Herman Cain on His Electrified Fence: “That’s a Joke”

The sad, tired “joke” excuse again
Wingnuts • Views: 28,120

How many times have we seen this dodge from conservatives? They say something disgusting to pander to the loony base, then when called out on it, claim it was “a joke.” This excuse is so tired and worn out by now, it’s a joke in itself.

Cain Says His Deadly Fence Plan Was ‘a Joke’.

Of course, the right wing crowd didn’t exactly laugh at Cain’s little xenophobic jest about killing Mexicans — they cheered.

At two campaign rallies in Tennessee on Saturday night, the Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain said that part of his immigration policy would be to build an electrified fence on the country’s border with Mexico that could kill people trying to enter the country illegally.

But by Sunday morning, in a dramatic change of tone, Mr. Cain, a former restaurant executive, said he was only kidding.

“That’s a joke,” Mr. Cain told the journalist David Gregory during an appearance on NBC’s “Meet the Press,” where he was asked about the electrified fence. “That’s not a serious plan. I’ve also said America needs to get a sense of humor.”

Mr. Cain’s attempt to pass off incendiary comments as nothing but a joke may take more effort, however. In making the initial remarks about an electrified fence killing illegal immigrants, Mr. Cain was detailed and repetitive. He did not introduce his thoughts as anything but serious commentary, beginning with the words, “We have a crisis of illegal immigration.”

And the crowds responded with cheers, not laughs.

Note that Cain also said he would use military troops “with real guns and real bullets” on the border to kill undocumented immigrants.

Was that also a “joke?”

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113 comments
1 Kragar  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:25:27am

Herman Cain is one big joke. An ignorant twit trying to pass himself as being worthy enough to become President.

2 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:26:46am

“That’s not a serious plan. I’ve also said America needs to get a sense of humor.”

And this person needs to learn what is funny and what is not.

3 Kragar  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:27:15am

Cain: People Will Demand 999 Even Though It Raises Their Taxes

GREGORY: I just want to break that down. So you’re acknowledging this morning, which I haven’t heard you do before, that there are individuals who are going to pay more in taxes.

CAIN: There are some, yes.

GREGORY: And you think those people are going to rally around tax reform where the wealthy pay less and middle-class and lower-income folks pay more.

CAIN: Yes.

4 Atlas Fails  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:29:26am

I think Herman Cain's the one who needs to get a sense a humor, if he think electrocuting Mexicans to death is in any way cute or funny.

5 Henchman Ghazi-808  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:29:36am

Of course the crowds were laughing not cheering.

This is called Derp Humor.

6 Kragar  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:29:46am

re: #2 PhillyPretzel

“That’s not a serious plan. I’ve also said America needs to get a sense of humor.”

And this person needs to learn what is funny and what is not.

Herman Cain walks into a bar...

...suffers a minor head injury, blames the media

7 allegro  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:30:13am

re: #3 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Cain: People Will Demand 999 Even Though It Raises Their Taxes

So he's acknowledging that he's playing to a base of really stupid people. At least he has that part right.

8 Henchman Ghazi-808  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:31:35am

I am sorry if I offended anybody. But it was meant to be a joke so if you don't find it funny you need to get a (whiny liberal) sense of humor.

9 Kragar  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:32:52am

Taking the kids to the zoo, cya later

10 Obdicut  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:36:11am

Okay, so it was a joke.

Where's the funny bit? Is he mocking the idea of a fence? Was the joke on his audience?

11 jaunte  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:37:07am

re: #7 allegro

If he thinks the exchange with David Gregory on taxes will fool his constituents, he must think they're incredibly dumb:

Mr. Cain also dismissed a Wall Street Journal editorial critique that “a 9% rate when combined with state and local levies would mean a tax on goods of 17% or more in many places.”

“Don’t combine it with state taxes,” he said. “This doesn’t address state taxes. If you combine it together, yes, you would get that number. This is a replacement structure. These are replacement taxes, they’re not on top of anything.”

Mr. Gregory asked then him, “Are you saying they’re going to be repealed?”

Mr. Cain replied: “With the current structure, you have state taxes, right? So with this new structure, you’re still going to have state taxes. That is muddying the water.”

So, yes, the WSJ criticism was correct, but to mention it would be muddying the water.

12 blueraven  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:38:40am

Herman Cain revealed his truly deep ignorance this morning on Meet the Press.
The display of ignorance was stunning in it's breath and depth.

13 Stanghazi  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:39:25am

The SNL skit nailed it.

Herman Cain: Well I really didn't think people would take me seriously, I just wanted a gig on Fox News.

14 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:41:54am

Newsweek goes there:
Image: yeswecain.jpg
[Link: www.thedailybeast.com...]

In other news, what is this crap (beware, PJM)?:

15 Interesting Times  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:42:03am

re: #4 Atlas Fails

I think Herman Cain's the one who needs to get a sense a humor, if he think electrocuting Mexicans to death is in any way cute or funny.

Like I've said before, humor only works when it mocks the powerful, not the powerless. Right-wing "humor" specializes in kicking people while they're down. Not "funny" in the least - just sleazy and sadistic.

16 HappyWarrior  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:42:28am

Is this his excuse every time he gets called out on bullshit? I agree we need a better sense of humor but Cain's humor is just stupid and juvenile.

17 allegro  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:42:42am

re: #11 jaunte

If he thinks the exchange with David Gregory on taxes will fool his constituents, he must think they're incredibly dumb:

So, yes, the WSJ criticism was correct, but to mention it would be muddying the water.

Good lord he can't even keep his own lies straight.

18 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:44:21am

It does not take a genius to have a successful business. You just have to have the right gimmick.

19 Henchman Ghazi-808  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:46:59am

There's a couple of dimensions of odd to this but the most obvious to me is that America clearly has a sense of humor but Cain doesn't understand when and how to apply one.

Or he's full of shit and just being spontaneous in responding to his previous spontaneity.

Or both.

20 blueraven  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:48:59am

re: #18 PhillyPretzel

It does not take a genius to have a successful business. You just have to have the right gimmick.

999...
great for the .9 percenters
not so much for the 99%

21 Stanghazi  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:49:08am

re: #14 000G

Newsweek goes there:
Image: yeswecain.jpg
[Link: www.thedailybeast.com...]

In other news, what is this crap (beware, PJM)?:

[Video]

From the Newsweek cover: The Anti-Obama

They are using him and his blackness. This is crazy.

22 blueraven  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:50:09am

re: #21 Stanley Sea

From the Newsweek cover: The Anti-Obama

They are using him and his blackness. This is crazy.

Newsweek has become the tabloid of the weekly news magazine.

23 kirkspencer  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:50:21am

re: #20 blueraven

999...
great for the .9 percenters
not so much for the 99%

You need to be catchier.

999. Because 99% aren't paying enough.

24 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:50:26am

re: #14 000G

Zo's videos are just plain uncomfortable to me.

25 allegro  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:50:44am

re: #19 BigPapa

There's a couple of dimensions of odd to this but the most obvious to me is that America clearly has a sense of humor but Cain doesn't understand when and how to apply one.

Or he's full of shit and just being spontaneous in responding to his previous spontaneity.

Or both.

It's the Rush "Libruls Can't Take a Joke" Limbaugh approach when he spews vicious shit and gets called on it by rational people.

26 nines09  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:51:52am

Wink wink. Nod nod. Sure he was kidding. He was playing the rubes. Wait till he plays the fundies. Can't wait for them excuses. By the way, how does the people who cheered his "remarks" feel being played? Schmucks all.

27 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:52:22am

re: #25 allegro

It's the Rush "Libruls Can't Take a Joke" Limbaugh approach when he spews vicious shit and gets called on it by rational people.

"Media tweak"

"I just said it to troll liberals"

28 Obdicut  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:52:28am

So what does he actually want done about the border? Are we just supposed to guess whether or not each statement is a new 'joke' or not?

I can't believe how contemptuous these politicians are of their supporters. They lie directly to them or, in this case, make 'jokes' that are mocking them-- or claim that they have-- and their supporters don't apparently give a single solitary crap.

"Did you hear Cain's idea for the border? Electrified fence! I'm totally behind that."

"Actually, he said he was joking, meaning that he thinks its a ridiculous one."

"Oh. Give me five seconds to adjust to this and then I'll carry on as if this didn't happen. I think I'll simultaneously pretend he was serious and agree with him but say that he was joking if anyone challenges the inhumanity of it. That should work."

29 Meitantei  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:54:37am

re: #21 Stanley Sea

People still read Newsweek?

Seriously, American news magazines are generally bleh, but I find Newsweek by far the worst of the lot.

30 Stanghazi  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:54:42am

re: #28 Obdicut

Seriously, I think the people who follow him will say that he's just being PC now because he has to. He really wants the sparky fence dammit!

31 HappyWarrior  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:56:30am

re: #30 Stanley Sea

Seriously, I think the people who follow him will say that he's just being PC now because he has to. He really wants the sparky fence dammit!

That or they'll accuse him of selling out.

32 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:57:45am

If he would've said, "And the fence will be patrolled by frickin' sharks with frickin' lasers attached to their heads" we would've known he was joking.

But he didn't.

33 blueraven  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:58:16am

re: #23 kirkspencer

You need to be catchier.

The 99% will love the used cake
that the .9% worked so very hard to bake

34 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 10:59:02am

re: #28 Obdicut

Bush and Obama have had the most effective means of curbing illegal immigration.

Trash the economy.

35 allegro  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:00:20am

re: #33 blueraven

The 99% will love the used cake
that the .9% worked so very hard to bake

But someone left the cake out in the rain and we'll never have the recipe again! Oh no!

/unwelcome flashback to a really stupid song

36 Lidane  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:01:23am

So far, the biggest joke here is Herman Cain. Why are people taking this guy seriously?

re: #30 Stanley Sea

Seriously, I think the people who follow him will say that he's just being PC now because he has to. He really wants the sparky fence dammit!

What are the freepers and Hot Air idiots saying about this? That should be a good enough barometer of the wingnut response.

37 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:01:33am

re: #32 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

If he would've said, "And the fence will be patrolled by frickin' sharks with frickin' lasers attached to their heads" we would've known he was joking.

But he didn't.

I don't know. I thought shark guy was joking, but the general consensus here was that he was dead serious, him and his toy shark.

38 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:03:48am

re: #36 Lidane

Why are people taking this guy seriously?

Because the base needs to be kept pandered to until they are forced to accept Romney.

39 Lidane  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:04:31am

re: #34 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Bush and Obama have had the most effective means of curbing illegal immigration.

Trash the economy.

40 jaunte  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:08:16am

re: #36 Lidane

Some Hot Air commenters are loving it:

Actually, Metal Storm turrets every 100 yards would be a lot cheaper.
...
Cain’s talking my language. You cross and your fried.
Tamper with the fence and you meet the business end of a sniper’s rifle.
...
I don’t give sh*t what liberals think. If you can even call it thinking. Cain is bringing his fastball, and every time they dig in, he throws a 95 mph heater under their useless chins.

With an occasional dissenter:

Electrify and kill people? Is he crazy? Are all of you crazy? What a nice Christian thing to do.

41 Moodsman  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:13:53am

I have a great sense of humor, just like Cain. Here are some jokes that I just thought up that show that I have a "Cain-esque" sense of humor:

A ni##er walks into a redneck bar, and gets the crap beat out of him. "Maybe we beat some sense into him!" they explained as they pushed him out the door.
See... funny funny funny!

or

An injun said "How" to me, and I said "With a bullet!" and shot him.
Now that's friggin funny!

If you don't get my jokes, just like Cain said, you have no sense of humor. After all, the idea of electrocuting migrating families can only be seen as funny.

(Sigh.. it's a sad sad world where Cain, Bachman and Palin are considered serious political leaders)

42 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:14:08am

re: #28 Obdicut

So what does he actually want done about the border? Are we just supposed to guess whether or not each statement is a new 'joke' or not?

Taqiyya!

43 Linden Arden  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:14:17am

Cain is also an associate Baptist minister and has cut a gospel album.

He is Pat Robertson with a pizza background.

44 Lidane  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:15:14am

re: #40 jaunte

I'm looking at this Freeper thread right now. These are all from the first page of comments:

Funny now Cain is getting Palin treatment by both the Romney/Perry camp and the Leftist media.
---

The joke is on David Gregory.

The electrified fence will be built.
---

well, some people are fed up enough to take that comment seriously. the people coming here are convinced they are the indigenous people and we are the invaders. they have the attitude that everything here belongs to them.

I read somewhere that hitler had that plan to tell them the same lies in order to keep the US out of WWI & WWII. well the story got out anyhow and we are now dealing with the attitude here from a lot of them today.
---

There was a long thread on FR yesterday about Cain's remarks on the electrified fence.
I'd say half the respondents supported zapping anyone trying to illegally cross the Tex-Mex border.

Some said if that doesn't work to use land mines. A few even suggested machine guns as an option.

I think joke or not, Herman Cain opeNd a can of worms with his questionable rhetoric.
---

I’m loving this. Cain is going to be one of the toughest border hawks of our lifetime but he is going to keep the leftist media guessing.

Conservatives know what he means ;-)
---


Herman Cain is the Left’s worst nightmare! They will do ANYTHING to stop him! (The gutter is certainly no problem to them. In fact, that’s where they’re most at home.)
---

“Pal, you are an idiot.”

You’re welcome to think that, but he now OWNS the Secure Border wing of the Republican Party. No one can ever get close to him on this issue again.

That’s how campaigns are won.
---

45 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:15:15am

I don't really run for President. That, too, was a joke.

46 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:16:56am

re: #45 Sergey Romanov

Herman Cain announces his withdrawal from the Presidential race:

47 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:17:41am

re: #46 000G

Kinda hard to rickroll with embedding.

48 jaunte  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:18:03am

re: #44 Lidane

I read somewhere that hitler had that plan to tell them the same lies in order to keep the US out of WWI & WWII. well the story got out anyhow and we are now dealing with the attitude here from a lot of them today

Authentic frontier gibberish.

49 Charleston Chew  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:18:45am

re: #2 PhillyPretzel

“That’s not a serious plan. I’ve also said America needs to get a sense of humor.”

And this person needs to learn what is funny and what is not.

I think we've found the official Cain campaign bumper sticker:

"That's Not A Serious Plan." - Cain 2012.

50 HappyWarrior  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:19:56am

re: #44 Lidane

I'm looking at this Freeper thread right now. These are all from the first page of comments:

I hear everytime a right winger calls a candidate the left's worst nightmare, an angel grows its wings.

51 jaunte  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:20:23am

'Not Intended To Be A Serious Plan'

52 makeitstop  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:21:25am
I’ve also said America needs to get a sense of humor.

No, Herb - err, Herman. You need to tell 'jokes' that are actually funny and that don't involve killing people.

53 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:23:05am

Boy, are some freeps pissed.

Having a sense of humor is one thing but talking policy of a joke, without clarifying is wrong. Some people will believe it.

54 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:23:50am

re: #49 Charleston Chew

I think we've found the official Cain campaign bumper sticker:

"That's Not A Serious Plan." - Cain 2012.

Friends don't let Friends vote for Cain

55 Charleston Chew  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:25:47am

re: #50 HappyWarrior

I hear everytime a right winger calls a candidate the left's worst nightmare, an angel grows its wings.

They don't quite get that being so-and-so's worst nightmare is not good politics in a democracy. I'll walk to a polling station in a hurricane to vote for a potato if it's running against my "worst nightmare".

56 Henchman Ghazi-808  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:27:26am

re: #51 jaunte

'Not Intended To Be A Serious Plan Candidate'

57 BongCrodny  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:30:16am

I like this comment from Talking Points Memo:

If the fence is electrified, why do you need the barbed wire on top?

58 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:31:03am

re: #57 BongCrodny
Adding insult to injury?/

59 Obdicut  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:31:12am

re: #54 HoosierHoops

Here's a hot air comment on the topic:

It was a joke, meant to underline what he feels…seal the border.
Kind of like Obama saying “if they bring a knife, bring a gun”, it was meant as humor, but to indicate that he is willing to escalate the fight…the NYT has a problem, not Herman Cain…

So yep. They're saying he's joking, but he's serious about 'sealing the border', while avoiding the fact that Cain hasn't said anything about, you know, how he'd do it that hasn't turned out to be a 'joke'.

But he's willing to 'escalate the fight'. What fight?

60 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:34:46am

re: #59 Obdicut

The fight thing is about Obama, not Cain.

61 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:37:11am

re: #59 Obdicut

Here's a hot air comment on the topic:

So yep. They're saying he's joking, but he's serious about 'sealing the border', while avoiding the fact that Cain hasn't said anything about, you know, how he'd do it that hasn't turned out to be a 'joke'.

But he's willing to 'escalate the fight'. What fight?

I'm so sick of Cain's simplistic solutions.. Today on meet the Press he is still hawking 9_9_9..
Look Herman..Even if you are elected...Even for 2 terms.. 9_9_9 will never pass in a million years.. So who needs to get serious here?
Clown

62 makeitstop  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:37:42am

re: #59 Obdicut

Kind of like Obama saying “if they bring a knife, bring a gun”, it was meant as humor, but to indicate that he is willing to escalate the fight…

Did Obama actually ever say that, or is the commenter conflating Obama's campaign with words from a move as a result of a combination of chronic gullibilty and persistent numb-skullery?

Rhetorical question, of course.

63 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:37:58am

re: #41 Moodsman

Don't be surprised if that gets deleted. The word is highly frowned on; we get the point. But it may get whacked.

64 Charleston Chew  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:38:28am

re: #62 makeitstop

Did Obama actually ever say that, or is the commenter conflating Obama's campaign with words from a move as a result of a combination of chronic gullibilty and persistent numb-skullery?

Rhetorical question, of course.

He said it during the 2008 campaign.

[Link: www.politico.com...]

65 Lidane  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:39:21am

re: #61 HoosierHoops

I'm so sick of Cain's simplistic solutions.. Today on meet the Press he is still hawking 9_9_9..

Speaking of 999:

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

Electronic Arts, which has sold more than 100 million units of the Sims franchise, is taking a tongue-in-cheek approach to the game's association with Cain's meteoric rise.

"The team here is glad that he chose to build a platform off of our tax system, but there are so many other serious issues in SimCity that I would love to see a politician construct a game around," said Katsarelis.

"Is anyone looking at an alien invasion plan?"

66 OhNoZombies!  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:39:36am

As far as Cain support, never under estimate the power of the darkside stupid.

Note:
My 7 year old has discovered Star Wars. It's is now his religion. Sadly, I have no one to blame but myself.
Help me... :s

67 What, me worry?  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:39:37am

re: #28 Obdicut

I noticed Palin'sCrush mentioned something the other day that resonated with me. Cain keeps floating out these appalling statements and then walking back on them (as she put it). He keeps saying these things, like he did about not allowing any Muslims in his cabinet, until the press calls him on it. Then he refuses to own it.

I think his popularity is more of the "flavor of the month" (or day, whatever). More of the "oddity" of a Black Republican, but I don't feel he's going to maintain his lead for very long.

68 Obdicut  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:40:38am

re: #60 Sergey Romanov

The fight thing is about Obama, not Cain.

Yeah, I know, but then the analogy is even more bizarre. Obama obviously isn't going to actually be involved in any fight. Cain obviously is actually saying he'll do something about the border. And though it's nutty, building a fence running the length of the border to secure it actually does get proposed by people in a serious way. No one, ever, would possibly think Obama was actually talking about bringing a gun or a knife.

But the Hot Air thread is basically trying to avoid the topic, which is pretty funny.

69 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:41:22am

Cain is such a Joker.

70 Charleston Chew  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:41:30am

re: #65 Lidane

Electronic Arts, which has sold more than 100 million units of the Sims franchise, is taking a tongue-in-cheek approach to the game's association with Cain's meteoric rise.

Not that it matters, but I think the reporter is getting Sim City and The Sims confused.

71 makeitstop  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:41:50am

re: #64 Charleston Chew

He said it during the 2008 campaign.

[Link: www.politico.com...]

Ah. I did not know that.

72 What, me worry?  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:42:13am

re: #65 Lidane

Speaking of 999:

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

Yea LOL Someone on twitter was wondering if Cain got to be president, which game he'd base his foreign policy on. World of Warcraft? Everquest, maybe?

73 OhNoZombies!  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:43:23am

I thought reality tv was on its way out too...
I thought there was no way Bush II would win twice...
I hope you guys are right.

74 Obdicut  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:43:50am

re: #67 marjoriemoon

I dunno. That sort of "Say stupid shit, then be forced to walk it back while claiming you're definitely not walking it back" is pretty much a staple of modern GOP thought. It may resonate well with a lot of the current GOP base, that he says things that 'keep the media guessing'. Limbaugh's 'It's just satire' thing has gotten pretty deeply ingrained in the GOP supporters.

He may have found a pretty winning formula. I'm not sure how much the voting base of the GOP cares about anything other than the candidates ability to tweak the media and say outrageous crap. I think Perry lost support not because he looked like a fool during the debates but because he looked too much like a real politician, whereas Cain acts more like a right-wing troll or 'provocateur'.

75 SidewaysQuark  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:45:48am

I don't think Herman Cain is stupid at all. I think he's a solid and specialized businessman. He's shown multiple times, now, though, that he's completely naive about politics on a national level.

Examples: He thinks he can crack bad "jokes" or "half-jokes" in interviews without repercussion, that Congress (even if it WAS all Republican) would eagerly bow to his 9-9-9 plan without special interest groups trying get their modifications in, he confuses the Constitution and Declaration of Independence, he expresses lack of knowledge about foreign geography is not a big deal, etc.

A successful businessman couldn't suddenly become a successful engineer; I don't know why people think one could suddenly become a successful President with any more ease....

76 Charleston Chew  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:45:49am

re: #71 makeitstop

Ah. I did not know that.

That's because you have a normal memory and not one enhanced by Obama Derangement Syndrome. Allows a person to remember every little thing the President ever did that they hate him for, even the things that never happened. Of course, the price one pays for this supermemory is insanity.

77 Charleston Chew  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:47:47am

re: #73 OhNoZombies!

I thought there was no way Bush II would win twice...

Before or after 9/11? Because after 9/11 a dead hamster could have won if it was the incumbent and promised to get tough on America's enemies.

78 What, me worry?  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:48:02am

And another little Cain tidbit from this morning.

Gregory asked him about abortion and Cain said he would not allow any abortion, not for rape or incest, nothing. So Gregory asked him "What about the health of the mother?" To which Cain said [paraphrasing], "That's going to be something the family is going to have to decide. That's up to the family."

REALLY. But if he outlaws abortion, a doctor can't perform it under any circumstance. So WTF. Then there's the issue of how he's going to change a Supreme Court ruling. but it's ok Herman. We know where you're at.

And speaking of Supreme Court, Clarence Thomas is his favorite judge.

Oh it was a hoot. I laughed... I cried... I mostly cried.

79 OhNoZombies!  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:48:05am

I don't think he can win the presidency, but I'm not convinced he can't win the GOP nomination.

80 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:52:04am

re: #78 marjoriemoon

And another little Cain tidbit from this morning.

Gregory asked him about abortion and Cain said he would not allow any abortion, not for rape or incest, nothing. So Gregory asked him "What about the health of the mother?" To which Cain said [paraphrasing], "That's going to be something the family is going to have to decide. That's up to the family."

REALLY. But if he outlaws abortion, a doctor can't perform it under any circumstance. So WTF. Then there's the issue of how he's going to change a Supreme Court ruling. but it's ok Herman. We know where you're at.

And speaking of Supreme Court, Clarence Thomas is his favorite judge.

Oh it was a hoot. I laughed... I cried... I mostly cried.

Old strategy. They prescribe sweeping controls on abortion, no matter what, little scare quotes on the 'health' of the mother, never, never never another abortion--and then, given a real-life scenario, they default to, "Well, that would have to be a personal decision."

Dan Quayle got hit with it in one of the most obvious examples ever.

81 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:52:11am

re: #78 marjoriemoon

I agree.. Worst interview this year....
And he is still fighting a 30 year old battle about Abortion that has already been decided by the law of the land..
I think Cain is a huckster..

82 recusancy  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:53:48am

re: #75 SidewaysQuark

I don't think Herman Cain is stupid at all. I think he's a solid and specialized businessman. He's shown multiple times, now, though, that he's completely naive about politics on a national level.

Examples: He thinks he can crack bad "jokes" or "half-jokes" in interviews without repercussion, that Congress (even if it WAS all Republican) would eagerly bow to his 9-9-9 plan without special interest groups trying get their modifications in, he confuses the Constitution and Declaration of Independence, he expresses lack of knowledge about foreign geography is not a big deal, etc.

A successful businessman couldn't suddenly become a successful engineer; I don't know why people think one could suddenly become a successful President with any more ease...

Funny. Actually he is sort of was an engineer. He was a computer systems analyst. You're right he's not stupid. And I don't think he's stupid about politics either. He's obviously doing something right. He knows how to play the right.

83 What, me worry?  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:54:14am

re: #74 Obdicut

I dunno. That sort of "Say stupid shit, then be forced to walk it back while claiming you're definitely not walking it back" is pretty much a staple of modern GOP thought. It may resonate well with a lot of the current GOP base, that he says things that 'keep the media guessing'. Limbaugh's 'It's just satire' thing has gotten pretty deeply ingrained in the GOP supporters.

He may have found a pretty winning formula. I'm not sure how much the voting base of the GOP cares about anything other than the candidates ability to tweak the media and say outrageous crap. I think Perry lost support not because he looked like a fool during the debates but because he looked too much like a real politician, whereas Cain acts more like a right-wing troll or 'provocateur'.

I don't know. Cain takes the prize on walking back his statements. I think really, it's his inexperience of being a politician which basically means, you have to have some kind of edit button. That is, if you want to get elected. It's something that some folks find refreshing. Personally I don't. I'd rather take the guy who experience. MOST especially with foreign policy. Working with foreign governments can be really sketchy.

84 OhNoZombies!  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:54:24am

re: #77 Charleston Chew

Even after 911.
I even supported him after 911; I thought he had potential. But Iraq was the dealbreaker for me and a lot of folks I know.

85 What, me worry?  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:54:57am

re: #75 SidewaysQuark

I don't think Herman Cain is stupid at all. I think he's a solid and specialized businessman. He's shown multiple times, now, though, that he's completely naive about politics on a national level.

Examples: He thinks he can crack bad "jokes" or "half-jokes" in interviews without repercussion, that Congress (even if it WAS all Republican) would eagerly bow to his 9-9-9 plan without special interest groups trying get their modifications in, he confuses the Constitution and Declaration of Independence, he expresses lack of knowledge about foreign geography is not a big deal, etc.

A successful businessman couldn't suddenly become a successful engineer; I don't know why people think one could suddenly become a successful President with any more ease...

Ross Perot of 2012?

86 makeitstop  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:58:57am

re: #85 marjoriemoon

Ross Perot of 2012?

If so, Obama will win re-election in a walk.

I'd love to see Cain run third-party. The Tea Party would flock to him and it wold probably deal a death blow to both Romney's presidential hopes and the Republican party.

Having said that, I realize it won't happen. I'm gravitating toward the idea that Cain is only making a 'presidential run' to use as a bargaining chip for a posh media gig. He doesn't need the money, but he definitely seems to need the attention.

87 blueraven  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:59:18am

re: #53 Sergey Romanov

Boy, are some freeps pissed.

Another PO'd Freeper

Note to Mr Cain: As one of your supporters, I am putting you on notice: Your back-pedaling about whether or not you would put a Muslim on your Cabinet was strike one; this asshattery with regard to saying you “favor” and electrified fence and then turning around and saying it was only a joke — is strike two.

This kind of nonsense is not worthy of a SERIOUS Presidential contender.

I thought you had a backbone of steel... I now suspect it might have some tupperware in it.

88 recusancy  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 11:59:26am

re: #82 recusancy

Funny. Actually he is sort of was an engineer. He was a computer systems analyst. You're right he's not stupid. And I don't think he's stupid about politics either. He's obviously doing something right. He knows how to play the right.

He also helped defeat "Hillary Care" all the way back in '93. He's definitely smart and knows what he's doing.

89 What, me worry?  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:00:20pm

And to foreign policy, Cain said we have to clearly define our "enemies" and our "friends." He made a huge point of this. So what, he's going to tell the Saudis to F off? Yea right.

SFZ and Hoops, I agree. He's playing to masses, or at least trying to, which is why he throws out these outrageous statements. If he actually got elected (Gd forbid), he'd run this country like his crappy pizza enterprise. And the ones he'd be telling to F off would be the poor and the elderly.

90 What, me worry?  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:03:17pm

re: #86 makeitstop

If so, Obama will win re-election in a walk.

I'd love to see Cain run third-party. The Tea Party would flock to him and it wold probably deal a death blow to both Romney's presidential hopes and the Republican party.

Having said that, I realize it won't happen. I'm gravitating toward the idea that Cain is only making a 'presidential run' to use as a bargaining chip for a posh media gig. He doesn't need the money, but he definitely seems to need the attention.

If he loses the election, he absolutely could do that though. Run as an independent. Didn't someone do that last election? And yes, he's Tea Party material through and through.

Although he'd take away some votes just as an independent candidate, anyone who likes Cain isn't going to like Romney and vice versa.

91 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:05:28pm

re: #89 marjoriemoon

And to foreign policy, Cain said we have to clearly define our "enemies" and our "friends." He made a huge point of this. So what, he's going to tell the Saudis to F off? Yea right.

SFZ and Hoops, I agree. He's playing to masses, or at least trying to, which is why he throws out these outrageous statements. If he actually got elected (Gd forbid), he'd run this country like his crappy pizza enterprise. And the ones he'd be telling to F off would be the poor and the elderly.

I think part of the conflict with the abortion wiggle-out--for all of these guys--is that the two parts represent two different messages. When you say "I won't allow it, I won't allow it for rape or incest or 'health', I'll make it all go away," you're catering to an audience that wants to be told that abortion will no longer be available to OTHER people, and that there will be no way for lying recreational abortionists to make excuses and continue to perform abortions.

When they go to the 'well, that would be a personal decision', it usually means they've been asked a question where they realize that audience suddenly imagines themselves in such a situation--their wife is in the second trimester, and they're told she'll die if they don't induce labor. (Santorum has sidestepped this, by pretending it wasn't a real abortion.) Or less dramatically--when Quayle was asked if he'd make his daughters carry an unwelcome pregnancy to term. Making the situation personal has a tendency to override the dogma, because YOU know that YOU wouldn't be making this shit up.

92 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:08:56pm

Off topic--I am reading the Hitchen piece about Gandhi, and I have read the one about Mother Teresa.

Is there any historical person that Hitchens believes to be worthy of admiration? Are there failings of perfect morality he will accept reasons for?
Do sacred cows simply annoy him? It's an interesting piece, but at times I just want to snap "Look, Hitchens, it was another time and another place, and another culture. I'm sorry he wasn't perfect, but does this have a point?"

93 sagehen  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:09:21pm

re: #34 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Bush and Obama have had the most effective means of curbing illegal immigration.

Trash the economy.

It also helps that the birthrate in Mexico is dropping sharply, and their GDP is rising faster than ours. Between them, those should eliminate illegal immigration within a generation (at least... from there to here. Here to there is another story.)

94 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:10:27pm

re: #92 SanFranciscoZionist

Off topic--I am reading the Hitchen piece about Gandhi, and I have read the one about Mother Teresa.

Is there any historical person that Hitchens believes to be worthy of admiration? Are there failings of perfect morality he will accept reasons for?
Do sacred cows simply annoy him? It's an interesting piece, but at times I just want to snap "Look, Hitchens, it was another time and another place, and another culture. I'm sorry he wasn't perfect, but does this have a point?"

Trotsky.

95 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:11:29pm

re: #94 Sergey Romanov

Trotsky.

He likes Trotsky?

96 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:13:29pm

re: #95 SanFranciscoZionist

He continues to regard both Vladimir Lenin and Leon Trotsky as great men,[66][67]

97 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:16:14pm

re: #96 Sergey Romanov

Hmmm. OK, that's interesting, in an odd way.

98 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:20:09pm

re: #96 Sergey Romanov

lol: [Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

99 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:21:13pm

re: #98 000G

Oh gee. A whole article on views?

100 bratwurst  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:21:37pm

re: #92 SanFranciscoZionist

Off topic--I am reading the Hitchen piece about Gandhi, and I have read the one about Mother Teresa.

Is there any historical person that Hitchens believes to be worthy of admiration? Are there failings of perfect morality he will accept reasons for?
Do sacred cows simply annoy him? It's an interesting piece, but at times I just want to snap "Look, Hitchens, it was another time and another place, and another culture. I'm sorry he wasn't perfect, but does this have a point?"

He writes things like this to satisfy his bizarre desire to shock. I think it is an aspect of the self-destructive streak that has plagued his life and career.

101 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:29:39pm

re: #100 bratwurst

Maybe. But what he writes needs to be written, IMHO.

102 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:40:24pm

re: #101 Sergey Romanov

Maybe. But what he writes needs to be written, IMHO.

Maybe. I mean, in this case, he's reviewing what sounds like a solid piece about Gandhi, bar his little jab about the use of the title "Mahatma", and basically going through it looking for the sort of sanctimony and hypocrisy that personally pisses of Christopher Hitchens.

Although the book sounds interesting.

103 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 12:40:36pm

re: #92 SanFranciscoZionist

I've never understood the adulation of Hitchens. His ego outstrips his scholarship and you end up with self righteous bit like the Gandhi piece. I know the atheists love him simply because of that but he's still an unreconstructed Trotskyite and I don't get love for him in some quarters.

104 TedStriker  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 1:01:48pm

re: #35 allegro

But someone left the cake out in the rain and we'll never have the recipe again! Oh no!

/unwelcome flashback to a really stupid song

Loved Richard Harris...don't particularly care for MacArthur Park.

However, that song has been covered for everyone and their mothers, aside from the Donna Summer disco cover. Quoth the Wiki:

Notable cover versions

The song has been covered more than 50 times, including versions by:

The 5th Dimension
Diana Ross & the Supremes
Beggar's Opera
Glen Campbell
Vic Damone
Sammy Davis, Jr (twice)
Percy Faith
Michael Feinstein
Maynard Ferguson - M.F.Horn (1971)
Ferrante & Teicher
The Four Tops
Aretha Franklin - Live on The Bob Hope Show (1975)
Plastic Penny
Justin Hayward
Gitte Hænning
Waylon Jennings (Grammy Award)
Long John Baldry
Stan Kenton - Live at Redlands University (1970)
Liza Minnelli
Grimethorpe Colliery Band
Hugo Montenegro (Hugo's version used primarly just the middle eight part and was also used as a TV News theme for WJW/WJKW in the mid 1970's)
Only Men Aloud!
Elaine Paige
Psychotica
The Queers
Doc Severinsen
Frank Sinatra - Trilogy: Past, Present & Future (2010) [Box Set, CD]
The Negro Problem
The Three Degrees
Ukulele Orchestra of Great Britain
Andy Williams
Zumpano
Regine Velasquez
Sally Yeh
The Daly-Wilson Big Band
101 Strings - "Million Seller Hits Composed by Jim Webb and Burt Bacharach" [LP S-5162]
Transistor Transistor
Rico J. Puno
Peter Hofmann - Rock Classics (1987)

[edit] Other versions

Frank Sinatra, Tony Bennett, and Ed Ames each recorded versions utilizing only the middle section.
Chet Atkins and Jerry Reed recorded an all-instrumental version for their guitar duet album Me & Jerry, winner of the 1971 Grammy Award for Best Country Instrumental Performance.
The Four Tops recorded their version of the song, omitting the long instrumental breaks of the song, and reached #38 on the Billboard singles chart.
Beggars Opera recorded a progressive version with harpsicord and mellotron in their 3rd album "Pathfinder" in 1972.
The song was also performed by the Madison Scouts Drum and Bugle Corps in several productions in the mid-1970s.
In 1977 Finnish singer-songwriter Hector recorded the song in band called H.E.C. with Finnish lyrics. Hector titled the song in Finnish as "Vanhan kirkon puisto" ("Old Church´s park"), referring to the old church of Helsinki, Hector's hometown.
In 1980 the song was performed by Pink Lady on their variety show Pink Lady and Jeff.
Mónica Naranjo performed a Spanish version of this song, "Palabra De Mujer", in the 1990s.
Moody Blues singer Justin Hayward with Mike Batt and the London Philharmonic Orchestra covered Webb's song on his Classic Blue album.
It was also performed by Carrie Underwood in season four of American Idol.
UK Hip Hop artist Roots Manuva uses the main chord structure in his 2001 single "Dreamy Days".
Father Guido Sarducci (Don Novello) sings an Italian version called "Parco MacArthur (La Torta in Pioggia)".
Noelia Cano, a Spanish singer, had a version in the reality show Operación Triunfo in 2008.
Industrial Music/Goth band Psychotica released the song as a 12' single on clear vinyl.
Parodied by "Weird Al" Yankovic in his 1993 song "Jurassic Park"
Vermont-based 'jam-band' Phish quoted the lyrics during a rendition of their composition "Dave's Energy Guide" at their March 8, 1991 concert while performing with members of the group Aquarium Rescue Unit at College Station Theater, in Tuscaloosa, Alabama.
Sung in Priscilla Queen of the Desert the musical.

Homer Simpson sang a version of this song in the 5th episode of season 15 "Co-dependents day."

Wild...

105 TedStriker  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 1:03:11pm

re: #40 jaunte

Some Hot Air commenters are loving it:

With an occasional dissenter:

Who are then swiftly lambasted and marginalized, at the very least.

106 William of Orange  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 1:36:24pm

Guess my worries are over. The 9-9-9 plan is now also considered a joke. I was affraid I had to take that one serious. Glad to see Cain cleared this up.

107 Amory Blaine  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 1:56:50pm

re: #106 William of Orange

Guess he wants to be the Comedian In Chief. Fine. Why the bloodthirsty cheers from mainstream republicans in the crowd?

108 nines09  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 2:10:46pm

Feed the crowd and deny anything you said. Even if it is from your own mouth and on video and audio. Nope. Didn't mean that. But, you know what I meant......No?

109 SidewaysQuark  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 2:22:48pm

re: #88 recusancy

He also helped defeat "Hillary Care" all the way back in '93. He's definitely smart and knows what he's doing.

The things he's already said would be thrown right back at him and destroy him in a general election, should he win the primary. He's already screwed himself.

110 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 5:09:42pm

Last sentence...I guess the answer is "overnight".

111 labman57  Sun, Oct 16, 2011 6:48:38pm

Making it up as he goes along? Explains a lot ...

Shades of Bachmann "merely joking" about God creating natural disasters along the east coast -- which result in loss of numerous lives and homes -- to show His displeasure with the Obama administration.

Just what the nation needs -- yet another right wing mental midget who gets his/her hyperbolic talking points from the likes of Limbaugh and Coulter.

112 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Oct 17, 2011 12:51:40am

re: #107 Amory Blaine

Guess he wants to be the Comedian In Chief. Fine. Why the bloodthirsty cheers from mainstream republicans in the crowd?

Because bloodthirsty cons r bloodthirsty.

113 im_gumby_damnit  Mon, Oct 17, 2011 10:30:19am

The problem with the old "I was joking" line is that the "joke" is often worse than the comment.

Did Herman Cain really think a comment about electrocuting poor Mexicans was funny? What does that say about him?

It's like when Michelle Bachmann tried to claim she was joking when she said that God sent Hurricane Irene to kill Americans so we would understand that Congress had to cut spending. That's a joke? Who in their right mind would think that was funny?


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