Million Vet March Unhappy with Cooption by Wingnuts

Turns out Ted, Sarah, and Larry were using vets as props while decrying using vets as props.
Politics • Views: 25,376

In underlined red letters on the front page of their website:

The political agenda put forth by a local organizer in Washington DC was not in alignment with our message. We feel disheartened that some would seek to hijack the narrative for political gain. The core principle is about all Americans honoring Veterans in a peaceful and apolitical manner.

And on Facebook:

We have, as a group, been prevented from certain groups that have piggy-backed off our grassroots efforts, to effectively create a comprehensive media message campaign. We made the mistake of trying to partner with some Washington insiders that thwarted many of our genuine concerns for keeping this apolitical and grassroots. While we support many of those groups common causes for Veterans, we do not support the manner in which they go about it. We chose instead to not incite or create panic.

What’s amazing to me is how completely the narrative of this group was co-opted. Their objective was, indeed, to hold gatherings at closed memorials, but with the express intention of showing gratitude, and they specifically talk about how visitors should pick up after themselves. There’s no fury at the park workers, no insults thrown, no ugliness in the intial posts…

[Note: My analysis of this is pretty shallow, looking at their website and Facebook. If anyone wants to research this deeper and contradict me, I will gladly retract this statement.]

It also speaks the utter cynicism of the individuals that caused such a mess this Sunday…not that this is the first sign that GOP/Tea Party support for veterans is a strictly on-paper affair. Within the cant that accompanies their worldview, a “veteran” is not just a person who has served in the armed forces of the USA, as denotation might suggest, but a fetish object. Like “The Bible,” “The Consitution,” and “The Founding Fathers,” veterans are gnostic implements, their true meaning only visible to True Conservatives. (And the secret is: social conservatives are totally right and deserve to change the country to match their vision). On actual veteran’s affairs—things like VA hospitals, mental health for PTSD—these people suddenly clam up—rather like they do for issues affecting people on active duty that don’t fit their vision of what a serviceman should be…like being, gay, female, or suffering from PTSD. Individual veterans (and servicemen) can be mocked, ignored, and insulted, because their idea is all that matters.

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441 comments
1 Stoatly  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 5:36:29am
a “veteran” is not just a person who has served in the armed forced of the USA, as denotation might suggest, but an fetish object. Like “The Bible,” “The Consitution,” and “The Founding Fathers,” veterans are gnostic implements,

And when they’re not being used as props they revert to just being part of the 47% of moochers living high off the money the government stole from real Americans.
Kipling’s “Tommy Atkins” is the best voicing of the double standards towards soldiers I know - though it’s more about how quickly attitudes change “when there’s trouble in the wind”

2 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:33:05am

The “Veterans March” was stupid anyway. Instead of complaining that their favorite memorial statuary is closed, why aren’t they complaining to their congressional representatives WHO ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE SHUTDOWN?

Memorial statuary and national parks are way way down the list of critical government operations that need to be re-opened immediately.

Focusing exclusively on marble monuments is the wrong way to do it.

3 Internet Tough Guy  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:34:32am
[Note: My analysis of this is pretty shallow, looking at their website and Facebook. If anyone wants to research this deeper and contradict me, I will gladly retract this statement.]

Still deeper than 99% of the American media.

4 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:34:48am

As a vet, I’ve always hated those who make a pretentious show of “supporting the troops”. That kind of support is a kilometer wide and a millimeter deep.

Pretending that these monuments are somehow the most important thing about the shutdown is especially vile considering that the November disabled vet checks probably won’t go out on time any more than the WIC payments or the other things that will hurt many anonymous people across the nation thanks only to greed.

Kipling was a strange man himself, a good middle class imperialist and poet, but lose his fake accent and read his works in straight English? Aye, then Tommy and Joe and Hans and Ivan and all the rest of the misused soldiers are there in their best light.

5 b.d.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:35:12am

They should have grabbed their mikes and kicked their asses out then. Literally a day late on this deal.

6 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:35:22am
7 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:36:48am

Basically, complaining about the shutdown monuments is a perfect example of the GOP’s cynical elevation of symbolism over practical reality.

These vets would benefit more from increases to veteran services and care. Instead, the GOP votes to cut that.

8 b.d.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:41:56am

re: #6 Vicious Babushka

[Embedded content]

$37? Could be a scam but that may be the best $37 I’ve ever spent.

9 wheat-dogghazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:43:10am

re: #6 Vicious Babushka

One weird trick …

11 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:50:42am

Very well said, Ghost of a Flea. You get to the heart of all this “vet praising” by the RW with this: ” Within the cant that accompanies their worldview, a “veteran” is not just a person who has served in the armed forced of the USA, as denotation might suggest, but an fetish object.”

Part and parcel of their jingoistic language and warmongering ideology.

World War II veterans are as foreign to this crowd as being from Mars because they don’t understand that those GIs fought the same ideology at its core that the RW is promoting.

12 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:51:25am

For starters… I eagerly await a public denunciation of Larry Klayman’s comments. I’ll wait.

13 b.d.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 6:55:32am

Shorter Million Vets Statement - We stood up to Hitler and Hirohito but we didn’t stand up to Sarah Palin.

14 Dr. Matt  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:01:13am

The Teabaggers response: PAID SOROS RINOS!

15 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:03:18am

re: #13 b.d.

And Palin was in NJ as the headliner for Lonegan’s campaign this weekend. But for her presence at campaign rallies that may have garnered a couple thousand people, Lonegan would have been standing on a street corner.

And hopefully after Wednesday, we will be able to say that definitively.

Right now, the polling appears to show a 10 point race with Booker leading.

Hope that Booker’s ground game and GOTV gets the job done and propels him to a resounding win, if only to repudiate Lonegan further.

16 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:03:36am

Find out who funds the group, “Brats for Veterans Advocacy Group”
and you will know who these people are. They describe themselves thusly, on the about page for the MVM website. 1mvetmarch.wordpress.com

“We are all military brats, current and former military spouses and some veterans. We cannot express how utterly disappointed we were that our Greatest Generation were being used as political pawns in the ongoing government shutdown and budget crisis. This should never be the case.”

17 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:03:42am

re: #13 b.d.

Shorter Million Vets Statement - We stood up to Hitler and Hirohito but we didn’t stand up to Sarah Palin.

Not sure why this statement is unsettling to me…maybe that nagging feeling that after all is said and done, many US citizens still cannot see clear and present danger to their livelihoods if those spouting the danger look too much like them…sinking feeling of the whole “well I don’t agree with EVERYTHING they say… .buuuut… .”

Shudder

18 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:06:29am

re: #10 Vicious Babushka

Crew members: The real “Captain Phillips” was an asshole.

New York Post. Plus there’s a lawsuit involved and I always take into account Tom Hanks derangement. Breaking: dramatic accounts of actual events is typically full of historical and general inaccuracies. I read about the Band of Brothers for example and watched the series countless times. It’s not 100 percent accurate by any means. Also breaking: ship’s captains are hard assess and are sometimes seen as assholes.

19 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:07:50am

re: #15 lawhawk

And Palin was in NJ as the headliner for Lonegan’s campaign this weekend. But for her presence at campaign rallies that may have garnered a couple thousand people, Lonegan would have been standing on a street corner.

And hopefully after Wednesday, we will be able to say that definitively.

Right now, the polling appears to show a 10 point race with Booker leading.

Hope that Booker’s ground game and GOTV gets the job done and propels him to a resounding win, if only to repudiate Lonegan further.

Just a 10 percent spread? Oh, that’s right. I forgot that I lived in Ocean County. Yep, I can see that. South Jersey is like a quasi Confederacy.

20 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:07:57am

re: #18 Gus

New York Post. Plus there’s a lawsuit involved and I always take into account Tom Hanks derangement. Breaking: dramatic accounts of actual events is typically full of historical and general inaccuracies. I read about the Band of Brothers for example and watched the series countless times. It’s not 100 percent accurate by any means. Also breaking: ship’s captains are hard assess and are sometimes seen as assholes.

Captain Bligh ran a fine ship, but the mutineers just wanted to relax on the tropical islands and rape the native maidens.

21 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:08:35am

re: #20 Vicious Babushka

Captain Bligh ran a fine ship, but the mutineers just wanted to relax on the tropical islands and rape the native maidens.

No fair! //

22 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:09:25am

re: #18 Gus

Well, there is one thing that’s verifiable: He was sailing too close to the coast. A lot of captains do it, but there is one overriding factor on whether ships get attacked: how close they are to the coast.

For that alone, I think that the celebration of him as a hero are really dumb and set a bad precedent.

23 Dr. Matt  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:09:59am

I’m really sick of consuming all this popcorn while watching the GOP self-implode.

24 BeenHereAwhile  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:10:47am

Based upon reported attendance, wouldn’t it be more accurate to label it the .0003% Million Vet March?

25 Dr. Matt  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:11:32am

re: #20 Vicious Babushka

Captain Bligh ran a fine ship, but the mutineers just wanted to relax on the tropical islands and rape the native maidens.

Good thing the native’s wombs shutdown during rape so they didn’t get pregnant.

26 b.d.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:12:26am

These guys are SHOCKED that their nonpartisan meetup was hijacked!

From link:

Get ready to join a million vets in Washington DC and online! The Administration has closed down war memorials that are normally open 24/7 and that do not have any staff to guard them under normal circumstances.

27 kerFuFFler  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:15:09am

Brilliant observation about the fetishization of the “Veteran”! Just as with”The Constitution”, a holy relic to be worn in one’s inner pocket——-near the heart—-and never read or understood, these nutters care fuck-all about actual veterans. They make a big show and photo op marathon of visiting war memorials, but do their damnedest to gut Meals-on-Wheels which serves thousand of veterans actual food.

28 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:15:29am

re: #24 BeenHereAwhile

Based upon reported attendance, wouldn’t it be more accurate to label it the .0003% Million Vet March?

Well, considering that on the linked website for the “Million Veterans March” that this was conceived and “organized” only about a week ago by 5 (yes, FIVE) people, it’s not surprising that it was basically a free for all on the rightwing types to dominate.

“We are a group of 5 military brats that decided to take action. We have been close friends for over a quarter of a century. We are Democrats, Liberals, Conservatives, Republicans and Libertarians. We support and love our Veterans. We all had someone that was a Veteran in our family. Some of our families Veterans paid the ultimate sacrifice for the freedom of others.”

1mvetmarch.wordpress.com

29 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:18:46am
30 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:19:39am

re: #22 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Well, there is one thing that’s verifiable: He was sailing too close to the coast. A lot of captains do it, but there is one overriding factor on whether ships get attacked: how close they are to the coast.

For that lone, I think that the celebration of him as a hero are really dumb and set a bad precedent.

It’s a movie. Americans can either watch it on the big screen or go back to watching Miley Cyrus twerking or watch some goofy movie. I’m thinking I’ll go to Safeway early this morning to go food shopping.

31 GlutenFreeJesus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:20:33am

re: #18 Gus

New York Post. Plus there’s a lawsuit involved and I always take into account Tom Hanks derangement. Breaking: dramatic accounts of actual events is typically full of historical and general inaccuracies. I read about the Band of Brothers for example and watched the series countless times. It’s not 100 percent accurate by any means. Also breaking: ship’s captains are hard assess and are sometimes seen as assholes.

The Captain was told directly on more than one occasion to avoid the waters they were hijacked in. He wanted to save time and money though, so he ignored said warnings. HERO!!!!

I refuse to see that movie.

32 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:21:30am

I’m kinda surprised the “The GOP’s little rule change they hoped you wouldn’t notice” video has 600K+ views. People are paying attention…

33 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:21:37am

Bleh. I’m out.

34 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:21:55am

re: #19 Gus

I’m actually expecting a far greater spread than what the polling indicates. Booker pulled twice the number of votes that Lonegan did - 210k+ to about 100k. If Booker maintains that core constituency, Lonegan would have to essentially peel off every other primary vote from both parties to have even a chance.

Lonegan has to be hoping for bad weather and super low turnout to have a chance.

He might actually get a bit of luck on that front since they’re predicting rain on Wednesday.

35 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:22:15am

re: #8 b.d.

$37? Could be a scam but that may be the best $37 I’ve ever spent.

I’m still in Vegas for a few more hours. My dad, a very concerned Fox viewer, wants me to bring some of my guns to my house for protection because things are going to get very violent soon. And that I should buy more ammunition while I still can.

He’s serious. He really sees a zombie apocolypse on our doorstep any day now…only instead of zombies it’s red necks and illegals fighting in the streets.

36 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:23:23am

re: #28 Justanotherhuman

“We are a group of 5 military brats that decided to take action. We have been close friends for over a quarter of a century. We are Democrats, Liberals, Conservatives, Republicans and Libertarians.

Really…one of each.

37 Jay in Oregon  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:24:05am

BREAKING:
People lie down with dogs, complain about fleas.

38 GlutenFreeJesus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:24:46am

re: #28 Justanotherhuman

Well, considering that on the linked website for the “Million Veterans March” that this was conceived and “organized” only about a week ago by 5 (yes, FIVE) people, it’s not surprising that it was basically a free for all on the rightwing types to dominate.

“We are a group of 5 military brats that decided to take action. We have been close friends for over a quarter of a century. We are Democrats, Liberals, Conservatives, Republicans and Libertarians. We support and love our Veterans. We all had someone that was a Veteran in our family. Some of our families Veterans paid the ultimate sacrifice for the freedom of others.”

1mvetmarch.wordpress.com

Who are the other 4?

39 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:25:52am

re: #30 Gus

It’s a movie. Americans can either watch it on the big screen or go back to watching Miley Cyrus twerking or watch some goofy movie. I’m thinking I’ll go to Safeway early this morning to go food shopping.

Whether or not a fictional work should adhere at all to the real events ‘inspiring’ it, what it means to be a ‘true story’ versus a fiction, and how such works affect the actual people who were involved in them are all interesting things to think about, especially since retelling of history is so often used in order to subvert reality to serve the interests of the media-makers.

“It’s a movie” doesn’t mean “It’s unimportant”.

40 HoosierHoops  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:26:54am

OT: Just returned from my MRI. First off.. Still can’t get registered for Obamacare… WTF is going on there? So I have really good insurance anyway but my out of pocket costs today was 1700.00. I went though 2 registrations and several ladies at desks processing paperwork. The last one had me fill out those standard papers about my medical history.
So you are telling me that the Hospital couldn’t have transfered all that data directly from my Doctor’s records?
He could have just logged in with my history and register me for a MRI. That would eliminate about 3 jobs right there. A proper Database would have printed copies for each dept and print my barcode wrist band with a press of a key. It cost thousands of $$ to get zapped by a magnet for 15 minutes.
How many on the staff just process insurance forms all day?
Put me in charge of the medical industry for one year..All I ask is one freaking year.

41 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:28:51am

From what I understand, tomorrow is the last day to register to vote

Please share.

42 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:30:22am

re: #40 HoosierHoops

OT: Just returned from my MRI. First off.. Still can’t get registered for Obamacare… WTF is going on there? So I have really good insurance anyway but my out of pocket costs today was 1700.00. I went though 2 registrations and several ladies at desks processing paperwork. The last one had me fill out those standard papers about my medical history.
So you are telling me that the Hospital couldn’t have transfered all that data directly from my Doctor’s records?
He could have just logged in with my history and register me for a MRI. That would eliminate about 3 jobs right there. A proper Database would have printed copies for each dept and print my barcode wrist band with a press of a key. It cost thousands of $$ to get zapped by a magnet for 15 minutes.
How many on the staff just process insurance forms all day?
Put me in charge of the medical industry for one year..All I ask is one freaking year.

I know! I get so friggin’ tired of reciting my medical history. I have to take cheat notes with me. And forget them taking my notes and just stapling them in the file, OR actually reading my notes themselves, I have to recite them.

I know part of it is to be sure the right information is assigned to the correct patient, but geez. I recite to the nurse and 5 minutes later to the doctor… .

43 wheat-dogghazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:30:24am

re: #29 DisturbedEma

Now we’ve done it…

From the LA Times story:

“As U.S. politicians of both political parties are still shuffling back and forth between the White House and the Capitol Hill without striking a viable deal to bring normality to the body politic they brag about, it is perhaps a good time for the befuddled world to start considering building a de-Americanized world,” the Xinhua news agency said in an English-language commentary.

China’s concerns echo those of economic officials around the world about the effects of a failure to raise the U.S. debt limit, which could trigger the federal government’s first-ever widespread default.

China would like very much for the Chinese RMB to be a “world currency,” like the euro, the dollar and the pound. They’ve floated this idea before. This impending shutdown of the US government has conveniently given them ammunition to float the proposal again, and this time people may even consider it seriously.

44 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:31:27am

re: #32 Carlos Danger

I’m kinda surprised the “The GOP’s little rule change they hoped you wouldn’t notice” video has 600K+ views. People are paying attention…

I saw that yesterday —and decided I LOVE youtube.

45 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:32:02am

Ben Shapiro is all butthurt about this cartoon, which I think is awesome (the cartoon, not Ben’s butthurt)

46 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:32:46am

re: #43 wheat-dogghazi

Exactly…just not sure HOW this is going to shake out this time around…what a fucking mess…

47 SidewaysQuark  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:33:11am

re: #28 Justanotherhuman

“We are a group of 5 military brats that decided to take action. We have been close friends for over a quarter of a century. We are Democrats, Liberals, Conservatives, Republicans and Libertarians….

1mvetmarch.wordpress.com

Cool, one of each!

48 b.d.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:33:22am

re: #35 darthstar

I’m still in Vegas for a few more hours. My dad, a very concerned Fox viewer, wants me to bring some of my guns to my house for protection because things are going to get very violent soon. And that I should buy more ammunition while I still can.

He’s serious. He really sees a zombie apocolypse on our doorstep any day now…only instead of zombies it’s red necks and illegals fighting in the streets.

I’ll never understand how manufactured gridlock in DC is supposed to turn the entire US population into acting like a bunch of extras in a John Carpenter movie? Safe journeys out of Las Vegas.

49 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:33:31am

re: #27 kerFuFFler

Brilliant observation about the fetishization of the “Veteran”! Just as with”The Constituition”, a holy relic to be worn in one’s inner pocket——-near the heart—-and never read or understood, these nutters care fuck-all about actual veterans. They make a big show and photo op marathon of visiting war memorials, but do their damnedest to gut Meals-on-Wheels which serves thousand of veterans actual food.

I carried my pocket Constitution in my purse. Then I realized I had a smart phone and could look-up anything I wanted. It is handy to have it at hand, but I don’t need the extra bulk in my purse. Not really worth it for the few times I’ve actually used it.

50 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:34:55am

re: #48 b.d.

You’re the Duke of New York….A number 1. You’re the Duke of New York.

Youtube Video

51 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:34:59am

re: #17 DisturbedEma

Not sure why this statement is unsettling to me…maybe that nagging feeling that after all is said and done, many US citizens still cannot see clear and present danger to their livelihoods if those spouting the danger look too much like them…sinking feeling of the whole “well I don’t agree with EVERYTHING they say… .buuuut… .”

Shudder

BBBBbuuuuttttt, the Mooselmens are coming to get us!!!!!

52 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:35:15am

re: #44 FemNaziBitch

It’s linked up on FB too…:)

53 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:35:33am

re: #45 Vicious Babushka

Ben Shapiro is all butthurt about this cartoon, which I think is awesome (the cartoon, not Ben’s butthurt)

Honestly, Ben’s butthurt is pretty awesome, too. He hates being called what he is.

54 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:35:48am

re: #52 DisturbedEma

It’s linked up on FB too…:)

I think I saw it there and shared it. Probably posted it here too.

55 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:36:17am
56 wheat-dogghazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:36:23am

re: #45 Vicious Babushka

Ben Shapiro is all butthurt about this cartoon, which I think is awesome (the cartoon, not Ben’s butthurt)

Is Shapiro having a sad because the cartoon hits too close to home, or because the cartoonist is Jewish? (Is Shapiro? One can never be too sure, despite his surname.)

57 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:37:34am

I’m still pissed-off about this. Condescending *&^%!

58 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:37:41am

re: #51 FemNaziBitch


Yelp, that’s the go to “problem” that has so many throwing in with this shit…”WHY YES, my family is suffering from the lack of health care and the cuts to assistance programs. And of course, the decrease in oversight on environmental protections will sting a bit…or a lot BUT eeeeek, there’s an invasion coming…”

59 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:37:48am
60 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:38:07am

re: #56 wheat-dogghazi

Is Shapiro having a sad because the cartoon hits too close to home, or because the cartoonist is Jewish? (Is Shapiro? One can never be too sure, despite his surname.)

He’s only famous for staying a virgin until marriage if that helps.

61 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:38:10am

re: #55 Vicious Babushka

[Embedded content]

Women or else? Slaves or else?

We all know where this is going.

62 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:38:18am

re: #54 FemNaziBitch

that’s where I found it…and shared the shit out of it…

63 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:38:37am

re: #56 wheat-dogghazi

Is Shapiro having a sad because the cartoon hits too close to home, or because the cartoonist is Jewish? (Is Shapiro? One can never be too sure, despite his surname.)

Ben, like Pamela, is TEH ONE TRUE JUICE!!!1!!! AND ALL TEH OTHER JUICE IS TEH JINOS!!!1!!!!!

64 wheat-dogghazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:39:24am

re: #60 darthstar

He’s only famous for staying a virgin until marriage if that helps.

I don’t think he’s in any danger.

65 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:39:59am

re: #60 darthstar

He’s only famous for staying a virgin until marriage if that helps.

I thought that was Todd Starnes?

66 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:40:01am

re: #54 FemNaziBitch

I think I saw it there and shared it. Probably posted it here too.

I did! I did!

Ha!

67 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:40:04am

Freeloaders on the land - American-style anti-government eccentrics take root in Canada

Mr Pirelli is one of a growing number of Canadians who try to avoid financial obligations by claiming to be Freemen, Detaxers, followers of Moorish Law, members of the Church of the Ecumenical Redemption International or of other assorted groups. The Law Society of British Columbia, which represents lawyers in the province, estimates that 30,000 Canadians now share these allegiances. Each group has its own peculiarities, but all contend that the government has no authority over them (including the power of arrest).

Why this obscurantist surge? Stephen Kent of the University of Alberta says some of it is spillover from the United States, but some is rooted in disorientation cause by the global financial crisis. The internet has made it easier for gurus to spread their views and sell DVDs, often to badly educated and unemployed young men in rural areas. Similar movements have popped up in Britain, Ireland, Australia and New Zealand.

There’s no reason not to believe that Alex Jones nuttiness is influencing other English speaking countries.

68 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:40:23am
69 wheat-dogghazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:40:55am

re: #63 Vicious Babushka

Ben, like Pamela, is TEH ONE TRUE JUICE!!!1!!! AND ALL TEH OTHER JUICE IS TEH JINOS!!!1!!!!!

Do you say that like “jeeno” or “jeye-no”?

70 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:40:56am
71 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:41:51am

re: #69 wheat-dogghazi

Do you say that like “jeeno” or “jeye-no”?

JINO!!!!!! rhymes with RINO!!!!!1!!!!

72 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:41:55am

re: #55 Vicious Babushka

[Embedded content]

One Year Debt Limit Increase

Not a dollar amount increase, but suspending the debt limit until the end of December 2014.

Similar to what we did earlier this year.

Want the year long to align with the year delay of Obamacare.

One Year Obamacare delay

Tax Reform Instructions

Similar to a bill we passed last fall, laying out broad from Ryan Budget principles for what tax reform should look like.

Gives fast track authority for tax reform legislation

Energy and regulatory reforms to promote economic growth

Includes pretty much every jobs bill we have passed this year and last Congress

All of these policies have important positive economic effects.

Energy provisions

Keystone Pipeline

Coal Ash regulations

Offshore drilling

Energy production on federal lands

EPA Carbon regulations

Regulatory reform

REINS Act

Regulatory process reform

Consent decree reform

Blocking Net Neutrality

Mandatory Spending Reforms

Mostly from the sequester replacement bills we passed last year

Federal Employee retirement reform

Ending the Dodd Frank bailout fund

Transitioning CFPB funding to Appropriations

Child Tax Credit Reform to prevent fraud

Repealing the Social Services Block grant

Health Spending Reforms

Means testing Medicare

Repealing a Medicaid Provider tax gimmick

Tort reform

Altering Disproportion Share Hospitals

Repealing the Public Health trust Fund

Sigh…we’re fucked. We are well and truly fucked.

Shit just got real folks. This is, in my opinion, proof the GOP is ready and willing to send this country straight off the cliff.

73 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:43:02am

re: #56 wheat-dogghazi

Is Shapiro having a sad because the cartoon hits too close to home, or because the cartoonist is Jewish? (Is Shapiro? One can never be too sure, despite his surname.)

According to Wikipedia, both Shapiro and his wife are Orthodox Jews.

74 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:43:34am

re: #73 Eclectic Cyborg

According to Wikipedia, both Shapiro and his wife are Orthodox Jews.

I am too but I’m not in Wikipedia.

75 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:44:06am

re: #57 FemNaziBitch


I remember reading his story in Reader’s Digest years ago- single mom, his groundwork on the issue of separating conjoined twins…I guess the nut job aspect wasn’t evident back when the article was written…

76 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:44:25am

Can we chant?

YELLEN -YELLEN -Y.E.L.L.E.N!

77 wheat-dogghazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:44:25am

re: #72 Eclectic Cyborg

They forgot “everyone gets a new pony.”

Are they trying to raise the ante, to see if Obama will fold? He’s holding a better hand, methinks.

78 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:44:55am

re: #75 DisturbedEma

I remember reading his story in Reader’s Digest years ago- single mom, his groundwork on the issue of separating conjoined twins…I guess the nut job aspect wasn’t evident back when the article was written…

Mozart was a musical genius, but he sucked at financial planning.

79 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:45:04am

re: #74 Vicious Babushka

I am too but I’m not in Wikipedia.

And you should be darn it. You’re certainly more important and noteworthy than Shapiro!

80 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:45:24am

re: #77 wheat-dogghazi

They forgot “everyone gets a new pony.”

Are they trying to raise the ante, to see if Obama will fold? He’s holding a better hand, methinks.

UNICORNS! Everyone gets a Unicorn.

81 chadu  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:45:31am

re: #72 Eclectic Cyborg

Sigh…we’re fucked. We are well and truly fucked.

Shit just got real folks. This is, in my opinion, proof the GOP is ready and willing to send this country straight off the cliff.

They’re fucking morons.

82 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:45:50am

re: #77 wheat-dogghazi

They forgot “everyone gets a new pony.”

Are they trying to raise the ante, to see if Obama will fold? He’s holding a better hand, methinks.

The stakes are high. If Obama caves, the precedent is set and the governance of the United States will never be the same again.

83 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:46:28am

Of course, it would be the Dems.

Dems ask banks to go easy on furloughed federal workers

Read more: thehill.com
Follow us: @thehill on Twitter | TheHill on Facebook

Also, man w/knife tries to get into Buckingham Palace (the Queen was not in residence at the time and he was quickly apprehended before he got very far).

Pres Obama stumps for Cory Booker in video: Youtube Video

84 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:46:32am

re: #72 Eclectic Cyborg

I agree- this does feel different…I have no sense that some 11th hour solution will present itself…feel like the only option is to try to hold on for as long as possible and hope for some body of water to splash down into when and if I have to let go…

85 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:48:21am

Jesus, Mark Zuckerburg bought 4 houses in Palo Alto. He needs his space…

We need jobs.

86 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:48:33am

I love the idea that we can have a Republic —the Tea Bagger version anyway. It doesn’t work with MILLIONS-BILLIONS of people.

Any system that large will inherently be unequal without government intervention. PERIOD.

Oh, I forget the creationists favor natural selection in the marketplace when they are at the top of the food chain.

87 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:48:45am

re: #78 Vicious Babushka

True that…

88 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:49:11am

re: #72 Eclectic Cyborg

Sigh…we’re fucked. We are well and truly fucked.

Shit just got real folks. This is, in my opinion, proof the GOP is ready and willing to send this country straight off the cliff.

That article is dated from September. I get the feeling that even the RWNJs know they’re not getting even half of that at this point.

89 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:49:12am

re: #85 Justanotherhuman

Jesus, Mark Zuckerburg bought 4 houses in Palo Alto. He needs his space…

We need jobs.

That’s nothing, I could buy 4 houses in Detroit!

90 wheat-dogghazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:49:28am

re: #82 Eclectic Cyborg

The stakes are high. If Obama caves, the precedent is set and the governance of the United States will never be the same again.

And China will gain in prestige and influence. America’s relations with the rest of the world will be damaged for a long time to come.

91 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:49:49am

If the default occurs because the GOP made it happen by not putting up a clean resolution - even if it’s on the short term basis, and the economy doesn’t immediately implode, watch for the GOP to claim that it proves their strategy successful. They will take it as proof that all the claims of dire consequences was hot air and that they’re going to stick it out until the Democrats cave.

Now, of course, there will be real effects, even if they’re not immediately seen. Money flowing in capital markets will shift. Costs for governance at all levels will increase due to higher borrowing and greater risk on debt obligations.

All self-inflicted of course. All due to the GOP, but they’re going to play this angle to the hilt. And then blame Obama for not caving in to their obscene demands.

92 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:50:36am

re: #85 Justanotherhuman

Jesus, Mark Zuckerburg bought 4 houses in Palo Alto. He needs his space…

We need jobs.

Dude, when that one falls, he will fall hard —mohs scale diamonds-hard.

93 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:51:25am

re: #91 lawhawk

If the default occurs because the GOP made it happen by not putting up a clean resolution - even if it’s on the short term basis, and the economy doesn’t immediately implode, watch for the GOP to claim that it proves their strategy successful. They will take it as proof that all the claims of dire consequences was hot air and that they’re going to stick it out until the Democrats cave.

Now, of course, there will be real effects, even if they’re not immediately seen. Money flowing in capital markets will shift. Costs for governance at all levels will increase due to higher borrowing and greater risk on debt obligations.

All self-inflicted of course. All due to the GOP, but they’re going to play this angle to the hilt. And then blame Obama for not caving in to their obscene demands.

When it all goes down, the usual excuse will be HURR HURR OBAMAZ FAULT!!!!!!1!!!!!

The GOP thinks they can’t possibly lose.

Everybody else will lose.

94 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:52:19am

One of the next, I think, “nationalisations” will be higher education. The price gouging cannot go on —the government is footing the bill already in the form of loans people cannot payback.

95 Dr. Matt  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:53:07am

Does anyone else think Ben Carson just doesn’t look right in the eyes?

96 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:53:41am

re: #95 Dr. Matt

Does anyone else think Ben Carson just doesn’t look right in the eyes?

It’s his coke-bottle-bottom glasses. Never translates well on TV.

97 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:55:10am

re: #92 FemNaziBitch

Dude, when that one falls, he will fall hard —mohs scale diamonds-hard.

Those 4 surround his, or are in close proximity to his own.

abcnews.go.com

“The buying spree may have been sparked when Zuckerberg learned of a developer’s plan to buy a property next to him, an unnamed source tells The San Jose Mercury News.

“The developer was going to build a huge house and market the property as being next door to Mark Zuckerberg,” the source says, according to the Mercury News. “

Gawd forbid they should have any neighbors. Now they can put up that electric fence around the entire block, no doubt.

98 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:58:55am

Well, Brat Puppy has a play date at the park.

Don’t forget your allergy meds today.

I guess there is some evidence out there that antihistamines might be an effective overall anti- inflammatory —like low-dose aspirin.

Who knew.

Another logical, but difficult to accept, side-effect. If sleepiness is brought on by allergies, taking an anti-histimine might actually wake-up you.

Works for me anyway. I never thought of it before, but I have more energy and am more alert when on my (old fashioned cheap antihistamines) meds then not.

99 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 7:59:35am

Well, my case of the Mondays is in full on contagious mode…I’ll leave you all before I infect you with my bad attitude…

100 erik_t  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:00:35am

re: #97 Justanotherhuman

“The developer was going to build a huge house and market the property as being next door to Mark Zuckerberg,” the source says, according to the Mercury News. “

Gawd forbid they should have any neighbors. Now they can put up that electric fence around the entire block, no doubt.

Frankly, sounds like both parties deserves the other. If you live in a city there are going to be people around you, and you don’t get to choose who those are… but I would rather not have my personal proximity used as a marketing feature, either.

101 Eventual Carrion  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:01:48am

re: #6 Vicious Babushka

You too can learn how to escape Obama’s FEMA camps for just $37!!! t.co
— Mother Jones (@MotherJones) October 14, 2013


Cool. Wonder how much I can get for my Yeti repellent?

102 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:02:52am

re: #72 Eclectic Cyborg

Sigh…we’re fucked. We are well and truly fucked.

Shit just got real folks. This is, in my opinion, proof the GOP is ready and willing to send this country straight off the cliff.

On the other hand however, that could be the House GOP’s ‘Hail Mary pass’; the final attempt to get what they want. After it’s shot down in flames is when Speaker Boehner will say, “Well, we fought like hell for what we wanted, but now it’s game over”, suspend the ‘Hastert Rule’ and pass a clean CR and debt-ceiling increase with the assistance of Nancy Pelosi and the Democrats plus a handful of centrist Republicans.

At least, I hope so, because if not, yep……..we’re boned.

103 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:03:28am

Annual self-evaluation due tomorrow. God, how I hate these!

104 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:04:51am

Jesus, Prudence WTF!!

105 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:07:25am

So wouldn’t it be more accurate to call this “The Five Self-Proclaimed “Military Brats’ Scam To Get Rich On The Backs Of Veterans March?”

106 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:12:30am

This gal will be across the street from my house next week.

107 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:20:28am

re: #72 Eclectic Cyborg

Sigh…we’re fucked. We are well and truly fucked.

Shit just got real folks. This is, in my opinion, proof the GOP is ready and willing to send this country straight off the cliff.

Yeah, this is not good. Most people have no idea or don’t care what the GOP is asking for. It’s really starting to make me a bit nuts. I was talking to a neighbor last night about the shutdown, and he had a kind of “WTF?” look on his face when I laid the blame on the GOP, not the President.

I’m glad Obama is standing up to these guys. However, I hate to say this, and I hope I’m wrong, but the GOP will eventually win this. A combination from the American people of shutdown fatigue and their legendary inability to grasp basic fucking facts is going to be tough for Obama to overcome.

108 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:21:06am

Honestly, they should have never brought them to begin with. Who doesn’t know that Larry Klayman, Sarah Palin, and Ted Cruz aren’t in this for one thing only? Their own egos.

109 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:21:22am

re: #97 Justanotherhuman

Those 4 surround his, or are in close proximity to his own.

abcnews.go.com

“The buying spree may have been sparked when Zuckerberg learned of a developer’s plan to buy a property next to him, an unnamed source tells The San Jose Mercury News.

“The developer was going to build a huge house and market the property as being next door to Mark Zuckerberg,” the source says, according to the Mercury News. “

Gawd forbid they should have any neighbors. Now they can put up that electric fence around the entire block, no doubt.

What about the houses that surround his houses? I guess he’ll have to buy those too.

Maybe he can just buy all of Palo Alto - the good part, anyway - and build a wall surrounded by a moat.

110 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:23:07am

re: #107 Mattand

Yeah, this is not good. Most people have no idea or don’t care what the GOP is asking for. It’s really starting to make me a bit nuts. I was talking to a neighbor last night about the shutdown, and he had a kind of “WTF?” look on his face when I laid the blame on the GOP, not the President.

I’m glad Obama is standing up to these guys. However, I hate to say this, and I hope I’m wrong, but the GOP will eventually win this. A combination from the American people of shutdown fatigue and their legendary inability to grasp basic fucking facts is going to be tough for Obama to overcome.

The problem is the GOP’s message has always been simpler and easier to sum up in soundbites. Plus enough people believe “Both sides are just as bad.” The one good short thing that will come of this is Ken Cuccinnelli won’t be my governor but I’d like to see the GOP lose their majority in the House too and a chance at winning the presidency.

111 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:24:28am

I do feel bad for the vets who can’t see the memorial but this protest seems to me to be focused on that rather than actual real genuine anger at the shutdown that effects people more ways than some relative inconvenience. Yes, I think not being able to visit a memorial is a convenience compared to some of the byproducts of the shutdown.

112 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:26:32am

Fucking GOP.

113 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:28:45am

re: #112 Varek Raith

That’s kind of a daily prayer for me.

114 calochortus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:29:52am

re: #109 Skip Intro

What about the houses that surround his houses? I guess he’ll have to buy those too.

Maybe he can just buy all of Palo Alto - the good part, anyway - and build a wall surrounded by a moat.

IIRC (I don’t pay much attention to that sort of thing) he’s going to lease the houses back to their current owners or something. He’s just trying to limit the changes in his neighborhood, not totally get rid of the neighbors.
On the other hand, I’m always amused by “Mr. People-don’t-want-privacy-anymore” being extremely careful with his own privacy.

115 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:30:12am

re: #110 HappyWarrior

The problem is the GOP’s message has always been simpler and easier to sum up in soundbites. Plus enough people believe “Both sides are just as bad.” The one good short thing that will come of this is Ken Cuccinnelli won’t be my governor but I’d like to see the GOP lose their majority in the House too and a chance at winning the presidency.

I’ve said for years that that is one of the major reasons conservative talk radio is so successful. It’s so much easier to point at something/someone, shout “THAT’S your enemy” and move on.

116 Snarknado!  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:30:24am

re: #74 Vicious Babushka

I am too but I’m not in Wikipedia.

My mother used to say “foolish names and foolish faces often appear in public places.”

117 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:30:46am

Given that my folks regularly vote for the GOP/Teahadists there’s part of me that is looking forward to them bitch about my dad not getting his SS/Veteran’s benefits and my mom (a home health aid) getting hours cut due to SS/Medicare/Medicaid payments drying up. I have one answer for them “this is what you voted for, this was the goal of the people you voted for”.

118 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:31:37am

re: #115 Mattand

I’ve said for years that that is one of the major reasons conservative talk radio is so successful. It’s so much easier to point at something/someone, shout “THAT’S your enemy” and move on.

That’s a good point. Makes sense when you think about it.

119 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:33:12am

John McCain Threatens Revenge on Democrats if They Humiliate Republicans on Govt Shutdown

Dear McCain,
We ain’t gotta do shit to humiliate you guys. You’re doing it all own your own.

120 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:34:47am

re: #115 Mattand

I’ve said for years that that is one of the major reasons conservative talk radio is so successful. It’s so much easier to point at something/someone, shout “THAT’S your enemy” and move on.

I just posted something very similar on Facebook.

Conservatives are fed a steady diet of outrage, period. Fox News and Limbaugh tell them every day what they should be outraged about, and they follow without question.

Case in point - these idiots who carried stupid park barricades to the White House yesterday are all ginned up over memorials being closed, while they seem to be perfectly okay with veterans’ benefits being cut. Why is that? Because nobody TOLD them to be outraged about vets’ benefits.

I would probably really hate myself if I woke up every morning and went looking for a reason to be pissed off all day.

121 piratedan  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:37:06am

re: #119 Varek Raith

John McCain Threatens Revenge on Democrats if They Humiliate Republicans on Govt Shutdown

Dear McCain,
We ain’t gotta do shit to humiliate you guys. You’re doing it all own your own.

REALLY JOHN? After all, these last five years have been positively collegial in atmosphere….. ////

122 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:37:26am

re: #119 Varek Raith

John McCain Threatens Revenge on Democrats if They Humiliate Republicans on Govt Shutdown

Dear McCain,
We ain’t gotta do shit to humiliate you guys. You’re doing it all own your own.

Now is the time to be magnanimous!” Fuck off McCain. I know you may not personally be happy with the shutdown either but do not play this MBF shit with us. Your party is at fault for this shutdown and the previous one, and don’t complain about the Democrats pointing out to the American people exactly that. You want magnanimous? How about you fucking apologize for unleashing Sarah Palin on the American people? You remember her right?

123 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:38:07am

re: #121 piratedan

REALLY JOHN? After all, these last five years have positively collegial in atmosphere….. ////

This kind of behavior by McCain actually makes me loathe him more than teh true believers. McCain is a partisan hack who often poses as a statesman.

124 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:39:47am
125 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:41:50am

re: #115 Mattand

I’ve said for years that that is one of the major reasons conservative talk radio is so successful. It’s so much easier to point at something/someone, shout “THAT’S your enemy” and move on.

Italy has a similar problem with Berlusconi’s media empire. It seems that if there is a station running this kind of stuff all the time, at least 30% of the population goes along with it. Always.

It seems like no one ever stops and questions the agenda of the station and asks why it’s wall to wall propaganda.

126 piratedan  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:42:02am

re: #123 HappyWarrior

This kind of behavior by McCain actually makes me loathe him more than teh true believers. McCain is a partisan hack who often poses as a statesman.

gotta love these preemptive strikes… “don’t embarrass us too much or gloat at all at our predicament”… ummm John, your party has yet to pull the nation’s collective nads from the fire and you want to make sure that there are no hard feelings first when the guys who’re holding them there aren’t even sure that they like you….

127 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:42:12am
128 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:44:02am

re: #119 Varek Raith

John McCain Threatens Revenge on Democrats if They Humiliate Republicans on Govt Shutdown

Dear McCain,
We ain’t gotta do shit to humiliate you guys. You’re doing it all own your own.

They want this country to explode in a flaming mushroom cloud and they’re worried about a little butthurt?

129 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:44:16am

re: #127 Varek Raith

GOPer calls for ‘four’ branches to work together

Ok, shoot me know.
Kthx.

Basic civics. We basically elected the guys who did pitfarts during civics class but ran for office because they didn’t like paying their taxes or they don’t understand that in a democratic society you pay for programs that may not directly benefit you sometimes. In other words, we elect idiots like this.

130 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:44:36am

re: #128 Vicious Babushka

They want this country to explode in a flaming mushroom cloud and they’re worried about a little butthurt?

Well, what’s really important?

///

131 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:45:38am

re: #130 makeitstop

Well, what’s really important?

///

Remember when McCain’s campaign slogan was Country First. He doesn’t show that often. Sometimes, he’ll act principled but then he’ll act like the partisan hack he’s become.

132 Amory Blaine  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:46:08am

re: #29 DisturbedEma

Now we’ve done it…

Alex Jones will be all over this

Xinhua called for a “a new world order” in which “all nations, big or small, poor or rich, can have their key interests respected and protected on an equal footing.”

133 calochortus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:48:06am

re: #127 Varek Raith

GOPer calls for ‘four’ branches to work together

Ok, shoot me know.
Kthx.

Eh, I put that in the same category as Obama’s “57 states” remark.
He was dividing the legislative in half, because he was making a point and speaking off the cuff.

134 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:48:42am

re: #131 HappyWarrior

Remember when McCain’s campaign slogan was Country First. He doesn’t show that often. Sometimes, he’ll act principled but then he’ll act like the partisan hack he’s become.

Three days ago he was telling Fox News it was the GOP’s fault the government shut down. Now he’s walking that back by threatening Democrats. He really is just a little mixed up in the head, as he can keep both positions simultaneously and not see the problem.

135 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:49:19am

re: #133 calochortus

Eh, I put that in the same category as Obama’s “57 states” remark.
He was dividing the legislative in half, because he was making a point and speaking off the cuff.

Guess so. Still sound by my remark that we’ve elected a bunch of idiots who don’t understand fundamental civics though.

136 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:49:40am

re: #134 darthstar

Three days ago he was telling Fox News it was the GOP’s fault the government shut down. Now he’s walking that back by threatening Democrats. He really is just a little mixed up in the head, as he can keep both positions simultaneously and not see the problem.

He really should have retired. I’m serious.

137 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:50:20am

WTFITS

138 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:51:28am

re: #137 Vicious Babushka

WTFITS

[Embedded content]

Threatening people and then crying that Obama is the tyrant. It’s the right wing way!

139 calochortus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:51:30am

re: #135 HappyWarrior

Guess so. Still sound by my remark that we’ve elected a bunch of idiots who don’t understand fundamental civics though.

I’ll be happy to agree with you there.

140 calochortus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:52:38am

BBL Despite being an evil Obama voter, I do have some work to do.

141 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:52:49am

re: #138 HappyWarrior

Threatening people and then crying that Obama is the tyrant. It’s the right wing way!

DEBT DEFAULT, BRING IT ON!!!11 I GOTS MY GUNZ & MY SURVIVAL SEEDS & MY GOLD & MY BUNKER1!!!!!!!

142 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:53:48am

re: #137 Vicious Babushka

WTFITS

[Embedded content]

Nice barbed wire ghetto they live in. Must suck to be that scared all the time they need guns at a BBQ.

143 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:55:05am

re: #142 darthstar

Nice barbed wire ghetto they live in. Must suck to be that scared all the time they need guns at a BBQ.

Yeah, we had a word for people like that when I was a kid and we called them pussies.

144 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:55:29am

re: #137 Vicious Babushka

Your neighborhood sucks if you’re having barbed wire and concertina wire fencing all over the place, and have to carry around semi-auto rifles.

145 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:56:31am

re: #144 lawhawk

Your neighborhood sucks if you’re having barbed wire and concertina wire fencing all over the place, and have to carry around semi-auto rifles.

Yeah no kidding. Where I come from, we live in a neighborhood not a place that resembles a post-apocalyptic fantasy world.

146 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:57:30am

re: #144 lawhawk

Your neighborhood sucks if you’re having barbed wire and concertina wire fencing all over the place, and have to carry around semi-auto rifles.

IT AIN’T A PICNIC UNTIL WE CAN HUNT US DOWN SOME OBAMA VOTERZ!!!1!!

147 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:57:33am
148 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:58:30am

NO SHIT

149 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:58:31am

re: #147 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Where’s the “No shit, sherlock.”

150 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:59:06am

re: #148 Vicious Babushka

NO SHIT

[Embedded content]

Go ahead and try House Republicans and you’ll watch yourselves become less popular than the Bubonic Plague.

151 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 8:59:56am

re: #127 Varek Raith

GOPer calls for ‘four’ branches to work together

Ok, shoot me know.
Kthx.

We have four branches of government: the Executive, the Judiciary, the Legislature, and People Who Listen To Glenn Beck And Buy Gold.

- Charles Pierce

152 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:01:02am

re: #151 Skip Intro

- Charles Pierce

Heh that would be funny if the fourth wasn’t so prominent and had Boehner’s balls in a vase.

153 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:03:23am

Gohmert wants to impeach the President over the GOP’s refusal to send up a clean bill on the debt ceiling, and that’s the President’s fault.

Republicans have wanted to impeach this president since the moment that he took office. They have claimed that everything that this president has done is an impeachable offense, but even the most basic understanding of the constitutional separation of powers makes it clear that President Obama can’t be impeached for default. Article I Sec.8 of the Constitution gives the power of the purse to Congress. This means if Congress does not paid our bills, that will be violating the Constitution.

If President Obama tried to raise taxes or borrow money on his own to pay our debts, he would be violating the Constitution. Congress has to pay the bills. What Rep. Gohmert is suggesting is that President Obama should be impeached because House Republicans have violated the Constitution.

Circular pretzel logic aspirants take note.

This is how you do it right: Louis Gohmert, collect your prize. You win the Wingnut Logic Prize of the Day.

154 Political Atheist  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:03:46am

DC Politics-So what do the Blue Dog Dems have to say?
Apparently nothing since January 4th. And yet they are quietly voicing a willingness to vote for a clean CR. Come on boys, you can’t advertise and hide at the same time now…

155 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:04:06am

re: #153 lawhawk

Gohmert wants to impeach the President over the GOP’s refusal to send up a clean bill on the debt ceiling, and that’s the President’s fault.

Circular pretzel logic aspirants take note.

This is how you do it right: Louis Gohmert, collect your prize. You win the Wingnut Logic Prize of the Day.

156 piratedan  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:04:47am

Steve B over at the TRMS has a nice succinct breakdown of the latest ransom demands:

maddowblog.msnbc.com

and remember, per Johnny Maverick, we’re supposed to play nice and allow them to save face.

157 kerFuFFler  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:05:03am

re: #148 Vicious Babushka

NO SHIT

House Republicans Want To Use Default As a Reason to Impeach President Obama

Jeez, if Obama uses some sort of executive power to raise the debt limit they will impeach him for tyranny (or whatever…), and if he doesn’t they will impeach him. Damned if he does and damned if he doesn’t.


Meanwhile, just what we need in case our economy and country head into the crapper, a bunch of fapping congressional impeachment hearings!

158 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:06:10am

Words.
I can’t spell em.

159 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:06:10am

Interesting. The food shelf had a bunch of good fruits & veggies this month - local apples, local chilies, pomegranate, mango, lime, beets, radish, kohlrabi & artichoke. I know what to do with the rest, but pointers or recipes to use those two artichokes would be greatly appreciated.

160 Political Atheist  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:06:35am

re: #144 lawhawk

Your neighborhood sucks if you’re having barbed wire and concertina wire fencing all over the place, and have to carry around semi-auto rifles.

If it did not suck before those loons moved in it sure does now. :-/

161 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:07:06am

re: #157 kerFuFFler

Jeez, if Obama uses some sort of executive power to raise the debt limit they will impeach him, and if he doesn’t they will impeach him. Damned if he does and damned if he doesn’t.

Meanwhile, just what we need in case our economy and country head into the crapper, a bunch of fapping congressional impeachment hearings!

During their breaks, they’ll continue having votes to trying repeal the ACA.

Worst Congress Ever.

163 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:07:58am
164 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:08:11am

re: #137 Vicious Babushka

WTFITS

[Embedded content]

Looks like another nice day in Somalia.

165 Varek Raith  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:08:44am

re: #164 Skip Intro

Looks like another nice day in Somalia.

Safest place on Earth.

166 The Ghost of a Flea  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:08:48am

re: #144 lawhawk

Your neighborhood sucks if you’re having barbed wire and concertina wire fencing all over the place, and have to carry around semi-auto rifles.

Alternately, if you have barbed wire and fencing all over the place, you’re the person making your neighborhood suck.

167 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:11:23am

re: #164 Skip Intro

Looks like another nice day in Somalia.

Nice shades, tho!

168 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:11:27am

re: #138 HappyWarrior

Threatening people and then crying that Obama is the tyrant. It’s the right wing way!

Exactly. And this is what scares me: there could be some natural and/or man-made catastrophe that could compel the government to declare martial law and call out National Guard soldiers to restore order and FEMA people to maintain infrastructure and critical services.

Do those fellows in the photo look they are going to cooperate peacefully and fully with their directives or see this as a chance to assert their inalienable rights as Sovereign Citizens?

169 darthstar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:13:13am
170 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:17:05am
171 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:17:22am
172 ProTARDISLiberal  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:18:56am

re: #132 Amory Blaine

Vietnam and the Philippines already know this is bullshit.

173 blueraven  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:19:36am

re: #152 HappyWarrior

Heh that would be funny if the fourth wasn’t so prominent and had Boehner’s balls in a vase.

Could those be sent over to the WH for a Halloween decoration?

174 Snarknado!  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:22:52am

re: #168 Sol Berdinowitz

Exactly. And this is what scares me: there could be some natural and/or man-made catastrophe that could compel the government to declare martial law and call out National Guard soldiers to restore order and FEMA people to maintain infrastructure and critical services.

Do those fellows in the photo look they are going to cooperate peacefully and fully with their directives or see this as a chance to assert their inalienable rights as Sovereign Citizens?

No, but they look like fat, middle-aged dilettantes who wouldn’t have a chance against regular troops, or probably even against the reserves. I grant you it could get ugly.

175 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:22:56am

re: #173 blueraven

Could those be sent over to the WH for a Halloween decoration?

Image: cheeseballs.png

176 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:24:09am

re: #137 Vicious Babushka

WTFITS

[Embedded content]

I don’t know, but if I were still a lively and attractive young woman, none of them would be getting any. : )

177 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:25:30am
178 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:31:44am
179 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:33:10am

Just what New York doesn’t need, Donald Trump potentially running for governor against Andrew Cuomo next year.

Trump’s solution to fix all that ails the state. Drill baby Drill (Marcellus Shale), and cut taxes on the rich (even though they’re flocking to NYC to buy up penthouse suites by the score - spurring a new skyscraper boon - where along 57th Street alone are three new tower proposals that will each top out at or above the height of the Empire State Building.

180 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:33:24am

16,000 Karma!!

Youtube Video

181 CuriousLurker  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:34:03am

Excellent post, especially the point about veterans being fetish objects.

182 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:34:06am

re: #177 wrenchwench

[Embedded content]

Read about this over the weekend at Pharyngula.com. Disgraceful behavior from SciAm. Simply stunning that they would take, what; four days to fire someone in their employ calling an associated blogger a whore?

183 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:37:02am

re: #179 lawhawk

Just what New York doesn’t need, Donald Trump potentially running for governor against Andrew Cuomo next year.

Trump’s solution to fix all that ails the state. Drill baby Drill (Marcellus Shale), and cut taxes on the rich (even though they’re flocking to NYC to buy up penthouse suites by the score - spurring a new skyscraper boon - where along 57th Street alone are three new tower proposals that will each top out at or above the height of the Empire State Building.

Maybe it’s the Philly side of my family coming out*, but something seems wrong about what are essentially glorified condos being higher than the ESB.

*There was a gentlemen’s agreement for decades in Philly to not build anything higher than City Hall, and its William Penn statue.

184 wrenchwench  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:39:21am

re: #182 Mattand

Read about this over the weekend at Pharyngula.com. Disgraceful behavior from SciAm. Simply stunning that they would take, what; four days to fire someone in their employ calling an associated blogger a whore?

Read some more, you’ve conflated a couple things. The person who used the ‘w’ word did not work for SciAm.

Here’s a good account of the matter.

185 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:39:30am

re: #163 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Damn it DS, I actually thought that was a real serious tweet given that Larry Klayman expects Obama to be arrested praying on a Quran.

186 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:40:01am

re: #183 Mattand

There was a similar type deal in NYC for a long time that buildings in Midtown wouldn’t encroach on the ESB’s “space” in the skyline, but that’s gone out the window in the past decade as a bunch of 1,000 foot towers have been built in and around Times Square, the City has rezoned parts of Midtown to encourage new development and taller buildings, and land values are expensive enough to make building these new towers desirable.

That and you’ve got a whole lot of rich people overseas having no where else to park their money, so they’re putting it into desirable locations in NYC.

187 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:40:40am

That guy in #137, who posed with his buddies in their compound?

188 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:40:42am

re: #179 lawhawk

Just what New York doesn’t need, Donald Trump potentially running for governor against Andrew Cuomo next year.

Trump’s solution to fix all that ails the state. Drill baby Drill (Marcellus Shale), and cut taxes on the rich (even though they’re flocking to NYC to buy up penthouse suites by the score - spurring a new skyscraper boon - where along 57th Street alone are three new tower proposals that will each top out at or above the height of the Empire State Building.

And Andrew Cuomo probably thought his opponents couldn’t get any more crazy than Carl “The Bat” Paladino and Jimmy McMillan.

189 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:41:23am

re: #187 Vicious Babushka

That guy in #137, who posed with his buddies in their compound?

[Embedded content]

That’s a pretty stupid quote since businesses make decisions that impact all of us.

190 ProTARDISLiberal  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:41:55am

I am getting very scared and pissed now.

191 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:42:04am

re: #189 HappyWarrior

That’s a pretty stupid quote since businesses make decisions that impact all of us.

Hey, at least it isn’t a Fake Quote.

192 The Ghost of a Flea  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:42:09am

re: #174 Snarknado!

No, but they look like fat, middle-aged dilettantes who wouldn’t have a chance against regular troops, or probably even against the reserves. I grant you it could get ugly.

Recall that when they say “government” they mean anybody they dislike, including civilians with different politics. Including people who voted wrong, are a part of minorities that “aren’t American.”

Kind of puts their posturing and threats in a different light.

193 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:42:47am

re: #191 Vicious Babushka

Hey, at least it isn’t a Fake Quote.

Heh true but those are usually reserved for actual rational people i.e Jefferson.

194 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:43:47am

FUCK

195 erik_t  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:44:00am

re: #187 Vicious Babushka

That guy in #137, who posed with his buddies in their compound?

Indeed. Dumbshits like Louie Gohmert are making a mistake, and I’m going to suffer the consequences.

Somehow I don’t think that’s the point the twitterer was trying to make.

196 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:44:16am

re: #186 lawhawk

Don’t know if you saw my post from a few days ago, but how hot is the Senate race up there? It’s been surprisingly quiet down here.

Part of that may be I don’t see political ads anymore as most of what we watch is on DVR. I’m just surprised at the lack of lawn signs and posters.

197 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:44:38am

Damn it.

198 CuriousLurker  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:44:45am

re: #192 The Ghost of a Flea

Recall that when they say “government” they mean anybody they dislike, including civilians with different politics. Including people who voted wrong, are a part of minorities that “aren’t American.”

Kind of puts their posturing and threats in a different light.

Yes, the tweeter’s reference was to “Obama voters”, not the government.

199 ProTARDISLiberal  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:45:53am

re: #194 Vicious Babushka

Damnit!

200 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:45:56am

re: #187 Vicious Babushka

Businesses make decisions that don’t affect others? Anyone remember BP oil spill in the Gulf? I’m pretty sure that was a business decision that screwed millions of people along the Gulf Coast.

Or that oil spill from a pipeline this past week that screwed a farmer when he found himself and his crop sinking into a oily mess of crude oil.

Or any of the natural gas pipeline explosions from past years.

Or tobacco companies that sold cancer sticks to the public and said it was good for them (and never mind the second hand smoke that affected people who weren’t even smokers).

Or planes that crash because of manufacturing defects.

Or cars that crash because of manufacturing defects - including victims who weren’t even driving at the time.

I could go on, but you get the point.

201 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:45:58am

re: #187 Vicious Babushka

That guy in #137, who posed with his buddies in their compound?

[Embedded content]

Atlas shragged?

202 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:46:29am

If for some reason you ever needed proof that the Republican party — and its sycophantic supporters in the population — value appearances and symbols over actual reality, the shutdown has provided a goldmine.

Important government services all over the place are shut down, checks that represent the United States Government’s obligations to its citizens aren’t going out, critical work isn’t getting done… and all these people care about is whether they can masturbate next to some pretty rocks.

The people of this useless, broken country get all the government they deserve.

203 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:47:14am

re: #200 lawhawk

Businesses make decisions that don’t affect others? Anyone remember BP oil spill in the Gulf? I’m pretty sure that was a business decision that screwed millions of people along the Gulf Coast.

Or that oil spill from a pipeline this past week that screwed a farmer when he found himself and his crop sinking into a oily mess of crude oil.

Or any of the natural gas pipeline explosions from past years.

Or tobacco companies that sold cancer sticks to the public and said it was good for them (and never mind the second hand smoke that affected people who weren’t even smokers).

Or planes that crash because of manufacturing defects.

Or cars that crash because of manufacturing defects - including victims who weren’t even driving at the time.

I could go on, but you get the point.

Seriously. Ayn Rand, worst pseudo-philospher ever.At least Marx had some fair observations about society.

204 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:47:18am

re: #200 lawhawk

Businesses make decisions that don’t affect others? Anyone remember BP oil spill in the Gulf? I’m pretty sure that was a business decision that screwed millions of people along the Gulf Coast.

Or that oil spill from a pipeline this past week that screwed a farmer when he found himself and his crop sinking into a oily mess of crude oil.

Or any of the natural gas pipeline explosions from past years.

Or tobacco companies that sold cancer sticks to the public and said it was good for them (and never mind the second hand smoke that affected people who weren’t even smokers).

Or planes that crash because of manufacturing defects.

Or cars that crash because of manufacturing defects - including victims who weren’t even driving at the time.

I could go on, but you get the point.

HURR HURR THAT WAS BECAUS OF TEH YOONUNZ & TOO MUCH GUBMENT REGULASHUNZ!!!!1!!!!11

205 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:49:06am

They must have come to that conclusion by reading Bryan’s Twitter feed.

206 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:49:12am

re: #196 Mattand

I’m assuming you’re talking Booker-Lonegan? It’s pretty low key, though there’s been a spate of ads in the past week or so. Lonegan is also running radio ads that are a word salad of every conceivable bad word/thought you can have about Democrats:

radical, leftist, Obamacare, socialism, rubber stamp, corrupt, etc.

His message is all over the place.

In contrast, even Booker’s attack ads are on the uplifting side, by indicating that he’d try to push above the fray and concentrate on what New Jerseyeans want in the Senate and protecting their rights and values while indicating that Lonegan is out of touch with New Jersey and New Jersey values.

207 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:52:07am

re: #206 lawhawk

I’m assuming you’re talking Booker-Lonegan? It’s pretty low key, though there’s been a spate of ads in the past week or so. Lonegan is also running radio ads that are a word salad of every conceivable bad word/thought you can have about Democrats:

radical, leftist, Obamacare, socialism, rubber stamp, corrupt, etc.

His message is all over the place.

In contrast, even Booker’s attack ads are on the uplifting side, by indicating that he’d try to push above the fray and concentrate on what New Jerseyeans want in the Senate and protecting their rights and values while indicating that Lonegan is out of touch with New Jersey and New Jersey values.

Sounds similar to what I’ve seen here in the governor’s race. I’ve even some ads where self-proclaimed life long Republicans announce their support for McAuliffe. Now granted i’ve seen the reverse for Cuccinnelli too but Cuccinnelli has done nothing to dispel the fact he’s a right wing zealot. There’s a lot of rumblings in the VA GOP.

208 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:52:45am

re: #206 lawhawk

I’m assuming you’re talking Booker-Lonegan? It’s pretty low key, though there’s been a spate of ads in the past week or so. Lonegan is also running radio ads that are a word salad of every conceivable bad word/thought you can have about Democrats:

radical, leftist, Obamacare, socialism, rubber stamp, corrupt, etc.

His message is all over the place.

In contrast, even Booker’s attack ads are on the uplifting side, by indicating that he’d try to push above the fray and concentrate on what New Jerseyeans want in the Senate and protecting their rights and values while indicating that Lonegan is out of touch with New Jersey and New Jersey values.

Thanks. I would imagine that if Christie was campaigning for Lonegan, rather than holding him at arm’s length, it’d be a tighter race.

I had never heard of Lonegan (or Bogota) until his Senate run. Was he actually any good as mayor?

209 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:52:50am

re: #205 Vicious Babushka

They must have come to that conclusion by reading Bryan’s Twitter feed.

[Embedded content]

How the hell are they not a hate group.

210 Interesting Times  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:53:09am

re: #196 Mattand

Part of that may be I don’t see political ads anymore as most of what we watch is on DVR. I’m just surprised at the lack of lawn signs and posters.

Do you live in an especially wingnutty part of NJ? It sounds that way from your posts, because it is a blue state overall (tongue-bathing of chris christie aside). Do these crazy people you know support Lonegan, for example?

211 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:53:15am

re: #203 HappyWarrior

Seriously. Ayn Rand, worst pseudo-philospher ever.At least Marx had some fair observations about society.

My standard-issue auto-response to anyone trying to mention Rand or any of her trash writing, in any capacity other than to be mocked, is as follows:

“Ayn Rand died miserable and alone, collecting checks from the welfare system she spent her life trash-talking. Her ideas are worthless and so are you.”

212 kirkspencer  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:53:27am

re: #194 Vicious Babushka

FUCK

[Embedded content]

Here’s the iron of the issue to me: Causing a default can be argued (has been in international law) to be a form of rebellion. Rebellion triggers not only the suspension clause (article I section 9) but several laws involving the posse comitatus and insurrection acts.

In short, their behavior may make the president a dictator.

(1) The President may employ the armed forces, including the National Guard in Federal service, to—
(A) restore public order and enforce the laws of the United States when, as a result of a natural disaster, epidemic, or other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident, or other condition in any State or possession of the United States, the President determines that—
(i) domestic violence has occurred to such an extent that the constituted authorities of the State or possession are incapable of maintaining public order; and
(ii) such violence results in a condition described in paragraph (2); or
(B) suppress, in a State, any insurrection, domestic violence, unlawful combination, or conspiracy if such insurrection, violation, combination, or conspiracy results in a condition described in paragraph (2).
(2) A condition described in this paragraph is a condition that—
(A) so hinders the execution of the laws of a State or possession, as applicable, and of the United States within that State or possession, that any part or class of its people is deprived of a right, privilege, immunity, or protection named in the Constitution and secured by law, and the constituted authorities of that State or possession are unable, fail, or refuse to protect that right, privilege, or immunity, or to give that protection; or
(B) opposes or obstructs the execution of the laws of the United States or impedes the course of justice under those laws.

213 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:53:52am

re: #187 Vicious Babushka

That guy in #137, who posed with his buddies in their compound?

[Embedded content]

I predict that Kickstarter campaign will be every bit as successful as the first two parts of ‘Atlas Shrugged.’

Part I: “after six weeks, the film was showing on only 32 screens and total ticket sales had not crossed the $5 million mark, recouping less than a quarter of the production budget.”

Part II: “According to Box Office Mojo, box office take totaled $3,286,255 through November 4, 2012, the last date for which the producers released numbers.”

214 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:54:51am

re: #211 GunstarGreen

My standard-issue auto-response to anyone trying to mention Rand or any of her trash writing, in any capacity other than to be mocked, is as follows:

“Ayn Rand died miserable and alone, collecting checks from the welfare system she spent her life trash-talking. Her ideas are worthless and so are you.”

Her ideas are not only worthless, they’re stupid. I’ve heard many people here argue that she’s kind of like a Satanic Marxist. I had never thought about that but it seems to me that her philosophy was a reaction to Leninism rather than something actually thought out.

215 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:55:12am

re: #213 makeitstop

I predict that Kickstarter campaign will be every bit as successful as the first two parts of ‘Atlas Shrugged.’

Part I: “after six weeks, the film was showing on only 32 screens and total ticket sales had not crossed the $5 million mark, recouping less than a quarter of the production budget.”

Part II: “According to Box Office Mojo, box office take totaled $3,286,255 through November 4, 2012, the last date for which the producers released numbers.”

Turns out that the wonderful almighty free market has no use for Rand and her nonsense.

216 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:55:15am

Meeting time. BBL.

217 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:56:17am

Rand’s ideas are merely an excuse for the selfish to rationalize it through convuluted bullshit. I’ve actually read the Fountainhead and it was a a load of shit.

218 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:57:22am

re: #206 lawhawk

I’m assuming you’re talking Booker-Lonegan? It’s pretty low key, though there’s been a spate of ads in the past week or so. Lonegan is also running radio ads that are a word salad of every conceivable bad word/thought you can have about Democrats:

radical, leftist, Obamacare, socialism, rubber stamp, corrupt, etc.

His message is all over the place.

In contrast, even Booker’s attack ads are on the uplifting side, by indicating that he’d try to push above the fray and concentrate on what New Jerseyeans want in the Senate and protecting their rights and values while indicating that Lonegan is out of touch with New Jersey and New Jersey values.

I heard a Lonegan ad yesterday morning. He actually claims that Booker favors abortions ‘up to the day of delivery.’

Dude’s nuts. I’m hoping for an all-time electoral ass-whupping.

219 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:58:59am

re: #217 HappyWarrior

Rand’s ideas are merely an excuse for the selfish to rationalize it through convuluted bullshit. I’ve actually read the Fountainhead and it was a a load of shit.

Precisely. Rand is popular insofar as a whole lot of people are selfish assholes and they like having pseudo-intellectual bullshit to make excuses with. They start to feel bad for being atavistic pigs, then Rand comes along and tells them that they don’t have to be ashamed of being staggeringly odious pieces of shit, they should CELEBRATE that instead. Decent human beings do not sing the praises of a woman who stated, on national television without a single shred of shame, that altruism is not only undesirable but actively Evil.

220 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 9:59:10am

re: #210 Interesting Times

Do you live in an especially wingnutty part of NJ? It sounds that way from your posts, because it is a blue state overall (tongue-bathing of chris christie aside). Do these crazy people you know support Lonegan, for example?

It’s not really wingnutty. Actually, the town and county I’m in lean Democratic. Most of that is me frustrated with the false balance shit I’ve been encountering.

My innate crankiness needs to be factored into my rantings.

People just don’t want to admit that one side is pretty much causing this mess. Maybe it’s that Jersey as a purple state thing; vote Obama for POTUS, Christie for gov.

221 The Ghost of a Flea  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:00:07am

re: #189 HappyWarrior

That’s a pretty stupid quote since businesses make decisions that impact all of us.

Businesses have, for a very long time, acted as micro-governments when given the opportunity. Coal mining in the Appalachians, for example, or pretty much all the agriculture in South and Central America. Companies with private armies, no less. Both in her lifetime and today, there are large and small businesses that use intimidation and violence to keep their workforce in place.

But the basis of Rand’s thinking is an artificial distinction between government (bad) and business (good), so the complex nature of authority is dismissed.

222 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:01:03am

re: #221 The Ghost of a Flea

Businesses have, for a very long time, acted as micro-governments when given the opportunity. Coal mining in the Appalachians, for example, or pretty much all the agriculture in South and Central America. Companies with private armies, no less. Both in her lifetime and today, there are large and small businesses that use intimidation and violence to keep their workforce in place.

But the basis of Rand’s thinking is an artificial distinction between government (bad) and business (good), so the complex nature of authority is dismissed.

Good points.

223 Tigger2  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:02:21am

re: #72 Eclectic Cyborg

Sigh…we’re fucked. We are well and truly fucked.

Shit just got real folks. This is, in my opinion, proof the GOP is ready and willing to send this country straight off the cliff.

They have truly evolved back into the Know Nothing Party.

224 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:02:58am

re: #200 lawhawk

Businesses make decisions that don’t affect others? Anyone remember BP oil spill in the Gulf? I’m pretty sure that was a business decision that screwed millions of people along the Gulf Coast.

Or that oil spill from a pipeline this past week that screwed a farmer when he found himself and his crop sinking into a oily mess of crude oil.

Or any of the natural gas pipeline explosions from past years.

Or tobacco companies that sold cancer sticks to the public and said it was good for them (and never mind the second hand smoke that affected people who weren’t even smokers).

Or planes that crash because of manufacturing defects.

Or cars that crash because of manufacturing defects - including victims who weren’t even driving at the time.

I could go on, but you get the point.

Those of us in California are still paying for the energy disaster Enron caused.

225 Egregious Philbin  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:03:00am

So, the professional rabble is angry at the common rabble for exploiting them,, while they are exploiting.

KOOK FIGHTS! Bring a chair, some beer and peanuts, this is gonna be fun to watch these yokels and hillbillies square off.

226 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:03:09am

re: #208 Mattand

Nondescript. Didn’t make much news - it’s not a particularly big town and is in the shadow of the much more well known Hackensack or Fort Lee.

But you know he’s a grade A hypocrite when he bitches about bailouts after he authorized his town to take a $500k one to help balance his town’s books.

227 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:03:37am

re: #213 makeitstop

I predict that Kickstarter campaign will be every bit as successful as the first two parts of ‘Atlas Shrugged.’

Part I: “after six weeks, the film was showing on only 32 screens and total ticket sales had not crossed the $5 million mark, recouping less than a quarter of the production budget.”

Part II: “According to Box Office Mojo, box office take totaled $3,286,255 through November 4, 2012, the last date for which the producers released numbers.”

Christ, they should rename it “The Movie Going Public Shrugged”, based on those returns.

228 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:05:50am

re: #226 lawhawk

Nondescript. Didn’t make much news - it’s not a particularly big town and is in the shadow of the much more well known Hackensack or Fort Lee.

But you know he’s a grade A hypocrite when he bitches about bailouts after he authorized his town to take a $500k one to help balance his town’s books.

LOL!

229 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:06:23am

re: #220 Mattand

Well, that and the fact that Corzine was just awful. Christie capitalized on that and ran a great campaign.

He’s basically doing nothing with Lonegan.

Lonegan had run against Christie in the primaries and lost in the race that ultimately saw him beat Corzine - I think there’s real animosity there in part because Christie sees Lonegan as a nutbar and gadfly who’s likely to hurt Christie’s own numbers.

Instead, Lonegan’s gotten Palin to stump for him, and any turnout can be attributed to people turning out to see her and not Lonegan on his own merits.

230 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:06:37am
231 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:07:27am

re: #230 Carlos Danger

[Embedded content]

I hope it ends soon. Cautiously optimistic.

232 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:08:36am

re: #212 kirkspencer

Self-fulfilling prophesy courtesy of wingnuts hoping to kick off the Second Civil War and overturning the results of the first.

233 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:09:23am

re: #229 lawhawk

Well, that and the fact that Corzine was just awful. Christie capitalized on that and ran a great campaign.

He’s basically doing nothing with Lonegan.

Lonegan had run against Christie in the primaries and lost in the race that ultimately saw him beat Corzine - I think there’s real animosity there in part because Christie sees Lonegan as a nutbar and gadfly who’s likely to hurt Christie’s own numbers.

Instead, Lonegan’s gotten Palin to stump for him, and any turnout can be attributed to people turning out to see her and not Lonegan on his own merits.

Forgot about Lonegan’s gov run.

That makes Chrisite’s decision to go back on his “No special elections” pledge even funnier: he was just as afraid of Lonegan’s rep hurting him as he was Booker’s.

234 Dr. Matt  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:09:43am

Why is there an NHL game starting at 1:00 on a Monday?

235 GlutenFreeJesus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:11:13am

re: #109 Skip Intro

What about the houses that surround his houses? I guess he’ll have to buy those too.

Maybe he can just buy all of Palo Alto - the good part, anyway - and build a wall surrounded by a moat.

He’s going to have his own Mega City 1 before too long.

236 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:11:17am

re: #230 Carlos Danger

[Embedded content]

Fingers crossed. Will also try to remember the old saw that “A good compromise leaves everyone chewing glass and setting goldfish on fire.”

Or something like that.

237 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:11:17am

re: #234 Dr. Matt

Why is there an NHL game starting at 1:00 on a Monday?

Columbus Day, I’d guess.

NBA does afternoon games on MLK Day. I’d assume this is something similar.

238 erik_t  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:11:29am

re: #230 Carlos Danger

With God as my witness, if we see a good no-hostages no-terrible-concessions deal I might go home at lunch and throw a fucking party.

239 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:12:10am

re: #224 Skip Intro

Those of us in California are still paying for the energy disaster Enron caused.

On purpose, I should have said.

240 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:12:11am

re: #233 Mattand

Forgot about Lonegan’s gov run.

That makes Chrisite’s decision to go back on his “No special elections” pledge even funnier: he was just as afraid of Lonegan’s rep hurting him as he was Booker’s.

I think Christie and Booker have a wink-nod deal not to campaign/race against the other, even if it’s via surrogates. They’re both looking at higher office in the future, and figure that this way helps both out.

That and the fact that they’re both friendly towards the other and would probably work quite well with each other, as compared to the nonstop bickering as between Christie and Lautenberg and Menendez.

241 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:12:23am

re: #238 erik_t

With God as my witness, if we see a good no-hostages no-terrible-concessions deal I might go home at lunch and throw a fucking party.

I’ll bring the beer.

242 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:13:12am

re: #236 Mattand

Fingers crossed. Will also try to remember the old saw that “A good compromise leaves everyone chewing glass and setting goldfish on fire.”

Or something like that.

Whatever the “compromise” is, it’ll probably be more trouble than it was worth for the Republicans.

243 Dr. Matt  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:13:42am

re: #237 makeitstop

Columbus Day, I’d guess.

Ah. Didn’t even realize it was a “holiday”. Do people actually get C-bus Day off?

244 brennant  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:13:47am

re: #238 erik_t

With God as my witness, if we see a good no-hostages no-terrible-concessions deal I might go home at lunch and throw a fucking party.

Ugh. Any concessions on this will infuriate me to no end. Once again, the GOP gets something for taking hostages. They should get nothing.

245 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:15:09am

re: #234 Dr. Matt

Why is there an NHL game starting at 1:00 on a Monday?

People often forget that Columbus invented the power play.

246 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:18:06am

re: #230 Carlos Danger

[Embedded content]

Time is running out. Any bipartisan agreement needs to come together very soon - either Monday or Tuesday - or else the nation runs a serious risk of running out of the ability to borrow money as soon as Thursday. In 2011, a last-minute deal to lift the debt limit resulted in a credit downgrade of U.S. debt.

And the Orange Boner still has to find where the GOP hid his balls to get his pack of crazed loons to sign on.

247 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:19:11am

re: #238 erik_t

With God as my witness, if we see a good no-hostages no-terrible-concessions deal I might go home at lunch and throw a fucking party.

The deal as I understand it says we’ll all go through this again in six months.

248 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:19:51am

re: #230 Carlos Danger

[Embedded content]

I notice that CNN is referring to all of this as a “partial” shutdown.

You know, CNN, if you want to call it a “slimdown” like your heroes at Fox, just do it.

249 makeitstop  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:20:01am

re: #243 Dr. Matt

Ah. Didn’t even realize it was a “holiday”. Do people actually get C-bus Day off?

Not me. However, I’m noticing a slowdown in client contact today, so I’ll assume some of those slackers took the day off.

250 erik_t  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:20:42am

re: #247 Skip Intro

The deal as I understand it says we’ll all go through this again in six months.

My prayer is that while Boehner may not have enough power in his caucus to make them blink with the cards on the table, he may have enough clue and power to be able to hide the deck.

251 ProTARDISLiberal  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:20:43am

re: #248 Mattand

Wolf was likely behind that change.

Dumbest name in news.

252 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:21:56am

re: #251 ProTARDISLiberal

Wolf was likely behind that change.

Dumbest name in news.

I doubt Wolf has a say in that. He’s still pathetic though.

253 erik_t  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:22:29am

re: #244 brennant

Ugh. Any concessions on this will infuriate me to no end. Once again, the GOP gets something for taking hostages. They should get nothing.

While I agree in principle, I’m too scared and chickenshit to be willing to burn down the world economy over the medical device tax. This is me blinking.

I am a Democrat, and I admit that I am part of the problem.

254 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:23:18am

You know, it’s frustrating. I actually looked for a job with the feds because I thought gee the federal government is stable at least. Need to think of a backup plan on what to do if the Republicans are gonna to continue to throw temper tantrums everytime there’s a Dem in the WH who doesn’t cave into their whiny bs.

255 Eventual Carrion  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:25:50am

re: #212 kirkspencer

Here’s the iron of the issue to me: Causing a default can be argued (has been in international law) to be a form of rebellion. Rebellion triggers not only the suspension clause (article I section 9) but several laws involving the posse comitatus and insurrection acts.

In short, their behavior may make the president a dictator.

[snip]
(B) opposes or obstructs the execution of the laws of the United States or impedes the course of justice under those laws.

Hmmm, obstructing the execution of the laws of the United States. Again, Hmmmm

256 Snarknado!  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:25:57am

re: #254 HappyWarrior

It looks like this time (same as last time) federal employees will get paid for not working (although what they’ll have to do to make up for the time they lost will probably justify the salary). If this pattern continues, you just need to have contingency funds for when your salary is delayed every other year or so.

257 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:26:22am

re: #203 HappyWarrior

Karl had an excellent analysis of capitalism, imperialism and society as it existed in his day. Much if it is still very applicable. Pity his pie in the sky Utopianism for solutions got taken seriously before being massively twisted by Engels, Lenin, etc.

Compared to her though, he was a thoughtful pragmatic voice of moderation.

258 b.d.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:26:23am

If there is a deal I think I’ll log off of the intertubes for a while because no matter how good it is the DUdebros will cry CAVE!!!!

EIther log off of wade over to RedState or FreeRepublic and watch them wail.

259 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:28:14am

re: #258 b.d.

If there is a deal I think I’ll log off of the intertubes for a while because no matter how good it is the DUdebros will cry CAVE!!!!

EIther log off of wade over to RedState or FreeRepublic and watch them wail.

BY the way, the top post on Red State right now reads

As Mitch McConnell puts the finishing touches on his terms of surrender…

lol

260 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:28:34am

re: #256 Snarknado!

It looks like this time (same as last time) federal employees will get paid for not working (although what they’ll have to do to make up for the time they lost will probably justify the salary). If this pattern continues, you just need to have contingency funds for when your salary is delayed every other year or so.

Right. Well my Catch-22 is I just got a job literally like a month before the shutdown. Had gone in for fingerprints and photo, all that jazz. Hell feds had even sent out the reference doc to my references. Limbo sucks.

261 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:29:01am

re: #259 Carlos Danger

BY the way, the top post on Red State right now reads

lol

Yawn.

262 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:29:37am

re: #257 William Barnett-Lewis

Karl’s had an excellent analysis of capitalism, imperialism and society as it existed in his day. Much if it is still very applicable. Pity his pie in the sky Utopianism for solutions got taken seriously before being massively twisted by Engels, Lenin, etc.

Compared to her though, he was a thoughtful pragmatic voice of moderation.

He did and I think people who blindly oppose socialism want to ignore the conditions that led to Marx and Engels writing about what they did.

263 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:30:42am

re: #260 HappyWarrior

Right. Well my Catch-22 is I just got a job literally like a month before the shutdown. Had gone in for fingerprints and photo, all that jazz. Hell feds had even sent out the reference doc to my references. Limbo sucks.

I had to submit for my security clearance review in the last few weeks. Its sitting out there in limbo right now.

264 Stoatly  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:31:22am

re: #4 William Barnett-Lewis

Kipling was a strange man himself, a good middle class imperialist and poet, but lose his fake accent and read his works in straight English? Aye, then Tommy and Joe and Hans and Ivan and all the rest of the misused soldiers are there in their best light.

He learnt the price often paid in the most bitter way: his son, barely 18 years old died in his first action on the Western Front in 1915. Kipling had pulled strings to get him into the army (he was physically unqualified IIRC) and both parents supported the war against Germany and had talked of the necessity of sacrifice.

Kipling’s Epitaphs of the War are usually read as being haunted by that death:


An Only Son
I have slain none except my Mother.
She (Blessing her slayer) died of grief for me.


Common Form
If any question why we died,
Tell them, because our fathers lied.


A Dead Statesman
I could not dig: I dared not rob:
Therefore I lied to please the mob.
Now all my lies are proved untrue
And I must face the men I slew.
What tale shall serve me here among
Mine angry and defrauded young?

265 ProTARDISLiberal  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:33:30am

re: #261 HappyWarrior

Part of me is real tempted to go over there and call them all traitors.

266 Stephen T.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:34:01am

re: #127 Varek Raith

GOPer calls for ‘four’ branches to work together

Ok, shoot me now.
Kthx.

Not only does he not know the correct number of branches of government, he also can’t use the proper tense of the verb “run”

Improper conjugation really irks me. This particular mistake makes me cringe.

267 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:34:20am

re: #265 ProTARDISLiberal

Part of me is real tempted to go over there and call them all traitors.

If you want to do that, go for it. I’ll just sit here and laugh at how blindly partisan the goatfucking child molester is.

268 Snarknado!  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:34:25am

re: #260 HappyWarrior

re: #263 Kragar

Indeed it does. Even if you’re waiting to see if your financial plans for life after retirement are about to be derailed by Congressional (in)action.

269 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:34:36am

Ted Cruz thinks he’s on a mission from God

Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX) said over the weekend that he had prayed to God to guide him in the shutdown fight and was sure that “his will be done as I know it will be.”

At the Values Voter Summit over the weekend, CBN’s David Brody spoke with Cruz about his role in instigating the government shutdown, which has been seen as complicating debt limit negotiations.

“Where do you see God in all of this fight that’s going on in your life right now?” Brody asked the Texas senator.

“Well, David, you know at every stage, my prayer to God is that His will be done,” Cruz insisted. “As it will be.”

270 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:35:37am

re: #269 Kragar

Ted Cruz thinks he’s on a mission from God


Chuck Todd Tears Into Ted Cruz: ‘What Planet Are You Living On?!’

huffingtonpost.com

271 ProTARDISLiberal  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:35:43am

re: #267 HappyWarrior

And the goat-fucking child molester is?

272 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:35:57am

re: #268 Snarknado!

Indeed it does. Even if you’re waiting to see if your financial plans for life after retirement are about to be derailed by Congressional (in)action.

At this point, I’m waiting to pledge my allegiance to the NCR.
/

273 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:36:40am

re: #271 ProTARDISLiberal

And the goat-fucking child molester is?

Heh Erickson. He called Roberts that.

274 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:36:54am

re: #269 Kragar

Ted Cruz thinks he’s on a mission from God

Fer God’s sake, get this man some dark glasses, a pack of Marlboros and a half-tank of Gas and get out of his way…

275 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:37:23am

re: #269 Kragar

Ted Cruz thinks he’s on a mission from God

Oh great, another religious lunatic who thinks he’s doing Gods work. Fuck off Ted please. You’re making Rand Paul look like a voice of reason. Do you know how fucking hard that is!

276 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:38:14am

This is where we stand.

The TP/GOP extortionists think it’s Obama who’s engaging in extortion - to raise the debt ceiling by $1.1t (see the latest Breitbart crapola), and that he’s demanding that the GOP cave to all Democrats’ demands.

Meanwhile, anyone with functioning logic and reasoning would point out that the Constitution and the facts and circumstances of this particular economic and political crisis all point to the Congress and the GOP in particular as the root cause of the crisis for failing to pass a budget and raising the debt ceiling because the House GOP leadership has chosen to stick with the TP extortionists.

But for Boehner’s choice to back out of a deal on the budget in July that would have cut spending and put a budget in place by choosing the GOP’s single-minded determination to destroy Obamacare even though it has no reasonable chance of success (by voting, courts, etc.) and therefore resorted to extortion we would not be in the position we’re in now.

The GOP decided that this would be their last stand. And when given the opportunity to retire from this particular field of battle, they’re right back at making demands that makes anyone think that they still aren’t right in the head. They’re in no position to make demands or force concessions given that they’re in the untenable position of trying to use economic chaos of their own design and intent to score political points.

Yet, that’s where we’re heading - with a default looming.

277 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:39:04am

re: #275 HappyWarrior

It never fails to amaze me that God always tells them exactly what they already believed.

It’s a miracle!

278 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:39:24am

re: #269 Kragar

Remind me again how Nancy Reagan was “crazy” for consulting and astrologer about china patterns (I know not really but in the scope of policy decisions it may as well have been)…but this asshat is virtuous… .and has a direct line to God…

279 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:39:50am

re: #277 Skip Intro

It never fails to amaze me that God always tells them exactly what they already believed.

It’s a miracle!

I like how God told them all to run for president. I think they were talking to Loki instead.

280 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:40:31am

re: #278 DisturbedEma

Remind me again how Nancy Reagan was “crazy” for consulting and astrologer about china patterns (I know not really but in the scope of policy decisions it may as well have been)…but this asshat is virtuous… .and has a direct line to God…

Because sadly the latter is mainstream and the former is not.

281 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:40:31am

re: #277 Skip Intro


TRUTH…umm if you believe in that sort of thing…:)

282 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:41:30am

re: #277 Skip Intro

It never fails to amaze me that God always tells them exactly what they already believed.

It’s a miracle!

“Well, I wasn’t sure I’d be able to score the touchdown, but Jesus decided to screw the sick, the poor, and the downtrodden so I could win a football game. Thanks Jesus!”

283 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:41:48am

re: #280 HappyWarrior

Imma gonna take my chances with the stars…just saying, and that is mad crazy since I have one of those birthdays that falls into 2 categories… .yep living on the edge…:)

284 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:42:14am

“God thought my presidential aspirations even though I’m a fringe nut mattered more than starving kids in the third world.”

285 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:43:23am

re: #283 DisturbedEma

Imma gonna take my chances with the stars…just saying, and that is mad crazy since I have one of those birthdays that falls into 2 categories… .yep living on the edge…:)

you mean you’re not going to take a thousands of years old book literally? Heathen!

286 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:43:41am

You can tell a lot about a person by the company he keeps.

Any God who talks directly to David Barton, Mike Huckabee, Sarah Palin, Ted Cruz, etc etc sounds like an enormous asshole who I want nothing to do with.

287 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:44:10am

re: #285 HappyWarrior

Yea verily;)

288 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:44:27am

re: #277 Skip Intro

It never fails to amaze me that God always tells them exactly what they already believed.

It’s a miracle!

God apparently told three or four of the GOP’s potential candidates for 2012 to run.

Clearly only one of them could succeed in the primary.

I guess God was just fucking with the rest of ‘em. Maybe I’m a strange person, but I don’t much see the wisdom of worshiping a deity that would engage in such childish pranking of his most devoted supplicants.

It’s one thing for a full-grown adult human to have an imaginary friend in the sky. It’s quite another for a full-grown adult human to buy into an obvious scam over and over and over again, never learning their lessons.

289 b.d.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:44:36am

re: #286 Kragar

You can tell a lot about a person by the company he keeps.

Any God who talks directly to David Barton, Mike Huckabee, Sarah Palin, Ted Cruz, etc etc sounds like an enormous asshole who I want nothing to do with.

I happen to like a God with a sense of humor.

290 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:44:39am

re: #278 DisturbedEma

Remind me again how Nancy Reagan was “crazy” for consulting and astrologer about china patterns (I know not really but in the scope of policy decisions it may as well have been)…but this asshat is virtuous… .and has a direct line to God…

It has a lot to do with Nancy and her White House Astrologer. The Religious Right was pretty incensed that Reagan courted their support so closely but once in power allowed a heathen idolatress to determine the very china off which he ate.

They have spent the whole time since working to get their people in power in all aspects of society: business, administration, education and, of course politics, namely hijacking the GOP and using it to hole the entire nation hostage to their agenda.

291 jaunte  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:45:20am

re: #259 Carlos Danger

BY the way, the top post on Red State right now reads

lol

BY the way, the top post on Red State right now reads

As Mitch McConnell puts the finishing touches on his terms of surrender…

They’re going to turn General Lee’s Arlington into a national cemetery!!!

292 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:45:49am
293 Dr. Matt  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:46:00am

Navy floods dry dock around USS Gerald R. Ford aircraft carrier ahead of Nov. 9 christening

mlive.com

294 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:47:19am
295 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:48:36am

re: #288 GunstarGreen

Why does God need a starship? /

296 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:49:15am

re: #294 Kragar

[Embedded content]

This ain’t good news.

297 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:50:11am

Even if they come to a deal there’s Ted Cruz AND the House GOP in the way.

Do you feel lucky, punk?

298 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:50:14am

re: #290 Sol Berdinowitz


The point you make is of course, spot on. It’s hard for me to remember this time and NOT also remember Jim and Tammy Faye, Swaggert, Falwell, and of course Oral Roberts and his announcement that if he didn’t raise X amount of dollars, God would call him home…

299 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:50:35am

re: #295 lawhawk

EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!

300 The Ghost of a Flea  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:50:49am

re: #285 HappyWarrior

you mean you’re not going to take a thousands of years old book literally? Heathen!

For certain definitions of “literally” where:

- A seven-headed beast rising out the sea can be a black guy in the Oval Office.
- Where prophecies regarding Israel now hinge upon the actions of its new friend Poochy the USA.
- All that stuff Jesus said about treating poor people well and abandonning attachment to worldly things is about after Jesus comes back. Right now, say the magic words.
- Jesus wasn’t a Jew talking to Jews.
- “You shall not know the hour or the day” has an asterisk after it, and a footnote reads “except those Protestant evangelical chaps…buy all of their assorted End Times materials.”

[With a nod to Fred Clark, aka Slacktivist, who rights about this stuff from the inside.]

301 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:51:18am

re: #295 lawhawk


Too many people are of the “when the Almighty asks you for something…” camp!

302 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:52:30am

re: #301 DisturbedEma

Too many people are of the “when the Almighty asks you for something…” camp!

Whenever that happens to me, I change my meds.

303 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:53:00am

re: #300 The Ghost of a Flea

For certain definitions of “literally” where:

- A seven-headed beast rising out the sea can be a black guy in the Oval Office.
- Where prophecies regarding Israel now hinge upon the actions of its new friend Poochy the USA.
- All that stuff Jesus said about treating poor people well and abandonning attachment to worldly things is about after Jesus comes back. Right now, say the magic words.
- Jesus wasn’t a Jew talking to Jews.
- “You shall not know the hour or the day” has an asterisk after it, and a footnote reads “except those Protestant evangelical chaps…buy all of their assorted End Times materials.”

[With a nod to Fred Clark, aka Slacktivist, who rights about this stuff from the inside.]

The irony of irony though is when they bitch about people selectively interpreting scripture i.e. liberal Christians when these are the people who think the Bible gives them the right to own unlimited fire arms pr for society to be purely capitalistic.

304 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:53:09am

re: #302 Skip Intro


I can’t change, I have Obamacare, I takes what they give me…/// :)

305 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:54:18am

re: #234 Dr. Matt

Why is there an NHL game starting at 1:00 on a Monday?

Canadian Thanksgiving.

306 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:54:29am

re: #303 HappyWarrior

Like the gay marriage thing? I’ve look for the prohibition against Adam and Steve, but I can see no description of Adam and Eve’s actual wedding, much less anything having to do with Steve…:)

307 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:55:05am

I keep tellling you guys that you need to register Republican. Just because you’re registered doesn’t mean you have to vote for them in November, but the Republicans need you, they just don’t know it.

308 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:55:39am

re: #306 DisturbedEma

Like the gay marriage thing? I’ve look for the prohibition against Adam and Steve, but I can see no description of Adam and Eve’s actual wedding, much less anything having to do with Steve…:)

Precisely. Though my whole argument is why the hell should we be using the Bible to dictate secular law because using the Bible to dictate law went over so well in the past but then again I remember that these are the people who thought the Crusades were awesome.

309 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:55:49am

re: #301 DisturbedEma

Too many people are of the “when the Almighty asks you for something…” camp!

If he’s Almighty, why does he need to ask?

310 Snarknado!  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:56:21am

re: #300 The Ghost of a Flea

[With a nod to Fred Clark, aka Slacktivist, who rights about this stuff from the inside.]

…not wanting to be left behind.

311 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:56:59am

re: #301 DisturbedEma

The Almighty tells me he can get me out of this mess, but he’s pretty sure you’re fooked. /Stephen

312 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:57:46am

re: #309 Kragar

Amen! I actually loved that movie for that plot, and the quote Kirk gives about pain, how he needs it, because it makes him…not a great movies but oh those moments…

313 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 10:58:45am

re: #311 lawhawk


Yes, the “He loves me more than he loves you” line…so used to it…:)

314 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:00:24am

Is God willing to prevent Evil, but not able? Then he is impotent.
Is God able to prevent Evil, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is God willing and able to prevent Evil? Then why is there Evil?
Is God neither willing nor able to prevent Evil? Then why call him God?

315 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:01:32am

The GOP is winning Arkansas!!

A new Talk Business-Hendrix College survey in Arkansas finds more voters blame President Obama than Republicans for the government shutdown, 40% to 35%.

Take that, libs!

316 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:01:38am

re: #314 GunstarGreen

Excellent…

317 dog philosopher  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:01:46am

Cruz Explains Remarks At Vet Protest Meant To Provide Massive Infusion Of Irony Into American’s Irony-Poor Bloodstream

says “let britain keep its silly walks and humorous understatement, america always has and always will be a nation that thrives on irony and absurdism”

Physicians Note Cruz’s Action May Lead To Hemochromotosis

318 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:02:31am

re: #315 Carlos Danger

The GOP is winning Arkansas!!

Take that, libs!

Next you’ll tell me that they’re winning West Virginia.

319 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:02:34am

“When it comes to bullshit, big-time, major league bullshit, you have to stand in awe of the all-time champion of false promises and exaggerated claims, religion. No contest. No contest. Religion. Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there’s an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever ‘til the end of time!

But He loves you. He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He’s all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can’t handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, you talk about a good bullshit story. Holy Shit! “

-George Carlin

320 dog philosopher  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:02:57am

re: #314 GunstarGreen

Is God willing to prevent Evil, but not able? Then he is impotent.
Is God able to prevent Evil, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is God willing and able to prevent Evil? Then why is there Evil?
Is God neither willing nor able to prevent Evil? Then why call him God?

aha it’s the old Problem Of EEEbils

321 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:04:56am

re: #319 Kragar

While I certainly hold religions in plenty of contempt, I never heard a religious person say that God needs money. And anybody who reached the second grade knows that religion is about more than ten rules.

322 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:05:21am

Apparently, Jennifer Rubin has been kidnapped and replaced by someone who ISN’T a moron.

There’s not a thing in there I can disagree with. Blind pig, acorn; stopped clock, etc.

323 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:05:38am

re: #305 Eclectic Cyborg

Canadian Thanksgiving.

Actually it’s a Boston/Detroit game being billed as a Columbus Day Matinee.

Dumb Bettman.

324 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:06:42am

re: #321 SteveMcGazi

While I certainly hold religions in plenty of contempt, I never heard a religious person say that God needs money. And anybody who reached the second grade knows that religion is about more than ten rules.

Would that be “no true religious person”?

325 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:07:09am

re: #319 Kragar

“When it comes to bullshit, big-time, major league bullshit, you have to stand in awe of the all-time champion of false promises and exaggerated claims, religion. No contest. No contest. Religion. Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there’s an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever ‘til the end of time!

But He loves you. He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He’s all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can’t handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, you talk about a good bullshit story. Holy Shit! “

-George Carlin

Yes, GC forgot to also say: The best job in the world, for which you need absolutely no training (although many fake it), can live off others who will keep up your church, your residence, give you a salary and car, and all they ask is that you tell them how to live—or else.

326 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:08:01am
327 Dancing along the light of day  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:08:32am

re: #106 darthstar

This gal will be across the street from my house next week.

[Embedded content]

Pictures, pretty please?

328 Lidane  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:09:31am
329 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:10:23am

re: #328 Lidane

[Embedded content]

BURN THE APOSTATE!!!!! PRIMARY HIM!!!!

330 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:10:26am

re: #324 Kragar

I’ve heard plenty of them say they need money to do God’s work. Some of them actually DO God’s work. I don’t know what point Carlin was trying to make. Religions have more than their share of charlatans and crooks. Don’t you think he could have made a better effort than that?

331 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:10:55am

re: #328 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Every time I see that name “Klayman”, it just brings up images of Klansman.

332 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:10:55am

re: #328 Lidane

They keep using that word (repudiate) I do not think it means what they think in means…

333 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:11:11am

re: #330 SteveMcGazi

I’ve heard plenty of them say they need money to do God’s work. Some of them actually DO God’s work. I don’t know what point Carlin was trying to make. Religions have more than their share of charlatans and crooks. Don’t you think he could have made a better effort than that?

Nope.

334 b.d.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:12:13am

re: #329 GeneJockey

BURN THE APOSTATE!!!!! PRIMARY HIM!!!!

RINOgell

335 GlutenFreeJesus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:12:40am

Speaking of religion:

Youtube Video

336 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:13:00am

re: #330 SteveMcGazi

I’ve heard plenty of them say they need money to do God’s work. Some of them actually DO God’s work. I don’t know what point Carlin was trying to make. Religions have more than their share of charlatans and crooks. Don’t you think he could have made a better effort than that?

I think his point is pretty clear that pretty much the whole idea of religion is a con. First we create a need (the afterlife), then fill it (Believe in our invisible friend, and you get the good stuff. DON’T believe, and you’ll burn forever).

337 dog philosopher  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:13:03am

re: #328 Lidane

GOP Rep. Rigell denounces Klayman’s call to wage an uprising

…quotes from martin luther’s “against the murderous, thieving hordes of peasants”

338 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:13:13am

re: #333 Kragar

You do realize that there are religions which don’t envision a guy who lives in the sky and watches over us, and religions that don’t have a list of ten rules, and that there are religions that don’t have a heaven and hell?

339 dog philosopher  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:13:49am

re: #332 DisturbedEma

They keep using that word (repudiate) I do not think it means what they think in means…

you elitists and your so-called “dictionaries”

340 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:14:34am

I think Carlin and you guys have confused religion with church.

341 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:15:13am

re: #339 dog philosopher

Curses! Foiled again…:)

342 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:15:33am


Will the clever among us please… pretty please…. submit questions…. this should be good for a laugh or two.

343 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:15:37am

re: #338 SteveMcGazi

You do realize that there are religions which don’t envision a guy who lives in the sky and watches over us, and religions that don’t have a list of ten rules, and that there are religions that don’t have a heaven and hell?

You do realize Carlin based his act around his life and his experiences, and that he attended a Catholic school?

344 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:15:42am

re: #340 SteveMcGazi

I think Carlin and you guys have confused religion with church.

No, what we’re NOT doing is confusing ‘religion’ with ‘faith’.

345 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:16:03am

re: #340 SteveMcGazi

With all due respect- I think you are confusing my spirituality with religion…

346 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:16:24am

re: #338 SteveMcGazi

You do realize that there are religions which don’t envision a guy who lives in the sky and watches over us, and religions that don’t have a list of ten rules, and that there are religions that don’t have a heaven and hell?

While this is true, speaking of religion in the context of the United States in general is necessarily speaking of religion of various judeo-christian flavors. There do exist buddhists and etc. in the US, but not in numbers anywhere close to significant enough to be implied as the subject one’s speaking about in that context.

347 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:16:57am
348 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:17:03am

re: #342 lawhawk

[Embedded content]


Will the clever among us please… pretty please…. submit questions…. this should be good for a laugh or two.

Ask him why gold, which only has value because people say it has value, is any different from a fiat currency, which only has value because people say it has value.

349 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:17:40am

re: #346 GunstarGreen


As the yowling asshats who are constantly demanding that the President reveal his “true religion” illustrate all too well…

350 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:18:12am

re: #347 Gus


Mr. God…tear down this wall!

351 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:18:28am

re: #348 GeneJockey

Ask him why gold, which only has value because people say it has value, is any different from a fiat currency, which only has value because people say it has value.

Because once the apocalypse goes down, you can, like use all of that stockpiled gold for like, semiconductors and cable tips and shit.

352 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:18:39am

re: #343 Kragar

So did I. Grade school, high school, and a Catholic University. Maybe George never heard of Hinduism or Buddhism. Maybe George didn’t know that Christians work very hard to feed homeless people, that they even travel overseas to tend to the sick and starving. He went for the cheap shot and did it half assed.

353 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:19:11am

re: #348 GeneJockey


Umm, boxers or briefs…that’s all I got ;)

354 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:19:13am

re: #350 DisturbedEma

Mr. God…tear down this wall!

God will send His mind-beams down to Earth which will enable Democrats and Republicans to live in harmony. Always works.

355 Amory Blaine  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:20:09am

I wonder how many survivalists are counting their canned goods right this minute.

356 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:20:15am

Projection on the Greatest IMAX the World Has Ever Known:

357 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:20:20am

re: #352 SteveMcGazi

So did I. Grade school, high school, and a Catholic University. Maybe George never heard of Hinduism or Buddhism. Maybe George didn’t know that Christians work very hard to feed homeless people, that they even travel overseas to tend to the sick and starving. He went for the cheap shot and did it half assed.

You really have a thing against George Carlin, I see.

358 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:20:21am

re: #353 DisturbedEma

Umm, boxers or briefs…that’s all I got ;)

Depends.

359 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:20:33am

In the future George Carlin will be relegated to the dustbin of history just like Christopher Columbus.

//

360 The Ghost of a Flea  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:20:50am

Wonkette’s coverage of the 1 Million Vet thing is much less forgiving.

And I agree.

I posted very late at night, and was waiting to see if anything developed.

As of noon today, I find that it’s really weak sauce that they won’t name names, or decry the specific positions that they object to (say, for example, the slurring of the President and of Muslims in general?).

There is such a thing as principled nonpartisanship, where you say “we are not political, and we do not stand for this political thing that was said.” Indeed, the only way to maintain nonpartisanship is to have an articulate platform and back it up by constantly saying “No, we do not stand for this other thing.”

361 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:20:51am

re: #351 GunstarGreen

Because once the apocalypse goes down, you can, like use all of that stockpiled gold for like, semiconductors and cable tips and shit.

But that would indicate that the value of sand is much higher since it can be used in electronics, castings, and help generate power via solar cells, etc.

We don’t hear anyone calling for pegging the dollar to sand, so there’s something more intrinsic about gold. Either that, or Rand Paul is really Auric Goldfinger. After all, we’ve never seen them both in the same place at the same time. /

362 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:20:59am

re: #354 Gus

You have naught to lose but the tin hats that bind you…

363 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:21:11am

re: #357 Kragar

You really have a thing against George Carlin, I see.

Because I criticized one riff? Get real.

364 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:21:15am

Along with Bugs Bunny cartoons and Teddy Roosevelt who ordered the massacre in the Philippines.

365 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:21:43am

re: #358 GeneJockey

better than commando :)

366 b.d.  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:21:57am

re: #332 DisturbedEma

They keep using that word (repudiate) I do not think it means what they think in means…

[sarah palin] the word is refudiate [/sarah palin]

367 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:21:58am

re: #361 lawhawk

But that would indicate that the value of sand is much higher since it can be used in electronics, castings, and help generate power via solar cells, etc.

We don’t hear anyone calling for pegging the dollar to sand, so there’s something more intrinsic about gold. Either that, or Rand Paul is really Auric Goldfinger. After all, we’ve never seen them both in the same place at the same time. /

“Consider your next witticism carefully, it may be your last.”

368 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:22:36am

re: #366 b.d.

ranch on the side of her word salad…

369 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:22:48am

re: #365 DisturbedEma

better than commando :)

I was going to say that, but discretion is the better part of ‘Oh HAELLL no!’

370 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:22:53am

Anthropologists discover Charles Darwin’s Tweets. He was mean and a bully and once said Greenwald was melodramatic. Schools shun and ban his work in response.

//

371 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:23:30am

re: #369 GeneJockey

I’ll go there for you…:)

372 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:23:58am

re: #361 lawhawk

But that would indicate that the value of sand is much higher since it can be used in electronics, castings, and help generate power via solar cells, etc.

We don’t hear anyone calling for pegging the dollar to sand, so there’s something more intrinsic about gold. Either that, or Rand Paul is really Auric Goldfinger. After all, we’ve never seen them both in the same place at the same time. /

It’s prettier than sand.

373 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:24:31am

re: #352 SteveMcGazi

So did I. Grade school, high school, and a Catholic University. Maybe George never heard of Hinduism or Buddhism. Maybe George didn’t know that Christians work very hard to feed homeless people, that they even travel overseas to tend to the sick and starving. He went for the cheap shot and did it half assed.

But do they do those things because they are religious, or because they are decent people? What about people that do those things but don’t subscribe to any religious belief system? What about people that DO subscribe to a religious belief system, but don’t do those things (which were the sort of people Carlin was talking about)?

I of course believe that people are free to believe in whatever fairy tales they choose to believe in. If that’s what help them get through the day, more power to them — everyone finds their own way. But I also believe that people should strive to be decent human beings for the sake of being decent human beings, not because any deity or deities or ancestors or earth spirits or anything else told them to. I believe that people should strive to be decent human beings because it’s the right thing to do, not because they’ll be punished for all eternity if they don’t. I believe that people should strive to be decent human beings because that’s how they’d like other people to treat them, not because it’s a requirement for getting into a higher tier of existence on the next go-around.

I would like to believe that people do good works towards their fellow people because that’s what they want to do, not because that’s what their religion compels them to do.

374 piratedan  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:26:52am

re: #363 SteveMcGazi

well you asked for it….

here are the people that we’re confronted with everyday in our media:

Brian Fischer
Pat Robertson
Westboro Baptist
The Catholic Church and Pedophile Priests
Billy Graham


I’m not saying that there aren’t devout people of all stripes out there doing good deeds quietly in the name of whichever faith that they choose to follow, but those people aren’t being represented in the media, the list I have above ARE.

375 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:27:25am

re: #373 GunstarGreen

I would like to believe that people do good works towards their fellow people because that’s what they want to do, not because that’s what their religion compels them to do.

Indeed, my primary response to “Atheists are immoral because they don’t answer to a higher power” is to point out that if you only do or do not do things because of an expectation of reward or fear of punishment, your morality is at the level of a toddler.

376 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:27:27am

re: #373 GunstarGreen

There is also the question of motivation; is it somehow more noble to do good works, mitzvahs and the like when you are Jewish (like me) without a conceptual heaven? Is it virtuous to practice benevolence because you fear hell? Or selfish…

377 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:30:16am

re: #376 DisturbedEma

There is also the question of motivation; is it somehow more noble to do good works, mitzvahs and the like when you are Jewish (like me) without a conceptual heaven? Is it virtuous to practice benevolence because you fear hell? Or selfish…

Ooops posted too quick- I know I do as much as I can for Tzedakah, but I don’t have a ton of resources fiscal or otherwise…and my “reward” if that’s the word, is knowing I helped, not a frequent flier type reward toward my place in heaven…is that suspect? Noble? None of the above?

378 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:30:23am

re: #374 piratedan

well you asked for it….

here are the people that we’re confronted with everyday in our media:

Brian Fischer
Pat Robertson
Westboro Baptist
The Catholic Church and Pedophile Priests
Billy Graham

I’m not saying that there aren’t devout people of all stripes out there doing good deeds quietly in the name of whichever faith that they choose to follow, but those people aren’t being represented in the media, the list I have above IS.

Well, the assholes who use religiosity to justify being assholes dominate the media because they crave attention.

People who are doing god works out of love for their fellow humans, and because they are following G-D’s commands, tend to be modest about their accomplishments and shun the spotlight.

379 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:31:04am

re: #347 Gus

[Embedded content]

When is the GOP going to replace that libtard hack with a real minister, like Bryan Fischer?

380 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:31:24am

re: #375 GeneJockey

Morality is separate from religiosity?? mind blown…:)

381 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:31:56am

re: #376 DisturbedEma

There is also the question of motivation; is it somehow more noble to do good works, mitzvahs and the like when you are Jewish (like me) without a conceptual heaven? Is it virtuous to practice benevolence because you fear hell? Or selfish…

Pirkei Avot 1:3

Antignos of Socho received the tradition from Shimon the Righteous. He would say: Do not be as servants, who serve their master for the sake of reward. Rather, be as servants who serve their master not for the sake of reward [but for the deed itself]. And the fear of Heaven should be upon you.

382 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:32:32am

Breaking. Nuclear medicine involves radioactive stuff. Run for the hills!

//

383 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:32:34am

re: #379 Skip Intro


After Breibart’s Beautification…did I guess right??

384 jaunte  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:32:54am

SQUIRREL!

385 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:34:01am

re: #381 Vicious Babushka

As I typed my post I thought I recognized something from my past readings on this subject- suffice to say I am trying to reconcile my religious life to my actual life…thank you for this

386 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:34:10am

*HEADDESK*

387 Schadenboner  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:34:12am

re: #6 Vicious Babushka

(Cross-posting from the actual story-site, hope that’s ok)

Amid all the various idiocies of the right this sort of thing is among the few that actually make me angry.

The willingness of hucksters to prey on their customers (by and large low-information, lower-to-lower-middle income people who feel large amounts of fear and confusion from the changes in society and the economy over the last ~40 years) with sales pitches this cruel speaks to nothing but the huckers’ deep sadism.

388 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:34:30am

No spoilers but the Red Shirts on Walking Dead are getting easy to spot. I really want to like the series but the writing and plot lines are frustrating. They are starting to rely on some predictable crutches. I find myself still watching hoping that certain characters will be killed off in hopes it will improve the story lines.

389 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:35:06am

OK, what did George Carlin say this time.

//

390 jaunte  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:35:11am

re: #386 Vicious Babushka

Still marketing their message to people who never crack open a book.

391 freetoken  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:36:09am

re: #388 Killgore Trout

I gave up after season 2. My patience is just too thin to tolerate dragged out story lines. Sort of like Under the Dome this year, which very quickly turned into a shaggy dog story.

392 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:36:42am

re: #390 jaunte

Still marketing their message to people who never crack open a book.

HURR HURR WE IS TEH PARTY OF LINCOLN!!!1!!!!! DEMS IS TEH REAL RACISTS!!!!!1!!!!

Got yer “party of Lincoln” right here.

393 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:37:32am

re: #390 jaunte

Still marketing their message to people who never crack open a book.

Breaking. The German Luftwaffe was once the air force for the 3rd Reich. Ergo. Something, something.

*Note. This is not a Godwin comparing anyone to the 3rd Reich.

394 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:37:38am

re: #373 GunstarGreen

“But do they do those things because they are religious, or because they are decent people? What about people that do those things but don’t subscribe to any religious belief system?”

You can’t be both? Carlin was singling out religious people.
“I of course believe that people are free to believe in whatever fairy tales they choose to believe in. If that’s what help them get through the day, more power to them — everyone finds their own way.”

All too often God is our projection of our own human values onto a Creator that we cannot know, but about which we can only infer. Some decide that they don’t need to believe in a God. Either way, that’s your business. When some guy says that you need to believe in his god or you’re going to hell, it’ snot religion’s fault, he’s just being territorial. Something like it’s my way or the highway, God says so himself. In spite of Carlin’s rant, I see people of all faiths live side by side without proselytizing at each other. Carlin decided to let the few blanket the many.
Most people who do good work do it because they think it’s the right thing to do. Perhaps it coincides with their religion, perhaps they do it without regard to religion. The fact remains, religion or not, people are free to do them or not to. Whether they believe God makes them do it doesn’t make the sacrifice any less genuine. Even religious people know that they could probably f=do less and think they’re still a good person.

395 jaunte  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:38:04am

re: #392 Vicious Babushka

Plantation P. McPlant!

396 Lidane  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:38:20am
397 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:39:11am

re: #392 Vicious Babushka

Dumbass is dragging his flag on the ground

398 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:39:12am

Why would Matt Barber be opposed to pedophilia and polygamy? It’s sanctioned in the Bible.

399 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:40:14am

re: #396 Lidane

400 erik_t  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:40:27am

re: #397 SteveMcGazi

Dumbass is dragging his flag on the ground

On the ground is where that flag belongs.

401 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:40:31am

re: #388 Killgore Trout

No spoilers but the Red Shirts on Walking Dead are getting easy to spot. I really want to like the series but the writing and plot lines are frustrating. They are starting to rely on some predictable crutches. I find myself still watching hoping that certain characters will be killed off in hopes it will improve the story lines.

Some day, I will see my vision of a TV show based around the antiquities department at Miskatonic university. No character will be safe.

Well, maybe the Dept Chair, Professor Armitage, but he’s always been the Dept Chair, ever since… 1916? Wait that can’t be right…

/dramatic music

402 Skip Intro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:40:31am

re: #388 Killgore Trout

No spoilers but the Red Shirts on Walking Dead are getting easy to spot. I really want to like the series but the writing and plot lines are frustrating. They are starting to rely on some predictable crutches. I find myself still watching hoping that certain characters will be killed off in hopes it will improve the story lines.

Walking Dead is Breaking Bad compared to the hopeless morass Homeland has become this year. They should have just ended it after season 2.

403 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:40:35am
404 erik_t  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:41:17am

re: #398 Vicious Babushka

Why would Matt Barber be opposed to pedophilia and polygamy? It’s sanctioned in the Bible.

@jmattbarber
First comes “gay love,” then comes “gay marriage,” then comes…

Then comes gay baby in the gay baby carriage, if I correctly remember my elementary school rhymes.

405 Lidane  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:41:40am
406 The Ghost of a Flea  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:42:03am

re: #403 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

It’s the Battle Flag, not the Stars and Bars.

Which makes it worse.

407 Amory Blaine  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:42:16am

He’s an amateur. He should have a belt on to help support his flagpoles.

408 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:43:02am

BACK TO BACK DERP

409 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:43:50am

re: #408 Vicious Babushka


Just when you thought it was safe to tweet…

410 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:43:54am
411 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:44:48am

re: #405 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Because food consumption and production was EXACTLY THE SAME in first century Israel as it is today. EXACTLY.

412 Lidane  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:44:52am

True story about The Walking Dead:

The awkward curly haired kid that dies at the end is played by Vincent Martella. He’s the voice of Phineas on the Disney cartoon Phineas & Ferb.

Also I’ve got my theory about why that happened. If I’m right, the world they’re in just got even more dangerous.

413 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:44:57am

Just to wrap up my little thing about George Carlin, I do find it hard to believe he went to catholic school and never heard of the Beatitudes. My junior year at Father judge had a large part of the theology course dedicated to the argument that Jesus came to Earth not to die for our sins (whatever that meant), but to give us the Beatitudes. In short, the argument goes something like:
You guys who are all hung up on the Old Scriptures are kind of missing my Dad’s point. There’s more to righteous living than obeying the ten commandments, and I don’t even know where you came up with some of the stuff that you base your laws on. But if you can abide by these eight simple guidelines, I think we’re good.

414 lawhawk  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:45:49am

re: #406 The Ghost of a Flea

I’ve always associated the term Stars and Bars with the Confederate Flag - the Battle Flag. Guess those were separate and distinct.

415 Killgore Trout  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:46:32am

re: #402 Skip Intro

Walking Dead is Breaking Bad compared to the hopeless morass Homeland has become this year. They should have just ended it after season 2.

I think i’m going to give Boardwalk Empire a try. I’ve seen a bit of it. Well acted and well written.

416 sagehen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:46:44am

re: #306 DisturbedEma

Like the gay marriage thing? I’ve look for the prohibition against Adam and Steve, but I can see no description of Adam and Eve’s actual wedding, much less anything having to do with Steve…:)

That’s that bit in Leviticus, where they say m/m sex is every bit as evil as cheeseburgers. Or, perish the thought, linen/wool blend fabric.

417 Kragar  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:46:53am

re: #412 Lidane

True story about The Walking Dead:

[Embedded content]

Also I’ve got my theory about why that happened. If I’m right, the world they’re in just got even more dangerous.

They said they planned to change things up for Season 4.

418 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:47:07am

re: #414 lawhawk

I’ve always associated the term Stars and Bars with the Confederate Flag - the Battle Flag. Guess those were separate and distinct.

The rebel Battle Flag is more easily recognizable, people would see the “Stars & Bars” and think it was a flag of Texas.

419 jaunte  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:47:10am

re: #415 Killgore Trout

I think i’m going to give Boardwalk Empire a try. I’ve seen a bit of it. Well acted and well written.

It’s exceptionally well done, but very dispiriting.

420 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:47:13am

re: #413 SteveMcGazi

Just to wrap up my little thing about George Carlin, I do find it hard to believe he went to catholic school and never heard of the Beatitudes. My junior year at Father judge had a large part of the theology course dedicated to the argument that Jesus came to Earth not to die for our sins (whatever that meant), but to give us the Beatitudes. In short, the argument goes something like:
You guys who are all hung up on the Old Scriptures are kind of missing my Dad’s point. There’s more to righteous living than obeying the ten commandments, and I don’t even know where you came up with some of the stuff that you base your laws on. But if you can abide by these eight simple guidelines, I think we’re good.

Ummm as someone who is “hung up” on the Torah, I respectfully disagree with your over simplistic and faintly insulting summation…

421 DisturbedEma  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:47:48am

re: #416 sagehen


Right, but I can’t find STEVE anywhere…

422 GunstarGreen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:47:56am

re: #398 Vicious Babushka

Why would Matt Barber be opposed to pedophilia and polygamy? It’s sanctioned in the Bible.

[Embedded content]

“Marriage is a legal contract entered into between consenting adults. This contract confers certain rights, benefits, and responsibilities, and integrates into the letter of the law regarding the United States tax code. How do you propose that children, who are not legally of age to enter into contracts, could suddenly become marriage participants as a result of the legalization of gay marriage? Don’t try to weasel out of it you craven piece of shit, answer the fucking question.”

Of course, that doesn’t fit into 140 characters or less. One of the many reasons I don’t subscribe to twitland.

423 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:48:20am

re: #416 sagehen

That’s that bit in Leviticus, where they say m/m sex is every bit as evil as cheeseburgers. Or, perish the thought, linen/wool blend fabric.

Homosexuality, shatnez and meat/dairy are all mentioned in different context in different locations of scripture, not all together in one place.

424 Mike Lamb  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:49:48am

re: #398 Vicious Babushka

Why would Matt Barber be opposed to pedophilia and polygamy? It’s sanctioned in the Bible.

[Embedded content]

Does this slippery slope clown understand the concept of “consent”? Does he also understand that there are perfectly valid, secular justifications for prohibiting polygamy?

425 Lidane  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:50:05am
426 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:51:09am

re: #420 DisturbedEma

I apologize for the choice of words. My intent was to suggest that Jesus was trying to provide some clarification to what was in the Old Testament (BTW I thought the Torah was the first five books). I tried to sum up in a hurry so I said something stupid.

427 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:51:12am

We should change the name of Columbus Day to Spanish Colonization Day. Would be more accurate then. No?

428 Lidane  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:51:52am
429 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:52:22am

re: #422 GunstarGreen

“Marriage is a legal contract entered into between consenting adults. This contract confers certain rights, benefits, and responsibilities, and integrates into the letter of the law regarding the United States tax code. How do you propose that children, who are not legally of age to enter into contracts, could suddenly become marriage participants as a result of the legalization of gay marriage? Don’t try to weasel out of it you craven piece of shit, answer the fucking question.”

Of course, that doesn’t fit into 140 characters or less. One of the many reasons I don’t subscribe to twitland.

My 14 year old daughter could squeeze that down into 140 characters I bet.

430 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:53:16am

re: #413 SteveMcGazi

Just to wrap up my little thing about George Carlin, I do find it hard to believe he went to catholic school and never heard of the Beatitudes.

He was probably high.

431 Gus  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:53:28am

Happy Self-Flagellation Day

432 Mattand  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:53:51am

re: #428 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Hey, Greg: 2011 called. It wants its prediction back.

433 Aqua Obama  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:54:26am

re: #428 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Yeah, they should make the next debt limit exactly November the 3rd.

434 allegro  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 11:56:14am

re: #240 lawhawk

I think Christie and Booker have a wink-nod deal not to campaign/race against the other, even if it’s via surrogates. They’re both looking at higher office in the future, and figure that this way helps both out.

That and the fact that they’re both friendly towards the other and would probably work quite well with each other, as compared to the nonstop bickering as between Christie and Lautenberg and Menendez.

Wow! Politicians of both parties acting like adults and professionals? Praise the day and grieve the rarity.

435 Lidane  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 12:11:03pm
436 GeneJockey  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 12:18:41pm

re: #388 Killgore Trout

No spoilers but the Red Shirts on Walking Dead are getting easy to spot. I really want to like the series but the writing and plot lines are frustrating. They are starting to rely on some predictable crutches. I find myself still watching hoping that certain characters will be killed off in hopes it will improve the story lines.

In my family we call them ‘Ensign Deadmeat’, after the character in ‘Hot Shots’.

437 sagehen  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 12:24:19pm

re: #426 SteveMcGazi

I apologize for the choice of words. My intent was to suggest that Jesus was trying to provide some clarification to what was in the Old Testament (BTW I thought the Torah was the first five books). I tried to sum up in a hurry so I said something stupid.

Torah is the first 5 books.

Tanakh is Torah + histories and psalms and prophets and everything up until the New Testament starts.

Talmud is commentaries, analysis and debate about the Tanakh, written many years later.

438 leftynyc  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 12:48:36pm

re: #273 HappyWarrior

Heh Erickson. He called Roberts that.

I believe he was referring to David Souter when he said that.

439 HappyWarrior  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 12:50:12pm

re: #438 leftynyc

I believe he was referring to David Souter when he said that.

Ah my bad.

440 Slap  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 1:14:24pm

re: #159 William Barnett-Lewis

Don’t know if anyone responded, and your email link doesn’t work for me. Here’s what I do for the chokes:

Cut off top 1”
Cut off stem to leave a flat base
With shears, cut off the tip of each of the remaining leaves
Rub cut surfaces with a half-lemon
Set up steamer basket in wok or pasta pot
Add enough water to maintain a low boil for an hour or so (depends on your pot)
With the flat side down, steam for 40-60 minutes, depending on size
Test by pulling off an outer leaf and tasting.
Steam ‘til done.

Mrs Slap prefers a mixture of lemon and mayo for dipping, I prefer ranch.

Hope this helps!

441 cinesimon  Mon, Oct 14, 2013 2:37:58pm

This reminds me of the so-called ‘moderate’ republicans being stunned at Tea Party behaviour.
Talk about out of this world naive.


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