Arnold Schwarzenegger vs. the Wingnuts

Extremists demanding far right ideological purity
Politics • Views: 29,682

Former California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger calls out the ideological extremists who dominate today’s Republican Party: California’s GOP Should Take Down Its Small Tent.

I’ve been writing my memoirs recently, and looking back at how I came to my political identity has reminded me that this election cycle marks my 44th year as a Republican. I can’t imagine being anything else.

That’s why I am so bothered by the party’s recent loss of two up-and-coming Republicans: San Diego mayoral candidate Nathan Fletcher, currently a state assemblyman, and former assemblyman and current Congressional candidate Anthony Adams, both of whom left the party to become independents. On the one hand, I respect their standing up for principle. On the other, I hate to see them go.

I’m sure they would have preferred to remain Republicans, but in the current climate, the extreme right wing of the party is targeting anyone who doesn’t meet its strict criteria. Its new and narrow litmus test for party membership doesn’t allow compromise.

I bumped up against that rigidity many times as governor. Not surprisingly, the party wasn’t always too happy with me. But I had taken an oath to serve the people, not my party. Some advisors whose opinions I respect urged me to consider leaving the party and instead identify myself as a “decline to state” voter. But I’m too stubborn to leave a party I believe in.

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374 comments
1 PhillyPretzel  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:50:05pm

"I’m sure they would have preferred to remain Republicans, but in the current climate, the extreme right wing of the party is targeting anyone who doesn’t meet its strict criteria. Its new and narrow litmus test for party membership doesn’t allow compromise." Thank you Arnold. You have hit the issue squarely on the head.

2 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:50:12pm

On the one hand, I respect Ahnold for speaking up about the very obvious problem with the party and his disagreement with it.

One the other, it still puzzles the fuck out of me how party members who recognize the very real collapse of any bit of sanity with the party ranks decide that the best course of action is to continue supporting the party.

3 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:50:44pm

And the Tea-hadi's are screaming in rage already.

4 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:51:00pm

re: #2 Targetpractice

On the one hand, I respect Ahnold for speaking up about the very obvious problem with the party and his disagreement with it.

One the other, it still puzzles the fuck out of me how party members who recognize the very real collapse of any bit of sanity with the party ranks decide that the best course of action is to continue supporting the party.

I don't either but I think a lot of them like Arnold and Frum think they can fix it.

5 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:51:26pm

re: #4 HappyWarrior

I don't either but I think a lot of them like Arnold and Frum think they can fix it.

I wish them luck, but think it's a fool's errand.

6 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:51:52pm

re: #5 Targetpractice

I wish them luck, but think it's a fool's errand.

Oh I do too. Just my guess to what their thought process is here.

7 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:52:00pm

And of course the extremists are jumping all over Arnold for doing this. From HotAir:

Good. I’m cheering for Lugar to go down to defeat Tuesday. The fewer of you “moderate” types we have, the happier we’ll be.

Stoic Patriot on May 6, 2012 at 2:22 PM

Yeah, "fewer" is just what the GOP needs.

The GOP pretty much is, which is what mkaes this sort of crap so ironic. The party is set to nominate yet another moderate for president, and yet we get the usual b1tching and moaning about “extremists” whenever ANY establishment squish like Lugar is in trouble. It’s the moderates who constantly are using that “purity test” to ferret out “extremists”, it seems to me.

ddrintn on May 6, 2012 at 3:11 PM

And so on.

8 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:53:03pm

Purity gets you no where.

9 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:54:07pm

BTW, this quest for purity by the far right in the GOP mirrors what is happening in various American Christian groups and denominations today, as the True Believers are working to root out the heretics.

College professors/teachers are being forced to leave their posts in religious schools, and denominations are doing the censoring thing, and so forth.

Indeed, the GOP purification is exactly like what is happening in these religious groups. Perhaps because it is the same people?

10 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:55:10pm

re: #9 freetoken

BTW, this quest for purity by the far right in the GOP mirrors what is happening in various American Christian groups and denominations today, as the True Believers are working to root out the heretics.

College professors/teachers are being forced to leave their posts in religious schools, and denominations are doing the censoring thing, and so forth.

Indeed, the GOP purification is exactly like what is happening in these religious groups. Perhaps because it is the same people?

That doesn't sound far off. What amazes me is instead of becoming more progressive minded (in the broad sense of the word) the GOP and churches seem to be growing more conservative and narrow minded.

11 engineer cat  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:55:25pm

let's see...

'single payer doesn't work' vs a constant stream of spam titled "pills from canadian pharmacies"

hmmm

12 engineer cat  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:56:56pm

Its new and narrow litmus test

in 2008 limbaugh ran a picture of schwartzenegger, giuliani, and mccain standing together at a podium, entitled "three liberals"

13 PhillyPretzel  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:57:01pm

re: #11 engineer cat

I get that spam too. I am filling up my spam block list fast.

14 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:58:26pm

I think Arnold may be one of the only people I've ever known of that was inspired to become a Republican because of Nixon. Which is kind of funny because alot believe that Nixon was the last domestically liberal president.

15 Stanghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 1:59:44pm

Its a very creepy, dangerous time.

Liberal, marked for extinction, not compromise.

16 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:00:42pm

re: #10 HappyWarrior

That doesn't sound far off. What amazes me is instead of becoming more progressive minded (in the broad sense of the word) the GOP and churches seem to be growing more conservative and narrow minded.

It's a winnowing process that happens most universally. I contend our society is in the process of a de-Christianization, and in doing this the peeling back of the layers of the onion, so to speak, will bring many tears.

17 goddamnedfrank  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:01:39pm

re: #2 Targetpractice

On the one hand, I respect Ahnold for speaking up about the very obvious problem with the party and his disagreement with it.

One the other, it still puzzles the fuck out of me how party members who recognize the very real collapse of any bit of sanity with the party ranks decide that the best course of action is to continue supporting the party.

It's just a gang mentality. They've been part of it so long that they can't imagine themselves on the outside.

re: #4 HappyWarrior

I don't either but I think a lot of them like Arnold and Frum think they can fix it.

They're not that stupid, they're just cowards, afraid of being on their own. They love the idea of belonging to the group. This is how they derive their sense of self identity and pride.

18 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:05:02pm

But... according to Krauthammer, it is Obama who is the one dividing the nation:

Obama’s flawed vision – victory by division

19 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:05:55pm

re: #18 freetoken

But... according to Krauthammer, it is Obama who is the one dividing the nation:

Obama’s flawed vision – victory by division

Funny Krauthammer, I don't see Obama going around dismissing parts of the country that disagree with him as not being "real Americans" like his Republican opponents like to do.

20 Interesting Times in Benghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:06:22pm
21 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:07:10pm

re: #17 goddamnedfrank

It's just a gang mentality. They've been part of it so long that they can't imagine themselves on the outside.

Yeah, pretty much what I've seen from every "moderate" so far, that acknowledgment that the party has lost its fraking mind, but a refusal to break ranks because "The other side will win!"

22 dragonath  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:11:11pm

Wow, I just found out about another thing James Buckley had a hand in. I always thought he was the more influential of the two brothers.

Buckley v. Valeo:

Buckley v. Valeo, 424 U.S. 1 (1976), was a case in which the Supreme Court of the United States upheld a federal law which set limits on campaign contributions, but ruled that spending money to influence elections is a form of constitutionally protected free speech, and struck down portions of the law. The court also ruled candidates can give unlimited amounts of money to their own campaigns.

I tripped across this while looking up an article about John Heinz, former moderate Republican from PA.

23 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:11:11pm

re: #21 Targetpractice

Yeah, pretty much what I've seen from every "moderate" so far, that acknowledgment that the party has lost its fraking mind, but a refusal to break ranks because "The other side will win!"

Or it's the other side is just as bad. The Democratic Party has its nuts certainly- every party does but the hostility directed towards President Obama has been disgusting and that's being generous.

24 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:20:17pm

I think he knows what the word means:

Newt Gingrich As Mitt Romney's Vice President: "It Would Be Inconceivable"

25 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:22:54pm

Speaking of the Republicans, Chris Mooney takes on an AEI flack:

Johannes Kepler’s Republican Brain? Not.

26 Lidane  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:24:46pm

re: #18 freetoken

But... according to Krauthammer, it is Obama who is the one dividing the nation:

Obama’s flawed vision – victory by division

Fuck Krauthammer. He's been a miserable hack for ages.

It would be news if he had an interesting idea for a change.

27 Obdicut  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:25:16pm

OT: Some mod I'm using is making all the light sources in Fallout: New Vegas buzz really loudly, and it's driving me nuts.

28 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:27:04pm

re: #18 freetoken

But... according to Krauthammer, it is Obama who is the one dividing the nation:

Obama’s flawed vision – victory by division

Yeah, I've heard that bullshit for months now. "Obama's dividing us for his reelection!" If that were so, you'd think the GOP would be making every effort to resist such division, working to touch base with the voters that Obama's "dividing" them from and work to address issues important to them.

Instead, the GOP is making a very strong, very public effort to piss off as many voter blocs as it can between now and November, while convincing itself that there's some small number in that bloc who support what they're doing.

29 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:28:30pm

I like it when right wing pundits claim Obama is the divisive one yet their own candidates are going around saying anyone who wants to raise taxes on the rich is just "jealous" and supporting "class warfare." Class warfare goes both ways and that reverse class warfare is exactly why people like Romney and his pal Paul Ryan support.

30 jamesfirecat  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:30:50pm

I sure hope Arnold is able to terminate the wing nuts but something tells me it could be a job that will take more than six days to accomplish.... (I could go on)

31 Lidane  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:31:17pm

re: #29 HappyWarrior

I like it when right wing pundits claim Obama is the divisive one yet their own candidates are going around saying anyone who wants to raise taxes on the rich is just "jealous" and supporting "class warfare."

Image: voting_republican.jpg

32 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:31:44pm

re: #31 Lidane

Image: voting_republican.jpg

Ha.

33 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:34:35pm

Take the Violence Against Women Act, for example. First you have every male GOP Senator voting against its extension, whining that it was a "poison bill" because amongst the added provisions was one that added visas for undocumented workers subject to abuse.

Now, the House GOP are looking to piss off women even more by not only stripping those additional visas, but writing new rules that would allow the abusers to know that the target of their abuse blew the whistle.

34 dragonfire1981  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:34:38pm

I'm betting against the wingnuts on this one. If movies have taught me anything its this: you do NOT fuck with Arnold Schwarzenegger.

35 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:35:27pm

re: #28 Targetpractice

It's projection on Krauthammer's part. He just can't own up to the idea that the racist wingnuts have been pushing the race-war meme in various camouflaged forms ever since Obama surfaced as a candidate.

36 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:35:33pm

re: #4 HappyWarrior

I don't either but I think a lot of them like Arnold and Frum think they can fix it.

I think that, too.

37 Obdicut  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:37:05pm

re: #36 Dark_Falcon

What are you doing to fix it?

38 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:38:11pm

re: #36 Dark_Falcon

I think that, too.

And how do you fix it by enabling it?

39 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:39:42pm

If I am correct and all this fractured American polity, internecine GOP/"conservative" warfare, and ODS are signs of the de-Christianization of America then I expect the fracturing to lead to apathy, not engagement. IOW, I project the driving instinct will be one of protection and withdrawing into the fortress.

40 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:39:45pm

re: #33 Targetpractice

Take the Violence Against Women Act, for example. First you have every male GOP Senator voting against its extension, whining that it was a "poison bill" because amongst the added provisions was one that added visas for undocumented workers subject to abuse.

Now, the House GOP are looking to piss off women even more by not only stripping those additional visas, but writing new rules that would allow the abusers to know that the target of their abuse blew the whistle.

Yeah that was fucked up But when you're seeing a mindset that thinks undocumented workers shouldn't be treated like you know human beings, this happens.

41 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:40:30pm

re: #22 Be Zorch, Daddio

Wow, I just found out about another thing James Buckley had a hand in. I always thought he was the more influential of the two brothers.

Buckley v. Valeo:

Buckley v. Valeo, 424 U.S. 1 (1976), was a case in which the Supreme Court of the United States upheld a federal law which set limits on campaign contributions, but ruled that spending money to influence elections is a form of constitutionally protected free speech, and struck down portions of the law. The court also ruled candidates can give unlimited amounts of money to their own campaigns.

I tripped across this while looking up an article about John Heinz, former moderate Republican from PA.

You don't think that was the right verdict. IT seems clear to me, especially the part about self-funding. You can't corrupt yourself, so there is no reason to bar self-funding. If that means a lesser but richer candidate snows under a poorer but smarter one, them's the brakes. The 1st Amendment was set up to preserve political speech and well as other kinds of speech. And yes, TV attack ads are political speech.

42 Sionainn  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:40:31pm

re: #33 Targetpractice

Take the Violence Against Women Act, for example. First you have every male GOP Senator voting against its extension, whining that it was a "poison bill" because amongst the added provisions was one that added visas for undocumented workers subject to abuse.

Now, the House GOP are looking to piss off women even more by not only stripping those additional visas, but writing new rules that would allow the abusers to know that the target of their abuse blew the whistle.

Not every single male GOP Senator voted against it. My Republican Senator voted for it...something that shocked the heck out of me.

43 goddamnedfrank  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:40:57pm

re: #38 Targetpractice

And how do you fix it by enabling it?

Hey now, nobody pays better lip service to the importance of integrity than D_F.

His use of footage of Obama wasn't quite as bad as what Grayson did, but it was very bad in my eyes. It'll prevent me from voting for Romney in the primary, since I don't support that sort of dishonesty. Mitt seems to have his eyes too closely focused on the prize, to the exclusion of principles and honesty.

44 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:41:13pm

re: #42 Sionainn

Not every single male GOP Senator voted against it. My Republican Senator voted for it...something that shocked the heck out of me.

You're right, should have worded that more like "every GOP Senator who voted against it was male."

45 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:41:31pm

re: #42 Sionainn

Not every single male GOP Senator voted against it. My Republican Senator voted for it...something that shocked the heck out of me.

Who was that?

46 Sionainn  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:43:35pm

re: #45 HappyWarrior

Who was that?

Dean Heller (R-NV).

47 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:44:09pm

re: #46 Sionainn

Dean Heller (R-NV).

Ah don't know anything about him.

48 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:45:42pm

re: #37 Obdicut

What are you doing to fix it?

I try to vote for the right people and give them money and I advise others to do the same. The problem is that last election cycle the two 'right people' were Mark Kirk and Joel Pollack. Kirk won Obama's old Senate seat but has since suffered a stroke, thus his influence has been curtailed (he has, though, come home from the RIC and he will likely be able to return to the Senate). As for Joel Pollack, he's someone who I thought was a good man but it turns out he's really an asshole who was willing to go full wingnut for the right price.

49 Sionainn  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:47:58pm

re: #47 HappyWarrior

Ah don't know anything about him.

He was one of Nevada's Representatives, but then was tapped to take Ensign's place when Ensign resigned. For as long as I can remember, Heller has never voted the way I wanted him to vote.

50 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:48:25pm

re: #33 Targetpractice

Take the Violence Against Women Act, for example. First you have every male GOP Senator voting against its extension, whining that it was a "poison bill" because amongst the added provisions was one that added visas for undocumented workers subject to abuse.

Now, the House GOP are looking to piss off women even more by not only stripping those additional visas, but writing new rules that would allow the abusers to know that the target of their abuse blew the whistle.

One very prominent GOP male Senator voted for the extension: That man was John McCain. The DNC graphic only listed the GOP men who voted 'no' and the women who voted yes, it did not show the GOP men who voted 'yes'.

51 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:49:32pm

re: #50 Dark_Falcon

One very prominent GOP male Senator voted for the extension: That man was John McCain. The DNC graphic only listed the GOP men who voted 'no' and the women who voted yes, it did not show the GOP men who voted 'yes'.

I've already addressed this mistake on my part.

52 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:50:58pm

re: #51 Targetpractice

I've already addressed this mistake on my part.

Sorry I hadn't seen that. No malice was assumed on your part, BTW.

53 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:51:57pm

The Republican Party's been pretty extreme for a couple years now. Arnold waited until he was safely out of office and needed some buzz for his book to speak out. Biggest problem for Republicans is they're a bunch of pussies. I remember after 9/11 all they wanted to do was give in to fear and throw away everything we stood for, or else the terrorists could strike again. As far as divisiveness, it's been the Republicans who own the wedge issues.

54 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:52:28pm

Hehe...

Ron, Rand Paul hold joint tea party rally in Texas

Ron Paul has told thousands of supporters that "we have infiltrated the Republican Party" in the name of defending liberty.

The GOP presidential hopeful and his son Rand addressed a boisterous rally Sunday outside the Texas Capitol.

The national Tea Party Express sponsored the event, which also featured senatorial candidate Ted Cruz.

[...]

Where's Allen West when you need him...

55 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:52:57pm

re: #53 SteveMcG

The Republican Party's been pretty extreme for a couple years now. Arnold waited until he was safely out of office and needed some buzz for his book to speak out. Biggest problem for Republicans is they're a bunch of pussies. I remember after 9/11 all they wanted to do was give in to fear and throw away everything we stood for, or else the terrorists could strike again. As far as divisiveness, it's been the Republicans who own the wedge issues.

Remember the many state wide referendums against gay marriage in 2004? I sure as hell do.Brilliant strategy, shitty thing to do.

56 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:53:50pm

re: #33 Targetpractice

Take the Violence Against Women Act, for example. First you have every male GOP Senator voting against its extension, whining that it was a "poison bill" because amongst the added provisions was one that added visas for undocumented workers subject to abuse.

Now, the House GOP are looking to piss off women even more by not only stripping those additional visas, but writing new rules that would allow the abusers to know that the target of their abuse blew the whistle.

their goal is the enslavement of women, period

removing the ability for a woman to escape an abusive situation is a big step

57 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:54:10pm

re: #54 freetoken

Hehe...

Ron, Rand Paul hold joint tea party rally in Texas

Where's Allen West when you need him...

Ron you were first elected to Congress in the 70's as a Republican. You may not be leadership but please stop patronizing us by acting like you're this newcomer. And a man who supports Chuck Baldwin for president can never be called a supporter of liberty.

58 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:54:23pm

re: #55 HappyWarrior

Now they blame everything on the labor unions.

59 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:54:34pm

re: #54 freetoken

Hehe...

Ron, Rand Paul hold joint tea party rally in Texas

Where's Allen West when you need him...

He's worried about drought in Texas. When Communists are all over the country like he thinks, you don't want to drink anything but rainwater and grain alcohol.

///

60 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:55:13pm

re: #52 Dark_Falcon

Sorry I hadn't seen that. No malice was assumed on your part, BTW.

Didn't assume any was, so there's no problem.

61 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:56:21pm

re: #58 SteveMcG

Now they blame everything on the labor unions.

I hate that. Whine about "greedy union workers" but anyone who even questions corporate creed is a "Marxist." Screw that.

62 Interesting Times in Benghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:56:56pm

re: #50 Dark_Falcon

One very prominent GOP male Senator voted for the extension: That man was John McCain. The DNC graphic only listed the GOP men who voted 'no' and the women who voted yes, it did not show the GOP men who voted 'yes'.

Because there were so bloody few of them, perhaps? So few that it in no way negates the misogynist douchebaggery of the House GOP?

The Violence Against Women Act (VAWA) is facing another struggle to stay intact, this time in the House of Representatives. The House GOP looks likely to rewrite the domestic violence prevention bill, which passed the Senate last week, with the aim of stripping provisions for Native Americans, undocumented people, and the LGBT community — the same provisions that Senate Republicans tried to remove from the bill.

[further comments redacted to protect my LGF account]

63 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:59:36pm

re: #62 Interesting Times

Because there were so bloody few of them, perhaps? So few that it in no way negates the misogynist douchebaggery of the House GOP?

The Republican men who did the right thing should have been honored alongside the women.

It's nothing to do with 'negation'.

64 Ben G. Hazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 2:59:43pm

re: #33 Targetpractice

Take the Violence Against Women Act, for example. First you have every male GOP Senator voting against its extension, whining that it was a "poison bill" because amongst the added provisions was one that added visas for undocumented workers subject to abuse.

Now, the House GOP are looking to piss off women even more by not only stripping those additional visas, but writing new rules that would allow the abusers to know that the target of their abuse blew the whistle.

re: #50 Dark_Falcon

One very prominent GOP male Senator voted for the extension: That man was John McCain. The DNC graphic only listed the GOP men who voted 'no' and the women who voted yes, it did not show the GOP men who voted 'yes'.

Let's not get too heavy on the hyperbole here, even though the GOP deserves the scorn it gets nowadays; my two senators (Lamar Alexander and Bob Corker of TN), along with Diaperman David Vitter of LA voted to reauthorize VAWA, were the only three Southern GOP senators to do so, IIRC.

65 EdDantes  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:00:10pm

re: #59 Dark_Falcon

/And deny them the essence.

66 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:01:02pm

re: #64 ArthurSlugworth

I doubt His Mittnessre: #33 Targetpractice

re: #50 Dark_Falcon

Let's not get too heavy on the hyperbole here, even though the GOP deserves the scorn it gets nowadays; my two senators (Lamar Alexander and Bob Corker of TN), along with Diaperman David Vitter of LA voted to reauthorize VAWA, were the only three Southern GOP senators to do so, IIRC.

Lamar Alexander...haven't heard from him in an age. Molly Ivin's comment on him, back when he ran for the nomination, was 'dead men DO wear plaid'.

Glad he stepped up for this one.

67 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:01:49pm

re: #66 SanFranciscoZionist

Lamar Alexander...haven't heard from him in an age. Molly Ivin's comment on him, back when he ran for the nomination, was 'dead men DO wear plaid'.

Glad he stepped up for this one.

However he ran for president, he has not been a wingnut as a senator.

68 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:03:23pm

Both Webb and Warner voted for it. Highly doubt Allen would have. Just another reason why I am glad Webb beat that jerk back in 2006 and hope Kaine can do it this year.

69 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:06:23pm

re: #68 HappyWarrior

Both Webb and Warner voted for it. Highly doubt Allen would have. Just another reason why I am glad Webb beat that jerk back in 2006 and hope Kaine can do it this year.

He likely won't, but we'll see. I hope George Allen is able to win.

70 fizzlogic  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:07:28pm
But I’m too stubborn to leave a party I believe in.

That was me back in '06; the last time I voted a straight Republican ticket. Currently there's no way I can conceivably see myself voting GOP ever again. I'm glad to be NPA after 25 years of being Republican.

71 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:09:07pm

re: #69 Dark_Falcon

He likely won't, but we'll see. I hope George Allen is able to win.

Why? Allen is an ideologue. This isn't Tom Davis or John Warner but rather a man who thinks it's just lovely to call a lifelong Virginian who just so happened to be an Indian American an ethnic slur and then say he wasn't form the real Virginia. Also, it's laughable as hell for him to call Kaine, Obama's Senator when he was a huge watercarrier for the Bush agenda. Hypocrisy much, George?

72 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:10:35pm

re: #70 fizzlogic

In some states (like mine), MPA pretty much shuts you out of the primary. I remain a registered Republican, without much to show for it since the worst wingnuts in PA run unopposed. As far as I'm concerned, it's still my party and I'm not leaving just because of these clowns.

73 Interesting Times in Benghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:10:58pm

re: #69 Dark_Falcon

He likely won't, but we'll see. I hope George Allen is able to win.

The racist douchebag who referred to an American of South Asian descent by a racial slur, i.e. "macaca"?

Youtube Video
74 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:11:44pm

re: #73 Interesting Times

The racist douchebag who referred to an American of South Asian descent by a racial slur, i.e. "macaca"?

[Embedded content]

The very same. And as I've said before guys, the worst thing was implying that kid couldn't be a real Virginian. That kid is more of a Virginian than Confederate wannabe Allen ever will be.

75 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:12:27pm

re: #71 HappyWarrior

Why? Allen is an ideologue. This isn't Tom Davis or John Warner but rather a man who thinks it's just lovely to call a lifelong Virginian who just so happened to be an Indian American an ethnic slur and then say he wasn't form the real Virginia.

That 'macaca' thing? I don't think he was being bigoted, it was just a goof-up. And there are lots of places in Illinois where they'd tell you someone from Cook County isn't part of the "real Illinois". Most such sentiments aren't ethnic-based, they're based on a view of urban life as 'inauthentic', an idea with a long history in America.

76 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:12:35pm

re: #69 Dark_Falcon

He likely won't, but we'll see. I hope George Allen is able to win.

I don't care how moderate the guy is anymore. Any Republican in the causus is just a warm body to advance the wingnuts' cause.

77 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:13:15pm

re: #75 Dark_Falcon

That 'macaca' thing? I don't think he was being bigoted, it was just a goof-up. And there are lots of places in Illinois where they'd tell you someone from Cook County isn't part of the "real Illinois". Most such sentiments aren't ethnic-based, they're based on a view of urban life as 'inauthentic', an idea with a long history in America.

You cannot possibly believe this, this is a lie

78 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:14:01pm

re: #77 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

You cannot possibly believe this, this is a lie

No, it isn't.

79 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:14:23pm

re: #77 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

And have a downding for calling me a liar.

80 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:14:39pm

re: #75 Dark_Falcon

That 'macaca' thing? I don't think he was being bigoted, it was just a goof-up. And there are lots of places in Illinois where they'd tell you someone from Cook County isn't part of the "real Illinois". Most such sentiments aren't ethnic-based, they're based on a view of urban life as 'inauthentic', an idea with a long history in America.

It's not like he didn't have a history of racial insensitivity, DF. Confederate flag in his office, hangman's noose paperweight, etc. And I don't give a shit about Illinois. I have a big problem with a patronizing asshole attacking my urban part of the state to score a cheap political point. Northern Virginia, downstate Virginia, it's all Virginia. Allen was playing to the bigoted attitudes many in that part of the state have towards us and it's disgusting.

81 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:14:40pm

re: #78 Dark_Falcon

No, it isn't.

Was that supposed to be a link or a shout?

82 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:14:49pm

re: #78 Dark_Falcon

No, it isn't.

It's all just goofups! There's no racism!

Calling Michelle a monkey and Obama's parents monkeys: goofup!

83 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:15:14pm

re: #79 Dark_Falcon

And have a downding for calling me a liar.

You are a liar, you don't believe he "goofed up"


George Allen is a racist shitbag fuck

84 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:15:48pm

re: #79 Dark_Falcon

And have a downding for calling me a liar.

seriously, "goofup"?


You insult everyone here by asking us to believe this

85 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:16:37pm

re: #82 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

It's all just goofups! There's no racism!

Calling Michelle a monkey and Obama's parents monkeys: goofup!

George Allen didn't say that.

86 engineer cat  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:16:37pm

my afternoon

enjoyed a light lunch en plein air on the deck w ignatz

reading a bio of mussonlini while sunning and overlooking the treetops

87 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:16:56pm

re: #81 SteveMcG

Was that supposed to be a link or a shout?

I guess it was a shout.

88 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:17:01pm

Yeah sorry but if it were someone like Davis or Warner, I'd be inclined to believe goof up but Allen has a history of racial insensitivity going way back. This wasn't an unique incident.

89 jamesfirecat  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:17:17pm

re: #75 Dark_Falcon

That 'macaca' thing? I don't think he was being bigoted, it was just a goof-up. And there are lots of places in Illinois where they'd tell you someone from Cook County isn't part of the "real Illinois". Most such sentiments aren't ethnic-based, they're based on a view of urban life as 'inauthentic', an idea with a long history in America.

What was he trying to say that came out as "macaca"? What kind of goof?

Could you please explain what you mean by this DF?

90 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:18:03pm

Ah, a pleasant fight on the Internet on a sunny Sunday afternoon...

91 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:18:34pm

re: #89 jamesfirecat

What was he trying to say that came out as "macaca"? What kind of good?

Could you please explain what you mean by this DF?

I mean I don't really think he was intending to publicly slur someone, James. The words weren't intended as an insult.

BBIAB

92 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:18:38pm

I don't know why people are surprised by the results of the Greek Election.

This is a nation that endorsed, supported, and aided a genocide within my lifetime.

93 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:18:49pm

raise your hand if you believe George Allen just magically happened to goof up and accidentally repeatedly call a guy with brown skin a racial slur


he goofed up!

94 dragonath  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:19:07pm

Even if he wasn't using a slur, he really comes off like an asshole:

This fellow here over here with the yellow shirt, Macaca, or whatever his name is. He's with my opponent... Let's give a welcome to Macaca, here. Welcome to America and the real world of Virginia.
—George Allen

How is this not an insult!?

95 goddamnedfrank  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:19:19pm

re: #75 Dark_Falcon

That 'macaca' thing? I don't think he was being bigoted, it was just a goof-up.

Allen's mother was born and raised in the former french colony of Tunisia in North Africa, the region where the term macaca originates and is widely used as a racial epithet. It wasn't a goof up, he repeated the term and was crystal clear in his diction. To be honest I don't think you even believe what you're saying, since you've repeatedly refused to address the previous times you've paid lip service to integrity and then run away when called on it.

96 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:19:55pm

"This fellow here over here with the yellow shirt, Macaca, or whatever his name is. He's with my opponent. He's following us around everywhere. And it's just great. We're going to places all over Virginia, and he's having it on film and it's great to have you here and you show it to your opponent because he's never been there and probably will never come. [...] Let's give a welcome to Macaca, here. Welcome to America and the real world of Virginia"
Yeah not intended to slur my ass. Sorry DF, but I don't think you understand that Allen clearly intended to slur this kid.

97 engineer cat  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:20:37pm

a view of urban life as 'inauthentic'

apparently i was not the only native of new york city who was surprised to find that we had become american citizens again in the aftermath of 9/11

perhaps these self proclaimed 'real americans' of the 'heartland' might be astonished to find out how much ill will they are engendering amongst some of us "others" who are pleased to think that we too are americans, when they loudly declare their special virtues

98 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:20:50pm

re: #91 Dark_Falcon

...BBIAB

re: #95 goddamnedfrank

...To be honest I don't think you even believe what you're saying, since you've repeatedly refused to address the previous times you've paid lip service to integrity and then run away when called on it.

heh

99 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:21:04pm
This fellow here over here with the yellow shirt, Macaca, or whatever his name is. He's with my opponent... Let's give a welcome to Macaca, here. Welcome to America and the real world of Virginia.
—George Allen

"Welcome to America" says the republican holding the noose

100 engineer cat  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:21:42pm

re: #91 Dark_Falcon

I mean I don't really think he was intending to publicly slur someone, James. The words weren't intended as an insult.

BBIAB

ok, you macaca, i'll accept that explanation

//

101 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:22:03pm

re: #99 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

"Welcome to America" says the republican holding the noose

Probably pushing the point a bit too far.

102 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:22:50pm

re: #101 SteveMcG

Probably pushing the point a bit too far.

Normally I'd agree but Allen was known to have a noose paperweight in his office and a CSA flag too. He's earned the racial bigot tag that WUB is applying here.

103 jamesfirecat  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:24:39pm

re: #91 Dark_Falcon

I mean I don't really think he was intending to publicly slur someone, James. The words weren't intended as an insult.

BBIAB

What did he mean them as a term of endearment? A cute joking nickname?

Could you please clue me in what he was reaching for, I don't get it.

104 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:25:17pm

re: #102 HappyWarrior

Normally I'd agree but Allen was known to have a noose paperweight in his office and a CSA flag too. He's earned the racial bigot tag that WUB is applying here.

Lord, never heard about the paperweight.

Doesn't that, along with sending a chilling message, make a shitty paperweight?

105 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:25:44pm

re: #103 jamesfirecat

re: #91 Dark_Falcon

"BBIAB"

'Snot gonna happen.

106 Kragar  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:26:25pm

re: #90 SanFranciscoZionist

Ah, a pleasant fight on the Internet on a sunny Sunday afternoon...

Suddenly... DRAMA!

107 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:26:30pm

re: #104 SanFranciscoZionist

Lord, never heard about the paperweight.

Doesn't that, along with sending a chilling message, make a shitty paperweight?

Yes, on both counts. There's a lot of accusations about Allen and race that go back to his days at UVA.

108 goddamnedfrank  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:27:23pm

re: #103 jamesfirecat

What did he mean them as a term of endearment? A cute joking nickname?

Could you please clue me in what he was reaching for, I don't get it.

D_F had to run to the store to purchase more credulity.

109 dragonath  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:28:26pm

George Allen is just prone to bizarre non-sequiturs and has bad taste in interior design. It has nothing to do with his politics! Really!

110 KronoGhazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:28:53pm

Macaca - dirty monkeys.

What the fuck else could it mean?

Ideology is what this is, not objectivity.

111 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:29:05pm

re: #102 HappyWarrior

Link for proof of the noose thing? I heard of the CSA flag issue, but not that.

112 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:29:30pm

re: #106 Kragar

Suddenly... DRAMA!

Yeah, but it's the same drama, over and over.

113 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:30:27pm

re: #101 SteveMcG

Probably pushing the point a bit too far.

was referencing the paperweight comment that popped up mere seconds before I typed that uhhh sooo...

114 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:31:06pm

re: #109 Be Zorch, Daddio

George Allen is just prone to bizarre non-sequiturs and has bad taste in interior design. It has nothing to do with his politics! Really!

he accidentally a klansman

115 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:31:12pm

re: #111 ProGunLiberal

Link for proof of the noose thing? I heard of the CSA flag issue, but not that.

[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]

116 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:32:04pm

re: #112 SanFranciscoZionist

Yeah, but it's the same drama, over and over.

I didn't wish to turn this into criticize DF subthread but I do wish he could understand why I as a Virginia voter would want nothing better to see Allen's political career end and the Macaca incident is a great example.

117 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:33:08pm

re: #113 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

was referencing the paperweight comment that popped up mere seconds before I typed that uhhh sooo...

I don't think Allen's ever gone that far in his rhetoric, and a lot of pro deathers think a noose is just the thing to show off their love of capital punishment. I don't like Allen one bit, but I wouldn't connect the noose to his racial views.

118 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:33:13pm

re: #116 HappyWarrior

I didn't wish to turn this into criticize DF subthread but I do wish he could understand why I as a Virginia voter would want nothing better to see Allen's political career end.

It's not even DF per se, it's more than I just cannot stand being asked to believe the dumbest, most transparent falsehood

119 Kragar  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:34:00pm

re: #112 SanFranciscoZionist

Yeah, but it's the same drama, over and over.

Youtube Video
120 fizzlogic  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:34:20pm

re: #72 SteveMcG

In some states (like mine), MPA pretty much shuts you out of the primary. I remain a registered Republican, without much to show for it since the worst wingnuts in PA run unopposed. As far as I'm concerned, it's still my party and I'm not leaving just because of these clowns.

I live in a closed primary state too--Florida.

When I was a Republican, it creeped me out that I had to vote against people like Randall Terry and Katherine Harris in the primary. And that it didn't matter anyway, since the Party was headed in their direction anyway.

121 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:34:37pm

re: #117 SteveMcG

I don't think Allen's ever gone that far in his rhetoric, and a lot of pro deathers think a noose is just the thing to show off their love of capital punishment. I don't like Allen one bit, but I wouldn't connect the noose to his racial views.

and the confedarate flag? is that a "goofup" too?

122 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:34:38pm

re: #115 HappyWarrior

Wow, what a bag of douche. I'm supposing we could use his history of Assholery to get African Americans and Hispanics to come to our side?

123 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:34:53pm

Like I asked earlier, how does D_F expect to fix the GOP when he keeps enabling it, keeps repeating the obvious falsehoods when confronted by the worst of the party?

124 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:35:35pm

re: #122 ProGunLiberal

Wow, what a bag of douche. I'm supposing we could use his history of Assholery to get African Americans and Hispanics to come to our side?

He already did that. As the state's demographics change, the worse people like Allen will do in statewide elections.

125 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:35:57pm

re: #117 SteveMcG

I don't think Allen's ever gone that far in his rhetoric, and a lot of pro deathers think a noose is just the thing to show off their love of capital punishment. I don't like Allen one bit, but I wouldn't connect the noose to his racial views.

sorry, dude, if it quacks like a sheetwearer

126 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:36:32pm

re: #108 goddamnedfrank

D_F had to run to the store to purchase more credulity.

No, I had to help my dad. He's cooking some fois gras.

127 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:37:06pm

re: #121 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

and the confedarate flag? is that a "goofup" too?

Even though I don't care for the man, at this point I'm more likely to believe the flag is his way of pandering than an advocation of genocide.

128 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:37:29pm

re: #117 SteveMcG

I don't think Allen's ever gone that far in his rhetoric, and a lot of pro deathers think a noose is just the thing to show off their love of capital punishment. I don't like Allen one bit, but I wouldn't connect the noose to his racial views.

so by all means

feel free to believe the Republican politician's prepared statements as opposed to his years of actual behavior


I'll believe his behavior instead

129 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:37:41pm

re: #127 SteveMcG

Even though I don't care for the man, at this point I'm more likely to believe the flag is his way of pandering than an advocation of genocide.

was he pandering in college?

130 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:37:59pm

re: #127 SteveMcG

Even though I don't care for the man, at this point I'm more likely to believe the flag is his way of pandering than an advocation of genocide.

“Allen said he came to Virginia because he wanted to play football in a place where ‘blacks knew their place,’” said Dr. Ken Shelton, a white radiologist in North Carolina who played tight end for the University of Virginia football team when Allen was quarterback. “He used the N-word on a regular basis back then.”

131 dragonath  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:38:11pm

re: #120 fizzlogic

At least you had the chance to vote against them. Even now, there still must be Republicans who, unlike Allen, chose not to pose with a Confederate flag.

132 jamesfirecat  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:38:47pm

re: #110 Kronocide

Macaca - dirty monkeys.

What the fuck else could it mean?

Ideology is what this is, not objectivity.

Well it does sounds like a fakey spanish way of saying "my shit"....

Which obviously isn't much better.

133 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:39:01pm

re: #127 SteveMcG

Even though I don't care for the man, at this point I'm more likely to believe the flag is his way of pandering than an advocation of genocide.


A second white teammate, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he feared retribution from the Allen campaign, separately claimed that Allen used the word “ni***r” to describe blacks. “It was so common with George when he was among his white friends. This is the terminology he used,” the teammate said.

A third white teammate contacted separately, who also spoke on condition of anonymity out of fear of being attacked by the Virginia senator, said he too remembers Allen using the word “n*****,” though he said he could not recall a specific conversation in which Allen used the term. “My impression of him was that he was a racist,” the third teammate said.


[Link: www.salon.com...]


weird, huh?!?!?!?!

134 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:39:11pm

re: #130 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

Well if he's said, in saying he came to Virginia because of that. He came to Virginia because of his dad getting the football head coaching job for the Redskins and Allen has used his Dad's name to elicit support with the Redskins fans here. Not defending him. I completely believe the former teammates given what I know about Allen.

135 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:39:59pm

re: #134 HappyWarrior

Well he's bullshitting in saying he came to Virginia because of that. He came to Virginia because of his dad getting the football head coaching job for the Redskins and Allen has used his Dad's name to elicit support with the Redskins fans here.

of course, hahaha

man it just gets better and better

136 KronoGhazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:41:24pm

Once a GOP voter realizes low taxation is not the most important thing in life, the ideological blindness begins to dissipate.

137 Interesting Times in Benghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:41:25pm

re: #112 SanFranciscoZionist

Yeah, but it's the same drama, over and over.

Speaking for myself, when I criticize certain comments, it isn't with an aim toward changing the mind of the commenter, but that of any lurkers who may be reading the thread. I know you don't like what you consider melodramatic or hyperbolic political language, but - after years and years and years of cry-wolf whining from the right - we're now at a point where, yes, there really is a wolf at the door, and it's in the form of the very people the cry-wolf whiners support.

138 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:42:19pm

re: #129 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

was he pandering in college?

I Just read the article. Still doesn't tie the noose to anybody. Asshole, absolutely, But it doesn't put him in a lynchmob.

139 Big Joe Ghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:44:16pm

James O’Keefe: N.H. Attorney General tried to serve a criminal subpoena on me

I got that off twitchy so I have no details.

140 JamesWI  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:44:25pm

re: #133 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]


A second white teammate, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he feared retribution from the Allen campaign, separately claimed that Allen used the word “ni***r” to describe blacks. “It was so common with George when he was among his white friends. This is the terminology he used,” the teammate said.

A third white teammate contacted separately, who also spoke on condition of anonymity out of fear of being attacked by the Virginia senator, said he too remembers Allen using the word “n*****,” though he said he could not recall a specific conversation in which Allen used the term. “My impression of him was that he was a racist,” the third teammate said.

[Link: www.salon.com...]

weird, huh?!?!?!?!

Oh, that's just another goofup! He clearly meant to say "nagger" and just goofed up.....multiple times!

141 fizzlogic  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:44:29pm

re: #131 Be Zorch, Daddio

At least you had the chance to vote against them. Even now, there still must be Republicans who, unlike Allen, chose not to pose with a Confederate flag.

You can't fight a trend. It's best to get out of the way and let it run its course. At least that's what I always say. :D

142 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:45:02pm

re: #139 Ghost of Tom Joad

James O’Keefe: N.H. Attorney General tried to serve a criminal subpoena on me

I got that off twitchy so I have no details.

"twitchy"?

143 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:45:19pm

re: #140 JamesWI

Oh, that's just another goofup! He clearly meant to say "nagger" and just goofed up...multiple times!

he goofed up!

Some minority groups, especially African-Americans, in Virginia criticized Allen for his policies and his embrace of the Confederate flag. Allen however claimed that the confederate flag is a symbol of southern and state heritage as Virginia was the capital of the Confederacy. Allen also opposed a separate state holiday commemorating Martin Luther King Jr.[99] The state holiday in favor of Martin Luther King Jr. was initially attached to Lee-Jackson day, a day honoring noted Generals Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson.
In 1995, 1996, and 1997, Allen proclaimed April as Confederate History and Heritage Month and called the Civil War "a four-year struggle for independence and sovereign rights."[100]

Oh the south, always the south

144 Big Joe Ghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:46:28pm

re: #142 SteveMcG

Twitchy

145 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:47:34pm

I think that when you take a legitimate criticism to an extreme, like putting a noose in Allen's hands here, or years ago when left wingers were calling President Bush "Hitler", your arguments fall on deaf ears.

146 Interesting Times in Benghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:47:34pm
147 Big Joe Ghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:47:34pm

re: #144 Ghost of Tom Joad

Twitchy

heh, guess I should have scrolled down...

148 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:48:50pm

re: #139 Ghost of Tom Joad

James O’Keefe: N.H. Attorney General tried to serve a criminal subpoena on me

I got that off twitchy so I have no details.

So, NH is finally getting around to charging his ass with a crime. The wheels of justice do, indeed, grind slowly.

149 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:49:53pm

re: #145 SteveMcG

I think that when you take a legitimate criticism to an extreme, like putting a noose in Allen's hands here, or years ago when left wingers were calling President Bush "Hitler", your arguments fall on deaf ears.

we know, you're just so very concerned #blogcommenterarchetype

150 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:52:24pm

re: #149 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

we know, you're just so very concerned #blogcommenterarchetype

I'm not that hip. What's #blogcommenterarchetype? I can guess the jist by the wording, but what's with the #? Is it a link to something?

151 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:53:02pm

re: #133 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

Those last two are severely questionable. I'm not a big believer in granting anonymity to some who says they "fear retribution from the campaign". That's usually a sign of a liar.

152 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:53:37pm

re: #149 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

we know, you're just so very concerned #blogcommenterarchetype

No luck with the Google: "No results found for #blogcommenterarchetype."

153 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:53:52pm

re: #149 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

we know, you're just so very concerned #blogcommenterarchetype

Concern. It's a bit like hysteria used to be for women, in that anyone voicing an opposing opinion can be diagnosed with it over the Internet.

154 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:54:17pm

Actually I'm inclined to believe the noose paperweight could be DP related. We had the highest execution rate during his governorship. Still hard not to have some racial suspicions. Context is everything, no?

155 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:56:13pm

re: #154 HappyWarrior

Actually I'm inclined to believe the noose paperweight could be DP related. We had the highest execution rate during his governorship. Still hard not to have some racial suspicions. Context is everything, no?

So am I. Pro Deathers are all to proud to show it. Some of these guys have made the leap to imply that a pro death racist is also pro lynching, and I will not go that far.

156 KronoGhazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:56:52pm
157 Sionainn  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:56:54pm

re: #151 Dark_Falcon

Those last two are severely questionable. I'm not a big believer in granting anonymity to some who says they "fear retribution from the campaign". That's usually a sign of a liar.

Okay, take those two out. Look at all the other incidents and then tell us he's not a racist.

158 Eventual Carrion  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:57:05pm

re: #151 Dark_Falcon

Those last two are severely questionable. I'm not a big believer in granting anonymity to some who says they "fear retribution from the campaign". That's usually a sign of a liar.

Yeah, like a women trying to hide from an abuser.

159 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:57:49pm

re: #137 Interesting Times

Speaking for myself, when I criticize certain comments, it isn't with an aim toward changing the mind of the commenter, but that of any lurkers who may be reading the thread. I know you don't like what you consider melodramatic or hyperbolic political language, but - after years and years and years of cry-wolf whining from the right - we're now at a point where, yes, there really is a wolf at the door, and it's in the form of the very people the cry-wolf whiners support.

Eh, I'm just bored and cranky. And now, mad at George Allen all over again. Heat's getting to me.

160 Eventual Carrion  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:58:37pm

re: #154 HappyWarrior

Actually I'm inclined to believe the noose paperweight could be DP related. We had the highest execution rate during his governorship. Still hard not to have some racial suspicions. Context is everything, no?

Were they still hanging people on death row during his admin?

161 Big Joe Ghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 3:59:33pm

re: #159 SanFranciscoZionist

Eh, I'm just bored and cranky. And now, mad at George Allen all over again. Heat's getting to me.

It's only 88 today, wait till it gets up around 110.

162 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:00:06pm

re: #160 RayFerd

Were they still hanging people on death row during his admin?

I think we phased out the chair for lethal injection then.

163 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:00:54pm

re: #155 SteveMcG

So am I. Pro Deathers are all to proud to show it. Some of these guys have made the leap to imply that a pro death racist is also pro lynching, and I will not go that far.

I'm at least going to say that a pro-death racist with a noose in his office is likely to a. prioritize racking up a death toll for his voters over examining the serious racial issues we got in this country over the death penalty and b. be deliberately callous to the significance of combining a noose and Confederate imagery.

Pro-lynching, maybe not. Scum of the earth...yeah, I'll go with scum of the earth. No one playing politics in the United States misses that last one.

164 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:02:30pm

re: #160 RayFerd

Were they still hanging people on death row during his admin?

According to Wikipedia (I hate citing Wiki) VA has used the chair and injection since 1994.

165 Interesting Times in Benghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:02:37pm

re: #158 RayFerd

Yeah, like a women trying to hide from an abuser.

O hai, look up-thread, Republicans have that taken care of too!

Now, the House GOP are looking to piss off women even more by not only stripping those additional visas, but writing new rules that would allow the abusers to know that the target of their abuse blew the whistle.

166 Eventual Carrion  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:03:15pm

re: #162 HappyWarrior

I think we phased out the chair for lethal injection then.

That's what I thought. So a hypodermic would have been more in line with the times. In the south the noose is a rather touchy symbol from the past. Like a German official having a replica of a gas chamber, wouldn't be looked at in a good light.

167 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:03:22pm

re: #158 RayFerd

Yeah, like a women trying to hide from an abuser.

Those two aren't at all alike. The latter can point to a pattern of behavior, all the latter can say is "I'm skeeered!".

168 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:04:37pm

re: #166 RayFerd

That's what I thought. So a hypodermic would have been more in line with the times. In the south the noose is a rather touchy symbol from the past. Like a German official having a replica of a gas chamber, wouldn't be looked at in a good light.

I guess the ideal thing would be to make a noose out of an extension cord.

169 Eventual Carrion  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:05:02pm

re: #167 Dark_Falcon

Those two aren't at all alike. The latter can point to a pattern of behavior, all the latter can say is "I'm skeeered!".

Then they should be able to shoot the person they are afraid of on sight.

170 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:05:53pm

re: #165 Interesting Times

O hai, look up-thread, Republicans have that taken care of too!

Police should protect someone who claims to have been abused, but given the severity of the charge, and the possibility of the accusation being a cover to obtain a visa, shouldn't the police interview the accused?

171 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:06:13pm

re: #165 Interesting Times

Wow, what the hell?!?!

172 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:06:41pm

re: #169 RayFerd

Now you're just being stupid.

173 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:07:25pm

re: #172 Dark_Falcon

Now you're just being stupid.

Tell that to the Stand Your Ground states.

174 Eventual Carrion  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:07:55pm

re: #172 Dark_Falcon

Now you're just being stupid.

Glad you agree, the law that allows that is stupid.

175 Stanghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:08:44pm

Did I miss something recent w/geo Allen? And a noose? Late to the meeting, can't really scroll up. ???

176 Amory Blaine  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:10:08pm

Right wing golden rule:

"Either you're with us or you're against us."

177 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:10:22pm

re: #175 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

Did I miss something recent w/geo Allen? And a noose? Late to the meeting, can't really scroll up. ???

Don't bother, lots of hysteria and denial up there.

178 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:11:24pm

re: #176 Amory Blaine

Right wing golden rule:

"Either you're with us or you're against us."

"with the terrorists"
FIFY

179 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:11:39pm

re: #170 Dark_Falcon

Police should protect someone who claims to have been abused, but given the severity of the charge, and the possibility of the accusation being a cover to obtain a visa, shouldn't the police interview the accused?

"Sir, we're looking into allegations of domestic abuse by one Alejandra Lopez. If we could have a moment of your time, we'd like to ask you a few questions concerning those allegations."

What do you think happens to Alejandra after those cops leave?

180 engineer cat  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:11:41pm

re: #145 SteveMcG

I think that when you take a legitimate criticism to an extreme, like putting a noose in Allen's hands here, or years ago when left wingers were calling President Bush "Hitler", your arguments fall on deaf ears.

on eschaton bush was almost never called 'hitler', or even compared to hitler. i never saw the justification for the claim from the right that bush was commonly compared to hitler by any significant portion of the progressive commentariat

we were much more likely to call him "junior" or "chimpy"

181 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:12:44pm

re: #179 Targetpractice

"Sir, we're looking into allegations of domestic abuse by one Alejandra Lopez. If we could have a moment of your time, we'd like to ask you a few questions concerning those allegations."

What do you think happens to Alejandra after those cops leave?

Well, you shouldn't ask if she's still living with the guy, but I wouldn't think police would do that.

182 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:14:03pm

re: #181 Dark_Falcon

Well, you shouldn't ask if she's still living with the guy, but I wouldn't think police would do that.

Wouldn't do what? Mention her name? What does it change if they just say that there's allegations of abuse and they need to ask him some questions about said allegations?

183 dragonath  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:14:09pm

re: #179 Targetpractice

"Witless Protection"

184 Only The Lurker Knows  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:15:06pm

re: #178 SteveMcG

"with the terrorists"
FIFY

Speaking of which, some good news on that front.

Senior al Qaeda operative killed by airstrike in Yemen

Sanaa, Yemen (CNN) -- A senior operative of al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula wanted for his role in the USS Cole bombing was killed by an airstrike in Yemen on Sunday, Yemeni officials said.

185 Interesting Times in Benghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:15:19pm

re: #170 Dark_Falcon

Police should protect someone who claims to have been abused, but given the severity of the charge, and the possibility of the accusation being a cover to obtain a visa, shouldn't the police interview the accused?

NO:

Undocumented victims already fear calling the police because they risk deportation in doing so. This portion of the bill adds on another level of fear by alerting their abusers that they’ve sought help — under current law, immigrant victims enjoy a right to confidentiality that would be seriously undermined by this bill. Allowing perpetrators of domestic violence to play any role in the deportation or protection of their victims is a cruel fate, but alerting an abuser to a victim’s complaint adds yet another level of emotional abuse on top of the physical abuse that the victim already faces.

Current law provides confidentiality. So we should get rid of that and endanger a victim's life because god forbid someone, somewhere, might get a visa when they shouldn't have 9_9

186 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:15:38pm

re: #182 Targetpractice

Wouldn't do what? Mention her name? What does it change if they just say that there's allegations of abuse and they need to ask him some questions about said allegations?

I'm saying that you don't do it if she's still living with the guy. It seems rather basic. But if she's moved out to a safe location, then asking might be a good idea.

187 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:17:05pm

re: #180 engineer cat

on eschaton bush was almost never called 'hitler', or even compared to hitler. i never saw the justification for the claim from the right that bush was commonly compared to hitler by any significant portion of the progressive commentariat

we were much more likely to call him "junior" or "chimpy"

Not familiar with eschaton, but I used to read comments on Philly.com and I saw it a lot. I still never attached to mainstream Democrats, although right wingers were always happy to see someone do it. My argument back then, and now is that hyperbole weakens your side.

188 Interesting Times in Benghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:17:34pm

re: #185 Interesting Times

And to clarify further, we're not talking about the police here, but immigration officials:

The GOP-led House’s version of the Violence Against Women Act (VAWA) would not only strip away Senate-passed protections for undocumented, LGBT, and Native American victims, it also contains a dangerous provision that violates an undocumented victim’s confidentiality by allowing immigration officials to speak with, and ask for evidence from, his or her abuser.

189 jamesfirecat  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:18:08pm

re: #181 Dark_Falcon

Well, you shouldn't ask if she's still living with the guy, but I wouldn't think police would do that.

So if a husband starts abusing his wife, he's going to get the house by default when she has to move out until such time as the entire thing can properly go to court?

It's a good idea that you shouldn't live with someone who is abusing you, but making it a requirement for making an accusation leads to unpleasant situations.

190 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:18:30pm

I'm not taking a strong position on the 'confidentiality' provision, since I don't know enough about police investigations in real life to be certain. I just wanted to put a different interpretation out there.

But now I need to get going and it'll be late before I get back.

191 palomino  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:19:24pm

re: #91 Dark_Falcon

I mean I don't really think he was intending to publicly slur someone, James. The words weren't intended as an insult.

BBIAB

Bullshit. And do you really know anything about George Allen? He is righteous neo-confed trash; if you did two seconds of research, you'd know the macaca incident is hardly isolated in terms of his long career as a race baiter. But none of this matters, right, cuz he's on your side?

192 jvic  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:20:08pm

re: #159 SanFranciscoZionist

Eh, I'm just bored and cranky. And now, mad at George Allen all over again. Heat's getting to me.

Maybe you're cranky because you sense the country going down the tubes with people of good will powerless to stop it.

Just a supposition. I'm not a mind reader.

193 engineer cat  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:23:11pm

re: #187 SteveMcG

Not familiar with eschaton, but I used to read comments on Philly.com and I saw it a lot. I still never attached to mainstream Democrats, although right wingers were always happy to see someone do it. My argument back then, and now is that hyperbole weakens your side.

that last is certainly true, but try googling 'bush hitler' and 'obama hitler'

the first mostly results in mostly right wing sites claiming that left wingers universally call bush hitler

the second results in mostly right wing sites

194 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:23:59pm

re: #179 Targetpractice

"Sir, we're looking into allegations of domestic abuse by one Alejandra Lopez. If we could have a moment of your time, we'd like to ask you a few questions concerning those allegations."

What do you think happens to Alejandra after those cops leave?

Compare: "Sir, Jimmy Batts says that you're the big drug kingpin round these parts, and responsible for some kneecap-breakin' that's been going on. Can we talk to you about what Jimmy has to say?"

195 Stanghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:24:16pm

Oh if real life fit the Gop's ridiculous view. It doesn't, and that's why they so easily leave the less fortunate of American society behind.

All I see is a bad future for such a wealthy country to be so heartless.

Go GOP!

196 SteveMcG  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:24:29pm

re: #193 engineer cat

that last is certainly true, but try googling 'bush hitler' and 'obama hitler'

the first mostly results in mostly right wing sites claiming that left wingers universally call bush hitler

the second results in mostly right wing sites

And in both cases those insults are only heard by the base.

Signing off.

197 McSpiff  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:27:57pm

re: #190 Dark_Falcon

I'm not taking a strong position on the 'confidentiality' provision, since I don't know enough about police investigations in real life to be certain. I just wanted to put a different interpretation out there.

But now I need to get going and it'll be late before I get back.

We know you don't know much about the real world for women. We know.

198 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:29:40pm

re: #192 jvic

Maybe you're cranky because you sense the country going down the tubes with people of good will powerless to stop it.

Just a supposition. I'm not a mind reader.

Nah, I'm an incurable optimist. I'm going to blame the heat.

199 JRCMYP  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:37:13pm

I'm curious. I've never seen a poll that shows the breakdown of Republican, Democrat, Green Party, Communist, Socialist or "unenrolled" for the general US population. Anyone have a linky link they could share?

200 jvic  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:40:01pm

re: #198 SanFranciscoZionist

Nah, I'm an incurable optimist. I'm going to blame the heat.

I'm a pessimist by temperament and an optimist by intellect.

In the late 1970s a colleague, born like I to refugee parents, said that the country was so screwed up he thought a band of Tartars could ride in and take over. Instead, what with Reagan, Clinton, Gingrich and luck, we had a quarter-century of prosperity.

Now, here we are again. "God looks after fools, drunks, and the United States of America." I hope so...

201 engineer cat  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:43:19pm

re: #198 SanFranciscoZionist

Nah, I'm an incurable optimist. I'm going to blame the heat.

better than being an incurable optometrist

202 EdDantes  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:46:28pm

re: #200 jvic

Instead, what with Reagan, Clinton, Gingrich and luck, we had a quarter-century of prosperity.

It will be even better with Andrew Luck at the helm.

203 Stanghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:50:26pm

re: #202 EdDantes

Instead, what with Reagan, Clinton, Gingrich and luck, we had a quarter-century of prosperity.

It will be even better with Andrew Luck at the helm.

Names=destiny. How in the he'll does #1 have the name of Luck!??

204 Romantic Heretic  Sun, May 6, 2012 4:54:27pm

*Rolls eyes* Sorry, Arnie. I have a certain respect for your courage and intelligence in making movies, when you still made movies, but Ronald Reagan is not a person that should be followed, never mind worshipped.

Let me tell you a little story about Reagan.

Dr. Oliver Sacks in his book, The Man Who Mistook His Wife For A Hat relates a story where opposite impaired patients—aphasiacs who can't understand spoken words but do take in information from extraverbal cues, and tonal agnosiacs who can understand words but miss their emotional content—watched a speech by President Reagan.

The aphasiacs laughed uproariously. The agnosiacs thought that his word use was improper and that he was hiding something.

Here then was the paradox of the President's speech. We normals—aided, doubtless, by our wish to be fooled, were indeed well and truly fooled.…And so cunningly was deceptive word use combined with deceptive tone, that only the brain-damaged remained intact, undeceived.

Ronald Reagan was clothes with no emperor.

I agree with Mr. Schwarzenegger's thesis, but I can't take seriously his saying that Ronald Reagan was a great man.

205 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:00:41pm

How is it going?

206 Mattand  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:01:19pm

re: #187 SteveMcG

Not familiar with eschaton, but I used to read comments on Philly.com and I saw it a lot. I still never attached to mainstream Democrats, although right wingers were always happy to see someone do it. My argument back then, and now is that hyperbole weakens your side.

As someone who is not a fan of W, I do not condone comparing Bush to Hitler. However, the Philly.com boards have got way bigger problems than Godwin-ing Bush.

207 Only The Lurker Knows  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:09:58pm

re: #205 ggt

How is it going?

Still breathing. But a bit pissed off by this.

2 of first female U.S. Navy submariners investigated for fraud.

"While details of the case and the officers names are not being released because the investigation is ongoing, a U.S. Navy official with knowledge of the matter said the two women are suspected of misrepresenting information about leases in their travel documents so their reimbursement pay was higher than it should have been."

If true, these Women have not only sullied the reputation of the Submarine
Service, but have potentially harmed other Women from joining.

Just to get a few extra bucks. What a waste.

208 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:12:37pm

re: #207 Bubblehead II

Still breathing. But a bit pissed off by this.

2 of first female U.S. Navy submariners investigated for fraud.

"While details of the case and the officers names are not being released because the investigation is ongoing, a U.S. Navy official with knowledge of the matter said the two women are suspected of misrepresenting information about leases in their travel documents so their reimbursement pay was higher than it should have been."

If true, these Women have not only sullied the reputation of the Submarine
Service, but have potentially harmed other Women from joining.

Just to get a few extra bucks. What a waste.

expense account fraud is not uncommon. What I wonder is who else they found during the audits and why they are highlighting the women?

209 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:17:45pm

re: #204 Romantic Heretic

*Rolls eyes* Sorry, Arnie. I have a certain respect for your courage and intelligence in making movies, when you still made movies, but Ronald Reagan is not a person that should be followed, never mind worshipped.

Let me tell you a little story about Reagan.

Dr. Oliver Sacks in his book, The Man Who Mistook His Wife For A Hat relates a story where opposite impaired patients—aphasiacs who can't understand spoken words but do take in information from extraverbal cues, and tonal agnosiacs who can understand words but miss their emotional content—watched a speech by President Reagan.

The aphasiacs laughed uproariously. The agnosiacs thought that his word use was improper and that he was hiding something.

Ronald Reagan was clothes with no emperor.

I agree with Mr. Schwarzenegger's thesis, but I can't take seriously his saying that Ronald Reagan was a great man.

Yeah, I've heard good things about Sacks, but I'm going to cast a somewhat skeptical eye over that one.

First, unless there's more background to that, it's strictly anecdotal. Are there political speeches these folks listened to with a different response? Who by? Did this person's later political career suggest that he was not hiding anything, or lying, when he gave the speech?

Second, I'm just deeply skeptical of this 'wisdom of the madman' sort of thing. Sure, maybe these folks had some sort of special insight into Ronald Reagan (which was remarkable similar to the opinion of 'normals' who didn't like Ronald Reagan). But I've got a story about a paranoid schizophrenic who thought Bill Clinton gave him a little thumbs-up on TV to thank him for being the only person in the U.S. whose vote was actually counted, and for giving him a second term. He was incorrect. This story does not give any actual insight into Bill Clinton.

Thirdly, I have a feeling Dr. Sacks wasn't a big Reagan fan. Maybe I'm wrong.

If there's more to this story, then I'd be interested, but it sounds fairly inadequate as damning evidence to me. There are plenty of reasons to dislike Reagan's legacy without turning to using aphasiac patients as some sort of Delphic oracle.

210 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:22:20pm

re: #209 SanFranciscoZionist

But I've got a story about a paranoid schizophrenic who thought Bill Clinton gave him a little thumbs-up on TV to thank him for being the only person in the U.S. whose vote was actually counted, and for giving him a second term. He was incorrect. This story does not give any actual insight into Bill Clinton.

My mother, by the way, when I related this tale from my psychopathology textbook to her commented "I guess this is what happens when Democrats go nuts?"

211 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:25:26pm

re: #209 SanFranciscoZionist

Yeah, I've heard good things about Sacks, but I'm going to cast a somewhat skeptical eye over that one.

First, unless there's more background to that, it's strictly anecdotal. Are there political speeches these folks listened to with a different response? Who by? Did this person's later political career suggest that he was not hiding anything, or lying, when he gave the speech?

Second, I'm just deeply skeptical of this 'wisdom of the madman' sort of thing. Sure, maybe these folks had some sort of special insight into Ronald Reagan (which was remarkable similar to the opinion of 'normals' who didn't like Ronald Reagan). But I've got a story about a paranoid schizophrenic who thought Bill Clinton gave him a little thumbs-up on TV to thank him for being the only person in the U.S. whose vote was actually counted, and for giving him a second term. He was incorrect. This story does not give any actual insight into Bill Clinton.

Thirdly, I have a feeling Dr. Sacks wasn't a big Reagan fan. Maybe I'm wrong.

If there's more to this story, then I'd be interested, but it sounds fairly inadequate as damning evidence to me. There are plenty of reasons to dislike Reagan's legacy without turning to using aphasiac patients as some sort of Delphic oracle.

I agree. The aphasic's interpretations are colored by their personal bias.

BTW, I love Oliver Sack's books. I've enjoyed reading them.

212 Only The Lurker Knows  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:27:09pm

re: #208 ggt

The Submariner community is tight knit and Male dominated. There are many who don't like the idea of opening it up to Women.

I suspect that these Women's expenses were gone over with a fine tooth comb by those who oppose it and any, and I mean any discrepancies in these Women's filings are going to be investigated as a means to discourage future applicants.

The only one one that crossed her T's and dotted her I's was cleared of any wrong doing.

"Originally, a third female officer was being investigated but she was cleared of wrongdoing three weeks ago, Rousselow said."

Probably because She knew/suspected that this type of shit was going to happen.

OTOH, if they in fact tried to game the system, well they deserve to get what happens to them.

213 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:28:33pm

re: #212 Bubblehead II

The Submariner community is tight knit and Male dominated. There are many who don't like the idea of opening it up to Women.

I suspect that these Women's expenses were gone over with a fine tooth comb by those who oppose it and any, and I mean any discrepancies in these Women's filings are going to be investigated as a means to discourage future applicants.

The only one one that crossed her T's and dotted her I's was cleared of any wrong doing.

"Originally, a third female officer was being investigated but she was cleared of wrongdoing three weeks ago, Rousselow said."

Probably because She knew/suspected that this type of shit was going to happen.

OTOH, if they in fact tried to game the system, well they deserve to get what happens to them.

If this is dishonesty, then yes. On the other hand, if this is anything like the stuff with the IRS, where you strain your brain just to understand what the words you are reading mean, then I have sympathy.

Does anyone have access to the form?

214 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:28:37pm

re: #211 ggt

I agree. The aphasic's interpretations are colored by their personal bias.

Could be. Depending on the area, they may all just have hated the man's guts. The mentally ill have no reason to care for Reagan. Or, maybe they hear all political speeches like this, which wouldn't surprise me in the slightest. What I doubt is that this can stand as some sort of proof of Reagan's special sneakisnakeness.

215 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:29:32pm

re: #212 Bubblehead II

The Submariner community is tight knit and Male dominated. There are many who don't like the idea of opening it up to Women.

I suspect that these Women's expenses were gone over with a fine tooth comb by those who oppose it and any, and I mean any discrepancies in these Women's filings are going to be investigated as a means to discourage future applicants.

The only one one that crossed her T's and dotted her I's was cleared of any wrong doing.

"Originally, a third female officer was being investigated but she was cleared of wrongdoing three weeks ago, Rousselow said."

Probably because She knew/suspected that this type of shit was going to happen.

OTOH, if they in fact tried to game the system, well they deserve to get what happens to them.

Padding one's expense account is the stupidest thing to do. Auditers ALWAYS look there and they know how to find things.

It's also a way to trap people. Boss says, "Yeah, just put on your Expenses" --then doesn't back the person up with audit time comes. Get it in writing and know the policy backwards and forwards.

216 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:30:18pm

re: #214 SanFranciscoZionist

Could be. Depending on the area, they may all just have hated the man's guts. The mentally ill have no reason to care for Reagan. Or, maybe they hear all political speeches like this, which wouldn't surprise me in the slightest. What I doubt is that this can stand as some sort of proof of Reagan's special sneakisnakeness.

Aphasics aren't necessarily mentally ill. My dad was from a stroke. So, we don't really know enough to draw meaningful conclusions.

217 Vicious Babushka  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:34:33pm

I spent all day trying to install Visual Web Developer Express (the free version of MS Visual Studio). The darn thing kept throwing errors during installation, finally I figured out it was because my C: drive is compressed. I uncompressed the drive and voilá!

Apart from that I feel very down, angry, stressed and depressed and I don't know what to do about it. DON'T RECOMMEND ALCOHOL.

218 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:35:20pm

re: #217 Learned Mother of Zion

I spent all day trying to install Visual Web Developer Express (the free version of MS Visual Studio). The darn thing kept throwing errors during installation, finally I figured out it was because my C: drive is compressed. I uncompressed the drive and voilá!

Apart from that I feel very down, angry, stressed and depressed and I don't know what to do about it. DON'T RECOMMEND ALCOHOL.

tomorrow is another day?

219 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:36:04pm

re: #217 Learned Mother of Zion

I spent all day trying to install Visual Web Developer Express (the free version of MS Visual Studio). The darn thing kept throwing errors during installation, finally I figured out it was because my C: drive is compressed. I uncompressed the drive and voilá!

Apart from that I feel very down, angry, stressed and depressed and I don't know what to do about it. DON'T RECOMMEND ALCOHOL.

Can I recommend brownie batter?

220 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:37:18pm

re: #219 Mostly sane, most of the time.

Can I recommend brownie batter?

ooooh, that's a good one!

221 engineer cat  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:38:49pm

saw the avengers

meh

222 Killgore Trout  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:39:57pm

re: #221 engineer cat

saw the avengers

meh

Yeah, I don't have any interest. I think the whole superhero genre needs to go away.

223 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:40:42pm

re: #217 Learned Mother of Zion

You have my sincere sympathy. MS is why I quit the field.

I prefer chocolate chip cookies to brownies in this case but either will do.

That or a round of trap with windows laptops in place of clay pigeons... ;)

224 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:41:22pm

re: #221 engineer cat

saw the avengers

meh

"Meh"? "Meh"?!

Burn the witch!!

//

225 Vicious Babushka  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:42:19pm

re: #219 Mostly sane, most of the time.

Can I recommend brownie batter?

I made a key lime pie on Friday.

I talked to my mom today because she's going on a cruise and will be in the Greek Islands on Mother's Day. Of course she fat-shamed me by warning me to NEVER EAT CARBS FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE.

Who wants to live like that?

226 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:42:31pm

re: #223 William Barnett-Lewis

You have my sincere sympathy. MS is why I quit the field.

I prefer chocolate chip cookies to brownies in this case but either will do.

That or a round of trap with windows laptops in place of clay pigeons... ;)

uuuh, I think that's an environmental hazard.

All I know is that you can't dispose of computer equipment at the shooting range the men go to with the "anything goes pit"

227 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:43:23pm

re: #225 Learned Mother of Zion

I made a key lime pie on Friday.

I talked to my mom today because she's going on a cruise and will be in the Greek Islands on Mother's Day. Of course she fat-shamed me by warning me to NEVER EAT CARBS FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE.

Who wants to live like that?

Rodney Dangerfield:

If you quit drinking, smoking and having sex, you will get very old and die.

I'd add carbs and caffeine to that.

228 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:43:27pm

re: #221 engineer cat

saw the avengers

meh

bring on the creator-owned comics by real people, not MegalGlomHeroCo(tm)

I think the last "superhero" movies I really REALLy dug were the Hellboy films

229 Killgore Trout  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:44:13pm

I have been thinking about starting the assassin's creed games. I never played any of them I figure I'd start with the first one. is it even available on PC or do I have to start with Assassin's Creed II?

230 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:45:10pm

re: #223 William Barnett-Lewis

You have my sincere sympathy. MS is why I quit the field.

I prefer chocolate chip cookies to brownies in this case but either will do.

That or a round of trap with windows laptops in place of clay pigeons... ;)

Not mine! I use windows for everything, because (surprise) no other platform has the applications I use

231 Amory Blaine  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:45:26pm

re: #229 Killgore Trout

I have been thinking about starting the assassin's creed games. I never played any of them I figure I'd start with the first one. is it even available on PC or do I have to start with Assassin's Creed II?

Warming up for 3?

232 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:47:31pm

re: #229 Killgore Trout

I have been thinking about starting the assassin's creed games. I never played any of them I figure I'd start with the first one. is it even available on PC or do I have to start with Assassin's Creed II?

According to Wiki, it's available for Windows. Not sure you'll find it in stores, though.

233 Killgore Trout  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:47:59pm

re: #231 Amory Blaine

Warming up for 3?

I suppose I could just start with 3 but then going back and playing 2 would be a disappointment. I'm also on a really tight budget for the next couple months, I thought I could pick up the original dirt cheap but it doesn't look like anyone sells it.

234 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:48:15pm

re: #216 ggt

Aphasics aren't necessarily mentally ill. My dad was from a stroke. So, we don't really know enough to draw meaningful conclusions.

True--er, mentally ill, and people suffering from brain damage--the mentally ill and the mentally injured--? But yes, no way to draw from it.

235 Killgore Trout  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:49:00pm

re: #232 Targetpractice

According to Wiki, it's available for Windows. Not sure you'll find it in stores, though.

Maybe I'll take a look in the real world stores. I looked on steam (and even Pirate bay) and didn't see it.

236 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:49:01pm

re: #234 SanFranciscoZionist

True--er, mentally ill, and people suffering from brain damage--the mentally ill and the mentally injured--? But yes, no way to draw from it.

I know another aphasic --born that way --treated as a learning disabiity. Maybe they've changed his diagnosis since he was a kid, I don't know.

237 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:50:19pm

re: #235 Killgore Trout

Maybe I'll take a look in the real world stores. I looked on steam (and even Pirate bay) and didn't see it.

Found it over at Amazon, bundled with AC2 for $9.99 (plus S&H).

238 darthstar  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:51:22pm

Hey everyone...had a nice ride in Napa this morning. As I wasn't riding with anyone, I kind of set my own pace. Did the fifty miler (48.6 to be precise) in two hours and forty eight minutes(wheel time), 3:25 with breaks at the rest areas...average speed was 17.3 mph. Yeah, it was a cruiser...only a few small rollers so no real climbing...15mph headwind on the north bound sections, which kept my pace down, otherwise I could have finished even faster. Still, it was good fun and the souvenir t-shirt is 100% polyester, so it'll be good for running the dogs or going for short rides.

239 Killgore Trout  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:51:48pm

re: #237 Targetpractice

Found it over at Amazon, bundled with AC2 for $9.99 (plus S&H).

Bingo! Much thanks.

240 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:52:46pm

re: #239 Killgore Trout

Bingo! Much thanks.

Not a prob.

241 Amory Blaine  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:53:55pm

re: #237 Targetpractice

Found it over at Amazon, bundled with AC2 for $9.99 (plus S&H).

Nice. Same bundle is 20 bux at newegg.

242 Only The Lurker Knows  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:54:59pm

re: #215 ggt

Padding one's expense account is the stupidest thing to do. Auditers ALWAYS look there and they know how to find things.

It's also a way to trap people. Boss says, "Yeah, just put on your Expenses" --then doesn't back the person up with audit time comes. Get it in writing and know the policy backwards and forwards.

Well if they were stupid enough to try it, then they don't deserve to be on a Boat. Conversely, if it was an honest mistake (I thought I could claim that expense) then let it go. How do I know this?

I once put in a claim for moving cost from Twin Falls, Idaho to Bangor Washington when I moved my Family from Groton. Ct.

Since I was going to a Sea going command, we set up home in in Idaho. Once I went to a shore based command, I moved my family to Washington.

I figured that since the household goods weren't delivered to my next Command in Washington, I was eligible to have the cost paid for by the Navy. Didn't work out that way. My request for reimbursement was denied.

I wasn't charged with fraud, the request was just denied. I think in this case, it is a means to put pressure on eligible Female candidates NOT to apply.

Because, if you do, We (The Submarine Community) will run you through the mill.

There is a bright side to this though. The Submarine Force may get their own version of a Catherin Janeway.

243 darthstar  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:56:29pm

re: #221 engineer cat

saw the avengers

meh

I've got a great idea! Let's make a comic book superhero movie? People will eat that shit right up! We don't even need to pay attention to the original comics...nobody will care!

In a media saturated society, originality is hard to find. Quality even harder.

244 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:58:35pm

re: #243 darthstar

I've got a great idea! Let's make a comic book superhero movie? People will eat that shit right up! We don't even need to pay attention to the original comics...nobody will care!

In a media saturated society, originality is hard to find. Quality even harder.

The first step in finding originality is to get away from the mass media :D

245 Big Joe Ghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 5:59:08pm

re: #221 engineer cat

saw the avengers

meh

I watched it on the internet last week. It's better than Thor or Hulk, as good as Captain America, but not as good as Iron Man 1. I'm looking forward to the reboot of Spider-man.

246 EdDantes  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:00:40pm

re: #90 SanFranciscoZionist

Ah, a pleasant fight on the Internet on a sunny Sunday afternoon...

My girlfriend's run off with my car,
And gone back to her ma and pa,
Telling tales of drunkenness and cruelty.
Now I'm sitting here,
Sipping at my ice cool beer,
Lazing on a sunny afternoon.

247 darthstar  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:03:49pm

re: #245 Ghost of Tom Joad

I watched it on the internet last week. It's better than Thor or Hulk, as good as Captain America, but not as good as Iron Man 1. I'm looking forward to the reboot of Spider-man.

I'm looking forward to them remaking the Harry Potter series and completely fucking that up. Given the slew of remakes, it should be some time this year.

248 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:05:33pm

How bored am I on this Sunday? Bored enough to watch somebody use Minecraft mods to build a Rube Goldberg machine on Youtube. *sigh*

249 Digital Display  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:06:25pm

re: #238 darthstar

Hey everyone...had a nice ride in Napa this morning. As I wasn't riding with anyone, I kind of set my own pace. Did the fifty miler (48.6 to be precise) in two hours and forty eight minutes(wheel time), 3:25 with breaks at the rest areas...average speed was 17.3 mph. Yeah, it was a cruiser...only a few small rollers so no real climbing...15mph headwind on the north bound sections, which kept my pace down, otherwise I could have finished even faster. Still, it was good fun and the souvenir t-shirt is 100% polyester, so it'll be good for running the dogs or going for short rides.

Did you ride Silverado Trail?

250 Only The Lurker Knows  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:07:21pm

bbiab. Beer run, then dinner.

Grilled Chicken, Green Beans W/ mushrooms and (Real*) Bacon Bits, chopped Onions and either a Rice or Pasta dish**.

* The package says they a real.
** TBD by the ultimate Feline Over Lord, The Wife. :-)

251 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:08:40pm

If anyone here can recommend a psych in Northern Colorado who has some amount of specialty with dealing with Autism and Depression, I would be thrilled.

252 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:14:45pm

re: #251 ProGunLiberal

If anyone here can recommend a psych in Northern Colorado who has some amount of specialty with dealing with Autism and Depression, I would be thrilled.

Are you far away a university with a medical school/psyc dept?

253 darthstar  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:15:16pm

re: #249 HoosierHoops

Did you ride Silverado Trail?

Vet's home in Yountville - up to Sterling, cross to Silverado Trail, Down to Oak Knoll crossing, and back up to Yountville. Nice loop.

254 Digital Display  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:18:47pm

re: #253 darthstar

Vet's home in Yountville - up to Sterling, cross to Silverado Trail, Down to Oak Knoll crossing, and back up to Yountville. Nice loop.

Nice..My old stomping grounds.

255 jvic  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:21:57pm

re: #217 Learned Mother of Zion

I spent all day trying to install Visual Web Developer Express (the free version of MS Visual Studio). The darn thing kept throwing errors during installation, finally I figured out it was because my C: drive is compressed. I uncompressed the drive and voilá!

Apart from that I feel very down, angry, stressed and depressed and I don't know what to do about it. DON'T RECOMMEND ALCOHOL.

Okay, I won't recommend alcohol, one day at a time.

I do recommend Steven Pressfield's The War of Art (sic) and his site, especially the Writing Wednesdays section. Typical quote: The counterfeit innovator is wildly self-confident. The real one is scared to death. If you're willing to pay your dues but don't know how, where, or to whom, Pressfield might be helpful.

(LMOZ has logged off. Maybe she'll see this later.)

256 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:24:17pm

re: #244 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

The first step in finding originality is to get away from the mass media :D

Originality is risky, and big companies don't like risk, since they exist to enrich their shareholders. So your point is valid.

257 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:29:58pm

re: #250 Bubblehead II

bbiab. Beer run, then dinner.

Grilled Chicken, Green Beans W/ mushrooms and (Real*) Bacon Bits, chopped Onions and either a Rice or Pasta dish**.

* The package says they a real.
** TBD by the ultimate Feline Over Lord, The Wife. :-)

Supper was Leek/Potato soup with mushrooms thrown in for the final 5 minutes of simmering. Yours sounds pretty good too.

258 Achilles Tang  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:33:22pm

Here is an email message I received from my Congressman, GOP, after having written to ask for his position on the type of commentary uttered by Ted Nugent; someone approached for support by Mitt Romney.

If I read this right, he implies that there are positive aspects to obscenities and implied threats against the president of the USA.

May 4, 2012

Thank you for letting me know of your concerns regarding the partisan environment in American politics today, as well as comments made by Ted Nugent that have been investigated by the Secret Service.

Over the course of my career in the United States House of Representatives I have made it my goal to represent every citizen of the 10th District, even if we may disagree on some issues, in a manner of which he or she can be proud, and to conduct myself in a manner befitting this high honor bestowed upon me by the people of Pinellas County. As a senior member of the House Committee on Appropriations, one of the oldest standing committees in Congress, I will continue to respect all members regardless of party.

Harsh partisanship is not a new phenomenon; fractious and aggressive political combat has been a part of America's political landscape since the founding of our republic. Our nation's fierce and intense political competition is a positive indicator of the vitality and strength of our democracy. However, while competition is at the core of our democratic system, personal attacks and divisive insinuations are not. All elected officials and candidates should carry out the business of government in the spirit of bipartisan respect, and contest elections in the spirit of fair competition.

Again, thank you for taking the time to contact me regarding this matter of mutual concern. It is my hope that you will continue to keep me apprised of your interest in legislative issues important to you. With best wishes and personal regards, I am

Bill Young
Member of Congress

259 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:33:43pm

re: #252 ggt

I graduate and go back to Colorado in a week. I need somebody to help me through the Autism+Depression+Various Complexes I developed over time, especially as psych medicines will never work properly on me. My meds are nothing more than a patch. A very dysfunctional, leaky patch.

260 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:34:40pm

re: #258 Flame Fin Tomini Tang

Oh, you live in one the worst places geographically for a hurricane.

261 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:36:51pm

re: #258 Flame Fin Tomini Tang

Here is an email message I received from my Congressman, GOP, after having written to ask for his position on the type of commentary uttered by Ted Nugent; someone approached for support by Mitt Romney.

If I read this right, he implies that there are positive aspects to obscenities and implied threats against the president of the USA.

I doubt he wrote that. Most likely its a form letter for the topic written by his staff.

262 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:38:09pm

re: #261 Dark_Falcon

Yeah, I got those from the Obama Campaign when I sent them a question in 2008. No biggie though. If they personally tried to respond to everything. Nothing would get done. And same thing even with staff involved.

263 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:39:08pm

re: #262 ProGunLiberal

Yeah, I got those from the Obama Campaign when I sent them a question in 2008. No biggie though. If they personally tried to respond to everything. Nothing would get done. And same thing even with staff involved.

Agreed.

264 Achilles Tang  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:40:30pm

re: #260 ProGunLiberal

Oh, you live in one the worst places geographically for a hurricane.

Not the worst, statistically, but potentially very sensitive to bad flooding due to shallow coastline.

265 Achilles Tang  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:41:31pm

re: #261 Dark_Falcon

I doubt he wrote that. Most likely its a form letter for the topic written by his staff.

Of course, but it has his name on it and I have no doubt he approved it. Is there a difference?

266 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:42:26pm

re: #264 Flame Fin Tomini Tang

And the fact you are in a bay. Only NYC (and maybe Boston) are more hosed than you if a Hurricane sez hai.

267 allegro  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:43:41pm

re: #266 ProGunLiberal

And the fact you are in a bay. Only NYC (and maybe Boston) are more hosed than you if a Hurricane sez hai.

Tell that to New Orleans.

268 Achilles Tang  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:44:08pm

re: #266 ProGunLiberal

And the fact you are in a bay. Only NYC (and maybe Boston) are more hosed than you if a Hurricane sez hai.

The whole west coast of Florida is like a bay, in that you need to go 15 miles offshore to get more than 40 feet deep water.

269 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:46:15pm

re: #267 allegro

Not anymore. The Dutch designed a levee system being built now. The big project is a 42 foot high floodwall. Good luck busting through that.

re: #268 Flame Fin Tomini Tang

But Tampa is even worse, water will funnel right into it, like NYC or Boston.

270 Achilles Tang  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:47:27pm

re: #269 ProGunLiberal

But Tampa is even worse, water will funnel right into it, like NYC or Boston.

True, but it still depend a combination of right factors, like tides, wind direction and time.

271 Decatur Deb  Sun, May 6, 2012 6:50:26pm

re: #270 Flame Fin Tomini Tang

True.

If one hits, just get your butt down there and sandbag the Four Green Fields.

[Link: www.tampa.fourgreenfields.com...]

272 Digital Display  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:06:22pm

re: #270 Flame Fin Tomini Tang

True, but it still depend a combination of right factors, like tides, wind direction and time.

I saw my first tornado last month in Norman. I stood outside in the pouring rain watching it lumber down Lindsey Street.
It was terrifying, Amazing, stunning and shocking..Man afterwards I was just freaking jacked up..Standing in awe in the pouring rain. If that bastard would have turned I was going to grab Winston at full speed and jump into the tub for safety.. Earlier I posted here all the prepping..Blankets in the tub, Lots of pillows and the LED flashlight..

273 Vicious Babushka  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:15:38pm

re: #272 HoosierHoops

I saw my first tornado last month in Norman. I stood outside in the pouring rain watching it lumber down Lindsey Street.
It was terrifying, Amazing, stunning and shocking..Man afterwards I was just freaking jacked up..Standing in awe in the pouring rain. If that bastard would have turned I was going to grab Winston at full speed and jump into the tub for safety.. Earlier I posted here all the prepping..Blankets in the tub, Lots of pillows and the LED flashlight..

My son saw his first tornado last year in Alabama.

Youtube Video

I'm thinking WTF are you freakin insane get the fuck down, why are you standing next to a freaking PLATE GLASS WINDOW to catch a tornado on your iphone?

274 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:16:55pm

re: #259 ProGunLiberal

I graduate and go back to Colorado in a week. I need somebody to help me through the Autism+Depression+Various Complexes I developed over time, especially as psych medicines will never work properly on me. My meds are nothing more than a patch. A very dysfunctional, leaky patch.

I'm always more comfortable going thru the work-up at a University Psyc Department. You'll get evaluated by a whole team, and it will be done in one place. Instead of getting referrals to psyhciatrist, psychologist, social worker, etc.

You are a complex case --multiple diagnoses --so I'd feel more comfortable getting a University team to re-evaluate you in light of the most current research. IT's what they do.

Congrats on graduation!!!!!

275 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:19:57pm

re: #273 Learned Mother of Zion

My son saw his first tornado last year in Alabama.

[Embedded content] I'm thinking WTF are you freakin insane get the fuck down, why are you standing next to a freaking PLATE GLASS WINDOW to catch a tornado on your iphone?

LOL, I was working in a store when one was sited and the area was on alert. We were all in the parking lot looking for it . . . .

276 Mich-again  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:22:54pm
I bumped up against that rigidity many times as governor.

There are people on the right who think that statement was so gay that Arnie should get kicked out of the party.

277 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:24:36pm

re: #276 Mich-again

There are people on the right who think that statement was so gay that Arnie should get kicked out of the party.

And to think, in the months before and just after he became governor, they were talking an amendment that would have allowed him to become president.

278 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:25:31pm

I know this one is from FNC, which is why I put this one to the group; Please take a look and tell me what you think of this story:

Attorney in hijab defends call for other women at 9/11 hearing to wear 'appropriate' clothing.

he defense attorney who wore a traditional Islamic outfit during the rowdy arraignment of the accused Sept. 11 terrorists is defending her courtroom appeal that other women in the room wear more "appropriate" clothing to the proceedings -- out of respect for her client's Muslim beliefs.

Cheryl Bormann, counsel for defendant Walid bin Attash, attended the arraignment Saturday dressed in a hijab, apparently because her client insisted on it. She further requested that the court order other women to follow that example so that the defendants do not have to avert their eyes "for fear of committing a sin under their faith."

At a press conference Sunday at Guantanamo Bay, Bormann said she dresses in a hijab at "all times" when she meets with her client "out of respect" for his beliefs. Asked why she requested other women do the same, Bormann said, "When you're on trial for your life, you need to be focused."

Bormann, who is not Muslim, claimed the issue came up several years ago, when a paralegal wore "very short skirts" and it became a distraction for the defendants. She said that on Saturday, "somebody" was also dressed "in a way that was not in keeping with my client's religious beliefs."

"If because of someone's religious beliefs, they can't focus when somebody in the courtroom is dressed in a particular way, I feel it is incumbent upon myself as a counsel to point that out and ask for some consideration from the prosecution," she said. "Suffice to say it was distracting to members of the accused."

279 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:27:29pm

re: #278 Dark_Falcon

The damn terrorists can control themselves and see women as more than sex objects is what I think.

280 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:28:45pm

re: #278 Dark_Falcon

I know this one is from FNC, which is why I put this one to the group; Please take a look and tell me what you think of this story:

Attorney in hijab defends call for other women at 9/11 hearing to wear 'appropriate' clothing.

My guess? Assuming the report is accurate? I think it's an attorney who:

a. Is a bit of a groupie and has gotten all into how special and pious her clients are, and dressing up to make them comfortable, and preaching to everyone else about how insensitive they're being by wearing short skirts,

and/or

2. Is trying to create a chaotic court environment, where every short skirt on a paralegal can turn into a fight over whether her client can function under these conditions/laying groundwork for an appeal afterward because he couldn't be expected to function under those conditions.

281 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:29:32pm

re: #279 ProGunLiberal

The damn terrorists can control themselves and see women as more than sex objects is what I think.

How do you mean?

282 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:29:42pm

re: #280 SanFranciscoZionist

This is going to be a circus.

283 Killgore Trout  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:30:37pm

re: #278 Dark_Falcon

I know this one is from FNC, which is why I put this one to the group; Please take a look and tell me what you think of this story:

Attorney in hijab defends call for other women at 9/11 hearing to wear 'appropriate' clothing.

I googled her the other day to see if she was some kind of moonbat or from the National Lawyers Guild. Didn't find anything interesting about her ideology. Maybe her legal strategy is just to make a mess of the hearings.

284 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:30:53pm

re: #281 Dark_Falcon

Bluntly, you don't have to be distracted by what they are wearing. I'm not. I'll act modestly, but like hell I will push my personal morals on others.

285 Mattand  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:31:35pm

re: #278 Dark_Falcon

I know this one is from FNC, which is why I put this one to the group; Please take a look and tell me what you think of this story:

Attorney in hijab defends call for other women at 9/11 hearing to wear 'appropriate' clothing.

The defendants can be whatever religion they want. They don't get to impose their views on everyone else.

It's a lesson the current Republican Party needs to learn.

286 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:31:38pm

re: #283 Killgore Trout

I googled her the other day to see if she was some kind of moonbat or from the National Lawyers Guild. Didn't find anything interesting about her ideology. Maybe her legal strategy is just to make a mess of the hearings.

I'd say that's the most likely scenario, she's trying to create as much of a circus as plausible in the hopes of generating a stack of appeals for the foreseeable future.

287 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:35:01pm

re: #284 ProGunLiberal

Bluntly, you don't have to be distracted by what they are wearing. I'm not. I'll act modestly, but like hell I will push my personal morals on others.

Yes, but that just proves you're not them. These assholes think nothing of forcing others to dress and live the way they think proper. Think of the worse kind of wingnut you can imagine, multiple that person by 1.5, and you'll be at how back Khalid Sheik Mohammad is.

288 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:35:07pm

Go France! Freaking awesome

289 Interesting Times in Benghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:35:29pm

re: #286 Targetpractice

I'd say that's the most likely scenario, she's trying to create as much of a circus as plausible in the hopes of generating a stack of appeals for the foreseeable future.

Excellent typo - chock full of subtext :)

(as for the lawyer's ploy, I'm also guessing it's an extraordinarily cynical & manipulative dirty trick)

290 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:37:32pm

re: #281 Dark_Falcon

How do you mean?

"Lower your eyes, stop talking about how you can't stop ogling the transcriptionist, stop ogling the transcriptionist, and focus on how very important this trial actually is."

That's what I would mean by that.

291 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:37:53pm

Personally, I'd tell defense council "tough shit," that the court does not have the authority to impose such a dress code upon any women who attend the proceedings, and that she's free to appeal the decision once the trial has ended. If her client is unable to operate under such conditions, perhaps he should have considered that when deciding on his line of "work."

292 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:40:05pm

re: #291 Targetpractice

Personally, I'd tell defense council "tough shit," that the court does not have the authority to impose such a dress code upon any women who attend the proceedings, and that she's free to appeal the decision once the trial has ended. If her client is unable to operate under such conditions, perhaps he should have considered that when deciding on his line of "work."

Quite Concur. I might add, if I was one of the prosecutors:

"Americans do not know how to submit to tyrants, and we refuse to learn how to do so. That you tried and failed to teach us is why you are here."

293 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:41:11pm

re: #291 Targetpractice

Personally, I'd tell defense council "tough shit," that the court does not have the authority to impose such a dress code upon any women who attend the proceedings, and that she's free to appeal the decision once the trial has ended. If her client is unable to operate under such conditions, perhaps he should have considered that when deciding on his line of "work."

I should also add that, if her client finds it so impossible to provide his defense under such conditions, a plea of "guilty on all charges" is always an option.

294 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:42:59pm

re: #293 Targetpractice

I should also add that, if her client finds it so impossible to provide his defense under such conditions, a plea of "guilty on all charges" is always an option.

"Nolo contendere, on the grounds that my client is afraid to open his eyes in this courtroom full of scantily clad women," is always an option.

295 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:43:10pm

re: #290 SanFranciscoZionist

There is some irony that the last thing I watched before see DF put this up was a review by Todd in the Shadows of a certain One-Hit Wonder from the early 90's. From Seattle. Guess which one?

296 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:44:30pm

re: #294 SanFranciscoZionist

"Nolo contendere, on the grounds that my client is afraid to open his eyes in this courtroom full of scantily clad women," is always an option.

They could claim "harassment by way of hijacking my dirty mind."

297 Digital Display  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:45:18pm

re: #292 Dark_Falcon

Quite Concur. I might add, if I was one of the prosecutors:

"Americans do not know how to submit to tyrants, and we refuse to learn how to do so. That you tried and failed to teach us is why you are here."

Hey! I'm all good with it.. If a Nudist goes on trial everybody must be naked..Somebody from Texas? Cowboy hats and boots all around..
And really.. If a Priest goes on Trial who doesn't want to see the whole court room filled with people dressed up as Altar Boys?

298 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:49:30pm

re: #297 HoosierHoops

Hey! I'm all good with it.. If a Nudist goes on trail everybody must be naked..Somebody from Texas? Cowboy hats and boots all around..
And really.. If a Priest goes on Trail who doesn't want to see the whole court room filled with people dressed up as Altar Boys?

I'm skipping any trial of the Duchess of Alba's.

[Link: famousplastic.com...]

299 KronoGhazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:49:53pm

Charles you should post your MotherJones podcast.

300 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:51:02pm

re: #295 ProGunLiberal

There is some irony that the last thing I watched before see DF put this up was a review by Todd in the Shadows of a certain One-Hit Wonder from the early 90's. From Seattle. Guess which one?

Post the vid, but I'm guessing it was "I'm Too Sexy".

301 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:52:13pm

re: #300 Dark_Falcon

Eh, no, it's THIS one. How did this become a hit, exactly?

One Hit Wonder review of....

302 simoom  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:52:14pm

re: #139 Ghost of Tom Joad

James O’Keefe: N.H. Attorney General tried to serve a criminal subpoena on me

It's about time after what O'Keefe pulled up here during the Primary.

^ That second tweet could have used some purplizing LGF wingnut tags around it.

303 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:52:56pm

re: #302 simoom

Aww, look, it's a widdle conspiracy theorist.

304 sagehen  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:54:27pm

re: #278 Dark_Falcon

I know this one is from FNC, which is why I put this one to the group; Please take a look and tell me what you think of this story:

Attorney in hijab defends call for other women at 9/11 hearing to wear 'appropriate' clothing.

"If the facts are against you, pound on the law
If the law is against you, pound on the facts
If the facts and the law are both against you, pound on the table"

(works better with a jury than a judge, but whatever. It's not like the lawyer has a lot of better cards to play.)

305 allegro  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:55:12pm

re: #302 simoom

It's about time after what O'Keefe pulled up here during the Primary.

[Embedded content] ^ That second tweet could have used some purplizing LGF wingnut tags around it.

Offhand, I'd say O'Keefe is really behind this due to his numbnuts commission of voter fraud then bragging about it.

306 Dark_Falcon  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:56:46pm

re: #302 simoom

It's about time after what O'Keefe pulled up here during the Primary.

[Embedded content] ^ That second tweet could have used some purplizing LGF wingnut tags around it.

307 Romantic Heretic  Sun, May 6, 2012 7:58:24pm

re: #209 SanFranciscoZionist

Being mentally ill myself I like to think people like me have a certain insight. semi-/

308 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:00:06pm

re: #302 simoom

It's about time after what O'Keefe pulled up here during the Primary.

[Embedded content] ^ That second tweet could have used some purplizing LGF wingnut tags around it.

How cute, he thinks that he's gonna prove Obama's out to get him. *rolls eyes*

309 Killgore Trout  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:00:18pm

re: #299 Kronocide

Charles you should post your MotherJones podcast.

Yeah, I'm listening to it now. It might be an interesting discussion but I see the pretty different from Charles. Although I agree with being misled by some unsavory characters in the past I see history repeating and I'm not falling for the same gimmick again by idiots and radicals on the other side.

310 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:02:54pm

re: #301 ProGunLiberal

Anybody watch it through yet?

Part of me wants to have this played at the trial, just to stick a finger in the radicals' eyes.

311 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:07:31pm

re: #309 Killgore Trout

Yeah, I'm listening to it now. It might be an interesting discussion but I see the pretty different from Charles. Although I agree with being misled by some unsavory characters in the past I see history repeating and I'm not falling for the same gimmick again by idiots and radicals on the other side.

MJ has always been hard left ideologically - they make the Progressive look like the old centrists they really are - but their journalism always used to be first rate. If you want a likely to be accurate take from the left side of things, it's probably still the best in the US. Of course, that's not saying all that much considering the utter lack of a liberal mass media in this country .The NYTimes is center-left & the rest just go marching further right the closer to Fox you get...

312 KronoGhazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:08:45pm

re: #309 Killgore Trout

Yeah, I'm listening to it now. It might be an interesting discussion but I see the pretty different from Charles. Although I agree with being misled by some unsavory characters in the past I see history repeating and I'm not falling for the same gimmick again by idiots and radicals on the other side.

I don't understand what you mean. 9/11 made the world a smaller place and put the microscope on Islamic extremism, which if valid. Instead the microscope turned into bullseye, a vehicle for xenophobia and racist nationalism. Then the GOP went through some serious changes, for the worse.

I don't see an equivalence from the left today.

313 jaunte  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:12:32pm
314 KronoGhazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:17:28pm

Dr Laura on Leviticus 18:22: Icksnay on Teh Ghey

315 Killgore Trout  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:18:51pm

I typed out a couple posts which I decided not to post, Maybe it's time for bed and listening to frogs.

316 Vicious Babushka  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:21:16pm

re: #314 Kronocide

Dr Laura on Leviticus 18:22: Icksnay on Teh Ghey

That belongs on Wikipedia as a perfect example of Teh Straw Man

317 Digital Display  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:33:34pm

It's that time of the year..NBA play-offs..And the Laker's are on so I can't go to bed..
When I first got here It was play-off time and I have posted about it every year since...I hate the Laker's..When I first got here I expressed that and the Laker's won the World Championship and Charles posted he went downtown for the parade and had a brew somewhere..
I posted Congratulations Charles..It was like vinegar on my lips. But good sportsman show respect no matter what.. I get my revenge.. Every year I mock all things Lakers..Like after a loss..
6:30am LA Jack Nicholson sitting naked at his kitchen table with a empty bottle of Vodka in front of him..Staring out the window as the sun comes up..A look of pure desperation..And the call of a bigger bottle..
Maid: Mr. Jack? You OK
Jack: I'm not OK Rosa..We lost..
Maid: You want a robe Mr. Jack?
Jack: We Lost..
Maid: I'm sorry Mr..J..
Jack: Why the hell does it take so long for a drink court side at Staples? WHY? I look up and frucking Ben Aflect has a drink..A half a dozen B listers have their drinks.. Who the hell do you think they are dealing with here Rosie?
Maid: Rosa sir..
Jack: Whatever.. Where is my robe?

And when the Laker's lose..The Hoopster wakes up with a smile on his face and a step in my walk..I'm walking on Sunshine...
It's 4th quarter time

318 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:38:09pm

re: #299 Kronocide

Charles you should post your MotherJones podcast.

Is this a new podcast?

319 Dancing along the light of day  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:39:07pm

re: #317 HoosierHoops

Hee Hee.

320 Mich-again  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:39:41pm

So in France, the Conservative Sarkozy tries to warm up to the far right for support in the election, but the fringe radicals he courted end up not supporting him because he just wasn't radical enough for them and they'd rather lose to a liberal now in order to further radicalize the right for the next election.

I wonder if the Tea Bots will do something similar to Mitt.

321 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:41:40pm

re: #320 Mich-again

Realizing of course that Sarkozy is only "conservative" on a French scale. Here, Allen West would call him a communist.

322 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:55:29pm

Holy crap, things died in here. Hello?

323 Dancing along the light of day  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:57:06pm

re: #322 ProGunLiberal

Yo!

324 BeenHereAwhile  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:58:43pm

re: #86 engineer cat

my afternoon

enjoyed a light lunch en plein air on the deck w ignatz

reading a bio of mussonlini while sunning and overlooking the treetops

So are you Archy (and Mehitabel), or Krazy Kat?

325 dragonath  Sun, May 6, 2012 8:59:05pm

re: #320 Mich-again

Sarkozy might have even won the election if he didn't try to be the second coming of Nixon. Le Pen is kind of like the French version of George Wallace. Populists aren't gonna vote for some short ostentatious dude who looks funny. The only guy who ever pulled that off was Napoleon.

326 funky chicken  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:03:13pm

Jeez this makes me feel old. Anchor dude looks too young to even know who Tool is/was. They put on a good show when I saw them way back when.

Rocker from Tool turned up-and-coming winemaker
Fans of alternative music know three-time Grammy winner James Keenan Ring as the lead singer of the band Tool. Karen Brown reports he is testing his latest talent in another industry - far from the stage.

[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]

327 Mich-again  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:05:03pm

re: #321 freetoken

Realizing of course that Sarkozy is only "conservative" on a French scale. Here, Allen West would call him a communist.

It might be foreshadowing of what could happen here with Mitt having gone so far to appeal to the Tea Wing of the Party. They might just decide to sit it out and leave the Mitt hanging so as to further move the GOP rightward as a minority party..

328 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:05:07pm

Sarkozy really pissed me off when he started playing to the bigots. Haven't heard great things about Hollende either but at least he's not a bigot.

329 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:06:06pm

What's a more apt comparision Ron/Rand Paul or Santorum to LePen and LePen's daughter?

330 Lidane  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:06:40pm

re: #314 Kronocide

Dr Laura on Leviticus 18:22: Icksnay on Teh Ghey

Needs moar sarc tags. Funny, though.

331 Mich-again  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:08:02pm

re: #329 HappyWarrior

What's a more apt comparision Ron/Rand Paul or Santorum to LePen and LePen's daughter?

I think LePaul is closer to LePen..

332 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:08:33pm

re: #327 Mich-again

The wingnuts are all over the net saying they want to purify the GOP, that Arnold is worse than a RINO, etc.

Yes, I expect them to cut off their noses to spite their faces.

However, I also realize that many people (and probably grey haired) will show up to the voting booth, having paid no attention to anything online or anything in print, and just vote party line. Thus Romney will get many GOP votes.

333 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:09:27pm

re: #331 Mich-again

I think LePaul is closer to LePen..

In terms of ideology or the massive cult following? Really don't know too much about LePen is absolutely insane when it comes to the Nazis. Believe he's very close if not already a Holocaust denier if not Holocaust/Nazi minimalist.

334 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:10:21pm

Democracy is a heresy, are least to the Dominionist crowd.

To the rest of us, Democracy is simply an illusion.

335 Targetpractice  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:10:28pm

re: #320 Mich-again

So in France, the Conservative Sarkozy tries to warm up to the far right for support in the election, but the fringe radicals he courted end up not supporting him because he just wasn't radical enough for them and they'd rather lose to a liberal now in order to further radicalize the right for the next election.

I wonder if the Tea Bots will do something similar to Mitt.

Sarkozy in the final days made the same mistake Mittens is now, trying to be something for everyone and failing miserably at it.

336 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:13:47pm

A Pakistani newspaper blog asks: Why do religious people distrust science?

337 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:15:38pm

re: #336 freetoken

Well, I wish our media would ask that, but props to that Pakistani Newspaper.

338 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:15:55pm

[Link: livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com...]
Heh apparently Romney doesn't think he can win Pa. A lot can happen between now and the election but I predict Romney will really struggle in Rust Belt states like Pa, Ohio, Michigan, etc. The let Detroit fail mentality isn't going to go over well with blue collar workers nor should it.

339 freetoken  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:16:51pm

I don't particularly like my avatar, but nothing comes to mind to which I can aspire to embody on such a thing, and my previous efforts the past couple of days were worse. Alas.

340 Mich-again  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:16:55pm

re: #332 freetoken

However, I also realize that many people (and probably grey haired) will show up to the voting booth, having paid no attention to anything online or anything in print, and just vote party line. Thus Romney will get many GOP votes.

I can't argue with that.. But I do think the longer the Paul campaign sticks around making noise going into the convention, the less of a chance there is the Paul loyalists will rally for Mitt. They'll be looking ahead 4 years thinking it'll either be Mitt's reelection campaign or Rand Paul's coming out party.

341 goddamnedfrank  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:17:19pm

re: #314 Kronocide

Dr Laura on Leviticus 18:22: Icksnay on Teh Ghey

That's a ripoff of a scene from The West Wing. The woman in the scene was a clear obvious stand in for Dr. Laura, which makes the purported letter even less original:

Youtube Video
342 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:18:59pm

re: #9 freetoken

BTW, this quest for purity by the far right in the GOP mirrors what is happening in various American Christian groups and denominations today, as the True Believers are working to root out the heretics.

College professors/teachers are being forced to leave their posts in religious schools, and denominations are doing the censoring thing, and so forth.

Indeed, the GOP purification is exactly like what is happening in these religious groups. Perhaps because it is the same people?

when they're told by their churches and leaders to be paranoid and look for scapegoats, then that's what they'll do

343 Mich-again  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:19:24pm

re: #338 HappyWarrior

[Link: livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com...]
Heh apparently Romney doesn't think he can win Pa. A lot can happen between now and the election but I predict Romney will really struggle in Rust Belt states like Pa, Ohio, Michigan, etc. The let Detroit fail mentality isn't going to go over well with blue collar workers nor should it.

Romney has no chance in Michigan. People from around here hate a traitor FAR worse than someone who was always an enemy. Mitt is toast.

344 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:21:38pm

re: #301 ProGunLiberal

Eh, no, it's THIS one. How did this become a hit, exactly?

One Hit Wonder review of...

Mix-a-lot was local to me, he's actually a really talented guy, albums full of fun and clever music, but naturally the dumbest, easiest song is the hit

345 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:21:52pm

re: #343 Mich-again

Romney has no chance in Michigan. People from around here hate a traitor FAR worse than someone who was always an enemy. Mitt is toast.

Yeah I knew he was toast in Michigan after Santorum nearly beat him there. Honestly other than Indiana and North Carolina, there's really no state I can think of that he will bring back into the Republican fold this year. Obama drew a huge and enthusiastic crowd when he spoke here in Virginia yesterday. Romney meanwhile got only 60% of the vote here without having to worry about Newt and Santorum on the ballot.

346 dragonath  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:22:32pm

re: #338 HappyWarrior

Toomey barely won and Corbett probably wouldn't have survived if not for a Republican wave year. But the Guv is actually polling far better than he really should.

I'm pretty sure PA is gonna go Democratic, but I wouldn't be surprised if Obama gets a higher winning percentage in a place like North Carolina.

347 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:24:15pm

re: #344 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

I have to admit, I laughed my ass off at that review. I really, really needed it.

348 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:25:23pm

re: #346 Be Zorch, Daddio

Toomey barely won and Corbett probably wouldn't have survived if not for a Republican wave year. But the Guv is actually polling far better than he really should.

I'm pretty sure PA is gonna go Democratic, but I wouldn't be surprised if Obama gets a higher winning percentage in a place like North Carolina.

I think NC is going to depend on the youth and black vote. Higher that is, the better Obama does. I think Virginia stays with Obama but it may become more competitive if Romney chooses McDonnell, who like Corbett is more popular than he should especially after the stupid vaginal ultrasound bill that he supported but then ran away from when he knew it was political suicide.

349 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:26:05pm

re: #314 Kronocide

Dr Laura on Leviticus 18:22: Icksnay on Teh Ghey

I have a nice Torah commentary in english that makes a good argument that it needs to be taken under advisement of Deut. 17:8-9. Put insanely over simplified, that's the amendment mechanism for the Law and he argues that is the best way to deal with matters that have become obsolete and he explicitly puts Lev.18:22 there.

350 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:30:51pm

Ok, Now I am officially pissed-off!

School tortures autistic boy with electric shocks, staff laughs

Read more: [Link: www.digitaljournal.com...]

He didn't take off his coat in class. To punish him, staff at a U.S. school for mentally handicapped children shocked the autistic boy 31 times, leaving him brain damaged.
"I never signed up for him to be tortured, terrorized, and abused," Cheryl McCollins, the mother of the autistic boy said in court. "I had no idea—no idea—that they tortured the children in the school."
Neither did the public. That's until last month, when a judge unsealed the chilling video, shot in 2002, showing 18-year-old Andre McCollins strapped face down, limbs tied to a table, screaming with pain as staff at the Judge Rotenberg Center in Canton, Mass. administer what Rotenberg employees call a "skin shock" therapy session.


Read more: [Link: www.digitaljournal.com...]

351 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:31:18pm

re: #350 ggt

Ok, Now I am officially pissed-off!

School tortures autistic boy with electric shocks, staff laughs

Read more: [Link: www.digitaljournal.com...]

Bastards..............

352 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:34:02pm

re: #351 HappyWarrior

Bastards...

I don't think it's going Godwin to compare this "treatment" with the Nazi's.

353 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:34:39pm

re: #351 HappyWarrior

Bastards...

There was a different case like this, also in Massachusetts. I have no idea what the fuck they think they are doing.

My vet tried to get me to get a zap collar for my dog, and I told him to forget about it. Who teaches children like this?

354 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:35:39pm

re: #353 SanFranciscoZionist

There was a different case like this, also in Massachusetts. I have no idea what the fuck they think they are doing.

My vet tried to get me to get a zap collar for my dog, and I told him to forget about it. Who teaches children like this?

sadists.

355 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:36:05pm

re: #353 SanFranciscoZionist

There was a different case like this, also in Massachusetts. I have no idea what the fuck they think they are doing.

My vet tried to get me to get a zap collar for my dog, and I told him to forget about it. Who teaches children like this?

I don't know. It's terrible really. Words can't express it.

356 ProGunLiberal  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:36:27pm

re: #352 ggt

No, it's not. I think the Feds are about to be called in. If they haven't been already.

357 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:37:22pm

re: #352 ggt

I don't think it's going Godwin to compare this "treatment" with the Nazi's.

It's something they would have done certainly, yes. Monsters aren't big creatures. They're our own fellow human beings and I think that's what makes this and other stories disturbing. That is fellow human beings capable of the worst atrocities.

358 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:39:53pm

After the oft cited "Pain" study (participants inflicted what they thought were electric shocks at the instruction of the examiner and heard the screams, but kept on going because of some "authority" hypothesis) you'd think this type of shit would be an anathema in psych circles..

359 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:41:39pm

I think the more I think about it (being an adult on the autistic spectrum) that I am glad I live when I do. I think someone like me gets committed in the past or at least made a huge social outsider. People need to be understanding of autistic people and electric shocking a child is just terrible.

360 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:45:42pm

re: #359 HappyWarrior

I think the more I think about it (being an adult on the autistic spectrum) that I am glad I live when I do. I think someone like me gets committed in the past or at least made a huge social outsider. People need to be understanding of autistic people and electric shocking a child is just terrible.

Electric Shocking any creature is terrible.

I'm amazed that people who are supposed to be educated as to the best treatments are doing this. Fucking should lose their licenses.

361 HappyBenghazi  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:47:13pm

re: #360 ggt

Electric Shocking any creature is terrible.

I'm amazed that people who are supposed to be educated as to the best treatments are doing this. Fucking should lose their licenses.

No doubt about it. As I said, bastards. Agree they should lose their licenses.

362 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:50:17pm

Does Electric Shock therapy actually help anything? Is there a reason it is still legal?

363 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:50:18pm

re: #350 ggt

I am unable to say what I wish to out of respect for Charles' rules.

364 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:53:43pm

re: #362 Mostly sane, most of the time.

Does Electric Shock therapy actually help anything? Is there a reason it is still legal?

No. Yes, though I don't understand why.

Stop and remember when "One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest" was published and it was already well know that that shit didn't work then.

365 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 9:54:26pm

Shock Treatment Works? The benefits of electric shock therapy

ECT is not what I think the were doing to these children. Using electric shock for aversion therapy sounds more like cattle prods to me.

366 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 10:12:21pm

re: #351 HappyWarrior

Bastards...

Oh, and they're blaming this crap on B.F. Skinner?

OH JOY.

367 sagehen  Sun, May 6, 2012 10:17:23pm

re: #341 goddamnedfrank

That's a ripoff of a scene from The West Wing. The woman in the scene was a clear obvious stand in for Dr. Laura, which makes the purported letter even less original:

[Embedded content]

nah, it's the other way around.

That letter made it's way around the... well, it was before the blogosphere, back when e-mail chains were all the rage... and Sorkin liked it enough to get permission to adapt it for the show.

368 Mentis Fugit  Sun, May 6, 2012 10:17:28pm

re: #341 goddamnedfrank

That's a ripoff of a scene from The West Wing. The woman in the scene was a clear obvious stand in for Dr. Laura, which makes the purported letter even less original:

[Embedded content]

It's the other way round. The letter's been around since at least May 2000, and was incorporated into The West Wing.

[Link: www.snopes.com...]

369 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 10:17:32pm

re: #362 Mostly sane, most of the time.

Does Electric Shock therapy actually help anything? Is there a reason it is still legal?

It's not electroshock, what they're doing. It's just aversive conditioning. They could as easily paddle them, or hit them with a ruler, but I suspect they like this because it looks 'clinical', and therefore they can pretend it's not just corporal punishment for stepping out of line in class, or inconveniencing the 'educators'.

370 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 10:21:09pm

re: #369 SanFranciscoZionist

It's not electroshock, what they're doing. It's just aversive conditioning. They could as easily paddle them, or hit them with a ruler, but I suspect they like this because it looks 'clinical', and therefore they can pretend it's not just corporal punishment for stepping out of line in class, or inconveniencing the 'educators'.

I think it's the "educators" that are mentally ill.

Sadists!

371 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, May 6, 2012 10:22:18pm

Ok, I FEEL BETTER.

Nytol.

372 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, May 6, 2012 10:26:33pm

re: #370 ggt

I think it's the "educators" that are mentally ill.

Sadists!

Beyond freaking belief. And very, very telling that they apparently didn't dare actually discuss their 'discipline plan' with the parents.

373 Ming  Sun, May 6, 2012 10:39:08pm

Arnold's speaking up is a dream come true for me. I've been waiting a long time for a Republican leader to come right out and say it: the Republican party has lost its way. Some Republicans have spoken up: Arlen Specter and Alan Simpson come to mind. But they've been few and far between. And this is why the right wing stays on the looney-tunes side: the near-total silence of the Republican establishment sends a message that the right wing isn't really crazy.

For example, I was frustrated a few months ago to watch an interview with Colin Powell (this was when Rick Perry was considered a front-runner) where he was asked what he thought of the current crop of GOP candidates, and the Secretary made some polite comment about how our political system encourages all kinds of interesting people to throw their hats into the ring. I was hoping he'd say something a little more honest, like "some of those people are really nuts!"

Thank you Arnold. Also, thanks for trying to fix California; it's unfortunate that you got the legislature-from-hell in Sacramento.

374 jvic  Sun, May 6, 2012 10:50:45pm

re: #366 SanFranciscoZionist

Oh, and they're blaming this crap on B.F. Skinner?

OH JOY.

The founder was Skinner's student.

The web site is here. The place claims it's growing fast. Although I haven't seen or read it, A Clockwork Orange came to mind when browsing the site.


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