Suit Reveals Ties Among Radical Abortion Opponents and Imprisoned Terrorist

ReligionJanuary 2013 • Views: 29,742

A lawsuit against a Kansas woman who publicly proclaimed her admiration for the man who gunned down one of the country’s few late-term abortion providers is revealing the unwavering support a small group of radical anti-abortion activists has for the imprisoned killer despite an ongoing federal investigation into the 2009 slaying.

Though no federal indictments have been handed down by a grand jury investigating whether Dr. George Tiller’s death was connected to a broader case involving extreme anti-abortion activists, the lawsuit against Angel Dillard is one indication the Justice Department is taking a more heavy handed approach to perceived threats to abortion providers. In addition to alleging Dillard, of Valley Center, sent a threatening letter in 2011 to another Wichita doctor who was training to offer abortions, the lawsuit also highlights Dillard’s relationship with Scott Roeder, the man convicted of fatally shooting Tiller at the physician’s church.

When Roeder opened fire on Tiller, he propelled himself to icon status among abortion opponent extremists — a status that hasn’t wavered since he was sentenced to life in prison. A leader in the Army of God, which supports violence against abortion doctors, notes Roeder gets more correspondence than other imprisoned anti-abortion activists.

Hailed by militant anti-abortion forces as a “prisoner of Christ,” Roeder has been spreading his radical views from a Kansas prison. Other extremists have gravitated to Roeder, visiting him in prison, sending him money and offering legal advice, court documents show.

More: Suit Reveals Ties Among Radical Abortion Opponents

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72 comments

iceweasel Mon, Jan 28, 2013 5:23:13am

great article. Thanks for posting it.

RadicalModerate Mon, Jan 28, 2013 5:42:18am

I think that the telling part of this article is the fact that Roeder is enlisting Donald Spitz, who is effectively organizing militant supporters via literature that advocates deadly violence against people on the pro-choice side.

The Rev. Don Spitz of Virginia, who runs the Army of God website, which supports violence against abortion providers and clinics, is helping Roeder with correspondence.

Roeder likes to “debate” with people who write and often asks Spitz to mail them a militant anti-abortion book written by Paul Hill, a Florida man who was executed for murdering an abortion provider in 1994, Spitz said. Roeder also asks him to send them the book written by the Rev. Michael Bray, an Ohio activist and author of “A Time to Kill,” which defends using lethal force to protect the unborn.

There is no two ways about this. If this was a group of Muslim activists, they would be (rightly) be labeled an Islamic terror cell.

kirkspencer Mon, Jan 28, 2013 7:52:50am

I’m not alone in wondering why the abortion facility attackers aren’t called domestic terrorists.

18 USC § 2331 …
(5) the term “domestic terrorism” means activities that—
(A) involve acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State;
(B) appear to be intended—
(i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
(ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
(iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping; and
(C) occur primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the United States.

Charles Johnson Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:31:03am

I’m promoting this because it’s an important story. The anti-choice movement is quickly developing a terrorist wing, and I’m very afraid we’re going to see more violence against doctors and clinics soon.

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:31:44am

Antichoice extremists have been terrorists for years.

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:33:29am

The same people who scream Bill Ayers probably have no shame or irony when they express sympathy for Roeder or imply Tiller deserved being murdered. Anyhow, this is a great find. A very disturbing one but this is important.

lawhawk Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:36:36am

re: #3 kirkspencer

A prosecutor should be considering that in addition to the other potential charges. As you run down the various elements of the crime, these guys fit the bill:

The propaganda by the violent fringe pro-lifers (who seek to kill those who provide abortions - a legal procedure) shows a definite intent to coerce and intimidate individuals and governments into causing abortions as a procedure to be further restricted out of fear and to force its end.

darthstar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:36:38am

Fucking Roeder…can’t believe that asshole is enjoying any level of influence or prestige.

Charles Johnson Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:39:23am

re: #5 Kragar

Antichoice extremists have been terrorists for years.

True - but my point is that modern technology and the Internet are enabling these fanatics to organize and spread their hatred much more effectively than in the past.

kirkspencer Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:41:02am

re: #7 lawhawk

A prosecutor should be considering that in addition to the other potential charges. As you run down the various elements of the crime, these guys fit the bill:

The propaganda by the violent fringe pro-lifers (who seek to kill those who provide abortions - a legal procedure) shows a definite intent to coerce and intimidate individuals and governments into causing abortions as a procedure to be further restricted out of fear and to force its end.

There have been numerous opportunities. If you’re feeling like playing a bit with conspiracy theories, the guess is that it’s because of the consequences of linking the religious right and terrorism. A hint of the pain comes from when the DHS under Napolitano issued the right wing terrorism report that noted possible candidates were disaffected military veterans.

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:44:38am

re: #9 Charles Johnson

True - but my point is that modern technology and the Internet are enabling these fanatics to organize and spread their hatred much more effectively than in the past.

Which makes me wonder if the right has grown nuts or if they’ve always been nuts? I think it’s the latter frankly.

dragonfire1981 Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:45:04am

What I have always found confusing is the notion these people favor the ending of life in one instance (abortion providers) but are vehemently against it in another (the abortions themselves).

dragonfire1981 Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:46:03am

Got a new page up on the whole border fence issue

lawhawk Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:46:23am

re: #10 kirkspencer

Yeah, it’s quite possible that prosecutors aren’t going to go that route because of concerns that it might lead to further violence (which itself is a pretty damning indictment of the state of affairs re: abortion and right wing violence).

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:47:14am

re: #12 dragonfire1981

What I have always found confusing is the notion these people favor the ending of life in one instance (abortion providers) but are vehemently against it in another (the abortions themselves).

Ends justify the means. If you see a guy like Dr. Tiller as being akin to a Dr. Mengele, you will think anything even cold blooded murder is acceptable. It’s probably why they compare abortion providers and supporters of the procedure to Nazis because if you see someone on being the same level as a Nazi, you really stop seeing them as human. Or it could be plain old cognitive dissonance. Many of the people I know who acted like abortion was the worst thing ever were some of the strongest supporters of the death penalty that I ever encountered.

RadicalModerate Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:51:07am

Donald Spitz’s violent bigotry isn’t limited to being against women, either.

From the Southern Poverty Law Center:
Army of God Website Adds Racist Materials

“African-American on bike randomly shoots people,” screams one link to a legitimate news story. “83 Year old White Woman beaten to death by three African-Americans,” says another. “African-American Killed her,” a third reads under photos of the principals, “because she was White and her parents ‘didn’t allow her to have sex with a black man.’” And the list goes on:

“NAACP calls for the murder of Police Officers.”
“Black robbers mug chancellor’s [white] wife.”
“White woman carjacked, raped and executed by African-Americans.”

And a longer headline accompanied by a photograph of an attractive white woman: “White Rebekah Hanson marries African-American Kashard Brown, then White Rebekah Hanson murdered by her African-American husband Kashard Brown.”

A little further down the list, another headline is limited to a single quote: “Let’s rape these White Girls, kill them and throw ‘em off the bridge!”

These eye-catching headlines are published on the Army of God Web site that Spitz has run for years. The Army of God is a loosely connected collection of people who have carried out violent attacks on abortion clinics, doctors and other clinic workers.

Spitz is also documented as giving logistical and monetary support to other convicted domestic terrorists, namely John Salvi, Clayton Waagner, and Eric Rudolph.

b_sharp Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:53:43am

re: #16 RadicalModerate

Donald Spitz’s violent bigotry isn’t limited to being against women, either.

From the Southern Poverty Law Center:
Army of God Website Adds Racist Materials

Spitz is also documented as giving logistical and monetary support to other convicted domestic terrorists, namely John Salvi, Clayton Waagner, and Eric Rudolph.

But they are just being ‘race realists’ by cherry picking violent events without context.

Who are we to condemn them for something so obviously immoral and cheap?

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:54:58am

re: #16 RadicalModerate

Donald Spitz’s violent bigotry isn’t limited to being against women, either.

From the Southern Poverty Law Center:
Army of God Website Adds Racist Materials

Spitz is also documented as giving logistical and monetary support to other convicted domestic terrorists, namely John Salvi, Clayton Waagner, and Eric Rudolph.

Sounds like quite the fucked up character.

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:55:27am

Lets be fair. The Army of God never states which God they’re the army for.
///

Charles Johnson Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:56:29am

The bottom line: if you actually believe the propaganda being put out by the anti-choice movement, that abortion is murder on a gigantic scale, the only moral choice is to do everything in your power to stop it, including violence.

This is what the anti-choice movement is encouraging with their non-stop absolutist rhetoric. You can’t just draw a line between the extremists like Scott Roeder and the mainstream anti-choice movement. The only difference between them is that the extremists have already taken the step into violence. The ideology is identical in every way.

RadicalModerate Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:56:38am

re: #18 HappyWarrior

Sounds like quite the fucked up character.

This is very much the case. And Scott Roeder is funneling people to him to be recruited by their cause.

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 10:59:28am

The Dangers of Getting a PhD in History From David Barton University

Recently, Georgia state Senator Barry Loudermilk appeared on TBN’s “Praise the Lord” where he made the rather familiar argument that the Founding Fathers took the concepts of the separation of powers and the three branches of government directly out of the Bible.

Claiming that John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, and George Washington all directly cited the Bible as justification for these concepts, Loudermilk asserted that Jeremiah 17:9’s claim that “the heart is devious above all else” made the Founder realize the need to divide power among various branches of government, which they took directly from Isaiah 33:22’s declaration that “the Lord is our judge, the Lord is our ruler, the Lord is our king”:

RadicalModerate Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:01:04am

re: #22 Kragar

The Dangers of Getting a PhD in History From David Barton University

Please tell me that his PhD program isn’t accredited.

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:01:14am

re: #21 RadicalModerate

This is very much the case. And Scott Roeder is funneling people to him to be recruited by their cause.

This cause gets more and more dangerous and the Obama DHS directive about right wing terrorism looks more and more right on.

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:01:47am

re: #22 Kragar

The Dangers of Getting a PhD in History From David Barton University

I think I’d rather get my degree at DeVry.

allegro Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:02:06am

re: #12 dragonfire1981

What I have always found confusing is the notion these people favor the ending of life in one instance (abortion providers) but are vehemently against it in another (the abortions themselves).

You’re still buying into the myth that it’s about the baybeeeez. It isn’t and never has been. The proof is that if they gave a shit about those unborns, they would still be concerned about them after they are borns. They aren’t. Further proof is that they want to see contraception limited/banned, women’s healthcare - including prenatal care - unfunded, and much more. The pro forced birthers are the backlash to feminism and women achieving full agency.

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:02:44am

re: #23 RadicalModerate

Please tell me that his PhD program isn’t accredited.

He’s a lecturer for Glenn Beck’s university.

Ghost of Tom Joad Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:04:45am

Killing somebody because you’re pro-life. Fighting for peace. Fucking for virginity.

Lunatics. It’s amazing that the more “pro-life” these people claim to be, the less they actually give a shit about the living. Every person who claims to be “pro-life” should be required to adopt a minimum of 2 children from different racial backgrounds. before they can say anything about the subject of abortion. Period. Otherwise, find a new hobby.

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:05:04am

The antichoice movement is as much about babies as the pro gun movement is about self defense.

Bulworth Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:05:30am

made the Founder realize the need to divide power among various branches of government, which they took directly from Isaiah 33:22’s declaration that “the Lord is our judge, the Lord is our ruler, the Lord is our king”:

Which is why the founders established a king, a judge and a ruler and appointed God to all three positions. /

dragonfire1981 Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:06:02am

re: #27 Kragar

He’s a lecturer for Glenn Beck’s university.

Which by the way is NOT accredited.

dragonfire1981 Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:06:34am

re: #30 Bulworth

Which is why the founders established a king, a judge and a ruler and appointed God to all three positions. /

Hail to the King baby!

allegro Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:07:03am

re: #28 Ghost of Tom Joad

Killing somebody because you’re pro-life. Fighting for peace. Fucking for virginity.

Lunatics. It’s amazing that the more “pro-life” these people claim to be, the less they actually give a shit about the living. Every person who claims to be “pro-life” should be required to adopt a minimum of 2 children from different racial backgrounds. before they can say anything about the subject of abortion. Period. Otherwise, find a new hobby.

I would never promote such hideous child abuse by placing them in these evil fuckers homes and care.

Eventual Carrion Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:09:23am

re: #22 Kragar

The Dangers of Getting a PhD in History From David Barton University

Founder realize the need to divide power among various branches of government, which they took directly from Isaiah 33:22’s declaration that “the Lord is our judge, the Lord is our ruler, the Lord is our king”:

Sounds more like the president should be over all 3 branches from that passage (and he should have a castle).

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:09:57am

re: #34 Eventual Carrion

Sounds more like the president should be over all 3 branches from that passage (and he should have a castle).

I nominate Joe Dredd to the position.

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:10:26am

What stupid idiot Barton doesn’t know or want to actually admit to his idiot followers is that liberal laws on religious liberty are in fact good for religion. Western countries without official religions actually have lower attendance than those like ours who do not. Now part of that may be cultural but I think not forcing a religion on people gives people more freedom to choose. Of course, Barton wants the official religion to be his personal cult of Evangelicalism combined with revisionism. Great job GOP making this guy part of your platform committee. Who will be next? Rush Limbaugh as the keynote? Bryan Fischer giving the prayer?

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:11:46am

Religious freedom is something that both the religious and non-religious should cherish. Our freedom to believe or equally important to believe is important in a democratic society.

Obdicut Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:13:28am

I used to be a clinic escort at the little women’s health clinic down the street from me. We had a group of protesters there every day. They were insane and hateful. We also had a mug book that we were encouraged to look at that was pictures of all the protesters that were known to be violent. It was a lot of pictures.

It is patently obvious that nobody actually considers a couple of weeks old fetus to be the same thing as a baby. We don’t react emotionally the same way to the loss of it, we can be completely ignorant of the existence of the fetus, etc. I can understand if people have a mystical belief in the existence of a soul and that soul being implanted at conception by a God who does that kind of stuff, but it shouldn’t impact public policy. I also don’t understand why their god doesn’t just solve this problem he created, but that’s true for a lot of god-stuff.

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:13:33am

Former homosexual argues that gay marriage will inevitably lead to human trafficking as gay couples seek children to buy.
— Bryan Fischer (@BryanJFischer) January 27, 2013

BongCrodny Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:13:58am

re: #28 Ghost of Tom Joad

Killing somebody because you’re pro-life. Fighting for peace. Fucking for virginity.

Lunatics. It’s amazing that the more “pro-life” these people claim to be, the less they actually give a shit about the living. Every person who claims to be “pro-life” should be required to adopt a minimum of 2 children from different racial backgrounds. before they can say anything about the subject of abortion. Period. Otherwise, find a new hobby.

…Know-nothing ostriches with their heads in the sand on the Science Committee, Michelle Bachmann on the Intelligence Committee….

dragonath Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:14:19am

Didn’t Todd Akin have some kind of connection to something like this? I could have swore… wait…

Akin tied to “domestic terrorist”

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:14:52am

re: #39 Kragar

Which is why those things have skyrocketed in states that allow gay marriage and Canada. Oh wait. Seriously Bryan, just stop pushing gay people around because you’re a sexually repressed loser with issues.

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:17:38am

re: #38 Obdicut

When one of my daughters was a maybe 2 years old, I had to run her to our pediatrician because she was having a problem breathing. Antichoicers were holding a protest at the clinic. I ended up having to park 3 blocks away, then having to run the protest line with a sick kid while having hatefilled soulless harpies scream about babykillers at a kid who is already scared because she was sick.

Those people, and anyone like them, are absolute worthless gutter scum.

Ghost of Tom Joad Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:19:00am

re: #38 Obdicut

Have to give you props for doing that. I couldn’t. Don’t have enough self-control to not cold-cock one of those assholes in the jaw.

I also don’t understand why their god doesn’t just solve this problem he created, but that’s true for a lot of god-stuff.

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then He is not omnipotent. Is He able, but not willing? Then He is malevolent. Is He both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is He neither able nor willing? Then why call Him God?

Epicurus (c. 341 - c. 270 BC)

lawhawk Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:19:12am

re: #39 Kragar

Really. He’s going to go with that?

dragonfire1981 Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:19:27am

re: #39 Kragar

Is…Is he talking about himself?

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:20:18am

re: #45 lawhawk

Really. He’s going to go with that?

I guess no one told him about the numerous Christian adoption agencies under investigation around the world for human trafficking.

kirkspencer Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:20:21am

re: #41 dragonath

Didn’t Todd Akin have some kind of connection to something like this? I could have swore… wait…

Akin tied to “domestic terrorist”

Another reason some, myself being one, think prosecutors don’t bring domestic terrorism charges against these people.

If some of the people who control your pursestrings are part of the group it becomes difficult to pull that particular trigger. It’s especially bad when they can act to kill the prosecution.

erik_t Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:21:03am

re: #39 Kragar

@BryanJFischer Former homosexual argues that gay marriage will inevitably lead to human trafficking as gay couples seek children to buy.

Because… gay people weren’t adopting children before they were allowed to marry?

Dumbfuck.

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:22:32am

re: #43 Kragar

When one of my daughters was a maybe 2 years old, I had to run her to our pediatrician because she was having a problem breathing. Antichoicers were holding a protest at the clinic. I ended up having to park 3 blocks away, then having to run the protest line with a sick kid while having hatefilled soulless harpies scream about babykillers at a kid who is already scared because she was sick.

Those people, and anyone like them, are absolute worthless gutter scum.

A lot of them take their kids to it which is even worse if you ask me. I knew a lot of really devoutly Catholic kids growing up. They went to Catholic school and all that jazz, I don’t know how other Catholic schools do it but these guys were getting off class on the anniversary of Roe V Wade and being encouraged by their teachers to protest at clinics on those days. I don’t know if they got extra credit or not but I still remember cringing inside when a friend’s sister bragged about taunting a clinic employee. She of course tried to make it out like the employee was the bad guy but even then at 13 years old, I knew it was just some poor woman doing her job who was probably sick to death of being harassed by nut cases. I know abortion isn’t popular but as a man I’ve promised myself this that I will never judge a woman who makes that decision. As a man, I will never get pregnant and I will never be in the tough situation that many women are in when they have to make that choice.

b_sharp Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:23:53am

re: #39 Kragar

Human trafficking doesn’t happen now?

wrenchwench Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:24:19am

re: #38 Obdicut

It is patently obvious that nobody actually considers a couple of weeks old fetus to be the same thing as a baby.

It’s an embryo through week 9. Most abortions remove embryos, not fetuses. Not that any scientific fact makes a difference to forced-birthers.

Ghost of Tom Joad Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:24:41am

re: #39 Kragar

Bryan Fischer @BryanJFischer
Former homosexual argues that gay marriage will inevitably lead to human trafficking as gay couples seek children to buy.
1:25 PM - 27 Jan 13

Ahh, so they’re buying children now. As opposed to those creepy straight couples who kidnap and abuse young children.

(edit: when you quote somebody who embedded a tweet, there’s a bunch of coding in a blockquote, but nothing shows up when you preview/post it…?)

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:24:59am

re: #41 dragonath

Didn’t Todd Akin have some kind of connection to something like this? I could have swore… wait…

Akin tied to “domestic terrorist”

It’s amazing that it just took one stupid slip of the tongue to keep this nutcase out of the Senate. If Akin hadn’t made the legitimate rape comment, he could have well won that Senate race or it at least would have been a lot closer than it was.

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:25:18am

re: #53 Ghost of Tom Joad

Ahh, so they’re buying children now. As opposed to those creepy straight couples who kidnap and abuse young children.

Ban straight marriage.///

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:25:25am

re: #50 HappyWarrior

It comes down to basic rights in a free society. If you don’t believe in it, you’re under no obligation to do it yourself, but you don’t infringe on the right of others to do so.

These people want to live in a theocratic dictatorship.

b_sharp Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:26:09am

re: #49 erik_t

Because… gay people weren’t adopting children before they were allowed to marry?

Dumbfuck.

The problem isn’t too few children for adoption, it’s too many rejected because of stupid reasons like age/gender/skin colour.

dragonath Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:26:16am

re: #48 kirkspencer

Another reason some, myself being one, think prosecutors don’t bring domestic terrorism charges against these people.

The worst part about all this is how in many states, judges go up for election, usually in an “off” year, and no one knows who the hell they are- except people with an agenda. That’s what happened in Iowa, when Focus for the Family and other religious right groups poured money into the Supreme Court races and recalled the justices who supported gay marriage.

b_sharp Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:27:25am

re: #53 Ghost of Tom Joad

Ahh, so they’re buying children now. As opposed to those creepy straight couples who kidnap and abuse young children.

(edit: when you quote somebody who embedded a tweet, there’s a bunch of coding in a blockquote, but nothing shows up when you preview/post it…?)

Bait and switch my friend, Charles is pulling a bait and switch.

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:27:32am

re: #56 Kragar

It comes down to basic rights in a free society. If you don’t believe in it, you’re under no obligation to do it yourself, but you don’t infringe on the right of others to do so.

These people want to live in a theocratic dictatorship.

Yeah they sure as hell do and that scares the crap out of me. They want this to be a society that resembles the Middle Ages more than it does modern society. A society where unwed pregnant women are shamed as sluts and whores, a society where gays are the same as violent sex offenders, a society where being a non-Christian or even non conservative Christian is a crime, etc.

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:29:26am

re: #58 dragonath

The worst part about all this is how in many states, judges go up for election, usually in an “off” year, and no one knows who the hell they are- except people with an agenda. That’s what happened in Iowa, when Focus for the Family and other religious right groups poured money into the Supreme Court races and recalled the justices who supported gay marriage.

It goes against a lot of my small letter d-democratic beliefs but I don’t like electing judges. I really think it makes them to beholden to political pressures. I mean elected judges is how we get Roy Moore and those like him. People who would probably never be seriously considered for a judicial appointment.

jaunte Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:29:55am

Some NARAL stats on violence from “pro-lifers”:

HISTORY OF VIOLENCE/Murders and Shootings

Anti-abortion extremists perpetrated an unprecedented level of violence in 1993 with the first murder of an abortion provider. Dr. David Gunn was shot and killed by a zealot in Pensacola, FL. Since that time, anti-abortion extremists have murdered or attempted to murder numerous other individuals who were involved in reproductive health care.

A chronology of abortion related murders and shootings follows:

[Link: www.prochoice.org…]

Arsons & bombings:
[Link: www.prochoice.org…]

Butyric Acid Attacks
[Link: www.prochoice.org…]

Anthrax threats:
[Link: www.prochoice.org…]

RadicalModerate Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:32:19am

re: #39 Kragar

Appropriate response

dragonath Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:35:44am

re: #61 HappyWarrior

Yeah, ironically it sometimes results in less freedom, especially when you get someone especially hawkish in charge. The same thing happens in many DA and attorney general elections, where the candidates routinely try to up the ante on each other.

Ghost of Tom Joad Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:36:31am

re: #61 HappyWarrior

It goes against a lot of my small letter d-democratic beliefs but I don’t like electing judges. I really think it makes them to beholden to political pressures. I mean elected judges is how we get Roy Moore and those like him. People who would probably never be seriously considered for a judicial appointment.

It’s a tough area to talk about electing judges. I don’t happen to care for the idea. Representatives (Congress, President, Mayor etc.) should be elected because those people are representing the interests of the people. Judges (and Sheriffs, fucking Arpaio) aren’t there to “represent the will of the people.” They’re there to do a job that should have some very strict standards of qualification. Maybe some form of test should be administered or something.

Kragar Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:37:00am

re: #63 RadicalModerate

Appropriate response

“Former homosexual” is a term a always find highly suspicious when used by religious whackos.

dragonfire1981 Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:38:04am

re: #66 Kragar

“Former homosexual” is a term a always find highly suspicious when used by religious whackos.

Perhaps “homosexual who has learned how to suppress his sexuality” would be more accurate?

b_sharp Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:38:09am

re: #66 Kragar

“Former homosexual” is a term a always find highly suspicious when used by religious whackos.

Former homosexual = late night news item.

Ghost of Tom Joad Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:38:50am

re: #67 dragonfire1981

Perhaps “homosexual who has learned how to suppress his sexuality” would be more accurate?

Marcus Bachmann is exhibit 1A.

Feline Fearless Leader Mon, Jan 28, 2013 11:39:17am

re: #49 erik_t

Because… gay people weren’t adopting children before they were allowed to marry?

Dumbfuck.

And of course has nothing to do with multiple adoption agencies with an underlying Christian identity that take extra trouble to prevent gay couples from adopting.
//

HappyWarrior Mon, Jan 28, 2013 12:41:59pm

re: #65 Ghost of Tom Joad

It’s a tough area to talk about electing judges. I don’t happen to care for the idea. Representatives (Congress, President, Mayor etc.) should be elected because those people are representing the interests of the people. Judges (and Sheriffs, fucking Arpaio) aren’t there to “represent the will of the people.” They’re there to do a job that should have some very strict standards of qualification. Maybe some form of test should be administered or something.

Yes, good point about the difference between the jobs of presidents/Congress and judges/law enforcement.

MartiansAteMyCat Mon, Jan 28, 2013 4:21:12pm

Suit Reveals Ties Among Radical Abortion Opponents and Imprisoned Terrorist

Did the suit reveal shirts too? Brown ones, I’m assuming. :)

Spy Mode Auto

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