Gallup Poll Finds 58% of Americans Favor Legalizing Marijuana

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According to a new Gallup poll, 58 percent of Americans support legalizing marijuana—the largest percentage ever in that survey. “Success at the ballot box in the past year in Colorado and Washington may have increased Americans’ tolerance for marijuana legalization,” Gallup says. “Support for legalization has jumped 10 percentage points since last November and the legal momentum shows no sign of abating.”

Gallup’s survey asks, “Do you think the use of marijuana should be made legal, or not?” That leaves open the question of whether commercial production and distribution should be legal as well (as in Colorado and Washington). But other national polls that go beyond marijuana consumption also have found majority support for legalization. In a Reason-Rupe survey last January, for example, 53 percent of respondents said “the government should treat marijuana the same as alcohol.” And last month a Public Policy Polling survey in Texas found that 58 percent of respondents either “somewhat” or “strongly” supported “changing Texas law to regulate and tax marijuana similarly to alcohol, where stores would be licensed to sell marijuana to adults 21 and older.” The latter finding was especially striking given the state’s conservative reputation.

More: Gallup Poll Finds 58% of Americans Favor Legalizing Marijuana

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290 comments
1 HappyWarrior  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 6:43:21pm

Like gay marriage, this is another issue that I’m pleasantly surprised to see society evolving on.

2 nines09  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 7:07:11pm

Just imagine. Two stalks of Sensimilla in your back yard. Personal use. Along with everyone else who desires such. State sold at (?) gram. Taxed. Regulated. No more Ganja Cartels. No more “Got no weed man, but check this out” bullshit. No synthetic chemical Herb bullshit. Make every state in the Union Beaucoup Bucks. No freaking brainer. No freaking brainer. Imagine going to (fill in blank) for the White Witch Hybrid tasting festival. Raspberry Skunk Delight. Drop Dead Kush. I Can’t Feel My Toes Dark Noise. Turn The Music Down Lambs Bread Limon. Bet You Stay Overnight Delight.

3 Targetpractice  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 9:47:25pm

I really do live for the day when we can have an American president stand up and say “Yes, I smoked pot, and no, I don’t feel sorry that I did.”

4 freetoken  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 9:47:42pm

re: #2 nines09

I can’t stand smoke of any kind; but I find that the side effects of the excessive hunting of users of marijuana by our legal system to be worse. There are just too many people in jails and prisons for trivial habitual behavior, and this is due to the short-sighted “3-strikes” laws.

5 wrenchwench  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 9:50:18pm

re: #2 nines09

Just imagine. Two stalks of Sensimilla in your back yard. Personal use. Along with everyone else who desires such. State sold at (?) gram. Taxed. Regulated. No more Ganja Cartels. No more “Got no weed man, but check this out” bullshit. No synthetic chemical Herb bullshit. Make every state in the Union Beaucoup Bucks. No freaking brainer. No freaking brainer. Imagine going to (fill in blank) for the White Witch Hybrid tasting festival. Raspberry Skunk Delight. Drop Dead Kush. I Can’t Feel My Toes Dark Noise. Turn The Music Down Lambs Bread Limon. Bet You Stay Overnight Delight.

I think I got a contact high just reading that.

6 freetoken  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 9:51:54pm

Just finished watching (well, mostly skipping parts, watching a few highlights of) today’s Apple Special Event video.

It struck me that the only thing sadder than seeing a theatre full of middle-age Americans clapping for a dropping by $30 the price of a small piece of aluminum and glass is that they’re also clapping the presentation performance of insomnia-curing Tim Cook.

There should be no more un-cured insomniacs around - just write them a script to watch a 90 minute Tim Cook presentation.

7 Single-handed sailor  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 9:52:01pm

I’ve been an advocate of legalization since 1970 and a supporter of NORML for 2 decades. I’d really like to grow my own, legally. I’m glad I live in California where it’s only been just an infraction since 1976. The draconian penalties in some other states are disgusting.

8 Targetpractice  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 9:53:48pm

You wanna solve America’s drug problems? Legalize pot, tax the fuck out of it, and put the tax money towards getting drug addicts help rather than locking their asses up and making them more likely to go back on the shit or dealing it when they get out. Did this country learn nothing from Prohibition?

9 AlexRogan  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 9:54:01pm

re: #5 wrenchwench

I think I got a contact high just reading that.

Youtube Video

One of my favorite movies…and I’m not even a stoner ;-P

10 Targetpractice  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 10:03:51pm

re: #7 Single-handed sailor

I’ve been an advocate of legalization since 1970 and a supporter of NORML for 2 decades. I’d really like to grow my own, legally. I’m glad I live in California where it’s only been just an infraction since 1976. The draconian penalties in some other states are disgusting.

No telling how many laws exist on the books because of “law and order” politicians responding to demands by moral guardians to “think of the children!”

11 wheat-dogghazi  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 10:04:22pm

re: #8 Targetpractice

You wanna solve America’s drug problems? Legalize pot, tax the fuck out of it, and put the tax money towards getting drug addicts help rather than locking their asses up and making them more likely to go back on the shit or dealing it when they get out. Did this country learn nothing from Prohibition?

Some people did not. They want to prohibit anything they consider immoral.

12 Kragar  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 10:06:54pm

re: #9 AlexRogan

[Embedded content]

One of my favorite movies…and I’m not even a stoner ;-P

I’m a fan of Half Baked myself.

Youtube Video

13 AlexRogan  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 10:11:39pm

re: #12 Kragar

I’m a fan of Half Baked myself.

[Embedded content]

Always loved this part:

Youtube Video

14 Kragar  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 10:12:41pm

re: #13 AlexRogan

Always loved this part:
[Embedded content]

I’ve only gotten to do that once in my life.

15 Kragar  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 10:29:56pm

Stewart mocks ‘Turd Blossom’ Karl Rove for having to ‘battle the stupid’ Tea Party he unleashed

“It’s as though the entire misguided shutdown affair was a culmination of a decade-long strategy to rile up and politically engage the most rigid and ideological pockets of the Republican party,” Stewart posited. “Which is why Karl Rove has no right to complain about all these radicals ruining his nice Republican party, because he’s the one who invited them.”

As proof, Stewart cited Rove telling author Thomas Edsall in 2004 that Republicans were out to play to conservative voters’ “anger points” like marriage equality or “free health care for immigrants.”

That kind of thought process, Stewart said, is what led to the sight of Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX) sharing a stage with the likes of Larry Klayman, who openly called for President Barack Obama to “put the Quran down, to get up off his knees, and to figuratively come out with his hands up.”

“Now old Turd Blossom here has to create a super PAC to attempt to battle the stupid he himself unleashed,” Stewart said of Rove. “So, no simpatico for a guy who started a fire that now rages out of control.”

16 sagehen  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 10:47:09pm

re: #15 Kragar

Stewart mocks ‘Turd Blossom’ Karl Rove for having to ‘battle the stupid’ Tea Party he unleashed

Do we take it personally that Stewart calls Sarah Palin McCain’s hatchling?

17 Targetpractice  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 10:50:55pm

re: #15 Kragar

Stewart mocks ‘Turd Blossom’ Karl Rove for having to ‘battle the stupid’ Tea Party he unleashed

Like Election Night ‘12, Karl can’t believe that things aren’t going to script. The Cruz and Paulians of the GOP were supposed to be kept in line with a tight leash called “reelection funds,” were supposed to come to heel whenever they were threatened with losing or being denied a committee chair, and were supposed to cower in fear when told that the juicy earmarks they wanted in the next funding bill might not garner the leadership’s approval.

It never seemed to occur to him that the simultaneous effort on the GOP’s part to grease the skids with Citizens United might backfire, that opening the floodgates on campaign financing might mean that the party’s money changers wouldn’t have exclusive control over where the gold was going and that the crazies might secure sources of funding outside the leadership’s grip. That the gerrymandering meant to secure the GOP’s majority for the next decade might instead create open season on the “safe” establishment Republicans who have been able to rely upon fear of the crazies by Democrats to keep them in office.

18 Sol Berdinowitz  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:01:47pm

re: #15 Kragar

The GOP missied its chance to rebuke or at least distance itself from the absolute frothing idiots in the TP. This led to an absolute race to the bottom to gain attention by spewing the most outrageous claims about Obama and everything he stands for.

19 HoosierHoops  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:08:46pm

Wait! What? I live in a college town with 40,000 students.. Are you saying pot is illegal? Noo wayy! duude!
BTW..I always shop near campus for the simple fact that I love standing in long lines with college girls. Mom always said I’ve never met a stranger..
I’ll admit some of the most beautiful girls in America attend Oklahoma University..I have loved living in a collegetown. The weeks are counting down now..Winston can feel it with boxes being packed up now…Funny..But I’m going to really miss the friends I’ve made here..I’m glad you’ve shared these times together..The people, Tornadoes, Sports…Remember when I moved from Indiana? Damn that kind of hurt with the life long friends I made there..I still and always will visit…Being home sick from my Home in Napa Valley..And now..Time to move on again…Damn..stupid tear

20 freetoken  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:15:56pm
21 GeneJockey  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:18:59pm

re: #16 sagehen

Do we take it personally that Stewart calls Sarah Palin McCain’s hatchling?

Nah. Birdbrains lay eggs, too.

22 HoosierHoops  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:20:21pm

re: #20 freetoken

[Embedded content]

Perfect..I hear clinking glasses in the background

23 wheat-dogghazi  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:21:45pm

re: #17 Targetpractice

Like Election Night ‘12, Karl can’t believe that things aren’t going to script. The Cruz and Paulians of the GOP were supposed to be kept in line with a tight leash called “reelection funds,” were supposed to come to heel whenever they were threatened with losing or being denied a committee chair, and were supposed to cower in fear when told that the juicy earmarks they wanted in the next funding bill might not garner the leadership’s approval.

It never seemed to occur to him that the simultaneous effort on the GOP’s part to grease the skids with Citizens United might backfire, that opening the floodgates on campaign financing might mean that the party’s money changers wouldn’t have exclusive control over where the gold was going and that the crazies might secure sources of funding outside the leadership’s grip. That the gerrymandering meant to secure the GOP’s majority for the next decade might instead create open season on the “safe” establishment Republicans who have been able to rely upon fear of the crazies by Democrats to keep them in office.

The Rovians thought they could control the extremists just so they could win elections indefinitely, but they didn’t count on right wing talk radio and the Internet provoking the nutjob wing into greater and greater wingnuttery. Now, the little fire they were tending has turned into an inferno that may burn the party down to the ground.

24 Lidane  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:29:48pm

re: #8 Targetpractice

You wanna solve America’s drug problems? Legalize pot, tax the fuck out of it, and put the tax money towards getting drug addicts help rather than locking their asses up and making them more likely to go back on the shit or dealing it when they get out.

YES. THIS. I’ve been saying this for ages.

It would also undercut the cartels, since weed would no longer be an easy part of their proft margin.

Did this country learn nothing from Prohibition?

LOL no. We still have people thinking that writing Constitutional amendments to restrict rights is a good thing.

25 Sol Berdinowitz  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:30:20pm

re: #23 wheat-dogghazi

The Rovians thought they could control the extremists just so they could win elections indefinitely, but they didn’t count on right wing talk radio and the Internet provoking the nutjob wing into greater and greater wingnuttery. Now, the little fire they were tending has turned into an inferno that may burn the party down to the ground.

They have come nowhere near bottom on the race down to say the most outrageous things. A few people with some shreds of decency are peeling off, but this lunacy has made it onto the GOP platform in such a manner that it cannot be ignored or rationalized away.

26 Lidane  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:30:54pm
27 piratedan  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:32:45pm

re: #26 Lidane

because everything was fucking fantastic before Obama, right Matt?

28 piratedan  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:34:03pm

re: #24 Lidane

I’d shelve prostitution as well, get the drugs out of it, regulate the fuck out of it, stop making people feel like pervs over their own fetishes.

29 Sol Berdinowitz  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:35:31pm

re: #27 piratedan

because everything was fucking fantastic before Obama, right Matt?

I recall a time in my relationship with my current partner when everything was great. Cannot recall exactly when or where, or why it was better back then, but it just was. And I am sure it was that way once or I would not still be with her.

But then she fell for this guy with a foreign-sounding name and things have never been the same. I find myself unable to sleep and often stainding in line at the Wal-Mart at 3am…

30 Kragar  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:36:02pm

re: #26 Lidane

Because the owners of Walmart are racking in millions while most Americans are stuck working terrible hours and can only afford the crap Walmart sells?

31 Sol Berdinowitz  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:36:38pm

re: #28 piratedan

I’d shelve prostitution as well, get the drugs out of it, regulate the fuck out of it, stop making people feel like pervs over their own fetishes.

If poor, dateless assholes know they can safely and legally just shell out the bucks and get their rocks off, they will not feel as compelled to get girls drunk or whacked on roofies in order to attempt doing so…

32 piratedan  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:41:18pm

re: #31 Sol Berdinowitz

yes Sol, how many crimes are perpetuated and instigated because of that societal guilt? How many women trapped into the profession because they’re strung out and held physically if not emotionally hostage? Lotta that old time religion pre-programmed guilt that causes people to do some seriously strange things.

33 Sol Berdinowitz  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:44:28pm

re: #32 piratedan

Yes, just read an article about some women who tried to get out of porn and back into a “normal” profession…when their past caught up with them, they were shunned and rejected. No discussion of how anybody came to find out in the first place about what they used to do.

34 Lidane  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:45:43pm

re: #28 piratedan

I’d shelve prostitution as well, get the drugs out of it, regulate the fuck out of it, stop making people feel like pervs over their own fetishes.

Legalizing it would also have the added bonus of giving sex workers legal protection, which they don’t have now.

35 Sol Berdinowitz  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:47:45pm

re: #34 Lidane

Legalizing it would also have the added bonus of giving sex workers legal protection, which they don’t have now.

It would have the disadvantage of bringing down God’s righteous wrath upon our nation.

/

36 piratedan  Tue, Oct 22, 2013 11:48:58pm

re: #34 Lidane

Legalizing it would also have the added bonus of giving sex workers legal protection, which they don’t have now.

and medical coverage….. could possibly have an even greater societal impact in the reduction of sexually transmitted diseases…. wonder if we could get Senator Vitter to sponsor it?

37 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:04:31am

re: #33 Sol Berdinowitz

Yes, just read an article about some women who tried to get out of porn and back into a “normal” profession…when their past caught up with them, they were shunned and rejected. No discussion of how anybody came to find out in the first place about what they used to do.

There have been several teachers who have lost their jobs for this very reason. One was a very popular and effective teacher in western Kentucky who did one porn flick when she was young and stupid. She was fired after a student outed her. She moved to St. Louis to teach, and the same damn thing happened again!

More recently, a Spanish teacher in Texas was let go when it was discovered she had posed nude for Playboy while a college student. The students seemed cool with it. Some parents, though, had different ideas. They said the boys would only think about their teacher being nude (like posing for Playboy would make a difference there) and the girls needed a better role model (like being both attractive and smart is a bad thing).

A hundred years ago, married female teachers had to leave the profession once they got pregnant, because sex! We have not progressed that far in the interim.

38 freetoken  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:12:00am

re: #37 wheat-dogghazi

This extreme Victorianism in our culture is part of the fallout from the shame-industry.

39 freetoken  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:12:06am
40 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:23:27am

re: #38 freetoken

This extreme Victorianism in our culture is part of the fallout from the shame-industry.

For some parents, it’s also a result of adults trying to so-called “protect” children from sex, as if a teacher posing nude or doing a porn flick is going to change matters.

41 Single-handed sailor  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:29:38am

In high school, in the early 70’s, our student body was on the bleeding edge of a social awakening. We brought in guest speakers to talk about new ideas such as gay rights, drug legalization, and also protection for sex workers. We had Margo St. James speak about the formation of a “union” for sex workers. She started Coyote in 1973. Needless to say, the school administration was not fond of our choices for guest speakers.

42 Sol Berdinowitz  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:31:07am

re: #38 freetoken

This extreme Victorianism in our culture is part of the fallout from the shame-industry.

without that sense of shame and titillation, the whole porn industry loses its appeal

43 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:48:34am

re: #41 Single-handed sailor

In high school, in the early 70’s, our student body was on the bleeding edge of a social awakening. We brought in guest speakers to talk about new ideas such as gay rights, drug legalization, and also protection for sex workers. We had Margo St. James speak about the formation of a “union” for sex workers. She started Coyote in 1973. Needless to say, the school administration was not fond of our choices for guest speakers.

I have a similar story. When I was in 9th grade (1970-71), my health teacher arranged to show us a CBS documentary called “The Homosexuals,” done by Mike Wallace in 1967. From the community reaction, you would have thought she was showing us gay porn. Parents protested, the teacher was grilled by the administration, the school board clucked about it, but this all happened after we got to see the program. The teacher got to keep her job, and we students did not all immediately become gay or lesbian. (Some were already there, of course.)

In fact, the show was notably biased against homosexuality. I’m not sure how the gays and lesbians in the class felt after watching it. But it was groundbreaking in that it discussed publicly what many back then kept as a dirty secret.

44 Single-handed sailor  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:59:35am

re: #43 wheat-dogghazi

I have a similar story. When I was in 9th grade (1970-71), my health teacher arranged to show us a CBS documentary called “The Homosexuals,” done by Mike Wallace in 1967. From the community reaction, you would have thought she was showing us gay porn. Parents protested, the teacher was grilled by the administration, the school board clucked about it, but this all happened after we got to see the program. The teacher got to keep her job, and we students did not all immediately become gay or lesbian. (Some were already there, of course.)

yeah, I was bemused that we were allowed to have Margo St. James talk but the school banned the gay rights speakers. That caused a protest and a walkout of a good portion of the student body. About 2000 students walked off campus to a park to listen to the gay rights speakers.

Bay Area news teams covered the story. That was when I learned the news media couldn’t get a story correct even if it was simple and straight forward. I haven’t had faith in the news since.

45 sagehen  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:59:51am

re: #43 wheat-dogghazi

I have a similar story. When I was in 9th grade (1970-71), my health teacher arranged to show us a CBS documentary called “The Homosexuals,” done by Mike Wallace in 1967. From the community reaction, you would have thought she was showing us gay porn. Parents protested, the teacher was grilled by the administration, the school board clucked about it, but this all happened after we got to see the program. The teacher got to keep her job, and we students did not all immediately become gay or lesbian. (Some were already there, of course.)

In fact, the show was notably biased against homosexuality. I’m not sure how the gays and lesbians in the class felt after watching it. But it was groundbreaking in that it discussed publicly what many back then kept as a dirty secret.

I’ve seen clips from that — pre-Stonewall, do I remember correctly that all the gay guys interviewed for it were dark silhouettes with voice alteration, or filmed only up to the neck, to protect their identities?

46 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 1:08:51am

re: #45 sagehen

I’ve seen clips from that — pre-Stonewall, do I remember correctly that all the gay guys interviewed for it were dark silhouettes with voice alteration, or filmed only up to the neck, to protect their identities?

Yup. To protect their identities.

47 Sol Berdinowitz  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 1:11:06am

re: #45 sagehen

I’ve seen clips from that — pre-Stonewall, do I remember correctly that all the gay guys interviewed for it were dark silhouettes with voice alteration, or filmed only up to the neck, to protect their identities?

A lot of them were priests or politicians…

48 sagehen  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 1:14:03am

Wouldn’t it be awesome if one of them was in one of those sweet old wrinkly white-haired couples hobbling into City Hall for a marriage license last year?

49 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 2:13:19am

I’m so motherfucking pissed off right now.

Just spent all afternoon and evening with Dad in the ER and Hospital. We meet for lunch every other Tuesday while the cleaning ladies do his condo, and apparently they put a throw rug down on the freshly polished linoleum in his bathroom toilet area where he says it doesn’t belong. No grip at all one the rug, not no grip as in worn down, no grip as in it’s one of those thin rugs that never had any. I’m here now and the fucking thing is slicker than wet ice, absolute, insane hazard, and predictably he went down hard. End result, enterochanteric tibia fracture.

His orthopedist showed me the x-ray and, I don’t know, yeah it could be worse but it’s not exactly a clean break either. Kind of crunched in along the chanteric plane, fairly ugly looking. Surgery tomorrow afternoon, so the man with L4/L5 fusion and a bunch of Ti clips from his prostate surgery gets a bunch more metal implanted. Good news is that he’ll be able to bear weight, albeit painfully, pretty much immediately. Otherwise he’s putting up a good front, appears to be in upbeat spirits but I can tell he’s really upset about the fact he’s going to need to use a walker for awhile, which is the only thing that makes me cry.

Gonna call the head of his cleaning crew, make them come over and show them how dangerous a condition they created, but I’ve got to calm down first. Whether he tells his own insurance agents that about their role in the accident is up to him, but they’ve got to know not to do shit like this.

50 Sol Berdinowitz  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 2:23:09am

re: #49 goddamnedfrank

fer god’s sake there are rubber skid mats you can put under a rug like that

51 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 2:23:18am

re: #49 goddamnedfrank

Sorry to hear about your dad, but he sounds like a tough old bird and he’ll probably do fine. If I were him, though, I’d talk to a lawyer. It might be hard to hold the cleaners liable, especially if the rug is his, but worth a try.

52 freetoken  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 2:36:52am
53 freetoken  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 2:39:06am
54 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 2:39:46am

re: #50 Sol Berdinowitz

fer god’s sake there are rubber skid mats you can put under a rug like that

I know. The rest of his bathroom is carpeted and on that it grips fine. I’m frustrated with him too because he’ll complain about the most inconsequential shit that can’t possibly matter, but apparently they often put this rug back in the wrong spot and he never mentions it. Probably contributing is the fact that he keeps his bedroom dark like a cave during the day, no overhead lights and the blinds drawn because he’s fanatical about keeping the heat out, in late October.

Already broached the subject with him that he’s addicted to his routine and there’s some really maladaptive shit in the way he’s set things up. That if he observed another person doing some of the things he does or organizing their home the way he does he’d speak up but that he refuses to recognize how fucked up it is when he does it.

55 Justanotherhuman  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 4:04:44am

re: #49 goddamnedfrank

I’m so motherfucking pissed off right now.

Just spent all afternoon and evening with Dad in the ER and Hospital. We meet for lunch every other Tuesday while the cleaning ladies do his condo, and apparently they put a throw rug down on the freshly polished linoleum in his bathroom toilet area where he says it doesn’t belong. No grip at all one the rug, not no grip as in worn down, no grip as in it’s one of those thin rugs that never had any. I’m here now and the fucking thing is slicker than wet ice, absolute, insane hazard, and predictably he went down hard. End result, enterochanteric tibia fracture.

His orthopedist showed me the x-ray and, I don’t know, yeah it could be worse but it’s not exactly a clean break either. Kind of crunched in along the chanteric plane, fairly ugly looking. Surgery tomorrow afternoon, so the man with L4/L5 fusion and a bunch of Ti clips from his prostate surgery gets a bunch more metal implanted. Good news is that he’ll be able to bear weight, albeit painfully, pretty much immediately. Otherwise he’s putting up a good front, appears to be in upbeat spirits but I can tell he’s really upset about the fact he’s going to need to use a walker for awhile, which is the only thing that makes me cry.

Gonna call the head of his cleaning crew, make them come over and show them how dangerous a condition they created, but I’ve got to calm down first. Whether he tells his own insurance agents that about their role in the accident is up to him, but they’ve got to know not to do shit like this.

Quietly go through his things, and toss any scatter rugs that don’t have rubber backing (no rugs w/o backing should ever be used in bathrooms or on waxed surfaces anyway). I’m not sure the cleaning crew would know everything about your dad’s limitations, but I’m sorry he fell and injured himself because of the cleaning. It sounds like a very nasty fall, but I’m not so sure the cleaners are liable for it. In fact, try to eliminate scatter rugs entirely; if he uses a cane or walker, they can get caught in them anyway.

And if they’re waxing the lino, tell the cleaning co to stop doing it. That’s a real hazard for anyone.

56 Dr Lizardo  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 4:05:53am

re: #3 Targetpractice

I really do live for the day when we can have an American president stand up and say “Yes, I smoked pot, and no, I don’t feel sorry that I did.”

Heh.

I’d love to see a president say, “Yeah, I smoked weed; lit up a bowl, watched South Park and laughed my ass off. And what of it?”

57 Justanotherhuman  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 4:12:49am

“The latter finding was especially striking given the state’s conservative reputation.”

Pot usage isn’t confined to “hippies” anymore, a lot of whom turned out to be ordinary assholes. In fact, I know some very politically conservative friends of my son who are pretty much potheads.

In fact, around here, almost everyone is conservative politically, and pot usage is pretty damn high (no pun intended), esp among the working class.

58 Justanotherhuman  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 4:31:20am

Let’s see: there were 58K documents (or files—no one seems sure) stolen by Snowden, the results of which have been “leaked” by various people privy to them, and none of which, singularly or collectively, give an accurate picture of NSA activities. So, the clever boys & girls are depending on the public’s anti-govt sympathies to garner support for what they’ve done and are doing.

James Clapper: Reports US tapped French phones ‘false’

bbc.co.uk

It’s going to be interesting to find out where Snowden goes when his year’s “asylum” in Russia is up next year. By that time, I doubt even Greenwald will be “safe” in Brazil, or Poitras in Berlin.

From what I’ve read, the entire situation sounds more like a criminal conspiracy to commit espionage while framing the narrative from afar.

There are plenty of ways to change how the NSA does its job—what Snowden, Greenwald and Poitras and their press friends have done is not one of them, regardless of how many times they want to call Snowden a “whistle blower” and themselves the only “journalists with integrity”.

59 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:07:57am

The older I get and the more chronic pain I experience (which isn’t alleviated by traditional pharmacopia) the more I want LEGAL WEED.

On another note, regarding Canadian Death Panels. I posted this yesterday and heard Hannity refer to the Death Panels sometime in the night. Of course he didn’t elaborate.

Personally, why anyone would want their corpse kept fresh ad infinitum is beyond me. (short-term perhaps for organ donation reasons)

60 Gus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:13:54am

[Insert statement on marijuana legalization here.]

61 Gus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:18:16am

Been sober for well over a month now. I have some top grade bud here. Haven’t touched it in a couple of days. It does nothing for my pain and never did. Being sober reminds me of the overall state of being intoxicated. The reason I haven’t touched it for a while is because I can’t stand the way pot makes me feel. Besides making me intoxicated (which is what marijuana does) it’s that weird gross feeling it gives me and how it turns me into a useless bag of bones. Overall I’d say not thanks at this point in my life and that it’s way overrated.

62 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:25:57am
63 Justanotherhuman  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:26:26am

re: #61 Gus

Maybe you should know the difference between sativa and indica properties and how the body reacts to both.

medicalmarijuana.procon.org

I expect most of the pot around here is sativa; I don’t think I’ve ever seen any indica, at least in leaf form, and that’s what you need for physical relief.

“The Indica and Sativa subspecies differ in their medicinal properties. Sativa strains produce more of a euphoric high, lifting the consumer’s mood and therapeutically relieving stress. Indica strains relax muscle and work as general analgesics, also helping with sleep. A cancer patient hoping to relieve the pain from chemotherapy would benefit greatly from the effects of an Indica plant bud, whereas an individual dealing with depression would better benefit from a Sativa plant bud…”

64 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:26:28am

This stupid, debunked birther shit from Prudence is still getting spammed over Teh Twitters:

65 Justanotherhuman  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:29:37am

re: #64 Vicious Babushka

Even the photo is of a mature Obama, not a 20 yr old.

Those people are just fucking disgusting.

66 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:31:58am

re: #65 Justanotherhuman

Even the photo is of a mature Obama, not a 20 yr old.

Those people are just fucking disgusting.

The bogus “student ID” is a very poor Photoshop of this German guy’s 1998 ID. In 1983 the ID cards did not have barcodes.

67 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:32:16am

Do Bishops Run your Hospital? Also Paged

Abortion services are always quick to go when a Catholic hospital takes over, but the changes go much further. In many cases, doctors are prohibited from prescribing birth control, and hospital pharmacies won’t sell it. Doctors may even be told not to counsel patients about it. Catholic hospitals have been reluctant to offer emergency contraception to rape victims, and when they do, they first require a pregnancy test to ensure the woman was not pregnant before the assault. The bishops’ guidelines forbid tubal ligations and vasectomies. They also extend to end-of-life care: Catholic hospitals may ignore patients’ requests to be removed from feeding tubes or life support, even if those wishes are expressed in living wills. And many states allow religious hospitals to discriminate against gays and lesbians, both as employees and as patients.

68 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:37:37am
69 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:38:36am
71 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 5:59:26am

Good morning Lizards. Overcast, cool, and a chance of rain here in Philadelphia.

“Fie on your silly hooman food” cat discovered bacon last night.

72 geoffm33  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:01:03am

What the hell have you people done to me? I went from voting Romney last November to trying to explain to my wife why she should vote for the more progressive choice in the Boston Mayoral race this November.

73 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:01:53am

re: #72 geoffm33

What the hell have you people done to me? I went from voting Romney last November to trying to explain to my wife why she should vote for the more progressive choice in the Boston Mayoral race this November.

@_@

All obey HypnoObama!

74 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:02:16am

I’m on day 3 of some very weird bug. Pain, congestion, fatigue, pain.

75 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:02:40am

re: #73 Feline Fearless Leader

@_@

All obey HypnoObama!

Zionist Conspiracy—did you forget?

:0

76 geoffm33  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:03:55am

re: #68 FemNaziBitch

[Embedded content]

A better analogy would be that the Wright brothers, being aviators in one of the last modernized countries to adopt air travel, only traveled 120 feet. Ruining aviation.

77 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:04:18am

i’m going to brush my teeth and go back to bed for a while.

78 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:04:40am

re: #76 geoffm33

A better analogy would be that the Wright brothers, being aviators in one of the last modernized countries to adopt air travel, only traveled 120 feet. Ruining aviation.

not my tweet, just retweeting …

79 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:05:05am

re: #75 FemNaziBitch

Zionist Conspiracy—did you forget?

:0

Feline Zionist Cat Conspiracy

Image: babushka_cat.jpg

80 geoffm33  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:05:32am

re: #78 FemNaziBitch

not my tweet, just retweeting …

Oh, I know! My reply to Lizz would go unnoticed so replied to you ;)

81 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:06:16am

re: #74 FemNaziBitch

I’m on day 3 of some very weird bug. Pain, congestion, fatigue, pain.

Sounds like one of my autumn sinus infections.

82 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:12:45am

WTFITS
I used to like Penn Jillette until I found out he was a climate change denier, but this alleged quote, if he actually even said it, just makes no freaking sense whatsoever.

83 Political Atheist  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:18:00am

Good Morning. I guess I went to bed a little too early, I had no idea this got promoted. What a nice surprise.

84 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:27:56am

re: #66 Vicious Babushka

The bogus “student ID” is a very poor Photoshop of this German guy’s 1998 ID. In 1983 the ID cards did not have barcodes.

These people will believe anything that fits their preconceptions, not matter how ludicrous. It explains why they get fooled so easily by The Onion and Steven Colbert.

Also, they’re stupid.

85 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:29:09am

re: #84 wheat-dogghazi

These people will believe anything that fits their preconceptions, not matter how ludicrous. It explains why they get fooled so easily by The Onion and Steven Colbert.

Also, they’re stupid.

Not to mention that their mother dresses them funny.
//

86 b.d.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:31:10am

re: #64 Vicious Babushka

Why would anyone other than Obama have Obama’s old student ID?

87 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:34:50am

re: #86 b.d.

Why would anyone other than Obama have Obama’s old student ID?

TRUTH!!!!1!!1!!!111!!!!

88 b.d.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:36:18am

Well this should go over well;

[Jerry] Jones: Romo’s Hispanic heritage makes him perfect Cowboys QB

wfaa.com

89 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:36:49am

re: #86 b.d.

Why would anyone other than Obama have Obama’s old student ID?

Why would anyone still have his old student ID? Mine are long gone, or buried at the bottom of some box somewhere.

90 b.d.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:39:31am

I FOUND THIS KID’S STUDENT ID LAYING ON THE GROUND, I BETTER HANG ON TO IT FOR A COUPLE OF DECADES

91 darthstar  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:46:57am

Mitch McConnell is Somebody is such a racist he can’t hide it anymore. - sorry McConnell…it was a house leader, not Senate.

92 lawhawk  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:54:02am

Oh FFS:


Customer service across all businesses and products offered include canned responses - including in health insurance. They train people off scripts.

Heck, they use scripts when firing people too (Up in the Air anyone?) It’s so that the particular company/agency/group has a consistent method of handling issues that arise.

Why is that even news? Oh wait. Obamacare DS.

93 William Barnett-Lewis  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:57:59am

re: #82 Vicious Babushka

WTFITS
I used to like Penn Jillette until I found out he was a climate change denier, but this alleged quote, if he actually even said it, just makes no freaking sense whatsoever.

[Embedded content]

He’s professes a very randian libertarian-ism. Hyper on the 2nd Amendment too.

94 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 6:59:07am

re: #91 darthstar

Mitch McConnell is Somebody is such a racist he can’t hide it anymore. - sorry McConnell…it was a house leader, not Senate.

[Embedded content]

My best guess is that it was Cantor. He’s the one who walked out of the “Grand Bargain” talks and refused to talk with the President.

95 Gus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:00:36am

Speaking of irony.

96 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:01:53am

re: #92 lawhawk

Oh FFS:

[Embedded content]


Customer service across all businesses and products offered include canned responses - including in health insurance. They train people off scripts.

Heck, they use scripts when firing people too (Up in the Air anyone?) It’s so that the particular company/agency/group has a consistent method of handling issues that arise.

Why is that even news? Oh wait. Obamacare DS.

Even the part where they admitted it was a canned script, WAS PART OF THE SCRIPT!!!!11!

97 lawhawk  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:02:57am

Sen. Elect Cory Booker is already showing willingness to cross the aisle to try and get stuff done in dysfunctional DC. He’s even willing to work with Rand Paul on revamping the drug laws that send a disproportionate number of minorities to prison for lengthy sentences despite being nonviolent offenders.

While he’s yet to be sworn in, on Tuesday Booker told The Wall Street Journal that he’s already looking for ways to revamp the nation’s drug laws, such as eliminating mandatory minimum-sentencing laws for nonviolent offenders. And he’s reaching across the aisle to a somewhat unlikely partner: Rand Paul, who campaigned for his Republican opponent. “I want to work with him,” said Booker. “I take everybody in the Senate as sincere people who want to make a difference.”

If anyone might be able to bridge that gap, I’d say it’s Booker.

98 darthstar  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:05:32am
99 b.d.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:10:10am

re: #98 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Hahaha, Todd is rightfully geting his ass lit over that tweet.

Love BWD:

100 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:12:31am

re: #99 b.d.

I missed this. What did he tweet?

101 Ian G.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:16:36am

re: #92 lawhawk

Oh FFS:

[Embedded content]


Customer service across all businesses and products offered include canned responses - including in health insurance. They train people off scripts.

Heck, they use scripts when firing people too (Up in the Air anyone?) It’s so that the particular company/agency/group has a consistent method of handling issues that arise.

Why is that even news? Oh wait. Obamacare DS.

As someone who once held a job managing the call centers that enrolled people in Medicare D, I can tell you that this is exactly the case, and much of my job involved constantly working with the agents to ensure that they didn’t sound like robots when working off the script, and that they could adjust their answers based on the particular caller’s situation.

The reason this isn’t news for Medicare D is shut up, that’s why. Also, Medicare D was not the signature achievement of the Kenyan Marxist Nazi Muslim Atheist usurper.

102 b.d.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:16:59am

Chuck Todd: What was worse: Hitler attacking the USSR or the Obamacare website rollout?

103 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:17:09am

re: #99 b.d.

Hahaha, Todd is rightfully geting his ass lit over that tweet.

Love BWD:

[Embedded content]

heh…reading the other responses to Todd are very amusing!

104 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:22:14am

re: #103 Backwoods_Sleuth

heh…reading the other responses to Todd are very amusing!

And this guy has a job on national TV. Sad.

105 Gus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:24:24am

Chuck Todd. Heh. Later.

106 geoffm33  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:24:35am

re: #92 lawhawk

Oh FFS:

[Embedded content]


Customer service across all businesses and products offered include canned responses - including in health insurance. They train people off scripts.

Heck, they use scripts when firing people too (Up in the Air anyone?) It’s so that the particular company/agency/group has a consistent method of handling issues that arise.

Why is that even news? Oh wait. Obamacare DS.

They will latch onto anything. EVERY company that care about efficiency and accuracy uses canned responses in chat and email.

107 Ian G.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:31:22am

nypost.com

So this kid should be the subject of a smear campaign soon enough from the right.

108 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:31:49am

re: #106 geoffm33

They will latch onto anything. EVERY company that care about efficiency and accuracy uses canned responses in chat and email.

That’s awful! Thousands of people a day call up and ask the same question of tens or hundreds of call center workers, and the company/agency writes them a script so they all convey the same message? FASCISM!!!!

Geez, the outrage trigger on these folks is just set way too light.

109 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:32:22am

re: #106 geoffm33

They will latch onto anything. EVERY company that care about efficiency and accuracy uses canned responses in chat and email.

Same reason why they mock Obama for using a teleprompter, going golfing, or taking a vacation with his family.

110 Targetpractice  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:34:09am

re: #108 GeneJockey

That’s awful! Thousands of people a day call up and ask the same question of tens or hundreds of call center workers, and the company/agency writes them a script so they all convey the same message? FASCISM!!!!

Geez, the outrage trigger on these folks is just set way too light.

They’re convinced this is their key to electoral domination for the next two elections, of course they’re gonna turn anything they perceive as a flaw into a deal-breaker.

111 lawhawk  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:34:17am

re: #108 GeneJockey

And imagine the outrage if they were giving out random information or information that wasn’t adhering to a script. There’d be outrageous outrage from that too.

Although in that case, they’d be right to complain. There’s a reason call centers use scripts - to make sure that there’s consistency in replies to situations.

A script isn’t a bug, and while folks like personalized results, the intake and questions have to be consistent - requiring scripts.

112 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:34:17am

re: #107 Ian G.

nypost.com

So this kid should be the subject of a smear campaign soon enough from the right.

Check his coutertops!!

For a group that claims to be all about individuals, they sure do go in for group identification for everyone else.

113 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:36:12am

re: #111 lawhawk

And imagine the outrage if they were giving out random information or information that wasn’t adhering to a script. There’d be outrageous outrage from that too.

Although in that case, they’d be right to complain. There’s a reason call centers use scripts - to make sure that there’s consistency in replies to situations.

A script isn’t a bug, and while folks like personalized results, the intake and questions have to be consistent - requiring scripts.

“It’s like my grandmother, Nana Roseannadanna used to tell me - ‘It’s always something.’”

114 Bulworth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:38:43am

re: #107 Ian G.

Wow.

115 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:41:01am

re: #111 lawhawk

I worked for a company that was conducting a Phase III trial for a vaccine for a very prominent disease. Before we broke the code at the end of the trial, the PR department asked for volunteers to man a call center, to handle the deluge of calls that would be expected if it had worked. These folks were given instructions and scripts and had to practice their responses to insure that a uniform message got out.

(Turned out it didn’t work. It was very quiet in the call center, between the lack of phones ringing and everyone worrying about losing their jobs…)

116 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:45:48am

re: #107 Ian G.

The staff at that Barney’s store was way out of line. If they suspected something fishy, one call to Chase Bank would have verified he was a cardholder. Instead, they punted on SOP, dragged the cops into it, and shamed this kid for doing nothing wrong — other than being a young black kid in a Barney’s store.

I bet Men’s Wearhouse now has a new customer.

117 Decatur Deb  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:52:13am

re: #72 geoffm33

What the hell have you people done to me? I went from voting Romney last November to trying to explain to my wife why she should vote for the more progressive choice in the Boston Mayoral race this November.

It’s for your own good. When the rabies has burned out of the GOP, we’ll release you back into the wild.

118 Political Atheist  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:58:07am

re: #107 Ian G.

nypost.com

So this kid should be the subject of a smear campaign soon enough from the right.

That would be an excellent Page

119 Ian G.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:58:21am

re: #116 wheat-dogghazi

I bet Men’s Wearhouse now has a new customer.

Or Macy’s. Or some other store that isn’t as ridiculously overpriced as Barney’s. If anything good comes out of this, I hope it’s that the kid learns that there are better ways to spend $350 than on a belt.

120 Ian G.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:59:14am

re: #118 Political Atheist

That would be an excellent Page

Heh, hadn’t noticed the page over there until after I had posted the link. :-P

121 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 7:59:32am

re: #16 sagehen

Do we take it personally that Stewart calls Sarah Palin McCain’s hatchling?

No, but he’s wrong about that. Palin should really be attributed to those people who threatened revolt if McCain picked Joe Lieberman as his running mate. McCain’s instincts were right, and in retrospect he should have stuck with them. But hindsight is always clear and at the time McCain couldn’t see the banking crisis that ensured his defeat.

122 geoffm33  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:01:23am

re: #117 Decatur Deb

It’s for your own good. When the rabies has burned out of the GOP, we’ll release you back into the wild.

What if I refuse to leave?

123 piratedan  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:04:59am

re: #122 geoffm33

What if I refuse to leave?

then it’s most likely “the comfy chair” for the likes of you… /////

124 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:05:31am

re: #116 wheat-dogghazi

The staff at that Barney’s store was way out of line. If they suspected something fishy, one call to Chase Bank would have verified he was a cardholder. Instead, they punted on SOP, dragged the cops into it, and shamed this kid for doing nothing wrong — other than being a young black kid in a Barney’s store.

I bet Men’s Wearhouse now has a new customer.

The NYPD didn’t cover itself in glory either, although they at least made sure that the young man didn’t incur an arrest record because of a store staff fuckup. It was still a foolish bit of racial stereotyping on their part, and the cops involved need to be punished and retrained. The Barney’s employees, however, need to be canned,

125 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:08:17am

re: #121 Dark_Falcon

No, but he’s wrong about that. Palin should really be attributed to those people who threatened revolt if McCain picked Joe Lieberman as his running mate. McCain’s instincts were right, and in retrospect he should have stuck with them. But hindsight is always clear and at the time McCain couldn’t see the banking crisis that ensured his defeat.

IIRC, it was Bill Kristol who was pushing her most prominently, but McCain still gets rightly dinged for making her a household name.

But really - you think Droopy Dog Lieberman would be a good choice? A pro-choice Liberal from Connecticut, who was running mate of the hated Al Gore?

126 geoffm33  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:09:35am

re: #123 piratedan

then it’s most likely “the comfy chair” for the likes of you… /////

I’ll stay as long as you all promise not have me force-gay-married.

127 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:09:39am
128 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:11:23am

re: #119 Ian G.

Or Macy’s. Or some other store that isn’t as ridiculously overpriced as Barney’s. If anything good comes out of this, I hope it’s that the kid learns that there are better ways to spend $350 than on a belt.

Damn belts are probably made in China and cost less than $10 each to make. Stick a designer label on anything, and you can sell it for 10,000% profit.

129 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:11:40am

re: #125 GeneJockey

IIRC, it was Bill Kristol who was pushing her most prominently, but McCain still gets rightly dinged for making her a household name.

But really - you think Droopy Dog Lieberman would be a good choice? A pro-choice Liberal from Connecticut, who was running mate of the hated Al Gore?

Lieberman is a sane person, and no one who isn’t an anti-Semite would panic if he had to take over as president.

130 lawhawk  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:13:14am

Sacre Bleu!


IOW - it’s a nothingburger on how the NSA isn’t doing anything that the OSS and CIA weren’t doing before that, and doing that which the French do to everyone else too.

131 piratedan  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:14:44am

re: #129 Dark_Falcon

Lieberman is a sane person, and no one who isn’t an anti-Semite would panic if he had to take over as president.

faint praise category of candidates, he’s an egotistical opportunistic bastard, but at the least he’s not a complete train wreck like Palin, who was neither prepared for or deserving of the national spotlight

132 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:15:18am

re: #128 wheat-dogghazi

Damn belts are probably made in China and cost less than $10 each to make. Stick a designer label on anything, and you can sell it for 10,000% profit.

They cost more than $10. I assure you. Just shipping the leather to China and shipping the belt back costs more than that. And the higher quality of workmanship on that kind of belt costs more too, since the better skilled workers who make that type of belt are paid more and have better quarters.

133 Dr Lizardo  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:15:27am

re: #130 lawhawk

Sacre Bleu!

[Embedded content]


IOW - it’s a nothingburger on how the NSA isn’t doing anything that the OSS and CIA weren’t doing before that, and doing that which the French do to everyone else too.

Are you insinuating that other countries spy on each other - friend and foe alike - and they’ve been doing so since the dawn of human civilization?!

The hell you say!!

///

134 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:16:18am

re: #129 Dark_Falcon

Lieberman is a sane person, and no one who isn’t an anti-Semite would panic if he had to take over as president.

Nonsense. Lieberman is one of the ‘more and bigger wars’ contingent, at least as much of a hawk as McCain. I’ll admit that it’s less panic-inducing that the thought of that irresponsible, feather-brained resentment monger, but still.

135 wheat-dogghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:18:44am

re: #132 Dark_Falcon

They cost more than $10. I assure you. Just shipping the leather to China and shipping the belt back costs more than that. And the higher quality of workmanship on that kind of belt costs more too, since the better skilled workers who make that type of belt are paid more and have better quarters.

Haha. Well, i never shopped for $350 belts, so you may be right. Come to think of it, I’ve never bought a $350 suit either.

Still, it doesn’t cost anywhere near $350 to manufacture one of those belts. If they’re being handcrafted in italy by master leatherworkers, then maybe that price is justified, but Ferragama is a retail brand. No way those belts are being handmade one by one in some little shop in Italy.

136 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:20:20am
137 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:21:44am

My name on my driver’s license and my name on my passport are different. I couldn’t register to vote in Texas.

138 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:24:24am

Holy crap his name is Trayvon too?

Oh, it’s TRAYON. My brain automatically read TRAYVON.

139 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:26:37am
140 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:29:50am
BOSTON (AP) — A 90-year-old Holocaust survivor made his orchestral debut with renowned cellist Yo-Yo Ma on Tuesday to benefit a foundation dedicated to preserving the work of artists and musicians killed by the Nazis.
Ma and George Horner received floral bouquets and a standing ovation from their audience of about 1,000 people in Boston’s Symphony Hall. They appeared to enjoy their evening, chatting briefly between numbers and walking off the stage hand-in-hand after taking a bow together.

George Horner, Holocaust survivor, makes symphony debut with Yo-Yo Ma

141 klys  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:37:12am

/semi-conscious greeting to the Lizards

142 lawhawk  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:38:52am


Except that those records are something that doctors, health experts, and other actual experts in the field want because it can help reduce errors (which can have deadly outcomes, are exceptionally costly), and can improve preventative care by letting doctors know when a given patient is due or overdue for certain kinds of care/treatments/vaccinations, etc.

It also lets doctors know a person’s medical history wherever they are - like someone who’s been admitted to an ER with a serious condition but the doctors might not know all meds being prescribed, underlying conditions, etc., that make treatment more difficult.

EMR is something that’s been in the works well before the ACA. Insurers and hospitals have been pushing for this too.

143 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:40:02am

re: #140 Backwoods_Sleuth

George Horner, Holocaust survivor, makes symphony debut with Yo-Yo Ma

Good stuff. My father holds Yo-Yo-Ma in good regard. If Mr. Horner ever has an event in Chicago my dad and I would be interested in going.

144 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:40:44am

There is an upper respiratory virus going around. I called my doctor’s office. Nurse said to drink fluids and suffer thru it.

145 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:41:10am
146 makeitstop  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:41:24am

re: #141 klys

/semi-conscious greeting to the Lizards

Semi-conscious wave back. I stayed up way too late reading last night.

147 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:41:39am

re: #144 FemNaziBitch

There is an upper respiratory virus going around. I called my doctor’s office. Nurse said to drink fluids and suffer thru it.

OBAMACARE!!!11!!!1!!1!!1TY

148 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:42:26am

re: #143 Dark_Falcon

Good stuff. My father holds Yo-Yo-Ma in good regard. If Mr. Horner ever has an event in Chicago my dad and I would be interested in going.

There are more photos at Daily Mail.
Looks like it was a wonderful event for everyone.

149 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:42:57am

re: #142 lawhawk

[Embedded content]


Except that those records are something that doctors, health experts, and other actual experts in the field want because it can help reduce errors (which can have deadly outcomes, are exceptionally costly), and can improve preventative care by letting doctors know when a given patient is due or overdue for certain kinds of care/treatments/vaccinations, etc.

It also lets doctors know a person’s medical history wherever they are - like someone who’s been admitted to an ER with a serious condition but the doctors might not know all meds being prescribed, underlying conditions, etc., that make treatment more difficult.

EMR is something that’s been in the works well before the ACA. Insurers and hospitals have been pushing for this too.

True that. When I was at Marcus Evans I worked on several events where Electronic Medical Records were a major topic. EMR is something Congress needs to push via proper oversight. No way back, only way on this one is forward.

150 ObserverArt  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:42:58am

Great idea to decriminalize pot. Considering that it has been around for a long time and it is well known what it effects in the long run, etc. It is far less a health and safety concern than alcohol, yet alcohol was banned around the same time pot became criminal, and alcohol was then allowed back in the society and most likely caused a whole lot of health, safety and productivity issues than pot. I know I’m generalizing, but it would take a book.

I remember an old story on the last page of an Esquire magazine many years ago that went something like: A young African American boy asked his grandfather why marijuana was illegal but you could get alcohol. The grandfather said because alcohol masks and marijuana makes you think. So, when you get sick of “the man” and all his bullshit, alcohol makes you forget about it, pass out and you wake up the next day cursing the alcohol and you accept your lot in life. Pot makes you think about the man and all his bullshit, how he is screwing you over and what you need to do to change things. So, “that man” is fine with alcohol because everyone goes on getting screwed and forgetting and finds marijuana dangerous because you’ve thought about “the man” and get out of his control.

As an artist I’ve always found for me it creates a rapid state of thinking outside the box and a rush of viewpoints based on all kinds of inputs, experiences, etc. In a sense a creative dream state that can be quite good for artistic ideas.

Then you also need to be productive, so at that point you need to lay off and get to work. Over time for me that meant working my ass off on the ideas I dreamt up the night before. It makes a great evening relaxant. It also helps me and many other I know deal with “the man’s” bullshit.

Also, I think overall, everyone has a quest for the altered state and different things have different effects on different people. I’ve never wanted to get blotto and disconnected. I want to be stimulated and be creative and enjoy. And marijuana never led me to any other hard drugs and I drink very little alcohol…a couple beers with my jamming band buddies on our Friday night sessions in my basement studio.

Now…back to work!

151 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:44:13am

re: #144 FemNaziBitch

There is an upper respiratory virus going around. I called my doctor’s office. Nurse said to drink fluids and suffer thru it.

I’m just finishing the second week of that nastiness. Hope it goes away for good soonest.
Good news is that the worst of it only lasted about 3-4 days. Now it’s just an occasion phlemgy cough.

152 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:48:01am

re: #151 Backwoods_Sleuth

I’m just finishing the second week of that nastiness. Hope it goes away for good soonest.
Good news is that the worst of it only lasted about 3-4 days. Now it’s just an occasion phlemgy cough.

lovely. I’ve been on allergy meds and was still getting that phlemgy cough—so I called the doctor. And now you are telling me it’s a 2 weeker?

153 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:48:16am
154 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:49:11am

re: #148 Backwoods_Sleuth

There are more photos at Daily Mail.
Looks like it was a wonderful event for everyone.

Indeed. It sounds like it was a good concert event. I’ll save the link and see what my father thinks of the video.

155 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:50:41am

I’m sure it’s been covered but:

House Republican “Leader” tells Obama he can’t stand to look at him

Tell me again why the Pres should “negotiate” with these asshats?

156 Decatur Deb  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:51:32am

Yet another teacher dead. Need to institute a Combat Instructor Badge.

slate.com

157 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:51:38am

re: #145 Vicious Babushka


Clearly it’s not just for the hell of it. He’s only jacking up rates on white applicants so he can use the money to pay reparations for slavery.

///

158 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:53:18am

re: #152 FemNaziBitch

lovely. I’ve been on allergy meds and was still getting that phlemgy cough—so I called the doctor. And now you are telling me it’s a 2 weeker?

More like maybe 10 days. OTC Musinex helped quite a bit.

159 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:54:13am

re: #155 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

House Republican “Leader” tells Obama he can’t stand to look at him

The Republican Party is being led by a bunch of fractious children. Really, it’s gotten so bad that I can’t stand to look at most of them.

161 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:57:12am

Talk about whacked-out.

“A bizarre demographic chill has stolen over the Land of the Rising Sun. According to a fascinating and bewildering investigation in the Guardian by Abigail Haworth, Japanese young people are losing interest not just in marriage but in romantic relationships. Some have even given up on sex. The national press is calling it sekkusu shinai shokogun, or celibacy syndrome.”

162 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:57:46am

re: #155 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

I’m sure it’s been covered but:

House Republican “Leader” tells Obama he can’t stand to look at him

Tell me again why the Pres should “negotiate” with these asshats?

Sen. Durbin should either name the Congressman in question or shut up. Absent a name, i don’t believe it.

163 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:57:57am

re: #158 Backwoods_Sleuth

More like maybe 10 days. OTC Musinex helped quite a bit.

Mucinex is one of my regular allergy daily meds.

164 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:58:40am

re: #162 Dark_Falcon

Sen. Durbin should either name the Congressman in question or shut up. Absent a name, i don’t believe it.

I posted this the other day, I think. Wondering if anyone had any idea how to authenticate. Someone did find the original source was not the “official” facebook page of the Senator.

165 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 8:59:24am

re: #161 FemNaziBitch

Talk about whacked-out.

As I said a few days ago, it’s a case of social conservatism without the Abrahamic admonition to be fruitful and multiply.

166 piratedan  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:00:35am

re: #162 Dark_Falcon

Sen. Durbin should either name the Congressman in question or shut up. Absent a name, i don’t believe it.

With the history of Rep. Joe Wilson’s “you Lie!” incident and the statements made to the press by various and sundry GOP reps from Trent Franks to Michelle Bachmann, I find it exceedingly plausible.

167 SpaceJesus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:00:40am

oral arguments regarding the legality of same-sex marriage in new mexico going on right now. live stream


livewire.koat.com

168 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:00:42am

re: #138 Vicious Babushka

Holy crap his name is Trayvon too?

Oh, it’s TRAYON. My brain automatically read TRAY>VON.

The shopping while black survivor? yeah, that caught me too.

169 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:00:57am

re: #163 FemNaziBitch

Mucinex is one of my regular allergy daily meds.

Then don’t take DayQuil. They both contain acetaminophen and taking both at the same time can wreck your liver.

170 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:03:26am

re: #166 piratedan

With the history of Rep. Joe Wilson’s “you Lie!” incident and the statements made to the press by various and sundry GOP reps from Trent Franks to Michelle Bachmann, I find it exceedingly plausible.

The fact that it is plausible makes it all the more important to authenticate it. Dick Durbin is certainly partisan enough to allow a false rumor of this kind to go out if he felt it would serve the Democrats’ interests.

171 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:04:04am

Power, greed and the religion:

Franz-Peter Tebartz-van Elst, 53, left his diocese in Limburg for Rome on a low-budget carrier last week, as anger mounted in Germany over the $42 million bill for revamping his residence. The bishop also faces charges that he made false statements twice under oath during a legal case

172 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:05:05am

re: #169 Dark_Falcon

Then don’t take DayQuil. They both contain acetaminophen and taking both at the same time can wreck your liver.

Mucinex doesn’t contain acetaminophen. Or, I should say, the version I take does not. There are many versions.

173 Dr Lizardo  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:05:08am

re: #161 FemNaziBitch

Talk about whacked-out.

I blame tentacle pr0n.

174 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:06:48am

re: #169 Dark_Falcon

Then don’t take DayQuil. They both contain acetaminophen and taking both at the same time can wreck your liver.

In my case, I only took one Musinex, then applied a good slathering of Vicks Vaporub on my chest that night. Next day, the worst of the crud had passed.
I suspected it’s allergies because the condition also improved with the arrival of cold weather and morning frost.

175 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:07:20am

re: #169 Dark_Falcon

Then don’t take DayQuil. They both contain acetaminophen and taking both at the same time can wreck your liver.

That depends on the type of Mucinex you take. The sinus formulations contain acetaminophen, but the basic cough & congestion formulation does not. In any event, you should always check the label.

176 wrenchwench  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:07:48am

re: #167 SpaceJesus

So exciting!

Also, I was visited over the weekend by two who followed you through law school. They’ve opened an immigration-centered practice together.

177 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:09:43am

re: #175 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi

That depends on the type of Mucinex you take. The sinus formulations contain acetaminophen, but the basic cough & congestion formulation does not. In any event, you should always check the label.

True. The version I took has the stuff. I needed it for the pain sinus pressure was giving me.

178 piratedan  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:09:47am

re: #170 Dark_Falcon

The fact that it is plausible makes it all the more important to authenticate it. Dick Durbin is certainly partisan enough to allow a false rumor of this kind to go out if he felt it would serve the Democrats’ interests.

by all means, yes, the proprieties must be observed. If only you held the entire Republican caucus to the same standards every time that they open their mouths to talk about the ACA, you might actually have a point about there being any kind of false equivalency. We’d have the national debt down by a few hundred bucks by the end of the day if there was a nickel jar that got filled each time one of your GOP reps spoke to the media about the ACA and all of the inherent evil filled within.

179 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:12:30am

What’s Prudence going to do when Cuccinelli gets his ass kicked, just like Lonegan, just like Romney? Tweet a bunch of birther shit?

180 SpaceJesus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:12:42am

re: #176 wrenchwench

My buddy from law school will be arguing soon on behalf of the attorney general’s position in favor of equality.

181 klys  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:13:37am

Getting up early to attend office hours for math proofs.

Ugh.

Need more diet mountain dew.

182 SpaceJesus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:14:09am

re: #176 wrenchwench

Good for them. I went above and beyond to settle a trial I had this morning just so I could watch this. Wish I could be up there in person, but oh well.

183 wrenchwench  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:14:35am

re: #167 SpaceJesus

oral arguments regarding the legality of same-sex marriage in new mexico going on right now. live stream

livewire.koat.com

And now, hashing out the hashtag.

184 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:15:12am

Hubby HAS to sleep with Fox TV on. I have ear plugs. Being sick, I wasn’t sleeping much and it seems they have nothing much to talk about except how the Obamacare website is a TOTAL failure and that Sebelius should be fired. I heard it over and over and over and over.

I swear they have about 3 talking points a day and each show’s cast has to bullshit it’s way thru them and find a way to fill the whole spot with it.

185 klys  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:19:19am

re: #184 FemNaziBitch

Since you are around, I discovered yesterday night that my favorite Georgette Heyer novel has finally been released as an unabridged audiobook. She’s considered the mother of Regency romances and has fantastic characters (and at most, you get one kiss).

So I highly recommend considering The Grand Sophy if you’re unsure what to listen to next.

186 wrenchwench  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:21:23am

Opponents of SSM already geared up to reject the Black Robed Cabal.

187 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:22:09am
188 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:23:07am

re: #185 klys

Since you are around, I discovered yesterday night that my favorite Georgette Heyer novel has finally been released as an unabridged audiobook. She’s considered the mother of Regency romances and has fantastic characters (and at most, you get one kiss).

So I highly recommend considering The Grand Sophy if you’re unsure what to listen to next.

I put it in the cue. I”m not one for romances, but because you recommended it… .

189 klys  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:23:09am

Alarm cat is going off.

“YOU’RE AWAKE LET ME IN LET ME IN LET ME IN MROW MROW MROW MROW MROW.”

190 b.d.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:23:44am

re: #186 wrenchwench

Opponents of SSM already geared up to reject the Black Robed Cabal.

[Embedded content]

Of course by:

the people have spoken

They mean them and not the other people.

191 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:23:54am
192 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:24:54am

re: #183 wrenchwench

And now, hashing out the hashtag.

[Embedded content]

I can understand the confusion over #ssm
It could mean that’s “some spicey meatball”!

193 klys  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:25:40am

re: #188 FemNaziBitch

I put it in the cue. I”m not one for romances, but because you recommended it… .

It’s one of my favorites and I honestly would consider it pretty different than most of the books classified as “romances” these days.

I think you’ll love Sophy, though.

(I will add this warning, because some people end up bothered by it: this was a time period where first cousins marrying was considered acceptable. I found this very easy to ignore.)

194 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:26:13am

re: #192 Backwoods_Sleuth

I can understand the confusion over #ssm
It could mean that’s “some spicey meatball”!

shit smells more?

195 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:27:07am

re: #194 FemNaziBitch

shit smells more?

most especially after those “some spicey meatballs”…

196 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:27:51am

Since I’m on the GoT rollercoaster and book 6 has yet to be published, I’m not sure any book is going to satisfy.

Right now, I have book 4 of Neal Stephenson’s Baroque series.

Just not the same.

197 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:28:52am

re: #179 Vicious Babushka

What’s Prudence going to do when Cuccinelli gets his ass kicked, just like Lonegan, just like Romney? Tweet a bunch of birther shit?

[Embedded content]

Blame the fact that he ran away from Cruz and the shutdown? Because obviously Virginians want a truly consistent right wing nutjob to be our governor. It stinks really because I’m skeptical whether McAuliffe will make even a decent governor but I’d love to be surprised.

198 wrenchwench  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:28:59am

re: #195 Backwoods_Sleuth

most especially after those “some spicey meatballs”…

And there’s always Shattuck St. Mary’s.

200 bubba zanetti  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:29:37am
201 klys  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:31:23am

re: #196 FemNaziBitch

Since I’m on the GoT rollercoaster and book 6 has yet to be published, I’m not sure any book is going to satisfy.

Right now, I have book 4 of Neal Stephenson’s Baroque series.

Just not the same.

As soon as my current listen finishes up (and only because I’m close to the end am I finishing it), I’m starting this one. They’ve only had the abridged version available up until now and I hate abridged stuff.

My sister normally isn’t a fan of romance novels at all but I made her listen to a …less legally obtained copy when we drove out to get the teardrop and she LOVED it.

On the other hand, my mom (who normally does read romance novels) didn’t like it as much. Which I find hard to comprehend, but everyone’s different.

202 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:33:00am

Rand Paul Proves His Ignorance, says “Liberals Have No Idea of How Capitalism Works”

As a liberal, I think I have a damn good grasp of how capitalism works. I also have a pretty good grasp of how flawed capitalism is. “Pure” capitalism is every bit the failure as communism or socialism. Unchecked, and unregulated, capitalism will build a society (as we’ve seen since “Reaganomics” took the U.S. by storm in the 1980s) where a small percentage of the population has everything and the vast majority has next to nothing.

203 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:33:42am

I used to love romance novels about 20 years ago (Nora Roberts my favorite) but now I like detective novels.

204 Lidane  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:34:58am
205 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:36:09am

re: #204 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Bam.

206 FemNaziBitch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:36:55am

going back to bed

207 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:38:10am

STOCKMAN’S INTERN JUST MAKES SHIT UP

208 piratedan  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:38:14am

re: #203 Vicious Babushka

I used to love romance novels about 20 years ago (Nora Roberts my favorite) but now I like detective novels.

lots of different styles for the “detective” novel these days and good purveyors of the craft…. really like Lawrence Block, Carl Hiaasen, Sue Grafton, and Lee Child… and some folks that are off the bell curve but are still “detective stories”, the late George C. Chesbro (the Mongo books) and Glen Cook’s Garrett PI series (fantasy setting) and the spouse adores the Dresden series….

209 SpaceJesus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:38:17am

re: #186 wrenchwench

uh

210 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:38:53am

re: #132 Dark_Falcon

They cost more than $10. I assure you. Just shipping the leather to China and shipping the belt back costs more than that. And the higher quality of workmanship on that kind of belt costs more too, since the better skilled workers who make that type of belt are paid more and have better quarters.

Better quarters? Gee, my employees had to find their own quarters and pay for them out of their own pockets. I guess China really is way ahead of us after all.

/Snowden logic

211 SpaceJesus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:39:34am

my former ethics prof is up now, about to lay the smack

212 piratedan  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:39:52am

re: #210 Shiplord Kirel

Better quarters? Gee, my employees had to find their own quarters and pay for them out of their own pockets. I guess China really is way ahead of us after all.

/Snowden logic

free from having to burden yourself with those decisions, truly liberating :-)

213 dog philosopher  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:41:34am

hemp is a tough plant that can survive well in the dry climates found west of the mississippi

if we make it legal, within a few decades the durn weed will be everywhar and we will have to start eradication efforts

214 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:41:38am

re: #208 piratedan

lots of different styles for the “detective” novel these days and good purveyors of the craft…. really like Lawrence Block, Carl Hiaasen, Sue Grafton, and Lee Child… and some folks that are off the bell curve but are still “detective stories”, the late George C. Chesbro (the Mongo books) and Glen Cook’s Garrett PI series (fantasy setting) and the spouse adores the Dresden series….

I love Lee Child’s Jack Reacher series but the movie was totally ruined by Tom Fucking Cruise.

Also like John Sandford, Jeffery Deaver, and John Lescroart. C.J. Sansom has a great Tudor-period series “Matthew Shardlake” are mysteries set in Tudor-era England.

215 Dr Lizardo  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:44:38am

OT, but for all you Ron Burgundy fans out there, I found the British trailer for “Anchorman 2: The Legend Continues”.

Enjoy.

theguardian.com

216 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:45:19am

re: #213 dog philosopher

hemp is a tough plant that can survive well in the dry climates found west of the mississippi

if we make it legal, within a few decades the durn weed will be everywhar and we will have to start eradication efforts

In many rural areas you can still find descendents of WWII hemp growing wild along fencerows.

217 dog philosopher  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:45:35am

wingnut blogger sez

Allahpundit links to this article about how the “tech surge” of the “best and brightest” isn’t going to be able to fix the problems:

“The final irony here, by the way, will be if the “tech surge” manages to solve the relatively easy problem of how to create a valid user account before it solves the more daunting problem of calculating subsidies or sharing accurate information about the user with insurance companies. That would enable a huge spike in the volume of enrollments before the system is able to process those enrollments correctly; suddenly you’ve got hundreds of thousands of people in the queue instead of tens of thousands right now”

they forgot to deny that anybody would be signing up for the eebil socialist obamacare that nobody wants and all Real Americans are ded set against

218 Lidane  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:45:47am
219 Ian G.  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:46:50am

re: #202 FemNaziBitch

Rand Paul Proves His Ignorance, says “Liberals Have No Idea of How Capitalism Works”

Funny. I studied a lot of capitalism while earning my MBA, and all it did is make me move left, because my jaw hit the floor when I studied macroecon and finance and realized how bug-fuck insane the GOP is when it comes to those fields. The GOP understands economics and finance about as well as they understand biology and climate science.

220 bubba zanetti  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:47:30am

re: #218 Lidane

Who is this Bush person he speaks of?

221 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:49:09am

re: #215 Dr Lizardo

OT, but for all you Ron Burgundy fans out there, I found the British trailer for “Anchorman 2: The Legend Continues”.

Enjoy.

theguardian.com

Hell yeah.

222 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:49:10am

re: #218 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Wow. Ron! Didn’t know that. How many thousands have died in the Obamacare rollout so far? Disabling wounds? Destroyed equipment? I haven’t heard of a single GSA Malibu being destroyed by an IED yet (though one never knows with the TP freaks around), let alone a whole fleet of them.

223 Eclectic Cyborg  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:49:33am
224 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:50:02am

re: #202 FemNaziBitch

Rand Paul Proves His Ignorance, says “Liberals Have No Idea of How Capitalism Works”

It’s precisely because I do understand how capitalism works, Rand that makes me not a fan of your brand and your party’s brand of it.

225 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:50:49am

re: #218 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Except the thousands dead. What a derpfuck. And was he criticizing Bush’s handling of Iraq and Katrina at the time or is this more of the right’s sudden discovery that Bush wasn’t good at his job.

226 wrenchwench  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:50:52am
227 Decatur Deb  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:51:02am

re: #208 piratedan

lots of different styles for the “detective” novel these days and good purveyors of the craft…. really like Lawrence Block, Carl Hiaasen, Sue Grafton, and Lee Child… and some folks that are off the bell curve but are still “detective stories”, the late George C. Chesbro (the Mongo books) and Glen Cook’s Garrett PI series (fantasy setting) and the spouse adores the Dresden series….

Always push Donna Leon’s Commissario Brunetti series. He’s a vice-questore in Venice, loves (in order) his communist/contessa/professora wife, his children, food, and Herotodus. He pulled and fired his Beretta once or twice in 20 volumes. He rarely brings anyone to trial, but justice is always sort of done—it’s Italy.

228 Lidane  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:51:04am

re: #219 Ian G.

Funny. I studied a lot of capitalism while earning my MBA, and all it did is make me move left, because my jaw hit the floor when I studied macroecon and finance and realized how bug-fuck insane the GOP is when it comes to those fields. The GOP understands economics and finance about as well as they understand biology and climate science.

THIS.

My undergraduate thesis was a defense of outsourcing and offshoring American labor, saying companies didn’t need more regulation or oversight because it stifled business. After going through graduate school and getting an MBA, I shifted to the left and couldn’t believe I’d been so wrong. I’m more liberal now after business school than I was as a garden variety college student. Funny how that works.

229 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:51:39am

re: #202 FemNaziBitch

Rand Paul Proves His Ignorance, says “Liberals Have No Idea of How Capitalism Works”

That’s pretty funny, because as Paul Krugman points out, Conservative economists’ predictions have been reliably wrong for years, but most especially since the Crash.

What liberals DON’T do, that Conservatives do, is to worship the Free Market as an end in itself. It’s a tool to advance and enrich society. Like most tools, it can be dangerous it not used properly - like a riding lawnmower: you can’t start it running and then get off and go for a pee while it mows the lawn for you.

230 Decatur Deb  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:52:07am

re: #216 Backwoods_Sleuth

In many rural areas you can still find descendents of WWII hemp growing wild along fencerows.

Navy grew some in Lexington under contract well into the ’70s.

231 dog philosopher  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:52:47am

Rand Paul Proves His Ignorance, says “Liberals Have No Idea of How Capitalism Works”

i thought that was economists

232 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:53:15am

re: #229 GeneJockey

That’s pretty funny, because as Paul Krugman points out, Conservative economists’ predictions have been reliably wrong for years, but most especially since the Crash.

What liberals DON’T do, that Conservatives do, is to worship the Free Market as an end in itself. It’s a tool to advance and enrich society. Like most tools, it can be dangerous it not used properly - like a riding lawnmower: you can’t start it running and then get off and go for a pee while it mows the lawn for you.

This so much about the free market.

233 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:54:27am

re: #231 dog philosopher

Rand Paul Proves His Ignorance, says “Liberals Have No Idea of How Capitalism Works”

i thought that was economists

Only the ones who work from hypothesis to conclusion to data gathering, rather than hypothesis to data gathering to conclusion

234 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:54:43am

I really don’t want to be lectured by someone inspired by the fringey Ludwig von Mises about my understanding of capitalism and economics. We had the economic system that Rand and his father dream about bringing back and what did we have? We had child labor, high work related deaths, and nothing resembling a middle class. So yeah fuck off Rand.

235 piratedan  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:55:07am

re: #227 Decatur Deb

sounds cool, I may check it out!

236 wrenchwench  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:55:53am
237 dog philosopher  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:55:59am

re: #229 GeneJockey

That’s pretty funny, because as Paul Krugman points out, Conservative economists’ predictions have been reliably wrong for years, but most especially since the Crash.

What liberals DON’T do, that Conservatives do, is to worship the Free Market as an end in itself. It’s a tool to advance and enrich society. Like most tools, it can be dangerous it not used properly - like a riding lawnmower: you can’t start it running and then get off and go for a pee while it mows the lawn for you.

according to right wing ‘economics’, with the right free market incentives, the lawnmower will not only mow the lawn for you, but also hold your dick while you pee

238 Lidane  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:58:39am

re: #234 HappyWarrior

I really don’t want to be lectured by someone inspired by the fringey Ludwig von Mises about my understanding of capitalism and economics.

Oh geez. I used to argue with some von Mises fanboy at a different message board years ago. He’d drone on and on about how anarcho-capitalism was the only valid economic system and everything else was theft. He’d also advocate for privatizing everything, including the courts, the police, and all emergency services and disaster relief. Shocka — he was a Luap Nor fanboy too.

239 wrenchwench  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:58:41am

Twitter is almost five minutes ahead of my ‘live’ feed.

240 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:59:03am

Obamacare is worse than Genghis Khan’s sack of Baghdad (not that sacking Baghdad is a bad thing, mind you), or maybe even Sherman’s March.

241 Eclectic Cyborg  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:59:22am

Cop buys $100 of groceries for woman after busting her for shoplifting

The South Florida mom admitted she’d been driven to taking groceries because she was struggling to feed her three children but had no money left for food, reports WSVN-TV.

The woman stopped at a Publix at the end of September, where cops said she walked out with a cart filled with $300 worth of groceries without paying first.

“I asked her, ‘Why would you do that? What would make you do that?’ ” said the police officer who stopped her. “And she said, ‘My children are hungry.’”

At that point the police officer ran her criminal history and saw that she hadn’t done anything like this before, so she charged her with a misdemeanor and handed her a notice to appear in court.

Here’s where the magical heartwarming action kicks into gear.

“I made the decision to buy her some groceries because arresting her wasn’t going to solve the problem with her children being hungry,” she said. “So I went in and bought her some groceries.”

The total came to $100 worth of food for the woman’s kids, who eagerly rifled through the bags right then and there.

“To see them go through the bags when we brought them in, it was like Christmas,” the officer said. “That $100 to me was worth it.”

Sad that I can already speculate what the RWNJ response to this story will be.

242 dog philosopher  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 9:59:22am

“Liberals Have No Idea of How Capitalism Works”

according to people who say things like this, nobody calling themself a progressive has a mortgage, a high paying job, or runs a small business

243 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:00:07am

re: #238 Lidane

Oh geez. I used to argue with some von Mises fanboy at a different message board years ago. He’d drone on and on about how anarcho-capitalism was the only valid economic system and everything else was theft. He’d also advocate for privatizing everything, including the courts, the police, and all emergency services and disaster relief. Shocka — he was a Luap Nor fanboy too.

Is there any Von Mises fanboy who isn’t also a Luap Nor? Seems to me that all these people hear about the “wonders” of Von Mises from Luap Nor who despite his bullshit is no economist and I imagine took very few economics courses if any in his life.

244 Internet Tough Guy  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:00:08am

re: #240 Shiplord Kirel

Obamacare is worse than Genghis Khan’s sack of Baghdad (not that sacking Baghdad is a bad thing, mind you), or maybe even Sherman’s March.

That’s all well and good, but is it worse than Sherman’s March on Baghdad?

245 EPR-radar  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:00:11am

re: #228 Lidane

THIS.

My undergraduate thesis was a defense of outsourcing and offshoring American labor, saying companies didn’t need more regulation or oversight because it stifled business. After going through graduate school and getting an MBA, I shifted to the left and couldn’t believe I’d been so wrong. I’m more liberal now after business school than I was as a garden variety college student. Funny how that works.

I honestly don’t see how a globalized labor market is consistent with any sensible economic policy in the developed world. It is just not possible for somewhat lower prices on goods to compensate for the earnings lost as jobs go elsewhere.

246 lawhawk  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:00:31am
247 Decatur Deb  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:00:40am

re: #235 piratedan

sounds cool, I may check it out!

First in the series is Death at La Fenice. The order is only important for watching development of the cast of characters. His secretary, Signorina Elettra, is hypercool.

248 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:01:12am

re: #236 wrenchwench

[Embedded content]

As they should be. We don’t ban elderly couples or couples who cannot conceive from marriage. Claiming that marriage should be limited to a man and woman because of creation is a stupid and outdated argument and one that will lose in the court of public opinion.

249 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:01:20am

re: #234 HappyWarrior

I really don’t want to be lectured by someone inspired by the fringey Ludwig von Mises about my understanding of capitalism and economics. We had the economic system that Rand and his father dream about bringing back and what did we have? We had child labor, high work related deaths, and nothing resembling a middle class. So yeah fuck off Rand.

The problem is, they’re all stuck in dogma, and their model of the Free Market doesn’t really work as they claim beyond the level of a village, and presupposes equality of power and information among all participants.

For example, the reasoning behind their opposition to labor unions is apparently all based on Sole Proprietor businesses, so that the workers all get together to extort from the employer, whom they always see as ONE SINGLE GUY, even though union shops are almost exclusively corporations owned by a number of shareholders/investors.

250 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:01:59am

re: #246 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

But Dr. Greenwald err Evil said they never do anything good.

251 wrenchwench  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:01:59am

re: #248 HappyWarrior

As they should be. We don’t ban elderly couples or couples who cannot conceive from marriage. Claiming that marriage should be limited to a man and woman because of creation is a stupid and outdated argument and one that will lose in the court of public opinion.

And, I hope, in the New Mexico Supreme Court.

252 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:02:01am

re: #178 piratedan

by all means, yes, the proprieties must be observed. If only you held the entire Republican caucus to the same standards every time that they open their mouths to talk about the ACA, you might actually have a point about there being any kind of false equivalency. We’d have the national debt down by a few hundred bucks by the end of the day if there was a nickel jar that got filled each time one of your GOP reps spoke to the media about the ACA and all of the inherent evil filled within.

You misunderstand me. I’m not claiming Dick Durbin made an improper disclosure. I’m saying that, absent his naming the congressman who “couldn’t stand to look at” President Obama, I do not believe his story to be true. I’m calling “BS!” on the story, not claiming equivalence.

253 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:02:42am

re: #237 dog philosopher

according to right wing ‘economics’, with the right free market incentives, the lawnmower will not only mow the lawn for you, but also hold your dick while you pee

The thought of a lawnmower getting anywhere near my dick is only slightly less frightening than Sarah Palin swearing the Oath of Office.

254 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:02:46am

re: #251 wrenchwench

And, I hope, in the New Mexico Supreme Court.

Let’s hope so.

255 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:03:04am

Also I want to mention Walter Moseley. Obdicut recommended this author and he is terrific! Easy Rawlins is a mystery series set in LA in the ‘50’s and ‘60’s, featuring an African-American private eye.

256 Backwoods_Sleuth  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:03:34am

re: #240 Shiplord Kirel

Obamacare is worse than Genghis Khan’s sack of Baghdad (not that sacking Baghdad is a bad thing, mind you), or maybe even Sherman’s March.

First image I got was someone stuck holding a paper bag of Baghdads…
perhaps even a flaming bag of Baghdads…

257 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:03:52am

re: #252 Dark_Falcon

You misunderstand me. I’m not claiming Dick Durbin made an improper disclosure. I’m saying that, absent his naming the congressman who “couldn’t stand to look at” President Obama, I do not believe his story to be true. I’m calling “BS!” on the story, not claiming equivalence.

My surprise, etc.

258 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:04:18am

re: #256 Backwoods_Sleuth

First image I got was someone stuck holding a paper bag of Baghdads…
perhaps even a flaming bag of Baghdads…

Then ring the doorbell and run like hell.

259 SpaceJesus  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:05:22am

The AG is kicking butt

260 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:06:05am

re: #243 HappyWarrior

Is there any Von Mises fanboy who isn’t also a Luap Nor? Seems to me that all these people hear about the “wonders” of Von Mises from Luap Nor who despite his bullshit is no economist and I imagine took very few economics courses if any in his life.

Yes, actually. Some Von Mises fanboys are also neocons who think Paul’s off his rocker on international affairs.

261 Lidane  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:08:25am

re: #245 EPR-radar

I honestly don’t see how a globalized labor market is consistent with any sensible economic policy in the developed world. It is just not possible for somewhat lower prices on goods to compensate for the earnings lost as jobs go elsewhere.

Yeah, I see that now. I didn’t see it at the time. At the time I argued that jobs going to less developed markets would hurt the US in the short term but that in the long-term a more educated, more skilled workforce would make up for it. And the new jobs and new companies moving overseas would raise the standard of living in those areas, enabling workers there to improve their lives.

It seemed like a good idea at the time and I made a Utilitarian case for it, but in retrospect, holy shit was I wrong. I freely admit that now.

262 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:09:30am

re: #260 GeneJockey

Yes, actually. Some Von Mises fanboys are also neocons who think Paul’s off his rocker on international affairs.

I’ve actually never met such a person. Now I’ve met neo-cons who are Hayek and Friedman inspired but while I disagree with the economic worldview of those two, I think they were more practical than LVM. Me though, still subscribe to Keynes all the way because I think Keynes understood more than the others that economics does effect people and we can’t look at the market as some abstract benevolent force.

263 klys  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:10:21am

re: #252 Dark_Falcon

You misunderstand me. I’m not claiming Dick Durbin made an improper disclosure. I’m saying that, absent his naming the congressman who “couldn’t stand to look at” President Obama, I do not believe his story to be true. I’m calling “BS!” on the story, not claiming equivalence.

I think the response you’re getting is because people wish this critical thinking was not only applied to statements critical of Republicans.

264 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:11:48am

re: #261 Lidane

Yeah, I see that now. I didn’t see it at the time. At the time I argued that jobs going to less developed markets would hurt the US in the short term but that in the long-term a more educated, more skilled workforce would make up for it. And the new jobs and new companies moving overseas would raise the standard of living in those areas, enabling workers there to improve their lives.

It seemed like a good idea at the time and I made a Utilitarian case for it, but in retrospect, holy shit was I wrong. I freely admit that now.

I was once arguing with a Von Mises fanboy about offshoring etc. His claim was that lower prices for consumers was an unalloyed good thing. His response to the issue of lost jobs, competing with sweatshops in the 3rd World, worker safety etc. was that it was their fault for not gettng better jobs.

So, you get to combine brainlessness with heartlessness. The Scarecrow and the Tin Man, all in one package.

265 sagehen  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:12:34am

Mississippi Tea Party Senate Challenger Attended Neo-Confederate Gatherings

Mississippi State Sen. Chris McDaniel (R), the recently announced primary challenger for Sen. Thad Cochran’s (R-Miss) Senate seat, spoke at a neo-Confederate conference in Laurel, Mississippi in August, according to Mother Jones.

The conference was hosted by the Jones County Rosin Heels, a local chapter of the Sons of Confederate Veterans. Invitations for the event described it as a “Southern Heritage Conference” intended for “politically incorrect folks.” Actually, Mother Jones also noted, that event was the second Jones County Rosin Heels event he recently attended. In June McDaniel was the keynote speaker at the Division Reunion in Jackson, also hosted by the Jones County Rosin Heels.

The Jones County Heels have been pretty clear about its secessionist sentiments, Mother Jones further noted. The group’s newsletter said in September said that “we are living in the times that Jefferson Davis predicted would one day come” where the disagreements that resulted in the Civil War arose again.

My surprise, let me show you.

266 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:14:08am

I’m not totally against out-sourcing but the one fault I’ve had with people who support outsourcing at all costs is they don’t take in mind that for many manufacturing areas that this all the people there have known. Take the steel mills where my great uncle worked. You had literally generations of people working in the steel mills. And I also have a big problem with companies going overseas simply because they want to get around labor and environment regs. I think that’s shitty.

267 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:14:54am

re: #265 sagehen

Mississippi Tea Party Senate Challenger Attended Neo-Confederate Gatherings

My surprise, let me show you.

I’d be honestly shocked if he hadn’t. Just another guy there to outwingnut Ted Cruz and Rand Paul since Rand Paul only employs neo-confederates.//

268 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:15:45am

re: #266 HappyWarrior

I’m not totally against out-sourcing but the one fault I’ve had with people who support outsourcing at all costs is they don’t take in mind that for many manufacturing areas that this all the people there have known. Take the steel mills where my great uncle worked. You had literally generations of people working in the steel mills. And I also have a big problem with companies going overseas simply because they want to get around labor and environment regs. I think that’s shitty.

HURR HURR YOONYUNZ!!!11!!!! HURR HURR DEMOCRATZ WRECKED DETROIT!!!1!!!!11!!!!!

269 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:16:46am

re: #262 HappyWarrior

I’ve actually never met such a person. Now I’ve met neo-cons who are Hayek and Friedman inspired but while I disagree with the economic worldview of those two, I think they were more practical than LVM. Me though, still subscribe to Keynes all the way because I think Keynes understood more than the others that economics does effect people and we can’t look at the market as some abstract benevolent force.

I confess to not having studied economics beyond simple observation, and a bit of reading Krugman’s columns and such. One reason why I’m Keynesian is that the models seem to make useful predictions, which is how you evaluate a model/hypothesis. And Krugman’s dissection of opposing viewpoints is generally along the lines of, “If that were true, then it would predict these things. Are they true?”

I admit, I’m a data guy, and not much for “Principles”, like “Government Can’t Create Jobs” - which, if true, would predict that the absence of government spending could not destroy them, which not even Ron Paul believes.

270 wrenchwench  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:17:58am
271 Lidane  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:19:18am
272 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:19:32am

re: #269 GeneJockey

I confess to not having studied economics beyond simple observation, and a bit of reading Krugman’s columns and such. One reason why I’m Keynesian is that the models seem to make useful predictions, which is how you evaluate a model/hypothesis. And Krugman’s dissection of opposing viewpoints is generally along the lines of, “If that were true, then it would predict these things. Are they true?”

I admit, I’m a data guy, and not much for “Principles”, like “Government Can’t Create Jobs” - which, if true, would predict that the absence of government spending could not destroy them, which not even Ron Paul believes.

I’m really not either but this is a good point about Krugman. Honestly, I think we’ve seen that Supply Side Economics just doesn’t work. It may have a possibility of working a little if our conservatives didn’t refuse to touch the defense budget. I’m sorry but you can’t preach low spending while you ignore the big elephant in the room (defense spending). It’s why the Ryan Plan should have been mocked by anyone with even the slightest economic sense.

273 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:19:33am

re: #266 HappyWarrior

I’m not totally against out-sourcing but the one fault I’ve had with people who support outsourcing at all costs is they don’t take in mind that for many manufacturing areas that this all the people there have known. Take the steel mills where my great uncle worked. You had literally generations of people working in the steel mills. And I also have a big problem with companies going overseas simply because they want to get around labor and environment regs. I think that’s shitty.

Simply put, we export the labor and environmental standards of the Gilded Age. At first, that all works just fine, except for the folks who lose their jobs. But soon that number grows to the point where the reduced compensation to workers here no longer can sustain the purchasing needed to keep the economy growing.

274 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:20:14am

re: #271 Lidane

[Embedded content]

IKnew that was coming. Just knew it!

275 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:21:16am

re: #273 GeneJockey

Simply put, we export the labor and environmental standards of the Gilded Age. At first, that all works just fine, except for the folks who lose their jobs. But soon that number grows to the point where the reduced compensation to workers here no longer can sustain the purchasing needed to keep the economy growing.

Tell that to the Waltons.

276 Feline Fearless Leader  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:24:03am

re: #196 FemNaziBitch

Since I’m on the GoT rollercoaster and book 6 has yet to be published, I’m not sure any book is going to satisfy.

Right now, I have book 4 of Neal Stephenson’s Baroque series.

Just not the same.

Was wandering in a somewhat eclectic bookstore in Wilmington last week and my brother recommended a book from their used section:

_The Poisonwood Bible_ by Barbara Kingsolver

Non-spoiler from wikipedia:

The Poisonwood Bible (1998) by Barbara Kingsolver is a bestselling novel about a missionary family, the Prices, who in 1959 move from Georgia (U.S. state) to the village of Kilanga in the Belgian Congo, close to the Kwilu River. (The nearest town, an impossibly long journey away, is Bulungu.) The Prices’ story, which parallels their host country’s tumultuous emergence into the post-colonial era, is narrated by the five women of the family: Orleanna, the long-suffering wife of Baptist missionary Nathan Price, and their four daughters—Rachel, Leah, Adah, and Ruth May.

From the initial background as above I knew things would not go well for the characters. Was still a good read since the writing was good and there were some very good turns of phrase.

277 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:24:04am

re: #275 Vicious Babushka

Tell that to the Waltons.

From what I hear, they’re discovering it all on their own.

278 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:25:27am

re: #273 GeneJockey

Simply put, we export the labor and environmental standards of the Gilded Age. At first, that all works just fine, except for the folks who lose their jobs. But soon that number grows to the point where the reduced compensation to workers here no longer can sustain the purchasing needed to keep the economy growing.

I think I remember when I took economics (this was right around the time the 2008 Dem primaries heated up). Anyhow, there was one economist. I forget his name. He acknowledged the inevitably of outsourcing but he talked about how companies needed to retrain workers who lost their jobs or something like that. IIRC my professor said this was pretty controversial among the more conservative economists. I thought it was practical. I mean, I’m not naive or foolish enough to want no free trade but at the same time, I think if we outsource jobs, we have to realize that we are impacting a way of life.

279 Lidane  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:26:44am

This is helpful:

280 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:29:20am

re: #279 Lidane

This is helpful:

[Embedded content]

Only if you pilot the plane delivering the missile, Shel. Fucking war mongreling idiots. This guy’s not going to have his life negatively impacted by the consequences of doing such a stupid thing but a lot of other people would.

281 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:29:44am

re: #278 HappyWarrior

I think I remember when I took economics (this was right around the time the 2008 Dem primaries heated up). Anyhow, there was one economist. I forget his name. He acknowledged the inevitably of outsourcing but he talked about how companies needed to retrain workers who lost their jobs or something like that. IIRC my professor said this was pretty controversial among the more conservative economists. I thought it was practical. I mean, I’m not naive or foolish enough to want no free trade but at the same time, I think if we outsource jobs, we have to realize that we are impacting a way of life.

The problem is, we’re long past the time when employers felt any responsibility to their employees, if we ever even experienced such a time. In my discussions with Conservatives, often small business owners, I found them uniformly to consider employees as akin to sheep - you pay them as little as you can, and for that they’re supposed to be grateful and every last one should put out his absolute best effort at all times. On the employer’s side, it’s a business arrangement, but for the employee they see it as a moral obligation.

282 HappyWarrior  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:32:23am

re: #281 GeneJockey

The problem is, we’re long past the time when employers felt any responsibility to their employees, if we ever even experienced such a time. In my discussions with Conservatives, often small business owners, I found them uniformly to consider employees as akin to sheep - you pay them as little as you can, and for that they’re supposed to be grateful and every last one should put out his absolute best effort at all times. On the employer’s side, it’s a business arrangement, but for the employee they see it as a moral obligation.

Yeah, this is a problem. It sucks too because employers really should value their employees. We can argue all we want about entrepreneurship and blah blah but deep down, it is labor that makes businesses succeed or fail.

283 Internet Tough Guy  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:33:51am

re: #280 HappyWarrior

And then Russia preempts and we all die.

284 BeenHereAwhile  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:34:44am

re: #74 FemNaziBitch

I’m on day 3 of some very weird bug. Pain, congestion, fatigue, pain.

Gloom Despair & Agony On Me

Youtube Video

285 sagehen  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:35:55am

re: #272 HappyWarrior

I’m really not either but this is a good point about Krugman. Honestly, I think we’ve seen that Supply Side Economics just doesn’t work. It may have a possibility of working a little if our conservatives didn’t refuse to touch the defense budget. I’m sorry but you can’t preach low spending while you ignore the big elephant in the room (defense spending). It’s why the Ryan Plan should have been mocked by anyone with even the slightest economic sense.

People don’t seem to remember that the whole point of Reagan’s economic policies was that when he took office inflation and interest rates were well into the double digits — getting those under control was the important first step in getting the economy back on track. Contracting the money supply and at the same time giving companies cash that they’d be eager to put into capital investment (since it devalued every day if they didn’t spend it on something of physical use), suited the conditions of the moment.

And within a couple of years, Reagan reversed course on taxes, signing what was at the time the largest tax increase in history because it was time to start reining in deficits.

286 GeneJockey  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 10:37:46am

re: #282 HappyWarrior

Yeah, this is a problem. It sucks too because employers really should value their employees. We can argue all we want about entrepreneurship and blah blah but deep down, it is labor that makes businesses succeed or fail.

The problem is seeing any one facet as being THE KEY, because it misses the whole picture and gives the ones with the most power (the wealthy) the whip hand. For a company to be successful, you need investors, management, workers, suppliers, and customers. Without any one of these, you have failure. Yet the investor class have convinced a large chunk of America that the first two are all you need, and that customers and workers are just a given.

287 ObserverArt  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 11:09:49am

re: #257 GeneJockey

My surprise, etc.

Isn’t it nice to see Dark holding Democrats to such high standards.

/

288 S'latch  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 11:40:49am

I hope marijuana is legal soon because I have wanted to try it my whole life, but I have always refused it because it is illegal.

289 BusyMonster  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 1:24:02pm

re: #17 Targetpractice

Like Election Night ‘12, Karl can’t believe that things aren’t going to script. .

Watching Karl melt down that evening was one of the best moments of my life, period. I know schadenfreude is not supposed to be nice, but when you’ve seen a serial liar, asshole, and saboteur fuck your country over year after year after year, and then to see his arrogance and high-handedness vanish in a puff of smoke, well it is delightful. I have to say I jeered, laughed, and crowed over it. I got on the Intertoobz and I sought out loud-mouthed right-wingers and I rubbed it the fuck in.

But I also realized that my picture of him as some sort of mastermind also evaporated that night, and it became obvious to me that he’s just not as smart as he thinks he is. Like virtually all Republicans today.

Honestly the political divide in this nation seems to be coming down to smart people telling the dumbest and most ignorant among us to shut up and get out of the way. The GOP have begun to self-select only the stupidest, most easily-led fools, and the opposition isn’t so much “liberals” as it is “everyone else who wants to put adults back in charge of this nation.”

290 BusyMonster  Wed, Oct 23, 2013 1:28:11pm

re: #275 Vicious Babushka

Tell that to the Waltons.

I think the invisible hand is already telling the Waltons. I was reading news stories about them having supply problems several months ago, and I know an ex-employee and basically they have hardly any stock on the shelves.

They’ve overplayed their mosopony hand and from the rumblings I am hearing it has begun to backfire. That, and the fact that they are creating a dependency on food stamps and Medicaid with their poverty wages, and thereby basically leeching off the taxpayer to keep in business.

I wouldn’t mind watching Wal-Mart implode. They are not propping up our economy — they’re siphoning off it.


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