Pro Lifer Discusses Shooting Abortion Providers

Sympathizes with anti-abortion terrorist Scott Roeder in interview
Wingnuts • Views: 29,985

A Des Moines anti-abortion activist has publicly proclaimed that “it will be a blessing to the babies” if someone shoots the people who recently reopened a Kansas abortion clinic.

Dave Leach’s comments are being denounced by the leader of Iowa’s largest anti-abortion group, who says such talk is immoral and hurts the cause.

Leach posted the comments this month on YouTube. His posting includes a recorded phone conversation he had with another man, whom Leach identifies as abortion opponent Scott Roeder. Roeder is serving a life prison sentence for the 2009 shooting death of the Wichita clinic’s then-owner, Dr. George Tiller.

Leach has previously suggested that other men were justified in killing other abortion providers. He notes in the video that Tiller’s old clinic was recently reopened by a new abortion agency.

More: Des Moines Man Discusses Shooting Abortion Providers

Jump to bottom

314 comments
1 theheat  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 6:32:26am
“Comments like this don’t feel any different from a jihadist calling for the death of another person he doesn’t agree with,” she said.

Is it alright to call them Christian terrorists yet, and think about deporting them and their radical agenda? //

2 Michael McBacon  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 6:53:29am

This guy’s shop, Family Music Center/Miller Music is right in my neighborhood. I definitely won’t be shopping there again anytime soon.

3 kirkspencer  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 7:38:53am

re: #1 theheat

Is it alright to call them Christian terrorists yet, and think about deporting them and their radical agenda? //

No, not deporting. But terrorists, yes.

Domestic Terrorism (18 USC sec 2331):

(5) the term “domestic terrorism” means activities that—
(A) involve acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State;
(B) appear to be intended—
(i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
(ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
(iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping; and
(C) occur primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the United States.

4 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:17:09am

You can never enforce Gun Control..

5 Kragar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:19:59am

And when they do kill someone, they’ll be “lone wolves”

6 GunstarGreen  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:20:26am

I am pro-life.

Which is why I advocate killing people.

Of course, it goes right along with “Thou Shalt Not Kill… Unless Thou Art Killing Brown People Of Differing Religious Views”.

7 Kragar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:21:20am

Anti-Choice Activist Threatening Abortion Providers Has Link to Personhood USA Leader

Leach has a long record of promoting violence against clinic workers and has defended Roeder’s murder of Tiller.

As a GOP state senate nominee in 2010, Leach suggested that HIV/AIDS was divine punishment for homosexuality. He was eventually defeated by Democratic incumbent Matt McCoy, but his candidacy did win the support of one leading anti-choice activist: Personhood USA board member Chet Gallagher:

Gallagher served as the field coordinator for Mississippi’s failed personhood campaign, led the Nevada Pro-Life Coalition, which worked with Personhood USA to sponsor that state’s personhood initiative, and worked on Personhood USA’s campaigns to outlaw abortion in Montana and Colorado. He also works for Flip Benham’s Operation Save America.

8 HappyWarrior  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:23:44am

This is so typical of the pro-life political movement.

9 Eclectic Cyborg  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:27:02am

So more accurately they are pro-some lives but not all lives?

10 HappyWarrior  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:28:02am

re: #9 Eclectic Cyborg

So more accurately they are pro-some lives but not all lives?

Some of the most enthusiastic death penalty supporters I’ve known were some of the same people I saw claim abortion was genocide so yeah.

11 Kragar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:29:18am

re: #9 Eclectic Cyborg

So more accurately they are pro-some lives but not all lives?

Pro-life for everyone who agrees with them, and death to the non-believers

12 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:30:58am

re: #10 HappyWarrior

Some of the most enthusiastic death penalty supporters were some of the same people I saw claim abortion was genocide so yeah.

I disagree with the Roman Catholic church on many things, but this is one area where their “whole life” doctrine is certainly more consistant than the fundies.

These kind are “Pro-forced-birth but they can then die quietly after that” instead.

13 GunstarGreen  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:31:15am

re: #9 Eclectic Cyborg

So more accurately they are pro-some lives but not all lives?

It mostly has to do with proclaiming themselves adequate judges of which humans ‘deserve’ death, mingled with an ignorance of the historical consequences of just such lines of thinking, repeated ad infinitum throughout human history.

14 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:35:15am

The music shop owner is fantasizing about a ‘legal strategy’:

Leach said he would prefer that anti-abortion activists work through the courts to have abortion banned. He said he’s been offering Roeder legal advice on how to appeal his murder conviction in a way that they hope could lead to the overturning of the Roe v. Wade ruling, which legalized abortion.

Murder a doctor, then work through the courts….

He says,

“I’m 67 years old. I don’t know anything about guns,” he said. “I think I could accomplish more with words.”

But maybe he knows a thing or two about explosives.

In 1996, he was fired as a suburban newspaper reporter when he used his own monthly “Prayer & Action” magazine to reprint 40 pages of the “Army of God Manual,” which gave step-by-step instructions for making plastic explosives and fertilizer bombs. The publication also discussed strategies for disabling or destroying abortion clinics. At the time, he said he published the material because he feared it was about to be suppressed by a court, and he disagreed with such censorship.

He can probably accomplish something with words about explosives. I wonder whether the Tsarnaev brothers read any of his words?

15 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:36:49am

On a somewhat related subject, the Gosnell trial testimony may end as early as today. Gosnell isn’t expected to testify, and his codefendant has opted not to testify as well. That means the case could go to the jury next week. Also, the judge corrected the charges that he tossed yesterday. Three of the murder counts were tossed, but adjusted the ones that were involved.

Common Pleas Judge Jeffrey Minehart had ruled Tuesday that prosecutors over the past month failed to make a case on three of the seven first-degree murder counts, involving aborted babies known as Baby B, Baby C and Baby G.

On Wednesday, Minehart clarified that he did not intend to dismiss charges related to Baby C, which former employee Lynda Williams admits killing after it was alive for 20 minutes.

Instead, Minehart has thrown out the charges involving Baby F, which allegedly jerked its leg after it was born. Another staff member says Gosnell then cut the baby’s neck to “ensure fetal demise.”

16 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:37:47am

I read things like this and what strikes me is how much some people risk in order to make sure that this service is available for women who need it.

17 Tigger2  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:38:02am

Sounds like a Terrorist threat to me.

18 HappyWarrior  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:39:11am

re: #12 William Barnett-Lewis

I disagree with the Roman Catholic church on many things, but this is one area where their “whole life” doctrine is certainly more consistant than the fundies.

These kind are “Pro-forced-birth but they can then die quietly after that” instead.

I think they call it the “Consistency of Life” ethic and yeah I admire that too despite strong disagreements with them on abortion and homosexuality and birth control and women. I respect that a lot more than the fundies who claim abortion is genocide yet are some of the biggest war droolers and death penalty enthusiastic.

19 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:39:50am

I used to consider myself pretty staunchly “anti-abortion” until I watched this video.

20 Kragar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:39:52am

re: #17 Tigger2

Sounds like a Terrorist threat to me.

Using GOP rules, they can be declared enemy combatants and held without their Miranda rights.

21 BLUE POINT 09  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:40:08am

Like showing up with gasoline at a fire. His justification feeds a loon somewhere who wanted to hear just that. How about inciting violence? How about inciting a riot? How about holding this abject idiot accountable for any shooting at any abortion clinic? “I love people so much, I just have to kill a few.”

22 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:41:05am

re: #15 lawhawk

On a somewhat related subject, the Gosnell trial testimony may end as early as today. Gosnell isn’t expected to testify, and his codefendant has opted not to testify as well. That means the case could go to the jury next week. Also, the judge corrected the charges that he tossed yesterday. Three of the murder counts were tossed, but adjusted the ones that were involved.

Keep wondering how many wingnuts were pissed last week that the bombing and subsequent manhunt had pushed their Gosnell-extravaganza off the political radar entirely.

23 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:41:40am

re: #12 William Barnett-Lewis

I disagree with the Roman Catholic church on many things, but this is one area where their “whole life” doctrine is certainly more consistant than the fundies.

These kind are “Pro-forced-birth but they can then die quietly after that” instead.

NO WELFARE OR FOOD STAMPS FOR THE MOOCHERS!!11!!

24 HappyWarrior  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:44:52am

mediamatters.org
Eric Bolling on Keith Ellison- “The Muslim Apologist.” Because we’re at war with all of Islam.//

25 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:45:17am

re: #22 Targetpractice


You mean the ones that even knew that the trial had been going on at all - or that he has been in prison since his arrest in 2011? Or that no one was defending any of the actions he took - and which alleged to have included late term abortions and killing his patients as well as medical malpractice?

26 Eclectic Cyborg  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:45:33am

I’ve been looking through my Bible here and I seem to have found an important commandment here…something about not killing…

27 Eclectic Cyborg  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:47:00am

Heh,

U.S. government sues Lance Armstrong to get sponsorship money back

Yeah because I’m sure ol’ Lance just happens to have $40 mil lying around these days…

28 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:47:22am

re: #26 Eclectic Cyborg

They’ll use the justification that if they kill one to save many that it’s worth it. We saw that line of reasoning used in the Tiller case, and I’d expect to see that used elsewhere. One of these days, that defense might actually sway a favorable jury.

29 GunstarGreen  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:48:49am

re: #19 Vicious Babushka

I used to consider myself pretty staunchly “anti-abortion” until I watched this video.

Basically, it comes down to ideological purity vs. reality.

Almost nobody (there are, of course, exceptions to everything) wakes up in the morning and says “Oh boy! Today is a wonderful day to have an abortion! I think I’ll have three!” It is a decision, often very hard-reached, that has to do with life situations and economics. Simply put, contraception is not infallible, and even if it were, people are not. When a woman decides that, for whatever reasons she has, she does not want to carry a fetus to term, there is nothing to be gained anywhere by forcing her to do so. She made a determination that she would be unwilling or unable to properly care for the child, and forcing someone to be born into such circumstances is cruelty in the very best case. It serves no purpose except to shame and punish the mother, unless the anti-abortion observer is actually, truly pro-life in every situation (no killing of any life for any reason, period), in which case they’re just being consistent. That is, however, almost never the case.

30 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:49:45am

re: #12 William Barnett-Lewis

I disagree with the Roman Catholic church on many things, but this is one area where their “whole life” doctrine is certainly more consistant than the fundies.

These kind are “Pro-forced-birth but they can then die quietly after that” instead.

Since the result of banning abortion is an increase in maternal death, I can’t agree. They may bring their words in line with some kind of internal consistency, but being opposed to abortions that are the will of the mother rather than the will of God is just another anti-scientific, anti-woman, anti-human viewpoint, in my opinion.

31 RadicalModerate  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:51:36am
His posting includes a recorded phone conversation he had with another man, whom Leach identifies as abortion opponent Scott Roeder. Roeder is serving a life prison sentence for the 2009 shooting death of the Wichita clinic’s then-owner, Dr. George Tiller.

I wonder if this guy is involved in Roeder’s and Army of God’s Donald Spitz’s recruitment campaign for domestic terrorism?

Suit Reveals Ties Among Radical Abortion Opponents and Imprisoned Terrorist

I know that given his history, he damn well better be on an FBI watch list.

32 sizzzzlerz  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:52:41am

And when one of their lunatic breathan decides to take action and actually kills someone, he’ll be all “It’s not my fault! Who could have ever forseen…”.

33 HappyWarrior  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:54:50am

re: #32 sizzzzlerz

And when one of their lunatic breathan decides to take action and actually kills someone, he’ll be all “It’s not my fault! Who could have ever forseen…”.

Of course. “What? We never thought that comparing abortion doctors to Joseph Mengele would result in someone trying to murder them.”

34 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:57:49am

re: #27 Eclectic Cyborg

Heh,

U.S. government sues Lance Armstrong to get sponsorship money back

Yeah because I’m sure ol’ Lance just happens to have $40 mil lying around these days…

Most folks saw this coming after he’d fessed up. You don’t cheat Uncle Sam out of millions of dollars and not end up in court or jail.

35 Eclectic Cyborg  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:00:01am

re: #34 Targetpractice

Most folks saw this coming after he’d fessed up. You don’t cheat Uncle Sam out of millions of dollars and not end up in court or jail.

Unless you work on Wall Street.

36 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:00:40am

re: #35 Eclectic Cyborg

Unless you work on Wall Street.

True. Then not only does Uncle Sam feel bad for making you cheat him, he gives you money to cover what you lost.

37 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:04:22am

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

38 kerFuFFler  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:04:52am

re: #1 theheat

Is it alright to call them Christian terrorists yet, and think about deporting them and their radical agenda? //

But, deport to where? Who would want them?

39 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:05:07am

re: #37 EdDantes

What the fuck.

40 jaunte  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:05:18am

Derp.

41 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:05:38am

re: #37 EdDantes

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

Gosnell was not performing a useful service to anyone except himself. He was an opportunist taking advantage of poor and desperate women.

42 jaunte  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:05:59am

re: #37 EdDantes

Try to make your argument without the bullshit.

43 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:06:07am

re: #37 EdDantes

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

If Gosnell is guilty of the charges then I don’t really feel sorry for him at all. He should rot in a cell for the rest of his life, period. I do feel sorry for those who have to deal with the fallout as Dr’s because this guy will be used to paint them all this way.

44 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:06:30am

re: #37 EdDantes

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

Because banning abortion would rid the world of guys like Gosnell?

45 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:06:37am

In other news, the weird spacebar troll got the Stink StickTM

46 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:06:42am

re: #37 EdDantes

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

No, he’s not. Other doctors who provide abortions are. Why is this a hard concept?

47 GunstarGreen  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:07:10am

re: #37 EdDantes

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

What Kermit Gosnell provides is not abortion. It is butchery that also happens to terminate pregnancies. No one is defending him. This kind of trolling is unwarranted and unnecessary.

48 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:07:48am

re: #37 EdDantes

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

Fuck you, Ed. Gosnell is an example of what’s going to happen if abortion is made illegal. He’s a conservative’s wet dream from what I can tell.

49 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:08:16am

re: #37 EdDantes

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

You’re giving conservatives a bad name. They don’t need your help with that.

50 Kragar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:08:17am

re: #37 EdDantes

Gosnell was a fucking butcher who is being used to vilify all abortion providers.

51 Bubblehead II  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:08:27am

re: #37 EdDantes

WTF? The man was a butcher.

52 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:09:33am

Wingnutistan is all umgrbroyzelt today with the fake Beck/Hoft conspiracy about

FLOTUS visiting the SAUDI PERSON OF INTEREST who is also OSAMA BIN LADEN’S SON and also A FREQUENT GUEST AT THE WHITE HOUSE!!11!!TY

53 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:10:50am

re: #37 EdDantes

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

That man is a monster, a modern day Josef Mengele. What is wrong with you?

54 Sol Berdinowitz  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:11:50am

re: #37 EdDantes

I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.

he was providing a service, but doing it in such a way that made it criminal.

55 Stanley Sea  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:13:34am

re: #53 NJDhockeyfan

That man is a monster, a modern day Josef Mengele. What is wrong with you?

Gosnell was a butcher. But no way in any comparison to Mengele. Be careful.

56 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:14:27am

re: #53 NJDhockeyfan

That man is a monster, a modern day Josef Mengele. What is wrong with you?

Um, let’s not Godwin without reason. He wasn’t a Mengele. He was a two-bit murderer preying on the weak and disatvantaged to get money. Mengele was a sociopathic Nazi who performed hideous and terrible experiments, many of them on children. Mengele is not just another word for ‘murderous doctor’.

57 jaunte  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:14:28am
Jenifer Bowen, executive director of Iowa Right to Life, watched the video and was upset by Leach’s words.

“Comments like this don’t feel any different from a jihadist calling for the death of another person he doesn’t agree with,” she said.
desmoinesregister.com

Some parallel behavior is emerging.

58 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:15:35am

DERP
FAIL

59 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:16:49am

There’s no way to claim that Gosnell was providing a valuable service. He was preying on the poor and those who were unfortunate and didn’t know to, or couldn’t, go somewhere else that provided a basic level of care.

The crimes he’s alleged to have violated indicate he operated a house of horrors. Bloody implements that weren’t sanitized. Carrying out illegal late term abortions. Murdering patients by direct and indirect actions (medical malpractice).

The guy had no redeeming characteristics.

Yet the first whiff that law enforcement had that something was wrong was investigating him for running a pill mill. It was only when they searched his premises did they learn the full extent of his depraved indifference to those who came to him for care.

Oh, and you’re not going to find people defending the guy’s actions. They were beyond reprehensible.

60 lawhawk  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:18:00am

re: #58 Vicious Babushka

She’s letting her xenophobia run loose. Figures.

61 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:18:30am

re: #53 NJDhockeyfan

That man is a monster, a modern day Josef Mengele. What is wrong with you?

Nothing is wrong with me. He is all the things that you said and worse. The thread is about a nonentity named Leach, who has killed no one. I want no innocent person killed for any reason. I don’t condone threatening death on abortion providers or anyone with whom I disagree.

62 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:19:23am

Oh brother.

63 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:19:31am

re: #61 EdDantes

Nothing is wrong with me. He is all the things that you said and worse. The thread is about a nonentity named Leach, who has killed no one. I want no innocent person killed for any reason. I don’t condone threatening death on abortion providers or anyone with whom I disagree.

You trolled here by praising Gosnell.

64 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:20:20am

re: #61 EdDantes

He isn’t worse than Mengele, by a factor of like a thousand. And you do know how many abortion doctors have been murdered in this country, right, how many clinics have been firebombed, how often right-wing terrorists have attempted to stop abortions through violence?

And whatever your point of view, instead of presenting it honestly, you had to do it in a passive-aggressive little bleat.

65 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:20:26am

re: #61 EdDantes

Nothing is wrong with me. He is all the things that you said and worse. The thread is about a nonentity named Leach, who has killed no one. I want no innocent person killed for any reason. I don’t condone threatening death on abortion providers or anyone with whom I disagree.

If you’re anti-abortion, grow a spine and just say it.

66 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:25:35am

re: #65 Mattand

If you’re anti-abortion, grow a spine and just say it.

I’m anti abortion.

67 GunstarGreen  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:26:42am

re: #58 Vicious Babushka

DERP
FAIL

I’ve managed to avoid exposing myself to Lady Skeletor for quite some time now, but I just had to see what arguments she’d raise against legal, legitimate immigration.

Holy cow. That goes beyond weapons-grade derp. It’s weapons-of-mass-destruction-grade derp.

68 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:30:12am

re: #66 EdDantes

I’m anti abortion.

Okay. Do you accept that Gosnell is a criminal who is completely atypical of abortion providers, or, in your mind, are they all like him?

69 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:36:52am

re: #68 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Okay. Do you accept that Gosnell is a criminal who is completely atypical of abortion providers, or, in your mind, are they all like him?

Gosnell is a criminal atypical of abortion providers. I ask you: Is a person who kills or threatens to kill an abortion provider atypical of those who are against abortion?

70 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:38:00am

re: #66 EdDantes

I’m anti abortion.

So, if you’re anti-abortion, please explain how your #37 is not a sleazy attempt to smear all abortion providers as being Gosnells.

You certainly don’t think any abortion provider, much less Gosnell, ‘provides a valuable service’.

71 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:41:28am

re: #70 EPR-radar

So, if you’re anti-abortion, please explain how your #37 is not a sleazy attempt to smear all abortion providers as being Gosnells.

You certainly don’t think any abortion provider, much less Gosnell, ‘provides a valuable service’.

It was a “modest proposal” based on the subject of the thread.

72 Eclectic Cyborg  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:43:34am

re: #58 Vicious Babushka

DERP
FAIL

My thought is, maybe we should consider admitting immigrants who can succeed in America, rather than deadbeats.

But we’re not allowed to “discriminate” in favor of immigrants who would be good for America. Instead of helping America, our immigration policies are designed to help other countries solve their internal problems by shipping their losers to us.

The problem isn’t just illegal immigration. I would rather have doctors and engineers sneaking into the country than legally arriving ditch-diggers.

*sigh*

73 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:43:48am

Just another reminder of how utterly impossible it is to talk reasonably with right wingers about this subject. They’re incapable of being honest about it.

74 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:44:05am

re: #70 EPR-radar

So, if you’re anti-abortion, please explain how your #37 is not a sleazy attempt to smear all abortion providers as being Gosnells.

You certainly don’t think any abortion provider, much less Gosnell, ‘provides a valuable service’.

I believe that abortion providers, under some circumstances, provide a valuable service.

75 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:45:33am

re: #74 EdDantes

Which circumstances would those be?

76 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:46:11am

re: #69 EdDantes

Gosnell is a criminal atypical of abortion providers. I ask you: Is a person who kills or threatens to kill an abortion provider atypical of those who are against abortion?

Yes, very. However, there are also a large group of people who, though they would not do it themselves, vocalize support for the action, minimize it, contribute to the defense of the person, and, say that the murdered doctor was also a murderer.

There is really nobody on the ‘pro-abortion’ side standing up for Gosnell. Instead, he is repudiated completely. But when an abortion bomber bombs a clinic, it is far too depressingly easy to find posts from people who believe abortion is murder justifying that crime or equating the murderer and his victim.

77 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:46:52am

re: #75 klys

Which circumstances would those be?

Rape, incest and the life of the mother. And even those are disputed by some.

78 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:48:15am

re: #76 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Yes, very. However, there are also a large group of people who, though they would not do it themselves, vocalize support for the action, minimize it, contribute to the defense of the person, and, say that the murdered doctor was also a murderer.

There is really nobody on the ‘pro-abortion’ side standing up for Gosnell. Instead, he is repudiated completely. But when an abortion bomber bombs a clinic, it is far too depressingly easy to find posts from people who believe abortion is murder justifying that crime or equating the murderer and his victim.

When Dr. George Tiller was murdered, there were literally THOUSANDS of comments all over the right wing blogs, and more than a few posts from the bloggers themselves, applauding the killing.

It was the most repellent display of reactionary hatred I’ve ever seen.

79 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:48:22am

re: #77 EdDantes

So you’re cool with compulsory organ donation?

80 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:50:54am

re: #76 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Yes, very. However, there are also a large group of people who, though they would not do it themselves, vocalize support for the action, minimize it, contribute to the defense of the person, and, say that the murdered doctor was also a murderer.

There is really nobody on the ‘pro-abortion’ side standing up for Gosnell. Instead, he is repudiated completely. But when an abortion bomber bombs a clinic, it is far too depressingly easy to find posts from people who believe abortion is murder justifying that crime or equating the murderer and his victim.

Excellent point. There is a consistent propaganda message put out by a significant fraction of the RW noise machine to the effect that abortion is murder, and stopping it is God’s will. Personal identification of targets has occurred —- e.g., ‘Tiller the baby killer’ by O’Reilly.

When some nutcase acts on such received messages, all we hear is ‘lone wolf’ BS.

There nothing lone wolf about this at all. It is stochastic terrorism whose prime mover is the RW noise machine and its apparatchiks.

81 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:51:04am

In case anyone’s tempted to doubt what I just wrote, please see: Bad Craziness Watch: Right Wing Reaction to the Tiller Murder.

82 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:52:16am

re: #79 klys

So you’re cool with compulsory organ donation?

No.

83 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:53:50am

re: #69 EdDantes

I ask you: Is a person who kills or threatens to kill an abortion provider atypical of those who are against abortion?

People who threaten or approve of murdering abortion providers are NOT rare at all on the right wing.

84 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:54:09am

re: #82 EdDantes

But it’s ok to take away a woman’s right to make decisions about her own body under the premise of saving a life?

Organ donation saves lives too.

85 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:57:54am

Watching Teh Twitterz, I can say with some certainty that MOST wingnuts hold up Gosnell as “typical” of abortion providers, that they want to ban ALL abortion, and they consider the massacre of 1st graders at Sandy Hook of a lesser magnitude than OMG 50 BAZILLION ABORTIONS SINCE ROE V WADE!!11!!

86 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 11:58:27am

re: #83 Charles Johnson

From what I’ve seen, there’s a low percentage of directly threaten, there’s a large percentage of calling them a murderer and saying they should be dead, that god should strike them down, that they don’t deserve to live. It’s a bit more cowardly in that way.

Unfun fact: “Lone wolf” has been co-opted by white supremacists, who use or variations on it in speeches when they want someone in the ‘leaderless resistance’ to commit murder. Nobody gets being an asshole pathetic coward of a murderer-by-proxy like white supremacists.

87 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:01:13pm

re: #83 Charles Johnson

People who threaten or approve of murdering abortion providers are NOT rare at all on the right wing.

That would depend on what you say is “rare.” Murdering abortion doctors is not part of the “right wing.” That is what you choose to believe. If you search the internet you will find anything you want to justify your beliefs.

88 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:04:04pm

re: #87 EdDantes

That would depend on what you say is “rare.” Murdering abortion doctors is not part of the “right wing.” That is what you choose to believe. If you search the internet you will find anything you want to justify your beliefs.

‘Tiller Was Killed by a Pro-Choice Act’
Anti-Abortion Bloggers Getting Crazier
Coulter: ‘I Don’t Think of It as a Murder’

89 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:04:32pm

re: #87 EdDantes

That would depend on what you say is “rare.” Murdering abortion doctors is not part of the “right wing.” That is what you choose to believe. If you search the internet you will find anything you want to justify your beliefs.

What do you choose to believe? Where on the internet did you find justification for it?

90 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:05:23pm

re: #84 klys

But it’s ok to take away a woman’s right to make decisions about her own body under the premise of saving a life?

Organ donation saves lives too.

Organ donation is voluntary and is informed by ones religious or cultural beliefs. A woman has the right to end her pregnancy.

91 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:07:18pm

re: #90 EdDantes

Organ donation is voluntary and is informed by ones religious or cultural beliefs. A woman has the right to end her pregnancy.

Since when does an anti-abortion advocate concede the right of women to terminate their pregnancy?

92 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:07:38pm

re: #88 Charles Johnson

‘Tiller Was Killed by a Pro-Choice Act’
Anti-Abortion Bloggers Getting Crazier
Coulter: ‘I Don’t Think of It as a Murder’

Muslims killed 3000 on September 11, 2001. What does that say about Muslims?

93 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:09:10pm

re: #90 EdDantes

Good, so if we’re all agreed that women should have the right to make that decision and have access to clean, safe providers to do so in a timely manner …why are you anti-abortion except in the case of rape, incest, or health of the mother?

94 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:09:42pm

re: #91 EPR-radar

Since when does an anti-abortion advocate concede the right of women to terminate their pregnancy?

When it is law.

95 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:12:53pm

re: #92 EdDantes

Muslims killed 3000 on September 11, 2001. What does that say about Muslims?

You’re kidding, right? This is what you call an argument?

96 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:13:19pm

It’s like pretzel logic, completely inexplicable and void of internal consistency.

Except that seems mean to pretzels, which are actually very tasty.

97 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:14:21pm

“Murdering abortion doctors is not part of the right wing.”

And if you believe that, I have a friend in Nigeria with $20,000,000,000 ready to transfer to your bank account.

98 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:15:08pm

re: #93 klys

Good, so if we’re all agreed that women should have the right to make that decision and have access to clean, safe providers to do so in a timely manner …why are you anti-abortion except in the case of rape, incest, or health of the mother?

Because I live in the real world. An imperfect world in which we must acknowledge that there are differences in opinion and the way we view or world. And we are not god (whatever that is) and we are not perfect.

99 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:15:21pm

re: #95 Charles Johnson

You’re kidding, right? This is what you call an argument?

9/11 is the favorite right-wing trump card.

Next up: Some Muslims celebrated it!

100 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:16:14pm

Just looked at a calendar. It’s a full moon tonight, lizards.

101 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:17:06pm

re: #99 CuriousLurker

I sent you an email. Nothing too big.

102 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:17:54pm

re: #101 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

I sent you an email. Nothing too big.

Thx. I’ll check.

103 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:18:29pm

re: #95 Charles Johnson

You’re kidding, right? This is what you call an argument?

Indeed it is. 19 Muslims caused all that destruction and you cannot say that radical Islam is a problem. Yet a person from Iowa named Leach is worthy of attention.

104 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:18:47pm

re: #98 EdDantes

Because I live in the real world. An imperfect world in which we must acknowledge that there are differences in opinion and the way we view or world. And we are not god (whatever that is) and we are not perfect.

…I’m not following.

See, you have a right to believe whatever you choose to. But that right stops at the point where you want to enforce your beliefs on my body. We grant bodily autonomy in that organ donation (which also saves lives) is not compulsory. All I am asking for is the same - that no one else has the right to make decisions about my body. Your statements here indicate you are willing to say that women have no bodily autonomy in the case of pregnancy.

105 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:20:20pm

re: #103 EdDantes

Indeed it is. 19 Muslims caused all that destruction and you cannot say that radical Islam is a problem. Yet a person from Iowa named Leach is worthy of attention.

Radical Islam is a problem, though. Almost nobody denies it.

You are flipping out about a fantasy, not reality.

106 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:20:21pm

re: #103 EdDantes

Indeed it is. 19 Muslims caused all that destruction and you cannot say that radical Islam is a problem. Yet a person from Iowa named Leach is worthy of attention.

You’ve gotta be freaking kidding me. Radical Islam & 9/11 is what gave birth to this blog. FFS.

107 jaunte  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:21:01pm

Oh, it’s a topic complaint.

108 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:21:31pm

re: #107 jaunte

It’s true, some people have issues with multitasking.

109 jaunte  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:21:55pm

Hey look, a jihadi thread! —->

110 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:24:02pm

re: #94 EdDantes

When it is law.

OK, so your #90 needs heavy interpretation along these lines:

‘A woman has the (legal) right to end her pregnancy (but I disagree with the scope of this legal right, and would like to see it eliminated or greatly reduced in scope via political action)’

As interpreted, the woman’s volition and autonomy are irrelevant (an essential aspect of the anti-abortion position), so why did the first part of #90 relate to voluntary activities and individual variations in belief (which are irrelevant if abortion is outlawed).

Now, I may have misunderstood you. If you are personally opposed to abortion, but have no issues with it being legal for others, then we have no disagreement on any matter of public policy. I assume that ‘anti-abortion’, without further explanation, means opposed to legal abortion and in favor of legally banning it in most or all cases.

111 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:24:11pm

re: #109 jaunte

Hey look, a jihadi thread! —->

Squirrel! LOL

112 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:24:32pm

re: #104 klys

…I’m not following.

See, you have a right to believe whatever you choose to. But that right stops at the point where you want to enforce your beliefs on my body. We grant bodily autonomy in that organ donation (which also saves lives) is not compulsory. All I am asking for is the same - that no one else has the right to make decisions about my body. Your statements here indicate you are willing to say that women have no bodily autonomy in the case of pregnancy.

I grant you total autonomy over your body. You may do with it what you will.
Women may also do to their bodies which suits their purposes as long as it is in accordance with the laws of their jurisdiction.

113 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:25:55pm

re: #103 EdDantes

These two statements:

…you cannot say that radical Islam is a problem.

Losing the anti-abortion talking point argument? No worries! Just change the subject to those evil Muslims! Works like magic!

114 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:26:34pm

Noun + verb + 9/11

115 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:27:12pm

re: #112 EdDantes

I grant you total autonomy over your body. You may do with it what you will.
Women may also do to their bodies which suits their purposes as long as it is in accordance with the laws of their jurisdiction.

Do you support efforts to restrict the availability of abortion or make it illegal? If so, why? How can you reconcile this with giving women autonomy over their own bodies?

116 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:29:11pm

re: #106 CuriousLurker

You’ve gotta be freaking kidding me. Radical Islam & 9/11 is what gave birth to this blog. FFS.

A throbbing memo gave birth to this site. And then it went into a different direction.

117 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:30:14pm

re: #115 klys

His argument seems to amount to disingenous, passive-aggressive, sniveling “have your cake and eat it too” cowardice:

Sure, women have autonomy over their bodies, but if states want to pass laws restricting abortion, who am I to argue! Laws! Jurisdiction! Derp.

118 kirkspencer  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:30:36pm

gaaah, I hate defending EdDantes, so when this post is done I’m off to find something to wash my hands and mouth.

The thing that seems to be slipping past is “all” vs “some”.

Not ALL rightwingers support murdering doctors who provide abortions. I know, I know some. Equally not ALL muslims are supportive of the radical Islamics.

Most right-wingers are anti-abortion. The majority, however, (or so it appears at this time) prefer to use law and verbal abuse, not bullets, to stop them. A plurality, and possibly the majority, condemned Tiller’s murder — just the same as muslims around the world did the 911 attackers.

From EdDantes previous remarks over the time i’ve been reading him he’s very, very anti-abortion, but I grant he has never spoken in favor or in any way praised Roeder and that ilk.

Now if y’all will excuse me, I need to find some soap and some alcohol.

119 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:31:05pm

re: #116 EdDantes

Hey, buddy, again: Radical Islam is a problem. The next thread is about Biden saying the kids were knockoff Jihadis. There’s the coverage you were whining about.

120 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:31:23pm

re: #118 kirkspencer

gaaah, I hate defending EdDantes, so when this post is done I’m off to find something to wash my hands and mouth.

The thing that seems to be slipping past is “all” vs “some”.

Not ALL rightwingers support murdering doctors who provide abortions. I know, I know some. Equally not ALL muslims are supportive of the radical Islamics.

Most right-wingers are anti-abortion. The majority, however, (or so it appears at this time) prefer to use law and verbal abuse, not bullets, to stop them. A plurality, and possibly the majority, condemned Tiller’s murder — just the same as muslims around the world did the 911 attackers.

From EdDantes previous remarks over the time i’ve been reading him he’s very, very anti-abortion, but I grant he has never spoken in favor or in any way praised Roeder and that ilk.

Now if y’all will excuse me, I need to find some soap and some alcohol.

Nobody said all, though.

121 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:31:24pm

re: #116 EdDantes

A throbbing memo gave birth to this site. And then it went into a different direction.

This site was rolling long before the throbbing memo.

122 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:33:49pm

re: #116 EdDantes

A throbbing memo gave birth to this site. And then it went into a different direction.

Who do you think you’re kidding? Back when the Internet Archive still had copies of LGF dating back to pre- and immediately post-9/11, I read the blog posts and saw the change for myself.

123 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:34:53pm

re: #113 Charles Johnson

These two statements:

Losing the anti-abortion talking point argument? No worries! Just change the subject to those evil Muslims! Works like magic!

Absurd argument, Mr. Johnson. I am comparing using people like leach to smear a group of people while not using radical Muslim as typical of the Islamic community.

124 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:36:21pm

re: #117 Interesting Times

His argument seems to amount to disingenous, passive-aggressive, sniveling “have your cake and eat it too” cowardice:

It is highly dishonest to say ‘a woman has the right to end their pregnancy’ while also believing something like:

“and I have the right to agitate for changes in laws that will take away this ‘right’ women presently have”

125 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:37:08pm

re: #118 kirkspencer

A plurality, and possibly the majority, condemned Tiller’s murder…

Sorry, I have to differ. I kept a very close watch on right wing reactions after Tiller’s murder, and the number of right wing commentators who supported and applauded it was definitely not a tiny minority at all. And those were just the public figures — commenters at right wing blogs overwhelmingly either outright supported the murder, or used weasel words to say something to the effect of, “well, I don’t approve of it, of course, but Tiller was a mass murderer of babies after all.”

I have no way of measuring numbers for these reactions, but I just don’t believe it’s accurate to say that a majority of right wingers denounced Scott Roeder.

126 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:39:30pm

re: #123 EdDantes

Absurd argument, Mr. Johnson. I am comparing using people like leach to smear a group of people while not using radical Muslim as typical of the Islamic community.

There are a limited, but definite, subset of Muslims in the US who minimize attacks by radical Muslims. It is a very small number of Muslims in the US who do this. No prominent ones I can think of— then again, there’s no prominent US muslims, really.

Bill O’Reilly called Dr. Tiller “Killer Tiller”, and Tiller was routinely accused of murder all over the right-wing media. It is trivial to cite source after source of right-wing media minimizing his murder, smearing him as as bad or worse than his killer, etc.

Radical Muslims exist, and are a danger. There are very few radical Muslims in the US. They are not influential in US politics. The anti-abortion fanatics have a ton of pull in US politics, they are here, and while the vast majority aren’t murderous, and the significant majority disapproves of these actions, I do not understand how you, if you are anti-abortion, cannot be goddamn disturbed by the number of anti-abortion activists who justify these murders.

127 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:39:34pm

re: #123 EdDantes

Absurd argument, Mr. Johnson. I am comparing using people like leach to smear a group of people while not using radical Muslim as typical of the Islamic community.

Leach ‘smeared’ himself with his own words. Should he not be called a ‘pro-lifer’ when his words are brought to light? Or do you really think nobody should pay attention to his incitement?

128 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:40:45pm

To put it another way, even the right wingers who DID denounce Roeder for murdering Dr. Tiller very often made it clear that they were doing it for pro forma reasons, and couched their denunciations in terms that made it clear they weren’t very unhappy to see Dr. Tiller dead.

129 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:41:18pm

And by the way, I refuse to get dragged into a stupid diversion about radical Islam.

130 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:42:14pm

re: #122 CuriousLurker

Who do you think you’re kidding? Back when the Internet Archive still had copies of LGF dating back to pre- and immediately post-9/11, I read the blog posts and saw the change for myself.

Look! I know it existed before 9/11. It did not reach prominence until Dan Rather’s absurd left wing attack on George Bush’s National Guard record. I was directed to this site Jonah Goldberg at National Review on line.

131 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:44:02pm

I think at this point, the only way I will respect someone advocating to legislate abortion out of existence is if they are tying it to legislation mandating testing for organ donation, with compulsory kidney and liver donations while alive if needed and then full donation upon death, if possible.

I wouldn’t necessarily agree with that position, but it would at least be consistent with what they’re asking women to give up in the name of saving lives.

132 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:47:26pm

re: #118 kirkspencer

gaaah, I hate defending EdDantes, so when this post is done I’m off to find something to wash my hands and mouth.

The thing that seems to be slipping past is “all” vs “some”.

Not ALL rightwingers support murdering doctors who provide abortions. I know, I know some. Equally not ALL muslims are supportive of the radical Islamics.

Most right-wingers are anti-abortion. The majority, however, (or so it appears at this time) prefer to use law and verbal abuse, not bullets, to stop them. A plurality, and possibly the majority, condemned Tiller’s murder — just the same as muslims around the world did the 911 attackers.

From EdDantes previous remarks over the time i’ve been reading him he’s very, very anti-abortion, but I grant he has never spoken in favor or in any way praised Roeder and that ilk.

Now if y’all will excuse me, I need to find some soap and some alcohol.

Kirk, I appreciate your kinda support. I hope you are able to remove the EdDantes stank from you.You are a mensch ( I mean that) and I am not very, very anti-abortion. God speed.

133 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:49:09pm

re: #131 klys

I think at this point, the only way I will respect someone advocating to legislate abortion out of existence is if they are tying it to legislation mandating testing for organ donation, with compulsory kidney and liver donations while alive if needed and then full donation upon death, if possible.

I wouldn’t necessarily agree with that position, but it would at least be consistent with what they’re asking women to give up in the name of saving lives.

Even mandatory full organ donation upon death would be viewed as an unconscionable infringement on autonomy by many, and that is much less of an imposition that a forced pregnancy.

Some time ago, I came to the simple conclusion that political agitation against abortion in the US is driven almost exclusively by straight-up misogyny. It is laughable in most cases to look to ‘pro-lifers’ for any kind of consistency on life issues.

134 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:49:19pm

re: #132 EdDantes

Hi, if you’d answer my questions in #115, that would be great. I swear, they’re not that difficult.

Thanks!

135 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:50:05pm

re: #130 EdDantes

Look! I know it existed before 9/11. It did not reach prominence until Dan Rather’s absurd left wing attack on George Bush’s National Guard record. I was directed to this site Jonah Goldberg at National Review on line.

Look! That’s not what you said.

re: #116 EdDantes

A throbbing memo gave birth to this site. And then it went into a different direction.

136 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:50:22pm

re: #133 EPR-radar

Even mandatory full organ donation upon death would be viewed as an unconscionable infringement on autonomy by many, and that is much less of an imposition that a forced pregnancy.

Some time ago, I came to the simple conclusion that political agitation against abortion in the US is driven almost exclusively by straight-up misogyny. It is laughable in most cases to look to ‘pro-lifers’ for any kind of consistency on life issues.

I know, but at least it’s a useful tool to force confrontation of what’s actually driving the beliefs, instead of shrouding it in ‘saving lives’.

137 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:50:29pm

re: #129 Charles Johnson

And by the way, I refuse to get dragged into a stupid diversion about radical Islam.

Why should you? radical Islam does not exist. Not in this country anyway.

138 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:51:29pm

Just anti-abortion enough to troll a thread about calling for the murder of doctors who are risking their lives to reopen a practice that was closed when the previous provider was murdered.

I’d hate to see a ‘very, very’ anti-abortion troll.

139 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:55:38pm

re: #137 EdDantes

Why should you? radical Islam does not exist. Not in this country anyway.

A fine self-beclowning.

Any evidence for the remarkable proposition that LGF is infested with those who claim radical Islam does not exist in the US?

140 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 12:55:53pm

re: #134 klys

Hi, if you’d answer my questions in #115, that would be great. I swear, they’re not that difficult.

Thanks!

Sorry, I missed your 115. Here is my answer: I do not believe in making abortion illegal. I believe that women, like men, should have autonomy over their bodies under the laws of their jurisdiction.

141 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:00:58pm

re: #139 EPR-radar

A fine self-beclowning.

Any evidence for the remarkable proposition that LGF is infested with those who claim radical Islam does not exist in the US?

Yes. There are no Radical Islam threads. All threads are about murderous right wingers. Check the top of this thread.

142 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:02:36pm

re: #140 EdDantes

Sorry, I missed your 115. Here is my answer: I do not believe in making abortion illegal. I believe that women, like men, should have autonomy over their bodies under the laws of their jurisdiction.

re: #66 EdDantes

I’m anti abortion.

So when you say you’re anti-abortion, what do you mean? It’s against your personal beliefs but you feel it should be allowed anyway? Or that you’re hoping to see legislative change that would restrict its availability except for the typical exceptions? If we assume that control over our bodies is a right, which most people do, what rationale is there for revoking this right from women only?

143 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:05:14pm

re: #141 EdDantes

Yes. There are no Radical Islam threads. All threads are about murderous right wingers. Check the top of this thread.

Check the next thread.

What does just flat-out lying gain you?

144 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:06:35pm

re: #141 EdDantes

Yes. There are no Radical Islam threads. All threads are about murderous right wingers. Check the top of this thread.

Self-beclowning —- round 2

Previous thread title is “Tuesday Evening Weirdness: David Byrne and St. Vincent, “Who””

Doesn’t seem like a thread about murderous right wingers to me. What am I missing? // dripping

145 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:08:14pm

re: #141 EdDantes

Yes. There are no Radical Islam threads. All threads are about murderous right wingers. Check the top of this thread.

*blinks* Wait. Wut?

So what blog was I on for the past week where there were numerous articles about the Boston bombers and where their radicalization was discussed over and over?

146 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:08:29pm

re: #125 Charles Johnson

Sorry, I have to differ. I kept a very close watch on right wing reactions after Tiller’s murder, and the number of right wing commentators who supported and applauded it was definitely not a tiny minority at all. And those were just the public figures — commenters at right wing blogs overwhelmingly either outright supported the murder, or used weasel words to say something to the effect of, “well, I don’t approve of it, of course, but Tiller was a mass murderer of babies after all.”

I have no way of measuring numbers for these reactions, but I just don’t believe it’s accurate to say that a majority of right wingers denounced Scott Roeder.

Of course they did! I respect the fact that this is your website and that you allow me to stay here, but please don’t make these sweeping generalities against those who are to the right of you.

147 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:11:04pm

Pro LIFE…until birth I guess…/

148 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:11:37pm

re: #146 EdDantes

Of course they did! I respect the fact that this is your website and that you allow me to stay here, but please don’t make these sweeping generalities against those who are to the right of you.

He provided evidence for his assertions. What do you provide? Assertions.

149 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:14:13pm

re: #145 CuriousLurker

ermahgerd…CL, didn’t a simiar conversation JUST occur with Buck, different topic, similar tactics? Or am I mistaken? Sheeh it just seems so deja vu all over again…

150 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:16:37pm

re: #149 DisturbedEma

ermahgerd…CL, didn’t a simiar conversation JUST occur with Buck, different topic, similar tactics? Or am I mistaken? Sheeh it just seems so deja vu all over again…

It’s a popular dance of the old-timers who either have not yet been sent to Boot Hill or have slipped in with socks: “This site doesn’t cater to me anymore, the topics are one-sided against me and my fellow travelers, and Charles is a hypocrite for focusing on this and not on a totally unrelated topic that I view as its exact opposite (i.e. liberals never want to talk about bad things liberals are doing).”

151 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:18:02pm

re: #146 EdDantes

Of course they did! I respect the fact that this is your website and that you allow me to stay here, but please don’t make these sweeping generalities against those who are to the right of you.

Fuck it, I will.

The current GOP/conservative movement in this country is driven in large part by religion. That’s the main reason for opposing abortion. And like it or not, the US is a secular nation.

Trying to get something made illegal because it allegedly is against your holy book doesn’t cut it here.

You guys won’t be happy until the Bible supercedes the Constitution. You’re becoming the American Taliban and you’re too blinded by your own fanaticism to see it.

152 abolitionist  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:18:11pm

re: #106 CuriousLurker

You’ve gotta be freaking kidding me. Radical Islam & 9/11 is what gave birth to this blog. FFS.

re: #116 EdDantes

A throbbing memo gave birth to this site. And then it went into a different direction.

Actually, Charles ran this blog for several months before September 2001. Topics included music, cycling, and programming/software. Thread comments were typically in the single digits back then. Charles dedicated much more of himself to it after 911.

153 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:19:31pm

You are all too clever for me. I can’t keep up.

154 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:21:27pm

re: #153 EdDantes

More questions for you in #142, if you don’t mind. On the original topic.

155 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:22:17pm

re: #153 EdDantes

You are all too clever for me. I can’t keep up.

Oh, please. You’re the one who went all passive-agressive and started this in first place, instead of just saying what was really on your mind.

156 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:22:35pm

re: #150 Targetpractice

I was pretty active here during the 2008 election- I came back because I couldn’t make sense of the current entity that passes for the party I thought I know. I am grateful for LGF because it is impossible to have rational discussions with most of the people I have around me…

157 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:23:28pm

One right winger who did denounce the murderer of Dr. Tiller: Bill O’Reilly.

Of course, that was after years of inciting hatred against him, calling him “Tiller the Baby Killer” over and over and over, and comparing him to Nazi Dr. Mengele.

But he DID denounce the murderer after Tiller was gunned down in his church.

That’s how right wing commentators “denounced” the murder.

158 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:24:02pm

re: #153 EdDantes

Really? There are questions for you in the thread…waiting for you

159 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:25:08pm

re: #157 Charles Johnson

One right winger who did denounce the murderer of Dr. Tiller: Bill O’Reilly.

Of course, that was after years of inciting hatred against him, calling him “Tiller the Baby Killer” over and over and over, and comparing him to Nazi Dr. Mengele.

But he DID denounce the murderer after Tiller was gunned down in his church.

That’s how right wing commentators “denounced” the murder.

That cuts zero ice with me. It is an unfortunate feature of legal reality that there is no way to legally charge O’Reilly with his share of the responsibility for Tiller’s murder.

160 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:25:33pm

re: #156 DisturbedEma

I was pretty active here during the 2008 election- I came back because I couldn’t make sense of the current entity that passes for the party I thought I know. I am grateful for LGF because it is impossible to have rational discussions with most of the people I have around me…

Indeed, I found myself facing something similar before I returned.

Then there was the fellow we had who hid mostly in the Pages a couple weeks back, who wished to engage in passive-aggressive BS over how “badly” he’d been treated back in the day here at LGF and now wanted Charles to basically grovel at his feet for forgiveness.

161 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:26:24pm

re: #154 klys

More questions for you in #142, if you don’t mind. On the original topic.

Abortion is against my personal beliefs! But I understand that I am not the supreme arbiter in everything. What is it you want to know!

162 Targetpractice  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:26:38pm

re: #157 Charles Johnson

One right winger who did denounce the murderer of Dr. Tiller: Bill O’Reilly.

Of course, that was after years of inciting hatred against him, calling him “Tiller the Baby Killer” over and over and over, and comparing him to Nazi Dr. Mengele.

But he DID denounce the murderer after Tiller was gunned down in his church.

That’s how right wing commentators “denounced” the murder.

Which was on the same moral level as all those who went “I don’t agree with his murders, BUT…!”

163 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:26:44pm

re: #160 Targetpractice

Indeed, I found myself facing something similar before I returned.

Then there was the fellow we had who hid mostly in the Pages a couple weeks back, who wished to engage in passive-aggressive BS over how “badly” he’d been treated back in the day here at LGF and now wanted Charles to basically grovel at his feet for forgiveness.

That was exceptionally tedious. I could have done without the reminder that fools can be found at all points along the political spectrum.

164 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:27:27pm

re: #155 Mattand

Oh, please. You’re the one who went all passive-agressive and started this in first place, instead of just saying what was really on your mind.

I said what was on my mind.

165 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:27:47pm

re: #152 abolitionist

Actually, Charles ran this blog for several months before September 2001. Topics included music, cycling, and programming/software. Thread comments were typically in the single digits back then. Charles dedicate much more of himself to it after 911.

Yep, that’s what I said and what Ed was disputing.

re: #122 CuriousLurker

Who do you think you’re kidding? Back when the Internet Archive still had copies of LGF dating back to pre- and immediately post-9/11, I read the blog posts and saw the change for myself.

I saw a small, run of the mill blog, then 9/11 happened. Charles was shocked, saddened & angry beyond words, and LGF as we know it today was born. (Okay, not exactly as we know it today, but I think you know what I mean—the focus changed.)

166 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:28:19pm

re: #158 DisturbedEma

Really? There are questions for you in the thread…waiting for you

List them, please.

167 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:30:17pm

re: #161 EdDantes

Abortion is against my personal beliefs! But I understand that I am not the supreme arbiter in everything. What is it you want to know!

I can respect abortion being against your personal beliefs. (I’m sure not going to force you - or anyone else - to have one.) I’m just trying to figure out if you support efforts to restrict access to abortion for women, as that is typically what people mean when they say they are anti-abortion.

There are a lot of folks on the pro-choice side who are personally against abortion but believe having it available safely and affordably is the right thing to do, because other women should not be forced to live according to their personal beliefs. Unfortunately, this is not the view taken by the majority of “right-wing” conservatives.

Hence the request for clarification.

168 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:32:19pm

I used to post at Free Republic before coming here (and also concurrently, until I took the left fork in the road 5 years ago), and I also watch the #TGDN and #TCOT Twitter feed, and I can honestly say that I have NEVER seen a “pro-choice” right-winger.

The last time I got into it with a right-winger, not even arguing that I was “pro-abortion” or “pro-choice” but simply requesting a reliable data source for the LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH meme they keep throwing around I got the WAAHH UR A LIBRUL TROLL UR PRETENDING TO BE PRO-LIFE.

WTF.

169 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:33:00pm

The Company They Keep: Republican House Leader Meets With Radical Anti-Choice Terrorist

In the midst of a national crisis of epic proportions, in the face of deepening unemployment, international instabiilty, climate change and profound and lasting shifts in the United States economy, John Boehner, speaker-designate of the House of Representatives, is preparing to govern.

How?

By meeting with domestic terrorist Randall Terry, original founder of Operation Rescue, and the man who after the murder of Dr. George Tiller in the vestibule of his church referred to Dr. Tiller as a “mass murderer” and said that, “horrifically, he reaped what he sowed.” How is that for signaling support for the murder of physicians?

170 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:37:01pm

re: #167 klys

I can respect abortion being against your personal beliefs. (I’m sure not going to force you - or anyone else - to have one.) I’m just trying to figure out if you support efforts to restrict access to abortion for women, as that is typically what people mean when they say they are anti-abortion.

I will add: you have danced around answering this question (do you support efforts to restrict access to abortion for women) by saying that it is currently legal under the law and that women should have autonomy over their bodies as permitted by the laws of the jurisdiction they live in. Those answers say nothing about whether or not you support changing these laws. That is the question being asked.

171 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:37:11pm

I was Googling to find out if Boehner had denounced the murder of Dr. Tiller … and found that.

I stopped looking for the denunciation. I don’t care if he did say some empty words. This is a perfect example of what I’m talking about when I say that mainstream Republicans are tacitly supporting the extremists who commit violence against abortion providers.

172 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:38:20pm

re: #167 klys

I can respect abortion being against your personal beliefs. (I’m sure not going to force you - or anyone else - to have one.) I’m just trying to figure out if you support efforts to restrict access to abortion for women, as that is typically what people mean when they say they are anti-abortion.

There are a lot of folks on the pro-choice side who are personally against abortion but believe having it available safely and affordably is the right thing to do, because other women should not be forced to live according to their personal beliefs. Unfortunately, this is not the view taken by the majority of “right-wing” conservatives.

Hence the request for clarification.

I do not seek restricting access to legal abortion. I follow the law of the land. I am begining to doubt what, “right winger,” means.

173 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:39:39pm

re: #172 EdDantes

I do not seek restricting access to legal abortion. I follow the law of the land. I am begining to doubt what, “right winger,” means.

I’m sorry, this still isn’t clear. “Legal abortion” is about access. You previously said that you accept abortion only in cases of incest, rape, or the health of the mother.

What do you think the law should be? Should a woman be able to get an abortion in general, or should one of the above conditions have to apply?

174 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:40:49pm

re: #169 Charles Johnson

One of Randall Terry’s greatest hits:

I want you to just let a wave of intolerance wash over you. I want you to let a wave of hatred wash over you. Yes, hate is good … if a Christian voted for Clinton, he sinned against God. It’s that simple. Our goal is a Christian nation. We have a biblical duty, we are called by God to conquer this country…

So Boehner consulted with this hateful theocrat prior to becoming Speaker of the House. Seems like the job he has done since then is consistent with this ‘preparation’.

175 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:40:54pm

re: #171 Charles Johnson

I was Googling to find out if Boehner had denounced the murder of Dr. Tiller … and found that.

I stopped looking for the denunciation. I don’t care if he did say some empty words. This is a perfect example of what I’m talking about when I say that mainstream Republicans are tacitly supporting the extremists who commit violence against abortion providers.

You have, unquestionably, undeniably, by any reasonable standard jumped the shark. Respectfully.

176 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:41:48pm

lol

177 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:42:20pm

re: #172 EdDantes

I do not seek restricting access to legal abortion. I follow the law of the land. I am begining to doubt what, “right winger,” means.

Great, I’m glad we’re on the same page in thinking that abortion should be safely, affordably, and reasonably accessible to all women. It’s too bad that one of the two major parties in the US thinks otherwise, but hey. Progress.

To help with the second part, why don’t you tell us what “right-wing” means to you? Since it seems that the standard definition here isn’t the same as yours. We frequently use it to refer to commentators on the right side of the American political spectrum, the majority of whom seem to be against letting women choose and willing to pass lots of laws restricting women’s bodily autonomy.

178 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:43:15pm

re: #173 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

I’m sorry, this still isn’t clear. “Legal abortion” is about access. You previously said that you accept abortion only in cases of incest, rape, or the health of the mother.

What do you think the law should be? Should a woman be able to get an abortion in general, or should one of the above conditions have to apply?

One of the conditions should apply.

179 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:43:35pm

re: #164 EdDantes

I said what was on my mind.

No, you were trolling and when people called you out on it, you tried to martyr yourself as a misunderstood Jonathan Swift.

I think Klys said it best. I’ve noticed all too often that when conservatives/Republicans/the religious are forced into a corner, they never come out and say they want abortion outright banned. Even thought that’s what they want.

I fail to see how you’re any different than that.

EDIT: Just saw #172. At least you’re willing to admit that abortion is legal.

180 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:44:50pm

re: #178 EdDantes

One of the conditions should apply.

Okay. Thanks for being straight.

In what way is Boehner meeting with Randall Terry— Boehner, who is one of the heads of the GOP, and Terry, who is the hateful inspiration for the murder of abortion doctors— not evidence of the mainstreaming of acceptance of Randall Terry-type people in the right-wing?

181 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:45:00pm

re: #179 Mattand

No, you were trolling and when people called you out on it, you tried to martyr yourself as a misunderstood Jonathan Swift.

I think Klys said it best. I’ve noticed all too often that when conservatives/Republicans/the religious are forced into a corner, they never come out and say they want abortion outright banned. Even thought that’s what they want.

I fail to see how you’re any different than that.

I don’t want abortion banned ouright.

182 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:45:29pm

re: #178 EdDantes

One of the conditions should apply.

re: #140 EdDantes

Sorry, I missed your 115. Here is my answer: I do not believe in making abortion illegal. I believe that women, like men, should have autonomy over their bodies under the laws of their jurisdiction.

I think you missed something here. My right to bodily autonomy is not something you get to put conditions on, or we’re right back to the whole discussion of compulsory organ donation.

183 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:45:47pm

re: #181 EdDantes

I don’t want abortion banned ouright.

Just out of interest, for the ‘rape’ exception, is it enough that the woman says that it was rape, or does she have to press charges against someone, too?

184 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:46:50pm

re: #182 klys

re: #140 EdDantes

I think you missed something here. My right to bodily autonomy is not something you get to put conditions on, or we’re right back to the whole discussion of compulsory organ donation.

I think that your organs should be donated.

185 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:47:21pm

re: #175 EdDantes

re: #172 EdDantes

You don’t doubt what “right winger” means…by using the “jump the shark” comment as a means of come back, it seems to me that the problem is not the blog per se, it is that you can’t see your place here because people disagree with you? Because you are insulted? not sure…but you surely know that this blog is filled with disagreements and discussions, and if it’s not patting you on the back for your every thought, well, that’s not the Lizard Way

186 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:47:31pm

re: #184 EdDantes

I think that your organs should be donated.

Er… while alive, you understand, is what we’re talking about.

187 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:48:05pm

re: #184 EdDantes

I think that your organs should be donated.

That may be the most accurate thing you’ve said so far, since pregnancy is, in fact, the donation of the woman’s organs to the support of the embryo/fetus for the duration of the pregnancy.

188 DisturbedEma  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:48:27pm

re: #184 EdDantes

Whoa, for real? Like as a law? please tell me you missed a sarc tag…

189 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:48:30pm

re: #183 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Just out of interest, for the ‘rape’ exception, is it enough that the woman says that it was rape, or does she have to press charges against someone, too?

Of course she should press charges if she is raped. A crime was committed.

190 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:50:15pm

re: #188 DisturbedEma

Whoa, for real? Like as a law? please tell me you missed a sarc tag…

Oh, he’s mad that we pointed out that if you can’t force people to donate organs in order to save a life, maybe you can’t force women to carry a pregnancy to term. I’m sort of thinking that I got under his skin with that.

191 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:51:13pm

re: #184 EdDantes

I think that your organs should be donated.

Start looking for a brain donor.

192 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:51:15pm

re: #189 EdDantes

Of course she should press charges if she is raped. A crime was committed.

Is a conviction required or just charges?

193 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:52:14pm

re: #190 klys

Oh, he’s mad that we pointed out that if you can’t force people to donate organs in order to save a life, maybe you can’t force women to carry a pregnancy to term. I’m sort of thinking that I got under his skin with that.

Not at all. You can’t get get under my skin. That is hubris.

194 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:53:10pm

re: #190 klys

Oh, he’s mad that we pointed out that if you can’t force people to donate organs in order to save a life, maybe you can’t force women to carry a pregnancy to term. I’m sort of thinking that I got under his skin with that.

Jamesfirecat will be so proud, or jealous maybe.

195 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:53:14pm

re: #178 EdDantes

One of the conditions should apply.

What’s the old saying? “If men could get pregnant, not only would abortion be legal, it’d be a sacrement.”

196 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:54:02pm

re: #192 klys

Is a conviction required or just charges?

Just charges. The judicial system does not dispense justice, only rulings.

197 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:54:51pm

re: #195 Mattand

What’s the old saying? “If men could get pregnant, not only would abortion be legal, it’d be a sacrement.”

Correct. I heard that in the seventies.

198 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:57:24pm

re: #193 EdDantes

Not at all. You can’t get get under my skin. That is hubris.

I guess that’s just what you say to charm all the girls then. ;) Here’s a pro-tip: it’s not very effective as a pickup line to tell a woman you want to donate her organs for the next 9 months.

199 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:57:26pm

re: #195 Mattand

What’s the old saying? “If men could get pregnant, not only would abortion be legal, it’d be a sacrement.”

It’s the political version of an old comedy routine:

Guy #1: “I’m a man of stone. I’m completely indifferent to pain.”

Guy #2 jabs guy #1 in the ass with a long needle

Guy #1: “AARGH! You idiot! I meant that I’m completely indifferent to other people’s pain”

200 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 1:59:39pm

re: #197 EdDantes

Correct. I heard that in the seventies.

And here we are, 40 years later, and you’re placing conditions on how women should control their bodies.

201 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:02:37pm

re: #198 klys

I guess that’s just what you say to charm all the girls then. ;) Here’s a pro-tip: it’s not very effective as a pickup line to tell a woman you want to donate her organs for the next 9 months.

How about, ” I will pay for the abortion?” Will that get me some action?

202 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:04:07pm

re: #200 Mattand

And here we are, 40 years later, and you’re placing conditions on how women should control their bodies.

I have placed to conditions on anyone. Explain what you are talking about.

203 jaunte  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:04:15pm

re: #201 EdDantes

Yes, try that.

204 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:04:23pm

re: #201 EdDantes

How about, ” I will pay for the abortion?” Will that get me some action?

Well, since you’re only in favor of abortion in cases of rape, incest, or threat to the life of the mother …

I think I’m not going to touch that one.

205 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:04:51pm

re: #176 Charles Johnson

lol

I too am laughing.

206 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:05:14pm

re: #202 EdDantes

I have placed to conditions on anyone. Explain what you are talking about.

When asked what you think the law regarding abortions should be, you replied: re: #178 EdDantes

One of the conditions should apply.

Makes sense now?

207 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:05:49pm

re: #202 EdDantes

I have placed to conditions on anyone. Explain what you are talking about.

You saying conditions should apply.

208 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:06:17pm

re: #204 klys

Well, since you’re only in favor of abortion in cases of rape, incest, or threat to the life of the mother …

I think I’m not going to touch that one.

What are the other conditions? Inconvenience?

209 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:07:10pm

re: #208 EdDantes

What are the other conditions? Inconvenience?

I think you failed to read how your offer to pay for the abortion might come across in light of the three conditions where you believe abortion should be allowed.

210 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:07:57pm

re: #207 Mattand

You saying conditions should apply.

I have placed no conditions on anyone. I do not make laws.

211 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:09:33pm

re: #210 EdDantes

I have placed no conditions on anyone. I do not make laws.

And you don’t vote for people who do based on how their beliefs line up with yours? You take no part in the political process whatsoever?

At least own your beliefs and what you want to see happen in the world.

212 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:10:09pm

re: #189 EdDantes

Of course she should press charges if she is raped. A crime was committed.

You have this weird way of dodging the actual question. I asked you if you’d require a woman press charges in order to get an abortion. You see, a lot of rapes are he-said/she-said situations where it is not going to be provable. This means a lot of women wind up being raped but unable to take it to court even if they want to face that harrowing ordeal.

So, again, does she have to press charges? Even if she knows that the case would not be prosecuted or would wind up with an acquittal on insufficiency of evidence?

213 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:10:22pm

re: #209 klys

I think you failed to read how your offer to pay for the abortion might come across in light of the three conditions where you believe abortion should be allowed.

I offered to pay for nothing. It was a question. Can you not understand what you read?

214 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:11:08pm

re: #210 EdDantes

I have placed no conditions on anyone. I do not make laws.

Oh, for fuck’s sake. You’re really going to go into kindergarten mode on this?

215 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:11:30pm

re: #201 EdDantes

How about, ” I will pay for the abortion?” Will that get me some action?

re: #213 EdDantes

I offered to pay for nothing. It was a question. Can you not understand what you read?

216 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:11:56pm

Here is the problem that I have with “exceptions for rape, incest and life of the mother.” This is not compassionate at all.

In order to prove one of these exceptions, a woman has to jump through flaming hoops filling out forms, making depositions, submitting affidavits, getting notary signatures, and other and various LEGAL (NOT MEDICAL) documents, such that the 1st trimester cutoff for a simple medical procedure is frequently missed due to the sheer volume of paperwork that is required for an exception. A 2nd trimester procedure is then levels of magnitude more complicated and many clinics are not equipped to perform them.

“Life of the mother” is a critical decision that is best left to a qualified medical professional. This is a condition that can change dramatically in a matter of hours and THERE IS NO TIME to submit all the required paperwork, as was tragically demonstrated by the case in Ireland.

The purpose of placing all these legal burdens on the woman is simply to discourage her from having an abortion altogether. Not only that, but these same people who want to limit, actually ban abortion, also want to put limits on contraception.

Oh and they also want to put limits on having sex.

QED:

217 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:13:03pm

I’m not reminded of this often, but now I am.

I think some people are anti-abortion because they are jealous and upset that women are god when it comes to creating a new human life. Women get to decide whether it happens or not, when they are free.

218 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:15:28pm

re: #210 EdDantes

I have placed no conditions on anyone. I do not make laws.

This is getting old. Let’s put the questions in one place and make them yes or no.

1) Do you participate in the political process, yes or no?

2) If yes, are your votes and/or advocacy for issues/candidates affected by how well or poorly their views match yours on abortion (and other issues as well)?

If yes, you are participating in the political process (as you have every right to do) to increase the chances of your views on abortion being enacted into law. What is the point of being disingenuous about this?

219 CuriousLurker  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:17:04pm

re: #185 DisturbedEma

…but you surely know that this blog is filled with disagreements and discussions, and if it’s not patting you on the back for your every thought, well, that’s not the Lizard Way

Heh, QFT.

220 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:18:12pm

re: #216 Vicious Babushka

It’s never about compassion for the woman. Ever.

Compassion is acknowledging that there are so many different reasons that women make this decision. Compassion is supporting women regardless of their choice.

Compassion is not trying to guilt or shame women into having a child. Compassion is not adding extra unnecessary steps to the process in order to make it more difficult. Compassion is not restricting access to information and birth control, making it more likely that an unintended pregnancy may result - which by far disproportionately affects the woman.

221 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:19:05pm

re: #212 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

You have this weird way of dodging the actual question. I asked you if you’d require a woman press charges in order to get an abortion. You see, a lot of rapes are he-said/she-said situations where it is not going to be provable. This means a lot of women wind up being raped but unable to take it to court even if they want to face that harrowing ordeal.

So, again, does she have to press charges? Even if she knows that the case would not be prosecuted or would wind up with an acquittal on insufficiency of evidence?

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning. I disagree.

222 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:20:23pm

re: #220 klys

It’s never about compassion for the woman. Ever.

Compassion is acknowledging that there are so many different reasons that women make this decision. Compassion is supporting women regardless of their choice.

Compassion is not trying to guilt or shame women into having a child. Compassion is not adding extra unnecessary steps to the process in order to make it more difficult. Compassion is not restricting access to information and birth control, making it more likely that an unintended pregnancy may result - which by far disproportionately affects the woman.

I don’t know if it’s a conscious decision on Ed’s part, but there is the whiff of slut shaming in the “no abortion except A, B, C” thought process.

223 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:23:34pm

re: #221 EdDantes

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning. I disagree.

Actually, I’m for post-birth abortions too, up to 18 years of age.

//

Seriously, how about addressing the actual arguments folks have made instead of waving your strawman around?

224 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:23:49pm

re: #222 Mattand

“Slut shaming.” Quite a stretch. But if it makes you happy.

225 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:24:00pm

re: #221 EdDantes

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning. I disagree.

I don’t think Obdicut has said that is his belief, so why are you making shit up?

A 3rd trimester pregnancy termination is a complicated surgical procedure and should never be performed because hey! My right to choose! The decision to terminate a pregnancy at such a late stage is frequently accomplished by an early delivery. In most cases, the termination is due to tragic medical circumstances.

226 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:25:09pm

re: #225 Vicious Babushka

I don’t think Obdicut has said that is his belief, so why are you making shit up?

A 3rd trimester pregnancy termination is a complicated surgical procedure and should never be performed because hey! My right to choose! The decision to terminate a pregnancy at such a late stage is frequently accomplished by an early delivery. In most cases, the termination is due to tragic medical circumstances.

Shhh, facts and reasonable discourse based on evidence aren’t welcome in this discussion. We’re all just supposed to sacrifice any right to say what happens to our bodies because babies!

227 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:26:28pm

re: #223 klys

Actually, I’m for post-birth abortions too, up to 18 years of age.

//

Seriously, how about addressing the actual arguments folks have made instead of waving your strawman around?

Please address those aruments to me one at a time. I am still here and cannot respond to every post. You are designated.

228 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:27:21pm

re: #224 EdDantes

“Slut shaming.” Quite a stretch. But if it makes you happy.

No, it doesn’t. But Klys has it right: most, if not all, male abortion opponents don’t so much check their compassion for women at the door, as they do bury it in a 12 foot hole.

229 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:29:02pm

re: #228 Mattand

see my 227.

230 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:29:08pm

re: #227 EdDantes

Please address those aruments to me one at a time. I am still here and cannot respond to every post. You are designated.

LOL, good luck with that. Even Charles doesn’t have that power.

231 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:30:46pm

re: #221 EdDantes

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning.

See, Ed, this is why it’s hard to have pity on you. Right here is just a lie. An absolute lie. I’ve never expressed support for an abortion at any time, for any reason, right to the baby crowning, but you’re lying and saying I have. Why should I respect you or your opinions if you’re willing to just lie to my face like this? I support the right of a woman to, after consultation with her doctor, get an abortion. The desire to get an abortion at, say, eight months would be so psychologically bizarre that, aside from the health of the mother, very few doctors would agree to that procedure— Gosnell types might, but with better regulation, we can keep those sorts from cropping up. Instead, such a woman would probably need therapy.

So you see, your portrayal of my position is just a lie, formed on nothing, something you made up. Why do this? Why just blatantly lie?

And likewise, your refusal to answer the straightforward question is just cowardice.

232 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:30:46pm

re: #230 Mattand

LOL, good luck with that. Even Charles doesn’t have that power.

Ok. Charles can ignore what he chooses. And does.

233 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:30:46pm

re: #221 EdDantes

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning. I disagree.

Speaking only for myself, I see no point in any laws specifically regulating abortion.

Of course, normal standards of medical ethics should still be followed, which are more than sufficient to dispose of the beloved and farcical RW straw man of the horrible woman who seeks an abortion during labor for the hell of it.

234 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:30:50pm

re: #227 EdDantes

Please address those aruments to me one at a time. I am still here and cannot respond to every post. You are designated.

I’m trying to figure out why I should spoonfeed things to you. But I would recommend you at least check out #218 and see about answering that one, since it’s got nice, easy questions.

235 Mattand  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:32:00pm

re: #232 EdDantes

Ok. Charles can ignore what he chooses. And does.

Now, all of a sudden you’re pro-choice.

236 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:32:09pm

re: #227 EdDantes

Please address those aruments to me one at a time.

You sure make a lot of demands for a rude, sulky, passive-aggressive, and sexist troll. How is it even possible you don’t realize how offensive you sound? Are you seriously that dense? o_O

237 jamesfirecat  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:33:29pm

re: #194 wrenchwench

Jamesfirecat will be so proud, or jealous maybe.

No proud, I have spread my the violinist argument well among my fellow lizards.

238 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:33:56pm

re: #237 jamesfirecat

No proud, I have spread my the violinist argument well among my fellow lizards.

It’s such a good one. :)

239 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:34:45pm

re: #218 EPR-radar

This is getting old. Let’s put the questions in one place and make them yes or no.

1) Do you participate in the political process, yes or no?

2) If yes, are your votes and/or advocacy for issues/candidates affected by how well or poorly their views match yours on abortion (and other issues as well)?

If yes, you are participating in the political process (as you have every right to do) to increase the chances of your views on abortion being enacted into law. What is the point of being disingenuous about this?

!., Yes

2,. No

240 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:36:15pm

re: #239 EdDantes

!., Yes

2,. No

Uh oh, the punctuation is getting weird. We’ve seen where that leads.

241 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:36:47pm

re: #239 EdDantes

!., Yes

2,. No

So if you don’t vote for candidates based on how well their views fit with yours (on any topic, as the question included issues other than abortion), how do you choose? Do you just flip a coin?

242 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:36:59pm

re: #236 Interesting Times

You sure make a lot of demands for a rude, sulky, passive-aggressive, and sexist troll. How is it even possible you don’t realize how offensive you sound? Are you seriously that dense? o_O

Aparently I am that dense.

243 jamesfirecat  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:37:09pm

re: #240 wrenchwench

Uh oh, the punctuation is getting weird. We’ve seen where that leads.

Five exclamation points, surely the sign of a deranged mind.

244 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:38:52pm

re: #240 wrenchwench

Uh oh, the punctuation is getting weird. We’ve seen where that leads.

That is all you need know.It means something!

245 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:40:49pm

re: #242 EdDantes

Aparently I am that dense.

Why are you dense enough to lie to my face about what my own views on abortion are?

246 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:42:18pm

re: #245 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Why are you dense enough to lie to my face about what my own views on abortion are?

I’m sorry. I was assuming. What are your views on abortion?

247 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:43:57pm

We should quit feeding the troll. It’s way beyond well-marbled.

248 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:44:25pm

re: #246 EdDantes

I’m sorry. I was assuming. What are your views on abortion?

See, what the fuck? Why do you think it’s okay to just make up shit about what I believe? Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with you?

I also explained my views on abortion in the post replying to the one where you just lied your ass off about me.

Why lie? What makes you think it’s okay to just make shit up?

249 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:45:18pm

re: #208 EdDantes

What are the other conditions? Inconvenience?

re: #221 EdDantes

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning. I disagree.

5 slut shaming points awarded for ‘inconvenience’

15 slut shaming points awarded for ‘abortion for the hell of it during labor’

250 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:48:00pm

re: #248 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

See, what the fuck? Why do you think it’s okay to just make up shit about what I believe? Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with you?

I also explained my views on abortion in the post replying to the one where you just lied your ass off about me.

Why lie? What makes you think it’s okay to just make shit up?

What are you views on abortion. Point me to the post. You must understand that I have had a lot posts to respond to.

251 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:51:10pm

re: #250 EdDantes

What are you views on abortion. Point me to the post. You must understand that I have had a lot posts to respond to.

I am going to make a suggestion here: stop digging.

Don’t reply to things you think someone has said until you verify that they have actually said that. Don’t make assumptions. Read the entire thread before you reply.

252 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:52:19pm

re: #250 EdDantes

What are you views on abortion. Point me to the post. You must understand that I have had a lot posts to respond to.

Here it is, but again, this is not the point. You just admitted that you simply made up my views on abortion. You just lied, without a qualm, and you apparently just don’t think it’s a bad thing to simply lie your ass off.

Can you explain why you think it’s okay to just lie?

253 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:53:53pm

re: #251 klys

I am going to make a suggestion here: stop digging.

Don’t reply to things you think someone has said until you verify that they have actually said that. Don’t make assumptions. Read the entire thread before you reply.

I’m not digging .GlennBeck etc,. said he posted his views on abortion. I asked what they were.

254 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:56:59pm

The Way It Was (Before Abortion Became Legal)

This may have been posted before, but it’s a very important article.

255 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 2:57:01pm

re: #253 EdDantes

He posted them in this thread, after you made up a lie about what he believed.

Which you apparently didn’t read.

But keep digging your hole.

And please explain, if you don’t mind, why you believe it’s fine to lie about what other people believe?

256 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:01:00pm

re: #252 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Here it is, but again, this is not the point. You just admitted that you simply made up my views on abortion. You just lied, without a qualm, and you apparently just don’t think it’s a bad thing to simply lie your ass off.

Can you explain why you think it’s okay to just lie?

I never lied about anything or anyone. What is your opinion on abortion? When, who how..?

257 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:02:40pm

re: #256 EdDantes

I never lied about anything or anyone. What is your opinion on abortion? When, who how..?

re: #246 EdDantes

I’m sorry. I was assuming. What are your views on abortion?

258 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:02:56pm

re: #255 klys

He posted them in this thread, after you made up a lie about what he believed.

Which you apparently didn’t read.

But keep digging your hole.

And please explain, if you don’t mind, why you believe it’s fine to lie about what other people believe?

I made up nothing. I’m just trying to navigate the circumlocutions at this site.

259 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:04:00pm

re: #257 klys

re: #246 EdDantes

Do you have a point?

260 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:04:02pm

re: #258 EdDantes

I made up nothing. I’m just trying to navigate the circumlocutions at this site.

re: #221 EdDantes

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning. I disagree.

261 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:05:10pm

re: #259 EdDantes

Do you have a point?

Youtube Video
262 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:07:01pm

re: #239 EdDantes

!., Yes

2,. No

According to these answers, you are politically neutral on the subject of abortion.

What exactly are we fighting about here, then?

BTW, there’s a term that is often used to describe those who may be personally opposed to abortion, but also have no desire to enact that opposition into law:

Pro-choice.

263 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:07:55pm

Again, do you have a point? re: #261 klys

[Embedded content]

KLYS, do you have a point? That is, a an argument based on perceived fact?

264 Randall Gross  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:10:28pm

Look at the shit eating grin as he tries to walk it back but can’t

usatoday.com

265 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:12:13pm

re: #262 EPR-radar

According to these answers, you are politically neutral on the subject of abortion.

What exactly are we fighting about here, then?

BTW, there’s a term that is often used to describe those who may be personally opposed to abortion, but also have no desire to enact that opposition into law:

Pro-choice.

That may very well be what I am. But the pit bulls at this site are twisting and obscuring everything. I hate morality but I and everyone else are inextricably bound by it. Regardless how they couch it.

266 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:12:39pm

re: #264 Randall Gross

Look at the shit eating grin as he tries to walk it back but can’t

usatoday.com

Scum. He does his agitprop right up to the edge of what is legally actionable as a threat or incitement, and then waits for a nut to act.

267 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:12:42pm

re: #263 EdDantes

I’m fairly certain the argument there was that you made up beliefs for Obdicut, which you proceeded to share with us. Some of us would call that lying. Now you’re trying to claim that you didn’t. I provided the text where you shared what Obdicut believed according to you.

Other than that, you haven’t really provided any arguments, with or without facts. So I figured I would provide an actual point.

Youtube Video
268 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:14:47pm

re: #265 EdDantes

That may very well be what I am. But the pit bulls at this site are twisting and obscuring everything. I hate morality but I and everyone else are inextricably bound by it. Regardless how they couch it.

Anyone will be cranky if someone brings in a giant turd by the name of Gosnell to start playing internet games.

269 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:15:45pm

re: #267 klys

I’m fairly certain the argument there was that you made up beliefs for Obdicut, which you proceeded to share with us. Some of us would call that lying. Now you’re trying to claim that you didn’t. I provided the text where you shared what Obdicut believed.

Other than that, you haven’t really provided any arguments, with or without facts. So I figured I would provide an actual point.

[Embedded content]

Lying is an intentional distortion of the truth. I did not do that. I’m still waiting for Obdicuts views on abortion.

270 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:18:33pm

re: #269 EdDantes

…yep, you really are that dense.

Please brush up on how to have an actual conversation on the Internet before the next one (hint: it involves reading comprehension) and otherwise enjoy your evening. I’m going to go do something more productive with my time.

271 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:21:22pm

re: #270 klys

…yep, you really are that dense.

Please brush up on how to have an actual conversation on the Internet before the next one (hint: it involves reading comprehension) and otherwise enjoy your evening. I’m going to go do something more productive with my time.

Enjoy! I’m well acquainted with conversations on the internet. I know not to insult people who are smarter than me.

272 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:21:40pm

re: #269 EdDantes

Lying is an intentional distortion of the truth. I did not do that. I’m still waiting for Obdicuts views on abortion.

He already stated them. You are too lazy to go back and look.

273 jaunte  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:23:48pm

re: #269 EdDantes

Lying is an intentional distortion of the truth. I did not do that.

“I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.”

274 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:23:52pm

re: #268 EPR-radar

Anyone will be cranky if someone brings in a giant turd by the name of Gosnell to start playing internet games.

The thread is about a person who is not a threat to anyone. I introduced Gosnell to direct attention to real threats.

275 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:25:55pm

re: #273 jaunte

“I, for one, fear for the life of Kermit Gosnell. He is providing a valuable service to women who find themselves pregnant. People like Leach would want him stopped in his useful activity.”

That was satire. No, Not as well as Swift, but in my own way.

276 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:28:16pm

re: #272 Vicious Babushka

He already stated them. You are too lazy to go back and look.

I have asked him to state his views on abortion and he has declined. It is very simple, something I have done.

277 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:30:24pm

Thanos, would you like to engage me in conversation?

278 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:31:33pm

re: #275 EdDantes

That was satire. No, Not as well as Swift, but in my own way.

Registered since 2010, over 2,000 comments, and never learned the LGF convention of putting a / after an intentionally sarcastic statement e.g.:

GW Bush was the most wonderful president. An intellectual giant, he embodied all that was right and proper about the USA, and was particularly noteworthy for his profound respect for civil liberties, and the quality and independent thinking of his high-level appointees./

Pull the other one.

279 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:32:42pm

re: #256 EdDantes

I never lied about anything or anyone. What is your opinion on abortion? When, who how..?

You lied, and admitted it, when you told me what I believed about abortion.

Are you having a mental breakdown?

280 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:33:21pm

re: #276 EdDantes

I have asked him to state his views on abortion and he has declined. It is very simple, something I have done.

Again, you’re lying. I’ve stated it, I’ve linked it in a comment for you. Why do you think these pathetic lies get you anywhere? Here it is yet again:

littlegreenfootballs.com

281 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:38:41pm

re: #278 EPR-radar

Registered since 2010, over 2,000 comments, and never learned the LGF convention of putting a / after an intentionally sarcastic statement e.g.:

GW Bush was the most wonderful president. An intellectual giant, he embodied all that was right and proper about the USA, and was particularly noteworthy for his profound respect for civil liberties, and the quality and independent thinking of his high-level appointees./

Pull the other one.

I know all about the sarc tag. I chose not to use it. By the way, GWB was a bad president in that he expanded government and intruded on our civil liberties.

282 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:41:59pm

re: #280 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Again, you’re lying. I’ve stated it, I’ve linked it in a comment for you. Why do you think these pathetic lies get you anywhere? Here it is yet again:

littlegreenfootballs.com

What are your views on abortion? I have not lied about anything. I don’t need to. What are you views on abortion. Are there restrictions? Tell me now.

283 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:43:25pm

I have 1342 karma points to waste.

284 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:44:44pm

re: #283 EdDantes

I have 1342 karma points to waste.

Out of brain cells, however. And completely lacking ability to honestly debate.

285 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:45:54pm

Nothing? That is what I thought.re: #284 wrenchwench

Out of brain cells, however. And completely lacking ability to honestly debate.

Score! What would you like to debate?

286 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:47:42pm

re: #282 EdDantes

What are your views on abortion? I have not lied about anything. I don’t need to. What are you views on abortion. Are there restrictions? Tell me now.

Ed, seriously, are you having a problem? I have linked to my views on abortion— the ones you lied your fucking ass off about. Since you’re apparently incapable of actually fucking following a link and reading, here it is in plain language for you again:

Yes, I want restrictions. I want women to be able to get abortions only after consultation with their doctor to make sure the decision is being made soberly, without coercion, and without mental handicap of any kind. An abortion of an otherwise healthy infant in the 8th month of a pregnancy would be an almost-certain sign of some psychiatric distress so only rare, fringe doctors would go along with it. In almost all cases, a woman would not be able to find a doctor to perform such an abortion. Criminalizing it would not improve the situation one whit, however.

I do not want, as you fucking lyingly put it, a woman to be able to gain an abortion at any time, for any reason, up until the baby is crowning, you fucking liar.

287 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:50:29pm

re: #281 EdDantes

I know all about the sarc tag. I chose not to use it. By the way, GWB was a bad president in that he expanded government and intruded on our civil liberties.

Very well. You come with a stink bomb, no sarc tag, and when that gets enough heat, out come the “its just sarcasm” line.

Is this taught in the Rush Limbaugh correspondence source for online RW commentary?

It is amusing that you whine about LGF ‘pit bulls’ after doing much to maximize your initial negative impression on this thread.

288 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:52:40pm

re: #285 EdDantes

Score! What would you like to debate?

Pointing out your inability to honestly debate is not an indication that I want to debate you.

Try responding honestly to Obdicut. There’s a challenge for you.

289 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:55:53pm

re: #286 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Ed, seriously, are you having a problem? I have linked to my views on abortion— the ones you lied your fucking ass off about. Since you’re apparently incapable of actually fucking following a link and reading, here it is in plain language for you again:

Yes, I want restrictions. I want women to be able to get abortions only after consultation with their doctor to make sure the decision is being made soberly, without coercion, and without mental handicap of any kind. An abortion of an otherwise healthy infant in the 8th month of a pregnancy would be an almost-certain sign of some psychiatric distress so only rare, fringe doctors would go along with it. In almost all cases, a woman would not be able to find a doctor to perform such an abortion. Criminalizing it would not improve the situation one whit, however.

I do not want, as you fucking lyingly put it, a woman to be able to gain an abortion at any time, for any reason, up until the baby is crowning, you fucking liar.

That is all I was asking and was not in what you posted earlier. I did not lie about your position on abortion because I did not know what it was. You have set the threshold of eight months much longer than I would. but these are differences in opinion. Now you may continue to call me a liar. I don’t care.

290 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:58:28pm

re: #289 EdDantes

That is all I was asking and was not in what you posted earlier.

Yes it was, you fucking liar.

I did not lie about your position on abortion because I did not know what it was.

Yes, you did, you fucking liar. Right fucking here, is you goddamn lying:

re: #221 EdDantes

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning. I disagree.

That, right there, is a complete fucking lie, Ed.

Everyone can see that you’re lying, Ed. What do you think is gained by denying it?

291 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 3:58:51pm

re: #288 wrenchwench

Pointing out your inability to honestly debate is not an indication that I want to debate you.

Try responding honestly to Obdicut. There’s a challenge for you.

I did.

292 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:00:27pm

re: #289 EdDantes

That is all I was asking and was not in what you posted earlier. I did not lie about your position on abortion because I did not know what it was. You have set the threshold of eight months much longer than I would. but these are differences in opinion. Now you may continue to call me a liar. I don’t care.

What on earth is the difference between Obdicut’s #231 and #286? If anything, #286 is more permissive since it explicitly says that criminalizing late term abortions is pointless.

293 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:03:26pm

re: #290 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Yes it was, you fucking liar.

Yes, you did, you fucking liar. Right fucking here, is you goddamn lying:

re: #221 EdDantes

That, right there, is a complete fucking lie, Ed.

Everyone can see that you’re lying, Ed. What do you think is gained by denying it?

Obdicut! you are a fucking liar! You fucking liar! This is fun! You fucking liar!
Did I say were a fucking liar? I don’t know what you are talking about but you are a fucking liar, you fucking Liar.

294 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:06:03pm

re: #293 EdDantes

Ed, you said this:

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning. I disagree.

This was a lie. And you can’t actually take responsibility for it. It’s pathetic.

295 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:06:40pm

re: #292 EPR-radar

What on earth is the difference between Obdicut’s #231 and #286? If anything, #286 is more permissive since it explicitly says that criminalizing late term abortions is pointless.

I missed his 231. I have been busy if you know what I mean.

296 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:07:48pm

re: #295 EdDantes

You missed it, and then you asked me to link to it, and then I did, and you missed it again.

But before you did all that, you said this:

I am not able to comment on those circumstances . You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning. I disagree.

Which was a lie.

297 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:10:07pm

re: #294 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

Ed, you said this:

This was a lie. And you can’t actually take responsibility for it. It’s pathetic.

It is very simple. If I was wrong for attributing statements to you that you did not make, I apologize. but I have not lied about anything.

298 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:11:10pm

re: #297 EdDantes

It is very simple. If I was wrong for attributing statements to you that you did not make, I apologize. but I have not lied about anything.

Oh, where are these statements that you attributed to me? Who else said that?

299 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:11:47pm

re: #296 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

EdDantes said:

You believe that a woman should be able to have an abortion at anytime, for any reason right to the baby crowning.

Which is something that no rational person believes.

Even people who agree that a woman has the absolute right to choose to terminate a pregnancy, would also agree that certain restrictions have to be in place during the 3rd trimester because it is a complicated procedure and NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MIND would decide to have a termination in the 9th month.

300 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:13:30pm

re: #299 Vicious Babushka

Yeah. Nobody else said that here. He didn’t mis-attribute those statements to me.

301 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:13:59pm

re: #291 EdDantes

I did.

Nope.

302 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:14:31pm

re: #295 EdDantes

I missed his 231. I have been busy if you know what I mean.

It was reposted to you several times. You were too ‘busy’ to read it.

303 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:16:54pm

re: #296 Glenn Beck’s Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut

You missed it, and then you asked me to link to it, and then I did, and you missed it again.

But before you did all that, you said this:

Which was a lie.

I assumed that that was what you meant, that is the baby crowning. Assuming wrongly and Lying are different things.

304 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:17:43pm

re: #302 wrenchwench

It was reposted to you several times. You were too ‘busy’ to read it.

You are new to this thread.

305 EdDantes  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:19:01pm

Obdicut will fill you all in on what transpired.

306 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:20:20pm

re: #303 EdDantes

I assumed that that was what you meant, that is the baby crowning. Assuming wrongly and Lying are different things.

No, they’re really not. You’re really not doing your cause any good here. You can’t just make up shit about what someone else believes based on your own nutso ideas. It’s really lying to do so. You didn’t know my opinions on abortion; you lied when you said you did. You also just lied again when you said you ‘misatrributed’ those statements, since no one else said them either.

This is pathetic, and sad, and then pathetic all over again.

307 wrenchwench  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:21:04pm

re: #303 EdDantes

I assumed that that was what you meant, that is the baby crowning. Assuming wrongly and Lying are different things.

Making an ‘assumption’ about the beliefs of another person and stating it as a fact is lying. Claiming you did not have the opportunity to read something pointed out to you several times, while continuing to say you have not been given the information is also lying.

re: #304 EdDantes

You are new to this thread.

re: #305 EdDantes

Obdicut will fill you all in on what transpired.

I posted on this thread before you did. Obdicut has been trying to fill you in.

But really there’s no point. You are just being a troll.

308 Interesting Times  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:22:36pm

re: #305 EdDantes

It’s hilarious how you bemoan other right-wingers making the cause look bad, when you do such a great job of it all on your own. Congrats! :)

309 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 4:23:20pm

re: #303 EdDantes

I assumed that that was what you meant, that is the baby crowning. Assuming wrongly and Lying are different things.

Let’s try to clear up some terminology here. My view is that there should be no laws specifically regulating abortion, but that normal standards of medical ethics do need to be in place, and will suffice to prevent hypothetical travesties like the horrible woman having an abortion in the 8th month for the hell of it.

Do you regard this view as “approval of abortion at any time up to and including crowning”?

310 Charles Johnson  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 6:37:42pm

There comes a point at which I realize that I’m dealing with a troll. I reached that point at comment #39.

311 klys  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 6:38:49pm

re: #310 Charles Johnson

There comes a point at which I realize that I’m dealing with a troll. That point was reached for me at comment #39.

I’m a little slow. :) Or less experienced. Apologies for the subsequent eruption of derp that resulted.

312 EPR-radar  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 6:41:53pm

re: #311 klys

I’m a little slow. :) Or less experienced. Apologies for the subsequent eruption of derp that resulted.

What was interesting about this for me was that I’ve never seen such evasiveness on the central point of regulating abortion under criminal law.

313 palomino  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 8:19:13pm

re: #103 EdDantes

Indeed it is. 19 Muslims caused all that destruction and you cannot say that radical Islam is a problem. Yet a person from Iowa named Leach is worthy of attention.

No one here has claimed that radical Islam is not a problem.

Your strawman has no legs.

314 subterraneanhomesickalien  Wed, Apr 24, 2013 10:27:02pm

Why are people continuing to respond to this condescending, parsing, human talking point?

He’s on auto water muddying, and he’s at boss level.

Just ignore him.


This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal Cash.app
Recent PagesClick to refresh
The Pandemic Cost 7 Million Lives, but Talks to Prevent a Repeat Stall In late 2021, as the world reeled from the arrival of the highly contagious omicron variant of the coronavirus, representatives of almost 200 countries met - some online, some in-person in Geneva - hoping to forestall a future worldwide ...
Cheechako
3 days ago
Views: 122 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ...
Cheechako
2 weeks ago
Views: 286 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1