Facebook Is Keeping Track of the Things You DON’T Post

Your inner thoughts are Facebook’s marketing tools
Internet • Views: 40,687

The NSA is a topic of discussion on social media tonight because of 60 Minutes, but here’s something I bet you didn’t know about the incredibly intrusive techniques Facebook uses to monitor everything you do on their site (and beyond): Facebook Self-Censorship: What Happens to the Posts You Don’t Publish?

We spend a lot of time thinking about what to post on Facebook. Should you argue that political point your high school friend made? Do your friends really want to see yet another photo of your cat (or baby)? Most of us have, at one time or another, started writing something and then, probably wisely, changed our minds.

Unfortunately, the code that powers Facebook still knows what you typed—even if you decide not to publish it. It turns out that the things you explicitly choose not to share aren’t entirely private.

Facebook calls these unposted thoughts “self-censorship,” and insights into how it collects these nonposts can be found in a recent paper written by two Facebookers. Sauvik Das, a Ph.D. student at Carnegie Mellon and summer software engineer intern at Facebook, and Adam Kramer, a Facebook data scientist, have put online an article presenting their study of the self-censorship behavior collected from 5 million English-speaking Facebook users. It reveals a lot about how Facebook monitors our unshared thoughts and what it thinks about them.

The study examined aborted status updates, posts on other people’s timelines, and comments on others’ posts. To collect the text you type, Facebook sends code to your browser. That code automatically analyzes what you type into any text box and reports metadata back to Facebook.

Yes, Facebook is actually keeping track of the things you don’t post. The stuff you delete because you thought better of it. The stuff you thought was gone forever, bits lost in the ether. The stuff you didn’t want anyone to see.

Facebook sees it, and records it, and analyzes it.

Jump to bottom

430 comments
1 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:07:29pm

Oh shit.

2 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:08:04pm

what if you didn’t even type it out on FB, but you posted it to Teh Twitters or even LGF?

3 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:08:12pm

W.T.F.

I guess my instinct was very right about not ever opening a FB acct.

4 Charles Johnson  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:10:13pm

Yes, Facebook is watching your “self-censorship.”

5 jonhendry  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:10:47pm

“Facebook sees it, and records it, and analyzes it.”

From the quoted passage, it would appear that what is recorded is only digested metadata, not everything you typed in.

6 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:11:34pm

But, of course, Facebook is a private company, so its invasion of its customers privacy is not worth getting worked up over. Only time it’s of note is when it gives info the NSA.

////

7 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:12:47pm

Facebook is keeping all ur Internet Vomits!!!

8 Charles Johnson  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:13:36pm

re: #5 jonhendry

“Facebook sees it, and records it, and analyzes it.”

From the quoted passage, it would appear that what is recorded is only digested metadata, not everything you typed in.

Metadata created by analyzing the text. Not metadata about the text.

9 darthstar  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:13:40pm

But Facebook is my friend!

10 darthstar  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:15:38pm
11 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:15:59pm

TOTALLY A WHITE GUY

12 darthstar  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:17:58pm

re: #11 Lord of the Pies

TOTALLY A WHITE GUY

[Embedded content]

Right after he got back from a weekend in Puerto Vallarta.

13 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:17:59pm

re: #11 Lord of the Pies

Ancient Painting of St. Nick proves #RWNJ claim that Santa has always been white.

Now, on to the question of whether reindeer really know how to fly.

14 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:19:28pm

re: #11 Lord of the Pies

TOTALLY A WHITE GUY

[Embedded content]

B-b-b-but, my little Russian and Yugoslavian St. Nicholas statues don’t even have a tan!

15 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:21:14pm

I’m sure the NSA knows far less about me than the internet does.

16 b.d.  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:21:17pm

re: #11 Lord of the Pies

TOTALLY A WHITE GUY

[Embedded content]

WHO THE HELL’S LAP HAVE I BEEN SITTING ON ALL OF THESE YEARS THEN!?!?!?!

17 b.d.  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:23:34pm

re: #15 Justanotherhuman

I’m sure the NSA knows far less about me than the internet does.

P&G, Nestle, Coca-Cola, Wal*Mart etc. care a LOT more about me than my government.

18 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:24:46pm

Russian icon, c. 1500, depicting St. Nicholas.

Image: Icon_c_1500_St_Nicholas.JPG

19 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:25:11pm

re: #17 b.d.

P&G, Nestle, Coca-Cola, Wal*Mart etc. care a >LOT more about me than my government.

Nah, they just care about your wallet.

20 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:25:38pm

re: #10 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Criminals are a cowardly and superstitious lot.

21 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:26:10pm

I looked at my last 4 FB posts:

1. Pie
2. Pie
3. Hanukkah in Alabama
4. Hanukkah in Alabama

22 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:27:01pm

re: #10 darthstar

[Embedded content]

Where is the one that looked like a mouth full of teeth?

23 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:30:30pm

re: #22 Lord of the Pies

Where is the one that looked like a mouth full of teeth?

You mean these optical illusions?

google.com

24 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:31:15pm
25 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:31:39pm

re: #18 Justanotherhuman

Russian icon, c. 1500, depicting St. Nicholas.

Image: Icon_c_1500_St_Nicholas.JPG

Somebody should paint a penguin over that before it hurts someone’s feelings.

26 Mentis Fugit  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:32:26pm

re: #18 Justanotherhuman

Russian icon, c. 1500, depicting St. Nicholas.
Image: Icon_c_1500_St_Nicholas.JPG

Dear Megyn,

When 14th Century Russia is more progressive than you, you might have a problem.

Love,
Reality

27 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:32:33pm

re: #24 Lord of the Pies

[Embedded content]

Wow, a normal human being, having a cigarette. My God, what a monster he is.

////

28 dog philosopher  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:32:41pm

i’m keeping a detailed log of all the things people refuse to think

as to what it all means, i refuse to think about it

29 Varek Raith  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:33:18pm

“Self censorship”?

Oy.

30 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:33:35pm

re: #27 Targetpractice

Wow, a normal human being, having a cigarette. My God, what a monster he is.

////

HURR HURR TAHT IS TEH MARIHUANA!!!!!111!!!

31 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:34:12pm

HURR HURR OBAMA TOTALLY BOGARTED TEH JOINT!!!!11!!!!1

32 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:35:17pm

re: #30 Lord of the Pies

HURR HURR TAHT IS TEH MARIHUANA!!!!!111!!!

Dude, one toke then pass! That’s the rule!

//

33 lawhawk  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:35:30pm

re: #4 Charles Johnson

Facebook Pre-Cog. They know the thoughts that you want to forget.

It’s as though they’ve got themselves keylogging for all Facebook entries, and they don’t delete anything because even the deletions have some value. It helps tailor their ads/statistics/marketing even further, but by being ever more intrusive into the lives of people who use it.

34 Internet Tough Guy  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:35:43pm

re: #24 Lord of the Pies

SMOKE WEED EVERY DAY

35 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:36:04pm

re: #32 Targetpractice

Dude, one toke then pass! That’s the rule!

//

An always pass to the left.

RBS
Or so I’ve been told.

36 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:37:11pm

re: #32 Targetpractice

Dude, one toke then pass! That’s the rule!

//

I was always accused of double toking. But I blithely explained I didn’t inhale deeply, so it took two tries where it might only take them one. : )

37 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:38:33pm

I can only imagine the next generation, looking back on us getting all bent out of shape that a politician might have once smoked pot in his youth.

38 JustMark  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:39:55pm

re: #37 Targetpractice

I can only imagine the next generation, looking back on us getting all bent out of shape that a politician might have once smoked pot in his youth.

Next generation?

39 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:41:29pm

I must sleep…laterz lizardz!

40 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:41:38pm

re: #37 Targetpractice

I can only imagine the next generation, looking back on us getting all bent out of shape that a politician might have once smoked pot in his youth.

Hey, I’m not getting bent out of shape and I’m an old lady. I had a goodly share. And would like some more, except we don’t smoke around the munchkin and I don’t get much of a chance to get out much anymore. : )

41 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:41:57pm

re: #38 JustMark

Next generation?

The kids who will be coming of age over the next couple of elections. The ones to whom pot usage is slowly becoming acceptable behavior by a majority of the public. When the response to admitting to have smoked pot is not “Don’t you realize that’s illegal?!,” but rather “Well, just so long as you were safe about it.”

42 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:43:00pm

re: #41 Targetpractice

The kids who will be coming of age over the next couple of elections. The ones to whom pot usage is slowly becoming acceptable behavior by a majority of the public. When the response to admitting to have smoked pot is not “Don’t you realize that’s illegal?!,” but rather “Well, just so long as you were safe about it.”

They said the same thing about kids who came of age in the ‘70’s.

How’d that work out?

43 Varek Raith  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:44:27pm

re: #42 Lord of the Pies

They said the same thing about kids who came of age in the ‘70’s.

How’d that work out?

To be fair, they thought disco was awesome.
;)

44 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:44:49pm

re: #43 Varek Raith

To be fair, they thought disco was awesome.
;)

When you’re that high, disco IS good.

//

45 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:45:40pm

Disco sucked.

46 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:46:00pm

The ‘70’s was the WORST FASHION DECADE EVER.

47 Varek Raith  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:47:13pm

re: #46 Lord of the Pies

The ‘70’s was the WORST FASHION DECADE EVER.

WHAT WERE YOU ALL THINKING?!?!
/

48 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:47:19pm

re: #46 Lord of the Pies

The ‘70’s was the WORST FASHION DECADE EVER.

I like to joke with my father, who came of age in the 70s, about how much of the decade could just be written off to rampant drug usage. That things collapsed when everybody sobered up and realized what they were wearing.

49 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:47:42pm

re: #37 Targetpractice

I can only imagine the next generation, looking back on us getting all bent out of shape that a politician might have one smoked pot in his youth.

My Father, who at 86 is more progressive than I am, is pleasantly surprised that both Gay Marriage and Marijuana legalization have progressed at the rate they have in the last few years. it’s funny, he spent a lot of his life working as an Electronics Engineer for the Air Force, but he gets so upset at some of the TP folks he runs into down in Florida. As he says, there is a lot of disguised racism, and some that is pretty blatant.

RBS

50 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:48:55pm

YOU ARE A RACIST WHO ADMIRES A WAR CRIMINAL.

51 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:49:53pm

BUT IT ALL COMES OUT HURR HURR DERP DERP ARGLE BARGLE

52 Mentis Fugit  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:50:32pm

re: #46 Lord of the Pies

The ‘70’s was the WORST FASHION DECADE EVER.

The Decade That Taste Forgot

53 Varek Raith  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:50:49pm

re: #51 Lord of the Pies

BUT IT ALL COMES OUT HURR HURR DERP DERP ARGLE BARGLE

[Embedded content]

Youngcons indeed.
/over their heads

54 Amory Blaine  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:51:07pm
55 Varek Raith  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:51:48pm

re: #54 Amory Blaine

[Embedded content]

Thank Zod they only had swords.

56 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:51:52pm

re: #51 Lord of the Pies

BUT IT ALL COMES OUT HURR HURR DERP DERP ARGLE BARGLE

[Embedded content]

“Strict interpretation of the Constitution,” except for that part about “well-organized militia,” no provisions for a standing Army, no mention of an Air Force, no filibuster, no veterans benefits/social security/medicare for those of us who’ve “earned it,”…

57 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:52:21pm

re: #45 Lord of the Pies

Disco sucked.

That’s why some of us were still listening to ’60s and early ’70s music into the ’80s. Oh wait, I forgot about hair music that came after disco, then whatever that stuff was after that, so make that like, forever? I guess that makes me a music conservative? Ouch.

58 Internet Tough Guy  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:52:55pm

re: #51 Lord of the Pies

Do they allow children on Twitter?

59 Belafon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:53:57pm

re: #54 Amory Blaine

So, keeping people alive is a far greater danger to the US than killing them. Got it.

60 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:53:57pm

re: #58 Internet Tough Guy

Do they allow children on Twitter?

Hey it’s a “Young Conservative” no older than 62!

61 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:53:59pm

What… these weren’t the peak of fashion???

RBS

62 Political Atheist  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:54:03pm

re: #4 Charles Johnson

It would be easy to give up Facebook. No more unposted screeds to analyze. Heck it’s even free of charge. Or type my posts in another bit of software instead of the entry box at FB, cut and paste only what I choose to post.

But I can’t really reduce or even modify how the NSA chooses to treat my cell phone or email.

63 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:54:59pm

Well whatever it is, she better have “rape insurance”

64 Varek Raith  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:55:01pm

re: #61 RealityBasedSteve

What… these weren’t the peak of fashion???
[Embedded image]

[Embedded image]

RBS

PEWPEWPEW.

65 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:55:02pm

re: #54 Amory Blaine

Justice Robert’s pen & Obamacare has done more damage to the USA then the swords of the Nazis,Soviets & terrorists combined.

IT’S “THAN”, SENATOR, “THAN”.

66 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:55:11pm

re: #57 Justanotherhuman

That’s why some of us were still listening to ’60s and early ’70s music into the ’80s. Oh wait, I forgot about hair music that came after disco, then whatever that stuff was after that, so make that like, forever? I guess that makes me a music conservative? Ouch.

Don’t feel too bad. Kids of my generation will one day have to listen to groups like Nirvana and Linkin Park referred to as “Oldies.”

67 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:55:50pm

Obamuhcare roont mah speling.

68 Belafon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:56:04pm

re: #62 Political Atheist

You can choose not to use a cell phone. And for some people, like my wife and son, facebook is just as useful as texting on the phone.

69 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:56:36pm

Maybe this Image: old-telephone.jpg and this Image: envelope.gif were actually safer?

Heh.

70 Internet Tough Guy  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:57:51pm

re: #61 RealityBasedSteve

Needs more pockets.

71 Belafon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:58:15pm

Hey, Charles, how easy would it be to add that to your website?

72 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:58:58pm

re: #63 Lord of the Pies

Kristen Snow-White

That name’s like a poker tell or something.

73 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 6:59:49pm

re: #63 Lord of the Pies

Well whatever it is, she better have “rape insurance”

[Embedded content]

Anymore, I’ve begun to tune out the “What about our kids?!” crowd, as most either seem to be Boomers who have no room to talk about leaving nothing to the next generation, and Millenials like myself who got raised on Boomer nostalgia for their own childhoods.

74 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:00:10pm

re: #70 Internet Tough Guy

Needs more pockets.

I remember them well, and since they were made of a 100% polyester doubleknit they would last forever, unless exposed to UV or open flame. I figure that somewhere down on the Jersey docks, there are still warehouses full of them still.

RBS

75 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:00:34pm
76 Political Atheist  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:00:48pm

re: #68 Belafon

You can choose not to use a cell phone. And for some people, like my wife and son, facebook is just as useful as texting on the phone.

Seen this? BYOD. Bring your own device. A growing professional requirement. Required use of that phone to communicate as a working professional.

At least you have SMS and need not use FB. It’s an option play. But there is another similar argument-The no fly list. The tissue thin argument that it is not punishment without rial is trains and cars. Unless your job or a family emergency requires you to be three time zones away in 12 hours,

77 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:00:55pm

re: #54 Amory Blaine

Justice Robert’s pen & Obamacare has done more damage to the USA then the swords of the Nazis,Soviets & terrorists combined.

I’m sure this guy “honors the troops” and can’t imagine that he’s just completely minimized the sacrifice of WW2 and Cold War vets.

78 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:01:57pm

Not to mention the more recent conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan.

79 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:02:03pm

re: #54 Amory Blaine

[Embedded content]

Uhhhhhhhh.

80 Varek Raith  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:03:34pm

re: #79 Gus

Uhhhhhhhh.

Combined.

81 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:04:23pm
82 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:04:29pm

re: #73 Targetpractice

Anymore, I’ve begun to tune out the “What about our kids?!” crowd, as most either seem to be Boomers who have no room to talk about leaving nothing to the next generation, and Millenials like myself who got raised on Boomer nostalgia for their own childhoods.

Well now that you bring up the Boomers, I was thinking about the XKCD graphic from the previous thread and I didn’t see “Jingle Bells” on the graph.

“JB” happens to be TEH MOAST SUCKY CHRISTMAS SONG with the worst covers, and it was written in 1857!

So it is in public domain which means that “artists” can style the shit out of it without paying royalties.

83 Amory Blaine  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:04:37pm

re: #65 jaunte

IT’S “THAN”, SENATOR, “THAN”.

Grammar is the least of his worries!!

84 Varek Raith  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:05:18pm

Wait.
An actual Senator said that?
Derp.

85 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:06:01pm

re: #75 Gus

[Embedded content]

Her sister, Olivia de Havilland, at age 97.

oliviadehavillandonline.com

They were “bitter rivals” some said. Both were quite beautiful, though.

86 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:06:40pm

I HATE EVERY ONE of the songs listed on that infographic. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE.

87 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:06:41pm

Was the CBS segment on possible Snowden amnesty a bait and switch? There is much outrage
60 Minutes gives a sloppy wet kiss to the NSA
It looks like they might have leaked the possibility of amnesty thing to get the Snowden fans to watch, then did a regular generic news story on him stealing shit. Now his fanclub gets a weeks worth of twitter outrage and blog posts providing 60 minutes with more publicity.

88 Kragar  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:07:14pm

re: #54 Amory Blaine

[Embedded content]

The Nazis and Soviets used swords?
/

89 Amory Blaine  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:07:22pm

Here was his follow up

Looks like ThinkProgress has the scoop.

90 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:07:33pm

re: #88 Kragar

Satire!

91 Varek Raith  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:08:04pm

re: #89 Amory Blaine

Here was his follow up

[Embedded content]

Looks like ThinkProgress has the scoop.

That…doesn’t clear up a damn thing.
Lol.

92 Amory Blaine  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:08:19pm

re: #88 Kragar

Forget it he’s rolling.

93 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:09:13pm

Bulwer Lytton, famous for TEH MOAST SUCK WRITING EVER

94 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:10:17pm
95 Decatur Deb  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:11:44pm

re: #93 Lord of the Pies

Bulwer Lytton, famous for TEH MOAST SUCK WRITING EVER

it was a dark and derpy senator.

96 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:11:58pm

This looks like the full 60 minutes segment.
cbsnews.com

Watching now, not sure how long I’ll last.

97 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:12:04pm

re: #89 Amory Blaine

Here was his follow up

[Embedded content]

Looks like ThinkProgress has the scoop.

98 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:12:32pm

And thus I don’t use Facebook.

99 Pie-onist Overlord  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:12:54pm

The original lyrics of “Jingle Bells” were kind of edgy, all about drunk sleigh-riding.

100 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:13:28pm

However, Facebook seems to know a lot about me, probably because many of my relatives use it and somehow Facebook put 2 and 2 together and figured out my email addresses and who I am related to.

101 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:16:23pm

re: #96 Killgore Trout

This looks like the full 60 minutes segment.
cbsnews.com

Watching now, not sure how long I’ll last.

Judging from the transcript the amnesty talk was just a few sentences and quickly dismissed. They just used it as a sensationalist angle to promote what looks like a very generic story about the NSA, nothing new.

102 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:16:34pm

re: #99 Lord of the Pies

Here’s the 1898 Edison Mae Quartet recording referenced in the Wikipedia article, the oldest known recording:

MP3 Audio

103 BongCrodny  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:19:55pm

Dear Google Chrome:

Look, I only visited the site one time, honestly. I know this kind of thing can follow you around and lead to people whispering about you, and I only visited it one time, and I swear on my father’s grave it really, really was for research purposes only.

So be a good little web browser and please stop with the urinary catheter ads.

Sincerely,

Bong

104 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:20:24pm

re: #101 Killgore Trout

Judging from the transcript the amnesty talk was just a few sentences and quickly dismissed. They just used it as a sensationalist angle to promote what looks like a very generic story about the NSA, nothing new.

…and as much as it pains me to admit the KosKidz have a point, the segment is just ass kissing and uncritically repeating NSA claims. Not much journalism here aside from repeating the NSA’s claims.

105 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:20:28pm

re: #89 Amory Blaine

Here was his follow up

Looks like ThinkProgress has the scoop.

The dentist and Finance Committee Co-Chair claimed: […]

A dentist. Why? Why is it always dentists who turn out to be the religious right loons?

106 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:22:42pm

re: #75 Gus

Wow. Gone at 96.

About two years ago I compiled a list of “golden era” (pre WWII movie stars) who were still around, and she and her sister of course were on it.

A beautiful woman, but that photo also shows the skill of the photographer.

107 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:23:10pm

ah, the NSA director says there are 31,000 documents about our intel capabilities and weaknesses regarding China, Iran and Russia. That’s a new piece of info.

108 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:29:51pm

re: #105 freetoken

Yes, I was just wondering if he knows Don McLeroy.

109 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:30:03pm

I’m definitely going to have to search through my collection of mp3 links for special recordings of Jingle Bells.

110 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:30:38pm

re: #106 freetoken

Wow. Gone at 96.

About two years ago I compiled a list of “golden era” (pre WWII movie stars) who were still around, and she and her sister of course were on it.

A beautiful woman, but that photo also shows the skill of the photographer.

He used “Clam Shell” lighting. An umbrella above her face, and a second one down below. it makes a beautiful soft flattering light. The give-away is the catchlights in her eyes, you can see one at the top and one at the bottom.

I’ve played around with it, it is a very flattering look for almost anybody.

RBS

111 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:31:15pm

re: #109 freetoken

I’m definitely going to have to search through my collection of mp3 links for special recordings of Jingle Bells.

I wonder if I’ve got my live Springsteen “Santa Claus is coming to town”

RBS

112 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:34:20pm

re: #109 freetoken

I’m definitely going to have to search through my collection of mp3 links for special recordings of Jingle Bells.

The cats singing Silent Night came on the radio today. My cats really liked it.

113 abolitionist  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:35:29pm

re: #100 freetoken

However, Facebook seems to know a lot about me, probably because many of my relatives use it and somehow Facebook put 2 and 2 together and figured out my email addresses and who I am related to.

That’s somewhat like my situation. I’ve never had a f***book account. Have relatives who do. But even if that were not so, I still visit lots of sites that have FB “like” and “dislike” icons, twitter icons, etc embedded in the webpages. So even if I never click on those, and unless I’m ever-vigilant about suppressing unwanted scripting on those pages/sites, I still get tracked.

Social media sites and other third parties get way more info about my online activities than I’m comfortable with, and in more ways than I can hope to manage.

114 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:37:22pm

re: #112 Killgore Trout

The cats singing Silent Night came on the radio today. My cats really liked it.

A friend of mine got me the “jingle cats” cd. It freaked mine out, they kept running over to the speakers, looking behind them, then run over to me, then back to the speakers. I had to stop,it was making them insane(r)

RBS

115 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:37:46pm

re: #114 RealityBasedSteve

MP3 Audio

116 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:39:36pm

I’m sorry… but it was in the queue….

117 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:42:26pm

re: #116 freetoken

I’m sorry… but it was in the queue….

There is going to be a very special place prepared for you in hell. With nothing but jingle cats, Sarah Palin Christmas Specials, and generic frozen pizzas to eat.

RBS

118 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:43:00pm

Peter O’toole, Tom Laughlin, and Joan Fontaine all gone in one day.

119 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:45:21pm

re: #3 Justanotherhuman

W.T.F.

I guess my instinct was very right about not ever opening a FB acct.

Ditto. This is a long step beyond creepy.

120 Mattand  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:52:33pm

re: #73 Targetpractice

Anymore, I’ve begun to tune out the “What about our kids?!” crowd, as most either seem to be Boomers who have no room to talk about leaving nothing to the next generation, and Millenials like myself who got raised on Boomer nostalgia for their own childhoods.

Trust me, there’s plenty of that bullshit going on in the Gen X crowd.

I should know, as I’m part of that unit and since I don’t have kids, it gets thrown in my face every time I make a point the “norms” can’t refute.

121 Kragar  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 7:53:06pm

Texas judge, forced to resign after texting prosecutors during trial, now running for district attorney

Elizabeth Coker agreed in October to resign her seat as a judge in Polk County, Texas, after an investigation into text messages she sent to prosecutors giving advice during trials.

Her resignation became effective Dec. 6. Her campaign to become the district attorney of Polk County became effective Dec. 8.

“I am running for Polk County Criminal District Attorney!!!” she wrote in a Facebook post. “The support and encouragement I am receiving has been overwhelming and humbling. I want to thank all my family, friends and supporters who still want me as a public servant.”

Coker resigned ahead of a State Commission on Judicial Conduct investigation into text messages and other improper ex parte communications and meetings with prosecutors in the Polk County District Attorney’s Office, the San Jacinto County District Attorney, and certain defense attorneys regarding various cases pending in her court.

122 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:00:07pm

re: #119 Dark_Falcon

Ditto. This is a long step beyond creepy.

It’s fucked up but really shouldn’t come as a surprise. Pretty sure that any website that offers autocomplete suggestions, like Google / Google Plus, does this. The only thing making Facebook’s implementation insidious is the glimpse into the mentality behind it, that it thinks users are somehow robbing it of enriching content by exercising personal discretion through frontal lobe inhibition, and then seeking to find ways of bypassing the psychological barriers to publishing that content.

Make no mistake, this is how all the big players in social media think.

123 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:00:53pm

64 years ago tomorrow, NBC broadcast on their Screen Directors Playhouse radio program the episode “The Affairs of Susan”, adaptation of the movie of the same name, both staring Joan Fontaine (RIP):

MP3 Audio

124 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:01:12pm

re: #120 Mattand

Trust me, there’s plenty of that bullshit going on in the Gen X crowd.

I should know, as I’m part of that unit and since I don’t have kids, it gets thrown in my face every time I make a point the “norms” can’t refute.

Yeah, I fall somewhere in that sliver between Gen X and Millenial, and it’s something I’ve heard from more than one Boomer wingnut. “Well, you don’t know what it’s like to have to raise a family!” It’s particular anger-inducing when it comes from Boomers who either are retired or nearing it, knowing that they won’t have to go through the shit their parents generation did without a social safety net around.

125 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:02:56pm

There once was a day, long before Clear Channel or Salem Communications, when AM radio programs had redeeming qualities.

126 GeneJockey  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:04:44pm

re: #27 Targetpractice

Wow, a normal human being, having a cigarette. My God, what a monster he is.

////

Yeah, you know, we may joke about that, because we see a regular guy with a cigarette, but it’s kinda like in Harold and Kumar Escape from Guantanamo, when Kumar smiles at an old white lady, but she sees a bearded, be-turbaned, Islamic terrorist. They look at those pics and see “Thug”.

127 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:09:42pm

re: #126 GeneJockey

Yeah, you know, we may joke about that, because we see a regular guy with a cigarette, but it’s kinda like in Harold and Kumar Escape from Guantanamo, when Kumar smiles at an old white lady, but she sees a bearded, be-turbaned, Islamic terrorist. They look at those pics and see “Thug”.

It takes careful conditioning to warp a mind that badly.

128 Charles Johnson  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:10:30pm

Tom Waits - Dog Treat

Youtube Video

129 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:11:52pm

130 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:13:26pm
131 Charles Johnson  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:13:55pm

A little word salad from the Weasel Zippers comments:

Charles ‘Chucklehead’ Johnson is and always has been a deranged mental midget and morally bankrupt tool. He’s simply just another garden variety Pied Piper of slapdick reprobates… Rev. Jimmy Jones kool-aid style.

132 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:15:25pm

re: #131 Charles Johnson

A little word salad from the Weasel Zippers comments:

“Slapdick reprobates”? Is that a promotion or demotion from “socialist”?

///

133 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:15:36pm

I’m a slapdick reprobate!!!! I’m somebody!!!!

Thank you Charles.

RBS

134 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:15:53pm

re: #131 Charles Johnson

A little word salad from the Weasel Zippers comments:

You are irrelevant! Irrelevant I tells you! Ahahahaha! //

135 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:16:22pm

re: #129 Gus

Jack Arnold Alexander Tancred Gurney, 14th Earl of Gurney:
I stand outside myself, watching myself watching myself. I smile, I smile, I smile.

136 Mattand  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:16:46pm

re: #129 Gus

[Embedded image]

They travel the highways and byways of Saudi Arabia: getting into wacky hijinks; solving crimes; and maybe.. just MAYBE… learning a thing or two about love.

If I’m feeling ambitious later, I’ll Photoshop the leisure suites from above on them.

137 RealityBasedSteve  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:18:29pm

FWIW, I call ‘dibs’ on “Slapdick Reprobates” as a future band name.

RBS

138 Mattand  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:18:46pm

re: #131 Charles Johnson

A little word salad from the Weasel Zippers comments:
Charles ‘Chucklehead’ Johnson is and always has been a deranged mental midget and morally bankrupt tool. He’s simply just another garden variety Pied Piper of slapdick reprobates… Rev. Jimmy Jones kool-aid style.

Is “slapdick” something that features the 3 Stooges naked?

139 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:21:23pm

re: #138 Mattand

It falls into the category of “speak in terms your audience finds familiar.”

140 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:21:36pm
141 Charles Johnson  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:22:51pm

Slapdick reprobates are the worst kind.

142 Charles Johnson  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:23:33pm

You think you’re doing a good job of being a reprobate, and along comes one of these fuckers, slaps you right in the dick.

143 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:24:32pm

re: #132 Targetpractice

“Slapdick reprobates”? Is that a promotion or demotion from “socialist”?

///

I think it means that the haters are able to slap us with their dicks. How they can slap us with dicks as small as theirs is not clear.

144 Mattand  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:25:52pm

re: #139 jaunte

It falls into the category of “speak in terms your audience finds familiar.”

Like “Speaking in tongues”, only for really fucking stupid people.

145 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:26:16pm

re: #140 Gus

[Embedded content]

Youtube Video

146 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:35:35pm
147 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:36:27pm

re: #146 Gus

[Embedded content]

I actually was very bad about doing homework when I was in school. Yet I always managed to do great on tests.

148 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:36:55pm

re: #146 Gus

[Embedded content]

Grumpy Cat is a ‘she’.

149 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:38:16pm

re: #148 Dark_Falcon

Grumpy Cat is a ‘she’.

Yep. @RealGrumpyCat‘d it so we all lived. //

150 sagehen  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:38:26pm

re: #13 jaunte

Now, on to the question of whether reindeer really know how to fly.

I can actually answer this one!!

Reindeer poke their noses through the snow to dig up mushrooms. Special mushrooms. Honest to god, it’s a major part of their diet. All winter, they’re just chock full of psilosybin.

So yes, reindeer can fly.

(extra trivia… the active ingredient remains chemically unchanged in its passage through the reindeer’s system. Which is why Lapp reindeer herders drink their piss, so they can get high too. )

151 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:38:28pm

RT’d it that is.

152 GeneJockey  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:39:00pm

re: #147 Targetpractice

I actually was very bad about doing homework when I was in school. Yet I always managed to do great on tests.

Me too, but it’s no longer enough to know the subject. It’s now more important to jump through the hoops and follow orders.

I’d have been fucked.

153 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:40:28pm

re: #152 GeneJockey

Me too, but it’s no longer enough to know the subject. It’s now more important to jump through the hoops and follow orders.

I’d have been fucked.

I nearly was. Managed to graduate with my class only on my final exams. If I’d scored poorly on my geometry exam, they’d have been mailing me my diploma after I finished summer school.

154 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:41:54pm

re: #150 sagehen

Santa’s real name is Amanita muscaria!

155 GlutenFreeJesus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:42:37pm

re: #11 Lord of the Pies

TOTALLY A WHITE GUY

[Embedded content]

He’s always been white. And morbidly obese!

156 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:43:22pm

This is an important story folks may have missed:

Mexico Passes Oil Bill Seen Luring $20 Billion a Year

Mexico’s Congress approved a bill to end a 75-year state oil monopoly and generate as much as $20 billion in additional foreign investment a year.

The nation’s most significant economic reform since the North American Free Trade Agreement secured the required two-thirds majority in a 353-134 lower-house vote yesterday. The proposal must be ratified by state assemblies, the majority of which are controlled by the alliance backing the reform.

The bill will change Mexico’s charter to allow companies such as Exxon Mobil Corp. (XOM) and Chevron Corp. (CVX) to develop the largest unexplored crude area after the Arctic Circle. Supporters say the overhaul could propel Mexico into the top five crude exporting countries while opponents say it will funnel resource wealth to foreign investors. The peso gained.

“The reform will energize Mexico’s economy,” Carlos Capistran, chief Mexico economist at Bank of America Corp., said in a telephone interview yesterday. “Congress was able to pass a better-than-expected constitutional reform.”

More oil production close to home means cheaper gas for us, more profits for energy production companies, and less money for Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Iran.

157 Uncle Obdicut  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:46:10pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

More oil production close to home means cheaper gas for us, more profits for energy production companies, and less money for Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Iran.

Nothing about this is correct.

158 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:46:45pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

This is an important story folks may have missed:

Mexico Passes Oil Bill Seen Luring $20 Billion a Year

More oil production close to home means cheaper gas for us, more profits for energy production companies, and less money for Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Iran.

So then we no longer need Keystone XL?

159 GlutenFreeJesus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:47:56pm

re: #62 Political Atheist

It would be easy to give up Facebook. No more unposted screeds to analyze. Heck it’s even free of charge. Or type my posts in another bit of software instead of the entry box at FB, cut and paste only what I choose to post.

But I can’t really reduce or even modify how the NSA chooses to treat my cell phone or email.

The NSA doesn’t care about your cell phone or email.

160 jaunte  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:48:10pm

re: #158 Targetpractice

So then we no longer need Keystone XL?

Good reason not to take the risk, then.

161 GlutenFreeJesus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:48:54pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

This is an important story folks may have missed:

Mexico Passes Oil Bill Seen Luring $20 Billion a Year

More oil production close to home means cheaper gas for us, more profits for energy production companies, and less money for Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Iran.

More $$$ for the drug cartels that run the country.

162 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:51:44pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

This is an important story folks may have missed:

Mexico Passes Oil Bill Seen Luring $20 Billion a Year

More oil production close to home means cheaper gas for us, more profits for energy production companies, and less money for Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Iran.

How dare Mexico try and lure foreign investors and oil production! Don’t they know only the USA is allowed to do that?

//

163 Gus  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:52:41pm

re: #160 jaunte

Good reason not to take the risk, then.

Ask Canada and China.

165 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:54:25pm

re: #157 Uncle Obdicut

Nothing about this is correct.

Defend that assertion.

166 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 8:55:04pm

re: #158 Targetpractice

So then we no longer need Keystone XL?

That remains to be seen. What is true is that the Mexican oil fields proposed for development have easier to refine oil than the Alberta tar sands.

167 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:03:11pm

re: #166 Dark_Falcon

That remains to be seen. What is true is that the Mexican oil fields proposed for development have easier to refine oil than the Alberta tar sands.

But probably don’t stand to net the Koch Brothers $100B by having a pipeline built from the tar sands deposits they own to the refineries they also own.

168 Uncle Obdicut  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:03:12pm

re: #165 Dark_Falcon

Defend that assertion.

Defend yours. Recognize that you just made a bunch of assertions, and show their mechanism of action.

But here’s the defense, anyway:

A) Oil is fungible. The only thing that really matters for price is global supply. It’ll lower the price of oil everywhere.

B) More oil production doesn’t necessarily mean more profits. This is something I’d expect an arch-capitalist to understand intuitively: the increased supply may allow companies to cut prices while retain the same profit margins, hoping to capture a larger share of the market. That’s what you hope for, as a customer, is an actual competitive scenario.

C) If simply more customers buy oil at the same prices, then Iran, Russia, etc. will make either the same or more money. So basically two of your points require contradictory situations.

169 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:09:42pm

re: #168 Uncle Obdicut

A. My assertion is still true, by your own admission. If the price is lower everywhere then its lower here. But I’d add that not having to ship something from far away tends to make it cheaper.

B. You’ve got the right of this one.

C. It depends. If more oil than consumers enters the market then prices would go down. And at the very least, the US is better off buying its oil from Mexico than from the Middle East.

Good discussion, Obdi.

170 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:11:42pm

re: #167 Targetpractice

But probably don’t stand to net the Koch Brothers $100B by having a pipeline built from the tar sands deposits they own to the refineries they also own.

Though given that a good bit of Mexican oil would be refined at those Texas refineries, the Koch brothers would still realize a healthy profit from that refining.

I’m going to sign off for the night. Sleep well, all.

171 wheat-dogghazi  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:13:50pm

May dog and Ceiling Cat have mercy on my soul. Today I will upgrade from Windows Vista Home to Windows 7 Ultimate. Taking down everything and starting fresh. My hard drive has too much clutter from five years of use.

Backed up my personal folders and took inventory of my most used programs. See you all soon. I hope.

172 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:14:00pm

Thing about it is that pumping or refining the product in the US doesn’t mean it’ll be kept for internal consumption. For example, the Alberta tar sands that KXL is supposed to transport would be refined into diesel bound for Europe, where it will sell for a higher price than on the US market.

173 Uncle Obdicut  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:15:45pm

re: #169 Dark_Falcon

A. My assertion is still true, by your own admission. If the price is lower everywhere then its lower here.

It is not true. You said that production closer to home meant cheaper gas for us. That is a false statement.

But I’d add that not having to ship something from far away tends to make it cheaper.

This is not true, for oil. There are a lot of reasons for it but it’s not very interesting.

C. It depends. If more oil than consumers enters the market then prices would go down.

If prices go down, then, again, you contradicted yourself on B. So your statement as a whole is still wrong.

And at the very least, the US is better off buying its oil from Mexico than from the Middle East.

This is not at all true. Again, oil is fungible. It doesn’t matter where we buy it from, all that matters is global demand. We’d be better off not using as much oil, but a lot of fucking assholes, including the GOP, the entire right-wing media, and most major corporations—and to toss a freaking tiny bone in, a very small number of people against all nuclear power who are on the left—are standing in the way of that.

The only actual moral and ethical choice is to reduce our energy expenditure, and it’s something that the party you support is absolutely against on ideological, and in many cases, religious, grounds.

Good discussion, Obdi.

Called the game a little early there chief.

174 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:17:08pm

re: #165 Dark_Falcon

Defend that assertion.

LOL. You know the argument, it’s been pointed out to you a thousand times that oil is a fungible commodity, the price of which is set by global demand. More oil production here does nothing to lower prices here if the global supply vs. demand ratio remains stable or decreases. Your assertion also ignores cost of extraction, refining and transport, so profits don’t even necessarily increase for domestic oil producers in a flat market , which is a huge assumption to begin with. Another false assumption is that the fungibility of oil means it’s all equal, it’s not. The grades of crude that are extracted here are often the most expensive to refine for our market, because our environmental laws demand cleaner fuels, so even more of it will end up being sold overseas than one might otherwise assume.

Why do you do this, why do you fein ignorance and repeat assertions you know to be false? This isn’t near the first time people have painstakingly take apart the litany of false economic ideas you labor under, so it’s really weird and disconcerting that it needs to happen again. Either you’re incapable of digesting these facts about how the market works, or you just prefer to live in a world of make believe.

175 The War TARDIS  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:27:10pm

A little OT, but this just scooted itself across Wikipedia in the Current Events page:

U.S. Senator John McCain joins protesters in Kiev and accuses Moscow of intervening in the internal politics of the country.

Uh, McCain, what are you doing over there?

176 abolitionist  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:28:56pm

re: #164 Gus

Reducing America’s Dependence on Foreign Oil As a Strategy to Increase Economic Growth and Reduce Economic Vulnerability

Excerpt:
But among its greatest effects are economic. Every barrel of oil or cubic foot of gas that we produce at home instead of importing from abroad means:

The bullet point that’s routinely omitted goes something like this:

By our efforts to increase our domestic oil/gas production in order to reduce our current dependence on imports, we will utterly exhaust our domestic non-renewable resources decades earlier than otherwise, and at great cost. And we will be much closer to 100% dependence on foreign oil/gas supplies much sooner.

177 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:35:33pm

re: #175 The War TARDIS

A little OT, but this just scooted itself across Wikipedia in the Current Events page:

Uh, McCain, what are you doing over there?

There’s a dem there too. These trips are usually organized/blessed by the White House to show American support for things without direct Whitehouse involvement.

178 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:36:52pm

re: #176 abolitionist

Excerpt:
But among its greatest effects are economic. Every barrel of oil or cubic foot of gas that we produce at home instead of importing from abroad means:

The bullet point that’s routinely omitted goes something like this:

By our efforts to increase our domestic oil/gas production in order to reduce our current dependence on imports, we will utterly exhaust our domestic non-renewable resources decades earlier than otherwise, and at great cost. And we will be much closer to 100% dependence on foreign oil/gas supplies much sooner.

That’s only if we use the oil. Maybe we’ll just drill it, hang on to it for a while and put it back later.

179 The War TARDIS  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 9:45:56pm

re: #177 Killgore Trout

I’m a little concerned about them getting harmed.

180 Killgore Trout  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:00:35pm

re: #179 The War TARDIS

I’m a little concerned about them getting harmed.

McCain won’t hurt the Ukrainians too bad, he promised to leave Palin at home.

181 Kragar  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:15:59pm
182 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:20:02pm

re: #181 Kragar

[Embedded content]

And tomorrow, they intend to drag us through another shutdown by filibustering the Ryan-Murray deal, and then demanding that any negotiations begin at the funding levels set by the Budget Control Act and actually find even more cuts to impose. But they’re willing to entertain some sort of “offsets” to undo defense cuts.

183 HoosierHoops  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:21:23pm

What up? You know what is funny? I realized last night what a nightmare for Winston we are moving too, My poor little dog.. My property has woods with Birds of prey. Eagles, Hawks, Owls.. Who knows? He could be snatched and eaten up. I’ll have to really watch out for him.

184 Kragar  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:21:26pm

re: #182 Targetpractice

And tomorrow, they intend to drag us through another shutdown by filibustering the Ryan-Murray deal, and then demanding that any negotiations begin at the funding levels set by the Budget Control Act and actually find even more cuts to impose. But they’re willing to entertain some sort of “offsets” to undo defense cuts.

My prefer Plan B, where we get as many of those fuckers out of office as possible.

185 Kragar  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:23:10pm

Meanwhile, I’m still waiting for my fucking heat to get fixed.

186 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:23:31pm

re: #184 Kragar

My prefer Plan B, where we get as many of those fuckers out of office as possible.

What, didn’t you hear? The ACA’s gonna totally tank next month, ensuring a wave of landslide elections for the GOP and spelling the doom of Obama. By 2016, any Democrat running for the presidency will have to promise to repeal it on Day One just to have a shot.

////

187 Kragar  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:26:44pm

re: #186 Targetpractice

What, didn’t you hear? The ACA’s gonna totally tank next month, ensuring a wave of landslide elections for the GOP and spelling the doom of Obama. By 2016, any Democrat running for the presidency will have to promise to repeal it on Day One just to have a shot.

////

Why do we even need elections in 2016? Can’t Larry Klayman’s shadow government just keep running things?
/

188 Targetpractice  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:28:35pm

re: #187 Kragar

Why do we even need elections in 2016? Can’t Larry Klayman’s shadow government just keep running things?
/

They wanna put Rand Paul in the White House so he can get to work totally fixing decades of “librul” rule. Gotta fix all the screw-ups of everybody since the last Founding Father died.

//

189 Rev_Arthur_Belling  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:37:44pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

opponents say it will funnel resource wealth to foreign investors.

And those opponents would be correct. We’ve seen this movie too many times before.

190 sagehen  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 10:39:56pm

Did anybody watch the season finale of Homeland? Wanna talk about it? I have feels.

I’m not sure if I’m supposed to be sad that Brody was publicly hanged in Teheran… he did kill the Vice President (even if everybody in the show is pretending they don’t know that), and he did almost set off a suicide vest in that season 1 finale (even though that’s not the bombing he’s been charged with and hunted for)…

Also wondering when they wrote/filmed did the four-months-later scenes. Had the Iran deal already been made public by then? Are we supposed to think there’s some correlation between fictional storyline and real-world happs?

I hope Dana is feeling better now.

191 freetoken  Sun, Dec 15, 2013 11:57:47pm
192 freetoken  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 12:02:48am

More for the champagne and long-haired crowd, Jessye Norman with one from the olde skool:

MP3 Audio

193 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 12:14:10am
194 wheat-dogghazi  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 12:14:32am

Well, I am back. On my office computer now, because occasionally they expect me to do some work here. Win7 installed just fine. Just had to download drivers for the Hotkeys on my Lenovo Thinkpad, so i can turn off the doggone touchpad.

195 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 12:26:52am

Not getting the irony or knowing the source material, a Tea Party group approvingly posts anti-immigrant Comstock faction graphic from Bioshock Infinite to their Facebook page.

This is stupidity folded in on itself, a facepalm inside an event horizon of pure ignorance, looking back on itself through a wormhole of fuckfaced dumshittery.

196 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 12:38:09am

re: #195 goddamnedfrank

Not getting the irony or knowing the source material, a Tea Party group approvingly posts anti-immigrant Comstock faction graphic from Bioshock Infinite to their Facebook page.

This is stupidity folded in on itself, a facepalm inside an event horizon of pure ignorance, looking back on itself through a wormhole of fuckfaced dumshittery.

Oh, that is hilarious. I love when wingnuts beclown themselves.

197 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 12:51:28am

re: #195 goddamnedfrank

Not getting the irony or knowing the source material, a Tea Party group approvingly posts anti-immigrant Comstock faction graphic from Bioshock Infinite to their Facebook page.

This is stupidity folded in on itself, a facepalm inside an event horizon of pure ignorance, looking back on itself through a wormhole of fuckfaced dumshittery.

Reminds me of an incident back in ‘08, when a bunch of terrorist wannabes used a piece of Fallout 3 concept art to threaten a nuclear attack on D.C.

198 wheat-dogghazi  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 1:14:02am

re: #197 Targetpractice

Reminds me of an incident back in ‘08, when a bunch of terrorist wannabes used a piece of Fallout 3 concept art to threaten a nuclear attack on D.C.

China’s national TV news once used an exploding fighter jet from Top Gun to illustrate the firepower of the latest Chinese fighter, and a scene from a sci fi movie to represent Chinese astronauts in orbit. I think they’ve also used game images, but I can’t remember any specifics right now.

199 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 3:14:54am

re: #198 wheat-dogghazi

China’s national TV news once used an exploding fighter jet from Top Gun to illustrate the firepower of the latest Chinese fighter, and a scene from a sci fi movie to represent Chinese astronauts in orbit. I think they’ve also used game images, but I can’t remember any specifics right now.

If you are preaching to the choir you can use any reference you please, those who take you to task over it will be dismissed as nazis, crackpots, etc.

200 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:01:10am

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

This is an important story folks may have missed:

Mexico Passes Oil Bill Seen Luring $20 Billion a Year

More oil production close to home means cheaper gas for us, more profits for energy production companies, and less money for Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Iran.

It doesn’t matter where oil originates. It always goes on the world market. It’s goes to the highest bidder, doncha know, or whoever is kissing whoever else’s ass at the time.

Isn’t that adhering to your much vaunted “free enterprise” system?

Even keep our own production for ourselves? Mwahahahaha!

201 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:06:25am

re: #200 Justanotherhuman

It doesn’t matter where oil originates. It always goes on the world market. It’s goes to the highest bidder, doncha know, or whoever is kissing whoever else’s ass at the time.

Isn’t that adhering to your much vaunted “free enterprise” system?

Even keep our own production for ourselves? Mwahahahaha!

The only way to keep it is to keep it in the ground. In some sense, the country that pumps the last barrel of oil wins.

202 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:08:49am

re: #201 Decatur Deb

The only way to keep it is to keep it in the ground. In some sense, the country that pumps the last barrel of oil wins.

In another sense, the first country that progresses beyond fossil fuels wins.

203 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:16:08am

re: #202 Sol Berdinowitz

In another sense, the first country that progresses beyond fossil fuels wins.

Why do you hate eagles?

204 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:18:40am

Eagles are a symbol of America’s Imperialist ambitions. I want to see a pile of them lying at the base of an ineffective wind turbine that provides no reliable power but clutters up the landscape.

/

205 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:23:00am

re: #204 Sol Berdinowitz

Sounds like another press release from the sheeple at “Friends of Carrion”.

206 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:39:07am

re: #203 Decatur Deb

Why do you hate eagles?

We owe everything we are to the sun—this planet just got lucky. The eagle knows this, other animals know this, instinctively.

Yet we “reasoning” humans, in our greed, keep fouling and destroying our own nest, the planet, and it will be our downfall, our own fault, no other.

Unless, of course, we’re hit by a giant asteroid.

207 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:40:50am

WTFITS What does this even MEAN?

208 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:42:05am

re: #207 Lord of the Pies

WTFITS What does this even MEAN?

[Embedded content]

Black guy in the White House.

209 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:44:15am

re: #207 Lord of the Pies

WTFITS What does this even MEAN?

[Embedded content]

It means, in spite of their throwing around the word “liberty” so freely, that these RWNJs not only want to spread fear around to ordinary people, they want politicians to fear for their actual lives.

Well, we see enough of them threatening the President, among others.

210 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:48:05am

re: #209 Justanotherhuman

It means, in spite of their throwing around the word “liberty” so freely, that these RWNJs not only want to spread fear around to ordinary people, they want politicians to fear for their actual lives.

Well, we see enough of them threatening the President, among others.

So we see that all those Godwinning Photoshops of Obama and that German guy with the mustache, are just projection of their own goals.

211 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:48:47am

Whole bunch of Derp this morning.

212 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 4:49:28am

Do you suppose with that white van, he drives around kidnapping pregnant women to make sure they don’t have abortions?

213 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:09:54am

re: #207 Lord of the Pies

WTFITS What does this even MEAN?

[Embedded content]

The Tea Party is never safer than when GOP candidates are terrified of the upcoming primary.

214 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:10:24am

re: #210 Lord of the Pies

So we see that all those Godwinning Photoshops of Obama and that German guy with the mustache, are just projection of their own goals.

Yeah, I don’t think any of them can be described as ever using reason. That’s how afraid they themselves are.

215 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:10:39am

re: #212 Lord of the Pies

Do you suppose with that white van, he drives around kidnapping pregnant women to make sure they don’t have abortions?

No, you have to lure them into the vehicle on false pretenses…

216 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:11:42am

Another favorite wingnut tactic: the false dichotomy.
HURR HURR

217 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:12:42am

If Ryan Loskarn was a Democrat, the wingnuts would be all HURR HURR TYPICAL LIBRUL!!!!!!111 but they are at a LOSS FOR WORDS.

218 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:15:29am

re: #211 Lord of the Pies

Whole bunch of Derp this morning.

EVERYONE GETS A CHOICE BUT THE VICTIMS

Especially the victim of rape (unless she has purchased Legal Rape Insurance)

219 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:15:34am

re: #216 Lord of the Pies

Another favorite wingnut tactic: the false dichotomy.
HURR HURR

[Embedded content]

At least Sandra Fluke didn’t give up her own identity, like Mia Love did.

220 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:19:14am

re: #217 Lord of the Pies

If Ryan Loskarn was a Democrat, the wingnuts would be all HURR HURR TYPICAL LIBRUL!!!!!!111 but they are at a LOSS FOR WORDS.

Oh, they shit in their own swimming hole all the time—it should be absolutely teeming by now. Loskarn is just one who got caught doing it.

221 steve_davis  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:24:03am

My only experience with Facebook has been being forced to create an account in order to receive book review status updates from a journal, and then discovering that something on Facebook had dinged my Paypal account roughly 90 bucks THROUGH MY FREAKING CHECKING ACCOUNT. And in one of the most situationally ironic moments in my life, I wound up thanking profusely a customer service rep in Mumbai for managing to straighten things out in the space of a couple of days. And I gather from the complete lack of surprise on his part that Facebook PULLS THIS SHIT ON PEOPLE ALL THE TIME. Needless to say, I’ll never use Facebook again for anything.

222 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:29:47am

I don’t “use” FB for anything except to post things that I am okay with if the whole world finds out about. I do not run apps or respond to anything advertised.

Anything else is asking for trouble.

223 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:39:43am

Dim Jim has decided that the Arapahoe shooter was HURR HURR A LEFTIST LIBRUL SOSHULIST!!!!!111!!!
How does he know this? From other wingnuts. HURR HURR

224 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:41:35am

re: #223 Lord of the Pies

Dim Jim has decided that the Arapahoe shooter was HURR HURR A LEFTIST LIBRUL SOSHULIST!!!!!111!!!
How does he know this? From other wingnuts. HURR HURR

[Embedded content]

The “armed guard” was unable to prevent one girl from being shot and one boy from killing himself. Tell me again how that guard saved people?

225 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:43:56am

There is nothing known about the shooter’s motivations or his political affiliations but wingnuts are all over this HURR HURR SOSHULIST!!!!11!!
As a member of the debate team, he would have been skilled in arguing both sites of an issue.

226 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:46:18am

re: #222 Sol Berdinowitz

I don’t “use” FB for anything except to post things that I am okay with if the whole world finds out about. I do not run apps or respond to anything advertised.

Anything else is asking for trouble.

I wouldn’t use anything a Harvard student who wrote a program for “hot or not” parlayed into billions. And Gawd knows, even Harvard didn’t want to ruin a young man’s “career”, no matter what rules he broke or who he exploited for his own purposes.

It’s still basically the same “Facemash” it was when he was a callow sophomore, just by a different name and now with advertisers and publicly sold in the stock market. A fine example of exploitive capitalism.

227 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:48:05am

HURR HURR HE’S A SOSHULIST BECAUSE I SAW IT ON TEH TWITTERS!!!!1111

228 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:52:25am

re: #224 William Barnett-Lewis

The “armed guard” was unable to prevent one girl from being shot and one boy from killing himself. Tell me again how that guard saved people?

He didn’t panic and got nearby students into classrooms then implemented the school’s lockdown policy. His swift action denied the shooter easy targets and thus in all probability hastened the shooter’s suicide.

It wasn’t the deputy’s gun that saved lives so much as his mind. He was competent and well-trained, and a good number of students likely survived because he was.

229 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:56:35am
230 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:56:50am
231 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:58:11am

re: #227 Lord of the Pies

HURR HURR HE’S A SOSHULIST BECAUSE I SAW IT ON TEH TWITTERS!!!!1111

[Embedded content]

This is really the most unbiased report I have seen on this shooting, yet they all got Claire Davis’s age wrong—she is 17. The CSM doesn’t really speculate, but it does ask questions, and doesn’t place Pierson’s politics on the left or right.

Karl Pierson: Portrait of the Arapahoe High School shooting (+video)

Karl Pierson was a bright student and enthusiastic high school debater who got into trouble with his debate coach. Were there signs that his anger would lead to gunshots and suicide?

csmonitor.com

232 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:58:57am

re: #228 Dark_Falcon

in all probability hastened the shooter’s suicide.

This is a big part of why I do not consider anything about this story a success DF.

233 A Mom Anon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 5:59:48am

re: #173 Uncle Obdicut

There’s also the actual commodities market and speculators that should be considered when you talk about the price of oil/petroleum products. Speculation plays a large role in the price of gas, which shouldn’t be legal but is.

234 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:00:00am

re: #230 Lord of the Pies

[Embedded content]

235 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:00:05am

re: #231 Justanotherhuman

This is really the most unbiased report I have seen on this shooting, yet they all got Claire Davis’s age wrong—she is 17. The CSM doesn’t really speculate, but it does ask questions, and doesn’t place Pierson’s politics on the left or right.

Karl Pierson: Portrait of the Arapahoe High School shooting (+video)

Karl Pierson was a bright student and enthusiastic high school debater who got into trouble with his debate coach. Were there signs that his anger would lead to gunshots and suicide?

csmonitor.com

I read the CSM article, also the Denver Post, they say nothing about Pierson’s political views or motivations for the shooting because DUH nobody knows.

HURR HURR COVER-UP!!!!11!!!!

236 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:02:09am

BBL.

237 A Mom Anon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:05:15am

re: #235 Lord of the Pies

Someone somewhere saw the word “socialist” regarding a kid’s political views and that was all it took. I have no clue where this came from, if it is even peripherally true it may have come from a side he debated for on the debate team. It doesn’t appear this was at all politically motivated though, I think it does a disservice to everyone to narrow it down to that. Mental illness? Maybe. Extreme stress and duress over something in his personal life? Likely. Until more people who actually knew this guy speak up, we honestly can’t know. It’s just another fucking school shooting that this country as a whole is getting more and more sensitized to. THAT is the bigger issue here you idiot wingnuts.

238 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:06:04am

re: #232 William Barnett-Lewis

This is a big part of why I do not consider anything about this story a success DF.

With all due respect, Will, once someone starts an ‘active shooter’ rampage, their death has to be treated as a given. Most such males are so enraged and despondent that they cannot be talked down and will either kill themselves or commit suicide-by-cop. A thwarted shooter killing himself relatively quickly is actually a fairly good outcome for an active shooter situation.

239 A Mom Anon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:08:22am

Alright, I have been putting off the Christmas shopping thing long enough, so it’s off to the stores on a Monday morning when they won’t be teeming with asshats. Hopefully. Also too, the dog is going to be mad at me for not walking her this morning, the whining has already commenced. BBL.

240 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:13:12am

re: #237 A Mom Anon

Someone somewhere saw the word “socialist” regarding a kid’s political views and that was all it took. I have no clue where this came from, if it is even peripherally true it may have come from a side he debated for on the debate team. It doesn’t appear this was at all politically motivated though, I think it does a disservice to everyone to narrow it down to that. Mental illness? Maybe. Extreme stress and duress over something in his personal life? Likely. Until more people who actually knew this guy speak up, we honestly can’t know. It’s just another fucking school shooting that this country as a whole is getting more and more sensitized to. THAT is the bigger issue here you idiot wingnuts.

One thing that is learned in debating is how to argue BOTH SIDES, so a skilled debater can learn the PROS and CONS of any argument. That doesn’t mean that he holds those views, it only means that he has learned how to argue them persuasively.

241 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:13:47am

re: #239 A Mom Anon

Alright, I have been putting off the Christmas shopping thing long enough, so it’s off to the stores on a Monday morning when they won’t be teeming with asshats. Hopefully. Also too, the dog is going to be mad at me for not walking her this morning, the whining has already commenced. BBL.

Why not do your shopping list online?

242 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:15:38am

re: #225 Lord of the Pies

And the shooter wasn’t killed by a school safety officer; he committed suicide.

The particular student was able to gain entry to the school with multiple weapons/explosive devices, and was only challenged after opening fire in the cafeteria and injuring fellow students.

The gunman’s motives remain a mystery (although it’s probably related to some action that there was a dispute between the shooter and a debate coach; but as to why he would shoot other students is unknown).

The entire incident took all of 1 minute and 20 seconds.

Oh, and I don’t quite get the cognitive dissonance where the right thinks that if push comes to shove and someone takes gun rights away, that the right will have more guns, but it’s left wingers who do all the mass killings.

Lots of cognitive dissonance on display, to say nothing of the amount of projection that would make IMAX look like a ViewMaster.

243 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:16:42am

re: #159 GlutenFreeJesus

The NSA doesn’t care about your cell phone or email.

They care enough to keep the metadata. Or did we get some good news I missed?

244 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:18:44am

My daughter was telling me about the TWO FEET OF SNOW they are “enjoying” in Jerusalem. Power was off and on at random intervals (it seems to be back on now). Schools are still closed. She had a houseful of guests on Friday and Saturday because their power was back on but neighbors didn’t have power.

She said what she enjoyed the most about this rare weather event was that it reminded her of Christmas. I said “what did we ever have to do with Christmas when you were a kid?”

She said “I just always loved the lights and the decorations and the ‘holiday spirit.’ It was a happy time.”

I guess that if you are watching as it plays out for others it may seem like a happy time, but I understand that the holidays are very stressful.

245 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:22:59am

re: #181 Kragar

Biden is stretching the truth there a bit-Yes those wars were voted for as was the prescription benefit. The recession came from war debt? Not really…Nice rant style but FOS at heart.

The U.S. Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission reported its findings in January 2011. It concluded that “the crisis was avoidable and was caused by: Widespread failures in financial regulation, including the Federal Reserve’s failure to stem the tide of toxic mortgages; Dramatic breakdowns in corporate governance including too many financial firms acting recklessly and taking on too much risk; An explosive mix of excessive borrowing and risk by households and Wall Street that put the financial system on a collision course with crisis; Key policy makers ill prepared for the crisis, lacking a full understanding of the financial system they oversaw; and systemic breaches in accountability and ethics at all levels.”[5][6]

246 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:29:14am

re: #245 Political Atheist

Biden is stretching the truth there a bit-Yes those wars were voted for as was the prescription benefit. The recession came from war debt? Not really…Nice rant style but FOS at heart.

Biden didn’t give a rat’s ass about the truth when he delivered that rant. It’s purpose was to publicly pin Paul Ryan’s ears back and break the momentum the Romney/Ryan campaign had gotten from Barack Obama’s difficulties in the first presidential debate. And at that Joe Biden succeeded. The facts were less important than the sound effects and imagery.

Post edited.

247 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:31:03am

re: #246 Dark_Falcon

I’m surprised to be first on the board to point out that glaring Bidenism.

248 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:32:55am
249 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:33:58am

re: #246 Dark_Falcon

Biden didn’t give a rat’s ass about the truth when he delivered that rant. It’s purpose was to publicly pin Paul Ryan’s ears back and break the momentum the Romney/Ryan campaign had gotten from Barack Obama’s difficulties in the first presidential debate. And that Joe Biden succeeded. The facts were less important than the sound effects and imagery.

Biden is easy to underestimate, and I think he uses that consciously. If he steps back from a 2016 run, he will have done more than anyone could ask of a politician.

250 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:34:08am

Breaking

Bombs at Harvard?! Hopefully a hoax.

Unconfirmed explosives reported at Science Center, Thayer, Sever and Emerson buildings on Harvard’s campus - @Harvard

251 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:37:08am
252 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:39:10am

re: #244 Lord of the Pies

My daughter was telling me about the TWO FEET OF SNOW they are “enjoying” in Jerusalem. Power was off and on at random intervals (it seems to be back on now). Schools are still closed. She had a houseful of guests on Friday and Saturday because their power was back on but neighbors didn’t have power.

She said what she enjoyed the most about this rare weather event was that it reminded her of Christmas. I said “what did we ever have to do with Christmas when you were a kid?”

She said “I just always loved the lights and the decorations and the ‘holiday spirit.’ It was a happy time.”

I guess that if you are watching as it plays out for others it may seem like a happy time, but I understand that the holidays are very stressful.

They can be stressful, but if you leave the politics, religion and other stuff at the door, you can remember why you love the people you’re with (and they you), and why you are there. Or not.

I had nothing in common much with my family, socially, politically, or much of any other way, but it was all right when we got together.

253 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:42:24am

re: #252 Justanotherhuman

They can be stressful, but if you leave the politics, religion and other stuff at the door, you can remember why you love the people you’re with (and they you), and why you are there. Or not.

I had nothing in common much with my family, socially, politically, or much of any other way, but it was all right when we got together.

Holidays can be stressful because of all the preparations, cooking, shopping, cleaning, entertaining, etc. Passover is TEH MOAST STRESSFUL HOLIDAY OF ALL.

We are having a New Year’s Family Reunion in California (for my mom’s 90th birthday) and already I am hearing some grumbling from my kids because of my Canadian son, who apparently doesn’t get along with his brothers.

254 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:44:53am

re: #249 Decatur Deb

He certainly puts party loyalty first.

255 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:45:01am

re: #251 Lord of the Pies

[Embedded content]

And the clown car drives over the edge at Hater’s Point and hits every ledge on the way down before exploding in a blaze of burning stupid in Galt’s Gulch,

256 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:45:35am
257 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:48:04am

HURR HURR

258 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:48:23am

re: #253 Lord of the Pies

Holidays can be stressful because of all the preparations, cooking, shopping, cleaning, entertaining, etc. Passover is TEH MOAST STRESSFUL HOLIDAY OF ALL.

We are having a New Year’s Family Reunion in California (for my mom’s 90th birthday) and already I am hearing some grumbling from my kids because of my Canadian son, who apparently doesn’t get along with his brothers.

We defeat much of the stress by moving Christmas to our own family calendar. We’re having it this weekend, giving the four scattered kids the chance to travel off-peak and spend the ‘official’ day with in-laws.

In fact, It’s about time to knock off and put up our $40.00 agnostic Frasier fir. It has LED lightstrings, but an incandescent angel on the top. Tradition !!!

259 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:49:35am

re: #256 Lord of the Pies

And there we have another one-Party out waay ahead of any loyalty to the facts. Apparently fiction still is a winner in politics.

260 ObserverArt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:49:48am

Monday morning!

So, what did I just type…but did not post???

Sheesh. How much longer until Facebook just pisses everyone off and it goes under? ///

Everyone running around in a mad panic the last many months bitching about NSA and yet Facebook, Google and Amazon probably do more to keep records than the NSA could dream of doing. Hell shut down the NSA and just set it up so that the government can petition for records from these big internet data miners by going to a judge and asking for a data warrant.

Will that make everyone happy about Government spying an American citizens?

By the way…I have always wondered about that ability to keep track of the keystrokes of messages, replies, comments and posts no matter what. I guess it goes back to my standard line of reasoning…if you think it, it probably is already being done. Fiction always becomes fact, one way or another.

261 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:50:23am

re: #256 Lord of the Pies

Something worth remembering: Even if Joe Biden played it fast and loose in that rant Kragar posted, his rant still contained relevant facts, unlike Ann Coulter’s fact-free rant.

262 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:51:58am
263 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:52:38am

re: #259 Political Atheist

And there we have another one-Party out waay ahead of any loyalty to the facts. Apparently fiction still is a winner in politics.

Name the last American president who was totally committed to truth.

264 Dr. Matt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:53:43am
Facebook Is Keeping Track of the Things You DON’T Post

Butt texts and typos?

265 Flounder  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:55:33am

Good morning. My smoked turkey turned out a pretty good. Not as moist as a whole chicken that I smoke, but everyone said it was yummy. After 10 hours in the smoker it was falling off the bone.

266 ObserverArt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:55:38am

re: #263 Decatur Deb

Name the last American president who was totally committed to truth.

Was there one? I’m gonna go with none of them. Tain’t nuttin’ new under the political sun.

267 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:55:50am

re: #264 Dr. Matt

Butt texts and typos?

Shouldn’t be hard to make a butt-text simulation ‘bot to draft and delete a few thousand messages per day. Couple million of those might take the fun out of that FB business plan.

268 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:56:07am

re: #262 Lord of the Pies

[Embedded content]

269 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:56:14am

re: #260 ObserverArt

Monday morning!

So, what did I just type…but did not post???

Sheesh. How much longer until Facebook just pisses everyone off and it goes under? ///

Not soon enough. : )

270 Ian G.  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:57:28am

re: #207 Lord of the Pies

WTFITS What does this even MEAN?

[Embedded content]

Assad is probably terrified of the various rebels aligned against him. That must mean that liberty is REALLY safe in Syria.

271 Dr. Matt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:58:35am

re: #263 Decatur Deb

Name the last American president who was totally committed to truth.

Speaking of “truth telling”: North Carolina Republican: Obamacare worse than Hitler, Stalin and terrorism — combined

And his double-down is worst than the original tweet:

“Those that tweeted, put your thinking caps back on: ‘The PEN is mightier than the SWORD.’ Edward Bulwar-Lytton,1839. But surely you knew that,” Rucho posted Sunday afternoon.

272 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:58:38am

re: #268 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

HURR HURR CLASS WAR!!!!!!! TEH POORS IS JELLY UV ARE SUCCESS!!!!!!!!!

273 Uncle Obdicut  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 6:59:15am

re: #245 Political Atheist

Biden is stretching the truth there a bit-Yes those wars were voted for as was the prescription benefit. The recession came from war debt? Not really…Nice rant style but FOS at heart.

What is true is that the GOP didn’t really give a shit about the enormous debt they were racking up under Bush, and they still, to this day, give not a solitary, single fuck for the debt they’d add through the addition tax cuts they want.

274 Joanne  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:07:25am

re: #172 Targetpractice

Thing about it is that pumping or refining the product in the US doesn’t mean it’ll be kept for internal consumption. For example, the Alberta tar sands that KXL is supposed to transport would be refined into diesel bound for Europe, where it will sell for a higher price than on the US market.

I am a little late to the game, but, it is my understanding that our refineries are: 1) running at full capacity now, and 2) are in need of upgrade. I am not sure if our refineries even have capacity to refine oil from Mexico.

275 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:07:37am

So much Derp in one place:

276 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:10:14am

Bomb threats called in for Harvard, but so far no explosives have been detected. No detonated devices either. Sounds like someone prank called the report in.

Just a few weeks ago, someone called in a report of a gunman on the Yale campus. No one was ever found in that instance either.

The bomb threats came in as this week begins the final exams period, so it’s possible that someone made the call to avoid having to take the exams.

I’d say that if the person is caught, they be prosecuted to the maximum extent of the law, and restitution paid for the cost of deploying the bomb squads to scour those buildings.

277 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:11:42am

re: #271 Dr. Matt

Speaking of “truth telling”: North Carolina Republican: Obamacare worse than Hitler, Stalin and terrorism — combined

And his double-down is worst than the original tweet:

I lived in Charlotte when Rucho was on the Mecklenburg County Commission, for only 1 term, 94-96, then ran for the NC Senate.

He was a rightwing asshole then, too.

278 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:12:24am

re: #277 Justanotherhuman

I lived in Charlotte when Rucho was on the Mecklenburg County Commission, for only 1 term, 94-96, then ran for the NC Senate.

He was a rightwing asshole then, too.

nccommerce.com

Is Rucho a US Senator or a NC State Senator?

279 Joanne  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:13:07am

re: #200 Justanotherhuman

It doesn’t matter where oil originates. It always goes on the world market. It’s goes to the highest bidder, doncha know, or whoever is kissing whoever else’s ass at the time.

Isn’t that adhering to your much vaunted “free enterprise” system?

Even keep our own production for ourselves? Mwahahahaha!

And the fact of the matter is that if the price of oil goes down too much, they simply pull back production of crude. No oil producer will allow the global market cost per barrel to get too low. It is not in their benefit.

280 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:13:10am

re: #275 Lord of the Pies

Not derp. Heritage is full of smart people—they’re lying and they know it.

281 Dr. Matt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:13:55am
282 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:15:23am

re: #274 Joanne

I am a little late to the game, but, it is my understanding that our refineries are: 1) running at full capacity now, and 2) are in need of upgrade. I am not sure if our refineries even have capacity to refine oil from Mexico.

Capacity can be added, and it should be. Oil exploration and additional production in Mexico is a Good Thing for the US.

283 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:15:35am

re: #280 Decatur Deb

Not derp. Heritage is full of smart people—they’re lying and they know it.

Heritage is full of Kochbots.

284 Dr. Matt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:15:36am

re: #277 Justanotherhuman

He was a rightwing asshole then, too.
nccommerce.com

And he reproduced. Ugh. Hopefully his sons do not take after him,

285 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:20:02am

re: #272 Lord of the Pies

From Williamson’s article, where we see Reich getting his stats wrong and then getting thumped for it:

Beyond stealing altar offerings from the almighty god of revenue, our philanthropists offend Professor Reich’s sensibilities in another way: They don’t give to the sort of enterprises he wants them to give to. “A large portion of the charitable deductions now claimed by America’s wealthy are for donations to culture palaces — operas, art museums, symphonies, and theaters — where they spend their leisure time hobnobbing with other wealthy benefactors… . These aren’t really charities as most people understand the term. They’re often investments in the life-styles the wealthy already enjoy and want their children to have as well. Increasingly, being rich in America means not having to come across anyone who’s not.” Unsurprisingly, Progressive America’s favorite non-economist-who-plays-an-economist-on-TV does not bother to document what he means by “a large share.” Giving to art-and-culture organizations amounted to just over $14 billion in 2012, or about 4.5 percent of charitable contributions, far less than was given to health, human-services, or public-benefit organizations. There are a fair number of single organizations that run into the billions per year, including YMCA ($6.24 billion), Goodwill Industries ($5 billion), Catholic Charities ($4.4 billion), and the Red Cross ($3.12 billion).

SNIP

A question, though: If spending on art, music, and culture is self-serving when private citizens do it, what is it when government does it? Essential, necessary, crucial — of course. The New York City Department of Cultural Affairs by itself spends some $150 million a year on precisely that sort of thing. The state spends dozens of millions more. A good deal of that money goes to subsidizing theater, including big-ticket theater. In my role as a theater critic, I am constantly surprised by how many shows selling tickets for north of $100 are publicly subsidized. It isn’t huge money — without public support for the Manhattan Theater Club, that $120 ticket to see Laurie Metcalf in The Other Place (excellent, be sorry if you missed it) might have been $125 instead. But it adds up: a few dozen millions from the state, a hundred million from the city, a billion and a half from Washington.

Try cutting a piece of that and you’ll hear howls about how vital every farthing spent in the service of culture is. Unless you’re David Koch, in which case it’s “Thanks for giving the New York ballet a nice place to perform, now please die.” I wonder how many New York balletomanes know that the David Koch in the David Koch Theater is that David Koch. Perhaps it is the urge to put one’s name on things that so offends Professor Reich and his colleagues at the Richard and Rhoda Goldman School of Public Policy.

286 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:20:12am
287 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:21:01am
288 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:22:43am

re: #285 Dark_Falcon

From Williamson’s article, where we see Reich getting his stats wrong and then getting thumped for it:

SNIP

What does he say about the Waltons establishing their own private family Foundation so that they can give “charitable” tax-free donations to THEMSELVES.

289 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:24:38am

re: #228 Dark_Falcon

It wasn’t the deputy’s gun that saved lives so much as his mind. He was competent and well-trained, and a good number of students likely survived because he was.

To a lot of NRA nuts, a gun is some magic talisman that will ward off evil jut by being waved around at the right time and place. Competence, training and experience are not available over the counter from the local Wal-Mart sporting goods section.

290 Dr. Matt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:26:34am

re: #287 lawhawk

Big news from Utah over the weekend: Federal judge effectively decriminalizes polygamy: t.co
— Slate (@Slate) December 16, 2013

RWNJs should be happy about this considering polygamy is one of many “biblical marriages”.

291 Internet Tough Guy  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:27:03am

Fuck these people.

Paul Ryan Indicates GOP Willing To Hold Debt Limit Hostage Again

“We as a caucus, along with our Senate counterparts, are going to meet and discuss what it is we want to get out of the debt limit. We don’t want nothing out of this debt limit. We’re going to decide what it is we can accomplish out of this debt limit fight”

What a dishonest piece of shit. He won’t shut down the government, but he’ll toy with destroying the economy.

Please proceed asshole.

292 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:28:07am

re: #291 Internet Tough Guy

Fuck these people.

Paul Ryan Indicates GOP Willing To Hold Debt Limit Hostage Again

“We as a caucus, along with our Senate counterparts, are going to meet and discuss what it is we want to get out of the debt limit. We don’t want nothing out of this debt limit. We’re going to decide what it is we can accomplish out of this debt limit fight”

What a dishonest piece of shit. He won’t shut down the government, but he’ll toy with destroying the economy.

Please proceed asshole.

They totally want to DESTROY THE ECONOMY because then they can BLAME OBAMA!!!

293 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:30:21am

re: #287 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Not so much:

The parties in question never sought legal recognition of their polyamorous relationship from the state. They did not have marriage licenses, for example, with the exception of the husband and his first (and still only legal) wife. The parties did not seek to take advantage of laws that apply only to married couples.

The issue is whether the state could criminally punish married people simply for cohabiting. The court said no, as a matter of constitutional law. The section of the statute criminalizing multiple marriages remains intact.

I think that is right. Unrelated consenting adults should be able to engage in “domesticity” in whatever combinations they please without fear of criminal penalty. The community might not like it. Most might, as I do, think it is highly immoral. Shunning would be appropriate for those of a censorious mind. But jail? No.

294 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:30:41am

re: #287 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

This has been an ongoing part of the deate over gay marriage: that there is a distinction between the legal institution of marriage and the religious sacrament of marriage.

Law says that marriage is between two adult partners. Which means that it is gender-neutral but restricted to only two at a time.

If those other wives are happy to live with the religious status of wives without any of the legal benefits, then I see no problem with that. In any case, they all seem happy about it.

295 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:31:51am

re: #278 Lord of the Pies

Is Rucho a US Senator or a NC State Senator?

NC Senate. He didn’t win in 2006, though, lost to Pittenger, who after that term went on to win a US Rep seat (due to redistricting), giving Rucho the NC Senate seat back.

Pittenger has lots of money and just outspent Rucho, interrupting his tenure in the NC Senate.

296 piratedan  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:32:57am

I honestly believe that the R’s would leave health care alone if Obama’s name wasn’t associated with it. For their own reasons, because it’s “tainted” with his name, they feel that there is no way that they can leave his administration with a single accomplishment to ensure that no white folk ever vote for one of “them” ever again. It’s personal and I have no idea as to why.. I’ve never understood this deep seated racism thing and never understood how when faced with such overwhelming evidence when you put to question what Obama is for and the concept alone, as soon as Obama’s name is linked to it, it’s verboten.

297 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:34:32am

re: #289 Sol Berdinowitz

To a lot of NRA nuts, a gun is some magic talisman that will ward off evil jut by being waved around at the right time and place. Competence, training and experience are not available over the counter from the local Wal-Mart sporting goods section.

Ignorant people believe many wrong things, but I don’t have to. The county and school put into place good policies and trained the deputies who would be ‘Johnny on the spot’ in the event of a school shooting. Those policies worked well and saved many lives.

298 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:34:44am

re: #287 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

How does that affect the welfare benefits a lot of those “wives” receive, I wonder. It should shut them out of it.

299 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:41:15am

re: #287 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Does that kind of ruling also cover polyandry?

Nah, they’ll just continue to call women who fuck more than one man a whore, whether she lives with them or not.

300 Ian G.  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:41:48am

re: #291 Internet Tough Guy

Fuck these people.

Paul Ryan Indicates GOP Willing To Hold Debt Limit Hostage Again

“We as a caucus, along with our Senate counterparts, are going to meet and discuss what it is we want to get out of the debt limit. We don’t want nothing out of this debt limit. We’re going to decide what it is we can accomplish out of this debt limit fight”

What a dishonest piece of shit. He won’t shut down the government, but he’ll toy with destroying the economy.

Please proceed asshole.

Yawn. Each time they try this shit, but end up blinking, it becomes less and less effective as a threat. We all know they aren’t going to breach the debt limit at this point, so what the fuck is Ryan saying this for?

My guess is it’s to protect his right flank, since a budget deal with Dems is considered treason by much of his party’s base.

301 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:43:58am

re: #300 Ian G.

Yawn. Each time they try this shit, but end up blinking, it becomes less and less effective as a threat. We all know they aren’t going to breach the debt limit at this point, so what the fuck is Ryan saying this for?

My guess is it’s to protect his right flank, since a budget deal with Dems is considered treason by much of his party’s base.

That’s my guess as well. He knows the budget deal is going to need 1-2 more Republican senators to support it and doesn’t want to make that task harder by seeming to ‘give the store away’ to Obama.

302 Ian G.  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:45:29am

re: #294 Sol Berdinowitz

This has been an ongoing part of the deate over gay marriage: that there is a distinction between the legal institution of marriage and the religious sacrament of marriage.

Law says that marriage is between two adult partners. Which means that it is gender-neutral but restricted to only two at a time.

If those other wives are happy to live with the religious status of wives without any of the legal benefits, then I see no problem with that. In any case, they all seem happy about it.

I’m with you here. With all the hysteria over “ZOMG TEH GAY MARRIAGE LEADS TO POLYGAMY” from the Bryan Fischers of the world, my reaction was always “So what if it does lead to polygamy?” I’m guessing the number of women willing to enter into such marriages is vanishingly small, and if they’re willing to do so as part of their own free will, eh, why do I care?

303 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:48:54am
304 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:54:46am

[Never mind, I blocked this dumb derp]

305 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:56:43am
306 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:57:30am

re: #304 Lord of the Pies

Who exactly has been calling Palin a slut? She’s been called many things, half-governor, shameless self-promoter, uninformed, ignorant, etc., but not a slut.

Sounds like projection once again. Not surprising though.

307 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 7:59:12am

re: #306 lawhawk

Who exactly has been calling Palin a slut? She’s been called many things, half-governor, shameless self-promoter, uninformed, ignorant, etc., but not a slut.

Sounds like projection once again. Not surprising though.

I removed that post when I found it is being Tweeted by a Rush fan. They will fall for any derp that he vomits out of his mouth hole.

308 Mattand  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:01:31am

re: #306 lawhawk

Who exactly has been calling Palin a slut? She’s been called many things, half-governor, shameless self-promoter, uninformed, ignorant, etc., but not a slut.

Sounds like projection once again. Not surprising though.

Bill Maher called her a bimbo a few years back. That could possibly be the genesis of that. Although I imagine you could debate how much sexual promiscuity is actually implied with the insult “bimbo”.

309 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:04:39am

re: #308 Mattand

Bill Maher called her a bimbo a few years back. That could possibly be the genesis of that. Although I imagine you could debate how much sexual promiscuity is actually implied with the insult “bimbo”.

I believe there is an ISO standard that runs: flirt- jezebel - bimbo - trollop - slut. It is calculated based on a formula that takes into account piercings, tattoos, average skirt length and number of sexual partners in the past three months.

310 Joanne  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:06:39am

re: #257 Lord of the Pies

HURR HURR

311 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:07:26am

re: #308 Mattand

Bill Maher called her a bimbo a few years back. That could possibly be the genesis of that. Although I imagine you could debate how much sexual promiscuity is actually implied with the insult “bimbo”.

Liberals do not have a meme that Palin is a “slut” but wingnuts have a meme which Rush made up, that Fluke is a “slut,” because Rush doesn’t understand how “birth control” works.

Never mind the fact that Sandra Fluke never even requested birth control for herself. Rush made up a whole fantasia about her. I am surprised she did not sue Rush for slander, although that would have made wingnuts go all HURR HURR THERE MUST BE SOMETHING!!!!

312 Joanne  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:09:49am

re: #282 Dark_Falcon

Capacity can be added, and it should be. Oil exploration and additional production in Mexico is a Good Thing for the US.

No, capacity cannot be added if a refinery is already running at full capacity, which I understand they are. You need to build new refineries to increase capacity and that takes years.

313 Uncle Obdicut  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:11:30am

re: #282 Dark_Falcon

Capacity can be added, and it should be. Oil exploration and additional production in Mexico is a Good Thing for the US.

Why do you keep repeating this? Do you want to go back to my post after you headed off to bed, and deal with some of what I said here?

Additional oil production, anywhere in the world, is neither good nor bad for the US in an economic sense. it is bad for the US, and for the world, in terms of AGW unless that oil is purposed towards sustainability, which it isn’t, partially because the GOP’s religious disbelief in AGW.

314 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:12:02am

re: #282 Dark_Falcon

Capacity can be added, and it should be. Oil exploration and additional production in Mexico is a Good Thing for the US.

And the occasional spill is just a necessary bump on the road to prosperity…

315 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:12:14am

re: #312 Joanne

No, capacity cannot be added if a refinery is already running at full capacity, which I understand they are. You need to build new refineries to increase capacity and that takes years.

You can add capacity to a refinery, though it often means enlarging it.

And we’ve got years. Mexico has made the needed legal changes, but actually working out contracts and the security arrangements is going to take rather longer.

316 Ian G.  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:13:27am

re: #310 Joanne

Sigh….

thedailybeast.com

Louisiana, Arkansas, Mississippi, Alabama, Arizona, Alaska…heavily democratic, right?

New York and Massachusetts are well known for being arch conservative states, right?

317 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:13:41am

re: #313 Uncle Obdicut

Why do you keep repeating this? Do you want to go back to my post after you headed off to bed, and deal with some of what I said here?

Additional oil production, anywhere in the world, is neither good nor bad for the US in an economic sense. it is bad for the US, and for the world, in terms of AGW unless that oil is purposed towards sustainability, which it isn’t, partially because the GOP’s religious disbelief in AGW.

If we’re refining the oil and building pipelines to bring it to our refineries, as well as providing the equipment to pump the oil, those efforts create profits and jobs.

318 Uncle Obdicut  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:15:41am

re: #317 Dark_Falcon

If we’re refining the oil and building pipelines to bring it to our refineries, as well as providing the equipment to pump the oil, those efforts create profits and jobs.

Again, want to go back to my post after you headed off to bed, rebutting a lot of what you said?

Refineries are very largely automated and are some of the absolute worst job-producing industries. I don’t know why you think we’d be providing the equipment to pump the oil. And if distance is, as you seem to think, a factor in the price of oil, why wouldn’t the companies build this expanded capacity right there in Mexico?

You are not actually thinking about this subject, you are taking your ideology and applying it.

319 The War TARDIS  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:17:12am

I had an interesting night a 2 days ago.

320 Joanne  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:17:41am

re: #316 Ian G.

Sigh….

thedailybeast.com

Louisiana, Arkansas, Mississippi, Alabama, Arizona, Alaska…heavily democratic, right?

New York and Massachusetts are well known for being arch conservative states, right?

I must be stupid because this doesn’t make sense to me:

Firearm deaths are significantly lower in states with stricter gun control legislation. Though the sample sizes are small, we find substantial negative correlations between firearm deaths and states that ban assault weapons (-.45), require trigger locks (-.42), and mandate safe storage requirements for guns (-.48).

321 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:19:13am

re: #316 Ian G.

Sigh….

thedailybeast.com

Louisiana, Arkansas, Mississippi, Alabama, Arizona, Alaska…heavily democratic, right?

New York and Massachusetts are well known for being arch conservative states, right?

At least they are not using this totally bogus “gun violence” map—actually the 2004 election results map.

322 Joanne  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:19:30am

re: #318 Uncle Obdicut

Not to mention that building the Keystone XL pipeline will create tens of temporary jobs.

323 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:20:41am

Who knew upper Minnesota was such a hotbed of gun violence? It must be all those Canadian drug gangs.//

324 Ian G.  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:21:28am

re: #323 Lord of the Pies

Who knew upper Minnesota was such a hotbed of gun violence? It must be all those Canadian drug gangs.//

Vermont too. Well known for its armed hippie gangs shooting each other over organic ice cream turf.

325 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:21:31am

re: #318 Uncle Obdicut

Again, want to go back to my post after you headed off to bed, rebutting a lot of what you said?

Refineries are very largely automated and are some of the absolute worst job-producing industries. I don’t know why you think we’d be providing the equipment to pump the oil. And if distance is, as you seem to think, a factor in the price of oil, why wouldn’t the companies build this expanded capacity right there in Mexico?

You are not actually thinking about this subject, you are taking your ideology and applying it.

Why would Mexico go with someone else? We’ve got large amounts of capability right to hand and we know the geology better than others. I can see Europe getting in on the action a bit, but that’s not a serious problem.

326 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:29:28am

re: #320 Joanne

Not sure where your confusion is. Negative correlation means that there’s a relationship - that with more of the regulation there’s less of the firearms deaths. States that have lax rules have higher firearms deaths.

327 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:30:52am

re: #326 lawhawk

Not sure where your confusion is. Negative correlation means that there’s a relationship - that with more of the regulation there’s less of the firearms deaths. States that have lax rules have higher firearms deaths.

There are liberal terrorists everywhere, all they need is access to guns and the next shooting is pre-programmed.

/

328 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:31:51am
329 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:31:51am

After decades of claiming that their soaps are antibacterial, the FDA is about to end those claims finding that there’s no sign that triclosan stops bacterial growth.


Proper washing of hands with soap and water is sufficient. The new rules being promulgated will require manufacturers to show that their product reduces bacteria more than just soap and water alone.

330 Joanne  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:32:58am

re: #326 lawhawk

Not sure where your confusion is. Negative correlation means that there’s a relationship - that with more of the regulation there’s less of the firearms deaths. States that have lax rules have higher firearms deaths.

I was reading it backwards with negative correlation being an increase (negative to the thesis). Thank you!!

331 Uncle Obdicut  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:34:12am

re: #325 Dark_Falcon

Why would Mexico go with someone else?

For any number of contingent reasons.

Again, want to go back to my post after you headed off to bed, rebutting a lot of what you said? Third time I’m asking this.

332 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:34:58am
333 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:40:29am

re: #328 Lord of the Pies

Seeing that most incidences of rape are acquaintances and not strangers, seems kind of odd to perpetuate the myth that it’s a stranger with a firearm committing the rape.

rwu.edu

One in eight college women is the victim of rape during her college years. One in four is the victim of attempted rape.

95 percent of these rape victims did not report the rape to officials.

25 percent of women were raped and/or physically assaulted by a current or former spouse, partner or date during their lifetime.

84 percent of the women knew the men who raped them; 57 percent were on dates.

334 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:41:33am

re: #333 lawhawk

Seeing that most incidences of rape are acquaintances and not strangers, seems kind of odd to perpetuate the myth that it’s a stranger with a firearm committing the rape.

rwu.edu

All single women should be chaperoned on dates.

335 Uncle Obdicut  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:43:51am

re: #334 Sol Berdinowitz

All single women should be chaperoned on dates.

All sex should be threesomes or more from now on. With a referee.

336 Internet Tough Guy  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:47:05am

re: #333 lawhawk

If only the women packed heat while on dates, the rapes never would have happened.

337 Internet Tough Guy  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:47:20am

re: #335 Uncle Obdicut

I’m OK with this.

338 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:53:10am

re: #336 Internet Tough Guy

If only the women packed heat while on dates, the rapes never would have happened.

Not just pack heat, but have it loaded, cocked and pointed at his head the whole time…

339 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:53:29am

re: #338 Sol Berdinowitz

Not just pack heat, but have it loaded, cocked and pointed at his head the whole time…

That’s Hot. /

340 Ian G.  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 8:56:30am

re: #332 Lord of the Pies

[Embedded content]

Keep it up, Frankie. I’ll look the other way on contraception and gays if you want to be my ally in the fight against Randianism run amok.

341 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:00:23am

Congrats, Uncle Obdicut.

342 RealityBasedSteve  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:01:33am

re: #309 Sol Berdinowitz

I believe there is an ISO standard that runs: flirt- jezebel - bimbo - trollop - slut. It is calculated based on a formula that takes into account piercings, tattoos, average skirt length and number of sexual partners in the past three months.

One thing to be aware of, in the upcoming revision to the standard, (RFC 6969) a distinction between trollop and slut will be clarified. A slut will be restricted to those who hold an amateur status, with items like meals and expensive show tickets not being counted as remuneration, and trollop will be restricted to those who primarily “Play For Pay”, with some allowances for “Charity Work”. Also, the jezebel classification is now considered to be obsolete, but will be maintained for this version of the standard for backward compatibility.

RBS
Who is tired of studying today. Being a student is hard. Teaching is Easy.

343 HoosierHoops  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:12:06am

re: #335 Uncle Obdicut

All sex should be threesomes or more from now on. With a referee.

344 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:17:49am

re: #294 Sol Berdinowitz

If those other wives are happy to live with the religious status of wives without any of the legal benefits, then I see no problem with that. In any case, they all seem happy about it.

Read this book before asserting that ‘they all’ seem happy with it. Women suffer under patriarchy. Polygamous Mormon sects are patriarchal in the extreme.

345 Uncle Obdicut  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:21:21am

re: #343 HoosierHoops

Someone’s planning on violating the offside rule, I see.

346 erik_t  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:22:20am

re: #345 Uncle Obdicut

Illegal touching.

347 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:22:20am

re: #344 wrenchwench

Read this book before asserting that ‘they all’ seem happy with it. Women suffer under patriarchy. Polygamous Mormon sects are patriarchal in the extreme.

I didn’t say that they seem happy, just “if” they were…I am aware that there is a lot more to it than that, I am looking solely at the legal aspects of it: one wife gets to be the “legal” one, the others are only the “religious” ones…


which in itself could lead to no end of problems, but at that point, they are somebody else’s problems.

348 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:22:21am

re: #343 HoosierHoops

All sex should be odd-numbered threesomes or more from now on. With a referee.

If there’s a tie, nothing ever gets done.

349 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:23:23am

sudden death overtime

350 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:24:17am
351 HoosierHoops  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:26:15am

What the Hell? I check my facebook and a young girl from Boston starts flirting with me.. Honey..You are very cute but young..
She wants a relationship with an older guy. What the hell is going on here?
Facebook..I only opened a page to keep in touch with the family. Half the people I don’t even know now. I’ll be marking this day down. The day a 21 yr old hit on me. You guys would be proud of me.. I deflected the flirtation to a pleasant conversation cause it was wandering into Penthouse letter territory. I’m sorry there is so much loneliness today. I never had that issue at 21. ( OK fuck it.. In the Napa Valley we had what we called meat market nightclubs with all the city people visiting for the weekend..Yes it was easy pickings but I was 21. What do they say? Don’t you judge me! )

352 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:28:03am

re: #351 HoosierHoops

What the Hell? I check my facebook and a young girl from Boston starts flirting with me.. Honey..You are very cute but young..
She wants a relationship with an older guy. What the hell is going on here?
Facebook..I only opened a page to keep in touch with the family. Half the people I don’t even know now. I’ll be marking this day down. The day a 21 yr old hit on me. You guys would be proud of me.. I deflected the flirtation to a pleasant conversation cause it was wandering into Penthouse letter territory. I’m sorry there is so much loneliness today. I never had that issue at 21. ( OK fuck it.. In the Napa Valley we had what we called meat market nightclubs with all the city people visiting for the weekend..Yes it was easy pickings but I was 21. What do they say? Don’t you judge me! )

“She’s” phishing.
“She” wants your passwords and your credit card numbers.
It’s probably some hairy dude in Belarus.

353 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:33:34am

re: #351 HoosierHoops

The Internet, where men are kids, women are men, and kids are undercover FBI agents.

354 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:33:39am

re: #352 Lord of the Pies

“She’s” phishing.
“She” wants your passwords and your credit card numbers.
It’s probably some hairy dude in Belarus.

Do you hang out at the mall, telling toddlers there is no Santa Clause?

355 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:34:57am

re: #347 Sol Berdinowitz

I didn’t say that they seem happy, just “if” they were…I am aware that there is a lot more to it than that, I am looking solely at the legal aspects of it: one wife gets to be the “legal” one, the others are only the “religious” ones…

which in itself could lead to no end of problems, but at that point, they are somebody else’s problems.

Sorry, I guess I took this the wrong way:

In any case, they all seem happy about it.

I have known a couple of happy threesomes, but this has nothing to do with the culture of child rape that happens in Mormon sects with polygamy. (Not the mainstream LDS Church, but I think they should do more to oppose it.)

356 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:35:34am

re: #354 Decatur Deb

Do you hang out at the mall, telling toddlers there is no Santa Clause?

I am married to Santa Claus!

357 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:36:52am

re: #356 Lord of the Pies

I am married to Santa Claus!

Explains the dreidel in my stocking.

358 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:38:33am

re: #355 wrenchwench

Sorry, I guess I took this the wrong way:

I have known a couple of happy threesomes, but this has nothing to do with the culture of child rape that happens in Mormon sects with polygamy. (Not the mainstream LDS Church, but I think they should do more to oppose it.)

I was just judging the way they were smiling in the photograph…God knows what lies beyond the story.

I remember driving through Colorado City, Arizona, a settlement of Mormon Old Believers, and noticed a lot of large houses with multiple sections all painted in different colors.

Someone pointed out that there would be one Mormon patriarch living there with multiple wives, and each wife got to choose her own color for her wing of the house…

I guess the Old guy would just stand in the entry and spin the needle on a color wheel to see where he was sleeping that night.

359 Dave In Austin  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:40:25am

Texas…….

Text me is I can help.

360 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:40:55am

OUTRAGE!

361 HoosierHoops  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:41:49am

re: #353 Varek Raith

The Internet, where men are kids, women are men, and kids are undercover FBI agents.

That is great! We have a mutual friend and I checked out her page.
Smoking hot girl from Boston. I think she is broken.
I’ve been around. You can’t fix broken. She reached out and I feel sorry for her. But I’m from Napa Valley. Seen it a thousand times. I’m sorry for her and really can’t believe she reached out.
Damn she is hot but I’m not buying it

362 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:42:24am

re: #352 Lord of the Pies

It’s Peggy!

Youtube Video

363 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:42:45am

re: #361 HoosierHoops

That is great! We have a mutual friend and I checked out her page.
Smoking hot girl from Boston. I think she is broken.
I’ve been around. You can’t fix broken. She reached out and I feel sorry for her. But I’m from Napa Valley. Seen it a thousand times. I’m sorry for her and really can’t believe she reached out.
Damn she is hot but I’m not buying it

If it’s “too good to be true”
It’s not true.

364 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:43:13am

re: #358 Sol Berdinowitz

I was just judging the way they were smiling in the photograph…God knows what lies beyond the story.

I remember driving through Colorado City, Arizona, a settlement of Mormon Old Believers, and noticed a lot of large houses with multiple sections all painted in different colors.

Someone pointed out that there would be one Mormon patriarch living there with multiple wives, and each wife got to choose her own color for her wing of the house…

I guess the Old guy would just stand in the entry and spin the needle on a color wheel to see where he was sleeping that night.

Seriously, you should read that book before you speak glibly about it. It’s child rape, child marriage, false imprisonment, abuse of children and adults. And the men who get no wives, or have their wives taken away from them by the patriarch, suffer almost as much as the women.

365 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:45:08am

re: #364 wrenchwench

Seriously, you should read that book before you speak glibly about it. It’s child rape, child marriage, false imprisonment, abuse of children and adults. And the men who get no wives, or have their wives taken away from them by the patriarch, suffer almost as much as the women.

And the male children who are expelled from the community when they become teenagers, so they won’t be competition for the Patriarch.

366 Dr. Matt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:46:33am

Anyone been to HuffPO lately? I haven’t visited HuffPo in months, but they now require a facebook account to post comments. I guess I can cross that website off my list.

367 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:46:54am

re: #351 HoosierHoops

I do not friend anyone on FB unless I have met them personally (with only a few exceptions) and wish to remain in real-life contact with them.

I got my Cyrillic keyboard installed a while back and decided to practice by responding to an unsolicited love letter from young woman from Russia.

Seemed all on the level, soon she was saying how she wanted to come and visit, was not asking for money or anything, had a flight booked.

Then I just Googled “Russian women scam” and found a site from the US State Department. The scam works like this: You go to the airport, she does not get off the plane…you get a tearful SMS that she was denied entry unless she could prove that she had $2,000 in cash…could you just wire it to her so she can clear customs, she will give it right back to you as soon as you see her again…

Which you never do.

368 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:47:33am

re: #366 Dr. Matt

Anyone been to HuffPO lately? I haven’t visited HuffPo in months, but they now require a facebook account to post comments. I guess I can cross that website off my list.

ThinkProg also requires a FB account in order to post comments.

369 BongCrodny  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:47:54am

USAToday had an article today on the country’s worst drivers.

In a survey conducted by CarInsuranceComparison.com, the worst states were determined to be:

1. Louisiana
2. South Carolina
3. Mississippi
4. Texas
5. Alabama
6. Florida
7. Missouri (tie)
7. North Carolina (tie)
9. Montana
10. North Dakota

Gee, I wondeR if theRe might be some soRt of shallow, supeRficial judgment I could offeR as to what all these paRticulaR states have in common.

It’s Right on the tip of my tongue, but foR some Reason, I just can’t seem to get a gRasp on it.

370 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:48:00am

re: #365 Lord of the Pies

And the male children who are expelled from the community when they become teenagers, so they won’t be competition for the Patriarch.

Hundreds of them.

371 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:48:51am

re: #366 Dr. Matt

Anyone been to HuffPO lately? I haven’t visited HuffPo in months, but they now require a facebook account to post comments. I guess I can cross that website off my list.

re: #368 Lord of the Pies

ThinkProg also requires a FB account in order to post comments.

Rofl.
I wonder what the dudebros over at those sites think of that.

372 HoosierHoops  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:49:01am

Anybody here seen the show Big Love? Dude gets married to 3 woman.
Cracked me up.. Who can keep 3 woman happy? Stick with one and blow her mind. 1/3 of awesome sucks

373 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:49:16am

re: #370 wrenchwench

Whoa my anti malware lit up like crazy at that link!!….

374 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:50:21am

re: #364 wrenchwench

Seriously, you should read that book before you speak glibly about it. It’s child rape, child marriage, false imprisonment, abuse of children and adults. And the men who get no wives, or have their wives taken away from them by the patriarch, suffer almost as much as the women.

Again, I am separating the cultural/social aspects of a primitive, Old-Testament patriarchal society from the legal aspects of modern marriage and cohabitation.

I am aware of what “family values” mean to these people.

The city in mentioned, Colorado City, formerly Short Creek, was the site of a raid by federal marshals in the early 1950’s when polygamy was being practiced openly there in an isolated corner of Arizona. Federal marshals had to be called in because the area was cut off by the Grand Canyon and inaccessible from any point in Arizona.

375 Dr. Matt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:51:37am

re: #368 Lord of the Pies

ThinkProg also requires a FB account in order to post comments.

Yeah. I hated that decision. I miss their previous setup.

376 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:52:53am

re: #375 Dr. Matt

Yeah. I hated that decision. I miss their previous setup.

The worst commenting system is at Gawker & its affiliates. Guarantees that trolls will get the highest rating.

377 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:53:42am

Geez you would think Mormons are the only culture that has polygamy.

378 erik_t  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:53:48am

re: #376 Lord of the Pies

The worst commenting system is at Gawker & its affiliates. Guarantees that trolls will get the highest rating.

Everything else about Gawker is absolute trash, so that’s fitting.

379 EmmaAnne  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:54:20am

re: #365 Lord of the Pies

And the male children who are expelled from the community when they become teenagers, so they won’t be competition for the Patriarch.

Yeah, I felt almost as sorry for the discarded young men.

That said, I don’t think laws against polygamy are needed - child endangerment, statutory rape, kidnapping - all much longer sentences and more to the point.

380 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:54:28am

Dudebro freakouts on the NPR Facebook page over Snowden not getting amnesty from the White House. ROFL. As if stealing classified information gets you a free pass from the government.

381 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:54:39am

re: #378 erik_t

Everything else about Gawker is absolute trash, so that’s fitting.

I like Jalopnik, Jezebel and io9.

382 Dr. Matt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:55:31am

re: #376 Lord of the Pies

The worst commenting system is at Gawker & its affiliates. Guarantees that trolls will get the highest rating.

I agree. I love the format of those affiliated web pages (Deadspin, Gawker, etc), but the commenting system blows.

383 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 9:56:13am

re: #380 Lidane

Dudebro freakouts on the NPR Facebook page over Snowden not getting amnesty from the White House. ROFL. As if stealing classified information gets you a free pass from the government.

[Embedded image]

Funny enough that a Privacy Paranoid is using FB.

384 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:00:58am

re: #373 Political Atheist

Whoa my anti malware lit up like crazy at that link!!….

Sorry. Try this article.

385 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:02:49am

Soon, someone may be acquitted of having ties to terror. If so, the verdict may remain secret. That’s not justice.

386 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:06:16am

re: #374 Sol Berdinowitz

Again, I am separating the cultural/social aspects of a primitive, Old-Testament patriarchal society from the legal aspects of modern marriage and cohabitation.

I am aware of what “family values” mean to these people.

The city in mentioned, Colorado City, formerly Short Creek, was the site of a raid by federal marshals in the early 1950’s when polygamy was being practiced openly there in an isolated corner of Arizona. Federal marshals had to be called in because the area was cut off by the Grand Canyon and inaccessible from any point in Arizona.

It is still going on. This article is from 2011.

[…]

And many of the townsfolk are less than friendly. When an outsider approaches, they often scurry away, leaving strangers to be followed by men in trucks with darkened windows.

FLDS lawyers say the distrust, or fear, stems from generations of religious persecution, dating to an Arizona raid in the 1950s, when the polygamous community was known as Short Creek.

Since then, church members awaiting the rapture have endured repeated conflicts with the state. Child marriages, which prompted the criminal cases against Jeffs, constitute the most visible controversy.

But a legal battle over ownership of the twin towns has emerged as strategically critical to both church leadership, which seeks to reassert control, and former church members and Utah, which aim to wrestle it away.

For decades, the FLDS Church, which is not affiliated with mainstream Mormonism, controlled virtually all of the community’s land, homes and businesses through a trust known as the United Effort Plan. Two years ago, assets were estimated at $110 million.

Families poured their labor and earnings into the trust, which in turn assigned wives, houses and jobs.

[…]

Wyler, 45, was among about 20 people booted from the FLDS priesthood - the church membership - in 2004.

He says excommunication orders came down after an elder inquired about his 9-year-old daughter, asking when she would be available for marriage. Wyler says he answered that, until the girl turned 18, the prophet “is going to have to come to my door with a baseball bat.”

Wyler says he had built his home, but the trust held the deed, so he was evicted. He says Jeffs uses that power over property as a weapon against FLDS members.

“They’re victims,” Wyler adds. “When you control people through fear, that’s not right. And I feel like it’s my responsibility to do something.”

Chatwin, 42, who left the church years ago when he realized Jeffs would never assign him a wife, says he lives as an outcast in a place where FLDS leaders still control the police, the medical clinic, the water department and Town Hall.

“It’s not just a cult; this is a mafia,” Chatwin says. “I know that they’re watching me all the time. I’ve had my house broken into, my office ransacked.

“We’re trying to stand up to the best of our ability… . And we’re starting to see changes. We’re starting to see people saying, ‘We’re done. We’re fed up.’ ”
[…]


Read more: azcentral.com

387 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:07:50am

re: #377 Political Atheist

Geez you would think Mormons are the only culture that has polygamy.

Why do you say that? Can I not offer criticism of the closest example to me without offering a survey of all the other examples?

388 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:13:05am

Oh this is just too good. Dudebro on FB tried to quote JFK at me as a means to support Snowden.

Cue me pointing out that an American government worker stealing classified info then hiding in Russia during the Cold War would’ve been charged with espionage and that we wouldn’t be having any sort of national conversation about it.

389 Eventual Carrion  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:14:17am

re: #279 Joanne

And the fact of the matter is that if the price of oil goes down too much, they simply pull back production of crude. No oil producer will allow the global market cost per barrel to get too low. It is not in their benefit.

Yep. Same with the people that say that the XL pipeline will lower the price of gas/oil. It won’t (energy companies won’t let it). That oil has only become profitable to acquire because the price of oil has gotten high enough. Makes no sense that they (oil companies) would pour all that money into something (the pipeline) only to end up unprofitable upon completion. Business doesn’t work that way.

390 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:15:45am

There have been quite a few comments about polygamy and child abuse/wife abuse etc. Not a peep about anyone else. Just seems odd. Unintentionally builds a perception apart from reality. I see a lot of discomfort (not just here) with the latest constitutional ruling on marriage. Most if not all of it centered at illegal splinter sects of the Mormon church.

391 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:21:16am

re: #390 Political Atheist

There have been quite a few comments about polygamy and child abuse/wife abuse etc. Not a peep about anyone else. Just seems odd. Unintentionally builds a perception apart from reality. I see a lot of discomfort (not just here) with the latest constitutional ruling on marriage. Most if not all of it centered at illegal splinter sects of the Mormon church.

I take it that’s a response to my #387.

The court case is from Utah. The case involved Mormons. It there something inappropriate about commenting without broadening with unrelated examples?

I have respect for the mainstream LDS church and its members. The fundamentalist sects that broke off from that deserve NO respect.

392 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:22:48am

re: #351 HoosierHoops

What the Hell? I check my facebook and a young girl from Boston starts flirting with me.. Honey..You are very cute but young..
She wants a relationship with an older guy. What the hell is going on here?
Facebook..I only opened a page to keep in touch with the family. Half the people I don’t even know now. I’ll be marking this day down. The day a 21 yr old hit on me. You guys would be proud of me.. I deflected the flirtation to a pleasant conversation cause it was wandering into Penthouse letter territory. I’m sorry there is so much loneliness today. I never had that issue at 21. ( OK fuck it.. In the Napa Valley we had what we called meat market nightclubs with all the city people visiting for the weekend..Yes it was easy pickings but I was 21. What do they say? Don’t you judge me! )

Be careful. “She” may be looking for your money, not you. And may not be what she seems.

393 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:27:17am

re: #391 wrenchwench

I take it that’s a response to my #387.

The court case is from Utah. The case involved Mormons. It there something inappropriate about commenting without broadening with unrelated examples?

I have respect for the mainstream LDS church and its members. The fundamentalist sects that broke off from that deserve NO respect.

Where the law is broken by a cult, I’m all for breaking it up and having the law take it’s course. Cults and child or wife abuse are a problem, thankfully pretty rare. Conflating those wrongs with the rights or desire of more than 2 adults to have a consensual marriage or cohabitation is rather dicey IMO. All too often in the MSM and sometimes here the Mormon church gets lumped in and or taken as something to point and laugh at.

394 Uncle Obdicut  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:36:43am

re: #393 Political Atheist

The Mormon church is a religion, and like any religion, especially a religion whose origin is actually known, there’s a shitload to make fun of.

Personally, I don’t get a lot out of making fun of them, but I am still, and will always remain, volcanically angry towards the Mormon Church for their stupid, short-sighted, asinine, contemptible, and should-be-illegal support for Proposition 8 in California.

395 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:39:48am

Dudebro logic:

With the Patriot Act, you don’t need a valid legal reason for anything. You can Waterboard as many American citizens as you deem fit.

396 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:44:22am

How is life today?

397 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:45:22am

re: #393 Political Atheist

Where the law is broken by a cult, I’m all for breaking it up and having the law take it’s course. Cults and child or wife abuse are a problem, thankfully pretty rare. Conflating those wrongs with the rights or desire of more than 2 adults to have a consensual marriage or cohabitation is rather dicey IMO. All too often in the MSM and sometimes here the Mormon church gets lumped in and or taken as something to point and laugh at.

I am very carefully not conflating. Twice I distinguished between the mainstream LDS and the FUNDAMENTALIST sects that have broken away. I have not used the word ‘cult’. I never said I want any group ‘broken up’. Once I even said:

I have known a couple of happy threesomes, but this has nothing to do with the culture of child rape that happens in Mormon sects with polygamy.

398 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:45:43am

re: #394 Uncle Obdicut

The Mormon church is a religion, and like any religion, especially a religion whose origin is actually known, there’s a shitload to make fun of.

Personally, I don’t get a lot out of making fun of them, but I am still, and will always remain, volcanically angry towards the Mormon Church for their stupid, short-sighted, asinine, contemptible, and should-be-illegal support for Proposition 8 in California.

We all have the choice of objecting to policies, actions etc. That’s all valid. Yet we need not look far to find those who would broad brush a religion with it’s fringe, or as a point of bigoted humor. There is a line in there that applies across the board-All religions.

399 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:47:22am

re: #398 Political Atheist

We all have the choice of objecting to policies, actions etc. That’s all valid. Yet we need not look far to find those who would broad brush a religion with it’s fringe, or as a point of bigoted humor. There is a line in there that applies across the board-All religions.

If you’re accusing me of this, I’m asking for a retraction. If you’re not, I’m asking for a clarification on your part.

400 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:48:06am
401 freetoken  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:48:07am

re: #398 Political Atheist

In many cases, such as the LDS, it is not just the “fringe” that is questionable but the very foundation.

402 ObserverArt  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:48:34am

re: #366 Dr. Matt

Anyone been to HuffPO lately? I haven’t visited HuffPo in months, but they now require a facebook account to post comments. I guess I can cross that website off my list.

That seems to be occurring at a lot of sites. I guess Facebook thinks they will be all things to all people. One size fits all has never appealed to me…too much an individualist.

And knowing how they cull all this data, they probably are linking those comments to email addresses and adding it all together even if you are not a user.

They really need to be told to step off. Hopefully America and the rest of the world’s users are beginning to get a grip on how intrusive Facebook is.

I had an account under a fake name because I had to deal with two companies pages. I hated the hell out of the fact that I had to even have that. Once the businesses closed their web stores and cut the staff to nothing I went and shut down the activity on the accounts. They asked for an email to forward any info that might come in during the 14 days it takes to shut down a page/account. I kept the Facebook account just in case it was needed. I planned to go a year and then close it ALL down.

In little time, I had ‘friends’ listed in emails sent by Facebook, and the only way those folks could have known it was me was association of the email address which has my full name. They never knew me through that account name. As soon as I started to see that I went to Facebook and shut it all down and made sure that they never contacted me again.

I’m probably on some ‘enemy to Facebook’ list somewhere now.

I’ve heard that LinkedIn can be about as bad. Too bad many now seem to think the only way to get a job is to have a LinkedIn account.

I’ve never been into large groups and doing what everyone is doing. I’m probably paying for it, but I will work around it.

403 freetoken  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:49:35am

re: #402 ObserverArt

I’ve stopped posting comments in some places because they switch to requiring Facebook or Google accounts.

Just not going to do it.

404 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:49:41am

re: #397 wrenchwench

Can’t I address a situation in general? I’m not saying you conflated anything. I’m saying what I said-nothing more. The Mormons take a lot of heat in the media and sometimes here especially during the election. That line I referred to above to Uncle Obdi is important to me in how I address religion and cults. And what goes wrong in religions.

405 The War TARDIS  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:50:25am

re: #394 Uncle Obdicut

So, your issues with the way I talk about them is the fact that I take your anger and add about 11 levels because I am attacking them about things that were done by people long dead.

Is that correct?

406 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:50:30am

re: #401 freetoken

In many cases, such as the LDS, it is not just the “fringe” that is questionable but the very foundation.

That does a disservice to those being abused by the fringe. It really is worse, by any measure.

407 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:51:04am

OMG! I don’t think I can take another conspiracy . .

408 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:52:32am

re: #404 Political Atheist

Can’t I address a situation in general? I’m not saying you conflated anything. I’m saying what I said-nothing more. The Mormons take a lot of heat in the media and sometimes here especially during the election. That line I referred to above to Uncle Obdi is important to me in how I address religion and cults. And what goes wrong in religions.

If you’re using the same ‘line’ for a mainstream religion as you are for a fundamentalist cult, you’re doing it wrong.

409 BusyMonster  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:54:59am

re: #86 Lord of the Pies

I HATE EVERY ONE of the songs listed on that infographic. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE.

I also despise virtually all Christmas music. And I did not realize that someone had spent the time to collect and date all the songs, but yes I’ve been hearing what sounds like the same fucking CD in every store since 1988 when I worked at a movie theater over Xmas one time. OH. MY. GOD. It’s the same songs, over 20 years later.

I’m sure I’m playing right into Bill O’Really’s ham-fisted narrative by hating on the cheese of the season so much, but seriously, Bill, if there really were a war on Xmas trust me I’d be on the opposing side with a goddamn bazooka. The entire affair makes my skin crawl these days. Relentless barrage of monotonous music, millions of brain-dead Stepford Shoppers scrambling over each other like ants on a goddamn cracker.

It is entirely bereft of human dignity, this orgy of running around accumulating things. We look like we’re all looters in the wake of an apocalypse.

P.S. ON topic of the thread, I only use Facebook to promote my original band, and I think LinkedIn is mostly there for spammers to harvest emails. I do not sign on to either website if I can possibly help it (sometimes months go by). And I am about this close to just deleting the whole FB thing because it is nothing but the community tree stump which doesn’t interest me.

410 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:55:49am
411 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 10:56:50am
412 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:00:15am

re: #411 FemNaziBitch

*sigh*

I knew they’d retcon it as soon as possible, but come on. Really?

I actually hoped they had killed him. I like Brian a lot, but it would’ve been incredibly ballsy to kill him and leave him dead.

413 Mattand  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:03:18am

re: #407 FemNaziBitch

OMG! I don’t think I can take another conspiracy . .

[Embedded content]

I think the big takeaway here is that Michael Moore is so neck-deep in truther bullshit that he’s willing to use Rupert Murdoch to back him up on it.

414 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:03:47am
415 Uncle Obdicut  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:04:52am

re: #398 Political Atheist

We all have the choice of objecting to policies, actions etc. That’s all valid. Yet we need not look far to find those who would broad brush a religion with it’s fringe, or as a point of bigoted humor. There is a line in there that applies across the board-All religions.

I think a lot of the humor comes from the obviousness of the changes in Mormonism in response to necessity and outside culture. They have recently rolled back their views on racism, too, not because of actual religious inquiry, but because it made them look horrible and was preventing them from proselytizing and getting converts in a lot of places they wanted them. The writing in “A Pearl of Great Price” is clear in its racism. Mormonism had the misfortune to be born during a period of exceedingly dumb cultural values, and it still has a lot of them embedded in it. Having a real history available is dangerous for a religion; it needs to be mythologized to withstand scrutiny.

416 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:05:17am

Ah dudebros. The Hitler comparisons have started, and the ZOMG YOU DON’T CARE ABOUT TEH CONSTITUTION hysteria is coming my way. Time to bow out with them.

417 Kragar  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:08:33am
418 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:09:29am
419 Kragar  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:10:08am

re: #418 Lidane

[Embedded content]

He must really hate what those tea party assholes are doing.
/

420 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:11:11am


Lol.

421 Gus  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:11:16am
422 Lidane  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:13:17am
423 FemNaziBitch  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:13:57am

424 Mattand  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:14:09am

More in the continuing series of “Why Thinking Christie is The Great Bipartisan Uniter is Fucking Stupid”:

Official Who Resigned In Bridge Scandal Owns Web Domains Of Christie Foes

I guess technically domain-squatting on your opponents’ name for potential mudslinging is sort of like reaching across the aisle.

425 Ian G.  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:14:37am

Ahh, Michael Moore and Ted Rall, reminding us that the left does indeed have cretins just like Rush Limbaugh and Bryan Fischer. It’s just that the Dems ignore them.

426 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:14:44am

re: #421 Gus

[Embedded content]

He’s such a dick.
And can’t draw.

427 Mattand  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 11:14:52am

re: #420 Varek Raith

[Embedded content]


Lol.

Although being high would explain why they think rape joke are somehow funny.

428 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 12:00:15pm
429 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 12:31:59pm

re: #417 Kragar

[Embedded content]

I actually don’t think it’s settled law that what Snowgreen did violated his constitutional rights, nor that he’s a “whistleblower”.

430 Hercules Grytpype-Thynneghazi  Mon, Dec 16, 2013 12:34:06pm

re: #353 Varek Raith

The Internet, where men are kids, women are men, and kids are undercover FBI agents.

And no one knows you’re a dog.


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