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199 comments

1 SpaceJesus  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:12:31pm
2 Kragar  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:14:46pm

Well, no game this weekend, but got an air defense tower, an anti tank emplacement, some trenchline and barbed wire built.

3 Four More Tears  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:15:29pm

re: #1 SpaceJesus

I understand Japan the way men understand women.

4 SpaceJesus  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:18:34pm

re: #3 Mocking Jay

it's not all that japanese, really. authentic german/bavarian variety shows from the 80s/90s are exactly like this.

this japanese guy just did the best bavarian impersonation ever

5 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:19:33pm

re: #1 SpaceJesus

O_O

[Embedded content]

What, you've never seen a man yodel to chickens before?

6 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:22:54pm

re: #4 SpaceJesus

it's not all that japanese, really. authentic german/bavarian variety shows from the 80s/90s are exactly like this.

this japanese guy just did the best bavarian impersonation ever

So...is this for a Japanese or Bavarian audience? Or is there a whole subculture of chicken-yodelin' men?

7 freetoken  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:23:00pm

re: #1 SpaceJesus

Nothing quite like Japanese yodeling.

8 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:23:35pm

Goodnight, all.

9 SpaceJesus  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:26:21pm

re: #6 SanFranciscoZionist

i just read the german wikipedia page for him. apparently this guy is 100% legit. fell in love with yodeling while he was a kid in tokyo, his dad wanted him to take over his mechanic's practice, but he took off to the alps as soon as he had the money. married there, has kids, the whole shebang.

10 darthstar  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:27:22pm

Hi all...

Good night all...

11 Kragar  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:27:41pm

re: #7 freetoken

Nothing quite like Japanese yodeling.

You haven't lived till you've gotten drunk in an Okinawan Karaoke bar and sang back up for a 250lb Japanese man singing Eric Clapton songs.

His "Wonderful Tonight" made the angels cry.

12 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:27:59pm

re: #9 SpaceJesus

i just read the german wikipedia page for him. apparently this guy is 100% legit. fell in love with yodeling while he was a kid in tokyo, his dad wanted him to take over his mechanic's practice, but he took off to the alps as soon as he had the money. married there, has kids, the whole shebang.

Hey...sometimes you gotta find what you like.

Sometimes that takes you pretty far afield, too.

13 SpaceJesus  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:32:50pm

re: #12 SanFranciscoZionist

if you gotta yodel to some chickens, you gotta yodel to some chickens

14 ReamWorks SKG  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:33:29pm

There's goes the theory that the latest CO shooting was cause by 'Not enough G-d"

Reuters is reporting that Holmes was a regular church goer!

He attended church with his family in their quiet, upper-middle-class San Diego neighborhood, listening to his sister play bass in the worship band. He breezed through high school and college, taking a strong interest in science and graduating with honors from the University of California, Riverside.

15 Kragar  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:39:34pm

re: #14 ReamWorks SKG

There's goes the theory that the latest CO shooting was cause by 'Not enough G-d"

Reuters is reporting that Holmes was a regular church goer!

But he studied science!
///

16 Four More Tears  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:41:36pm

re: #9 SpaceJesus

i just read the german wikipedia page for him. apparently this guy is 100% legit. fell in love with yodeling while he was a kid in tokyo, his dad wanted him to take over his mechanic's practice, but he took off to the alps as soon as he had the money. married there, has kids, the whole shebang.

I invoke Poe's Law to explain any confusion on my part.

17 freetoken  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:47:33pm

Sigh... still messing with Chrome.

My username doesn't display properly on the LGF front page, in the upper left control box. Whenever I change the Chrome settings on "font size" in the advanced settings page my LGF user name comes up with a different subset of "freetoken" 9 characters, sometimes with a number.

WWW standards and software ain't what they used to be.

18 Four More Tears  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:47:51pm

The guy shooting at them in the first place was part of this "Christian country."

19 SpaceJesus  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:48:24pm

re: #16 Mocking Jay

the chickens seem convinced

20 Kragar  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:51:37pm

re: #18 Mocking Jay

[Embedded content]

The guy shooting at them in the first place was part of this "Christian country."

Funny this coming from the same man who said saving people lives feminized the Medal of Honor.

21 Four More Tears  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:56:52pm

re: #20 Kragar

Funny this coming from the same man who said saving people lives feminized the Medal of Honor.

I need a flow chart to keep this man's judgments straight.

22 TedStriker  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:57:36pm

re: #18 Mocking Jay

[Embedded content]

The guy shooting at them in the first place was part of this "Christian country."

Funny...what Fischer is extolling as "Christian" virtue (three of the Aurora dead supposedly taking bullets trying to protect their girlfriends), he castigates as "feminizing" when talking about a Medal of Honor recipient that earned it trying to save others in his squad under enemy fire in Afghanistan (Salvatore Giunta).

Fuck him.

23 TedStriker  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:57:48pm

re: #20 Kragar

Funny this coming from the same man who said saving people lives feminized the Medal of Honor.

GMTA...I dare you to reply back to Fischer with that. ;-P

24 Kragar  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:59:30pm

re: #22 TedStriker

Funny...what Fischer is extolling as "Christian" virtue (three of the Aurora dead supposedly taking bullets trying to protect their girlfriends), he castigates as "feminizing" when talking about a Medal of Honor recipient that earned it trying to save others in his squad under enemy fire in Afghanistan (Salvatore Giunta).

Fuck him.

Fischer's evidence of a "Christian nation" makes no mention in any way of the victim's religious beliefs.

25 Four More Tears  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:05:14pm

AUTHORITIES: 11 DEAD AFTER TRUCK CRASHES IN TEXAS

GOLIAD, Texas (AP) — At least 11 people died Sunday and another 12 were injured after their pickup truck left the highway and crashed into trees in a rural South Texas community, authorities said.

State troopers and Goliad County sheriff's investigators were investigating what prompted the crash and have not released names of the victims. The Ford F-250 pickup was heading north on U.S. 59 when it struck two large trees Sunday evening in the unincorporated community of Berclair, about 100 miles southeast of San Antonio, said Gerald Bryant, a spokesman for the Texas Department of Public Safety.

How... I can't fathom how 23 people get in a pickup.

26 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:05:28pm

re: #18 Mocking Jay

[Embedded content]

The guy shooting at them in the first place was part of this "Christian country."

One boy got shot protecting the girlfriend of another man, who had not only fled the theater, but driven off without waiting to find out if his girlfriend and their children were OK.

I'm not sure which of them gets to be the inhabitant of a Christian nation here, but I vote for the guy with the bullet hole in him, if he wants the title.

I take it from this that we've decided to forgive the unspeakable wimps for not taking Holmes on with their bare hands and their Big Gulp cups?

//Fischer, you don't get to claim these men as yours, any more than you get to claim the MoH recipients you trashed.

27 freetoken  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:06:28pm

Curse these computers.

28 Four More Tears  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:07:13pm

re: #27 freetoken

Curse these computers.

Careful. They can hear you now.

29 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:07:57pm

re: #21 Mocking Jay

I need a flow chart to keep this man's judgments straight.

Bears, gays, and anything non-Christian is bad.

Saving people is good.

Killing people is MUCH better.

Michelle Bachmann is good, but can't be president because it would feminize the office (you'll note that the feminizing of things is a constant concern), unless the Lord said she should be president, in which case all bets are off.

30 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:08:46pm

re: #25 Mocking Jay

AUTHORITIES: 11 DEAD AFTER TRUCK CRASHES IN TEXAS

How... I can't fathom how 23 people get in a pickup.

If the people are skinny, and everyone is willing to scrunch, it can happen.

31 Four More Tears  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:09:12pm

re: #29 SanFranciscoZionist

Bears, gays, and anything non-Christian is bad.

Saving people is good.

Killing people is MUCH better.

Michelle Bachmann is good, but can't be president because it would feminize the office (you'll note that the feminizing of things is a constant concern), unless the Lord said she should be president, in which case all bets are off.

She said He did, so it's all good? Or does he have to tell Fischer? Is there a god-phone that he calls?

32 Chrysicat  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:09:13pm

re: #25 Mocking Jay

The majority in the bed rather than the cab?

That said, I've never seen a case that looked more coyote-ish in my life...

33 TedStriker  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:11:24pm

re: #25 Mocking Jay

AUTHORITIES: 11 DEAD AFTER TRUCK CRASHES IN TEXAS

How... I can't fathom how 23 people get in a pickup.

I'm guessing the truck had as many people as the cab and bed (which, by my guess, may have had a bed topper on it) could hold; I'm also guessing that this may have been a coyote running a load of human cargo from Mexico, but maybe I should invoke the 48-Hour Rule on that one.

A tragedy, nonetheless.

34 TedStriker  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:12:51pm

re: #32 Chrysicat

The majority in the bed rather than the cab?

That said, I've never seen a case that looked more coyote-ish in my life...

Damnit, beat to the chase again!

///

35 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:13:27pm

re: #31 Mocking Jay

She said He did, so it's all good? Or does he have to tell Fischer? Is there a god-phone that he calls?

Hard to tell. I only know that back when her campaign was still going, he wrote a column talking about how it would coarsen women, and damage the masculinity of the office if a lady were to be President.

I think Bachmann's campaign called and had a word, because a couple of days later there was ANOTHER column, all about how, Biblically speaking, women are sometimes called to leadership, and if the Lord calls a woman to leadership, we have to respect that.

Since Michele is not actually the prophetess Deborah, nothing much came of it, but I was intrigued by someone's apparent ability to make Fischer back down in certain circumstances.

36 Four More Tears  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:13:29pm

re: #34 TedStriker

Damnit, beat to the chase again!

///

Heh. You're having one of those nights.

37 freetoken  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:13:51pm

Well... loading LGF with the latest Firefox... loads the fonts ok... and then LGF crashes all of Firefox.

Curse these computers.

38 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:14:18pm

re: #33 TedStriker

I'm guessing the truck had as many people as the cab and bed (which, by my guess, may have had a bed topper on it) could hold; I'm also guessing that this may have been a coyote running a load of human cargo from Mexico, but maybe I should invoke the 48-Hour Rule on that one.

A tragedy, nonetheless.

Yeah. That's probably a coyote.

I wish they didn't call them that. Real coyotes are shy creatures who only kill stuff they want to eat.

39 freetoken  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:24:31pm
40 TedStriker  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:28:14pm

re: #38 SanFranciscoZionist

Yeah. That's probably a coyote.

I wish they didn't call them that. Real coyotes are shy creatures who only kill stuff they want to eat.

"Coyotes" tend to be really shitty human beings; as long as they get their money, they don't really care about what ultimately happens to their "cargo".

One of the most haunting things I've ever seen on those Most Shocking shows on truTV is a Texas cop chasing a coyote down near the border who was driving a pickup much like what was involved in tonight's crash in South Texas. The coyote led the cop on a high-speed chase to the Rio Grande and, right before the truck careens down a steep bank into the river, the coyote bails on foot, leaving his load of seven people (IIRC) who are trapped in the truck to drown. The cop is able to save the passengers, but the fucking POS coyote swam across the river and taunted them.

That incident makes me think that this crash tonight was a coyote run gone wrong, especially being so close to the border.

41 freetoken  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:32:43pm

fwiw, Safari 5.0.6 displays LGF correctly. Too bad Safari eats so much memory, though.

42 tajsagay01  Sun, Jul 22, 2012 11:58:19pm

holla

43 freetoken  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 12:06:49am

Looks like Rick Warren was misinterpreted about his now infamous tweet from 2 days ago:

Rick Warren Responds

In a comment on my blog post about his recent tweet, Rev. Rick Warren has taken the time to leave a comment, clarifying his meaning. Here is what he wrote:

TWITTER'S limit on words allows no context for statements. A lack of contxt causes misinterpretation. So when you tweet what’s on your mind, people preassume (incorrectly) that you are talking about what’s on THEIR mind. This is a clear example. My tweet was a brief response to a question to me about SEXUAL PROMISCUITY. It had NOTHING to do with the tragedy in Colorado.! I had received this email from a dad: “Pastor Rick, my daughter told me her teacher said in class “There's nothing wrong with sex with multiple partners! Sex is a natural, inate drive, and any attempt to limit it to one, single partner is a manmade construct.” THAT is what I was commenting on. Unfortunately, you also incorrectly presumed the context.

I really appreciate Rev. Warren taking the time to respond. I think, to be fair, the Aurora shooting was on the entire nation's mind, and not only mine, and so, if the coincidence was unfortunate, it is surely neither surprising nor blameworthy that the rest of our hearts, minds, and/or prayers were with the tragic occurrence, the victims, and their families. If anything, it is surprising that Rev. Warren chose to post an ambiguous and easily misinterpreted sentence at a time when he was surely aware of what was on everyone else's minds.

[...]

44 freetoken  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 12:07:32am

re: #42 tajsagay01

Most of LGF regulars are asleep at this hour.

45 tajsagay01  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 12:09:40am

re: #44 freetoken

not me! my day just began! :-D

46 tajsagay01  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 12:14:42am

re: #39 freetoken

nice tunes

47 freetoken  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 12:16:49am

A little George Benson for a quiet morning...

48 TedStriker  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 12:39:28am

re: #47 freetoken

A little George Benson for a quiet morning...

[Embedded content]

Oh that's good...what the name of the song?

49 freetoken  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 12:43:35am

re: #48 TedStriker

Oh that's good...what the name of the song?

Theme from Summer of `42

50 researchok  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 1:06:28am

Morning, all

51 researchok  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 1:12:23am

re: #47 freetoken

Good stuff- and a great movie to boot.

52 freetoken  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 1:19:29am

"Entry of the Gods into Valhalla":

53 researchok  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 1:30:28am

re: #52 freetoken

Wagner on a Monday morning.

OK, I'm ready for the battle now.

TY

54 freetoken  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 2:21:48am
55 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 4:20:13am

re: #25 Mocking Jay

AUTHORITIES: 11 DEAD AFTER TRUCK CRASHES IN TEXAS

How... I can't fathom how 23 people get in a pickup.

4 in front, 3 in back, 10 in the truckbed, 2 in the glove compartment.
//too early?

56 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 4:20:32am

re: #52 freetoken

"Entry of the Gods into Valhalla":

[Embedded content]

I love me some Wagner.

57 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 4:22:44am

Detroit Tigers in 1st place W00h00!

58 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 4:50:29am

re: #43 freetoken

Looks like Rick Warren was misinterpreted about his now infamous tweet from 2 days ago:

Rick Warren Responds

I really appreciate Rev. Warren taking the time to respond. I think, to be fair, the Aurora shooting was on the entire nation's mind, and not only mine, and so, if the coincidence was unfortunate, it is surely neither surprising nor blameworthy that the rest of our hearts, minds, and/or prayers were with the tragic occurrence, the victims, and their families. If anything, it is surprising that Rev. Warren chose to post an ambiguous and easily misinterpreted sentence at a time when he was surely aware of what was on everyone else's minds.

[...]

"Sorry I removed your brain tumor with my 28 oz Estwing framing hammer. It's my favorite tool, and it was handy. Somehow this is your fault."

'Morning, all.

59 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 5:59:37am

Good morning Lizards.

Went from a quiet apartment (well, except when the cat was wailing), to a street of traffic and a crew jackhammering pavement up, to work on an almost uninhabited floor. A study in aural contrasts today.

That truck accident in Texas caught my eye simply from the association of a pick-up with that high of a death/injury toll. Given that it has caught attention here I'm sure it will be followed up on in the comments.

And I see there are a few more religious big mouths who should just keep their yaps shut. They make their God appear petty, cruel, and trivial. And the fact that there is so little kickback towards this from the middle of the road religious tends to make me more suspicious of religion in general.

Back to work. And coffee. Must have more coffee.

60 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:04:42am

All the beautiful people:
[Link: www.nypost.com...]
Lindsay Lohan continues her train wreck.

61 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:06:04am

Manson Lamps Michelle cites a report claiming Grover Norquist helped the Muslim Brotherhood infiltrate the US government.

As evidence of their claims, the five Republicans cited “The Muslim Brotherhood in America: The Enemy Within,” a ten-part video course produced by the Center for Security Policy.

The movies claim that the “Muslim Brotherhood was helped in its efforts to achieve information dominance over the George W. Bush administration” by Norquist, a Christian. The influential anti-tax activist is also accused of using “various organizations to promote Islamist agendas.”

Now it all makes sense. The reason the GOP all signed pledges to Norquist is because they're all secretly members of the Muslim Brotherhood, declaring fealty to chief infiltrator Mullah Grover Norquist.

62 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:09:02am

re: #60 Tommy's cone of shame

Oh, and if there are any gleeks here (like me, so sad) I think Lea Michelle got a nose job.

63 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:13:04am

re: #61 Temporarily Embarrassed Millionaire

Manson Lamps Michelle cites a report claiming Grover Norquist helped the Muslim Brotherhood infiltrate the US government.


Now it all makes sense. The reason the GOP all signed pledges to Norquist is because they're all secretly members of the Muslim Brotherhood, declaring fealty to chief infiltrator Mullah Grover Norquist.

Are the various right-wing conspiracies officially in a cycle yet where they are eating their own tail and the secret controlling groups now form a full circle -- hmm, does that make it some sort of pseudo-democracy since *everyone* is in control?

Almost makes me want to break out an old copy of Steve Jackson's "Illuminati" and play it. (This is a not-so-serious game where you build a network of controlled organizations and attempt to conquer the Earth via some goal; e.g. The Gnomes of Zurich seek a threshold of financial holdings.)

64 sagehen  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:15:08am

Wow.

When the NCAA said the penalty they'd be announcing would be "unprecedented"... they weren't kidding.

Good for them.

65 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:20:00am

re: #64 sagehen

Only a 60 million dollar fine...

66 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:20:36am

re: #64 sagehen

Wow.

When the NCAA said the penalty they'd be announcing would be "unprecedented"... they weren't kidding.

Good for them.

67 sagehen  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:22:01am

re: #64 sagehen

$60 million fine.
4 year full ban from post-season play
less scholarships
erasing every Penn State victory 1998-2011 from the record books
Any current student athlete can transfer immediately to wherever they want, and retain eligibility.
Anybody currently on scholarship keeps their scholarship, even if they don't play anymore.

68 sagehen  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:24:59am

re: #43 freetoken

Looks like Rick Warren was misinterpreted about his now infamous tweet from 2 days ago:

Rick Warren Responds

One of the following is true:

Rick Warren lied about getting such an e-mail from a parent
or
the daughter lied to her father about what the teacher said.

69 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:29:53am

re: #23 TedStriker

Heh

70 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:30:43am

re: #43 freetoken

Looks like Rick Warren was misinterpreted about his now infamous tweet from 2 days ago:

Rick Warren Responds

I really appreciate Rev. Warren taking the time to respond. I think, to be fair, the Aurora shooting was on the entire nation's mind, and not only mine, and so, if the coincidence was unfortunate, it is surely neither surprising nor blameworthy that the rest of our hearts, minds, and/or prayers were with the tragic occurrence, the victims, and their families. If anything, it is surprising that Rev. Warren chose to post an ambiguous and easily misinterpreted sentence at a time when he was surely aware of what was on everyone else's minds.

[...]

"Sorry I removed your brain tumor with my 28 oz Estwing framing hammer. It's my favorite tool, and it was handy. Somehow this is your fault."

'Morning, all.re: #68 sagehen

One of the following is true:

Rick Warren lied about getting such an e-mail from a parent
or
the daughter lied to her father about what the teacher said.

Sounds like a standard-issue rwnj moral-panic e-chainletter.

71 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:31:39am

re: #68 sagehen

One of the following is true:

A) Rick Warren lied about getting such an e-mail from a parent
or
B) the daughter lied to her father about what the teacher said.

I'll take A) for $10,000 please Bob.

BOOM Mitt Romney'd.

72 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:36:37am

N.C.A.A. Fines Penn State $60 Million for Sandusky Case.

Sorry, but they deserved to have the football program canned altogether. The school's officials actively engaged in a coverup of sexual abuse and it was institutionalized by those in the athletic department and from top school officials. $60 million is a huge sum, but one that isn't going to miss a beat with a school's endowment the size of Penn State ($1.8 billion systemwide). Losing scholarships, bowl appearances, etc., will hurt, but it's not going to rectify the way that the school completely abrogated its responsibilities to the community.

People need to learn that there are serious consequences for condoning sexual abuse. A fine isn't going to cut it in my book.

Oh, and I still see that the Paterno family questions the Freeh report's conclusions about Joe P. Sorry, but I have no sympathy for them or Paterno's legacy. He knew, or had reason to know of the abuse, and did nothing - and worse, let Sandusky continue to play a role in the sports program and work with kids.

73 dragonath  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:40:29am

Generation X Is Lukewarm On Global Warming

Americans in this age group generally are not well-informed about climate change, nor are they highly concerned about or paying much attention to it, both surveys indicated.

The survey data comes from the university's Longitudinal Study of American Youth, which includes responses from approximately 4,000 Gen Xers, born between 1961 and 1981.

Political affiliation also mattered. Zero conservative Republicans were alarmed, while only 10 percent were concerned. Meanwhile, only 5 percent of liberal Democrats were dismissive or doubtful.

Reagan's legacy.

74 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:42:32am

re: #72 lawhawk

I agree with you. I do think that they could have played football again eventually, but I think that the PSU administration should have self-imposed a two-year suspension of the football program, and then re-evaluated the situation after that.

That being said, what irks me the most about the whole situation is not the specifics or the magnitude of the ban, but the fact that PSU waited for some other external authority to punish them. It would have been much better all round if they had come up with their own sanctions to demonstrate that they took the situation seriously. As it is, I'm afraid that letting the NCAA determine the outcome will continue to give cover to those fans who continue to see themselves as the victims in the story.

75 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:46:36am

re: #74 iossarian

I agree with you. I do think that they could have played football again eventually, but I think that the PSU administration should have self-imposed a two-year suspension of the football program, and then re-evaluated the situation after that.

That being said, what irks me the most about the whole situation is not the specifics or the magnitude of the ban, but the fact that PSU waited for some other external authority to punish them. It would have been much better all round if they had come up with their own sanctions to demonstrate that they took the situation seriously. As it is, I'm afraid that letting the NCAA determine the outcome will continue to give cover to those fans who continue to see themselves as the victims in the story.

Well, who was going to institute such a sanction? The rot went all the way to the top. And the new/interim president is probably looking at other things rather than killing the football program for a few years - and then dealing with further alumni backlash for doing that. Probably a closed door decision made to let the NCAA do that and take the heat.

76 darthstar  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:48:22am

re: #72 lawhawk

Joe Paterno was worhipped for 40 years. That's enough. Sure, he was a good coach but a coach also has to protect his team...obviously he cared more about a football program than the people it touched. I don't feel any sympathy for his survivors...in a couple of years, they'll re-elevate him to sainthood and cash in like this all never happened.

77 Interesting Times  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:49:47am

re: #73 Fred Galt

Generation X Is Lukewarm On Global Warming

Old fossils like the Kochs and their political puppets I can understand, since they won't live to see the worst effects. But there's a special level of FAIL for those people in my age group, who - if they keep their heads firmly up their posteriors in this fashion - will be spending their old age not in a comfortable retirement home, but a full-scale sci-fi dystopia. Food rations go to the young and fit first.

78 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:51:44am

re: #72 lawhawk

but they deserved to have the football program canned altogether. The school's officials actively engaged in a coverup of sexual abuse and it was institutionalized by those in the athletic department and from top school officials.

Can't agree. That would be hurting the students and athletes that are there now, as well as the higher ups that were not involved. Those that were have all been replaced and will face further issues

$60 million is a huge sum, but one that isn't going to miss a beat with a school's endowment the size of Penn State

The 60 mil is just the tip of the iceburg. The school will be paying out settlements of much more than that for years to come, not to mention the hit it takes on it's image (read,, money raising)

79 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:52:54am

It's morning.

again.

you?

80 darthstar  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:53:05am

Mornin' everyone...did my first 'open water' swim yesterday in Princeton Harbor at Half Moon Bay...FUCKING COLD WATER!...though I did get used to it after about five minutes. Swam for thirty minutes, probably did about a half mile. Did have a harbor seal come up and keep me company for about ten minutes...cute little fucker. Next weekend is the Tiburon triathlon...no longer freaked about the swim part.

81 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:54:00am

I see the stock market took a dump. I betchya we will still end positive today.

82 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:54:15am

re: #80 darthstar

Did have a harbor seal come up and keep me company for about ten minutes.

Just so you know, if the two of you get romantically involved, I think there are websites for that!!
/

83 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:54:51am

I think the moon of the football god is waning.

Between this major sex scandal and the mounting evidence of traumatic brain injury and it's long-term effects it's popularity is eroding.

84 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:55:24am

I begin to believe that NCAA Football should end. Let the NFL run it's own minor league, hell even run the Bowls, and tell colleges to concentrate on academics not athletics. This "punishment" is nothing but eyewash to keep the money flowing into AD offices around the nation. If they were serious about these problems, the Penn State program would have been ended. But there's too much TV & advertising revenue at stake for something as meaningless as peoples lives to matter to the bean counters.

85 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:55:51am

re: #83 ggt

I think the moon of the football god is waning.

Between this major sex scandal and the mounting evidence of traumatic brain injury and it's long-term effects it's popularity is eroding.

My street is named for the 'Bama team.

86 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:56:19am

re: #81 Tommy's cone of shame

I see the stock market took a dump. I betchya we will still end positive today.

Remember when there was speculation that Saddam shipped his cache of nasty stuff to Syria?
[Link: hosted.ap.org...]

Syria says will use chemical weapons if attacked

hmmmm

87 darthstar  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:56:32am

re: #79 ggt

It's morning.

again.

you?

Monday morning! I get to tell my team today that I gave notice on Friday and will be leaving the company. That'll be sad. But I am negotiating a positive departure ($$ - will explain if/when it happens). And the new job pays more.

88 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:57:12am

re: #60 Tommy's cone of shame

All the beautiful people:
[Link: www.nypost.com...]
Lindsay Lohan continues her train wreck.

Hello Lindsay and other wasted celebrities:

HIRE A CHAUFFER!

89 darthstar  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:57:39am

re: #82 sattv4u2

Did have a harbor seal come up and keep me company for about ten minutes.

Just so you know, if the two of you get romantically involved, I think there are websites for that!!
/

The auto mechanic told me I blew a seal. I said, "Just fix the damn thing and leave my personal life out of it."

90 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:57:45am

re: #83 ggt

I think the moon of the football god is waning.

Between this major sex scandal and the mounting evidence of traumatic brain injury and it's long-term effects it's popularity is eroding.

Funny thing is that going back to the old leather helmets would probably solve the brain injury issue. They didn't happen then because you couldn't hit like you can with the plastic helmets on.

91 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:57:49am

re: #80 darthstar

Mornin' everyone...did my first 'open water' swim yesterday in Princeton Harbor at Half Moon Bay...FUCKING COLD WATER!...though I did get used to it after about five minutes. Swam for thirty minutes, probably did about a half mile. Did have a harbor seal come up and keep me company for about ten minutes...cute little fucker. Next weekend is the Tiburon triathlon...no longer freaked about the swim part.

Brace yourself for a bad Sat joke.

92 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:57:55am

re: #74 iossarian

Agreed; I'd also want to see that the players on the team get the opportunity to switch to other schools at no penalty to them (allowing them to keep whatever scholarships they have, tuition, etc.). They are affected by the decisions, but weren't involved in the situation. They came to an institution that didn't serve them or the community at large. The penalty shouldn't be on them individually.

Satt: The $60 million is the tip of the iceberg, but the school can absorb that and whatever settlements are eventually made to the kids who were abused.

I do disagree that it harms those administrators who are there now. They worked at an institution that failed the community. The institution has to recognize the failings - and the Freeh report indicates those institutionalized failings; policies and procedures were such that they too were part of the scandal. It's only after the prosecutors took up the case that the school began to take these issues seriously and conduct their own investigation into the matter.

93 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:58:07am

re: #86 sattv4u2

Remember when there was speculation that Saddam shipped his cache of nasty stuff to Syria?
[Link: hosted.ap.org...]

Syria says will use chemical weapons if attacked

hmmm

We had satellite pics of trucks leaving the building . . . .

94 darthstar  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:59:00am

re: #89 darthstar

The auto mechanic told me I blew a seal. I said, "Just fix the damn thing and leave my personal life out of it."

Here it is...Kip Adotta...love this fucking song.

95 Mattand  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 6:59:38am

re: #83 ggt

I think the moon of the football god is waning.

Between this major sex scandal and the mounting evidence of traumatic brain injury and it's long-term effects it's popularity is eroding.

I'm not sure about that. You're already starting to see people argue to "let bygones be bygones" in the PSU case ("Sure, some kids were raped, but what about the players?????).

As for brain injury in the pros, most people don't know or care. I'm in Eagles country, and people here literally will try to put fans of other teams in the hospital. The last thing on their minds is what happens to the players after they retire.

As long as they get their Sunday fix...

96 darthstar  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:00:04am

re: #93 ggt

We had satellite pics of trucks leaving the building . . .

OMGTHEYGOTTRUCKS!!!

97 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:00:06am

re: #89 darthstar

oh yeah, the last time I got drunk I blew chunks...

98 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:00:35am

re: #86 sattv4u2

They've been known to have their own indigenous stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons. They were also working on their own nuclear program before Israel took it out a few years back. It's a threat similar to that which Saddam countered in 1991 (first Gulf War).

In this case, the threat of using chemical weapons would target Turkey and Israel since both those countries are in range of Syrian artillery/missiles.

99 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:01:06am

re: #84 William Barnett-Lewis

nah, switching to rugby, now thats a sport!

100 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:01:15am

re: #98 lawhawk

They've been known to have their own indigenous stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons. They were also working on their own nuclear program before Israel took it out a few years back. It's a threat similar to that which Saddam countered in 1991 (first Gulf War).

In this case, the threat of using chemical weapons would target Turkey and Israel since both those countries are in range of Syrian artillery/missiles.

But why do they hate us?

101 darthstar  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:01:16am

Shit, seven. Time to go run the dogs. Catch you all later.

102 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:01:50am

re: #91 Varek Raith

Brace yourself for a bat Sat joke.

too late
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

and a darth/ self deprecating one also

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

103 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:03:20am

re: #28 Mocking Jay

Careful. They can hear you now.

So count at them. It freaks them out because it shows you don't really need 'em.

104 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:04:10am

re: #98 lawhawk

They've been known to have their own indigenous stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons. They were also working on their own nuclear program before Israel took it out a few years back. It's a threat similar to that which Saddam countered in 1991 (first Gulf War).

In this case, the threat of using chemical weapons would target Turkey and Israel since both those countries are in range of Syrian artillery/missiles.

Not saying Syria didn't/ doesn't have their own

Saying that they may have more!

105 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:06:33am

re: #103 Romantic Heretic

So count at them. It freaks them out because it shows you don't really need 'em.

And to really screw with them, throw in a random "2" every now and then

106 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:07:36am

re: #63 Feline Emperor of the Conservative WasteAlmost makes me want to break out an old copy of Steve Jackson's "Illuminati" and play it. (This is a not-so-serious game where you build a network of controlled organizations and attempt to conquer the Earth via some goal; e.g. The Gnomes of Zurich seek a threshold of financial holdings.)

I liked playing The UFOs because nobody knew what you were up to.

107 Eventual Carrion  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:10:15am

re: #86 sattv4u2

Remember when there was speculation that Saddam shipped his cache of nasty stuff to Syria?
[Link: hosted.ap.org...]

Syria says will use chemical weapons if attacked

hmmm

Those same chemical weapons that had lost their potency/effectiveness over 10 years ago? The ones sold to Saddam by Rummy and St. Ronney in the 80's? Weapons with a shelf life of about 6 - 10 years?

Edit: Syria has had the ability to make their own stuff for a while now. No sense in bringing up an unproven fallacy to try and justify the clusterfornication that was Iraq.

108 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:14:07am

re: #107 RayFerd

Those same chemical weapons that had lost their potency/effectiveness over 10 years ago? The ones sold to Saddam by Rummy and St. Ronney in the 80's? Weapons with a shelf life of about 6 - 10 years?

Sarin, yes

Mustard Gases, not so much

109 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:15:29am

BTW - the $60 million is going to found a fund to compensate victims; the $60 million isn't in addition to whatever settlements come against the school or its officials.

Let that sink in a moment. Penn State's fine is equal to one year's revenues from the football program.

The schools wins are vacated from 1998 to 2011.

And all of this is because these school officials thought that protecting the football program and the university's reputation was more important than protecting innocent kids.

Now, the program is hit with the stigma of condoning the abuse. And it still is insufficient.

110 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:15:59am

Oh,, goody

Shots fired from Egypt at Israeli troops, none hurt

[Link: www.reuters.com...]

Gunshots fired across the border from Egypt on Sunday hit an Israeli army bus but caused no casualties, a military spokeswoman said.

111 Eventual Carrion  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:16:28am

re: #108 sattv4u2

Sarin, yes

Mustard Gases, not so much

Prob missed the edit I just made to the post about Syria's own ability to create these weapons on their own. I am not disputing that they could/would use chemical weapons, just that they were from Iraq.

112 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:17:36am
113 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:17:41am

re: #111 RayFerd

Prob missed the edit I just made to the post about Syria's own ability to create these weapons on their own. I am not disputing that they could/would use chemical weapons, just that they were from Iraq.

see 104

114 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:20:58am

re: #92 lawhawk

I started to write a further response to this and then it became a page.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

115 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:22:04am
116 Interesting Times  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:22:27am
117 dragonath  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:25:07am

Cool, I haven't heard about the Iraq/Syria weapons connection since I heard a republican activist hung up on it back in 2004.

Oh, yeah, this:

Iraq rejects Arab calls for Assad to go-government spox

118 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:35:54am

I've decided there is no such thing as "too much coffee."

119 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:37:34am

Here's another thing that ticks me off about the PSU punishment. People keep crapping on about how you "can't punish the current players" by suspending the program because "that wouldn't be fair".

In that case, how is a $60M fine fair? That money is simply going to come out of PSU's already-shaky general fund. So you're basically cutting back on academic and other support services for all the students because Paterno, the AD and the President fucked up.

How's that for fair? Meanwhile the games keep getting played and the TV guys continue to pull in the big bucks.

120 Decatur Deb  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:38:47am

...

121 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:40:09am

re: #119 iossarian

how is a $60M fine fair? That money is simply going to come out of PSU's already-shaky general fund.

umm,,no

As LawHawk pointed out in #72
$60 million is a huge sum, but one that isn't going to miss a beat with a school's endowment the size of Penn State ($1.8 billion systemwide)

122 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:41:14am

BBL

123 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:41:35am

re: #121 sattv4u2

how is a $60M fine fair? That money is simply going to come out of PSU's already-shaky general fund.

umm,,no

As LawHawk pointed out in #72
$60 million is a huge sum, but one that isn't going to miss a beat with a school's endowment the size of Penn State ($1.8 billion systemwide)

I work in higher education, and a big part of my work is revenue/expenditure monitoring.

Believe me, I know whereof I speak. You don't just take $60M out of the endowment to pay the fine. If you want I can go into the details, but essentially the $60M will come out of ongoing expenditures.

124 garhighway  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 7:53:44am

re: #123 iossarian

This conversation reminds me of seeing sentencing hearings where the criminal pleads for leniancy because his absence (while in jail) will hurt his family.

He's right that his family becomes one more set of victims of his bad behavior, but so what? He should have thought of that sooner.

Ditto for Penn state. When your football program becomes such a center of your institutional existance that covering up for pedophiles seems like a good idea, then you need to have your reality recalibrated.

125 dragonath  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:01:22am

Amazingly, Penn State just had their 2nd best year for donations ever. At least with this fine (which is to be paid into an endowment), some of it will go to good causes.

126 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:01:57am

re: #124 garhighway

This conversation reminds me of seeing sentencing hearings where the criminal pleads for leniancy because his absence (while in jail) will hurt his family.

He's right that his family becomes one more set of victims of his bad behavior, but so what? He should have thought of that sooner.

Ditto for Penn state. When your football program becomes such a center of your institutional existance that covering up for pedophiles seems like a good idea, then you need to have your reality recalibrated.

Oh, sure, Penn State needs to make amends as an institution.

I was just pointing out that virtually any such punishment will be meted out on current students who had no responsibility for the actions of the administrators in question, which undermines the whole "you can't suspend the program because that unfairly punishes the current players" argument.

127 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:03:20am

More insight into the decision by the NCAA:

Without any further delay, here are the penalties. The Big Ten is also set to announce additional sanctions against Penn State later this morning

1) A $60 million fine, the funds of which go to external programs for child abuse. According to the NCAA, that amount “cannot come at the expense of non-revenue sports or student-athlete scholarships.”

2) A four-year postseason ban.

3) All wins from 1998-2011 will be vacated (111 wins). Joe Paterno is no longer major college football’s winningest.

4) A reduction of 10 initial and 20 total scholarships each year for a four-year period. This will drop the limit of offered scholarships per year to 15 and cap the total number of scholarships to 65.

5) Five years probation with a monitor.

6) The NCAA can investigate the program further after criminal proceedings.

Additionally, Penn State athletes may be allowed to transfer wherever they like without penalty. NCAA is considering waiving scholarship limit for schools that accept PSU transfers as well, so the Association is really bending over backward for the athletes here.

I really agree with the last part, and yet the decision doesn't go hard enough against the university.

128 allegro  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:08:56am

re: #127 lawhawk

More insight into the decision by the NCAA:

I really agree with the last part, and yet the decision doesn't go hard enough against the university.

What do you feel would be more appropriate/adequate?

129 Interesting Times  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:12:29am

Meanwhile, in the #backhandedCompliments department:

130 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:13:17am

re: #128 allegro

The football program should have been disbanded. The university institutionalized the failings that allowed Sandusky to commit his abuse and didn't do enough to protect innocents.

The scandal will eventually fade and the program will eventually return in full form.

Heck, a point shaving scandal at a bunch of NYC area colleges had longer lasting results -

While Kentucky was forced to cancel one season of play (1952-53), it was the only program that was not permanently hobbled by the scandal. To date, Bradley is the only other affected school to have appeared in a final major media poll. However, none of the programs would suffer more than CCNY and LIU. Following the discovery of several other irregularities, CCNY deemphasized its athletic program and dropped down to what is now Division III. LIU shut down its entire athletic program from 1951 to 1957, and didn't return to Division I until the 1980s.

Penn State should have at least done the same as LIU, or the NCAA should have imposed a similar fate. And that was for point shaving (gambling) - not sexual abuse of minors by a school official with a coverup by other school officials.

131 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:14:23am

re: #128 allegro

What do you feel would be more appropriate/adequate?

Can't speak for Lawhawk but since this went on from 98 to 2011, banning Penn State from fielding a football team for 13 years would have been a good start to me.

132 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:16:15am

The pro-Chavez diary I pointed out at Dkos made the Rec list: Anti-Capitalist Meet-Up: Mitt And His Fellow Vulture Capitalists See Venezuela As a Threat: It Is.

Tip Jar (129+ / 0-)

133 garhighway  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:21:07am

re: #126 iossarian

Cuurent scholarship athletes can leave without penalty or stay. So if they are a non-student/pro-in-waiting, they'll leave. If they are real students, they can stay and keep their scholarship. That's VERY fair.

For students who are just fans? If the harm to them is that there's no football for a while, that harm is SO mild compared to what's being addressed here that I don't think it's worth the expenditure of any pixels to moan over it.

134 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:23:59am

re: #132 Killgore Trout

Wow, they all know better than me, just ask them.

135 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:24:07am

Morning Lizards.

136 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:27:14am

re: #130 lawhawk

The football program should have been disbanded. The university institutionalized the failings that allowed Sandusky to commit his abuse and didn't do enough to protect innocents.

The scandal will eventually fade and the program will eventually return in full form.

Heck, a point shaving scandal at a bunch of NYC area colleges had longer lasting results -

Penn State should have at least done the same as LIU, or the NCAA should have imposed a similar fate. And that was for point shaving (gambling) - not sexual abuse of minors by a school official with a coverup by other school officials.

I agree. Frankly, continuing "business as usual" has no impact. At the very least the football program should be suspended for 5-10 years. The only way to force change is to shock the system and remove the revenue source.

I think continuing the program shows that the system values money and tradition over children.

It's shameful.

137 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:37:35am

re: #133 garhighway

For students who are just fans? If the harm to them is that there's no football for a while, that harm is SO mild compared to what's being addressed here that I don't think it's worth the expenditure of any pixels to moan over it.

My point was that the $60M fine is going to hurt current students via cutbacks. In the current state university fiscal environment you just can't hide that kind of cut - it will have an impact somewhere.

138 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:38:47am

re: #136 ggt

I agree. Frankly, continuing "business as usual" has no impact. At the very least the football program should be suspended for 5-10 years. The only way to force change is to shock the system and remove the revenue source.

I think continuing the program shows that the system values money and tradition over children.

It's shameful.

If you were really cynical, you would observe that suspending the football program for a couple of years would deprive the TV networks of 24 relatively high-audience events.

139 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:39:38am

re: #138 iossarian

If you were really cynical, you would observe that suspending the football program for a couple of years would deprive the TV networks of 24 relatively high-audience events.

I guess that is a factor when children's safety and health is involved.

/gah

140 GunstarGreen  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:41:45am

re: #136 ggt

I think continuing the program shows that the system values money and tradition over children.

It's shameful.

This has always been the case. When a university is faced with fiscal shortfalls, what do they cut? Administrative compensation? Nope. Sports? Nope. Actual educational components? You bet your ass.

American university is not about learning, it's about paying your club dues for a slip of paper that gets you into the non-shitty part of the workforce. And as those club dues have become more accessible to the general public, that slip of paper has become less and less valuable as a pass into the non-shitty part of the workforce while other, more exclusive means have begun to supplant it.

141 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:43:18am

I have felafel chips.
Yum.

142 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:44:20am

re: #141 Varek Raith

I have felafel chips.
Yum.

If they last more than 48 hours, consult a physician

143 garhighway  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:44:31am

re: #137 iossarian

If the level of service they have now has been artificially subsidized by a corrupt football program, then having it revert to what it would have been in the absence of that program smells like justice to me.

144 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:44:37am

re: #140 GunstarGreen

This has always been the case. When a university is faced with fiscal shortfalls, what do they cut? Administrative compensation? Nope. Sports? Nope. Actual educational components? You bet your ass.

American university is not about learning, it's about paying your club dues for a slip of paper that gets you into the non-shitty part of the workforce. And as those club dues have become more accessible to the general public, that slip of paper has become less and less valuable as a pass into the non-shitty part of the workforce while other, more exclusive means have begun to supplant it.

I agree, the only slips of paper that show you have learned anything are the 2 year or less certificates for "lower-level" jobs like xray-tech, CNA or child-care worker. They show you know the basics and the laws that govern your job.

These days they are often a better choice, because you get a job and often have no or little loans when you are finished.

145 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:45:19am

re: #141 Varek Raith

I have felafel chips.
Yum.

falafel is good!

146 Achilles Tang  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:45:23am

re: #141 Varek Raith

I have felafel chips.
Yum.

Chips?

147 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:45:39am

Dogs had me up late and up early.

I'm going to take my mid-morning nap.

148 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:46:05am

re: #140 GunstarGreen

This has always been the case. When a university is faced with fiscal shortfalls, what do they cut? Administrative compensation? Nope. Sports? Nope. Actual educational components? You bet your ass.

American university is not about learning, it's about paying your club dues for a slip of paper that gets you into the non-shitty part of the workforce. And as those club dues have become more accessible to the general public, that slip of paper has become less and less valuable as a pass into the non-shitty part of the workforce while other, more exclusive means have begun to supplant it.

As a higher ed person I feel obliged to point out that colleges do also impart some book-learnin', which both enriches the soul and boosts worker productivity.

But yes, your analysis does capture a significant portion of the role of higher education in the US. It's all part of the rigid American class system and the ongoing entrenchment of privilege.

149 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:46:08am

re: #146 Achilles Tang

Chips?

Chips.
Locally made.
Picked them up at the farmer's market.

150 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:49:05am

re: #149 Varek Raith

Chips.
Locally made.
Picked them up at the farmer's market.

Did they come with a Farmers Daughter?

151 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:49:16am

re: #143 garhighway

If the level of service they have now has been artificially subsidized by a corrupt football program, then having it revert to what it would have been in the absence of that program smells like justice to me.

Yes, except that, again, the current students had no knowledge of the situation, so essentially (by this logic) they were misled into attending an institution that would have looked less competitive had the full situation been known.

My sole point on this, once again, is that the argument that suspending the football program "punishes the current players" is invalid, since any punishment, more or less, punishes current students.

I am not arguing that PSU should not be punished (actually I did argue that they should have self-punished before it got to this stage, but that isn't an argument against punishment).

152 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:51:00am

re: #150 sattv4u2

Did they come with a Farmers Daughter?

Fraid not.

153 garhighway  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:51:03am

re: #151 iossarian

Yeah, and the thieve's kids didn't know Dad was a thief. He still goes to jail.

154 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:51:11am

re: #140 GunstarGreen

This has always been the case. When a university is faced with fiscal shortfalls, what do they cut? Administrative compensation? Nope. Sports? Nope. Actual educational components? You bet your ass.

American university is not about learning, it's about paying your club dues for a slip of paper that gets you into the non-shitty part of the workforce. And as those club dues have become more accessible to the general public, that slip of paper has become less and less valuable as a pass into the non-shitty part of the workforce while other, more exclusive means have begun to supplant it.

Parents can't afford to support you while you work at an unpaid internship? Sux 2 b u.

155 dragonath  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:51:15am

The current Republican administration of Pennsylvania cut the state education funing by something like 20 percent. I'd be surprised if the governor of Pennsylvania even approached the Penn State issue with a ten foot pole, considering his former involvement.

156 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:54:42am

re: #153 garhighway

Yeah, and the thieve's kids didn't know Dad was a thief. He still goes to jail.

I AGREE.

I'm sorry if I haven't made this clear. I agree that PSU should be punished. In fact I think they should have self-punished themselves.

My ONLY point is that any such punishment pretty much automatically is visited on students who had nothing to do with the actual offenses. And my ONLY reason for bringing it up is that some people opposed suspending the football program on the basis that it would "punish current players".

The current solution that the NCAA has devised essentially makes PSU pay out, without damaging the lucrative TV contracts that the Big 10 has negotiated (though we will see what the Big 10 punishment, apparently arriving soon, will be). The hit that PSU takes will be mostly visited on non-revenue sports and the general student/academic body, because that is how the budget system works.

157 Achilles Tang  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:55:00am

re: #132 Killgore Trout

The pro-Chavez diary I pointed out at Dkos made the Rec list: Anti-Capitalist Meet-Up: Mitt And His Fellow Vulture Capitalists See Venezuela As a Threat: It Is.

Tip Jar (129+ / 0-)

That was interesting stuff about where Bain investors were from, but I take exception to the description of Venezuela as a socialist paradise and the 5th happiest people on the planet.

For a start, there have been about 160,000 murders (known) there since 1999, an that rate is many times what it was before Chavez. The place is a hellhole of gangs, drug dealers, corrupt politicians and stupid populist leadership.

158 Achilles Tang  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:56:14am

re: #149 Varek Raith

Chips.
Locally made.
Picked them up at the farmer's market.

I meant that I don't know of falafel as chips. They are like medium sized meatballs.

159 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:58:10am

re: #158 Achilles Tang

I meant that I don't know of falafel as chips. They are like medium sized meatballs.

I make 'burgers' out of them.

160 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:58:32am

re: #145 ggt

falafel is good!

I'm making home-made falafel for dinner tonight!

161 garhighway  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:58:57am

re: #156 iossarian

There is always collateral damage.

Could the remedy have been more tightly focused? Sure. But this feels ballpark right. If they missed, they missed on the side of lenience.

162 Varek Raith  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:59:04am

re: #160 Learned Mother of Zion

I'm making home-made falafel for dinner tonight!

I'll be right over.

163 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 8:59:58am

re: #162 Varek Raith

Swing by and get me too please.

164 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:00:57am

re: #157 Achilles Tang

That was interesting stuff about where Bain investors were from, but I take exception to the description of Venezuela as a socialist paradise and the 5th happiest people on the planet.

For a start, there have been about 160,000 murders (known) there since 1999, an that rate is many times what it was before Chavez. The place is a hellhole of gangs, drug dealers, corrupt politicians and stupid populist leadership.

I didn't check out the Bain allegations but I'd take those with a big grain of salt given the source. My big question about Chavez is will he ever willingly give up power. He's certainly a strong man authoritarian but I'm not sure how far he's going to take it.

165 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:02:25am

re: #161 garhighway

There is always collateral damage.

Could the remedy have been more tightly focused? Sure. But this feels ballpark right. If they missed, they missed on the side of lenience.

Yes, again I agree with this. I had been advocating for a two-year suspension of the program, which would have cost about twice as much (the $60M fine was based on one year of gross football revenue apparently).

Fining without the suspension allows the games to be played. The cynic in me suspects that this is to do with TV contracts. The non-cynic recognizes that this way, there will be some money redirected (via the fine) into support programs.

166 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:04:03am

Shooter is in court with his public defender, I heard he has "lawyered" up. Not true? [Link: www.nypost.com...]

167 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:04:08am

re: #164 Killgore Trout

I didn't check out the Bain allegations but I'd take those with a big grain of salt given the source.

The source is Salon:

[Link: www.salon.com...]

A significant portion of the seed money that created Mitt Romney’s private equity firm, Bain Capital, was provided by wealthy oligarchs from El Salvador, including members of a family with a relative who allegedly financed rightist groups that used death squads during the country’s bloody civil war in the 1980s

168 garhighway  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:04:22am

re: #165 iossarian

At the risk of reading the NCAA's mind, I suspect that preserving the revenue stream mattered to them.

169 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:04:45am

Just thought I'd check to see what Chavez is up to these days...
Chavez says he won't stop taking over airwaves

President Hugo Chavez said Sunday that he will not stop seizing control of Venezuela's airwaves to give his trademark marathon television and radio addresses despite complaints from his challenger that it gives him an unfair advantage during the country's presidential election campaign.
....
"The major part of the radios, television channels and newspapers are in the hands of the bourgeoisie," said Chavez, who is seeking re-election to a fresh six-year term.

170 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:05:03am

re: #168 garhighway

At the risk of reading the NCAA's mind, I suspect that preserving the revenue stream mattered to them.

I think it probably is a bit of both. This is how the sausage gets made.

Sorry for shouting above. I think we were talking at cross-purposes.

171 garhighway  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:05:23am

re: #170 iossarian

Agree.

172 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:08:17am

Big 10 tacks on bowl revenue share penalty to PSU sanctions, for additional $13M hit:

[Link: www.sbnation.com...]

173 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:11:39am

re: #172 iossarian

Big 10 tacks on bowl revenue share penalty to PSU sanctions, for additional $13M hit:

[Link: www.sbnation.com...]

The big hits are still to come. Victim compensations, be they private or court ordered, future fund raising drops, long term losses of revenues because with the scholarship limitations the football program won't be anywhere near good for a long long time, meaning they won't attract the top recruits/ coaches. This is only the beginning. This is going to impact the school for a long time

174 iossarian  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:14:53am

re: #173 sattv4u2

They are screwed, no doubt about it.

175 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:15:37am

re: #174 iossarian

They are SELF screwed, no doubt about it.

ftfy

176 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:29:55am

re: #86 sattv4u2

Remember when there was speculation that Saddam shipped his cache of nasty stuff to Syria?
[Link: hosted.ap.org...]

Syria says will use chemical weapons if attacked

hmmm

They've had their own chemical weapons program for some years, with support from Iran. Dunno if they got, or need, anyone else's stuff.

177 freetoken  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:30:57am

re: #77 Interesting Times

AGW is too slow for people to really do anything about it. And young people have lived too little to take any notice of changes.

178 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:31:16am

re: #176 SanFranciscoZionist

They've had their own chemical weapons program for some years, with support from Iran. Dunno if they got, or need, anyone else's stuff.

re: #176 SanFranciscoZionist

They've had their own chemical weapons program for some years, with support from Iran. Dunno if they got, or need, anyone else's stuff.

i'm sure to a despot like Assad, it's never "enough"

179 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:31:31am

re: #110 sattv4u2

Oh,, goody

Shots fired from Egypt at Israeli troops, none hurt

[Link: www.reuters.com...]

Gunshots fired across the border from Egypt on Sunday hit an Israeli army bus but caused no casualties, a military spokeswoman said.

The Sinai is getting pretty messy these days.

180 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:31:43am

damn thumbs

181 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:35:40am

re: #178 sattv4u2

re: #176 SanFranciscoZionist

i'm sure to a despot like Assad, it's never "enough"

Probably, but how would Assad have acquired it? As an Iranian client state, he wasn't exactly at the top of Saddam's 'you can have it if I fall' list. How was it moved out of country? And do we have any evidence that what we're talking about actually existed?

182 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:38:02am

re: #180 sattv4u2

damn thumbs

I say things started going wrong when we came down out of the trees.

183 Winny Spencer  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:39:00am

Howdy,

I thought Mittens gave a dignified and deeply heartfelt post-Aurora speech

184 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:39:11am

re: #181 SanFranciscoZionist

Probably, but how would Assad have acquired it? As an Iranian client state, he wasn't exactly at the top of Saddam's 'you can have it if I fall' list. How was it moved out of country? An for a number ofrd do we have any evidence that what we're talking about actually existed?

Probably a moot point regardless, that Assad (or his minions) have access to any of it AND they are at a desperate point (from all reports) I wonder what his endgame is

185 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:39:42am

re: #182 SanFranciscoZionist

I say things started going wrong when we came down out of the trees.

Who is "we"!?!?

186 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:40:32am

re: #183 Winny Spencer

Howdy,

I thought Mittens gave a dignified and deeply heartfelt post-Aurora speech

As did the President

kudos to both

187 Achilles Tang  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:42:09am

re: #164 Killgore Trout

I didn't check out the Bain allegations but I'd take those with a big grain of salt given the source. My big question about Chavez is will he ever willingly give up power. He's certainly a strong man authoritarian but I'm not sure how far he's going to take it.

That's not much of a question. The answer is no, but he will die.

188 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:50:07am

This is kind of cool for those of us who wonder why the Larouche nuts (and Alex Jones) have such a weird obsession with the British.
The (Secret) City of London Part 1: History

189 sattv4u2  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:53:57am

re: #188 Killgore Trout

This is kind of cool for those of us who wonder why the Larouche nuts (and Alex Jones) have such a weird obsession with the British.
The (Secret) City of London Part 1: History

[Embedded content]

Are there werewolves..,, and is their hair perfect?

190 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:55:18am

re: #184 sattv4u2

Probably a moot point regardless, that Assad (or his minions) have access to any of it AND they are at a desperate point (from all reports) I wonder what his endgame is

He's stated that he won't employ chems unless invaded from outside. That, I speculate, could last until he decides that the rebels are in the pay of some outside nation. This is both a warning to everyone else to keep the hell out, no matter how insane things get, and a reminder to everyone inside that he's got this stuff and will use it.

Everyone's dressed a lot less pretty, and there are no dragons or wights, but the phrase 'when you play the game of thrones, you win or you die' comes to mind. Assad has very few options left. And he is from the family that inspired Tom Friedman's phrase 'Hama rules'.

I doubt that he will use this stuff outside his own borders, since he knows that if he does, it will be game over very fast. However, I have absolutely no doubt that if he thinks it will get him anything, even a measure of revenge, he will throw everything he's got at the opposition and civilians, if he's still got control of it, and gets the chance.

This is really, really not good, but nothing about this mess has been good from the beginning.

This is not even getting into who may inherit/may have already inherited the stuff.

191 freetoken  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:56:51am

Looks like someone noticed:

Is Romney buying Twitter followers?

Before this past weekend, Romney had been picking up followers at a steady, if modest, clip — a rate of 5,000 or 6,000 a day. Then, on Friday, something changed, and suddenly he was adding 1,000 to 4,000 fans an hour. He picked up 23,926 on Friday, 93,054 on Saturday, and 24,285 on Sunday, according to the website 140Elect, which first reported the spike. 140Elect's graph illustrating the explosion, says Charles Johnson at Little Green Footballs, "looks like a hockey stick."

192 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 9:59:36am

Fishing this past friday night for the barracuda:

193 lawhawk  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 10:00:22am

re: #190 SanFranciscoZionist

The threats are explicit warnings to Israel and Turkey not to interfere. It's also a threat that if Syria believes foreign powers are involved in the uprising/civil war/insurrection, that those two countries could be targeted.

194 Achilles Tang  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 10:01:38am

Nasa Video

This is a science video from the 70's. To me the tone and language used is strikingly different from today and the 70's don't seem all that distant to me, but I can't really figure out how to describe what is different.

Note there is 25 second ad in the beginning.

195 Flounder  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 10:01:51am

re: #188 Killgore Trout

That was really good. I misread Epping Forest to read Fapping Forest, which all towns have those.

196 Killgore Trout  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 10:06:56am

re: #195 Tommy's cone of shame

That was really good. I misread Epping Forest to read Fapping Forest, which all towns have those.

I thought it was really interesting too. I think I've seen part of the ritual of the Monarch asking permission to enter the City of London before but I forget where. Very strange ritual involving slamming the door in the Queen's face, making a weird speech then letting her enter. I wish I could remember where I saw that.

197 Interesting Times  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 10:20:43am

re: #177 freetoken

AGW is too slow for people to really do anything about it. And young people have lived too little to take any notice of changes.

The latest research indicates it's happening much faster than previously predicted, and people's wallets will get hit hard as a result of this season's crop failures. Give it another 10 years or so, and we'll see a drought so horrid the US will be forced to end corn exports. And more cities in the South/Southwest will run right out of water.

This is why I keep telling you you're wrong about the human race being unable to drive itself to extinction. Unless something dramatic changes, it will:

Ever so slowly is is a very relative term. Since the 50's phytoplankton is down in concentration by over 50% for example...here is your most plausible near term extinction scenario.

Coasts flood, displacing millions as breadbaskets simultaneously turn to dust bowls. Disease vectors spread to new populations killing people and surviving crops alike. Fresh water supplies dry up in regions that depend on melt water creating even more desperate, malnourished refugees...

People start killing each other over what is left.

Nukes get used.

The end.

198 freetoken  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 10:21:33am

re: #197 Interesting Times

AGW is too slow for anybody to really do anything about it.

199 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Mon, Jul 23, 2012 10:26:57am

re: #198 freetoken

AGW is too slow for anybody to really do anything about it.

How does this work? If it were much faster, then something could be done?

I could understand "AGW is too slow to motivate anybody to really do anything about it." The proverbial* frog could hop out of the pot at any time.

-------
*apparently frogs will hop out of warming water after all. They may have something on us there.


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