When Abortion Was Illegal: Untold Stories (1992)

Gus
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When Abortion Was Illegal: Untold Stories (1992)

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This Academy Award-nominated film features compelling first person accounts which reveal the physical, legal, and emotional consequences during the era when abortion was a criminal act. Remembrances include those of women who experienced illegal abortions, doctors who risked imprisonment and loss of their licenses for providing illegal abortions, and individuals who broke the law by helping women find safe abortions.

This movie is part of the collection: Fadiman Social Documentaries

Other viewing options available at the Internet Archive.

Related
Video: Romney on Abortion - 1994

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401 comments
1 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:21:11pm

Wow, great find, Gus. Heart wrenching stories.

2 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:24:11pm

re: #1 Charles Johnson

Wow, great find, Gus. Heart wrenching stories.

Thanks. I seem to be having a hard time with all of my internet connections today. Saw this mentioned earlier while doing another search at Internet Archive.

3 jamesfirecat  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:38:29pm

Democrats need to get better at messaging, a film like this is a step in the right direction, too bad we can't do the same thing with "when unions were illegal" just as easily....

4 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:38:35pm

In prolife circles, this would be called "The Good Ole Days."

5 Patricia Kayden  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:41:00pm

Timely video.
[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

6 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:43:34pm

This is the write up from Bullfrog Films:

When Abortion was Illegal
Untold Stories
Devastating stories from the era of illegal abortion.

The era of illegal abortion, roughly the period between the turn of the century and the Roe v. Wade decision in 1973, has been a sealed chapter in women's history.

The profound aura of shame and fear surrounding unwanted pregnancies and abortions before Roe v. Wade kept most women from ever admitting that they had had illegal abortions. Women suffering complications from back alley or self-induced abortions risked arrest if they admitted what they had done, as did their husbands and doctors if they acknowledged compliance and aid.

WHEN ABORTION WAS ILLEGAL illuminates this largely undocumented era and reveals the physical, emotional and legal consequences of having an abortion when it was a criminal act.

They also have study guide (PDF) available.

7 darthstar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:47:03pm
8 CarleeCork  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:48:28pm

A great place to add my Great Aunt's death certificate. She left behind five children and a husband. Women seeking abortion will always find them, it's up to all of us to keep them safe and legal.

Image: Aunt_Augie.jpg

9 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:52:13pm

Mitt was for safe available abortions as was his mother due to the death of an aunt. Need to find link.

10 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:53:24pm

re: #9 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

Mitt was for safe available abortions as was his mother due to the death of an aunt. Need to find link.

Video: Romney on Abortion - 1994

11 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:53:27pm

re: #9 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

Mitt was for safe available abortions as was his mother due to the death of an aunt. Need to find link.

Was that before or after somebody reversed the values on his PoliticalAlignment.EXE file?

12 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:54:28pm

[Link: www.slate.com...]

Romney’s family had its first, fatal brush with abortion in 1963. Romney was 16. His father was the governor of Michigan. Mitt’s sister was married to a young man with a 21-year-old sister who was pregnant. The pregnant young woman, Ann Keenan, desperately wanted an abortion. But abortion was illegal in Michigan. So Keenan tried an illegal abortion. She bled to death

13 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:55:11pm

Cold hearted panderer.

14 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:56:19pm

re: #8 CarleeCork

A great place to add my Great Aunt's death certificate. She left behind five children and a husband. Women seeking abortion will always find them, it's up to all of us to keep them safe and legal.

Image: Aunt_Augie.jpg

Thank you for posting that.

15 Charles Johnson  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 5:56:48pm

Mitt Romney in 1994:

Youtube Video
16 sagehen  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:00:10pm

In 1967, Governor Ronald Reagan signed what was then the most liberal abortion law in the country, at the urging of the California Medical Association -- doctors were just goddamn sick and tired of seeing constant, daily admissions to emergency rooms and morgues of women with sepsis or hemorrhage or a whole range of other entirely preventable results brought on by unqualified practitioners working in unsanitary conditions.

The girls and women that didn't die from it were usually left sterile, they knew the risks going in and did it anyway.

17 CarleeCork  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:00:26pm

re: #2 Gus

Yes Gus, thank you so much for posting this!

18 CarleeCork  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:01:18pm

re: #16 sagehen

In 1967, Governor Ronald Reagan signed what was then the most liberal abortion law in the country, at the urging of the California Medical Association -- doctors were just goddamn sick and tired of seeing constant, daily admissions to emergency rooms and morgues of women with sepsis or hemorrhage or a whole range of other entirely preventable results brought on by unqualified practitioners working in unsanitary conditions.

The girls and women that didn't die from it were usually left sterile, they knew the risks going in and did it anyway.

Why is it that we always have to repeat history?

19 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:01:49pm

re: #18 CarleeCork

Why is it that we always have to repeat history?

Because we never learn unfortunately.

20 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:02:14pm

re: #17 CarleeCork

Yes Gus, thank you so much for posting this!

You're welcome. My connection finally stabilized and watch the final minutes of the video. Devastating. I hope people realize what's at stake here in this election and the danger of a Romney presidency with regards to the Supreme Court.

21 darthstar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:04:03pm

Okay...time to leave. Got tickets for tonight's Giants/Astros game. One extra, even. Will see about giving it away in front of the park. Nic is blue. If any lizard is within reach of AT&T park and wants to go, email me and I'll respond from my phone and leave the ticket at will-call for you. Seriously.

22 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:07:14pm

re: #18 CarleeCork

Why is it that we always have to repeat history?

In this case, because too many have grown complacent, believing that society as a whole agrees with the progress made, and don't take seriously the efforts at work to retard or even reverse that progress.

23 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:08:31pm

re: #3 jamesfirecat

Democrats need to get better at messaging, a film like this is a step in the right direction, too bad we can't do the same thing with "when unions were illegal" just as easily...

You could do that with alot of issues I think.

24 researchok  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:12:59pm

Sobering.

Not just about numbers.

26 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:18:07pm

re: #24 researchok

Sobering.

Not just about numbers.

Thing is, most of the "pro-life" wingnuts I've talked to would probably declare this film "propaganda," because they're absolutely convinced that illegal abortions were a myth or were vanishingly few.

27 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:19:58pm

I have to say the most insidious lie spread by the prolifers is that pro-choice people hate kids and that's why they support legalized abortion. Bastards.

28 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:23:11pm

Docs being released re: George Zimmerman

When asked by his wife whether the more than $135,000 collected from supporters through his website should be used for his bond, George Zimmerman answered “hell no.”

The credit union records also showed that more than $47,000 from the PayPal account was transferred to a bank account belonging to George Zimmerman’s sister. The phone transcripts also reveal that George Zimmerman instructed his wife to use the money, which was donated by supporters, to “pay off all the bills,” including accounts with American Express and Sam’s Club.

[Link: thegrio.com...]

No comment.

29 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:24:48pm

re: #26 Targetpractice

Thing is, most of the "pro-life" wingnuts I've talked to would probably declare this film "propaganda," because they're absolutely convinced that illegal abortions were a myth or were vanishingly few.

They need to read carleecork's great aunt's death cert. Liars and fools.

30 abolitionist  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:28:30pm

LGF has changed much since the time when abortion was a taboo topic here. Keep up the good work, everyone.

31 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:29:11pm

The reactionary right continues to ensare those supposedly "moderate" Republicans who have not decided it's time to totally jump ship:

Once considered a moderate, Pinellas sheriff candidate Everett Rice accepts support of far-right groups

It seems it is becoming impossible for someone to be a Republican party politician these days and not have to make the choice of (1) giving oneself over totally to the far-right, or (2) just leaving the GOP altogether.

32 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:30:05pm

A bit of drama around here tonight. I was working in the greenhouse and heard screeching brakes and a collision out front. Somebody ran a stop sign and nailed a cyclist. Judging from the sounds of things he was probably going 40-50 mph. threw the cyclist over the car and almost onto the sidewalk. The driver tried to run but noticed witnesses and stopped about a block away. I went in and got some paper towels which is the extent of my first aid expertise . I got a pen and paper out of my car to write down the diver's plate # just in case. Once they saw me writing their plate # down they took off. Ambulance and police were here in under 5 minutes. His wife showed up after he was taken off and I agreed to store his bike in the basement. I took the liberty of storing his bag of cherries and oranges in the fridge.
One of the first helpers on the scene was an off duty EMT. Asked the cyclist who the president was. He said "Joe Biden" and laughed. "just kidding, It's the Obama Man".

33 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:31:14pm

People are such assholes.

34 simoom  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:34:20pm

Romney floats the idea of incentive pay to motivate Presidents:
CNN Money: Incentive pay for President Romney?

Surely not a serious proposal but instead I'm assuming it was just a kind of name dropping -- a way of referencing his Private equity years and implying to radio listeners, who like the concept, that he just might bring all sorts of business management consulting norms to government? Maybe a bit of a perilous subject matter though as you may leave the impression in some listeners' minds that you're suggesting you'd need extra motivation to properly fulfill the duties of the Presidency.

35 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:34:38pm

re: #32 Killgore Trout

Hope the cyclist can make a good recovery.

Automobiles are among the dangerous things we allow people to own without controls. Until something dramatic happens we tend to forget how powerful and life-threatening automobiles are.

36 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:34:47pm

re: #33 Killgore Trout

People are such assholes.

No shit, we just had cops here in our neighborhood as well. One of the neighbor's kids was up at the 7-11 when three punks confronted him and demanded he hand over his bike. One pulled out a knife and stabbed him, then they ran off, taking the bike with them. Thankfully the kid's been taking karate lessons and we able to turn his body in such a way to as to avoid a fatal injury.

38 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:36:38pm

Possibly an important scientific bit of research announced today:

DNA Methylation Declines with Age

Progress is being made on the old question of why we "age" - that is, physiologically enter "old age". I doubt we will ever get to the place where we will be able to stop it, but it might be possible to slow it down significantly.

39 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:37:26pm

re: #38 freetoken

Possibly an important scientific bit of research announced today:

DNA Methylation Declines with Age

Progress is being made on the old question of why we "age" - that is, physiologically enter "old age". I doubt we will ever get to the place where we will be able to stop it, but it might be possible to slow it down significantly.

Be like in all those scifi shows where human life expectancy goes up to 200 or higher?

40 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:37:48pm

re: #35 freetoken

Hope the cyclist can make a good recovery.

Automobiles are among the dangerous things we allow people to own without controls. Until something dramatic happens we tend to forget how powerful and life-threatening automobiles are.

He had a head wound which was bleeding pretty bad but the ambulance crew was most concerned about lower back injuries. A very sad commentary on our healthcare system is one of the first things he said to me was he has insurance. When the EMT's arrived they had to ask him which insurance he has, if he has his card and which hospital he can be taken to which will cover him. That's fucked up.

41 simoom  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:38:05pm

re: #37 Kragar

Romney Touts Presidential Salary Plan That Was Literally A Saturday Night Live Skit

Hah. I'd totally forgotten Dana Carvey's Perot impression! Watching the Hulu clip now :P.

42 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:38:12pm

re: #37 Kragar

Romney Touts Presidential Salary Plan That Was Literally A Saturday Night Live Skit

is he going to be revealed to be a SNL character before or after the election?

43 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:38:41pm

re: #35 freetoken

Hope the cyclist can make a good recovery.

Automobiles are among the dangerous things we allow people to own without controls. Until something dramatic happens we tend to forget how powerful and life-threatening automobiles are.

Getting on the 5 today. Shiny new Porsche in front of me really lame with the merge. Going 45 and not speeding up. I had to go around. Looked, chick was texting! Powerful car, idiot driver. Help us.

44 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:39:54pm

re: #42 HappyWarrior

is he going to be revealed to be a SNL character before or after the election?

Your not ready for Prime time players, the GOP!

45 simoom  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:41:28pm

re: #41 simoom

Aww, the full skit is Hulu Plus only. =/

46 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:41:41pm

re: #44 Kragar

Your not ready for Prime time players, the GOP!

Heh there was this hilarious video that some Aussies put up making out Lord Monckton the famous climate change denier out to be a Sacha Baron Cohen character. Guy even got an interview with Monckton and asked him to do a "That's nice" for old time sakes. Monckton not surprisingly wasn't amused.

47 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:42:24pm

re: #40 Killgore Trout

He had a head wound which was bleeding pretty bad but the ambulance crew was most concerned about lower back injuries. A very sad commentary on our healthcare system is one of the first things he said to me was he has insurance. When the EMT's arrived they had to ask him which insurance he has, if he has his card and which hospital he can be taken to which will cover him. That's fucked up.

Insurance=nice hospital

No insurance=poor/bad hospital

They are really classified as such. And it sucks.

48 b_sharp  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:43:52pm

re: #43 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

Getting on the 5 today. Shiny new Porsche in front of me really lame with the merge. Going 45 and not speeding up. I had to go around. Looked, chick was texting! Powerful car, idiot driver. Help us.

Here they don't just not speed up, they slow down. Only about one in five drivers know how to merge - without texting, which is illegal while driving. Add texting and the number goes up to one in infinity know how to merge.

49 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:44:40pm

Michigan passes nation's most restrictive abortion bill

1) Bans Abortions After 20 Weeks, Even For Rape And Incest Victims

2) Transforms Doctors Into Detectives

3) Limits Access For Rural Women

4) Requires Doctors To Purchase Costly Malpractice Insurance

5) Regulates Clinics Out Of Existence

50 [deleted]  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:44:49pm
51 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:45:17pm

re: #40 Killgore Trout

...A very sad commentary on our healthcare system is one of the first things he said to me was he has insurance. When the EMT's arrived they had to ask him which insurance he has, if he has his card and which hospital he can be taken to which will cover him. That's fucked up.

But.. but... Ayn Rand and the current GOP assure us that the market will take care of all of this. After all, if someone can't afford insurance do we really want to keep them around?

Embrace our glorious capitalist future.

52 b_sharp  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:47:03pm

re: #51 freetoken

But.. but... Ayn Rand and the current GOP assure us that the market will take care of all of this. After all, if someone can't afford insurance do we really want to keep them around?

Embrace our glorious capitalist future.

The GOP depopulation scheme.

They're all about the planet.

53 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:50:18pm

Get ready for a slew of attacks against Betty White

Betty White: ‘I Really Don’t Care With Whom You Sleep’

WHITE: Oh! I didn’t know I was a gay icon. I get a lot of mail — but I don’t get many bad letters — but I got a woman the other day that was so upset with me because they said, “How do you feel about the gay marriage thing?” and my answer to that is, “I really don’t care with whom you sleep, I just care what kind of a decent human being you are.” I figure all the rest of it is your business and not mine. And not hers, incidentally.

54 HappyWarrior  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:52:11pm

re: #53 Kragar

Get ready for a slew of attacks against Betty White

Betty White: ‘I Really Don’t Care With Whom You Sleep’

I'm sure. Anyhow she's awesome.

55 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:54:48pm

re: #53 Kragar

Get ready for a slew of attacks against Betty White

Betty White: ‘I Really Don’t Care With Whom You Sleep’

Grandma America

56 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:55:38pm

re: #40 Killgore Trout

re: #43 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

re: #47 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

Thanks Guys. Wife is starting a road trip tomorrow to the Oregon coast for a 5 day vacation and to see our Daughter and Grandkids. I really didn't need to read about nutzoid drivers texting while driving.

57 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:56:00pm

re: #43 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

Getting on the 5 today. Shiny new Porsche in front of me really lame with the merge. Going 45 and not speeding up. I had to go around. Looked, chick was texting! Powerful car, idiot driver. Help us.

Even without texting some of these dorks manage to crash. Often.

Youtube Video
58 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:56:49pm

We're doomed:

Coal Could Regain Ground from Gas as Summer Demand Ramps Up

I really do not expect the world to voluntarily reduced CO2 emissions back to those of a pre-industrial revolution era.

And, the summit down south that the UN has just opened, to commemorate the Rio Summit, is also doomed.

I'm really tired of all the shell games going on with this. No nation has a goal of decreasing itself in stature against the rest of the world, and thus the drive for ever more wealth will be accompanied by ever greater impact on the ecosystem of this planet's surface.

59 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:57:57pm

Classic example, Brazil:

Rio+20: why Brazil is a country of contradictions

60 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 6:58:40pm

re: #56 Bubblehead II

re: #43 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

re: #47 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

Thanks Guys. Wife is starting a road trip tomorrow to the Oregon coast for a 5 day vacation and to see our Daughter and Grandkids. I really didn't need to read about nutzoid drivers texting while driving.

Defensive drive. That's what you do. She'll be fine.

61 [deleted]  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:02:29pm
62 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:03:50pm

re: #49 Kragar

Michigan passes nation's most restrictive abortion bill

2) Transforms Doctors Into Detectives: The Republican-backed legislation would make it a crime for anyone to coerce a woman into having an abortion. Doctors will have to give their patients a questionnaire to inform them of the illegality of coercion and determine if the woman had been coerced or is the victim of domestic abuse before the abortion procedure.

Not that the whole thing doesn't make me sick...but gotta love the fantasy-land conclusion that abusive husbands force women to have abortions...when all the data shows that they tend to force women to have more kids as part of their strategy for maintaining the abusive relationship.

I'm too angry to be glib. This is sick.

63 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:04:48pm

re: #61 Killgore Trout

I am not a lawyer and will not play one on the internet.

However, and I'm sure you are aware of this, be careful of hiding evidence related to a crime.

And, I'm not talking necessarily about turning him in wrt the weed (after all, I think minor possession ought not be a crime.) Rather, you have material evidence - the bike - about a crime - hit and run - that is serious.

64 Killgore Trout  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:06:30pm

re: #63 freetoken

Duly noted

65 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:12:34pm

re: #59 freetoken

Classic example, Brazil:

Rio+20: why Brazil is a country of contradictions

Very interesting article.

As you well know, SA is so off ordinary America's radar.

66 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:20:17pm

Bristol Palin sued for defamation by bar heckler

67 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:23:22pm

re: #60 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

I know. She has made longer drives than this by herself when She came up to Silverdale, Wa. to see me when I was on the H.M. Jackson. But I still worry. She on the other hand is worried that I will not eat right while She is gone. Which is kinda funny since I am the main cook and bottle washer around this place. But still, I worry.

68 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:23:57pm

re: #8 CarleeCork

A great place to add my Great Aunt's death certificate. She left behind five children and a husband. Women seeking abortion will always find them, it's up to all of us to keep them safe and legal.

Image: Aunt_Augie.jpg

I didn't know your family had roots in Chicago.

69 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:29:13pm

Stoneage Artists Created Prehistoric Movies

Stone Age artists used‭ ‬cartoon-like techniques to give the impression that wild beasts were trotting or running across cave walls,‭ ‬a new study‭ has suggested.

‭Reporting in ‬ the June issue of Antiquity, archaeologist Marc Azéma of the University of Toulouse–Le Mirail in France and independent French artist Florent Rivère argued that by about‭ ‬30,000‭ ‬years ago Paleolithic artists used "animation effects" in their paintings. To render the movement, they deconstructed it in successive images.

According to the researchers, this would explain multiple heads or limbs on some cave paintings.

"Prehistoric man foreshadowed one of the fundamental characteristics of visual perception, retinal persistence," Azéma and Rivère wrote.

Azéma, who spent ‭ ‬20‭ ‬years researching Stone Age animation techniques,‭ isolated 53 ‬figures in‭ ‬12‭ ‬French caves that superimpose two or more images to represent trot or gallop,‭ ‬head tossing, and tail shaking.‭

"Lascaux is the cave with the greatest number of cases of split-action movement by superimposition of successive images. Some 20 animals, principally horses, have the head, legs or tail multiplied," Azéma said.

When the paintings are viewed by flickering torchlight, the animated effect "achieves its full impact," said Azéma.

70 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:33:33pm

Exclusive: Adelson's Pro-Romney Donations Will Be "Limitless," Could Top $100M

Forbes has confirmed that billionaire Sheldon Adelson, along with his wife Miriam, has donated $10 million to the leading Super PAC supporting presumptive Republican presidential nominee Mitt Romney–and that’s just the tip of the iceberg. A well-placed source in the Adelson camp with direct knowledge of the casino billionaire’s thinking says that further donations will be “limitless.”

Adelson, who has built Las Vegas Sands into an global casino empire, will do “whatever it takes” to defeat Obama, this source says. And given that Adelson is worth $24.9 billion–and told Forbes in a recent rare interview about his political giving that he had been willing to donate as much as $100 million to his initial presidential preference, Newt Gingrich–that “limitless” description telegraphs potential nine-digit support of Romney.

Adelson, this source continues, believes that “no price is too high” to protect the U.S. from what he sees as Obama’s “socialization” of America, as well as securing the safety of Israel. He added that Adelson, 78, considers this to be the most important election of his lifetime.

71 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:37:17pm

re: #69 Kragar

Stoneage Artists Created Prehistoric Movies

"And of course, with the birth of the artist came the inevitable afterbirth... the critic."

72 jaunte  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:40:12pm

re: #70 Kragar

The criminal probe of Sheldon Adelson's casino empire

...
Jacobs has also claimed in that suit that Adelson told him to hire a Macau public official, Leonel Alves, who was listed as Sands China's counsel for more than a year. Paying a public official in any capacity raises questions of bribery under the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act. Sands in court papers denied illegal activity.
.....
Jacobs further alleged that Adelson personally demanded secret investigations of Macau officials, "so that any negative information obtained could be used to exert 'leverage' in order to thwart government regulations/initiatives viewed as adverse to LVSC's (Las Vegas Sands Corporation's) interests."...

73 Mocking Jay  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:40:21pm

re: #69 Kragar

You know these 30,000 year old cave paintings were just put there by god to trick you, right?

74 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:41:51pm

re: #71 Targetpractice

"And of course, with the birth of the artist came the inevitable afterbirth... the critic."

"Those Mammoths have trunks that are too long, and the tribal chant for tonight needs more cowbell."

"What's 'cowbell'?"

"Shut up.", the Critic explained.

75 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:45:31pm

Far Right Greek party says it will throw all immigrants and their children out of hospitals and onto the streets.

A Far Right party has threatened to remove immigrants and their children from hospitals and nurseries in Greece if it gains power following Sunday's general election.

Golden Dawn issued the warning at an election campaign rally in Athens, drawing loud applause from an audience.

According to the Guardian, Golden Dawn MP Ilias Panagiotaros said: 'If Chrysi Avgi [Golden Dawn] gets into parliament, it will carry out raids on hospitals and kindergartens and it will throw immigrants and their children out on the street so that Greeks can take their place.'

Get a load of the guy's ugly mug. He looks and acts like Rush Limbaugh's uglier brother.

76 Eclectic Infidel  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:46:42pm

I made the mistake of reading the comments on the video on the archive's page.

Reading the nauseating religious justification for banning abortion, the condemnation of women, calling them murderers, just gets me crazy with anger, that's just the written word.

Time for a nice glass of shiraz.

77 Eclectic Infidel  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:49:28pm

re: #75 Dark_Falcon

Far Right Greek party says it will throw all immigrants and their children out of hospitals and onto the streets.

Get a load of the guy's ugly mug. He looks and acts like Rush Limbaugh's uglier brother.

I'm not in the least surprised. I remember reading about gangs of Greek thugs roaming the streets with clubs, looking for immigrants to assault/batter. I have a sinking feeling that Greece might be going in an ugly direction...

78 Only The Lurker Knows  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:51:26pm

re: #66 Kragar

I pretty much despise the whole Palin family, but this lawsuit is a joke. He states, in a public place, that her mother is a whore.

"Palin, who rose to fame because of a teen pregnancy when her mother was running for U.S. vice president in 2008 as a Republican, had just ridden a mechanical bull at the bar when Hanks, who was a customer there, shouted out that her mother was "a whore" and said she was "evil".

(Call my Mother that and see what the hell I try to do to you asshole).

Hanks also says he suffered emotional distress and invasion of privacy over Palin's questions about his sexuality, and the use of the incident in publicity for the TV reality show.

And now he is crying a river of tears because he called her Mother a whore (in a public venue) and asked if he was gay in the same setting.

Somebody call the WAAAAAAABULANCE!

79 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 7:56:37pm

re: #78 Bubblehead II

I pretty much despise the whole Palin family, but this lawsuit is a joke. He states, in a public place, that her mother is a whore.

"Palin, who rose to fame because of a teen pregnancy when her mother was running for U.S. vice president in 2008 as a Republican, had just ridden a mechanical bull at the bar when Hanks, who was a customer there, shouted out that her mother was "a whore" and said she was "evil".

Hanks also says he suffered emotional distress and invasion of privacy over Palin's questions about his sexuality, and the use of the incident in publicity for the TV reality show.

And now he is crying a river of tears because he called her Mother a whore (in a public venue) and asked if he was gay in the same setting.

Somebody call the WAAABULANCE!

He's just a hater. He's seeking publicity by showcasing his severe case of PDS.

80 ozbloke  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:02:19pm

For your entertainment

Prejudice

Youtube Video
81 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:10:58pm

re: #71 Targetpractice

"And of course, with the birth of the artist came the inevitable afterbirth... the critic."

Thog think brushwork unpolished and amateurish...what you mean no brushes?

82 RadicalModerate  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:13:22pm

re: #71 Targetpractice

"And of course, with the birth of the artist came the inevitable afterbirth... the critic."

+1 for the "History of the World - Pt. 1" reference.

83 CarleeCork  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:15:22pm

re: #68 Dark_Falcon

I didn't know your family had roots in Chicago.

I didn't know you knew where my family came from.

84 jaunte  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:17:33pm

Here are some of the death threats sent to a climate scientist

...James Delingpole is a British journalist for The Telegraph who was primarily responsible for the pseudo-controversy known by the unoriginal name “Climategate.” Last month, he wrote an opinion piece mocking claims by climate scientists that they’d received death threats — in particular, Phil Jones of the University of East Anglia...

85 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:18:20pm

re: #83 CarleeCork

I didn't know you knew where my family came from.

I didn't. But that death certificate is from Chicago, and things from Chicago draw my attention, since I'm from Chicago. That's all it is.

86 Mattand  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:22:16pm

re: #71 Targetpractice

"And of course, with the birth of the artist came the inevitable afterbirth... the critic."

It STINKS!

87 Mattand  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:23:22pm

re: #69 Kragar

Stoneage Artists Created Prehistoric Movies

The carving of the mammoth trunk being used as a shower head was especially illuminating.

88 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:40:17pm

re: #67 Bubblehead II

I know. She has made longer drives than this by herself when She came up to Silverdale, Wa. to see me when I was on the H.M. Jackson. But I still worry. She on the other hand is worried that I will not eat right while She is gone. Which is kinda funny since I am the main cook and bottle washer around this place. But still, I worry.

Understood. I predict all will be fine, her travels, your belly.

89 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:41:59pm

re: #72 jaunte

The criminal probe of Sheldon Adelson's casino empire

Hard to link "Casino Empire" and illegal. Yeah...

90 Varek Raith  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:42:51pm

re: #32 Killgore Trout

A bit of drama around here tonight. I was working in the greenhouse and heard screeching brakes and a collision out front. Somebody ran a stop sign and nailed a cyclist. Judging from the sounds of things he was probably going 40-50 mph. threw the cyclist over the car and almost onto the sidewalk. The driver tried to run but noticed witnesses and stopped about a block away. I went in and got some paper towels which is the extent of my first aid expertise . I got a pen and paper out of my car to write down the diver's plate # just in case. Once they saw me writing their plate # down they took off. Ambulance and police were here in under 5 minutes. His wife showed up after he was taken off and I agreed to store his bike in the basement. I took the liberty of storing his bag of cherries and oranges in the fridge.
One of the first helpers on the scene was an off duty EMT. Asked the cyclist who the president was. He said "Joe Biden" and laughed. "just kidding, It's the Obama Man".

Damn!
Good on ya.

91 Varek Raith  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:46:06pm

re: #69 Kragar

Uwe Boll.

92 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:46:38pm

re: #78 Bubblehead II

re: #79 Dark_Falcon

Leave the Kardashian Klondikes ALO O O NE!

93 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:47:30pm

re: #91 Varek Raith

Uwe Boll.

Should be tried for crimes against humanity.

94 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:51:02pm

re: #92 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

re: #79 Dark_Falcon

Leave the Kardashian Klondikes ALO O O NE!

That really is unfair to the Kardashians. Kris Jenner is actually capable of explaining an idea using words containing more than 2 syllables, which Sarah Palin cannot do, and none of Kim Kardashian's boyfriends have come close to matching Levi Johnston in the 'asshole' department.

95 CarleeCork  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:52:52pm

re: #85 Dark_Falcon

I didn't. But that death certificate is from Chicago, and things from Chicago draw my attention, since I'm from Chicago. That's all it is.

My uncle is a retired cop from Chicago and his son (my cousin) died while on duty as a Chicago cop. He died when his cruiser went out of control on an icy road and wrapped around a tree.

96 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:55:45pm

re: #91 Varek Raith

Uwe Boll.

They were French, not Germans, you fool!

97 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:57:59pm

re: #95 CarleeCork

My uncle is a retired cop from Chicago and his son (my cousin) died while on duty as a Chicago cop. He died when his cruiser went out of control on an icy road and wrapped around a tree.

Thank you for sharing that. I am grateful for their service. That may be trite to say, but I do mean it.

98 Varek Raith  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:58:05pm

re: #96 Kragar

They were French, not Germans, you fool!

He's still has a caveman's directing ability.

99 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:58:55pm

re: #94 Dark_Falcon

That really is unfair to the Kardashians. Kris Jenner is actually capable of explaining an idea using words containing more than 2 syllables, which Sarah Palin cannot do, and none of Kim Kardashian's boyfriends have come close to matching Levi Johnston in the 'asshole' department.

One famous for a sex tape.

One famous (riding the tail) of a teenage pregnancy

No smart American would ever allow their young daughter to look upon these two as nothing but bad examples. But ah America, they are the 1% you strive to be. PUKE

100 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:59:11pm

re: #98 Varek Raith

He's still has a caveman's directing ability.

Why do you hate cavemen?

101 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:59:41pm

re: #98 Varek Raith

He's still has a caveman's directing ability.

I can't for a second believe cavemen could have directed something as terrible as House of the Dead.

102 prairiefire  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 8:59:49pm

It's great to visit family, but I'm ready to head home. I miss the broad prairie sky.

103 Varek Raith  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:00:01pm

re: #100 Kragar

Why do you hate cavemen?

Because without them, you humans wouldn't be on my planet.

104 CarleeCork  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:00:47pm

re: #97 Dark_Falcon

Thank you for sharing that. I am grateful for their service. That may be trite to say, but I do mean it.

Thank you for saying that. I miss my cousin, we didn't agree politically, but we loved each other. He was a good man and had a strong faith and shared that faith with others.

105 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:01:48pm

re: #99 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

One famous for a sex tape.

One famous (riding the tail) of a teenage pregnancy

No smart American would ever allow their young daughter to look upon these two as nothing but bad examples. But ah America, they are the 1% you strive to be. PUKE

Bristol isn't the 1%, not even close (you need an income of over $300,000 to get that title, and she does not have that, though her mother does).

106 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:03:02pm

It may not be the plane, but the suit:

Now, investigators are zeroing in on a part of the flight suit called the "Combat Edge," which "hampers breathing and causes oxygen loss when combined with a physiological condition that collapses air sacs in the lungs," CNN reports.

The Air Force report is also expected to state that another possible problem for pilots is a condition called acceleration atelectasis, which causes a pilot's lungs to not effectively deliver oxygen to the bloodstream. The extreme effects of g-forces along with the pure oxygen breathed by pilots could lead to the condition.

107 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:03:18pm

re: #102 prairiefire

It's great to visit family, but I'm ready to head home. I miss the broad prairie sky.

Where are you visiting?

108 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:03:44pm

re: #103 Varek Raith

Because without them, you humans wouldn't be on my planet.

"It's not my goddamn planet. Understand, monkey boy?"

109 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:04:56pm

Oh dear. Stupid meets Wired:

Revealed: 64 Drone Bases on American Soil

The Posse Comitatus Act prohibits the U.S. military from operating on American soil, and there’s no evidence that drones have violated it so far.

Ummm. No.

Add to the fact that it's another in a long line of these Paulian types trying to hype up the drone hysteria. Half the comments are dripping.

110 gwangung  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:06:02pm

re: #109 Gus

Oh dear. Stupid meets Wired:

Revealed: 64 Drone Bases on American Soil

Ummm. No.

Add to the fact that it's another in a long line of these Paulian types trying to hype up the drone hysteria. Half the comments are dripping.

Drone bases. Like...um...military bases?

111 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:06:18pm

re: #108 Targetpractice

"It's not my goddamn planet. Understand, monkey boy?"

WHERE ARE WE GOING?!

112 Varek Raith  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:06:42pm

XD

MSNBC Video
113 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:07:16pm

re: #111 Kragar

WHERE ARE WE GOING?!

Planet Ten!

114 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:08:02pm

re: #110 gwangung

Drone bases. Like...um...military bases?

Pretty much. He even points out Edwards. Dryden has a civil UAV Team at Edwards.

115 Mocking Jay  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:10:56pm

I'm going to say this one more time... see the 10 minute gameplay demo for Watch Dogs. See it now.

Youtube Video
116 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:11:05pm

re: #109 Gus

Oh dear. Stupid meets Wired:

Revealed: 64 Drone Bases on American Soil

Ummm. No.

Add to the fact that it's another in a long line of these Paulian types trying to hype up the drone hysteria. Half the comments are dripping.

Only thing the PCA prevents is the military being used for unconstitutional actions. The military can and has been used to maintain law and order in the past. Why do these nutbars think that one of the first responses to any natural disaster is to call up the National Guard?

117 prairiefire  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:13:08pm

re: #107 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

Where are you visiting?

We are on Oahu visiting an aunt and uncle. Last week we were on the Big Island visiting my in laws. Mother Nature is on acid in Hawaii!

118 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:14:02pm

re: #116 Targetpractice

Only thing the PCA prevents is the military being used for unconstitutional actions. The military can and has been used to maintain law and order in the past. Why do these nutbars think that one of the first responses to any natural disaster is to call up the National Guard?

I'll be honest with you. I've about had it with these guys. They're starting to remind me of the 911 truthers. They're all about the same age group and the same demographics. This "drone trend" is getting hysterical.

119 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:15:35pm

re: #113 Targetpractice

Planet Ten!

WHEN?

120 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:16:03pm

re: #118 Gus

I'll be honest with you. I've about had it with these guys. They're starting to remind me of the 911 truthers. They're all about the same age group and the same demographics. This "drone trend" is getting hysterical.

I find them fascinating, if only because I used to be a conspiracy theorist myself. Kinda interesting to see people descend to depths I never plumbed to believe some of the craziest shit.

121 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:16:09pm

re: #119 Kragar

WHEN?

Soon!

122 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:17:38pm

re: #121 Targetpractice

Soon!

Not going to lie, but I had a real crush on Ellen Barkin after that movie.

123 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:20:36pm

re: #122 Kragar

Not going to lie, but I had a real crush on Ellen Barkin after that movie.

Haven't seen her in much lately. One of those 80's stars that just sorta dropped off the radar.

124 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:21:05pm

re: #117 prairiefire

We are on Oahu visiting an aunt and uncle. Last week we were on the Big Island visiting my in laws. Mother Nature is on acid in Hawaii!

GF, enjoy!!!

125 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:22:30pm

re: #123 Targetpractice

Haven't seen her in much lately. One of those 80's stars that just sorta dropped off the radar.

She married then divorced a very very rich man. She's fine. No worky needed.

126 Mocking Jay  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:22:39pm

If you saw Prometheus, you owe it to yourself to read this recap of it.

[Link: m15m.livejournal.com...]

127 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:23:33pm

re: #118 Gus

I'll be honest with you. I've about had it with these guys. They're starting to remind me of the 911 truthers. They're all about the same age group and the same demographics. This "drone trend" is getting hysterical.

The problem is it's more mainstream, at least right now. And parts of the media feed the hysteria in order to sell advertising. I'm worried America's UAV programs may end up crippled because too many congresspeople got too many phone calls and emails from ignorant constituents saying "I'm askeered uh teh drone!!1"

128 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:24:11pm

re: #120 Targetpractice

I find them fascinating, if only because I used to be a conspiracy theorist myself. Kinda interesting to see people descend to depths I never plumbed to believe some of the craziest shit.

I don't think they get the concept. A UAV in the hands of law enforcement is a tool. Both entities don't make law and both are subject to work within the confines of law. Drones (I hate that word) don't make law. They shouldn't be kvetching about their future use. They should be concerned with the laws they might object to. That same logic can be applied to their military use. The question should be why are we in AFPAK and what are our future plans. More importantly what is Karzai's plans. Their are bigger questions than UAV and their rare use in high profile cases such as Anwar al-Awlaki.

129 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:27:32pm

[Link: latimesblogs.latimes.com...]


One person dies in South L.A. explosion, official says

One person died and at least three others were injured in an explosion Wednesday evening in the Historic South-Central district of Los Angeles.

Bad. RWC?

130 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:28:12pm

re: #128 Gus

I don't think they get the concept. A UAV in the hands of law enforcement is a tool. Both entities don't make law and both are subject to work within the confines of law. Drones (I hate that word) don't make law. They shouldn't be kvetching about their future use. They should be concerned with the laws they might object to. That same logic can be applied to their military use. The question should be why are we in AFPAK and what are our future plans. More importantly what is Karzai's plans. Their are bigger questions than UAV and their rare use in high profile cases such as Anwar al-Awlaki.

These are the sorts of people who believe the government is reading their email, sorting through their garbage cans, and keeping 24 hr surveillance on them through the use of satellites and embedded chips. To them, UAVs are just another sign of the government's ever-growing encroachment on their lives and the inevitable day when they get hauled off to a FEMA camp and exterminated for not buying into the New World Order's master plan.

Shit, I just described the bulk of cyberpunk fiction.

131 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:31:35pm

re: #130 Targetpractice

These are the sorts of people who believe the government is reading their email, sorting through their garbage cans, and keeping 24 hr surveillance on them through the use of satellites and embedded chips. To them, UAVs are just another sign of the government's ever-growing encroachment on their lives and the inevitable day when they get hauled off to a FEMA camp and exterminated for not buying into the New World Order's master plan.

Shit, I just described the bulk of cyberpunk fiction.

I was just thinking that this new "64 drone bases" "report" is the new FEMA camps for the drone bunch. They're using most of those for training. The civilian uses include atmospheric research, border surveillance, maritime patrols, etc. Albeit it's still very minimal. Of course you can deck out modern helicopters with a lot of electronic gear. Most have infrared sensors.

132 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:33:52pm

re: #126 It's a cookbook!

If you saw Prometheus, you owe it to yourself to read this recap of it.

[Link: m15m.livejournal.com...]

The more I read, the more my initial judgement upon seeing the trailer seems to have been correct.

133 Mocking Jay  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:34:52pm

re: #132 Kragar

The more I read, the more my initial judgement upon seeing the trailer seems to have been correct.

Which was?

134 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:35:35pm

re: #122 Kragar

Not going to lie, but I had a real crush on Ellen Barkin after that movie.

Did you ever see the 1995 movie Bad Company? There's a very brief couple of frames where she exposes her naughty bits while straddling Laurence Fishburne. Kind of random too, easy to miss. At first my friends didn't believe me when I yelled out "vagina!" So I made them rewind it, cementing my reputation as an eagle eyed celebrity muff spotter.

Wait, did I just say that out loud?

135 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:35:56pm

re: #131 Gus

I was just thinking that this new "64 drone bases" "report" is the new FEMA camps for the drone bunch. They're using most of those for training. The civilian uses include atmospheric research, border surveillance, maritime patrols, etc. Albeit it's still very minimal. Of course you can deck out modern helicopters with a lot of electronic gear. Most have infrared sensors.

Quite Concur.

136 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:37:03pm

Texas man took a camera with him to document his Stand Your Ground confrontation. This is a local news show showing the video followed by a short analysis of whether he was in the right. He shot three people, one of whom died. He's now using the video he shot to justify his action.

137 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:37:44pm

re: #131 Gus

I was just thinking that this new "64 drone bases" "report" is the new FEMA camps for the drone bunch. They're using most of those for training. The civilian uses include atmospheric research, border surveillance, maritime patrols, etc. Albeit it's still very minimal. Of course you can deck out modern helicopters with a lot of electronic gear. Most have infrared sensors.

Yeah, but UAVs that have come online in the last two decades now offer speed, range, and payload that were out of reach before. The possibilities are rather endless as to what they could be adapted for, provided one has the money and the motivation. Then again, that's been true for a lot of technologies in the past that went to fallow in the civilian world when folks got a gander at the price tag.

138 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:37:57pm

Lol, my housemate has been converted. Boots on the ground success. Hearing him talk to his peep on the phone (very intelligent points btw) about how Obama is better for US than Romney.

"Seamus the dog!! Blah blah, look it up! The worst person to run a country!!"

I'm LOL and have a smile on my face.

139 Daniel Ballard  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:38:21pm

re: #135 Dark_Falcon

Who else remembers the similar debate about police helicopters?
LAPD circa 60's

140 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:38:43pm

re: #137 Targetpractice

Yeah, but UAVs that have come online in the last two decades now offer speed, range, and payload that were out of reach before. The possibilities are rather endless as to what they could be adapted for, provided one has the money and the motivation. Then again, that's been true for a lot of technologies in the past that went to fallow in the civilian world when folks got a gander at the price tag.

Yes. Here's another way I look at it. Complaining about drones is like complaining about the IRS. ;)

141 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:38:45pm

For those of you who know what makes the world really go 'round, today BP released its annual Statistical Review, which is seen as the most comprehensive review of fuel and energy produced by a private entity, and has been for many years.

Be warned, though, that collective obfuscation is in full operation (which is not new.) It takes a careful eye, and one with experience, to pick out the real measurements from the, let's call it "analysis".

For example, in the oil section the link for "oil production" describes the contents as:

Crude oil production data for crude and shale oil, oils sands and NGLs

Read that very carefully. Did you notice the slight of hand?

142 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:38:54pm

re: #138 Residence: Hopeandchangeistan 2012

Lol, my housemate has been converted. Boots on the ground success. Hearing him talk to his peep on the phone (very intelligent points btw) about how Obama is better for US than Romney.

"Seamus the dog!! Blah blah, look it up! The worst person to run a country!!"

I'm LOL and have a smile on my face.

Your Vast Left Wing Conspiracy check will be in the mail first thing tomorrow.

//

143 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:40:25pm

re: #141 freetoken

For those of you who know what makes the world really go 'round, today BP released its annual Statistical Review, which is seen as the most comprehensive review of fuel and energy produced by a private entity, and has been for many years.

Be warned, though, that collective obfuscation is in full operation (which is not new.) It takes a careful eye, and one with experience, to pick out the real measurements from the, let's call it "analysis".

For example, in the oil section the link for "oil production" describes the contents as:

Read that very carefully. Did you notice the slight of hand?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't "shale oil" and "oil sand" virtually the same thing?

144 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:41:12pm

re: #139 Daniel Ballard

Who else remembers the similar debate about police helicopters?
LAPD circa 60's

I would prefer a nice quiet drone over a police helicopter chopping about at any hour of the night. Although it will be some time before a UAV can match the tactical advantage of a manned police helicopter.

145 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:41:23pm

re: #133 It's a cookbook!

Which was?

Crap sandwich.

146 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:42:17pm

Down with city hall!

//

147 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:43:08pm

re: #140 Gus

Yes. Here's another way I look at it. Complaining about drones is like complaining about the IRS. ;)

God, if I never hear a Paulian bitch about the IRS or the Fed ever again, I can die happy.

148 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:44:04pm

re: #136 The Ghost of a Flea

Texas man took a camera with him to document his Stand Your Ground confrontation. This is a local news show showing the video followed by a short analysis of whether he was in the right. He shot three people, one of whom died. He's now using the video he shot to justify his action.

Doesn't making a video tape of you shooting a person, with a camera you brought along specifically to document the shooting, indicate a certain degree of premeditation leading up to the shooting?

149 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:44:56pm

re: #136 The Ghost of a Flea

Texas man took a camera with him to document his Stand Your Ground confrontation. This is a local news show showing the video followed by a short analysis of whether he was in the right. He shot three people, one of whom died. He's now using the video he shot to justify his action.

I should add that his claim probably won't fly given the language of the SYG law in Texas.

150 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:46:37pm

re: #143 Targetpractice

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't "shale oil" and "oil sand" virtually the same thing?

No.

However, that is one of the many problems with their definition.

Truth is, hydrocarbons are found in all sorts of material, and in various states (gas, liquid, solid.)

"Shale oil" makes no sense, as the term does not discriminate between (1) crude (liquid) petroleum which is trappedin situ in sedimentary rocks that geologists call shale, and (2) kerogen which is still in the source sedimentary rock in which it was laid down millions of years ago.

Then, the term "oil sand" is a misdirection too. Liquid petroleum can be trapped underground in sandstone or sand deposits. However, what is found in Alberta Canada has been exposed to surface (water and air) and has degraded into tar. That is why it ought to be called "tar sands products". To make it a useful product not only does it has to cleaned from the sand but then it has to be mixed with a lighter hydrocarbon or have hydrogen atoms added.

And we're still not to the #1 deception in that little phrase I quoted.

151 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:47:46pm

re: #147 Targetpractice

God, if I never hear a Paulian bitch about the IRS or the Fed ever again, I can die happy.

Before when I went out for my fan? I got stuck in traffic -- a rather bad jam. It was wall to wall cars for at least 2 miles. There was traffic everywhere. Smog. All of us in our car humming along with our oil driven engines. I thought about climate change and what we need to do. Thinking. Seeing all of these cars while thinking about any chance or movement towards mitigation. There were no drones, UAVs, airplanes, choppers, or even one cop in the picture.

152 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:49:09pm

re: #149 The Ghost of a Flea

I should add that his claim probably won't fly given the language of the SYG law in Texas.

Have you met Joe Horn?

Youtube Video
153 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:51:47pm

June 13, 1944. First German V-1 rocket launched against the United Kingdom.

154 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:55:26pm

re: #153 Gus

June 13, 1944. First German V-1 rocket launched against the United Kingdom.

I've always found something astonishing about the technological advances Germany squeezed out in such a short time during the war, cruise missiles being one of them.

155 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:57:06pm

Here's what BP ought to have written, to be even close to accurate:

Crude oil Total liquid production data for traditional crude petroleum, petroleum from non-traditional source deposits, and kerogen shale oil products, oils tar sands and NGLs

BP, like most of their customers, though, have a vested interest in continuing to obfuscate.

The differences matter for two reasons. First, the non-traditional source of liquid hydrocarbons are much more expensive to produce, which is why things made from them cost more. Secondly, these unusual sources often have even worse eco-system effects from their production techniques than traditional petroleum.

156 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:57:38pm

Never, ever, underestimate the ability of humans to collectively lie to themselves.

157 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:57:47pm

re: #149 The Ghost of a Flea

I should add that his claim probably won't fly given the language of the SYG law in Texas.

How does the Texas law differ from the one in Florida?

158 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:58:11pm

re: #148 Kragar

Doesn't making a video tape of you shooting a person, with a camera you brought along specifically to document the shooting, indicate a certain degree of premeditation leading up to the shooting?

He doesn't actually film the shooting...the camera drops and you can hear the shoots.

I'm not good enough to do a transcript off one viewing, but the rough flow of what happens is that Rodriguez, with camera and gun, confronts neighbors about too-loud music at a party. He's actually narrating to the camera as he goes. When the neighbors reject his demands, he mentions his weapon and feeling threatened. The neighbors respond by getting angry to him "flashing" his gun, and mention going to their house to "get something equal." Rodriguez then narrates that the situation is escalating and he has to defend himself...(notably, the filmed neighbors are at that moment at least five or six paces away and not armed...one did make a move to get closer but was grabbed by his friends).

It's eery to watch. He's playacting the right things to say and do in a self-defense situation, yet his own video really suggests no salient threat.

159 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 9:59:49pm

re: #154 Targetpractice

I've always found something astonishing about the technological advances Germany squeezed out in such a short time during the war, cruise missiles being one of them.

The Germans will always be Germans. They are a very technologically and scientifically prone nation. Many of the greatest thinkers, designers, scientists have been Germans and many of them German Jews.

160 darthstar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:00:10pm

Too bad nobody took me up on that ticket offer...perfect game for Matt Cain...pretty sweet.

161 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:00:50pm

re: #157 Dark_Falcon

How does the Texas law differ from the one in Florida?

The language says that if you are carrying a (legal) concealed weapon, start a confrontation and then use the firearm in self-defense, you're not covered by SYG.

162 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:03:41pm

A National Review Online article I think we'll all agree with:

Fears of ‘Creeping Sharia’
This chimerical battle in the culture war poses real dangers.

By Matthew Schmitz

The anti-sharia movement also undermines national security in much more concrete ways. Tom Lynch recently linked to a post by one Gary DeMar contending that instruction in the Arabic language in a New York City public school was part of a program of deliberate Islamization. Now, the real reason the school selected Arabic was to help it gain certification from the prestigious International Baccalaureate (IB) program, but DeMar brushed this fact aside: “I suspect that the IB program is more about the Islamization of America than anything else.”

Teaching Arabic in our schools, of course, is precisely the kind of thing that will help Americans combat terrorism. The fact that the anti-sharia people so readily oppose it shows they are much more concerned about the specter of “creeping sharia” than about readying our nation to intelligently counter immediate and ongoing terrorist threats. They would rather win a chimerical battle in the culture war than support policies that could provide critical aid to Americans engaged abroad who stand in need of agents, officers, and interpreters with a firm grasp of Arabic.

Unhinged rhetoric, if long enough tolerated, will eventually impose real costs. The National Conference of State Legislatures says anti-sharia measures already have been considered in 20 states, and Oklahoma, Arizona, Louisiana, and Tennessee have all enacted such measures. These bills put religious contracts on an unequal footing with secular ones without extending any new constitutional or legal protections to women in Muslim communities. Their conservative advocates embarrass the very name of “religious liberty” and endanger our national security.

Anti-Muslim bigots and their public apologists must be vigorously opposed by Americans who recognize the value of a religious voice in the public square and the imperative that all Americans be treated equally under the law, whether they are religious or irreligious, Christian, Muslim, or Jew.

163 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:05:18pm

re: #161 The Ghost of a Flea

The language says that if you are carrying a (legal) concealed weapon, start a confrontation and then use the firearm in self-defense, you're not covered by SYG.

A reasonable addition and one I suspect does prevent some of the absurd situations that have been seen under Florida's SYG law.

164 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:10:35pm

re: #162 Dark_Falcon

Gary DeMar is one of the leaders of Christian Dominionism and has written several books on that topic.

The author of that article, Matthew Schmitz, often writes on religious/moral topics:
[Link: www.firstthings.com...]

and is no doubt fully aware of DeMar's stances on many things.

165 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:15:07pm

84 dead.

166 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:18:15pm

It is not yet known who is responsible for the attacks but Iraqi Sunni insurgents tied to al-Qaeda have attacked Shia targets in the past.

167 dell*nix  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:18:24pm

re: #165 Gus

Ignorance and stupidity abounding.

168 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:18:43pm

re: #165 Gus

Sad.

How many more do we expect in the next few years? Do we really believe Iraq will settle down into stable state?

169 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:18:47pm

re: #165 Gus

84 dead.

I fear it's only going to keep getting worse.

170 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:19:55pm

re: #167 dell*nix

re: #168 freetoken

re: #169 Targetpractice

Sectarian violence continues. Sunni versus Shia.

171 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:20:26pm

re: #169 Targetpractice

I fear it's only going to keep getting worse.

Unlikely. Al Qaeda in Iraq isn't what it was in 2006.

172 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:20:30pm

AQ in turn takes advantage of that.

173 Lidane  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:20:40pm

Finally! I've been having site issues with LGF and other pages and I finally narrowed down the problem -- Flash. Installed a Flash killing extension into Chrome that changes all Flash elements on a page into clickable elements, and voila! Problem solved.

174 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:20:59pm

re: #171 Dark_Falcon

Unlikely. Al Qaeda in Iraq isn't what it was in 2006.

True.

175 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:25:03pm

re: #173 Lidane

Finally! I've been having site issues with LGF and other pages and I finally narrowed down the problem -- Flash. Installed a Flash killing extension into Chrome that changes all Flash elements on a page into clickable elements, and voila! Problem solved.

Thought you were awfully quiet tonight.

//

176 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:25:09pm

re: #163 Dark_Falcon

A reasonable addition and one I suspect does prevent some of the absurd situations that have been seen under Florida's SYG law.

Well, it's good in the sense that he'll get convicted...maybe...because of that language. Unless he gets the Joe Horn treatment.

However, I dislike the larger trend in which SYG muddies the ground on what's justifiable homicide. This shooting falls in with a bunch of others in terms of armed individuals "misunderstanding" their right to exercise lethal force. That they sometimes get convicted doesn't change that there are dead and maimed people. In this case, the dead guy was a middle school teacher whose music was too loud.

177 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:29:26pm

re: #176 The Ghost of a Flea

Well, it's good in the sense that he'll get convicted...maybe...because of that language. Unless he gets the Joe Horn treatment.

However, I dislike the larger trend in which SYG muddies the ground on what's justifiable homicide. This shooting falls in with a bunch of others in terms of armed individuals "misunderstanding" their right to exercise lethal force. That they sometimes get convicted doesn't change that there are dead and maimed people. In this case, the dead guy was a middle school teacher whose music was too loud.

Well, given the language SYG may not be operational, as the judge could say his 'looking for trouble' obviates any claim of self-defense. In such a situation, he would not be allowed to mount an SYG defense at all.

178 Lidane  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:30:16pm

re: #175 Targetpractice

Thought you were awfully quiet tonight.

//

Quiet for the last few days. My one trip to the ER for an ulcer last week turned into a second trip for strained back muscles because I'd spent so much energy trying to twist myself into comfortable positions that I just made things worse. Yay for prescription drugs! I'm all better now. :D

All that's left is finding a damn job. I've easily sent over a dozen applications in the last three days, and weeded out a company that I thought sounded great until I saw their application. Not only did they demand my current salary, but my desired salary on the initial application. NOT happening. Ever. I refuse to talk money with a potential employer before I've ever even met them.

179 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:30:44pm

Congrats to Killgore for getting the Silver in the top 10 comments tonight. Felt good to up-ding him.

180 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:32:24pm

re: #178 Lidane

Quiet for the last few days. My one trip to the ER for an ulcer last week turned into a second trip for strained back muscles because I'd spent so much energy trying to twist myself into comfortable positions that I just made things worse. Yay for prescription drugs! I'm all better now. :D

All that's left is finding a damn job. I've easily sent over a dozen applications in the last three days, and weeded out a company that I thought sounded great until I saw their application. Not only did they demand my current salary, but my desired salary on the initial application. NOT happening. Ever. I refuse to talk money with a potential employer before I've ever even met them.

Yikes, I'd thought the ulcer was it. Well, I do hope you're feeling better or will be in the near future. And good luck on the job hunt, lord knows it can't be easy these days.

181 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:33:12pm

Barth's Notes: Together at Long Last: Pam Gellar and the English Defense League

with the final note:

(Hat tip: LGF)

182 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:35:15pm

re: #181 The Ghost of a Flea

Barth's Notes: Together at Long Last: Pam Gellar and the English Defense League

with the final note:

Nice. :)

183 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:35:41pm

I hate haters.

184 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:36:33pm

re: #177 Dark_Falcon

Well, given the language SYG may not be operational, as the judge could say his 'looking for trouble' obviates any claim of self-defense. In such a situation, he would not be allowed to mount an SYG defense at all.

Rodriguez has been convicted. The punishment phase begins tomorrow.

The point though is that the very existence of the SYG law is what got that guy killed. It planted the idea in Rodriguez's head that if he said all the right things that he might be able to get away with murder.

185 Lidane  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:37:39pm

re: #180 Targetpractice

Yikes, I'd thought the ulcer was it. Well, I do hope you're feeling better or will be in the near future. And good luck on the job hunt, lord knows it can't be easy these days.

Oh, I'm feeling good now. I laid low, stayed offline and focused on getting better for the last few days. Plus, apart from the ulcer medication that I have to take daily, I took the painkiller and muscle relaxant for my back sparingly, so I still have a few if I need them.

And thanks. The job hunt is annoying and obnoxious, but I'm hopeful. I'm casting my net widely, sending apps in all directions. With any luck something will come through soon.

186 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:38:53pm

re: #184 goddamnedfrank

I wish this had come up two hours ago, when I had the energy to argue it. But it's too late for that now, and I need to go to bed.

Good Night, all.

187 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:40:40pm

Hate the logical fallacy; love the person.
-- Atheist Christian

//

188 gwangung  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:40:58pm

re: #184 goddamnedfrank

Rodriguez has been convicted. The punishment phase begins tomorrow.

The point though is that the very existence of the SYG law is what got that guy killed. It planted the idea in Rodriguez's head that if he said all the right things that he might be able to get away with murder.

That's like a religious catechism, a formula for forgiveness a lot of right wingers seems to rely on.

Boy, are some people gonna be surprised....

189 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:44:39pm

re: #185 Lidane

Oh, I'm feeling good now. I laid low, stayed offline and focused on getting better for the last few days. Plus, apart from the ulcer medication that I have to take daily, I took the painkiller and muscle relaxant for my back sparingly, so I still have a few if I need them.

And thanks. The job hunt is annoying and obnoxious, but I'm hopeful. I'm casting my net widely, sending apps in all directions. With any luck something will come through soon.

Yeah, I haven't been here as much as I've wanted to be recently, been feeling a bit off for some reason. Think I ended up stressing my self out a couple weeks back when I was supposed to go on vacation. I've actually come to dread visiting my grandmother, if only because it means driving 12 hours both ways.

190 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:50:31pm

*pokes the thread* It's dead, Jim.

191 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:55:39pm

re: #190 Targetpractice

*pokes the thread* It's dead, Jim.

(goes thru the thread's pockets for loose change)

192 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:56:15pm

re: #191 Kragar

(goes thru the thread's pockets for loose change)

Loose change was an inside job!!!

193 Lidane  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 10:57:29pm

re: #192 Gus

Loose change was an inside job!!!

Say that loud enough and you'll get Alex Jones going.

194 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:11:03pm

8 Second Cuda Pass **INCAR**AWSOME**SOUND**SantaPod

Youtube Video

The end is awesome.

195 Kronocide  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:11:23pm

Thermite.

Super Thermite.

ExoKinetic Thermite.

196 ozbloke  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:17:49pm

Aussie comedian, Carl Barron

Youtube Video
197 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:18:02pm

Putin propaganda:

198 Gus  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:18:42pm

Any questions please line up.

199 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:19:21pm

re: #197 Gus

Putin propaganda:

[Embedded content]

Liberal propaganda!

200 ozbloke  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:19:57pm

re: #198 Gus

Any questions please line up.

Are fruit flies healthier than normal flies?

201 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:20:31pm

re: #198 Gus

Any questions please line up.

What does God need with a starship?

202 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:31:30pm

re: #198 Gus

Any questions please line up.

Dafuq?

203 freetoken  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:32:00pm

re: #197 Gus

What I find sad is that almost none of our fellow citizens even know that the US is engaged in negotiating these type of things, that there even is a TPP, or exactly what the provisions could mean to them.

If ignorance is bliss, then we are a very blissful people.

204 Kragar  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:38:08pm

My journey's of the internet in my quest for ultimate power take me to some truly bizarre places at time.

Let me just say Rule 34, Jesus and the Flying Spaghetti Monster and leave it at that.

I need to go scour myself clean now.

205 Targetpractice  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:41:54pm

re: #204 Kragar

My journey's of the internet in my quest for ultimate power take me to some truly bizarre places at time.

Let me just say Rule 34, Jesus and the Flying Spaghetti Monster and leave it at that.

I need to go scour myself clean now.

Nothing a few swigs of brain bleach can't fix.

206 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Jun 13, 2012 11:45:45pm

76 Things Banned in Leviticus

People opposed to the use of Leviticus often make light of its odd, outdated rules. What I find more interested is that the people who take Leviticus 18:22 so seriously prefer to duck and weave around stuff like:

“the foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born” (Leviticus 19:33-34)

207 freetoken  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 12:34:22am

re: #206 The Ghost of a Flea

Just because I'm an implacable pedant I will note that their claim:

Here’s chapter and verse on a more-or-less comprehensive list of things banned in the Leviticus book of the bible. .... :

23. Going to church within 33 days after giving birth to a boy (12:4)

24. Going to church within 66 days after giving birth to a girl (12:5)

Is not quite accurate. The NIV translation:

12 The Lord said to Moses, 2 “Say to the Israelites: ‘A woman who becomes pregnant and gives birth to a son will be ceremonially unclean for seven days, just as she is unclean during her monthly period. 3 On the eighth day the boy is to be circumcised. 4 Then the woman must wait thirty-three days to be purified from her bleeding. She must not touch anything sacred or go to the sanctuary until the days of her purification are over. 5 If she gives birth to a daughter, for two weeks the woman will be unclean, as during her period. Then she must wait sixty-six days to be purified from her bleeding.

6 “‘When the days of her purification for a son or daughter are over, she is to bring to the priest at the entrance to the tent of meeting a year-old lamb for a burnt offering and a young pigeon or a dove for a sin offering.[a] 7 He shall offer them before the Lord to make atonement for her, and then she will be ceremonially clean from her flow of blood.

“‘These are the regulations for the woman who gives birth to a boy or a girl. 8 But if she cannot afford a lamb, she is to bring two doves or two young pigeons, one for a burnt offering and the other for a sin offering. In this way the priest will make atonement for her, and she will be clean. ’”

The idea is one of ritual purification (which, it ought to be noted, is not the same as a personal sin) and the ability to participate in the public rituals. This is not quite the same as some ideas of what a Christian "church" is, or ought to be. Since in Christianity there is no such thing as human managed "ritual purity", these old Judahite customs just can't be applied today (and, I'll note, there isn't a mobile Sanctuary or the permanent one in a Jewish temple anymore, so none of these purification rituals can strictly apply at all.)

208 freetoken  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 1:04:44am
MP3 Audio
209 Kragar  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 1:07:35am
Youtube Video
210 researchok  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 1:15:51am

Morning, all

211 researchok  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 1:20:06am

re: #208 freetoken

Great era- but not a lot which can beat this

212 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 1:53:20am

re: #211 researchok

Great era- but not a lot which can beat this

Must be a generational bias, but it seems that there is very little music coming out that is not derivative or a direct descendant of the 60's...

213 researchok  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 2:03:23am

re: #212 Expand Your Ground

The Ronettes were before my time but I'd have to agree somewhat.

The better music today is derivative- because it descends from great music.

214 Decatur Deb  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 2:46:40am

re: #207 freetoken

Just because I'm an implacable pedant I will note that their claim:

Is not quite accurate. The NIV translation:

The idea is one of ritual purification (which, it ought to be noted, is not the same as a personal sin) and the ability to participate in the public rituals. This is not quite the same as some ideas of what a Christian "church" is, or ought to be. Since in Christianity there is no such thing as human managed "ritual purity", these old Judahite customs just can't be applied today (and, I'll note, there isn't a mobile Sanctuary or the permanent one in a Jewish temple anymore, so none of these purification rituals can strictly apply at all.)

'Morning, all.

There is a hangover of the Old Testament in the Catholic/Anglican feast of Candlemas (Purification or Presentation) and the old practice of 'churching'.

[Link: www.fisheaters.com...]

215 Decatur Deb  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 3:03:37am

re: #212 Expand Your Ground

Must be a generational bias, but it seems that there is very little music coming out that is not derivative or a direct descendant of the 60's...

Already an oldie in the 1760s:

Youtube Video

Re-recycled 1960s derivative:

Youtube Video

Re-re-recycled:

Youtube Video
216 Varek Raith  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 3:50:54am

Air Force Osprey crash at Florida base injures five
This thing is stupid. Sheesh.

217 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 3:53:47am

re: #216 Varek Raith

Air Force Osprey crash at Florida base injures five
This thing is stupid. Sheesh.

we just need to spend more money to fix it.

/

218 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:18:32am

re: #216 Varek Raith

They sure as hell look cool.

219 Decatur Deb  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:24:04am

US military's first Class A. Wilbur at the controls, the Army's first aviator co-piloting.

Image: Fort_Myer_Wright_Flyer_crash.jpg

220 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:24:07am

NY Senate proposes law to bar welfare spending on booze, cigarettes, gambling and adult entertainment


Read more: [Link: www.nypost.com...]
This is like closing the barn doors after the horses get out.

221 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:24:18am

re: #218 Tommy's cone of shame

They sure as hell look cool.

they look like 20 billion dollars' worth of cool, yes...

222 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:26:16am

I watched this video, and it gave me nightmares last night.

223 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:41:47am

re: #220 Tommy's cone of shame

NY Senate proposes law to bar welfare spending on booze, cigarettes, gambling and adult entertainment

Read more: [Link: www.nypost.com...]
This is like closing the barn doors after the horses get out.

And there's nothing worse than drunk, smoking, gambling horses going to a strip club!

224 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:42:57am

re: #219 Decatur Deb

US military's first Class A. Wilbur at the controls, the Army's first aviator co-piloting.

Image: Fort_Myer_Wright_Flyer_crash.jpg

Imagine the paperwork needed to be done of that happened today!!
/

225 Varek Raith  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:46:30am

re: #219 Decatur Deb

US military's first Class A. Wilbur at the controls, the Army's first aviator co-piloting.

Image: Fort_Myer_Wright_Flyer_crash.jpg

Cost...what, 50 bucks to build???

226 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:52:15am

T - 55 Minutes...

I'll be busy a good chunk of the day but I'll give everyone a follow up later on. Meanwhile, lizards, have a good day, Your positive waves sure couldn't hurt, either ;)

227 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 4:58:58am

re: #219 Decatur Deb

US military's first Class A. Wilbur at the controls, the Army's first aviator co-piloting.

Image: Fort_Myer_Wright_Flyer_crash.jpg

That's what you get for going to the Class VI first.../// :LOL:

228 Decatur Deb  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:00:14am

re: #225 Varek Raith

Cost...what, 50 bucks to build???

$100,000 in 1908 dollars. Top speed 42 MPH, 40 mile range, 250 lb payload.

[Link: www.wifcon.com...]

229 Decatur Deb  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:04:31am

Off to give the Rover its monthly top-off with 90wt. BBL

230 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:14:19am

re: #183 Gus

I hate haters.

Honk if you hate noise pollution.


Don't read this sentence under penalty of the law.

231 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:19:10am

Morning Lizardim from the grey and stormy wild north country. Too bad I didn't get the back yard done before the rain came. Sigh.

232 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:26:38am

re: #223 sattv4u2

And there's nothing worse than drunk, smoking, gambling horses going to a strip club!

Why the long face?

233 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:30:02am

re: #232 RayFerd

Why the long face?

Somethings NAGging at me

234 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:33:04am

re: #233 sattv4u2

Somethings NAGging at me

What is the mane problem?

235 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:34:00am

re: #234 RayFerd

What is the mane problem?

I think someones tailing me!

236 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:35:24am

re: #235 sattv4u2

I think someones tailing me!

It would behoove you to find cover.

237 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:36:31am

re: #236 RayFerd

It would behoove you to find cover.

Any ideas? I can't blend in with the bridle party!

238 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:38:27am

re: #237 sattv4u2

Any ideas? I can't blend in with the bridle party!

Maybe just stall for time.

239 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:39:18am

re: #238 RayFerd

Maybe just stall for time.

Neigh,,,I should get going fast. I think I'll make hay!

240 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:40:21am

re: #239 sattv4u2

Neigh,,,I should get going fast. I think I'll make hay!

Ok, but if you get in a tight spot I might be able to bale you out.

241 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:47:26am

re: #240 RayFerd

Ok, but if you get in a tight spot I might be able to bale you out.

You're the best, barn non!

242 dell*nix  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:48:10am

Sheesh, a nightmare of a pun thread.

243 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:48:44am

re: #242 dell*nix

Sheesh, a nightmare of a pun thread.

Took you long enough to join in. Why were you stallion?

244 dell*nix  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:49:06am

Being held at bay.

245 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:50:06am

Gah, some RWNJ is spam-tweeting randomMargaret Sanger quotes to make it sound like she wanted to exterminate a bunch of genetic inferiors by birth-controlling the shit out of them.

246 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:50:28am

re: #244 dell*nix

Being held at bay.

Well, saddle up and git along!

247 dell*nix  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:50:58am

I'll get a roan to it later.

248 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:52:35am

re: #247 dell*nix

I'll get a roan to it later.

Well, if you don't get here before I leave, Abyssinian later!

249 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:53:14am

re: #245 Learned Mother of Zion

Gah, some RWNJ is spam-tweeting randomMargaret Sanger quotes to make it sound like she wanted to exterminate a bunch of genetic inferiors by birth-controlling the shit out of them.

Not that old chestnut again!

250 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:53:53am

re: #249 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Not that old chestnut again!

Yeah, they're trotting out the same old justifications all over again.

251 dragonfire1981  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:55:23am

They have just added a photo wall showing top company management in our break room at work.

There are photos of 13 people

3 are women
10 are men

ALL are white.

252 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:56:01am

re: #250 thedopefishlives

Yeah, they're trotting out the same old justifications all over again.

How tack-y

253 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:56:20am

re: #249 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Not that old chestnut again!

Here's a sample:

His entire timeline is full of this shit.

254 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 5:59:49am

re: #253 Learned Mother of Zion

His entire timeline is full of this shit.

Context? We don't need no stinkin' context.

255 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:03:41am

re: #253 Learned Mother of Zion

Margaret Sanger is dead.

The current leadership of Planned Parenthood has no tinge of racial bias to them whatsoever.

This line of attack is as idiotic as going after Obama through Ayers.

256 kirkspencer  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:06:14am

re: #216 Varek Raith

Air Force Osprey crash at Florida base injures five
This thing is stupid. Sheesh.

Go look at the failure rate over the first two decades for tandem rotor helicopters. The V22 is significantly better.

I like "this thing". Its practical comparison is against helicopters with similar carrying capacity, and it wins both logistically and in operational flexibility.

257 kirkspencer  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:07:10am

re: #253 Learned Mother of Zion

Here's a sample:

[Embedded content] His entire timeline is full of this shit.

sigh. Yay, eugenics. ///

258 kirkspencer  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:09:20am

re: #257 kirkspencer

and yes I know the point you were trying to make, but when they slice and dice that way it makes me wonder if they're projecting.

259 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:20:07am

re: #255 Obdicut

Margaret Sanger is dead.

The current leadership of Planned Parenthood has no tinge of racial bias to them whatsoever.

This line of attack is as idiotic as going after Obama through Ayers.

Then there's this asshat tweeting the Lila Rose crap:

260 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:23:54am

re: #259 Learned Mother of Zion

Ugh. I don't understand why people have to be such asshats about this.

261 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:27:07am

Morning all!

Was stuck in traffic on the way to get Grandma last night. We went to dinner and came back and still got stuck in traffic. It was really bad.

Here is why.

Asshole drivers.

How are you?

262 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:29:05am

re: #253 Learned Mother of Zion

Here's a sample:

[Embedded content] His entire timeline is full of this shit.

Margaret Sanger advocated Individual Choice. She assumed a mother wouldn't want to have a "feeble-minded" child. She also knew that the number and spacing of pregnancies contributed to the health of both the mother and the child.

She did not advocate Government mandated reproduction.

263 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:38:28am

re: #261 ggt

Morning all!

Was stuck in traffic on the way to get Grandma last night. We went to dinner and came back and still got stuck in traffic. It was really bad.

Here is why.

Asshole drivers.

How are you?

Heh, I admit that I occasionally have bouts of barely controllable road rage. Maybe this story will help me keep it in check more often.

264 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:39:23am

Good morning lizards!

265 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:47:21am

Dog's against Romney

266 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:48:23am

re: #265 ggt

Dog's against Romney

Did canines get the vote? I thought the feline overlords were taking great pains to block that.

267 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:49:30am

re: #263 thedopefishlives

Heh, I admit that I occasionally have bouts of barely controllable road rage. Maybe this story will help me keep it in check more often.

I don't get the cannibus angle, perhaps it wasn't road rage, but some idiot stoned and racing. either way, a motorcyclist is dead and untold hundreds were really, really late getting home last night. The roads affected are the few that lead from the highwayt to a lot of neighborhoods. The traffic during rush hour is normally bad.

268 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:50:24am

re: #266 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Did canines get the vote? I thought the feline overlords were taking great pains to block that.

I hadn't heard.

Been out of the loop for a few days.

269 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:51:05am

re: #262 ggt

Margaret Sanger advocated Individual Choice. She assumed a mother wouldn't want to have a "feeble-minded" child. She also knew that the number and spacing of pregnancies contributed to the health of both the mother and the child.

She did not advocate Government mandated reproduction.

And now @jstrevino has blocked me!

270 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:51:31am

re: #267 ggt

I don't get the cannibus angle, perhaps it wasn't road rage, but some idiot stoned and racing. either way, a motorcyclist is dead and untold hundreds were really, really late getting home last night. The roads affected are the few that lead from the highwayt to a lot of neighborhoods. The traffic during rush hour is normally bad.

Yeah, I know how Chicago traffic is. I actively try to avoid it at all costs when driving back to fish country.

271 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:51:52am

re: #265 ggt

Dog's against Romney

There is a license plate cover that says "I ride inside".

Some really good thinkers behind this!

272 darthstar  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:52:02am

Mornin' everyone...still kind of jazzed about being there for Matt Cain's perfect game last night...of course, that kind of shit happens all the time in baseball, so I don't see what the big deal is really...


Oh, and Fox is now plagiarizing liberals?

273 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:52:56am

re: #272 darthstar

Mornin' everyone...still kind of jazzed about being there for Matt Cain's perfect game last night...of course, that kind of shit happens all the time in baseball, so I don't see what the big deal is really...

You were there?! ENVIOUS!

274 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:53:01am

re: #269 Learned Mother of Zion

And now @jstrevino has blocked me!

Success! You hit a nerve!

Good Job!

The Spanish word for Success is Exito! It might work better in this case. LOL

275 darthstar  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:54:47am

re: #273 thedopefishlives

You were there?! ENVIOUS!

Look upthread. I had an extra ticket and couldn't give it away.

276 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:55:22am

re: #270 thedopefishlives

Yeah, I know how Chicago traffic is. I actively try to avoid it at all costs when driving back to fish country.

which is why I don't get the whole scenerio as it was written in the article. Traffic is normally moving rather slowly at this series of intersections at 5pm. The guy must have been really f-ed up to be going fast enough to kill someone.

There is also construction right there, so I can't imagine traffic going over 20 miles an hour during a green light.

277 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:55:35am

re: #275 darthstar

Look upthread. I had an extra ticket and couldn't give it away.

It's understandable, but in hindsight, I bet a lot of people are wishing they'd taken you up on it. Heh.

278 darthstar  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:57:14am

re: #277 thedopefishlives

It's understandable, but in hindsight, I bet a lot of people are wishing they'd taken you up on it. Heh.

Yeah, I offered it up to my fb friends yesterday at noon, then after the game got a few, "Damn...why didn't I?" responses.

279 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:58:12am

re: #276 ggt

which is why I don't get the whole scenerio as it was written in the article. Traffic is normally moving rather slowly at this series of intersections at 5pm. The guy must have been really f-ed up to be going fast enough to kill someone.

There is also construction right there, so I can't imagine traffic going over 20 miles an hour during a green light.

The person killed was on a motorcycle. It doesn't take that much. We had a fatal accident here in the Twin Cities where a motorcyclist ran into the back of a truck that stopped suddenly and died. Given the time of day, traffic in that area wouldn't have been moving much faster than 20 mph, but it still happened.

280 lawhawk  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:58:26am

re: #272 darthstar

The Cain perfect game was pretty impressive, and so too was that catch by the right fielder to save the perfecto in the 7th. It was just the first perfect game by a Giants pitcher in 120+ years the team has existed. Mighty impressive. Also tied Koufax for most strikeouts in a perfect game with 14.

Good thing I have him on my fantasy league team!

281 lawhawk  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 6:59:06am

re: #275 darthstar

Had I been in SF.....

282 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:01:02am

re: #281 lawhawk

Had I been in SF...

I would've gone even before it became a perfect game. I just love watching baseball. Watched the Twins lose impressively last night; they were down 6 runs in the top of the first, but came back with a mighty effort by their bullpen and an awe-inspiring 7th-inning rally to fall short 9-8. Even though they lost, it was a darn fun game.

283 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:03:31am

I see there is a Cat Division of the DogPAC.Dog

284 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:04:58am

re: #279 thedopefishlives

The person killed was on a motorcycle. It doesn't take that much. We had a fatal accident here in the Twin Cities where a motorcyclist ran into the back of a truck that stopped suddenly and died. Given the time of day, traffic in that area wouldn't have been moving much faster than 20 mph, but it still happened.

so sad

BE CAREFUL EVERYONE!

I'm even more anxious now. Kid wants to drive into the City for a late night comedy show this weekend. Both he and his friend have never driven in the City. They already bought the tickets and I am freaking out.

285 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:06:12am

re: #284 ggt

so sad

BE CAREFUL EVERYONE!

Yeah. I try to be extra-careful around bikes. I have a friend who rides; he's laid his bike down twice in the span of 2 years to prevent a serious accident.

286 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:08:32am

re: #274 ggt

Success! You hit a nerve!

Good Job!

The Spanish word for Success is Exito! It might work better in this case. LOL

Oh wait, he's still showing up in my Twitter feed, so I'm not blocked.

287 lawhawk  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:08:49am

re: #282 thedopefishlives

I am a big fan and will try to get to as many games as I can - and it doesn't matter if they're the majors, minors, or independents. A game is a game - and what's better on a warm summer evening than watching baseball unfold.

And minor league parks are where some of the most fun games are to be had - nice family crowds, great scenery, and affordable to boot.

288 lawhawk  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:10:21am

Developing:

Egypt’s Highest Court Says Parliament Must Dissolve

The court ruled that a third of the seats in both the upper and lower houses were contested in an unconstitutional manner. However, the head of the court has just told Jazeera that the ruling means parliament in its entirety be dissolved.

289 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:15:15am

Oh, brother...

'Game of Thrones' put George W. Bush's head on a stake

One of the many decapitated heads that appeared on "Game of Thrones" last season was a prop likeness of former President George W. Bush, its creators revealed in a DVD commentary.

In the tenth episode of the first season, Sansa Stark looks at several heads on spikes. One belongs to her father, Ned, and another to the former United States president.

..."The last head on the left is George Bush," says David Benioff, one of the show's co-creators, in the DVD commentary.

"George Bush's head appears in a couple beheading scenes," adds co-creator D.B. Weiss.

"It's not a choice, it's not a political statement," explains Benioff. "It's just, we had to use what heads we had around."

They couldn't find another head? Imagine the outrage if it was Bill Clinton or Barack Obama's head.

290 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:16:32am

re: #287 lawhawk

I am a big fan and will try to get to as many games as I can - and it doesn't matter if they're the majors, minors, or independents. A game is a game - and what's better on a warm summer evening than watching baseball unfold.

And minor league parks are where some of the most fun games are to be had - nice family crowds, great scenery, and affordable to boot.

My wife actually got me addicted to baseball. My first baseball game was at the old Komiskey Park, now U.S. Cellular Field, in Chicago. I was much less interested in it at the time, but it was still an alright experience. The difference between that and the Metrodome, however, was night and day. That's when I knew I was a goner.

291 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:20:46am

re: #289 NJDhockeyfan

Do you find it outrageous, then?

292 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:21:52am

re: #289 NJDhockeyfan

Oh, brother...

'Game of Thrones' put George W. Bush's head on a stake

They couldn't find another head? Imagine the outrage if it was Bill Clinton or Barack Obama's head.

Who would have even noticed it if this guy hadn't opened his mouth?

293 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:22:34am

One dog with an ear infection (yeast--allergies) one with a bladder infection. Can't get into the vet until 9:30 tomorrow morning. Should I give cranberry juice to the dog with the bladder infection?

294 lawhawk  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:23:04am

re: #290 thedopefishlives

I hear ya... no grass is ever as green as the baseball diamonds at the MLB parks - and walking into Yankee Stadium for the first time (the old one) was a real eye opener. Can't wait to make the trip to see Wrigley and Fenway - the stadiums from a bygone era.

The new Yankee Stadium is great in its own right, and the Great Hall is truly amazing to see, but it doesn't quite have the feel of the old place across the street. At least not yet.

Citifield is much better now than when it first opened - though they've still got some things to work out (like the grammar on some of their hall of fame displays - caught problems in their description of Shea Stadium for instance). And how is it that the team can't find pristine copies of its annual yearbooks; some of those look like the dog ate them.

295 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:26:10am

gotta love George (Orwell)

296 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:26:45am

re: #282 thedopefishlives

I would've gone even before it became a perfect game. I just love watching baseball. Watched the Twins lose impressively last night; they were down 6 runs in the top of the first, but came back with a mighty effort by their bullpen and an awe-inspiring 7th-inning rally to fall short 9-8. Even though they lost, it was a darn fun game.

I was sitting in a tavern eating dinner with co-workers for the first few innings of that game. Looks like the Phillies needed all those 1st inning runs after all. Plus that fairly awesome defensive play by Rollins in the bottom of the 1st.

297 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:27:07am

re: #294 lawhawk

Target Field, despite Minnesotans complaining about the absurdity of an open-air stadium in one of the northernmost baseball markets in the country, is an astonishingly beautiful facility. I have immensely enjoyed every game there. The "home run overhang" is an especially amusing piece of home-field advantage.

298 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:28:14am

re: #289 NJDhockeyfan

Oh, brother...

'Game of Thrones' put George W. Bush's head on a stake


They couldn't find another head? Imagine the outrage if it was Bill Clinton or Barack Obama's head.

I thought they were pro-feudalist conservatives just putting RINOs there to make a point!

Though your concern is appreciated.
///

299 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:29:45am

re: #291 Obdicut

Do you find it outrageous, then?

Outrageous? No. I just think it's as stupid as the movie that was about the assassination of George Bush.

300 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:30:08am

So true.

301 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:32:01am

Gaza sniper fires at farmer near border fence

A Palestinian sniper in the southern Gaza Strip fired at an Israeli farmer working in a field near Kibbutz Nir Oz in the Eshkol Regional Council area on Thursday.

The man was not injured, hiding behind a tractor until IDF soldiers arrived and evacuated him to safety. IDF soldiers returned fire toward the Palestinian sniper.

...Several hours later a mortar shell fired from Gaza landed in the Eshkol Regional Council area. No injuries or damage were reported in the attack.

302 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:34:22am

re: #299 NJDhockeyfan

Outrageous? No. I just think it's as stupid as the movie that was about the assassination of George Bush.

As stupid? Kind of a little off-scale, aren't you?

One is an entire movie about the assassination and aftermath of Bush. The other uses a prop head that they had lying around in one scene.

I think it's in bad taste to use the prop heads of any living people, but it seems like a silly thing to get all worked up about.

303 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:36:34am

re: #302 Obdicut

As stupid? Kind of a little off-scale, aren't you?

One is an entire movie about the assassination and aftermath of Bush. The other uses a prop head that they had lying around in one scene.

I think it's in bad taste to use the prop heads of any living people, but it seems like a silly thing to get all worked up about.

But... but,,, we would have been screaming from the rooftops if it had been Clinton's head instead!!1!!
///

304 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:43:48am

re: #303 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Are there any black people in Game of Thrones? I thought it was pretty much White People Behaving Badly While Mongols Attack Them.

305 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:46:24am

re: #304 Obdicut

Are there any black people in Game of Thrones? I thought it was pretty much White People Behaving Badly While Mongols Attack Them.

The Mongol equivalents are still a secondary plot zone. Their are Viking analogs to the west and also the Picts northerners and some supernatural threat in the north as well.

306 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:47:00am

re: #305 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

The threat from the North is probably just Scotch Eggs and deep-friend Mars Bars.

307 allegro  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:50:04am

re: #306 Obdicut

The threat from the North is probably just Scotch Eggs and deep-friend Mars Bars.

Ooo, Scotch eggs. I had never even heard of them until a few months ago when Ice and Jimmah mentioned them. I looked up a recipe to see what they were and oooh my, are they good! I've made several batches since - they freeze very well and make a great quickie breakfast or late night snack.

Adding the ingredients to my shopping list now. You've made me hungry for them again.

308 lawhawk  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:50:10am

re: #305 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Are they coming from the Morgul Vale? And why do the baddies look like the Army of the Dead?

309 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:50:21am

re: #306 Obdicut

The threat from the North is probably just Scotch Eggs and deep-friend Mars Bars.

And while you're nomming on those the haggis sneaks up and strangles you from behind. Though I think it's more like aliens from Andromeda...

310 allegro  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:52:59am

Heh, my Beelza-buddy is sound asleep on the sofa and his tail is wagging like crazy. He must be having a very happy dream.

311 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:54:18am

re: #304 Obdicut

Are there any black people in Game of Thrones? I thought it was pretty much White People Behaving Badly While Mongols Attack Them.

There are no black people in Middle Earth either.

312 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 7:56:59am

re: #311 Learned Mother of Zion

There are no black people in Middle Earth either.

Yeah there are, and they're all eeeeevil.

Tolkien wasn't exactly nuanced about racial stuff. On the other hand, there are no societies in Middle Earth that are even remotely actually, like, nice or good.

313 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:03:23am

Gus, I love the things you find on the internet.

THANKS FOR YOUR WORK!

314 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:04:44am

re: #311 Learned Mother of Zion

There are no black people in Middle Earth either.

Only the Corsairs!

Tolkein wanted to create a mythical history for the British Isles as they had no written history or stories. I guess the movie was true to the book.

sigh!

315 Gus  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:05:29am

re: #313 ggt

Gus, I love the things you find on the internet.

THANKS FOR YOUR WORK!

You're welcome.

316 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:06:13am

Today Nobody swept the bottom list! Congratulations, Mr. Nobody! Now, where's my drum... //

317 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:06:15am

Good morning from LA

Thanks and a hat tip to NPR for the musician featured this morning, a Tuareg blues player.

318 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:06:33am

re: #312 Obdicut

I guess the hobbits are nice, in a fashion, but they're petty and isolationist and intolerant and greedy. And they're the best of the lot.

319 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:07:01am

re: #318 Obdicut

I guess the hobbits are nice, in a fashion, but they're petty and isolationist and intolerant and greedy. And they're the best of the lot.

They like their wacky tobaccky as well!

320 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:07:20am

bbl

321 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:07:53am

re: #318 Obdicut

I guess the hobbits are nice, in a fashion, but they're petty and isolationist and intolerant and greedy. And they're the best of the lot.

This being back before Policitcal Correctness required even fantasy worlds to also represent the Ideal World.

322 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:08:37am

re: #314 ggt

Only the Corsairs!

Tolkein wanted to create a mythical history for the British Isles as they had no written history or stories. I guess the movie was true to the book.

sigh!

That's because the Pictsies kept stealing the sheep before they could be used to make vellum to write on. Then the Saxons came in with Beowulf and blew the library down. Followed by the Normans who trampled all the King Arthur tales and put in French poofs like Lancelot to steal the best stories...
;)

323 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:08:51am

from Gus's link.

(paraphrased) "A women who has an unhappy pregnancy will risk her life without hesitation to end the pregnancy. That same women later in life, in difference circumstances, will risk her life without hesitation to have a baby."

And the men who want power don't give a shit either way about the woman.

324 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:12:06am

bbl

325 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:13:02am

re: #321 Expand Your Ground

This being back before Policitcal Correctness required even fantasy worlds to also represent the Ideal World.

Well, yeah. Tolkein's representation of all non-white races as inherently evil or corrupted is pretty shitty, but the the white races are all pretty badly off, too. Everywhere you go, leaders are corrupted, the desire for the Ring overwhelms people, and nobody is shown as being really particularly brave, more just fighting out of complete goddamn desperation.

Really, only Aragorn, Eowyn, and Faramir are shown in a pretty-purely positive nature, from the human races. And the hobbits all rock, of course, but they're rocking in a specifically un-hobittish way, by leaving the Shire and getting involved.

I think it's safe to say that Tolkein didn't think much of any society, any group, but he thought individuals could rise above.

326 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:17:33am

re: #325 Obdicut

I understand the necessesity for PC when it comes to official language and speech. Laws and official announcements must be as racially, culturally and sexually neutral as possible.

But I do not understand why this notion has become mandatory for almost every other form of expression, from fantasy literature to song lyrics...

327 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:19:10am

re: #326 Expand Your Ground

I don't think it has.

328 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:19:52am

re: #316 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton

Today Nobody swept the bottom list! Congratulations, Mr. Nobody! Now, where's my drum... //

You left it in the circle!

329 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:21:25am

Random note on Tolkien: The greatest hero, Frodo, never kills anyone. Anyone that can think, that is. He's not a pacifist, certainly, but he never kills.

330 Kronocide  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:21:57am

I held the eat, and it was good.

331 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:23:04am

re: #327 Obdicut

I don't think it has.

It has - to a sometimes laughable extent.

I remember the BBC banning a Pogues' song "Fairytale of New York" becuase it contains the word "faggot".

The song portrays a drunken argument between a low-life and his wife, during which she hurls the invective at him. What could that possibly have to do with gay-bashing?

332 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:26:09am

I don't know if anyone posted this but happy Flag Day!

...On June 14th, 1885, Bernard J. Cigrand, a 19 year old teacher at Stony Hill School, placed a 10 inch, 38- star flag in a bottle on his desk then assigned essays on the flag and its significance. This observance, commemorated Congresses adoption of the Stars and Stripes as the flag of the United States on June 14, 1777. This observance was also the beginning of Cigrand’s long years of fervent and devoted effort to bring about national recognition and observance of Flag Day. The crowning achievement of his life came at age fifty when President Wilson, on May 30, 1916, issued a proclamation calling for a nation wide observance of Flag Day. Then in 1949, President Truman signed an Act Of Congress designating the 14th day of June every year as National Flag Day. On June 14th, 2004, the 108th U.S. Congress voted unanimously on H.R. 662 that Flag Day originated in Ozaukee County, Waubeka Wisconsin.

:)

333 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:26:12am

re: #331 Expand Your Ground

But it also hasn't. The Sopranos has shitloads of racism, sexism, homophobia, etc. throughout it. The percentage of white characters still vastly outnumbers on TV still vastly outnumbers their actual percentage of the population. Mad Men is popular in part because of its representation of a totally un-PC time period. Most hip-hop and rap is hardly PC.

I really am not sure where you're seeing all this PC run amuk.

334 Big Steve  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:26:43am

Wow.....no one in the Bottom 10 comments in the last 24 hours! For shear diversity sake, thought I would pop in, say hello, and collect the usual amount of down dings.

335 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:27:14am

re: #334 Big Steve

Wow...no one in the Bottom 10 comments in the last 24 hours! For shear diversity sake, thought I would pop in, say hello, and collect the usual amount of down dings.

how DARE you!!!
/

336 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:27:28am

re: #334 Big Steve

Wow...no one in the Bottom 10 comments in the last 24 hours! For shear diversity sake, thought I would pop in, say hello, and collect the usual amount of down dings.

I down dinged ya to get it started!

337 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:28:20am

re: #334 Big Steve

Wow...no one in the Bottom 10 comments in the last 24 hours! For shear diversity sake, thought I would pop in, say hello, and collect the usual amount of down dings.

Outrageous!

338 Big Steve  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:28:54am

re: #336 NJDhockeyfan

I down dinged ya to get it started!

Yea but Sattv4u2 canceled you out with an upding

339 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:29:13am

re: #338 Big Steve

Yea but Sattv4u2 canceled you out with an upding

I'M SO CONFUSED!!!

340 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:29:29am

re: #338 Big Steve

Yea but Sattv4u2 canceled you out with an upding

I updinged too but I'm contrarian.

341 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:29:31am

re: #333 Obdicut

There are those who would see it applied everywhere, and they are often very vocal about it.

Britain has it worse than the USA, but even then, it is the nearly-forbidden allure of the non-PC that makes series like the ones you mentioned so attractive to modern viewers: a window to an age where people could be blatantly sexist/racist/classist without fear of being called out on it.

But those days are returning to us, my friends...

342 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:30:53am

re: #340 Killgore Trout

I updinged too but I'm contrarian.

Splitter.

343 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:31:03am

re: #340 Killgore Trout

I updinged too but I'm contrarian.

I'm giving you one of each showing my inner Sybil!!

344 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:33:11am

re: #334 Big Steve

Wow...no one in the Bottom 10 comments in the last 24 hours! For shear diversity sake, thought I would pop in, say hello, and collect the usual amount of down dings.

Something is in the air tonight...///

345 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:33:44am

I went out to check the scene of last night's hit and run. I didn't notice before but the cyclist not only bounced off the windshield. He totally shattered it and probably went over the roof of the car. Not only that but it looks like the car not only ran the stop sign but was driving on the wrong side of the road. I can understand maybe the initial impulse to flee but he stopped thought about it for a few minutes and then took off again. that really pisses me off. Here's hoping for a very long prison sentence.

346 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:35:36am

re: #345 Killgore Trout

I went out to check the scene of last night's hit and run. I didn't notice before but the cyclist not only bounced off the windshield. He totally shattered it and probably went over the roof of the car. Not only that but it looks like the car not only ran the stop sign but was driving on the wrong side of the road. I can understand maybe the initial impulse to flee but he stopped thought about it for a few minutes and then took off again. that really pisses me off. Here's hoping for a very long prison sentence.

The shattered window probably was a good thing for the cyclist. If it didn't shatter his injuries would have been worse.

347 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:35:45am

re: #345 Killgore Trout

I went out to check the scene of last night's hit and run. I didn't notice before but the cyclist not only bounced off the windshield. He totally shattered it and probably went over the roof of the car. Not only that but it looks like the car not only ran the stop sign but was driving on the wrong side of the road. I can understand maybe the initial impulse to flee but he stopped thought about it for a few minutes and then took off again. that really pisses me off. Here's hoping for a very long prison sentence.

You said you got the license # and a description of the car, correct?

Assuming they successfully trace it I wonder if the driver will be forthcoming at that point, or continue to attempt to avoid responsibility.

348 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:36:25am

xre: #341 Expand Your Ground

There are those who would see it applied everywhere, and they are often very vocal about it.

Yeah, but they're nowhere close to actually having their way, which is what you originally said.

We're not going to get overrun by PC anytime soon. PC is really kind of just a rebranding of 'societally acceptable', and usually just hauled out by assholes who can't stand being unpopular for being douchebags.

349 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:38:09am

re: #347 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

You said you got the license # and a description of the car, correct?

Assuming they successfully trace it I wonder if the driver will be forthcoming at that point, or continue to attempt to avoid responsibility.

Unless the guy is a career criminal with the forethought to have a a fake license plate they'll get him. he won't make it far.

350 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:38:14am

re: #348 Obdicut

x

PC is really kind of just a rebranding of 'societally acceptable', and usually just hauled out by assholes who can't stand being unpopular for being douchebags.

Or it is hauled out selectively by someone who wants to be indignantly butthurt over some remark or comment.

351 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:38:14am

re: #348 Obdicut

x


Yeah, but they're nowhere close to actually having their way, which is what you originally said.

We're not going to get overrun by PC anytime soon. PC is really kind of just a rebranding of 'societally acceptable', and usually just hauled out by assholes who can't stand being unpopular for being douchebags.

I see it often used as an excuse to hide behind in advance of purposefully saying something insulting, or after being called on saying something stupid that indicates a complete lack of empathy for others.

352 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:40:00am

re: #348 Obdicut

Yeah, but they're nowhere close to actually having their way, which is what you originally said.

We're not going to get overrun by PC anytime soon. PC is really kind of just a rebranding of 'societally acceptable', and usually just hauled out by assholes who can't stand being unpopular for being douchebags.

Well, to be fair, there are some who are hypersensitive about political correctness, for whatever reason. That being said, those people are quite a bit more few and far between than the people that crow about "OMG PC is going to be the death of us all" would have you believe.

353 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:40:04am

re: #349 Killgore Trout

Unless the guy is a career criminal with the forethought to have a a fake license plate they'll get him. he won't make it far.

What possibility there is a claim made that the car had been stolen earlier that day and the owner had not gotten around to reporting that to the police yet? People are stupid and will go to fairly incredible ends in attempting to avoid consequences.

354 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:41:14am

re: #352 thedopefishlives

It's also not one-sided. The Freedom Fries bullshit was "PC", being employed by people who railed about how terrible PC was. It was "Use this term for political reasons or you're a bad person".

355 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:41:36am

Grand jury to get case of Texas dad who beat alleged child molester to death

A Texas prosecutor said the case of a rancher who beat to death a man he caught allegedly molesting his daughter will go to a grand jury to decide whether the killing was justified, or an act of excessive force.

The father, whose name has not been released by authorities, claims he caught the man trying to molest his 4-year-old daughter on his ranch Saturday. Although Lavaca County Sheriff Micah Harmon said the girl’s father is unlikely to be arrested, District Attorney Heather McMinn told FoxNews.com the case remains under investigation and that the Texas Rangers have joined the probe.

“Once completed, [results of the investigation] will be forwarded to the district attorney’s office and it will be taken to a grand jury,” McMinn told FoxNews.com. “They’re still investigating what happened at this point.”

The grand jury will ultimately decide what charges -- if any -- the girl’s father will face, McMinn said.

If this guy isn't charged with anything I won't be surprised. I probably would have done that same thing if I had caught someone doing that to my daughter.

356 CuriousLurker  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:41:56am

Oopsie! Another Republican counters Romney's messaging about the economy:

357 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:42:10am

re: #354 Obdicut

It's also not one-sided. The Freedom Fries bullshit was "PC", being employed by people who railed about how terrible PC was. It was "Use this term for political reasons or you're a bad person".

It's all good until someone else does it. Ah, I love the smell of hypocrisy in the morning.

358 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:43:21am

re: #353 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

What possibility there is a claim made that the car had been stolen earlier that day and the owner had not gotten around to reporting that to the police yet? People are stupid and will go to fairly incredible ends in attempting to avoid consequences.

I'm sure the driver will come up with some lame excuse. At first I thought he might have been texting on distracted with a cell phone but I think he was just driving like a maniac.

359 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:43:58am

re: #355 NJDhockeyfan

What if the guy is lying, or thought something was happening that wasn't?

360 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:44:52am

re: #350 Expand Your Ground

Or it is hauled out selectively by someone who wants to be indignantly butthurt over some remark or comment.

Well, part of dealing with people is spotting those who are looking to be upset about something/anything. You won't please them regardless, so not much benefit in trying. And probably the best strategy for dealing with them is getting done with it and moving on. Unfortunately, that mode appears to have positive effects in the business world and they keep getting promoted...

361 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:45:45am

re: #360 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Well, part of dealing with people is spotting those who are looking to be upset about something/anything. You won't please them regardless, so not much benefit in trying. And probably the best strategy for dealing with them is getting done with it and moving on. Unfortunately, that mode appears to have positive effects in the business world and they keep getting promoted...

The corporate ladder is like a bunch of monkeys in a tree. The guys at the top look down and see all smiling faces. The guys at the bottom look up and see nothing but assholes.

362 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:47:19am

Well. the moving van and the Boss are on their way north. I'm stuck here, probably till tomorrow around 4:00 PM waiting for her last paycheck at this address. EDS runs the Medicaid provider payments here and won't do direct deposit (too much $$$ in the fload) and take forever to do a change of address. So I'll collect the mail & then drive north to join the family.

Did I mention yet that moving sucks?

363 lawhawk  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:48:46am

re: #356 CuriousLurker

And the NJ unemployment rate is still about a point higher than the national rate of 8.2%.

Oh, and Christie still wants to go ahead with tax cuts even as revenues are projected to fall short - leaving a budget gap that has to be closed.

364 CuriousLurker  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:50:20am

re: #363 lawhawk

Yep, I live in Jersey also.

365 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:50:49am

re: #362 William Barnett-Lewis

Did I mention yet that moving sucks?

No need

I moved from Boston to North Carolina to Boston to Atlanta all in the course of 15 months

366 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:52:52am

re: #362 William Barnett-Lewis


Moving tips from The Onion


A few selections:

To avoid breakage, glass items should be melted down, then re-blown after moving into your new home.

Six weeks before moving day, fill one small box with books, seal it tightly, and write "books" on top in permanent marker. Then do nothing more until the day before your move.

Throw smoke grenades into every room of your new home to flush out any possible Viet Cong.

Get a jump on things by cancelling electricity and water service several weeks before moving.

Boxes are an unnecessary expense. Place all possessions in the truck and fill to top with packing peanuts.

For the love of God, don't ever move.

367 sattv4u2  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:54:09am

Speaking of moving

Time to get moving to my car for the long quiet drive home!

368 Mattand  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:55:06am

re: #363 lawhawk

And the NJ unemployment rate is still about a point higher than the national rate of 8.2%.

Oh, and Christie still wants to go ahead with tax cuts even as revenues are projected to fall short - leaving a budget gap that has to be closed.

Oh, he said how he'll close it: by raiding transportation funding. Because he's so different from every other governor before him.

369 Mattand  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:56:23am

re: #363 lawhawk

And here's what I don't get: does he really think NJ residents are that dumb that we'll be hypnotized by a shiny tax cut?

370 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:57:28am

re: #369 mattand

And here's what I don't get: does he really think NJ residents are that dumb that we'll be hypnotized by a shiny tax cut?

Hey, it works on the Tea Party.

371 abolitionist  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:58:06am

Possibly my browser's flaky, or maybe this is one of the most vapid news stories of the day:
Egypt's Highest Court Says Third of Seats in Islamist-Dominated Parliament Illegally Elected

The whole news story is just a repeat of the headline, so it's kinda pointless. Ok, the story included a period, and lowercased some letters.

Yahoo does better:
Egypt high court orders parliament dissolved

372 allegro  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:58:24am

re: #366 Obdicut

Moving tips from The Onion

A few selections:

I can move in about an hour. Secure loose stuff, bring the patio furniture inside, and start the engine.

Life in a motorhome is Good.

373 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:58:29am

re: #359 Obdicut

What if the guy is lying, or thought something was happening that wasn't?

Then that would be a different story. If he was molesting that child then he got what he deserved.

374 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:59:47am

re: #373 NJDhockeyfan

Then that would be a different story. If he was molesting that child then he got what he deserved.

But that's an 'if'. Which is why vigilantism sucks.

375 lawhawk  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 8:59:47am

re: #368 mattand

That part pisses me off to no end since the transportation trust fund is already insufficient to get the job done of maintaining infrastructure. But he wants his tax cuts. So he'll go ahead and borrow against the fund to keep the cuts he wants.

Democrats in the legislature are split on the tax cuts/property tax relief with most favoring some form. Assembly Democrats are pushing ahead with a tax hike on millionaires (whether it is actually on income over $1 million or something far less is still up in the air) to fund a property tax relief plan, while Senate Democrats are seemingly going along with Christie.

Christie can get what he wants since he has line item veto and gets to certify the budget figures. So, he will probably pick and choose the parts he wants, the voters get some form of relief now, but the state's finances remain structurally screwed.

376 Gus  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:01:06am

Racism In The Arkansas Tea Party

Ozark Tea Party board member Inge Marler told the following racist joke in her speech before the 500-person crowd:

A black kid asks his mom, ‘Mama, what’s a democracy?’

“‘Well, son, that be when white folks work every day so us po’ folks can get all our benefits.’

“‘But mama, don’t the white folk get mad about that?’

“‘They sho do, son. They sho do. And that’s called racism.’”

MP3 Audio
377 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:03:03am

re: #374 Obdicut

But that's an 'if'. Which is why vigilantism sucks.

I wouldn't necessarily call this a case of vigilantism. If there's an emotional affect involved (caught in the act and immediately beat to death, which wouldn't do in a non-immediate situation), it's not vigilantism. It would be vigilantism if he found out some time later, made plans, etc.

378 lawhawk  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:03:22am

re: #369 mattand

Actually, he is - and the taxpayers here have gone along with similar tax cut plans, even though few have worked out. The supported the sales tax hike to fund property tax relief (under Corzine) but that ended quickly when revenues didn't hit targets and they simply kept the hike without generating any property tax relief.

The one thing in the state's favor going forward is that the localities are now facing a hard(ish) cap on tax hikes. That will at least slow the pace of hikes locally, and potentially bring time for tax relief statewide. A hike on the wealthiest NJ residents is probably the only way that will really happen.

As for the Transportation Trust Fund, it would probably take a very unpopular hike to get that funded to the level needed to undertake major projects statewide (including the Pulaski Skyway replacement, rail improvements, and other major road/bridge replacement projects).

379 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:03:55am

Breathtaking derp! This guy does nothing but Tweet lies all day long.

380 Mattand  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:05:15am

re: #375 lawhawk

This is the shit the rest of the country doesn't hear about him. I'm not a fan, but if he thinks he can fix stuff, I'll listen. But this is starting to turn in to the same old GOP tax cut fetishism that doesn't fix anything.

What kills me is how people think he's this breath of fresh air because he yells at teachers. Here's a hint to the rest of the country: Fox News saying he's the second coming of Washington should cause your bullshit meter to explode.

381 Gus  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:07:24am
382 Obdicut  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:08:07am

re: #377 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton

Sure. It might, or might not be, vigilantism, or it might be a simple attack with an excuse made up to cover it, or it might be an emotional reaction. Who knows.

383 Mattand  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:08:43am

re: #378 lawhawk

Did you catch what went on in Medford? Years of GOP financial mismanagement forced a GOP mayor to ask the residents for a 33% tax hike. And he got it. Because as much as taxes suck, the Medford residents realized what a hole they were in.

Meanwhile, Christie was literally trying to turn the residents against the mayor. Unbelievable.

384 Gus  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:11:41am

Copy.

385 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:12:11am

re: #384 Gus

Copy.

Paste.

386 Gus  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:12:59am

re: #385 thedopefishlives

Paste.

Repeat.

387 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:13:05am

re: #381 Gus

[Embedded content]

And we must never refer to it as a "Polish" concentration camp, although anyone familiar with the history of WWII and the Holocaust knows that Poland was an occupied country and never ran any concentration camps...

388 Varek Raith  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:13:24am

Female Fox Anchor Walks Off Set After Co-Host’s Sexist Joke
Brian Kilmeade, piece of shit.

389 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:13:48am

re: #382 Obdicut

Vigilantism in his own home? Unless this guy was in a militia or something... That seems a stretch to me. You can have excessive force in the absence of vigilantism of course. Since it was a death, good for Texas to have a grand jury take a good look at the evidence. If it was a case where an unfortunate punch was lethal, or a smack on concrete from a fall did it that's one thing.

If it was a bunch of hits and or a choking that would indicate excessive force. Then one has to consider how different that is from a bar brawl. Which might call for harsher punishment. I'd give a Dad more leeway than an angry drunk.

390 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:14:36am

re: #388 Varek Raith

Female Fox Anchor Walks Off Set After Co-Host’s Sexist Joke
Brian Kilmeade, piece of shit.

What in the living hell is wrong with that man.

391 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:14:50am

Watching Egypt? They no longer have a Parliament.

392 Mattand  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:15:11am

re: #381 Gus

I need to verify it but supposedly Ike was adamant that camera crew be present when they liberated the camps. When asked why, he said that some dumb SOB 50 years from now will insist this stuff never happened.

Smart guy, that Ike.

393 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:15:34am

re: #387 Expand Your Ground

And we must never refer to it as a "Polish" concentration camp,

Correct.

394 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:16:30am

re: #392 mattand

I need to verify it but supposedly Ike was adamant that camera crew be present when they liberated the camps. When asked why, he said that some dumb SOB 50 years from now will insist this stuff never happened.

Smart guy, that Ike.

He wanted the whole world to know what had happened for the simple reason that he did not want to see it repeated.

395 Mattand  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:16:56am

re: #388 Varek Raith

Female Fox Anchor Walks Off Set After Co-Host’s Sexist Joke
Brian Kilmeade, piece of shit.

Never thought I'd ever say this, but good for Gretchen Carlson.

On the flip side, how much you want to bet she's the one forced to apologize tomorrow?

396 AK-47%  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:17:08am

re: #388 Varek Raith

Female Fox Anchor Walks Off Set After Co-Host’s Sexist Joke
Brian Kilmeade, piece of shit.

When douchebags collide...

397 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:17:45am

re: #392 mattand

Note that deniers usually don't deny atrocious conditions in concentration camps, they just blame them on Allies. Also, Ike's cams wouldn't prove much in regard to specifically extermination camps, since those were overrun exclusively by the Soviets.

398 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:27:28am

re: #377 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton

I wouldn't necessarily call this a case of vigilantism. If there's an emotional affect involved (caught in the act and immediately beat to death, which wouldn't do in a non-immediate situation), it's not vigilantism. It would be vigilantism if he found out some time later, made plans, etc.

I think the term "Act of passion" or some such was often used. That term would come up when a husband came home and found his wife in bed with someone else and he killed or seriously injured the man or both man and wife.

399 allegro  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 9:45:28am

re: #398 RayFerd

I think the term "Act of passion" or some such was often used. That term would come up when a husband came home and found his wife in bed with someone else and he killed or seriously injured the man or both man and wife.

To me it looks like defense of a small child being sexually assaulted which is stopping a crime in progress. That it was his own child makes an extreme response understandable. An investigation is certainly warranted but I doubt this man will ever be prosecuted.

400 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 10:06:45am

re: #378 lawhawk

Actually, he is - and the taxpayers here have gone along with similar tax cut plans, even though few have worked out. The supported the sales tax hike to fund property tax relief (under Corzine) but that ended quickly when revenues didn't hit targets and they simply kept the hike without generating any property tax relief.

The one thing in the state's favor going forward is that the localities are now facing a hard(ish) cap on tax hikes. That will at least slow the pace of hikes locally, and potentially bring time for tax relief statewide. A hike on the wealthiest NJ residents is probably the only way that will really happen.

As for the Transportation Trust Fund, it would probably take a very unpopular hike to get that funded to the level needed to undertake major projects statewide (including the Pulaski Skyway replacement, rail improvements, and other major road/bridge replacement projects).

My friend who lives in northern NJ thinks one thing that has to be done is starting to consolidate township-level services at the county level to remove costly duplicate services and charges. Is that a general feeling up that way? And if so, is there any hope it will start to happen?

401 Mattand  Thu, Jun 14, 2012 10:38:31am

re: #400 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

My friend who lives in northern NJ thinks one thing that has to be done is starting to consolidate township-level services at the county level to remove costly duplicate services and charges. Is that a general feeling up that way? And if so, is there any hope it will start to happen?

I know there's a push to do that with school districts. You've got a lot of small towns that could legitimately merge with some of their larger neighbors. Since the majority of the property tax problems here have to do with school funding, that might alleviate some of the problems

In Camden County, they've talked about merging some local police forces with the county. The problem with that is reduced response time. That was an issue in our last mayoral election; I'm personally against it.


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