Pamela Geller Spreads Hatred and Lies at Breitbart.com

The right wing mob responds: “The only good Muslim is a dead Muslim”
Wingnuts • Views: 33,603

Anti-Muslim demagogue Pamela Geller is featured at breitbart.com, with another of her by-the-numbers rants spreading hatred against Muslims — not to mention outright lies: Where Are the ‘Moderate’ Muslims?

In the wake of the monstrous beheading of a young British man in broad daylight by Muslims who cited the Qur’an to explain and justify their ritual slaughter has come the predictable reaction - blame anything except Islam’s violent teachings — from the left and their media propagandists. But where are the “moderate Muslims”?

The kneejerk reaction from Muslim spokespeople and the “leaders” of various Muslim organizations after the bloody beheading of a young British soldier and father in the streets of London, the copycat stabbing of a French soldier by a Muslim who is still at large in Paris, and the bloody bombing of women, children and families on a bright shiny Monday in Boston, has been a deflection of responsibility, as well as secondary attacks on the kuffar. We are admonished and schooled on a mythical narrative of anti-Muslim backlash and “Islamophobia.” We hear, meanwhile, no cries for reform. “Moderate Muslims” hold no protests against the jihad here or abroad.

Geller is simply lying. All of the major British Muslim organizations immediately spoke out against this murder, with no “deflection of responsibility” or “attacks on the kuffar.” Here are three examples out of many:

The Muslim Council of Britain issued a statement:

“This is a truly barbaric act that has no basis in Islam and we condemn this unreservedly. Our thoughts are with the victim and his family. We understand the victim is a serving member of the armed forces. Muslims have long served in this country’s armed forces, proudly and with honour. This attack on a member of the armed forces is dishonourable, and no cause justifies this murder.

This action will no doubt heighten tensions on the streets of the United Kingdom. We call on all our communities, Muslim and non-Muslim, to come together in solidarity to ensure the forces of hatred do not prevail. It is important we allow our police authorities to do their job without speculation. We also urge the utmost vigilance and ask the police authorities to calm tensions.”

[…]

Mohammed Shafiq, the head of the Ramadhan Foundation has also criticised the murder of a man in Woolwich by men invoking the name of Allah.

“I wish to condemn the evil and barbaric crime carried out today in Woolwich. Our immediate thoughts are with the family and friends of the victims. From whatever angle you see today’s attack it was at every level evil.

“We must allow the police to gather all the facts before unnecessary speculation and wait for the facts before determining its impact on our country.

“But what happens in the days to come, London and our nation will come together and will not be divided. The terrorists will never win and succeed in their evil plans.

But tonight we think of the family of that soldier killed.”

[…]

Fiyaz Mughal, the director of Faith Matters and co-ordinator of the UK Government-backed anti-Muslim hatred ‘Tell MAMA’ project said of today’s Woolwich killing:

“The cold blooded killing of a serving British soldier is a crime that sickens every member of every community in the UK. For the peace of our communities to be shattered like this is almost unthinkable. We must come together, isolate those who believe that extremism and violence are acceptable, and work to ensure that they meet the full force of the law.

“We as the Muslim community will work against anyone who promotes such hatred. Our armed forces deserve respect for putting their lives on the line, irrespective of what we think about the political decisions that put their lives in harm’s way. Their blood is indeed our treasure which we must always protect, just as they protect us.”

Notice the calls for solidarity, and for Brits to resist the hate speech that divides. That’s why Pamela Geller is spreading lies — because that’s the last thing this deranged bigot wants to see.

Meanwhile, if you follow the link to her ugly article, you’ll see more than 100 comments from the Breitbart audience, letting their hatred and xenophobia run free, and calling for mass deportations and even genocide. Comments like this:

A Muslim is a Muslim is a Muslim. If you don’t protest your radical religion, you are just as guilty of radicalism as your fellow Islamists. No more Muslims should be allowed into this country, period!

[…]

Wake up and smell the coffee. There is no such thing as “Moderate muslims.” They are a creation of our islamo/fascist administration and propagandized, 24/7 by the state run media.

[…]

If you (and I don’t care what religion you are) don’t like the western way of life, get the H**l out of here. Go to where they practice what you preach!!! WE don’t want you here if you’re trying to put your way of life into our way of life. WE like what we have here.

[…]

In the old wild west the real Americans used to say, the only good native Indian is a dead native Indian. Now real Americans are saying that the only good Muslims are dead Muslims….

This is the reaction Pamela Geller and Robert Spencer and their fellow travelers are trying to provoke, and they’re succeeding.

UPDATE at 5/29/13 1:49:27 pm

Geller responds on Twitter:

Jump to bottom

446 comments

1 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:29:15am

It’s sad. I wish I could be surprised at this but I am not. Muslims are one of those groups that it’s perfectly acceptable to wish genocide on and Geller, Spencer, and that crowd have a big role in why that is.

2 Tigger2  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:32:15am

If you (and I don’t care what religion you are) don’t like the western way of life, get the H**l out of here. Go to where they practice what you preach!!! WE don’t want you here if you’re trying to put your way of life into our way of life. WE like what we have here.

I’m sure this is what they think when we are in their countries pushing our way of life.

3 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:34:00am

re: #2 Tigger2

I’m sure this is what they think when we are in their countries pushing our way of life.

No, the furriners welcome us with open arms because freedom.

4 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:37:48am
Where Are the ‘Moderate’ Muslims?

Going to work, raising their kids, feeding their families, enjoying hobbies, watching TV, reading books, surfing the Internet…

Oh yeah, and reporting creepy whackjobs at the mosque to local law enforcement.

You know, stuff that everybody else does every day, without feeling compelled to organize in a march or a demonstration to denounce their neighbors all the damn time.

5 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:38:04am

I suppose it’s now settled then and all out in the open. They now claim “there are no moderate Muslims.” None, as in zero. They’re now going as far as saying “all Muslims are terrorists.” I’m seeing this with Geller, Spencer, commentators at Liveleak, and now Breitbart. So when they say their criticism is just against those Muslims who happen to be terrorists they’re lying and they’re charging all the Muslim people. This is coming to a boiling point including calls for the genocide of Muslims as I have seen on some Liveleak comments.

6 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:40:11am

Well if you’re a religious nut, you don’t look for moderates among secular people (you don’t LIKE secular people after all), you look for religious leaders who preach love and tolerance.

But in Muslim culture, religious leaders aren’t the place to look.

7 lawhawk  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:41:42am


Of course, they’ll attempt to reply that this is a troller and not representative of the posters at the site - even as the 100s of other commenters have no problems with that kind of comment as others agree with the sentiment.

8 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:42:27am

re: #6 stabby

Well if you’re a religious nut, you don’t look for moderates among secular people (you don’t LIKE secular people after all), you look for religious leaders who preach love and tolerance.

But in Muslim culture, religious leaders aren’t the place to look.

Bullshit.

9 RadicalModerate  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:44:30am

Meanwhile, Pam’s good friends over at the EDL have been engaging in numerous violent attacks against Muslim people, and have attempted firebombing mosques while people were inside.

ibtimes.com

10 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:45:24am

re: #6 stabby

Three Muslim leaders quoted in the post you supposedly just read — “none so blind” comes to mind.

11 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:46:15am

Is it my job as a white American to protest Geller’s insane whackadoodle racism and xenophobia?

Apparently it is, so: please find enclosed my repudiation of Geller’s whackadoodle racism and xenophobia, and I do protest.

12 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:47:17am

re: #10 Randall Gross

Three Muslim leaders quoted in the post you supposedly just read — “none so blind” comes to mind.

Besides those three….
/

13 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:47:41am

re: #11 erik_t

Is it my job as a white American to protest Geller’s insane whackadoodle racism and xenophobia?

Apparently it is, so: please find enclosed my repudiation of Geller’s whackadoodle racism and xenophobia, and I do protest.

No, it’s your job as a human.

14 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:49:23am

re: #10 Randall Gross

Take a look at the first organization quoted:

Muslim Council of Britain Boycotts Holocaust Memorial Day Again

And the first time they were against it because:
“It includes the controversial question of alleged Armenian genocide as well as the so-called gay genocide.”

15 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:50:02am

What happened to the link?
hurryupharry.org

16 Dr Lizardo  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:51:11am

Pammy should bear in mind what happened to Tom Metzger. All it’s gonna take is for one of her dim-bulb followers to act on their homicidal impulses, and Pammy loses everything. It’s the doctrine of vicarious liability.

17 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:51:44am

She’s trying to incite violence. Fuck her.

18 RadicalModerate  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:51:54am

re: #6 stabby

Well if you’re a religious nut, you don’t look for moderates among secular people (you don’t LIKE secular people after all), you look for religious leaders who preach love and tolerance.

But in Muslim Republican culture, religious leaders aren’t the place to look.

Fixed your quote for accuracy.

19 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:52:02am

You could just do the following search:
google.com

20 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:52:05am

re: #17 darthstar

She’s trying to incite violence. Fuck her.

Precisely.

21 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:52:57am

re: #19 stabby

So basically, you agree with Pamela Geller? Is that what you’re saying?

22 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:53:06am
23 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:53:31am
24 lawhawk  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:53:37am

re: #16 Dr Lizardo

She and her fellow travelers were already skirting crossing that line with Breivik. And something like that is bound to happen again.

25 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:54:22am

re: #15 stabby

What happened to the link?

What “happened to the link” is that you screwed up the code.

26 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:54:25am

re: #21 Charles Johnson

No, I’m saying that I understand why wingnuts make the mistake that her followers are making.

I also understand her = she’s a coward.

27 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:54:36am

Sen. Rubio: Best response to IRS scandal is ‘repealing Obamacare’

In a video response to a constituent, Sen. Marco Rubio (R-FL) claimed Wednesday that the best way to respond to the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) scandal is by “repealing Obamacare,” which he claimed would be enforced by tax collectors demanding payment from Americans who do not purchase health insurance.

“When you read a headline that a powerful government agency is targeting people because of their political views, that’s the kind of headline you read in other countries, not here in America,” Rubio said in footage picked up by Talking Points Memo.

“As far as the IRS’s role in Obamacare, now that’s chilling, because if you noticed, the IRS is deeply involved in implementing Obamacare; they’re on the front lines of it,” he continued. “The IRS is gonna go through the country asking people, ‘What kind of prove to us that you have health insurance,’ ‘prove to us that the health insurance you have is adequate.’ And if you don’t have health insurance, ‘Pay us $2,000 or a similar fine or fee or tax as a result of failing to get health insurance.’”

That’s not actually true, however.

28 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:55:03am

During the height of GWOT I used to read Middle Eastern and Pakistani newspapers and blogs daily - there were moderate Muslims decrying terrorism, ‘Kalashnikov Culture,’ and the horrors of religious extremism every single day. They did so with great courage and in some cases they lost their lives. To display just a sliver of similar courage you would have to go to a back country bar in Mississippi, Missouri, or Tennessee step up on the bar and start speaking out for Gay Marriage. So I say screw anyone who says there aren’t moderate Muslims.

29 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:56:04am

re: #26 stabby

No, I’m saying that I understand why wingnuts make the mistake that her followers are making.

Because they’re racist pieces of scum, and because I’ve scraped better things off the bottom of my shoe?

30 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:56:13am

re: #26 stabby

No, I’m saying that I understand why wingnuts make the mistake that her followers are making.

I also understand her = she’s a coward.

You certainly don’t seem to be making the point that this is a “mistake.”

If you agree with this, but don’t want to admit it, who’s the coward?

31 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:56:16am

re: #15 stabby

Two bads do not make a right, and it doesn’t change what you said to a truth. They spoke out against terror, now keep on defending hatemeisters Spencer and Geller by deflection you little turd.

32 Tigger2  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:56:17am

re: #22 Gus

By someone that has Republican Political Signs in their yard ? /////

33 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:56:18am

re: #9 RadicalModerate

Meanwhile, Pam’s good friends over at the EDL have been engaging in numerous violent attacks against Muslim people, and have attempted firebombing mosques while people were inside.

ibtimes.com

Another, more recent, article here. (Hat tip to some Lurking tweeter.)

That’s what Pam wants to see here. Neighbors and former friends attacking each other over religion, ethnicity, nationalism, etc.

34 Dr Lizardo  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:57:22am

re: #24 lawhawk

She and her fellow travelers were already skirting crossing that line with Breivik. And something like that is bound to happen again.

True enough, but the Utoya Massacre didn’t happen in the US. My thought is that if one of her loony fellow-travellers actually kills a Muslims in the United States, and if it can be demonstrated that the suspect was incited to commit said crime through inflammatory doctrine being spouted by Pam, Robert Spencer, et al, I think a good lawyer could make a case and as in the case with Tom Metzger, find her civilly liable using vicarious liability.

35 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:58:07am

Sadly I just spent a week hearing all of these same false arguments from my father to claims Islam is nothing but a cult, Mohammed was a pedophile, and that all muslims are bad.

36 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:58:57am

re: #30 Charles Johnson

Randall Gross said that the quotes were by moderate Islamic organizations, and their example disproves my claim that Islamic clerics are NOT where moderation come from in Muslim societies.

I pointed out that the first group isn’t moderate, which, IMO illustrates that moderation doesn’t come naturally to Islamic clerics.

37 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:59:25am

OpEDL: ‘Anonymous’ targets far-right English Defense League

Individuals claiming to be part of international hacktivist group Anonymous have published phone numbers and addresses for supporters of the English Defence League (EDL) as part of what they said was the first phase of a campaign to destroy the far-right street protest movement.

An audio statement posted on YouTube on Tuesday in the name of Anonymous UK accused the EDL of using the killing of Drummer Lee Rigby to spread a campaign of hate and bigotry and said that it would begin a “systematic and comprehensive decimation [sic]” of the group.

38 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:59:45am

re: #35 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

Sadly I just spent a week hearing all of these same false arguments from my father to claims Islam is nothing but a cult, Mohammed was a pedophile, and that all muslims are bad.

Welcome home.

(I mean back here.)

39 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 10:59:57am

re: #22 Gus

@jenanmoussa How to spot a terrorist? Some1 w/ “sudden obsession w/ physical fitness, adopts traditional Arab dress” bit.ly #Muslimrage

Exactly right, Jenan!

/

40 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:00:00am

re: #27 Kragar

Sen. Rubio: Best response to IRS scandal is ‘repealing Obamacare’

This is like saying the response to Watergate should be to repeal the EPA and OSHA.But yeah please proceed Senator and show why you’re an intellectual lightweight.

41 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:00:21am

re: #36 stabby

I said no such thing liar.

42 Tigger2  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:00:55am

re: #27 Kragar

Sen. Rubio: Best response to IRS scandal is ‘repealing Obamacare’

That’s not actually true, however.

When has that ever stopped a Republican rant on Obamacare.

43 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:01:31am

re: #27 Kragar

Sen. Rubio: Best response to IRS scandal is ‘repealing Obamacare’

But it has become a popular talking point.

44 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:01:35am

re: #34 Dr Lizardo

True enough, but the Utoya Massacre didn’t happen in the US. My thought is that if one of her loony fellow-travellers actually kills a Muslims in the United States, and if it can be demonstrated that the suspect was incited to commit said crime through inflammatory doctrine being spouted by Pam, Robert Spencer, et al, I think a good lawyer could make a case and as in the case with Tom Metzger, find her civilly liable using vicarious liability.

Help me out here Doc but Metzger was the leader of the Neo-Nazi group that the SPLC sued when they attacked I want to say a Hispanic mother and son.

45 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:01:53am

re: #42 Tigger2

That’s not actually true, however.

When has that ever stopped a Republican rant on Obamacare.

Congressional Recess.

46 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:02:03am

re: #41 Randall Gross

I thought I was interpreting your response at #10 fairly.

If that’s not what your, admittedly too terse to parse rebuttal meant, then please explain what it meant.

47 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:02:07am

re: #36 stabby

Here’s exactly what I said:

Three Muslim leaders quoted in the post you supposedly just read

You changed it to “groups” to deflect the conversation.

48 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:02:44am

re: #46 stabby

I thought I was interpreting your response at #10 fairly.

If that’s not what your, admittedly too terse to parse rebuttal meant, then please explain what it meant.

No, you were purposefully stuffing words in my mouth and you just got caught.

49 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:03:03am

How E.W. Jackson’s ‘Prosperity Gospel’ Could Spell Bad News For Low-Income Virginians

Jackson, a former minister of the so-called “prosperity gospel,” insists on making public connections between his theological convictions and his political actions. According to Jackson’s campaign website, he is founder of Staying True to America’s National Destiny, or S.T.A.N.D., an organization “dedicated to restoring America’s founding values which were informed by the principles found within the Jewish and Christian faiths.” What’s more, Jackson, who has accused Democrats of being “anti-God,” is also head of “Exodus Now”, a national effort that encourages “Christians and other people of moral values within the black community” to leave the Democratic Party.

To get a better look at what Jackson’s politicized theology could mean for Virginians, Think Progress looked at a copy of Jackson’s 2008 book Ten Commandments To An Extraordinary Life. In it, Jackson offers an extensive - and often unsettling - peek at his bizarre religious views.

Jackson, for instance, suggests in his book that people should prioritize giving to the wealthy, not to the poor:

“One of the common mistakes made by those who have a heart is to assume that the only appropriate giving is downward, i.e. to the poor. While giving to the poor is important, the most powerful giving for wealth building is upward giving.” (page 177)

In fact, Jackson seems to hold up wealth as the ultimate religious ideal, and even indicates that having money makes someone a better person in God’s eyes:

“Money is not evil, nor does it make people evil. Money magnifies the character of an individual. It gives you more opportunity to be who you really are. God is the creator of silver and gold. He has nothing against money, in fact he values it.” (page 172)

50 Walking Spanish Down the Hall  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:03:05am

re: #11 erik_t

Is it my job as a white American to protest Geller’s insane whackadoodle racism and xenophobia?

Apparently it is, so: please find enclosed my repudiation of Geller’s whackadoodle racism and xenophobia, and I do protest.

It’s your obligation as a human to protest unreasonable and damaging propaganda.

51 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:03:41am

re: #48 Randall Gross

Not true. Calm down.

52 Dr Lizardo  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:03:57am

re: #44 HappyWarrior

Help me out here Doc but Metzger was the leader of the Neo-Nazi group that the SPLC sued when they attacked I want to say a Hispanic mother and son.

It was the death of Mulegeta Seraw up in Portland, OR by a gang of neo-Nazis.

And Pammy is the leader of Stop The Islamization Of America, if I’m not mistaken. If an SIOA member murders a Muslim, as the leader of said group, can she not be held to account in a civil court using vicarious liability?

53 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:04:03am

Stabby, it might be simpler if you just said:

All religions are bad. Islam is a religion. Therefore Islam is bad.

Instead you argue on the one hand that all religions are total scams and If You Ruled The World, they’d vanish. On the other, Islam is worse than the others that are so bad you’d eradicate them if you could.

54 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:04:27am

re: #51 stabby

Exactly true - you are a lying little turd trying to defend Pam Geller, and I’m done with you.

55 Walking Spanish Down the Hall  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:05:03am

re: #26 stabby

No, I’m saying that I understand why wingnuts make the mistake that her followers are making.

I also understand her = she’s a coward.

BACKPEDDLE!!!

56 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:05:13am

re: #53 GeneJockey

Well, it’s how I feel.

I don’t like Christianity, but I’m grateful that it isn’t Islam. I’m grateful that I don’t live in a Muslim country.

57 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:05:19am

re: #49 Kragar

Jackson, for instance, suggests in his book that people should prioritize giving to the wealthy, not to the poor:

“One of the common mistakes made by those who have a heart is to assume that the only appropriate giving is downward, i.e. to the poor. While giving to the poor is important, the most powerful giving for wealth building is upward giving.” (page 177)

WTF?

58 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:05:50am

IMO, Geller thread = open thread.

59 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:06:11am

re: #49 Kragar

How E.W. Jackson’s ‘Prosperity Gospel’ Could Spell Bad News For Low-Income Virginians

Jackson, a former minister of the so-called “prosperity gospel,”

Oh FFS. Of course he is. I really should have seen that coming.

60 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:06:22am

Did I miss a memo? Is today step on your own dick day or something?

61 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:06:57am

re: #58 darthstar

IMO, Geller thread = open thread.

Every thread is an open thread, get with the program.

62 Bubblehead II  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:07:02am

Report is out on that live fire incident that killed 7 marines.

Human error blamed in deaths of 7 Marines during training

An investigation of the March 18 incident at Hawthorne Army Depot revealed that “the Marines employing one of the mortars did not follow correct procedures, resulting in the detonation of a high explosive round at the mortar position,” the Marines said in a statement

63 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:07:07am

re: #51 stabby

Not true. Calm down.

Hey, is this a good time for this, Stabby?

You have a long-standing claim that Islam is the worst major religion.

Your support for this is twofold:

1. You assert that you’ve read the Qu’Ran, compared it to other texts,and likewise studied the character of Mohammed and compared him to the important figures in other religions, and from your analysis the Qu’Ran contains the most evil instructions and Mohammed is the most destructive ideal.

2. You assert that simply by looking at the world today, we can see more Muslim extremists, therefore Islam is more extreme.

My criticisms of this are:

1a. That your supposed study is unproven, and that the Tanakh contains a lot of really horrific stuff in it as instructions from god, and a lot of heroes that do ethically terrible things, like genocide, rape, etc. You haven’t addressed why, with such a violent text and unethical heroes, you don’t think that Judaism has the same inherent flaws as Islam.

1b. It’s trivially demonstrable that most Christians don’t live their lives in anything like a christ-like way, so on what basis do you think the example of Christ makes Christians behave in a certain way?

2a. By looking at various points in history, we can see that at some times, members of other religions— mostly Christianity— have dominated extremism on a worldwide scale. From the Christian-fueled colonization of the New World to the massacres of Jews again and again over centuries, culminating in Nazi Germany, Christian nations, leaders, and doctrine has been radical beyond radical. Why do you refuse to look at the past when analyzing religion?


I’d note that a response to this would involve addressing the criticisms, and not simply, as you usually do, restating the premise, insulting my intelligence, or accusing me of some bizarre meta-game.

64 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:07:14am

re: #57 GeneJockey

WTF?

I think he just means money should be given to him.

65 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:07:17am

re: #55 Walking Spanish Down the Hall

It wasn’t a backpeddle it was explaining what I mean and believe.

That fact that you’re hostile to my point of view makes you project black and white on it.

But what I have said about Geller is consistent. She’s a phobic person and a coward. I think I understand her. So what?

66 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:07:43am

re: #56 stabby

Well, it’s how I feel.

I don’t like Christianity, but I’m grateful that it isn’t Islam. I’m grateful that I don’t live in a Muslim country.

You don’t live in a Christian country either.

67 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:08:14am

re: #66 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

*live

68 Tigger2  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:08:17am

Jackson, who has accused Democrats of being “anti-God,” is also head of “Exodus Now”, a national effort that encourages “Christians and other people of moral values within the black community” to leave the Democratic Party.


I’m sure I remember from my youth a warning in the bible that says ” Beware of False Prophets’ I sure Jackson falls within that catagory.

69 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:08:20am

re: #66 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

You don’t like in a Christian country either.

And I, for one, am grateful for that.

70 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:08:30am

re: #66 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

You don’t like in a Christian country either.

Pencil -> “live in a Christian country” ?

71 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:08:43am

re: #63 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

There will never again be enough time in my life to go through that pointless argument yet another time.

72 efuseakay  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:08:57am

“Where’s the condemnation from Muslins????!!!!!”

*many examples here*

“It doesn’t matter. THEY ALL LIE!!!!!!!”

73 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:09:31am

re: #58 darthstar

IMO, Geller thread = open thread.

Security Guard At N.Y. High School Arrested For Threatening To Blow Up School

We need MOAR GUNZ, so the Good Guy With A Gun could stop this Good Guy With A Gun Turned Bad
.

Although, No True Good Guy With A Gun could ever possibly Go Bad, or go nuts, or leave his gun where kids can get to it, or accidentally discharge his weapon, or shoot the wrong person, or………

74 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:09:44am

Ok, but our society is a lot more Christian than it is Islamic.

75 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:09:45am

re: #71 stabby

So your reply is “TL:DR”?

76 Bubblehead II  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:09:45am

re: #60 Kragar

Did I miss a memo? Is today step on your own dick day or something?

Just another day with Stabby

77 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:10:10am

Geez. Is it really so hard to understand that poor, theocratically-governed countries are generally less nice places to live than rich, democratically-governed ones?

78 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:10:11am

re: #75 Kragar

Yep. But I’ve wasted days on him and that argument already.

79 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:10:23am

re: #36 stabby

I pointed out that the first group isn’t moderate, which, IMO illustrates that moderation doesn’t come naturally to Islamic clerics.

A word of advice: Quit while you’re behind.

Pleasant lie: You’re doing great.

80 jaunte  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:10:26am

re: #75 Kragar

“Too hard to address; avoid.”

81 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:10:56am

Excuse me - I’ll leave on a high note while I’m having a good laugh at the projectionist in chief accusing others of projecting. Later on friends.

82 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:11:14am

re: #74 stabby

Ok, but our society is a lot more Christian than it is Islamic.

Can you give specific examples of things which are good about our society that are Christian in origin, and that could not arise from Islam?

83 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:11:24am

re: #78 stabby

Yep. But I’ve wasted days on him and that argument already.

84 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:11:27am

re: #64 calochortus

I think he just means money should be given to him.

Won’t somebody please think of the children wealthy?!?

85 Walking Spanish Down the Hall  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:12:15am

re: #78 stabby

Yep. But I’ve wasted days on him and that argument already.

Logic: You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

86 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:12:38am

re: #49 Kragar

How E.W. Jackson’s ‘Prosperity Gospel’ Could Spell Bad News For Low-Income Virginians

That’s not prosperity gospel. That shit makes prosperity gospel look good. Really? Give to the rich. This guy is the gift that keeps on giving. More I hear about him, the more I think he’s going ot bring down the ticket and Virginia may get a Dem governor, lt governor, and AG.

87 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:13:12am
88 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:13:48am

Random Islamophobic Tweets:

89 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:14:01am
90 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:14:01am

re: #87 dragonath

JC Penny Denies Tea Kettle Looks Like Hitler

Image: hit-ket.jpg

And yet they managed to sell out of them online. Profit!

91 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:14:31am

re: #87 dragonath

hitler wore bells on his fingers?

92 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:14:34am

re: #87 dragonath

“Seen Kyle? He’s about this tall…”

93 CuriousLurker  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:15:02am

re: #33 wrenchwench

Another, more recent, article here. (Hat tip to some Lurking tweeter.)

That’s what Pam wants to see here. Neighbors and former friends attacking each other over religion, ethnicity, nationalism, etc.

I see what you did there. //

94 RadicalModerate  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:15:48am

re: #74 stabby

Ok, but our society is a lot more Christian than it is Islamic.

Only because the predominant religion of our settlers was Protestant Christianity. If the original colonists were Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, or any other religion, that would be the default faith.

It is also worth mentioning that the authors of our Constitution saw a significant danger in allowing any form of religion having undue influence on our government and wrote protections into the very first amendment to protect against it.

95 Stanghazi  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:15:49am

George Zimmerman is out of money again.

Shouldn’t have rushed to pay off those student loans and credit cards.

96 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:15:57am

re: #82 iossarian

Can you give specific examples of things which are good about our society that are Christian in origin, and that could not arise from Islam?

Wrong question. It’s not “what could not arise” that matters, it what often arises.

You’re using a common rhetorical device, you’re retreating to theory because the examples of what usually happens in reality support the other side of the argument.

97 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:16:23am

re: #96 stabby

Wrong question. It’s not “what could not arise” that matters, it what often arises.

You’re using a common rhetorical device, you’re retreating to theory because the examples of what usually happens in reality support the other side or the argument.

So, no.

98 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:16:51am

re: #94 RadicalModerate

agreed

99 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:17:00am

re: #88 Vicious Babushka

Random Islamophobic Tweets:

Why is Uncle Sam a burn victim?

100 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:17:10am

re: #96 stabby

Wrong question. It’s not “what could not arise” that matters, it what often arises.

You’re using a common rhetorical device, you’re retreating to theory because the examples of what usually happens in reality support the other side or the argument.

Correlation and causation: how might they differ?

101 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:17:10am

re: #74 stabby

Ok, but our society is a lot more Christian than it is Islamic.

re: #56 stabby

I don’t like Christianity, but I’m grateful that it isn’t Islam. I’m grateful that I don’t live in a Muslim country.

Not very long ago, you would have been put to death by torture for saying something like that. In a Christian country.

This is such a bullshit argument, and you seem to think it’s genius.

102 Sionainn  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:18:05am

re: #93 CuriousLurker

I see what you did there. //

How are you feeling, CL? Glad to see you back.

103 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:18:54am

re: #88 Vicious Babushka

Random Islamophobic Tweets:

So Islam is actually blocking the hammer of the Gun Of Liberalism from striking the Firing Pin Of Tolerance, causing it to ignite the Primer of Progressivism, firing the Bullet of Multiculturalism scattering American Ingenuity all over the Pillar of Western Civilization?

104 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:19:03am

I think stabby should change its name to diggy. It would be more apt.

105 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:19:06am

re: #101 Charles Johnson

But my point of view is that what could have happened “not very long ago” is not what counts, it’s what actually exists that counts.

You have hopes that Islam will change. Fine. It could. But your imagined future is still imagined.

106 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:19:37am

re: #105 stabby

But my point of view is that what could have happened “not very long ago” is not what counts, it’s what actually exists.

You have hopes that Islam will change. Fine. It could. But your imagined future is still imagined.

Explain to me how this is different from what Pamela Geller is saying, please.

107 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:19:46am

re: #104 erik_t

I think stabby should change its name to diggy. It would be more apt.

Maybe Backhoe.

108 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:19:57am

edit made: it’s what actually exists that counts.

109 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:20:05am

re: #105 stabby

You have hopes that Islam will change. Fine. It could. But your imagined future is still imagined.

This sort of posting is gross. It’s the sort of reason I never registered until the 2010s.

110 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:20:35am

re: #109 erik_t

This sort of posting is gross. It’s the sort of reason I never registered until the 2010s.

I agree, it’s pretty ugly stuff he’s spouting here.

111 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:20:40am

re: #105 stabby

But my point of view is that what could have happened “not very long ago” is not what counts, it’s what actually exists.

You have hopes that Islam will change. Fine. It could. But your imagined future is still imagined.

Oh I can’t resist: just like your imagined present.

112 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:20:44am

re: #106 Charles Johnson

Uhm what?

113 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:20:49am

re: #105 stabby

You have hopes that Islam will change. Fine. It could. But your imagined future is still imagined.

It’s not smart to argue about the future when you’re stuck in the past.

114 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:20:57am

re: #105 stabby

But my point of view is that what could have happened “not very long ago” is not what counts, it’s what actually exists that counts.

You have hopes that Islam will change. Fine. It could. But your imagined future is still imagined.

What actually exists? OK, let me use a simple acronym.

IRA.

Irish Republican Army.

Not a bit of Islam in that organization.

115 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:21:00am

re: #101 Charles Johnson

That’s something I tried to impress upon my father. Historically speaking it wasn’t that long ago that the Catholics were practicing a “kill or convert” strategy on native populations in south america and christianity was being spread at the point of roman spears.

It wasn’t long ago (in this country) that people were hung, drowned, and even burned at the stake for not being “christian” so therefore they were “in league with the devil”

116 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:21:28am

re: #108 stabby

edit made: it’s what actually exists that counts.

You’re still equating Islam with terror. Time to shut the fuck up and stop digging.

117 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:22:41am

re: #116 darthstar

You’re still equating Islam with terror. Time to shut the fuck up and stop digging.

No, I rather like where this is going. I want to see just how far stabby is willing to go. I want to see just how much further there is to go.

118 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:23:13am
119 Bubblehead II  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:23:15am

re: #104 erik_t

I think stabby should change its name to diggy. It would be more apt.

Yep. He just keeps digging that hole deeper. Sooner or later it’s going to collapse in on him.

120 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:23:53am

re: #71 stabby

There will never again be enough time in my life to go through that pointless argument yet another time.

You’ve never, ever gone through it. All you ever do is claim you have, and dodge away.

121 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:24:33am

re: #120 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

You’ve never, ever gone through it. All you ever do is claim you have, and dodge away.

Its the same thing, right?

122 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:24:50am

re: #105 stabby

But my point of view is that what could have happened “not very long ago” is not what counts, it’s what actually exists that counts.

History actually does matter, yo. There’s even sayings about it and shit.

It’s really bizarre to meet someone who seriously thinks the past doesn’t matter in analyzing a religion.

123 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:25:05am

re: #116 darthstar

I’m equating it with immoderate views which can be very ugly.

Take “we refuse to condemn multiple genocides” that I showed is the position of the Muslim Council of Britain. And they have ties to groups that support terrorism and they’ve made mealy mouthed condemnations of terrorism in the past.

Quote from the MCB “Terror and violence is not the way to convey a message however legitimate the cause may be. It is totally counter-productive.”

Note the “legitmate”

124 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:26:15am

re: #122 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

It’s really bizarre to meet someone who seriously thinks the past doesn’t matter in analyzing a religion.

It’s like arguing with Obi-Wan.

“Your eyes facts can deceive you, don’t trust them.”

125 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:26:43am

re: #123 stabby

Someone apparently forgot the First Law of Holes — when you’re in one, stop digging.

126 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:26:48am

re: #96 stabby

Wrong question. It’s not “what could not arise” that matters, it what often arises.

You’re using a common rhetorical device, you’re retreating to theory because the examples of what usually happens in reality support the other side or the argument.

I’ll actually go a bit further with this, not because it’s a good argument, but because it’s a good opportunity to deal with it in a hopefully decisive manner.

The fact that contemporary western/liberal/democratic societies happen to have developed in Christian countries is obviously interesting and worth examining. However the claim that Christianity somehow promotes the development of this type of society in a way that other religions do not is not supported by any standard notion of causality.

For causation (A causes B), we usually require three conditions:

1) temporality, i.e., A precedes B
2) significance, i.e., some kind of statistical measure that B always/often arises after A (and not after a different pre-condition A’)
3) explanation, i.e., a clear and convincing explanation of *how* A causes B

Of these three, the “Christianity causes democracy” argument really only satisfies point 1. For 2, there are many counterexamples of Christian countries that are not democratic and democracy taking hold in non-Christian countries. For 3, well, I asked for an explanation and didn’t get one. Obviously there’s Weber and the Protestant Work Ethic but that’s mostly been discredited now as standard early 20th century colonialism.

I don’t think there’s a real case for “Christianity causes democracy”. I think the alternative explanation, that Christianity happened to be the main religion in those countries that benefited most from colonial expansion, with a resulting rise in the professional middle classes and drive towards popular representation in government, is far more convincing.

127 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:27:10am

Schlafly advises Republicans: Ignore Hispanics and ‘reach out to… white voters’

Conservative activist Phyllis Schlafly says Republicans are making a mistake by trying to court Hispanics with comprehensive immigration reform legislation.

“I think that’s a great myth because the Hispanics who come in like this are going to vote Democrat,” Schlafly told the Focus Today radio program in a clip obtained by Right Wing Watch on Wednesday. “And there is not the slightest bit of evidence they are going to vote Republican.”

“And the people the Republicans should reach out to are the white votes — the white voters who didn’t vote in the last election, and there are millions of them,” she advised.

Schlafly added that the Republican establishment had given the party a “series of losers” with the nominations of former Sen. Bob Dole, Sen. John McCain and former Gov. Mitt Romney.

She left Bush off the list of losers.

128 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:27:42am

re: #124 erik_t

It’s like arguing with Obi-Wan.

“Your eyes facts can deceive you, don’t trust them.”

“ONLY THE SITH DEAL IN ABSOLUTES!”

129 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:27:49am

re: #123 stabby

I’m equating it with immoderate views which can be very ugly.

Take “we refuse to condemn multiple genocides” that I showed is the position of the Muslim Council of Britain. And they have ties to groups that support terrorism and they’ve made mealy mouthed condemnations of terrorism in the past.

Quote from the MCB “Terror and violence is not the way to convey a message however legitimate the cause may be. It is totally counter-productive.”

Note the “legitmate”

Umm, the “legitimate” thing refers to the cause, not the tactic.

130 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:28:45am

re: #129 calochortus

Right, but it’s a sly wink.

131 CuriousLurker  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:28:45am

re: #102 Sionainn

How are you feeling, CL? Glad to see you back.

I’m feeling good, thanks for asking. I’m glad to be back. ;)

132 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:29:05am

re: #105 stabby

But my point of view is that what could have happened “not very long ago” is not what counts, it’s what actually exists that counts.

You have hopes that Islam will change. Fine. It could. But your imagined future is still imagined.

No, it isn’t. You assert all Islam is this way despite numerous individuals pointing you to organizations and individuals demonstrating otherwise.

To use the same ugly brush I would say that the IRA, the NLFT, Breivik, the Army of God, the Christian Identity subgroups, the MNSA, and the Lord’s Resistance Army (not an exhaustive list) demonstrate exactly the same about Christianity.

They don’t - neither Christianity nor Islam.

133 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:29:11am
134 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:30:01am

re: #127 Kragar

Except for the fact that I did vote in the last election, Schlafly thinks reaching out to me and shafting my Hispanic neighbors is a winning argument? Really?

135 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:30:02am

re: #129 calochortus

Umm, the “legitimate” thing refers to the cause, not the tactic.

I tried three times to write that and each time realized it was a waste of time.

136 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:30:53am

re: #117 erik_t

No, I rather like where this is going. I want to see just how far stabby is willing to go. I want to see just how much further there is to go.

This reminds me of the scene in ‘A Night At The Opera’, where Chico, Harpo, and the Handsome Male Lead are all hiding out at Groucho’s place, and a detective comes a knockin’:

Groucho: You guys gotta get out of here before I get arrested!

Chico: No, I believe I’d like to stay and see that.

137 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:31:22am

re: #129 calochortus

Umm, the “legitimate” thing refers to the cause, not the tactic.

Quite. Opposition to the oppression of the Catholic minority in Northern Ireland was a legitimate cause, but the IRA’s tactics were still wrong.

138 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:31:30am

re: #130 stabby

Right, but it’s a sly wink.

No, it is a straightforward statement. You’re letting your preconceived ideas strongly influence your reading of it.
What actual evidence do you have that it doesn’t mean what it says?

139 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:31:40am

re: #130 stabby

Right, but it’s a sly wink.

Sly wink? Jesus fucking Christ…you’re not the thought police. If you are really that distrustful of other cultures, lock yourself in your home, order out for Pizza, and we’ll read about you when you hit 900lbs.

140 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:31:56am
141 jaunte  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:32:00am

“Couches. A couch is a thing. But things get couched. Words, phrases, acts. They get couched in language, to obscure or deflect. You can lie on a couch. But you can also couch a lie.”
newyorker.com

142 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:32:22am
143 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:32:55am

GOP rebranding, part the infinity:

144 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:32:59am

re: #105 stabby

But my point of view is that what could have happened “not very long ago” is not what counts, it’s what actually exists that counts.

Christ. Within the memory of living man, a Christian country chock full of Christians slaughtered 6 million members of a different religion in the most ruthlessly efficient manner they could manage.

Compared to that, Islam is a piker.

145 Romantic Heretic  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:33:37am

re: #49 Kragar

Money is not evil, nor does it make people evil. Money magnifies the character of an individual. It gives you more opportunity to be who you really are. God is the creator of silver and gold. He has nothing against money, in fact he values it.

Oh, really?

For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. 1 Timothy 6:10

I don’t know where you get your theology from, Mr. Jackson, but it’s not The Bible.

146 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:34:05am

re: #141 jaunte

“Couches. A couch is a thing. But things get couched. Words, phrases, acts. They get couched in language, to obscure or deflect. You can lie on a couch. But you can also couch a lie.”
newyorker.com

Couching is also a form of embroidery where you lay a thread on the surface and stitch it down to the fabric below with another thread. I suspect that might be a better etymology, but it’s just a guess on my part.

147 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:34:16am

re: #145 Romantic Heretic

You gotta wonder where that guy got his bible.

148 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:34:18am

re: #133 Lidane

Dear GOP,

Please proceed.

Sincerely,
Lidane

Frankly, I would love to see a Schafly backed candidate be the 2016 GOP nominee.

149 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:35:13am

re: #148 Kragar

Frankly, I would love to see a Schafly backed candidate be the 2016 GOP nominee.

Is there enough popcorn available for that?

150 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:35:25am

re: #148 Kragar

Frankly, I would love to see a Schafly backed candidate be the 2016 GOP nominee.

Schafly/Bachmann 2016!

151 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:35:36am

Bryan Fischer has a new BFF

152 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:36:26am

re: #147 GeneJockey

You gotta wonder where that guy got his bible.

He probably followed the Jeffersonian principle: cut out the parts that don’t make sense. It’s just he used a different standard of “what makes sense.”
///

153 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:36:33am

re: #145 Romantic Heretic

God valued empty space, he made so much of it?

154 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:36:47am
155 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:37:29am

re: #144 GeneJockey

Christ. Within the memory of living man, a Christian country chock full of Christians slaughtered 6 million members of a different religion in the most ruthlessly efficient manner they could manage.

Compared to that, Islam is a piker.

Ghenghis Khan considered himself a divine agent of god and thought that his victories proved it. He’s considered by traditionally observant Mongols to be the greatest shaman that ever lived. He killed millions, sacked cities. Yet somehow, those observant Mongols in the modern day don’t really think sacking cities is great.

It’s weird, it’s like the texts and heroes of a religion don’t have a direct connection with how the followers act! But how can that be?

156 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:37:44am

re: #149 calochortus

Is there enough popcorn available for that?

Image: s_h22_hbgpat01.gif

157 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:38:43am

re: #151 Vicious Babushka

Bryan Fischer has a new BFF

Awwww. Their 2000’s BC worldview is perfect for each other.

158 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:39:01am

re: #154 Gus

“We hate all non Christians from impure bloodlines equally.”

159 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:39:14am

re: #155 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

It’s weird, it’s like the texts and heroes of a religion don’t have a direct connection with how the followers act! But how can that be?

It must be the secret mind controlling ray embedded in the Kaaba ///

160 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:39:44am

re: #156 Kragar

Image: s_h22_hbgpat01.gif

Objection: there is no humanity in the modern Republican ticket.

161 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:39:48am

Bryan’s taking a break from Teh Ghey, for a few Tweets.

162 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:40:10am

re: #143 Lidane

GOP rebranding, part the infinity:

I fear that race is going to be a nail-biter. Sure, the Republicans are nuts and magnificent examples of why rebranding is necessary - and in fact are severely disliked.

But it’s McAuliffe, who is only a step or two better, in a state that tends to vote Republican.

163 RadicalModerate  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:40:14am

re: #127 Kragar

Schlafly advises Republicans: Ignore Hispanics and ‘reach out to… white voters’

An appeal to ethnic purity?

It’s becoming more and more evident that the GOP is becoming more and more comfortable getting their talking points from so-called “race realist” bigots and only disassociating themselves with those individuals when the public spotlight gets too bright for them to ignore.
In short, they don’t have a problem with the white nationalism itself, they just don’t want to be perceived as supporting to the mainstream.

164 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:40:37am

re: #143 Lidane

GOP rebranding, part the infinity:

Good and I am feeling what the voters feel. I don’t like McAuliffe at all but I hate hate Cuccinelli.

165 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:40:54am

re: #160 erik_t

Objection: there is no humanity in the modern Republican ticket.

Fixed.

Image: 1362599_02bcdea730.jpg

166 Dr Lizardo  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:41:04am

re: #144 GeneJockey

Christ. Within the memory of living man, a Christian country chock full of Christians slaughtered 6 million members of a different religion in the most ruthlessly efficient manner they could manage.

Compared to that, Islam is a piker.

Zing!

167 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:41:07am
168 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:41:20am

re: #161 Vicious Babushka

Bryan’s taking a break from Teh Ghey, for a few Tweets.

Twisted fuckwad.

169 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:42:16am

re: #167 Lidane

I guess it was too much to expect to Glenn to grow up after he turned 11 last year.

170 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:42:42am

re: #167 Lidane

The right wing and their obsession with homosexuality.

171 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:42:46am

Oh my god, they’re cooperating despite their different party. They must be lovers! Hee Hee!

172 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:43:00am

re: #163 RadicalModerate

In short, they don’t have a problem with the white nationalism itself, they just don’t want to be perceived as supporting to the mainstream.

Pretty much, yeah. They want the bigot vote, but can’t be openly bigoted.

173 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:43:26am

re: #162 kirkspencer

I fear that race is going to be a nail-biter. Sure, the Republicans are nuts and magnificent examples of why rebranding is necessary - and in fact are severely disliked.

But it’s McAuliffe, who is only a step or two better, in a state that tends to vote Republican.

Last two polls have had McAuliffe with a 5 point lead. Even TPM says that it’s ultimately going to come down to who the voters dislike less.

174 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:43:26am

re: #171 HappyWarrior

Oh my god, they’re cooperating despite their different party. They must be lovers! Hee Hee!

Its the only logical explanation.
/

175 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:44:36am
176 efuseakay  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:44:38am

re: #94 RadicalModerate

Only because the predominant religion of our settlers was Protestant Christianity. If the original colonists were Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, or any other religion, that would be the default faith.

It is also worth mentioning that the authors of our Constitution saw a significant danger in allowing any form of religion having undue influence on our government and wrote protections into the very first amendment to protect against it.

Said Protestants who invaded these foreign lands, wiped out the natives, and forced their way of life onto those they didn’t kill. But stabby is ok with that. That’s the kind of place he’d choose to live in.

177 Dr Lizardo  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:45:04am

re: #170 Gus

The right wing and their obsession with deeply repressed homosexuality.

FTFY.

178 Occam's Guillotine  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:45:37am

Fischer, Beck, and Geller belong in a zoo; and not cleaning the cages either: Shoveling elephant shit is honest work and I wouldn’t dare impugn it by assigning them to it.

179 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:45:39am

So he’s not just a lunatic. He’s a prosperity gospel lunatic. Whee!

180 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:45:56am

re: #173 Targetpractice

Last two polls have had McAuliffe with a 5 point lead. Even TPM says that it’s ultimately going to come down to who the voters dislike less.

I think ultimately voters will decide tehy dislike Terry because while unlikable, he lives in reality and doesn’t have a lunatic as a running mate.

181 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:46:13am

re: #173 Targetpractice

Last two polls have had McAuliffe with a 5 point lead. Even TPM says that it’s ultimately going to come down to who the voters dislike less.

Disagree. It ultimately will come down to who can get voters to come out in an off-year election. Yes, a major factor is who is disliked less, but the key is just getting people out. Nobody’s voters are enthused about their choices.

182 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:46:23am

re: #175 darthstar

For the same reason they all treated GM paying off the bailout loans early with disinterest and/or disbelief: Because the idea that government can invest in something other than making the 1% richer is taboo when the 1% is cutting your paycheck.

183 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:47:00am

re: #176 efuseakay

Don’t forget, said Protestants left their home country because they were considered whacked out religious zealots by their fellow countrymen.

184 efuseakay  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:47:47am

re: #166 Dr Lizardo

Zing!

Zwah!

185 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:47:57am

re: #181 kirkspencer

I should be more clear. While voters will turn out to vote against an issue, they don’t (usually) for candidates. If they’re being asked to vote for a-hole so as to stop crazy, they’ll probably just abstain and stay home.

186 lawhawk  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:48:10am

re: #140 Lidane


Israel clinched a deal on Wednesday to abolish wholesale exemptions from military service for Jewish seminary students, ended a brief crisis that divided the ruling coalition parties.

The issue of “sharing the national burden” is at the heart of heated debate over privileges the ultra-Orthodox minority has enjoyed for decades, and a government-appointed committee had failed to formulate a new conscription law earlier this week.

Defense Minister Moshe Yaalon, a member of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s right-wing Likud party, had balked at a clause under which criminal charges would be brought against those trying to dodge conscription.

Netanyahu’s main coalition partner, the centrist Yesh Atid party, threatened on Monday to quit the government unless the issue was resolved.

In a compromise that paved the way for the deal, the committee agreed on sanctions but delayed imposing them during a four-year interim period in which the military will encourage 18-year-old Bible scholars to enlist, political officials said.

Under the proposed law, which still faces ratification in the cabinet and parliament, the number of seminary students exempted from the military each year will be limited to 1,800 of the estimated 8,000 required to register for the draft annually.

It’s likely to be ratified and solves one of the thorny issues for the Israeli government - how to better integrate the Ultra Orthodox into the wider Israeli society, as well as to deal with the need for manpower and the poverty that persists in the ultra Orthodox community.

187 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:48:40am

re: #179 Lidane

The VA GOP has just announced they have a brand new campaign anthem which sums up their whole message:

Youtube Video

188 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:48:57am

re: #179 Lidane

So he’s not just a lunatic. He’s a prosperity gospel lunatic. Whee!

“God compels you to give to my donors”

189 jaunte  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:49:18am

re: #179 Lidane

“One of the common mistakes made by those who have a heart is to assume that the only appropriate giving is downward, i.e. to the poor. While giving to the poor is important, the most powerful giving for wealth building is upward giving.”

One of my former employees ran into some financial trouble trying to follow this principle, when he gave too much away to that smiley con man Joel Osteen.

190 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:49:19am

re: #175 darthstar

Because then they’d have to mention how much the Tesla stock has gone up?

191 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:49:37am

re: #183 Kragar

Don’t forget, said Protestants left their home country because they were considered whacked out religious zealots by their fellow countrymen.

Be more accurate, please. They were considered whacked out religious zealots because they refused to tolerate other denominations, even other flavors of protestant.

heh - our current crop truly is traditional, isn’t it?

192 efuseakay  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:49:37am

re: #183 Kragar

Don’t forget, said Protestants left their home country because they were considered whacked out religious zealots by their fellow countrymen.

TAXES!!!!!!!

/

193 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:49:44am

re: #185 kirkspencer

I should be more clear. While voters will turn out to vote against an issue, they don’t (usually) for candidates. If they’re being asked to vote for a-hole so as to stop crazy, they’ll probably just abstain and stay home.

They pulled that shit in ‘10, they got the Tea Party. If the Democrats of Virginia can’t be arsed to show up to the polls because they don’t like Terry McAuliffe, then they’ve no one to blame but themselves when PP becomes extinct in VA, birth control is outlawed, and funding for the social safety net hollowed out to fund more tax cuts for the wealthiest Virginians.

194 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:50:59am

re: #182 Targetpractice

For the same reason they all treated GM paying off the bailout loans early with disinterest and/or disbelief: Because the idea that government can invest in something other than making the 1% richer is taboo when the 1% is cutting your paycheck.

Here is the difference between GM and Tesla: Tesla is a toy for rich folks, whereas a normal working person can actually aspire to own a GM product.

195 darthstar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:51:24am

I’m glad derpy took a break…my anger has subsided greatly in the last fifteen minutes.

196 Joanne  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:51:27am

re: #127 Kragar

Schlafly advises Republicans: Ignore Hispanics and ‘reach out to… white voters’

She left Bush off the list of losers.

Maybe Rush could run, he’s a Tru Conservative. We’d see EC of 350 instead of the last 332. Maybe then the GOP could purge the loons and get some real ideas.

197 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:51:34am

He sounds reasonable:

198 CuriousLurker  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:52:37am

re: #195 darthstar

I’m glad derpy took a break…my anger has subsided greatly in the last fifteen minutes.

Shhhhh….don’t jinx it.

199 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:53:15am

re: #197 Lidane

He sounds reasonable:

What a tool.

200 jaunte  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:53:17am

re: #197 Lidane

“The minute we start stifling our speech, we might as well go home, roll up our sleeves and get our guns out.”

Maine Gov. Paul LePage calls for wave of accidental shootings.

201 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:54:15am

re: #177 Dr Lizardo

FTFY.

Eh. It’s not all repression.

Some of them feel it really is their entitlement to tell all people how to fuck properly.

202 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:54:21am

re: #194 Vicious Babushka

Here is the difference between GM and Tesla: Tesla is a toy for rich folks, whereas a normal working person can actually aspire to own a GM product.

You’ve fairly accurately described the attitude towards the automobile, circa 1900. That Tesla has successfully paid off its loans says that there is a market for the electric automobile, which will spur others to work towards making it available to the masses.

203 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:54:31am

re: #196 Joanne

Maybe Rush could run, he’s a Tru Conservative. We’d see EC of 350 instead of the last 332. Maybe then the GOP could purge the loons and get some real ideas.

I actually would love for Rush to put his money where his mouth is and run. He’s always saying that a true conservative wins every time. Why Rush why don’t you give it the old college try? I mean if Al Franken can run for office and actually be effective………Oh wait this is Rush who thinks it’s humorous to say Christie and Obama have a servant-boss relationship. Yeah I see.

204 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:55:12am

re: #74 stabby

Ok, but our society is a lot more Christian than it is Islamic.

And the parts that are the most ‘Christian’ are the ones that force women to have children even when the children are stillborn.

Because state and religion mixing is the problem, it really isn’t what the religion is.

205 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:55:21am

re: #197 Lidane

He sounds reasonable:

Until what you see he was angry about. A legislative committee meeting on the budget, and he wanted to talk at the committee. The chair said “no”.

“Darnit, you’re suppressing my first amendment right to free speech.”

///

206 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:56:23am

re: #202 Targetpractice

You’ve fairly accurately described the attitude towards the automobile, circa 1900. That Tesla has successfully paid off its loans says that there is a market for the electric automobile, which will spur others to work towards making it available to the masses.

Tesla is a luxury product. There are other electric and hybrid vehicles on the market that are more affordable. For example, Volt, Leaf, C-Max.

207 Varek Raith  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:56:48am

re: #6 stabby

Hi Pam!

208 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:57:03am

re: #205 kirkspencer

Until what you see he was angry about. A legislative committee meeting on the budget, and he wanted to talk at the committee. The chair said “no”.

“Darnit, you’re suppressing my first amendment right to free speech.”

///

The First Amendment means everyone has to make time and give you their full attention every time you want to say something.
/

209 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:57:10am

re: #205 kirkspencer

Until what you see he was angry about. A legislative committee meeting on the budget, and he wanted to talk at the committee. The chair said “no”.

“Darnit, you’re suppressing my first amendment right to free speech.”

///

He’s going to be a one term governor. Just another boil on the ass from the 2010 elections that voters are oging to look at and think “Wait, what we elected this guy GOVERNOR.”

210 RadicalModerate  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:58:12am

re: #183 Kragar

Don’t forget, said Protestants left their home country because they were considered whacked out religious zealots by their fellow countrymen.

Some (most notably the Puritans and Calvinists), were hardcore zealots who were escaping an -albeit slightly - more liberal Europe, but not all.

For example, the French settlers came over for economic reasons, and established friendly relations with the natives via fur trade.

Then you have the Spanish conquistadors, who weren’t interested in settlement, but more in conquest and enslaving/exterminating the native population.

211 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:58:21am
“The minute we start stifling our speech, we might as well go home, roll up our sleeves and get our guns out.”

“Roll up our sleeves…?”

212 Varek Raith  Wed, May 29, 2013 11:59:14am

re: #197 Lidane

He sounds reasonable:

I’ll be on the side with Teh Tankz.

213 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:00:27pm

WTF

214 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:00:54pm

re: #210 RadicalModerate

Some (most notably the Puritans and Calvinists), were hardcore zealots who were escaping an -albeit slightly - more liberal Europe, but not all.

For example, the French settlers came over for economic reasons, and established friendly relations with the natives via fur trade.

Then you have the Spanish conquistadors, who weren’t interested in settlement, but more in conquest and enslaving/exterminating the native population.

I was referring specifically to those who would be considered our “fore fathers” and founders of our “Christian” nation.

215 efuseakay  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:01:27pm

re: #197 Lidane

He sounds reasonable:

Geez. I’m starting to stock up to defend myself against these idiots. Bet they never saw that coming!

216 Varek Raith  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:01:48pm

re: #213 Vicious Babushka

WTF

Lol, nope.

217 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:02:19pm

re: #206 Vicious Babushka

Tesla is a luxury product. There are other electric and hybrid vehicles on the market that are more affordable. For example, Volt, Leaf, C-Max.

Viewed cynically, however, the popularity of Tesla’s Model S among more affluent buyers will increase the push for the infrastructure needed to make electric cars more convenient and acceptable for everyone. Also, it demonstrates that an electric car need not be a funny-looking, gutless subcompact.

218 lawhawk  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:02:22pm

re: #202 Targetpractice

That’s part of it. The car is doing quite well to fit demand among those who are currently able to afford it - and beating out the likes of upscale Audis, BMWs, and MBs.

And as he refines the Tesla model, they’re going to drive down cost too. His battery packs look like they’re going to set a benchmark others will license for use. He’s looking to build infrastructure to go along with the cars - each additional vehicle he puts on the road will help reach towards critical mass in getting shared standards (like common battery types, charging ports, etc.)

Oh, and Tesla’s managed to sell more of its cars than GM or Nissan did with the Volt and Leaf … combined while turning a profit.

219 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:03:08pm

re: #213 Vicious Babushka

WTF

Bitter are they. Sorry wingnuts but Mitt won’t save you and he doesn’t care because he’s still rolling in dough regardless of who’s in the WH.

220 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:03:33pm

re: #206 Vicious Babushka

Tesla is a luxury product. There are other electric and hybrid vehicles on the market that are more affordable. For example, Volt, Leaf, C-Max.

Yet Tesla sold more of its Model S cars last year than Volts or Leafs were sold by its competitors. And it’s working on its own mass-production cars, with every intention of making electric cars available to the masses.

221 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:03:36pm

re: #213 Vicious Babushka

Number 3 in the Line Of Succession is the Speaker of the house, John Boehner. He becomes the President, (#45, as Obama’s second term is not being shortened, it is being invalidated), and can appoint his choice as Vice President, shall we say Ted Cruz. At any time going forward, If John Boehner should decide to resign7 return to the Speaker role, or private life, Ted Crux would assume the role as President of the United States.

Haha. “Ted Crux”

222 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:03:37pm

re: #49 Kragar

Freaking “prosperity gospel” garbage is one of the worst heresies Christianity has spawned in a long time. It actively teaches and encourages anti-Christian behavior in pursuit of material gain.

223 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:03:49pm

re: #213 Vicious Babushka

WTF

Misreading the constitution plus wishful thinking.

The house already did its decision. It’s done, no backsies.

And the house only certifies the president, so rejecting Obama does not automatically reject Biden. The senate confirms the vice president (one of those checks and balances things from when they were elected separately instead of on a joint party slip.)

Idiots are idiots.

224 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:04:33pm

re: #123 stabby

Quote from the MCB “Terror and violence is not the way to convey a message however legitimate the cause may be. It is totally counter-productive.”

Note the “legitmate”

You’re not completely without a point here - the Muslim Council of Britain does take some positions I strongly disagree with.

But your view of this statement is clearly distorted by your bias. The statement is telling Muslims to renounce terror and violence and work for their goals within the political system. You may not agree with those goals, but what the fuck could possibly be wrong with this?

I thought this is what you wanted - Muslim leaders denouncing terrorism and urging political action instead. But your prejudice is showing again.

225 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:04:44pm

re: #213 Vicious Babushka

And those stupid democrats were just too stupid to do it when they had the house majority during the Bush years.
/

226 Varek Raith  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:04:52pm

Legalize the Constantions!

227 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:04:56pm

On the road to peak wingnut. We’re still not there.

228 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:05:09pm

re: #223 kirkspencer

Misreading the constitution plus wishful thinking.

The house already did its decision. It’s done, no backsies.

And the house only certifies the president, so rejecting Obama does not automatically reject Biden. The senate confirms the vice president (one of those checks and balances things from when they were elected separately instead of on a joint party slip.)

Idiots are idiots.

TEH BUTTHURT continues and will continue as long as Obama resides in the WH.

229 StephenMeansMe  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:05:13pm

“There are no moderate Muslims” according to RWNJs, and they point to passages in the Koran that call for violent jihad against nonbelievers, but if you turn around and point out how the Bible condones chattel slavery of nonbelievers (&c.) they’ll all be like “But that’s taken out of context!”

230 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:06:06pm

re: #229 StephenMeansMe

“There are no moderate Muslims” according to RWNJs, and they point to passages in the Koran that call for violent jihad against nonbelievers, but if you turn around and point out how the Bible condones chattel slavery of nonbelievers (&c.) they’ll all be like “But that’s taken out of context!”

Ones that condone murdering disobedient children too.

231 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:06:19pm

re: #213 Vicious Babushka

WTF

I’m with you. There’s some crazy, stupid people out there.

232 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:06:24pm

re: #213 Vicious Babushka

We must retroactively and unilaterally decertify the 2012 election in order to save the Constitution from the usurper!

Some fucking people.

233 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:06:53pm

re: #206 Vicious Babushka

Tesla is a luxury product. There are other electric and hybrid vehicles on the market that are more affordable. For example, Volt, Leaf, C-Max.

All of which are either gas users (implying electrical is still just a gimmick) or have typical ranges of less than 100 miles. The Teslas get 200+.

The other thing Tesla did which I think was long-term brilliant is started investment in independent recharge stations. If you have a Tesla and you’re driving in California you can get from LA to San Francisco in a “normal” driving day, not needing to either kick in the gas engine or stop for a few hours every hundred miles. Just stop for ten minutes or so at the recharge station and continue on your way.

Yes, it’s a rich person’s toy. But it’s the only full electric that’s directly competitive against gasoline engine cars, and so proves it’s doable.

234 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:07:03pm

DERP

BTW Bryan is totally wrong. Proverbs 31 describes a business woman.

235 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:07:33pm

re: #224 Charles Johnson

But your view of this statement is clearly distorted by your bias. In fact, it’s telling Muslims to renounce terror and violence and work for their goals within the political system. You may not agree with those goals, but what the fuck could possibly be wrong with this?

I thought this is what you wanted - Muslim leaders denouncing terrorism and urging political action instead. But your prejudice is showing again.

I think there’s a stronger word, a more specific word, that you might find useful and applicable in this discussion.

236 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:08:25pm

re: #234 Vicious Babushka

DERP

Sorry Bryan, could you repeat that? Because all I heard was “Unga bunga.”

237 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:08:32pm

re: #231 GeneJockey

I’m with you. There’s some crazy, stupid people out there.

I like the “End the Gun Free Zones” graphic on the right hand side, which has a picture of the nearly assassinated Ronald Reagan.

Brilliant.

238 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:08:38pm

re: #234 Vicious Babushka

DERP

No, Bryan. God designed men to laze about in a garden of plenty, and designed women as workers intended to keep men from being bored and lonely. Breadwinning was what people had to do because they didn’t stick with the original design intent.

239 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:09:37pm

re: #154 Gus

well…THAT causes just a bit of whiplash…

240 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:10:25pm

re: #234 Vicious Babushka

DERP

I guess that means my family’s experience didn’t happen according to primitive fuckwad.

241 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:10:26pm

re: #233 kirkspencer

All of which are either gas users (implying electrical is still just a gimmick) or have typical ranges of less than 100 miles. The Teslas get 200+.

The other thing Tesla did which I think was long-term brilliant is started investment in independent recharge stations. If you have a Tesla and you’re driving in California you can get from LA to San Francisco in a “normal” driving day, not needing to either kick in the gas engine or stop for a few hours every hundred miles. Just stop for ten minutes or so at the recharge station and continue on your way.

Yes, it’s a rich person’s toy. But it’s the only full electric that’s directly competitive against gasoline engine cars, and so proves it’s doable.

I dunno. I’m more in favor of the Volt’s model, since, for example, if I owned one, I’d almost never need to do anything but charge it every night, but if I needed to go farther, I would not need to worry about finding a charging station and waiting the requisite time. I think the future ultimately belongs to whatever technology can take over seamlessly.

But I gotta tell you - seeing all the Tesla Model S’s on the Peninsula is pretty cool!

242 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:10:37pm

Michele Bachmann to leave Congress, insisting departure has nothing to do with ongoing ethics investigation

Accompanied by odd digitized theme music, Minnesota Congresswoman Michele Bachmann announced early Wednesday morning via YouTube that she would not seek a fifth term in Congress. At this writing, comments for the ‘Team Bachmann’ video have been disabled.

During her video presentation, Bachmann (R-Minn.) insisted that her announcement was not related to the ongoing ethics investigation regarding alleged misconduct during her failed attempt to win the 2012 Republican presidential primary.

243 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:11:37pm
244 sattv4u2  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:12:03pm

Disneyland Employee Arrested in Toontown Explosion

ktla.com

Defense?

he was just being Goofy!
/

245 AlexRogan  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:12:36pm

re: #6 stabby

Uhh, what?

246 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:13:41pm

Translating Michele Bachmann’s Resignation Speech

Like you, I got about 30 seconds in before her tendency to talk to the public like it’s made up of very slow-witted preschoolers got to me and I had to shut it off. However, the hard-working folks at Minnesota Public Radio graciously published a transcript, and so I thought I’d use that to quote juicy bits and help translate them from Wingnutese (which I sadly speak fluently) to English.

My good friends, after a great deal of thought and deliberation, I have decided next year I will not seek a fifth Congressional term to represent the wonderful people of the Sixth District of Minnesota. After serious consideration, I am confident that this is the right decision.

After reading my poll numbers and having to endure multiple interviews with the FBI, I’ve decided that this job actually requires work, so I’m quitting.

247 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:13:50pm
248 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:14:10pm

re: #241 GeneJockey

I dunno. I’m more in favor of the Volt’s model, since, for example, if I owned one, I’d almost never need to do anything but charge it every night, but if I needed to go farther, I would not need to worry about finding a charging station and waiting the requisite time. I think the future ultimately belongs to whatever technology can take over seamlessly.

But I gotta tell you - seeing all the Tesla Model S’s on the Peninsula is pretty cool!

fwiw I would like to see a merging of both down the road. In home slow recharge (possibly with higher voltage chargers) plus on the road fast recharging stations.

Recharging at home is great and for 80% of the people 80% of the time it’s all they need. For the 20% who travel more than 100 miles a day, and the 20% of the time the short-distant users go on vacations or long family trips, the recharge stations matter.

All that said what I really expect to happen is to start seeing most if not all the electrics go to the fast recharge stations. It’s money on the road.

249 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:14:16pm

Random Islamophobic Tweets

250 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:14:40pm

re: #247 HappyWarrior

However, the law limits anyone from serving as President of the United States for more than eight years. And in my opionion, well, eight years is also long enough for an individual to serve as a representative for a specific congressional district.

To make myself feel better about leaving in disgrace, I’m going to pretend Congress is a club I don’t want to be in anyway, starting by disparaging those who managed to hang in longer than I did.

251 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:14:44pm

re: #241 GeneJockey

I dunno. I’m more in favor of the Volt’s model, since, for example, if I owned one, I’d almost never need to do anything but charge it every night, but if I needed to go farther, I would not need to worry about finding a charging station and waiting the requisite time. I think the future ultimately belongs to whatever technology can take over seamlessly.

But I gotta tell you - seeing all the Tesla Model S’s on the Peninsula is pretty cool!

Thing about hybrids is that it’s neither a good gasoline-powered car or a good electric car. Whether you’re driving on electric or gasoline, you’re dragging along extra weight, whether it be the gas engine when running on battery alone or all the batteries when driving it as a hybrid. It’s training wheels, ones that give the sense that electric cars can’t work unless there’s a gas engine to kick in when the batteries run out.

252 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:15:04pm

re: #244 sattv4u2

Disneyland Employee Arrested in Toontown Explosion

ktla.com


Dry ice appeared to have been placed in a plastic bottle that was left in the trash can, police said.

Aw, hell, I’ve seen that done with a 10L carboy. A bunch of guys thought they were inventing a CO2-powered water cannon, but a polypropylene carboy is not a pressure device, so in fact it was a CO2-powered water BOMB

253 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:17:50pm

re: #226 Varek Raith

Legalize the Constantions!

Run by some bozo called Tom O’Halloran. Sure enough he links to Jihad Watch and has a bunch of stuff about Moozlims!

254 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:18:00pm

re: #249 Vicious Babushka

Random Islamophobic Tweets

Is conquest of new lands rwnj slang for setting up hookah bars all over town? Because that one is true here in NoVa. Not like I’m complaining. I

255 A Mom Anon  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:18:38pm

re: #234 Vicious Babushka

So let’s say you have a child with a guy who runs off and you don’t see him for 4 yrs. Because he joined the military so he wouldn’t have to face his responsibility(that is until the mother of his kid sues him for support and ends up with some of his teeny military pay). Or what if the father commits suicide? Since we know Bryan hates people on public assistance what happens to the mother and kids then? I know young mothers this has happened to, they kinda had to win some bread for their families. Bryan might know that if he ever left his cave and had a freaking empathy gene implant.

What an asshole.

256 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:19:09pm

re: #66 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

You don’t live in a Christian country either.

And I, as a Christian, thank God for that.

“There never was a union of church and state which did not bring serious evils to religion.”
The Right Reverend John England, first Roman Catholic Bishop of Charleston SC, 1825.

257 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:19:16pm

re: #254 HappyWarrior

Conquest?

Youtube Video

258 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:19:25pm

re: #255 A Mom Anon

So let’s say you have a child with a guy who runs off and you don’t see him for 4 yrs. Because he joined the military so he wouldn’t have to face his responsibility(that is until the mother of his kid sues him for support and ends up with some of his teeny military pay). Or what if the father commits suicide? Since we know Bryan hates people on public assistance what happens to the mother and kids then? I know young mothers this has happened to, they kinda had to win some bread for their families. Bryan might know that if he ever left his cave and had a freaking empathy gene implant.

What an asshole.

Bryan is just a giant douche.

259 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:19:44pm

re: #256 William Barnett-Lewis

And I, as a Christian, thank God for that.

“There never was a union of church and state which did not bring serious evils to religion.”
The Right Reverend John England, first Roman Catholic Bishop of Charleston SC, 1825.

A wise man.

260 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:20:15pm

re: #255 A Mom Anon

I saw a (-1), went to see who downdinged, and by then it was a (+1). It’s comforting to see that other people sometimes make the same silly screw-ups I make.

In the interest of protecting the not-so-innocent, I won’t say who.

261 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:20:26pm

How’s that “Prosperity Gospel” working out?

262 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:21:21pm

re: #261 Vicious Babushka

How’s that “Prosperity Gospel” working out?

Pretty well, for 8% of us. The other 92% must be lazy and shiftless.
//

263 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:21:51pm

re: #224 Charles Johnson

True.

But that other example I gave (and I only stop at one because I hate reading that stuff), shows that their statements ARE sly ways to stick in the maximum hate.

There’s no good way to parse what they said. But the fact that they were politically savy enough to leave mention of the Jews off of their opposition to Holocaust Memorial day illustrates that their statements ARE sly.

So yeah, they probably did it show hatred toward the Jews while denying it. And their statement managed to show support for the Nazis killing gays and support for a genocide that was actually perpetuated by Muslims in the process. Win?

264 lawhawk  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:22:00pm

re: #258 Vicious Babushka

I would disagree. After reading his troglodytic, misogynistic, and racist rantings and ravings, one needs to take a shower.

He is beneath pond scum. And we are all dumber for having to put up with his incessant twitterings.

265 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:22:04pm

re: #255 A Mom Anon

He also seems unaware that back in the day it wasn’t just some wage-slave going off to his job and drawing a paycheck while the little woman waited at home. A functioning household required at least a man and a woman and probably a few children or servants to do the work.

266 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:22:16pm

re: #261 Vicious Babushka

How’s that “Prosperity Gospel” working out?

Earn? :O

267 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:23:19pm

A group that is THAT much of a hate group. Why would it matter if they came out against terrorism anyway? It’s not much of a breakthrough if a hate group feels so much pressure that they say something that isn’t horrible occasionally.

268 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:23:27pm
269 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:23:42pm

re: #263 stabby

But that other example I gave (and I only stop at one because I hate reading that stuff), shows that their statements ARE sly ways to stick in the maximum hate.

Or, y’know, maybe they’re right about some things and wrong about some other things.

Just maybe. Just a thought.

270 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:24:17pm
271 Joanne  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:24:23pm

re: #194 Vicious Babushka

Here is the difference between GM and Tesla: Tesla is a toy for rich folks, whereas a normal working person can actually aspire to own a GM product.

Now. The computer was once unaffordable by mere humans like myself.

272 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:24:27pm

re: #267 stabby

A group that is THAT much of a hate group. Why would it matter if they came out against terrorism anyway? It’s not much of a breakthrough if a hate group feels so much pressure that they say something that isn’t horrible occasionally.

Did you just call the Muslim Council of Britain a hate group?

273 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:24:27pm

re: #268 Vicious Babushka

The poor dog’s head appears to have deflated.

274 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:24:34pm

re: #261 Vicious Babushka

“Man should not consider his material possession his own, but as common to all, so as to share them without hesitation when others are in need.”

-Thomas Aquinas

275 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:24:47pm

re: #270 Lidane

Is the big problem with Chernobyl really that it’s undignified?

276 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:24:49pm

re: #267 stabby

You know, I was going to respond to this masterpiece of circular reasoning, but I really think I should go do something constructive instead.

Later, all.

277 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:24:55pm

re: #269 erik_t

Or, y’know, maybe they’re right about some things and wrong about some other things.

Just maybe. Just a thought.

Nuance can be a bitch. Good men with vices and bad men with virtues. Something something.

278 sattv4u2  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:24:58pm

re: #252 GeneJockey


Dry ice appeared to have been placed in a plastic bottle that was left in the trash can, police said.

Aw, hell, I’ve seen that done with a 10L carboy. A bunch of guys thought they were inventing a CO2-powered water cannon, but a polypropylene carboy is not a pressure device, so in fact it was a CO2-powered water BOMB

Moronic thing to do, considering the venue though. This isn’t the back patio of a frat house on a Saturday night

279 blueraven  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:25:06pm

re: #260 erik_t

I saw a (-1), went to see who downdinged, and by then it was a (+1). It’s comforting to see that other people sometimes make the same silly screw-ups I make.

In the interest of protecting the not-so-innocent, I won’t say who.

It is I, the “Guilty One”

Hmmm…I find it weird that you felt this important to note as it was an obvious mistake, immediately corrected…and then go so far as to proclaim one as “not-so-innocent”.

whatever

280 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:25:51pm

re: #270 Lidane

I like turtles.

281 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:26:12pm

re: #272 erik_t

Yes.

Tell me how to oppose a memorial to the holocaust without supporting hate.

Tell me how to support the Nazi’s slaughter of gays without being a hate group.

Tell me how to support the Armenian genocide without being a hate group.

282 calochortus  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:26:24pm

re: #279 blueraven

I think he was referring to himself as having been guilty of the same thing.

283 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:26:28pm

Someone has been hitting the vodka bottle early.

284 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:26:33pm

re: #272 erik_t

Did you just call the Muslim Council of Britain a hate group?

Look, they did this!

When schoolteacher Gillian Gibbons was jailed in Sudan for allowing her class to name a teddy bear as the Islamic Prophet Muhammad, the MCB condemned the incident as “a gross overreaction” and said the Sudanese authorities lacked basic common sense.

Sneaky Muslims! Taquiyya! Moon-god!

285 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:26:48pm

re: #263 stabby

True.

But that other example I gave (and I only stop at one because I hate reading that stuff), shows that their statements ARE sly ways to stick in the maximum hate.

There’s no good way to parse what they said. But the fact that they were politically savy enough to leave mention of the Jews off of their opposition to Holocaust Memorial day illustrates that their statements ARE sly.

So yeah, they probably did it show hatred toward the Jews while denying it. And their statement managed to show support for the Nazis killing gays and support for a genocide that was actually perpetuated by Muslims in the process. Win?

Not so long ago, LaPierre said that the fact Obama hadn’t pressed for any gun control measures (pre-Newton) proved he intended to seize the guns. ‘The fact they didn’t mention it proves how much they intend it’ is a perfect strawman.

You chose a quote to demonstrate their perfidy, and it was shown invalid. Rather than choosing another that might work better you instead make the first a strawman.

Perhaps you wondered why you’re seeing downdings and ridicule. This is an explanation.

286 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:26:55pm

re: #278 sattv4u2

Moronic thing to do, considering the venue though. This isn’t the back patio of a frat house on a Saturday night

Or Genentech on a Friday Afternoon in the 1980s. BTW, one of the ‘inventors’ ended up going to the ER with plastic shrapnel in his leg.

287 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:27:15pm

re: #281 stabby

Yes.

Tell me how to oppose a memorial to the holocaust without supporting hate.

Tell me how to support the Nazi’s slaughter of gays without being a hate group.

Tell me how to support the Armenian genocide without being a hate group.

What does the word ‘support’ mean to you, Stabby?

288 Joanne  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:27:18pm

re: #203 HappyWarrior

I actually would love for Rush to put his money where his mouth is and run. He’s always saying that a true conservative wins every time. Why Rush why don’t you give it the old college try? I mean if Al Franken can run for office and actually be effective………Oh wait this is Rush who thinks it’s humorous to say Christie and Obama have a servant-boss relationship. Yeah I see.

Then we’d get He’s Been Married FOUR times! He’s not a REAL conservative!!!11!

But then again, who is?

289 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:27:31pm

re: #279 blueraven

I thought my tone was clearly lighthearted. My bad.

290 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:27:59pm

re: #283 Vicious Babushka

Wait, Charles is getting paid for this? When do I get my check?!

///

291 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:28:06pm

re: #288 Joanne

Then we’d get He’s Been Married FOUR times! He’s not a REAL conservative!!!11!

But then again, who is?

Republican Jesus.

//

292 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:28:12pm

re: #287 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

mcb.org.uk

293 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:29:48pm
294 AlexRogan  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:30:19pm

re: #59 erik_t

Oh FFS. Of course he is. I really should have seen that coming.

He’s a Creflo Dollar with political aspirations.

295 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:30:42pm

The next time they boycotted, they felt so much pressure that they voted to boycott, but announced nothing.

296 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:31:24pm

re: #288 Joanne

Then we’d get He’s Been Married FOUR times! He’s not a REAL conservative!!!11!

But then again, who is?

“Ronald Reagan.”

297 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:32:23pm

re: #251 Targetpractice

Thing about hybrids is that it’s neither a good gasoline-powered car or a good electric car. Whether you’re driving on electric or gasoline, you’re dragging along extra weight, whether it be the gas engine when running on battery alone or all the batteries when driving it as a hybrid. It’s training wheels, ones that give the sense that electric cars can’t work unless there’s a gas engine to kick in when the batteries run out.

You may well be right. If my predictions of the future were of any value, I wouldn’t have to work for a living!

298 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:33:18pm

re: #296 HappyWarrior

“Ronald Reagan.”

“He’ll save every one of us!”

299 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:33:23pm
300 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:33:35pm

re: #296 HappyWarrior

“Ronald Reagan.”

But only imaginary Ronald Reagan, not the actual guy.

301 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:33:47pm

re: #292 stabby

mcb.org.uk

Hey, maybe you missed my question. It was was the word support meant to you. You’re accusing them of supporting the Armenian genocide. What they seem to be doing is saying that it’s controversial whether it’s a genocide.

See, I think holocaust deniers are shitty people, but I also don’t think they’re supporting the Holocaust, mainly since, y’know, they’re denying the Holocaust. It’s actually pretty hard to support something you’re denying.

I’m happy to call them to account for their views on the Armenian genocide— while there may have been controversy in the past, I think the bulk of academic opinion is that it was a genocide by almost any workable definition.

And as to them opposing the memorial to the Holocaust, they said:

“We reiterate the British Muslim community’s unequivocal denunciation and condemnation of the Nazi holocaust against Jewish and other non German communities before and during the Second World War.”

302 Gus  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:34:59pm

re: #293 Charles Johnson

I imagine CAIR. They’re so predictable. They use the same rhetoric they’ve been using since 9/12/2001.

303 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:35:12pm

re: #301 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

The Turkish government doesn’t deny that the events of the Armenian genocide happened. They oppose mention of it as an insult to the Turkish nation or some such gobbledy gook.

They don’t deny the deaths, they deny that the deaths deserve mention or criticism.

304 Charles Johnson  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:35:17pm
305 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:35:19pm

re: #300 GeneJockey

But only imaginary Ronald Reagan, not the actual guy.

Hence the quotes.

306 AlexRogan  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:35:28pm

re: #71 stabby

There will never again be enough time in my life to go through that pointless argument yet another time.

Chickenshit.

307 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:35:36pm

re: #297 GeneJockey

You may well be right. If my predictions of the future were of any value, I wouldn’t have to work for a living!

If you’d made the same prediction even 10 years ago, I’d have agreed with you. Hell, even now, it’s not that far off the mark. Electric cars are still very much struggling to gain acceptance and it’s going to take time for folks to buy one rather than settling for a hybrid because they want a gas engine “just in case.”

308 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:36:00pm

re: #300 GeneJockey

But only imaginary Ronald Reagan, not the actual guy.

Ronald Reagan ended the cold war by fighting Mikhail Gorbachev on a spiked rotating platform, battling each other with whips.

309 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:36:05pm

re: #298 Kragar

“He’ll save every one of us!”

“Stand for every one of us!”

310 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:36:06pm

I’m trying to see daylight between stabby and Pam. I really, really am.

Maybe my eyes just aren’t that good anymore.

311 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:36:13pm

I popped back in for a break and I see that someone’s pwning the bottom comments list with a vengeance.

312 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:36:56pm

re: #309 Targetpractice

“Stand for every one of us!”

“Just a man, with a man’s courage.”

313 engineer cat  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:38:02pm

There is no reason at all to think that consciousness continues on after death. None

why does theorizing that consciousness could exist without some non-biological infrastructure cause people so much anxiety?

i don’t believe we have reached the end of scientific advancement as of yet and know everything there is to know, so, you know, it is possible that we could find out more things about the physical functioning of ‘consciousness’

unless somebody can explain to me the physical details of exactly how ‘consciousness’ functions

314 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:38:44pm

re: #301 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

And I would guess that bits like “We reiterate the British Muslim community’s unequivocal denunciation and condemnation of the Nazi holocaust against Jewish and other non German communities before and during the Second World War” stem from what tiny success the British government’s strategy of coopting the MCB with funding, recognition and the power of constant consultation has had, that and the fact that they’d blown it often enough to be losing that favor.

315 AlexRogan  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:38:48pm

re: #109 erik_t

This sort of posting is gross. It’s the sort of reason I never registered until the 2010s.

stabby is having the Longest.Flounce.Ever.

316 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:39:03pm

re: #281 stabby

Yes.

Tell me how to oppose a memorial to the holocaust without supporting hate.

Tell me how to support the Nazi’s slaughter of gays without being a hate group.

Tell me how to support the Armenian genocide without being a hate group.

‘We object to the narrowness of the holocaust memorial, which refused to allow victims other than those of a select subgroup to participate or be recognized.’

‘We object to the narrowness of the holocaust memorial which fails to acknowledge all the holocausts, all the victims, of government sponsored genocidal actions.’

Either of those work. As I recall the former is the position the MCB took.

Now as to the other two, I’m going to have to ask you to provide citations to documentation the MCB supported those actions. Where did they support Nazi slaughter of gays (retroactively, of course), and where did they support the Armenian Genocide?

317 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:39:08pm

re: #307 Targetpractice

If you’d made the same prediction even 10 years ago, I’d have agreed with you. Hell, even now, it’s not that far off the mark. Electric cars are still very much struggling to gain acceptance and it’s going to take time for folks to buy one rather than settling for a hybrid because they want a gas engine “just in case.”

It’s going to be interesting to see how resource problems change as popularity takes off. Lithium doesn’t really grow on trees.

318 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:39:55pm

re: #315 AlexRogan

The Horribly Slow Murderer with the Extremely Inefficient Weapon

Youtube Video

319 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:40:29pm

re: #314 stabby

And I would guess that bits like “We reiterate the British Muslim community’s unequivocal denunciation and condemnation of the Nazi holocaust against Jewish and other non German communities before and during the Second World War” stem from what tiny success the British government’s strategy of coopting the MCB with funding, recognition and the power of constant consultation has had, that and the fact that they’d blown it often enough to be losing that favor.

In other words,

Taqqiyah!!!!

320 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:41:01pm

re: #303 stabby

The Turkish government doesn’t deny that the events of the Armenian genocide happened. They oppose mention of it as an insult to the Turkish nation or some such gobbledy gook.

They don’t deny the deaths, they deny that the deaths deserve mention or criticism.

Not really interested in this derail, thanks.

Hey, here’s a good time to humilaite me by actually addressing my post that criticizes your views on Isalm as the most evil religion, Stabby. I know you said you’ve done it before, but hey, I’ll really look like an idiot if you actually respond to the criticisms above?

Come on, humiliate me. Show why my criticisms of your position are so faulty.

321 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:41:01pm

re: #316 kirkspencer

From their statement. The the reasons they can not attend the ceremony included this point:

“2. It includes the controversial question of alleged Armenian genocide as well as the so-called gay genocide. “

The “gay genocide” probably being the one in WWII.

322 erik_t  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:41:31pm

re: #314 stabby

“When Muslim groups do good things, it’s only because they know they have been doing bad things and need political cover”

This is really uncomfortable. I think I’m going to go do something else.

323 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:41:44pm

re: #314 stabby

And I would guess that bits like “We reiterate the British Muslim community’s unequivocal denunciation and condemnation of the Nazi holocaust against Jewish and other non German communities before and during the Second World War” stem from what tiny success the British government’s strategy of coopting the MCB with funding, recognition and the power of constant consultation has had, that and the fact that they’d blown it often enough to be losing that favor.

So basically, any action a Muslim orgnaiation takes that doesn’t fit in with your idea that they’re winking at terrorism and supporting Holocausts, that must be the result of outside, non-Muslim pressure?

324 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:41:54pm

re: #315 AlexRogan

I keep hoping for Stinky to log in and end the flounce.

325 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:42:44pm

re: #322 erik_t

“When Muslim groups do good things, it’s only because they know they have been doing bad things and need political cover”

This is really uncomfortable. I think I’m going to go do something else.

What’s funny is he froths at the GOP for being bigoted, whiile simultaneously pulling this shit. Humans are great at comparetmentalization.

326 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:42:48pm

re: #322 erik_t

Take off the quotes, that’s not what I said.

The MCB is dirty, has ties to Hizb ut tahir etc.

327 AlexRogan  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:43:48pm

re: #154 Gus

@SafinaHussain we are not anti Muslim

— Tommy Robinson EDL (@EDLTrobinson) May 29, 2013

Nah, Tommy, you just want all Muslims that won’t turn their backs on their religion to leave Great Britain, right?

Shitstain…

328 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:43:55pm

re: #326 stabby

And all the other Muslim organizsations that spoke out, they’re all dirty too, right? Or they’re just reacting to outside political pressure?

329 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:44:13pm

re: #311 Randall Gross

I popped back in for a break and I see that someone’s pwning the bottom comments list with a vengeance.

well, there is a record to shoot for…

330 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:45:03pm

re: #307 Targetpractice

If you’d made the same prediction even 10 years ago, I’d have agreed with you. Hell, even now, it’s not that far off the mark. Electric cars are still very much struggling to gain acceptance and it’s going to take time for folks to buy one rather than settling for a hybrid because they want a gas engine “just in case.”

One important thing to note is that different people have different lives. Sounds trite and silly, but it’s somethign that Conservatives often miss: “Electric cars are stupid because I have to commute farther than the range of a Leaf.”, or “Hybrids are stupid because I need a truck to haul stuff.”

Consider passenger trains - they make great sense in heavily populated corridors, like Boston-Washington, but much less sense in less populous areas. Similarly, a Tesla Model S, or other electric with similar range may be perfectly fine for many who live where there are lots of charging stations, but not so much for folks in, say, Montana, or Wyoming.

The thing is, they don’t have to be great in all circumstances. Just as a Volt makes no sense for the guy who has to drive 100 miles a day and haul a lot of stuff, so a big pickup truck with great hauling capacity makes no sense for a guy who commutes 15 miles each way.

331 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:45:53pm

re: #320 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

If you say “genocide didn’t happen” you’re a denier. And that’s horrible and probably means that you’re slyly supporting that genocide.

BUT if you say “this genocide shouldn’t be talked about, mentioning it is an insult” you’re saying something much worse. You’re saying that the victims should be forgotten, ie that the genocide was a good idea. That’s much worse.

I can see why you want to change the subject.

332 engineer cat  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:46:12pm

re: #321 stabby

my problem with your arguments is that i only hold individuals responsible for their individual actions

333 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:48:37pm

re: #305 HappyWarrior

Hence the quotes.

Ah. I suspected as much but wasn’t certain.

334 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:48:37pm

re: #331 stabby

If you say “genocide didn’t happen” you’re a denier. And that’s horrible and probably means that you’re slyly supporting that genocide.

Do you agree that Christian nations are responsible for the most significant genocides carried out in the world over the past 500-1,000 years?

335 Targetpractice  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:49:59pm

re: #330 GeneJockey

One important thing to note is that different people have different lives. Sounds trite and silly, but it’s somethign that Conservatives often miss: “Electric cars are stupid because I have to commute farther than the range of a Leaf.”, or “Hybrids are stupid because I need a truck to haul stuff.”

Consider passenger trains - they make great sense in heavily populated corridors, like Boston-Washington, but much less sense in less populous areas. Similarly, a Tesla Model S, or other electric with similar range may be perfectly fine for many who live where there are lots of charging stations, but not so much for folks in, say, Montana, or Wyoming.

The thing is, they don’t have to be great in all circumstances. Just as a Volt makes no sense for the guy who has to drive 100 miles a day and haul a lot of stuff, so a big pickup truck with great hauling capacity makes no sense for a guy who commutes 15 miles each way.

Indeed, electric vehicles have a niche that they fill nicely right now, namely city and suburban commuters, with gasoline still having plenty of usage out in rural environments. But that’s a matter of time more than anything else. And even if one refuses to accept an electric vehicle, there are still more environmentally-friendly alternatives, such as turbodiesels running on ultra-low sulfur blends.

336 Joanne  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:50:39pm

re: #282 calochortus

I think he was referring to himself as having been guilty of the same thing.

I’m often on my iPhone. I can’t count how many times I’ve fat fingered that. And I’ve favorited several WTF comments by error, too. Not sure how to unFav, so I have lots of Favs. :-)

337 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:51:12pm

re: #333 GeneJockey

Ah. I suspected as much but wasn’t certain.

it’s cool. The joke was that it’s the idea of Reagan that they love more so than the actual reality of Reagan the president who raised taxes, talked with Gorby, and signed an immigration amnesty, and liked Tip O’Neil.

338 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:51:54pm

re: #331 stabby

If you say “genocide didn’t happen” you’re a denier. And that’s horrible and probably means that you’re slyly supporting that genocide.

Why do you believe the last bit? I have dealt with Holocaust deniers for a long, long time, and a very large number of them really simply deny it, they really don’t think it happened. They think it’s all a lie. Where are you getting this ‘probably’ from?

BUT if you say “this genocide shouldn’t be talked about, mentioning it is an insult” you’re saying something much worse. You’re saying that the victims should be forgotten, ie that the genocide was a good idea. That’s much worse.

The Turkish government doesn’t recognize the Armenian Genocide, I’m not sure why you think they do. They admit the deaths, but say it wasn’t genocide.

I can see why you want to change the subject.

Why is that, Stabby? Is it because the topic is your blanket condemnation of all Muslim groups, your refusal to believe that there is any such thing as a moderate Muslim cleric, and instead we’re talking about the Armenian Genocide?

You never want to actually defend whatever positions you have, you always just want to strike out and find something else, because your positions are fucking indefensible.

339 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:52:39pm

re: #334 iossarian

Do you agree that Christian nations are responsible for the most significant genocides carried out in the world over the past 500-1,000 years?

And all-time leaders in the genociders-of-Jews categories, with a depressingly large lead.

340 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:53:04pm

re: #334 iossarian

Do you agree that Christian nations are responsible for the most significant genocides carried out in the world over the past 500-1,000 years?

Right now, I’m reading Charles Mann’s “1491” and it’s a real eye-opener about how the native populations of this hemisphere were decimated by Christians and their missionaries.

341 Killgore Trout  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:53:42pm

Militant group had link to Woolwich

A week after the murder of soldier Lee Rigby in Woolwich, BBC London has learnt that a senior member of Somali militant group al-Shabab spent time there lecturing at a mosque before he was asked to leave.

One of the two main murder suspects is believed to have had links to the group.

342 Joanne  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:53:48pm

re: #296 HappyWarrior

“Ronald Reagan.”

Sorry. Only the Zombie Reagan that doesn’t exist in reality. Just like Moderate Republicans!

343 Dr Lizardo  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:54:18pm

re: #309 Targetpractice

“Stand for every one of us!”

“He’s king of the impossible!”

344 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:54:20pm

re: #340 Backwoods_Sleuth

To be fair, the most gentle and kind contact would have wiped out entire Amerind populations because of disease vectors. So a lot of it was unintentional genocide, but that unintentional genocide probably prevented some real active genocide-with-slavery.

345 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:54:42pm

Anti-choice ‘ministry’ deploys ultrasound RVs to sway ‘abortion-minded women’

The executive director of an anti-choice ministry called “ICU Mobile” touted his organization’s effort to deploy recreational vehicles outfitted with ultrasound machines to sway “abortion-minded women” away from undergoing the procedures at the headquarters of the Family Research Council on Wednesday.

Michael Homula, an admitted former member of the radical anti-abortion group Operation Rescue, claimed that ICU Mobile has a fleet of 41 vehicles around the country (far more than the 12 ICU lays claim to on its website). He described the process of ICU Mobile founder Sylvia Slyfco’s efforts of retrofitting an RV into a “mobile ministry” that administers ultrasounds and offers “counseling” in the same style as anti-choice Crisis Pregnancy Centers, which have come under fire for providing a litany of inaccurate medical information to the often-unsuspecting women who enter the facilities under the assumption that they’re health care centers.

He claimed the RVs go through a process that’s slightly different from a straightforward retrofitting because “that’s just a little creepy.” He went on to explain that, “this vehicle technically never was an RV even though it looks like one” and that the staff members all go through a 20-week ministry training because “they must put on the full armor of God.”

346 engineer cat  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:55:09pm

muslims, christians, albigensians - feh

HUMANS

i blame humans

we’d better watch out or we’re all gonna get a stiff warning from the united federation of planets about what a bunch of assholes we are

347 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:55:28pm

re: #340 Backwoods_Sleuth

Right now, I’m reading Charles Mann’s “1491” and it’s a real eye-opener about how the native populations of this hemisphere were decimated by Christians and their missionaries.

Trying to work a scenario similar to that into the movie I’m working on.

348 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:55:37pm

re: #334 iossarian

The Bangladesh genocide, the Armenian genocide, Marsh Arabs in Iran. Ok that’s three.

We have the Holocaust. There was fighting, infecting and displacing the American Indians. Rwanda that’s three.

349 Joanne  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:55:58pm

re: #305 HappyWarrior

Hence the quotes.

Shit. Always a post late and a dollar short.

350 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:56:29pm

re: #342 Joanne

Sorry. Only the Zombie Reagan that doesn’t exist in reality. Just like Moderate Republicans!

See my 337 yo!

351 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:56:45pm

re: #344 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

To be fair, the most gentle and kind contact would have wiped out entire Amerind populations because of disease vectors. So a lot of it was unintentional genocide, but that unintentional genocide probably prevented some real active genocide-with-slavery.

this is true…the disease vectors were indeed devastating to a degree that is (to me) just unimaginable. But there also were, as you note, the active genocides as well.

352 Varek Raith  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:56:48pm

*Cough*Crusades*Cough

353 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:57:31pm

re: #352 Varek Raith

*Cough*Crusades*Cough

Pogromscough.

354 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:57:46pm

re: #348 stabby

The Bangladesh genocide, the Armenian genocide, Marsh Arabs in Iran. Ok that’s three.

We have the Holocaust. There was fighting, infecting and displacing the American Indians. Rwanda that’s three.

Simply listing the number of times Christians massacred Jews in the past 1000 years would take a long time, you know.

355 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:58:32pm

re: #352 Varek Raith

*Cough*Crusades*Cough

Forget it, he’s rolling.
/

356 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:58:37pm

re: #353 HappyWarrior

Pogromscough.

Colonial democidecough.

357 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 12:59:48pm

re: #348 stabby

And the American Indians weren’t one coherent group. You’re talking about hundreds and hundreds of tribes, each with their own culture, getting wiped out.

358 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:00:17pm

re: #347 Kragar

Trying to work a scenario similar to that into the movie I’m working on.

The book is rather dense, but I’m fighting my way through it because there are a lot of very interesting details. You might want to browse it for some ideas for methods used on both sides of the encounters.

359 engineer cat  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:01:08pm

and we we talked to muslims about massacres committed in the name of islam, they’d start subdividing it up between shi’a massacres and sunni massacres

and so on and so on…

360 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:01:45pm

Hell, the Ukrainian famines. This sure isn’t exclusive to muslims. I can name 10 different genocides off the top of my head that have fuck-all to do with muslims.

361 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:02:06pm

re: #263 stabby

There’s no good way to parse what they said.

Yet he spends his next 12 comments trying to do that.

362 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:02:59pm

re: #359 engineer cat

And the entire 30 years war is basically the most brutal Christian vs. Christian descent into utter goddamn hell.

363 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:03:11pm

re: #360 dragonath

Hell, the Ukrainian famines. This sure isn’t exclusive to muslims. I can name 10 different genocides off the top of my head that have fuck-all to do with muslims.

Well on that note. The Great Leap Forward.

364 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:04:01pm

As for disease vectors, the most widely “known” is the “smallpox blankets” but that was just a tiny part. Smallpox was indeed a real disease vector because Europeans already had immunities as a result of exposure in childhood. What was news to me (and it really shouldn’t have) is some evidence that influenza or something similar was likely the greater lethal disease.
I still have another 200 pages left to wade through in the book.

365 Lidane  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:04:24pm

Genocides in history

Hey, look at that. There are more than three.

366 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:04:50pm

Rwandan genocide is another.

367 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:05:25pm

re: #364 Backwoods_Sleuth

Oh yeah, common consensus is that it was various influenzas, and, probably, staph infections that were the main killers, even beyond smallpox. There’s just more of ‘em, for one thing.

368 Sionainn  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:06:50pm

re: #345 Kragar

The executive director of an anti-choice ministry called “ICU Mobile” touted his organization’s effort to deploy recreational vehicles outfitted with ultrasound machines to sway “abortion-minded women” away from undergoing the procedures at the headquarters of the Family Research Council on Wednesday.

Am I reading this wrong, or does that say that abortions are occurring at the Family Research Council on Wednesday?

369 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:08:09pm

re: #368 Sionainn

Am I reading this wrong, or does that say that abortions are occurring at the Family Research Council on Wednesday?

I just love when misplaced parenthetical phrases completely destroy the point of a sentence…bwahahahaaa!

370 HappyWarrior  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:08:23pm

re: #368 Sionainn

Am I reading this wrong, or does that say that abortions are occurring at the Family Research Council on Wednesday?

It’s badly phrased but it’s basically saying that at the FRC HQ, they are swaying “abortion minded women” from getting the procedure. Now what an “abortion minded woman” is I have no idea because I have never met such a woman.

371 Varek Raith  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:10:20pm

re: #369 Backwoods_Sleuth

I just love when misplaced parenthetical phrases completely destroy the point of a sentence…bwahahahaaa!

Let’s eat, grandpa.
Let’s eat grandpa.

372 Joanne  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:10:22pm

re: #350 HappyWarrior

See my 337 yo!

I’ll see your 337 and raise you a 349! :-)

373 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:10:38pm

Pol Pot
Bangladeshi Massacres
Belgian Occupation of Congo
Rape of Nanking
Taiping Rebellion
Lucius Verus’s sack of Seleucia
Asiatic Vespers

Hey! People have been doing this for a long fucking time!

374 Sionainn  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:10:53pm

re: #370 HappyWarrior

It’s badly phrased but it’s basically saying that at the FRC HQ, they are swaying “abortion minded women” from getting the procedure. Now what an “abortion minded woman” is I have no idea because I have never met such a woman.

Damn. Too bad because I thought I’d just pop on in there on Wednesday and get me an abortion.
////

375 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:13:03pm

re: #338 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Why do you believe the last bit? I have dealt with Holocaust deniers for a long, long time, and a very large number of them really simply deny it, they really don’t think it happened. They think it’s all a lie. Where are you getting this ‘probably’ from?

I think it’s very naive to take the words of Holocaust deniers at face value.

And what you get if you follow the lives of people like David Irving supports that. He starts off as a historian who questions the numbers, then when he gets himself arrested for breaking the law against denial in Austria, he’s actually talking to neo-nazis. And eventually he drops all pretense and puts up a website commemorating Adolf Hitler.

Connotations are often the most important message of a text. Especially when those connotations are not socially acceptable - they’re implied because the author is too cowardly to actually say them, or because the author enjoys trolling without taking heat for it. They’re there for a reason.

The Turkish government doesn’t recognize the Armenian Genocide, I’m not sure why you think they do. They admit the deaths, but say it wasn’t genocide.

“It wasn’t genocide” means “it happened but it’s not bad enough to deserve a negative label” It is not an innocent semantic argument about the meaning of the word “genocide”.

376 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:13:04pm

However, I’m sure that the past of Christianity and the killing of Jews shouldn’t worry me or other Jews at all. After all, it’s not like religions ever go from being more enlightened to more conservative and radical.

377 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:14:37pm

re: #375 stabby

Connotations are often the most important message of a text. Especially when those connotations are not socially acceptable - they’re implied because the author is too cowardly to actually say them, or because the author enjoys trolling without taking heat for it. They’re there for a reason.

That explains your posting style.

378 kirkspencer  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:15:53pm

re: #321 stabby

From their statement. The the reasons they can not attend the ceremony included this point:

“2. It includes the controversial question of alleged Armenian genocide as well as the so-called gay genocide. “

The “gay genocide” probably being the one in WWII.

Probably? You’re arguing without having looked?

OK, a touch of history. In 2000 the UK had a less formal holocaust memorial day. The Armenian population objected. Maybe you were around and politically aware then, maybe you weren’t, but this got kind of big and nasty. It wasn’t resolved in 2001. The Turks and a lot of others were arguing it wasn’t a genocide - and in fact that the MBF was involved because the Armenians had been equally bloody toward Turks. If you go far enough back that’s true. Further there were various official documents (from both sides, again) that indicated the number of deaths was significantly smaller than any genocidal level. These are reasons the original plan was to have a hard cut-off date for genocides to be officially recognized. Because of the furor from Armenians recalling 2000, however, this was revisited and no ‘official’ cut-off was made. In practice what happened is that the ‘most recent’ genocide was considered - only tit, no tat.

For various reasons of give and take, then, the 2001 HMD’s theme wasn’t merely the holocaust, but genocides as a whole.

The MCB at that time disagreed. Both because of the official documents and the ‘only the most recent’ principle. Hate? not particularly. More a case of support of their allies.

Add to the mix the gay pride issues going on at the time. In addition to the holocaust the homosexuals were raising the allegation of their slaughter in numerous places around the globe. They hinged their claim on the holocaust but claimed much more. As it turned out their accuracy beyond WWII was mixed.

This gave a hook to the devout Muslims AND CHRISTIANS of the time who found themselves conflicted about respecting gays in the holocaust memorial service. The gays were making claims of genocide in addition, and for this reason “so-called” could be added to the discussion. It was, and is, a form of hatred.

But in no way was it ‘support of the Nazi’s slaughter of gays’. That is a significant misstatement driven by your apparent bigotry.

379 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:18:23pm
Connotations are often the most important message of a text. Especially when those connotations are not socially acceptable - they’re implied because the author is too cowardly to actually say them, or because the author enjoys trolling without taking heat for it. They’re there for a reason.

And you’re the Magical Knower of Connotations, right? 100% accurate anticipation of the nuance meaning of all sentences.

This would be why I feel no guilt calling you dumb. It’s dumb to not recognize the different between an argument and “trust me, I know.”

The latter is not inherently wrong in a casual conversation, but substituting it for the former is either stupid or dishonest.

380 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:18:52pm

But yeah, I’m sure that everyone is right and there are innumerable and even hard to classify genocides in history.

In any case the Middle east is anything but peaceful at the moment.

No one is sure what to do about Syria because a bad outcome is likely in most scenarios, whether we help or no, whether whatever side we choose wins or no.

We keep hearing that Iraq is more violent than ever.

Afghanistan too.

Pakistan is always breaking out.

Minorities in these countries and some surrounding countries are neither safe nor free.

And everyone keeps staring daggers at Israel.

381 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:19:30pm

re: #377 wrenchwench

Oh bullshit, I’m open with my beliefs and don’t mind being shocking at all.

382 Varek Raith  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:20:21pm

re: #381 stabby

Yeah, you hate Muslims.
We get it.

383 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:21:07pm

re: #380 stabby

We keep hearing that Iraq is more violent than ever.

Of course, that has absolutely nothing to do with being occupied by a nation that went to war on explicitly Christian motives.

It’s just those crazy Muslims. They’re the violent ones, not us!

384 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:21:20pm

re: #381 stabby

Oh bullshit, I’m open with my beliefs and don’t mind being shocking at all.

Then just spell out your bigotry and get blocked. Why keep denying your agreement with Geller?

385 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:21:37pm

re: #378 kirkspencer

Probably? You’re arguing without having looked?

OK, a touch of history. In 2000 the UK had a less formal holocaust memorial day. The Armenian population objected. Maybe you were around and politically aware then, maybe you weren’t, but this got kind of big and nasty. It wasn’t resolved in 2001. The Turks and a lot of others were arguing it wasn’t a genocide - and in fact that the MBF was involved because the Armenians had been equally bloody toward Turks. If you go far enough back that’s true. Further there were various official documents (from both sides, again) that indicated the number of deaths was significantly smaller than any genocidal level. These are reasons the original plan was to have a hard cut-off date for genocides to be officially recognized. Because of the furor from Armenians recalling 2000, however, this was revisited and no ‘official’ cut-off was made. In practice what happened is that the ‘most recent’ genocide was considered - only tit, no tat.

For various reasons of give and take, then, the 2001 HMD’s theme wasn’t merely the holocaust, but genocides as a whole.

The MCB at that time disagreed. Both because of the official documents and the ‘only the most recent’ principle. Hate? not particularly. More a case of support of their allies.

Add to the mix the gay pride issues going on at the time. In addition to the holocaust the homosexuals were raising the allegation of their slaughter in numerous places around the globe. They hinged their claim on the holocaust but claimed much more. As it turned out their accuracy beyond WWII was mixed.

This gave a hook to the devout Muslims AND CHRISTIANS of the time who found themselves conflicted about respecting gays in the holocaust memorial service. The gays were making claims of genocide in addition, and for this reason “so-called” could be added to the discussion. It was, and is, a form of hatred.

But in no way was it ‘support of the Nazi’s slaughter of gays’. That is a significant misstatement driven by your apparent bigotry.

The alternative to “gay genocide” referring to the one in the Holocaust is that it refers to the slaughter of gays in Iran and other Muslim countries.

Would their support for that be better?

386 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:22:37pm

re: #384 wrenchwench

You’re projecting.

My opinion isn’t the same as Gellers. You simply don’t WANT there not to be any such thing as someone who crosses some of your lines without being a bigoted nutcase,.

387 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:22:54pm

re: #385 stabby

The alternative to “gay genocide” referring to the one in the Holocaust is that it refers to the slaughter of gays in Iran and other Muslim countries.

Would their support for that be better?

Actually, it refers to the slaughter of gays all over the world, which you’d know if you’d investigated the issue, which you haven’t because you seriously could give less than a fuck about the gay genocide except as a rhetorical point to attack Muslims with.

You don’t think gay people get killed outside Muslim countries? You fucking tool.

388 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:23:30pm

re: #386 stabby

You’re projecting.

My opinion isn’t the same as Gellers. You simply don’t WANT there to be any such thing as someone who crosses some of your lines without being a bigoted nutcase,.

Then spell out the difference between your view and Geller’s.

389 engineer cat  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:23:50pm

“With the Model S, you have a compelling car that’s too expensive for most people,” he said. “And you have the Leaf, which is cheap, but it’s not great. What the world really needs is a great, affordable electric car. I’m not going to let anything go, no matter what people offer, until I complete that mission.”

That car, not yet named, would be priced below $40,000, and reach consumers in “three to four years,” Musk said in an interview today on “Bloomberg West.” It will have a range of about 200 miles (322 kilometers) per charge, he said in the television interview.

this is the car i have been waiting for all these years

i want my next car to be a tesla

390 Kragar  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:24:33pm

re: #373 dragonath

Pol Pot
Bangladeshi Massacres
Belgian Occupation of Congo
Rape of Nanking
Taiping Rebellion
Lucius Verus’s sack of Seleucia
Asiatic Vespers

Hey! People have been doing this for a long fucking time!

Grog vs Og

391 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:28:33pm

re: #387 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Are there non-Muslim countries that have the death penalty for homosexuality? I’m not aware of any.

392 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:28:51pm

re: #380 stabby

What about Muslims in America then? Why don’t they have a higher proclivity to violence? Or are you seriously making the argument that America is free by virtue of being a Christian majority country?

393 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:29:50pm

re: #385 stabby

The alternative to “gay genocide” referring to the one in the Holocaust is that it refers to the slaughter of gays in Iran and other Muslim countries.

Would their support for that be better?

Matthew Wayne Shepard.

Virginia Foxx (R-NC) on the floor of Congress: his murder because he was gay was a “hoax”.

Look at the RW gay bashers who are getting louder and louder (all “Christians” BTW).
This is how genocides start…with political nutcases. (again…here they are “Christians”)

394 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:30:29pm

re: #391 stabby

Are there non-Muslim countries that have the death penalty for homosexuality? I’m not aware of any.

Yeah, the only way gay people ever die for being gay is when they’re executed.

Like I said, you don’t know shit about what the people who want recognition of the gay genocide actually say or want. you’re just using them to swipe at Islam. Which is contemptible.

395 EPR-radar  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:30:43pm

re: #391 stabby

Are there non-Muslim countries that have the death penalty for homosexuality? I’m not aware of any.

Uganda is trying to pass such a law. It may well pass. Some US evangelicals are providing significant support for this effort.

396 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:31:45pm

re: #395 EPR-radar

Uganda is trying to pass such a law. It may well pass. Some US evangelicals are providing significant support for this effort.

American evangelicals pretty much wrote the legislation.

397 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:31:52pm

re: #391 stabby

Are there non-Muslim countries that have the death penalty for homosexuality? I’m not aware of any.

This goes back to your claim that Islam is somehow less conducive to liberal democracy than Christianity.

Are you going to address the fact that there isn’t all that much evidence for this (to be more specific, are you going to present arguments that show that there is a significant relationship between Christianity and democracy, and explain what specific aspects of Christianity promote democracy)?

398 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:34:58pm

re: #396 The Ghost of a Flea

American evangelicals pretty much wrote the legislation.

Ah, Uganda - the Laboratory of Democracy.

399 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:35:54pm

I don’t think it’s controversial to say that any current “gay holocaust” would be the counties where slaughtering gays is official policy.

How odd that saying that provokes argument here. Don’t you feel conflicted being pushed to deny the importance of governments that slaughter gays?

400 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:37:10pm

I would argue more but I have to leave the house now.

401 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:37:20pm

re: #399 stabby

I don’t think it’s controversial to say that any current “gay holocaust” would be the counties where slaughtering gays is official policy.

I think it’d be the countries where people get killed for being gay.

Can you explain what’s wrong with using that metric?

402 wrenchwench  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:37:35pm

re: #400 stabby

I would argue more but I have to leave the house now.

Define ‘now’.

403 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:38:06pm

re: #401 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

That I don’t know of examples of rounding up the gays and killing them all except where the police do it.

404 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:38:37pm

How odd that someone would turn a thread about a hate group leader into a thread about hating Muslims.

405 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:39:20pm

re: #404 Randall Gross

You’re deliberately misrepresenting what my argument is.

And it’s obvious WHY you’re doing that.

406 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:40:32pm

re: #402 wrenchwench

Define ‘now’.

After at least two more posts….

407 Randall Gross  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:40:32pm

Odd indeed.

408 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:41:15pm

re: #403 stabby

That I don’t know of examples of rounding up the gays and killing them all except where the police do it.

What’s this ‘rounding up’ bit? You’re only counting it when gay people get moved from one place to another before being killed?

Why doesn’t it count when gay people are just being murdered for being gay?

409 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:42:01pm

He doesn’t hate Muslims. He just hates what they believe in with the white-hot heat of a thousand suns.

410 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:42:52pm

re: #408 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

I’m saying that when they’re trying to kill them all it counts as a holocaust.

When there’s random violence against a few gays, it’s something less.

411 Varek Raith  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:43:18pm

re: #388 wrenchwench

Then spell out the difference between your view and Geller’s.

I guess not.

412 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:44:01pm

re: #410 stabby

I’m saying that when they’re trying to kill them all it counts as a holocaust.

When there’s random violence against a few gays, it’s something less.

It’s not random violence, Stabby. The violence that kills gays in the US, for example, is rooted in the Christian extremists who preach hate against homosexuals and say they cause child abuse.

How is that ‘random’ to you?

413 EPR-radar  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:44:09pm

re: #409 GeneJockey

He doesn’t hate Muslims. He just hates what they believe in with the white-hot heat of a thousand suns.

This is a fine example of a distinction without a difference. Right up there with the similarly bogus ‘hate the sin, love the sinner’ that some on the US right use as an excuse for their bigotry.

414 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:44:48pm

re: #412 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

A pogrom here, a pogrom there, what’s the difference?

//

415 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:45:59pm

re: #405 stabby

You’re deliberately misrepresenting what my argument is.

And it’s obvious WHY you’re doing that.

You realize that the single strong theme in your posts is YOU telling EVERYONE ELSE…worldwide Muslims and LGF posters alike…what we’re really thinking.

I don’t think you’re actually capable of correcting this behavior, but I just want to point it out as explicitly as possible.

I also want to make it explicit that you seem to expect people to not call you a bigot while you say bigoted things that you can’t justify because of your aforementioned inability to perceive the difference between your strong feelings and actual facts.

Also, all the special pleading is giving me a headache. Case in point:

I’m saying that when they’re trying to kill them all it counts as a holocaust.

When there’s random violence against a few gays, it’s something less.

So generalization from isolated incidents is a bad thing now, since it’s not Islamic terrorists?

416 stabby  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:46:08pm

re: #412 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

When it happens to very few people and there’s no attempt to make it apply to all, its silly pedantry for you to say it’s not random.

Sadly this is what you do when you’ve lost a point, you try to redefine the meaning of words.

It’s why arguing with you is futile.

Bye for now.

417 iossarian  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:46:51pm

re: #412 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

It’s not random violence, Stabby. The violence that kills gays in the US, for example, is rooted in the Christian extremists who preach hate against homosexuals and say they cause child abuse.

How is that ‘random’ to you?

Similarly, state violence against gays in 20th century western nations was predicated on the Christian understanding that homosexuality was a sin.

Relaxation of such laws has gone hand-in-hand with a general de-Christianization of society (see the UK for a particularly obvious example of this).

418 Varek Raith  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:47:42pm

Wow…

419 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:48:24pm

re: #416 stabby

When it happens to very few people and there’s no attempt to make it apply to all, its silly pedantry for you to say it’s not random.

Sadly this is what you do when you’ve lost a point, you try to redefine the meaning of words.

It’s why arguing with you is futile.

Bye for now.

Wow. Claims that the hatred preached against gays by Christian extremist doesn’t cause gay people to get killed, while supposedly bemoaning people who object to the term ‘gay genocide’.

So goddamn pathetic.

420 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:48:29pm

re: #413 EPR-radar

This is a fine example of a distinction without a difference. Right up there with the similarly bogus ‘hate the sin, love the sinner’ that some on the US right use as an excuse for their bigotry.

This. And most of the ‘hate the sin, love the sinner’ types somehow manage to express it in terms that look an awful lot like hating the sinner. Then there’s their choice of which sins to focus on, and which to ignore, like, say, adultery when practiced by a Republican. I’d have thought that including a ban on adultery in the 10 Commandments would make it pretty darn important.

Silly me.

421 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:49:04pm

Cool, the LGF commentariat is the equivalent of the Borg.

Stabby knows.

422 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:49:17pm

re: #416 stabby

Bye for now.

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

423 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:50:55pm

“What could preachers saying that gay people are all child molesters possibly have to do with gay people getting attacked and killed?”

424 Walking Spanish Down the Hall  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:52:12pm

re: #423 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

“What could preachers saying that gay people are all child molesters possibly have to do with gay people getting attacked and killed?”

Living in the Twilight Zone.

425 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:53:28pm

re: #423 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

“What could preachers saying that gay people are all child molesters possibly have to do with gay people getting attacked and killed?”

Hey, what’s the worst that could happen?
//

426 dragonath  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:54:53pm

re: #424 Walking Spanish Down the Hall

I was just thinking that some random internet commenter who knows all our true intentions is a Rod Serling-esque twist.

427 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 1:58:03pm

re: #426 dragonath

I was just thinking that some random internet commenter who knows all our true intentions is a Rod Serling-esque twist.

The Monsters Are Due On Littlegreenfootballs.

428 122 Year Old Obama  Wed, May 29, 2013 2:00:04pm

There needs to be a demotivational poster for this.

“Doesn’t wanna talk anymore. Keeps posting.”

429 RadicalModerate  Wed, May 29, 2013 2:12:20pm

re: #391 stabby

Are there non-Muslim countries that have the death penalty for homosexuality? I’m not aware of any.

Uganda - very much a Christian nation, via a US evangelical’s (namely Scott Lively) efforts.

Also, the same western Christian groups are trying to influence similar legislation in Ethiopia and Nigeria.

Campus Crusade For Christ ‘Pamoja 3′ Conference Incites Hatred Against LGBT Community In Africa

430 Dancing along the light of day  Wed, May 29, 2013 2:20:56pm

re: #416 stabby

Shit, you’re still here?

431 Dancing along the light of day  Wed, May 29, 2013 2:21:53pm

Gamey buttocks, anyone?

432 sattv4u2  Wed, May 29, 2013 2:23:12pm

re: #431 Dancing along the light of day

Gamey buttocks, anyone?

Me, I’d prefer something a tad less,,,,, chewy
a tad more ,, tasty
a tad less ,,, disgusting!

433 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, May 29, 2013 2:33:13pm

re: #416 stabby

It really amazes me this troll still hasn’t been kissed by the ban hammer.

434 sattv4u2  Wed, May 29, 2013 2:38:22pm

re: #433 William Barnett-Lewis

It really amazes me this troll still hasn’t been kissed by the ban hammer.

I have a lot of issues with many of Stabbys posts, but I don’t think he’s a ‘troll”. And what benefit does ban hammering him do?

I don’t agree with something he posts, I tell him. If he wants to debate it, great. If not, so be it and I move along to the next subject/ topic

435 Vicious Babushka  Wed, May 29, 2013 2:40:19pm

re: #290 Targetpractice

Wait, Charles is getting paid for this? When do I get my check?!

///

BWAHAHAA!

436 Bubblehead II  Wed, May 29, 2013 3:01:17pm

re: #433 William Barnett-Lewis

It really amazes me this troll still hasn’t been kissed by the ban hammer.

Charles is letting us play with it. Beside, I want to see this little fuck hit negative Karma, which shouldn’t be to much longer.

Karma: 182
stabby
Web site URL: Edited Out


Registered since: Nov 21, 2012 at 1:37 pm
No. of comments posted: 3,054
No. of Pages posted: 2

437 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 3:21:22pm

You know, stabby doesn’t actually bother me that much. Maybe it’s because I spent too much time trying to talk to increasingly crazy wingnuts over the last 13 years, but he seems rather mild.

He’s got a prejudice that he’s trying to convince us, and likely himself, is justified. And so far, he hasn’t severely flamed anyone, even Obdicut, who’s been doing yeoman’s work trying to nail him down.

438 ContraryLemming  Wed, May 29, 2013 3:21:23pm

re: #317 erik_t

It’s going to be interesting to see how resource problems change as popularity takes off. Lithium doesn’t really grow on trees.

A little late to the Buckaroo Banzai-appreciation party a few threads ago, but:

“Lithium is no longer available on credit.”

439 sattv4u2  Wed, May 29, 2013 3:25:37pm

re: #437 GeneJockey

You know, stabby doesn’t actually bother me that much. Maybe it’s because I spent too much time trying to talk to increasingly crazy wingnuts over the last 13 years, but he seems rather mild.

He’s got a prejudice that he’s trying to convince us, and likely himself, is justified. And so far, he hasn’t severely flamed anyone, even Obdicut, who’s been doing yeoman’s work trying to nail him down.

Thing is, they’re at the point now that they’re talking past each other

Stabby believes he’s already answered Obdicuts questions in detail
Obdi believes Stabbys answers are incomplete

Neither is going to change their stance.

So they’re on a constant merry go round, ending up at the same place they start every time

440 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Wed, May 29, 2013 3:26:39pm

re: #437 GeneJockey

You know, stabby doesn’t actually bother me that much. Maybe it’s because I spent too much time trying to talk to increasingly crazy wingnuts over the last 13 years, but he seems rather mild.

He’s got a prejudice that he’s trying to convince us, and likely himself, is justified. And so far, he hasn’t severely flamed anyone, even Obdicut, who’s been doing yeoman’s work trying to nail him down.

Oh, he flames me all the time.

441 EPR-radar  Wed, May 29, 2013 3:29:44pm

re: #439 sattv4u2

Thing is, they’re at the point now that they’re talking past each other

Stabby believes he’s already answered Obdicuts questions in detail
Obdi believes Stabbys answers are incomplete

Neither is going to change their stance.

So they’re on a constant merry go round, ending up at the same place they start every time

The two competing versions of “random” upthread are a clear example of this.

Random can be used to describe an event with no apparent cause.

Random can also be used to describe an event that is not precisely preplanned in every detail.

442 GeneJockey  Wed, May 29, 2013 3:32:36pm

re: #440 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Oh, he flames me all the time.

I must have missed it, or I am used to bigger flames. Or I scrolled over it, since stabby’s point is always the same:

I already answered that, and now I’m going to leave.

Really.

I have my hat in my hand.

My hand’s on the doorknob.

I’m turning it.

Really, I’m leaving now.

No shit, I mean it!

//

443 BroncD  Wed, May 29, 2013 3:41:05pm
whose “check” am I supposed to be cashing?

Why, George Soros of course!

444 Ace-o-aces  Wed, May 29, 2013 7:00:48pm

outright lies? moderate muslims came out repulsed & rant it has nothing

— Pamela Geller (@Atlasshrugs) May 29, 2013


What does that even mean? How can you pack so much incoherency into a single tweet?

445 Ojoe  Wed, May 29, 2013 9:54:40pm

I would like the moderate Muslims to actively put an end to the crimes of their co-religionists.

446 kirkspencer  Thu, May 30, 2013 7:18:40am

re: #445 Ojoe

I would like the moderate Muslims to actively put an end to the crimes of their co-religionists.

An equally accurate restatement: I would like the moderate Christians to actively put an end to the crimes of their co-religionists as well.

What exactly is it you think the moderates should be doing? Making protests and condemnations, both vocal and in writing? Joining the militaries and law enforcement agencies of nations aiming at ending these extremists? Guess what - they do. So what else is it you think needs done?


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