Newt Gingrich’s Anti-Muslim Conspiracy Theories

Crazy bigoted fear-mongering
Wingnuts • Views: 31,880

With all the focus on Newt Gingrich’s race-baiting and “big ideas,” one thing that hasn’t gotten much notice yet: his outrageous anti-Muslim statements.

There’s a reason why Newt was scheduled to speak at hate group leader Pamela Geller’s “Ground Zero Mosque” demonstration in New York, and there’s a reason why she endorses him for President. On this subject, Gingrich sounds exactly like Geller.

Here’s Gingrich today on The Janet Mefferd Show, explaining that the Obama administration, the Justice Department, secular judges, “religious bigots who want to drive Christianity out of public life,” and “elites” are conspiring with the “Organization of Islamic Countries” to advance the cause of radical Islam.

Youtube Video

Newt Gingrich with hate group leader Pamela GellerGingrich: Well, I think that we have to really, from my perspective you don’t have an issue of religious tolerance you have an elite which favors radical Islam over Christianity and Judaism. You have constant pressure by secular judges and by religious bigots to drive Christianity out of public life and to establish a secular state except when it comes to radical Islam, where all of the sudden they start making excuses for Sharia, they start making excuses that we really shouldn’t use certain language. Remember, the Organization of Islamic Countries is dedicated to preventing anyone, anywhere in the world from commenting negatively about Islam, so they would literally eliminate our free speech and there were clearly conversations held that implied that the US Justice Department would begin to enforce censorship against American citizens to protect radical Islam, I think that’s just an amazing concept frankly.

Here are a couple of facts to counteract this bizarre fear-mongering conspiracy theory that Newt’s parroting directly from Pamela Geller and Robert Spencer:

First, Gingrich has the name of the organization wrong; it’s the Organization of the Islamic Conference (which shows the depth of Gingrich’s knowledge). (Update: recently changed to “Organization of Islamic Cooperation.”)

Second, the Obama administration has come out strongly against OIC-sponsored UN resolutions barring the defamation of religion. The idea that the Justice Department is going to start “enforcing censorship” against people who criticize Islam is just … stupid.

Newt is spouting a cartoon-like version of the reality, with Muslims as the boogeymen, and the right wing eats this stuff up.

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767 comments
1 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:16:50pm

Ah, isn't it wonderful how election years bring out the best in our politicians?

Yegods.

2 Martinsmithy  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:18:50pm

Maybe Pamela Geller will be the next subject of a request from Mr. Gingrich to his current wife to have an "open marriage."

Yuck!

3 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:19:39pm
there were clearly conversations held that implied that the US Justice Department would begin to enforce censorship against American citizens to protect radical Islam

What conversations is he talking about?

4 erik_t  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:20:13pm

re: #3 jaunte

What conversations is he talking about?

The ones between the voices in his head.

/kinda low-hanging fruit I know

5 b_sharp  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:21:26pm
"Newt is spouting a cartoon-like version of the reality,..."

I thought I saw Newt in Roger Rabbit.

6 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:21:35pm

I'd wrap up his race-baiting and his anti-Muslim statements as part and parcel of his demented self-perception as an intellectual and historian: he's basically applying Victorian theories of history and race to modern times. Doubtless he believes it's bold and daringly un-PC to give credence to old, warped analysis that was part ignorance, part hubris, and part justification for empire.

7 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:21:38pm

re: #4 erik_t

Any reporter worth their salt could ask him 'which conversations are you interpreting to mean this.'

8 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:22:21pm

"Clearly!"

9 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:23:01pm

re: #3 jaunte

What conversations is he talking about?

He may actually be referring to a ridiculous post by Pamela Geller that she called a "bombshell:" Geller Bombshell: American Thinker Lede Article New Docs Reveal How DOJ Kowtows to Muslim Brotherhood - Atlas Shrugs.

10 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:24:51pm

Pam luvs her some Newt.

11 nines09  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:26:21pm

I think Mr Gingrich should introduce his friend Ms Geller to the general American population. Like maybe on Fox News?

12 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:27:04pm

re: #10 Alouette

Pam luvs her some Newt.

EWWWWWWWW

/brain bleach, stat!

13 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:27:13pm

re: #9 Charles

"The DOJ holds "inter-agency meetings" with Muslim Brotherhood groups on a regular basis. Prior to these meetings, Treene sends around issues submitted by these very groups to be discussed at the meeting -- submitted, I assume, for their approval."

There's the dreaded Kowtow!

14 b_sharp  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:27:57pm

re: #13 jaunte

There's the dreaded Kowtow!

Shhh, the baby is trying to sleep.

15 Flashmash  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:28:25pm

Did not know about this connection...(Geller Gingrich).
Newt is seeming kookier and kookier to ke with each passing day....what kind of name is Newt anyways?

16 EdDantes  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:29:17pm

re: #15 Flashmash

Short for Newton

17 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:29:31pm

Janet Mefferd:

Wednesday, January 25, 2012
President Obama delivered his state of the union address last night. How did he do? Former House Speaker Newt Gingrich will join Janet to talk about it. And Operation Rescue has launched a brand new website that targets the abortion industry. Troy Newman, President of Operation Rescue, will stop by to tell us about AbortionDocs.org. And some shocking documents show how the Department of Justice is kowtowing to the Muslim Brotherhood. Atlas Shrugs founder Pamela Geller will talk about it with Janet.

18 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:29:47pm

Organization of Islamic Cooperation.

19 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:29:49pm

re: #13 jaunte

There's the dreaded Kowtow!

Kowtow into a triple-toe-loop.

20 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:30:27pm

This was uploaded by Salem Communications BTW. Same outfit that owns Hot Air.

21 Flashmash  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:30:30pm

re: #16 EdDantes

So go by Newton....Newt is you would call a little kid. What about Mitt? Is that short for something as well?

22 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:30:46pm

It is an amazing concept, I have to agree.

23 b_sharp  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:30:52pm

re: #19 darthstar

Kowtow into a triple-toe-loop.

Now you've done it. He's crying.

24 b_sharp  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:31:18pm

re: #21 Flashmash

So go by Newton...Newt is you would call a little kid. What about Mitt? Is that short for something as well?

Mitton.

25 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:31:32pm

re: #20 Gus 802

This was uploaded by Salem Communications BTW. Same outfit that owns Hot Air.

So we know it was done in Jesus' name.

26 Flashmash  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:32:35pm

re: #24 b_sharp

WTF is with these GOP candidates? Doesn't anyone have a full and proper name? LOL

27 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:32:42pm

re: #25 darthstar

So we know it was done in Jesus' name.

Yeah. Gives something for Andy Levy and Allahpundit to Tweet about. Zzzz.

28 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:33:02pm

re: #18 Gus 802

I saw that Wikipedia entry, but I think it's using a different translation of the name. It's most often referred to as the Organization of the Islamic Conference.

29 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:33:39pm

re: #28 Charles

I saw that Wikipedia entry, but I think it's using a different translation of the name. It's most often referred to as the Organization of the Islamic Conference.

Ah. OK. Yeah, I saw that one too.

30 Petero1818  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:33:47pm

"you have an elite which favors radical Islam over Christianity and Judaism."

This is really priceless. It may actually be the funniest think I have ever heard him say. Scary, and disgusting, but hysterical in its absolute absurdity.

31 aagcobb  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:34:10pm

re: #26 Flashmash

WTF is with these GOP candidates? Doesn't anyone have a full and proper name? LOL

If your name was Willard, would you use it? OTOH, I think Newt should have gone with his middle name, Leroy. Its much cooler.

32 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:34:40pm

re: #27 Gus 802

Yeah. Gives something for Andy Levy and Allahpundit to Tweet about. Zzzz.

I really find these people tedious and boring...especially that hate-rag Geller. I think if they were properly ignored long enough they'd all just go get jobs working at Sports Authority or Staples...except Geller, who would go to work at an Orange Julius.

33 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:35:41pm

Let's see who else was working with the OIC. Well, well, here's one other president:

President George W. Bush announced on June 27, 2007, that the United States would establish an envoy to the OIC. Bush said of the envoy, "Our special envoy will listen to and learn from representatives from Muslim states, and will share with them America's views and values." Sada Cumber became the U.S. representative on March 3, 2008.[citation needed] Individual organisation members vote against the United States on over 86 percent of United Nations resolutions.

34 Flashmash  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:36:26pm

re: #31 aagcobb

LOL....I suppose . But, you would think a presidential candidate would be above such nonsense and just use their proper name....i guessnit is no big deal....just amusing to me.

35 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:36:47pm

Gingrich fear-mongering over Muslims is despicable.

Gingrich fear-mongering over 'elites' makes him what Jaunte called him earlier, a footshooter.

36 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:37:09pm

Statement on the Organization of Islamic Conference (OIC) Summit Declaration

On December 7 and 8, leaders of Muslim nations belonging to the Organization of Islamic Conference (OIC) met in Mecca, Saudi Arabia. The OIC Summit Declaration issued at the conclusion of this Summit covers a great deal of ground. There is much in the Declaration with which we agree, though there are also portions which do not comport with U.S. policy.

The United States welcomes valuable statements from the OIC regarding the common fight against terrorism and extremism. The Declaration condemns terrorism; stresses the need to criminalize all aspects of terrorism, including its financing; and rejects any justification for the deliberate killing of innocent civilians. In addition, the OIC Declaration condemns extremism and calls for developing school curricula that "strengthen the values of understanding, tolerance, dialogue and pluralism."

The United States also praises the OIC for the support it extends to Iraq as it completes its transitional political process and elects a full term government under its new democratic constitution. We appreciate the endorsement of OIC members of the Arab League initiative to promote national dialogue in Iraq and welcome the OIC's unreserved condemnation of terrorist violence directed against the Iraqi people.

The United States welcomes the OIC decision to confront the scourges of terrorism and extremism and support Iraq. We look forward to strengthening our cooperation with members of the OIC committed to making progress in the global fight against terrorists and their supporters.

37 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:37:20pm

re: #32 darthstar

Well, this post shows why I write about her - she's mad as a hatter, yes, but her deranged ideas are influencing Presidential candidates! Can't just ignore someone like that.

38 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:37:50pm

This crap that Gingrich is putting out. He's starting to remind me of some of the old trolls. Same old talking points.

39 b_sharp  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:38:00pm

OT:

Apparently I have an auto-immune problem. I guess I'll just have to run my immune system manually.

Anybody know where the stick shift is?

40 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:38:33pm

re: #37 Charles

Well, this post shows why I write about her - she's mad as a hatter, yes, but her deranged ideas are influencing Presidential candidates! Can't just ignore someone like that.

I understand...she's just such a shitheel of a person...only someone like Newt could find value in her.

41 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:38:38pm

Fact Sheet: Strengthening Our Friendship with the Muslim Community Worldwide

President Bush Announces He Will Appoint A Special Envoy To The Organization Of The Islamic Conference

42 EdDantes  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:39:15pm

re: #31 aagcobb

If your name was Willard, would you use it? OTOH, I think Newt should have gone with his middle name, Leroy. Its much cooler.

My Granddad's first name was Marion. He preferred "Andy."

43 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:39:18pm

re: #39 b_sharp

OT:

Apparently I have an auto-immune problem. I guess I'll just have to run my immune system manually.

Anybody know where the stick shift is?

Know why the leper failed his driving test?

Left his foot on the clutch.

44 b_sharp  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:39:49pm

re: #35 wrenchwench

Gingrich fear-mongering over Muslims is despicable.

Gingrich fear-mongering over 'elites' makes him what Jaunte called him earlier, a footshooter.

There must be a more descriptive term for that.

Dipstick?

45 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:40:09pm

President Reports Progress, Calls for Action in Cabinet Meeting
Remarks by the President After Cabinet Meeting

THE PRESIDENT: I have asked my Cabinet to come in and give me a briefing on the progress that we're making on the war on terrorism. I can report to the American people we're making substantial progress.

First, our Secretary of State and our diplomats around the world have put together a broad coalition of nations to make a stand against terrorists, terrorism and those who harbor terrorists. And I'm really pleased. This coalition includes not only our friends in Europe and South America, but as we saw at the OIC Conference, the Organization of Islamic Conferences, many Muslim nations have taken a very firm stand against terrorist activities, as well.

Obviously, the Secretary of Defense and the Defense Department has been busy. As I said today, America is very proud of the men and women who wear the uniform; they're proud of your leadership too, sir. We'll leave the military briefing for the Pentagon...

46 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:41:29pm

President Hosts Iftaar
Remarks by the President at Iftaar
State Dining Room

I'm honored that our great Secretary of State is with us today. Mr. Secretary, thank you for being here. I appreciate Your Highness Sheikh Hamad bin Zayed of the United Arab Emirates, for coming. I want to thank members of my administration who are here -- in particular, Dr. Elias Zerhouni, who's the Director of the National Institute of Health. I want to thank all the ambassadors who are here -- it's good to see you all again. And the other representatives from the Organization of Islamic Conference. I appreciate so very much my fellow Americans here, many from the Muslim community.

47 b_sharp  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:42:03pm

re: #43 darthstar

Know why the leper failed his driving test?

Left his foot on the clutch.

I shouldn't laugh at other people's misfortune, but that really was funny.

48 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:43:01pm

And so on. The president I am referring to here of course is George W. Bush. However, it is my understanding that Pamela Geller was already spewing her unintelligible babble at that time and directed against Bush. Now of course with Obama this adds another dimension to these conspiracy theories.

49 SpaceJesus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:43:07pm

"And now for a word from Secretary of State, Pamela Geller"

-what will happen 1 year from now if sane people don't vote in Nov.

50 BongCrodny  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:43:09pm

re: #5 b_sharp

I thought I saw Newt in Roger Rabbit.

Wasn't he the one wearing the straightjacket?

51 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:44:07pm

re: #31 aagcobb

If your name was Willard, would you use it? OTOH, I think Newt should have gone with his middle name, Leroy. Its much cooler.

When my grandfather returned from WWII he made a deal with a wartime buddy to name their first sons after each other. My dad's name is Stuart. The other poor fella got stuck with Willard.

52 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:44:45pm

re: #46 Gus 802

George Bush: "George Washington said that America gives to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance. This was our policy at our nation's founding; this is our policy today. America rejects all forms of religious intolerance."

Unless you're a conservative candidate trying to attract the bigot vote.

53 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:47:36pm

As for Geller:

The principal impact of reading through the material is the sheer bulk of it. Hundreds and hundreds of pages of emails, documenting nearly daily friendly contact, consultation, cooperation and collaboration between the DOJ and Hamas-linked Muslim Brotherhood groups. One thing is clear, the Muslim Brotherhood has fully infiltrated command and control at the Department of Justice civil rights division.

Sounds like she dropped it on her foot. And, if I want to infiltrate the government, do I just send them emails?

54 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:50:39pm

re: #52 jaunte

Unless you're a conservative candidate trying to attract the bigot vote.

Correct. Gingrich is both anti-atheist and more importantly, anti-secular. He has a poor understanding of the reasoning behind the Establishment Clause. It is there to prevent the meddling of churches in government which part and parcel of King George and the British colonialists. It's ironic too in that the best hope for most Muslim/Middle Eastern countries, or make that all countries around the world, is to establish secular governments. When Gingrich says religion he of course only means Christianity and the white suburban version of Christianity -- the gospel of free-market Jesus, etc.

55 aagcobb  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:50:51pm

re: #51 compound idaho

When my grandfather returned from WWII he made a deal with a wartime buddy to name their first sons after each other. My dad's name is Stuart.

That's my name too! Your dad even spells it right!

56 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:52:11pm

In fact not a day goes by now where one doesn't hear Gingrich babbling on about this imaginary war on Christianity and the pitfalls of a secular government. How in the world can someone claim to be an American and be against a secular government?

57 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:53:52pm

Oh noz! The war on Christians is realz!

@rdfrs RDFRS(US)
Alaska Airlines removing prayer cards from meal trays after 30 years as complaints increase - AP/Washington Post - [Link: bit.ly...]

58 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:55:00pm

re: #52 jaunte

Unless you're a conservative candidate trying to attract the bigot vote.

Conservatives don't need minority outreach anyway. It's not like minorities instinctively understand conservatism anyway.

Newt and GOP should just focus on white people to win.

/freeper

BTW, that's pretty much a real post I saw today. There are folks who believe it.

59 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:56:58pm

Um. Yes, er, um.

Okay, so, I was under the impression that there is a pact, a kind of important one, that all nations own space jointly. Right? Nobody actually owns the moon or Mars or the asteroids. (Now, if a chunk of space comes down and lands, then someone can own it.)

Newt is now proposing the moon as the 51st state.

Boy, I'll bet that'll go over great internationally. The diplomatic equivalent of mailing the other countries a picture of your tush.

[Link: www.buzzfeed.com...]

Newt: the first moonbase will be, of necessity, international. Count on it.

60 SpaceJesus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:58:31pm

Do not slander Newt, The Prince of Space.

61 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:58:39pm

re: #55 aagcobb

That's my name too! Your dad even spells it right!

My middle name and I spell it right too.

62 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 4:59:15pm

Gingrich is a wingnut. I'm not sure if I would call Romney a wingnut. Perhaps he's a junior grade wingnut 1st class. Gingrich is like admiral wingnut.

63 SpaceJesus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:00:29pm

I actually think this whole "moon as the 51st state" thing is just a ploy by Newt to get the moon developed so that he can one day travel there, secede, then be president of the fucking moon.

64 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:00:42pm

re: #62 Gus 802

Romney has been briefed on being a wingnut.

65 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:00:59pm

re: #62 Gus 802

Gingrich is a wingnut. I'm not sure if I would call Romney a wingnut. Perhaps he's a junior grade wingnut 1st class. Gingrich is like admiral wingnut.

I have settled on Romney. He is swimming it very difficult waters, but he seems to be the only adult in the room.

66 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:01:09pm

re: #63 SpaceJesus

I actually think this whole "moon as the 51st state" thing is just a ploy by Newt to get the moon developed so that he can one day travel there, secede, and be president of the fucking moon.

I'm okay with that. Can we send them now?

67 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:01:25pm

re: #63 SpaceJesus

I actually think this whole "moon as the 51st state" thing is just a ploy by Newt to get the moon developed so that he can one day travel there, secede, and be president of the fucking moon.

Know who's going to fuck that dream in the butt?

Image: al_gore_on_futurama.jpg

68 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:01:35pm

re: #60 SpaceJesus

Do not slander Newt, The Prince of Space.

I'm surprised you have enough room out there for his head.

69 SpaceJesus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:01:41pm

re: #66 EmmmieG

there goes the neighborhood

70 jamesfirecat  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:01:59pm

re: #60 SpaceJesus

Do not slander Newt, The Prince of Space.

Bah he doesn't have any superpowers, all he can do is skip relatively well!

71 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:03:12pm

re: #63 SpaceJesus

I actually think this whole "moon as the 51st state" thing is just a ploy by Newt to get the moon developed so that he can one day travel there, secede, and be president of the fucking moon.

I hereby propose that from this day forward that Newt Gingrich be called, Moonbeam.

//

72 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:04:51pm

re: #71 Gus 802


Hey; Jerry Brown has claim on that!

73 aagcobb  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:05:55pm

re: #72 compound idaho

Hey; Jerry Brown has claim on that!

Leroy has earned it.

74 BongCrodny  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:06:58pm

re: #63 SpaceJesus

I actually think this whole "moon as the 51st state" thing is just a ploy by Newt to get the moon developed so that he can one day travel there, secede, then be president of the fucking moon.

"Lex Luthor, ruler of Australia!" -- General Zod

75 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:07:19pm

re: #71 Gus 802

We should call Newt 'Hari Seldon', cause he's a psycho/historian.

76 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:07:48pm

Looking around...

Abortion in Islamic countries

In all, there are 57 members in the Organization of Islamic Conference—an organisation of countries with Muslim majorities or pluralities.36 Most Muslim countries have restrictive abortion laws that permit abortions only when the life of the mother is threatened. Twelve members of the Organization of Islamic Conference allow unrestricted access to abortion. With the exception of Turkey and Tunisia, they are mainly former Soviet Bloc states. Bahrain, a politically and socially conservative Muslim state, is the 12th among these countries to permit unrestricted access to abortion. Among socially conservative Muslim countries, seven countries permit abortion in the first 4 months of gestation for fetal deformities, four countries in subSaharan Africa (Benin, Burkina Faso, Chad and Guinea) and three in the Middle East (Kuwait, Qatar and, now, Iran).

Seems as though many conservative Muslim countries have more liberal laws regarding abortion when compared to Rick Santorum and many Republicans.

77 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:08:42pm

re: #75 jaunte

We should call Newt 'Hari Seldon', cause he's a psycho/historian.

We could always call him History Channel. ;)

78 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:09:10pm

re: #65 compound idaho

I have settled on Romney. He is swimming it very difficult waters, but he seems to be the only adult in the room.

What if he doesn't get the nomination? Will you still vote for the Republican?

79 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:09:44pm

re: #78 wrenchwench

Yup.

80 aagcobb  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:09:59pm

re: #75 jaunte

We should call Newt 'Hari Seldon', cause he's a psycho/historian.

Upding for Isaac Asimov reference.

81 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:11:03pm

re: #78 wrenchwench

It is probably more important who wins control of the house and senate. The Pres. can only sign or veto what is sent to him.

82 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:11:53pm

re: #79 compound idaho

Yup.

Even though you've acknowledged they aren't 'adult'? Even if it's Ron Paul?

83 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:12:45pm

Count me out. If I believe the GOP nominee would be a disaster for the country, I will not vote GOP.

I'm loyal to ideals, not an organization.

84 Stanghazi  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:13:35pm

re: #63 SpaceJesus

I actually think this whole "moon as the 51st state" thing is just a ploy by Newt to get the moon developed so that he can one day travel there, secede, then be president of the fucking moon.

I heard the live Gingrich quote about the moon on my drive home..."In my second term as president...". Pause, audience laughs/applauses

Dont they see the crazy man? No, it's all about who they think can debate Pres. Obama. Whoo whee! They are going to be surprised.

85 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:14:00pm

re: #65 compound idaho

I have settled on Romney. He is swimming it very difficult waters, but he seems to be the only adult in the room.

Romney stopped being the adult once he began his string of Palinesque accusations against Obama. You know, that our prez doesn't really love or understand America. And Romney's flip flopping is shameful. A few years back he described himself as a "moderate with progressive views"; now he'd have you think he's been a staunch conservative his whole life. He's a blank slate who stands for nothing.

86 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:15:16pm

re: #65 compound idaho

I have settled on Romney. He is swimming it very difficult waters, but he seems to be the only adult in the room.

How 'adult' was it for Romney to claim Obama never had a real job?

87 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:15:44pm

re: #82 wrenchwench

Even though you've acknowledged they aren't 'adult'? Even if it's Ron Paul?

I never said I was an adult but party and platform do mean something.

88 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:16:18pm

re: #81 compound idaho

It is probably more important who wins control of the house and senate. The Pres. can only sign or veto what is sent to him.

Really? That's all the president does? You might wanna go back to Poli Sci 101.

89 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:16:50pm

re: #87 compound idaho

I never said I was an adult but party and platform do mean something.

What about the GOP platform attracts you?

Global warming denial?

Teaching evolution in the classroom?

Removing child labor laws?

Criminalizing contraception and abortion?

90 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:17:02pm

re: #65 compound idaho

I have settled on Romney. He is swimming it very difficult waters, but he seems to be the only adult in the room.

The only one who was ever the closest to being the adult in the room was Huntsman, and they hated him for speaking Mandarin and working with Obama.

Face it-- the GOP base wants a bomb thrower to go after the Seekrit Moozlim in the White House, and Mitt's not it.

91 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:19:01pm

re: #88 palomino

Really? That's all the president does? You might wanna go back to Poli Sci 101.

Never took Poli Sci. 101, just entrepreneurship 601.

92 Atlas Fails  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:19:40pm

re: #86 Obdicut

How 'adult' was it for Romney to claim Obama never had a real job?

Hussein was just an ACORN Alinsky-style radical community organizer who got into Harvard and Columbia because of affirmative action. Republicans like George W. Bush and Mitt Romney were given nothing and worked hard for everything they have, because capitalism.

93 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:20:14pm

re: #89 Obdicut

What about the GOP platform attracts you?

Global warming denial?

Teaching evolution in the classroom?

Removing child labor laws?

Criminalizing contraception and abortion?

Most of that does not come up in a meaningful way .. just meat for the loyalists on both sides.

94 Atlas Fails  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:20:48pm

re: #91 compound idaho

Never took Poli Sci. 101, just entrepreneurship 601.

Image: 8d1041c3-e806-4f4a-ab92-40fde01e6b12.jpg

95 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:21:30pm

re: #81 compound idaho

It is probably more important who wins control of the house and senate. The Pres. can only sign or veto what is sent to him.

96 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:21:53pm

More love for the President over at foxnation........

wingnut1

Barry needs a teleprompter to tell him where to go. Disturbing.

wingnut2

We could all tell him where to go... but he can start with BACK to indonesia.

wingnut3

BO needs a teleprompter to give a speech written at an eighth grade level. Affirmative action in action.

wingnut4

he couldn't spell "Allah Akbar"

other select cuts from the same thread
"naziboy soros" being repeated ad-infinitum.

And it seems the only comments "flagged for review" are being made by the reality based universe trolls

97 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:22:00pm

re: #92 Atlas Fails

Not true! GWB would have gotten into Yale had he been born into a working class suburbanite family!

//

98 Stanghazi  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:22:00pm

re: #87 compound idaho

I never said I was an adult but party and platform do mean something.

Ya know, I do appreciate this. I follow it, although my peeps just are better so there's no downside. /half

But really I don't think I'd flip out if Romney was elected, because I think his outrageous positions during the primary are for the votes. I could be ms. #1 naive fool, but I think he wouldn't be horrible COMPARED TO GINGRICH. W/Gingrich, we'll be in another unpaid for war. Based on bigger lies.

99 Atlas Fails  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:22:00pm

re: #93 compound idaho

Most of that does not come up in a meaningful way .. just meat for the loyalists on both sides.

Climate change denial doesn't come up in a meaningful way? Tell that to your kids and grandkids.

100 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:22:04pm

re: #91 compound idaho

Never took Poli Sci. 101, just entrepreneurship 601.

Apparently you didn't learn anything about govt there. The prez does a hell of a lot more than sign or veto legislation. But why would I expect a Romney/Gingrich supporter to know that?

Aren't you the same guy who denigrates teachers because of their whopping 50k salaries and 8 weeks of summer vacation? You're a revanchist anti-intellectual.

101 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:22:12pm

re: #93 compound idaho

Most of that does not come up in a meaningful way .. just meat for the loyalists on both sides.

Wrong. Abortion access for women has been drastically cut, education has been undermined, and the lack of response to climate denial is going to devastate us.

How do you manage to bullshit yourself that that doesn't come up in a meaningful way?

How is it not meaningful for people to try to get the teaching of creationism in the classroom?

102 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:22:23pm

re: #93 compound idaho

Most of that does not come up in a meaningful way .. just meat for the loyalists on both sides.

If you think none of those come up in any meaningful way, you're either oblivious or deliberately dense.

103 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:23:12pm

re: #93 compound idaho

Most of that does not come up in a meaningful way .. just meat for the loyalists on both sides.

If a candidate thinks I don't have the right to control my own life, I find that meaningful, even if he'll only have the power to veto what comes from congress. Also, he can nominate justices who will further his views.

104 Stanghazi  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:23:46pm

re: #96 wozzablog

More love for the President over at foxnation...

wingnut1

wingnut2

wingnut3

wingnut4

other select cuts from the same thread
"naziboy soros" being repeated ad-infinitum.

And it seems the only comments "flagged for review" are being made by the reality based universe trolls

I hate it

105 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:27:40pm

re: #104 Stanley Sea

I hate it

Flat out racist garbage, hate of the President based on his ethnicity and the commenters wanton ignorance.

The Gingrich base at work probably, although people are showing up to santorum events with the same schtick.

Not all people who oppose the president are racist, of course not, - but by golly there are enough examples of those who clearly are.

106 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:27:43pm

re: #103 wrenchwench

If a candidate thinks I don't have the right to control my own life, I find that meaningful, even if he'll only have the power to veto what comes from congress. Also, he can nominate justices who will further his views.

I suspect you and I will never agree, but have come to the conclusion there is another life involved.

107 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:28:35pm

Occupy strikes again.

They flashbanged some poor dude and broke his face.

Oh wait, it was the cops.

[Link: www.courthousenews.com...]

A diesel mechanic who was making himself lunch in his kitchen says Dallas police fired a flash bomb through his back door, smashed through and "zip tied" his hands behind his back, then beat him until he was bloody and unconscious and ransacked his house - apparently by mistake, as no charges were filed after the chaos subsided.

In his federal complaint, Danny Cantu, 45, says he has never been convicted of a crime. He has a high school diploma and a degree from ITT as a diesel mechanic.

Cantu says he was making his lunch in his kitchen on the afternoon of Jan. 22, 2010 when he saw several uniformed officers run into his backyard.

Almost at once, he says, the officers fired a flash bomb through his back door.

"In matter of milliseconds after the deafening and frightening explosion, the defendant officers ... forcefully entered the home by ramming through the back door," the complaint states.

Cantu said the officers did not "knock and announce" their presence or intentions, nor give him a chance to let them into his home peacefully, or otherwise attempt to obtain his consent for them to enter.

"Upon forcefully and violently entering plaintiffs home, defendant officers ... screamed at plaintiff Danny Cantu to 'get on the ground!' Plaintiff Danny Cantu immediately complied by laying face first on the kitchen floor and spreading his arms and legs while facing the floor beneath him," the complaint states.

"Defendant officers then proceeded to 'zip tie' plaintiff Danny Cantu's hand behind his back placing him under arrest. Not satisfied with shooting bombs off in plaintiff's home, violently breaking the door down and screaming at plaintiff Danny Cantu for no reason, defendant officers then proceed to repeatedly kick and beat him, causing significant bodily injuries which rendered him unconscious and lying in a pool of his own blood."

The complaint continues: "Plaintiff Danny Cantu was not charged with any crime in connection with the January 22, 2010 search and arrest conducted by defendant officers and/or defendants John Doe 1 through 10. Plaintiff Danny Cantu was not charged with resisting arrest, assault or any other criminal activity. Defendant officers and/or defendants John Doe 1 through 10 executed the search warrant and subjected plaintiff Danny Cantu to excessive force for unknown reasons."

109 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:29:23pm

re: #106 compound idaho

I suspect you and I will never agree, but have come to the conclusion there is another life involved.

Who's life other than mine is involved if I choose to use birth control?

110 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:29:34pm

re: #106 compound idaho

I suspect you and I will never agree, but have come to the conclusion there is another life involved.

Ah. So you actively approve of the GOP's anti-abortion lunacy. Fine.

So you must hate their anti-contraceptive, abstinence-only bullshit, right? Because that leads to a lot more pregnancies-- and abortions.

111 SpaceJesus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:30:49pm

re: #107 Obdicut

sue. sue the ever-living shit out of cops.

112 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:31:50pm

re: #110 Obdicut

I know there are nuts on my side, but I can still by rubbers at the truck stop and I don't need my insurance company to pay for them.

113 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:31:51pm

re: #106 compound idaho

By the way, what sort of punishment do you think that a woman who obtains an abortion should face? Or a doctor who provides one?

Jail time?

114 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:32:04pm

re: #106 compound idaho

I suspect you and I will never agree, but have come to the conclusion there is another life involved.

There's no other life involved if a woman decides to use birth control, but the lunatics in the GOP want to outlaw it.

Yeah, that's pretty damn meaningful, especially since some women, like me, take birth control pills for medical reasons.

116 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:32:58pm

re: #112 compound idaho

I know there are nuts on my side, but I can still by rubbers at the truck stop and I don't need my insurance company to pay for them.

Yeah, but if you have insurance companies cover them, you get fewer abortions-- which is what you want, right? I mean, there's another life involved, so you wouldn't not want insurance companies to cover abortion just to save a buck, right?

117 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:33:15pm

re: #108 Lidane

I'm sure none of this is meaningful at all:

GOP Rep. Slams Obama’s Contraception Rule, Claims Birth Control Is ‘Unrelated To Basic Needs Of Health Care’

Or this:

Mitch Daniels: Coal Regulations Have No Effect On ‘Human Health Or World Temperature’

Or this:

Gingrich: ‘Most Of The Asians,’ Some Latinos, But Not Many African Americans Understand Entrepreneurship

Mitch Daniels: Coal Regulations Have No Effect On ‘Human Health Or World Temperature’?

Seriously? That's like EPA 101 right there. Has the dolt even forgotten about the effects of acid rain in the north east and into Canada? Even the most basic of coal regulations have had a positive effect on our environment and the health of our people.

And this Daniels guys is supposed to be their last "great hope"? This is hilarious.

118 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:33:23pm

re: #112 compound idaho

I know there are nuts on my side, but I can still by rubbers at the truck stop and I don't need my insurance company to pay for them.

I'm guessing the "truck stop" is where you learned most of what you know about politics. There are other sources, you might want to check them out.

119 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:35:05pm

re: #112 compound idaho

I know there are nuts on my side, but I can still by rubbers at the truck stop and I don't need my insurance company to pay for them.

You know what? Fuck you and your gender privilege. Some of us have standing prescriptions for birth control pills for medical reasons, not just because we don't want kids. That prescription adds up over time. So yeah, having my insurance help cover the costs is useful.

120 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:35:31pm

re: #116 Obdicut

Yeah, but if you have insurance companies cover them, you get fewer abortions-- which is what you want, right? I mean, there's another life involved, so you wouldn't not want insurance companies to cover abortion just to save a buck, right?

You also have fewer unintended pregnancies to begin with. We're not talking about expensive experimental drugs here. Contraception is cheap and definitely cost-effective in the long run.

121 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:35:35pm

re: #117 Gus 802

Image: ec88bd3afab9e11394499bdc1b40b5f6_1M.png

That's coal sludge.

122 ProGunLiberal  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:36:03pm

re: #121 Obdicut

That's utterly disgusting.

123 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:36:04pm

re: #112 compound idaho

I know there are nuts on my side, but I can still by rubbers at the truck stop and I don't need my insurance company to pay for them.

But, erm, wives and girlfriends can't get the pill or geds at truckstops.

124 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:36:18pm

Who are these idiots like Daniels kidding anyway? Find me one Republican that would want to live in the vicinity of an unregulated coal fired power plant. I mean one that would really have to be in harms way and not some mouth breathing theoretical wingnuts sitting in his basement typing away comments at Pajamas Media. No one wants to live in those condition again. No one.

125 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:36:22pm

Nate Silver, Five Thirty Eight:
Polls Suggest Gingrich’s Support May Have Peaked

Polling released within the past 24 hours suggests that Mitt Romney may have stopped and possibly reversed Newt Gingrich’s momentum before the Florida primary on Tuesday.

The FiveThirtyEight forecast model still projects Mr. Gingrich as the slight favorite in Florida, giving him a 2-point lead and a 60 percent chance of victory. However, this lead is diminished considerably from two days ago, when the model saw a potential double-digit win for Mr. Gingrich as polls released immediately after the South Carolina primary had him surging in Florida.

126 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:37:09pm

re: #125 jaunte

His model is completely ad-hoc, though, which he freely admits. This is the test for it basically.

127 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:37:53pm

re: #124 Gus 802

No one wants to live in those condition again. No one.

Free market! Individual rights! Eleventy!

128 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:37:53pm

re: #123 wozzablog

But, erm, wives and girlfriends can't get the pill or geds at truckstops.

Not at the truck stop, but at the WalMart Pharmacy for < $20/mo.

129 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:38:24pm

re: #112 compound idaho

I know there are nuts on my side, but I can still by rubbers at the truck stop and I don't need my insurance company to pay for them.

Aside from the issue of who pays for it, what if birth control was made illegal? What if you couldn't buy your rubbers at the truck stop?

130 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:39:15pm

re: #124 Gus 802

Who are these idiots like Daniels kidding anyway? Find me one Republican that would want to live in the vicinity of an unregulated coal fired power plant. I mean one that would really have to be in harms way and not some mouth breathing theoretical wingnuts sitting in his basement typing away comments at Pajamas Media. No one wants to live in those condition again. No one.

Come now, Gus, don't you know that the key to cleaner energy is not to impose draconian regulations on power companies, but to instead insist upon them as consumers and rely upon the power of the "free market" to make power companies adopt more expensive means of energy production.

///

131 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:39:25pm

re: #129 wrenchwench

Aside from the issue of who pays for it, what if birth control was made illegal? What if you couldn't buy your rubbers at the truck stop?

Pfft. Don't you know that the only birth control that counts is for women? Condoms aren't birth control. They're just an inconvenience. =P

///

132 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:39:45pm

Oh, well, this is nice. I wonder if the secret service know that there is a foxnation user called "kenyanhunter".

He has such a rich lexicon though,

You're a brainless FaggottCockSucker troll !

Again, the comment above that one was flagged, i imagine for being true.

133 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:39:56pm

re: #128 compound idaho

Not at the truck stop, but at the WalMart Pharmacy for < $20/mo.

Your knowledge base seems to revolve around truck stops and Wal-Marts. You must be a "real American."

134 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:40:48pm

re: #127 Lidane

Heck. I remember when I was a small child driving through North Jersey on the Turnpike or the Garden State Parkway. The memories are almost mind boggling of a polluted and toxic environment in which one could barely breath. It was horrible to even drive through the area. Then, after environmental regulations took hold thanks in large part to Nixon and others things began to change for the better. What we see now in North Jersey is clean compared to what it was like in the 1960s.

135 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:42:53pm

re: #134 Gus 802

Heck. I remember when I was a small child driving through North Jersey on the Turnpike or the Garden State Parkway. The memories are almost mind boggling of a polluted and toxic environment in which one could barely breath. It was horrible to even drive through the area. Then, after environmental regulations took hold thanks in large part to Nixon and others things began to change for the better. What we see now in North Jersey is clean compared to what it was like in the 1960s.

Yeah, but think of all the lost jobs! And the higher price of electricity, which has caused prices on everything else to go up! If we got rid of all these needless regulations, why, we might see a renewed economic boom that would bring back the Good Ol' Days!

///

136 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:42:59pm

I've also seen some Republicans talking about the new gas drilling and oil drilling going on in some parts of this state. The weird thing is that sometimes you'll hear them say, "well, I used to be a Republican but..."

Everything changes when it's on your land and your air.

137 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:43:59pm

re: #136 Gus 802

I've also seen some Republicans talking about the new gas drilling and oil drilling going on in some parts of this state. The weird thing is that sometimes you'll hear them say, "well, I used to be a Republican but..."

Everything changes when it's on your land and your air.

And by Republicans here I'm talking about ranchers.

138 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:44:24pm

re: #132 wozzablog

Oh, well, this is nice. I wonder if the secret service know that there is a foxnation user called "kenyanhunter".

He has such a rich lexicon though,

Again, the comment above that one was flagged, i imagine for being true.

Yeah, this stuff is atrocious. But you can take some solace in two things: (1) this irrational intense racist hatred will be more and more on display in the coming months...for all the world to see...long term very bad for gop; (2) The kind of people who write this bile still had to live at least 4 years under a black president; and they know the days of absolute white rule are over, which really screws with their heads, so fuck them.

139 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:44:46pm
"You have constant pressure by secular judges and by religious bigots to drive Christianity out of public life and to establish a secular state except when it comes to radical Islam..."


Umm...

140 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:45:20pm

Or farmers. You might think you're a Republican farmer or rancher supporting fracking but when the time comes when that fracking destroys your underground water supply you're not going to be supporting it anymore.

141 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:45:31pm

re: #133 palomino

Your knowledge base seems to revolve around truck stops and Wal-Marts. You must be a "real American."

I spend 100+ nights a year away from home and do a lot of shopping at WalMart. Please just pay for your our birth control. Its is not that expensive.

I quess all that travel is my own form of birth control.

142 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:45:45pm

re: #140 Gus 802

Or farmers. You might think you're a Republican farmer or rancher supporting fracking but when the time comes when that fracking destroys your underground water supply you're not going to be supporting it anymore.

Not to mention the earthquakes it causes.

143 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:46:44pm

re: #141 compound idaho

But getting contraceptives through insurance is paying for it.

144 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:47:33pm

re: #26 Flashmash

WTF is with these GOP candidates? Doesn't anyone have a full and proper name? LOL

Interestingly, they often criticize Obama for going from "Barry" to his full "Barack", as though he were hiding something.

145 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:47:33pm

re: #141 compound idaho

I spend 100+ nights a year away from home and do a lot of shopping at WalMart. Please just pay for your our birth control. Its is not that expensive.

I quess all that travel is my own form of birth control.

What if your rubbers, and all other birth control methods, were illegal?

146 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:48:16pm

re: #141 compound idaho

Insurance covers boner pills, so it only makes sense that it should also cover birth control.

147 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:48:25pm

re: #134 Gus 802

Heck. I remember when I was a small child driving through North Jersey on the Turnpike or the Garden State Parkway. The memories are almost mind boggling of a polluted and toxic environment in which one could barely breath. It was horrible to even drive through the area. Then, after environmental regulations took hold thanks in large part to Nixon and others things began to change for the better. What we see now in North Jersey is clean compared to what it was like in the 1960s.

Two words: Gary, Indiana. Nastiest place I ever had to be in. Still not pretty but it's nowhere near as actively hazardous to your health to drive past the steel mills with your car windows open. I'll never forget that stink.

148 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:48:28pm

re: #145 wrenchwench

What if your rubbers, and all other birth control methods, were illegal?

Oh please. Answering that would require actual thought. I wouldn't hold out any hope of that.

149 justaminute  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:48:45pm

I can't help but wonder how they are going to keep up their anti-Muslim sentiment when our military is out of the ME? Talked to my son today and they are all excited about a re tasking of the Navy and the Marine Corp from the ME to the Pacific. He's on his way there for 6 months after SERE school.

Said the size of the Marine Corp is going to be reduced and changed back to what it was originally intended for. He said the Marine Corp has grown as large as the Army and that was not what it was intended for. He said the President made certain statements that shows we are shifting from the ME to the Pacific but I haven't heard it discussed in an boards on the net.

150 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:49:33pm

re: #146 Slumbering Behemoth

I have never understood why insurance wouldn't cover contraceptives. I know they know exactly how expensive babies are. (Very, very, very.)

151 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:49:37pm

re: #146 Slumbering Behemoth

Insurance covers boner pills, so it only makes sense that it should also cover birth control.

Pfft. Boner pills are for men. Not being able to get it up is a medical condition.

There couldn't possibly be a medical reason for birth control pills. They're unrelated to basic health care needs. It's just women, you know.

///

152 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:49:46pm

re: #147 wlewisiii

Two words: Gary, Indiana. Nastiest place I ever had to be in. Still not pretty but it's nowhere near as actively hazardous to your health to drive past the steel mills with your car windows open. I'll never forget that stink.

Come now, that was the smell of American industry! Our fathers and grandfathers grew up to that smell! It's absence is just proof of how American industry has left these shores for more business-friendly ones!

153 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:49:53pm

re: #141 compound idaho

I spend 100+ nights a year away from home and do a lot of shopping at WalMart. Please just pay for your our birth control. Its is not that expensive.

I quess all that travel is my own form of birth control.

Kinda hard to pay for birth control in states that may make it illegal.

Insurance plans pay for all kinds of drugs/medical devices that are relatively inexpensive. Why should birth control fall into a different category? We're not talking about cotton balls or toothpicks, but something that's very cost-effective in the long run. Fewer unintended pregnancies, fewer abortions, etc.

154 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:50:15pm

re: #62 Gus 802

Gingrich is a wingnut. I'm not sure if I would call Romney a wingnut. Perhaps he's a junior grade wingnut 1st class. Gingrich is like admiral wingnut.

Romney's not a wingnut. Romney occasionally tries to talk like a wingnut because wingnuts get votes, but the true fire of wingnuttery isn't in him.

Newt, however, is definitely an admiral wingnut. Maybe even a prince among wingnuts.

155 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:50:24pm

re: #146 Slumbering Behemoth

Insurance covers boner pills, so it only makes sense that it should also cover birth control.

It's freakin medication that someone here doesn't seem to understand.

And the last time I checked, NO ONE is getting insurance for FREE, so we're paying a bundle for The Pill.

156 wrenchwench  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:50:25pm

re: #148 Lidane

Oh please. Answering that would require actual thought. I wouldn't hold out any hope of that.

You're right. I'm going home.

Besides, we have our intelligent Idahoan on board now, dinging the dumb one down. Hi Bubblehead II.

157 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:50:44pm

re: #151 Lidane

They're starting to issue them to nuns to help with the breast cancer problem.

You see, pregnancies and breastfeeding reduce your risk, which means that nuns have a much higher risk. Apparently, birth control can help with this.

158 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:51:07pm

re: #147 wlewisiii

Two words: Gary, Indiana. Nastiest place I ever had to be in. Still not pretty but it's nowhere near as actively hazardous to your health to drive past the steel mills with your car windows open. I'll never forget that stink.

I could swear I've seen the water bubbling sometimes. It was like this murky slime. I think people have forgotten the road to ruin we were on before the EPA. We were headed in that direction of dead lakes, rivers and streams. And so on.

159 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:51:59pm

re: #151 Lidane

There couldn't possibly be a medical reason for birth control pills. They're unrelated to basic health care needs

I'm beating a dead horse with this, and I know you were being sarcastic, but I once had a girlfriend who was prescribed 'The Pill' in order to better regulate her unusual hormone fluctuations.

160 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:52:11pm

It's more cost-effective to pay for contraception or abortions.

It's also a myth that women use abortions as a method of birth control.

161 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:52:20pm

re: #158 Gus 802

I could swear I've seen the water bubbling sometimes. It was like this murky slime. I think people have forgotten the road to ruin we were on before the EPA. We were headed in that direction of dead lakes, rivers and streams. And so on.

You mean rivers spontaneously combusting isn't natural???

162 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:52:40pm

re: #149 justaminute

I can't help but wonder how they are going to keep up their anti-Muslim sentiment when our military is out of the ME? Talked to my son today and they are all excited about a re tasking of the Navy and the Marine Corp from the ME to the Pacific. He's on his way there for 6 months after SERE school.

Said the size of the Marine Corp is going to be reduced and changed back to what it was originally intended for. He said the Marine Corp has grown as large as the Army and that was not what it was intended for. He said the President made certain statements that shows we are shifting from the ME to the Pacific but I haven't heard it discussed in an boards on the net.

Meanwhile, the wingnut armchair generals are scared shitless that "Oh my God, Obambi's dismantling the military! The terrorists have won!!!"

Anybody else having Clinton flashbacks?

163 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:52:53pm

re: #161 Varek Raith

You mean rivers spontaneously combusting isn't natural???

It is on your home planet, but not down here.

164 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:53:26pm

re: #163 wozzablog

It is on your home planet, but not down here.

Good point.

165 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:53:38pm

re: #161 Varek Raith

You mean rivers spontaneously combusting isn't natural???

Hell, once we're burned up all the coal, oil, and gas, we can burn the water! Cheap energy for all!

166 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:53:42pm

re: #161 Varek Raith

You mean rivers spontaneously combusting isn't natural???

I'm trying to figure out how that party claims to be on the side of hunters and fishermen and say things like this. You can't call yourself a sportsman and be against environmental protection.

167 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:53:52pm

re: #161 Varek Raith

You mean rivers spontaneously combusting isn't natural???

The lost secret to Greek fire!!!

///

168 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:54:28pm

re: #165 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Heck! Who cares if we die. We're all going to heaven anyway!

//

169 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:54:34pm

re: #159 Slumbering Behemoth

I'm beating a dead horse with this, and I know you were being sarcastic, but I once had a girlfriend who was prescribed 'The Pill' in order to better regulate her unusual hormone fluctuations.

That's why I take them. My PCOS is better controlled with a combination of birth control pills and medication. I'm not having the same issues I had before.

I don't know what I'd do without them. I'd probably be right back where I was before, and I don't want to go through that again.

170 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:54:51pm

re: #167 talon_262

The lost secret to Greek fire!!!

///

Was that on the History Channel?

//

171 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:55:16pm

re: #166 Gus 802

Indeed. The overwhelming majority of hunter/fishermen that I've known are very keen on that.

172 BongCrodny  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:55:28pm

re: #141 compound idaho

I quess all that travel is my own form of birth control.

We're all grateful.

173 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:55:30pm

re: #170 Gus 802

Was that on the History Channel?

//

Ancient aliens.

174 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:55:37pm

re: #76 Gus 802

Looking around...

Abortion in Islamic countries

Seems as though many conservative Muslim countries have more liberal laws regarding abortion when compared to Rick Santorum and many Republicans.

I know next to nothing about the rulings on abortion in Islam, (although I seem to recall Mohammed spoke against female infanticide, which I assume has some connection), but if it's anything like the halacha on the subject, it will be far more flexible than Santorum's approach.

175 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:56:07pm

re: #174 SanFranciscoZionist

I know next to nothing about the rulings on abortion in Islam, (although I seem to recall Mohammed spoke against female infanticide, which I assume has some connection), but if it's anything like the halacha on the subject, it will be far more flexible than Santorum's approach.

Scary isn't it?

176 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:56:11pm

re: #159 Slumbering Behemoth

I'm beating a dead horse with this, and I know you were being sarcastic, but I once had a girlfriend who was prescribed 'The Pill' in order to better regulate her unusual hormone fluctuations.

My sister was on The Pill for years after puberty due to irregular periods. Don't think she ever saw it as anything other than just another drug to keep her healthy.

177 justaminute  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:56:28pm

re: #162 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Meanwhile, the wingnut armchair generals are scared shitless that "Oh my God, Obambi's dismantling the military! The terrorists have won!!!"

Anybody else having Clinton flashbacks?

No, he's not dismantling he's just taking the Navy from the sandbox and putting them back out to sea. Seems that a lot of the Navy and the Marines have been there so long that their sea skills have rusted. There's going to be quite a bit of retraining going on.

178 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:56:42pm

re: #160 Gus 802

It's more cost-effective to pay for contraception or abortions.

It's also a myth that women use abortions as a method of birth control.

And safer, of course.

I'm not sure it's a myth. I don't think most women think they can just have an abortion, no biggie. On the other hand, I really don't care if she does. It's her legal right to have an abortion in any case.

The anti-contraceptive camp goes much further than controlling women's reproduction. It's about controlling women, period. The pill freed us.

179 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:56:45pm

re: #173 Varek Raith

Ancient aliens.

The Ancients?

//

180 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:56:55pm

re: #159 Slumbering Behemoth

I'm beating a dead horse with this, and I know you were being sarcastic, but I once had a girlfriend who was prescribed 'The Pill' in order to better regulate her unusual hormone fluctuations.

My ex-wife had endomitriosis, and as a result had -- no exaggeration -- cripplingly painful periods. She got on the pill and it made all the difference in the world. Some were still worse than others but it was no longer a 5-day suicide watch once a month.

181 Coracle  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:56:57pm

re: #174 SanFranciscoZionist

I know next to nothing about the rulings on abortion in Islam, (although I seem to recall Mohammed spoke against female infanticide, which I assume has some connection), but if it's anything like the halacha on the subject, it will be far more flexible than Santorum's approach.

That only means that the right to choose is basically Sharia Law.
/

But just wait. Someone will say it.

182 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:57:38pm

re: #177 justaminute

No, he's not dismantling he's just taking the Navy from the sandbox and putting them back out to sea. Seems that a lot of the Navy and the Marines have been there so long that their sea skills have rusted. There's going to be quite a bit of retraining going on.

We've been running blue-water ships in brown-waters for so long, I'm sure they all need a remedial course.

183 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:58:03pm

re: #179 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

The Ancients?

//

Damn pricks.
"Hey, we're godlike and all, but... You're on your own against the Ori. Kthxbai."

184 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:58:17pm

re: #98 Stanley Sea

Ya know, I do appreciate this. I follow it, although my peeps just are better so there's no downside. /half

But really I don't think I'd flip out if Romney was elected, because I think his outrageous positions during the primary are for the votes. I could be ms. #1 naive fool, but I think he wouldn't be horrible COMPARED TO GINGRICH. W/Gingrich, we'll be in another unpaid for war. Based on bigger lies.

I think that if Romney wins the presidency, (which, God forbid), he'll be competent. I'll disagree with him about most stuff, but the thought of him in the White House does not make me want to cry, and hide under the bed, and eat whole half-gallon tubs of ice-cream.

Newt, on the other hand...

185 justaminute  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:58:19pm

re: #174 SanFranciscoZionist

I know next to nothing about the rulings on abortion in Islam, (although I seem to recall Mohammed spoke against female infanticide, which I assume has some connection), but if it's anything like the halacha on the subject, it will be far more flexible than Santorum's approach.

You can obtain an abortion in Iran. But I don't know of any specific ruling in Iran that denies or OK's it.

186 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:58:20pm

re: #178 marjoriemoon

And safer, of course.

I'm not sure it's a myth. I don't think most women think they can just have an abortion, no biggie. On the other hand, I really don't care if she does. It's her legal right to have an abortion in any case.

The anti-contraceptive camp goes much further than controlling women's reproduction. It's about controlling women, period. The pill freed us.

Right. I should rephrase that. It's a myth that women only use abortions as a form of birth control. Which is a common meme from the anti-abortion crowd.

187 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:58:49pm

re: #154 SanFranciscoZionist

Romney's not a wingnut. Romney occasionally tries to talk like a wingnut because wingnuts get votes, but the true fire of wingnuttery isn't in him.

Newt, however, is definitely an admiral wingnut. Maybe even a prince among wingnuts.

Which is exactly why I go back and forth over which one I detest more. Gingrich is more real--a real prick with no personal integrity and the RW blowhard penchant for demonizing gays, blacks, foreigners, the poor, etc.

Romney, OTOH, is more measured, but he's probably the phoniest politician we've had run for prez in decades. Very little of what he says now is consistent with what he said just a few years back. Old Mitt: "I'm not a Reagan/Bush supporter...I'm a moderate Republican with progressive views." New Mitt: I am Ronald Reagan reborn.

He's an unemployed wax figure in search of a job, and he'll say anything to get it, since he stands for nothing.

188 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:59:30pm

re: #183 Varek Raith

Damn pricks.
"Hey, we're godlike and all, but... You're on your own against the Ori. Kthxbai."

Before that, it was "Sorry, but we can't help you with them Goa'uld guys."

189 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:59:31pm

re: #156 wrenchwench

Have a good night.

190 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 5:59:37pm

The obvious point being that contraception prevents abortions. It's just plain common sense.

191 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:00:27pm

re: #190 Gus 802

The obvious point being that contraception prevents abortions. It's just plain common sense.

Image: common-sense-superpower.jpg

192 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:00:29pm

re: #153 palomino

Kinda hard to pay for birth control in states that may make it illegal.

Insurance plans pay for all kinds of drugs/medical devices that are relatively inexpensive. Why should birth control fall into a different category? We're not talking about cotton balls or toothpicks, but something that's very cost-effective in the long run. Fewer unintended pregnancies, fewer abortions, etc.

I am not opposed to birth control on moral grounds. Just pay for it at the counter.

I could be wrong. (I have been more often than I would like to admit!) Are any states proposing making rubbers illegal?

193 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:00:38pm

re: #169 Lidane

My poor ex-g/f. When we started getting serious, she let me know what I was gonna be in for. Before she started taking the pill, she was pretty much the living embodiment of every menses stereotype you've ever heard, and a few you probably haven't. It made her miserable.

194 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:01:01pm

re: #190 Gus 802

The obvious point being that contraception prevents abortions. It's just plain common sense.

well there's a .0047% chance that it won't, clearly a waste of time.

195 Political Atheist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:01:13pm

re: #147 wlewisiii

Two words: Gary, Indiana. Nastiest place I ever had to be in. Still not pretty but it's nowhere near as actively hazardous to your health to drive past the steel mills with your car windows open. I'll never forget that stink.

I grew up in the LA Air basin. Apocryphal stories have the Indians complaining about the smoke that hung around from their own cook fires. LA acts like a big bowl sometimes trapping us in our own stinky pollution. In high school I ran cross country competitions. Work outs got cancelled because the air was unfit to breathe deeply. We cut school and ran our practices sub rosa. I probably hurt myself that way.

I remember actual lung pain from smog alert days. That's all over with. And I'm damn glad. Back in the day I bitched long and loud about what the state did to my go fast cars. I was as wrong as can be save one point. We were only allowed one technology to meet emission rules. The state mandated technology. No other method was allowed to comply, which was pretty stupid from an innovators point of view.

Now I'm the guy that keeps our Air Quality Air Management authorities satisfied despite running an aqua regia acid chem lab to refine gold in major quantities at our unmarked facility. You should see the books of rules. I don't mind them a bit.

196 EdDantes  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:01:17pm

re: #187 palomino

"He's an unemployed wax figure in search of a job, and he'll say anything to get it, since he stands for nothing".

A man who stands for nothing will stand for anything.

197 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:01:29pm

re: #180 negativ

My ex-wife had endomitriosis, and as a result had -- no exaggeration -- cripplingly painful periods. She got on the pill and it made all the difference in the world. Some were still worse than others but it was no longer a 5-day suicide watch once a month.

My wife as well.

198 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:02:02pm

You know, this all really does my head in.

Viagra can be used for heart patients. The pill can be used for other things.

Blanket bans on anything are insane, but then this is a tricksy sciencemagiks related area.

199 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:02:19pm

re: #132 wozzablog

Oh, well, this is nice. I wonder if the secret service know that there is a foxnation user called "kenyanhunter".

He has such a rich lexicon though,

Again, the comment above that one was flagged, i imagine for being true.

Planted, I'm sure.

200 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:02:28pm

re: #190 Gus 802

The obvious point being that contraception prevents abortions. It's just plain common sense.

Well yeah Gus, but that's because you're a godless heathen. Now, if you'd read the Good Book, as interpreted by the legions of brain dead misogynists and their scumbag political enablers, you'd know that abortions are a sin in the eyes of the lord and contraception is little more than an engraved invitation to women to engage in sinful activities. We must remove these options, so that women only have sex as God intended: married & at the whims of her husband's libido.

201 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:02:49pm

re: #195 Rightwingconspirator

Denver used to get the terrible "brown cloud." I even saw it well into the 1990s. It slowly went away because of regulations. Believe me that was an ugly sight to behold. We get them on occasion but they're very infrequent today.

202 Coracle  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:02:51pm

re: #192 compound idaho

I am not opposed to birth control on moral grounds. Just pay for it at the counter.

I could be wrong. (I have been more often than I would like to admit!) Are any states proposing making rubbers illegal?

Don't pretend the two methods of contraception are equivalent.

203 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:03:04pm

re: #196 EdDantes

"He's an unemployed wax figure in search of a job, and he'll say anything to get it, since he stands for nothing".

A man who stands for nothing will stand for anything.

But, additionally, a wax man should stand nowhere near a heat source. Debate stage lighting, for example.

204 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:04:27pm

re: #190 Gus 802

The obvious point being that contraception prevents abortions. It's just plain common sense.

Right. Well the significance of the Pill was huge for woman. I'm not sure a lot of men understand it and I'm not sure a lot of women born after the Pill became a household item understand it either. There were really only a few professions women could get. Telephone operator, nurse, teacher, secretary. Not much beyond that. Women could go to college before 1960, my grandmother born in 1890 went to college, but they didn't do much with their degrees afterwards.

At any rate, women would take these few professions, but had to quit when they become pregnant. Went on to raise the kids and felt they had no lives of their own. Not that raising children is not fulfilling. It is. We just wanted more, or both. Family and career. The Pill gave us that option.

205 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:04:46pm

re: #192 compound idaho

I am not opposed to birth control on moral grounds. Just pay for it at the counter.

Why not pay through it for insurance? What is the big deal?

206 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:04:58pm

re: #192 compound idaho

I am not opposed to birth control on moral grounds. Just pay for it at the counter.

I could be wrong. (I have been more often than I would like to admit!) Are any states proposing making rubbers illegal?

Why the obsession with removing insurance from the equation? Lots of medications/devices that are arguably less essential (zit meds, boner pills, etc) are covered, so why not birth control, especially when it's clearly cost-effective. Seems like a win-win-win: Less unwanted pregnancies, less abortions, and money saved long term.

207 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:05:26pm

Barrack Hussien Obama has been terrible towards sports fishermen in this country! That's why when we elect Gingrich into the White House we can look forward to him allowing the chemical plant to able to dump all of their waste into the nearest estuary and sea outlet.

208 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:05:50pm

re: #198 wozzablog

You know, this all really does my head in.

Viagra can be used for heart patients. The pill can be used for other things.

Blanket bans on anything are insane, but then this is a tricksy sciencemagiks related area.

In fact, Viagra was initially developed to be used with heart patients, but when they noticed that odd side effect... $$$KA-CHING$$$

209 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:06:11pm

re: #192 compound idaho

I am not opposed to birth control on moral grounds. Just pay for it at the counter.

I could be wrong. (I have been more often than I would like to admit!) Are any states proposing making rubbers illegal?

No I don't think so. Only female contraception, not male contraception. How's them apples?

Hey, I'm all for making the Pill an over the counter item. Allergy medication is. But I honestly don't think you'll ever see the Pill over the counter.

210 EdDantes  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:06:14pm

re: #203 wozzablog

The madam Tussauds candidate.

211 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:06:22pm

re: #204 marjoriemoon

well you're implying that there weren't women who both had careers and relationships, or who didn't get pregnant before the pill.

It was important, but lets not be silly.

212 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:06:23pm

re: #128 compound idaho

Not at the truck stop, but at the WalMart Pharmacy for < $20/mo.

Precisely why should there be one routine medication used by many if not most American women during their lives that doesn't get covered by health insurance? Why should I pay a ten-dollar copay for my antidepressants, my antibiotics, my inhaler for bronchitis wheezing, but thirty bucks a month (never twenty that I can recall) for my birth control?

I did it for years because I worked for Catholic schools, but that was something I was willing to put up with, although I had some choice words about it at times. In general, it sucks.

Also, you need a prescriber. If you don't HAVE health insurance, that's often Planned Parenthood, who I have also used, which is why I tend to frown on politicians who treat them like the devil.

213 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:07:01pm

re: #195 Rightwingconspirator

Having grown up in northern Wisconsin, I usually only had the occasional minor stink from the paper mill downtown to contend with. Visiting family friends in Chicago or, worse, into Indiana was alway a shock to my system. I could, almost, understand why the companies let things get that bad (greed) but I couldn't understand why the workers didn't run for something else somewhere else. I understand now just how high those salaries were and how good the benefits were back in the day. But how many of them and their children died much younger than they should have for the sake of those wages?

214 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:07:45pm

Just look at what happened with BP and the Gulf of Mexico. And that's with regulations. Now imagine not having regulations in place. The free-market would not regulate itself. Ecosystems do not have the luxury of waiting for "the market" to straighten things out.

215 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:07:55pm

re: #192 compound idaho

I am not opposed to birth control on moral grounds. Just pay for it at the counter.

I could be wrong. (I have been more often than I would like to admit!) Are any states proposing making rubbers illegal?

they're only women! Who cares, right?!?!! They're not as important as you!

216 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:08:02pm

re: #204 marjoriemoon

Bullshit. The Pill is all about fucking for fun.
///need I?

217 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:08:03pm

re: #212 SanFranciscoZionist

condoms cost at least that much!!! IT's only fair!

218 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:08:38pm

re: #212 SanFranciscoZionist

Why should I pay a ten-dollar copay for my antidepressants, my antibiotics, my inhaler for bronchitis wheezing, but thirty bucks a month (never twenty that I can recall) for my birth control?

Well, silly, don't you know that pain in childbirth is God's judgement against you women for causing man to sin, and thus encouraging you to avoid becoming pregnant is akin to encouraging you to avoid God's will?

219 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:09:31pm

re: #141 compound idaho

I spend 100+ nights a year away from home and do a lot of shopping at WalMart. Please just pay for your our birth control. Its is not that expensive.

I quess all that travel is my own form of birth control.

I do pay for my own birth control. I do it when I pay for it separately because I work for Catholic schools, and I do it when my health insurance covers it, because I pay for that health insurance. Why should I 'just pay for my own birth control' in a separate way from other medications I'm prescribed? (Aside from my personal situation with the diocese, which, as I mentioned, I was never happy about.)

220 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:09:33pm

re: #218 freetoken

God's will is that people get polio

221 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:10:01pm

re: #220 WindUpBird

God's will is that people get polio

Blindness is also a part of intelligent design.

//

222 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:10:24pm

re: #193 Slumbering Behemoth

My poor ex-g/f. When we started getting serious, she let me know what I was gonna be in for. Before she started taking the pill, she was pretty much the living embodiment of every menses stereotype you've ever heard, and a few you probably haven't. It made her miserable.

God, so was I. My hormones went totally out of control a few years ago. I'd get aggro and rage about the smallest, dumbest things, then I'd get depressed. Never mind the extended periods that started happening later on, right before my PCOS diagnosis. I'd literally go months without having a period then spend -- and I'm not exaggerating -- anywhere from 3-5 weeks dealing with a cycle that felt like it would never end.

I thought I was going crazy. I was self-diagnosing myself with everything, like depression, anxiety, OCD, bipolar, etc. And the extended periods made me so miserable that not only did my sex life die, but I hated my body and seriously considered a hysterectomy just to end the whole ordeal. A single visit to the endocrinologist and to a gynecologist and two prescriptions later, and things are right back to normal.

NO way would I want to go back to that again. These GOP assholes who want to outlaw birth control make me angry. I'm not being a selfish bitch for taking them. I'm taking care of my body so I can be normal.

223 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:10:36pm

re: #204 marjoriemoon

Right. Well the significance of the Pill was huge for woman. I'm not sure a lot of men understand it and I'm not sure a lot of women born after the Pill became a household item understand it either. There were really only a few professions women could get. Telephone operator, nurse, teacher, secretary. Not much beyond that. Women could go to college before 1960, my grandmother born in 1890 went to college, but they didn't do much with their degrees afterwards.

At any rate, women would take these few professions, but had to quit when they become pregnant. Went on to raise the kids and felt they had no lives of their own. Not that raising children is not fulfilling. It is. We just wanted more, or both. Family and career. The Pill gave us that option.

Excellent comment, so true. My mom was actually a telephone operator, then a nurse, then a teacher. So I know exactly what you're talking about.

224 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:10:42pm

re: #221 Gus 802

Blindness is also a part of intelligent design.

//

Who's the idiot that made the food pipe and the air pipe the same?!?!?!

225 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:10:46pm

re: #221 Gus 802

Blindness is also a part of intelligent design.

//

well seriously, how else are you supposed to know if you're one of the Elect or not?

All those blindies should be thanking God for letting them know they shouldn't bother.

226 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:11:26pm

Hear the stories about how bad pollution used to be and think a lot of the reason so many Republicans are now pushing the deregulation angle is because people of my generation and the ones after have no living memory of how bad it used to be. To us, things like smog and acid rain are things you read about in science books or watch about on history channels, not things experienced on a daily basis. We've never seen rivers ablaze or had to worry that walking outside could fill our lungs with enough crud to shave years off our lives.

So hearing politicians tell us that those days are gone, that deregulation won't mean they'll return, and we'll all be happier with lower costs and more jobs, is hard to refute. After all, we certainly can't say "When I was a kid..."

227 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:11:32pm

re: #224 Varek Raith

Who's the idiot that made the food pipe and the air pipe the same?!?!?!

Why does poop stink I ask. I mean seriously. Why can't it smell like a petunia?

//

228 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:11:48pm

re: #157 EmmmieG

They're starting to issue them to nuns to help with the breast cancer problem.

You see, pregnancies and breastfeeding reduce your risk, which means that nuns have a much higher risk. Apparently, birth control can help with this.

Coworker of mine got into a fight with the Diocese when she was prescribed birth control pills for a hormone issue. (She's a lesbian, so this was not otherwise relevent. to her.)

Diocese didn't want to pay because it was CONTRACEPTION. I think they eventually gave in, after several annoyed letters and a lot of documentation.

229 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:12:12pm

Actually works as a good survival mechanism. When something stinks it means "stay away!"

230 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:12:22pm

re: #224 Varek Raith

Who's the idiot that made the food pipe and the air pipe the same?!?!?!

The same idiot that put the amusement park right next to the sewage plant.

231 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:12:45pm

re: #227 Gus 802

Why does poop stink I ask. I mean seriously. Why can't it smell like a petunia?

//

Eat more flowers

232 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:13:14pm

re: #209 marjoriemoon

No I don't think so. Only female contraception, not male contraception. How's them apples?

Hey, I'm all for making the Pill an over the counter item. Allergy medication is. But I honestly don't think you'll ever see the Pill over the counter.

It can't be over the counter. Too many hormonal variables at work.

233 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:13:22pm

re: #230 Slumbering Behemoth

The same idiot that put the amusement park right next to the sewage plant.

Image: tysonreaction.gif

234 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:13:36pm

re: #228 SanFranciscoZionist

ok seriously, gotta ask, she was gay and the issue the Diocese had was contraception?

235 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:13:42pm

re: #227 Gus 802

Why does poop stink I ask. I mean seriously. Why can't it smell like a petunia?

//

That's to keep you from playing with it...unless you have a cold...or are Glenn Beck.

236 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:13:45pm

re: #231 windsagio

Eat more flowers

Euell Gibbons!

Ah the 70s.

//

237 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:13:52pm

re: #215 WindUpBird

they're only women! Who cares, right?!?!! They're not as important as you!

My lady friends expected me to supply to condom and the pill when we got serious. I did. Not uncle Sam. It is not that big of a deal.

238 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:14:46pm

re: #226 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Hear the stories about how bad pollution used to be and think a lot of the reason so many Republicans are now pushing the deregulation angle is because people of my generation and the ones after have no living memory of how bad it used to be. To us, things like smog and acid rain are things you read about in science books or watch about on history channels, not things experienced on a daily basis. We've never seen rivers ablaze or had to worry that walking outside could fill our lungs with enough crud to shave years off our lives.

So hearing politicians tell us that those days are gone, that deregulation won't mean they'll return, and we'll all be happier with lower costs and more jobs, is hard to refute. After all, we certainly can't say "When I was a kid..."

Yeah, this.

239 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:14:53pm

re: #237 compound idaho

both?

Edit: can a man even get birth control pills legally?

240 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:15:15pm

re: #211 windsagio

well you're implying that there weren't women who both had careers and relationships, or who didn't get pregnant before the pill.

It was important, but lets not be silly.

I think the Pill was developed in the 50s, but prior to that time, no, women had a hard time finding a career. We had few choices, mainly because, like I said and I'll repeat it, once you got pregnant, that ended your career. There was no daycare, no nannies. Momma took care of the kid.

In fact, when a woman died leaving the man alone with the children, he would often have to give them to a relative to raise, or put them up for adoption. There was no vehicle available for him to work and care for his children.

241 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:15:16pm

re: #192 compound idaho

I am not opposed to birth control on moral grounds. Just pay for it at the counter.

I may be missing your point. Do you feel that contraception should or shouldn't be covered by insurance? Because either way, you pay at the counter. It's just a matter of how much you pay, in addition to what you're already paying for the insurance.

242 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:15:24pm

re: #237 compound idaho

My lady friends expected me to supply to condom and the pill when we got serious. I did. Not uncle Sam. It is not that big of a deal.

If you're taking a pill before giving your "lady friend" a condom a) you're not doing it right... and b) she might not be a lady.

243 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:15:31pm

re: #237 compound idaho

My lady friends expected me to supply to condom and the pill when we got serious. I did. Not uncle Sam. It is not that big of a deal.

Uh. You do understand how birth control pills work, right?

244 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:15:49pm

re: #216 Slumbering Behemoth

Bullshit. The Pill is all about fucking for fun.
///need I?

Not that there's anything wrong with that :)

245 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:15:58pm

re: #243 Charles

Uh. You do understand how birth control pills work, right?

Apparently not.

246 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:16:03pm

maybe he means morning after pills (ok that's pretty dark actually)

247 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:16:24pm

re: #237 compound idaho

My lady friends expected me to supply to condom and the pill when we got serious. I did. Not uncle Sam. It is not that big of a deal.

Insurance isn't paid for by "uncle sam"...it's paid for by the policy holder.

Unless you actually had an uncle called sam who had an unnatural level of interest in your sex life.

248 EdDantes  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:16:30pm

re: #230 Slumbering Behemoth

The same idiot that put the amusement park right next to the sewage plant.

Beat me to it. :)

249 JAFO  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:16:33pm

re: #243 Charles

Uh. You do understand how birth control pills work, right?

or insurance, for that matter. Uncle Sam has nothing to do with it.

250 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:16:44pm

re: #237 compound idaho

My lady friends expected me to supply to condom and the pill when we got serious. I did. Not uncle Sam. It is not that big of a deal.

What the fuck do you not get about this:

People getting contraceptives through their insurance are still paying for them. Not uncle sam.

What the fuck is not getting through to you about this, seriously, it's weird.

251 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:17:12pm

re: #243 Charles

Uh. You do understand how birth control pills work, right?

I put one on the dashboard of my car. Haven't had an accident since.

252 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:17:13pm

re: #243 Charles

Uh. You do understand how birth control pills work, right?

Just two kids. You be the judge.

253 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:17:57pm

Speaking of sex... just published today in the fascinating field of genetics:

Y Chromosome Lineages in Men of West African Descent

The early African experience in the Americas is marked by the transatlantic slave trade from ~1619 to 1850 and the rise of the plantation system. The origins of enslaved Africans were largely dependent on European preferences as well as the availability of potential laborers within Africa. Rice production was a key industry of many colonial South Carolina low country plantations. Accordingly, rice plantations owners within South Carolina often requested enslaved Africans from the so-called “Grain Coast” of western Africa (Senegal to Sierra Leone). Studies on the African origins of the enslaved within other regions of the Americas have been limited. To address the issue of origins of people of African descent within the Americas and understand more about the genetic heterogeneity present within Africa and the African Diaspora, we typed Y chromosome specific markers in 1,319 men consisting of 508 west and central Africans (from 12 populations), 188 Caribbeans (from 2 islands), 532 African Americans (AAs from Washington, DC and Columbia, SC), and 91 European Americans. Principal component and admixture analyses provide support for significant Grain Coast ancestry among African American men in South Carolina. AA men from DC and the Caribbean showed a closer affinity to populations from the Bight of Biafra. Furthermore, 30–40% of the paternal lineages in African descent populations in the Americas are of European ancestry. Diverse west African ancestries and sex-biased gene flow from EAs has contributed greatly to the genetic heterogeneity of African populations throughout the Americas and has significant implications for gene mapping efforts in these populations.

[....]

Individuals of African descent within the Americas have varied African origins and did have interactions with non-Africans, namely Europeans and indigenous Americans. European ancestry entered this sociopolitical defined group due to a range of practices including voluntary concubinage, marriage, and forced relations. European males predominated in this exchange, but sometimes European females were also involved.

[...]

The amounts of paternal genetic contributions made by Europeans to the African American populations included in this study were similar and varied between 30–40% (Table 5). One of the Caribbean populations, Jamaica, had the highest amount of European admixture at 41.1%. The African American population from South Carolina had the least amount of European admixture, only 32.3%.

[...]

Hmm... maybe someone should ask the Tea Partying GOP if they'll allow "voluntary concubinage" when they get around to restricting marriage laws.

Anyway, not surprising about the lineages as it has been well known that most African Americans have some European ancestors in the family tree. But to see over 30% of the AA males carrying European traced Y-DNA is higher than I would have expected.

254 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:18:15pm

re: #252 compound idaho

Just two kids. You be the judge.

Okay...so you get mail and milk service. So what?

255 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:18:46pm

Lol.

256 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:19:27pm

re: #254 darthstar

Okay...so you get mail and milk service. So what?

Darth, that was a bit below the belt.

257 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:19:38pm

re: #250 Obdicut

What the fuck do you not get about this:

People getting contraceptives through their insurance are still paying for them. Not uncle sam.

What the fuck is not getting through to you about this, seriously, it's weird.

What the fuck do you not get about INSURANCE? It should not pay for every trip to Walgreens.

258 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:19:44pm

I gotta big date tonight...anyone know where I can find a pill?

259 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:20:10pm

re: #258 darthstar

Truck stop!

260 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:20:15pm

re: #256 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Darth, that was a bit below the belt.

That's what the milkman said.

261 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:20:23pm
262 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:20:38pm

re: #231 windsagio

Eat more flowers

That'll also help with fiber intake!

263 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:20:41pm

re: #259 compound idaho

Truck stop!

Don't like truck stops...all the hookers are named Merle.

264 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:20:49pm

re: #237 compound idaho

My lady friends expected me to supply to condom and the pill when we got serious. I did. Not uncle Sam. It is not that big of a deal.

Some people are barely getting by. Many of whom are on public assistance. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. And yes, 30 dollars or so month can break people that are barely making it. Many of whom are working and not on PA. With that you not only avoid abortions but you prevent the birth of a child that could not be afforded by the mother. When that happens you increase the need for entitlements exponentially. So that $360/year in birth control can save the 10s of thousands of dollars in aid needed for that child.

265 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:20:50pm

re: #243 Charles

I highly doubt it.

266 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:21:21pm

re: #257 compound idaho

What the fuck do you not get about INSURANCE?

I don't know. To me, health insurance is something that helps pay for medical expenses.

Why the hell are you referring to Uncle Sam buying contraceptives? What on earth are you talking about?

Someone buys insurance, the insurance pays for the pill-- uncle sam is not fucking involved.

Get it?

267 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:21:27pm

re: #237 compound idaho

My lady friends expected me to supply to condom and the pill when we got serious. I did. Not uncle Sam. It is not that big of a deal.

Well, what your "lady friends" expected is really immaterial. Try to look outside your life, at a huge group of people who may have different needs than you.

And, for god's sake, quit calling them "rubbers." This isn't the Summer of '44.

268 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:21:28pm

re: #240 marjoriemoon

random example: Claire Boothe Luce says hi

and I'm tending to wander off point, but hyperbole can get a bit gnarly. There were both ways to avoid pregnancy and women who had careers after they had kids well before the pill.

269 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:21:45pm

re: #258 darthstar

I don't know how the hell to enter this conversation.

270 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:21:49pm

re: #257 compound idaho

What the fuck do you not get about INSURANCE? It should not pay for every trip to Walgreens.

The heck?

Aspirin is a few cents a pack, fine - birth control is in the tens of dollars and not everyone can afford it, even though it may not be needed for the purposes of controlling brths.

271 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:21:51pm

re: #264 Gus 802

Some people are barely getting by. Many of whom are on public assistance. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. And yes, 30 dollars or so month can break people that are barely making it. Many of whom are working and not on PA. With that you not only avoid abortions but you prevent the birth of a child that could not be afforded by the mother. When that happens you increase the need for entitlements exponentially. So that $360/year in birth control can save the 10o00s of dollars in aid needed for that child.

Personal responsibility.

272 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:22:06pm

Evening all. What's the good word?

273 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:22:15pm

re: #269 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I don't know how the hell to enter this conversation.

From behind is still available.
//

274 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:22:32pm

re: #268 windsagio

But it became far, far easier afterwards. I'm not getting what your point is.

275 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:22:45pm

re: #272 Dark_Falcon

Evening all. What's the good word?

Responsibility!

276 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:23:02pm

re: #272 Dark_Falcon

Evening all. What's the good word?

Antidisestablishmentarianism. As always.

277 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:23:10pm

re: #271 compound idaho

Personal responsibility.

Where is personal responsibility lacking in someone choosing to get birth control?

Isn't that, in fact, an exercise in personal responsibility?

278 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:23:23pm

re: #272 Dark_Falcon

What's the good word?

Prophylaxis

279 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:23:30pm

re: #274 Obdicut

But it became far, far easier afterwards. I'm not getting what your point is.

I said that myself, I'm saying that the absolutist oversimplification isn't helpful.

280 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:23:30pm

The best birth control pill for a woman is aspirin, actually.

Hold it between your knees.

(old joke)

281 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:23:42pm

re: #269 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I don't know how the hell to enter this conversation.

Lubricated might work.

282 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:23:42pm

re: #279 windsagio

I said that myself, I'm saying that the absolutist oversimplification isn't helpful.

What absolutist oversimplification?

283 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:23:47pm

re: #271 compound idaho

Personal responsibility.

Right. Personal responsibility. If that's the case then we deny every form of health care to anyone that did anything wrong in their lives. And I mean anything and everything. So if you're speeding and get into a car accident you can forget about any health care because you were speeding.

284 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:23:52pm

re: #272 Dark_Falcon

Evening all. What's the good word?

We're talking about fucking, and people who think a birth control pill is something you can give a date once and be protected (note: only works if the person you're fucking is of the same sex as you). You're right on time.

285 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:24:11pm

My cousin and his wife claims that 2 different forms of birth control failed (for their 2 kids). Not sure I believe them tho'.

286 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:24:17pm

re: #280 marjoriemoon

The best birth control pill for a woman is aspirin, actually.

Hold it between your knees.

(old joke)

I was actually thinking of entering the conversation with that, but was afraid you'd hit me.

287 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:24:21pm

re: #271 compound idaho

Personal responsibility.

Dude...

288 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:24:37pm

re: #234 windsagio

ok seriously, gotta ask, she was gay and the issue the Diocese had was contraception?

At that particular moment in time, yes. The plot thickened later on, due to psychotics beyond our control, but that is another story.

Her wife worked at another school in the same diocese.

289 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:25:11pm

re: #282 Obdicut

What absolutist oversimplification?

here we go again >>

to quote:

Family and career. The Pill gave us that option.

290 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:25:15pm

re: #280 marjoriemoon

The best birth control pill for a woman is aspirin, actually.

Hold it between your knees.

(old missionary joke)

291 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:25:27pm

re: #288 SanFranciscoZionist

At that particular moment in time, yes. The plot thickened later on, due to psychotics beyond our control, but that is another story.

Her wife worked at another school in the same diocese.

Now your just reciting the plot of a telenovella.

292 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:25:28pm

re: #240 marjoriemoon

I think the Pill was developed in the 50s, but prior to that time, no, women had a hard time finding a career. We had few choices, mainly because, like I said and I'll repeat it, once you got pregnant, that ended your career. There was no daycare, no nannies. Momma took care of the kid.

I'm sure wealthy people had nannies. Wealthy people have ALWAYS had nannies.

293 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:25:39pm

re: #283 Gus 802

Right. Personal responsibility. If that's the case then we deny every form of health care to anyone that did anything wrong in their lives. And I mean anything and everything. So if you're speeding and get into a car accident you can forget about any health care because you were speeding.

Cancer treatments for smokers...heart surgery for obese patients...dialysis for diabetics who didn't regulate their sugar intake...the list goes on.

294 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:25:42pm

re: #271 compound idaho

Personal responsibility.

Newt Gingrich...the guy you're planning to vote for.

Drop the tired gop slogans...whether you pay out of pocket or through insurance, obtaining and using birth control amounts to the same level of personal responsibility.

295 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:25:52pm

re: #204 marjoriemoon

Right. Well the significance of the Pill was huge for woman. I'm not sure a lot of men understand it and I'm not sure a lot of women born after the Pill became a household item understand it either. There were really only a few professions women could get. Telephone operator, nurse, teacher, secretary. Not much beyond that. Women could go to college before 1960, my grandmother born in 1890 went to college, but they didn't do much with their degrees afterwards.

At any rate, women would take these few professions, but had to quit when they become pregnant. Went on to raise the kids and felt they had no lives of their own. Not that raising children is not fulfilling. It is. We just wanted more, or both. Family and career. The Pill gave us that option.

Quoted again for truth.

296 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:26:03pm

re: #254 darthstar

Okay...so you get mail and milk service. So what?

re: #256 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Darth, that was a bit below the belt.

Maybe, but I chuckled my ass off.

297 BongCrodny  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:26:06pm

re: #226 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Hear the stories about how bad pollution used to be and think a lot of the reason so many Republicans are now pushing the deregulation angle is because people of my generation and the ones after have no living memory of how bad it used to be. To us, things like smog and acid rain are things you read about in science books or watch about on history channels, not things experienced on a daily basis. We've never seen rivers ablaze or had to worry that walking outside could fill our lungs with enough crud to shave years off our lives.

So hearing politicians tell us that those days are gone, that deregulation won't mean they'll return, and we'll all be happier with lower costs and more jobs, is hard to refute. After all, we certainly can't say "When I was a kid..."

Absolutely.

When I was a kid, my hometown had -- and I've never looked this up, so I don't know whether it's a fact or just hearsay --what was considered one of the ten most polluted rivers in the country, mostly due to the local paper mill and sawmills upstream.

When I walked across the footbridge to meet my dad as he was coming out of work, I could see the sweat and piss and excrement pouring into the river.

A popular novelty band in Maine memorialized my hometown with a song called "Beneath the Rumford Moon," that included this line: "...and the air smelled like boiled cabbage..."

The area I grew up in was given the nickname "Cancer Valley."

Most of the folks who work in the mill don't even live in the town proper, preferring to live fifteen, twenty miles away.

I have never, nor will I ever, be a fan of deregulation.

298 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:26:13pm

re: #288 SanFranciscoZionist

that actually happened to one of my teachers in HS, not counting the BCP part.

299 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:26:46pm

re: #257 compound idaho

What the fuck do you not get about INSURANCE? It should not pay for every trip to Walgreens.

But it should pay for Viagra or Cialas?

300 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:27:04pm

re: #292 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm sure wealthy people had nannies. Wealthy people have ALWAYS had nannies.

hell the rich people had wetnurses.

Edit:


re: #299 Bubblehead II

But it should pay for Viagra or Cialas?

Heart condition! It should also pay for my pot, I have a bad back.

301 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:27:27pm

re: #289 windsagio

here we go again >>

to quote:

Sure. Like integration allowed black people to get a decent education. Was it possible for a black person to get a decent education before integration? Sure.

It's a manner of speech to speak in broad terms. It's not absolutist, it's just convention.

302 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:27:29pm

re: #283 Gus 802

Right. Personal responsibility. If that's the case then we deny every form of health care to anyone that did anything wrong in their lives. And I mean anything and everything. So if you're speeding and get into a car accident you can forget about any health care because you were speeding.

Yeah, fat people, smokers, drinkers, couch potatoes: they've all shown personal irresponsibility and shouldn't get insurance coverage for their ailments.

303 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:27:35pm

re: #299 Bubblehead II

But it should pay for Viagra or Cialas?

Nope!

304 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:27:43pm

re: #292 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm sure wealthy people had nannies. Wealthy people have ALWAYS had nannies.

Yes, but I don't know how many wealthy women became teachers. In the 30's, 40's and into the 50's, once you got knocked up, that was it.

305 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:28:24pm

re: #303 compound idaho

Nope!

Should health insurance cover medication?

307 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:28:50pm

re: #268 windsagio

random example: Claire Boothe Luce says hi

and I'm tending to wander off point, but hyperbole can get a bit gnarly. There were both ways to avoid pregnancy and women who had careers after they had kids well before the pill.

Dude, where did I say that NO WOMAN HAS EVER HAD A CAREER AND KIDS BEFORE 1950? Did you read anything I wrote? The last thing I was was hyperbolic.

I'm telling you the story about the normal, average woman. No, there were no ways to avoid getting pregnant by your husband, except for prayer and the rhythm method because that works so well....

308 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:29:22pm

re: #269 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I don't know how the hell to enter this conversation.

Frontal assault?

309 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:29:40pm
310 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:29:41pm

re: #284 darthstar

We're talking about fucking, and people who think a birth control pill is something you can give a date once and be protected (note: only works if the person you're fucking is of the same sex as you). You're right on time.

That's stuff I know nothing of the practicalities thereof. I understand how the various birth control methods work, but my knowledge is solely academic in that regard.

311 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:29:41pm

re: #306 Varek Raith

Megyn Kelly Notices Something Is Amiss At Fox: "You Democrats On This Panel Do Not Sound Like Democrats"

Made me laugh.

I would have loved to have known her in college.

312 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:29:41pm

re: #271 compound idaho

Personal responsibility.

And that still doesn't wash because like it or not the government will help to support that child. So in the end your costs are multiplied by a rather significant factor. Instead of paying $360 a year you wind up with a situation where the child is supported from birth until he's 18 more or less. Depending on if the mother is able to sustain herself monetarily. But the thing is that the Republicans want to do none of these things. No birth control, no prenatal and postnatal care, no public schools and so on.

313 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:29:43pm

re: #308 Bubblehead II

Frontal assault?

Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!

//

314 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:29:53pm

re: #305 Obdicut

Should health insurance cover medication?

expensive stuff yes. low cost no. Insure the catastrophic.

315 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:29:57pm

re: #257 compound idaho

What the fuck do you not get about INSURANCE? It should not pay for every trip to Walgreens.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the average American, ie, me, gets prescription medicines by paying a co-pay through their health insurance. (OK, I currently do not have health insurance, and neither do many average Americans, but let's assume that better times are coming.)

Birth control is a prescription medication.

If I buy a bottle of OTC cold remedy at Walgreens, that's something else, although my old employer did offer a flex spending account so you could take out untaxed money for stuff like that. Never seemed worth it to me. Some folks needed it for stuff.

316 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:30:11pm

re: #286 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I was actually thinking of entering the conversation with that, but was afraid you'd hit me.

LOL I'm never violent this late in the evening.

317 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:30:29pm

re: #272 Dark_Falcon

Evening all. What's the good word?

Legs, but only if you provide the Pill and Condoms.

318 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:30:33pm

re: #243 Charles

Uh. You do understand how birth control pills work, right?

I think he has confused them with Tic-Tacs.

319 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:30:36pm

re: #314 compound idaho

expensive stuff yes. low cost no. Insure the catastrophic.

Define 'low cost'.

320 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:30:37pm

re: #314 compound idaho

expensive stuff yes. low cost no. Insure the catastrophic.

Right. Wait for a cancer to reach stage IV then treat.

321 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:31:01pm

re: #292 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm sure wealthy people had nannies. Wealthy people have ALWAYS had nannies.

How many wealthy people were there prior to 1960?

322 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:31:07pm

re: #311 darthstar

I would have loved to have known her in college.

You just have a thing for blonds.

//

323 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:31:23pm

re: #315 SanFranciscoZionist

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the average American, ie, me, gets prescription medicines by paying a co-pay through their health insurance. (OK, I currently do not have health insurance, and neither do many average Americans, but let's assume that better times are coming.)

Birth control is a prescription medication.

If I buy a bottle of OTC cold remedy at Walgreens, that's something else, although my old employer did offer a flex spending account so you could take out untaxed money for stuff like that. Never seemed worth it to me. Some folks needed it for stuff.

Insure the catastrophic; not the day to day.

324 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:31:34pm

re: #264 Gus 802

Some people are barely getting by. Many of whom are on public assistance. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. And yes, 30 dollars or so month can break people that are barely making it. Many of whom are working and not on PA. With that you not only avoid abortions but you prevent the birth of a child that could not be afforded by the mother. When that happens you increase the need for entitlements exponentially. So that $360/year in birth control can save the 10o00s of dollars in aid needed for that child.

re: #271 compound idaho

Personal responsibility.

So what I'm hearing from you is "Tramps just need to keep their legs shut (never mind that men aren't usually asked to do the same) and, for those with real hormonal issues that The Pill can alleviate, tough luck!", no matter if it involves Medicaid/Medicare or private insurance.

Correct me if I'm wrong...

325 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:31:40pm

re: #295 Charles

Quoted again for truth.

Cool beans!! ((hugs))

326 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:31:42pm

re: #264 Gus 802

Some people are barely getting by. Many of whom are on public assistance. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. And yes, 30 dollars or so month can break people that are barely making it. Many of whom are working and not on PA. With that you not only avoid abortions but you prevent the birth of a child that could not be afforded by the mother. When that happens you increase the need for entitlements exponentially. So that $360/year in birth control can save the 10s of thousands of dollars in aid needed for that child.

What I hated was buying birth control every month because I couldn't afford to pay for the three months they'd prescribe at a time. The gal behind the counter always pointed out how you could get THREE MONTHS, and I'm like "Lady, I KNOW, but I'm paying full fare because the Diocese of Oakland won't accept a note from my rabbi, and I don't HAVE a spare ninety dollars this week."

327 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:31:47pm

re: #310 Dark_Falcon

That's stuff I know nothing of the practicalities thereof. I understand how the various birth control methods work, but my knowledge is solely academic in that regard.

Oh, come on now...you like fucking just as much as the next person...you just keep your eyes closed. Open them up. It' okay...really.

328 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:31:53pm

re: #307 marjoriemoon

quoted it, lol. Had a choice, either or right?

Lets not even get into working single mothers or 'temporary widows' (like from the world wars).

329 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:32:07pm

My oldest sister was born in December of '57... the rest of us (six total) followed within a very short period, youngest brother born in February 64 (my folks liked each other... a lot).

The pill would have done great things in my parent's and older siblings lives.

But, then? Y'all wouldn't have me. I was fifth.

*smirk*

330 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:32:20pm

re: #269 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I don't know how the hell to enter this conversation.

It's like getting into Double Dutch--you just have to see the opening and jump.

331 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:32:39pm

re: #271 compound idaho

Personal responsibility.

That's why I have the health insurance.

332 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:32:48pm

re: #314 compound idaho

expensive stuff yes. low cost no. Insure the catastrophic.

People die because they can't get antibiotics cheaply enough, and some courses of geenerics are cheap but still out of the price range of those living hand to mouth.

Just sayin'

333 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:32:55pm

re: #314 compound idaho

expensive stuff yes. low cost no. Insure the catastrophic.

Why the fuck do you think that's a good idea? Why this random goddamn belief? What is 'expensive' and what is 'low cost'?

You want to make it illegal for people to get health insurance that covers low-cost medication or something?

And can you please clear up why the fuck you think someone getting the pill through health insurance is having it bought by "Uncle Sam"? Or are you just going to try to forget you claimed that?

334 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:33:14pm

re: #329 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My oldest sister was born in December of '57... the rest of us (six total) followed within a very short period, youngest brother born in February 64 (my folks liked each other... a lot).

The pill would have done great things in my parent's and older siblings lives.

But, then? Y'all wouldn't have me. I was fifth.

*smirk*

Oh, what might have been...

///

335 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:33:45pm

Of course Cialis has to be covered by insurance.

Cabins with double claw-footed tubs on the deck are expensive, you know.

336 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:33:56pm

re: #314 compound idaho

expensive stuff yes. low cost no. Insure the catastrophic.

Shouldn't people be able to choose insurance that covers the not-catastrophic (but perhaps still costly) stuff if they want it? If you're going to demand one-size-fits-all health insurance, I'm going to rename you "Compound Alberta".

337 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:34:10pm

re: #314 compound idaho

expensive stuff yes. low cost no. Insure the catastrophic.

Here's a thought -- if you cover the cheaper stuff (i.e., birth control pills, other prescription meds, etc.) then the insurance company might not have to pay for the more expensive things (childbirth, ER visits, hospital stays, etc.)

You're either an elaborate troll or in the running for the dumbest person on the internet next to Dim Hoft.

338 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:34:29pm

re: #324 talon_262

re: #271 compound idaho

So what I'm hearing from you is "Tramps just need to keep their legs shut (never mind that men aren't usually asked to do the same) and, for those with real hormonal issues that The Pill can alleviate, tough luck!", no matter if it involves Medicaid/Medicare or private insurance.

Correct me if I'm wrong...

The pill is $20/mo.

339 JAFO  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:34:35pm

re: #314 compound idaho

expensive stuff yes. low cost no. Insure the catastrophic.

For the $1500 a month I pay for insurance I expect them to pay for the low cost stuff too.

340 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:34:36pm

re: #329 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My oldest sister was born in December of '57... the rest of us (six total) followed within a very short period, youngest brother born in February 64 (my folks liked each other... a lot).

The pill would have done great things in my parent's and older siblings lives.

But, then? Y'all wouldn't have me. I was fifth.

*smirk*

If your youngest brother had waited a month he could have been an Aries. 64 Aries represent! Yeah!

341 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:34:43pm

re: #222 Lidane

I am happy for you that you were able to have such a solution available.

I shit you not, I once saw my ex cycle from screaming (at me, of course) to crying to laughing in just under a minute. I really felt for her, even when she was screaming at me.

:sigh: I'm a much better boyfriend than I aught to be.

342 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:34:53pm

re: #334 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Oh, what might have been...

I had a dream the other night that all the babies prevented by the Pill suddenly showed up....boy, were they pissed!
-Steven Wright

343 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:34:57pm

re: #301 Obdicut

Sure. Like integration allowed black people to get a decent education. Was it possible for a black person to get a decent education before integration? Sure.

It's a manner of speech to speak in broad terms. It's not absolutist, it's just convention.

It makes my head spin. Do people realize that the Blacks got the vote in 1869 (I think it was), but really were not able to be full voting, U.S. citizens until 1964 at the passage of the Civil Rights Act? And as old as our nation is, women couldn't vote until 1920.

Them's the facts, lest I'm accused of being "hyperbolic".

344 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:35:40pm

Rachel's showing a computer animation of the Seal Team 6 rescue in Somalia right now...great stuff.

345 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:35:59pm

re: #329 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My oldest sister was born in December of '57... the rest of us (six total) followed within a very short period, youngest brother born in February 64 (my folks liked each other... a lot).

The pill would have done great things in my parent's and older siblings lives.

But, then? Y'all wouldn't have me. I was fifth.

*smirk*

My great aunt got an IUD.

re: #343 marjoriemoon

when you're being accurate there's no problem :D

346 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:36:10pm
347 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:36:12pm

re: #343 marjoriemoon

It makes my head spin. Do people realize that the Blacks got the vote in 1869 (I think it was), but really were not able to be full voting, U.S. citizens until 1964 at the passage of the Civil Rights Act? And as old as our nation is, women couldn't vote until 1920.

Them's the facts, lest I'm accused of being "hyperbolic".

I don't think you can get a treatment for hyperbolism on insurance now anyways, it's only $20 a month.

348 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:36:15pm

re: #291 wozzablog

Now your just reciting the plot of a telenovella.

"Today, on "El Secretos de San Columba...""

349 BongCrodny  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:36:27pm

re: #337 Lidane

Here's a thought -- if you cover the cheaper stuff (i.e., birth control pills, other prescription meds, etc.) then the insurance company might not have to pay for the more expensive things (childbirth, ER visits, hospital stays, etc.)

You're either an elaborate troll or in the running for the dumbest person on the internet next to Dim Hoft.

Aw, we got Buck and chunkymonkey here. Idaho's not even anywhere near those guys.

350 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:37:29pm

re: #333 Obdicut

Why the fuck do you think that's a good idea? Why this random goddamn belief? What is 'expensive' and what is 'low cost'?

You want to make it illegal for people to get health insurance that covers low-cost medication or something?

And can you please clear up why the fuck you think someone getting the pill through health insurance is having it bought by "Uncle Sam"? Or are you just going to try to forget you claimed that?

CI, I'd quit this argument sooner rather than later if I were you. Obdi is pretty devastating if he "catches you on the DERP". Drop the argument, analyze and reform your position, ensure it is coherent, and than try again. If you keep DERPing, he's gonna make you look like a fool.

351 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:37:49pm

Yes...Rachel showed a pic of President Obama and the First Lady on the phone - just before the SOTU address, letting the family of the hostage in Somalia know she was rescued and safe. And THEN he came in and kicked Republican ass rhetorically.

352 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:38:11pm

re: #304 prairiefire

Yes, but I don't know how many wealthy women became teachers. In the 30's, 40's and into the 50's, once you got knocked up, that was it.

Some coworkers (when I was working public) were once talking about how hard the district made it to take maternity leave. One lady said that she thought that, seeing as we WORKED WITH KIDS, they would get the idea.

But first teaching was something you did until you married, and then it was something you did until you were pregnant...it's never been, weirdly enough, a mommy-friendly field.

353 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:38:14pm

OH, btw, Sanfrancisco thanks for me 15,000th kharmic doodad,

thanks :)

354 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:38:15pm

re: #349 BongCrodny

Didn't Charles ban chunkymonkey earlier? We're down to Buck and this moran for the wingnut derpitude, I think.

355 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:38:36pm

re: #343 marjoriemoon

It makes my head spin. Do people realize that the Blacks got the vote in 1869 (I think it was), but really were not able to be full voting, U.S. citizens until 1964 at the passage of the Civil Rights Act? And as old as our nation is, women couldn't vote until 1920.

Them's the facts, lest I'm accused of being "hyperbolic".

If your comments are more rounded does that make you parabolic instead?

;)

356 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:39:11pm

re: #321 marjoriemoon

How many wealthy people were there prior to 1960?

I think that there must have been a few.

357 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:39:43pm

re: #353 wozzablog

OH, btw, Sanfrancisco thanks for me 15,000th kharmic doodad,

thanks :)

Congrats!

358 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:39:45pm

re: #354 Lidane

Didn't Charles ban chunkymonkey earlier? We're down to Buck and this moran for the wingnut derpitude, I think.

I don't recall him telling you he has Bugs Moran in his family tree.

/PIYF

359 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:39:57pm

Of course Newt wants to ban abortions so that way he can have more children to work in the factories. Just like back in the good old days.

//

360 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:39:58pm

re: #339 mracb

For the $1500 a month I pay for insurance I expect them to pay for the low cost stuff too.

Yes! Government mandated no.

361 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:40:02pm

re: #315 SanFranciscoZionist

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the average American, ie, me, gets prescription medicines by paying a co-pay through their health insurance. (OK, I currently do not have health insurance, and neither do many average Americans, but let's assume that better times are coming.)

Birth control is a prescription medication.

If I buy a bottle of OTC cold remedy at Walgreens, that's something else, although my old employer did offer a flex spending account so you could take out untaxed money for stuff like that. Never seemed worth it to me. Some folks needed it for stuff.

I pay something like $350 a month for my insurance for my family. Actually, I need to check that because I think it went up. Our co-pays are now $50. So if I wanted to get birth control, I'd have to pay the $50 for the office visit, then my discounted prescription price, which I think is much less on other meds than the Pill. So really, that's a lot of money.

The spending account is pretty nice, actually.

362 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:40:04pm

re: #271 compound idaho

When my girlfriend asked me if I brought protection, I tried showing her my bootstraps, but she said GTFO!

363 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:40:06pm

re: #345 windsagio

My great aunt got an IUD.

Which one? Gräfenberg's ring? Barely an IUD, and killed a lot of women with silver allergies.

Do you get that when someone says "Integration allowed black people to get good educations" they're not saying "Before that time, no black person, ever, was able to get an education"?

364 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:40:12pm

re: #349 BongCrodny

Chunky is defuncty.

I won't post the raging email he sent though the contact form, even though I'm very tempted to.

365 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:40:21pm

re: #358 Dark_Falcon

I don't recall him telling you he has Bugs Moran in his family tree.

/PIYF

you know, I"d be kind of proud of that in weird way. It makes for a good icebreaker!

366 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:40:35pm

re: #323 compound idaho

Insure the catastrophic; not the day to day.

OK, but that's a whole different approach to insurance and health care. If we adopted that, well, I have my doubts, but fine, assume that.

However, given our current set-up, I don't get how birth control is different from cough syrup with codeine. If I can co-pay for the other, why should I pay full freight for the one?

367 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:40:52pm

re: #323 compound idaho

Insure the catastrophic; not the day to day.

Gee, by that reasoning, My Wife and I should pay full cost, out of pocket, for Her Diabetes meds and my cholesterol meds, both that have to be taken daily. You ARE a fucking idiot.

368 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:41:18pm

re: #350 Dark_Falcon

Ooops. Too late.

369 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:41:43pm

re: #357 darthstar

Congrats!

Thanks, I could be more cravenly populist and really kick it into high gear, but I'll stay within the realms of the middling.

370 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:42:19pm

re: #338 compound idaho

The pill is $20/mo.

A bottle of cough syrup with codeine is probably about the same. Nu?

371 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:42:45pm

On another type of contraception...

Don't be stupid like me, and find out you're allergic to spermicidal foam the hard way. Spot check that shit first!

372 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:43:01pm

re: #369 wozzablog

Thanks, I could be more cravenly populist and really kick it into high gear, but I'll stay within the realms of the middling.

Heh...I turned 50K not to long ago...never saw that coming...and I'm usually just a snarky asshole.

373 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:43:08pm

re: #360 compound idaho

Yes! Government mandated no.

And so, we really get to the meat of the matter. What is it that you don't like about the new regs?

374 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:43:10pm

re: #366 SanFranciscoZionist

OK, but that's a whole different approach to insurance and health care. If we adopted that, well, I have my doubts, but fine, assume that.

However, given our current set-up, I don't get how birth control is different from cough syrup with codeine. If I can co-pay for the other, why should I pay full freight for the one.

I prefer insurance. My insurance does not pay for cough syrup or birth control.

375 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:43:36pm

re: #353 wozzablog

OH, btw, Sanfrancisco thanks for me 15,000th kharmic doodad,

thanks :)

Mazal tov. Wear it in good health.

376 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:43:51pm

re: #374 compound idaho

I prefer insurance. My insurance does not pay for cough syrup or birth control.

So, basically, you want everyone else to be forced to have the kind of insurance you have.

Why?

377 BongCrodny  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:44:07pm

re: #364 Charles

Chunky is defuncty.

I won't post the raging email he sent though the contact form, even though I'm very tempted to.

I miss out on all the fun.

378 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:44:22pm

re: #371 Slumbering Behemoth

On another type of contraception...

Don't be stupid like me, and find out you're allergic to spermicidal foam the hard way. Spot check that shit first!

I bet that led to an interesting evening. Heh.

379 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:44:40pm

re: #376 Obdicut

So, basically, you want everyone else to be forced to have the kind of insurance you have.

Why?

No the kind the want.

380 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:44:42pm

re: #363 Obdicut

well nobody said 'black people couldn't get an education before'

somebody DID say that women HAD to quit working when they had kids.

Still, I didn't come to post again just to get into stupid-ass semantic arguments. If somebody has to let go, it might as well be me.

381 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:44:47pm

BTW--I have succeeded in corrupting Mr. EmmmieG.

He was raised in a healthy-food household.

I now have him eating cookie dough out of the fridge.

SUCCESS!!

382 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:45:10pm

re: #331 SanFranciscoZionist

That's why I have the health insurance.

Exactly...I pay for a high-deductible health plan, a HSA, life and long-term/short-term disability insurance through my job so that I;m not a drain on my family or society.

But keep in mind, not everyone is so lucky.

383 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:45:11pm

re: #374 compound idaho

I prefer insurance. My insurance does not pay for cough syrup or birth control.

They're actually for different purposes, by the way. And if you get prescription cough syrup, it will be covered...if you have a prescription.

What insurance do you have, by the way? Because BC should be covered.

384 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:45:20pm

Right. Being that government never mandates anything.

//

385 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:45:48pm

re: #367 Bubblehead II

Gee, by that reasoning, My Wife and I should pay full cost, out of pocket, for Her Diabetes meds and my cholesterol meds, both that have to be taken daily. You ARE a fucking idiot.

If we only insured for the catastrophic, my parents would BE catastrophic. Between them, my folks are on more medications than Zimbabwe.

My father's GP refers to him as an 'interesting case'.

386 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:46:02pm

re: #349 BongCrodny

Aw, we got Buck and chunkymonkey here. Idaho's not even anywhere near those guys.

Chunkymonkey got the stick today. Guess compond is trying to fill the vacuum.

387 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:46:22pm

re: #379 compound idaho

No the kind the want.

Okay. Everyone gets the insurance they want. That's great. Maybe they can get a pony too. Now can you explain how someone's insurance paying for their contraceptives is "Uncle Sam" paying for it?

Or, you can tell me you're just going to dodge that question forever. Either way works. An explanation, or acknowledge you're just not going to take personal responsibility for the shit you say.

388 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:46:28pm

re: #374 compound idaho

I prefer insurance. My insurance does not pay for cough syrup or birth control.

could be worse, meds are just about the ONLY thing my insurance pays for, it feels like.

(ask my 900$ testing bills vs 2500$ deductible)

389 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:46:49pm

re: #374 compound idaho

I prefer insurance. My insurance does not pay for cough syrup or birth control.

You prefer insurance to what?

390 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:47:03pm

re: #384 Gus 802

Right. Being that government never mandates anything.

//

This government mandate's gonna send my insurance premiums through the roof! If women can't get by without birth control, then they need to learn how to cross their legs and just say "No."

391 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:47:36pm

re: #338 compound idaho

The pill is $20/mo.

So what? If it prevents one hospitalization for endometriosis or case of endometrial cancer then it's lowered healthcare costs. Preventative medicine saves lives and money.

392 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:48:15pm

An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

393 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:48:17pm

re: #390 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

See I think you can do better than that,

"Insurance paying for birth control just reinforces the idea that its the Woman's responsibility! It's patriarchal!"

394 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:48:23pm

This show "Touch", Kiefer's new thang? Looks promising as hell.

Don't know what is going on, but damn!

395 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:48:26pm

re: #386 Bubblehead II

Chunkymonkey got the stick today. Guess compond is trying to fill the vacuum.

What happened? Did he dance the Butthurt Fandango once too often.

396 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:48:32pm

re: #364 Charles

Chunky is defuncty.

I won't post the raging email he sent though the contact form, even though I'm very tempted to.

Oh, please do.

397 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:48:54pm

re: #396 Bubblehead II

Oh, please do.

I admit I want to see it too. I love the hate mail.

398 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:49:03pm

re: #396 Bubblehead II

Oh, please do.

I vote no.

399 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:49:11pm

re: #395 Dark_Falcon

What happened? Did he dance the Butthurt Fandango once too often.

I think he was banned before and re-registered...

400 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:49:21pm

re: #398 Gus 802

I vote no.

Yeah, he just craves the validation.

401 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:49:27pm

You know what else costs too much via prescription? My kids' fluoride tablets.

We pay $42 per year per child, and that's not with prescription. It's a cheap drug, so it's only $42 per year per child. Times five.

How much would it be to put it in the water?

I remind myself of the families that won't be getting it because they can't afford that much.

402 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:49:31pm

re: #387 Obdicut

Okay. Everyone gets the insurance they want. That's great. Maybe they can get a pony too. Now can you explain how someone's insurance paying for their contraceptives is "Uncle Sam" paying for it?

Or, you can tell me you're just going to dodge that question forever. Either way works. An explanation, or acknowledge you're just not going to take personal responsibility for the shit you say.

When uncle sam mandates that is be included in the policy. duh.

403 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:49:48pm

re: #372 darthstar

Heh...I turned 50K not to long ago...never saw that coming...and I'm usually just a snarky asshole.

you also seem to have three times as many comments in the same time frame. ANd I though tI'd been on here a lot :p

:p

404 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:50:13pm

re: #400 Obdicut

Yeah, he just craves the validation.

Yeah. Especially with what's going on now with a now rather deranged former Lizard over at the crazed website which shall remain nameless.

405 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:50:14pm

publishing private emails is always seriously weak sauce.

406 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:50:28pm

re: #378 Lidane

I bet that led to an interesting evening. Heh.

That evening was fun. It was the next morning when I woke, looked at my peter and OMGWTFBBQ!!!

I'll spare you the details, but it was ugly and painful.

407 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:50:37pm

re: #401 EmmmieG

You know what else costs too much via prescription? My kids' fluoride tablets.

We pay $42 per year per child, and that's not with prescription. It's a cheap drug, so it's only $42 per year per child. Times five.

How much would it be to put it in the water?

I remind myself of the families that won't be getting it because they can't afford that much.

Flouridation? What of their precious bodily fluids?!

///

408 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:50:39pm

re: #392 Gus 802

An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

I prefer an ounce of the other.

409 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:50:43pm

re: #402 compound idaho

When uncle sam mandates that is be included in the policy. duh.

How is that Uncle Sam paying for it?

Since Uncle Sam mandates that doctors be licensed to practice medicine, does that mean the government is paying for everything related to doctors?

410 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:50:44pm

re: #389 SanFranciscoZionist

You prefer insurance to what?

Forget it. He's in Reality Denial Mode. Spouting nonsense is all he can do right now, since saying "Damn you with your facts and logic, Obdicut!" would kind of give the game away.

411 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:50:57pm

re: #406 Slumbering Behemoth

That evening was fun. It was the next morning when I woke, looked at my peter and OMGWTFBBQ!!!

I'll spare you the details, but it was ugly and painful.

I laugh at your suffering.
/
:P

412 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:51:15pm

re: #404 Gus 802

Yeah. Especially with what's going on now with a now rather deranged former Lizard over at the crazed website which shall remain nameless.

Um, you just described an awful lot of people.

413 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:51:25pm

re: #402 compound idaho

When uncle sam mandates that is be included in the policy. duh.

Wow! Sorry about the grammar. That bottom shelf whiskey is having its effect. Maybe top shelf should be included in my drinking policy.

414 BongCrodny  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:51:39pm

re: #402 compound idaho

When uncle sam mandates that is be included in the policy. duh.

People who write things like "that is be included" should not be saying "duh" to anybody else.

415 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:51:41pm

re: #403 wozzablog

you also seem to have three times as many comments in the same time frame. ANd I though tI'd been on here a lot :p

:p

Yeah...I sit in front of computers a lot...and I like to multi-task...so I'll work on a presentation, facebook, and post here at the same time...just waiting for the day when I'm giving a presentation to upper management and there's a slide that reads "FUCK YOU TROLL!"

416 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:51:41pm

re: #404 Gus 802

Yeah. Especially with what's going on now with a now rather deranged former Lizard over at the crazed website which shall remain nameless.

That's all so pointless, though. Why would anyone believe anything he had to say? It's bizarre.

417 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:51:46pm

re: #337 Lidane

Here's a thought -- if you cover the cheaper stuff (i.e., birth control pills, other prescription meds, etc.) then the insurance company might not have to pay for the more expensive things (childbirth, ER visits, hospital stays, etc.)

You're either an elaborate troll or in the running for the dumbest person on the internet next to Dim Hoft.

That's cold as ice...and she's not even here in this thread.

/

418 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:51:48pm

re: #401 EmmmieG

You know what else costs too much via prescription? My kids' fluoride tablets.

We pay $42 per year per child, and that's not with prescription. It's a cheap drug, so it's only $42 per year per child. Times five.

How much would it be to put it in the water?

I remind myself of the families that won't be getting it because they can't afford that much.

I know people who love portland because they don't Fluoridate.

...mind control!

419 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:52:19pm

re: #392 Gus 802

An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

Given that an average pill is far less than an ounce in weight, say 10mg, and an average baby more than a pound (in the US anyway) 7.5 lbs, then I'd say -

10 milligrams of prevention is worth 7.5 pounds of cure

420 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:52:29pm

re: #412 EmmmieG

Um, you just described an awful lot of people.

I'm talking about the email revelations crap going on with a certain former member over at the stalker site.

421 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:53:02pm

re: #418 windsagio

I know people who love portland because they don't Fluoridate.

...mind control!

Private well. No fluoridation here.

422 darthstar  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:53:21pm

re: #418 windsagio

I know people who love portland because they don't Fluoridate.

...mind control!

Wow...I read that as "flatulate"...scared me for a second.

423 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:53:41pm

re: #419 freetoken

Given that an average pill is far less than an ounce in weight, say 10mg, and an average baby more than a pound (in the US anyway) 7.5 lbs, then I'd say -

10 milligrams of prevention is worth 7.5 pounds of cure

Oh you wit!

424 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:54:12pm

re: #419 freetoken

Given that an average pill is far less than an ounce in weight, say 10mg, and an average baby more than a pound (in the US anyway) 7.5 lbs, then I'd say -

10 milligrams of prevention is worth 7.5 pounds of cure

And helps keep up the price of flavor enhancers in Oklahoma.
///

425 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:54:21pm

re: #422 darthstar

Wow...I read that as "flatulate"...scared me for a second.

we'd have a bit of a Spontaneous Human Combustion problem, then.

426 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:54:45pm

Rachel is going to town on Politifact right now. Good stuff.

427 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:54:48pm

re: #422 darthstar

Wow...I read that as "flatulate"...scared me for a second.

That's a gas!

428 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:55:14pm

re: #426 wozzablog

Rachel is going to town on Politifact right now. Good stuff.

Eh? Over what?

429 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:56:17pm

re: #402 compound idaho

When uncle sam mandates that is be included in the policy. duh.

Uncle Sam also mandates there be no lead in your paint, appreciably no mercury in your drinking water. The pill helps lower the risk of endometrial cancer, just like Lipitor prevents the risk of heart attacks. Either you give a shit about lowering healthcare costs overall by removing additional costs to individuals who need these meds, or you accept the monumental costs associated with hospitalizations and surgery.

430 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:56:37pm

Rachel has just FIRED politifact for this debacles.

Quite rightly as well.

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

431 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:56:52pm

re: #338 compound idaho

The pill is $20/mo.

Hate to break it to you, but many things don't cost the same price everywhere around the country or the world, especially stuff that's subject to swings in supply and demand, like prescription drugs and especially when paying cash on the barrelhead for it (see SFZ's tale about it upthread).

432 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:56:57pm

re: #428 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

See my 430

433 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:58:08pm

re: #371 Slumbering Behemoth

On another type of contraception...

Don't be stupid like me, and find out you're allergic to spermicidal foam the hard way. Spot check that shit first!

Dude, at least you have outside-y parts. Very bad scene, indeed.

434 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:58:17pm

Hard to believe it's 2012 sometimes.

435 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:58:18pm

re: #420 Gus 802

I'm talking about the email revelations crap going on with a certain former member over at the stalker site.

Right now, they devoted their "Blogmocracy Live" internet radio show to a "Diary of Daedalus Dorkus edition. It's a non-stop "Hate on Charles" fest over there. That kind of hate is both scary and pathetic at the same time.

436 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:58:27pm

re: #430 wozzablog

Rachel has just FIRED politifact for this debacles.

Quite rightly as well.

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

This is what happens when you try to appease the MBF.

437 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:58:45pm

re: #349 BongCrodny

Aw, we got Buck and chunkymonkey here. Idaho's not even anywhere near those guys.

Charles got tired of playing out rope for chunky to hang themselves with a couple of threads ago; he is now an ex-Lizard.

438 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 6:59:16pm

re: #429 goddamnedfrank

Uncle Sam also mandates there be no lead in your paint, appreciably no mercury in your drinking water. The pill helps lower the risk of endometrial cancer, just like Lipitor prevents the risk of heart attacks. Either you give a shit about lowering healthcare costs overall by removing additional costs to individuals who need these meds, or you accept the monumental costs associated with hospitalizations and surgery.

I should be able to buy the coverage I want.

439 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:00:51pm

re: #437 talon_262

Charles got tired of playing out rope for chunky to hang themselves with a couple of threads ago; he is now an ex-Lizard.

So he's joined the "Choir Butthurt"?

/riff off of the 'Dead Parrot" skit

440 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:01:09pm

re: #402 compound idaho

When uncle sam mandates that is be included in the policy. duh.

So?, the individual who purchases the policy is still paying for it through their premiums, not the Government. Because, believe me, when the Government (State or Fed) mandates an insurance company cover a medication, treatment or procedure, the Insurance company will jack up the price of their policy to insure they will still make a profit.

441 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:01:12pm

re: #364 Charles

Chunky is defuncty.

I won't post the raging email he sent though the contact form, even though I'm very tempted to.

Did it at least contain, "Fuck your couch!"?

///

442 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:01:25pm

re: #430 wozzablog

Rachel has just FIRED politifact for this debacles.

Quite rightly as well.

[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

Yeah, I found myself wondering last night if this was another example of Politifact's sudden found desire to be seen as "fair" or some "fact-checker" having a brainfart moment.

443 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:03:05pm

re: #438 compound idaho

I should be able to buy the coverage I want.

Nobody is stopping you. And that is the lamest excuse I've heard so far for condemning insurance coverage of contraception. Just. Lame.

444 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:03:18pm

re: #438 compound idaho

I should be able to buy the coverage I want.

That ain't what you've been sayin', boyo! you've been ranting on and on about what insurance "should cover" and now you start talking about choices. All that does is dig your hole deeper.

445 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:03:31pm

re: #412 EmmmieG

Um, you just described an awful lot of people.

Walter and DoD

446 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:04:00pm

re: #442 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yeah, I found myself wondering last night if this was another example of Politifact's sudden found desire to be seen as "fair" or some "fact-checker" having a brainfart moment.

They went completely magical balance fairy - nothing any politician can be wholly true.

They showed their own bias.

They end up looking like partisan assholes.

447 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:04:03pm

re: #435 Dark_Falcon

Right now, they devoted their "Blogmocracy Live" internet radio show to a "Diary of Daedalus Dorkus edition. It's a non-stop "Hate on Charles" fest over there. That kind of hate is both scary and pathetic at the same time.

Their whole lives are consumed with this obsession of theirs. It truly is pathological and quite seemingly a communicable mental illness.

448 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:04:34pm

re: #402 compound idaho

When uncle sam mandates that is be included in the policy. duh.

So what this is all about is that you don't want any government regulation of health insurance?

449 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:04:46pm

re: #415 darthstar

Are you on Facebook?

450 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:04:47pm

re: #433 marjoriemoon

It cleared up in a couple of days, and we were back to business with other contraceptives. Just as well. The minute you use the foam you take a few playtime options right off the table.

451 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:05:11pm

re: #429 goddamnedfrank

Uncle Sam also mandates there be no lead in your paint, appreciably no mercury in your drinking water. The pill helps lower the risk of endometrial cancer, just like Lipitor prevents the risk of heart attacks. Either you give a shit about lowering healthcare costs overall by removing additional costs to individuals who need these meds, or you accept the monumental costs associated with hospitalizations and surgery.

*moving chair closer to Frank*

I like you. You smart.

:)

452 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:05:14pm

re: #440 Bubblehead II

So?, the individual who purchases the policy is still paying for it through their premiums, not the Government. Because, believe me, when the Government (State or Fed) mandates an insurance company cover a medication, treatment or procedure, the Insurance company will jack up the price of their policy to insure they will still make a profit.

Yes. I don't want a government mandate to cover/pay.....whatever for birth control. I carry a $5000 deductible. Please leave me and my insurer alone.

453 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:05:21pm

re: #450 Slumbering Behemoth

Uh, whah?/

454 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:05:24pm

re: #406 Slumbering Behemoth

That evening was fun. It was the next morning when I woke, looked at my peter and OMGWTFBBQ!!!

I'll spare you the details, but it was ugly and painful.

Looked like one of those (usually cheap) dyed-red franks, didn't it?

455 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:05:27pm

I was opposed to the Zumwalt DD.
Where was the check in the tax reform to not fund it?

/

456 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:05:34pm

re: #451 marjoriemoon

*moving chair closer to Frank*

I like you. You smart.

:)

He is.

457 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:05:44pm

re: #416 Obdicut

That's all so pointless, though. Why would anyone believe anything he had to say? It's bizarre.

I'm not sure exactly what that's all about. They seem to be enjoying themselves. A little ghoulish, a lot pointless.

458 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:06:40pm

re: #448 SanFranciscoZionist

So what this is all about is that you don't want any government regulation of health insurance?

I will acknowledge there is a line. The line should be way over there.

459 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:06:53pm

re: #452 compound idaho

Yes. I don't want a government mandate to cover/pay...whatever for birth control. I carry a $5000 deductible. Please leave me and my insurer alone.

Welcome to your brand-new argument. Do you realize how weird it looks to completely change your argument along the thread without acknowledging it?

460 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:07:13pm

re: #438 compound idaho

I should be able to buy the coverage I want.

Have you currently got that, and how is it going to change?

461 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:07:26pm

The creationism news of the day, in case anyone missed it:


Ind. Senate panel votes to let schools teach creationism

An Indiana Senate committee on Wednesday endorsed teaching creationism in public schools, despite pleas from scientists and religious leaders to keep religion out of science classrooms.
Senate Bill 89 allows school corporations to authorize "the teaching of various theories concerning the origin of life" and specifically mentions "creation science" as one such theory.
State Sen. Scott Schneider, R-Indianapolis, who voted for the measure, said if there are many theories about life's origins, students should be taught all of them.

But John Staver, professor of chemistry and science education at Purdue University, said evolution is the only theory of life that relies on empirical evidence from scientific investigations.
"Creation science is not science," Staver said. "It is unquestionably a statement of a specific religion."

The Rev. Charles Allen, head of Grace Unlimited, an Indianapolis campus ministry, said students would be served better by teaching religion comparatively, rather than trying to "smuggle it in" to a science course.

The Republican-controlled Senate Education Committee nevertheless voted 8-2 to send the legislation to the full Senate.

462 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:07:27pm

Sitting here wondering why my healthy-food mother-in-law put gravy on baked potatoes.

Gravy is liquid fat.

463 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:07:29pm

re: #459 Obdicut

Welcome to your brand-new argument. Do you realize how weird it looks to completely change your argument along the thread without acknowledging it?

no

464 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:07:32pm

Oh, and Jan Brewer went batshit at the President on the tarmac in Arizona.

Wagging her finger at him and just generally carrying on cranky.

465 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:07:36pm

re: #453 prairiefire

Do I have to start over from the beginning?

re: #454 talon_262

EXACTLY!!! Has that happened to you as well?
/It was dry and peeling as well.

466 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:08:10pm

re: #464 wozzablog

Oh, and Jan Brewer went batshit at the President on the tarmac in Arizona.

Wagging her finger at him and just generally carrying on cranky.

Did he give her the "Bitch, PLEASE!" look?

//

467 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:08:12pm

re: #438 compound idaho

I should be able to buy the coverage I want.

Great, and when you skimp on the preventative medicine and can't afford the catastrophic treatment that results what? Are you okay with being left to die in the waiting room or will you accept the treatment you can't pay for and allow society to bail your ignorant ass out through increased costs for everyone? If you're incapable of recognizing it, this is a self-reinforcing paradigm, where costs keep going up, and up, and up because society decided to cater to a claque of ignorant narcissists rather than prioritize efficient, no nonsense insurance regulation that mandates preventative care for all.

468 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:08:25pm

re: #463 compound idaho

no

Yeah, well, you're pointless to talk to since you won't man up and actually take responsibility for the shit you say.

All the while preaching personal responsibility.

What a goddamn joke.

469 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:08:32pm

re: #465 Slumbering Behemoth

No, spot check first.

470 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:08:34pm

re: #458 compound idaho

I will acknowledge there is a line. The line should be way over there.

I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest the whole 'I should pay for what I want' is just a strawman.
What you are really opposed to is contraceptives and contraceptives alone.

471 BongCrodny  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:09:10pm

re: #464 wozzablog

Oh, and Jan Brewer went batshit at the President on the tarmac in Arizona.

Wagging her finger at him and just generally carrying on cranky.

She's been taking Newt lessons.

Talking Points Memo: Newt Gingrich pointing at things

472 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:09:21pm

re: #452 compound idaho

Yes. I don't want a government mandate to cover/pay...whatever for birth control. I carry a $5000 deductible. Please leave me and my insurer alone.

Jesus Hedgefundmanager Christ, I thought *my* deduction was high. If I had a $5k deduction, I really would have to wait until everything was a life-or-death emergency to see a friggin' doctor.

473 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:09:54pm

re: #465 Slumbering Behemoth

Do I have to start over from the beginning?

re: #454 talon_262

EXACTLY!!! Has that happened to you as well?
/It was dry and peeling as well.

Never had that happen to me, it was an educated guess though.

474 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:11:37pm

How it went down on the tarmac in Arizona.

Brewer is entirely classless.

[Link: www.azcentral.com...]

475 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:11:48pm

re: #473 talon_262

Never had that happen to me, it was an educated guess though.

I never had that happen to me, either.
Image: 3d5B8.png

476 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:12:07pm

re: #416 Obdicut

That's all so pointless, though. Why would anyone believe anything he had to say? It's bizarre.

The whole point is to see if by releasing these E-Mails, Charles will ban certain Lizards, there by validating their POV, that Charles will not stand any POV that contradicts his. Pitiful if you ask me. Though now I am sure they are gleefully awaiting for Charles to ban me because I have obviously been there and have read what has been posted.

BTW, lurkers, I have disagreed with Charles in the past and have in fact, called him out when I thought he was wrong. But I did it in a way that was respectful, not by throwing a temper tantrum. Get over it.

477 austin_blue  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:12:11pm

re: #402 compound idaho

When uncle sam mandates that is be included in the policy. duh.

Ah. All contraception is evil, eh? Barefoot and pregnant is the lot of women. In the kitchen. The receptacle of the patriarch's seed.

Nice worldview, Ruby Ridge.

478 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:12:23pm

re: #437 talon_262

Charles got tired of playing out rope for chunky to hang themselves with a couple of threads ago; he is now an ex-Lizard.

Granted, I haven't been around as often as I used to, but flouncing is almost a thing of the past, no? Death by Charles seems to be the way to go these days. They'd rather be martyrs. Cowards.

479 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:13:03pm

re: #472 negativ

Why did I think "deductible" and type "deduction" twice? Perhaps I'm having a stroke. Oh well, too expensive to worry about thaowdjna vlb dz

480 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:13:18pm

re: #478 marjoriemoon

Granted, I haven't been around as often as I used to, but flouncing is almost a thing of the past, no? Death by Charles seems to be the way to go these days. They'd rather be martyrs. Cowards.

What's the point of flouncing if your post lasts 3 nanoseconds. Lot of work to go through for 3 nanoseconds.

481 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:13:24pm

re: #467 goddamnedfrank

Great, and when you skimp on the preventative medicine and can't afford the catastrophic treatment that results what? Are you okay with being left to die in the waiting room or will you accept the treatment you can't pay for and allow society to bail your ignorant ass out through increased costs for everyone? If you're incapable of recognizing it, this is a self-reinforcing paradigm, where costs keep going up, and up, and up because society decided to cater to a claque of ignorant narcissists rather than prioritize efficient, no nonsense insurance regulation that mandates preventative care for all.

Catastrophic coverage is just that! My max out of pocket is very manageable. My life time max $5,000,000. PS I qualified for the Boston Marathon on 12/4/2011 and Mrs Compound is a professional body builder. (100% Natural) Some of us actually live the life we talk.

482 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:13:35pm

re: #476 Bubblehead II

But it could all be just fake shit. Outside of a forensic setting, you can't prove the veracity of emails, and the source is, well, tainted, to say the least.

Listening to liars is a dedication to foolishness.

483 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:14:04pm

re: #470 Varek Raith

I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest the whole 'I should pay for what I want' is just a strawman.
What you are really opposed to is contraceptives and contraceptives alone.

I think he just didn't like Obdicut pointing out he was posting stupidity. Ignorance and butthurt did the rest.

484 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:14:08pm

re: #472 negativ

Jesus Hedgefundmanager Christ, I thought *my* deduction was high. If I had a $5k deduction, I really would have to wait until everything was a life-or-death emergency to see a friggin' doctor.

It's called a HDHP (high-deductible health plan); a lot of employers offer it nowadays, usually in conjunction with HSAs (health savings accounts), because you can save on the premiums on the front end and bank more money in the HSA (which, like a 401k, the money stays yours, even if you change jobs) to cover the deductible, prescriptions, dental/vision stuff, etc. I've had this option for my health insurance for a couple of years and I like it.

485 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:14:26pm

re: #481 compound idaho

Catastrophic coverage is just that! My max out of pocket is very manageable. My life time max $5,000,000. PS I qualified for the Boston Marathon on 12/4/2011 and Mrs Compound is a professional body builder. (100% Natural) Some of us actually live the life we talk.

Its' kind of an aside, but its ugly when your employer makes catastrophic coverage the only affordable option.

486 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:14:54pm

re: #474 wozzablog

How it went down on the tarmac in Arizona

[Link: www.azcentral.com...]

Now she'll have a nice pic of her wagging her finger at the President for all the conservative voters in AZ to swoon over.

487 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:17:15pm

re: #476 Bubblehead II

They can never win on intellect so they resort to defamation of character, harassment, internet stalking, privacy threats, etc. Many of them hold grudges over things for years if not decades. However, I'm sure that with most their personal character flaws were present before they became a member of any internet community.

488 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:17:47pm

re: #474 wozzablog

Looks like a person who has no interest in keeping their right index finger.

489 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:17:51pm

re: #452 compound idaho

Yes. I don't want a government mandate to cover/pay...whatever for birth control. I carry a $5000 deductible. Please leave me and my insurer alone.

You have a catastrophic policy. I assume you're under 30.

Women can't have those policies. Well, they can, but it's pretty silly. We go to the doctor all the time. Things happen with us all the time.

490 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:18:00pm

re: #482 Obdicut

But it could all be just fake shit. Outside of a forensic setting, you can't prove the veracity of emails, and the source is, well, tainted, to say the least.

Listening to liars is a dedication to foolishness.

The great part is, Walter stressed repeatedly that all correspondence with him be kept private. All he asked. Turns out he was a total sleaze bag. Live and learn.

I know because he posted one of my emails.

491 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:18:45pm

re: #486 jaunte

Now she'll have a nice pic of her wagging her finger at the President for all the conservative voters in AZ to swoon over.

Image: x610.jpg

492 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:19:45pm

re: #491 Gus 802

Look, she's standing up to that (possibly foreign) Obama!

493 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:19:51pm

re: #491 Gus 802

Image: x610.jpg

Look how patronizing he is! That insensitive prick! He can't handle a strong conservative female getting in his face!!!

494 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:20:03pm

re: #490 McSpiff

He's just still craving attention. It's very bizarre.

Living offa internet drama: what a life.

495 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:20:08pm

re: #491 Gus 802

Image: x610.jpg

Just an empty dry person.

496 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:20:44pm

re: #481 compound idaho

497 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:21:02pm

Unticking 'Contraception Coverage' on your insurance ain't gonna do shit to lower a 5k deductible.
;)

498 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:21:04pm

re: #492 jaunte

Look, she's standing up to that (possibly foreign) Obama!

Oh yeah. You know I'm just sitting here thinking of jokes I could make but can't because they'd be way over the top! ;) But I can imagine many of the reactions towards this and they would be full of color.

499 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:21:18pm

re: #494 Obdicut

He's just still craving attention. It's very bizarre.

Living offa internet drama: what a life.

I ever become that petty and stupid, I'll kick my own ass.

500 zora  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:21:20pm

re: #492 jaunte

Look, she's standing up to that (possibly foreign) Obama!

did she ask for his papers.

501 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:21:34pm

re: #489 marjoriemoon

Women's equipment requires so much more maintenance than men's. I am not jealous.

502 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:21:36pm

re: #491 Gus 802

Image: x610.jpg

"No, Jan, I don't want to pull your finger."

503 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:21:40pm

re: #494 Obdicut

He's just still craving attention. It's very bizarre.

Living offa internet drama: what a life.

Really is. Particularly fine example of cherry picking too, which I'm sure is true in the majority of cases.

504 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:22:31pm

re: #485 windsagio

Its' kind of an aside, but its ugly when your employer makes catastrophic coverage the only affordable option.

Self employed.

505 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:22:43pm

re: #491 Gus 802

Image: x610.jpg

"No Jan, I will not smell it and guess where it's been."

506 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:23:06pm

re: #494 Obdicut

He's just still craving attention. It's very bizarre.

Living offa internet drama: what a life.

I was thinking last night. Some people will crave so much attention that they'll take any audience. In fact even Barret Brown did the same thing. We're looking at some rather highly egotistical and narcissistic people who are willing to break social norms to get that attention.

507 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:23:35pm

re: #491 Gus 802

Image: x610.jpg

Is it just me, or does the president look somewhat less robust than normal in that photo?

508 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:23:58pm

re: #336 Dark_Falcon

Shouldn't people be able to choose insurance that covers the not-catastrophic (but perhaps still costly) stuff if they want it? If you're going to demand one-size-fits-all health insurance, I'm going to rename you "Compound Alberta".

That horrible "one size fits all" Canadian system is far less expensive than ours; and Canadians live longer as well. They're doing something right.

509 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:24:01pm

re: #507 Dark_Falcon

Is it just me, or does the president look somewhat less robust than normal in that photo?

Jet lag's a bitch?

510 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:24:07pm

re: #507 Dark_Falcon

Is it just me, or does the president look somewhat less robust than normal in that photo?

Looks like he was trying to cool things down. Has that "look, look" kind of thing happening.

511 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:25:39pm

re: #510 Gus 802

Looks like he was trying to cool things down. Has that "look, look" kind of thing happening.

Gets off plane, sees angry wingnut.
"Oh geez."

512 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:25:52pm

Common situation to be in. You approach somebody that wronged you in some form and then they turn around an make a public spectacle of the whole thing. Even though they were wrong and still wrong.

513 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:25:55pm

re: #507 Dark_Falcon

Is it just me, or does the president look somewhat less robust than normal in that photo?

I wouldn't draw myself up to my full 6ft if i was being yelled at by a crazy cat lady. WOuldn't have to.

However - she is carrying on about a meeting that Obama and everyone else in the room had thought went fairly well a couple of years back - so he was probably just taken aback..

514 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:25:55pm

re: #506 Gus 802

It's really sad. How many times did Walter violently declaim about how pathetic the stalkers were?

He was right! He was very right about that.

515 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:26:00pm

re: #506 Gus 802

I instantly thought of folks like BB when I saw this.

516 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:26:38pm

re: #512 Gus 802

Common situation to be in. You approach somebody that wronged you in some form and then they turn around an make a public spectacle of the whole thing. Even though they were wrong and still wrong.

We're still talking about the Arizona gov, right?

517 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:26:39pm

re: #336 Dark_Falcon

Shouldn't people be able to choose insurance that covers the not-catastrophic (but perhaps still costly) stuff if they want it? If you're going to demand one-size-fits-all health insurance, I'm going to rename you "Compound Alberta".

Hi, Canadian here.

I have catastrophic coverage through my provincial government.

For everything else, I had a choice between 3 employeer plans or "none of the above". I get to pocket the money (taxed as income) or deposit it in a HSA (not taxted) if i choose the lowest plan, or none.

518 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:26:55pm

re: #452 compound idaho

Yes. I don't want a government mandate to cover/pay...whatever for birth control. I carry a $5000 deductible. Please leave me and my insurer alone.

WTF? Put the bottle away and go to bed. You are making less sense as the night goes on.

As a banned Lizard once said. If you think you are to drunk to post, you probably are. Or words to that effect.

519 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:27:16pm

re: #516 wozzablog

We're still talking about the Arizona gov, right?

Yep.

520 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:27:45pm

PS

I pay for my 21 yr old daughters birth control.

When is that boy (name withheld) going to make her an honest woman?

Probably when I am done paying for grad school.

521 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:28:46pm

BTW, the Indiana state senator mentioned in that article has quite a history. He's a bit anti-Planned Parenthood guy, who also authored another bill (which did not get passed by the committee today, unlike the creationism bill), to get Indiana schools out of the new national Common Core Curriculum standards (a Bill Gates funded project) because of objections by home schoolers.

522 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:28:49pm

re: #491 Gus 802

Image: x610.jpg

"Hey, watch where you point that! It could be loaded!"

523 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:29:00pm

re: #513 wozzablog

she is carrying on about a meeting that Obama and everyone else in the room had thought went fairly well a couple of years back

It looks like she didn't want to sit next to him then either:
Image: File:JanBrewer_PresObama.jpg

524 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:29:16pm

re: #520 compound idaho

Wait, does that mean she was born dishonest?
/

525 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:29:54pm

re: #517 McSpiff

Hi, Canadian here.

I have catastrophic coverage through my provincial government.

For everything else, I had a choice between 3 employeer plans or "none of the above". I get to pocket the money (taxed as income) or deposit it in a HSA (not taxted) if i choose the lowest plan, or none.

My private insurer (Sun Life? Not sure if they're American or not) also covers private clinics for walk ins, MRI/Cat Scans, sports medicine, physiotherapists, sports injury clinics, orthopedics, dentistry, optometry. The list goes on.

All private in Canada.

526 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:30:51pm

Here's that photo; couldn't get it to link.
Image: 800px-JanBrewer_PresObama.jpg

527 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:30:57pm

re: #521 freetoken

BTW, the Indiana state senator mentioned in that article has quite a history. He's a bit anti-Planned Parenthood guy, who also authored another bill (which did not get passed by the committee today, unlike the creationism bill), to get Indiana schools out of the new national Common Core Curriculum standards (a Bill Gates funded project) because of objections by home schoolers.

Page it! Sounds like a guaranteed front-pager.

528 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:31:06pm

re: #491 Gus 802

Image: x910.jpg

"I do not want to play 'pull my finger' right now, OK?"

529 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:31:23pm

re: #523 jaunte

Piccy no worky

530 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:31:27pm

re: #402 compound idaho

When uncle sam mandates that is be included in the policy. duh.

Gov. Brewer, is that you?

531 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:31:42pm

re: #524 Slumbering Behemoth

Wait, does that mean she was born dishonest?
/

I am pretty sure she is mine, but you can never be sure.

She is beautiful and very smart. You could be right. Maybe she belongs to the mail man.

532 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:32:02pm

re: #529 wozzablog

526 has it.

533 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:32:05pm

re: #531 compound idaho

I am pretty sure she is mine, but you can never be sure.

She is beautiful and very smart. You could be right. Maybe she belongs to the mail man.

Creepy.

534 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:32:40pm

re: #482 Obdicut

True. It would be more believable if they included the E-Mail headers.

535 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:32:47pm

re: #501 Slumbering Behemoth

Women's equipment requires so much more maintenance than men's. I am not jealous.

You start to make up for it after 50. LOL

536 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:33:21pm

re: #530 palomino

I always thought that the entrance to the Abyss was near Arizona. So. Damn. Hot.

537 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:33:26pm

re: #515 Slumbering Behemoth

I instantly thought of folks like BB when I saw this.

There it is. We're looking at low self-esteem here. People with low self-esteem typically take things very personally. Even the smallest of things.

538 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:33:32pm

re: #534 Bubblehead II

True. It would be more believable if they included the E-Mail headers.

Nah, even that is easy to fake. There's no way, outside of a forensic situation, to prove the veracity of an email. Especially not when it's being touted by a known liar. Maybe it's true. Maybe it isn't. What's definitely true is I don't give a flying fuck.

539 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:33:48pm

re: #517 McSpiff

Hi, Canadian here.

I have catastrophic coverage through my provincial government.

For everything else, I had a choice between 3 employeer plans or "none of the above". I get to pocket the money (taxed as income) or deposit it in a HSA (not taxted) if i choose the lowest plan, or none.

Eh, sorry. It was just a gag line, a joking 'single payer' reference. I know darn well things are more complicated than that, but I wanted to mock compound idaho, and the line served to do that.

540 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:33:51pm

re: #489 marjoriemoon

All. The. Time. Menopause is starting to kick my ass, Marj, watch out.

541 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:34:08pm

re: #535 marjoriemoon

Hahaha! No doubt.

542 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:34:50pm

re: #538 Obdicut

Nah, even that is easy to fake. There's no way, outside of a forensic situation, to prove the veracity of an email. Especially not when it's being touted by a known liar. Maybe it's true. Maybe it isn't. What's definitely true is I don't give a flying fuck.

Sounds like a 10 difficulty rating.

543 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:35:13pm

re: #542 Varek Raith

Sounds like a 10 difficulty rating.

No, that's the flying fuck at the mooooooooon.

544 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:35:27pm

re: #540 prairiefire

All. The. Time. Menopause is starting to kick my ass, Marj, watch out.

Just give the rest of us a warning if we have to start ducking crockery.

545 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:35:36pm

re: #539 Dark_Falcon

Eh, sorry. It was just a gag line, a joking 'single payer' reference. I know darn well things are more complicated than that, but I wanted to mock compound idaho, and the line served to do that.

I figured you did, just making compound Idaho look stoopider...

546 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:36:12pm

re: #538 Obdicut

Nah, even that is easy to fake. There's no way, outside of a forensic situation, to prove the veracity of an email. Especially not when it's being touted by a known liar. Maybe it's true. Maybe it isn't. What's definitely true is I don't give a flying fuck.

You couldn't find any fucks to give?

547 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:36:44pm

re: #546 talon_262

His concern was ultralight.

548 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:36:46pm

re: #543 Obdicut

No, that's the flying fuck at the mooon.

Well, it would seem a bit hard to fly over the moon while fucking...

//

549 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:36:55pm

re: #521 freetoken

BTW, the Indiana state senator mentioned in that article has quite a history. He's a bit anti-Planned Parenthood guy, who also authored another bill (which did not get passed by the committee today, unlike the creationism bill), to get Indiana schools out of the new national Common Core Curriculum standards (a Bill Gates funded project) because of objections by home schoolers.

Would someone please explain to me what the home schoolers objected to?

I, personally, don't care what the local elementary school is teaching. If I find out they're teaching calculus, I'll call Doctor Who to investigate.

550 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:37:41pm

re: #527 Charles

Page it! Sounds like a guaranteed front-pager.

Well, he's got a bit of history, but isn't as notorious as some. He's just another theocrat in another state assembly. His bills run the litany , from the one on creationism, to public nudity, slowing down "environmental" rules, right to vote:

[Link: www.in.gov...]

551 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:37:46pm
552 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:37:56pm

re: #548 Dark_Falcon

Well, it would seem a bit hard to fly over the moon while fucking...

Sounds worth a try...

553 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:38:18pm

re: #544 wozzablog

Just give the rest of us a warning if we have to start ducking crockery.

Body armor and steel helmets are available at the front desk.

//

554 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:38:23pm

re: #533 Obdicut

Creepy.

Creepy? Yeah, she is mine. Very beautiful and very intelligent. Got it from Mrs Compound I am sure. I pay for her needs. I reluctantly pay for her birth control (poor dad). I love her. I know it. She knows it. We talk about it. Leave Uncle Sam out of it.

555 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:38:42pm

re: #546 talon_262

You couldn't find any fucks to give?

Well would ya look at that...

556 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:38:46pm

re: #546 talon_262

You couldn't find any fucks to give?

Jean-Luc don't give one either

557 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:38:47pm
558 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:38:55pm

re: #549 EmmmieG

a huge number of homeschoolers are young-earth creationist types (I know my relatives that homeschooled are), there's a number of things in the most common cirriculums that they objected to.

559 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:39:18pm

re: #554 compound idaho

Creepy? Yeah, she is mine. Very beautiful and very intelligent. Got it from Mrs Compound I am sure. I pay for her needs. I reluctantly pay for her birth control (poor dad). I love her. I know it. She knows it. We talk about it. Leave Uncle Sam out of it.

You know, Uncle Sam will never force you to file a claim with your private insurance provider. Dumbass.

560 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:39:37pm

re: #554 compound idaho

Protip: sometimes its time to cut your losses and come back another day, at this point its just down to the rockflinging :p

561 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:39:48pm

re: #554 compound idaho

What does Uncle Sam have to do with anything? That's what you've completely fucking failed to explain.

First you claimed Uncle Sam was paying for the contraception. Then you wanted everyone's insurance to be catastrophic only. Now you are really, really invested in paying for your daughter's birth control rather than her insurance paying for it. No clue why.

She at college?

562 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:40:09pm

re: #559 McSpiff

You know, Uncle Sam will never force you to file a claim with your private insurance provider. Dumbass.

No just pay for it.

563 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:40:23pm

re: #548 Dark_Falcon

Armstrong and Aldrin don't like to talk about that incident, so we should just drop it.
///

564 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:40:25pm

re: #557 Varek Raith

Image: Picardigans.jpg

565 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:40:42pm

re: #562 compound idaho

No just pay for it.

[facepalm]

566 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:40:52pm
567 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:41:14pm

re: #563 Slumbering Behemoth

Armstrong and Aldrin don't like to talk about that incident, so we should just drop it.
///

LMFAO!

568 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:41:48pm

re: #562 compound idaho

No just pay for it.

Now, please explain to me how, if you choose to pay out of pocket, and file 0 paper with your insurance provider, would they be forced to pay out of pocket.

edit: woops, taking out the part that doesnt make sense

569 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:42:13pm

re: #566 Varek Raith

Image: tumblr_lydi39GkZe1ro2yz3o1_500.png

"No, you look like a walking coat rack."

570 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:42:26pm
571 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:43:17pm

re: #536 Slumbering Behemoth

I always thought that the entrance to the Abyss was near Arizona. So. Damn. Hot.

Abyss, I don't know. But AZ has some awesome caves if you're into spelunking. Live and dead both.

572 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:44:08pm

And, coincident with the earlier discussion on the pill, creationist In. state senator Schneider a few months ago was championed by anti-abortionists:

Stand with Senator Scott Schneider

Indiana State Senator Scott Schneider helped to make history in the 2011 Indiana State Legislature by championing an amendment to end all state-directed funding for businesses that do abortions. [...]

I do believe there were some Pages put up about that Indiana bill.

573 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:45:02pm
574 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:45:11pm

re: #569 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

"No, you look like a walking coat rack."

Image: 104na7o.jpg

575 SpaceJesus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:45:38pm

Image: 4QSxd.jpg

hat tip, somethingawful goons

576 jaunte  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:46:07pm

re: #575 SpaceJesus

Ground control to Major Newt.

577 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:46:12pm
578 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:46:23pm

re: #575 SpaceJesus

Image: 4QSxd.jpg

hat tip, somethingawful goons

AH! Bad MST3K flashbacks!

579 Varek Raith  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:46:37pm
580 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:46:53pm

re: #565 Dark_Falcon

[facepalm]

re: #568 McSpiff

Now, please explain to me how, if you choose to pay out of pocket, and file 0 paper with your insurance provider, would they be forced to pay out of pocket.

edit: woops, taking out the part that doesnt make sense

My choice. Some other dad may not want to do the same.

I want catastrophic insurance. Not day to day health care.

581 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:47:49pm

re: #540 prairiefire

All. The. Time. Menopause is starting to kick my ass, Marj, watch out.

Most of the women I work with are over 45. It's not pretty.

I'll be 50 on Monday. Hey, me and King Abdullah II are born on the SAME day, SAME year! He'll be 50, too. I ran across this tidbit quite by accident.

582 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:49:26pm

re: #580 compound idaho

This makes absolutely no sense to me. None.

583 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:49:56pm

Carl Paladino wasn't available so the GOP opted for Newt Gingrich.

//

584 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:50:09pm
585 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:50:15pm

All the fucks Christian Slater gives fit into one envelope.

*Language Warning*

586 EdDantes  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:50:48pm

My wife can't find her Mydol. God help me.

587 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:50:55pm

re: #561 Obdicut

What does Uncle Sam have to do with anything? That's what you've completely fucking failed to explain.

First you claimed Uncle Sam was paying for the contraception. Then you wanted everyone's insurance to be catastrophic only. Now you are really, really invested in paying for your daughter's birth control rather than her insurance paying for it. No clue why.

She at college?

I really have to give you applause for following that. I got lost about 300 posts ago.

588 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:52:08pm

re: #582 McSpiff

This makes absolutely no sense to me. None.

Me neither. Hey CI, I am still awaiting a answer to my 367

589 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:52:13pm

re: #514 Obdicut

It's really sad. How many times did Walter violently declaim about how pathetic the stalkers were?

He was right! He was very right about that.

How sure are we that this guy is Walter?

590 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:53:03pm

re: #586 EdDantes

My wife can't find her Mydol. God help me.

Run! Run as far and as fast as you can! And whatever you do, don't look back!!!

///

591 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:53:16pm

re: #589 SanFranciscoZionist

How sure are we that this guy is Walter?

Again with the me not caring part.

592 BongCrodny  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:53:28pm

re: #585 Slumbering Behemoth

All the fucks Christian Slater gives fit into one envelope.

*Language Warning*

Love that movie to death.

593 Robert O.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:53:35pm

Meanwhile, BILL GATES today gave an interview in which he (like Warren Buffett) supports raising taxes on the rich, saying "taxes are going to have to go up" and that this would be "just justice." And what do you think the reaction of the Fox Nation crowd would be? -- [Link: nation.foxnews.com...]

594 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:54:00pm

re: #579 Varek Raith

Hold me!

595 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:54:13pm

re: #554 compound idaho

Creepy? Yeah, she is mine. Very beautiful and very intelligent. Got it from Mrs Compound I am sure. I pay for her needs. I reluctantly pay for her birth control (poor dad). I love her. I know it. She knows it. We talk about it. Leave Uncle Sam out of it.

Yes, creepy, as hell. She's not a dog, she's an adult woman who doesn't belong to you or anyone else, no matter how much you pay or what you choose to pay for. If you love her great, but true love doesn't come with entangled with a sense of ownership. There's something deeply sickening about the kind of language you're using.

596 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:54:33pm

re: #593 Robert O.

Meanwhile, BILL GATES today gave an interview in which he (like Warren Buffett) supports raising taxes on the rich, saying "taxes are going to have to go up" and that this would be "just justice." And what do you think the reaction of the Fox Nation crowd would be? -- [Link: nation.foxnews.com...]

Without looking, I'm going to guess that they're no longer fawning over his success and his wealth.

597 dragonfire1981  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:54:43pm

re: #557 Varek Raith

Image: fuck-this-shit-im-a-tree.jpg

That is fantastic. I say that both as a wrestling fan and as someone who appreciates good humor.

598 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:54:53pm

re: #588 Bubblehead II

Me neither. Hey CI, I am still awaiting a answer to my 367

Why does Uncle Sam make my renters insurance cover theft and fire? Pfft! Big government.

599 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:55:06pm

re: #581 marjoriemoon

My wife turned 50 last September. We use her as a space-heater.

600 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:55:06pm

re: #544 wozzablog

Just give the rest of us a warning if we have to start ducking crockery.

A hand flourish is suffice for now.

601 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:55:09pm

re: #589 SanFranciscoZionist

How sure are we that this guy is Walter?

I can't say. But I don't have a way to verify on way or the other, so I'm not going to worry about it.

602 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:55:34pm

re: #589 SanFranciscoZionist

How sure are we that this guy is Walter?

If it isn't, his email got hacked.

603 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:57:41pm

re: #599 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My wife turned 50 last September. We use her as a space-heater.

ROFL

604 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:57:47pm

re: #602 McSpiff

If it isn't, his email got hacked.

I'm not sure there's enough firing neurons over at DoD to boil a cup of water, let alone hack an email server.

605 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:57:51pm

re: #481 compound idaho

Catastrophic coverage is just that! My max out of pocket is very manageable. My life time max $5,000,000. PS I qualified for the Boston Marathon on 12/4/2011 and Mrs Compound is a professional body builder. (100% Natural) Some of us actually live the life we talk.

Yep, I was right, you're a narcissist.

606 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:57:51pm

re: #600 prairiefire

A hand flourish is suffice for now.

*hurls self under table.*

607 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:57:52pm

re: #582 McSpiff

This makes absolutely no sense to me. None.

The federal government should not require that health insurance cover birth control coverage. I'll pay for it on my own if needed. (wife, daughter, mother ..etc.)re: #595 goddamnedfrank

Yes, creepy, as hell. She's not a dog, she's an adult woman who doesn't belong to you or anyone else, no matter how much you pay or what you choose to pay for. If you love her great, but true love doesn't come with entangled with a sense of ownership. There's something deeply sickening about the kind of language you're using.

Wow. You really do not know what you are talking about. Really.

608 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:57:57pm

re: #586 EdDantes

My wife can't find her Mydol. God help me.

That's what happens when you get Uncle Sam mandating lady stuff.
///

609 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:58:28pm

re: #608 Slumbering Behemoth

That's what happens when you get Uncle Sam mandating lady stuff.
///

I don't have my Uncle Sam mandated lady....

610 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:58:32pm

re: #596 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Without looking, I'm going to guess that they're no longer fawning over his success and his wealth.

And imagine my surprise that the running theme is "If Gates feels he's not taxed enough, then let him write a check!"

These dimwits really need to get some new material.

611 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:58:39pm

re: #607 compound idaho

Should the government mandate medical professionals be licensed?

612 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:59:05pm

re: #611 Obdicut

Yes

613 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:59:37pm

re: #612 compound idaho

Yes

So why is that okay? Why shouldn't you have the right to pay for whoever they want to do whatever they want, medically?

614 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 7:59:55pm

re: #599 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My wife turned 50 last September. We use her as a space-heater.

That's not really a joke. The house thermostat is set at 64 degrees. I wear fleece pajamas, under two snuggies on the couch, in bed I have three blankets on my side. She sleeps under the comforter and a sheet... most of the time, by morning, the comforter's also thrown over top of me.

If I were a woman... I honestly don't think I would've made it.

615 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:00:04pm

re: #612 compound idaho

Yes

Should the insurance industry have any type of regulation? Should there be any verification that they can provide the services you're paying for, for example

616 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:00:08pm

re: #605 goddamnedfrank

Yep, I was right, you're a narcissist.

Or just an elaborate troll.

617 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:00:15pm

re: #609 wozzablog

I don't have my Uncle Sam mandated lady...

"If the [insert military branch] wanted you to have a wife, they'd have issued you one!"

618 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:00:37pm

For the maddow lovers among you:

[Link: rachelmaddowheygirl.tumblr.com...]

619 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:00:43pm

re: #614 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My GF was like that. Oy.

620 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:00:47pm

re: #616 Lidane

Or just an elaborate troll.

Whatever you do. Don't send him an email.

//

621 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:01:14pm

re: #613 Obdicut

So why is that okay? Why shouldn't you have the right to pay for whoever they want to do whatever they want, medically?

You should.

I however would chose a licensed professional. My choice.

622 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:01:36pm

re: #581 marjoriemoon

Most of the women I work with are over 45. It's not pretty.

I'll be 50 on Monday. Hey, me and King Abdullah II are born on the SAME day, SAME year! He'll be 50, too. I ran across this tidbit quite by accident.

He made eyes at me! I am not kidding. At an English American college in Grantham. He arrived at the school in a black limo and body guards. Back when he was fourth in line in 1982. The son of the Ambassador to Great Britain from Jordan attended my school and was a childhood friend. I heard he has had a nice government job in Jordan since graduation.

623 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:02:13pm

re: #621 compound idaho

You should.

I however would chose a licensed professional. My choice.

Okay. So now you don't think the government should regulate medical providers.

Why is your first answer never the real one? Do you have a compulsion to lie on your first answer?

624 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:02:45pm

re: #623 Obdicut

Okay. So now you don't think the government should regulate medical providers.

Why is your first answer never the real one? Do you have a compulsion to lie on your first answer?

No.

I mean yes.

625 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:02:59pm

re: #618 Obdicut

For the maddow lovers among you:

[Link: rachelmaddowheygirl.tumblr.com...]

love love love

626 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:03:32pm

re: #617 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

"If the [insert military branch] wanted you to have a wife, they'd have issued you one!"

"This in my rifle, this is my gun, this is for fighting, this is for fun!"

627 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:03:37pm

re: #507 Dark_Falcon

Is it just me, or does the president look somewhat less robust than normal in that photo?

Obama's smart enough not to get into a finger pointing fight with a nobody like Gov. Brewer. It's beneath him, and it was smart to stay presidential and let her act like a clown.

628 Coracle  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:03:56pm

re: #623 Obdicut

He's defending a vague, amorphous position. One that is ultimately indefensible except for 'this is how I want it because I want it this way'. It's not worth anyone's time, Obdi.

629 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:05:14pm

re: #627 palomino

Obama's smart enough not to get into a finger pointing fight with a nobody like Gov. Brewer. It's beneath him, and it was smart to stay presidential and let her act like a clown.

He just seemed a bit pale and ill is all.

630 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:05:31pm

re: #628 Coracle

Yeah, it's just good to demonstrate the shallowness of the 'everyone should have a choice' position, and how quickly it winds up in anarchy.

His position would allow back-alley abortions, but disallow the government mandating pharm coverage included the pill.

Cuckoo.

631 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:05:51pm

re: #592 BongCrodny

Love that movie to death.

Went on a double date to see some Stallone action movie that came out. We ended up too late to make the last showing (I suspected feminine sabotage), and the only thing left that hadn't started yet was something lame, and "True Romance". None of us knew a damn thing about that movie or Tarantino. The ladies said "Oooh, that sounds good, lets watch that". Me and my buddy looked at each other like "aw, damnit" and said "okay".

Obviously it was not the kind of movie any of us were expecting. Right in the opening, when Slater said "I always said, if I had to fuck a guy... I mean had to, if my life depended on it... I'd fuck Elvis.", I thought "I may just like this movie."

632 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:06:49pm

Practicing medicine without a license should be legal ... hilarious. Coat hanger abortions, that "doctor" who tells his patients HIV doesn't cause AIDS, it's all good.

633 TedStriker  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:07:41pm

re: #628 Coracle

He's defending a vague, amorphous position. One that is ultimately indefensible except for 'this is how I want it because I want it this way'. It's not worth anyone's time, Obdi.

Pretty much...if you get mad with him, they claim victory and if you cede the conversation, they claim victory also.

634 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:08:01pm

re: #531 compound idaho

I am pretty sure she is mine, but you can never be sure.

She is beautiful and very smart. You could be right. Maybe she belongs to the mail man.

Time for you to go to bed.

Seriously. Sleep.

635 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:09:23pm

re: #632 goddamnedfrank

Practicing medicine without a license should be legal ... hilarious. Coat hanger abortions, that "doctor" who tells his patients HIV doesn't cause AIDS, it's all good.

Its totally rational to assume that the government is completely incompetent, and that the consumer, with no force of law behind him, will have a greater access to information than any regulatory agency. Clearly we can decide who should and should not perform heart surgery on us. If anything $200 triple-bypass specials just ensure more access to healthcare.

Oh? Will you survive? How should I know. That's none of my concern.

636 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:09:26pm

re: #634 SanFranciscoZionist

Time for you to go to bed.

Seriously. Sleep.

Good advice.

637 Coracle  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:09:40pm

re: #633 talon_262

Pretty much...if you get mad with him, they claim victory and if you cede the conversation, they claim victory also.

And thus they can sleep secure that their own little stovepipe world will remain unchanged. They convince no one. They learn nothing themselves.

638 Obdicut  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:09:49pm

If I had a sexually active kid, I'd want contraceptives to be available from drinking fountains, stop signs, and have them in those little mint dishes in restaurants. You wouldn't be able to ever have enough contraceptives around.

639 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:10:12pm

re: #629 Dark_Falcon

He just seemed a bit pale and ill is all.

What, are you a doctor now? You gonna diagnose him based on a photo, a la Bill Frist and Terry Schiavo.

If I had to get that close to Gov. Brewer and listen to her BS, I'd probably feel ill as well.

640 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:10:21pm

re: #622 prairiefire

He made eyes at me! I am not kidding. At an English American college in Grantham. He arrived at the school in a black limo and body guards. Back when he was fourth in line in 1982. The son of the Ambassador to Great Britain from Jordan attended my school and was a childhood friend. I heard he has had a nice government job in Jordan since graduation.

No way!! LOL He's a nice lookin fellow. And you know, of all the countries Israel has to tangle with Jordan gives them the least amount of grief. Too funny!

641 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:10:36pm

re: #591 Obdicut

Again with the me not caring part.

Basically, me neither, except that I am bearing in mind that, well, these guys lie a lot.

642 jamesfirecat  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:11:27pm

re: #638 Obdicut

If I had a sexually active kid, I'd want contraceptives to be available from drinking fountains, stop signs, and have them in those little mint dishes in restaurants. You wouldn't be able to ever have enough contraceptives around.

I think you forgot hotel rooms leaving you contraceptives on your pillow instead of mints. (Not mocking your position)

643 McSpiff  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:11:54pm

night all

644 Coracle  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:11:59pm

re: #639 palomino

What, are you a doctor now? You gonna diagnose him based on a photo, a la Bill Frist and Terry Schiavo.

If I had to get that close to Gov. Brewer and listen to her BS, I'd probably feel ill as well.

I believe he's suffering from the near fatal malady of acute photographic overexposure. I prescribe two percent contrast enhance and call me in the morning.

645 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:12:05pm

re: #636 Gus 802

I suggested that earlier, even quoted the IF rule. But did he listen? Nooooo.

646 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:12:07pm

re: #626 talon_262

"This in my rifle, this is my gun, this is for fighting, this is for fun!"

"This is my rifle..."

647 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:12:09pm

re: #630 Obdicut

Yeah, it's just good to demonstrate the shallowness of the 'everyone should have a choice' position, and how quickly it winds up in anarchy.

His position would allow back-alley abortions, but disallow the government mandating pharm coverage included the pill.

Cuckoo.

Times I think it's not choice so much as the illusion of choice, being handed a small set of "options" and then feeling satisfied that, of those available, you "chose" the one you wanted.

648 freetoken  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:12:47pm

Ok, by popular demand, I Paged it.

649 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:13:48pm

re: #638 Obdicut

If I had a sexually active kid, I'd want contraceptives to be available from drinking fountains, stop signs, and have them in those little mint dishes in restaurants. You wouldn't be able to ever have enough contraceptives around.

re: #642 jamesfirecat

I think you forgot hotel rooms leaving you contraceptives on your pillow instead of mints. (Not mocking your position)

Definition of a dilemma... your daughter gets home at 3am with a Gideon Bible under her arm...

650 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:14:30pm

re: #640 marjoriemoon

The ambassador's son kept trying to point out all the Euro people in the room. It was a U.S. school for international students who didn't have the grades for Oxford or Cambridge. No, he was captivated by the mid-western, seven shades of white girl./ I got out of there as fast as I could!

651 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:14:40pm

re: #481 compound idaho

Catastrophic coverage is just that! My max out of pocket is very manageable. My life time max $5,000,000. PS I qualified for the Boston Marathon on 12/4/2011 and Mrs Compound is a professional body builder. (100% Natural) Some of us actually live the life we talk.

Nice to hear you're in good shape...comes in handy when you're taking a pounding like this, from people far more knowledgable than you.

You're getting eviscerated so thoroughly by other lizards that I half expect your bloody spleen to jump through my monitor.

652 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:15:39pm

re: #638 Obdicut

If I had a sexually active kid, I'd want contraceptives to be available from drinking fountains, stop signs, and have them in those little mint dishes in restaurants. You wouldn't be able to ever have enough contraceptives around then I have failed as a parent in the eyes of Gawd and deserve His wrath

.

FTFWN

653 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:15:51pm

re: #645 Bubblehead II

I suggested that earlier, even quoted the IF rule. But did he listen? Nooo.

I can't go to bed now! I'm arguing with someone on the internet!

//

654 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:16:27pm

Who run Uterus Town?!?

655 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:16:37pm

I wish I could stay longer, but I'm just too worn out.

Good Night, all.

656 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:16:47pm

re: #621 compound idaho

You should.

I however would chose a licensed professional. My choice.

you have never worked in health care, I take it

657 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:16:59pm

re: #627 palomino

Obama's smart enough not to get into a finger pointing fight with a nobody like Gov. Brewer. It's beneath him, and it was smart to stay presidential and let her act like a clown.

I'm having a real hard time with her sticking her finger out at him, especially if she wagged it. For real. That is the epitome of rudeness.

I had a boss who was well connected politically. He told me never, ever, ever to point at someone. You notice how seasoned politicians, when they want to make a point, stick their fist out, but the pointer finger is curled in? Clinton did this a lot, the "curled finger point." But they all do it.

Early on when Palin was running for VP, she always shook her finger and pointed when she spoke. They must have said something to her because eventually, you'd see her do it, then curl it back in right away when she became aware of it.

Shaking your finger at someone is awful, and to the President? Wow.

658 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:17:39pm

re: #656 WindUpBird

you have never worked in health care, I take it

you wub, which Rush album had the objectivist songs on it? (freewill, etc?)

659 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:18:44pm

re: #508 palomino

That horrible "one size fits all" Canadian system is far less expensive than ours; and Canadians live longer as well. They're doing something right.

Not touching Budweiser is part of it I'm sure.
//

660 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:18:46pm

re: #655 Dark_Falcon

I wish I could stay longer, but I'm just too worn out.

Good Night, all.

Are you pale and ill? Maybe you're working too hard.

Now imagine that you have the world's toughest job, POTUS, and you have to meet with retarded Governors like Jan Brewer. Would you be more or less "worn out"?

661 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:18:55pm

re: #658 windsagio

2112

662 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:19:25pm

re: #659 oaktree

Not touching Budweiser is part of it I'm sure.
//

Fewer poisonous snakes

663 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:19:43pm

re: #661 goddamnedfrank

2112

awesome thx, need it for some internetting elsewhere :D

664 Altermite  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:20:02pm

Anybody know anything about ACTA?

665 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:20:15pm

Wire: #656 WindUpBird

you have never worked in health care, I take it

Mrs Compound (I like saying that) worked in private practice as an audiologist for years. My guess is you never worked in health care.

666 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:20:29pm

re: #657 marjoriemoon

It's the new environment. Obama is "not their president." It's shameful. I always called for respect of Bush, Clinton, Bush I, Reagan, etc. I can see after they leave office. I have a general rule. If you hate the president then you hate America. It should not matter as long as the president is reasonable and within law. All reasoning is also not equal and there are level. But this is unprecedented. But you know how it when they say to walk in a mans shoes. Or about what it's really like to live as a black man in America. Well, in a way with Obama we're getting to see what it's like to live as a black man in America. Where even being president still isn't good enough.

667 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:21:08pm

Night all.

Painkillers have kicked in, been knocked flat back on my ass by an old health problem again the last couple of days. Down for the two weeks after xmas too.

Bah.

668 sagehen  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:21:09pm

re: #581 marjoriemoon

Most of the women I work with are over 45. It's not pretty.

I'll be 50 on Monday. Hey, me and King Abdullah II are born on the SAME day, SAME year! He'll be 50, too. I ran across this tidbit quite by accident.

I have the same birthday as Nancy Reagan and Dubya. Not the same year as either one, but it's still depressing to think what an astrologer might say about my day.

669 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:21:44pm

re: #657 marjoriemoon

I had a boss who was well connected politically. He told me never, ever, ever to point at someone. You notice how seasoned politicians, when they want to make a point, stick their fist out, but the pointer finger is curled in? Clinton did this a lot, the "curled finger point." But they all do it.

Even gawt-damned, pos, douchebag Hitler used the "curled finger point." No one reacts positively to physical finger pointing.

670 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:21:55pm

re: #663 windsagio

awesome thx, need it for some internetting elsewhere :D

Actually I answered too soon. Freewill is on Permanent Waves. 2112 has a lot of Randian ass worship too tho'.

671 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:21:56pm

re: #658 windsagio

you wub, which Rush album had the objectivist songs on it? (freewill, etc?)

Freewill is on Permanent Waves, Anthem is on Fly By Night, and of course there's lots of Rand-ness on 2112

672 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:22:01pm

re: #665 compound idaho

Wi

Mrs Compound (I like saying that) worked in private practice as an audiologist for years. My guess is you never worked in health care.

oh dude, oh dude, oh dude.

I was tryin' to help you earlier, but you do NOT wanna hear his healthcare biz stories.

673 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:22:22pm

re: #661 goddamnedfrank

2112

there's more objectivey songs than just 2112! #proggeek

674 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:22:49pm

Elizabeth Banks is on Conan... She's adorable.

675 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:22:52pm

re: #670 goddamnedfrank

re: #671 WindUpBird

OK got it, you both are awesome

Edit: Any album is made better by a man in the far future finding a lost guitar and rediscovering rock music.

676 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:23:57pm

re: #673 WindUpBird

there's more objectivey songs than just 2112! #proggeek

Come at me bro, Roll the Bones!

677 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:24:08pm

re: #665 compound idaho

Wi

Mrs Compound (I like saying that) worked in private practice as an audiologist for years. My guess is you never worked in health care.

Fifteen years in the trenches working with MR/DD population, sir

Sorry, the idea that in America we should have unlicensed medical care, it's as insane and infantile a position as saying that we should remove all air traffic controllers and just let people in planes "figure it out"

seriously, do you even think over the things you say? or do you work backwards from your solution (ideology) because you define yourself by ideology?

678 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:24:25pm

re: #676 goddamnedfrank

Come at me bro, Roll the Bones!

Jack, relax

get busy with the facts

no zodiacs no almanacs

679 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:24:40pm

re: #676 goddamnedfrank

no maniacs with polyester slacks


it's a parallax ya dig

680 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:24:50pm

re: #666 Gus 802

But you know how it when they say to walk in a mans shoes.

"Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way, you'll be a mile from them, and you'll have their shoes."

681 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:24:54pm

re: #666 Gus 802

It's the new environment. Obama is "not their president." It's shameful. I always called for respect of Bush, Clinton, Bush I, Reagan, etc. I can see after they leave office. I have a general rule. If you hate the president then you hate America. It should not matter as long as the president is reasonable and within law. All reasoning is also not equal and there are level. But this is unprecedented. But you know how it when they say to walk in a mans shoes. Or about what it's really like to live as a black man in America. Well, in a way with Obama we're getting to see what it's like to live as a black man in America. Where even being president still isn't good enough.

Maybe it's the fall out of the internet age where we can say whatever we like to anonymously so now it's become the norm to do it in person?

But I think what you're saying is you can hate the President, but at least respect the Office.

Also, self righteous indignation seems to be on the rise.

682 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:25:17pm

re: #657 marjoriemoon

I'm having a real hard time with her sticking her finger out at him, especially if she wagged it. For real. That is the epitome of rudeness.

I had a boss who was well connected politically. He told me never, ever, ever to point at someone. You notice how seasoned politicians, when they want to make a point, stick their fist out, but the pointer finger is curled in? Clinton did this a lot, the "curled finger point." But they all do it.

Early on when Palin was running for VP, she always shook her finger and pointed when she spoke. They must have said something to her because eventually, you'd see her do it, then curl it back in right away when she became aware of it.

Shaking your finger at someone is awful, and to the President? Wow.

It's a slightly less egregious example of the kind of disrespect that Joe "You Lie!" Wilson showed Obama.

Some people will think it makes Obama look weak to have someone (particularly a woman in the eyes of some) shake her finger at him, and then for him to not respond forcefully. But think of the alternative: Obama gets angry, points a finger back, and has a shouting match with her at the airport. That would look far worse. The base may eat up the blowhard antagonism of Gingrich or Christie, but it's beneath the office of the president.

683 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:25:26pm

re: #667 wozzablog

Night all.

Painkillers have kicked in, been knocked flat back on my ass by an old health problem again the last couple of days. Down for the two weeks after xmas too.

Bah.

(((wozza))) I'm out too. Past my bedtime. Check ya'll later :)

684 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:25:44pm

re: #677 WindUpBird

And the lesson of the Shep is that you can't trust companies to hire quality care providers without being forced to by the law.

685 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:25:55pm

re: #668 sagehen

I have the same birthday as Nancy Reagan and Dubya. Not the same year as either one, but it's still depressing to think what an astrologer might say about my day.

Year and time matter a great deal astrology-wise. I'm dying to know what time the King was born!

686 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:26:19pm

I run marathons and my wife is She-Hulk. Hear my words of wisdom!

687 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:26:43pm

re: #686 goddamnedfrank

you realize that's the same as saying 'my wife's a whore' right?

688 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:26:46pm

re: #684 windsagio

And the lesson of the Shep is that you can't trust companies to hire quality care providers without being forced to by the law.

yep!

Can you fucking imagine our company with even less regulation, hahaha

689 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:27:57pm

re: #686 goddamnedfrank

I fear for your penis.

690 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:28:26pm

re: #665 compound idaho

Wi

Mrs Compound (I like saying that) worked in private practice as an audiologist for years. My guess is you never worked in health care.

So what? Everything you say is about yourself, your wife, kids, "lady friends." Mostly irrelevant to a larger question of health care for 300 million people, most of whom are not members of your family.

691 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:28:34pm

re: #688 WindUpBird

dude yes, its called the Washington region.

"Hi there guy that had a broken hip and nobody noticed for months!"

692 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:28:37pm

re: #682 palomino

It's a slightly less egregious example of the kind of disrespect that Joe "You Lie!" Wilson showed Obama.

Some people will think it makes Obama look weak to have someone (particularly a woman in the eyes of some) shake her finger at him, and then for him to not respond forcefully. But think of the alternative: Obama gets angry, points a finger back, and has a shouting match with her at the airport. That would look far worse. The base may eat up the blowhard antagonism of Gingrich or Christie, but it's beneath the office of the president.

At least in that picture, someone said it above, he's reacting like, "Ok, calm down, crazy lady." He takes care of himself well so yea, he definitely wins.

693 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:29:07pm

The real visceral hatred of Bush was generally confined to the far-left. With Obama the real visceral hatred quickly went from the far-right then through the Tea Party and quickly became mainstream with Republicans. Where even "you lie" was screamed at Obama by Joe Wilson in congress.

The stories are very familiar with everyone in here now. Bush was given his time and there was much resistance to his judicial nominations he was given a fair hearing. In fact Bush signed many bills written largely by Democrats. Barney Frank had a descent relationship with George.

Nancy Pelosi stood fast and resisted the Code Pinks and refused to hear any talk of impeachment. The Democrats in the end held their head up high during the Bush years -- despite the now historical turmoil. That cannot be said of the Republican Party and President Obama.

694 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:29:13pm

re: #692 marjoriemoon

At least in that picture, someone said it above, he's reacting like, "Ok, calm down, crazy lady." He takes care of himself well so yea, he definitely wins.

Brewer just gives me the creeps

695 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:29:31pm

My sister posted the following item on facebook.

Look at Rainn Wilson's twitter pic.

[Link: twitter.com...]

696 compound idaho  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:30:18pm

re: #634 SanFranciscoZionist

thanks SF you too WindUpBird. don't know where the whole unlicensed thing came from. Too many bottom shelf whiskeys?

I suspect know you are right about sleep

Do not forget that some of us take care of our own affairs. We like it that way.

Perhaps I get too defensive, but the load is getting very heavy.

697 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:30:31pm

re: #686 goddamnedfrank

You think anybody thinks I'm a failure because I go home to Starla at night? Forget about it!
-Napoleon Dynamite

698 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:30:37pm

We hated Reagan but we never hated Reagan like these guys hate Obama.

699 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:32:30pm

re: #697 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You think anybody thinks I'm a failure because I go home to Starla at night? Forget about it!
-Napoleon Dynamite

Bow to your sensei. BOW TO YOUR SENSEI!

700 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:32:50pm

re: #693 Gus 802

It's just gawt-damned embarrassing, I tell ya. If and when they start losing voters, they've only got themselves to blame.

701 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:33:14pm

re: #695 EmmmieG

He's recently had to admit that he looks a lot like Newt did when Newt was his age.

702 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:33:19pm

re: #698 Gus 802

We hated Reagan but we never hated Reagan like these guys hate Obama.

I hated Reagan pretty badly. I hated Dubya worse, until he invaded Iraq and then I liked his whole "America FUCK YEA" thing. Like Obama got last night. I'm a sucker for that, and as a liberal, it's a bit embarrassing LOL

703 What, me worry?  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:34:14pm

Ok, I really have to go to bed. Night all.

704 sagehen  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:34:52pm

re: #653 Gus 802

I can't go to bed now! I'm arguing with someone on the internet!

//

[Link: xkcd.com...]

705 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:34:57pm

re: #671 WindUpBird

Freewill is on Permanent Waves, Anthem is on Fly By Night, and of course there's lots of Rand-ness on 2112

On that note, I love their song "The Trees" from Hemispheres, mainly because of its silly lyrics and muddled premise. It's got an anti-affirmative action element with a strong Randian streak. Key lyric:

"Now there's no more oak oppression,
For they passed a noble law,
And the trees are all kept equal
By hatchet, axe, and saw."

706 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:36:16pm

re: #694 WindUpBird

Brewer just gives me the creeps

She always looks pinched to me, like she's smelling something bitter.

707 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:36:23pm

re: #701 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

He's recently had to admit that he looks a lot like Newt did when Newt was his age.

Newt/Schrute

708 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:36:39pm

re: #705 palomino

Heh. I thought they were advocating communism. But what do I know? I'm mainly in it for the awesome guitar riffs.

709 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:37:49pm

re: #696 compound idaho

thanks SF you too WindUpBird. don't know where the whole unlicensed thing came from. Too many bottom shelf whiskeys?

I suspect know you are right about sleep

Do not forget that some of us take care of our own affairs. We like it that way.

Perhaps I get too defensive, but the load is getting very heavy.

Most of us "take care of our own affairs." Don't be a jackass and imply otherwise.

710 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:37:54pm

re: #608 Slumbering Behemoth

That's what happens when you get Uncle Sam mandating lady stuff.
///

When did the United States invade Burma!
//

711 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:38:15pm

re: #693 Gus 802

Every wingnut I've seen in recent years seems convinced that what's coming in November is a replay of '80, that Obama is the new Carter and the eventual GOP candidate will be Reagan riding in to return America to greatness.

Personally, I think they're off by 4 years and have the parts backwards, because it looks more like Obama is Reagan still dealing with a very hostile and very loony opposition, and that the GOP nominee will follow Mondale in flushing his party's chances down the drain and leading to a major house cleaning in the ranks.

712 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:38:25pm

re: #702 marjoriemoon

I hated Reagan pretty badly. I hated Dubya worse, until he invaded Iraq and then I liked his whole "America FUCK YEA" thing. Like Obama got last night. I'm a sucker for that, and as a liberal, it's a bit embarrassing LOL

Hey despite it all I love the military. Airshows are the greatest and when they used to have a single ship team from Air Combat Command that was the greatest. I love patriotic music, real country, and bluegrass. I drink Mt. Dew, smoke and drink. I never worry about what I'm eating. One of the greatest actors in my estimation was Jimmy Stewart. I love the sound of a pedal steel. I'm probably as American as they come. There's other things I love. Like gypsy music, flamenco, Spain, and such. But those American things are on that list.

713 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:38:34pm

re: #705 palomino

Heh. As long as we're sharing Rush stories, my first car was a red 1992 Saturn SL2. I was so excited when I got it that I drove around blasting Red Barchetta for the first week or so that I had the car, as my sort of unofficial soundtrack. What a nerd. XD

714 Coracle  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:39:01pm

re: #696 compound idaho

Your 'load' would be less heavy if more of the population had basic preventative care covered. Like birth control.

715 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:39:53pm

re: #706 Lidane

She always looks pinched to me, like she's smelling something bitter.

A.K.A. The Fred Schneider Effect.

716 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:40:30pm

re: #715 Slumbering Behemoth

A.K.A. The Fred Schneider Effect.

Except Fred Schneider is entertaining. Jan Brewer? Not so much.

717 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:40:58pm

re: #695 EmmmieG

My sister posted the following item on facebook.

Look at Rainn Wilson's twitter pic.

[Link: twitter.com...]

Yes, he looks much like a young Newt:[Link: www.dailymail.co.uk...]

718 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:41:50pm

My favorite character on Full Metal Jacket was Gunnery Sgt. Hartman. I was taken aback when he was murdered. The rest of the movie sucks after that. But I like characters in real life like those gunnies. At least before all of this lets all hate each other crap came down.

719 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:42:00pm

re: #715 Slumbering Behemoth

A.K.A. The Fred Schneider Effect.

I thought about Jan Brewer in the Love Shack and then threw up a little.

/tin roof, rusted.

720 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:42:13pm

re: #708 Slumbering Behemoth

Heh. I thought they were advocating communism. But what do I know? I'm mainly in it for the awesome guitar riffs.

I'm not sure. It's a weird song: it starts out critically describing unfairness and then seems to suggest that an all-powerful state went too far in remedying those injustices. I think Rush (or at least Peart, the lyricist) are fairly staunch libertarians.

As for the guitar, that's what always drew me to them. Some of their best stuff (like Alex's epic guitar solo in "Working Man") is lyric-less.

721 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:42:45pm

re: #702 marjoriemoon

lol

722 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:43:00pm

re: #716 Lidane

Oh, I dunno. I'm sure Pres. Obama and co. had quite a few laughs at her expense after that encounter.

723 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:43:53pm

"Sgt. Hartman" was harsh but he was teaching them how to stay alive. That's how all DIs work. It may seem inhumane but they're teaching you how to be in an inhumane environment. They're teaching you how to stay alive and come back from a war with all of your limbs and preferably your life.

724 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:44:11pm

re: #713 Lidane

Heh. As long as we're sharing Rush stories, my first car was a red 1992 Saturn SL2. I was so excited when I got it that I drove around blasting Red Barchetta for the first week or so that I had the car, as my sort of unofficial soundtrack. What a nerd. XD

A little nerdy, but that's a great driving song.

And it's also got a libertarian theme: about being able to freely drive a car "before they passed the Motor Law."

725 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:44:39pm

re: #718 Gus 802

R. LEE MOTHER-FUCKING ERMEY, BITCHES!!!! THE REAL DEAL!

I really liked his show "Mail Call".

726 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:45:04pm

re: #713 Lidane

Mind if I share a "Rush" story?

I've never listened to a Rush song all of the way through.

Not one. Ever.

Does that make me a bad person?
(don'tanswerthat)

727 Bubblehead II  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:45:29pm

Night Lizards. See you in the morning. CI go to bed before you say something really stupid and get yourself banned.

728 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:45:53pm

re: #723 Gus 802

"Sgt. Hartman" was harsh but he was teaching them how to stay alive. That's how all DIs work. It may seem inhumane but they're teaching you how to be in an inhumane environment. They're teaching you how to stay alive and come back from a war with all of your limbs and preferably your life.

"Is that you John Wayne???"

729 jamesfirecat  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:46:27pm

re: #725 Slumbering Behemoth

R. LEE MOTHER-FUCKING ERMEY, BITCHES!!! THE REAL DEAL!

I really liked his show "Mail Call".

I liked him in Lock N Load.... but really just give the man some guns, some watermellons and do what ever and I'd watch it....

730 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:47:22pm

re: #723 Gus 802

"Sgt. Hartman" was harsh but he was teaching them how to stay alive. That's how all DIs work. It may seem inhumane but they're teaching you how to be in an inhumane environment. They're teaching you how to stay alive and come back from a war with all of your limbs and preferably your life.

I've recounted the tidbit here that R. Lee Ermey was actually not originally in the film, but simply hired as a consultant. Stanley Kubrick brought him in to help pick an actor to play Hartmann and to teach him how to act like a real D.I.

Ermey had himself filmed being pelted with tennis balls for 15 minutes straight while screaming various obscenities and insults, without repeating himself, and without cringing.

Kubrick not only gave him the part, but broke with his directing style slightly by letting Ermey ad-lib entire sections of dialogue.

731 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:47:38pm

re: #726 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You don't eat meat, you actually like cake, and you won't listen to an entire RUSH song.

That doesn't make you a bad person, but it definitely speaks ill of your judgement.
///

732 Lidane  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:47:48pm

re: #726 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Mind if I share a "Rush" story?

I've never listened to a Rush song all of the way through.

Not one. Ever.

Does that make me a bad person?
(don'tanswerthat)

Heh. I made it through the entire 1980's without ever seeing E.T.

Still haven't seen it, either.

733 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:47:59pm

re: #725 Slumbering Behemoth

R. LEE MOTHER-FUCKING ERMEY, BITCHES!!! THE REAL DEAL!

I really liked his show "Mail Call".

When I read the story about the SEAL getting those pirates it reminded me of some stories I read about Vietnam. It was about a SEAL team there. Greg McPartlin who was a combat medic there but carried a Stoner. Sneak attack at 2 AM. No casualties. Primo stuff right there.

734 palomino  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:48:09pm

Goodnight everyone.

Take it easy on Compound W. Apparently he's in the process of destroying his precious few remaining brain cells.

735 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:48:10pm

re: #728 oaktree

"Is that you John Wayne???"

"Hey, start the cameras, this is 'Vietnam: The Movie'!"

736 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:48:48pm

re: #735 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

"Hey, start the cameras, this is 'Vietnam: The Movie'!"

Who gets David Jensen's part?

737 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:49:59pm

re: #723 Gus 802

"Sgt. Hartman" was harsh but he was teaching them how to stay alive. That's how all DIs work. It may seem inhumane but they're teaching you how to be in an inhumane environment. They're teaching you how to stay alive and come back from a war with all of your limbs and preferably your life.

One of the issues with Hartmann was that he was a hammer and every problem was a nail. Therefore you had the contrast of Joker trying to talk Pyle down, and you knew it was going to end badly the moment Hartmann went into the head.

And one reason the latter half of the movie didn't match up is that it was trying to deal with more complex issues in a much more complex situation. Lots of gray as well compared to how black/white Parris Island was. (And the fact that Hartmann was gone was a factor as well.)

738 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:50:25pm
739 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:51:24pm

re: #723 Gus 802

"Sgt. Hartman" was harsh but he was teaching them how to stay alive. That's how all DIs work. It may seem inhumane but they're teaching you how to be in an inhumane environment. They're teaching you how to stay alive and come back from a war with all of your limbs and preferably your life.

Well they're also intentionally breaking people down mentally in order to make them more obedient/better soldiers.

740 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:51:30pm

G'night knuckleheads!

741 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:51:35pm

re: #737 oaktree

One of the issues with Hartmann was that he was a hammer and every problem was a nail. Therefore you had the contrast of Joker trying to talk Pyle down, and you knew it was going to end badly the moment Hartmann went into the head.

And one reason the latter half of the movie didn't match up is that it was trying to deal with more complex issues in a much more complex situation. Lots of gray as well compared to how black/white Parris Island was. (And the fact that Hartmann was gone was a factor as well.)

Right. And "Pyle" had personal issues as well. So he doesn't really represent the norm.

742 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:53:19pm

re: #730 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Kubrick not only gave him the part, but broke with his directing style slightly by letting Ermey ad-lib entire sections of dialogue.

The Ermey cannot be contained. It must be allowed to flow freely, or it will destroy that which blocks it's path.

All those incredibly dubious "Chuck Norris Facts"? Multiply them by eleventy and you get honest to goodness "R. Lee Ermey Facts".

743 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:55:32pm

re: #741 Gus 802

Right. And "Pyle" had personal issues as well. So he doesn't really represent the norm.

Pyle had essentially cracked and gone psychotic. Which made him "functional" in a military basic training sense if you weren't paying close attention. Joker noticed since he'd been mentoring Pyle, but apparently never brought it up in an official manner. Which arguably was a downside of that training style.

744 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:56:35pm

re: #739 windsagio

Well they're also intentionally breaking people down mentally in order to make them more obedient/better soldiers.

Yep. And the job of the commanders it to help keep their soldiers alive. Or as in Patton the job is to kill more of their guys and not get yourself killed. Something like that. They do their work according to the will of the American people, by the president and congress. Just like when the SEALS did their thing in Somalia just recently. The SEALS didn't decide this on their own they did this according to the wishes of the president.

745 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:57:05pm

re: #742 Slumbering Behemoth

The Ermey cannot be contained. It must be allowed to flow freely, or it will destroy that which blocks it's path.

All those incredibly dubious "Chuck Norris Facts"? Multiply them by eleventy and you get honest to goodness "R. Lee Ermey Facts".

I didn't know it until recently that Ermey's Gunnery Sgt rank was honorary.

746 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:57:31pm

re: #743 oaktree

Pyle had essentially cracked and gone psychotic. Which made him "functional" in a military basic training sense if you weren't paying close attention. Joker noticed since he'd been mentoring Pyle, but apparently never brought it up in an official manner. Which arguably was a downside of that training style.

Yep. The best route in a modern situation would be to just let Pyle go. That's what was done in WWII.

747 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:57:56pm

re: #744 Gus 802

I'm not moralizing on the subject, it does make for better soldiers, just noting that a certain element of, well, dehumanization is totally intentional.

748 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:58:06pm

Are we going to start debating the character of folks who participate in an ~ all volunteer ~ military?

749 windsagio  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 8:58:47pm

re: #748 prairiefire

Are we going to start debating the character of folks who participate in an ~ all volunteer ~ military?

only the character of fictional folks >>

750 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:00:04pm

re: #747 windsagio

I'm not moralizing on the subject, it does make for better soldiers, just noting that a certain element of, well, dehumanization is totally intentional.

Of course. I mean you would have to dehumanize yourself already if you're putting yourself in a situation where you very well may be killed. You go in knowing that you're already dead. All it takes is one bullet.

751 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:00:36pm

re: #748 prairiefire

Are we going to start debating the character of folks who participate in an ~ all volunteer ~ military?

No. But it should be noted that it tends to change people. And that is partially due to the psychological work that is purposefully done as part of the initial training. And I can't say that the change is always good or always bad - it a case by case thing.

752 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:00:36pm

re: #748 prairiefire

Are we going to start debating the character of folks who participate in an ~ all volunteer ~ military?

God and country?

753 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:01:39pm

I remember registering for the draft. I was already a rebel by then. It felt rather strange. It makes you think about death. Your death.

754 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:02:51pm

re: #753 Gus 802

Gone by the time I was "of age". Now people just bitch about Jury Duty like that is the end of the world.

755 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:05:55pm

re: #754 Slumbering Behemoth

Gone by the time I was "of age". Now people just bitch about Jury Duty like that is the end of the world.

Let's bring back the levee en masse' and teach these yutes some real discipline!

Fairly disgusting article in the paper today. Four young adults (age 18-23) ordered a pizza to be delivered to an abandoned house address, ambushed the deliveryman, killed him, and all they took was the pizza. So a 29-year-old father is dead due to idiots wanting to steal an $11 pizza.

756 Achilles Tang  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:06:01pm

re: #739 windsagio

Well they're also intentionally breaking people down mentally in order to make them more obedient/better soldiers.

You call training to fight, and kill, to be "breaking down mentally"?

757 Targetpractice  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:07:21pm

re: #754 Slumbering Behemoth

Gone by the time I was "of age". Now people just bitch about Jury Duty like that is the end of the world.

Call me weird, but I wouldn't mind serving jury duty. Mostly because I find court proceedings fascinating.

758 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:09:20pm

re: #754 Slumbering Behemoth

Gone by the time I was "of age". Now people just bitch about Jury Duty like that is the end of the world.

It's a lot easier to get out of jury duty.

//

759 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:09:23pm

re: #756 Naso Tang

You call training to fight, and kill, to be "breaking down mentally"?

I think he is referring to the early stages of basic training that are trying to break down individuality and form the basis for the group mentality and quick reaction to orders they desire soldiers to have.

They're also training to instill understanding that they will be expected to fight and kill and that the behavior is acceptable.

760 Gus  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:10:25pm

re: #759 oaktree

I think he referring to the early stages of basic training that are trying to break down individuality and form the basis for the group mentality and quick reaction to orders they desire soldiers to have.

There also training to instill understanding that they will be expected to fight and kill and that the behavior is acceptable.

True. And sometimes it is acceptable.

761 prairiefire  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:17:30pm

re: #752 Gus 802

God and country?

I just think these folks have a natural propensity to military life as they are "volunteering" to have that career. In the place of the many who do not.

762 simoom  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:22:33pm

re: #629 Dark_Falcon

He just seemed a bit pale and ill is all.

I'm wondering if the whole thing isn't just being blown out of proportion. Here's the video of the exchange (you can just see the tops of their heads and hear the whine of the jet engines):

It just doesn't seem that animated. The President is still smiling as he side-steps to the next person in the receiving delegation, and then the next.

Perhaps they greeted each other, she hands him her letter, they agree to meet and he he gently ribs her about how she spun their last meeting, and they have a brief, relatively cordial conversation (though perhaps speaking loudly over the engines). Shortly afterward Gov. Brewer approaches the local media to paint the exchange favorably, something about how she was promoting the "Arizona Comeback", but they end up mainly being interested in the bit about her book.

Her campaign strategists, seeing the pool photo that came out of the meeting, and realizing the opportunity presented by it then have her make the rounds, doing interviews on right-wing radio stations and then Greta van Susteran's FNC show, spinning the whole thing so that she becomes the disrespected, aggrieved heroine who stood up to the hated, arrogant usurper :P. That wouldn't be so different from what occurred in the past, were she at first described her White House meeting positively to the press, but later in her book retconed it and then made the RW-media rounds.

763 Fred72  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:32:15pm

Speaking of Newt, has anybody else noticed the uncanny resemblance?

[Link: imgur.com...]

764 simoom  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:37:09pm

re: #762 simoom

Heh, the CNN write-up now has video of Gov Brewer doing some sort of evening press availability on her brief greeting delegation exchange:
[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]

Apparently she went from the tarmac greeting to local reporters, to some right-wing radio appearances, to Fox News and then this. She's really milking it.

765 theheat  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 9:51:56pm

I just had a discussion today about all the rabid statements made against minorities, people of certain ethnic groups, and Muslims, made by the current GOP candidates. I get the feeling, still, that any of these flaming assholes will still be preferable to Obama, and it really doesn't matter which one.

To vote for politicians who actively defame, humiliate, and marginalize entire groups of people, to me, is the same as saying you condone it. Maybe you didn't outright agree with it, but you'll give it a pass because the bigger goal is to unseat the current POTUS.

In the broad brush category, I don't really make distinctions in groups like multiple murders. I'd say they all suck. Wife beaters as a group, I'm comfortable with the broad brush of they suck. Pedophiles, broad brush applies. Terrorists, rapists, broad brush applies. Fuck the lot of 'em.

There's a saying, "A good horse is never a bad color." And by the same token, a good person is never a bad color, or a bad religion. To look the other way while these pandering jackasses make such ignorant and hateful statements about groups of people - people who you know as your friends, family, coworkers - is to really spit in the face of good and decent people everywhere. It's not just shameful, it's immoral.

766 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 10:58:20pm

re: #589 SanFranciscoZionist

How sure are we that this guy is Walter?

Absolutely sure.

767 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jan 25, 2012 11:07:45pm

re: #482 Obdicut

But it could all be just fake shit. Outside of a forensic setting, you can't prove the veracity of emails, and the source is, well, tainted, to say the least.

Listening to liars is a dedication to foolishness.

Well, it's not entirely correct.
First of all, there are ways to publicly prove at least some emails to be authentic. See DKIM signatures.
Second, the source is only "tainted" in that the source is a scumbag on a mission. However, unless the source is shown to have posted at least one suspicious email (i.e. until the first denial or demonstrable fake), there isn't really a reason not to provisionally accept what is posted. Sure, the doubt is there, but not so strong as to simply reject everything out of hand.


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