Rick Perry Doubles Down, Calls Leaders of Turkey ‘Islamic Terrorists’ Again

Ignorant and proud of it
Politics • Views: 37,784

One of the many freakishly over the top moments in last night’s Fox News GOP debate was Rick Perry’s claim that Turkey is “run by Islamic terrorists.”

After I picked my jaw up off the floor, I realized that he probably has a vague awareness of Turkey’s struggles with secularism and radical Islam, but his caveman’s brain reduced it down to “Turkey = Islamic terrorists.” This is the kind of thing that, in any other election, a candidate would “clarify” the next day (read: backpedal furiously) after consulting with advisers.

But this year, Rick Perry just goes right ahead and doubles down on that mind-bending idiocy, and also manages to accuse Wolf Blitzer of “defending honor killings.”

Today’s GOP: ignorant, bigoted, and proud of it.

Youtube Video

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511 comments
1 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:02:51pm

Rick, you ignorant slut

2 Romantic Heretic  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:04:18pm

Sad that such an ignorant putz could be considered a Presidential candidate.

3 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:05:27pm

This is that point in the play where everybody gives a silent prayer in thanks to the deity of their choice that this man's chance at becoming president are lower than his IQ.

4 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:05:28pm

In happier news, it looks like Scott Walker won't be in charge that much longer, I'll enjoy seeing him given the boot, as much as democracy may upset you at times, there is nothing sweeter than watching it self correct!

5 blueraven  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:08:38pm

I am so sick of this creepy man. He has been my Governor for over a decade. I hope to hell Texans that keep voting for him can see what a dimwit he is, now that he has been forced to debate.

He has always had much more money than his opponents, ran scathing ads but never, ever debated any of them. He is an embarrassment.

6 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:08:41pm

Perry seems to think the government of Turkey is perpetrating honor killings against its citizens, and Wolf Blitzer digs it.

7 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:09:43pm

re: #4 jamesfirecat

In happier news, it looks like Scott Walker won't be in charge that much longer, I'll enjoy seeing him given the boot, as much as democracy may upset you at times, there is nothing sweeter than watching it self correct!

Personally, I'm getting a kick out of all the conservatives who spoke at length about the wondrous thing that was recall elections and how democratic it was that the people could get rid of politicians who they felt had failed miserably at their jobs when it all applied to Gray Davis...and whinge themselves inside out at how "expensive" and "undemocratic" it is to recall Scott Walker and his cronies in the legislature.

8 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:10:29pm

re: #7 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Personally, I'm getting a kick out of all the conservatives who spoke at length about the wondrous think that was recall elections and how democratic it was that the people could get rid of politicians who they felt had failed miserably at their jobs when it all applied to Gray Davis...and whinge themselves inside out at how "expensive" and "undemocratic" it is to recall Scott Walker and his cronies in the legislature.

Yep good times. And goddamn is Rick Perry one ignorant dumbass.

9 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:11:23pm

There's an amazing amount of stoopit packed into this 1:27 video clip.

10 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:11:46pm

re: #7 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Personally, I'm getting a kick out of all the conservatives who spoke at length about the wondrous thing that was recall elections and how democratic it was that the people could get rid of politicians who they felt had failed miserably at their jobs when it all applied to Gray Davis...and whinge themselves inside out at how "expensive" and "undemocratic" it is to recall Scott Walker and his cronies in the legislature.

Honestly I was just impressed by how much of LGF (Charles included) rose to sing their support of the Unions and wanting to see Scot Walker shown the door.


Solidarity Forever!

11 jaunte  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:12:03pm

re: #9 Charles

"Winning!"

12 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:12:10pm

re: #9 Charles

There's an amazing amount of stoopit packed into this 1:27 video clip.

But does it end with "OOPS" like the "Dope Diamond" clip of him at the debate?

13 Atlas Fails  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:12:36pm

Republicans: embarrassing the U.S. on the international stage since 2001!

14 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:12:58pm

re: #10 jamesfirecat

Honestly I was just impressed by how much of LGF (Charles included) rose to sing their support of the Unions and wanting to see Scot Walker shown the door.

Solidarity Forever!

Of course, always happy to defend the right to organize.

15 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:13:40pm

Maybe he's been reading about Pam Geller's terror turkeys and got confused.

16 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:13:58pm

I'm surprised he knew Turkey was a good country not just delicious

17 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:15:08pm

re: #13 Atlas Fails

Republicans: embarrassing the U.S. on the international stage since 2001!

Like I was saying last night, you gotta feel sorry for the State Department these last six or so months, no doubt making phone calls after every debate to our allies and assuring them that the fruitloops running for the GOP nomination do not speak for this administration.

18 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:15:54pm

And we are listening to an Alcoholic Nut, why?

19 jaunte  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:17:36pm

Turkey, State Department blast Rick Perry's 'Islamic terrorist' remarks

State Department spokesman Mark Toner was asked at his daily briefing about whether the U.S. considered the Turkish government to be populated by “Islamic terrorists.”

“We absolutely and fundamentally disagree with that assertion. You know, Turkey, as I said, is a -- is a strong partner in the region. We've seen it make a very courageous stand against what's going on in Syria, for example. It continues to play a very positive and constructive role in the region. And it is often cited -- an example of a so-called Islamic democracy in action,” Toner said.

“Turkey is one of the oldest members of NATO and it's been a stalwart member of NATO and a strong ally to the United States. And, you know, we stand by our relationship,” Toner said.

Turkey’s ambassador to the United States, Namik Tan, released a statement expressing his disappointment with Perry’s criticism, which he termed “misplaced” and “ill-advised.”

20 Atlas Fails  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:17:44pm

lol, watching 1/2 Gov. Palin on Hannity right now. "Man wuz made 2 wurk, Sean, and this president doesn't realize this! TEH FOOD STAMP PRESIDENT!!1"

I'm still kinda bummed she didn't throw her hat into the circus ring.

21 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:17:52pm

re: #18 ProLifeLiberal

And we are listening to an Alcoholic Nut, why?

"So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself."

22 Olsonist  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:17:57pm

re: #7 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Gray Davis. He'd just been re-elected but Darrel Issa saw a window of opportunity in the energy crisis (Enron) and went for it. And then Issa got steamrolled by Arnold.

My chief complaint with Davis was that he was a tool of the prison guards union. He wasn't a terrible governor rather he wanted to finish his long career as governor. It kind of started as Chief of Staff for Gerry Brown and it ended as governor, the pinnacle if not the cursus honorem.

23 Randall Gross  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:18:30pm

No surprise - this is from the party that last cycle gave us the "Nuke Mecca" candidate, Tom Tancredo during their primaries.

24 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:19:44pm

re: #20 Atlas Fails

lol, watching 1/2 Gov. Palin on Hannity right now. "Man wuz made 2 wurk, Sean, and this president doesn't realize this! TEH FOOD STAMP PRESIDENT!!1

I'm still kinda bummed she didn't throw her hat into the circus ring.

Half Term Governor doesn't realize most people on food stamps are poor children. Yeah it's too bad she didn't run so we gradually begin the getting rid of her.

25 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:20:18pm

So what this tells me is that there are enough stupid Texans in Texas that this guy keeps getting elected

26 Sheila Broflovski  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:20:34pm

I think Rick Perry got Pamela's Butterball outrage mixed up.

27 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:21:33pm

Speaking of ignorant twits

Geert Wilders Says There's No Such Thing as Moderate Islam

28 Randall Gross  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:21:39pm

You have double caps in RIck.

29 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:21:41pm

re: #21 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And an alcoholic is prone to blasting himself more than blasting an enemy.

Seriously, this is a nut who appeared at a campaign stop drunk earlier.

30 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:22:28pm

re: #28 Thanos

Arigato.

31 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:22:50pm

You walk into study hall. There are fifteen students. Twelve are misbehaving while three are trying to do their homework.

You walk up to one that is trying to do his homework and yell at him for being a juvenile delinquent.

32 Atlas Fails  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:23:16pm

re: #24 HappyWarrior

Half Term Governor doesn't realize most people on food stamps are poor children. Yeah it's too bad she didn't run so we gradually begin the getting rid of her.

But there's more poor children now than when Obama took office! Pay no attention to the then-plummeting economy that has been slowly rebounding since, these are FACTS!!1

Ooh goody, they'll be raging over the Newsweek nontroversy after the commercial. Should be comedy gold.

33 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:23:19pm

re: #27 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

He's always said that.

He also said that Norway could have prevented Utoya by bashing Muslims more. Combined with the Netherlands responding to the attack via Twitter statement, Norway (and the Nordic Nations at large) have very chilly relations with the Dutch right now.

34 nines09  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:23:31pm

Un-freaking-believable. This must be what non-stop debates do to a fragile mind. He forgot where he was and who he was talking to and let some more of him ooze out. What a load. What a load.

35 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:28:18pm

Heard on CNN tonight that Turkey is stunned that we have someone running who doesn't even know who our allies are.

...his hair is as laughable as the Donald's, BTW.

36 Randall Gross  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:29:34pm

re: #30 Charles

Arigato.

どう致しまして

37 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:29:51pm

re: #34 nines09

Un-freaking-believable. This must be what non-stop debates do to a fragile mind. He forgot where he was and who he was talking to and let some more of him ooze out. What a load. What a load.

So if you drill a hole in him and let the sap run out, and then collect it, you can make Perry syrup?

38 Eclectic Infidel  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:29:52pm

I don't agree with Perry, and yet on the flip side of things...

Erdogan to Haniyeh: Talks must include Hamas

Palestinian sources said the meeting lasted two hours, during which the leaders agreed that a permanent solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict cannot be reached without involving Hamas in the negotiations.

According to reports, Haniyeh and Erdogan discussed the "The 'Jewfication' of Jerusalem, and the cruel attacks against its Arab residents."

And this is the same Hamas that has repeatedly admitted that it does not want peace, that it wants Israel destroyed.


Turkey does have some explaining to do.

39 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:30:32pm

re: #30 Charles

You just made me think of Styx's "Mr. Roboto".

I blame you.

40 aagcobb  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:31:44pm

re: #35 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Heard on CNN tonight that Turkey is stunned that we have someone running who doesn't even know who our allies are.

...his hair is as laughable as the Donald's, BTW.

Israel is our ally. All other nations are either godless commies, islamic terrorists or just scary dark people who want to come here and live off food stamps.

41 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:32:54pm

re: #40 aagcobb

Israel is our ally. All other nations are either godless commies, islamic terrorists or just scary dark people who want to come here and live off food stamps.

The godless commies can cook well, right?

42 Randall Gross  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:33:32pm

re: #39 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You just made me think of Styx's "Mr. Roboto".

I blame you.

Youtube Video
43 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:33:34pm

re: #39 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You just made me think of Styx's "Mr. Roboto".

I blame you.

Me too! Only I couldn't remember the band. Only the name Tommy Shaw.

44 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:34:21pm

re: #38 eclectic infidel

With Hamas distancing itself from Syria and Iran, they might soften to negotiation.

Israel will have to make some painful concessions, but if an idea similar to mine ever comes up, so will the Palestinians.

45 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:35:09pm

re: #41 EmmmieG

The godless commies can cook well, right?

Depends if you like pirohy, kolbasi, and cabbage. I love it.

46 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:35:21pm

re: #42 Thanos

[Video]

I should downding you for that.

:0

47 aagcobb  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:35:32pm

re: #41 EmmmieG

The godless commies can cook well, right?

The commie French and Chinese can. Not so much the commie Brits.

48 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:36:43pm

re: #43 ggt

Me too! Only I couldn't remember the band. Only the name Tommy Shaw.

How can you not remember Styx?

Youtube Video
49 Eclectic Infidel  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:37:26pm

re: #44 ProLifeLiberal

With Hamas distancing itself from Syria and Iran, they might soften to negotiation.

Israel will have to make some painful concessions, but if an idea similar to mine ever comes up, so will the Palestinians.

Well, Israel gave up the entire Gaza strip and Hamas has not ceased its rocket attacks.

50 Randall Gross  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:37:32pm

re: #46 ggt

Go ahead, I deserve it and my karma can stand it...

51 ElCapitanAmerica  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:37:56pm

Charles;

I don't think Wolf is "digging it", he seems dumbfounded by Perry's stupidity.

BTW, I have to admit, Perry had me doubting myself. When I heard him say this during the debate, I was so shocked I thought maybe I missed some type of overnight revolution I didn't read about in the news that happened in Turkey!

However, nobody is criticizing Bret Baier for his original question which made Turkey sound like it's ruled by the Taliban!

52 aagcobb  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:38:48pm

re: #48 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

How can you not remember Styx?

[Video]

Wow, I searched Mr. Roboto on youtube, and the sidebar looks like an MTV video lineup from 1985.

53 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:39:48pm

re: #49 eclectic infidel

Hamas to eventually lose Syrian support, and support from Iran much harder to get, they will be in a weaker position. This is advantageous to getting reasonable concessions.

54 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:39:49pm

re: #52 aagcobb

Wow, I searched Mr. Roboto on youtube, and the sidebar looks like an MTV video lineup from 1985.

I want my MTV!

/

55 prairiefire  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:40:30pm

re: #3 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

This is that point in the play where everybody gives a silent prayer in thanks to the deity of their choice that this man's chance at becoming president are lower than his IQ.

He is the favorite at Redstate.com.

56 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:40:46pm

I'm old enough to remember when MTV actually had music. Those were the days my children :D and yeah I know most of you all are older than me.

57 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:41:29pm

I'm amazed this guy was elected to anything let alone is the longest tenured governor in the country. He oozes ignorance.

58 prairiefire  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:41:39pm

re: #43 ggt

Me too! Only I couldn't remember the band. Only the name Tommy Shaw.

He was the blonde!

59 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:41:53pm

re: #48 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

How can you not remember Styx?

[Video]

old, tired brain

60 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:42:38pm

re: #52 aagcobb

Wow, I searched Mr. Roboto on youtube, and the sidebar looks like an MTV video lineup from 1985.

I know.

THat alone deserves a 2nd downding.!

:0

61 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:42:42pm

re: #57 HappyWarrior

I'm amazed this guy was elected to anything let alone is the longest tenured governor in the country. He oozes ignorance.

It helps when your state is so red, liberals are an endangered species.

62 aagcobb  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:42:42pm

re: #54 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I want my MTV!

/

Love me some Dire Straits.

Youtube Video
63 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:42:58pm

re: #54 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I want my MTV!

/

I thought that was actually a good song.

64 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:43:30pm

re: #56 HappyWarrior

I'm old enough to remember when MTV actually had music. Those were the days my children :D and yeah I know most of you all are older than me.

I was a freshman in college with MTV came on the air. WE thought it was the coolest thing EVAH!

65 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:44:15pm

re: #58 prairiefire

He was the blonde!

He finally got out of his contract and went with a real rock band (can't remember that name either). Dissed Styx on stage. Had to publically apologize.

66 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:45:07pm

re: #64 ggt

We must be about the same age.

67 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:45:38pm

you know what's great about Oregon's governor? he's a fucking doctor

suck it Texas, try electing someone who can tie his own shoes without help

68 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:45:42pm

re: #66 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

We must be about the same age.

How did your non-Murikan sales call go the other day?

69 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:45:55pm

re: #56 HappyWarrior

I'm old enough to remember when MTV actually had music. Those were the days my children :D and yeah I know most of you all are older than me.

I remember seeing Billie Jean run on MTV. And not as a novelty item--it was in heavy rotation.

70 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:46:34pm

Rick Perry is obviously risen as high as he's gonna get.

71 Atlas Fails  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:46:37pm

re: #67 WindUpBird

you know what's great about Oregon's governor? he's halted all executions in the state.

FTFY

72 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:47:07pm

re: #70 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Rick Perry is obviously risen as high as he's gonna get.

A living, breathing example of the Peter Principle in action.

73 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:47:40pm

re: #65 ggt

He finally got out of his contract and went with a real rock band (can't remember that name either). Dissed Styx on stage. Had to publically apologize.

are you referring to Damn Yankees, the hair-rock project of Ted Nugent?

I'll take Styx ;-)

74 Talking Point Detective  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:47:55pm

Yeah - the man's stoooopidity is astounding in magnitude, and that is downright hilarious - but on the other hand this is some serious shit when an American presidential candidate: (1) says dangerous shit on such a public forum. This kind of idiocy has geo-political implications and, (2) an American presidential candidate thinks that making such ignorant and inflammatory statements is politically expedient. Worse than his comments is the fact that he thinks those kinds of comments will win him votes from the Republican electorate.

Sad commentary.

75 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:48:04pm

re: #71 Atlas Fails

FTFY

he's done a lot of cool stuff! :D

76 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:48:28pm

re: #68 ggt

How did your non-Murikan sales call go the other day?

Oh, it was awful. Nobody around to translate. I was phoning a friend like a crazy person.

77 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:48:42pm

re: #69 EmmmieG

I remember seeing Billie Jean run on MTV. And not as a novelty item--it was in heavy rotation.

THey had a limited number of videos at the beginning. I think some record companies just re-edited stock performance footage and made a video of it at first.

Then a whole to facet of the industry strung up --jobs for dancers!

78 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:49:05pm

re: #69 EmmmieG

I remember seeing Billie Jean run on MTV. And not as a novelty item--it was in heavy rotation.

you already know what i used MTV for:

Youtube Video
79 Talking Point Detective  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:49:10pm

re: #74 Talking Point Detective

Boy - that editing feature comes in handy!!

80 MittDoesNotCompute  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:49:40pm

re: #30 Charles

Arigato.

Domo?

81 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:49:59pm

Have to wonder if MTV was a precursor to Youtube. . . .

82 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:50:28pm

re: #64 ggt

I was a freshman in college with MTV came on the air. WE thought it was the coolest thing EVAH!

It must have been. Gosh though technology evolution is amazing. I remember thinking the 40 GB iPod I won at my high school graduation party would last me for a long time. Ended up breaking it. Long story but my stupid temper. Now I have 2.5X music on my 160 GB iPod Classic. I also remember being eight years old thinking my best friend's sister's 6 track CD player was cutting edge tech. Gonna be amazing what they have down the road.

83 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:50:36pm

re: #77 ggt

THey had a limited number of videos at the beginning. I think some record companies just re-edited stock performance footage and made a video of it at first.

Then a whole to facet of the industry strung up --jobs for dancers!

And VJs, don't forget those.

84 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:50:40pm

re: #80 talon_262

Domo?

Gam sa ha ni da?

85 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:50:48pm

re: #80 talon_262

Domo?

STOP IT!

(I'm sailing away...)

86 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:51:37pm

re: #83 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And VJs, don't forget those.

Joan Jett hair!

Now they play Joan Jett on Musak in stores.

87 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:51:37pm

re: #82 HappyWarrior

It must have been. Gosh though technology evolution is amazing. I remember thinking the 40 GB iPod I won at my high school graduation party would last me for a long time. Ended up breaking it. Long story but my stupid temper. Now I have 2.5X music on my 160 GB iPod Classic. I also remember being eight years old thinking my best friend's sister's 6 track CD player was cutting edge tech. Gonna be amazing what they have down the road.

the next step is already here: streaming music services through smartphones

88 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:51:50pm

What's gonna be funny is the music of my youth being seen as oldies.
"Dad, we don't want to hear Biggy Smalls. God your old music sucks!"
"But kids he was a genius!"
Okay not a fan of Biggy in particular but you get the picture.

89 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:52:17pm

re: #65 ggt

He finally got out of his contract and went with a real rock band (can't remember that name either). Dissed Styx on stage. Had to publically apologize.

I believe unfortunately it was a band with Terrible Ted.

90 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:52:25pm

re: #87 WindUpBird

the next step is already here: streaming music services through smartphones

Smartphones are amazing. Had my iPhone 3G for three years and just got a Droid Bionic last month. I'm amazed.

91 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:52:34pm

THis was a good link from the Mr. Roboto side bar. IMHO

92 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:52:44pm

re: #82 HappyWarrior

It must have been. Gosh though technology evolution is amazing. I remember thinking the 40 GB iPod I won at my high school graduation party would last me for a long time. Ended up breaking it. Long story but my stupid temper. Now I have 2.5X music on my 160 GB iPod Classic. I also remember being eight years old thinking my best friend's sister's 6 track CD player was cutting edge tech. Gonna be amazing what they have down the road.

I remember when a portable CD player was something that you treated like it was gold-plated. Now? You can buy one for $10, but why do that when you can just buy an MP3 and carry your entire music collection in a device the size of a cigarette pack.

93 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:53:01pm

re: #88 HappyWarrior

What's gonna be funny is the music of my youth being seen as oldies.
"Dad, we don't want to hear Biggy Smalls. God your old music sucks!"
"But kids he was a genius!"
Okay not a fan of Biggy in particular but you get the picture.

My kids will have some song they like, and I refrain from mentioning that I listened to it as a teen.

Don't want to make it dorky.

94 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:53:04pm

re: #89 Stanley Sea

I believe unfortunately it was a band with Terrible Ted.

DAMN YANKEES

the big radio hit being High Enough

95 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:53:33pm

re: #92 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I remember when a portable CD player was something that you treated like it was gold-plated. Now? You can buy one for $10, but why do that when you can just buy an MP3 and carry your entire music collection in a device the size of a cigarette pack.

And drop into the toilet and lose $500 worth of songs.

Just saying.

96 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:53:46pm

re: #88 HappyWarrior

What's gonna be funny is the music of my youth being seen as oldies.
"Dad, we don't want to hear Biggy Smalls. God your old music sucks!"
"But kids he was a genius!"
Okay not a fan of Biggy in particular but you get the picture.

"And this picture is Granny on the night she got her tramp stamp."

97 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:54:05pm

re: #92 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I remember when a portable CD player was something that you treated like it was gold-plated. Now? You can buy one for $10, but why do that when you can just buy an MP3 and carry your entire music collection in a device the size of a cigarette pack.

I think we are all going to have ocular implants as an option in the near future. With a ipod type device on our wrist to control it.

98 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:54:29pm

re: #78 WindUpBird

you already know what i used MTV for:

[Video]

We threw a wake when they cancelled HB...such sorrow.

Well, an Irish wake...we mourned and there was booze and stuff.

99 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:55:02pm

re: #88 HappyWarrior

What's gonna be funny is the music of my youth being seen as oldies.
"Dad, we don't want to hear Biggy Smalls. God your old music sucks!"
"But kids he was a genius!"
Okay not a fan of Biggy in particular but you get the picture.

They remarked on that a couple seasons back on Top Gear, about how people in their 40s and 50s now are hearing groups like The Ramones, The Clash, The Sex Pistols, and others on "oldies" stations.

God, I hate to think of the day when Linkin Park is considered "oldies."

100 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:55:06pm

re: #96 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"And this picture is Granny on the night she got her tramp stamp."

"This is Grandpa the night he drank 40 loco with the Situation."
"Grandma, What's the Situation?"
"It was a different time, dear, a different time."

101 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:55:14pm

ANd what do I choose to play on Sirius in the car?

Met Opera

102 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:55:24pm

re: #95 EmmmieG

And drop into the toilet and lose $500 worth of songs.

Just saying.

there are these things called "computers" that contain "4 terabyte hard drives" which we use to "back up" our "mp3s" :D

and our .oggs and .flacs and lossless codec audiophile argument about lossy encoding dynamic range blah blah

103 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:55:29pm

re: #94 WindUpBird

DAMN YANKEES

the big radio hit being High Enough

Had a laugh the other day at work. One of our clients is on High Bluff, Suite 420.

for real.

104 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:55:37pm

re: #99 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

They remarked on that a couple seasons back on Top Gear, about how people in their 40s and 50s now are hearing groups like The Ramones, The Clash, The Sex Pistols, and others on "oldies" stations.

God, I hate to think of the day when Linkin Park is considered "oldies."

Yeah my first cousins who are pretty much all Gen Xers are feeling that and it's weirding them out.

105 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:56:32pm

Sitting here listening to Johnny Cash's Hurt, and wondering why some legends lose their edge at the end, and some use all they have learned to become the very best at the end.

106 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:56:42pm

re: #99 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

They remarked on that a couple seasons back on Top Gear, about how people in their 40s and 50s now are hearing groups like The Ramones, The Clash, The Sex Pistols, and others on "oldies" stations.

God, I hate to think of the day when Linkin Park is considered "oldies."

Yeah,

I was at the Apple Genius Bar this morning. Tech did something that made my computer go to the DOS screen (what I would call the DOS screen anyway). I told him I used to have a job in which I had to type codes at the top of that screen to process car payments.

He just stared at me.

107 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:56:44pm

re: #92 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I remember when a portable CD player was something that you treated like it was gold-plated. Now? You can buy one for $10, but why do that when you can just buy an MP3 and carry your entire music collection in a device the size of a cigarette pack.

Gosh I can remember that. I still have my old CD player. What's funny is I finally found out how to burn CDs on the computer well after the MP3 revolution.

108 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:56:58pm

re: #98 Jimmi the Grey

We threw a wake when they cancelled HB...such sorrow.

Well, an Irish wake...we mourned and there was booze and stuff.

Metal was a tough sell in the 90's, I think partially because heavy alternative music was occupying the marketplace

109 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:57:09pm

re: #103 Stanley Sea

Had a laugh the other day at work. One of our clients is on High Bluff, Suite 420.

for real.

ahahahaha

110 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:57:27pm

re: #105 EmmmieG

Sitting here listening to Johnny Cash's Hurt, and wondering why some legends lose their edge at the end, and some use all they have learned to become the very best at the end.

THat is so haunting. Especially with June on the stairwell, silent and with her expressive eyes!

111 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:57:45pm

re: #105 EmmmieG

Sitting here listening to Johnny Cash's Hurt, and wondering why some legends lose their edge at the end, and some use all they have learned to become the very best at the end.

I love what Trent Reznor said about what Cash did with that song. But yeah there are some legends who lose that edge (thinking The Who in the SB a few years back, I love The Who but that was painful to watch) but others like Johnny were something right til the end.

112 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:57:54pm

re: #95 EmmmieG

And drop into the toilet and lose $500 worth of songs.

Just saying.

You'd be amazed what these things can survive now. And even if they die, with the move towards cloud storage and computing, that $500 will still be good, even if you have to replace the player.

113 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:58:09pm

re: #98 Jimmi the Grey

We threw a wake when they cancelled HB...such sorrow.

Well, an Irish wake...we mourned and there was booze and stuff.

The season where Rob Zombie hung out in the background on every episode.

114 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:58:13pm

re: #92 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I remember when a portable CD player was something that you treated like it was gold-plated. Now? You can buy one for $10, but why do that when you can just buy an MP3 and carry your entire music collection in a device the size of a cigarette pack.

I had a friend who had one of (if not the) first CD players in Roanoke. $2,500.00.

He was also the first person I ever knew who died of AIDS.

Now, I'm sad.

RIP, Andy.

115 Atlas Fails  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 6:59:44pm

Scott Walker recall effort officially underway.

116 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:00:05pm

I can remember in the mid 90's so I guess it was later than most people as my Dad always is a little late on the tech transition making the transition from tapes to CDs. When I was a kid, one of the things we'd do together was make tapes. Even made one for my grandmother apparently since I own a copy of her own journals and she writes about that. And in my teens we made CDs together. Now we make virtual playlists together. The process is different but the spirit remains the same. I liken making a mix to putting a puzzle together.

117 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:00:08pm

re: #104 HappyWarrior

Yeah my first cousins who are pretty much all Gen Xers are feeling that and it's weirding them out.

I'm a Gen-Xer and I'm sitting here, staring down 30 and wondering where all the time went.

118 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:00:42pm

re: #117 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I'm a Gen-Xer and I'm sitting here, staring down 30 and wondering where all the time went.

The 30's are fun, I get to do all the stuff I wanted to do in my 20's but didn't have my shit together to so

119 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:02:22pm

Nah, most mp3 sources allow you to redownload whatever you've bought, and if you've ripped them from cds yourself you should know enough to back your stuff up.

120 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:02:31pm

re: #110 ggt

THat is so haunting. Especially with June on the stairwell, silent and with her expressive eyes!

I listened to Johnny's biography on CD, read by Kris Kristofferson.

The opening was (paraphrasing) "America let out a collective gasp when they heard that June died before Johnny."

121 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:03:02pm

re: #106 ggt

Yeah,

I was at the Apple Genius Bar this morning. Tech did something that made my computer go to the DOS screen (what I would call the DOS screen anyway). I told him I used to have a job in which I had to type codes at the top of that screen to process car payments.

He just stared at me.

It's a sad commentary on my memory that I would probably need to break out a "Dummies Guide to DOS" these days, not having played around with it since my A+ classes in college.

Abort, Retry, Fail?

122 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:03:36pm

re: #117 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I'm a Gen-Xer and I'm sitting here, staring down 30 and wondering where all the time went.

I'm hitting a quarter century this year. The way I thought of it recently in a poem I wrote was that the old future has become the new past. I can remember being a grade school kid and having high school and college kids as my summer camp counselors. Gosh they seemed so big and grown up to me. Heck the older kids who liked to tease my best friend and I felt big but they were no younger than 10-11 years old. I always liked that Rolling Stones lyric from As Tears Go By. Mick's talking about how he likes to watch the children play "doing things they think are new I used to do." I feel that way around my ten year old kid brother especially. Watching him discover girls, his interests, etc. The things that just pass you by while you live them.

123 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:04:12pm

re: #121 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

It's a sad commentary on my memory that I would probably need to break out a "Dummies Guide to DOS" these days, not having played around with it since my A+ classes in college.

Abort, Retry, Fail?

I typed those codes so much and I couldn't remember any of the if my life depended on it.

124 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:04:13pm

re: #121 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

It's a sad commentary on my memory that I would probably need to break out a "Dummies Guide to DOS" these days, not having played around with it since my A+ classes in college.

Abort, Retry, Fail?

gaming when you had to fucking mean it, config.sys and autoexec.bat

125 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:04:27pm

re: #121 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

It's a sad commentary on my memory that I would probably need to break out a "Dummies Guide to DOS" these days, not having played around with it since my A+ classes in college.

Abort, Retry, Fail?

dirw

126 MittDoesNotCompute  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:05:06pm

re: #120 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I listened to Johnny's biography on CD, read by Kris Kristofferson.

The opening was (paraphrasing) "America let out a collective gasp when they heard that June died before Johnny."

I think most expected that either that the drugs/booze or June would have killed Johnny back in the 60s, before he got straight.

127 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:05:26pm

re: #122 HappyWarrior

A quarter century? Are you fucking kidding me?

I have a suit as old as you are.

(but that was a lovely post.)

Seriously? Are you fucking kidding me?

128 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:05:29pm

re: #119 JasonA

Nah, most mp3 sources allow you to redownload whatever you've bought, and if you've ripped them from cds yourself you should know enough to back your stuff up.

Many MP3 players have software that you can buy that allows you to transfer them to a new computer. I have my iPod music on three devices: my iPod obviously, my laptop, and my big computer.

129 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:05:44pm

re: #125 JasonA

dirw

Ah nuts, it wouldn't process my backslash :(

130 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:05:45pm

There were days when the whole office network would freeze and you'd have to walk around to fine one of two people who knew how to clear the error on the big computer in the back room. They had to toggle screens to get to the right place.

131 Interesting Times  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:05:50pm

re: #121 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

It's a sad commentary on my memory that I would probably need to break out a "Dummies Guide to DOS" these days, not having played around with it since my A+ classes in college.

Abort, Retry, Fail?

I often wondered if that was the origin of the modern "Fail" meme.

132 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:05:57pm

re: #124 WindUpBird

gaming when you had to fucking mean it, config.sys and autoexec.bat

Insert disk 17 to continue install...

133 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:06:19pm

re: #132 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Insert disk 17 to continue install...

Insert Disk 4 to Continue

134 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:06:36pm

re: #132 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Insert disk 17 to continue install...

oh man

how many discs was Black Gate? Like a million

135 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:06:54pm

re: #127 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

A quarter century? Are you fucking kidding me?

I have a suit as old as you are.

(but that was a lovely post.)

Seriously? Are you fucking kidding me?

Ha I know. It's all relative. This fall marks 20 years since I started elementary school which feels like ages ago. Only vague memories of that left. And thanks.

136 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:07:15pm

re: #115 Atlas Fails

Scott Walker recall effort officially underway.

That was petitions being submitted. They still have to be certified. Then the Donks have to hold a primary. I'm going to check see how primaries are run up there.

137 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:07:16pm

re: #132 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Insert disk 17 to continue install...

Willy Beamish was 12 discs on the Amiga


no hard drive. The swapping was ridiculous

138 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:07:25pm

re: #128 HappyWarrior

Many MP3 players have software that you can buy that allows you to transfer them to a new computer. I have my iPod music on three devices: my iPod obviously, my laptop, and my big computer.

You can do all that for free.

139 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:08:18pm

re: #138 JasonA

You can do all that for free.

Really, good deal then.

140 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:08:31pm

re: #134 WindUpBird

oh man

how many discs was Black Gate? Like a million

re: #134 WindUpBird

oh man

how many discs was Black Gate? Like a million

I'm having Falcon 4.0 flashbacks.

141 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:08:38pm

re: #134 WindUpBird

oh man

how many discs was Black Gate? Like a million

"Got a 40mb drive."
"Dude, you'll never use all that space."

142 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:08:46pm

re: #132 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Insert disk 17 to continue install...

I remember that. That version of MS Office that needed 40 disks, and having to do the work in the hot computer room... ig.

143 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:09:11pm

re: #141 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"Got a 40mb drive."
"Dude, you'll never use all that space."

"They're making 1GB hard drives now!
"Who would ever need that much space?"

144 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:09:14pm

They're tazing a naked guy on Tosh.0.

Heh.

145 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:10:24pm

re: #136 Dark_Falcon

Yeah. They need a half a million, turned in a million. Just in case a bunch are horseshit.

States are gonna have a tough time dealing with this issue.

146 Big Joe  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:10:41pm

Apple IIs came with 4k or 16k standard.

147 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:11:14pm

re: #141 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"Got a 40mb drive."
"Dude, you'll never use all that space."

I was late to the HD game *_* I didn't have a computer with a hard drive until high school, and it was a 250mb compaq 486

148 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:11:58pm

re: #115 Atlas Fails

Scott Walker recall effort officially underway.

One governor, one Majority Leader, and four legislature Republicans. All with signatures well in excess of what is necessary.

149 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:12:01pm

re: #115 Atlas Fails

Scott Walker recall effort officially underway.

And this does figure, since I used up my "good news from Wisconsin" quota on Sunday when the Giants shellacked the Packers.

150 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:12:18pm

re: #121 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

It's a sad commentary on my memory that I would probably need to break out a "Dummies Guide to DOS" these days, not having played around with it since my A+ classes in college.

Abort, Retry, Fail?

Heh. One of the reasons I dearly love OS X is that fact that underneath all the eye candy is a full BSD Unix. I always have a terminal open because I never know when I might want it. I also have verbose booting turnon. Freaks out some people to see all the messages about kernels & devs & addresses scroll by while I tell them what they mean :D

151 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:12:29pm

I think when historians look back on this era, they'll see that its technology growth was perhaps the greatest in history perhaps outside the Industrial Revolution. Friend of mine posted a link to a story about a 1911's newspapers prediction on 2011. I'll get the link. It was interesting since they were kind of right on some stuff but way off on others. One prediction was that pests like mosquitos would be exticnt.

152 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:12:37pm

re: #132 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Insert disk 17 to continue install...

What were those little cards with slots cut into them called?
LOL!

153 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:12:42pm

re: #148 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

One governor, one Majority Leader, and four legislature Republicans. All with signatures well in excess of what is necessary.

it turns out people in Wisconsin are tired of being treated like shit by Republicans

154 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:13:01pm

[Link: www.buzzfeed.com...]

155 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:14:14pm

re: #151 HappyWarrior

I think when historians look back on this era, they'll see that its technology growth was perhaps the greatest in history perhaps outside the Industrial Revolution. Friend of mine posted a link to a story about a 1911's newspapers prediction on 2011. I'll get the link. It was interesting since they were kind of right on some stuff but way off on others. One prediction was that pests like mosquitos would be exticnt.

Like the predictions in 1914 that said the World War would be over in less than a month due to the amazing technology the armies of the day had access to?

156 Interesting Times  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:14:26pm

re: #147 WindUpBird

I was late to the HD game *_* I didn't have a computer with a hard drive until high school, and it was a 250mb compaq 486

What, you didn't want to carry around one of these? ^_^

In September 1956 IBM launched the 305 RAMAC, the first ‘SUPER’ computer with a hard disk drive (HDD). The HDD weighed over a ton and stored 5 MB of data.

157 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:14:29pm

re: #136 Dark_Falcon

That was petitions being submitted. They still have to be certified. Then the Donks have to hold a primary. I'm going to check see how primaries are run up there.

Donks? Really?

158 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:14:49pm

I remember playing Sim City 2000 and Doom and them looking like amazingly advanced games. I would love it if they remade Oregon Trial for the PS3 or PC. That was my favorite game to play on the computer during computers class in grade school. Well that and Grammar Monsters since my best friend and I would make dirty mad libs.

159 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:15:19pm

re: #154 HappyWarrior

grand opera will be telephoned!

160 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:15:39pm

To England in two days!

Minus one.

161 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:15:44pm

re: #156 publicityStunted

rad

162 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:16:49pm

re: #155 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Like the predictions in 1914 that said the World War would be over in less than a month due to the amazing technology the armies of the day had access to?

Had a paper that I wrote last fall for German history where I wrote about German letters from the front. The early letters are so optimistic about victory but as the months drag on to years, the optimism turns to a great cynicism. Much like what happens in All Quiet on the Western Front. And from what I recall three of the five guys whose letters I used ended up dying i naction.

163 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:16:52pm

re: #157 JasonA

Donks? Really?

I guess "donk" is what you call "citizen" these days :D

164 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:17:11pm

When's Wikipedia supposed to go dark?

Where will I find my iron clad evidence for the internet that I am right and it is wrong!?!

165 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:18:07pm

re: #151 HappyWarrior

I think when historians look back on this era, they'll see that its technology growth was perhaps the greatest in history perhaps outside the Industrial Revolution. Friend of mine posted a link to a story about a 1911's newspapers prediction on 2011. I'll get the link. It was interesting since they were kind of right on some stuff but way off on others. One prediction was that pests like mosquitos would be exticnt.

Nah, want scary shit? Watch these commercials from '93 and identify how much of it has become reality in less than a decade.

Youtube Video
166 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:19:05pm

re: #136 Dark_Falcon

That was petitions being submitted. They still have to be certified. Then the Donks have to hold a primary. I'm going to check see how primaries are run up there.

I'll bet there won't be a primary. Party & Union will back room someone acceptable to everyone, probably Mahlon Mitchell, the President of the Professional Fire Fighters of Wisconsin who was the Official First Signature on the recall petition. He's young, black, & as charismatic as the gentleman living in the White House. Kathleen Falk will probably be the Lt. Gov candidate.

167 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:19:54pm

Air ships only for the military.

And bored high schoolers looking to get their pilot's license early.

Grand opera to be telephoned to homes

Actually, yeah, you could get it on youtube. Don't everyone try to log in all at once.

Black, blue and green roses.

Nope. They're still working at it. Seriously, they are.

Man will see around the world.

Yep, nailed that one. Unfortunately, mankind's tastes will not necessarily have improved, and we will use that interconnectedness to watch shows like "Jackass."

168 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:19:56pm

re: #152 Floral Giraffe

What were those little cards with slots cut into them called?
LOL!

punch cards!

or

Florida Ballots?

169 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:21:04pm

re: #158 HappyWarrior

I remember playing Sim City 2000 and Doom and them looking like amazingly advanced games. I would love it if they remade Oregon Trial for the PS3 or PC. That was my favorite game to play on the computer during computers class in grade school. Well that and Grammar Monsters since my best friend and I would make dirty mad libs.

You have died of dysentery.

170 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:21:50pm

Whoa. One of our referrers today is a whacked out neo-Confederate pro-Ron Paul site:

[Link: spiritwaterblood.com...]

(Google cache link)

And check this one out: Dear Fellow Southern Man.

171 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:23:10pm

Sometimes this stuff really, really creeps me out.

172 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:23:12pm

re: #149 Dark_Falcon

And this does figure, since I used up my "good news from Wisconsin" quota on Sunday when the Giants shellacked the Packers.

I object to the retro LGF use of 'donks'

We've refrained. You can too.

173 Killgore Trout  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:23:22pm

Smoke Bomb Thrown Over White House Fence

174 Big Joe  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:24:32pm

re: #152 Floral Giraffe

hollerith cards

175 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:24:39pm

re: #151 HappyWarrior

I think when historians look back on this era, they'll see that its technology growth was perhaps the greatest in history perhaps outside the Industrial Revolution. Friend of mine posted a link to a story about a 1911's newspapers prediction on 2011. I'll get the link. It was interesting since they were kind of right on some stuff but way off on others. One prediction was that pests like mosquitos would be exticnt.

NPR, I heard it. Really interesting.

176 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:24:48pm

"Why is it that when Republicans and Democrats need to solve the budget and the deficit, there's deadlock, but when Hollywood lobbyists pay them $94 million dollars to write legislation, people from both sides of the aisle line up to co-sponsor it?" -- Alexis Ohanian ( Reddit Founder )

177 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:25:08pm

re: #173 Killgore Trout

White House security does not fuck around.

They might want to check themselves before they wreck themselves.

178 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:25:36pm

re: #176 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

"Why is it that when Republicans and Democrats need to solve the budget and the deficit, there's deadlock, but when Hollywood lobbyists pay them $94 million dollars to write legislation, people from both sides of the aisle line up to co-sponsor it?" -- Alexis Ohanian ( Reddit Founder )

because America

179 Killgore Trout  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:25:42pm

re: #177 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

White House security does not fuck around.

They might want to check themselves before they wreck themselves.

It's ok because they're radical leftists.
/

180 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:26:33pm

re: #169 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

You have died of dysentery.

Crap (pun intended)

181 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:27:14pm

re: #153 WindUpBird

it turns out people in Wisconsin are tired of being treated like shit by Republicans

Due to some comments today I read up on Robert LaFollette a bit. Wisconsin was cutting edge at the beginning of the 20th century were "liberal" in things like labor laws, workers compensation, and direct primary voting.

182 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:27:38pm

re: #178 WindUpBird

because America

fuck yeah

183 jaunte  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:27:45pm
"Many of our own state and local governments have passed laws that unnaturally grant social and political supremacy to non-Southerners living in our midst."[Link: spiritwaterblood.com...]

Must be some good moonshine.

184 Interesting Times  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:34:11pm

re: #170 Charles

And check this one out: Dear Fellow Southern Man.

(2) On the whole, have the vast millions of immigrants from Asia, Central America, the Middle East, and Africa improved our lives or worsened them?

When a million Africans come into this country and are granted the political franchise, they have the effect of making us that much more like Africa. When a million Vietnamese enter here and become part of this society, they have the effect of making us that much more like Vietnam. When a million Mexicans enter this country and become part of it, they make the country that much more like Mexico.

Well, I guess that explains the behavior of the South Carolina GOP debate audience...

185 freetoken  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:34:44pm

re: #183 jaunte

I wonder how many in the audience at the last GOP debate would find some sympathy for that website?

186 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:35:05pm

re: #149 Dark_Falcon

And this does figure, since I used up my "good news from Wisconsin" quota on Sunday when the Giants shellacked the Packers.

DF, If the price of putting Scooter in the Unemployment line is a lost Packers game, we got off pretty light. Go 49'er's!

187 Eclectic Infidel  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:35:57pm

re: #184 publicityStunted

Well, I guess that explains the behavior of the South Carolina GOP debate audience...

All of that whacky ranting begs the question...what would they really do if they had an opportunity to gain a majority in, say Congress? Kick everyone out? Pass fascist theocratic laws that attempt to force Christian evangelism down our throats at gunpoint? Lots of puffery there.

188 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:36:18pm

re: #145 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Yeah. They need a half a million, turned in a million. Just in case a bunch are horseshit.

States are gonna have a tough time dealing with this issue.

I checked Wikipedia, and found that Wisconsin has open primaries. So Republicans should look into "Operation: Chaos"-type measures. might not be a good idea, but it might work well, too.

189 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:36:44pm

re: #185 freetoken

I wonder how many in the audience at the last GOP debate would find some sympathy for that website?

I still want to know if Eugene Robinson and Juan Williams were the only 2 people of color there.

Still need to find Eugene R's take/response.

190 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:38:27pm

re: #185 freetoken

I wonder how many on that stage at the last GOP debate would find some sympathy for that website?

191 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:39:45pm

re: #183 jaunte

"So far from engaging in a war to perpetuate slavery, I am rejoiced that Slavery is abolished. I believe it will be greatly for the interest of the South. So fully am I satisfied of this that I would have cheerfully lost all that I have lost by the war, and have suffered all that I have suffered to have this object attained."

I love showing racist types this Robert E. Lee quote.

192 Eclectic Infidel  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:40:06pm

re: #190 JasonA

I wonder how many on that stage at the last GOP debate would find some sympathy for that website?

I'll go out on a limb and guess that some of them would find sympathy - the real question is...would anyone be foolish enough to admit it in front of millions of viewers?

193 Killgore Trout  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:41:31pm

I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

194 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:41:46pm

re: #188 Dark_Falcon

I checked Wikipedia, and found that Wisconsin has open primaries. So Republicans should look into "Operation: Chaos"-type measures. might not be a good idea, but it might work well, too.

Is Walker's hand so weak that Republicans have to fuck with the Dem primary just to have a chance at winning?

195 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:41:48pm

re: #188 Dark_Falcon

I checked Wikipedia, and found that Wisconsin has open primaries. So Republicans should look into "Operation: Chaos"-type measures. might not be a good idea, but it might work well, too.

Maybe James O'Keefe can investigate.

196 jaunte  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:42:00pm

re: #192 eclectic infidel

would anyone be foolish enough to admit it in front of millions of viewers?

Ron Paul!
...
Not proven! Wasn't me!

197 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:42:42pm

re: #192 eclectic infidel

I'll go out on a limb and guess that some of them would find sympathy - the real question is...would anyone be foolish enough to admit it in front of millions of viewers?

I think a certain doughy man whose name I won't mention here is more than halfway there. Also a Mr. Paul, who is on the record defending those newsletters he never read.

198 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:43:08pm

re: #195 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Maybe James O'Keefe can investigate.

Pimping ain't easy. And frankly if the Wisconsin Republicans tried some Operation Chaos crap, that's only gonna make Walker more reviled than he already is. Walker made his own bed. He has to lie in the piss.

199 MittDoesNotCompute  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:43:24pm

re: #188 Dark_Falcon

I checked Wikipedia, and found that Wisconsin has open primaries. So Republicans should look into "Operation: Chaos"-type measures. might not be a good idea, but it might work well, too.

Are you advocating that WI GOP voters game the system of the state's open primaries, especially with so many voters against Scott Walker?

If you are, than I am sorely disappointed with you.

200 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:43:53pm

re: #191 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

"So far from engaging in a war to perpetuate slavery, I am rejoiced that Slavery is abolished. I believe it will be greatly for the interest of the South. So fully am I satisfied of this that I would have cheerfully lost all that I have lost by the war, and have suffered all that I have suffered to have this object attained."
I love showing racist types this Robert E. Lee quote.

That's cool. Do you know the source of it? It would go good with the story of how, shortly after the war, there was an Episcopalian church service in Richmond. At the communion an newly freed black man came up to the rail to receive. The priest was set to ignore him until Mr. Lee came up and kneeled down next to him. IIRC that was at the end of Ken Burn's documentary.

201 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:45:12pm

re: #200 wlewisiii

That's cool. Do you know the source of it? It would go good with the story of how, shortly after the war, there was an Episcopalian church service in Richmond. At the communion an newly freed black man came up to the rail to receive. The priest was set to ignore him until Mr. Lee came up and kneeled down next to him. IIRC that was at the end of Ken Burn's documentary.

I think it was the Burns' documentary. I have more respect for Lee than many in his fan club. Still don't believe in celebrating him like we do here in Virginia but he was gracious in defeat and more than the neo-confederate buttheads of today knew that the civil war was a tragic event.

202 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:45:13pm

re: #199 talon_262

Are you advocating that WI GOP voters game the system of the state's open primaries, especially with so many voters against Scott Walker?

If you are, than I am sorely disappointed with you.

It's all a battle to him.

203 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:45:16pm

re: #194 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Is Walker's hand so weak that Republicans have to fuck with the Dem primary just to have a chance at winning?

Yep. He certainly isn't fund raising around here any more.

Last pro-Walker sign I saw was at a Christmas tree farm in the middle of no-where.

204 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:45:25pm

Let's see: A basically secular state but one where creationism spreads like a contagious disease and the current administration is friendly with atavistic and ruthless theocrats.
Yep, Rick Perry is an Islamic terrorist.

205 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:45:37pm

re: #166 wlewisiii

I'll bet there won't be a primary. Party & Union will back room someone acceptable to everyone, probably Mahlon Mitchell, the President of the Professional Fire Fighters of Wisconsin who was the Official First Signature on the recall petition. He's young, black, & as charismatic as the gentleman living in the White House. Kathleen Falk will probably be the Lt. Gov candidate.

And you'll be wrong. The temptation to run will be too much. And back rooms will pose their own PR challenges. Easy enough to present such a candidate as the creature of far left activists groups, meeting behind closed doors.

And I still do not see why the firefighters have been so antsy. Gov. Walker is their natural friend, and his bill exempted them.

206 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:46:11pm

re: #193 Killgore Trout

Prof de la Paz quote? Or was that character quoting someone else?

207 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:46:38pm

re: #205 Dark_Falcon

And you'll be wrong. The temptation to run will be too much. And back rooms will pose their own PR challenges. Easy enough to present such a candidate as the creature of far left activists groups, meeting behind closed doors.

And I still do not see why the firefighters have been so antsy. Gov. Walker is their natural friend, and his bill exempted them.

Maybe they decided that the common good was more important than their own short term interests?

208 freetoken  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:47:02pm

re: #190 JasonA

I wonder how many on that stage at the last GOP debate would find some sympathy for that website?

Ron Paul.
Rick Perry (at least in part.)
Newt (at least in part.)
Mr. Tofu (Romney) would attempt to make them think he is flavored like them, while looking constipated the entire time.

Strange as it may seem, I suspect Santorum would be uncomfortable with that site. Mitt would be uncomfortable with it too, but he would still try to find a way to exploit it. Like Newt also, who would try to convince that crowd that he was their saviour (whether or not he really believes it.)

209 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:48:40pm

re: #200 wlewisiii

He also said,

They do not know what they say. If it came to a conflict of arms, the war will last at least four years. Northern politicians will not appreciate the determination and pluck of the South, and Southern politicians do not appreciate the numbers, resources, and patient perseverance of the North. Both sides forget that we are all Americans. I foresee that our country will pass through a terrible ordeal, a necessary expiation, perhaps, for our national sins.

Very quotable guy. Found the quotes here.

210 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:49:00pm

Possessed of a noble pedigree? What are they, show dogs?

211 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:49:50pm

My own "noble pedigree" contains at least a couple of men I would categorize as "jerks," or perhaps "total jerks."

Probably some women, too, but they're harder to spot.

212 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:49:58pm

re: #205 Dark_Falcon

And you'll be wrong. The temptation to run will be too much. And back rooms will pose their own PR challenges. Easy enough to present such a candidate as the creature of far left activists groups, meeting behind closed doors.

And I still do not see why the firefighters have been so antsy. Gov. Walker is their natural friend, and his bill exempted them.

He is their natural enemy. Divide and conquer - then steal the rights of those who helped you destroy the others. He thought that the Police and Firemen would be dumb enough to think he cared about them, but they have, to their great honor, stood in Solidarność with their brothers and sisters.

213 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:50:26pm

re: #194 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Is Walker's hand so weak that Republicans have to fuck with the Dem primary just to have a chance at winning?

Walker's still got organization and lots of money. But his hand is stronger if the Dems hold a primary.

214 jaunte  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:50:30pm

re: #209 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I like this one:

"We made a great mistake in the beginning of our struggle, and I fear, in spite of all we can do, it will prove to be a fatal mistake. We appointed all our worst generals to command our armies, and all our best generals to edit the newspapers."

215 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:50:48pm

It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it.
I believe he said that after Fredericksburg. Truer words never spoken.

216 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:52:19pm

re: #209 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

He also said,

Very quotable guy. Found the quotes here.

Thank you for the link, I appreciate it.

217 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:54:08pm

re: #207 oaktree

Maybe they decided that the common good was more important than their own short term interests?

I do not understand how they could think that way in this case. Why side with a bunch of bureaucrats who are draining the state's monies?

And there are good reasons to say firefighters should have a strong union while saying that government office workers should not. Firefighters do hazardous work and in such cases unions are indeed needed. But what benefit is served by allowing DMV employees to unionize?

218 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:54:09pm

re: #213 Dark_Falcon

Walker's still got organization and lots of money.

And the Koch Bros.

219 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:54:20pm

re: #213 Dark_Falcon

Walker's still got organization and lots of money. But his hand is stronger if the Dems hold a primary.

Why, because the Republicans would use it as an opportunity to vote for the guy they think they can beat? How'd that work out for them with Obama?

220 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:54:46pm

re: #193 Killgore Trout

I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

But the Frogs know!

221 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:56:16pm

re: #193 Killgore Trout

I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do. I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

Youtube Video
222 jaunte  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:57:10pm

"...the absence of public sector unions does not necessarily help balance state budgets, either. Texas, which does not allow collective bargaining and has a very weak union movement, faces a $27 billion budget deficit over the next two fiscal years, a budget deficit similar in size to California's, but with a much smaller economy."
[Link: www.usnews.com...]

223 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:57:16pm

This is funny, I don't care who you are...

224 freetoken  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:57:27pm

Not too long ago the BBC did a program "Abraham Lincoln: Saint or Sinner?" in which they did a couple of interviews of real neo-confederates.

The show is available on Youtube:

Youtube Video

or in 4 parts here:

Youtube Video

or in 4 parts here:

Youtube Video

(the first and latter have better vid quality.)

It's always interesting to see what outsiders see when they look at the US.

Nothing in the show will likely surprise most of us here.

I just wished at the last debate that Juan or someone would have asked the states' rights candidates on stage what they thought about court ordered busing to desegregate schools.

225 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:57:27pm

re: #215 HappyWarrior

It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it.
I believe he said that after Fredericksburg. Truer words never spoken.

Neo-Confederates and their allies only know "ROBERT E. LEE!!1", "the man frozen inside the marble myth" to quote Robert Leckie. They don't know who he really was, they just applaud a distortion of him that fits their fantasies.

226 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:58:13pm

re: #212 wlewisiii

He is their natural enemy. Divide and conquer - then steal the rights of those who helped you destroy the others. He thought that the Police and Firemen would be dumb enough to think he cared about them, but they have, to their great honor, stood in Solidarność with their brothers and sisters.

Must repost.

227 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:58:18pm

re: #217 Dark_Falcon

I do not understand how they could think that way in this case. Why side with a bunch of bureaucrats who are draining the state's monies?

And there are good reasons to say firefighters should have a strong union while saying that government office workers should not. Firefighters do hazardous work and in such cases unions are indeed needed. But what benefit is served by allowing DMV employees to unionize?

What benefit? Jesus...

228 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:58:26pm

re: #225 Dark_Falcon

Neo-Confederates and their allies only know "ROBERT E. LEE!!1", "the man frozen inside the marble myth" to quote Robert Leckie. They don't know who he really was, they just applaud a distortion of him that fits their fantasies.

Yep. That's what most people do with their heroes. The legend never is the reality.

229 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:58:48pm

re: #225 Dark_Falcon

They picture Robert E. Lee as Taggart from Blazing Saddles.

230 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:58:59pm

re: #217 Dark_Falcon

I do not understand how they could think that way in this case. Why side with a bunch of bureaucrats who are draining the state's monies?

And there are good reasons to say firefighters should have a strong union while saying that government office workers should not. Firefighters do hazardous work and in such cases unions are indeed needed. But what benefit is served by allowing DMV employees to unionize?

Um, to help prevent their exploitation. Or is it ok to exploit some occupations but not others based on some 'nobility standard' that I'm unaware of?

Damn, and they say the left are elitists.

231 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 7:59:02pm

re: #218 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

And the Koch Bros.

I have nothing to say here about Charles or David Koch or about Koch Energy. This is due to work reasons.

232 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:00:06pm

re: #229 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

They picture Robert E. Lee as Taggart from Blazing Saddles.

You mean the militia slowed his invasion of Pennsylvania in 1863 by putting up a toll booth?

233 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:00:36pm

re: #232 oaktree

You mean the militia slowed his invasion of Pennsylvania in 1863 by putting up a toll booth?

That and the Army of Northern Virginia sat around a fire farting.

234 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:00:36pm

re: #231 Dark_Falcon

I have nothing to say here about Charles or David Koch or about Koch Energy. This is due to work reasons.

I'm picturing silver jump suits, a volcanic island and a table lined with chairs over trapdoors.

235 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:00:44pm

re: #228 HappyWarrior

Yep. That's what most people do with their heroes. The legend never is the reality.

When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.
-The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance.

236 palomino  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:01:04pm

re: #171 Charles

Sometimes this stuff really, really creeps me out.

He seems unable to accept that anything in the South has changed over the last 100 years. His fantasy piece could have been from 1912 almost as easily as from this year.

237 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:01:06pm

re: #232 oaktree

You mean the militia slowed his invasion of Pennsylvania in 1863 by putting up a toll booth?

"SOMEONE GO BACK AND GET A SHITLOAD OF DIMES!"

238 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:01:25pm

re: #235 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.
-The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance.

Yep. We're always chasing legends someway or form if you ask me.

239 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:02:14pm

re: #232 oaktree

You mean the militia slowed his invasion of Pennsylvania in 1863 by putting up a toll booth?

Somebody's gotta go back and get a shitload of dimes!
-Robert E. Lee
/

240 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:03:01pm

re: #230 Jimmi the Grey

Um, to help prevent their exploitation. Or is it ok to exploit some occupations but not others based on some 'nobility standard' that I'm unaware of?

Damn, and they say the left are elitists.

If an office worker thinks himself exploited, he is free to leave and find other employment.

Firefighters, like police, perform work wherein allowing workers a say is the only way to prevent deaths and as such a union is needed and legitimate. But for government office workers, unions do not prevent exploitation, what they do is vote themselves greater amounts of other people's money.

241 palomino  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:03:51pm

re: #188 Dark_Falcon

I checked Wikipedia, and found that Wisconsin has open primaries. So Republicans should look into "Operation: Chaos"-type measures. might not be a good idea, but it might work well, too.

Wow, that shows a lot of integrity on your part. Advocating tactics publicly supported by Limbaugh and his ilk.

You should be careful what you wish for. Once you open up such a can of worms, it's likely to drag down the whole electoral process and eventually bite your side in the ass as well.

242 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:06:05pm

re: #234 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I'm picturing silver jump suits, a volcanic island and a table lined with chairs over trapdoors.

Funny, but that's not it. It's really more about me proceeding with an abundance of caution.

243 palomino  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:06:12pm

re: #205 Dark_Falcon

And you'll be wrong. The temptation to run will be too much. And back rooms will pose their own PR challenges. Easy enough to present such a candidate as the creature of far left activists groups, meeting behind closed doors.

And I still do not see why the firefighters have been so antsy. Gov. Walker is their natural friend, and his bill exempted them.

Maybe because they're afraid they'll be next on the chopping block. Maybe because they give a shit about other union workers. Maybe because they have some integrity and can't be that easily bought off.

244 MittDoesNotCompute  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:06:44pm

re: #234 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I'm picturing silver jump suits, a volcanic island and a table lined with chairs over trapdoors.

Which one of the Koch brothers is Dr. Evil and which is Mini Me?

245 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:07:06pm

G'night knuckleheads!

246 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:07:18pm

re: #243 palomino

Maybe because they're afraid they'll be next on the chopping block. Maybe because they give a shit about other union workers. Maybe because they have some integrity and can't be that easily bought off.

Shit gotta imagine that some of them probably have family and friends who are part of the other unions that have been effected as well and who's to say yeah they won't be next. Didn't Kasich target firefighters in Ohio?

247 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:08:36pm

re: #240 Dark_Falcon

Dude, the vote themselves greater monies meme is so played. Support it with evidence please because it has always sounded vaguely blame-the-victim-ish.

Or could it be that it is something, to quote SFZ who was quoting from a sci-fi novel, "it is known".

248 jaunte  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:09:50pm

re: #240 Dark_Falcon

I think it's quite possible to exploit office workers.

249 dragonath  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:10:05pm

Huh, firefighters and police weren't exempted in Ohio and Indiana. Why should they trust Republicans?

250 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:10:23pm

re: #215 HappyWarrior

It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it.
I believe he said that after Fredericksburg. Truer words never spoken.

There's one other high-level Confederate quote from Fredericksburg. When Gen. Thomas J. "Stonewall" Jackson ordered forward his reserves to close the penetration made in his corps' line by Gen. Meade (the same man who would command the entire Army of the Potomac at Gettysburg), one of his aides remarked that it was a pity to kill men who fought so bravely. To this, Jackson replied: "No, kill them all. I do not wish them to be brave."

251 [deleted]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:10:31pm
252 Altermite  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:10:34pm

re: #247 Jimmi the Grey

Dude, the vote themselves greater monies meme is so played. Support it with evidence please because it has always sounded vaguely blame-the-victim-ish.

Or could it be that it is something, to quote SFZ who was quoting from a sci-fi novel, "it is known".

Not scifi.

253 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:10:39pm

re: #188 Dark_Falcon

I checked Wikipedia, and found that Wisconsin has open primaries. So Republicans should look into "Operation: Chaos"-type measures. might not be a good idea, but it might work well, too.

Thank you once again Dark for showing off why a fanatic is someone who redoubles his efforts while loosing sight of his goals.

You need to stop loving democracy to death man.

254 palomino  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:10:50pm

re: #240 Dark_Falcon

If an office worker thinks himself exploited, he is free to leave and find other employment.

Firefighters, like police, perform work wherein allowing workers a say is the only way to prevent deaths and as such a union is needed and legitimate. But for government office workers, unions do not prevent exploitation, what they do is vote themselves greater amounts of other people's money.

So I guess you have a problem with the fact that so many coal miners and oil rig workers aren't unionized, right?

255 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:11:04pm

re: #248 jaunte

I think it's quite possible to exploit office workers.

I do too and I have to as the son of a federal employee take issue with them being seen as mere office workers. We bitch about bureaucracy and that's our right as Americans but those bureaucrats do try make parts our daily lives a little easier contrary to belief.

256 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:11:07pm

re: #251 MikeySDCA

OT: Wikipedia did not shut down as promised (threatened?)

It's 8am EST already?!? Damn, I'm LATE!!!

257 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:11:18pm

re: #38 eclectic infidel

I don't agree with Perry, and yet on the flip side of things...

Erdogan to Haniyeh: Talks must include Hamas

And this is the same Hamas that has repeatedly admitted that it does not want peace, that it wants Israel destroyed.

Turkey does have some explaining to do.

I know just how you feel. The .tr govt is seriously working my nerves as of late.

258 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:11:23pm

re: #248 jaunte

I think it's quite possible to exploit office workers.

there's a point at which it's just impossible for me to express just how bizarre the workings of the republican mind are

259 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:11:53pm

re: #249 dragonath

Huh, firefighters and police weren't exempted in Ohio and Indiana. Why should they trust Republicans?

pay no attention!

They're NATURAL FRIENDS

260 Lidane  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:12:10pm

re: #5 blueraven

I am so sick of this creepy man. He has been my Governor for over a decade. I hope to hell Texans that keep voting for him can see what a dimwit he is, now that he has been forced to debate.

He has always had much more money than his opponents, ran scathing ads but never, ever debated any of them. He is an embarrassment.

Mercifully, it's taken Rick Perry showing his ignorance on a national stage to finally break through the wall of denial around here:

[Link: www.publicpolicypolling.com...]

What might be most shocking on this poll is that Romney edges Perry 46-45 if Republican voters had to pick just between the two of them. When we asked that identical question four months ago Perry led Romney 72-18. There's been a 55 point shift in Romney's direction.

It's not just that Texas Republicans are no longer planning to vote for Perry- a lot of them even feel that Perry's candidacy has hurt Texas' image. 39% of GOP voters think his candidacy has been a negative for perceptions of the state, while only 13% believe it's been a positive. By comparison just 28% of primary voters believe Ron Paul's campaign has been bad for the state's image to 19% who believe it's been a positive.

He's made the Texas GOP look like the ignorant morans that they are just by being himself, and they hate him for it. It's glorious.

261 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:12:17pm

re: #253 jamesfirecat

And why people like me exist. Those will to mirror tactics to the other side.

I see some conservative religious groups to rip tax-exempt status away from

Notably, the Mormon Church, for interference in Prop 8.

262 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:12:25pm

Quick!

what is another legal type word for "misrepresented"

something that means "outright lie"

Thanks, writing a letter.

263 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:12:45pm

re: #234 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I'm picturing silver jump suits, a volcanic island and a table lined with chairs over trapdoors.

"Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to my volcano lair. I have gathered here before me the world's dumbest politicians, and yet each of you has failed to kill the unions. That makes me angry. And when Mr. Koch gets angry, Mr. Bigglesworth gets upset. And when Mr. Bigglesworth gets upset... people DIE! "

///

264 jaunte  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:12:49pm

re: #255 HappyWarrior

I also think it's probably 'pound-foolish' in the long term to drive talent away from government office jobs.

265 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:13:48pm

re: #252 Altermite

Not scifi.

Fantasy? I was impressed with the reference and forgot the genre. Almost sure it was fiction...

266 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:13:50pm

re: #87 WindUpBird

the next step is already here: streaming music services through smartphones

And Spotify is going to start charging ALL our butts. /the old bait and switch

267 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:14:04pm

re: #249 dragonath

Huh, firefighters and police weren't exempted in Ohio and Indiana. Why should they trust Republicans?

Because Wisconsin is not Ohio, and because there really are reasons to exempt firefighters.

That having been said, Gov. Walker should have talked to Gov. Kaisch and gotten the Ohio bill to incorporate similar exemptions. Although how anyone can listen to john Kaisch's syrupy-sweet voice without their blood crystallizing is something I will never understand.

268 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:14:15pm

re: #262 ggt

Quick!

what is another legal type word for "misrepresented"

something that means "outright lie"

Thanks, writing a letter.

Fraud?

269 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:14:42pm

re: #268 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Fraud?

oooh, yes, but a little too strong for what I am trying to accomplish.

270 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:15:03pm

re: #253 jamesfirecat

Thank you once again Dark for showing off why a fanatic is someone who redoubles his efforts while loosing sight of his goals.

You need to stop loving democracy to death man.

fxd

271 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:15:21pm

re: #254 palomino

So I guess you have a problem with the fact that so many coal miners and oil rig workers aren't unionized, right?

He has a Koch secrecy ring. No can do.

272 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:15:28pm

re: #267 Dark_Falcon

If you don't have issue with Limbaugh-style screwing with the Constitution, you shouldn't have an issue with my proposal for permanently curbing conservative power.

273 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:15:39pm

re: #267 Dark_Falcon

Because Wisconsin is not Ohio, and because there really are reasons to exempt firefighters.

That having been said, Gov. Walker should have talked to Gov. Kaisch and gotten the Ohio bill to incorporate similar exemptions. Although how anyone can listen to john Kaisch's syrupy-sweet voice without their blood crystallizing is something I will never understand.

Dude do you realize that Kasich didn't want to make those exemptions. He wants to bust unions. Plain and simple.

274 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:15:51pm

re: #266 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

And Spotify is going to start charging ALL our butts. /the old bait and switch

I don't use streaming music services because they never have what I want

I pretty much use emusic, and occasionally amazon or if possible, an artist's own site, to buy music digitally, I am very resistant to the streaming/cloud thing

275 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:16:25pm

re: #263 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

"Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to my volcano lair. I have gathered here before me the world's dumbest politicians, and yet each of you has failed to kill the unions. That makes me angry. And when Mr. Koch gets angry, Mr. Bigglesworth gets upset. And when Mr. Bigglesworth gets upset... people DIE! "

///

I miss the 90's sometimes. And then I have a beer and I don't.

276 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:16:27pm

re: #262 ggt

Quick!

what is another legal type word for "misrepresented"

something that means "outright lie"

Thanks, writing a letter.

Falsified

277 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:16:37pm

re: #266 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

And Spotify is going to start charging ALL our butts. /the old bait and switch

Meh. I'll be more into Spotify when the carriers raise the data limits.

278 Romantic Heretic  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:17:00pm

re: #146 mracb

Apple IIs came with 4k or 16k standard.

Mine came with 48K. I splurged.

I still have trouble distinguishing between MB, GB and TB.

I'm old. :(

279 MittDoesNotCompute  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:18:50pm

re: #274 WindUpBird

I don't use streaming music services because they never have what I want

I pretty much use emusic, and occasionally amazon or if possible, an artist's own site, to buy music digitally, I am very resistant to the streaming/cloud thing

That's why I use Google Music; free cloud space to upload 20000 songs from your collection to your Google account and access to it anywhere with a Internet connection, from the desktop or Android apps.

280 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:19:18pm

re: #279 talon_262

That's why I use Google Music; free cloud space to upload 20000 songs from your collection to your Google account and access to it anywhere with a Internet connection, from the the desktop or Android apps.

Bummer because I just went over 20,000.

281 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:19:54pm

re: #254 palomino

So I guess you have a problem with the fact that so many coal miners and oil rig workers aren't unionized, right?

Honestly, yeah. That is a problem, or at least a potential one. Because coal mining is a job for which the need for unions is evident and glaring. If any were to say otherwise to me, I'd just recommend a viewing of The Molly Maguires (also worth viewing if you are a Sean Connery fan).

282 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:20:20pm

Also Dark to answer your questions...

Beliving that the current GOP will stop at busting only Government Unions or only the government unions of people with non dangerous jobs, that's like the Romulans believing that just because they have a non aggression treaty with the Dominion, they'll be left alone once the Dominion is done with the Federation and Klingons they'll be left alone rather than getting crushed after the fact so that the Dominion can totally dominate the Alpha Quadrant.

(This is the least offensive metaphore for the situation I could come up with, the others were a lot more Godwiny...)

283 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:21:24pm

re: #274 WindUpBird

I don't use streaming music services because they never have what I want

I pretty much use emusic, and occasionally amazon or if possible, an artist's own site, to buy music digitally, I am very resistant to the streaming/cloud thing

It's interesting - i did at first, but I'm finding it to be an amazing research tool. I'm finding stuff I didn't even know people did. I don't know if it will be worth $4.99 or $9.99 or whatever a month, but I now see the draw of it. At least for someone like me.

284 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:21:26pm

re: #281 Dark_Falcon

Honestly, yeah. That is a problem, or at least a potential one. Because coal mining is a job for which the need for unions is evident and glaring. If any were to say otherwise to me, I'd just recommend a viewing of The Molly Maguires (also worth viewing if you are a Sean Connery fan).

Well it's great to see you aren't against all unions.

Also, reading 1632 by Eric Flint will give anyone warm glowy feelings anytime they think about Union Coal Miners....

285 Big Joe  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:21:42pm

re: #278 Romantic Heretic

If I recall correctly, wasn't it $400 for each 16k? I worked at Computerland in those days.

286 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:22:19pm

re: #282 jamesfirecat

Also Dark to answer your questions...

Beliving that the current GOP will stop at busting only Government Unions or only the government unions of people with non dangerous jobs, that's like the Romulans believing that just because they have a non aggression treaty with the Dominion, they'll be left alone once the Dominion is done with the Federation and Klingons they'll be left alone rather than getting crushed after the fact so that the Dominion can totally dominate the Alpha Quadrant.

(This is the least offensive metaphore for the situation I could come up with, the others were a lot more Godwiny...)

That's the geekiest metaphor I've heard today. Well done, sir.

287 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:22:23pm

re: #282 jamesfirecat

Also Dark to answer your questions...

Beliving that the current GOP will stop at busting only Government Unions or only the government unions of people with non dangerous jobs, that's like the Romulans believing that just because they have a non aggression treaty with the Dominion, they'll be left alone once the Dominion is done with the Federation and Klingons they'll be left alone rather than getting crushed after the fact so that the Dominion can totally dominate the Alpha Quadrant.

(This is the least offensive metaphore for the situation I could come up with, the others were a lot more Godwiny...)

The GOP is not the Tal Shaire, James. Nor is Scott Walkler a Cardassian.

288 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:22:56pm

re: #287 Dark_Falcon

The Republican Party seems like the Al-Nour Party in Egypt right now.

289 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:23:05pm

re: #279 talon_262

That's why I use Google Music; free cloud space to upload 20000 songs from your collection to your Google account and access to it anywhere with a Internet connection, from the desktop or Android apps.

If I was travelling all over the place and had a smartphone, I'd probably use google music, but I always listen to music in one of three places: behind this desk, in my garage with no internets, and in my car with no internets. So I just have big hard drives and an ipod *_* i sorta want a Cowon x7 120gb, I keep running out of room on the durned ipod

290 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:24:04pm

Our press is downright dangerous. Morons like Perry should have been vetted and shamed into oblivion for his stupidity. Yet Blitzer fawns away...

291 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:24:08pm

My mom's parents, miners' kids used to tell me in the homes in their hometown. You had two portraits in the house: FDR and John L. Lewis. Now I am not a fan of everything Lewis stood for but he fought his ass off for the miners.

292 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:25:19pm

re: #286 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

That the geekiest metaphor I've heard today. Well done, sir.

I'd give James a Dana Carvey point for the reference, myself.

293 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:26:40pm

re: #283 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

It's interesting - i did at first, but I'm finding it to be an amazing research tool. I'm finding stuff I didn't even know people did. I don't know if it will be worth $4.99 or $9.99 or whatever a month, but I now see the draw of it. At least for someone like me.

My interest would certainly be piqued if it had bootlegs >_>

294 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:27:19pm

re: #287 Dark_Falcon

The GOP is not the Tal Shaire, James. Nor is Scott Walkler a Cardassian.

My point is, that while you may honestly believe that Scott Walker intends to stop his Union busting there....

A) Does Scott Walker know that?

B) Do the people who elected Scott Walker know that? Because otherwise, they'll just elect someone else who will bust up the Police and Firefighter Union eventually....

295 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:28:35pm

Scott Walker is scum. Soon he will be unemployed.

296 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:28:44pm

re: #255 HappyWarrior

I do too and I have to as the son of a federal employee take issue with them being seen as mere office workers. We bitch about bureaucracy and that's our right as Americans but those bureaucrats do try make parts our daily lives a little easier contrary to belief.

You know, I'm behind in the thread but this needs more comment.

This is what's happening. We are creating, living in, and unfortunately thriving in an American society where we are defining people (fathers, mothers, family, neighbors, etc.) as WORTH ANYTHING, OR NOT WORTH ANYTHING.

That debate last night shockingly showed it clear.

297 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:29:32pm

re: #288 ProLifeLiberal

The Republican Party seems like the Al-Nour Party in Egypt right now.

I was gonna say the Ferengi, but...

298 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:29:50pm

re: #268 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Fraud?

Perhaps, I could say an exaggeration of what services were available. sounds omnious. don't you think?

299 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:30:04pm

re: #297 Jimmi the Grey

I was gonna say the Ferengi, but...

Khorne worshipers, pure and simple

300 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:30:24pm

re: #296 Stanley Sea

And, sometimes it's easy to forget, that we are all worth something!
*waves*

301 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:30:26pm

re: #276 Jimmi the Grey

Falsified

good, but still too strong.

I think I'll go with "exaggeration"

302 Interesting Times  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:30:38pm

re: #298 ggt

Perhaps, I could say an exaggeration of what services were available. sounds omnious. don't you think?

Misrepresented? Bait-and-switch?

303 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:31:21pm

re: #294 jamesfirecat

My point is, that while you may honestly believe that Scott Walker intends to stop his Union busting there...

A) Does Scott Walker know that?

B) Do the people who elected Scott Walker know that? Because otherwise, they'll just elect someone else who will bust up the Police and Firefighter Union eventually...

Let me reverse the question, if I may: What evidence do you have that Walker wanted to restrict unions further? Because I have seen little on that point save supposition.

304 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:31:27pm

re: #296 Stanley Sea

You know, I'm behind in the thread but this needs more comment.

This is what's happening. We are creating, living in, and unfortunately thriving in an American society where we are defining people (fathers, mothers, family, neighbors, etc.) as WORTH ANYTHING, OR NOT WORTH ANYTHING.

That debate last night shockingly showed it clear.

And we're listening to men who compare balancing the federal budget to balancing your checkbook at home and declare that the government should be "run like a business." And nodding along to it all, telling ourselves that only businessmen, who've years of experience running companies, can get America's economy back on track rather than plunder it as they have companies they've run.

305 RadicalModerate  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:31:37pm

re: #170 Charles

In response to the "Dear Fellow Southern Man"

(2) On the whole, have the vast millions of immigrants from Asia, Central America, the Middle East, and Africa improved our lives or worsened them?

Let's take these one at a time, shall we?

When a million Africans come into this country and are granted the political franchise, they have the effect of making us that much more like Africa.

And exactly how did the vast majority of people of African origin come into this country? On slave ships through no choice of their own. A situation which required a damn civil war in this country for them to gain their freedom, and another 100 years for them to gain even the most basic of civil rights. I'm guessing that "the political franchise" includes things like being allowed to vote without fear of being lynched.

When a million Vietnamese enter here and become part of this society, they have the effect of making us that much more like Vietnam.

Outside of Asian neighborhoods in major cities, I don't know what part of the US looks anything at all like Vietnam. Neighborhoods that they created themselves because they were completely shut out of "mainstream" America. As for laws on the books, or even proposed, I honestly can't think of a single one that has an origin from an Asian country.

When a million Mexicans enter this country and become part of it, they make the country that much more like Mexico.

Protip: much of the southwestern United States used to be Mexico, before the Mexican-American War in the 1800s. Their roots to the region are a lot deeper than those of many Americans. And horror of horrors, a lot of them still speak Spanish!
Protip #2: The United States is one of a very few countries on the planet who have an "English-only" policy. In fact, most countries REQUIRE basic skills in a second language, and several bring teachers from overseas to teach.

Finally, I notice a lack of criticism for European countries in this screed. Of course the fact that you're a bunch of white nationalists (at least that's what I gather from the pro-David Duke article, and content from VNN and Stormfront that is all over the site) might have something to do with that part.

306 abolitionist  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:32:01pm

re: #251 MikeySDCA

OT: Wikipedia did not shut down as promised (threatened?)

Web goes on strike ... "will start the blackout at 8AM EST and end at 8PM EST." ( Wed 18 Jan )

307 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:32:04pm

re: #299 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Khorne worshipers, pure and simple

Yeah, but I was trying to stick to the theme of the original metaphor.

308 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:32:07pm

re: #296 Stanley Sea

You know, I'm behind in the thread but this needs more comment.

This is what's happening. We are creating, living in, and unfortunately thriving in an American society where we are defining people (fathers, mothers, family, neighbors, etc.) as WORTH ANYTHING, OR NOT WORTH ANYTHING.

That debate last night shockingly showed it clear.

Annoys the shit out of me really. Really, you see anti government fanatics act like you don't have a real job if you're working for your government. That's a load of shit. My mom's worked her ass off, as did my dad's dad before, and millions of others who wake up everyday to work for their government. What has me mad about many of the rabid anti illegal immigration people is they seem like the idea of acknowledging that these people are people with dreams.

309 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:32:10pm

re: #260 Lidane

Mercifully, it's taken Rick Perry showing his ignorance on a national stage to finally break through the wall of denial around here:

[Link: www.publicpolicypolling.com...]

He's made the Texas GOP look like the ignorant morans that they are just by being himself, and they hate him for it. It's glorious.

And he got quite rich, by being their puppet. Game over. Look up how public sector for his whole life Perry became a multi-millionaire. Ya. Those public sector folks!

310 Digital Display  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:32:16pm

Hi Lizards!
All my bags are packed I'm ready to go..
I fly home early this morning..I'd like to thank all the lizards thoughts and prayers about my Dad passing...It really means alot to me..
I spent hours alone today writing about pops.. Those words I want to say in front of him.. This last hour..I have worked very hard today to do him very proud of his life...My goal is to speak the best tribute in the history of the world..There will be joy, laughter, tears and introspect of the soul for 15 minutes...I hope he will be proud of his son..I am so proud of Him

311 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:32:40pm

re: #303 Dark_Falcon

Let me reverse the question, if I may: What evidence do you have that Walker wanted to restrict unions further? Because I have seen little on that point save supposition.

If he wanted to save money, the Unions were willing to cut back their costs.

Walker insisted on breaking them completely and refused to strike a deal.

Why would he do that unless his end game was busting unions?

312 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:33:07pm

re: #306 abolitionist

Web goes on strike ... "will start the blackout at 8AM EST and end at 8PM EST." ( Wed 18 Jan )

That's pretty good, because Wiki's been running a countdown since yesterday and is down to less than an hour.

313 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:33:15pm

re: #285 mracb

If I recall correctly, wasn't it $400 for each 16k? I worked at Computerland in those days.

OMFG! I used to just drive the local Computerland staff nuts hanging out there and drooling over the latest and greatest. The last time I remember visiting before they disappeared, they had just gotten in the the Macintosh Portable. It was a 68k laptop that weighed more and was bigger than a Mac Plus but slower... :EEK:

I fell in love with the SE/30 about the same time. Still love the one I have :D

314 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:33:25pm

re: #308 HappyWarrior

Government workers are parasites doncha know!!!
///

America!!!!Fuck yeah!!!!

315 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:34:57pm

re: #314 Amory Blaine

Government workers are parasites doncha know!!!
///

America!!!Fuck yeah!!!

Yeah I see that comment alot on right wing blogs. What a bunch of toolbags. Yeah because you're soooooooooo independent, Mr. bigshot. Seriously would people talk that kind of crap about soldiers? Anti government fanatics seem to conveniently ignore that our troops are part of the government.But yeah drives me nuts seeing government workers being called parasites. Load of shit.

316 RadicalModerate  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:35:13pm

re: #251 MikeySDCA

It hasn't happened yet - the Wiki "shutdown" starts at midnight EST.

317 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:35:14pm

Walker didn't say anything about busting unions when he ran for governor.

318 jaunte  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:35:59pm

re: #317 Amory Blaine

Well, not in public.

319 abolitionist  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:37:19pm

re: #278 Romantic Heretic

Mine came with 48K. I splurged.

I still have trouble distinguishing between MB, GB and TB.

I'm old. :(

My first personal computer was a SYM-1 with 4KB ram; I hand-coded my printer driver --which took about 1/2 page in source form. (I may be older.)

320 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:37:39pm

re: #317 Amory Blaine

Walker didn't say anything about busting unions when he ran for governor.

I looked it up back in the day, Walker's whole rhetoric on the campaign trail was about bringing the unions to the table and working out a new deal that kept the pensions viable.

321 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:38:01pm

re: #309 Stanley Sea

What was the verdict on your car?

322 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:38:57pm

re: #315 HappyWarrior

toolbags

Haha

+

323 Interesting Times  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:38:58pm

re: #314 Amory Blaine

Government workers are parasites doncha know!!

Everyone read this. Comment by LGF member dmon (who is a firefighter), and CuriousLurker's response.

324 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:39:47pm

re: #297 Jimmi the Grey

I was gonna say the Ferengi, but...

Not really. The Ferengi are capitalistic, but in most games they lack the ability to train their ships and crews well. So they may have better ships than the Cardassians, but the Cardassians have more skilled crews.

325 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:40:13pm

re: #319 abolitionist

My first personal computer was a SYM-1 with 4KB ram; I hand-coded my printer driver --which took about 1/2 page in source form. (I may be older.)

Sound's like CP/M to me! Gah, 8.3 anyone?

326 abolitionist  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:40:24pm

re: #312 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

That's pretty good, because Wiki's been running a countdown since yesterday and is down to less than an hour.

I left out the part about the scripting automation. If websites are going dark manually, midnight is as good a time as any, I guess.

327 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:41:31pm

re: #324 Dark_Falcon

Not really. The Ferengi are capitalistic, but in most games they lack the ability to train their ships and crews well. So they may have better ships than the Cardassians, but the Cardassians have more skilled crews.

You are correct on game mechanics. On ideology on the other hand...

328 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:42:04pm

re: #324 Dark_Falcon

Not really. The Ferengi are capitalistic, but in most games they lack the ability to train their ships and crews well. So they may have better ships than the Cardassians, but the Cardassians have more skilled crews.

Its not that they lack the ability, they just prefer not to spend the money.

329 Romantic Heretic  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:42:50pm

re: #297 Jimmi the Grey

I was gonna say the Ferengi, but...

Short, ugly, sexist and greedy?

330 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:42:56pm

re: #262 ggt

Quick!

what is another legal type word for "misrepresented"

something that means "outright lie"

Thanks, writing a letter.

Falsified.

331 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:43:22pm

re: #328 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Its not that they lack the ability, they just prefer not to spend the money.

It's what you get for hiring your crew at as minimum a wage as you can.

332 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:43:45pm

Here's what Walker did prior to his being elected Gov. that could be construed as a clue, if you think Walker is braindead. :

In 2009, then Milwaukee County Executive Scott Walker promised he would save the county money by firing unionized courthouse security guards and replacing them with private security guards. Walker claimed that using a private security firm at the courthouse and other county facilities would save taxpayers more than $125,000 a year. The plan was rejected by the County Board.

In March of the same year, Walker, in an “emergency budget measure,” (sound familiar?) unilaterally ordered the ouster of the security guards and replaced them with a private firm after Walker claimed a potential 2010 year-end deficit of about $7 million.

Then what happened?

In January of 2010, an arbitrator ruled against Walker's actions. “The county did not have a true budget crisis at the time and county officials failed to give the union representing the security guards an opportunity to make some alternative cost-saving proposals before laying them off,” said arbitrator Amedeo Greco.

He fucking lied to fire the security.

Then, because of his arrogance and stupidity, the county was ordered to backpay the fired security guardsand offer their jobs that he unjustly ended.

333 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:43:55pm

Also Dark some provisions that Walker wanted had nothing to do about saving any one money and were just a great big FU to unions.

Like making it so unions had to vote to stay in existence more often. Or that they needed to get the majority of the people involved and not just the majority of the people who bothered to cast votes.

Things like that aren't about saving anyone money they're about busting unions and once you've proven yourself hostile to one set of unions, why should any other union trust you?

Better to make one great stand together than be taken apart one by one, solidarity forever if you will....

334 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:44:15pm

re: #310 HoosierHoops

And, you know in your heart, how PROUD he is of you.
Be well.

(My typing sucks)

335 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:44:37pm

re: #328 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Its not that they lack the ability, they just prefer not to spend the money.

Why keep your own armed forces and training them when you can just use your money to hire the lowest bidding mercs?

336 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:45:09pm

re: #310 HoosierHoops

Oh, and go have too many of his favorite drinks & cry, in his honor.
He would like that.

337 Romantic Heretic  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:45:15pm

re: #303 Dark_Falcon

Let me reverse the question, if I may: What evidence do you have that Walker wanted to restrict unions further? Because I have seen little on that point save supposition.

Why would he stop? The GOP make it clear the right of assembly doesn't apply to unions, public or private.

I wonder what other rights they'll restrict according to class and political belief?

338 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:47:05pm

re: #311 jamesfirecat

If he wanted to save money, the Unions were willing to cut back their costs.

Walker insisted on breaking them completely and refused to strike a deal.

Why would he do that unless his end game was busting unions?

Because he suspected a bait and switch, perhaps. It has often happened that Democrats have gotten higher taxes or fees that go into effect right away, or gotten a tax planned tax cut scrapped, in exchange for a more gradual cut in spending. But when the time comes to actually make the cuts, the Dems balk and call the GOP "heartless" if Republicans try to insist on the agreed-upon cuts.

339 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:47:29pm

re: #310 HoosierHoops

And may the ignorant Nazis of the TSA let you fly in ease!

340 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:48:19pm

re: #304 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And we're listening to men who compare balancing the federal budget to balancing your checkbook at home and declare that the government should be "run like a business." And nodding along to it all, telling ourselves that only businessmen, who've years of experience running companies, can get America's economy back on track rather than plunder it as they have companies they've run.

the unspoken part of the GOP saying that the government should be "run like a business" is the part where they install sleazy management, run it into the ground, fire everyone, steal their pensions, and sell off the assets to the Chinese

341 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:48:36pm

re: #333 jamesfirecat

This is why the Democrats need to fight fire with fire.

The tax-exempt status of Conservative Religious Organizations is a good counter-target.

342 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:48:45pm

re: #330 Floral Giraffe

Falsified.

Still too strong. I want a full refund from these people. I'll stick with "exaggerated" until I have to get nasty. Hope I don't have to. It's a rather strongly, but still nicely, worded letter.

:0

343 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:48:52pm

re: #262 ggt

Quick!

what is another legal type word for "misrepresented"

something that means "outright lie"

Thanks, writing a letter.

Perjure.

344 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:49:20pm

re: #333 jamesfirecat

Also Dark some provisions that Walker wanted had nothing to do about saving any one money and were just a great big FU to unions.

Like making it so unions had to vote to stay in existence more often. Or that they needed to get the majority of the people involved and not just the majority of the people who bothered to cast votes.

Things like that aren't about saving anyone money they're about busting unions and once you've proven yourself hostile to one set of unions, why should any other union trust you?

Better to make one great stand together than be taken apart one by one, solidarity forever if you will...

"We must all hang together or we, most assuredly, shall all hang separately."

Sigh. Possibly the greatest of the founding fathers born 306 years ago today.

345 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:49:32pm

Letter finished, and proofed.

Saved for overnight digestion. If all is the same in the morning, I will send via email.

346 Lidane  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:50:11pm

The GOP suddenly cares about children that have been born:

GOP Senator: We Need ‘Child Labor’ To Fight Obesity Epidemic

That's a novel approach. I can't wait to see how Faux News spins this.

347 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:50:17pm

re: #343 goddamnedfrank

Perjure.

Forswear.

348 RadicalModerate  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:50:24pm

re: #146 mracb

Apple IIs came with 4k or 16k standard.

I was more of a Commodore CBM/PET fan here. Originally came in 4K, 16K and 32K models. For games, I had an Atari 800, with 2(!) expansion cartridge slots. Later got a C64, which lasted until I entered the world of MS/IBM.

On a side note, one of my near-future purchases is gonna be one of these bad boys, simply for the nostalgia value.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

349 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:50:31pm

re: #341 ProLifeLiberal

This is why the Democrats need to fight fire with fire.

The tax-exempt status of Conservative Religious Organizations is a good counter-target.

It is amazing to me how many religious institutions seem more like businesses than churches. I know Protestant ministers don't take the Catholic vow of poverty but wow it just strikes me as sort of obscene that you have these preachers who are more celebrities than men of God. Totally different than what my grandmother's brother was doing when he was a priest.

350 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:50:48pm

re: #346 Lidane

The GOP suddenly cares about children that have been born:

GOP Senator: We Need ‘Child Labor’ To Fight Obesity Epidemic

That's a novel approach. I can't wait to see how Faux News spins this.

hmmm, will Senator's obese children be included in the work gangs?

351 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:51:15pm

re: #328 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Its not that they lack the ability, they just prefer not to spend the money.

Which means they end up spending more money replacing the ships when the Federation or the Klingon Empire (both of which field well-trained crews) vaporize the Ferengi's ships (More the Klingons, than the Federation, as the latter actively trades with the Ferengi Alliance).

/It turns out I'm more of a Star Trek geek than i thought.

352 Eclectic Infidel  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:51:22pm

re: #328 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Its not that they lack the ability, they just prefer not to spend the money.

I recall in the abysmal first season of TNG that a Ferengi admitted to either Riker or another officer that no one had ever tried to attack them. I got the impression that Ferengi weaponry was more than simply formidable. In fact, throughout the entire series, I don't recall the Ferengi going to war against any race, differences with the Federation aside of course.

353 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:51:31pm

re: #338 Dark_Falcon

Because he suspected a bait and switch, perhaps. It has often happened that Democrats have gotten higher taxes or fees that go into effect right away, or gotten a tax planned tax cut scrapped, in exchange for a more gradual cut in spending. But when the time comes to actually make the cuts, the Dems balk and call the GOP "heartless" if Republicans try to insist on the agreed-upon cuts.

Why the actions addressed in my post #333 which were nothing but blatent "F*** YOU to unions and didn't save anyone any money?"|

Things like.....
Like making it so unions had to vote to stay in existence more often. Or that they needed to get the majority of the people involved and not just the majority of the people who bothered to cast votes.

Do either of the above save the state any money or do they just exist to screw unions?

354 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:51:38pm

What is with the obsession with child labor? First Newt, now Grassley?

355 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:51:42pm

re: #349 HappyWarrior

Exactly.

Also, appeases (and very slightly) reduces my anger.

356 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:51:53pm

re: #338 Dark_Falcon

Because he suspected a bait and switch, perhaps. It has often happened that Democrats have gotten higher taxes or fees that go into effect right away, or gotten a tax planned tax cut scrapped, in exchange for a more gradual cut in spending. But when the time comes to actually make the cuts, the Dems balk and call the GOP "heartless" if Republicans try to insist on the agreed-upon cuts.

And so decided to teach those buggers a lesson by not even offering sit down with them, but moving straight to the "kneecap and let bleed to death slowly" strategy. *rolls eyes*

357 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:52:12pm

re: #349 HappyWarrior

It is amazing to me how many religious institutions seem more like businesses than churches. I know Protestant ministers don't take the Catholic vow of poverty but wow it just strikes me as sort of obscene that you have these preachers who are more celebrities than men of God. Totally different than what my grandmother's brother was doing when he was a priest.

Yeah, growing-up Catholic, I have a knee-jerk distrust of those that don't take a vow of poverty (even the Jesuits, although I have respected the one's I've met).

Jesus and $$$ just don't go together IMHO.

358 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:52:37pm

re: #348 RadicalModerate

"Expansion!" This is what i was expanding with my Atari 400

359 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:52:53pm

re: #352 eclectic infidel

I recall in the abysmal first season of TNG that a Ferengi admitted to either Riker or another officer that no one had ever tried to attack them. I got the impression that Ferengi weaponry was more than simply formidable. In fact, throughout the entire series, I don't recall the Ferengi going to war against any race, differences with the Federation aside of course.

Well, it's a money thing. I think the Swiss learned that as well ---

*ducks*

360 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:52:56pm

re: #355 ProLifeLiberal

Exactly.

Also, appeases (and very slightly) reduces my anger.

It doesn't really anger me but it just makes me more adverse than I already am to organized religion. I mean honest growing up in Virginia, I am shocked that Falwell or Robertson never tried to open up a fast food place or something like that with their name on it.

361 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:53:25pm

re: #346 Lidane

The GOP suddenly cares about children that have been born:

GOP Senator: We Need ‘Child Labor’ To Fight Obesity Epidemic

That's a novel approach. I can't wait to see how Faux News spins this.

Grassley LeGree: send 'em upriver to the HFC plantation. It's for their own good!!!

362 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:53:38pm

re: #348 RadicalModerate

I was more of a Commodore CBM/PET fan here. Originally came in 4K, 16K and 32K models. For games, I had an Atari 800, with 2(!) expansion cartridge slots. Later got a C64, which lasted until I entered the world of MS/IBM.

On a side note, one of my near-future purchases is gonna be one of these bad boys, simply for the nostalgia value.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

I think about getting an Amiga 500 again, once in awhile. But my Mac SE/30 can still do real work (in Word 5.1a) where an Amiga 500 can't really do much other than be a toy. I may just get an Amiga emulator instead.

363 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:54:04pm

re: #349 HappyWarrior

It is amazing to me how many religious institutions seem more like businesses than churches. I know Protestant ministers don't take the Catholic vow of poverty but wow it just strikes me as sort of obscene that you have these preachers who are more celebrities than men of God. Totally different than what my grandmother's brother was doing when he was a priest.

I just assume all churches are human power structures, and thus they're not really much different than any business

some are benevolent, some are dysfunctional, some are greedy thieves

364 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:54:18pm

re: #357 ggt

Yeah, growing-up Catholic, I have a knee-jerk distrust of those that don't take a vow of poverty (even the Jesuits, although I have respected the one's I've met).

Jesus and $$$ just don't go together IMHO.

Didn't know that about the Jesuits. Yeah it just strikes me as weird seeing a guy like Robertson who is more of a celebrity than he is minister at this point. Guys like my great uncle Bill who I just mentioned spent their time administering to the poor. I respect that despite my relative agnosticism than someone like Robertson who is only in it for Pat.

365 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:55:53pm

re: #363 WindUpBird

I just assume all churches are human power structures, and thus they're not really much different than any business

some are benevolent, some are dysfunctional, some are greedy thieves

Yeah they all are to some degree but damn some of them just come across as being more like a huge conglomerate than church. It's funny especially with Baptists given that they originally formed in opposition to over the top church wealth.

366 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:56:11pm

re: #349 HappyWarrior

It is amazing to me how many religious institutions seem more like businesses than churches. I know Protestant ministers don't take the Catholic vow of poverty but wow it just strikes me as sort of obscene that you have these preachers who are more celebrities than men of God. Totally different than what my grandmother's brother was doing when he was a priest.

Most Protestant churches, at least in America, are nothing like American megachurches. In many Black churches, such as the one my father first pastored, the ministers also have full time jobs and are not salaried.

We never lived in a parsonage, but parsonage living sux! Many a member of my mother's family did it.

367 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:56:35pm

re: #364 HappyWarrior

Didn't know that about the Jesuits. Yeah it just strikes me as weird seeing a guy like Robertson who is more of a celebrity than he is minister at this point. Guys like my great uncle Bill who I just mentioned spent their time administering to the poor. I respect that despite my relative agnosticism than someone like Robertson who is only in it for Pat.

One of our Jesuit friends is the most humble and parsimonius people I've ever met. They may not take a vow of poverty, but most I've met are not gluttonous either.

Some of the other Preacher-types you almost expect to carry a credit card swiper in their pockets. Maybe the Catholic Church has been in the business so long they don't have the fundraising challenges the protestant churches do?

368 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:56:39pm

re: #357 ggt

Yeah, growing-up Catholic, I have a knee-jerk distrust of those that don't take a vow of poverty (even the Jesuits, although I have respected the one's I've met).

Jesus and $$$ just don't go together IMHO.

Heh, I understand. I give Franciscan's and Jesuits an automatic pass. Dominican's OTOH... Bennies can be suspect too, LOL!

It's a good thing I'm an Episcopalian. I like our fraternal arguments better. At least we never burned each other.

369 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:56:51pm

re: #365 HappyWarrior

Yeah they all are to some degree but damn some of them just come across as being more like a huge conglomerate than church. It's funny especially with Baptists given that they originally formed in opposition to over the top church wealth.

the bigger they get, yeah!

Like family business versus working for Bloomberg or Enron, heh

370 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:57:38pm

re: #360 HappyWarrior

It doesn't really anger me but it just makes me more adverse than I already am to organized religion. I mean honest growing up in Virginia, I am shocked that Falwell or Robertson never tried to open up a fast food place or something like that with their name on it.

Lol why settle for a hamburger joint when you can cut right to the chase and just go for blood diamonds. /

371 Digital Display  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:57:45pm

re: #339 Floral Giraffe

And may the ignorant Nazis of the TSA let you fly in ease!

Hi You..My folks were special like yours..We spoke many hours about it..
I'm stunned..A million things going on..You know

372 freetoken  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:58:05pm

The NCDC is doing their annual analysis of the previous year.

In regards to precipitation, it turns out last year was the wettest on record for several north-east and old northwest-territory states:
States Map
while Texas had its driest month on record.

373 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:58:20pm

re: #342 ggt

Still too strong. I want a full refund from these people. I'll stick with "exaggerated" until I have to get nasty. Hope I don't have to. It's a rather strongly, but still nicely, worded letter.

:0

Can you say that they exaggerated their claims?

374 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:58:25pm

re: #370 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Lol why settle for a hamburger joint when you can cut right to the chase and just go for blood diamonds. /

No f*&^ng shit!

You nailed that one.

375 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:58:42pm

re: #373 Floral Giraffe

Can you say that they exaggerated their claims?

that's about exactly what I said.

376 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:58:52pm

re: #367 ggt

One of our Jesuit friends is the most humble and parsimonius people I've ever met. They may not take a vow of poverty, but most I've met are not gluttonous either.

Some of the other Preacher-types you almost expect to carry a credit card swiper in their pockets. Maybe the Catholic Church has been in the business so long they don't have the fundraising challenges the protestant churches do?

I always admired the Jesuits for their intellectual curiosity above all. I think with the church there's always been a bunch of poor priests and wealthy priests. From my understanding of the French and other revolutions in Catholic countries, the more poor priests were more sympathetic with the commoners while the more rich ones stood up for the elites.

377 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:59:00pm

re: #345 ggt

Letter finished, and proofed.

Saved for overnight digestion. If all is the same in the morning, I will send via email.

NO! Certified with proof of delivery. Much more effective. Cheap too!

378 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:59:31pm

re: #359 ggt

Well, it's a money thing. I think the Swiss learned that as well ---

*ducks*

No, seriously, I've always thought it was a sly dig at the swiss. They have had some truly strange weapons that would probably not work well in combat over the past century because their last real war was their short civil war after Napoleon pulled out. Without testing in combat you end up with nice target rifles you might not want to carry into battle...

379 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:59:49pm

re: #366 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Most Protestant churches, at least in America, are nothing like American megachurches. In many Black churches, such as the one my father first pastored, the ministers also have full time jobs and are not salaried.

We never lived in a parsonage, but parsonage living sux! Many a member of my mother's family did it.

Yeah I know most Protestant churches aren't like that. The megachurches just turn me off for some reason even though I am not religious so I really shouldn't care.

380 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 8:59:58pm

re: #371 HoosierHoops

Big old (((Hugs))) You know.
Be well!

381 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:00:19pm

re: #370 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Lol why settle for a hamburger joint when you can cut right to the chase and just go for blood diamonds. /

Ah Pat and Chuck's Excellent Diamond Adventures.

382 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:00:55pm

re: #381 HappyWarrior

Ah Pat and Chuck's Excellent Diamond Adventures.

someone photoshop King Diamond makeup on Pat Robertson

383 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:00:58pm

re: #377 Floral Giraffe

NO! Certified with proof of delivery. Much more effective. Cheap too!

They emailed a letter to me backpeddling on what I was told. So, I'll email back with that receipt notification thingy.

Again, trying to remain civil. May have to go to the Attorney General on it. I now have two items I may be going to the Attorney General for.

Sounds like a year of paper work.

UGH!

384 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:01:30pm

re: #379 HappyWarrior

Yeah I know most Protestant churches aren't like that. The megachurches just turn me off for some reason even though I am not religious so I really shouldn't care.

Yeah, I don't care what the megachurches do within their walls. It's only when the bigot ones try and impose their crappy bullshit on me that the trouble starts. Otherwise, live/let live.

385 dragonath  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:02:01pm

re: #378 wlewisiii

Ah I was going to look that up on Wikipedia but it just turned 12:00. Arghhh

386 Big Joe  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:02:28pm

re: #372 freetoken

The NCDC is doing their annual analysis of the previous year.

In regards to precipitation, it turns out last year was the wettest on record for several north-east and old northwest-territory states:
States Map
while Texas had its driest month on record.

I question that map with regards to Northern California. We've had 1.5" of rain. I've lived here 50 years and I do not recall a drier year. 1976 was close though.

387 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:02:48pm

re: #378 wlewisiii

No, seriously, I've always thought it was a sly dig at the swiss. They have had some truly strange weapons that would probably not work well in combat over the past century because their last real war was their short civil war after Napoleon pulled out. Without testing in combat you end up with nice target rifles you might not want to carry into battle...

Hey no hating on the Swiss. I might be Swiss-German or so family lore says.

388 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:03:02pm

re: #384 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Yeah, I don't care what the megachurches do within their walls. It's only when the bigot ones try and impose their crappy bullshit on me that the trouble starts. Otherwise, live/let live.

Most megachurches, IMHO, are just like the traditional Catholic Church complexes --gym, auditorium, meeting rooms, schoolrooms. They are just built like modern buildings in a more cost-effective and less decorative manner.

389 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:03:10pm

re: #383 ggt

They emailed a letter to me backpeddling on what I was told. So, I'll email back with that receipt notification thingy.

Again, trying to remain civil. May have to go to the Attorney General on it. I now have two items I may be going to the Attorney General for.

Sounds like a year of paper work.

UGH!

Send them a copy of their email in your certified letter.
I don't know quite why, but trust me here, certified
scares them in a way that email can not!
Rotsa Ruck to you!

390 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:03:53pm

re: #378 wlewisiii

No, seriously, I've always thought it was a sly dig at the swiss. They have had some truly strange weapons that would probably not work well in combat over the past century because their last real war was their short civil war after Napoleon pulled out. Without testing in combat you end up with nice target rifles you might not want to carry into battle...

Well, kinda silly to attack the place that has all your secret money.

:)

391 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:03:53pm

re: #387 HappyWarrior

Hey no hating on the Swiss. I might be Swiss-German or so family lore says.

familysearch.org

Find out for free.

392 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:04:20pm

re: #360 HappyWarrior

I think you missed a conversation on an earlier thread.

While the increased anger from Utoya is gone, the feelings themselves are still there. They just transplanted onto resentment about treatment earlier in my life.

393 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:04:37pm

re: #390 ggt

Well, kinda silly to attack the place that has all your secret money.

:)

I'm dealing with an attorney.

I'm going to remain civil.

394 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:05:55pm

re: #393 ggt

I'm dealing with an attorney.

I'm going to remain civil.

I have had to kick some attorneys.
Just saying.
I did kick them gently the first time...

395 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:05:59pm

re: #391 EmmmieG

familysearch.org

Find out for free.

Nice! Thanks. Anyhow I've always known that my Dad's paternal great grandparents were German born and that his father came to the US with them as a young boy but we don't know where in Germany. And I am the only one in the family really interested in this stuff.

396 freetoken  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:06:58pm

re: #386 mracb

There are more detailed maps, with each state broken into regions:
States' regional 2011 temps

States' regional 2011 precipitation

Precipitation can be highly localized, and county by county divisions would likely show that your area was quite dry.

Also, by looking at that temp map one can see why KT's tomatoes performed so badly, as the coastal NW temps were near record lows.

397 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:07:00pm

re: #392 ProLifeLiberal

I think you missed a conversation on an earlier thread.

While the increased anger from Utoya is gone, the feelings themselves are still there. They just transplanted onto resentment about treatment earlier in my life.

Gotcha man. Hang in there tho.

398 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:07:25pm

DF while I want to have this discussion with you I need to get up in seven hours for work tommorow (I think I'm like two hours ahead of you time zone wise) so yeah... I'm going to bed, and you have a moderately good night, we'll have plenty of time to talk this over when Charles does a thread about the Walker recall effort.

I'll be the guy whose posting the scene from Matilda where the entire school rises up against the evil Principle and chases her away never to be heard from again.

(Or at least I would be if it weren't impossible to find on Youtube...

399 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:08:02pm

re: #396 freetoken

There are more detailed maps, with each state broken into regions:
States' regional 2011 temps

States' regional 2011 precipitation

Precipitation can be highly localized, and county by county divisions would likely show that your area was quite dry.

Also, by looking at that temp map one can see why KT's tomatoes performed so badly, as the coastal NW temps were near record lows.

The world, it is a changing.

400 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:08:23pm

OH GOD ALL IS LOST

401 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:08:26pm

re: #387 HappyWarrior

Hey no hating on the Swiss. I might be Swiss-German or so family lore says.

Who's hating? My wife is Swiss/German-American. Her grandparents immigrated after WWI.

Those straight pull bolt actions are great for the target range but I'd not wished to carry them in those trenches...

402 Big Joe  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:08:38pm

re: #396 freetoken

That's even worse, it says our county is normal.

403 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:08:45pm

re: #394 Floral Giraffe

I have had to kick some attorneys.
Just saying.
I did kick them gently the first time...

I know, but I think I can still work a deal with them. If I remain nice enough and I think they need my money.

404 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:08:53pm

re: #401 wlewisiii

Who's hating? My wife is Swiss/German-American. Her grandparents immigrated after WWI.

Those straight pull bolt actions are great for the target range but I'd not wished to carry them in those trenches...

Just teasing.Sorry about the misunderstanding. Always wanted to go there. Looks beautiful in the photos and I was in Austria and Germany.

405 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:08:54pm

re: #400 WindUpBird

OH GOD ALL IS LOST

How will we live? How will we survive?! It's the endtimes, man!!

///

406 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:09:37pm

re: #400 WindUpBird

OH GOD ALL IS LOST

WOW, that is well done.

407 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:09:43pm

re: #388 ggt

Give me an old cathedral or basilica to a megachurch eyesore, any old day.

408 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:10:37pm

re: #407 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Give me an old cathedral or basilica to a megachurch eyesore, any old day.

Me too.

I'm an architecture nut.

Some of them are just too beautiful for words.

409 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:11:02pm

re: #400 WindUpBird

OH GOD ALL IS LOST

Good for them. Much like OWS reminding people about 1% vs 99%, this will teach many more people than anything else could.

410 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:11:18pm

Wait, the horseman of the Lost Internet Information?

I missed that one.

411 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:11:47pm

re: #408 ggt

Me too.

I'm an architecture nut.

Some of them are just too beautiful for words.

Saw some great ones when I was overseas a few years back. I really wanted to see the one in Prague where the partisans who killed Heydich hid but it was closed that day. St. Vitus was beautiful though.

412 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:12:39pm

re: #398 jamesfirecat

DF while I want to have this discussion with you I need to get up in seven hours for work tommorow (I think I'm like two hours ahead of you time zone wise) so yeah... I'm going to bed, and you have a moderately good night, we'll have plenty of time to talk this over when Charles does a thread about the Walker recall effort.

I'll be the guy whose posting the scene from Matilda where the entire school rises up against the evil Principle and chases her away never to be heard from again.

(Or at least I would be if it weren't impossible to find on Youtube...

Smart idea, James. I've got to remember to turn in on time tonight, too.

413 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:12:45pm

re: #406 ggt

Oh good, they will give me the ability to fuck with my representatives.

414 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:12:52pm

re: #407 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Give me an old cathedral or basilica to a megachurch eyesore, any old day.

If you ever get the opportunity to visit a BAPS temple/mandir do so. Anyone can enter and pray in any (quiet) way. They give tours as well. Just drop in.

The interior is absolutely breathtaking. You can feel the psychology of the architecture like in an old cathedral.

415 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:13:39pm

Millions of kids who have a paper due tomorrow are screaming in agony.

An argument between bros about the 1967 superbowl is going unresolved.

There was at least one article in the middle of being disputed that is frozen in aspic.

416 engineer cat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:13:42pm

re: #400 WindUpBird

OH GOD ALL IS LOST

can't think clearly... need information... all is dark, stumbling, lost... can't find out anything about the history of goat cheese...

417 jamesfirecat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:14:06pm

Wait I found it, an rather poor quality version of it, but here it is!

Youtube Video

And now good night everybody!

418 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:14:12pm

re: #416 engineer dog

can't think clearly... need information... all is dark, stumbling, lost... can't find out anything about the history of goat cheese...

how the fuck will I look up the displacement of a 1995 volvo 850 now

419 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:15:20pm

EmmmieG thanks for the link. Have found some useful things like a copy of a great grandfather's draft reg card.

420 freetoken  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:15:21pm

re: #402 mracb

That's even worse, it says our county is normal.

Those aren't counties, they are state divisions. Again, your own locale may be quite different in regards to precipitation, but precipitation can be quite localized.

421 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:15:43pm

re: #321 goddamnedfrank

What was the verdict on your car?

Frank, so far behind, but thanks for asking.

Towed (photos yeah) Tomorrow will know!

422 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:16:46pm

re: #421 Stanley Sea

Frank, so far behind, but thanks for asking.

Towed (photos yeah) Tomorrow will know!

You not playing word games lately?

sorry about the car.

423 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:16:58pm

Today, thousands of innocent children might have to just read the friggin' book...

424 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:17:17pm

G'night all.

425 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:17:26pm

They actually show an article for a second there. Time enough for ctrl-a/ctrl-c.

426 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:18:03pm

re: #414 ggt

If you ever get the opportunity to visit a BAPS temple/mandir do so. Anyone can enter and pray in any (quiet) way. They give tours as well. Just drop in.

The interior is absolutely breathtaking. You can feel the psychology of the architecture like in an old cathedral.

[Link: www.malaysiasite.nl...]

I visited this place in Georgetown on Penang Island.

427 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:18:05pm

re: #323 publicityStunted

Everyone read this. Comment by LGF member dmon (who is a firefighter), and CuriousLurker's response.

The beauty of being behind. Those who missed, here ya go.

428 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:18:54pm

for all your wiki editing needs, feel free to vandalize conservapedia with photos of Phyllis Schlafly's testicles

429 engineer cat  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:19:09pm

Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA) in the U.S. House of Representatives and PROTECT IP Act (PIPA) in the U.S. Senate. If passed, this legislation will harm the free and open Internet and inhibit people's access to information online.

Why? SOPA and PIPA put the burden on website owners to police user-contributed material and call for the unnecessary blocking of entire sites. Small sites won't have sufficient resources to defend themselves. Big media companies may seek to cut off funding sources for their foreign competitors, even if copyright isn't being infringed. Foreign sites will be blacklisted, which means they won't show up in major search engines. SOPA and PIPA build a framework for future restrictions and suppression.

just like with the stalinistic "patriot" act, all measures restricting civil rights come with a bodyguard of Perfectly Reasonable Explanations about why it is in Your Best Interest to give the government more control over your freedom of communication. It's all Very Reasonable, and nobody in the government would ever think of abusing the new laws in ways not foreseen or talked about right now...

430 abolitionist  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:19:55pm

re: #418 WindUpBird

how the fuck will I look up the displacement of a 1995 volvo 850 now

Other search engines still work. Using dogpile.com I found

popular.ebay.com/…nger-vehicles/volvo-850-turbo.htm

The Volvo 850, manufactured between 1992 and 1997, is a mid-size luxury car or ... turbocharged engine with displacement of 2435.00 cc that generates 222.00 ...

431 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:20:07pm

re: #428 WindUpBird

A couple years ago, I actually went on a article blanking spree on their site.

Killed 40 articles before I was banned.

432 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:20:42pm

re: #429 engineer dog

Nah, it's all the fault of Anonymous and OWS. They're to blame for the loss of internet freedoms, haven't you heard?/

433 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:20:58pm

Google's front page has also changed:

Google.com

And leads to here:

Google: Take Action

434 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:22:00pm

re: #426 oaktree

[Link: www.malaysiasite.nl...]

I visited this place in Georgetown on Penang Island.

That one looks beautiful as well!

435 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:22:48pm

re: #400 WindUpBird

OH GOD ALL IS LOST

Zip code 10101 is your basic NYC zip, if you want to be fake.
I did.

436 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:23:05pm

The Princess is mourning the loss of wikipedia.

Seriously--our pop culture is now a blank again. How are we supposed to remember exactly which supermodels are married to which popstars?

437 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:23:25pm

re: #427 Stanley Sea

The beauty of being behind. Those who missed, here ya go.

reminds me of the soldiers who were advised not to wear street clothes when in the US and off duty.

WTF?

438 Big Joe  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:23:45pm

re: #420 freetoken

Those aren't counties, they are state divisions. Again, your own locale may be quite different in regards to precipitation, but precipitation can be quite localized.

I'm telling you it has hardly rained at all within 150 miles of here since July. The Bay Area is in a major record drought.

439 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:23:46pm

Found a cool old show on Netflix, but it sucks it only lasted 4 episodes. Its called Cadfael, its about a former soldier turned Benedictine monk in medieval England who solves murders.

440 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:24:10pm

re: #434 ggt

That one looks beautiful as well!

[Link: s29.photobucket.com...]

Link to my photos from the upper part of the complex. Wish I had had a better camera since the long shots are not so good. And thus it was hard to get a good picture of a 30m high bronze statue.

441 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:25:18pm

re: #439 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Found a cool old show on Netflix, but it sucks it only lasted 4 episodes. Its called Cadfael, its about a former soldier turned Benedictine monk in medieval England who solves murders.

I love Cadfael. The books are good too!

Good, old fashioned, whodunits!

442 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:25:48pm

re: #419 HappyWarrior

EmmmieG thanks for the link. Have found some useful things like a copy of a great grandfather's draft reg card.

I just finished up something like 30-40 hours of work on a single microfilm record from Germany. I had gotten the link from that site.

However, reading it in Latin was...delightful. Yes, delightful. If you find squinting at old microfilm records from before the era of standardized handwriting fun.

443 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:27:45pm

Without Wikipedia, I started searching for random stuff.

Apparently, Marrakech is considered a world class romantic city.

If I'm not too defective, I'll keep that in mind.

444 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:28:00pm

re: #439 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Found a cool old show on Netflix, but it sucks it only lasted 4 episodes. Its called Cadfael, its about a former soldier turned Benedictine monk in medieval England who solves murders.

In Shrewsbury. Only part of the monastery is left, it was spared after Henry VIII seized it and was used as a parish church. Made out of a nice red sandstone.

Was this the show with Derek Jacobi playing Cadfael?

445 freetoken  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:28:03pm

re: #438 mracb

Another example, here is the December 2011 percent of normal precipitation, mapped for the lower 48 but on a finer grid:
December precipitation

You can indeed see that the Bay area shows very low percentage of normal for precipitation for Dec 2011.

However, taken over the whole year, the region compared to the entire 117 year record is ranked in a category labeled "below normal".

446 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:28:34pm

re: #400 WindUpBird

OH GOD ALL IS LOST

Citation Needed

447 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:28:59pm

re: #442 EmmmieG

I just finished up something like 30-40 hours of work on a single microfilm record from Germany. I had gotten the link from that site.

However, reading it in Latin was...delightful. Yes, delightful. If you find squinting at old microfilm records from before the era of standardized handwriting fun.

I just found my great grandparents wedding certificate. Was a little thrown off at first since it referred to my great grandmother was Mary L. We always assumed her name was just Lillian. Guess she preferred that one. It all makes sense now given my grandmother's notes in her journal about how my oldest aunt was named after her mother. Mary Jo(yce). Joyce being the maiden name.

448 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:29:00pm

re: #440 oaktree

[Link: s29.photobucket.com...]

Link to my photos from the upper part of the complex. Wish I had had a better camera since the long shots are not so good. And thus it was hard to get a good picture of a 30m high bronze statue.

THis is my favorite!

The BAPS temple in Chicago isn't nearly as colorful. The white marble is translucent and they have pin lights spaced thru-out, so it glows. They can change the color of the lights as well.

It really creates a spiritual aural type environment. The interior of the dome is rosette design and you can get lost in it.

449 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:29:18pm

And the Associated Press gets its marching orders:

AP: Wikipedia editors question site's planned blackout

NEW YORK (AP) — Can the world live without Wikipedia for a day? The shutdown of one of the Internet's most-visited sites is not sitting well with some of its volunteer editors, who say the protest of anti-piracy legislation could threaten the credibility of their work.

"My main concern is that it puts the organization in the role of advocacy, and that's a slippery slope," said editor Robert Lawton, a Michigan computer consultant who would prefer that the encyclopedia stick to being a neutral repository of knowledge. "Before we know it, we're blacked out because we want to save the whales."

Wikipedia's English-language site shut down at midnight Eastern Standard Time Tuesday and the organization said it would stay down for 24 hours.

[...]

The shutdown adds to a growing body of critics who are speaking out against the legislation. But some editors are so uneasy with the move that they have blacked out their own user profile pages or resigned their administrative rights on the site to protest. Some likened the site's decision to fighting censorship with censorship.

450 Kragar  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:29:25pm

Google's black out is up.

451 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:29:41pm

re: #447 HappyWarrior

I just found my great grandparents wedding certificate. Was a little thrown off at first since it referred to my great grandmother was Mary L. We always assumed her name was just Lillian. Guess she preferred that one. It all makes sense now given my grandmother's notes in her journal about how my oldest aunt was named after her mother. Mary Jo(yce). Joyce being the maiden name.

Oh dear. You're hooked.

452 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:30:09pm

re: #447 HappyWarrior

I just found my great grandparents wedding certificate. Was a little thrown off at first since it referred to my great grandmother was Mary L. We always assumed her name was just Lillian. Guess she preferred that one. It all makes sense now given my grandmother's notes in her journal about how my oldest aunt was named after her mother. Mary Jo(yce). Joyce being the maiden name.

All Catholic girls were named Mary, Marie, Catherine or Ann.

They went by their 2nd name so everyone could keep them straight.

:0

453 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:30:48pm

re: #451 EmmmieG

Oh dear. You're hooked.

i've been hooked ha!

454 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:31:29pm

re: #452 ggt

I think Catherine is a very pretty name.

455 Interesting Times  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:31:48pm

re: #449 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And the Associated Press gets its marching orders:

AP: Wikipedia editors question site's planned blackout

[...]

Meh, typical shortsighted "slippery slope" argument. This isn't "garden-variety" advocacy on Wikipedia's part; it's making a statement about something that could threaten their very existence. The editors might as well protest the funding drives they hold.

456 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:32:13pm

re: #454 ProLifeLiberal

I think Catherine is a very pretty name.

It is, they all are, but the repetition get's old.

457 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:32:13pm

re: #454 ProLifeLiberal

I think Catherine is a very pretty name.

The most common female given name in my family as a matter of fact.

458 Big Joe  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:34:03pm

re: #445 freetoken
The problem might be when they measure the rain season. California's rain season isn't measured January to December. It's July to June. Our rains occur from October to April.

459 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:34:12pm

re: #457 HappyWarrior

But imagination is important too.

460 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:34:12pm

re: #452 ggt

All Catholic girls were named Mary, Marie, Catherine or Ann.

:0

Well there's a little mystery to that too. For the longest time we assumed she was fully Irish Catholic like her husband but some research I did indicated that her mother was born in Scotland. Now there are Scottish Catholics and I don't know whether they were of Irish decent since we imagine her mom's parents were born during the time of the famine given her mid 1870's birth.

461 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:34:52pm

re: #459 ProLifeLiberal

But imagination is important too.

It is. Tributes are nice though. My three cousins were named after my grandmother.

462 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:34:59pm

re: #456 ggt

It is, they all are, but the repetition get's old.

With the German Catholic records, I started recording names as:

Ma Cath Wilh
An Ma Fried

It wasn't like I was going to forget what that meant, and I was tired of writing the same ten names out in full.

463 SpaceJesus  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:35:29pm

even the derp is bigger in texas

464 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:35:50pm

A single day next month is going to make me very, very depressed.

Guess which one.

465 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:36:02pm

re: #455 publicityStunted

Meh, typical shortsighted "slippery slope" argument. This isn't "garden-variety" advocacy on Wikipedia's part; it's making a statement about something that could threaten their very existence. The editors might as well protest the funding drives they hold.

It's AP, no doubt acting on corporate orders, looking to put the blackouts in a bad light. And it's hardly news that there will be some who don't agree with the blackout. I read the statement from Wiki yesterday and it laid out the reasoning for the blackout, namely because it was the proposal supported by the majority of those who voted on a course of action. By majority, I mean over 1,500 of the 1,800 editors.

466 Gretchen G.Tiger  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:37:49pm

I'm off for tonite.

Have a great one all!

467 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:37:51pm

re: #455 publicityStunted

Meh, typical shortsighted "slippery slope" argument. This isn't "garden-variety" advocacy on Wikipedia's part; it's making a statement about something that could threaten their very existence. The editors might as well protest the funding drives they hold.

Indeed, meh. If they don't like it, they're free to leave. And the pretense of true wikipedia neutrality is laughable, IMHO.

468 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:39:51pm
and if the audience sees Wikipedia taking a stand, it might not believe the articles are objective, either.

I would see it as a positive development. People should stop "trusting" wikipedia.

469 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:41:48pm

re: #464 ProLifeLiberal

A single day next month is going to make me very, very depressed.

Guess which one.

Leap Day. Nothing like an extra day of winter to drag you down. Not me, though. for me its an extra sales day.

470 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:43:11pm

re: #469 Dark_Falcon

Remember my age and condition.

471 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:45:13pm

re: #468 Sergey Romanov

I would see it as a positive development. People should stop "trusting" wikipedia.

Back in college, every professor I had told me the same thing: "Wikipedia does not count as a valid source." Using the sites linked to by Wiki, provided they were themselves valid, was okay. But Wiki was never considered valid, because any yahoo could use his spare time to write whatever he liked and have it sit there for minutes to hours before somebody realized the alteration and fixed it.

472 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:45:56pm

re: #450 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Google's black out is up.

You know what? Time Mag had it completely right.

The protester is the person of the year. And so far the next.

473 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:46:26pm

re: #468 Sergey Romanov

I would see it as a positive development. People should stop "trusting" wikipedia.

much the way people should stop trusting news media

474 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:46:33pm

re: #471 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Wikipedia is good for trivia, and it's a good collection of links. These are its two main uses.

475 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:46:39pm

re: #471 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Back in college, every professor I had told me the same thing: "Wikipedia does not count as a valid source." Using the sites linked to by Wiki, provided they were themselves valid, was okay. But Wiki was never considered valid, because any yahoo could use his spare time to write whatever he liked and have it sit there for minutes to hours before somebody realized the alteration and fixed it.

There's always at least one butthead in history classes who thinks he can get away with using wiki verbatim on his papers. Me? I always used wiki to get background info when I was researching a topic or thinking of a topic to write on. I like reading wiki despite its obvious flaws.

476 freetoken  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:46:44pm

re: #458 mracb

The NCDC graphs are on a Gregorian calendar basis.

The ranking of a year is compared to the other 116 years. So even a very (calendar) dry year might not be the driest. I do not know whether the distribution divisions used by NCDC are based on the well known "normal" distribution (i.e., standard deviations with 1sd roughly2/3rds of the points), but let's assume that is what the NCDC is using. In this case by putting your region of the state as "below normal", 1 category below normal, and assuming each NCDC category is 1 sd, means that for the year the average precip over the region is more than 1 but less than 2 standard deviations below "normal". In other words, 2.3% of the 117 years were drier than what 2011 recorded.

477 prairiefire  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:47:34pm

re: #472 Stanley Sea

You know what? Time Mag had it completely right.

The protester is the person of the year. And so far the next.

Yay! With the Inernets it's amplified times 50 x 5.

478 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:48:17pm

re: #475 HappyWarrior

There's always at least one butthead in history classes who thinks he can get away with using wiki verbatim on his papers. Me? I always used wiki to get background info when I was researching a topic or thinking of a topic to write on. I like reading wiki despite its obvious flaws.

Wiki is often where you start. It's how you find out what you need to know, and you can look for real sources from there.

479 Big Joe  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:48:44pm

re: #476 freetoken

We had a wetter than normal year last year so it is skewing our rain season with data from last season.

480 freetoken  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:49:08pm

re: #476 freetoken

That last sentence should read "at least 2.3% of the 117 years, but no more than 15.9%, were drier than what 2011 recorded."

The actual rankings on the NCDC site are only down to the state, the intra-state regions are given relative to a scale.

481 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:49:41pm

re: #475 HappyWarrior

There's always at least one butthead in history classes who thinks he can get away with using wiki verbatim on his papers. Me? I always used wiki to get background info when I was researching a topic or thinking of a topic to write on. I like reading wiki despite its obvious flaws.

Wiki's like TV Tropes: If you're not careful, they will literally suck hours of your life away.

482 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:49:59pm

re: #470 ProLifeLiberal

Remember my age and condition.

How could I? I don't know your age. I'm guessing you mean Valentine's Day.

483 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:50:10pm

re: #470 ProLifeLiberal

I guess I am bracing myself for feeling really miserable.

My least favorite day of the year, bar none, is Valentine's Day.

It does a real good job of reminding me "You're 21, and never had a relationship, and are functionally defective!"

Remember I have Asperger's Syndrome, so I'm socially hobbled. That hurts me greatly in finding someone.

484 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:51:31pm

re: #478 EmmmieG

Wiki is often where you start. It's how you find out what you need to know, and you can look for real sources from there.

Yep. Really the kids who copy from wiki must think their professors are stupid. One professor, an English professor told a particular funny plagiarism story. Guy actually copied from an article the professor himself wrote. Professor recalls reading the paper and thinking gosh this sounds familiar and then it hits him, that it was his own words. For my big term paper on Russia, I had classmates cite work by the professor which was different because it was legit. Asked the professor how that felt when we had a conference and he said he was used to it as he's been teaching since the 60's. One thing I am gonna miss about college are my professors. Great people.

485 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:52:10pm

re: #483 ProLifeLiberal

I guess I am bracing myself for feeling really miserable.

My least favorite day of the year, bar none, is Valentine's Day.

It does a real good job of reminding me "You're 21, and never had a relationship, and are functionally defective!"

Remember I have Asperger's Syndrome, so I'm socially hobbled. That hurts me greatly in finding someone.

May I make a suggestion? Why don't you find some way to make others feel better that day. Buy a bag of Hershey's kisses, and just go around giving them to random girls. Don't say much, just give them the kiss and say "Happy Valentine's Day."

486 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:52:22pm

re: #483 ProLifeLiberal

I guess I am bracing myself for feeling really miserable.

My least favorite day of the year, bar none, is Valentine's Day.

It does a real good job of reminding me "You're 21, and never had a relationship, and are functionally defective!"

Remember I have Asperger's Syndrome, so I'm socially hobbled. That hurts me greatly in finding someone.

I feel ya dude. At 24 and struggling in relationships and a fellow Aspergers 2-14 really is the toughest day.

487 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:54:37pm

re: #485 EmmmieG

That seems really weird to me. I can't explain why.

488 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:55:13pm

re: #487 ProLifeLiberal

That seems really weird to me. I can't explain why.

Any other day, it would be weird.

489 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:55:58pm

It doesn't have to be that. If you spend the day making others feel better, you won't feel so bad yourself.

Remember: the vast majority of girls at your college probably aren't getting anything, either.

490 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:57:33pm

re: #487 ProLifeLiberal

That seems really weird to me. I can't explain why.

It is weird. Not Emmmie's suggestion, but the whole obligatory nature of 2-14, when so many people in couples are utterly miserable and can't stand to even look at each other. That, I have never quite understood about it.

491 Jimmi the Grey  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:57:47pm

re: #483 ProLifeLiberal

I guess I am bracing myself for feeling really miserable.

My least favorite day of the year, bar none, is Valentine's Day.

It does a real good job of reminding me "You're 21, and never had a relationship, and are functionally defective!"

Remember I have Asperger's Syndrome, so I'm socially hobbled. That hurts me greatly in finding someone.

I get it brah, but you just gotta remember that it's a manufactured holiday to sell Hallmark cards and give the floral and chocolate/candy industries a sales boost.

Go with Emmmie's suggestion, worked for me for many years back in the school daze. Or take on the role of Cupid and spend the day as Celestial Wingman.

492 prairiefire  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:58:15pm

re: #486 HappyWarrior

re: #487 ProLifeLiberal

I think you guys will be ok. As you grow older, I hope you find the definition of normalcy and comfort are what you make of it. What ~ you ~ make of your own definition of normal.

493 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 9:59:53pm

re: #489 EmmmieG

A lady (Also very close friend) I knew in High School broke up with her 4.5 year boyfriend in August after he cheated on her. I'll be making sure she's okay. She still seems a bit hurt and damaged emotionally. She no longer smiles very much.

If it weren't for the fact she said she didn't want me to do anything to him, I would beat the shit out of him for hurting her. That fact he did that makes me more angry than everything. Even the residual anger from Utoya.

494 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:00:19pm

re: #492 prairiefire

re: #487 ProLifeLiberal

I think you guys will be ok. As you grow older, I hope you find the definition of normalcy and comfort are what you make of it. What ~ you ~ make of your own definition of normal.

I do feel much more comfortably as I enter mid 20's than I did leaving high school. Much more social and comfortable in my own shoes. I am now merely shy as opposed to in the past being quiet to a fault.

495 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:01:24pm

re: #493 ProLifeLiberal

A lady (Also very close friend) I knew in High School broke up with her 4.5 year boyfriend in August after he cheated on her. I'll be making sure she's okay. She still seems a bit hurt and damaged emotionally. She no longer smiles very much.

If it weren't for the fact she said she didn't want me to do anything to him, I would beat the shit out of him for hurting her. That fact he did that makes me more angry than everything. Even the residual anger from Utoya.

Exactly. My brother was going to be alone on Christmas for his first Christmas since his divorce. I invited him to come and help us volunteer at a breakfast, and he loved it. Made him happy.

496 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:02:40pm

re: #490 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

It is weird. Not Emmmie's suggestion, but the whole obligatory nature of 2-14, when so many people in couples are utterly miserable and can't stand to even look at each other. That, I have never quite understood about it.

It's funny to look at relationships from the outside looking in. You see couples and wonder how you'd do or you see your friends relationships go up, down, and all in between. Single life is a lonely life but sometimes lonely isn't always sad to steal a line from my little crush Zooey Deschanel.

497 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:05:02pm

re: #493 ProLifeLiberal

PLL, can you shake it up? Your life right now? I'm reading something lately that makes me think you need to change it up. Just a little, change your daily routine.

498 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:07:40pm

re: #495 EmmmieG

I'll ask a friend here what to do aside from contacting the girl mentioned previously (she goes to Colorado State).

Would anyone here have the same reaction to what happened to the lady I mentioned?

499 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:08:54pm

re: #496 HappyWarrior

It's funny to look at relationships from the outside looking in. You see couples and wonder how you'd do or you see your friends relationships go up, down, and all in between. Single life is a lonely life but sometimes lonely isn't always sad to steal a line from my little crush Zooey Deschanel.

Yeah, I make a big distinction between being alone and being lonely. I have no problems being single; sometimes I quite prefer it. I have a low threshhold for drama, considering some of the family stuff I've had to deal with. Priorities, I guess.

So many people seem to believe they're nobodies unless they have a relationship to show everyone how "normal" they are. Those are some of the loneliest, most miserable people in the world, I've noticed - always searching, never finding, never satisfied, dependent on others' views of them for their sense of self.

500 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:10:43pm

re: #498 ProLifeLiberal

I'll ask a friend here what to do aside from contacting the girl mentioned previously (she goes to Colorado State).

Would anyone here have the same reaction to what happened to the lady I mentioned?

Send her corny jokes to make her laugh.

Sample from my son tonight:

Sometimes I wonder, "Why is that frisbee getting bigger?" Then it hits me.

501 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:13:47pm

re: #483 ProLifeLiberal

I guess I am bracing myself for feeling really miserable.

My least favorite day of the year, bar none, is Valentine's Day.

It does a real good job of reminding me "You're 21, and never had a relationship, and are functionally defective!"

Remember I have Asperger's Syndrome, so I'm socially hobbled. That hurts me greatly in finding someone.

I remember that feeling. It bothered me for a while, too. But I wouldn't recommend the way I ended up dealing with it: I simply gave up ever making a romantic connection with anyone. Glad to see you're still trying.

502 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:13:51pm

re: #500 EmmmieG

exceptionally corny. took me a sec.

503 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:13:59pm

re: #498 ProLifeLiberal

I'll ask a friend here what to do aside from contacting the girl mentioned previously (she goes to Colorado State).

Would anyone here have the same reaction to what happened to the lady I mentioned?

Maybe; depends on the situation. I have been very protective of love interests in bad situations, myself, but that comes from being very sensitive to domestic violence for personal reasons.

Julia Kristeva wrote something I think of, often, along the lines of: a fear of being bitten is really a fear of biting. I think that is a very wise saying.

504 ProGunLiberal  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 10:15:39pm

re: #500 EmmmieG

I might do that.

To give you an idea of the anger against the douche, the angriest I have ever been before that was the revelations after the 7/22 Attacks last year.

The anger with this is equal to that. And unlike the Terror Attack, directed at just one target.

re: #497 Stanley Sea

I'm feeling more than a little bit lonely with a bad family situation, and unable to get in contact much of the time with friends my age.

505 sagehen  Tue, Jan 17, 2012 11:40:52pm

re: #378 wlewisiii

No, seriously, I've always thought it was a sly dig at the swiss. They have had some truly strange weapons that would probably not work well in combat over the past century because their last real war was their short civil war after Napoleon pulled out. Without testing in combat you end up with nice target rifles you might not want to carry into battle...

Aside from nobody wanting to fuck with the banks, I'd guess terrain had something to do with it. Who wants to try marching their infantry over the Alps?

506 sagehen  Wed, Jan 18, 2012 12:03:51am

re: #483 ProLifeLiberal

I guess I am bracing myself for feeling really miserable.

My least favorite day of the year, bar none, is Valentine's Day.

It does a real good job of reminding me "You're 21, and never had a relationship, and are functionally defective!"

Remember I have Asperger's Syndrome, so I'm socially hobbled. That hurts me greatly in finding someone.

If you don't mind some unsolicited advice -- science fiction fandom, from what I can tell from my various mailing lists and discussion boards, are just *full* of girl aspies. The married ones almost invariably met their guy at Comic-Con or Dragon-Con or a Star Trek event; wear a cute costume, know your show, there's obvious discussion topics that will save you having to come up with small talk.

Oh, and... before you go, read some feminist website articles about "that creepy guy in the elevator" for tips on what not to say, what body language to try to avoid, there's only about a dozen or so rules you need to memorize to have good odds on meeting somebody smart and fun who'd want to see you again. (and even if she doesn't find you physically appealing, if you avoid setting off her stalker-radar she may well have a friend she'll volunteer to fix you up with).

507 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 18, 2012 12:07:15am

re: #6 Charles

Perry seems to think the government of Turkey is perpetrating honor killings against its citizens, and Wolf Blitzer digs it.

No, Turkey is carrying out air attacks on Kurdish cigarette smugglers. I have no idea how Wolf Blitzer feels about that.

508 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 18, 2012 12:08:01am

re: #7 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Personally, I'm getting a kick out of all the conservatives who spoke at length about the wondrous thing that was recall elections and how democratic it was that the people could get rid of politicians who they felt had failed miserably at their jobs when it all applied to Gray Davis...and whinge themselves inside out at how "expensive" and "undemocratic" it is to recall Scott Walker and his cronies in the legislature.

When we recalled Gray Davis, dozens and dozens of people ran for governor. It was fun! The people complaining about this should try it.

509 Robert O.  Wed, Jan 18, 2012 12:26:34am

At this point, Rick Perry has shown himself as nothing more substantial than a Sarah Palin with a p3n1s. Considering Texas is a far larger and more diverse state, I hate to think how embarrassed millions of good Texans must be for their governor (current one as well as the previous).

510 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Jan 18, 2012 5:23:06am

re: #464 ProLifeLiberal

A single day next month is going to make me very, very depressed.

Guess which one.

{{{PLL}}}

511 SidewaysQuark  Wed, Jan 18, 2012 8:11:46am

Erdogan is at least as much of a fundie jerkwad as Rick Perry. Not much more of a terrorist than Ricky Perry, though.


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