#TwitterGulag Reprise: How to Get Blocked and Reported for Spam

A look at the kind of wingnut behavior that causes accounts to be suspended by Twitter
Wingnuts • Views: 37,094

What sort of wingnut gets their account suspended, then whines about being unjustly imprisoned in #TwitterGulag by the super-secret conspiracy led by yours truly?

When I happened to click on a Twitter user’s profile today, I discovered the answer to this poignant question.

Our tale begins when I saw the following retweet appear in one of my Tweetdeck timelines:

Yes, it’s that same brain-dead conspiracy theory again; they’re still retweeting it like mindless parrots. But when I clicked the link for “Retweeted by @guy_next_to_me,” I discovered that “@guy_next_to_me” (aka “YzzOne”) had recently escaped from the dreaded Twitter Gulag after 48 days of torture, starvation, and forced labor … no, wait, that was the real Soviet Gulag. This guy was unable to tweet, which is just like a Gulag only if you’re nuts.

After reading his triumphant tweet about the delicious taste of freedom, I clicked his name and took a look at what this former Gulag inmate was tweeting right before his dastardly unjust suspension by commie leftist masterminds led by yours truly.

Here’s what I found…

Why in the world would anyone block and report this wingnut for spam? It’s a real head-scratcher.

UPDATE at 6/6/12 1:51:52 pm

Notice that the profile images for almost all the tweets posted above are now showing up blank. That’s because after being exposed in this post, “YzzOne” deleted all the evidence of his spamming from Twitter — but the tweets still show up here, obviously.

Jump to bottom

359 comments
1 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 7:51:36pm

Its almost as if you simply post the same thing over and over to multiple people, then they block you for spam.

WTF is that shit?

2 Varek Raith  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 7:53:00pm

SPAM

3 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 7:53:21pm

re: #2 Varek Raith

SPAM

Bloody Vikings.

4 jaunte  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 7:55:24pm

Goldie Taylor is part of it!

5 Gus  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 7:56:10pm

Damn. That's one manic spammer right there.

6 Varek Raith  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 7:56:46pm

re: #5 Gus

Damn. That's one manic spammer right there.

DOG!

7 jaunte  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:01:14pm

re: #6 Varek Raith

Dude bit dog, man!

8 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:01:14pm

CA results should be coming in any time now.

9 GunstarGreen  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:01:22pm

Clearly it's a liberal conspiracy that people who constantly spam the same copy-pasted message get banned for spamming.

10 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:04:41pm

re: #9 GunstarGreen

Clearly it's a liberal conspiracy that people who constantly spam the same copy-pasted message get banned for spamming.

Rules of the Internet

Rule 22) Copypasta is made to ruin every last bit of originality.
Rule 23) Copypasta is made to ruin every last bit of originality.

11 Varek Raith  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:06:05pm

Copypasta is made to ruin every last bit of originality.

12 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:08:19pm

re: #11 Varek Raith

Copypasta is made to ruin every last bit of originality.

Copypasta is made to ruin every last bit of originality.

13 Varek Raith  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:09:06pm

Copypasta is made to ruin every last bit of originality.

Copypasta is made to ruin every last bit of originality.

Copypasta is made to ruin every last bit of originality.

14 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:16:20pm

Copypasta killed the thread

15 Gus  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:19:46pm

re: #14 Kragar

Copypasta killed the thread

Every time you kill a thread a kitten dies someone goes off into #TwitterGulag. Which is worse!

//

16 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:22:40pm

re: #15 Gus

Every time you kill a thread a kitten dies someone goes off into #TwitterGulag. Which is worse!

//

You were supposed to say "Copypasta killed the thread"

Have I taught you nothing?
/

17 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:25:42pm

CA Senate race: 1% reporting

Dianne Feinstein (D)
48.9% 258,951

Elizabeth Emken (R)
13.6% 71,845

Dan Hughes (R)
6.3% 33,443

Orly Taitz (R)
3.2% 17,052

18 jaunte  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:31:12pm

re: #17 Kragar

Orly hanging back, waiting to make her move on the outside at the last turn.

19 CuriousLurker  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:50:17pm
...escaped from the dreaded Twitter Gulag after 48 days of torture, starvation, and forced labor … no, wait, that was the real Soviet Gulag. This guy was unable to tweet, which is just like a Gulag only if you’re nuts.

I've seen a couple of people actually refer to those whose accounts have been suspended as POWs. Talk about a slap in the face to people who were real POWs.

20 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 8:57:51pm

re: #19 CuriousLurker

I've seen a couple of people actually refer to those whose accounts have been suspended as POWs. Talk about a slap in the face to people who were real POWs.

To them McCain's just a RINO, to be maligned as needed to feed their unending need for outrages, purges, and other artificial drama.

21 Gus  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:01:31pm

We will hold you in Twitter gulag as long as it's required.

Youtube Video
22 Mentis Fugit  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:02:53pm

re: #19 CuriousLurker

I've seen a couple of people actually refer to those whose accounts have been suspended as POWs. Talk about a slap in the face to people who were real POWs.

Pathetic Overcompensating Whiners?

23 Gus  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:04:15pm

No one fucks with me and gets away with it.

[Spits out cigar tip.]

[Sound of whip.]

[Dobro slide.]

24 CuriousLurker  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:05:27pm

While searching for something totally unrelated, I came across a paper published last November by a European organization called the Centre for Economic Policy Research (CEPR). The first few pages were very interesting, however since I'm no good with numbers or financial/economic things, I didn't bother reading the whole thing.

I did, however, save the link as I know some of you brainy types will understand it better and might enjoy it: The Impact of Economics Blogs (PDF).

25 freetoken  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:11:00pm

Given that some wingnuts in this country are trying to paint Breivik as being not being a far-right wingnut ... this story is needed:


Far-right leaders defend Breivik's views in court

A handful of Norwegian right-wing extremists testified yesterday in self-confessed killer Anders Behring Breivik's defence, backing his ideological claims that Norway is "at war" with Islam.

The 33-year-old self-styled anti-Muslim crusader has placed great importance on this line of argument, fearing that his ideology could be undermined if he is declared insane.

[...]

Defence lawyers attempted to show that while there are people who share Breivik's views, they are not declared mentally ill for doing so.

"Norway is at war," Tore Tvedt, a far-right extremist who has been convicted for his published anti-Semitic statements, told the court.

Although many of the witnesses echoed Breivik's political views during the hearing, all of them took care to distance themselves from the violent actions for which he is on trial.

"We are a non-violent organisation," said Arne Tumyr, leader of 'Stop the Islamisation of Norway'. But he declared that "Islam is an evil political ideology disguised as a religion".

Another witness, Ronny Alte, said that although he knows of no one in his immediate surroundings who supported Breivik's actions, "there could easily be around a hundred that I know about" on the internet who do.

Gee, with whom do these guys hang out?

Pamela Geller Ally Testifies on Behalf of Anders Breivik's Defense

26 Gus  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:12:01pm

re: #25 freetoken

Given that some wingnuts in this country are trying to paint Breivik as being not being a far-right wingnut ... this story is needed:

Far-right leaders defend Breivik's views in court

Gee, with whom do these guys hang out?

Pamela Geller Ally Testifies on Behalf of Anders Breivik's Defense

That's some sick shit there.

27 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:17:21pm

re: #26 Gus

That's some sick shit there.

Sick shit is their speciality.

28 freetoken  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:20:05pm

Same old story:

Allegations of N.J. cleric sex abuse widen

29 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:25:23pm

re: #28 freetoken

Same old story:

Allegations of N.J. cleric sex abuse widen

I'm sure the Catholic Church will have time to investigate the matter once they've finished their inquiries into the Girl Scouts, Nuns writing books they disagree with and complaining about laws they're already excluded from.

30 freetoken  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:29:54pm

For those who are unaware - South Korea has been the target of evangelism for many years, which has yielded, over the years, some unusual spin-offs, as well as the growth of conservative/evangelical Christianity in that nation.

Anyway, this ought not come as a surprise:


South Korea surrenders to creationist demands

Mention creationism, and many scientists think of the United States, where efforts to limit the teaching of evolution have made headway in a couple of states1. But the successes are modest compared with those in South Korea, where the anti-evolution sentiment seems to be winning its battle with mainstream science.

A petition to remove references to evolution from high-school textbooks claimed victory last month after the Ministry of Education, Science and Technology (MEST) revealed that many of the publishers would produce revised editions that exclude examples of the evolution of the horse or of avian ancestor Archaeopteryx. The move has alarmed biologists, who say that they were not consulted. “The ministry just sent the petition out to the publishing companies and let them judge,” says Dayk Jang, an evolutionary scientist at Seoul National University.

The campaign was led by the Society for Textbook Revise (STR), which aims to delete the “error” of evolution from textbooks to “correct” students’ views of the world, according to the society’s website. The society says that its members include professors of biology and high-school science teachers.

The STR is an independent offshoot of the Korea Association for Creation Research (KACR), according to KACR spokesman Jungyeol Han. Thanks in part to the KACR’s efforts, creation science — which seeks to provide evidence in support of the creation myth described in the Book of Genesis — has had a growing influence in South Korea, although the STR itself has distanced itself from such doctrines. [...]

Even the nation’s leading science institute — the Korea Advanced Institute of Science and Technology — has a creation science display on campus. “The exhibition was set up by scientists who believed in creation science back in 1993,” says Gab-duk Jang, a pastor of the campus church. The institute also has a thriving Research Association for Creation Science, run by professors and students, he adds.

[...]

31 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:35:01pm

Totally OT:

Newsad (you know the type) shows a beautiful model sitting on a big expensive couch in an immaculately clean house with the caption:

Nature's cure for unhappiness.

I'm not going to read it.

Yes, having my house suddenly be clean, being below my ideal weight, and having a lot of money would make me more comfortable, if not happier.

32 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:41:45pm

Walker won 37% of union households.

33 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:42:35pm

re: #32 Amory Blaine

Walker won 37% of union households.

Fucking idiots.

34 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:44:14pm

Adult Swim games presents...

Robot Unicorn Attack Evolution

35 Killgore Trout  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:47:05pm

re: #32 Amory Blaine

Walker won 37% of union households.

Gave it a quick skim. Looks like the important factors may be indy voters and those who believe recalls should be only for official misconduct.

36 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:48:08pm

NormalRepublican - Today at 10:41 PM - Report Abuse
12
Teachers in this state are USELESS, money grubbing whiners. Also, I don't believe YOUR party believes in a higher power. GOD was and always is for the Republican (moral) party.

Let the gloating begin.

37 freetoken  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:51:11pm

re: #32 Amory Blaine

Walker won 37% of union households.

creationists

38 Digital Display  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:51:14pm

re: #35 Killgore Trout

Gave it a quick skim. Looks like the important factors may be indy voters and those who believe recalls should be only for official misconduct.

Just got home a bit ago and saw the Walker victory speech on the tube.
I thought it would have been a closer race.

39 abolitionist  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:55:05pm

re: #30 freetoken

For those who are unaware - South Korea has been the target of evangelism for many years, which has yielded, over the years, some unusual spin-offs, as well as the growth of conservative/evangelical Christianity in that nation.

Anyway, this ought not come as a surprise:

South Korea surrenders to creationist demands

Seems like it's Ken Ham's world-wide franchise.

40 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 9:59:14pm

re: #32 Amory Blaine

Walker won 37% of union households.

Citizens United!

41 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:00:40pm

Jason Statham needs to stick with making British movies. Much better than the action dreck Hollywood keeps stick him in.

42 sattv4u2  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:03:20pm

re: #35 Killgore Trout

Gave it a quick skim. Looks like the important factors may be indy voters and those who believe recalls should be only for official misconduct.

That jumped out at me also

43 Digital Display  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:05:49pm

re: #42 sattv4u2

That jumped out at me also

Your summer work schedule really sucks dude

44 sattv4u2  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:06:15pm

re: #43 HoosierHoops

Your summer work schedule really sucks dude

I'll give you my boss's phone #

45 Mocking Jay  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:06:55pm

re: #41 Kragar

Jason Statham needs to stick with making British movies. Much better than the action dreck Hollywood keeps stick him in.

Doesn't he always just play the same character?

46 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:10:17pm

re: #45 It's a cookbook!

Doesn't he always just play the same character?

He has a niche which works some places and doesn't in others.

47 blueraven  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:11:08pm

I think both parties over-reached.

Walker did NOT campaign on getting rid of collective bargaining. Period.
He surprised even his own party. He was arrogant and divisive from the beginning.

But after the first recall in which the dems picked up two seats...they should have called it a day and spent their time and money organizing for the next election.
I think people are pissed at all the cost. Moderates do not go out to vote against someone.

Both parties are guilty of dividing Wisconsin.

48 dragonath  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:14:14pm

South Korea has a LOT of whacko evangelicals. Check this (admittedly, pretty old) article out:

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

Christian fundamentalists have stoked resentment by vandalizing statues of Dangun, the nation's mythic founder. Families also have been divided as increasing numbers of Protestants have refused to take part in Confucian ancestor worship, holiday rituals that used to be performed in all families regardless of their religious affiliation.

The Buddhist furor escalated in recent weeks as videos circulated on the Internet showing zealous Protestant preachers, one of whom led his congregation in shouts for the "collapse of Buddhist temples."

In another clip, a leading preacher, Jang Kyong Dong, says: "Buddhist monks are wasting their time. They should convert to Jesus. Is there any Buddhist country in the world that is rich?"

and

In the spotlight of the dispute is Lee, who once outraged Buddhists by vowing, when he was mayor of Seoul, to "consecrate" the capital to the Christian God.

...

Lee was not the first Christian that South Korea has elected president. Two of his three predecessors were practicing Christians.

But discord flared after Lee's inauguration in February.

Buddhists complain that of the 16 members of Lee's cabinet, 13 are Christians while only one is a Buddhist. (The other two have no religious affiliation.)

...

Protestantism arrived here with American missionaries only a century ago but has expanded in the past several decades in parallel with the country's modernization.

49 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:14:28pm

Sorry, but I'm fading and need to get to bed.

Good night, all.

50 jaunte  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:22:07pm

What the Union Fight is Really About: Defunding the Left

There's nothing illegal about the right's efforts to defund the left. As they say, politics ain't beanbag. But the left is fighting with one hand tied behind its back if it doesn't understand exactly what's going on and doesn't make sure that the public understands it, too. Unlike the fights over funding for NPR or Planned Parenthood, these aren't just—or even mainly—fights over liberal versus conservative priorities or principles, regardless of how often the right likes to portray them that way. They're really fights over raw, naked power, with Republicans trying to permanently tilt the political playing field and restore their Bush-era dream of a permanent majority.

51 dragonath  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:29:40pm

Google's theme is pretty cool today- the 79th anniversary of the drive-in movie theater. The second one that ever opened is still in operation.

52 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:33:07pm

Video: Koch Bros Take Their Wisconsin Victory Lap

53 Cheechako  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:43:18pm

Who won the seat in the Wisconsin Senate? I thought there was one seat up for grabs which would dictate control of the State Senate.

54 dragonath  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 10:53:58pm

re: #53 Cheechako

District 21 is still fairly close- at least it hasn't been called yet.

55 freetoken  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:07:25pm

re: #52 Kragar

"Our Father who art in Wichita,
hallowed be your name.
Your franchise come,
your will be done,
in Wisconsin as it is in Athabasca.
Give us this day our company store credits,
and forgive us our debit cards,
as we also have forgiven our subprime mortgage lenders.
And lead us not into the Democratic Party,
but deliver us from the unions."

56 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:07:35pm

Unions are clear losers in Walker victory

RonaldReaganFan - Today at 12:45 AM - Report Abuse
00
Now is the time to go after the generous pay packages of police and firefighter unions.

Thanks for your service, officers and firemen, but taxpayers are tired of supporting your high-on-the hog salaries and pensions and benefits. At the very least, we can strip public safety workers' families from being supported by taxpayer dollars (i.e. family members who are covered by an insurance policy.)

The time is now. We're sick of paying for BMW-driving, three-Harley Davidson-owning patrolmen and weekend firemen.

57 Targetpractice  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:09:14pm

re: #56 Amory Blaine

Unions are clear losers in Walker victory

And people wondered at the time why those unions were out there, marching against Walker, when they were spared from the axe.

58 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:12:02pm

re: #56 Amory Blaine

Unions are clear losers in Walker victory

What patrolman does Reaganfan know? Oh and it's hilarious that someone that obviously worships Reagan is bitching about unions when Reagan himself was a union president and called collective bargaining an essential part of democracy.

59 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:13:21pm

re: #56 Amory Blaine

Unions are clear losers in Walker victory

I hope the pig fucker needs to call 911 and gets put on hold because they're too busy.

60 Amory Blaine  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:13:42pm

re: #58 HappyWarrior

His attitude, is rampant here. Boggles the mind. Sigh.

61 Targetpractice  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:16:29pm

re: #58 HappyWarrior

What patrolman does Reaganfan know? Oh and it's hilarious that someone that obviously worships Reagan is bitching about unions when Reagan himself was a union president and called collective bargaining an essential part of democracy.

He worships Reagan for the same reason that a lot of union haters do, because Reagan took on PATCO and "won," thus breaking the back of private unions and leading to the last 30+ years of decline for the middle class.

62 dragonath  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:16:37pm

re: #56 Amory Blaine

THIS is why Republicans can never hold on to a long-term majority. Their followers are so stupid they can't help but taunt the losers after they win.

They ALWAYS overreach.

Then people forget, but that's another story.

63 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:17:30pm

"Hello, 911 , my kitchen is on fire."

"We'll send a crew over to contain it."

"If you go in, you might be able to save the house."

"Too dangerous. Better to make sure it doesn't spread and let it burn out."

64 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:17:45pm

re: #61 Targetpractice

He worships Reagan for the same reason that a lot of union haters do, because Reagan took on PATCO and "won," thus breaking the back of private unions and leading to the last 30+ years of decline for the middle class.

True that.

65 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:18:58pm

They can try to differeniate between public sector unions and private corporations but I'm sorry you're a goddamned hypocrite in my book if you complain about union greed but just shrug your shoulders and say it's business when executives reward themselves with huge salary increases.

66 Targetpractice  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:19:50pm

That's what always gets me about such idiots, they worship Reagan and hate unions with a passion, then wonder why they're working thankless, dead-end jobs with no benefits, shitty pay, and little chance of advancement. At least, those whose jobs haven't already been outsourced overseas.

67 Kragar  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:20:19pm

re: #65 HappyWarrior

They can try to differeniate between public sector unions and private corporations but I'm sorry you're a goddamned hypocrite in my book if you complain about union greed but just shrug your shoulders and say it's business when executives reward themselves with huge salary increases.

Hypocrisy is something they're really good at though.

68 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:21:21pm

re: #66 Targetpractice

That's what always gets me about such idiots, they worship Reagan and hate unions with a passion, then wonder why they're working thankless, dead-end jobs with no benefits, shitty pay, and little chance of advancement. At least, those whose jobs haven't already been outsourced overseas.

They just blame the unions for their plight because they believed Reagan and the other bullshitters scapegoating union bullshit. If they had any idea how they were being had for a ride, they'd probably end up being radical to the left as they are radical to the right.

69 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:21:49pm

re: #67 Kragar

Hypocrisy is something they're really good at though.

The best hypocrites know they're hypocrites.

70 Targetpractice  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:24:47pm

re: #68 HappyWarrior

They just blame the unions for their plight because they believed Reagan and the other bullshitters scapegoating union bullshit. If they had any idea how they were being had for a ride, they'd probably end up being radical to the left as they are radical to the right.

That's because they point at the few remaining unions, point at the "cushy" pay and "Cadillac" benefits and go "These people are making way more than you are, don't do anything differently, and it's costing you more at the register. That's not right!"

Then you read in the paper about a CEO who just got a 8 or 9 figure "bonus" atop his regular pay, not to mention various benefits (private jet, paid vacations, etc), and get told that he's "earned" that because the company's stock value went up. And it really rubs the salt into the wound when you hear that the reason the value went up is due to decisions like shutting down plants and firing hundreds/thousands of workers.

71 AK-47%  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:25:28pm

One of the other great post-Reagan myths is that greedy unions wrecked American industry. Perhaps their demands did play a role, but look at what managment and companies like Bain Capital did to America.

We created a system in which there was more short-term profit to be had from buying a company and stripping it than in buying one and refurbishing it.

72 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:26:41pm

re: #70 Targetpractice

That's because they point at the few remaining unions, point at the "cushy" pay and "Cadillac" benefits and go "These people are making way more than you are, don't do anything differently, and it's costing you more at the register. That's not right!"

Then you read in the paper about a CEO who just got a 8 or 9 figure "bonus" atop his regular pay, not to mention various benefits (private jet, paid vacations, etc), and get told that he's "earned" that because the company's stock value went up. And it really rubs the salt into the wound when you hear that the reason the value went up is due to decisions like shutting down plants and firing hundreds/thousands of workers.

True that. It's a weird phenomenon I must say though. Can't imagine ever thinking that way myself but I guess it's how I was raised.

73 Targetpractice  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:32:34pm

re: #72 HappyWarrior

True that. It's a weird phenomenon I must say though. Can't imagine ever thinking that way myself but I guess it's how I was raised.

It's a weird working of class envy and idol worship. We're a nation that's come to idolize an ideal, that any person can work himself up to being one of "the elite." That a kid can, through hard work and sacrifice, find himself one day at the top of a Fortune 500 company.

Thing is, over the last century, the Fortune 500's used their money to stack the deck in their favor. So now that hardworking kid finds himself fired at the age of 50 with a 401K stuffed with company stock that's only good as toilet paper because the bastards at the top bet against their own company, bilked it of millions while running it into the ground, and then ratted out the CEO so they could avoid jail time.

74 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:36:53pm

re: #73 Targetpractice

It's a weird working of class envy and idol worship. We're a nation that's come to idolize an ideal, that any person can work himself up to being one of "the elite." That a kid can, through hard work and sacrifice, find himself one day at the top of a Fortune 500 company.

Thing is, over the last century, the Fortune 500's used their money to stack the deck in their favor. So now that hardworking kid finds himself fired at the age of 50 with a 401K stuffed with company stock that's only good as toilet paper because the bastards at the top bet against their own company, bilked it of millions while running it into the ground, and then ratted out the CEO so they could avoid jail time.

Yeah that sounds right. What bugs me in recent years is we've seen the average CEO salary's skyrocket while the average worker has not seen the same growth. I think I would be less hostile to big business if that growth had occurred. And I have to admit outright greed is something that rubs me the wrong way.

75 AK-47%  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:37:58pm

And the legacy of Calvinism: wealth as an outward sign of inner grace. A great way of stuffing that camel through the eye of the needle. We still harbor the notion that the Rich are somehow morally superior to us.

76 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:40:17pm

re: #75 Expand Your Ground

And the legacy of Calvinism: wealth as an outward sign of inner grace. A great way of stuffing that camel through the eye of the needle. We still harbor the notion that the Rich are somehow morally superior to us.

Not just that but that the poor and less off are somehow morally inferior and thus have not been blessed. It's as Targetpractice said a weird combination of class envy and idol worship.

77 Targetpractice  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:43:51pm

re: #74 HappyWarrior

Yeah that sounds right. What bugs me in recent years is we've seen the average CEO salary's skyrocket while the average worker has not seen the same growth. I think I would be less hostile to big business if that growth had occurred. And I have to admit outright greed is something that rubs me the wrong way.

That's because we're all frogs that have been slowly boiled. Pay stagnated, but taxes also dropped like a fucking rock, so we didn't notice right away. By the time that we did, we started getting our stores flooded with cheap shit made overseas, so we got the impression that the dollar still went pretty far. At the same time, companies started slowly stripping benefits away from us, but assured us that it was "temporary," just til the company got through a dry spell, and that we'd get it back when things got better.

Now we're a whole country with a mutated strain of Stockholm Syndrome, so fucking used to the idea of having everything that our ancestors fought and bled for slowly stripped from us that we've become numb to the experience. We're on course for the Gilded Age and are assuring ourselves it's fine, because it means we'll still have jobs.

78 AK-47%  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:47:15pm

And we have come to assume that having both parents putting in 60-hour weeks to support their families is the norm...

79 Targetpractice  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:54:35pm

re: #78 Expand Your Ground

And we have come to assume that having both parents putting in 60-hour weeks to support their families is the norm...

Yeah, that's one thing that always gets me, the idealized version of the 1950s, where mommy kept the home while daddy brought home the bacon. They forget that that prosperity, that ability to keep a middle class living standard on a single paycheck, was thanks to unions fighting for things like decent pay and profit sharing.

80 freetoken  Tue, Jun 5, 2012 11:57:38pm

At 99.9% in, the fat lady has sung.

And here was her tune:

MP3 Audio
81 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 12:02:12am

re: #78 Expand Your Ground

And we have come to assume that having both parents putting in 60-hour weeks to support their families is the norm...

And we have come to see ADHD, obesity, autism and sundry behavioral/social disorders among young people as the norm...

Rick Santorum insists that the causality runs the other way: our economic decline is related to the moral decline pricipitated by the sexual and social revolutions starting in the 60's.

82 Kragar  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 12:20:56am

re: #81 Expand Your Ground

And we have come to see ADHD, obesity, and sudry behavioral/social disorders among young people as the norm...

Rick Santorum insists that the causality runs the other way: our economic decline is related to the moral decline pricipitated by the sexual and social revolutions starting in the 60's.

As opposed to our economic decline being because of the fundamentalist backlash to increasing freedoms for historically oppressed groups.

83 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 12:23:50am

And all those feminism-crazed mothers abandoning their families to pursue glamouors careers consisting of working two minimum-wage jobs to help make the mortgage payments...

84 freetoken  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:26:03am

Monk:

MP3 Audio
85 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:31:54am

re: #84 freetoken

Monk:

[Embedded content]

Fish

Image: 96e.jpg

86 researchok  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:38:23am

Morning, all

87 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:39:27am

re: #86 researchok

Morning, all

You're late

And you better have brought muffins!

88 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:42:19am

re: #87 sattv4u2

You're late

And you better have brought muffins!

I brought the muffin tops!

89 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:43:16am

re: #88 Expand Your Ground

I brought the muffin tops!

Image: muffin-top-Seinfeld.jpg

90 researchok  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:48:01am

re: #87 sattv4u2

Prune or 88 grain?
/

91 Kragar  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:48:54am

Orly Taitz came in 5th in CA, with 3.1% of the vote.

106,348 people actually voted for her.

92 researchok  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:50:10am

re: #80 freetoken

The fat lady has sung indeed.

I expected a much closer race.

93 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 1:54:51am

re: #92 researchok

The fat lady has sung indeed.

I expected a much closer race.

Why?

The only poll that had it 'close" was the PPP poll (Walker +3) and they're very dem leaning

[Link: www.realclearpolitics.com...]

94 prairiefire  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:01:08am

My mom in law is watching a Korean soap opera on TV. There are ads for Volcano pot vaporisers on TV in Hawaii.

95 researchok  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:01:31am

re: #93 sattv4u2

Because if I'm not mistaken, he won by a wider margin now than he did when he was first elected.

Oner might have expected some buyers remorse (politicians never deliver everything they promise and Walker has taken a hell of a beating), so to speak but there clearly was none.

I suspect they'll be analyzing this for a long time to come.

My thoughts center around the idea that has been floated- it was an abuse of the recall system- you recall if there was a clear abuse of the system or crime and the unions overplayed their hands.

Still, the real reasons for the loss will best be determined by the people who live there.

96 researchok  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:03:23am

re: #94 prairiefire

We get guys who scream at you in trying to sell state quarters.

97 prairiefire  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:09:55am

re: #95 researchok

People in general don't like recall elections. They think they're not fair.

98 freetoken  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:11:25am

re: #95 researchok

Because if I'm not mistaken, he won by a wider margin now than he did when he was first elected.

The final percentages are very similar to 2010.

99 prairiefire  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:15:40am

re: #86 researchok

Morning, all

Night, youse guys.

100 researchok  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:16:01am

re: #97 prairiefire

Certainly not for political reasons, anyway.

Recalls were meant to recall deliberate malfeasance, corruption, etc.

101 researchok  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:28:57am

The Wisconsin Voter: Walker vs. Barrett: The sequel was a replay of the original

In the end, after all the ground-breaking rancor and searing conflict and mind-boggling money and crushing attention, Scott Walker’s 2012 victory for governor looked a lot like his 2010 victory for governor.

Just as he did against Democrat Tom Barrett in 2010:

Walker won men and lost women.

He lost voters under 30 and won every other age group.

He won independents and lost moderates.

He lost college grads and won voters without a college degree.

He lost union households badly.

He lost lower-income voters and won everyone else.

He won almost all Republicans and lost almost all Democrats.

He won rural and suburban voters and lost urban voters.

The same two candidates meet in two elections, separated by 19 months and a consuming political inferno.

And history repeats itself. The chart below shows how little change there was in Walker's performance with different kinds of voters between the two elections...

This was a volatile conflict but not a volatile electorate. Instead, voters showed every sign of being fixed in place when it came to their views of Walker. According to the exit polls Tuesday, only 8% of voters decided their vote in the last few days of the election. In Wisconsin’s GOP presidential primary two months earlier, 36 % of voters made up their minds in the last few days...

102 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:51:37am

re: #101 researchok

There was an awful lot of time, energy, money, and angst spent just to recreate the 2010 results and have it all decided within an hour of the polls closing.

For the record, I'm claiming the betting pool.

103 researchok  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:52:46am

Voters in California Appear to Approve Pension Cuts

As Wisconsin residents voted on Tuesday not to recall Gov. Scott Walker — who has become an enemy of labor unions nationwide — two California cities dealt blows of their own to organized labor.

In both San Diego and San Jose, voters appeared to overwhelmingly approve ballot initiatives designed to help balance ailing municipal budgets by cutting retirement benefits for city workers.

Around 70 percent of San Jose voters favored the pension reform measure, with almost 80 percent of precincts reporting. In San Diego, 67 percent had supported a similar pension reform measure, with more than 65 percent of precincts reporting.

104 researchok  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:55:57am

re: #102 RogueOne

You have to wonder if the money, PR, media coverage, outside influence amounted to anything more than a distraction.

The do over was a repeat of 2010.

No doubt the fund raisers did well.

105 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 2:56:50am

re: #103 researchok
iirc, it's not "pension cuts" as much as it is moving from a pension based system to a 401k system, similar to what many in the private sector have done

When I started with this company 14 years ago we had a "pension plan". Five years and two owners later we're now in a 401k plan

106 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:00:17am

re: #104 researchok

That's true. On the positive side there are a lot of ad agencies and media companies that made a lot of money and they have one more to go this year. I am a little surprised at the turnout, it was a bit higher than I expected.

107 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:01:53am

Howdy Honcos!

Looks like the President chose wisely not getting overly involved in the recall election. Hmmmm

108 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:02:47am

re: #94 prairiefire

My mom in law is watching a Korean soap opera on TV. There are ads for Volcano pot vaporisers on TV in Hawaii.

no shit :D

109 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:03:16am

re: #107 Darth Vader Gargoyle

I've been asking about you. You back from your tour or did they leave you in Vietnam to re-open that naval base?

110 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:03:37am

re: #81 Expand Your Ground

And we have come to see ADHD, obesity, autism and sundry behavioral/social disorders among young people as the norm...

Rick Santorum insists that the causality runs the other way: our economic decline is related to the moral decline pricipitated by the sexual and social revolutions starting in the 60's.

Apparently rock and roll is a genetic disease, who knew

111 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:04:10am

re: #78 Expand Your Ground

And we have come to assume that having both parents putting in 60-hour weeks to support their families is the norm...

+1

112 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:05:38am

re: #109 RogueOne

I've been asking about you. You back from your tour or did they leave you in Vietnam to re-open that naval base?

I've been back for a while, wrapping up our final Industry study report and a National Security Strategy Exercise to wrap up the year. Graduation is tomorrow. I've been lurking some, but am taking a little bread from the politics, plenty more to enjoy in the next few months...Hope all is well with you guys!

113 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:06:49am

Everyone see the video of the lady slapping Tom Barrett after his concession speech? Supossedly she was upset because he conceded while "people were still voting"....He gave the speech 2 hours after the polls closed, who did she think was still voting?

114 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:07:25am

re: #113 RogueOne

Everyone see the video of the lady slapping Tom Barrett after his concession speech? Supossedly she was upset because he conceded while "people were still voting"...He gave the speech 2 hours after the polls closed, who did she think was still voting?

Some of the UAW buses were late from Michigan...

115 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:08:10am

re: #75 Expand Your Ground

And the legacy of Calvinism: wealth as an outward sign of inner grace. A great way of stuffing that camel through the eye of the needle. We still harbor the notion that the Rich are somehow morally superior to us.

if wealth is an outward sign of inner grace, then why do bands so often suck when they get rich

116 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:10:35am

re: #115 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]

Wealth can be a sign of inner grace, as poverty can be a sign of a sinful, dissolute life. But life (and the Bible itself) is full of examples to the contrary.

117 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:11:43am

I know it's a vain hope, but I really do hope that, if the Democrats take away any lessons from last night's debacle, one of them is that "Go along to get along" is a losing campaign message. And pissing on your biggest supporters is a great way to kill whatever enthusiasm remained for your candidacy.

118 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:12:58am

re: #113 RogueOne

Everyone see the video of the lady slapping Tom Barrett after his concession speech? Supossedly she was upset because he conceded while "people were still voting"...He gave the speech 2 hours after the polls closed, who did she think was still voting?

Have you no clue as to how long it takes to get a dead corpse to the polls?

There's the digging up,,, the make-up,,, the whole transportation kerfuffle (car,, bus ,, hearse ,,)

119 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:14:44am

re: #114 Darth Vader Gargoyle

Some of the UAW buses were late from Michigan...

They got a phone call telling them since they signed the recall they didn't really need to get there early....

120 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:17:34am

re: #119 RogueOne

They got a phone call telling them since they signed the recall they didn't really need to get there early...

That, and they were waiting for the Nigerian Prince to transfer them those funds!

121 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:19:08am

re: #117 Targetpractice

I'm not sure what you mean there. Are you talking about Barrett and collective bargaining?

122 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:25:55am

re: #121 RogueOne

I'm not sure what you mean there. Are you talking about Barrett and collective bargaining?

What I'm talking about is Barrett seeming to think that the problem in Wisconsin was the recall itself, rather than Walker's actions. That people were angry that it was going on rather than that Walker had so incensed people with anti-union actions that they felt a recall was warranted. And then stood on-stage and told folks that he wasn't beholden to the unions, a kick in the teeth at the worst time he could afford it.

123 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:29:17am

Local reality tv celebrity gets 5 years:

MTV's 'Teen Mom' Amber Portwood sentenced to 5 years in prison
[Link: www.indystar.com...]

The Madison County woman made famous by MTV’s “Teen Mom” reality show was sentenced to prison today for violating terms of a plea agreement.

Amber Portwood, 22, first was arrested in 2010 after beating up her boyfriend, Gary Shirley. Charged with felony counts of domestic violence, she managed to avoid jail time when a judge gave her a two-year suspended sentence and probation.

Last December, however, she was arrested again after probation officers discovered drugs in her home for which she had no prescriptions. Though she spent more than a month in jail while her attorney worked out a plea deal, she ultimately agreed to participate in a drug rehab program that helped her avoid any further time behind bars.

Seems excessive. She got 2 years probation for slapping her boyfriend on camera. My brothers ex walked into a bar, broke a glass, and stabbed him in front of a dozen witnesses and managed to get deferment.

124 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:32:42am

Later Lizards! Off to enjoy the day.

My friend is being promoted to CDR/05 (she is a Muslim and hasn't even killed anyone that I know of//) at 11:00 and then off to JR Cigars to work on filling the humidor I got from SWMBO for graduation.

125 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:34:26am

re: #124 Darth Vader Gargoyle

Good "seeing" you again

126 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:41:05am

re: #123 RogueOne

Seems excessive. She got 2 years probation for slapping her boyfriend on camera.

Don't know if it's the case here, but sometimes thats due to testimony showing the person has a pattern of such behaviour

127 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:41:27am

Few conclusions that I personally have come to in light of last night:

1. Tom Barrett is not cut out for any office higher than mayor, at least not so long as he thinks that the people want a milquetoast to run for office.
2. That what happened was not a referendum on whether Walker deserves to remain in office so much as a poll on whether people agree with recall elections, the result being a resounding "No."
3. Assuming he's not indicted in the John Doe investigation between now and August, Scott Walker has secured himself the keynote address spot at the Republican National Convention.
4. That we officially live in a post-Citizens United democracy, which is one that will be dominated (at least in the immediate future) by corporate money.

128 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:42:50am

re: #126 sattv4u2

They put her on probation for hitting him which allowed them to search her house whenever they felt like it. That's how they got her on the prescription drug charges. She's obviously a messed up young woman, I'm not seeing how 5 years behind bars is really going to help anyone here.

129 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:45:08am

re: #128 RogueOne

They put her on probation for hitting him which allowed them to search her house whenever they felt like it. That's how they got her on the prescription drug charges. She's obviously a messed up young woman, I'm not seeing how 5 years behind bars is really going to help anyone here.

Sorry ,, didn't open/ read the link,, but from the snippet you posted

Though she spent more than a month in jail while her attorney worked out a plea deal, she ultimately agreed to participate in a drug rehab program that helped her avoid any further time behind bars.

130 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:45:58am

re: #128 RogueOne

re: #129 sattv4u2

Does it say she's in for 5 in the article?

(sorry ,,,here at work and I'm in the middle of writing a report)

131 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:49:43am

re: #130 sattv4u2

yeah. They caught her with the drugs, put her in what they call "drug court" around here and she failed out. I have a former employee that was about to graduate the drug program when he got pulled over for a seat belt violation while taking his dad, in his dads truck, to a doctors appointment. They searched the truck, since he was on probation, and found one of the old mans pills. They revoked his probation and put him in jail for 6 months before a judge finally tossed it and released him.

132 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:53:50am

re: #127 Targetpractice

The hopeful notes are:

1. It also shows the limitations of corporate money-- Barrett really wasn't a very good candidate, people don't like recall elections, and the right-wing really has its ground game together. Even with all that stacked up, the difference was 6%.

2. Walker in office and being indicted, if he is, is more politically useful than him out of office. Whether this is part of why the national Democrats didn't commit more resources, I don't know, but it has the possibility of being a big story later.

3. The GOP isn't very magnanimous in victory, and will probably pull some real dick moves in the afterglow of this.

133 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:54:13am

re: #131 RogueOne

Yeah ,, 5 years is excessive, at least at 1st glance

BUT ,,,

Still, Portwood likely would have received additional opportunities to get back on track, the prosecutor said.

“Relapse is part of the pharmacology of treatment,” Cummings said. “But she just said she couldn’t do it and she wanted out of the program. The consequence for opting out was jail time. That already had been determined.”

5 years, still excessive imho,, BUT she opted out of the treatment program knowing that if she didn't stay in there would be jail time

134 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:56:24am

For anyone still following the Kimberlin brouhaha:

Forgetting Brandenburg And The Rule of Law: Brett Kimberlin Censorship-Through-Lawfare Update
[Link: www.popehat.com...]

The day of the arrest, it wasn't clear why Aaron had been arrested...Now it's clearer. It appears that Brett Kimberlin sought a new peace order after Everyone Blog About Brett Kimberlin day and contrived to have Aaron arrested on that when he came to court on May 29th. The order — provided and analyzed by David Hogberg — is shockingly conclusory and vague. Yet even with that vagueness, it's clear that Kimberlin is explicitly seeking to have Aaron prohibited from discussing Kimberlin, and equally clear that a unprincipled and limp judiciary uncritically acquiesced.
...
3. This will not stand: People aren't accepting Judge Vaughey's ruling meekly. It will be fought. It will be overcome. First Amendment demigod Eugene Volokh is assisting. I'm doing what modest things I can to round up more help. People are organizing, writing more, defying Kimberlin and his clan.

Here is the Volokh announcement.
[Link: volokh.com...]

135 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:57:30am

re: #133 sattv4u2

Yep, like I said, she's a messed up young woman.

136 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:57:47am

re: #134 RogueOne

"STILL"!?!?

I never STARTED!!!

137 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:58:21am

re: #135 RogueOne

Yep, like I said, she's a messed up young woman.

Amen to that

Hope she does get some help

138 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:59:13am

re: #136 sattv4u2

Kimberlin is still a well known entity around here. He spent 12 years behind bars for blowing people up, the crazy immature reality tv star gets 5 for having pills in her system.....

139 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 3:59:42am

re: #132 Obdicut

The hopeful notes are:

1. It also shows the limitations of corporate money-- Barrett really wasn't a very good candidate, people don't like recall elections, and the right-wing really has its ground game together. Even with all that stacked up, the difference was 6%.

And that's with what will likely be far higher turnout than we'll see in Wisconsin in November. Whether that bodes ill for the GOP or not remains to be seen.

2. Walker in office and being indicted, if he is, is more politically useful than him out of office. Whether this is part of why the national Democrats didn't commit more resources, I don't know, but it has the possibility of being a big story later.

True enough, which is why I remain somewhat optimistic that his recent transferring of campaign funds to a defense fund hints that an indictment is in the making.

3. The GOP isn't very magnanimous in victory, and will probably pull some real dick moves in the afterglow of this.

If the Drudge frontpage is any indication, the GOP's preparing to go out there and declare to folks that Wisconsin is the beginning of the end for Obama. You know, despite polls showing that he enjoys just as big an advantage over Romney in the state as Walker did over Barrett.

140 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:01:00am

re: #137 sattv4u2

In fairness to the system the "drug court" thing has a pretty good success rate from what I can tell. If you manage to keep yourself clean, and they test you multiple times a week, they clear your record and keep you out of jail. OTOH, it's a great way for the city to make a lot of money off of these people. They have to pay for everything which includes classes, counseling, testing, and probation fees.

141 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:05:58am

re: #140 RogueOne

In fairness to the system the "drug court" thing has a pretty good success rate from what I can tell. If you manage to keep yourself clean, and they test you multiple times a week, they clear your record and keep you out of jail. OTOH, it's a great way for the city to make a lot of money off of these people. They have to pay for everything which includes classes, counseling, testing, and probation fees.

from your article

Madison County Circuit Judge David Happe sentenced Portwood to five years in prison. Under Indiana law, Cummings said, she can reduce that time to two and a half years through proper conduct while incarcerated.

So like I said,,, hopefully she'll wake up and accept the help offered

142 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:06:11am

re: #132 Obdicut

The hopeful notes are:

1......... Even with all that stacked up, the difference was 6%.
....

You guys can go ahead and send your money...:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

If there were a pool I'd have tried to grab the block Walker by 6.

143 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:06:49am

re: #139 Targetpractice

I'm a political realist. Political systems can collapse, or can get into very bad, very scary places, even in a democracy, for a long time. As dysfunctional as the US is, we've actually had it pretty good, governmentally, for a long run; we didn't have shit like Italy's new-government-every-five weeks, or Japan's 38 years of one-party domination after WWII, or their continuing debacles since then.

It may be that the GOP increases, rather than decreases, its control. It can really fuck shit up, probably put us into another depression, etc. But it can't last very long; the demographics are working against it. They've bet everything on white, and no matter what they try to do about immigration, about disenfranchisement, the numbers will out and the GOP will be reduced to a regional party. They can still be the same obstructionist assholes they are now, of course, and still sink our economy, but there's no possibility of long-term one-party rule from the GOP.

And hell, worldwide depression is good for one thing: It gives us slightly more time to deal with AGW. Now there's a thin silver lining if ever there was one.

144 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:07:14am

re: #142 RogueOne

Send money where, for what?

145 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:07:35am

re: #144 Obdicut

I won the pool, someone owes me beer money///

146 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:08:02am

re: #145 RogueOne

I won the pool, someone owes me beer money///

Oh, you're pretending that I bet that Barrett would win. I see.

147 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:08:10am

re: #145 RogueOne

I won the pool, someone owes me beer money///

As usual, you're all wet!!
/

148 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:08:35am

re: #146 Obdicut

No, I called it by 6 yesterday morning.

149 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:09:15am

re: #148 RogueOne

No, I called it by 6 yesterday morning.

You get up early!
/

150 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:09:49am

re: #148 RogueOne

No, I called it by 6 yesterday morning.

Yes, but I didn't call it for anyone, so what are you talking about?

151 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:10:03am

{sigh}

152 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:10:07am

re: #149 sattv4u2

You get up early!
/

Speaking of which, I need to get going. I'm taking off to Lebanon today. Lebanon, IN.

153 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:10:19am

re: #145 RogueOne

I won the pool, someone owes me beer money///

Sorry man, I'm tapped out til Friday. You accept an IOU?

//

154 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:10:51am

re: #150 Obdicut

Yes, but I didn't call it for anyone, so what are you talking about?

I didn't mention you, I was only pointing out that I called it by 6 yesterday and that's how it ended. I'm psychic, remember?//

155 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:11:04am

re: #152 RogueOne

Speaking of which, I need to get going. I'm taking off to Lebanon today. Lebanon, IN.

I've been to the ones in New Hampshire, Tennessee and Ohio ,, does that count??

156 RogueOne  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:11:38am

k. I'm gone. If anyone wants a palm reading later I'll be back.

157 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:12:32am

re: #154 RogueOne

You responded to me, saying "You guys can go ahead and send your money...".

If you were talking to me, and didn't mean me when you said 'you', then congrats on your election prediction, but you need to brush up on the ol' logic and language stuff.

158 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:16:54am

re: #157 Obdicut

he was responding too
Even with all that stacked up, the difference was 6%.

In that he predicted 6%, he responded to your post,, specifically that ONE phrase in that post

You just happened to be the one that brought that number up

159 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:17:50am

re: #143 Obdicut

Oh, I'm not overly worried right now. Personally, I'm expecting to see the GOP do what they do best in the next few days, which is to overstate the importance of their "victory" and then get their asses spanked when they overreach. Right now, it looks very possible that the Democrats just took a one-seat majority in the state Senate, which was one of the hopes folks had if Walker prevailed.

The Koch's and their fellow travelers just shoveled millions into an election that saw Walker expand his win over Barrett by a single percentage point. Personally, I consider that fucking hilarious.

160 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:19:49am

re: #158 sattv4u2

What could I win for predicting that you'd obtusely miss the point? Hell, I could predict that daily, and win big. I'm rich!

161 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:20:17am

re: #160 Obdicut

What could I win for predicting that you'd obtusely miss the point? Hell, I could predict that daily, and win big. I'm rich!

{sigh}

162 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:21:29am

re: #159 Targetpractice

I really am considering starting up some sort of phony conservative think-tank thingy just to rake in some of this sweet cash. The problem is, I can't figure out how to make it work. I could make a think tank that spouted ludicrous, offensive bullshit, but that doesn't appear to actually be a negative in modern GOP circles. It's hard to parody or subvert people who are without irony and without history.

163 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:22:22am

re: #161 sattv4u2

I predict you will continue to misuse commas in a really bizarre way.

164 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:24:18am

re: #163 Obdicut

I predict you will continue to misuse commas in a really bizarre way.

,, what,,, do ,, you ,, win???

165 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:25:18am

re: #164 sattv4u2

According to Rogue, you need to send me money now.

166 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:25:40am

Think I'm gonna try to grab a short nap, maybe things will make more sense then. BBL.

167 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:26:30am

Crotchety but correct:


Your Idiot Kid Doesn't Need to Watch Movies All Day

Frankly speaking-- and I don't care who you are, really-- nothing you're doing beside your parenting is so important that you need to put your child's development on hold day in and day out. Nothing you are doing at work or anywhere else in your life is so important that you have to put your child in some kind of fuck-off gadget stasis for their formative years. You are not that important. Your child is actually more important than you, in case you forgot. Get the fuck off of Facebook or Classmates.com and talk to your shitty kid.

Parents, I must ask: When does it become just too much to be the same parent that every generation previous to you had been? When did you give up and stop trying to live up to the same standard? At which point exactly did you just throw in the towel and get the iPod Touch because you can't stand answering questions about why planes fly or how cars work or whatever else curious, brilliant children ask? When did it become easier to just put on a movie and not talk to them?

Obviously you can parent how you want, just keep in mind that no great person in the future will ever say, "Yeah, as a kid I watched the same movies over and over for years. Want to hear me recite Cars?

168 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:26:53am

re: #165 Obdicut

According to Rogue, you need to send me money now.

Sure

Just give me your bank account info
Routing number
Account number
password!

169 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:27:13am

Good morning, all.

While Governor Doe still has a job this morning, it would appear that over in the 21st state senate district, one his henchmen is in need of a government appointment. Gridlock is not my preferred outcome but if it keeps Governor Doe from doing anymore damage to my son's education and health care, well, it'll do.

How's everyone else doing?

170 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:27:48am

re: #168 sattv4u2

I'll take my payment in the form of the worst, most obvious attempts at jokes I've ever seen. So you've actually already paid in advance.

171 sattv4u2  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:32:06am

re: #170 Obdicut

I'll take my payment in the form of the worst, most obvious attempts at jokes I've ever seen. So you've actually already paid in advance.

Then why did you ask me for the money??

Double dipping??

Youz twicksy!!!

172 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:33:11am

re: #169 William Barnett-Lewis

I'm making sure no child can possibly use the toy I'm working on to sound out any naughty words, because god forbid children show the slightest interest in sexuality. Making sex into something that only adults get to talk about and is at once portrayed as scary and awesome will surely curtail kid's interests in it and make sure they grow up as healthy adults.

/

173 harlequinade  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:35:05am

I just read this about the election

Some, miserable, quotes:

"But while the liberals had anger on their side, Walker's conservative supporters had serious money, bringing in tens of millions of dollars from outside the state, and big-name endorsements from fellow GOP governors Nikki Hayley, Chris Christie and Bobby Jindal.

It helped the Republicans to outspend their Democratic rivals by a factor of eight to one: the election was so closely fought, that more than $60m was poured into the race - the vast majority of it by the Republicans and their supporters.

Walker managed to get round rules capping the amount he could raise from supporters by raking in tens of millions of dollars from outside the state. Key donors included Sheldon Adelson, the casino mogul who bankrolled Newt Gingrich through the primaries, and Rick Santorum's erstwhile money-man, Foster Friess."

And, the conclusion:
"Spending serious cash - or rather, spending way more serious cash than your rival, brings results.

That was the pattern of the Republican primaries, as the financial juggernaut of the Romney campaign eventually flattened everything in its path: that has been the pattern in Wisconsin.

It's a depressing message, but an enduring one: if you raise it, they will come."

174 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:37:28am

re: #173 harlequinade

As I phrased it last night,

Wisconsin: 1848 - 2012. Killed by Citizens United.

175 harlequinade  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:45:43am

re: #174 William Barnett-Lewis

I watch all this from overseas, I'm English living in Denmark and working in Sweden. I know more about the US political scene than any of the multiple places I live.

I'm watching Parliament collapse over the Murdoch/phone hacking affair, and money and politics are a terrible mix.

Watching this presidential race is really depressing.

176 alpuz  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 4:55:09am

Welp - depressing day for me here in Wisconsin. I get to enjoy the smug reactions of some of my 'conservative' family and acquaintances for the next few months. There was a robin perched on my Tom Barrett sign as I looked out my front door this morning. Hopefully that's some sort of good sign.

177 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:28:34am

re: #175 harlequinade

I watch all this from overseas, I'm English living in Denmark and working in Sweden. I know more about the US political scene than any of the multiple places I live.

I'm watching Parliament collapse over the Murdoch/phone hacking affair, and money and politics are a terrible mix.

Watching this presidential race is really depressing.

I am an expat American living in Germany, still registered to vote in Arizona, my last state of legal residence. And it is depressing following natinal politics, and even more depressing seeing what is happening in Arizona.

Kinda glad that I get it from a distance...

178 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:38:22am

These guys have just out-Newted Gingrich:

Dutchmen on Mars?

179 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:39:52am

re: #178 Expand Your Ground

They're just going there so they can write "Belgium Sucks" in giant letters on the surface.

180 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:40:35am

Hope they don't bump into any Germans there...

181 Decatur Deb  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:40:55am

re: #178 Expand Your Ground

These guys have just out-Newted Gingrich:

Dutchemn on Mars?

We had a counter-Wisconsin thread up on that last night, but it seems to have rolled off the line-up.

182 S.D.  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:43:09am

So, Basically, he thinks (Like most of the White Wing) that he should harass people with no consequences to his own actions.

Remember this when dealing with wackos:

“Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

183 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:43:41am

Morning Lizardim. So, it looks like scumsucker Scott Walker remains, at least pending the conclusion of the criminal investigation. I'm sure the derp masters are crowing about it this morning. I would remind them that Walker may have won, but they're still a bunch of drooling retards.

184 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:47:22am

re: #183 thedopefishlives

Most kids with Down Syndromes are pretty nice.

185 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:47:27am

Sergey...

Russian parliament backs huge protest fines

Russia's upper house of parliament has voted through a controversial bill which sharply increases fines for breaking laws governing protests.

The bill boosts fines for violations from the current maximum 5,000 roubles (£99; $152) to 300,000 for participants and 600,000 for organisers.

The legislation was backed by 132 senators on Wednesday, with one voting against and one abstaining.

It now just has to be signed off on by President Vladimir Putin...

186 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:51:08am

re: #185 Gus

From an article on the topic:

"For comparison, violating safety precautions in designing, building, and using nuclear energy facilities that could cause danger or radioactive contagion is punishable by a fine of 200,000 rubles ($6,000)."

So we see how Putin views the threat from policial dissent.

187 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:52:26am

re: #186 Expand Your Ground

From an article on the topic:

"For comparison, violating safety precautions in designing, building, and using nuclear energy facilities that could cause danger or radioactive contagion is punishable by a fine of 200,000 rubles ($6,000)."

So we see how Putin views the threat from policial dissent.

Explains why Putin is popular with wingnuts.

188 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:53:18am

re: #185 Gus

Sergey...

Russian parliament backs huge protest fines

Shh!!! You'll give Scooter ideas!

189 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:53:31am

re: #187 Gus

Explains why Putin is popular with wingnuts.

Law and Order.

190 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:53:49am

re: #184 Obdicut

Most kids with Down Syndromes are pretty nice.

I try not to use the word "retard" when referring to people with a legitimate mental handicap. Self-inflicted wounds, on the other hand.

191 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 5:56:01am

re: #185 Gus

Still sliding towards fascism, little by little.

192 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:00:36am

re: #191 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

Still sliding towards fascism, little by little.

How did you like our little election last night? The wingnuts think they're going to take over the universe this morning. Just because of one expected win in some state next to Minnesota. ;)

193 Interesting Times  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:01:12am

Wow, Wisconsin sure picked a winner!

The Heartland Institute’s Special Guest: Scott Walker

Image: heartland_walker.png

Gov. Scott Walker (R-WI) is scheduled to be the keynote speaker for the Heartland Institute’s benefit dinner in August, 2012. Heartland has lost more than $1 million in expected corporate funding in the wake of public outrage over its climate denial, reducing president Joe Bast to beg for more financial support. Walker is a perfect fit for the anti-science extremists at Heartland — like them, he’s Koch-funded global warming conspiracy theorist. Walker has attacked investment in high-speed rail, wind power, and even recycling.

194 darthstar  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:02:29am

My kind of cop.

Image: 182498_10151000041115236_512180235_12379701_1605438041_n.jpg

195 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:03:26am

re: #105 sattv4u2

iirc, it's not "pension cuts" as much as it is moving from a pension based system to a 401k system, similar to what many in the private sector have done

When I started with this company 14 years ago we had a "pension plan". Five years and two owners later we're now in a 401k plan

And one factor in having that switch is that depending on the plan the individual worker has a lot more influence over the investment options of his 401K over the pension plan; e.g. in my old one I had an option of investing in company stock and avoided it - since I figured if the company was doing well I would be getting a bonus. And someone alluded in an earlier comment about how easily pension plans can be abused by their managers for short-term gain for themselves.

196 Decatur Deb  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:04:56am

re: #192 Gus

How did you like our little election last night? The wingnuts think they're going to take over the universe this morning. Just because of one expected win in some state next to Minnesota. ;)

Bottom line--TPGOP pockets are a little emptier, and Wisconsin is slightly less badly governed/legislated than it was yesterday. It would be nice if liberals nationally took the greater task to heart.

197 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:06:34am

re: #127 Targetpractice

Few conclusions that I personally have come to in light of last night:

1. Tom Barrett is not cut out for any office higher than mayor, at least not so long as he thinks that the people want a milquetoast to run for office.
2. That what happened was not a referendum on whether Walker deserves to remain in office so much as a poll on whether people agree with recall elections, the result being a resounding "No."
3. Assuming he's not indicted in the John Doe investigation between now and August, Scott Walker has secured himself the keynote address spot at the Republican National Convention.
4. That we officially live in a post-Citizens United democracy, which is one that will be dominated (at least in the immediate future) by corporate money.

So you're saying that George, Abraham, and Benjamin are now the most influential figures in United States politics?

198 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:06:42am

re: #192 Gus

That was sad, but it's small raisins compared to November. So I don't focus on it.

199 Decatur Deb  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:09:45am

re: #197 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

So you're saying that George, Abraham, and Benjamin are now the most influential figures in United States politics?

Same as it ever was.

Youtube Video
200 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:13:46am

re: #198 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

That was sad, but it's small raisins compared to November. So I don't focus on it.

Hope they learn from this. A large reason Walker won is because people were voting against the recall. Lots of other issues too including that 38 percent of union households voted for Walker according to exit poll.

201 darthstar  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:14:17am

re: #196 Decatur Deb

Bottom line--TPGOP pockets are a little emptier, and Wisconsin is slightly less badly governed/legislated than it was yesterday. It would be nice if liberals nationally took the greater task to heart.

I fear this will only encourage Super PACs to spend more. Funny, you'd think all this money they spend would somehow help the economy. Why don't advertising dollars trickle down?

202 Decatur Deb  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:15:35am

Upside--Walker is now the TPGOP frontrunner for 2016.

203 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:15:42am

re: #200 Gus

Hope they learn from this. A large reason Walker won is because people were voting against the recall. Lots of other issues too including that 38 percent of union households voted for Walker according to exit poll.

How could they vote against their own interests? They are aware that he has explicitly stated that he wants to destroy unions, yes?

204 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:16:26am

re: #200 Gus

Plus Barrett was underfunded.

Anyway, people should not let the small stuff crush them. They tried, they failed, meh. Keep the eyes on the prize.

205 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:17:17am

re: #201 darthstar

A lot of it is vastly overpriced, for one thing, and a lot of it gets outsourced and/or automated.

206 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:18:21am

re: #203 thedopefishlives

How could they vote against their own interests? They are aware that he has explicitly stated that he wants to destroy unions, yes?

Human behavior or society? If it doesn't involved "their union" they don't really think about it?

207 Obdicut  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:18:35am

re: #203 thedopefishlives

Not everyone in a union loves the union. Junior guys in a union don't necessarily support it, since unions are seniority based. Traditionally, a lot of union-busting has started with tapping into that.

And many people were just voting against the recall itself. I have mixed feelings about recalls, personally.

208 darthstar  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:19:13am

Ron Jeremy - Peta spokesman. That man was a star.

[Link: www.peta.xxx...]

First page semi-safe for work.

209 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:19:34am

re: #204 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

Plus Barrett was underfunded.

Anyway, people should not let the small stuff crush them. They tried, they failed, meh. Keep the eyes on the prize.

Yep. I barely even saw or heard about Barrett until the last couple of weeks. He was like Wisconsin's best kept secret.

210 Eventual Carrion  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:20:07am

re: #203 thedopefishlives

How could they vote against their own interests? They are aware that he has explicitly stated that he wants to destroy unions, yes?

Because you don't know what you've got 'till it's gone. Too many people think that the way things are now with employment are the way they have always been (vacation, weekends, etc). They will not get mad until all that is taken away and they finally (possibly) wise up. Or they will just continue to be ignorant or brainwashed into believing that it was all the unions fault that they are ion this mess rather than the exact opposite. When that happen we will see how the Citizens truly unite.

211 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:20:09am

re: #197 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

So you're saying that George, Abraham, and Benjamin are now the most influential figures in United States politics?

Nope, Alex and Andy are more important.

212 darthstar  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:20:47am

re: #205 Obdicut

A lot of it is vastly overpriced, for one thing, and a lot of it gets outsourced and/or automated.

I was being semi-rhetorical. Rupert Murdoch isn't going to create jobs because of election money. He's getting back far more than he's donating.

213 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:21:21am

People showed enthusiasm for Walker (for whatever reason). Will they show it for Tofu? No, but they can show it against Obama. I expect a big R turnout in the general elections. And somehow I suspect that many of the 2008 Obama voters won't be enthusiastic 2012 Obama voters. Esp. if Romney does not commit McCain's radical VP mistake.

214 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:23:08am

re: #191 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

Still sliding towards fascism, little by little.

Is if it ever left. It just went into hiding a while there to give the people a taste of chaos so they would welcome the Iron Hand again....

215 harlequinade  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:27:28am

re: #214 Expand Your Ground

Have we seen the 2045 movement?

216 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:30:03am

re: #127 Targetpractice

Few conclusions that I personally have come to in light of last night:

1. Tom Barrett is not cut out for any office higher than mayor, at least not so long as he thinks that the people want a milquetoast to run for office.

4. That we officially live in a post-Citizens United democracy, which is one that will be dominated (at least in the immediate future) by corporate money.

These two are the most important I think. Barretts anti-gun attitudes also hurt him badly in Northern Wisconsin. We like guns, we like hunting and lots of folks up there deeply fear - rightly or wrongly - he'd try to take that away.

Falk would have been stomped even worse. Vinehout would have done well if she had been properly financed - a Democratic dairy farmer from up north - but the chickenshits at the DNC weren't going to properly finance anyone.

Which brings us to #4 as they need to save every penny for Obama's run this fall because of Citizens United. That single decision will haunt what is left of America for as long as it lingers on.

217 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:33:14am

re: #207 Obdicut

Not everyone in a union loves the union. Junior guys in a union don't necessarily support it, since unions are seniority based. Traditionally, a lot of union-busting has started with tapping into that.

And many people were just voting against the recall itself. I have mixed feelings about recalls, personally.

Plus. The bright side of all this is that Twitter Gulag remains open for business.

//

218 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:33:52am

re: #217 Gus

Plus. The bright side of all this is that Twitter Gulag remains open for business.

//

Like a bunch of drooling wingnut "keyboard artists" could shut down the mighty Twitter Gulag. In their dreams, maybe.

219 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:36:33am

re: #217 Gus

Plus. The bright side of all this is that Twitter Gulag remains open for business.

//

A benefit is that the wire is electrified by default.
//

220 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:40:19am
Youtube Video
221 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:46:42am

re: #215 harlequinade

Have we seen the 2045 movement?

In Putin's Russia, Gulag twitter you!!!

222 lawhawk  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 6:54:39am

The same folks who would complain bitterly about how words are being taken out of context are themselves guilty of using gulag to describe their account suspensions on twitter as though they are equivalent.

It's far more than hyperbole on their part. It's ahistorical and undermines the meaning of the word they choose to associate with - gulag.

These idiots have gotten their accounts suspended -often for spamming, but essentially violating the Twitter TOS (which prohibits various kinds of misconduct). They have no one to blame but themselves, but have chosen to focus their ire on Charles). It's projection at its base, and while it might make them feel better by railing against Charles, their words and deeds only highlight just how off the rails they have gone.

223 lawhawk  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:08:00am

Re: Walker holding off the recall.

I've seen some exit polls that shed light on why he won. It has nothing to do with the GOP or Obama (which exit polls found to still be favored over Romney in November, even as both aren't seen as getting the job done on the economy), but rather that most Wisconsin voters didn't think that a recall was warranted over policy differences/preferences. 60% saw recalls as warranted only in cases of official misconduct. That was the real issue here. Walker came into office saying that he'd change how things were done - and while ending union collective bargaining was a huge change, it's a policy position - not official misconduct.

Sixty percent of Wisconsin voters in today's recall election say recall elections are only appropriate for official misconduct, according to early CBS News exit polls. Twenty-eight percent said they think they are suitable for any reason, while nine percent think they are never appropriate.
Today's recall election in Wisconsin pits Republican Gov. Scott Walker versus Democratic Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett, in a rematch of their 2010 race. According to the early exit polls, 6 percent say they decided on their candidate in the last few days, with 93 percent saying they made up their minds before that.

The recall effort was brought about mainly in response to Walker's plan that restricted collective bargaining rights for public union workers. Today, 52 percent of Wisconsin voters in the early exit polls said they have a favorable view of unions for government workers, while 43 percent have an unfavorable opinion of these unions. Among voters in unions households (public or not), 69 percent view these unions favorably.

On the issue of collective bargaining, 50 percent of Wisconsin voters say they approved of the recent changes to state law that limits collective bargaining for government workers, but 48 percent disapproved of these changes.

Other exit polls break down the consequences going into November further, and it only reinforces the fact that it will be a money battle all the way to the end.

224 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:20:19am

In which Glenn Greenwald throws [another] fit:

Raw Story’s liberal rhetoric
Sliming critics of the President's policies as Terrorist-lovers was once an exclusively right-wing tactic: no more
By Glenn Greenwald

225 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:22:58am

re: #223 lawhawk

Re: Walker holding off the recall.

I've seen some exit polls that shed light on why he won. It has nothing to do with the GOP or Obama (which exit polls found to still be favored over Romney in November, even as both aren't seen as getting the job done on the economy), but rather that most Wisconsin voters didn't think that a recall was warranted over policy differences/preferences. 60% saw recalls as warranted only in cases of official misconduct. That was the real issue here. Walker came into office saying that he'd change how things were done - and while ending union collective bargaining was a huge change, it's a policy position - not official misconduct.

Other exit polls break down the consequences going into November further, and it only reinforces the fact that it will be a money battle all the way to the end.

That's my position- that elected officials should be recalled over misconduct. I really don't like the idea of recalling over policy personally. Not that I would have voted for Walker or someone I disagreed with during a hypothetical recall but I think like impeachment the recall is something that if it exists should be used sparingly and not as a political toy.

226 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:24:38am

Good morning lizards!

Happy D-Day Anniversary :)

227 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:31:02am
228 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:31:34am

re: #227 Gus

Rest in peace, Mr. Bradbury.

229 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:32:48am

Damn. I can remember reading All Summer in a Day in grade school and listening to an audio version of Fahrenheit 451 with a friend on a weekend trip to UVA. Thanks for the books, Ray.

230 Interesting Times  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:38:56am
231 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:41:38am

re: #230 Interesting Times

[Embedded content]

True, but he did get pissed off at Michael Moore ;)

232 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:42:39am

re: #231 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

True, but he did get pissed off at Michael Moore ;)

Hard to believe that someone would get pissed off at Mr. Moore.

//

233 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:43:12am

Ray Bradbury wrote Fahrenheit 451 to protest the technology of television, which he believed would destroy literature.

The novel presents a future American society where books are outlawed.

The novel has been the subject of various interpretations, primarily focusing on the historical role of book burning in suppressing dissenting ideas. Bradbury has stated that the novel is not about censorship, but a story about how television destroys interest in reading literature, which leads to a perception of knowledge as being composed of factoids, partial information devoid of context.

That last line described Teh Intertubez more accurately than TV.

234 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:44:54am

re: #233 Learned Mother of Zion

Internet is much better/more benign than TV in that respect. Besides, it's just a medium. You can't read from TV (well, not in any practicable way.)

235 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:46:08am

re: #234 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

Internet is much better/more benign than TV in that respect. Besides, it's just a medium. You can't read from TV (well, not in any practicable way.)

TV is passive; Internet is interactive.

236 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:50:02am

re: #235 Learned Mother of Zion

TV is passive; Internet is interactive.

TV's problem is exactly the limits of its format - audio-visual pieces. Internet is all that and lots of text. One can choose.

If one chooses wisely, there is still a benefit, like from reading paper stuff. And unwise choices can be made in selecting literature too.

237 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:50:23am

Mad at your candidate? Slap him!

After Wisconsin loss, Barrett supporter slaps him

(CBS News) After a loss in Wisconsin's gubernatorial election Tuesday night, Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett took another blow - literally - when one of his own supporters slapped him.

...According to Sater, she asked Barrett if she could slap him for conceding, and Barrett said he'd rather give her a hug. He leaned down, presumably for the hug, and got socked instead. WISN captured the incident on on video.

"She was upset with the mayor she came up and slapped him, and said, how dare you concede while there are people still trying to vote," Sater said. "This woman, upset about that, and she slapped the mayor. He seemed very stunned by the fact that she had done that."

238 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:51:15am

re: #234 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

Internet is much better/more benign than TV in that respect. Besides, it's just a medium. You can't read from TV (well, not in any practicable way.)

Channel surfing preceded web surfing. ;)

239 Sheila Broflovski  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:52:08am

re: #236 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

TV's problem is exactly the limits of its format - audio-visual pieces. Internet is all that and lots of text. One can choose.

If one chooses wisely, there is still a benefit, like from reading paper stuff. And unwise choices can be made in selecting literature too.

I like to watch TV after a long hard day of surfing the Internet. :)

240 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:56:40am

re: #227 Gus

That sucks. Fahrenheit 451 is still one of my favorites among the required reading from my school days. I have a copy laying somewhere about the house.

241 dragonfire1981  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 7:59:46am

A couple of interesting takeaways from Wisconsin for me personally:

1) If money is a huge factor, that could work against the Republicans in November as, to my understanding, Obama has been outpacing them considerably in fundraising. Having said that, I think the true difference maker in November might well be...

2) Voter enthusiasm. Say what you want about the Tea Partiers, Birthers, right wing religious types but there is no denying they are a very energized and enthusiastic voter base. I got the feeling the Wisconsin Republicans may have been even more motivated than Democrats in the campaign. There's been a lot of malaise amongst Democrats in the past little while, evidenced by their apparently slow and unorganized responses to the War on Women, the creation/evolution thing and other controversies. While they have continued to secure victories on the Gay marriage front, Deomcratic supporters just don't seem as organized and energized as their GOP counterparts.

Now that may change between now and the fall, but the Right wing has been constantly rallying behind a "STOP OBAMA!" battle cry since about January 2009. That is what it comes to. It's not about the economy, it's not about jobs, it's not even about social issues or Mitt Romney. It's about getting the scary black man (tm) out of the White House.

Think about this: A lot of GOP leaning voters will likely be happier with Mitt Romney as President, even he ends up with a worse track record than Obama, because he's NOT black.

The GOP message is simple and clear: Stop Obama...at any cost.

Seems to me the Democrats need a simple clear message of their own as well as an organized strategy to get the voters excited for November.

Money alone is not enough.

242 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:03:54am

Obama - D-Day = Wingnut Outrage of the Day

Film @ 11.

243 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:06:19am

Image: 9A05352A_640.jpg

Lt. Albert Lanker of the 31st Photo Reconnaissance Squadron flies fast and very low over the beach in "Outlaw", his F-5 Lightning. Lanker's job was to photograph the beach obstructions on the Normandy coast for the planners of the massive D-Day invasion; it was only his third mission.

Image Number: 9A05352A

A somewhat famous image. You can see the Nazi troops scurrying in panic on the beach.

244 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:08:00am

re: #229 HappyWarrior

Damn. I can remember reading All Summer in a Day in grade school and listening to an audio version of Fahrenheit 451 with a friend on a weekend trip to UVA. Thanks for the books, Ray.

Well said. The one that got me was The Illustrated Man.

245 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:09:05am

re: #241 dragonfire1981

Think about this: A lot of GOP leaning voters will likely be happier with Mitt Romney as President, even he ends up with a worse track record than Obama, because he's NOT black.

I disagree. If that were the case Obama would have lost the election and John McCain would be president today. George Bush's popularity was dropping in the polls as the economy and unemployment dropped toward the end of his presidency and the Democrats took full advantage of that.

As always I think it will come down to the Independents. The left is going to vote for Obama, the right will vote for Romney. Both sides have to convince the Independents to vote for their side and if the economy and jobs numbers don't turn around and improve it's going to be a bad day for the Democrats on election day.

246 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:12:26am

re: #243 Gus

Image: 9A05352A_640.jpg

A somewhat famous image. You can see the Nazi troops scurrying in panic on the beach.

This is a good story from one of the few WWII vets still alive.

On 68th anniversary of D-Day, 102-year-old Army veteran recalls watching Allied planes

Anyone who lives long enough is all but certain to witness something significant, and for centenarian Bea Cohen of Los Angeles, not only did she see air strikes during World War II--Cohen watched the Allied airplanes en route to the shores of Normandy in support of the D-Day invasion, 68 years ago today.

It's a life experience for the 102-year-old veteran that is as sharp in her mind today as it was in front of her face that early morning in England.

"Imagine all of those planes and gliders," Cohen recently recalled. "Loads of them!" She was a U.S. Army private on a train towards her new post when the dark sky erupted with the thunderous roar of motors.

"It was top secret. Nobody knew even aboard ship nobody knew when or where or what. And there were the planes--the sky was filled with planes and gliders. The Normandy invasion we knew that was the beginning of the end of World War II."

247 lawhawk  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:12:55am

The Enterprise is on the move - they are moving it the final few miles on a barge up the Hudson River to the Intrepid Sea Air Space Museum as I type. It will arrive up at the Intrepid around noon, and it will then be hoisted into place this afternoon.

248 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:14:20am

And here it is...

Gov. Walker calls for constitutional change to prevent future state recalls
By Rose Gordon Sala
Wed Jun 6, 2012 10:47 AM EDT

249 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:15:37am

re: #248 Gus

And here it is...

Gov. Walker calls for constitutional change to prevent future state recalls
By Rose Gordon Sala
Wed Jun 6, 2012 10:47 AM EDT

That did not take long. He's just mad because he got caught out and, despite a large number of people disapproving of the recall in the first place, almost losing it.

250 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:15:53am

Can you imagine being on a Higgins Boat landing on the beaches? A ride into fate. The paratroppers too. Man I can't imagine it. That generation had a lot of balls. And it's sad that we lose more and more of em daily.

251 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:16:47am

Morning all!

I found it!!! The Door to Hell.

What did you do this morning?

252 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:17:05am

re: #248 Gus

And here it is...

Gov. Walker calls for constitutional change to prevent future state recalls
By Rose Gordon Sala
Wed Jun 6, 2012 10:47 AM EDT

Honestly in a Machiavellian way I hope it succeeds and then one of Walker's successors is staunchly pro union and the right flips it shit.

253 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:18:54am

re: #241 dragonfire1981

Seems to me the Democrats need a simple clear message of their own as well as an organized strategy to get the voters excited for November.

Money alone is not enough.

Keep in mind., Obama and Romney are beholden to the same moneyed interests. Their fiscal and economic policies will vary to a matter of degrees, nothing substantial.

The big difference will be in social policy. If Mittster wants to maintain any sort of centrist economic policy, he will have to cave to the GOP base on every anti-woman, anti-gay and anti-minority initiative they float.

That is the message the Dems need to get across: vote GOP and you will see the clock turned back by decades on matters of abortion, contraception, gay rights, minority rights, separation of church and state, etc...

254 lawhawk  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:20:17am

re: #250 HappyWarrior

Or the Omaha Beach DDs (Donald Ducks), which were swamped by the ocean due to being released too far from shore and breakers higher than expected. They fared somewhat better on the other beaches.

So many things had to go right for the Allies on D-Day, and that it succeeded is a testament to those who fought and gave their lives on that fateful day.

255 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:20:36am

re: #250 HappyWarrior

Can you imagine being on a Higgins Boat landing on the beaches? A ride into fate. The paratroppers too. Man I can't imagine it. That generation had a lot of balls. And it's sad that we lose more and more of em daily.

Fun D-Day fact that almost everyone already knows: General Eisenhower wrote two speeches to broadcast to the world on D-Day. Only one of them was used; the one he had prepared for the event of a failed invasion remained in his pocket.

256 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:21:19am

This is insane...

From the Milwaukee NBC website:

Police, DOJ investigate death threats against Walker after recall win

MILWAUKEE - The Milwaukee Police Department said that they and the Wisconsin Department of Justice are looking into death threats made against Governor Scott Walker the morning after he won a gubernatorial recall election.

Newsradio 620 WTMJ has confirmed a number of tweets which were aggregated and posted on Twitchy.com Wednesday morning.

Those tweets describe various death threats against the Governor.

Many contain vulgar content, but one of them includes "Scott Walker will die within the next week. I've already paid for the hit."

The Governor's spokesman tells 620WTMJ that they are aware of the threats, that Walker has security, and that his schedule will not change from what has been planned.

"People cannot assume anonymity via social media while issuing a threat to another's safety or life," said Milwaukee Police spokeswoman Anne E. Schwartz in a statement.

Disagree with the outcome of an election but follow it up with death threats? WTF is wrong with people?

257 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:22:44am

re: #245 NJDhockeyfan

Both sides have to convince the Independents to vote for their side and if the economy and jobs numbers don't turn around and improve it's going to be a bad day for the Democrats on election day.

Yes, likely.

258 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:24:28am

re: #256 NJDhockeyfan

I hope the twerp forgot to use a proxy...
Then again, this is based on twitchy, so I'll take a closer look.

259 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:24:39am

re: #254 lawhawk

Or the Omaha Beach DDs (Donald Ducks), which were swamped by the ocean due to being released too far from shore and breakers higher than expected. They fared somewhat better on the other beaches.

So many things had to go right for the Allies on D-Day, and that it succeeded is a testament to those who fought and gave their lives on that fateful day.

And thank god Hitler was whacked out his drug and vitamin cocktail injection and could not be awakened in time to release the Panzer reserves.

260 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:25:38am

re: #259 Expand Your Ground

And thank god Hitler was whacked out his drug and vitamin cocktail injection and could not be awakened in time to release the Panzer reserves.

Heh yep, also good that the Allies in the pre-landing plans were able to convince the Germans to divert their forces too.

261 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:25:57am

re: #258 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

I hope the twerp forgot to use a proxy...
Then again, this is based on twitchy, so I'll take a closer look.

Check it out. The company here blocks twitter.

262 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:25:59am

re: #259 Expand Your Ground

And thank god Hitler was whacked out his drug and vitamin cocktail injection and could not be awakened in time to release the Panzer reserves.

Even if he could, there's no telling if he would. By that stage of the war, Hitler was pretty much convinced he was a god on the battlefield. He might've just told Rommel to stick it.

263 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:26:41am

re: #259 Expand Your Ground

And thank god Hitler was whacked out his drug and vitamin cocktail injection and could not be awakened in time to release the Panzer reserves.

I thought the Generals were scared to wake him up.

265 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:28:44am

re: #264 Gus

I admit sort of liking his stuff back in 2004. Of course, I see it different now. He probably has good intentions, but he lacks honesty.

266 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:29:00am

re: #258 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

I hope the twerp forgot to use a proxy...
Then again, this is based on twitchy, so I'll take a closer look.

Heh. You mean with rhetoric like this?

...Tonight, liberal Twitter users are openly advocating the assassination of Gov. Scott Walker...

Ummm. No.

267 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:29:38am

re: #263 NJDhockeyfan

I thought the Generals were scared to wake him up.

They probably could not have done so if they had tried...

268 StillAMarine  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:29:46am

Rest In Peace, Ray Bradbury

It is the end of an era with the passing of author Ray Bradbury on Tuesday night. I will never forget Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles.

Thank you, Ray!

ברוך אתה 'הוה א לוהינו מלך העולם, דין האמת

269 dragonfire1981  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:30:15am

re: #256 NJDhockeyfan

This is insane...

From the Milwaukee NBC website:

Police, DOJ investigate death threats against Walker after recall win

Disagree with the outcome of an election but follow it up with death threats? WTF is wrong with people?

More info on this...

Angry supporters of the failed effort to recall Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker expressed their frustration Tuesday night by issuing tweets calling for Gov. Walker's assassination.

A post at Twitchy highlighted a number of profane messages sent over Twitter advocating the murder of the first governor to survive a recall election.

Some also called for killing those who voted for Walker.

"Please somebody kill Scott Walker," tweeted "Prototypeisgame," in one of the few messages that did not include profanity or racial slurs.

"Someone from the NRA should shoot Scott Walker in the head, GTA-style," wrote "Wesley Lam."

One user, going by the name "Ahh fack im based!" sent a message claiming to have paid for a "hit" against Gov. Walker.

"Scott Walker will die within the next week," he wrote.

Some of the messages also threatened Gov. Walker's wife and son.

"I Know What School Scott Walker Son Go To (sic)," wrote "TeeJay."

Another threatened to rape the Governor's wife, while one person said she would kill any member of the Walker family she saw on the street.

Ironically, DNC boss Debbie Wasserman Schultz (D-FL) wrote: "Despite the disappointing outcome, #WIrecall effort sent Scott Walker a message that his brand of divisive politics is offensive & wrong."

270 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:31:49am

Sigh, I wish people wouldn't act like that. Walker's a bastard. It's not that complicated people.

271 dragonfire1981  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:31:56am

I'd like to make two short comments on the Walker/threats thing:

1) I think it's wrong for ANY person regardless of political leanings to advocate killing someone over something like this.

2) It's pretty much a guarantee the right is going to play this up and pretend like they never, ever do similar things.

272 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:33:03am

re: #250 HappyWarrior

Can you imagine being on a Higgins Boat landing on the beaches? A ride into fate. The paratroppers too. Man I can't imagine it. That generation had a lot of balls. And it's sad that we lose more and more of em daily.

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

One of the better books I've read detailing Omaha Beach.

273 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:33:09am

re: #271 dragonfire1981

I'd like to make two short comments on the Walker/threats thing:

1) I think it's wrong for ANY person regardless of political leanings to advocate killing someone over something like this.

2) It's pretty much a guarantee the right is going to play this up and pretend like they never, ever do similar things.

Number 2 is a guarantee. Number 1 I wholeheartily agree with. I think Walker's a jerk, a fucker even, but do I want violence on his family or him, hell no.

274 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:33:29am

re: #271 dragonfire1981

I'd like to make two short comments on the Walker/threats thing:

1) I think it's wrong for ANY person regardless of political leanings to advocate killing someone over something like this.

2) It's pretty much a guarantee the right is going to play this up and pretend like they never, ever do similar things.

more than 2) they are make these idiots out to be the very epitome of those who supported the recall.

275 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:33:52am

re: #269 dragonfire1981

Some of the messages also threatened Gov. Walker's wife and son.

"I Know What School Scott Walker Son Go To (sic)," wrote "TeeJay."

Another threatened to rape the Governor's wife, while one person said she would kill any member of the Walker family she saw on the street.

That is totally fucked up.

276 dragonfire1981  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:34:23am

re: #245 NJDhockeyfan

I disagree. If that were the case Obama would have lost the election and John McCain would be president today. George Bush's popularity was dropping in the polls as the economy and unemployment dropped toward the end of his presidency and the Democrats took full advantage of that.

As always I think it will come down to the Independents. The left is going to vote for Obama, the right will vote for Romney. Both sides have to convince the Independents to vote for their side and if the economy and jobs numbers don't turn around and improve it's going to be a bad day for the Democrats on election day.

I'm not sure I agree with you here. Obama's Hope and Change message was really strong at the time. That, combined with the hype of his potential to become the first ever black President really helped him. Now a lot of people on both sides of the political spectrum don't feel like they got the "change" they hoped for when they elected him.

And of course he can't be the first black President again so the hype isn't there as much.

277 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:34:46am

re: #271 dragonfire1981

I'd like to make two short comments on the Walker/threats thing:

1) I think it's wrong for ANY person regardless of political leanings to advocate killing someone over something like this.

2) It's pretty much a guarantee the right is going to play this up and pretend like they never, ever do similar things.

It's probably not even political. Just some dumb kid and his wannabe friends. Here's the account of the first person mentioned making the threats: [Link: twitter.com...]

278 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:34:55am

re: #262 thedopefishlives

Even if he could, there's no telling if he would. By that stage of the war, Hitler was pretty much convinced he was a god on the battlefield. He might've just told Rommel to stick it.

Finished The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich by William Shirer in the wee hours. Man, Hitler was whacked, sick, nearly physically incapacitated at the end-believing prophecy and shit.

He did, however, know how to surroud himself with men who couldn't take power from him no matter how hard they tried.

279 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:35:09am

re: #261 NJDhockeyfan

Check it out. The company here blocks twitter.

OK, checking it out. Just like the last time I caught twitchy lying, they're lying now too.

They ascribing all the disgusting tweets to "liberals".

Here is their top tweet:

Sorry, but just because he hates Walker and is black doesn't mean he is a liberal.

His twitter stream doesn't show evidence of his "liberality" (well, aside from his hatred for a particular politician). Liberalism is a set of views, and this dumb kid's views are not apparent.

280 dragonfire1981  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:35:20am

re: #275 NJDhockeyfan

That is totally fucked up.

Just as fucked up as the attacks on Obama's kids and Wife. I don't care who you are, that shit is not right.

281 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:35:25am

re: #259 Expand Your Ground

And thank god Hitler was whacked out his drug and vitamin cocktail injection and could not be awakened in time to release the Panzer reserves.

Though one factor with this is that if the panzers had been turned loose they also would have been deployed within range of the Allied naval support. Something Rommel at least was somewhat wary of after the landings. The Allied tac air wasn't capable of attacking at night, but the naval forces were capable of support 24/7 generally.

282 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:36:13am

re: #276 dragonfire1981

I'm not sure I agree with you here. Obama's Hope and Change message was really strong at the time. That, combined with the hype of his potential to become the first ever black President really helped him. Now a lot of people on both sides of the political spectrum don't feel like they got the "change" they hoped for when they elected him.

And of course he can't be the first black President again so the hype isn't there as much.

McCain simply failed to make any kind of convincing case that he was the better candidate.

And his running mate might have totally electrified around 25% of the electorate, but totally annoyed and alienated a lot more than she attracted...

283 dragonfire1981  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:36:20am

re: #279 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

OK, checking it out. Just like the last time I caught twitchy lying, they're lying now too.

They ascribing all the disgusting tweets to "liberals".

Here is their top tweet:

[Embedded content] Sorry, but just because he hates Walker and is black doesn't mean he is a liberal.

His twitter stream doesn't show evidence of his "liberality" (well, aside from his hatred for a particular politician). Liberalism is a set views, and this dumb kid's views are not apparent.

Twitchy is of course, Michelle Malkin's site. I've been trying to find a few other sources on this story.

284 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:37:04am

re: #279 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

OK, checking it out. Just like the last time I caught twitchy lying, they're lying now too.

They ascribing all the disgusting tweets to "liberals".

Here is their top tweet:

[Embedded content] Sorry, but just because he hates Walker and is black doesn't mean he is a liberal.

His twitter stream doesn't show evidence of his "liberality" (well, aside from his hatred for a particular politician). Liberalism is a set views, and this dumb kid's views are not apparent.

Yep. Check out his followers too. Nothing political and lots of wannabe crap.

`Marques.Scoot.
@__SupaMcNASTY__
'#Basketball Is Life. #Swagg Is A Must. #Weed Is A Habbit. #TeamPaperChaser! #TeamSingleee!

It's rather stupid of Twitch to try and make this some kind of liberal conspiracy. But we are talking about the same groups of people that are pushing the #TwitterGulag and Charles conspiracy.

285 dragonfire1981  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:37:09am

re: #282 Expand Your Ground

McCain simply failed to make any kind of convincing case that he was the better candidate.

And his running mate might have totally electrified around 25% of the electorate, but totally annoyed and alienated a lot more than she attracted...

Question for you relating to that: Do you believe Republican voters were as energized to vote for McCain and Palin as they are to vote against Obama this year?

286 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:37:34am

re: #280 dragonfire1981

Just as fucked up as the attacks on Obama's kids and Wife. I don't care who you are, that shit is not right.

Death threats to politicians is wrong, threatening their families is beyond comprehension.

287 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:37:40am

re: #285 dragonfire1981

Question for you relating to that: Do you believe Republican voters were as energized to vote for McCain and Palin as they are to vote against Obama this year?

No.

288 Interesting Times  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:37:44am

re: #284 Gus

It's rather stupid of Twitch to try and make this some kind of liberal conspiracy. But we are talking about the same groups of people that are pushing the #TwitterGulag and Charles conspiracy.

289 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:38:02am

re: #248 Gus

And here it is...

Gov. Walker calls for constitutional change to prevent future state recalls
By Rose Gordon Sala
Wed Jun 6, 2012 10:47 AM EDT

Takes passing the legislature twice and then passing a referendum. This is for show for the base.

Now if we hadn't flipped the senate seat, he'd be calling a special session right now to force through a "Right To Work Exploit" law.

Just more proof that he has to be fought tooth and nail till the perp walk him out of the Capitol building.

290 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:39:10am

re: #285 dragonfire1981

Question for you relating to that: Do you believe Republican voters were as energized to vote for McCain and Palin as they are to vote against Obama this year?

There are plenty enough who are energized to stop Obama from being re-elected, but few of the base are to any degree excited about their candidate.

291 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:39:16am

re: #289 William Barnett-Lewis

Takes passing the legislature twice and then passing a referendum. This is for show for the base.

Now if we hadn't flipped the senate seat, he'd be calling a special session right now to force through a "Right To Work Exploit" law.

Just more proof that he has to be fought tooth and nail till the perp walk him out of the Capitol building.

A tyrant would *never* suggest such a change to the constitution --would he?

292 Interesting Times  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:39:52am
293 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:40:39am

re: #292 Interesting Times

[Embedded content]

Yes.

294 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:41:02am

re: #283 dragonfire1981

Twitchy is of course, Michelle Malkin's site. I've been trying to find a few other sources on this story.

Here are three...

Police to investigate Walker death threats

MPD says its 'evaluating' threats against Walker

Milwaukee police, DOJ evaluating Twitter threats against Walker

295 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:42:59am

The first dozen or so of tweets are from black teens. I stopped checking after that. Twitchy is scum.

296 CuriousLurker  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:43:24am

re: #279 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

OK, checking it out. Just like the last time I caught twitchy lying, they're lying now too.

They ascribing all the disgusting tweets to "liberals".

Here is their top tweet:

[Embedded content] Sorry, but just because he hates Walker and is black doesn't mean he is a liberal.

His twitter stream doesn't show evidence of his "liberality" (well, aside from his hatred for a particular politician). Liberalism is a set of views, and this dumb kid's views are not apparent.

The whole notion that anyone can ascribe anything to anyone else on Twitter is absurd. I can grab a photo right now, create a new account pretending to be whoever I want to be, and start spewing all kinds of nasty crap.

297 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:43:38am

re: #288 Interesting Times

[Embedded content]

Hell Malkin herself harassed a kid whose policy stance she had a problem with. She has no room to talk.

298 dragonath  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:43:48am

Ya know, all the people voting "against the recall" in Wisconsin remind me of the independents in 2004 who voted for Bush because they wanted him "to finish the job he started in Iraq". Same logic, anyway.

299 Big Steve  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:43:53am

Damn Ray Bradbury died.

300 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:45:11am

re: #299 Big Steve

Damn Ray Bradbury died.

Don't we need some punctuation here?

301 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:46:00am

re: #298 Be Zorch, Daddio

Ya know, all the people voting "against the recall" in Wisconsin remind me of the independents in 2004 who voted for Bush because they wanted him "to finish the job he started in Iraq". Same logic, anyway.

People are strange so said a guy named Morrison.

302 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:46:01am

Maybe we should form a Pirate Parte?

nah

303 Big Steve  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:46:47am

re: #298 Be Zorch, Daddio

Ya know, all the people voting "against the recall" in Wisconsin remind me of the independents in 2004 who voted for Bush because they wanted him "to finish the job he started in Iraq". Same logic, anyway.

I don't follow your logic at all. It is perfectly plausible for someone to maybe not like Scott Walker and his policies but to believe that the normal political process should take place to handle it rather than a recall. However the 2004 election was the normal political process and to vote for the incumbent because one wants to see the policies continued is normal....that is how it is supposed to work.

304 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:47:03am

re: #302 ggt

Maybe we should form a Pirate Parte?

nah

Sorry, the MPAA/RIAA is going to ban that next.

305 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:47:06am

re: #295 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

The first dozen or so of tweets are from black teens. I stopped checking after that. Twitchy is scum.

Yeah. It's basically being sold as "THE LIBERALS, THE LIBERALS, THE LIBERALS!!"

306 Big Steve  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:48:10am

re: #300 Expand Your Ground

Don't we need some punctuation here?

LOL.....yep......Damn, Ray Bradbury died!

307 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:48:31am

re: #303 Big Steve

I don't follow your logic at all. It is perfectly plausible for someone to maybe not like Scott Walker and his policies but to believe that the normal political process should take place to handle it rather than a recall. However the 2004 election was the normal political process and to vote for the incumbent because one wants to see the policies continued is normal...that is how it is supposed to work.

He's saying, it's weird to have a problem with the recall and then vote for Walker solely because of your dislike of the idea. I have to admit. I am skeptical of recalls but I can't imagine voting for someone whose ideology was opposed to mine because of that. I'd either not vote or vote for his opponent.

308 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:48:38am

Hey. I did check one more, and what do I see?

Here is the tweet twitchy cited:

For those slow on the take: EEElverhoy did not post a threat, he RT'd a threat with "???" (=WTF).

He got a lot of wingnut hate:

Wow. Just wow. Wingnuts are clueless.

309 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:51:04am

re: #308 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

Hey. I did check one more, and what do I see?

Here is the tweet twitchy cited:

[Embedded content] Wow. Just wow. Wingnuts are clueless.

Oops. //

Well now. There you go then. They implicated a fellow wingnut?

310 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:51:05am

I honestly think some designers are hoping to get picked-up by Hollywood.

311 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:52:11am

re: #309 Gus

No, but they heaped blame on an innocent party in their blind rage.

312 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:54:36am

"Gangsta" talk stuff is a problem. It should not be excused, solutions should be found. But it has nothing to do with liberalism,

313 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:55:32am

Seriously? These might actually be illegal.

I'm so not into the dystopian theme in fashion.

314 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:56:01am

re: #312 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

"Gangsta" talk stuff is a problem. It should not be excused, solutions should be found. But it has nothing to do with liberalism,

sure it does, conservatives would have silenced these guys already. That is what gulag's are for . . . .

315 CuriousLurker  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:56:16am

re: #305 Gus

Yeah. It's basically being sold as "THE LIBERALS, THE LIBERALS, THE LIBERALS!!"

Yep. I could sit here and scan any hashtag I want to cherry pick dozens of the most egregious tweets I can find, and then ascribe them to conservatives, liberals, atheists, Jews, Muslims, Christians, blacks, hispanics, whites, asians, whatever. It's even easier if you have someone familiar with the Twitter API that can automate things. Unfortunately, it's really easy to find ugly, hateful tweets.

316 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:57:03am

The PeeWee Herman look???

317 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:57:07am

re: #315 CuriousLurker

Yep. I could sit here and scan any hashtag I want to cherry pick dozens of the most egregious tweets I can find, and then ascribe them to conservatives, liberals, atheists, Jews, Muslims, Christians, blacks, hispanics, whites, asians, whatever. It's even easier if you have someone familiar with the Twitter API that can automate things. Unfortunately, it's really easy to find ugly, hateful tweets.

Not on my timeline! :)

318 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:58:43am

Sorry for all the fashion statements. I'm just trying to ignore the result of the Wisconsin Recall. I can't quite stomach it this early in the morning. . . .

319 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:58:50am

Of course some people will Retweet the weird shit so I will see it on occasion. The people I follow are normal folks. I also don't build a timeline on hashtags. Unless it's something fun or interesting that's trending.

320 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 8:59:44am

Also: someone voting for Obama does not mean she is a liberal.

321 CuriousLurker  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:00:29am

re: #312 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

"Gangsta" talk stuff is a problem. It should not be excused, solutions should be found. But it has nothing to do with liberalism,

Sometimes some of it sounds like a caricature—i.e like what people who've never actually been around "gangstas" think they sound like.

322 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:02:01am

CL will correct me, but I think a lot of Muslims were pro-R up to the known events and subsequent reaction.

323 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:03:44am

re: #322 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

CL will correct me, but I think a lot of Muslims were pro-R up to the known events and subsequent reaction.

Whatever else you wanna say about Bush, he was not a knee-jerk Islamophobe.

324 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:04:42am

re: #323 Expand Your Ground

Whatever else you wanna say about Bush, he was not a knee-jerk Islamophobe.

Yes, I value this. And in this he was pretty much alone. (I'm exaggerating, but only slightly.)

325 CuriousLurker  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:05:49am

re: #322 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

CL will correct me, but I think a lot of Muslims were pro-R up to the known events and subsequent reaction.

Not sure which events you mean, but, yeah, observant Muslims tend to be fairly conservative and would naturally lean towards the GOP—if they weren't being demonized by them. I'm pretty sure the GOP has lost 99% of Muslims for the foreseeable future.

326 kirkspencer  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:07:39am

Pardon the driveby post: PSA

If you have a linkedin account, change your password.
[Link: nakedsecurity.sophos.com...]
over 6 million passwords have allegedly been stolen.

327 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:10:13am

re: #324 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

Yes, I value this. And in this he was pretty much alone. (I'm exaggerating, but only slightly.)

He would be in today's GOP.

328 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:11:15am

re: #325 CuriousLurker

I've read somewhere that Muslims were a promising voting block ([not a monolith; but you get what I mean]) for the Republicans before 9/11. Not theoretically either. Like, polls allegedly showed most Muslims voted for Bush the first time, etc. Again, no idea as to the credibility of this info.

329 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:12:23am

Intrepid Museum live webcams.

The Enterprise is being positioned...

330 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:12:47am

Like this:

MSNBC Video

A separate poll by Zogby International -- run by James Zogby's brother John -- indicated that Bush won 44.5 percent of the Arab community’s vote in the 2000 election, but the same poll suggested that if Arab-Americans were to vote today only 28 percent would vote to reelect Bush.
Video: Arab American Institute

In addition, a recent poll of 1,700 American Muslims -- including Arab-Americans -- conducted by Zogby International for Georgetown University's “Muslims in the American Public Square," showed Muslims backed Kerry by a margin of 76 percent to just 7 percent for Bush, marking a stark reversal from the 2000 election when Bush commanded 42 percent of the Muslim vote versus 31 percent for Al Gore.

331 lawhawk  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:13:24am

re: #323 Expand Your Ground

He was repeatedly attacked for not going all in on the war against terror as a war against Islam. He kept to the position that the war against terror was against those who held a corrupted view of Islam - violent Islamist beliefs.

And two guess (first doesn't count) as to who were among those who attacked the President for that stance...

332 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:13:43am

re: #330 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

(I've no idea why a video was inserted. I don't see one in the article.)

333 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:14:10am

Take that Houston! :P

//

334 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:14:20am

re: #332 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

(I've no idea why a video was inserted. I don't see one in the article.)

dingos?

336 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:20:41am

re: #328 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

I've read somewhere that Muslims were a promising voting block ([not a monolith; but you get what I mean]) for the Republicans before 9/11. Not theoretically either. Like, polls allegedly showed most Muslims voted for Bush the first time, etc. Again, no idea as to the credibility of this info.

So were Latinos back when Bush was in favor of a reasonable immigration policy. The GOP has decided to abandon these growing minority groups in favor of the mouth-breathing base

337 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:21:09am

re: #335 Gus

Diamond Jubilee Flypast as seen from the Spitfire

[Embedded content]

Here's the view from the lancaster
Video from a Lancaster bomber during jubilee flyover

Liveleak Video

Kind of cool to see the inner courtyard of Buckingham Palace.

338 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:23:07am

re: #337 Killgore Trout

Here's the view from the lancaster
Video from a Lancaster bomber during jubilee flyover

[Embedded content] Kind of cool to see the inner courtyard of Buckingham Palace.

Very green. I like the forward view in the cockpit.

339 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:26:49am

Another live feed but from NBC News NYC: Shuttle Enterprise Sails Toward Intrepid

340 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:31:13am

Businessman 'exported WMD chemicals to Iran'

Jarrad Beddow, 43 the former sales manager of Remet UK, is alleged to have played a 'leading role' in the shipment of cobalt aluminate to the Islamic Republic via Slovakia.

It is claimed he ignored warnings that there was "an unacceptable risk of diversion to WMD programmes."

341 CuriousLurker  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:33:03am

re: #328 I'm back in the USSR (sigh)

I've read somewhere that Muslims were a promising voting block ([not a monolith; but you get what I mean]) for the Republicans before 9/11. Not theoretically either. Like, polls allegedly showed most Muslims voted for Bush the first time, etc. Again, no idea as to the credibility of this info.

Sorry, I got distracted. It wouldn't surprise me, but I wasn't involved in politics at all back then so I couldn't say for sure.

342 Romantic Heretic  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:33:54am

re: #189 Expand Your Ground

Law and Order.

They don't give a damn about law. It's order they want, with order being defined as "If you get in our way or disagree with us, you are going to suffer for it."

343 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:34:53am

re: #342 Romantic Heretic

They don't give a damn about law. It's order they want, with order being defined as "If you get in our way or disagree with us, you are going to suffer for it."

Laws don't have to be legal...

344 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:37:49am

This is just beautiful...

NASA | SDO's Ultra-high Definition View of 2012 Venus Transit

Youtube Video
345 Shropshire_Slasher  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:38:10am

Woman charged with castration, urinates in police car
[Link: www.shelbystar.com...]
I want the testicle lock box back!

346 lawhawk  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:41:28am

re: #340 NJDhockeyfan

Cobalt aluminate isn't a WMD, and its most commonly used as a pigment in paints/art/ceramics. It can be used as a high temperature resistance coating, ceramics, enamels, glass coloring, and coloring of high temperature resistance engineering.

So, what apparently happened is that this guy decided that despite a rejection by authorities for a license to sell the materials to Iran, he went ahead and sent what would otherwise be considered a dual-use material to Iran, where it may end up being incorporated into the WMD programs (probably as a coating to improve equipment involved in the nuclear enrichment program).

347 Gus  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:42:55am

Gotta work on $omething. BBL

348 The Left  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:46:06am

re: #335 Gus

Diamond Jubilee Flypast as seen from the Spitfire

[Embedded content]

Obligatory:

Youtube Video
349 Romantic Heretic  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:48:12am

re: #250 HappyWarrior

Can you imagine being on a Higgins Boat landing on the beaches? A ride into fate. The paratroppers too. Man I can't imagine it. That generation had a lot of balls. And it's sad that we lose more and more of em daily.

About the only thing I liked about Saving Private Ryan was the starting scene which, I think, caught the horror and fear of the assault on Omaha.

Scarier still is the fact that the actual 'stuck on the beach being hammered by the Germans' lasted about three times longer than the movie.

350 Romantic Heretic  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:49:56am

re: #248 Gus

And here it is...

Gov. Walker calls for constitutional change to prevent future state recalls
By Rose Gordon Sala
Wed Jun 6, 2012 10:47 AM EDT

With all future elections being classified as 'recalls.' The people have spoken so we don't have to waste their time any more. ///

351 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:51:42am

re: #349 Romantic Heretic

About the only thing I liked about Saving Private Ryan was the starting scene which, I think, caught the horror and fear of the assault on Omaha.

Scarier still is the fact that the actual 'stuck on the beach being hammered by the Germans' lasted about three times longer than the movie.

It was a fairly mediocre movie but that opening was a brilliant piece of movie making. What I really like is they managed to convey the tactical situation very well.

352 Romantic Heretic  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:51:55am

re: #254 lawhawk

Or the Omaha Beach DDs (Donald Ducks), which were swamped by the ocean due to being released too far from shore and breakers higher than expected. They fared somewhat better on the other beaches.

And then they got into the bocage where things really got tough.

353 Romantic Heretic  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 9:54:42am

re: #351 Killgore Trout

It was a fairly mediocre movie but that opening was a brilliant piece of movie making. What I really like is they managed to convey the tactical situation very well.

I liked, as a WWII history geek, was not going 'Bzzzzt! Wrong!' even once. So many WWII movies and TV shows dress up American equipment in field grey, slap on an Iron Cross and claim it's German. Annoying.

354 Mattand  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 10:08:35am

re: #32 Amory Blaine

Walker won 37% of union households.

Like taking a cow to dinner and having it order steak for its meal.

355 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 10:08:55am

re: #343 Expand Your Ground

Laws don't have to be legal...

Legal, or just?

356 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 10:10:15am

re: #350 Romantic Heretic

With all future elections being classified as 'recalls.' The people have spoken so we don't have to waste their time any more. ///

So the next governor's election in California will feature Arnie and be advertised as "Total Recall"?
/ ;)

357 Gretchen G.Tiger  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 10:26:55am

bbl

358 AK-47%  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 10:38:08am

re: #349 Romantic Heretic

About the only thing I liked about Saving Private Ryan was the starting scene which, I think, caught the horror and fear of the assault on Omaha.

Scarier still is the fact that the actual 'stuck on the beach being hammered by the Germans' lasted about three times longer than the movie.

First scene I was preapred for from the reviews and work of mouth. i was more fascinated at how they got it so look so realistic.

Then the movie drew me in, and that final scene really got me.

Took some time ro realize that my own dad looked a bit like Tom Sizemore, and he sort of played the "father figure" to the unit, and his loss hit me the way my own father's untimely death left our family.

Funny, cause if my dad had not been 4F and roling steel in Gary, he would have been much the same age as the Tom Sizemore character in the film, 30 years old in 1944, which woulda made him one of the senior members of the unit...

359 MittDoesNotCompute  Wed, Jun 6, 2012 12:34:58pm

re: #356 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

So the next governor's election in California will feature Arnie and be advertised as "Total Recall"?
/ ;)

No, Colin Farrell.

Get with the times...

///


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