The Ultimate Earworm: Jazz That Nobody Asked For

Jazz isn’t dead - it’s unkillable
Arts • Views: 40,732

A short film by Benny Box

Sometimes a song can get stuck in your mind. Become a little piece of unwanted music, that keeps looping for the rest of your day.

Neurologist claim that stuck songs are like thoughts we’re trying to suppress. The harder we try not to think about them, the more we can’t help it. The phenomenon is also known as earworms, and the ongoing ‘dim di da da dum’ causes a kind of brain itch you can’t scratch.

Jazz that nobody asked for is an ode to all those unwanted songs out there, that has nowhere to go. The music that haunts this film, is the amazing swing jazz tune ‘Quaker City Jazz’ by the long forgotten ‘Jan Savitt and his Top Hatters’. In 1937 they were the first jazz big band to feature an african american vocalist.

The film is made without any financing, and has no commercial purpose. The love of all things animated has been the driving force for the small team of 3 persons that has created it.

thejazzmovie.com

Credits

Directors: Rune Fisker & Esben Fisker
Idea: Rune Fisker & Esben Fisker
Storyboard: Rune Fisker
Animatic: Rune Fisker
Character design: Rune Fisker
Background design: Esben Fisker
Animation: Pawel Binczycki, Rune Fisker, Esben Fisker
Compositing: Rune Fisker, Esben Fisker, Pawel Binczycki
Sound design: Pawel Binczycki
Music: ‘Quaker City Jazz’ by Jan Savitt and his Top Hatters ‘Intro’ by Balkan Balagan
Produced by Benny Box

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311 comments
1 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 12:45:54pm

This video is hilarious! I loled my a o.

2 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 12:47:03pm

The moral of the story: don’t open dangorous boxes.

3 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 12:58:45pm

well, the band is tight as a tick!

4 bronxboy47  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:06:54pm

I’m not a grammar Nazi, but stuff like this is inexcusable:
“Songs that has nowhere to go…” Chalk on chalkboard! Doesn’t anyone check their copy anymore?

5 b_sharp  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:08:05pm

re: #4 bronxboy47

I’m not a grammar Nazi, but stuff like this is inexcusable:
“Songs that has nowhere to go…” Chalk on chalkboard! Doesn’t anyone check their copy anymore?

You has a problem with that?

LOLCat hater.

6 Varek Raith  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:13:09pm

re: #4 bronxboy47

I’m not a grammar Nazi, but stuff like this is inexcusable:
“Songs that has nowhere to go…” Chalk on chalkboard! Doesn’t anyone check their copy anymore?

I can haz speelchek?
;)

7 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:14:02pm

I think the filmmakers are Danish, actually.

8 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:16:02pm

re: #7 Charles Johnson

I think the filmmakers are Danish, actually.

Well, that makes the reply to the error easier:

SPEAK ENGLISH, YOU GODDAMNED SOCIALISTIC FURRENERS!!!11

9 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:16:42pm

re: #4 bronxboy47

I’m not a grammar Nazi, but stuff like this is inexcusable:
“Songs that has nowhere to go…” Chalk on chalkboard! Doesn’t anyone check their copy anymore?

I’m no cliche nazi, but isn’t it ‘fingernails on chalkboard’?

10 bronxboy47  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:17:54pm

If English is not the author’s mother tongue, I do apologize for going ballistic. Lord knows my German grammar would never pass muster.

11 b_sharp  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:18:46pm

re: #9 wrenchwench

I’m no cliche nazi, but isn’t it ‘fingernails on chalkboard’?

In your case ’ 12mm wrench on chalkboard.’

12 b_sharp  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:19:27pm

re: #10 bronxboy47

If English is not the author’s mother tongue, I do apologize for going ballistic. Lord knows my German grammar would never pass muster.

We were just teasing you. We do that you know.

13 bronxboy47  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:20:17pm

I don’t don’t deal in cliches, just memories of what drove me crazy in high school. Why would anyone run his fingernails across a chalkboard?

14 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:20:21pm

Notice at the end, God is sitting on a cloud reading a book titled “Hello Sailor.”

15 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:20:27pm

G-roovy Daddio

16 Varek Raith  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:20:31pm

re: #12 b_sharp

We we just teasing you. We do that you know.

Image: Beavis-Butthead-p21.jpg
You said ‘we we’.

17 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:24:05pm

re: #13 bronxboy47

I don’t don’t deal in cliches, just memories of what drove me crazy in high school. Why would anyone run his fingernails across a chalkboard?

To drive people crazy. You were easy, I guess. How do you feel about squeaky pens on a whiteboard?

18 b_sharp  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:27:02pm

re: #16 Varek Raith

Image: Beavis-Butthead-p21.jpg
You said ‘we we’.

I deny all weweishness.

19 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:31:29pm

re: #4 bronxboy47

I’m not a grammar Nazi, but stuff like this is inexcusable:
“Songs that has nowhere to go…” Chalk on chalkboard! Doesn’t anyone check their copy anymore?

Not to mention “Neurologist claim”. Although, now that I come to think of it, I just did mention it.

20 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:36:51pm

real danish swing: svend asmussen

pretty kuhl!

21 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:41:58pm

svend asmussen: hallelujah, i’m a bum

really svings, ja!

22 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:43:24pm

Where is everyone today?

24 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:49:44pm

re: #23 Charles Johnson

Somewhere an emptywheel Is Missing Its Hamster: New Frontiers in Obama Derangement Syndrome | Angry Black Lady Chronicles

25 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:54:11pm

re: #23 Charles Johnson

Somewhere an emptywheel Is Missing Its Hamster: New Frontiers in Obama Derangement Syndrome | Angry Black Lady Chronicles

Brennan Sworn In On Draft Copy Of Constitution Without the 13th Amendment!!

26 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 1:59:35pm
27 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:02:08pm

re: #25 Gus

Brennan Sworn In On Draft Copy Of Constitution Without the 13th Amendment!!

But that just makes him a wingnut who wants to own slaves!

/Two can play this game, and have fun doing it.

28 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:13:58pm
29 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:22:37pm

re: #22 Eclectic Cyborg

I am okay but those wingers have gone off the end again. Brennan has to be sworn in on a “holy book.” Gus and other members of LGF have proven and will continue to prove otherwise.

30 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:24:26pm

re: #27 Dark_Falcon

But that just makes him a wingnut who wants to own slaves!

/Two can play this game, and have fun doing it.

I don’t want to be an asshole but John Brennan took an oath of office on a constitution without the 13th Amendment. Could this mean he will bring back slavery?

//

31 jaunte  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:26:00pm

With Obama in attendance but media excluded, Brennan took the oath from Biden in the Roosevelt Room. Rather than swearing on a Bible, Brennan placed his hand on an original copy of the Constitution from 1787 that had George Washington’s handwriting and annotations on it. He told Obama he requested the document from the archives because he wanted to reaffirm his commitment to the rule of law, an administration official said.

You see? A draft from 1787? You know what the Constitution didn’t contain when it was drafted, right? Any amendments! No Bill of Rights was positioned under Brennan’s cloven hoof! Why do John Brennan and President Obama HATE THE BILL OF RIGHTS??!1!?
[Link: angryblackladychronicles.com…]

Why did ‘founder in name only’ George Washington hate the Bill of Rights?

32 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:26:02pm

re: #30 Gus

I don’t want to be an asshole but John Brennan took an oath of office on a constitution without the 13th Amendment. Could this mean he will bring back slavery?

//

From Emptywheel…

I really don’t mean to be an asshole about this. But these vows always carry a great deal of symbolism. And whether he meant to invoke this symbolism or not, the moment at which Brennan took over the CIA happened to exclude (in symbolic form, though presumably not legally) the key limits on governmental power that protect American citizens.

33 EPR-radar  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:27:09pm

re: #30 Gus

I don’t want to be an asshole but John Brennan took an oath of office on a constitution without the 13th Amendment. Could this mean he will bring back slavery?

//

But the 16th and 17th amendments are also missing, so shouldn’t wingnuts be overjoyed?

34 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:27:41pm

re: #33 EPR-radar

But the 16th and 17th amendments are also missing, so shouldn’t wingnuts be overjoyed?

Ha! Was just thinking that about 5 minutes ago.

35 Killgore Trout  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:28:39pm

US Drones bombing Africa operated from RAF bases in the heart of the Lincolnshire countryside

An RAF base in Britain is being used by America in its controversial drone warfare campaign, it was claimed last night.

Documents seen by The Mail on Sunday reveal that the United States has established a drone ‘operations centre’ in the heart of the Lincolnshire countryside which could be used to co-ordinate attacks in the Middle East and Africa.

Last night, the revelation sparked claims of British complicity in the US Airforce (USAF) assassination programme which is being investigated by the United Nations.
….
Politicians and human rights groups have demanded to know the extent of America’s use of British bases to support its operations.

Clive Stafford Smith, the head of legal charity Reprieve, said: ‘The US drones programme operates from secret bases without regard to law.

‘The evidence that UK bases, subject to RAF oversight, are supporting US drones appears to implicate the UK in terrorisation and destruction.’

Professor Noel Sharkey, of the University of Sheffield and Britain’s foremost expert on drones, said the documents demanded an explanation from the UK and US military.

36 jaunte  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:29:17pm

Derp nuance.

37 EPR-radar  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:31:49pm

re: #34 Gus

Ha! Was just thinking that about 5 minutes ago.

I can see why the 16th amendment would be a wingnut target, since that is the income tax amendment.

But why on earth do they whine about the 17th amendment (direct election of Senators)? Is it really as simple as the fact that the 17th is viewed as a progressive amendment, and all things liberal/progressive are anathema to the RWNJs?

38 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:32:15pm
39 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:33:18pm

re: #37 EPR-radar

I can see why the 16th amendment would be a wingnut target, since that is the income tax amendment.

But why on earth do they whine about the 17th amendment (direct election of Senators)? Is it really as simple as the fact that the 17th is viewed as a progressive amendment, and all things liberal/progressive are anathema to the RWNJs?

Got me. They’re always going back and forth on things. Like when they loved the idea of amendment that would allow Reagan a third term.

40 Kragar (Antichrist )  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:33:28pm

The bad news: I was hoping to make several hundred bucks today, I made $60.

The “good” news: No one else at the swap meet was making any money either, so I don’t feel that bad.

Still, depressing.

41 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:34:17pm

re: #36 jaunte

Derp nuance.

I’m reading some of this exchange now. Really doesn’t make sense.

42 jaunte  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:36:02pm

re: #41 Gus

If the facts don’t support a wild speculation, symbolism can be twisted to fit the occasion.

43 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:38:24pm

re: #37 EPR-radar

I can see why the 16th amendment would be a wingnut target, since that is the income tax amendment.

But why on earth do they whine about the 17th amendment (direct election of Senators)? Is it really as simple as the fact that the 17th is viewed as a progressive amendment, and all things liberal/progressive are anathema to the RWNJs?

No, its more a belief that the 17th Amendment ended an important power the state governments had over the federal government. It’s a ‘State’s Rights’ issue.

44 Destro  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:38:48pm

Jazz did not die. It became heavy metal:

[Link: www.allaboutjazz.com…]

Bill Ward: From Jazz to Black Sabbath

45 Kragar (Antichrist )  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:39:24pm

re: #43 Dark_Falcon

No, its more a belief that the 17th Amendment ended an important power the state governments had over the federal government. It’s a ‘State’s Rights’ issue.

In other words, utter and complete horseshit.

46 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:40:21pm

re: #40 Kragar (Antichrist )

The bad news: I was hoping to make several hundred bucks today, I made $60.

The “good” news: No one else at the swap meet was making any money either, so I don’t feel that bad.

Still, depressing.

I feel you. I’ve been trying to make some extra money selling this and that on Craigslist. Either my items don’t sell at all or I get ridiculous lowball offers. I did however manage to sell a flatscreen monitor for $40 a couple of weeks ago, so I am having some success.

47 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:40:45pm

re: #44 Destro

Jazz did not die. It became heavy metal:

And suddenly I wonder what Heavy Jazz might sound like…

48 Varek Raith  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:43:59pm

It took me weeks to get my PCs surround sound to be perfect.
A single driver update wiped it out.
Dammit.

49 b_sharp  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:44:03pm

re: #47 Eclectic Cyborg

And suddenly I wonder what Heavy Jazz might sound like…

John McLaughlin

50 EPR-radar  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:44:59pm

re: #43 Dark_Falcon

No, its more a belief that the 17th Amendment ended an important power the state governments had over the federal government. It’s a ‘State’s Rights’ issue.

States rights has been invoked to support slavery in the nineteenth century and to support Jim Crow in the twentieth century. I am not aware of any other substantive use of this doctrine in US history, so I view it with extreme hostility and skepticism.

If the 17th amendment were repealed, I can’t imagine the voters in any state, red or blue, being happy about the state legislatures picking their Senators.

51 Destro  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:46:55pm

re: #47 Eclectic Cyborg

And suddenly I wonder what Heavy Jazz might sound like…

Just listen to the first Black Sabbath albums.


or Jazz Quartet Tribute to Black Sabbath - Paranoid

52 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:47:23pm

re: #50 EPR-radar

States rights has been invoked to support slavery in the nineteenth century and to support Jim Crow in the twentieth century. I am not aware of any other substantive use of this doctrine in US history, so I view it with extreme hostility and skepticism.

If the 17th amendment were repealed, I can’t imagine the voters in any state, red or blue, being happy about the state legislatures picking their Senators.

And immigration discrimination and the erosion of Women’s health protections in the twenty first century.

53 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:47:38pm

re: #44 Destro

Jazz did not die. It became heavy metal:

hah!

not!

54 Varek Raith  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:48:49pm

Whenever I hear someone say ‘State’s Rights’, I ask, “…To do what?”

55 EPR-radar  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:50:14pm

re: #52 Eclectic Cyborg

And immigration discrimination and the erosion of Women’s health protections in the twenty first century.

Good points. I’ll have to add them to the canonical list of evils that ‘states rights’ arguments are brought out to support.

In fairness, there is a legitimate states rights argument against the federalized drug war, but it doesn’t have a very high profile or much success yet.

56 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:51:58pm

re: #50 EPR-radar

States rights has been invoked to support slavery in the nineteenth century and to support Jim Crow in the twentieth century. I am not aware of any other substantive use of this doctrine in US history, so I view it with extreme hostility and skepticism.

I share your sentiments as far as civil rights, but states rights are important in business regulation; obviously it’s messy and needs sorting out, but the state laws on insurance regulation, for example, is the only thing stopping nationwide insurance pools all incorporating in Delaware where consumer protection is weakest. That, and the other things like it, is where I can think of states rights being important.

57 EPR-radar  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:54:35pm

re: #56 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

I share your sentiments as far as civil rights, but states rights are important in business regulation; obviously it’s messy and needs sorting out, but the state laws on insurance regulation, for example, is the only thing stopping nationwide insurance pools all incorporating in Delaware where consumer protection is weakest. That, and the other things like it, is where I can think of states rights being important.

Good point. I wonder how the supposedly pro-Federalist Supreme court under Rehnquist and Roberts has been ruling on these issues. It would be nice if they were at least being consistent.

58 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:57:18pm

re: #57 EPR-radar

Good point. I wonder how the supposedly pro-Federalist Supreme court under Rehnquist and Roberts has been ruling on these issues. It would be nice if they were at least being consistent.

I don’t know. It’s not an area I know a ton about— it’s way too complex. I know there was some ‘bad’ (from my perspective, anyway) decision about credit cards that resulted in all of them incorporating in Delaware and protections for consumers getting gutted, and a friend of mine who is a corporate attorney said that if state law had been upheld in respect to banks we’d have better fiscal oversight, because right now the banks kind of serve to drain money from some states and funnel it to other states.

59 Varek Raith  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:59:32pm

PSA
DST needs to go away forever.
;)

60 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 2:59:33pm

Really, even the best state’s right example is just an example of something we should be doing at the national level, though.

People fetishize states to a weird degree. They’re an arbitrary governmental level. There’s nothing sacred about them, and the population disparity makes for really fucking weird politics. There is no rationality at all for Idaho to have the same number of senators as California. Zero.

61 EPR-radar  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:00:17pm

re: #58 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

I don’t know. It’s not an area I know a ton about— it’s way too complex. I know there was some ‘bad’ (from my perspective, anyway) decision about credit cards that resulted in all of them incorporating in Delaware and protections for consumers getting gutted, and a friend of mine who is a corporate attorney said that if state law had been upheld in respect to banks we’d have better fiscal oversight, because right now the banks kind of serve to drain money from some states and funnel it to other states.

That’s kind of where I’m at. Absent real evidence, I’ll assume business as usual —- i.e., capture of Federal regulators, followed by assertion of Federal supremacy to sweep away state-level protections.

So state level protections are either extinct or endangered.

62 AlexRogan  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:01:49pm

re: #60 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Really, even the best state’s right example is just an example of something we should be doing at the national level, though.

People fetishize states to a weird degree. They’re an arbitrary governmental level. There’s nothing sacred about them, and the population disparity makes for really fucking weird politics. There is no rationality at all for Idaho to have the same number of senators as California. Zero.

Why not?

There is a reason for that, you know.

63 EPR-radar  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:02:29pm

re: #60 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Really, even the best state’s right example is just an example of something we should be doing at the national level, though.

People fetishize states to a weird degree. They’re an arbitrary governmental level. There’s nothing sacred about them, and the population disparity makes for really fucking weird politics. There is no rationality at all for Idaho to have the same number of senators as California. Zero.

I can live with the Senate as a historical artifact of the process needed to get states which really were independent at the time to form a useful Federal government.

64 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:10:11pm

re: #54 Varek Raith

Whenever I hear someone say ‘State’s Rights’, I ask, “…To do what?”

if wingnuts actually ever learned anything about american history and knew about the articles of confederation, there might be a movement among them to go back to that constitution

however, consider this: during the debate in the late 1780s leading up to the current constitution being adopted, one of the issues was whether or not there should be a powerful centralized federal government. proponents were of course known as ‘federalists’, soon to become the conservatives to thomas jefferson’s more liberal ‘democratic republicans’

but there were also ‘anti-federalists’. and they were in favor of less centralization of power. and this is a concept that people from any place in the current political spectrum might think about

now, we are familiar with issues from the last 50 years or so when the federal government intervened when states were doing things that most of us consider immoral, so we tend to approve of the exercise, and even expansion, of centralized federal power in these cases

but someday the shoe might very well be on the other foot

65 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:14:18pm

re: #62 AlexRogan

Why not?

There is a reason for that, you know.

No, there really isn’t. Or it’s a very poor reason. The original reason states were granted power under the Constitution was that the states already existed as incorporated things, and they didn’t want to give up the power and autonomy they had. The ideas about them being laboratories of democracy is pretty and all, but the massive disparity of wealth, population, geography, natural resources, etc. etc. means it’s rare that something from one state will actually benefit another state. It also means that democracy is weakened, since the voters in Idaho have an enormous amount of power compared to the voters in California; it privileges certain people simply because of where they live.

66 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:17:42pm

re: #64 engineer cat

The shoe was on the other foot already. And there’s no real way of getting around that “state” is a completely arbitrary level of government and the states have almost no similarity to each other. Why invest this power at the state level? Why not at the county level? Why not some other arbitrary division, or perhaps even a division that’s a little bit thought out?

Hell, I think California is too big, that the differences between NorCal and SoCal are large enough to really merit breaking the state at least in half, if not in thirds. This is a lot more reasonable than North and South Dakota being two separate entities.

67 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:28:34pm

[Link: twitter.com…]

68 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:33:44pm

re: #66 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

The shoe was on the other foot already. And there’s no real way of getting around that “state” is a completely arbitrary level of government and the states have almost no similarity to each other. Why invest this power at the state level? Why not at the county level? Why not some other arbitrary division, or perhaps even a division that’s a little bit thought out?

Hell, I think California is too big, that the differences between NorCal and SoCal are large enough to really merit breaking the state at least in half, if not in thirds. This is a lot more reasonable than North and South Dakota being two separate entities.

the question is: centralized power - when is it good or bad, and how much is a good thing?

what do you think?

of course, these days we are perhaps more ruled by the whims of entities more powerful in some ways than the government in washington - that is, multinational corporations

69 AlexRogan  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:35:04pm

re: #65 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

No, there really isn’t. Or it’s a very poor reason. The original reason states were granted power under the Constitution was that the states already existed as incorporated things, and they didn’t want to give up the power and autonomy they had. The ideas about them being laboratories of democracy is pretty and all, but the massive disparity of wealth, population, geography, natural resources, etc. etc. means it’s rare that something from one state will actually benefit another state. It also means that democracy is weakened, since the voters in Idaho have an enormous amount of power compared to the voters in California; it privileges certain people simply because of where they live.

The main reason, as I understand it, that the Senate provides for equal representation, while the House provides for proportional representation, is to prevent “tyranny of the majority” in Congress. Maybe it isn’t working so well right now, but there was a laudable reason why it was done in the first place. Like you said, the original pre-Constitution states were interested in preserving as much of their power as they could; it was just perpetuated throughout the next 150-160 years as new states were added.

I don’t know what you have in mind as a solution to this, but I can say that any reworking of the federal government to reduce state governments’ influence and representation on Capital Hill is going to be a complete non-starter.

70 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:36:58pm

This guy is in LA:

lol

71 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:38:57pm

as an historical sidelight, it seems that in the course of the 1780s, in a number of places there were debtor’s revolts where citizens ganged up to e.g. prevent farms from being foreclosed on. the same thing began to occur in the depths of the depression in the 1930s. and there were other kinds of debtor’s revolts. there was a deep depression on in the mid 1780s, partly due to the serious depreciation of paper currency such as colonial notes, as well as bank notes in an era when a ‘bank note’ meant a piece of paper currency actually issued by an actual bank

so, there is a school of historical thought that says that the current constitution came about as a result of the class of creditors in this country in the 1780s ganging together to make sure that debtors could not overpower state governments and force them to allow people to get out from under debts

72 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:40:28pm

re: #68 engineer cat

the question is: centralized power - when is it good or bad, and how much is a good thing?

what do you think?

of course, these days we are perhaps more ruled by the whims of entities more powerful in some ways than the government in washington - that is, multinational corporations

What I think is kind of complex, but basically that the centralized government ought to set a high bar for minimum standard of treatment of citizens— the federal government ought to safeguard civil rights above all else. After that, in terms of business regulation and environment, the federal government should likewise enact laws so that states cannot profit from things that harms everyone else.

Most state laws simply have to do with the administration of the state— those sorts of laws obviously belong at that level, as long as they follow the rule of not working to the detriment of other states. But there again, there’s nothing special about the ‘state’ level. In fact, we see lots of cities that are very different from the surrounding state in many ways. Obviously laws about this or that at the state level are also going to be too coarse to work effectively for all areas on the state.

What would be ideal is an interlocking set of laws that set standards based on mutuality but allow freedom to address problems in a variety of ways. Getting to there from here would be nigh-impossible, given the inertia of the states.

73 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:40:34pm

re: #66 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

The shoe was on the other foot already

actually i’m not really sure what you are referring to here

74 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:45:14pm

re: #72 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

What I think is kind of complex, but basically that the centralized government ought to set a high bar for minimum standard of treatment of citizens— the federal government ought to safeguard civil rights above all else. After that, in terms of business regulation and environment, the federal government should likewise enact laws so that states cannot profit from things that harms everyone else.

Most state laws simply have to do with the administration of the state— those sorts of laws obviously belong at that level, as long as they follow the rule of not working to the detriment of other states. But there again, there’s nothing special about the ‘state’ level. In fact, we see lots of cities that are very different from the surrounding state in many ways. Obviously laws about this or that at the state level are also going to be too coarse to work effectively for all areas on the state.

What would be ideal is an interlocking set of laws that set standards based on mutuality but allow freedom to address problems in a variety of ways. Getting to there from here would be nigh-impossible, given the inertia of the states.

i wouldn’t disagree, but aren’t we merely saying that we think the federal government should intervene to do things that we approve of?

75 AlexRogan  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:45:22pm

re: #72 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

What I think is kind of complex, but basically that the centralized government ought to set a high bar for minimum standard of treatment of citizens— the federal government ought to safeguard civil rights above all else. After that, in terms of business regulation and environment, the federal government should likewise enact laws so that states cannot profit from things that harms everyone else.

Most state laws simply have to do with the administration of the state— those sorts of laws obviously belong at that level, as long as they follow the rule of not working to the detriment of other states. But there again, there’s nothing special about the ‘state’ level. In fact, we see lots of cities that are very different from the surrounding state in many ways. Obviously laws about this or that at the state level are also going to be too coarse to work effectively for all areas on the state.

What would be ideal is an interlocking set of laws that set standards based on mutuality but allow freedom to address problems in a variety of ways. Getting to there from here would be nigh-impossible, given the inertia of the states.

I can agree with everything you just said; ideally, that’s the way it should be, but we are far from living in an ideal world. However, it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t work towards those ends.

76 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:48:25pm

re: #69 AlexRogan

The main reason, as I understand it, that the Senate provides for equal representation, while the House provides for proportional representation, is to prevent “tyranny of the majority” in Congress. Maybe it isn’t working so well right now, but there was a laudable reason why it was done in the first place.

The original senate and what the senate is now, being directly elected, is very different. I don’t think the original reason was actually that laudable, I think it was a mistake, an aristocratic holdover, and I’m glad it was removed.

Second, the division of the states obviously actually contributed to the tyranny of the majority in the South— at the state level. Whenever you make arbitrary divisions, you actually increase the chance that there’s going to be a lock-out-able minority.

77 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:48:58pm

re: #74 engineer cat

i wouldn’t disagree, but aren’t we merely saying that we think the federal government should intervene to do things that we approve of?

I have no idea why that’s ‘merely’. Of course I want the government to intervene to preserve civil rights when they’re being violated. I don’t get why this seems problematic to you.

78 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:50:28pm

re: #73 engineer cat

actually i’m not really sure what you are referring to here

Oh, any number of things— the Dredd Scott decision, DOMA, prohibition, a lot of environmental laws— lots of times when federal power has overridden juster state laws.

79 Killgore Trout  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:56:49pm

In Venezuela, oil and idealism won’t mix forever

Venezuela’s oil is too big for major energy companies to ignore and too risky to plunge into. Eventually, post-Chávez Venezuela will choose pragmatism over idealism.

80 engineer cat  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 3:58:32pm

re: #77 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

I have no idea why that’s ‘merely’. Of course I want the government to intervene to preserve civil rights when they’re being violated. I don’t get why this seems problematic to you.

i’m thinking of the issue of federal power as a general principle. therefore, you have answered your own question right here:

re: #78 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Oh, any number of things— the Dredd Scott decision, DOMA, prohibition, a lot of environmental laws— lots of times when federal power has overridden juster state laws.

that’s what i’m talking about - we approve of centralized federal power when it is used to do what we approve of

since us “libberuls” often hear the accusation from wingnuts that goes like this: “you are in favor of Big Government”, i would like for myself to say uh, as a principle, um, not necessarily at all. but then… on the other hand… and then…

81 Lidane  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:00:29pm

re: #70 wrenchwench

My response to that:

Image: sxsw.jpg

82 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:08:32pm

re: #80 engineer cat

that’s what i’m talking about - we approve of centralized federal power when it is used to do what we approve of

Well, obviously. I don’t get why you think this is an important point. I’m in favor of decentralized power when it does what I approve of, too. Weirdly, you’ll find I approve of the things I approve of.

83 austin_blue  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:10:25pm

re: #70 wrenchwench

This guy is in LA:

lol

I See Badge People….

84 Varek Raith  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:10:54pm

re: #82 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Well, obviously. I don’t get why you think this is an important point. I’m in favor of decentralized power when it does what I approve of, too. Weirdly, you’ll find I approve of the things I approve of.

I’m Obdicut and I approve this message.

85 jaunte  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:20:01pm

re: #79 Killgore Trout

In Venezuela, oil and idealism won’t mix forever

If Maduro replaces some of the incompetent Chavista political appointees who have been mismanaging PdVSA, they should do all right.

86 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:20:05pm

re: #81 Lidane

My response to that:

Image: sxsw.jpg

Excellent.

When I moved from Southern California to Oregon, I was afraid to tell people where I came from.

87 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:26:59pm

re: #85 jaunte

If Maduro replaces some of the incompetent Chavista political appointees who have been mismanaging PdVSA, they should do all right.

Image: Jaunte.png

88 AlexRogan  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:27:15pm

re: #82 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Well, obviously. I don’t get why you think this is an important point. I’m in favor of decentralized power when it does what I approve of, too. Weirdly, you’ll find I approve of the things I approve of.

Lemme attempt to translate here:

You two agree on a stronger federal government for thing like civil rights and such; I think what EC was saying that it cuts both ways, in that y’all might not feel the same way about that when it’s the RWNJs pushing for stuff like DOMA.

To me, that goes beyond saying, but I digress.

89 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:27:27pm
90 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:30:15pm

re: #88 AlexRogan

Lemme attempt to translate here:

You two agree on a stronger federal government for thing like civil rights and such; I think what EC was saying that it cuts both ways, in that y’all might not feel the same way about that when it’s the RWNJs pushing for stuff like DOMA.

To me, that goes beyond saying, but I digress.

Well, of course I don’t feel the same way. I wouldn’t like the strong central government of Russia, either, or the strong central government of Nazi Germany. I don’t just like strong central government for its own sake.

91 austin_blue  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:39:23pm

Going to see the Ginastera Harp Concerto tonight at the Long Center with Yolanda Kondonassis as Principal Soloist. It is one rollicking piece of music.

92 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:41:41pm

re: #89 wrenchwench

Yeah, was watching some of the crap last night. Some really weird people out there.

93 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:48:26pm

re: #92 Gus

Yeah, was watching some of the crap last night. Some really weird people out there.

ABL is retweeting some stuff from earlier.

Geez. Some conversations need to be had, but it just brings out the loonies and the freaks. Takes a lot of courage to confront them, or be exposed to them without being able to confront them.

94 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:49:32pm
95 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:50:12pm

re: #93 wrenchwench

ABL is retweeting some stuff from earlier.

Geez. Some conversations need to be had, but it just brings out the loonies and the freaks. Takes a lot of courage to confront them, or be exposed to them without being able to confront them.

I Tweeted this to Adam Baldwin last night.

96 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:52:23pm

re: #95 Gus

I Tweeted this to Adam Baldwin last night.

Handy little tune there.

97 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:54:14pm

2 more Juante.

Plain

Image: Jaunte-3.png

and peanut.

Image: Jaunte-2.png

98 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:57:59pm

I was checking yahoo and grumpy cat is one of the trending items. [Link: search.yahoo.com…]

99 Lidane  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 4:59:35pm

re: #98 PhillyPretzel

I was checking yahoo and grumpy cat is one of the trending items. [Link: search.yahoo.com…]

That’s because Grumpy Cat is here in Austin. Mashable brought him to SXSW and people have been taking pictures with that kitty since yesterday.

100 Killgore Trout  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:00:12pm

re: #85 jaunte

If Maduro replaces some of the incompetent Chavista political appointees who have been mismanaging PdVSA, they should do all right.

Maybe but Chavez gutted their oil industry, Venezuelan oil expertise left the country a while ago. Without foreign investment and knowledge they’re going to have a really tough time. Also they won’t be able to continue squeezing their oil industry for social engineering experiments. It’s just not sustainable and it’s been a decade of diminishing returns.

101 Lidane  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:03:34pm
102 Killgore Trout  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:03:59pm

Just picked the last of my greenhouse tomatoes. Plants pretty much died off a few weeks ago but the tomatoes stayed fresh. New tomato plants volunteered and and already a few inches tall. Not bad. I had fresh tomatoes all winter long and with a little better planning new plants should have already been setting fruit.

103 Political Atheist  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:08:36pm

Charles- (& my fellow photog / gear heads)
I know we share a liking for macro photog. On the opposite focal length-Fooling around with he newest GoPro is just screaming that this is a lot of camera for $400. Massive good deal. 4k timelapse @ 15 fps. HD 60 FPS. That’s going to show up in some Pages before long.

104 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:10:14pm

re: #101 Lidane

Much discussion of that on the overnight thread.

105 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:10:49pm

re: #104 wrenchwench

Much discussion of that on the overnight thread.

Runs!

[Sound of basement hatch closing shut.]

//

106 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:11:29pm

re: #105 Gus

Runs!

[Sound of basement hatch closing shut.]

//

I’ll be in the attic.

107 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:13:23pm

re: #106 wrenchwench

I’ll be in the attic.

You’ll be attic cat and I’ll be basement cat. Who’s on first?

109 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:16:38pm

re: #89 wrenchwench

Without justifying the ignorant, racist and misogynist backlash, I do thing there’s a fundamental miscommunication going on.

The gist of Zerlina’s argument was that it should be on men and the culture in general to make rape and sexual assault unacceptable rather than on women to arm themselves to not be raped. In other words, don’t put it on her to carry a gun any more than you tell her to dress a particular way or anything else.

Is that what gun rights advocates are doing when they defend the right of women to carry, putting it on them? This seems like a very deliberate method of reversing the actual argument made, one of rights, that women have a right to bear arms if they want, just like they have a right to dress as they want, and casting it as rank paternalism, as just more of male dominated society dictating the rules to women. I don’t see anybody stating that if a woman doesn’t want to be raped that she needs to carry a gun, only that she has a right to. It’s taking a message that is at worst rooted in pragmatic empowerment, that women have equal rights to own guns and can use them to offset the difference in physical strength between them and any male assailant, and turning it into a patronizing explanation for any particular rape, that the woman did something wrong in not owning a gun. That position was neither expressed nor implied.

There’s also a false dilemma at play, in as much as neither approach impinges on the other. What the author presents as an either / or situation, isn’t.

The underlying point of debate was whether rape is just something like murder or robbery — something that will always exist to some, hopefully limited, degree — or something that is bound up in and encouraged or discouraged by our culture. In other words, whether men can be taught not to rape.

Let’s be honest, it takes a special brand of magical thinking to pretend with a straight face that a phenomenon like rape, that predates human society and is present in countless number of our ancestor species is something that is going to simply be “taught” away. Sure culture has a significant influence on how much it is or is not going to be tolerated, but rape is in no way “bound up” in it. It’s dangerous to believe that whatever approach, or blend of approaches we as society end up taking will enlighten human beings to the point where rape simply no longer occurs.

110 Decatur Deb  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:18:50pm
111 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:19:40pm

re: #110 Decatur Deb

Droneghazi

Fast and Droneless

112 Decatur Deb  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:20:34pm

re: #111 Gus

Fast and Droneless

Ya know who needs cargo drones? Drug cartels.

113 Stanley Sea  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:21:26pm

re: #106 wrenchwench

Hey WW, hope alls well! Monthly lizard check in.

114 Stanley Sea  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:23:39pm

re: #108 Varek Raith

GOP Senators Introduce Pointless Drone Bill

Pitiful and oh so transparent these If you are not breaking the law you have nothing to worry about folks are afraid.

115 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:23:46pm

Was invited to church today by a new customer. I politely declined, but retained his custom, because I was recommended to him as the best mechanic in town.

Then a guy came in on a mission from his boss. His boss has a company which I googled and it came up with many terms like ‘fraud’ and ‘rip-off’. The boss also wrote a book, a huge image of which was on the side of the motor home parked out front. It’s a story about a successful rich guy mentoring a kid. The guy who came in was going to give me a copy, but fortunately he forget. The boss has decided to ride a bike across the country with nearly no training and no knowledge of bikes, and has blisters on his butt from doing 140 miles in one day. I sold him $180 worth of stuff that might help, but it won’t fix stupid. At least he’s smart enough to have a motor home with him.

116 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:26:35pm

re: #103 Political Atheist

Charles- (& my fellow photog / gear heads)
I know we share a liking for macro photog. On the opposite focal length-Fooling around with he newest GoPro is just screaming that this is a lot of camera for $400. Massive good deal. 4k timelapse @ 15 fps. HD 60 FPS. That’s going to show up in some Pages before long.

Yeah, I’ve been reading great things about the GoPro too.

117 Decatur Deb  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:29:45pm

re: #115 wrenchwench

Old School solution:

[Link: buyvintage1.files.wordpress.com…]

118 HoosierHoops  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:33:51pm

So it’s pretty slow on a Sat. Night..So I’m going to post what happened last night. Since I don’t sleep my Doc gave me some sleeping pills that rocks your dreams. Lucky I don’t sleep walk cause I’d be dead by now.
Last night I had a dream that was a full scale Civil war Saga. ( I’m not a civil war buff so I have no idea why ) This is the gist of the story.
I was a soldier for the south fighting in the war and yes I killed Union soldiers in these battles. Ugly shit.
I got captured and sent up north to a prison camp. During my time there I began scoping out a escape and learned how to speak as a Yankee to lose my southern accent. I did a daring escape up north and found clothing to disguise myself as a local. I hid at various places and had to figure out a way to blend in with the locals.
I came across a wild fire in the mountains with Union Soldiers trying to put it out. I jumped right in with them working side by side to put it out. In the end we did and was part of the party afterwards with them to celebrate our work.
They asked why I wasn’t in the Army and I lied about spending the last couple of years out west trapping beavers with my uncle and just got back East. They bought it and wanted me to join up. I had no options so I joined the Army. Luckily for me the war ended and afterwards returned down south to find my friends and wife. ( She was really cute )
I woke up amazed at this saga and was covered in sweat.
Those are some damn good pills and every night is an adventure for me.

119 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:34:52pm

re: #109 goddamnedfrank

Let me start at the ending.

Let’s be honest, it takes a special brand of magical thinking to pretend with a straight face that a phenomenon like rape, that predates human society and is present in countless number of our ancestor species is something that is going to simply be “taught” away. Sure culture has a significant influence on how much it is or is not going to be tolerated, but rape is in no way “bound up” in it. It’s dangerous to believe that whatever approach, or blend of approaches we as society end up taking will enlighten human beings to the point where rape simply no longer occurs.

I don’t think it’s dangerous to give it a try. Slavery hasn’t been totally eliminated from the planet, but it’s illegal everywhere for the first time in history, and there’s a lot less of it. Perhaps there’s some validity to that analogy.

Now the middle:

I don’t see anybody stating that if a woman doesn’t want to be raped that she needs to carry a gun, only that she has a right to. It’s taking a message that is at worst rooted in pragmatic empowerment, that women have equal rights to own guns and can use them to offset the difference in physical strength between them and any male assailant, and turning it into a patronizing explanation for any particular rape, that the woman did something wrong in not owning a gun. That position was neither expressed nor implied

I think Zerlina has seen the argument that you have not seen. I think she made an excellent point about most rapes being committed by someone the woman knows and trusts and would have a hard time shooting, and (I didn’t hear her go this far) someone who, if they’re going to rape this woman who trusts them, might just take her gun and kill her too.

Now the start:

Without justifying the ignorant, racist and misogynist backlash, I do thing there’s a fundamental miscommunication going on. … Is that what gun rights advocates are doing when they defend the right of women to carry, putting it on them?

I think you’re right that there’s some miscommunication going on, and I really appreciate your perspective as someone who is not a misogynist and is a reasonable advocate for gun ownership. I’ll try to keep your perspective in mind without giving up mine from the reaction to the ending (above).

120 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:38:42pm

re: #113 Stanley Sea

Hey WW, hope alls well! Monthly lizard check in.

All’s well here, I hope you’re tolerating your onerous employment well!

Image: h9DDFAAFA.jpg

I’ve been seeing too many food tweets, and I’m very hungry, but I just found out my new best friend made gumbo again, and there’s some waiting for me at home. Suddenly being very hungry is a good thing!

121 Lidane  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:43:23pm

Heh. This is awesome:

[Link: www.facebook.com…]

122 Lidane  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:48:49pm
123 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:52:28pm

re: #119 wrenchwench

On the gun part. I’ve mentioned the fact that rape victims know their rapists in 70 percent of the case. How would we expect someone to just blow away a friend who might appear to be raping her. I imagine there would be different clues like lunging at someone. What if it’s just horse play? What if it’s not. What are college students expected to be packing when they go to a frat party? Should adult women be able to carry? Yes, but the idea that it’s the only way to prevent a rape is weak. That some people get upset by this idea is beyond me.

124 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:53:24pm

Started working on adding a scheduled posting feature for LGF Pages today, and it turned into a bigger project than I thought it would. That’s OK, because I’m digging into some neglected areas of the LGF codebase that needed attention.

Learning to love oAuth.

125 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:57:08pm

re: #119 wrenchwench

The Fox News audience. I wish I could say I was surprised, but after seeing the sick hatred they spew at Michelle Obama this is totally expected. Fox encourages this kind of response.

126 Political Atheist  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 5:57:54pm

re: #124 Charles Johnson

Thanks for taking the time and effort.

127 Stanley Sea  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:02:36pm

re: #118 HoosierHoops

So it’s pretty slow on a Sat. Night..So I’m going to post what happened last night. Since I don’t sleep my Doc gave me some sleeping pills that rocks your dreams. Lucky I don’t sleep walk cause I’d be dead by now.
Last night I had a dream that was a full scale Civil war Saga. ( I’m not a civil war buff so I have no idea why ) This is the gist of the story.
I was a soldier for the south fighting in the war and yes I killed Union soldiers in these battles. Ugly shit.
I got captured and sent up north to a prison camp. During my time there I began scoping out a escape and learned how to speak as a Yankee to lose my southern accent. I did a daring escape up north and found clothing to disguise myself as a local. I hid at various places and had to figure out a way to blend in with the locals.
I came across a wild fire in the mountains with Union Soldiers trying to put it out. I jumped right in with them working side by side to put it out. In the end we did and was part of the party afterwards with them to celebrate our work.
They asked why I wasn’t in the Army and I lied about spending the last couple of years out west trapping beavers with my uncle and just got back East. They bought it and wanted me to join up. I had no options so I joined the Army. Luckily for me the war ended and afterwards returned down south to find my friends and wife. ( She was really cute )
I woke up amazed at this saga and was covered in sweat.
Those are some damn good pills and every night is an adventure for me.

LOL Hoops. Great dream.

128 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:04:26pm
129 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:11:41pm

Gumbo time!

Later, lizards.

130 Charles Johnson  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:14:13pm

I just have two words: Khao Soi.

The Thai soup I had for lunch today was so amazing, I may go back and order it for dinner too.

131 Kragar (Antichrist )  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:15:09pm

re: #122 Lidane

OFFFS

132 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:17:17pm

re: #131 Kragar (Antichrist )

OFFFS

[Link: twitter.com…]

133 Stanley Sea  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:18:18pm

re: #129 wrenchwench

Gumbo time!

Later, lizards.

HEY

134 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:21:33pm
135 Vicious Babushka  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:26:27pm

re: #118 HoosierHoops

So it’s pretty slow on a Sat. Night..So I’m going to post what happened last night. Since I don’t sleep my Doc gave me some sleeping pills that rocks your dreams. Lucky I don’t sleep walk cause I’d be dead by now.
Last night I had a dream that was a full scale Civil war Saga. ( I’m not a civil war buff so I have no idea why ) This is the gist of the story.
I was a soldier for the south fighting in the war and yes I killed Union soldiers in these battles. Ugly shit.
I got captured and sent up north to a prison camp. During my time there I began scoping out a escape and learned how to speak as a Yankee to lose my southern accent. I did a daring escape up north and found clothing to disguise myself as a local. I hid at various places and had to figure out a way to blend in with the locals.
I came across a wild fire in the mountains with Union Soldiers trying to put it out. I jumped right in with them working side by side to put it out. In the end we did and was part of the party afterwards with them to celebrate our work.
They asked why I wasn’t in the Army and I lied about spending the last couple of years out west trapping beavers with my uncle and just got back East. They bought it and wanted me to join up. I had no options so I joined the Army. Luckily for me the war ended and afterwards returned down south to find my friends and wife. ( She was really cute )
I woke up amazed at this saga and was covered in sweat.
Those are some damn good pills and every night is an adventure for me.

Wow, what drug is that?

136 HoosierHoops  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:28:47pm

re: #135 Vicious Babushka

Wow, what drug is that?

300 mg of Trazodone..
Everything is so realistic and vivid.

137 Single-handed sailor  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:38:56pm

re: #136 HoosierHoops

300 mg of Trazodone..
Everything is so realistic and vivid.

I think Trazodone is what Mr Wizard used on Tutor Turtle.
I’m old/

138 Vicious Babushka  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:43:45pm

re: #136 HoosierHoops

300 mg of Trazodone..
Everything is so realistic and vivid.

I took that once. It made my nasal sinuses swell up and I couldn’t breathe through my nose! Awful! Then my Dr. prescribed Ambien which has worked pretty well.

139 Killgore Trout  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:47:07pm

Kind of a headfuck game on par with Portal but with less slick graphics

140 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:47:32pm
141 Vicious Babushka  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:47:45pm

re: #123 Gus

On the gun part. I’ve mentioned the fact that rape victims know their rapists in 70 percent of the case. How would we expect someone to just blow away a friend who might appear to be raping her. I imagine there would be different clues like lunging at someone. What if it’s just horse play? What if it’s not. What are college students expected to be packing when they go to a frat party? Should adult women be able to carry? Yes, but the idea that it’s the only way to prevent a rape is weak. That some people get upset by this idea is beyond me.

This is a Wingnut meme that you see all over the place. Do they really think that a woman can blow away some dude and all she needs to say is “he tried to rape me” and there won’t be a homicide investigation? Yes I think they really are that dumb.

142 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:48:23pm

re: #141 Vicious Babushka

This is a Wingnut meme that you see all over the place. Do they really think that a woman can blow away some dude and all she needs to say is “he tried to rape me” and there won’t be a homicide investigation? Yes I think they really are that dumb.

What does the UN have to do with… oh nevermind. :D

143 Stanley Sea  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:51:23pm

re: #141 Vicious Babushka

This is a Wingnut meme that you see all over the place. Do they really think that a woman can blow away some dude and all she needs to say is “he tried to rape me” and there won’t be a homicide investigation? Yes I think they really are that dumb.

That photo: GUNS! BREASTS!

I’m tired.

144 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:51:42pm

re: #130 Charles Johnson

I just have two words: Khao Soi.

The Thai soup I had for lunch today was so amazing, I may go back and order it for dinner too.

Thinking of asian soup makes me want a bowl of Pho Ga (Viet noodle soup). I learned to love it when we were there to adopt our son.

Failing that at least we had a nice pot of home made leek & potato soup tonight with the last of my home made chicken stock.

145 Stanley Sea  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:53:32pm

re: #144 William Barnett-Lewis

Thinking of asian soup makes me want a bowl of Pho Ga (Viet noodle soup). I learned to love it when we were there to adopt our son.

Failing that at least we had a nice pot of home made leek & potato soup tonight with the last of my home made chicken stock.

I’ve got a Tub of stock. Please give me ways to use.

146 Vicious Babushka  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 6:58:39pm

DERP


Airports?

148 The Ghost of a Flea  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:03:33pm

re: #141 Vicious Babushka

This is a Wingnut meme that you see all over the place. Do they really think that a woman can blow away some dude and all she needs to say is “he tried to rape me” and there won’t be a homicide investigation? Yes I think they really are that dumb.

All the moreso because there’s already a toxic level of “skepticism” when a woman reports actually being raped.

And, to boot, this has the problem of How are existing societal biases about race, class, and sex recapitulated in the narrative of “I shot a would-be rapist.”

149 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:07:21pm

re: #145 Stanley Sea

I’ve got a Tub of stock. Please give me ways to use.

1:1 stock and water
2 large leeks sliced
1 lb potato, peeled & diced
2 carrots, sliced
2 stalks celery, sliced
Seasoning depends on your stock. I added no extra but I had plenty in the stock. The usual suspect herbs all work well.

Bring to boil then simmer at least 2 hours.
Traditionally just mash it up, I prefer to blend it. Put back in pot.

Melt 1 stick of butter into the soup
Add one cup heavy cream
Add 8 oz package fresh mushrooms
Parsley on top to taste.
Simmer 10 ~ 15 minutes.

Serve with good bread, sourdough prefered.

150 Vicious Babushka  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:07:23pm

DERP. I have had a conversation with this wingnut. He really is this freaking dumb.

151 Stanley Sea  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:09:56pm

re: #149 William Barnett-Lewis

1:1 stock and water
2 large leeks sliced
1 lb potato, peeled & diced
2 carrots, sliced
2 stalks celery, sliced
Seasoning depends on your stock. I added no extra but I had plenty in the stock. The usual suspect herbs all work well.

Bring to boil then simmer at least 2 hours.
Traditionally just mash it up, I prefer to blend it. Put back in pot.

Melt 1 stick of butter into the soup
Add one cup heavy cream
Add 8 oz package fresh mushrooms
Parsley on top to taste.
Simmer 10 ~ 15 minutes.

Serve with good bread, sourdough prefered.

Thank you friend. I will report.

152 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:12:37pm

re: #123 Gus

On the gun part. I’ve mentioned the fact that rape victims know their rapists in 70 percent of the case.

Why is it people are so eager to write off the 30 percent who don’t?

153 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:16:27pm

re: #152 goddamnedfrank

Why is it people are so eager to write off the 30 percent who don’t?

I’m not. I said that it’s OK for CCWs, “Should adult women be able to carry? Yes…” But keep in mind that only a small percentage of that 30 percent would be successful. I don’t think gun ownership and rape should have ever come up from either side. I have a mixed view on these things. I support CCWs but not in colleges. Some would not support CCWs period.

154 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:19:44pm

LOL. Comment I just saw about my DHS story:

From the promotion of the vehicle as a police/”rescue” DHS vehicle, if I had to guess, I’d guess the debunking is actually disinformational damage control.

155 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:20:50pm

Yes, I’m with the NSA, CIA, FBI, LAPD, CAIR, NAACP, SPLC, AIPAC, and the United States Air Force buster!

156 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:22:07pm

re: #155 Gus

You got almost everything covered. /

157 Stanley Sea  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:22:13pm

re: #152 goddamnedfrank

re: #153 Gus

Normal woman here. Without gun. I’m out there, but my FEAR of rape is minimal and I’ll deal if it comes my way in the old fashioned way. scream, & 911.

158 Vicious Babushka  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:24:32pm

DERP

159 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:25:40pm

re: #157 Stanley Sea

Cast iron frying pan works well too. :)

160 HoosierHoops  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:26:36pm

re: #159 PhillyPretzel

Cast iron frying pan works well too. :)

Pepper spray

161 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:27:01pm

I knew mah “fact checking” page would get some traffic. :D Plus I have back-up. And again, Jim “Accuracy in Media” Hoft has updated or corrected nothing. On their side, fear sells.

162 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:39:02pm

re: #153 Gus

I’m not. I said that it’s OK for CCWs, “Should adult women be able to carry? Yes…” But keep in mind that only a small percentage of that 30 percent would be successful. I don’t think gun ownership and rape should have ever come up from either side. I have a mixed view on these things. I support CCWs but not in colleges. Some would not support CCWs period.

Here’s what was presented, a raped woman was expressing her desire to have been allowed to exercise her RTBA. In response to that she was first reduced to a statistic, by a woman, and then had her argument twisted into the patronizing equivalence of men telling women what to wear, by another woman.

That’s what happened. The fact is that she’s not a statistic, she’s a person, and she wasn’t telling anybody what they needed to do to avoid rape, she was expressing her own personal desire to bear arms, which intelligently or not happens to be an individual constitutionally protected right. What’s actually patronizing is the people telling her that she’s wrong and can’t protect herself because some very dubious second order numbers say so, or that she’s somehow slut shaming or explaining the rape of any woman who chooses not to carry simply because she expressed her own desire to.

163 Targetpractice  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:39:13pm

re: #150 Vicious Babushka

DERP. I have had a conversation with this wingnut. He really is this freaking dumb.

Why? Because the “Fair Tax” is a consumption tax, which means that the guy making $15,000 a week will be paying a bigger share of his paycheck to taxes than the guy making $1,500,000.

164 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:39:50pm

I’ve been following the Simcity 5 debacle all week. I liked Simcity back in the day. I was thinking of getting 5 but seeing what a disaster it’s been there’s no chance of that now.

I am currently playing a version of Simcity 2000. That will have to be enough of a fix for me now.

165 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:42:22pm

re: #162 goddamnedfrank

Simple answer? That Colorado legislator was an asshole. Was reading something the other day at a liberal blog that put it in a more complex manner. In short, she was out of line. Don’t have a link.

166 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:46:06pm

re: #60 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Really, even the best state’s right example is just an example of something we should be doing at the national level, though.

People fetishize states to a weird degree. They’re an arbitrary governmental level. There’s nothing sacred about them, and the population disparity makes for really fucking weird politics. There is no rationality at all for Idaho to have the same number of senators as California. Zero.

It’s because of this that 16% of the US population has 50% of the Senators.

167 Targetpractice  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:46:15pm

re: #164 Eclectic Cyborg

I’ve been following the Simcity 5 debacle all week. I liked Simcity back in the day. I was thinking of getting 5 but seeing what a disaster it’s been there’s no chance of that now.

I am currently playing a version of Simcity 2000. That will have to be enough of a fix for me now.

I bought a copy before I found out that even if you want to play a single-player game, you have to have an internet connection always on and if the server where you’re cloud-saving your game screws up, you could lose hours of work.

So now I’m waiting to get the all-clear signal from other players before I’ll even think of installing it.

168 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 7:50:47pm

Keep in mind that legislators are mostly comprised of attorneys. They brought this “witness” out to provide “emotional testimony.” This is sort of a trap in normal trials. The proper response for the said legislator should have been something to the effect of “I have no questions your honor.” We could have dozens of witnesses that could provide testimony on how they were saved by gun ownership in a multitude of scenarios. That guns were banned in colleges was already a settled issue in the Colorado capitol. Why it was brought up again, I don’t know. Unlike many, currently, blue states, we remain by and large a CCW state. The new laws will lower magazine capacity. In the end, those new magazine capacities can cause dozens of deaths in the hands of the next mad man.

169 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:04:09pm

re: #168 Gus

Keep in mind that legislators are mostly comprised of attorneys. They brought this “witness” out to provide “emotional testimony.”

I guess that’s one way of describing it. Another would be a citizen wanted to address her legislature on a topic close to her heart. Your scare quotes could just as aptly and patronizingly be used to dismiss Sandra Fluke.

170 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:04:46pm

re: #169 goddamnedfrank

I guess that’s one way of describing it. Another would be a citizen wanted to address her legislature on a topic close to her heart. Your scare quotes could just as aptly and patronizingly be used to dismiss Sandra Fluke.

I don’t use scare quotes.

171 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:06:13pm

I use quotes when using general nomenclature. I never understood the scare quote concept. Then again, I never understood working with people who never stop being sarcastic about everything.

172 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:14:52pm

Hand guns weren’t even part of the discussion in the CO legislature. Other than in colleges. OK then. Justify allowing a bunch of boozed up, pot smoking college students with hand guns in their dorms.

173 Amory Blaine  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:23:46pm

re: #136 HoosierHoops

300 mg of Trazodone..
Everything is so realistic and vivid.

I took that for a few years. Insomnia almost destroyed my marriage.

174 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:37:51pm
175 Interesting Times  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:44:06pm

re: #174 Gus

Misogynist asshole is a racist idiot too. Film at 11:

176 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:47:10pm

re: #133 Stanley Sea

HEY

I did the lolcat early!

177 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:48:30pm

re: #175 Interesting Times

Misogynist asshole is also a racist idiot too. Film at 11:

178 wrenchwench  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:48:39pm

It was not just gumbo, there was sweet potato pie too. Best pie ever. Second best gumbo.

179 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:48:47pm

No one was talking about FORCING men to do anything.

180 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:51:53pm

OT Daylight Savings Time is starting tomorrow. Please set your clocks ahead one hour before you go to sleep tonight. Here is my LGF page: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

Good night to my fellow Lizards.

181 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:52:18pm
182 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 8:54:55pm

re: #175 Interesting Times

Misogynist asshole is also a racist idiot too. Film at 11:

Yeah. I’ve been watching this. Most of the traffic against Zerlina Maxwell isn’t being propagated by Fox News. It’s coming from the nutcases that follow that dick Adam Baldwin.

183 Interesting Times  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:00:05pm

re: #179 Gus

No one was talking about FORCING men to do anything.

It’s hilarious how they scream and whine at the mere suggestion that cultural norms have an influence on the prevalence of rape, and that *gasp!* trying to change those norms could have a positive impact. If they don’t believe cultural norms influence rape rates for better or for worse, how can they complain about the treatment of women in Muslim nations?

We just need to give all the wimminz MOAR GUNS to defend against creeping sharia!!!1! Derp.

184 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:21:53pm

Rhetorical question time: it’s not WWI & we don’t have a nation of low tech farmers anymore. So why do we still have daylight savings time? Foo…

Time to stop lurking and go to bed as I’ll pay for that lost hour in the morning. G’night all.

185 ProBosniaLiberal  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:21:55pm

re: #90 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Hey, I need to send a message for you to read. We may not agree on the issue I wanted you to look at, but I want to make sure my points are reasonable.

186 sagehen  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:25:01pm

tonight’s SNL is the UNANNOUNCED ALL-STAR edition… for anyone whose time zone it hasn’t started in yet.

Seriously. A dozen big names, who I won’t spoil by naming, but… lots of them.

187 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:29:44pm

Ho hum.

188 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:39:54pm

re: #186 sagehen

tonight’s SNL is the UNANNOUNCED ALL-STAR edition… for anyone whose time zone it hasn’t started in yet.

Seriously. A dozen big names, who I won’t spoil by naming, but… lots of them.

Wow. SNL? Last time I thought about that show there was still music on MTV… (sad thing is, there’s no sarc there… :( )

189 AlexRogan  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:40:57pm

re: #177 Gus

Adam Baldwin: Animal Mother…For Real

190 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:41:41pm

re: #189 AlexRogan

Adam Baldwin: Animal Mother…For Real

More like asshole mother.

191 AlexRogan  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:42:04pm

re: #190 Gus

More like asshole mother.

Yeah, I could go with that one too.

192 AlexRogan  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 9:47:10pm

I feel bad for the rest of the cast of Firefly (I like Ron Glass, especially in Barney Miller, which should say a little something about my age) and for Joss Whedon, but if there was one upside to Fox canceling the show halfway through its first season, it’s that Adam Baldwin wasn’t really able to fuck it up.

Fox did that one all by themselves.

193 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 10:05:00pm

re: #184 William Barnett-Lewis

Rhetorical question time: it’s not WWI & we don’t have a nation of low tech farmers anymore. So why do we still have daylight savings time? Foo…

‘Cause it feels so good when you get that hour back in the Fall.

194 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 10:13:41pm

Deleted some Tweets because of lack of interest.

195 Gus  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 10:24:05pm

OMG! DST! I’m gonna die! Please give!

196 sagehen  Sat, Mar 9, 2013 11:38:03pm

re: #184 William Barnett-Lewis

Rhetorical question time: it’s not WWI & we don’t have a nation of low tech farmers anymore. So why do we still have daylight savings time? Foo…

Time to stop lurking and go to bed as I’ll pay for that lost hour in the morning. G’night all.

Because in winter, commuters get cranky if it’s still dark while they’re driving into work in the morning (it doesn’t bother them as much if it’s already dark when they’re going home after).

And in summer, it’s so awesome to still have hours of daylight after you leave the office — when I worked at a law office in LA, we had a volleyball league on Wednesday evenings in the summer, playing against other law firms, we could drive out to the beach and get in two or three games and go swimming before it got dark (loser pays for dinner).

197 freetoken  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 12:29:27am

JJ Johnson & Kai Winding:

198 chadu  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 12:56:44am

re: #175 Interesting Times

Dammit, Adam.

199 Inner Partisan  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 1:42:33am

re: #190 Gus

More like asshole mother.

The asshole of Twitter, the man they call… Adam.

(To be fair: I liked Baldwin in Firefly. He was perfectly suited for the role of Jayne, after all - a dim-witted Mercenary with little to no personal honor; ready to sell his fellow crew mates to the highest bidder.)

200 Kragar (Antichrist )  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 1:55:55am

re: #199 Inner Partisan

The asshole of Twitter, the man they call… Adam.

(To be fair: I liked Baldwin in Firefly. He was perfectly suited for the role of Jayne, after all - a dim-witted Mercenary with little to no personal honor; ready to sell his fellow crew mates to the highest bidder.)

I like him as an actor, but as a person, he’s a dick.

201 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 3:51:44am

re: #196 sagehen

In DST-free Arizona, companies simply work “summer hours”, from 7am-4pm, construction workers start even earlier, 5am-2pm to avoid the midday heat.

202 Usually refered to as anyways  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 3:53:31am

re: #201 Sol Berdinowitz

In DST-free Arizona, companies simply work “summer hours”, from 7am-4pm, construction workers start even earlier, 5am-2pm to avoid the midday heat.

That’s silly, how do they avoid the midday heat if they work till 2pm?

203 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 3:55:37am

re: #202 Usually refered to as anyways

That’s silly, how do they avoid the midday heat if they work till 2pm?

Mid-afternoon heat, if you want to be picky about it, the hottest time of the day is arond 3pm, when deser dwellers should be home having a siesta.

204 Usually refered to as anyways  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 4:05:18am

re: #203 Sol Berdinowitz

Just teasing Sol…

205 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 5:02:07am

re: #204 Usually refered to as anyways

Just teasing Sol…

I’d like to point out that an argument with a guy named Sol about when it’s hottest is appropriate, or rather, it’s appropriate that Sol is right.

206 freetoken  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 5:06:40am

DST is a sin against nature and nature’s God.

207 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 5:47:20am

I woke up earlier this morning than I normally do on Sunday morning, even though we lost an hour, WTF.

208 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 5:58:59am

re: #94 wrenchwench

Retweeted. Nothing Ms. Maxwell said was out of bounds. Heck, she didn’t even argue in favor of gun control; Nothing she proposed would would grab one lawful gun, not one. But because she’s black, angry white people see her challenge on cultural points as a threat and react in the typical fashion of angry white people towards a black person in America. A few years ago I really thought that this shit didn’t happen any more, that America was better than that. That turned out not to be true.

209 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 6:21:13am

I was just going over the back guest bedroom for a final vacuuming when I saw something under the bed. I bent over and found…WTF IS THIS, A CHEERIO!

Now I have to inspect that room more thoroughly.

Zedushka’s room, don’t even ask. I just want to slap a red six-petaled rose on it and seal the door shut.

210 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 6:27:24am

DERP, Bryan has decided he believes in Evolution, thinks it’s a reel he can load into his massive Projector.

211 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 6:47:35am

Wingnut Derp O’Teh Day

OBAMA STOLE AN HOUR WHILE U WERE ASLEEP!!!!111!!!!!

212 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 7:04:13am

re: #210 Vicious Babushka

DERP, Bryan has decided he believes in Evolution, thinks it’s a reel he can load into his massive Projector.

The “reverse” evolutionary path described in the article is from parasite to free-living organism. Is he implying that liberals have made that transition, but conservatives haven’t? (Or did he just not read past the headline?)

213 kirkspencer  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 7:20:27am

re: #212 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi

The “reverse” evolutionary path described in the article is from parasite to free-living organism. Is he implying that liberals have made that transition, but conservatives haven’t? (Or did he just not read past the headline?)

Nah, he was just being “duhr duhr” funny. After all, evolution is supposed to be an advancement…

214 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 7:46:38am

OT: the container my takeout Crab Rangoon came in last night bears this warning:

Caution: contents inside may be hot.

I feel that, for the sake of completeness, it ought also to have this warning:

Caution: contents not inside may not be contents.

215 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 7:50:36am

re: #175 Interesting Times

Misogynist asshole is a racist idiot too. Film at 11:

This really is screwed up.

216 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:00:28am

That’s sort of like agreeing with “if men are natural rapists,” ergo, “blacks are natural thieves.”

217 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:04:37am

re: #215 Gus

This really is screwed up.

Yeah, it is. The stuff thrown at Zerlina Maxwell reads like stuff the Ku Klux Klan put out back in the 1920’s.

218 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:06:57am

re: #217 Dark_Falcon

Yeah, it is. The stuff thrown at Zerlina Maxwell reads like stuff the Ku Klux Klan put out back in the 19201870’s.

219 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:13:15am

re: #218 Vicious Babushka

I used the 1920’s because the original KKK did not put out much under its own name, distributing most of its threats anonymously. The 20th Century Klan, by contrast, put out quite a bit of published material during the 1920’s.

220 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:18:40am

Thinking about making a page of that.

221 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:19:26am

re: #220 Gus

Thinking about making a page of that.

Please do so.

222 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:20:04am

DERP

223 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:21:24am

re: #221 Dark_Falcon

Please do so.

Headline:

Adam Baldwin Agrees: Anti-Rape Classes Equals Anti-Stealing Classes for Blacks

224 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:30:53am

And here’s today’s Weird Nut Daily Birth Freakout. How many dog whistles can you find in this one:

The Obama administration is launching new peace initiatives in and around Kenya, but acknowledges that chronic cattle rustling and other cultural practices – such as killing rivals “to prove their manhood or impress young women” – serve as impediments to progress.

Obama, through the U.S. Agency for International Development, nonetheless intends to hire private contractors that would, hypothetically, offer services such as “reflective workshops” and “trauma education” to warring clans and tribes,

according to an agency concept paper that WND located through routine database research.

The purpose of such providing services is to encourage empathy between “victims” and “perpetrators” – terms that the document repeatedly encloses in quotation marks to emphasize USAID’s position that so-called “perpetrators” also have endured trauma.

Exchanging “trauma stories” between hostile groups is a critical step in the community healing process, USAID says, as this sharing helps to raise awareness that “victims” are often the “perpetrators,” particularly when they carry out acts of revenge. This approach is one of several that USAID is proposing.

The “PEACE III” concept paper offers detailed ideas aimed at promoting stability across East African border regions. USAID recently released the paper to solicit feedback from contractors on various “theories of change” that could be implemented as part of future Horn of Africa peace and reconciliation programs.

The Obama administration hopes to create “healing peace-building cycles” that ultimately will replace “cycles of violence,” particularly along multiple conflict-prone points on the Kenya-Uganda, Kenya-South Sudan, Kenya-Ethiopia, Kenya-Somalia, and Ethiopia-South Sudan borders.

USAID said in the document that attaining such stability “is a central U.S. foreign policy and development priority in the context of regional security and economic integration.”

The agency acknowledges that the task ahead will be difficult, as “certain cultural practices and norms” in the Horn of Africa “may encourage acts of violence.”

“For example, in the western border areas, spiritual leaders bless the warriors before and after cattle raids,” the concept paper says. “A warrior is believed to have defended the pride of his clan and proven his manhood when he murders a man from the enemy tribe/clan.

“Songs and dances prepared for such warriors stir other warriors and young men to engage in murder and cattle raids. Women rebuke the warriors who have not been successful in raids rousing them to raid again,” the paper points out.

Despite the cultural, political, and economic challenges to successfully implementing conflict management programs, USAID says it had identified a “multitude of determined, credible, and committed actors at the regional, national, and local levels” that in the long term could help bring more “stability, peace, and prosperity to this part of the world.”

225 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:33:58am

Mornin’ everyone…stroke ‘em if you got ‘em…


226 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:34:16am

re: #222 Vicious Babushka

DERP

227 Inner Partisan  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:43:41am

re: #213 kirkspencer

Nah, he was just being “duhr duhr” funny. After all, evolution is supposed to be an advancement…

Sorry to be nitpicky, but: That’s one of the most common misunderstandings about evolution. There is no “higher goal” or “purpose” in evolution - simply adaption through natural selection. Such adaption can, of course, also result in a *loss* of complexity.
Likewise, the article linked to by the Derpinator is pretty much, well, bullshit. There is no such thing as “reverse evolution”. Which is ironic - judging by the comments, that website’s userbase would stand as an excellent example of such a process. But I guess they’re just really, really stupid.

228 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:44:49am

re: #224 Dark_Falcon

Of course, the programs being proposed by USAID aren’t actually controversial at all, and seem more likely to work than previous programs aiming to stop fighting in Africa. But of course for WND, it can only be Obama “aiding Kenya while hurting America! DERP!!1.”

Gun Note: If you can stomach it, check out WND’s from page for a bigger version of the photo. The magazine in that AKM looks like one of the original model “slab-side’ mags the Russians made in the 1950’s.

229 Killgore Trout  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:45:12am

Somewhere Rand Paul and Glenn Greenwald are crying
Drone Strike Reported in Pakistan

If confirmed, the attack could be the first American strike in Waziristan in two months — one of the longest operational pauses since the drone campaign started in earnest in mid-2008.

The drones have been unusually quietly lately. I was getting worried that the anti-drone folks were having some influence.

230 Killgore Trout  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:46:44am
231 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:47:21am

re: #229 Killgore Trout

Somewhere Rand Paul and Glenn Greenwald are crying
Drone Strike Reported in Pakistan

The drones have been unusually quietly lately. I was getting worried that the anti-drone folks were having some influence.

Brennan is confirmed so the CIA is celebrating… by blasting a terrorist leader into dust bunnies.

232 Killgore Trout  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:48:50am

re: #231 Dark_Falcon

Brennan is confirmed so the CIA is celebrating… by blasting a terrorist leader into dust bunnies.

Maybe there’s just been a shortage of targets. That could be a good sign.

233 Political Atheist  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:49:39am

re: #229 Killgore Trout

I figured all the worthwhile targets are air pollution already. Or someone somewhere learned to keep a secret. //

234 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:53:20am

re: #232 Killgore Trout

edited the hashtag

235 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:54:04am

re: #234 darthstar

Damn…I conserved a t there.

236 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 8:59:47am

re: #233 Political Atheist

I figured all the worthwhile targets are air pollution already. Or someone somewhere learned to keep a secret. //

OR
falling back, regrouping and lining up the next batch of Second In Line’s!! (otherwise known as The Worlds Worst Position!!)

237 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:01:52am

The dumbest fucking moron in Congress is out spreading his message of derp this morning.

Paul Ryan: GOP Budget Assumes Obamacare Repeal

Paul Ryan on Sunday said that the GOP House budget was tailored to assume that the Affordable Care Act would be repealed.

“Are you saying, as part of your budget, you assume the repeal of Obamacare?,” asked Fox News Sunday host Chris Wallace.

“Yes,” said Ryan, adding that, “we’re going to propose replacing Obamacare with patient-centered health care, with a better health care system for everybody.”

Ryan defended his opposition to the law.

“We don’t want to push more people into a failing program,” he said. “We believe that Obamacare is a program that will not work. We believe Obamacare will actually lead to hospitals and doctors and health care providers turning people away.”

238 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:02:01am
239 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:02:28am

How’s this?

During the current “Monstrous” feed frenzy of misogynist and racist attack against Zerlina Maxwell after her appearance on Hannity we find Adam Baldwin of Breitart and “Full Metal Jacket” fame in agreement that “Forcing all men to go through ‘do not rape’ classes would be as bad as sending all blacks to ‘do not steal’ classes.” Never mind that this is a complete misrepresentation of Maxwell’s argument since she never once mention “forcing” anyone to take said classes. However, I find the comparison of anti-rapes classes for men to forcing blacks to take “anti-stealing classes” to be somewhat intriguing. Is he equating an alleged natural tendency of men to rape with the race realist or racist and highly erroneous and ignorant idea of a natural tendency for blacks to steal? What word would we use to describe such a comparison?

240 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:03:13am

re: #237 Amory Blaine

The dumbest fucking moron in Congress is out spreading his message of derp this morning.

Paul Ryan: GOP Budget Assumes Obamacare Repeal

And people voted for him to be one heartbeat away from the White House.

241 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:04:36am

Cannon is packed, charged and ready to fire!

242 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:05:54am

Yeah like men never “joke” about rape. I’ve heard everyone from leaders of men to the streetsweeper make crude jokes about women and also rape. A man with an ounce of courage to tell their stupid friends to STFU about rape/misogyny is the education most people need. Present commenter included.

243 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:06:57am

re: #241 Gus

Cannon is packed, charged and ready to fire!

I learned as a kid never to fuck with Cannon.

Image: cannontvseries_thumb1.jpg

244 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:07:43am

Don’t fuck with his sandwich man. You’ve been warned.

245 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:10:59am

Fire in the hole!

247 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:11:58am

Too late.

248 Killgore Trout  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:14:14am

re: #234 darthstar

Well, they’re all grown up now and free to make their own decisions.

249 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:15:10am

re: #239 Gus

Only thing I might add is to make clear that for a rarity its not Sean Hannity who did something wrong. He behaved himself properly in his treatment of Ms. Maxwell; it was only after a dishonest article distorting her words appeared on The Blaze that the hate started flowing.

250 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:15:35am

re: #248 Killgore Trout

Well, they’re all grown up now and free to make their own decisions.

You don’t get it.

251 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:16:03am

re: #249 Dark_Falcon

Only thing I might add is to make clear that for a rarity its not Sean Hannity who did something wrong. He behaved himself properly in his treatment of Ms. Maxwell; it was only after a dishonest article distorting her words appeared on The Blaze that the hate started flowing.

I didn’t say anything about Hannity.

252 Mattand  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:19:24am

re: #237 Amory Blaine

The dumbest fucking moron in Congress is out spreading his message of derp this morning.

Paul Ryan: GOP Budget Assumes Obamacare Repeal

“We don’t want to push more people into a failing program,” he said. “We believe that Obamacare is a program that will not work. We believe Obamacare will actually lead to hospitals and doctors and health care providers turning people away.”

Christ, it’s barely been enacted and it’s already a failure?

I would imagine this is going to be like abortion, where Republicans can’t overtly get rid of it, but slowly make it as impossible to access as possible.

I just don’t understand why people vote Republican when these kinds of people are running the party.

253 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:19:57am

re: #251 Gus

I didn’t say anything about Hannity.

I know. It’s just part of how I think that I always want to establish very clearly who I am blaming. It’s both for reasons of justice, and to reduce the incidence of assholes deliberately taking my words out of context.

254 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:22:31am

My…how time flies…

255 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:24:07am

re: #252 Mattand

Paul Ryan is only the messenger. The republican party is the problem. They love this shit. You think your average republican wants poor people to have access to the same doctors/health care they have? No. You have to “earn it”.

256 Iwouldprefernotto  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:24:24am

re: #254 darthstar

My…how time flies…

How did the war turn out? Did we find the WMD? Did it cost more than 50 billion?

257 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:24:49am

re: #250 darthstar

You don’t get it.

I do get it, but so what? We can’t really change the realities of life on the ground in North Wazirstan, so the best we can do is keep the Taliban’s leadership trimmed back.

258 Mattand  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:25:45am

re: #255 Amory Blaine

Paul Ryan is only the messenger. The republican party is the problem. They love this shit. You think your average republican wants poor people to have access to the same doctors/health care they have? No. You have to “earn it”.

Yeah, that’s always been my take: I fail to see how keeping you and your family healthy is a “privilege”, like they say a driver’s license is.

259 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:25:57am

Bzzzt.

260 Stanley Sea  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:26:31am

re: #256 Iwouldprefernotto

How did the war turn out? Did we find the WMD? Did it cost more than 50 billion?

Traitor boy, it was paid for by the oil.

261 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:26:43am

Hang on for the ride!

262 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:26:58am

re: #259 Gus

Bzzzt.

here

Image: fly-swatter.jpg

263 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:29:04am

re: #262 sattv4u2

here

Image: fly-swatter.jpg

This is what happens when someone RT’s a 12 year old after having too many beers. Or something.

264 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:29:45am

That 50 billion number sounds like bullshit too. Sounds way too low.

265 Gus  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:29:56am
266 The Mountain That Blogs  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:30:15am

re: #258 Mattand

Yeah, that’s always been my take: I fail to see how keeping you and your family healthy is a “privilege”, like they say a driver’s license is.

Because sitting around and saying “We want to cut this,” is much more abstract than even the busing thing, and a hell of a lot more abstract than “n**** n****”

267 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:31:07am

Maybe Baldwin is jockeying for a job on the next Atlas Shrugged movie.

268 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:35:39am

Oy!
Afghan President Hamid Karzai on Sunday accused the Taliban and the U.S. of working in concert to convince Afghans that violence will worsen if most foreign troops leave

[Link: hosted.ap.org…]

269 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:38:39am
270 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:40:12am

Deleted.

271 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:41:37am
272 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:41:38am

re: #270 Dark_Falcon

or we’ll leave and salt the earth on our way out.”

ummm,,,, no!

273 Killgore Trout  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:42:23am

re: #268 sattv4u2

Oy!
Afghan President Hamid Karzai on Sunday accused the Taliban and the U.S. of working in concert to convince Afghans that violence will worsen if most foreign troops leave

[Link: hosted.ap.org…]

Yeah, that’s making the rounds this morning. He has made some unhelpful statements in the past but I’m a bit wary of the translation and context of his statement on this one.

“The explosions in Kabul and Khost yesterday showed that they are at the service of America and at the service of this phrase: 2014. They are trying to frighten us into thinking that if the foreigners are not in Afghanistan, we would be facing these sorts of incidents,” he said during a nationally televised speech about the state of Afghan women.

He’s not completely wrong. Although I think the Taliban is more interested in creating chaos (they’ll kill pretty much anybody they can get their hands on) it’s not unreasonable that part of the Taliban goal is to keep the US in Afghanistan so they can have the bonus of killing Americans instead of just their fellow Muslims.

274 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:42:33am

I like how with right to work and almost any employment situation for that matter, the health care and financial security of my family is potentially in the hands of some unhinged ideologue who could fire me at any time for some perceived “leftyism”. That’s the smell of fucking freedom.

275 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:42:48am

re: #270 Dark_Falcon

I really think the time has come to directly threaten Karzai, tell him “stop smearing us in this fashion or we’ll leave and salt the earth on our way out.”

Spoken like a true diplomat.
/

276 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:45:01am

re: #273 Killgore Trout

it’s not unreasonable that part of the Taliban goal is to keep the US in Afghanistan so they can have the bonus of killing Americans instead of just their fellow Muslims.

yes, but otoh no US forces gives the taliban even freer reign especially in the more remote areas

277 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:46:23am

Deleted.

278 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:46:39am

re: #274 Amory Blaine

I like how with right to work and almost any employment situation for that matter, the health care and financial security of my family is potentially in the hands of some unhinged ideologue who could fire me at any time for some perceived “leftyism”. That’s the smell of fucking freedom.

The glory of ‘at-will’ employment is not only do employers not need an excuse to fire someone, but the employee him/herself has the ability to gut health care and financial security for their family…without notice…don’t you feel empowered?

279 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:48:39am

re: #270 Dark_Falcon

I really think the time has come to directly threaten Karzai, tell him “stop smearing us in this fashion or we’ll leave and salt the earth on our way out.”

What do you mean by ‘salt the earth’? Hopefully stupid hyperbole on your part?

280 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:49:14am

How come the rebuild effort isn’t as big as the military action in Afghanistan? Where’s the planeloads of engineers rushing to win hearts and minds? Lifting the Afghani people out of the misery where the Taliban dwell? I won’t hold my breath. Why don’t we have open immigration with this country?

281 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:50:00am

re: #277 Dark_Falcon

And when we make nice, all that asshole does is DERP some more and stick his hand out for some more money. Fuck him.

Now you’re getting warmer. Money. Cut the flow of that off for a few weeks and see what happens…”What do you mean you didn’t get the check yet? It’s in the mail…you should have it any time now.”

282 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:50:35am

re: #278 darthstar

Yeah because a two week notice is so burdensome.

283 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:51:15am

re: #277 Dark_Falcon

And when we make nice, all that asshole does is DERP some more and stick his hand out for some more money. Fuck him.

HIM, yes,

But to “salt the earth on the way out” indicates you’re either calling for the assassination of a countries leader or killing a lot of innocents just “because”

284 dragonath  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:51:43am

This is really weird:

Is Canada telling Hungary’s Roma ‘Do not seek asylum here’?

The Harper government has launched an ad campaign in the Hungarian city of Miskolc – from which many Roma have migrated to Canada in recent years – warning of tougher immigration laws.

285 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:58:50am

re: #282 Amory Blaine

Yeah because a two week notice is so burdensome.

I got laid off in December and just started working again last week. Job market’s smokin’ hot out here right now so I took a month or so off before looking. But the day I got laid off? That was one bad fuckin’ gut punch…and I didn’t even like that company all that much (nice people to work with, but no real value in their product). It was a ‘financial’ decision to help them get another round of VC funding…laid off a bunch of good people right before xmas.

So I decided I’d strip them of my former employees when I got rehired…spoke to the first one on Friday…he’d just taken another job so I missed him. There’s one other gal there I want, so I’ll nab her (that’ll screw them for a bit) and then there are a couple of other developers I’d like to steal. Turns out the layoffs were short-sighted and a bunch of other talent just left fearing they were next. It’s hard to buid products when the people who know how to write the code all leave…even maintenance/bug fixing becomes impossible.

286 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 9:59:10am

deleted.

287 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:00:30am

re: #286 Dark_Falcon

I mean that we cannot allow Afghanistan to become a terrorist haven again.

and “salt(ing) the earth” before we leave accomplishes that ,, how!?!?!

288 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:01:25am

re: #286 Dark_Falcon

I mean that we cannot allow Afghanistan to become a terrorist haven again.

Yeah, yeah. Be clear: What actions do you think we should take to ‘salt the earth’? In historical terms, this means destroying the agriculture and other infrastructure so that it’s no longer a viable place to live.

So what are you suggesting?

289 Amory Blaine  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:02:54am

Not every problem is solved with a bomb.

290 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:03:33am

deleted.

291 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:03:36am

re: #283 sattv4u2

HIM, yes,

But to “salt the earth on the way out” indicates you’re either calling for the assassination of a countries leader or killing a lot of innocents just “because”

Nah…it’s just poisoning the well a little. Preventing regrowth of the children, if you will. Wingnuts compare President Obama to a specific historical figure all the time…that this kind of attitude lies close to the surface should not come as a surprise to anyone.

292 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:06:31am

Building roads and bridges and other infrastructure makes a lot more sense, and costs a lot less than killing your way out of a country.

Call it a fertilize the earth strategy. Give people hope, and they won’t be so resistant as to take up arms against you.

293 Iwouldprefernotto  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:07:43am

re: #289 Amory Blaine

Not every problem is solved with a bomb.

I would argue that 99% of problems can’t be solved with force.

294 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:07:54am

re: #290 Dark_Falcon

All comments in this vein have been deleted by me. I was seriously out of line.

295 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:09:41am
296 Interesting Times  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:09:56am

re: #284 dragonath

This is really weird:

Is Canada telling Hungary’s Roma ‘Do not seek asylum here’?

Why I despise stephen harper and can’t wait until he’s gone, reason #5,542

297 Killgore Trout  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:12:52am

re: #292 darthstar

Building roads and bridges and other infrastructure makes a lot more sense, and costs a lot less than killing your way out of a country.

Call it a fertilize the earth strategy. Give people hope, and they won’t be so resistant as to take up arms against you.

Not really. Roads, bridges and schools are easy to blow up. If we build infrastructure without killing the people who want to destroy it we’d be wasting our time and money. Remember that when the Taliban isn’t trying to kill us they’re shooting 14 year old girls in the face for wanting to learn to read. These are not nice people.

298 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:12:56am

re: #296 Interesting Times

Why I despise stephen harper and can’t wait until he’s gone, reason #5,542

He always speaks highly of you!!

299 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:14:13am

re: #292 darthstar

Building roads and bridges and other infrastructure makes a lot more sense, and costs a lot less than killing your way out of a country.

Call it a fertilize the earth strategy. Give people hope, and they won’t be so resistant as to take up arms against you.

Isn’t that what we tried (are trying) in Iraq with the moonbats shouting HALIBURTON all the way !?!?!

300 Killgore Trout  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:15:23am

Child killed in Khyber Agency bomb explosion

A child was killed in a bomb blast on Sunday in Kohga Khail area of Landi Kotal tehsil of Khyber Agency.

According to Khyber Agency police administration, explosive material planted at the entrance of a local mosque went off suddenly, killing one child nearby. No one was injured in the incident. However, a house near the mosque was also partially damaged in the explosion.

301 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:16:30am

re: #294 Dark_Falcon

All comments in this vein have been deleted by me. I was seriously out of line.

Does that mean everyone has to go back and edit their quotes of your posts to read ‘deleted’? That’s kind of silly.

You said something stupid. It happens all the time (to everyone, not just you). Nobody’s going to hold that against you…we’ll mock the living shit out of you for a little while, but this is the internet and that’s the way it should be…but we’ll move on…eventually.

302 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:17:22am

re: #301 darthstar

It happens all the time (to everyone, not just you).

Nuh uh,, no way ,,,not me,,, never happens,,, nope !!!

303 dragonath  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:18:36am

re: #299 sattv4u2

Isn’t that what we tried (are trying) in Iraq with the moonbats shouting HALIBURTON all the way !?!?!

Occupied Iraq could have used a public works project of some kind. It probably would have been cheaper than paying contractors, and it would have given the Iraqis a greater stake in the reconstruction.

304 darthstar  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:21:31am

re: #299 sattv4u2

Isn’t that what we tried (are trying) in Iraq with the moonbats shouting HALIBURTON all the way !?!?!

Halliburton built US bases in Iraq. Rebuiding infrastructure was never part of Bush’s plan.

305 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:22:13am

re: #303 dragonath

Occupied Iraq could have used a public works project of some kind. It probably would have been cheaper than paying contractors, and it would have given the Iraqis a greater stake in the reconstruction.

After all the Saddam years they didn’t have the resources/ expertise to do large (and even in some cases small) scale projects. Co-worker was there in the early years (post Saddam) doing some telecommunications work and what they had in place was decades behind what we had

306 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:23:33am

re: #303 dragonath

Occupied Iraq could have used a public works project of some kind. It probably would have been cheaper than paying contractors, and it would have given the Iraqis a greater stake in the reconstruction.

The thing is that the US Army no longer does many such projects itself, it contracts them out. Given the limited pool of enlistees, the actual soldiers are needed for fighting, they can’t be spared for building.

307 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:25:56am

re: #304 darthstar

Halliburton built US bases in Iraq. Rebuiding infrastructure was never part of Bush’s plan.

or,,
[Link: abcnews.go.com…]

308 sattv4u2  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:28:35am

tip off in 2 minutes

Gotta scoot and run commercials for an ACC basketball game,, bbiab

309 dragonath  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:30:31am

re: #306 Dark_Falcon

I think you’re missing the point. Even if the US Army was incapable as acting as administrators on Iraqi-built projects, another agency could have. The infrastructure programs that were carried out were scattershot and unorganized, much like the entire occupation plan.

310 dragonath  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:33:17am

re: #306 Dark_Falcon

The thing is that the US Army no longer does many such projects itself, it contracts them out. Given the limited pool of enlistees, the actual soldiers are needed for fighting, they can’t be spared for building.

Secondly, this reads as a tacit acknowledgment that the US was not up to the task of occupation.

311 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Mar 10, 2013 10:39:55am

re: #310 dragonath

Secondly, this reads as a tacit acknowledgment that the US was not up to the task of occupation.

It isn’t, it really isn’t. i was saying that to make the point that the contractors would have gotten the job of any additional project mounted. And they still would have needed foreign troops or security contractors to protect the crews.


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