Yes, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev Has Miranda Protections

Even if he isn’t read Miranda

This is relatively simple. The FBI may not “Mirandize” Dzhokhar Tsarnaev when they interrogate him. As a result of this, anything he says during that interview that doesn’t relate to immediate threats to the public (like other bombs) would not be admissable as evidence against him in a trial. This is something that the FBI and the prosecutors have to weigh, to consider the need for public safety vs. the need to prosecute him. As the prosecution should be iron-clad anyway, I don’t think they ever need to Mirandize him as they never intend to use his statements against him in a court of law.

nytimes.com

We have the right not to incriminate ourselves. We don’t have the right not to be tricked into telling the cops where a large cache of explosives is, if that admission is not used to prosecute us.

Furthermore: The public safety exemption means that things that are revealed without being Mirandized which are direct threats to public safety can be used against you in a court of law. So, if you reveal where the bomb that you have strapped to a bridge is, that admission can be used against you. What the legal logic of that is, I don’t really know, but I guess it’s that the cops have no realistic way to get that information in a timely fashion, and they can’t say, “Just tell us where they are and we won’t use it against you.”

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132 comments

1 Kronocide  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:08:39am

The interpretations are evolving:

Justice official: No reading of Miranda rights

The public safety exception permits law enforcement officials to engage in a limited and focused unwarned interrogation of a suspect and allows the government to introduce the statement as evidence in court. The public safety exception is triggered when police officers have an objectively reasonable need to protect the police or the public from immediate danger.

As I read it, you are correct and this AP story is in error.

2 wrenchwench  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:10:52am

Heck of a time for Lawhawk to go on vacation….

3 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:13:12am

re: #1 Kronocide

I think it’s both. If he reveals things that are public safety, they can be used against him. If he reveals there’s a bomb hidden at at MIT, for example, that revelation can be used against him in court. But any of the ‘further’ questioning, not related to immediate threats, cannot be used against him.

So the AP article is right, and I’m right as to the extended questioning after public safety has been exhausted. I’ll adjust the post to account for that.

4 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:35:44am

Promoted! Good explanation.

Also, here’s the FBI page explaining the public safety exception in great detail:

fbi.gov

5 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:44:44am

This is one article that I feel is spreading disinformation on the topic.

slate.com

It’s a Slate article that references the NYT article that specifically talks about the information not being used in court. However, the Slate article fails to cover this. I think at a bare journalistic minimum you should read any article you cite when writing an article. It then even compounds the error by saying that we’ll never learn what came out in the interrogation because it’ll be secret. If we never learn it, that means it’s not introduced as evidence, which means his Miranda protections have, actually, been upheld.

6 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:48:44am

re: #5 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Also, what Lindsey Graham proposed is NOT the “public safety” exception - he wants Tsarnaev declared an “enemy combatant,” which would completely void his Constitutional rights.

7 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:50:36am

You know, I kind of expect our lawmakers to actually respect the rule of law. Am I setting the bar too high?

8 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:51:52am

And another point - just because he won’t be read his rights immediately does not mean that he doesn’t still have those rights. He can still exercise his right to remain silent and have an attorney. The only difference is that with the exception, authorities won’t TELL him he can do that.

9 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:52:39am

re: #7 Four More Tears

You know, I kind of expect our lawmakers to actually respect the rule of law. Am I setting the bar too high?

That’s exactly what I was talking about - there seem to be more than a few conservatives itching to torture this guy.

10 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:53:10am

re: #9 Charles Johnson

That’s exactly what I was talking about - there seem to be more than a few conservatives itching to torture this guy.

It’s repulsive.

11 Varek Raith  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:54:01am

Let’s send the ricin guy to Gitmo.
And the MLK bomber guy.
And Dr. Tiller’s killer.
All terrorists.

12 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:54:17am

Silvio tweeted me this article:

outsidethebeltway.com

What all this means is that the issue of not reading Tsarnaev his rights only really matters to the extent that the authorities are concerned with being able to use something that he might say in Court against him. Given the mountain of evidence that we already know the authorities have against him related to the bombings, most especially the videos and the photographs but also the evidence obtained during Friday morning’s chase as well as whatever was recovered at the apartment he shared with his brother while not at school, the authorities most likely don’t need Tsarnaev to confess to anything at all. Instead, they are interested in finding out what he is willing to tell them about what he and his brother did, why they did it, how it was financed, whether they had any confederates, and whether they were allied in any way with terror groups overseas. Thus, it’s more appropriate to view any future interrogation of Tsarnaev as an intelligence gathering operation rather than as part of a criminal investigation.

13 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:55:03am

Why even have courts huh Graham and McCain. Sick of this shit. But I am glad McCain is reminding me why I didn’t vote for him.

14 Apeman  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:56:14am

I always thought that is was in particularly tough times we cling to the constitution, not ignore it. Sometimes, I get so confused.

15 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:56:52am

re: #10 Four More Tears

It’s repulsive.

It is. Why is it such an absurd concept to those two that we can’t try Tsarnaev in our legal system the way we did McVeigh and Nichols who killed much more people than Tsaranaev did. Not miminizing what’s happened mind you, just stating that if we can try Terry Nichols and Timothy McVeigh in our own courts, then there’s no reason that we can’t do the same here. The man is a US citizen.

16 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 10:58:02am

re: #14 Apeman

I always thought that is was in particularly tough times we cling to the constitution, not ignore it. Sometimes, I get so confused.

Unfortunately in tough times, we tend to ignore it. I.E. Wilson’s DoJ prosecuting people for opposing WWI and FDR’s internment of the Japanese Americans. What is unfortunate is some 70 years after those events that we have two men in prominent positions in government who want us to repeat the same mistakes.

17 Feline Fearless Leader  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:01:10am

re: #15 HappyWarrior

It is. Why is it such an absurd concept to those two that we can’t try Tsaranaev in our legal system the way we did McVeigh and Nichols who killed much more people than Tsaranaev did. Not miminizing what’s happened mind you, just stating that if we can try Terry Nichols and Timothy McVeigh in our own courts, then there’s no reason that we can’t do the same here. The man is a US citizen.

Must be that odd hang-up in that part of the political spectrum about being a “natural born” American.
/

18 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:01:47am

I don’t give a damn about Tsaranev’s father and his silly conspiracy theory that the US government is framing his sons but by sending Dzhokhar Tzarnaev to Gitmo , you feed that and other conspiracies like that. What’s the harm in trying him in a court and presenting evidence that will surely convict him and send him to prison if not for the rest of his life but until he’s executed. I don’t believe in the DP but Graham’s solution makes the DP look enlightened even.

19 funky chicken  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:05:17am

Since the older brother appears to have been the only “true believer,” I wonder how much intel the kid can even provide. Hopefully there is lots to be recovered from the apartment.

20 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:06:34am

At the risk of repeating myself…

21 Lidane  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:08:38am
22 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:09:46am
23 Iwouldprefernotto  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:09:51am

re: #20 Charles Johnson

At the risk of repeating myself…

Does this act also make the case that we need to make it harder to purchase weapons?

24 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:10:26am

re: #21 Lidane

Pretty much. The shit he’s doing makes the stuff McCain did to outwingnut Heyworth to get renominated is pathetic. Charles said it yesterday, what a shame that this guy is still relatively speaking one of the sane Republicans.

25 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:10:58am

re: #23 Iwouldprefernotto

Does this act also make the case that we need to make it harder to purchase weapons?

No, because if that guy in the SUV had a gun he could have shot them right there!

Or pulled his gun and gotten wasted himself, but still…

26 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:11:27am

re: #22 Four More Tears

You just know that some buttheads are going to threaten that lawyer even though someone has to represent Tsarnaev. IF I hear someone claiming that we should take away his right to counsel, I’m going to be pissed. We cannot let our emotions effect rule of law.

27 Lidane  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:12:07am

re: #22 Four More Tears

I’m sure there will be a lot of ZOMG OUTRAGE over that, but at the end of the day this kid is still an American. He has the right to legal counsel, and he’s still got Constitutional rights.

Yes, he committed terrorist acts against his fellow citizens. Yes, we need to know what he knows. But that doesn’t mean that we need to lose sight of our laws and our system to do it.

28 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:12:09am

Sounds like a normal 19 year old to me.

29 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:12:41am

I got at least 6 tweets last night from Tea Partiers calling me “stupid” and other insults, because they said Teabaggers hate Lindsey Graham and love the Constitution, and I was an asshole and a moron for saying he was trying to appeal to them.

Yeah, right.

30 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:13:04am

re: #28 Four More Tears

Fischer should know, he flunked too

31 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:13:20am

re: #28 Four More Tears

Fischer shouldn’t talk - he flunked “Intro to Humanity.”

32 blueraven  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:13:36am

re: #28 Four More Tears

Sounds like a normal 19 year old to me.

Byran Fischer flunks that subject on a daily basis.

33 Lidane  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:13:59am
34 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:15:03am

Whoa, I hadn’t realized Drudge had gone so far over the deep end.

35 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:15:33am

Oh yeah, he’s losing it.

36 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:15:48am

FYI since there’s various stories floating about regarding the previous FBI look at Tsarnaev — the statement is now posted as a page:

littlegreenfootballs.com

37 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:15:57am

The ACLU weighs in:

38 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:16:19am

re: #28 Four More Tears

Sounds like a normal 19 year old to me.

Yeah he failed because he’s a Muslim. That’s right, Bryan. Let’s totally ignore the fact that the Muslim-American community is among the highly educated. I know you disdain higher education but you have to be able to pass a class on American government to graduate high school and I think many colleges require some form of basic government course work no matter what you degree program. Besides, Bryan shows he fails to understand American politics daily.

39 Lidane  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:16:23am
40 blueraven  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:16:49am

re: #34 Four More Tears

Whoa, I hadn’t realized Drudge had gone so far over the deep end.

He eee eee and Mr Jones, Mr Jones, Mr Jones…

41 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:17:19am

re: #39 Lidane

I have. They complain about an non-existent tyranny but want real tyranny.

42 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:17:54am

Drudge is trolling the sludge.

43 wrenchwench  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:17:54am

re: #40 blueraven

He eee eee and Mr Jones, Mr Jones, Mr Jones…

They got a thing goin’ on?

44 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:17:59am

I’ve got some friends and family on FB saying it’s a shame he was taken alive because now we’re going to waste more money on trials and whatnot. That it’s too bad some patriot citizen wasn’t able to just “take him out”.
I was going to ask them if that meant it would have been OK for said hypothetical patriotic citizen to just “take out” all of the previous “suspects” identified in the media, but then realized all of the other “suspects” had the one thing in common that scares the crap out of them.

45 AlexRogan  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:18:24am

re: #41 HappyWarrior

I have. They complain about an non-existent tyranny but want real tyranny.

Just as long as they’re the ones wielding the iron fist.

46 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:18:40am

re: #45 AlexRogan

Just as long as they’re the ones wielding the iron fist.

Ah pretty much, yes.

47 Lidane  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:19:23am
48 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:21:39am

He may have a lawyer real soon.

49 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:21:55am

excellent topic Obdi!

We have our rights regardless of what anyone says to us.

50 blueraven  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:22:42am

re: #48 NJDhockeyfan

He may have a lawyer real soon.

Of course he will have a lawyer.

51 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:23:32am

re: #9 Charles Johnson

That’s exactly what I was talking about - there seem to be more than a few conservatives itching to torture this guy.

It’s one of the reasons I regard many of those who claim the mantle ‘conservative’ as revolutionaries instead. Events such as this show they intend to rip the country down and rebuild it in their image.

52 Kronocide  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:23:48am

re: #44 Backwoods_Sleuth

I’ve got some friends and family on FB saying it’s a shame he was taken alive because now we’re going to waste more money on trials and whatnot. That it’s too bad some patriot citizen wasn’t able to just “take him out”.
I was going to ask them if that meant it would have been OK for said hypothetical patriotic citizen to just “take out” all of the previous “suspects” identified in the media, but then realized all of the other “suspects” had the one thing in common that scares the crap out of them.

My response to that: if we really want to save money just get some pitchforks.

53 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:24:30am

re: #9 Charles Johnson

That’s exactly what I was talking about - there seem to be more than a few conservatives itching to torture this guy.

Graham is trolling for votes

scum

54 Lidane  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:25:07am
56 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:26:53am

re: #28 Four More Tears

Sounds like a normal 19 year old to me.

Ohhh, no, no, no, no.

Mr. Fischer, as a proud Canadian, I protest your inappropriate use of the word “Eh”.

57 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:27:01am

re: #34 Four More Tears

Whoa, I hadn’t realized Drudge had gone so far over the deep end.

Fuck Matt Drudge, if it was his city he’d call for the Marines.

58 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:27:51am

re: #55 Backwoods_Sleuth

Greg Ball, New York State Senator, On Boston Suspect: ‘Who Wouldn’t Use Torture On This Punk’?

*sigh*

And you know as I was reading the posts up thread I started to consider there’s a high chance someone will try to blow this kids head off before he even makes it to a courtroom.

59 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:29:34am

re: #34 Four More Tears

Whoa, I hadn’t realized Drudge had gone so far over the deep end.

A right wing friend of mine was posting last night about how he believed that Boston was merely a “dress rehearsal” so Obama and his thugs could practice their tactics for patrolling/locking down/taking over cities and the Administration paid the two brothers some ridiculous sum of money to persuade them to carry out the attack.

Yes, of course I’m serious.

60 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:30:03am

re: #39 Lidane

So on my fb

61 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:31:23am

re: #58 Eclectic Cyborg

*sigh*

And you know as I was reading the posts up thread I started to consider there’s a high chance someone will try to blow this kids head off before he even makes it to a courtroom.

I realize that at first there is a lot of outrage. Like 9/11, we all felt it.

Then time passes and we calm down and remember we are a nation of “laws, not men” Some of us actually learn from the experience.

Some of us don’t.

62 HappyWarrior  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:33:50am

re: #55 Backwoods_Sleuth

Greg Ball, New York State Senator, On Boston Suspect: ‘Who Wouldn’t Use Torture On This Punk’?

I wouldn’t. What good does torturing him do? It doesn’t bring his victims back. Torture’s about revenge and sick enjoyment.

63 funky chicken  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:34:57am

re: #34 Four More Tears

Whoa, I hadn’t realized Drudge had gone so far over the deep end.

Where have you been? Drudge has been re-posting Alex Jones insanity for a few years now.

64 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:38:42am

So basically he can’t be read his rights anyway and we’ve been arguing about absolutely nothing. Politics as usual.

65 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:39:09am

re: #63 funky chicken

Where have you been? Drudge has been re-posting Alex Jones insanity for a few years now.

Yeah, but now he seems to coming up with it on his own!

66 Decatur Deb  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:39:14am

Off to do the lord’s work, stripping Windows from a friend’s machine and replacing with Ubuntu 12. BBL.

67 A Mom Anon  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:40:06am

re: #63 funky chicken

I like how he “just woke up one day” and the cops look like the military. Where the fuck has he been over the last decade or so? The cops around here went from the standard navy blue police uniform to tactical black military style many years ago. The look a lot more like SWAT even if they aren’t SWAT. It’s as much about looking intimidating as it is anything else. That transformation has been going on since before 9/11 but really went into full tilt after.

68 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:42:25am

re: #67 A Mom Anon

I like how he “just woke up one day” and the cops look like the military. Where the fuck has he been over the last decade or so? The cops around here went from the standard navy blue police uniform to tactical black military style many years ago. The look a lot more like SWAT even if they aren’t SWAT. It’s as much about looking intimidating as it is anything else. That transformation has been going on since before 9/11 but really went into full tilt after.

It’s like he’s never seen a G8 summit.

69 wrenchwench  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:42:38am

re: #67 A Mom Anon

I like how he “just woke up one day” and the cops look like the military. Where the fuck has he been over the last decade or so? The cops around here went from the standard navy blue police uniform to tactical black military style many years ago. The look a lot more like SWAT even if they aren’t SWAT. It’s as much about looking intimidating as it is anything else. That transformation has been going on since before 9/11 but really went into full tilt after.

I think he may have reached a condition of limited consciousness, but ‘woke up’ overstates it.

70 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:43:15am

Interesting topic on C-SPAN’s Book TV today:

3pm ET - INTERVIEW with viewer questions via calls, e-mails, Twitter, and Facebook

Eric Deggans, author of “Race-Baiter: How the Media Wields Dangerous Words to Divide a Nation”

Not yet on audible. Don’t know if I’ll have time to watch it today. Would be interested if anyone does.

71 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:43:25am

re: #66 Decatur Deb

Off to do the lord’s work, stripping Windows from a friend’s machine and replacing with Ubuntu 12. BBL.

Stick to 12.04 as .10 has some quirks yet. Reminds me I ought to run updates again, bet Oracle has some more security bugs to introduce to my copy of Java…

72 Varek Raith  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:48:36am

re: #66 Decatur Deb

Off to do the lord’s work, stripping Windows from a friend’s machine and replacing with Ubuntu 12. BBL.

I’m afraid the devil has tricked you.

73 dragonath  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:50:49am

re: #34 JasonA

Whoa, I hadn’t realized Drudge had gone so far over the deep end.

This from a guy who fetishized military symbols less than 10 years ago. What would he prefer the police wear, constabulary bobbies?

74 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 11:53:02am

re: #73 dragonath

This from a guy who fetishized military symbols less than 10 years ago. What would he prefer the police wear, constabulary bobbies?

I think he’s just jealously mad that he doesn’t get to ride around on it and play with the weaponry.

75 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:03:16pm

lol

77 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:08:20pm
78 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:08:39pm
79 bratwurst  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:09:02pm

re: #76 Varek Raith

Last Inspection Of West, Texas Fertilizer Plant Was In 1985

Where were the free market inspections during that time to prevent nanny state government from sticking its nose into everyone’s business down there? /

80 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:09:53pm

re: #79 bratwurst

Where were the free market inspections during that time to prevent nanny state government from sticking its nose into everyone’s business down there? /

I think the plant exploding is the free market solution…

81 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:10:17pm

Wow, filed taxes on the 10th and already got refund deposited in the account.

I got to pay bills with it.

82 dragonath  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:10:19pm

“Starve the Beast” was really getting into full swing about then.

83 gwangung  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:10:27pm

re: #52 Kronocide

My response to that: if we really want to save money just get some pitchforks.

Noose, actually.

84 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:11:27pm

Now, I’m “hearing” that they can try him with a military trial because they didn’t read him his Miranda Rights.

*sigh*

85 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:11:50pm

re: #78 Four More Tears

I was 9.

That was the decade I don’t remember.

86 dragonath  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:12:01pm

I see Kansas was quite busy in passing a spate of bad laws this week.

87 Dr. Matt  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:12:49pm

Live Leak has a leaked photo of the Dead Boston Bomber, Tamerlan Tsarnaev. I won’t link to it since it’s pretty awful. *Warning * Graphic * if you’re interested.

88 dragonath  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:15:10pm

re: #80 Four More Tears

I think the plant exploding is the free market solution…

It’s faster to recover from something when it’s been totally destroyed! FDR was throwing good money after bad when he saved the livelihoods of millions of people!

89 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:16:21pm

re: #88 dragonath

It’s faster to recover from something when it’s been totally destroyed! FDR was throwing good money after bad when he saved the livelihoods of millions of people!

The the goal is the bottom line, that’s what we are all here for …

90 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:16:47pm

re: #76 Varek Raith

I made a picture to go with that.

regulations

91 Varek Raith  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:17:28pm
92 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:18:29pm

re: #90 Backwoods_Sleuth

I made a picture to go with that.

regulations

So on my fb, with your permission!

93 Dr. Matt  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:18:55pm
94 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:19:28pm

re: #92 FemNaziBitch

So on my fb, with your permission!

go right ahead! It’s just now starting to make its rounds there.

95 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:22:54pm

The infrared photo of the terrorist hiding in the boat.

twitter.com

96 biorabbi  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:25:11pm

re: #8 Charles Johnson

Yes, this is correct, Charles. He still has Miranda rights even though these rights have not been read to him… yet. Joint CIA, FBI, intel special group will fairly quickly question him for intel, then he will be read Miranda.

My question is will be be an open trial or not-so-open and the venue must be changed if the Feds try him in Boston. Just a hunch.

There is no reason or rational for a military commission to take over. The boy is an American Citizen who did his criminal acts in the US; how is this different than Timothy McVeigh?

97 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:26:37pm

re: #96 biorabbi

Yes, this is correct, Charles. He still has Miranda rights even though these rights have not been read to him… yet. Joint CIA, FBI, intel special group will fairly quickly question him for intel, then he will be read Miranda.

My question is will be be an open trial or not-so-open and the venue must be changed if the Feds try him in Boston. Just a hunch.

There is no reason or rational for a military commission to take over. The boy is an American Citizen who did his criminal acts in the US; how is this different than Timothy McVeigh?

IIRC, this brother is not a naturalized citizen. Thus, the seething idiots think they have a chance to draw and quarter him.

UPDATE: CHARLES corrected me on this. It’s the younger brother who is a citizen.

98 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:27:30pm
99 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:27:37pm

re: #97 FemNaziBitch

IIRC, this brother is not a naturalized citizen. Thus, the seething idiots think they have a chance to draw and quarter him.

No, the younger brother is a naturalized citizen. The older one was still in the process.

100 dragonath  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:27:42pm

re: #95 Randall Gross

The infrared photo of the terrorist hiding in the boat.

twitter.com

Yes, Drudge, the police can see you sweating as you post Alex Jones links and eat stale Fritos.

101 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:27:54pm

re: #99 Charles Johnson

No, the younger brother is a naturalized citizen. The older one was still in the process.

ah! Thanks.

102 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:29:32pm

re: #97 FemNaziBitch

To think this whole meme of trying non citizens in military court meme started on the right from that Tom Clancy novel where they tried drug smugglers at sea. They just can’t shake the idea that it doesn’t work well in the real world.

103 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:29:35pm

re: #98 Randall Gross

dailymail.co.uk

I have a strong hunch that this is related to this tweet from Dzhokhar:

He tweeted to this account a lot. The fact that he asked about “black market” items AFTER the bombings seems very incriminating.

104 AlexRogan  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:30:43pm

re: #61 FemNaziBitch

I realize that at first there is a lot of outrage. Like 9/11, we all felt it.

Then time passes and we calm down and remember we are a nation of “laws, not men” Some of us actually learn from the experience.

Some of us don’t.

Some people find it easier to mainline on fear and hate or to be the dealer to those who do.

105 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:31:09pm

re: #103 Charles Johnson

Keep in mind that drugs, criminal activities, and terror sometimes come as a trifecta.

106 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:32:51pm
107 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:32:59pm
108 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:34:18pm

re: #104 AlexRogan

Some people find it easier to mainline on fear and hate or to be the dealer to those who do.

Yes, some will always see opportunity in such things.


*sigh*

BTW can I use this.

109 Dr. Matt  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:35:43pm

re: #95 Randall Gross

The infrared photo of the terrorist hiding in the boat.

twitter.com

Are the RWNJs freaking over the usage of FLIR? Do they realize this technology is about 50 years old?

110 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:36:21pm

re: #109 Dr. Matt

Probably, they always assume the worst when it’s our government.

111 Olsonist  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:38:26pm

Just tell us where they are and we won’t use it against you.

Actually, I think the police can say that as part of the public safety exception and then still use the answer as evidence. The police are not the prosecution. The police can lie in the course of an investigation. On the other hand, the prosecution can’t lie in the course of a prosecution.

The Miranda warning was created to draw a line between what the police could say before an arrest and after, the public safety exception notwithstanding. In particular, Where are the drugs isn’t about public safety.

112 justaminute  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:40:43pm

Speaking as an Oklahoman that lost friends in the Murrah bombing, McVeigh didn’t seek any appeals in his death sentence. Nichols on the other hand is suffering a lot more with his life sentence and no parole in Super Max. But then I was never a fan of capital punishment, not then, not now.

113 dragonath  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:51:42pm

re: #107 NJDhockeyfan

It’s actually quite a nice anthem…

114 Charles Johnson  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:55:53pm

By the way, that “Terrorista #1” license plate is genuine. Here’s another photo of it:

Image: ZZ1113C9BA.jpg

115 aagcobb  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:55:59pm

re: #58 Eclectic Cyborg

*sigh*

And you know as I was reading the posts up thread I started to consider there’s a high chance someone will try to blow this kids head off before he even makes it to a courtroom.

I’m sure the security is going to be at a presidential level whenever they transport him to jail and the courthouse.

116 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:56:23pm

re: #113 dragonath

It’s actually quite a nice anthem…

Eh, it’s ok. I’d rather see “America the Beautiful” replace it but what do I know?

117 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:56:36pm

Sixty Minutes and CBS Denver twitter accounts got hacked, 60 mins tweeted a Lyndon LaRouche link and CBS denver tweeted a couple of US supplying Al Qaeda in Syria links.

118 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:57:03pm
119 Four More Tears  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 12:59:11pm

re: #118 Randall Gross

And Alex Jones just jizzed in his pants.

120 dragonath  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:03:23pm

re: #116 William Barnett-Lewis

Eh, it’s ok. I’d rather see “America the Beautiful” replace it but what do I know?

The Ray Charles or Mel Brooks version?

121 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:04:56pm

re: #120 dragonath

The Ray Charles or Mel Brooks version?

Bruddah Iz

122 aagcobb  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:05:29pm

re: #112 justaminute

Speaking as an Oklahoman that lost friends in the Murrah bombing, McVeigh didn’t seek any appeals in his death sentence. Nichols on the other hand is suffering a lot more with his life sentence and no parole in Super Max. But then I was never a fan of capital punishment, not then, not now.

If this kid isn’t sentenced to death, he could spend the next six decades or more under 23 hour/day lockdown. I think I’d prefer a quick death.

123 dragonath  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:07:22pm

Alex Jones for President! False flags in your false flags

124 Dr Lizardo  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:10:26pm

re: #122 aagcobb

If this kid isn’t sentenced to death, he could spend the next six decades or more under 23 hour/day lockdown. I think I’d prefer a quick death.

You know, same here. That would truly suck - such a sentence is hell on earth, in my opinion.

125 HoosierHoops  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:15:36pm

Great post Obdi..I was wondering about this and you cleared it up nicely.

126 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:16:53pm

re: #124 Dr Lizardo

You know, same here. That would truly suck - such a sentence is hell on earth, in my opinion.

I just want to know what we can do to prevent other kids from using their free will to commit such atrocities —here and abroad.

Sadly, in the end, I don’t there there is anything we can do—even if we chose some awful form of government.

127 justaminute  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:20:26pm

re: #122 aagcobb

Yes, they do suffer much more than the person who escapes through death. But living in such a pro-death penalty state as Oklahoma and next door to Texas, I consider that one person who is put to death that is innocent too much to have a death penalty. Justice is not equal nor blind here.

128 Randall Gross  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:22:02pm

Now I’m having a twitter debate with someone who thinks the license plate was faked for some reason… argggh.

129 wrenchwench  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:26:59pm

re: #127 justaminute

Good to see you. I hope all’s well.

130 Feline Fearless Leader  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:42:50pm

re: #109 Dr. Matt

Are the RWNJs freaking over the usage of FLIR? Do they realize this technology is about 50 years old?

There are already US Supreme Court cases in the books regarding police using IR devices to “search” houses looking for places using grow lights for pot farming. IIRC, the rulings generally are that they need a warrant for it to be permissible.

en.wikipedia.org

131 Stanley Sea  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 1:48:08pm

re: #112 justaminute

Nice seeing you Justa!

132 Decatur Deb  Sat, Apr 20, 2013 3:59:41pm

re: #71 William Barnett-Lewis

Stick to 12.04 as .10 has some quirks yet. Reminds me I ought to run updates again, bet Oracle has some more security bugs to introduce to my copy of Java…

Yes. Going with 12.4 because it has a longer ‘support’ date than the new one. Might drop my machine back to Ubuntu from Mint—just don’t like the look/feel.


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