement of the auto companies, which he saved. He got a health care reform package that was backed by the AMA. Crony Capitalists financed the formation of the TP movement two months after his inauguration. Faux News and the WSJ started the meme that we had a deficit, as opposed to an employment problem. Here, read this, please:

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

514 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:33:49pm

Speaking of writers/authors, anyone here know of a free pdf editor for Win7 that recreates a pdf created by Word 4 Mac? My wife does the editing and proofreading for a writer we know and she's had to print it out and pencil in corrections when she really wants to edit the file.

515 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:35:34pm

re: #511 SanFranciscoZionist

Spit coffee on the keyboard, dammnit!

Good. It sounds like I've done my job here for the day.

516 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:37:21pm

re: #513 austin_blue

He got the biggest stimulus he could get. He raised CAFE standards with the agreement of the auto companies, which he saved. He got a health care reform package that was backed by the AMA. Crony Capitalists financed the formation of the TP movement two months after his inauguration. Faux News and the WSJ started the meme that we had a deficit, as opposed to an employment problem. Here, read this, please:

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

I remember when concerns about the deficit were just discredited left-wing scare tactics. My, how things have changed since a Democrat moved into the White House.

517 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:38:32pm

I want to wish all of my fellow Lizards and their families and very happy Labor Day.

518 Renaissance_Man  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:39:21pm

re: #513 austin_blue

Hey, I don't disagree. I for one consider the actions of the Conservative cult to be borderline seditious and immoral, considering the active desire to benefit from actions that are to the detriment of the nation as a whole. There is a definite lack of courage and unwillingness to engage with this present evil, though, both in media and politics.

519 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:39:30pm

re: #516 Atlas Fails

I remember when concerns about the deficit were just discredited left-wing scare tactics. My, how things have changed since a Democrat moved into the White House.

The left, with their leftist, liberal, progressive ideas have become an evil to be defeated in order to save the country. The same mentality has found its way up here.

520 HappyWarrior  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:39:41pm

re: #516 Atlas Fails

I remember when concerns about the deficit were just discredited left-wing scare tactics. My, how things have changed since a Democrat moved into the White House.

"Deficits don't matter" Hint it wasn't Biden or Obama who said that.

521 Gus  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:39:49pm

re: #500 jaunte

Murdoch gets paid on both ends, to create 'scandal' and to tut-tut at it.
"Page Three" and "Page 3" are registered trademarks of News International Ltd.

Guess who was a Page Three girl once? Caroline Cosey. AKA former Bond Girl Tula... a MTF transsexual. She was born with XXY chromosone pattern instead of XY.

522 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:41:26pm

re: #517 PhillyPretzel

I want to wish all of my fellow Lizards and their families and very happy Labor Day.

Thank you.

I'll tell you, at my age, some times it feels like you're in labor.

523 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:41:40pm

So, how do the folks on the left feel about Mr. Hoffa's speech?

I'm surprised it isn't being talked about.

524 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:43:18pm

re: #523 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

What happened?

525 wrenchwench  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:43:18pm

Here's a Labor Day song.

Youtube Video

Here's another one.

Have a good one. To be actually working today feels both right and wrong.

526 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:43:27pm

re: #521 Gus 802

Guess who was a Page Three girl once? Caroline Cosey. AKA former Bond Girl Tula... a MTF transsexual. She was born with XXY chromosone pattern instead of XY.

There's a French movie, "Ma Vie En Rose", about a little boy who thinks he's supposed to be a girl. There's a wonderful scene where his big sister explains to him WHY he's a boy, and shows him her biology textbook. He comes up with his own response to this, which is that he was intended to have another X, except the stork dropped it into a trash can accidentally (this whole thing plays out on screen), but God will notice the problem and get him another X shortly.

527 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:43:57pm

re: #514 b_sharp

You might look at Open Office. It might work on Win 7. Don't know as I use linux.

528 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:44:17pm

re: #522 b_sharp

Thank you.

I'll tell you, at my age, some times it feels like you're in labor.

My mother called to wish us a happy Labor Day, and asked what we were doing.

I told her my husband had gone back to bed.

She said, "Does this say something about the decline of the American middle class?"

529 Steve  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:45:14pm

I read the article and I am wondering why we can believe 'Brady' and the 'ATF'.

530 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:45:45pm

re: #520 HappyWarrior

"Deficits don't matter" Hint it wasn't Biden or Obama who said that.

And then, of course, we got the idiotic meme of "Bush was really a liberal" through laughably transparent use of No True Scotsman. Funny how they never mention the deficit that Jesus Christ Ronnie Raygun ran up, or that he was the father of modern deficit spending.

531 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:45:54pm

re: #527 dell*nix

You might look at Open Office. It might work on Win 7. Don't know as I use linux.

I use it on Win7 all the time. The problem is it doesn't recreate the file well, there are a lot of misalignments to correct.

532 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:45:59pm

re: #524 ProLifeLiberal

He declared war on the right in America for Obama.

Maybe that's where all the guns went. The left is arming up.

533 laZardo  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:46:17pm

re: #518 Renaissance_Man

Hey, I don't disagree. I for one consider the actions of the Conservative cult to be borderline seditious and immoral, considering the active desire to benefit from actions that are to the detriment of the nation as a whole. There is a definite lack of courage and unwillingness to engage with this present evil, though, both in media and politics.

If I recall, Obama ran on a campaign of bipartisanship, not specifically progressivism. If anything, the lack of "progress" could be attributed to the fact that the executive responds primarily to the initiatives of the legislative.

534 austin_blue  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:46:52pm

re: #518 Renaissance_Man

Hey, I don't disagree. I for one consider the actions of the Conservative cult to be borderline seditious and immoral, considering the active desire to benefit from actions that are to the detriment of the nation as a whole. There is a definite lack of courage and unwillingness to engage with this present evil, though, both in media and politics.

We'll see what happens on Thursday, then, when the Big O speaks on unemployment, won't we? I'm betting on him showing both courage and willingness to deal with the *real* long-term threat to our Country.

Think the R's will collectively face palm and say, "By, God! He's right! We've been going at this economy thing bass ackward!!"

535 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:46:59pm

re: #532 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Wow.

536 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:48:00pm

re: #532 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

“We got to keep an eye on the battle that we face: The war on workers. And you see it everywhere, it is the Tea Party. And you know, there is only one way to beat and win that war. The one thing about working people is we like a good fight. And you know what? They’ve got a war, they got a war with us and there’s only going to be one winner. It’s going to be the workers of Michigan, and America. We’re going to win that war,” Jimmy Hoffa Jr. said to a heavily union crowd.

“President Obama, this is your army. We are ready to march. Let’s take these son of bitches out and give America back to an America where we belong,” Hoffa added.

537 HappyWarrior  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:48:40pm

re: #530 Atlas Fails

And then, of course, we got the idiotic meme of "Bush was really a liberal" through laughably transparent use of No True Scotsman. Funny how they never mention the deficit that Jesus Christ Ronnie Raygun ran up, or that he was the father of modern deficit spending.

Yep, yep. Whenever you bring up the realities of Reagan though, you get blame pinned on Tip and the Dems in Congress. It's like they think everything good in the 80's and there after was because of Reagan but anyhting bad was the fault of Tip and the Dems.

538 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:53:57pm

re: #536 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

The Republicans have said worse.

539 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:54:42pm

re: #537 HappyWarrior

Yep, yep. Whenever you bring up the realities of Reagan though, you get blame pinned on Tip and the Dems in Congress. It's like they think everything good in the 80's and there after was because of Reagan but anyhting bad was the fault of Tip and the Dems.

Can you imagine a candidate in today's GOP primary who supported civilian trials for terrorists, amnesty for illegal immigrants, 17 debt ceiling raises, 7 tax raises for every 1 tax cut, was a former union head, and flip-flopped big time on abortion? He'd be considered to the left of Jon Huntsman, and probably polling similarly.

540 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:54:49pm

re: #538 ProLifeLiberal

Magical balance fairy flies across the screen.

Oh, wait. That only works when the righties bring it up.

541 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:57:58pm

re: #536 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

“We got to keep an eye on the battle that we face: The war on workers. And you see it everywhere, it is the Tea Party. And you know, there is only one way to beat and win that war. The one thing about working people is we like a good fight. And you know what? They’ve got a war, they got a war with us and there’s only going to be one winner. It’s going to be the workers of Michigan, and America. We’re going to win that war,” Jimmy Hoffa Jr. said to a heavily union crowd.

“President Obama, this is your army. We are ready to march. Let’s take these son of bitches out and give America back to an America where we belong,” Hoffa added.

This will be a valid comparison when Jimmy Hoffa Jr. becomes a serious contender for the Democratic presidential nomination.

542 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:59:05pm

re: #536 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

“President Obama, this is your army. We are ready to march. Let’s take these son of bitches out and give America back to an America where we belong,” Hoffa added.

On noes, not another Obama army!

We was already tyrranized once by his Eric Holder X Muhammad Shabazz private army of hiphop DOJ dancers, now this!!

/Schadenfreude

543 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 12:59:12pm

re: #540 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Considering what the TPing roommate said earlier (something along the lines "Us Conservatives would win a Civil War because we have more guns"), I think having an oppostion force is a good thing.

Besides, the last time the Liberals and Conservatives went into war in the US, the Conservatives were wrecked. At least two states wrecked, their cities burned, their infrastructure torn up, and their territories occupied.

544 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:00:39pm

re: #543 ProLifeLiberal

Besides, the last time the Liberals and Conservatives went into war in the US, the Conservatives were wrecked.

Yeah, and they've never gotten over it. That's their entire problem. /Schadenfreude

545 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:03:12pm

re: #544 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

True, but only because we didn't finish the job. We had mercy, and stopped the occupation prematurely. We should have handled it, ala Germany after 1945.

546 dell*nix  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:04:27pm

re: #531 b_sharp

Are you using version 3.3? I understand it is the latest out. I use LibreOffice for what little I do.

547 Atlas Fails  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:05:00pm

re: #545 ProLifeLiberal

True, but only because we didn't finish the job. We had mercy, and stopped the occupation prematurely. We should have handled it, ala Germany after 1945.

You're sounding more like Andrew Johnson than Abraham Lincoln. Ironically, fuckhead J.W. Booth probably did more to hurt the post-war South than anyone other than Johnson.

548 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:14:37pm

re: #532 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

He declared war on the right in America for Obama.

Maybe that's where all the guns went. The left is arming up.

It seems he said that war had been declared on workers and that they needed to vote. He used colorful and unhelpful language, but I don't see a call to arms. I see a metaphorical call to mobilize and get to the polls in November.

"We've got to keep an eye on the battle that we face -- a war on workers. And you see it everywhere. It is the Tea Party," he said. "And there's only one way to beat and win that war -- the one thing about working people is, we like a good fight."

Hoffa called on workers to get involved in opposing Tea Party-aligned lawmakers next November.

"President Obama, this is your army, we are ready to march," Hoffa said. "But everybody here's got to vote. If we go back, and keep the eye on the prize, let's take these son-of-a-bitches out."

549 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:17:01pm

re: #521 Gus 802

Guess who was a Page Three girl once? Caroline Cosey. AKA former Bond Girl Tula... a MTF transsexual. She was born with XXY chromosone pattern instead of XY.

Snopes.com addressed this on one of their famous urban legend pages.

Claim: One of the women in the James Bond film For Your Eyes Only used to be a guy.
Status: True

550 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:19:38pm

re: #536 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

“We got to keep an eye on the battle that we face: The war on workers. And you see it everywhere, it is the Tea Party. And you know, there is only one way to beat and win that war. The one thing about working people is we like a good fight. And you know what? They’ve got a war, they got a war with us and there’s only going to be one winner. It’s going to be the workers of Michigan, and America. We’re going to win that war,” Jimmy Hoffa Jr. said to a heavily union crowd.

“President Obama, this is your army. We are ready to march. Let’s take these son of bitches out and give America back to an America where we belong,” Hoffa added.

Interesting omission either you or your unidentified source made (It's hard to tell when you don't link or use blockquotes.) Between "We are ready to march" and "Let's take these sons of bitches out" he said "But everybody here's got to vote."

551 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:21:06pm

re: #547 Atlas Fails

The South would have continued their ways. The only way to fix something like that is to completely break a society. What we did to Germany is a good example.

552 b_sharp  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:30:42pm

re: #546 dell*nix

Are you using version 3.3? I understand it is the latest out. I use LibreOffice for what little I do.

Nope, 3.2.

I'l dl it and try again.

Thanks.

553 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 1:46:08pm

re: #548 goddamnedfrank

He used colorful and unhelpful language, but I don't see a call to arms.

That is untroooo!!!1

Class warfare! SEIU ACORN Thugggggs!!!!!

554 Steve  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 2:23:56pm

In response to the Hoffa speach I am wondering what happened to: "Lets tone down the rhetoric."

555 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 3:10:49pm

The story claims there are nearly 4,500 licensed gun manufacturers throughout the country. Closer to 1700. With nearly 750 licensed importers.

556 blueraven  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:01:51pm

re: #555 shreck

The story claims there are nearly 4,500 licensed gun manufacturers throughout the country. Closer to 1700. With nearly 750 licensed importers.

Link?

557 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:05:12pm

Working on the link, the batfe page crashed my laptop twice. I wanted an atf link, not one from a blog ect, altho I found a complete listing at [Link: 130.94.182.159...] The link I'm downloading is a complete FFL list so it's huge.

558 Kronocide  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:12:22pm

re: #43 Charles

Absolutely - the NRA is a hard right wing lobby for the gun industry, and they could not possibly care less about public safety or crime.

In a certain way, the gun lobby is no different than Apple, which the vast majority of people respect how they've plied their wares: they are selling a vision, and ideal, above and beyond products.

Beyond that there is no comparison. iPhones don't kill people.

559 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:12:57pm

Now that link doesn't work, try.. [Link: 130.94.182.159...]

560 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:15:06pm

Wiki, FWIW [Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

561 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 4:29:30pm

iPhones don't kill people.

This one does... [Link: wweapons.blogspot.com...] :)

562 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 5:52:11pm

OK I finally crunched the number of FFL licenses by manufacturer. It's 5297 total licensees, remember this includes anyone who alters a firearm, which is all gunsmiths. So it's a squishy number, re the Wiki link you can see the number of major manufacturers is about 120. So this number includes both Colt and the old guy in Burgaw that did the trigger job on my Colt. So I have one pistol that has been manufactured twice.

563 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:36:47pm

re: #562 shreck

So your 555 was backwards, then.

564 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:43:02pm

Depends on who you call a manufacturer. As I said, this number includes gunsmiths as well. It's a difficult number to quantify. Colt equals a garage smith.

565 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:44:44pm

re: #564 shreck

Sure. But in terms of what we call a manufacturer and how many are licensed, the high number is the correct one.

What does the number of manufacturers matter, by the way?

566 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:48:17pm

I saw the 4500 number and thought it was high. And to skew things even further the "manufactures of firearms" doesn't even count the companies who make "destructive devices" not considered firearms. I was wondering where the number came from. And now I am more confused than when I began.

567 Obdicut  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:49:24pm

re: #566 shreck

But why does it matter?

568 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 6:55:39pm

It bothered me. So I worried it out. Why else would I sort 64062 FFL holders. Other than being a nut.

569 shreck  Mon, Sep 5, 2011 7:01:29pm

So now I can go to bed somewhat happy and somewhat confused.


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