Michele Bachmann’s Iowa Co-Chairman Endorses Ron Paul

Ron Paul rising
Wingnuts • Views: 32,514

OK now, this is just getting hilarious: Breaking: Michele Bachmann Iowa campaign co-chair endorses Ron Paul.

News is breaking this evening that presidential candidate Michele Bachmann’s Iowa campaign co-chairman Kent Sorenson has endorsed Ron Paul, one of her rivals in the Iowa caucus race.

Sorenson, a state senator from Indianola, apparently announced the surprise endorsement from the stage of a Paul event at the the Iowa State Fairgrounds.

The turnabout is a major surprise with just six days remaining before Iowa’s first-in-the-nation caucuses. Sorenson, in fact, appeared at a Bachmann event just this afternoon — a stop at the Pizza Ranch in his hometown of Indianola.

[…]

Fellow Bachmann campaign co-chairman Brad Zaun told reporters Sorenson had just returned from the dentist, and Sorenson himself said he was saying little because he was still numb and afraid he would drool on himself.

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714 comments
1 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:10:08pm
... Sorenson, in fact, appeared at a Bachmann event just this afternoon — a stop at the Pizza Ranch in his hometown of Indianola.

Tell me why. Why do the wingnuts in Iowa congregate at these cheap knock-off pizza joints?

2 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:10:31pm

Is this a rat jumping from a sinking ship to the Titanic?

3 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:10:58pm
Fellow Bachmann campaign co-chairman Brad Zaun told reporters Sorenson had just returned from the dentist, and Sorenson himself said he was saying little because he was still numb and afraid he would drool on himself.

/Not the Onion.

4 jamesfirecat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:11:05pm

Send in... the clowns...

5 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:15:28pm

OMG. CAN'T.MAKE.THIS.UP.

6 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:15:52pm

re: #3 jaunte

Fellow Bachmann campaign co-chairman Brad Zaun told reporters Sorenson had just returned from the dentist, and Sorenson himself said he was saying little because he was still numb and afraid he would drool on himself.

This is the funniest campaign ever.

And yet, the saddest.

7 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:16:30pm

Sorenson: "Ahrm wiff Raahn Porrr nahw..."

8 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:17:13pm

I was trying to post this - it's pretty crazy to be a Republican. Afraid now of Ron Paul. Or just giving in and endorsing him. WTF.

But OT, was having a hell of a time with my ipad - question Charles, is there a inherent difficulty with your extreme (HTML - correct?) site with the apple monster?

I'm on my pc now, piece of freaking cake.

9 windsagio  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:17:24pm

THey've got photos.

10 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:19:48pm

LOLGOP LOLGOP

Ron Paul says he will eliminate five cabinet departments and replace them with weed, gold & the tears of women losing their right to choose.

11 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:20:40pm

Pizza Ranch

???

anybody who would sell pizza in a ranch would buy jewelry in a barn

12 Irving  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:21:39pm

I'm sorry, I can't post a response that doesn't make me sound like I'm jeeped up on dentist juice myself, this is so bizarre. Wha? Snu? Meefle?

I used to envy Italian elections for their surrealism. Guess I don't have that to worry about anymore.

13 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:24:22pm

re: #12 Irving

Hi Irving!

14 jamesfirecat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:25:33pm

re: #6 Charles

This is the funniest campaign ever.

And yet, the saddest.

The tears of a clown who doesn't realize why their shoes are so big...

15 dragonath  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:26:26pm

re: #11 engineer dog

Yeah, if she was a real Tea Party Patriot, she would have stopped at Paul Revere's Pizza. Check out that cool logo.

16 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:28:05pm

K, I'mre: #15 dragonath

Yeah, if she was a real Tea Party Patriot, she would have stopped at Paul Revere's Pizza. Check out that cool logo.

Revolutionary Home Delivery!

17 Obdicut  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:29:08pm

re: #15 dragonath

Do they start off bringing you the pizza, only to have a breakdown and pass it off to Sam Prescott pizza, who gets it to you in time?

18 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:29:19pm

re: #12 Irving

Image: MVDlh.jpg

19 jamesfirecat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:30:02pm

re: #15 dragonath

Yeah, if she was a real Tea Party Patriot, she would have stopped at Paul Revere's Pizza. Check out that cool logo.

Do they ring bells to warn people that your pizza is coming?

20 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:30:48pm

re: #19 jamesfirecat

Do they ring bells to warn people that your pizza is coming?

lol, I wonder what the dingbat is thinking now.

22 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:32:17pm

re: #21 Gus 802

Ron Paul scrubs endorsement from "gays should get the death penalty" pastor Rev. Phillip G. Kayser.

It's still in the Google cache though.

Page it!

23 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:33:58pm

OK, let me see what I can do.

24 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:35:04pm

Lol, his wiki page has been updated.

On December 28, 2011 Sorenson resigned as Michele Bachmann's Iowa campaign chairman and endorsed Ron Paul as his choice in the 2012 Iowa Caucuses and the presidency of the United States.[1]

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

25 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:35:16pm

re: #11 engineer dog

anybody who would sell pizza in a ranch would buy jewelry in a barn

Things normally raised on ranches: horses, cattle, sheep.

"Pizza" is not an ungulate.

26 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:36:22pm

re: #21 Gus 802

This may help too: [Link: www.ronpaulforums.com...]

27 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:36:33pm

re: #1 freetoken

Tell me why. Why do the wingnuts in Iowa congregate at these cheap knock-off pizza joints?

Pizza Ranch?

Something wrong with barbecue?

You buy barbecue on a Ranch.

You buy seafood in Homer, Alaska.

You buy pizza in certain neighborhoods in New York City.

You buy Mexican food in certain neighborhoods in Los Angeles.

You buy Chinese food in certain neighborhoods in...lots of cities. (For example, despite its name, you want to buy Chinese food in Alhambra, California.)

You buy steak in Dallas.

Rule #1: Buy what they make there. They'll be good at it.

28 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:38:23pm

re: #17 Obdicut

Do they start off bringing you the pizza, only to have a breakdown and pass it off to Sam Prescott pizza, who gets it to you in time?

One topping if ordered by land, two if by sea.

29 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:38:54pm

re: #25 freetoken

"Pizza" is not an ungulate.

Even though the pieces do tapir toward the middle.

30 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:39:24pm

OK, I'm off to In & Out. bbl

31 Killgore Trout  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:44:45pm

Tardy anarchist shows up late to flight, claims oppression....
Occupy London:Occupier Denied Boarding For Flight Home-"Could Distribute Leaflets" As Justification

Of course the outrageous outrage falls apart if you follow the links: Occupy protester 'banned' from flight home for Christmas

A spokesman for Servisair, which manages the departure gates, said Mr Culatto was stopped because he arrived at the gate after it closed because of the time it took to clear security. He said the decision not to allow him to fly was taken by the airline.

Ryanair called the allegations "complete and utter rubbish"

32 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:45:22pm

@NicoleGennette

Lowest of the low. Big Journalism's @DLoesch urges a boycott of the Girl Scouts due to "moral decline".

Apparently she's mad at the Girl Scouts for suggesting Media Matters as a site to check the validity of internet rumors.

33 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:48:07pm

re: #31 Killgore Trout

Tardy anarchist shows up late to flight, claims oppression...
Occupy London:Occupier Denied Boarding For Flight Home-"Could Distribute Leaflets" As Justification

Of course the outrageous outrage falls apart if you follow the links: Occupy protester 'banned' from flight home for Christmas

Should have gone Aer Lingus. They don't care if you want to get up and macarena down the aisles.

34 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:48:27pm

re: #32 jaunte

@NicoleGennette

Apparently she's mad at the Girl Scouts for suggesting Media Matters as a site to check the validity of internet rumors.

Media Ma-SOROS!

35 elizajane  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:54:14pm

And Ann Coulter endorses Willard Romney on the grounds that the guy who invented Obamacare is the candidate most likely to successfully repeal it.

No really. I'm not making it up.

[Link: www.anncoulter.com...]

36 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:57:14pm

re: #35 elizajane

Hey, I said some wingnuts would come around.

37 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:57:18pm

re: #35 elizajane

No really. I'm not making it up.

Campaign sloganeering time Lizards!


No, We're Not Making This Up!

Generic Republican 2012

38 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:57:36pm

re: #35 elizajane

And Ann Coulter endorses Willard Romney on the grounds that the guy who invented Obamacare is the candidate most likely to successfully repeal it.

No really. I'm not making it up.

[Link: www.anncoulter.com...]

I'd be willing to bet that Mitts will end up as the GOP nominee.

39 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:59:20pm

re: #38 Charles

I'd be willing to bet that Mitts will end up as the GOP nominee.

What clued you in? The complete meltdown of the other candidates?

40 jamesfirecat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 6:59:54pm

re: #38 Charles

I'd be willing to bet that Mitts will end up as the GOP nominee.

Jon Stewart called it back when Cain was still running, though it all depends on if the crazies can rally behind one candidate or not, if they do then Mitt is probably toast.

41 elizajane  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:03:57pm

re: #38 Charles

I'd be willing to bet that Mitts will end up as the GOP nominee.

It was always destined to be so, because it was his turn!!

And the Republicans are no longer a party: they are a party game.

42 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:10:05pm

re: #41 elizajane

It was always destined to be so, because it was his turn!!

And the Republicans are no longer a party: they are a party game.

You're right. They do sound like a very odd game of Apples to Apples right now.

43 Nick Schroeder  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:12:19pm

The original link seems to no longer work.

44 Nick Schroeder  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:15:03pm

Ah, they updated the title and the URL changed, and they haven't bothered to redirect.

[Link: caucuses.desmoinesregister.com...]

Also, Bachmann responds:

[Link: caucuses.desmoinesregister.com...]

45 darthstar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:15:17pm

Poor Bachmann. Knowing she's probably in a Lithium-muted rage right now makes me happy.

46 nines09  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:17:10pm

He really jumped ship because he came to the sad realization that as crazy as Michelle is.....She's just not crazy enough. He should have ended his announcement by saying, "And now I'm going to set myself on fire and pinwheel through a plate glass window."

47 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:18:48pm

I'm waiting for Bachmann to compare this betrayal to Brutus stabbing Popeye in the back on the floor of the Senate.

48 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:18:58pm

re: #44 Nick Schroeder

Ah, they updated the title and the URL changed, and they haven't bothered to redirect.

[Link: caucuses.desmoinesregister.com...]

Also, Bachmann responds:

[Link: caucuses.desmoinesregister.com...]

I wonder how much money he was offered?

“Kent Sorenson personally told me he was offered a large sum of money to go to work for the Paul campaign. Kent campaigned with us earlier this afternoon and went immediately afterward to a Ron Paul event and announced he is changing teams. Kent said to me yesterday that ‘everyone sells out in Iowa, why shouldn’t I,’ then he told me he would stay with our campaign. The Ron Paul campaign has to answer for its actions.

49 darthstar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:20:18pm

re: #47 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I'm waiting for Bachmann to compare this betrayal to Brutus stabbing Popeye in the back on the floor of the Senate.

Only if Bachmann can claim to be Olive Oyl.

50 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:21:30pm

re: #38 Charles

I'd be willing to bet that Mitts will end up as the GOP nominee.

WHAT THE FUCK IS LEFT? Nobody is worth it - Romney! Think McCain had it bad. hahahaha

51 darthstar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:22:46pm

re: #44 Nick Schroeder

Also, Bachmann responds:

[Link: caucuses.desmoinesregister.com...]

It's not a defection, it's a conspiracy!

52 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:23:37pm

Meanwhile, in Birtherville, GA:

Five Georgia men are challenging President Barack Obama's inclusion on next year's presidential ballot, with some arguing the Democrat is not eligible for office because the Constitution says that a president must be a "natural born citizen."

The challenges have been made through the Georgia Office of the Secretary of State.

Two of the men filing the challenges are being represented by Republican state Rep. Mark Hatfield, a Waycross lawyer.

Hatfield says he believes the United States' founders intended not only for presidents to be born in the U.S. but for their parents to also have been U.S. citizens. Obama was born to an American mother and Kenyan father.

53 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:23:51pm

re: #32 jaunte

@NicoleGennette

Apparently she's mad at the Girl Scouts for suggesting Media Matters as a site to check the validity of internet rumors.

We all know that the Girl Scouts are just a front for Lesbian Activists anyway... don't we?

54 nines09  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:24:44pm

re: #8 Stanley Sea
I cannot link on my ipad2 either to LGF article or page. Thought it might be me.

55 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:26:18pm

Paul Questions the U.S. Military Presence on Korean Peninsula

NEWTON, Iowa — Ron Paul on Wednesday questioned the United States’ long military presence on the Korean Peninsula even as the death of the North Korean leader Kim Jong-il raised concerns about the region’s stability.

“How long do we have to stay in Korea?” he asked at a campaign event at the Iowa Speedway. “We were there since I was in high school.”

Mr. Paul did not explicitly call for the withdrawal of American troops from the region. But the implication was clear: He questioned the cost of keeping the troops there and the wisdom of American involvement overseas.

56 Killgore Trout  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:27:49pm

IDF confirms preparations for extensive future Gaza military action

Under a plan overseen by Chief of General Staff Lt. Gen. Benny Gantz, the next Gaza operation would be shorter than the one launched in late 2008, but would employ far greater firepower.

The IDF notes, however, that Hamas and other terror groups in the Gaza Strip, including Islamic Jihad, have more weapons now than they did in 2008. The Kornet anti-tank missiles have since become a threat to Israeli tanks, and this year rockets were fired for the first time at IDF troops.
...
The officers also noted an increase in terror activity coming from Egypt, which they attribute to the weakening of government control in the Sinai Peninsula.

"We know the Gaza Strip," said an officer who is active in the region. "But over the last year there have been changes in the Middle East that brought new challenges and new realities. The loss of control in Egypt has led to an increase in hostile activity and to a different deployment of our forces."

57 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:29:33pm

War, it gets us off.

58 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:29:51pm

Ron Paul's stance on Israel called into question

LOS ANGELES — A leading Jewish human rights organization is calling on Republican presidential candidate Ron Paul to address newly published assertions by a former aide that Paul favors abolishing Israel.

Such a position, if true, would mark a radical departure from more than 60 years of bipartisan U.S. support for the Jewish state, said Rabbi Marvin Hier, founder and dean of the Los Angeles-based Simon Wiesenthal Center.

"We hope that (Paul) would confront this issue," Hier told Reuters on Wednesday.

"If he says that his principal aide was mistaken and that he never said that, that's one thing. But if he adheres to such a position, that he believes there ought not be an Israel, that should be a wake-up call to America."

Neither Paul nor representatives of his campaign immediately returned phone calls or responded to email queries seeking comment on the issue.

59 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:32:11pm

re: #55 NJDhockeyfan

Paul Questions the U.S. Military Presence on Korean Peninsula

I guess he doesn't give a fuck about allies or treaties.

60 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:33:25pm

re: #56 Killgore Trout

IDF confirms preparations for extensive future Gaza military action

The people who live in Gaza would have nothing to worry about if they just dropped their weapons, turned in their rockets & bombs, and decided to live like respectable humans right next to Israel.

61 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:34:12pm

re: #59 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I guess he doesn't give a fuck about allies or treaties.

The entire point of Libertarianism is "Leave me alone, I'll leave you alone."

It requires, I think, a grand indifference to what has actually happened to other people throughout history, and how often mutual assistance has been needed, and been effective.

62 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:34:41pm

re: #60 NJDhockeyfan

The people who live in Gaza would have nothing to worry about if they just dropped their weapons, turned in their rockets & bombs, and decided to live like respectable humans right next to Israel.

Problem is, that's not a decision that my mythical cabbie from Gaza can make for himself. The majority of the people in the Strip are essentially hostages to Hamas' agenda.

63 FreedomMoon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:37:38pm

Another confirmation that it's easier said than done when being consistent on crazy. It's hard to settle on one when they're so many erratic flavors.

64 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:38:17pm

re: #62 SanFranciscoZionist

Problem is, that's not a decision that my mythical cabbie from Gaza can make for himself. The majority of the people in the Strip are essentially hostages to Hamas' agenda.

They voted to put Hamas in charge and now have to live with the consequences. I really feel sorry for them. If they started massive protests in the streets against the terrorists like what we saw in Egypt, Libya, and now in Syria they could solve a lot of their problems.

65 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:41:48pm

re: #14 jamesfirecat

The tears of a clown who doesn't realize why their shoes are so big...

Shall we get Smoky Robinson to sing them a song?

66 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:42:46pm

re: #64 NJDhockeyfan

They voted to put Hamas in charge and now have to live with the consequences. I really fell sorry for them. If they started massive protests in the streets against the terrorists like what we saw in Egypt, Libya, and now in Syria they could solve a lot of their problems.

It would look more like Syria than Egypt, and in a very small area, and Israel would almost certainly become involved almost immediately.

Hard to know what would help at this point. Gaza is one of the Intractable Problems of the World.

67 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:43:21pm

re: #64 NJDhockeyfan

They voted to put Hamas in charge and now have to live with the consequences. I really feel sorry for them. If they started massive protests in the streets against the terrorists like what we saw in Egypt, Libya, and now in Syria they could solve a lot of their problems.

I cannot wait to see the unusual supporters of Occupy Gaza.

HA

68 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:46:47pm

re: #66 SanFranciscoZionist

It would look more like Syria than Egypt, and in a very small area, and Israel would almost certainly become involved almost immediately.

Hard to know what would help at this point. Gaza is one of the Intractable Problems of the World.

Quite Concur. Hamas would just deploy fanatics who'd start shooting. To them, their being in charge means the place is "properly Islamic" and they will not let such a status or their power slip. They'll have to be killed in large numbers, that's the only way Hamas goes away.

69 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:47:42pm

re: #59 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I guess he doesn't give a fuck about allies or treaties.

Rabble rabble rabble entangling treaties rabble rabble George Washington rabble rabble harumph!

I didn't get a harumph out of that guy!

70 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:52:04pm

re: #68 Dark_Falcon

Quite Concur. Hamas would just deploy fanatics who'd start shooting. To them, their being in charge means the place is "properly Islamic" and they will not let such a status or their power slip. They'll have to be killed in large numbers, that's the only way Hamas goes away.

They've managed to hold more power than Fatah would have let them keep if they hadn't managed to sieze control of inaccessible Gaza. Fortress Hamas. And they're going to hold on to that no matter what comes out of the talks with Fatah.

Makes me quote Yeats...Great hatred, little room, maimed us at the start.

71 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:52:12pm

re: #69 ArchangelMichael

Because at no time in American history did we ever need allies to help us, so why should we help them!
/

72 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:54:03pm

re: #71 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Because at no time in American history did we ever need allies to help us, so why should we help them!
/

I see you graduated from Greater Wingnuttia University, M.A. in Kookology with a Minor in Conspiracy Theories involving Joos and the CFR?

/

73 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:55:50pm

The Republican Party has gone off the deep end. Now the Virginia GOP wants primary voters to sign a loyalty oath.

74 ArchangelMichael  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:56:37pm

re: #73 Gus 802

The Republican Party has gone off the deep end. Now the Virginia GOP wants primary voters to sign a loyalty oath.

Does it end in "Partei über Alles!"?

75 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:57:11pm

re: #73 Gus 802

It will work like a Gingrich wedding vow.

76 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:58:03pm

arlen spectre doing standup?

77 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:59:40pm

re: #73 Gus 802

The Republican Party has gone off the deep end. Now the Virginia GOP wants primary voters to sign a loyalty oath.

Fuck that. I will vote for whoever I want to and I wont tell them who it is. I think I will sign the loyalty oath for Gen. Patton.

78 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:59:44pm

Shhh, no one tell Ron Paul, he'll get in a tizzy.

Texas-South Korea Trade Coalition

The Free Trade Alliance, in conjunction with the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, has founded the Texas-South Korea Trade Coalition to advocate for the passing of the pending trade agreement and benefits of trade with South Korea. The Coalition is comprised of Texas companies, industry organizations, trade associations, and local chambers that support passage of the U.S. – South Korea Fair Trade Agreement and increased trade and investment with South Korea. Korea is one of Texas’ largest trading partners, with 2009 exported goods totaling $5.3 billion.

79 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 7:59:48pm

re: #74 ArchangelMichael

Does it end in "Partei über Alles!"?

Ich gelobe, die almight Gott, dass ich getreulich für die höchste republikanische Partei Kandidaten der Nation für das Präsidentenamt des Vaterlandes am Wahltag zur Wahl!

80 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:00:37pm
Signs for polling places and the pledge form will advise voters that “Section 24.2-545 of the Code of Virginia allows the political party holding a primary to determine requirements for voting in the primary, including ‘the signing of a pledge by the voter of his intention to support the party’s candidate when offering to vote in the primary.’ ”

The pledge will require the voter to sign and to print his name beneath a line that says: “I, the undersigned, pledge that I intend to support the nominee of the Republican Party for president.”
[Link: bit.ly...]

81 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:01:07pm

Pam Geller can rest easy, knowing that the LGF haters are on the case!

That's right folks, Pam's loyal defenders, Dorkus and his Stalker Blog, have swung into action. As usual they are insulting Charles without addressing his arguments and defending the hate spewers who comments Charles quoted without even mildly being perturbed by their hate. The mindlessness is astounding, and it's because they can't face the truth. Pathetic.

[waves to the Stalkers]

82 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:04:16pm

re: #80 jaunte

That's a bit much. I understand that they're worried about shenanigans, though, and its not a baseless fear. Democrats might vote in the GOP primary to vote for Ron Paul and mess things up for Mitt Romney.

83 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:04:27pm

re: #73 Gus 802

The Republican Party has gone off the deep end. Now the Virginia GOP wants primary voters to sign a loyalty oath.

Or what?

84 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:05:37pm

re: #83 SanFranciscoZionist

Or what?

No vote! Obviously that's unenforceable and likely un-Constitutional.

85 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:07:10pm

It's not clear what will happen to anyone who breaks the pledge.

86 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:07:30pm

re: #85 jaunte

It's not clear what will happen to anyone who breaks the pledge.

I'll let you know.

87 Lidane  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:07:46pm

re: #73 Gus 802

The Republican Party has gone off the deep end. Now the Virginia GOP wants primary voters to sign a loyalty oath.

The loyalty oath makes me laugh. How would they enforce it? General election ballots are secret.

88 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:09:10pm

re: #84 Gus 802

No vote! Obviously that's unenforceable and likely un-Constitutional.

Yeah, I don't think that's gonna work real well.

89 Romantic Heretic  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:09:16pm

re: #62 SanFranciscoZionist

Problem is, that's not a decision that my mythical cabbie from Gaza can make for himself. The majority of the people in the Strip are essentially hostages to Hamas' agenda.

Thank you. After reading another lizard's comment elsewhere that made it clear they regard all Arabs as haters of Israel and America it's nice to see someone with a little nuance.

90 Lidane  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:09:22pm

re: #83 SanFranciscoZionist

Or what?

Why do you hate America?

///

91 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:09:36pm

re: #87 Lidane

The loyalty oath makes me laugh. How would they enforce it? General election ballots are secret.

They can't. It's intended as an "on your honor" sort of thing.

92 Lidane  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:10:21pm

re: #91 Dark_Falcon

They can't. It's intended as an "on your honor" sort of thing.

It's still fucking stupid. Then again, we're talking about the same idiots who think that a candidate signing a pledge forces them to actually live up to it.

93 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:10:32pm

re: #87 Lidane

The loyalty oath makes me laugh. How would they enforce it? General election ballots are secret.

What do they want, anyway? If they're primary voters, they're going to...er..vote for the Republican of their choice in the primary...?

What else do they want from them?

94 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:11:13pm

re: #89 Romantic Heretic

Thank you. After reading another lizard's comment elsewhere that made it clear they regard all Arabs as haters of Israel and America it's nice to see someone with a little nuance.

Nuance is kind of my thing. It's a curse.

95 Lidane  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:11:52pm

re: #93 SanFranciscoZionist

What do they want, anyway? If they're primary voters, they're going to...er..vote for the Republican of their choice in the primary...?

What else do they want from them?

Dunno. But until they start handing out color coordinated shirts to people, I'm just going to point and laugh.

96 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:13:30pm

re: #93 SanFranciscoZionist

I think in Virginia, Democrats can vote in the Republican primary.

97 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:14:11pm

re: #91 Dark_Falcon

They can't. It's intended as an "on your honor" sort of thing.

OK, I read an article on this now, and it blows my mind. The idea is that if you vote for, say, Romney, and Romney doesn't make it, you can't vote for Obama, because you promised?

That's crazy. No one gets to do that to an American voter. What bullshit.

98 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:15:26pm

re: #97 SanFranciscoZionist

OK, I read an article on this now, and it blows my mind. The idea is that if you vote for, say, Romney, and Romney doesn't make it, you can't vote for Obama, because you promised?

That's crazy. No one gets to do that to an American voter. What bullshit.

It's downright un-American.

99 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:16:13pm

re: #96 jaunte

I think in Virginia, Democrats can vote in the Republican primary.

Ah, you are correct. So that's what they're trying to avoid, Democrats swaying the nomination.

Stupid.

100 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:16:40pm

re: #85 jaunte

It's not clear what will happen to anyone who breaks the pledge.

You'll make baby Jesus cry.

101 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:16:57pm

re: #96 jaunte

I think in Virginia, Democrats can vote in the Republican primary.

Yes they can. Anyone can vote in any election out there.

102 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:17:02pm

To lose one campaign staff is careless.... to lose two....?

103 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:17:03pm

re: #99 SanFranciscoZionist

Another bulwark against the flood of voter fraud.
///

104 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:18:07pm

re: #96 jaunte

I think in Virginia, Democrats can vote in the Republican primary.

And that's it right there. They're afraid of Democrats crossing over to vote for Ron Paul. Said Dems would do that to take delegates away from Mitt Romney, and the Virginia GOP does not like that scenario. I don't like it either, but I don't think a pledge like this will have the desired effect.

105 Lidane  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:19:08pm

re: #97 SanFranciscoZionist

OK, I read an article on this now, and it blows my mind. The idea is that if you vote for, say, Romney, and Romney doesn't make it, you can't vote for Obama, because you promised?

That's crazy. No one gets to do that to an American voter. What bullshit.

That's why it's ultimately meaningless. What are they going to do, try to prosecute someone for voting for a different candidate? Even if you could get a wingnut DA to go along with it, they'd get slapped down by every court in the country, up to and including SCOTUS.

It's fucking stupid. It makes a mockery of the secret ballot. And it is ultimately unconstitutional.

106 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:19:55pm

re: #104 Dark_Falcon

And that's it right there. They're afraid of Democrats crossing over to vote for Ron Paul. Said Dems would do that to take delegates away from Mitt Romney, and the Virginia GOP does not like that scenario. I don't like it either, but I don't think a pledge like this will have the desired effect.

If the law says that people can vote for the candidates, that's the law. If they were this worried about Democrats meddling in Republican business, perhaps they should have worked on changing this...sooner?

107 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:20:02pm

re: #99 SanFranciscoZionist

Ah, you are correct. So that's what they're trying to avoid, Democrats swaying the nomination.

Stupid.

They did something similar in CA. You have to be registered Republican to vote in the GOP primary.

108 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:20:56pm

re: #107 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

They did something similar in CA. You have to be registered Republican to vote in the GOP primary.

Yeah, I can only vote in Democratic primaries. But I've never had to promise who I was going to support in the general.

109 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:21:51pm

re: #107 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

They did something similar in CA. You have to be registered Republican to vote in the GOP primary.

That's OK. What is not OK is trying to require someone to sign a pledge.

110 Lidane  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:22:33pm

re: #104 Dark_Falcon

And that's it right there. They're afraid of Democrats crossing over to vote for Ron Paul. Said Dems would do that to take delegates away from Mitt Romney, and the Virginia GOP does not like that scenario.

Tough shit. They can deal with it. Four years ago, Limbaugh and the rest of the talk radio howler monkeys were encouraging Republicans to vote in the Democratic primaries here in Texas to give the state to Hillary Clinton. They obviously approve of the tactic.

Besides, most Democrats are happy watching the GOP destroy each other from the sidelines, and there isn't going to be a Dem primary in VA at all anyway. The VA GOP are assuming that people are going to go vote when they don't have to.

111 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:23:42pm

g'night folks.

had to visit my doc this afternoon, was seen within the hour and left with 2 weeks of antibiotics and painkillers. Totally free because i'm out of work. £15/$20 total for the drugs if I was working.

112 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:24:09pm

Marching Orders for Paul’s Volunteers: Do Shave, Don’t Tweet

DES MOINES — Ron Paul’s college-aged volunteer army — a core of the powerful ground organization that is the envy of rivals — is descending on Iowa from around the nation to coax people to the state’s Republican caucuses as he seeks to pull off what only months ago seemed like an unthinkable victory here on Tuesday.

Four years after young people flocked to the state to help propel the campaign of Barack Obama, this radically different movement is embracing a 76-year-old veteran Texas congressman who is drawing supporters for his libertarian and antiwar views.

And they say they are under strict orders: To look, dress, shave, sound and behave in a way that will not jeopardize Mr. Paul’s chances. Even before flying here on their own nickel, some students said they had been instructed to cover up tattoos and told that their faces should be fresh-shaved or beards neatly trimmed, wearing only nice clothes that one described as “business casual.”

“No tats,” another volunteer, Rocco Lucente, said as he ticked off the rules after arriving at the airport Tuesday night. No liquor, no drugs and, he said, no “fraternizing in the dorms, nothing like that.”

He said the standard expected of volunteers was: “What would Ron Paul do?”

Here is a group of proud clean Paulbots.

113 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:25:22pm

re: #112 NJDhockeyfan

Marching Orders for Paul’s Volunteers: Do Shave, Don’t Tweet

Here is a group of proud clean Paulbots.

Gene McCarthy's campaign did that, didn't they? "Clean for Gene".

114 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:29:44pm

re: #112 NJDhockeyfan

Marching Orders for Paul’s Volunteers: Do Shave, Don’t Tweet

Here is a group of proud clean Paulbots.

It's a Ronulan invasion!

115 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:31:34pm

Hi Lizardia!

It took FOUR FREAKIN HOURS from the time we got off the I-80 in New Jersey until we finally made it to our temp apartment in Brooklyn. FOUR FREAKIN HOURS which is longer than it took to drive all the way across Ohio, including a detour for lunch in Cleveland.

Driving the I-80 is not fun.

When finally got unpacked and logged on to Teh Intertubes, found an email inviting The Babushka as a guest to the Zev Brenner talk show, because of this blog post. I said I would have to think it over.

Any NY lizards ever listen to the Zev Brenner show? Is he a wingnut?

116 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:31:59pm

re: #114 Dark_Falcon

It's a Ronulan invasion!

True Believers

117 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:32:07pm
And they say they are under strict orders: To look, dress, shave, sound and behave in a way that will not jeopardize Mr. Paul’s chances.

"There is only one kind of freedom and that's individual liberty."
-- Ron Paul

118 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:36:12pm

re: #116 Gus 802

True Believers

He's suffering now, I'm sure. This caucus trip is really rough on hippies like that: having to shave the scraggly beard, having to wash your hair and live without the do' rag, taking out the nose piercing. He's making big sacrifices because he believes in FREEDOM, MAN!

/dripping

119 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:36:54pm

re: #115 Alouette

Hi Lizardia!

It took FOUR FREAKIN HOURS from the time we got off the I-80 in New Jersey until we finally made it to our temp apartment in Brooklyn. FOUR FREAKIN HOURS which is longer than it took to drive all the way across Ohio, including a detour for lunch in Cleveland.

Driving the I-80 is not fun.

When finally got unpacked and logged on to Teh Intertubes, found an email inviting The Babushka as a guest to the Zev Brenner talk show, because of this blog post. I said I would have to think it over.

Any NY lizards ever listen to the Zev Brenner show? Is he a wingnut?

Well, according to Wikipedia, you'll be in good company.

Notable personalities he interviewed on his show include President Bill Clinton; Secretary of State Hillary Clinton; Senators Joseph Lieberman and Charles Schumer; Israeli Prime Ministers Benjamin Netanyahu, Shimon Peres, Yitzhak Shamir and Yitzhak Rabin; former Vice President Dan Quayle; former Soviet Premier Mikhail Gorbachev; and Al Sharpton.

I'd do a little research, and perhaps see if you can talk to him and get a feel for where he's coming from...but hey, if he's not crazy, go for it!

120 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:37:37pm

re: #117 jaunte

"There is only one kind of freedom and that's individual liberty."
-- Ron Paul

But individual liberty is so important that surely you can give up your individual liberty to help elect the one man who can protect your individual liberty.

121 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:38:16pm

re: #118 Dark_Falcon

He's suffering now, I'm sure. This caucus trip is really rough on hippies like that: having to shave the scraggly beard, having to wash your hair and live without the do' rag, taking out the nose piercing. He's making big sacrifices because he believes in FREEDOM, MAN!

/dripping

Yeah, it's the whole body language here. The closed eyes and head out stretched. Reminds me of people at a revival meeting. They really are like "true believers" and the Ron Paul followers make up a cult.

122 Nick Schroeder  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:39:18pm

God it would be so fucking hilarious if Ron Paul somehow won the GOP nomination.

I wouldn't have said that a few weeks ago, but after all the debates, I really can't stand all their pandering to the zealots and hatemongers in the Party. I don't like any of them, and Obama v. Paul in the general would pretty much be the same thing as Clinton v. Perot would have been if one could reshuffle history.

Personally I think most politicians stink and I've never given a dime of money or time and effort to any of them, but the GOP has really become a cesspool that brings out the worst in humanity to convince people to believe in a blatantly evil and hurtful ideology. I'm in a closed primary state and I'm a registered Republican... I'll be voting for Paul out of spite.

123 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:40:22pm

re: #118 Dark_Falcon

That's not a "hippie". My mom was a "hippie". That there is a "slippy".

124 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:41:21pm

And, if you can stand the insanity, Ron Paul in on 'The tonight Show' tonight.

125 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:44:29pm

re: #124 Dark_Falcon

And, if you can stand the insanity, Ron Paul in on 'The tonight Show' tonight.

I'm up for some comedy this evening.
:)

126 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:45:50pm

re: #124 Dark_Falcon

The TV I have is little more than my XBox's bitch. I'll spend that time wrecking zombies rather than watching Jay Leno pitch softball questions to one.

127 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:51:09pm

I call this one "Orly Paul."

128 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:51:11pm

John McCain ran in 2008, at the age of 72.

Many people said he was too old to occupy the Oval Office.

Ron Paul is now 76.

Just sayin'.

129 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:52:16pm

re: #127 Gus 802

I will kick you sooo hard your soul will pee.
/

130 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:53:08pm

re: #115 Alouette

Hi Lizardia!

It took FOUR FREAKIN HOURS from the time we got off the I-80 in New Jersey until we finally made it to our temp apartment in Brooklyn. FOUR FREAKIN HOURS which is longer than it took to drive all the way across Ohio, including a detour for lunch in Cleveland.

Driving the I-80 is not fun.

When finally got unpacked and logged on to Teh Intertubes, found an email inviting The Babushka as a guest to the Zev Brenner talk show, because of this blog post. I said I would have to think it over.

Any NY lizards ever listen to the Zev Brenner show? Is he a wingnut?

When we were Back East, the Princess wanted to visit Salem. I said no, because we would have had to drive up the coast through both New York City and Boston. I don't need to ask to know that driving those roads is not a happy thing.

131 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:53:50pm

re: #127 Gus 802

omfg
my eyes

132 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:55:48pm

re: #127 Gus 802

I call this one "Orly Paul."

SMACK!

Bad Gus!

133 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:55:51pm

re: #127 Gus 802

I call this one "Orly Paul."

Was that one of the 9 ladies dancing I just saw on Jay Leno?

134 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 8:58:55pm

re: #128 Slumbering Behemoth

John McCain ran in 2008, at the age of 72.

Many people said he was too old to occupy the Oval Office.

Ron Paul is now 76.

Just sayin'.

With McCain, I was afraid he might die in office.

With Paul, I'd be sort of hoping.

Yes, that's sick.

Actually, I wasn't that worried about McCain's age, until he tapped Palin. Yes, he's an older man, and his life has not been easy on his body, to say the least, but if he'd chosen a good VP candidate, I would have said, go for it.

Then I had this nightmarish fantasy of him taking the oath of office, clutching his chest and keeling over...next scene, Palin, taking the oath...wearing black.

135 Petero1818  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:01:00pm

re: #46 nines09

He really jumped ship because he came to the sad realization that as crazy as Michelle is...She's just not crazy enough. He should have ended his announcement by saying, "And now I'm going to set myself on fire and pinwheel through a plate glass window."

Let's be honest. She is as crazy as the rest of them. But her ability to communicate the crazy has been hampered by the fact that she is completely out of money. Dead in the water.

136 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:03:08pm

Ron Paul on Leno: "Young people go to college and really get their minds messed up..."

137 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:05:00pm

Paul is now on to his state's rights groove, riding a Tenther high. I'm waiting for the Dancing Klansmen to come onstage.

/spits

138 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:06:21pm

re: #136 jaunte

Ron Paul on Leno: "Young people go to college and really get their minds messed up..."

Seriously?

139 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:06:57pm

re: #138 Gus 802

Seriously?

Yes, seriously.

140 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:07:02pm

re: #138 Gus 802

That's what he said. There will probably be tape of it tomorrow.

141 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:08:09pm

re: #137 Dark_Falcon

Paul is now on to his state's rights groove, riding a Tenther high. I'm waiting for the Dancing Klansmen to come onstage.

/spits

I hope Leno brings up his foreign policy nonsense.

142 Petero1818  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:08:45pm

re: #136 jaunte

Ron Paul on Leno: "Young people go to college and really get their minds messed up..."

(with pitch fork in hand): "Book learnin is for Jews and fags" ////

143 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:09:13pm

re: #134 SanFranciscoZionist

With Paul, I'd be sort of hoping.

You're only saying that 'cuz he hasn't tapped a running mate yet. (Second look at Sarah Palin? Anyone?)

Actually, I wasn't that worried about McCain's age, until he tapped Palin. Yes, he's an older man, and his life has not been easy on his body, to say the least, but if he'd chosen a good VP candidate, I would have said, go for it.

This may sound a bit bigoted, but after seeing both my grandmas get hit with Alzheimer's, I am hugely in favor of taking a serious look at "upper-end" age limits.

We as a society accept the necessity of age limits on youth, it's a net benefit to all concerned. We need to get serious about the other end of life for the same reasons. With people living so much longer than they used too in this country, it's not enough to only say "You must be this old to blah blah blah". We must also get to a point where we can say "You must be at least this young to blah blah blah".

Not a popular stance, I know.

144 Big Joe  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:09:54pm

OT

Cow PooPooPaper for when you want to write shit.

145 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:11:08pm

He's against seat belt laws.

146 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:11:26pm

re: #136 jaunte

Ron Paul on Leno: "Young people go to college and really get their minds messed up..."

Only the ones homeschooled on creationist garbage.

147 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:11:27pm

re: #143 Slumbering Behemoth

You're only saying that 'cuz he hasn't tapped a running mate yet. (Second look at Sarah Palin? Anyone?)

This may sound a bit bigoted, but after seeing both my grandmas get hit with Alzheimer's, I am hugely in favor of taking a serious look at "upper-end" age limits.

We as a society accept the necessity of age limits on youth, it's a net benefit to all concerned. We need to get serious about the other end of life for the same reasons. With people living so much longer than they used too in this country, it's not enough to only say "You must be this old to blah blah blah". We must also get to a point where we can say "You must be this young to blah blah blah".

Not a popular stance, I know.

I think the difference is that people have such different experiences of aging. Some people slip into dementia in their seventies, some are sharp as a tack until they die at a hundred and nine.

148 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:13:09pm

re: #145 NJDhockeyfan

He's against seat belt laws.

He's also saying the federal government shouldn't be involved to regulate alcohol. This leaves out the long history of federal taxation of alcohol, going all the way back to George Washington.

149 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:13:30pm

You don't want none of them learnin'.

//

150 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:14:04pm

Ron Paul worries Fort Knox gold is gone
June 24, 2011

WASHINGTON (CNNMoney) -- With the price of gold at record highs, presidential candidate Rep. Ron Paul wants to make sure the U.S. gold bars at Fort Knox are really there.

Paul called a congressional hearing Thursday to grill federal officials about his bill to audit and inventory all of the gold reserves at Fort Knox, Ky., West Point, N.Y., and Denver, even though Treasury officials insist that the gold is audited annually and is all there.

During the hearing, Paul suggested that the Federal Reserve of New York, which has 5% of the U.S. gold reserves, has the ability to secretly sell or swap gold with other countries without anyone knowing.

"The Fed is pretty secret, you know," said Paul, who leans Libertarian. "Congress doesn't have much say on what's going on over there. They do a lot of hiding."

Paul, a Texas Republican who wants to convert the U.S. monetary system to one based on the gold standard, says the federal government owes it to taxpayers to make sure U.S.-owned gold is safe.

151 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:14:57pm

re: #148 Dark_Falcon

He's also saying the federal government shouldn't be involved to regulate alcohol. This leaves out the long history of federal taxation of alcohol, going all the way back to George Washington.

He's after the moonshiner vote.

152 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:15:47pm

re: #141 NJDhockeyfan

I hope Leno brings up his foreign policy nonsense.

You're going to get your wish after the commercial break.

153 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:15:55pm

Oh cool, foreign affairs is next. This should be mind numbing.

154 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:17:14pm

re: #149 Gus 802

You don't want none of them learnin'.

//

Except for me. I've got a M.D., but I'm special.

155 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:18:20pm

re: #153 NJDhockeyfan

Oh cool, foreign affairs is next. This should be mind numbing.

everybody grab your chair's arms tight. Otherwise Crazy Uncle Ron's lunacy will cause you to hurt yourself with all the facepalming you'll do.

156 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:18:27pm

re: #147 SanFranciscoZionist

I think the difference is that people have such different experiences of aging. Some people slip into dementia in their seventies, some are sharp as a tack until they die at a hundred and nine.

That is indeed true, and worthy of consideration. But the same could be said of the mental/emotional development of young people who are stuck living by arbitrary age limit rules.

And imagine if we applied such arbitrary, age associated rules to the elder end of the spectrum. IHOPs the nation over would be slightly inconvenienced!
/

157 Nick Schroeder  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:18:47pm

re: #147 SanFranciscoZionist

People have different experiences when it comes to being young, too. People who join the military at 18 probably think it's bullshit they can't go to a bar once in a while.

I don't really have an opinion on the issue, but I would point out that almost all public office positions have a minimum age requirement. And other governed aspects of life, such as being licensed to drive, have certain requirements once you reach a certain age. It seems a valid conversation to me.

158 jaunte  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:20:25pm

re: #145 NJDhockeyfan

He's against seat belt laws.

And federal safety standards for car makers.

159 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:21:18pm

Iran has no nukes or are building one.

Drink!

160 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:21:27pm

re: #158 jaunte

And federal safety standards for car makers.

By extension the NTSB and the FAA.

Where did they find this weirdo?

161 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:22:34pm

Yeah Ron, about propaganda: You've just shown that you've swallowed Iran's propaganda, hook, line, and sinker.

162 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:23:46pm

Lots of Paulbots in the audience.

163 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:23:49pm

The Paulians in the crowd are very loud tonight.

164 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:25:11pm

Ron Paul said Michelle Bachmann "hates Muslims". The vipers are fanging each other.

165 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:26:44pm

re: #163 Dark_Falcon

The Paulians in the crowd are very loud tonight.

What they lack in substance they make up with volume.

They're the aerogel of politics.

166 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:27:07pm

re: #161 Dark_Falcon

Yeah Ron, about propaganda: You've just shown that you've swallowed Iran's propaganda, hook, line, and sinker.

It's almost worse than that. I see it with some of these guys. It's a sort of casual indifference to whether a given thing is true or not. They can't imagine that there would be consequences they would care about, one way or another.

167 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:28:59pm

My apologies, aerogel is useful. The analogy doesn't work.

168 Mocking Jay  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:30:52pm

Joe Rogan has a new fan.

169 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:33:49pm

re: #167 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

My apologies, aerogel is useful. The analogy doesn't work.

substitute culinary foam for aerogel.

170 Gus  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:34:32pm

Who boy. Read the anti-climate change comments here...

[Link: www.frumforum.com...]

Talk about braindead.

171 Alexzander  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:34:50pm

re: #162 NJDhockeyfan

Lots of Paulbots in the audience.

Here at LGF? I just joined in; whats going on?

172 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:35:41pm

re: #171 Alexzander

Here at LGF? I just joined in; whats going on?

Ron Paul is on Leno.

173 erik_t  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:35:47pm

re: #1 freetoken

I have to reply all this way down. DO NOT MESS WITH MY DAMNED PIZZA RANCH.

After a rather aggressive and outrageous cross-country race in metro Des Moines (first through the course gets to break through the ice on the creek!), Pizza Ranch was possibly the best food I ever ate. Even though it was probably garbage.

BUT IT WAS MY GARBAGE AND I LOVED IT.

174 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:37:52pm

"But I guess I’d say to people who look at Ron Paul and have some measure of support for his domestic policies on the libertarian side, I’d have to say look, I consider myself pretty libertarian but you cannot live in fantasy land. The rest of the world is not going to leave us alone and we need a Commander-in-Chief who understands that. A Ron Paul president would simply not address the challenges we face."

~John Bolton

175 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:38:42pm

re: #156 Slumbering Behemoth

On that...

Many years back it was clear that my grandma had Alzheimer's, and her degenerated skill and ability behind the wheel made her a danger to herself and others.

One of her adult children made the tough decision to contact the DMV with medical evidence and get her DL pulled.

She fought for two years to get it back, and she did. After failing (miserably) several written tests*, failing several driving tests (one which ended before even pulling out of the parking stall at the DMV for nearly running over three people).

The day they finally did pass her, I was waiting out front of the DMV on a blazing hot summer's day, and saw her coming down the road with her windshield wipers going. A car she owned for many years, and she couldn't figure out how to turn them off, or remember how they got turned on. And that's the day she passed and got her DL back after two years of epic fail.

Something is wrong when that kind of thing happens.

*I took the same written test, that same year she had. And without studying, nor having the benefit of "driver's ed" :mumblety: years prior, I nailed it 100%

176 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:39:47pm

re: #168 JasonA

Joe Rogan has a new fan.

Alex Jones?

177 Mocking Jay  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:41:35pm

re: #176 Slumbering Behemoth

Alex Jones?

Paul.

178 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:42:23pm

re: #177 JasonA

Paul.

Paul, Alex....twins?

179 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:44:02pm

re: #178 NJDhockeyfan

Paul, Alex...twins?

Jones is young and boisterous. Paul is old and frail.

Not twins. Clones.
/

180 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:44:40pm

re: #179 Slumbering Behemoth

Jones is young and boisterous. Paul is old and frail.

Not twins. Clones.
/

MASTER BLASTER RUN WINGNUT TOWN!

181 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:48:02pm

re: #180 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

If ever a photoshop demanded to be born...

182 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:49:28pm

re: #181 Slumbering Behemoth

If ever a photoshop demanded to be born...

Image: Master-Blaster.jpg

183 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:50:21pm

re: #182 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Looks nothing like Paul or Jones. Fail.

184 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:51:25pm

re: #183 Slumbering Behemoth

Looks nothing like Paul or Jones. Fail.

How can you tell with the mask?

185 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 9:54:40pm

Perry is pulling a Herman Cain

In another shift, Perry says he would allow abortion if a woman’s life were at risk

186 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:02:02pm

re: #184 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Jones ain't that big, and Paul ain't that tiny. Though I could see how it might fool the less than observant.

And on a side note, Aunty was a slacker.

"Who run Bartertown"? Not the mother-fucker knee deep in pig shit if I were in her chain mail.

Wanna talk some shit? Seven spears for Blaster, and Master can have his fun being neck deep in it. THAT'S who run Bartertown!

187 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:06:54pm

upupa epops

188 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:10:10pm

re: #185 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Perry is pulling a Herman Cain

In another shift, Perry says he would allow abortion if a woman’s life were at risk

There is no way a man who worked as an OB-GYN for that many years never ran into an ectopic pregnancy.

189 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:10:39pm

re: #188 EmmmieG

There is no way a man who worked as an OB-GYN for that many years never ran into an ectopic pregnancy.

Perry, not Paul.

190 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:11:17pm

U.S. is giving South American leaders cancer, says Hugo Chavez

The U.S. government could be responsible for a recent spate of cancer among South American leaders, according to Venezuela's outspoken president Hugo Chavez.

He suggested that the U.S. might have 'invented technology to spread cancer', and warned other left-wing heads of state that they could be targeted next.

Mr Chavez, one of several Latin American leaders to have contracted the disease in the last year, said he had developed his theories after Fidel Castro described the CIA's repeated attempts to assassinate him.

191 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:11:21pm

re: #189 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Perry, not Paul.

Oh, oops. Getting tired. Sorry.

192 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:19:08pm

re: #190 NJDhockeyfan

I await Penn's assessment.
/

193 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:21:39pm

re: #175 Slumbering Behemoth

I'm about due to renew my DL, and in browsing over the info at the TX DPS website I was slightly alarmed to discover that Texas theoretically allows drivers over age 85 to obtain a commercial driver license. That means buses, double- and triple-trailer semis, tankers... basically anything huge and impervious to pedestrians, motorcycles, and small-to-midsize sedans.

194 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:22:54pm

re: #193 negativ

I'm about due to renew my DL, and in browsing over the info at the TX DPS website I was slightly alarmed to discover that Texas theoretically allows drivers over age 85 to obtain a commercial driver license. That means buses, double- and triple-trailer semis, tankers... basically anything huge and impervious to pedestrians, motorcycles, and small-to-midsize sedans.

Don't they also need that for RVs and Motorhomes?

195 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:23:21pm

Top 10 Racist Ron Paul Friends, Supporters

196 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:24:27pm

re: #193 negativ

Looks like they are pretty strict though.
[Link: www.dmv.org...]

197 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:27:10pm

re: #193 negativ

'Tis an odd and skewed system when we take the lack of experience of those younger into account, but not the lack of physical or mental ability of those older into account.

198 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:28:55pm

Nina Simone, with an appropriate song for this thread:

MP3 Audio
199 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:29:22pm

Beautiful song, that.

200 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:29:32pm

re: #197 Slumbering Behemoth

'Tis an odd and skewed system when we take the lack of experience of those younger into account, but not the lack of physical or mental ability of those older into account.

16 year olds don't vote; the AARP is the terror of Congress.

201 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:30:20pm

re: #192 Slumbering Behemoth

I await Penn's assessment.
/

It's not that I don't think the United States wouldn't have given Chavez cancer if we could...it's just that...well, lots of reasons why I think he's full of shit on this one.

202 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:31:27pm

re: #201 SanFranciscoZionist

It's not that I don't think the United States wouldn't have given Chavez cancer if we could...it's just that...well, lots of reasons why I think he's full of shit on this one.

If we could give people cancer, why is Castro still alive?

203 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:34:43pm

re: #190 NJDhockeyfan

U.S. is giving South American leaders cancer, says Hugo Chavez

Lol.

204 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:34:50pm

Zombie and UFO queries are wasting police time, warns chief

Chief Constable Ian Arundale is annoyed at officers being forced to spend hours answering "bizarre" queries instead of being on the beat.

So far this year his officers have also logged queries about witches, ghosts, demons, wizards, Big Foot and UFOs.

The rural Dyfed Powys force in Wales is legally required to spend up to 18 hours finding the information needed to answer each request.

Mr Arundale said: "We find ourselves not only dealing with the legitimate inquries but also the bizarre which are time-consuming and take a while to deal with.

205 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:35:26pm

re: #200 EmmmieG

Pretty much the long and the short of it. Lobby.

206 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:37:51pm

re: #204 NJDhockeyfan

Zombie and UFO queries are wasting police time, warns chief

Methinks they are being trolled.

207 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:38:26pm

re: #202 EmmmieG

If we could give people cancer, why is Castro still alive?

Castro got special, anti-American-cancer treatments from the Soviets back in the 70's.

Makes total sense now, right?

208 Petero1818  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:39:36pm

You know I can accept Paul thinking that regardless of what Iran is doing there is no way we should be taking military action. But for him to argue that there is no evidence Iran is seeking a nuclear weapon ignores more than 25 years of documented attempts by the Iranian regime to do exactly that. Including well documented evidence of dealings with the Khan network in Pakistan as well as the North Koreans.

209 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:42:23pm

MMM, the sweet smell of spray paint primer

210 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:43:08pm

re: #209 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

MMM, the sweet smell of spray paint primer

Painting your WH stuff?

211 Petero1818  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:43:09pm

re: #202 EmmmieG

If we could give people cancer, why is Castro still alive?

ITs a reverse false flag operation. By not giving him Cancer, we gain plausibly deniability that we are responsible for giving the other one's cancer.

212 Nick Schroeder  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:43:16pm

I just have to say, the threadjacking here has gotten pretty out of control over he past few months. Not a dig on anyone in particular, because I only swing into the comments a few times a week. But it's getting pretty hard to have a real conversation that stays on topic lately.

213 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:43:22pm

re: #206 Varek Raith

Methinks they are being trolled.

I wouldn't ascribe all of it to trolling. Never underestimate the persistence of conspiracy / UFO nuts when they find out how to exploit some foreign agency's equivalent of a FOIA request. I used to be a UFO nut until I took an arrow in the knee.

214 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:44:17pm

re: #209 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Put down that rag and get some help. You're better than that.

Not much better. I mean... buy some real drugs loser.

215 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:45:51pm

re: #210 Varek Raith

Painting your WH stuff?

First chance I've had. Got 2 Razorbacks and an Imperial Strongpoint getting primed now.

216 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:45:56pm

re: #213 negativ

I wouldn't ascribe all of it to trolling. Never underestimate the persistence of conspiracy / UFO nuts when they find out how to exploit some foreign agency's equivalent of a FOIA request. I used to be a UFO nut until I took an arrow in the knee.

Set phasers to arrow.

217 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:46:56pm

re: #214 Slumbering Behemoth

Put down that rag and get some help. You're better than that.

Not much better. I mean... buy some real drugs loser.

Canned air?

218 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:47:00pm

re: #211 Petero1818

ITs a reverse false flag operation. By not giving him Cancer, we gain plausibly deniability that we are responsible for giving the other one's cancer.

nah, the cancer ray was set to Live Forever by mistake & now we'll never get rid of him durn it

219 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:47:42pm

re: #215 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

First chance I've had. Got 2 Razorbacks and an Imperial Strongpoint getting primed now.

It's almost as much fun painting them, isn't it?
It was like that with my model train collection.

220 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:48:12pm

re: #217 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

-_-

221 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:52:15pm

Angler catches exotic fish that kills by biting men's testicles

A TELEVISION angler told yesterday how he snared a fish that kills men by biting off their testicles.

ITV’s Jeremy Wade, 53, spent weeks hunting in Papua New Guinea after locals claimed the 40lb monster was castrating fishermen – with at least two bleeding to death.

He finally hooked the pacu fish in a small wooden boat – wearing just shorts and a T-shirt.

Jeremy, of Bath, said: “I’d heard of a couple of Papua New Guinea fishermen who were castrated by something in the water.

“The bleeding was so severe that they died. When I reeled it in, it had this mouth that was surprisingly human-like, with teeth like molars and powerful jaw muscles.”

Pacu fish are from the Amazon, where they need tough teeth to break open seed and nut shells.

222 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:53:07pm

re: #219 Varek Raith

It's almost as much fun painting them, isn't it?
It was like that with my model train collection.

I have more free time to paint than I do to play.

223 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:53:24pm

re: #221 NJDhockeyfan

Angler catches exotic fish that kills by biting men's testicles

O_o

224 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:55:34pm

re: #222 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

First World Nerd Problems.
:P

225 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:56:58pm

re: #224 Slumbering Behemoth

First World Nerd Problems.
:P

*Shoots an arrow at SB's knee*

226 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:57:28pm

re: #225 Varek Raith

*Shoots an arrow at SB's knee*

Great, now he's stuck being a guard.

227 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:57:46pm

re: #221 NJDhockeyfan

Angler catches exotic fish that kills by biting men's testicles

i'm working on the obligatory ex wife joke but i don't have anything just yet

228 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 10:59:09pm

re: #225 Varek Raith

re: #226 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

First World Nerd Memes.

/Iamnotimmune

229 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:00:52pm

re: #223 Varek Raith

O_o

Can Fisherman Cups be sold in sporting good stores anytime soon?

230 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:02:05pm

re: #228 Slumbering Behemoth

re: #226 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

First World Nerd Memes.

/Iamnotimmune

I'm still trying to figure out why the Thieves' Guild picked the guy wearing full plate as their leader.

231 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:02:28pm

re: #226 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Great, now he's stuck being a guard.

Youtube Video
232 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:02:55pm

I was a bird watcher like you, then I took a sparrow to the tree.

233 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:04:47pm

re: #232 Slumbering Behemoth

I was a bird watcher like you, then I took a sparrow to the tree.

I used to be a guard, then I took a Thu'um to the knee.

234 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:05:19pm

re: #233 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I used to be a guard, then I took a Thu'um to the knee.

Which one?

235 wilburs  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:05:56pm

re: #80 jaunte

The law which allows them to do this clearly states that this must be approved by the board of elections 90 days prior to the date of the primary....a little detail they seem to have overlooked,

Any registered voter could file suit to have this enjoined quite easily.

236 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:06:34pm

re: #234 Varek Raith

Which one?

Zul Mey Gut

237 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:07:25pm

re: #236 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Zul Mey Gut

*Shakes head*
Funny one though.

238 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:08:03pm

well, this mulholland drive movie is very diverting and i almost believe it has a plot

239 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:08:46pm

I passed on Oblivion, will likely do so with Skyrim. At least until the bargain bin.

240 boxhead  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:08:48pm

re: #233 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I used to be a guard, then I took a Thu'um to the knee.

Used to be a Vegan, then I took a Brussels sprout to the knee.

241 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:10:11pm

re: #237 Varek Raith

*Shakes head*
Funny one though.

My warrior's current tactic is to use that one, then shield rush and power attack the guys from behind.

242 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:10:50pm

re: #239 Slumbering Behemoth

I passed on Oblivion, will likely do so with Skyrim. At least until the bargain bin.

STRUN BAH QO!

243 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:12:52pm

re: #238 engineer dog

A movie that strangely fits the GOP race.

244 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:13:21pm

Photography can be so frustrating. Earlier I get these two shots, then I try a star trail shot. A one hour exposure of crystal clear sky. Twice the camera has stuck in processing mode. Oh well get up a bit early and try again at dawn.

Image: abi2_2011_12_28_00413.JPG

Image: abi2_2011_12_27_00328-2.jpg

245 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:13:29pm

re: #242 Varek Raith

Imma bargain bin browsing broke bastard.

246 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:15:22pm

re: #244 Rightwingconspirator

Photography can be so frustrating. Earlier I get these two shots, then I try a star trail shot. A one hour exposure of crystal clear sky. Twice the camera has stuck in processing mode. Oh well get up a bit early and try again at dawn.

Image: abi2_2011_12_28_00413.JPG

Image: abi2_2011_12_27_00328-2.jpg

Looks better than any pic I could take.
:P

247 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:15:32pm
Youtube Video
248 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:16:11pm

re: #244 Rightwingconspirator

Or, you could just stick with bell peppers and nekkid women in strange places.

249 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:16:49pm

As Rick Santorum surges, Newt Gingrich fades fast in Iowa

250 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:17:19pm

re: #249 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

As Rick Santorum surges, Newt Gingrich fades fast in Iowa

...
..
.
Nice headline...
XD

251 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:18:58pm

re: #249 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Fickle, those Iowa Republicans.

252 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:19:02pm

re: #250 Varek Raith

...
..
.
Nice headline...
XD

Santorum surging is not something to take lightly.

253 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:19:42pm

re: #246 Varek Raith
Thanks.

254 boxhead  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:21:31pm

re: #243 freetoken

A movie that strangely fits the GOP race.

I think the same about Idiocracy..

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

255 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:22:00pm

re: #254 boxhead

Have you read my Twitter account tag line?

256 boxhead  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:24:51pm

re: #255 freetoken

Have you read my Twitter account tag line?

no... enlighten me of this twitter you speak of :)

257 freetoken  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:25:38pm

re: #256 boxhead

Click on my avatar, then click on the little blue twitter button at the bottom of the pop-up window.

258 Kragar  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:28:39pm

Police: 14-Year-Old Girl, Injected With Heroin By 26-Year-Old Party Host, Fighting For Life

Life in prison would be too good for this shit.

259 boxhead  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:32:28pm

re: #257 freetoken

Click on my avatar, then click on the little blue twitter button at the bottom of the pop-up window.

heheh... :)

260 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:40:53pm

I'm out.
Laters.

261 boxhead  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:42:20pm

re: #260 Varek Raith

I'm out.
Laters.

good night

262 Big Joe  Wed, Dec 28, 2011 11:56:09pm

This is pretty cool. It's better than I expected.

Have you ever seen daytime fireworks?

263 Kragar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:06:20am

I need a term to convey the feeling of joy upon realizing you have enough spare parts to scratch build something completely different.

264 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:18:16am

Santorum could win Iowa.

265 engineer cat  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:22:54am

re: #264 Winny Spencer

Santorum could win Iowa.

iowa polls have been really unreliable the past few election cycles

no telling what'll happen

266 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:25:58am

re: #265 engineer dog

iowa polls have been really unreliable the past few election cycles

no telling what'll happen

He is surging at the right time, he has visited every county in the state and is THE social conservative candidate. In that sense, he makes for a likely winner.

267 freetoken  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:27:09am

From Saint-Preux's La Passion:

Overture:

MP3 Audio

Adagio Pour Piano:

MP3 Audio
268 MittDoesNotCompute  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:32:30am

re: #263 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I need a term to convey the feeling of joy upon realizing you have enough spare parts to scratch build something completely different.

Whoops?

269 _RememberTonyC  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:34:03am

Bachmann and Paul cannibalize each other while Newt peaked too soon. Perry is dumber than dogshit. Santorum should change his name to Sanitarium. That leaves Mitt and Huntsmann. The only actual adults in the room. Both have worked with Democrats, and that trait means more to me than orthodoxy of thought or groupthink. We need to cross lines and get things done. it is Mitt's nomination to lose, and he won't. It can't go any other way.

270 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:36:10am

re: #269 _RememberTonyC

I've maintained that from the beginning. Mittens will be the nominee.

271 _RememberTonyC  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:38:14am

re: #270 Winny Spencer

Me too ... Been saying it for 3 years ... Anyone else will be a sure loser to Obama.

272 researchok  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 1:17:48am

Morning, all

273 Kragar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 2:15:23am

Nigerian churches call Christmas bombings 'declaration of war'

Nigeria's Christians are losing faith that the government will protect them from attacks by Islamic extremists and will "respond appropriately" to future killings, the country's leading church group warned Wednesday.

In a public message to President Goodluck Jonathan, the Christian Association of Nigeria called the Christmas Day targeting of churches in several cities "a declaration of war on Christians and Nigeria as an entity." The group also criticized its Muslim counterparts for failing to condemn the Islamic militants blamed for Sunday's attacks, calling their responses "unacceptable."

274 AK-47%  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 2:27:43am

re: #273 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)


Step one: use religion as a pawn in a political war. Then ignore the politics and business behind it and turn it into a religious struggle.

Nigeria is a victim of its own natural resources: the "Dutch disease" gone malignant.

Not only do the people there see little benefit from the oil that is being extracted, many tribes are actually suffeing from the environmental after-effects.

275 wheat-dogg  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 3:14:53am

re: #150 NJDhockeyfan

Two comments:

"Paul, who leans Libertarian?" Isn't that like saying Genghis Khan leaned toward world conquest?

Audit the gold bricks? So, is Ron subscribing to a new (maybe it's old, it's hard to keep up) wacko conspiracy theory? Maybe those reptilians beamed up all the gold to planet Nebiru, or whatever the fuck it's called.

276 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 4:10:50am

Ron Paul: Secret Homophobe or Misunderstood Ally?
--David Groshoff
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

The conclusion of the piece:

I will not be voting Republican in my state's upcoming primary, which means I will not be voting for Ron Paul. But if you plan to vote Republican in your state's primary or caucus, and if queer rights are important factors in determining which GOP candidate earns your approval, then how Ron Paul has wielded the power that his constituents gave him (i.e., his voting record, and not the noise about outdated newsletters and campaign solicitations) deserves your scrutiny, consideration, and perhaps your support.

Because your decisions today become our likely collective choices in November, please be thoughtful in using your vote to help decide which candidates stay and which ones sashay away.

277 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 4:31:55am

Crazy woman now crazy and dead:

Jameela Barnette Dead: Woman Who Allegedly Sent Pig's Foot To Peter King Killed By Police
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

An Atlanta woman who allegedly mailed threats to lawmakers was shot and killed by police during an altercation on Christmas Day.

Jameela Barnette, 53, was indicted earlier this year for her supposed involvement in the sending of malicious packages to two New York lawmakers.

Barnette was accused of mailing a pig's foot to the office of Rep. Peter King (R) in April. A note included in the package read "Kiss my black Muslim ass," and referred to King as a "Jew," even though he is Catholic. The incident came in the wake of King's hearings on Muslim "radicalization."

Barnette was also indicted for allegedly sending a fake weapon of mass destruction to the office of New York State Sen. Greg Ball in the form of a bottled liquid labeled "Zyklon B." The substance was eventually identified as perfume oil. The package also included a screed against Jews and Christians and a stuffed toy monkey with Stars of David fastened to it.
.....
On Sunday, Cobb County police responded to multiple panic alarms activated at Barnette's residence.

A statement from the Cobb County police claimed that an aggressive Barnette met the responding officer.

"Moments after knocking on the door, a female (who was armed with a knife and handgun) opened it and began assaulting the officer with the weapons," the statement read. "Despite receiving injuries to his arm, the officer was able to use his service weapon to stop the assault."

Barnette died at the scene, while the injured officer was treated on site and released. He has been placed on administrative leave pending an investigation of the incident.

278 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 4:39:26am

OWS occupy Ron Paul event, get confused:

Ron Paul Iowa Event Interrupted By Occupy Protesters
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

DES MOINES, Iowa -- Some 20 protesters interrupted the start of a Ron Paul event at the Iowa State Fairgrounds just as the GOP candidate and Texas Representative began to speak, at about 7:30 p.m. local time.

"Ron Paul, why do you hate gays," Heaven Ryan, 16, shouted. "Why do you hate the 99 percent?"
.....
The protesters continued to yell near the back of the room, while a few Paul supporters stood to yell back. A staffer stood between them, asking Paul's supporters to ignore the group and remain calm. John Kurr, a 49-year-old Paul supporter, tried to reason with the Occupy group, saying the candidate is for the 99 percent.

"He's not for the corporate people, he's for the little guy," Kurr told HuffPost. "He's for everybody. He's not for Wall Street."

Some Occupy protesters agreed. As Kurr spoke to the group, one woman said she supports Paul. Another protester, 28-year-old Des Moines resident Clarke Davidson, told HuffPost he also likes Paul, but wanted to stand in solidarity with his fellow Occupiers.

Later in the event, Davidson ran toward the front of the auditorium waving a sign that said "End the Fed" and started a chant of the same.

279 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 4:51:12am

A public Service announcement from Cindy Adams and the evils of drinking too much:
[Link: www.nypost.com...]
I don't miss it one bit. Two years and seven months sober.

280 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 4:59:52am

re: #279 Shropshire_Slasher

Quitter!

281 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:00:04am

I wonder if the North Koreans have ever seen the movie National Lampoon's Vacation with Chevy Chase? [Link: www.guardian.co.uk...]
The coffin on top of the car reminds me of when their grandma Edna died, and they strapped her ass on the roof of their station wagon, thru a driving rainstorm. Ah good times.

282 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:00:57am

re: #280 RogueOne

I'm still finding empty beer cans around my property, if my son is smart, he will blame me for his empties.

283 sagehen  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:02:06am

Good morning, I'll start with off-topic (although, I suppose to some extent it is tangentially political, in the way that all sci-fi is set on a political background, but I digress...)

Is anybody here watching Terra Nova? I just watched the season finale, and I'm wondering if I cleverly deduced something or was just stupid enough to feel clever for barely catching something that was supposed to be obvious:

The 18th century ship's prow found in the badlands... did that come from the Bermuda triangle? And are the sixers coming back to the colony next season with Mira as Taylor's 2iC?

284 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:03:46am

re: #277 RogueOne

Crazy woman now crazy and dead:

Jameela Barnette Dead: Woman Who Allegedly Sent Pig's Foot To Peter King Killed By Police
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

That gave me a headache. My fault of course since I tore of to search the intertubes and read something by Debbie Schlussel on this, "here's something you won't see on 'All American Muslim'." That's right, you won't see that because this woman was obviously mentally deranged.

285 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:06:04am

re: #282 Shropshire_Slasher

Over the last decade my drinking has pretty much ground to a halt. I still drink but the days of drinking to excess are pretty rare anymore. I bought a 12-pack almost 3 weeks ago and I still have 7 or 8 left.

286 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:06:06am

re: #281 Shropshire_Slasher

I wonder if the North Koreans have ever seen the movie National Lampoon's Vacation with Chevy Chase? [Link: www.guardian.co.uk...]
The coffin on top of the car reminds me of when their grandma Edna died, and they strapped her ass on the roof of their station wagon, thru a driving rainstorm. Ah good times.

Murderous dictator passes away. 100s of thousands dead in previous 50 year from his and his father's actions. Wait! We should probably put our flags at half mast.

//

287 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:07:40am

re: #284 Gus 802

Yeah, it's pretty obvious the lady was seriously disturbed. I wonder if this was a "suicide by cop" thing or if she finally just completely snapped.

288 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:07:48am

North Korea is like a time machine. Even their photos make it look like it's still 1967 over there. They could probably make a ton of money by allowing Hollywood to film movies there.

289 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:09:59am

re: #286 Gus 802

I think the videos of the "grieving" are all the evidence people need to understand how horrific the NK regime actually is. Can you imagine the power and level of fear the state holds over those people to make them act for the cameras like that? Absolutely incredible.

290 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:10:54am

re: #287 RogueOne

Yeah, it's pretty obvious the lady was seriously disturbed. I wonder if this was a "suicide by cop" thing or if she finally just completely snapped.

Probably a mixture of "all of the above." She me with the cop with a gun and a knife already in her hand. Hard to tell because given her previous actions she may have seen something on TV about cops and that made her concoct some crazy scheme to call the cops in order to murder a police officer. Or something. Guess this would fall under forensic psychology. Post-mortem.

291 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:12:32am

re: #281 Shropshire_Slasher

I wonder if the North Koreans have ever seen the movie National Lampoon's Vacation with Chevy Chase? [Link: www.guardian.co.uk...]
The coffin on top of the car reminds me of when their grandma Edna died, and they strapped her ass on the roof of their station wagon, thru a driving rainstorm. Ah good times.

USA: Carry coffin by caisson to be buried.
UK: Carry coffin by carriage to be buried.
North Korea: Strap your coffin to the roof of an old Buick.

292 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:12:35am

re: #283 sagehen

You are very observant, the prow is probably from the triangle. Plus there is that new group heading to the badlands. They are also supposedly cut off from the "future"
I'm not exactly sure if they are on Earth's past, or Earth for that matter.

293 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:12:42am

re: #289 RogueOne

I think the videos of the "grieving" are all the evidence people need to understand how horrific the NK regime actually is. Can you imagine the power and level of fear the state holds over those people to make them act for the cameras like that? Absolutely incredible.

The regime has a massive psychological and emotional hold on the people. I'm sure a few are "playing along." One also has to consider that all of this took place in Pyongyang which is inhabited by hand picked party loyalists. Sort of like Germany's Berlin during the 3rd Reich perhaps?

294 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:14:26am

But that giant portrait of Kim atop the Lincoln. That was hilarious. It was so out of scale that it looked like some giant toy. Like a Matchbox car "with dad's picture on top of it."

295 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:15:48am

re: #294 Gus 802

But that giant portrait of Kim atop the Lincoln. That was hilarious. It was so out of scale that it looked like some giant toy. Like a Matchbox car "with dad's picture on top of it."

You know he's gotta have the steering wheel in a death grip, because one turn taken too sharply and that picture's coming down, which means he'll be before a firing squad by dawn.

296 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:19:39am

re: #295 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

You know he's gotta have the steering wheel in a death grip, because one turn taken too sharply and that picture's coming down, which means he'll be before a firing squad by dawn.

But they're ruled by the Worker's Party in NK. All workers, people, are treated equally.

//

297 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:20:51am

re: #296 Gus 802

But they're ruled by the Worker's Party in NK. All workers, people, are treated equally.

//

Bullets don't discriminate.

298 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:21:09am

...and not what Kim is gone we can looked forward to a sea of change in North Korea!

[Sound of inspirational song of Kim Jong-il plays in the background.]

//

299 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:21:30am

re: #293 Gus 802

I think it comes down to "those that don't cry hard enough don't eat". The country is so malnourished their bodies are shrinking with every generation. Kim Jong Un: one fat bastard ruling a nation of malnourished midgets

300 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:22:52am

re: #299 RogueOne

I'm rooting for diabetes.

301 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:23:06am

re: #299 RogueOne

I think it comes down to "those that don't cry hard enough don't eat". The country is so malnourished their bodies are shrinking with every generation. Kim Jong Un: one fat bastard ruling a nation of malnourished midgets

Yep. That's always been the case. Those that don't cry hard enough. Those that don't dance the national dance when the party leaders come to town. Those that don't sing in unison. Those that don't have the portraits of the "eternal leaders" in their home. Etc.

302 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:24:02am

re: #299 RogueOne

I think it comes down to "those that don't cry hard enough don't eat". The country is so malnourished their bodies are shrinking with every generation. Kim Jong Un: one fat bastard ruling a nation of malnourished midgets

Never thought I'd see Mao's "Great Leap" in such vivid detail. But I just look at pictures of North Korea and see it in living color.

303 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:25:41am

From this day forward patriotism and national unity shall be enforced by the state until morale improves!

//

304 RogueOne  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:26:13am

Time to hit the road. Taking a trip to Iowa to hang with the in-laws for a couple days. Should be...fun//

Enjoy the day people!

305 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:26:28am

re: #302 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Never thought I'd see Mao's "Great Leap" in such vivid detail. But I just look at pictures of North Korea and see it in living color.

Too bad it was snowing. I was hoping for a fly-by of some Mig-15s.

//

306 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:33:57am

Bills aim to roll back teaching evolution
Lawmaker says kids must get alternative
By Sarah Palermo
December 29, 2011

To state Rep. Jerry Bergevin, the horrors of the Columbine school shooting and the atrocities of Nazi Germany are linked by the theory of evolution, and that's all the evidence he needs to see that New Hampshire's children shouldn't be taught that it's correct.

Bergevin, a Republican from Manchester serving his first term, introduced one of two bills that will be before the Legislature next year addressing evolution, the first in the state since the late 1990s.

The second bill, introduced by Reps. Gary Hopper of Weare and John Burt of Goffstown, more vaguely calls for science teachers to "instruct pupils that proper scientific (inquiry) results from not committing to any one theory or hypothesis . . . and that scientific and technological innovations based on new evidence can challenge accepted scientific theories."...

307 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:34:42am

My brain! My brain!

308 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:37:53am

re: #278 RogueOne

OWS occupy Ron Paul event, get confused:

Ron Paul Iowa Event Interrupted By Occupy Protesters
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

The stupid, it burns.

309 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:43:48am

re: #307 Gus 802

My brain! My brain!

BRAAAAIIINNNNSSSS

310 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:44:29am

re: #308 Winny Spencer

The stupid, it burns.

Yuck. You have to read the whole thing to see the complete view of that circle jerk. Whew.

311 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:45:29am

re: #309 Varek Raith

BRAAAIIINNNSSS

Bergevin is less interested in the science of evolution than he is in the political and religious views of Darwin and his disciples. His bill would require schools to teach evolution as a theory, and include "the theorists' political and ideological viewpoints and their position on the concept of atheism."

Eleventy.

312 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:46:44am

re: #311 Gus 802

Bergevin is less interested in the science of evolution than he is in the political and religious views of Darwin and his disciples. His bill would require schools to teach evolution as a theory, and include "the theorists' political and ideological viewpoints and their position on the concept of atheism."

Eleventy.

Derpity!

313 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:47:14am

re: #312 Varek Raith

Derpity!

Forgive me but for now I must spew!

//

314 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:48:48am

If elected, I promise to introduce a bill affirming that Rep. Jerry Bergevin is an ignorant douche.

315 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:49:26am

Paultards and OWS-moonbats are the reasons why I support Perry's proposal to raise the legal voting age to 21. Oh, it wasn't a proposal, but I support it nonetheless.

316 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:51:39am

re: #306 Gus 802

Bills aim to roll back teaching evolution
Lawmaker says kids must get alternative
By Sarah Palermo
December 29, 2011

The second bill, introduced by Reps. Gary Hopper of Weare and John Burt of Goffstown, more vaguely calls for science teachers to "instruct pupils that proper scientific (inquiry) results from not committing to any one theory or hypothesis . . . and that scientific and technological innovations based on new evidence can challenge accepted scientific theories."...

Ah yes, the "competing theories" line of bullshit, which always tries to cloak itself in the veneer of scientific "skepticism," but really comes off as little more than trying to sneak in creationism as an "alternative" to evolution.

The bolded is my personal favorite, as I wonder if these snake-handlers think this is something exclusive to evolution. Is there some competing theory to Einstein's theories on general relativity and special relativity?

317 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:53:26am

re: #315 Winny Spencer

Paultards and OWS-moonbats are the reasons why I support Perry's proposal to raise the legal voting age to 21. Oh, it wasn't a proposal, but I support it nonetheless.

I was looking at some of those Occupy Iowa Caucus folks yesterday and they looked like they were getting close to being a little long in the tooth. Seriously though. They were blocking the Romney offices yesterday -- didn't last very long and some were arrested. What a pointless activity. They can picket the office but blocking the doors is w-r-o-n-g.

318 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:56:38am

re: #316 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Ah yes, the "competing theories" line of bullshit, which always tries to cloak itself in the veneer of scientific "skepticism," but really comes off as little more than trying to sneak in creationism as an "alternative" to evolution.

The bolded is my personal favorite, as I wonder if these snake-handlers think this is something exclusive to evolution. Is there some competing theory to Einstein's theories on general relativity and special relativity?

Hmmm, now's my chance to get rid of those ridiculous imaginary numbers!
MUHAHAHAHA!

319 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:56:43am

re: #316 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Ah yes, the "competing theories" line of bullshit, which always tries to cloak itself in the veneer of scientific "skepticism," but really comes off as little more than trying to sneak in creationism as an "alternative" to evolution.

The bolded is my personal favorite, as I wonder if these snake-handlers think this is something exclusive to evolution. Is there some competing theory to Einstein's theories on general relativity and special relativity?

And this...

His bill would require schools to teach evolution as a theory, and include "the theorists' political and ideological viewpoints and their position on the concept of atheism."

Atheism? What are they going to bring up Einstein's views on atheism? Or others. What the heck do I care if a scientist whom I respect was a Christian. What about Werner Von Braun and the race to the moon? Are we supposed to teach science class and then start bringing up the Nazi SS? This is like the flip side of the PC coin.

320 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:58:19am

re: #319 Gus 802

And this...

His bill would require schools to teach evolution as a theory, and include "the theorists' political and ideological viewpoints and their position on the concept of atheism."

Atheism? What are they going to bring up Einstein's views on atheism? Or others. What the heck do I care if a scientist whom I respect was a Christian. What about Werner Von Braun and the race to the moon? Are we supposed to teach science class and then start bringing up the Nazi SS? This is like the flip side of the PC coin.

Alright, I'm game.
As long as we also discuss the Founder's views on religion.
It's only fair.
/

321 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 5:59:36am

re: #319 Gus 802

And this...

His bill would require schools to teach evolution as a theory, and include "the theorists' political and ideological viewpoints and their position on the concept of atheism."

Atheism? What are they going to bring up Einstein's views on atheism? Or others. What the heck do I care if a scientist whom I respect was a Christian. What about Werner Von Braun and the race to the moon? Are we supposed to teach science class and then start bringing up the Nazi SS? This is like the flip side of the PC coin.

"Now that we've finished outlining evolution by describing to you how bad a man Darwin was, let us move on to creationism and give you the list of the bad shit God has done since the beginning of time..."

322 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:00:57am

re: #52 jaunte

Meanwhile, in Birtherville, GA:

It's too bad stupid isn't a commodity because futures in it look very good.

323 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:03:22am

re: #321 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

"Now that we've finished outlining evolution by describing to you how bad a man Darwin was, let us move on to creationism and give you the list of the bad shit God has done since the beginning of time..."

Uhhh...well we didn't mean to....You see.... Not about God...It's..DAMMIT
FFFFUUUUUUUUUU

324 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:03:57am

re: #321 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

"Now that we've finished outlining evolution by describing to you how bad a man Darwin was, let us move on to creationism and give you the list of the bad shit God has done since the beginning of time..."

Class. Charles Darwin was a Democrat!

//

325 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:06:18am

Off for a walk.

326 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:08:57am

So would "Adam and Eve" be in biology class? What else can we fit in from the Bible in our schools. I mean if we continue with the creationists logic and form follow function why stop at Genesis?

327 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:10:09am

re: #82 Dark_Falcon

That's a bit much. I understand that they're worried about shenanigans, though, and its not a baseless fear. Democrats might vote in the GOP primary to vote for Ron Paul and mess things up for Mitt Romney.

Kinda like what Rush L. was trying to get his listeners to do last election? Maybe that is where they got that idea that someone might be trying that?

"This would be funny if it wasn't happening to me!"

328 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:11:47am

re: #93 SanFranciscoZionist

[snp]

What else do they want from them?

Total control

329 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:11:52am

re: #326 Gus 802

So would "Adam and Eve" be in biology class? What else can we fit in from the Bible in our schools. I mean if we continue with the creationists logic and form follow function why stop at Genesis?

"Okay kids, let's toss out those history books and crack open our Bibles. Today, we cover the 'Begats'."

330 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:11:58am

But yeah. Creationists continually usurp the public education system day after day. More about GoDaddy!!11ty

On Twitter that is. ;)

//

331 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:16:48am

Thomas Paine

332 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:20:21am

re: #289 RogueOne

I think the videos of the "grieving" are all the evidence people need to understand how horrific the NK regime actually is. Can you imagine the power and level of fear the state holds over those people to make them act for the cameras like that? Absolutely incredible.

I even doubt that most of them are doing it "involuntarily". I.e. some show the true state of grief, others are acting up voluntarily, because they want to show the grief. Brainwashing at its finest. When Stalin died, millions cried absolutely honestly, thinking all was lost now.

333 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:21:14am

re: #142 Petero1818

(with pitch fork in hand): "Book learnin is for Jews and fags" ///

Whycome you aint got a tattoo?

334 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:21:34am

re: #326 Gus 802

So would "Adam and Eve" be in biology class? What else can we fit in from the Bible in our schools. I mean if we continue with the creationists logic and form follow function why stop at Genesis?

I want to see their class on how evolution has caused snakes to lose their vocal chords and speech ability over the last 6000 years.

335 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:21:51am

re: #324 Gus 802

Class. Charles Darwin was a Democrat!

//

And he looked suspiciously like Marx. Was he a Marx brother?! //

336 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:23:22am

re: #335 Sergey Romanov

And he looked suspiciously like Marx. Was he a Marx brother?! //

Must have been Chico. Harpo went to work at a bicycle factory. Thus the reason a lot of them had horns like his.

337 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:23:30am

re: #329 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

"Okay kids, let's toss out those history books and crack open our Bibles. Today, we cover the 'Begats'."

"In the olden days, our forefathers were hermaphrodites. See when it says that this male begat that male? Bible says it, I believe it, that settles it."

338 sagehen  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:23:38am

re: #316 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

The bolded is my personal favorite, as I wonder if these snake-handlers think this is something exclusive to evolution. Is there some competing theory to Einstein's theories on general relativity and special relativity?

actually there is, but not widely accepted... experimental data is really hard to come by (for Einstein or his upstart competitors), and nobody's going to toss Einstein without real evidence, reproducible results, blah blah. That's one of the questions the particle accelerator is hoping to eventually be able to answer.

339 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:25:08am

re: #337 Sergey Romanov

"In the olden days, our forefathers were hermaphrodites. See when it says that this male begat that male? Bible says it, I believe it, that settles it."

Teacher!? When do we get to the part about sodomy and incest?

//

340 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:25:11am

re: #319 Gus 802

Einstein would not call himself an atheist, but for all intents and purposes he was one.

341 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:25:46am

re: #339 Gus 802

Teacher!? When do we get to the part about sodomy and incest?

//

Right after we get through the erotic poem with allusions to oral sex. //

342 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:26:34am

re: #340 Sergey Romanov

Einstein would not call himself an atheist, but for all intents and purposes he was one.

I know. He "dabbled" in atheism. He was too busy thinking about other things. It's like sometimes when I'm reading through my "atheist Tweets" I sit there thinking, "jeez guys is all you think about is atheism?" And of course I'm an atheist myself.

343 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:27:00am

re: #315 Winny Spencer

Paultards and OWS-moonbats are the reasons why I support Perry's proposal to raise the legal voting age to 21. Oh, it wasn't a proposal, but I support it nonetheless.

As long as there is an upper age limit at 60.

344 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:27:13am

re: #338 sagehen

actually there is, but not widely accepted... experimental data is really hard to come by (for Einstein or his upstart competitors), and nobody's going to toss Einstein without real evidence, reproducible results, blah blah. That's one of the questions the particle accelerator is hoping to eventually be able to answer.

Besides the point that generally the models complement each other since they are successfully explaining outlier behaviors or stuff at the edges. Quantum Mechanics explained stuff that Newtonian physics didn't, but the Newtonian rules pretty much hold as "good enough" at the macro level of our everyday existence.

And it's not like a change was declared and the QM-ites stoned and killed all the Newtonists.

345 sagehen  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:27:29am

re: #334 oaktree

I want to see their class on how evolution has caused snakes to lose their vocal chords and speech ability over the last 6000 years.

Silly boy -- that "talking" snake didn't need vocal chords, he was telepathic. And once he said all he had to say, he shut up.

346 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:29:32am

re: #342 Gus 802

I know. He "dabbled" in atheism. He was too busy thinking about other things. It's like sometimes when I'm reading through my "atheist Tweets" I sit there thinking, "jeez guys is all you think about is atheism?" And of course I'm an atheist myself.

Yeah, he simply wasn't big on "-isms". But you're right, each time this topic comes up we're getting those out-of-context "god" quotes (even though Einstein meant something else by them and never intended them to be used by fundie apologists, of all people).

347 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:30:42am

Oh look! A Tweet for free iPhones!

//

348 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:33:49am

"Teacher, it says 'be fruitful and multiply'. But you said acting fruity was liable to get you labeled a Sodomite and be stoned. And does that mean God doesn't like the multiplication tables either?"

349 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:34:10am

re: #298 Gus 802

...and not what Kim is gone we can looked forward to a sea of change in North Korea!

[Sound of inspirational song of Kim Jong-il plays in the background.]

//

I can only co-sigh on that.
On the other hand, some of the very very worst policies may be reversed (leaving only very worst ones ;). I'm thinking purely by analogy here. In Turkmenistan Saparmurat Niyazov was getting very crazy with his cult of personality, and made a lot of crazy laws in the social sphere. One happy day he died. As suddenly as Kim Jong-Il. And something happened. No, Turkmenistan didn't cease to be a dictatorship. But the craziest policies of Turkmenbashi were annulled, the cult of his personality was scaled back significantly. The new "glorious leader" may be a dictator, but compared to the old one he at least looks downright benevolent.

350 sagehen  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:35:25am

re: #340 Sergey Romanov

Einstein would not call himself an atheist, but for all intents and purposes he was one.

Jews don't have to believe in God to be Jews; and the ones who do believe in God, don't have to believe that God is an anthropomorphic being. We're more of a "doing" than a "believing" faith.

Most Reconstructionist Jews (and a substantial number of Reform) are all about the cultural heritage and ethical structure, with ritual observance mostly a means to build community -- even some of the Rabbis refuse to assert positively that there is such a thing as God.

351 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:36:35am

re: #350 sagehen

Jews don't have to believe in God to be Jews; and the ones who do believe in God, don't have to believe that God is an anthropomorphic being. We're more of a "doing" than a "believing" faith.

Most Reconstructionist Jews (and a substantial number of Reform) are all about the cultural heritage and ethical structure, with ritual observance mostly a means to build community -- even some of the Rabbis refuse to assert positively that there is such a thing as God.

Sounds like the Jewish version of UU.

352 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:40:09am

re: #343 Sergey Romanov

As long as there is an upper age limit at 60.

Carousel at 30 should take care of that.

353 sagehen  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:40:37am

re: #351 oaktree

Sounds like the Jewish version of UU.

Kinda, yeah... with an extra genetic component.

354 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:41:21am

re: #350 sagehen

Yup, basically there are 2 main senses of "Jewish" wrapped in one word in the English language - religion and ethnicity (which includes ancestry, culture and whatnot). Ethnic Jews can be of any religion, or lack religion at all (like Einstein), like the Japanese can be of any religion and still be Japanese. Einstein was ethnically Jewish, but he did not belong to Judaism as a religion.

355 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:41:27am

Breaking!

@AnonymousPress Anonymous
Human Guinea Pigs: Genetically Modified Mosquitoes to be Released in the US for the First Time naturalsociety.com/genetically-mo… As FEMA camps spring up

//

*Actual Tweet.

356 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:42:15am

re: #355 Gus 802

Breaking!

@AnonymousPress Anonymous
Human Guinea Pigs: Genetically Modified Mosquitoes to be Released in the US for the First Time naturalsociety.com/genetically-mo… As FEMA camps spring up

//

*Actual Tweet.

looooolwut?!

357 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:42:46am

re: #356 Sergey Romanov

looolwut?!

Oh you know. Those deep thinkers from "anonymous."

358 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:43:45am

re: #357 Gus 802

Oh you know. Those deep thinkers from "anonymous."

It's funny no, how sometimes we can't distinguish between various far-leftist and libertariannish sects, so similar their rhetoric is on some issues?

359 Locker  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:44:01am

Definitely think this is a preliminary pitch to a Paul/Bachmann ticket. I'd be careful if I were him, she's the same type of boat anchor as Sarah Palin.

360 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:45:47am

re: #358 Sergey Romanov

It's funny no, how sometimes we can't distinguish between various far-leftist and libertariannish sects, so similar their rhetoric is on some issues?

I know I can't. When I read some of the recent things from the far-left at times it's almost indistinguishable from the Tea Party or the far-right. There's a lot of overlap and shared "values."

361 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:45:58am

re: #353 sagehen

Kinda, yeah... with an extra genetic component.

I'm talking more about the emphasis on community, ceremony, and joint action rather than the dogmas and particular points such as the absolute existance of God.

362 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:46:34am

re: #358 Sergey Romanov

It's funny no, how sometimes we can't distinguish between various far-leftist and libertariannish sects, so similar their rhetoric is on some issues?

And effectively this is also another form of anti-science, misinformation (obviously), with a heavy dose of crypto-Luddism.

I like that word crypto. ;)

363 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:46:39am

re: #338 sagehen

actually there is, but not widely accepted... experimental data is really hard to come by (for Einstein or his upstart competitors), and nobody's going to toss Einstein without real evidence, reproducible results, blah blah. That's one of the questions the particle accelerator is hoping to eventually be able to answer.

And that's really the gist of it, science is not static and is certainly not without disagreement. Even in evolution, while the general framework is agreed upon, the specifics are forever in flux. It's a collection of theories within a theory. Some claim that evolution is gradual, others say it acts in fits and spurts. Some branch the tree far more times than others, with disagreements springing up over which species evolved into which.

The oddball out are the "intelligent design" fruitloops, who are little more than preachers in labcoats, trying to argue that we should take it on faith that there's no coincidence in how life came about on this planet, and that everything exists because some higher power (i.e. "God") designed it.

364 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:47:03am

re: #357 Gus 802

Oh you know. Those deep thinkers from "anonymous."

A propos of nothing: my friend calls the doctrinaire Marxist/far-left "cliche" speech "machinespeak". You know, "corporate control of big pharma blah blah blah" stuff.

365 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:47:44am

re: #355 Gus 802

Breaking!

@AnonymousPress Anonymous
Human Guinea Pigs: Genetically Modified Mosquitoes to be Released in the US for the First Time naturalsociety.com/genetically-mo… As FEMA camps spring up

//

*Actual Tweet.

The GMs were only for off-world. Tyrell is going to be pissed.

366 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:48:04am

re: #364 Sergey Romanov

A propos of nothing: my friend calls the doctrinaire Marxist/far-left "cliche" speech "machinespeak". You know, "corporate control of big pharma blah blah blah" stuff.

It's mostly a fashion statement. ;)

367 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:48:33am

re: #359 Locker

Definitely think this is a preliminary pitch to a Paul/Bachmann ticket. I'd be careful if I were him, she's the same type of boat anchor as Sarah Palin.

Paul/Bachmann '12 - Pray the Mayans Were Right
Paul/Bachmann '12 - Taking America Back - To The 18th Century
Paul/Bachmann '12 - God, Gold, and Glory!

368 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:49:08am

re: #360 Gus 802

I know I can't. When I read some of the recent things from the far-left at times it's almost indistinguishable from the Tea Party or the far-right. There's a lot of overlap and shared "values."

That's partially because the single left-right axis is a lousy model for the spectrum of political/social thought that is out there. If you add the second libertarian/authoritarian axis like some models do you can get a big spectrum on the left-right X axis, and all these folk way up there on the Y-axis where the libertarian views put them in common.

And even then you're dealing with a poor model since even then I suspect there is a lot of variation from case-to-case based on pet issues.

369 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:49:30am

And you can see here where the anonytards got that "GM mosquito" story.

Pwison Pwanet!

370 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:50:45am

re: #366 Gus 802

It's mostly a fashion statement. ;)

It's like there's a little musical organ in their heads.

371 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:52:12am

re: #368 oaktree

That's partially because the single left-right axis is a lousy model for the spectrum of political/social thought that is out there. If you add the second libertarian/authoritarian axis like some models do you can get a big spectrum on the left-right X axis, and all these folk way up there on the Y-axis where the libertarian views put them in common.

And even then you're dealing with a poor model since even then I suspect there is a lot of variation from case-to-case based on pet issues.

Right. If we lay it out linearly. It's better seen as a circle and here we see them meet at either the lower or upper quadrants. But like human psychology it's complicated. It's not about left or right in these cases it's about human behavior. It's not a surprise that they share the same values in many, most, cases.

372 kirkspencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:54:59am

re: #359 Locker

Definitely think this is a preliminary pitch to a Paul/Bachmann ticket. I'd be careful if I were him, she's the same type of boat anchor as Sarah Palin.

But since Paul's an anchor chain, aren't they made for each other?

//

373 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:55:38am

re: #370 Sergey Romanov

It's like there's a little musical organ in their heads.

Great.

Now I have a mental image of little turn rods sticking out of the back of their heads like for a music box. You turn it and you can faintly hear "Pop Goes the Weasel" playing inside. Then suddenly the top of their head hinges open and their atrophied brains pop out and start tap dancing.

O_o

374 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:56:17am

re: #370 Sergey Romanov

It's like there's a little musical organ in their heads.

Image: 2009-09-09-organgrindermonkey.gif

375 darthstar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:57:38am

Good morning Manchurians...what's grinding?

376 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:58:01am

re: #374 Gus 802

Image: 2009-09-09-organgrindermonkey.gif

Isn't that menky the lookout for a group of bank robbers?
;)

377 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:58:09am

re: #375 darthstar

Good morning Manchurians...what's grinding?

Organs and monkeys. Manchurian monkeys in fact.

378 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:58:35am

@TPM Talking Points Memo
Kelly Clarkson endorses Ron Paul: tpm.ly/vs5R3A

379 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:58:39am

re: #375 darthstar

Good morning Manchurians...what's grinding?

Organs, sausage meat, and laws. Typical stuff in other words.

380 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:58:59am

Fascinating. Now I have to Google Kelly Clarkson.

381 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:59:27am

re: #378 Gus 802

@TPM Talking Points Memo
Kelly Clarkson endorses Ron Paul: tpm.ly/vs5R3A

Can't...breathe...laughing...too...hard.

382 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:59:34am

re: #373 oaktree

Great.

Now I have a mental image of little turn rods sticking out of the back of their heads like for a music box. You turn it and you can faintly hear "Pop Goes the Weasel" playing inside. Then suddenly the top of their head hinges open and their atrophied brains pop out and start tap dancing.

O_o

I shamelessly stole the imagery from

[Link: video.mail.ru...]

383 darthstar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 6:59:50am

re: #380 Gus 802

Fascinating. Now I have to Google Kelly Clarkson.

is that what kids are calling it these days?

384 sagehen  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:02:15am

re: #380 Gus 802

Fascinating. Now I have to Google Kelly Clarkson.

She was an early American Idol winner. Better than Clay Aiken, not as good as Fantasia.

385 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:02:59am

re: #374 Gus 802

Image: 2009-09-09-organgrindermonkey.gif

As a man of Italian heritage, I strongly voice my utter glee at that stereotypical image!!

(he sort of looks like my brother-in-law, Guido)
((umm,, the man,,,not the monkey ,, although,,,))

386 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:06:58am

re: #385 sattv4u2

As a man of Italian heritage, I strongly voice my utter glee at that stereotypical image!!

(he sort of looks like my brother-in-law, Guido)
((umm,, the man,,,not the monkey ,, although,,,))

Popeye The Sailor 045 - Organ Grinder's Swing

Youtube Video
387 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:07:50am

Brace yourselves for the revolution!
Anonymous Survival Guide for Citizens in a Revolution
They really have a fetish for bandannas. From the "general strategies" section...

Wear white/green head bands so militarypersonnel can recognize you - Be visible.• Do not let children go outdoors unless you arecertain that it is safe and do not let them out of your sight. A bandana as a head band is a handy article because it is multi-purpose.

Their first tip to avoid rape...

Try to appear undesirable and unatractive...

Of course, don't forget your all important Guy Fawkes mask...

if you manage to gethold of mask, then use it. Ensure that you cover anyparcularly idenfying features (e.g. taoos, scars,birthmarks). If possible, bring extra masks for peo-ple who don’t have one.

388 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:08:47am

re: #387 Killgore Trout

Brace yourselves for the revolution!
Anonymous Survival Guide for Citizens in a Revolution
They really have a fetish for bandannas. From the "general strategies" section...

Their first tip to avoid rape...

Of course, don't forget your all important Guy Fawkes mask...

WTF? "Try to appear undesirable and unatractive [sic]"?

389 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:08:55am

re: #387 Killgore Trout

Brace yourselves for the revolution!
Anonymous Survival Guide for Citizens in a Revolution
They really have a fetish for bandannas. From the "general strategies" section...

Their first tip to avoid rape...

Of course, don't forget your all important Guy Fawkes mask...

The Revolution Will Not Be Televised...because it lost its slot to American Idol.

390 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:09:37am

re: #388 Gus 802

WTF? "Try to appear undesirable and unatractive [sic]"?

Yes, they only pretend to be ugly.///

391 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:09:44am

re: #388 Gus 802

WTF? "Try to appear undesirable and unatractive [sic]"?

I think I can manage that.

392 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:11:01am

re: #391 Killgore Trout

I think I can manage that.

That's the old "she had it coming" defense. It's highly frowned upon by most people. God I hate these people.

393 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:12:47am

re: #392 Gus 802

That's the old "she had it coming" defense. It's highly frowned upon by most people. God I hate these people.

My guess is the document was written by teenage boys. It reads like a fantasy from someone who spent too much time watching Hollywood movies and imagining what a revolution is going to be like.

394 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:13:27am

re: #393 Killgore Trout

My guess is the document was written by teenage boys. It reads like a fantasy from someone who spent too much time watching Hollywood movies and imagine what a revolution is going to be like.

Definitely. A bunch of hoodie wearing street urchins without a clue.

395 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:13:32am

re: #387 Killgore Trout

re: #388 Gus 802

WTF? "Try to appear undesirable and unatractive [sic]"?

re: #390 Sergey Romanov

Maybe thats what the bandannas are for

To cover up any attractive parts!!!

396 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:13:41am

re: #384 sagehen

She was an early American Idol winner. Better than Clay Aiken, not as good as Fantasia.

And apparently first and foremost an idiot.

397 kirkspencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:14:01am

re: #387 Killgore Trout

Brace yourselves for the revolution!
Scribd Document>Their first tip to avoid rape...

"Try to appear undesirable and unatractive [sic]"

So rape is again always the woman's fault. If she didn't tempt, it wouldn't happen. /spit

Some cases of statutory rape are about sex. Other than that, rape is never about sex. It's a brutal assault to display and establish power and dominance, in part by diminishing the target.

398 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:14:07am

re: #394 Gus 802

Definitely. A bunch of hoodie wearing street urchins without a clue.

Or, as proper dictatorships/oligarchies know them: "Cannon fodder."

399 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:15:16am

re: #398 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Or, as proper dictatorships/oligarchies know them: "Cannon fodder."

Before cannon were used militarily they were referred to as "auxilaries", "peasants", or possibly "militia".

400 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:15:18am

re: #393 Killgore Trout

The new "Indians and Cowboys".

401 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:16:03am

re: #397 kirkspencer

So rape is again always the woman's fault. If she didn't tempt, it wouldn't happen. /spit

Uh, no, that's not what they're saying.

402 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:16:26am

re: #401 Sergey Romanov

Uh, no, that's not what they're saying.

It's implied.

403 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:16:38am

re: #393 Killgore Trout

My guess is the document was written by teenage boys. It reads like a fantasy from someone who spent too much time watching Hollywood movies and imagine what a revolution is going to be like.

Ah, folk convinced that if they jump around enough they'll hit onto one of the cheat codes for life.

404 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:17:00am

re: #403 oaktree

Ah, folk convinced that if they jump around enough they'll hit onto one of the cheat codes for life.

I tried the Konami Code already. It didn't work.

//

405 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:17:56am

Once my greenhouse is finished I'll be pretty much self sufficient in terms of food. However. I'm not under any false impression that I'll survive a serious social upheaval or worldwide disaster. Once these friendly hippies around me get hungry enough I'm fucked. I'm surrounded by far more people than I could reasonably feed or shoot.

406 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:18:02am

re: #404 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I tried the Konami Code already. It didn't work.

//

The Mariachi already found and used that one.

407 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:18:57am

re: #401 Sergey Romanov

So rape is again always the woman's fault. If she didn't tempt, it wouldn't happen. /spit

Uh, no, that's not what they're saying.

re: #402 Gus 802

It's implied.

Actually, given a choice of targets, the rapey/stabby will probably go for the one he most resents/feels least sympathy with. The victim-to-be appearance is germane.

408 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:19:14am

re: #405 Killgore Trout

Once my greenhouse is finished I'll be pretty much self sufficient in terms of food. However. I'm not under any false impression that I'll survive a serious social upheaval or worldwide disaster. Once these friendly hippies around me get hungry enough I'm fucked. I'm surrounded by far more people than I could reasonably feed or shoot.

Start training the frogs as an auxilary defense force. Or convince them to subsidize you as *their* defense force. You've already built them a fortified palace (or at least have one underway).

409 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:19:16am

re: #405 Killgore Trout

Once my greenhouse is finished I'll be pretty much self sufficient in terms of food. However. I'm not under any false impression that I'll survive a serious social upheaval or worldwide disaster. Once these friendly hippies around me get hungry enough I'm fucked. I'm surrounded by far more people than I could reasonably feed or shoot.

I have an acre or two out back I could lease to you

410 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:20:55am

re: #405 Killgore Trout

Once my greenhouse is finished I'll be pretty much self sufficient in terms of food. However. I'm not under any false impression that I'll survive a serious social upheaval or worldwide disaster. Once these friendly hippies around me get hungry enough I'm fucked. I'm surrounded by far more people than I could reasonably feed or shoot.

So your best strategy is to grow less broccoli and more community.

411 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:21:30am

I really hope it doesn't happen. It would be so embarrassing to be killed by a vegetarian.

412 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:22:13am

Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez hinted that the U.S. may be behind a “very strange” bout of cancer affecting several leaders aligned with him in South America.
[Link: www.bloomberg.com...]

Hugo,,, if we were responsible, more likely than not, I would have preferred lead poisoning!!

413 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:22:15am

re: #407 Decatur Deb

re: #402 Gus 802

Actually, given a choice of targets, the rapey/stabby will probably go for the one he most resents/feels least sympathy with. The victim-to-be appearance is germane.

Rape victims are largely random. It's usually a matter of opportunity for the perpetrator and not based on attractiveness. Additionally, attractiveness is not a mutable trait. They might as well have said "in order to avoid rape wear a Burqa."

414 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:22:19am

re: #411 Killgore Trout

I really hope it doesn't happen. It would be so embarrassing to be killed by a vegetarian.

And a waste of good protein.

415 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:22:55am

re: #402 Gus 802

It's implied.

It is implied that rapists are more likely to go for attractive women. Which may or may not be true, but there is no blaming of women going on. In certain countries (both now and in recent history) one would have to hide being Jewish to avoid brutal death. It doesn't mean that tips for survival in such countries saying "hide that you're Jewish" blame Jews for the violence.

416 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:23:33am

re: #411 Killgore Trout

I really hope it doesn't happen. It would be so embarrassing to be killed by a vegetarian.

"Yeah Sarge,, looks as if he was bludgeoned to death by an unripened eggplant"

417 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:23:38am

re: #405 Killgore Trout

Once my greenhouse is finished I'll be pretty much self sufficient in terms of food. However. I'm not under any false impression that I'll survive a serious social upheaval or worldwide disaster. Once these friendly hippies around me get hungry enough I'm fucked. I'm surrounded by far more people than I could reasonably feed or shoot.

Guess it's time to start digging the moat and heating up the vat of lead.

418 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:26:47am

re: #413 Gus 802

Rape victims are largely random. It's usually a matter of opportunity for the perpetrator and not based on attractiveness. Additionally, attractiveness is not a mutable trait. They might as well have said "in order to avoid rape wear a Burqa."

It depends on context. There's usual smug male "she should just dress modestly" hostile/domination advice thing. And there's "when you're in a hostile environment, try to blend in and don't stand out" friendly advice thing. If I say that it would be wise for the woman journalist who was raped on the Tahrir square to wear Islamic garb (considering the male contingent that gathered there), I'm not implying that she is to blame for what happened, yet I'm saying that this might have been avoided.

419 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:26:58am

"Luuuucyyy,,, you got some SPLAININ to dooo!!"

Outrage as BBC chooses panda as 2011 female face

[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

420 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:27:48am
Youtube Video

The new campaign song for Luap Nor?

"A Moment Like This"

421 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:29:11am

re: #420 Winny Spencer

[Video]The new campaign song for Luap Nor?

Nah, this will forever be his campaign song...

Youtube Video
422 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:34:29am

re: #418 Sergey Romanov

It depends on context. There's usual smug male "she should just dress modestly" hostile/domination advice thing. And there's "when you're in a hostile environment, try to blend in and don't stand out" friendly advice thing. If I say that it would be wise for the woman journalist who was raped on the Tahrir square to wear Islamic garb (considering the male contingent that gathered there), I'm not implying that she is to blame for what happened, yet I'm saying that this might have been avoided.

One my most favorite scenes in "Forrest Gump" is when he punches out Jenny's boyfriend at the Black Panthers meeting.

423 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:34:55am

re: #422 Gus 802

One my most favorite scenes in "Forrest Gump" is when he punches out Jenny's boyfriend at the Black Panthers meeting.

I gotta see that movie sometime.

424 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:35:33am

re: #423 Sergey Romanov

I gotta see that movie sometime.

You've never seen Forrest Gump?

425 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:35:46am

re: #405 Killgore Trout

Once my greenhouse is finished I'll be pretty much self sufficient in terms of food. However. I'm not under any false impression that I'll survive a serious social upheaval or worldwide disaster. Once these friendly hippies around me get hungry enough I'm fucked. I'm surrounded by far more people than I could reasonably feed or shoot.

I'll be putting the plastic over the hoop-house at the end of this (relatively) warm cycle. It will only be up for 2-3 months, and most of that time will be furled open in daylight. Almost time to start early tomato and pepper sets.

426 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:36:24am

re: #424 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

You've never seen Forrest Gump?

My bad.

427 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:37:41am

re: #426 Sergey Romanov

My bad.

Eh, don't worry, I've got a long list of films that I absolutely "must see" but simply can't be arsed to sit down and view. Blade Runner is up there towards the top of the list.

428 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:38:04am

re: #424 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

You've never seen Forrest Gump?

But in a tu quoque manner, if SFZ has never seen the Blazing Saddles, I don't feel as bad for not seeing FG. :P

429 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:39:20am

re: #424 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

You've never seen Forrest Gump?

My, what a lucky man he is. I'd really rather have that time back.

430 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:40:16am

re: #429 wlewisiii

My, what a lucky man he is. I'd really rather have that time back.

What, I shouldn't?

431 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:41:55am

re: #429 wlewisiii

My, what a lucky man he is. I'd really rather have that time back.

*rolls eyes* Everybody's a critic.

432 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:45:17am

re: #431 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

*rolls eyes* Everybody's a critic.

Image: 222px-The_Simpsons-Jeff_Albertson.png

433 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:45:25am

re: #425 Decatur Deb

I'll be putting the plastic over the hoop-house at the end of this (relatively) warm cycle. It will only be up for 2-3 months, and most of that time will be furled open in daylight. Almost time to start early tomato and pepper sets.

I'm dying to get started with my greenhouse but everything's on hold for the holidays. I have the raised beds all filled with dirt and compost. I started some tomatoes and peppers indoors to transplant out once finished. I spend a lot of time out there just looking at it and dreaming of the possibilities. Very frustrating waiting.

434 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:46:50am

re: #432 Gus 802

Image: 222px-The_Simpsons-Jeff_Albertson.png

Wurst Simpsons ref evah!/

435 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:47:49am

re: #433 Killgore Trout

I'm dying to get started with my greenhouse but everything's on hold for the holidays. I have the raised beds all filled with dirt and compost. I started some tomatoes and peppers indoors to transplant out once finished. I spend a lot of time out there just looking at it and dreaming of the possibilities. Very frustrating waiting.

Yea. We all know that this was just cover time for the auxilary Lizard bunker to be dug out under there. Wait! This isn't a private thread? But..
(carrier lost)

436 Decatur Deb  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:50:12am

re: #433 Killgore Trout

I'm dying to get started with my greenhouse but everything's on hold for the holidays. I have the raised beds all filled with dirt and compost. I started some tomatoes and peppers indoors to transplant out once finished. I spend a lot of time out there just looking at it and dreaming of the possibilities. Very frustrating waiting.

In years past it was very pleasant to spend a winter hour or so in the 75 degree/90% humidity. Then you get to eat the stuff.

437 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:50:58am

Anyone seen this:

Criminal Charges Possible Against BP Engineers For Gulf Oil Spill

438 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:51:40am

re: #435 oaktree

Yea. We all know that this was just cover time for the auxilary Lizard bunker to be dug out under there. Wait! This isn't a private thread? But..
(carrier lost)

Comrade, this one is going to cost you. To Wasilla with you!

//

439 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:52:07am

re: #437 wlewisiii

Anyone seen this:

Criminal Charges Possible Against BP Engineers For Gulf Oil Spill

Quickly I would say it looks like they're passing the buck.

440 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:52:48am

re: #430 Sergey Romanov

What, I shouldn't?

I appear to be the exception to the rule that everyone must love "Forrest Gump". I found it to be an extremely annoying pean to the virtues of ignorance. YMMV.

441 lawhawk  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:55:17am

Greets and saluts from the NYC metro area. I see that with just a few days before the Iowa caucus, Romney tops the polls, with Paul in second and Santorum in third, surging past a fading Gingrich. Well, considering the GOP clown circus, it's not surprising that Santorum is surging - he's the one guy who hasn't been touted as the anyone but Romney alternative to date. The headline reflects the ABR meme, but that's who's leading - not Santorum or Paul, and Gingrich has had himself a meltdown:

Former Massachusetts governor Romney — who has spent relatively little time in Iowa — now stands in first place in the state with 25%, according to the poll. He also holds a big lead in New Hampshire, where voters will hold its primary Jan. 10.

In Iowa, Romney is followed by Rep. Ron Paul at 22%, and Santorum at 16%, which is three times more support than last month. Former House speaker Gingrich, who was polling at 33% in Iowa last month, is fading fast and was down to 14%, according to the poll.

The CNN/Time/ORC poll only surveyed registered Republican voters. A poll published Tuesday by Public Policy Polling included independents and Democrats — many who are expected to re-register as Republicans for the Iowa caucuses — showed Paul holding a slight lead over Romney.

I give this poll more credence than the PPP poll, which assumes that independents and Democrats will re-register as Republicans and vote for Paul over Romney or other candidates.

But overall, this shapes up to be a caucus that should terminate the Bachmann campaign (as if her campaign people jumping ship to Paul shouldn't be enough of a signal). Her recriminations and excuses make for quite the comedy of errors.

442 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:55:50am

More trash from the wingbat in chief:

@ggreenwald Glenn Greenwald
From The Surveillance State: how dare you invade the sanctity of our email communications!!!

443 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:56:42am

re: #440 wlewisiii

I appear to be the exception to the rule that everyone must love "Forrest Gump". I found it to be an extremely annoying pean to the virtues of ignorance. YMMV.

I mainly remember the Gary Sinise character.

444 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:57:28am

re: #439 Gus 802

Quickly I would say it looks like they're passing the buck.

I think so too, but I know little about these issues. OTOH, there are other lizards who are very well versed and I was hoping for their thoughts.

445 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:58:05am

re: #413 Gus 802

Rape victims are largely random. It's usually a matter of opportunity for the perpetrator and not based on attractiveness. Additionally, attractiveness is not a mutable trait. They might as well have said "in order to avoid rape wear a Burqa."

re: #415 Sergey Romanov

It is implied that rapists are more likely to go for attractive women. Which may or may not be true, but there is no blaming of women going on. In certain countries (both now and in recent history) one would have to hide being Jewish to avoid brutal death. It doesn't mean that tips for survival in such countries saying "hide that you're Jewish" blame Jews for the violence.

Oh, I have just the best timing in when I show up, don't I?

First off, rape victims are not largely random. The vast majority of rapes are committed by people the victim is at least somewhat acquainted with. That's pretty much the opposite of random.

Second, saying "Try to appear undesirable and unatractive..." absolutely is blaming women. It's implying that manner of dress and how you look play some sort of major role in determining who is raped and this is simply not the case. It reeks of the whole disgusting "She was asking for it by dressing that way" meme.

446 lawhawk  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:58:35am

re: #442 Gus 802

Like Andrew Sullivan, I have no idea how Greenwald came to have such a following (especially following the Socky McSockpuppet incident).

447 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 7:58:50am

re: #440 wlewisiii

I appear to be the exception to the rule that everyone must love "Forrest Gump". I found it to be an extremely annoying pean to the virtues of ignorance. YMMV.

It's not one of my favorite movies but it's not about the virtues of ignorance. It's about the simplicity of life. It is pretty simple to do what the moment requires. If it was a foreign film with subtitles set in rural China intellectuals would hail it as a Zen masterpiece. It's American, it's sappy but it's not a bad movie.

448 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:00:04am

re: #445 Simply Sarah

re: #415 Sergey Romanov

Oh, I have just the best timing in when I show up, don't I?

First off, rape victims are not largely random. The vast majority of rapes are committed by people the victim is at least somewhat acquainted with. That's pretty much the opposite of random.

Second, saying "Try to appear undesirable and unatractive..." absolutely is blaming women. It's implying that manner of dress and how you look play some sort of major role in determining who is raped and this is simply not the case. It reeks of the whole disgusting "She was asking for it by dressing that way" meme.

Thanks for that and yes!

449 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:01:03am

re: #447 Killgore Trout

It's not one of my favorite movies but it's not about the virtues of ignorance. It's about the simplicity of life. It is pretty simple to do what the moment requires. If it was a foreign film with subtitles set in rural China intellectuals would hail it as a Zen masterpiece. It's American, it's sappy but it's not a bad movie.

So it's the American version of _Doctor Zhivago_!

;)

450 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:01:21am

re: #446 lawhawk

Like Andrew Sullivan, I have no idea how Greenwald came to have such a following (especially following the Socky McSockpuppet incident).

Probably the same way Ron Paul did. Said a few things people liked and they started focusing on that to the exclusion of everything else he says.

451 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:02:33am

re: #445 Simply Sarah

Second, saying "Try to appear undesirable and unatractive..." absolutely is blaming women. It's implying that manner of dress and how you look play some sort of major role in determining who is raped and this is simply not the case. It reeks of the whole disgusting "She was asking for it by dressing that way" meme.

To repeat, it's one thing to be wrong about whether or not appearance influences rapes. It's another thing to intentionally blame someone. From "they're wrong about this" does not follow "they blame women".

452 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:02:52am

re: #440 wlewisiii

I appear to be the exception to the rule that everyone must love "Forrest Gump". I found it to be an extremely annoying pean to the virtues of ignorance. YMMV.

That's mostly because, in adapting the novel to film, they aimed for family film territory, which means a lot of the grittier and darker portions of the novel had to get cut out.

453 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:02:53am

re: #448 Gus 802

Well, it's incorrect.

454 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:04:58am

re: #453 Sergey Romanov

Well, it's incorrect.

Subjective. :)

455 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:05:36am

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Hanlon's Razor is an eponymous adage that reads:
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

456 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:06:28am

re: #451 Sergey Romanov

To repeat, it's one thing to be wrong about whether or not appearance influences rapes. It's another thing to intentionally blame someone. From "they're wrong about this" does not follow "they blame women".

And I need to strongly disagree. To me, those mindsets go hand in hand. Even if the blaming of women isn't conscious and explicit, it is underlying the entire concept. It's saying that if she (In most cases) didn't look so sexy/provocative/attractive/etc., she wouldn't have been raped (Or would have had a lower chance of it occurring). It ignores the fact that, no, the fault is on the guy (Again, in most cases) that decided he was going to rape her for whatever reason. Her looks have nothing to do with that, especially since I don't buy the bullshit on rape being caused simply by men that can't control their sexual urges.

457 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:07:01am

Cripes. I either have to clean up my Twitter followers/following or grow more resistant to have to see Greenwald's drivel flash before my screen.

458 Targetpractice  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:10:20am

Think I'll try to go get something accomplished before new threads begin. BBL

459 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:13:16am

re: #458 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Think I'll try to go get something accomplished before new threads begin. BBL

Outstanding! My plan of becoming able to drive people from threads just due to seeing my user name is starting to fall into place nicely!
/ is hopefully not needed.

460 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:14:14am

re: #456 Simply Sarah

The problem I see with this is that then it's not possible to give any anti-rape advice in principle, because rape is something that apparently always happens spontaneously and that it is impossible to decrease the probability of it happening. E.g. an advice for a woman not to get into an elevator with a strange male at night alone can be interpreted as blaming her for the rape if she does get into the elevator. After all, this ignores that it is the rapist's fault. (Though I would say that the rapist's fault is assumed here by default.)

And if it is possible to give such an advice, then it's pretty much inevitable that a lot of folks will assume (wrongly) that attractiveness is a possible causal factor in rape. Again, they may be wrong, but not out of malicious or blaming mindset (though some are).

461 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:14:41am

We have a break in the rain, it's warm and the frogs are talking again. I have about 5 yards of compost I need to move.

462 allegro  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:14:58am

re: #456 Simply Sarah

And I need to strongly disagree. To me, those mindsets go hand in hand. Even if the blaming of women isn't conscious and explicit, it is underlying the entire concept. It's saying that if she (In most cases) didn't look so sexy/provocative/attractive/etc., she wouldn't have been raped (Or would have had a lower chance of it occurring). It ignores the fact that, no, the fault is on the guy (Again, in most cases) that decided he was going to rape her for whatever reason. Her looks have nothing to do with that, especially since I don't buy the bullshit on rape being caused simply by men that can't control their sexual urges.

I have seen a couple of articles from feminists lately with an intriguing argument about this and that is that those friendly advice lists for women on how to avoid rape are in fact excuse lists for rapists. It's actually quite valid. In criminal court cases these are the things that are traditionally argued in defense of the rapist. She was drunk, she was dressed like a whore, she was seen in public with breasts... These things are so ingrained in the cultural psyche as "she was asking for it" and they are things that a rapist can look for knowing that these factors are going to excuse his actions, both in his mind AND in the mind of the public.

463 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:16:22am

re: #455 Sergey Romanov

Corollary: any sufficiently advanced stupidity is indistinguishable from malice.

464 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:20:05am

re: #462 allegro

I have seen a couple of articles from feminists lately with an intriguing argument about this and that is that those friendly advice lists for women on how to avoid rape are in fact excuse lists for rapists. It's actually quite valid. In criminal court cases these are the things that are traditionally argued in defense of the rapist. She was drunk, she was dressed like a whore, she was seen in public with breasts... These things are so ingrained in the cultural psyche as "she was asking for it" and they are things that a rapist can look for knowing that these factors are going to excuse his actions, both in his mind AND in the mind of the public.

Exactly! Even if it is well intended, most of that "advice" still finds itself rooted in the idea that, somehow, the victim opened herself up to being raped through some action or her appearance or whatever. And it still ignores the fact I mentioned earlier that only a minority of rapes are actually committed by strangers.

465 allegro  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:20:25am

re: #460 Sergey Romanov

The problem I see with this is that then it's not possible to give any anti-rape advice in principle, because rape is something that apparently always happens spontaneously and that it is impossible to decrease the probability of it happening. E.g. an advice for a woman not to get into an elevator with a strange male at night alone can be interpreted as blaming her for the rape if she does get into the elevator. After all, this ignores that it is the rapist's fault. (Though I would say that the rapist's fault is assumed here by default.)

And if it is possible to give such an advice, then it's pretty much inevitable that a lot of folks will assume (wrongly) that attractiveness is a possible causal factor in rape. Again, they may be wrong, but not out of malicious or blaming mindset (though some are).

Here's terrific anti-rape advice:

Sexual Assault Prevention Tips Guaranteed to Work

1. Don’t put drugs in women’s drinks.

2. When you see a woman walking by herself, leave her alone.

3. If you pull over to help a woman whose car has broken down, remember not to rape her.

4. If you are in a lift and a woman gets in, don’t rape her.

5. When you encounter a woman who is asleep, the safest course of action is to not rape her.

6. Never creep into a woman’s home through an unlocked door or window, or spring out at her from between parked cars, or rape her.

7. When you lurk in bushes and doorways with criminal intentions, always wear bright clothing, wave a flashlight, or play “Boys Who Rape (Should All Be Destroyed)” by the Raveonettes on a boombox really loud, so women in the vicinity will know where to aim their flamethrowers.

8. USE THE BUDDY SYSTEM! If it is inconvenient for you to stop yourself from raping women, ask a trusted friend to accompany you when lurking in shadows.

9. Carry a rape whistle. If you find that you are about to rape a woman, you can hand the whistle to your buddy, so s/he can blow it to call for help.

10. Give your buddy a revolver, so that when indifferent passers-by either ignore the rape whistle, or gather round to enjoy the spectacle, s/he can pistol-whip you.

11. Don’t forget: Honesty is the best policy. When asking a woman out on a date, don’t pretend that you are interested in her as a person; tell her straight up that you expect to be raping her later. If you don’t communicate your intentions, the woman may take it as a sign that you do not plan to rape her.

In other words, the best way to prevent rape is to not rape anybody.

466 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:21:29am

re: #465 allegro

In other words, the best way to prevent rape is to not rape anybody.

Yeah, this is so helpful to everyone.

467 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:26:01am

re: #452 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

That's mostly because, in adapting the novel to film, they aimed for family film territory, which means a lot of the grittier and darker portions of the novel had to get cut out.

That could well be but nothing in the movie made me desire to seek out the novel ... :eek:

468 allegro  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:27:26am

re: #466 Sergey Romanov

Yeah, this is so helpful to everyone.

I know you meant that sarcastically but it is indeed helpful to everyone. Because, dig this, rape done by men is THEIR RESPONSIBILITY. It is THEIR crime and only theirs. Until our culture treats rape as a serious crime by actually blaming the ones responsible for it rather than just play pearl-clutching lip service to it with a few token convictions, victims will continue to be victimized. It has gotten better here with (some) rape victims being taken more seriously but it is still more a matter of educating men that rape is actually a bad thing to do.

469 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:28:07am

When I have to walk along the street at night, I know I'm safe from robbery: every potential robber knows that robbery is bad. So they won't rob me, and I don't have to take precautions. Yay!

470 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:28:49am

re: #469 Sergey Romanov

When I have to walk along the street at night, I know I'm safe from robbery: every potential robber knows that robbery is bad. So they won't rob me, and I don't have to take precautions. Yay!

Varek's Razor : I'll cut you!
/

471 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:29:15am

re: #468 allegro

You do understand that simply saying that men have responsibility for rape is stating the obvious, but does not really solve anything or help anyone, because rape is still there?

472 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:30:13am

I do however draw the line on the "all men are rapists" meme.

473 lawhawk  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:31:08am

re: #470 Varek Raith

Lawhawk's lightsaber: If you cut me down, I'll become more powerful than you could ever imagine (f/k/a Kenobi's Knife)

474 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:31:48am

re: #465 allegro

Just a warning for anyone following the link to IBTP. While Twisty is rather accepting for a self-identified radfem (Such as running about the only major radfem website that isn't disgusting anti-trans), IBTP is still a radfem website and if you look around then yeah, you'll probably see a lot of stuff that you strongly disagree with. Just don't try to use that as an excuse to ignore what allegro linked/posted.

475 allegro  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:32:52am

re: #472 Gus 802

I do however draw the line on the "all men are rapists" meme.

There is no such meme. The truth is that until a woman knows a man and know that he can be trusted, she MUST be wary. Listen to Sergio - he's telling you exactly that because rapists are everywhere, right?

476 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:33:32am

*Scratches head*

477 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:33:52am

re: #475 allegro

There is no such meme. The truth is that until a woman knows a man and know that he can be trusted, she MUST be wary. Listen to Sergio - he's telling you exactly that because rapists are everywhere, right?

Um, what?

478 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:34:26am

Sarah Palin GoDaddy!

//

479 allegro  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:34:30am

re: #474 Simply Sarah

Just a warning for anyone following the link to IBTP. While Twisty is rather accepting for a self-identified radfem (Such as running about the only major radfem website that isn't disgusting anti-trans), IBTP is still a radfem website and if you look around then yeah, you'll probably see a lot of stuff that you strongly disagree with. Just don't try to use that as an excuse to ignore what allegro linked/posted.

Twisty is a hoot, brilliant writer, but you are correct in her radfemness. It's just that her blog was where I knew I could find that list that was travelling about a couple of years ago.

480 allegro  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:37:31am

re: #477 Sergey Romanov

Um, what?

You are saying that it is the responsibility of women to take precautions at all times and to be wary because rapes are going to happen.

Gus is "drawing the line" that all men are rapists "meme."

You aren't seeing the rather obvious connection between these two points?

What women here are probably seeing, as I am, is that if women aren't wary, we're raped, and if we are diligently wary, we're still fucked for being paranoid meanies.

481 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:39:23am

Ok, now I understand what's going on.
Nice knowing you Sergey.
*Ducks*
/:P

482 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:41:21am

re: #480 allegro

You are saying that it is the responsibility of women to take precautions at all times and to be wary because rapes are going to happen.

No, he's not. He's saying that rapes are going to happen. He's not saying anything about the responsibility of it, other than to say it's the rapists entire responsibility for the act.

He's also saying that if there is something that one can do to diminish the chance of rape, then, if it's not a restriction on freedom one can't live with, one should do it. For example, going out with a known rapist is a bad idea.

The fact is that attractiveness of the woman does not increase the chance of rape, and so anyone advising that women not be attractive in order to avoid being rape is either ignorant of that-- reprehensibly ignorant-- or is using that construction to say it's really the woman's fault.

483 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:41:35am

re: #480 allegro

You are saying that it is the responsibility of women to take precautions at all times and to be wary because rapes are going to happen.

Gus is "drawing the line" that all men are rapists "meme."

You aren't seeing the rather obvious connection between these two points?

What women here are probably seeing, as I am, is that if women aren't wary, we're raped, and if we aren't, we're still fucked for being paranoid meanies.

Uh no, even if I were to write the claim you attribute to me, there would still be no way to derive "all men are rapists" from it.

What I'm saying is this:

1. There are, in principle, circumstances when the probability of rape is larger than usual.

2. It's not wrong, in principle, to try to identify such circumstances.

3. When one does err while identifying such circumstances, it may look bad, but does not necessarily stem from either malice or blaming mindset.

With which of the above three do you disagree?

484 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:42:15am

re: #481 Varek Raith

Ok, now I understand what's going on.
Nice knowing you Sergey.
*Ducks*
/:P

I'm about ready to blow the canopy.

//

485 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:42:50am

re: #482 Obdicut

Finally!

486 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:43:42am
Youtube Video
487 Lidane  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:44:06am

Erick, Son of Erick is not happy about Iowa:

No Surprise, Iowa Social Conservatives Are About To Shoot Us All in the Foot Again

488 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:44:10am

Also, let's remember that rape is not just of women-- while fewer adult men are raped, many, many male children are raped. So positing it just in terms of women being raped is something that I think confuses the issue a little-- there's a lot of overlap between those who rape and those who don't care about age of consent laws.

489 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:46:07am

re: #486 Gus 802

[Video]

DIVE! DIVE! DIVE!
Er...

490 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:52:09am

The excuses made by ephebophiles and pedophiles often match those made by adult rapists, too-- focusing on the sexuality of the victim, claiming they wanted it. That's one of the reasons that age of consent laws exist, so that we don't have to put children through the torture of asking if they consented or not.

All of the focus on the victim, rather than the perpetrator, is part of the overall problem that Allegro and Sarah are talking about. The sexuality and behavior of the victim is immaterial to the crime, as long as none of it is real consent.

The biggest problem that we have with rape is people being ashamed of it or thinking they won't be believed, or that it won't be worth going through the prosecution. And, unfortunately, it often isn't worth prosecuting. Often there is no physical evidence, it is he-said-she-said, and there really is reasonable doubt. I think it's a terrible thing to have to say, but to anyone who gets raped they should immediately go to the police or the hospital so that evidence can be collected.

But obviously, some people aren't going to be capable of doing that, they're going to need comfort first. It's one of the twisted parts of rape-- it's a traumatizing and horrid version of a normal human interaction.

492 allegro  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:52:53am

re: #483 Sergey Romanov

Uh no, even if I were to write the claim you attribute to me, there would still be no way to derive "all men are rapists" from it.

No one is saying that all men are rapists. What we are saying is that women cannot tell the difference between a rapist and non-rapist at first sight. Therefore, in order to remain safe, as you suggest, we must take precautions with any man we may meet until we know him well enough to know that we are safe with him. Will you agree with this?

What I'm saying is this:

1. There are, in principle, circumstances when the probability of rape is larger than usual.

2. It's not wrong, in principle, to try to identify such circumstances.

Exactly. See above. Are you aware that most rapes are acquaintance rapes as Sarah has pointed out? They are date rapes, rapes that happen at parties, rapes by family members. How is a women to "identify such circumstances" in which, by statistical reality, the "probability of rape" is higher when it is more probable as she is simply going about her life.

3. When one does err while identifying such circumstances, it may look bad, but does not necessarily stem from either malice or blaming mindset.

It's because asking the questions "why did you go out with him?" or "why did you go to that party and leave your drink unattended?" are absolutely victim blaming regardless of the intent behind them.

493 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:56:06am

re: #492 allegro

What you're missing is that Sergey is talking prophylactically, not in judgement after. He's not saying "Why did you go out with him?" he's saying "Don't go out with him, please consider the danger", if there is reason to believe he's a rapist. He's not saying "Why did you go to that party and leave your drink unattended?" he's saying "If you go to a party, don't leave your drink unattended, and bring a buddy."

He's not saying "And if you don't do these things, you are more to blame, and whether or not you did them should not be mitigating circumstances."

494 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:58:24am

re: #488 Obdicut

Also, let's remember that rape is not just of women-- while fewer adult men are raped, many, many male children are raped. So positing it just in terms of women being raped is something that I think confuses the issue a little-- there's a lot of overlap between those who rape and those who don't care about age of consent laws.

Granted, but most of the "advice" being talked about here pretty much exclusively applies to women. Are you really going to tell a five year old to "be less attractive"? And, yet again, much of this advice is actually of little help in preventing rape because it presumes a large amount of rape occurs randomly from strangers, when that is just not the case, especially in the case of children.

495 allegro  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:58:36am

re: #493 Obdicut

What you're missing is that Sergey is talking prophylactically, not in judgement after. He's not saying "Why did you go out with him?" he's saying "Don't go out with him, please consider the danger", if there is reason to believe he's a rapist. He's not saying "Why did you go to that party and leave your drink unattended?" he's saying "If you go to a party, don't leave your drink unattended, and bring a buddy."

He's not saying "And if you don't do these things, you are more to blame, and whether or not you did them should be mitigating circumstances.

Which brings us full circle to the beginning of the discussion in the thread. I'm not interested in rehashing and I must boogie and get some work done.

496 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:59:12am

re: #492 allegro

No one is saying that all men are rapists.

I didn't bring up this meme. I didn't discuss it. There was no need to bring me up in #475.

Therefore, in order to remain safe, as you suggest,

I don't believe I made specific suggestions. We're discussing the meta: the anti-rape advice in principle: whether it's possible, permissible, etc.

Exactly. See above. Are you aware that most rapes are acquaintance rapes as Sarah has pointed out? They are date rapes, rapes that happen at parties, rapes by family members. How is a women to "identify such circumstances" in which, by statistical reality, the "probability of rape" is higher when it is more probable as she is simply going about her life.

Do you see the difference between "avoiding any possibility of rape" and "decreasing the probability of rape"?

It's because asking the questions "why did you go out with him?" or "why did you go to that party and leave your drink unattended?" are absolutely victim blaming regardless of the intent behind them.

Sure, but we're not discussing such questions.

497 wilburs  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 8:59:37am

Kelly Clarkson endorses Ron Paul!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Link: www.whosay.com...]

498 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:00:15am

re: #497 wilburs

Kelly Clarkson endorses Ron Paul!!!

[Link: www.whosay.com...]

My, this thread has come full circle!

499 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:01:40am

re: #494 Simply Sarah

Granted, but most of the "advice" being talked about here pretty much exclusively applies to women. Are you really going to tell a five year old to "be less attractive"?

Can we be clear that nobody here thinks being attractive has anything to do with rape? Nobody is saying that.

And, yet again, much of this advice is actually of little help in preventing rape because it presumes a large amount of rape occurs randomly from strangers, when that is just not the case, especially in the case of children.

I'm not talking about the stupid advice, though. Sergey identified that piece of advice as wrong and incorrect like forty posts ago. There is still valid advice to give women, and children, about rape. The main one being that it is most often a close associate who does it, and that no matter who it is, it's wrong and you should report it immediately and you have the right to stop it.

500 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:04:58am

re: #490 Obdicut

...
The biggest problem that we have with rape is people being ashamed of it or thinking they won't be believed, or that it won't be worth going through the prosecution. And, unfortunately, it often isn't worth prosecuting. Often there is no physical evidence, it is he-said-she-said, and there really is reasonable doubt. I think it's a terrible thing to have to say, but to anyone who gets raped they should immediately go to the police or the hospital so that evidence can be collected.

They think they won't be believed because often times they aren't. Women especially. This can be seen in all the "she's just a lying bitch" reactions that seem to come out of woodwork whenever a high profile man is accused by a woman. And yes, in the rare cases where the rapist is a woman, it becomes almost impossible for the victim to be believed, man, woman, or child.

501 Lidane  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:05:50am

re: #497 wilburs

Kelly Clarkson endorses Ron Paul!!!

[Link: www.whosay.com...]

Where's Steve? I'm sure he's got a comment about an American Idol winner endorsing a candidate. Heh.

502 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:08:14am

re: #500 Simply Sarah

They think they won't be believed because often times they aren't.

Yes, I know. And that's what I was identifying above-- rape is, unless physical evidence is obtained quickly or the guy talks about it with others-- very difficult to prove, legally. You can't implicitly believe everyone who says they were raped, legally. Any woman that I know I would believe immediately if they say they were raped, but I wouldn't expect the legal system to simply take them at their word.

Now, there's also women who are so disbelieved that their cases aren't even investigated, like nearly any sex worker, and that's a whole nother kettle of rotten fish.

503 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:11:46am

re: #493 Obdicut

What you're missing is that Sergey is talking prophylactically, not in judgement after. He's not saying "Why did you go out with him?" he's saying "Don't go out with him, please consider the danger", if there is reason to believe he's a rapist. He's not saying "Why did you go to that party and leave your drink unattended?" he's saying "If you go to a party, don't leave your drink unattended, and bring a buddy."

He's not saying "And if you don't do these things, you are more to blame, and whether or not you did them should be mitigating circumstances.

The problem is that most rapists don't "seem like they could be a rapist". Most seem like otherwise normal people or even exemplary citizens. This is where allegro's point on "All men are rapists" comes into play. It pretty much seems to be saying that women need to treat all men as potential rapists until we, somehow, have proof otherwise.

504 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:14:04am

re: #503 Simply Sarah

It pretty much seems to be saying that women need to treat all men as potential rapists until we, somehow, have proof otherwise.

No, nobody says that. There are, however, times and places where rape is more probable.

I don't believe that an advice to a German girl in 1945 Berlin not to approach Soviet soldiers is sexist or blaming her.

505 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:14:47am

re: #503 Simply Sarah

The problem is that most rapists don't "seem like they could be a rapist". Most seem like otherwise normal people or even exemplary citizens. This is where allegro's point on "All men are rapists" comes into play. It pretty much seems to be saying that women need to treat all men as potential rapists until we, somehow, have proof otherwise.

Everyone is a potential murderer of me, but that's not really going to affect how I treat them. Everyone's a potential thief, defrauder, libeler, etc. etc. So what?

If the phrase actually means "every man is capable of rape", then it's just obviously false.

506 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:16:50am

Just got here. We talking "rapey-stabby"? Trying to catch up, but I'm lazy. (Way too lazy to be a rapist, btw).

507 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:17:18am

re: #506 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Just got here. We talking "rapey-stabby"? Trying to catch up, but I'm lazy. (Way too lazy to be a rapist, btw).

But do you stab?/

508 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:17:23am

re: #504 Sergey Romanov

Basically: If my hypothetical daughter is going to go out with someone I know date-raped someone else, I am going to (first and foremost) warn her that he's a date-rapist and she shouldn't go out with him. If she chose to still go out with him-- since unfortunately, a lot of date-rapists are very good at playing the victim-- it wouldn't be any more her fault if she did get raped, but it would be more likely then if she went out with someone who wasn't a known date-rapist.

509 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:18:00am

re: #508 Obdicut

Yes.

510 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:19:47am

Moonbat leader Level II suggests the following:

Vote Against Obama in Iowa
Cenk Uygur

Found by way of:

@JeffersonObama C Gauvin
The Greenwald-Hamsher-Moore-Uygur CATO Assault has Begun on Dems: Cenk Uygur.: Vote Against Obama [Link: t.co...] 3p2

511 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:19:56am

Afternoon Honcos.

512 McSpiff  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:20:36am

re: #502 Obdicut

Yes, I know. And that's what I was identifying above-- rape is, unless physical evidence is obtained quickly or the guy talks about it with others-- very difficult to prove, legally. You can't implicitly believe everyone who says they were raped, legally. Any woman that I know I would believe immediately if they say they were raped, but I wouldn't expect the legal system to simply take them at their word.

Now, there's also women who are so disbelieved that their cases aren't even investigated, like nearly any sex worker, and that's a whole nother kettle of rotten fish.

I'm really bad at discussing a few issues, rape is one of them. I probably won't jump into this discussion other than to say that I really respect the way you handle yourself Obi. Happy Holidays, back to lurking.

513 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:21:13am

re: #508 Obdicut

My daughter went out with a guy who tried to rape her. He's still trying to remove his testicles from his nostrils.

Two good things came out of it... First? She told me about it.
Second? I didn't add insult to injury by finding and killing him.

514 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:21:51am

re: #510 Gus 802

That guy seems significantly less smarter than he sounds. He writes and speaks with great format, but doesn't really construct much of a logical argument.

515 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:22:41am

Cenk Uygur is a genocide denier.

516 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:22:54am

re: #511 Cannadian Club Akbar

Afternoon Honcos.

G'morning.

517 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:23:01am

re: #515 Winny Spencer

Cenk Uygur is a genocide denier.

He is?

518 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:23:09am

re: #512 McSpiff

I'm really bad at discussing a few issues, rape is one of them. I probably won't jump into this discussion other than to say that I really respect the way you handle yourself Obi. Happy Holidays, back to lurking.

It helps me keep perspective on the topic that I was raped as a kid, so thinking about it abstractly was a way of gaining control over the trauma.

And lots of hitting stuff until it broke.

519 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:23:16am

re: #517 Sergey Romanov

He is?

I knew you'd ask. ;)

520 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:23:47am

re: #508 Obdicut

Basically: If my hypothetical daughter is going to go out with someone I know date-raped someone else, I am going to (first and foremost) warn her that he's a date-rapist and she shouldn't go out with him. If she chose to still go out with him-- since unfortunately, a lot of date-rapists are very good at playing the victim-- it wouldn't be any more her fault if she did get raped, but it would be more likely then if she went out with someone who wasn't a known date-rapist.

OK, sure. Saying "You probably shouldn't go on a date with a known date-rapist" is kind of obvious. Wasn't really the kind of thing we were talking about, though. I'm sort of mentally drained on that topic for now.

521 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:23:51am

re: #519 Gus 802

I knew you'd ask? ;)

Genocide denial is my milieu.*

---

*Somebody is sure to maliciously misinterpret the above.

522 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:24:26am

re: #510 Gus 802

Moonbat leader Level II suggests the following:

Vote Against Obama in Iowa
Cenk Uygur

Found by way of:

@JeffersonObama C Gauvin
The Greenwald-Hamsher-Moore-Uygur CATO Assault has Begun on Dems: Cenk Uygur.: Vote Against Obama [Link: t.co...] 3p2

I saw this as "Greenwald-Hamster-Moore-Uygur"

523 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:24:34am

re: #521 Sergey Romanov

Genocide denial is my milieu.*

---

Somebody is sure to maliciously misinterpret the above.

Yep. BTW. That wasn't meant to be a question.

524 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:25:38am

re: #518 Obdicut

It helps me keep perspective on the topic that I was raped as a kid, so thinking about it abstractly was a way of gaining control over the trauma.

And lots of hitting stuff until it broke.

I'm extremely sorry you had to have that happen to you, since no one should have to go through that. Please understand that our intentions were never to suggest that children cannot and are not raped, nor that it wasn't an important issue. It was just that the topic at hand was focused on women, mainly.

525 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:26:54am

re: #518 Obdicut

It helps me keep perspective on the topic that I was raped as a kid, so thinking about it abstractly was a way of gaining control over the trauma.

And lots of hitting stuff until it broke.

My daughter was raped in 2002. I have a hard time even thinking about it without an unfocused hate welling up. They never did find the piece of shit.

526 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:28:01am

re: #520 Simply Sarah

OK, sure. Saying "You probably shouldn't go on a date with a known date-rapist" is kind of obvious. Wasn't really the kind of thing we were talking about, though. I'm sort of mentally drained on that topic for now.

But we never got around to discussing what might be valid advice. Sergey said, very clearly, that attractiveness or clothing was not valid advice, and then, for reasons that are unknown to me, people seemed to think he was saying that was valid advice.

And saying not to date known date-rapists is actually rather edgy advice, I'm sorry to say. Especially since date-rapists tend to be very good at the victimhood act, getting a girl to believe his ex was just vindictive, etc.

527 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:28:29am

re: #524 Simply Sarah

Oh, I didn't even notice whatever aspect of your post you're apologizing for, don't worry.

528 McSpiff  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:29:05am

re: #518 Obdicut

It helps me keep perspective on the topic that I was raped as a kid, so thinking about it abstractly was a way of gaining control over the trauma.

And lots of hitting stuff until it broke.

That's what amazes me. I don't even have the personal experience, just seeing the effect it had on a very close friend has made it very difficult with me to deal with in any sort of rational manner. Someone made the mistake of suggesting she was promiscuous the other night. Her fiancé had to drag me out of the bar in a choke hold, after he got me off the guys throat. Good on you for being able to maintain that perspective.

529 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:29:22am

re: #515 Winny Spencer

Cenk Uygur is a genocide denier.

Did I miss something?

530 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:30:08am

re: #529 Killgore Trout

Did I miss something?

[Link: www.armenianweekly.com...]

531 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:30:09am

re: #527 Obdicut

Oh, I didn't even notice whatever aspect of your post you're apologizing for, don't worry.

Mostly in general, in case I may have said something that offended. I tend to get overly worried about hurting people with what I say or do.

532 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:30:25am

re: #526 Obdicut

But we never got around to discussing what might be valid advice. Sergey said, very clearly, that attractiveness or clothing was not valid advice, and then, for reasons that are unknown to me, people seemed to think he was saying that was valid advice.

It always happens on "hot" topics. Say something against certain attacks on OWS and you're an OWS supporter. Critique some arguments against Ron Paul on purely academic grounds, and you're a Paul apologist. Meh.

533 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:30:39am

This will be the last thing I will say on the subject. I've done well over the last 15 years dealing with my violent nature, but if they ever do find the scum, I'm not sure I wouldn't look for a way to kill him.

534 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:30:57am

And I have the impression that either today's current subject or yesterday's heavy topic (honor killings) would be getting anything close to this treatment on the "old" LGF. Conniptions are being had somewhere.

I'm generally staying clear since I have little to add. Sexual assault is a very touchy cultural subject. And it has mainly been treated more as a property crime against the male "owners" than a crime against the female herself for a great deal of our history. And a lot of gray involved as well since the false accusation has some cultural traction going back into the Greek myths even.

535 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:31:39am

re: #530 Gus 802

[Link: www.armenianweekly.com...]

What a douche.

536 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:32:33am

re: #525 b_sharp

There was a reason I was sincerely glad that my daughter told me about what happened to her. Because as we discussed it; I had the sinking feeling that she thought she'd be able defend herself against any potential rapist.

I told her that many men would've simply killed her after she hurt them.

537 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:32:41am

re: #533 b_sharp

This will be the last thing I will say on the subject. I've done well over the last 15 years dealing with my violent nature, but if they ever do find the scum, I'm not sure I wouldn't look for a way to kill him.

Learn his travel routes and pick an out of the way place with no cameras.

538 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:33:10am

re: #526 Obdicut

But we never got around to discussing what might be valid advice. Sergey said, very clearly, that attractiveness or clothing was not valid advice, and then, for reasons that are unknown to me, people seemed to think he was saying that was valid advice.

And saying not to date known date-rapists is actually rather edgy advice, I'm sorry to say. Especially since date-rapists tend to be very good at the victimhood act, getting a girl to believe his ex was just vindictive, etc.

Well, that's part of the problem. There really isn't a lot of good advice on how to prevent rape, simply due to the fact that so much of it happens in situations that, in theory, should seem safe. So much of the advice applies to trying to avoid rape by a stranger, but that's only a small fraction of rape and even if it works, it doesn't really protect you very well from rape in general.

539 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:33:15am

re: #528 McSpiff


Oh, I had anger issues. Thus the hitting stuff. I used to be very violent and get into fights. Then I started taking organized violence classes-- jujitsu and then boxing/kickboxing, and got control of my rage.

But yeah, a good way to permanently fall out of my good graces is calling a girl a slut or talking about her in any sort of predatory fashion. It just makes me completely cold.

The bonus part of this was that it made me prefer female friends to male friends, and so I learned a hell of a lot about women that I probably wouldn't have otherwise, which came in handy later.

540 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:33:17am

re: #510 Gus 802

Moonbat leader Level II suggests the following:

Vote Against Obama in Iowa
Cenk Uygur

Found by way of:

@JeffersonObama C Gauvin
The Greenwald-Hamsher-Moore-Uygur CATO Assault has Begun on Dems: Cenk Uygur.: Vote Against Obama [Link: t.co...] 3p2

I quick scroll through the comments shows some variety of opinion but plenty of people seem content to turn on Obama. Liberals are losing their shit and it's going to cost Obama votes, I'm still hoping it doesn't cost him the election.

541 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:34:28am

re: #530 Gus 802

[Link: www.armenianweekly.com...]

Ah, thanks.

542 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:34:46am

I need some comfort. My brother came down from Toontown last night and shocked me to the core by admitting he's a conspiracy nut and a Ron Paul supporter. We argued into the wee hours of the night.

The world has turned inside out!

543 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:35:46am

re: #530 Gus 802

Interesting.

[Link: www.theyoungturks.com...]

544 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:35:51am

re: #540 Killgore Trout

Cenk Uygur used to be very conservative. A lot of his stuff is just the zeal of the convert. I don't think he actually swings that much weight, and even in that article he's careful to say that this wouldn't affect Obama's chances of getting elected.

545 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:35:57am

Junk Uygar

546 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:35:58am

re: #540 Killgore Trout

I quick scroll through the comments shows some variety of opinion but plenty of people seem content to turn on Obama. Liberals are losing their shit and it's going to cost Obama votes, I'm still hoping it doesn't cost him the election.

Yep. Emoprogs, Puritopians Firebaggers, Paulbots, Bradley Manning fans, Julian Assange fans, Wikileaks fans, Libertarians...

547 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:36:36am

re: #540 Killgore Trout

I quick scroll through the comments shows some variety of opinion but plenty of people seem content to turn on Obama. Liberals are losing their shit and it's going to cost Obama votes, I'm still hoping it doesn't cost him the election.

I assume that, when push comes to shove, most will hold their noses and vote for Obama over the alternative. Will just need to yell 2000! at them.

548 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:36:38am

re: #543 Sergey Romanov

Interesting.

[Link: www.theyoungturks.com...]

Yeah, I saw some of that. Fine. He's still a douche. I don't want to complicate matter too much here this morning. A useless loudmouth hack.

549 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:36:40am

re: #542 b_sharp

I need some comfort. My brother came down from Toontown last night and shocked me to the core by admitting he's a conspiracy nut and a Ron Paul supporter. We argued into the wee hours of the night.

The world has turned inside out!

Hmm, you'd think someone would have opened a rehabilitation clinic specializing in that by now. Must be enough of them around to support a business.
//

550 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:37:13am

re: #548 Gus 802

Hey, I'm agreeing with you.

551 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:37:38am

re: #549 oaktree

Hmm, you'd think someone would have opened a rehabilitation clinic specializing in that by now. Must be enough of them around to support a business.
//

Only works if they want to be rehabilitated.

552 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:37:39am

re: #550 Sergey Romanov

Hey, I'm agreeing with you.

I know. I think. Let me check again... ;)

553 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:38:25am

re: #544 Obdicut

Cenk Uygur used to be very conservative. A lot of his stuff is just the zeal of the convert. I don't think he actually swings that much weight, and even in that article he's careful to say that this wouldn't affect Obama's chances of getting elected.

Now, now, don't go confusing him with facts that don't fit his preconceptions.

554 McSpiff  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:38:37am

re: #539 Obdicut

That's one reason I've re-joined a gym. Nothing puts me into a more docile state than pushing around weights. But maybe some organized violence isn't a bad idea either.

555 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:39:05am

re: #549 oaktree

Hmm, you'd think someone would have opened a rehabilitation clinic specializing in that by now. Must be enough of them around to support a business.
//

Wow, Ron Paul deprogramming. What would it consist of? Probably lots of videos of people working together to accomplish great things and tons of team exercises, until they get the whole "Humans help other humans" thing.

556 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:39:16am

re: #546 Gus 802

Yep. Emoprogs, Puritopians Firebaggers, Paulbots, Bradley Manning fans, Julian Assange fans, Wikileaks fans, Libertarians...

It's also moslty based on dishonest bullshit. Indefinate detention of American Citizens and Maddow's bogus claim that diplomatic solutions with Iran have been outlawed. Liberals are being fed a load of shit and they're unquestionably swallowing it. It didn't work out well for the wingnuts and it's not going to go any better for the moonbats. It's frustrating to watch.

557 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:39:44am

re: #554 McSpiff

Just don't spar, because it turns out being hit in the head repeatedly isn't good for you.

558 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:39:59am

Interesting that Uygur relies on Bernard Lewis:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

One can be a "respectable" denier, it seems.

559 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:40:01am

re: #555 Obdicut

Wow, Ron Paul deprogramming. What would it consist of? Probably lots of videos of people working together to accomplish great things and tons of team exercises, until they get the whole "Humans help other humans" thing.

Marching band.

560 McSpiff  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:40:08am

re: #556 Killgore Trout

It's also moslty based on dishonest bullshit. Indefinate detention of American Citizens and Maddow's bogus claim that diplomatic solutions with Iran have been outlawed. Liberals are being fed a load of shit and they're unquestionably swallowing it. It didn't work out well for the wingnuts and it's not going to go any better for the moonbats. It's frustrating to watch.

I see you've been reading /r/worldnews too..

561 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:40:31am

re: #554 McSpiff

That's one reason I've re-joined a gym. Nothing puts me into a more docile state than pushing around weights. But maybe some organized violence isn't a bad idea either.

bully!

562 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:40:35am

re: #556 Killgore Trout

So far, it's comparing a rivulet to a torrent, though.

563 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:40:54am

re: #554 McSpiff

That's one reason I've re-joined a gym. Nothing puts me into a more docile state than pushing around weights. But maybe some organized violence isn't a bad idea either.

May be talking this too literally, but martial arts help because they focus on calm and control, rather than lashing out.

564 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:42:09am

re: #555 Obdicut

Wow, Ron Paul deprogramming. What would it consist of? Probably lots of videos of people working together to accomplish great things and tons of team exercises, until they get the whole "Humans help other humans" thing.

They tried wilderness survival training. But it wasn't supervised closely enough and thus had troubles with cannibalism breaking out.
///

565 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:43:21am

re: #554 McSpiff

pushing around weights

Having friends over for dinner later

We're going to be doing 12 ounce curls!

566 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:43:46am

re: #558 Sergey Romanov

I'm not all that familiar with the events of the Armenian genocide. From what you've read of Uygur's views on it, does he classify as a denier?

567 McSpiff  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:44:12am

re: #563 Simply Sarah

May be talking this too literally, but martial arts help because they focus on calm and control, rather than lashing out.

Same idea really. If you're keeping yourself at the edge of your capacity, you're much focused on making controlled movements, when you're breathing, how you're holding your core, etc. That same level of control, and I think the calm naturally flows from that.

568 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:44:26am

re: #557 Obdicut

Just don't spar, because it turns out being hit in the head repeatedly isn't good for you.

What?
Does it cause ringing in the ears and random short term memory lo


What?

569 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:45:47am

re: #566 Obdicut

I'm not all that familiar with the events of the Armenian genocide. From what you've read of Uygur's views on it, does he classify as a denier?

He was a denier alright. Whether he is now I've no idea.

570 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:46:38am

re: #568 b_sharp

What?
Does it cause ringing in the ears and random short term memory lo


What?

If you answer the phone once in a while the ringing in your ears might stop!
/

571 Obdicut  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:47:00am

re: #569 Sergey Romanov

He was a denier alright. Whether he is now I've no idea.

Sad to see. The letters are dated 8 years apart, so it's a position he held for awhile, at any rate.

572 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:47:28am

re: #568 b_sharp

What?
Does it cause ringing in the ears and random short term memory lo

What?

No worries

The pieces of cauliflower on each side of your head look fine!!

573 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:47:37am

I had a customer lecture me this morning about Sears closing Sears and KMart stores in historically poor performing areas. Said, "Sears needs to understand that people just don't have money in some areas."

The stupid? It burns.

574 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:48:08am

Cenk goes to bat for Ron Paul...

Ron Paul Doubles Down On War Stance

Youtube Video

Same old, same old rhetoric.

575 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:48:29am

Deniers of most stripes seem to be welcome on MSNBC. Some are allowed to host their own shows, while others serve as "political analysts".

576 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:48:35am

re: #573 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I had a customer lecture me this morning about Sears closing Sears and KMart stores in historically poor performing areas. Said, "Sears needs to understand that people just don't have money in some areas."

The stupid? It burns.

Seems to me as if I've read that somewhere before!!!
/

577 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:48:40am

re: #573 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I had a customer lecture me this morning about Sears closing Sears and KMart stores in historically poor performing areas. Said, "Sears needs to understand that people just don't have money in some areas."

The stupid? It burns.

I want my free shit. A nice tool box filled with all the goodies will work. Thanks.
/

578 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:48:57am

re: #573 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I had a customer lecture me this morning about Sears closing Sears and KMart stores in historically poor performing areas. Said, "Sears needs to understand that people just don't have money in some areas."

The stupid? It burns.

Sears waited too long to introduce NON-Sears brands into their stores. By the time they did, the Best Buys (electronics) Kohls (clothes) and stores like those had a grip on the "name brand" market

579 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:49:16am

re: #575 Winny Spencer

Deniers of most stripes seem to be welcome on MSNBC. Some are allowed to host their own shows, while others serve as "political analysts".

Balances out the truthers on fox.
/

580 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:49:19am

re: #575 Winny Spencer

Deniers of most stripes seem to be welcome on MSNBC. Some are allowed to host their own shows, while others serve as "political analysts".

He was kicked out last time I checked. Of course, deniers are also welcome among the Republican candidates.

581 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:49:23am

re: #572 sattv4u2

No worries

The pieces of cauliflower on each side of your head look fine!!

Damn it, I told them I wanted broccoli ears.

582 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:50:40am

re: #580 Sergey Romanov

He was kicked out last time I checked. Of course, deniers are also welcome among the Republican candidates.

Only because his ratings were in the basement, even by MSNBC-standards.

583 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:51:00am

re: #581 b_sharp

Damn it, I told them I wanted broccoli ears.

I hear children want ears of corn!

584 McSpiff  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:51:07am

And I just deleted my work email accounts off my phone. 'Oops'

585 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:51:15am

re: #583 sattv4u2

I hear children want ears of corn!

Oh geez.

586 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:51:50am

Let's see, most Republican candidates: evolution deniers, AGW deniers. Just for starters.

587 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:52:09am

re: #578 sattv4u2

Best Buy's in a world of hurt. They are referred to in retail circles as "Amazon.com's Showroom".

588 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:52:36am

re: #583 sattv4u2

I hear children want ears of corn!

Spoiled brats.

589 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:52:41am

re: #586 Sergey Romanov

Let's see, most Republican candidates: evolution deniers, AGW deniers. Just for starters.

MBF???

590 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:52:53am

re: #586 Sergey Romanov

Let's see, most Republican candidates: evolution deniers, AGW deniers. Just for starters,

Fracking causes small earthquakes and tapwater that catches on fire deniers.
Oil is fungible deniers.

591 kirkspencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:53:19am

re: #505 Obdicut

Everyone is a potential murderer of me, but that's not really going to affect how I treat them. Everyone's a potential thief, defrauder, libeler, etc. etc. So what?

If the phrase actually means "every man is capable of rape", then it's just obviously false.

Had to leave for a bit, and I'm going to have to do so again, but I want to interject on this point.

Obdi, 1 in 3 women will be the victim of sexual assualt or worse by the time they're 30. That's a statistical reality. In over 80% of the cases they will know the attacker -- over 50% of the time they'll have known them for at least a year and consider them friend or family.

1 in 3. Think about that on a gut level.

Now add that according to some studies (I'll find and link for you after I get home) sexual assaults and rapes are significantly under-reported, must less prosecuted.

"All men are potential rapists" is exactly the mentality needed to make it less likely. Sure, there are nuances and details, but that's the easiest one to memorize.

592 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:53:20am

re: #587 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Best Buy's in a world of hurt. They are referred to in retail circles as "Amazon.com's Showroom".

two words

Circuit City!

593 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:53:28am

re: #589 Winny Spencer

MBF???

You're saying it as if it's something bad.

594 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:53:59am

re: #590 Varek Raith

Fracking causes small earthquakes and tapwater that catches on fire deniers.
Oil is fungible deniers.

Next will be cabbage causes gas deniers.

595 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:54:02am

re: #578 sattv4u2

Sears waited too long to introduce NON-Sears brands into their stores. By the time they did, the Best Buys (electronics) Kohls (clothes) and stores like those had a grip on the "name brand" market

Well, another problem for Sears is that they're a chain that built its name on quality and service, if not always the cheapest prices. Right now, cheap throwaway shit is a big draw and the Sears model just doesn't fit it.

596 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:54:03am

re: #590 Varek Raith

"Fracking" sounds like a cartoon curse word.

597 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:54:31am

Actually...
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

598 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:54:46am

re: #595 Simply Sarah

Oh, hell yeah. No doubt about it.

599 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:55:19am

re: #592 sattv4u2

two words

Circuit City!

Radio Shack.

600 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:55:43am

re: #599 b_sharp

Radio Shack.

Pizza Hut!

601 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:55:49am

Breaking!

And boom!

Anti-Gay Hate Group Chair Is Now Ron Paul's Iowa State Director

602 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:56:00am

re: #597 Varek Raith

Actually...
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

I'll frak your flak.

603 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:56:07am

re: #599 b_sharp

Radio Shack.

Blockbuster!

604 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:57:10am

re: #600 Varek Raith

Pizza Hut!

Pineapple Pizza Hut.

605 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:58:17am

re: #603 Killgore Trout

Blockbuster!

Now called 'For Lease'.

606 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:58:35am

re: #604 b_sharp

Pineapple Pizza Hut.

STFU!!!
/

607 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:59:02am

re: #599 b_sharp

Radio Shack.

Yeah ,, but they're still open. How, I have no idea! Non of their big ticket items are competitive in price. All of their mid-range items are cheaply made (worse than very inexpensive throw-away stuff from a Wal Mart, lets say).

The only thing they have going for them (imho) is you can get small parts for things, and at a couple of bucks per part I don't know how they survive

608 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:59:25am

Ron Paul's Iowa chair:

Heath spent 14 years running the Christian Civic League of Maine (which has since changed its name). As a prominent figure in Maine, Heath slowly alienated the Christian right in the state with his extreme tactics. In 2004, for example, he launched a witch hunt to out gay members of the Maine legislature, asking supporters, according to the Portland Press Herald, to “e-​mail us tips, rumors, speculation and facts” regarding the sexual orientation of the state’s political leaders, adding, “We are, of course, most interested in the leaders among us who want to overturn marriage, eliminate the mother/​father family as the ideal, etc.” The result was that his own organization suspended him for a month.

“He’s a well-​known conspiracy theorist about the ‘gay agenda,’” says Travis Kennedy, chief of staff for the House Democratic Office in Maine, who says Heath was a big figure around the capital for many years. Heath made more enemies than friends, says Kennedy, whose “offensive and aggressive” tactics put off even his allies on the Christian right. In 2007, Heath played a big part in opposing a sexual orientation anti-​discrimination ballot measure which ultimately passed by a wide margin. On Heath’s new job in Iowa, Kennedy said, “I’m not surprised he’d be hired in a state far away from Maine. He has a pretty poor reputation around here.”

From 2008 – 2010, Heath served as chairman of the board of Americans for Truth About Homosexuality. AFTAH is a fringe, anti-​gay organization and has been listed as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center for promoting false information. For example, the organization and its founder, Peter LaBarbera, have published false reports about LGBT people, including allegations that they live shorter lives and that they are prone to pedophilia. LaBarbera disputes the SPLC’s label.

“Peter LaBarbera is among the most fringe elements of the anti-​gay industry in America today,” Michael Cole-​Schwartz, spokesman for the Human Rights Campaign, wrote in an email to TPM. “You’d be hard pressed to find another group that is so singularly focused on telling lies about LGBT Americans.”

It’s unclear if Ron Paul ascribes to some of Heath’s anti-​gay beliefs. Paul’s newsletters do contain several quotes smearing gay Americans as well as the AIDS epidemic. Recently, a disenchanted former Paul aide described an instance when Paul refused to use the bathroom of a gay supporter. But whatever Paul’s beliefs, Heath’s work on his campaign is another strike against a candidate with a history of associating with fringe elements of the right.

609 wilburs  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 9:59:26am

re: #601 Gus 802

Breaking!

And boom!

Anti-Gay Hate Group Chair Is Now Ron Paul's Iowa State Director

This guy is batshit...he was so crazy that he had to leave the state of Maine as he had just become a joke.

610 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:00:10am

re: #601 Gus 802

Breaking!

And boom!

Anti-Gay Hate Group Chair Is Now Ron Paul's Iowa State Director

But but but pot! and and and he's anti-war!.../

611 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:00:13am

re: #607 sattv4u2

Yeah ,, but they're still open. How, I have no idea! Non of their bog ticket items are competitive in price. All of their mid-range items are cheaply made (worse than very inexpensive throw-away stuff from a Wal Mart, lets say).

The only thing they have going for them (imho) is you can get small parts for things, and at a couple of bucks per part I don't know how they survive

They're also boring as hell now, since it seems most stores have way fewer parts and gizmos and way more products you could get at any electronics store or department.

612 kirkspencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:00:35am

re: #595 Simply Sarah

Well, another problem for Sears is that they're a chain that built its name on quality and service, if not always the cheapest prices. Right now, cheap throwaway shit is a big draw and the Sears model just doesn't fit it.

IMHO, what bit Sears is when it tried to continue claiming qulaity and service but ran with cheap throwaway shit. Kenmore machines started being crap (and getting Sears warranties honored something of a joke) starting about 20 years ago. I bought my last craftsman tool about 15 years ago when the screwdriver and both its subsequent replacements broke -- and I wasn't the only one noticing that decline.

My wife's description at the time was "K-mart quality at Penney's prices." You have no idea how we laughted when they picked up K-mart.

613 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:01:25am

re: #611 Simply Sarah

They're also boring as hell now, since it seems most stores have way fewer parts and gizmos and way more products you could get at any electronics store or department.

True. I haven't been in one for over a year, but I did notice that the last time I was there (to buy a small part, btw)

614 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:01:48am

Mike Heath...

Youtube Video

Abortion and gay rights!

615 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:02:25am

re: #612 kirkspencer

IMHO, what bit Sears is when it tried to continue claiming qulaity and service but ran with cheap throwaway shit. Kenmore machines started being crap (and getting Sears warranties honored something of a joke) starting about 20 years ago. I bought my last craftsman tool about 15 years ago when the screwdriver and both its subsequent replacements broke -- and I wasn't the only one noticing that decline.

My wife's description at the time was "K-mart quality at Penney's prices." You have no idea how we laughted when they picked up K-mart.

Yeah, I suppose that's true. They just haven't been able to admit it to themselves yet that such a model doesn't really work very well in the medium to long term.

616 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:02:58am

re: #608 Gus 802

Ron Paul's Iowa chair:

What a winner Ron has found here.

617 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:03:19am

re: #609 wilburs

This guy is batshit...he was so crazy that he had to leave the state of Maine as he had just become a joke.

Got any leads? I mean local newspaper stories?

618 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:04:03am

re: #607 sattv4u2

Yeah ,, but they're still open. How, I have no idea! Non of their big ticket items are competitive in price. All of their mid-range items are cheaply made (worse than very inexpensive throw-away stuff from a Wal Mart, lets say).

The only thing they have going for them (imho) is you can get small parts for things, and at a couple of bucks per part I don't know how they survive

I don't think there are any Radio Shacks left in Canada, which is where they started.

I used to get electronic parts there but now I get them off the web. The web has certainly changed how business is done.

619 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:04:28am

One thing that always bothered me about many libertarians is how many liberties they actually want to take away.

620 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:05:04am

I interrupt this thread to bring you a "Father of the Year" candidate.
Police: Man with three past DUIs drove drunk with kids in car
PINELLAS PARK — A man with three DUI convictions in his past was arrested on charges earlier this week that he drove impaired again and sped away from officers with two unrestrained children in the car.

Randy Schaub, 30, of Pinellas Park, is on felony probation and isn't allowed to drive. He has been convicted of DUI three times in the past 13 years and is considered a habitual traffic offender.
[Link: www.tampabay.com...]

621 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:05:58am

re: #591 kirkspencer

Had to leave for a bit, and I'm going to have to do so again, but I want to interject on this point.

Obdi, 1 in 3 women will be the victim of sexual assualt or worse by the time they're 30. That's a statistical reality. In over 80% of the cases they will know the attacker -- over 50% of the time they'll have known them for at least a year and consider them friend or family.

1 in 3. Think about that on a gut level.

Now add that according to some studies (I'll find and link for you after I get home) sexual assaults and rapes are significantly under-reported, must less prosecuted.

"All men are potential rapists" is exactly the mentality needed to make it less likely. Sure, there are nuances and details, but that's the easiest one to memorize.

Yes, exactly this! The numbers are horrifying, but they're (understating) reality. Everyone should be made to know this, women and men, since we can't stop rape without changing the thinking around it.

622 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:06:07am

re: #613 sattv4u2

True. I haven't been in one for over a year, but I did notice that the last time I was there (to buy a small part, btw)

One more small part to carry in your pants, eh?

623 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:06:35am

Another issue with Sears is that they went away from the stand-alone store to being an "anchor" store in malls. People don't go to malls to buy stoves and lawn mowers and power washers!

624 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:06:40am

re: #618 b_sharp

I don't think there are any Radio Shacks left in Canada, which is where they started.

I used to get electronic parts there but now I get them off the web. The web has certainly changed how business is done.

I thought Canadian Radio Shack was completely different from American Radio Shack?

625 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:06:54am

re: #622 b_sharp

One more small part to carry in your pants, eh?

That would make a total of ,, umm, ONE!

626 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:06:58am

re: #622 b_sharp

One more small part to carry in your pants, eh?

Satt doesn't wear pants.
/

627 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:07:17am

re: #624 Simply Sarah

I thought Canadian Radio Shack was completely different from American Radio Shack?

You're right

One was in Canada,, the other, not so much!!
/

628 McSpiff  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:07:21am

re: #618 b_sharp

I don't think there are any Radio Shacks left in Canada, which is where they started.

I used to get electronic parts there but now I get them off the web. The web has certainly changed how business is done.

They're all The Source now. Owned by Circuit City I believe.

629 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:07:26am

More from Mike Heath:

Wounds inflicted by sexual revolution can be healed

630 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:07:36am

Gays and Lesbians for Ron Paul

African Americans for Ron Paul 2012

631 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:08:02am

re: #619 Sergey Romanov

One thing that always bothered me about many libertarians is how many liberties they actually want to take away.

One thing that always bothered me about libertarians is their unquestioned faith in the goodness and power of the unfettered free market.

632 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:08:03am

re: #630 Winny Spencer

Gays and Lesbians for Ron Paul

African Americans for Ron Paul 2012

My brain! My brain!

Morons.

633 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:09:43am

re: #624 Simply Sarah

I thought Canadian Radio Shack was completely different from American Radio Shack?

Are they?

Like Smarties and M&Ms?

634 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:10:05am

re: #629 Gus 802

More from Mike Heath:

Wounds inflicted by sexual revolution can be healed

I really want to make a snarky comment, but all I'm able to do right now is just make various disgusted and distressed faces at my monitor.

635 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:10:18am

re: #626 Cannadian Club Akbar

Satt doesn't wear pants.
/

Oh right. In his frilly dress then.

636 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:10:39am

re: #607 sattv4u2

Even the CEO doesn't know why they're still around.

637 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:10:52am

re: #634 Simply Sarah

I really want to make a snarky comment, but all I'm able to do right now is just make various disgusted and distressed faces at my monitor.

Why,, what did your monitor do to deserve your disgusted and distressed face!?!?

638 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:11:05am

re: #630 Winny Spencer

And no less contradictory:

[Link: www.facebook.com...]

639 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:11:15am

re: #629 Gus 802

More from Mike Heath:

Wounds inflicted by sexual revolution can be healed

Damn, good work finding all the crazee on this guy.
:/

640 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:11:21am

re: #628 McSpiff

They're all The Source now. Owned by Circuit City I believe.

And they carry diddly electronic parts but lots of TVs.

641 Winny Spencer  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:12:02am

re: #638 Sergey Romanov

And no less contradictory:

[Link: www.facebook.com...]

One of the latest comments:

"nobody here actually has a jewish last name, lol."

Hah!

643 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:12:13am

re: #636 negativ

Even the CEO doesn't know why they're still around.

Ha!

644 sattv4u2  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:12:23am

And on that note,,,, have to go pick up the pooches from the groomers!

645 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:12:27am

Ron Paul's Iowa Chair continued...

Mike Heath “Exposes” His Self-Righteous Idiocy

Mike Heath of the Christian Civic League of Maine, rushing in an attempt to publicly libel and defame some nefarious homoseckshul deviant pervert, published this photo of someone’s car and license plate who hasn’t a damn thing to do with what he was supposedly “exposing”. (I blocked out the plate number, it’s been published enough.)

Continues.

646 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:12:30am

re: #632 Gus 802

My brain! My brain!

Morons.

Quick, drink some Koolaid.

647 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:13:03am

re: #633 b_sharp

Are they?

Like Smarties and M&Ms?

It was a different company spun off from Tandy back in the day operating in Canada with a license to use the RadioShack name, apparently.

648 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:13:13am

re: #629 Gus 802

More from Mike Heath:

Wounds inflicted by sexual revolution can be healed

Steps to experience momentary panic and/or side-splitting hilarity:
1) Hit F11 to make your browser full-screen
2) click the bizarrely overexposed photo of Michael Heath in the link above.

649 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:13:56am

re: #637 sattv4u2

Why,, what did your monitor do to deserve your disgusted and distressed face!?!?

It allowed me to see what Gus posted, obviously! And Gus isn't here for me to make faces at, so it's the next best option.

650 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:14:33am

Whew.

651 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:15:14am

RON PAUL

652 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:15:31am

Congratulations!

653 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:16:53am

re: #652 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Congratulations!

Fucking brilliant.

654 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:18:15am

re: #648 negativ

Steps to experience momentary panic and/or side-splitting hilarity:
1) Hit F11 to make your browser full-screen
2) click the bizarrely overexposed photo of Michael Heath in the link above.

Sorry, can't do it, I'm trying to cut down.

I am looking for information about healing wounds caused by reading gross stupidity though.

655 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:18:35am

Break time.:)

656 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:18:57am

re: #652 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Congratulations!

I don't know the 2nd guy in the 3rd column, yet I know Snooki. Am I damned for all time?

657 wilburs  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:19:28am

re: #617 Gus 802

Got any leads? I mean local newspaper stories?

[Link: www.pressherald.com...]

He started a" project" to out members of the state government that was so repulsive that even ardent Christianists had to distance themselves.

He also filed to run for Governor in 2010, but then withdrew, which is odd because he is no crazier then the nut who actually got elected.

Between the picture, and his never ending obsession with gayness, the closeted proclivity is pretty obvious.

658 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:20:09am

re: #652 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Congratulations!

On one side you have a bunch of dead people and on the other side you have a stupid person.

659 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:20:15am

re: #656 Sergey Romanov

I don't know the 2nd guy in the 3rd column, yet I know Snooki. Am I damned for all time?

I know who all of them are...
I'm screwed, aren't I???

660 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:20:29am

re: #656 Sergey Romanov

Who's Snooki?

661 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:20:45am

re: #656 Sergey Romanov

I don't know the 2nd guy in the 3rd column, yet I know Snooki. Am I damned for all time?

Same guy I didn't know.

662 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:21:28am

re: #661 b_sharp

Same guy I didn't know.

Thomas Paine

663 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:21:38am

re: #660 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Who's Snooki?

A pool snark.

664 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:21:43am

re: #660 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Who's Snooki?

The one with the retort. //

665 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:22:11am

re: #661 b_sharp

Same guy I didn't know.

Shame, shame on us!

666 funky chicken  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:22:44am

re: #21 Gus 802

Ron Paul scrubs endorsement from "gays should get the death penalty" pastor Rev. Phillip G. Kayser.

It's still in the Google cache though.

re: #629 Gus 802

More from Mike Heath:

Wounds inflicted by sexual revolution can be healed

His picture sent my gaydar off the chart. So, he's a tragic figure for me.

But wow.

667 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:22:52am

re: #662 negativ

Thomas Paine

Oh.

I don't know no Americans.

668 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:22:59am

And TBH, knowing Ayaan Hirsi Ali is not required. :/

669 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:23:12am

re: #662 negativ

That hurt.

670 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:23:41am

re: #668 Sergey Romanov

And TBH, knowing Ayaan Hirsi Ali is not required. :/

Yeah. I was kind of wondering what she was doing there.

671 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:24:02am

re: #668 Sergey Romanov

And TBH, knowing Ayaan Hirsi Ali is not required. :/

[Link: instantrimshot.com...]

672 funky chicken  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:24:57am

re: #601 Gus 802

Breaking!

And boom!

Anti-Gay Hate Group Chair Is Now Ron Paul's Iowa State Director

But Andrew Sullivan still loves him some Ron Paul. WTF?

673 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:25:02am

My cat is going ape shit.

I'll be posing from the bunker.

*Closes door*

Bunker secured.

674 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:25:27am

Guess that Mike Heath story came out yesterday. Nothing but crickets from the media regarding him or that "death penalty for gays" pastor. Just fluff pieces about Ron Paul fans getting a shave and a haircut. What a waste.

675 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:25:41am

re: #673 Varek Raith

I'll be posing from the bunker.

Show-off.

676 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:26:04am

re: #675 Sergey Romanov

Show-off.

Too sexy for you all.

677 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:26:31am

re: #674 Gus 802

Guess that Mike Heath story came out yesterday. Nothing but crickets from the media regarding him or that "death penalty for gays" pastor. Just fluff pieces about Ron Paul fans getting a shave and a haircut. What a waste.

I wonder what Sully thinks. I mean...

678 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:26:40am

re: #672 funky chicken

But Andrew Sullivan still loves him some Ron Paul. WTF?

Sullivan lost his marbles a long time ago.

679 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:26:40am

Also!
Too sexy to edit that typo.
:P

680 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:26:51am

re: #674 Gus 802

Guess that Mike Heath story came out yesterday. Nothing but crickets from the media regarding him or that "death penalty for gays" pastor. Just fluff pieces about Ron Paul fans getting a shave and a haircut. What a waste.

A waste, but not at all surprising, sadly.

681 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:27:10am

re: #675 Sergey Romanov

Show-off.

Please tell me he has more than just a moustache on.

682 funky chicken  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:27:13am

Oh hell. I got the 666 with a post about teh gheys and Ron Paul. LOL.

Ron Paul!

683 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:28:04am

re: #681 b_sharp

Please tell me he has more than just a moustache on.

At least it's bushy! //// I'll burn, won't I?

684 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:28:28am

re: #681 b_sharp

Please tell me he has more than just a moustache on.

Image: DS__Monsters___Lich_by_willowWISP.jpg

685 Varek Raith  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:30:02am

Tsunami debris spotted along West Coast

Ten months after a tsunami devastated parts of Japan, some of the island nation’s debris has washed up on North American shores, according to news reports.

On Vancouver Island, B.C., The Sun newspaper reported that wreckage from Japan began appearing this month. "In or around Dec. 5th the first item or two of some consequence was found," Tofino Mayor Perry Schmunk told the newspaper. "Some lumber came ashore that had Japanese export stamps on it."

Two weeks ago, CNN affiliate KIRO in Seattle showed video footage of what it said was debris from the March 11 tsunami - at least 10 Japanese buoys - on the Washington coast. “That’s about as good as the evidence gets for first arrivals,” retired oceanographer Curtis Ebbesmeyer told KIRO.

More reports of mundane Japanese items - such as bottles and toothbrushes - popping up along North American shores are beginning to emerge.

But that’s just the beginning, experts say.

686 funky chicken  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:32:21am

re: #540 Killgore Trout

I quick scroll through the comments shows some variety of opinion but plenty of people seem content to turn on Obama. Liberals are losing their shit and it's going to cost Obama votes, I'm still hoping it doesn't cost him the election.

Crazy liberals, maybe. There aren't enough of them to affect the election, IMHO. After the GOP horrorshow, folks are gonna vote for Obama in 2012.

687 jaunte  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:33:20am

Daniel Henninger at the WSJ thinks Romney had better suck up to the TPGOP fast, or he might be facing a third-party challenge.

The Ron Paul Vote
It has little to do with the Texas congressman.

688 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:34:19am

Some protesters are wondering why OWS can't be a little less rapey....
Occupy Boston: Where's the Empathy?

I have been sexually assaulted in my life. Moreover, I have a young daughter. I learned retroactively that people within Occupy Boston knew of the presence of a Level 3 sex offender (convicted for raping and abusing 2 different children) at the encampment and did not share that information until after the camp was torn down. My daughter had interactions with this person.
...
After recent events, where the Occupy Boston community was unwilling to withdraw support from a man who had been violent toward others and who threatened me while I was facilitating a General Assembly - causing me to announce over the microphone that I was not able to maintain the neutral role of facilitator because he had done so - I have no reason to trust that this community is concerned about the physical and emotional well-being of it's members. They may talk about concern, but they don't enact care.

689 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:36:08am

re: #686 funky chicken

Crazy liberals, maybe. There aren't enough of them to affect the election, IMHO. After the GOP horrorshow, folks are gonna vote for Obama in 2012.

Yeah. I think firebaggers have already been a minority. And even someone as far left and annoying as Uygur doesn't want Obama to lose.

690 funky chicken  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:37:20am

re: #497 wilburs

Kelly Clarkson endorses Ron Paul!!!

[Link: www.whosay.com...]

WTF? These people are idiots. What could possibly attract anybody to this lunatic? I just have to assume they are stupid and pay no attention to anything outside of entertainment venues.

691 wilburs  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:38:31am

re: #687 jaunte

Daniel Henninger at the WSJ thinks Romney had better suck up to the TPGOP fast, or he might be facing a third-party challenge.

The Ron Paul Vote
It has little to do with the Texas congressman.

It's funny that the writer boasts about the tea party gains at the state level in 2010, but doesn't mention anything about the unprecedented buyers remorse amongst voters who elected these tea party supported governors.

This is the most under reported story of the year.

692 lawhawk  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:40:24am

re: #612 kirkspencer

Indeed. Kenmore is now a brand name stuck on machines made by others (whether it's Whirlpool or others under contract depends on the appliance in question). The K-Mart acquisition hurt them on image and quality and they have gone down market.

But customer service is the worst part of all. They have 20 people circling like vultures in their appliance departments, but few know what they need to do in order to complete the sale, and that's overhead they can ill afford. The only thing Sears has over the likes of HD, Lowes, or online, is that those Kenmore appliances (like fridges) still have pretty good quality and you can't get them anywhere but Sears (or K-mart).

And with the real estate market meltdown and ongoing economic conditions, durable goods sales are still down, meaning that they can't generate the profits the company needs.

The only bright spot for Sears these days is the in-store sales of Lands End. Everything else is down, and quality of goods, including Craftsman is down as you say.

693 wilburs  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:40:41am

re: #690 funky chicken

WTF? These people are idiots. What could possibly attract anybody to this lunatic? I just have to assume they are stupid and pay no attention to anything outside of entertainment venues.

I find Paul bots have one trait in common...they have no knowledge about or interest in public policy. They are about the freedomz.

694 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:41:16am

re: #690 funky chicken

WTF? These people are idiots. What could possibly attract anybody to this lunatic? I just have to assume they are stupid and pay no attention to anything outside of entertainment venues.

My younger brother loves Ron Paul and is definitely not stupid. However he does look to be highly suggestible, as he unquestioningly trusts naturopaths.

695 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:41:54am

Oh whaddaya know, Sully did weigh in on the issue:

Agreed. The attempt by the left and the neocon right to make Paul out to be the real bigot in this race is gob-smacking. Maybe one reason the gays are not so upset is because they have a better idea of what is threatening to them than Dave Weigel. (The exception is Jamie Kirchick, but he is as motivated by Israeli issues as gay ones). But Jim Burroway complicates the story:[...]

Keep trying. But remind me: which of all the candidates has refused to sign the anti-gay Marriage Pledge? Ah, yes, the real homophobe of the bunch.

Here's the clue: nobody forces you to endorse any of these nuts.

696 sagehen  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:44:50am

re: #596 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

"Fracking" sounds like a cartoon curse word.

Battlestar Galactica is not a cartoon.

697 lawhawk  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:45:15am

re: #696 sagehen

Battlestar Galactica is not a cartoon.

The frell you say. /Your text to link...

698 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:47:50am

re: #688 Killgore Trout

Some protesters are wondering why OWS can't be a little less rapey...
Occupy Boston: Where's the Empathy?

Misogyny by any other name.

699 wilburs  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:48:01am

Does anyone give a crap about Karl Rove's 2012 predictions?

[Link: online.wsj.com...]

I don't see Mitt Romney as our newly elected President among them.

700 BishopX  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:48:31am

re: #692 lawhawk

I have a friend who works as a cashier at sears. Their entire performance evaluation consists of how many people they can get to apply for a sears credit card. It's hell.

701 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:52:06am

re: #694 b_sharp

My younger brother loves Ron Paul and is definitely not stupid. However he does look to be highly suggestible, as he unquestioningly trusts naturopaths.

Homeopathy and healing rocks?

702 Killgore Trout  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:52:55am

re: #698 Gus 802

Misogyny by any other name.

She mentions misogyny but I don't think that's the problem. Protesters were just concerned with protecting their image and furthering their cause instead of cleaning house and protecting the safety of their fellow protesters. It was a callous decision made by a lot of the OWS camps to not report rapes or violence to the police because of the bad publicity. Many seem to think it was more important to protect the image of the movement rather than the victims of assault or rape.

703 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:55:39am

re: #699 wilburs

Does anyone give a crap about Karl Rove's 2012 predictions?

[Link: online.wsj.com...]

I don't see Mitt Romney as our newly elected President among them.

Karl who?

704 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:57:47am

re: #702 Killgore Trout

She mentions misogyny but I don't think that's the problem. Protesters were just concerned with protecting their image and furthering their cause instead of cleaning house and protecting the safety of their fellow protesters. It was a callous decision made by a lot of the OWS camps to not report rapes or violence to the police because of the bad publicity. Many seem to think it was more important to protect the image of the movement rather than the victims of assault or rape.

Well, it comes easy to them obviously and a handy device to meet their propaganda needs. To be honest I'm not surprised to see this kind of behavior from the left. And I will repeat here again that I am through with those "occupy" scoundrels.

705 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:58:08am

re: #698 Gus 802

Misogyny by any other name.

Well, the specific example given at the start seems to be talking about a child abuser, so that particular example might be a bit broader. Didn't read the whole thing to see if it went into rapists and such in general.

706 b_sharp  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 10:58:15am

re: #701 Gus 802

Homeopathy and healing rocks?

Not that far yet, more 'live food', 'living water', 'toxin repair'.

707 Simply Sarah  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 11:01:27am

re: #704 Gus 802

Well, it comes easy to them obviously and a handy device to meet their propaganda needs. To be honest I'm not surprised to see this kind of behavior from the left. And I will repeat here again that I am through with those "occupy" scoundrels.

Oh sure. The left isn't immune to "forgiving" people they're in no place to forgive should it feel that doing so will help advance its causes.

708 wilburs  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 11:02:01am

re: #703 b_sharp

Karl who?

Maybe you know him by his Free republic nick

"Tokyo Rove"

709 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 11:05:11am

re: #702 Killgore Trout

She mentions misogyny but I don't think that's the problem. Protesters were just concerned with protecting their image and furthering their cause instead of cleaning house and protecting the safety of their fellow protesters. It was a callous decision made by a lot of the OWS camps to not report rapes or violence to the police because of the bad publicity. Many seem to think it was more important to protect the image of the movement rather than the victims of assault or rape.

Remember the response to the rape allegations on Julian Assange? Also look at who their heroes are of the year for the fringe element: Julian Assange, Cenk Uygur, Bradley Manning, Glenn Greenwald, Ron Paul, etc. There is a pattern here obviously.

710 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 11:05:56am

re: #688 Killgore Trout

The consequences of refusing to govern themselves could well wreck the whole thing. There have to be folks responsible for certain things in every community.

711 Gus  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 11:08:31am

There it is again. More crap about GoDaddy on Twitter... yawn.

712 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 11:58:05am

I gave up on Sears over a decade go. Bought a bike rack for my car that was missing a part and also ill-cut (a bolt hole was off by about 1/4"). And then got massively dragged through the ringer trying to return it even though I had the receipt and had bought it the day before. Apparently simply opening the box had removed any requirement they had regarding customer service.

713 funky chicken  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:25:12pm

re: #693 wilburs

I find Paul bots have one trait in common...they have no knowledge about or interest in public policy. They are about the freedomz.

Freedom to what? Suffer for years in the aftermath of a natural disaster because the federal government no longer helps to rebuild?

Freedom to buy tainted milk and BS "medications" that do nothing?

Freedom to have vaccines produced without inspections?

Freedom to not terminate any unplanned pregnancy, ever?

714 funky chicken  Thu, Dec 29, 2011 12:27:19pm

re: #712 oaktree

I gave up on Sears over a decade go. Bought a bike rack for my car that was missing a part and also ill-cut (a bolt hole was off by about 1/4"). And then got massively dragged through the ringer trying to return it even though I had the receipt and had bought it the day before. Apparently simply opening the box had removed any requirement they had regarding customer service.

It's a shame, because it used to be the best place for appliances and tools. Now they just sell crap ... and thought they would save themselves by joining forces with the Kardashians to market hooker-wear.

I guess that shows the company's opinion of the American consumer.


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