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Texas Kills Women’s Health Program to Get at Planned Parenthood

The GOP is destroying women’s rights, one state at a time
Wingnuts • Views: 35,589

Texas Gov. Rick Perry’s administration continues their all-out war against women’s rights, by signing into law a bill that bans Planned Parenthood and other abortion providers from participating in the Texas’ Women’s Health Program — effectively killing the program altogether.

If there was any hope that the state was seeking a compromise with the federal government over Texas’ Women’s Health Program, it’s fading fast. At the direction of lawmakers and Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott, the Texas Health and Human Services commissioner signed a rule on Thursday that formally bans Planned Parenthood clinics and other “affiliates of abortion providers” from participating in the program — something the Obama administration has said is a deal-breaker for the nearly $40 million-per-year state-federal Medicaid program. …

The rule, signed by Commissioner Tom Suehs on Thursday, takes effect March 14. Unless some last-minute agreement is brokered, the program, which receives $9 in federal funds for every $1 in state funds, will be either phased out or cut off by the end of March. At least 130,000 poor Texas women will lose access to cancer screenings, well-woman exams and contraception.

“No one’s politics should interfere with a woman’s access to health care,” said Planned Parenthood Gulf Coast President and CEO Peter J. Durkin. “It is shameful that Governor Perry and Commissioner Suehs continue to politicize lifesaving breast cancer screenings and birth control access for low-income women.”

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388 comments

1 Interesting Times  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:32:45am
2 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:37:26am

These idiots in the state legislature feel free to pass up Federal money (even though Texas only gets 91 cents on the dollar back from each Federal tax dollar as it is) because it's "only going to be spent on poor women's health issues anyway."

3 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:37:36am

When does Mullah Omar immigrate to a retirement home in Texas? Looks like he will feel right at home.

4 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:39:27am

re: #3 Daniel Ballard

When does Mullah Omar immigrate to a retirement home in Texas? Looks like he will feel right at home.

Arab oil and Texas oil. Perhaps there is something about cause and effect. A match made in heaven for the Texas Ayatollahs.

5 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:40:21am
At the direction of lawmakers and Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott, the Texas Health and Human Services commissioner signed a rule on Thursday that formally bans Planned Parenthood clinics and other “affiliates of abortion providers” from participating in the program

Depending on how they define 'affiliate', that could include lots of OB/GYN doctors, the nurses who work with them, lots of hospitals and clinics, etc.

6 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:41:07am

"Hmm, our party is getting its ass beat in the press by being portrayed as anti-woman with its efforts. How do we prove we're not? I know, let's give them more ammo by continuing that attacks!"

Utter morons.

7 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:41:17am

This is perfectly understandable with all those abortions that Planned Parenthood provides.
///

8 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:41:33am

More destructive legislative maneuvers from the evil geniuses at ALEC.

9 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:42:47am
“It is shameful that Governor Perry and Commissioner Suehs continue to politicize lifesaving breast cancer screenings and birth control access for low-income women.”

Bulls Eye.

10 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:42:55am

re: #8 jaunte

More destructive legislative maneuvers from the evil geniuses at ALEC.

Who should be treated to the full Lysistrata.
[Link: www.alec.org...]

11 Interesting Times  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:43:01am

re: #8 jaunte

More destructive legislative maneuvers from the evil geniuses at ALEC.

Speaking of which:

12 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:45:21am

I tire from the intensity of the stupidity coming from the right, in the US and here. What is going on?

13 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:47:32am

re: #12 Grumpy, Not Sneezy

I tire from the intensity of the stupidity coming from the right, in the US and here. What is going on?

A black man in the White House has an excellent chance of getting reelected.

14 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:48:25am

re: #12 Grumpy, Not Sneezy

Power-crazed zero-sum greedhead mofos, scared of losing it all.

15 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:50:00am

re: #12 Grumpy, Not Sneezy

I tire from the intensity of the stupidity coming from the right, in the US and here. What is going on?

Election year desperation, as they find themselves in serious danger of losing their current dominance at the polls.

Well, perhaps not in Texas, but in other states it seems that the worm has turned.

16 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:51:40am

re: #14 jaunte

Power-crazed zero-sum greedhead mofos, scared of losing it all.

Yes. A lot of this is window dressing to get their ignorant electorate to vote for them and in which said politicians help maintain the status quo of tax-cuts and other government incentives for a select sector of multi-national corporations.

17 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:53:55am

So you get them to vote for you on social issues but use that power of office for the benefit of Koch Industries, Exxon, Massey Energy, Peabody Energy, etc.

18 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:54:39am

...

19 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:55:24am

re: #13 I Never Tilt My Camera

A black man in the White House has an excellent chance of getting reelected.

So the amount of melanin in his skin is enough reason to go insane?

That's a fucking alien mindset from where I'm sitting.

20 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:55:36am

re: #18 I Never Tilt My Camera

...

Link got eatted.

21 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:55:52am

re: #16 Gus

A lot of this is window dressing to get their ignorant electorate ...

Image: pic.jpg

22 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:56:09am

re: #17 Gus

So you get them to vote for you on social issues but use that power of office for the benefit of Koch Industries, Exxon, Massey Energy, Peabody Energy, etc.

Thing is, social issues of late have been a vote loser for the GOP. Unlike previous generations, these new ones aren't jumping as much at the three boogeymen of abortions, birth control, and gay marriages.

23 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:57:20am
This boils down to the rule of law — which the state of Texas respects and the Obama administration does not.

Oh, who the fuck are you kidding, bitch? Federal law overrides state law and you're the ones breaking the law here.

God damn, brian dead, heartless, selfish, narrow minded, australopithecine, theocratic, authoritarian assholes!

24 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:58:08am

This comment belongs here.

299 moderatelyradicalliberal

You know what? FUCK THE GOP! Fuck those woman hating bastards. Everyone of them. In my home state of Texas, the GOP is set to kill a program that funds preventative care and contraception for thousands of poor and low income women because the Federal Govt which funds 90% of the program allows these women to go to Planned Parenthood to get services. Half of the women who come to the clinic where I work for OB/GYN services are on this program. We may have to close are OB/GYN department.

[...]

Read the whole thing.

25 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 10:59:53am

re: #22 Targetpractice

Thing is, social issues of late have been a vote loser for the GOP. Unlike previous generations, these new ones aren't jumping as much at the three boogeymen of abortions, birth control, and gay marriages.

We're not really sure yet if it's a vote loser for the GOP. We'll find out come November. It still seems to be a vote winner for these state however and Texas has always been a prime example. I'm afraid we've returned to the state where you really have to think twice before moving to a particular state because of their general stance on social issues. Traditionally this was the original states of the Confederacy. But it has spread to northern states.

26 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:00:43am

re: #23 Romantic Heretic

Oh, who the fuck are you kidding, bitch? Federal law overrides state law and you're the ones breaking the law here.

God damn, brian dead, heartless, selfish, narrow minded, australopithecine, theocratic, authoritarian assholes!

27 Mocking Jay  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:02:33am

The Handmaid's Tale wasn't meant to be an action plan...

28 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:05:10am

re: #25 Gus

We're not really sure yet if it's a vote loser for the GOP. We'll find out come November. It still seems to be a vote winner for these state however and Texas has always been a prime example. I'm afraid we've returned to the state where you really have to think twice before moving to a particular state because of their general stance on social issues. Traditionally this was the original states of the Confederacy. But it has spread to northern states.

Like I said, it may not be much of a loser in Texas, it'll just mean fewer women showing up for the GOP on election day. But in other states, like here in VA, it seems that the sleeping giant has been awoken. McDonnell had to publicly come out as "against" mandated wanding, something that he probably wouldn't have batted an eye for if women voters hadn't show up in Richmond to voice their displeasure.

29 Decatur Deb  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:07:00am

re: #23 Romantic Heretic

Oh, who the fuck are you kidding, bitch? Federal law overrides state law and you're the ones breaking the law here.

God damn, brian dead, heartless, selfish, narrow minded, australopithecine, theocratic, authoritarian assholes!

Forgot "Confederates".

30 Mocking Jay  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:07:04am

re: #28 Targetpractice

Men start paying attention once their nookie supply is threatened.

31 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:08:33am

re: #25 Gus

I'm afraid we've returned to the state where you really have to think twice before moving to a particular state because of their general stance on social issues.

Bingo.

32 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:09:54am

re: #30 The Most Interesting Man in My World

Men start paying attention once their nookie supply is threatened.

Which is part of the reason why they're trying to drag us back to the 50s, warts and all. They want to return to those days when a woman didn't have even control over the nookie, lest their man go looking elsewhere.

33 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:10:55am

Americans' sympathies evenly divided between religious leaders and the Obama administration

Americans have paid fairly close attention to the news about whether religious-based employers should have to provide contraception coverage for employees as part of their health plans. When asked what they think about the issue, 48% of all Americans say they sympathize more with the views of religious leaders, while 45% sympathize more with the Obama administration. The views of men and women are nearly identical.

34 Mocking Jay  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:11:50am

re: #25 Gus

We're not really sure yet if it's a vote loser for the GOP. We'll find out come November. It still seems to be a vote winner for these state however and Texas has always been a prime example. I'm afraid we've returned to the state where you really have to think twice before moving to a particular state because of their general stance on social issues. Traditionally this was the original states of the Confederacy. But it has spread to northern states.

New York taxes vs. 14th century values isn't a tough decision for me to make.

35 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:12:24am

re: #33 Killgore Trout

Americans' sympathies evenly divided between religious leaders and the Obama administration

The question is which side will flinch first. My money's on Obama.

36 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:13:24am

re: #34 The Most Interesting Man in My World

New York taxes vs. 14th century values isn't a tough decision for me to make.

Yep. You either pay more or go back to being a closet gay, atheist, etc. Because it really is that way in the outback of America.

37 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:14:13am

///Gentlemen and ladies, I feel the time has come to mess with Texas.

38 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:14:56am

re: #33 Killgore Trout

When asked what they think about the issue, 48% of all Americans say they sympathize more with the views of religious leaders, while 45% sympathize more with the Obama administration. The views of men and women are nearly identical.

That number is shocking to me, and I find it just stunning that this is even an issue. For fuck's sake, IT'S 2012 YOU THROWBACKS!

39 Achilles Tang  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:14:58am

This is so depressing. Perhaps I watch too much MSNBC and think most Americans have the same IQ. At least 75.

40 Tigger2005  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:15:14am

re: #35 Targetpractice

The question is which side will flinch first. My money's on Obama.

I doubt it. Not this time.

41 Interesting Times  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:15:35am

re: #33 Killgore Trout

Americans' sympathies evenly divided between religious leaders and the Obama administration

As I said previously, the whole premise of that poll is idiotic:

WTF Gallup? Asking who do people "sympathize" with, "religious leaders" or "Obama administration"? Ridiculous, stupid premise to the whole poll in the first place. Why on earth didn't they ask whether people agreed with the policy or not? Or agreed with whether religious institutions have the right to deny any coverage they want if it offends their beliefs?

It's almost as if they push-polled this question to generate responses as sympathetic to the religious nutters as possible.

42 Tigger2005  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:16:13am

re: #38 I Never Tilt My Camera

That number is shocking to me, and I find it just stunning that this is even an issue. For fuck's sake, IT'S 2012 YOU THROWBACKS!

Frankly, I think a lot of this had to do with how the issue was framed. I don't think a lot of Americans really get what's going on.

43 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:17:21am

re: #40 Tigger2005

I doubt it. Not this time.

I'd believe it if he stood up and gave a speech on why he is supporting the rights of women to quality health care over the rights of religious oligarchs to rule women as they like.

But he hasn't, so I'm waiting until he inevitably tries to reach a "compromise" that sees the Catholic Church get 99.9% of what it wants.

44 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:17:32am

re: #41 Interesting Times

As I said previously, the whole premise of that poll is idiotic:

True but a good 50 percent of America is literally "Jesus Camp." Obama was correct when he said "it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion." It's a shrinking demographic but it still remains a powerful one.

45 Decatur Deb  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:18:01am

re: #42 Tigger2005

Frankly, I think a lot of this had to do with how the issue was framed. I don't think a lot of Americans really get what's going on.

Let's not hypnotize ourselves. Ninety-plus percent of Americans consider themselves affiliated with some kind of religion.

46 Mocking Jay  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:18:34am

re: #36 Gus

Yep. You either pay more or go back to being a closet gay, atheist, etc. Because it really is that way in the outback of America.

I don't mind paying for civilization.

47 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:19:38am

Every once in a while, despite the meds I'm on, I get severely depressed where I recoil from contact with others and want to sleep all the time. Usually it's just part of a cycle of ups and downs the meds are unable to smooth out completely that I just ride out, even when I feel like giving up, because I know it's temporary.

What's happening down there, and what I hear on the local RW radio shows, even though I intellectually understand the success of those attitudes doesn't have a high probability, is really affecting my current down swing.

Fuck 'em.

48 Interesting Times  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:20:53am

re: #45 Decatur Deb

Let's not hypnotize ourselves. Ninety-plus percent of Americans consider themselves affiliated with some kind of religion.

But roughly the same number (of women, anyway) use birth control. And if the ones who aren't paying attention finally got it through their skulls that it could be taken away from them, you'd see the GOP get the electoral kick in the balls it so sorely deserves.

49 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:21:16am
50 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:21:53am

Steve Silberman ‏ @stevesilberman
.@MrSmolin on Santorum: Religious extremists commit the greatest blasphemy of all: They think God needs their help.

51 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:21:56am

re: #49 Charles Johnson

Headline of the day: Santorum Comes From Behind in Alabama Three-Way.

So, who do I send the bill for my new monitor?

//

52 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:22:19am

re: #47 Grumpy, Not Sneezy

Why do you listen to rw shows? That's not good for anyone's health.

53 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:23:47am

re: #49 Charles Johnson

How fitting that that came *cough cough cough* from a website based in Alabama. They probably didn't even get it.

54 Decatur Deb  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:23:57am

re: #49 Charles Johnson

Headline of the day: Santorum Comes From Behind in Alabama Three-Way.

Ease up, y'all. We know about snark, even south of the Pea River.

55 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:24:38am

re: #35 Targetpractice

The question is which side will flinch first. My money's on Obama.

If he does, I'll be planning on rescuing the original Constitution. It's too likely the theocrats will burn it since 'it wasn't what the Founders meant' or some other horse shit.

We can't lose such an important historical document to barbarians.

I'm now thinking of a paragraph from H. Beam Piper's Space Viking

I'm sorry, Prince Vandervart. You had a wonderful civilization here. You could have done anything with it. It's too late now. The gates are down and the barbarians are in.

56 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:25:16am

re: #47 Grumpy, Not Sneezy

{{{Whoeveryouare}}}

We're fighting back. Don't get depressed unless Obama loses in November. If that happens, I'll be visiting, in person.

{{{b_sharp}}}

57 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:25:21am

re: #38 I Never Tilt My Camera

That number is shocking to me, and I find it just stunning that this is even an issue. For fuck's sake, IT'S 2012 YOU THROWBACKS!

I was a little surprised too but it does makes sense. Most people in the country are religious so many see it as protecting the religious freedom of employers. Also, the vast maojority of Americans have no idea how their insurance coverage works. Employers pay the premiums and the employee never thinks about it. As I recall Obama's compromise was the the government will pick up the cost and most people won't see a difference in coverage so his compromise seems reasonable.

58 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:26:15am

re: #52 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

Why do you listen to rw shows? That's not good for anyone's health.

No shit. I've avoided it for 5 days, which helps somewhat.

59 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:26:29am

This is the figure I use when considering America's derp factor:

General Election: Santorum vs. Obama
RCP Average 2/8 - 2/23 49.9% (Obama) 43.8% (Santorum): Obama +6.1

60 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:28:43am

re: #58 Grumpy, Not Sneezy

No shit. I've avoided it for 5 days, which helps somewhat.

You mean you haven't missed "Obama is destroying the economy!!!" repeated every five seconds for three hours, five days a week?
/

61 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:31:15am

re: #55 Romantic Heretic

If he does, I'll be planning on rescuing the original Constitution. It's too likely the theocrats will burn it since 'it wasn't what the Founders meant' or some other horse shit.

We can't lose such an important historical document to barbarians.

I'm now thinking of a paragraph from H. Beam Piper's Space Viking

I really, truly want to believe that Obama will stand tough and refuse to back down on this. But I also wanted to believe that so many times since he got into office, that I'm not sure I'll see it happen now.

62 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:31:24am

re: #60 I Never Tilt My Camera

You mean you haven't missed "Obama is destroying the economy!!!" repeated every five seconds for three hours, five days a week?
/

What I hear is liberals have destroyed the world, are responsible for every evil and only conservatives have the balls to fix it.

63 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:33:47am

Good day friends, I'm going to take a nap.

64 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:34:05am

Scott Walker's Koch Connection Goes Bad

...it was incredible when David Koch admitted in an interview with the Palm Beach Post that he planned to support Walker with spending by AFP. “We’re helping him, as we should,” Koch said of Walker. “We’ve gotten pretty good at this over the years. We’ve spent a lot of money in Wisconsin. We’re going to spend more.”

The Post added: “By ‘we’ he says he means Americans for Prosperity, which is spending about $700,000 on an ‘It’s working’ television ad buy in the state.”

Could Koch really be admitting to a violation for the Internal Revenue Service code that says organizations such as AFP are “absolutely prohibited from directly or indirectly participating in, or intervening in, any political campaign on behalf of (or in opposition to) any candidate for elective public office”?

65 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:34:11am

re: #62 Grumpy, Not Sneezy

What I hear is liberals have destroyed the world, are responsible for every evil and only conservatives have the balls to fix it.

If conservatives were the actual opposition, I might believe that. But what stands in opposition are theocrats that are worshiping the twin idols of religion and tax-cuts.

66 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:34:24am

re: #62 Grumpy, Not Sneezy

What I hear is liberals have destroyed the world, are responsible for every evil and only conservatives have the balls to fix it.

Yep. Then there's wingnut history which includes calling all former tyrants in history, liberals. Why according to these knuckleheads Hitler was a liberal. We can thank Jonah Goldberg for that one.

67 blueraven  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:34:41am

re: #57 Killgore Trout

I was a little surprised too but it does makes sense. Most people in the country are religious so many see it as protecting the religious freedom of employers. Also, the vast maojority of Americans have no idea how their insurance coverage works. Employers pay the premiums and the employee never thinks about it. As I recall Obama's compromise was the the government will pick up the cost and most people won't see a difference in coverage so his compromise seems reasonable.

Employers pay part of the premium, employees pay their share.
Also, these premium payments by the employers are part of the overall salary/benefits package.
So it is wrong to suggest that employers should have more say than the employee.

68 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:36:19am

Gallup: Santorum's lead over Romney drops to 1%

Santorum 31% -2
Romney 30% +3

69 The Yankee  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:37:16am

Has anyone seen this video. I been to this country it is a complete lie and someone is going to vote for this guy because of this.

From what I have heard if you are able to make it to the hospital before you die. And there is nothing the doctor can do but prolong your life. It is usually a slow some times painful death. At least it appears that way to the people looking. It is a shame that we can not be educated about this kind of stuff.

70 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:37:55am

re: #66 Gus

Yep. Then there's wingnut history which includes calling all former tyrants in history, liberals. Why according to these knuckleheads Hitler was a liberal. We can thank Jonah Goldberg for that one.

"Liberal fascism" I remember that piece of revisionism. Oh there are also some right wingers who defend Pinochet because of his free market policies totally ignoring the killing and tyranny of said regime but yeah most tyrants are remade into liberals.

71 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:39:24am

re: #70 HappyWarrior

"Liberal fascism" I remember that piece of revisionism. Oh there are also some right wingers who defend Pinochet because of his free market policies totally ignoring the killing and tyranny of said regime but yeah most tyrants are remade into liberals.

Hitler's pal Franco is good though.

72 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:40:02am

re: #71 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

Hitler's pal Franco is good though.

Franco wasn't a fascist! He was just a realist and helped save Spain.

//

73 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:40:24am

And he's still dead.

74 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:40:47am

re: #73 Gus

And he's still dead.

Thank God for small favors.

75 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:41:38am

re: #68 jaunte

Gallup: Santorum's lead over Romney drops to 1%

Santorum 31% -2
Romney 30% +3

The "Not-Romney" effect plays itself out as the increased scrutiny reveals Santorum as not being the "Gene Eric Republic" they've been seeking. I was hoping the momentum would continue at least til Tuesday, but it appears that Romney might be able to use Michigan to stage his comeback.

76 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:42:18am

re: #67 blueraven

Employers pay part of the premium, employees pay their share.
Also, these premium payments by the employers are part of the overall salary/benefits package.
So it is wrong to suggest that employers should have more say than the employee.

My guess is many see it as a personal liberty issue. The healthcare mandate is tricky enough for many Americans who see it as government forcing people to purchase a service. Forcing them to purchase a service that violates their religious belief is seen as a slippery slope. If the employers can be forced the employees might be next.
Just guessing but since we don't have anyone here to defend the other side we just have to speculate.

77 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:44:09am

Wingnuts are the masters of Godwinisms.

78 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:44:38am

Someone here remind me again that the GOP is a pro-woman party.

Please. Go ahead and tell me that the Republicans don't actively hate women, because I'm sure as hell not seeing it.

79 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:45:15am

re: #70 HappyWarrior

"Liberal fascism" I remember that piece of revisionism. Oh there are also some right wingers who defend Pinochet because of his free market policies totally ignoring the killing and tyranny of said regime but yeah most tyrants are remade into liberals.

re: #71 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

Hitler's pal Franco is good though.

As my favourite author says, "Capitalism was content under Hitler, happy under Mussolini, very happy under Franco and delirious under General Pinochet."

I share his belief that capitalism prefers advanced authoritarian governments to democracy. Not that democracy and capitalism can't have a good working relationship. The years between approximately the end of WWII and the beginning of the 70s show that. But capitalism as an economic system doesn't care much for democracy. Democracy is 'bad for business.'

There's a reason people like the Kochs and Rupert Murdoch do what they do. They know they'd be much better off if the U.S. became a modern dictatorship, like China.

80 blueraven  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:46:30am

re: #76 Killgore Trout

My guess is many see it as a personal liberty issue. The healthcare mandate is tricky enough for many Americans who see it as government forcing people to purchase a service. Forcing them to purchase a service that violates their religious belief is seen as a slippery slope. If the employers can be forced the employees might be next.
Just guessing but since we don't have anyone here to defend the other side we just have to speculate.

It is ridiculous to think today's republican party really give a shit about personal liberty when they are forcing women to undergo unnecessary, costly, medical procedures.

81 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:46:39am

re: #79 Romantic Heretic

re: #71 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

As my favourite author says, "Capitalism was content under Hitler, happy under Mussolini, very happy under Franco and delirious under General Pinochet."

I share his belief that capitalism prefers advanced authoritarian governments to democracy. Not that democracy and capitalism can't have a good working relationship. The years between approximately the end of WWII and the beginning of the 70s show that. But capitalism as an economic system doesn't care much for democracy. Democracy is 'bad for business.'

There's a reason people like the Kochs and Rupert Murdoch do what they do. They know they'd be much better off if the U.S. became a modern dictatorship, like China.

Whose quote is that.

82 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:47:26am

re: #77 Gus

Wingnuts are the masters of Godwinisms.

Case in point:

Arizona GOP House Candidate Compares Saddam Hussein’s Invasion Of Kuwait To President Obama

83 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:47:39am

re: #78 Lidane

Someone here remind me again that the GOP is a pro-woman party.

Please. Go ahead and tell me that the Republicans don't actively hate women, because I'm sure as hell not seeing it.

They've "pro-woman" if your ideal woman is a Stepford Wife who thinks that America was so much nicer back in the 50's, before that nasty Pill came and ruined everything.

84 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:49:43am

re: #82 Lidane

Case in point:

Arizona GOP House Candidate Compares Saddam Hussein’s Invasion Of Kuwait To President Obama

What he said about his opponent was just as pathetic.

85 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:49:56am

re: #80 blueraven

It is ridiculous to think today's republican party really give a shit about personal liberty when they are forcing women to undergo unnecessary, costly, medical procedures.

Exactly.

"Personal liberty" isn't a Republican plank, unless you're talking about the liberty of corporate persons to rape and pillage the environment at will and to not have to pay taxes when they do it. Everyone else can just bend over and take whatever the GOP has decided to dish out.

86 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:50:02am

Which takes us back to...

re: #17 Gus

So you get them to vote for you on social issues but use that power of office for the benefit of Koch Industries, Exxon, Massey Energy, Peabody Energy, etc.

87 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:51:09am

re: #82 Lidane

Case in point:

Arizona GOP House Candidate Compares Saddam Hussein’s Invasion Of Kuwait To President Obama

A partially apt comparison, considering that Kuwait is a conservative theocracy.

88 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:51:45am

re: #81 HappyWarrior

Whose quote is that.

It's from The Doubter's Companion by John Ralston Saul.

Also recommended works by him: Voltaire's Bastards: The Dictatorship of Reason in the West and On Equilibrium.

89 Charleston Chew  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:51:46am

Juan Williams calls Pat Buchanan his "brother" on Fox News.

I feel like we are brothers in understanding what these groups, on the left primarily, decided that you're not to be allowed to speak. They will banish you and make you an outcast and Pat, I'm sorry that's happened to you.

90 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:52:36am

re: #85 Lidane

Exactly.

"Personal liberty" isn't a Republican plank, unless you're talking about the liberty of corporate persons to rape and pillage the environment at will and to not have to pay taxes when they do it. Everyone else can just bend over and take whatever the GOP has decided to dish out.

That plank and its neighbor, "personal responsibility," got broken into splinters in '08, used for kindling in '09, and now are nothing more than a little pile of ashes. The GOP as a party is a monument to human hypocrisy.

91 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:53:54am

re: #88 Romantic Heretic

"Known for his novels of international intrigue, Saul in his first work of nonfiction delivers a passionate jeremiad on the follies of our age. Reason, he argues, has run amok; instead of the enlightened utopia envisaged by Voltaire, the modern West is a soulless machine run by technocratic elites that promise efficiency but create disasters."

Reason has run amok? Doesn't sound like a reasonable idea.

92 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:54:45am
93 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:55:55am

re: #92 Lidane

Gee, look who's polishing their resume for reelection.

94 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 11:57:54am

re: #89 Charleston Chew

Juan Williams calls Pat Buchanan his "brother" on Fox News.

Wow Juan get a fucking grip.

95 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:00:12pm

re: #91 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

Reason has run amok? Doesn't sound like a reasonable idea.

But it has run amok. You need only look at the recent collapse of Wall Street. All those tools that created that problem; asset backed commercial papers, derivatives etc.; were reasonable, logical.

But devoid of ethics, of memory, they were destructive.

Mr. Saul does not say Reason is bad, which is how many interpret him. He says without the balancing effect of other important human traits; common sense, ethics, imagination, intuition, and memory; reason will, as you say, run amok.

96 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:00:35pm

The Queen of Word Salad has been pulled out of her case, dusted off and rebooted. Via Facebook:

And not only can’t a gun rack fit in a Volt, but the government will take away our pick-up trucks when they pry the steering wheel “from our cold, dead hands.” Newt explains in this video some commonsense, pro-American solutions to the problems President Obama causes with his terrifyingly naïve assault on U.S. energy production.

Referring to the POTUS as being anti-American, huh? You are one classy bitch, Sarah.

Your text to link...

97 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:00:57pm

re: #94 HappyWarrior

Wow Juan get a fucking grip.

Why? He might, as well, be.

98 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:01:39pm

re: #96 I Never Tilt My Camera

The Queen of Word Salad has been pulled out of her case, dusted off and rebooted. Via Facebook:

Referring to the POTUS as being-anti-American, huh? You are one classy bitch, Sarah.

Your text to link...

She always does this. Says that the president and his allies' ideas are anti American while hers and her allies are the only Pro American ones. It's typical bullshit from the half term governor.

99 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:01:57pm

re: #96 I Never Tilt My Camera

The Queen of Word Salad has been pulled out of her case, dusted off and rebooted. Via Facebook:

Referring to the POTUS as being-anti-American, huh? You are one classy bitch, Sarah.

Your text to link...

Sarah's trying to hold out hope that the party will come a-courtin' in the event of a brokered convention.

100 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:01:58pm

re: #96 I Never Tilt My Camera

The Queen of Word Salad has been pulled out of her case, dusted off and rebooted. Via Facebook:

Referring to the POTUS as being-anti-American, huh? You are one classy bitch, Sarah.

Your text to link...

New rules!

Not only will Obama come for your gunz but he's goin' ta take away yer pick-up trucks!

101 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:02:10pm

re: #97 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

Why? He might, as well, be.

I was referring to the part where he acts like he and Pat have been persecuted by some evil liberal cabal.

102 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:03:01pm

re: #100 Gus

You betcha!!!

103 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:03:13pm

I hope they pull it off. Christie is a coward who should have his veto thrown back in his face:

104 Charleston Chew  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:03:17pm

re: #79 Romantic Heretic

re: #71 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

As my favourite author says, "Capitalism was content under Hitler, happy under Mussolini, very happy under Franco and delirious under General Pinochet."

I share his belief that capitalism prefers advanced authoritarian governments to democracy. Not that democracy and capitalism can't have a good working relationship. The years between approximately the end of WWII and the beginning of the 70s show that. But capitalism as an economic system doesn't care much for democracy. Democracy is 'bad for business.'

There's a reason people like the Kochs and Rupert Murdoch do what they do. They know they'd be much better off if the U.S. became a modern dictatorship, like China.

Dictatorships have nationalized businesses or industries, so I don't think it's better for business.

Don't confuse "business" with "rich assholes", such as the Kochs and Rupert Murdoch. Those are separate (but overlapping) categories. Rich assholes can be bad for business, too. The housing bubble, bullshit derivitives, and resulting recession were very bad for business and rich assholes played a key role in creating that.

105 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:03:29pm

re: #102 I Never Tilt My Camera

Mind boggling.

106 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:04:44pm
107 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:04:55pm

re: #103 Lidane

I hope they pull it off. Christie is a coward who should have his veto thrown back in his face:

I'd like to see them pull it off as well. Nothing better at this point than to see gay marriage come to NJ in spite of a troglodyte in the Governor's mansion.

108 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:06:03pm

re: #95 Romantic Heretic

But it has run amok. You need only look at the recent collapse of Wall Street. All those tools that created that problem; asset backed commercial papers, derivatives etc.; were reasonable, logical.

Uh, sorry, that's sophism. What makes these tools "reasonable" and "logical" in themselves?

But devoid of ethics, of memory, they were destructive.

Mr. Saul does not say Reason is bad, which is how many interpret him. He says without the balancing effect of other important human traits; common sense, ethics, imagination, intuition, and memory; reason will, as you say, run amok.

Gee. What else does he say? Sky is blue? Kittens are cute?

The question is: why focus on reason at all, in any way? Why not simply say "we need this, and this, and this"?

If anyone thinks there's just too much reason, my suggestion is to vote Republican. They rely on gut and morality. See how that works out.

109 Charleston Chew  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:06:12pm

re: #94 HappyWarrior

Wow Juan get a fucking grip.

He can't get a grip because his hands are full of Fox money - $2 million worth.

110 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:06:32pm

re: #109 Charleston Chew

He can't get a grip because his hands are full of Fox money - $2 million worth.

But he's oppressed by the liberal media!

111 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:06:42pm

re: #106 Gus

2012 Chevy Silverado Hybrid | Fuel Efficient Pickup Truck | Chevrolet

And that's just the beginning.

Let GM fail!!! Managed bankruptcy!!!

112 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:08:09pm

The funniest was seeing Allan West blaming President Obama for his high gas fees for his H2. Hey West when you decide to buy a H2, it's obvious that the thing is a gas guzzler. It's not the president trying to screw you. It's your own stupidity in buying a military type vehicle for the regular road.

113 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:08:21pm

re: #111 I Never Tilt My Camera

Don't laugh, there's no doubt wingnuts who will point to this as "proof" that GM is "Government Motors." Many of them honestly believe that the only reason that Chrysler and GM are looking at hybrids and electric cars is because the government's telling them to, rather than because they're getting their asses kicked by foreign automakers who are embracing hybrids and electric cars to great success.

114 Charleston Chew  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:08:43pm

re: #95 Romantic Heretic

But it has run amok. You need only look at the recent collapse of Wall Street. All those tools that created that problem; asset backed commercial papers, derivatives etc.; were reasonable, logical.

They were not reasonable.

115 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:08:45pm

re: #112 HappyWarrior

The funniest was seeing Allan West blaming President Obama for his high gas fees for his H2. Hey West when you decide to buy a H2, it's obvious that the thing is a gas guzzler. It's not the president trying to screw you. It's your own stupidity in buying a military type vehicle for the regular road.

Not to mention his bad taste.

116 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:09:11pm

re: #115 I Never Tilt My Camera

Not to mention his bad taste.

Yeah those are ugly cars.

117 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:09:24pm

re: #112 HappyWarrior

The funniest was seeing Allan West blaming President Obama for his high gas fees for his H2. Hey West when you decide to buy a H2, it's obvious that the thing is a gas guzzler. It's not the president trying to screw you. It's your own stupidity in buying a military type vehicle for the regular road.

I'd like to ask West if he stopped and considered that the same war that saw his career end in disgrace might have had something to do with gas prices being so high.

118 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:10:40pm

re: #108 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

Missing the point. To paraphrase a play I'm fond of, "Reason is a good thing, a very good thing. But it's not the only thing."

Shrugs. Had this argument many times before. Will in the future.

Musical Interlude.

119 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:12:23pm

re: #118 Romantic Heretic

Missing the point. To paraphrase a play I'm fond of, "Reason is a good thing, a very good thing. But it's not the only thing."

No. You're missing the point. Nobody says that reason is the only thing. To write a book knocking on reason, that has supposedly "run amok" is a folly alright, especially when there's so much destructive unreason around. Much more destructive.

120 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:14:15pm

HEVT's Plug-in Hybrid Electric Ford F150 Pickup

41 MPG. Protean had/has an all electric F-150. A lot of this is still in development but the day will finally come. Sarah Palin is perpetuating ignorance on the technology and of course just says these things because she's ignorant herself.

121 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:14:44pm

re: #120 Gus

HEVT's Plug-in Hybrid Electric Ford F150 Pickup

[Embedded content]41 MPG. Protean had/has an all electric F-150. A lot of this is still in development but the day will finally come. Sarah Palin is perpetuating ignorance on the technology and of course just says these things because she's ignorant herself.

Driven: Protean Ford F-150 All-Electric Pickup Truck

122 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:14:47pm

re: #120 Gus

HEVT's Plug-in Hybrid Electric Ford F150 Pickup

[Embedded content]41 MPG. Protean had/has an all electric F-150. A lot of this is still in development but the day will finally come. Sarah Palin is perpetuating ignorance on the technology and of course just says these things because she's ignorant herself.

Nah, it's good. Helps keep reason in check.

123 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:15:45pm

re: #120 Gus

HEVT's Plug-in Hybrid Electric Ford F150 Pickup

[Embedded content]41 MPG. Protean had/has an all electric F-150. A lot of this is still in development but the day will finally come. Sarah Palin is perpetuating ignorance on the technology and of course just says these things because she's ignorant herself.

Personally, I believe hybrids are a dead-end, plug-in hybrids more so. If the problem with hybrids is that they have to be plugged in in order to become useful over increased distances, then why not just ditch the gas engine entirely and go full electric.

124 Charleston Chew  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:17:44pm

re: #112 HappyWarrior

The funniest was seeing Allan West blaming President Obama for his high gas fees for his H2. Hey West when you decide to buy a H2, it's obvious that the thing is a gas guzzler. It's not the president trying to screw you. It's your own stupidity in buying a military type vehicle for the regular road.

I have to admit, I have some respect for people who drive the Hummer H1 (the one that's a modified military vehicle) as their regular car because it's so damn impracticle and frustrating -- anyone who's crazy enough to put up with that must at least be interesting.

But West drives the smaller (though ridiculously fuel-inefficient) H2, the Hummer for pussies. It's just a GMC pick-up in disguise.

125 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:19:04pm

re: #124 Charleston Chew

I have to admit, I have some respect for people who drive the Hummer H1 (the one that's a modified military vehicle) as their regular car because it's so damn impracticle and frustrating -- anyone who's crazy enough to put up with that must at least be interesting.

But West drives the smaller (though ridiculously fuel-inefficient) H2, the Hummer for pussies. It's just a GMC pick-up in disguise.

I've only seen the H2 on the road. Good points though heh.

126 erik_t  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:19:31pm

re: #123 Targetpractice

Personally, I believe hybrids are a dead-end, plug-in hybrids more so. If the problem with hybrids is that they have to be plugged in in order to become useful over increased distances, then why not just ditch the gas engine entirely and go full electric.

Having the freedom to putter along on a gasoline engine if circumstances dictate is a very important mental safety blanket to drivers who aren't used to needing to keep an exact count on how far they've driven since the last charge (and other more esoteric stuff like the outside air temperature). Without a complete revolution in battery chemistry, electrical infrastructure and a number of other things, electric vehicles are always going to be charged in timeframes in excess of an hour.

127 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:20:44pm

re: #123 Targetpractice

Personally, I believe hybrids are a dead-end, plug-in hybrids more so. If the problem with hybrids is that they have to be plugged in in order to become useful over increased distances, then why not just ditch the gas engine entirely and go full electric.

It's a good transitional platform for reluctant consumers since it also provides an extended range. I imagine that eventually all-electric vehicles will be popular once battery technology provides an acceptable range. This would have to include fast charging stations.

128 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:22:42pm

re: #126 erik_t

Having the freedom to putter along on a gasoline engine if circumstances dictate is a very important mental safety blanket to drivers who aren't used to needing to keep an exact count on how far they've driven since the last charge (and other more esoteric stuff like the outside air temperature). Without a complete revolution in battery chemistry, electrical infrastructure and a number of other things, electric vehicles are always going to be charged in timeframes in excess of an hour.

Problem is that a hybrid is piss-poor by either measure. When running on its batteries it's hampered by the weight of a gasoline engine and related equipment, but when running on gas the engine is generally too small to get good mileage unless the vehicle is tiny.

If we're to go hybrid to gain fuel mileage, then my suggestion would be to ditch the gasoline engine and promote diesel hybrids. Otherwise, as you suggest, they're nothing more than electric cars with very heavy training wheels.

129 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:23:01pm

Long story short. Nobody's coming for your pick-up trucks.

130 erik_t  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:23:02pm

re: #127 Gus

It's a good transitional platform for reluctant consumers since it also provides an extended range. I imagine that eventually all-electric vehicles will be popular once battery technology provides an acceptable range. This would have to include fast charging stations.

Pipe dream, I think. Unless magic (and cheap) room-temperature superconductors happen, you just can't push that much power through a residential-like infrastructure, nor would any known battery chemistry be happy charging very quickly.

Frankly, electrochemical energy storage just isn't so hot, and there's no reason to think it ever will be.

131 erik_t  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:24:45pm

re: #128 Targetpractice

Problem is that a hybrid is piss-poor by either measure. When running on its batteries it's hampered by the weight of a gasoline engine and related equipment, but when running on gas the engine is generally too small to get good mileage unless the vehicle is tiny.

Um.... what? Smaller engines, run at or near their maximum power output, are far more efficient than large engines run at fractional power settings.

132 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:26:38pm

re: #131 erik_t

Um... what? Smaller engines, run at or near their maximum power output, are far more efficient than large engines run at fractional power settings.

And their maintenance upkeep? Maximum power output doesn't tend to be a recipe for long engine life.

133 SpaceJesus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:28:48pm

Speaking of cars. Nissan gets obliterated in accident in Russia

134 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:29:16pm

re: #49 Charles Johnson

Headline of the day: Santorum Comes From Behind in Alabama Three-Way.

BOW CHICKA WOW WOW

135 funky chicken  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:29:53pm

re: #15 Targetpractice

Election year desperation, as they find themselves in serious danger of losing their current dominance at the polls.

Well, perhaps not in Texas, but in other states it seems that the worm has turned.

Maybe not this year, but it will bite them in the ass eventually. It took a couple of decades of fundamentalist evangelical foolishness, but the folks in Kansas elected a democrat woman governor. Their US Senators are still GOP, but this guy sounds almost ... normal. Of course, I currently live in OK, so YMMV.

[Link: moran.senate.gov...]

136 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:30:18pm

re: #134 talon_262

BOW CHICKA WOW WOW

Are you watching the same link as me? /

137 erik_t  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:30:56pm

re: #132 Targetpractice

And their maintenance upkeep? Maximum power output doesn't tend to be a recipe for long engine life.

Well, obviously the engine is designed to run at higher power output, rather than being designed to cruise at 25-odd percent like a typical direct-drive automobile engine. A good place to start looking would be general aviation piston engines, which rarely operate at less than 75% power or so. Curiously, I don't often see light aircraft falling out of the sky.

This isn't feeling like a terribly fact-based discussion.

138 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:33:13pm

re: #124 Charleston Chew

But West drives the smaller (though ridiculously fuel-inefficient) H2, the Hummer for pussies. It's just a GMC pick-up in disguise.

Kinda like how the Porsche Boxster is considered the "Porsche With Panties."

139 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:34:14pm

re: #133 SpaceJesus

Speaking of cars. Nissan gets obliterated in accident in Russia

[Embedded content]

Looks fatal.

140 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:37:34pm

Heh:

Romney turns Santorum's 2008 endorsement against him

It may just turn out that Mitt Romney's most important endorsement in his battle against Rick Santorum for the Michigan primary isn't Gov. Rick Snyder, or any of the host of legislators or local luminaries who've backed his candidacy this cycle, but instead Santorum himself - who supported Romney in 2008.

Saturday, before more than a thousand attendees of a conservative conference, Romney used Santorum's 2008 endorsement as a pivot, around which he turned from explaining his own vision to throwing a verbal haymaker at Santorum, who earlier Saturday at the same event called for the party to nominate a "consistent conservative" to take on Barack Obama.
"I can attest to my conservative credentials by quoting someone who endorsed me in 2008 campaign. Senator Santorum was kind enough to say on the Laura Ingraham show, he said, Mitt Romney, this is the guy who is really conservative and who we can trust. And when he came out and endorsed me he said these words: He said he is the clear, conservative candidate." Romney said. "He's right, I'm the conservative candidate and what we need in the White House is principled, conservative leadership and I'll bring it."

141 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:38:03pm

re: #137 erik_t

Well, obviously the engine is designed to run at higher power output, rather than being designed to cruise at 25-odd percent like a typical direct-drive automobile engine. A good place to start looking would be general aviation piston engines, which rarely operate at less than 75% power or so. Curiously, I don't often see light aircraft falling out of the sky.

This isn't feeling like a terribly fact-based discussion.

It's a weekend, don't bother me with facts!!

///

I don't know, it just seems like hybrids, at least American ones, are ultimately a dead-end. Trying to turn SUVs, full-sized trucks, and so forth into hybrids seems foolish compared to items like Ecoboost which utilize turbocharging and direct fuel injection to reach the same targets.

142 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:38:05pm

re: #112 HappyWarrior

The funniest was seeing Allan West blaming President Obama for his high gas fees for his H2. Hey West when you decide to buy a H2, it's obvious that the thing is a gas guzzler. It's not the president trying to screw you. It's your own stupidity in buying a military type vehicle for the regular road.

The H2 and H3 are most definitely not "military type vehicles", because they're just Chevy/GMC trucks that look somewhat like the H1 (the original milspec Hummer).

143 funky chicken  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:40:03pm

re: #126 erik_t

Having the freedom to putter along on a gasoline engine if circumstances dictate is a very important mental safety blanket to drivers who aren't used to needing to keep an exact count on how far they've driven since the last charge (and other more esoteric stuff like the outside air temperature). Without a complete revolution in battery chemistry, electrical infrastructure and a number of other things, electric vehicles are always going to be charged in timeframes in excess of an hour.

Yep. Here in OK lots of people are doing CNG conversions on their trucks and SUVs because the CNG is about $1.50 a gallon (last I checked) and works just fine. They have to maintain some gasoline-using capability for when they travel to rural areas that don't have CNG stations. If they weren't able to keep using gasoline when needed, there would be far fewer CNG vehicles on the roads here.

144 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:42:22pm

re: #142 talon_262

The H2 and H3 are most definitely not "military type vehicles", because they're just Chevy/GMC trucks that look somewhat like the H1 (the original milspec Hummer).

They're also not fuel efficient:

H2 fuel economy

H3 fuel economy

Anyone who buys one of those and then bitches that they're paying too much in gas deserves to be called an idiot and then laughed at. They knew what they were getting into when they bought the damn thing.

145 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:42:57pm

re: #124 Charleston Chew

I have to admit, I have some respect for people who drive the Hummer H1 (the one that's a modified military vehicle) as their regular car because it's so damn impracticle and frustrating -- anyone who's crazy enough to put up with that must at least be interesting.

But West drives the smaller (though ridiculously fuel-inefficient) H2, the Hummer for pussies. It's just a GMC pick-up in disguise.

re: #125 HappyWarrior

I've only seen the H2 on the road. Good points though heh.

Just a quick comparo: Arnold Schwarzenegger drove/drives an Hummer H1, Allen West drives a Hummer H2.

'Nuff said...

///

146 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:43:12pm

Store run while I'm still awake. BBL

147 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:46:45pm

re: #144 Lidane

They're also not fuel efficient:

H2 fuel economy

H3 fuel economy

Anyone who buys one of those and then bitches that they're paying too much in gas deserves to be called an idiot and then laughed at. They knew what they were getting into when they bought the damn thing.

Yeah, because they're total un-aerodynamic bricks compared even to the rest of GM's regular PU/SUV line.

148 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:54:10pm

re: #142 talon_262

The H2 and H3 are most definitely not "military type vehicles", because they're just Chevy/GMC trucks that look somewhat like the H1 (the original milspec Hummer).

My bad. Guess my broad point is if he wants to invest in a gas guzzler like the H2 then he should expect to pay more for gas.

149 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:56:00pm

re: #148 HappyWarrior

My bad. Guess my broad point is if he wants to invest in a gas guzzler like the H2 then he should expect to pay more for gas.

A lot of folks still seem to believe that the problem is not their mistake in buying gas-guzzling tanks to drive on the road, but rather than the government's not doing it's "job" to ensure low gas prices.

150 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:57:13pm

re: #149 Targetpractice

A lot of folks still seem to believe that the problem is not their mistake in buying gas-guzzling tanks to drive on the road, but rather than the government's not doing it's "job" to ensure low gas prices.

The famed "personal responsibility" at its best.

151 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:57:54pm
152 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 12:59:49pm

re: #151 Lidane

The craziest part of that article: if the extreme right loses, they'll be convinced they weren't extreme enough.

“If Romney is the nominee and he loses in November, I think we’ll see a resurgence of the charismatic populist right,” says Robert Alan Goldberg, a history professor at the University of Utah and author of a biography of Barry Goldwater. “Not only will [the grassroots wing] say that Romney led Republicans down the road to defeat, but that the whole type of conservatism he represents is doomed.”

Goldberg points out that this is what happened in 1976, when the party stuck with Ford over Reagan, was beaten by Carter, and went on to embrace the Gipper’s brand of movement conservatism four years later. So who does Goldberg think might be ascendant in the aftermath of a Romney licking? “Sarah Palin,” he replies. “She’s an outsider, she has no Washington or Wall Street baggage, she’s electric—and she’s waiting, because if Romney doesn’t win, she will be welcomed in.”

153 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:00:24pm

re: #150 HappyWarrior

The famed "personal responsibility" at its best.

Thing is, I agree to a point, if the government were doing its job, a lot of those responsible for rising gas prices would be behind bars, or measures taken to make speculation an expensive past-time. Instead, we're seeing the scramble to open up more land to drilling and ease regulations, as though the problem is anything other than rampant speculation.

154 Charleston Chew  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:01:21pm

re: #151 Lidane

Ed Rollins, campaign advider to Huckabee and Bachmann better make sure the insurance on his glass house is paid up before he starts throwing stones.

155 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:04:51pm

re: #152 jaunte

The craziest part of that article: if the extreme right loses, they'll be convinced they weren't extreme enough.

“If Romney is the nominee and he loses in November, I think we’ll see a resurgence of the charismatic populist right,” says Robert Alan Goldberg, a history professor at the University of Utah and author of a biography of Barry Goldwater. “Not only will [the grassroots wing] say that Romney led Republicans down the road to defeat, but that the whole type of conservatism he represents is doomed.”

Goldberg points out that this is what happened in 1976, when the party stuck with Ford over Reagan, was beaten by Carter, and went on to embrace the Gipper’s brand of movement conservatism four years later. So who does Goldberg think might be ascendant in the aftermath of a Romney licking? “Sarah Palin,” he replies. “She’s an outsider, she has no Washington or Wall Street baggage, she’s electric—and she’s waiting, because if Romney doesn’t win, she will be welcomed in.”

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...
*catches breath*
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

That's funny, I don't care who ya are!

156 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:07:59pm

re: #149 Targetpractice

A lot of folks still seem to believe that the problem is not their mistake in buying gas-guzzling tanks to drive on the road, but rather than the government's not doing it's "job" to ensure low gas prices.

re: #150 HappyWarrior

The famed "personal responsibility" at its best.

Responsibility starts with self; some people just don't a fuck about anyone else, except when it affects them.

157 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:08:04pm

re: #152 jaunte

The craziest part of that article: if the extreme right loses, they'll be convinced they weren't extreme enough.

A Palin nomination would see the GOP consigned to the political wildnerness for the next decade.

158 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:11:56pm

re: #157 Targetpractice

A Palin nomination would see the GOP consigned to the political wildnerness for the next decade.

At this point, as a (still) registered Republican, I wouldn't be surprised if this happened or mind if it did.

The GOP is in dire need of an enema.

159 Charleston Chew  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:16:26pm

Watching the American Experience episode on Clinton (available online) reminded me how current craziness began during the Clinton years with the Contract With America generation, culminating with impeachment.

In '98, the country had had enough of them, and the GOP started unraveling with a major midterm defeat.

My theory is that the trend would have continued, but 9/11 and the county's shock, grief, and fear gave them 5 extra years.

160 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:18:49pm

re: #159 Charleston Chew

Watching the American Experience episode on Clinton (available online) reminded me how current craziness began during the Clinton years with the Contract With America generation, culminating with impeachment.

In '98, the country had had enough of them, and the GOP started unraveling with a major midterm defeat.

My theory is that the trend would have continued, but 9/11 and the county's shock, grief, and fear gave them 5 extra years.

I've said for a long time that, were it not for 9/11, Bush would have been a one-term president kicked out of office for doing nothing to fix a down economy. Instead, he got to blame our economic problems on 9/11 and not only use the resulting political capital to pass the second round of his godawful tax cuts, but then ride the war fever he induced to a second term.

161 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:21:16pm

re: #160 Targetpractice

I've said for a long time that, were it not for 9/11, Bush would have been a one-term president kicked out of office for doing nothing to fix a down economy. Instead, he got to blame our economic problems on 9/11 and not only use the resulting political capital to pass the second round of his godawful tax cuts, but then ride the war fever he induced to a second term.

Have to agree. And I think if Gore or Kerry ran better campaigns they could have beaten him too. The thing I laugh at is in 2004 all the media especially the right wingers were acting like Bush had a mandate. He won by one state and then Obama wins in the biggest electoral landslide in twenty years and he gets treated like this illegitimate usurper by the same people.

162 Charleston Chew  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:24:35pm

re: #160 Targetpractice

I've said for a long time that, were it not for 9/11, Bush would have been a one-term president kicked out of office for doing nothing to fix a down economy. Instead, he got to blame our economic problems on 9/11 and not only use the resulting political capital to pass the second round of his godawful tax cuts, but then ride the war fever he induced to a second term.

I was also reminded of the debt the Obama administration owes the Clintons (both of them) for walking through the Republican minefield first. I'm sure the President has drawn a lot of lessons from the 90s regarding healthcare reform, gays in the military, use of force overseas, general public image, etc.

163 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:26:11pm

[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]
He did it again, typical Santorum. Also what the hell is he smoking when he talks about these liberal college professors. He talks about them as if they're somehow not Americans and do nothing productive. Me? I'm planning to use one of my professors as a reference for a job I'm seeking. I'm tired of Republicans attacking academics at all levels.

164 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:29:04pm

re: #161 HappyWarrior

Have to agree. And I think if Gore or Kerry ran better campaigns they could have beaten him too. The thing I laugh at is in 2004 all the media especially the right wingers were acting like Bush had a mandate. He won by one state and then Obama wins in the biggest electoral landslide in twenty years and he gets treated like this illegitimate usurper by the same people.

Kerry's like Romney is this go around, the guy essentially drawing the short straw over who will get his ass kicked in a midterm to a president who nobody really hates but just disagrees with. The article's right about one thing, Sarah might be seen as plausible in '16 because of her charisma, something that Romney utterly lacks as a candidate.

But what Romney has and Sarah doesn't in a comparison to Reagan is a career to run on. Granted that, like Reagan, Romney has turned on everything he once believed in. But it's still there, while Sarah's resume is about as thin as a human hair.

165 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:43:43pm

I done went and killed the thread. Crap!

166 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:44:35pm

Well, my computer is beginning to malfunction more and more often. Turning 4 in April, I already know what the problem is. The Laptop is slowly dying.

I'm beginning to look at parts for a full-size tower. The motherboard is the most important part:

Is this one a good one?

Or what about this one?

Any other recommendations for a motherboard of Full-ATX form factor with a good deal of room for the various parts like Hard Drives and Graphics Cards, as well as room to put in a Network card or things that also may be needed in the future?

167 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:47:30pm

re: #166 ProGunLiberal

Well, my computer is beginning to malfunction more and more often. Turning 4 in April, I already know what the problem is. The Laptop is slowly dying.

I'm beginning to look at parts for a full-size tower. The motherboard is the most important part:

Is this one a good one?

Or what about this one?

Any other recommendations for a motherboard of Full-ATX form factor with a good deal of room for the various parts like Hard Drives and Graphics Cards, as well as room to put in a Network card or things that also may be needed in the future?

What's your budget and what kind of performance are you looking for?

168 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:49:51pm

re: #167 talon_262

A decent amount. I'm graduating in May, and both sets of Grandparents are giving some amount of money.

I'm trying to keep the computer as Future-Proof as possible. So I want to start with a LGA 2011, as it was just released in November-ish.

169 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:50:35pm

Misleading title - "Texas kills Women's Health Program...". Not true. Other clinics who do not perform abortions are available to continue the Health Program, as would be Planned Parenthood if it gave up its abortion business. (I know - no way this is going to happen. Too much revenue involved.)

Obama Administration can indeed kill the Women's Health Program if they pull Federal Funding from the Texas Program as a result of a state not wishing to fund abortion on the taxpayers dollar.

Will be interesting to see how this works out - States Rights vs the Federal Hammer.

170 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:51:19pm

re: #169 BrainSurfer

State's Rights led to Slavery and Jim Crow.

State's Rights is an ideology that needs to be stamped out, and buried.

171 Obdicut  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:51:26pm

re: #169 BrainSurfer

You're a very boring troll. Can't you come up with something original?

172 Obdicut  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:52:41pm

re: #170 ProGunLiberal

State's Rights led to Slavery and Jim Crow.

State's Rights is an ideology that needs to be stamped out, and buried.

It takes a special sort of idiot to think that a state-- a purely arbitrary level of governance-- has some sort of magic to it. Why the state? Why not county rights, or town rights?

173 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:55:24pm

re: #168 ProGunLiberal

A decent amount. I'm graduating in May, and both sets of Grandparents are giving some amount of money.

I'm trying to keep the computer as Future-Proof as possible. So I want to start with a LGA 2011, as it was just released in November-ish.

Any preference for Intel or would anything AMD has suit your fancy, such as their APU lineup?

174 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:55:54pm

re: #169 BrainSurfer

Misleading title - "Texas kills Women's Health Program...". Not true. Other clinics who do not perform abortions are available to continue the Health Program, as would be Planned Parenthood if it gave up its abortion business. (I know - no way this is going to happen. Too much revenue involved.)

Obama Administration can indeed kill the Women's Health Program if they pull Federal Funding from the Texas Program as a result of a state not wishing to fund abortion on the taxpayers dollar.

Will be interesting to see how this works out - States Rights vs the Federal Hammer.

Come now, I thought all your "States Rights" gobshites also believed that actions have consequences. Well, the action here is Texas exercising its "Right" to be a bunch of Bible-thumping fuckheads, and the consequence is the Feds pulling the funding.

175 Digital Display  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:56:27pm

Update: You'll probably want to read this about how I am falling in love with a local Lady..At least till the end where I said the stupidest and funniest thing in my life to a woman.
Ready? What the hell it kind of breaks of the talk about Clinton..:)
So we went out last night with some friends to crawl Campus corner and have fun and dance last night. It was really fun..I am smitten with her.. Cute, Tall, Red red..She dresses really sharp and we just get along so well. It's spooky...It seems so natural...We have like interests...She likes to play Golf for effen sakes....I knew there would be a test
So last night I'm sitting by her girlfriend talking and she said to me.Looking across the table.. 'She is pretty isn't she?" This is the first test.. The Girlfriend asking questions..
I knew if I said she is smoking hot that would come across as creepy..or if I said she is OK the word would go back he's just not into to you.
I said sure she is pretty but she is just so much fun to be around...
Test one: Hoopster
So I'm feeling pretty good about my chances..
Well at about midnight She had to go cause she has to spend the weekend in Stillwater and leave at 6am..She does some traveling being a State worker for Oklahoma...So that's cool..I walked her out to her car said goodnight and a little kiss.. And she stopped and turned around and whispered in my ear that If she didn't have to go out of town she'd take me home.. My knees kind of buckled..I was just a tad stunned with the sound of her voice whispering in my ear..Wow..just wow..There will be sex involved...I'm smitten with her..
So What could I say to reply...No really..What did I say as she got in her car?
I said goodnight and thank you..
I said fucking thank you
Thank you.. I have been beating my head on every piece of furniture today yelling out..You said Thank you Are you a complete Idiot? Thank you? Really thank you? That was smooth Hoopster...
Thank You..
Fuck...
Thank You...

176 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:57:19pm

re: #173 talon_262

Intel. I heard something went screwy with the most recent line of AMD cores (Bulldozer?).

177 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 1:57:45pm

re: #172 Obdicut

It takes a special sort of idiot to think that a state-- a purely arbitrary level of governance-- has some sort of magic to it. Why the state? Why not county rights, or town rights?

It's the 10th amendment fetishism that totally ignores other parts of the Constitution.

178 Funky_Gibbon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:00:10pm

And they have the gall to go on TV and talk about religious fundamentalism in other countries...

179 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:00:14pm

re: #175 HoosierHoops

Update: You'll probably want to read this about how I am falling in love with a local Lady..At least till the end where I said the stupidest and funniest thing in my life to a woman.
Ready? What the hell it kind of breaks of the talk about Clinton..:)
So we went out last night with some friends to crawl Campus corner and have fun and dance last night. It was really fun..I am smitten with her.. Cute, Tall, Red red..She dresses really sharp and we just get along so well. It's spooky...It seems so natural...We have like interests...She likes to play Golf for effen sakes...I knew there would be a test
So last night I'm sitting by her girlfriend talking and she said to me.Looking across the table.. 'She is pretty isn't she?" This is the first test.. The Girlfriend asking questions..
I knew if I said she is smoking hot that would come across as creepy..or if I said she is OK the word would go back he's just not into to you.
I said sure she is pretty but she is just so much fun to be around...
Test one: Hoopster
So I'm feeling pretty good about my chances..
Well at about midnight She had to go cause she has to spend the weekend in Stillwater and leave at 6am..She does some traveling being a State worker for Oklahoma...So that's cool..I walked her out to her car said goodnight and a little kiss.. And she stopped and turned around and whispered in my ear that If she didn't have to go out of town she'd take me home.. My knees kind of buckled..I was just a tad stunned with the sound of her voice whispering in my ear..Wow..just wow..There will be sex involved...I'm smitten with her..
So What could I say to reply...No really..What did I say as she got in her car?
I said goodnight and thank you..
I said fucking thank you
Thank you.. I have been beating my head on every piece of furniture today yelling out..You said Thank you Are you a complete Idiot? Thank you? Really thank you? That was smooth Hoopster...
Thank You..
Fuck...
Thank You...

Maybe I been married too long but that's not so bad at all. She paid you a high compliment and you said thank you. I think ya done good. Lady Lizards am I crazy or right here? Hoops done good.

180 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:01:05pm

re: #178 Funky_Gibbon

And they have the gall to go on TV and talk about religious fundamentalism in other countries...

Well, they haven't started cramming women into burqas...yet.

181 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:01:57pm

re: #171 Obdicut

You're a very boring troll. Can't you come up with something original?

Just scroll over them; trolls crave attention and confrontation.

182 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:03:00pm

re: #175 HoosierHoops

Congratulations!

183 blueraven  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:04:00pm

re: #140 Lidane

Heh:

Romney turns Santorum's 2008 endorsement against him

"I can attest to my conservative credentials by quoting someone who endorsed me in 2008 campaign. Senator Santorum was kind enough to say on the Laura Ingraham show, he said, Mitt Romney, this is the guy who is really conservative and who we can trust. And when he came out and endorsed me he said these words: He said he is the clear, conservative candidate"

You mean the same guy who endorsed ARLEN SPECTER!!

184 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:05:23pm

re: #181 talon_262

Just scroll over them; trolls crave attention and confrontation.

It's always amusing to smack around latter-day Confederates. Seeing them wriggle around, trying to explain why civil rights should be decided on a state-by-state basis, is always amusing.

185 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:05:29pm

re: #175 HoosierHoops

Dude, that is really hot what she said.

186 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:06:29pm

re: #170 ProGunLiberal

State's Rights led to Slavery and Jim Crow.

State's Rights is an ideology that needs to be stamped out, and buried.

A weird exception here-as the shoe was on the other foot when California passed a law to lead on alternative fuels, and it got quashed by the commerce clause.

[Link: articles.latimes.com...]

We don't want to let states reduce rights. We do want them to be able to lead or innovate when we need it. I don't claim to have an answer, I just see the quandary.

187 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:07:09pm

re: #72 Gus

Franco wasn't a fascist! He was just a realist and helped save Spain.

//

Francisco Franco. Collaborator. Realist.

George Soros, aged 14. Living under protection of a collaborator. Worst Person Ever.

//Thus, the summing up of human history by the heartless.

188 Digital Display  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:07:13pm

re: #182 Killgore Trout

Congratulations!

I never saw this coming KT..I never saw it coming. I think my life is about to change...

189 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:07:57pm

re: #179 Daniel Ballard

Maybe I been married too long but that's not so bad at all. She paid you a high compliment and you said thank you. I think ya done good. Lady Lizards am I crazy or right here? Hoops done good.

I don't know for sure but I have been told from female friends that the Thank you's can be awkward or off putting. I don't remember the exact context or reasoning. The only reason I remember this is because my favorite gimmick after a night of sexy time is to wake, give the lady a firm handshake and say something like "thank you very much, that was very nice and I look forward to doing that again". It never fails to get a good laugh.

190 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:08:30pm

re: #188 HoosierHoops

Great for you, life offers these epic wonders only so often.

191 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:08:38pm

re: #172 Obdicut

Big O - re: #177 HappyWarrior

Have to agree with Happy Warrior, Big O. That damn Bill of Rights and the 10th Amendment are kind of like huge potholes which I got to swerve around in my ol' pick-up with my riflerack and proud K-Buc sticketer. I know how Obama feels when it seems you can't get something because of the Constitution gettin' in the way. But, hell, I say with Congress so screwed up as it is, makes sense to say "ta heck with Consti...I doing thing the Chicago way. Stop me if you can."

Texas had better watch their six.

192 Obdicut  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:08:39pm

re: #177 HappyWarrior

It's the 10th amendment fetishism that totally ignores other parts of the Constitution.

The same idgits who fetishize it are often the ones who deny there's an implicit right to privacy in the Constitution.

193 engineer cat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:09:27pm

pope ricky's boom is done busted

Gallup Daily Tracking:

Santorum 31%
Romney 30%
Gingrich 16%
Paul 11%
Other 3%
Fish 10%

this must be the work of those albigensian heretics again...

194 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:09:36pm

re: #192 Obdicut

The same idgits who fetishize it are often the ones who deny there's an implicit right to privacy in the Constitution.

Precisely and are wanting to gut many of the previsions in the 14th amendment and get rid of the income tax amendment and in more crazy cases get rid of the direct election of senators.

195 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:09:47pm

re: #96 I Never Tilt My Camera

The Queen of Word Salad has been pulled out of her case, dusted off and rebooted. Via Facebook:

Referring to the POTUS as being anti-American, huh? You are one classy bitch, Sarah.

Your text to link...

Actually, you can put a gun rack in a Volt. Ingenious Americans will show you how.

196 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:09:50pm

re: #186 Daniel Ballard

That's rather simple, at least to me. The way this is solved is by having the Feds act as something along the lines of the minimum standards, with states able to go above it, but not below it.

Also, expand the Voting Rights Act to cover all States (I don't say 50, because Puerto Rico very well could become 51 this year).

197 Tigger2005  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:10:08pm

re: #169 BrainSurfer

Misleading title - "Texas kills Women's Health Program...". Not true. Other clinics who do not perform abortions are available to continue the Health Program, as would be Planned Parenthood if it gave up its abortion business. (I know - no way this is going to happen. Too much revenue involved.)

Obama Administration can indeed kill the Women's Health Program if they pull Federal Funding from the Texas Program as a result of a state not wishing to fund abortion on the taxpayers dollar.

Will be interesting to see how this works out - States Rights vs the Federal Hammer.

Federal funds cannot be used for abortion.

198 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:11:20pm

re: #188 HoosierHoops

I never saw this coming KT..I never saw it coming. I think my life is about to change...

I'm jealous. I've taken myself out of the dating and marriage scene for practical reasons. It works best for me but I still miss that new relationship buzz. enjoy it.

199 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:11:53pm

re: #158 talon_262

At this point, as a (still) registered Republican, I wouldn't be surprised if this happened or mind if it did.

The GOP is in dire need of an enema.

"Madam, this man is dead. Giving him an enema won't help."

"It couldn't hurt."

200 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:12:29pm

re: #163 HappyWarrior

[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]
He did it again, typical Santorum. Also what the hell is he smoking when he talks about these liberal college professors. He talks about them as if they're somehow not Americans and do nothing productive. Me? I'm planning to use one of my professors as a reference for a job I'm seeking. I'm tired of Republicans attacking academics at all levels.

As opposed to Rick Santorum, who has worked hard with his hands all his life...

201 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:13:19pm

re: #197 Tigger2005

Federal funds cannot be used for abortion.

Seriously. Is Google really that hard for these idiot trolls to use?

Hyde Amendment

Dear troll -- Wilkipedia and Google are your friend. Use them and avoid looking like an idiot.

202 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:14:04pm

re: #169 BrainSurfer

Misleading title - "Texas kills Women's Health Program...". Not true. Other clinics who do not perform abortions are available to continue the Health Program, as would be Planned Parenthood if it gave up its abortion business. (I know - no way this is going to happen. Too much revenue involved.)

Obama Administration can indeed kill the Women's Health Program if they pull Federal Funding from the Texas Program as a result of a state not wishing to fund abortion on the taxpayers dollar.

Will be interesting to see how this works out - States Rights vs the Federal Hammer.

I hope you don't mind, but I'm not even going to pick at your stupidity. I have enough shit going on today.

203 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:14:14pm

re: #197 Tigger2005

Well, smack in the liver and untie my shoe. Tigger, did you really just say "Federal funds can not be used for abortion"? Do you really really really believe this?

204 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:14:54pm

re: #198 Killgore Trout

I'm hoping to get a relationship. I really want some sort of connection to people, and some sort of stability.

I know that a good chunk of this feeling is because I have had an astounding poor time with my family in the past 5-10 years. I can't give a full explanation, because it is hard to put into words.

205 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:15:05pm

re: #203 BrainSurfer

It's been the law for over 30 years.

Learn to Google.

206 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:15:15pm

re: #202 SanFranciscoZionist

No problem - don't mind at all.

207 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:15:57pm

re: #178 Funky_Gibbon

And they have the gall to go on TV and talk about religious fundamentalism in other countries...

Well, no. They talk about religious fundamentalism in ISLAM.

208 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:16:54pm

re: #180 Targetpractice

Well, they haven't started cramming women into burqas...yet.

And they won't, because that's the other guy's colors.

Maybe those prairie dresses the FLDS women wear, although Dr. Laura and the Fox gals will never wear those. Too frumpy.

209 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:18:00pm

re: #179 Daniel Ballard

Maybe I been married too long but that's not so bad at all. She paid you a high compliment and you said thank you. I think ya done good. Lady Lizards am I crazy or right here? Hoops done good.

If it's the right lady, she'll understand that he was blown away, and be flattered.

Hoops done good.

210 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:19:07pm

re: #192 Obdicut

The same idgits who fetishize it are often the ones who deny there's an implicit right to privacy in the Constitution.

The Constitution.

Written by Harvard men.

Interpreted by Harvard men who deliberately read important texts as though they were in fifth grade.

211 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:20:12pm

re: #203 BrainSurfer

Well, smack in the liver and untie my shoe. Tigger, did you really just say "Federal funds can not be used for abortion"? Do you really really really believe this?

Please explain how federal funds are used for abortions, or STFU.

Either way you'll be doing me a favor.

212 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:21:45pm

re: #211 SanFranciscoZionist

Please explain how federal funds are used for abortions, or STFU.

Either way you'll be doing me 41 registered users a favor.

Hope you don't mind the adjustment.

213 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:24:38pm

Hmm. I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing:

Kickstarter Expects To Provide More Funding To The Arts Than NEA

I can see this being a real double-edged sword.

214 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:24:47pm

Troll headline writer
Image: cq6cE.jpg

215 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:26:07pm

re: #214 Pope Ron Polyp XXXVII

Troll headline writer
Image: cq6cE.jpg

Somewhere in Alabama, a journalist is giggling.

216 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:26:52pm

re: #214 Pope Ron Polyp XXXVII

Troll headline writer
Image: cq6cE.jpg

This is the best headline ever.

217 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:27:04pm

Party unity!

218 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:29:02pm

re: #203 BrainSurfer

Well, smack in the liver and untie my shoe. Tigger, did you really just say "Federal funds can not be used for abortion"? Do you really really really believe this?

Let me guess, you're gonna pull the "fungible" argument out of your ass and claim that "proof" that federal dollars go to abortions. One beep for no, two beeps for yes.

219 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:29:44pm

re: #217 Lidane

Party unity!

Isn't this the same governor who flipped his shit over a mural that had the nerve to mention unions in a positive light?

220 Decatur Deb  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:30:37pm

re: #219 HappyWarrior

Isn't this the same governor who flipped his shit over a mural that had the nerve to mention unions in a positive light?

Yes--I think he means the Fabulous Four aren't batshit enough.

221 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:31:51pm

re: #211 SanFranciscoZionist

Ok, folks. Federal Funds are approved for use, under Medicare, to fund abortion in cases of rape, incest, and life endangerment.

But, that's not what you all really talking about. The basic question is whether federal funds going to Planned Parenthood can be considered as funding in any way the abortion business they are. Of course, Planned Parenthood says no way. Planned Parenthood critics say federal funds, like any other donation, goes into the pot they use for services which include providing abortion.

222 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:32:47pm

re: #221 BrainSurfer

Ok, folks. Federal Funds are approved for use, under Medicare, to fund abortion in cases of rape, incest, and life endangerment.

But, that's not what you all really talking about. The basic question is whether federal funds going to Planned Parenthood can be considered as funding in any way the abortion business they are. Of course, Planned Parenthood says no way. Planned Parenthood critics say federal funds, like any other donation, goes into the pot they use for services which include providing abortion.

Gee, how'd I guess that one? *rolls eyes*

223 Archangelus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:34:23pm

The Modern-day OP ('G' removed on account of disqualification): Submit or suffer and/or die, constitutional rights be damned.

They want their control by any means possible...

224 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:35:25pm

re: #221 BrainSurfer

Wow. You're really bad at trolling.

Next time, try using talking points that can't be debunked through a simple Google search.

225 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:36:00pm

Women's salaries go into the pot they use for services which might include abortion. There are just two solutions.

226 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:36:08pm

re: #176 ProGunLiberal

Intel. I heard something went screwy with the most recent line of AMD cores (Bulldozer?).

Yeah, the first iteration of Bulldozer hasn't lived up to the hype, but it still a serviceable, cost-effective option AFAIK, even more so with upcoming revisions. I was talking more about the A-series APUs, which is where AMD's processor fortunes may ultimately lie for their future in the consumer arena.

My brothers have laptops with AMD's low/midrange E-series APUs in them (1 Dell, 1 Toshiba); for what they are and what was paid for them (about 300-400 a piece), their performance isn't bad. The A-8 APUs are AMD's top-of-the-line in that segment; you get quad CPU cores and Radoen 65xx graphics baked-in for less than 150 bucks. The Gigabyte motherboards I saw at Newegg for the A-series APUs have good features and expandablity for a good price.

As an AMD user (Phenom II quad-core @ 3.5 GHz, 8 GB RAM, Radeon 4850 X2), I would highly recommend considering an AMD APU setup, if you want good performance for the dollar and aren't hung up on raw processor power.

227 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:37:08pm

Michigan Tea Partiers Share Rick Santorum’s Fears Over Obama’s College Push

“I think he’s saying, ‘Do you think that that’s the only way you can be a successful person? To go to college?’” said another attendee, Elizabeth, who didn’t want her last name used. “That is snobbery. In this entrepreneurial country that we have, where fortunes are made in a lot of ways — they’re not only made by college-educated people.”

They all agreed that college can help some people — but they also agreed that universities are basically socialism factories.

“They try and disguise it with, you know, ‘equal opportunity’…” Stephen Clement began.

“It’s communism,” Murrow said, cutting him off. “The professors are all teaching the kids…”

“Where does the social engineering stop?” Clement jumped back in, fired up. “Does it stop after we send everybody to college, or does it stop after we set their curriculum and said, ‘these are the things you’re allowed to study?’ Does it become the Soviet Union?”

228 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:37:39pm

re: #221 BrainSurfer

Ok, folks. Federal Funds are approved for use, under Medicare, to fund abortion in cases of rape, incest, and life endangerment

I see no reason whatsoever to object to those instances. You just endorsed letting women die in pregnancies where things have gone lethally wrong. Congrats.

229 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:39:05pm

re: #227 Lidane

Self Awareness Theater:
“It starts down at the elementary school level with all this bullshit about diversity, pardon my French,” he said. “Diversity and sensitivity and all that crap."

230 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:40:14pm

re: #228 Daniel Ballard

I see no reason whatsoever to object to those instances. You just endorsed letting women die in pregnancies where things have gone lethally wrong. Congrats.

God's will, didn't ya hear?

///

231 HappyWarrior  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:40:48pm

re: #227 Lidane

Michigan Tea Partiers Share Rick Santorum’s Fears Over Obama’s College Push

Man this is some genius work from The Onion. Okay, more seriously, I realize that we need manual laborers in society but at the same time, why is it such a bad thing for this president to suggest everyone should have an opportunity at college and to call that an elitist attitude is the stupidest thing I've ever heard from the Tea Party and we've heard alot of stupid crap from them.

232 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:41:23pm

re: #224 Lidane

Whoa, there really are a lot of trolls here. All calling me a troll, imagine that.

Just being uppity, guys and gals. You all need some pushback, otherwise you're all going posting backpats to each other. I might even get some of you to open your minds a wee bit.

233 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:42:20pm

re: #227 Lidane

Michigan Tea Partiers Share Rick Santorum’s Fears Over Obama’s College Push

“I think he’s saying, ‘Do you think that that’s the only way you can be a successful person? To go to college?’” said another attendee, Elizabeth, who didn’t want her last name used. “That is snobbery. In this entrepreneurial country that we have, where fortunes are made in a lot of ways — they’re not only made by college-educated people.”

She's right to a point, there were some very successful people that didn't get very good educations. But ask Thomas Edison what good that did him when Nikola Tesla got the last laugh in the "War of the Currents."

234 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:43:00pm

re: #228 Daniel Ballard

Have not endorsed anything, Daniel. Far as I am concerned, women should have the option to abort in these cases.

235 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:43:47pm

re: #232 BrainSurfer

You'd have to offer something more than just the same old, tired talking points first. You're not saying anything new, and all of it can easily be debunked in just a few clicks.

Try harder next time.

236 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:43:52pm

re: #232 BrainSurfer

Whoa, there really are a lot of trolls here. All calling me a troll, imagine that.

Just being uppity, guys and gals. You all need some pushback, otherwise you're all going posting backpats to each other. I might even get some of you to open your minds a wee bit.

What have you "opened our minds" on? That States Rights are a wash?

237 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:45:03pm

re: #236 Targetpractice

What have you "opened our minds" on? That States Rights are a wash?

That Google and Wikipedia are useful tools, and they make debunking talking points really easy.

Other than that, their posts have been a total waste of 1's and 0's.

238 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:45:57pm

re: #234 BrainSurfer

Have not endorsed anything, Daniel. Far as I am concerned, women should have the option to abort in these cases.

How magnanimous of you.

239 A Mom Anon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:46:57pm

How is abortion a huge revenue stream for Planned Parenthood when that is about 2 percent of total services they provide? And again,PP is a non profit,as opposed to an actual business that's there to turn a big profit and/or answer to shareholders. PP also has private and other charitable donors,they are not totally federally funded. Some services are also subject to small fees,so there is that money to consider as well.

I'd adore it if these right to life people would focus on the kids already here that need help or homes or support. It might help make for happier and healthier communities if that anti choice energy got focused on the "post born".

240 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:47:15pm

re: #221 BrainSurfer

Yo! DF! Doofus Troll ready for grilling.

241 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:48:19pm

re: #239 A Mom Anon

It might help make for happier and healthier communities if that anti choice energy got focused on the "post born".

That might require real sustained effort.

242 Decatur Deb  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:49:30pm

re: #239 A Mom Anon

Hi AMA--my autistic grand-daughter is developing a talent for puns. New name for her dad: "Baldilocks".

243 palomino  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:49:41pm

re: #221 BrainSurfer

Ok, folks. Federal Funds are approved for use, under Medicare, to fund abortion in cases of rape, incest, and life endangerment.

But, that's not what you all really talking about. The basic question is whether federal funds going to Planned Parenthood can be considered as funding in any way the abortion business they are. Of course, Planned Parenthood says no way. Planned Parenthood critics say federal funds, like any other donation, goes into the pot they use for services which include providing abortion.

Sen. Kyl, only 3% of what PP does is abortion, not the 97% figure you pulled out of your ass and cynically quoted on the Senate floor.

After all your years in Congress, you still don't appear to know anything about the Hyde Amendment...or the Stupak Amendment for that matter.

244 labman57  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:50:51pm

Social conservatives have more regard for zygotes than they do for the privacy rights and health of women.

245 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:51:12pm

re: #232 BrainSurfer

Whoa, there really are a lot of trolls here. All calling me a troll, imagine that.

Just being uppity, guys and gals. You all need some pushback, otherwise you're all going posting backpats to each other. I might even get some of you to open your minds a wee bit.

Thank god you're here. I was so concerned that our minds are nailed shut.

246 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:51:34pm

re: #235 Lidane

Lidane - my old tired talking points work just as well against your old tired talking points. We probably ought to number each of the various talking points on both sides. Then we can just type a number to rebut each other. Would save a lot of typing effort, and typos.
"
Lidane: Brainsurfer, you are a 12, and you crazy idea 18.
Brainsurfer: 14 back at you
Lidane: Oh yeah, 15 you troll.
Brainsurfer: 2145
Lidane: "rolling eyes" 265,334. Top that.
Brainsurfer: Ah man, you got me.

247 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:51:46pm

re: #239 A Mom Anon

It might help make for happier and healthier communities if that anti choice energy got focused on the "post born".

That's just it -- they don't care about the "post-born". They don't even give a damn about the babies that haven't been born. It's all about slut shaming women and controlling their bodies and their sexuality.

It's why these so-called "pro-life" nutcases even object to things that would demonstrably lower the abortion rate, like birth control, emergency contraception, and comprehensive sex ed. It's not about the babies at all. It's about trying to roll back the progress women have made since The Pill was introduced.

248 A Mom Anon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:52:27pm

re: #242 Decatur Deb

I read that and about peed from laughing so hard.

249 engineer cat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:53:10pm

In this entrepreneurial country that we have, where fortunes are made in a lot of ways

ya, pickin' fruit n pushin' broom yer way to fame and fortune

seriously, i think a major unstated aim of the "conservative" movement is to browbeat american workers into being as cheap as the workers overseas they've been outsourcing our jobs to

250 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:55:41pm

re: #249 engineer cat

In this entrepreneurial country that we have, where fortunes are made in a lot of ways

ya, pickin' fruit n pushin' broom yer way to fame and fortune

seriously, i think a major unstated aim of the "conservative" movement is to browbeat american workers into being as cheap as the workers overseas they've been outsourcing our jobs to

One facet to that strategy is the one this woman so neatly represents, namely the celebration of ignorance and the demonizing of intellectuals. With a dollop of fear-mongering that colleges are engaging in "indoctrination" by providing a broader viewpoint to their students than just the one they got in their own homes.

251 A Mom Anon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:56:13pm

re: #247 Lidane

Yeah, I know,but think of the good all that energy could do if it was directed toward actually giving a shit. A girl can dream....

252 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:56:54pm

re: #249 engineer cat

In this entrepreneurial country that we have, where fortunes are made in a lot of ways

ya, pickin' fruit n pushin' broom yer way to fame and fortune

seriously, i think a major unstated aim of the "conservative" movement is to browbeat american workers into being as cheap as the workers overseas they've been outsourcing our jobs to

I keep saying an unfettered open market requires a large poorly paid workforce.

253 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 2:59:10pm

What is the Hyde Amendment?

Passed by Congress in 1976, the Hyde Amendment excludes abortion from the comprehensive health care services provided to low-income people by the federal government through Medicaid. Congress has made some exceptions to the funding ban, which have varied over the years. At present, the federal Medicaid program mandates abortion funding in cases of rape or incest, as well as when a pregnant woman's life is endangered by a physical disorder, illness, or injury.

Most states have followed the federal government's lead in restricting public funding for abortion. Currently only seventeen states fund abortions for low-income women on the same or similar terms as other pregnancy-related and general health services. (See map.) Four of these states provide funding voluntarily (HI, MD, NY,1 and WA); in thirteen, courts interpreting their state constitutions have declared broad and independent protection for reproductive choice and have ordered nondiscriminatory public funding of abortion (AK, AZ, CA, CT, IL, MA, MN, MT, NJ, NM, OR, VT, and WV).2 Thirty-two of the remaining states pay for abortions for low-income women in cases of life-endangering circumstances, rape, or incest, as mandated by federal Medicaid law.3 (A handful of these states pay as well in cases of fetal impairment or when the pregnancy threatens "severe" health problems, but none provides reimbursement for all medically necessary abortions for low-income women.) Finally, one state (SD) fails even to comply with the Hyde Amendment, instead providing coverage only for lifesaving abortions.

254 Tigger2005  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:00:53pm

re: #232 BrainSurfer

Whoa, there really are a lot of trolls here. All calling me a troll, imagine that.

Just being uppity, guys and gals. You all need some pushback, otherwise you're all going posting backpats to each other. I might even get some of you to open your minds a wee bit.

Awwwhhh, your concern for us is sooooo touching! I think...I think I'm gonna cry...you care! You really CARE!

255 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:03:01pm

re: #254 Tigger2005

Tigger, I really really do.
Want some tissues?

256 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:04:14pm

re: #232 BrainSurfer

Whoa, there really are a lot of trolls here. All calling me a troll, imagine that.

Just being uppity, guys and gals. You all need some pushback, otherwise you're all going posting backpats to each other. I might even get some of you to open your minds a wee bit.

Open my mind? I've been a patient of Planned Parenthood. You've just provided nothing against them except a 'nudge-nudge wink-wink' routine.

257 Tigger2005  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:05:48pm

re: #255 BrainSurfer

Tigger, I really really do.
Want some tissues?

/

258 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:06:05pm
259 A Mom Anon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:08:29pm

re: #256 SanFranciscoZionist

Me too. When I was a poor young woman,I don't know what I would have done without them. I was homeless for a short time,PP was my only access to ANY medical care back then.

260 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:08:58pm

re: #256 SanFranciscoZionist

SFZ - I'm happy PPH has helped you out - the services they provide are definitely helpful and needed.

261 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:11:08pm

re: #258 SanFranciscoZionist

Something useful to know.

Thanks for posting this.

262 Tigger2005  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:21:21pm

re: #260 BrainSurfer

SFZ - I'm happy PPH has helped you out - the services they provide are definitely helpful and needed.

Now try reading the link SFZ posted, BrainSurfer. Maybe it will open YOUR mind a wee bit.

263 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:35:52pm

Oh, man. I do get all kinds in here.

A guy just came in who is touring on his bicycle, I didn't ask him where he's from nor where he's going. He said he joined Adventure Cycling for a year, but didn't like their multicultural attitude, "You know, showing a white girl with a black guy in a tent."

I said, "That doesn't bother me. You know you're in a very multicultural town right now."

He said, "Oh, it's nothing against the black guy, it's just 'stick with your own kind', you know?"

And since I knew he was on his way out of town, I kept going. I said, "How pure do you think you are? If you haven't had your DNA checked, you don't know what you got in you. My grandmother said I have the blood of Genghis Khan in my veins, because he and his hordes came through the part of Europe where she was born in and raped all the women."

He muttered something about, "Well, I have a different spiritual attitude about it...let's see, I was going to ask you about something else...nevermind, I forgot."

Spiritual? What a pig.

264 Decatur Deb  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:41:03pm

re: #263 wrenchwench

Oh, man. I do get all kinds in here.

A guy just came in who is touring on his bicycle, I didn't ask him where he's from nor where he's going. He said he joined Adventure Cycling for a year, but didn't like their multicultural attitude, "You know, showing a white girl with a black guy in a tent."

I said, "That doesn't bother me. You know you're in a very multicultural town right now."

He said, "Oh, it's nothing against the black guy, it's just 'stick with your own kind', you know?"

And since I knew he was on his way out of town, I kept going. I said, "How pure do you think you are? If you haven't had your DNA checked, you don't know what you got in you. My grandmother said I have the blood of Genghis Khan in my veins, because he and his hordes came through the part of Europe where she was born in and raped all the women."

He muttered something about, "Well, I have a different spiritual attitude about it...let's see, I was going to ask you about something else...nevermind, I forgot."

Spiritual? What a pig.

Politics--10
Ethics--10
Attitude--10
Customer Relations--2

265 blueraven  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:42:50pm

re: #263 wrenchwench

Oh, man. I do get all kinds in here.

A guy just came in who is touring on his bicycle, I didn't ask him where he's from nor where he's going. He said he joined Adventure Cycling for a year, but didn't like their multicultural attitude, "You know, showing a white girl with a black guy in a tent."

I said, "That doesn't bother me. You know you're in a very multicultural town right now."

He said, "Oh, it's nothing against the black guy, it's just 'stick with your own kind', you know?"

And since I knew he was on his way out of town, I kept going. I said, "How pure do you think you are? If you haven't had your DNA checked, you don't know what you got in you. My grandmother said I have the blood of Genghis Khan in my veins, because he and his hordes came through the part of Europe where she was born in and raped all the women."

He muttered something about, "Well, I have a different spiritual attitude about it...let's see, I was going to ask you about something else...nevermind, I forgot."

Spiritual? What a pig.

Ha...genghiskhanwench
Watch the fuck out!

266 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:42:52pm

Okay, now I know how the Sockets work for Intel.

LGA-2011 is high end/high performance
LGA-1155 is performance to regular joe

Still want LGA-2011 to try and stave off obsolescence as long as possible. I'll probably gradually replace a few parts over the succeeding years (CPU and RAM).

I will probably compile a list of parts over time. I have a few motherboards of interest.

The real pains in the butt will be the Monitors, Speakers, Mouse, and Keyboard. Trying to choose them internet wise may not work for me because those are sensory, and with my Asperger's Induced sensitivity.

267 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:44:47pm

re: #263 wrenchwench

Spiritual side to his racism? Oh right. Let's not forget that the KKK used to have a "spiritual side" as well. What a creep.

268 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:46:16pm

re: #263 wrenchwench

Part of me would have wanted to kick him in the cajones to make sure to doesn't reproduce to perpetuate his racism.

269 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:53:47pm

re: #266 ProGunLiberal

I saw this and thought it might interest you.
Placement Service a Boon for People with Asperger's

Many people with Asperger's syndrome have difficulties in the job market and workplace, but they also have special abilities that many employers crave. A Danish company has found a way to bring the two together and is exporting its successful job-placement concept to other countries.

270 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:54:08pm

re: #263 wrenchwench

Nothing amuses the hell out of me more than hearing white guys, especially white American guys, play the "their own kind" card. I don't even have to go back 5 generations to find Indian blood in my veins, how far do you think that peckerwood would have to go?

And "spiritual attitude"? I'd have asked him if he stopped and considered that Jesus, rather than being the bleached blond stereotype you see in every Sunday school, was more than likely a short brown Jewish rabbi.

271 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:57:10pm

re: #260 BrainSurfer

SFZ - I'm happy PPH has helped you out - the services they provide are definitely helpful and needed.

Except that they're, according to what I read between the lines of your text, more interested in making a fortune from abortions, than in helping poor women get healthcare. So you can see that I'm a little curious as to your sources for this belief.

272 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:58:16pm

Same old shit from the Republicans.

Top 10 Reasons the Proposed House Bill is Bad for Biking and Walking

The House's proposed multi-year transportation bill eliminates key provisions for biking and walking infrastructure. Without dedicated funding and safety protection, communities across the country will lose access to the federal funds necessary to build the sidewalks, crosswalks, and bikeways that make biking and walking safe and accessible.

Reminds me of the 1980s.

273 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:58:39pm

re: #269 Killgore Trout

I want to work with GIS. That means working with Maps, which I absolutely love to do. I think spatially.

Also in a bit of a militaristic/opposition mindset. This might explain alot of how I act in some ways.

274 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:58:46pm

re: #263 wrenchwench

Oh, man. I do get all kinds in here.

A guy just came in who is touring on his bicycle, I didn't ask him where he's from nor where he's going. He said he joined Adventure Cycling for a year, but didn't like their multicultural attitude, "You know, showing a white girl with a black guy in a tent."

I said, "That doesn't bother me. You know you're in a very multicultural town right now."

He said, "Oh, it's nothing against the black guy, it's just 'stick with your own kind', you know?"

And since I knew he was on his way out of town, I kept going. I said, "How pure do you think you are? If you haven't had your DNA checked, you don't know what you got in you. My grandmother said I have the blood of Genghis Khan in my veins, because he and his hordes came through the part of Europe where she was born in and raped all the women."

He muttered something about, "Well, I have a different spiritual attitude about it...let's see, I was going to ask you about something else...nevermind, I forgot."

Spiritual? What a pig.

He thinks he gets away with assholeness with his fake spiritualness.

Yah, what a pig.

275 calochortus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:59:17pm

re: #270 Targetpractice

Their own kind? Really?
My own kind is people. What's theirs?

276 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 3:59:20pm

re: #265 blueraven

Ha...genghiskhanwench
Watch the fuck out!

Well, apparently one in 200 men today has genes they can trace back to the Great Khan. Same percentage of women are descendents, presumably, they just can't track the patrilineal markers.

Genghis got around. In several senses of the word.

277 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:00:16pm

re: #272 Gus

That doesn't bother me so much as cutting money towards building High-Speed and normal Rail. We have to end the dependence on cars, and building new rail system/improving this one means jobs, jobs, jobs!

278 calochortus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:01:45pm

re: #276 SanFranciscoZionist

Interesting. Those with European ancestry have an overwhelming probability of being able to trace their ancestry back to Charlemagne. (20 children and 40 generations will do that...)

279 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:03:55pm

re: #275 calochortus

Marrying your own kind results in a shrunken gene pool, which makes a person more vulnerable to genetic disorders.

This is why I have Asperger's. The Frisian part of my family married their own kind for 300 years, with 130 of it being in the US. The Gene pool was shrunk to the size of a kiddie pool. When the Norwegian Great-Grandmother brought in the Asperger's/Bipolar, there was nothing to counteract it.

Now, among her descendants, over half the males have either Autism or Bipolar disorder. No history of Schizophrenia yet.

280 MittDoesNotCompute  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:06:16pm

re: #276 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, apparently one in 200 men today has genes they can trace back to the Great Khan. Same percentage of women are descendents, presumably, they just can't track the patrilineal markers.

Genghis got around. In several senses of the word.

Genghis was a horny mutha...

281 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:06:57pm

re: #277 ProGunLiberal

That doesn't bother me so much as cutting money towards building High-Speed and normal Rail. We have to end the dependence on cars, and building new rail system/improving this one means jobs, jobs, jobs!

It's all important if one considers inter-modal transportation planning which includes cycling and walking. This also fits in with a high-speed or light-rail transportation design system. Obviously they're going to ignore all of the above and once again focus primarily on the automobile and the interest of big oil.

282 calochortus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:08:47pm

re: #279 ProGunLiberal

I think most people come from a somewhat limited gene pool. Easier travel, immigration and the greater ability for people to mix now days is a good thing.

283 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:12:19pm

From Transportation For America » The more they see, the less they like: 10 reasons why opposition to the House transportation bill is growing

1. Ends three decades of dedicated federal funding for public transportation.

Despite significant stakeholder opposition (including a letter signed by over 600 organizations), House leaders propose to end a bipartisan agreement dating back to the Reagan administration and eliminate all dedicated federal funding for public transportation.

H.R. 7 would take from transit the small share of the federal gas it now receives, and replace that revenue with a one-time, lump sum transfer from the general fund — even though no one knows where all of that money will come from.

Critiques of this provision have been sharp and relentless. The Sacramento Bee called it “a radical change to U.S. transportation policy.” The Illinois Chamber of Commerce said it will “put hundreds of millions of dollars for transit in peril,” a warning that has reverberated among dozens of suburban Republican legislators in transit-rich regions across the country, including a number from the Chicago area who have started in the last week to speak out against the bill. And perhaps former Pennsylvania Governor Ed Rendell said it best of all: “A transportation bill without transit is no transportation bill at all. The nation’s millions of transit riders deserve better than this.”

284 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:12:31pm

re: #279 ProGunLiberal

Should mention that my Norwegian Great-Grandmother married another man after she divorce my asshole of a Great-Grandfather. Mental Disorders are less common from the descendant of my Step-Great Grandfather.

The Step-Great Grandfather was more of a mix, consisting much of Germany and the Netherlands.

On the other hand, my Great-Grandfather came from a small region of West Europe, Frisia. In particular, Groningen Provence of the Netherlands. They did cross the border into Germany alot though, but not into areas that were unexpected considering they came from super-national ethnic group.

I am still likely related to my Step-Great-Grandfather by blood though: He has a name in common with my blood Great Grandfather.

285 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:13:22pm

Editorial: U.S. House throws transit under a bus
Published Thursday, Feb. 09, 2012

The day before a House Ways and Means Committee hearing last week, Republican leaders sprang a radical change to U.S. transportation policy.

If they have their way, the nation's transportation network will take a giant step backward to a "roads only" policy for dedicated funding. The full House votes next week on a multi-year transportation bill (House Resolution 7) – and Americans should urge their members of Congress to reject it.

The United States needs a transportation system that gives people a variety of options – roads, rail, bus, bicycle paths and walkways. It needs to find ways to reduce emissions and traffic congestion.

Currently, the federal gas tax we all pay when we fill up at the pump goes into the Highway Trust Fund. Since President Ronald Reagan signed the 1982 transportation bill, the money has been divided into an account for highways and an account for mass transit...

286 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:14:19pm

Hell I take back the 1980s comment. This is more like taking us back to the 1950s. Even Reagan --allegedly -- was more hip than this new crop of Republicans.

287 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:15:24pm

re: #272 Gus

Same old shit from the Republicans.

Top 10 Reasons the Proposed House Bill is Bad for Biking and Walking

Reminds me of the 1980s.

A bad bill gets worse. But it's election year politics: The GOP's assuring folks that it's a "jobs bill."

288 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:15:55pm

re: #287 Targetpractice

A bad bill gets worse. But it's election year politics: The GOP's assuring folks that it's a "jobs bill."

Just another highway boondoggle.

289 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:16:20pm

1 step forward. 2 steps back.

290 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:17:02pm
291 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:17:06pm

re: #282 calochortus

I think most people come from a somewhat limited gene pool. Easier travel, immigration and the greater ability for people to mix now days is a good thing.

It depends. Ashkenazi Jews, for example, have a ton of genetic disorders, compared to Sephardim, just because there were so few Jews in Europe, all descended from the same hundred and fifty people, that we bottlenecked.

The Sephardim had a much bigger marriage market, and didn't get nearly so concentrated.

292 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:17:38pm

re: #282 calochortus

Point taken, however, they were in the US for 100 years before they married outside of the group. They continued to be isolated long after that should have happened. The US is a melting pot. My mom's side caught more than half of all the big immigrant groups coming into the US. They started English, and accrued the Scottish, the Irish, the French, the Alsatians, the Swiss, the Dutch, the German, the Polish, and the Slovakians. My mom's very tolerant ancestors also fought in the American Revolution and the American Civil War, which makes me proud, because they acted for what they fought for.

My dad's side stayed with the same group in that same time. Eventually, this caused a problem.

293 calochortus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:17:59pm

re: #288 Gus

You'd think even people who never take transit would realize that keeping all the transit riders off the roads improves things for those who drive.

294 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:20:47pm

re: #288 Gus

Just another highway boondoggle.

It's the GOP figuring that they'll spend this year putting one bullshit bill after another before Reid and Obama, calling them "jobs bills," and then make press about the subsequent deaths or vetoes. They're already discussing openly their intention to put forth the Ryan Plan this year as their answer to the President's budget proposal.

295 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:21:43pm

re: #294 Targetpractice

It's the GOP figuring that they'll spend this year putting one bullshit bill after another before Reid and Obama, calling them "jobs bills," and then make press about the subsequent deaths or vetoes. They're already discussing openly their intention to put forth the Ryan Plan this year as their answer to the President's budget proposal.

Oh I'm sure they'll be trying to attach contraception amendments to the transportation bill at the same time.

296 calochortus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:21:44pm

re: #292 ProGunLiberal

I think a lot of people did that. My line on my Mom's side of the family is virtually all English for 300 years in the US. From a lot of different places in England as they trickled over, but still English. My Dad's side are immigrants of the Scandinavian persuasion. Some diversity, but not a whole lot.

297 Decatur Deb  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:21:59pm

re: #276 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, apparently one in 200 men today has genes they can trace back to the Great Khan. Same percentage of women are descendents, presumably, they just can't track the patrilineal markers.

Genghis got around. In several senses of the word.

re: #278 calochortus

Interesting. Those with European ancestry have an overwhelming probability of being able to trace their ancestry back to Charlemagne. (20 children and 40 generations will do that...)

Works for Brian Boru, too. Seems to work for most significant monarchs in time.

[Link: www.buildinghistory.org...]

298 engineer cat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:22:39pm

re: #282 calochortus

I think most people come from a somewhat limited gene pool. Easier travel, immigration and the greater ability for people to mix now days is a good thing.

we have gots the hybrid vigor

299 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:24:59pm

re: #296 calochortus

Ah, I thought my Mom's side was the Norm.

My mom's side is awesome. Though, they didn't end up in WWI or WWII. They hit the awkward zone where the family in both case had nobody of the right age to fight in those wars.

My Dad's side (the Dutch part) did. A large number of them died.

300 calochortus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:25:03pm

In the fullness of time, when I have grandchildren they will be the descendants of Charlemagne and Ghengis Khan. They will rule the world. Or at least our little part of it.

301 dragonfire1981  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:25:41pm

re: #285 Gus

Editorial: U.S. House throws transit under a bus
Published Thursday, Feb. 09, 2012

As a very pro-mass transit person, this shit REALLY pisses me off.

It already drives me mad how the United States has basically dick all as far as passenger train service goes. Bus coaches aren't much better. The other day I checked to see how long it would take me to travel from Alabama to Toronto, Canada on a Bus and the route took me from Alabama west through Mississippi and then north through Arkansas, then through Missouri, Chicago and Indianapolis before finally reaching Michigan and the Canadian border. I realize that such a long trip by necessity would require several transfers, but this is the best route I can get? That's a fucking joke. That trip takes me HUNDREDS of miles out of my way.

Efficient public transportation, especially trains, can be beneficial to society in a number of different ways, not least of which is cutting pollution and providing a viable alternative to expensive air travel.

We need more mass transit in this country, not more car engines clogging up the interstates.

302 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:26:44pm

re: #301 dragonfire1981

That's the thing. Not only are we not moving forward we're apparently going to throw it in reverse. WTF?

303 engineer cat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:27:25pm

re: #296 calochortus

I think a lot of people did that. My line on my Mom's side of the family is virtually all English for 300 years in the US. From a lot of different places in England as they trickled over, but still English. My Dad's side are immigrants of the Scandinavian persuasion. Some diversity, but not a whole lot.

"english" historically should be a mixture of the pre-celtic population whatever that might have been, celtic 'britons' (originally from the celtic homeland on the continent), angles and saxons from southern demark and northern germany, danes who settled in the danelaw, now known as york, and norman vikings from norway, not to mention the offspring of nice victorian ladies and their italian dancing masters...

304 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:28:13pm

re: #295 Gus

Oh I'm sure they'll be trying to attach contraception amendments to the transportation bill at the same time.

Nah, they already put their other favorite "cause" in it, namely Keystone.

305 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:28:53pm

re: #300 calochortus

Ehh, I would be more impressed my the children that would be reproduced by a marriage from a descendant of Suleiman and a descendant of Genghis Khan. Charlemagne didn't take over that much land.

Having a great deal of bloodline from Charlemagne's former empire, I wonder about my own genealogy a bit more.

306 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:30:00pm

re: #304 Targetpractice

Nah, they already put their other favorite "cause" in it, namely Keystone.

What a joke Keystone has turned out to be. Most of that oil wouldn't even stay in the USA and is basically "earmarked" for China.

307 calochortus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:30:29pm

re: #299 ProGunLiberal

Ah, I thought my Mom's side was the Norm.

My mom's side is awesome. Though, they didn't end up in WWI or WWII. They hit the awkward zone where the family in both case had nobody of the right age to fight in those wars.

My Dad's side (the Dutch part) did. A large number of them died.

That is too bad.

I've been doing some genealogy lately and find very little military participation by my ancestors. There was a tendency for males to be the wrong age for military service during conflicts. A few served but more didn't.

308 calochortus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:31:37pm

re: #305 ProGunLiberal

Ehh, I would be more impressed my the children that would be reproduced by a marriage from a descendant of Suleiman and a descendant of Genghis Khan. Charlemagne didn't take over that much land.

Having a great deal of bloodline from Charlemagne's former empire, I wonder about my own genealogy a bit more.

Picky, picky, picky. Charlemagne's just not good enough for you?

309 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:33:09pm

re: #306 Gus

What a joke Keystone has turned out to be. Most of that oil wouldn't even stay in the USA and is basically "earmarked" for China.

The whole thing, from tops to tails, is a joke. It's sold as a job creator except most of the jobs will likely just be people from other construction jobs moved over to work on it or remain in Canada, it will actually raise oil prices in the MidWest rather than lower them, and TransCanada's history with pipelines shows that it will likely be every bit as leaky as feared.

But the GOP needs to look like they're big on jobs and Big Oil's had a hard-on for this pipeline for years now, so don't expect it to die anytime soon as a political issue.

310 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:35:31pm

Republicans rebel against an oily transportation bill
Instead of fixing roads, the House leadership proposes a bonanza for the oil industry. Many Republicans are balking

There are over 4 million miles of road in the United States, 600,000 bridges, and more than 100,000 miles of rail. To prevent the lot of it from crumbling beneath us, Congress passes transportation authorization bills to fund the repair of the nation’s withering infrastructure. Given their unmistakable utility — everyone tends to agree that sagging bridges need fixing — they’re typically highly bipartisan affairs that come and go without anyone really noticing. Not this time.

When the GOP announced its transportation bill last month, Capitol HIll jaws dropped. The $260 billion five-year plan would, for the first time, tie transit funding to a bevy of new oil and gas projects. One would open up the long-preserved Arctic National Wildlife Refugee. Another would offer up millions of acres of public lands to shale drilling. Still another would open nearly all the nation’s coastline, including the recently oil-soaked Gulf of Mexico, and mandate a host of new offshore drilling operations.

You’ve almost got to admire the sheer audacity of House Republicans: This was supposed to be a transportation bill, not a bonanza for the oil industry...

I imagine the Republicans who are balking are in a small minority.

311 Gus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:36:26pm

re: #309 Targetpractice

The whole thing, from tops to tails, is a joke. It's sold as a job creator except most of the jobs will likely just be people from other construction jobs moved over to work on it or remain in Canada, it will actually raise oil prices in the MidWest rather than lower them, and TransCanada's history with pipelines shows that it will likely be every bit as leaky as feared.

But the GOP needs to look like they're big on jobs and Big Oil's had a hard-on for this pipeline for years now, so don't expect it to die anytime soon as a political issue.

Yep. It's a "Big Oil" bill.

312 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:36:32pm

re: #232 BrainSurfer

Whoa, there really are a lot of trolls here. All calling me a troll, imagine that.

Just being uppity, guys and gals. You all need some pushback, otherwise you're all going posting backpats to each other. I might even get some of you to open your minds a wee bit.

You only claim that abortion should be seen as morally wrong but not illegal.

That is not exactly a mind blowing position to take.

313 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:37:36pm

re: #307 calochortus

My mom's side participated before 1900. Then awkward age dynamics said hi, and they sat out the next century.

My Dad's side picked that up in WWII. One relative was blasted in 2 by Anzio Annie in Operation Shingle. There were a number of others too. Another was killed when his ship was sunk.

314 calochortus  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:40:32pm

re: #313 ProGunLiberal

War is wasteful in so many ways.

315 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:42:21pm

re: #313 ProGunLiberal

My mom's side participated before 1900. Then awkward age dynamics said hi, and they sat out the next century.

My Dad's side picked that up in WWII. One relative was blasted in 2 by Anzio Annie in Operation Shingle. There were a number of others too. Another was killed when his ship was sunk.

For those who do not know, Anzio Annie was a massive 350mm K5 railway gun used against the Allied beach head at Anzio by Germany. After the Allied advance forced its withdrawal, it was knocked out by Allied aircraft.

316 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:43:53pm

re: #261 My Camera Does Not Make Me A Good Photographer

Thanks for posting this.

LOL @ your pseudo nic BTW

317 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:47:57pm

re: #314 calochortus

He died for a good cause. I can take pride in that.

My mom's side on the other hand, seems to have made it out without much injury from the Revolution and the Civil War. Which is real lucky in the case of the Civil War, considering the death rate for males in that war was something like 8%, with the North (who my mom's ancestor's fought for) suffering 3% losses.

Also, the economic recovery is very slow still. The fertility rate of the US has dropped during our quasi-depression.

318 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:50:38pm

re: #317 ProGunLiberal

He died for a good cause. I can take pride in that.

My mom's side on the other hand, seems to have made it out without much injury from the Revolution and the Civil War. Which is real lucky in the case of the Civil War, considering the death rate for males in that war was something like 8%, with the North (who my mom's ancestor's fought for) suffering 3% losses.

Also, the economic recovery is very slow still. The fertility rate of the US has dropped during our quasi-depression.

1935 was the lowest birthrate recorded in the United States.

People tend to have fewer babies when there's no money.

319 jaunte  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:51:06pm

re: #309 Targetpractice

Valero is publicly “dedicated” to the Keystone XL project, and their 310,000 barrels per day Port Arthur, Texas refinery would receive the Alberta-born crude. Valero has invested heavily to upgrade the Port Arthur plant to handle “heavy” “sour” crude (a.k.a. tar sands DilBit) for the past few years, anticipating the pipeline’s completion.

“The nation’s top refiner has locked in at least 20 percent of the pipeline’s capacity,” Oil Change International found, “and, because its refinery in Port Arthur is within a Foreign Trade Zone, the company will accomplish its export strategy tax free.”
[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

320 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:52:40pm

re: #316 Daniel Ballard

LOL @ your pseudo nic BTW

Lol, thanks! I have a list of many, many more that I will be using as the year progresses. A couple of samples:

1.) Stop Asking Me How Much My 400mm 2.8 Costs, Asshole.

2.) No, I Will Not Email You Your Picture With No Watermarks.

321 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:53:59pm

For my own part, my father's father was 28 when America entered WWII. However, as the son of two German immigrants he was not drafted. He was called before the draft board, but the board decided not to conscript him. A short time thereafter, my grandfather found out that one member of the board had argued my grandfather would have "been a better fit for a Nazi recruiting poster" since as a tall, blond German he fit Hitler's 'Aryan' stereotype. Neither my father nor the elder two of his younger brothers were conscripted. The youngest two of his brothers (twins born after my aunt (the only girl of 6 children)) attended college and did not graduate till after conscription had ended. One of my cousins served in the National Guard early in the 2000's, but his enlistment ended years before his unit was sent to Iraq.

My mother's father did serve in World War II, as a B-25 bombardier based out of Port Morseby. He was shot down twice, and the second time the Japanese shot down the Catalina that rescued him. This ended his war, as he was sent home and finished hostilities on stateside duties. As plus, this did allow him time to marry my mother's mother.

322 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:54:01pm

re: #320 My Camera Does Not Make Me A Good Photographer
LOL

323 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:54:09pm

Also, apparently Red Cross is managing to evacuate Homs. I think we should consider trying to open up the US to the new Refugees. We have the room, and we need to repopulate Detroit anyway.

Though, we would have to encourage a large number of therapists to move to Detroit as well. A Syrian wave to the Detroit Metro Area will have PTSD and shell shock.

I think Detroit will be a good choice because of the high number of Arabs already in the area. They will be able to help the absorption of these people into the US.

324 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:54:22pm

re: #322 PhillyPretzel

LOL

*thumbs up*

325 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:55:09pm

re: #322 PhillyPretzel

LOL

No, I Will Not Put Your Wedding Rings Around Your Babies' Toes.

326 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:55:20pm

re: #320 My Camera Does Not Make Me A Good Photographer

I was thinking of going with Circle of confusion=Depth of Field.

327 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 4:57:24pm

re: #326 Daniel Ballard

I was thinking of going with Circle of confusion=Depth of Field.

This week I used "I Never Tilt My Camera." Possibly the most overused composition "tool" EVER. It is so weak.

328 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:01:57pm

re: #327 My Camera Does Not Make Me A Good Photographer

Are you going to shoot the conjunction tonight? I'm kinda thinking about it but I'd have to get up to the mountains to see it.

329 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:02:26pm

Nelson Mandela admitted to hospital with stomach ailment

The good news is that it looks like Nelson Mandela will recover from this, and that is Good News.

The bad news is that this is FNC, so the comments are a racist sewer:

James 5 minutes ago
Who cares about this old murderer?

brody24 19 minutes ago
I will say a prayer for Mr. Mandela. He is a true hero of mine, and one of the few we have left.

cobra129 39 minutes ago
Like Chavez, another soon to be dead.....Commuinist

factcheckman 48 minutes ago
I may have some conservative values, but I will never call myself a Republican. Look at yourselves, disgracing a great leader because of the color of his skin. Don't tell me you aren't, because I've seen a certain word spewed on this story at least 5 times. And this isn't all, no... You hate M uslims, you hate hom osexuals, you hate L atinos, you hate the C hinese... Who don't you hate? There was a real problem in the world when GB43 stepped down: EVERYONE HATED US! Why? Because of people like you, thinking they're better than everyone else....
show more

cobra129 36 minutes ago in reply to factcheckman
WHAAAAAAAAA...........WHAAAAAAAA............WHAAAAAAA. Sht the phvck up liberal pinko.......Mandela was nothing more than a communist mutha-phvcker, good riddence
1 person liked this.

danglingbags 1 hour ago
Sarah Palin is so upset about Nelson that she bought a Party Pack of Condoms and headed off to the NBA All Star Game.

11b4 56 minutes ago in reply to danglingbags
Meanwhile---ole Todd is in a position where he could BUY three or four tribes in africa.

whyxazz 1 hour ago
Maybe if Mandella croaks, Barry could go run that country instead.

Two decent and respectful comments, and the rest were filth (even the on going after Sarah Palin had racist undertones).

330 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:06:42pm

This next part is a particularly hateful exchange from that same FNC comment:

bobcat4662 1 hour ago
Yup, He sure Changed South Africa, THEY USED to be a self sustaining productive country, Now they beg and mooch off of the world, The land they took away from them that have owned it and improved it for hundreds of years is useless!!
5 people liked this.

11b4 56 minutes ago in reply to bobcat4662
Trash liberals will never understand what you have said. Zimbabwe is a prime example.

godisangry 1 hour ago
Mandella shall join Martin Luther King, Jr. in H e l l.
2 people liked this.

ebizzle13 1 hour ago in reply to godisangry
That's where your mother is! She will burn in there for having you!
1 person liked this.

11b4 53 minutes ago in reply to ebizzle13
Speaking of burning. Have you noticed all the negroids that are up for execution? It is going to be a beautiful spring.

I'll stop now, and I'll go wash my hands. They feel dirty just from copying and pasting that exchange.

331 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:08:10pm

re: #328 Daniel Ballard

Are you going to shoot the conjunction tonight? I'm kinda thinking about it but I'd have to get up to the mountains to see it.

I'm not in a good spot to shoot that.

332 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:09:38pm

re: #329 Dark_Falcon

More "fair and balanced" from the Fox News audience.
//

333 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:11:33pm

re: #323 ProGunLiberal

Actually, with the Syrian Crisis, it's high time for Immigration Reform.

Those here illegally will pay a fine and back taxes, which can be reduced if you volunteer for military service. Those who have serious criminal records (not talking about traffic violations, minor misdemeanors, or possession of soft-core drugs (marijuana and hashish). Also, have a temporary expansion of the INS to filter through the illegal immigrants, and those already in line as quickly as possible.

Post this, the INS structure needs to be reformed, with less levels of bureaucracy, but more people in the remaining levels. The wait time to the US needs to be slashed. I think right now, in many cases, it's close to 20 years. Would like it to be closer to 5. Also, we should have it so the number coming in per year is based off of the Census. Something like .5-.6% a year in Normal immigration, and .25-.5% a year for refugees. With the ability for the refugee number to be given exemptions if a massive crisis (like Syria) develops rapidly.

334 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:12:10pm

re: #330 Dark_Falcon

bobcat4662 1 hour ago
Yup, He sure Changed South Africa, THEY USED to be a self sustaining productive country, Now they beg and mooch off of the world, The land they took away from them that have owned it and improved it for hundreds of years is useless!!
5 people liked this.

First off, this comment's translation means "Things were a whole lot better when the whites ran the place and the blacks knew their place. Second, five people liked this. What a bunch of sick fucks.

335 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:13:23pm

Back. Wife had a bad PTSD episode. She's sleeping now so I can reply.

re: #108 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

Uh, sorry, that's sophism. What makes these tools "reasonable" and "logical" in themselves?

Are you saying that when these things were proposed in meetings that there weren't flowcharts? Graphs? Spreadsheets? All of which laid out in clear and precise logic how these things would work? Is that not reason in its full glory?

What was missing was ethics and memory, neither of which are reasonable. Ethics would have helped them question whether these were good things to not. Memory would have told them that similar things have been tried before and failed miserably. Reason cannot fill either of these roles.

re: #108 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

Gee. What else does he say? Sky is blue? Kittens are cute?

Cheap shot, really cheap. Unworthy of you.

It also demonstrates Mr. Saul's hypothesis that Reason has become a dictatorship. For a person cannot question or critique Reason without becoming an enemy of it. An enemy who must be derided and shamed.

re: #108 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

The question is: why focus on reason at all, in any way? Why not simply say "we need this, and this, and this"?

He does say that. His book On Equlibrium is about the other human traits he regards as essential and why they are necessary.

re: #108 Pam and Bob Sitting in a Tree

If anyone thinks there's just too much reason, my suggestion is to vote Republican. They rely on gut and morality. See how that works out.

I'm afraid that the Republicans, as currently constituted, merely demonstrate Mr. Saul's hypothesis; that any one human trait without the balance of other traits is destructive.

The Republicans are an example of ethics without restraint. They know the Truth and the Good and they are going to impose it on the world. A little common sense would tell them the world doesn't work the way they think it does, that the starting point of their ethics is fallacious. A little imagination would tell them where their goal will end up. Memory, that is history, would tell them their ethics are based on falsehoods. Reason would help them synthesize these things into a useful and good form.

Instead, they have only ethics which will be destructive because they have nothing else.

That is what Mr. Saul is saying about Reason. Unrestrained, not given direction by other necessary human traits, it is trampling blindly across the landscape of our lives.

336 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:13:48pm

Matt Taibbi is on point again:

Arizona Debate: Conservative Chickens Come Home to Roost

Most importantly, though, the conservative passion for divisive, partisan, bomb-tossing politics is threatening to permanently cripple the Republican party. They long ago became more about pointing fingers than about ideology, and it's finally ruining them.

Oh, sure, your average conservative will insist his belief system is based upon a passion for the free market and limited government, but that's mostly a cover story. Instead, the vast team-building exercise that has driven the broadcasts of people like Rush and Hannity and the talking heads on Fox for decades now has really been a kind of ongoing Quest for Orthodoxy, in which the team members congregate in front of the TV and the radio and share in the warm feeling of pointing the finger at people who aren't as American as they are, who lack their family values, who don’t share their All-American work ethic.

The finger-pointing game is a fun one to play, but it’s a little like drugs – you have to keep taking bigger and bigger doses in order to get the same high.

337 God of Binders with Women  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:15:23pm

re: #336 Lidane

The finger-pointing game is a fun one to play, but it’s a little like drugs – you have to keep taking bigger and bigger doses in order to get the same high.

Swoosh! Nothing but net.

338 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:17:48pm

re: #321 Dark_Falcon

Sorry to shift off of that, but I like my Immigration solution.

339 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:22:10pm

Oh shit, I have done killed the thread.

340 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:27:07pm

re: #338 ProGunLiberal

Sorry to shift off of that, but I like my Immigration solution.

Not a problem, but I'd rather not comment on the latter. It's ground we've gone over before and don't need to go over again.

341 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:30:46pm

re: #340 Dark_Falcon

Even with the disagreement over Arab Immigration, I think we can agree the immigration system is hopelessly broken. In fact, I would argue that is one reason so many illegal immigrants are illegal.

342 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:38:38pm

re: #341 ProGunLiberal

Even with the disagreement over Arab Immigration, I think we can agree the immigration system is hopelessly broken. In fact, I would argue that is one reason so many illegal immigrants are illegal.

True. Actually, I think Newt Gingrich* had a decent point when he said that no one could pass a single comprehensive immigration reform bill right now. Any changes will have to be small, piecemeal compromises.

*: This should not be read as support of Newt Gingrich in any way. I give him credit for a single correct insight with this post, no more.

343 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:39:54pm

re: #339 ProGunLiberal

Oh shit, I have done killed the thread.

Sorry, in the middle of watching somebody who should know better launch themselves into a circular argument over why the FDA needs to be done away with.

Long story short, I'm being told that the FDA can't be trusted because it was bribed to suppress test results, so we should instead trust 50 state governments to keep the same companies honest.

344 Lidane  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:42:20pm

re: #343 Targetpractice

Sorry, in the middle of watching somebody who should know better launch themselves into a circular argument over why the FDA needs to be done away with.

Long story short, I'm being told that the FDA can't be trusted because it was bribed to suppress test results, so we should instead trust 50 state governments to keep the same companies honest.

Let me guess -- a Luap Nor supporter? Sounds like some of the Paulbots I know.

345 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:45:24pm

re: #342 Dark_Falcon

I would actually agree with Gingrich's point on this.

However, I want everything reset ASAP.

And Detroit is actually fantastic for Arab immigration. Because people who are similar to you culturally who are already here will help in getting you settled in and added to the American Soup. Detroit is depopulated and in need of repopulation, and has a large number of Arabs both within the city, and in its suburbs.

Most people see a crisis in Detroit. I see it too, but I see something else too. Opportunity.

If, I am correct though on Afghanistan, the Hazara may form an analogy to some South Vietnamese and the Hmong people. But they are only distantly related to the Iranians. So, where to they end up?

346 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:45:56pm

re: #344 Lidane

Let me guess -- a Luap Nor supporter? Sounds like some of the Paulbots I know.

Ayep. Got herself worked into a snit about Monsanto and is ranting that if the regulations that exist aren't taking it behind the woodshed, then the regulations need to go, because we need to put our trust in folks like Dr. Oz and Consumer Reports.

347 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:50:31pm

re: #346 Targetpractice

Dr. Oz is a quack, but Consumer Reports are pretty good.

When I am on my own, I will get a subscription to it and NatGeo.

348 Targetpractice  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:56:37pm

re: #347 ProGunLiberal

Dr. Oz is a quack, but Consumer Reports are pretty good.

When I am on my own, I will get a subscription to it and NatGeo.

I trust in Consumer Reports, but at the same time, they have made mistakes in the past. And trusting them to test all food and drugs, not simply in the US but also those being imported, and giving us impartial reviews is a bit much.

349 ProGunLiberal  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 5:58:03pm

re: #348 Targetpractice

That is very true. Only it and National Geographic will I ever buy subscriptions for.

350 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 6:06:27pm

re: #345 ProGunLiberal

I would actually agree with Gingrich's point on this.

However, I want everything reset ASAP.

And Detroit is actually fantastic for Arab immigration. Because people who are similar to you culturally who are already here will help in getting you settled in and added to the American Soup. Detroit is depopulated and in need of repopulation, and has a large number of Arabs both within the city, and in its suburbs.

Most people see a crisis in Detroit. I see it too, but I see something else too. Opportunity.

If, I am correct though on Afghanistan, the Hazara may form an analogy to some South Vietnamese and the Hmong people. But they are only distantly related to the Iranians. So, where to they end up?

As Soon As Possible is in several years, though. I know you want to move faster, but the people on both side who understand Congress know it won't happen. Too much polarization, and both polarities have enough power to block a big move by the other. This is a "small ball" situation, requiring compromise. The good news about that is that, done correctly, nativists can be marginalized and both parties can end up holding fairly sane positions.

351 dell*nix  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 6:21:48pm

re: #169 BrainSurfer

As a resident of Houston, I can say that you are more than a little short of sense when it comes to womens health care in Texas. PP provides more than abortion services and you should be more than aware of that.

352 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 6:51:10pm

re: #351 dell*nix

Hi Dell. Glad you can make use of PPH services in Houston. I am well aware of all the services they provide. I simply do not like taxpayer dollars going to an organization that provides abortions. PPH can perform all the abortions they want - just not with the sleight of hand accounting trickery they and the government want everyone to overlook.

353 bubba zanetti  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 6:59:13pm

re: #273 ProGunLiberal

I want to work with GIS. That means working with Maps, which I absolutely love to do. I think spatially.

A friend of my wife has a son who has Asberger's syndrome or something similar. In his case he had a lot of problems with socializing and as a teenager would also have problems with violent episodes. A few years back the friend said he was calmed by maps in National Geographic magazine. I work in GIS, so I said "You have to show him Google Earth!". She set him up with it and he was hooked - I'm guessing he finally got to see things in the way his brain wanted to work. It calmed him down so much he ended up enrolling in the local community college's GIS certificate program, where he was doing excellent work.

354 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 7:20:38pm

re: #352 BrainSurfer

Hi Dell. Glad you can make use of PPH services in Houston. I am well aware of all the services they provide. I simply do not like taxpayer dollars going to an organization that provides abortions. PPH can perform all the abortions they want - just not with the sleight of hand accounting trickery they and the government want everyone to overlook.

If you feel that abortion should be legal why do you have a problem with the government funding it?

I'm morally opposed to premptive wars like Iraq, but at the same time you don't see me saying we should defund the troops who were fighting there.

355 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 7:43:47pm

re: #354 jamesfirecat

Right now, the law of the land is that abortion is legal. I accept this. I would prefer that abortion is a last choice, rarely needed option - except for the legal exceptions allowed for today, but that is idealist thinking. Don't see the need to pay for other people's poor luck or bad choices.

356 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 7:46:01pm

re: #355 BrainSurfer

Right now, the law of the land is that abortion is legal. I accept this. I would prefer that abortion is a last choice, rarely needed option - except for the legal exceptions allowed for today, but that is idealist thinking. Don't see the need to pay for other people's poor luck or bad choices.

I don't see the need to pay government subsidies to oil companies that are making huge profits.

Do you have an argument to make beyond "I think act X it should be legal should not be supported by government dollars?"

357 The Ghost of a Flea  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 7:46:10pm

re: #263 wrenchwench

...

He muttered something about, "Well, I have a different spiritual attitude about it...let's see, I was going to ask you about something else...nevermind, I forgot."

Spiritual? What a pig.

Well, he could be Ariosophist or Christian Identity: You know, those fake religions custom-built around hatin' brown folk and white-ness as substitute for actual merits or worth.

358 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 7:52:40pm

re: #354 jamesfirecat

James - re your second point ... being morally opposed to a preemptive war. Assuming for the sake of argument that you are sitting in Israel right now in some position of power, and you received confirm-able intel that Iran was planning to send a few nuke-tipped missiles your way. Would you wait till after you were hit, or take preemptive action?

359 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 7:56:19pm

re: #358 BrainSurfer

James - re your second point ... being morally opposed to a preemptive war. Assuming for the sake of argument that you are sitting in Israel right now in some position of power, and you received confirm-able intel that Iran was planning to send a few nuke-tipped missiles your way. Would you wait till after you were hit, or take preemptive action?

Yes.

If it's preemptive war of be destroyed, preemptive war is the obvious choice.

Now explain to me how Iraq would have destroyed the USA if we didn't invade.....

360 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:05:29pm

re: #356 jamesfirecat

James, are you against US support for a domestic oil producing capability as apparently the Obama Administration is? If so, then obviously oil companies should be left to sink or swim on their own. Meanwhile, we become more dependent on other countries who can provide the oil we need which can only result in higher and higher gas prices.

Meanwhile, we subsidize unproven green technologies to the tune of billions without effect.

Doesn't make sense. I say take advantage of our own natural resources while we can while we move in the direction of cleaner and cleaner energy when it makes economic sense to do so.

361 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:07:27pm

re: #359 jamesfirecat

No. Let's not rehash Iraq all over again. But I would be interested in your take on whether or not we should be in Afghanistan.

362 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:09:53pm

re: #361 BrainSurfer

No. Let's not rehash Iraq all over again. But I would be interested in your take on whether or not we should be in Afghanistan.

We should be. They/the terrorist group that was hand in glove with the government was attacked us so we were 100% justified in retaliating. However, it was a mistake to allow them to self govern so soon after our invasion, we should have taken actions similar to what we did with Germany and Japan a tight leash on things for a while, conquer the nation, stay in complete governmental control and rebuild the nation from the ground up before turning power over to the locals.

363 freetoken  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:10:32pm

re: #360 BrainSurfer

Given that drilling in the US has gone up during the Obama administration it makes no sense to claim that the current administration is keeping companies from drilling for oil petroleum.

It just doesn't.

364 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:10:56pm

re: #360 BrainSurfer

James, are you against US support for a domestic oil producing capability as apparently the Obama Administration is? If so, then obviously oil companies should be left to sink or swim on their own. Meanwhile, we become more dependent on other countries who can provide the oil we need which can only result in higher and higher gas prices.

Meanwhile, we subsidize unproven green technologies to the tune of billions without effect.

Doesn't make sense. I say take advantage of our own natural resources while we can while we move in the direction of cleaner and cleaner energy when it makes economic sense to do so.

The purpose of government subsidies is to help companies make up the cost of actions which while not optimally profitable, the government wants someone to do.

Oil companies are making record profits, why do they still need subsidies?

365 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:13:37pm

re: #363 freetoken

Be serious, James - drilling has gone up in spite of the Obama Admin's attempt to whack-a-mole it. All the drilling in North Dakota and the oil boom that is taking place there is being accomplished without govenerment help.

366 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:14:58pm

re: #365 BrainSurfer

Be serious, James - drilling has gone up in spite of the Obama Admin's attempt to whack-a-mole it. All the drilling in North Dakota and the oil boom that is taking place there is being accomplished without govenerment help.

Just out of curiosity, what actions has the Obama administration taken that you consider to be so anti-American oil?

367 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:15:25pm

re: #365 BrainSurfer

Be serious, James - drilling has gone up in spite of the Obama Admin's attempt to whack-a-mole it. All the drilling in North Dakota and the oil boom that is taking place there is being accomplished without govenerment help.

That's Freetoken, I'm James.

368 Interesting Times  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:16:28pm

re: #363 freetoken

Given that drilling in the US has gone up during the Obama administration it makes no sense to claim that the current administration is keeping companies from drilling for oil petroleum.

What, you don't agree with the brain-dead troll's implication that, save for government largesse, the poor, poor oil companies would wilt and wither? :P

Never mind the fact they get far, far, far more help than renewables do:

Estimates of the value of U.S. federal subsidies to the domestic oil and gas industry alone (not coal) range from “only” $4 billion a year, to an amazing $41 billion annually. One recent comprehensive study of U.S. energy subsidies (see graph below) identified $72.5 billion in federal subsidies for fossil fuels between 2002-2008, or just over $10 billion annually. For more information on the range of subsidies, see below.

369 Interesting Times  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:19:14pm

re: #367 jamesfirecat

That's Freetoken, I'm James.

The brain-dead troll is furiously pulling Rush Limbaugh talking points from his nether regions. He can be excused for lacking any additional mental energy for correctly quoting comments ;)

370 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:24:15pm

re: #364 jamesfirecat

Oil companies make profits when prices go up based on margins allowed. Subsidies are in place to help those companies offset the extremely high cost of exploration and drilling. If the government doesn't want the oil companies to explore for oil, then drill for oil to make it available for our use, then obviously the subsidies should be canceled. Sure seems counterproductive to me.

What I don't understand is why Obama wants to minimize our own oil producing capabilities (while providing help to the Brazilian oil industry) before we have proven and cost effective energy alternatives.

My guess is that he wants to placate the Environmentalists and the AGW crowd in order to help him get reelected.

371 sagehen  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:24:21pm

re: #355 BrainSurfer

Right now, the law of the land is that abortion is legal. I accept this. I would prefer that abortion is a last choice, rarely needed option - except for the legal exceptions allowed for today, but that is idealist thinking. Don't see the need to pay for other people's poor luck or bad choices.

Anyone who can't afford an abortion, can't afford labor and delivery. The taxpayers will cover it. And of course she'll need a minimum of a couple weeks off work (more if it's a c-section), and she probably can't afford diapers and formula and vaccinations -- assuming of course that she has a healthy child who doesn't need a couple of weeks of NICU. There'll probably be some medicaid for the kid, food stamps...

I'm saying, don't use "the money the money!!!eleventyttryingtosavemoney!!" as an argument against public funding of abortions for women who can't scrape up the money themselves. You're not saving any money.

372 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:25:53pm

re: #367 jamesfirecat

My bad. Getting my threads mixed up. (Third beer was the culprit).

373 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:27:08pm

re: #370 BrainSurfer

Oil companies make profits when prices go up based on margins allowed. Subsidies are in place to help those companies offset the extremely high cost of exploration and drilling. If the government doesn't want the oil companies to explore for oil, then drill for oil to make it available for our use, then obviously the subsidies should be canceled. Sure seems counterproductive to me.

What I don't understand is why Obama wants to minimize our own oil producing capabilities (while providing help to the Brazilian oil industry) before we have proven and cost effective energy alternatives.

My guess is that he wants to placate the Environmentalists and the AGW crowd in order to help him get reelected.

Umm... the help that was given to the Brazillian companies was part of the Import Export Bank of the US, it wasn't done to help get Brazil to drill for oil, it was done so that they would agree to buy products from us in exchange for some money they needed....

374 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:27:54pm

re: #372 BrainSurfer

My bad. Getting my threads mixed up. (Third beer was the culprit).

Try using "quote" button instead of "reply",makes it much easier to tell who/what you're supposed to be talking about.

375 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:30:31pm

re: #366 jamesfirecat

Let me turn that question around and ask exactly where or when has Obama proactively pushed for greater support for American oil companies or increased drilling.

376 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:32:25pm

re: #374 jamesfirecat

Try using "quote" button instead of "reply",makes it much easier to tell who/what you're supposed to be talking about.

Thanks. Dumb troll that I am will gladly take on the help I can get.

377 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:33:20pm

re: #375 BrainSurfer

Let me turn that question around and ask exactly where or when has Obama proactively pushed for greater support for American oil companies or increased drilling.

Let me turn it around again, what have oil companies done to prove that they deserve the right to drill in more areas in America? After a disaster like with BP's rig having other companies take the risk of having such disasters happen somewhere away from our soil would have to start looking more appealing, don't you agree?

378 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:52:16pm

re: #377 jamesfirecat

Let me turn it around again, what have oil companies done to prove that they deserve the right to drill in more areas in America? After a disaster like with BP's rig having other companies take the risk of having such disasters happen somewhere away from our soil would have to start looking more appealing, don't you agree?

That's like saying the space shuttle Challenger blew up so we should stop all attempts to go into space. Sorry don't buy that. American oil companies are demonized for being oil companies - they produce oil which, by definition from a Left perspective, is bad (causing global warming) - yet these companies provide one heck of a lot of jobs, have stock which is owned in some form or another by probably a majority of Americans (e.g. pension funds), and provide the energy which powers America today.

And yet, Obama says we need to support American companies. Which is true - if these American companies are "green" and owned by his supporters, or, maybe, simply owned by his supporters.

379 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:54:25pm

re: #369 Interesting Times

The brain-dead troll is furiously pulling Rush Limbaugh talking points from his nether regions. He can be excused for lacking any additional mental energy for correctly quoting comments ;)

Don't listen to Rush, although I do plead guilty to running low on mental energy about now.

380 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 8:55:59pm

re: #378 BrainSurfer

That's like saying the space shuttle Challenger blew up so we should stop all attempts to go into space. Sorry don't buy that. American oil companies are demonized for being oil companies - they produce oil which, by definition from a Left perspective, is bad (causing global warming) - yet these companies provide one heck of a lot of jobs, have stock which is owned in some form or another by probably a majority of Americans (e.g. pension funds), and provide the energy which powers America today.

And yet, Obama says we need to support American companies. Which is true - if these American companies are "green" and owned by his supporters, or, maybe, simply owned by his supporters.

Its not just the disaster it was the way that the oil companies seemed to be tripping over themselves to prove their incompitence, like how many companies had the same five years dead guy on their list of experts to call in case of a disaster.

By the way you go too far in demonizing all leftists as opposing oil companies. How would you feel if I said "All conservatives hate colleges because they pick apart the simple biblical world view many conservatives depend upon in order to get people to vote for them"?

Either way we've sort of wandered away from the issue at hand here (abortion and who pays for it), haven't we?

381 Interesting Times  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 9:06:03pm

re: #380 jamesfirecat

Either way we've sort of wandered away from the issue at hand here (abortion and who pays for it), haven't we?

Here's something to bring it right back:

Nicolae Ceausescu loved nothing better than a monument to himself. But his ministerial palaces and avenues paled next to another of his schemes for building socialism: a plan to increase Romania’s population from 23 million to 30 million by the year 2000. He began his campaign in 1966 with a decree that virtually made pregnancy a state policy. “The fetus is the property of the entire society,” Ceausescu proclaimed. “Anyone who avoids having children is a deserter who abandons the laws of national continuity.”

Read the whole horrifying thing.

382 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 9:07:47pm

re: #381 Interesting Times

Here's something to bring it right back:

Read the whole horrifying thing.

Wow... this late at night the only way I can mentally deal with that is imagining Vlad Tepes rising from his grave (again) to kick his ass....

383 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 9:13:54pm

re: #373 jamesfirecat

Umm... the help that was given to the Brazillian companies was part of the Import Export Bank of the US, it wasn't done to help get Brazil to drill for oil, it was done so that they would agree to buy products from us in exchange for some money they needed...

Yeah, concede that point, poor example.

384 jamesfirecat  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 9:20:25pm

re: #383 BrainSurfer

Yeah, concede that point, poor example.

Don't worry about it too much its so late I'm only up because Star Trek (the new one) is still on and I haven't gotten around to seeing it till now, I'm turning in for the night.

385 BrainSurfer  Sat, Feb 25, 2012 9:29:57pm

re: #384 jamesfirecat

Don't worry about it too much its so late I'm only up because Star Trek (the new one) is still on and I haven't gotten around to seeing it till now, I'm turning in for the night.

Ah man... I am missing a Star Trek doing this? Life's a bitch. But then again, I'm also Google Talking with my daughter in Shanghai right how, so Life is all right after all. Enjoy the show.

386 Obdicut  Sun, Feb 26, 2012 7:27:16am

re: #365 BrainSurfer

Nearly every substantive post of yours contains an easily-verified lie.

387 S'latch  Mon, Feb 27, 2012 5:38:22am

I recently was surprised to learn that Rick Santorum is a Catholic. He certainly acts and sounds more like a Protestant evangelical type. I wonder if his new supporters realize he is a traditional Roman Catholic. (Not that it really matters in the end. He is a kook who is destined to fail.)

388 S'latch  Mon, Feb 27, 2012 5:51:31am

I also just realized that I posted my comment in the wrong thread. So, I should know about fail.


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Here's one for mother.