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Rand Paul on Glenn Beck Show: “Something Really Depraved Is Rising in the Country”

Fear-mongering taken to the next level
Wingnuts • Views: 28,191

“I think that our country needs a spiritual cleansing. I really think we need a revival in this country — and I do need your prayers and I do need the strength to go on with this, because this isn’t always easy.

[…]

I think our country’s problems are deeper than political — that we need spiritual leaders to come forward. We need something beyond just the politics of the day and, you know, I see it everywhere — something really depraved is rising in the country.”

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276 comments

1 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:00:49pm

Think most psychiatrists would classify that as a cry for help.

2 blueraven  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:01:08pm

Elmer Gantry part deux

3 Kragar (Antichrist )  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:01:35pm

Its about time that Glenn took on the Evangelicals.

4 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:02:49pm
When asked about the sequester budget cuts that will go into effect on March 1, Paul said even though everyone dislikes it because it cuts in every area of the budget, it’s probably a better cut than what Congress could come up with.

Paul said, “We’d be fools to get rid of this now, ‘cause we’ll not get anything better that the President would sign.”
[Link: www.westkentuckystar.com…]

Fools dragging us all over the falls.

5 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:03:15pm

Yeah, your party, chief.

6 austin_blue  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:05:07pm

Dear Rand:

Please fuck off. There is not a “spiritual” problem in this country. There is a problem with folks like you who reject the social contract implicit in both the preamble to the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. The Constitution is a secular, not religious, document.

You sir, are an ignorant idiot. The best favor you could do for America is walk in front of a train.

7 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:05:12pm

re: #4 jaunte

Fools dragging us all over the falls.

Paul’s of the “We have to destroy the country to save it” persuasion, like his daddy was. And considering how this apple didn’t fall far from the tree, he probably also sees the sequester as a great way to scale back “American imperialism.”

8 Lidane  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:09:18pm

And the GOP thinks their problem is in their messaging, not their message.

ROFL. Keep dreaming.

9 Kragar (Antichrist )  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:09:30pm

Rand Paul: “ALL GLORY TO THE AQUA BUDDHA!”

10 Kragar (Antichrist )  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:10:17pm

re: #8 Lidane

And the GOP thinks their problem is in their messaging, not their message.

ROFL. Keep dreaming.

“You don’t think the problem could be people get your message and they just don’t like it?”
“INCONCEIVABLE!”

11 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:10:32pm
you know, I see it everywhere — something really depraved is rising in the country

Maybe it’s the same political cynicism his daddy taught him.

12 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:10:55pm

re: #8 Lidane

And the GOP thinks their problem is in their messaging, not their message.

ROFL. Keep dreaming.

Before: “You godless heathens are gonna burn for accepting gay marriage, abortions, and women on the front lines!”

After: “We don’t agree with those things and think anybody who does is a godless heathen, but now we only think they’ll just wander purgatory forever.”

13 engineer cat  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:13:19pm

re: #2 blueraven

Elmer Gantry part deux

or father coughlin

14 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:18:03pm

re: #6 austin_blue

Dear Rand:

Please fuck off. There is not a “spiritual” problem in this country. There is a problem with folks like you who reject the social contract implicit in both the preamble to the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. The Constitution is a secular, not religious, document.

You sir, are an ignorant idiot. The best favor you could do for America is walk in front of a train.

That isn’t nice: It messes up the rail line for hours and it does a real head trip on the engineer of the train.

15 Godisdeadandburied  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:19:59pm

“Something Really Depraved Is Rising in the Country”

You mean the religious right, the Tea Party, and followers of Ayn Rand?

16 stabby  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:26:27pm

For gays and women: the inquisition!
For the poor: Ayn Rand!

17 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:35:47pm

There’s something deeply amusing about a devotee of Ayn Rand calling for a “spiritual cleansing.” It’s a might like Rush Limbaugh calling for civility in the media.

18 austin_blue  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:38:23pm

re: #12 Targetpractice

Before: “You godless heathens are gonna burn for accepting gay marriage, abortions, and women on the front lines!”

After: “We don’t agree with those things and think anybody who does is a godless heathen, but now we only think they’ll just wander purgatory forever.”

Purgatory is a very Catholic concept, like Limbo. Being a retired mackerel snapper, I’m not real clear on the theology of them right now.

Lizards? Any insight?

19 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:43:55pm
20 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:44:40pm
21 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:44:47pm

re: #19 jaunte

Um…. I just want to say I love all you guys. Well, not all. But a significant percentage.

22 stabby  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:47:47pm

re: #19 jaunte

Bullshit

23 Lidane  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:51:40pm
24 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:52:42pm

re: #22 stabby

She’s just reporting from 2012.

25 Mongo only pawn... in game of life.  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:55:28pm

I see it too. It looks like Glenn Beck and Rand Paul and Rush Limbaugh and Savage, Citizens United and a hundred am radio chuckle heads who just mouth breath into the mic and ask “and who pays for that?” to the rubes and suckers who then tune in Fox News and scream with delight as they “heard that too”! May a hard rain fall on these jackals.

26 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 8:55:47pm

re: #22 stabby

We’ll have to wait and see.

27 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:00:07pm
28 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:05:47pm

Fireball in the sky over San Francisco? It’s a sign!!

//

29 Kragar (Antichrist )  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:12:04pm

re: #28 Targetpractice

Fireball in the sky over San Francisco? It’s a sign!!

//

JESUS IS BACK!

30 Targetpractice  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:13:29pm

re: #29 Kragar (Antichrist )

JESUS IS BACK!

The guy who mows my lawn?

//

31 John Vreeland  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:14:29pm

Pics or it didn’t happen.

32 LWNJ  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:15:08pm

Why am I always looking the other way when the meteor streaks by?

33 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:15:23pm

re: #28 Targetpractice

Fireball in the sky over San Francisco? It’s a sign!!

//

If its visible in San jose its just a sign that the Sharks lost tonight and the Chicago Blackhawks have won their 11th game of the season. The Blackhawks remain the only NHL team this season to have not lost a game in regulation, and lead the league with 25 points.

Go Hawks!

34 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:16:38pm

re: #31 John Vreeland

35 austin_blue  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:17:51pm

OT from a post WAY downthread: (redacted for more updated info)

That was one significant bolide today over Chelyabinsk. The shockwave occurred between 2 and 2 and 1/2 minutes after the initial breakup, indicating an altitude of between 125,00 and 150,00 feet. The contrail itself was around two hundred and fifty miles long. (perspective is an odd thing, yes?).

Over a million square feet of glass was shattered in the city. The object was approximately 50 feet in diameter and was probably a chondroid (most incoming objects are), but we can hope for a Palasite body (beautiful stuff).

The altitude of the the breakup caused most of the injuries. People went to the windows to see what the bright light was and were staring at the contrail when the windows blew in. Lots of opthalmic surgeons will be really busy the next few days. Some victims have been airlifted to hospitals in Moscow and St. Pete.

The coincidence of this object, entering the atmosphere at a completely different angle and a much greater speed (30 miles per second!) than the fly-by asteroid which missed us by 17,000 miles today was just that; a coincidence. But the timing indicates that there are, as the Bard wrote, “more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.”

A fine example of “real world” Earth Science was displayed today. NASA is looking for really big bodies. If this object had come in vertically over LA today, it would have stomped the city into a bloody stain.

36 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:19:34pm

Freaky. He’s not like his father. Pray people! Pray!

37 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:23:00pm

re: #35 austin_blue

OT from a post WAY downthread: (redacted for more updated info)

That was one significant bolide today over Chelyabinsk. The shockwave occurred between 2 and 2 and 1/2 minutes after the initial breakup, indicating an altitude of between 125,00 and 150,00 feet. The contrail itself was around two hundred and fifty miles long. (perspective is an odd thing, yes?).

Over a million square feet of glass was shattered in the city. The object was approximately 50 feet in diameter and was probably a chondroid (most incoming objects are), but we can hope for a Palasite body (beautiful stuff).

The altitude of the the breakup caused most of the injuries. People went to the windows to see what the bright light was and were staring at the contrail when the windows blew in. Lots of opthalmic surgeons will be really busy the next few days. Some victims have been airlifted to hospitals in Moscow and St. Pete.

The coincidence of this object, entering the atmosphere at a completely different angle and a much greater speed (30 miles per second!) than the fly-by asteroid which missed us by 17,000 miles today was just that; a coincidence. But the timing indicates that there are, as the Bard wrote, “more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.”

A fine example of “real world” Earth Science was displayed today. NASA is looking for really big bodies. If this object had come in vertically over LA today, it would have stomped the city into a bloody stain.

It would depend on where it hit. If it hit near the ocean, for example, the San Fernando Valley would likely survive, as the Hollywood Hills would shield it from the blast wave. That was, after all, how parts of Nagasaki survived the nuclear strike on that city in August 1945.

38 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:23:55pm

re: #36 Gus

Freaky. He’s not like his father. Pray people! Pray!

He’s irrational and politically uncontrollable. He’s very much his father’s son.

39 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:28:53pm
40 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:29:58pm
41 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:30:45pm
42 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:39:12pm
43 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:42:06pm

re: #42 jaunte

Which is it?

44 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:42:59pm

re: #43 Gus

Given the number of reports, it’s likely.

45 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:45:00pm

re: #44 jaunte

Given the number of reports, it’s likely.

Took it’s time

Meteor streaks across sky over Bay Area
Wednesday, October 17, 2012

46 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:46:16pm

re: #45 sattv4u2

Did you see the Feb 15 story?

47 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:47:36pm

re: #46 jaunte

Did you see the Feb 15 story?

Nope. took that from your #42

48 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:48:07pm

Damn. One negative review about the Tesla Model S and people are just totally freaking out at the New York Times who already made one positive review in the past. WTF. What kind of weasel goes to the New York Times for a car review in the first place. Typically one relies on Motor Trend, Car and Driver, Consumer Reports. Get a life already and take a couple of Valiums.

49 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:48:41pm

Oh. And according to other new reports. Tesla won’t survive unless it gets more gubernment loans.

50 Single-handed sailor  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:53:12pm

re: #22 stabby

Bullshit

Local blog here in east bay is talking about it. It is my go-to place for local breaking news.

51 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:53:13pm

re: #45 sattv4u2

Took it’s time

Meteor streaks across sky over Bay Area
Wednesday, October 17, 2012

NBC. What do you expect. There’s no chatter on Twitter. I blame wingnuts and Republicans.

52 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:54:58pm

Estimates for the mass that falls on Earth each year range from 37,000-78,000 tons. People probably get tired of noticing.

53 Kragar (Antichrist )  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:55:32pm

So what you’re all saying is that Obama is engaged in a massive coverup of the San Fran meteor.

54 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:55:50pm

Meteor over Bay Area misreported. I blame the war on women and racism.

55 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:56:11pm

That. And drones.

56 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:56:16pm

re: #51 Gus

NBC. What do you expect. There’s no chatter on Twitter. I blame wingnuts and Republicans.

Where do you see an October date? The links from #42 lead to a story dated Feb. 15. The story compares the meteor to one that occurred last October, but it’s a different event.

ETA: #39 links to an October story. It appears that was just an error on the tweeter’s part.

57 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:56:20pm

re: #54 Gus

Meteor over Bay Area misreported. I blame the war on women and racism.

lets not forget Fox News!

58 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:56:42pm

re: #49 Gus

Oh. And according to other new reports. Tesla won’t survive unless it gets more gubernment loans.

Then its time for it to close up shop. The government shouldn’t be loaning out money to an unprofitable car company like that, especially since the money being to the US government in the first place.

59 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:57:34pm

Meteor streaks across Bay Area skies

It may not have been as spectacular as the space rock that streaked across the skies above Russia late Thursday, but the Bay Area’s close encounter with a meteor Friday night was drawing its own attention on social networks.

Comments on Twitter indicated the object that flashed across the horizon around 8 p.m. was blue in color and visible from the Peninsula to at least the eastern reaches of Contra Costa County and as far away as Red Bluff.

60 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:58:04pm

re: #56 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi

Where do you see an October date? The links from #42 lead to a story dated Feb. 15. The story compares the meteor to one that occurred last October, but it’s a different event.

Click #42 where is says Fireball Streaks Across Bay Area Sky in blue

That story is dated Oct 2012

61 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:59:01pm

re: #60 sattv4u2

That was the story linked in #39.

62 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:59:28pm

re: #60 sattv4u2

Click #42 where is says Fireball Streaks Across Bay Area Sky in blue

That story is dated Oct 2012

Not when I click it it’s not. It’s dated February 15. Here.

63 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:59:34pm

This is my only chance to blame William Gibson for something.

64 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 9:59:47pm

re: #57 sattv4u2

lets not forget Fox News!

Clearly I’ve morphed into the Taliban.

65 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:00:20pm

Death to America! //

66 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:00:32pm

re: #62 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi

Not when I click it it’s not. It’s dated February 15. Here.

In #45 I copy/ pasted the 1st two lines from the article

67 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:00:35pm

re: #64 Gus

No music, then?

68 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:01:29pm

re: #67 jaunte

No music, then?

Act Now to Stop War and End Racism! //

69 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:01:51pm

re: #62 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi

re: #66 sattv4u2

In #45 I copy/ pasted the 1st two lines from the article

heh

Now it shows Updated 9:58 PM PST

70 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:02:18pm

re: #66 sattv4u2

In #45 I copy/ pasted the 1st two lines from the article

That’s the story linked in #39. It refers to an event last October.

The story linked in #42 refers to an event that happened yesterday, comparing it to last October’s meteor and denying that it has anything to do with the close-approaching asteroid - which, as we know, happened yesterday and not 4 months ago.

71 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:02:37pm

re: #68 Gus

Act Now to Stop War and End Racism! //

Is that you, Cindy Sheehan??

72 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:02:55pm

Too many damn rocks.

73 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:03:01pm

re: #70 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi

see 69

74 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:03:03pm

Wait. Found it. Just some stupid meteor.

75 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:03:38pm

re: #73 sattv4u2

see 69

See 70 again.

76 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:04:08pm

Republicans were probably just trying to keep this silent. It was probably a thermite bullet.

77 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:05:03pm

re: #75 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi

See 70 again.

I did, and as stated, when I 1st look at the article linked in 42, it showed Oct 2012 (my copy/paste of 45)

6 minutes ago it was “updated” with one of the changes being the date

78 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:05:07pm

More women die from meteor strikes than men. Did you know that? //

79 Kragar (Antichrist )  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:05:24pm

I blame all of you for this.

80 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:05:35pm

re: #76 Gus

Republicans were probably just trying to keep this silent. It was probably a thermite bullet.

They filibustered it out of existence!!

81 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:05:38pm

re: #78 Gus

Great Aunt Tunguska!

82 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:06:10pm

re: #81 jaunte

Great Aunt Tunguska!

Is she related to Aunt Jemima??

83 jaunte  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:06:42pm

re: #82 sattv4u2

Some family taigas.

84 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:07:10pm

re: #80 sattv4u2

They filibustered it out of existence!!

You laugh but billions will die. Because. Christians. //

85 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:07:38pm

K

That equipment rack I’m supposed to be rewiring

I still have to rewire it!!

86 sattv4u2  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:07:56pm

re: #84 Gus

You laugh but billions will die. Because. Christians. //

Only white male ones

87 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:08:55pm

re: #77 sattv4u2

I did, and as stated, when I 1st look at the article linked in 42, it showed Oct 2012 (my copy/paste of 45)

6 minutes ago it was “updated” with one of the changes being the date

It seems clear to me that that story refers to an event that occurred yesterday. Otherwise there’d be no point in any of the following:

It comes on the same night a 150-foot-wide asteroid was due to come within 17,200 miles of Earth. It was not immediately clear if the fireball had any connection to the asteroid.

He said it was likely smaller than another meteor that landed in the Bay Area in October, which caused a loud sonic boom as it fell, breaking apart and spreading rocks, called meteorites, in the North Bay.

It also happened about 24 hours after a huge meteorite fell from the skies over Russia’s Chelyabinsk region, resulting in a powerful blast that injured nearly 1,000 people and shattered windows across the area.

I really think you saw two different articles, the first one being this.

ETA: especially since that story has the exact headline and dateline that you quoted in #45.

88 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:13:46pm

re: #86 sattv4u2

Only white male ones

The irony being that white males typically bring that up. Weird, that. But yeah. I’ve noticed.

89 Kragar (Antichrist )  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:15:26pm

Scientists say giant tin of white paint more use against asteroid hit

Reliable warning of smaller objects coming our way is tricky - there are just too many.

“The Earth gets hit all the time,” said Dr Lewis. “The solar system is quite literally littered with these objects.”

Objects of DA14’s size are far rarer, however. The last one known to hit the planet was the Tunguska event in 1908.

“That caused the trees to flatten in an area equivalent to the inside of the M25,” said Dr Lewis.

With a year’s warning, and today’s technology, what realistically could we do to avoid that?

“Evacuate.”

90 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:16:33pm

re: #87 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi

Sounds real now. We’d probably know that this would happen if it wasn’t for Republicans.

91 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:17:14pm

Wednesday, October 17, 2012

92 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:25:25pm

Moonbats alarmed about meteor strikes.

93 wrenchwench  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:39:29pm

I saw a meteor when I was walking home a few nights ago. It had a double trail kind of like the one over Russia, but of course it was much, much smaller.

94 Kragar (Antichrist )  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:40:36pm

I saw a meteor drinking a pina colada at Trader Vic’s

95 wrenchwench  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:47:33pm

re: #94 Kragar (Antichrist )

I saw a meteor drinking a pina colada at Trader Vic’s

Well-coiffed?

96 TedStriker  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:48:18pm

re: #94 Kragar (Antichrist )

I saw a meteor drinking a pina colada at Trader Vic’s

re: #95 wrenchwench

Well-coiffed?

His hair was perfect…

97 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:49:35pm

If you oppose the minimum wage you hate women. Yep.

98 wrenchwench  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:55:59pm

Image: h659D5147.jpg

Later, lizards.

99 Gus  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 10:58:04pm
100 BeenHereAwhile  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 12:24:39am
I think our country’s problems are deeper than political - that we need spiritual leaders to come forward

Well, bourbon spirits seem to be trending. 

101 Amory Blaine  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 12:49:26am

Scott Walker’s transportation budget might include sale of state power plants

Gov. Scott Walker is seeking to sell off hundreds of millions of dollars in power plants or other state assets to help pay some of the borrowing he is proposing as part of his two-year $6.4 billion transportation plan unveiled Friday.

The controversial move to sell the 37 power and heating plants - already being outlined to lawmakers - would, if it happened, help the Republican governor and the state keep on schedule with key Milwaukee area projects such as the Zoo Interchange and Hoan Bridge. The move could also have the unexpected effect of linking the prices paid by some utility customers to the financing of the state’s road system.

Bonds for the road work would go through even if the state property was not ultimately sold.

102 Sol Berdinowitz  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 12:54:44am

re: #49 Gus

Oh. And according to other new reports. Tesla won’t survive unless it gets more gubernment loans.

How can America support the manufacture of any car from a company dependent on government loans to survive?

103 thecommodore  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 1:04:30am

Glenn, you and your followers give me fear.

Tons of it.

104 Sol Berdinowitz  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 1:24:50am

A dark threat looms over America. Dark, you see. And somehow foreign. And we are being called upon to disarm that threat using all means at our disposal. And in doing so, we answer to a higher authority, and one with paler skin…

/

105 Stanley Sea  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:06:25am

Anyone here?

106 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:09:48am

re: #105 Stanley Sea

Anyone here?

Kinda sorta!

107 Stanley Sea  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:10:27am

Hey Satt.

108 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:14:40am

re: #107 Stanley Sea

Hey Satt.

Did you bring breakfast?

109 dragonath  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:16:46am

re: #101 Amory Blaine

Sounds like Virginia. The whole “you need to spend more on energy to keep the roads up”.

110 Stanley Sea  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:17:01am

Nope. To me it’s the middle of the night, kinda.

111 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:20:10am

re: #110 Stanley Sea

Nope. To me it’s the middle of the night, kinda.

Well, truth be told, seeing that I’m nearing the end of my work “day”, it’s closer to dinner time than breakfast for me

112 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:20:53am

Good Morning.

113 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:21:45am

re: #112 PhillyPretzel

Good Morning.

prove it!
/

114 Stanley Sea  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:23:28am

Hey Philly!

115 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 4:33:31am

I am just “checking in.” I am going to be all over the internet today. Philly is expecting some snow during the day. [Link: www.wunderground.com…]

116 Bulworth  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 5:19:04am

So “spiritual leaders need to step forward”? They’ve been stepping forward for years if not decades. Well, they’ve been stepping in it mostly. Ayn Rand Paul and Beck might want to ask themselves why, with all the religion in this country, their country still isn’t to their liking.

117 Bulworth  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 5:28:08am

re: #17 Targetpractice

There’s something deeply amusing about a devotee of Ayn Rand calling for a “spiritual cleansing.” It’s a might like Rush Limbaugh calling for civility in the media.

yeah i can’t keep up with it. boggles the mind.

118 Flounder  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 5:51:18am

From my local paper, made it to Drudge
Woman partially disrobes at student assembly
[Link: www.timesunion.com…]

Police said that Aydrea Meaders of Albany got on stage during an assembly in the school’s cafeteria and began to dance. School officials told police that while she was on stage, Meanders began to disrobe,

119 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 6:01:59am

re: #118 Flounder

From my local paper, made it to Drudge
Woman partially disrobes at student assembly
[Link: www.timesunion.com…]

Maybe she was the new Pole Dancing 101 instructor!

120 Flounder  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 6:18:06am

State government at work
[Link: blog.timesunion.com…]

Avella will discuss possible changes to City law that would exempt pigs like Petey as well as possible legislation that would classify these pigs as therapy pets.

Cute piggy pic alert!
My daughter wants a teacup pig. I said fine, but if that pig pisses me off, It’s bacon!

121 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 6:33:52am

re: #101 Amory Blaine

Scott Walker’s transportation budget might include sale of state power plants

A state is better suited to building roads than running power plants. And by proposing infrastructure upgrades Scott Walker is taking action at a time when Obama just proposed something similar, thus avoiding the charge of being a do nothing.

Smart, quite smart.

122 Sionainn  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 6:37:55am

re: #35 austin_blue

OT from a post WAY downthread: (redacted for more updated info)

That was one significant bolide today over Chelyabinsk. The shockwave occurred between 2 and 2 and 1/2 minutes after the initial breakup, indicating an altitude of between 125,00 and 150,00 feet. The contrail itself was around two hundred and fifty miles long. (perspective is an odd thing, yes?).

Over a million square feet of glass was shattered in the city. The object was approximately 50 feet in diameter and was probably a chondroid (most incoming objects are), but we can hope for a Palasite body (beautiful stuff).

The altitude of the the breakup caused most of the injuries. People went to the windows to see what the bright light was and were staring at the contrail when the windows blew in. Lots of opthalmic surgeons will be really busy the next few days. Some victims have been airlifted to hospitals in Moscow and St. Pete.

The coincidence of this object, entering the atmosphere at a completely different angle and a much greater speed (30 miles per second!) than the fly-by asteroid which missed us by 17,000 miles today was just that; a coincidence. But the timing indicates that there are, as the Bard wrote, “more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.”

A fine example of “real world” Earth Science was displayed today. NASA is looking for really big bodies. If this object had come in vertically over LA today, it would have stomped the city into a bloody stain.

Just learned something new today…if I see a bright flash, get far away from windows and anything else that can be blown over onto me.

123 dragonath  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 6:55:16am

re: #121 Dark_Falcon

A state is better suited to building roads than running power plants. And by proposing infrastructure upgrades Scott Walker is taking action at a time when Obama just proposed something similar, thus avoiding the charge of being a do nothing.

Smart, quite smart.

Oh for fuck’s sake. Walker has no problem having the state decide who marries who.

124 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 6:56:34am

re: #121 Dark_Falcon

A state is better suited to building roads than running power plants. And by proposing infrastructure upgrades Scott Walker is taking action at a time when Obama just proposed something similar, thus avoiding the charge of being a do nothing.

Smart, quite smart.

If Walker is doing it, it’s because he was told to do so by his bosses at the Koch Brothers. He’s too corrupt to do anything for the good of Wisconsin.

125 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 6:58:30am

Good morning lizards.

Bacon roses!
Image: bacon-roses.jpg

126 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:03:18am

re: #124 William Barnett-Lewis

If Walker is doing it, it’s because he was told to do so by his bosses at the Koch Brothers. He’s too corrupt to do anything for the good of Wisconsin.

Even if that were true (and I don’t think it is), he’s planning to build and improve roads, as you folks on the left have been demanding. So a proposal has been put forward to do at least some of what you wanted; If you think that proposal flawed, put forward a counter to it. Such is politics, after all.

127 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:04:58am

re: #125 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards.

Bacon roses!
Image: bacon-roses.jpg

Roses for the Right. Earlier this week, Rihanna showed off some Roses for the Left.

129 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:18:27am

re: #125 NJDhockeyfan

Good morning lizards.

Bacon roses!
Image: bacon-roses.jpg

And while you’re here, how please are your with the New Jersey Devils right now? They’re doing very well, exceeded only by Chicago’s Blackhawks.

130 dragonath  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:26:33am

re: #126 Dark_Falcon

Even if that were true (and I don’t think it is), he’s planning to build and improve roads, as you folks on the left have been demanding. So a proposal has been put forward to do at least some of what you wanted; If you think that proposal flawed, put forward a counter to it. Such is politics, after all.

This is a redux of 2011, when Walker attempted to sell the state power plants (in the budget omnibus bill, no less) with no-bid contracts.

Selling public state assets in no bid contracts is about as corrupt as it fucking gets.

131 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:28:29am

re: #129 Dark_Falcon

And while you’re here, how please are your with the New Jersey Devils right now? They’re doing very well, exceeded only by Chicago’s Blackhawks.

Awesome. They playing so well right now. Its as if last season is still going on. Brodeur is playing great and Clarkson is on fire. If they keep this up the playoffs are going to be fun to watch.

132 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:38:45am
133 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:40:06am

re: #132 wrenchwench

Image: hC2B31E1A.jpg

Young cats are typically able to take their place as LOL Cats at about 9 months old.

/Just having fun.

134 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:40:55am

re: #131 NJDhockeyfan

Awesome. They playing so well right now. Its as if last season is still going on. Brodeur is playing great and Clarkson is on fire. If they keep this up the playoffs are going to be fun to watch.

Hopefully your team and mine will meet for the Stanley Cup Finals. What a showdown that would be!

135 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:43:33am

What’s up with Salon? They are playing the victim card for Dorner.


Understanding Christopher Dorner

Bradley Manning: imprisoned, tortured. Marsha Coleman-Adebayo: lost her career at the Environmental Protection Agency. Karen Silkwood: died in a suspicious car accident. Gary Webb and Deborah Jeane Palfrey: committed suicide, the former having lost his career, the latter under threat of a 55-year prison sentence. Adrian Schoolcraft: involuntarily admitted to a psychiatric ward.

This isn’t a country that necessarily holds whistleblowers in the highest regard.

…Dorner’s reaction is partly rooted in a corrosive version of American masculinity — his response to institutional corruption is uniquely Jack Bauer and John Wayne. Gratuitous violence included. Dorner is a wholesale product of a society gone mad on racism and war, of a state that aggressively punishes dissent, of an intellectual milieu where telling the truth has become a dangerous act. There was no internal institutional outlet for him to address injustices against him: the blue line prevented that.

…In Dorner’s case, the allegory of life to a furnace takes literal weight — he has died, consumed by fire. The police will celebrate, the chorus will quiet, the lives of his victims mourned. It is unlikely that the fire that burned away Dorner will burn away any illusion: this is unfortunate, and disturbing. His allegations will be dismissed as the rantings of a lunatic, things will return to normal. Until the fire, next time.

In other words its not his fault. Im sure the families of the people he murdered share a different view.

136 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:43:36am

re: #121 Dark_Falcon

A state is better suited to building roads than running power plants. And by proposing infrastructure upgrades Scott Walker is taking action at a time when Obama just proposed something similar, thus avoiding the charge of being a do nothing.

Smart, quite smart.

Proposing to sell off infrastructure to pay for other infrastructure is goddamn moronic.

137 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:47:00am

Yeehaw! Two bills from Denver General and my teeth hurt. Amongst other things. Whatever.

138 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:47:37am

re: #135 NJDhockeyfan

Articles that start off with “Bradley Manning, tortured” aren’t generally going to wind up that great, but I didn’t see anywhere in there where they were saying it wasn’t his fault. I don’t agree with much of the article, specifically the bit about saving Dorner’s life, but it doesn’t say it’s not his fault.

139 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:47:49am

re: #135 NJDhockeyfan

What’s up with Salon? They are playing the victim card for Dorner.

Understanding Christopher Dorner

In other words its not his fault. Im sure the families of the people he murdered share a different view.

Salon sucks. Moonbat central. Home to Glenn Greenwald.

140 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:49:11am

re: #137 Gus

Yeehaw! Two bills from Denver General and my teeth hurt. Amongst other things. Whatever.

My wife is a med student at a world-class university and she cannot figure out what the fuck is going on with the bills she’s been getting since her broken leg. She’s having to recruit her mother, who is an insurance agent, to sort through it with her. Right now they’re aggressively billing her for the full amount, it seems, and every goddamn department sends its own bill. It’s a nightmare.

And that’s with insurance. Figuring this shit out and settling it shouldn’t take 40+ hours.

141 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:50:04am

re: #135 NJDhockeyfan

What’s up with Salon? They are playing the victim card for Dorner.

Understanding Christopher Dorner

In other words its not his fault. Im sure the families of the people he murdered share a different view.

I thought so too but others here seemed to think different. Go figure.

142 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:50:33am

re: #139 Gus

Salon sucks. Moonbat central. Home to Glenn Greenwald.

I think he left and is now at the Guardian.

143 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:50:35am

re: #140 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

My wife is a med student at a world-class university and she cannot figure out what the fuck is going on with the bills she’s been getting since her broken leg. She’s having to recruit her mother, who is an insurance agent, to sort through it with her. Right now they’re aggressively billing her for the full amount, it seems, and every goddamn department sends its own bill. It’s a nightmare.

And that’s with insurance. Figuring this shit out and settling it shouldn’t take 40+ hours.

I haven’t opened them yet. Bad enough getting two envelopes. Onward and downward. Life is succession of bills. Then you die.

144 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:51:34am

re: #142 Killgore Trout

I think he left and is now at the Guardian.

Yep, he did. The Guardian hates America more. Guardian and Salon isn’t really news. It’s all opinion and commentary. Not news.

145 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:52:56am

re: #141 Killgore Trout

I thought so too but others here seemed to think different. Go figure.

Really? Who here said that it wasn’t his fault, Killgore?

146 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:54:16am

That’s the trick to being a really hip pseudo intellectual. Got to hate America and have a lot of self loathing if you’re an American. That and a pair of fake black framed, lens-less glasses.

147 Lidane  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 7:57:26am
148 Lidane  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:00:34am

More right-wing history:

Heh.

149 dragonath  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:02:02am

“Dick’s Daily Lunch”, huh…

150 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:03:56am

Dick Morris ruined my life.

151 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:06:25am

re: #146 Gus

That’s the trick to being a really hip pseudo intellectual. Got to hate America and have a lot of self loathing if you’re an American. That and a pair of fake black framed, lens-less glasses.

It also helps to actually live outside America.

152 dragonath  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:07:05am

I don’t really feel like watching a video with Dick in it, but that same American “populism” that Jackson espoused brought us:

The Trail of Tears
The Mexican American War
Citizen Know Nothing
and the continuation of Slavery as a fundamental right

…I prefer Abraham Lincoln’s brand of Americanism.

153 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:08:46am

re: #134 Dark_Falcon

Hopefully your team and mine will meet for the Stanley Cup Finals. What a showdown that would be!

Absolutely. I do like Chicago too. That would be a great series.

154 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:15:03am

What are the Ruskies up to?

Russian nuclear bombers intercepted near Guam

Two Russian bombers, capable of carrying nuclear cruise missiles, circled the U.S. island of Guam in the Western Pacific this week, U.S. military officials told NBC News. U.S. Air Force F-15 jets scrambled from Andersen Air Force Base on Guam to intercept the bombers.

According to one military official, the Russian Bear bombers remained in international airspace, the encounter between the U.S. and Russian aircraft “stayed professional” and there was no incident. The official said it’s impossible to determine whether the Russian bombers carried any nuclear weapons.

155 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:15:31am

re: #140 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

My wife is a med student at a world-class university and she cannot figure out what the fuck is going on with the bills she’s been getting since her broken leg. She’s having to recruit her mother, who is an insurance agent, to sort through it with her. Right now they’re aggressively billing her for the full amount, it seems, and every goddamn department sends its own bill. It’s a nightmare.

And that’s with insurance. Figuring this shit out and settling it shouldn’t take 40+ hours.

Two words: Single Payer.

156 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:21:16am

re: #138 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Articles that start off with “Bradley Manning, tortured” aren’t generally going to wind up that great, but I didn’t see anywhere in there where they were saying it wasn’t his fault. I don’t agree with much of the article, specifically the bit about saving Dorner’s life, but it doesn’t say it’s not his fault.

Right under the title it says ‘The ex-cop was a product of a society gone mad on racism and war — and a state that aggressively punishes dissent’. The entire article seems find any excuse to find a reason for his actions and fails to call him what he is - a cold blooded killer.

157 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:23:40am

re: #156 NJDhockeyfan

Right under the title it says ‘The ex-cop was a product of a society gone mad on racism and war — and a state that aggressively punishes dissent’. The entire article seems find any excuse to find a reason for his actions and fails to call him what he is - a cold blooded killer.

I’m not a big fan of Charles Blow but I think his NYT editorial is spot on
Don’t Mythologize Christopher Dorner

158 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:25:11am

re: #156 NJDhockeyfan

Right under the title it says ‘The ex-cop was a product of a society gone mad on racism and war — and a state that aggressively punishes dissent’. The entire article seems find any excuse to find a reason for his actions and fails to call him what he is - a cold blooded killer.

They also changed the title shortly after posting. Originally it was something like ” Dorner isn’t a Monster”

159 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:29:13am

re: #158 Killgore Trout

They also changed the title shortly after posting. Originally it was something like ” Dorner isn’t a Monster”

This whole thing has been a teaching moment for me.

160 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:30:13am

It’s interesting to see the Dorner Truthers hard at work early on a Saturday morning
New Details Emerge About Christopher Dorner’s Cache of Weapons

From the comments

Ads suck and those weapons were not found in the cabin so stop lying! The plastic isn’t even melted on any of them. Dorner had only a pistol in the end. Believe it.

161 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:31:16am

re: #157 Killgore Trout

I’m not a big fan of Charles Blow but I think his NYT editorial is spot on
Don’t Mythologize Christopher Dorner

This is spot on:

According to KTLA in Los Angeles, Dorner’s mother issued a statement that read in part: “It is with great sadness and heavy hearts that we express our deepest sympathies and condolences to anyone that suffered losses or injuries resulting from Christopher’s actions.” They said it continued: “We do not condone Christopher’s actions.”

That’s the right sentiment: condolences for the victims and condemnation of Dorner’s actions. Period.

162 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:31:29am

re: #159 Gus

This whole thing has been a teaching moment for me.

It’s frustrating to watch this happening, like a slow motion train wreck.

163 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:33:10am

re: #160 Killgore Trout

It’s interesting to see the Dorner Truthers hard at work early on a Saturday morning
New Details Emerge About Christopher Dorner’s Cache of Weapons

From the comments

I just noticed this from the article

Led by San Bernardino County Sheriff John McMahon, authorities showcased assault weapons, a sniper rifle, large caliber ammunition, smoke bombs, silencers, and even one rifle bearing the word ‘Vengeance,’ all allegedly belonging to Dorner.

Seems he had “incendiary devices” of his own.

164 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:35:02am

re: #162 Killgore Trout

It’s frustrating to watch this happening, like a slow motion train wreck.

Quite embarrassing at times. One of the reasons I remain an independent. Which of course some people would say that makes me a Republican, ergo the Taliban. //

165 Lidane  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:35:33am

re: #162 Killgore Trout

OMG! There are stupid people on the internet! Also, some people hate the LAPD so much they’ll buy into a conspiracy about them, even if that means sympathizing with a cowardly mass murderer!

We must thoroughly investigate these new revelations. There have never, ever been stupid people who let themselves be led by their biases. Someone alert the media.

166 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:36:50am

re: #165 Lidane

OMG! There are stupid people on the internet! Also, some people hate the LAPD so much they’ll buy into a conspiracy about them, even if that means sympathizing with a cowardly mass murderer!

We must thoroughly investigate these new revelations. There have never, ever been stupid people who let themselves be led by their biases. Someone alert the media.

You’re right. Back to Bryan Fischer who has about 3,000 followers on Twitter and is about to take over the universe. Nevermind the Karadžić fan either.

167 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:38:10am

re: #157 Killgore Trout

I’m not a big fan of Charles Blow but I think his NYT editorial is spot on
Don’t Mythologize Christopher Dorner

I am a big fan of Charles Blow. And the editorial is spot on.

Here’s my thing about Dorner vs LAPD. Dorner is absolutely the wrong person to illustrate the problems with the LAPD. For one thing, he was not right in the head. For another, he was all about self-interest: ‘clearing his name’, revenge, retribution. For another, he was part of the LAPD.

But there will never be a really great spokesperson for reform of the LAPD. Rodney King? He was a symbol, not much more. The victims of the LAPD are usually criminals and suspects, and often poor and poorly educated. They don’t pick on college professors and pundits. Somehow, the reform must happen anyway. I would hope for some leadership from Villaraigosa, but I don’t know if it will come, and he’s not going to be in that office much longer..

168 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:38:10am

re: #163 Killgore Trout

Yep. It’s always been entirely possible that he set the house on fire himself.

This has been really bizzare. It’s difficult to track from day to day what it is you’re outraged about. You seem to be conflating the bizzarro conspiracy theorists on the fringes with people who are saying that Dorner’s actions weren’t in a vacuum and it’d behoove us to understand the narrative, background, and choices he made that led to this.

That Salon article is something I disagree with more than I agree with, especially the section about saving Dorner’s life, but it doesn’t say it wasn’t his fault.

169 Lidane  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:39:38am

re: #166 Gus

You’re right. Back to Bryan Fischer who has about 3,000 followers on Twitter and is about to take over the universe. Nevermind the Karadžić fan either.

Fischer and the AFA have political influence in the Republican party.

When these drooling, gibbering retards that idolize Dorner find similar influence in politics, let me know.

170 Gus  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:40:37am

re: #169 Lidane

Fischer and the AFA have political influence in the Republican party.

When these drooling, gibbering retards that idolize Dorner find similar influence in politics, let me know.

OK, you’re right. I’ll shut up.

Later.

171 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:41:45am

re: #170 Gus

OK, you’re right. I’ll shut up.

Later.

I know you can carry on discourse without overreacting like that. But whatever.

172 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:41:46am

re: #166 Gus

You’re right. Back to Bryan Fischer who has about 3,000 followers on Twitter and is about to take over the universe. Nevermind the Karadžić fan either.

Gus, I can appreciate that you think that different topics should be highlighted and there should be more of an emphasis on other topics, but what are you actually trying to achieve? Do you think you’re going to convince Charles by stuff like this?

And you know that Bryan Fischer is one of the top guys at AFA, which had a revenue of $17,955,438 in 2011? He’s not some fringe nobody, he’s a spokesman for a very well-connected lobbying organization that is classified as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center.

173 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:43:05am

re: #135 NJDhockeyfan

What’s up with Salon? They are playing the victim card for Dorner.

Understanding Christopher Dorner

In other words its not his fault. Im sure the families of the people he murdered share a different view.

That’s not what the article says at all. I don’t agree with everything he says but it’s just false to try to paint this as an excuse for Dorner.

I guess some people have developed their own purity test over the Dorner case. When did it become a horrible left wing moonbat thing to try to understand the reasons for criminal behavior?

Go ahead, now, and accuse me of “sympathizing” with Dorner.

174 darthstar  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:45:41am

re: #162 Killgore Trout

It’s frustrating to watch this happening, like a slow motion train wreck.

It’s more like you’re slowing down traffic on the road so you can rubberneck while driving by a hitch hiker with a limp.

175 darthstar  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:47:02am

Mornin’ gang…speaking of drive-bys…I’m off to run the dogs before heading up to Tahoe for the weekend.

Play nice…

176 Lidane  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:47:44am

re: #170 Gus

I’m not telling anyone to shut up. I’m just not seeing the outrage.

Yes, there are stupid people on the internet. There will always be stupid people on Twitter, Facebook, and random news sites who express sympathy for assholes like Dorner. They will let their hatred of the LAPD cloud their perceptions and they will buy into whatever conspiracy makes the cops look the worst.

There are Breivik fans, and Tim McVeigh fans, and Charles Manson fans, for fuck’s sake. This isn’t new. The difference is one of influence. A few random moonbats and imbeciles saying they think Dorner was a hero are not a surprise. If a bunch of LA politicians were to suddenly start empathizing with Dorner, OTOH, that would be a problem.

177 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:53:55am

re: #170 Gus

OK, you’re right. I’ll shut up.

Later.

A very disappointing reaction.

178 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:54:29am

re: #176 Lidane

There also are people who are disaffected with the police because their only interactions with them are negative. The stop and frisk law here in New York, which is hugely targeted against young black men, may be successful in finding drugs and guns, but the vast majority of the stops produce nothing— except, of course, a moment of humiliation and shame for a young black man. Doing shit like that, doing the ‘infiltration’ of the mosques, all these things break the bond of trust between police and citizens.

I am not blaming the police as a whole for these tactics, and most of them are understandable if ill-advised. It is the political level that decides tactics like this, and it really is important to remember the average officer, detective, lieutenant has no influence on this shit and so criticizing them for it next to useless.

But things like this hurt the trust of the police— as does unloading on two pickups that bore a passing resemblance to Dorner’s, as does changing the story rapidly about what happened during one of those incidents. I don’t think it’s fair or right for people to stop trusting the police due to things like this, but it is going to happen. The relationship between police and citizens is a consensual one; police cannot police without the willing acceptance of the policed, and when that breaks down, it’s bad for everyone.

179 Interesting Times  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:57:26am

re: #171 wrenchwench

I know you can carry on discourse without overreacting like that. But whatever.

You know that “if you think you’re too drunk to post” rule? I think it should be amended to include too angry, too stressed, and in just plain too bad a mood. I’ve seen this pattern before with people going through crappy situations offline—best not to open yourself up like that to taking it out on others and saying things you’ll later regret.

180 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 8:58:49am

re: #179 Interesting Times

You know that “if you think you’re too drunk to post” rule? I think it should be amended to include too angry, too stressed, and in just plain too bad a mood. I’ve seen this pattern before with people going through crappy situations offline—best not to open yourself up like that to taking it out on others and saying things you’ll later regret.

At least he logs off fast. Some stay and keep digging.

181 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:00:34am

re: #141 Killgore Trout

I thought so too but others here seemed to think different. Go figure.

Passive-aggressive DARVO, nice.

182 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:04:34am

re: #178 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

There also are people who are disaffected with the police because their only interactions with them are negative. The stop and frisk law here in New York, which is hugely targeted against young black men, may be successful in finding drugs and guns, but the vast majority of the stops produce nothing— except, of course, a moment of humiliation and shame for a young black man. Doing shit like that, doing the ‘infiltration’ of the mosques, all these things break the bond of trust between police and citizens.

I am not blaming the police as a whole for these tactics, and most of them are understandable if ill-advised. It is the political level that decides tactics like this, and it really is important to remember the average officer, detective, lieutenant has no influence on this shit and so criticizing them for it next to useless.

But things like this hurt the trust of the police— as does unloading on two pickups that bore a passing resemblance to Dorner’s, as does changing the story rapidly about what happened during one of those incidents. I don’t think it’s fair or right for people to stop trusting the police due to things like this, but it is going to happen. The relationship between police and citizens is a consensual one; police cannot police without the willing acceptance of the policed, and when that breaks down, it’s bad for everyone.

Obdi, I’ve got a lot to say in reply, but I haven’t the time to write it at the moment. I’ll be back later today and we can discuss things then if you wish to do so.

BBL

183 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:10:41am

re: #182 Dark_Falcon

I’m showing my awesome 19 year old cousin around the city (when she wakes up, sleepyhead was at a concert until 3:30 AM) and probably won’t be around all that much. But maybe she’ll go shopping and I will be, because I don’t shop.

184 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:13:07am

One thing I agree with — I do see some people trying to shut down the conversation about Dorner and the police. They’re the ones who are mocking and making fun of everyone who discusses it, and refusing to differentiate between being critical of the police’s behavior and “supporting” or “making excuses” for Dorner.

185 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:13:22am

re: #173 Charles Johnson

That’s not what the article says at all. I don’t agree with everything he says but it’s just false to try to paint this as an excuse for Dorner.

I guess some people have developed their own purity test over the Dorner case. When did it become a horrible left wing moonbat thing to try to understand the reasons for criminal behavior?

Go ahead, now, and accuse me of “sympathizing” with Dorner.

All I see in that article are reasons they think are responsible for his actions other than calling him what he really is… a mass murderer. All murderer have their own reasons for killing innocent people. He did have some issues in his life that set him off but as far as I’m concerned at the end of the day he’s just another cold blooded killer.

186 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:14:40am

re: #135 NJDhockeyfan

Oh boy here we go. I’m waiting for the fucking pathetic Dorner OWS connection.

187 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:15:38am

re: #186 Kronocide

Oh boy here we go. I’m waiting for the fucking pathetic Dorner OWS connection.

I haven’t seen that one.

188 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:16:22am

re: #185 NJDhockeyfan

All I see in that article are reasons they think are responsible for his actions other than calling him what he really is… a mass murderer. All murderer have their own reasons for killing innocent people. He did have some issues in his life that set him off but as far as I’m concerned at the end of the day he’s just another cold blooded killer.

The article very specifically says that Dorner is a criminal and a murderer. Try reading.

189 makeitstop  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:16:57am

re: #185 NJDhockeyfan

All I see in that article are reasons they think are responsible for his actions other than calling him what he really is… a mass murderer. All murderer have their own reasons for killing innocent people. He did have some issues in his life that set him off but as far as I’m concerned at the end of the day he’s just another cold blooded killer.

And there isn’t a single person here who denies that that is what he was. None that I’ve seen, anyway.

This insistence that people here are ‘defending’ or ‘idolizing’ Dorner is getting extremely tiring. It’s OWS II. Kinda sucks.

190 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:18:20am

It may still be early in the year but I think we already have a strong contender for the “Worst Metaphor or Analogy of 2013” prize.

The weak, effeminate evolutionist bear has been caught by the creationist bear trap! If only he had the teeth of truth and claws of logic that creationists bears have! - - Evolution is a Liberal Lie

Creationist bears…that set bear traps…for “effeminate” evolutionist bears…what?

191 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:18:43am

re: #173 Charles Johnson

That’s not what the article says at all. I don’t agree with everything he says but it’s just false to try to paint this as an excuse for Dorner.

I guess some people have developed their own purity test over the Dorner case. When did it become a horrible left wing moonbat thing to try to understand the reasons for criminal behavior?

Go ahead, now, and accuse me of “sympathizing” with Dorner.

This is a common theme on the right, at least here, that any attempt on understanding the reasons behind deviant behaviour (as in deviates from what we accept as ‘normal’) is an effort to except the person from personal responsibility for those actions.

192 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:20:05am

re: #187 NJDhockeyfan

I haven’t seen that one.

That’s why I typed ‘I’m waiting.’ It’s very close.

193 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:25:15am

Same guy a little further down…

Come into my layer [sic] said the Creationist spider to the Darwinist fly!

Lol, no thanks, I think you should probably keep that “lair” of idiocy all to yourself.

194 dragonath  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:26:09am

Salon article re: #191 b_sharp

Yeah, I was thinking that too. Public conversation gets buried under an accusation that trying to understand his motives is excusing his actions.

How can you be, uh, such a monster.

Salon has an agenda, though, but I’d think that’d be pretty obvious when they’re sourcing their story from something called the “Jacobin” magazine.

195 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:26:40am

What the goddamned fuck was that?

196 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:26:50am

Quote from that horrible moonbat Salon article:

The initial response to the Dorner phenomena — like most phenomena involving madmen — has been to isolate it as an individual event, extrinsic to our society. Why does he hate us? Indeed, the presentation of most criminality is as something monstrous. This formulation ignores something crucial: it is impossible to arbitrarily separate some parts of our lives from the others. It is as foolish to presume that criminality is monstrous as it is to presume that the leg operates independently of the hip.

And so the Dorner incident, like all incidents involving madmen, requires us to consider the madness that structures life in America.

Baldwin’s midcentury injunction still holds today, absent the male normativity: we do need to take a hard look at ourselves. Why has Dorner attracted such support online, especially in communities of color? Why have two more LAPD officers, at great risk, come forward to address the free-flowing racism that characterizes their worklife? The questions we might ask will be fraught with peril, but there could be great positives: one of the key things that this experience has exposed is that a broader social consideration of what it means to live life ethically is gravely absent.

In Dorner’s case, the allegory of life to a furnace takes literal weight — he has died, consumed by fire. The police will celebrate, the chorus will quiet, the lives of his victims mourned. It is unlikely that the fire that burned away Dorner will burn away any illusion: this is unfortunate, and disturbing. His allegations will be dismissed as the rantings of a lunatic, things will return to normal. Until the fire, next time.

What he describes in that last paragraph is exactly what I see going on here.

197 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:27:37am

re: #192 Kronocide

That’s why I typed ‘I’m waiting.’ It’s very close.

I don’t any possible connection that could be used to mention OWS. He’s just a madman who lost it and went on a killing spree. Thank goodness the LAPD were able to stop him before he added any more victims to his list.

198 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:27:38am

re: #189 makeitstop

And there isn’t a single person here who denies that that is what he was. None that I’ve seen, anyway.

This insistence that people here are ‘defending’ or ‘idolizing’ Dorner is getting extremely tiring. It’s OWS II. Kinda sucks.

I disagree with the ‘kinda sucks.’ I say ‘is fucking pathetic and below a Lizard.’

You beat me to it pointing it out, it is OWS 2. Understanding the issues and sentiments of person/group means idolizing/making excuses for stabbing and raping. In Dorner’s case, taking some of the points of his screed about the LAPD is idolizing him and whatever else is wrong with ‘the Left.’ It’s a whole new Strawman to get worked up about.

199 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:28:10am

You folks who think the Salon article is just horribly bad support for Christopher Dorner had better not ever read a book by James Baldwin — your heads would explode.

200 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:28:26am

re: #154 NJDhockeyfan

What are the Ruskies up to?

Russian nuclear bombers intercepted near Guam

Um. If the Russians were going to dispatch aircraft with nuclear weapons on board they would not use Tu-95s. That plane is older than I am.

They’d probably use Tu-22Ms (Backfires) if they were going to perform a nuclear strike. That plane is capable of high Mach numbers so it could, possibly, strike before a response could be launched.

Probably the flight was a recon and response test. I’m sure our side does much the same thing.

I wish the media wouldn’t use such inflammatory headlines. The Bear is nuclear capable, yes, but that was fifty years ago. Today it is just a target. As the pilots of the maritime recon version would say, “We have sighted the enemy task force. Dosvidanya Rodina!

201 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:29:33am

re: #186 Kronocide

Oh boy here we go. I’m waiting for the fucking pathetic Dorner OWS connection.

Killgore already pulled that one in a previous thread.

202 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:30:38am

re: #201 Charles Johnson

Killgore already pulled that one in a previous thread.

shakes head, frowns disapprovingly with an eye roll

203 bratwurst  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:31:08am

re: #198 Kronocide

Understanding the issues and sentiments of person/group means idolizing/making excuses for stabbing and raping. In Dorner’s case, taking some of the points of his screed about the LAPD is idolizing him and whatever else is wrong with ‘the Left.’ It’s a whole new Strawman to get worked up about.

Maybe you can look forward to getting accused of these things BY NAME the way I did!

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

204 makeitstop  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:31:27am

re: #198 Kronocide

I disagree with the ‘kinda sucks.’ I say ‘is fucking pathetic and below a Lizard.’

I was low-keying it. Your description is much closer to the mark.

You beat me to it pointing it out, it is OWS 2. Understanding the issues and sentiments of person/group means idolizing/making excuses for stabbing and raping. In Dorner’s case, taking some of the points of his screed about the LAPD is idolizing him and whatever else is wrong with ‘the Left.’ It’s a whole new Strawman to get worked up about.

And no doubt, it’ll get flogged to death here over the next week or two. It’s the Contrarians’ new hobby horse.

205 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:32:36am

re: #203 bratwurst

Whoa! Missed that one.

206 Shvaughn  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:33:08am

re: #186 Kronocide

Oh boy here we go. I’m waiting for the fucking pathetic Dorner OWS connection.

Wait no further! That was Trout’s Valentine’s Day gift to us all.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

207 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:33:16am

re: #196 Charles Johnson

Notice that in the quote I pulled from the Salon article, he refers to Dorner as a “criminal” and a “madman.”

Right, he totally supports Dorner.

This is really getting on my nerves this morning.

208 bratwurst  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:34:26am

re: #205 Kronocide

Whoa! Missed that one.

I missed the apology.

209 Shvaughn  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:35:01am

re: #207 Charles Johnson

Notice that in the quote I pulled from the Salon article, he refers to Dorner as a “criminal” and a “madman.”

Right, he totally supports Dorner.

This is really getting on my nerves this morning.

But but but it doesn’t say [arbitrarily chosen purity test term], therefore they support his actions!!

/

210 gwangung  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:35:59am

re: #197 NJDhockeyfan

I don’t any possible connection that could be used to mention OWS. He’s just a madman who lost it and went on a killing spree.

No, he isn’t.

He’s a madman who worked off of specific abuses by the LAPD that other people shared. But you don’t have to be a madman to be pissed off by those LAPD actions.

You keep ignoring the LAPD abuses, and that has the effect of legitimizing those abuses.

211 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:36:09am

re: #195 chadu

What the goddamned fuck was that?

Meteor?

212 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:37:04am

re: #202 Kronocide

shakes head, frowns disapprovingly with an eye roll

You should have an ophthalmologist check that out!

213 makeitstop  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:37:16am

re: #208 bratwurst

I missed the apology.

Never happen. Contrarians Libertarians Classical Liberals never apologize. They just move on to the next thing to act detached and superior about.

/ half

214 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:37:35am

I don’t suspect the policy of any police force was to kill Dorner by lighting the building on fire. However, cops there (maybe of multiple jurisdictions) probably called for the ‘burner’ hoping it would flush him out and, if it burnt him to a crisp, oh well. Not making excuses despite the training and professionalism, I’m sure they were jacked up and hoping to put an end to the whole deal.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with questioning and criticizing the deployment of ‘burners’ or asking if it really is a policy, and if so, changing it. With no hostages, it’s reasonable to question a waiting posture as the cabin was surrounded. In that case, time was on the side of the cops.

There is no question the dude is deranged and was a major threat. But we have due process. Whether we want it or not, we have it.

215 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:38:48am

re: #203 bratwurst

Maybe you can look forward to getting accused of these things BY NAME the way I did!

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

Wow, that was really a shitty thing to say.

216 Mattand  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:39:10am

Just dropped in to see what was going on. So apparently, Salon thinks Chris Dorner is Jesus and it’s OWS’s fault. Or something.

LOL, I should probably read the article first.

218 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:39:40am

re: #187 NJDhockeyfan

I haven’t seen that one.

Have you seen it now?

219 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:39:45am

re: #216 Mattand

Just dropped in to see what was going on. So apparently, Salon thinks Chris Dorner is Jesus and it’s OWS’s fault. Or something.

LOL, I should probably read the article first.

Why? That doesn’t seem to have stopped anyone else from expressing an opinion about it.

220 Mattand  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:40:44am

re: #217 Killgore Trout

Dorner death protest planned for Los Angeles today

More here: Nationwide protests Saturday, 2/16, in response to murder of Chris Dorner

I’m sure the total nationwide turnout will be in the high three figure range.

221 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:40:48am

re: #210 gwangung

No, he isn’t.

He’s a madman who worked off of specific abuses by the LAPD that other people shared.

You keep ignoring the LAPD abuses, and that ha the effect of legitimizing them.

Abuses by the LAPD are wrong. They certainly have a lot of cleaning up to do to weed out and get rid of the assholes.

222 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:41:07am

re: #216 Mattand

Just dropped in to see what was going on. So apparently, Salon thinks Chris Dorner is Jesus and it’s OWS’s fault. Or something.

LOL, I should probably read the article first.

THREAD WINNER.

223 Killgore Trout  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:42:56am

re: #220 Mattand

I’m sure the total nationwide turnout will be in the high three figure range.

I still think that’s a high estimate. Maybe a couple dozen in LA or new york. The smaller cities will be lucky to get 8 idiots to show up.

224 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:43:59am

re: #217 Killgore Trout

First comment for the Reddit post:

I’m coming out to the NYC. I assure you, nobody is going to be there with a big Chris Dorner banner. It’s about the system that broke him.

I know, it’s a difficult thing to understand. Easier to accuse everyone of being a stupid moonbat.

225 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:46:22am

re: #217 Killgore Trout

Right on time. The OWS connection next post?

226 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:46:43am

re: #211 wrenchwench

Atmospherium?

(Just got a new DVD of LOST SKELETON OF CADAVRA; my ex took it in the divorce.)

227 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:46:48am

re: #199 Charles Johnson

You folks who think the Salon article is just horribly bad support for Christopher Dorner had better not ever read a book by James Baldwin — your heads would explode.

There is a group out there that dismisses psychological research as nothing more than fanciful nonsense, shown to be false by common sense and traditional views. That most of the research tells us our common sense is frequently wrong, especially when used to assume reasons for our actions makes it all the more difficult to accept.

The only conclusion that can be made by those invested in their own beliefs is that psychology, represented by some generic liberal plan to blame parents, society, circumstances, whatever can be blamed other than the human being considered is done to shift blame. That we do the research, not to assign blame, but to find ways of recognizing the mental pathways to specific actions in order to minimize deviant behaviour doesn’t enter their thought.

They tend to rely on punishment as a deterrent where liberals look to correcting fundamental causes as a method to prevent behaviours.

228 Shvaughn  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:47:40am

re: #217 Killgore Trout

Dorner death protest planned for Los Angeles today

Is there any other reporting on that story than the one you cited here?

229 bratwurst  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:48:13am

re: #215 Charles Johnson

Wow, that was really a shitty thing to say.

Thanks again to Killgore for saying it and NJDhf, satt, Big Steve and Floral for updinging it!

230 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:48:29am

re: #224 Charles Johnson

First comment for the Reddit post:

I know, it’s a difficult thing to understand. Easier to accuse everyone of being a stupid moonbat.

Not everyone. But too many (imho)

A little further down

I think that is a terrible name for a group

(We Stand With Christopher Dorner)

Regardless, it has thousands of followers

231 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:49:17am

re: #227 b_sharp

There are people born stupid, and some who are willfully stupid.

Do you agree?

232 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:50:20am

re: #231 chadu

There are people born stupid, and some who are willfully stupid.

Do you agree?

What does that mean??
/

233 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:50:37am

re: #230 sattv4u2

The statement on the Facebook page:

The aberration of justice that was the way the LAPD and SBPD handled the situation regarding Christopher Dorner is indicative of a widespread culture of corruption. The toxic attitude of shoot-first-don’t-ask-questions, of valuing the lives of police over civilians, and cops protecting cops from any scrutiny. We stand with Christopher Dorner, not in anger, not in defense of the mistakes he made or the violent retribution he carried out, but in solidarity against injustices that harm all of us. See you soon.

Hey, what do you know! They’re not actually defending Dorner’s violence.

Don’t let that stop you.

234 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:51:02am

re: #226 chadu

Atmospherium?

(Just got a new DVD of LOST SKELETON OF CADAVRA; my ex took it in the divorce.)

Had to look it up.

I can see why she took it!

235 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:52:50am

re: #214 Kronocide

While the cops are tied up there, they can’t be other places. Just waiting around for a guy who’s killed four people already to decide he’s had enough, or to line up a shot, or come up with some sort of plan, doesn’t seem wise to me. The use of tear gas to get him out seems completely fine to me. I hadn’t known that tear gas grenades can start fires, but fires are not some instantly lethal thing; you can get the fuck out of a fire.

236 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:53:25am

It’s entirely plausible that despite Dorner’s craziness the LAPD does actually have problems. We cannot get away from the reality that he killed 4 people and created terror and havoc in a major metropolitan region. But we cannot get away from the potential that Dorner pointed out some real issues with the LAPD. It may have been sour grapes, or it may not have been.

237 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:56:13am

re: #231 chadu

There are people born stupid, and some who are willfully stupid.

Do you agree?

What do you mean by stupid?

Both liberal and conservative beliefs are valid strategies in different situations. It’s just that with current population sizes and modern technology, parts of the conservative belief system have become maladaptive.

238 blueraven  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:56:17am

re: #235 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

While the cops are tied up there, they can’t be other places. Just waiting around for a guy who’s killed four people already to decide he’s had enough, or to line up a shot, or come up with some sort of plan, doesn’t seem wise to me. The use of tear gas to get him out seems completely fine to me. I hadn’t known that tear gas grenades can start fires, but fires are not some instantly lethal thing; you can get the fuck out of a fire.

Agree, some are saying he had a choice of suicide, or burning. He also had a third choice to leave the cabin, hands up, white flag surrender.
He made his choice and I have no sympathy whatsoever for him.

However, this whole case deserves some examination and discussion

239 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:57:02am

re: #232 sattv4u2

Let me expand: Some folks don’t have the brainpower to grasp reasonable choices; others do, but refuse for some reason.

240 Kronocide  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:57:54am

re: #235 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Yeah, well, I’m keyboard quarterbacking. Waiting him out may not have been the best solution by people in the know on the ground but it seemed a valid plan.

241 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:58:26am

bbl

242 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:58:33am

re: #233 Charles Johnson

The phrase ‘we stand with Christopher Dorner’ is still a bad one to use and is only going to confuse the issue.

243 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 9:59:56am

re: #242 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

The phrase ‘we stand with Christopher Dorner’ is still a bad one to use and is only going to confuse the issue.

As is allowing Anonymous to latch on (from the “we Stand With,, Facebook Page)

244 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:03:38am

re: #242 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

The phrase ‘we stand with Christopher Dorner’ is still a bad one to use and is only going to confuse the issue.

I agree, but it’s just flat wrong to say they’re supporting Dorner, regardless of the name. They’re very clear on that.

245 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:09:38am

re: #238 blueraven

Agree, some are saying he had a choice of suicide, or burning. He also had a third choice to leave the cabin, hands up, white flag surrender.
He made his choice and I have no sympathy whatsoever for him.

However, this whole case deserves some examination and discussion

I’ve said very clearly more than once now that I have no sympathy for Dorner, either. His own murderous choices led him to that cabin.

And I’ll bet that most of the people being accused of “supporting” Dorner feel the same way. Yes, there are a few idiots who’ve made him into a hero in their own minds — a tiny, tiny, minority on the far fringe.

246 lawhawk  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:10:55am

Sweet jeebus. Scientists are raising the estimates on the size of the meteoroid and the potential energy from hurtling through the skies over Russia.

The new estimates, based on additional readings from a sensor network built to detect nuclear blasts, suggest the meteor released the energy equivalent of nearly 500 kilotons of TNT. That’s about 30 times the power of the Hiroshima atomic bomb.

Experts have been assessing the level of the meteor explosion using a network of infrasound sensors that were set up under the terms of the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty to check for changes in atmospheric pressure caused by nuclear blasts. “These new estimates were generated using new data that had been collected by five additional infrasound stations located around the world — the first recording of the event being in Alaska, over 6,500 kilometers away from Chelyabinsk,” NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory said in a statement.

NASA now says the Chelyabinsk object must have been about 55 feet wide (17 meters wide) with a mass of 10,000 tons before it entered Earth’s atmosphere.

“We would expect an event of this magnitude to occur once every 100 years on average,”Paul Chodas of NASA’s Near-Earth Object Program Office said in the statement. “When you have a fireball of this size, we would expect a large number of meteorites to reach the surface, and in this case there were probably some large ones.”

Searchers have been focusing on a frozen lake about 50 miles (80 kilometers) west of Chelyabinsk, where they suspect meteorite fragments made a 20-foot-wide (6-meter-wide) hole in the ice. Divers explored the bottom of the lake on Saturday but have found nothing so far, according to Russian news reports.

247 makeitstop  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:10:56am

re: #245 Charles Johnson

I’ve said very clearly more than once now that I have no sympathy for Dorner, either. His own murderous choices led him to that cabin.

And I’ll bet that most of the people being accused of “supporting” Dorner feel the same way. Yes, there are a few idiots who’ve made him into a hero in their own minds — a tiny, tiny, minority on the far fringe.

And as far as I’ve seen, none here at LGF. That’s what sticks in my craw about this. Like I said, OWS II.

248 dragonath  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:13:23am

re: #242 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Using that phrase is going to hurt them. How hard would it be for them to say “we stand against the abuses of the LAPD which resulted in etc.” because they sure weren’t (and aren’t) going to benefit by “standing” with him.

249 Mattand  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:14:27am

Just read the article; twice, actually, to make sure I didn’t miss something.

I can see why it’s yanking people’s chains. It’s not heavy on “OMFG, what a horrible monster!” Taking that tone, it’s easy to see how people would think it skirts the edge of almost absolving Dorner for his actions.

I think the big problem is that the article brings up the question of “Why did he do this?”, which is hard to discuss without engaging the LAPD’s abysmal race relations record. This is even more uncomfortable given the murder victims were either cops or innocent people.

Dorner was a cold-blooded murderer, pure and simple. I’m sorry that he chose the path he did, given the destruction of people’s lives and families it caused. However, it’s brought to the forefront a cripplingly divisive issue in the nation’s second largest police force. That needs to be addressed.

250 makeitstop  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:15:00am

re: #248 dragonath

Using that phrase is going to hurt them. How hard would it be for them to say “we stand against the abuses of the LAPD which resulted in etc.” because they sure weren’t (and aren’t) going to benefit by “standing” with him.

That would be a little unwieldly on a bumper sticker. But I get your point.

251 blueraven  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:15:12am

re: #245 Charles Johnson

I’ve said very clearly more than once now that I have no sympathy for Dorner, either. His own murderous choices led him to that cabin.

And I’ll bet that most of the people being accused of “supporting” Dorner feel the same way. Yes, there are a few idiots who’ve made him into a hero in their own minds — a tiny, tiny, minority on the far fringe.

Yes, and we see that often. Usually in a historical context. Look at Bonnie and Clyde…they have been made out as folk heroes, even though they killed many cops and innocent people. The bad guy is the one who blew the whistle.
But even at the time, there were people rooting for them. Why? It was in the middle of the depression when social ills were rampant.

252 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:15:13am

re: #249 Mattand

Just read the article; twice, actually, to make sure I didn’t miss something.

I can see why it’s yanking people’s chains. It’s not heavy on “OMFG, what a horrible monster!” Taking that tone, it’s easy to see how people would think it skirts the edge of almost absolving Dorner for his actions.

I think the big problem is that the article brings up the question of “Why did he do this?”, which is hard to discuss without engaging the LAPD’s abysmal race on relations record. This is even more uncomfortable given the murder victims were either cops or innocent people.

Dorner was a cold-blooded murderer, pure and simple. I’m sorry that he chose the path he did, given the destruction of people’s lives and families it caused. However, it’s brought to the forefront a cripplingly divisive issue in the nation’s second largest police force. That needs to be addressed.

Why do you support Dorner?

/

253 Mattand  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:18:16am

re: #252 Charles Johnson

Why do you support Dorner?

/

LOL, it took me half-an-hour and 2 drafts to write that and 5 minutes to decide whether I should even post it. And the whole time I’m thinking “Someone will accuse me of siding with Dorner!”

And so we’re all clear, I saw Charles’s sarc tag.

254 Charles Johnson  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:18:56am

re: #248 dragonath

Using that phrase is going to hurt them. How hard would it be for them to say “we stand against the abuses of the LAPD which resulted in etc.” because they sure weren’t (and aren’t) going to benefit by “standing” with him.

Naming things is hard, but I agree, it’s a poor choice - because it lets people smear them as “supporting a murderer” when their statement of purpose makes it clear that they’re not.

255 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:26:07am

I’m still mildly upset that few people want to resurrect TR as a zombie.

I have 3 different methods to try this: Voodoo, Freemason, and Illuminati. Fully researched. Very scientific. I even have a chunk of atmospherium.

C’mon, Lizards! Zombie TR is all upside with no downside!

256 makeitstop  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:27:20am

re: #255 chadu

I’m still mildly upset that few people want to resurrect TR as a zombie.

Todd Rundgren?

257 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:28:56am

re: #255 chadu

I’m still mildly upset that few people want to resurrect TR as a zombie

Teddy Roosevelt?

258 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:30:13am

re: #256 makeitstop

we were born in different era’s, huh!!
//

259 wrenchwench  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:30:15am
260 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:30:25am

re: #256 makeitstop

Todd Rundgren?

Theodore Roosevelt!

Though, Todd Rundgren… Wait he’s still alive, right? The zombie-fication would be weird there.

Still worthy of considering…

261 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:30:45am

re: #260 chadu

Theodore Roosevelt!

Though, Todd Rundgren… Wait he’s still alive, right? The zombie-fication would be weird there.

Still worthy of considering…

I WIN!!!!!!!

262 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:32:07am

re: #261 sattv4u2

INDEED! (/lo-pan)

263 b_sharp  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:33:11am

re: #261 sattv4u2

I WIN!!!!!!!

What?

264 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:36:49am

re: #263 b_sharp

What?

I’ll have to call and ask Charlie Sheen!

265 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:36:49am

re: #244 Charles Johnson

In a weird way, it reminds me of the aftermath of Mai Lai, though in a much more subdued way. There was a lot amount of support for the troops that committed the massacre there, not by people excusing the massacre but by people who believed that the context it occurred in mattered, that these weren’t just guys walking down the street and deciding to flip out. They are fully culpable, they are mass murderers, and that only one was ever charged is a travesty, but it’s important to understand the context of the war and the way we were fighting it and the background it had for the soldiers that committed the atrocity. Treating the story as though they just flipped out one day is useless.

The Salon article to me makes the opposite mistake— by using language like ‘product of a society’, it kind of seems to be deterministic. I get what the article is doing, but I disagree with it. It gets close to saying this was inevitable for Dorner, whereas I think the more relevant thing to say is that one of the side effects of corruption and racism is that it can add insults and injury and drive people nuts. One of the reasons that I object to this in the article is that it’s entirely possible that Dorner was in the wrong in everything, not just his last act, that he was the problem the entire time, but at the very least we have the problem that Dorner was LAPD. They fired him, but does their responsibility end there? If the worse about Dorner is true, if he was a dangerous lunatic, then isn’t there some way they could have channeled him into psychiatric help instead of just flat-out firing him?

266 Dr Lizardo  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:37:33am

re: #246 lawhawk

Sweet jeebus. Scientists are raising the estimates on the size of the meteoroid and the potential energy from hurtling through the skies over Russia.

A once-in-a-lifetime event. 500 kilotons is nothing to sneeze at; that’s a city-killer.

267 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:38:18am

Just thinking/imagining about TR running thru the current Congress.

He wouldn’t touch or be anything but polite to Pelosi.

He would yell at Reid.

He’d beat the hell out of Boehner, Cantor, and McConnell. He’d break them. Just with fists.

TR meeting Obama is a million fan-fics waiting to happen. About half of the Obama-Lincoln meetings.

268 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:40:11am

BTW, Thomas Jefferson was a dick.

269 Funky_Gibbon  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:46:13am

I take it that these Republicans think that Obama is in to Cthulu-worshipping or something?

I for one welcome our new tentacled Overlord.

270 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:48:53am

re: #254 Charles Johnson

Naming things is hard, but I agree, it’s a poor choice - because it lets people smear them as “supporting a murderer” when their statement of purpose makes it clear that they’re not.

And there’s no shortage of worthy people fighting battles with LAPD. This has nationwide attention, but it’s going to be forgotten quickly— as the Salon article says. But the real work on reform isn’t done in response to stuff like this and it’s not done in a flashy, newsworthy way, it’s boring, mundane improvements to oversight, governance, hiring policies, etc. It’s politics.

271 sattv4u2  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:50:36am

Hitting the hay

BBL

272 makeitstop  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:50:58am

re: #258 sattv4u2

we were born in different era’s, huh!!
//

Actually, probably the same. I’m just playing to the Todd R. love shown here at LGF. That, and I grew up in Philly and he was one of my early guitar heroes.

273 makeitstop  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:52:21am

re: #260 chadu

Theodore Roosevelt!

Though, Todd Rundgren… Wait he’s still alive, right? The zombie-fication would be weird there.

Still worthy of considering…

I saw him one night at Iridium in NYC where he was pretty zombified.

My fault for going to the late show.

274 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 10:57:14am

re: #273 makeitstop

Zombie TR is pretty badass at doing the Hustle.

Wouldn’t have thought Teddy would be into disco. WEIRD.

275 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 11:09:24am

How is it today?

276 chadu  Sat, Feb 16, 2013 11:18:07am

Come over to my other thread and be silly.


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