Romney Demands Retraction, Washington Post Says No

Cue wingnut screaming

PoliticsJune 2012 • Views: 27,233

Mitt Romney’s representatives met with the Washington Post today to demand a formal retraction of the Post’s report that Romney’s Bain Capital had a deliberate strategy of investing in firms that outsourced American jobs.

The Washington Post said no: Washington Post Will Not Retract Romney ‘Outsourcing’ Story.

The Washington Post will not retract their June 21 report about Bain Capital’s investments in firms that specialized in outsourcing American jobs, POLITICO has learned.

“We are very confident in our reporting,” Washington Post spokesperson Kris Coratti told POLITICO following a meeting between the Post’s executive editor Marcus Brauchli and Mitt Romney campaign representatives.

Here’s the full report that isn’t being retracted: Romney’s Bain Capital Invested in Companies That Moved Jobs Overseas.

What a bone-headed move by the Romney campaign. All they’ve achieved is to ensure that a lot more people will now read the Washington Post’s article.

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106 comments

AK-47% Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:00:45pm

Proof that the librul media take their marching orders from the White House

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:01:30pm

Romneyland, of course, won't give the rest of us any evidence-based reason to trust them over the newspaper. Can't let facts, or even alleged facts, escape to the hoi polloi except when absolutely necessary.

Saying 'we think they're wrong and this is why' invites rational thought, and we don't want to encourage the voters to use critical thinking. It's about to be banned in Texas, after all.

Someone Please Beam Me Up! Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:04:17pm

Wouldn't it be fun if he sues....

goddamnedfrank Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:04:39pm

Denied

Targetpractice Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:05:02pm

Bain could clear all this up if they could just give us a few simple documents. Why would they keep those hidden if they had nothing to hide?

///

Bulworth Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:06:36pm

didn't read the article but what was Romney's complaint?

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:08:12pm

re: #4 goddamnedfrank

Denied

Youtube Video

ArchangelMichael Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:08:13pm

re: #4 goddamnedfrank

Denied

WAPO receives marching orders from Obama to give Romney the Heisman

Denied

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:08:39pm

re: #6 Bulworth

didn't read the article but what was Romney's complaint?

They were not properly supportive of his campaign.

goddamnedfrank Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:10:03pm

re: #6 Bulworth

didn't read the article but what was Romney's complaint?

His penis hurts.

gwangung Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:10:08pm

Meh. The visit was an intimidation tactic, to get the Post to be "more circumspect" in the future.

And like most media of today, the Post will fold in the future, when it's not very visible.

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:12:18pm

re: #6 Bulworth

didn't read the article but what was Romney's complaint?

The same claims were used in an Obama campaign ad. Even WaPo's own factcheker rated the claims as false.
4 Pinocchios for Obama’s newest anti-Romney ad
Fact Check and Politifact gave the claims similar ratings.

Obdicut Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:13:07pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

The same claims were used in an Obama campaign ad. Even WaPo's own factcheker rated the claims as false.
4 Pinocchios for Obama’s newest anti-Romney ad
Fact Check and Politifact gave the claims similar ratings.

Why are you repeating this when you've already been shown this is not true?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Glenn Kessler didn't dispute their Tom Hamburger story, he instead tried to make a distinction between it and the Obama Campaign ad because he complains they cited Romney's Bain "grey area" too much in their sourcing:

ArchangelMichael Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:14:16pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

The same claims were used in an Obama campaign ad. Even WaPo's own factcheker rated the claims as false.
4 Pinocchios for Obama’s newest anti-Romney ad
Fact Check and Politifact gave the claims similar ratings.

Which is why I'm surprised they didn't get a retraction... unless the fact checkers involved are hacks. I don't know.

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:18:08pm

Speaking of DENIED.
Federal Judge: Counseling Student Has No Right To Impose Anti-Gay Beliefs On Clients

One conspicuous and abiding theme of the American story is that individuals like Jennifer Keeton are free to choose their own spiritual path, and need brook no government trespass thereon. The Constitution guarantees that the heart may pulse to meters of its own design, deaf to public cadence. But when affairs of the conscience ripen into action – either speech or conduct – government is granted leave to regulate in behalf of certain public interests, including education and professional fitness. Boundaries drawn through decades of case law establish the whither and when of such regulation, and, after carefully considering the factual content of Keeton’s allegations, the Court concludes that Defendants acted within those bounds – there is no room to reasonably infer otherwise.

As the decision is careful to explain, at no point was Keeton asked to change her beliefs. She was merely expected to keep them to herself in compliance with professional counseling ethics. Not only did she refuse to do so, but she even expressed discomfort at the prospect of having to interact with LGBT people at all, objecting to the idea of attending a Pride parade for the sake of cultural immersion. Though she likely would not frame it this way, her intent was to harm gay clients, and the school had every right and responsibility to evaluate her performance in program accordingly.

As this is in regards to ethical conduct in a licensed profession, I would think this decision would carry over to other cases where professionals have denied proper care or service to others based on their personal beliefs.

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:18:11pm

re: #13 Obdicut

Why are you repeating this when you've already been shown this is not true?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

I expect a retraction to be forthcoming.

goddamnedfrank Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:18:35pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

The same claims were used in an Obama campaign ad. Even WaPo's own factcheker rated the claims as false.
4 Pinocchios for Obama’s newest anti-Romney ad
Fact Check and Politifact gave the claims similar ratings.

Except they weren't really the "same" claims, this has already been pointed out to you and for some reason you'd prefer to repeat the assertion rather than deal with the facts.

“Unlike the Obama campaign, he was careful to only look at things in the pre-1999 context,” Kessler said. “And to be clear, there is a distinction between saying someone is responsible for shipping jobs overseas (the ad) and saying someone invested in companies that specialized in helping companies subcontract work to overseas factories (Tom’s story).”

William Barnett-Lewis Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:19:35pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

The same claims were used in an Obama campaign ad. Even WaPo's own factcheker rated the claims as false.
4 Pinocchios for Obama’s newest anti-Romney ad
Fact Check and Politifact gave the claims similar ratings.

You sure have a major need to believe this.

Interesting Times Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:20:34pm

If Romney can't get retraction from WaPo, I bet $10K he buys it, lays everyone off, ships jobs to China and cancels their healthcare.
— Paul Begala (@PaulBegala) June 27, 2012

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:20:40pm

re: #4 goddamnedfrank

Denied

The opposite of denial is this:

Youtube Video

HappyWarrior Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:21:19pm

re: #19 Interesting Times

[Embedded content]

Heh he likes to fire people.

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:23:39pm

Terry Jones thinks the President has "a type of homosexual look"

Youtube Video

HappyWarrior Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:25:52pm

re: #22 Kragar

Terry Jones thinks the President has "a type of homosexual look"

[Embedded content]

They do know this is how ten year olds argue right. "Well you look gay, so there"

Sionainn Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:26:28pm

re: #22 Kragar

Terry Jones thinks the President has "a type of homosexual look"

[Embedded content]

He looks like a drunk hillbilly in a suit. Can he speak any more slowly?!?

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:26:36pm

re: #13 Obdicut

Why are you repeating this when you've already been shown this is not true?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Ah, I skimmed past because material from Dem think tanks is suspect to me. I usually just scroll over. However...

“Unlike the Obama campaign, he was careful to only look at things in the pre-1999 context,” Kessler said. “And to be clear, there is a distinction between saying someone is responsible for shipping jobs overseas (the ad) and saying someone invested in companies that specialized in helping companies subcontract work to overseas factories (Tom’s story).”

Ok, that seems reasonable enough if the quote is accurate.

Charles Johnson Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:26:47pm

This was a very bone-headed move by the Romney campaign. They've ensured that a lot more people will now read the WaPo report.

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:29:06pm

re: #26 Charles Johnson

This was a very bone-headed move by the Romney campaign. They've ensured that a lot more people will now read the WaPo report.

The Streisand effect, appropriately enough.

re: #25 Killgore Trout

Ah, I skimmed past because material from Dem think tanks is suspect to me. I usually just scroll over. However...

As opposed to press releases from Republican presidential campaigns, which obviously have the imprimatur of truthiness all over them.

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:29:11pm

re: #26 Charles Johnson

This was a very bone-headed move by the Romney campaign. They've ensured that a lot more people will now read the WaPo report.

The Romney campaign made a shortsighted move because they neglected to consider that their scheme might backfire?

Never thought I'd see the day.

Obdicut Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:29:44pm

re: #25 Killgore Trout

Ah, I skimmed past because material from Dem think tanks is suspect to me.

How deeply stupid. Simoom is an extremely reliable poster, and skipping over his stuff is just willful blindness.

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:31:19pm

UFO Cult Celebrates World Swastika Rehabilitation Day

Celebrants of World Swastika Rehabilitation Day, who on Saturday arranged to have a swastika-festooned banner flown along Manhattan and the New Jersey shore, are expressing bafflement and outrage over the barrage of complaints their festivities invited.

“Why should the swastika, a symbol of peace for more than 1.5 billion people in the world, offend the people of Manhattan?” asked Thomas Kaenzig, coordinator of the event, in a press release. “Any negative emotions regarding the swastika by people under the age of 70 years old are obviously linked to their education and not to their experiences. It’s about time people were re-educated to understand the original meaning of the oldest and most recurrent symbol in the world.”

The event was organized by followers of the “Raelian movement,” a publicity-loving UFO cult founded by a French race car driver and journalist who claims to be the son of an extraterrestrial named Yahweh and a half-brother to Jesus, Moses and Buddha.

Obdicut Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:31:21pm

We've got to come up with a word for posting inaccurate crap while talking about factchecking. It comes up rather often.

Self-ironing?

Fact-choking?

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:34:32pm

re: #31 Obdicut

We've got to come up with a word for posting inaccurate crap while talking about factchecking. It comes up rather often.

Self-ironing?

Fact-choking?

Rebunking?

wrenchwench Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:35:08pm

re: #29 Obdicut

How deeply stupid. Simoom is an extremely reliable poster, and skipping over ~~his~~ her stuff is just willful blindness.

If I'm not mistaken.

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:35:12pm

re: #27 iossarian

As opposed to press releases from Republican presidential campaigns, which obviously have the imprimatur of truthiness all over them.

Agreed.

goddamnedfrank Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:35:38pm

re: #25 Killgore Trout

Ah, I skimmed past because material from Dem think tanks is suspect to me.

Yet uncritically repeating Republican campaign assertions as if they're certain fact is totally kosher? Not very Druid of you.

Obdicut Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:36:46pm

re: #33 wrenchwench

If I'm not mistaken.

It's definitely a name that can go either way. I dunno. I like Simoom, but don't see her/him often enough.

Targetpractice Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:37:40pm

re: #27 iossarian

As opposed to press releases from Republican presidential campaigns, which obviously have the imprimatur of truthiness all over them.

Swear to God, I had a wingnut make that very allegation the other day. He got challenged on how he wasn't using a reputable source to defend Romney on jobs. What does he say? "Well, his site is reputable, as it at least sources its information."

I damn near died laughing.

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:37:50pm

Issa: No Evidence or Strong Suspicions Holder Knew Of Gunwalking

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:38:26pm

re: #29 Obdicut

How deeply stupid. Simoom is an extremely reliable poster, and skipping over his stuff is just willful blindness.

No insult intended to the poster but if you want to persuade a skeptics that Obama is a socialist with links to Heritage, Freedom Works and Cato most people are just going to scroll over. With fact checking issues it's best to stick with less partisan sources.

gwangung Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:38:36pm

re: #38 Kragar

Issa: No Evidence or Strong Suspicions Holder Knew Of Gunwalking

That's going to be the opposite in about four days, isn't it?

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:40:01pm

re: #40 gwangung

That's going to be the opposite in about four days, isn't it?

I have no evidence or suspicions that Issa routinely orally molests livestock, but I demand he produce evidence he has not or he will be found in contempt!

Obdicut Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:41:11pm

re: #39 Killgore Trout

Except Talking Points Memo is in no way comparable to Heritage in terms of accuracy, and it's really deeply stupid of you to pretend it is.

You're on a roll today. It's funny how you're not even embarrassed about having posted something inaccurate twice in a row, and you're holding yourself up, after having just done that, as non-partisan judge of accuracy.

As always, you're best understood as performance art. Celebrate violence while decrying violence. Say you skip over partisan sources for being inaccurate, post inaccurate information.

wrenchwench Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:42:01pm

re: #39 Killgore Trout

No insult intended to the poster but if you want to persuade a skeptics that Obama is a socialist with links to Heritage, Freedom Works and Cato most people are just going to scroll over. With fact checking issues it's best to stick with less partisan sources.

How partisan they are matters less than how accurate they are. TPM is usually pretty good, I think. Is that what you're calling a 'Dem think tank'?

Targetpractice Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:43:33pm

re: #38 Kragar

Issa: No Evidence or Strong Suspicions Holder Knew Of Gunwalking

His campaign manager was shocked. 'We can't say that, Lyndon,' he said. 'It's not true.' 'Of course it's not,' Johnson barked at him, 'but let's make the bastard deny it.'

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:46:07pm

I can honestly say I never expected this to happen ever.

Britain's queen shakes hands with ex-IRA chief

BELFAST (Reuters) - Britain's Queen Elizabeth shook the hand of former IRA guerrilla commander Martin McGuinness for the first time on Wednesday, drawing a line under a conflict that cost the lives of thousands of soldiers and civilians, including that of her cousin.

The meeting with McGuinness, who is now the deputy first minister of Northern Ireland, comes 14 years after the Irish Republican Army ended its war against British rule in the province, and is one of the last big milestones in a peace process whose success has been studied around the world.

The queen met McGuinness, Northern Ireland's Unionist first minister Peter Robinson and Irish President Michael D.Higgins for just under 10 minutes behind closed doors in a theatre in a leafy suburb of Belfast cordoned off by hundreds of police.

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:49:27pm

re: #45 Kragar

I can honestly say I never expected this to happen ever.

Britain's queen shakes hands with ex-IRA chief

That is awesome. It shows that reconciliation is always possible, despite what people say.

Apart from anything else, the IRA assassinated her cousin.

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:49:56pm

And then as some of my faith in humanity was restored...

Focus on the Family Reveals How Colorado Wildfires Are Providing a Valuable Lesson About Sex Ed

It seems that to the folks at CitizenLink, the tragic consequences of these wildfires are just like the tragic consequences of sex-education since teaching students about safe sex is no different than handing them matches and sending them out into the woods:

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:50:17pm

re: #43 wrenchwench

How partisan they are matters less than how accurate they are. TPM is usually pretty good, I think. Is that what you're calling a 'Dem think tank'?

TPM is ok in my book but not great. Info is selective but usually accurate. Media Matters also does a decent job (with the exception of the MJ Rosenberg thing) but they are also selective. Think Progress is pretty bad in my opinion. Much sloppier, more factual errors, no corrections, etc. All of them are run by the Center for American Progress. Not that there's anything wrong with that but they do have an agenda to promote.
Although sites like FactCheck, Politifact, etc are not always perfect I tend to take their fact checking more seriously than lobbyists and partisan think tanks.

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:53:30pm

re: #48 Killgore Trout

TPM is ok in my book but not great. Info is selective but usually accurate. Media Matters also does a decent job (with the exception of the MJ Rosenberg thing) but they are also selective. Think Progress is pretty bad in my opinion. Much sloppier, more factual errors, no corrections, etc. All of them are run by the Center for American Progress.

They are?

I sure can't find anything obvious saying that.

Targetpractice Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:54:49pm

re: #38 Kragar

Issa: No Evidence or Strong Suspicions Holder Knew Of Gunwalking

Whitewater 2.0: "No, we don't have anything concrete, that's why we have to dig deeper! Now grab a shovel!"

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:55:29pm

re: #49 erik_t

They are?

I sure can't find anything obvious saying that.

Their Wikipedia page also says not one thing about CAP:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

dragonfire1981 Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:56:04pm

re: #2 erik_t

Romneyland, of course, won't give the rest of us any evidence-based reason to trust them over the newspaper. Can't let facts, or even alleged facts, escape to the hoi polloi except when absolutely necessary.

Saying 'we think they're wrong and this is why' invites rational thought, and we don't want to encourage the voters to use critical thinking. It's about to be banned in Texas, after all.

That could possibly be the creepiest theme park ever:

- Employees walking around dressed up as cops
- Roving bands of barbers waiting to strike at unsuspecting visitors at any moment
- A bus which constantly circles the park, honking non-stop day and night
- Odd animatronic creatures all over the place
- Rides that change constantly, sometimes even in the same day.

and a curious sign by the main gate:

PARK RULES

We aren't sure what they are exactly, but whatever they are, we stand by them 100%. Violations will NOT be tolerated.

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:56:37pm

re: #51 iossarian

Their Wikipedia page also says not one thing about CAP:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

How about their Conservapedia page?

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:57:36pm

re: #53 erik_t

How about their Conservapedia page?

/

Seriously, is this another "fact-like-substance" in this debate?

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 1:58:26pm

re: #47 Kragar

And then as some of my faith in humanity was restored...

Focus on the Family Reveals How Colorado Wildfires Are Providing a Valuable Lesson About Sex Ed

Many of the firefighters working their asses off to save Focus on the Family have no health insurance

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:01:48pm

re: #49 erik_t

ThinkProgress

ThinkProgress at ThinkProgress.org is a project of the nonpartisan Center for American Progress Action Fund.[1]

Not really "non-partisan" but that's another thing that I'm not comfortable with is that it's not really a secret but they really don't advertise the fact. They aren't really blogs in the old school sense, they are platforms for well connected and funded beltway insiders. Again, not there's anything wrong with that but it does raise my suspicions.

Destro Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:02:13pm

re: #1 Expand Your Ground

This is telling me this news story hurts Romney (political genius that I am)

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:03:31pm

re: #56 Killgore Trout

ThinkProgress

Not really "non-partisan" but that's another thing that I'm not comfortable with is that it's not really a secret but they really don't advertise the fact. They aren't really blogs in the old school sense, they are platforms for well connected and funded beltway insiders. Again, not there's anything wrong with that but it does raise my suspicions.

re: #48 Killgore Trout

TPM is ok in my book but not great... All of them are run by the Center for American Progress.

Sigh.

dragonfire1981 Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:03:52pm

re: #55 erik_t

Many of the firefighters working their asses off to save Focus on the Family have no health insurance

That is absolutely appalling.

This is NOT how a society should treat its bravest.

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:04:37pm

re: #56 Killgore Trout

Are you just going to ignore the fact that you made a false statement in associating TPM with the Center for American Progress?

ThinkProgress

Not really "non-partisan" but that's another thing that I'm not comfortable with is that it's not really a secret but they really don't advertise the fact. They aren't really blogs in the old school sense, they are platforms for well connected and funded beltway insiders. Again, not there's anything wrong with that but it does raise my suspicions.

Do you have any evidence at all for that statement? I'll point you to Josh Marshall's Wikipedia page to get you started. How exactly was he "well connected and funded"?

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

dragonfire1981 Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:05:08pm

re: #47 Kragar

And then as some of my faith in humanity was restored...

Focus on the Family Reveals How Colorado Wildfires Are Providing a Valuable Lesson About Sex Ed

An interesting quote from the original FOF post:

Yet our federal government currently pours nearly 16 times as much money into “safe” sex education than it does into helping kids learn how to avoid starting fires in the area of sexuality or SRA. Perhaps this is why we have so many uncontained “fires” caused by sex outside of marriage.

I live in Mississippi, where abstinence only sex ed is all that's allowed. We also have the highest teen birthrate in the nation.

Hmmm....

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:07:36pm

re: #55 erik_t

Many of the firefighters working their asses off to save Focus on the Family have no health insurance

Pff, if those guys were smart, they would all be investment bankers and lawyers. Dumbasses.

///

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:09:11pm

re: #60 iossarian

Center for American Progress

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:09:32pm

re: #61 dragonfire1981

An interesting quote from the original FOF post:

I live in Mississippi, where abstinence only sex ed is all that's allowed. We also have the highest teen birthrate in the nation.

Hmmm...

If you tell kids "Don't touch that!", they invariably touch it. If you scare the hell out of them in graphic details, showing them the negative outcomes, they find something better to do.

Bulworth Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:10:03pm

re: #61 dragonfire1981

An interesting quote from the original FOF post:

I live in Mississippi, where abstinence only sex ed is all that's allowed. We also have the highest teen birthrate in the nation.

Hmmm...

Ur doing that thing again. Thinking.

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:10:43pm

re: #63 Killgore Trout

Center for American Progress

Curiously lacking in any mentions of TPM.

When will we get our retraction?

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:10:51pm

Funding

The Center for American Progress is classified as a 501(c)(3) organization under U.S. Internal Revenue Code. The institute receives approximately $25 million per year in funding from a variety of sources, including individuals, foundations, and corporations. From 2003 to 2007, the center received about $15 million in grants from 58 foundations. Major individual donors include George Soros, Peter Lewis, Steve Bing, and Herbert M. Sandler. The Center receives undisclosed sums from corporate donors.[5]

Wal-Mart is a major funder of the Center for American Progress, having given at least half a million dollars to the organization. [6] Wal-Mart has been a major backer of Pres Obama's health care legislation, which critics contend would disproportionately drive up costs for Wal-Mart's smaller competitors. [7]

Some open government groups, such as the Sunlight Foundation and the Campaign Legal Center, criticize the Center's failure to disclose its contributors, particularly since it is so influential in appointments to the Obama administration.[8]

CAP has also been funded by the Democracy Alliance.

Bulworth Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:11:32pm

Yet our federal government currently pours nearly 16 times as much money into “safe” sex education than it does into helping kids learn how to avoid starting fires in the area of sexuality or SRA. Perhaps this is why we have so many uncontained “fires” caused by sex outside of marriage.

So the FoF is saying that if we just "threw some money at the problem", the incompetent gubmit could social engineer us some no-sexy time for kids?

dragonfire1981 Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:11:37pm

re: #64 Kragar

If you tells kids "Don't touch that!", they invariably touch it. If you scare the hell out of them in graphic details, showing them the negative outcomes, they find something better to do.

Precisely.

"Sex is bad unless you do it after you get married" is about the stupidest message you can send to kids.

I am a Christian but you better believe that if I have a daughter I am teaching her about contraception and the like. Maybe I'd like her to wait until marriage for sex, but if her judgment fails her and that doesn't happen, I'd at least like to minimize the chance of her ending up with an unwanted pregnancy.

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:12:56pm

re: #66 erik_t
You can click through the links and check the sources for yourself.
ThinkProgress

ThinkProgress at ThinkProgress.org is a project of the nonpartisan Center for American Progress Action Fund.[1]

gwangung Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:13:12pm

re: #67 Killgore Trout

Funding

~~So, where's the connection to TPM????~~ Ah. OK

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:13:29pm

re: #70 Killgore Trout

You can click through the links and check the sources for yourself.
ThinkProgress

You know that Talking Points Memo and ThinkProgress are different, right? Because we all know that.

Obdicut Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:13:33pm

re: #63 Killgore Trout

Talking Points Memo and ThinkProgress are different entities. You do know that, right?

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:14:14pm

re: #73 Obdicut

Talking Points Memo and ThinkProgress are different entities. You do know that, right?

Of course he does, because he listed them separately in re: #48 Killgore Trout.

Obdicut Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:14:32pm

I love Killgore in his 'barely following the conversation' mode.

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:15:12pm

re: #75 Obdicut

I love Killgore in his 'barely following the conversation' mode.

I don't. It makes me sad to consciously lose respect for people in real time.

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:16:38pm

2 days till I get my special edition 6th Edition 40k rules.

Image: 8YnxF.jpg

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:17:53pm

OK, I'm off now. We now know a lot about the Center for American Progress and its funding (Soros!). We also know that Think Progress and Talking Points Memo are two separate entities (though confusingly they share some initials).

Tune in tomorrow as we find out why political party press releases are more reliable than independent media sources.

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:18:08pm

re: #72 erik_t

You know that Talking Points Memo and ThinkProgress are different, right? Because we all know that.

Oops sorry about that. I mixed up the TPM and TP.

iossarian Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:18:54pm

Image: deflated_balloon.jpg

kirkspencer Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:19:40pm

KT, per your link Media Matters is not "run by the Center for American Progress." It has jointly run other agencies and groups with CAP.

CAP did help found MMFA by providing start-up funding. There is a bit of difference between that and running it.

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:20:01pm

re: #79 Killgore Trout

Oops sorry about that. I mixed up the TPM and TP.

Yet you listed them separately and referred them separately by name several times...

Whether intentional obfuscation or carelessness, it doesn't exactly make me more confident in anything but your rebunking skills.

Charles Johnson Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:24:02pm

Robert Stacy McCain's neo-Nazi pal appears to be losing his mind: Neo-Nazi Bill White: U.S. Is a 'Demonic Dream'.

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:24:27pm

re: #81 kirkspencer

KT, per your link Media Matters is not "run by the Center for American Progress." It has jointly run other agencies and groups with CAP.

CAP did help found MMFA by providing start-up funding. There is a bit of difference between that and running it.

That's probably true. Like I said, I'm not suspecting some secret Soros conspiracy but they are well funded and well connected folks. They make no secret that they do have an agenda but I don;t know who's behind these sites, where the money comes from and what they're agenda might be. I'm just not comfortable with it.

engineer cat Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:25:01pm

i'm a project of the non-partisan Center for Feline Based Software Methodogies and Wandering Around Aimlessly

Targetpractice Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:25:27pm

re: #83 Charles Johnson

Robert Stacy McCain's neo-Nazi pal appears to be losing his mind: Neo-Nazi Bill White: U.S. Is a 'Demonic Dream'.

Get that man some thorazine, stat!

goddamnedfrank Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:26:05pm

Socrates the Druid casts Baffling Bullshit. Your attempts at logical construction automatically fail unless buttressed by a blood alcohol level of at least 0.1%

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:26:17pm

re: #82 erik_t

Yet you listed them separately and referred them separately by name several times...

Whether intentional obfuscation or carelessness, it doesn't exactly make me more confident in anything but your rebunking skills.

I did recall that TPM was a Center For American Progress funded project but I can't seem to find a link right now. I may have remembered incorrectly.

dragonath Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:30:29pm

Everybody knows the Center for American Progress is funded by a secret cabal of Gay Jewish Nazi Leprechauns like Soros, whose one wish is to bring down the United States and perhaps Canada too. Ohohoho can you feel the eeevil

Kragar Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:34:55pm

re: #89 Be Zorch, Daddio

Everybody knows the Center for American Progess is funded by a secret cabal of Gay Jewish Nazi Leprechauns like Soros, whose one wish is to bring down the United States and perhaps Canada too. Ohohoho can you feel the eeevil

Youtube Video

erik_t Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:35:50pm

re: #88 Killgore Trout

I did recall that TPM was a Center For American Progress funded project but I can't seem to find a link right now. I may have remembered incorrectly.

You only recall this now, rather than fifteen posts ago? So were you or were you not mixing up TPM and ThinkProgress?

Daniel Ballard Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:39:20pm

re: #46 iossarian

God Bless The Queen, peacemaker

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:47:59pm

re: #91 erik_t

You only recall this now, rather than fifteen posts ago? So were you or were you not mixing up TPM and ThinkProgress?

Yes, once you pointed out my mistake of mixing up TP and TMP a realized I didn't have a link to support my allegation that TPM was a CAP funded project. I can't find anything about their funding so it might not be available information.

goddamnedfrank Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:48:15pm

re: #92 Daniel Ballard

Wanted to catch you. Awhile ago you mentioned thinking about getting a 22/45 to mod into a target pistol. Turners is running a sale on all Ruger models through tomorrow.

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:53:28pm

BTW, Think Tanks and lobbyists are a very interesting and influential force on American politics and news. The Soros/Koch Bros. conspiracies get pretty silly but there is big money out there and it buys a lot of influence.

Amory Blaine Wed, Jun 27, 2012 2:55:22pm

re: #22 Kragar

Terry Jones thinks the President has "a type of homosexual look"

[Embedded content]

He should speak for himself first!!

Youtube Video

dragonath Wed, Jun 27, 2012 3:01:00pm

In Nazi Leprechaun Lore, the letters "T" "P" and "M" are used to confuse their enemies and have a complicated runosophic and occultish history. Sometimes you can hear the little people's incantation at midnight: "Taxes, Taxes, Power and Might, In the Darkness we Delight".

Targetpractice Wed, Jun 27, 2012 3:08:22pm

An expansion on TPM's earlier bulletin about Issa:

Fast And Furious: Issa No Longer Suspicious Holder Knew Of Gunwalking

A day ahead of a vote to find Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress, House Oversight Committee Chairman Darrell Issa (R-CA) said his committee is no longer even strongly suspicious that highest ranking law enforcement officer in the country knew that guns “walked” during the botched ATF operation known as Fast and Furious.

“During the inception and the participation through the death of Brian Terry, we have no evidence nor do we currently have strong suspicion” that Holder knew of the tactics, Issa said during testimony before the House Rules Committee on Wednesday.

“We have just the opposite, have a number of people, including Lanny Breuer, who should have known who’s responsibility was to know, that as part of our ongoing responsibility to figure out who was responsible,” Issa continued.

Issa also said he had no specific knowledge that the White House knew of the gunwalking tactics and said the committee wasn’t looking to the president.

*snip*

“We are now about to find in contempt the attorney general of the United States of America after you just heard that,” Cummings said.

“Sure,” replied Issa. “It’s not for what the attorney general knew about Fast and Furious, it’s about the attorney general’s refusal to provide the documents.”

In other words, it's sheer pettiness on Issa's part. He's had this witch hunt going for months, it's gone nowhere, so now he's throwing a temper tantrum that the party leadership thinks it can profit off.

goddamnedfrank Wed, Jun 27, 2012 3:08:31pm

re: #93 Killgore Trout

I can't find anything about their funding so it might not be available information.

They're privately owned by Josh Marshall and run advertisements.

re: #97 Be Zorch, Daddio

In Nazi Leprechaun Lore, the letters "T" "P" and "M" are used to confuse their enemies and have a complicated runosophic and occultish history. Sometimes you can hear the little people's incantation at midnight: "Taxes, Taxes, Power and Might, In the Darkness we Delight".

It's true. You can't spell Mister Mxyzptlk without them.

100

Tigger2 Wed, Jun 27, 2012 3:17:19pm

re: #12 Killgore Trout

The same claims were used in an Obama campaign ad. Even WaPo's own factcheker rated the claims as false.
4 Pinocchio's for Obama’s newest anti-Romney ad
Fact Check and Politifact gave the claims similar ratings.

Killgore I give every Republican Politician and all right wing media 10 Pinocchio's most of the time.

101

CuriousLurker Wed, Jun 27, 2012 3:18:30pm

re: #93 Killgore Trout

Yes, once you pointed out my mistake of mixing up TP and TMP a realized I didn't have a link to support my allegation that TPM was a CAP funded project. I can't find anything about their funding so it might not be available information.

I doubt TPM receives any kind of "funding" in the way TP does. Just to clarify:

Center for American Progress Action Fund

Formerly known simply as the American Progress Action Fund, the Center for American Progress Action Fund is a "sister advocacy organization" and is organizationally and financially separate from the Center for American Progress, although they share many staff and a physical address. Whereas the Center for American Progress is a 501(c)(3) nonprofit, the fund is a 501(c)(4), allowing it to devote more funds to lobbying. In 2003, George Soros promised to financially support the organization by donating up to three million dollars.

TP is owned by the Center for American Progress Action Fund. TPM is an LLC, not a 501(c), which would put them under a different set of rules WRT to income/financing/taxation as they are a commercial/business entity.

102

Killgore Trout Wed, Jun 27, 2012 3:20:41pm

re: #101 CuriousLurker

I doubt TPM receives any kind of "funding" in the way TP does. Just to clarify:

TP is owned by the Center for American Progress Action Fund. TPM is an LLC, not a 501(c), which would put them under a different set of rules WRT to income/financing/taxation as they are a commercial/business entity.

Ah, thanks. I guess that would also explain why funding (if there is any) isn't openly available information.

103

CuriousLurker Wed, Jun 27, 2012 3:21:32pm

re: #101 CuriousLurker

Addendum: The fact that TPM is an LLC is right there in the footer of every one of their web pages next to the copyright:

© 2011 TPM Media LLC. All Rights Reserved.

104

CuriousLurker Wed, Jun 27, 2012 3:22:56pm

re: #102 Killgore Trout

Correct, their revenue is undisclosed.

105

Daniel Ballard Wed, Jun 27, 2012 3:46:25pm

re: #94 goddamnedfrank

Thanks, but had a change of plan. My young student has moved on to more appealing to teen sports, so I'm refinishing my Caspian .45 that Kings made long ago. Might be getting a new finish, a vapor deposited form of carbon that is a lot like diamond. The holster draws keep wearing the finish off, so this 3rd refinishing job bis hopefully more permanent.
Gotta get back to IDPA competitions. I miss the adrenaline.

106

JRCMYP Wed, Jun 27, 2012 6:29:14pm

re: #10 goddamnedfrank

His penis hurts.

No, that would be butt hurt.

Spy Mode Auto

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