Ben Folds Five: Do It Anyway

There will be times you might leap before you look
Music • Views: 30,812

The reunion album from Ben Folds Five is as great as you knew it would be. You should buy it immediately so these guys are never tempted to break up again.

ws-na.amazon-adsystem.com

You might put your love and trust on the line
It’s risky, people love to tear that down
Let ‘em try
Do it anyway
Risk it anyway

And if you’re paralyzed by a voice in your head
It’s the standing still that should be scaring you instead
Go on and
Do it anyway
Do it anyway

There will be times you might leap before you look
There’ll be times you’ll like the cover and that’s precisely why you’ll love the book
Do it anyway
Do it anyway

Tell me what I said I’d never do
Tell me what I said I’d never say
Read me off a list of the things I used to not like but now I think are ok

Sometimes it’s not subjective: wrong and right
Deep down you know it’s downright wrong but you’re invincible tonight
So you
Do it anyway
It’s done
You did it

Despite your grand attempts the chips are set to fall
And all the stories you might weave cannot negotiate them all
Do it anyway
Be honest, anyway

So tell me what I said I’d never do
Tell me what I said I’d never say
Read me off a list of the things I used to not like but now I think are OK
Yeah yeah yeah yeah
Woah woah woah woah

It’s gonna be so very hard to say
And watch the trust and joy all drain from her innocent face
But you must
Do it anyway
It sucks but
Do it anyway

Call it surrender but you know that that’s a joke
And the punchline is you were never actually in control
But still, surrender anyway

Tell me what you said you’d never do
Tell me what you said you’d never say
Read me off that list of things ‘cause I used to not like you
But now I think you’re OK
Yeah yeah yeah yeah
Woah woah woah woah

Everybody knows that you just gotta do it anyway

Do it anyway
Do it anyway
Do it anyway
Do it anyway

Cause you don’t do nothing to avoid self punishment
You won’t do nothing
You won’t feel nothing
Gotta
Do it, do it, do it anyway
Ah
Do it anyway

Jump to bottom

587 comments
1 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:47:17pm

I haven't even watched this yet and I'm already in love.

Ben Folds + the Fraggles? Awesome.

2 Gus  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:47:24pm
3 Mattand  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:48:42pm

Ben Folds Five broke up?

4 freetoken  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:51:27pm

Neat bit of science, more from Lenski's lab:


Researchers track evolution through snapshots of 40,000 generations

[...]

In the new paper, the authors sequence the genomes of 29 different clones of bacteria, obtained from various points in the culture's history. One distinct genetic lineage appeared in the culture a bit before 10,000 generations but had apparently died off before 20,000 generations, never to be seen again (the authors called this UC, for "unsuccessful clade"). Three large groups of related strains still persist in the cultures, but only one of them has citrate-eating bacteria, which evolved sometime around 31,000 generations in.


The first citrate-eating bacteria appear to have left a lot of descendants, since that group has diversified rapidly (although it hasn't completely killed off its competition). In fact, one branch of the citrate eaters has picked up a mutation that wipes out a gene involved in DNA repair, which causes an increased rate of mutation and an even faster diversification.

The genomes also let the researchers figure out exactly how citrate eating evolved. The E. coli used in the experiment actually have a gene that brings citrate inside the cell, but it's normally shut down when oxygen is present. In the first citrate eaters, a bad duplication of this gene made an extra copy, but put it under the control of regulatory DNA for a neighboring gene. This worked, in that the new control sequence expressed the gene even when oxygen was around, but it didn't work well. The resulting bacteria only had a one percent advantage in reproductive success relative to their peers.

Things accelerated afterwards, as further duplications put more and more copies of the newly generated gene into the genomes. By the time there were three copies of this gene present, the bacteria had a large competitive advantage. Presumably, somewhere in Michigan, their descendants are fine-tuning that ability even as you read this.

[...]

5 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:53:13pm

I worked my ass off today. Off tomorrow but have 3 interviews.:) (all crappy jobs, though)

6 Charles Johnson  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:54:47pm

re: #3 Mattand

Ben Folds Five broke up?

Nah, that was just some kind of bad dream.

7 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:55:01pm

re: #5 Cannadian Club Akbar

I worked my ass off today. Off tomorrow but have 3 interviews.:) (all crappy jobs, though)

I hear you. Keep at it, though.

8 Kragar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:55:19pm

Team Romney: We Do Support Two-State Solution

Yeah, I'm sure Mitt has a whole lot of credibility in the ME right now.

9 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:56:11pm

re: #8 Kragar

Team Romney: We Do Support Two-State Solution

Yeah, I'm sure Mitt has a whole lot of credibility in the ME right now.

Yeah they say now that their pants were done earlier.

10 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:57:45pm

re: #8 Kragar

Team Romney: We Do Support Two-State Solution

Yeah, I'm sure Mitt has a whole lot of credibility in the ME right now.

Fixed.

He's pretty much destroyed his campaign these last few days.

11 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 8:58:42pm

They sure do love their former governor.

12 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:00:06pm

re: #4 freetoken

Presumably, somewhere in Michigan, their descendants are fine-tuning that ability even as you read this.

erp. hells yes I am.

13 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:01:52pm

re: #11 JamesWI

[Embedded content]

They sure do love their former governor.

They're probably wondering why they elected the guy in the first place.

14 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:02:16pm

re: #10 Lidane

Fixed.

He's pretty much destroyed his campaign these last few days.

Hate to say this, but the election is still a while away. Most people have the attention span of a ferret on a double espresso.

15 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:02:52pm

re: #11 JamesWI

[Embedded content]

They sure do love their former governor.

re: #11 JamesWI

[Embedded content]

They sure do love their former governor.

It might have something to do with the way he used the state as a punchline when he went out on the campaign trail in 2008.

16 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:03:44pm

re: #14 Cannadian Club Akbar

Hate to say this, but the election is still a while away. Most people have the attention span of a ferret on a double espresso.

Especially the filthy garbage picking 47% who live in cardboard boxes in back alleys.

17 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:04:02pm

re: #15 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne


It might have something to do with the way he used the state as a punchline when he went out on the campaign trail in 2008.

Yeah that was one of my first exposures to him. I thought that was really lame. I mean I know Massachusetts liberal jokes are like fish in a barrel to Republican voters but for god sake couldn't Mitt have pointed out that Massachusetts is the home of John Adams and John Quincy Adams or even Calvin Coolidge?

18 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:04:42pm

Is this the same story that was on here a few weeks or so ago, or is this a different case of employers forcing their workers to attend Mitt Romney events?

19 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:04:48pm

re: #17 HappyWarrior

Yeah that was one of my first exposures to him. I thought that was really lame. I mean I know Massachusetts liberal jokes are like fish in a barrel to Republican voters but for god sake couldn't Mitt have pointed out that Massachusetts is the home of John Adams and John Quincy Adams or even Calvin Coolidge?

Assuming that Mitt knew any of those things.

20 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:05:25pm

re: #5 Cannadian Club Akbar

I worked my ass off today. Off tomorrow but have 3 interviews.:) (all crappy jobs, though)

Good luck dude! I'm still looking, but got a call from a recruiter I worked with in the past who I like a lot (and that's saying a lot!)

21 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:06:25pm

re: #18 JamesWI

Looking at the article, looks like it was the one that was on here before. I recognize this ridiculous quote: "“Attendance was mandatory but no one was forced to attend the event.”

22 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:06:37pm

re: #18 JamesWI

The story was a "corrected version". I didn't bother to look for the original. Sorry.

23 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:06:43pm

re: #19 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

Assuming that Mitt knew any of those things.

Ha, true enough. But really it just came across and maybe some Massachusetts residents can help me out here but it just came across that he just used Massachusetts to launch his political career and after that, fuck you Massachusetts.

24 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:06:45pm

re: #4 freetoken

Neat bit of science, more from Lenski's lab:

Researchers track evolution through snapshots of 40,000 generations

Yeah, but they're still bacteria. Wake me when they grow legs and stuff.

///

25 Kragar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:06:58pm

Fox News’s ‘Civil Rights Activist’ Calls Top Clinton Aide A ‘Muslim Brotherhood Operative’

Fox Host Megyn Kelly referred to Horowitz as a “civil rights activist” and asked what he thought of the police questioning of the man behind the anti-Islam film that caused recent protests in the Middle East. “This is one of the most disgraceful moments in the history of the American presidency,” Horowitz said (the filmmaker, Nakoula Basseley Nakoula, answered police questions voluntarily). Horowitz then brought up Abedin:

HOROWITZ: An American ambassador has been raped and tortured and murdered and the White House is focusing on or the Justice Department is focusing on a filmmaker. And you have to ask yourself, isn’t it not the fact that the chief adviser on Muslim affairs for Hillary Clinton, our Secretary of State is a Muslim Brotherhood operative and the Obama administration has turned over Egypt to the Muslim Brotherhood which is a Nazi organization –

At this point, Kelly interrupted Horowitz, not to say he was wrong about Abedin but only to say “there are questions” as to whether she is a Muslim Brotherhood plant.

26 bratwurst  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:07:02pm
27 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:07:08pm

re: #21 JamesWI

Looking at the article, looks like it was the one that was on here before. I recognize this ridiculous quote: "“Attendance was mandatory but no one was forced to attend the event.”

Yes, I remember that. Mandatory but no one was forced to come. What a crock.

28 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:07:29pm

re: #24 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

Yeah, but they're still bacteria. Wake me when they grow legs and stuff.

///

Don't look in my refrigerator then. (there's stuff in there old enough to vote)

29 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:08:24pm

re: #23 HappyWarrior

Ha, true enough. But really it just came across and maybe some Massachusetts residents can help me out here but it just came across that he just used Massachusetts to launch his political career and after that, fuck you Massachusetts.

I think the real word is that Mitts much more interested in having the job than doing the job.

30 Gus  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:08:35pm
31 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:08:47pm

re: #20 Mr. Crankypants

Good luck dude! I'm still looking, but got a call from a recruiter I worked with in the past who I like a lot (and that's saying a lot!)

Where I am working now, the managers love me because I'm not an idiot. Which means I am ahead of the idiots. Not sure what that means.
/

32 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:09:07pm

re: #29 Mr. Crankypants

I think the real word is that Mitts much more interested in having the job than doing the job.

Yes, the prestige and being able to say "I was president" or in that case, "I was governor."

33 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:09:27pm

re: #30 Gus

[Embedded content]

Heh I saw that one on facebook.

34 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:09:40pm

re: #31 Cannadian Club Akbar

Where I am working now, the managers love me because I'm not an idiot. Which means I am ahead of the idiots. Not sure what that means.
/

So you looking for more money or more interesting work?

35 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:10:00pm

re: #25 Kragar

Fox News’s ‘Civil Rights Activist’ Calls Top Clinton Aide A ‘Muslim Brotherhood Operative’

"Come on arising when,
Dave's gone up around the bend!"

36 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:10:28pm

re: #14 Cannadian Club Akbar

Hate to say this, but the election is still a while away. Most people have the attention span of a ferret on a double espresso.

Oh, there are still seven weeks left in the race. It's far from over. But Mittens has hurt himself a lot these past few days, and it's going to be hard to recover. Add to that the fact that he's spending all his time fundraising and barely doing any public campaigning, it's going to be a long drag for the next few weeks. He has to hope for a major turnaround in the debates.

From what I've seen of Team Obama, they're not letting up at all. They're out there, soliciting donations, holding rallies, encouraging people to register and to GOTV, etc. I hope they keep that momentum going until Election Day.

37 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:12:17pm

re: #34 Mr. Crankypants

So you looking for more money or more interesting work?

Well, I am now working in retail but the interviews tomorrow are in the restaurant industry, which I have decided to despise. I'm actually waiting on news about financial aid from a local CC. I have credits and can move into the right direction if I get it. If not, then it's all about the money.

38 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:12:34pm
39 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:13:17pm

re: #36 Lidane

Oh, there are still seven weeks left in the race. It's far from over. But Mittens has hurt himself a lot these past few days, and it's going to be hard to recover. Add to that the fact that he's spending all his time fundraising and barely doing any public campaigning, it's going to be a long drag for the next few weeks. He has to hope for a major turnaround in the debates.

From what I've seen of Team Obama, they're not letting up at all. They're out there, soliciting donations, holding rallies, encouraging people to register and to GOTV, etc. I hope they keep that momentum going until Election Day.

I suspect that the debates will be a complete take down. Almost wish I could still drink to make the evening more enjoyable.

40 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:14:02pm

re: #18 JamesWI

Is this the same story that was on here a few weeks or so ago, or is this a different case of employers forcing their workers to attend Mitt Romney events?

[Embedded content]

This was the one where the judges found that under Citizens United it was not illegal for Unions or Companies to force their members to attend rallies. CU didn't say it was OK, it just didn't consider it. something like that.

41 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:14:13pm

re: #37 Cannadian Club Akbar

Well, I am now working in retail but the interviews tomorrow are in the restaurant industry, which I have decided to despise. I'm actually waiting on news about financial aid from a local CC. I have credits and can move into the right direction if I get it. If not, then it's all about the money.

What do you want to do? I keep trying to find a way to be creative for a living, but so far have had to stick with IT since that pays the bills nicely.

42 Kragar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:14:16pm

Florida Governor Blows Off Questions About His State’s Lackluster Job Creation

Amy Baker, the Florida Legislature’s chief economist, found that the two-point drop in the state’s unemployment rate is almost entirely attributable to people dropping out of the workforce while job creation has been sluggish. Only a week ago, Scott said that “every economic indicator we have is good,” but when Bloomberg reporter Michael Bender tried to question Scott about the report, the governor dismissed the scrutiny, according to the Miami Herald:

Reporter: “Are you saying those numbers from the state economist are wrong, Governor?”

Scott: “I’m saying we generated 130,000 jobs.”

Reporter: “But that’s not all of the—“

Scott: “Mike, I’ve answered all your questions on that.”

Reporter: “But, no, my question is about the unemployment rate drop—“

Scott: “Mike! I said I’ve answered all your questions.”

Scott ran for governor on the slogan “Let’s get to work,” promising to create 700,000 jobs in addition to normal job growth. Last year, he walked back that campaign pledge after killing thousands of jobs in the state. “I don’t know who said that,” Scott said when asked about the promise.

43 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:15:04pm

re: #42 Kragar

Florida Governor Blows Off Questions About His State’s Lackluster Job Creation

Yet another sorry reminder of the 2010 elections.

44 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:15:39pm

re: #38 Lidane

[Embedded content]

45 Kragar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:15:44pm

re: #38 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Hoi poloi refusing to return to their shanties.

46 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:16:12pm
47 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:17:06pm

re: #41 Mr. Crankypants

What do you want to do? I keep trying to find a way to be creative for a living, but so far have had to stick with IT since that pays the bills nicely.

Registered Dietician. Or own my own restaurant.

48 Kragar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:17:23pm

re: #46 Lidane

JOBS! JOBS! JOBS!

49 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:17:39pm

Speaking of terrible Governors:

50 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:18:07pm

Those New York liberals are going to take our gold!!!!

51 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:19:07pm

re: #49 JamesWI

Speaking of terrible Governors:

[Embedded content]

God as bad as Romney is, can you imagine if Perry was the nominee? I actually thought Perry could be Romney's biggest challenger but I didn't know he was such a big idiot.

52 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:19:19pm

re: #47 Cannadian Club Akbar

Registered Dietician. Or own my own restaurant.

Cool! I live in a very small town (< 6000) and I keep thinking we have a desperate need for a good burger joint. Only choice is McDonald's.

Would love to do really good hamburgers with handcut fries and hand dipped shakes.

Don't have the money or the courage though.

53 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:19:25pm

It would be hilarious if they did return it, and it wound up getting robbed because it wasn't as secure in Texas.

54 Kragar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:19:52pm

re: #49 JamesWI

Speaking of terrible Governors:

[Embedded content]

Someone toss a piece of toast at Perry and tell him someone saw Jesus on it. That will keep him busy for day.

55 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:19:58pm

re: #51 HappyWarrior

God as bad as Romney is, can you imagine if Perry was the nominee? I actually thought Perry could be Romney's biggest challenger but I didn't know he was such a big idiot.

If Perry was the nominee he'd be down by 30.

56 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:20:59pm

re: #54 Kragar

Someone toss a piece of toast at Perry and tell him someone saw Jesus on it. That will keep him busy for day.

There you go Akbar, you're first food service job! Throw toast at Rick Perry

57 Gus  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:21:20pm

Uh oh. Samson hates me.

58 Gus  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:21:44pm

You can down ding all night honey.

59 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:22:24pm

re: #52 Mr. Crankypants

Cool! I live in a very small town (< 6000) and I keep thinking we have a desperate need for a good burger joint. Only choice is McDonald's.

Would love to do really good hamburgers with handcut fries and hand dipped shakes.

Don't have the money or the courage though.

I have 5 different restaurant concepts. A diner with the best burgers and hand dipped shakes are there. As are old skool Cherry Cokes. And home made ice cream. Fried chicken. Biscuits. Etc....

60 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:22:28pm

I am watching Fox News for the first time in forever, just to see what it is these days, and I can't get over the rhetoric about how we are in a war on Islam repeated over and over in one show after another. alls I can say is wow. It's a redneck version of Al Jazeera.

61 SanFranciscoZionist  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:22:32pm

re: #51 HappyWarrior

God as bad as Romney is, can you imagine if Perry was the nominee? I actually thought Perry could be Romney's biggest challenger but I didn't know he was such a big idiot.

He seemed to come on very strong for a month or so. Then he just crumbled.

It's Mitt's to lose. It was always Mitt's to lose.

62 Gus  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:22:50pm

Freaking hilarious. Some people take this place way too seriously.

63 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:23:00pm

re: #58 Gus

You can down ding all night honey.

Where is this going on, Gus?

64 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:23:25pm

re: #56 Mr. Crankypants

There you go Akbar, you're first food service job! Throw toast at Rick Perry

Like the Rocky Horror Picture Show?:)

65 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:23:30pm

re: #61 SanFranciscoZionist

He seemed to come on very strong for a month or so. Then he just crumbled.

It's Mitt's to lose. It was always Mitt's to lose.

Yeah I know. Never thought Santorum would be the one that gave him the biggest run for his money though.

66 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:24:28pm

re: #61 SanFranciscoZionist

It's Mitt's to lose. It was always Mitt's to lose.

It's Mitt's to lose and Mitt is determined to make it happen.

67 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:24:40pm

re: #62 Gus

Freaking hilarious. Some people take this place way too seriously.

I logged my complaint the other day. These punk asses need to jump in the game. (BTW, I was downdinged by people I don't know)

68 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:25:28pm

re: #59 Cannadian Club Akbar

I have 5 different restaurant concepts. A diner with the best burgers and hand dipped shakes are there. As are old skool Cherry Cokes. And home made ice cream. Fried chicken. Biscuits. Etc....

Oh yeah. We need a diner like that. Lots of empty spaces downtown. We have one place where the old farts gather for coffee, but it's dark and not very nice. I'd want to do really good breakfasts with Biscuits and RedEye gravy, cinnamon rolls the size of hubcaps, etc.

69 Mattand  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:26:16pm

re: #65 HappyWarrior

Yeah I know. Never thought Santorum would be the one that gave him the biggest run for his money though.

Overheard two über conservatives talking yesterday about Obama's socialist leanings; one of these guys is a born again who thinks the Girl Scouts have a lesbian agenda.

I'm not surprised in the least at Santorum's showing.

70 Gus  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:26:16pm

re: #67 Cannadian Club Akbar

I logged my complaint the other day. These punk asses need to jump in the game. (BTW, I was downdinged by people I don't know)

Mother fuckers! Just gets my boil!

//

71 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:26:17pm

re: #68 Mr. Crankypants

Oh yeah. We need a diner like that. Lots of empty spaces downtown. We have one place where the old farts gather for coffee, but it's dark and not very nice. I'd want to do really good breakfasts with Biscuits and RedEye gravy, cinnamon rolls the size of hubcaps, etc.

Have you ever heard of Steak and Shake?

72 Gus  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:26:46pm

Oh crap. Down to two Red Stripes.

73 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:26:51pm

Media should go easy on Romney — for their own sake

At this rate, Romney will surely lose the election — and for journalism, this would be a tragedy.

At these times of declining revenue, we in the media need to stay true to our core interests. As the old saying goes, we should “vote the story.” And the better story in this election is clearly President Romney.

Romney’s hit parade — insulting the British, inviting Clint Eastwood to the Republican convention, flubbing Libya and now dismissing half the nation as parasites — may make good copy for the next seven weeks. But if we go easy on the man, we could have four years of gaffes instead of just seven more weeks. Admittedly, this may not be the best outcome for the country, or for the world. But in this race, there is no denying that one man will give us much better material.

74 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:27:01pm

re: #70 Gus

Mother fuckers! Just gets my boil!

//

I'm sorry you have a boil. Unless it's a shrimp boil. Those rule.

75 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:27:15pm

re: #65 HappyWarrior

Yeah I know. Never thought Santorum would be the one that gave him the biggest run for his money though.

Somehow the words Santorum and run are not ones that I want to see together. But the truth is that Santorum always ends up as number 2.

76 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:28:05pm

re: #71 Cannadian Club Akbar

Have you ever heard of Steak and Shake?

Yeah, but I don't want anything that greasy. I haven't been really impressed by Steak and Shake the few times I've been there.

77 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:28:28pm

re: #68 Mr. Crankypants

Oh yeah. We need a diner like that. Lots of empty spaces downtown. We have one place where the old farts gather for coffee, but it's dark and not very nice. I'd want to do really good breakfasts with Biscuits and RedEye gravy, cinnamon rolls the size of hubcaps, etc.

Too costly for just old timers, though. You need to be able to attract crowds, at least at times, if you want to succeed. And that means you're going to have to find a way to make breakfasts swiftly, because most people don't have time to wait on weekdays. Save the leisurely items for the weekends, when people can take the time to enjoy them.

78 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:28:35pm

re: #51 HappyWarrior

God as bad as Romney is, can you imagine if Perry was the nominee? I actually thought Perry could be Romney's biggest challenger but I didn't know he was such a big idiot.

Rick Perry makes Sarah Palin look like a goddamn genius. God, I hate having that man as my governor. He's every Aggie stereotype brought to life, but with better hair.

I'm seriously hoping that I'm right about the Dems playing the long game here in Texas. By having Julian Castro keynote the DNC, I'm hoping they're setting him up to run against Perry. I want Goodhair the hell out of the governor's mansion.

79 Mattand  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:28:38pm

re: #75 Mr. Crankypants

Somehow the words Santorum and run are not ones that I want to see together. But the truth is that Santorum always ends up as number 2.

Let me Google thatOH MY SWEET JESUS!!!

80 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:29:21pm

re: #69 Mattand

Overheard two über conservatives talking yesterday about Obama's socialist leanings; one of these guys is a born again who thinks the Girl Scouts have a lesbian agenda.

I'm not surprised in the least at Santorum's showing.

Well views wise, I'm not surprised. Hell look at what Mitt was reduced to pandering to get votes but I just thought Santorum was a terrible candidate.

81 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:29:36pm

re: #78 Lidane

Rick Perry makes Sarah Palin look like a goddamn genius. God, I hate having that man as my governor. He's every Aggie stereotype brought to life, but with better hair.

I'm seriously hoping that I'm right about the Dems playing the long game here in Texas. By having Julian Castro keynote the DNC, I'm hoping they're setting him up to run against Perry. I want Goodhair the hell out of the governor's mansion.

At least your Governor made it through college.......

82 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:30:12pm

re: #79 Mattand

Let me Google thatOH MY SWEET JESUS!!!

Please don't start that meme again. I threw up last night and don't to do so again tonight.

83 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:30:14pm

re: #78 Lidane

Rick Perry makes Sarah Palin look like a goddamn genius. God, I hate having that man as my governor. He's every Aggie stereotype brought to life, but with better hair.

I'm seriously hoping that I'm right about the Dems playing the long game here in Texas. By having Julian Castro keynote the DNC, I'm hoping they're setting him up to run against Perry. I want Goodhair the hell out of the governor's mansion.

I think they definitely see Castro as having a future. He was here in Northern Va the Saturday after the convention at my alma mater. I would have gone but the kid brother had a baseball game that afternoon.

84 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:30:16pm

re: #59 Cannadian Club Akbar

I have 5 different restaurant concepts. A diner with the best burgers and hand dipped shakes are there. As are old skool Cherry Cokes. And home made ice cream. Fried chicken. Biscuits. Etc....

I would like a place that served a big cup of Kraft Mac&Cheese to go with a spoon. Made from the box, not some crappy homemade Mac&Cheese recipe.

85 Mattand  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:30:19pm

re: #80 HappyWarrior

Well views wise, I'm not surprised. Hell look at what Mitt was reduced to pandering to get votes but I just thought Santorum was a terrible candidate.

Rocked the sweater vest like no one's business, though.

86 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:30:28pm

re: #74 Cannadian Club Akbar

I'm sorry you have a boil. Unless it's a shrimp boil. Those rule.

Had the most amazing seafood soup at our local mexican restaurant on Saturday. One thing that was interesting is that some of the shrimp were boiled whole with the head and some weren't. The ones boiled with the head on were incredibly sweet and flavorful. It was really surprising how good they were.

87 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:31:26pm

re: #77 Dark_Falcon

I was looking at a place back in FLA. One of my goals was to offer a good lunch to skool children at a lower cost than the skool could offer. Would have worked.

88 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:31:58pm

re: #86 Mr. Crankypants

The ones boiled with the head on were incredibly sweet and flavorful. It was really surprising how good they were.

With some fava beans?

89 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:33:05pm

re: #77 Dark_Falcon

Too costly for just old timers, though. You need to be able to attract crowds, at least at times, if you want to succeed. And that means you're going to have to find a way to make breakfasts swiftly, because most people don't have time to wait on weekdays. Save the leisurely items for the weekends, when people can take the time to enjoy them.

True, but this is my fantasy restaurant not anything I'll ever do.

90 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:33:40pm

re: #84 Mich-again

I would like a place that served a big cup of Kraft Mac&Cheese to go with a spoon. Made from the box, not some crappy homemade Mac&Cheese recipe.

I used to make lobster Mac-N-cheese. Cheese sauce was a butter cream with Gorgonzola, Swiss and Provolone. We would sell out of it in 2 hours. And yes, real lobster.

91 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:35:01pm

re: #84 Mich-again

I would like a place that served a big cup of Kraft Mac&Cheese to go with a spoon. Made from the box, not some crappy homemade Mac&Cheese recipe.

I think that could work. I'd like to be able to have raw veggies available as a side for anything. Carrots, celery, radishes, cauliflower and broccoli.

92 engineer cat  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:35:34pm

re: #59 Cannadian Club Akbar

I have 5 different restaurant concepts. A diner with the best burgers and hand dipped shakes are there. As are old skool Cherry Cokes. And home made ice cream. Fried chicken. Biscuits. Etc....

i don't seem to be able to make any progress with my great restaurant concept of a nationwide chain of beer 'n' pie joints

beer 'n' pie! it's a natural!!!

campaign and ice cream for the high end customers...

93 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:35:50pm

re: #90 Cannadian Club Akbar

I used to make lobster Mac-N-cheese. Cheese sauce was a butter cream with Gorgonzola, Swiss and Provolone. We would sell out of it in 2 hours. And yes, real lobster.

Sometimes I cut up leftover hot dogs and mix them in with the Mac & Cheese. Kind of the same thing.

94 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:36:00pm

re: #88 Mich-again

With some fava beans?

No that would have been liver, which I prefer with lots of carmelized onions.

95 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:36:17pm

re: #91 Mr. Crankypants

I think that could work. I'd like to be able to have raw veggies available as a side for anything. Carrots, celery, radishes, cauliflower and broccoli.

Problem is, the kids would want Ranch dressing with it. ranch is dot good. Check your label, peeps.

96 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:37:04pm

re: #95 Cannadian Club Akbar

Problem is, the kids would want Ranch dressing with it. ranch is dot good. Check your label, peeps.

I wouldn't have a problem with that. Peanut butter with celery is a winner no matter what.

97 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:37:05pm

re: #93 Mich-again

Sometimes I cut up leftover hot dogs and mix them in with the Mac & Cheese. Kind of the same thing.

Fried hot dogs and mac-n-cheese were a staple for me.

98 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:37:59pm

re: #92 engineer cat

Try beer with M&M's. Trust me.

99 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:38:10pm

re: #97 Cannadian Club Akbar

Fried hot dogs and mac-n-cheese were a staple for me.

Back when I was poor and single, mac and cheese, tuna, and a can of Veg-all was my version of tuna casserole.

100 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:38:24pm

re: #98 Cannadian Club Akbar

Try beer with M&M's. Trust me.

hmmmm.....

101 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:38:26pm

re: #94 Mr. Crankypants

No that would have been liver, which I prefer with lots of carmelized onions.

Liver and onions was in the rotation when I was a kid. Take the piece of liver, dip it in applesauce, cover it with mashed potatoes, quick bite and a sip of milk and try not to gag. yep. remember that..

102 Pawn of the Oppressor  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:38:44pm

Chris Hardwick tweeted about this song today and didn't even mention he was in the video... What the heck, Chris??? :)

103 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:39:48pm

re: #98 Cannadian Club Akbar

Try beer with M&M's. Trust me.

If they ever come out with sea salt Dark Chocolate M&Ms, I'm done for. Sea salt and dark chocolate are my favorite combo.

104 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:39:58pm

My typing tonight is really the suck.

105 Kragar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:40:01pm

re: #98 Cannadian Club Akbar

Try beer with M&M's. Trust me.

Hershey's Big Block and ice cold beer is a slice of heaven.

106 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:40:34pm

Oh by the way, The Luckiest is the best Ben Folds song ever. Played it for my wife and made her cry.

107 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:40:43pm

re: #96 Mr. Crankypants

I wouldn't have a problem with that. Peanut butter with celery is a winner no matter what.

Another one kids like is a fruit salad in a cup.

108 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:41:00pm

re: #103 Mr. Crankypants

If they ever come out with sea salt Dark Chocolate M&Ms, I'm done for. Sea salt and dark chocolate are my favorite combo.

After I eat I crave chocolate. Salt and chocolate are a really good back to back combo.

109 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:41:33pm

re: #101 Mich-again

Liver and onions was in the rotation when I was a kid. Take the piece of liver, dip it in applesauce, cover it with mashed potatoes, quick bite and a sip of milk and try not to gag. yep. remember that..

If it's cut very thin, dusted in flour, salt and pepper, it's very good. Definitely an acquired taste though.

110 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:42:24pm

re: #108 Cannadian Club Akbar

After I eat I crave chocolate. Salt and chocolate are a really good back to back combo.

Lindt makes a sea salt dark chocolate bar that is really good. I buy them at Walgreen's every time I stop.

111 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:42:25pm

re: #94 Mr. Crankypants

No that would have been liver, which I prefer with lots of carmelized onions.

I have never liked liver. My mom used to make it when I was a kid then quit when she realized I would eat everything but the liver on my plate.

Same goes for veal. I don't like it either. Haven't eaten veal in over 20 years and I see no reason to ever have it again.

112 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:42:31pm

re: #89 Mr. Crankypants

True, but this is my fantasy restaurant not anything I'll ever do.

I know, but its something that could work some of the time. It's just that lingering isn't something that can be done for weekday meals except dinner. So I was arguing for a place that produce good breakfasts quickly during the week but then produces superlative breakfasts more slowly when people don't have to work.

113 andres  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:43:03pm

Random OT:

Just in case anyone's interested, Amazon has American Gods (10th anniversary edition) by Neil Gaiman at a reduced price.

It's a very good novel, and extremely complex. One of the things I liked the most, and I have to always point out, is how well Gaiman, a British, captures small town America (and the USA in general).

114 Kragar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:43:10pm

re: #111 Lidane

I have never liked liver. My mom used to make it when I was a kid then quit when she realized I would eat everything but the liver on my plate.

Same goes for veal. I don't like it either. Haven't eaten veal in over 20 years and I see no reason to ever have it again.

I really can't eat organ meat of any kind.

115 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:43:38pm

re: #107 Mich-again

Another one kids like is a fruit salad in a cup.

Fruit salad in a waffle cone cup with a little whip cream or frozen yogurt.

116 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:43:55pm

re: #114 Kragar

I really can't eat organ meat of any kind.

Organ meat is very bad for you. And it taste like ass.

117 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:44:19pm

Nate Silver says:

The Democrats’ chances of controlling the Senate have increased to 79 percent in the forecast, up from 70 percent on Tuesday.

Had we run the model a month ago, based on polls through Aug. 19, the Democrats’ chances of maintaining Senate control would have been listed at just 39 percent.

118 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:45:02pm

re: #111 Lidane

Same goes for veal. I don't like it either. Haven't eaten veal in over 20 years and I see no reason to ever have it again.

Mom used to make a polish dish called city chicken. A drumstick sized shish kebob of veal, pork and beef, breaded, fried, then roasted.. mmm

119 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:45:23pm

re: #117 JamesWI

Nate Silver says:

Pretty amazing turnaround. Any chance they get back the House?

120 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:45:23pm

re: #96 Mr. Crankypants

Peanut butter with celery is a winner no matter what.

Ants on a log! Celery with peanut butter, topped with raisins. I ate the hell of that when I was in Girl Scouts.

121 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:45:38pm

re: #115 Mr. Crankypants

Fruit salad in a waffle cone cup with a little whip cream or frozen yogurt.

Layer this: Yogurt, Wheat Germ, Fruit, more yogurt, granola. Yummy. (add a spice you like as well)

122 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:46:07pm

re: #118 Mich-again

Mom used to make a polish dish called city chicken. A drumstick sized shish kebob of veal, pork and beef, breaded, fried, then roasted.. mmm

You mentioned Polish. Was at the grocery store tonight and to my delight, I saw that Mrs. T's now has sweet potato pierogis.

123 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:47:27pm

It seems the foods that gourmets like
are really unappealing
like fois de gras, steak tartare
or aspic that's congealing

I think I will approach my life
just like a gourmet cook
with hopes that things are tastier
the nastier they look

124 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:47:39pm

re: #119 HappyWarrior

Pretty amazing turnaround. Any chance they get back the House?

He doesn't have anything on the House (at least not yet, I don't think) I think most people think it's extremely doubtful that the Dems would have a chance there.

125 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:47:48pm

Sitting here listening to Sean Calamity Hannity on Fox is making me crack up.. He must sit there all day thinking up stupid shit to say.

126 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:47:51pm

re: #114 Kragar

I really can't eat organ meat of any kind.

Same. Every time I see organ meats like liver or beef tongue in the grocery store I'm immediately drawn to the produce section just as an instinct.

NO. Just...no. Some things are not meant to be eaten.

127 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:47:58pm

re: #116 Cannadian Club Akbar

Organ meat is very bad for you. And it taste like ass.

Tongue, however is amazing if done right.

128 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:48:19pm

re: #124 JamesWI

He doesn't have anything on the House (at least not yet, I don't think) I think most people think it's extremely doubtful that the Dems would have a chance there.

I would agree. I will be happy though if people like Bachmann, Joe Walsh, Steve King, and others are booted out of office though.

129 engineer cat  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:49:05pm

re: #116 Cannadian Club Akbar

Organ meat is very bad for you. And it taste like ass.

not if you pull out all the stops

130 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:49:13pm

re: #125 Mich-again

Sitting here listening to Sean Calamity Hannity on Fox is making me crack up.. He must sit there all day thinking up stupid shit to say.

I don't think he has to sit around all day to think up stuff that stupid, it comes naturally. You and I would have to sit around all day to think up stuff that stupid, it just happens for him.

131 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:49:40pm

re: #128 HappyWarrior

I would agree. I will be happy though if people like Bachmann, Joe Walsh, Steve King, and others are booted out of office though.

Steve King is my current congressman, and I'm ashamed.

132 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:49:59pm

How to eat properly: Avoid the isles and only shop the perimeters of the store. Meat, produce, veggies, fruits, dairy.

133 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:50:43pm

re: #127 Mr. Crankypants

Tongue, however is amazing if done right.

There's a restaurant in the Chicago suburbs called Bobek's which has a huge ass buffet. I had the most amazing tongue with horseradish sauce there.

134 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:50:55pm

Tim Pawlenty to be named head of major lobbying group for big banks, insurance companies, and other major players in the finance world.

There's a shocker.

135 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:51:06pm

re: #132 Cannadian Club Akbar

How to eat properly: Avoid the isles and only shop the perimeters of the store. Meat, produce, veggies, fruits, dairy.

Better yet, don't eat anything if you don't know what it's been.

136 Mich-again  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:51:35pm

re: #130 Mr. Crankypants

I don't think he has to sit around all day to think up stuff that stupid, it comes naturally. You and I would have to sit around all day to think up stuff that stupid, it just happens for him.

Sean and his guests are in violent agreement, all of them yelling at each other, each trying to out-outrage the one they are shouting down.

Crayfish in a bucket.

137 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:51:45pm

Pawlenty is probably thanking God right about now, that Romney didn't come calling....

138 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:52:42pm

re: #137 JamesWI

Pawlenty is probably thanking God right about now, that Romney didn't come calling....

I think the negative charisma would have caused some kind of rift in the space time continuum.

139 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:52:50pm

re: #135 Mr. Crankypants

Better yet, don't eat anything if you don't know what it's been.

Also, if you can't pronounce the ingredients on the list, or they sound like something that belongs in a lab, avoid that food.

140 MittDoesNotCompute  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:53:04pm

re: #134 JamesWI

Tim Pawlenty to be named head of major lobbying group for big banks, insurance companies, and other major players in the finance world.

There's a shocker.

Well, knock me over with a feather...

141 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:53:46pm
142 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:54:39pm

re: #137 JamesWI

Pawlenty is probably thanking God right about now, that Romney didn't come calling....

Who says he didn't?

I seriously doubt that Ryan was Romney's first choice.

143 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:55:33pm

Romney is starting to have a negative effect down ticket. If he loses the GOP both houses and the presidency, he needs to go into hiding.

The 47% comment just exposed the GOP as the un empathetic assholes that they've always been.

144 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:56:43pm

re: #142 goddamnedfrank

Who says he didn't?

I seriously doubt that Ryan was Romney's first choice.

That's what I thought at the time.

Seeing his incompetence in action the past few weeks, I now doubt that. Now it seems perfectly reasonable that Romney would somehow think Ryan was his best option.

145 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:56:53pm

Goodnight, all.

146 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:57:04pm

re: #139 Lidane

Also, if you can't pronounce the ingredients on the list, or they sound like something that belongs in a lab, avoid that food.

Bingo.

147 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:57:41pm

re: #142 goddamnedfrank

Who says he didn't?

I seriously doubt that Ryan was Romney's first choice.

Ryan was another Hail Mary to excite the base that otherwise was very suspicious of the nominee.

148 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:58:11pm

re: #145 Dark_Falcon

Goodnight, all.

nighty night.

149 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:58:14pm

re: #144 JamesWI

That's what I thought at the time.

Seeing his incompetence in action the past few weeks, I now doubt that. Now it seems perfectly reasonable that Romney would somehow think Ryan was his best option.

I think Rob Portman was asked first and declined. Not sure about Pawlenty.

150 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:58:22pm
151 Mr. Crankypants  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:58:46pm

Well that's it for me too. Gnite

152 HappyWarrior  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 9:59:48pm

re: #149 goddamnedfrank

I think Rob Portman was asked first and declined. Not sure about Pawlenty.

I heard that the advisers wanted Portman but Mrs. Romney and the boys pushed hard for Ryan.

153 danhenry1  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:00:15pm

We still have a ways to go before we get up thar to Fraggle world. Sad. So sad. I don't think their would even be a close 'Race', if Obama's mom and dad had been lifted out of Kansas..

154 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:01:15pm

re: #150 JamesWI

And then there's this...
[Link: hosted.ap.org...]

155 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:05:46pm

This is awesome:

156 Petero1818  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:05:53pm

re: #59 Cannadian Club Akbar

I have 5 different restaurant concepts. A diner with the best burgers and hand dipped shakes are there. As are old skool Cherry Cokes. And home made ice cream. Fried chicken. Biscuits. Etc....

WTF happened to dietician. Jesus. You have that restaurant you aren't going to need a dietician you will need a cardiologist.//

157 Big Joe  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:07:35pm

re: #98 Cannadian Club Akbar

Try beer with M&M's. Trust me.

Cabernet Sauvignon with Nutter Butter Peanut-butter cookies. They even dip well.

158 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:10:41pm

re: #111 Lidane

I have never liked liver. My mom used to make it when I was a kid then quit when she realized I would eat everything but the liver on my plate.

Same goes for veal. I don't like it either. Haven't eaten veal in over 20 years and I see no reason to ever have it again.

I feel so alone. I loved liver as a child. My mom used to make it with onions and bacon about once a week. One problem is that it's very easy to overcook liver and turn it into shoe leather. Mom was never guilty of this, but I can't say as much for some restaurants I've eaten at.

159 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:11:33pm

re: #156 Petero1818

WTF happened to dietician. Jesus. You have that restaurant you aren't going to need a dietician you will need a cardiologist.//

My food will flat out kill you, eventually. But, remember, fat adds flavor.:)

160 Lidane  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:16:09pm

re: #158 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

I feel so alone. I loved liver as a child. My mom used to make it with onions and bacon about once a week. One problem is that it's very easy to overcook liver and turn it into shoe leather. Mom was never guilty of this, but I can't say as much for some restaurants I've eaten at.

The problem wasn't the texture. It's that liver tastes metallic and gross to me. I never liked it, no matter who cooked it.

I don't care for lamb either, but that's because the only lamb I've eaten is at my aunt's house during the holidays and she seems to have a theory that the mint jelly is supposed to be the main flavor. As a result, hers is dry and awful.

161 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:16:09pm

Alrighty. I'm outtie. Y'all have a good night.:)

162 Cannadian Club Akbar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:19:49pm

re: #160 Lidane

A lamb porterhouse with chimichurri....
[Link: www.culinarycolleen.com...]

163 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:20:24pm

re: #160 Lidane

The problem wasn't the texture. It's that liver tastes metallic and gross to me.

High in iron. That's one of the reasons we had it weekly.

Mom was a good cook, but prone to food fads.

164 engineer cat  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:24:26pm

my favorite type of liver is chopped chicken liver, delicatessen style

the essential thing besides the inevitable garlic are the carmelized onions

165 Dancing along the light of day  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:31:17pm

re: #6 Charles Johnson

Charles, when I'm logged in I still get pop up ads. Why is that? When I reload the page.

166 Mocking Jay  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:32:45pm

re: #158 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

I feel so alone. I loved liver as a child. My mom used to make it with onions and bacon about once a week. One problem is that it's very easy to overcook liver and turn it into shoe leather. Mom was never guilty of this, but I can't say as much for some restaurants I've eaten at.

You're not alone. I like liver. Throw in some bacon and onions and I'm down with it. Oh, and peas. Don't forget the peas.

167 Kragar  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:35:23pm

Wife is going to make some slow roasted ginger pork this weekend. Slice it thin and serve it with green onions and soy sauce.

168 Mocking Jay  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:36:13pm

re: #155 Lidane

El Oh fucking El

169 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 10:55:43pm

re: #166 Mocking Jay

You're not alone. I like liver. Throw in some bacon and onions and I'm down with it. Oh, and peas. Don't forget the peas.

You may have all the peas. I've never developed a taste for them.

170 Mocking Jay  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 11:07:59pm

re: #169 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

You may have all the peas. I've never developed a taste for them.

Gimme gimme gimme.

171 Pip's Squeak  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 11:13:45pm

re: #126 Lidane

Same. Every time I see organ meats like liver or beef tongue in the grocery store I'm immediately drawn to the produce section just as an instinct.

NO. Just...no. Some things are not meant to be eaten.

It's a personal, obviously, but if I am going to be non-vegetarian, then it would seem a moral necessity to eat/use all of a slaughtered animal.

172 palomino  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 11:15:10pm

What the hell is Todd Akin doing within half a point of McCaskill in Missouri (in the latest aggregate poll of polls)? MO is a red state, but it was the closest state Obama lost in 08. So you'd think the voters there might have some grasp on modernity. Maybe I've overestimated them.

173 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 11:29:40pm

re: #172 palomino

What the hell is Todd Akin doing within half a point of McCaskill in Missouri (in the latest aggregate poll of polls)? MO is a red state, but it was the closest state Obama lost in 08. So you'd think the voters there might have some grasp on modernity. Maybe I've overestimated them.

A) Lots of stupid people

B) Lots of biased polls. If you're talking about the TPM PollTracker stats, the most recent poll was sponsored by Citizens United (yes, that Citizens United). That one has Akin ahead +5. The same company that did that one also has a slightly older poll that is the only other recent one with Akin ahead.

Another bad one that is included is Gravis Marketing. I've seen them all over the place, and they tend to have the most right-leaning polls, though in this one they have McCaskill up by like 1. I think Nate Silver pointed out one where Gravis had a Republican winning by like 9% in a race where every other poll had the Dem winning by more than 10%. (I think it was the Pennsylvania Senate Race).

Even Rasmussen (from 9/11) has McCaskill up by six. I think this is just a case of the poll aggregators not weighting obviously biased polls.

174 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 11:34:20pm
175 palomino  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 11:48:47pm

re: #173 JamesWI

A) Lots of stupid people

B) Lots of biased polls. If you're talking about the TPM PollTracker stats, the most recent poll was sponsored by Citizens United (yes, that Citizens United). That one has Akin ahead +5. The same company that did that one also has a slightly older poll that is the only other recent one with Akin ahead.

Another bad one that is included is Gravis Marketing. I've seen them all over the place, and they tend to have the most right-leaning polls, though in this one they have McCaskill up by like 1. I think Nate Silver pointed out one where Gravis had a Republican winning by like 9% in a race where every other poll had the Dem winning by more than 10%. (I think it was the Pennsylvania Senate Race).

Even Rasmussen (from 9/11) has McCaskill up by six. I think this is just a case of the poll aggregators not weighting obviously biased polls.

I'm just afraid that your point A might trump point B on election day. Outside of STL and Colombia, Missouri might as well be Kansas or Oklahoma.

Having a troglodyte like Akin in the Senate would be just one more embarrassment for middle America.

176 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 11:49:22pm

I think maybe this guy has had enough beer, but that doesn't stop him from trying to get more and failing pitifully...

177 JamesWI  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 11:53:27pm

re: #175 palomino

I'm just afraid that your point A might trump point B on election day. Outside of STL and Colombia, Missouri might as well be Kansas or Oklahoma.

Having a troglodyte like Akin in the Senate would be just one more embarrassment for middle America.

Eh, if even Rasmussen is giving the Democrat 6 points, I think that means it's probably not going to happen. Unless he's trying a new reverse-psychology strategy in his polls.

178 palomino  Wed, Sep 19, 2012 11:59:27pm

re: #177 JamesWI

Eh, if even Rasmussen is giving the Democrat 6 points, I think that means it's probably not going to happen. Unless he's trying a new reverse-psychology strategy in his polls.

How does Rasmussen massage the numbers so that he gives Republicans what they want to hear during the campaign, but magically isn't that far off on election day? He must tweak his stat models at some late point in the game, because his final predictions typically don't disagree with other pollsters by the same margins as earlier in campaigns.

179 JamesWI  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 12:09:31am

re: #178 palomino

How does Rasmussen massage the numbers so that he gives Republicans what they want to hear during the campaign, but magically isn't that far off on election day? He must tweak his stat models at some late point in the game, because his final predictions typically don't disagree with other pollsters by the same margins as earlier in campaigns.

Well, I can't really say since you have to pay to join his site if you want to look at his actual poll data, questions, etc.

But earlier today (or yesterday, now...) Nate Silver posted a piece where he was talking about how polls that include cell-phone users have been much better for Obama than those that use only land-lines. Rasmussen is one of the ones that only dials land-lines for their polls.

And since 1/3 of the households in the country don't even have a land-line, and those that only use cell-phones tend to be younger (I saw a number saying 60% of 25-29 year olds don't have a land-line), that means his polls likely skew older, and older voters are more likely to vote Republican.

Also, you can mess with the numbers based on what questions you actually ask the participants. On Rasmussen's Wikipedia page, there's an example from where he was polling Republican voters about whether they thought Rush Limbaugh was a "leader" of the Republican Party, and the actual poll question was: "Agree or Disagree: 'Rush Limbaugh is the leader of the Republican Party -- he says jump and they say how high.'" So, that was obviously worded to make people more likely to disagree with the statement.

180 palomino  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 12:16:42am

re: #179 JamesWI

Rasmussen actually included the "jump and they say how high" part? Well, I guess if the GOP has its own propaganda TV network, they might as well have their own biased polling firm. Ironically, speaking of FoxNews, I think their polls are actually less skewed than Rasmussen's.

181 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 12:37:10am

All you can truly and objectively get out of poll results is "x number of people gave the following multiple-choice to the following questions"

Derive from that what you will.

182 researchok  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 1:14:57am

Morning, all

183 freetoken  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 1:26:45am

Going deeply long-hair here... given my re-awakened interest in choral music I thought I'd give Dvorak's Requiem a spin... it's one of those "7 course meal" type of things:

184 goddamnedfrank  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 1:35:34am

re: #178 palomino

How does Rasmussen massage the numbers so that he gives Republicans what they want to hear during the campaign, but magically isn't that far off on election day? He must tweak his stat models at some late point in the game, because his final predictions typically don't disagree with other pollsters by the same margins as earlier in campaigns.

Rasmussen was way off in 2010, and if he's tweeking late his tweaks are pretty much in place by the final three week mark:

Moreover, Rasmussen’s polls were quite biased, overestimating the standing of the Republican candidate by almost 4 points on average. In just 12 cases, Rasmussen’s polls overestimated the margin for the Democrat by 3 or more points. But it did so for the Republican candidate in 55 cases — that is, in more than half of the polls that it issued.

If one focused solely on the final poll issued by Rasmussen Reports or Pulse Opinion Research in each state — rather than including all polls within the three-week interval — it would not have made much difference. Their average error would be 5.7 points rather than 5.8, and their average bias 3.8 points rather than 3.9.

185 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 1:40:17am

God, how we love silver bullets, one-pill miracle weight-loss cures, "objective" fact-checkers and "100% accurate" polls. Polls are good at showing trends, but unless a candidate is consistently way out ahead, they are no clear indicator of the outcome

186 researchok  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 2:20:54am

re: #183 freetoken

I had 2 1/2 courses.

I'm stuffed

That, and I have to get ready for real life.

Good stuff, FT- pretty breathtaking.

187 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 3:24:20am

re: #159 Cannadian Club Akbar

My food will flat out kill you, eventually. But, remember, fat adds flavor.:)

You should instead stick to the types of foods that cause immortality.

188 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 3:26:47am

re: #187 Our Precious Bodily Fluids

You should instead stick to the types of foods that cause immortality.

A restaurant is not the sort of place where you go to eat on a daily basis. I eat quite simply at home so that when I do go out (which is not often these days), I splurge on something hideous, the sort of thing I would never prepare at home.

189 Samsonn  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:10:48am

re: #57 Gus

Sorry Gus - I didn't mean to target you...when I posted here last, the ding system didn't exist. So I was just mucking about trying it out. I've down-rated and up-rated a few posts.. not with any real targeted intent, just for the sake of trying out how many votes I can give and so forth (though I did down rate a couple of posts I disagreed with, from other folks in other threads)...I tried to uprate the posts I downrated, but it was a bit of a scatter gun approach! Sorry!

190 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:12:56am

Groan, I really could care less about Monica
[Link: www.nypost.com...]
She really needs to go away.

191 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:17:31am

If their lips are moving, they are lying.
[Link: www.nypost.com...]

192 ozbloke  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:17:42am

re: #190 Tommy's cone of shame

Groan, I really could care less about Monica
[Link: www.nypost.com...]
She really needs to go away.

You could be kinder, she was serving at the presidents pleasure.

193 BongCrodny  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:26:20am

When I first heard the name Ben Folds Five, I was convinced it was a poker reference.

I was a little embarrassed when a friend told me his name was Folds.

194 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:28:41am

Remember the Rachel? Now its the Megan
[Link: www.nypost.com...]
And its not what you think.
Thats hot.

195 Kronocide  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:32:05am

re: #192 ozbloke

You could be kinder, she was serving at the presidents pleasure.

She's useful to bash Clinton again. None of the tabloids tell the source and all have the same information.

196 ozbloke  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:35:15am

re: #195 Kronocide

She's useful to bash Clinton again. None of the tabloids tell the source and all have the same information.

Would you be surprised if she wrote a tell all?

197 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:37:53am

Things not to buy at yard sales
[Link: www.timesunion.com...]
I prolly shouldn't have bought that wetsuit, but it does explain the rashes
/

198 Kronocide  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:54:04am

re: #196 ozbloke

Would you be surprised if she wrote a tell all?

No, not at all. It's quite possible this is genuine timing by her or her advisers if she really is doing a book.

But the timing is suspicious.

199 ozbloke  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 4:58:29am

re: #198 Kronocide

No, not at all. It's quite possible this is genuine timing by her or her advisers if she really is doing a book.

But the timing is suspicious.

I would say the timing couldn't be better if I were her publicist

200 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:15:59am

re: #92 engineer cat

i don't seem to be able to make any progress with my great restaurant concept of a nationwide chain of beer 'n' pie joints

beer 'n' pie! it's a natural!!!

campaign and ice cream for the high end customers...

Selling pies at such a low price it's like you cut your own throat?

201 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:21:48am

re: #139 Lidane

Also, if you can't pronounce the ingredients on the list, or they sound like something that belongs in a lab, avoid that food.

[Link: www.amazon.com...]

A good read if you want to know about additives, where they come from, and what they are used for.

Michael Pollen books as well - but your comment looks almost like a quote from one of them. ;)

202 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:28:00am

re: #181 47 turn it up to 11

All you can truly and objectively get out of poll results is "x number of people gave the following multiple-choice to the following questions"

Derive from that what you will.

Well, that's not strictly true. You can, with careful sample selection and proper polling techniques, determine a probable percentage range that the actual candidate popularity or whatever the poll is studying falls within. As far as pinning down an exact "54% of America definitely approves of this candidate", no, obviously that's not going to happen.

203 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:40:45am

re: #202 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

Well, that's not strictly true. You can, with careful sample selection and proper polling techniques, determine a probable percentage range that the actual candidate popularity or whatever the poll is studying falls within. As far as pinning down an exact "54% of America definitely approves of this candidate", no, obviously that's not going to happen.

True. But there seems to be a lot of manipulation going on to "push" results one way or another in a self-fulfilling way. Major method is simply from how the questions are worded. I hate most polls and questionnaires I get from work, etc. because they have piles of ambiguously worded questions.

I live in a world of grays, not black and white.

204 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:41:52am

re: #203 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

True. But there seems to be a lot of manipulation going on to "push" results one way or another in a self-fulfilling way. Major method is simply from how the questions are worded. I hate most polls and questionnaires I get from work, etc. because they have piles of ambiguously worded questions.

I live in a world of grays, not black and white.

That's why I said "proper polling techniques". Most polls are either intentionally or unintentionally loaded to produce a certain result. Hence the post above highlighting Rasmussen's chronic tendency to lean Republican.

205 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:47:22am

re: #203 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

True. But there seems to be a lot of manipulation going on to "push" results one way or another in a self-fulfilling way. Major method is simply from how the questions are worded.

exactly, which is why you have to pay close attention to the choice of questions and how they are worded

206 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:51:11am

re: #204 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

That's why I said "proper polling techniques". Most polls are either intentionally or unintentionally loaded to produce a certain result. Hence the post above highlighting Rasmussen's chronic tendency to lean Republican.

Polling is pretty much the ultimate methodology of "lies, damned lies, and statistics". Ties nicely to group think and tribalism - if 1000s have such and such an opinion there must be something to it.

207 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:52:44am

Heh. A friend of mine who just moved here from Sweden is getting his first taste of the American medical system. He finds it Kafkaesque.

208 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:54:34am

re: #207 Obdicut

Heh. A friend of mine who just moved here from Sweden is getting his first taste of the American medical system. He finds it Kafkaesque.

Wait until he tries the meatballs...
;)

209 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:54:37am

re: #207 Obdicut

Heh. A friend of mine who just moved here from Sweden is getting his first taste of the American medical system. He finds it Kafkaesque.

No, just capitalist.

210 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 5:55:24am

re: #206 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Polling is pretty much the ultimate methodology of "lies, damned lies, and statistics". Ties nicely to group think and tribalism - if 1000s have such and such an opinion there must be something to it.

I do love statistics. But similar to the horror of watching Hollywood movies as a real computer programmer, I sit here and I read headlines supposedly based on medical studies and polls and find myself screaming, "IT DOESN'T WORK LIKE THAT!"

211 Interesting Times  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:02:01am
212 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:05:47am

re: #210 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

I do love statistics. But similar to the horror of watching Hollywood movies as a real computer programmer, I sit here and I read headlines supposedly based on medical studies and polls and find myself screaming, "IT DOESN'T WORK LIKE THAT!"

heh. Reminds me of a lyric from "Court of the Crimson King".
"I run to grasp divining signs in order to satisfy the hoax."

Which essentially describes it. They want to report something with the spin running a certain way. So you either find a poll/study that fits the desired result, or find one close enough is twist it to fit the target. That it works so well points out how far we have to go in getting a properly educated citizenry. Or at least one that will clearly reject the more blatant manipulation, lies, and misrepresentations.

213 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:09:49am

re: #212 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

...That it works so well points out how far we have to go in getting a properly educated citizenry. Or at least one that will clearly reject the more blatant manipulation, lies, and misrepresentations.

But not enough to put Fox News out of business...

214 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:11:05am

re: #212 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

heh. Reminds me of a lyric from "Court of the Crimson King".
"I run to grasp divining signs in order to satisfy the hoax."

Which essentially describes it. They want to report something with the spin running a certain way. So you either find a poll/study that fits the desired result, or find one close enough is twist it to fit the target. That it works so well points out how far we have to go in getting a properly educated citizenry. Or at least one that will clearly reject the more blatant manipulation, lies, and misrepresentations.

I do wish that a basic course in practical statistics was required to graduate high school. It would go a long way toward dispelling the bullshit headlines we read every day, I think.

215 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:14:13am

re: #199 ozbloke

I would say the timing couldn't be better if I were her publicist

Concur. Bill Clinton's profile is very high right now, and a book by her would be well positioned to sell at this point.

216 ShaunP  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:15:16am

Democratic Candidates Being Attacked by Republican-Linked Liberal Named Group

People living in Delray might have received a mailer about Democrat Sen. Maria Sachs contributing to George W. Bush "more than once" and being in cahoots with Katherine Harris in disenfranchising voters.

The mailers, from a group called Progressives, are intended to sound as if a liberal organization is warning people not to vote for Sachs by tying her to W. and other assorted characters from the right's rogues gallery. Only problem is, Progressives is actually a Republican-linked group.

Ah, GOPers, is there nothing dirty, shady and downright dickish you won't do to win elections?

According to Sachs's campaign, she has never written a single check to George W. Bush.

Progressives, as it turns out, is chaired by one William S. Jones, who is also happens to chair the Liberty Foundation of Florida, which is a group that has happened to have raised a little over $2 million between May 24 and August 9. And most those donations happen to come from the Florida Conservative Majority Committee.

Nice, FL Republicans. Good job, good effort...

*ShaunP's partisan reformation continues*

217 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:16:14am

re: #214 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

I do wish that a basic course in practical statistics was required to graduate high school. It would go a long way toward dispelling the bullshit headlines we read every day, I think.

Basic education is badly failing in our country: a lot of Americans are poorly versed in not only in statistics, but also in science and how it works as well as literary criticism (in the sense of understanding where the author is coming from and what they are trying to say), basic civics and understanding of the Constitution.

Or to put it this way: combine a basic misunderstanding of statistics, science, literary interpretation and civics and you get Creationism in the schools.

218 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:16:57am

re: #214 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

I do wish that a basic course in practical statistics was required to graduate high school. It would go a long way toward dispelling the bullshit headlines we read every day, I think.

I actually think the stronger need is instilling a better sense of curiosity - and then add-on how to properly research and analyze from there. If you teach the latter without the former you possibly have someone see the headline, but having no interest in finding out whether it is actually true or not.

(I come to this from working with IT interns a ways back in my career. Some were better than others - with the better ones genuinely curious about how things worked and actively learning new things. Others were very happy with rote jobs and had to be driven to learn about how processes actually worked. One in particular was very good at going from manager to manager to deal with a particular subject until we cross-conferred, caught on to what he was doing, and then we all answered his query about that subject with "go look it up yourself".)

219 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:19:09am

re: #218 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

In either case, I think that there needs to be some work done on basic education. The current state of affairs is atrocious.

220 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:22:01am

This picture truly says a thousand words. It's caption:

Masked Palestinians stone-throwers collect bricks to use against Israeli security forces, not pictured, during clashes erupted after demonstration against an anti-Islam film called "Innocence of Muslims" that ridicules Islam's Prophet Muhammad, in Shuafat refugee camp, Jerusalem.

Note that the Israeli government had absolutely nothing to do with that PoS film, but the Palestinians are rioting anyways. Also note how they use a baby carriage to carry bricks with which to try to injure Israeli police and soldiers.

221 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:22:20am

It's morning again.

How are you-all?

222 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:23:09am

re: #219 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

In either case, I think that there needs to be some work done on basic education. The current state of affairs is atrocious.

Pretty much. But also not something with a simple solution. It's a complex interaction of public and private interests, parties, and finances. A lot of varying environments as well. And, of course, contrasting goals and approaches in how to carry out the mission.

223 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:23:21am

re: #221 ggt

It's morning again.

How are you-all?

I'm going to be applying fire retardant to my scales here soon, as I look at the clock and wonder apprehensively when the flaming will start.

224 iossarian  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:24:03am

re: #216 ShaunP

Democratic Candidates Being Attacked by Republican-Linked Liberal Named Group

Nice, FL Republicans. Good job, good effort...

*ShaunP's partisan reformation continues*

I liked this part:

According to Sachs's campaign, she has never written a single check to George W. Bush.

Outright lies. SOP for the GOP.

225 kirkspencer  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:24:31am

re: #217 47 turn it up to 11

Basic education is badly failing in our country: a lot of Americans are poorly versed in not only in statistics, but also in science and how it works as well as literary criticism (in the sense of understanding where the author is coming from and what they are trying to say), basic civics and understanding of the Constitution.

Or to put it this way: combine a basic misunderstanding of statistics, science, literary interpretation and civics and you get Creationism in the schools.

Defend this. see, I think you're using the wrong basis.

Some points to consider. First and probably largest, the complaint you have about creationism and all that? What's the age of the people pushing that sort of thing? It ain't the students, it's the parents.

Second, the scores (from the NCES) have gradually increased for all tested grade levels over the past few decades.

226 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:24:39am

re: #194 Tommy's cone of shame

Remember the Rachel? Now its the Megan
[Link: www.nypost.com...]
And its not what you think.
Thats hot.

I just don't understand . . .

227 iossarian  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:25:00am

re: #225 kirkspencer

re:

e.g.:

228 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:25:25am

re: #207 Obdicut

Heh. A friend of mine who just moved here from Sweden is getting his first taste of the American medical system. He finds it Kafkaesque.

Do tell . . .

229 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:26:08am

re: #206 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Polling is pretty much the ultimate methodology of "lies, damned lies, and statistics". Ties nicely to group think and tribalism - if 1000s have such and such an opinion there must be something to it.

Wouldn't the same exact complaint extend to voting. After all, we don't have 100% turnout, which means that only a fraction of the populace is determining outcomes for the rest of the electorate? Most general elections see around 50% of registered voters turn out. Many primary elections, let alone school and other local elections see even lower turnout. Heck, there are elections determined where turnout is about 25-30%. Does that make them any less valid? After all, registered voters is a subset of the entire population affected.

But, voting is a definitive measure despite the shortcomings and low turnout.

Polling does have valid use and properly designed polls with good methodologies can inform about views of the general population. That's why polling relies on margins of error and that good polls do a very good job of reducing their margins of error.

230 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:26:11am

re: #214 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

I do wish that a basic course in practical statistics was required to graduate high school. It would go a long way toward dispelling the bullshit headlines we read every day, I think.

How about just Logic 101?

231 kirkspencer  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:26:24am

re: #227 iossarian

e.g.:

fixted. did an error in copy pasting and got conflicting tags.

232 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:28:12am

re: #231 kirkspencer

fixted. did an error in copy pasting and got conflicting tags.

Conflicting Tags are dangerous . . .you need to be careful, it could cause Space-Time to fold within itself, by a factor of 5.

233 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:28:13am

re: #225 kirkspencer

Defend this. see, I think you're using the wrong basis.

Some points to consider. First and probably largest, the complaint you have about creationism and all that? What's the age of the people pushing that sort of thing? It ain't the students, it's the parents.

Second, the scores (from the NCES) have gradually increased for all tested grade levels over the past few decades.

The parents are also the product of a declining school system, it has been going on for decades now.

Test scores show how well students answer test questions, not how well they can think critically and process information from various competing and often contradictory sources.

234 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:28:42am

re: #207 Obdicut

I know someone who moved to Israel a few years back from the US, but complains bitterly that Obama's a Marxist for imposing Obamacare. The irony is apparently lost on this person considering that Israel's national health care system isn't quite single payer, but it has 4 health insurance companies, and everyone must pay after the first year in the country. In other words, they've got a mandate provision, and withholding comes from their paychecks.

Oh, and they actually say good things about the Israeli health care system. Go figure.

235 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:29:43am

Damn you Obdicut and your big words
[Link: en.wiktionary.org...]

236 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:30:07am

re: #230 ggt

How about just Logic 101?

Wouldn't work, because quite often people simply aren't interested in logic. They do what they do out of loyalty to the team (as I sometimes do) or to serve various other emotional needs.

237 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:32:32am

re: #234 lawhawk

My friend is dealing with the whole "First you have to figure out if the doctor is in-network, then you have to get approval from the health insurance to see a specialist, then you have to figure out if the specialist is in-network, and then the insurance company has to review the proposed procedure and okay it." And in this case, the insurance company is attempting to give him a much less efficacious drug.

Since he has chronic health problems (he has Marfans) he's seriously considering moving back to Sweden. He'd heard how fucked up our health care system was but didn't really believe it.

238 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:33:16am

re: #236 Dark_Falcon

Wouldn't work, because quite often people simply aren't interested in logic. They do what they do out of loyalty to the team (as I sometimes do) or to serve various other emotional needs.

I disagree. A basic Logic course gives a person an alternative to emotional decisions--that they otherwise wouldn't have. May not work for all, but I think a good minority would choose Logic. Which is better than we have now.

And, it's easier than Statistics. Those of us who are numerically challenged can still get good grades in Logic. I did.

239 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:33:32am

re: #235 Tommy's cone of shame

Lemme blow your mind, then, with simple words:

Buffalo, Buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo.

That's a coherent English sentence.

240 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:34:47am

re: #238 ggt

There's actually good research backing up what you're saying. If you expose people to logic and science, it actually prophylactically helps to guard against irrationality. Like, people who are taking science courses are less likely to believe illogical religious things.

This is another reason why voting in churches shouldn't be allowed; it has the opposite effect.

241 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:36:56am

re: #237 Obdicut

My friend is dealing with the whole "First you have to figure out if the doctor is in-network, then you have to get approval from the health insurance to see a specialist, then you have to figure out if the specialist is in-network, and then the insurance company has to review the proposed procedure and okay it." And in this case, the insurance company is attempting to give him a much less efficacious drug.

Since he has chronic health problems (he has Marfans) he's seriously considering moving back to Sweden. He'd heard how fucked up our health care system was but didn't really believe it.

Sad as it is, he can hire an Advocate or an Attorney to help him thru it. I found life is much better on PPO as opposed to HMO. I don't go thru all the "approval" processes. As long as the insurance company is large enough --most hospitals and doctors I've wanted to see are on the plan.

All the collagen disorders (such as Marfans and what I have-Ehlers Danlos) are rare enough that many doctors have never seen a patient with it. I hear "Oh I learned about that in residency". A lot. I've learned I have to to to a teaching hospital or a doctor affiliated with a teaching hospital to get the best, most efficient care.

242 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:39:45am

re: #240 Obdicut

There's actually good research backing up what you're saying. If you expose people to logic and science, it actually prophylactically helps to guard against irrationality. Like, people who are taking science courses are less likely to believe illogical religious things.

This is another reason why voting in churches shouldn't be allowed; it has the opposite effect.

Yup. If no alternative is learned, a person will not have a chance to leave the bubble of ignorance. Many of the more hard-core religious homeschoolers do this on purpose. A homeschooling friend of mine told me that she inquired about joining a Christian Homeschool group and they actually had a form for her to sign that she wouldn't eve say the word "Evolution" around her children.

243 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:39:47am

re: #229 lawhawk

Wouldn't the same exact complaint extend to voting. After all, we don't have 100% turnout, which means that only a fraction of the populace is determining outcomes for the rest of the electorate? Most general elections see around 50% of registered voters turn out. Many primary elections, let alone school and other local elections see even lower turnout. Heck, there are elections determined where turnout is about 25-30%. Does that make them any less valid? After all, registered voters is a subset of the entire population affected.

But, voting is a definitive measure despite the shortcomings and low turnout.

Polling does have valid use and properly designed polls with good methodologies can inform about views of the general population. That's why polling relies on margins of error and that good polls do a very good job of reducing their margins of error.

Voting is another complex issue when you start looking at it. The "ideal" is selecting the best candidate based on the input of an informed electorate. And with voluntary participation in the process you then get into individual decision-making regarding the opportunity cost of actually taking part in the process. And once that is in play it becomes of interest to various parties to potentially manipulate that opportunity cost for their own gain. And so on. (And then you can go down the various avenues regarding mandatory vs voluntary voting; voting systems; registration issues; etc. etc.)

Well-designed polls with good methodologies can inform. The question then becomes to value to be gained in finding them and understanding them amidst the dross of poorly designed polls - or simply results of polls (even good ones) being misreported or other misrepresented by the various talking heads.

244 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:40:15am

re: #241 ggt

You have Ehlers-Danlos? I have a tentative diagnosis of a variation of it. I don't have the stretchy skin or the easy bruising, but I have amazingly flexible joints and bones-- including being able to bend my ribs at about a 45 degree angle with no pain. The funny part is that I have no joint weakness-- they never dislocate-- they're just hyperflexible. I can rotate my hand/arm 360 degrees. It was great for jujitsu.

I should get a genetic panel done eventually.

245 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:42:49am

re: #244 Obdicut

I should get a genetic panel done eventually.

Before the Death Panels get you...

246 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:44:05am

re: #245 47 turn it up to 11

Before the Death Panels get you...

Or the Sentinels decide that you are a mutant and thus must be confined for the safety of society.

247 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:44:25am

re: #244 Obdicut

Actually, make that 540 degrees. Freeow!

248 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:44:57am

re: #244 Obdicut

You have Ehlers-Danlos? I have a tentative diagnosis of a variation of it. I don't have the stretchy skin or the easy bruising, but I have amazingly flexible joints and bones-- including being able to bend my ribs at about a 45 degree angle with no pain. The funny part is that I have no joint weakness-- they never dislocate-- they're just hyperflexible. I can rotate my hand/arm 360 degrees. It was great for jujitsu.

I should get a genetic panel done eventually.

Hypermobility --yes, the hallmark of Ehlers-Danlos Type III. It is my major symptom. Love Yoga. HA!

Years ago when I was first researching it, all the new research and support groups were in England. Rodney Graham PHD was the main impetus. His book is a big help. Finally, they've started paying attention in the US. Mostly with children, but that is a great start. Dr. Brad Tinker from Cincinnati just came out with another book. Thinking about going for a consultation with him.

The only doc in the Chicago area I could find on the good doc list has retired now. It's important to get the proper diagnosis.

Two words--Pilates and Prolotherapy.

I'll make my nic blue if you want to talk more.

249 A Mom Anon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:48:22am

re: #238 ggt

There used to be civics,basic statistics,more than a semester of American History,teaching the Constitution and other important documents AND there was a focus on providing good electives for kids so they could actually have a part of the school day doing something they really enjoyed. When the focus is on testing and rote learning,you destroy a kid's intellectual curiosity. When kids don't test well,they come away feeling stupid and worthless,which is kind of the opposite of education. This is what happens when you apply a business mindset to education and allow people who don't spend time in actual classrooms to have sole dominion over policy and procedure.

My son graduated Class of '12. The electives were cut every single year he was at school,and the Class of '13 is facing yet another cut. There's nothing to spark an interest in anything but math. Plenty of math classes,but what if math isn't something that interests you? These kids are graduating with no skills that serve them in reality,they can barely spell and can't find shit on a map,let alone manage money or learn how to be independent.

250 Interesting Times  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:49:37am
251 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:49:48am

re: #240 Obdicut

There's actually good research backing up what you're saying. If you expose people to logic and science, it actually prophylactically helps to guard against irrationality. Like, people who are taking science courses are less likely to believe illogical religious things.

This is another reason why voting in churches shouldn't be allowed; it has the opposite effect.

I dunno. My local polling place is a church and it doesn't have an effect that I've witnessed. Though the room used for voting is kind of open multipurpose room that does not contain religious symbols.

252 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:51:04am

re: #248 ggt

Yoga is actually terrible for me; some of the positions are trivial, and other ones I'm totally unstable in because my joints don't lock completely.

My wife is in the MD/PhD program at Cornell, and I have access to great doctors on the subject if I wanted to get off my ass, but since I have no negative aspects to the condition, only positive ones, I've been lazy about it. Of course, the danger is that at any moment it might turn into arthritis et al.

Thank you for the book recommendations; I'll check 'em out and my wife will as well.

253 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:51:57am

re: #249 A Mom Anon

There used to be civics,basic statistics,more than a semester of American History,teaching the Constitution and other important documents AND there was a focus on providing good electives for kids so they could actually have a part of the school day doing something they really enjoyed. When the focus is on testing and rote learning,you destroy a kid's intellectual curiosity. When kids don't test well,they come away feeling stupid and worthless,which is kind of the opposite of education. This is what happens when you apply a business mindset to education and allow people who don't spend time in actual classrooms to have sole dominion over policy and procedure.

My son graduated Class of '12. The electives were cut every single year he was at school,and the Class of '13 is facing yet another cut. There's nothing to spark an interest in anything but math. Plenty of math classes,but what if math isn't something that interests you? These kids are graduating with no skills that serve them in reality,they can barely spell and can't find shit on a map,let alone manage money or learn how to be independent.

We did private education with my son. Montessori to grade 6, then Catholic School for two years --then all boys Catholic JROTC high school. I can't say enough about the Benedictines. I never thought I'd send my kid to Catholic High School, but they know boys and he thrived.

Either way, private or public, it still takes a huge investment in time and energy on the part of the parents. Most parents simply don't have the time or the energy after working all day to keep it up.

254 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:51:59am

re: #251 Dark_Falcon

I dunno. My local polling place is a church and it doesn't have an effect that I've witnessed. Though the room used for voting is kind of open multipurpose room that does not contain religious symbols.

Actual studies done have shown that doing voting in churches makes people vote more in line with the values they associate with that particular religion.

It's improper. Sadly, in many towns, the churches are one of the only large, well-kept up public spaces.

255 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:52:21am

Outrage!

256 ReamWorks SKG  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:52:32am

I thought Obama looked great on Letterman last night. I watched the entire thing. He answered the questions well, and Letterman asked some tough questions.

257 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:53:26am

re: #252 Obdicut

Yoga is actually terrible for me; some of the positions are trivial, and other ones I'm totally unstable in because my joints don't lock completely.

My wife is in the MD/PhD program at Cornell, and I have access to great doctors on the subject if I wanted to get off my ass, but since I have no negative aspects to the condition, only positive ones, I've been lazy about it. Of course, the danger is that at any moment it might turn into arthritis et al.

Thank you for the book recommendations; I'll check 'em out and my wife will as well.

Men tend to stay and get "tighter" with age. But the pain will come. Just keep moving and don't give-up.

Also, I don't understand your comments about Yoga. Joints shouldn't lock. Group yoga classes are bunk, IMHO. If you really want to get into it, find a private teacher, who has a teacher.

258 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:54:28am

re: #257 ggt

Men tend to stay and get "tighter" with age. But the pain will come. Just keep moving and don't give-up.

It's one of the things that recently drove me to lose weight and get in good shape-- if my body is going to fall apart, I want it to fall apart from being in perfect condition, so it'll take longer.

259 iossarian  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:54:35am

re: #254 Obdicut

Actual studies done have shown...

Science!

Done by liberals of course. Can't be trusted.

260 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:55:33am

re: #254 Obdicut

Actual studies done have shown that doing voting in churches makes people vote more in line with the values they associate with that particular religion.

It's improper. Sadly, in many towns, the churches are one of the only large, well-kept up public spaces.

Well, where I am there are well kept schools with suitable rooms but churches are preferred for security reasons, though high schools are often polling places as well.

261 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:55:54am

Derp!

262 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:56:01am

LOL

263 iossarian  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:56:08am

re: #251 Dark_Falcon

I dunno. My local polling place is a church and it doesn't have an effect that I've witnessed. Though the room used for voting is kind of open multipurpose room that does not contain religious symbols.

Dude - you're an unshakeable right-wing voter. Whatever the rights and wrongs of your political position, maybe you're not the most obvious counter-example against an effect of religion on voting habits?

264 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:56:41am

re: #258 Obdicut

It's one of the things that recently drove me to lose weight and get in good shape-- if my body is going to fall apart, I want it to fall apart from being in perfect condition, so it'll take longer.

LOL --don't over stretch!

For years I did because I didn't know I was overs-tretching. Caused a lot of damage that way. Also, a good yoga teacher or PT will stop you when you do.

265 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:57:14am

re: #261 Gus

Derp!

[Embedded content]

That's right folks. The Fokkk News caption reads, "too busy for Israel, finds time for pirate."

268 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 6:59:41am

re: #263 iossarian

Dude - you're an unshakeable right-wing voter. Whatever the rights and wrongs of your political position, maybe you're not the most obvious counter-example against an effect of religion on voting habits?

I meant an effect on other people, not on me. It's much less likely that the type of building in which the polling place is found would effect those who post here, as LGF commentators tend to be far better informed than most people.

269 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:01:16am

2008 election for my precinct was held in a church. Big church. Never seen so many liberals in my life.

270 danarchy  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:02:00am

re: #254 Obdicut

Actual studies done have shown that doing voting in churches makes people vote more in line with the values they associate with that particular religion.

It's improper. Sadly, in many towns, the churches are one of the only large, well-kept up public spaces.

I just can't understand that. I've never gone to a polling place not knowing how I was going to vote and have never changed my mind in the booth. People who make up there minds in the polling booth just boggle my mind.

271 Mr. Crankypants  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:02:28am

re: #268 Dark_Falcon

I meant an effect on other people, not on me. It's much less likely that the type of building in which the polling place is found would effect those who post here, as LGF commentators tend to be far better informed than most people.

He doesn't practice what he preaches, but he's not the type of person he's preaching to. :)

272 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:02:57am

Couple years before that it was held in a fire house... So I voted in line with firepeoples.

//

273 Mr. Crankypants  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:03:11am

Good morning all..how the heck are ya?

274 Mr. Crankypants  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:03:46am

re: #272 Gus

Couple years before that it was held in a fire house... So I voted in line with firepeoples.

//

Must have voted Democrat then, Republicans just want to watch the world burn.

275 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:03:57am

re: #267 dragonath

Some Jackass Made Blowjob Pantomimes Behind Home Plate At Wrigley For Nearly An Inning Before Getting Ejected

Asshole. I'd propose for him the Supreme Penalty: He'd be locked in a room for two hours with Bryan Fischer, who'd berate him for "displaying America's moral decline". If he can keep from killing himself to get away from that loon, then he can go free.

276 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:04:17am

re: #269 Gus

2008 election for my precinct was held in a church. Big church. Never seen so many liberals in my life.

Gave them an excuse to come in and look at the architecture.
;)

277 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:04:18am

Watching Jon Stewart's "Chaos on Bulls#%t Mountain." It's fantastic. Especially when he calls Romney like jazz: it's the words you don't hear!

278 erik_t  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:09:50am

re: #270 danarchy

I just can't understand that. I've never gone to a polling place not knowing how I was going to vote and have never changed my mind in the booth. People who make up there minds in the polling booth just boggle my mind.

I can certainly see it downballot. There are lots of county-commissioner, school-board-rep sorts of races that I've not had an opinion on when I walked into the booth.

Of course, I just don't vote on these races. Better no opinion than an irrational one.

279 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:10:49am

re: #278 erik_t

I can certainly see it downballot. There are lots of county-commissioner, school-board-rep sorts of races that I've not had an opinion on when I walked into the booth.

Of course, I just don't vote on these races. Better no opinion than an irrational one.

I have found myself doing that too! And it pisses-me-off that I do. The local races are often the most important.

280 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:10:55am

re: #241 ggt

Yeah, there are so many flavors of health care insurance that it's tough. Even through an employer you can get multiple choices, including how much coverage to get (in vs. out of network coverage)- 90/70, 80/60, 70/50 - each with progressively lower premiums. Then there are copay levels, from 0 to $40 or more, and then pharmacy costs with similar cost levels. When you have a major insurance company (Aetna, Blue Cross, Anthem, Humana, etc.) you're much more likely to find a doctor in network. Sometimes finding the doc with your needs means going out of network and the costs can really jump. After all, some doctors don't take insurance because of all the costs associated with the paperwork.

281 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:11:28am

re: #278 erik_t

I can certainly see it downballot. There are lots of county-commissioner, school-board-rep sorts of races that I've not had an opinion on when I walked into the booth.

Of course, I just don't vote on these races. Better no opinion than an irrational one.

Following up since this supports a point made in an earlier comment (I think). Why no opinion on the candidates in a local school board race?

282 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:13:08am
283 erik_t  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:13:33am

re: #281 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Following up since this supports a point made in an earlier comment (I think). Why no opinion on the candidates in a local school board race?

Shrug. I hadn't taken the time to study up on the race. It didn't help that I was in college at the time and felt somewhat transient to the locale.

I try to keep this sort of thing past-tense. These are important races.

284 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:15:45am

re: #282 Gus

Hey Chuck Todd:
70 minutes of Romney droning on about how he has no problem ignoring needs of half the nation missing a couple of minutes at most, or a few moments of a larger speech given by Obama taken out of context? Yeah, they're exactly the same. Mo-ron.

285 gwangung  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:16:41am

re: #284 lawhawk

Hey Chuck Todd:
70 minutes of Romney droning on about how he has no problem ignoring needs of half the nation missing a couple of minutes at most, or a few moments of a larger speech given by Obama taken out of context? Yeah, they're exactly the same. Mo-ron.

Not only out of context, but edited, right?

286 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:17:21am

re: #284 lawhawk

Hey Chuck Todd:
70 minutes of Romney droning on about how he has no problem ignoring needs of half the nation missing a couple of minutes at most, or a few moments of a larger speech given by Obama taken out of context? Yeah, they're exactly the same. Mo-ron.

But Mitt is 100% for Americans! (But please ignore the GOP definition of "American" since it does not follow normal logic or the official definition of citizenry in the United States of America.)
//

287 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:18:08am

Mornin' everyone...holy shit, is that Chuck Todd a retardmoron or what?

Sorry...meant to type moron. Still waking up.

288 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:18:25am

re: #280 lawhawk

Yeah, there are so many flavors of health care insurance that it's tough. Even through an employer you can get multiple choices, including how much coverage to get (in vs. out of network coverage)- 90/70, 80/60, 70/50 - each with progressively lower premiums. Then there are copay levels, from 0 to $40 or more, and then pharmacy costs with similar cost levels. When you have a major insurance company (Aetna, Blue Cross, Anthem, Humana, etc.) you're much more likely to find a doctor in network. Sometimes finding the doc with your needs means going out of network and the costs can really jump. After all, some doctors don't take insurance because of all the costs associated with the paperwork.

I have one doctor that only takes one insurance (BCBS) because the hospital made her. She has the best run office and IMHO, prices lower than her competitors because she doesn't the extra staff and costs associated with taking a bazillion types of insurance and waiting for payment to arrive.

I pay, I submit.

My husband and I probably allocate more of our budget for healthcare than many people choose do to. I understand many people have NO room in their budget for healthcare. It's just easier and cheaper in the long run to manage our own care-choose our own doctors etc. Luckily, being in a major metro area, it's easier to find what we want covered and in-network.

WE do our own research and learn vocabulary--I think it also helps to know how to talk to medical professionals about one's care. THAT is a big part of why I think people don't get good care. The patient needs to get off their butt and READ.

I'd like to see classes in High School on reseraching skills. I'm amazed at the people I meet who are "educated" but can't work the computer or get information from the Library and utilize it.

The medical profession also spent many years setting themselves up as a god. People tend to shy away from taking control away from the doctor--conditioned response I guess. Sometimes I think if I hear "my doctor SAYS" one more time, I'll scream.

289 Coracle  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:18:34am

re: #251 Dark_Falcon

I dunno. My local polling place is a church and it doesn't have an effect that I've witnessed.

I find that statement ironic.

290 bratwurst  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:18:58am

re: #251 Dark_Falcon

I dunno. My local polling place is a church and it doesn't have an effect that I've witnessed.

Do you go inside the booths with people to see how they vote?

291 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:19:43am
292 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:20:21am

Satire, or a prediction of things to come?

The Onion: 'What About That Whole Birth Certificate Thing?' Romney Suggests To Staff

With his campaign still reeling from a series of miscues, Republican presidential nominee Mitt Romney asked a group of top advisers Wednesday whether it would be worth going after Obama by questioning the nation of his birth. “What about that whole deal with his birth certificate, or him being born in Kenya or wherever—you think that might stick?” said Romney, adding he was “just spitballing here.” “Also, wasn’t he connected to that terrorist guy, what’s-his-name? Ayers? Bill Ayers? That might have legs, right? Let’s look into that.” After agreeing that the situations should be investigated, Romney and his aides then reportedly sat in silence for 10 whole minutes.

293 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:21:39am

re: #284 lawhawk

Hey Chuck Todd:
70 minutes of Romney droning on about how he has no problem ignoring needs of half the nation missing a couple of minutes at most, or a few moments of a larger speech given by Obama taken out of context? Yeah, they're exactly the same. Mo-ron.

Talk about dumb "journalism."

294 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:23:57am

Expect to hear this refrain a lot today:

295 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:24:13am

re: #288 ggt

I've seen the flip side of knowledge and internet use from personal experience. It's called cherry picking information and relying on unsourced or crank sites for anecdotal information to avoid treatments that could be beneficial. Doctors and friends I've spoken with have said that some people will try to look stuff online and get completely misled or attempt self diagnoses with nothing but bad outcomes.

There are reasons that lawyers go to law school to practice law, and there's reasons that doctors go to med school to learn medicine. You don't go to a lawyer to get a medical diagnosis or to a doctor to get a legal opinion.

But that has to be balanced by being skeptical and asking the doctors questions - getting second opinions, and understanding that doctors are not infallible.

296 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:24:57am

Finally, somebody not waiting to get fired.

297 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:26:06am

re: #239 Obdicut

Lemme blow your mind, then, with simple words:

Buffalo, Buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo.

That's a coherent English sentence.

And at that it's a short version of the sentence. I've also seen this::

Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo.

[Bison from an upstate NY city that are intimidated by bison from the same city themselves intimidate bison from that city.]

Even longer versions are possible.

298 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:26:13am

re: #296 darthstar

Finally, somebody not waiting to get fired.

[Embedded content]

Hang on, that's T-Paw! I wonder if he had his son call Mitt to tell him he was leaving or if he did it himself.

299 Mr. Crankypants  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:26:24am

re: #284 lawhawk

Hey Chuck Todd:
70 minutes of Romney droning on about how he has no problem ignoring needs of half the nation missing a couple of minutes at most, or a few moments of a larger speech given by Obama taken out of context? Yeah, they're exactly the same. Mo-ron.

But if we admit they're not we won't have a horse race any more, even though we don't now.

300 erik_t  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:26:47am

re: #296 darthstar

Finally, somebody not waiting to get fired.

[Embedded content]

TPaw does tend to be the first rat to jump, doesn't he?

301 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:28:07am

re: #295 lawhawk

I've seen the flip side of knowledge and internet use from personal experience. It's called cherry picking information and relying on unsourced or crank sites for anecdotal information to avoid treatments that could be beneficial. Doctors and friends I've spoken with have said that some people will try to look stuff online and get completely misled or attempt self diagnoses with nothing but bad outcomes.

There are reasons that lawyers go to law school to practice law, and there's reasons that doctors go to med school to learn medicine. You don't go to a lawyer to get a medical diagnosis or to a doctor to get a legal opinion.

But that has to be balanced by being skeptical and asking the doctors questions - getting second opinions, and understanding that doctors are not infallible.

Another reason for Logic courses in high school-hah!

I agree, a person has to be grounded in empirical science. Yet, I talk to so many people who have no clue in simple biology. How can they communicate effectively with their doctor?

I mean, educated people who don't know the difference between ibuprophen and apsirin? Just look at the myriad of options available OTC at the drug store. Most are all the same drug or combination of drugs in different packaging.

I don't have a science background, but that doesn't mean the information is unobtainable.

302 dragonath  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:28:35am

re: #291 darthstar

[Embedded content]

That's... that's real?

Because he looks like a Oompa Loompa.

303 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:29:54am

re: #302 dragonath

That's... that's real?

Because he looks like a Oompa Loompa.

Now you've done it!

304 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:30:14am

re: #299 Mr. Crankypants

But if we admit they're not we won't have a horse race any more, even though we don't now.

The media will trip Obama if they have to to keep things within shouting distance. A blowout is not the "liberal media's dream", its their nightmare instead. A certain outcome to the election means people watching CSI instead of Chris Matthews.

305 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:30:21am

re: #302 dragonath

That's... that's real?

Because he looks like a Oompa Loompa.

I'm waiting to see if he's bleached out again in his next appearance. That would finally get some questions...maybe.

306 Gretchen G.Tiger  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:31:20am

The dogs agree. We all need our mid-morning nap.

Have a great one all!

308 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:32:28am

re: #306 ggt

The dogs agree. We all need our mid-morning nap.

Have a great one all!

My dogs want to go to the beach...damn. Enjoy your nap, I'm headed out for a run.

309 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:33:50am
310 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:33:56am

HOLY CRAP WTF?

311 Mr. Crankypants  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:34:40am

re: #304 Dark_Falcon

The media will trip Obama if they have to to keep things within shouting distance. A blowout is not the "liberal media's dream", its their nightmare instead. A certain outcome to the election means people watching CSI instead of Chris Matthews.

This is true. If the MSM was actually about journalism rather than the MBF and ratings this wouldn't even be a contest, or it would be because the GOP wouldn't be able to field an actual candidate.

312 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:36:07am

Link for PA oath requirement [Link: www.dmv.state.pa.us...]

313 Mr. Crankypants  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:37:13am

re: #306 ggt

The dogs agree. We all need our mid-morning nap.

Have a great one all!

Ours usually come and see me and bark until I go to bed, then jump up to cuddle.

314 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:38:12am

re: #312 Sheila Brovlofski

Link for PA oath requirement [Link: www.dmv.state.pa.us...]

Looks like SOP to me. If I need a Colorado ID I have to pay for it. Right now I have a license which of course also requires a fee. If people think everything is going to be free they're on the wrong planet.

315 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:39:02am

Morning Honcos.

316 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:39:57am

re: #314 Gus

All the best things in life are free*.
*plus shipping and handling

317 Mr. Crankypants  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:41:57am

re: #316 Cannadian Club Akbar

All the best things in life are free*.
*plus shipping and handling

Especially on ebay. Actually shipping is free but the items are overpriced.

318 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:42:25am

re: #316 Cannadian Club Akbar

All the best things in life are free*.
*plus shipping and handling

$13.50 is a poll tax!

Well it's free if you recite this oath!

That's against my beliefs!

319 Mr. Crankypants  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:43:22am

Well off to look at an assisted living community for my 95 year old father in law. He's still with it, but needs more help than we can give. Not a nursing home, more like an apartment with a very good super.

320 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:43:30am

re: #312 Sheila Brovlofski

Link for PA oath requirement [Link: www.dmv.state.pa.us...]

But it's a simple process...
:p

321 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:43:53am
322 Mr. Crankypants  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:44:00am

re: #320 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

But it's a simple process...
:p

Saw a story on this. Took the person 4 hours to get their ID.

323 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:45:08am

re: #322 Mr. Crankypants

Saw a story on this. Took the person 4 hours to get their ID.

Took me 4 hours to get my registration renewed.

Waiting 4 hours at the DMV is something new?

324 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:45:47am

re: #318 Gus

$13.50 is a poll tax!

Well it's free if you recite this oath!

That's against my beliefs!

Isn't the oath you essentially saying that you don't have an alternative ID you should use instead of trying to get a free one and avoid the $13.50 fee.

The fun stuff is the hoops if you don't have the SS card and the other supporting documents. (My SS# card is long gone - it got wet a few times when carried in a wallet and then disintegrated. Presumably one can get a new one issued, but I have other ID.)

325 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:45:59am

re: #322 Mr. Crankypants

Saw a story on this. Took the person 4 hours to get their ID.

My friend went to renew his DL in Florida. He was there 2 hours and he had an appointment.

326 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:46:28am

re: #324 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Isn't the oath you essentially saying that you don't have an alternative ID you should use instead of trying to get a free one and avoid the $13.50 fee.

The fun stuff is the hoops if you don't have the SS card and the other supporting documents. (My SS# card is long gone - it got wet a few times when carried in a wallet and then disintegrated. Presumably one can get a new one issued, but I have other ID.)

Yeah. Something like that. Doesn't look like anything unusual. Typical government work.

327 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:46:41am

re: #325 Cannadian Club Akbar

My friend went to renew his DL in Florida. He was there 2 hours and he had an appointment.

Outrage!

328 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:47:05am

re: #322 Mr. Crankypants

Saw a story on this. Took the person 4 hours to get their ID.

I see this and hear John Cleese's voice saying, "Stop it. You're not fooling anyone."

329 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:48:23am
330 Daniel Ballard  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:48:32am

re: #324 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Isn't the oath you essentially saying that you don't have an alternative ID you should use instead of trying to get a free one and avoid the $13.50 fee.

The fun stuff is the hoops if you don't have the SS card and the other supporting documents. (My SS# card is long gone - it got wet a few times when carried in a wallet and then disintegrated. Presumably one can get a new one issued, but I have other ID.)

We should be able to get (free for those on asst.) ss cards with our photo and biometric on them for things like applying for passport etc. ID for anywhere anytime. Like with EBT.

331 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:48:44am

re: #327 Gus

Outrage!

When I think of the DMV I think of Selma and Patty.

332 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:49:23am

re: #331 Cannadian Club Akbar

When I think of the DMV I think of Selma and Patty.

It should be free and instant!

Derp.

333 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:51:33am

re: #332 Gus

It should be free and instant!

Derp.

The Simpsons are free and instant on Hulu.

334 Decatur Deb  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:52:08am

re: #331 Cannadian Club Akbar

When I think of the DMV I think of Selma and Patty.

Like, synchronicity, man.
Minutes ago we heard from an old New Jersey friend who just got her license renewed. The clerk was making Pirate Day and Pi Day jokes with her.

Jokes at the NJDMV?, It's the Endtimes, man.

335 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:54:03am

re: #334 Decatur Deb

Like, synchronicity, man.
Minutes ago we heard from an old New Jersey friend who just got her license renewed. The clerk was making Pirate Day and Pi Day jokes with her.

Jokes at the NJDMV?, It's the Endtimes, man.

Ugh, been there done that. Might seem shocking to some people but sometimes you have to wait a long time at these place. Longest I ever waited at the NJ DMV was about 2 hours. The people behind the counters were the usual gruff bureaucrats.

336 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:54:37am

re: #334 Decatur Deb

Before 9/11 you could renew in the internets. Now in FLA they want your b/c, utility bills to prove your address, and they jacked the price by about 50%. That way the polis can say they didn't raise taxes.

337 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:55:11am

Libya moderates to protest powerful Islamic militias; Militia eyed in consulate attack plans counter demo

Moderate Libyan activists have organized a protest Friday in Benghazi, Libya, to demand that the well-armed Islamic militias which virtually run security in much of the country lay down their arms.

Friday is the Muslim holy day, and one of the most powerful militias in Benghazi has called their own protest to coincide with the so-called "Save Benghazi" rally.

Ansar al-Sharia - one of the groups U.S. officials say was likely involved in the attack on the consulate which left U.S. Ambassador Christopher Stevens dead - announced its own protest, "in defense of our prophet on Friday 21."

The prospect of both Ansar al-Sharia, with its conservative Muslim supporters and its well-stocked arsenal of weaponry, rallying on the same streets on the same day as groups calling for them to be disarmed and replaced by state security forces, presents an obvious risk of tension, and possible clashes.

338 FitzroyMcLean  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:55:57am

Gus, Obdicut not sure if you guys are still here but.....
Did either of you have muscle weakness as kids? My 6 year old has the hyper flexibility plus muscle weakness. No two doctors agree on diagnosis though.

339 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:58:24am

re: #338 FitzroyMcLean

Gus, Obdicut not sure if you guys are still here but.....
Did either of you have muscle weakness as kids? My 6 year old has the hyper flexibility plus muscle weakness. No two doctors agree on diagnosis though.

How bad is the muscle weakness?

340 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 7:58:59am

Ranting Elmo Returns and Is Arrested in Times Square

A man with a history of shouting anti-Semitic rants while dressed as Elmo at popular tourist destinations was arrested in his red costume in Times Square on Tuesday...

Image: 19elmo-blog480.jpg

341 Sionainn  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:00:05am

re: #310 Sheila Brovlofski

HOLY CRAP WTF?

[Embedded content]

Here's the affidavit I think that is referencing.

342 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:02:04am

As Pennsylvania’s strict voter ID law returns to the lower court for reconsideration, its original sponsor, Rep. Daryl Metcalfe (R-PA), told KDKA Radio Wednesday morning that his law will only disenfranchise “lazy” people, like the ones Mitt Romney was talking about in the leaked video of a private fundraiser.

When asked about the voter ID law’s disenfranchisement of the 750,000 Pennsylvanians who cannot get IDs, Metcalfe cited Romney’s offhand dismissal of the 47% of the country who will never “take personal responsibility and care for their lives” as proof that those people don’t deserve the right to vote:

HOST: Are you absolutely convinced…that the methods to implement this law are effective and will in fact make sure no legitimate voter will be disenfranchised?

METCALFE: I don’t believe any legitimate voter that actually wants to exercise that right and takes on the according responsiblity that goes with that right to secure their photo ID will be disenfranchised. As Mitt Romney said, 47% of the people that are living off the public dole, living off their neighbors’ hard work, and we have a lot of people out there that are too lazy to get up and get out there and get the ID they need. If individuals are too lazy, the state can’t fix that.

Read it here.

343 dragonath  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:02:35am

re: #318 Gus

$13.50 is a poll tax!

Well it's free if you recite this oath!

That's against my beliefs!

Sounds like PA. I believe they charge something like that to ex-POWs who want one of those "Veteran" license plates.

344 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:04:06am

Sad but true. If you want to vote you have to leave the house.

345 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:04:20am

re: #336 Cannadian Club Akbar

Before 9/11 you could renew in the internets. Now in FLA they want your b/c, utility bills to prove your address, and they jacked the price by about 50%. That way the polis can say they didn't raise taxes.

Well, Grover Norquist did publicly say that fee hikes did not violate his "no new taxes" pledge. So those who have taken the pledge often look to increase fees.

346 FitzroyMcLean  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:05:08am

re: #339 Gus

He has problems jumping and running, but walks fine and mostly gets around okay. I still have to help him climb (into cars, playground etc.) He would probably test at 3 years officially. No cognitive problems. Just muscular.

347 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:05:15am

re: #344 Gus

Sad but true. If you want to vote you have to leave the house.

I don't leave the house. I vote absentee. But I don't get an "I voted" sticker.

348 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:05:21am

re: #335 Gus

Ugh, been there done that. Might seem shocking to some people but sometimes you have to wait a long time at these place. Longest I ever waited at the NJ DMV was about 2 hours. The people behind the counters were the usual gruff bureaucrats.

I suspect that there are some really interesting feedback loops going on in these places. People go in expecting lines, waiting, hassles, etc. and thus often have attitude. Workers are there working a repetitive job, hearing the same issues and questions constantly, probably getting attitude, and probably often giving it back. Sort of a self-fulfilling grinder. (And Selma and Patty hit it fairly dead on.)

I can empathize with it to a degree due to seeing some of this in IT work. Same (stupid) user errors cropping up constantly*. And then one of the repeat offenders turns up.**

* - A complex cause. Lack of training, poor documentation, and also some laziness on the user's side. Along with being a process that they do not do very often and thus not learned by rote. And please do not get me started on password reset requests. ;)

** - And a few of the serial repeat offenders top things off by being no-holds barred Type A personalities. They want priority now! Until you ask for additional information and suddenly they don't have time to deal with it. Unfortunately it also seems to be a behavior set not uncommon to managerial types.

349 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:05:26am

re: #344 Gus

Sad but true. If you want to vote you have to leave the house.

That's discrimination! It's outrageous!!1

350 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:05:59am

re: #342 Sheila Brovlofski

[Embedded content]

BTW. That's a misquote. That's not exactly what he said.

351 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:06:33am

re: #350 Gus

BTW. That's a misquote. That's not exactly what he said.

Ari Berman is lying.

352 Decatur Deb  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:07:18am

Mainstream Catholic magazine goes after Ryan on his Ayn Rand fetish:

Secret Ryan Transcript: Social Security and Medicare are the Target

[Link: www.americamagazine.org...]

(lifted from Memorandum)

353 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:08:10am

re: #350 Gus

BTW. That's a misquote. That's not exactly what he said.

Is this link accurate?

354 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:09:22am

re: #345 Dark_Falcon

Well, Grover Norquist did publicly say that fee hikes did not violate his "no new taxes" pledge. So those who have taken the pledge often look to increase fees.

Of course Grover loves fees: they are, along with sales taxes, the ultimate regressive tax impacting the poor far far harder than the 1% which is, of course, his whole purpose in life.

355 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:09:23am

re: #353 Sheila Brovlofski

Is this link accurate?

Yes.

356 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:10:02am

Egypt Christian arrested, beaten over film: activists

Egyptian rights groups on Wednesday demanded the release of a Coptic Christian arrested on suspicion of posting an anti-Islam video online that ignited Muslim protests around the globe.

Police grabbed computer science graduate Alber Saber from his Cairo home last week after neighbors accused him of uploading sections of the film "Innocence of Muslims", rights activists said.

The neighbors also accused Saber, 27, of making a new movie that mocks all religions. He was jailed for 15 days pending investigations.

357 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:10:09am

Might have to tune into Rush the Hutt today, just to see if he makes anything of the Inspector General's report on Fast and Furious. The dittoheads seem to be waiting for him to give them the talking point they need to respond.

358 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:11:49am

Romney lying: Bad.
Me lying: Good

359 William Barnett-Lewis  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:11:59am

re: #344 Gus

Sad but true. If you want to vote you have to leave the house.

Perhaps where you live, but not according to the laws in Wisconsin. To be sure, the TP/GOP is doing everything they can to change that but elders and the disabled can have someone come to them, register them and then send them ballots by mail.

Soldiers would have a hard time leaving the fox hole to return and vote too, but we've seen how much the TP/GOP thinks of combat troops...

360 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:12:07am

How low can he go?

361 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:13:07am

re: #359 William Barnett-Lewis

Perhaps where you live, but not according to the laws in Wisconsin. To be sure, the TP/GOP is doing everything they can to change that but elders and the disabled can have someone come to them, register them and then send them ballots by mail.

Soldiers would have a hard time leaving the fox hole to return and vote too, but we've seen how much the TP/GOP thinks of combat troops...

That's always been true. Yes, the elderly, disabled veterans, etc., have a hard time getting around. Been that way for 1000s of years.

362 Gus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:13:28am

BBL

363 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:13:31am

re: #350 Gus

BTW. That's a misquote. That's not exactly what he said.

Yeah, I fell for that too. :-/ What he's saying is still not very nice, though.

364 wrenchwench  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:13:58am

re: #357 Targetpractice

Might have to tune into Rush the Hutt today, just to see if he makes anything of the Inspector General's report on Fast and Furious. The dittoheads seem to be waiting for him to give them the talking point they need to respond.

Buck's not waiting.

365 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:14:29am

re: #344 Gus

Sad but true. If you want to vote you have to leave the house.

You can vote by absentee ballot.

366 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:17:31am

re: #360 Mocking Jay

How low can he go?

[Embedded content]

He's heading into negative feedback loop territory. News says "Romney can't win," so voters start to believe it. Voters believe it and tell pollsters, who in turn publish their reports that say Romney's poll numbers in decline. News sees declining numbers and runs with them, ratcheting up declarations that Romney's toast. And so it goes.

367 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:18:03am

re: #364 wrenchwench

Buck's not waiting.

Have you ever seen Buck and Rush in the same room at the same time? Hmmm...

368 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:18:30am

Romney has five practice debates with Portman - loses all of them.

In fact, Romney, who recently did five mock debates in a 48-hour period to practice, has confided to advisers that it may be hard to win a debate because every attack against President Barack Obama will seem stale while the attacks on him will seem fresher and newsier to a hostile media.

Rule #1 - you're not supposed to lose to your sparring partner.
Rule #2 - you're not supposed to admit it.

Note to media: stop selling Mitt as an 'excellent debater' - you're making him more nervous than he already is.

369 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:20:12am

re: #368 darthstar

Romney has five practice debates with Portman - loses all of them.

[Embedded content]

Rule #1 - you're not supposed to lose to your sparring partner.
Rule #2 - you're not supposed to admit it.

Note to media: stop selling Mitt as an 'excellent debater' - you're making him more nervous than he already is.

The Obama team's trying to downplay the odds of a successful debate series, in the hopes of giving his slaughter of Willard more impact. Unfortunately, it looks like Willard is not helping matters.

370 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:20:14am

re: #366 Targetpractice

He's heading into negative feedback loop territory. News says "Romney can't win," so voters start to believe it. Voters believe it and tell pollsters, who in turn publish their reports that say Romney's poll numbers in decline. News sees declining numbers and runs with them, ratcheting up declarations that Romney's toast. And so it goes.

Until eventually some people start to think there's no need to turn out for Obama since he's a lock anyway...

371 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:20:52am

re: #370 Mocking Jay

Until eventually some people start to think there's no need to turn out for Obama since he's a lock anyway...

Ayep, that is the real danger, that overconfidence will breed apathy.

372 Decatur Deb  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:23:10am

re: #365 Sheila Brovlofski

You can vote by absentee ballot.

In Alabama that's usually more difficult than voting at the polls. Unless you show up at the courthouse for your ballot, you wind up mailing drivers license, etc, back-and-forth.

373 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:23:29am

re: #329 Gus

He's been seen in Central Park and elsewhere in Manhattan and has been arrested before. He also reportedly has been involved in Cambodian porn.

374 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:23:56am

re: #370 Mocking Jay

Until eventually some people start to think there's no need to turn out for Obama since he's a lock anyway...

This time, we're taking that confidence and applying it across the ticket...keeping the Senate and making a run for the House.

375 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:24:52am

This would never have happened under Steve Jobs.

376 Decatur Deb  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:24:54am

re: #371 Targetpractice

Ayep, that is the real danger, that overconfidence will breed apathy.

The Prez spoke to local GOTV leaders via videolink a couple nights ago. They anticipated 2000-4000 sign-ons, got 6000. Our people are really sort of pissed right now.

377 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:25:15am
378 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:25:31am

re: #335 Gus

I got my license renewed earlier this year, and the wait was about an hour - mostly the wait before the location opened. Once it did, it was about 20 minutes inside to do the paperwork and wait for the license to be printed. Pretty easy.

My initial license and vehicle registration took even shorter than that.

The limited location hours play into the length of the wait at the MVC locations in NJ.

379 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:27:49am

Good morning lizards!

380 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:28:05am

Even the Times is beating Apple up over this.

381 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:28:19am
382 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:28:29am

re: #376 Decatur Deb

The Prez spoke to local GOTV leaders via videolink a couple nights ago. They anticipated 2000-4000 sign-ons, got 6000. Our people are really sort of pissed right now.

Yeah, I've heard reporters that Dem enthusiasm has been soaring since the convention. Romney's missteps are no doubt just adding fuel to the fire. We have to keep that going, while hoping that the downturn in the polls is damning enthusiasm on the other side of the aisle.

383 Decatur Deb  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:28:38am

re: #379 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards!

It's New Jersey DMV Day at LGF.

384 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:29:24am

re: #368 darthstar

Naw - it's all about setting expectations. This way if Mitt holds his own, it counts as a big win. But, if Obama wipes the walls with him, then Mitt can say that he did better than expected.

Fact is that Obama should destroy him on the health care and foreign policy aspects - most notably on turning his back on Romneycare and deciding that Obamacare has to be repealed in its entirety, even though the programs are largely the same, and that the GOP pursued an individual mandate for personal responsibility and now claim that it's unconstitutional.

385 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:31:03am

re: #377 Lidane

All of this just goes to show that the G.O.P. should have nominated Gingrich. #ThingsNobodyHasEverSaid

ThingsOnlyNewtGingrichHasEverSaid

386 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:32:10am

re: #384 lawhawk

Naw - it's all about setting expectations. This way if Mitt holds his own, it counts as a big win. But, if Obama wipes the walls with him, then Mitt can say that he did better than expected.

Fact is that Obama should destroy him on the health care and foreign policy aspects - most notably on turning his back on Romneycare and deciding that Obamacare has to be repealed in its entirety, even though the programs are largely the same, and that the GOP pursued an individual mandate for personal responsibility and now claim that it's unconstitutional.

Seriously, at this point, I'm not sure there's anywhere that Willard has left to turn in the debates. He's run such a vague campaign that if pressed to offer examples of how he's different from Obama, he can only offer empty platitudes about how just his being in office will cause the economy to jump back into line.

387 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:32:24am

WORTHLESS LAZY PARASITES (Oh wait)

388 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:33:44am

re: #375 Mocking Jay

Apparently the iPhone map now shows Brooklyn NY in Manhattan and vice versa in searches. /fuhgeddaboutit!

389 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:35:31am

re: #386 Targetpractice

Or he'll claim that he can create 12 million jobs, even though the experts expect that many jobs to be created 2013-2018 regardless of who is in the WH beginning in 2013.

390 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:35:52am

re: #388 lawhawk

Apparently the iPhone map now shows Brooklyn NY in Manhattan and vice versa in searches. /fuhgeddaboutit!

I fully admit to being an Apple hater. Probably to an irrational degree. But here is one of the reasons for that. Not so much that they added Apple Maps, but they got rid of Google Maps. Their anti-competitive nature gets under my skin.

391 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:36:49am

re: #389 lawhawk

Or he'll claim that he can create 12 million jobs, even though the experts expect that many jobs to be created 2013-2018 regardless of who is in the WH beginning in 2013.

Yeah, he seems to be clinging to that one tenaciously, because it's technically true.

392 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:37:30am

re: #383 Decatur Deb

It's New Jersey DMV Day at LGF.

I'm glad I don't have to deal with that. I have a Va license.

393 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:38:03am
394 simoom  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:38:08am

re: #352 Decatur Deb

Mainstream Catholic magazine goes after Ryan on his Ayn Rand fetish:

Secret Ryan Transcript: Social Security and Medicare are the Target

[Link: www.americamagazine.org...]

(lifted from Memorandum)

Here's the mp3 audio they're transcribing (~20min):

A lot of objectivist jargon in his speech (ex: "Social Security right now is a collectivist system, it’s a welfare transfer system" ... "get the individual back in the game and break the back of this collectivist philosophy").

395 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:38:34am

If you haven't watched this yet you need to click it.

396 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:41:13am

re: #386 Targetpractice

Seriously, at this point, I'm not sure there's anywhere that Willard has left to turn in the debates. He's run such a vague campaign that if pressed to offer examples of how he's different from Obama, he can only offer empty platitudes about how just his being in office will cause the economy to jump back into line.

And Obama will nail him to the wall in a debate by asking him to utter some specifics instead of vague platitudes - and also audibly wonder why such information could not have been offered earlier even if Mitt does. The last I expect to not be likely since Mitt would fear how poorly trying to go technical during a debate would make him look. Though I think Obama could do some detail work and present it if called upon to do so.

397 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:42:59am

re: #393 Lidane

Alabama GOP chair promotes birther movie that claims Obama's concealing his true father bit.ly/PL5jvV

— Right Wing Watch (@RightWingWatch) September 20, 2012

Darth Vader?

398 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:43:31am

re: #397 Eventual Carrion

Darth Vader?

The Force is strong with him.

399 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:43:34am

OMG, your campaign got blown up by Jimmy Carter's grandson! Oh the humanity!

400 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:45:46am

re: #399 lawhawk

OMG, your campaign got blown up by Jimmy Carter's grandson! Oh the humanity!

That's a bit like having a farmboy blow up your planet-destroying battlestation, is it not?

401 ReamWorks SKG  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:46:20am

I like Ben Folds' sometime bassist (and fellow Bösendorfer artist) Ryan Lerman:

402 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:46:37am

re: #399 lawhawk

OMG, your campaign got blown up by Jimmy Carter's grandson! Oh the humanity!

He actually said "Oh the Habitat for Humanity!", which is even better.

403 Decatur Deb  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:47:21am

re: #393 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Nate Silver has Alabama at 100.0% likelihood for Romney. There is a certain freedom when things get as bad as they can get. Today I turned down a local Dem organizer who invited me to a speech by Roy Moore's opponent, told her all my time and money is going into FL GOTV.

404 ReamWorks SKG  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:48:05am

It's hard for me to like anything associated with Jimmy Carter, but we can't hold kids responsible for the sins of their fathers. And I always had a soft spot for Amy.

405 abolitionist  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:49:09am

re: #392 NJDhockeyfan

I'm glad I don't have to deal with that. I have a Va license.

My local DMV (in VA) stopped issuing DL's over the counter a while back. They now have holograms and digitally encoded data, and have to be mailed to you.

406 Decatur Deb  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:50:52am

re: #405 abolitionist

My local DMV (in VA) stopped issuing DL's over the counter a while back. They now have holograms and digitally encoded data, and have to be mailed to you.

Wow. Does Obi Wan appear and tell the state trooper you are not the speeder he is looking for?

407 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:50:57am

re: #405 abolitionist

My local DMV (in VA) stopped issuing DL's over the counter a while back. They now have holograms and digitally encoded data, and have to be mailed to you.

Yeah, I was glad that I didn't have to wait in line when I had to renew my ID this July. Real convenient.

408 dragonath  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:51:19am

re: #381 Eventual Carrion

That story tickles me.

The best part? The guy's name is Adam Sandler.

409 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:51:28am

re: #405 abolitionist

My local DMV (in VA) stopped issuing DL's over the counter a while back. They now have holograms and digitally encoded data, and have to be mailed to you.

I haven't gotten one in a while. I still have the old style license.

410 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:51:33am
411 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:51:44am

re: #408 dragonath

The best part? The guy's name is Adam Sandler.

That's not his real name.

412 ReamWorks SKG  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:52:07am

You can now register to vote in California over the web. Click click and you're done. You don't even have to type in a SS# or DL# (I went through the entire form with everything but the final submit to see.)

I'd register my cats, but I suspect they'll vote for Romney. They like the idea of tying dogs to the tops of cars.

413 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:52:21am
414 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:53:12am

Hahahahaha...not a chance in hell:

Considering how the GOP machine fought against Kay Bailey Hutchison tooth and nail when she ran against Goodhair, there's no way they'd roll over and let Crazy Uncle Liberty become governor.

415 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:53:16am

re: #405 abolitionist

My local DMV (in VA) stopped issuing DL's over the counter a while back. They now have holograms and digitally encoded data, and have to be mailed to you.

Cool. Can Skynet read it at every intersection so they can be sure you are on the straight and narrow? And if you deviate I bet they send out a terminator to set you back on the correct path. All this and they STILL can't get me a serviceable jet-pack.

416 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:54:10am

Yikes!

Man accused of emailing ESPN about killing children is charged

Prosecutors on Wednesday charged a Valencia man, who is accused of sending emails that made references to killing children and to "The Dark Knight" movie theater shooting in Colorado, with possession of an illegal weapon.

Eric Ting Yee, 21, who appeared briefly in San Fernando Courthouse on Wednesday afternoon, had his arraignment postponed until next month. Meanwhile, Court Commissioner Martin R. Gladstein reduced Yee's bail to $100,000 even though the Los Angeles County district attorney's office had argued the nature of the threats warranted a $2-million bail.

Eric Ting Yee's father, Roger Manfoo Yee, 62, faces the same charge of illegal possession of an H&K M-94 assault weapon. He has not been arrested and did not appear in court.

Eric Ting Yee is accused of sending emails with threats against children to an ESPN website. Yee was connected to a residence in the 23000 block of Edenton Place, which overlooks Santa Clarita Elementary and Arroyo Seco Junior High, authorities said.

417 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:56:09am

re: #415 Eventual Carrion

Cool. Can Skynet read it at every intersection so they can be sure you are on the straight and narrow? And if you deviate I bet they send out a terminator to set you back on the correct path. All this and they STILL can't get me a serviceable jet-pack.

I got a ticket for not stopping on a red light even thought it was a right turn on red. They sent me pictures of it and a link to the video.

Bastards.

418 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:57:17am

re: #414 Lidane

Hahahahaha...not a chance in hell:

[Embedded content]

Considering how the GOP machine fought against Kay Bailey Hutchison tooth and nail when she ran against Goodhair, there's no way they'd roll over and let Crazy Uncle Liberty become governor.

Seriously, Alex Jones thinks Luap Nor has a serious chance at the governor's mansion? How, by promising all the stoners free pot if he wins?

419 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:57:47am

More cartoons due later this month
German Magazine Wades into Muhammad Affair

Germany's leading satire magazine Titanic is likewise jumping into the fray with an Islam issue of its own, set for publication later this month. The cover story imagines what it might look like if Germany's embattled former first lady, Bettina Wulff, were to make a Muhammad film of her own. Many are concerned that the publication could make Germany even more of a target of Muslim anger than it already is.

.....

In light of the decision to move ahead with a cover story on Islam, SPIEGEL ONLINE spoke with Titanic Editor-in-Chief Leo Fischer about satire and the fine line between humor and right-wing propaganda.

Full interview at link

420 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:58:54am
421 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:59:22am

re: #417 NJDhockeyfan

I got a ticket for not stopping on a red light even thought it was a right turn on red. They sent me pictures of it and a link to the video.

Bastards.

A lot of those showing up on Pittsburgh city streets. Not up here in horse and buggy land where I am, I'm glad to say.

422 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 8:59:35am

Abandon ship!

423 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:00:50am

re: #422 Mocking Jay

Abandon ship!

[Embedded content]

Wingnut firing squad! Heh:

424 Varek Raith  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:00:59am

Who turned off summer???

425 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:01:25am

re: #424 Varek Raith

Who turned off summer???

Shut up! It might hear you and come back!

426 ReamWorks SKG  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:02:36am

Ok! It's 9:00! I need to go to work and support the 47%. Let's hope for a nice, peaceful news day!

427 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:02:46am

re: #424 Varek Raith

Who turned off summer???

We're cold and grey here today too. I like fall, my favorite season

428 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:02:50am

re: #421 Eventual Carrion

A lot of those showing up on Pittsburgh city streets. Not up here in horse and buggy land where I am, I'm glad to say.

What goes "clop, clop, clop, bang, bang, bang, clop, clop, clop"? Amish drive by shooting.:)

429 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:03:02am

re: #417 NJDhockeyfan

I got a ticket for not stopping on a red light even thought it was a right turn on red. They sent me pictures of it and a link to the video.

Bastards.

Aren't you still supposed to stop, though?

430 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:03:57am

The outrageous Mo'toons with English translations
Mohammed Cartoons - English Captions

431 abolitionist  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:04:09am

re: #406 Decatur Deb

Wow. Does Obi Wan appear and tell the state trooper you are not the speeder he is looking for?

Not quite. The last time I was issued a speeding ticket, I got to court, came before the judge, and the officer testified that the equipment he'd used to clock me might not have been accurate, because it was re-calibrated shortly after. So the case was dismissed.

I was polite when the county officer stopped me about 4am. He'd already tailed me a couple miles. I'd explained that I was picking up a friend to take him to work, and said "Thank you, sir" when he handed me the ticket.

432 Varek Raith  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:04:29am

re: #429 Mocking Jay

Aren't you still supposed to stop, though?

Yes.

433 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:04:46am

re: #422 Mocking Jay

Abandon ship!

[Embedded content]

Yeah, I heard Pawlenty jumped ship today. Wonder if he had a "TPaw 2016" sticker on the back of his limo as he made his get-away.

434 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:06:36am

re: #429 Mocking Jay

Aren't you still supposed to stop, though?

I slowed down to a crawl. A cop told me I had to stop completely. I've been driving for over 30 years and never got a ticket for that before.

435 abolitionist  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:06:58am

re: #417 NJDhockeyfan

I got a ticket for not stopping on a red light even thought it was a right turn on red. They sent me pictures of it and a link to the video.

Bastards.

I believe you are still obligated to stop at red lights, right-turn-on-red or not.

436 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:07:25am

Redskin's fans are nutbars.
[Link: www.washingtontimes.com...]

437 romans828  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:07:28am

great song! just what I needed today.

i keep that poem attributed to Mother Teresa on the wall of my office.

there has been a debate going on for years about Ben Folds and his agnosticism. it is at least possible that he was inspired by the Mother Teresa poem...

438 Varek Raith  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:08:29am

re: #436 Cannadian Club Akbar

Redskin's fans are nutbars.
[Link: www.washingtontimes.com...]

Eagle's fans.
Your argument is invalid.
/

439 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:08:36am

re: #430 Killgore Trout

The outrageous Mo'toons with English translations
Mohammed Cartoons - English Captions

They are insulting Bug Bunny!

440 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:09:13am

re: #438 Varek Raith

Eagle's fans.
Your argument is invalid.
/

Eagle fan need medication.

441 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:09:39am

re: #424 Varek Raith

Who turned off summer???

Gaia

442 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:11:20am

re: #439 NJDhockeyfan

They are insulting Bug Bunny!

Outrage!

443 romans828  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:11:56am

i remember taking civics. now there are folks who can't name the three branches of government. or even know that there are three branches of government. Or have no idea how bills become law. Bring back "I'm just a Bill" from Schoolhouse Rock!

444 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:12:01am

Ugh, they're doing sidewalk repair outside. I get to listen to jackhammers all day.

445 Varek Raith  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:12:05am

re: #430 Killgore Trout

The outrageous Mo'toons with English translations
Mohammed Cartoons - English Captions

And they're not even funny.
Satire fail.

446 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:12:28am

Oh brother.

447 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:13:07am

re: #446 Mocking Jay

Oh brother.

[Embedded content]

"More specifically creating wealth for me and my buddies. The rest of you people are SOL."

448 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:13:16am

re: #445 Varek Raith

And they're not even funny.
Satire fail.

Yeah, The "film critic" one is the only one that's even remotely funny.

449 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:13:18am

re: #445 Varek Raith

And they're not even funny.
Satire fail.

Maybe that is why they are protesting. They want to read some real humor.
//

450 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:13:31am

Neat-o.
[Link: www.reuters.com...]

451 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:14:25am

re: #434 NJDhockeyfan

I slowed down to a crawl. A cop told me I had to stop completely. I've been driving for over 30 years and never got a ticket for that before.

Ah, the famous "rolling stop". They don't usually fine you for that, but they can if they feel like it.

As far as I'm concerned, they can let that one go. The drivers I wish they'd catch and punish are the ones who pull into an intersection when there's no room on the other side, so that they end up in the middle of the intersection, blocking traffic, when the light changes.

You get a different perspective on poor driving behavior when you've ridden in an ambulance carrying one of your children to the emergency room.

452 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:15:16am

re: #424 Varek Raith

Who turned off summer???

Dale Gribble: I say let the world warm up. We'll grow oranges in Alaska.
Hank Hill: Dale, you giblet-head, we live in Texas. It's already 110 in the summer, and if it gets one degree hotter I'm gonna kick your ass!

453 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:15:35am

re: #443 romans828

i remember taking civics. now there are folks who can't name the three branches of government. or even know that there are three branches of government. Or have no idea how bills become law. Bring back "I'm just a Bill" from Schoolhouse Rock!

And when people think of the first amendment they think freedom of speech and can't name the other 4 freedoms given.

454 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:15:55am

Tim Kaine is apparently having a bout of stupidity:

WTF.

455 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:16:26am

re: #451 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

Ah, the famous "rolling stop". They don't usually fine you for that, but they can if they feel like it.

As far as I'm concerned, they can let that one go. The drivers I wish they'd catch and punish are the ones who pull into an intersection when there's no room on the other side, so that they end up in the middle of the intersection, blocking traffic, when the light changes.

You get a different perspective on poor driving behavior when you've ridden in an ambulance carrying one of your children to the emergency room.

They should spend more time pulling over these kids texting and driving. I see it everyday.

456 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:16:50am

re: #454 Lidane

Tim Kaine is apparently having a bout of stupidity:

[Embedded content]

WTF.

*facepalm*

You're taking a lead in the polls, your opponent's party is on the skids, and you pick NOW to put your head up your own ass?!

Damnit, Kaine!

457 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:16:56am

re: #455 NJDhockeyfan

They should spend more time pulling over these kids texting and driving. I see it everyday.

That's illegal where I live.

458 blueraven  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:17:10am

re: #449 NJDhockeyfan

Maybe that is why they are protesting. They want to read some real humor.
//

They are not funny, they are not insightful in any way. So what is the point here?

459 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:17:28am

re: #446 Mocking Jay

Wait, so all of Mitt's calls to adjust the tax rates and tax brackets, as well as adjusting incentives, credits, exemptions, and deductions, aren't redistributing wealth?

Gotcha.

460 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:17:32am

re: #457 Cannadian Club Akbar

That's illegal where I live.

So is talking w/o a hands free device.

461 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:18:29am

re: #456 Targetpractice

*facepalm*

You're taking a lead in the polls, your opponent's party is on the skids, and you pick NOW to put your head up your own ass?!

Damnit, Kaine!

They opened a trap and he fell right into it. What a moron.

462 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:18:42am

re: #459 lawhawk

Wait, so all of Mitt's calls to adjust the tax rates and tax brackets, as well as adjusting incentives, credits, exemptions, and deductions, aren't redistributing wealth?

Gotcha.

That's the "creating wealth" bit. Or, more like finding it. As in "I can't believe we've raked in so much money. Wherever could it have come from?" while the poor and middle class are wondering why their taxes went up so suddenly.

463 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:20:49am

re: #458 blueraven

They are not funny, they are not insightful in any way. So what is the point here?

Those are cartoons that aren't funny at all, that's all. I don't see any reason for weeks of protests and violence.

464 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:21:09am
465 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:21:23am

re: #338 FitzroyMcLean

Gus, Obdicut not sure if you guys are still here but.....
Did either of you have muscle weakness as kids? My 6 year old has the hyper flexibility plus muscle weakness. No two doctors agree on diagnosis though.

I was a scrawny kid, but I don't think it was muscle weakness.

466 Mocking Jay  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:22:02am

re: #461 Lidane

They opened a trap and he fell right into it. What a moron.

Textbook unforced error.

468 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:23:42am

Geez, I thought I had a reason to be pissed when my house was broken into.
[Link: www.nbclosangeles.com...]

469 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:25:36am

re: #443 romans828

i remember taking civics. now there are folks who can't name the three branches of government. or even know that there are three branches of government. Or have no idea how bills become law. Bring back "I'm just a Bill" from Schoolhouse Rock!

To this day, the only reason I can recite the Preamble to the Constitution from memory is because of School House Rock.

470 romans828  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:25:47am

re: #453 Cannadian Club Akbar

freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, freedom to petition the government?

i associate the phrase "four freedoms" with FDR

471 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:27:09am

re: #446 Mocking Jay

Oh brother.

I am running for president to get us creating wealth again – not to redistribute it.
— Mitt Romney (@MittRomney) September 20, 2012

And that is a large part of the problem MittHead. We need to be creating products and services, not moving money around to produce wealth for the leisure/trust fund crowd.

472 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:27:13am

re: #470 romans828

freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, freedom to petition the government?

i associate the phrase "four freedoms" with FDR

Freedom of association along with assembly, speech, press and religion.

473 romans828  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:28:03am

re: #469 Our Precious Bodily Fluids

same here! I just have to remember to include "of the United States" after We the People... why they left that out of the song I'll never know.

474 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:28:55am

Kaine just destroyed his chances. What a fucking moron.

475 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:30:52am

re: #474 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Kaine just destroyed his chances. What a fucking moron.

The question is "Why?" Did he really think he was gonna win over more voters than he was gonna lose by trying to tempt Republicans with talk of getting the "takers" to pay more?

476 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:33:34am

Italian Study Shows Male Genitalia Is Shrinking
[Link: philadelphia.cbslocal.com...]
D'oh!!!

477 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:34:03am

re: #475 Targetpractice

It really is the natural outgrowth of the Randian philosophy that's taken over the GOP. They've become the party of complete Objectivist selfishness, combined with hyperreligiosity. It's the logical conclusion of the myth they perpetuate about how stuff is fair already and we don't need to help any groups or level the playing field at all.

478 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:34:20am

re: #475 Targetpractice

The question is "Why?" Did he really think he was gonna win over more voters than he was gonna lose by trying to tempt Republicans with talk of getting the "takers" to pay more?

Yep, nothing like following up being told you are worthless because of your lack of money then being told they want to take more of what you don't have to make you worth less.

479 Lidane  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:34:34am

re: #475 Targetpractice

The question is "Why?" Did he really think he was gonna win over more voters than he was gonna lose by trying to tempt Republicans with talk of getting the "takers" to pay more?

I have no idea, but he really needs to see a doctor. Sudden onset stupidity like that must be a sign of a larger problem.

Fucking moron. Allen's going to wrap that minimum income tax on the "takers" around his neck like an albatross, and frankly, Kaine deserves it. It's a stupid idea that should die a quick, painful death.

480 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:34:41am

re: #476 Cannadian Club Akbar

Italian Study Shows Male Genitalia Is Shrinking
[Link: philadelphia.cbslocal.com...]
D'oh!!!

It's just cold, honest! Let me turn up the thermostat!

//

481 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:35:45am

re: #476 Cannadian Club Akbar

Italian Study Shows Male Genitalia Is Shrinking
[Link: philadelphia.cbslocal.com...]
D'oh!!!

Depends what is on Skinamax and how cold the temperature is.

482 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:36:21am

re: #480 Targetpractice

It's just cold, honest! Let me turn up the thermostat!

//

"I was in the pool!"

483 Shropshire_Slasher  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:36:27am

I was in the pool!

484 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:36:50am

re: #479 Lidane

I have no idea, but he really needs to see a doctor. Sudden onset stupidity like that must be a sign of a larger problem.

Fucking moron. Allen's going to wrap that minimum income tax on the "takers" around his neck like an albatross, and frankly, Kaine deserves it. It's a stupid idea that should die a quick, painful death.

He spends most of the race in a virtual tie, then finally opens up a lead in the final weeks...just to blow it like that.

Fuck it, he deserves to lose after this.

485 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:36:56am

re: #480 Targetpractice

It's just cold, honest! Let me turn up the thermostat!

//

It was shrinkage!!
-George Costanza

486 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:40:58am

Iran lied? Shocka!

Iran admits it deceived the West over nuclear program

Iran deliberately provided false information about its nuclear program to Western investigators and the International Atomic Energy Agency, a senior Iranian official has confirmed.

In an interview published in the London-based daily Al-Hayat on Thursday, Iranian Vice President Fereydoon Abbasi-Davani, who is also the head of the Atomic Energy Organization of Iran (AEOI), said that misleading facts were used to protect his country’s nuclear program and to disguise some of the technical advances it has made.

He did not elaborate on what specific part of the program was lied about. Israel and much of the West believe Tehran has covered up efforts to build a nuclear weapon.

“Sometimes we pretended to be weaker than we really were, and sometimes we showed strength that was not really in our hands,” Abbasi-Davani said in the interview. “We had no choice.”

487 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:41:25am

No Mo'toons allowed on Facebook

French cartoon censored by Facebook

Facebook has censored the page of a French news magazine after it posted one of the controversial cartoons of the Prophet Mohammed.

Le Point magazine says that on Wednesday evening it had posted one of the two cartoons published by the satirical weekly Charlie Hebdo, alongside a link to a story on its website.

The magazine says less than an hour later the post was deleted by Facebook and the account of Le Point's administrator blocked for 72 hours for content in violation of Facebook regulations.

488 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:45:41am

Grenade explodes on football pitch – video

Players in a local derby in the Iranian city of Isfahan were lucky to avoid serious injury. One of the players came across an object on the pitch and threw it away – it turned out to be a grenade and exploded upon landing.

489 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:46:39am

Father Of Pakistan's Nukes Enters Politics

The man known as the father of Pakistan's nuclear weapons program, Abdul Qadeer Kahn, is a national hero in Pakistan — and a villain in much of the West.

Now, the controversial scientist is trying his hand at politics at the age of 76.

In the U.S., Khan is best known for selling nuclear technology to nations such as North Korea and Iran. In 2004, at the urging of the U.S., Pakistan placed Khan under house arrest. But in 2009, he was freed.

Khurshid Zaman, Khan's chief campaign adviser, says Khan wants to end what he sees as Pakistan's downward spiral and target young voters. Khan calls his movement Tehreek Tahafuz Pakistan, which loosely translates as "Save Pakistan."

490 BongCrodny  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:46:46am

re: #445 Varek Raith

And they're not even funny.
Satire fail.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

I looked at those and I thought "What the hell am I missing? These are AWFUL."

491 Amory Blaine  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:49:24am

f**k the poor

492 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:50:15am

This should get interesting....

Monica's revenge: Lewinsky 'to publish secret love letters to Clinton revealing his insatiable desire for threesomes and how he trashed Hillary'

Monica Lewinsky is reportedly set to write a tell-all book about her affair with Bill Clinton - including her intimate love letters to the ex-president and how he had an insatiable desire for threesomes.

The former White House intern, 39, reportedly wants revenge on Clinton, who she believes escaped unscathed while she has never been able to shake the disgrace of their Oval Office trysts.

Friends claim publishers are scrambling to get their hands on the book, and after holding meetings, she has learned she could get as much a $12 million if she recounts every tawdry detail.

While she has not yet secured a book deal, her apparent attempts to cash in on the affair could rattle the Clinton marriage - and wreck Hillary's bid for the presidency in 2016.

493 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:51:39am

re: #492 NJDhockeyfan

This should get interesting....

Monica's revenge: Lewinsky 'to publish secret love letters to Clinton revealing his insatiable desire for threesomes and how he trashed Hillary'

And people wonder why "tell-all" books have such a bad reputation.

494 engineer cat  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:52:36am

rassmussen has gone from giving mitt a one point lead yesterday to showing obama ahead by two today

495 Amory Blaine  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:53:22am

re: #443 romans828

i remember taking civics. now there are folks who can't name the three branches of government. or even know that there are three branches of government. Or have no idea how bills become law. Bring back "I'm just a Bill" from Schoolhouse Rock!

ALEC Rock

496 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:53:24am

re: #492 NJDhockeyfan

This should get interesting....

Monica's revenge: Lewinsky 'to publish secret love letters to Clinton revealing his insatiable desire for threesomes and how he trashed Hillary'

Ugh. I don't care what people do with their private lives. Consenting adult do stuff. I guess Bill might be kind of a jerk but I really hate these chicks who get involved and then can't keep their mouths shut.

497 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:53:38am

re: #474 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Kaine just destroyed his chances. What a fucking moron.

Sigh what the hell was he thinking. Really, if this means six years of George Allen in the senate that's going to really piss me off because I want that as much as I want four years of Romney.

498 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:53:42am

re: #493 Targetpractice

And people wonder why "tell-all" books have such a bad reputation.

She is going to make a shitload of cash off that book.

499 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:53:47am

re: #492 NJDhockeyfan

I wonder if she made copies of the letters she sent.

500 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:54:12am

re: #494 engineer cat

rassmussen has gone from giving mitt a one point lead yesterday to showing obama ahead by two today

And the SS Romney takes on more water, with experts wondering how much longer the stress goes on before the keel gives way.

501 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:54:58am

re: #499 Cannadian Club Akbar

I wonder if she made copies of the letters she sent.

Maybe...

The book will also include never-before-seen love letters that she wrote to the president - some of which were so intimate she never sent them, another friend added.

502 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:56:01am

re: #496 Killgore Trout

Yet another chick who doesn't know when to shutty.
/
[Link: www.radaronline.com...]

503 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:56:36am

re: #477 Obdicut

It really is the natural outgrowth of the Randian philosophy that's taken over the GOP. They've become the party of complete Objectivist selfishness, combined with hyperreligiosity. It's the logical conclusion of the myth they perpetuate about how stuff is fair already and we don't need to help any groups or level the playing field at all.

Don't those two intersect in a Venn Diagram under the term "we are the Elect"?

504 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:56:49am

re: #502 Cannadian Club Akbar

Yet another chick who doesn't know when to shutty.
/
[Link: www.radaronline.com...]

I still have no clue why she's famous.

505 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:57:18am

re: #502 Cannadian Club Akbar

Yet another chick who doesn't know when to shutty.
/
[Link: www.radaronline.com...]

Paris Hilton commenting on other people's promiscuity. There's a word for that.

506 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:57:37am

re: #498 NJDhockeyfan

She is going to make a shitload of cash off that book.

Hence why "tell-all" books generally get met with derision.

507 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:57:54am

re: #505 HappyWarrior

Paris Hilton commenting on other people's promiscuity. There's a word for that.

It's like goldy or bronzy, only it's made of iron.

508 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:57:59am

re: #505 HappyWarrior

Paris Hilton commenting on other people's promiscuity. There's a word for that.

Whore? "Cause when I think of her that's what I think.
/not

509 b_sharp  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:58:23am

re: #504 Killgore Trout

I still have no clue why she's famous.

She gives presidential head.

510 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:58:32am

re: #507 Targetpractice

It's like goldy or bronzy, only it's made of iron.

Tea pot?

511 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:58:56am

re: #509 reflections of a redneck

She gives presidential head.

Suite ;)

512 Petero1818  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:59:03am

re: #496 Killgore Trout

Ugh. I don't care what people do with their private lives. Consenting adult do stuff. I guess Bill might be kind of a jerk but I really hate these chicks who get involved and then can't keep their mouths shut.

You know, normally I would agree. I like Clinton a lot but I don't begrudge her this deal. 12 million to tell her story. She has a lifetime to live down what this scandal did to her. She didn't leak it. She has gone a long time without talking about it. She handled herself pretty admirably while the whole thing went down and in the aftermath. She was awfully young and made a mistake that I suspect many young women would have made in her position. Going through life with this history can't be easy and she is the only person that really paid a price for it. Tough economy to find a job without a history like that. Take the money.

513 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 9:59:10am

I don't think this is going to do much good but worth a try. They are protesting because they hate us.

514 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:00:15am

re: #513 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

I don't think this is going to do much good but worth a try. They are protesting because they hate us.

There are many who do believe that the US government sanctioned the video. It's worth an effort.

515 b_sharp  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:00:19am

re: #512 Petero1818

You know, normally I would agree. I like Clinton a lot but I don't begrudge her this deal. 12 million to tell her story. She has a lifetime to live down what this scandal did to her. She didn't leak it. She has gone a long time without talking about it. She handled herself pretty admirably while the whole thing went down and in the aftermath. She was awfully young and made a mistake that I suspect many young women would have made in her position. Going through life with this history can't be easy and she is the only person that really paid a price for it. Tough economy to find a job without a history like that. Take the money.

I'm sure when the book is done she'll break out the Cubans.

516 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:00:32am

re: #500 Targetpractice

And the SS Romney takes on more water, with experts wondering how much longer the stress goes on before the keel gives way.

How soon until the Good Ship Obama puts a Mark 48 into the water to finish it off?

517 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:00:34am

re: #512 Petero1818

You know, normally I would agree. I like Clinton a lot but I don't begrudge her this deal. 12 million to tell her story. She has a lifetime to live down what this scandal did to her. She didn't leak it. She has gone a long time without talking about it. She handled herself pretty admirably while the whole thing went down and in the aftermath. She was awfully young and made a mistake that I suspect many young women would have made in her position. Going through life with this history can't be easy and she is the only person that really paid a price for it. Tough economy to find a job without a history like that. Take the money.

The best thing to come out of that whole thing was John Goodman playing Linda Tripp on SNL.

518 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:01:05am

re: #517 Cannadian Club Akbar

The best thing to come out of that whole thing was John Goodman playing Linda Tripp on SNL.

Ha, good old John Goodman.

519 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:01:56am

re: #516 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

How soon until the Good Ship Obama puts a Mark 48 into the water to finish it off?

"The suspense is terrible...I hope it will last."

520 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:01:56am

re: #514 HappyWarrior

There are many who do believe that the US government sanctioned the video. It's worth an effort.

Those are the same people who never seen it. They are protesting because they were told to do it. I hope this thins the crowd but I wouldn't bet on it.

521 Kragar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:02:58am
522 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:03:23am

re: #520 NJDhockeyfan

Those are the same people who never seen it. They are protesting because they were told to do it. I hope this thins the crowd but I wouldn't bet on it.

Oh, so just humans being humans. Like the picketing I saw in the village I lived in in northern New York State when "Life of Brian" was released.

523 gwangung  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:04:41am

re: #514 HappyWarrior

There are many who do believe that the US government sanctioned the video. It's worth an effort.

Yeah, not gonna affect the hardcore reactionaries, but worth it to nibble away at the edges. (Besides the fact that it's part of diplomacy's job to do that...)

524 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:04:51am

re: #522 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Oh, so just humans being humans. Like the picketing I saw in the village I lived in in northern New York State when "Life of Brian" was released.

They really should just look on the bright side of life.

/

525 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:04:54am

re: #522 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Oh, so just humans being humans. Like the picketing I saw in the village I lived in in northern New York State when "Life of Brian" was released.

Did they set fire to any buildings back then?

526 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:04:57am

Girls beat up Iran cleric over dress code

The cleric said he asked "politely," but the girl's angry reaction and some pugilistic double-teaming with her friend landed the holy man in the hospital, according to an account Monday in the semiofficial Mehr News Agency.

Hojatoleslam Ali Beheshti said he encountered the girls on his way to the mosque in the village of Shahmirzad for noon prayers in late August.

He told one of the girls to cover up, the report said.

"She responded by telling me to cover my eyes, which was very insulting to me," Beheshti said. So he asked her a second time to cover up and also to put a lid on what he felt was verbal abuse.

She hit the man of the cloth, and he hit the ground.

"I don't remember what happened after that," he said. "I just felt her kicks and heard her insults."

527 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:05:25am

re: #524 Targetpractice

They really should just look on the bright side of life.

/

Well played, sir.

528 Kragar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:05:26am

Club For Growth To ‘Mixed Bag’ Romney: You’re On Your Own

If Romney hoped well-heeled conservative advocates would come running to his rescue after his remarks about the poor and middle class sent his campaign into a tailspin, he’ll have to look elsewhere.

His right-leaning campaign hasn’t convinced conservatives that he’s one of them, according to Club for Growth president Chris Chocola.

“This may sound strange, but we’re doing nothing to improve his odds,” Chocola said Thursday in Washington at a breakfast roundtable hosted by the Christian Science Monitor. “We’re not really involved in the presidential race. … We didn’t make an endorsement in the Republican primary process, not because we didn’t want to but because there wasn’t a candidate that we thought we could recommend to our members.”

529 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:06:29am

re: #526 Killgore Trout

Girls beat up Iran cleric over dress code

And now the other clerics point and laugh....

530 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:06:47am

re: #523 gwangung

Yeah, not gonna affect the hardcore reactionaries, but worth it to nibble away at the edges. (Besides the fact that it's part of diplomacy's job to do that...)

Right. That's what I'm thinking.

531 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:06:48am

re: #525 NJDhockeyfan

Did they set fire to any buildings back then?

Catholics. They just tried to make everyone feel guilty about living.
:p

532 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:07:12am

re: #531 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Catholics. They just tried to make everyone feel guilty about living.
:p

Wouldn't be Catholics without the guilt.

533 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:07:47am

re: #531 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Catholics. They just tried to make everyone feel guilty about living.
:p

I went to a Catholic wedding one week.

534 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:08:11am

re: #529 Cannadian Club Akbar

And now the other clerics point and laugh....

Iranian women are not to be trifled with. They were brilliant, brave and on the front line in the last uprising a few years ago. I look forward to the next one.

535 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:08:17am

re: #532 HappyWarrior

Wouldn't be Catholics without the guilt.

Come for the wine, stay for the guilt.

536 Kragar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:08:48am

Paul Ryan To House Republicans: This Is A ‘Choice’ Election And We Will Win

The House budget chief vowed that the efforts he and his Republican have undertaken since taking over the chamber last year will elevate the Romney-Ryan ticket in the remaining weeks. But the consequence of all those controversial votes, Ryan suggested to GOP members, is that the election will be a choice between two different visions for the country. That’s a far cry from the referendum on President Obama’s leadership that Republicans had hoped to make the election about.

“We are going to win this thing,” Ryan assured them, according to a Republican aide in the room. “This is going to be an up and down race. Three polls came out that have us within one point. They are going to try to distract us.”

“They will try to make this about little things. We have taken all the tough votes and led,” he told House colleagues in the private meeting. “Here’s our commitment: we are going to make this about the big things. We need to go on offense and we need to give our constituents the choice of two futures.”

The fact they're having to switch now to calling it a choice election means they have failed completely with their initial strategy of this being all about Obama's failure.

537 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:08:55am

re: #535 Targetpractice

Come for the wine, stay for the guilt.

Members in good standing get Jesus cookie too.

538 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:09:14am

re: #522 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Oh, so just humans being humans. Like the picketing I saw in the village I lived in in northern New York State when "Life of Brian" was released.

I was going to a Baptist high school when Life of Brian was released(no Catholic high school in our town, so my parents thought this would be a good substitute). When I wen to the theater to see it with my brother, all my classmates and teachers were out front protesting the film as sacrilegious. When they saw me, they said, "Hey! You made it! We're so happy you'd join us for the protest!" I told them, sorry, but I was actually there to see the movie...that was the start of a very long year on the wrong side of the teachers and administrators for this 15 year old Catholic boy.

539 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:09:46am

re: #535 Targetpractice

Come for the wine, stay for the guilt.

I'm a recovering Catholic - I've been guilt free for 25 years.

540 b_sharp  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:10:07am

re: #526 Killgore Trout

Girls beat up Iran cleric over dress code

I can understand the girls' emotions at being told what to do, especially since it was an attempt at oppression, but I don't think beating the man was acceptable. They need to learn appropriate responses.

'Man of the cloth'? What difference does that make, is striking a man of the cloth somehow worse than striking any other person?

541 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:10:33am

re: #526 Killgore Trout

Girls beat up Iran cleric over dress code

You see? A simple, devout mullah doing his religious duty becomes the victim of westernized feminist agression!

542 Cannadian Club Akbar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:10:44am

re: #538 darthstar

Serves you right, hippie!!!
/

543 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:10:50am

4 Pinocchios for a truncated, 14-year-old Obama clip
Outrageous fact checking conspiracy!

544 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:10:54am

re: #536 Kragar

Paul Ryan To House Republicans: This Is A ‘Choice’ Election And We Will Win

The fact they're having to switch now to calling it a choice election means they have failed completely with their initial strategy of this being all about Obama's failure.

When your VP candidate has to have a closed-door meeting to shore up support, you're in deep shit.

545 b_sharp  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:11:28am

re: #525 NJDhockeyfan

Did they set fire to any buildings back then?

How many buildings have been torched in the US since the '60s?

546 NJDhockeyfan  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:11:51am

re: #538 darthstar

I was going to a Baptist high school when Life of Brian was released(no Catholic high school in our town, so my parents thought this would be a good substitute). When I wen to the theater to see it with my brother, all my classmates and teachers were out front protesting the film as sacrilegious. When they saw me, they said, "Hey! You made it! We're so happy you'd join us for the protest!" I told them, sorry, but I was actually there to see the movie...that was the start of a very long year on the wrong side of the teachers and administrators for this 15 year old Catholic boy.

I saw it with some friends of mine. There weren't any protesters there and we laughed like hell during the movie.

547 SpaceJesus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:12:44am

In which Free Republic endorses the killing of children in Afghanistan

[Link: www.freerepublic.com...]

To: EGPWS

Why don’t I care anymore?

A stray puppy followed me home once. It was cute and I wanted to keep it. My mother said no honey, you can’t have that puppy because it has a terrible habit - growing up to be a dog.

Not the fault of the puppy, of course. But she was right. A pit bull puppy is pretty darn cute, but they are deadly as a mature dog.

8 posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 8:50:10 AM by KittenClaws (You may have to fight a battle more than once in order to win it." - Margaret Thatcher)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: barryobi

Present and future islamsists should be past islamists. Their age, sex or conditon doesn’t matter to me as long as they’re dead.

7 posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 8:46:13 AM by onedoug
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

...

...you can’t fight nice and hope to win wars.
Well put.

There are still too many -- mostly Dem -- politicians who just don't get that.


12 posted on Thursday, September 20, 2012 12:09:19 PM by TChris ("Hello", the politician lied.)

548 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:13:06am

re: #522 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

Oh, so just humans being humans. Like the picketing I saw in the village I lived in in northern New York State when "Life of Brian" was released.

When that movie first came out I thought "Wow that's so offensive!" but after seeing it I thought "Wow that's so offensive but it's the second most offensive/funniest movie of all time!"

549 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:13:37am

re: #547 SpaceJesus

In which Free Republic endorses the killing of children in Afghanistan

[Link: www.freerepublic.com...]

....

...

These are the people I remember in high school during the lead up to the Iraq War who thought nuking Iraq was a swell idea.

550 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:13:59am

re: #540 reflections of a redneck

I can understand the girls' emotions at being told what to do, especially since it was an attempt at oppression, but I don't think beating the man was acceptable. They need to learn appropriate responses.

'Man of the cloth'? What difference does that make, is striking a man of the cloth somehow worse than striking any other person?

This is a little different. Iran is a theocracy and the clerics do actually control what women can wear. The girls have no legal recourse. Making the cleric think twice about enforcing his will on others is just about the only thing they can do.

551 Kragar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:14:15am

re: #544 Targetpractice

When your VP candidate has to have a closed-door meeting to shore up support, you're in deep shit.

Dramatic reenactment:

552 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:14:20am

After two days of good polls in the swing states for Obama, what does Matt Drudge headline with? Gallup's 7-day poll showing the race tied again, a poll that was being roundly rebuked a week ago when it was showing Obama serious momentum in the wake of the conventions.

553 Obdicut  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:14:39am

re: #545 reflections of a redneck

How many buildings have been torched in the US since the '60s?

Lots and lots of black churches.

[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]

554 b_sharp  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:14:56am

re: #548 Sheila Brovlofski

When that movie first came out I thought "Wow that's so offensive!" but after seeing it I thought "Wow that's so offensive but it's the second most offensive/funniest movie of all time!"

Which is the most offensive?

555 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:15:14am

re: #550 Killgore Trout

This is a little different. Iran is a theocracy and the clerics do actually control what women can wear. The girls have no legal recourse. Making the cleric think twice about enforcing his will on others is just about the only thing they can do.

And of course, the local press will make the mullah out to be a victim and a hero for doing his religious duty and falling prey to westernized feminism...

556 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:15:16am

re: #499 Cannadian Club Akbar

I wonder if she made copies of the letters she sent.

She kept a 'soiled' dress around for quite awhile.

557 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:15:27am

re: #554 reflections of a redneck

Which is the most offensive?

BLAZING SADDLES! (Also the funniest. movie. of. all. time.)

558 SpaceJesus  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:15:48am

re: #549 HappyWarrior

except these guys are all pushing 70, are lonely, and will have heart attacks the night Obama wins reelection.

559 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:16:11am

re: #558 SpaceJesus

except these guys are all pushing 70, are lonely, and will have heart attacks the night Obama wins reelection.

Yeah. Was talking about the mindset of course.

560 b_sharp  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:16:42am

re: #550 Killgore Trout

This is a little different. Iran is a theocracy and the clerics do actually control what women can wear. The girls have no legal recourse. Making the cleric think twice about enforcing his will on others is just about the only thing they can do.

What did you do with the real Kilgore Trout? The version who routinely complains about OWS?

561 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:17:11am

re: #548 Sheila Brovlofski

When that movie first came out I thought "Wow that's so offensive!" but after seeing it I thought "Wow that's so offensive but it's the second most offensive/funniest movie of all time!"

It was offensive if you wanted to be offended. What it mainly skewered was human behavior and groups in terms of how they handled religion and politics. As such it was a brilliant satire with some bizarre slapstick mixed in.

562 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:17:15am

re: #557 Sheila Brovlofski

BLAZING SADDLES! (Also the funniest. movie. of. all. time.)

A movie that has provided so many good lines for describing this election. Like the one Obama no doubt consoles himself when thinking of the Romney campaign:

"Ooh baby, you are so talented ...and they are so dumb."

563 Charles Johnson  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:17:59am

Meanwhile this morning, our old friend Buck decided it would be a good idea to post an Islamophobic right wing screed about evil Muslims by an associate of the Pamela Geller-Robert Spencer crowd.

That page is now deleted and I'm seriously considering doing the same to Buck's account. I haven't worked this hard to turn LGF around just to have morons come in and spew the same old hateful crap again.

564 Kragar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:19:10am

With all the remakes, reboots, and repackaging of 80s movies, I'm suprised none of them have gotten around to "The Last Starfighter". Hell, you could actually make a straight up sequel and just pick up 25 years later, with the same character now as the leader of the Starfighters and the rebuilt legion.

565 b_sharp  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:19:19am

re: #553 Obdicut

Lots and lots of black churches.

[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]

So torching buildings and destroying property is a common way of expressing ideology.

I take it that the group the arsonists belong to is important in determining the level of evil in the action.

566 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:19:50am

re: #562 Targetpractice

A movie that has provided so many good lines for describing this election. Like the one Obama no doubt consoles himself when thinking of the Romney campaign:

"Ooh baby, you are so talented ...and they are so dumb."

Heh, I remember when Mel Brooks was being given an award at the Kennedy center or something, Obama mentioned that he had seen Blazing Saddles when he was a kid and Mel asked how he was able to do that since Obama was under 18 at the time. Pres remarked that he sneaked in. Love that movie. Probably Mel's best and that's saying something because Young Frankenstein and my personal favorite, The Producers are both fine films too.

567 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:20:07am

re: #563 Charles Johnson

Meanwhile this morning, our old friend Buck decided it would be a good idea to post an Islamophobic right wing screed about evil Muslims by an associate of the Pamela Geller-Robert Spencer crowd.

That page is now deleted and I'm seriously considering doing the same to Buck's account. I haven't worked this hard to turn LGF around just to have morons come in and spew the same old hateful crap again.

Eh, let him live. He's like rwmofo, someone to get a chuckle out of from time to time.

568 Decatur Deb  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:20:29am

re: #553 Obdicut

Lots and lots of black churches.

[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]

And a hundred or so PP/abortion clinics. Perhaps by some of the same people.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

569 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:20:44am

re: #564 Kragar

With all the remakes, reboots, and repackaging of 80s movies, I'm suprised none of them have gotten around to "The Last Starfighter". Hell, you could actually make a straight up sequel and just pick up 25 years later, with the same character now as the leader of the Starfighters and the rebuilt legion.

According to Wiki, a sequel to it's been in development hell since '08.

570 b_sharp  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:20:55am

re: #557 Sheila Brovlofski

BLAZING SADDLES! (Also the funniest. movie. of. all. time.)

Blazing Saddles was brilliant satire.
This piece of shit anti-Islam movie is just offensive.

571 Killgore Trout  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:21:54am

How an 'Innocence of Muslims' Lawsuit Could Impact Hollywood (Analysis)

"Typically, a producer has the right to edit footage and leave an actor's performance on the cutting room floor," says David Stern, an attorney at Jeffer Mangels Butler & Mitchell. "Nearly all acting agreements grant such rights to the producer and, further, bar the actor from seeking injunctive relief to stop the distribution and exhibition of a film. Even SAG acting agreements confer these rights to the producer. There is no duty to explain to an actor the political or societal implications of a project. In many films directed by Woody Allen, the actor does not get to see any portion of the script other than the actor's lines."

Other attorneys in Hollywood agree.

"Her best claim is false light because she agreed to perform a certain role and then her image was used for something else that damaged her," says Bryan Sullivan at Early Sullivan Wright Gizer & McRae. "But it depends on what the contract says because the rights granted in them are typically broad and don’t give the actors much input."

572 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:21:55am

re: #561 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

It was offensive if you wanted to be offended. What it mainly skewered was human behavior and groups in terms of how they handled religion and politics. As such it was a brilliant satire with some bizarre slapstick mixed in.

Comedy walks a fine line. Something can be totally offensive but people are forgiving as long as it's funny as hell. If it's lame then there is nothing to remember except how offensive it is.

573 Kragar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:22:25am

re: #569 Targetpractice

According to Wiki, a sequel to it's been in development hell since '08.

Maybe it can come out with the next Buckaroo Banzai.

574 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:22:37am

re: #564 Kragar

With all the remakes, reboots, and repackaging of 80s movies, I'm suprised none of them have gotten around to "The Last Starfighter". Hell, you could actually make a straight up sequel and just pick up 25 years later, with the same character now as the leader of the Starfighters and the rebuilt legion.

Good movie. Wouldn't be the same without Robert Preston, though.

575 darthstar  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:22:39am

re: #545 reflections of a redneck

How many buildings have been torched in the US since the '60s?

Not counting churches, synagogues, and women's health clinics?

576 Targetpractice  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:23:47am

re: #574 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

Good movie. Wouldn't be the same without Robert Preston, though.

Agreed, a sequel or remake just wouldn't work without Centauri.

577 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:24:06am

re: #570 reflections of a redneck

Blazing Saddles was brilliant satire.
This piece of shit anti-Islam movie is just offensive.

The Charlie Hebdo cartoons are just offensive and lame, and that NSFW cartoon from "The Onion" was also stupid and lame.

578 b_sharp  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:24:29am

re: #563 Charles Johnson

Meanwhile this morning, our old friend Buck decided it would be a good idea to post an Islamophobic right wing screed about evil Muslims by an associate of the Pamela Geller-Robert Spencer crowd.

That page is now deleted and I'm seriously considering doing the same to Buck's account. I haven't worked this hard to turn LGF around just to have morons come in and spew the same old hateful crap again.

I think letting the air out of Buck's head was enough for now. It's not likely any of us would let his simple-minded wingnut bs stand uncontested.

579 wrenchwench  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:25:22am

re: #567 Targetpractice

Eh, let him live. He's like rwmofo, someone to get a chuckle out of from time to time.

I disagree, but I have to admit the last comment I made to him was 'lol'.

He can be quite offensive, and extremely annoying, beside arguing dishonestly and looking stupid.

Posting a Page like what Charles described would be the bannable offense, though.

580 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:25:23am

re: #574 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

Good movie. Wouldn't be the same without Robert Preston, though.

You just liked it because he turned out to be a Lizard...

;P

581 AK-47%  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:25:35am

I even googled up TIoM just to see what there was of it before it gets taken down for whatever reason...and yes, it is an execrable piece of shit designed to incite hatred and resentment.

From that point of view, it is highly successful.

And the fact that he raised $5 million to put this turd together is a feat worty of May Byalistok of The Producers

582 Eventual Carrion  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:25:51am

re: #545 reflections of a redneck

How many buildings have been torched in the US since the '60s?

Quite a few. Team championship celebrations, Rodney King, just bored mayhem, etc.

583 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:26:54am

Ack. Someone posted a picture of a local schoolbus after a collision with a piece of construction machinery. It was about a mile from my house, right near my kids' high school.

Of course, I had to go to the local news to get the info that nobody was hurt, except for the schoolbus driver, because the bus was empty.

That was not a pleasant five minutes.

Now I'm wondering if I should call my friend the schoolbus driver.

[Link: www.oregonlive.com...]

584 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:27:57am

re: #580 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste

You just liked it because he turned out to be a Lizard...

;P

I also liked the part where Grig shows off his family photo: "my Wife-oid, and six thousand little grig-lets."

585 HappyWarrior  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:28:08am

re: #581 47 turn it up to 11

I even googled up TIoM just to see what there was of it before it gets taken down for whatever reason...and yes, it is an execrable piece of shit designed to incite hatred and resentment.

From that point of view, it is highly successful.

And the fact that he raised $5 million to put this turd together is a feat worty of May Byalistok of The Producers

I wonder if he slept with as many little old ladies as Max had to.

586 lawhawk  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:35:05am

re: #575 darthstar

There were around 45 hate crimes identified as arson for 2010. That can include attacks against places of worship under the FBI uniform reporting statistics (no data available for 2011 or 2012 as yet).

For the same year 2010, there were 56,825 arsons reported by participating agencies.

587 Sheila Broflovski  Thu, Sep 20, 2012 10:36:54am

re: #585 HappyWarrior

I wonder if he slept with as many little old ladies as Max had to.

100 little old ladies?


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Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT
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