Video: Mike Huckabee Speaks to Radical Anti-Abortion ‘Personhood’ Group

‘Those who profit from the sale of death’
Wingnuts • Views: 30,753

In case you had any remaining doubt that the religious right is going for broke on the abortion issue, here’s Mike Huckabee at a fundraiser for the “Personhood Mississippi” campaign — one branch of an extreme anti-abortion multi-state initiative that would criminalize abortion in all cases, make some types of birth control illegal, and ban in vitro fertilization and the treatment of ectopic pregnancies.

Huckabee told the far right audience that pro-choice activists and the “abortion industry” only want to “profit from the sale of death.”

The fundamentalist fanatic persona of Mike Huckabee. You don’t usually see this version of Huckabee on his Fox News show.

Youtube Video

But here’s what I don’t assume. I do not assume that you comprehend the battle you’re gonna face over the next couple of months in this fight for Amendment 26. You have no idea how many millions of dollars are likely to be poured into your state and it’s not stimulus money and economic development and job creation, it is hardcore political money that is designed to preserve the abortion industry which is a multimillion dollar industry specifically designed in order to terminate life and make people rich. Let’s not kid ourselves; this is not about elevating women this is about elevating wealth on behalf of those who profit from the sale of death.

[…]

The reason that America is more pro-life than it ever has been is because the younger generation of Americans are more pro-life than their mothers and their grandmothers. And do you know why? Because science has affirmed what God has been trying to scream to us all along: that is a human life! Thank God for the science that’s affirmed it.

Jump to bottom

589 comments
1 makeitstop  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:14:01pm

'science has affirmed...??'

I thought science was anathema to the people in Huck's crowd?

2 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:14:34pm
Thank God for the science that’s affirmed it.

Because if there's anything the radical right understands or cares about, it's science.

3 allegro  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:16:51pm

So who are all these people getting rich from the big bad abortion industry? Odd that they keep being talked about but none ever appear.

4 Kronocide  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:17:10pm

I don't think any zygote/fertilized egg/fetus should be considered a person until they can support themselves without government help, like have a job.

5 Charles Johnson  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:17:32pm

They're trying to find a talking point that won't make them sound like Neanderthal throwbacks who hate women, so they've latched onto the "crony capitalism" meme like lampreys.

6 jamesfirecat  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:18:28pm

///"Profit from the sale of death..."? My good sir I believe you've confused Planned Parenthood with the NRA.

7 Targetpractice  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:18:33pm

So would Mr. Huckabee declare that it's "incontrovertible" that life begins at conception?

8 allegro  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:18:38pm

re: #5 Charles

They're trying to find a talking point that won't make them sound like Neanderthal throwbacks who hate women, so they've latched onto the "crony capitalism" meme like lampreys.

Not working.

9 Kronocide  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:19:55pm

Anybody who gives $ to 'women's health issues' = funding death.

SOROS!

10 Kragar  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:20:01pm

Texas GOP: 'Of Course This Is A War On Birth Control'

11 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:21:17pm

Texas GOP cuts funding for Women's Health.

12 jaunte  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:21:33pm

re: #3 allegro

George Tiller might have become rich, but he decided not to be a dermatologist.

After I had been there for a little while, patients in the practice began to ask me if I was going to do abortions like my father did. I was outraged. Why would these nice people say that he was a scumbag kind of a physician?

I began to ask some of these women. And I found out that in 1945, '46, or '47, a young woman for whom Dad had already delivered two babies came to him pregnant again right away, and she said something to the effect that, "I can't take it, can you help me?" That is apparently the way you asked for an abortion from your regular doctor before abortion was legal. Dad said, "No. Big families are in vogue, by the time the baby gets here, everything will be all right." She had a non-healthcare provider abortion and came back and died. [Link: www.prch.org...]

13 Killgore Trout  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:23:00pm

The Industrial Abortion Complex!
/Glenn Beck's legacy lives on

14 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:23:26pm

These people will never accept that abortion isn't going away.

Women and girls WILL DIE seeking illegal abortions. Children will be left without mothers.

15 Kragar  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:23:44pm

Big families make great sense when half your kids die from malnutrition, disease, and injuries due to unsafe conditions...

Do you think that might be their master plan?

16 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:24:52pm

re: #15 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Big families make great sense when half your kids die from malnutrition, disease, and injuries due to unsafe conditions...

Do you think might be their master plan?

If those children are brown.

17 Kragar  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:28:01pm

re: #16 ggt

If those children are brown.

God hates melanin.

18 Killgore Trout  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:28:50pm

If god thought abortion was so important he would have included it in the bible, old testament/torah or Konstitution. It was common practice at the time these books were written.

19 Targetpractice  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:29:02pm

re: #15 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Big families make great sense when half your kids die from malnutrition, disease, and injuries due to unsafe conditions...

Do you think might be their master plan?

At this point, the only conclusion I can come to is these people honestly think that if they do "God's will," he'll solve the resulting problems himself. And if not, well, the world need's ditch diggers too. *rolls eyes*

20 Linden Arden  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:29:33pm

What if an abortion provider were only taxed at the 15% capital gains tax?

Would the GOP fight for that business then?

21 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:29:55pm

re: #14 ggt

These people will never accept that abortion birth control isn't going away.

FTFY

This goes far, far beyond abortion. All these "personhood" amendments and this entire line of attack is about making birth control illegal. These fanatics can't stand that women now have the option of avoiding pregnancy altogether, or any say in their sexuality at all.

22 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:30:07pm

When something from The Onion is reality in your mind, your mind is rotten. Defunct. These types are mentally deficient. Functionally (but barely) BONSAIed!!!

23 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:30:08pm

re: #19 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

At this point, the only conclusion I can come to is these people honestly think that if they do "God's will," he'll solve the resulting problems himself. And if not, well, the world need's ditch diggers too. *rolls eyes*

Like the Faith Healing True Believers who had their baby at home and it died?

The hypocrisy is so deep we need waders.

24 jaunte  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:30:24pm

Nice friends these Republicans have.

According to Christian Exodus’s mission statement, “The initial goal was to move thousands of Christian constitutionalists to South Carolina to accelerate the return to self-government based upon Christian principles at the local and State level. This project continues to this day, with the ultimate goal of forming an independent Christian nation that will survive after the decline and fall of the financially and morally bankrupt American empire.”

The group, which is closely tied to the neo-confederate League of the South, attempted to set up an independent, theocratic state in South Carolina by 2016 but has since moved on to creating theocratic settlements in Panama and Idaho.[Link: www.rightwingwatch.org...]

25 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:33:01pm

re: #24 jaunte

It's cool to be explicilty anti-American if your'e in the GOP.

I mean, Perry is a secessionist, and he's the GOP favorite. Someone who wanted to destroy the Union.

Many of them will proudly proclaim their adherence not to America as it is, but a fictitious one, founded by arch-Christians as an explicitly religious nation.

That isn't the US. Their loyalty is not to the US. It, like all revolutionaries, is for what the US 'should' be.

26 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:33:09pm

re: #24 jaunte

Nice friends these Republicans have.

Yeah, I'm really worried about Shariah.

/

27 allegro  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:33:56pm

re: #24 jaunte

Nice friends these Republicans have.

I bet they have a few cases of koolaid. Story sounds just too familiar, don't it?

28 jaunte  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:34:39pm

re: #26 ggt

Huckabee: just another harmless, avuncular theocratic Fox contributor.

29 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:34:49pm

re: #14 ggt

The theocrats are desperately scrambling. They see their power and privilege slipping away, and are doubling down on their un-American agenda. They will only win if we let them.

30 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:35:09pm

re: #25 Obdicut

It's cool to be explicilty anti-American if your'e in the GOP.

Pretty much. You can openly talk about secession, armed insurrection (i.e., "Second Amendment solutions") and violently taking the country back from your political opponents, and few on the right are going to raise much of a peep about it.

31 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:37:48pm

re: #25 Obdicut

They are "Christian first, American second". Their loyalties lie not in the nation of their birth, but with those who minister their favored mythology. Entirely un-American.

32 Linden Arden  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:40:09pm

re: #29 Slumbering Behemoth

I feel bad. My old parents are dizzy End-Timers who pray for Jesus to come back and whack the heads off all 5 billion non-believers in one day.

They are suspicious of Romney but now are solid Rick W. Perry advocates.

Of course they hate the President.

33 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:41:37pm

re: #30 Lidane

I lean right, and "peep" an awful lot. Nobody in my vicinity really cares about my peeping, because I'm clearly just a godless cretin.
/

34 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:41:43pm

re: #32 Linden Arden

I feel bad. My old parents are dizzy End-Timers who pray for Jesus to come back and whack the heads off all 5 billion non-believers in one day.

They are suspicious of Romney but now are solid Rick W. Perry advocates.

Of course they hate the President.

Why would anyone who thought themselves a Christian want anyone to be murdered in such a way?

Oh, wait, these people are outside the womb.

/gah

35 darthstar  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:42:04pm

I believe science has affirmed that Mike Huckabee is a self-righteous prick.

36 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:42:53pm

re: #32 Linden Arden

Awww... don't feel bad. It's not your fault your parents think that way.

37 Decatur Deb  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:43:13pm

re: #31 Slumbering Behemoth

They are "Christian first, American second". Their loyalties lie not in the nation of their birth, but with those who minister their favored mythology. Entirely un-American.

If you look at many eternity-bound religions, that's a feature, not a bug. The pious pilgrims and other non-conformists came here for just that reason.

38 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:43:29pm

re: #32 Linden Arden

I feel bad. My old parents are dizzy End-Timers who pray for Jesus to come back and whack the heads off all 5 billion non-believers in one day.

They are suspicious of Romney but now are solid Rick W. Perry advocates.

Of course they hate the President.

I'm sorry, you have to deal with this in your personal life. My above comment was rather insensitive to that fact.

I'm so glad none of my immediate family believes such things (or lets me know if they do)

39 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:43:46pm

re: #31 Slumbering Behemoth

Except I don't think Perry is actually a real believer. I have no way of knowing, but it seems too convenient. I think he's just riding it, in a deeply cynical way.

I think a lot of the GOP are.

40 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:44:48pm

re: #39 Obdicut

Except I don't think Perry is actually a real believer. I have no way of knowing, but it seems too convenient. I think he's just riding it, in a deeply cynical way.

I think a lot of the GOP are.

I think he is a politician. What he believes is that these people will win him the nomination.

What he will believe once he is in the race is an entirely different matter, IMHO

I call him the wiley one.

41 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:44:59pm

re: #34 ggt

Why would anyone who thought themselves a Christian want anyone to be murdered in such a way?

It's a twisted, adolescent revenge fantasy cloaked in the "Love of Christ". Sociopaths.

42 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:48:14pm

re: #37 Decatur Deb

If you look at many eternity-bound religions, that's a feature, not a bug. The pious pilgrims and other non-conformists came here for just that reason.

It's a serious deficiency in my book. I am American first. Anything else that I may be comes in at a distant second.

43 nines09  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:51:01pm

Yeah. Sure. We all know that influential folks can get (and do get) sorts of favors and "one hand washing the other" and on and on. If they got their way, why there would never be another abortion. Ever again. Unless it was one that was needed for the sake of the right family(s). Like Rick Santorum. Soft and fuzzy Huck wants to thank science when it serves him, and deny it when the shoe is on the other foot.

44 jaunte  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:53:10pm

re: #39 Obdicut

Except I don't think Perry is actually a real believer. I have no way of knowing, but it seems too convenient. I think he's just riding it, in a deeply cynical way.

It's hard to tell if he's a true believer or an opportunist, but a lot of the measures he supports are hurting people in his state.
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

45 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:53:24pm

re: #33 Slumbering Behemoth

I lean right, and "peep" an awful lot. Nobody in my vicinity really cares about my peeping, because I'm clearly just a godless cretin.
/

In fact, anytime I mention anything about the founding of the USA that doesn't follow the false judeo-christian meme, it's because I was "brainwashed in college".

If you knew me personally, you'd know what an hilariously stupid assertion that is.

46 Iwouldprefernotto  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:53:38pm

Abortion Industry? I thought capitalism was good.

47 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 6:57:27pm

re: #43 nines09

Science is only accurate when it serves the purpose gaining wealth and political power our Lord Jesus Christ.
/

48 BongCrodny  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:00:51pm

re: #25 Obdicut

It's cool to be explicilty anti-American if your'e in the GOP.

I mean, Perry is a secessionist, and he's the GOP favorite. Someone who wanted to destroy the Union.

You might think that somebody in the press or audience would have asked Perry about that in either of the last two Presidential debates.

Nah. Screw that.

49 Achilles Tang  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:02:21pm

re: #47 Slumbering Behemoth

Science is only accurate when it serves the purpose gaining wealth and political power our Lord Jesus Christ.
/

Not to mention that it is only science when the bible says it is.

50 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:05:13pm

OT ~~ I follow Cher on Facebook (ok, I know). She just posted this news of another young 14 year old gay suicide:[Link: gawker.com...]

51 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:05:46pm

And now the local teabaggers in my area are out protesting the creation of jobs *cough* I mean the building of a high speed rail system in the Central Valley.

"There's no money to pay for it".

Say, where did the money come from to found the USA? Oh, that's right. Our Founding Fathers borrowed it from foreign lenders, because we didn't have enough of our own "money to pay for it".

52 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:07:06pm

re: #48 BongCrodny

Well, to be fair to the shit, he just lied and claimed that Texas could secede if he wanted to, and that it might come to that. It's a egregious lie, but it's probably just more pandering, not an actual avocation of secession.

It's still pandering to secessionists.

53 jaunte  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:08:33pm

re: #51 Slumbering Behemoth

Ron Paul must have been out building his first log cabin at the time.

54 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:09:40pm

re: #53 jaunte

And he didn't borrow no gawt-damned gov't saw to do it, either!
/

55 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:15:54pm

I'm gonna bounce before I get too ornery.

As for Huck... you and your kind are going the way of the dodo, and this patriotic American will do everything possible to hasten the extinction of your blatantly un-American ideology. Your vision for this nation needs to find it's way to the dustbin of history ASAP.

Later Lizards.

56 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:21:01pm

re: #52 Obdicut

Well, to be fair to the shit, he just lied and claimed that Texas could secede if he wanted to, and that it might come to that. It's a egregious lie, but it's probably just more pandering, not an actual avocation of secession.

It's still pandering to secessionists.

He's toeing right up to the line if not outright crossing it.

When we came into the nation in 1845, we were a republic, we were a stand-alone nation. the governor can be heard saying. And one of the deals was, we can leave anytime we want. So we’re kind of thinking about that again.

Unfortunate use of first person plural there.

57 Achilles Tang  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:27:45pm

re: #56 goddamnedfrank

I wonder if visas and passports would be required to cross the border.
Import duties? A tax on exported oil? Would he be allowed to buy F16's from the USA, or buy Chinese because they are cheaper?

The idiocy strains my mind.

58 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:31:00pm

re: #57 Naso Tang

I wonder if visas and passports would be required to cross the border.
Import duties? A tax on exported oil? Would he be allowed to buy F16's from the USA, or buy Chinese because they are cheaper?

The idiocy strains my mind.

I'd settle for one of our republicans to tell me how this kind of talk is acceptable from a party leader?

59 jaunte  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:31:03pm

re: #56 goddamnedfrank

Perry is a bullshitter.

"Both in lying and in telling the truth people are guided by their beliefs concerning the way things are. These guide them as they endeavor either to describe the world correctly or to describe it deceitfully. For this reason, telling lies does not tend to unfit a person for telling the truth in the same way that bullshitting tends to. ...The bullshitter ignores these demands altogether. He does not reject the authority of the truth, as the liar does, and oppose himself to it. He pays no attention to it at all. By virtue of this, bullshit is a greater enemy of the truth than lies are."
-- Harry G. Frankfurt
[Link: www.slate.com...]

60 Achilles Tang  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:32:22pm

re: #58 goddamnedfrank

I'd settle for one of our republicans to tell me how this kind of talk is acceptable from a party leader?

I'd settle for a pandering debate moderator asking him about it.

61 Kragar  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:41:34pm

So, if Perry gets elected, I'm sure he'll have no problem with states telling him to fuck right off, or will he suddenly decide state's rights don't matter any more?

62 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:43:37pm

re: #60 Naso Tang

I'd settle for a pandering debate moderator asking him about it.

Who? Where?

63 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:44:24pm

re: #61 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

So, if Perry gets elected, I'm sure he'll have no problem with states telling him to fuck right off, or will he suddenly decide state's rights don't matter any more?

The only people who disagree with Republican presidents are radical anti-American malcontents. Duh.

64 wheat-dogg  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:44:52pm

A "multimillion dollar industry specifically designed in order to terminate life and make people rich."

He must be confusing it with the defense industry. I don't see anyone else making millions (or billions) from killing people.

65 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:47:27pm

re: #60 Naso Tang

I'd settle for a pandering debate moderator asking him about it.

"Governor Perry, you recently said that Texas came into the nation in 1845 as a republic with the right to leave. Didn't Texas attempt to exercise that option in 1861 in an attempt to retain slavery, and wasn't this issue decisively settled in 1865?"

We hold as undeniable truths that the governments of the various States, and of the confederacy itself, were established exclusively by the white race, for themselves and their posterity; that the African race had no agency in their establishment; that they were rightfully held and regarded as an inferior and dependent race, and in that condition only could their existence in this country be rendered beneficial or tolerable.
—Secession Convention, "A Declaration of the Causes which Impel the State of Texas to Secede from the Federal Union"

66 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:49:10pm

re: #65 goddamnedfrank


Perry reminds me of the pick up trucks I occasionaly see around here with synthetic testicles hanging from the license plate.

67 Interesting Times  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:52:34pm

re: #66 prairiefire

Perry reminds me of the pick up trucks I occasionaly see around here with synthetic testicles hanging from the license plate.

It takes balls to execute an innocent man, and Truck Nutz™ to brag about how much you love America all the while hint-hinting you can leave her whenever you like.

68 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:53:07pm

re: #66 prairiefire

Perry reminds me of the pick up trucks I occasionaly see around here with synthetic testicles hanging from the license plate.

Image: 20080118.png

Image: 20080429.png

69 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:56:26pm

re: #65 goddamnedfrank

"Governor Perry, you recently said that Texas came into the nation in 1845 as a republic with the right to leave. Didn't Texas attempt to exercise that option in 1861 in an attempt to retain slavery, and wasn't this issue decisively settled in 1865?"

And if that isn't explicitly racist, while naming slavery as the cause of secession, I don't know what would be. Not that any Neo-Confederates would be swayed.

70 BongCrodny  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 7:57:07pm

re: #66 prairiefire

Perry reminds me of the pick up trucks I occasionaly see around here with synthetic testicles hanging from the license plate.

Can we get a Google bomb for this?

71 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:02:11pm

re: #69 Dark_Falcon

And if that isn't explicitly racist, while naming slavery as the cause of secession, I don't know what would be. Not that any Neo-Confederates would be swayed.

Can you still see yourself voting for Perry?

72 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:09:13pm

re: #50 prairiefire

OT ~~ I follow Cher on Facebook (ok, I know). She just posted this news of another young 14 year old gay suicide:[Link: gawker.com...]

Oh no. I heard Tom Ammiano speak recently. The Author of Seths law. Deeply compelling issue. This California legislator has real passion on this. Great speech on the law and what it means. It's a serious protocol for dealing with bullying, and not just gay bullying. Any serious bullying.

73 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:09:31pm

re: #68 negativ

So funny, George Jefferson.

74 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:15:33pm

re: #71 goddamnedfrank

Can you still see yourself voting for Perry?

After Obama's tax bomb on Monday, heck yes! I'm not going to vote for someone whose plan is built around 3 dollars in tax increases for 1 dollar of spending cuts, with any Medicare changes put off till 2017. I can see Perry pandering, but I don't think he actually believe the words of the Secession Declaration.

75 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:17:31pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

I gotta say he loses me at the Dominionist point. I can not go there.

76 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:22:56pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

After Obama's tax bomb on Monday, heck yes! I'm not going to vote for someone whose plan is built around 3 dollars in tax increases for 1 dollar of spending cuts, with any Medicare changes put off till 2017. I can see Perry pandering, but I don't think he actually believe the words of the Secession Declaration.

I need to revise and expand this statement: I will certainly vote Republican the GOP nominee is Mitt Romney. If it were Perry, I would still be unlikely to vote for Obama, but there is a chance that I might simply not vote for President (I would still vote for congressional, state, and local candidates). If Michelle Bachmann were the nominee, I would vote for Obama, on the grounds that she is a dangerous lunatic.

77 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:23:21pm

Hey, Charles -- apparently you're a science denier now:

BlueCollarTodd
9:57pm via TweetMeme
Prenatal Science Denier Charles Johnson Attacks Mike Hucabee On #Abortion.. [Link: t.co...] #lgf @andrewbreitbart tcot #tlot #gop

ROFL

78 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:24:19pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

Rick Perry shouldn't be elected dog catcher, much less POTUS, and you're going to vote for him?

That's sad, IMO.

79 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:26:16pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

Dark, you're solely basing your decision on taxation, even though a few months ago you didn't even understand what progressive taxation was?

Do you really think this is the best way for you to decide between candidates? On a subject that you were incurious about?

80 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:27:35pm

re: #77 Lidane

Hey, Charles -- apparently you're a science denier now:

ROFL

Projection, thy name is Wingnut!

81 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:27:39pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

Oh, and we shouldn't be cutting spending at all. Austerity measures are going to be a self-fulfilling mechanism of depressing the economy and causing lower tax revenues in the future.

Yay. We get to suffer though this economic twilight until enough people realize that.

How awesome.

82 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:28:19pm

stepped-out for a few

What did I miss?

83 Kragar  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:28:30pm

re: #77 Lidane

Hey, Charles -- apparently you're a science denier now:

ROFL

WOMEN CAN'T HAVE CONTROL OVER THEIR OWN BODIES OR THEY'LL BECOME SHAMELESS HUSSIES!!! THAT'S SCIENCE!

84 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:28:44pm

re: #81 Obdicut

Not at all? Not military spending?

85 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:30:01pm

slash the military budget, ratchet up the taxes on the upper 1%

voila

86 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:31:00pm

spacejesus for king of america

87 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:31:20pm

re: #84 Rightwingconspirator

Not at all? Not military spending?

Well, that depends. We need to spend very differently-- need to spend a ton of money combating AGW, and the military is already at the centerpiece of that. So less over-designed warplanes that won't work in different temperature zones, and more design of alternative energy that can be used by the military, development of truly green biofuel, etc.

Cut the weapons programs that the Pentagon itself says they don't want, and repurpose that money to revamp the military to not rely on fossil fuels.

88 Gus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:32:14pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

After Obama's tax bomb on Monday, heck yes! I'm not going to vote for someone whose plan is built around 3 dollars in tax increases for 1 dollar of spending cuts, with any Medicare changes put off till 2017. I can see Perry pandering, but I don't think he actually believe the words of the Secession Declaration.

Yeah. The current tax code has been such a hindrance to those poor and suffering billionaires and millionaires in this country who've seen their wealth continue to skyrocket while most of Americans on the bottom have seen flat and sometimes negative wage increases since 1980.

Don't worry though. I seriously doubt any tax hikes for those poor and suffering billionaires and millionaires getting through with their hired legal help, I mean Congress as long as the Republicans control the house.

Hey. If Perry wins they're going to have to figure out how to pay for their next overseas police action, meddling, oops, I mean war with Iran.

89 Girth  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:32:31pm

I wonder what percentage of the population have no idea how marginal tax rates work.

I'll bet it's really high.

90 Gus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:33:40pm

donnabrazile Donna Brazile
"When the rich take from the poor, it’s called an economic plan. When the poor take from the rich, it’s called class warfare.." Rev Coffin

91 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:33:51pm

re: #87 Obdicut

Agreed and wrap up a couple wars. Big bucks there, smart spending will include rest and repair of the hardware. And VA medical for a lot of vets.

92 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:34:07pm

re: #89 Girth

In my anecdotal experience, yes, depressingly high.

The GOP spreads the belief that progressive taxation alone means that you can wind up making less money when you get paid more.

This isn't true, of course, except in regards to exemptions and loopholes that start to not apply at different levels, but those are corner cases.

93 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:35:08pm

re: #91 Rightwingconspirator

God yes. The costs for the vets are going to be huge, but that's money owed.

94 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:36:22pm

American Taliban, Neo-Klan, enslavers of women, human garbage

your modern GOP, everyone! Raise a toast to fanatical lunacy

95 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:37:32pm

re: #81 Obdicut

Oh, and we shouldn't be cutting spending at all. Austerity measures are going to be a self-fulfilling mechanism of depressing the economy and causing lower tax revenues in the future.

Yay. We get to suffer though this economic twilight until enough people realize that.

How awesome.

I thought Obama cut spending already by eliminating Federal Jobs?

I am so confused. The creative accounting that is used by politicians must really piss-off those that really know what is going on at the OMB.

96 Gus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:38:08pm

re: #94 WindUpBird

American Taliban, Neo-Klan, enslavers of women, human garbage

your modern GOP, everyone! Raise a toast to fanatical lunacy

A sucker is born every minute. -- PT Barnum The Republican Party

97 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:38:43pm

re: #95 ggt

Yes, spending has already been cut.

Which sucks, and is going to hurt us.

98 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:38:51pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

After Obama's tax bomb on Monday, heck yes! I'm not going to vote for someone whose plan is built around 3 dollars in tax increases for 1 dollar of spending cuts, with any Medicare changes put off till 2017. I can see Perry pandering, but I don't think he actually believe the words of the Secession Declaration.

Ah, if you weren't straight, maybe you'd feel differently


Maybe if his prayer rally was pointing at you with a noose in their hand, you'd feel differently

but, you know, taxes!

99 Gus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:39:34pm

@frontlinepbs FRONTLINE
“Brain Wars: How the Military is Failing Its Wounded”--an ongoing @nprnews/@ProPublica invstg: [Link: ow.ly...] #Frontline

100 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:39:51pm

re: #93 Obdicut

God yes. The costs for the vets are going to be huge, but that's money owed.

There has been a large increase in trauma survivors because we have become so adept at saving IED victims. Why did we have to become adept at saving IED victims in the first place?
What war or wars caused this increase in military causalities?

101 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:41:55pm

re: #64 wheatdogg

A "multimillion dollar industry specifically designed in order to terminate life and make people rich."

He must be confusing it with the defense industry. I don't see anyone else making millions (or billions) from killing people.

But those are brown lives, they don't count

only white christian lives count

102 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:43:07pm

re: #79 Obdicut

Dark, you're solely basing your decision on taxation, even though a few months ago you didn't even understand what progressive taxation was?

Do you really think this is the best way for you to decide between candidates? On a subject that you were incurious about?

We're dealing with theology here, not logic. Dark wasn't so much incurious about how progressive taxation worked, he was lied to. He swallowed, internalized and regurgitated that lie. Yes he didn't bother to educate himself but it's somewhat by design, he long ago identified with the liars and sees the battle of rhetoric as a game. It's not in his makeup to get angry at those who lied to him, and who let him spread the falsehood. Instead he'll just be off on class warfare, hurting the job creators, or whatever the GOP mythology of the day happens to be. He's an expert on these subject until he's not, then he moves on attempting to pass as an expert on some other facet. Introspection isn't on the menu.

The problem with the prior stance on progressive taxation wasn't that it was wrong per se, but that it was so demonstrably, provably, irrefutably wrong. The broader stance against taxing the wealthy is easier to maintain because the refutation takes more time and relies on a more complex set of facts.

103 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:46:22pm

i wish charles would make this a front page thing


Youtube Video
104 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:46:47pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

Just curious, would you vote for a guy like Perry if you were gay?


if you knew he was specifically organizing people (under the banner of Christ of course) who wanted you dead or imprisoned?


Just curious!

105 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:46:53pm

re: #100 prairiefire

There has been a large increase in trauma survivors because we have become so adept at saving IED victims. Why did we have to become adept at saving IED victims in the first place?
What war or wars caused this increase in military causalities?

Iraq. But this would have become an issue again sooner or later. IEDs are not a new threat. They've been around since the development of gunpower in China, and the Viet Cong used them often. Israel has also had to face this weapon. The choice to use IEDs was made by the enemy, and we adapted to defeat their tactics. Thanks to better medical care and better vehicles, we gained the upper hand and have retained it.

106 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:49:23pm

BBL, I've got to go bring some hurricanes into town with my sinful ways

107 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:49:38pm

re: #105 Dark_Falcon

Yes, it has, sooner rather than later.

108 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:49:50pm

re: #104 WindUpBird

Just curious, would you vote for a guy like Perry if you were gay?

if you knew he was specifically organizing people (under the banner of Christ of course) who wanted you dead or imprisoned?

Just curious!

I cannot answer that. If I were gay, I'd likely be a significantly different person, and many of the events that influenced my life might have gone differently. I cannot speak to what my state of mind would have become in that case, and therefore I cannot answer.

109 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:50:29pm

re: #107 prairiefire

Yes, it has, sooner rather than later.

Eh?

110 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:50:45pm

guys, china is going to become an issue sooner or later. onward to beijing!

111 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:52:05pm

re: #108 Dark_Falcon

I cannot answer that. If I were gay, I'd likely be a significantly different person, and many of the events that influenced my life might have gone differently. I cannot speak to what my state of mind would have become in that case, and therefore I cannot answer.

You display a frightening lack of empathy. You don't have to be a person to attempt putting yourself in their shoes, unless maintaining your worldview mandates that you not even try.

112 palomino  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:55:49pm

re: #108 Dark_Falcon

I cannot answer that. If I were gay, I'd likely be a significantly different person, and many of the events that influenced my life might have gone differently. I cannot speak to what my state of mind would have become in that case, and therefore I cannot answer.

Would I need to be black to know that opposition to the Civil Rights Act was fucked up?

113 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:57:42pm

re: #108 Dark_Falcon

I cannot answer that. If I were gay, I'd likely be a significantly different person, and many of the events that influenced my life might have gone differently. I cannot speak to what my state of mind would have become in that case, and therefore I cannot answer.

Quite frankly, this is bullshit.

I don't have to be black to understand that slavery was wrong. You don't have to be a woman to understand that keeping women from full voting rights was wrong, or a minority to understand that opposing civil rights is wrong.

114 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:58:12pm

Is this the kind of person you want nominating Supreme Court Justices?

It's been eight years since the Supreme Court officially knocked down anti-sodomy laws as unconstitutional in Lawrence v. Texas, but Texas' state legislature has thus far refused to remove the law from the books—in large part because most Texas Republicans still support it. In 2010, the state GOP made defense of the anti-sodomy statute part of its platform, calling for the state to effectively ignore the the law of the land: "We demand that Congress exercise its authority granted by the U.S. Constitution to withhold jurisdiction from the federal courts from cases involving sodomy." Gov. Rick Perry, meanwhile, dismissed the Lawrence decision as the product of "nine oligarchs in robes" (never mind that it was a 6–3 decision).

115 Kragar  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 8:59:24pm

Michele Bachmann says Obama should block Iranian president's U.N. speech

This again?

Its the UN, get over it.

116 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:00:47pm

re: #110 SpaceJesus

With Spacejesus as our Dear Leader!
//

117 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:01:10pm

re: #114 goddamnedfrank

but but


but

but


taxes!

118 palomino  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:01:36pm

re: #114 goddamnedfrank

Is this the kind of person you want nominating Supreme Court Justices?

Sometimes I wish Lincoln had just let the South secede.

Nate Silver predicts that ALL states, including TX and MS, will pass gay marriage within 15 years. Normally Silver is pretty spot on, but I'd take the over on this bet.

119 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:01:42pm

re: #114 goddamnedfrank

Rick Perry, just like the rest of the GOP, is all for individual liberty.

Well, unless you're gay, or a woman, or a minority, or anything other than a rich, white Christian male landowner. Then you're on your own.

120 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:01:56pm

re: #109 Dark_Falcon

Eh?

The costs of the current and continuing wars are now on the books. They have to be dealt with. I don't think they just "happened" like fairy dust.

121 Gus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:02:21pm

re: #117 WindUpBird

but but

but

but

taxes!

Reagan

122 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:02:38pm

re: #108 Dark_Falcon

I cannot answer that. If I were gay, I'd likely be a significantly different person, and many of the events that influenced my life might have gone differently. I cannot speak to what my state of mind would have become in that case, and therefore I cannot answer.

How about if Rick Perry said that Jewish people bring hurricanes, ruin crops, and need to be banned from having sex with each other, under penalty of death?

How about then?

123 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:03:15pm

re: #120 prairiefire

The costs of the current and continuing wars are now on the books. They have to be dealt with. I don't think they just "happened" like fairy dust.

Or Teflon.

124 celticdragon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:03:23pm

re: #25 Obdicut

It's cool to be explicilty anti-American if your'e in the GOP.

I mean, Perry is a secessionist, and he's the GOP favorite. Someone who wanted to destroy the Union.

Many of them will proudly proclaim their adherence not to America as it is, but a fictitious one, founded by arch-Christians as an explicitly religious nation.

That isn't the US. Their loyalty is not to the US. It, like all revolutionaries, is for what the US 'should' be.

Exactly. Note that their "America" also has a lot less people in it.

125 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:04:07pm

Rick Perry: Curbstomps For Christ!

126 palomino  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:04:18pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

After Obama's tax bomb on Monday, heck yes! I'm not going to vote for someone whose plan is built around 3 dollars in tax increases for 1 dollar of spending cuts, with any Medicare changes put off till 2017. I can see Perry pandering, but I don't think he actually believe the words of the Secession Declaration.

You're overreacting. The tax rates he's proposing didn't destroy the economy or our social fabric or anything else in the 90s when we had them. Nor did they imperil the American Dream in any of the previous decades when we had even higher marginal rates than the 90s.

127 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:05:28pm

re: #126 palomino

You're overreacting. The tax rates he's proposing didn't destroy the economy or our social fabric or anything else in the 90s when we had them. Nor did they imperil the American Dream in any of the previous decades when we had even higher marginal rates than the 90s.

What Obama is proposing is similar to what Clinton proposed


and we all know that Clinton left the economy in ruins lol.

128 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:07:25pm

re: #122 WindUpBird

How about if Rick Perry said that Jewish people bring hurricanes, ruin crops, and need to be banned from having sex with each other, under penalty of death?

How about then?

Rick Perry didn't say that, other people who attended the rally said that, and they did not say that at the rally. Rick Perry does not like gayness at all, but I believe he understands the limits of the office he is seeking. Moreover, he main priority will be economic, not social issues.

129 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:07:31pm

re: #117 WindUpBird

but but

but

but

taxes!

First they came for the Birds, and I said nothing because I wasn't an avian.

re: #122 WindUpBird

How about if Rick Perry said that Jewish people bring hurricanes, ruin crops, and need to be banned from having sex with each other, under penalty of death?

How about then?

Jewish people are like ... different ... we've recently begun pretending to give a shit about them ... for the lulz. Now move along, your kind ain't welcome here.

130 celticdragon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:08:07pm

re: #32 Linden Arden

I feel bad. My old parents are dizzy End-Timers who pray for Jesus to come back and whack the heads off all 5 billion non-believers in one day.

They are suspicious of Romney but now are solid Rick W. Perry advocates.

Of course they hate the President.

I was raised on that stuff. My mom updates me from time to time on the latest bit of end times prophecy she thinks has just been fulfilled. The last I heard, she thinks Obama might fit the criteria of being the Anti-Christ according to Revelations, Daniel and Zechariah.

Not a joke, unfortunately.

I love my mom. So how in the hell am I supposed to have a real conversation with her...given that we do not share the same mental reality at all (It goes without saying that Fox News is on half the day at my folks house)

131 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:08:36pm

re: #120 prairiefire

The costs of the current and continuing wars are now on the books. They have to be dealt with. I don't think they just "happened" like fairy dust.

I didn't say that. What I said was that the blame for those IED injuries lies with the terrorists who planted the bombs.

132 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:09:31pm

re: #129 goddamnedfrank

First they came for the Birds, and I said nothing because I wasn't an avian.

re: #122 WindUpBird

Jewish people are like ... different ... we've recently begun pretending to give a shit about them ... for the lulz. Now move along, your kind ain't welcome here.

they came with torches and barbecue sauce, and shit man I just started runnin

133 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:09:47pm

all right, I still can't figure out in simple terms --the tax issue.

There are 312,260,203 people in the US.

Total Outlay (If I've found the correct figure) is $3,456,213,000,000.

put the figures into my xcel spredsheet and it equals: $11,068.37 per person

I understand that that this means every child, every elderly person etc.

This doesn't take into account revenues from Corporations, import duties, fines, fees, etc. It also, as I understand it, doesn't count money collected for Social Security, medicare etc.

So, without drawing any conclusions, is my math correct?

134 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:09:58pm

re: #128 Dark_Falcon

Rick Perry does not like gayness at all, but I believe he understands the limits of the office he is seeking.

Which is why he and his fellow Republicans refuse to remove the Texas sodomy law and why he called the Supreme Court Justices "nine oligarchs in robes." Because he understands things like limits LOL.

135 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:10:24pm

rick perry is wrong on everything. like, all of it. social, economic, foreign, legal, scientific, etc. -- doesn't matter.

the man is literally 100% insane and or mentally handicapped.

136 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:11:08pm

re: #115 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Michele Bachmann says Obama should block Iranian president's U.N. speech

This again?

Its the UN, get over it.

Bachman wants the POTUS to violate the 1st Amendment?

137 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:12:24pm

re: #128 Dark_Falcon

Rick Perry didn't say that, other people who attended the rally said that, and they did not say that at the rally. Rick Perry does not like gayness at all, but I believe he understands the limits of the office he is seeking. Moreover, he main priority will be economic, not social issues.

he doesn't need to say it. Like good republicans, he hires people to say that shit for him. :)


if it was a gaggle of noted anti-semites he invited to speak at his rally, you would probably not be defending Mr. Perry.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm guessing you would probably not be saying "His main priority would be economic, not persecuting jewish people."


But queers, eh who cares, right?

138 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:12:58pm

re: #130 celticdragon

I don't share the same mental reality with my mom in law, at all. It just happened on the phone again, for the umpteenth time. I think it is some sort of cosmic test.

139 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:13:13pm

re: #126 palomino

You're overreacting. The tax rates he's proposing didn't destroy the economy or our social fabric or anything else in the 90s when we had them. Nor did they imperil the American Dream in any of the previous decades when we had even higher marginal rates than the 90s.

Seriously.

I love how the right are hyperventilating now over taxes going back to the same rates as we had in the 90s. What a bunch of goddamn drama queens. You'd think that they were being asked to wear hairshirts and flog themselves in public or something.

140 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:13:17pm

re: #137 WindUpBird

"who cares about our fellow countrymen, we have an economy to destroy"

141 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:13:28pm

re: #128 Dark_Falcon

Rick Perry didn't say that, other people who attended the rally said that, and they did not say that at the rally. Rick Perry does not like gayness at all, but I believe he understands the limits of the office he is seeking. Moreover, he main priority will be economic, not social issues.

BINGO! That will be his focus if he get's the nomination. It has traditionally been the GOP's big issue.

The problem is that no one seems to trust ANY party when it comes to fiscal issues this time around.

He is banking on support I'm not sure will be there.

142 Digital Display  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:13:36pm

oh heck..50 minutes till my birthday...I've been hanging out with the dog drinking a few beers on a Tuesday night all alone in Oklahoma...Happy Birthday to me..
You know.. Empathy and understanding is something that let's Humans rise above the Animal world..
We can walk a mile in some one Else's shoes...We can understand the human condition because if we open our eyes we can see all.. There is no glass ceiling.. Only sky above us with no limits..

143 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:14:02pm

re: #131 Dark_Falcon

I didn't say that. What I said was that the blame for those IED injuries lies with the terrorists who planted the bombs.

Of course! But why are our soldiers there in the first place?

144 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:14:08pm

re: #138 prairiefire

You passed the test, if you were polite.

145 palomino  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:14:17pm

re: #128 Dark_Falcon

Rick Perry didn't say that, other people who attended the rally said that, and they did not say that at the rally. Rick Perry does not like gayness at all, but I believe he understands the limits of the office he is seeking. Moreover, he main priority will be economic, not social issues.

There's something you're missing in the whole debate that's far more important than wonkish talk of raising marginal tax rates by a whopping 3%.

As an LGF regular, it should be painfully obvious, from the tea party to the Andrew Breitbarts, David Bartons, Brian Fischers, et al. that tax policy isn't what this is really about. It's simply a marker in the overarching culture war, which is a much bigger struggle. As W would say, you're either with us or against us. Pick a side: post-Enlightenment (like our founding fathers) or Medieval. The choice is yours, but don't be fooled by a distraction like 36% vs. 39% top tax rates.

146 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:14:20pm

re: #136 ggt

Bachman wants the POTUS to violate the 1st Amendment?

Bachmann wants the POTUS to act as King of the World, but without Leonardo DiCaprio's acting skills.

147 jaunte  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:14:44pm

re: #142 HoosierHoops

Happy Almost-Birthday.

148 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:14:48pm

re: #142 HoosierHoops

29 again???
Happy Birthday, you.
May next year be better than the last!

149 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:15:25pm

re: #142 HoosierHoops

oh heck..50 minutes till my birthday...I've been hanging out with the dog drinking a few beers on a Tuesday night all alone in Oklahoma...Happy Birthday to me..
You know.. Empathy and understanding is something that let's Humans rise above the Animal world..
We can walk a mile in some one Else's shoes...We can understand the human condition because if we open our eyes we can see all.. There is no glass ceiling.. Only sky above us with no limits..

Happy early birthday.

150 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:15:26pm

re: #146 Lidane

Bachmann wants the POTUS to act as King of the World, but without Leonardo DiCaprio's acting skills.

But they are both tall, handsome and well built.

151 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:15:50pm

re: #142 HoosierHoops

Do you get cake?
Or beer?

152 celticdragon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:16:02pm

re: #108 Dark_Falcon

I cannot answer that. If I were gay, I'd likely be a significantly different person, and many of the events that influenced my life might have gone differently. I cannot speak to what my state of mind would have become in that case, and therefore I cannot answer.

You need to rethink that one, DF.

Just sayin'...

153 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:16:12pm

i have it on good sources that perry does in fact look remarkably like satan

154 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:16:39pm

Are we celebrating an early birthday?

I have the perfect cake for everyone!

Only Chocolate for Early Birthdays.

155 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:16:53pm

re: #115 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Michele Bachmann says Obama should block Iranian president's U.N. speech

This again?

Its the UN, get over it.

Michelle Bachmann should worry about what she's good at, which is kidnapping dalmatian puppies to be made into coats

156 Kragar  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:17:03pm

re: #136 ggt

Bachman wants the POTUS to violate the 1st Amendment?

She also wants him to do something Bush never did.

157 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:17:06pm

re: #136 ggt

Bachman wants the POTUS to violate the 1st Amendment?

LEGALIZE THE CONSTANT IONS!

158 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:17:06pm

re: #153 SpaceJesus

i have it on good sources that perry does in fact look remarkably like satan

THE WALKIN DUDE

159 jaunte  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:17:26pm

re: #153 SpaceJesus

i have it on good sources that perry does in fact look remarkably like satan

[Link: 4.bp.blogspot.com...]

160 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:17:35pm

re: #144 Floral Giraffe

You passed the test, if you were polite.

Oh, good.
I said: "Really?" "Well, thanks for calling." It was regarding her 45 year old son finally having a girlfriend over for Thanksgiving. "Good thing he's not gay since I want him to have a family."

161 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:18:42pm

oh my god facebook makes even less sense than rick perry after this update

162 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:18:49pm

re: #141 ggt

BINGO! That will be his focus if he get's the nomination. It has traditionally been the GOP's big issue.

The problem is that no one seems to trust ANY party when it comes to fiscal issues this time around.

He is banking on support I'm not sure will be there.

I think the support will arrive. Obama's vaporware plans will go nowhere (he isn't even sending a detailed tax proposal to Congress), and he's not going to look good for having proposed something he knew wouldn't pass and couldn't even bother to properly detail. I don't see how Obama beats Romney or Perry with a bad economy and not having taken effective action to help it.

163 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:19:01pm

re: #150 ggt

But they are both tall, handsome and well built.

Except that Leo would really make the wingnuts explode in outrageous outrage, given his environmental activism and decidedly liberal views. I mean, how could anyone earning $60 million for a single film be sympathetic to anyone who isn't rich?

164 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:19:22pm

re: #153 SpaceJesus

i have it on good sources that perry does in fact look remarkably like satan

Like This?

165 palomino  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:20:08pm

re: #135 SpaceJesus

rick perry is wrong on everything. like, all of it. social, economic, foreign, legal, scientific, etc. -- doesn't matter.

the man is literally 100% insane and or mentally handicapped.

Don't insult that cute little Palin kid by putting him in the same category as Rick Perry.

166 engineer cat  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:21:20pm

re: #139 Lidane

Seriously.

I love how the right are hyperventilating now over taxes going back to the same rates as we had in the 90s. What a bunch of goddamn drama queens. You'd think that they were being asked to wear hairshirts and flog themselves in public or something.

it seems to me that the scare value of higher taxes has, after 30 years, finally run its course

we see majorities in all polls for tax increases on high income earners and large corporations, eh?

history does not stand still, and if you stay in the same place long enough you will find yourself behind the eight ball

167 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:21:46pm

re: #152 celticdragon

You need to rethink that one, DF.

Just sayin'...

What I was saying is that I can't be sure how much differently my life would have gone if I were gay. Some of it is also that in my interactions in real life I'm so asexual that it scarcely makes a difference as to my sexual orientation. Being gay might have meant I did not end up with this attitude.

168 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:22:16pm

re: #162 Dark_Falcon

I think the support will arrive. Obama's vaporware plans will go nowhere (he isn't even sending a detailed tax proposal to Congress), and he's not going to look good for having proposed something he knew wouldn't pass and couldn't even bother to properly detail. I don't see how Obama beats Romney or Perry with a bad economy and not having taken effective action to help it.

I think you underestimate the lack of confidence voters have right now. They are very focused on social issues and simply do not trust white men from Texas. This election more than any other in my lifetime (I believe) will be based on emotions.

Any facts and figure proposed will not be believed.

169 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:22:24pm

???

170 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:22:51pm

re: #141 ggt

Why the hell do you guys think he'll focus on fiscal issues?

With the massive anti-choice campaign going on, with the furor about DADT, with all the anti-Shariah bullshit, what on earth makes you think his focus will be financial?

171 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:23:34pm

re: #162 Dark_Falcon

Again, Dark:

Since you have shown yourself to be totally incurious about how taxation actually functions, why do you keep talking about taxation?

172 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:24:07pm

re: #162 Dark_Falcon

I don't see how Obama beats Romney or Perry with a bad economy and not having taken effective action to help it.

Here's a hint: The Republicans can't block every conceivable effort of the POTUS, then complain he didn't do anything. After the GOP ran us headlong towards default for no reason, folks are far more aware of Republican obstructionism than they were in the past, and they have a lot less patience for it.

173 engineer cat  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:24:26pm

re: #162 Dark_Falcon

I think the support will arrive. Obama's vaporware plans will go nowhere (he isn't even sending a detailed tax proposal to Congress), and he's not going to look good for having proposed something he knew wouldn't pass and couldn't even bother to properly detail. I don't see how Obama beats Romney or Perry with a bad economy and not having taken effective action to help it.

i think obama is proposing something that a majority of americans support and want, and the republican party will be seen as refusing to give them what they want

174 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:25:35pm

re: #170 Obdicut

Why the hell do you guys think he'll focus on fiscal issues?

With the massive anti-choice campaign going on, with the furor about DADT, with all the anti-Shariah bullshit, what on earth makes you think his focus will be financial?

Because it is the only issue he has a chance on beating Obama and that is normally a BIG issue. People are out of work, jobs are being "outsourced" (as if we haven't heard that buzzword enough).

All I can tell you Obdi is that the wingnuts I know are all hot about money and don't give a shit about social issues. One even said those very words to me. They will sacrifice every man, woman and child to keep their jobs.

They are concerned about their ability to pay their bills.

175 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:25:46pm

Substitute taxes for fire and this is what the GOP reminds me of, Phil Hartman breaking character. The level of sincerity behind their act is one big joke:

Youtube Video
176 Ming  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:26:41pm

re: #10 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Texas GOP: 'Of Course This Is A War On Birth Control'

I'm basically pro-choice, although I must admit I have mixed feelings about the later months of pregnancy. Maybe I would be opposed to abortion in the 8th or 9th month, assuming the month could be verified. I don't mind having some mixed feelings about abortion, but what really shocks me is how many on the religious right, who say they care about the life of the unborn, are opposed to birth control. You don't have to be a scientist to know that birth control should be welcomed by anyone who sincerely feels that abortion is a tragedy. Obviously, birth control is one very effective way to avoid abortions! No pregnancy, no abortion! My point is that there is great hypocrisy when someone claims to sincerely feel that abortion is murder, and that person is ALSO opposed to contraception.

And how about in vitro fertilization, which routinely destroys human fertilized eggs? I once knew a very conservative Christian couple who had no qualms about trying in vitro fertilization. I doubt that they agonized over those discarded fertilized human eggs. But they would be first to champion a constitutional amendment against abortion.

177 Digital Display  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:26:46pm

re: #151 Floral Giraffe

Do you get cake?
Or beer?

Hi You..I guess no cake..I think I'll get up in the Morning a play a round of Golf at OU.. ( That is going to be funny )
Come home and pick up Winston and head over to Thunderbird Lake and have a picnic lunch while Winston runs around playing on the shore.. Then come home...I like Oklahoma.. But tonight I'm really feeling homesick..
I'll be better later when all the phone calls come in.. My Kids, My Family and Friends....

178 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:27:10pm

re: #174 ggt

But why are you ignoring what the GOP is actually doing, in state legislatures, all over the place?

Why are you ignoring the anti-choice campaign that you yourself document?

I don't get it.

179 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:28:34pm

re: #171 Obdicut

Again, Dark:

Since you have shown yourself to be totally incurious about how taxation actually functions, why do you keep talking about taxation?

I have sources whom I trust, and all of them say that increased taxation is not a good idea. Moreover, the tax cuts Obama proposes are only temporary, while the tax increases are permanent. The next taxes would go into effect next year, while any changes to Medicare would be 5 years away.

And lastly, there is the fact that he could not even be bother to send his proposals of this month in a document that could be introduced and passed as a bill. If order to even imagine that such proposals could be approved, he'd have to have Republicans work on turning his proposals into a bill, which will not happen. It's expecting someone who opposes your policies to do the leg work in implementing them.

180 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:28:34pm

re: #174 ggt


average voter wants their bills paid, giant dominionist lobby arm wants to keep women barefoot, helpless and pregnant


which group has more pull: Average wingnut? Or giant Dominionist lobbying arm

181 palomino  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:28:45pm

re: #162 Dark_Falcon

I think the support will arrive. Obama's vaporware plans will go nowhere (he isn't even sending a detailed tax proposal to Congress), and he's not going to look good for having proposed something he knew wouldn't pass and couldn't even bother to properly detail. I don't see how Obama beats Romney or Perry with a bad economy and not having taken effective action to help it.

Yes, your fellow Republicans know this, which is why they are loath to compromise with Obama on anything, even things which used to be non-issues like the debt ceiling.

You'll probably get your wish: the gop will win the WH and Senate in 2012. Then they'll revert back to their 2000-2006 form of big govt bullshit conservatism masquerading as fiscal conservatism. Remember, most of these Republicans were in office back then too. Especially anyone in leadership. The teabaggers won't hold their feet to the fire; they'll just be ecstatic to get the black muslim guy out of office.

It's a culture war, my friend, not a war over a few points one way or the other in taxes or budgets. You either get this, or you don't.

182 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:28:53pm

re: #174 ggt

They've always been like that. Fiscal cons do not give a whup about the social cons demands. As long as the vote helps the fiscons, they do not care what else is behind it.

183 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:29:49pm

re: #177 HoosierHoops

Well, you could MAKE a call.
Just saying!

184 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:29:59pm

re: #176 Ming

I don't mind having some mixed feelings about abortion, but what really shocks me is how many on the religious right, who say they care about the life of the unborn, are opposed to birth control. You don't have to be a scientist to know that birth control should be welcomed by anyone who sincerely feels that abortion is a tragedy. Obviously, birth control is one very effective way to avoid abortions! No pregnancy, no abortion! My point is that there is great hypocrisy when someone claims to sincerely feel that abortion is murder, and that person is ALSO opposed to contraception.

That's because opposition to birth control isn't about abortion. It's about the fact that birth control removes the possibility of pregnancy from sex. This means it removes the only purpose of sex as far as the wingnuts go. It's not about fun or expressing your love for your partner. It's only about procreation.

Give a woman the means to prevent pregnancy, and control over her own body, and the whole social order goes to hell, as far as these wingnuts are concerned. We can't allow women any freedom. They should be under the rule of their fathers and then their husbands. Period.

185 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:30:28pm

re: #182 prairiefire

They've always been like that. Fiscal cons do not give a whup about the social cons demands. As long as the vote helps the fiscons, they do not care what else is behind it.

Social cons greatly outnumber the fisc cons.
;)

186 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:30:48pm

re: #179 Dark_Falcon

I have sources whom I trust, and all of them say that increased taxation is not a good idea.

Are these the same sources that got you to internalize and regurgitate your previously held erroneous ideas about how progressive tax brackets function, or have you swapped out advisors since then?

187 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:31:05pm

re: #185 Varek Raith

Social cons greatly outnumber the fisc cons.
;)

It wasn't fiscal cons that necessitated a civil rights movement

188 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:31:59pm

re: #184 Lidane

Chained to the kitchen sink, barefoot & pregnant, is what they want.

189 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:32:05pm

re: #178 Obdicut

But why are you ignoring what the GOP is actually doing, in state legislatures, all over the place?

Why are you ignoring the anti-choice campaign that you yourself document?

I don't get it.

Because I don't think the Republican rhetoric will go that way after he get's the nomination. They'll focus on the Economy and let the Democrats focus on Social Issues --or at least they'll try.

It all depends on current events and we are way away from November 2012. Another 9/11 type attack and American might want another cowboy POTUS --who knows. I don't think they want one right now.

It's all smoke screen and mirrors on the campaign trail. What anyone is actually doing is ignored by the MSM. You ought to know that by now.

190 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:32:11pm

re: #185 Varek Raith

Social cons greatly outnumber the fisc cons.
;)

it just so happens that fiscal cons can be easily bought :D

191 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:32:28pm

re: #190 WindUpBird

it just so happens that fiscal cons can be easily bought :D

Bingo

192 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:32:31pm

re: #186 goddamnedfrank

Are these the same sources that got you to internalize and regurgitate your previously held erroneous ideas about how progressive tax brackets function, or have you swapped out advisors since then?

My errors on progressive taxation were my own, and those people I talk to would have corrected my error had I asked them. I did not ask them and my subsequent FAIL rests on my head alone.

193 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:33:18pm

re: #179 Dark_Falcon

I have sources whom I trust, and all of them say that increased taxation is not a good idea.

But why do you trust them? How did they manage to avoid informing you how progressive taxation worked? And why weren't you at all curious about it yourself? Don't you feel it's your civic duty to actually make an informed vote, and not simply blindly trust in someone else?

And lastly, there is the fact that he could not even be bother to send his proposals of this month in a document that could be introduced and passed as a bill.

What are you talking about? There's a jobs bill. Are you saying the President didn't personally craft it, or what?

If order to even imagine that such proposals could be approved, he'd have to have Republicans work on turning his proposals into a bill, which will not happen. It's expecting someone who opposes your policies to do the leg work in implementing them.

They don't oppose his policies, per se. They oppose anything he does. They do not care about the merits of the proposal. Their goal is to defeat him in the election. In your most honest moments, you've admitted this. They will not hand him any sort of win, even if it would be good for the US.

194 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:33:27pm

re: #180 WindUpBird

average voter wants their bills paid, giant dominionist lobby arm wants to keep women barefoot, helpless and pregnant

which group has more pull: Average wingnut? Or giant Dominionist lobbying arm

Yes, it is going to be an interesting campaign trail. I will probably go back into self exile --reading Science Fiction.

195 palomino  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:34:02pm

re: #179 Dark_Falcon

I have sources whom I trust, and all of them say that increased taxation is not a good idea. Moreover, the tax cuts Obama proposes are only temporary, while the tax increases are permanent. The next taxes would go into effect next year, while any changes to Medicare would be 5 years away.

Are you kidding? In a democracy, NOTHING is permanent. The other side can always change things, whether it's Obamacare or the Constitution itself.

196 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:34:39pm

re: #189 ggt

Because I don't think the Republican rhetoric will go that way after he get's the nomination. They'll focus on the Economy and let the Democrats focus on Social Issues --or at least they'll try.

Really, I understand that you believe this. I'm asking you WHY. You haven't given any reason, except that you believe.

The current crop of GOP freshman got elected on a wave of economic promises. They've engaged in a furious host of social conservative laws. You know this.

So why would Perry and the GOP be any different this time around?

197 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:34:49pm

re: #195 palomino

Are you kidding? In a democracy, NOTHING is permanent. The other side can always change things, whether it's Obamacare or the Constitution itself.

It's almost like some in the GOP don't like this whole "republic" thingamajig.

198 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:35:48pm

re: #196 Obdicut

Really, I understand that you believe this. I'm asking you WHY. You haven't given any reason, except that you believe.

The current crop of GOP freshman got elected on a wave of economic promises. They've engaged in a furious host of social conservative laws. You know this.

So why would Perry and the GOP be any different this time around?

Because of what I hear from the rwnj around me. They don't give a shit about LGBT or Planned Parenthood. I'm the screaming crazy in their midst. All they talk about is the economy, taxes and the DOW.

199 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:35:56pm

re: #197 Varek Raith

It's almost like some in the GOP don't like this whole "republic" thingamajig.

That's why they want the Bush tax cuts to be permanent. It's just dumb.

200 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:36:14pm

re: #197 Varek Raith

It's almost like some in the GOP don't like this whole "republic" thingamajig.

The world's gone to shit since we moved away from feudalism.

201 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:36:18pm

re: #179 Dark_Falcon

The frustrating think about you, Dark, is not that your an ideologue, but that it's not even your ideology. It's someone else's, that you're just repeating. That's very, very odd to me. I can't imagine doing that, myself. Just passing on, uncritically, an instruction from another.

Why not have him/her poke their head in here and see if they can manage to sustain their argument?

202 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:37:10pm

re: #198 ggt

Because of what I hear from the rwnj around me. They don't give a shit about LGBT or Planned Parenthood. I'm the screaming crazy in their midst. All they talk about is the economy, taxes and the DOW.

I think those types of people might be easily moved if the economy was better.

203 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:37:36pm

re: #198 ggt

Because of what I hear from the rwnj around me. They don't give a shit about LGBT or Planned Parenthood. I'm the screaming crazy in their midst. All they talk about is the economy, taxes and the DOW.

But that's just a tiny anecdotal sample size. Why does that lead you to ignore that in the last election, the GOP was elected on economic issues and immediately launched into a massive social conservative agenda?

Furthermore, even if that's what the people want, why would the GOP pay attention? The people want us to raise taxes on the wealthy, and the GOP doesn't give a solitary fuck about that.

204 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:37:38pm

re: #198 ggt

Because of what I hear from the rwnj around me. They don't give a shit about LGBT or Planned Parenthood. I'm the screaming crazy in their midst. All they talk about is the economy, taxes and the DOW.

What they don't see (as conservatives seem not to recognize change until it is already stale) is that we are truly in the Brave New World. The Republic cannot be restored . . .we have to accept the Global Nature of our world and figure out how to thrive in it.

205 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:38:19pm

re: #198 ggt

Because of what I hear from the rwnj around me. They don't give a shit about LGBT or Planned Parenthood. I'm the screaming crazy in their midst. All they talk about is the economy, taxes and the DOW.

And, has the freshmen GOP have proven, they don't care what their constituents want. Why do you think it's been nothing but social issues with these new members?

206 palomino  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:39:14pm

re: #196 Obdicut

Really, I understand that you believe this. I'm asking you WHY. You haven't given any reason, except that you believe.

The current crop of GOP freshman got elected on a wave of economic promises. They've engaged in a furious host of social conservative laws. You know this.

So why would Perry and the GOP be any different this time around?

Only because Frank Luntz and other pollsters tell them that a fixation on social issues won't help them win the general election. Otherwise, they wouldn't stop; nothing gets the reactionary right more riled up than talk of how great America used to be before liberals ruined it with homosexuality and abortion and women having jobs.

207 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:39:56pm

Where's the GOP economic plan?

208 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:40:16pm

re: #203 Obdicut

But that's just a tiny anecdotal sample size. Why does that lead you to ignore that in the last election, the GOP was elected on economic issues and immediately launched into a massive social conservative agenda?

Furthermore, even if that's what the people want, why would the GOP pay attention? The people want us to raise taxes on the wealthy, and the GOP doesn't give a solitary fuck about that.

Because I don't think the constituency has realized that. They are living with 1980's mentality. The GOP stands for the Economy and the Democrats are Jimmy Carter in their minds.

Jesus, these people are quoting Reagan. They think it can really be like that again. They want that.

209 engineer cat  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:40:31pm

re: #197 Varek Raith

It's almost like some in the GOP don't like this whole "republic" thingamajig.

it seems that voting sometimes leads to results they don't like. that can't be right!

210 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:40:43pm

re: #207 Varek Raith

Well, there's the pack of lies Ryan created, that depends on a fantasy world and is a cruel piece of crap that adds trillions to the deficit.

That's a cool one.

211 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:40:57pm

re: #207 Varek Raith

on some koch brother's hard drive someplace

212 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:41:55pm

re: #204 ggt

What they don't see (as conservatives seem not to recognize change until it is already stale) is that we are truly in the Brave New World. The Republic cannot be restored . . .we have to accept the Global Nature of our world and figure out how to thrive in it.

We're talking about people who are fundamentally incapable of grasping that the world has changed dramatically in the last 20 years. The Cold War is over. The internet changed everything -- communications, business, the way we interact with each other, etc. The world is literally far more connected and globalized now than it has ever been in the past.

To me, the current wailing and gnashing of teeth from the GOP, and the Tea Party in particular, are the death throes of a limited worldview. They can't cope with all the changes that have happened these past two decades, so they're lashing out and crying about things like socialism and the end of the world.

213 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:41:55pm

re: #208 ggt

But you're not connecting it to what Perry would do. I fully accept that whatever people you know mistakenly think that the GOP is better economically, and that's why they'd vote for them.

But given the GOP history of pressing it's agenda of social conservatism even after being elected on fiscal issues, why do you think they'd change this time around?

214 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:42:24pm

re: #205 Varek Raith

And, has the freshmen GOP have proven, they don't care what their constituents want. Why do you think it's been nothing but social issues with these new members?

"Social Issues are the reason the economy sucks. Entitlement spending will bankrupt us. We need to stop paying people who don't work."

The mental gymnastics are so outdated.

215 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:42:50pm

OT, but I am watching a play through of Lonesome Road DLC for New Vegas.

Holy Hell, those are some epic ruins.

216 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:44:13pm

re: #215 ProLifeLiberal

OT, but I am watching a play through of Lonesome Road DLC for New Vegas.

Holy Hell, those are some epic ruins.

SURPRISEDEATHCLAWBEHINDYOU!!!!

217 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:44:21pm

re: #214 ggt

The mental gymnastics are so outdated.

At this point, the entire GOP worldview is quickly becoming outdated. They need to adapt to the real world that exists now, or risk total irrelevance and becoming the old man yelling at clouds.

218 Obdicut  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:44:24pm

and good goddamn night.

Remember to hang by your thumbs.

219 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:44:50pm

Image: jobgrowthchart.jpg

220 sattv4u2  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:45:23pm

re: #218 Obdicut

and good goddamn night.

Remember to hang by your thumbs.

Thats a real uncomfortable way to sleep!

221 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:45:53pm

damn you mark zuckerberg! damn you to hell!!!

222 engineer cat  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:46:20pm

re economy vs social issues:

when you respond to a suggestion that some of the bush tax cuts be sunsetted as they were originally intended by whining about "class warfare!!!", economic issues are turned into social issues - you are no longer suggesting a modification of fiscal policy and you have become a long haired hippie socialist with foreign ideas who hates america

223 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:46:51pm

re: #218 Obdicut

and good goddamn night.

Remember to hang by your thumbs.

That sign-off reminds me of William F. Buckley, and I mean that in a good way.

224 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:47:31pm

re: #213 Obdicut

But you're not connecting it to what Perry would do. I fully accept that whatever people you know mistakenly think that the GOP is better economically, and that's why they'd vote for them.

But given the GOP history of pressing it's agenda of social conservatism even after being elected on fiscal issues, why do you think they'd change this time around?

I don't think the GOP would change. I think they will focus on fiscal issues to get elected, and continue Dominionist Business as usual.

But, it's not what I think, it's the emotions of the voters on the First Tuesday after the First Monday of November 2012 that matters.

They are living in the past and want to re-create some utopian version of it. I don't understand the mental gymnastics. But there be little GOP voting on the basis of logic, IMHO.

I'll probably be (as I stated before) in self-imposed exile reading Sci-Fi Novels.

225 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:47:54pm

re: #221 SpaceJesus

damn you mark zuckerberg! damn you to hell!!!

Did he launch a satellite that hit you or something? :D

226 sagehen  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:48:27pm

re: #133 ggt

all right, I still can't figure out in simple terms --the tax issue.

There are 312,260,203 people in the US.

Total Outlay (If I've found the correct figure) is $3,456,213,000,000.

put the figures into my xcel spredsheet and it equals: $11,068.37 per person

I understand that that this means every child, every elderly person etc.

This doesn't take into account revenues from Corporations, import duties, fines, fees, etc. It also, as I understand it, doesn't count money collected for Social Security, medicare etc.

So, without drawing any conclusions, is my math correct?

Yes.

And for that $11k per person, you get:

the food you buy at the grocery store, and the water that comes from your tap, is safe. The money you put in the bank will still be there when you go to withdraw it. The only wars our nation fights are far away, there's no air-raids in your town, there's no artillery battles or foreign soldiers between your home and your workplace.

If you hold any copyrights or patents, they're enforceable. If you own your home, you *own* it. The roads are pretty good. And you don't have to pay tolls on most of them.

There's free weather information, hurricane and tornado warnings, rebuilding help if one happens to hit your area. Airplanes are mostly safe. If you need a part for the engine you're rebuilding, and it's not in-stock a couple miles away, they can get it delivered within a day or two. The phones work. Electricity works. If you get hit by a bus, somebody will come to scrape you off the road and deliver you to an emergency room, and they won't even ask about your ability to pay until you wake up all stitched and medicated and on the mend. If you get in trouble in a foreign country, there's somebody from your government whose job it is to help you.

If your boat flounders in the surf, there's someone whose job it is to rescue you, at no charge. If you get lost on a mountain, there's someone whose job it is to rescue you, at no charge. There's an internet. If you get some weird new sickness that nobody ever had before, there's a whole big building full of people whose job it is to find a cure and tell your doctor what to do.

etc.

I'd say we're getting pretty good value for the money.

227 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:48:27pm

re: #225 Dark_Falcon

Did he launch a satellite that hit you or something? :D

No.
..
.
I DID!

228 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:48:38pm

re: #225 Dark_Falcon

Did he launch a satellite that hit you or something? :D

The new fb sucks big donkey balls. And they grow bigger each day.

229 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:49:21pm

re: #221 SpaceJesus

damn you mark zuckerberg! damn you to hell!!!

I know, it sucks.

230 sattv4u2  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:49:27pm

re: #228 ggt

The new fb sucks big donkey balls. And they grow bigger each day.

eeewwwww!!!

231 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:49:43pm

re: #227 Varek Raith

Would you leave The Divide please?

re: #228 ggt

Seriously, it blows massively.

232 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:50:59pm

Speaking of religious whackjobbery, I got this comment from my daughter tonight:

It's DADT repeal day. I wonder how many Arkansas birds will die.

The daughter is as sweet-natured as a person could be but she also has a certain wry, cynical streak. I can't imagine where she picked up such a thing.

233 prairiefire  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:51:03pm

Night, lizards!

234 engineer cat  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:51:18pm

re: #222 engineer dog

re economy vs social issues:

when you respond to a suggestion that some of the bush tax cuts be sunsetted as they were originally intended by whining about "class warfare!!!", economic issues are turned into social issues - you are no longer suggesting a modification of fiscal policy and you have become a long haired hippie socialist with foreign ideas who hates america

i've got my syntax bollixed up here so both ends of the argument are "you"

but you know what i mean, right?

235 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:52:15pm

re: #228 ggt

The new fb sucks big donkey balls. And they grow bigger each day.

I don't have the real-time ticker yet. It's bad enough that I have the chat sidebar.

236 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:53:45pm

re: #225 Dark_Falcon

i wish he had satellites , i would destroy them all after what he just did to facebook

237 sattv4u2  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:55:34pm

re: #236 SpaceJesus

i wish he had satellites , i would destroy them all after what he just did to facebook

Buy him out, then you can do whatever you want with it!!

238 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:56:05pm

re: #226 sagehen

Yes.

And for that $11k per person, you get:

the food you buy at the grocery store, and the water that comes from your tap, is safe. The money you put in the bank will still be there when you go to withdraw it. The only wars our nation fights are far away, there's no air-raids in your town, there's no artillery battles or foreign soldiers between your home and your workplace.

If you hold any copyrights or patents, they're enforceable. If you own your home, you *own* it. The roads are pretty good. And you don't have to pay tolls on most of them.

There's free weather information, hurricane and tornado warnings, rebuilding help if one happens to hit your area. Airplanes are mostly safe. If you need a part for the engine you're rebuilding, and it's not in-stock a couple miles away, they can get it delivered within a day or two. The phones work. Electricity works. If you get hit by a bus, somebody will come to scrape you off the road and deliver you to an emergency room, and they won't even ask about your ability to pay until you wake up all stitched and medicated and on the mend. If you get in trouble in a foreign country, there's somebody from your government whose job it is to help you.

If your boat flounders in the surf, there's someone whose job it is to rescue you, at no charge. If you get lost on a mountain, there's someone whose job it is to rescue you, at no charge. There's an internet. If you get some weird new sickness that nobody ever had before, there's a whole big building full of people whose job it is to find a cure and tell your doctor what to do.

etc.

I'd say we're getting pretty good value for the money.

Ok, so the math is right. Now factor in revenue from Corporations, tariff's fees, fines etc and the actual number of people paying taxes (households).

Even if 1/3 of the population pays taxes and we don't factor in non-individual income tax revenues, social security, medicare collections, that would be $33,205.12 per person.
right?

Not unreasonable for some people, Very unreasonable for many.

My point is that I don't understand why there is a deficit. The IRS should be able to collect the equivalent of 11K per person with all the different income sources.

There are so many ways of looking at this.

239 sagehen  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:56:24pm

re: #193 Obdicut

They don't oppose his policies, per se. They oppose anything he does. They do not care about the merits of the proposal. Their goal is to defeat him in the election. In your most honest moments, you've admitted this. They will not hand him any sort of win, even if it would be good for the US.

Youtube Video
240 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:57:02pm

meh, screw it. ill figure the new fb out tomorrow.

back to trolling the ayn rand dating site atlasphere.com

241 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:57:02pm

re: #236 SpaceJesus

i wish he had satellites , i would destroy them all after what he just did to facebook

Thanks for the warning. I'll just keep staying off of Facebook and leave it to the Stalkers. They deserve a site that sucks.

242 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:57:33pm

re: #240 SpaceJesus

meh, screw it. ill figure the new fb out tomorrow.

back to trolling the ayn rand dating site atlasphere.com

Wait, whut?
Lol.

243 engineer cat  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:58:31pm

re: #226 sagehen

I'd say we're getting pretty good value for the money.

exactly!

what you said!

244 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:58:42pm

Ah, on Words with Friends and Strangers I finally got a random stranger that can play well!

245 sagehen  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 9:58:49pm

re: #207 Varek Raith

Where's the GOP economic plan?

Tax cuts. More tax cuts. Especially for the highest brackets.

Duh.

246 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:00:21pm

re: #242 Varek Raith

[Link: www.theatlasphere.com...]

you have no idea how much fun ive had here

247 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:00:39pm

And I just checked in on the Stalkers. Nothing to report, just Internet Howler Monkeys flinging poo.

248 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:02:16pm

re: #247 Dark_Falcon

Just Joined Google+

249 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:03:07pm

re: #235 Lidane

I don't have the real-time ticker yet. It's bad enough that I have the chat sidebar.

Everyone's screens seem to be different.

I now have "Home" screen. WTF does that mean.

They also are deciding what news I think is relevant and what emails I will get.

fb is getting less and less relevant to me with every change.

250 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:03:27pm

re: #237 sattv4u2

Making it sane again would be fucking peachy.

251 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:04:03pm

re: #243 engineer dog

exactly!

what you said!

Unless you have a family of 5. Remember the figure I devised is per person, not household.

252 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:04:17pm

re: #249 ggt

Everyone's screens seem to be different.

I now have "Home" screen. WTF does that mean.

They also are deciding what news I think is relevant and what emails I will get.

fb is getting less and less relevant to me with every change.

Firefox is going down a similar path.

253 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:04:37pm

re: #249 ggt

OK. I just got this update.

So far, I'm not impressed. My main news feed was the Most Recent stuff. Now it's in the corner in a small ticker box. WTF.

254 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:04:50pm

re: #252 Varek Raith

Firefox is going down a similar path.

Firefox has been giving me choices tho. fb just does it.

255 sagehen  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:05:12pm

re: #238 ggt

Ok, so the math is right. Now factor in revenue from Corporations, tariff's fees, fines etc and the actual number of people paying taxes (households).

Even if 1/3 of the population pays taxes and we don't factor in non-individual income tax revenues, social security, medicare collections, that would be $33,205.12 per person.
right?

Not unreasonable for some people, Very unreasonable for many.

My point is that I don't understand why there is a deficit. The IRS should be able to collect the equivalent of 11K per person with all the different income sources.

There are so many ways of looking at this.

Our current revenue is about 60-70% of our current spending, that's where the deficit comes from. If we return to the Clinton tax rates and wind down the wars, that cuts the deficit by 3/4. The economy picking itself back up will take care of the rest.

256 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:05:14pm

re: #252 Varek Raith

Firefox is going down a similar path.

I just uninstalled Firefox and switched to Chrome. I've used Chrome exclusively at work for months now and Firefox was getting on my nerves.

257 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:05:36pm

i just tried opening facebook on my blackberry and it literally burst into flames

258 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:05:44pm

re: #254 ggt

Firefox has been giving me choices tho. fb just does it.

Ah, sounds annoying as hell.
I'm glad I stay away from social networking sites.
:)

259 engineer cat  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:06:26pm

re: #243 engineer dog

exactly!

what you said!

via atrios @ eschaton

Elizabeth Warren!

I hear all this, you know, “Well, this is class warfare, this is whatever.”—No!

There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody.

You built a factory out there—good for you! But I want to be clear.

You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for.

You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate.

You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for.

You didn’t have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory, and hire someone to protect against this, because of the work the rest of us did.

Now look, you built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea—God bless. Keep a big hunk of it.

But part of the underlying social contract is you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along.

260 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:07:29pm

re: #256 Lidane

I just uninstalled Firefox and switched to Chrome. I've used Chrome exclusively at work for months now and Firefox was getting on my nerves.

Yeah, I'll try it out and see if it annoys me less than FF.

261 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:07:40pm

re: #253 Lidane

OK. I just got this update.

So far, I'm not impressed. My main news feed was the Most Recent stuff. Now it's in the corner in a small ticker box. WTF.

Just checked --no ticker.

What's it for?

262 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:08:05pm

re: #257 SpaceJesus

I'm sorry.

The best way to describe this is Nunfuckery.

263 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:08:50pm

BRB

264 Lidane  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:09:48pm

re: #261 ggt

Just checked --no ticker.

What's it for?

From what I can tell, it shows updated comments from your friends and pages in the corner. Every time there's a new comment, it updates.

265 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:09:57pm

re: #255 sagehen

Our current revenue is about 60-70% of our current spending, that's where the deficit comes from. If we return to the Clinton tax rates and wind down the wars, that cuts the deficit by 3/4. The economy picking itself back up will take care of the rest.

ok, WHY is our current revenue 60-70% of current spending?

If we go by my 11K figure, I can tell you my family pays our fair share per person.

266 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:10:15pm

re: #262 ProLifeLiberal

yeah, im off to check out google+ as well, this is real dumb

267 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:11:03pm

re: #260 Varek Raith

Yeah, I'll try it out and see if it annoys me less than FF.

FF doesn't annoy me.

A friend tried downloading Chrome and was at the Apple Genius Bar three times before everything worked the way she wanted.

268 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:11:29pm

re: #262 ProLifeLiberal

I'm sorry.

The best way to describe this is Nunfuckery.

Is it time to say that "New Facebook revision = EPIC FAIL"?

269 Kragar  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:13:12pm

re: #268 Dark_Falcon

Is it time to say that "New Facebook revision = EPIC FAIL"?

270 SpaceJesus  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:13:56pm

i like how the new facebook sidebar is just people talking shit about the new facebook sidebar right now

271 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:14:38pm

re: #268 Dark_Falcon

YES!!!

re: #270 SpaceJesus

I just contributed the same.

272 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:14:55pm

The US Population has a net gain of 1 person every 12 seconds.

I never quite thought if it that way before. :)

273 Varek Raith  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:16:29pm

Hmm, Chrome seems alright.

274 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:28:46pm

re: #273 Varek Raith

Hmm, Chrome seems alright.

can you see yourself in shiny reflection?

275 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:37:56pm

Goodnight, all.

276 laZardo  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:44:41pm

Injustice Facts on Twitter!

277 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:46:50pm

re: #230 sattv4u2

eeewww!!!

I can't believe I grossed-YOU-out.

278 sagehen  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:55:43pm

re: #265 ggt

ok, WHY is our current revenue 60-70% of current spending?

If we go by my 11K figure, I can tell you my family pays our fair share per person.

reduced revenue since turn of the century due to:
1. Bush tax cuts, which were also extended by Obama.
2. Economic collapse

increased spending since turn of the century due to:
1. several wars
2. Medicare Part D
3. extended unemployment, bailouts to States (who depend heavily on real estate taxes for their revenue -- lots of people's homes got reassessed and tax reductions when the housing bubble burst, plus foreclosures so there's no one to collect from), and just increased need for things like Medicare and Food Stamps since so many people don't have the income they used to.

If you'll recall, Clinton left us with a slight surplus -- there was no deficit when Bush took office.

279 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:58:59pm

re: #278 sagehen

reduced revenue since turn of the century due to:
1. Bush tax cuts, which were also extended by Obama.
2. Economic collapse

increased spending since turn of the century due to:
1. several wars
2. Medicare Part D
3. extended unemployment, bailouts to States (who depend heavily on real estate taxes for their revenue -- lots of people's homes got reassessed and tax reductions when the housing bubble burst, plus foreclosures so there's no one to collect from), and just increased need for things like Medicare and Food Stamps since so many people don't have the income they used to.

If you'll recall, Clinton left us with a slight surplus -- there was no deficit when Bush took office.

I remember the surplus --but I thought was explained by military cuts, which were then needed after 9/11.

So, if the economy had sustained itself, things would be better as collections are a percentage of what corporations and individuals actually earn.

They misjudged that amount and didn't collect enough?

Which I don't understand because I paid . . .

Other people didn't and Corporations fiddle with their numbers so much that they pay too little?

280 sagehen  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:59:01pm

re: #265 ggt

ok, WHY is our current revenue 60-70% of current spending?

If we go by my 11K figure, I can tell you my family pays our fair share per person.

p.s. -- don't count the bank and auto industry bailouts as part of the problem... those were loans, and they've been paid back.

281 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 10:59:21pm

re: #278 sagehen

BTW, thanks for walking me thru this.

282 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:00:05pm

re: #280 sagehen

p.s. -- don't count the bank and auto industry bailouts as part of the problem... those were loans, and they've been paid back.

from escrow accounts?

The creative accounting astounds me.

I don't know what to believe.

283 austin_blue  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:03:28pm

re: #7 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

So would Mr. Huckabee declare that it's "incontrovertible" that life begins at conception?

It think it is. At conception, the new cell that is formed can do wonderful things. It is self-replicating. It contains a human genetic code that will inform its development into a fully functional human being, delivered into the world as a happy, healthy, screeching New American, as enshrined in the Constitution as an American Citizen by dint of being born on American soil!

Unless it doesn't. It might not implant into the uterine wall and be flushed out of the uterus during the next menstrual cycle (up to 50% of fertilized ova). It might implant but not be viable before the next menstrual cycle (up to 10%). It might be spontaneously aborted (miscarried) during the first three months because of significant genetic defects or hormonal imbalances (5-10%).

And so on.

In any case, it's life, but not necessarily human life, of which we've got a settled definition. That's because we, as a culture, did not want to be vivisectionists when harvesting organs to save sick humans. If it doesn't have a functioning forebrain, a living corpse can be used as an organ donor.

So when does a fetus achieve a functioning forebrain, by definition, that would not allow it to be an organ donor?

Best guess right now is 19 weeks.

Sorry, Huckabucka.

284 sagehen  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:06:43pm

re: #279 ggt

I remember the surplus --but I thought was explained by military cuts, which were then needed after 9/11.

So, if the economy had sustained itself, things would be better as collections are a percentage of what corporations and individuals actually earn.

They misjudged that amount and didn't collect enough?

Which I don't understand because I paid . . .

Other people didn't and Corporations fiddle with their numbers so much that they pay too little?

Rates were cut. The largest, most profitable corporations are now making huge -- record -- profits, but their assessments are significantly lower than they were 15 years ago.

Bush's cuts on individual income tax come to about $330B/year, on corporate taxes about $150B/year. The wars have been running about $150B/year, without counting VA benefits/medical. Medicare D is about $50B/year, and the downturn is another $200B/year reduced income taxes and $50B/year reduced payroll taxes plus $50B/year increased social services.

285 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:09:35pm

Will Congress vote to tax it's members?

286 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:13:06pm
The richest member of Congress is Issa, whose net worth was valued between $156 million and $451 million. (When members of Congress disclose information about their financial assets and liabilities, they are allowed to do so by giving broad ranges.)

allowed to give ranges? WTF?

287 austin_blue  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:13:46pm

re: #285 ggt

Will Congress vote to tax it's members?

D's? Yes. Members of the Reality Based Community.

R's? You've *got* to be kidding!

288 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:14:47pm

re: #287 austin_blue

D's? Yes. Members of the Reality Based Community.

R's? You've *got* to be kidding!

I don't trust any of them --regardless of party.

They are all both Politicians and Humans --the two bottom rungs.

289 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:15:34pm

I have a full day tomorrow.

Have a great morning all!

290 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:17:01pm

Wikipedia just gave Fantastic News:

Google+, the social network service developed by Google, is released to the general public.

And just in time.

291 laZardo  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:17:45pm

re: #290 ProLifeLiberal

Wikipedia just gave Fantastic News:

And just in time.

If it can't play CityVille, then I don't give a shit.

/half

292 sattv4u2  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:22:43pm

re: #289 ggt

I have a full day tomorrow.

Not me

I've altered mine to just 21 hours!
//

293 Alexzander  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:29:17pm

How's your evening going LaZardo?

294 Charles Johnson  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:33:33pm

Look out. The wingnut blogs are foaming at the mouth again.

Apparently, pointing out Rick Perry's fanatical Christian Zionism makes me an anti-Semite, who is probably going to end up murdering homeless people.

Yep! They really are writing stuff like that tonight. Morons.

295 Alexzander  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:35:56pm

re: #294 Charles

Look out. The wingnut blogs are foaming at the mouth again.

Apparently, pointing out Rick Perry's fanatical Christian Zionism makes me an anti-Semite, who is probably going to end up murdering homeless people.

Yep! They really are writing stuff like that tonight. Morons.

Yeah, to be honest when I first saw those posts I feared the worst. Expect to be an anti-semite forever now (in the eyes of the batshit hate-filled insane at least).

296 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:41:41pm

re: #162 Dark_Falcon

I think the support will arrive. Obama's vaporware plans will go nowhere (he isn't even sending a detailed tax proposal to Congress), and he's not going to look good for having proposed something he knew wouldn't pass and couldn't even bother to properly detail. I don't see how Obama beats Romney or Perry with a bad economy and not having taken effective action to help it.

I'm jumping in this conversation late, but I had to comment on this one. Why is it Dead on Arrival? because the Republicans in Congress have no desire or willingness to compromise. They're banking that exactly what you're saying will happen: That people will see 2 years of ineffectual government, and reward the people who spent the last two years preventing the government from doing anything to help a spiraling economy.

So, we're going to spend the next 14 months doing nothing. Because *nothing* the Republicans have offered will do anything for the economy except hurt it. Corporations are already sitting on 3 Trillion (yes Trillion) Dollars in cash reserves. Cutting their taxes won't induce them to spend it. There's no demand (that's why it's called a demand recession). Meanwhile, interest rates are about zero. (and in fact are effectively negative in some cases) So investing it gives the same rate of return as cash.

So by cutting taxes of corporations, you're taking money that would be spent (which pays wages and for other companies to perform work), and instead forcing the US government to borrow even more money. While the corporations continue to sit on their increasingly large cash reserves.

Le me be blunt. The Republicans oppose anything they feel will help Obama. The damage being done to America in the process? Just have to break a few eggs to make that omelet. Right?

The only chance America has is if enough Republican congressmen begin to fear for their jobs, but with the gerrymandering that the states have done, there are so many safe seats that the only fear the Republicans have are challenges from the *right*.

... and people still don't understand how dire the situation in Europe really is. There's a very real chance that you could see Greece, then Portugal, then Ireland, then Italy, then Spain, all default. and if you thought the consequences of the Banking crisis was severe... yeah... We're sitting here doing nothing, whistling past the graveyard, and hoping that our inaction doesn't doom America.

297 laZardo  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:46:37pm

re: #293 Alexzander

Got mom some chocolates for her birthday.

Then suddenly found out that my little brother got hospitalized for spontaneous severe stomach pains, which my mother suspect runs down her side of the family.

You?

298 austin_blue  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:47:03pm

re: #283 austin_blue

It think it is. At conception, the new cell that is formed can do wonderful things. It is self-replicating. It contains a human genetic code that will inform its development into a fully functional human being, delivered into the world as a happy, healthy, screeching New American, as enshrined in the Constitution as an American Citizen by dint of being born on American soil!

Unless it doesn't. It might not implant into the uterine wall and be flushed out of the uterus during the next menstrual cycle (up to 50% of fertilized ova). It might implant but not be viable before the next menstrual cycle (up to 10%). It might be spontaneously aborted (miscarried) during the first three months because of significant genetic defects or hormonal imbalances (5-10%).

And so on.

In any case, it's life, but not necessarily human life, of which we've got a settled definition. That's because we, as a culture, did not want to be vivisectionists when harvesting organs to save sick humans. If it doesn't have a functioning forebrain, a living corpse can be used as an organ donor.

So when does a fetus achieve a functioning forebrain, by definition, that would not allow it to be an organ donor?

Best guess right now is 19 weeks.

Sorry, Huckabucka.

Got curious, did some research. Looked at some peer reviewed articles. My best guess of 19 weeks was bullshit. The result is a Geez! inducing paper.

One overview study states that until a fetus hits 33 weeks, it would be eligible for donor status:

[Link: brainmind.com...]

The money quote:

"It is evident that the fetus is capable of considerable behavioral complexity. These complex actions appear to be mediated and governed by the brainstem with minimal forebrain participation, for similar behaviors are demonstrated by anencephalics and following forebrain destruction. However, although forebrain influences are minimal, the late-term fetal brainstem may also be capable of experience-induced synaptic plasticity, and can become organized to respond selectively to certain auditory stimuli presented up to 6 weeks before birth. These latter findings could be interpreted as evidence for exceedingly rudimentary, learning-related cognitive-like activity."

I'm a whole lot uncomfortable with this. I have neighbors whose twins were born at 23 1/2 weeks. They're beautiful kids, although they have *huge* issues, ranging from blindness to cerebral palsy. Twenty years ago, they would not have survived.

I guess I am at the point that if they can survive outside of the womb, they're human. If they can't, they aren't. The existence of a functional cerebral cortex (our definition of human death) just isn't there from 0 to 32 weeks.

299 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Tue, Sep 20, 2011 11:57:07pm

re: #298 austin_blue

Just as a counterpoint, I have a friend who's 29, (that I'm on the phone with even as I type this, and was born at 25 weeks) at a little over 2 pounds in 1982, Her only health issues she has are her lungs. But not debilitatingly so. Evidently, when she was born, her father was told by the doctor, "Do you have good insurance?"

She knows she was lucky to not have worse issues, but it's an interesting question of viability, how early can a fetus be delivered and be viable?

300 austin_blue  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:05:00am

re: #299 bloodstar

Just as a counterpoint, I have a friend who's 29, (that I'm on the phone with even as I type this, and was born at 25 weeks) at a little over 2 pounds in 1982, Her only health issues she has are her lungs. But not debilitatingly so. Evidently, when she was born, her father was told by the doctor, "Do you have good insurance?"

She knows she was lucky to not have worse issues, but it's an interesting question of viability, how early can a fetus be delivered and be viable?

When they live? That's kind of a QRD.

301 sagehen  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:07:27am

the world record is 22 weeks... under perfect conditions (at a hospital with state-of-the-art neonatal unit and top-notch specialists), and even so it shocked the doctors. Generally, they give 50/50 odds of survival for a 25 weeks delivery.

302 austin_blue  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:09:14am

re: #300 austin_blue

When they live? That's kind of a QED.

303 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:13:57am

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

After Obama's tax bomb on Monday, heck yes! I'm not going to vote for someone whose plan is built around 3 dollars in tax increases for 1 dollar of spending cuts, with any Medicare changes put off till 2017. I can see Perry pandering, but I don't think he actually believe the words of the Secession Declaration.

lmao

Obama in a landslide, if this is how conservatives make their decisions. Rotfl!

304 austin_blue  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:14:39am

I've got to go to bed. I've added my $.02. Please tear my argument apart, if you can. It really, really is an important policy and Constitutional question.

Goodnight, dear Lizards! Sweet scaly dreams!

305 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:15:22am

re: #296 bloodstar

Just have to break a few eggs to make that omelet. Right?

Yerp!

306 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:23:03am

re: #297 laZardo

Hey. One of my friends up there mentioned Carolyn Downs / Country Doctor as a good community resource.

307 laZardo  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:24:17am

re: #306 goddamnedfrank

I'll write it down for her to pick up in the morning, thanks. She said she already visited a clinic affiliated with the UW earlier.

308 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:38:07am

re: #307 laZardo

I'll write it down for her to pick up in the morning, thanks. She said she already visited a clinic affiliated with the UW earlier.

Honestly she might get better overall service through the UW clinic. Country Doctor apparently has a good medical staff but the wait is always long and the reception staff not always the most gracious. Low income community clinics are often overwhelmed and courtesy unfortunately sometimes takes a back seat. That was my experience in Santa Barbara which has an incredible county public health department. I was medically indigent for a hard moment and the county totally saved my life.

309 laZardo  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:50:31am

Headan to bed. Nighty.

310 freetoken  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:50:42am
MP3 Audio
311 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 12:58:38am

I really hate being up this early.
Morning Honcos.

312 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:15:36am

I don't need no stinking rope!! (or a car running in the garage, or pills, or a gun...)
[Link: www.timesunion.com...]

313 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:27:59am

re: #312 Cannadian Club Akbar

he died doing something he loved, like a musician keeling over on stage or a hunter dying from a moose falling on him...

314 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:29:08am

Headline:
Jill Lyle, Santa Fe Substitute Teacher, Fired After Allegedly Passing Out With Alcohol

FTA:
The terms and specific reasons for Lyle's termination are not being made public.

What??? You just gave the reason!!
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

315 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:31:40am

Subs who cannot hold their drink are not worth their salt...

316 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:33:38am

re: #313 ralphieboy

he died doing something he loved, like a musician keeling over on stage or a hunter dying from a moose falling on him...

Or a hooker being stabbed by a fat guy with sores on his face...

317 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:37:21am

re: #315 ralphieboy

Subs who cannot hold their drink are not worth their salt...

I worked with a guy years ago. I was telling him about a teacher who needed to take a 2 week "break" because we kinda drove her nuts. He then told me about a teacher he had who committed herself. Turned out it was the same woman, just a year apart.

318 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:39:10am

re: #316 Cannadian Club Akbar

Now that was tasteless, and not even fitting: how about a mistress whose neck snaps under the weight of the diamond necklace her sugar daddy has just bought her?

319 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:41:25am

re: #318 ralphieboy

Now that was tasteless, and not even fitting: how about a mistress whose neck snaps under the weight of the diamond necklace her sugar daddy has just bought her?

You leave Newt's mistress out of this.

320 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:45:39am

re: #319 Cannadian Club Akbar

You leave Newt's mistress out of this.

it's just his passion for America that drives him to do it...

321 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:48:27am

re: #114 goddamnedfrank

Is this the kind of person you want nominating Supreme Court Justices?

Ron "Champion of Liberty" Paul sez the same:

Consider the Lawrence case decided by the Supreme Court in June. The Court determined that Texas had no right to establish its own standards for private sexual conduct, because gay sodomy is somehow protected under the 14th amendment “right to privacy.” Ridiculous as sodomy laws may be, there clearly is no right to privacy nor sodomy found anywhere in the Constitution. There are, however, states' rights — rights plainly affirmed in the Ninth and Tenth amendments. Under those amendments, the State of Texas has the right to decide for itself how to regulate social matters like sex, using its own local standards. But rather than applying the real Constitution and declining jurisdiction over a properly state matter, the Court decided to apply the imaginary Constitution and impose its vision on the people of Texas.

Oh, and that text also contains this gem from "the defender of the Constitution":

The real tragedy is that our founders did not intend a separation of church and state, and never envisioned a rigidly secular public life for America. They simply wanted to prevent Congress from establishing a state religion, as England had. The First amendment says “Congress shall make no law” — a phrase that cannot possibly be interpreted to apply to the city of San Diego.

[Link: www.lewrockwell.com...]

322 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:50:32am

re: #320 ralphieboy

it's just his passion for America that drives him to do it...

Well, as long as some 10 years olds from Sierra Leone and Liberia died for the diamonds to make the necklace....
/

323 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 1:56:56am

re: #321 000G

Ron "Champion of Liberty" Paul sez the same:

Oh, and that text also contains this gem from "the defender of the Constitution":

[Link: www.lewrockwell.com...]

Dirty confederate.

324 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:03:41am

I do have to agree that there has been an overreaction resulting in some people calling for banning religion from public discourse, but this is just the blowback from a time when (Protestant) Christianity was the de facto state religion of America.

I have trouble seeing Christians in America as oppressed victims at this stage.

And I suspect that a lot of the same people who rage at the Ground Zero Mosque have no trouble with Christian prayers in schools or public nativity scenes.

325 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:04:12am

My radio just said the hikers in Iran will be released today.
[Link: www.reuters.com...]

I wonder if Dinnerjacket will be sure to point this out. Fucking douche.

326 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:05:07am

re: #325 Cannadian Club Akbar

My radio just said the hikers in Iran will be released today.
[Link: www.reuters.com...]

I wonder if Dinnerjacket will be sure to point this out. Fucking douche.

Not only make a point, but say something to the affect that it was due to him over the stern objections of 'his" people

327 researchok  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:09:59am

Morning, all

328 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:10:56am

re: #326 sattv4u2

Not only make a point, but say something to the affect that it was due to him over the stern objections of 'his" people

I'm sure he will bring up Iran's compassion when/if he speaks at the UN. And then he'll call for the destruction of Israel, but no one will hear that.

329 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:12:41am

re: #328 Cannadian Club Akbar

I'm sure he will bring up Iran's compassion when/if he speaks at the UN. And then he'll call for the destruction of Israel, but no one will hear that.

It's also a total coincidence that after (over) two years they'll be released while shortshit is in the USA
No connection at all ,, nuh uh!

330 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:18:13am

re: #329 sattv4u2

It's also a total coincidence that after (over) two years they'll be released while shortshit is in the USA
No connection at all ,, nuh uh!

Let's have dinner with him!!!!
[Link: newyork.cbslocal.com...]

“Some segments within the U.S. government orchestrated the attacks to reverse the declining economy and its grips on the Middle East in order to save the Zionist regime,” Ahmadinejad said.

Gripping conversation, that's for sure!!

331 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:21:27am

re: #330 Cannadian Club Akbar

in order to save the Zionist regime,

Drats ,,, he's on to us!!

332 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:24:14am

re: #331 sattv4u2

in order to save the Zionist regime,

Drats ,,, he's on to us!!

I'm sure Dinnerjacket will praise DADT, too. Although it might be a little weird for him since they don't have teh gays in Iran unless they are swinging from a crane.

333 researchok  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:26:15am

re: #332 Cannadian Club Akbar

I'm sure Dinnerjacket will praise DADT, too. Although it might be a little weird for him since they don't have teh gays in Iran unless they are swinging from a crane.

I wish that were a joke.

334 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:29:12am

re: #333 researchok

I wish that were a joke.

I've seen some of the LiveLeak videos. They don't hang them in the regular sense of hanging, they pick them up off the ground.

335 researchok  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:34:21am

How 21st century.
//

336 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:43:19am

DADT in Iran: don't ask, don't torture

337 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:51:20am

CCA

Good luck today

Let me know how it goes

338 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:51:32am

I'm gonna beat Rogue One to the punch (no pun intended)
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

339 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 2:51:34am

and on that note, the long quiet drive home beckons

340 wheat-dogg  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:22:11am

re: #256 Lidane

I've been using FF for years, but each new version never seemed to fix the dreaded memory leak that Mozilla swore at first didn't exist. (Memory leak denialism) A few nights ago, using FF6, my notebook fan was whirring like mad and response to everything was snail slow. I opened up procexp and found FF had gobbled up 1.6GB of my 4GB RAM! I guess I had it running too long all day.

I checked the Internet and found Mozilla now admits, well, yeah, there's some kinda problem with memory leakage, so try this new beta 7. We fixed it this time, really! I downloaded it, what the hell. So far, no memory problems -- FF only using about 300 MB.

And yeah, I have Chrome and Opera, too. If FF7 still leaks, I'll give it up for Chrome.

341 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:36:38am

This is just stoopid.
[Link: miami.cbslocal.com...]

342 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:41:41am

re: #341 Cannadian Club Akbar

This is just stoopid.
[Link: miami.cbslocal.com...]

Now prostitutes in Manatee County have learned: stick it with a pin first before you suck it to make sure it is real...

This is just a slight "foretaste" of what awaits us if we let the religious fundamentalists start imposting their view of morality on our legal and justice systems...

343 Obdicut  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:43:26am

re: #340 wheatdogg

FF7 still leaks for me, but I use greasemonkey extensively.

344 Obdicut  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:44:40am

re: #342 ralphieboy

Does arresting prostitutes in any way help them stop being prostitutes?

Nope.

So what the fuck good does it do?

345 Varek Raith  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:46:07am

re: #343 Obdicut

FF7 still leaks for me, but I use greasemonkey extensively.

Yeah, the leak is still there though it isn't as bad.
In my case anyways.

346 Obdicut  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:46:48am

re: #345 Varek Raith

Heh. Ironically, I'm ctrl-alt-del-ing it right now, because it just leaked while I was playing Kingdom of Loathing.

347 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:46:57am

re: #342 ralphieboy

Know what's fucked up, kinda? My link is from a Miami link. There is no mention of the story in the Manatee paper. Sheesh.

348 Obdicut  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:47:13am

re: #346 Obdicut

While using 1.5 megs of ram, too.

349 Varek Raith  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:47:50am

re: #348 Obdicut

While using 1.5 megs of ram, too.

Lol.
Sorry man.

350 Varek Raith  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:50:00am

I skipped FF 4 and 5. I'll give 7 a few months or I ditch it. Sheesh.

351 Obdicut  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:50:10am

re: #349 Varek Raith

Luckily, multiple cores + 4 megs of ram means it never takes down my computer, just itself.

352 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:51:10am

So I have a new FB friend. A girl I went to HS with. Saw her first post this morning since becoming friends. Was scripture. Now, there's nothing wrong with that, but I friended her because she's a former Playboy Centerfold. I'm always late to the party.:(

353 Varek Raith  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:51:42am

re: #351 Obdicut

Luckily, multiple cores + 4 megs of ram means it never takes down my computer, just itself.

That's true.
I got 8 cores and 8 gigs of ram.
BRING IT ON, FF!!!
My laptop, otoh, would asplode.

354 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:52:24am

Wow,,,,, I think I just set a record

That had to the the fastest drive home I've had since moving here

Didn't get stopped at one red light
Didn't get behind any school buses
The part of the highway I take was void of 18 wheelers


All this extra time I now have between the time I get my son up for school/ he leaves for school and I go to bed

It's ,,, MINUTES!!

YYIIPPPEEEEE

355 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:53:24am

re: #352 Cannadian Club Akbar

So I have a new FB friend. A girl I went to HS with. Saw her first post this morning since becoming friends. Was scripture. Now, there's nothing wrong with that, but I friended her because she's a former Playboy Centerfold. I'm always late to the party.:(

Tell her you've been praying hard for her and the Lord told you it's best if you lay hands on her!

356 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:54:32am

re: #355 sattv4u2

Tell her you've been praying hard for her and the Lord told you it's best if you lay hands on her!

FTFY

357 Varek Raith  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:55:14am

[Updated at 6:21 a.m. ET] Swiss Ambassador in Iran Livia Leu Agosti told CNN she had not been officially informed of the pending release of two U.S. hikers, but would undertake all duties normally handled by American officials in such circumstances. Switzerland handles United States interests in Tehran because there is no American embassy there.

[Updated at 5:27 a.m. ET] Iran's semi-official FARS news agency says the two American hikers will be handed over to officials from the Swiss Embassy at 3 p.m. local (6:30 a.m. ET) Wednesday.

358 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:57:23am

re: #357 Varek Raith

[Updated at 6:21 a.m. ET] Swiss Ambassador in Iran Livia Leu Agosti told CNN she had not been officially informed of the pending release of two U.S. hikers, but would undertake all duties normally handled by American officials in such circumstances. Switzerland handles United States interests in Tehran because there is no American embassy there.

[Updated at 5:27 a.m. ET] Iran's semi-official FARS news agency says the two American hikers will be handed over to officials from the Swiss Embassy at 3 p.m. local (6:30 a.m. ET) Wednesday.

TRANSLATION,,, they're waiting to make sure the ransom check penalty check clears

359 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:57:38am

re: #344 Obdicut

Does arresting prostitutes in any way help them stop being prostitutes?

Nope.

So what the fuck good does it do?

It stops them from behaving in a manner that fundamentalist Christians find immoral. And puts them out of work. And shows that police officers will stop at nothing to find creative solutions to enable them to better do their job.

We can discuss this all day, but our society is miles removed from being able to see that what consenting adults do for fun in their spare time is noboy's business but their own.

360 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:57:47am

re: #357 Varek Raith

Soon afterward, a convoy of Swiss embassy cars entered Iran's Evin prison where Josh Fattal and Shane Bauer were being held, a Reuters journalist reported, signaling that their release was imminent.

[Link: www.reuters.com...]

361 Varek Raith  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:58:10am

"Steam has stopped working"

Figures.

362 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 3:58:58am

re: #361 Varek Raith

"Steam has stopped working"

Figures.

You in a Turkish bathhouse!?!?

NTTAWWT!!

363 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:12:10am

Whats that I hear??
Oh ,, it's my pillow,, calling my name,,, softly enticing me to it's comfort!!

364 Obdicut  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:15:07am

re: #359 ralphieboy

It stops them from behaving in a manner that fundamentalist Christians find immoral. And puts them out of work. And shows that police officers will stop at nothing to find creative solutions to enable them to better do their job.

We can discuss this all day, but our society is miles removed from being able to see that what consenting adults do for fun in their spare time is noboy's business but their own.

But it doesn't even do that. The prostitute will get bailed out immediately, most of the time. They'll usually, if even conviced, face a fine and a small amount of time in jail. Then they'll be back at it, after they're out. In fact, arresting them, having that on their record, makes it harder for them to stop being prostitutes.

It's not the morality of it I even am arguing about, it's the efficacy. If the goal is less prostitution, arresting prostitutes won't achieve that.

365 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:19:47am

re: #364 Obdicut

Depending on the times convicted, a prostitute here will get probation, community service (irony) and have to take a sex ed class (ripoff).
Guys caught trying to pick up prostitutes get pretty much the same and lose their drivers license for a year, but can get a business permit (work, store, Dr's, church) after 6 months. Not sure what happens to the prostitutes DL.

366 Shropshire_Slasher  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:20:23am

re: #312 Cannadian Club Akbar
As the crow flies, that's in my back yard.

367 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:26:37am

re: #366 Shropshire_Slasher

As the crow flies, that's in my back yard.

I'll sell you a scarecrow to keep them out

368 sattv4u2  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:27:14am

Blissful bedtime

Later

369 Shropshire_Slasher  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:29:04am

This pisses me off:
[Link: www.timesunion.com...]
The State Police here seem to be above the law. If you or I did what he did, we would still be in jail with no bail.
The guy he killed was tried and convicted in the court of public opinion for being a drunk. I feel for his family.
BTW, where the officer hit the guy, was a straight road, no curves, no dips, nuthin.

370 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:35:36am

re: #364 Obdicut

It stops the prostitutes temporarily, which is good enough for the moralists to say they are doing their job.

I remember when my nephew, who works for the Mesa, Arizona police department, showed me a video tape he had made of a Red Hot Chili peppers concert around 1990.

The city had heard about them appearing onstage wearing sothing but socks on their cocks and wanted to have evidence in the event they should pull that stunt in Mesa.

So he had the job of setting up a video camera from a balcony overlooking the open-air amphitheater and taping the concert. I even asked him how many cars were stolen and how many houses were broken into during the time he was filming it, and he agreed it was a pretty stupid allocation of resources.

But it showed that the City of Mwas willing to go to great lengths to uphold its standards of decency...

371 Obdicut  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:37:14am

re: #370 ralphieboy

Sigh. Humanity. Look at us. Obsessed with our most basic biological functions.

372 S'latch  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:46:00am

When Mike Huckabee says "Let’s not kid ourselves; this is not about elevating women . . .." I just naturally suspect it must be about elevating women.

373 garhighway  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:52:23am

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

After Obama's tax bomb on Monday, heck yes! I'm not going to vote for someone whose plan is built around 3 dollars in tax increases for 1 dollar of spending cuts, with any Medicare changes put off till 2017. I can see Perry pandering, but I don't think he actually believe the words of the Secession Declaration.

Because keeping taxes low on the wealthy is clearly way more important than women's health, global warming, respecting science, repeating the separation of church and state or any of those other silly things that Perry shits on every day.

374 garhighway  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:53:43am

re: #359 ralphieboy

It stops them from behaving in a manner that fundamentalist Christians find immoral. And puts them out of work. And shows that police officers will stop at nothing to find creative solutions to enable them to better do their job.

We can discuss this all day, but our society is miles removed from being able to see that what consenting adults do for fun in their spare time is noboy's business but their own.

I don't think anyone realistically equates prostitution with "fun".

375 wheat-dogg  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:54:29am

re: #77 Lidane

Hey, Charles -- apparently you're a science denier now:

ROFL

"prenatal science denier" -- Apparently there's a whole new branch of science now. It joins YEC and ID as part of the right wing science curriculum.

376 freetoken  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:57:05am

As more (as if more is needed) evidence of how the far the reactionary right is now running with their talking points, did anyone catch PalePat's latest (Sep 16) article?

Titled "The Democracy Worshipers" Buchanan writes:

[...]


And neither Africa nor Arabia offers much in the way of hope.

The overthrow of Ian Smith’s government in Rhodesia brought to power Robert Mugabe and his Mashona, who proceeded to massacre the Matabele of rival Joshua Nkomo, rob the whites of their property, drive them out of their country and create the hellhole that is Zimbabwe.

Yet such is the power of democracy worship, this secular religion, to blind people to the evidence of their own eyes that virtually every Western leader favored one-man, one-vote democracy in Rhodesia.

As we see in Julius Malema, that admirer of Mugabe and 30-year-old firebrand of Mandela’s ANC, just convicted of a hate crime for his singing of the anti-apartheid ditty “Shoot the Boer!” who wants to expropriate South Africa’s mines and confiscate white farms, racism and tribalism are alive and well in liberated Southern Africa. And democracy is their enabler.

[...]

One man, one vote - oh the evil that!

Nobody should be deceived - the reactionary right in this country would have been quite happy with this country before 1860.

377 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:57:32am

re: #374 garhighway

I don't think anyone realistically equates prostitution with "fun".

Then why do the customers offer to pay for it? Biological compulsion?

I understand that the prostitutes don't necessarily see it as fun, but why do they continue to offer their services for cash unless they see a personal or financial advantage in doing so instead of working at a minimum-wage job?

378 Shropshire_Slasher  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:59:12am

re: #377 ralphieboy

Taxes?
/

379 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:59:37am

re: #374 garhighway

I don't think anyone realistically equates prostitution with "fun".

Tourists who visit Nevada and Amsterdam.

380 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 4:59:48am

re: #376 freetoken


I especially like the "rob the whites of their property" riff. Tell me, Pat, how did the whites come to own their property in the first place?

381 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:00:12am

re: #378 Shropshire_Slasher

Taxes?
/

If they call the money they get "gifts" aren't the first 13K tax exempt?

382 garhighway  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:02:27am

re: #377 ralphieboy

Then why do the customers offer to pay for it? Biological compulsion?

I understand that the prostitutes don't necessarily see it as fun, but why do they continue to offer their services for cash unless they see a personal or financial advantage in doing so instead of working at a minimum-wage job?

While I am not claiming to be an expert here, my understanding is that the vast majority do it because they think they have to. They are drug-addicted, they are under coercion, they are psychologically damaged, etc...

Obviously, I am not talking about the exceptions: the high-end call girls, the Craig's list dabblers, etc.. I am talking about the hard core streetwalkers. No fun there.

I get that there's a libertarian argument that prostitutes should be left to do their thing in peace, just as that same argument applies to heroin addicts. Both behaviors are deeply self-destructive, but, to a point, they harm no one else. Still...

383 garhighway  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:04:15am

Meanwhile, in "Country First" territory, the GOP demands that The Fed not try to revive the economy.

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

Sample:

Even though the financial markets have been counting on the Federal Reserve to take action, Republican Congressional leadership sent a letter to the Federal Reserve chairman on Tuesday evening urging it not to engage in further stimulus.

Ya gotta love these guys. They have no shame.

384 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:04:16am

re: #378 Shropshire_Slasher

Taxes?
/

Even in Amsterdam they are just starting to institute a tax on prostitution.

It has always been a bit of a gray area in Europe: it is decriminalized only to the extent that it remains a punishable offense, but will not be prosecuted if it is practiced within cedrtain designated areas of the city and/or does not constitute a public nuisance.

There are similar rules governing it in Germany, but another major catch is that because it is still illegal, there can therefore be no binding legal contract between prostitute and client as it is illegal to conclude a legal contract over an illegal act.

Therefore if the client stiffs the prostitue (so to speak) she has no legal recourse to collecting her money and is required to employ the services of a pimp...

385 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:07:32am

re: #382 garhighway


It is a vicious cycle, because it is illegal, they are not able to practice their trade under "market conditions" and benefit from the fruits of their labor.

I must admit that I have never paid for the services of a prostitute.

Not that I have any moral objection to it, but for starters I am too cheap, and even if I were willing to pay for it, I would have trouble knowing that the girl herself keeps only a small part of the money, the rest goes tot he pimps, dealers and sundry racketeers who live off her.

386 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:24:51am

8 Simple Questions You Won't Believe Science Can't Answer

So, what happens when you ask scientists exactly what makes a bicycle stable? Or what keeps it going? Or how people ride them? Well, odds are they’ll either nervously tell you that they have cookies in the oven and run out on you, or if they’re honest, they’ll give you a pretty big shrug. In fact, top bike researchers admit that, even though some people have come up with equations on how to ride a bike or how they think bikes work, those equations are pretty much fancy icing on top of a cake of cluelessness. One Cornell researcher even says that absolutely nobody has ever come to an intuitive understanding of what makes a bicycle do its thing.

[Link: www.cracked.com...]

387 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:32:54am

My radio just said the Iranian hikers are free. Haven't seen a link yet. (said it was confirmed by the State Department)

388 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:39:51am

re: #387 Cannadian Club Akbar

My radio just said the Iranian hikers are free. Haven't seen a link yet. (said it was confirmed by the State Department)

[Link: www.cnn.com...]

389 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:39:57am

re: #386 000G


My dad explained that riding a bicycle is a permanent act of falling down, but as long as you are moving you can just keep steering away from hitting the ground...

390 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:42:29am

re: #376 freetoken

Yet such is the power of democracy worship, this secular religion, to blind people to the evidence of their own eyes that virtually every Western leader favored one-man, one-vote democracy in Rhodesia.

As we see in Julius Malema, that admirer of Mugabe and 30-year-old firebrand of Mandela’s ANC, just convicted of a hate crime for his singing of the anti-apartheid ditty “Shoot the Boer!” who wants to expropriate South Africa’s mines and confiscate white farms, racism and tribalism are alive and well in liberated Southern Africa. And democracy is their enabler.

This dolt doesn't even know when he's arguing against his own case--am I wrong that this 'firebrand' was arrested for anti-White speech by a Black-dominated government?

(I don't doubt that I could find a young Creek firebrand who would like to expropriate my butt from Alabama.)

'Morning, all.

391 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:44:58am

re: #389 ralphieboy

My dad explained that riding a bicycle is a permanent act of falling down, but as long as you are moving you can just keep steering away from hitting the ground...

Heh. Earth orbit has been described as falling to the Earth, but continually missing.

392 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:51:29am

Good morning Lizards!

Hazy and humid in the lovely city of Philadelphia this morning after some overnight rain. And lots on the plate here at work once I finish my first cup of coffee.*

* - which I am dragging out since modifying SSIS packages is often a big pain in the ass.

393 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:56:50am

Morning Lizardim. Today dawns warm (well, warmer, anyway) and rainy here in the wild north country. Makes it a perfect day to stay in the garage and work on my car for a while, I'd say.

394 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:57:42am

re: #393 thedopefishlives

Morning Lizardim. Today dawns warm (well, warmer, anyway) and rainy here in the wild north country. Makes it a perfect day to stay in the garage and work on my car for a while, I'd say.

Morning. Interesting car?

395 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 5:59:07am

re: #392 oaktree

the lovely city of Philadelphia

There's another Philadelphia? You mean the one in Indiana? New York? Mississippi? North Carolina? Tennessee?

396 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:00:08am

re: #394 Decatur Deb

Morning. Interesting car?

A 1984 VW Rabbit Mk I. It was a gift from my father-in-law because I drive ~40 miles to work one way every day. The fuel efficiency has been a major saver on my monthly budget.

397 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:02:37am

re: #396 thedopefishlives

My Highlander gets 23 mpg. However, I have 300K on it. Its' a 2004.

So, the extra I've spent in gas has been (IMO) softened by the 140.00 I have spent on repairs (over the car's lifetime) and the fact I haven't had to buy another car.

That Rabbit's rockin' it out for you, sounds like.

398 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:04:03am

re: #396 thedopefishlives

A 1984 VW Rabbit Mk I. It was a gift from my father-in-law because I drive ~40 miles to work one way every day. The fuel efficiency has been a major saver on my monthly budget.

Great to get a beater that does the job. FIL gave me a 73 Toyota once, just to drive to AL while our car was returning from O/S. It got great mileage, and just wouldn't die. Finally sold it to a guy for a hundred bucks. It might still be running around town. (My fun ride is a 73 LandRover.)

399 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:04:30am

re: #397 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My Highlander gets 23 mpg. However, I have 300K on it. Its' a 2004.

So, the extra I've spent in gas has been (IMO) softened by the 140.00 I have spent on repairs (over the car's lifetime) and the fact I haven't had to buy another car.

That Rabbit's rockin' it out for you, sounds like.

At 53 mpg, even the higher cost of maintenance is more than offset by the savings in fuel. Certainly an improvement on a month-to-month basis compared to my wife's Dodge Dakota, at 18.5 mpg. That being said, the little Rabbit is probably going to be replaced by a considerably newer Volkswagen, probably more in the Jetta family, as soon as I can save back enough cash.

400 wheat-dogg  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:07:53am

When I was in LA last month, I got a glimpse of a classic Beetle tooling around Santa Monica. Looked brand new, at least from three blocks away.
That's a diehard Beetle fan.

401 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:09:30am

re: #400 wheatdogg

When I was in LA last month, I got a glimpse of a classic Beetle tooling around Santa Monica. Looked brand new, at least from three blocks away.
That's a diehard Beetle fan.

There's a classic car show at the local drive-in every Thursday. One of the guys that attends has a classic Beetle in this lovely cream-white color. Absolutely spotless car, which is remarkable for Minnesota. Sometimes I forget just how cute those little cars are.

402 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:11:30am

re: #400 wheatdogg

When I was in LA last month, I got a glimpse of a classic Beetle tooling around Santa Monica. Looked brand new, at least from three blocks away.
That's a diehard Beetle fan.

We have a guy who has an all-Beetle (and Karman) junkyard. He puts zombie Beetles back on the road. It's a shame we really don't have the rust-free climate for old cars.

403 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:13:42am

re: #402 Decatur Deb

We have a guy who has an all-Beetle (and Karman) junkyard. He puts zombie Beetles back on the road. It's a shame we really don't have the rust-free climate for old cars.

My buddy in Flagstaff, AZ, used to drive a 1956 VW bus with split rear window and everything. Do not know if it is still alive and kicking.

404 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:15:06am

re: #403 ralphieboy

My buddy in Flagstaff, AZ, used to drive a 1956 VW bus with split rear window and everything. Do not know if it is still alive and kicking.

Yes. Did some duty in Tuscon, old-car heaven.

405 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:19:05am

re: #403 ralphieboy

My buddy in Flagstaff, AZ, used to drive a 1956 VW bus with split rear window and everything. Do not know if it is still alive and kicking.

Had a friend of mine in college that drove an old Volkswagen Cabriolet mini-pickup. He got a certificate from Volkswagen for turning 300k miles on the original engine and transmission. The very next week, he snapped the timing belt and destroyed the engine.

406 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:19:46am

My sister had a Beetle (her first car).

She now drives a high-end Lexus convertible. (Yeah, she needs to pay more taxes, who needs a Lexus?).

To this day, her favorite car?

The "Beetle".

407 wheat-dogg  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:20:12am

re: #403 ralphieboy

My buddy in Flagstaff, AZ, used to drive a 1956 VW bus with split rear window and everything. Do not know if it is still alive and kicking.

Jeez. It's as old as me. My dad went through four of those microbuses for his TV repair biz from 1959 to 1968. The last one basically rusted away by 1975, IIRC. We lived on Long Island. Salt in many forms.

408 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:21:47am

re: #407 wheatdogg

Growing up? We had a VW bus.

Dad drove it until he found out that hippies liked them. Then he traded it in.

(Not really true, but I prefer that version of the story that I made up)

409 wheat-dogg  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:23:15am

Little Miss Sunshine brings back memories of those VW buses. However, we didn't stash grandpa on the cargo shelf above the engine.

410 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:23:19am

re: #400 wheatdogg

That's a diehard Beetle fan.

I always kind of wanted one of those Beetles with the Rolls Royce looking front end. Always thought they were cool looking.

411 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:23:23am

I learned to drive in my mom's 1971 VW Beetle. Trashed the front end jumping RR crossings in NW Indiana.

412 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:23:27am

re: #406 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My first car was a '91 Chevy. It was destroyed in a serious accident wherein I was rear-ended by a dump truck hauling Indiana limestone from a quarry. My family and I all still reminisce about that old beater. There's just something about a first car that forms a unique attachment.

413 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:25:55am

re: #411 ralphieboy

I learned to drive in my mom's 1971 VW Beetle. Trashed the front end jumping RR crossings in NW Indiana.

I was born in NW Indiana. Near Michigan City.

414 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:26:10am

re: #409 wheatdogg

Little Miss Sunshine brings back memories of those VW buses. However, we didn't stash grandpa on the cargo shelf above the engine.

My little brother would fall asleep in the floor of our VW Bus when we traveled in it. The rubber floor had grooves that ran from front to rear. His face would have an imprint for hours.

By the way, I always thought it was a piece of shit.

415 wheat-dogg  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:26:10am

1970 Dodge Dart. My uncle gave to me in '77 when I was in college. I drove it another 7 years. Snot green paintjob with upholstery to match -- the automobile equivalent of avocado appliances.

416 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:28:14am

re: #415 wheatdogg

1970 Dodge Dart. My uncle gave to me in '77 when I was in college. I drove it another 7 years. Snot green paintjob with upholstery to match -- the automobile equivalent of avocado appliances.

My grandma had an Oldsmobile 88 that was that color. I always thought it was the most hideous beast.

417 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:28:48am

Used to crave a VW camper like the one in the background. Now I want the LR Dormobile in the foreground.

Image: Wrothamhill002.jpg

418 wheat-dogg  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:33:30am

Our last bus was camper, but not the kind with the pop up top. We took to the Catskills and camped out to Chicago one summer.

419 garhighway  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:42:06am

re: #402 Decatur Deb

We have a guy who has an all-Beetle (and Karman) junkyard. He puts zombie Beetles back on the road. It's a shame we really don't have the rust-free climate for old cars.

I had a 69 Beetle. (Really. Be nice.)

It was great in the snow, but even with a bunch of aftermarket accessories it wouldn't heat or defrost for shit. And it was fun having a car I could actually work on.

420 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:44:40am

re: #419 garhighway

I had a 69 Beetle. (Really. Be nice.)

It was great in the snow, but even with a bunch of aftermarket accessories it wouldn't heat or defrost for shit. And it was fun having a car I could actually work on.

Never had one, but learned to drive on a buddy's '66 (and my girlfriend/wife's '66 Mustang).

421 docproto48  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:48:41am

re: #19 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

At this point, the only conclusion I can come to is these people honestly think that if they do "God's will," he'll solve the resulting problems himself. And if not, well, the world need's ditch diggers too. *rolls eyes*

I seriously question how much those at the top believe "Gods will" applies to anyone but themselves just like I question whether leaders of Islamic extremist groups believe suicide is a direct trip to heaven. I don't see them putting on the explosive vests

By the same token when I see people suffering the after effects of a problem who say it must have been God's will are blaming God for their problems

422 garhighway  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:48:52am

re: #420 Decatur Deb

Never had one, but learned to drive on a buddy's '66 (and my girlfriend/wife's '66 Mustang).

I know that we idealize cars from that era, but I remember driving my brother-in-law's Plymouth Satellite with the 383, 4 barrel, dual exhaust, 4-in-the-floor, and it was a freaking rocket. It is a wonder I didn't kill myself.

423 wheat-dogg  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:49:57am

re: #422 garhighway

Yeah, Detroit liked putting way too many horses in cars with crappy brakes and poor handling.

424 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:51:50am

re: #422 garhighway

I know that we idealize cars from that era, but I remember driving my brother-in-law's Plymouth Satellite with the 383, 4 barrel, dual exhaust, 4-in-the-floor, and it was a freaking rocket. It is a wonder I didn't kill myself.

GTOs were the wetdream among my buddies then. Didn't hurt that a very pretty WAC in our shop was initialled 'GTO'.

425 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:52:55am

re: #415 wheatdogg

1970 Dodge Dart. My uncle gave to me in '77 when I was in college. I drove it another 7 years. Snot green paintjob with upholstery to match -- the automobile equivalent of avocado appliances.

The 1970's were the UGLIEST DECADE, ever! Ugly fashions, ugly hair, ugly colors, ugly!

How did anyone survive TEH UGLY?

426 docproto48  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:53:43am

re: #420 Decatur Deb

Never had one, but learned to drive on a buddy's '66 (and my girlfriend/wife's '66 Mustang).

I remember my dads 59 beetle he drove it until 1969 had 2 or 300K miles on it, leaked water from underneeth in heavy rain, he must have changed a zillion fan belts on the road!

427 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:54:39am

re: #425 Alouette

The 1970's were the UGLIEST DECADE, ever! Ugly fashions, ugly hair, ugly colors, ugly!

How did anyone survive TEH UGLY?

'73 seemed to be the bottom for US cars. IRRC, the paint used to drop off Fords in the dealer's lots.

428 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:54:46am

Morning all!

How is it going?

429 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:55:01am

re: #425 Alouette

The 1970's were the UGLIEST DECADE, ever! Ugly fashions, ugly hair, ugly colors, ugly!

How did anyone survive TEH UGLY?

Dark discos, loud music and recreational drugs.

430 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:56:35am

re: #427 Decatur Deb

'73 seemed to be the bottom for US cars. IRRC, the paint used to drop off Fords in the dealer's lots.

But just a few years later we got the early smog controlled cars. I'd say those were the worst. California was first to self inflict itself with the early tech.

431 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:57:45am

re: #429 Rightwingconspirator

Dark discos, loud music and recreational drugs.

You don't want the leisure suit to experience a revival?

432 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:58:12am

re: #426 proto87

I remember my dads 59 beetle he drove it until 1969 had 2 or 300K miles on it, leaked water from underneeth in heavy rain, he must have changed a zillion fan belts on the road!

Heh. I still carry a spare serpentine belt for my TechnoWonder. I'd hate to actually have to change one on the road.

433 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:59:28am

Breaking on CBS and CNN
The hikers are freed in Iran.
Hallelujah & Celebrations

I don't think I ever blogged that word before.

434 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 6:59:47am

re: #432 Decatur Deb

Heh. I still carry a spare serpentine belt for my TechnoWonder. I'd hate to actually have to change one on the road.

One advantage to the Rabbit over my wife's Dakota: The alternator belt is a simple V-belt, no serpentine, no complex tensioners.

435 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:01:42am

re: #431 ggt

You don't want the leisure suit to experience a revival?

Best male birth control evah. You just can not get any interest wearing one of those.

436 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:02:53am

Off to work!

437 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:03:11am

re: #434 thedopefishlives

One advantage to the Rabbit over my wife's Dakota: The alternator belt is a simple V-belt, no serpentine, no complex tensioners.

Not being a great mechanic, I've gone for radical simplicity. My truck has sliding windows, not roll-up, and I can get kits to renew the bearings in my door hinges.

438 wheat-dogg  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:03:22am

re: #435 Rightwingconspirator

Especially now.

439 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:04:28am

My son found a bunch of old family photos from the '70's and posted them on Facebook. I was all like, wow I was REALLY THIN back then but all my clothes were TEH UGLY.

Not to mention my hair and my glasses.

UGLY!

440 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:06:52am

re: #439 Alouette

My son found a bunch of old family photos from the '70's and posted them on Facebook. I was all like, wow I was REALLY THIN back then but all my clothes were TEH UGLY.

Not to mention my hair and my glasses.

UGLY!

I bet you were stylin' tho!

441 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:07:47am

re: #433 Rightwingconspirator

Breaking on CBS and CNN
The hikers are freed in Iran.
Hallelujah & Celebrations

I don't think I ever blogged that word before.

Good news!

442 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:07:47am

re: #437 Decatur Deb

Not being a great mechanic, I've gone for radical simplicity. My truck has sliding windows, not roll-up, and I can get kits to renew the bearings in my door hinges.

Yeah, my dad instilled the mechanical gene in me from a very tender age. His intent, with my sister as well as myself, was that we would be able to take care of ourselves on our own whenever necessary.

443 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:10:38am

re: #442 thedopefishlives

Yeah, my dad instilled the mechanical gene in me from a very tender age. His intent, with my sister as well as myself, was that we would be able to take care of ourselves on our own whenever necessary.

Wife's dad gave her an old Nash Metropolitan. He made her change a perfectly good tire before he gave her the keys. We did the same thing with our daughters.

444 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:12:34am

re: #442 thedopefishlives

Yeah, my dad instilled the mechanical gene in me from a very tender age. His intent, with my sister as well as myself, was that we would be able to take care of ourselves on our own whenever necessary.

My dad drew a schematic of what was under the hood of the car. He used red arrows to point to things like --the oil, the windshield wiper fluid, anti-freeze etc.

Then he taught me how to check and fill these things.

After that, he figured I wouldn't want to learn.

He was right.

445 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:13:00am

re: #440 ggt

I bet you were stylin' tho!

American Gothic, 1970's.

446 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:13:47am

re: #445 Alouette

American Gothic, 1970's.

LOL, you are missing the little neck tie bow thingy.

447 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:14:27am

re: #443 Decatur Deb

Wife's dad gave her an old Nash Metropolitan. He made her change a perfectly good tire before he gave her the keys.

Dad made us both do our own oil changes. He'd buy the oil and filter for us, then after the engine had cooled down a little bit, he'd open up the toolbox and told us to get to it.

448 darthstar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:14:49am

re: #445 Alouette

American Gothic, 1970's.

Careful...you're flashing a little bit of wrist there.

Mornin' everyone.

449 shutdown  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:18:31am

I hate to post and run, but I need to take a moment to voice my disappointment about the tone some comments to page and articles have assumed recently. A few members have become like snipers, waiting in bushes for targets of opportunity and then making snarky or outright aggressive comments, that bear little or no relation to the topic at hand. These members are often people who have posted very little, and have no clear opinion other than anti. Anti-religion or anti-Progressive or anti-Republican or anti-whatever the page happens to be about. Why is that? WHy do I have to be told that I am "the most vindictive poster on LGF", and other ridiculous accusations? It's like being in middle school. Some members think that taking a contrary position is automatically clever and constructive.

Maybe I need a time away to thicken my skin?

450 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:18:59am

re: #447 thedopefishlives

Dad made us both do our own oil changes. He'd buy the oil and filter for us, then after the engine had cooled down a little bit, he'd open up the toolbox and told us to get to it.

We have 2 oil-change parties a year, set for Dec 7 and the 4th of July. Most of the work is in setting up the ramps, containers, and cleanup kit, so I do our cars, any of our kids that are around, and a friend or two.

451 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:21:08am

re: #408 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Growing up? We had a VW bus.

Dad drove it until he found out that hippies liked them. Then he traded it in.

(Not really true, but I prefer that version of the story that I made up)

In high school my girlfriend's family had a 1st gen Rabbit. So imagine the uproar when she says, loudly, one day in the lunchroom that "The Rabbit died"... :eek:

452 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:23:43am

re: #449 imp_62

...snip

Maybe I need a time away to thicken my skin?

That's not how callouses are built up. You might be attaching too much importance to opinions you would ignore in a bar.

453 shutdown  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:23:53am

re: #449 imp_62

I really would like to hear from others here as to whether they are experiencing things the same way. Or is it just me?

454 shutdown  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:25:03am

re: #452 Decatur Deb

Good point. But I have a tendency not to shy away from arguments. I should work on ignoring the snipers from now on.

455 shutdown  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:26:23am

Anyway, gtg for a bit. I'lll be back, and will review the thread for any responses to my moaning.
Bye all

456 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:27:04am

re: #453 imp_62

I really would like to hear from others here as to whether they are experiencing things the same way. Or is it just me?

I know I've been rather pissy lately. I apologize if it has seemed snarky.

Everyone has their moods.

457 darthstar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:27:12am

re: #449 imp_62

Anonymity begets courage...some people just like being contrary on the internet. Don't take them too seriously. I myself can be a snarky asshole at times...but it's cool when I do it.

458 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:27:38am

re: #423 wheatdogg

Yeah, Detroit liked putting way too many horses in cars with crappy brakes and poor handling.

There is a common announcement on the Armed Forces Network in Germany warning Americans about driving their cars on German Autobahns with no speed limit: namely that although American cars might have the horsepower to go at speeds in excess of 100 mph, they generally do not have the suspension, steering or braking to be handled safely at those speeds.

459 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:29:07am

re: #427 Decatur Deb

'73 seemed to be the bottom for US cars. IRRC, the paint used to drop off Fords in the dealer's lots.

I remember a friend who bought a chevy Vega, one of America's first attempts at a sub-compact car after the oil crisis. I noticed that the point of the front was nearly 1" off center from the point of the cooler grill.

460 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:29:28am

re: #454 imp_62

Good point. But I have a tendency not to shy away from arguments. I should work on ignoring the snipers from now on.

A soft answer turneth away wrath; But a grievous word stirreth up anger.

461 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:29:52am

re: #460 Decatur Deb

A soft answer turneth away wrath; But a grievous word stirreth up anger.

There are posters who seem to invite it . .. . .

462 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:30:44am

re: #449 imp_62

I hate to post and run, but I need to take a moment to voice my disappointment about the tone some comments to page and articles have assumed recently. A few members have become like snipers, waiting in bushes for targets of opportunity and then making snarky or outright aggressive comments, that bear little or no relation to the topic at hand. These members are often people who have posted very little, and have no clear opinion other than anti. Anti-religion or anti-Progressive or anti-Republican or anti-whatever the page happens to be about. Why is that? WHy do I have to be told that I am "the most vindictive poster on LGF", and other ridiculous accusations? It's like being in middle school. Some members think that taking a contrary position is automatically clever and constructive.

Maybe I need a time away to thicken my skin?

I've taken an "ignore and move on" approach to a lot of that. Mildly annoying to have to scroll through a snark-fest clogging a page to find the few gem comments, but I don't think there is a real alternative. If you think the discussion is worth responding to, respond.

This is a good community due to Charles' handling of things - controls to keep things from getting out of hand, but also considerable latitude for posters if they do cross the stated lines. You just have to opt to deal with both the good and bad sides of it, and pick the proper times to make the commitment to engage rather than moving on.

463 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:32:24am

re: #451 wlewisiii

In high school my girlfriend's family had a 1st gen Rabbit. So imagine the uproar when she says, loudly, one day in the lunchroom that "The Rabbit died"... :eek:

How many decades has it been already that it is no longer necessary to kill a rabbit for a pregnancy test?

464 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:32:31am

re: #459 ralphieboy

I remember a friend who bought a chevy Vega, one of America's first attempts at a sub-compact car after the oil crisis. I noticed that the point of the front was nearly 1" off center from the point of the cooler grill.

The British went through the same 'fit and finish' decay, and now there is an aftermarket industry disassembling and rebuilding new Russian motorcycles from the original parts.

465 bratwurst  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:33:02am

re: #452 Decatur Deb

You might be attaching too much importance to opinions you would ignore in a bar.

This.

466 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:33:28am

re: #425 Alouette

The 1970's were the UGLIEST DECADE, ever! Ugly fashions, ugly hair, ugly colors, ugly!

How did anyone survive TEH UGLY?

There was a comment from Ozzy Ozbourne on the cover photo of a Black Sabbath Album from the 70's: "That was before we had MTV to show us how to dress."

467 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:34:36am

re: #463 Alouette

How many decades has it been already that it is no longer necessary to kill a rabbit for a pregnancy test?

Don't think wife and I killed any in the 60s.

468 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:35:09am

re: #462 oaktree

I've taken an "ignore and move on" approach to a lot of that. Mildly annoying to have to scroll through a snark-fest clogging a page to find the few gem comments, but I don't think there is a real alternative. If you think the discussion is worth responding to, respond.

This is a good community due to Charles' handling of things - controls to keep things from getting out of hand, but also considerable latitude for posters if they do cross the stated lines. You just have to opt to deal with both the good and bad sides of it, and pick the proper times to make the commitment to engage rather than moving on.

On top of that, if things get too heated between two or more posters, I usually just take a temporary self-enforced time out. By the time I get back, cooler heads have usually prevailed, or a new thread has opened which has not been stained by the vitriol of the previous exchange.

469 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:35:20am

Listening to Obama at the UN right now..
BTW..Happy Birthday to me!

470 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:36:30am

re: #469 HoosierHoops

Listening to Obama at the UN right now..
BTW..Happy Birthday to me!

Happy Birthday. And to Prairie, too (missed her last night).

471 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:36:54am

re: #462 oaktree

I've taken an "ignore and move on" approach to a lot of that. Mildly annoying to have to scroll through a snark-fest clogging a page to find the few gem comments, but I don't think there is a real alternative. If you think the discussion is worth responding to, respond.

This is a good community due to Charles' handling of things - controls to keep things from getting out of hand, but also considerable latitude for posters if they do cross the stated lines. You just have to opt to deal with both the good and bad sides of it, and pick the proper times to make the commitment to engage rather than moving on.

There has been an increase in squabbling recently. I've just been ignoring it but it does get annoying, especially for the more casual or newer readers who don't give a shit about the personalities involved.

472 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:37:46am

CAKE!!!!!

473 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:39:23am

I downloaded Skee Ball to my iPhone.

It's as freakin' addictive as the real game.

474 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:39:28am

re: #471 Killgore Trout

There has been an increase in squabbling recently. I've just been ignoring it but it does get annoying, especially for the more casual or newer readers who don't give a shit about the personalities involved.

Between our elections, the UN, and the crappy economy real-world crap is settling in. Also noticed a somewhat better class of troll, with spelling, grammar and all.

475 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:43:13am

Freedom from want is a basic human right?
That Audi A8 is looking better every day.. I want one..
/

476 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:44:26am

We had a fellow yesterday, Buck, who supported a rather unpopular point of view re Rick Perry, and although I disagreed with him, I found that he was set upon in an unnessecarily rude and belligerent manner.

477 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:45:27am

re: #475 HoosierHoops

Freedom from want is a basic human right?
That Audi A8 is looking better every day.. I want one..
/

We must get the UN to redefine the basic human needs as: Food, clothing, shelter, Audi

478 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:50:58am

re: #463 Alouette

How many decades has it been already that it is no longer necessary to kill a rabbit for a pregnancy test?

A very long time. But that was still the saying in 1982. And it took nearly a decade before people stopped asking how our "child" was.

479 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:52:08am

re: #476 ralphieboy

We had a fellow yesterday, Buck, who supported a rather unpopular point of view re Rick Perry, and although I disagreed with him, I found that he was set upon in an unnessecarily rude and belligerent manner.

Antagonists are rarely convinced by arguments that begin: "That's stupid". Buck could be a special case.

480 lawhawk  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:53:02am

re: #475 HoosierHoops

Freedom from want is a basic human right?
That Audi A8 is looking better every day.. I want one..
/

Be careful what you want for.

I want a socialist dictatorship (with me in charge of course) . /
I want a libertarian dictatorship (with me in charge, of course). /

Are there any queers in the audience tonight? Get 'em up against the wall! That one in the spotlight, he don't look right! Get him up against the wall! And that one looks Jewish... and that one's a coon! Who let all this riff raff into the room? That one's smoking a joint! And that one's got spots! If I had my way, I'd have all of you shot!
I want a country free of greens, pinks, purples, oranges (sorry Boehner). /

Somehow, I don't think that's the want they want to talk about.

481 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:57:19am

re: #479 Decatur Deb

Antagonists are rarely convinced by arguments that begin: "That's stupid". Buck could be a special case.

I just found that it got very personal in a big hurry. I did not agree at all with his position on the topic of debate, but I did not see the need to pounce on him.

482 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:57:36am

re: #469 HoosierHoops

Happy Birthday to me!

Happy Birthday!

483 Interesting Times  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:00:50am

re: #481 ralphieboy

I just found that it got very personal in a big hurry.

That happens with people who have a certain "history", if you know what I mean. They don't get the leeway someone without said history would receive.

484 iossarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:04:29am

re: #481 ralphieboy

I just found that it got very personal in a big hurry. I did not agree at all with his position on the topic of debate, but I did not see the need to pounce on him.

Buck drops by and makes the same points over and over again, despite the numerous debunkings.

E.g. "the democrats are the anti-gay party", because of DOMA (Republican bill signed by Clinton in an effort to be bipartisan) and DADT (Democratic bill that actually improved the lot of gay people in the military, and has subsequently been further improved by the current Democratic administration).

There's only so many times you can patiently explain before you call bullshit.

485 Digital Display  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:04:50am

re: #482 wrenchwench

Happy Birthday!

Thank you ww..
We'll I'm about ready to head over to the golf course for a round..
I got my clubs, Cigars and beer ready to go..
I think there are only 2 times you can drink in the morning, Tailgate parties and on a golf course...

486 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:05:44am

re: #483 publicityStunted

That happens with people who have a certain "history", if you know what I mean. They don't get the leeway someone without said history would receive.

If people would be specific about who they think is being rude or getting out of line, then we could dogpile on them.

///

487 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:08:40am

re: #485 HoosierHoops

Thank you ww..
We'll I'm about ready to head over to the golf course for a round..
I got my clubs, Cigars and beer ready to go..
I think there are only 2 times you can drink in the morning, Tailgate parties and on a golf course...

Sounds like a great start to a birthday. Needs some good followup.

488 shutdown  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:10:31am

Thank you all for the thoughts and advice. I need to remember that the "Back" button is my friend.

489 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:23:30am

Ruth Buzzi is a hot Tweeter this morning.

Ruth_A_Buzzi
"Don't Ask - Don't Tell" has been replaced with a new policy in all our military shower rooms. It's now called "Don't Lurk - Don't Smirk."

Ruth_A_Buzzi
Please don't hold it against our fine governor here in Texas that he presided over more than 20 times as many executions as Charles Manson.

And many more, including on the birthday front:

Ruth_A_Buzzi
Today is Fannig Flagg, Larry Hagman and Bill Murray's birthday. So much for astrology. But they're all friends - HAPPY BIRTHDAY, y'all!

Maybe Hoops is really Bill Murray? Or Larry Hagman?

490 Interesting Times  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:24:19am

re: #488 imp_62

Thank you all for the thoughts and advice. I need to remember that the "Back" button is my friend.

Also keep in mind that many people have issues/causes that set them off, which can result in them interpreting something as an attack even when it isn't (i.e. projecting hostility toward their cause onto someone else)

491 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:27:11am

re: #490 publicityStunted

Also keep in mind that many people have issues/causes that set them off, which can result in them interpreting something as an attack even when it isn't (i.e. projecting hostility toward their cause onto someone else)

AGW is all but guaranteed to set off flame wars, Israel a close second.

Last night it hinged on Rick Perry's stated support for Israel, which seems like a good thing on the surface, but if you dig a bit deeper into his associations, his "Christian mandate to support Israel" takes on a rather sinister, theocratic, end-times aspect.

492 lawhawk  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:28:35am

Text of the President's speech at the UN General Assembly.

He goes on about the Arab Spring, the lack of human rights, and then points out the way that the UN singularly appears to focus on the Arab-Israeli conflict but explicitly states that peace will come through negotiations between the Palestinians and Israelis - not from declarations at the UN.

Unstated is the fact that Israel lacks a partner in peace.

493 SidewaysQuark  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:29:06am

re: #386 000G

8 Simple Questions You Won't Believe Science Can't Answer

[Link: www.cracked.com...]

Anyone who understands conservation of angular momentum knows why a bicycle works....

494 Interesting Times  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:31:16am

re: #491 ralphieboy

AGW is all but guaranteed to set off flame wars, Israel a close second.

In the past, yes, but not now (as most of the deniers got the well-deserved ban stick). Israel has moved into first place as the guaranteed "flame-retardant cyberclothing required" topic.

495 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:31:17am

re: #493 SidewaysQuark

Anyone who understands conservation of angular momentum knows why a bicycle works...

Falling at the gound, turning away and missing. Just like the Earth keeps falling onto the Sun and missing.

496 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:35:30am

re: #490 publicityStunted

Also keep in mind that many people have issues/causes that set them off, which can result in them interpreting something as an attack even when it isn't (i.e. projecting hostility toward their cause onto someone else)

"My great crime in the world is blunder. I will get into scrapes without intention or any bad motive."

--Stand Watie, Cherokee leader, last Confederate General to surrender.

497 CuriousLurker  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:40:14am

re: #490 publicityStunted

Also keep in mind that many people have issues/causes that set them off, which can result in them interpreting something as an attack even when it isn't (i.e. projecting hostility toward their cause onto someone else)

THIS.

re: #488 imp_62

What publicityStunted said.

Also, I've found that there are some people I simply can't have a conversation with because it just turns into dueling monologues. I don't even bother responding to those people, no matter how badly I may want to. Ditto for the people who drop stink bombs trying to rile up those they consider to be opponents.

Life is too short and there's too much I don't know to waste time having a prolonged snark fest when I could be learning something useful or doing something I enjoy. I love & appreciate LGF, but it's just a blog. Perspective.

The world is divided into people who think they are right. —Anonymous

498 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:41:02am

re: #490 publicityStunted

Also keep in mind that many people have issues/causes that set them off, which can result in them interpreting something as an attack even when it isn't (i.e. projecting hostility toward their cause onto someone else)

re: #488 imp_62

Publicitystunted hit the nail on the head. I was pretty drunk last night at the end of a celebratory day, and I was clearly projecting my own snarkyness/vindictiveness - set off by a different of opinion about wikileaks/assange. In my stupor I even forgot that your name comes up as Turn About Is Fair Play in the pages.

I'm sorry about the tone and the accusation.

499 CuriousLurker  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:42:07am

Gah! Work....BBL

500 Obdicut  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:42:27am

re: #498 Alexzander

Hook a breathalyzer up to your keyboard.

If you can't blow under legal, you don't get to post.

Can I patent that?

501 makeitstop  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:43:47am

re: #500 Obdicut

Hook a breathalyzer up to your keyboard.

If you can't blow under legal, you don't get to post.

Can I patent that?

Boy, would that ever come in handy sometimes.

Mornin', Lizards. What fresh hell awaits?

502 CuriousLurker  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:43:52am

re: #498 Alexzander

re: #488 imp_62

Publicitystunted hit the nail on the head. I was pretty drunk last night at the end of a celebratory day, and I was clearly projecting my own snarkyness/vindictiveness - set off by a different of opinion about wikileaks/assange. In my stupor I even forgot that your name comes up as Turn About Is Fair Play in the pages.

I'm sorry about the tone and the accusation.

This too. Sometimes people post under the influence. And sometimes they're just having a bad day.

Over & out.

503 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:44:09am

re: #500 Obdicut

Hook a breathalyzer up to your keyboard.

If you can't blow under legal, you don't get to post.

Can I patent that?

I seriously woke up this morning and wondered with great anxiety if I drunk LGF-posted. My memory kicked and I said to myself; Yep, I was an asshole.

504 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:45:35am

Beautiful weather finally--time for outside work. BBL

505 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:46:05am

re: #500 Obdicut

Hook a breathalyzer up to your keyboard.

If you can't blow under legal, you don't get to post.

Can I patent that?

There is the [banned lizard] Rule: If you think you might be too drunk to post, you are too drunk to post.

506 CuriousLurker  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:47:22am

re: #494 publicityStunted

In the past, yes, but not now (as most of the deniers got the well-deserved ban stick). Israel has moved into first place as the guaranteed "flame-retardant cyberclothing required" topic.

Okay, I lied—one more.

I've started thinking of the Pages as "Little Israel". Luckily, people are only able to detonate word bombs there.

507 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:51:21am

re: #493 SidewaysQuark

Anyone who understands conservation of angular momentum knows why a bicycle works...

Knowing it intuitively is one thing. Mathematically proving it is quite another.

508 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:51:25am

re: #494 publicityStunted

(as most of the deniers got the well-deserved ban stick)

Note: I don't think anybody got banned for being a denier, rather for being a complete jerk about it, or some unrelated offense. (Partial jerks usually maintain their lizard status.)

509 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:51:35am
After Disclosures by WikiLeaks, Al Jazeera Replaces Its Top News Director

CAIRO — Al Jazeera, the pan-Arab news network financed by Qatar, named a member of the Qatari royal family on Tuesday to replace its top news director after disclosures from the group WikiLeaks indicating that the news director had modified the network’s coverage of the Iraq war in response to pressure from the United States.

Yoahza.

510 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:52:17am

re: #508 wrenchwench

(Partial jerks usually maintain their lizard status.)

Thank God.

511 Interesting Times  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:54:15am

re: #508 wrenchwench

Note: I don't think anybody got banned for being a denier, rather for being a complete jerk about it, or some unrelated offense. (Partial jerks usually maintain their lizard status.)

True. Oftentimes the ban is the result of a "last straw" sort of thing.

512 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:54:24am

re: #507 thedopefishlives

Knowing it intuitively is one thing. Mathematically proving it is quite another.

Just like supply-side economics...

513 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:55:46am

re: #510 Alexzander

Thank God Charles.

FTFY

There is a tip jar....

514 Interesting Times  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:58:04am

re: #513 wrenchwench

There is a tip jar...

Ha, now there's a concept - top up the swear tip jar for every ill-advised or drunken post ;)

515 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 8:59:00am

To ease comprehension, this is the the US budget situation with 8 zeros removed.

Annual income: $21,700
Money spent: $38,200
New debt: $16,500
Outstanding balance: $142,710
Budget cuts: $385 (April 2011)

516 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:00:24am

re: #512 ralphieboy

Just like supply-side economics...

Oh no you di-in't!

517 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:00:46am

re: #515 ralphieboy

To ease comprehension, this is the the US budget situation with 8 zeros removed.

Annual income: $21,700
Money spent: $38,200
New debt: $16,500
Outstanding balance: $142,710
Budget cuts: $385 (April 2011)

Awesome. Can you break down the money spent by sector/department?

518 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:01:31am

re: #517 Alexzander

Awesome. Can you break down the money spent by sector/department?

And make sure you get a cover on that TPS report.

519 lawhawk  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:04:06am

re: #515 ralphieboy

To ease comprehension, this is the the US budget situation with 8 zeros removed.

Annual income: $21,700
Money spent: $38,200
New debt: $16,500
Outstanding balance: $142,710
Budget cuts: $385 (April 2011)

Working from those numbers, we'd need to either:
1) vastly increase annual income;
2) vastly cut spending;
3) engage in both massive increases in income and spending cuts - just to break even and eliminate new debt; or
4) engage in even more massive increases in income and spending cuts to make a dent on long term debt (the outstanding balance).

Everything on the table thus far has been window dressing compared to the magnitude of the problem - and note too that any deal done can be undone by a single act of Congress after all the hand wringing of a prior Congressional session worked out a deal.

520 Bulworth  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:06:22am

A 26th Amendment? Sounds like more of that "less government" the teabaggers claim to want.

521 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:08:19am

Personally, I think we need to reduce defense/military spending drastically - perhaps even by half. We are projected to spend 1.4 trillion in 2012.

523 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:10:04am

re: #522 JasonA

Yeah, so what?

Brit Hume: "If [Income] Inequality Is At A Very Much Higher Level Who Cares?"

If Brit Hume were to get smacked in the nose with a rotten halibut every hour on the hour who cares?

524 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:11:40am

re: #523 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

If Brit Hume were to get smacked in the nose with a rotten halibut every hour on the hour who cares?

Actually, I'd care. Because I'd want to watch.

525 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:12:36am

re: #524 thedopefishlives

Actually, I'd care. Because I'd want to watch.

I sense a bold new reality game show in the making

526 SidewaysQuark  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:20:34am

re: #507 thedopefishlives

Knowing it intuitively is one thing. Mathematically proving it is quite another.

Well, of course - the devil is in the details. The article seems to infer we don't even know the basics, though, which is just silly....

527 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:20:37am

re: #523 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

If Brit Hume were to get smacked in the nose with a rotten halibut every hour on the hour who cares?

The Veggitales version of Jonah says that the great evil of Nineveh was slapping each other with fish. Let's get Brit a part in the live action remake ;)

(Personally I preferred the movie of "The Pirates Who Don't Do Anything" but tolerable kid movies are rare enough as it is.)

528 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:23:28am

re: #527 wlewisiii

The Veggitales version of Jonah says that the great evil of Nineveh was slapping each other with fish. Let's get Brit a part in the live action remake ;)

(Personally I preferred the movie of "The Pirates Who Don't Do Anything" but tolerable kid movies are rare enough as it is.)

"The Thing" counts as a kid movie right?

529 Mocking Jay  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:24:57am

re: #528 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"The Thing" counts as a kid movie right?

Well, I saw it as a kid. Might explain why I'm more of a cat person.

530 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:27:48am

re: #528 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"The Thing" counts as a kid movie right?

Fear and movies is a not funny thing for me. My son was badly scared by "Gremlins" and we still have serious issues two years later. He refuses to go to the theater anymore after we took him to "Coraline".

Acceptable movies are really hard for us to find. :(

531 _RememberTonyC  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:28:16am

It is good to see Lizards discussing forum culture. LGF has always been an oasis in an otherwise barren place. One frustration I have is that this used to be a much more conservative place, but as it has transitioned into a more liberal (and anti Conservative) place, those of us who have stuck around frequently find ourselves under fire for pretty moderate right of center opinions. The newer Lizards should realize that most of our occasionally conservative posters are still here BECAUSE we do try to be moderate. And when we are constantly on the receiving end of snark and generalizations because of our views, it really hurts the level of discourse. I never felt the need to "win" every argument or even get INTO so many arguments. Simply exchanging views and discussing them in a civil manner is good enough for me.

532 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:29:00am

re: #522 JasonA

Yeah, so what?

Brit Hume: "If [Income] Inequality Is At A Very Much Higher Level Who Cares?"

Yunno, one of the things I admire about America is its emphasis on individual effort and responsibility.

But those traits seem to have totally overshadowed the fact that we nonehteless depend on each other for our success and we do not seem to educate people to respect or appreciate the joint effort that goes into even the most "individual" success story.

But the dialogue seems to be dominated by people who have managed to reconcile Ayn Rand with the the Bible, people who reject Evolution but embrace Social Darwinism, and people who see the free market not as a mechanism for balancing supply and demand but as an ideological ideal to pursued even at the expense of those people who participate in it.

533 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:30:05am

re: #530 wlewisiii

Fear and movies is a not funny thing for me. My son was badly scared by "Gremlins" and we still have serious issues two years later. He refuses to go to the theater anymore after we took him to "Coraline".

Acceptable movies are really hard for us to find. :(

My kids are the opposite, they love a good scary movie. The hard part is finding "good" scary movies. We might watch the original "Pitch Black" this weekend.

534 Mocking Jay  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:31:03am

re: #532 ralphieboy

They perpetuate the myth of the self-made man. All of our successes are built with tools and institutions that have been passed down to us. To not acknowledge that is sadly selfish, in my humble opinion.

535 Achilles Tang  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:31:16am

I have a sudden new problem viewing LGF on my netbook. The font and everything else is too large to fit on the screen so I have to scroll to the right to see all the text. I don't have this problem with other websites.

Anyone have any suggestions?

536 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:31:47am

re: #535 Naso Tang

I have a sudden new problem viewing LGF on my netbook. The font and everything else is too large to fit on the screen so I have to scroll to the right to see all the text. I don't have this problem with other websites.

Anyone have any suggestions?

Hit ctrl and -

537 Achilles Tang  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:33:34am

re: #536 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Hit ctrl and -

Bingo, you're a genius.

539 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:34:46am

re: #530 wlewisiii

Fear and movies is a not funny thing for me. My son was badly scared by "Gremlins" and we still have serious issues two years later. He refuses to go to the theater anymore after we took him to "Coraline".

Acceptable movies are really hard for us to find. :(

I heard stories of parents who took their kids to see "Pan's Labyrinth" thinking it was going to be some fairy/fantasy flick and had to run out of the theater after their screaming kids...

Image: pans-labyrinth-3.jpg

540 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:35:26am

re: #538 Killgore Trout

Ron Paul Says Aide Who Died With $400k Medical Bill Didn’t Need Government Help

Yeah, that's why his mom went into debt and his friends had to hold a fund raiser to pay the bills.

541 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:35:47am

Great kids movies from the past year or so:

How To Train Your Dragon
Book of Kells

542 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:36:26am

re: #541 Alexzander

Great kids movies from the past year or so:

How To Train Your Dragon
Book of Kells

My kids liked Tangled

543 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:37:29am

re: #540 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Yeah, that's why his mom went into debt and his friends had to hold a fund raiser to pay the bills.

I don't think they ever paid the bills. They raised about $30K and stuck the hospital with the rest.

544 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:38:26am

re: #538 Killgore Trout

Ron Paul Says Aide Who Died With $400k Medical Bill Didn’t Need Government Help

It was his personal responsibility to get a church to help him, and he didn't. Oh well, eggs/omelets. /sociopathy

545 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:38:31am

Troy Davis is going to be executed in Georgia today at 7pm EST.

546 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:38:51am

re: #541 Alexzander

Great kids movies from the past year or so:

How To Train Your Dragon
Book of Kells

About the time of "Shrek", "Toy Story" and "Finding Nemo" they figured out that although you can make millions by producing a film that kiddies like, but you can tons more money doing one that entertains parents, too.

547 Mocking Jay  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:39:30am

re: #545 Alexzander

Troy Davis is going to be executed in Georgia today at 7pm EST.

Somewhere a small group of Republicans just cheered.

548 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:40:35am

re: #541 Alexzander

Great kids movies from the past year or so:

How To Train Your Dragon
Book of Kells

re: #542 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

My kids liked Tangled

Netflix time. Thank you, Gentlemen.

549 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:40:41am

re: #545 Alexzander

Troy Davis is going to be executed in Georgia today at 7pm EST.

At least he doesn't have any outstanding hospital bills...

/

550 lawhawk  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:41:00am

Well, just got back from the Zuccotti Park protests (they're supposed to be protesting Wall Street or something, but it includes protests for everything from the wars in Afghanistan/Iraq to the pending execution of Troy Davis in GA).

Seems that there's several hundred people in the protest, and they're of the "professional protester" sort. Construction workers and tourists who are normally found in the park have a rather bemused look to all this, and so too does the NYPD that has a presence to keep things safe for all involved.

551 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:41:13am

re: #546 ralphieboy

About the time of "Shrek", "Toy Story" and "Finding Nemo" they figured out that although you can make millions by producing a film that kiddies like, but you can tons more money doing one that entertains parents, too.

Absolutely. Frankly, kids movies have been some of the all around best movies in the past two years.

552 Decatur Deb  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:41:37am

Those who were kids in the '80s might not like the upcoming "Red State". This is the old (Phelps) preacher's wife:

Image: Bettyfixed.jpg

553 shutdown  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:41:53am

re: #498 Alexzander

re: #488 imp_62

Publicitystunted hit the nail on the head. I was pretty drunk last night at the end of a celebratory day, and I was clearly projecting my own snarkyness/vindictiveness - set off by a different of opinion about wikileaks/assange. In my stupor I even forgot that your name comes up as Turn About Is Fair Play in the pages.

I'm sorry about the tone and the accusation.

Thank you for this post. I was really surprised at your post on the page, given your past history as a poster here. I accept the apology, and have full understanding of not wanting to be held to statements made after a night out.

554 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:42:35am

Sorry I got the name wrong, it is The Secret of Kells. Here is the trailer; its really excellent.

Youtube Video
555 Obdicut  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:43:44am

re: #543 Killgore Trout

I don't think they ever paid the bills. They raised about $30K and stuck the hospital with the rest.

And if it was a state hospital, or a school non-profit hospital, he definitely did need, and got, government help.

Hell, every doctor in the US is trained in part with money subsidized by the government.

556 Killgore Trout  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:43:53am

re: #550 lawhawk

Well, just got back from the Zuccotti Park protests (they're supposed to be protesting Wall Street or something, but it includes protests for everything from the wars in Afghanistan/Iraq to the pending execution of Troy Davis in GA).

Seems that there's several hundred people in the protest, and they're of the "professional protester" sort. Construction workers and tourists who are normally found in the park have a rather bemused look to all this, and so too does the NYPD that has a presence to keep things safe for all involved.

Thanks for the report. nice pics too.

557 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:46:16am

re: #554 Alexzander

Sorry I got the name wrong, it is The Secret of Kells. Here is the trailer; its really excellent.

[Video]

I thought that might be the one you ment when I went looking. Looks really interesting. Thank you!

558 Lidane  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:46:58am

re: #538 Killgore Trout

Ron Paul Says Aide Who Died With $400k Medical Bill Didn’t Need Government Help

What a heartless douchebag. I can't believe people actually support him.

559 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:48:58am

re: #530 wlewisiii

Fear and movies is a not funny thing for me. My son was badly scared by "Gremlins" and we still have serious issues two years later. He refuses to go to the theater anymore after we took him to "Coraline".

Acceptable movies are really hard for us to find. :(

My granddaughters have told me they won't watch any Disney cartoons because "Disney is too scary." I let them watch "Bee Movie" about a thousand times and they picked up on all the adult jokes in that movie.

560 shutdown  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:49:33am

re: #550 lawhawk

Well, just got back from the Zuccotti Park protests (they're supposed to be protesting Wall Street or something, but it includes protests for everything from the wars in Afghanistan/Iraq to the pending execution of Troy Davis in GA).

Seems that there's several hundred people in the protest, and they're of the "professional protester" sort. Construction workers and tourists who are normally found in the park have a rather bemused look to all this, and so too does the NYPD that has a presence to keep things safe for all involved.

So where did the chess players divert to?

561 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:49:35am

re: #547 JasonA

Somewhere a small group of Republicans just cheered climaxed.

fixed

562 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:50:00am

re: #554 Alexzander

Sorry I got the name wrong, it is The Secret of Kells. Here is the trailer; its really excellent.

[Video]

I watched it, I thought it was meh.

563 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:51:31am

The Hellboy movies were just good fun.

564 lawhawk  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:53:03am

re: #560 imp_62

Washington Square Park?

565 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:54:51am

re: #542 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

My kids liked Tangled

Tangled was totally creepy, I would not let my grandkids watch that.

My favorite animated series is Shrek. Shrek #2 was the best, #3 was lame and #4 was creepy.

Rango and The Tale of Despereaux are way too scary and creepy for kids.

566 AK-47%  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:56:11am

re: #559 Alouette

My granddaughters have told me they won't watch any Disney cartoons because "Disney is too scary." I let them watch "Bee Movie" about a thousand times and they picked up on all the adult jokes in that movie.

My favorite was the "Visit Tupelo" poster in the background A hint for those folks who are not fans of old Van Morrison:

Youtube Video
567 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:56:25am

re: #565 Alouette

Tangled was totally creepy, I would not let my grandkids watch that.

My favorite animated series is Shrek. Shrek #2 was the best, #3 was lame and #4 was creepy.

Rango and The Tale of Despereaux are way too scary and creepy for kids.

So I take it "The Secret of Nimh" is right out?

568 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 9:59:48am

re: #565 Alouette

My favorite animated series is Shrek. Shrek #2 was the best, #3 was lame and #4 was creepy.

My son started watching Shrek. It was ok, nothing special but ok, until the bird blew up. He immediately took the DVD out and will have nothing to do with anything Shrek related.

569 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:01:09am

re: #568 wlewisiii

My son started watching Shrek. It was ok, nothing special but ok, until the bird blew up. He immediately took the DVD out and will have nothing to do with anything Shrek related.

How old is your son?

570 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:02:38am

re: #569 Alouette

How old is your son?

9 1/2.

571 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:03:25am

Another unhatched visitor:

PaulT

(Logged in)
Registered since: Dec 4, 2009 at 11:37 am
No. of comments posted: 0
No. of Pages posted: 0

Those 0's can be hard to break.

572 Kragar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:04:20am

re: #571 wrenchwench

Another unhatched visitor:

Those 0's can be hard to break.

Been there. done that...

573 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:04:30am

re: #571 wrenchwench

Another unhatched visitor:

Those 0's can be hard to break.

How do you find someone's account if they never posted? Is he logged in right now? Wierd.

574 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:05:05am

I should really change my avatar to something other than the football.

575 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:06:13am

re: #570 wlewisiii

9 1/2.

So is my granddaughter.

She wanted to know, after watching "Beauty and the Beast":

Why is Gaston the bad guy and Beast is the good guy? According to her, they are both bad guys, and Beast is much scarier than Gaston.

576 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:07:40am

re: #573 Alexzander

How do you find someone's account if they never posted? Is he logged in right now? Wierd.

Watch the Spy. You can see when folks log in and out, and post on dead threads and all kinds of stuff. You might never complain about a slow thread again!

577 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:07:43am

Peanut Butter.

578 shutdown  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:07:57am

A weird day, what with the UNGA and all. Off to the gym to clear my head. BBL

579 darthstar  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:08:15am

re: #575 Alouette

So is my granddaughter.

She wanted to know, after watching "Beauty and the Beast":

Why is Gaston the bad guy and Beast is the good guy? According to her, they are both mean guys, and Beast is scarier than Gaston.

Easy...Gaston is French.
The Beast is only scary until you get him on his back and give him a good belly rub...

580 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:10:10am

re: #571 wrenchwench

Another unhatched visitor:

Those 0's can be hard to break.

When I finally figured out how to register and saw an opening I couldn't wait for my dumb ass to jump in.

Y'all being so sexy and all.

581 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:11:05am

re: #570 wlewisiii

9 1/2.

I was a sensitive kid. I was about 8 when I asked my Dad where white glue comes from. He said, "Oh, old horses bones and things." I was stunned. I didn't get over it for a long time. But by age 13 or so, I was helping to butcher rabbits.

582 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:12:57am

re: #568 wlewisiii

Seriously? Took my boy to see Jurassic Park when he was just under 10 years old. I was afraid that it'd be too intense.

Silly me.

I was gripping my chair for dear life, looked over at him, he gave me the most joyful grin and thumbs up I'd ever seen from him.

583 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:13:52am

re: #581 wrenchwench

With all her babies? Alouette is known in rabbit circles as "KAAAHHHNNN!"

584 Alexzander  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:15:10am

The Labyrinth messed me up for a while when I was a kid.

585 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:15:25am

re: #581 wrenchwench

I was a sensitive kid. I was about 8 when I asked my Dad where white glue comes from. He said, "Oh, old horses bones and things." I was stunned. I didn't get over it for a long time. But by age 13 or so, I was helping to butcher rabbits.

He knows I hunt, but I think he avoids thinking too closely about what that means. Deer are ok but he doesn't want to know about the birds and small mammals. It's not quite so bad as it was before he started understanding about predation and the food chain.

586 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:25:23am

re: #584 Alexzander

My kids loved it.

Especially the "Bog of Eternal Stench". Every time one of those sphincters would let go they'd shriek in laughter.

587 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:29:20am

I'm just glad he loved "The Princess Bride". I'm not sure I could have survived him rejecting that one :D

588 wrenchwench  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 10:52:34am

Another one:

Bob.Schumaker

(Logged in)
Registered since: Aug 20, 2007 at 6:44 pm
No. of comments posted: 0
No. of Pages posted: 0

He has an avatar but has never posted with it.

589 jamesfirecat  Wed, Sep 21, 2011 7:08:34pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

After Obama's tax bomb on Monday, heck yes! I'm not going to vote for someone whose plan is built around 3 dollars in tax increases for 1 dollar of spending cuts, with any Medicare changes put off till 2017. I can see Perry pandering, but I don't think he actually believe the words of the Secession Declaration.

///Voting with your pocket book instead of your patriotism....


This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal Cash.app
Recent PagesClick to refresh
Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ...
Cheechako
3 days ago
Views: 135 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1