Ron and Rand Paul Announce New Cause: Let Corporations Control the Internet

Pseudo-libertarians or corporate shills?
Technology • Views: 43,447

The dynamic duo of Ron and Rand Paul have announced a new crusade — keeping the Internet free of government interference and solidly in the hands of the wise, loving corporations who always choose the right path: The Pauls’ New Crusade: ‘Internet Freedom’.

Kentucky senator Rand and his father Ron Paul, who has not yet formally conceded the Republican presidential nomination, will throw their weight behind a new online manifesto set to be released today by the Paul-founded Campaign for Liberty. The new push, Paul aides say, will in some ways displace what has been their movement’s long-running top priority, shutting down the Federal Reserve Bank. The move is an attempt to stake a libertarian claim to a central public issue of the next decade, and to move from the esoteric terrain of high finance to the everyday world of cable modems and Facebook.

The manifesto, obtained yesterday by BuzzFeed, is titled “The Technology Revolution” and lays out an argument —�in doomsday tones —for keeping the government entirely out of regulating anything online, and for leaving the private sector to shape the new online space.

Sure, let the big cable companies and ISPs do what they want! What could possibly go wrong? Free market uber alles!

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127 comments
1 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:23:40am

These guys do not understand that there are some things that cannot be left to the Free Market, including managing resources and infrastructure.

Including human resources, namely education.

2 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:25:22am

I can see no negative repercussions to allowing entities concerned mainly with profits control a major communications and technological system.

///

3 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:26:42am

Rand & Ron Paul, proudly defending the right of "Local Mom" to advertise her "Weird Wrinkle Tip" on all websites, instead of targeted ads for online stores where you might actually buy something.

4 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:28:51am

re: #3 Learned Mother of Zion

Rand & Ron Paul, proudly defending the right of "Local Mom" to advertise her "Weird Wrinkle Tip" on all websites, instead of targeted ads for online stores where you might actually buy something.

"Your search for global warming produced no results. Did you mean offshore drilling? These results brought to you by BP."

5 Bulworth  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:29:56am
The new push, Paul aides say, will in some ways displace what has been their movement’s long-running top priority, shutting down the Federal Reserve Bank.

I forget. How is the Federal Reserve Bank restricting my liberty today? /

6 lawhawk  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:33:04am

Well, Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN) already controls the DNS so I'm not exactly sure what they're looking to do. Their manifesto (use of that word should raise eyebrows) includes the following bit:

The manifesto lays out five specific battles with government regulation and with liberals who state their goal of online liberty in similar terms, but who view corporate encroachment as a more immediate risk. The Paul manifesto seeks to rein in anti-trust actions against companies in new industries; to stop attempts to impose "Net Neutrality" rules on broadband providers; to prevent government control of online infrastructure; to broaden private control of the wireless spectrum, and shore up "private property rights on the Internet."

The Pauls also take a stand for the growing industry known (and widely criticized) as "big data."

They deride the notion that "private sector data collection practices must be scrutinized and tightly regulated inthe name of 'protecting consumers,' at the same time as government’s warrantless surveillance and collection of private citizens’ Internet data has dramatically increased."

Right, because there's nothing to fear from the data collection practices of private entities, like Facebook. Facebook, after all, has such a splendid record of respecting privacy rights and making it easy to control privacy settings.

I'm all for making sure that an individual's data is protected from unwarranted snooping, but it ignores that corporations and business entities are among the most voracious users of that kind of data (think cookies, spending habits, etc.) They set up entire business models to exploit data that would fall into data collection under their terms.

7 The Ghost of a Flea  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:33:38am

I'll just leave these here--

Let It Bleed: Libertarianism and the Workplace

Libertarianism is [not] a philosophy of individual freedom

As well as the money quote:

Libertarianism is a philosophy of individual freedom. Or so its adherents claim. But with their single-minded defense of the rights of property and contract, libertarians cannot come to grips with the systemic denial of freedom in private regimes of power, particularly the workplace. When they do try to address that unfreedom, as a group of academic libertarians calling themselves “Bleeding Heart Libertarians” have done in recent months, they wind up traveling down one of two paths: Either they give up their exclusive focus on the state and become something like garden-variety liberals or they reveal that they are not the defenders of freedom they claim to be.

8 KettleKat  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:34:18am

Why do people like the Pauls always assume that if other are left to their own devices, they'll do exactly what you want? Doesn't the existence of people who disagree with them about how things should be run kind of blow their whole ideology out of the water? Apparently the free market is a massive exercise in collectivism.

9 Kronocide  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:36:27am

Dumb and Dumber sez whut?

Freedom is Slavery
War is Peace
Ignorance is Strength

10 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:36:48am

I don't know who the guy who Rush had subbing for him is, but the guy is a fucking moron.

He argued that Obamacare will have to fail because he won't be able to find soldiers willing to round up the people who choose not to buy insurance.

What the fuck is he talking about?

11 The Ghost of a Flea  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:38:35am

re: #10 Kragar

I don't know who the guy who Rush had subbing for him is, but the guy is a fucking moron.

He argued that Obamacare will have to fail because he won't be able to find soldiers willing to round up the people who choose not to buy insurance.

What the fuck is he talking about?

The words are less important than the sustained tone of outrage.

12 Bulworth  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:38:58am
What the fuck is he talking about?

His own fevered imagination version of the AFA.

13 Kronocide  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:40:43am

re: #10 Kragar

I don't know who the guy who Rush had subbing for him is, but the guy is a fucking moron.
What the fuck is he talking about?

Maybe Rush and Beck are in Puerto Rico together since Beck had a guy subbing for him the other day. His greatest statement O'Reillyism of the segment I listened to, talking about heat records and global warming:

So this heat record got broken, set in 1898. Why was it hot in 1898? Can you explain that to me?

14 Amory Blaine  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:41:35am
15 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:42:23am

re: #8 rainkettle

Why do people like the Pauls always assume that if other are left to their own devices, they'll do exactly what you want?

Because the Pauls are wealthy. They're probably right.

16 abolitionist  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:44:25am
17 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:44:33am

re: #12 Bulworth

His own fevered imagination version of the AFA.

He then tried to bring up federal aid as theft.

"If I force you to give me $200 but I spend it to buy food and shelter for a homeless person, its still theft, right? What if I get 3 or 100 or 1000 people to agree with me? It's still theft."

So if someone forces me to pay money, and uses it for road I'll never drive on, bail out a bank I'll never be a customer at, buys a fighter jet I'll never fly, or pays a Federal Employee in a Dept I don't benefit from, it is theft right?

The idea of a functional community just doesn't register with these guys.

18 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:44:49am

I'm sure free market will get right on the problem of tackling, e.g., online child pornography.

Why does Ron Paul hate children?

19 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:45:00am

re: #14 Amory Blaine

Private company fires lifeguard for trying to save a drowning man.

a bit OT, but it does demonstrate the efficiency of the free market in managing human resources and ensuring safety

20 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:45:54am

re: #14 Amory Blaine

Private company fires lifeguard for trying to save a drowning man.

It was a liability issue for the company.

They're still dicks though.

21 Bulworth  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:48:55am
"If I force you to give me $200 but I spend it to buy food and shelter for a homeless person, its still theft, right? What if I get 3 or 100 or 1000 people to agree with me? It's still theft."

I think we all remember this familiar argument from talk radio when Medicare Part D was passed. Oh, wait...

22 Amory Blaine  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:49:09am

re: #20 Kragar

It was a liability issue for the company.

They're still dicks though.

Having a private company provide the service sounds like a liability for the beachgoers. The reason Florida even exists as a tourist destination in the first place is its beaches.

23 Romantic Heretic  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:49:10am

re: #7 The Ghost of a Flea

I'll just leave these here--

Let It Bleed: Libertarianism and the Workplace

Libertarianism is [not] a philosophy of individual freedom

Which makes me think of this article in American Conservative Marxism of The Right

24 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:52:17am

re: #22 Amory Blaine

Having a private company provide the service sounds like a liability for the beachgoers. The reason Florida even exists as a tourist destination in the first place is its beaches.

It was my understanding it was a privately owned beach he was working at.

Edit: never mind, I see it was a public beach

25 Amory Blaine  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:54:45am

re: #24 Kragar

I was under the impression it is a public beach.

26 wrenchwench  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:54:48am

From the link at the top:

"This is our revolution -- government needs to get out of the way," the manifesto concludes.

The Pauls fail to recall that we had a revolution and the result was to put the power in the hands of the people, who elect representatives to run things for their benefit. Obviously it's not perfect (the Pauls themselves are elected, after all) but it's a hell of a lot better than having corporations run things for their own benefit.

27 Amory Blaine  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:55:57am

Form the article

Jeff Ellis Management, the Orlando-area company under contract with Hallandale Beach since 2003 to provide lifeguards at two public beaches, announced Wednesday that it would immediately interview the managers and workers involved in the incident to determine whether any safety protocols were violated.

28 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:55:59am

re: #26 wrenchwench

From the link at the top:

The Pauls fail to recall that we had a revolution and the result was to put the power in the hands of the people, who elect representatives to run things for their benefit.

Of the people, by the people, for the people.

Morons.

29 lawhawk  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:57:10am

re: #22 Amory Blaine

Company officials on Tuesday said Lopez broke a rule that could've put beachgoers in his designated area in jeopardy. The firm could ultimately have been sued, officials said.

"We have liability issues and can't go out of the protected area," said supervisor Susan Ellis. "What he did was his own decision. He knew the company rules and did what he thought he needed to do."

Lopez said he was sitting at his post at about 1:45 p.m. Monday when someone rushed to his stand asking for help. Lopez said he noticed a man struggling in the water south of his post. The man was previously swimming in an "unprotected" stretch of the beach, city officials confirmed Tuesday.

"It was a long run, but someone needed my help. I wasn't going to say no," he said.

Company officials said the rescue took place about 1,500 feet south of the company's protective boundaries. The unprotected area has signs alerting beachgoers to swim at their own risk.

It was a public beach, but the guy also left his area of responsibility to save the guy's life outside of an area patrolled by lifeguards. Had someone drowned within his zone, he and the company would have been on the hook - and so too the municipality.

I happen to think the lifeguard did the right thing, but the company has a point - if your job is to patrol your sector of guarded beach and you leave it, that opens up the potential for drowning in an area you're contracted to watch.

30 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:57:33am

re: #26 wrenchwench

... but it's a hell of a lot better than having corporations run things for their own benefit.

The British East India Company was a government unto itself, and it was one of the things that Adam Smith was warning against in The Wealth of Nations: state-sactioned monoplies like that stifled free trade.

31 nines09  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:57:34am

"Internet Freedom" "Campaign for Liberty" What could possibly go wrong?

32 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:57:47am

Alabama Pastor Holds ‘Whites Only’ Conference


The organizer of the event, Rev. William C. Collier says that his Church of God’s Chosen (Christian Identity Ministries) is not a hate group but adds that he believes “the white race is God’s chosen people.”

Collier defends why only white Christians are invited.

“We don’t have the facilities to accommodate other people. We haven’t got any invitations to black, Muslim events. Of course we are not invited to Jewish events and stuff,” Collier said.

Collier does not specify what sort of special “facilities” people of color may need, but the line harkens back to old southern segregation, when water fountains and bathrooms had “whites only” signs similar to Collier’s flyer.

The church hosting the conference is named Christian Identity Ministries. This is the third annual conference — and the Ku Klux Klan is among the attendees this year. The founder of the church, Rev. Mel Lewis, complained that this year’s uproar shows a disrespect for religious liberty.

33 Varek Raith  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:58:49am

re: #29 lawhawk

Some things should not be privatized or for-profit.

34 wrenchwench  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:59:03am
Internet freedom, Paul insiders say, is going to be Rand's end-the-Fed.

Yah, because look how well that worked out. People started looking around and they see Europe, which has nothing like the Fed and no powers similar to it, and they are having a harder time of it than the US. Quick! We need a new issue for Junior to run with!

35 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:59:10am

Control the Internet.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!

Good one for a morning after a holiday (feels like Monday to me)

How are you?

36 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:59:16am

re: #29 lawhawk

I

I happen to think the lifeguard did the right thing, but the company has a point - if your job is to patrol your sector of guarded beach and you leave it, that opens up the potential for drowning in an area you're contracted to watch.

The real failure was on the part of the municipality that issued the contract to the private company to make it clear that they had a responsibility to save lives wherever necessary, not just in their designated area.

37 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:00:45am

Rep. Joe Walsh Attacks Double Amputee Veteran Again, Says She Uses Her Service ‘As A Political Ploy’

From Walsh’s website regarding the “Duckworth Attack”:

Friends,

My opponents are once again trying to accuse me of something that is not true. It has become their agenda this Fourth of July week to twist my words and claim I said my opponent is not a hero and have insulted all veterans as a consequence. Folks, if you’re familiar with me and my campaign, you know this is utterly false. Shame on her for saying this and shame on her for using veterans in this fashion. In fact, recently on the Big John and Amy Show I stated, “Tammy Duckworth’s service demands our respect and that is something I will do and say for her throughout this campaign.” I open all my town halls by recognizing our veterans who served to protect our great nation.

Tammy Duckworth knows this and should know better than to use her service and the service of others as a political ploy to distort my words and distract voters. We as a people are facing great problems in our country, and it is time for us to get serious and address them.

38 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:01:13am

re: #32 Kragar

Alabama Pastor Holds ‘Whites Only’ Conference

"The founder of the church, Rev. Mel Lewis, complained that this year’s uproar shows a disrespect for religious liberty."

Well, in that sense, criticizing the Ayatollah of Iran also "shows a disrespect for religious liberty."

39 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:02:23am

re: #38 Expand Your Ground

"The founder of the church, Rev. Mel Lewis, complained that this year’s uproar shows a disrespect for religious liberty."

Well, in that sense, criticizing the Ayatollah of Iran also "shows a disrespect for religious liberty."

Denying skulls for the Skull Throne also shows disrespect for religious liberty.

40 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:02:24am
41 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:03:25am

Joe Walsh is a hero for standing up against the rising feminism in the US and bravely not paying his child support!
///

42 CuriousLurker  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:03:48am

re: #6 lawhawk

I'm all for making sure that an individual's data is protected from unwarranted snooping, but it ignores that corporations and business entities are among the most voracious users of that kind of data (think cookies, spending habits, etc.) They set up entire business models to exploit data that would fall into data collection under their terms.

Exactly. Anyone who's interested can view the Collusion demo (a Firefox add-on). It'll show you how you're tracked, step-by-step:

If you're not paying for something, you're not the customer; you're the product being sold. —Andrew Lewis

The following TED talk will explain how these things can also affect the news that reaches you. Creepy: Eli Pariser: Beware online "filter bubbles"

43 Amory Blaine  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:03:54am

Here's a good read Hard Water: Politics and Water Supply in Milwaukee, 1870-1995. Its these kinds of practices that lead to 8 water companies providing London with water.

44 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:04:27am

re: #29 lawhawk

It was a public beach, but the guy also left his area of responsibility to save the guy's life outside of an area patrolled by lifeguards. Had someone drowned within his zone, he and the company would have been on the hook - and so too the municipality.

I happen to think the lifeguard did the right thing, but the company has a point - if your job is to patrol your sector of guarded beach and you leave it, that opens up the potential for drowning in an area you're contracted to watch.

LAWYERS! If one has to choose between one's conscience and a possible lawsuit --the lifeguard did the right thing.

45 Gus  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:04:45am

re: #10 Kragar

I don't know who the guy who Rush had subbing for him is, but the guy is a fucking moron.

He argued that Obamacare will have to fail because he won't be able to find soldiers willing to round up the people who choose not to buy insurance.

What the fuck is he talking about?

Walter Williams?

46 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:05:20am

You know what just struck me as potentially hilarious?

What are all the Paulbots who lurk at 4-Chan and the other chan sites going to make of Ron's latest crusade?

47 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:05:51am

re: #46 Kragar

You know what just struck me as potentially hilarious?

What are all the Paulbots who lurk at 4-Chan and the other chan sites going to make of Ron's latest crusade?

They will bravely and stoically pretend it never happened.

48 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:06:23am

re: #45 Gus

Walter Williams?

[Embedded content]

Thats the douche.

49 Gus  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:07:29am

re: #48 Kragar

Thats the douche.

Summer's Eve. Here's his Wiki page.

Another libertarian fruitloop.

50 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:07:29am

re: #46 Kragar

You know what just struck me as potentially hilarious?

What are all the Paulbots who lurk at 4-Chan and the other chan sites going to make of Ron's latest crusade?

I would guess they'll love it. They seem to be against any government regulation of the internet.

51 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:08:38am

re: #50 Killgore Trout

I would guess they'll love it. They seem to be against any government regulation of the internet.

But they also hate companies.

52 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:08:52am

re: #26 wrenchwench

From the link at the top:

The Pauls fail to recall that we had a revolution and the result was to put the power in the hands of the people, who elect representatives to run things for their benefit. Obviously it's not perfect (the Pauls themselves are elected, after all) but it's a hell of a lot better than having corporations run things for their own benefit.

Yeah, didn't Mussolini try it that way. He had a name for it. Just can't get it out now because I never hear it mentioned anymore.

53 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:09:54am

re: #50 Killgore Trout

I would guess they'll love it. They seem to be against any government regulation of the internet.

You're absolutely right! They were so very fond of SOPA.

While a Google representative went back and forth with politicians over the wording of the bill and its goals, dozens of websites, including Reddit, 4chan, Canvas, blacked out their logos in solidarity with American Censorship Day, a nationwide movement urging people to raise their voices in opposition.

/

54 abolitionist  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:11:03am

We live in an increasingly information-rich age, but there's a bit of a problem.

On the net, practically every which way we try to exploit that --to search, read, learn, converse, argue, advocate, shop, share info with friends, etc, we ourselves are being exploited --profiled and data-mined.

55 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:11:58am

re: #53 erik_t

You're absolutely right! They were so very fond of SOPA.

/

Heh. We also overlooked the obvious reality that everything on the internet is Pro-Ron Paul. No exceptions allowed.

56 Varek Raith  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:12:05am

*Renames Death Star to Freedom Star*
Good afternoon.

57 wrenchwench  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:12:31am

re: #54 abolitionist

We live in an increasingly information-rich age, but there's a bit of a problem.

On the net, practically every which way we try to exploit that --to search, read, learn, converse, argue, advocate, shop, share info with friends, etc, we ourselves are being exploited --profiled and data-mined.

From the first link CL just provided:

If you're not paying for something, you're not the customer; you're the product being sold.

- Andrew Lewis

Oops, she posted the quote too...

58 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:12:33am

Ron Paul Gets His Biggest Endorsement Yet — Straight From God

God just came out and endorsed Ron Paul.

Well, sort of.

Pastor Steven Andrew, president of USA Christian Ministries, wrote that Barack Obama and Mitt Romney are non-Christians, and that the only true Christian in the bunch — Ron Paul — would beat the incumbent president Obama.

He alludes to the fact that God wants Ron Paul to win to build a stronger, more conservative America. Get ready for a heavy dose of religious Kool-Aid.

Andrew is "calling denominations, pastors and Christians throughout July to speak up for Christians to be elected, and to publicly repent of sinning against God with non-Christians Barack Obama and Mitt Romney."

Which polling place does He vote at?

59 Varek Raith  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:13:08am

re: #58 NJDhockeyfan

Ron Paul Gets His Biggest Endorsement Yet — Straight From God

Which polling place does He vote at?

He can't.
God is an illegal alien.

60 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:14:11am

re: #56 Varek Raith

*Renames Death Star to Freedom Star*
Good afternoon.

From now on Stormtroopers are to be referred to as "Rainy day scouts"

61 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:14:15am

re: #59 Varek Raith

He can't.
God is an illegal alien.

I bet He can find someone to get fake ID card.

62 Feline Fearless Leader  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:15:02am

re: #56 Varek Raith

*Renames Death Star to Freedom Star*
Good afternoon.

That's "freedom" as in your ionized gases are free to disperse after the superlaser does in your ship or planet, correct?

63 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:15:15am

re: #61 NJDhockeyfan

I bet He can find someone to get fake ID card.

God Himself can presumably create ab initio a perfectly legitimate version of whatever he wants, so long as it's not a Hawaiian long-form.

64 Varek Raith  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:15:48am

re: #63 erik_t

God Himself can presumably create ab initio a perfectly legitimate version of whatever he wants, so long as it's not a Hawaiian long-form.

What.

65 The Ghost of a Flea  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:15:57am

re: #61 NJDhockeyfan

I bet He can find someone to get fake ID card.

"If God creates himself a long-form birth certificate, is it valid?" is the new "Can God create a stone so heavy he can't lift it?"

66 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:17:08am

re: #20 Kragar

It was a liability issue for the company.

They're still dicks though.

The lifeguard would have been screwed no matter what he did.

Left his post to rescue somebody not in the protected area: SCREWED
Refused to leave his post in the protected area, and somebody outside the protected area drowned: SCREWED
Left his post to rescue somebody not in the protected area, meanwhile somebody in the protected area drowned because there was no one at the post: SCREWED

67 Romantic Heretic  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:18:35am

re: #29 lawhawk

It was a public beach, but the guy also left his area of responsibility to save the guy's life outside of an area patrolled by lifeguards. Had someone drowned within his zone, he and the company would have been on the hook - and so too the municipality.

I happen to think the lifeguard did the right thing, but the company has a point - if your job is to patrol your sector of guarded beach and you leave it, that opens up the potential for drowning in an area you're contracted to watch.

As I discovered myself long ago, doing the right thing is and always will be a firing offence. When you work for some one you are property and property does what it's told.

68 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:20:21am
69 William of Orange  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:21:51am

Get a taste of corporate Internet from the guys at Cisco!@

You agree not to use or permit the use of the Service: (i) to invade another's privacy; (ii) for obscene, pornographic, or offensive purposes; (iii) to infringe another's rights, including but not limited to any intellectual property rights; (iv) to upload, email or otherwise transmit or make available any unsolicited or unauthorized advertising, promotional materials, spam, junk mail or any other form of solicitation; (v) to transmit or otherwise make available any code or virus, or perform any activity, that could harm or interfere with any device, software, network or service (including this Service); or (vi) to violate, or encourage any conduct that would violate any applicable law or regulation or give rise to civil or criminal liability.

LOLWUT??!!

No porn on the internet?? That's it! Ron and Rand, Internet wrecking crew.

70 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:22:19am
71 abolitionist  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:25:03am

re: #67 Romantic Heretic

As I discovered myself long ago, doing the right thing is and always will be a firing offence. When you work for some one you are property and property does what it's told.

If you are property you can be sold, or otherwise disposed of. I'd suggest re-thinking that.

72 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:26:04am

OK, if we have to let a company control the internet, I propose we let the guys at Piratebay handle it.

73 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:26:43am

re: #65 The Ghost of a Flea

"If God creates himself a long-form birth certificate, is it valid?" is the new "Can God create a stone so heavy he can't lift it?"

Birth certificates require a birth date.

And parents.

74 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:27:11am

re: #72 Kragar

OK, if we have to let a company control the internet, I propose we let the guys at Piratebay handle it.

Why not icanhascheezburger.com?

75 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:27:34am

re: #67 Romantic Heretic

As I discovered myself long ago, doing the right thing is and always will be a firing offence. When you work for some one you are property and property does what it's told.

Again, I see it as a failure on the part of the municipality contracting the services out not to foresee such a circumstance and add a clause to the contract exempting lifeguards from liability if they their designated areas to save a life outside it.

76 Gus  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:28:23am

OT - Chris Rock stirs up a delayed hornet's nest of right wing crazy:

77 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:28:31am

ME, I'll control the internet.

Pay me and I"ll do nothing.

78 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:28:33am

re: #66 Learned Mother of Zion

The lifeguard would have been screwed no matter what he did.

Left his post to rescue somebody not in the protected area: SCREWED
Refused to leave his post in the protected area, and somebody outside the protected area drowned: SCREWED
Left his post to rescue somebody not in the protected area, meanwhile somebody in the protected area drowned because there was no one at the post: SCREWED

Facing God someday: Not screwed.

79 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:29:30am

re: #76 Gus

OT - Chris Rock stirs up a delayed hornet's nest of right wing crazy:

[Embedded content]

I'm perfectly happy to celebrate Juneteenth any day.

80 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:29:56am

re: #78 Mostly sane, most of the time.

Facing God someday: Not screwed.

Being able to sleep at night without nightmares --NOT screwed.
Being able to look at oneself in the mirror --NOT screwed.

81 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:31:10am

re: #79 Mostly sane, most of the time.

I'm perfectly happy to celebrate Juneteenth any day.

Oh, wait, as long as that date is June 19th.

Perhaps I meant that I would celebrate any year.

The official foods of Juneteenth would be Texas barbecue and sheetcake, so you can see why I'm so willing to celebrate.

83 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:34:43am

I was rather ambivalent about the holiday yesterday, so I am on Chris Rock's side right now.

the War on Women has gotten me down. I"m also reading/listening to the last in Robert Caro's series on LBJ The Passage to Power.

How government works is not something to inspire patriotism.

84 Gus  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:37:31am

Apparently it's perfectly fine for people to "dredge up" old history as long as it's in the form of "Moses" and by way of Charlton Heston.

85 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:38:17am

GOP Rep. Tells Constituent Who Asks About Raising The Minimum Wage To ‘Get A Job’

CONSTITUENT: Hi, I’m (inaudible) how are you? Happy Fourth of July. Jesse Jackson, Jr. is passing a bill around to increase the minimum wage to 10 bucks and hour. Do you support that?

YOUNG: Probably not.

CONSTITUENT: 10 bucks, that would give us a living wage.

YOUNG: How about getting a job?

CONSTITUENT: I do have one.

YOUNG: Well, then why do you want that benefit? Get a job.

86 Mattand  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:38:26am

re: #67 Romantic Heretic

As I discovered myself long ago, doing the right thing is and always will be a firing offence. When you work for some one you are property and property does what it's told.

I don't know if I'd go so far as to say property. However, I often find that the employee in some ways is the least valuable asset at any given company.

If there's any financial problems, management sure as hell isn't going to layoff the desk or the copier.

87 lawhawk  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:40:08am

re: #84 Gus

So it was said. So shall it be done *clap clap* /Pharaoh

88 Mattand  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:40:24am

re: #85 Kragar

GOP Rep. Tells Constituent Who Asks About Raising The Minimum Wage To ‘Get A Job’

CONSTITUENT: Hi, I’m (inaudible) how are you? Happy Fourth of July. Jesse Jackson, Jr. is passing a bill around to increase the minimum wage to 10 bucks and hour. Do you support that?

YOUNG: Probably not.

CONSTITUENT: 10 bucks, that would give us a living wage.

YOUNG: How about getting a job?

CONSTITUENT: I do have one.

YOUNG: Well, then why do you want that benefit? Get a job.

This is Chris Christie's campaign strategy for President in a nutshell: abuse anyone who disagrees with you.

89 Gus  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:44:32am

re: #85 Kragar

GOP Rep. Tells Constituent Who Asks About Raising The Minimum Wage To ‘Get A Job’

Another day, another Republican, and yet another asshole.

90 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:45:03am

re: #85 Kragar

GOP Rep. Tells Constituent Who Asks About Raising The Minimum Wage To ‘Get A Job’

Work is its own reward. It keeps you from the idleness which will lead to sinning. Now shut up and get back to work and stop thinking about sinning.

91 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:45:04am

re: #86 Mattand

I don't know if I'd go so far as to say property. However, I often find that the employee in some ways is the least valuable asset at any given company.

If there's any financial problems, management sure as hell isn't going to layoff the desk or the copier.

My last job was as low level as one can get in a corporation. Hourly worker in a store.

Yes, you feel like property at times. You are a warm body there to fill space and do mindless work that has to be done that can't be done by a machine (yet). Interaction with the Customers is the only meaningful part of the job.

While you are on the clock, you are theirs to do with what they will and without the Labor laws and your ability to defend them, you would be treated as a slave by many in the organization and the organization itself.

Management is much more aware of liability than they are of being decent human beings. Because they themselves are treated as property by the higher ups.

I have a lot of admiration for the corporate structure because of the efficiency in which it can bring products to market. Yet, I do not think it is always good for the people it employees. People are emotional creatures. Corporations are not. We need labor laws to regulate corporate behavior.

And, now I see I speak of corporates as if they are sentient beings. OMG!!!

92 leftynyc  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:45:39am

O/T but hilarious. Seems this LA politician was surprised to find out that vouchers for religious schools includes Muslims:

[Link: www.joemygod.blogspot.com...]

93 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:46:35am

re: #92 leftynyc

O/T but hilarious. Seems this LA politician was surprised to find out that vouchers for religious schools includes Muslims:

[Link: www.joemygod.blogspot.com...]

Some animals are more equal than others --doncha know?

94 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:46:45am

re: #85 Kragar

GOP Rep. Tells Constituent Who Asks About Raising The Minimum Wage To ‘Get A Job’

This assclown does know that the minimum wage... only applies to those with jobs, right? That those damned lazy welfare mommas rollin' in their blinged Caddies don't get minimum wage just for existing? That someone asking about minimum wage, y'know, probably holds a minimum-wage job?

95 Mattand  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:48:20am

re: #91 ggt

While you are on the clock, you are theirs to do with what they will and without the Labor laws and your ability to defend them, you would be treated as a slave by many in the organization and the organization itself.


I have a lot of admiration for the corporate structure because of the efficiency in which it can bring products to market. Yet, I do not think it is always good for the people it employees. People are emotional creatures. Corporations are not. We need labor laws to regulate corporate behavior.

This is why I'm not as dismissive of unions as I used to be, and also why we still need them.

96 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:49:22am

re: #95 Mattand

This is why I'm not as dismissive of unions as I used to be, and also why we still need them.

Yeah, I used think the different government agencies that have been created (OSHA etc) were doing the work of Unions and that Unions were no longer necessary. I also now see it differently.

Also, I see a real problem for the non-union, non-upper, upper management employees in a corporation. Both Union and Upper Execs have contracts --when a company runs into trouble, they are legally bound to honor the contracts --execs get their uber-bonuses, Union employees get paid. It's those in the middle who are screwed.

97 Lidane  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:53:48am

Oh look. More economic and business illiteracy from Ron and Rand Paul. What a surprise.

Anyone who takes these imbeciles seriously as authorities on how the world works needs therapy. Or to read an actual economics book.

98 Gus  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:56:08am

Bird brain strikes again!

99 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:57:28am

re: #98 Gus

Bird brain strikes again!

[Embedded content]

Mitt is the member of the family that releases the carefully-considered sound bites.

Consider that for a moment.

100 Gus  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 11:59:40am

re: #99 erik_t

Mitt is the member of the family that releases the carefully-considered sound bites.

Consider that for a moment.

Ann Romney said it, and she owns it. This isn't the first time.

101 Varek Raith  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:00:09pm

Steam offline mode has been broken since the third.
I freaking hate steam.
/Rant

102 Gus  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:01:45pm
103 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:04:19pm

Why is Ann Romney being persecuted for speaking The Truth About Obama?

/

104 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:04:37pm

George Zimmerman new bail set at $1m
Your text to link...

105 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:06:17pm

re: #101 Varek Raith

Steam offline mode has been broken since the third.
I freaking hate steam.
/Rant

I haven't had any problems with it.

106 CuriousLurker  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:07:23pm
107 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:07:27pm

re: #101 Varek Raith

Steam offline mode has been broken since the third.
I freaking hate steam.
/Rant

Damn steam punks!

108 wrenchwench  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:07:38pm

re: #105 Kragar

I haven't had any problems with it.

Now Varek hates you, too.

109 Varek Raith  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:08:22pm

re: #105 Kragar

I haven't had any problems with it.

[Link: forums.steampowered.com...]

I feel so much better. :P

110 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:11:11pm

Here is a steam question for you:

My kids have started playing TF2 and I wanted to set up a server where they could practice against each other and some bots at the same time. If I set up a server for them, can I have bots join their teams?

111 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:14:00pm

So how about them Cubs?

112 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:14:10pm

re: #110 Kragar

Here is a steam question for you:

My kids have started playing TF2 and I wanted to set up a server where they could practice against each other and some bots at the same time. If I set up a server for them, can I have bots join their teams?

I haven't played in a long time. I know they were working on developing playable bots but I don't know how far they got with it. The last TF2 bot I saw on a practice server would just run around aimlessly.

113 Destro  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:14:20pm

The internet was created with research and infrastructure from govt tax funds why should we the people who built it now hand it over to lazy private entities were were too lazy, cowardly or visionless to build the internet before the govt did?

114 erik_t  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:16:49pm

re: #112 Killgore Trout

I haven't played in a long time. I know they were working on developing playable bots but I don't know how far they got with it. The last TF2 bot I saw on a practice server would just run around aimlessly.

That was me...

115 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:17:19pm
116 Mattand  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:21:36pm

re: #110 Kragar

Here is a steam question for you:

My kids have started playing TF2 and I wanted to set up a server where they could practice against each other and some bots at the same time. If I set up a server for them, can I have bots join their teams?

There's some German servers, saigans.de IIRC, that are lousy with bots but are public.

I'm guessing you want to keep your server private for the kids' protection. They might be okay with a public game. I have noticed that TF2 seems to be relatively free of nasty voice spam, although the chats in the lower left can get unpleasant.

117 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:21:54pm

re: #115 Killgore Trout

TF2 bots

So if I set up a server for 10 man teams, will it auto populate to fill in the teams, or is there something else I need to do?

118 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:26:06pm

re: #117 Kragar

So if I set up a server for 10 man teams, will it auto populate to fill in the teams, or is there something else I need to do?

I don't know. There's a list of server commands at the bottom of the article, it looks like you have to add them manually.

119 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:27:15pm

re: #117 Kragar

So if I set up a server for 10 man teams, will it auto populate to fill in the teams, or is there something else I need to do?

Ah, there seems to be a quota command that will fill the server with a given number of bots.

120 Kragar  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:29:12pm

re: #119 Killgore Trout

Ah, there seems to be a quota command that will fill the server with a given number of bots.

Going to have to check it out when I get home again. I didn't see any options like that while I was messing around last night, but I was only hosting a game for a LAN off my PC, not running a fully dedicated server.

121 Varek Raith  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:30:42pm
122 Varek Raith  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:33:41pm

re: #121 Varek Raith

Oracle cannot block the resale of its software in Europe

"Oracle, which makes a vast proportion of its revenues from maintenance agreements as well, had tried to argue that it does not sell software as such, only licences. However, the court effectively backed up Bot's opinion that this was an "artificial distinction".

About time.

123 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:34:12pm

Hubby said it was 106 degrees in the car with the air running full blast. Electricity bill is going to be sky high this month.

There is still a significant portion of Chicagoland without power.

124 Lidane  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:35:02pm

re: #113 Destro

The internet was created with research and infrastructure from govt tax funds why should we the people who built it now hand it over to lazy private entities were were too lazy, cowardly or visionless to build the internet before the govt did?

Because of reasons, that's why. =P

It's just more Paulian idiocy that has no concept of the real world.

125 allegro  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:40:33pm

re: #90 Expand Your Ground

Work is its own reward. It keeps you from the idleness which will lead to sinning. Now shut up and get back to work and stop thinking about sinning.

... or paying rent or feeding your family or...

126 Lidane  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 12:46:18pm

re: #90 Expand Your Ground

Work is its own reward. It keeps you from the idleness which will lead to sinning. Now shut up and get back to work and stop thinking about sinning.

I'd love to get back to work. Unfortunately, the job market here in Austin seems to be over-saturated. Dozens of applications these past weeks and not a damned thing.

I've expanded my search exponentially. I'm applying pretty much anywhere that will pay for my relocation. God, something has to give soon.

127 deadletterboy  Thu, Jul 5, 2012 1:42:00pm

Why, oh why did I make the mistake of posting a criticism there? I can't think of a group who takes criticism worse than Ron Paul fans.


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