GOP Theme Song

Reposted quote from last thread:

Theirs is a brand of narcissism so total that they seem to lack, in whole or in part, the capacity for empathy...Their narcissism makes the evil dangerous not only because it motivates them to scapegoat others but also because it deprives them of the restraint that results from empathy and respect for others.

In addition to the fact that the evil need victims to sacrifice to their narcissism, their narcissism permits them to ignore the humanity of their victims as well...The blindness of the narcissist to others can extend even beyond a lack of empathy; narcissists may not "see" others at all.

There are boundaries to the individual soul. And in our dealings with each other we generally respect these boundaries. It is characteristic of--and prerequisite for--mental health both that our own ego boundaries should be clear and that we should clearly recognize the boundaries of others. We must know where we end and others begin.

-M. Scott Peck, The People of the Lie pg 136-137

Sure. Let them die. Let some father of his children die, I'm sure that won't wind up costing the taxpayers anything. Let their mother die. Let some fresh-out-of-college student, who is educated and ready to perform in the workplace, die because he skimped on health insurance. I'm sure we won't need his engineering degree. That part-time substitute teacher, let her die. Complications in childbirth? Well, the baby wasn't aborted, thank god, so now the mother can hemorrhage trying to do a home delivery and the baby can die stillborn.

Sorry to be so graphic and brutal but this is the world we're walking back into if these fuckers get their way.

what a blowhard...friggin millionaire

Image: EveryManAnEmperor.jpg

And that is why I will never like Ron Paul. He's a quack, always has been and will.

re: #6 HappyWarrior

And that is why I will never like Ron Paul. He's a quack, always has been and will.

Look at it this way...Ron Paul probably hasn't pulled a rectal thermometer out of someone's ass in twenty years. When Blitzer says, "You're a doctor." he's simply kissing Ron Paul's ass on TV. Ron Paul hasn't been a practicing physician in decades.

I still find it more disturbing the applause at Rick Perry's pride at executions in TX, given that it is known that innocent people were executed.

Here's Perry and the Tea Party crowd, circa 30AD:

To:Texas

From:Gov. Goodhair

Max Raabe

re: #7 darthstar

Look at it this way...Ron Paul probably hasn't pulled a rectal thermometer out of someone's ass in twenty years. When Blitzer says, "You're a doctor." he's simply kissing Ron Paul's ass on TV. Ron Paul hasn't been a practicing physician in decades.

not sure that's true...he's an OBGYN and had a lively practice last I heard a few years back

Filthy confederate.

Get rid of licensing and open competition in the medical field.

Yeah, that's a way to guarantee "American Exceptionalism". Maybe we can all get treated at the Church clinic, assuming they believe in vaccinations and don't require you to convert before being seen.

re: #7 darthstar

Look at it this way...Ron Paul probably hasn't pulled a rectal thermometer out of someone's ass in twenty years. When Blitzer says, "You're a doctor." he's simply kissing Ron Paul's ass on TV. Ron Paul hasn't been a practicing physician in decades.

I think Steve's right that he still practices.

And I'm supposed to condemn Krugman today. The truth hurts. The republican party is full of monsters.

re: #13 HappyWarrior

I think Steve's right that he still practices.

When, exactly, does he have time to practice? Can you imagine being his patient? I'd like to see Dr. Paul...Sure...he'll be in the office for three hours on September 29th...oh...sorry...those appointments are full. Does February 6th work for you?

re: #12 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

You can't have competition in the medical field. It's not going to fucking work. You can't get repeatable results. A hospital might have a great survival rate, but might not take a lot of complex cases. Shit like that is so fucking hard to research; most hospitals don't even keep, much less make public, the kind of statistics that'd be necessary to make a decision like that.

Fucking lunatic glibertarians who pretend everyone is goddamn omniscient. How does anyone fall for this bullshit?

re: #15 darthstar

When, exactly, does he have time to practice? Can you imagine being his patient? I'd like to see Dr. Paul...Sure...he'll be in the office for three hours on September 29th...oh...sorry...those appointments are full. Does February 6th work for you?

you're as bad as CNN...fact check it then

re: #17 albusteve

you're as bad as CNN...fact check it then

I don't get as much money as CNN.

re: #13 HappyWarrior

He last practiced in 1988.

re: #19 jaunte

He last practiced in 1988.

Shit...1988...that's like yesterday...plus 23 years.

re: #15 darthstar

When, exactly, does he have time to practice? Can you imagine being his patient? I'd like to see Dr. Paul...Sure...he'll be in the office for three hours on September 29th...oh...sorry...those appointments are full. Does February 6th work for you?

Exactly. Even a "brave iconoclast" like Ron Paul is in DC 90% of the time. The rest of the time he's making speeches to tea partiers who still can't figure out if they like him cuz he's not Jesus-y enough.

Still practicing medicine? Gimme a break.

re: #16 Obdicut

You can't have competition in the medical field. It's not going to fucking work. You can't get repeatable results. A hospital might have a great survival rate, but might not take a lot of complex cases. Shit like that is so fucking hard to research; most hospitals don't even keep, much less make public, the kind of statistics that'd be necessary to make a decision like that.

Fucking lunatic glibertarians who pretend everyone is goddamn omniscient. How does anyone fall for this bullshit?

Who needs a hospital when the guy down the street has a full set of surgical tools from Home Depot and works cheap?

re: #15 darthstar

When, exactly, does he have time to practice? Can you imagine being his patient? I'd like to see Dr. Paul...Sure...he'll be in the office for three hours on September 29th...oh...sorry...those appointments are full. Does February 6th work for you?

I've just heard the same that he still practices part time. I've heard the same about past OBGNY politicians. I don't disagree with your main point but I've heard that he's still a practicing doctor.

re: #19 jaunte

He last practiced in 1988.

I stand corrected then. Thanks.

re: #18 darthstar

I don't get as much money as CNN.

it's too hard...
no reason to trash Paul as an MD...especially when you are clueless

re: #22 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Weren't barbers the local surgeons of old?

He didn't say let him die. He said he would let him die (if he wasn't a relative), but a church or someone else somewhere would probably help him, maybe, just like used to happen before we were a unified society (socialist scum).

re: #21 palomino

Exactly. Even a "brave iconoclast" like Ron Paul is in DC 90% of the time. The rest of the time he's making speeches to tea partiers who still can't figure out if they like him cuz he's not Jesus-y enough.

Still practicing medicine? Gimme a break.

People who want to believe Ron Paul will suck on the cock of righteousness until they pass out before they'll admit he's full of shit...at best, he's a retired doctor...in his seventies. My dad's in his mid seventies...a retired doctor...but he just finally stopped seeing patients in the last year or so. Then again, he didn't run for public office...which is good, because he'd be just like Ron Paul.

"Hmmm. I have to choose between these two doctors. They're unlicensed, so I have now way of knowing they're even basically competent. I know. I'll commission a study of their practices, tracking down old patients (which will be tough, because it violates privacy laws, unless we're junking those as well) and doing a long-term study. Shouldn't cost more than fifty-thousand dollars to do. Yippee!"

re: #25 albusteve

it's too hard...
no reason to trash Paul as an MD...especially when you are clueless

I'm not trashing him as an MD. I'm saying he's not been a practicing MD in two or more decades...and apparently I was right (not bad for being clueless, eh?) Keep sucking.

BTW you're nto going to get any arguments from me about Ron Paul's ideas. A guy like him as president would be a disaster. Heck a guy like him chairing a major committee would be.

re: #22 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Who needs a hospital when the guy down the street has a full set of surgical tools from Home Depot and works cheap?

I once made perfectly functional sutures out of superglue. I'm a fuckin' doctor LOL.

re: #26 Amory Blaine

Weren't barbers the local surgeons of old?

Barbers and blacksmiths for dentists.

Nothing brutal about it -look that's what some of these violent cowards wan, and believe they are entitled to. Might as well just state it, outright.

re: #3 Obdicut

Sure. Let them die. Let some father of his children die, I'm sure that won't wind up costing the taxpayers anything. Let their mother die. Let some fresh-out-of-college student, who is educated and ready to perform in the workplace, die because he skimped on health insurance. I'm sure we won't need his engineering degree. That part-time substitute teacher, let her die. Complications in childbirth? Well, the baby wasn't aborted, thank god, so now the mother can hemorrhage trying to do a home delivery and the baby can die stillborn.

Sorry to be so graphic and brutal but this is the world we're walking back into if these fuckers get their way.

re: #30 darthstar

I'm not trashing him as an MD. I'm saying he's not been a practicing MD in two or more decades...and apparently I was right (not bad for being clueless, eh?) Keep sucking.

you presumptuous twit...I'm no fan of Paul, you got lucky

re: #22 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Who needs a hospital when the guy down the street has a full set of surgical tools from Home Depot and works cheap?

"Hold on, I'm not metric"

re: #35 albusteve

Next time, Steve, just look it up yourself.

I'll trash Ron Paul as an MD.

Paul (and his son) belongs to an organization of quacks (run by a woman who is associated with our old friend Art Robinson) that have a long history of marginal to highly questionable practices and positions, contrary the vast majority of modern medical science.

re: #37 Obdicut

Next time, Steve, just look it up yourself.

I didn't make the assertion...try to keep up

re: #16 Obdicut

You can't have competition in the medical field. It's not going to fucking work. You can't get repeatable results. A hospital might have a great survival rate, but might not take a lot of complex cases. Shit like that is so fucking hard to research; most hospitals don't even keep, much less make public, the kind of statistics that'd be necessary to make a decision like that.

Fucking lunatic glibertarians who pretend everyone is goddamn omniscient. How does anyone fall for this bullshit?

Infection rates are a start on a reasonable metric. Sure, there can be differences in the complexity of procedures, but prospective patients can get a start on deciding whether to choose EColiMotel6Hospital or SpicnSpanHospital.

There has been considerable progress in controlling the in-house spread of infections. More zealous attention to hand washing and to the thorough sanitation of surfaces pays off. Keeping close track of what goes wrong, where and when, and getting on top of it fast, pays off. Some hospitals have a better track record in this regard than others, and competition is the perfect tonic to inspire the laggards to a more determined effort.

And it starts with keeping the necessary records. Those with something to crow about may as well pride themselves on it; that sort of cleanliness doesn't come without cost in terms of abrasion to skin etc. as well as sheer man-hours on task.

Those with nothing good to report on that front, well, competition can give them a reason to get with the program.

If there are any "Christians" who cheered, they had better hope that God was asleep at the switch.

Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

Matthew 7:23

re: #14 Amory Blaine

And I'm supposed to condemn Krugman today. The truth hurts. The republican party is full of monsters.

Paul Krugman dropped a turd of a post yesterday. I thought it wrongheaded and full of BDS. I maintain that when it comes to matters of war Krugman is a hack.

However, when it comes to economics he does know some things. So in the interests of balance, here's an excerpt from the kind of post Paul Krugman should write:

The best guide to recent events is actually a paper written this spring, by Paul De Grauwe (pdf). I have to admit that when I first read De Grauwe’s paper I didn’t grasp the full force of his argument about liquidity crises; but he now looks absolutely prescient.

The key point, which I’ve finally taken fully on board, is that in addition to the huge problems of adjustment created by a rigid exchange rate in the aftermath of a bubble, the fact that European nations no longer have their own currencies leaves them vulnerable to self-fulfilling debt crises – in effect bank runs on governments rather than banks (although those too).

To head off this risk, somebody – the EFSF, the ECB, whatever – has to be ready to act as lender of last resort; Eurobonds would have served much the same purpose.

By resigning from the ECB, Juergen Stark has conveyed, deliberately or not, the message that there will be no such lender of last resort, that there isn’t enough political cohesion in the eurozone to stand behind countries under market attack. And this translates directly into soaring spreads for Spain and Italy; the self-fulfilling crisis is on.

If you go to the full post, you'll see the links he provides. He sticks to his expertise and backs up his conclusions. That is a good piece.

re: #35 albusteve

you presumptuous twit...I'm no fan of Paul, you got lucky

No...I just pay attention. Anyone who has spent the last decade plus on TV as much as they have in Washington can't have a functioning business - whether it be a medical practice or a nursery or a plumbing outfit - and be a full time politician and TV personality.

Steve Martin: Theodoric of York

[Link: www.hulu.com...]

re: #27 Naso Tang

He didn't say let him die. He said he would let him die (if he wasn't a relative), but a church or someone else somewhere would probably help him, maybe, just like used to happen before we were a unified society (socialist scum).

So he said, 'let him die, unless a church or someone wants to help out'?

I'd feel more comfortable with that if so many of these people didn't seem to have a demonic version of Jefferson's Bible, where instead of all the miracles being edited out, every reference to one's obligation to the poor has been razored.

re: #43 darthstar

No...I just pay attention. Anyone who has spent the last decade plus on TV as much as they have in Washington can't have a functioning business - whether it be a medical practice or a nursery or a plumbing outfit - and be a full time politician and TV personality.

but you didn't know that, did you?

re: #29 Obdicut

"Hmmm. I have to choose between these two doctors. They're unlicensed, so I have now way of knowing they're even basically competent. I know. I'll commission a study of their practices, tracking down old patients (which will be tough, because it violates privacy laws, unless we're junking those as well) and doing a long-term study. Shouldn't cost more than fifty-thousand dollars to do. Yippee!"

I had to listen to that clip again, and it cut off when Blitzer tried to keep the question going. However what I caught second time was waffle about costs increasing, including inflation. What the hell does that have to do with who pays, whether church or family?

Then I heard practice "alternative" medicine!

What the fuck is alternative medicine? Witch doctors?

re: #40 lostlakehiker

Some hospitals have a better track record in this regard than others, and competition is the perfect tonic to inspire the laggards to a more determined effort.

Yes, and less regulation is obviously the answer, lol:

"I created a city where the artist would not fear the censor. Where the scientist would not be bound by petty morality ..."

re: #40 lostlakehiker

Infection rates are a start on a reasonable metric.

Yay, leading with an assertion with absolutely no proof or even logic to it.

Why are they a reasonable metric? What does the infection rate of a hospital have to do with the likelihood of them carrying out a complicated vascular surgery well?

And how are you going to get the information about their infection rates?

And it starts with keeping the necessary records. Those with something to crow about may as well pride themselves on it; that sort of cleanliness doesn't come without cost in terms of abrasion to skin etc. as well as sheer man-hours on task.

It does't come, generally, without bottom-up change, as detailed by Gawande is his thorough handling of the subject in the book Better. You might want to read it. Man-hours on task are actually rather useless; you have to do it the right way.

Those with nothing good to report on that front, well, competition can give them a reason to get with the program.

Again: how would you know you could trust the figures from the hospitals? And if you had the infection rate information, why on earth would you believe that magically meant everything else at the hospital was at that level of quality?

re: #30 darthstar

I'm not trashing him as an MD. I'm saying he's not been a practicing MD in two or more decades...and apparently I was right (not bad for being clueless, eh?) Keep sucking.

Alternative medicine. You won't trash him for that?

re: #38 freetoken

"Only Ron Paul believes in genuine health freedom. He's the creator of the Health Freedom Protection Act, a bill that would reestablish Free Speech provisions for makers of superfoods, herbs, nutritional supplements and other natural remedies." - Mike Adams of NaturalNews

Well, at least it's out in the open.

re: #34 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

wan

Want

re: #40 lostlakehiker

Sure, there can be differences in the complexity of procedures, but prospective patients can get a start on deciding whether to choose EColiMotel6Hospital or SpicnSpanHospital.

Are you serious? Do you have a hospital selection list in your iPhone based on a google search, if you happen to wake up in an ambulance while in (name your city), and you will pull up the navigation for the driver if he is going to one you don't like?

The truth is, of course, that two thirds of the hospitals in the US are non-profit hospitals-- and that's no even counting the public hospitals. They don't want to capture more business, they want to serve the communities that they're in and they're drowning already, thanks to our lack of comprehensive insurance coverage. They need subsidies of all sorts, and the insurance companies past costs along to us as well. That's the reality of how health care gets delivered in the US; two-thirds of hospital care is from non-profit institutions.

Yet somehow 'competition' will be a magic goddamn bullet.

Shit.

Oh, except in rural areas, where most of the hospitals are either non-profits or public. I mean, there's not a lot of money in providing health care out in the boonies, so private hospitals really couldn't give a shit. Yet somehow 'competition' will make those public hospitals get more efficient.

re: #55 Obdicut

The truth is, of course, that two thirds of the hospitals in the US are non-profit hospitals-- and that's no even counting the public hospitals. They don't want to capture more business, they want to serve the communities that they're in and they're drowning already, thanks to our lack of comprehensive insurance coverage. They need subsidies of all sorts, and the insurance companies past costs along to us as well. That's the reality of how health care gets delivered in the US; two-thirds of hospital care is from non-profit institutions.

Yet somehow 'competition' will be a magic goddamn bullet.

Shit.

But I thought profit was the end all and be all of all businesses? Obviously, we need to privatize all of them and get businessmen involved in the process.

re: #45 SanFranciscoZionist

So he said, 'let him die, unless a church or someone wants to help out'?

Some of the most vicious people in the world think everyone else is supposed to be at their mercy, when in fact they are completely devoid of it.

Dumb confederates.

So half of them can fail. //

re: #57 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

But I thought profit was the end all and be all of all businesses? Obviously, we need to privatize all of them and get businessmen involved in the process.

re: #50 Naso Tang

Alternative medicine. You won't trash him for that?

He's not a doctor any more, in my book. I could give a fuck what he did twenty years ago. It's the fact that he's still a viable politician that bugs me now.

re: #59 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

So half of them can fail. //

Failure just means they didn't love Jesus enough.

Or so I've been told.

re: #40 lostlakehiker

Infection rates are a start on a reasonable metric. Sure, there can be differences in the complexity of procedures, but prospective patients can get a start on deciding whether to choose EColiMotel6Hospital of SpicnSpanHospital.

There has been considerable progress in controlling the in-house spread of infections. More zealous attention to hand washing and to the thorough sanitation of surfaces pays off. Keeping close track of what goes wrong, where and when, and getting on top of it fast, pays off. Some hospitals have a better track record in this regard than others, and competition is the perfect tonic to inspire the laggards to a more determined effort.

And it starts with keeping the necessary records. Those with something to crow about may as well pride themselves on it; that sort of cleanliness doesn't come without cost in terms of abrasion to skin etc. as well as sheer man-hours on task.

Those with nothing good to report on that front, well, competition can give them a reason to get with the program.

While this is a tech post, you may find some parallells between the SLA and your proposed methodology.

Jane, you ignorant slut...

University of Chicago hospitals just needs to get more competitive! I bet it'd be more competitive if it started mainly doing boob jobs and liposuction and gastric bypasses, and got rid of all that boring, unprofitable "take five bullets out of a sixteen year old girl who got shot in a drive by and has no insurance" thing. That kind of medicine is just not competitive.

The purpose of a business is to make a profit and the purpose of a hospital is to deliver health care. I'm afraid I regard these as mostly opposing purposes.

If businesspeople got involved in health care they would immediately start dropping their 'non-profitable services', and who could blame them? Such things hurt their bottom line. Raising prices may not help as those services may end up priced out of the range of many 'customers'.

So a hospital run as a business is either going to be a barely profitable one or one that delivers only those services that pad the profits.

That won't be good for a lot of people, nor for the country.

Is Gold in Fort Knox Real? Ron Paul Wants to Know

Audit the Fort!

re: #55 Obdicut

The truth is, of course, that two thirds of the hospitals in the US are non-profit hospitals-- and that's no even counting the public hospitals.

Rubbish (sorry). They are all for profit. They all want to have money to pay the best doctor rates, buy the best equipment, have the nicest lounges, and build more departments; to serve the community of course. They have budgets, P&L and balance sheets. All good capitalist stuff.

The only difference is that they don't pay dividends to shareholders (just like government run hospitals, like the VA, don't) and they don't pay corporate taxes (as if the for profit ones do after expenses/).

re: #61 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Failure just means they didn't love Jesus enough.

Or so I've been told.

It ain't easy loving Jesus enough...

re: #66 jaunte

Is Gold in Fort Knox Real? Ron Paul Wants to Know

Audit the Fort!

Can we just let him in to examine the gold and then lock the doors behind him?

/

re: #66 jaunte

Is Gold in Fort Knox Real? Ron Paul Wants to Know

Audit the Fort!

Take it all out and stack it on the front lawn for the cameras.

re: #63 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Jane, you ignorant slut...

what the fuck is wrong with conservatives? they only give a shit about their fellow countrymen when it is in their immediate best interest.

re: #67 Naso Tang

No, it's not rubbish. They really are non-profit. What the fuck are you talking about? Are you just defining to redefine 'non-profit' for some bizarre reason?

re: #69 Dark_Falcon

Can we just let him in to examine the gold and then lock the doors behind him?

/

Just don't let him hold your golf balls.

re: #55 Obdicut

I wasn't being mean. Explain if you disagree.

re: #70 darthstar

Take it all out and stack it on the front lawn for the cameras.

Can't

Goldfinger and Oddjob got it all

re: #75 Naso Tang

Dude, it is factually true that about 2/3rds of hospitals in the US are public-- in terms of volume. I know the rural ones tend more to be public ones.

So what exactly is 'rubbish'. They really are non-profit. You've kind of decided the 'only difference' between a non-profit organization and a for-profit one is the non-profit one isn't trying to make a profit.

Um, yeah. That's the fucking point.

So what is 'rubbish'?

Jesus, can you just imagine Paul when he was a practicing OBGYN. Ladies, Doctor Crypt Keeper will see you now ... so spread 'em. We accept payment in the form of gold, silver, and chickens stuffed with ammunition. By the way we recommend the services of our local medical shaman for the lingering horror you're about to experience.

All the gold
In California
Is in a bank
in the middle
of Beverly Hills
In somebody
else's name.
-Larry Gatlin

re: #78 goddamnedfrank

Oh, I'm sure that Ron Paul likes good old greenbacks just fine. Probably even owns government bonds.

re: #79 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

All the gold
In California
Is in a bank
in the middle
of Beverly Hills
In somebody
else's name.
-Larry Gatlin

You had to bring up that song...

re: #81 darthstar

You had to bring up that song...

[Video]

But that is some sweet satin in those shirts.

re: #79 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Sebastian Janikowski just tied the record for the longest field goal in NFL history

a 63 yarder (that would have been good from at least another 5)

re: #73 Obdicut

No, it's not rubbish. They really are non-profit. What the fuck are you talking about? Are you just defining to redefine 'non-profit' for some bizarre reason?

Oooh. Touchy tonight. I'm not trying to rile you. I simply mean that non profit doesn't mean charity. It just means what I already said; not for profit outside the operation of the enterprise and with certain tax exemptions.

A "non profit hospital" still runs to make more money than it spends (or make up the difference by grants), or else it would not even keep up with inflation, let alone achieve the ambitions of its board of directors.

In all manner it is still run as a capitalist operation, except net profit is put back into the business instead of paying some investor in the Caymans.

re: #81 darthstar

Saw them in concert once and they substituted "somebody else's name" with "Kenny Roger's name".

Right after Kenny had done "Coward of the County"; "The Gatlin Boys came calling; there were three of them."

By the way, I had this fucking earworm stuck in my head this morning for some ungodly reason...

re: #74 darthstar

Just don't let him hold your golf balls.

It would be fun if a cartoon was made where Oddjob showed up as Ron Paul toured Ft. Know and spun Paul's head around to look backwards before shoving said head back up his ass.

But only if it were a cartoon. I don't actually want to see Ron Paul hurt.

re: #81 darthstar

You had to bring up that song...

[Video]

I never was much of a Country Western music fan! Yeah, there would be "a" song now and then, but overall ,, eh

About 5 years ago we went to Dollywood and the Gatlin Brothers were in concert there ( free with the park ticket package we had)

Went ,,watched ,,, listened ,, ENJOYED ,,, very good!!

re: #84 Naso Tang

I simply mean that non profit doesn't mean charity.

And if I'd claimed it meant 'charity' then you could say 'rubbish'. But I didn't.

A "non profit hospital" still runs to make more money than it spends (or make up the difference by grants), or else it would not even keep up with inflation, let alone achieve the ambitions of its board of directors.

This is not true. I have no idea why you think it is. A non-profit hospital, often associated with a university, is a complex beastie to be sure, but all your'e actually saying is "A hospital wants to have the money to do what it wants to do". No shit, sherlock.

But as for 'making' that money, no. Most new wings at non-profit hospitals are raised by funding drives; grants provide a ton of the salaries of doctors, researchers, etc. Unless you're now suddenly defining a bequest by an alumni as money the hospital 'made', which you probably are, because fuck definitions.

In all manner it is still run as a capitalist operation, except net profit is put back into the business instead of paying some investor in the Caymans.

No. It does not run as a capitalist operation. Non-profit hospitals run on the assumption of funding from outside sources rather than internal profitability. You're wrong, and I have no idea why the hell you're arguing such an obviously wrong point.

Paul's an evil crackpot. The current metric would at least evaluate the patient's ability to be a "participating citizen" before the financial plug is yanked.

re: #85 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Saw them in concert once and they substituted "somebody else's name" with "Kenny Roger's name".

Right after Kenny had done "Coward of the County"; "The Gatlin Boys came calling; there were three of them."

I went to a number of country shows when I was younger...George Strait, Bocephus, Oak Ridge Boys (with these gals - The Forester Sisters...now there was some fuckable harmony.)

re: #85 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Was kind of a joke between the Gatlin's and Rogers.

I've seen the Gatlins three times live. Best trio harmony I've ever heard.

Good goddamn night.

Eh eggs/omelets! Let 'em die!!

Less competition that way!!@

re: #64 Obdicut

University of Chicago hospitals just needs to get more competitive! I bet it'd be more competitive if it started mainly doing boob jobs and liposuction and gastric bypasses, and got rid of all that boring, unprofitable "take five bullets out of a sixteen year old girl who got shot in a drive by and has no insurance" thing. That kind of medicine is just not competitive.

they should ask paul point blank if it would be ok for a private hospital to turn you away because you are black

re: #73 Obdicut

No, it's not rubbish. They really are non-profit. What the fuck are you talking about? Are you just defining to redefine 'non-profit' for some bizarre reason?

Sometimes debating with you makes me feel I'm in the Reagan library. I'm making a simple economic observation and you get all worked up.

Let me put it another way. Go get treatment in a "non profit" hospital without insurance, and I can guarantee you that they will send you a bill, and pass it to a collection agency if not paid, and on top of that you would find that the bill would be as much as twice it would have been had you had insurance from a plan they were connected with.

If that isn't capitalist for profit, I don't know what is.

re: #92 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Was kind of a joke between the Gatlin's and Rogers.

I've seen the Gatlins three times live. Best trio harmony I've ever heard.

Gotta love that video. They've got corded mics and they appear in about five different positions on the old fire wagon.

re: #95 SpaceJesus

they should ask paul point blank if it would be ok for a private hospital to turn you away because you are black

I cannot imagine that he would say no. He's absolutely committed to his deranged cause.

re: #90 Gepetto

Paul's an evil crackpot. The current metric would at least evaluate the patient's ability to be a "participating citizen" before the financial plug is yanked.

"Sorry sir, but according to our records, you'll no longer be able to contribute to society at what we feel is a competitive level. We can however provide you with a variety of self termination options."

re: #90 Gepetto

Paul's an evil crackpot. The current metric would at least evaluate the patient's ability to be a "participating citizen" before the financial plug is yanked.

What's the 'current metric'?

re: #89 Obdicut

I have no idea why the hell you're arguing such an obviously wrong point.

This is a favorite phrase of yours when you have a disagreement. I think I have already pointed out before that it is not a self flattering position to hold.

Note that I didn't start this meaning to pull your chain, and I apologize for saying "rubbish" when I could have used a gentler word; but as the flush has already started...so we go.

re: #96 Naso Tang

Your arugment is seriously that a non-profit place isn't a non-profit if it bills you?

That may be your own personal pet definition. It's not what the words actually mean. Non-profits can charge for services. It doesn't make them not non-profits.

According to you, the only thing that counts as a non-profit is a pure charity.

All you actually mean is 'non-profit hospitals aren't pure charities'.

Yeah. No shit, Sherlock. So what? What does that have to do with the point I was making about competitiveness? Try to actually connect it to the topic at hand, instead of just letting me know that you've decided to define words however the fuck you want them and not according to actual usage.

I'm worn out. Goodnight, all.

re: #100 SanFranciscoZionist

What's the 'current metric'?

A system that really never caught in here !!

//

re: #103 Dark_Falcon

I'm worn out. Goodnight, all.

I don;t think we need to hear about you wearing yourself out!!
/

re: #104 sattv4u2

A system that really never caught in here !!

//

I remember learning metric in class as a small child, and being told that we would need it because by the time we grew up, the United States would be on the metric system.

That was thirty years ago.

No progress.

re: #103 Dark_Falcon

And I really am now as well.

re: #106 SanFranciscoZionist

I remember learning metric in class as a small child, and being told that we would need it because by the time we grew up, the United States would be on the metric system.

That was thirty years ago.

No progress.

Same here ,, except you can add 7 (or so) years

re: #102 Obdicut

You are no fun tonight, intellectually or humorously, and I object to drunken use of 4 letter words when speaking to me, let alone being just another dingaling.

Past midnight here. Goodnight, and thanks for the stimulation.

re: #109 Naso Tang

You are no fun tonight, intellectually or humorously, and I object to drunken use of 4 letter words when speaking to me, let alone being just another dingaling.

Past midnight here. Goodnight, and thanks for the stimulation.

Did someone say Dingaling? Well, that's a good song to go to bed by...

re: #106 SanFranciscoZionist

re: #108 sattv4u2

Same here ,, except you can add 7 (or so) 10 years

(keeping it metric!)

re: #2 goddamnedfrank

Reposted quote from last thread:

I've mentioned here before that Dr. Peck was my therapist when I got home from Vietnam. I wasn't exactly a basket-case but I was exhibiting some pretty alarming symptoms, especially insomnia and depression. He helped me a great deal, especially in strengthening my resiliency and ability to cope. Both of these have served me very well in the years since.

re: #110 darthstar

Did someone say Dingaling? Well, that's a good song to go to bed by...

[Video]

With your OWN DingALing?

"If they would rather die,'' said Scrooge Paul, "they had better do it, and decrease the surplus population."

Trouble is, Marley and three Spirits probably gave up on Paul ages ago.
No hope for redemption here.

re: #100 SanFranciscoZionist

sorry, i guess its not the current metric quite yet. Zeke Emmanuel, until January was special adviser for health policy to the director of OMB. These are his terms regarding how to ethically determine how society rations health care.

I can't cope with this level of fail. I'm going to just sit here and listen to Arcade Fire and hope that people are paying attention to what these lunatics are cheering for.

re: #115 Gepetto

sorry, i guess its not the current metric quite yet. Zeke Emmanuel, until January was special adviser for health policy to the director of OMB. These are his terms regarding how to ethically determine how society rations health care.

Oh, so bullshit then.

re: #116 Lidane

I can't cope with this level of fail. I'm going to just sit here and listen to Arcade Fire and hope that people are paying attention to what these lunatics are cheering for.

"WE JUST CHEERED FOR THE DEATH OF A 35 YEAR OLD MAN! HOORAY!"

Right, now I'm depressed again. :(

re: #117 SanFranciscoZionist

Deth Panils

One of the passages written by Emanuel and used as evidence by Palin and others that he would favor withholding medical care from those who aren’t productive members of society include a 1996 contribution to the Hastings Center Report, in which he said that under the “civic republican or deliberative democratic” construct, “services provided to individuals who are irreversibly prevented from being or becoming participating citizens are not basic and should not be guaranteed. An obvious example is not guaranteeing health services to patients with dementia. A less obvious example is guaranteeing neuropsychological services to ensure children with learning disabilities can read and learn to reason."

Is he saying, as Palin and others have suggested, that those who aren’t “participating citizens” should have no guarantee to health care?

“No,” Emanuel says, “and I think I made it pretty clear I wasn’t endorsing that view, I was analyzing that perspective and what it might mean in practical terms. The rest of the text around that quote made it made it pretty clear I was trying to analyze it and understand it, not endorse it.”
[Link: abcnews.go.com...]

What Paul was advocating by the time he finished was not actually individual responsibility, but complete irresponsibility -- that you just buy insurance or not as you decide, and if you end up needing medical care without insurance and without being able to pay for it, you just find others (i.e., charitable organizations if any can be found) to provide the resources for you, knowing that you probably won't really be refused.

Alan Grayson Blasts Tea Party Debate Audience's Reaction To Health Care Question: 'It's Sadism'

What you saw tonight is something much more sinister than not having a healthcare plan. It's sadism, pure and simple. It's the same impulse that led people in the Coliseum to cheer when the lions ate the Christians. And that seems to be where we are heading -- bread and circuses, without the bread. The world that Hobbes wrote about -- "the war of all against all."

re: #122 Shiplord Kirel

Alan Grayson Blasts Tea Party Debate Audience's Reaction To Health Care Question: 'It's Sadism'

It's not sadism. It's compassionate conservatism, y'all!

Watching now. Too much Bachmann. Too much Bachmann... _{too much Bachmann...}

re: #118 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"WE JUST CHEERED FOR THE DEATH OF A 35 YEAR OLD MAN! HOORAY!"

Less competition for me!

And MINE!!

Stupid wingnuts.

re: #125 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Stupid wingnuts.conservatives.

ftfy, to be more specific

re: #118 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"WE JUST CHEERED FOR THE DEATH OF A 35 YEAR OLD MAN! HOORAY!"

Evolution is a lie! (But Darwinism is the shit!)

i wonder what it would be like to know a republican

re: #123 Lidane

Conservatism IS compassion! Oh, yeah, and war is peace, ignorance is strength, and freedom is slavery.

re: #129 Shiplord Kirel

Conservatism IS compassion! Oh, yeah, and war is peace, ignorance is strength, and freedom is slavery.

Man should not consider his material possession his own, but as common to all, so as to share them without hesitation when others are in need.
- Thomas Aquinas, Communist agitator

doctors don't need to be licensed
i totally regret vaccinating all those young girls against cervical cancer
omg taxes are so incredibly high right now
OBAMACARE WILL DESTROY AMERICA! I'M RUNNING FOR PRES JUST TO STOP THIS ANTI-CHRIST COME IN THE FORM OF POLICY

stream of consciousness breaking down...down...down

re: #120 jaunte

oh, so bullshit then.
I would much rather take my chances with rationed care (and there will be rationed care, its already starting), than with Paul's self pay (in toto) or die approach.

re: #130 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Sounds like a foreigner.

we don't need the government to do anything for us
except stop brown people from moving in next door

re: #128 SpaceJesus

i wonder what it would be like to know a republican

They're ok to talk about the weather and perhaps superficial entertainment. Otherwise...can't be trusted, not the way they are going these days.

Goodnight all. Try not to get sick.

re: #133 jaunte

Sounds like a foreigner.

What kind of dirty liberal would be quoted as saying "Beware of the person of one book"?

Eurotrash.

re: #134 JasonA

we don't need the government to do anything for us
except stop brown people from moving in next door

Last line is one of my favorites of any lyric I've ever heard:

You don't have to live next to me
Just give me my equality
Everybody knows about...Mississippi Goddamn

(1964)

I didn't hear Ron Paul say "let 'em die". I am not a Ron Paul fan. I think he is a nut. But I think it is extreme to say that is what he intended. The vociferous members of the audience certainly seemed to be saying "let 'em die".

re: #139 luzbone

I didn't hear Ron Paul say "let 'em die". I am not a Ron Paul fan. I think he is a nut. But I think it is extreme to say that is what he intended. The vociferous members of the audience certainly seemed to be saying "let 'em die".

They're called constituents.

re: #135 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

can republicans have friends? is that ideologically allowed? or is it just "me and my guns and my gold against all the browns and commies" 24/7?

re: #139 luzbone

I didn't hear Ron Paul say "let 'em die". I am not a Ron Paul fan. I think he is a nut. But I think it is extreme to say that is what he intended. The vociferous members of the audience certainly seemed to be saying "let 'em die".

Those would be Ron Paul voters. They know exactly what he meant, which is "let 'em die".

re: #128 SpaceJesus

i wonder what it would be like to know a republican

*smooch*
Gives cooties!
LOL!
Not sure how much longer I'll be a Republican, though.

Rick Perry is of course correct that Social Security is a Ponzi scheme. That was known from the get-go, when the model of it was designed for Bismarck. This has never been a secret, save from people who can't add and subtract. Since that is the vast majority of the population, even in the chattering classes, this revelation has caused much dismay.

Meanwhile, although Perry did thereby illustrate the Blind Pig Rule (even a blind pig can find an acorn occasionally), his views on science and practically everything else would have been considered obscurantist in fourteenth-century Siena. This is the real issue.

Mitt: We're the party of legal law-abiding citizens.

re: #143 Floral Giraffe

Not sure how much longer I'll be a Republican, though.

I couldn't imagine being a Republican in the current party climate. The loonies are running the asylum.

re: #143 Floral Giraffe

fascinating.

how did you become republican?

re: #141 SpaceJesus

can republicans have friends? is that ideologically allowed? or is it just "me and my guns and my gold against all the browns and commies" 24/7?

Who knows what goes through those sociopath's minds. They'll even bust up their own families and scream about their superior family values everyone else. Some values. Very self-loathing, confused people, I'm afraid.

re: #144 MikeySDCA

Rick Perry is of course correct that Social Security is a Ponzi scheme.

No, he is not.

re: #147 SpaceJesus

fascinating.

how did you become republican?

I used to be one. But I left that lifestyle choice as soon as was humanly possible /thereisagod

re: #150 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I used to be one. But I left that lifestyle choice as soon as was humanly possible /thereisagod

It gets better.

A memorable moment from tonight’s GOP debate: thunderous applause for Ron Paul’s call to let people without private health insurance die.

I've watched this clip three times now, and I'm still looking for the moment where Paul said to let them die. You can say whatever you want about Rep. Paul, but he never said to let them die.

re: #144 MikeySDCA

Rick Perry is of course correct that Social Security is a Ponzi scheme.

Stopped reading here. The fail was so strong in this one sentence that the rest of the post just faded into nothing.

re: #147 SpaceJesus

I left when I noticed that Washington State does not include party registration on its form.

re: #144 MikeySDCA

Social Security is a Ponzi scheme

Repeated, mindless, parroted cliché.

re: #149 JasonA

No, he is not.

Technically, it is

It takes your money to pay 'other people" with the promise you'll be paid in the future with other peoples monies

A Ponzi scheme is a fraudulent investment operation that pays returns to separate investors, not from any actual profit earned by the organization, but from their own money or money paid by subsequent investors.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

You may not like the term because of the negative connotation, but it is what it is

re: #151 JasonA

It gets better.

It gets WAY better!

re: #152 Kid A

I've watched this clip three times now, and I'm still looking for the moment where Paul said to let them die. You can say whatever you want about Rep. Paul, but he never said to let them die.

You're right. According to Paul the man chose to die because he didn't sink a quarter of his take home income into health insurance.

re: #156 sattv4u2

It takes your money to pay 'other people" with the promise you'll be paid in the future with other peoples monies

Sounds like a typical insurance policy.

"fraudulent" "profit"

re: #156 sattv4u2

Technically, it is

No, it is not.

re: #154 laZardo

I left when I noticed that Washington State does not include party registration on its form.

Texas doesn't have party registration either. You just register to vote.

The only time party comes into play is during the primaries. When you vote in a party primary, your voter card gets stamped with that party name, locking you out of the other party's primaries for something like two years.

re: #158 JasonA

You're right. According to Paul the man chose to die because he didn't sink a quarter of his take home income into health insurance.

Again, did Paul say "Let him die?"

Ahem:

Having thus in a few words, opened the merits of the case, I shall now proceed to the plan I have to propose, which is,

To create a national fund, out of which there shall be paid to every person, when arrived at the age of twenty-one years, the sum of fifteen pounds sterling, as a compensation in part, for the loss of his or her natural inheritance, by the introduction of the system of landed property:

And also, the sum of ten pounds per annum, during life, to every person now living, of the age of fifty years, and to all others as they shall arrive at that age.

You know who said that? Thomas Paine.

Edit Addendum: Remember, 21 and 50 years was very much "old age" back then.

re: #163 Kid A

Again, did Paul say "Let him die?"

Again, you're right.

Now tell me that what Paul said was actually better.

re: #164 laZardo

You know who said that? Thomas Paine.

Pfft. Everyone knows he was just a librul commie.

re: #144 MikeySDCA

Rick Perry is of course correct that Social Security is a Ponzi scheme.

Ridiculous. Ponzi schemes rely on false advertising and present themselves as investments. Social Security is an aspect of the American social contract, well defined, understood and with nothing sneaky of underhanded about it. The fact that a bunch of me-me-now narcissists have chosen to misrepresent it doesn't alter reality.

You can't tell the difference between a Ponzi scheme and Social Security?

We surely won't get anywhere if its another talking point-a-thon.

re: #161 JasonA

No, it is not.

Well,,, you've convinced ME!

re: #166 Lidane

Pfft. Everyone knows he was just a librul commie.

Thomas Paine was a lunatic radical. But he was OUR lunatic radical. Until he took off for France, anyway.

re: #166 Lidane

Pfft. Everyone knows he was just a librul commie.

Paine with an "e"?

What kind of French spelling is that!!!Q@

re: #169 sattv4u2

Well,,, you've convinced ME!

I really don't give two shits about convincing you. If you've made it to your age without figuring out what a Ponzi scheme is then I have no hope of getting through to you.

re: #167 goddamnedfrank

Ridiculous. Ponzi schemes rely on false advertising and present themselves as investments. Social Security is an aspect of the American social contract, well defined, understood and with nothing sneaky of underhanded about it. The fact that a bunch of me-me-now narcissists have chosen to misrepresent it doesn't alter reality.

Give it time.

Every con today is a blathertarian, until they have an accident.

Then, watch them squeal I PAID INTO THE SYSTEM THIS IS MINNNE!!!

Fucking con assholes.

re: #172 JasonA

I really don't give two shits about convincing you. If you've made it to your age without figuring out what a Ponzi scheme is then I have no hope of getting through to you.

Seriously. Why bother.

re: #172 JasonA

I really don't give two shits about convincing you. If you've made it to your age without figuring out what a Ponzi scheme is then I have no hope of getting through to you.

Like I said,,, I'm convinced!

Social Security was intended to pay to the receiver what that receiver and their employers had paid into the account over the working life of the receiver.

Thus, it was not intended to be a Ponzi scheme.

Period.

Since then SS has been expanded and included additional benefits, which require (and over time will increase) redistribution of tax money. This is an enlarged vision of Social Security, but one made in public through laws. This again is not a Ponzi scheme but a government program to help the poor.

Social Security to See Payout Exceed Pay-In This Year

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

the system is destined to collapse because the earnings, if any, are less than the payments to investors

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

That darn con asshole publication, the New York Times!

It should also be noted that the subsequent financial difficulties have arisen because the lifespan of the average American has increased, meaning that payouts will exceed what would have been envisioned even 50 years ago.

This is a bad thing?

re: #158 JasonA

You're right. According to Paul the man chose to die because he didn't sink a quarter of his take home income into health insurance.

Yep. Suicide by lack of insurance, don'tcha know.

re: #173 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Every con today is a blathertarian, until they have an accident.

Then, watch them squeal I PAID INTO THE SYSTEM THIS IS MINNNE!!!

Or, to echo the Tea Party idiots,

KEEP YER GUBMINT HANDS OFF MAH MEDICARE AND SOCIAL SECURITY!

There's nothing wrong with Social Security that eliminating the salary cap won't fix.

Ah well

Have to go set up for NFL wrap ups (unless the last game goes into overtime)

BBL

the system is destined to collapse because the earnings, if any, are less than the payments to investors

SS is not an investment. An investment is x paid into y with the hope of a profit. SS is current earners paying for current beneficiaries.

Also, if you want to make SS more efficient, is means testing really all that bad? I'm sorry, but if you retire with a pension and every health benefit known to man, you do NOT need SS or Medicare. Can we just take care of those in need?

re: #183 Kid A

To be more accurate, among other things SS is an implementation of a fiscal policy and a monetary policy (indirectly).

When an employee has SS deducted, and the employer pays their share, that is money that is essentially taken out of circulation in the economy unless the government then spends that same amount through some other means.

Many people don't realize this.

This makes SS different than a private savings account (IRA, SEP, etc.).

SS is exactly what its first name implies, a social contract between the whole nation and the payer/payee to ensure that people when they are old are not totally penniless, like what occurred in the "good old days".

The Pro Life Party finds a death panel it likes.

re: #185 freetoken

To be more accurate, among other things SS is an implementation of a fiscal policy and a monetary policy (indirectly).

When an employee has SS deducted, and the employer pays their share, that is money that is essentially taken out of circulation in the economy unless the government then spends that same amount through some other means.

Many people don't realize this.

This makes SS different than a private savings account (IRA, SEP, etc.).

SS is exactly what its first name implies, a social contract between the whole nation and the payer/payee to ensure that people when they are old are not totally penniless, like what occurred in the "good old days".

When you could be sure that your money was always backed by something that gave it actual value? When people could choose of their own free will to be charitable?

re: #185 freetoken

To be more accurate, among other things SS is an implementation of a fiscal policy and a monetary policy (indirectly).

When an employee has SS deducted, and the employer pays their share, that is money that is essentially taken out of circulation in the economy unless the government then spends that same amount through some other means.

Many people don't realize this.

This makes SS different than a private savings account (IRA, SEP, etc.).

SS is exactly what its first name implies, a social contract between the whole nation and the payer/payee to ensure that people when they are old are not totally penniless, like what occurred in the "good old days".

Do you agree with my post at #184?

re: #188 Kid A

Do you agree with my post at #184?

Well, if someone has already paid into SS then I think that they have a right to collect what was in the contract at the time of the payment. To do otherwise would be to defraud them.

re: #189 freetoken

Well, if someone has already paid into SS then I think that they have a right to collect what was in the contract at the time of the payment. To do otherwise would be to defraud them.

What contract? I don't recall ever walking into a SS office and signing a contract, is the contract implied?

re: #190 Kid A

What contract? I don't recall ever walking into a SS office and signing a contract, is the contract implied?

It's the law of the land, passed by Congress. To not give people their payments back would be in violation of what the law explicitly intended to do.

re: #191 freetoken

It's the law of the land, passed by Congress. To not give people their payments back would be in violation of what the law explicitly intended to do.

You specified a contract.

re: #191 freetoken

So, means testing is non-negotiable with you?

I am currently uninsured. I am trying to get into a job where I can somehow afford a plan with a deductible that won't bust my meager bank account.

Watching the video makes me want to punch something.

Fortunately, I have my violent video games. :3

re: #192 Kid A

You specified a contract.

The contract being the one codified by law between the government and the American people.

re: #192 Kid A

You specified a contract.

Laws are contracts. They are our most official, formal forms of contracts. That's why the Constitution is rightly called a "covenant", which is the sacralized form of a "contract".

re: #194 laZardo

Washington Basic Health.

I don't know the specifics of your visa situation, but as soon as you meet the residency and other requirements do apply and get on the waiting list.

re: #197 goddamnedfrank

I'm a citizen. But thanks loads for the pointer. :D

re: #198 laZardo

I'm a citizen. But thanks loads for the pointer. :D

It's really good insurance. Several of my friends were on it back in the day. Take notice that personal care workers get to bypass the waiting list. I wish I had better healthcare connections up there to help you in that direction, I might be able to put you in touch with a couple friends who are nurse practitioners and RNs, but they don't have any hiring authority that I'm aware of.

re: #67 Naso Tang

Rubbish (sorry). They are all for profit. They all want to have money to pay the best doctor rates, buy the best equipment, have the nicest lounges, and build more departments; to serve the community of course. They have budgets, P&L and balance sheets. All good capitalist stuff.

The only difference is that they don't pay dividends to shareholders (just like government run hospitals, like the VA, don't) and they don't pay corporate taxes (as if the for profit ones do after expenses/).

We've got two major hospitals here in the Lewiston, Maine area; they're both non-profit.

re: #199 goddamnedfrank

That's okay. I'm more concerned about my mom. I successfully petitioned her but for reasons I'd rather not discuss, she listed a sponsor in California. So I think that'd disqualify her on the basis that they'd start peering into the inconsistencies.

re: #184 Kid A

Also, if you want to make SS more efficient, is means testing really all that bad? I'm sorry, but if you retire with a pension and every health benefit known to man, you do NOT need SS or Medicare. Can we just take care of those in need?

That's inaccurate. Depending on what kind of pension plan you have, you will probably need Medicare, because a pension will likely not meet room/board at assisted living, let alone skilled nursing.

Also, if you're a public sector worker, your union may or may not have bargained away Social Security benefits at some point. If you become disabled earlier than 65 you could need Medicare much sooner.

re: #186 shecky

The Pro Life Party finds a death panel it likes.

Only corporations and fetuses are people!!

We are pro life for fetuses and healthy business plans, only, because everyone else is, obviously, the result of SIN!

Otherwise, they would not be alive at all! Why should I have to pay for the sins of others, that's what Jesus is for!!!1Q!!@

re: #201 laZardo

That's okay. I'm more concerned about my mom. I successfully petitioned her but for reasons I'd rather not discuss, she listed a sponsor in California. So I think that'd disqualify her on the basis that they'd start peering into the inconsistencies.

One of my distant older cousins just retired after a long career at Washington State DSHS. We used her help to navigate my alcoholic half brother into state medicaid. Then after rehab he fucked up the whole deal by moving down to Texas to be with his alcoholic mother. Texas is shit unhelpful, but he eventually got onto SSD and is doing okay. Anyway I can bounce questions off my cousin if you need an insider's POV of things.

re: #204 goddamnedfrank

I'm already on EBT with the DSHS. If it's not too much trouble, could you pass on the previously mentioned sponsor question to her? Mom's worried that the California sponsor could be charged if she gets the insurance.

re: #205 laZardo

I'm already on EBT with the DSHS. If it's not too much trouble, could you pass on the previously mentioned sponsor question to her? Mom's worried that the California sponsor could be charged if she gets the insurance.

No problem. I'll contact my cousin and get back to you in a day or two. By sponsor do you mean her Green Card sponsor?

re: #206 goddamnedfrank

Yeah. I petitioned her, and she had to list a "financial sponsor."

re: #207 laZardo

Yeah. I petitioned her, and she had to list a "financial sponsor."

Got it, will let you know.

If you're a white guy in America, this probably won't happen to you [Link: jalopnik.com...]

AMERICA FUCK YEAH

re: #208 goddamnedfrank

Lazardo, do you know if the contract the sponsor signed was form I-864 or form I-134?

re: #181 goddamnedfrank

There's nothing wrong with Social Security that eliminating the salary cap won't fix.

yep!

re: #156 sattv4u2

So how is it you have no clue as to what a Ponzi scheme is?

You can add, multiply, and read at a 6th grade level right?

re: #177 sattv4u2

Social Security to See Payout Exceed Pay-In This Year

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

the system is destined to collapse because the earnings, if any, are less than the payments to investors

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

That darn con asshole publication, the New York Times!

,,,

re: #212 WindUpBird

So how is it you have no clue as to what a Ponzi scheme is?

You can add, multiply, and read at a 6th grade level right?

Self-identified old, angry* white man.

Explains a lot. /

*utterly seething, really

re: #212 WindUpBird

So how is it you have no clue as to what a Ponzi scheme is?

He'll figure it out eventually, this time last year he had no idea how tax brackets worked.

re: #180 Lidane

Or, to echo the Tea Party idiots,

KEEP YER GUBMINT HANDS OFF MAH MEDICARE AND SOCIAL SECURITY!

,

G-d fking DAMMIT where the hell is my medicare scooter! I need to go wave my confederate flag at the tea party rally!! I paid into this!!!

It's Miiinnne!

Morning, all

Morning Honcos.

re: #218 researchok

Morning, all

re: #219 Cannadian Club Akbar

Morning Honcos.

Not for me!

I HATE Tuesday mornings during NFL season

Just finished writing up 12 "after action reports" on all the games we did this weekend!!

FEH, I say ,,, FEH

re: #215 goddamnedfrank

He'll figure it out eventually, this time last year he had no idea how tax brackets worked.

Actually, it was a tad later than "this time last year"

You know,,, while I was watching my mother slowly die during several months of hospitalization!

Sorry, but I may have been a tad distracted!

re: #214 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Self-identified old, angry* white man.

Explains a lot. /

*utterly seething, really

Yup,.,, thats me, Chippy!

re: #222 sattv4u2

Yup,.,, thats me, Chippy!

you're gonna have to try a lot harder to break into today's bottom ten!

re: #223 Cannadian Club Akbar

you're gonna have to try a lot harder to break into today's bottom ten!

I can't try harder

Too tired

After all, I'm an old, angry (*utterly seething, really) white man.

brb,,, changing work stations/ puters

re: #225 sattv4u2

brb,,, changing work stations/ puters

I like the fact that you posted a NYT article and got the downding. Heh.

re: #226 Cannadian Club Akbar

I like the fact that you posted a NYT article and got the downding. Heh.

Well, you know how far right they are

Typical Tea Party rag, full of raging wingnut opinions

re: #227 sattv4u2

Well, you know how far right they are

Typical Tea Party rag, full of raging wingnut opinions

I read somewhere that if you read every word in a Sunday edition of the NYT it would take something like 10 days to finish.

re: #228 Cannadian Club Akbar

I read somewhere that if you read every word in a Sunday edition of the NYT it would take something like 10 days to finish.

well of course

4 of those days you'd be in the bathroom barfing!

(((disclaimer ,,, I actually pick up the Sunday NY Times about once a month and besides the editorial page it's pretty good)))

re: #230 sattv4u2

(((disclaimer ,,, I actually pick up the Sunday NY Times about once a month and besides the editorial page it's pretty good)))

I don't even read the local rag put out here. And that giant mess of dead trees isn't worth the coupons.

Good morning folks

re: #232 RogueOne

Good morning folks

:)

re: #233 sattv4u2

:)

You got the ponzi scheme stuff from years of reading the NYTimes didn't you.

Paul Krugman: 1996 (the 90's, back when he was sane)
[Link: www.bostonreview.net...]

Social Security is structured from the point of view of the recipients as if it were an ordinary retirement plan: what you get out depends on what you put in. So it does not look like a redistributionist scheme. In practice it has turned out to be strongly redistributionist, but only because of its Ponzi game aspect, in which each generation takes more out than it put in. Well,the Ponzi game will soon be over, thanks to changing demographics, so that the typical recipient henceforth will get only about as much as he or she put in (and today's young may well get less than they put in).

Math, how does it work?

re: #234 RogueOne

You got the ponzi scheme stuff from years of reading the NYTimes didn't you.

Paul Krugman: 1996 (the 90's, back when he was sane)
[Link: www.bostonreview.net...]

Math, how does it work?

shhh

SATTY says it,,, BAD SATT ,, BAD BAD BAD

Krugman says it ,, hmmm, food for thought!!

:)

re: #234 RogueOne

And I'm sure all my detractors here from that will start downdinging Krugman in 5,4,3,2,,,

:)

re: #235 sattv4u2

shhh

SATTY says it,,, BAD SATT ,, BAD BAD BAD

Krugman says it ,, hmmm, food for thought!!

:)

Back in the 90's during the Clinton terms Krugman saw the coming problems with social security and, especially, medicaid. Shortly thereafter he turned into a complete hack letting his partisan beliefs affect his math skills.

re: #237 RogueOne

Back in the 90's during the Clinton terms Krugman saw the coming problems with social security and, especially, medicaid. Shortly thereafter he turned into a complete hack letting his partisan beliefs affect his math skills.

Whats very sad is that back then, just like now, SS and Medicaid are the third rails of politics,, touch them and you may politically die

If the politicians back then had the testicular fortitude to make some minor changes the systems would most likely be more solvent now.

They're in so much trouble now I fear it's too late for "minor changes"

re: #236 sattv4u2

And I'm sure all my detractors here from that will start downdinging Krugman in 5,4,3,2,,,

:)

Here's where I got it, 3 Nobel Prize Winners (Friedman, Samuelson, Krugman) all agree:

Ponzi Scheme
[Link: marginalrevolution.com...]

re: #238 sattv4u2

You can't fix a problem until you're willing to admit there's a problem.

re: #239 RogueOne

Here's where I got it, 3 Nobel Prize Winners (Friedman, Samuelson, Krugman) all agree:

Ponzi Scheme
[Link: marginalrevolution.com...]

saved for future use

Thanks

re: #240 RogueOne

You can't fix a problem until you're willing to admit there's a problem.

shhh

Everythings fine folks ,,, nothing to see here ,,, move along

re: #240 RogueOne

You can't fix a problem until you're willing to admit there's a problem.

Look, I only have one Big Gulp sized drink before dinner.
/

re: #243 Cannadian Club Akbar

Look, I only have one Big Gulp sized drink before dinner.
/

Problem is, you call every meal or snack "dinner"!!

re: #243 Cannadian Club Akbar

Look, I only have one Big Gulp sized drink before dinner.
/

I had a friend with a drinking problem who tried that. He'd only have one after dinner, a 40oz.

re: #245 RogueOne

I had a friend with a drinking problem who tried that. He'd only have one after dinner, a 40oz.

Thats a lotta vodka!

re: #246 sattv4u2

In his defense he ended up going completely clean, no smoking or drinking, shortly after his 3rd DUI. Going on 15 years now.

re: #246 sattv4u2

Thats a lotta vodka!

Maybe, but add a lemon twist and it's healthy.
///

Remember the story yesterday about the guys who got pulled off the plane in Detroit for spending too much time in the bathroom? First hand account from the lady sitting next to them who also got the same treatment:

Some real Shock and Awe: Racially profiled and cuffed in Detroit
[Link: shebshi.wordpress.com...]

Before I knew it, about 10 cops, some in what looked like military fatigues, were running toward the plane carrying the biggest machine guns I have ever seen–bigger than what the guards carry at French train stations.

My last tweet:

Majorly armed cops coming aboard

Someone shouted for us to place our hands on the seats in front of us, heads down. The cops ran down the aisle, stopped at my row and yelled at the three of us to get up. “Can I bring my phone?” I asked, of course. What a cliffhanger for my Twitter followers! No, one of the cops said, grabbing my arm a little harder than I would have liked. He slapped metal cuffs on my wrists and pushed me off the plane. The three of us, two Indian men living in the Detroit metro area, and me, a half-Arab, half-Jewish housewife living in suburban Ohio, were being detained.

re: #249 RogueOne

Someones got a lot of 'splainin to do!

I didn't watch the debate last night but Morning Joe played part of a clip with Perry and Romney going at it about SS. Good stuff, amusing. Both of them flipping back and forth on previously stated positions.

re: #250 sattv4u2

Someones got a lot of 'splainin to do!

Yeah. She's understandably pissed. She did a much better job than I would have of keeping her mouth shut. My ass would still be in a cell somewhere cussing up a storm.

re: #249 RogueOne

FTA:
Near the ceiling above the toilet there was a video camera.

I'm calling bullshit on this.

re: #253 Cannadian Club Akbar

FTA:
Near the ceiling above the toilet there was a video camera.

I'm calling bullshit on this.

That would be illegal in a normal jail setting.

Joe Scarborough has a real thing about Perry. I don't think they like each other.//

[Link: sacramento.cbslocal.com...]

Big Rig Loaded With Beer Overturns On Interstate 80 Overpass

Crews on the scene said it may take several tow trucks to upright the truck bowls of pretzels to complete the job