Pat Buchanan Is Finally Fired From MSNBC

Old school racist whines
Wingnuts • Views: 41,095

It wasn’t clear whether Pat Buchanan had actually been fired from MSNBC or not, but tonight the grizzled old racist confirms it in a monumentally whiny article titled: The New Blacklist.

My days as a political analyst at MSNBC have come to an end.

After 10 enjoyable years, I am departing, after an incessant clamor from the left that to permit me continued access to the microphones of MSNBC would be an outrage against decency, and dangerous.

The calls for my firing began almost immediately with the Oct. 18 publication of “Suicide of a Superpower: Will America Survive to 2025?”

A group called Color of Change, whose mission statement says that it “exists to strengthen Black America’s political voice,” claimed that my book espouses a “white supremacist ideology.” Color of Change took particular umbrage at the title of Chapter 4, “The End of White America.”

Media Matters parroted the party line: He has blasphemed!

A Human Rights Campaign that bills itself as America’s leading voice for lesbians, bisexuals, gays and transgendered people said that Buchanan’s “extremist ideas are incredibly harmful to millions of LBGT people around the world.”

Their rage was triggered by a remark to NPR’s Diane Rehm — that I believe homosexual acts to be “unnatural and immoral.”

On Nov. 2, Abe Foxman of the Anti-Defamation League, who has sought to have me censored for 22 years, piled on.

“Buchanan has shown himself, time and again, to be a racist and an anti-Semite,” said Foxman. Buchanan “bemoans the destruction of white Christian America” and says America’s shrinking Jewish population is due to the “collective decision of Jews themselves.”

Well, yes, I do bemoan what Newsweek’s 2009 cover called “The Decline and Fall of Christian America” and editor Jon Meacham described as “The End of Christian America.” After all, I am a Christian.

And what else explains the shrinkage of the U.S. Jewish population by 6 percent in the 1990s and its projected decline by another 50 percent by 2050, if not the “collective decision of Jews themselves”?

Let error be tolerated, said Thomas Jefferson, “so long as reason is left free to combat it.” What Foxman and ADL are about in demanding that my voice be silenced is, in the Jeffersonian sense, intrinsically un-American.

Consider what it is these people are saying.

Well, here’s what I’ve been saying: an LGF search page for all our articles about Pat Buchanan, and I stand by every one.

He should have been fired a long time ago.

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687 comments
1 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:45:16pm

10 years too late.

2 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:45:29pm

Whiny bitch is whiny.

I hope they gave him a golden doorstop as a going away present so the door doesn't hit his ass on the way out.

3 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:47:39pm

This is bad news. Now he has time to work on the time machine he wants to use to take us out of WWII and stop the federal government getting involved with the civil rights movement.......This was a grave mistake.///

4 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:48:02pm

Repost:

"After 10 enjoyable years, I am departing, after an incessant clamor from the left that to permit me continued access to the microphones of MSNBC would be an outrage against decency, and dangerous."

I don't know how to tell you this Pat, but I'm not from "the left", and I've been sick of you're shit for a lot longer than most of the young folk from "the left". Fuck off, and goodbye.

5 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:49:39pm

re: #3 The Yankee

This is bad news. Now he has time to work on the time machine he wants to use to take us out of WWII and take away women's rights to vote...This was a grave mistake.///

If that douchebag had a time machine, we'd all be saying "The North Will Rise Again" today.

I hope the door did hit him in the ass on the way out.

6 HappyWarrior  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:49:57pm

Auf Wiedersen, fascist fuck.

7 darthstar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:50:43pm

Buh-bye, bigot.

8 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:52:41pm

I decided to change that comment cause I don't ever remember him saying anything negative about women's right to vote. I do recall him sounding like Paul Ryan when it came to the Civil Rights movement.

9 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:52:54pm

Rachel's reporting that there was a shooting in a Cali Federal bldg. One death.

10 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:52:55pm

So, they put a tracking collar on him and released him into the right wing wilds to trace migration patterns? Let the science commence!
/

11 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:53:46pm

re: #6 HappyWarrior

"Say Auf Wiedersen to your Nazi balls"

- Hugo Stiglitz

12 HappyWarrior  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:53:49pm

The thing I recall most about Pat B is that he loves him some Joe McCarthy and Francisco Franco. His attacks on Churchill and interventionism during WWII also quite pathetic.

13 Tigger2  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:53:56pm

Buchanan finally got what he deserved, I'm doing the happy dance.

14 Firstinla  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:54:44pm

I've been feeling crappy all day: fighting the flu and a cold. But this news makes me feel good all over. Maybe more racists fucks will be hitting the unemployment line with him.

15 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:54:57pm

re: #5 Slumbering Behemoth

If that douchebag had a time machine, we'd all be saying "The North Will Rise Again" today.

I hope the door did hit him in the ass on the way out.

More like the border states of the North demanding that the govt build them a fence to keep all of the illegal immigrants from the Confederate States of America out. ;)

16 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:55:30pm

re: #14 Firstinla

I've been feeling crappy all day: fighting the flu and a cold. But this news makes me feel good all over. Maybe more racists fucks will be hitting the unemployment line with him.

Not as long as FOX News is still around.

17 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:56:19pm

re: #9 They're pants, essentially...

Whoa...

An immigration officer was injured in a shootout and the gunman reportedly was fatally shot in the head at the Long Beach Federal Building shortly before 6 p.m. Thursday, Long Beach police told NBCLosAngeles.com.

At least one U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement officer sustained a gunshot wound in the incident on the seventh floor of the building, at 501 W. Ocean Blvd, police said. He was taken to a nearby hospital.

18 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:56:28pm

So when does he get hired by Fox News?

19 Meitantei  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:57:21pm

re: #16 moderatelyradicalliberal

Buchannan outdid all of those people on FOX, really quite an accomplishment. A worthless Hitler lover, and when he dies, I'll piss on his grave.

20 Tigger2  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:57:42pm

re: #18 Gus

So when does he get hired by Fox News?

He secretly worked for Fox all along.

21 General Nimrod Bodfish  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:58:04pm

re: #9 They're pants, essentially...

Rachel's reporting that there was a shooting in a Cali Federal bldg. One death.

According to this, an ICE (Immigration and Customs Enforcement) agent fired on two of his own, killing one before the suspect was killed.

22 darthstar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 6:58:56pm

re: #6 HappyWarrior

Auf Wiedersen, fascist fuck.

One day you're in, the next day you're 'Aufed'...

23 Only The Lurker Knows  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:00:45pm

Night Lizards. May The Deity of Your Choice Smile Down Upon You.

And Pat, May you burn in the hell of your own making.

24 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:02:28pm

One thing I will never forget, is how Rachel Maddow said he was such a nice guy. Sure, racists are always friendly and polite in the elevator, and they don't go out and attack you personally (in order to keep their job) but get your fucking radar up. They are your enemy in the most basic way.

We need to be stronger in our daily life, not to accept this shit. To stand up.

Kudos MSNBC.

25 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:02:58pm

Is it really a big mystery why they guy who wrote "Let Detroit Go Bankrupt" is losing the Michigan polls?

Just thinking out loud here...

26 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:03:01pm

re: #23 Bubblehead II

And Pat, May you burn in the hell of your own making.

"I already am, son. I already am".

/Paraphrased Pumpkinhead

27 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:03:44pm

You guys probably think that Buchanan is just a clownish and marginal political figure, with some influence on the paleo-right and that's that.
Well, he and his books about the survival of the white race, as well as many of his political stances are very popular among Russian nationalists. Buchanan spread his poison far and wide.

28 Linden Arden  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:04:08pm

re: #19 Meitantei

Buchannan outdid all of those people on FOX, really quite an accomplishment. A worthless Hitler lover, and when he dies, I'll piss on his grave.

I despise Hannity more. Hannity is a full-time liar along with all the bad qualities Buchanan has. Buchanan was critical of Bush and the Iraq War while Hannity is a partisan liar every second of the day.

29 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:04:18pm

Mr. Friess is trying to defend his "joke" on O'Donnell now.

30 darthstar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:04:43pm

re: #23 Bubblehead II

Night Lizards. May The Deity of Your Choice Smile Down Upon You.

And Pat, May you burn in the hell of your own making.

My wish for Pat is that he realizes, at some point, that there is nothing after.

31 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:05:34pm

re: #24 2012. Birth Control is NOT a political issue.

Though I agree with you in spirit, I can not give any kudos to MSNBC.

That would be like giving someone credit for doing shit they're supposed to be doing anyway, like parents not beating their kids.

32 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:06:06pm

re: #28 Linden Arden

I despise Hannity more. Hannity is a full-time liar along with all the bad qualities Buchanan has. Buchanan was critical of Bush and the Iraq War while Hannity is a partisan liar every second of the day.

Hannity has a face that looks like it's dying for several fists to punish it.

34 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:06:18pm

He just equated what the administration did to forcing a Jewish soup kitchen to serve ham...

35 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:06:47pm

re: #4 Slumbering Behemoth

Repost:

I don't know how to tell you this Pat, but I'm not from "the left", and I've been sick of you're shit for a lot longer than most of the young folk from "the left". Fuck off, and goodbye.

Dittos.

The fat Dittohead should be next.

36 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:07:38pm

re: #29 They're pants, essentially...

Mr. Friess is trying to defend his "joke" on O'Donnell now.

As I place my Bayer in the spot.

No fun for me, loser woman.

37 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:07:44pm

re: #27 e_e

I'm sorry. If I could have done anything to prevent that, I would have.

38 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:08:03pm

re: #29 They're pants, essentially...

Mr. Friess is trying to defend his "joke" on O'Donnell now.

He says he's been "blessed" by contraception. His wealth allows him and his wife no barriers to contraception, but screw anybody else who can't afford it. Typical winger: "Screw you, I got mine".

39 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:08:10pm

re: #31 Slumbering Behemoth

Though I agree with you in spirit, I can not give any kudos to MSNBC.

That would be like giving someone credit for doing shit they're supposed to be doing anyway, like parents not beating their kids.

ya.

40 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:08:13pm

re: #29 They're pants, essentially...

He either has no idea of Santorum's positions or is a giant liar.

41 nines09  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:09:29pm

MSNBC needs to do an internal soul searching and figure out WTF took them so long to cut this piece of flotsam loose. Just the fact that he was on TV gave some credence to his vile and bigoted fascist views. About time. Past due. Finally.

42 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:09:33pm

Blessed by contraception, are the owner class.

43 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:10:09pm

re: #40 jaunte

He either has no idea of Santorum's positions or is a giant liar.

Or he doesn't care. He's rich enough that any restriction on personal behavior that the right wing would enact wouldn't affect him. He can overlook social issues and just focus in on taxes. Isn't that the typical rich Republican attitude?

44 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:10:40pm

re: #40 jaunte

He either has no idea of Santorum's positions or is a giant liar.

Damage control.

All I know is the Ron Paul flirty girl said today, after I broadcast the GOP being against contraception...Well, I'll vote for Obama to keep these assholes out.

45 HappyWarrior  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:10:59pm

Reads like typical fuck you I got mine like mentality. And Freiss your joke wasn't funny. Your candidate of choice though he is quite funny.

46 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:11:33pm

re: #41 nines09

MSNBC needs to do an internal soul searching and figure out WTF took them so long to cut this piece of flotsam loose. Just the fact that he was on TV gave some credence to his vile and bigoted fascist views. About time. Past due. Finally.

I'm curious if he was fired or if his contract ran out and they didn't renew it. He's been talking this smack for a long time. I'm not complaining, but why fire him now?

47 Charles Johnson  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:11:48pm

Foster Friess compares contraception coverage to forcing Muslims to serve pork in their soup kitchens.

48 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:11:49pm

“Santorum will tell you what you believe.”

49 HappyWarrior  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:12:48pm

I think this Freiss guy may be an even bigger douche than the Kochs.

50 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:14:11pm

re: #49 HappyWarrior

I think this Freiss guy may be an even bigger douche than the Kochs.

No. Just no.

51 Interesting Times  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:14:43pm
52 HappyWarrior  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:14:49pm

re: #50 They're pants, essentially...

No. Just no.

They all suck the same if you ask me.

53 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:15:07pm

re: #49 HappyWarrior

I think this Freiss guy may be an even bigger douche than the Kochs.

not as dangerous, though

54 HappyWarrior  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:15:30pm

re: #51 Interesting Times

Government hands off my wood.

55 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:15:55pm

re: #47 Charles Johnson

Am I missing something here? I thought that the contraceptive coverage rule was for those receiving federal funds. In other words, you could still offer insurance that doesn't cover contraception as long as you're not receiving federal money.

Do I have that wrong?

56 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:19:11pm

Andrew Katz @katz

"I don't think there's any story worth dying for, but I do think there are stories worth taking risks for." - Anthony Shadid

57 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:23:03pm

re: #54 HappyWarrior

Government hands off my wood.

"Our hands are no where near your wood, because your hands are in the way. Always. Seriously son, take a break before you yank that thing completely off".

- Your Gov't

58 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:24:21pm

re: #55 Slumbering Behemoth

Am I missing something here? I thought that the contraceptive coverage rule was for those receiving federal funds. In other words, you could still offer insurance that doesn't cover contraception as long as you're not receiving federal money.

Do I have that wrong?

Nope. My basic understanding (without links, so correct as needed) is that a religious employer who disagrees with the coverage will not have to offer it. But the insurance company, direct to the policy holder will. No Churchy involved. The bishops were not happy with that.

Then, the GOP is introducing a bill that ANY employer can deny ANY coverage it disagrees with. Stupidity trying to go with the hate flow.

Correct and elaborate peeps.

59 freetoken  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:25:13pm

re: #55 Slumbering Behemoth

Am I missing something here? I thought that the contraceptive coverage rule was for those receiving federal funds.

I've been under the impression that the rule was to be applied to any participating element of "Obamacare", whether it be the insurance pools or the service providers.

60 Ojoe  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:26:25pm

Buchanan had insulting ideas about Abe Lincoln IIRC.

Good riddance.

61 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:26:47pm

I know it's been said a million times before, but it just can't be said enough...

Fuck Pat Buchanan.

62 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:27:27pm

Ojoe logs in. Ojoe logs out. I can't explain that! //

63 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:28:14pm

re: #62 e_e

Ojoe logs in. Ojoe logs out. I can't explain that! //

I do that quite a bit myself. What are you trying to say?

64 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:28:30pm

re: #58 2012. Birth Control is NOT a political issue.

Nope. My basic understanding (without links, so correct as needed) is that a religious employer who disagrees with the coverage will not have to offer it. But the insurance company, direct to the policy holder will. No Churchy involved. The bishops were not happy with that.

Then, the GOP is introducing a bill that ANY employer can deny ANY coverage it disagrees with. Stupidity trying to go with the hate flow.

Correct and elaborate peeps.

Yep that is pretty much correct. If you are a person working for Georgetown and want to get the pill you just have to get it by directly contacting your Health Care provider.

65 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:28:41pm

Being famous is not the same thing as being right.

It's not the same as being wrong, either.

It has no bearing on it.

66 Linden Arden  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:30:40pm

re: #58 2012. Birth Control is NOT a political issue.

Could an organization run by Jehovah's Witness's deny secular employees blood transfusions based on their beliefs?

To me, this is a devastating line of attack. No one would deprive simple modern blood transfusions that saves lives to maintain religious purity.

67 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:30:44pm

re: #61 Slumbering Behemoth

I know it's been said a million times before, but it just can't be said enough...

Fuck Pat Buchanan.

Yep. And also let's not forget his history, specifically his once prominent position in the Republican party. Lest people continue saying that the GOP went bonkers only after 2008.

68 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:31:30pm

re: #66 Linden Arden

Could an organization run by Jehovah's Witness's deny secular employees blood transfusions based on their beliefs?

To me, this is a devastating line of attack. No one would deprive simple modern blood transfusions that saves lives to maintain religious purity.

Just to their children.
(wish I could sarc that, but it's true.)

69 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:31:42pm

Slumbering Behemoth logs in. Slumbering Behemoth logs out. I can't explain that! //

70 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:31:54pm

re: #65 Meh.

Also...

71 freetoken  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:31:59pm

re: #67 e_e

PaleoPat was brought into prominence by none other than Richard Milhouse Nixon. That should pretty much be a clue.

72 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:32:02pm

re: #69 Gus

Slumbering Behemoth logs in. Slumbering Behemoth logs out. I can't explain that! //

Sleep-blogging?

73 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:32:24pm

re: #69 Gus

damnyou :P

74 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:32:40pm

This crazy GOP stuff seems to be happening more frequently. Maybe it's just the past week.

75 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:33:25pm

The thing that bothers me the most about this is that the same people that were trying to push the idea that the condom doesn't help prevent AIDs and probably the myth that the pill can cause infertility are the same people having so much influence in this debate.

76 freetoken  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:33:34pm

re: #74 jaunte

This crazy GOP stuff seems to be happening more frequently. Maybe it's just the past week.

We're definitely seeing a crescendo. It may not be the last movement, though. I think we are looking at a Wagnerian class opera ring here.

77 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:33:39pm

re: #74 jaunte

This crazy GOP stuff seems to be happening more frequently. Maybe it's just the past week.

Reverse half-life. Leading to the final fusion and implosion as the GOP reduces to a single pure member. Who then declares themselves a RINO.

78 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:34:01pm

re: #74 jaunte

I think the GOP primaries have brought more national focus on the wingnuttery.

79 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:35:01pm

re: #74 jaunte

This crazy GOP stuff seems to be happening more frequently. Maybe it's just the past week.

Sometimes I just take step back and look, and can't believe.

Ann Coulter is a moderate now?

80 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:35:03pm

re: #77 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Reverse half-life. Leading to the final fusion and implosion as the GOP reduces to a single pure member. Who then declares themselves a RINO.

Don't you mean GOP Highlander.

81 prairiefire  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:35:07pm

re: #58 2012. Birth Control is NOT a political issue.

Babe, I think you got it.

82 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:36:27pm

Yes, there are insane Delegates in Virginia:

During the floor debate on Tuesday, Del. C. Todd Gilbert announced that “in the vast majority of these cases, these [abortions] are matters of lifestyle convenience.” (He has since apologized.) Virginia Democrat Rep. David Englin, who opposes the bill, has said Gilbert’s statement “is in line with previous Republican comments on the issue,” recalling one conversation with a GOP lawmaker who told him that women had already made the decision to be “vaginally penetrated when they got pregnant.” (I confirmed with Englin that this quote was accurate.)

That’s the same logic that animates the bill’s sponsor in the House of Delegates, Del. Kathy J. Byron, who insisted this week that, “if we want to talk about invasiveness, there’s nothing more invasive than the procedure that she is about to have.” Decoded, that means that if you are willing to submit to sex and/or an abortion, the state should be allowed to penetrate your body as well.
[Link: www.slate.com...]

83 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:36:46pm

re: #77 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Super-fans are super pissed that not a peep has been made by Valve about any potential upcoming title in the series.

Me? I am content to be surprised, so long as they release something good.

84 Firstinla  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:36:57pm

re: #79 e_e

Sometimes I just take step back and look, and can't believe.

Ann Coulter is a moderate now?

The Republican clown car contained more than just those presidential candidates.

/

85 blueraven  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:37:04pm

re: #81 prairiefire

Babe, I think you got it.

Aspirin...it's birth control, essentially.

86 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:38:10pm

The Overton window is stretched to the limits.

87 Interesting Times  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:39:16pm

re: #86 e_e

The Overton window is stretched to the limits.

And the GOP has defenestrated itself (while attempting to drag as much of the country down with it as possible)

88 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:39:28pm

re: #82 jaunte

... recalling one conversation with a GOP lawmaker who told him that women had already made the decision to be “vaginally penetrated when they got pregnant.”

Words fail me. There isn't a weapons grade facepalm big enough for that.

89 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:39:37pm

re: #80 The Yankee

Don't you mean GOP Highlander.

Not enough decapitated GOP candidates about for it to be that. Though apparently Santorum thinks Obama might be an immortal.
/

90 prairiefire  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:39:53pm

re: #85 blueraven

Aspirin...it's birth control, essentially.

What makes me furious is, if men had wombs, the morning after pill would have been invented in 1943. Fuckers

91 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:40:38pm

re: #86 e_e

OVERTON SCREEN DOOR!!!

92 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:41:10pm

re: #85 blueraven

Aspirin...it's birth control, essentially.

Lysol use to be a form of birth control and it is less then $5 to buy. I suggest you gals buy some of that after Rick becomes our next Prez....I am totally buy a ton of stock in that company.
re: #79 e_e

Sometimes I just take step back and look, and can't believe.

Ann Coulter is a moderate now?

Ann was the one who said that this country would be better off if women were allowed to vote, not Pat. Sorry, Pat might of been in the same room though when she said it.

93 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:42:10pm

By posting this link I do NOT endorse it as 100% factual. But it is of interest to this blog:

[Link: www.dailykos.com...]

94 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:42:49pm

re: #90 prairiefire

If men had wombs, "Not Tonight, I Have A Headache" would be the national motto, printed on our money.

95 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:42:52pm

re: #90 prairiefire

What makes me furious is, if men had wombs, the morning after pill would have been invented in 1943. Fuckers

Thus the joking reference to all Viagra prescriptions requiring catheterizing to go with it. :p

(Which I don't find amusing due to adventures with the search for kidney stones.)

96 goddamnedfrank  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:43:32pm

Wait, is this for real?:

FARMINGTON HILLS, Mich. – Hours after General Motors announced that it earned its highest profit in its storied history last year, Mitt Romney said he is “delighted” at its success and took credit for the managed bankruptcy that helped to rescue the struggling corporation, saying he “recommended [it] from the very beginning.”

“I love the businesses of this state, I love the auto industry. I want to see it thrive and grow,” said Romney, speaking at a luncheon at the Greater Farmington-Livonia Chamber of Commerce. “I’m glad it went through a managed bankruptcy process, which I recommended from the very beginning, to shed unnecessary costs and get its footing again. I’m delighted it’s profitable.”

Does Romney actually think people are going to believe this crap, what the hell? I mean, this has to be the most craven, outright lying, triple lutz of a flip flop in US political history. This is why people hate the man, it's impossible to believe a word he says.

97 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:43:34pm

re: #94 Slumbering Behemoth

If men had wombs, "Not Tonight, I Have A Headache" would be the national motto, printed on our money.

And abortion would be in the bill of rights.

98 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:44:33pm

re: #97 e_e

And abortion would be in the bill of rights.

And the uterine replicator would have been invented as part of the Space Race.

99 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:45:08pm

re: #90 prairiefire

What makes me furious is, if men had wombs, the morning after pill would have been invented in 1943. Fuckers

Repeated for emphasis!

100 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:45:42pm

re: #76 freetoken

We're definitely seeing a crescendo. It may not be the last movement, though. I think we are looking at a Wagnerian class opera ring here.

I think we'll be heading into precious bodily fluid territory before long...

101 prairiefire  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:45:53pm

re: #94 Slumbering Behemoth

If men had wombs, "Not Tonight, I Have A Headache" would be the national motto, printed on our money.

Well, there are the 3-4 days of menses, total bliss.

102 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:46:20pm

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

103 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:46:34pm

re: #101 prairiefire

LOL!
Don't you want to give some of that bliss to men?

104 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:46:44pm

re: #96 goddamnedfrank

Does Romney actually think people are going to believe this crap, what the hell?

He's counting on our overly short political memories. The sad thing is, that's usually a safe bet.

105 TheSwedish  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:46:45pm

Sigh. Now that Buchanan is gone, I'm sure Joan Walsh will once more tie herself in knots saying that-while she really, really, REALLY won't miss the guy-he deserves a hearing because he reminds her of her old - world Catholic relatives (that is hugely unfair to her relatives, methinks).

106 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:46:48pm

re: #99 Floral Giraffe

Repeated for emphasis!

Is it my imagination, or did the pill get invented right when blood tests were being developed to accurately identify fathers of children.

Going to look that up.

107 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:46:51pm

The pill would be available in over-the-counter form.

108 Interesting Times  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:46:54pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

...a world population that's actually sustainable?

109 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:46:54pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

There is the winner of "what would you do if you were Satan".

110 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:46:55pm

re: #94 Slumbering Behemoth

If men had wombs, "Not Tonight, I Have A Headache" would be the national motto, printed on our money.

You were the ones that ate the apple, not us....//

111 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:47:58pm

re: #109 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

There is the winner of "what would you do if you were Satan".

Pack of smokes. Six pack. And some RU-486.

Paper please.

112 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:47:59pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

... stretch marks?

:ducks and runs:

113 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:48:08pm
Proposed Bill Calls for Ultrasound Before Abortion
Lynchburg, VA – Republican Del. Kathy Bryon is once again proposing a bill that would require a pregnant woman to have an ultrasound before an abortion.

Bryon, who represents the 22nd District, says she is more confident in it this time around, calling the bill "medically responsible."
....
Bryon's bill would also require a two-hour waiting period after the ultrasound.

After the government-mandated wanding, a government-mandated timeout.

114 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:49:40pm

re: #107 Gus

The pill would be available in over-the-counter form.

That's bullshit, and you know it.

In Altoids tins in the check out line.

115 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:49:43pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

How would one impregnate a man?

*runs away too*

116 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:49:51pm

"You've been a very bad girl. Sit. Stay."

117 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:50:16pm

re: #113 jaunte

After the government-mandated wanding, a government-mandated timeout.

Ties up the doctor's office even longer, makes for long appointments that will be less likely to be taken up, etc. All part of making the process as annoying and untenable to the woman as possible.

118 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:50:54pm

Whoa. Lawrence just took Limbaugh to the woodshed.

119 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:50:58pm

re: #115 e_e

How would one impregnate a man?

*runs away too*

What else? Immaculate conception. We're men remember?

//

120 HappyWarrior  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:51:06pm

re: #113 jaunte

After the government-mandated wanding, a government-mandated timeout.

More small government except it's not.

121 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:51:46pm

re: #115 e_e

How would one impregnate a man?

*runs away too*

Women would evolve ovipositors?

122 prairiefire  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:51:48pm

re: #103 Floral Giraffe

LOL!
Don't you want to give some of that bliss to mes?

I don't think anyone wants any of my current menopause induced rage. ***Waves***

123 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:51:59pm

re: #119 Gus

What else? Immaculate conception. We're men remember?

//

I suppose the gays/straights situation would get reversed./

124 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:52:17pm

re: #113 jaunte

Again I say, this is a violation of American's 4th amendment rights, and needs to be attacked as such.

125 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:52:23pm

re: #117 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

I don't see how they can force women to stay 2 hours after the procedure.

126 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:52:46pm

re: #123 e_e

I suppose the gays/straights situation would get reversed./

Away with immoral hetero marriage! They can't produce children!

127 sunnygal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:52:54pm

re: #66 Linden Arden

Yes, they could deny blood transfusions. And, a company owned by a Christian Scientist could deny any health care except Christian Scientists prayer healers.

128 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:52:56pm

No son of mine is going to be having no baby during regular season or any season for that matter. We've got football to play.

//

129 prairiefire  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:53:27pm

re: #116 jaunte

"You've been a very bad girl. Sit. Stay."

Painful.

130 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:53:43pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

Tricked out, gas powered strollers. NASCRIB!!!!

131 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:54:06pm

re: #107 Gus

The pill would be available in over-the-counter form.

I am so pissed. How dare they?

132 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:54:18pm

re: #125 jaunte

I don't see how they can force women to stay 2 hours after the procedure.

They can't force the woman to stay, but they then would have to refuse to give her the abortion if she failed to. At least that's how I see it.

133 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:55:05pm

re: #113 jaunte

After the government-mandated wanding, a government-mandated timeout.

IOKIYAS: It's OK if You're a State.

Remember it's only federal mandates that the right wing doesn't like. They are fine with state mandates. State's Rights, bitches! In this case literally.

134 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:56:25pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

Gov't mandated, paid maternity leave. 72 months.

135 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:56:26pm

re: #133 moderatelyradicalliberal

IOKIYAS: It's OK if You're a State.

Remember it's only federal mandates that the right wing doesn't like. They are fine with state mandates. State's Rights, bitches! In this case literally.

That's the big lie about Ron Paul, too. He's not against government power, just federal gov't power.

136 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:56:46pm

re: #133 moderatelyradicalliberal

IOKIYAS: It's OK if You're a State.

Remember it's only federal mandates that the right wing doesn't like. They are fine with state mandates. State's Rights, bitches! In this case literally.

Except for that federal mandate against gay marriage of course. And the one preventing... (etc).

Just like the definition of "activist judge". For it as long as it supports what I want.

137 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:56:50pm

re: #124 Slumbering Behemoth

Again I say, this is a violation of American's 4th amendment rights, and needs to be attacked as such.

Exactly, they are requiring that a woman have something stuck up in her body, hell the most private and intimate part of her body whether she wants it or not. This is basically dictating that doctors rape their patients with an object.

138 aagcobb  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:57:48pm

re: #118 They're pants, essentially...

Whoa. Lawrence just took Limbaugh to the woodshed.

You mean Rush? I listened to him angrily ranting today because the President is getting credit for the economic recovery. Made me smile.

139 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:58:20pm

re: #137 moderatelyradicalliberal

They're going to need a bunch of hall monitors to make sure the more ethical doctors who don't want to do it their way are forced to.

140 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:58:32pm

re: #134 Slumbering Behemoth

Gov't mandated, paid maternity leave. 72 months.

...paternity leave /pedant

141 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:59:22pm

re: #138 SantorumSurging

You mean Rush? I listened to him angrily ranting today because the President is getting credit for the economic recovery. Made me smile.

You mean the Canadian Band? Didn't know they were involved in american politics...

142 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:59:24pm

re: #134 Slumbering Behemoth

Gov't mandated, paid maternity leave. 72 months.

GOVERNMENT WARNING: (1) According to the Surgeon general, men should not drink alcoholic beverages during pregnancy because of the risk of birth defects. (2) Consumption of alcoholic beverages impairs your ability to drive a car or operate machinery, and may cause health problems.

Strike out! Can't have that.

143 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 7:59:51pm

re: #140 e_e

...paternity leave /pedant

The poor male seahorse just gets a quick "hello" from the spouse every morning.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

144 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:00:02pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

Awkward conversations like...

Bill: "Whoa Bob, that's quite the beer belly you're packing."

Bob: "Fuck you, Bill! I'm 8 months pregnant". :runs away crying:

/y'know, as opposed to "When are you due?"... "Fuck you, I'm not pregnant".

145 Dancing along the light of day  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:00:59pm

re: #122 prairiefire

I don't think anyone wants any of my current menopause induced rage. ***Waves***

Waves back, with a big HUG!

146 aagcobb  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:01:31pm

re: #144 Slumbering Behemoth

Awkward conversations like...

Bill: "Whoa Bob, that's quite the beer belly you're packing."

Bob: "Fuck you, Bill! I'm 8 months pregnant". :runs away crying:

/y'know, as opposed to "When are you due?"... "Fuck you, I'm not pregnant".

I thought my boss was pregnant awhile ago. Good thing I didn't ask, because she wasn't.

147 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:01:32pm

I am having too much fun, and it's all Gus's fault.

148 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:01:46pm

re: #139 jaunte

They're going to need a bunch of hall monitors to make sure the more ethical doctors who don't want to do it their way are forced to.

That's something else. They are putting doctors in a position in which they might have to violate their consciences and medical ethics. Doctors are supposed to do no harm, what if a doctor thinks this does do harm? Can they loss their licenses if they refuse? The ramifications of this seems pretty far reaching? And what about emergency situations in hospitals? I could go on and on and on.

149 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:01:49pm

OK, there's actually a sub-series of Oglaf comics exactly about the tribe of males who get pregnant... but I'm not going any further.

150 aagcobb  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:03:01pm

re: #148 moderatelyradicalliberal

That's something else. They are putting doctors in a position in which they might have to violate their consciences and medical ethics. Doctors are supposed to do no harm, what if a doctor thinks this does do harm? Can they loss their licenses if they refuse? The ramifications of this seems pretty far reaching? And what about emergency situations in hospitals? I could go on and on and on.

That is a feature, not a bug. They want to make it ethically impossible for Doctors to perform abortions.

151 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:04:01pm

No, no correlation. Paternity tests advanced in the 1920's, 1930's with blood tests, but then remained stuck until the 1970's.

The pill was advanced during the 1950's.

152 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:04:22pm

re: #144 Slumbering Behemoth

Awkward conversations like...

Bill: "Whoa Bob, that's quite the beer belly you're packing."

Bob: "Fuck you, Bill! I'm 8 months pregnant". :runs away crying:

/y'know, as opposed to "When are you due?"... "Fuck you, I'm not pregnant".

Found a way to combine the "Satan question" with the "pregnant men" question:

If I were Satan I'd make all the House Republican men pregnant overnight.

153 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:04:37pm

re: #140 e_e

...paternity leave /pedant

Now you're thinking with portals penis!

154 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:04:41pm

Wait, perhaps we're relaxing too soon? What sort of a bigot will MSNBC invite to replace ole Pat?

155 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:04:50pm

re: #147 Slumbering Behemoth

I am having too much fun, and it's all Gus's fault.

Enjoy it before I get into one my mood swings.

//

156 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:05:13pm

re: #152 Gus

HAIL SATAN!!!

157 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:05:14pm

re: #151 Meh.

No, no correlation. Paternity tests advanced in the 1920's, 1930's with blood tests, but then remained stuck until the 1970's.

The pill was advanced during the 1950's.

They use to use bunnies to see if your were prego right?

158 Robert O.  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:05:34pm

Pat Buchanan is just your typical "racialist" Paleo-conservative. Every generation gets one. Pat Buchanan is so 1990s. Today's Paleo-conservatives are enthralled with Ron Paul.

159 moderatelyradicalliberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:05:42pm

re: #152 Gus

Found a way to combine the "Satan question" with the "pregnant men" question:

If I were Satan I'd make all the House Republican men pregnant overnight.

Oh come on. Think of the children, won't you? They don't deserve that.

160 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:05:43pm

re: #151 Meh.

No, no correlation. Paternity tests advanced in the 1920's, 1930's with blood tests, but then remained stuck until the 1970's.

The pill was advanced during the 1950's.

Makes one wonder if that is partially due to women getting heavily into the job markets and further into the military with WW2. Thus greater interest in medical conditions that affected a greater part of the work force.

161 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:06:14pm

re: #157 The Yankee

They use to use bunnies to see if your were prego right?

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

162 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:06:20pm

re: #159 moderatelyradicalliberal

Oh come on. Think of the children, won't you? They don't deserve that.

Mr. Mom

Pregnant and with a chainsaw.

163 SpaceJesus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:06:29pm

go play race war someplace else, pat

164 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:07:33pm

re: #157 The Yankee

"You can't catch me 'cause the rabbit done died".

165 The Yankee  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:08:30pm

re: #161 Meh.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

I actually learned about this from a MASH episode. I shit you not.

166 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:08:41pm

"If you were Satan what would you do?"

"Well. I'd make Rick Santorum pregnant of course."

"I'd turn Pat Buchanan into a Jewish black guy."

//

167 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:09:04pm

re: #165 The Yankee

I actually learned about this from a MASH episode. I shit you not.

Erma Bombeck.

168 Mocking Jay  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:09:12pm

re: #163 SpaceJesus

go play race war someplace else, pat

I hear Ron Paul has a newsletter that hasn't gotten much use lately.

169 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:09:17pm

re: #159 moderatelyradicalliberal

Oh come on. Think of the children, won't you? They don't deserve that.

Not to worry. They'd be preforming late term abortions right there on the House floor that very night.

170 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:10:27pm

re: #166 Gus

"If you were Satan what would you do?"

"Well. I'd make Rick Santorum pregnant of course."

"I'd turn Pat Buchanan into a Jewish black guy."

//

Those sounds more like the actions of a Just God than those of an Evil Adversary.

171 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:10:48pm

re: #170 Slumbering Behemoth

Those sounds more like the actions of a Just God than those of an Evil Adversary.

I know.

172 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:19:04pm

re: #164 Slumbering Behemoth

"You can't catch me 'cause the rabbit done died".

Yep. "The rabbit died" was the old saying.

173 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:20:12pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

... already invented a Portable Quantum Tunneling Device to extract the baby without having to experience the pain of childbirth.

174 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:21:17pm

re: #172 Gus

Yep. "The rabbit died" was the old saying.

Of course, the rabbit died for the necessary surgery, so the rabbit died regardless.

175 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:21:51pm

re: #174 Meh.

Of course, the rabbit died for the necessary surgery, so the rabbit died regardless.

Yep.

176 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:22:11pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

... completely outlawed "abstinence only" education in every school centuries ago.

177 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:24:01pm

Heh.

If men got pregnant we'd have a lot more dried seahorse use in Chinese medicine.

178 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:24:17pm

re: #176 Slumbering Behemoth

... completely outlawed "abstinence only" education in every school centuries ago.

...free contraception in every school...

179 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:25:04pm

re: #174 Meh.

Of course, the rabbit died for the necessary surgery, so the rabbit died regardless.

Not easy being a bunny.

180 erik_t  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:26:57pm

Good fucking riddance, you worthless racist piece of garbage.

181 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:28:19pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

... Costco offering free vasectomies with every purchase of $2 or more.

182 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:28:23pm

Imagine if you will some wingnut reading this over at Newsmax: Fox News Poll: Obama Leads Republican Candidates in Swing States

183 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:29:54pm

re: #181 Slumbering Behemoth

... Costco offering free vasectomies with every purchase of $2 or more.

Planned Parenthood would be overfunded. ;)

184 engineer cat  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:29:55pm

“The Decline and Fall of Christian America”

has been happening at least since americans stopped spending christmas in church and began to adapt pagan ceremonies such as tree decorating and gift parties

face it, civilization has been declining ever since they began to let temple scribes write records in akkadian instead of good old sumerian

185 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:30:47pm

re: #182 Gus

Polls aren't scientific/don't matter anyway.
/

186 engineer cat  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:31:02pm

re: #182 Gus

Imagine if you will some wingnut reading this over at Newsmax: Fox News Poll: Obama Leads Republican Candidates in Swing States

wingnuts in general are gullible and easily led anywhere

187 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:31:27pm

re: #185 Slumbering Behemoth

Polls aren't scientific/don't matter anyway.
/

Obviously they need to bring back Generic Republican™.

188 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:32:43pm

re: #183 Gus

Planned Parenthood would be overfunded. ;)

With twice the worldwide locations as McDonald's, and drive-thrus at every one.

189 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:32:59pm

Instead they brought out Dufus Millionaire. Old Fashioned Sweater Vest Dork. Whacko Gingrich and Crazy Uncle Paul.

Derp!

190 jaunte  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:33:10pm

re: #182 Gus

Imagine if you will some wingnut reading this over at Newsmax: Fox News Poll: Obama Leads Republican Candidates in Swing States

"I deny your reality and substitute my own"
[Link: www.google.com...]

191 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:33:57pm

re: #190 jaunte

"I deny your reality and substitute my own"
[Link: www.google.com...]

OWS will probably lead to Obama being crushed come November!!11ty

192 ProGunLiberal  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:34:41pm

re: #191 Gus

That's what KT probably hopes for.

193 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:38:38pm

Where is KT? He been going missing more and more every evening.

194 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:39:36pm

re: #192 ProGunLiberal

I'm pretty sure KT supports Obama over every single GOP candidate, but I suppose you could end the speculation and ask him yourself.

195 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:42:15pm

re: #193 Gus

Probably puttering around in his new greenhouse. Or planting racist comments on Fox News websites.
/

196 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:43:39pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

... The United States Department of Daycare and Diaper Changing.
/with a budget larger than the military.

197 engineer cat  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:43:43pm

so, the "Agile" software development methadology

1. scrums: not so bad, all they do is waste precious time, interrupt your train of thought, make your daily schedule inflexible, and generally give you the feeling that management is breathing down your neck.

2. unit test code: test code is good. demanding it in volume and shaming laggards by displaying coverage volume statistics is worse that useless. one engineer said to me "with unit testing code you'll find that all your assignments take twice as long". uh, no. Unit test code is excellent in small quantities when what is tested is chosen carefully - very carefully. besides which, i object vehemently to anything that makes the lives of QAs easier.

3. six week internal deadlines: the worst. i guess all successful olympic track stars run all their long distance races in 100 yard sprints. the most destructive idea to impact productivity since the invention of associate vice presidents

198 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:45:24pm

re: #195 Slumbering Behemoth

Probably puttering around in his new greenhouse. Or planting racist comments on Fox News websites.
/

False flag operation! Derpity derpy doo!

//

199 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:46:10pm

re: #198 Gus

Mobies.

200 Interesting Times  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:50:47pm

I'm shocked, I tell you, shocked!

Security camera footage from a well-known gay bar has played a key role in a hit-and-run investigation of a former Houston City Councilman, who is now a conservative talk show host, Local 2 Investigates reported on Wednesday.
...
Tuderia Bennett, of Galena Park, told Houston police that he was working as a bouncer at the front door during a popular cross-dressing 'drag show' that was going on inside the club. He watched the crash happen and told police he rushed up to the car after impact and got a good look at Berry behind the wheel.

"I said, 'That's definitely the guy.' For sure, 100 percent," said Bennett.

201 engineer cat  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:52:04pm

re: #182 Gus

Imagine if you will some wingnut reading this over at Newsmax: Fox News Poll: Obama Leads Republican Candidates in Swing States

Obama Puts On His Leaderhosen

(ducks)

202 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:52:04pm

re: #199 Slumbering Behemoth

Mobies.

I'm amazed they actually believe that instead of owning up to it and dealing with it. Instead of criticizing the racism they choose to deflect the issue and come up with silly excuses. Fox News obviously doesn't give a shit for the most part. It's sort of like Ron Paul using the excuse of "well I didn't write that" and making no comments on the racism. If they're not sympathetic to the racism then they will deal and confront the racism within their own circles. But of course they don't and continue to resist their own imperfections as a group.

203 Digital Display  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:53:55pm

It was a genius move by the Administration yesterday while the Chinese VP was visiting.. We completely got out of debt with China by selling one Billion Lin Jerseys for 50 bucks each to them.
I hear we got some change left over for a case of Baby Ruth candy bars and an open bar at a Maxim party on 4th of July.
/

204 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 8:54:32pm

re: #200 Interesting Times

I'm shocked, I tell you, shocked!

Wow, that guy must be really dedicated to conduct field research like that.
/

205 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:00:45pm

I declare Ron Paul wins the quote of the day

"If we are allowed to deal with our eternity and all that we believe in spiritually, and if we're allowed to read any book that we want under freedom of speech, why is it we can't put into our body whatever we want?"

Um, because some of that shit is poison?

206 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:01:08pm

re: #202 Gus

They've taken their Cult of the Infallibility of the Bible and internalized that philosophy to apply to their party.

Just as one is greeted with "You have not studied The Word well enough to understand it properly" when one points out the truly evil parts of The Word of God; one is also greeted with "You're cherry picking/taking out of context/falling for a phony liberal plant" when you point out the truly racist comments left on FNC.

Very transparent, both.

207 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:06:00pm

re: #9 They're pants, essentially...

Rachel's reporting that there was a shooting in a Cali Federal bldg. One death.

Long Beach. Two dead now.

208 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:06:07pm

Darrell Issa Compares His All-Male Anti-Contraception Panel To Martin Luther King

We heard from religious leaders whose positions might not be popular, like MLK's position was not so long ago: [Link: bit.ly...] #p2

Fuck you. Fuck you right up your self righteous ass, you fucking bastard.

209 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:07:11pm

re: #205 Kragar

Unless you're a woman.

/also, "No Space on the Internet!"

210 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:08:12pm

re: #34 They're pants, essentially...

He just equated what the administration did to forcing a Jewish soup kitchen to serve ham...

I used to volunteer at a Jewish food pantry.

Most of the people in our neighborhood who needed food weren't Jews.

When we got pork, we gave it out. People could choose for themselves whether they wanted to take it.

211 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:09:03pm

re: #210 SanFranciscoZionist

People could choose for themselves whether they wanted to take it.

STOP OPPRESSING THEM!
/

212 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:09:09pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

... the phrase "State's Rights" would be legally considered Hate Speech, punishable by law.

213 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:11:01pm

re: #107 Gus

The pill would be available in over-the-counter form.

Probably not. It can take some tinkering to get you on a version you can tolerate. I mean, so I've heard. I never had an issue.

214 HappyWarrior  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:11:50pm

re: #208 Kragar

Darrell Issa Compares His All-Male Anti-Contraception Panel To Martin Luther King

Fuck you. Fuck you right up your self righteous ass, you fucking bastard.

Wow lack of perspective much but then again Glenn Beck did claim to be the heir of MLK too.

215 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:13:02pm

re: #157 The Yankee

They use to use bunnies to see if your were prego right?

Yes. Hence the continued expression "the rabbit died", even though the more accurate modern version is 'the two lines turned blue'.

216 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:13:43pm

re: #213 SanFranciscoZionist

Probably not. It can take some tinkering to get you on a version you can tolerate. I mean, so I've heard. I never had an issue.

Believe me, that would be worked out if men needed them.

217 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:14:29pm

re: #212 Slumbering Behemoth

... the phrase "State's Rights" would be legally considered Hate Speech, punishable by law.

Contraception is patriotic!

218 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:17:46pm

OK, in Long Beach, one of the dead is the shooter.

The victims were two ICE agents. One is dead at the scene, the other is stable.

219 Ojoe  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:17:49pm

re: #62 e_e

Ojoe logs in. Ojoe logs out. I can't explain that! //

I was tired, drove trucks all day for the food bank. So I checked out the happenings here & then turned the computer off for a while.

Which I'm doing again, until tomorrow sometime.

Good night all.

220 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:20:43pm

You know damn well that most of these damn pious hypocritical assholes in the House have had their asses saved on numerous occasions with the help of contraception and abortions. That's how men work.

221 Locker  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:26:54pm

After thinking about this it seems I'd prefer an alternative to Pat Buchanan being fired. What I want is for him to have his say and then have to defend it against a real opponent without any ability to control the flow or edit the product.

I want them out in the spotlight and I want their artificial layer of insulation stripped away.

222 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:27:31pm

I'm trying to grasp the notion of these online petitions trying to get the GOP to do "the right thing." It's a waste of energy.

223 blueraven  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:29:53pm

re: #200 Interesting Times

I'm shocked, I tell you, shocked!

Wow! Have you ever heard this dude, Michael Berry? He is one nasty piece of work.

224 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:34:24pm

re: #220 Gus

You know damn well that most of these damn pious hypocritical assholes in the House have had their asses saved on numerous occasions with the help of contraception and abortions. That's how men work.

My area of study, back when I did a history BA, was early modern Europe. The Renaissance and the Enlightenment, ie, the era of the rise of the modern urban middle class. Contraception, in the forms that were available at the time, was commonly used throughout this period by the merchant class. People didn't want no kids, they wanted five instead of ten. Few enough that you could give them apprenticeships and dowries to stay within the middle class, and not destroy the family wealth.

This pattern continues today in the United States. People want to have few enough children that they can preserve their standard of living, and, more importantly, pass on to their children the education and the funds they need to live in a similar manner as adults.

Making this about religion or women's health is interesting, but this is more accurately about our ability to maintain a large, functional, middle class in this country. If you are against contraception being easily available to adult women, you are against the only actual triumph of capitalism: the creation and functioning of a merchant and professional middle class. If you are against contraception, you are against one of the most essential social patterns of the United States.

I know some people would like us to go back to farming, so we'd need big families to bring in the harvest, but those times will not come again in the U.S. unless there's actually a total societal collapse.

We need birth control to be who we are, as much as we need paper, or electricity. People not having access to birth control would absolutely destroy this country.

Of course, that's not the goal. The goal is to use this as a political football, and make people's lives just a little more expensive.

225 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:34:33pm

Pat Buchanan is still writing for Townhall. He is still featured at Vdare who got a front row seat at CPAC in which the major Republican candidates spoke. He's still a member of Creator's Syndicate. Yes, he was fired by MSNBC. But he remains a notable force with the post-modern Republican movement. He was even tolerated by PBS for some times. I'm really not that impressed. Look at what happened with Helen Thomas. How her career came to a literal halt. Instead we continue to see the flagrant approval of Mr. Buchanan who in fact has been more antithetical to human decency than Ms. Thomas. That's white male privilege talking right there.

226 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:37:52pm

re: #220 Gus

You know damn well that most of these damn pious hypocritical assholes in the House have had their asses saved on numerous occasions with the help of contraception and abortions. That's how men work.

That's how they work, thankyouverymuch.

They couldn't give two shits about any of the social issues they pretend to bitch about. All they care about is pandering to what they perceive as a large, coveted voting bloc. If they thought they could beat their political opponents by being pro-gay, they'd come out in favor of the "gay indoctrination in public schools" boogeyman that they constantly flog.

227 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:41:39pm

So much for Ayn Rand. If women went John Galt right now these Republican men would be seriously screwed in more way than one. Ayn Rand herself would be reeling over what these Republicans have been doing. This isn't about objectivism. It never was. Republicans wouldn't know objectivism if it hit them in the face. Including most of the undereducated Tea Party politicians and voters. For all her faults I think we can finally say that even Ayn Rand is "spinning in her grave" tonight.

228 darthstar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:42:07pm
229 darthstar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:43:46pm
230 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:46:26pm

re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist

Excellent observation. Not a connection I would have thought of, but it makes perfect sense. I am impressed, as always.

231 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:46:51pm

re: #230 Slumbering Behemoth

Excellent observation. Not a connection I would have thought of, but it makes perfect sense. I am impressed, as always.

Why, thank you!

232 prairiefire  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:46:54pm

re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't think I've told you how brilliant you are, lately. ☀☀☀

233 HappyWarrior  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:47:02pm

re: #224 SanFranciscoZionist

My area of study, back when I did a history BA, was early modern Europe. The Renaissance and the Enlightenment, ie, the era of the rise of the modern urban middle class. Contraception, in the forms that were available at the time, was commonly used throughout this period by the merchant class. People didn't want no kids, they wanted five instead of ten. Few enough that you could give them apprenticeships and dowries to stay within the middle class, and not destroy the family wealth.

This pattern continues today in the United States. People want to have few enough children that they can preserve their standard of living, and, more importantly, pass on to their children the education and the funds they need to live in a similar manner as adults.

Making this about religion or women's health is interesting, but this is more accurately about our ability to maintain a large, functional, middle class in this country. If you are against contraception being easily available to adult women, you are against the only actual triumph of capitalism: the creation and functioning of a merchant and professional middle class. If you are against contraception, you are against one of the most essential social patterns of the United States.

I know some people would like us to go back to farming, so we'd need big families to bring in the harvest, but those times will not come again in the U.S. unless there's actually a total societal collapse.

We need birth control to be who we are, as much as we need paper, or electricity. People not having access to birth control would absolutely destroy this country.

Of course, that's not the goal. The goal is to use this as a political football, and make people's lives just a little more expensive.

Never thought of it that way but good points.

234 freetoken  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:55:27pm

All this conception/contraception talk... how about a little Khachaturian to go with that:


235 Lidane  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 9:55:55pm

re: #226 Slumbering Behemoth

They couldn't give two shits about any of the social issues they pretend to bitch about. All they care about is pandering to what they perceive as a large, coveted voting bloc.

They fit the meme:

Image: GOP_candidate.jpg

236 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:05:55pm

re: #225 Gus

Helen Thomas had it coming, and for some time. But she had only one career focus. Pat has many.

Pat also has it coming, in the worst way, and I will be just as happy, indeed more so, to see his various careers screech to a halt like Helen's did.

If I were Satan, I'd make them share an Ever Burning Cell for eternity, full of sordid details best left untyped. They deserve each other.

237 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:08:08pm

See. Sometimes my babble can inspire others.

//

238 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:08:47pm

re: #231 SanFranciscoZionist

I know I tend to talk a lot of shit about religion and the religious, but I respect the hell out of you and your intellect.

And I don't think all religious people are stereotypes reflected by the worst of the religious right. But damned if the religious right doesn't make an easy target.

239 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:13:58pm

re: #237 Gus

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

... a Gus that would be a breeding machine that would put Mrs. Duggar to shame.
/

240 SanFranciscoZionist  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:16:05pm

re: #238 Slumbering Behemoth

I know I tend to talk a lot of shit about religion and the religious, but I respect the hell out of you and your intellect.

And I don't think all religious people are stereotypes reflected by the worst of the religious right. But damned if the religious right doesn't make an easy target.

Believe me, the religious center to left has noticed.

We handle it by sighing a lot...

;)

241 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:17:27pm

re: #240 SanFranciscoZionist

A harder row to hoe than mine in some ways, I imagine.

242 palomino  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:17:29pm

re: #190 jaunte

"I deny your reality and substitute my own"
[Link: www.google.com...]

Hilarious, some of those links saying Obama is in trouble are from before the 2008 election. Some trouble: he only won by 10 million votes.

What really strikes me is the delusional confidence on both sides. Dems think Obama will automatically win because the GOP candidates are weak; but a bad economy always makes reelection difficult for an incumbent. Even more deluded are Republicans who think everyone hates Obama as much as they and Limbaugh, despite his polling leads over all GOP candidates, despite his 50% approval rating, despite some good economic news, etc, etc.

243 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:23:39pm

re: #227 Gus

For all her faults I think we can finally say that even Ayn Rand is "spinning in her grave" tonight.

If only to prove that pioneering entrepreneurs, left unfettered by gov't regulations, taxes, labor concerns, etc., could actually achieve the elusive, scientific miracle of perpetual motion.
/

244 Lidane  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:26:37pm

re: #242 palomino

Nothing is set in stone and a lot can happen between now and November, but the GOP primary season and their caveman bullshit on birth control isn't doing the party any favors.

245 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:28:10pm

So, the Bioshock series...

B1 mocks Randian Libertarianism.
B2 mocks Leftist Collectivism
B3 mocks Patriotic Nationalism

What's on deck for B4, if there is one?

246 prairiefire  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:29:59pm

re: #240 SanFranciscoZionist

By sighing, feeling sad, and trying to eke out that extra smile in the face of obliviousness.

247 Mentis Fugit  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:31:52pm

re: #32 moderatelyradicalliberal

Hannity has a face that looks like it's dying for several fists to punish it.

The word you are looking for is Backpfeifengesicht.

248 Prideful, Arrogant Marriage Equality Advocate  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:32:08pm

We get Pat off the TV and he gets to be a martyr. Everybody wins a little in this!

249 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:33:18pm

re: #244 Lidane

I hope they double down with a "Shoeless, Inseminated, and Pantry-Bound" campaign slogan.

250 palomino  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:33:21pm

re: #244 Lidane

Nothing is set in stone and a lot can happen between now and November, but the GOP primary season and their caveman bullshit on birth control isn't doing the party any favors.

Almost like Obama set a trap for them, and Neanderthals like Sen. Blunt stepped right in. Blunt's new legislation would not only allow religious affiliated corps. to deny contraception coverage, but ALL employers the right to deny coverage on anything, not just birth control, if it violated their conscience in some way. Thus we'd be going back to before the 2000 EEOC decision (that Bush never objected to) which required non-religious employers to provide contraceptive coverage in their health plans.

Some of my older friends are worried Obama made a mistake here...possibly, but I can't see him losing the election over coverage of contraception.

251 prairiefire  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:34:03pm

re: #246 prairiefire

By sighing, feeling sad, and trying to eke out that extra smile in the face of obliviousness.

"Love your neighbor as yourself, even if that neighbor does not give a shit."

Night, lizards.

252 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:35:34pm

re: #248 Burning in the acidic quality of time

We get Pat off the TV and he gets to be a martyr. Everybody wins a little in this!

He's only off MSNBC. He may still find his old spot on PBS open, or a new one on Fox.

Too many idiots take that man seriously for him to just disappear from television.

253 Prideful, Arrogant Marriage Equality Advocate  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:37:59pm

re: #252 Slumbering Behemoth

I am really surprised that he is not on Fox already.

254 palomino  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:38:30pm

re: #252 Slumbering Behemoth

He's only off MSNBC. He may still find his old spot on PBS open, or a new one on Fox.

Too many idiots take that man seriously for him to just disappear from television.

I could even see CNN taking him...who better to replace Dana Loesch (she got fired right?)

255 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:43:08pm

re: #253 Burning in the acidic quality of time

I am really surprised that he is not on Fox already.

I think the executives just might be smart enough to say "Let that paleo-douche tar up that librul MSNBC".

The shot callers at Fox are gonna wait, testing the waters. If they feel like he'll hurt their brand more than help it, he will continue to be persona non grata there as he has been for many years.

256 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:44:17pm

re: #254 palomino

They did love them some Glenn Beck for a while there. I guess anything is possible.

257 Gus  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:45:29pm

Muy tired. Good night.

258 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:45:58pm

re: #248 Burning in the acidic quality of time

^Heh.

How about "Resisting the acidic quality of fundamentalism"?

259 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:48:31pm

Pat Buchanan is a giant bag of dicks. And not in a good way.

260 freetoken  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:48:49pm
261 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:51:00pm

re: #102 Gus

If men could get pregnant we'd have...

... a DODA rather than a DOMA.

262 Prideful, Arrogant Marriage Equality Advocate  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:51:28pm

re: #260 freetoken

So beautiful! Still listening to it.

263 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 10:58:20pm

FUCK YEAH!!!

That moment when you think you only have one shitty Tall Boy left, and discover you actually have two.

I predict weirdness, cheese puns, and dick jokes.

264 Prideful, Arrogant Marriage Equality Advocate  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:01:59pm

re: #263 Slumbering Behemoth


I predict weird puns and dick cheese jokes..so we're kinda on the same page!

265 dragonath  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:02:02pm
The calls for my firing began almost immediately with the Oct. 18 publication of “Suicide of a Superpower: Will America Survive to 2025?”

Will Buchanan survive to 2025?

266 Prideful, Arrogant Marriage Equality Advocate  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:04:10pm

re: #265 dragonath

I noticed how he completely ignored the "White America" part of what he said and just emphasized the "Christian America" part instead.

267 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:16:32pm

re: #260 freetoken

I was on a quest...

Back in the day when this game came out, I tried like hell to find some source for the music tracks in it. It seems no simpler now.

At the time I tried to find a way to convert the tracks that were on the disc, but the format used to encode them made it impossible.

Thank you, Freetoken, for reminding me of a frustration long forgotten./

268 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:22:39pm

re: #264 Burning in the acidic quality of time

Head Cheese.
/writes itself

269 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:31:18pm

re: #268 Slumbering Behemoth

Head Cheese.
/writes itself

hehe, you said write

270 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:33:04pm
271 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:34:13pm

re: #270 Slumbering Behemoth

In Soviet Russia...

BANG!

272 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:34:57pm

How The GOP Went Back To The 1950s In Just One Day

Very neatly, and on three separate fronts, conservatives in America turned the clock back to the 1950s with their rhetoric about women’s rights Thursday, according to women in politics on both sides of the aisle. This could be a big problem for the GOP when the calendar reaches November.

Let’s take a look at Thursday, February 16, 2012, the day Washington fell into a time-warp.

273 Lidane  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:36:08pm

re: #250 palomino

Almost like Obama set a trap for them, and Neanderthals like Sen. Blunt stepped right in.

Pretty much. The GOP is now on the defensive after their all-male birth control panel and after their caveman statements about contraception. It's all playing out like a massive game of rope-a-dope. They're coming across as sexist and retrograde about women, and it's not doing any of the candidates any favors.

Some of my older friends are worried Obama made a mistake here...possibly, but I can't see him losing the election over coverage of contraception.

What would kill his re-election is an economic catastrophe, which the GOP seems bound and determined to cause, especially if we hit another debate over the debt ceiling. Contraception won't hurt him. If anything, it will help him with women and independents, especially if the GOP keeps acting like a bunch of Neanderthals on the issue.

274 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:41:11pm

re: #273 Lidane

Pretty much. The GOP is now on the defensive after their all-male birth control panel and after their caveman statements about contraception. It's all playing out like a massive game of rope-a-dope. They're coming across as sexist and retrograde about women, and it's not doing any of the candidates any favors.

What would kill his re-election is an economic catastrophe, which the GOP seems bound and determined to cause, especially if we hit another debate over the debt ceiling. Contraception won't hurt him. If anything, it will help him with women and independents, especially if the GOP keeps acting like a bunch of Neanderthals on the issue.

I was talking about this whole BC debacle with my wife in the car, highlighting some of the GOP tactics and statements, when my 10 year old daughter blurted out "That's bullshit."

I told her that is only time I better hear her use that word, but otherwise let it slide. My wife almost choked holding back her laughter.

275 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:42:24pm

re: #272 Kragar

Please, GOP, continue to be Neanderthals. I want a landslide for Obama.

276 Lidane  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:43:30pm

re: #274 Kragar

I was talking about this whole BC debacle with my wife in the car, highlighting some of the GOP tactics and statements,when my 10 year old daughter blurted out "Thats bullshit."

Ha! Ten years old and already a liberal and a feminist. Awesome. ;)

I told her that's only time I better hear her use that word, but otherwise let it slide. My wife almost choked holding back her laughter.

Just wait. If Torquemada Jr. ends up the Republican nominee, your ten year old might be saying it a lot. Haha.

278 Kragar  Thu, Feb 16, 2012 11:57:24pm
279 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:10:54am

re: #275 e_e

Please, GOP, continue to be Neanderthals. I want a landslide for Obama.

It figures a foreign Soviet would say such a thing.
/

I want to see a complete referendum on American Theocracy.
notholdingmybreath

280 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:11:50am

He forgets one thing: msnbc is a company, firing him is a business decision, they have decided he is bad for the Bottom Line.

Why does he hate capitalism? Mitt made his career based on dumping people to improve the Bottom line.

281 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:12:47am

re: #279 Slumbering Behemoth

It figures a foreign Soviet would say such a thing.
/

I want to see a complete referendum on American Theocracy.
notholdingmybreath

Even a complete landslide against them would only heighten their resolve and make them double down. There's no arguing with these pricks.

282 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:15:15am

re: #281 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

Even a complete landslide against them would only heighten their resolve and make them double down. There's no arguing with these pricks.

"Rush keeps saying the most conservative candidate will win! We need a more conservative candidate!"

283 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:16:26am

re: #281 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

There's no arguing with these pricks.

You are sooo wrong. With these pricks, there seems to be nothing but arguing, and without a hint of compromise./

On an unrelated note, I've just found that I like the combination baby carrots and peanut butter.

284 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:19:18am

re: #282 Kragar

"Rush keeps saying the most conservative candidate will win! We need a more conservative candidate!"

And when we distill that down to it's most puritanical form, we will find a candidate that refuses to run at all in order to preserve what currently is.
/

285 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:22:14am

re: #284 Slumbering Behemoth

And when we distill that down to it's most puritanical form, we will find a candidate that refuses to run at all in order to preserve what currently is.
/

That candidate will not run, but rather attempt to seize power in a coup, because he knows that the electorate is not able to understand how much they need him...

286 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:22:45am

re: #279 Slumbering Behemoth

If/when their establishment understands that socons no longer bring home the meat, and thus it's not necessary to polish their butts, things may start improving.

287 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:23:25am

re: #285 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

That candidate will not run, but rather attempt to seize power in a coup, because he knows that the electorate is not able to understand how much they need him...

"Its for the best really. Real Americans will realize that."

288 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:31:33am

re: #286 e_e

If/when their establishment understands that socons no longer bring home the meat, and thus it's not necessary to polish their butts, things may start improving.

They have begun to understand that, but the socons are so good at getting the media stirred up that the establishment is afraid to take them on.

289 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:32:55am

re: #288 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

Sure, before the election. If they turn off enough voters, there might be a Night of the Long Knives.

290 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:34:38am

re: #289 e_e

Sure, before the election. If they turn off enough voters, there might be a Night of the Long Knives.

It would have to be enough of a landslide to refudiate their assertulation that they just weren't conservatatious enough.

291 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:36:44am

re: #290 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

That excuse is getting old.

292 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:37:19am

re: #291 e_e

That excuse is getting old.

Conservatism is about sticking to the old...

293 dragonath  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:38:32am

re: #267 Slumbering Behemoth

Wow, that is one weird file format. I looked it up, and the soundtrack was evidently composed by this guy, and some person named Etienne Grunenwald. But I can't even find any music from them! I dunno if it was Sierra's policy... they used to like using proprietary formats...

I used to search for music like this all the time, since a lot of the tracks (and games) from the old days haven't really been archived. I'd love to get one of the old computers from Japan so I can get the music files off the sound tests, like this:

294 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:45:56am

re: #292 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

Conservatism is about sticking to the old...

But you also know the def of madness.

295 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:47:23am

re: #294

But you also know the def of madness.

Its one step beyond?

296 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:47:51am

re: #294

But you also know the def of madness.

re: #294

But you also know the def of madness.

It is to keep searching for the condidate who is socially conservative enough to get elected, yes...

297 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:55:48am

Good Middle-of-the Night, all. Have we solved something since I went to bed?

298 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:58:47am

re: #293 dragonath

There were a couple of percussion heavy tracks in that game that were bad ass.

Alas, it was a B title from a B team, and I don't think it generated much interest. I don't even have the disk anymore.

And it was a "meh" game overall. I bought it just 'cuz I was stoked to see a feudal-type cRPG not based on the European mythos that has dominated that market for more than thirty years.

299 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:59:33am

My state is about to close its hospitals for the mentally ill. Our legislature can't stand competition:

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

300 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:13:14am

House passes Keystone bill, Senate action uncertain

The House of Representatives passed an energy bill on Thursday that would wrest control of a permit for the controversial Keystone XL oil pipeline away from President Barack Obama, who has put the project on hold.

The bill, part of a broader House Republican effort to fund highways and infrastructure projects, would also expand offshore oil drilling and open up parts of the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge to drilling.

While approval of the Keystone measure by the House was widely expected, what happens with a similar proposal in the Democratic-controlled Senate is not yet clear.

301 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:18:57am

re: #300 Kragar

How I see the GOP strategy: keep up pressure on Iran to maintain high oil prices. Then try to make Obama look "inactive" on exploiting domestic (i.e. Canadian) resources so GOP can lay the blame for higher gasoline prices at Obama's door.

302 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:25:25am

It's not fracking's fault, study says

A university study asserts that the problems caused by the gas extraction process known as hydraulic fracturing, or "fracking," arise because drilling operations aren't doing it right. The process itself isn't to blame, according to the study, released today by the Energy Institute at the University of Texas at Austin.

The report is likely to add new fuel to a blazing controversy over fracking. Researchers reviewed the evidence contained in the reports of groundwater contamination from three prominent shale-rock formations where the process is employed: the Barnett Shale in North Texas, the Marcellus Shale in Pennsylvania, New York and other areas of Appalachia; and the Haynesville Shale in western Louisiana and northeast Texas.

Well, I'm sure once we get regulations in place, this whole mess can be put...

Oh right.

303 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:29:38am

re: #302 Kragar

It's not fracking's fault, study says

Well, I'm sure once we get regulations in place, this whole mess can be put...

Oh right.

Doing it right costs money, which cuts into margins...

And this stuff happens underground, you don't find out that they have screwed up until they have moved on.

304 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:34:31am

Morning, all

305 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:35:39am

re: #304 researchok

Morning, all

306 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:36:04am

re: #299 Decatur Deb

My state is about to close its hospitals for the mentally ill. Our legislature can't stand competition:

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

Big, big mistake.

307 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:36:42am

re: #305

Good to see you, Tovarisch.

308 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:39:44am

re: #307 researchok

Good to see you, Tovarisch.

☭!

309 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:42:27am

re: #308

You know, with an avatar like that sooner or later someone will refer to you as a 'godless heathen.'

You godless heathen.

310 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:42:58am

re: #309 researchok

You know, with an avatar like that sooner or later someone will refer to you as a 'godless heathen.'

You godless heathen.

You were saying?.. //

311 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:43:04am

re: #306 researchok

Big, big mistake.

It's OK, we're Number One in the SEC.

312 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:44:07am

Early AM on LGF has it's moments.

313 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:45:25am

Insomnia is a lifestyle choice.

314 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:46:38am

re: #312 researchok

Early AM on LGF has it's moments.

315 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:46:43am

re: #312 researchok

Early AM on LGF has it's moments.

for us Old Europeans, it's mid-morning. I usually miss out the threads just as they start getting going...

316 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:47:42am

re: #313 Decatur Deb

Insomnia is a lifestyle choice.

I hear that.

For the last year or so, I had to get get up early. This contract is never ending.... or so it seems, anyway. They keep re upping. They pay, but man, it's getting tough.

317 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:48:55am

re: #315 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

for us Old Europeans, it's mid-morning. I usually miss out the threads just as they start getting going...

I'm a former Euro (Brit)...but my hours are now such that I have to meet schedules here and there.

318 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:49:02am

they say that most folks, if left to their own accord, would go to bed between 1-2am and wake up in the mornings between 9-10am.

which seems perfectly normal to me.

319 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:49:49am

re: #318 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

they say that most folks, if left to their own accord, would go to bed between 1-2am and wake up in the mornings between 9-10am.

which seems perfectly normal to me.

For me, that much sleep has become a concept.

320 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:50:01am

re: #314 ☞☞☞☞☠

Arirang Yo

321 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:51:09am

re: #319 researchok

For me, that much sleep has become a concept.

"left to their own accord" is the key concept here

322 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:52:53am

re: #320 Decatur Deb

OK, this is different.

I'm waiting for Zamfir the pan flute guy to show up...

Actually, this is pretty good.

323 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:53:11am

re: #321 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

"left to their own accord" is the key concept here

A couple years into retirement I realized 3 meals and fixed sleep hours were immaterial.

324 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:54:17am

Meals, fixed sleep, retirement...?

Que?

325 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:54:56am

Music is picking up now...very good.

326 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:55:04am

re: #324 researchok

327 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:55:25am

re: #322 researchok

OK, this is different.

I'm waiting for Zamfir the pan flute guy to show up...

Actually, this is pretty good.

The first piece is Korean folk song #1, to match Sergei's typeface.

328 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:56:49am

re: #327 Decatur Deb

This is quite good.

Seriously good.

329 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:58:26am

re: #328 researchok

This is quite good.

Seriously good.

Got to start going to mountain music festivals again.

330 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 1:59:19am

Saved it.

331 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 2:03:05am

Music overcoming technology:

332 researchok  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 2:05:55am

re: #331 Decatur Deb

Nice...Like an Asheville NC summer fest..

333 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 2:08:45am

re: #332 researchok

Nice...Like an Asheville NC summer fest..

Yes--they carried it right through that hopeless setting and amateur audio-visual. It's 4:00, time to switch from wine to coffee.

334 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 2:27:35am

re: #332 researchok

Nice...Like an Asheville NC summer fest..

Got the French press pressing. That group hangs around Leesburg VA.

336 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:27:34am

re: #335 ☞☞☞☞☠

I think I detect a pattern...

337 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:28:24am

re: #336 Decatur Deb

338 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:33:33am

re: #337 ☞☞☞☞☠

So that's where Bowser wound up.

339 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:33:54am

Not to be outdone:

you may try to guess which one is yours truly

340 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:36:40am

re: #339 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

I hope you're the guy with the blinding glare coming off his head

341 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:38:41am

re: #339 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

Not to be outdone:

you may try to guess which one is yours truly

[Video]

Going with Banjo guy.

342 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:38:57am

re: #339 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

You're in Frankfurt?

343 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:44:21am

Megadeth's Dave Mustaine Not Ready to 'Endorse' Santorum
[Link: www.billboard.com...]

Megadeth frontman Dave Mustaine's not ready to cast his vote just yet.

"Contrary to how some people have interpreted my words, I have not endorsed any presidential candidate," the rocker said in a release after earlier reports had him backing Republican Rick Santorum on Wednesday.

344 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:45:48am

re: #340 RogueOne

re: #341 Decatur Deb

I play the bano, but not on this one.

And I don't play bass...

345 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:46:07am

re: #343 RogueOne

Megadeth's Dave Mustaine Not Ready to 'Endorse' Santorum
[Link: www.billboard.com...]

He did not endorse him. He simlpy said he wants to see him in the WH. But he did not endorse. Ja ja.

346 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:46:29am

re: #342 ☞☞☞☞☠

You're in Frankfurt?

Not as such, but I play there a lot. I live on the Rhine between Mainz and Cologne.

347 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:53:40am

re: #344 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

LOL

348 EdDantes  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 3:57:38am

Why do boiled eggs smell like farts?

349 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:00:51am

re: #348 EdDantes

Why do boiled eggs smell like farts?

sulphur

350 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:01:17am

re: #347 ☞☞☞☞☠

LOL

[Video]

you found our big hit crowd-pleaser

351 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:04:22am

I love google!

Almost 8 years ago my wife had someone open a bunch of different accounts under her name and completely wrecked her credit rating. It took years to get most of it settled but we still get debt collector crap. 2 weeks ago we got sued over one of those accounts. After doing a lot of google research I found out that they didn't file the correct paperwork with their lawsuit and was able to file a motion to dismiss and filed a counterclaim of $3k. I just checked online and found the judge gave them 30 days to come up with the docs or else it's dismissed and they've set a date for my counterclaim. I might actually get some of the money we've spent over the years dealing with this crap thanks to an over-exuberant debt collector.

352 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:05:55am

re: #351 RogueOne

Related (and what reminded me to check the court status):

New consumer finance watchdog targets debt collectors
[Link: www.usatoday.com...]

353 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:06:25am

re: #351 RogueOne

cool
get them

354 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:08:22am

re: #353 ☞☞☞☞☠

This company is slimy. We dealt with them more than 2 years ago and thought it was all settled. They waited until the statute of limitations date was coming up (May '12) and then they filed suit against us anyway (without any notice) when they know damn well this was a fraudulent account.

355 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:09:52am

re: #354 RogueOne

Was it identity theft?

356 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:15:43am

re: #355 ☞☞☞☞☠

Was it identity theft?

Yeah. We didn't know anything about it until we went to buy a house and all these accounts showed up on her credit report. It almost cost us a house. My credit was fine but I don't have a lot of it. I'm a firm believer in "if I can't buy it with cash I probably don't need it".

357 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:18:19am

re: #356 RogueOne

Was it easy for the fraudster to open them? Because this hearkens back to the relatively recent discussions here about what constitutes an identity in the US, and the need for a unique and protected ID.

358 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:21:24am

Speaking of credit. The SiL (who is only 19) has been working and saving to buy a car. She's managed to scrape together $8k and can buy one outright but I thought it might be best if she took out a small loan (using her cash as collateral) to build up a credit history. Went to the bank yesterday and found out they don't do personal loans under $5k anymore, no car loans under $6k, and the dealership won't give her financing because she only works part-time. How is she supposed to build up a credit history if they won't even give her a loan backed with cash? I knew it was still tough to get banks to cough up money but this is silly.

359 _RememberTonyC  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:21:37am

Three words for you, pat:

Boo fucking hoo

360 Gretchen G.Tiger  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:23:34am

Morning all

361 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:23:46am

re: #357 ☞☞☞☞☠

Was it easy for the fraudster to open them? Because this hearkens back to the relatively recent discussions here about what constitutes an identity in the US, and the need for a unique and protected ID.

The cost and speed of DNA analysis is improving wildly. In a few years we'll be able to sign securely in blood.

362 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:24:12am

re: #361 Decatur Deb

The cost and speed of DNA analysis is improving wildly. In a few years we'll be able to sign securely in blood.

Uh oh.

363 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:24:51am

re: #357 ☞☞☞☞☠

Was it easy for the fraudster to open them? Because this hearkens back to the relatively recent discussions here about what constitutes an identity in the US, and the need for a unique and protected ID.

No idea how they managed to get her info and get the loans other than back then banks were passing out money like candy. They opened up a couple credit card accounts, one with GMAC financing, and one with Citi financial.

364 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:24:57am

re: #358 RogueOne

Speaking of credit. The SiL (who is only 19) has been working and saving to buy a car. She's managed to scrape together $8k and can buy one outright but I thought it might be best if she took out a small loan (using her cash as collateral) to build up a credit history. Went to the bank yesterday and found out they don't do personal loans under $5k anymore, no car loans under $6k, and the dealership won't give her financing because she only works part-time. How is she supposed to build up a credit history if they won't even give her a loan backed with cash? I knew it was still tough to get banks to cough up money but this is silly.

Look into credit unions--they are probably a better deal anyway.

365 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:25:38am

re: #361 Decatur Deb

I understand it's a joke, but how would identical twins fit this picture?

366 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:28:06am

re: #364 Decatur Deb

That is a good idea. I've had the same local bank for 15 years now. They've always been real good to me. I'd hate to go somewhere else but I bet her employer has a credit union option.

367 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:28:29am

hoo fucking ray

[Link: www.google.com...]

CLEVELAND (AP) — The parents of an 8-year-old boy who died from Hodgkin lymphoma after suffering for months from undiagnosed swollen glands were sentenced to eight years in prison Thursday following their guilty pleas to denying him medical treatment.

368 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:30:45am

re: #367 ☞☞☞☞☠

ALtho 8 years is too short, upon review:

The judge compared the autopsy photo of Willie's emaciated body to concentration camp victims. "If anybody, anybody, didn't know this kid was sick, they are seriously, seriously disturbed," Astrab said.

Two doctors told the judge before the sentencing that no sick child would be turned away from a hospital.

Willie Robinson collapsed at his home on March 22, 2008. Prosecutors say he had begged his parents to take him to see a doctor but was rejected. Hodgkin lymphoma is a highly treatable cancer.

369 EdDantes  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:30:57am

re: #349 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

sulphur

Oh. I didn't know humans emitted sulfur. I like boiled eggs but I don't like farts. Except my own.

370 AK-47%  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:35:43am

re: #369 EdDantes

Oh. I didn't know humans emitted sulfur. I like boiled eggs but I don't like farts. Except my own.

one of the products created by the breakdown of foodstuffs. Eggs have a lot of sulphur.

371 EdDantes  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:36:45am

BY the way, Pat Buchanan is an anti-Semitic ass hole and needs to be fired.
Thank you very much.

372 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:37:37am

re: #371 EdDantes

BY the way, Pat Buchanan is an anti-Semitic ass hole and needs to be fired.
Thank you very much.

He just has been.

373 EdDantes  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:39:41am

re: #372 ☞☞☞☞☠

He just has been.

I should have used the word, "needed". I know he was fired.

374 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:46:36am

re: #365 ☞☞☞☞☠

I understand it's a joke, but how would identical twins fit this picture?

Half-joke. I think they can be distinguished--

[Link: www.livescience.com...]

375 EdDantes  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:53:16am

Nite all.

376 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:55:33am

Well, shit, this morning is not going well.

I was late for work and drove out of the garage too fast and ripped off the passenger side mirror on my SUV.

Insurance will cover it, but still...fuck.

377 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:56:50am

It's daylight--Dog time. BBL.

378 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:58:28am

re: #368 ☞☞☞☞☠

I don't get the mindset that denies an obviously deathly ill child medical care. Even if you believe that prayer works and god is great and all, I doubt those parents, say, refuse to bandage their own wounds. Why should treating cancer be any different?

379 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:59:07am

re: #346 Ministry of Fairness and Balance

Not as such, but I play there a lot. I live on the Rhine between Mainz and Cologne.

I might be out that way for a few days in April. Work though, so probably no free time to go see anything. :(

Plant located in Wesseling. Which I'm told is close to Cologne.

380 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 4:59:20am

re: #378 Obdicut

Seems like they were just lazy druggies, not bible-thumpers.

381 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:02:25am

re: #374 Decatur Deb

When we use DNA for identification, we don't sequence the entire thing, but only individual parts. If we actually did want to create a database of IDs based on genes, you could do it one of two ways:

Either have everyone identified with a different set of genes, whatever is proveably unique for them. This would require the smallest amount of data, but it would make identifying John and Jane Does harder. It'd preserve more privacy, though.

Or you can have the same set of gene markers work as identifiers for everyone. This means the set of genes chosen would have to be large enough to mostly-uniquely identify everyone. This would mean if you got anyone's DNA, you could at least narrow down who they were to a very small set of people. It'd be a larger privacy concern, and the amount of data needed would be larger, but it'd be easier for most applications.

Basically, the former is a way for an individual to have an ID keyed from their genes, the latter is a way for the gubmint to keep track of everyone based on their genes.

382 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:02:27am

This story makes my brain hurt:

Liberals, Don’t Homeschool Your Kids
Why teaching children at home violates progressive values.
[Link: www.slate.com...]

It is unclear how many homeschooling families are secular, but the political scientist Rob Reich has written that there is little doubt the homeschooling population has diversified in recent years.* Yet whether liberal or conservative, “[o]ne article of faith unites all homeschoolers: that homeschooling should be unregulated,” Reich writes. “Homeschoolers of all stripes believe that they alone should decide how their children are educated.”

Could such a go-it-alone ideology ever be truly progressive—by which I mean, does homeschooling serve the interests not just of those who are doing it, but of society as a whole?

So...a progressive parent should be more concerned with "serving the interests of society" than their children? Isn't that what she's saying here?

383 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:03:16am

re: #380 ☞☞☞☞☠

Seems like they were just lazy druggies, not bible-thumpers.

Seriously? Seriously? I don't know if that's worse, but it's fucking disgusting.

384 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:03:45am

re: #380 ☞☞☞☞☠

Seems like they were just lazy druggies, not bible-thumpers.

Some parents completely suck.

385 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:04:05am

re: #367 ☞☞☞☞☠

hoo fucking ray

[Link: www.google.com...]

I'm half betting the lack of treatment was due to medical reasons. And I await the parade of politicians (mainly GOP) to line up to denounce this court decision as destroying the parent's religious freedom.
/

(Edit)
Stand corrected by a later comment. This comment is therefore moot.

386 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:05:04am

re: #383 Obdicut

Yeah, the item gives a lot of he says/she says detail. Seems like they tried, half-assedly, to do something but gave up as soon as they heard the cost. Altho the doctors at the trial said the child would be treated anyway.
This also highlights the problems with healthcare.

387 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:06:02am

re: #382 RogueOne

So...a progressive parent should be more concerned with "serving the interests of society" than their children? Isn't that what she's saying here?

The child then has to live in that society. So yeah, in a way, it's saying that giving your kids an advantage isn't necessarily a good thing when it takes away from society as a whole.

It's this odd notion that we actually belong to a society, rather than being brave, man-as-island pioneers striking out on our own, strangling marmosets and braining wombats on the way to the watering hole.

388 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:06:21am

re: #385 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

What does religion have to do with it?

389 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:07:06am

re: #388 ☞☞☞☞☠

What does religion have to do with it?

Didn't read full article. Mea culpa. And I edited my earlier comment.

390 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:07:44am

re: #388 ☞☞☞☞☠

What does religion have to do with it?

Typically, when stories like this come up in the US, it's based on the selfishness of fanatical religious beliefs, rather than garden-variety selfishness. That's why I kneejerked.

Also, where was child protective services? Didn't anyone who saw this kid think to report it?

391 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:07:49am

re: #382 RogueOne

So...a progressive parent should be more concerned with "serving the interests of society" than their children? Isn't that what she's saying here?

Education is compulsory exactly because this serves interests of society.
And since this is so, the content of education should also matter.

392 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:08:53am

re: #390 Obdicut

Typically, when stories like this come up in the US, it's based on the selfishness of fanatical religious beliefs, rather than garden-variety selfishness. That's why I kneejerked.

Also, where was child protective services? Didn't anyone who saw this kid think to report it?

See the story please. There was some case worker.

393 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:11:15am

Well, there's the answer to my question:

Trumbull County Children Services says it had worked with the family to provide Willie health care, getting involved after receiving a phone call in July 2007. Agency officials said a case worker visited the family at least monthly and pushed the parents to have a medical follow-up on his swollen neck but they didn't.

However, Robinson's attorney Thomas Rein said previously that a social worker who visited the family in January 2008 "indicated the kids were healthy and happy." He said no one knew the boy had cancer until he died and an autopsy was performed.

Visiting monthly, and the kid has a swollen neck every time? He's obviously chronically ill, you idiots.

I don't know if CPS can actually mandate that parents take their kids to get medical care. Fuck this would be so much easier with single payer.

394 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:12:34am

re: #393 Obdicut

The parents are to blame, but so is the system.

395 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:13:14am

re: #387 Obdicut

The child then has to live in that society. So yeah, in a way, it's saying that giving your kids an advantage isn't necessarily a good thing when it takes away from society as a whole.

It's this odd notion that we actually belong to a society, rather than being brave, man-as-island pioneers striking out on our own, strangling marmosets and braining wombats on the way to the watering hole.

Do you think a parents primary responsibility to their children or society? The article is arguing that societal needs outweigh the individual.

396 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:14:18am

re: #394 ☞☞☞☞☠

The parents are to blame, but so is the system.

Totally. Especially if the case worker said that it was just a swollen gland and they could wait to get it looked at. A swollen gland is indicative of a disease, be it a trivial infection or a cancer. It needs to get checked out-- especially if it persists longer than a week.

CPS is such a mess in so many places in this country.

397 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:14:36am

re: #391 ☞☞☞☞☠

Education is compulsory exactly because this serves interests of society.
And since this is so, the content of education should also matter.

I'll agree but that isn't really what the article is arguing.

398 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:14:53am

re: #395 RogueOne

Do you think a parents primary responsibility to their children or society?

I think that's a false dichotomy.

The article is arguing that societal needs outweigh the individual.

Only if you think there's a dichotomy at work.

399 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:16:29am

Morning Lizardim. A very happy Friday from the wild north country; my interest-free loan to the federal government has finally been repaid, and my very much not interest-free loan from a major credit vendor has also been repaid. To top it all off, snow flurries overnight and this morning give a gilded edge to the otherwise brown and dull countryside. How is everyone else this morning? What's new in the land of the odd?

400 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:16:42am

re: #397 RogueOne

I'll agree but that isn't really what the article is arguing.

The quote you provided is about whether homeschooling should be regulated. It totally should be.

401 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:19:30am

I'm using my "Owner Advantage" membership to get this whole car repair thing started, and I'm stuck in voice mail hell.

What's even worse is that the voice mail hell is somewhere in this building.

"You have reached a number at the Business Assistance Center that is no longer in service."

Well!

402 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:19:49am

re: #393 Obdicut

Well, there's the answer to my question:


Visiting monthly, and the kid has a swollen neck every time? He's obviously chronically ill, you idiots.

I don't know if CPS can actually mandate that parents take their kids to get medical care. Fuck this would be so much easier with single payer.

I know of cases where CPS has taken legal action to take children away from parents. Not sure what the thresholds are for that though - and it probably varies from place to place.

403 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:19:54am

Speaking of parenting:
[Link: reason.com...]

here's a big omnibus article by David Pimentel of the Florida Costal School of Law on all the ways you are potentially legally screwed if you let your kid do stuff that was considered normal at some point in the less intensively parented past.

Choice tidbits:

Even one generation ago, the norms were different for determining the age at which a child no longer needed a babysitter. The expected minimum age for babysitters has gone up as well, although in the few states that have legislated specific ages, the thresholds vary widely. In Illinois, it is illegal to leave a child under 14 unsupervised for an “unreasonable period of time”; in Maryland, in contrast, a 13-year-old is considered old enough not only to care for himself, but to babysit infants. The days when 11- and 12-year-old neighborhood kids were considered competent babysitters appear to be long gone. This development is all the more marked considering that mobile phones have created a virtually instant line of communication between the sitter and the parents, something unheard of in earlier eras, when younger sitters were considered acceptable.

And:

Vague statutes do not provide sufficient guidance to parents to know what matters remain in their discretion, or sufficient guidance to prosecutors and jurors to know when a parental lapse rises to the level of criminal conduct. For parents, the vagueness problem may prompt paranoia. For the legal system, the vagueness problem results in overreliance on the discretion of the prosecutor, on the judge’s attempt to give meaning to the statute via jury instructions, and on the judgment of a jury venire already tainted by media hysteria over child protection.

Study in question (PDF):
CRIMINAL CHILD NEGLECT AND THE “FREE RANGE KID”:
IS OVERPROTECTIVE PARENTING THE NEW STANDARD OF CARE?
[Link: works.bepress.com...]

404 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:19:57am

re: #401 Look At My Grandbaby!

I'm using my "Owner Advantage" membership to get this whole car repair thing started, and I'm stuck in voice mail hell.

What's even worse is that the voice mail hell is somewhere in this building.

"You have reached a number at the Business Assistance Center that is no longer in service."

Well!

What happened to your car?

405 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:19:58am

re: #400 ☞☞☞☞☠

The quote you provided is about whether homeschooling should be regulated. It totally should be.

And the person clearly says:

does homeschooling serve the interests not just of those who are doing it, but of society as a whole?

So there's not a dichotomy. You can serve the interests of the kid and society as a whole.

I don't really get the homeschooling stuff. Doesn't everyone try to teach their kids outside of school as well? Except for a few corner cases, I can't think of any time it'd actually be good for the kid, long-term.

406 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:23:38am

re: #399 thedopefishlives

Morning Lizardim. A very happy Friday from the wild north country; my interest-free loan to the federal government has finally been repaid, and my very much not interest-free loan from a major credit vendor has also been repaid. To top it all off, snow flurries overnight and this morning give a gilded edge to the otherwise brown and dull countryside. How is everyone else this morning? What's new in the land of the odd?

40s (F) and damp here in Philadelphia. Sort of a free day to catch up on stuff at work. And to see how the fallout continues from some adjustments I made to some application security on Wednesday. (My name is MUD with a few analysts since they can no longer approve requisitions at this moment. My defense is that I was following orders - and we know how well that works.)

Also need to do food planning for the role-playing game session tomorrow. The monthly Arthurian adventures continue. I'm thinking of making a salmon loaf. (And then hope that Mr Death doesn't turn up with some issue regarding the reaping.)

407 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:24:18am

re: #395 RogueOne

Do you think a parents primary responsibility to their children or society? The article is arguing that societal needs outweigh the individual.

Considering that the people - parents and children - are society and that the makeup of that society - the social contract to use the old fashioned phrase - is heavily dependent on the content of education, I would say that is a false distinction. I would also advise anyone, left or right, against homeschooling for social reasons as well but it has more to do with the fact that many/most of those I've know who were home schooled were not properly socialized and have had an unnecessarily hard time adjusting to living in the majority society. Arguably they did not learn the social contract in school and hence had a harder time understanding what is expected of them.

If nothing else, an important part of school is learning that, no, you are not allowed to smack the snot out of the kid next to you just because he's annoying.

408 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:24:42am

re: #406 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

40s (F) and damp here in Philadelphia. Sort of a free day to catch up on stuff at work. And to see how the fallout continues from some adjustments I made to some application security on Wednesday. (My name is MUD with a few analysts since they can no longer approve requisitions at this moment. My defense is that I was following orders - and we know how well that works.)

Also need to do food planning for the role-playing game session tomorrow. The monthly Arthurian adventures continue. I'm thinking of making a salmon loaf. (And then hope that Mr Death doesn't turn up with some issue regarding the reaping.)

Alas, it's the rule of IT: The last person to touch it is responsible. No matter whose responsibility it actually is.

409 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:24:46am

People who are stupid enough to vote for Gingrich or Santorum, homeschooling their children? Yeah, like that's a swell idea.

410 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:26:15am

re: #382 RogueOne

This story makes my brain hurt:

Liberals, Don’t Homeschool Your Kids
Why teaching children at home violates progressive values.
[Link: www.slate.com...]

So...a progressive parent should be more concerned with "serving the interests of society" than their children? Isn't that what she's saying here?

For a few thousand years we have raised children to be avid soldiers.

411 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:26:42am

re: #404 thedopefishlives

What happened to your car?

I knocked off the side passenger mirror while backout of the garage.

412 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:27:23am

re: #407 William Barnett-Lewis

Considering that the people - parents and children - are society and that the makeup of that society - the social contract to use the old fashioned phrase - is heavily dependent on the content of education, I would say that is a false distinction. I would also advise anyone, left or right, against homeschooling for social reasons as well but it has more to do with the fact that many/most of those I've know who were home schooled were not properly socialized and have had an unnecessarily hard time adjusting to living in the majority society. Arguably they did not learn the social contract in school and hence had a harder time understanding what is expected of them.

If nothing else, an important part of school is learning that, no, you are not allowed to smack the snot out of the kid next to you just because he's annoying.

See, I have the opposite experience. In fact, many of the homeschooled kids I knew were more well-adjusted than the malcontents I went to public high school with. However, the homeschooled kids were extensively involved in their community and church, and often participated in extracurricular activities at the local school, as well.

413 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:27:28am

re: #409 ☞☞☞☞☠

In some areas of the country, the education provided by the public system is poor. I understand the desire to homeschool in those areas, especially when the problems have lasted for decades, but it's still mainly a fools errand.

Heh-- some friends of my parents started a homeschooling group. They were a bunch of academics, so they all had different areas of expertise. Then they decided that rather than having the tutors go to different houses, it'd be easier to have the kids rotate houses. That way, the kids could get socialized, too.

So, basically, they created a school.

414 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:29:49am

re: #408 thedopefishlives

Alas, it's the rule of IT: The last person to touch it is responsible. No matter whose responsibility it actually is.

My boss has my back on this. But advised that I should have put out a notice that the approval security was being adjusted in any case. And folk above my pay scale are still working out how to fix this. (There was a misunderstanding of what the various security settings actually entailed.) I made a recommendation yesterday on what to change - which boils down to officially doing what was previously the status quo.

IT Security folk are a bit like Internal Affairs. Necessary, but disliked due to the fact they step on toes and occasionally stop you from doing things the "easy way".

415 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:30:35am

re: #410 Decatur Deb

For a few thousand years, we have raised children to be avid soldiers.

I would think that would be an argument against the premise that it's a liberals duty to send their kids to public schools. One of the commentators calls them "cookie cutter people".

416 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:32:04am

re: #412 thedopefishlives

See, I have the opposite experience. In fact, many of the homeschooled kids I knew were more well-adjusted than the malcontents I went to public high school with. However, the homeschooled kids were extensively involved in their community and church, and often participated in extracurricular activities at the local school, as well.

That's actually one of the arguments I think. Well-parented kids are an asset to the public school system.

417 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:32:21am

re: #414 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

My boss has my back on this. But advised that I should have put out a notice that the approval security was being adjusted in any case. And folk above my pay scale are still working out how to fix this. (There was a misunderstanding of what the various security settings actually entailed.) I made a recommendation yesterday on what to change - which boils down to officially doing what was previously the status quo.

IT Security folk are a bit like Internal Affairs. Necessary, but disliked due to the fact they step on toes and occasionally stop you from doing things the "easy way".

Yeah, I know the feeling. At development houses, QA people are often looked at the same way. They put out a product that they think is absolutely awesome and flawless, and we rip it to shreds and send it back. They tend not to like that. All the more ironic is that now the coin is flipped and I'm writing the code that is getting ripped apart.

418 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:33:28am

re: #415 RogueOne

BTW, I rarely read comment sections because you just know it's going to denigrate into "You F'ing Suck!" within a few comments but the people in this particular thread all behaved themselves. It's sad that I find that amazing.

419 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:34:23am

re: #416 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

That's actually one of the arguments I think. Well-parented kids are an asset to the public school system.

Oh, I agree. And my sister and I turned out well enough, and we were both public schooled, to the disgust of some of our church friends who felt that public schooling was inherently evil. I'm just saying, well-parented kids can survive and thrive even if they don't attend a public school. It does, however, take a lot more work and careful attention on the part of the parent, which many don't seem to realize.

420 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:37:01am

re: #415 RogueOne

I would think that would be an argument against the premise that it's a liberals duty to send their kids to public schools. One of the commentators calls them "cookie cutter people".

Just arguing that raising your kids for the public good doesn't fit neatly into a left-right mold. The good old boy down the street who sends his son and daughter into a free-fire zone is doing the "progressive collectivist" thing. The Romney, Gingrich and Santorum families might not agree with me, but they have no standing on the issue.

421 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:37:10am

re: #417 thedopefishlives

Yeah, I know the feeling. At development houses, QA people are often looked at the same way. They put out a product that they think is absolutely awesome and flawless, and we rip it to shreds and send it back. They tend not to like that. All the more ironic is that now the coin is flipped and I'm writing the code that is getting ripped apart.

Ever look at some of your own code that was over a year or two old and wonder "What moron wrote this drivel!?! And why didn't they comment it?"

422 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:38:42am

re: #421 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Ever look at some of your own code that was over a year or two old and wonder "What moron wrote this drivel!?! And why didn't they comment it?"

Funny you should say that. I'm working on a bugfix to my first real development project, which was written two years ago. I'm looking at the database design and I'm like, "Surely I wasn't the one who suggested doing something THIS stupid. ...Was I?"

423 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:39:08am

re: #420 Decatur Deb

It's always funny to me that libertarians and anti-progressives fetishize the military so much, being that it's a highly regimented, authoritarian, 'socialist' (in the modern bastardized version) communal group that's used for the benefit of society as a whole.

I mean, I get that the glibertarian types think that physical defense is one of the only roles of the government (though Ron Paul seriously wants letters of marque, the scamp) but the actual formation and set up of the military should make them think.

But it doesn't.

424 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:40:39am

re: #422 thedopefishlives

I didn't take a job at a place because my one question was "Will your programmers get all sulky and truculent if I tell them to comment their code more?"

The interviewer thought about it and said, "Yep."

425 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:41:33am

re: #420 Decatur Deb

Just arguing that raising your kids for the public good doesn't fit neatly into a left-right mold. The good old boy down the street who sends his son and daughter into a free-fire zone is doing the "progressive collectivist" thing. The Romney Gingrich and Santorum families might not agree with me, but they have no standing on the issue.

Public education is one of the great equalizers in our society. Otherwise, you get the underclass remaining the underclass except for exceptional people (driven, or simply lucky.) Not to mention that literacy and some degree of education is essentially mandatory in an industrialized society.

But the quality of a local school system essentially boils down to the community's will. Good parents can cover a lot of ground, and are essential as well. But good parents *will* remove their children from a bad system since their primary goal is a good education for their child.

426 Mocking Jay  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:44:15am

What Are Women For?

No comment necessary.

427 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:44:32am

re: #425 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Well, they will remove their kid if there's an actual better alternative. For a lot of parents, there isn't. Private schools achieve a large measure of their success by rejecting a lot of applicants, ones that aren't up their academic standards, would be too difficult to deal with or not fit 'culturally'.

428 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:45:22am

re: #425 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

But the quality of a local school system essentially boils down to the community's will. Good parents can cover a lot of ground, and are essential as well. But good parents *will* remove their children from a bad system since their primary goal is a good education for their child.

This right here is why we're even considering home schooling our son. The local school system is renowned across the area as a center for drug trafficking and generally poor education (we live in a very rural, redneck-ish area), so we're looking at either ponying up to put him in the Catholic school or else just doing it ourselves.

429 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:45:46am

re: #425 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Public education is one of the great equalizers in our society. Otherwise, you get the underclass remaining the underclass except for exceptional people (driven, or simply lucky.) Not to mention that literacy and some degree of education is essentially mandatory in an industrialized society.

But the quality of a local school system essentially boils down to the community's will. Good parents can cover a lot of ground, and are essential as well. But good parents *will* remove their children from a bad system since their primary goal is a good education for their child.

We get that here in Baja Alabama. The deliberate degradation of the public schools after desegregation was all but openly discussed. As a young lawyer, Hillary Clinton was sent to our town to investigate the manipulation of public resources for the foundation of the "academies". (Daughter 1 is a union thug teacher.)

430 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:45:59am

re: #426 They're pants, essentially...

Hee hee.

despite the fanatical discipline and norm-enforcement of much of the liberal cultural establishment.

What's the liberal cultural establishment when it's at home? Academia? Fanatical discipline? What?

431 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:46:39am

re: #422 thedopefishlives

Funny you should say that. I'm working on a bugfix to my first real development project, which was written two years ago. I'm looking at the database design and I'm like, "Surely I wasn't the one who suggested doing something THIS stupid. ...Was I?"

My first four years in IT was programmer/analyst for applications that were dead and gone (or massively rewritten) within two years of being rolled out. My name on a project team was the kiss of death.

Then I got some serious input into a Db design for a small app, and actually won some arguments with the designer about date storage* and some of the table organization. That one lasted (and was well liked at the plant) until the hardware it ran on went away thirteen years later.

* - Even though it was 1992 I got the date storage to be Y2K compliant. Therefore no issues seven years later while we worked to get other systems over that hump.

432 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:48:37am

re: #423 Obdicut

It's always funny to me that libertarians and anti-progressives fetishize the military so much, being that it's a highly regimented, authoritarian, 'socialist' (in the modern bastardized version) communal group that's used for the benefit of society as a whole.

I mean, I get that the glibertarian types think that physical defense is one of the only roles of the government (though Ron Paul seriously wants letters of marque, the scamp) but the actual formation and set up of the military should make them think.

But it doesn't.

How does the Randian mindset deal with issues regarding product quality? They assume the free market will put them out of business? And if a product (or food item) kills or maims a bunch a people in the meantime it's their own fault for buying it without checking it out first?

433 Shropshire_Slasher  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:50:23am

re: #401 Look At My Grandbaby!
Come on, you don't use your mirrors anyway, black duct tape does wonders!
/

434 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:50:37am

re: #427 Obdicut

Well, they will remove their kid if there's an actual better alternative. For a lot of parents, there isn't. Private schools achieve a large measure of their success by rejecting a lot of applicants, ones that aren't up their academic standards, would be too difficult to deal with or not fit 'culturally'.

The fact that the private schools can reject candidates and toss malcontents is often overlooked when discussing this issue. It would be like comparing LGF versions that allowed moderation and one where all contents had to be accepted (up to a very broad standard.) Which one would you hang out in?

435 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:51:42am

re: #432 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

How does the Randian mindset deal with issues regarding product quality? They assume the free market will put them out of business? And if a product (or food item) kills or maims a bunch a people in the meantime it's their own fault for buying it without checking it out first?

Yeah, they mostly think that everyone should be responsible for their own quality-control and that corporations will be scurred enough of prosecution that they won't engage in bad behavior. It's rather sad.

Most glibertarian fantasies depend on the idea that perfect information is attainable and would be available; they overlook that in capitalism information itself is not only worth money but highly manipulated. I don't know why, it's pretty obvious.

436 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:51:58am

So I get home from work last night about 9, 9:15

As I unlock the front door, our Westie is sitting there waiting (typical). About 10 seconds later our other terrier comes bounding down the stairs to greet me (also typical)
About 10 seconds later two other smallish dogs come into the hallway from the kitchen area to check things out ( NOT typical, as we only have two dogs)

"Honey ,, what did you do today ???"

(seems as if we're fostering two lil guys!,,,,, AGAIN!!)

437 Shropshire_Slasher  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:54:51am

re: #424 Obdicut

Your power with the English language never ceases to amaze me.

438 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:54:52am

re: #428 thedopefishlives

This right here is why we're even considering home schooling our son. The local school system is renowned across the area as a center for drug trafficking and generally poor education (we live in a very rural, redneck-ish area), so we're looking at either ponying up to put him in the Catholic school or else just doing it ourselves.

A co-worker of mine who lives north of Philly does this - his daughter is in Catholic school. And said school was on the list that the archdiocese is planning on closing. So he's looking for an alternative since the local public school district doesn't have that good of a reputation.

439 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:55:39am

re: #437 Tommy

Your power with the English language never ceases to amaze me.

Wanna read the book I wrote?

440 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:55:41am

re: #430 Obdicut

Hee hee.


What's the liberal cultural establishment when it's at home? Academia? Fanatical discipline? What?

Snazzy uniforms.

441 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:56:33am

re: #440 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Snazzy uniforms.

Fanatical devotion to the Ganja Pope.

442 Shropshire_Slasher  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:56:43am

re: #439 Obdicut

Sounds good, might take me awhile.

443 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:57:00am

re: #442 Tommy

Sounds good, might take me awhile.

Just give me an email-- my name here at gmail.

444 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:58:37am

re: #435 Obdicut

Yeah, they mostly think that everyone should be responsible for their own quality-control and that corporations will be scurred enough of prosecution that they won't engage in bad behavior. It's rather sad.

Most glibertarian fantasies depend on the idea that perfect information is attainable and would be available; they overlook that in capitalism information itself is not only worth money but highly manipulated. I don't know why, it's pretty obvious.

A coupla months back, we had someone who was arguing that we could get away with abolishing the EPA by allowing people to sue companies for environmental damages.

445 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:58:38am

re: #435 Obdicut

Yeah, they mostly think that everyone should be responsible for their own quality-control and that corporations will be scurred enough of prosecution that they won't engage in bad behavior. It's rather sad.

Most glibertarian fantasies depend on the idea that perfect information is attainable and would be available; they overlook that in capitalism information itself is not only worth money but highly manipulated. I don't know why, it's pretty obvious.

So essentially the same sort of idealistic fantasyland as you would get with ideal behaviors and players for other systems like anarchy, feudalism, communism, etc.

446 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 5:59:23am

re: #444 thedopefishlives

A coupla months back, we had someone who was arguing that we could get away with abolishing the EPA by allowing people to sue companies for environmental damages.

Oddly enough, the same people that advocate that rarely advocate the removal of corporate personhood, and often want to cap tort damages.

447 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:02:08am

re: #444 thedopefishlives

A coupla months back, we had someone who was arguing that we could get away with abolishing the EPA by allowing people to sue companies for environmental damages.

Someone who hasn't researched how legal expenses work and how quickly they escalate.

448 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:04:36am

The horror-- the horror.

449 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:04:39am

re: #447 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Someone who hasn't researched how legal expenses work and how quickly they escalate.

Well, even beyond that, EPA regulations provide at least some form of preemptive buffer against catastrophic environmental damage. With prosecution, there is no preemption - a company can do whatever the heck it wants to the environment, and the consequences only come after the damage has been done.

450 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:06:41am

FUCK.
This mirror replacement will cost about $300 and my deductible is $500.
FUCK.

451 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:08:16am

re: #450 Look At My Grandbaby!

FUCK.
This mirror replacement will cost about $300 and my deductible is $500.
FUCK.

Yeah, mirror replacements are deceptively expensive. That's why you often see people driving around without them, in spite of the danger of getting pulled over and ticketed.

452 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:11:20am

re: #450 Look At My Grandbaby!

FUCK.
This mirror replacement will cost about $300 and my deductible is $500.
FUCK.

That blows. One of your 1476 kids/grandkids needs to open up a body shop.

453 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:11:47am

re: #434 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

The fact that the private schools can reject candidates and toss malcontents is often overlooked when discussing this issue. It would be like comparing LGF versions that allowed moderation and one where all contents had to be accepted (up to a very broad standard.) Which one would you hang out in?

This is why I get, actually, angry at people who say charter schools are "the ultimate solution" to education problems. Only if you want to throw away a huge chunk of kids because the charters won't accept them and they take away too many resources from the schools that have to take those kids. It's just another version of the "separate but equal" lie.

454 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:12:05am

re: #449 thedopefishlives

Well, even beyond that, EPA regulations provide at least some form of preemptive buffer against catastrophic environmental damage. With prosecution, there is no preemption - a company can do whatever the heck it wants to the environment, and the consequences only come after the damage has been done.

Then the corporation does what other "persons" cannot do--it commits suicide and re-incarnates.

455 Tigger2005  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:12:43am

re: #450 Look At My Grandbaby!

FUCK.
This mirror replacement will cost about $300 and my deductible is $500.
FUCK.

Get a mirror from a salvage yard and stick it on yourself.

456 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:17:32am

re: #455 Tigger2005

Get a mirror from a salvage yard and stick it on yourself.

Salvage Yard Mirror ,,, $25
Roll of duct Tape,,,,,,, $4.99
Do-it-yourself,,,,,,,,,,,,FREE

Satisfaction ,,,, PRICELESS

457 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:21:06am

re: #456 sattv4u2
Tutorial:

Red Green: Duct tape door repair

458 Shropshire_Slasher  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:26:04am

re: #450 Look At My Grandbaby!

Trade it in!

459 Shropshire_Slasher  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:27:28am

I myself have stopped putting on lipstick while backing up my truck.

460 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:29:13am

UPDATE 1-Payment system SWIFT says ready to block Iran banks

The Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Telecommunication said it understood the European Union was drafting new international sanctions regulations directly affecting EU-based financial communication service providers.

"SWIFT stands ready to act and discontinue its services to sanctioned Iranian financial institutions as soon as it has clarity on EU legislation currently being drafted," it said in an emailed statement.

SWIFT said it was also closely following the progress of a bill passed by the U.S. Senate's Banking Committee seeking to cut off Iranian financial institutions.

461 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:29:18am

re: #450 Look At My Grandbaby!

FUCK.
This mirror replacement will cost about $300 and my deductible is $500.
FUCK.

Install a grandchild to look out the right side and repeatedly say "car" if one is within 30' on that side.
Job creation!
;)

462 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:29:47am

Police 'Tank' Purchase Riles New Hampshire Town
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

"We're going to have our own tank."

That's what Keene, N.H., Mayor Kendall Lane whispered to Councilman Mitch Greenwood during a December city council meeting.

It's not quite a tank. But the quaint town of 23,000 -- scene of just two murders since 1999 -- had just accepted a $285,933 grant from the U.S. Department of Homeland Security to purchase a Bearcat, an eight-ton armored personnel vehicle made by Lenco Industries Inc.

But those plans are on hold for now, thanks to a backlash from feisty residents.

463 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:31:48am

re: #462 RogueOne

Police 'Tank' Purchase Riles New Hampshire Town
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

Yep. Need an armored vehicle to repel those Islamic Terrorist Downhill Suicide Skiers.
//
(Does make one wonder if someone looked at the price tag, and then also looked and saw what sort of drain the maintenance costs in the future were going to be as well.)

464 Shropshire_Slasher  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:32:58am

re: #462 RogueOne

If that was my town, I'd be dumping sardine juice in the tank's defroster vents for sure!

465 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:33:05am

re: #462 RogueOne

Police 'Tank' Purchase Riles New Hampshire Town
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

Meh. Fanboys.

466 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:34:31am

re: #463 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Yep. Need an armored vehicle to repel those Islamic Terrorist Downhill Suicide Skiers.
//
(Does make one wonder if someone looked at the price tag, and then also looked and saw what sort of drain the maintenance costs in the future were going to be as well.)

Doesn't look like the council took it into consideration but the residents did:

Some city council members have said that because the vehicle will be paid for by a federal grant, the town would be foolish not to take it. O'Meara doesn't buy it. "They try to say it's 'free.' Well it isn't free. Taxpayers are still paying to put this militaristic thing in our town. And it isn't about the money, anyway. It's about what kind of town we want to be."

467 Shropshire_Slasher  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:34:34am

re: #464 Tommy

Or leave a couple of chickens in it, but that is not fair to the chickens.

468 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:35:10am

re: #465 ☞☞☞☞☠

Meh. Fanboys.

[Video]

Lord no, please no!

469 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:35:53am

re: #462 RogueOne

Police 'Tank' Purchase Riles New Hampshire Town
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

I've been there...for their pumpkin festival. All the streets are lined with glowing pumpkins that people have carved...a friend of mine proposed to his wife with a set of jack-o-lanterns there. The tank would come in handy, as it probably has some nice large flat surfaces for holding pumpkins.

470 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:36:01am

So last night an ICE agent turned his gun on his boss, who had threatened disciplinary action. A third agent shot the first one dead. This is truly disturbing. I did this from a TV report, and linked to an earlier CNN story

[Link: edition.cnn.com...]

471 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:36:10am

re: #465 ☞☞☞☞☠

Meh. Fanboys.

[Video]

Oh god, you posted that.
...

472 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:37:05am

re: #471 Varek Raith

Oh god, you posted that.
...

Problem? *trollface.jpg*

473 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:37:51am

re: #472 ☞☞☞☞☠

Problem? *trollface.jpg*

...
No, it's all good.
...
/

474 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:37:55am

re: #469 darthstar

I've been there...for their pumpkin festival. All the streets are lined with glowing pumpkins that people have carved...a friend of mine proposed to his wife with a set of jack-o-lanterns there. The tank would come in handy, as it probably has some nice large flat surfaces for holding pumpkins.

His wife has a nice set of jack-o-lanterns?

475 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:38:25am

Can I get a DHS grant for an APC???

476 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:38:51am

re: #473 Varek Raith

...
No, it's all good.
...
/

Then why are your antennae shaking?

477 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:42:03am

re: #474 RogueOne

His wife has a nice set of jack-o-lanterns?

Gourd-jus.

479 RogueOne  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:44:13am

re: #477 darthstar

Very good!
Image: applause.gif

480 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:45:45am

re: #455 Tigger2005

Get a mirror from a salvage yard and stick it on yourself.

These are automatic mirrors.

481 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:46:21am

re: #462 RogueOne

Police 'Tank' Purchase Riles New Hampshire Town
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

What good is Posse Comitatus after you militarize the police?
Between Clinton's 100,000 police program and post 9/11 over reaction we have given our police a lot of straight out military skills and small/medium size equipment. It kinda started earlier... LAPD Daryl Gates and his "tank" (kinda hyperbolic, its an APC)
[Link: articles.latimes.com...]

482 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:47:21am

BBL. Gotta go be a sacristan for the weekend's services.

483 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:47:27am

Your morning 'heh...'

484 Interesting Times  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:47:58am
485 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:49:00am

re: #483 darthstar

Your morning 'heh...'

Image: John_Stewart_911.jpg

486 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:49:08am

re: #484 Interesting Times

Reminds me, I missed his "explanation" last night. Anybody catch that?

487 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:51:13am

re: #480 Look At My Grandbaby!

These are automatic mirrors.

Then they'll take care of themselves.

488 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:51:14am

re: #480 Look At My Grandbaby!

These are automatic mirrors.

Then they should have ducked.

(Go the salvage yard--neighborhood mechanic route.)

489 SpaceJesus  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:51:15am

lol

[Link: wonkette.com...]

490 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:54:05am

re: #480 Look At My Grandbaby!

These are automatic mirrors.

Duct-tape it on and it'll be good enough until you can save back money for a proper repair.

491 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:54:52am

re: #490 thedopefishlives

Duct-tape it on and it'll be good enough until you can save back money for a proper repair.

Don't duct tape it...bling it!

Image: sideview-mirror-frame-1-500x375.jpg

492 lawhawk  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 6:55:20am

re: #462 RogueOne

I was up in Keene last March and it's the epitome of a quaint New England town. It's a college town but it also has a very nice main street and business district. I can't see a reason for that kind of spending - except that they're spending it or else they lose the federal funding. Use it or lose it.

Frankly, this is the kind of funding we see across the country where localities are given money to upgrade their law enforcement and emergency response services with equipment they don't really need, but which they'll take because the money is there.

The town probably would have been better served by using that money to repair roads, buy a new fire truck or ambulance, rather than buying an APC that will gather dust.

493 lawhawk  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:01:00am

BTW - this is the one year anniversary since Libyans rose up to overthrow Mumar Khadafi. The economic conditions that helped foster the protests (followed by insurrection, civil war, and revolution) remain pretty much as bad as they were before Khadafi was overthrown. The NTC is incapable of restoring order or dealing the economic conditions since Khadafi gutted the various institutions and cronyism and corruption are rampant. The militias don't think too much of the NTC and are operating autonomously - opening the door for more violence to come.

Overthrowing a dictator is the easy part. Building lasting institutions that are responsive and just are much tougher. They need all the luck they can get.

494 Romantic Heretic  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:02:39am

re: #432 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

How does the Randian mindset deal with issues regarding product quality? They assume the free market will put them out of business? And if a product (or food item) kills or maims a bunch a people in the meantime it's their own fault for buying it without checking it out first?

Yes. 'Personal responsibility' and all that.

495 Eventual Carrion  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:04:11am

re: #34 They're pants, essentially...

He just equated what the administration did to forcing a Jewish soup kitchen to serve ham...

And if you don't want the ham, don't fucking order it. Granted I don't know the dietary constraints/handling for kosher food, like can there be pork products stored and prepared along side of kosher products and it still be ok? But damn, Jewish people can surely eat at Denny's and just not order bacon even if it is in the same kitchen as their meal is being prepared, right?

So if contraceptives reside on the same policy as all the other coverages then just don't use it. If their faith is so frail that they have to have it banned all over just so they won't use it, maybe it is time to reevaluate your faith.

496 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:05:36am

re: #495 RayFerd

You can't prepare kosher and non-kosher foods in the same kitchen.

The better analogy was already given by SFZ. Jewish soup kitchens wouldn't refuse cans of ham. They'd give them out to non-Jews. It's not a problem.

497 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:07:33am
498 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:08:05am

re: #497 darthstar

Wow...I never knew this before.

Hey, did you know the word "gullible" isn't in the dictionary?

499 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:09:36am

re: #498 thedopefishlives

Hey, did you know the word "gullible" isn't in the dictionary?

Depending on the dictionary, it isn't.

500 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:10:11am

re: #498 thedopefishlives

Hey, did you know the word "gullible" isn't in the dictionary?

Did you know that dictionaries don't really exist and that you're made of fudge?

501 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:10:27am

re: #498 thedopefishlives

Hey, did you know the word "gullible" isn't in the dictionary?

It isn't? Let me check.

WAITAMINUTE!!!

//

502 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:11:52am

re: #498 thedopefishlives

Hey, did you know the word "gullible" isn't in the dictionary?

Lilliputian humor...so cute.

503 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:13:30am

re: #502 darthstar

Lilliputian humor...so cute.

I prefer laputas.

504 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:13:39am

re: #495 RayFerd

And if you don't want the ham, don't fucking order it. Granted I don't know the dietary constraints/handling for kosher food, like can there be pork products stored and prepared along side of kosher products and it still be ok?

NO.

But damn, Jewish people can surely eat at Denny's and just not order bacon even if it is in the same kitchen as their meal is being prepared, right?

NO.
Hallal requirements for Muslims might be less stringent, but kosher food can NOT be prepared and served alongside non-kosher, it has to be prepared and served on completely separate utensils.

So if contraceptives reside on the same policy as all the other coverages then just don't use it. If their faith is so frail that they have to have it banned all over just so they won't use it, maybe it is time to reevaluate your faith.

Well, this is a bad analogy. Health care plans are not subject to kosher supervision. I mean, people can still subscribe to a health care plan and just not make use of the contraceptives or abortions options. It is totally nothing like eating at a kosher cafeteria.

505 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:14:22am

re: #481 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

What good is Posse Comitatus after you militarize the police?
Between Clinton's 100,000 police program and post 9/11 over reaction we have given our police a lot of straight out military skills and small/medium size equipment. It kinda started earlier... LAPD Daryl Gates and his "tank" (kinda hyperbolic, its an APC)
[Link: articles.latimes.com...]

That will just make the terrorists escalate their own weaponry.
(Example: Rickman's crew deal with the LAPD's "recreational vehicle" in _Die Hard_.)

506 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:16:05am

re: #493 lawhawk

BTW - this is the one year anniversary since Libyans rose up to overthrow Mumar Khadafi. The economic conditions that helped foster the protests (followed by insurrection, civil war, and revolution) remain pretty much as bad as they were before Khadafi was overthrown. The NTC is incapable of restoring order or dealing the economic conditions since Khadafi gutted the various institutions and cronyism and corruption are rampant. The militias don't think too much of the NTC and are operating autonomously - opening the door for more violence to come.

Overthrowing a dictator is the easy part. Building lasting institutions that are responsive and just are much tougher. They need all the luck they can get.

So they're about on par with our efforts in Iraq post-Saddam?
//

507 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:17:12am

re: #481 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

What good is Posse Comitatus after you militarize the police?
Between Clinton's 100,000 police program and post 9/11 over reaction we have given our police a lot of straight out military skills and small/medium size equipment. It kinda started earlier... LAPD Daryl Gates and his "tank" (kinda hyperbolic, its an APC)
[Link: articles.latimes.com...]

Really does at times seem like America's slowly turning into a cyberpunk version of itself, where corporations hold more power than the government, where you identify yourself with who you work for than your nationality, where there's military police on virtually every corner, and information technology has pretty much killed off human interaction.

508 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:18:02am

re: #507 Targetpractice

Have you read Snowcrash?

509 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:19:01am

re: #508 Obdicut

Have you read Snowcrash?

Not yet, but it's on my "to-do" list. Have read Neuromancer though.

510 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:19:49am

re: #509 Targetpractice

Not yet, but it's on my "to-do" list. Have read Neuromancer though.

You basically just described Snow Crash, except that the military is Libertarian before so it "Admiral Bob's Navy" and the like.

511 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:20:29am

re: #504 Look At My Grandbaby!

NO.

...snip.. and just not make use of the contraceptives or abortions options. It is totally nothing like eating at a kosher cafeteria.

Tell me there's not a Lewis Black joke in there.

512 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:21:15am

re: #510 Obdicut

You basically just described Snow Crash, except that the military is Libertarian before so it "Admiral Bob's Navy" and the like.

Yeah, it's pretty much the cyberpunk genre in general, see also: Deus Ex.

513 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:21:41am

re: #507 Targetpractice

Really does at times seem like America's slowly turning into a cyberpunk version of itself, where corporations hold more power than the government, where you identify yourself with who you work for than your nationality, where there's military police on virtually every corner, and information technology has pretty much killed off human interaction.

Yes, but I bought a bunch of stock in the OCP so I'm all set. (I liked that Robocop was set in some mythical town called Detroit)

514 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:21:42am

re: #511 Decatur Deb

Tell me there's not a Lewis Black joke in there.

Who is Lewis Black?

515 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:22:35am

Good morning lizards!

After 11 1/2 years the state of Virginia has finally caught up with me. I am now in the jury pool.

516 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:23:13am

re: #514 Look At My Grandbaby!

Who is Lewis Black?

517 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:24:04am

re: #515 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards!

After 11 1/2 years the state of Virginia has finally caught up with me. I am now in the jury pool.

They finally caught ya, huh?

//

518 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:24:38am

re: #515 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards!

After 11 1/2 years the state of Virginia has finally caught up with me. I am now in the jury pool.

Try not to leave a ring.

519 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:25:29am

re: #515 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards!

After 11 1/2 years the state of Virginia has finally caught up with me. I am now in the jury pool.

Fry the bastards!//

520 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:27:14am

Off to pour concrete--helping a buddy put a shed/bar in his panyard.

Panyard

521 Tigger2005  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:29:28am

re: #480 Look At My Grandbaby!

These are automatic mirrors.

Well, it's probably still just unplug-old plug-in new.

522 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:31:10am

re: #519 ☞☞☞☞☠

Fry the bastards!//

And don't let that nonsense about "this isn't a capital case" fool you, either.

523 darthstar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:31:30am

Friday morning...Banjo's ready for his frisbee on the beach walk. See you all later.

524 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:31:43am

re: #522 thedopefishlives

And don't let that nonsense about "this isn't a capital case" fool you, either.

Yes. Jury can "nullify" in either direction! //

525 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:31:58am

re: #515 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards!

After 11 1/2 years the state of Virginia has finally caught up with me. I am now in the jury pool.

526 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:37:45am

I'm hoping for a huge trial with a national MSM frenzy so after the trial I can write a book and make lots of money.

527 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:38:27am

re: #526 NJDhockeyfan

I'm hoping for a huge trial with a national MSM frenzy so after the trial I can write a book and make lots of money.

Yeah, but that only works if you're the lone holdout juror that causes a hung jury and mistrial.

528 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:40:58am

rain, rain, rain, fog, rain, rain rain
/looking at the weather forecast

529 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:42:27am

re: #528 Killgore Trout

rain, rain, rain, fog, rain, rain rain
/looking at the weather forecast

I see the frogs got their secret weather control device operational. It's tapping the greenhouse power.

530 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:43:21am

re: #527 thedopefishlives

Yeah, but that only works if you're the lone holdout juror that causes a hung jury and mistrial.

I need another OJ Simpson trial.

531 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:45:31am

re: #530 NJDhockeyfan

I need another OJ Simpson trial.

Does Virginia have any celebraties worthy of such attention?

532 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:49:06am

re: #529 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

I see the frogs got their secret weather control device operational. It's tapping the greenhouse power.

I've heard reports of frog sightings from a few neighbors. There aren't many survivors but some made it.

533 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:53:14am

re: #532 Killgore Trout

I've heard reports of frog sightings from a few neighbors. There aren't many survivors but some made it.

Are you going to move a few into the greenhouse for insect control and give they their own wet space?

534 Lidane  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:59:15am

Torquemada Jr. is on the defensive again:

Santorum defends backer after contraception remarks

As for his own beliefs on birth control, Santorum repeated remarks he's come under fire for in recent days. He told the Fox host that he morally disagrees with it. He said contraception is a "downside" to the "whole concept of sexual liberation, sexual freedom."

Santorum has come under pressure in recent days for comments he made in the past about contraception. In an interview in 2006, then-Sen. Santorum said he is "not a believer in birth control."

"I think it's harmful to women; I think it's harmful to society," Santorum said.

An uncomfortable-looking Santorum offered assurance that contraception will be permissible should he become president.

"Not everything that I... disagree with morally should the government be involved in," Santorum said "People have the right to in this country and it certainly will be safe to [use contraception] in a Santorum presidency."

535 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 7:59:49am

re: #531 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Does Virginia have any celebraties worthy of such attention?

Lots of athletes are from Virginia. Anything is possible.

536 lawhawk  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:02:04am

Santorum's Small Thinking - get government out of the way. It's a good op-ed on Santorum's position, but it doesn't quite go far enough. Santorum also goes to the extreme position of being all for government intrusion into personal lives - it should be ever more intrusive into a woman's health and decisions about her own life.

So, Santorum (and most of the rest of the GOP for that matter) is all for small government, except when it comes to contraceptive rights, the right to have an abortion, and other reproductive health choices. When that comes up, the government must impose highly invasive procedures that are unwarranted, costly, and extremely burdensome.

537 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:02:58am

re: #533 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Are you going to move a few into the greenhouse for insect control and give they their own wet space?

I thought about it but I think the frogs will be happier outdoors and I'm not sure I can keep my cats from attacking the frogs. I few spiders are setting up homes in the greenhouse and they seem to be doing a good job with the insects. A few lacewings are flying round the greenhouse too. No sign of pest insects yet.

538 Lidane  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:04:38am

re: #536 lawhawk

So, Santorum (and most of the rest of the GOP for that matter) is all for small government, except when it comes to contraceptive rights, the right to have an abortion, and other reproductive health choices. When that comes up, the government must impose highly invasive procedures that are unwarranted, costly, and extremely burdensome.

Government small enough to fit in a woman's uterus.

After all, she's just an overly emotional imbecile who can't be trusted to know what's best for her body. She's already too stupid to fire a gun or serve in combat, and some of the RWNJ's think she's too stupid to be trusted with the vote, or with working outside the home or doing anything other than breeding.

Assholes, all of them.

539 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:05:15am

re: #534 Lidane

Torquemada Jr. is on the defensive again:

Santorum defends backer after contraception remarks

You ever notice that, whenever one of the "Not-Romneys" comes into the spotlight, the national narrative seems to swing to whatever will hurt them the most politically?

540 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:05:39am

re: #537 Killgore Trout

I thought about it but I think the frogs will be happier outdoors and I'm not sure I can keep my cats from attacking the frogs. I few spiders are setting up homes in the greenhouse and they seem to be doing a good job with the insects. A few lacewings are flying round the greenhouse too. No sign of pest insects yet.

Apparently enough to keep the predators fed without becoming an overwhelming number causing undue harm to the plants.

My catnip plants moved outdoors once after an aphid epidemic started. Local ladybug population had a field day.

541 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:07:57am

re: #534 Lidane

Torquemada Jr. is on the defensive again:

Santorum defends backer after contraception remarks

Nice walkback. So if you're not going to support and push for legislation to control it Rick why are you yapping so loudly about it all of a sudden? Or are you just pandering in the standard GOP manner to get socon votes and then leave them at the altar (again)?

542 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:10:31am

re: #541 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Nice walkback. So if you're not going to support and push for legislation to control it Rick why are you yapping so loudly about it all of a sudden? Or are you just pandering in the standard GOP manner to get socon votes and then leave them at the altar (again)?

He's been yapping about it for awhile, but nobody was really paying attention, as the other NRs before him were the focus of the attention. That now he's in the spotlight, the months and years of stupid shit he's said about women are coming to the forefront.

543 erik_t  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:10:46am

re: #539 Targetpractice

You ever notice that, whenever one of the "Not-Romneys" comes into the spotlight, the national narrative seems to swing to whatever will hurt them the most politically?

Is that the right order? I thought the contraception silliness started before Santorum started bubbling up in the polls and the primaries.

544 wrenchwench  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:12:52am

re: #534 Lidane

then-Sen. Santorum said he is "not a believer in birth control."

"I think it's harmful to women; I think it's harmful to society,"

Moron.

He said contraception is a "downside" to the "whole concept of sexual liberation, sexual freedom."

Does he think there was an upside?

545 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:14:30am

re: #543 erik_t

Is that the right order? I thought the contraception silliness started before Santorum started bubbling up in the polls and the primaries.

The "controversy" started the same week that Ricky won his triple crown.

My worry now is that he'll do enough damage to himself between now and the 28th that Romney can make a comeback in Michigan.

546 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:14:33am

Mitt Romney attack ad says that Rick Santorum approved the "Bridge to Nowhere" (aka the bridge to Canada that will compete with the Troll's bridge)

This means money is being shoveled to Romney by the Bridge Troll and Koch Brothers.

These attack ads are trying to portray Santorum as "too liberal"

Like WTF!! I guess they figure that the people who would vote against Santorum because of his batshit crazy religious policies are already voting for Obama.

547 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:16:06am

re: #544 wrenchwench

Does he think there was an upside?

Of course not. Like any good right-wing nutjob, the idea of sexual liberation is appalling. It's a symptom of America's moral decay, after all.

548 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:16:56am

Iran, Hezbollah seek to attack more Israeli targets abroad, official says

Iranian and Hezbollah operatives are still seeking to attack Israeli targets in several countries, Israel's Counterterrorism Bureau indicated on Friday, warning Israeli citizens to adhere to the directives of local security forces.

The remarks, given during a press briefing, came after earlier Friday Thai security forces have upped alertness levels in the country's international airports and rail system over what local police is saying is an Israeli warning against new terror attacks.

549 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:17:06am

re: #546 Look At My Grandbaby!

Mitt Romney attack ad says that Rick Santorum approved the "Bridge to Nowhere" (aka the bridge to Canada that will compete with the Troll's bridge)

This means money is being shoveled to Romney by the Bridge Troll and Koch Brothers.

These attack ads are trying to portray Santorum as "too liberal"

Like WTF!! I guess they figure that the people who would vote against Santorum because of his batshit crazy religious policies are already voting for Obama.

It's all that Romney's got left to run on, Santorum's a "Washington Insider," because he can't attack him on the contraceptive business without drawing attention the Mormon Church's own practices, while he's pretty much on par with Frothy for most of the secular issues like climate change.

550 Lidane  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:21:01am
552 erik_t  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:23:18am

Ho.ly. shit.

Sourdough cheesy garlic monkey bread.

I MUST HAVE IT.

553 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:24:07am

re: #551 Killgore Trout

An interesting read here: Why is Iran having a hard time targeting Israeli diplomats?

...“If I were Iran, I would be frustrated,” a senior defense official said this week. “They are trying and trying but not succeeding.”
...

Heh.

554 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:25:00am

re: #552 erik_t

Ho.ly. shit.

Sourdough cheesy garlic monkey bread.

I MUST HAVE IT.

WANT.

555 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:25:13am

I thought for sure this was satire...
Chavez Promises to Sing at Sean Penn's Haiti Benefit Concert

Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has promised to sing at a benefit concert for Haiti being organized by Hollywood actor Sean Penn.

"We were talking about the idea of a great concert and he wants me to sing in that concert," Chavez said last night alongside Penn outside the Miraflores presidential palace in Caracas in comments broadcast on state television. "What do you think? I said yes."

It seems real. Here's the photo op

[Link: news.daylife.com...]

556 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:25:42am

re: #552 erik_t

Ho.ly. shit.

Sourdough cheesy garlic monkey bread.

I MUST HAVE IT.

Former First Lady Nancy Reagan offered another explanation when she provided the recipe to the kitchen staff to prepare for holiday visitors to the White House in 1982: “'Because when you make it, you have to monkey around with it.”

557 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:28:30am

re: #555 Killgore Trout

I thought for sure this was satire...
Chavez Promises to Sing at Sean Penn's Haiti Benefit Concert

It seems real. Here's the photo op

[Link: news.daylife.com...]

Somehow I get the feeling Chavez can't sing quite as well as our President can.

558 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:31:52am

re: #555 Killgore Trout

I thought for sure this was satire...
Chavez Promises to Sing at Sean Penn's Haiti Benefit Concert

It seems real. Here's the photo op

[Link: news.daylife.com...]

Id doesn't surprise me. There isn't a dictator he doesn't like.

559 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:32:40am

re: #557 thedopefishlives

Somehow I get the feeling Chavez can't sing quite as well as our President can.

Heh, good point. I bet Chavez is a crooner. Obama's got soul.

560 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:35:03am

re: #558 NJDhockeyfan

Id doesn't surprise me. There isn't a dictator he doesn't like.

It's a very strange attraction I still can't quite grasp. Galloway and to a lesser extent Carter too. A steady stream of Occupiers were lined up to appear on Iranian state TV. It's instinctive for some people.

561 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:35:46am

The Brits don't like this far-left loser either.

BRITS TO SEAN PENN
You’re A Moron ...
And Your Movies SUCK!!!

Members of British Parliament are lining up to slam Sean Penn ... and his movies -- trashing him over recent comments he made concerning Britain’s stance over the Falkland Islands.

In case you don't know: Britain and Argentina have both claimed sovereignty over the Falklands since the early 19th-Century ... and went to war with each other over the territory in 1982.

Penn called the Brits’ continuing claims over the Falklands "colonialist, ludicrous and archaic" -- and got their dander up even further by criticizing their recent decision to deploy Prince William there.

One member of the British Parliament called Penn’s views “nonsense." Patrick Mercer, a famed British Army veteran, also ripped Penn – calling his views “moronic.”

Mercer added, Penn “seems to know nothing about the situation” -- and “A good number of his movies have been turkeys, so I suppose we shouldn’t expect much better coming out of his mouth.”

562 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:41:05am

re: #544 wrenchwench

Moron.


Does he think there was an upside?

Yogurt gets the upside.

563 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:41:51am

re: #555 Killgore Trout

"Every day, this elected leader is called a dictator here, and we just accept it, and accept it. And this is mainstream media. There should be a bar by which one goes to prison for these kinds of lies."

564 Lidane  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:44:01am
565 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:44:13am

AP & CNN both reporting the House version of the payroll tax cut extension passed. Wonder what Boehner promised the Tea Party as a sacrifice?

566 jaunte  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:44:17am

Kentucky Economy Sluggish, Noah's Ark Theme Parks Hardest Hit

The group building a Noah's Ark-themed tourism attraction in northern Kentucky says it has purchased the final tract of land for the project but a sluggish economy has hurt fundraising.
...
The ark project has also been criticized for seeking state tax rebates for a religious-themed park. But Kentucky officials agreed to make the project eligible for more than $40 million in sales tax rebates if the Ark Encounter hits maximum attendance goals. The group has said it expects to draw more than one million visitors in the park's first year.

567 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:44:50am

re: #552 erik_t

Ho.ly. shit.

Sourdough cheesy garlic monkey bread.

I MUST HAVE IT.

Looks excellent. A quick version of that might be ideal for festivities on the morrow.

568 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:45:14am

re: #566 jaunte

Kentucky Economy Sluggish, Noah's Ark Theme Parks Hardest Hit

"What the group hasn't said is how many of those will be there in the first year just to laugh at all the rubes."

//

569 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:47:07am

re: #568 Targetpractice

"What the group hasn't said is how many of those will be there in the first year just to laugh at all the rubes."

//

Does make one wonder what sort of contingency plans the owners have to enhance attendence in that first year.

570 Lidane  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:51:35am

Senate GOP Cries Uncle On Payroll Tax Cut Bill

Confronted with strong opposition from GOP rank and file, two Senate Democratic sources say Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell has agreed to immunize the payroll tax cut agreement from a filibuster. That means it can avoid the 60-vote threshold that's become standard for significant legislation in recent years.

The development suggests opposition runs deep enough, particularly in the GOP, that the package would fail if held to the supermajority requirement.

571 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 8:56:48am

re: #570 Lidane

Senate GOP Cries Uncle On Payroll Tax Cut Bill

I don't have a particular problem with the filibuster, but the way it's been used to force a 60-vote majority on any old bill that somebody doesn't like has become annoying.

572 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:02:46am

re: #561 NJDhockeyfan

The Brits don't like this far-left loser either.

BRITS TO SEAN PENN
You’re A Moron ...
And Your Movies SUCK!!!

Penn is an idiot.

The residents aren't Argentinians. There were some sporadic colonies by the Argentines from 1823-1833. That's the sum of their claim, except for a few international treaties they claim give them rights to the islands.

Claiming that you should have the right to rule a piece of land, against the will of the inhabitants, because you like where it is, is the worst part of colonialism.

573 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:02:48am

re: #570 Lidane

Senate GOP Cries Uncle On Payroll Tax Cut Bill

My guess is because the deal was only made when Boehner finally threw up his hands and agree that the extension would not need to be "paid for" with budget cuts elsewhere.

574 wrenchwench  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:07:38am

re: #562 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Yogurt gets the upside.

Is that a reference to this?

In 1972, Downer was arrested and charged with "practicing medicine without a license" – for using yogurt to treat a woman's vaginal yeast infection. She was acquitted after a trial that was dubbed "The Great Yogurt Conspiracy"

575 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:10:08am

re: #574 wrenchwench

Is that a reference to this?

Not that.

Colonel Sandurz: [in reference to not wanting to attack Yogurt's lair] But sir, your ring! Don't you have the schwartz too?
Dark Helmet: Nah, he got the upside, I got the downside. See there's two sides to every Schwartz.

576 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:10:17am

Carter Center is demanding Israel release Islamic Jihad terrorist leader Khader Adnan

WASHINGTON (JTA) -- The Carter Center called on the Israeli government to either charge or release a Palestinian prisoner on a hunger strike.

The center founded by former President Jimmy Carter asked Israel on Thursday to release Palestinian prisoner Khader Adnan, who was arrested in December on the basis of “secret evidence.”

Adnan has been held in administrative detention without charge and has undertaken a hunger strike since being incarcerated.

The Carter Center previously spoke out about Israel’s administrative detention policies in holding three members of the Palestinian Legislative Council, including Dr. Aziz Dweik, the Speaker of the PLC.

“The detention of Speaker Dweik and other Palestinian legislators appears to be an attempt to hamstring the PLC in order to prevent Palestinian reconciliation and a prospective election later this year,” former President Carter said in a Jan. 24 press statement. “The continued use of ‘administrative detention’ also is of great concern.”

577 jaunte  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:11:11am

@j_zimms: Found some photos of Foster Friess explaining birth control. [Link: is.gd...]

578 wrenchwench  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:15:29am

re: #575 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Not that.

Colonel Sandurz: [in reference to not wanting to attack Yogurt's lair] But sir, your ring! Don't you have the schwartz too?
Dark Helmet: Nah, he got the upside, I got the downside. See there's two sides to every Schwartz.

Eh, another cultural reference flies high above my head.

I think I'll declare it a food thread anyway. We have yogurt, sourdough monkey bread, and Foster Fries.

Oh, wait...

579 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:16:56am

Damnit, now I'm starting to get even hungrier. Time to step up lunch preparations.

580 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:17:00am

re: #578 wrenchwench

Eh, another cultural reference flies high above my head.

I think I'll declare it a food thread anyway. We have yogurt, sourdough monkey bread, and Foster Fries.

Oh, wait...

Mel Brooks: Spaceballs

581 wrenchwench  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:19:12am

re: #580 Look At My Grandbaby!

Mel Brooks: Spaceballs

Yeah, I looked it up. I'm going to have to watch that eventually.

582 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:19:56am

re: #581 wrenchwench

Yeah, I looked it up. I'm going to have to watch that eventually.

"It's like I don't even know you anymore..."(c)SB//

583 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:20:43am

re: #578 wrenchwench

Eh, another cultural reference flies high above my head.

I think I'll declare it a food thread anyway. We have yogurt, sourdough monkey bread, and Foster Fries.

Oh, wait...

I was considering a quick monkey bread recipe to take tomorrow, but I have doubts about it being as good re-heated. Not enough time to make it there, and with two hour travel time and early morning departure can't make it tomorrow morning effectively. :(

Back to search mode. (Last month I made a bacon-egg-cheese breakfast strata, let it sit overnight in the fridge, and then had the hosts bake it once I arrived. Did the same thing with a stuffed pumpkin last autumn.)

Yes, I'm that sort of guest.

584 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:21:08am

re: #576 NJDhockeyfan

Carter Center is demanding Israel release Islamic Jihad terrorist leader Khader Adnan

I think there are much more noble human rights causes other than defending known members of terrorist organizations.

Saudi mufti rejects call to try Hamza by non-religious court

Saudi Arabia's mufti, the country's highest religious figure, has rejected calls to shift the trial of Hamza Kashgari, the controversial former columnist, from religious courts to the information ministry

585 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:22:10am

re: #582 ☞☞☞☞☠

"It's like I don't even know you anymore..."(c)SB//

Hmm, does make you wonder if Santorum is equipped with a virgin alarm.
/

586 Achilles Tang  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:26:04am

re: #584 Killgore Trout

Carter seems to think that if only we were nicer to them they wouldn't try to kill us, or anyone else.//

587 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:26:31am

Well, the bill got through the Senate and is now on its way to Obama for his signature. What remains to be seen is how badly the Tea Party will feel "betrayed."

588 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:27:49am

re: #584 Killgore Trout

I think there are much more noble human rights causes other than defending known members of terrorist organizations.

Saudi mufti rejects call to try Hamza by non-religious court

I don't think the Carter Center or Jimmy himself will say a word about that. I don't remember them calling on Hamas to stop the daily rockets fired at Israel either.

589 Sheila Broflovski  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:31:49am

re: #586 Red Sea Desjardini Tang

Carter seems to think that if only we were nicer to them they wouldn't try to kill us, or anyone else.//

Isn't that also what Ron Paul thinks?

590 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:33:05am

re: #584 Killgore Trout

The Carter Center

I have to drive by there once or twice a week

I just sigh as I go by!

591 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:33:18am

re: #589 Look At My Grandbaby!

Isn't that also what Rom Paul thinks?

I think he wants us to bring all of our troops back from every country and let the rest of the world fend for themselves.

592 Lidane  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:34:20am

re: #587 Targetpractice

Well, the bill got through the Senate and is now on its way to Obama for his signature. What remains to be seen is how badly the Tea Party will feel "betrayed."

Give the wingnuts time. I don't think they've got their marching orders from Limbaugh yet.

593 Achilles Tang  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:38:03am

re: #588 NJDhockeyfan

I don't think the Carter Center or Jimmy himself will say a word about that. I don't remember them calling on Hamas to stop the daily rockets fired at Israel either.

I'm surprised the GOP clowns aren't making a big deal about this violation of religious rights..///

594 Achilles Tang  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:39:32am

re: #589 Look At My Grandbaby!

Isn't that also what Ron Paul thinks?

I don't think quite that. He seems to think that if we don't fuss when they kill someone else then they won't bother us.

595 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:41:48am

Incoming Jerusalem NYT bureau chief learns dangers of Facebook, Twitter

...Just to bring all readers up to speed, Jodi Rudoren, the NYT's education editor, is about to assume the coveted post of the paper's Jerusalem Bureau Chief and even before reaching these shores, she has managed to get herself into hot water with certain media circles over a few ill-advised tweets. Rudoren's main crime was what seemed to some as an over-friendly tweet to Ali Abunimah, the anti-Zionist founder of the website Electronic Intifada (if you are not a regular reader, you can probably get the gist just from the title ).

Hot on the heels of that came her enthusiastic impression of Peter Beinart's soon to be published book, not expected to be very complimentary of Israel's current policies, which she tweeted as, "terrific: provocative, readable, full of reporting and reflection."

596 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:41:49am

re: #593 Red Sea Desjardini Tang

I'm surprised the GOP clowns aren't making a big deal about this violation of religious rights..///

Sadly nobody is paying attention to the story. There's also a web designer facing the death penalty in Iran now too. The world barely cares.

597 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:43:19am

re: #593 Red Sea Desjardini Tang

I'm surprised the GOP clowns aren't making a big deal about this violation of religious rights..///

But it's just one Saudi court case!
//

599 Lidane  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:46:39am

re: #597 NJDhockeyfan

Speaking of the Saudis:

Saudi Arabia Was Just Kidding About Letting Women Compete in the Olympics

International Olympic Committee rules require that countries allow both men and women to compete as a prerequisite for their participation in the Olympic Games. Saudia Arabia, a country that has never sent a female athlete to the games, has been warned of this, promised to correct the situation, and then sort of did nothing for awhile and hoped that no one would notice.

Now, one human rights group says enough is enough and is encouraging the IOC to bar the Middle Eastern Kingdom from the Games, on account of the fact that they're clearly dragging their feet on this. In a letter to the IOC on Wednesday, the organization demanded Saudi Arabia be barred from the upcoming London Olympic Games if they fail to send a lady to compete.

600 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:47:27am

re: #596 Killgore Trout

Sadly nobody is paying attention to the story. There's also a web designer facing the death penalty in Iran now too. The world barely cares.

And a woman accused of adultery who is going to be hanged. Iran did have her sentenced to stoning but they switched it to a noose so maybe the press see that as not news worthy.

601 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:50:19am

re: #596 Killgore Trout

Sadly nobody is paying attention to the story. There's also a web designer facing the death penalty in Iran now too. The world barely cares.

How'd that whole"open hand extended" thingy work out!?!?

602 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:50:35am

German Reporter Recalls Abuse in Iranian Jail

When German reporter Marcus Hellwig was thrown into an Iranian prison on spying allegations, it struck him as odd that the chair in the interrogation cell had no backrest.

The reason soon became clear: "There was no backrest so that they could conveniently hit and kick people's backs," Hellwig told The Associated Press in his first interview with international media.

The 46-year-old reporter for Germany's mass-circulation Bild am Sonntag was arrested with his photographer after entering Iran on a tourist visa in October 2010 and interviewing the son of Sakineh Mohammadi Ashtiani, an Iranian woman sentenced to death by stoning for adultery in a case that generated international outrage.

Hellwig and photographer Jens Koch were split up and Hellwig said he was initially thrown into a plain 65 sq. foot (6 sq. meter) cell kept brightly lit 24 hours a day, but without a window or toilet. There was no furniture, only a carpet to lie on.

Hellwig said he was held in a facility run by the Pasdaran, Iran's feared Revolutionary Guard elite forces, and heard "terrifying cries" of inmates being abused every day.

"I was scared to death. Knowing that I was in a Pasdaran prison, with no lawyer or diplomatic assistance, outside of the official judicial system, they could have done anything to me," he said. "This total insecurity was the worst — physical pain heals after a couple of hours."

603 blueraven  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:53:55am

re: #601 sattv4u2

How'd that whole"open hand extended" thingy work out!?!?

About as well as the whole "axis of evil" thing.

604 kirkspencer  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:56:01am

re: #576 NJDhockeyfan

Carter Center is demanding Israel release Islamic Jihad terrorist leader Khader Adnan

Headline error, which if fixed makes this a less outrageous position.

Carter is demanding Israel CHARGE OR release ...

605 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:57:13am

re: #604 kirkspencer

Headline error, which if fixed makes this a less outrageous position.

Carter is demanding Israel CHARGE OR release ...

It's repulsive no matter how you write the headline.

606 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:57:25am

re: #603 blueraven

About as well as the whole "axis of evil" thing.

Yeah ,, because they were actually an Axis Of All Thats Good And Lollipops and Puppies

607 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:57:52am

Rush Limbaugh Leads GOP In Pondering How To Deal With Improving Economy

there’s another idea gaining traction fast on the right as well: ditch the economy entirely and instead return to the 2004 God/guns/gays plan that re-elected President Bush. Since Rove-style national security demagoguery is pretty hard to use against Barack “Bin Laden Sleeps With The Fishes” Obama, that means social issues would likely become the dominant part of the campaign. Let’s call it the Santorum Approach.

“I suspect if I’m Mitt Romney, I’m getting a little nervous because maybe that jobs picture won’t look so bad in November,” Santorum said last month after the latest jobs report. “And then, what’s his pitch to all of you? ‘I’m the guy who can put you back to work.’ The president of the United States is more than a guy in the private sector who knows how to create jobs. You’ve got to be the commander in chief. You’ve got to look at bigger issues. You’ve got to look at what the role of a leader is in this country.”

Given that Republicans have been losing almost every fight this year over abortion, gay marriage, and contraception in the court of public opinion, this may come across as a dangerous move. But it has at least one very powerful sympathizer in Rush Limbaugh (who, by the way, has no qualms about openly rooting for the economy to fail this year).

“Something tells me, that if the upcoming election could be decided on social issues, the Republicans could win that in a landslide, because we are on the right side of the culture war,” Limbaugh told listeners on Thursday. “The problem is, we’re scared to death of it. The Republican establishment wants no part of it.”

608 blueraven  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:58:14am

re: #604 kirkspencer

Headline error, which if fixed makes this a less outrageous position.

Carter is demanding Israel CHARGE OR release ...

Actually

The Carter Center called on the Israeli government to either charge or release a Palestinian prisoner on a hunger strike.

There are no demands anywhere.

609 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:58:18am

re: #606 sattv4u2

Yeah ,, because they were actually an Axis Of All Thats Good And Lollipops and Puppies

"...evil puppies?" /

610 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:58:37am

re: #609 ☞☞☞☞☠

"...evil puppies?" /

with laser beams on their foreheads

611 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 9:59:10am

re: #604 kirkspencer

Headline error, which if fixed makes this a less outrageous position.

Carter is demanding Israel CHARGE OR release ...

Actually the Center's own site says just "release" on FP.

612 HappyWarrior  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:00:05am

re: #607 Kragar

Rush Limbaugh Leads GOP In Pondering How To Deal With Improving Economy

Dumbass really thinks they can win with the culture war? Go for it and then your asses get kicked.

613 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:00:19am

Santorum Backer Laughs Off Birth Control 'Joke'

Viewers didn't get the "context of that joke," Friess told MSNBC's The Last Word with Lawrence O'Donnell. Back in his day, Friess said, the birth control pill wasn't available, so the thought of aspirin used as birth control would be pretty "silly" and "funny," he said.

614 blueraven  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:00:19am

re: #606 sattv4u2

Yeah ,, because they were actually an Axis Of All Thats Good And Lollipops and Puppies

Where did that rhetoric get us, was the implied question.

615 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:01:52am

re: #605 NJDhockeyfan

It's repulsive no matter how you write the headline.

So you're in favor indefinite detention with no charges? Just in Israel, or here, too?

616 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:02:00am

re: #612 HappyWarrior

Dumbass really thinks they can win with the culture war? Go for it and then your asses get kicked.

Dumbass still preaches that the reason they can't win elections is that their candidates aren't conservative enough.

617 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:02:52am

re: #615 Coracle

So you're in favor indefinite detention with no charges? Just in Israel, or here, too?

We don't know what evidence Israel has on this terrorist but I bet it's not jaywalking.

618 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:03:36am
619 HappyWarrior  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:03:45am

re: #616 Kragar

Dumbass still preaches that the reason they can't win elections is that their candidates aren't conservative enough.

Yeah I know. I hope they nominate Santorum and Santorum gets Goldwatered or McGoverned or even Dukakised and puts that myth to rest.

620 McSpiff  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:04:20am

re: #617 NJDhockeyfan

We don't know what evidence Israel has on this terrorist but I bet it's not jaywalking.

So charge and convict like the rest of the civilized world does.

621 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:04:57am

re: #620 McSpiff

So charge and convict like the rest of the civilized world does.

Israel is,, UNcivilized??

622 jaunte  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:05:19am

Feds arrest man heading to U.S. Capitol for suicide mission

Authorities have arrested a man on his way to the U.S. Capitol for what he thought would be a suicide attack on one of the nation's most symbolic landmarks, Fox News has learned exclusively.

The man, in his 30s and of Moroccan descent, was nabbed following a lengthy investigation by the FBI, initiated after he expressed interest in conducting an attack. It's unclear how the FBI learned of his aspirations.

The man thought undercover FBI agents assisting him in his plot were associates of Al Qaeda.

When he was arrested Friday in Washington, he was carrying with him a vest supposedly packed with explosives, but the material inside was not actually dangerous...

623 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:05:25am

re: #607 Kragar

Rush Limbaugh Leads GOP In Pondering How To Deal With Improving Economy

So Jabba thinks the GOP could win the "culture war"? Perhaps he's not seen where they're polling the contraception question.

624 McSpiff  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:05:51am

re: #621 sattv4u2

Israel is,, UNcivilized??

No, Israel is very civilized. That's why I hold it to the same standard as the rest of the civilized world.

625 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:05:53am

re: #617 NJDhockeyfan

We don't know what evidence Israel has on this terrorist but I bet it's not jaywalking.

Then we can't know if the arrest and detention is justified.

Your apparent trust in the government is comforting. Does that extend to this side of the Atlantic as well?

And you haven't answered my question.

626 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:05:58am

re: #621 sattv4u2

Israel is,, UNcivilized??

"Reading comprehension is crucial!" (c) NJDH

"the rest of" implies that Israel belongs to the civilized world.

627 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:06:40am

re: #620 McSpiff

So charge and convict like the rest of the civilized world does.

Like we do at Gitmo.
Uh, wait a minute...
///

628 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:07:21am

re: #627 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

Like we do at Gitmo.
Uh, wait a minute...
///

He said civilized world!

///
///

629 McSpiff  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:07:23am

re: #627 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

Like we do at Gitmo.
Uh, wait a minute...
///

I'd say the same thing in that case as well. Charge and convict.

630 kirkspencer  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:08:42am

re: #611 ☞☞☞☞☠

Actually the Center's own site says just "release" on FP.

um, no. From Carter Center:

Atlanta…The Carter Center calls on the Israeli government to immediately charge or release Palestinian prisoner Khader Adnan, ...

(my emphasis)

631 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:09:47am

re: #629 McSpiff

Why do you do that with a P.O.W.?

632 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:09:55am

re: #630 kirkspencer

Their headline and their text differ. They're doing themselves no favors

633 kirkspencer  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:10:04am

re: #630 kirkspencer
Ah, wait, I see what you're saying. On the front page in the opening link.

But not in the article linked on this page, and not in Carter Center's actual article.

634 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:10:53am

Oh and why do we not have headlines from Carter demanding the release of combatants held by Hezbollah etc? Is it him or the media?

635 McSpiff  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:11:09am

re: #631 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

Why do you do that with a P.O.W.?

The USG has been absolutely clear that they do not consider anyone in Gitmo a P. O. W. Perhaps you should do additional research into this?

636 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:11:31am

re: #625 Coracle

Then we can't know if the arrest and detention is justified.

Your apparent trust in the government is comforting. Does that extend to this side of the Atlantic as well?

And you haven't answered my question.

You going to try to turn this into a pissing match on whether I agree with the Carter Center? No I don't. With their anti-Israel pro-Hamas history I don't give a rats ass what they think.

637 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:11:34am

re: #630 kirkspencer

Sorry, how about reading what I wrote?

Here's the Center's front page:

[Link: cartercenter.org...]

Here's the headline:

Feb. 16, 2012
The Carter Center Calls on Israel to Release Hunger Striker Khader Adnan >>

And oh the irony, their p-r to which you linked is entitled:

The Carter Center Calls on Israel to Release Hunger Striker Khader Adnan

638 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:12:21am

re: #633 kirkspencer

and not in Carter Center's actual article.

Look again.

639 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:12:28am

re: #627 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

The one thing we've been very careful to do is not declare them POWs, because they're not being treated in the way we treat POWs.

640 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:13:21am

RAGE BUILDING

Virginia Poised To Enact ‘State-Sponsored Rape’ Law Forcing Women To Be Vaginally Probed Before Abortions

discussions among lawmakers leave little doubt that its supporters understood just what they were trying to write into law — they just didn’t care. As an unnamed lawmaker told a fellow Virginia delegate, a woman already consented to being “vaginally penetrated when they got pregnant.”

What kind of fucking horseshit is that?

641 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:13:26am

re: #636 NJDhockeyfan

No. My question to you had nothing to do with the Carter Center.
Very specifically: Do you believe Israel has a right to indefinite detention without charging? Do you believe that the US or Canada have the right to indefinite detention without charging?

642 jaunte  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:15:14am
643 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:16:30am

re: #640 Kragar

RAGE BUILDING

Virginia Poised To Enact ‘State-Sponsored Rape’ Law Forcing Women To Be Vaginally Probed Before Abortions

What kind of fucking horseshit is that?

Sometimes I wish LGF didn't have anti-violent comments rules.

644 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:17:31am

re: #635 McSpiff

It is my contention that battle or post attack captured terrorists affiliated with the big organizations should be treated as POW's. get of the criminal track entirely, and negotiate release for trade of prisoners or concessions.

645 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:17:45am

re: #640 Kragar

RAGE BUILDING

Virginia Poised To Enact ‘State-Sponsored Rape’ Law Forcing Women To Be Vaginally Probed Before Abortions

What kind of fucking horseshit is that?

The sooner the inevitable challenge gets to the supreme court the better.

646 jaunte  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:17:56am
647 Kragar  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:18:25am

re: #643 ☞☞☞☞☠

Sometimes I wish LGF didn't have anti-violent comments rules.

Dramatic reenactment

648 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:18:33am

re: #641 Coracle

Darn it I have to run in a sec, but the POW rules could apply. Indefinite means until a negotiated release as in a swap or at a negotiated end of hostilities.

649 McSpiff  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:18:37am

re: #644 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

It is my contention that battle or post attack captured terrorists affiliated with the big organizations should be treated as POW's. get of the criminal track entirely, and negotiate release for trade of prisoners or concessions.

In that case yes I agree.

650 McSpiff  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:19:06am

re: #640 Kragar

RAGE BUILDING

Virginia Poised To Enact ‘State-Sponsored Rape’ Law Forcing Women To Be Vaginally Probed Before Abortions

What kind of fucking horseshit is that?

Fucking hateful swine.

651 Simply Sarah  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:20:04am

re: #645 Coracle

The sooner the inevitable challenge gets to the supreme court the better.

Well, that's exactly what the sponsors want. All these radical bills are in large part designed to get abortion in front of the Supreme Court again, with the hope being that they'll overturn Roe. If the laws don't get challenged? Well, then they can continue to chip away at abortion rights until they reach their goal that way.

652 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:20:25am

re: #640 Kragar

RAGE BUILDING

Virginia Poised To Enact ‘State-Sponsored Rape’ Law Forcing Women To Be Vaginally Probed Before Abortions

What kind of fucking horseshit is that?

It's the GOP doing the hard work for the DNC, writing the campaign commercials for them. Shit like this is what's going to drive women to the polls in November. It's the "culture war" that Rush thinks the GOP can win.

653 HappyWarrior  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:20:25am

re: #640 Kragar

RAGE BUILDING

Virginia Poised To Enact ‘State-Sponsored Rape’ Law Forcing Women To Be Vaginally Probed Before Abortions

What kind of fucking horseshit is that?

I guess these are the jobs Bob McDonnell ran on. Seriously this is pathetic as hell.

654 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:20:44am

re: #641 Coracle

No. My question to you had nothing to do with the Carter Center.
Very specifically: Do you believe Israel has a right to indefinite detention without charging?

Israel has the right to do whatever they want to in their own country. I have no idea what their laws are.

Do you believe that the US or Canada have the right to indefinite detention without charging?

If it's against the law, no. If they end up at Gitmo before they touch our soil, it sucks to be them.

655 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:21:20am

re: #648 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

Darn it I have to run in a sec, but the POW rules could apply. Indefinite means until a negotiated release as in a swap or at a negotiated end of hostilities.

Until and unless they are declared a POW, those rules do not apply. So what - would it be more satisfactory to say "Charge, release, or declare them a POW?".

Regardless until that time these people are simply in indefinite detention without charges. Very civilized.

656 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:21:48am

re: #643 ☞☞☞☞☠

Sometimes I wish LGF didn't have anti-violent comments rules.

Write the comments in Russian, paste them into Google Translate and let it translate that to Spanish. Take the Spanish output and translate it into German. Finally, translate the German into English and post the result. The verb placement problems alone should be enough to pretty much encrypt the old ultraviolence, or at least make it comical.

657 McSpiff  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:22:18am

re: #654 NJDhockeyfan

Do you believe that the US or Canada have the right to indefinite detention without charging?

If it's against the law, no. If they end up at Gitmo before they touch our soil, it sucks to be them.

Presumably then, you also feel that the US soldiers serving in overseas military bases also don't deserve constitutional protection?

658 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:22:55am

re: #651 Simply Sarah

Well, that's exactly what the sponsors want. All these radical bills are in large part designed to get abortion in front of the Supreme Court again, with the hope being that they'll overturn Roe. If the laws don't get challenged? Well, then they can continue to chip away at abortion rights until they reach their goal that way.

I do understand that. They believe the court will be on their side.

I want to know if I'm living in a country where the highest court in the land is on that side.

659 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:24:30am

re: #637 ☞☞☞☞☠

Sorry, how about reading what I wrote?

Here's the Center's front page:

[Link: cartercenter.org...]

Here's the headline:

And oh the irony, their p-r to which you linked is entitled:

Heh. "Hunger striker" sounds so much better than "terrorist". Who could oppose releasing a peaceful hunger striker?

660 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:24:35am

re: #656 Bishop Cornwallis Gobbletot

No, it didn't work. It's still obvious what is meant. Damn, google is good.

661 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:26:40am

Carter Center Urges Israel to Release Palestinian Legislators
They are Hamas members, an internationally recognized terrorist organization.

662 Simply Sarah  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:26:48am

re: #658 Coracle

I do understand that. They believe the court will be on their side.

I want to know if I'm living in a country where the highest court in the land is on that side.

Yeah. I'm just afraid of what the answer might be. O'Connor retiring when she did was a terrible tragedy.

663 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:26:53am

re: #654 NJDhockeyfan

If it's against the law, no. If they end up at Gitmo before they touch our soil, it sucks to be them.

Two points for really good hedging. Professional quality. Is indefinite detention by the government, without charges, compatible with a free society?

664 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:27:22am

re: #657 McSpiff

If it's against the law, no. If they end up at Gitmo before they touch our soil, it sucks to be them.

Presumably then, you also feel that the US soldiers serving in overseas military bases also don't deserve constitutional protection?

I think we have agreements with various countries in which our military are subject to UCMJ. They have to do something really seriously bad to end up in the country's prison.

665 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:27:52am

heh

667 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:30:39am

re: #661 Killgore Trout

Carter Center Urges Israel to Release Palestinian Legislators
They are Hamas members, an internationally recognized terrorist organization.

Screw the terrorism links. Charge them or release them!

//

668 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:32:55am

re: #667 NJDhockeyfan

Screw the terrorism links. Charge them or release them!

//

Damn straight - if you want to have cred as a free society remove the sarc tags.

Though in deference to RWC, I'd add "or declare them POW".

669 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:37:04am

re: #655 Coracle

Until and unless they are declared a POW, those rules do not apply. So what - would it be more satisfactory to say "Charge, release, or declare them a POW?".

Regardless until that time these people are simply in indefinite detention without charges. Very civilized.

IMO they are P.O.W's in by practical measures. Legal/semantic maneuvers by governments are flying in the face of reality on this. Guerilla soldiers essentially. And of course all the conduct rules apply-Red Cross inspections, square meals, no torture, etc.

670 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:37:16am

re: #668 Coracle

Damn straight - if you want to have cred as a free society remove the sarc tags.

Though in deference to RWC, I'd add "or declare them POW".

Obama is an oppressive wingnut troll!
/

671 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:38:39am

re: #669 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

IMO they are P.O.W's in by practical measures. Legal/semantic maneuvers by governments are flying in the face of reality on this. Guerilla soldiers essentially. And of course all the conduct rules apply-Red Cross inspections, square meals, no torture, etc.

Then we should have the balls to declare them so and treat them so. It's our shame that we don't.

672 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:39:44am

re: #670 Killgore Trout

Obama is an oppressive wingnut troll!
/

I think treatment of the GITMO prisoners is one of the Obama Admin's real failures.

673 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:40:23am

re: #667 NJDhockeyfan

Screw the terrorism links. Charge them or release them!

//

He's not calling for trials. He asking for unconditional freedom.

"These men are guilty of nothing more than winning a parliamentary seat in an open and honest election, which was monitored by The Carter Center in 2006," said former U.S. President Jimmy Carter.

674 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:40:50am

re: #672 Coracle

I think treatment of the GITMO prisoners is one of the Obama Admin's real failures.

Don't forget NDAA.

675 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:44:05am

There is a good case against indefinite detention laws. However I would urge critics to develop a more realistic understanding of why someone like Obama would support them. There is a very real reason. It's one of the many issues that deserves a better discussion than it gets.

676 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:44:07am

re: #674 Killgore Trout

A laundry list was not my point. Charge, release, or declare POW. Or admit you don't actually value freedom or human rights. Applies to the US and Israel.

677 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:48:01am

re: #673 Killgore Trout

He's not calling for trials. He asking for unconditional freedom.

Other than terrorism and murder they are just innocent misunderstood gentlemen.

678 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:48:54am

re: #672 Coracle

I think treatment of the GITMO prisoners is one of the Obama Admin's real failures.

How are they being treated?

679 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:49:56am

re: #677 NJDhockeyfan

Other than terrorism and murder they are just innocent misunderstood gentlemen.

If this one is not, and there is evidence to prove it, fucking charge him, then. Otherwise that's just gas.

The problem with a free society is that you have to take the risks of letting people behave freely.

680 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:50:36am

re: #678 NJDhockeyfan

How are they being treated?

The are being held indefinitely without charge.

681 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:54:30am

re: #679 Coracle

This comes down to double standards. The same people that defend indefinite detention without trial for "good guys" would be (and are) all agog if/when the "bad guys" do the same, rightly arguing that such measures are not democratic.

682 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:54:46am

re: #680 Coracle

The are being held indefinitely without charge.

They are POWs treated humanely and in accordance with the Geneva Conventions. What's the problem?

683 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 10:58:02am

re: #681 ☞☞☞☞☠

Agreed. That is a point I'd like NDJH to admit to.

684 kirkspencer  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 11:00:56am

re: #682 NJDhockeyfan

They are POWs treated humanely and in accordance with the Geneva Conventions. What's the problem?

No, they aren't. They are not POWs, nor are they criminals, and as such they have been prohibited certain rights each category is afforded.

That they have been treated humanely is, well, since they're neither fish nor fowl, neither of the category of oversight bodies on which we rely has been able to check on them. I'd like to assume they're being treated humanely. Unfortunately Abu Ghraib happened, and I will not trust without verification anymore.

685 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 11:01:12am

re: #682 NJDhockeyfan

We have not declared them to be POWs, and are not treating them as if they are.
The fact of the matter is that the GITMO prisoners are in a similar limbo to the case in Israel and the same need to accuse, declare, or release exists, if we want to hold the mantle of a free society that respects human rights.

686 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 11:22:51am

re: #685 Coracle

Are we not (at least since Obama took office) treating them as well as what is called for in the instance of POW's?

687 Coracle  Fri, Feb 17, 2012 12:00:23pm

re: #686 Antipasta Loving Antipartisan

Are we not (at least since Obama took office) treating them as well as what is called for in the instance of POW's?

I don't know. I don't think we've been very privy to how GITMO detainees are actually being treated - physically, mentally, or legally.


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