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Not Again - School Shooting in Newtown, Connecticut

Principal reportedly shot
Crime • Views: 26,824

Shooting Reported at Sandy Hook Elementary School:

State and Newtown police, ambulance, and emergency response personnel responded to the Sandy Hook Elementary School shortly after 9:30 am, Friday, following reports of a shooting. One child was carried from the school by a police officer, apparently seriously wounded. Other injuries are reported, and emergency personnel have set up triage facilities.

The AP news wire is now reporting that the gunman has been killed; no details yet.

UPDATE at 12/14/12 10:01:11 am

This is a really bad one, folks. The Associated Press now reports that 27 people are dead, 18 of them children.

UPDATE at 12/14/12 10:27:27 am

Latest reports are that 26 people are dead, 18 of them children. A second person is reportedly now in custody.

UPDATE at 12/14/12 10:37:36 am

From the Newtown Bee, a heartbreaking photo of children being led from the school:

Jump to bottom

463 comments

1 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:30:53am

This is not a reason to arm schools. This is a reason to screen gun ownership and improve mental health policies.

2 prairiefire  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:30:56am

Terrible, terrible news.

3 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:31:44am

And the Derp is right on time:

4 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:32:58am

There cannot be a discussion of gun control in the USA, only a shouting match with proponents of enhanced controls and restrictions are bound to lose.

5 erik_t  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:34:13am

re: #3 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

And the Derp is right on time:

Gun violence is only allowed to be politicized in one direction.

Go fuck yourself, Bryan.

6 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:34:50am

3 hurt, and the gunman was killed according to this report. Some children being treated for trauma.

7 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:36:40am

re: #3 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

8 kirkspencer  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:36:45am

re: #6 lawhawk

3 hurt, and the gunman was killed according to this report. Some children being treated for trauma.

This report says there was a confirmed second gunman. bleah.

9 bratwurst  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:37:36am

re: #7 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

THIS IS NOT THE TIME TO HAVE A DISCUSSION LIKE THAT, DONTCHA KNOW?!?

10 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:41:53am

re: #7 lawhawk

as opposed to 100s killed annually by family members w/legally owned weapons by accident

To paraphrase Doonesbury's Dr Duke: "If someone in your family was shooting at you, wouldn't you want to be in the position to return fire?"

11 Tigger2005  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:42:59am

Please, everyone, be sure not to say anything that might hurt the gun's feelings. Guns are VERY sensitive.

12 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:48:08am

OT, but, surprise!

13 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:50:06am

re: #12 Gus

OT, but, surprise!

[Embedded content]

So when she stays put, it's a conspiracy. Now that Ambassador Rice has stepped aside, it's also a conspiracy. Poor woman can't win with these lunatics. Gonna be a very bumpy next four years to say the least.

14 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:50:10am
15 BongCrodny  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:50:49am

re: #6 lawhawk

3 hurt, and the gunman was killed according to this report. Some children being treated for trauma.

There's a photo that shows the children being led away; there's a little girl in a blue sweater who looks absolutely terrified.

And all Bryan Fischer can say is "more guns."

16 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:51:15am

re: #15 BongCrodny

There's a photo that shows the children being led away; there's a little girl in a blue sweater who looks absolutely terrified.

And all Bryan Fischer can say is "more guns."

Because Bryan Fischer is a heartless douchebag.

17 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:51:49am

Hey. But we all look forward to the next block buster movie where the protagonists murder people with fire arms.

18 AntonSirius  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:52:26am
19 steve_davis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:53:42am

re: #11 Tigger2005

Please, everyone, be sure not to say anything that might hurt the gun's feelings. Guns are VERY sensitive.

Yep. Many come with hair-trigger tempers.

20 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:54:04am

re: #19 steve_davis

Yep. Many come with hair-trigger tempers.

They like to shoot off from time to time too.

21 erik_t  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:54:25am

If those kindergartners had handguns to defend themselves, this never would have happened.

22 Bulworth  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:55:35am
And all Bryan Fischer can say is "more guns."

That's because he loves families so much. Well, certain kind of families. /

23 Bulworth  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:56:20am
So when she stays put, it's a conspiracy. Now that Ambassador Rice has stepped aside, it's also a conspiracy.

It's a RWNJ win-win.

24 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:56:22am

People like to look for answer as long as it doesn't involve their own sub-cultural mores. Quick and simple. It's not about society as a whole but instead it's always "the other guy."

25 allegro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:56:25am

I keep hearing that the shooter is dead. A murder-suicide thing maybe?

26 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:57:55am

re: #12 Gus

OT, but, surprise!

[Embedded content]

It must be hell being them, unable to walk through the halls or down the street without seeing danger and conspiracy around every corner.

27 allegro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:58:04am

Just heard that the shooter was killed by police. Never mind.

28 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:58:19am

How many Americans have been murdered by other Americans since Benghazi? And how many congressional hearings have been held over these murders?

29 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:58:47am

re: #15 BongCrodny

And all Bryan Fischer the modern right wing can say is "more guns."

FTFY

I guarantee that Fischer won't be the only one calling for more guns in and around schools after this.

30 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 8:59:29am

re: #24 Gus

People like to look for answer as long as it doesn't involve their own sub-cultural mores. Quick and simple. It's not about society as a whole but instead it's always "the other guy."

This. In triplicate.

31 BongCrodny  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:00:00am

re: #28 Gus

How many Americans have been murdered by other Americans since Benghazi? And how many congressional hearings have been held over these murders?

Only a guess here, but less than one?

32 allegro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:00:20am

re: #26 b_sharp

It must be hell being them, unable to walk through the halls or down the street without seeing danger and conspiracy around every corner.

But certainly no connection between this continuous feeding of fear/paranoia and mass shootings happening every week or two. None whatsoever. Nope.

///

33 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:01:52am

re: #31 BongCrodny

Only a guess here, but less than one?

Less than zero. This is probably too hard for them to wrap around their skulls. They rather put together a hearing involving a bunch of male clerics with regards to contraception. The Pope is busy with gay marriage. And so on.

34 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:02:27am

Who exactly was going to have more guns in a kindergarten class, where the shooting took place. Multiple victims now being reported.

35 Romantic Heretic  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:02:38am

re: #3 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

And the Derp is right on time:

[Embedded content]

Good fucking Christ. What a complete tool.

36 Alexzander  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:04:41am

A close family friend lost his daughter in the Dunblane elementary school shooting in Scotland. He spent much of the past decade advocating for greater gun control in the UK.

37 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:06:36am

I wonder if the principal died trying to stop the gunman. Nothing is clear yet.

38 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:07:48am
39 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:08:19am

52 minutes.

40 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:10:02am

Meanwhile, Dana Loesch is still going on and on about Tentghazi.

41 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:13:48am

re: #36 Alexzander

A close family friend lost his daughter in the Dunblane elementary school shooting in Scotland. He spent much of the past decade advocating for greater gun control in the UK.

The UK went WAY too far in my book. I'm for better mental-health capabilities, but I'd also like to increase education for the public in why these sorts of shootings happen. Help people better spot the warning signs, and sadly, decrease the ability of individuals and parents to challenge orders that they be treated for mental issues. That last will surely be abused at times, but if done right the lives saved should outweigh those ruined.

42 Ian G.  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:14:17am

re: #3 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

And the Derp is right on time:

[Embedded content]

Remember everyone, white suburban kids packin' heat in school is as 'murkan as Apple Pie. Minority kids from the 'hood packing heat in school is proof of the nihilism in the African-American community and that Obama wants a race war against white America. Or something like that.

////winger mind.

43 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:16:09am
44 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:20:59am
45 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:21:48am
46 allegro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:23:27am

CNN reporting an interview with a witness saying that the school Principal and psychologist were killed. Vice Principal injured. Apparently the witness was in a meeting with them when they heard "pops". The 3 people went out into the hall, only one returned, crawling back into the room. Children had to be led past the bodies to exit the building.

THis is horrific.

47 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:25:46am

OT - Avigdor Lieberman, Israeli Foreign Minister, Resigns - NYTimes.com

JERUSALEM — Facing indictment for breach of trust and fraud, Israel’s foreign minister, Avigdor Lieberman, resigned his post Friday afternoon amid mounting political pressure, upending the campaign landscape five weeks before national elections.

48 ramex  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:25:48am

Fischer thinks unarmed children are "sitting ducks." Does he take one moment to consider why children should wind up as targets in the first place? I didn't know that every time I walk down the street without a gun that I'm a sitting duck. I don't think I very much like people who view me that way.
"Hey! There's one who's unarmed. Let's kill 'em. It'll be easy. He's a sitting duck."

49 allegro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:25:48am

re: #44 Gus

DEVELOPING: @johnmillercbs reports preliminary information indicates a student's father was CT school gunman cbsn.ws/live

No doubt, another responsible, law abiding gun owner we keep hearing about.

50 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:26:49am

re: #47 Gus

OT - Avigdor Lieberman, Israeli Foreign Minister, Resigns - NYTimes.com

Something tells me that we have not heard the last from that fascist.

51 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:28:03am

Good morning lizards.

I just heard about this 5 minutes ago. I'm horrified.

52 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:28:33am

re: #50 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

Something tells me that we have not heard the last from that fascist.

He won't be missed until then.

53 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:28:49am

re: #44 Gus

[Embedded content]

That gives some insight into the shooting: Principal and psychologist tell mentally troubled father things he didn't want to hear, he flips out and murders them.

/This should not be read as approval of a murder ramage, but rather an attempt to find out why the murders happened.

54 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:29:08am

I think the presser has been moved up and may start in about 2 minutes.

55 Alexzander  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:30:09am

re: #41 Dark_Falcon

The UK went WAY too far in my book. I'm for better mental-health capabilities, but I'd also like to increase education for the public in why these sorts of shootings happen. Help people better spot the warning signs, and sadly, decrease the ability of individuals and parents to challenge orders that they be treated for mental issues. That last will surely be abused at times, but if done right the lives saved should outweigh those ruined.

I agree with you; I'm fairly libertarian when it comes to gun ownership.

56 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:30:27am

re: #50 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

Yep.

I do have a question. It has been gnawing at me for months.

Namely, I seem to be the only idiot on the internet that thinks Jeremy Clarkson is a massive, raging asshole.

I am crazy for thinking that?

57 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:31:49am

re: #53 Dark_Falcon

That gives some insight into the shooting: Principal and psychologist tell mentally troubled father things he didn't want to hear, he flips out and murders them.

/This should not be read as approval of a murder ramage, but rather an attempt to find out why the murders happened.

If that's true the question still is why the fuck would he shoot kids.

58 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:32:55am

re: #57 NJDhockeyfan

If that's true the question still is why the fuck would he shoot kids.

His child may have been bullied and he decided the school as a whole was to blame.

This is only conjecture, you understand.

59 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:33:02am

Unconfirmed.

60 Ghost of Tom Joad  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:33:17am

re: #53 Dark_Falcon

Well, it gives some possible motive other than "fucking nut decides to shoot up a random school." The question then becomes...why do people continually turn to violent methods to resolve every problem...

Or the school found out he was abusing the kid or something (which I wouldn't doubt considering the atrocity he committed) and went on a shooting rampage after being confronted about it.

Who the hell knows. I wish there was a way to understand what goes through people's minds when they do things like this.

61 gwangung  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:33:18am

re: #57 NJDhockeyfan

If that's true the question still is why the fuck would he shoot kids.

Bad aim...or overpowered gun punching through his target and hitting a child behind?

62 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:34:19am
NEWTOWN—
Multiple people, including children, have been killed in a shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School.

The number of victims is unclear. Many of the shootings took place in a kindergarten classroom, sources said.

A person believed to be a shooter is dead. Earlier reports of a second shooter are unconfirmed.

Kindergarten class? Fucking sick.

63 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:34:24am

re: #41 Dark_Falcon

The UK went WAY too far in my book. I'm for better mental-health capabilities, but I'd also like to increase education for the public in why these sorts of shootings happen. Help people better spot the warning signs, and sadly, decrease the ability of individuals and parents to challenge orders that they be treated for mental issues. That last will surely be abused at times, but if done right the lives saved should outweigh those ruined.

The average person is not trained and has too little experience to objectively assess other people's mental condition, so you would end up with 'wolf' being cried too often for the system to be effective. Well trained teachers and school psychologists on site would be the best.

That takes money.

64 kirkspencer  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:34:26am

re: #57 NJDhockeyfan

If that's true the question still is why the fuck would he shoot kids.

Wild speculation here: remember the people at the movie theater who were shot when bullets went through the walls? Yeah. More modern school walls aren't heavily reinforced as a rule. Just a simple stud and wallboard separator for the most part.

And even if they're the older cinderblock construction, cinderblocks aren't that good at stopping bullets. Slowing them, sure, but a 'slow' bullet can still kill.

65 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:34:38am

re: #58 Dark_Falcon

Would like thoughts on that post I just made. I feel like this right now on that guy:

66 Ghost of Tom Joad  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:35:04am

re: #57 NJDhockeyfan

If that's true the question still is why the fuck would he shoot kids.

When you're mentally unstable and armed with a hammer, everything becomes a nail.

67 allegro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:35:10am

re: #53 Dark_Falcon

That gives some insight into the shooting: Principal and psychologist tell mentally troubled father things he didn't want to hear, he flips out and murders them.

/This should not be read as approval of a murder ramage, but rather an attempt to find out why the murders happened.

According to the witness, the principal and psychologist were in a meeting with her (the witness) when the shooting began in the hall. The 2 were killed and other injured when they went out into the hall. From this story, it doesn't appear that these people were necessarily targets. Could be just in the wrong place, wrong time.

68 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:35:59am

re: #61 gwangung

Bad aim...or overpowered gun punching through his target and hitting a child behind?

I heard on the news in my car that some women in the school said she heard at least 100 rounds. That not bad aiming, he was looking for mass casualties.

69 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:36:16am

Multiple children are among those killed. At least a dozen people were shot.

[deleted]

70 kirkspencer  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:36:29am

re: #67 allegro

According to the witness, the principal and psychologist were in a meeting with her (the witness) when the shooting began in the hall. The 2 were killed and other injured when they went out into the hall. From this story, it doesn't appear that these people were necessarily targets. Could be just in the wrong place, wrong time.

which completely nullifies my wild speculation above.

I think it's time to ask for the 24 hour rule.

71 gwangung  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:36:56am

re: #68 NJDhockeyfan

I heard on the news in my car that some women in the school said she heard at least 100 rounds. That not bad aiming, he was looking for mass casualties.

Ugh. Ugh. Ugh.

72 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:37:03am

re: #63 b_sharp

That takes money.

And there is the real problem with trying to fix a nation where too many think that their pissant tiny tax rate is too high.

73 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:37:09am

President Obama has been notified, and CT Gov. Malloy is on the scene.

Presser now underway.

74 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:37:19am

This sounds really bad. Terrible.

75 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:37:34am

Crap.

76 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:37:45am

This does not sound like a case of a gunman seeking out a "gun-free zone" where he can act with impunity, Mr Fischer.

77 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:37:47am
78 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:37:59am

re: #65 ProGunLiberal

Would like thoughts on that post I just made. I feel like this right now on that guy:

[Embedded content]

Which post is that?

79 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:38:00am

That presser is at the Danbury Hospital where victims were taken.

80 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:38:19am

Makes you wanna cry like a baby. Kids fucking kids.

81 ramex  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:38:19am

The shooter shot the principal. This is the second amendment in action. The shooter, all on his own, identified a tyrant and overthrew that tyrant. You see, that's how it works.

82 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:38:52am

re: #67 allegro

According to the witness, the principal and psychologist were in a meeting with her (the witness) when the shooting began in the hall. The 2 were killed and other injured when they went out into the hall. From this story, it doesn't appear that these people were necessarily targets. Could be just in the wrong place, wrong time.

OK. I hadn't known that.

83 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:39:13am

re: #77 Gus

I think we have found this century's candidate for worst American ever.

84 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:39:28am

At Danbury Hospital:

3 patients in transport; managed by trauma service. Will not disclose patient-specific treatment/conditions until further notice.

ED is on a lockdown to deal with treatment from the mass casualty incident.

85 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:39:36am

*HEAD DESK*

86 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:39:49am

You know. I abhor vigilante justice but if I had a child and they were a victim. I don't know what I'd do. I really don't. Not condoning violence or encouraging people to take the law into their own hands but I really don't know how I'd respond.

87 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:40:18am

re: #78 Dark_Falcon

The one on Jeremy Clarkson. I mentioned this once before, as I want to make sure I am not taking some sort of crazy pills.

88 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:40:49am

re: #85 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

*HEAD DESK*

[Embedded content]

This is my problem with them. You want to advocate for firearm rights, great, that's your right but show some goddamn sensitivity.

89 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:41:35am

re: #87 ProGunLiberal

The one on Jeremy Clarkson. I mentioned this once before, as I want to make sure I am not taking some sort of crazy pills.

I don't know who he is.

90 Ghost of Tom Joad  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:41:50am

re: #88 HappyWarrior

This is my problem with them. You want to advocate for firearm rights, great, that's your right but show some goddamn sensitivity.

I'm sure LaPierre will pull an Heston at some point and hold a gun-nut rally in the state of a mass shooting. Hell, I'm surprised he hasn't already.

91 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:42:17am
A parent who was at the school told a CNN producer that the principal, vice principal and school psychologist left the office right after shots rang out. The vice principal had been shot in the foot or leg and crawled back into the office.

The parent said she saw the other two lying in the hall, along with children, "in pools of blood," according to the producer.

Authorities said the suspected gunman was dead and his body was in a classroom.

Oh my God.

92 erik_t  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:42:19am

re: #85 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

re: #88 HappyWarrior

This is my problem with them. You want to advocate for firearm rights, great, that's your right but show some goddamn sensitivity.

Posted, for the curious, yesterday.

Let's make sure we know to what we're referring before we go all rabble-rabble.

93 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:42:31am

re: #89 Dark_Falcon

I don't know who he is.

something to do with a casting and/or reality show?

94 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:43:14am

re: #85 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

*HEAD DESK*

[Embedded content]

To be fair, they posted that tweet yesterday. They had no way of knowing what would happen today when they put it up.

/Said for the sake of fairness. This does not make me the NRA's defender for this thread. Please don't go after me.

95 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:43:20am
96 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:43:26am

BTW, if you're watching the Danbury presser, that was NJ Burkett who was asking the PR guy whether he could confirm reports that 2 dozen were killed, most of them are kids.

The hospital can't confirm events off the hospital campus. They refer to the CT State Troopers and their upcoming presser.

Fed/state officials confirm multiple casualties among children at the school.

97 RadicalModerate  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:43:34am

CNN is reporting that there was a second gunman involved in the school shooting, and that person has been apprehended by local police.

98 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:43:37am

re: #92 erik_t

Posted, for the curious, yesterday.

Let's make sure we know to what we're referring before we go all rabble-rabble.

Fair point. Sorry. Been feeling sick the past couple days. Judgement's not the best.

99 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:43:49am
100 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:44:16am

re: #99 Gus

[Embedded content]

Oh man. Man.

101 gwangung  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:44:23am

re: #97 RadicalModerate

CNN is reporting that there was a second gunman involved in the school shooting, and that person has been apprehended by local police.

WTF????? (if true)

What's going on?

102 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:44:50am

re: #97 RadicalModerate

CNN is reporting that there was a second gunman involved in the school shooting, and that person has been apprehended by local police.

Eyewitness News reporters on the scene observed a man in camouflage gear being taken away from the staging area. He screamed to people in the area that he was not involved in the shooting.

103 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:45:02am

This whole situation just makes me sick. Thoughts and prayers go out to all those affected by the shooting.

104 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:46:29am

27 killed? Most of them kids. That's a higher toll than that at Columbine, and similar to the Virginia Tech massacre - 32 killed. Tremendous loss of life.

105 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:46:31am

re: #90 Ghost of Tom Joad

I'm sure LaPierre will pull an Heston at some point and hold a gun-nut rally in the state of a mass shooting. Hell, I'm surprised he hasn't already.

He's too interested in making money. He knows exactly where the line is that might cost them money.

106 kirkspencer  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:46:48am

Asked once, suggesting again. 24 hour rule, please. There are way too many changing pieces here for me to be comfortable.

107 Alexzander  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:46:53am

.....

108 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:47:11am

re: #90 Ghost of Tom Joad

I'm sure LaPierre will pull an Heston at some point and hold a gun-nut rally in the state of a mass shooting. Hell, I'm surprised he hasn't already.

You do know that Heston couldn't cancel the NRA's meeting in Denver after Columbine, right? He canceled all exhibits, events, and guest speakers, but the annual meeting had to be held (by law, given the NRA's charter and its legal status). So don't lay that charge at Heston's feet. Its a lie put out by Michael Moore.

/Again, said in interests of honesty and fairness.

109 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:47:38am

The pictures of kids being led out and crying is breaking my heart.

110 erik_t  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:47:48am

Getting these details bit by bit really isn't improving my day, and certainly isn't serving some kind of grand purpose. I'll learn about it all tomorrow.

Shit's terrible everywhere and I can't do anything about it on the timescale of hours.

See y'all later.

111 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:47:55am

re: #108 Dark_Falcon

You do know that Heston couldn't cancel the NRA's meeting in Denver after Columbine, right? He canceled all exhibits, events, and guest speakers, but the annual meeting had to be held (by law, given the NRA's charter and its legal status). So don't lay that charge at Heston's feet. Its a lie put out by Michael Moore.

/Again, said in interests of honesty and fairness.

Heston wasn't a dick like LaPierre is.

112 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:47:55am

re: #89 Dark_Falcon

One of the British Hosts of Top Gear. Somehow the circles I run in love him.

The guy has said this:

In the last couple of weeks everyone has been asking how on earth the greatest and most powerful nation on earth could be so crippled by a bit of wind and rain.
The rest of the world has natural disasters without the whole of society falling to pieces. So why is it different in America?
Well, if you stop and think about it, the answer is obvious.
America may have given the world the space shuttle and, er, condensed milk, but behind the veneer of civilisation most Americans barely have the brains to walk on their back legs.

and this:

Hurricane Katrina didn't just knock a few bricks from the fabric of a levee. More importantly, it knocked a few bricks also from the notion that America is a shining beacon of hope for a troubled world.
It isn't. It's a house of straw. With no education to glue that straw together.

this too:

I think it’s a good idea to tie Peter Mandelson to a van. Such an act would be cruel and barbaric and inhuman. But it would at least cheer everyone up a bit.

had a conversation about German Cars that had this "gem.":

Clarkson: We should do a car that's quintessentially German
Hammond:What replace the spoons with little sausages?
Clarkson: No, no. Give it traffic indicators that go like that. (gives Nazi salutes) A SatNav that only goes to Poland. Und ein fanbelt zat vil last for a thousand years!

113 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:49:23am

re: #106 kirkspencer

Asked once, suggesting again. 24 hour rule, please. There are way too many changing pieces here for me to be comfortable.

Quite Concur. This is a very bad situation, but the worse things get the more important it is for the sane to stay calm. We here are the Sane, so we must remain rational in times such as this.

114 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:49:46am
115 Feline Fearless Leader  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:49:54am

re: #73 lawhawk

President Obama has been notified, and CT Gov. Malloy is on the scene.

Presser now underway.

Wingnut fauxrage about Obama taking advantage to do a photo op over the bodies of dead children in 10, 9, 8...
///

116 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:50:27am

re: #115 Feline Fearless Leader

Wingnut fauxrage about Obama taking advantage to do a photo op over the bodies of dead children in 10, 9, 8...
///

That's inevitable really. Sad to say.

117 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:50:44am

re: #28 Gus

How many Americans have been murdered by other Americans since Benghazi? And how many congressional hearings have been held over these murders?

This nation averages 87 gun deaths each day.

118 Skip Intro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:50:54am

re: #94 Dark_Falcon

To be fair, they posted that tweet yesterday. They had no way of knowing what would happen today when they put it up.

Yeah, you're right, because this kind of thing is so rare.

Oh wait. No it's not. It happens every week or so now, doesn't it? Not that the NRA gives a flying shit.

119 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:51:25am

And some ones that are non-quotes:

About the US and Barack Obama:

Clarkson has been highly critical of the United States and more recently President Barack Obama. In an article after Obama was sworn into office, Clarkson wrote (in reference to Americans) "they have got it into their heads that Barack Obama is actually a blend of Jesus, Mother Teresa and Martin Luther King." Clarkson has also been very critical of the Special Relationship between the United States and the United Kingdom.

About Wales and Scotland:

On his chat show, Clarkson, he caused upset to the Welsh by placing a 3D plastic map of Wales into a microwave oven and switching it on. He later defended this by saying, "I put Wales in there because Scotland wouldn't fit."

On the Welsh and people with genetic differences:

BBC presenter Jeremy Clarkson is well-known for his xenophobic comments which sometimes take an anti-Welsh direction, e.g. "It’s entirely unfair that some people are born fat or ugly or dyslexic or disabled or ginger or small or Welsh. Life, I’m afraid, is tragic." Another example, in the context of Wales's 2008 Grand Slam victory: "You can never rely on the French. All they had to do was go to Cardiff last weekend with a bit of fire in their bellies and they’d have denied Wales the Six Nations Grand Slam. But no. They turned up instead with cheese in their bellies and mooched about for 80 minutes, seemingly not at all bothered that we’ve got to spend the next 12 months listening to the sheepsters droning on about their natural superiority and brilliance. Or worse. Give them a Grand Slam and the next thing you know, all our holiday cottages are on fire. There are, of course, other reasons I hoped the French would win. I’d rather live in France than Wales; I’d rather eat a snail than a daffodil; I’d certainly rather drink French fizzy wine; and I’d much rather sleep with Carole Bouquet than Charlotte Church." On his BBC2 show he placed a plastic map of Wales in a microwave and burned it to audience applause. On 4 September 2011, writing in his weekend column for The Sun newspaper, he said "I think we are fast approaching the time when the United Nations should start to think seriously about abolishing other languages. What’s the point of Welsh for example? All it does is provide a silly maypole around which a bunch of hotheads can get all nationalistic."

And he has mocked former PM Gordon Brown for having only one eye.

120 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:51:35am

re: #95 Gus

[Embedded content]

Oh no.

121 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:52:07am

re: #112 ProGunLiberal

One of the British Hosts of Top Gear. Somehow the circles I run in love him.

The guy has said this:

and this:

this too:

had a conversation about German Cars that had this "gem.":

He's a shithead for saying that. Last year his show got in trouble for slurring Mexicans. So no, you're not imagining things.

Some conservatives may overstate it, but sometimes European anti-Americanism really can be quite ugly.

122 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:52:32am

re: #113 Dark_Falcon

Am I taking crazy pills, or is this guy a major, massive, raging hemerroid on the ass of the United Kingdom?

123 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:52:33am

re: #119 ProGunLiberal

Can you please shut up about Clarkson while we are all focused on the shooting in CT?

124 RadicalModerate  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:53:36am

re: #99 Gus

[Embedded content]

CBS has broken into daily programming and are reporting the 27 deaths number on their broadcast. From what I can tell with local programming, they appear to be the only network who is currently reporting this.

125 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:53:41am

Fucking media. Leave those kids alone.

126 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:53:51am
[Link: www.thedailybeast.com...]

Interactive Map: The U.S. Shooting Epidemic

Roll over or tap the interactive map below to see how your state compares, or explore the data in the spreadsheet below. If we missed one, let us know in the comments or at @mhkeller and @BrianAbelson.

127 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:54:14am

re: #123 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

Can you please shut up about Clarkson while we are all focused on the shooting in CT?

bit of distraction is fine...

128 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:54:43am

re: #122 ProGunLiberal

Am I taking crazy pills, or is this guy a major, massive, raging hemerroid on the ass of the United Kingdom?

Yea, you are taking crazy pills since you are bringing up a totally unrelated topic on this thread.

129 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:54:48am

Bryan is the biggest douche in the universe.

130 Political Atheist  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:54:54am

I'm just sick and sad at heart. This is awful.

131 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:55:01am

re: #121 Dark_Falcon

Thing is, he is a conservative.

And I will give (most of) US TV credit on this. If we had someone who was this big an asshole making statements on the Tele, he would be thrown out so fast, it would incite a Hurricane stronger that Wilma.

He also has said that Indian food and water gives people diarrhea. Considering the fact I have a number of Pakistani and Indian friends how the fuck did I miss that?

132 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:55:17am

re: #125 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Fucking media. Leave those kids alone.

they only do it because the audience is there for it. if they were faced with a boycott or mass outpourings of indignant disgust, they might start to back down.

133 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:56:15am

re: #131 ProGunLiberal

Thing is, he is a conservative.

And I will give (most of) US TV credit on this. If we had someone who was this big an asshole making statements on the Tele, he would be thrown out so fast, it would incite a Hurricane stronger that Wilma.

He also has said that Indian food and water gives people diarrhea. Considering the fact I have a number of Pakistani and Indian friends how the fuck did I miss that?

Verdict: He's a xenophobic ass. Racist too.

134 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:56:28am

re: #124 RadicalModerate

AP is also reporting 27 dead; at least 18 of them children.

135 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:56:38am

re: #125 NJDhockeyfan

Perhaps there should be regulations on doing that sort of thing. These are kids who haven't even learned multiplication in many cases.

LEAVE THOSE KIDS ALONE!

I'm hoping CBS is wrong. I think CBS is hoping CBS is wrong.

136 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:56:43am

re: #112 ProGunLiberal

One of the British Hosts of Top Gear. Somehow the circles I run in love him.

The guy has said this:

and this:

this too:

had a conversation about German Cars that had this "gem.":

I love him. It's pretty much the opinion of Americans overseas. Get used to it or prove them wrong. And the man in question leans right in England so it's not a left wing view of America alone.

137 Varek Raith  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:57:08am

What the fuck is wrong with this country?
Mass shootings are now a regular event.
What the fuck.

138 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:57:22am

re: #134 lawhawk

AP is also reporting 27 dead; at least 18 of them children.

27 dead?????? WHAT?

139 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:57:36am

Clarifications on the number of casualties and other key details will come at a presser in a few minutes.

140 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:57:58am

re: #138 Destro

[Link: www.nhregister.com...]

141 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:58:17am

re: #133 Dark_Falcon

Verdict: He's a xenophobic ass. Racist too.

He has a reality show about cars, a sort of automotive casting show. And as I recall, you cannot turn on a TV at any time of day in the UK without finding it running on one of the channels, it is an institution.

142 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:58:53am

re: #128 Destro

Yea, you are taking crazy pills since you are bringing up a totally unrelated topic on this thread.

Go Fuck Yourself. PLL wasn't doing anything wrong and you go and downding and insult him. That's rotten, Destro.

143 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:59:27am

re: #137 Varek Raith

What the fuck is wrong with this country?
Mass shootings are now a regular event.
What the fuck.

Part of it is end time insanity. Part of it is stress from the meltdown that began years ago. And a really fucking big part of it is that we do not have any fucking mental health care system in this country.

144 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:59:40am

Sounds like high capacity clips.

145 Dr Lizardo  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 9:59:58am

re: #138 Destro

That's what I'm hearing. 27 dead, 18 of them children.

146 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:00:40am

re: #142 Dark_Falcon

Go Fuck Yourself. PLL wasn't doing anything wrong and you go and downding and insult him. That's rotten, Destro.

I'd prefer he saved the discussion for later, but otherwise I agree with DF.

147 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:00:58am

re: #141 Sol Berdinowitz

He has a reality show about cars, a sort of automotive casting show. And as I recall, you cannot turn on a TV at any time of day in the UK without finding it running on one of the channels, it is an institution.

I know. But his words are nasty and hurtful. And Destro just downdinged my post for no reason.

148 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:02:11am

re: #132 Sol Berdinowitz

they only do it because the audience is there for it. if they were faced with a boycott or mass outpourings of indignant disgust, they might start to back down.

If I arrived to the school and saw a damn reporter with a microphone shoved my crying daughter's face I'd take that microphone and shove it up his ass.

149 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:02:14am

Skip Intro, come out and play games!

150 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:02:15am
151 CuriousLurker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:02:49am

What the hell? %$@^#*%&!

Shooters attack an elementary school in CT - another "gun-free zone." Makes children sitting ducks. —Bryan Fischer

Right, because we should turn America's elementary schools into armed fortresses. That'll teach children a really great lesson in preparation for turning them into future wingnuts: Be afraid, kids, be very afraid. "They" are out to get you.

152 Skip Intro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:02:55am

re: #149 Dark_Falcon

What would you like to play?

153 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:03:24am

re: #136 Destro

"Liberal" only in economics I see. Completely okay to crank of on quite literally everybody. Redheads, the Welsh, the Scots, the French, the Germans, the Poles, those with disabilites (whether by Genetics or otherwise), the Indians, the short, and I think I missed many others.

Congratulations on being a massive tool. Perhaps you should see the opinion many nations had on the most recent election.

And sorry for thread-jacking. That finally boiled over.

Also, now we have some incident at the Local Harrison School District. Will keep you posted.

154 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:03:28am

re: #148 NJDhockeyfan

If I arrived to the school and saw a damn reporter with a microphone shoved my crying daughter's face I'd take that microphone and shove it up his ass.

Then you'd get arrested yourself. The cops would have to do it, since they would witness it. No, you'd bat the mic away and shield your daughter.

155 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:03:42am

re: #150 Gus

[Embedded content]

Short and sweet and to the point. Kudos.

156 Feline Fearless Leader  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:04:04am

re: #152 Skip Intro

What would you like to play?

How about a nice game of chess? The only way to win Global Thermonuclear War is not to play.

157 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:04:23am

re: #154 Dark_Falcon

Then you'd get arrested yourself. The cops would have to do it, since they would witness it. No, you'd bat the mic away and shield your daughter.

I would go to jail and the reporter would have a hard time sitting down for a while.

158 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:04:24am

re: #152 Skip Intro

What would you like to play?

Let's play "Why were you downdinging PLL and updinging Destro's insult of him?"

159 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:04:59am

re: #157 NJDhockeyfan

I would go to jail and the reporter would have a hard time sitting down for a while.

Then who would console and be there for your daughter?

160 Feline Fearless Leader  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:05:10am

re: #157 NJDhockeyfan

I would go to jail and the reporter would have a hard time sitting down for a while.

And the Breitbart crowd would call you a teacher-hugging unionist thug.
:p
//

161 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:05:18am

Fucking hell.

162 Charles Johnson  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:05:28am

This is now the worst school shooting in US history.

163 wrenchwench  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:05:28am

re: #153 ProGunLiberal

Congratulations on being a massive tool.

Hey now, tools are useful implements....

164 CuriousLurker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:05:48am

re: #145 Dr Lizardo

That's what I'm hearing. 27 dead, 18 of them children.

No, I don't want to hear that. ^%#$^#@*

165 Skip Intro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:05:56am

re: #158 Dark_Falcon

Let's play "Why were you downdinging PLL and updinging Destro's insult of him?"

Because I disagree with the former and agree with the latter. Sometimes it's just the opposite. You just never can tell.

166 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:06:00am

re: #154 Dark_Falcon

I agree with both of you.

On a rational level, I would try to do what DF said.

On an emotional level, I would never vote to find someone who did such an action guilty of the action NJD proposed.

167 allegro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:06:37am

re: #125 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Fucking media. Leave those kids alone.

I have seen only one child interviewed with both of her parents standing next to her. The child did not appear to be upset at all by the interview.

168 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:06:46am

re: #164 CuriousLurker

I'm still holding out hope that maybe there was a mistake with numbers somewhere.

169 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:06:54am

re: #142 Dark_Falcon

Go Fuck Yourself. PLL wasn't doing anything wrong and you go and downding and insult him. That's rotten, Destro.

I won't let you gun nuts change the topic.

170 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:08:30am

Damn.

171 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:08:33am

re: #145 Dr Lizardo

That's what I'm hearing. 27 dead, 18 of them children.

I just thought it was the principle in the office not the kids. I am just hurt/rage/pissed off/shocked right now.

172 Dr. Matt  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:08:35am

27 dead and just earlier this week the conservatives were smearing Bob Costas because he was discussing America's violent and dangerous gun culture. As usual, the right is on the wrong side of yet another issue.

173 Ian G.  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:08:47am

re: #150 Gus

[Embedded content]

I wonder if Fischer has ever seen "City of God", where there are actual elementary school-age kids walking around with guns. Did he think that movie was how the US should be? Did he think the movie glorified children armed to the teeth? Or does none of this compute because he only thinks in tribal terms, and thus the Favelas of Brazil are full of dark-skinned people speaking a dirka dirka language, instead of God's chosen people: white Americans.

174 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:08:54am

re: #153 ProGunLiberal

Apparently the incident in Harrison School District were armed burglars in the neighborhood breaking into houses. The schools were put on lockdown.

Burglars were caught, schools off lockdown.

175 gwangung  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:09:40am

re: #174 ProGunLiberal

Apparently the incident in Harrison School District were armed burglars in the neighborhood breaking into houses. The schools were put on lockdown.

Burglars were caught, schools off lockdown.

Thankful.

176 RadicalModerate  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:10:20am

re: #129 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

Bryan is the biggest douche in the universe.

[Embedded content]

Bryan Fischer has officially placed himself on the "Religious Asshole" list somewhere between the Fred Phelps clan and the Christian Identity movement, and is rapidly moving in the direction of the latter.

177 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:10:21am

Bryan Fischer is an evil spiteful shiteating bastard.

178 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:10:50am

re: #143 William Barnett-Lewis

Part of it is end time insanity. Part of it is stress from the meltdown that began years ago. And a really fucking big part of it is that we do not have any fucking mental health care system in this country.

The stress from the meltdown is the thesis for why these mass shootings take pace in America per Mark Ames' book:

[Link: www.alternet.org...]

An interview with Mark Ames, whose book "Going Postal" about rage murders in American schools and workplaces

179 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:11:17am

re: #166 ProGunLiberal

I agree with both of you.

On a rational level, I would try to do what DF said.

On an emotional level, I would never vote to find someone who did such an action guilty of the action NJD proposed.

I would vote to find him guilty, but of the least severe charge I could and I'd do my best to get a jury statement asking the judge for leniency. You can't let a violent assault go unpunished, whatever the reason for it.

180 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:11:26am

re: #173 Ian G.

I wonder if Fischer has ever seen "City of God", where there are actual elementary school-age kids walking around with guns. Did he think that movie was how the US should be? Did he think the movie glorified children armed to the teeth? Or does none of this compute because he only thinks in tribal terms, and thus the Favelas of Brazil are full of dark-skinned people speaking a dirka dirka language, instead of God's chosen people: white Americans.

I doubt he has but that's an excellent movie.

181 Bulworth  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:11:26am
This is a really bad one, folks. The Associated Press now reports that 27 people are dead, 18 of them children.

No words. Not sure I can handle any more Internet today.

182 efuseakay  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:11:27am

re: #172 Dr. Matt

27 dead and just earlier this week the conservatives were smearing Bob Costas because he was discussing America's violent and dangerous gun culture. As usual, the right is on the wrong side of yet another issue.

Just wait for them to blame him for even mentioning this country's gun obsession...

183 Locker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:12:01am

ABC says TWO gunmen:

[Link: abcnews.go.com...]

The massacre involved two gunmen at a Connecticut school this morning, prompting the town of Newtown to lock down all of its schools and draw SWAT teams to the school, authorities said today.

State Police confirm that one shooter is dead. A second gunman is apparently at large. Car-to-car searches are underway.

184 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:12:02am

Worse and worse.

185 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:12:06am

Lester Holt:

Shooter was clad in all black, two handguns. Police presser is still pending.

186 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:12:06am

re: #147 Dark_Falcon

I know. But his words are nasty and hurtful. And Destro just downdinged my post for no reason.

Every nation has its untouchable assholes, we have Rush Limbaugh. Destro must be upset. I can understand that to an extent. But we are not making dead schoolkid jokes here, for chrissakes...

187 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:12:57am

re: #170 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Damn.

Only for shooting.

From Wiki:
The Bath School disaster is the name given to three bombings in Bath Township, Michigan, on May 18, 1927, which killed 38 elementary school children, two teachers, four other adults and the bomber himself; at least 58 people were injured. Most of the victims were children in the second to sixth grades (7–14 years of age [1]) attending the Bath Consolidated School. Their deaths constitute the deadliest mass murder in a school in U.S. history and the fourth-deadliest massacre in U.S. history, behind the Oklahoma City bombing, the Mountain Meadows massacre and 9/11.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Humans have an infinite capacity for evil.

188 wrenchwench  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:13:16am

re: #181 Bulworth

No words. Not sure I can handle any more Internet today.

Tough old journalists are having a hard time with it.

189 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:13:26am

Ugh. I'm about as pro-gun as they come and even I'm seeing a problem with the direction things are heading. The "right to keep and bear arms" line has to lie somewhere between "no guns at all" and "enough guns and ammunition to blow away several classrooms of innocent children". Probably much closer to the former than the latter, unfortunately for the second-amendment nutcases.

190 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:13:46am

re: #153 ProGunLiberal

"Liberal" only in economics I see. Completely okay to crank of on quite literally everybody. Redheads, the Welsh, the Scots, the French, the Germans, the Poles, those with disabilites (whether by Genetics or otherwise), the Indians, the short, and I think I missed many others.

Stick to the topic. Who gives a fuck about a British car show right now?

191 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:14:01am

re: #176 RadicalModerate

Bryan Fischer has officially placed himself on the "Religious Asshole" list somewhere between the Fred Phelps clan and the Christian Identity movement, and is rapidly moving in the direction of the latter.

The sick thing is that the Phelps Klan will surely picket the funerals of some the children who died. As ever, the Patriot Guard will be there to screen them off, protecting the grieving from the ghouls.

192 Skip Intro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:14:10am

re: #189 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

A rational post.

Thank you.

193 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:14:37am

Bryan Fischer would turn America into a Third world country where Christian warlords run their territories using mob violence and militias.

194 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:14:38am

re: #191 Dark_Falcon

Wasn't there some incident in China with a knife recently?

195 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:15:09am

re: #172 Dr. Matt

27 dead and just earlier this week the conservatives were smearing Bob Costas because he was discussing America's violent and dangerous gun culture. As usual, the right is on the wrong side of yet another issue.

Now is not the time to discuss gun violence, OK?

196 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:15:22am

re: #190 Destro

Stick to the topic. Who gives a fuck about a British car show right now?

Both of you, shut the fuck up.

197 gwangung  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:15:25am

re: #189 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

Ugh. I'm about as pro-gun as they come and even I'm seeing a problem with the direction things are heading. The "right to keep and bear arms" line has to lie somewhere between "no guns at all" and "enough guns and ammunition to blow away several classrooms of innocent children". Probably much closer to the former than the latter, unfortunately for the second-amendment nutcases.

This is the price for the NRA stance on guns. No ifs, ands or buts.

You can have gun control, or have increased mental health forces, but not having anything is a price too high to be paid.

198 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:15:31am

re: #183 Locker

ABC says TWO gunmen:

[Link: abcnews.go.com...]

Fuck.

199 Randall Gross  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:15:39am

re: #117 Destro

This nation averages 87 gun deaths each day.

I went and did the math on this figure this am thinking it was too high or inflated somewhere. After digging through FBI and CDC stats and building my own spreadsheet, I can back up the figures and say if anything that 87 might be low once all the figures for 2011 are finalized.

200 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:16:01am

re: #187 William Barnett-Lewis

Only for shooting.

From Wiki:
The Bath School disaster is the name given to three bombings in Bath Township, Michigan, on May 18, 1927, which killed 38 elementary school children, two teachers, four other adults and the bomber himself; at least 58 people were injured. Most of the victims were children in the second to sixth grades (7–14 years of age [1]) attending the Bath Consolidated School. Their deaths constitute the deadliest mass murder in a school in U.S. history and the fourth-deadliest massacre in U.S. history, behind the Oklahoma City bombing, the Mountain Meadows massacre and 9/11.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Humans have an infinite capacity for evil.

This paragraph from the Wikipedia entry will seem sickly familiar:

The bomber was school board treasurer Andrew Kehoe, 55, who was enraged about a property tax levied to fund the construction of the school building. He blamed the additional tax for financial hardships which led to foreclosure proceedings against his farm. These events apparently provoked Kehoe to plan his attack. He died in a car bomb he set off after he drove up to the school as the crowd gathered to rescue survivors from the burning school.

201 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:16:02am

re: #173 Ian G.

I wonder if Fischer has ever seen "City of God", where there are actual elementary school-age kids walking around with guns. Did he think that movie was how the US should be?

That is exactly how they want life to be.

202 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:16:22am

re: #183 Locker

NBC is saying 1 gunman according to their sources. Still awaiting presser with more information.

We're just going to see a churn of information until we get a more official word.

203 Charles Johnson  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:16:24am
204 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:16:36am

re: #189 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

Ugh. I'm about as pro-gun as they come and even I'm seeing a problem with the direction things are heading. The "right to keep and bear arms" line has to lie somewhere between "no guns at all" and "enough guns and ammunition to blow away several classrooms of innocent children". Probably much closer to the former than the latter, unfortunately for the second-amendment nutcases.

Agree. There is something in there about a well regulated militia, too...and nothing about unlimited access to murderous firepower.

205 Interesting Times  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:16:53am

re: #194 ProGunLiberal

Wasn't there some incident in China with a knife recently?

China school knife attack in Henan injures 22 children

The attack happened at the gate of a school in Chenpeng village in Henan province.

Police arrested a 36-year-old local man at the scene.

Security at China's schools has been increased in recent years following a spate of similar knife attacks in which nearly 20 children have been killed.

I'm surprised Bryan Fischer hasn't said that if the Chinese children had guns...

/oh fuck it I can't do it. But you know the wingnuts will point to this story as an excuse. Human capacity for evil infinite, indeed.

206 CuriousLurker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:16:54am

re: #196 b_sharp

Both of you, shut the fuck up.

Seconded.

207 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:16:55am

re: #198 NJDhockeyfan

Scary thought that there are two people that were this depraved to do this.

208 Dr Lizardo  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:17:09am

re: #171 Destro

Czech Television is covering it live (in Czech, of course).

Here in the Czech Republic, a person can own a gun. It's not hard. Hell, you can even get a concealed permit.

However, you need to demonstrate the ability to handle a firearm, the ability to field-strip and reassemble your firearm, and if you're going for concealed carry, you get a nice little interview with a federal police shrink.

I myself have a CZ shotgun for pheasant hunting. I had to get a license for it. I had to demonstrate firearms proficiency and safe handling to a Czech police firearms instructor.

No problem, for me at least. And it would never occur to me to start blowing people away.

Not to mention a classroom full of kids.

209 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:17:10am

re: #206 CuriousLurker

Seconded.

Thirded.

210 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:17:19am

re: #194 ProGunLiberal

Wasn't there some incident in China with a knife recently?

Yes. Some guy went on a killing spree with a knife. He killed something like 9-12 people before the police finally shot him dead.

211 wrenchwench  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:17:35am

re: #203 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

American exceptionalism.

ugh

212 Political Atheist  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:17:47am

re: #136 Destro

Same guy that did a euro centric screw job on Tesla. Lied his ass off about it. The lawsuit failed but the facts remain-

Over the last several months, we have written to the BBC, asking them to stop repeating the serious and damaging lies on the show. Specifically:

The Roadster's true range is only 55 miles per charge. Clarkson says: "Although Tesla say it will do 200 miles we worked out that on our track it would run out after just 55 miles."

Fact: The Roadster has been certified under UN ECE R101, the EU regulation for measuring electric vehicle range, at 211 miles. All ECE R101 tests are witnessed and certified by a neutral third party approved by the United Nations Economic Commission for Europe, in Tesla's case, the Department of Road Transport – Netherlands. Of course, a car driven aggressively will get reduced mileage, regardless of whether its fueled by petrol or electricity, as Top Gear found. At the other end of the spectrum, through mindful driving, a Tesla owner achieved an astounding 313 miles on a single charge. To let either of these extremes represent real-world range is an incomplete analysis.
One of the Roadsters ran out of charge and had to be pushed into the Top Gear hangar by four men.

Fact: Neither Roadster ran out of charge during Top Gear's tests, or even came close. We know because the Roadster records basic operating information. The show fails to mention that neither Roadster ever went below twenty-five percent charge. Why stage the stunt of pushing it into the hangar?
The Roadster's brakes broke, rendering the car not drivable.

Fact: During Top Gear’s drive on the test track, the fuse for the braking system's electric vacuum pump failed. But the brakes were operational and safe. The result was like driving a car without the convenient power brakes to which we’ve grown accustomed. Tesla's brakes, both with and without the fuse, must pass all UN ECE safety tests, and they do.
Neither Roadster provided to Top Gear was available for test driving due to these problems.

Fact: At all times, there was at least one Roadster at the ready.

If the episode had been broadcast in 2008, and not rebroadcast repeatedly to hundreds of millions of new viewers all over the globe, Tesla would not have sued. We’re not doing this for money. As the world leader in EV technology, Tesla owes it to the public to stop Top Gear’s disinformation campaign and provide the truth. Top Gear scripted how the show would end before they ever got into the car. Meanwhile, the show continues to seriously misinform its fans.

213 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:17:52am

re: #205 Interesting Times

Mom says I am going so far out on a limb I am sitting a twig, but could it be a copycat?

214 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:17:56am

re: #205 Interesting Times

China school knife attack in Henan injures 22 children

I'm surprised Bryan Fisher hasn't said that if the Chinese children had guns...

/oh fuck it I can't do it. But you know the wingnuts will point to this story as an excuse. Human capacity for evil infinite, indeed.

215 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:18:04am

re: #194 ProGunLiberal

Wasn't there some incident in China with a knife recently?

A few times I think.

216 Dr. Matt  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:18:09am

I hate to be macabre and insensitive, but I believe 27 dead is a new American "record" for number of deaths in a shooting spree. This is heartbreaking.

217 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:18:18am

re: #186 Sol Berdinowitz

Every nation has its untouchable assholes, we have Rush Limbaugh. Destro must be upset. I can understand that to an extent. But we are not making dead schoolkid jokes here, for chrissakes...

Who made a joke about this? And I saw an effort by a guy with the name "progun" trying to change the topic to that of a British car show. That pissed me the fuck off.

218 Randall Gross  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:18:30am

CNN says 24 yr old, four weapons, bullet proof vest, possible accomplice.

219 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:18:32am

re: #196 b_sharp

Both of you, shut the fuck up.

Agreed.

220 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:18:37am

re: #204 Sol Berdinowitz

Agree. There is something in there about a well regulated militia, too...and nothing about unlimited access to murderous firepower.

It's not the kind of thing the Founders envisioned, I'm sure. Like it or not, the strict literalist interpretation of the Constitution has to go away.

221 Locker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:18:46am

I don't feel much different right now than when I saw a plane deliberately crash into a building in New York City. The desperate hope that I'm dreaming and can wake up.

This crushes my spirit.

222 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:18:54am

re: #193 Kragar

Bryan Fischer would turn America into a Third world country where Christian warlords run their territories using mob violence and militias.

So Uganda, then? Or maybe Somalia. The anarcho-capitalist douchebags like Somalia.

223 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:19:22am

re: #205 Interesting Times

China school knife attack in Henan injures 22 children

I'm surprised Bryan Fisher hasn't said that if the Chinese children had guns...

/oh fuck it I can't do it. But you know the wingnuts will point to this story as an excuse. Human capacity for evil infinite, indeed.

224 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:19:45am

re: #218 Randall Gross

CNN says 24 yr old, four weapons, bullet proof vest, possible accomplice.

POSSIBLE ACCOMPLICE???? Is this a terrorist attack? Who gets 2 people to do such an act?

225 wrenchwench  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:19:52am

re: #213 ProGunLiberal

Mom says I am going so far out on a limb I am sitting a twig, but could it be a copycat?

Not so much a copycat as a product of the sick gun culture, more likely. And mentally sick himself, most likely.

226 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:20:00am

re: #223 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

The rule of holes.

227 RadicalModerate  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:20:19am

ABC News reports that the shooter was 24 years old, armed with four weapons and had bulletproof clothing.

Also, from CNN: the school that this occurred at DID have a security system in place to restrict access to the building, and the shooter did somehow circumvent it.

228 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:20:25am

Fischer is about as predictable as a sunrise. Fucker makes Robertson look somewhat decent. And before you remind me that Robertson says nasty shit too. Hence the somewhat qualifier.

229 brennant  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:20:25am

Bryan Fischer needs to zipper his trap.

230 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:20:26am

re: #220 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

It's not the kind of thing the Founders envisioned, I'm sure. Like it or not, the strict literalist interpretation of the Constitution has to go away.

you should have the right to unlimited muzzle-loading muskets?

231 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:20:47am

The shooter is dead, and NBC is now reporting that a second person is in custody and they're trying to determine whether he was in the school coincidentally or was involved in the shooting.

The shooter is apparently a 20 year old male.

232 Dr Lizardo  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:20:57am

re: #224 Destro

Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold.

233 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:20:57am

re: #227 RadicalModerate

ABC News reports that the shooter was 24 years old, armed with four weapons and had bulletproof clothing.

Also, from CNN: the school that this occurred at DID have a security system in place to restrict access to the building, and the shooter did somehow circumvent it.

24 years old so likely not a parent then.

234 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:21:15am

I don't know how I can work the rest of the day. I'm decimated by this news.

235 Interesting Times  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:21:55am

re: #214 Kragar

re: #223 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

I hate it when reality exceeds my worst expectations

236 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:22:00am

Real big man who targets helpless kids. Real big fucking man.

237 Varek Raith  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:22:07am

God dammit.

238 Randall Gross  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:22:21am

re: #224 Destro

Columbine was 2 wasn't it? That's still speculation here -- police are looking for a possible accomplice is the report.
That means this is horrifying, and officers on scene are making sure.

239 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:22:25am

re: #220 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

It's not the kind of thing the Founders envisioned, I'm sure. Like it or not, the strict literalist interpretation of the Constitution has to go away.

The first amendment doesn't mention the internet as part of speech or the press. Do we really want to go there either?

240 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:22:41am

re: #213 ProGunLiberal

Mom says I am going so far out on a limb I am sitting a twig, but could it be a copycat?

PLL, I'd suggest you remove your temporary nic for a short time. The 'pro-gun liberal' thing seems to be setting some people off a bit. 'Pro-life liberal' would seem less grating right now. Not trying to push at you, but emotions are running very high and I'd like to reduce tensions here when possible right now.

241 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:23:23am

This cruel & hateful fuckball really believes he's all kind & loving & shit. What a delusional turd.

242 RadicalModerate  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:23:24am

re: #233 HappyWarrior

24 years old so likely not a parent then.

Not necessarily. If he was in his late teens when becoming a parent, his child would definitely be of elementary school age.

243 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:23:25am

The worst part is waiting for more information. I hope most of this is wrong.

244 Randall Gross  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:23:42am

I wouldn't jump to conclusions on an accomplice yet.

245 Alexzander  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:23:49am

My girlfriend has a lot of family in Connecticut but I don't want to tell her about this because she has two final papers due in 4 hours and this news is paralysing.

246 brennant  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:23:59am

So sad. Right now, I would like stop what I am doing, and sit with my son and play with his toy cars.

247 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:24:00am

re: #234 NJDhockeyfan

Understandable.

Unfortunately, I think the whole 2012 Hysteria may cause more of this in the next week.

248 Locker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:24:29am

re: #245 Alexzander

Nothing wrong with that and she'll understand, I'm sure.

249 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:24:39am

re: #242 RadicalModerate

Not necessarily. If he was in his late teens when becoming a parent, his child would definitely be of elementary school age.

True enough.

250 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:24:40am

re: #246 brennant

So sad. Right now, I would like stop what I am doing, and sit with my son and play with his toy cars.

One million times, this. I am going to give my little boy a great big hug when I get home from work.

251 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:24:40am

re: #247 ProGunLiberal

Understandable.

Unfortunately, I think the whole 2012 Hysteria may cause more of this in the next week.

How many people do you think actually believe in that Mayan shit?

252 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:24:48am

re: #240 Dark_Falcon

I have had the nic-nic so long, I forgot how to change it.

253 allegro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:24:59am

re: #233 HappyWarrior

24 years old so likely not a parent then.

He could certainly be a parent. The school is K-4 so there are 4yo to 9yo kids.

254 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:25:05am
WASHINGTON (AP) -- A law enforcement official says the attacker in the Connecticut school shootings is a 20-year-old man with ties to the school.

The official said that a gun used in the attacks is a .223-caliber rifle. The official also said that New Jersey state police are searching a location in that state in connection with the shootings, said by an official in Connecticut to have left 27 dead, including 18 children.

255 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:25:06am

re: #247 ProGunLiberal

Understandable.

Unfortunately, I think the whole 2012 Hysteria may cause more of this in the next week.

Fucking lunatics and their conspiracy theories.

256 Feline Fearless Leader  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:25:10am

re: #247 ProGunLiberal

Understandable.

Unfortunately, I think the whole 2012 Hysteria may cause more of this in the next week.

Maybe go with "ProMayaLiberal" then and confuse them?

257 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:25:18am

re: #241 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

This cruel & hateful fuckball really believes he's a kind & loving & shit. What a delusional turd.

Doesn't matter how kind & loving we are. If we're pro-life rape and pro-marriagehomophobic to the point of paranoia, will be hated. Accept it.

258 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:25:27am

re: #251 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

How many people do you think actually believe in that Mayan shit?

There are a lot of stupid people in the world.

259 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:25:40am

re: #253 allegro

He could certainly be a parent. The school is K-4 so there are 4yo to 9yo kids.

Yeah, you're right. Seeing other people say the guy was 20 which would make it less likely IMO.

260 Petero1818  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:25:54am

re: #246 brennant

I get that. I am at work and I just checked news on Internet. It makes me want to puke. I have 3 kids at elementary school right now playing, learning, living. I feel sick to my stomach.

261 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:26:23am

re: #256 Feline Fearless Leader

I can do that. How do I change the Alt-Name?

262 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:26:32am

I wish you guys would stop posting Bryan Fischer tweets. I can't stomach the hate along with following the shooting.

263 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:26:55am

re: #246 brennant

So sad. Right now, I would like stop what I am doing, and sit with my son and play with his toy cars.

Do it.

264 Dr Lizardo  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:26:56am

re: #251 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

A whole lot of people believe in it. I have a friend up in Washington state who believes in it wholeheartedly. To the extent that if she's still alive come 12/22, she's gonna off herself. She's planned her whole life around the apocalypse coming on 12/21.

265 Sionainn  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:27:12am

re: #223 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

[Embedded content]

Those children were WOUNDED, Fischer, not fucking SLAUGHTERED!

Oh, I feel so sick right now. My heart is breaking for those parents and I can't wait until my little kindergartner gets home.

266 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:27:39am
267 brennant  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:27:45am

re: #263 b_sharp

Do it.

Once the important crap is done to keep a roof over our heads, I plan on it.

268 Charles Johnson  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:27:56am

NBC now reporting that a second shooter is in custody.

269 RadicalModerate  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:27:58am

ABC and NBC News have finally broken into regular programming and are reporting live - almost 45 minutes after CBS.

MSNBC: 26 Dead - 18 children, 8 adults.

270 SidewaysQuark  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:28:43am

Every so often a news story comes up so disgusting it leaves me speechless.

271 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:28:47am

re: #261 ProMayaLiberal

Never mind, figured it out.

I want to control who has the guns. The mentally ill and criminals should be banned from having guns. And there should be better training and teaching to have them in the first place.

272 brennant  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:29:00am

re: #262 NJDhockeyfan

I wish you guys would stop posting Bryan Fischer tweets. I can't stomach the hate along with following the shooting.

That guy is such a dirt bag.

273 Alexzander  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:29:00am

re: #264 Dr Lizardo

A whole lot of people believe in it. I have a friend up in Washington state who believes in it wholeheartedly. To the extent that if she's still alive come 12/22, she's gonna off herself. She's planned her whole life around the apocalypse coming on 12/21.

Woah.
I worked in a new age bookstore when the 2012 meme really took off (in part due to Daniel Pinchbeck's book) but I don't think I ever met someone who took it that seriously. Even Pinchbeck says 'it is what we make it' aka it will be like any other day, save for winter solstice.

274 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:30:05am

re: #270 SidewaysQuark

Every so often a news story comes up so disgusting it leaves me speechless.

Yeah, this is one of those.

I can't wrap my head around this at all. WTF. It just makes no sense. :(

275 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:30:07am

re: #272 brennant

That guy is such a dirt bag.

We all know that.

276 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:30:14am

re: #272 brennant

That guy is such a dirt bag.

Hey now. That's disrespectful to bags of dirt everywhere.

277 Dr. Matt  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:30:28am

re: #269 RadicalModerate

ABC and NBC News have finally broken into regular programming and are reporting live - almost 45 minutes after CBS.

MSNBC: 26 Dead - 18 children, 8 adults.

The number of dead could (and will likely) exceed 30 depending nature of the injuries of those still alive.

278 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:30:55am

re: #272 brennant

That guy is such a dirt bag.

Except that bags of dirt are often useful. Bryan Fischer? Not so much.

279 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:31:38am

re: #264 Dr Lizardo

If a evil lunatic gets it into his mind that their won't be consequences, then we have a problem. My logic is that there are a number of loons out there who may go nuts in the next few days.

280 lawhawk  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:31:39am

Gunman had connections with the school, and with NJ. NJ State Troopers are currently searching a NJ location. A .223 rifle was also apparently secured at the school. 2d person in custody, not yet determined whether that person is involved in the shooting.

Sheesh.

281 Randall Gross  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:31:51am

re: #268 Charles Johnson

Did they say "shooter" or "person?" -- reason I ask is that if they found someone on school grounds who forgot to sign in or something they would be in custody right now.

282 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:32:02am

the BF tweets are symptomatic of what happens in a case like this: the gun advocates are going to feel insecure and feel the need to get pre-emptive and proactive, since they fear an assault on their assault weapons coming up.

And the fact that Obama has done nothing to restrict or limit gun access or ownership is not going to calm them down, either.

283 Feline Fearless Leader  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:32:15am

re: #261 ProMayaLiberal

I can do that. How do I change the Alt-Name?

Up in your profile settings.

285 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:32:38am

re: #276 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

Hey now. That's disrespectful to bags of dirt everywhere.

Exactly. So let's not talk about him for a while. His hate is just everyone here feel worse.

286 Dr Lizardo  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:32:46am

re: #273 Alexzander

In regards to my friend, all I can hope is that she climbs-down. I've told her parents and siblings about it, but they really don't seem to give a shit.

287 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:32:52am

re: #284 Charles Johnson

A horrible, horrible photo. (Not gruesome, heartbreaking.)

Something no one let alone a child should have to go through.

288 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:32:55am

re: #284 Charles Johnson

A horrible, horrible photo. (Not gruesome, heartbreaking.)

That's going to be one of the most influential photos of 2012.

289 Petero1818  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:33:08am

re: #284 Charles Johnson

Unfortunately I suspect the photos will get harder and harder to look at.

290 Interesting Times  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:33:10am

re: #278 Lidane

Except that bags of dirt are often useful. Bryan Fischer? Not so much.

Then I'll just describe him as a rusted, leaking barrel of toxic filth.

291 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:33:36am

re: #290 Interesting Times

Then I'll just describe him as a rusted, leaking barrel of toxic filth.

Now we're getting somewhere.

292 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:33:55am

This might explain how the shooter was able to get into the school.

293 RadicalModerate  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:34:53am

re: #280 lawhawk

Gunman had connections with the school, and with NJ. NJ State Troopers are currently searching a NJ location. A .223 rifle was also apparently secured at the school. 2d person in custody, not yet determined whether that person is involved in the shooting.

Sheesh.

Multiple news organizations are reporting that the second person has been formally arrested, but no info on charges as of yet.

294 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:35:03am

Tears...

295 Alexzander  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:35:21am

Guy on FOX just blamed reality TV, facebook and video games for dehumanizing the American populous...

296 makeitstop  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:35:42am

Dear God. This is horrible. Those little kids... they did nothing to deserve this.

I am gutted.

297 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:36:06am

re: #295 Alexzander

Guy on FOX just blamed reality TV, facebook and video games for dehumanizing the American populous...

So stupid to do that because there are millions of Americans who do those things and don't shoot people.

298 Major Tom  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:36:30am

...

299 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:36:31am

re: #295 Alexzander

Guy on FOX just blamed reality TV, facebook and video games for dehumanizing the American populous...

It's all about defending the gun culture, at this point. As long as we don't blame guns, it's all good. *spit*

300 Dr. Matt  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:36:52am

re: #284 Charles

A horrible, horrible photo. (Not gruesome, heartbreaking.)

HuffPo Shooting Pic

Huffpo has blurred out the faces of the children in that pic.

301 calochortus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:37:24am

Because we are unlikely to get people to agree on gun policy, how about we work on developing a "mass shooters are pathetic weaklings" meme?
Anyone, including me, could go shoot a bunch of unarmed people. Using a gun like that doesn't make you a special, powerful person-it is in many ways an admission that you aren't strong enough to cope without using a weapon as a crutch.

302 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:37:42am

Bryan Fischer wants schools to look more like this?

Hi, I'm Mr. Foxtrot and I'll be your substitute teacher today. Mrs. Delta had an accidental discharge last night and may be out for awhile, don't worry though students, I'm sure she will be fine.

"God I hate lunchroom monitor duty, and why do I always have to be the one on point going in?"

/ not really

303 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:37:43am

re: #299 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

It's all about defending the gun culture, at this point. As long as we don't blame guns, it's all good. *spit*

Like I said, the pro-gun folks are feeling a bit insecure and have to get pre-emptive and proactive about it, deflect and distrct from what every normal person sees as a root cause...

304 Interesting Times  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:37:55am

re: #284 Charles Johnson

A horrible, horrible photo. (Not gruesome, heartbreaking.)

This one may be even worse. I can't even begin to imagine what's going through their minds.

305 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:38:04am

re: #299 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

It's all about defending the gun culture, at this point. As long as we don't blame guns, it's all good. *spit*

Yeah, we can't criticize the gun culture but we'll blame Facebook. Unreal.

306 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:38:07am

re: #295 Alexzander

Guy on FOX just blamed reality TV, facebook and video games for dehumanizing the American populous...

That's not really it, but I can see where he gets the idea. And I'm not gonna hate on someone saying that, because at least they're looking at things that are genuinely problematic and not simply slinging shit like Bryan Fischer.

307 calochortus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:38:23am

re: #295 Alexzander

Guy on FOX just blamed reality TV, facebook and video games for dehumanizing the American populous...

And Fox's contribution was discussed? No? Why am I not surprised?

308 Killgore Trout  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:38:29am

re: #183 Locker

ABC says TWO gunmen:

[Link: abcnews.go.com...]

Hmmm, That's very odd. Usually reports of multiple shooters end up being false. One person losing their mind and doing a random shooting isn't that uncommon. The chances of two people doing this stuff is very unusual. It indicates some sort of shared motive.

309 Locker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:38:31am

I can't do this...

I can not sit here on the internet compulsively clicking refresh looking for news and thinking about how terrible this is and how it will change nothing.

I'm going to shut this computer off. I'm going to take a shower. I'm going to take my dogs for a walk. I'm going to make some lunch.

This could happen to me, you any of us at any time. I will use today to practice being right in my moment, not missing anything, not expecting anything, not thinking... just being.

Peace.

310 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:38:58am

re: #300 Dr. Matt

HuffPo Shooting Pic

Huffpo has blurred out the faces of the children in that pic.

That's a defensible action by a news site in a circumstance like this.

311 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:39:27am

re: #303 Sol Berdinowitz

Like I said, the pro-gun folks are feeling a bit insecure and have to get pre-emptive and proactive about it, deflect and distrct from what every normal person sees as a root cause...

And I just know that when I get home to fish country for Christmas, my father is going to go off on a pro-gun rant tying back to this whole event, and I am going to have to sit on my hands so as not to slug him right in his face. Because I love him and I tolerate him, but he is wrong. Horribly, horribly wrong. And I'm sorry.

312 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:39:56am

re: #309 Locker

I can't do this...

I can not sit here on the internet compulsively clicking refresh looking for news and thinking about how terrible this is and how it will change nothing.

I'm going to shut this computer off. I'm going to take a shower. I'm going to take my dogs for a walk. I'm going to make some lunch.

This could happen to me, you any of us at any time. I will use today to practice being right in my moment, not missing anything, not expecting anything, not thinking... just being.

Peace.

Peace.

313 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:40:05am

re: #301 calochortus

Because we are unlikely to get people to agree on gun policy, how about we work on developing a "mass shooters are pathetic weaklings" meme?
Anyone, including me, could go shoot a bunch of unarmed people. Using a gun like that doesn't make you a special, powerful person-it is in many ways an admission that you aren't strong enough to cope without using a weapon as a crutch.

I can agree with that.

314 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:40:08am

re: #299 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

It's all about defending the gun culture, at this point. As long as we don't blame guns, it's all good. *spit*

Exactly. Any excuse at all to avoid looking at our gun culture.

WTF.

315 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:40:09am

Plenty of fail over at the TCOT tag, as usual:

316 Ian G.  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:40:19am

You know, the Swiss have a heavily-armed population too, in fact it's probably just like the "well-regulated militia" that Jefferson envisioned. Yet they don't have these mass shootings happen every week. Sorry to sound like a cranky old conservative (which I'm obviously not), but I sometimes think there's something uniquely fucked up about our culture.

317 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:41:01am

re: #315 dragonfire1981

Plenty of fail over at the TCOT tag, as usual:

[Embedded content]

Idiots. More guns isn't the solution at all.

318 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:41:03am

re: #315 dragonfire1981

Because more guns = less gun violence.

WTF.

319 Ghost of Tom Joad  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:41:17am

re: #301 calochortus

Because we are unlikely to get people to agree on gun policy, how about we work on developing a "mass shooters are pathetic weaklings" meme?
Anyone, including me, could go shoot a bunch of unarmed people. Using a gun like that doesn't make you a special, powerful person-it is in many ways an admission that you aren't strong enough to cope without using a weapon as a crutch.

I don't think it's about power, in that sense, when these mass shootings happen. I think it's more along the lines of the endpoint of depression where a person has absolutely no ability to cope with their own demons, and decides that if they can't be happy, then nobody else deserves to be. Weapons just give these people a much more efficient tool to carry out their plans to, in a sense, take as many people with them as possible.

Just my .02$ anyway.

321 Political Atheist  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:41:48am

re: #295 Alexzander

It's way too soon. Time to get everyone safe, get the killer or killers in custody and then try to learn. Then, with luck and good people we know enough to advocate for this or that.

Right now it is all about the kids & other victims. Nothing else IMO.

322 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:41:54am

re: #310 Dark_Falcon

The right thing to do. Good on Huffpo for having the presence of mind on this.

All news organizations should be doing this.

323 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:42:02am

re: #316 Ian G.

You know, the Swiss have a heavily-armed population too, in fact it's probably just like the "well-regulated militia" that Jefferson envisioned. Yet they don't have these mass shootings happen every week. Sorry to sound like a cranky old conservative (which I'm obviously not), but I sometimes think there's something uniquely fucked up about our culture.

Doesn't help that we have politicians that pose with guns like they're fucking toys. I respect gun ownership. Really, I do and I understand why people own guns but gun fetishization is a problem in our society.

324 RadicalModerate  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:42:07am

State police briefing starting now.

325 Randall Gross  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:43:10am

I can't stand this, my heart is hurting -physically. So I'm checking out a while to call the kids and play with the dog.

326 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:43:30am

re: #317 HappyWarrior

Idiots. More guns isn't the solution at all.

Because having multiple shooters with kids in the crossfire would keep everyone safer.
/

327 Dr. Matt  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:43:35am

Rawstory has streaming video of the presser

328 sattv4u2  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:44:03am

Everyone ,, right now. Hug your child! If you don't have yours near you (or you don't have any) ask permission to hug someone else's child. A friend, a relative, a neighbor. it will do both you and the child good!! (fyi,,, just went into my 18 y/o sons room and hugged him)

329 Gus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:44:05am

bbl

330 Sol Berdinowitz  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:44:09am

re: #315 dragonfire1981

Plenty of fail over at the TCOT tag, as usual:

[Embedded content]

This is just the sort of pre-emptive, deflective ranting you are going to see a lot of. It is not about "political gain" it is about reducing the number of children who are killed by guns in this country.

We can do that without impinging on anyone's constitutional rights.

331 Dr Lizardo  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:44:21am

re: #316 Ian G.

You know, the Swiss have a heavily-armed population too, in fact it's probably just like the "well-regulated militia" that Jefferson envisioned. Yet they don't have these mass shootings happen every week. Sorry to sound like a cranky old conservative (which I'm obviously not), but I sometimes think there's something uniquely fucked up about our culture.

Here in the Czech Republic, a lot of folks have firearms. We also don't have weekly mass shootings.

It's something in the culture. Czechs get pissed off like everyone else on that planet, but they'd be far more likely to punch you in the face as opposed to shooting you. And that's even with people who do have concealed-carry licenses here.

332 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:44:21am

re: #326 Kragar

Because having multiple shooters with kids in the crossfire would keep everyone safer.
/

That's the problem with that kind of logic. I think I read that there was someone with a CC carry in the Aurora shooting who nearly got shot themselves because the cops thought he was the shooter.

333 Feline Fearless Leader  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:44:31am

Work here on Friday afternoon is at a bit of a standstill. This event has a bunch of people talking about shootings, gun safety, etc. The one contractor who has four kindergarten (or so) aged children is essentially just *angry* if anything. Another knot of people are in the lunchroom since CNN is on there - no idea what they're discussing.

334 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:44:38am

re: #325 Randall Gross

I can't stand this, my heart is hurting -physically. So I'm checking out a while to call the kids and play with the dog.

Take care of yourself.

335 CuriousLurker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:45:53am

FUCK. 26 killed--18 kids, 20 8 adults as per NBC.

336 S'latch  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:45:57am

As a father of a seven-year-old, I am thinking about the parents and families of these children, and I am crying. I sometimes wonder if I made a wise choice in bringing a child into this world. I owe that child everything, and more.

337 calochortus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:46:35am

re: #319 Ghost of Tom Joad

I don't think it's about power, in that sense, when these mass shootings happen. I think it's more along the lines of the endpoint of depression where a person has absolutely no ability to cope with their own demons, and decides that if they can't be happy, then nobody else deserves to be. Weapons just give these people a much more efficient tool to carry out their plans to, in a sense, take as many people with them as possible.

Just my .02$ anyway.

But why would you want to take people with you if you are depressed, unless you want to go out in a 'blaze of glory'? I suggest this isn't a blaze of glory, it's a blaze of utter fail.

338 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:46:40am

re: #316 Ian G.

You know, the Swiss have a heavily-armed population too, in fact it's probably just like the "well-regulated militia" that Jefferson envisioned. Yet they don't have these mass shootings happen every week. Sorry to sound like a cranky old conservative (which I'm obviously not), but I sometimes think there's something uniquely fucked up about our culture.

The difference there:

Rules regarding firearms in Switzerland differ markedly from those in other European countries. Under Swiss law, all adult males who have received training in the Swiss armed forces are reservists who are required under law to keep their official firearms at home. According to the gun law of 1999 (larm99), automatic weapons like the Swiss army assault rifle have to be stocked separately of the bolt, which has to be in a locked place.

Slight difference from every yahoo who is upright with a pulse being able to buy as many guns as he wants.

339 prairiefire  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:47:08am

When are the American people going to stop accepting this?

340 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:47:11am

re: #319 Ghost of Tom Joad

I don't think it's about power, in that sense, when these mass shootings happen. I think it's more along the lines of the endpoint of depression where a person has absolutely no ability to cope with their own demons, and decides that if they can't be happy, then nobody else deserves to be. Weapons just give these people a much more efficient tool to carry out their plans to, in a sense, take as many people with them as possible.

Just my .02$ anyway.

I think it can also be a societal anger thing. Anger at schools for not properly teaching kids, anger at corporations for not giving a shit about employees and communities, anger at government for being inefffective and no longer "for the people" and the sense that the wealthy and elite will always stack the deck against "the little people".

In a nutshell: Frustration at how unfair things often are.

341 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:47:13am

re: #335 CuriousLurker

FUCK. 26 killed--18 kids, 20 adults as per NBC.

Doesn't add up.

342 Joanne  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:47:18am

re: #241 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

This cruel & hateful fuckball really believes he's all kind & loving & shit. What a delusional turd.

[Embedded content]

343 blueraven  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:47:25am

This school is Kindergarten - 4th grade. Kindergarten!!

What is it going to take? Can we talk about guns now?

Once, when my children were in elementary school, there was a gunman spotted in the woods around the local high-school, not far from the elementary. I got the word from a friend. This was just after Columbine. I drove so fast to the school just a couple of miles away, but it seemed to take forever. My heart was in the pits of my belly and I was praying as hard as I could.

When I got there, the school was supposedly on lockdown, but I opened and entered through the back door. After retrieving my kids and seeing there was nothing going on at the school, I went to the office and let them have it. How the hell did I just walk in the back door?

I just cant imagine this thing in Connecticut...it is beyond anything that should be happening in this country. Those poor kids, those poor parents. Oh my God.

344 CuriousLurker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:47:30am

re: #335 CuriousLurker

FUCK. 26 killed--18 kids, 20 adults as per NBC.

Sorry, I meant 8 adults.

345 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:47:31am

re: #335 CuriousLurker

FUCK. 26 killed--18 kids, 20 adults as per NBC.

Math doesn't add up?

346 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:47:43am

Could there possibly be a few more people involved?

347 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:47:53am

re: #344 CuriousLurker

Sorry, I meant 8 adults.

Ahhh, got it.

348 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:48:22am

re: #311 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

And I just know that when I get home to fish country for Christmas, my father is going to go off on a pro-gun rant tying back to this whole event, and I am going to have to sit on my hands so as not to slug him right in his face. Because I love him and I tolerate him, but he is wrong. Horribly, horribly wrong. And I'm sorry.

Tell him this: "Whatever else is true, grade school age children shouldn't be armed. Adult are supposed to protect them, and in this case an adult (two adults) decided to murder them instead. More access to guns would not have likely made a difference here. Teachers should not have to carry guns to school to protect their students from a nutcase. So drop the gun talk. This isn't principally about gun control, this is about nutcase control."

349 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:48:45am

re: #342 Joanne

[Embedded content]

That's NOT the kind of persecution Christ was talking about Mr. Fisher.

350 danarchy  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:49:04am

re: #341 b_sharp

Doesn't add up.

8 adults and no mention if that includes the shooter or not.

351 Feline Fearless Leader  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:49:09am

re: #337 calochortus

But why would you want to take people with you if you are depressed, unless you want to go out in a 'blaze of glory'? I suggest this isn't a blaze of glory, it's a blaze of utter fail.

I suspect it's depression and fear that channels over into anger.

352 prairiefire  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:49:11am

my hearts is breaking, God bless those people

353 CuriousLurker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:49:36am

re: #345 dragonfire1981

Math doesn't add up?

Yeah, I just corrected it. It was 8 adults.

18 CHILDREN.

I'm out. Later.

354 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:49:47am

re: #331 Dr Lizardo

I think it is a fine time for a study as the reason why there is such a heavy difference between the Czech Republic and the US. Include Scandinavia on this. They tend to be more friendly to guns than much of Europe as well.

355 Ghost of Tom Joad  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:49:58am

re: #331 Dr Lizardo

Here in the Czech Republic, a lot of folks have firearms. We also don't have weekly mass shootings.

It's something in the culture. Czechs get pissed off like everyone else on that planet, but they'd be far more likely to punch you in the face as opposed to shooting you. And that's even with people who do have concealed-carry licenses here.

It's, as many things are, a conglomeration of different problems. A culture the fetishizes weaponry to the point that it's ridiculously easy to attain, where violence is seemingly the cure to all ills (government-sanctioned killing, wars etc. don't help any), to a lack of mental-health care and understanding, to the slow, trudging decline of standards of living. I'm sure there's more, but it all contributes in some way.

356 Polito  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:50:07am

Where was God when this happened? Why didn't He intervene?

357 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:50:22am

re: #342 Joanne

[Embedded content]

Can we please not repost that hateful hack any more today? His words just make me want to put my fist through the screen.

358 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:50:23am

re: #339 prairiefire

When are the American people going to stop accepting this?

When you pry the guns from our cold, dead hands.

--The NRA

359 Dr. Matt  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:50:28am

Laura Ingraham and the Foxtards owe Bob Costas an apology.

360 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:50:41am

re: #338 Kragar

The difference there:

Slight difference from every yahoo who is upright with a pulse being able to buy as many guns as he wants.

There is still a very strong shooting culture there where people take other firearms they own, just not their military firearms.

Finland also has a large shooting culture and Norway has a large (for Europe) hunting poplulation.

It is more than just guns that is wrong with America.

361 sattv4u2  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:51:01am

re: #356 Polito

one comment
one downding

Keep going!

362 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:51:20am

I have twin 10 year old girls.

363 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:51:21am

The shooter is confirmed as one of the dead.

364 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:51:43am

Friend of mine just tweeted: "This is what happens when Liberals get out of control."

365 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:51:57am

re: #356 Polito

THAT's your first comment?! You're seriously starting off here on the wrong foot, buddy.

366 Feline Fearless Leader  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:51:58am

re: #356 Polito

Where was God when this happened? Why didn't He intervene?

The atheists scared him off with their aura of disbelief.
/

367 sattv4u2  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:52:17am

re: #356 Polito

hey

JOE 90

Please comment so I can downding you too for updinging #356

368 aagcobb  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:52:30am

re: #316 Ian G.

You know, the Swiss have a heavily-armed population too, in fact it's probably just like the "well-regulated militia" that Jefferson envisioned. Yet they don't have these mass shootings happen every week. Sorry to sound like a cranky old conservative (which I'm obviously not), but I sometimes think there's something uniquely fucked up about our culture.

Switzerland is a small country, so there are a lot fewer mentally ill people, and its also a very wealthy country that already has mandatory health insurance, so mental health care is probably a lot more accessible.

p.s. Switzerland did have a mass shooting in 2001; 14 dead.

369 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:52:43am

re: #364 dragonfire1981

Friend of mine just tweeted: "This is what happens when Liberals get out of control."

Unfriend him, both on Twitter and in real life.

370 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:52:56am

re: #360 William Barnett-Lewis

There is still a very strong shooting culture there where people take other firearms they own, just not their military firearms.

Finland also has a large shooting culture and Norway has a large (for Europe) hunting poplulation.

It is more than just guns that is wrong with America.

Here in the Canadian West just about everybody own rifles. We have few gun incidents.

371 William of Orange  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:53:15am

Anybody asked for Bob Costas' opinion?

372 Ghost of Tom Joad  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:53:23am

re: #346 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Could there possibly be a few more people involved?

I hope not, but I'm sure they're being overly cautious at this point. Get a list of all known friends/family and round them up before things get out of hand.

I hope it's just caution.

373 CuriousLurker  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:53:25am

re: #356 Polito

Where was God when this happened? Why didn't He intervene?

Really? You're gonna use this tragedy for some kind of fucking personal rant about religion??

374 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:53:30am

I agree with this girl.

375 b_sharp  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:53:50am

re: #356 Polito

Where was God when this happened? Why didn't He intervene?

Not the time to bring religion into it.

376 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:53:59am

re: #364 dragonfire1981

Friend of mine just tweeted: "This is what happens when Liberals get out of control."

Your "friend" is a bastard.

377 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:54:17am

Guys, do not feed the troll. Now more than ever is a perfect time to GAZE. Also, the downdinger and the report button are very handy.

378 Killgore Trout  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:54:30am

[Link: abcnews.go.com...]

1:17 p.m: One shooter is described as 24-years-old, armed with four weapons and wearing a bullet-proof vest, sources tell ABC News.

379 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:55:33am

OT, but interesting story

Principal orders male students to hold hands, endure gay slurs as punishment
(Photo at link)

Two Arizona high school students who were caught fighting faced a controversial punishment concocted by their principal: Either endure a suspension, or sit in the school courtyard holding hands while other students shout and throw homophobic slurs at you.

The message here seems to be that there’s nothing more horrific than being perceived as gay.

Student Brittney Smyers told ABC 15, "Kids were laughing at them and calling them names, asking, 'Are you gay?' ”

Pictures of the boys holding hands surfaced online with some singing the principal’s praises, while others denounced his tactics as shortsighted and discriminatory.

Tim Richard is Westwood High School’s first-year principal, described by colleagues as a “dynamo” who was brought in to reinvigorate the school’s reputation, starting with its academic standing.

380 Ghost of Tom Joad  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:55:39am

re: #364 dragonfire1981

Friend of mine just tweeted: "This is what happens when Liberals get out of control."

And you call them a "friend?"

The fuck??

381 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:55:53am

re: #378 Killgore Trout

[Link: abcnews.go.com...]

1:17 p.m: One shooter is described as 24-years-old, armed with four weapons and wearing a bullet-proof vest, sources tell ABC News.

The reports are also a 20 year old with 2 weapons. Which is it or are there 2 shooters?

382 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:55:56am

re: #376 Kragar

Your "friend" is a bastard.

Indeed.

Want to bring up gun control when something like this happens? OK, though I'm not likely to agree with your proposals.

Want to demean religion at a time like this? You're being a shithead.

383 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:56:45am

Dear God.

Dear, dear God.

Do we have any information on who the shooter(s) were, what their motives were or anything like that?

And why? Even from the standpoint of psycho wanting to take others with him, this is not "normal." I mean targeting kids at an elementary school? Why?

And finally, is it time yet to talk about the fact that the 2nd amendment is about a well organized militia?

384 calochortus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:56:49am

re: #351 Feline Fearless Leader

I suspect it's depression and fear that channels over into anger.

Anger certainly-and angry people presumably prefer to have power over others, to let the world see who they are. That "who" is not usually a pathetic loser.

However, what do I know? I'm the sort of person who occasionally is angry enough to punch the wall but never do because I know I'd have to fix the hole after my broken hand healed. The consequences tend to interfere with expression...

385 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:56:55am

re: #380 Ghost of Tom Joad

And you call them a "friend?"

The fuck??

That person might well have been a friend till now. I've had people I thought were friends who turned out to be rotters.

386 kirkspencer  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:56:58am

re: #379 dragonfire1981

OT, but interesting story

Principal orders male students to hold hands, endure gay slurs as punishment b
(Photo at link)

Stupid, stupid punishment. Does nothing but build a ton of resentment against the other person, the principal, and the other students.

387 Killgore Trout  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:57:17am

re: #381 NJDhockeyfan

The reports are also a 20 year old with 2 weapons. Which is it or are there 2 shooters?

Early reports are always fuzzy. Anything's possible but I'm still leaning towards one shooter.

388 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:57:35am

re: #380 Ghost of Tom Joad

And you call them a "friend?"

The fuck??

Hey, I have both moonbat and wingnut friends. We don't agree with everything but they are still my friends.

389 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:57:38am

re: #358 Lidane

I am waiting for some wag to say that if the 10 year olds had guns this wouldn't have happened.

390 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:57:55am

re: #383 Mad Prophet Ludwig

Dear God.

Dear, dear God.

Do we have any information on who the shooter(s) were, what their motives were or anything like that?

And why? Even from the standpoint of psycho wanting to take others with him, this is not "normal." I mean targeting kids at an elementary school? Why?

And finally, is it time yet to talk about the fact that the 2nd amendment is about a well organized militia?

Just their age which I've seen reported 20 and 24 years old and that they had ties to the school though what those ties are has been unspecified at the moment.

391 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:58:20am

re: #380 Ghost of Tom Joad

And you call them a "friend?"

The fuck??

Maybe friend was too strong a word. He's more like a (now former) acquaintance.

392 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:58:28am

re: #386 kirkspencer

Stupid, stupid punishment. Does nothing but build a ton of resentment against the other person, the principle, and the other students.

Which, I wouldn't be surprised to find such underlying resentment being the driving force behind today's disaster. I know there were people in my school that everyone was afraid to make angry because we were afraid they'd come back and shoot up the place, Eric and Dylan-style.

393 Joanne  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:58:56am

re: #342 Joanne

Let's try this again:

395 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:59:14am

NBC: Obama Expected To Make Statement On CT Shooting ‘Shortly’

396 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:59:19am

re: #356 Polito

Congratulations on having one of the worst first posts ever, and being a smug jackalope.

Nevermind humans are self-aware and that humans can act against what God has stated in the Quran, Bible, Torah, and other Holy Books of other faiths.

No, you seem to be getting off on being snide while the rest of us are horrified, and somehow putting yourself on a pedestal for being more "rational."

397 Dr Lizardo  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:59:23am

re: #355 Ghost of Tom Joad

It's all about a willingness (or lack thereof) to utilize lethal force to deal with problems or issues. I remember hearing on the radio, in around 91 or 92, a sarcastic commercial for a long-forgotten product or service, but the ad copy said, and I'll never forget this, "It's the 90s answer to everything! If someone ticks you off, blow 'em away!"

It stuck with me for all the years. In retrospect, it was prophetic.

398 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 10:59:59am

re: #392 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

Which, I wouldn't be surprised to find such underlying resentment being the driving force behind today's disaster. I know there were people in my school that everyone was afraid to make angry because we were afraid they'd come back and shoot up the place, Eric and Dylan-style.

Explain to me how a bullied 24 year old thinks its a good idea to go into a classroom and kill KINDERGARTNERS??

If they were high school students, that might be plausible but why does a 5 year old need to pay the price because some young guy got bullied?

399 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:00:11am

re: #390 HappyWarrior

Just their age which I've seen reported 20 and 24 years old and that they had ties to the school though what those ties are has been unspecified at the moment.

20 somethings are unlikely to be old enough to have kids in that school. It is possible, but barely.

Could this be two fired losers?

400 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:00:17am

More Bryan Fischer? I think I'll go try to do some work. Have a good weekend, if that's possible.

401 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:00:22am

re: #395 Kragar

NBC: Obama Expected To Make Statement On CT Shooting ‘Shortly’

Wingnuts expected to blow their top over said statement moments after that.

402 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:14am

re: #401 dragonfire1981

Wingnuts expected to blow their top over said statement moments after that.

"HE'S GOING TO COME FOR OUR GUNS!"

Just like he did after the last dozen or so mass shootings.
/

403 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:19am

re: #400 NJDhockeyfan

More Bryan Fischer? I think I'll go try to do some work. Have a good weekend, if that's possible.

The man tweets a LOT. Seriously, does he have THAT much spare time on his hands?

404 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:21am

re: #399 Mad Prophet Ludwig

20 somethings are unlikely to be old enough to have kids in that school. It is possible, but barely.

Could this be two fired losers?

Definitely a possibility.

405 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:25am

re: #398 dragonfire1981

Explain to me how a bullied 24 year old thinks its a good idea to go into a classroom and kill KINDERGARTNERS??

If they were high school students, that might be plausible but why does a 5 year old need to pay the price because some young guy got bullied?

If I knew the answer to that, I'd be the world's greatest psychiatrist. I swear, there are so many things that are beyond my ability to comprehend. Even on my WORST day (and I had some very bad days in school, being a geek), I never would've even dreamed of pulling a trigger on someone, or even of bringing a gun "just to scare people". Not even on my radar screen.

406 aagcobb  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:25am

re: #379 dragonfire1981

OT, but interesting story

Principal orders male students to hold hands, endure gay slurs as punishment
(Photo at link)

If this story is true, this principal should be fired. he is both a homophobe and a child abuser.

407 Dr. Matt  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:28am

re: #401 dragonfire1981

Wingnuts expected to blow their top over said statement moments after that.

Hell, they already are preemptively outraged.

408 Interesting Times  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:38am

re: #397 Dr Lizardo

It's all about a willingness (or lack thereof) to utilize lethal force to deal with problems or issues. I remember hearing on the radio, in around 91 or 92, a sarcastic commercial for a long-forgotten product or service, but the ad copy said, and I'll never forget this, "It's the 90s answer to everything! If someone ticks you off, blow 'em away!"

It stuck with me for all the years. In retrospect, it was prophetic.

On this very page someone linked to above, I see, in the sidebar, a link to the following:

FL police: Man shot roommate over how to make pork chops

HEAD.DESK.

409 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:40am

re: #396 ProMayaLiberal

Congratulations on having one of the worst first posts ever, and being a smug jackalope.

Nevermind humans are self-aware and that humans can act against what God has stated in the Quran, Bible, Torah, and other Holy Books of other faiths.

No, you seem to be getting off on being snide while the rest of us are horrified, and somehow putting yourself on a pedestal for being more "rational."

Give him a second to follow up.

You may be entirely correct in your assessment.

Or it could be the very natural human urge to wonder why God doesn't stop these things more.

410 Joanne  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:43am

re: #357 Dark_Falcon

Can we please not repost that hateful hack any more today? His words just make me want to put my fist through the screen.

I was trying to post my response to him, which I finally managed to get right in 393.

I am so used to being on my iPhone and my Tweets app, I don't know how to use Twitter on a computer. It's so much easier in my app. Sorry!!

411 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:44am

re: #403 dragonfire1981

The man tweets a LOT. Seriously, does he have THAT much spare time on his hands?

His modem is too slow to download good porn?

412 sattv4u2  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:01:54am

re: #390 HappyWarrior

Just their age which I've seen reported 20 and 24 years old and that they had ties to the school though what those ties are has been unspecified at the moment.


CBS News’ John Miller reports there is preliminary information that the gunman was the father of one of the students. Miller additionally reports the gunman is 20 years old and is from New Jersey
.
[Link: connecticut.cbslocal.com...]

413 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:02:15am
414 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:02:45am

re: #412 sattv4u2


CBS News’ John Miller reports there is preliminary information that the gunman was the father of one of the students. Miller additionally reports the gunman is 20 years old and is from New Jersey
.
[Link: connecticut.cbslocal.com...]

20 and a father of one of the students. Didn't see that. Not that it's biologically impossible.

415 wrenchwench  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:02:52am

re: #394 NJDhockeyfan

White House: “Today Is Not The Day” To Debate Gun Control

White House doesn't always get what it wants.

416 Joanne  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:02:52am

re: #364 dragonfire1981

Friend of mine just tweeted: "This is what happens when Liberals get out of control."

Nice friends you have there. ;)

417 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:02:55am

re: #403 dragonfire1981

The man tweets a LOT. Seriously, does he have THAT much spare time on his hands?

Sure. It's not like he's actually ministering to anyone.

418 dragonfire1981  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:03:07am

re: #405 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

If I knew the answer to that, I'd be the world's greatest psychiatrist. I swear, there are so many things that are beyond my ability to comprehend. Even on my WORST day (and I had some very bad days in school, being a geek), I never would've even dreamed of pulling a trigger on someone, or even of bringing a gun "just to scare people". Not even on my radar screen.

I will admit, I did think about violence, but against the kids who were hurting me, NOT first graders or adults or anyone else.

419 Ghost of Tom Joad  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:03:11am

re: #405 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

If I knew the answer to that, I'd be the world's greatest psychiatrist. I swear, there are so many things that are beyond my ability to comprehend. Even on my WORST day (and I had some very bad days in school, being a geek), I never would've even dreamed of pulling a trigger on someone, or even of bringing a gun "just to scare people". Not even on my radar screen.

It's not the root cause, but as with many mentally unhinged people, all it takes is one small 'push' to drive them over the edge. What may seem innocuous to most can set others off into a furious rage.

420 HappyWarrior  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:03:31am

re: #413 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Feeling a little like the case of the gunman in the U-Texas tower then. That guy as I recall killed his mother and his wife and then went on a spree.

421 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:04:06am

re: #401 dragonfire1981

Wingnuts expected to blow their top over said statement moments after that.

Yeah fuck those wingnuts. They don't have a single idea that isn't destructive.

How about a policy where getting a gun is just like getting a drivers license, only serious - with a real background check. You and your gun are linked by a photo ID and you have to take actual gun safety classes and you have to maintain insurance and registration of the weapon.

422 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:05:31am

Welcome to your Second Amendment rights. Here is your black powder muzzle loader, exactly as the Founding Fathers intended it.

423 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:05:46am

re: #409 Mad Prophet Ludwig

It isn't even a question for me. People are self-aware and act independently from God. Free will and all that.

424 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:06:00am
425 Charles Johnson  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:06:08am
426 Dr Lizardo  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:06:31am

re: #408 Interesting Times

Shooting someone over a disagreement on how to cook pork chops?

Just damn.

I take my cooking seriously, but not to the point.

427 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:06:40am

re: #420 HappyWarrior

Feeling a little like the case of the gunman in the U-Texas tower then. That guy as I recall killed his mother and his wife and then went on a spree.

428 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:06:48am

re: #423 ProMayaLiberal

It isn't even a question for me. People are self-aware and act independently from God. Free will and all that.

I agree completely, but to have come to that answer, one must have asked the question.

429 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:06:54am

re: #421 Mad Prophet Ludwig

Yeah fuck those wingnuts. They don't have a single idea that isn't destructive.

How about a policy where getting a gun is just like getting a drivers license, only serious - with a real background check. You and your gun are linked by a photo ID and you have to take actual gun safety classes and you have to maintain insurance and registration of the weapon.

I actually like this idea. I can't even bring myself to type out my usual sarcastic snarky wingnut-tagged response.

430 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:07:37am

re: #425 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

431 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:07:54am

A fair point, IMO:

432 danarchy  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:08:23am

re: #421 Mad Prophet Ludwig

Yeah fuck those wingnuts. They don't have a single idea that isn't destructive.

How about a policy where getting a gun is just like getting a drivers license, only serious - with a real background check. You and your gun are linked by a photo ID and you have to take actual gun safety classes and you have to maintain insurance and registration of the weapon.

Unless you throw in periodic psychological evaluations I don't see how any of those measures stop something like this.

433 Ghost of Tom Joad  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:08:29am

re: #421 Mad Prophet Ludwig

Problem is that cat got out of the bag years ago. There are so many unlicensed weapons out there, not to mention with enough money I'm sure some would be convinced to sell them without those pesky background checks. It'd be like trying to combat the common cold at this point.

434 Dr. Matt  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:10:04am

NBC is reporting that the parent of the shooter has been found dead.

435 funky chicken  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:10:10am

What kind of sick fuck shoots up his kid's kindegarten class?

436 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:10:24am
437 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:11:06am

re: #432 danarchy

Unless you throw in periodic psychological evaluations I don't see how any of those measures stop something like this.

Annual refresher training and requirements to participate in a government controlled program to retain ownership as part of a "well regulated Militia."

438 Dr Lizardo  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:11:33am

re: #434 Dr. Matt

NBC is reporting that the parent of the shooter has been found dead.

Starting to sound like another Charles Whitman.

439 wrenchwench  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:11:55am

re: #432 danarchy

Unless you throw in periodic psychological evaluations I don't see how any of those measures stop something like this.

It's a start. Then we can throw in periodic evaluations. All I've seen from you recently is "that won't stop all of these cases", as though only stopping some of them isn't worth the effort.

440 calochortus  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:12:03am

So I think, like various people before me, it is time to turn off the radio, get off the internet and do some small positive things in my corner of the world.

441 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:12:07am

re: #429 Douchecanoe and Ryan Too

I actually like this idea. I can't even bring myself to type out my usual sarcastic snarky wingnut-tagged response.

Thank you. I have given it a lot of thought.

On the one hand, I clearly want to prevent horror stories like this as much as possible.

On the other, I don't want to punish the large majority of weapon owners who are not criminally psychotic and use their fire-arms for legitimate purposes.

So I figure that if you don't let anyone just drive a car (and we let too many drive as it is) because it can be a dangerous machine that will get people killed if misused... then clearly you should have regulation at least as strong for dangerous machines whose sole purpose is killing.

442 ProMayaLiberal  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:12:38am

re: #437 Kragar

That is a plan I can get behind.

443 Dr. Matt  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:14:36am

If you believe in Hell, the shooter is a new resident.

444 RadicalModerate  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:15:01am

re: #401 dragonfire1981

Wingnuts expected to blow their top over said statement moments after that.

For true unhinged wingnuttiness, a quick trip to the fever swamp.

They're already claiming that it is some sort of leftist "false flag" being covered up by the feds.

Really.

To: DYngbld
.
“Alleged witness” claims over 100 shots were fired by shooter (who wore a Halloween mask)
Why would a husband or boy friend wear a Halloween mask?
Sarah Brady, Eric Holder, and Barack Obama are cheering this right now
Do not doubt that a radical anti-gun leftie would do things like this
Expect Obama to attempt to fulfill his promise to “fly under the radar” to illegally finds ways to kill the 2nd Ammendment
The most dangerous GLOCK users in NYC were in the NYPD - and they were shooting themselves in the foot because they instantly put their finger on the hinged trigger
.
111 posted on Friday, December 14, 2012 11:45:50 AM by devolve

[Link: www.freerepublic.com...]

445 Killgore Trout  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:15:09am

re: #431 Lidane

A fair point, IMO:

[Embedded content]

He's an apologist for Palestinian terrorists and a contributor to the anti-Israeli hate site Mondowiess.

446 Kragar  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:16:11am

re: #443 Dr. Matt

If you believe in Hell, the shooter is a new resident.

So are the parents of his victims.

447 Polito  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:16:17am

re: #375 b_sharp

Fair enough.

448 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:16:58am

re: #432 danarchy

First off, "stop" is never going to happen. It sadly is not a realistic goal.

However prevent more is.

The crux of what I am proposing would be not just in the registration - actual background check and photo ID, but in the fact that if you have a gun, you know that everyone knows this is *your* gun. I would also require each weapon's ballistics to be on file.

On the other side, if you have a gun that is outside of these norms, then you have just committed a crime and there will be penalties.

If you sell without doing all the paperwork, there will be penalties.

Yes I will put a crimp in the gun trade show business. Too bad.

The point is that anyone who has a gun is in trouble without the ID, and you can't get the ID without being clean.

449 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:17:45am

re: #445 Killgore Trout

So in other words, you're knee-jerking again. Good to know.

Does any of what you say somehow invalidate his point that one shoe bomber caused EVERY American to have to remove their shoes at the airport, but mass shootings like this end up going nowhere?

450 blueraven  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:18:49am

re: #432 danarchy

Unless you throw in periodic psychological evaluations I don't see how any of those measures stop something like this.

They should have to post in the local newspapers

(Name) applied for gun license (or renewal)
at least 30 days for objections before license is issued

Too many crazy people are getting guns. There has to be something, some way, to stop this madness.

451 Killgore Trout  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:19:58am

re: #449 Lidane

So in other words, you're knee-jerking again. Good to know.

Does any of what you say somehow invalidate his point that one shoe bomber caused EVERY American to have to remove their shoes at the airport, but mass shootings like this end up going nowhere?

I don't care what terrorism apologists and hate site authors think about gun control.

452 sattv4u2  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:20:16am

re: #449 Lidane

So in other words, you're knee-jerking again. Good to know.

Does any of what you say somehow invalidate his point that one shoe bomber caused EVERY American to have to remove their shoes at the airport, but mass shootings like this end up going nowhere?

"going nowhere"

We already have stacks of gun laws on the books

otoh, prior to 9/11, what safeguards did air travel have??

453 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:21:10am

re: #451 Killgore Trout

I don't know who he is and I don't give a shit about whatever site he writes for. He raises a fair point.

Deal with it.

454 Joanne  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:21:32am

re: #445 Killgore Trout

He's an apologist for Palestinian terrorists and a contributor to the anti-Israeli hate site Mondowiess.

That makes his point less valid?

455 Lidane  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:21:38am

re: #452 sattv4u2

So we didn't have a TSA or any sort of airport security before 9/11?

Wow. You learn something new every day.

456 prairiefire  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:22:20am

I think they should lock down all the schools in our district, right now. I know I'm being paranoid. I'm afraid of copy catters.

457 CarleeCork  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:27:28am

The gunman has been identified as Ryan Lanza, 20 years old.

458 sattv4u2  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:29:11am

...

459 CarleeCork  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:29:29am

They just reported that his Mother was/is a teacher at the school.

460 sattv4u2  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:30:40am

re: #455 Lidane

So we didn't have a TSA or any sort of airport security before 9/11?

Wow. You learn something new every day.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

The TSA was created as a response to the September 11, 2001, attacks.

You're welcome

461 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 11:36:11am

re: #454 Joanne

That makes his point less valid?

Would you say that if true words were spoken by Bryan Fischer?

462 Eventual Carrion  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 12:23:27pm

re: #295 Alexzander

Guy on FOX just blamed reality TV, facebook and video games for dehumanizing the American populous...

Fuck fox news

463 Destro  Fri, Dec 14, 2012 2:19:19pm

re: #462 Eventual Carrion

Fuck fox news

Ever been to Japan? Their video games don't seem to turn them into mass shooters and the Japanese don't worship the Jesus by and large either.


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 Frank says:

Star Wars won't work. Star Wars won't work. The gas still gets through; it could get right on you. And what about those germs, now? Star Wars won't work.