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Dealing with issues
LGF • Views: 27,471

We’re still having some growing pains with the new servers. I’ve identified some MySQL queries that are causing problems, and they’re all in the LGF Pages index — that code is old and needs some refactoring. So until that can be done, I’ve closed the LGF Pages index (the page you get to by clicking the “LGF Pages” button at top right). You can still post Pages, view individual Pages, and use the LGF Pages Dashboard; just the index is closed.

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268 comments
1 darthstar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:20:10pm

Venn Diagram

Image: 546899_10100159609303518_859538488_n.jpg

2 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:21:57pm

Third instance of voter registration dumping found in Virginia

A third instance of fraudulent voter registration has been uncovered in the important swing state of Virginia, where a Republican consultant has been arrested and thousands of discarded voter registration forms were recovered from a dumpster earlier this week. According to the Not Larry Sabato blog, a law student at James Madison University registered to vote on campus, but found when she tried to verify the change online, found that her form had never been submitted.

On Thursday, Raw Story reported that 31-year-old Colin Small, a Republican operative employed by Pinpoint, a firm contracted by Republican Party of Virginia, was arrested and charged with “four counts of destruction of voter registration applications, eight counts of disclosure of voter registration application, and one count of obstruction of justice” for throwing active voter registration forms into a dumpster.

Not Larry Sabato blogger Ben Trippett wrote that 2 to 3 weeks ago, a woman, identified only by her first name, Lucy, attempted to update her voter registration at a table on the campus of James Madison University.

“She stopped to fill out a voter registration form to change her voting address from her parents house in Fairfax to her dorm address in Harrisonburg so she could vote in person on election day,” wrote Trippett. ”On Wednesday night Lucy went online to check her voter registration status and found out she had not been registered in Harrisonburg- meaning whoever was collecting her form on campus had not turned it in.”

3 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:25:11pm

re: #2 Kragar

Third instance of voter registration dumping found in Virginia

This is getting very interesting.

4 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:27:39pm

re: #2 Kragar

Third instance of voter registration dumping found in Virginia

Clearly if we'd asked for Lucy's ID, there would not have been a problem.

/

5 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:28:08pm

And I hope that "mistranslation" error in Maricopa County, AZ seriously motivates and galvanizes the Hispanic voters to get out and throw the bums out who were behind it.

6 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:29:41pm

Republicans Disavow Man Nabbed In Voter Form Destruction

A staffing agency called Pinpoint was paying Small for his work on behalf of the Republican Party of Virginia. Republican Party of Virginia chair Pat Mullins issued a statement to WWBT in Richmond that Small was fired after the allegations were brought to the party’s attention.

Small was originally hired by Pinpoint to work for Strategic Allied Consulting, a firm run by an Arizona-based Republican political consultant named Nathan Sproul. The RNC fired Strategic Allied Consulting in late September after Florida investigators began looking into potentially fraudulent voter registration forms in the state.

David Leibowitz, a spokesman for Sproul, downplayed the connection in an interview with TPM and said company officials hoped Small was prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

“When this person was hired by Strategic, he was trained on how to do the job,” Leibowitz said. “He was educated on how to obey the law. If he followed the training, if he followed the education he was provided, he wouldn’t have gotten arrested.”

Leibowitz said it was unfair to blame Sproul or his company for Small’s conduct.

“Let’s say that I’m working at McDonald’s, I’m a manager at McDonald’s. I hire employees, I’m the manager of McDonald’s, I get fired. A few days later, or three weeks later when I no longer manage the McDonald’s, one of the employees goes out and robs the cash register. Am I connected to the employee who robbed the cash register? I mean I guess, circumstantially there’s some small connection, but you can’t hold me accountable for his conduct. That’s ridiculous,” Leibowitz said.

7 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:30:11pm
8 Stinky Beaumont  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:31:55pm

It's looking like the LGF Pages index is going to have to be completely redesigned.

It may end up looking a lot like the current LGF front page.

9 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:32:01pm

re: #4 erik_t

Clearly if we'd asked for Lucy's ID, there would not have been a problem.

/

All she'd do would be hold the ID out, then pull it away when you tried to get a good look.

/Peanuts

10 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:34:33pm

re: #7 Gus

Snicker:

Image: $(KGrHqN,!iEE4q!F,yDGBONCLq6EOQ~~0_35.JPG

11 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:35:24pm

Fraudulent 'vote-by-phone' calls reported in Florida, Virginia

Florida voters head to the polls in just a few weeks and there are reports fraudsters are already trying stop some registered voters from casting their ballots.

"The purpose of these calls is to confuse voters," said Darden Rice, Pinellas County League of Women Voters.

Rice says they are concerned about phone calls made to Florida voters. The callers reportedly said a new law was passed and you can now vote by phone. They also claimed to have the voter’s name, address and party affiliation.

"Voters cannot vote by phone, not in any state, so if you get a call like this, it's fraudulent and please report it immediately,” said Rice."Try to get the name and number and organization of the person calling you or do a *69 to call them back to get their phone number.”

The "Vote-by-Phone" calls have been reported in Miami-Dade County and in Virginia. A non-partisan voter advocate group called the Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights says it’s investigating and set-up a voter fraud hotline, 1-866-OUR-VOTE.

12 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:35:43pm

Haha, love it. I'm getting this ad here in Wisconsin:

[Link: pagead2.googlesyndication.com...]

Anyone who actually watched the debate saw Tommy acting like an angry, drunk grandpa. Oh yeah, they also watched him get booed by the audience when he shouted "STOP INTERRUPTING ME, JOE BIDEN!!!!"

13 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:36:27pm

re: #8 Stinky Beaumont

I think that will be an improvement. Consistent is good right? Oh and Stinky, if you ever get to my neighborhood the beer is on me.

14 freetoken  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:37:06pm

Finally, able to get to LGF. My isp has been playing dumb all day, claiming LGF doesn't exist.

15 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:39:10pm
16 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:39:23pm

re: #14 freetoken

Finally, able to get to LGF. My isp has been playing dumb all day, claiming LGF doesn't exist.

LGF is like a dinosaur skeleton, as it tests the faith of the true believers.
/

17 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:40:40pm

Problem is that some of the techniques I used when I first coded the LGF Pages index were fine as long as that database table wasn't too large -- but it's grown a LOT, and now queries that worked almost instantly are bogging down the whole system.

We'll get it fixed.

18 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:41:07pm

re: #15 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

I'm sure you'll get a lot of updings.

19 MittDoesNotCompute  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:41:49pm

re: #15 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

If you're trying to compete with Gus' "bumper stickers", please don't.

IMO, you're coming off flat and uninspired...just like your candidate.

20 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:42:43pm

Meanwhile, Romnesia.

21 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:43:21pm

re: #15 Dark_Falcon

You've got enough time today to randomly post campaign images, so maybe you could answer a long-standing question.

You preach the dire need for defense procurement reform while supporting a candidate who argues for defense spending as a 4% floor (his emphasis) of GDP rather than on the basis of mission need.

You keep ducking this. I'd still like to know how you reconcile this apparent hypocrisy.

22 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:43:22pm

Hahaha!

But the most head-turning Romney endorsement has to be from the New York Observer, which is nothing if not in touch with the pulse of trendy Manhattan.


--Powerline

23 MittDoesNotCompute  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:44:03pm

re: #21 erik_t

You've got enough time today to randomly post campaign images, so maybe you could answer a long-standing question.

You preach the dire need for defense procurement reform while supporting a candidate who argues for defense spending as a 4% floor (his emphasis) of GDP rather than on the basis of mission need.

You keep ducking this. I'd still like to know how you reconcile this apparent hypocrisy.

Good luck with that...

24 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:44:15pm

re: #17 Charles Johnson

Problem is that some of the techniques I used when I first coded the LGF Pages index were fine as long as that database table wasn't too large -- but it's grown a LOT, and now queries that worked almost instantly are bogging down the whole system.

We'll get it fixed.

So you're saying bubble sort wasn't the best-scaling idea...

25 garhighway  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:44:16pm

Dark, it's a cute image. It's a shame there's no intellectual content behind it, though.

I'd really like to hear the argument for Romney once all of the lies and straw men are stripped out.

26 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:44:53pm

re: #21 erik_t

You've got enough time today to randomly post campaign images, so maybe you could answer a long-standing question.

You preach the dire need for defense procurement reform while supporting a candidate who argues for defense spending as a 4% floor (his emphasis) of GDP rather than on the basis of mission need.

You keep ducking this. I'd still like to know how you reconcile this apparent hypocrisy.

It's all about supporting the team at all costs.

27 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:45:24pm

re: #24 erik_t

So you're saying bubble sort wasn't the best-scaling idea...

I once wrote a recursive quick-sort algorithm in 68000 assembly language.

/random synapse firing

28 freetoken  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:45:41pm

National Review publishes a classic case of derp:

Human Exceptionalism

[...]

Human induced climate change is scientifically controversial, particularly since there has been no statistically significant warming in the last 16 years and some of the computer models that alarmists used to try and panic the population have proved wrong. [...]

[...] Young Earth Creationism is religion, I agree, but my colleagues at the Discovery Institute are pursuing a heterodox scientific theory of intelligent design. It may be incorrect, but it isn’t anti science to hypothesize and investigate it. Indeed–as just one example–fellows at the DI predicted early on that “junk DNA” wasn’t ”junk,” for which they were ridiculed by some. Yet, so it isn’t.

The author is ignoring, or totally oblivious, to why ID isn't science.

And once again, we see the anti-climatology stance aligned with the anti-biology position of the creationist.

29 Obdicut  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:45:44pm

re: #22 Gus

New York Observer is the paper for the rich, according to itself. It claims the average net worth of its readers is above a million bucks. So, yeah. They endorsed Romney. Big fucking surprise there.

30 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:47:24pm

re: #29 Obdicut

New York Observer is the paper for the rich, according to itself. It claims the average net worth of its readers is above a million bucks. So, yeah. They endorsed Romney. Big fucking surprise there.

Currently owned by Donald Trump's son in law. Anyway. It's a tiny paper that most people don't even know exist. It's kind of like getting and endorsement from the San Fransisco Bay Guardian.

31 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:47:47pm

Since shutting down the Pages index, we're running much better.

32 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:48:03pm

re: #18 Gus

I'm sure you'll get a lot of updings.

I knew I'd get downdinged, but I felt some pushback was needed.

33 garhighway  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:48:20pm

Charles:

I'm still having some weirdness with the site that I wonder if you can help me understand. I see two main symptoms:

1. For me, the "Reply" and "quote" buttons don't work, and
2. If I try to up- or down-ding, or click the aggregate score of a post, I get tossed all the way back to the front page.

I'm accessing your site from a computer at work that is a Wyse device that connects to servers running IE8.

Is there something I can do to fix this?

34 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:48:20pm

re: #32 Dark_Falcon

I knew I'd get downdinged, but I felt some pushback was needed.

Pushback?

35 Obdicut  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:48:30pm

re: #30 Gus

Now if Romney got endorsed by the Bay Guardian, that'd be a story.

36 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:48:47pm
37 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:48:49pm

Number Of Gun Dealers Increased By 3000 Under Obama

An analysis by The Associated Press of data tracking the health of the gun industry shows that sales are on the rise, so much so that some gun manufacturers can’t make enough weapons fast enough. Major gun company stock prices are up. The number of federally licensed, retail gun dealers is increasing for the first time in nearly 20 years. . . . The poor economy, fear of crime and military veterans returning from war who want to keep their shooting skills sharp also may be driving some gun sales. But the general view of analysts and those in the industry is that Obama is the main catalyst.

“The driver is President Obama. He’s the best thing that ever happened to the firearm industry,” said Jim Barrett, an industry analyst at C.L. King & Associates Inc. in New York. . . . For the first time since 1993, the number of federally licensed retail gun dealers in the U.S. increased slightly in 2010 and 2011, as the country added 1,167 more licensed retail gun dealers, according to Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives records. After the assault weapons ban in 1994, the number of gun dealerships dropped annually until 2010. As of October 2012, there were 50,812 retail gun dealers – that’s 3,303 more than in 2009.

38 Obdicut  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:49:01pm

re: #32 Dark_Falcon

I knew I'd get downdinged, but I felt some pushback was needed.

How about actually engaging with people asking serious policy questions, like the above one about Romney's stance on defense spending?

39 A Mom Anon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:49:13pm

re: #25 garhighway

I've been asking him for well over a month and he won't deal. I just want to know why I should vote for Romney. In simple terms,how will he make healthcare more affordable,create well paying jobs,improve education and in general help the middle class become properous again. He can't answer it.

40 Sionainn  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:50:18pm

re: #15 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

Another case of wishful thinking.

41 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:50:22pm

re: #33 garhighway

Charles:

I'm still having some weirdness with the site that I wonder if you can help me understand. I see two main symptoms:

1. For me, the "Reply" and "quote" buttons don't work, and
2. If I try to up- or down-ding, or click the aggregate score of a post, I get tossed all the way back to the front page.

I'm accessing your site from a computer at work that is a Wyse device that connects to servers running IE8.

Is there something I can do to fix this?

It sounds like your work system is blocking Javascript. Those functions rely on Javascript, and if it's blocked that's what happens.

Nothing I can do from my end - you could try contacting your IT department and asking about it.

42 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:51:35pm

re: #36 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

Doughy Douche pantload makes a funny on Benghazi.

43 A Mom Anon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:06pm

re: #34 Gus

Again with the team sports attitude from DF. This isn't a damned game.

44 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:11pm

re: #34 Gus

Pushback?

Neener, sir. And again I say, neener.

45 blueraven  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:14pm

re: #36 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

WTF?

46 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:27pm

re: #37 Kragar

Number Of Gun Dealers Increased By 3000 Under Obama

A cunning trap to lull us into a false sense of security...

47 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:29pm

re: #39 A Mom Anon

I've been asking him for well over a month and he won't deal. I just want to know why I should vote for Romney. In simple terms,how will he make healthcare more affordable,create well paying jobs,improve education and in general help the middle class become properous again. He can't answer it.

My impression is that it doesn't matter. Obama is not the candidate of the GOP, therefore Romney. It's reflexive and is not involving much in the way of thought and introspection. I'd make as much progress asking the cat to explain why it likes chicken.

48 Sionainn  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:31pm

re: #27 Charles Johnson

I once wrote a recursive quick-sort algorithm in 68000 assembly language.

/random synapse firing

Hunh?

49 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:40pm

re: #32 Dark_Falcon

I knew I'd get downdinged, but I felt some pushback was needed.

That's not "pushback" Pushback would be if you had a snazzy graphic that had some kind of policy comparison that made your candidate look good (even if only to your fellow conservatives). Yours contains only wishful thinking.

50 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:42pm

re: #32 Dark_Falcon

I knew I'd get downdinged, but I felt some pushback was needed.

That was just straight up trolling.

51 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:50pm

re: #21 erik_t

You've got enough time today to randomly post campaign images, so maybe you could answer a long-standing question.

You preach the dire need for defense procurement reform while supporting a candidate who argues for defense spending as a 4% floor (his emphasis) of GDP rather than on the basis of mission need.

You keep ducking this. I'd still like to know how you reconcile this apparent hypocrisy.

It's not necessarily a contradiction. If we reform procurement processes, then we will spend less per system/item, and that extra money can be used to buy more equipment, increase military pay, and improve military infrastructure.

52 makeitstop  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:52:56pm

re: #32 Dark_Falcon

I knew I'd get downdinged, but I felt some pushback was needed.

Pushback on humorous images? Srsly?

53 Sophist, Gingham Style  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:53:07pm

re: #36 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

Binders full of murdered Americans! Hilarious!

54 leftynyc  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:53:11pm

Hmmm - this is interesting

[Link: www.buzzfeed.com...]

The Romney campaign's recently announced "Arab-Americans for Romney" includes some of the Republican Party’s staunchest advocates for the Palestinian cause, some of whom have worked directly against positions shared by the intensely pro-Israel Republican Party and President Barack Obama.
The list, which includes some prominent sitting and former members of Congress like Darrell Issa and Sen. John E. Sununu (the son of Gov. John Sununu), as well as anti-tax advocate Grover Norquist's wife Samah. Also on the roster is George Salem, an advisor to global lobbying firm DLA Piper who has recently been involved in bitter infighting in Washington’s pro-Palestinian community, pushing for a more confrontational stance toward Israel.
Salem sits on the board of the American Task Force on Palestine, a group in Washington that is aligned with Salam Fayyad, the technocratic Prime Minister of the Palestinian National Authority. Salem was at the heart of a dispute last year inside the organization, in which, according to an ally’s account, he pressed for the group to support the Palestinian pursuit of statehood before the United Nations, a move Israel feared and that the United States openly opposed.

I wonder what the reaction would be if this were part of Pres Obama's campaign.

55 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:53:59pm

re: #40 Sionainn

Another case of wishful thinking.

There you go making my slowly-typed comment redundant.

56 blueraven  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:55:24pm

re: #42 Gus

Doughy Douche pantload makes a funny on Benghazi.

hur hur
They jump on Obama for using the words "not optimal", yet they make jokes about Benghazi.

unreal.

57 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:55:32pm

re: #51 Dark_Falcon

It's not necessarily a contradiction. If we reform procurement processes, then we will spend less per system/item, and that extra money can be used to buy more equipment, increase military pay, and improve military infrastructure.

You're still buying things because it satisfies a we-must-spend-$X requirement, not because you need them. Literally, that's Romney's requirement.

Mitt Romney will begin by reversing Obama-era defense cuts and return to the budget baseline established by Secretary Robert Gates in 2010, with the goal of setting core defense spending—meaning funds devoted to the fundamental military components of personnel, operations and maintenance, procurement, and research and development—at a floor of 4 percent of GDP.

This is the opposite of procurement reform. This is the exact definition of the worst form of pork-barrel spending.

58 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:55:59pm

re: #54 leftynyc

Look at it another way: Mitt Romney isn't buying into the crazed "The Muslim Brotherhood has INFILTRATED the Federal Government!!1" meme. If anything, this repudiates it quite directly.

59 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:55:59pm

re: #56 blueraven

hur hur
They jump on Obama for using the words "not optimal", yet they make jokes about Benghazi.

unreal.

Gotta love it right.

60 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:56:50pm

re: #51 Dark_Falcon

It's not necessarily a contradiction. If we reform procurement processes, then we will spend less per system/item, and that extra money can be used to buy more equipment, increase military pay, and improve military infrastructure.

Is that why the GOP controlled congress keeps shooting down projects the Pentagon actually say are vital while buying gear the Pentagon says it doesn't need so it can keep money flowing to defense contractors?

61 Sionainn  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:56:52pm

re: #53 Sophist, Gingham Style

Binders full of murdered Americans! Hilarious!

What do you expect from someone who finds women's health and pay issues "mildly amusing."

62 leftynyc  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:57:04pm

re: #29 Obdicut

New York Observer is the paper for the rich, according to itself. It claims the average net worth of its readers is above a million bucks. So, yeah. They endorsed Romney. Big fucking surprise there.

I live in New York and don't know even one person who reads that rag. Can't even remember the last time I saw it around.

63 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:57:16pm

...

64 Sionainn  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:57:39pm

re: #55 wrenchwench

There you go making my slowly-typed comment redundant.

I type for a living. ;-)

65 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:57:43pm

Hurr, hurr. I knew they'd have to come up with #Obamanesia.

66 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:58:01pm

re: #60 Kragar

Is that why the GOP controlled congress keeps shooting down projects the Pentagon actually say are vital while buying gear the Pentagon says it doesn't need so it can keep money flowing to defense contractors?

It's like reforming health care spending by mandating everyone spend at least 10% of their household budget on healthcare.

It's utterly brainless. Literally the most comical part of a comical campaign, platform, and probably the most insultingly stupid argument I have ever seen here.

67 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:58:04pm

re: #36 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

Fucking hilarious, DF. This is what you find funny? You guys freak out about Obama quotes taken out of context, then you make jokes about Benghazi?

68 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:58:13pm

re: #60 Kragar

Is that why the GOP controlled congress keeps shooting down projects the Pentagon actually say are vital while buying gear the Pentagon says it doesn't need so it can keep money flowing to defense contractors?

What vital project did Congress 'shoot down'?

69 freetoken  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:58:16pm

Meanwhile, closer to home, and in a disturbing development for the future of what little journalism is left among the former big newspapers:

[...]

Bertrand Russell’s musings on the subject fit UT-San Diego’s Publisher Doug Manchester to a tee: “The megalomaniac differs from the narcissist by the fact that he wishes to be powerful rather than charming, and seeks to be feared rather than loved. To this type belong many lunatics and most of the great men of history.”

Whether he belongs to either the ‘lunatic’ or the ‘great men’ category is the only question at play here. Having made the jump from hotel developer to media mogul, Manchester clearly wants more, more & more. If his worldview isn’t supported by the facts, he’s willing to simply use his power to deny, defer or dispute reality.

Yesterday it was reported by KPBS that Manchester is officially looking into purchasing the Tribune Company, which will give him control over the Los Angeles Times, along with The Chicago Tribune, The Baltimore Sun and The Hartford Courant.

[...]

Manchester is the local real estate baron who bought the SD Union-Tribune and veered it into wingnut territory. He'd do to the larger Tribune company the same, making it more like the right-wing hate radio or Fox News.

70 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:58:20pm

re: #27 Charles Johnson

I once wrote a recursive quick-sort algorithm in 68000 assembly language.

/random synapse firing

The only flawless piece of code I ever wrote was a hierarchical database search routine in 370 assembler. It was my first-ever production assembly program and I must have desk-checked it 30 or 40 times before typing it in (these were the days when we coded on paper and only entered the code once we could get terminal time). It worked the first time and as far as I know no bugs were ever found in it.

Too bad this is not true of any other piece of code I've ever been involved with (mine or, for that matter, anyone else's).

71 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:58:52pm

re: #58 Dark_Falcon

Look at it another way: Mitt Romney isn't buying into the crazed "The Muslim Brotherhood has INFILTRATED the Federal Government!!1" meme. If anything, this repudiates it quite directly.

Yeah, that's why he's flying Jerome Corsi around on his plane.

Pull the other one.

72 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:59:04pm

re: #67 JamesWI

Fucking hilarious, DF. This is what you find funny? You guys freak out about Obama quotes taken out of context, then you make jokes about Benghazi?

I didn't freak out, and turning two memes into one mockery of both is perfectly fair.

73 Sionainn  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 12:59:51pm

re: #65 Gus

Hurr, hurr. I knew they'd have to come up with #Obamanesia.

Too bad that none of them are funny. Another huge comedy fail from GOP conservatives.

74 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:00:02pm

re: #71 goddamnedfrank

Yeah, that's why he's flying Jerome Corsi around on his plane.

Pull the other one.

I won't say it, it's too easy.

75 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:00:06pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

I didn't freak out, and turning two memes into one mockery of both is perfectly fair.

So Benghazi is now a "meme" to you. Yes, you are as fucking ghoulish as we all thought you were.

76 leftynyc  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:00:21pm

re: #58 Dark_Falcon

Look at it another way: Mitt Romney isn't buying into the crazed "The Muslim Brotherhood has INFILTRATED the Federal Government!!1" meme. If anything, this repudiates it quite directly.

In all honesty, take your partisan blinders off for a second - what would be the reaction on the right if Pres Obama has this dude on his team:

"The fact that the Romney folks have an anti-Israel activist like George Salem and a guy like like Grover Norquist, who has been widely criticized, including by Republican members of congress, for long standing ties to terrorists and supporters of terrorists groups, affiliated with their campaign is pretty troubling,” said one official with a Jewish organization. "If this were the Obama campaign, you can only imagine the howls of outrage that we would be hearing from Conservatives — and rightly so.”
Salem’s role produced particular complaints, in part because of his role in connecting President George W. Bush with Arab American leaders who were later pushed well out of the political mainstream. Salem has served as a lawyer for the Holy Land Foundation, a group with ties to Hamas, which President Bush shut down in 2001, and has been the target of at-times intense intra-party criticism since then.

77 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:00:41pm

re: #73 Sionainn

Too bad that none of them are funny. Another huge comedy fail from GOP conservatives.

Yeah. Conservatives typically respond by getting really angry about things. Poor anger management.

78 blueraven  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:01:58pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

I didn't freak out, and turning two memes into one mockery of both is perfectly fair.

No...jokes about the attack on Benghazi where 4 Americans were killed is definitely not "perfectly OK".

Goldberg is scum, and you should not have repeated his "joke"

79 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:03:24pm

re: #75 JamesWI

So Benghazi is now a "meme" to you. Yes, you are as fucking ghoulish as we all thought you were.

Don't take my words out of context. "Who said and did what and when" regarding the Benghazi attack is now an established attack meme in the election. The attack itself wasn't a meme, it was a planned attack in the service of a totalitarian ideology.

80 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:03:26pm

re: #68 Dark_Falcon

What vital project did Congress 'shoot down'?

Defense officials defend "Great Green Fleet" cost

A year-old Defense Department report predicted the military will spend $2 billion more annually if it pursues its biofuels goals. And a more recent study by the RAND Corporation think tank said renewable fuels for U.S. military vessels and jets are likely to remain far more expensive than petroleum products, absent a technological breakthrough.

But the Navy said estimates that it will spend more using biofuels are flawed. The projections assume petroleum prices will not be higher by the end of the decade, which is unlikely, and that the Navy will buy biofuels at a significant premium to petroleum.

The Navy has said it will not buy biofuels for operational use until the price is competitive with petroleum.

"The Navy is pursuing cost-competitive alternative fuels and greater fuel efficiency because unpredictable and increasingly volatile oil prices could have a direct impact on readiness," a Navy spokeswoman said. "That volatility resulted in more than $500 million additional fuel bill to the Navy in FY12."

81 alpuz  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:03:37pm

re: #65 Gus

Yup. Romnesia left quite the mark. Awesome.

82 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:03:50pm

re: #74 Dark_Falcon

I won't say it, it's too easy.

I love it when you pretend at having mature sensibilities. Just answer the charge, if your man is so serious about combatting the bad craziness in his party why is he flying Corsi around as part of his press corps?

83 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:04:06pm

re: #51 Dark_Falcon

It's not necessarily a contradiction. If we reform procurement processes, then we will spend less per system/item, and that extra money can be used to buy more equipment, increase military pay, and improve military infrastructure.

Romney's ideas of procurement reform include such nebulous ideas as 'adding more competition'. As I look at programs that are spiraling wildly out of control, things like F-35 or the Burke Flight III, or CVN-78, I find myself wondering exactly how more competition will be added to the process.

Every major aerospace company of the era bid on F-35; I assume we're not going to rebid multiple times in the process. That doesn't sound very reform-y. Both Bath and Ingalls (the only shipyards capable) are building Burkes right now; that doesn't seem to be helping. Only one shipyard in the nation can build aircraft carriers.

Competition isn't like peanut butter; you don't just smear more onto the process to make a better procurement-sandwich. What of Romney's procurement reform ideas actually make any meaningful sense?

If reform is really his goal, why does he then levy the additional need to spend additional dollars on unrequired systems to make his spending floor?

84 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:04:27pm

re: #73 Sionainn

Too bad that none of them are funny. Another huge comedy fail from GOP conservatives.

Partisan jokes are often only funny to those of the view political persuasion as the teller.

85 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:04:35pm

re: #80 Kragar

Defense officials defend "Great Green Fleet" cost

The "cost" of oil is also indirectly subsidized by the very presence of the US fleet to guard access to the Straits of Hormuz...

86 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:04:42pm

Romnesia: When you go from trying to out left Teddy Kennedy on GLBT rights to having your surrogates accuse the first president to announce support for gay marriage of forcing gay marriage on America.

87 allegro  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:04:46pm

re: #68 Dark_Falcon

What vital project did Congress 'shoot down'?

Security $ request to embassies.

88 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:05:01pm

It's amazing how much a person has to completely ignore in order to support Mitt Romney, and to think he would make a good President.

89 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:06:21pm

re: #79 Dark_Falcon

Don't take my words out of context. "Who said and did what and when" regarding the Benghazi attack is now an established attack meme in the election. The attack itself wasn't a meme, it was a planned attack in the service of a totalitarian ideology.

I'm not taking your words out of context. You think jokes about Benghazi are funny. You're just a dick.

90 freetoken  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:06:25pm

re: #80 Kragar

Because it is "green" means it is from Satan, when we all know God wants us to use oil, that's why he put so much of it here, if only the environmentalists would allow us to use it.

91 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:06:39pm

re: #83 erik_t

How can you have "more competition" when there is often only one supplier, and the contratcts are offered without bidding on a cost-plus basis?

This is another one of those ideological pipe dreams they sell us: that defense contracting is anything other than state socialism.

92 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:06:40pm

re: #80 Kragar

Defense officials defend "Great Green Fleet" cost

I do not believe Congress has denied that program funding. But Congress might prefer to privatize biofuels research instead of having the government handle it.

93 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:06:58pm

re: #50 goddamnedfrank

I don't think that's trolling. We have pro Obama graphics up here a lot. Well, for reasons of his own Dark wants a new guy in the oval. So he put up a graphic that represents his view. Not harsh, not snarky, and not what (guessing) 90% of the people around here want to see.

94 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:06:59pm

re: #63 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

Did you see where that comes from? Do you know what the Urban League is? So why do you think they call themselves the "ExUrban League? Hint: it's probably not because they're from the "exurbs" of Phoenix. Check their blogroll for further evidence.

It's also the kind of place where they feel no need to make corrections.

The system is worthless.

How many more people have to die on both sides of the border before we get serious about the flood of criminals streaming into the U.S.?

Authorities say a U.S. Border Patrol agent died after a shooting near Naco, Ariz. early Tuesday morning.

According to spokesman Brent M. Cagen with the Tucson Sector of the U.S. Border Patrol, agents assigned to the Brian Terry Station were involved in the shooting.

Three agents total were involved: 1 was killed, 1 received non-life threatening injuries, and another was unharmed, said Cochise County Sheriff’s spokeswoman Carol Capas.

Our thoughts and prayers are with the families and friends of these law enforcement agents involved, and may justice be sure and swift for their killers.

And it saddens me to no end that I have to wonder if this murder was committed by a person wielding a firearm given to them by the very government the victim was sworn to uphold.

Oh, wait. That last sentence is correct, isn't it. The first one, not so much.

95 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:07:16pm

re: #87 allegro

Security $ request to embassies.

That's a DoS, rather than DoD funding item.

96 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:07:40pm

re: #93 Daniel Ballard

I don't think that's trolling. We have pro Obama graphics up here a lot. Well, for reasons of his own Dark wants a new guy in the oval. So he put up a graphic that represents his view. Not harsh, not snarky, and not what (guessing) 90% of the people around here want to see.

I built that.

DF didn't build that.

Win.

97 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:08:15pm

I also like how DF says he doesn't "freak out" about Obama quotes taken out of context, when he was trying to push "YOU DIDN'T BUILD THAT!" as a serious problem for months.

But whatever. Let's joke about terrorist attacks that killed Americans! Benghazi LOL ROFL.

98 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:08:18pm

Romnesia: Pledging that you'll never wave in your pro-choice commitment. Then claiming you'll get rid of Planned Parenthood.

99 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:08:45pm

re: #93 Daniel Ballard

I don't think that's trolling. We have pro Obama graphics up here a lot. Well, for reasons of his own Dark wants a new guy in the oval. So he put up a graphic that represents his view. Not harsh, not snarky, and not what (guessing) 90% of the people around here want to see.

From a fucking racist source. Heehee. Not.

100 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:08:48pm

re: #92 Dark_Falcon

I do not believe Congress has denied that program funding. But Congress might prefer to privatize biofuels research instead of having the government handle it.

It is an interesting argument, but think of how often technology devloped for the mioitary was later adoped for civilian use...why not do the same with biofuels? the need is there and the market has been slow to respond for a number of reasons, one being the indirect subsidies to oil prices in the form of the military as a "security escort service" for our oil tankers.

101 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:08:58pm

Congress Pushes for Weapons Pentagon Didn't Want

The Pentagon, which is facing end-of-year cuts that it says could cripple its ability to fight future wars, may spend billions in coming years on weapons systems and programs it says it doesn't need but are favored by area members of Congress.

The Dayton Daily News analyzed proposed defense budgets for 2013 and identified five programs that Ohio's congressional delegation is fighting for although Pentagon officials have called them unnecessary and unaffordable.

Critics say these big-ticket items are earmarks in disguise, using the Department of Defense budget for economic stimulus. They also point out that the multi-million dollar contracts are awarded to major campaign contributors.

102 engineer cat  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:09:02pm

re: #27 Charles Johnson

I once wrote a recursive quick-sort algorithm in 68000 assembly language.

/random synapse firing

i once implemented the dynamic programming solution to the knapsack problem using only dixie cups and purple jellybeans

103 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:09:16pm

re: #99 wrenchwench

From a fucking racist source. Heehee. Not.

The Exurban League thing?

104 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:09:20pm

re: #91 AK-47%

How can you have "more competition" when there is often only one supplier, and the contratcts are offered without bidding on a cost-plus basis?

This is another one of those ideological pipe dreams they sell us: that defense contracting is anything other than state socialism.

You can have some competition. Indeed, you can have as much competition as is possible. But you have to recognize that there is a maximum-competition-possible. This maximum degree of competition will vary from program to program, but it's still there.

What you can't do is just repeat the word over and over and over until things get better. Dare I say it, that's the sort of mindset some dumbfuck insulated CEO would tend to have.

I wonder if he'll trot out Six Sigma next. Or buy tanks only according to the Toyota Production System.

105 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:09:21pm

Romnesia: Supporting SB1070 and hiring its writer as your immigration adviser as well as denouncing DOJ's lawsuit against it. Then claiming you don't support the bill.

106 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:09:22pm

re: #94 wrenchwench

I didn't know that they posted that sort of stuff, as I didn't get it directly from their site. Thank you for informing me in time; That post has been deleted.

107 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:09:45pm

re: #103 Gus

The Exurban League thing?

Yes.

108 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:10:41pm

re: #99 wrenchwench

From a fucking racist source. Heehee. Not.

Really? I did not know. The graphic isn't though. It's typical just election year slogan visuals.

109 freetoken  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:11:26pm

re: #101 Kragar

Congress pushes because lobbyists from contractors in their districts visit them continually, tell them about all the jobs it creates in their districts, and it follows that then the Congress-person realizes that it is in their best interest to push for it.

And then the wingnuts and Romney run around screaming about how government doesn't create jobs.

Yeah, we label that "cognitive dissonance".

110 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:11:35pm

re: #106 Dark_Falcon

I didn't know that they posted that sort of stuff, as I didn't get it directly from their site. Thank you for informing me in time; That post has been deleted.

How about opening your eyes? A huge chunk of Romney's supporters are racists who actually hate Romney and Obama, they just hate Obama more. Because of this, you have to do research on all of them.

Thanks for deleting that crap. Try not to fall for it so easily in the future.

111 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:11:39pm

re: #99 wrenchwench

From a fucking racist source. Heehee. Not.

Only for the second pic and its gone now. As I said, I had not gotten it directly from their site and so did not know they posted stuff like that.

112 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:12:20pm

re: #94 wrenchwench

Did you see where that comes from? Do you know what the Urban League is? So why do you think they call themselves the "ExUrban League? Hint: it's probably not because they're from the "exurbs" of Phoenix. Check their blogroll for further evidence.

Pitiful.

113 MittDoesNotCompute  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:12:27pm

re: #101 Kragar

Congress Pushes for Weapons Pentagon Didn't Want

TPGOPer Congresscritters don't mind economic stimulus from the Feds (jobs, investment, etc.) if it benefits their districts (and if it's sufficiently buried in the budget so it's harder for Inquiring Minds to find out about it).

They just don't want that Dirty Commie Muslim Socialist in the White House to get any credit for it.

114 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:12:37pm

re: #93 Daniel Ballard

I don't think that's trolling. We have pro Obama graphics up here a lot. Well, for reasons of his own Dark wants a new guy in the oval. So he put up a graphic that represents his view. Not harsh, not snarky, and not what (guessing) 90% of the people around here want to see.

Oh please, the child was trolling. And as much as I think Romney is complete dogshit making any predictions on the outcome of an election this close goes way beyond snarky, it's fucking ludicrously stupid. It's the kind of cocksure idiocy we see from rwmofo and barfucktom.

115 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:12:42pm

re: #108 Daniel Ballard

Really? I did not know. The graphic isn't though. It's typical just election year slogan visuals.

True, but the source is tainted enough to merit the graphic's withdrawal.

116 engineer cat  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:12:55pm

re: #70 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

The only flawless piece of code I ever wrote was a hierarchical database search routine in 370 assembler. It was my first-ever production assembly program and I must have desk-checked it 30 or 40 times before typing it in (these were the days when we coded on paper and only entered the code once we could get terminal time). It worked the first time and as far as I know no bugs were ever found in it.

Too bad this is not true of any other piece of code I've ever been involved with (mine or, for that matter, anyone else's).

the number of known bugs in any piece of code is finite. the number of unknown bugs is, mathematically speaking, infinite

117 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:12:58pm

Schlafly: Senate Should Move to Expel Al Franken

Eagle Forum’s Phyllis Schlafly believes that Al Franken never would have been elected to the U.S. Senate in 2008 if Minnesota had a voter ID law and that there is now “reason enough for the U.S. Senate to use its constitutional power in Article I, Section 5 to unseat Franken.” Franken won by a mere 225 votes against incumbent Norm Coleman, but Schlafly says in her latest column that it's because felons cast illegal votes to push him over the top and that only Voter ID laws, which she claims are beloved by minorities, can remedy the situation.

118 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:13:05pm

re: #108 Daniel Ballard

Really? I did not know. The graphic isn't though. It's typical just election year slogan visuals.

To me, the source matters. They have their (trying not to say fucking again) web address on it, therefore they spread their hate with every republishing of their stuff. Insidious.

119 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:13:56pm

re: #117 Kragar

Schlafly: Senate Should Move to Expel Al Franken

File that under "Never Going to Happen".

120 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:14:06pm

re: #113 MittDoesNotCompute

TPGOPer Congresscritters don't mind economic stimulus from the Feds (jobs, investment, etc.) if it benefits their districts (and if it's sufficiently buried in the budget so it's harder for Inquiring Minds to find out about it).

They just don't want that Dirty Commie Muslim Socialist in the White House to get any credit for it.

Didn't Ryan want his stimulus funds request hidden? Really, these guys are hypocrites. They want to use the government to help their own district, constituents, and supporters out but the second something's proposed that may help the whole country, they act like "NO SOCIALISM, UNCONSTITUTIONAL." Bunch of goddamn hypocriets.

121 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:14:06pm

re: #92 Dark_Falcon

I do not believe Congress has denied that program funding. But Congress might prefer to privatize biofuels research instead of having the government handle it.

Haha nope (PDF).

We encourage the cost effective development of renewable energy, but the taxpayers should not serve as venture capitalists for risky endeavors. It is important to create a pathway toward a market-based approach for renewable energy sources and to aggressively develop alternative sources for electricity generation such as wind, hydro, solar, biomass, geothermal, and tidal energy.

== Navy wants it, can't get it.

You don't even know what your own team wants, yet you lap up their secretions ceaselessly and with great gusto. It's kind of gross.

122 MittDoesNotCompute  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:14:25pm

re: #117 Kragar

Schlafly: Senate Should Move to Expel Al Franken

She (and her idiot son) is definitely high on their own supply...

123 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:15:10pm

re: #117 Kragar

Schlafly: Senate Should Move to Expel Al Franken

Mommy, why is that dinosaur yelling at Senator Franken?

124 MittDoesNotCompute  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:15:43pm

re: #123 HappyWarrior

Mommy, why is that dinosaur yelling at Senator Franken?

RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE

125 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:16:16pm

re: #121 erik_t

Haha nope (PDF).

== Navy wants it, can't get it.

You don't even know what your own team wants, yet you lap up their secretions ceaselessly and with great gusto. It's kind of gross.

Navy's wrong. Such work should be done by private firms.

126 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:16:26pm

re: #117 Kragar

Schlafly: Senate Should Move to Expel Al Franken

Vapid, hateful, bitter old woman says what?

127 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:16:33pm

re: #124 MittDoesNotCompute

RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE

Image: 2263308-South-Park-rabble-rabble-rabble.jpg Rabble!

128 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:17:13pm

re: #125 Dark_Falcon

Navy's wrong. Such work should be done by private firms.

Read the goddamned platform, for pity's sake. The Navy can't even fund the work, because it counts as taxpayer investment in an risky technology.

129 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:17:20pm

re: #126 erik_t

Vapid, hateful, bitter old woman says what?

She always struck me as weird. She made her name by opposing feminism. I don't know what to make of that.

130 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:17:41pm

re: #115 Dark_Falcon

True, but the source is tainted enough to merit the graphic's withdrawal.

Agreed. We have to be extra careful about that sort of thing. Of course even if you 'shopped that up yourself it was gonna get the dings anyway.

131 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:18:09pm

re: #125 Dark_Falcon

Navy's wrong. Such work should be done by private firms.

Which is why DARPA should be immediately disbanded, get those layabouts to do real work in the private sector.
/

132 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:18:22pm

re: #128 erik_t

Read the goddamned platform, for pity's sake. The Navy can't even fund the work, because it counts as taxpayer investment in an risky technology.

taxpayer expense in an established technology (oil) but with a risky source of supply (straits of Hormuz) is okay, though...

133 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:18:27pm

re: #126 erik_t

Vapid, hateful, bitter old woman says what?

And "Reactionary", don't forget reactionary.

/Not said to mock, since Phyllis Schlafly is in fact a reactionary.

134 A Mom Anon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:18:33pm

re: #118 wrenchwench

This is what happens when you're in a big hurry to say"So There!! HaHa!" and don't check where the thing came from first. One would think if one were aware of the obvious number of racists,homophobes and he-man-woman-haters in one's party,checking sources might be a smart idea.

135 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:19:09pm
136 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:19:28pm

re: #118 wrenchwench

To me, the source matters. They have their (trying not to say fucking again) web address on it, therefore they spread their hate with every republishing of their stuff. Insidious.

This disgusting racist garbage is absolutely typical of the right wing blogosphere these days. Just check out the blogroll on that site.

137 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:20:33pm

re: #135 Gus

The thing about right wing humor is that it has an underlying streak of sheer meanness. That's why it's not funny except to wingnuts -- you have to be able to enjoy the viciousness.

138 engineer cat  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:20:51pm

re: #88 Charles Johnson

It's amazing how much a person has to completely ignore in order to support Mitt Romney, and to think he would make a good President.

i think the polling question should be 'who will you vote for 1) obama, the democrat, 2) romney, the moderate republican, or 3) romney, the severe conservative?'

139 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:21:33pm

re: #130 Daniel Ballard

Agreed. We have to be extra careful about that sort of thing. Of course even if you 'shopped that up yourself it was gonna get the dings anyway.

Not the same thing, though. If I post something and it gets downdinged, then all that means is that people here don't like it. To shop around the work of a racist after being informed he is a racist is another matter entirely and something I won't do.

140 lawhawk  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:22:03pm

re: #101 Kragar

In specific, Congress is pushing for contracts to refurbish older M1 Abrams tanks so as to keep the line jobs at the factories in a number of states going, even though the Army is currently studying plans for a replacement tank and the Army says that it has sufficient numbers of tanks at its disposal.

141 The Ghost of a Flea  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:22:05pm

re: #135 Gus

Right wing humor is all about hurting the People Not In The Tribe.

Hey, that boot ain't stomping my face, forever--therefore it's hilarious!

142 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:22:15pm

At no time in the history of forever has an inventor or company come forward with an idea saying "Hey, we can get this to work if you give us some assistance", the government provides said assistance, and it turns into a major breakthrough for the entire civilization.

That shit never happens.

143 A Mom Anon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:23:06pm

re: #129 HappyWarrior

She made her name telling women they should be at home raising kids,tending husbands,baking cookies and not being smarter than your husband. While she was out working full time and then some to tell us all that. She's a freaking old,bitter velociraptor who should have been retired years ago.

144 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:23:15pm

Right wing humor generally sucks. Let's be honest.Look at Limbaugh. He's about as funny as stepping on a nail.

145 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:23:53pm

Again, I'm sorry about that graphic from that 'exUrban League' site. I didn't get it from that site, and didn't know what they post on that site. As soon as wrenchwench made me aware for their vileness I pulled the graphic.

146 freetoken  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:24:13pm

re: #142 Kragar

That shit never happens.

Hehehe...

he wrote, communicating on the ARPANET.

147 HappyWarrior  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:24:36pm

re: #143 A Mom Anon

She made her name telling women they should be at home raising kids,tending husbands,baking cookies and not being smarter than your husband. While she was out working full time and then some to tell us all that. She's a freaking old,bitter velociraptor who should have been retired years ago.

Right, that's what I find amusing about her and her whole schtick. Kind of like Dinesh D'Sousa and his mistress railing against liberals for immorality all the while having an adulterous tryst.

148 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:24:51pm

re: #144 HappyWarrior

Right wing humor generally sucks. Let's be honest.Look at Limbaugh. He's about as funny as stepping on a nail.

Right-wing humor is simply hatred, ghoulishness and being a dick.....then saying "It's a joke!!!!" at the end.

See: Dark Falcon.

149 dragonath  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:24:52pm

re: #93 Daniel Ballard

I don't think that's trolling. We have pro Obama graphics up here a lot. Well, for reasons of his own Dark wants a new guy in the oval. So he put up a graphic that represents his view. Not harsh, not snarky, and not what (guessing) 90% of the people around here want to see.

I know you're trying to be a reasonable conservative and all, but when your arguments end up sharing space with racists, it's time to start over.

150 engineer cat  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:25:08pm

re: #141 The Ghost of a Flea

Right wing humor is all about hurting the People Not In The Tribe.

Hey, that boot ain't stomping my face, forever--therefore it's hilarious!

it reminds me of when i was working in a place where people were very conformist - they were constantly affirming that they were the 'normal' people and making jokes about people who they considered 'weird'

they liked me but were very concerned about my 'weird' habits, such as reading things other than the sports section, and offered to help me with this embarrassing problem

151 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:25:49pm

re: #140 lawhawk

In specific, Congress is pushing for contracts to refurbish older M1 Abrams tanks so as to keep the line jobs at the factories in a number of states going, even though the Army is currently studying plans for a replacement tank and the Army says that it has sufficient numbers of tanks at its disposal.

I can accept that, though Congress should admit that such a program is just one of FDR's New Deal programs in another guise. Because it is, isn't it?

Slight revision.

152 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:27:09pm

Salt Lake Tribune endorses Obama, slaps Romney

153 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:28:19pm

re: #151 Dark_Falcon

I can accept that, if Congress is prepared to admit that such a program is just one of FDR's New Deal programs in another guise. Because it is, isn't it?

But... but... dire need for procurement reform.

Which is it?

154 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:28:21pm

re: #151 Dark_Falcon

I can accept that, if Congress is prepared to admit that such a program is just one of FDR's New Deal programs in another guise. Because it is, isn't it?

Psst, FDR's been gone for about 60 years.

155 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:28:35pm

re: #152 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

Salt Lake Tribune endorses Obama, slaps Romney

It's the Salt Lake Tribune.

This means nothing to you, but let's just say I'm not shocked. I would have been shocked if they had endorsed Romney.

156 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:28:44pm

re: #152 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

Salt Lake Tribune endorses Obama, slaps Romney

We all know Salt Lake City is mostly Muslim. They're just playing to their audience./

157 dragonath  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:29:22pm

re: #151 Dark_Falcon

FDR: History's Greatest Monster

158 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:29:45pm

re: #153 erik_t

But... but... dire need for procurement reform.

Which is it?

Tribe, because neither side is really ready to make the needed changes.

159 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:30:03pm

re: #149 dragonath

I know you're trying to be a reasonable conservative and all, but when your arguments end up sharing space with racists, it's time to start over.

I really had no idea, but you are correct that it's very wrong to support that sort of thing at all. Dark should have grabbed a graphic from a clean source.

160 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:30:19pm

Banana Boat makers recall sunscreen after users catch on fire

The company behind the Banana Boat sunscreen line is recalling some of its spray-on products after reports of people catching on fire after using them.

The Associated Press reported Friday that Energizer Holdings is pulling nearly two dozen products in its UltraMist spray-on tan line after five people — four in the U.S. and one in Canada — reported that they caught on fire after standing near an open flame following application of the product.

In a statement, the company said UltraMists’s spray valve is over-applying the product, making it more flammable because it takes longer to dry.

“If a consumer comes into contact with a flame or spark prior to complete drying of the product on the skin, there is a potential for the product to ignite,” the company said.

161 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:30:21pm

re: #151 Dark_Falcon

I can accept that, if Congress is prepared to admit that such a program is just one of FDR's New Deal programs in another guise. Because it is, isn't it?

These are questions that go beyond simple bottom-line considerations: we have a long-term interestest in maintaining a base of skilled workers and engineers, these people are not just a commodity product that can be bought, sold and transferred as needed.

and yes, which congresspersons are going to turn doen the opportuinity to have jobs created in their districs?

162 erik_t  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:31:29pm

re: #158 Dark_Falcon

Tribe, because neither side is really ready to make the needed changes.

Thanks for the honesty, I guess. I won't try to engage you in rational discourse any more.

I knew it was a waste of my time, but it's nice to see you admit it.

163 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:31:41pm

re: #156 JamesWI

We all know Salt Lake City is mostly Muslim. They're just playing to their audience./

Here's the history of the Tribune:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

164 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:32:02pm

re: #157 dragonath

FDR: History's Greatest Monster

I didn't say that! I didn't even criticize FDR! All I said was that if you are using government money to keep people employed doing things for the federal government with the main aim of keeping them employed, then that is the kind of program FDR ran.

Excuse the shouting, but I needed to make myself clear.

165 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:32:12pm

Would anyone care to vote in my pre election poll?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

166 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:33:14pm

re: #164 Dark_Falcon

so the gov't does create jobs then?

167 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:34:07pm

re: #164 Dark_Falcon

I didn't say that! I didn't even criticize FDR! All I said was that if you are using government money to keep people employed doing things for the federal government with the main aim of keeping them employed, then that is the kind of program FDR ran.

Excuse the shouting, but I needed to make myself clear.

We had a long-term national interest in not seeing our workforce starve to death, for chrissakes.

168 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:34:52pm

re: #166 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

so the gov't does create jobs then?

It can, but it's like paying your kids to work around the house--it doesn't bring in new money. Government jobs do not represent a growth of the economy, but they do employ people gainfully.

169 boredtechindenver  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:35:18pm

re: #34 Gus

Pushback?

You're hurting his feefees.

170 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:35:22pm

re: #165 Daniel Ballard

Would anyone care to vote in my pre election poll?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Looks like you found another loose end on the new server -- poll results aren't being shown. Will check.

171 lawhawk  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:35:47pm

re: #164 Dark_Falcon

The Army - and the entire DoD is facing rescission cuts across the board, and that includes projects that do need the funding (think UAV programs), while this is a program that if cut would enable the Army to continue modernization to deal with current threats. Allowing Congress to force this unwanted program on the Army means that they're willing to undermine readiness goals for the military to achieve a few more votes on election day.

At the same time, many of these same folks on the GOP side will kill infrastructure projects even though they'll create jobs and a lasting improvement to the economy (better efficiencies, transportation, reliability of infrastructure, etc.).

Kill the tank program as the Army wants, and allow the Army to spend the money on the programs it has identified as a critical need.

172 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:36:19pm

re: #151 Dark_Falcon

I can accept that, if Congress is prepared to admit that such a program is just one of FDR's New Deal programs in another guise. Because it is, isn't it?

New Deal programs produced things of actual value to society, like bridges, trails, roads, parks and buildings. You know, infrastructure. Building tanks that the Pentagon doesn't need or even want is typical Republican wasteful defense spending for the sake of spending on defense. It's also crony capitalism, making sure more and more national treasure flows its way into the military industrial complex. This is exemplified in Romney's proposed $2 Trillion Pentagon budget increase. They don't need the money, they don't want the money, they know that such reckless spending can only destabilize our economy, which will negatively impact the world's economy and likely lead to more pointless conflicts and lives lost. But Romney's planning to cram it down their throats whether they like it or not because every Republican wants to play War President.

173 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:36:36pm

re: #163 Mostly sane, most of the time.

Here's the history of the Tribune:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Well, I see that they hated Brigham Young way back when, but I also see that in the more recent past, they worked in a joint-operating agreement with the other Salt Lake paper, which was owned by the LDS Church.

Is there something that you can find that shows a bias more clearly?

174 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:36:39pm

re: #165 Daniel Ballard

Would anyone care to vote in my pre election poll?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Hey you left something out, it should say...

Yes?
No?
Undecided?
Ron Paul!

175 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:36:49pm

re: #168 Mostly sane, most of the time.

It can, but it's like paying your kids to work around the house--it doesn't bring in new money. Government jobs do not represent a growth of the economy, but they do employ people gainfully.

If you pay your kid to fix a broken window, it could save money over the long run, that is the concept behind infrastructure programs.

176 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:37:15pm

re: #167 AK-47%

We had a long-term national interest in not seeing our workforce starve to death, for chrissakes.

Again, what I said was not a criticism of FDR.

177 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:37:17pm

re: #168 Mostly sane, most of the time.

It can, but it's like paying your kids to work around the house--it doesn't bring in new money. Government jobs do not represent a growth of the economy, but they do employ people gainfully.

Because people who get gov't paychecks never, ever spend any of that money buying goods and services from providers in the private sector. Ever.

178 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:38:10pm

re: #159 Daniel Ballard

I really had no idea, but you are correct that it's very wrong to support that sort of thing at all. Dark should have grabbed a graphic from a clean source.

If you want a quick grab source, you're out of luck as a conservative, because you have to look into every one to find the needle in the haystack of bigotry.

179 Killgore Trout  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:39:00pm

re: #174 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You

Hey you left something out, it should say...

Yes?
No?
Undecided?
Ron Paul!

Heh, of course! How could we overlook Ron Paul?

180 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:39:22pm

re: #176 Dark_Falcon

Again, what I said was not a criticism of FDR.

There are pork-barrel projects, but a lot of what FDR did was just about keeping oatmeal in their kids' bowls.

181 darthstar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:39:24pm
182 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:40:25pm

re: #177 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

Because people who get gov't paychecks never, ever spend any of that money buying goods and services from providers in the private sector. Ever.

Nope, never happens.

If the government spends money to build a bridge, that money gets taken and thrown into a shredder, then burned. The money doesn't get paid to a construction company, which then pays its workers, who then buy food from the roach coach, buy gas commuting, pay rent, buy goods and services in the community, etc.

That shit never happens.

183 darthstar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:40:52pm

Obama winning Utah (I know, It'll never happen) would provide for some sweet, sweet schadenfreude.

184 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:41:07pm

re: #181 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Oh yeah! The New York Observer endorsed Romney! Take that!

185 makeitstop  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:41:36pm

re: #152 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

Salt Lake Tribune endorses Obama, slaps Romney

This part has really gotta sting...

Sadly, it is not the only Romney, as his campaign for the White House has made abundantly clear, first in his servile courtship of the tea party in order to win the nomination, and now as the party’s shape-shifting nominee. From his embrace of the party’s radical right wing, to subsequent portrayals of himself as a moderate champion of the middle class, Romney has raised the most frequently asked question of the campaign: "Who is this guy, really, and what in the world does he truly believe?"

[snip]

Politicians routinely tailor their words to suit an audience. Romney, though, is shameless, lavishing vastly diverse audiences with words, any words, they would trade their votes to hear.

SLC has his number.

186 dragonath  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:42:34pm

re: #176 Dark_Falcon

Again, what I said was not a criticism of FDR.

No, the issue was reflexively comparing wasteful government spending to New Deal programs. How much deeper do you want to dig? The New Deal is a big thing. Social Security... a waste of government money? I suppose all those people who were living more comfortably in their old age weren't adding anything to the economy.

If the term "Democrat Wars" was in vogue again, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if you used it.

187 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:43:00pm

re: #182 Kragar

Nope, never happens.

If the government spends money to build a bridge, that money gets taken and thrown into a shredder, then burned. The money doesn't get paid to a construction company, which then pays its workers, who then buy food from the roach coach, buy gas commuting, pay rent, buy goods and services in the community, etc.

That shit never happens.

Unfortunately, it is not unheard of that some of the money gets siphoned off into corrupt peoples' pockets and winds up in offshore account. My hometown of Gary, Indiana was awash in federal money in the 60's and very little of it actually came to benefit the citizens.

But I do not buy the conservative article of faith that says "government spending = money down the drain (unless it's defense spending)"

188 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:43:19pm

LOL

[Link: cheezburger.com...]

189 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:43:42pm

Who helps the economy more: The man who takes his pay and spends it in his community purchasing good and services or the man who takes his pay and places it in a hidden offshore account?

190 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:43:51pm

re: #173 JamesWI

Well, I see that they hated Brigham Young way back when, but I also see that in the more recent past, they worked in a joint-operating agreement with the other Salt Lake paper, which was owned by the LDS Church.

Is there something that you can find that shows a bias more clearly?

An actual article or newspaper? No. I lived in Utah, though, so I can tell you that the trib is seen as the liberal newspaper and the Deseret News is seen as the conservative newspaper.

191 allegro  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:43:56pm

re: #167 AK-47%

We had a long-term national interest in not seeing our workforce starve to death, for chrissakes.

And that money was far from wasted in any sense. It wasn't just creating busy work. Many of the fine structures, bridges, and highways built with WPA dollars are still in service today. We need that again, today. It would lower unemployment very quickly while helping to rebuild our crumbling infrastructure in benefit to the entire nation. Even the 1%.

192 darthstar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:44:29pm
193 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:45:39pm

re: #187 AK-47%

Unfortunately, it is not unheard of that some of the money gets siphoned off into corrupt peoples' pockets and winds up in ofshore account. My hometown of Gary, Indiana was awash in federal money in the 60's and very little of it actually came to benefit the citizens.

But I do not buy the conservative article of faith that says "government spending = money down the drain (unless it's defense spending)"

The issue there being corruption and lack of proper regulation and oversight, not the program the money was intended to go towards.

194 Killgore Trout  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:47:01pm

CNN crawl: CNN/ORC poll taken after second debate: 49% of likely Florida voters support Mitt Romney, and 48% back President Obama.

195 Varek Raith  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:47:12pm

re: #192 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Obola!
/

196 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:47:18pm

re: #190 Mostly sane, most of the time.

An actual article or newspaper? No. I lived in Utah, though, so I can tell you that the trib is seen as the liberal newspaper and the Deseret News is seen as the conservative newspaper.

Alrighty then, I don't doubt you.

197 darthstar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:47:45pm

Image: o-ROMNESIA-MITTMENTO-MOVIE-POSTER-570.jpg

198 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:47:54pm

Romney Binders game

199 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:48:12pm

[Link: cheezburger.com...]

200 dragonath  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:48:37pm

re: #190 Mostly sane, most of the time.

Deseret...? Is that like, some kind of fancy ice cream?

201 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:48:59pm

re: #195 Varek Raith

Obola!
/

The Black Death... YOU'RE RACIST FOR THINKING THAT IS RACIST!
///

202 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:49:15pm

re: #194 Killgore Trout

CNN crawl: CNN/ORC poll taken after second debate: 49% of likely Florida voters support Mitt Romney, and 48% back President Obama.

Also, we do have to take those numbers with a grain of salt, as the registered voter poll had Obama up something like 5 or 6, I believe? So, they're in Gallup's corner in saying there's a massive enthusiasm gap that isn't exactly being shown in other polls (or in the early voting stats).

203 darthstar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:49:42pm
204 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:49:44pm

re: #195 Varek Raith

Obola!
/

Joke that I might have made:
///
MSNBC: Ebola is from Africa, so 'Obola' is racist!
///

But actually, given how it would likely be used, 'Obola' really would be racist.

205 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:49:50pm

this should be handy for the ladies...

[Link: cheezburger.com...]

206 Varek Raith  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:50:59pm

re: #204 Dark_Falcon

Yep, that's what I was channeling.
Wingnut humor.

207 darthstar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:51:33pm

re: #200 dragonath

Deseret...? Is that like, some kind of fancy ice cream?

I thought it was a Neil Diamond song. I remember Deseret...oh Deseret!

208 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:51:42pm

re: #206 Varek Raith

Yep, that's what I was channeling.
Wingnut humor.

careful of humor that has to go around several corners to make a point, it can wind up biting you in the butt...

209 dragonath  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:51:44pm

re: #199 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

Wow, that last debate must have really burned, when some guy makes a tl;dr comment at that site.

210 A Mom Anon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:53:08pm

re: #193 Kragar

Same happens with defense spending. It's a lack of oversight and not enforcing the stated cost of the bids to do the job. If a contractor underbids by a big margin,that should be an indicator of probable cost overruns on down the line. IMO a company should also be fined big time for shoddy workmanship or cutting corners by using crappy materials(I'm talking to you Halliburton and KBR). Do those things and you could cut alot of waste and fraud.

The WPA was a really interesting and kind of awesome idea,I have a collection of books about it,especially the writer's project and the stuff related to the National Parks.

211 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:54:17pm

re: #202 JamesWI

Also, we do have to take those numbers with a grain of salt, as the registered voter poll had Obama up something like 5 or 6, I believe? So, they're in Gallup's corner in saying there's a massive enthusiasm gap that isn't exactly being shown in other polls (or in the early voting stats).

Where are the crosstabs published for CNN/ORC polls?

212 Varek Raith  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:55:24pm

re: #208 AK-47%

careful of humor that has to go around several corners to make a point, it can wind up biting you in the butt...

Yeah, too smart for wingnut humor.
/
Yeah, I know, I get your point.
:)

213 AK-47%  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:55:45pm

re: #210 A Mom Anon

There was a famous case of a defense contractor, I think it was Hughes Aircraft in Tucson, who had a whole assembly line ostensibly being paid for a defense project while actually turning out illegal cable descrabmler boxes...

The defense-spending version of the Welfare-Mom-driving-a-Cadillac anecdote, I guess...

/

214 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:57:07pm

re: #206 Varek Raith

Yep, that's what I was channeling.
Wingnut humor.

i actually started out making the joke, but then I thought about it a bit more and decided to go in a different direction. While I still think MSNBC was overboard in suggesting Republicans' use of "Chicago" was a dog whistle, the fact is that if someone actually used the line 'Obola', it would more likely than not be part of an attack with racist tones.

215 darthstar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:57:37pm

This is what happens when your voter registration subcontractor gets caught breaking the law and you have to suspend Voter Registration drives in five states. I wonder if the RNC regrets trying to suppress the vote yet, or if they'll have to wait until November to deny it hurt them.


216 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 1:57:56pm

re: #211 goddamnedfrank

Where are the crosstabs published for CNN/ORC polls?

I've been trying to look for them since I posted the last comment, I'm not finding it. I was going off of what I saw on Twitter when the poll was released.

I wonder if they stopped publishing all that info after their post-debate polls got torn apart for being horrible.

217 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:01:05pm

Deseret is a word from the Book of Mormon.

It means honeybee. The honeybee is the state insect.

(The state flower is the Sego Lily. The early pioneers ate Sego liliy bulbs during the first few winters to survive. It's nice when the state symbols have a point, rather than just being random.)

218 The Ghost of a Flea  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:01:52pm

re: #206 Varek Raith

Yep, that's what I was channeling.
Wingnut humor.

Wingnut humor would be something like:

Welfare Hussein Obama

The formula is [Tribally Understood Dog Whistle] + [Insult] + [Real or Imagined Offense Taken By Target].

219 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:02:23pm

re: #211 goddamnedfrank

Where are the crosstabs published for CNN/ORC polls?

Nevermind, I just found it. Not linked on CNN's site, but it was on RCP.

220 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:03:09pm
221 Mattand  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:03:56pm

re: #202 JamesWI

Also, we do have to take those numbers with a grain of salt, as the registered voter poll had Obama up something like 5 or 6, I believe? So, they're in Gallup's corner in saying there's a massive enthusiasm gap that isn't exactly being shown in other polls (or in the early voting stats).

If my experiences with racist conservative seniors who live in the South is any indication, those numbers in FL (49% for Mitt, 48% for Obama) may be more accurate than people want to admit.

222 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:03:58pm

re: #219 JamesWI

Nevermind, I just found it. Not linked on CNN's site, but it was on RCP.

Obama up 7 with registered voters, down 1 with likely......

They cut out almost 1/3 of their registered voters to get their likely voters.

223 dragonath  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:04:43pm

re: #217 Mostly sane, most of the time.

Aww that's kind of cute.

Unrelated, but the Honeybee is in fact not native to North America. Lots of states have em as State Insects though.

224 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:04:45pm

re: #178 wrenchwench

Nah, just blow by the blogs, the funny T shirt industry is all over the election. That might have been a much better source.

225 alpuz  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:08:27pm

re: #220 Gus

edit: never mind.

226 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:08:32pm

re: #222 JamesWI

Obama up 7 with registered voters, down 1 with likely......

They cut out almost 1/3 of their registered voters to get their likely voters.

They also maxed out their acceptable margin of error on non-whites and under 50's. Meaning that according to their stated methodology if they'd had just one fewer black respondent under 50 they wouldn't have been able to publish numbers for either category.

227 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:08:52pm

re: #225 alpuz

Typo?

Yes!

228 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:10:10pm

Fixing. Kind of tired here today. :)

229 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:10:30pm

re: #222 JamesWI

Obama up 7 with registered voters, down 1 with likely......

They cut out almost 1/3 of their registered voters to get their likely voters.

That sounds about right.

230 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:10:39pm

re: #224 Daniel Ballard

Nah, just blow by the blogs, the funny T shirt industry is all over the election. That might have been a much better source.

No matter the source, any pro-Romney propaganda is still in support of a racist, so there's no escape.

231 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:11:27pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

That's sounds about right.

Really? You think 1/3 of the people who are actually willing to sit through a poll (after getting hounded with calls all election season), aren't going to actually vote?

232 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:11:48pm

Fixed.

233 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:12:41pm

Bozo!

Hostility to Islam is as valid as hostility to Nazism. In both cases there are good reasons to be hostile, and they are the same reasons.


-- Pat Condell

234 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:12:43pm

I already don't participate in any polls, and I'm definitely going to vote. I can only imagine the complete lack of motivation I would have to sit through any of the polls that call my house if I had no interest in voting.

235 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:12:58pm

re: #231 JamesWI

Really? You think 1/3 of the people who are actually willing to sit through a poll (after getting hounded with calls all election season), aren't going to actually vote?

Yep. People are lazy, and that's how it normally goes.

236 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:13:38pm

re: #165 Daniel Ballard

Would anyone care to vote in my pre election poll?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

OK, the polling script is now working again. Have at it.

237 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:24:42pm

re: #230 wrenchwench
Well there is this sort of thing out there, anti Obama and certainly not pro Romney...
I do NOT endorse this graphic. I find it just stupid.
Angry moonbats need to calm down a little maybe.

Image: obama_peace_prize_bombs_sticker--217832612822544248-product-210.jpg

238 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:24:59pm

re: #236 Charles Johnson

Thank you Charles.

239 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:26:09pm

re: #235 Dark_Falcon

Yep. People are lazy, and that's how it normally goes.

Saying 1/3 of the people of Florida aren't going to vote is obviously acceptable, as the number would probably be bigger than that.

But 1/3 of the people actually willing to sit through an entire poll and answer all the questions? I just can't imagine too many non-voters would be willing to do that. If you're too lazy to care about voting, you generally would be too lazy to care about answering a dozen or more questions about how you're going to (not) vote.

240 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:27:11pm

re: #239 JamesWI

Saying 1/3 of the people of Florida aren't going to vote is obviously acceptable, as the number would probably be bigger than that.

But 1/3 of the people actually willing to sit through an entire poll and answer all the questions? I just can't imagine too many non-voters would be willing to do that. If you're too lazy to care about voting, you generally would be too lazy to care about answering a dozen or more questions about how you're going to (not) vote.

Most other LV screens I see tend to weed out about 1/6-1/9 of the RVs in a poll. I can't remember seeing one as drastic as this poll.

241 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:27:21pm

re: #237 Daniel Ballard

Well there is this sort of thing out there, anti Obama and certainly not pro Romney...
I do NOT endorse this graphic. I find it just stupid.
Angry moonbats need to calm down a little maybe.

Image: obama_peace_prize_bombs_sticker--217832612822544248-product-210.jpg

What did you think of my comment calling Romney a racist?

242 engineer cat  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:28:03pm

problem loading page

Rogue Hamster Crew Attacks LGF Hamster Wheel

aim to corner market in food pellets and SQL queries

244 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:30:13pm

Romney’s New ‘Military Advisory Council’ Packed With Military Contractors

Mitt Romney’s campaign yesterday announced a “Military Advisory Council” of retired military officers who support his candidacy for president. “While many of those on the Council are clearly decorated veterans,” boldprogressive.org’s Zaid Jilani observes, “one curious aspect of the list is how many of these military figures left the government only to become highly paid consultants and board members to major weapons makers.” Romney plans on increasing military spending by more than $2 trillion should he become president (without any plan to pay for it) and perhaps Romney’s new supporters plan on cashing in. Jilani lists some members of Romney’s council and their defense industry affiliations here.

245 engineer cat  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:31:11pm

Romney’s New ‘Military Advisory Council’

"i advise you to buy all my stuff"

246 Gus  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:32:05pm

!

248 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:32:46pm

Again, we're still trying different approaches to optimize the settings for the new web server - sorry for the temporary outages, but we're working on it and we'll get it settled.

249 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:33:53pm

re: #244 Kragar

Romney’s New ‘Military Advisory Council’ Packed With Military Contractors

Mitt is at heart a businessman. it would figure he'd want to surround himself with others who are comfortable with his views and who've had both military and private sector experience.

BBL

250 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:34:04pm

re: #246 Gus

!

[Embedded content]

People can come to their senses. That's why I don't always feel like I'm beating my head against a wall.

251 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:34:12pm

re: #241 wrenchwench

You have a good point, personally I draw a small distinction between active virulent racists and those that merely hire them or associate with them. It's a matter of degree. Of course DF has declared his vote, even though his poorly sourced graphic made no mention of Mitt. The racist in immigration seems terribly consistent with anti evolutionists on the science committee.

As a moderate conservative I do wonder what will be up for those like me in the future. Will the GOP split into TP and old school? Or will it fall and another party arise, or perhaps the Dems might split under the weight of incoming moderate conservatives into moderate and farther left? Perhaps the only sensible status for us is permanent no affiliation.

I personally do not expect to see the same 2 parties fighting it out in 2020.

252 Kragar  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:35:08pm

Tea Party Group Plans Obama Phone Bank Sabotage

A small Florida-based Tea Party group, Lee912, is urging Republicans to sabotage a key Obama campaign organizing tool, an online feature that allows supporters to access a list of phone numbers and place calls on behalf of the campaign from home.

Posting on the website, Meetup.com, the group's founder — Dr. Joe Magnant, a vein specialist practicing in Fort Meyers, Fla. — asked Lee912 members Thursday to use the Obama phone list to campaign for Romney.

Magnant suggests callers make the case directly for the Romney-Ryan ticket or just mark the voter as "already called" ("This will remove them from their call list," Magnant explains).

253 Daniel Ballard  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:36:12pm

re: #244 Kragar

He would then be able to point to a war and say "I built that".
///

254 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:36:55pm

One weird assumption that polls make is that admittedly bad data can be stacked to produce nominally larger and more trustworthy samples. Look at the CNN/ORC poll, there's only two age categories, under 50 and over 50. Now the under 50's have a margin of error of +/- 8.5, which is the very highest their stated methodology allows before they'll simply not publish the number because it's too unreliable. In comparison their over 50 sample has a MOE of +/- 4.5, meaning that they oversampled the hell out of the over 50 crowd vs. everyone younger. However when it comes time to publish results they add all the ages together and claim an overall margin of error of +/- 4. In other words the sheer badness of their sampling of younger voters is forgotten and the overall sample is given an MOE @ a so called 95% certainty that's nominally better than either of the constituent results.

255 MittDoesNotCompute  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:38:59pm

re: #252 Kragar

Tea Party Group Plans Obama Phone Bank Sabotage

What a bunch of choads...

256 makeitstop  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:39:54pm

re: #252 Kragar

Tea Party Group Plans Obama Phone Bank Sabotage

How can these people take any pride in their party?

There is nothing at all positive about them. They're all about destruction, hatred and fear.

How can anyone take pride in that?

257 Mattand  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:40:45pm

My auto new comments reload has been getting stuck in reload for a while now, even before Server-poaclypse. Is that a thing, or am I doing something wrong?

258 Decatur Deb  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:41:51pm

re: #252 Kragar

Tea Party Group Plans Obama Phone Bank Sabotage

Not much of a threat. Wife did phone banking in FL while I did canvassing. The Obama for America folks don't just hand out their lists, they phone bank in small groups. A false-flag would have to have a sloppy community or regional OfA leader to let him pose like that.

259 wrenchwench  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:41:51pm

re: #251 Daniel Ballard

You have a good point, personally I draw a small distinction between active virulent racists and those that merely hire them or associate with them. It's a matter of degree.

I appreciate your moderation, but I'm going to push back against this part. Romney is running for president. He has vast amounts of attention on himself because of this. Hiring a racist under these circumstances totally legitimizes that racist's views. That is active. That is not passive. That is truly supporting racism, something that is done only by racists and people who, if they aren't racists, are too stupid to be elected dog catcher. Romney is not stupid.

Therefore, I don't see it as a matter of degree. The white supremacist at home yelling at his TV is doing less to support racism.

260 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:42:43pm

re: #259 wrenchwench

I appreciate your moderation, but I'm going to push back against this part. Romney is running for president. He has vast amounts of attention on himself because of this. Hiring a racist under these circumstances totally legitimizes that racist's views. That is active. That is not passive. That is truly supporting racism, something that is done only by racists and people who, if they aren't racists, are too stupid to be elected dog catcher. Romney is not stupid.

Therefore, I don't see it as a matter of degree. The white supremacist at home yelling at his TV is doing less to support racism.

Absolutely right. Applause.

261 freetoken  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:44:29pm

re: #254 goddamnedfrank

Now the under 50's have a margin of error of +/- 8.5, [...]

I would get a kick out of every time that kind of statement is published and quoted, if it weren't so sad.

Even if the calculation of "margin of error" was accurate - and by no means do I believe the polling organizations are repeatable tests - the reading/listening audience has no clue about what the phrase means.

In astronomy and elementary particle physics, the golden bar for asserting truth, so to speak, is five "sigma". That is, the measurement is expected to be an actual measurement and not some noise with odds better than 1 in a few million.

The poll you quoted at "margin of error of +/- 8.5" is telling me that the so called data is very untrustworthy.

And yet people will quote such polls as if they mean something.

262 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:45:41pm

Hey Dark_Falcon, did you ever talk to that trusted best friend of yours who said black turnout would be down this year? Are you ready yet to relay the incredibly compelling reasoning and insight of his into the mindset of minority voters?

263 Charles Johnson  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:45:59pm

Romney's invitation of Jerome Corsi into his press corps is even more troubling, if you ask me. Corsi is every kind of right wing wacko - a racist, a Birther, a fanatic fundamentalist, a blatant liar. The guy is simply deranged and for him to be anywhere near a presidential candidate is highly disturbing.

264 engineer cat  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:46:44pm

re: #251 Daniel Ballard

perhaps the Dems might split under the weight of incoming moderate conservatives into moderate and farther left?

i generally agree except i would classify democratic politicians as center and slightly to the left of center. this would still put them to the right of most "conservatives" in europe

"in america, you have the republican party, which is like our conservative party, and the democratic party, which is like our conservative party"

- british comedy group 'beyond the fringe', 1962

265 freetoken  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:47:28pm

re: #263 Charles Johnson

With Corsi and Kobach on his team, Mitt might as well just sign on Joe Farah and Peter Brimelow and be done with it.

266 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:49:02pm

re: #261 freetoken

The poll you quoted at "margin of error of +/- 8.5" is telling me that the so called data is very untrustworthy.

And yet people will quote such polls as if they mean something.

Not only that, but the MOE is calculated at an industry standard of 95% certainty, meaning they're always giving one in twenty odds that the final result will land totally outside the given range.

267 JamesWI  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 2:51:41pm

re: #254 goddamnedfrank

One weird assumption that polls make is that admittedly bad data can be stacked to produce nominally larger and more trustworthy samples. Look at the CNN/ORC poll, there's only two age categories, under 50 and over 50. Now the under 50's have a margin of error of +/- 8.5, which is the very highest their stated methodology allows before they'll simply not publish the number because it's too unreliable. Now their over 50 sample has a MOE of +/- 4.5, meaning that they oversampled the hell out of the over 50 crowd vs. everyone younger. However when it comes time to publish results they add all the ages together and claim an overall margin of error of +/- 4. In other words the sheer badness of their sampling of younger voters is forgotten and the overall sample is given an MOE @ a so called 95% certainty that's nominally better than either of the constituent results.

One thing I'm not getting from these crosstabs:

In the intro, it says the Party ID for the LVs is 32%D, 32%R, 36% I (which is already sketchy).

But in all the questions where they break it down between parties, the Republican MOE is 6.0%, the Independents MOE is at 6.5%, and the Dems MOE is at 7.0%.

So....how does that happen when there are supposedly the same amount of Dems and Repubs, and more indies?

Looks to me like CNN is just really bad at conducting polls.

268 CuriousLurker  Fri, Oct 19, 2012 3:02:57pm

re: #248 Charles Johnson

Again, we're still trying different approaches to optimize the settings for the new web server - sorry for the temporary outages, but we're working on it and we'll get it settled.

I hope when everything is fixed you'll be doing a Tech Note for us geeks about how you improved the database queries & whatnot.


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