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440 comments
1 mr.fusion  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:05:31pm

LOVE this ad

How cynical of Romney, and how sad that his lying and deception could land him the most powerful job in the world.

He is not fit for the office of the Presidency

2 efuseakay  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:07:53pm

Actually calling Romney a liar. About damn time.

3 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:08:51pm

Should that title say 'New' not 'Now'?

4 Kragarghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:09:50pm


Brian Kilmeade Wonders If Obama Cancelling Events For Hurricane Sandy A Sign His Campaign In ‘Disarray’

With Hurricane Sandy batters the East Coast, President Barack Obama has opted to cancel campaign events in battleground states in order to monitor the situation on the ground. With the president preparing to leave Florida after cancelling a rally, Brian Kilmeade wondered if the cancellation of events ahead of the storm was a sign of “disarray” within the Obama campaign.

5 Lidanghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:09:56pm
6 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:11:26pm

On the other hand...

7 The Mountain That Blogs  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:11:32pm

re: #5 Lidane

Nice. Still needs the statue's head kicked off, Cloverfield-style.

8 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:13:41pm

re: #4 Kragar

If Obama is in disarray, Mitt Romney would be too, seeing as they've both canceled campaign events today and tomorrow.

The truth, of course, is that the campaigns are on hold because both men realize that to be out kissing babies while New York City is flooding would be to be an indifferent asshole. But once again the Obama hater feels the need to hate.

9 darthstar  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:14:09pm

Holy crap! I'm glad I'm not in New York right now!

10 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:17:06pm

re: #5 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Brilliant. I'm so sick of seeing that picture.

(Is this fucking wind ever going to die down?)

11 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:17:53pm

re: #8 Dark_Falcon

If Obama is in disarray, Mitt Romney would be too, seeing as they've both canceled campaign events today and tomorrow.

The truth, of course, is that the campaigns are on hold because both men realize that to be out kissing babies while New York City is flooding would be to be an indifferent asshole. But once again the Obama hater feels the need to hate.

I see by your dings you're still falling for the Benghazi trutherism.

12 Lidanghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:18:38pm

re: #11 wrenchwench

Benghazi trutherism.

13 darthstar  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:19:36pm

re: #5 Lidane

Ah, I figured someone beat me to it. Still fun.

14 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:20:37pm

re: #12 Lidane

[Embedded content]

They don't want real answers on Libya, they want one of their shit balls to stick.

15 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:20:48pm

re: #13 darthstar

Still fun.

Unless the incessant wind is making you cranky....

16 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:22:04pm

re: #8 Dark_Falcon

If Obama is in disarray, Mitt Romney would be too, seeing as they've both canceled campaign events today and tomorrow.

The truth, of course, is that the campaigns are on hold because both men realize that to be out kissing babies while New York City is flooding would be to be an indifferent asshole. But once again the Obama hater feels the need to hate.

I think Lostlakehiker was getting piled on unfairly for posting the WaPo report. Curt's page was briefly updinged, but that was reversed after an examination of its sources proved it unworthy of support. The Washington Times report was full of crap, but the Washington Post had useful information.

17 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:23:01pm

WND/Breitbart dumbnuts still promoting "Obama is anti-Israel" bullshit

18 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:23:08pm

re: #10 makeitstop

Brilliant. I'm so sick of seeing that picture.

(Is this fucking wind ever going to die down?)

I'm watching a massive tree in a neighbours yard sway like a sapling. It's freaky!

One more spike and my modem's going to go on strike. And I have NO idea how to boot the box (from the cable company that runs the DSL). It has no power switch, no power cord and the 'cable in' line is locked.

3G still on, tho!

19 A Mom Anon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:26:44pm

I cannot express how glad I'll be next freaking Wednesday when this election is over. Also glad I voted early and got that part done.

I'm seeing alot of these little christian fish stickers around here lately that have the letters BGB inside the fish. Bring God Back. He's on break,I guess?
I get so tired of people who have such weak faith they can't be without a biblical reference everywhere they look. Even freaking Yoga is a problem for these people now. I was listening to a lady in line at the polling place today talk about how the "liberals are trying to indoctrinate our kids by trying to sneak yoga into some phys ed classes". Really? Yoga? If true,that's pretty freaking clever and diabolical. And too subtle. I say go big and get right to the goat sacrifices in home ec class.

20 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:28:02pm

re: #16 Dark_Falcon

I think Lostlakehiker was getting piled on unfairly for posting the WaPo report. Curt's page was briefly updinged, but that was reversed after an examination of its sources proved it unworthy of support. The Washington Times report was full of crap, but the Washington Post had useful information.

OK, 50% then. Llh is being fairly piled on.

21 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:28:08pm

re: #9 darthstar

It's getting real bad - winds are picking up here in Bergen County, brother in law lost power as a tree came through power lines and into a house in Plainview LI; flooding in Long Beach is going to be horrific.

Tidal gauges in Sandy Hook are already at record levels and rising.

Tidal gauges at the Battery are on the rise and already seeing localized flooding in Lower Manhattan. Serious flooding is likely within the next few hours...

And the winds keep on coming.

22 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:28:14pm

re: #18 Joanne

I'm watching a massive tree in a neighbors yard sway like a sapling. Same here in Philly. The tree is across the street. Not good if it breaks. :(

23 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:28:59pm

re: #15 wrenchwench

Unless the incessant wind is making you cranky....

Put me in that column, plz.

It sounds like a couple of freight trains drag racing down my block. It's gone beyond being scary and now it's just wearing me out. Too much stress.

24 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:29:41pm

re: #22 PhillyPretzel

I had that last year and I'm worried about another tree that could cause big damage. Worried about all these majestic oaks on the main road near me. They're all too likely to go any time tonight....

25 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:29:43pm

re: #17 Sheila Broflovski

26 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:30:17pm
27 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:30:21pm

We're now getting big gusts - I'd estimate about 50mph or more just coming through now... Strongest of the day.

28 Charles Johnson  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:30:39pm

re: #16 Dark_Falcon

The purpose of the post was to make yet another confused attempt to claim that there was some kind of "cover-up" by the Obama administration, and I really am on my last nerve with this BS.

29 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:32:04pm

re: #20 wrenchwench

OK, 50% then. Llh is being fairly piled on.

I respectfully disagree. I think, though, that the WaPo report is non-crazy enough to cover you and I disagreeing about it, since we both agree that the Wa-Times piece is a pack of lies.

30 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:32:16pm

re: #23 makeitstop

Put me in that column, plz.

It sounds like a couple of freight trains drag racing down my block. It's gone beyond being scary and now it's just wearing me out. Too much stress.

I've never been in winds like that, but the Santa Ana winds in So California used to make me crazy.

31 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:32:55pm

Hurricane Sandy pass 1 and 2 from the ISS.

Youtube Video
Youtube Video
32 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:33:52pm

re: #29 Dark_Falcon

I respectfully disagree. I think, though, that the WaPo report is non-crazy enough to cover you and I disagreeing about it, since we both agree that the Wa-Times piece is a pack of lies.

Lostlakehiker's comment, "And there you have it." was irritating, unnecessary, and wrong.

33 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:35:39pm

Reposted from thread below:

East River is overtopping at the South Street Seaport; still two hours before high tide.

Battery gauge is at 9.3 9.74 feet and rising.

Sandy Hook already at record levels and rising.

Other areas are seeing significant flooding.

34 darthstar  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:35:48pm

All this Hurricane Sandy stuff is making me feel like I should do something. So when I get off work I'm going to go home, put a load of laundry in the machine, make myself a cocktail, and watch the news for a while. Sadly, there are no baseball games scheduled for tonight.

By the way, thank you Detroit for beating the Yankees...this storm would have totally screwed up our ability to have a parade on Wednesday.

35 darthstar  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:36:54pm

re: #33 lawhawk

Youtube Video
36 erik_t  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:37:41pm

re: #34 darthstar

By the way, thank you Detroit for beating the Yankees...

Further explanation unnecessary

37 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:39:11pm

re: #36 erik_t

Further explanation unnecessary

Pffffffft on you both. My poor adopted city.

38 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:40:11pm

re: #35 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Youtube Video
39 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:40:29pm

LIPA on LI is showing nearly 500k without power.

40 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:41:13pm

re: #36 erik_t

Further explanation unnecessary

Edit:
NOTE TO SELF: Read for comprehension.

41 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:41:30pm
42 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:44:24pm

Just got back.

News of the flooding and storm surge?

43 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:45:16pm
44 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:45:57pm

re: #42 ProGunLiberal

Just got back.

News of the flooding and storm surge?

The floodwaters are threatening to wash away all logic and sanity.

/

45 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:46:20pm

re: #43 Mattand

[Embedded content]

Stay safe.

46 Lidanghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:46:39pm
47 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:47:36pm

re: #44 Dark_Falcon

No, dead serious. I have missed most of the news. The surge is supposed to be 11-15 ft at NYC last I heard.

48 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:48:07pm
49 erik_t  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:48:34pm

WTF.

ROB PORTMAN: It was Barack Obama who took GM and Chrysler through bankruptcy, okay. Right? Am I right? Second, it was Mitt Romney who actually did provide for loan guarantees to make sure the warranties were backed up.

What in the zombie jesus... how did Romney affect this process in any way? As a private citizen and perpetual presidential campaigner? I mean, even if we wanted to pretend that Bain were of a meaningful scale compared to GM, who is fucking GM, he wasn't even involved with Bain at that point.

How the shit does this statement make any sense, even in Tealand?

50 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:48:45pm

re: #42 ProGunLiberal

10.1 feet at the Battery and rising.

Sandy Hook at 11.09 (record level) and rising.

Just had a near miss - transformers sparked near the house (probably branches hitting wires).

51 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:48:55pm

re: #47 ProGunLiberal

Sandy will landfall as a Cat 1 Hurricane. This is unprecedented so late in the season.

52 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:49:09pm

Ocean waves south of LI about to top 30 feet.

NDBC

53 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:49:22pm

re: #50 lawhawk

What does that mean, at the Battery?

54 Lidanghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:50:05pm

re: #49 erik_t

How the shit does this statement make any sense, even in Tealand?

Because Obama, that's why.

55 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:50:22pm

re: #53 ProGunLiberal

What does that mean, at the Battery?

Battery Park... or...

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

56 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:50:48pm

Where you place your cannons to fire at British vessels. :)

57 Lidanghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:51:38pm
58 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:51:49pm
59 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:53:10pm

re: #57 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Fuck.

60 dragonfire1981  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:53:23pm

re: #26 Gus

[Embedded content]

Wow, that seriously looks like it's straight out of "The Day after Tomorrow"

61 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:53:53pm

re: #51 ProGunLiberal

What Gus said. The Southern tip of Manhattan originally was an artillery site, placed to deter sea raids on what was then New Amsterdam.

62 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:55:09pm

re: #53 ProGunLiberal

The Battery gauge is at the southern tip of Manhattan. With the flooding down there, it's going to get Con Ed to shut the grid to protect their gear plus customers' gear. That means that the exchanges will be shuttered as well as most financial and news reporting firms from lower Manhattan. WTC and Battery Park City also affected.

It's also meaning that depending on where the waters eventually rise to, that it could cause significant flood damage to the subways at South Ferry, including the Fulton Terminal.

Flooding of the MTA tunnels could mean that the subways could be out of commission for a while.

63 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:55:15pm

re: #21 lawhawk

It's getting real bad - winds are picking up here in Bergen County, brother in law lost power as a tree came through power lines and into a house in Plainview LI; flooding in Long Beach is going to be horrific.

Tidal gauges in Sandy Hook are already at record levels and rising.

Tidal gauges at the Battery are on the rise and already seeing localized flooding in Lower Manhattan. Serious flooding is likely within the next few hours...

And the winds keep on coming.

Question for you: is the Battery a candidate for more damage since it's landfill, IIRC?

64 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:55:55pm

re: #57 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Is this authentic?

65 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:56:23pm

re: #45 Dark_Falcon

Stay safe.

Appreciate it.

66 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:56:50pm

A million people are without power and rising in NYC metro.

67 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:57:10pm

Power is out at Battery Park.

68 Lidanghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:57:24pm

re: #64 b_sharp

Is this authentic?

The blue check mark says it's the verified FDNY account, so I guess so.

69 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:57:58pm

re: #53 ProGunLiberal

What does that mean, at the Battery?

New York, New York --
A hell of a town,
The Bronx is up and the Battery's down.

70 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:58:05pm

Question for you weather experts.

In a late season hurricane like this, are tornadoes spun off?

71 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:58:07pm

The house is shaking under the wind. Surreal and frightening.

72 dragonfire1981  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:58:09pm

YES.

73 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:58:10pm

re: #63 Mattand

Well, there's a sea wall, and most of Lower Manhattan is fill, so it's likely to be flooded out, but the location is why it's so at risk. It's at the point where the East River/Hudson River and Greater NY Harbor come together - everything points to it.

74 erik_t  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:58:17pm

re: #62 lawhawk

Flooding of the MTA tunnels could mean that the subways could be out of commission for a while.

But it might get the smell down.

75 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:58:53pm

re: #68 Lidane

The blue check mark says it's the verified FDNY account, so I guess so.

I hope it's a false alarm.
Or an empty building.

76 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:59:01pm

re: #72 dragonfire1981

The Star Wars fan in me loves that one.

77 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 3:59:36pm

re: #71 makeitstop

Yeah, we've been getting an increasing number of flickering lights and the gusts are causing distant thuds.

Mrs. Lawhawk's aunt has already lost trees - but thankfully missing the house.

78 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:00:05pm

Star Wars sucks.

79 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:00:35pm

re: #77 lawhawk

Yeah, we've been getting an increasing number of flickering lights and the gusts are causing distant thuds.

Mrs. Lawhawk's aunt has already lost trees - but thankfully missing the house.

This thing's gotta peak out sometime. Gotta hope so anyway.

I'm amazed that we've still got power here.

80 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:00:47pm

We're getting some lightning flashes down in South Jersey. Way off to the east, so I can't quite pinpoint where.

81 darthstar  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:01:18pm

Romney Surrogate says what?

82 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:01:25pm

re: #79 makeitstop

I still have power in Philly.

83 erik_t  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:01:31pm

re: #78 b_sharp

Star Wars sucks.

Um.... well..... ur mom sucks.

84 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:01:42pm

re: #49 erik_t

WTF.

What in the zombie jesus... how did Romney affect this process in any way? As a private citizen and perpetual presidential campaigner? I mean, even if we wanted to pretend that Bain were of a meaningful scale compared to GM, who is fucking GM, he wasn't even involved with Bain at that point.

How the shit does this statement make any sense, even in Tealand?

Obama says Romney opposed any government help to rescue carmakers (mostly false)

85 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:02:11pm

re: #49 erik_t

I read that Bain had rejected any capital infusion into GM. (Looking for link.)

And since when do the teahadists require, or appreciate, ANY kind of logic?

86 erik_t  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:02:52pm

re: #81 darthstar

Romney Surrogate says what?

But Christie is neither effete nor high-pitched. How could he have fallen under Silver's mathematical spell!?

87 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:03:14pm

re: #79 makeitstop

This thing's gotta peak out sometime. Gotta hope so anyway.

I'm amazed that we've still got power here.

Preaching to the choir. We were initially mentally prepared to be without power for 2 days, but I'm starting to think a week is likely.

I have a newfound appreciation for the people who live in LA, FL, the Carolinas, and other hurricane hotspots. I don't know how they deal with it.

88 Someone Please Beam Me Up!  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:03:39pm

re: #78 b_sharp

Star Wars sucks.

Hey, it's one thing to argue about politics, but stay away from this, or you'll find out what trouble is!

//

89 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:03:59pm

re: #87 Mattand

It is part of life in those areas.

90 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:04:03pm

re: #85 Joanne

I read that Bain had rejected any capital infusion into GM. (Looking for link.)

And since when do the teahadists require, or appreciate, ANY kind of logic?

See #84.Portman is referring to Mitt's bankruptcy proposal.

91 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:04:10pm

About that building collapse:

A building located at 92 8th Ave. in Manhattan has suffered a collapsed front facade and falling debris in advance of the landfall of Hurricane Sandy, a New York Fire Department spokesperson confirmed in a phone interview with TPM.

FDNY had no reported injuries at the time of the interview with TPM and 25 units were on the scene clearing debris and checking to see if anyone was hurt.

The building, which appears to be a "Muscle Maker Grill" chain restaurant location, collapsed at about 6:30 p.m. local time, the FDNY spokesperson told TPM.

92 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:04:11pm

re: #83 erik_t

Um.... well..... ur mom sucks.

You know, she probably did when she was alive.

93 erik_t  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:04:11pm

re: #84 Killgore Trout

Obama says Romney opposed any government help to rescue carmakers (mostly false)

My cat's breathe smells like cat food
2+2 = purple
This is a relevant and thoughtful counter-point to Portman's comments


One of these three statements is correct.

94 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:04:54pm

Image: collapsed.jpg

95 ghazidor  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:05:23pm

re: #70 b_sharp

Question for you weather experts.

In a late season hurricane like this, are tornadoes spun off?

Any major atmospheric disturbance like this can spawn tornadoes, but they are only possibly at the very periphery of the storms outlying cloud activity. The winds in the storm proper are too strong for Cumulonimbus incus (anvil clouds) the kind that usually spawn tornadoes to form. In Florida we often get water spouts and tornadoes along the edges of a major storm system like this.

96 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:05:36pm

Sandy is Post-Tropical.

97 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:06:18pm

Building collapse was just the facade.

[Link: www.businessinsider.com...]

98 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:06:33pm

re: #84 Killgore Trout

Obama says Romney opposed any government help to rescue carmakers (mostly false)

Once again: we can't figure out what the fuck Romney was talking about, and his campaign won't clarify for us, so any characterization of his words is false.

99 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:06:38pm

re: #71 makeitstop

The house is shaking under the wind. Surreal and frightening.

{{{makeitstop makeitstop makeitstop makeitstop makeitstop}}}

100 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:07:02pm

re: #84 Killgore Trout

Obama says Romney opposed any government help to rescue carmakers (mostly false)

The banks weren't lending and Romney wanted loan guarantees, that's funny. Henry Paulson had forced the banks to accept $250 billion in capital infusions so that they would lend, instead the credit markets remained frozen. So why exactly should the US Government guarantee loans made with it's own money? All Obama did was eliminate the idea of going through demonstrably unwilling middlemen.

101 RadicalModerate  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:07:31pm

Hurricane Sandy is no longer considered a hurricane, because of the Arctic front that affected most of the country over the weekend has finally reached the tropical system. It's still got the 90mph winds and and extremely-low pressure eye. However, on the western (inland) edge of the storm, there are now widespread reports of sleet and snow.

102 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:07:51pm

re: #86 erik_t

But Christie is neither effete nor high-pitched. How could he have fallen under Silver's mathematical spell!?

Silver's GAY mathematical spell!

103 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:07:58pm

re: #96 ProGunLiberal

Sandy has lost some steam. yay. Let's hope it continues to downgrade.

104 darthstar  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:08:00pm

If you're going to stand in the street like a fucking idiot in order to hype up a storm, don't be surprised if you attract fellow fucking idiots who are there to mock you.

105 erik_t  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:08:30pm

re: #98 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

Once again: we can't figure out what the fuck Romney was talking about, and his campaign won't clarify for us, so any characterization of his words is false.

It's laughably irrelevant to my question as to how Portman could be claiming that Romney did (not proposed to) provide guarantees that saved GM.

I have no idea why he replied to my post. It wasn't in any way related.

KT, would you like to try again? What guarantees did Citizen Romney provide to General Motors?

106 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:08:42pm

re: #99 wrenchwench

{{{makeitstop makeitstop makeitstop makeitstop makeitstop}}}

Thanks, WW. I've been on the verge of just vomiting all day, I'm comforted by the fact that it's only going to last another 12-15 hours.
//////

Is this what the future of hurricanes is going to be? I may just decide to join you in the desert if it is.

107 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:08:45pm

re: #93 erik_t

My cat's breathe smells like cat food
2+2 = purple
This is a relevant and thoughtful counter-point to Portman's comments

One of these three statements is correct.

Just read the Politifact article. There's so many fucking weasel words in there, it'd be funny if so many people didn't rely on the site as the final arbiter.

108 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:09:17pm

re: #97 Gus

Building collapse was just the facade.

[Link: www.businessinsider.com...]

Just imagine if you were walking around naked!

109 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:09:26pm

re: #103 PhillyPretzel

Sandy has lost some steam. yay. Let's hope it continues to downgrade.

When it goes inland through the Alleghenies... inland flooding, small rivers, creeks and streams. Same like what happened with Irene up in Vermont and New Hampshire.

110 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:09:38pm

re: #88 Someone Please Beam Me Up!

Hey, it's one thing to argue about politics, but stay away from this, or you'll find out what trouble is!

//

I had a choice, denigrate Star Wars or promote pineapple on pizza.

111 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:09:42pm

re: #101 RadicalModerate

WVA is reporting blizzard conditions and 2-3 feet of snow likely

112 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:10:16pm

re: #106 makeitstop

Thanks, WW. I've been on the verge of just vomiting all day, I'm comforted by the fact that it's only going to last another 12-15 hours.
//////

Is this what the future of hurricanes is going to be? I may just decide to join you in the desert if it is.

There's plenty of room, but bring some of that water with you.

113 kirkghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:10:59pm

re: #88 Someone Please Beam Me Up!

Hey, it's one thing to argue about politics, but stay away from this, or you'll find out what trouble is!

//

Are you willing to put your life on the line to defend Jar-Jar?

//

114 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:11:16pm

re: #90 Killgore Trout

See #84.Portman is referring to Mitt's bankruptcy proposal.

Which was total bullshit and if you're being honest (which, unfortunately, we've already established you don't care about) you know that, too. Parsing the meaning as mostly false was laughable. They said they couldn't determine Romney's meaning so they gave it a mostly false. Which in itself was laughable. But, again, none of that matters to you. It's all about making points to you, truth or not.

115 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:11:26pm
116 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:12:56pm

Sandy Causes Lakeshore Flood Warning in Chicago

117 Someone Please Beam Me Up!  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:13:15pm

re: #113 kirkspencer

Are you willing to put your life on the line to defend Jar-Jar?

//

I'm neutral in this, and advising YOU to be that way too!

118 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:13:39pm

That's a bit old. Let me check NOAA.

119 darthstar  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:14:57pm

Image: vegan.gif

120 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:15:16pm

30 foot waves south of LI. Holy crap.

121 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:15:23pm

Also, strictly speaking Romney only advocated government loan "guarantees for post bankruptcy financing." That wouldn't have gotten GM through bankruptcy itself, because again there were no willing lenders in the private market.

And since any hypothetical (but in the real world non-existent) private loans would have been made with government money anyways due to the capital infusions, it's not clear why Romney thought it was preferable for the government to then also guarantee those loans.

122 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:16:00pm

Still in effect.

Lakeshore Flood Warning

LAKESHORE HAZARD MESSAGE
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE CHICAGO IL
1204 PM CDT MON OCT 29 2012

ILZ014-300115-
/O.CON.KLOT.LS.W.0001.121030T0600Z-121031T2100Z/
COOK-
1204 PM CDT MON OCT 29 2012

...LAKESHORE FLOOD WARNING REMAINS IN EFFECT FROM 1 AM TUESDAY TO
4 PM CDT WEDNESDAY...

* LAKE SHORE FLOODING...THE REMNANTS OF HURRICANE SANDY ARE
FORECAST TO MOVE ACROSS THE EASTERN GREAT LAKES FROM MONDAY
NIGHT THROUGH WEDNESDAY. DUE TO THE LARGE SIZE OF THIS STORM
SYSTEM...STRONG NORTHERLY WINDS OF 50 TO 60 MPH WILL OCCUR ON
LAKE MICHIGAN FOR A PROLONGED PERIOD FROM LATE TONIGHT THROUGH
TUESDAY EVENING. AS A RESULT...WAVES ACROSS THE SOUTHERN END OF
THE LAKE ARE EXPECTED TO BUILD SIGNIFICANTLY...WITH WAVE HEIGHTS
OF 18 TO 23 FT LIKELY BY TUESDAY ALONG THE COOK COUNTY
SHORELINE...

123 Charles Johnson  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:16:59pm

re: #114 Joanne

If Mitt Romney's "idea" (I hate to dignify it by the word - it's really a kind of right wing fever dream) of having the auto industry go bankrupt with no governmental assistance had been allowed to happen, the chances are extremely good that there would be no US auto industry to speak of right now.

That's the crucial difference between what Obama did and what Romney wanted to do.

With the economy collapsing, there was no private sector financing available on the scale needed to carry the auto industry. If Romney had his way, it would have been a disaster.

Politifact is full of shit on this one, again. It was not "mostly false," it's a correct thing to say that Romney would have let the auto industry fail, not just go bankrupt.

124 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:17:20pm

Related to the inland flooding I mentioned.

Inland flooding: A hidden danger of tropical cyclones

Coastal residents understand the dangers associated with hurricanes — heavy rainfall, high wind and storm surge can cause a host of problems.

But did you know that the majority of hurricane-related deaths in the United States do not occur along the coast?

When these powerful storms move over land, they lose wind strength but continue to dump massive amounts of rain into streams, rivers and lakes — posing a serious threat of inland flooding. These floods account for more than 50 percent of hurricane-related deaths each year...

125 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:17:41pm

re: #104 darthstar

Okay. That's funny. With all the craziness, that's just funny.

Jersey City is seeing major flooding and the streets a few blocks in from the waterfront are now rivers.

Long Beach (LI) is seeing major flooding.

Battery gauge - 10.69 feet (and rising).

126 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:17:59pm

re: #116 Gus

Sandy Causes Lakeshore Flood Warning in Chicago

Thanks for the warning.

127 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:18:10pm

re: #114 Joanne

Which was total bullshit and if you're being honest (which, unfortunately, we've already established you don't care about) you know that, too. Parsing the meaning as mostly false was laughable. They said they couldn't determine Romney's meaning so they gave it a mostly false. Which in itself was laughable. But, again, none of that matters to you. It's all about making points to you, truth or not.

It took all of 30 seconds to google and understand what he was trying to say. Here's Portman's giving the same speech at Hoffstra University a few days ago....
[Link: www.politico.com...]

“Look, I supported a rescue for the auto companies, but these are desperate attacks by President Obama ‘cause he doesn’t want to talk about his record,” the senator said. “First, it was President Obama who actually took GM and Chrysler through bankruptcy. That’s a fact. Second, Mitt Romney did propose government help. He proposed government guarantees for loans. He proposed the government backing up the warranties, and folks, all the independent fact-checkers who have looked at this agree, President Obama was wrong. He was not telling the truth.

He deviated from the script in the Dkos version. It's not hard to figure out what he was trying to say.

128 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:18:16pm

re: #124 Gus

That is why I have been checking my down spout and my storm drain.

129 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:18:24pm

From the NWS 7:00 update:

A wind gust to 82 mph was recently reported at Islip New York.

That's my town.

130 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:18:43pm

re: #122 Gus

That's just nuts. The storm is affecting a larger swath of the country than anyone can possibly imagine. Pretty much from the Mississippi River East to the coast.

131 909Ghazis  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:18:52pm

re: #123 Charles Johnson

And "business's" like Bain Capital would pick up the pieces for pennies on the dollar.

132 ghazidor  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:18:55pm

re: #84 Killgore Trout

Obama says Romney opposed any government help to rescue carmakers (mostly false)

Yeah, yeah, Romney said it would be OK for the government to issue loan guarantees so the automakers could declare bankruptcy and get restructuring loans from private investors.

This completely ignores the fact that all the banks who might have made those loans were underwater and needed money from the government themselves just to stay afloat. It also ignores that it would have meant borrowing the money at highly inflated interest rates while in bankruptcy. Provided that anyone could have been found to loan it to them at all, which is by no means a surety.

Supposing they had, the automakers would still have been saddled with an even higher debt load with higher required repayment rates. It was not the type of recipe for a robust recovery of the auto industry that the TARP loans have proven themselves to be.

133 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:19:43pm

7pm intermediate update:
SUMMARY OF 700 PM EDT...2300 UTC...INFORMATION
----------------------------------------------
LOCATION...39.1N 74.4W
ABOUT 30 MI...50 KM ENE OF CAPE MAY NEW JERSEY
ABOUT 20 MI...35 KM S OF ATLANTIC CITY NEW JERSEY
MAXIMUM SUSTAINED WINDS...85 MPH...140 KM/H
PRESENT MOVEMENT...WNW OR 300 DEGREES AT 28 MPH...44 KM/H
MINIMUM CENTRAL PRESSURE...946 MB...27.93 INCHES

134 erik_t  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:20:22pm

This is dumb. I'm going to go watch a movie or something.

135 sagehen  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:20:30pm

re: #113 kirkspencer

Are you willing to put your life on the line to defend Jar-Jar?

//

no, but I'd give a toe to save the Ewoks.

136 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:20:48pm

re: #133 lawhawk

That helps explain the heavy duty winds.

137 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:21:24pm

re: #130 lawhawk

That's just nuts. The storm is affecting a larger swath of the country than anyone can possibly imagine. Pretty much from the Mississippi River East to the coast.

Yeah. The outer edge is hitting all of Lake Michigan and half of Lake Superior.

138 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:21:43pm

re: #135 sagehen

That and Honor Harrington will ask Nimitz and all of the other treecats in the world to help. //

139 Obdicut  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:23:18pm

re: #127 Killgore Trout

But he's lying. Romney didn't want government to guarantee for the loans that'd take them through bankruptcy, he wanted them to garuntee loans for post-bankruptcy financing. Part of this is because he wanted them to have to junk all the union contracts.

140 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:24:20pm

Google Maps weather.

141 SteveMcG  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:24:37pm

Here in Philadelphia, I've been bounced around more on sunny days.

142 sagehen  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:25:09pm

re: #125 lawhawk

Okay. That's funny. With all the craziness, that's just funny.

Jersey City is seeing major flooding and the streets a few blocks in from the waterfront are now rivers.

Long Beach (LI) is seeing major flooding.

Battery gauge - 10.69 feet (and rising).

On the Upper West Side the buildings are safe (with the possible exception of a couple resturaunts in Riverside Park and on Pier 46)... but the landscaping's going to be a huge mess. I hope the ducks are okay.

143 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:25:16pm
144 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:25:59pm

One57 crane continues swaying in the 100mph winds at altitude. No word on what FDNY/NYPD will be doing other than evacuating nearby structures.

145 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:27:49pm

da fuq??

146 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:28:18pm

It's extreme weather events like this that make me glad one of our two major political parties wants to defund NOAA / FEMA and thinks AGW is a hoax.

147 labman57  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:28:27pm

Team Romney has been employing standard Rove-Atwater tactics: it matters little whether his campaign rhetoric has any basis in reality. All that matters is that he can sell it to the voting populace.

The assumption is that If you keep repeating the lie over and over, eventually some people will conclude that it must be true, simply because they continually heard it being uttered.

Furthermore, Mitt routinely makes crap up because he cannot be bothered with doing his homework so that his comments are drawn from verifiable facts and empirical data so that they reflect reality. If actual recent historical events do not support his argument, he simply rewrites the historical record to one more aligned with his point of view.

Lately, he has been channeling his inner Bachmann -- taking distorted or misinterpreted news reports, unsubstantiated, isolated anecdotal accounts, and wild rumors spawned from the right wing blogosphere, and using them as stump speech talking points ... or worse ... as the basis for formulating public policy positions.

148 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:28:49pm

Hurricane Sandy does not like being snarked at

149 JamesWI  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:29:09pm

re: #84 Killgore Trout

Obama says Romney opposed any government help to rescue carmakers (mostly false)

Yeah, Romney offered imaginary guarantees for loans made by non-existent private lenders. Obviously, that means he offered federal help!!!!!

Of course, you know it's bullshit. You're just doing your troll thing.

150 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:29:19pm

re: #123 Charles Johnson

Exactly. That's why I find it so frustrating all this BS the wingnuts throw out about Government Motors because we'd have no auto industry, all the downstream vendors would have been affected (many closing shop as small businesses rely on ongoing receivables for operations - I know Duh - but moreso the small guys who might rely on one or two companies to sustain them) which would have affected ALL auto manufacturers (who share vendors) and some entire towns whose existence often rely on one or two companies.

The insanity of the wingnut mindset truly boggles my mind. We're talking basic freaking economics here.

151 Only The Lurker Knows  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:29:36pm

Christie blames mayor for stranded people

The Governor is not a happy man.

152 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:30:25pm

re: #148 Sheila Broflovski

TMZ lives. No one messes with TMZ.

Gawker/HuffPo etc. are all NYC based, so they're probably affected by flooding and/or the power issues around One57 (shutting power to avoid problems should crane collapse to pavement).

Kos was up for the moment, but they're also NYC based.

153 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:30:40pm

re: #151 Only The Lurker Knows

Excuse me but is there an article I can read instead of a video.

154 sagehen  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:30:41pm

re: #151 Only The Lurker Knows

Christie blames mayor for stranded people

The Governor is not a happy man.

It pains me to have to admit... he may be right.

155 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:30:57pm

Another building collapse, in Williamsburg Brooklyn 475 Bedford Ave.

156 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:31:29pm

[Link: www.philly.com...]

157 Summer Lovin' Torture Party  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:31:49pm

re: #150 Joanne

It's remarkable scary as shit to know that there are a lot of people that actually think that GM and Chrysler make every single part that goes into their cars. I am not kidding, but I wish I was.

158 SteveMcG  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:31:50pm

re: 154

It remains to be seen if the people in that shelter are in any distress. Otherwise, Christie's just being Christie.

159 sagehen  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:31:53pm

re: #152 lawhawk

TMZ lives. No one messes with TMZ.

Gawker/HuffPo etc. are all NYC based, so they're probably affected by flooding and/or the power issues around One57 (shutting power to avoid problems should crane collapse to pavement).

Kos was up for the moment, but they're also NYC based.

I'd have sworn Kos was in San Francisco...

160 JamesWI  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:32:25pm

re: #148 Sheila Broflovski

Hurricane Sandy does not like being snarked at

[Embedded content]

BuzzFeed's still up for me. Just in time to see that Romney endorsed a guy who said "You have 50 percent of the American population now believes that they are entitled to a government handout. That's a real weakness."

But remember guys, he's really, really sorry about those 47% comments that he stood by for a month!

161 Summer Lovin' Torture Party  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:32:41pm

re: #159 sagehen

I'd have sworn Kos was in San Francisco...

I thought so as well. Berkeley, I believe.

162 blueraven  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:32:44pm

re: #127 Killgore Trout

It took all of 30 seconds to google and understand what he was trying to say. Here's Portman's giving the same speech at Hoffstra University a few days ago....
[Link: www.politico.com...]

He deviated from the script in the Dkos version. It's not hard to figure out what he was trying to say.

What was Romney trying to say about Jeep KT?

163 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:33:11pm

re: #156 lawhawk

Thanks.

164 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:33:34pm

re: #159 sagehen

His servers are located in NYC:

165 Only The Lurker Knows  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:34:24pm

re: #153 PhillyPretzel

Not that I could find.

166 efuseakay  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:34:31pm

That nyharborwebcam.com site is down too. Either too much traffic or it got knocked out.

NBC News has some good live updates with pics too.

[Link: usnews.nbcnews.com...]

167 Only The Lurker Knows  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:35:15pm

re: #156 lawhawk

Thanks.

168 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:35:47pm

re: #165 Only The Lurker Knows

Lawhawk found it in philly.com Please see #156.

169 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:37:04pm

re: #162 blueraven

What was Romney trying to say about Jeep KT?

I think he was full of shit on that one.

170 blueraven  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:38:34pm

re: #169 Killgore Trout

I think he was full of shit on that one.

He is a liar. He lies all the time. He tries to cover up his lies with double talk and you are buying it.

171 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:39:54pm

re: #162 blueraven

What was Romney trying to say about Jeep KT?

...and no matter how many times you keep asking me I'll tell you it still bullshit. Via that outrageous Politifact site: Fact check: Romney repeats false claim of Jeep outsourcing to China

172 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:40:59pm

Wait a minute, buildings are collapsing? What's the updates?

173 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:41:44pm

re: #139 Obdicut

But he's lying. Romney didn't want government to guarantee for the loans that'd take them through bankruptcy, he wanted them to garuntee loans for post-bankruptcy financing. Part of this is because he wanted them to have to junk all the union contracts.

Using bankruptcy to scrap the UAW contracts would have greatly increased GM and Chrysler's profitability, so that's not a solution to be despised.

174 ghazidor  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:41:46pm

re: #144 lawhawk

One57 crane continues swaying in the 100mph winds at altitude. No word on what FDNY/NYPD will be doing other than evacuating nearby structures.

Making sure to get a good camera angle for the inevitable viral YouTube video?

175 JamesWI  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:42:21pm

Bill Clinton in Ohio today - Romney's claim is "the biggest load of bull in the world."

176 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:42:44pm

re: #154 sagehen

It pains me to have to admit... he may be right.

He is right, but a good governor doesn't stop in the middle of a state-wide crisis to say "I told you so, na na." Which is what he's doing. A 12 year old does that.

If it's true that the AC mayor told people to ignore the Governor and stay (which I'm not sure is entirely correct), fucking deal with it after the storm.

177 garhighway  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:42:54pm

I'm in a 5 story building in the West 80's and I just felt it sway.

178 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:42:54pm

My iPhone is completely overwhelmed. I'm going back in read only mode.

179 blueraven  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:43:14pm

re: #171 Killgore Trout

...and no matter how many times you keep asking me I'll tell you it still bullshit. Via that outrageous Politifact site: Fact check: Romney repeats false claim of Jeep outsourcing to China

I dont need to check poltifact to know Romney is a liar.

180 Charles Johnson  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:43:19pm

LGF's servers are nowhere near the hurricane's path, by the way.

181 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:43:46pm

Dad and step mom in NC are getting hardly any wind or rain. They voted last week. Step mom is worried that Obama's going to lose, and ranted a bit about those crazy Republicans and legitimate rape, etc. I suggested she go read Nate Silver's blog and take a deep breath.

They said to say hi. Oh wait, that wasn't for you....

182 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:43:57pm

re: #177 garhighway

I'm in a 5 story building in the West 80's and I just felt it sway.

Damn, those little buildings aren't supposed to do that. Hang on.

183 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:43:59pm

re: #180 Charles Johnson

Thought as much. Out of curiosity, where is their home?

184 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:45:02pm

re: #177 garhighway

I'm in a 5 story building in the West 80's and I just felt it sway.

Is there anywhere you can go? You might want to explore that option, especially if the building's an older one. Be safe.

185 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:45:10pm

re: #175 JamesWI

I had though that the Obama campaign had been suspended. Such a speech would be a violation of such a suspension.

186 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:45:11pm

re: #177 garhighway

Be careful.

187 darthstar  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:45:26pm
188 garhighway  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:45:27pm

re: #182 Killgore Trout

Damn, those little buildings aren't supposed to do that. Hang on.

Especially one sandwiched between two others.

189 JamesWI  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:46:03pm

re: #185 Dark_Falcon

I had though that the Obama campaign had been suspended. Such a speech would be a violation of such a suspension.

Obama and Romney are off the campaign trail. No one said anything about their surrogates. I believe Ann Romney is out at events today too.

191 gwangung  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:46:33pm

re: #173 Dark_Falcon

Using bankruptcy to scrap the UAW contracts would have greatly increased GM and Chrysler's profitability, so that's not a solution to be despised.

If your only concern is for the company and stockholders.

But even in a capitalist system, the workers hold a stake. They're not simply interchangeable parts. That's something Republicans ignore, which is a fatally flawed analysis.

192 JamesWI  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:47:04pm

re: #189 JamesWI

Obama and Romney are off the campaign trail. No one said anything about their surrogates. I believe Ann Romney is out at events today too.

Indeed, Ann Romney spoke in Michigan today.

193 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:47:19pm

re: #187 darthstar

Maybe earlier today.

194 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:48:09pm

re: #187 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Saw that earlier. It's possible, but I remain skeptical to proven otherwise. I just Photoshopped Jason Voorhees into a photo of my cousin looking out the window at the storm.

My first reaction was wondering if sharks like that hang around the AC area this late in the season (the photo was supposedly taken in Brigantine.)

If it is a Photoshop, it is a good one.

195 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:48:10pm

re: #180 Charles Johnson

Your bloggers... .well, that's a different story.

Not sure if/when we'll lose power, but most everyone I know has lost power in NYC metro.

BTW - Lower Manhattan is now out - Con Ed shut down the network there to protect their gear.

196 engineer cat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:49:02pm

re: #173 Dark_Falcon

Using bankruptcy to scrap the UAW contracts would have greatly increased GM and Chrysler's profitability, so that's not a solution to be despised.

i invite you to visit the gm and chrysler plants and personally explain to each worker there why this outcome would be preferable

197 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:49:08pm

BTW, they should rename this storm ARod. It would guarantee that it hits not a thing.... /

198 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:49:44pm

re: #195 lawhawk

Your bloggers... .well, that's a different story.

Not sure if/when we'll lose power, but most everyone I know has lost power in NYC metro.

BTW - Lower Manhattan is now out - Con Ed shut down the network there to protect their gear.

Keep reporting as long as you can. Is Obdi still on?

Brooklyn had a building fall?

(I had to drive home from work, sorry)

199 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:49:58pm

re: #189 JamesWI

Obama and Romney are off the campaign trail. No one said anything about their surrogates. I believe Ann Romney is out at events today too.

Still, it does seem a violation in spirit.

The other thing that springs to my mind is that Mr. "It depends on what the meaning of 'is' is." is the last person who should be commenting on the truthfulness of others. Slick Willy is a proven liar who will say anything to get his party's candidate elected.

200 JamesWI  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:50:14pm

Journo's on Twitter were perplexed why Romney would actually go ahead with this ad when he knew it would be so easily torn apart.

Consensus seems to be desperation (because they know Ohio's pretty much gone because of the auto bailout), and because he didn't think the media would have the balls to call him out on his lies (seeing as they haven't been all that interested in doing it for a while).

The media did ignore it for a few days, but now it's coming back to bite him in the ass.

201 JamesWI  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:51:23pm

re: #199 Dark_Falcon

Still, it does seem a violation in spirit.

The other thing that springs to my mind is that Mr. "It depends on what the meaning of 'is' is." is the last person who should be commenting on the truthfulness of others. Slick Willy is a proven liar who will say anything to get his party's candidate elected.

So....it's fine for Romney's surrogates to be out on tour (including Paul Ryan), but it's a VIOLATION IN SPIRIT for the Dems to do it.

Gotcha.

202 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:51:27pm

re: #198 Page 3 in the Binder of Women

There were facade collapses in Manhattan (Chelsea). Not sure what's going on in Brooklyn.

203 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:51:45pm

re: #185 Dark_Falcon

I had though that the Obama campaign had been suspended. Such a speech would be a violation of such a suspension.

Screw that. Call that chump a liar all day, every day. Because he is one.

204 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:52:49pm

re: #191 gwangung

If your only concern is for the company and stockholders.

But even in a capitalist system, the workers hold a stake. They're not simply interchangeable parts. That's something Republicans ignore, which is a fatally flawed analysis.

My first concern is to uphold the law for bankruptcy cases, according to which the bondholders ought to have been paid and the UAw getting the leftovers. This would have been fair, too, as unlike the bondholders the UAW bears some of the blame for the collapse.

205 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:53:17pm

re: #198 Page 3 in the Binder of Women

Keep reporting as long as you can. Is Obdi still on?

Brooklyn had a building fall?

(I had to drive home from work, sorry)

Gus had a pic:

re: #94 Gus

Image: collapsed.jpg

206 Mattand  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:54:07pm

My part of South Jersey is now in what appears to a windstorm. Hardly any rain at all.

207 blueraven  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:54:31pm

re: #199 Dark_Falcon

Still, it does seem a violation in spirit.

The other thing that springs to my mind is that Mr. "It depends on what the meaning of 'is' is." is the last person who should be commenting on the truthfulness of others. Slick Willy is a proven liar who will say anything to get his party's candidate elected.

Your candidate is lying about Jeep. He smacks of desperation. Even Chrysler called him out.

And as hard as you all try to make him the bad guy, Bill Clinton has very high marks for the economy when he was President and is respected around the world for his good deeds.

208 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:54:43pm

The Brooklyn collapse is another facade collapse - no injuries. AFAIK

ABC News reporting another facade collapse/exterior damage at: 9th Ave-20th street in Manhattan.

209 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:55:11pm

re: #178 Joanne

My iPhone is completely overwhelmed. I'm going back in read only mode.

You're arguing with a deranged stalker on twitter.

210 JamesWI  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:55:29pm

Meanwhile on CNN.....

No mention of this flap anywhere on the front page......but they do still have Biden's MAJOR GAFFE when he called someone Tom instead of Tim!!!!! GAMECHANGER!

211 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:56:17pm

re: #205 wrenchwench

Gus had a pic:

re: #94 Gus

Wow, that looks like someone's beautiful abode. :(

212 engineer cat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:56:54pm

re: #204 Dark_Falcon

My first concern is to uphold the law for bankruptcy cases, according to which the bondholders ought to have been paid and the UAw getting the leftovers. This would have been fair, too, as unlike the bondholders the UAW bears some of the blame for the collapse.

50 bondholders

50 UAW members

which group can build a car?

213 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:57:32pm

re: #211 Page 3 in the Binder of Women

Wow, that looks like someone's beautiful abode. :(

Now it's a furnished veranda.

214 gwangung  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:57:36pm

re: #204 Dark_Falcon

My first concern is to uphold the law for bankruptcy cases, according to which the bondholders ought to have been paid and the UAw getting the leftovers. This would have been fair, too, as unlike the bondholders the UAW bears some of the blame for the collapse.

I think your interpretation, and not the law, is flawed, as the UAW negotiated in good faith and I believe had temporal precedent (bondholders came MUCH later). The UAW had negotiated something that was properly a debt in and of itself; that the company could not meet that obligation WAS NOT THE BLAME OF THE UAW as the company, which the bondholders KNEW going in, mismanaged that obligation.

215 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:58:20pm

re: #201 JamesWI

So....it's fine for Romney's surrogates to be out on tour (including Paul Ryan), but it's a VIOLATION IN SPIRIT for the Dems to do it.

Gotcha.

Also, I have no idea why DF thinks it's a reproach to say that Clinton is a proven liar who will say anything to get his party's candidate elected. These are the very characteristics he applauds in Romney.

216 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:58:24pm

The disregard for fellow Americans.

That's Gop v. Dem in a nutshell.

(Soldiers are included in this shocker)

217 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:58:46pm

re: #205 wrenchwench

That's a location in Chelsea Manhattan:

218 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 4:58:58pm

re: #157 God of Binders with Women

It's remarkable scary as shit to know that there are a lot of people that actually think that GM and Chrysler make every single part that goes into their cars. I am not kidding, but I wish I was.

Also, wingnuts who think that everybody in Detroit who works in the auto industry, works at a GM dealership. Like there are no other jobs outside of dealerships, or at other auto companies. WTF.

219 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:00:47pm

Flooding on Lower East Side around 14-20th streets at Ave C.

220 engineer cat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:01:03pm

'job creators', bondholders, entrepreneurs

apparently they think that without their help all of the people who actually make things and provide services would wander around in a daze, unable to comprehend how to proffer services in exchange for compensation

221 calochortus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:01:18pm

re: #145 Sheila Broflovski

da fuq??

[Embedded content]

Because Fischer's god loves the San Francisco lifestyle?

222 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:01:26pm

re: #219 lawhawk

And it begins.

223 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:01:28pm

re: #217 lawhawk

That's a location in Chelsea Manhattan:

[Embedded content]

I spent a few nights in a building like that in Chelsea. It was a couple floors taller, and had a pizza place on the ground floor. A year later I met the son of the pizza place owner in Montana. One of my weirdest small-world experiences.

224 alpuz  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:01:55pm

re: #196 engineer cat

Would it be like walking into a restaurant in Chicago wearing a 'Bears Suck' shirt?

225 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:02:22pm

re: #217 lawhawk

That's a location in Chelsea Manhattan:

[Embedded content]

If you had happened to be taking a nap (impossible, prob) but CLOSE.

226 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:02:49pm

Donald Trump totally PWN3D by David Letterman

Youtube Video
227 gwangung  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:03:14pm

re: #220 engineer cat

'job creators', bondholders, entrepreneurs

apparently they think that without their help all of the people who actually make things and provide services would wander around in a daze, unable to comprehend how to proffer services in exchange for compensation

They apparently think the 47% have no stake in the business, when they very obviously do.

228 Summer Lovin' Torture Party  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:03:30pm

I want to take this moment to thank all the brave fire fighters and cops and EMS personnel for the hard work they are doing right now all up the east coast.

229 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:03:46pm

re: #212 engineer cat

50 bonholders

50 UAW members

which group can build a car?

Irrelevant. The UAW members went along as their leaders demanded unsustainable labor contracts and pensions, and should have been told: "Sorry, but you bought into a Ponzi scheme, and it would be unjust to make other people take losses due to save you from your own folly. You'll just have to live with the reduced compensation the courts decide upon. We'll give you a raise when production recovers."

230 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:03:50pm
231 efuseakay  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:04:15pm

re: #196 engineer cat

i invite you to visit the gm and chrysler plants and personally explain to each worker there why this outcome would be preferable

Nobody in favor of Romney's plan for GM/Chrysler never mentions the workers.

232 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:04:16pm

Nearly 2 million people in NYC metro area without power, as per 1010WINS. Wow.

233 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:05:17pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

Irrelevant. The UAW members went along as their leaders demanded unsustainable labor contracts and pensions, and should have been told: "Sorry, but you bought into a Ponzi scheme, and it would be unjust to make other people take losses due to save you from your own folly. You'll just have to live with the reduced compensation the courts decide upon. We'll give you a raise when production recovers."

Why is only one side in the agreement at fault?

234 sattv4u2  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:05:21pm

re: #228 God of Binders with Women

I want to take this moment to thank all the brave fire fighters and cops and EMS personnel for the hard work they are doing right now all up the east coast.

Lets not forget the hundreds of linemen that are on their way to the affected areas to help restore any lost power ASAP. Coming into work today I saw a caravan of Georgia Power trucks heading north

235 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:05:23pm

re: #9 darthstar

Holy crap! I'm glad I'm not in New York right now!

[Embedded content]

And that "East Wind Rain" radio signal means the Japanese are going to attack as well!
///

236 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:05:41pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

Irrelevant. The UAW members went along as their leaders demanded unsustainable labor contracts and pensions, and should have been told: "Sorry, but you bought into a Ponzi scheme, and it would be unjust to make other people take losses due to save you from your own folly. You'll just have to live with the reduced compensation the courts decide upon. We'll give you a raise when production recovers."

What part of there were no banks willing to invest are you incapable of comprehending? The only other options was Chapter 7, total liquidation.

237 Summer Lovin' Torture Party  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:05:59pm

re: #234 sattv4u2

Damn straight.

238 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:06:15pm

re: #236 goddamnedfrank

What part of there were no banks willing to invest are you incapable of comprehending? The only other options was Chapter 7, total liquidation.

Bain speciality.

239 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:06:43pm

re: #234 sattv4u2

Saw dozens of trucks from Michigan heading towards the GWB yesterday. They're coming from all over the country (and it wont be enough).

240 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:07:09pm

re: #233 wrenchwench

Why is only one side in the agreement at fault?

I'd make sure the blame was allocated fairly. The stockholders, which means the executives would also take major losses, and most of the execs ought to have been flung out with no 'golden parachute'.

241 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:08:18pm

re: #240 Dark_Falcon

I'd make sure the blame was allocated fairly. The stockholders, which means the executives would also take major losses, and most of the execs ought to have been flung out with no 'golden parachute'.

What's wrong with the way it was handled? Not fair enough?

242 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:08:30pm

Lot of Nate Silver hate out there today in politics land

243 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:08:30pm

re: #187 darthstar

[Embedded content]

So far I've seen that pic identified as being in Brigantine, Margate, Long Beach Island and Wildwood.

244 sattv4u2  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:08:52pm

re: #217 lawhawk

That's a location in Chelsea Manhattan:

[Embedded content]

FOR RENT

Breezy Walk Up in the Trendy Chelsea District

This apt comes with unobstructed 10 foot high vistas

245 allegro  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:09:08pm

re: #240 Dark_Falcon

I'd make sure the blame was allocated fairly. The stockholders, which means the executives would also take major losses, and most of the execs ought to have been flung out with no 'golden parachute'.

Funny how that never happens. They have contracts, doncha know. But fuck the workers whose contracts suddenly vaporize due to arguments such as you have made, in favor of stockholders.

246 JamesWI  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:09:12pm

re: #241 wrenchwench

What's wrong with the way it was handled? Not fair enough?

Didn't destroy the unions, therefore it was terrible./

247 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:09:24pm

re: #242 SpaceJesus

Lot of Nate Silver hate out there today in politics land

The usual pundit assholes. Joe Scarborough was at it first this morning. Then Politico started trolling this afternoon.

248 engineer cat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:09:44pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

Irrelevant. The UAW members went along as their leaders demanded unsustainable labor contracts and pensions, and should have been told: "Sorry, but you bought into a Ponzi scheme, and it would be unjust to make other people take losses due to save you from your own folly. You'll just have to live with the reduced compensation the courts decide upon. We'll give you a raise when production recovers."

wait till somebody tells you the same thing and see how fair you think it is, when they tell you the company's financial problems are all your fault and you'll have to take less than you were promised

249 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:10:02pm
250 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:10:05pm

re: #233 wrenchwench

Why is only one side in the agreement at fault?

Ooo! Ooo! I know this one!

Because Unions are collectives that extort businesses by threatening to withhold their labor in a strike, and the failure of GM and Chrysler was all about Unions, and had nothing to do with the string of appallingly bad decisions made by management, and the string of appallingly bad vehicles management directed be built.

251 engineer cat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:10:49pm

re: #240 Dark_Falcon

I'd make sure the blame was allocated fairly. The stockholders, which means the executives would also take major losses, and most of the execs ought to have been flung out with no 'golden parachute'.

which universe does this happen in?

252 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:11:11pm

re: #239 lawhawk

My grandpa swears he heard Mexico was also sending power crews in.

I think Mexico needs a good reward for that.

253 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:11:20pm
254 calochortus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:11:48pm

re: #242 SpaceJesus

Lot of Nate Silver hate out there today in politics land

Any particular reason other than the fact he is reporting on the polls?

255 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:12:30pm

re: #252 ProGunLiberal

My grandpa swears he heard Mexico was also sending power crews in.

I think Mexico needs a good reward for that.

Might have been New Mexico. And yes, we deserve a reward! :)

256 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:12:32pm

re: #253 wrenchwench

Thanks. That is beautiful.

257 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:12:40pm

re: #254 calochortus

Any particular reason other than the fact he is reporting on the polls?

This garbage...

[Link: www.politico.com...]

258 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:12:54pm

re: #254 calochortus

Any particular reason other than the fact he is reporting on the polls?

He's a thin, effeminate man ...

259 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:13:33pm

re: #219 lawhawk

Please do what you need to do to stay safe!

260 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:13:42pm
261 gwangung  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:13:55pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

Irrelevant. The UAW members went along as their leaders demanded unsustainable labor contracts and pensions"

Demanded? They GOT them, in a contract.

You keep forgetting that. It's a legal obligation

Granted, there's a clash of legal obligations, but you're pretty much setting up a rule that the workers get the short end of the stick every time.

There's no legal precedent for that.

262 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:14:03pm

re: #245 allegro

Funny how that never happens. They have contracts, doncha know. But fuck the workers whose contracts suddenly vaporize due to arguments such as you have made, in favor of stockholders.

That's the point of bankruptcy: Those contracts ought to go 'poof'. If there is pressure for that not to happen, then deal with that. But I don't favor keeping an executive contract intact while dissolving the union contracts. Bankruptcy ought to clear the slate; I'm not a fan of favoritism.

263 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:14:08pm

re: #194 Mattand

Saw that earlier. It's possible, but I remain skeptical to proven otherwise. I just Photoshopped Jason Voorhees into a photo of my cousin looking out the window at the storm.

My first reaction was wondering if sharks like that hang around the AC area this late in the season (the photo was supposedly taken in Brigantine.)

If it is a Photoshop, it is a good one.

Totally a Photoshop, that exact same shark is everywhere.

264 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:14:18pm

re: #255 wrenchwench

He swears to heaven he heard Mexico. The old one.

265 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:15:29pm

re: #263 Sheila Broflovski

That shark gets around. //

266 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:15:41pm

re: #264 ProGunLiberal

He swears to heaven he heard Mexico. The old one.

Could be!

267 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:15:56pm

anybody else watching this?

[Link: www.ustream.tv...]

268 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:17:04pm

re: #252 ProGunLiberal

My grandpa swears he heard Mexico was also sending power crews in.

I think Mexico needs a good reward for that.

They'll be paid for their work, at what should be 1.5 times normal (educated guess). If employed by the Mexican government, then I'd argue for compensation at same rate for the government. I say thank them and pay them generously. Best way to handle it.

269 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:17:09pm

re: #259 Dancing along the light of day

Trust me. I'm not going to do anything now other than hunker down and wait this out. This storm has resulted in fatalities in NYC metro area.

Developing: Tree collapses, taking out a transformer with a structure fire in Teaneck NJ - and concern that embers from fire could spread to adjacent structures.

270 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:18:35pm

dude leave your car

271 freetoken  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:19:18pm

The Battery tide gauge shows almost 9 feet above normal:

[Link: tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov...]

With the tide already at 13 feet, I wonder what's next.

272 efuseakay  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:19:34pm

re: #267 SpaceJesus

anybody else watching this?

[Link: www.ustream.tv...]

They don't seem very bright...

273 calochortus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:19:42pm

re: #257 Gus

re: #258 goddamnedfrank

So he's a thin, effeminate man AND he's statistically literate? That is damning...

274 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:19:50pm

wow, this sucks

275 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:20:06pm

re: #268 Dark_Falcon

I'm thinking along the lines of Legalizing weed to deny the Cartels revenue, then offering to use our drones on the Cartels.

276 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:20:16pm

re: #270 Page 3 in the Binder of Women

You know the storm's bad when you attract famous tornado chasers like Timmer (or Jim Cantore). That should give people some idea of just how wild this storm really is.

277 ninja cat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:20:27pm

re: #242 SpaceJesus

Lot of Nate Silver hate out there today in politics land

May he have the last laugh come the 7th.

278 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:20:58pm

Oh, btw, my friends husband who's boss kept them in Brooklyn till this morning (when their flight was cancelled, duh) drove to Pittsburgh today and got the last flight out.

279 Cheechako  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:21:26pm

I don't know if this site has already been posted.
It's a great site to monitor the tide gauges.

Tides Online

280 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:21:36pm

Four of the bookies on oddschecker are now offering greater than 2 to 1 against Romney winning. That means that privately the think Mitt's chances are even steeper than that, since bookies never offer a better payout than they can afford.

But hey, what do they know, it's only their business, reputation and entire livelihoods at stake. If you're positive they're wrong you should hop on and exploit this opportunity to triple your available cash on hand.

281 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:21:53pm

Battery gauge is pushing towards 13 feet (already in record territory). For reference, flood stage is 6.7 feet.

This storm is at least a foot above what Irene did at the Battery (far higher elsewhere).

282 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:22:01pm

re: #270 Page 3 in the Binder of Women

Given how many cars there are in NYC, that kind of water damage is going to drive the cost of this storm incredibly high. It's also going to play havoc with people's mobility.

Does car insurance cover this kind of damage? I ask because I honestly don't know.

283 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:22:54pm

re: #272 efuseakay

they are mainly concerned with the safety of the beer and tobacco

284 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:23:06pm

re: #279 Cheechako

I've been referencing the tidal gauges - to give an idea of what kind of flooding is ongoing.

285 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:24:07pm

re: #275 ProGunLiberal

I'm thinking along the lines of Legalizing weed to deny the Cartels revenue, then offering to use our drones on the Cartels.

We're already doing the latter. The former is a non-starter due to continuing anti-pot sentiment in much of the country. The former effect would also be lower than you might think, given that much of the cartels' profits are in cocaine and heroin, not just in pot.

286 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:24:14pm

re: #284 lawhawk

Does thirteen feet mean over the seawall thing?

287 calochortus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:24:23pm

re: #280 goddamnedfrank

Some wingnuts have actually been suggesting it would be a great idea to put money on Romney on Intrade because they could somehow both influence the election and make money!!!! Sadly, it isn't legal for Americans to bet on Intrade, so as law abiding citizens they just can't bring themselves to get this free money.

288 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:24:51pm

re: #285 Dark_Falcon

Still, it would be a heavy dent, and would represent a new source of revenue.

289 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:25:49pm

Sandy Has Landed. [Link: www.nhc.noaa.gov...]

290 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:26:26pm

re: #275 ProGunLiberal

I'm thinking along the lines of Legalizing weed to deny the Cartels revenue, then offering to use our drones on the Cartels.

We're already using drones on the border, and I think we sold a couple to Mexico.

291 engineer cat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:27:15pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

Irrelevant. The UAW members went along as their leaders demanded unsustainable labor contracts and pensions, and should have been told: "Sorry, but you bought into a Ponzi scheme, and it would be unjust to make other people take losses due to save you from your own folly. You'll just have to live with the reduced compensation the courts decide upon. We'll give you a raise when production recovers."

dark, if you are the owner or exec who signs these contracts, are you not then the 'risk taker' who makes loads when they guess correctly but takes the fall when they guess badly? why then should the poor stiff who bargains a fixed rate for his services and doesn't get the windfall when the company profits take the hit when the 'risk taker' gambles poorly?

why?

by the system you propose as 'fair', it's once more the privatization of profit and the socialization of debt

292 bratwurst  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:27:44pm
293 kirkghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:27:52pm

re: #282 Dark_Falcon

Given how many cars there are in NYC, that kind of water damage is going to drive the cost of this storm incredibly high. It's also going to play havoc with people's mobility.

Does car insurance cover this kind of damage? I ask because I honestly don't know.

Some do, most don't. "Acts of God" clause.

294 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:28:49pm

re: #290 wrenchwench

We're already using drones on the border, and I think we sold a couple to Mexico.

We have. Those are smaller drones for more local use, as that is Mexico's UAV need at this time. They do still have high-grade sensors, though Mexico is not being given the very latest gear. Due to corruption in Mexico, we've had to hold back on a few of the cutting edge sensor systems.

295 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:29:31pm

re: #287 calochortus

Some wingnuts have actually been suggesting it would be a great idea to put money on Romney on Intrade because they could somehow both influence the election and make money!!!! Sadly, it isn't legal for Americans to bet on Intrade, so as law abiding citizens they just can't bring themselves to get this free money.

Americans bet on Intrade all the time, nothing illegal about it that I'm aware of under federal law. The website itself couldn't be operated inside the US, and there may be individual state laws that affect its customers.

296 Summer Lovin' Torture Party  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:30:21pm

Joe Scarborough is a douche canoe. Anyone with a rudimentary understanding of statistics should know that his prediction is based on current and historic conditions run through millions of samples. Think about poker statistics: AA versus any pair heads-up to the river wins about 85% of the time. Can those pocket aces lose fifteen times in a row? Duh, of course, it's called "variance."

297 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:30:26pm

re: #293 kirkspencer

Some do, most don't. "Acts of God" clause.

If the storm damage isn't covered, then parts on New york are going to have greatly fewer cars when this is over. I'm not saying that's a good thing, because having it happen this way would not be.

298 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:30:35pm

re: #285 Dark_Falcon

We're already doing the latter. The former is a non-starter due to continuing anti-pot sentiment in much of the country. The former effect would also be lower than you might think, given that much of the cartels' profits are in cocaine and heroin, not just in pot.

The bulk of their money is made on marijuana, then meth, then heroin and cocaine, then extortion and kidnapping. And if you're talking about anti-pot sentiment in Mexico, they've already legalized possession of small amounts. If you're talking about this country, the sentiment against it is mostly among those profiting from prohibition: law enforcement, drug companies, etc.

299 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:31:15pm

My daughter-in-law in NY just called to let me know she is OK even if she is shut up in the house with 5 rambunctious kids and my son is out of town. She said they have power and they are in the highest part of Brooklyn (duh, it's called Heights for a reason).

Her daughters were baking up a storm (pardon the expression) using the fancy cake decoration set that I got my granddaughter for her birthday last month.

300 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:31:20pm

re: #296 God of Binders with Women

Wasn't there some issue with an intern with him?

301 calochortus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:31:30pm

re: #295 goddamnedfrank

Americans bet on Intrade all the time, nothing illegal about it that I'm aware of under federal law. The website itself couldn't be operated inside the US, and there may be individual state laws that affect its customers.

That could be true. Gambling holds no interest whatsoever for me so I'm not up on laws governing it. I merely report why these idiots upstanding conservatives are saying they can't take advantage of a sure thing.

302 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:32:26pm

re: #298 wrenchwench

The bulk of their money is made on marijuana, then meth, then heroin and cocaine, then extortion and kidnapping. And if you're talking about anti-pot sentiment in Mexico, they've already legalized possession of small amounts. If you're talking about this country, the sentiment against it is mostly among those profiting from prohibition: law enforcement, drug companies, etc.

i was referring to sentiment within the US, to be clear.

303 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:32:56pm

re: #297 Dark_Falcon

If the storm damage isn't covered, then parts on New york are going to have greatly fewer cars when this is over. I'm not saying that's a good thing, because having it happen this way would not be.

Yeah and be very careful about buying used cars.

When I was shopping for a used car in 2005 I was warned about "Katrina cars" that were flooding the market (pardon the expression)

304 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:33:42pm

re: #286 ProGunLiberal

No. AFAIK it's 13 feet from mean tide level (mean of high and low tide). Flood stage indicates the point where water can cause flooding. 13 feet is significant flooding.

305 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:33:45pm

occupy went dark. welp. there goes my chances of seeing a hipster get eaten by a shark in lower manhattan

306 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:34:23pm
307 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:34:26pm

re: #301 calochortus

That could be true. Gambling holds no interest whatsoever for me so I'm not up on laws governing it. I merely report why these idiots upstanding conservatives are saying they can't take advantage of a sure thing.

Anyone who thinks this election going one particular way is a "sure thing" is either delusional, a chowderhead, or both. It' outcome is quite uncertain and run on an assumption like that is foolish.

308 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:37:20pm
309 engineer cat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:38:19pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

Ponzi scheme

there is no way in hell that a union contract or production plan can legitimately be compared to a ponzi scheme

310 calochortus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:39:17pm

re: #307 Dark_Falcon

Agreed, but polling numbers lean Obama, making this 'easy money' a total delusion. Still, I prefer your term of 'chowderhead'.

311 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:40:00pm

People walking around Times Square

Some people might have luck finding traffic cams operating around NYC.

West Side Highway closed from 50s to 79th St. FDR Drive similarly closed due to flooding (including around Lower East Side).

312 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:42:17pm

Yeah. I'm sure that lowering auto workers salaries would be great for the economy. Ummmm. No.

313 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:42:21pm
314 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:42:43pm

re: #311 lawhawk

People walking around Times Square

Some people might have luck finding traffic cams operating around NYC.

West Side Highway closed from 50s to 79th St. FDR Drive similarly closed due to flooding (including around Lower East Side).

New York tough, those folks.

315 Bipartite Gnomenclature  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:43:08pm

re: #204 Dark_Falcon

My first concern is to uphold the law for bankruptcy cases, according to which the bondholders ought to have been paid and the UAw getting the leftovers. This would have been fair, too, as unlike the bondholders the UAW bears some of the blame for the collapse.

Say what?
You have to be kidding?

Contracts between employers and employees are the result of pure capitalism, the employees charge what the market demands and the employers agree to pay what they feel is fair in the given market. If the market changes because of management vision, as it did with the US car makers, then the fault is with management, not unionized employees. The US auto manufacturers refused to follow the Japanese quality and feature model for decades.

We are told time and time again that the reason the 'investors', otherwise known as job creators, get the big money is because they take the big risks. How about we see them take the hits that justify the claims of big risks, instead of passing those huge hits on to people who do not make the big money?

316 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:43:39pm
317 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:43:44pm

It's happened:

318 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:45:02pm
319 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:45:33pm
320 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:45:43pm

re: #281 lawhawk

At the moment, the Battery gauge is now at ...

drumroll....

13.34 feet and rising.

321 gwangung  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:46:23pm

re: #318 Gus

[Embedded content]

These guys seem pretty industrious for unionized, public workers.

322 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:46:59pm

re: #319 Gus

Con Ed had said they were shutting down the grid south of the Brooklyn Bridge (Chambers St) to the Battery b/c of flooding. They weren't kidding.

323 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:47:14pm

[Link: aws1.earthcam.com...]

brooklyn bridge webcam

324 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:47:36pm

fuck it just stopped

325 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:47:41pm

re: #321 gwangung

These guys seem pretty industrious for unionized, public workers.

If a flood is coming to destroy one's place of employment, any sane man will be industrious in preventing that from happening.

326 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:47:50pm

Take a look at the involved, graduate level advanced statistical analysis being done by Nate Silver or Sam Wang, and compare it to the sixth grade homework assignment over at RCP.

The isn't a story about wishful thinking or confirmation bias, it's a story about adults who do this kind of shit for a living vs. dull little children who've discovered the =average(range) function in Excel and have learned to game the inputs.

327 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:48:01pm

Scary fact: Before all this started, my Weather Underground account had my town listed at 23 feet above sea level.

I just checked it. We're now 11 feet above sea level.

328 freetoken  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:48:04pm

The center of Sandy, what's left of it, is between Dover and Philadelphia:

[Link: radar.weather.gov...]

It'll transition it's character (from a tropical storm) very quickly.

329 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:48:15pm

re: #317 ProGunLiberal

That's not the subway. That's the Brooklyn Battery Tunnel (motor vehicle). The subways may not be that far behind with their exposures across Lower Manhattan.

330 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:48:49pm

re: #308 wrenchwench

[Embedded content]

Big points for originality

331 freetoken  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:51:35pm

Battery tide gauge still showing water levels going up.

332 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:51:42pm

911 system in NYC has been overloaded with nonemergency calls. Only call 911 for emergency situations. Trees down aren't emergency unless you're talking about trapped persons, fires, or the like.

333 Lidanghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:52:04pm

re: #326 goddamnedfrank

Take a look at the involved, graduate level advanced statistical analysis being done by Nate Silver or Sam Wang, and compare it to the sixth grade homework assignment over at RCP.

The isn't a story about wishful thinking or confirmation bias, it's a story about adults who do this kind of shit for a living vs. dull little children who've discovered the =average(range) function in Excel and have learned to game the inputs.

YES. THIS.

What Nate Silver and Sam Wang do for a living with numbers would make the average college student shit themselves in fear, even the math and accounting majors. They're not playing at being stats geniuses. They know what they're talking about.

RCP is a joke in comparison. It's like comparing an NFL team to a Pop Warner team.

334 freetoken  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:52:37pm

re: #332 lawhawk

One report just came across of a man dying in Queens from a fallen tree.

335 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:53:04pm

re: #331 freetoken

13.46 feet and rising. It's blown by the previous record, and we're talking historic flooding in Lower Manhattan (to say nothing of the massive flooding elsewhere in the region).

336 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:53:38pm

re: #334 freetoken

Yes. Apparently 29 year old was in bed when tree collapsed on house; family members found him buried under debris.

337 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:54:32pm

re: #336 lawhawk

Only thing I can say is I hope it was quick. I hope he didn't suffer. :(

338 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:54:35pm

re: #331 freetoken

Battery tide gauge still showing water levels going up.

Link?

339 freetoken  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:54:55pm

re: #338 Gus

[Link: tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov...]

340 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:55:02pm

Image: 8518750.png

341 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:57:01pm

What's up wastelanders?

342 freetoken  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:57:17pm

re: #341 Varek Raith

What's up wastelanders?

Sea level.

343 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:57:35pm

Looks like it's at 13.72 now.

344 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:57:37pm

Two more fatalities in NJ - a tree fell on a motor vehicle in Mendham.

345 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:57:43pm

re: #330 researchok

Big points for originality

Not my originality, of course. I'm just a Tweet curator.

346 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:58:11pm

re: #340 Gus

Image: 8518750.png

That graph seems to show sea levels climbing since 1850. Am I reading it right?

347 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:58:17pm

8518750 20121030 00:30 4.69 13.46 7.13
8518750 20121030 00:36 4.71 13.54 7.00
8518750 20121030 00:42 4.73 13.65 6.68
8518750 20121030 00:48 4.74 13.72 6.85

348 jamesfirecat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:58:22pm

re: #173 Dark_Falcon

Using bankruptcy to scrap the UAW contracts would have greatly increased GM and Chrysler's profitability, so that's not a solution to be despised.

Except for what would happen for those workers...

I meant didn't Henry Ford originally get rich based on the concept of paying your workers enough to afford the cars that you produced?

349 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:58:28pm

re: #346 Dark_Falcon

That graph seems to show sea levels climbing since 1850. Am I reading it right?

Yep.

350 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:59:40pm

Looks like the DC area dodged a bullet.

351 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:59:52pm

re: #332 lawhawk

Tweeted.

352 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 5:59:58pm

re: #348 jamesfirecat

Except for what would happen for those workers...

I meant didn't Henry Ford originally get rich based on the concept of paying your workers enough to afford the cars that you produced?

That was when a new Ford cost $500.

353 Interesting Times  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:00:21pm
354 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:00:26pm

re: #349 Gus

It's going to be a long, long night

355 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:00:53pm

Please read all that I posted about the auto bailout before replying. It will make things easier for everyone.

356 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:00:53pm

But, I went to bed this afternoon to be up all night just in case.

357 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:01:19pm

re: #354 researchok

It's going to be a long, long night

Was supposed to peak at 2 AM eastern. Not the tide/surge though.

358 Interesting Times  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:01:39pm
359 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:01:41pm

re: #353 Interesting Times

[Embedded content]

Well, your nic overlay fits this situation well. Interesting Times, indeed.

360 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:02:14pm

13.78 still climbing.

361 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:02:17pm

re: #345 wrenchwench

Do you wear those white cotton curator gloves when you retweet?

362 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:02:25pm

Breaking: MTA announcing that subways shut through end of the week due to flooding. Significant flooding and damage to system/networks/signals.

363 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:02:40pm

re: #311 lawhawk

Hey tkts is still in business! WOOT!
Thanks for the linky!

364 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:02:56pm

8518750 20121030 00:36 4.71 13.54 7.00
8518750 20121030 00:42 4.73 13.65 6.68
8518750 20121030 00:48 4.74 13.72 6.85
8518750 20121030 00:54 4.74 13.78 7.12

365 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:02:58pm

crane going crazy

366 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:03:15pm

re: #361 researchok

Do you wear those white cotton curator gloves when you retweet?

Just the opposite. I type with greasy fingers on my black keyboard.

367 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:03:43pm

re: #357 Gus

They're talking about salt water in the subway system.

Big time bad news

368 calochortus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:04:08pm

Sort of surreal-I'm watching the local news which is all about the Giants returning home, woohoo and all that, and reading about Sandy here.

369 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:04:19pm

re: #366 wrenchwench

LOLOL

370 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:04:19pm

re: #344 lawhawk

Two more fatalities in NJ - a tree fell on a motor vehicle in Mendham.

hate updinging. thanks for the reporting. I gave up on the tv.

371 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:05:12pm

How are they going to get food and supplies into the city?

372 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:05:33pm

occupy adventure is live again

[Link: www.ustream.tv...]

373 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:06:15pm
374 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:06:18pm

re: #371 researchok

How are they going to get food and supplies into the city?

The bridges are holding together and parts of the airports can likely be cleared once the storm passes.

375 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:06:30pm

re: #371 researchok

The GWB will be open as soon as the winds drop, same for other bridges. The BBT and Holland Tunnel will probably be shuttered for a while (flooding).

376 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:06:39pm

re: #372 SpaceJesus

The good news is laundry will finally get done.

377 calochortus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:07:08pm

BBL

378 Lidanghazi  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:07:20pm
379 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:07:26pm

re: #374 Dark_Falcon

I'm thinking about flooded stores/basements, impassable streets...

380 Interesting Times  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:07:29pm
381 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:08:06pm

13.81

382 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:10:03pm

re: #374 Dark_Falcon

The JFK and LGA airports had seen some flooding during the morning high tide; this evening's tide significantly worse (but so far no word/photos).

From earlier today (compilation of photos/damage from around area).

RT:
1WTC still alight, everything else dark. 3 million without power (growing).

383 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:10:49pm

re: #381 Gus

We need to start a betting pool on high the water gets.

384 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:10:55pm
385 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:11:01pm
386 engineer cat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:12:50pm

new yorkers are used to being without power for a day or so, and high winds, but i can't recall manhattan island ever being flooded a foot deep

387 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:12:55pm

Anyone who was questioning the MTA shutdown ought to be reconsidering their approach considering that if they hadn't done so, thousands would be stuck with rising water all around. It was the right call with Irene. It was the right call here. Better safe than sorry, and despite the precautions, we're seeing tremendous damage to the lifeline of the NYC metro area.

Damage to the subway means that 5 people people will have trouble getting to from work - a hit to the local economy and a cost that the MTA can ill afford (even if it gets reimbursed from the feds).

388 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:13:17pm

"tha wata gets werse? oh mah gawd"

-occupy v. sandy

389 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:13:43pm

re: #379 researchok

I'm thinking about flooded stores/basements, impassable streets...

Streets are an addressable problem. Put out a call to WWII vehicle collectors and to tour operators that their DUKWs ('Ducks' are needed in the hurricane zone. Those can get supplies in through flooded areas.

390 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:14:02pm

13.85

391 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:14:31pm

Image: Q0Yilpktdkq5o2lmLxBC-w2.jpg

Later, lizards.

392 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:14:42pm

This looks pretty bad.

393 Interesting Times  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:14:42pm

re: #383 researchok

We need to start a betting pool on high the water gets.

394 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:15:02pm

So, is Sandy the "Katrina-killer?"

395 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:16:36pm

It doesn't look bad. It is bad. Very bad.

BBT is being flooded - water cascading into the tunnel from West Street, and I'm not sure that the MTA pumps will be able to keep up.

Expect a similar tale for the MTA subways throughout Lower Manhattan and other areas (think Coney Island and Flushing Yards for instance).

396 Interesting Times  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:16:37pm

re: #394 ProGunLiberal

So, is Sandy the "Katrina-killer?"

In terms of sheer size and eventual damage, probably...in terms of final death toll, I sure as hell hope not.

397 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:16:53pm
398 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:16:57pm

re: #394 ProGunLiberal

So, is Sandy the "Katrina-killer?"

I'm sure people will politicize this, it started a few days ago. It's not going to make anyone regret politicizing in the past or future. The circle of derp spins always.

399 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:17:06pm

re: #394 ProGunLiberal

So, is Sandy the "Katrina-killer?"

Highly unlikely. This storm isn't going to produce a death toll anywhere near Katrina's. It may do more monetary damage, but people appropriately don't think of that as much as loss of life.

400 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:17:08pm

Multiple rescues from fire situation in Rockaway Park - 15-30 pulled and rescued by boat.

401 freetoken  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:17:38pm

re: #395 lawhawk

Bergen Point has a higher water level than the Battery:

[Link: tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov...]

402 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:17:41pm

13.87

403 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:18:05pm

You're probably also not going to have white militias roving the streets shooting black kids like we had with Katrina

404 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:18:48pm

Some really powerful winds right now.

405 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:18:57pm

re: #399 Dark_Falcon

I mean monetarily. Is this going to exceed the $125-140 billion price tag for Katrina?

406 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:20:08pm

re: #402 Gus

Reminds me of the requisite bomb in the James Bond type flics' "Detonation is 3 minutes...2 minutes...1 minute..."

"Detonation sequence aborted. Have a nice day"

407 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:20:50pm

re: #405 ProGunLiberal

I mean monetarily. Is this going to exceed the $125-140 billion price tag for Katrina?

It could very well do that. BIG areas of Long Island's South Shore are under water. NYC is flooding. Economically, this could be very, very bad.

408 PhillyPretzel  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:20:51pm

re: #406 researchok

Mission Impossible started that way.

409 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:21:15pm

re: #365 SpaceJesus

crane going crazy

How high up is that?

410 freetoken  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:21:19pm

Full moon rising in the east... looks beautiful, but it's deadly.

411 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:21:24pm

re: #401 freetoken

Not sure of the local conditions at Bergen. I know the Battery and how it has a low sea wall, plus promenade (that's where the boats to the Statue of Liberty and Ellis Island embark from). The Bergen Point location is on the Raritan Bay and is likely to cause significant flooding into Linden NJ and towards Elizabeth (where the NY container port is located) as well as through the Arthur Kill and Kill Van Kull.

LGA closed until further notice due to flooding. I expect similar report for JFK.

412 Joanne  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:21:30pm

Whoa!!!

413 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:21:59pm

Bergen still climbing too. Now at 14.54.

414 ghazidor  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:22:00pm
NEW YORK (CBSNewYork/AP) — Reporting from Lower Manhattan, CBS 2′s Elise Finch reported that water from West Street was “cascading” like a “waterfall” into the Brooklyn-Battery Tunnel.

[Link: newyork.cbslocal.com...]

Brooklyn-Battery Tunnel Entrance.

415 researchok  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:22:03pm

re: #408 PhillyPretzel

You have to wonder why the hero never went home and beat up the person who made that recording...

416 ProGunLiberal  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:22:46pm

re: #403 SpaceJesus

Linky, please. And yeah, militias aren't going to be a problem. And the military is already prepared. And the whole world has a clear view of the events. If we need help, it will be here in a New York Minute.

417 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:23:30pm

re: #412 Joanne

That's the PATH terminal in Hoboken. Figure similar stories at Exchange Place - and flooding into the tunnel between NY and NJ (the WTC). That could result in shutdown for significant time.

418 Interesting Times  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:23:32pm

From 350.org:

On May 5th, New Yorkers gathered in Battery Park to connect the dots between fossil fuels and flooding in Manhattan.

Today they were proven right. Here's the action in May, and what that same spot looked like earlier today.

Image: 526020_10151215072897708_736080877_n.jpg

419 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:23:38pm

re: #410 freetoken

Full moon rising in the east... looks beautiful, but it's deadly.

A literal bad moon rising:

Youtube Video
420 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:23:39pm

You can see the building twisting in the wind.
Instant vertigo.

421 ghazidor  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:24:29pm

re: #409 Varek Raith

How high up is that?

The building is 65 stories, crane is taller of course...

422 Coracle  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:24:46pm

re: #199 Dark_Falcon

Still, it does seem a violation in spirit.

The other thing that springs to my mind is that Mr. "It depends on what the meaning of 'is' is." is the last person who should be commenting on the truthfulness of others.

Kindly blow that out your ass, Dark. Your party should not be throwing stones in that glass house and you damn well know it. You've excused your own party's lies on literally dozens of different topics for weeks, if not months, and still won't own up to your team's neanderthal stances on women's rights to their own bodies. Have you talked to the women in your life about that yet?

423 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:25:11pm

The full moon tide is making this worse, its a fact.

424 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:25:31pm

re: #421 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You

The building is 65 stories, crane is taller of course...

Winds will be ~30 percent higher than ground level at that height.
Yikes.

425 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:25:39pm

re: #420 Varek Raith

You can see the building twisting in the wind.
Instant vertigo.

If that crane is swinging, it's got to be putting bigtime stress on that building.

The whole top of the damn thing could come down.

426 jamesfirecat  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:26:21pm

re: #406 researchok

Reminds me of the requisite bomb in the James Bond type flics' "Detonation is 3 minutes...2 minutes...1 minute..."

"Detonation sequence aborted. Have a nice day"

Out of order? F***, even in the future nothing works!

427 Gus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:26:44pm

13.87

428 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:27:09pm

re: #425 makeitstop

If that crane is swinging, it's got to be putting bigtime stress on that building.

The whole top of the damn thing could come down.

Torquing the hell out if it.

429 Summer Lovin' Torture Party  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:27:17pm

Have any of the nutjobs blamed the hurricane on gay marriage yet?

430 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:27:28pm

re: #429 God of Binders with Women

Have any of the nutjobs blamed the hurricane on gay marriage yet?

Yep.

431 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:27:55pm

re: #429 God of Binders with Women

Have any of the nutjobs blamed the hurricane on gay marriage yet?

Yes, more than one of them.

432 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:28:38pm

Which means gay people are more powerful than you can possibly imagine.
Or something.

433 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:29:44pm

re: #429 God of Binders with Women

Have any of the nutjobs blamed the hurricane on gay marriage yet?

They got that out of the way this morning.

And let's not even mention the 'Obama is using HAARP to swing talk away from Benghazi' crowd.

Fuckin' loons.

434 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:30:42pm

re: #432 Varek Raith

Which means gay people are more powerful than you can possibly imagine.
Or something.

The ark people choose gays as the most powerful.

435 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:32:02pm

re: #433 makeitstop

They got that out of the way this morning.

And let's not even mention the 'Obama is using HAARP to swing talk away from Benghazi' crowd.

Fuckin' loons.

Ah, HAARP.
Classic conspiracy is classic.

436 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 6:32:04pm

re: #407 makeitstop

It could very well do that. BIG areas of Long Island's South Shore are under water. NYC is flooding. Economically, this could be very, very bad.

A nice time to remind people that without the government there'd be no flood insurance, because private insurers abandoned that market because of the difficulty of making a reliable profit.

437 sagehen  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 7:32:16pm

re: #311 lawhawk

People walking around Times Square

Some people might have luck finding traffic cams operating around NYC.

West Side Highway closed from 50s to 79th St. FDR Drive similarly closed due to flooding (including around Lower East Side).

West Side Highway from 60's to 79th is elevated; closures are more likely because of wind (the railings are... inadequate.)

438 sagehen  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 7:37:51pm

re: #333 Lidane

YES. THIS.

What Nate Silver and Sam Wang do for a living with numbers would make the average college student shit themselves in fear, even the math and accounting majors. They're not playing at being stats geniuses. They know what they're talking about.

RCP is a joke in comparison. It's like comparing an NFL team to a Pop Warner team.

People Who Can't Do Math Are So Mad At Nate Silver

The New York Times' Nate Silver has created a model to predict the outcome of the presidential election that's watched by just about every pundit, and yet Silver's model refuses to perfectly reflect the conventional wisdom spouted by just about every pundit. The pundits do not like this! Silver's FiveThirtyEight model uses math to show that President Obama has a 74.6 percent chance of beating Mitt Romney, even though Romney has unmeasurable things like "momentum" as well as newspaper endorsements, plus a lead in several national polls. Obama's chances remain high, Silver explains, because he has a significant lead in enough swing states to win the needed 270 electoral college votes. The latest pundit outraged that Silver's model doesn't feel right is MSNBC's Joe Scarborough, who ranted Monday morning:

439 SpaceJesus  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 8:35:38pm

re: #416 ProGunLiberal

you serious?

[Link: www.thenation.com...]

440 Ming  Mon, Oct 29, 2012 10:51:16pm

There is no alternative for Obama: he must clearly and plainly talk about the elephant in the room: Mitt Romney's lying. Obama must talk about it, not just once, and not just in a single TV ad.

If Obama does this, undecided voters will have heard the truth. They're free to vote for Romney, but they will have had a choice. Deep down, we all can sense the truth of a given situation. Truth can be a very powerful thing to have on your side. But you must be willing to have faith in its power, enough faith to articulate it, until you know it's been heard.


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