Amazingly, Republicans Getting Even Stupider About Evolution

Anti-science craziness getting worse
Wingnuts • Views: 34,076

Remember when Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal hilariously called on the GOP to stop being “the stupid party?”

Well, um, yeah. Republicans Growing More Skeptical About Evolution.

The Washington Post uses the word “skeptical” to describe this reactionary idiocy, but that word implies rational questioning — and there’s absolutely nothing rational about the right’s embrace of literal creationism. It’s part and parcel of a long Republican tradition of rejecting modern science in favor of superstition.

I seriously wish we’d start calling this what it is: dangerous, destructive stupidity. But you can count on the US media to continue pretending this view is simply “skepticism.”

Over the last four years, the percentage of Democrats who said they believe in evolution has risen by three points, from 64 percent to 67 percent. But the percentage of Republicans who believe in the theory has dropped 11 points, from 54 percent to 43 percent.

So while there was a 10-point gap in 2009, there is now a 24-point gap.

Pew says similar shifts have not occurred for any other demographics, either racial or religious.

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440 comments
1 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:20:39am

I didn’t come from no monkey!

2 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:21:32am

Whenever they refer to denial as “skepticism,” I just end up shaking my head. The media is just unable to level with a significant portion of its reader/listener/viewership that responding to scientific facts with declarations that there’s a “hoax” or “conspiracy” going on, or that science can’t be right because the Bible says differently, is not “skepticism” it’s stupidity.

3 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:21:48am

And it just so happens the Tea Party first came to prominence about 4 years ago…

4 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:21:52am

I had just paged this.

My point on this was it doesn’t necessarily mean that more Republicans have stopped believing in evolution, but more likely means that people who believe in evolution have stopped believing in the GOP.

5 b.d.  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:21:59am

HOW COME TERE ARE STILL MONKEYS THEN!!?!?!?

6 allegro  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:22:44am
Pew says similar shifts have not occurred for any other demographics, either racial or religious.

.

Well that is certainly… enlightening.

7 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:24:45am

re: #1 Gus

>I didn’t come from no monkey!

Obviously you’re still a monkey.

8 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:25:06am

re: #4 Kragar

I had just paged this.

My point on this was it doesn’t necessarily mean that more Republicans have stopped believing in evolution, but more likely means that people who believe in evolution have stopped believing in the GOP.

I think it’s also some people of no firm belief on evolution following the herd.

9 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:25:34am

Think the only thing that gives me a bigger headache is when the subject of “intelligent design” comes up in the press and they treat that as if it’s a legitimate idea, rather than what it is: creationism in a lab coat. We’re a nation that used to pride itself on not only a strong grasp of the sciences and thorough education, but also on a media that was unafraid to broach the difficult subjects. Now we have a media that’s patting an increasingly infantile nation on the head and cooing that it’s okay to believe in those fairy tales, because you don’t need no book learning to watch TV.

10 ericblair  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:25:49am

re: #4 Kragar

I had just paged this.

My point on this was it doesn’t necessarily mean that more Republicans have stopped believing in evolution, but more likely means that people who believe in evolution have stopped believing in the GOP.

That’s my read on it. Any organization on a purity purge like the GOP is is going to keep getting smaller and crazier. I think the party’s in a death spiral, but that doesn’t mean it will be quick or painless.

11 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:25:52am

Republicans Growing More Convinced They Were Right About Everything All Along, Despite Growing Evidence To The Contrary

12 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:26:06am

As a former Republican, allow me to say that one of the reasons I ended up leaving the GOP was because of the party’s decision to embrace that Olde Tyme Religion.

13 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:26:07am

Hmmmm.

An awful lot of “leaners” out there. I’m assuming those come from all those so-called “independents” who love to brag about themselves.

gallup.com

14 S'latch  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:26:19am

Youtube Video

They tell us that
We lost our tails, evolving up
From little snails
I say it’s all, just wind in sails

Are we not men?
We are Devo
Are we not men?
D E V O

We’re pinheads now
We are not whole
We’re pinheads all
Jocko homo

15 Charles Johnson  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:26:33am

re: #4 Kragar

I had just paged this.

My point on this was it doesn’t necessarily mean that more Republicans have stopped believing in evolution, but more likely means that people who believe in evolution have stopped believing in the GOP.

That’s probably part of the reason. The Tea Party has brought a lot of complete morons into the party at the same time, though.

16 nsmith25  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:26:49am

re: #1 Gus

“There may be bugs on some of you mugs…”

17 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:27:40am

re: #15 Charles Johnson

That’s probably part of the reason. The Tea Party has brought a lot of complete morons into the party at the same time, though.

The two factors most likely worked together to give them the boost.

18 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:27:57am

re: #13 Justanotherhuman

Hmmmm.

An awful lot of “leaners” out there. I’m assuming those come from all those so-called “independents” who love to brag about themselves.

gallup.com

Anytime the pollsters talk about “independents” as if they’re a legitimate bloc anymore, I roll my eyes. The more savvy ones are noting aloud that all the talk about the importance of winning over “independents” has waned as the bloc becomes clogged with Republicans-in-denial, those who’ve given up their party identification but will still vote a straight ticket come November.

19 Timothy Watson  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:28:44am

re: #4 Kragar

More than likely that’s what happened.

Remember when how Mitt Romney thought he was going to win the election because he was winning self-identified independents by such a large margin? He was winning independents because Republican identification was a record low, and people who consider themselves (non-crazy) conservative or semi-conservative were identifying as independents but still voting for the Republican nominees as always.

20 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:30:31am

re: #16 nsmith25

Welcome, hatchling.

21 nsmith25  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:32:01am

re: #20 wrenchwench

Appreciate it. Watched/read from afar. Great Articles. Great Community.

22 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:32:07am

That sound you hear is Evangelicals keening.

Israel Expected To Fund All Abortions For Women Aged 20-33

23 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:32:10am

re: #8 Dark_Falcon

I think it’s also some people of no firm belief on evolution following the herd.

24 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:32:40am

Acceptance of evolution is the touchstone of an individual’s level of scientific knowledge.

Evolution is touched by so many different science disciplines, rejection of it is a rejection of the majority of work done by scientists over the last several hundred years.

25 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:32:59am

re: #8 Dark_Falcon

I think it’s also some people of no firm belief on evolution following the herd.

Dreamer.

26 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:33:26am

re: #21 nsmith25

Appreciate it. Watched/read from afar. Great Articles. Great Community.

Well, please don’t be a stranger. : )

27 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:34:01am

re: #24 b_sharp

“The truth of our faith becomes a matter of ridicule among the infidels if any Catholic, not gifted with the necessary scientific learning, presents as dogma what scientific scrutiny shows to be false.”
- Thomas Aquinas

28 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:34:32am

re: #21 nsmith25

Appreciate it. Watched/read from afar. Great Articles. Great Community.

Get! Off! My! Rock!

It’s mine!
All mine!

29 Belafon  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:35:26am

re: #24 b_sharp

And the flip side is that Charles Darwin was really the first modern scientist. He laid the groundwork for the scientific method. Part of the reason they try to discount the theory of Evolution is to discount the entire scientific process.

30 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:37:09am

Is it not possible to believe in evolution but also believe in forces/phenomena that are currently under or unexplained by science?

31 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:37:16am

re: #22 Kragar

That sound you hear is Evangelicals keening.

Israel Expected To Fund All Abortions For Women Aged 20-33

What if a woman is 34 or over?

32 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:37:38am

re: #31 Pie-onist Overlord

What if a woman is 34 or over?

Good question.

33 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:38:08am

Israel is PRO DEATH!!

34 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:38:37am

re: #32 Eclectic Cyborg

Good question.

What if she is under 20?

35 Charles Johnson  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:38:38am

The right wing media is constantly pushing creationism on the flock, too. I’m sure that has a big effect — Fox News frequently features the most ridiculous creationist shills as “experts.”

The right wing media is heavily invested in keeping the base stupid and angry.

36 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:39:10am

It’s possible that women under 20 and over 34 were already covered.

37 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:39:13am

re: #28 b_sharp

Get! Off! My! Rock!

It’s mine!
All mine!

Get out of here, Daffy, before I tell the Robertsons you’re around.

38 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:40:13am

re: #29 Belafon

And the flip side is that Charles Darwin was really the first modern scientist. He laid the groundwork for the scientific method. Part of the reason they try to discount the theory of Evolution is to discount the entire scientific process.

Actually, a lot of the groundwork for modern scientific practices were founded by priests and monks and the pursuit of science was seen as a way to better understand the Bible and God.

39 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:40:37am

re: #31 Pie-onist Overlord

What if a woman is 34 or over?

They’re working on that next apparently.

40 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:40:53am

re: #38 Kragar

Actually, a lot of the groundwork for modern scientific practices were founded by priests and monks and the pursuit of science was seen as a way to better understand the Bible and God.

This is the view I still hold today.

41 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:42:12am

re: #29 Belafon

And the flip side is that Charles Darwin was really the first modern scientist. He laid the groundwork for the scientific method. Part of the reason they try to discount the theory of Evolution is to discount the entire scientific process.

He was a meticulous scientist and postponed the release of his work because he wanted to make sure he got everything right including the identification of all the specimens he collected.

However, people like Isaac Newton formulated and practiced the general system of objective science before Darwin.

42 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:43:39am

re: #40 Eclectic Cyborg

This is the view I still hold today.

Apparently an omnipotent creator cannot create and shape a universe over billions of years using observable scientific phenomenon because ancient tribesmen from one geographic region 3000 years ago didn’t write it in a book.

43 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:44:41am

re: #30 Eclectic Cyborg

Is it not possible to believe in evolution but also believe in forces/phenomena that are currently under or unexplained by science?

It is.

Mind you, as we learn more about how the system is built, the harder it is to believe in some immeasurable force or power responsible for the system that can be described as a ‘god’.

44 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:45:29am

re: #43 b_sharp

It is.

Mind you, as we learn more about how the system is built, the harder it is to believe in some immeasurable force or power responsible for the system that can be described as a ‘god’.

Maybe we need a better description for God.

45 Belafon  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:46:23am

re: #38 Kragar

I was specifically talking about the scientific method, and I definitely don’t want to credit him more, or discredit others. Based on things I have read, his contribution was the idea of coming up with a hypothesis and then testing it against new data, in an attempt to remove selection bias. It’s kind of like Einstein’s Special Theory of Relativity, which was built on contributions - like Lorentz - with one critical insight.

46 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:46:37am

What, evangelicals aren’t “quiverful-ing” enough?

U.S. population growth slows

usatoday.com

“The Census Bureau projected the nation’s population as of News Year’s Day (Wednesday) as 317,297,938, an increase of 2,218,622, or 0.7%, from New Year’s Day 2013.”

Seems like enough people to me. : ) Of course, we can always admit more immigrants. Any time. But you cannot make people have babies if they’re not ready to, or don’t want to.

47 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:46:39am

re: #44 Kragar

Maybe we need a better description for God.

1. Doesn’t care who wins the ball game

48 Belafon  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:47:44am

re: #41 b_sharp

Granted. But there’s more than one reason they go after Darwin, not just because of the connection to monkeys.

49 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:47:59am

re: #47 jaunte

1. Doesn’t care who wins the ball game

2. Doesn’t tap a guy on the shoulder and tells them “Go tell everyone to do this.”

50 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:48:05am

re: #46 Justanotherhuman

What, evangelicals aren’t “quiverful-ing” enough?

U.S. population growth slows

usatoday.com

“The Census Bureau projected the nation’s population as of News Year’s Day (Wednesday) as 317,297,938, an increase of 2,218,622, or 0.7%, from New Year’s Day 2013.”

Seems like enough people to me. : ) Of course, we can always admit more immigrants. Any time. But you cannot make people have babies if they’re not ready to, or don’t want to.

Really, it’s immigration that’s keeping us above water right now. If ever the wingnuts got their wish and every immigrant and first-generation offspring were tossed out on their ear, the US would join much of the First World in declining populations.

51 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:48:12am

re: #38 Kragar

Actually, a lot of the groundwork for modern scientific practices were founded by priests and monks and the pursuit of science was seen as a way to better understand the Bible and God.

There was a recognition that intuition/common sense frequently gave the wrong answer so those priests and monks some 400 years ago started to develop techniques to remove the effects of subjectivity.

52 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:48:29am

re: #30 Eclectic Cyborg

Is it not possible to believe in evolution but also believe in forces/phenomena that are currently under or unexplained by science?

Sure. I believe so.

For further proof, keep up with Morgan Freemans science show. Fearlessly treads the grounds beyond proven science and well into where theory runs into issues of faith. Just watched a show yesterday where a great case was made for the universe itself to be alive, via natural selection. It’s a theory, unprovable for now. The idea is that black holes are the seed of other universes, that our universe is just one branch of a great tree of universes.

Through The Wormhole

53 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:48:55am

re: #49 Kragar

2. Doesn’t tap a guy on the shoulder and tells them “Go tell everyone to do this.”

3. Does not take sides in a war.

54 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:50:29am

re: #53 Targetpractice

3. Does not take sides in a war.

4. Doesn’t condemn people to burn for eternity

55 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:50:44am

re: #44 Kragar

Maybe we need a better description for God.

I think the problem comes when it is assumed a god has to be an intentional intelligent being rather than just a set of circumstances and processes following within a specific set of constraints.

56 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:51:41am

re: #55 b_sharp

I think the problem comes when it is assumed a god has to be an intentional intelligent being rather than just a set of circumstances and processes following within a specific set of constraints.

So you’re trying to tell me God doesn’t look like Zeus and sound like Morgan Freeman?

57 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:52:39am

It’s just so hard to ask the Planck length for a personal favor.

58 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:53:31am

re: #55 b_sharp

I think the only constraint we need to remove is that God might not fit in the bible. Like us he might be a product of natural selection. Does our universe have ancestors? (Still riffing on Morgan F.)

And we might fit your description.

59 allegro  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:53:39am

re: #54 Kragar

4. Doesn’t condemn people to burn for eternity

5. Doesn’t care who you love.

60 darthstar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:53:47am

re: #56 Kragar

So you’re trying to tell me God doesn’t look like Zeus and sound like Morgan Freeman?

Nope…he looks like Roseanne Barr and sounds like Bobcat Goldthwait.

61 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:54:43am

re: #48 Belafon

Granted. But there’s more than one reason they go after Darwin, not just because of the connection to monkeys.

Certainly.

Primarily because most of them are authoritarian in nature, used to basing the validity of everything in terms of a supreme authority and then assuming the supreme authority in the belief system most dangerous to theirs is Darwin.

62 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:55:11am

re: #55 b_sharp

I think the problem comes when it is assumed a god has to be an intentional intelligent being rather than just a set of circumstances and processes following within a specific set of constraints.

The problem, at least from my viewpoint, is that we’ve always tried to think of god or a pantheon of deities in human terms. As much as we may have advanced in our understanding of the universe, we still have a long way to go. And as insulting as it may be to some sensibilities, we humans tend to be very limited in what we can imagine when you think about it. We still have a hard time rationalizing the idea that aliens might resemble us as much as resemble cockroaches.

63 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:55:13am

re: #60 darthstar

Nope…he looks like Roseanne Barr and sounds like Bobcat Goldthwait.

That would actually explain quite a bit…

64 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:55:36am

I think part of the population decline is due to the economic conditions. People don’t think they can afford to have kids/more kids right now so they hold off.

65 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:55:56am

re: #56 Kragar

So you’re trying to tell me God doesn’t look like Zeus and sound like Morgan Freeman?

If God doesn’t sound like Morgan Freeman I will be greatly disappointed.

66 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:55:59am

Video of explosion in Volgograd railway made public

The video was shot by a surveillance camera from a distance, and is Safe For Work.

67 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:56:31am

Looks like Ben Shapiro is having a cow HURR HURR CROSS RACIAL ADOPTIONS HURR HURR!!!!!!

Tell me Ben are you OK with Black people adopting white babies? Cause it should work that way too.

68 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:56:57am

re: #64 Eclectic Cyborg

I think part of the population decline is due to the economic conditions. People don’t think they can afford to have kids/more kids right now so they hold off.

Very likely is the reason. Most of the first world is experiencing declining populations at the same time as they’re experiencing economic hardship. Shipping off all the jobs to industrializing nations, leaving the next generation with few options for providing for a family isn’t helping matters.

69 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:58:32am

re: #52 Political Atheist

Sure. I believe so.

For further proof, keep up with Morgan Freemans science show. Fearlessly treads the grounds beyond proven science and well into where theory runs into issues of faith. Just watched a show yesterday where a great case was made for the universe itself to be alive, via natural selection. It’s a theory, unprovable for now. The idea is that black holes are the seed of other universes, that our universe is just one branch of a great tree of universes.

Through The Wormhole

Perhaps the word ‘hypothesis’ would work there better than the word ‘theory’.

A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing. If enough evidence accumulates to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next step—known as a theory—in the scientific method and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon.

70 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:58:41am

re: #52 Political Atheist

Sure. I believe so.

For further proof, keep up with Morgan Freemans science show. Fearlessly treads the grounds beyond proven science and well into where theory runs into issues of faith. Just watched a show yesterday where a great case was made for the universe itself to be alive, via natural selection. It’s a theory, unprovable for now. The idea is that black holes are the seed of other universes, that our universe is just one branch of a great tree of universes.

Through The Wormhole

I’d argue that has nothing to do with the theist interpretation of faith. Those speculations are also not part of general science, nor are they theories. Those are some of the hypotheses thrown around that some theories eventually shake out from.

71 geoffm33  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:58:59am

re: #62 Targetpractice

The problem, at least from my viewpoint, is that we’ve always tried to think of god or a pantheon of deities in human terms. As much as we may have advanced in our understanding of the universe, we still have a long way to go. And as insulting as it may be to some sensibilities, we humans tend to be very limited in what we can imagine when you think about it. We still have a hard time rationalizing the idea that aliens might resemble us as much as resemble cockroaches.

People have a hard time rationalizing that 1 2 3 4 5 6 has the same chance as any other combination in the lottery.

72 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 11:59:07am

re: #42 Kragar

Apparently an omnipotent creator cannot create and shape a universe over billions of years using observable scientific phenomenon because ancient tribesmen from one geographic region 3000 years ago didn’t write it in a book.

Or they did - and that section was dropped because it did not serve the purposes of the current editors of “the book” at that time.

73 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:00:01pm

re: #43 b_sharp

It is.

Mind you, as we learn more about how the system is built, the harder it is to believe in some immeasurable force or power responsible for the system that can be described as a ‘god’.

But if she asks you if you are one, you say “yes”.
/

74 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:00:09pm

re: #69 wrenchwench

I stand corrected. There goes my A for today. :-)

75 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:00:23pm

re: #56 Kragar

So you’re trying to tell me God doesn’t look like Zeus and sound like Morgan Freeman?

No, I would never say that, because it is the truth on every Tuesday that falls on the Ides of March in years equally divisible by 11.

76 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:00:52pm

re: #72 Feline Fearless Leader

Or they did - and that section was dropped because it did not serve the purposes of the current editors of “the book” at that time.

Image: tumblr_m70bopECOh1rpoq9uo1_1280.png

77 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:01:18pm

re: #57 jaunte

It’s just so hard to ask the Planck length for a personal favor.

That Planck moment is over before you even think of the favour.

78 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:01:21pm

re: #44 Kragar

Maybe we need a better description for God.

79 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:01:57pm

re: #42 Kragar

Apparently an omnipotent creator cannot create and shape a universe over billions of years using observable scientific phenomenon because ancient tribesmen from one geographic region 3000 years ago didn’t write it in a book.

I’m stunned by the accuracy in said book. //

80 ObserverArt  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:02:46pm

re: #35 Charles Johnson

The right wing media is constantly pushing creationism on the flock, too. I’m sure that has a big effect — Fox News frequently features the most ridiculous creationist shills as “experts.”

The right wing media is heavily invested in keeping the base stupid and angry.

And in keeping with this thought and the context of this page/thread…evolution goes both ways.

Some evolve to survive and move on, others do not and go extinct.

The GOP by creating and keeping stupid people really is hastening its own and the stupid people’s demise. They will stay stuck to old conventions and the world will move on. As people move on they will have less and less to do with the stupid and that old thinking will die out with the last of those holding on to it.

81 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:02:55pm

re: #72 Feline Fearless Leader

Or they did - and that section was dropped because it did not serve the purposes of the current editors of “the book” at that time.

That’s one of those ones that amuses me greatly, the reality that the book people are so sure is the unquestionable word of God is effectively the local translation of a book that was translated from now dead local languages to a Latin (itself dead) and the composition determined by a committee that chose which religious texts it wished to include and which it chose to keep out for various political reasons mainly having to do with establishing the authority of the Church and the “one true faith.”

82 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:03:46pm

re: #70 b_sharp

Okay, the point I would emphasize is that the question of whether God exists is not limited to religions concepts. Either way, yes or no it’s a question of how nature works at the largest scale. Taking apart the logic in the bible is not an indication that he does not, it’s just showing the limitations of the men that wrote it. Religion like science can be right or wrong for reasons that turn out not to be so at some point.

83 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:03:49pm

Omnipotent god. Inventor of the universe from atom to human primates to solar systems. Can only communicate in local vernacular using antiquated local social norms of Middle Eastern tribesmen in fables and tall tales.

84 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:03:51pm

re: #60 darthstar

Nope…he looks like Roseanne Barr and sounds like Bobcat Goldthwait.

And his True Prophets are Sam Kinnison and Andy Kaufman.

85 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:04:19pm

It would be like hiring Werner Von Braun to build rockets and all he does it through writing short stories, poems, and essays.

86 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:04:57pm

re: #70 b_sharp

The expanding universe was once not a part of science.

87 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:05:04pm

re: #84 Feline Fearless Leader

And his True Prophets are Sam Kinnison and Andy Kaufman.

Bill Hicks died for our sins.

88 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:05:30pm

Here is how man was made! First, we’ll need a talking snake and an apple tree.

89 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:06:04pm

re: #87 Kragar

Bill Hicks died for our sins.

Where does George Carlin fit into the hierarchy?

90 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:06:15pm

My Ford My Ford why hast thou forsaken the Warranty on thy vehicle?

91 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:06:24pm

Help wanted. Neurosurgeon. Must have a PhD in comparative literature.

92 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:06:45pm

re: #88 Gus

Here is how man was made! First, we’ll need a talking snake and an apple tree.

“Sir, why does it have to be an apple tree? Why not a pear tree? Or maybe a fig tree?”

93 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:06:53pm

Pfft. I didn’t tell them Earth was round because it was a test! //

94 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:06:57pm

re: #83 Gus

Omnipotent god. Inventor of the universe from atom to human primates to solar systems. Can only communicate in local vernacular using antiquated local social norms of Middle Eastern tribesmen in fables and tall tales.

Well, the book said that he was known for taking on odd bets.
/

95 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:07:21pm

re: #89 Targetpractice

Where does George Carlin fit into the hierarchy?

Wherever the hell he wants.

96 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:08:33pm

re: #92 Targetpractice

“Sir, why does it have to be an apple tree? Why not a pear tree? Or maybe a fig tree?”

Genesis does not mention what kind of tree it was.

97 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:08:59pm

re: #62 Targetpractice

The problem, at least from my viewpoint, is that we’ve always tried to think of god or a pantheon of deities in human terms. As much as we may have advanced in our understanding of the universe, we still have a long way to go. And as insulting as it may be to some sensibilities, we humans tend to be very limited in what we can imagine when you think about it. We still have a hard time rationalizing the idea that aliens might resemble us as much as resemble cockroaches.

There are certain constraints the universe throws at us that can guide our assumptions about what aliens might look like. By definition we assume intelligence includes communication, tool use, knowledge preservation and transmission to following generations. We can safely assume life requires some form of self replication subject to selection.

Evolution isn’t an optimization, nor is intelligence the ultimate goal, so there will be a limited number of paths available to reach intelligence.

98 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:09:17pm

re: #96 Pie-onist Overlord

Genesis does not mention what kind of tree it was.

What, you mean decades of preachers and religious texts telling me it was an apple from the Tree of Knowledge were wrong?!

///

99 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:09:33pm

Given that I’m omnipotent. I will tell you the story of Noah based on completely unattainable goals with wanton human genocide and incest. Appeal to my authority!

//

100 ObserverArt  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:10:39pm

re: #37 Dark_Falcon

Get out of here, Daffy, before I tell the Robertsons you’re around.

Heh. I just had a flash of the old classic Bugs and Daffy arguing over what hunting season it is.

So…

Bugs: A&E fired Phil Robertson
Daffy: A&E did not fired Phil Robertson
Bugs: A&E fired Phil Robertson
Daffy: A&E did not fired Phil Robertson
Bugs: A&E fired Phil Robertson
Daffy: A&E did not fired Phil Robertson
Bugs: A&E did not fired Phil Robertson
Daffy (Loudly to be heard by everyone): A&E fired Phil Robertson!!!

And the good fundamentalist duck dynasty lovin’ hunters pop up from behind all the trees and bushes and blast the crap out of Daffy.

Daffy is rearranging his beak and is heard muttering…You’re dissssspicckkabllllee!

101 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:10:42pm

Here’s where it appears the Snowden/libertarian types are going with the NSA: Put the NSA on trial! Put Clapper and Hayden in jail!

More blah, blah, blah from Sirota.

“With potential perjury by top officials, and new questions about spying, let’s stop assuming everything is legal”

Hmm, Sirota, news flash: It is legal.

salon.com

102 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:10:43pm

re: #96 Pie-onist Overlord

Genesis does not mention what kind of tree it was.

Pine.

103 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:10:54pm

re: #98 Targetpractice

What, you mean decades of preachers and religious texts telling me it was an apple from the Tree of Knowledge were wrong?!

///

All I know is that Adam and Eve were white and had blonde hair. Eve was pretty hot and Adam was clean shaven. They both wore nice cotton robes. Eve shaved her legs and had nicely arched eyebrows.

//

104 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:11:03pm

re: #102 Kragar

Pine.

Bonsai.

105 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:11:13pm

re: #102 Kragar

Pine.

Pine. Apple. Pineapple. //

106 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:12:25pm

re: #105 Gus

Pine. Apple. Pineapple. //

And that is why he have Christmas trees.

107 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:12:34pm

re: #97 b_sharp

There are certain constraints the universe throws at us that can guide our assumptions about what aliens might look like. By definition we assume intelligence includes communication, tool use, knowledge preservation and transmission to following generations. We can safely assume life requires some form of self replication subject to selection.

Evolution isn’t an optimization, nor is intelligence the ultimate goal, so there will be a limited number of paths available to reach intelligence.

There are a lot of safe assumptions, it’s true. But the idea that there is an ideal path for evolution, that somehow humans are the norm rather than the exception, is nonetheless amusing. We are not the ideal, we’re just the ones who crossed the finish line first.

108 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:14:14pm

re: #103 Gus

All I know is that Adam and Eve were white and had blonde hair. Eve was pretty hot and Adam was clean shaven. They both wore nice cotton robes. Eve shaved her legs and had nicely arched eyebrows.

//

And despite all the begetting from an astronomically small gene pool, they managed to spawn entire races of people with no genetic defects whatsoever.

//

109 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:14:23pm

You’d think He would have made another Earth in the solar system. Just as a backup. //

110 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:15:10pm

re: #107 Targetpractice

There are a lot of safe assumptions, it’s true. But the idea that there is an ideal path for evolution, that somehow humans are the norm rather than the exception, is nonetheless amusing. We are not the ideal, we’re just the ones who crossed the finish line first.

“finish line”? Or happened to wander across a fuzzy line indicating that this planet’s evolutionary lifeform bush was going to experiment with large brains and self-aware sentience?

111 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:15:43pm

re: #108 Targetpractice

And despite all the begetting from an astronomically small gene pool, they managed to spawn entire races of people with no genetic defects whatsoever.

Just a few abbie normal brains.

112 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:16:31pm

Oh geez. A wingnut I know is linking to former SNL ditz Victoria Jackson’s incoherent howling about Obama is funding hardcore porn and how it’s all part of a Communist plot. The very same Commumist plot that Cleon Skousen warned everyone about 50 years ago.

No I won’t link it. Reading it once was bad enough.

113 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:18:09pm

re: #109 Gus

You’d think He would have made another Earth in the solar system. Just as a backup. //

Even if he did, can you imagine the extent of the regression testing libraries alone that would be required to work with a backup and/or implement an upgrade?
;)

Oh wait, God isn’t ISO-compliant, is he?

114 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:18:54pm

Bah, if I wanna believe in fictional white men who watch from upon high and take pleasure in the actions of humans, I’ll choose to believe in The Doctor. At least he admits that he never has a plan.

115 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:19:30pm

Think I’ll let 60 million people die of hunger. Teach them a lesson. I know I made them in my image and I’m omnipotent and stuff but they gotta learn how to do things right. I only made them and let them die this way but I’m still a caring omnipotent being that made atoms, the universe and stuff.

116 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:20:22pm

re: #114 Targetpractice

Bah, if I wanna believe in fictional white men who watch from upon high and take pleasure in the actions of humans, I’ll choose to believe in The Doctor. At least he admits that he never has a plan.

The holy trinity thirteen-ity?

117 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:20:27pm

Oops. My mistake. I better drown them. Have Noah build a big boat anyway and start all over again. //

118 makeitstop  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:20:38pm

re: #112 Lidane

Oh geez. A wingnut I know is linking to former SNL ditz Victoria Jackson’s incoherent howling about Obama is funding hardcore porn and how it’s all part of a Communist plot. The very same Commumist plot that Cleon Skousen warned everyone about 50 years ago.

No I won’t link it. Reading it once was bad enough.

LOLWUT

119 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:21:14pm

Wait! I have an idea. After making poison ivy and tooth aches think I’ll throw them a curve and invent cancer. Hey man. I made everything remember.

120 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:21:53pm

re: #82 Political Atheist

Okay, the point I would emphasize is that the question of whether God exists is not limited to religions concepts. Either way, yes or no it’s a question of how nature works at the largest scale. Taking apart the logic in the bible is not an indication that he does not, it’s just showing the limitations of the men that wrote it. Religion like science can be right or wrong for reasons that turn out not to be so at some point.

The existence of a god is a difficult problem because it isn’t amenable to scientific testing so it will always remain subjective. The idea of God however comes with certain characteristics like being a loving god that can be refuted by going back to the source of that characteristic and looking for a time when that characteristic did not occur. There is a lot of danger in taking the Bible, a single source for everything Christian, as a literal instance of God’s word.

What happens is that when we come across difficult questions to answer, like the idea black holes are infant universes, people tend to inject a god, or an intelligence with intent, to fill the gap. There is no more reason to fill that gap with an intelligence than there is to fill it with something more mundane. Or just to say we don’t know.

121 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:22:30pm

re: #116 erik_t

The holy trinity thirteen-ity?

He moves in mysterious ways.

122 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:22:31pm

re: #117 Gus

Oops. My mistake. I better drown them. Have Noah build a big boat anyway and start all over again. //

So Noah was a recovery disk saved while God wiped the hard drive?

(First Church of Christ Computer Programmer)

123 geoffm33  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:23:54pm

re: #115 Gus

Think I’ll let 60 million people die of hunger. Teach them a lesson. I know I made them in my image and I’m omnipotent and stuff but they gotta learn how to do things right. I only made them and let them die this way but I’m still a caring omnipotent being that made atoms, the universe and stuff twinkies.

There.

124 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:24:27pm

OK. Bacteria’s done. Should work for large and small scale infections. Let them figure out how to cure bacterial infections. Not my job man.

125 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:24:33pm

re: #86 Political Atheist

The expanding universe was once not a part of science.

That is true, but your comment suggests that because one hypothesis becomes part of a theory all hypotheses will become part of theories.

Many ‘out there’ hypotheses have become part of general science, tectonic plates being one of them, but many more have not.

126 Bulworth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:25:13pm

re: #112 Lidane

What about BenGHAZzi?!??11??

127 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:25:43pm

re: #96 Pie-onist Overlord

Genesis does not mention what kind of tree it was.

And it couldn’t have been a fig tree because they were covering their naughty bits with fig leaves.

128 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:25:48pm

Tea Party is another one of my latest inventions. //

129 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:26:24pm

re: #124 Gus

OK. Bacteria’s done. Should work for large and small scale infections. Let them figure out how to cure bacterial infections. Not my job man.

Hmm, bacteria are pretty simplistic, but adaptable. Now malaria - there’s a masterpiece design.

130 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:27:32pm

re: #108 Targetpractice

And despite all the begetting from an astronomically small gene pool, they managed to spawn entire races of people with no genetic defects whatsoever.

//

No genetic defects? Have you seen the size of my head?

131 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:28:09pm

re: #130 b_sharp

No genetic defects? Have you seen the size of my head?

It’s all part of the plan!

//

132 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:28:17pm

re: #129 Feline Fearless Leader

Hmm, bacteria are pretty simplistic, but adaptable. Now malaria - there’s a masterpiece design.

Anything with massive abdominal swelling, bulging eyes, and internal bleeding is a true sign of omnipotent design. Worship me! If not that’s cool I’ll just send you to hell after you die.

133 RealityBasedSteve  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:28:29pm

re: #103 Gus

All I know is that Adam and Eve were white and had blonde hair. Eve was pretty hot and Adam was clean shaven. They both wore nice cotton robes. Eve shaved her legs and had nicely arched eyebrows.

//

Ah… but did they have belly buttons? That’s the question.

I’ve seen a number of conservative / religious sites that maintain a person can’t be a conservative without believing in the literal creation story. Their argument, not surprisingly, is simple.

1. The Bible is the inerrant word of God.
2. We get our Rights and Morality from God.
3. If we deny 1 part of the Bible (Genesis creation), then what’s to keep us from denying any part we don’t like
4. QED. To be a conservative is to believe in a YEC

Yea. it’s a lot like the underwear gnomes.

RBS

134 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:28:37pm

re: #113 Feline Fearless Leader

Even if he did, can you imagine the extent of the regression testing libraries alone that would be required to work with a backup and/or implement an upgrade?
;)

Oh wait, God isn’t ISO-compliant, is he?

Subversion.

135 ObserverArt  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:29:30pm

re: #117 Gus

Oops. My mistake. I better drown them. Have Noah build a big boat anyway and start all over again. //

My Noah story…climate change version #1.

Yes, as many expect, we do things over and over as we never learn.

Scenario…Noah keeps feeling it getting warmer and warmer in his neck of the woods and can’t remember it being like that. And the rain and storms keep getting heavier and more extreme. (This is god sending him a message!)

So Noah wonders if he should start building a big old house boat and runs about gathering his animals and goods he will need to survive as the rivers and lakes rise and rise. The flood comes and Noah is damn glad he was watching things and taking in all those messages!

/ A little…but it would make a hell of a story to put the religious zealots in a mental meltdown.

136 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:30:01pm

re: #129 Feline Fearless Leader

Hmm, bacteria are pretty simplistic, but adaptable. Now malaria - there’s a masterpiece design.

More bacteria around than any other organism.

137 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:30:34pm

re: #89 Targetpractice

Where does George Carlin fit into the hierarchy?

I believe he comes from the Tree of Tonight Show.

Contemporary branches include the Tree of Brooks, which itself is part of Tree of Your Show of Shows.

138 Charles Johnson  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:31:05pm

Randy Newman - God’s Song

Youtube Video

139 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:31:11pm
140 GlutenFreeJesus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:31:22pm

I’ll repeat this meme. (Sorry if it’s already been posted in here. I’m mobile and too lazy to read everything.)

The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree… yeah, makes perfect sense.

141 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:31:29pm

re: #136 b_sharp

More bacteria around than any other organism.

And I made it so it all still evolves! Ha! Oops. Don’t tell anyone I said that.

142 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:31:40pm

re: #133 RealityBasedSteve

Ah… but did they have belly buttons? That’s the question.

I’ve seen a number of conservative / religious sites that maintain a person can’t be a conservative without believing in the literal creation story. Their argument, not surprisingly, is simple.

1. The Bible is the inerrant word of God.
2. We get our Rights and Morality from God.
3. If we deny 1 part of the Bible (Genesis creation), then what’s to keep us from denying any part we don’t like
4. QED. To be a conservative is to believe in a YEC

Yea. it’s a lot like the underwear gnomes.

RBS

I don’t find it that surprising. When you look closely you quickly see that their authority stems solely from them being the sole translators of what GOD is actually saying via the texts. Anything challenging the absolute and unchallengeable authority of their book is a direct challenge to their chosen translation as well.

143 GlutenFreeJesus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:33:02pm

re: #136 b_sharp

More bacteria around than any other organism.

The GOP is catching up with stupiditeria.

144 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:33:11pm

re: #120 b_sharp

The mans point was that natural selection might make it so. Meaning the universe itself as a thinking entity, not an entity that chose to do Adam and Eve or Earth in particular at all. So maybe set aside the tern God and hypothesise it’s that bigger older neighbor. The ultimate alien so to speak.

145 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:33:42pm

re: #138 Charles Johnson

Randy Newman - God’s Song

[Embedded content]

XTC - Dear God

Youtube Video

146 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:34:29pm

re: #141 Gus

And I made it so it all still evolves! Ha! Oops. Don’t tell anyone I said that.

It not only evolves, it’s opportunistic and is part of every animal’s cells. God used bacteria to build more complex organisms.

147 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:35:57pm

re: #144 Political Atheist

The mans point was that natural selection might make it so. Meaning the universe itself as a thinking entity, not an entity that chose to do Adam and Eve or Earth in particular at all. So maybe set aside the tern God and hypothesise it’s that bigger older neighbor. The ultimate alien so to speak.

Does it reach a point between deism, agnosticism, much less atheism where this becomes a distinction without a difference? A “thinking universe” sounds like something unlikely to notice us, unlikely to care, and working at a level that our intellects could not meaningfully communicate with.

148 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:36:29pm

re: #119 Gus

And I’ll make an tree bark a cure for a wide range of ailments (asprin).

And a different plant will cause more harm and misery than any other known to man (coca plant)

And a different mold would be turned into one of the most powerful drugs (penicillin).

Still different mold can kill (black molds)

And we’ll use a toxin so deadly that people are warned about its presence in food on a regular basis as a plastic surgery technique (botox).

149 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:36:56pm

Cheese!

150 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:37:49pm

re: #148 lawhawk

And I’ll make an tree bark a cure for a wide range of ailments (asprin).

And a different plant will cause more harm and misery than any other known to man (coca plant)

And a different mold would be turned into one of the most powerful drugs (penicillin).

Still different mold can kill (black molds)

And we’ll use a toxin so deadly that people are warned about its presence in food on a regular basis as a plastic surgery technique (botox).

No. Unless I can make a jet-pack from tree bark I’m not buyin’ it. //

151 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:38:39pm

re: #149 Gus

Cheese!

Cow and bug working as one.

And then we can talk about harvesting and eating the fruiting bodies of various fungus. Just make sure you select the right ones!

152 Timothy Watson  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:39:23pm

re: #83 Gus
For some reason, the first thing that popped into my mind after reading your comment was the following quote from the reimagined Battlestar Galactica series:

I don’t want to be human! I want to see gamma rays! I want to hear X-rays! And I - I want to - I want to smell dark matter! Do you see the absurdity of what I am? I can’t even express these things properly because I have - I have to conceptualize complex ideas in this stupid limiting spoken language! But I know I want to reach out with something other than these prehensile paws; and feel the solar wind of a supernova flowing over me. I’m a machine, and I can know much more. I can experience so much more. But I’m trapped in this absurd body. And why?! Because my five creators thought that “God” wanted it that way.

153 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:39:28pm

More religious music from XTC

Youtube Video

154 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:40:17pm

re: #30 Eclectic Cyborg

Is it not possible to believe in evolution but also believe in forces/phenomena that are currently under or unexplained by science?

multi-tasking iz teh hardest for some people…

155 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:40:31pm

re: #147 Feline Fearless Leader

Does it reach a point between deism, agnosticism, much less atheism where this becomes a distinction without a difference? A “thinking universe” sounds like something unlikely to notice us, unlikely to care, and working at a level that our intellects could not meaningfully communicate with.

Phrased alternately, it’s a “scientific” “theory” that explains no data, makes no predictions, and is not testable.

It’s philosophy, at best.

156 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:40:39pm

re: #150 Gus

Tree bark, which includes cellulose, can be converted to fuel. Wood, like balsa could be made into a lightweight frame, and glues can be synthesized, and create the fuels necessary to make a jet pack. /

157 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:40:50pm

re: #144 Political Atheist

The mans point was that natural selection might make it so. Meaning the universe itself as a thinking entity, not an entity that chose to do Adam and Eve or Earth in particular at all. So maybe set aside the tern God and hypothesise it’s that bigger older neighbor. The ultimate alien so to speak.

Natural selection, because it’s based on specific constraints with some consistency, could very well have developed a thinking universe, as long as each universe inherited, with minor differences, characteristics from its parent universe and there was some pressure to become intelligent.

It is an interesting question.

158 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:41:17pm

OK, I’m not the sharpest knife in the drawer and I don’t have a lot of education. But I haven’t bought into the “god” business in an awful long time.

Yet, I will take evolution over the bible or any religious explanation of our existence any day. It’s because I know we as the human race are getting smarter, if we want to be, we are building on our knowledge, and that there are plenty of folks smarter than me. I may not be able to recite the Periodic Table of Elements because I never studied it, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist because others have said it does and keep publishing it.

If you want to call it “faith”, that’s fine. But it’s faith in other humans and being wiling to give them credit for understanding what I don’t always understand. I know I can depend to a great extent on those humans who know more, have different training and occupations, who come from different backgrounds.

In elevating others who can teach us something, aren’t we also elevating ourselves at the same time by absorbing that knowledge, too?

I’ve noticed a disturbing trend of distrust that doesn’t give many people the credit they deserve for having studied, experienced, and practiced many things over their lifetimes, people who have withstood the vetting and examination of peers and the public and yet too many people still put their “faith” into ignorance because of differences in social and political positions.

Society needs a huge corrective for this if we’re to survive.

159 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:41:52pm

re: #149 Gus

Just as long as it’s Wensleydale! /Wallace

160 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:41:57pm

re: #147 Feline Fearless Leader

I might not explain it well, just watched the show yesterday, and only once. His take was from biology and complex systems. Not religion at all. As I recall your question was left for the viewer to ponder. The inherent capacity of a thinking universe would have only natural constraints like physics. That leaves a lot open. Might spend all his time chatting with his pals that are those other universes for all I could say.

161 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:42:23pm

An alien race of gigantic beings could land on Earth tomorrow and consume all the humans to extinction. Theoretical god would just sit back and watch. It’s just like that loose tire from a tractor trailer that might kill you on your way to Sunday school.

162 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:42:51pm

re: #156 lawhawk

Tree bark, which includes cellulose, can be converted to fuel. Wood, like balsa could be made into a lightweight frame, and glues can be synthesized, and create the fuels necessary to make a jet pack. /

We can call it a BarkaLauncher.

163 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:43:09pm

re: #34 Pie-onist Overlord

What if she is under 20?

The article explains a bit more.

ETA: clickbait headline are the suckiest.

164 William of Orange  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:43:43pm

Who says superstars have no feelings?

Beyonce recently fulfilled the wish of a 12-year-old girl suffering from terminal cancer by singing to and dancing with her at one of her concerts.


With the help of the Make-A-Wish Foundation, Taylon attended a Beyonce show in Las Vegas earlier this month. As seen in a video posted on Beyonce’s official YouTube page on Christmas Eve, the girl, who sat in a wheelchair, was then moved to tears when the singer stepped down from the stage and hugged her, saying, “Nice to meet you.”

She then returned and began singing “Love On Top,” allowing Taylon to sing along into her microphone. The girl was later seen standing up and dancing as Beyonce sang her old group Destiny’s Child’s hit “Survivor.”

“They found an inoperable tumor on her brain and her dying wish was to dance with Beyonce,” Ivy McGregor of Philanthropy Program Partnerships says in the video (watch it below).

“Meet Taylon, she has been fighting cancer since being diagnosed 12 months ago,” McGregor had said on her Instagram page on Dec. 7. “Taylon has endured medicines, chemotherapy, radiation and multiple surgeries including a full leg amputate and STILL maintains an A average scholastically. Well due to a new recent finding of cancer on her brain which is inoperable - she was placed on hospice and given two weeks to live.”

McGregor said she has “not met one so young and as strong, positive and courageous, as this beautiful 12-year-old young lady.”

There’s a video in this link.

Bless you Beyonce.

165 Killgore Trout  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:44:19pm

Russia suicide bombing: Is Doku Umarov the Kremlin’s worst nightmare?

Two suicide bombings in a Russian city are stoking fear about the Sochi Winter Olympics. The most likely mastermind is a Chechen field commander who wants to humiliate Vladimir Putin and the Kremlin.

166 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:44:42pm

re: #158 Justanotherhuman

OK, I’m not the sharpest knife in the drawer and I don’t have a lot of education. But I haven’t bought into the “god” business in an awful long time.

Yet, I will take evolution over the bible or any religious explanation of our existence any day. It’s because I know we as the human race are getting smarter, if we want to be, we are building on our knowledge, and that there are plenty of folks smarter than me. I may not be able to recite the Periodic Table of Elements because I never studied it, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist because others have said it does and keep publishing it.


If you want to call it “faith”, that’s fine. But it’s faith in other humans and being wiling to give them credit for understanding what I don’t always understand. I know I can depend to a great extent on those humans who know more, have different training and occupations, who come from different backgrounds.

In elevating others who can teach us something, aren’t we also elevating ourselves at the same time by absorbing that knowledge, too?

I’ve noticed a disturbing trend of distrust that doesn’t give many people the credit they deserve for having studied, experienced, and practiced many things over their lifetimes, people who have withstood the vetting and examination of peers and the public and yet too many people still put their “faith” into ignorance because of differences in social and political positions.

Society needs a huge corrective for this if we’re to survive.

Perhaps an intellectual ExLax.

167 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:46:29pm

re: #144 Political Atheist

The mans point was that natural selection might make it so. Meaning the universe itself as a thinking entity, not an entity that chose to do Adam and Eve or Earth in particular at all. So maybe set aside the tern God and hypothesise it’s that bigger older neighbor. The ultimate alien so to speak.

That’s not science.

I looked at the vid of the producers talking about their show. They ‘go beyond science’ and get scientists to speculate about stuff. They aren’t ‘doing science’. They are doing entertainment.

168 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:47:13pm
169 ericblair  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:48:16pm

re: #147 Feline Fearless Leader

A “thinking universe” sounds like something unlikely to notice us, unlikely to care, and working at a level that our intellects could not meaningfully communicate with.

Sounds like Spinoza’s God. No heaven, or hell, life everlasting, moral code, or heavenly intervention. Pray all you want, God doesn’t give a shit. I don’t think that church would do very well with the churchgoing population, but of course the upside is is that God won’t notice or give a crap anyways.

170 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:48:20pm

re: #168 Lidane

[Embedded content]

“sharing is for losers”—could be libertarianism explained in 4 words…

171 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:48:23pm

re: #167 wrenchwench

That’s not science.

I looked at the vid of the producers talking about their show. They ‘go beyond science’ and get scientists to speculate about stuff. They aren’t ‘doing science’. They are doing entertainment.

And there’s nothing wrong with that, per se. Unless one actually calls it science, in which case one is doing a disservice to science and to the public by confusing them about what science is and what science most definitely is not.

172 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:49:29pm

re: #171 erik_t

And there’s nothing wrong with that, per se. Unless one actually calls it science, in which case one is doing a disservice to science and to the public by confusing them about what science is and what science most definitely is not.

Speculation isn’t science but it can be religion.

173 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:50:55pm

re: #171 erik_t

And there’s nothing wrong with that, per se. Unless one actually calls it science, in which case one is doing a disservice to science and to the public by confusing them about what science is and what science most definitely is not.

Exactly.

It’s good to be very clear about what is and what is not science. Science has a hard enough time staying funded and getting done without having to fend off critics who don’t know what science really is.

174 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:50:59pm

re: #172 Justanotherhuman

Speculation isn’t science but it can be religion.

Speculation is a fun mind game to play but you have to recognize it as idle fantasy not idol fantasy.

175 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:51:03pm

re: #170 Justanotherhuman

176 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:52:20pm
177 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:52:57pm

re: #175 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Thanks for that! From a non-twitterer. Er. : )

178 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:53:09pm

re: #175 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Except many would spell that loosers not losers.

179 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:53:12pm
180 geoffm33  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:54:06pm
181 Charles Johnson  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:54:33pm

re: #179 wrenchwench

This one got a lot of retweets:

182 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:55:06pm

re: #52 Political Atheist

Sure. I believe so.

For further proof, keep up with Morgan Freemans science show. Fearlessly treads the grounds beyond proven science and well into where theory runs into issues of faith. Just watched a show yesterday where a great case was made for the universe itself to be alive, via natural selection. It’s a theory, unprovable for now. The idea is that black holes are the seed of other universes, that our universe is just one branch of a great tree of universes.

Through The Wormhole

small quibble, but should the part I bolded be referred to as “hypothesis” not “theory”?
BTW, I also enjoy “Through The Wormhole” very much.

ETA: oops, I see WW got this before my comment.

183 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:55:10pm

re: #178 b_sharp

Youtube Video

184 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:55:37pm

re: #174 b_sharp

Speculation is a fun mind game to play but you have to recognize it as idle fantasy not idol fantasy.

Though speculation and thought experiments can serve as conceptual background leading to an actual hypothesis and ideas for how to design experiments that can lead the hypothesis towards becoming a theory or otherwise working model.

Most of what is being discussed here is beyond that sort of use though.

185 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:56:22pm

re: #182 Backwoods_Sleuth

small quibble, but should the part I bolded be referred to as “hypothesis” not “theory”?
BTW, I also enjoy “Through The Wormhole” very much.

Third quibble on a comment—you owe us lunch!

I just made that rule up. Could you tell?

186 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:56:56pm

re: #182 Backwoods_Sleuth

small quibble, but should the part I bolded be referred to as “hypothesis” not “theory”?
BTW, I also enjoy “Through The Wormhole” very much.

It’s not testable. It’s not even a hypothesis.

It’s an idea, or a musing.

187 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:57:08pm
188 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:58:14pm

re: #187 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

Mine would have been. “Got Mine. F**k you.” Essentially the same concept.

189 Killgore Trout  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:59:09pm

This is interesting….
Iranian billionaire Babak Zanjani ‘arrested’
it seems likely this is connected to the scandals in Turkey. Reading between the lines it seems it wasn’t so much the sanctions that got him in trouble. he was skimming off the top…

Mr Zanjani has acknowledged that since 2010 he has used a web of more than 60 companies based in the UAE, Turkey and Malaysia to sell millions of barrels of Iranian oil on behalf of the government, generating $17.5bn of desperately needed revenue.

After being accused of withholding money earlier this year, Mr Zanjani said that he had already transferred $700m, but that the international sanctions were preventing him from handing over the remaining $1.2bn.

“I will pay it back if they give me an account number tomorrow that accepts up to 1bn euros,” he was quoted as saying in an interview with an Iranian magazine. “How can I transfer the money when the oil ministry and the central bank are under sanctions? We also are not able to transfer the money, but the money is in the account.”

Last week, the Central Bank of Iran said Mr Zanjani had not transferred the outstanding amount.

190 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 12:59:49pm

re: #96 Pie-onist Overlord

Genesis does not mention what kind of tree it was.

It was probably a larch, if Monty Python has anything to say about it…

191 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:00:23pm

re: #181 Charles Johnson

Young dolphins deliberately chew puffer fish to get high with each other

Scientists found that dolphins apparently had learned just how much of the toxin would safely intoxicate them, and they carefully chewed the fish and then passed it among themselves.

The dolphins then entered what appeared to be a trancelike state.

192 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:01:06pm

re: #167 wrenchwench

I think you discount the science behind the mans ideas. This was presented not as fact, but as a possibility based on certain hints that science, not religion, not entertainment has certainly uncovered and proven. Nothing was misrepresented. You might find the show itself to be a better indicator. That would include the interviews with the science people.

In any case the idea serves well to show us that the chance of a far larger more powerful entity in the universe existing should not be limited to or by religion, it’s texts or spokespeople. Pointing out the flaws in a work of man to judge the likelihood of the existence of god is severely misplaced.

193 Charles Johnson  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:01:25pm

re: #191 jaunte

Young dolphins deliberately chew puffer fish to get high with each other

Dolphins are the libertarians of the sea.

194 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:01:48pm

Arachnophobes, avert your eyes…..

195 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:02:03pm

re: #121 Targetpractice

He moves in mysterious ways.

Explains what he was doing all that time before 6,000 years ago…

196 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:02:26pm
“After chewing the puffer gently and passing it round, they began acting most peculiarly, hanging around with their noses at the surface as if fascinated by their own reflection.”
197 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:03:14pm

re: #167 wrenchwench

That’s not science.

I looked at the vid of the producers talking about their show. They ‘go beyond science’ and get scientists to speculate about stuff. They aren’t ‘doing science’. They are doing entertainment.

Why not, if natural selection is the hypothetical mechanism? Extrapolation is a part of science. And grist for educational entertainment.

198 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:04:22pm

Speaking of God.

199 Charles Johnson  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:05:06pm

re: #194 wrenchwench

This is why you should never poke things that look like a big pile of spiders.

200 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:05:33pm

Oh crap gotta run. I go because my god said so.

..
..

..

Okay actually that was the wife.

201 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:05:46pm

re: #175 lawhawk

202 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:06:30pm

re: #193 Charles Johnson

Dolphins are the libertarians of the sea.

Nah…Dolphins are smart.

203 dog philosopher  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:06:48pm

More And More Republicans Refusing To Evolve

looking into legislation to repeal the enlightenment but keep industrial revolution

“Two Legs Good - Four Eyes Bad!”

204 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:07:13pm

I’m an atheist but grew up sort of Catholic. I admit, I’m biased. I never liked American church “leaders.”

205 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:07:40pm

re: #199 Charles Johnson

This is why you should never poke things that look like a big pile of spiders.

Or try to jump over a wasps’ nest.

I still wish we had a camera for that one.

206 dog philosopher  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:07:55pm

re: #202 Eclectic Cyborg

Nah…Dolphins are smart.

so they’re the librarians of the sea

207 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:08:07pm

re: #194 wrenchwench

Arachnophobes, avert your eyes…..

[Embedded content]

Arachnophobes should be fine! Those are technically harvestmen.

(♫The more you knowwwwww…..♫)

208 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:08:27pm

Never liked Billy Graham. His son Franklin is an asshole.

209 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:08:31pm

re: #192 Political Atheist

I think you discount the science behind the mans ideas. This was presented as fact, but as a possibility based on certain hints that science, not religion, not entertainment has certainly uncovered and proven. Nothing was misrepresented. You might find the show itself to be a better indicator. That would include the interviews with the science people.

In any case the idea serves well to show us that the chance of a far larger more powerful entity in the universe existing should not be limited to or by religion, it’s texts or spokespeople. Pointing out the flaws in a work of man to judge the likelihood of the existence of god is severely misplaced.

I don’t ‘discount the science behind the mans ideas’, I discount that the discussion of a thinking universe IS science. It is not.

Here’s the description of one episode:

When Does Life Begin?: June 5 at 10PM

We can all trace our lives back to a beginning. But what defines the beginning? Is it the moment when two cells unite? Or does something have to know it is alive before its life can begin? It is a debate scientists and religious leaders have been battling over for centuries, but with the birth of new technology, scientists have been able to probe the question deeper and deeper. There is groundbreaking evidence showing that inside all of us are traces of cells from our relatives, blurring the lines between the beginning of one life and the end of another. Some scientists believe life doesn’t truly begin until we are conscious. But when does consciousness begin? One child psychologist’s experiments suggest true consciousness may not begin until the age of five once children become aware of how the world perceives them. Does life begin after we are able to walk and talk? The argument extends beyond human life. Technology is giving birth to new life forms made of nonliving things. One computational neuroscientist is building brains for robots. Can a machine become alive if it can think, feel, and move on its own? Perhaps the only way to know when life begins is by going back to the beginning of life on earth 4 billion years ago. How did non-living chemicals first become alive? And could Earth still give birth to a new life-form: one comprised of all of humanity in a globally connected network.

Just because there are scientific facts and ideas in the discussion does not make the discussion ‘science’, nor is the topic necessarily ‘science’.

I think you discount the science behind the mans ideas

What man? Are you saying the ideas are those of Morgan Freeman?

210 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:09:46pm

re: #208 Gus

Graham Chapman was the real prophet.

211 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:10:22pm

re: #207 erik_t

Arachnophobes should be fine! Those are technically harvestmen.

(♫The more you knowwwwww…..♫)

From your link:

Class: Arachnida

:P

212 RealityBasedSteve  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:10:28pm

re: #176 Gus

[Embedded content]

I went and read the original document (linked from RWW). It’s a masterpiece of delusion. I think it can be pretty well summed up with a couple of very short extracts.

1. Assumptions: Millions of Americans will participate.

Yea, that worked out so well last time.

2. Phase 1 - Field millions, as many as ten million, patriots who will assemble in a non-violent, physically unarmed (Spiritually/Constitutionally armed), display of unswerving loyalty to the US Constitution…

3. There is not much time and the only planning necessary is to select a starting date, which we have done, and then show up in Washington, D.C. on that date, and plan to stay for the duration.

Ok, lets play your “let’s pretend” game for minute, even scale it back a bit. No planning needed? Lets say 100,000 people show up. You’re a retired COL in the US Army. (oh, he posted his full name, address, email and phone number on the operations order). 100,000 is appx 5 Army divisions, or just under 2 Corps. I know that you are more than familar with Logistics, and I suspect that even in your most optimistic view of the self-relient nature of the patriots that show up, don’t you think that food / water / porta-potties might be a good idea? Scale that up by a factor of 10 or more (which is still under what you seem to be projecting) and tell us how that would work.

“Amateurs talk about tactics, but professionals study logistics.”

- Gen. Robert H. Barrow, USMC (Commandant of the Marine Corps) noted in 1980

RBS

213 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:11:27pm

Freemarket Jesus is angry.

214 Stanley Sea  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:11:33pm
215 dog philosopher  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:11:43pm

re: #204 Gus

I’m an atheist but grew up sort of Catholic. I admit, I’m biased. I never liked American church “leaders.”

i thought there was no such thing as ‘slightly catholic’

216 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:12:12pm

re: #215 dog philosopher

i thought there was no such thing as ‘slightly catholic’

Cultural Catholics. ;D

217 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:12:13pm

Seriously?

218 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:12:49pm

re: #217 Kragar

And we pay for this idiot troll.

219 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:13:06pm

New rules. Secular Roman Catholics that think hillbilly American religious leaders are weird and annoying.

220 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:13:28pm

re: #196 jaunte

A skeptical response:


The skepticism relies too heavily on the inherent danger of chewing on a puffer fish, but there is no evidence the dolphins are aware of that danger….

221 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:13:31pm

White bread and cheese product.

222 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:13:34pm

re: #217 Kragar

There should be some kind of penalty for conduct like that.

223 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:14:10pm

re: #207 erik_t

Arachnophobes should be fine! Those are technically harvestmen.

(♫The more you knowwwwww…..♫)

We call them daddy long legs. As an arachnophobe, they’ve never bothered me.

224 Amory Blaine  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:14:24pm

Bitter clingers.

225 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:14:33pm

re: #222 Eclectic Cyborg

There should be some kind of penalty for conduct like that.

There is. A rusty gun.

226 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:14:57pm

re: #220 wrenchwench

A skeptical response:

[Embedded content]


The skepticism relies too heavily on the inherent danger of chewing on a puffer fish, but there is no evidence the dolphins are aware of that danger….

“Puffer fish are poisonous!”
“Fuck you, I’m a Dolphin!”

227 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:15:12pm

re: #160 Political Atheist

I might not explain it well, just watched the show yesterday, and only once. His take was from biology and complex systems. Not religion at all. As I recall your question was left for the viewer to ponder. The inherent capacity of a thinking universe would have only natural constraints like physics. That leaves a lot open. Might spend all his time chatting with his pals that are those other universes for all I could say.

I’m going to jump ion the middle of this and say that even as someone who considers herself a believer in God, I have to say that I don’t feel like I have the slightest clue who/what God is. When expressed, this usually leads to much annoyance from fellow believers, be they Muslim or something else.

We humans don’t even fully understand our own brains, yet many of us are comfortable saying, “Well, my holy book describes God as [insert whatever], so that’s the definitive answer,” and expecting people to accept it? Or categorically denying the existence of God and expecting people to accept it?

Before anyone gets all twitchy, please note that I did NOT include those who say, “Based on the lack of scientific evidence proving the existence of a God or gods, I find it highly unlikely that said God/s exist, so I’m going to proceed on the assumption that there is no such entity/power.” That’s completely different than the first two assertions above, both of which strike me as exceedingly arrogant and remind me of the blind men and the elephant story.

Nothing is comprehensible except by virtue of its edges.
—Hindu Proverb

228 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:15:19pm

re: #224 Amory Blaine

Bitter clingers.

Murican bigots.

229 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:15:53pm

re: #212 RealityBasedSteve

I know that you are more than familar with Logistics, and I suspect that even in your most optimistic view of the self-relient nature of the patriots that show up, don’t you think that food / water / porta-potties might be a good idea?

Don’t forget the charging stations for all the scooters.

230 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:17:29pm

re: #209 wrenchwench

I don’t ‘discount the science behind the mans ideas’, I discount that the discussion of a thinking universe IS science. It is not.

Here’s the description of one episode:

Just because there are scientific facts and ideas in the discussion does not make the discussion ‘science’, nor is the topic necessarily ‘science’.

What man? Are you saying the ideas are those of Morgan Freeman?

That isn’t what he meant. The ‘the man’ referenced was the person speculating about an intelligent universe.

231 RealityBasedSteve  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:17:35pm

re: #229 Lidane

Don’t forget the charging stations for all the scooters.

Watch out for the 135th Scooterized Division, the Rolling AARPS!

RBS

232 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:17:48pm

re: #194 wrenchwench

Arrrrrgh! I hate you for that!! //

233 Dave In Austin  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:17:48pm
234 Mattand  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:17:50pm

re: #212 RealityBasedSteve

I went and read the original document (linked from RWW). It’s a masterpiece of delusion. I think it can be pretty well summed up with a couple of very short extracts.

2. >Phase 1 - Field millions, as many as ten million, patriots who will assemble in a non-violent, physically unarmed (Spiritually/Constitutionally armed), display of unswerving loyalty to the US Constitution…

LOL, the type of people who want the country run by Cruz and West can’t show up at a baby’s baptism without packing heat.

235 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:18:04pm
236 Mattand  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:18:08pm

re: #229 Lidane

Don’t forget the charging stations for all the scooters.

You rascal, you.

237 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:18:10pm

Pope Francis is non-partisan.

Franklin Graham is a Republican.

238 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:18:20pm

re: #218 jaunte

And we pay for this idiot troll.

We’re paying for Stockman (and the rest of the TP-GOP) alright.

239 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:18:38pm

White bread and cheese product.

240 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:18:54pm

re: #230 b_sharp

That isn’t what he meant. The ‘the man’ referenced was the person speculating about an intelligent universe.

Who was he?

241 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:19:10pm
242 Mattand  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:20:10pm
243 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:20:12pm

#libertarianismin4words Glenn Greenwald is God

244 piratedan  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:20:38pm

re: #235 Lidane

i was thinking….perhaps….

“political wankery for novices”

245 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:20:51pm

re: #217 Kragar

Seriously?

[Embedded content]

He using it to lube an AK, because FREEDOM

246 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:21:14pm

re: #114 Targetpractice

Bah, if I wanna believe in fictional white men who watch from upon high and take pleasure in the actions of humans, I’ll choose to believe in The Doctor. At least he admits that he never has a plan.

“We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese.”

247 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:22:18pm

Pope Francis is arroz con pollo and a nice white wine as Franklin Graham is white bread and cheese product.

248 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:22:22pm
249 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:22:43pm

Processed.

250 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:24:15pm

re: #232 CuriousLurker

Arrrrrgh! I hate you for that!! //

We’ve known for quite a while that WW is evil.

251 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:25:15pm

re: #249 Gus

Processed Cheese Melt Food
(Does Not Melt)

252 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:26:00pm

re: #240 wrenchwench

Who was he?

I don’t know, I didn’t see the show.

I was more interested in discussing the idea and PA’s understanding of it than wondering who came up with the idea.

253 dog philosopher  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:26:54pm

re: #247 Gus

Pope Francis is arroz con pollo and a nice white wine as Franklin Graham is white bread and cheese product.

con platanos maduros

254 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:27:04pm

re: #214 Stanley Sea

[Embedded content]

Fuck the number 5!

255 Mattand  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:27:25pm

re: #246 Varek Raith

“We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese.”

Semi-OT: going to see the final live performance of Cinematic Titantic tonight.

I will, indeed, be looking out for snakes.

Hikeeba!

256 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:27:41pm

re: #254 Varek Raith

Fuck the number 5!

KI55 my A55.

257 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:28:38pm
258 Stanley Sea  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:28:47pm

re: #254 Varek Raith

Fuck the number 5!

Fucker’s a fake!

259 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:29:10pm

re: #258 Stanley Sea

Fucker’s a fake!

S in disguise!

260 Amory Blaine  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:29:14pm

re: #191 jaunte

Young dolphins deliberately chew puffer fish to get high with each other

Upon release of the study, we contacted the Jesus fish caucus for their reaction. “We find these results appalling and will be introducing legislation to end this horrific practice” read part of the response.

261 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:29:27pm

re: #255 Mattand

Semi-OT: going to see the final live performance of Cinematic Titantic tonight.

I will, indeed, be looking out for snakes.

Hikeeba!

All our snakes are asleep under the snow, and no show of any kind would perform in this weather.

262 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:30:14pm

re: #255 Mattand

Semi-OT: going to see the final live performance of Cinematic Titantic tonight.

I will, indeed, be looking out for snakes.

Hikeeba!

Gratz.

263 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:30:39pm

re: #250 b_sharp

We’ve known for quite a while that WW is evil.

FFS, you coulda warned me. Sheesh. //

264 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:31:00pm

re: #258 Stanley Sea

Fucker’s a fake!

Calling it anything but ‘V’ is a passing modern affectation.

265 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:31:14pm

Oh, good one.

266 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:31:58pm

re: #263 CuriousLurker

FFS, you coulda warned me. Sheesh. //

The memo was sent out.

267 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:32:10pm

re: #264 Decatur Deb

Calling it anything but ‘V’ is a passing modern affectation.

Anything bigger than 2 is asking for trouble.

268 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:32:50pm

re: #255 Mattand

Semi-OT: going to see the final live performance of Cinematic Titantic tonight.

I will, indeed, be looking out for snakes.

Hikeeba!

Ole!

269 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:33:32pm

re: #267 Kragar

Anything bigger than 2 is asking for trouble.

Humans can only conceive of 0, 1 2, and 3. Anything putatively bigger is just a combination of those 4.

270 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:33:50pm

One of my favorites.
Not sure why.
XD
Youtube Video

271 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:34:22pm
272 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:34:31pm

re: #252 b_sharp

I don’t know, I didn’t see the show.

I was more interested in discussing the idea and PA’s understanding of it than wondering who came up with the idea.

Yes, including PA’s understanding of whose ideas we’re discussing. He doesn’t say whose ideas above, but he mentions Morgan Freeman.

273 Jack Burton  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:34:41pm

re: #246 Varek Raith

“We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese.”

Heathen! We all know that Bulk Vanderhuge is the one true way!

274 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:35:05pm

re: #267 Kragar

Anything bigger than 2 is asking for trouble.

The Khoikhoi got by for millenia with “One, Two, Three, Many”.

en.wikipedia.org

275 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:35:08pm

re: #269 b_sharp

Humans can only conceive of 0, 1 2, and 3. Anything putatively bigger is just a combination of those 4.

“How many guards did you see?”
“2”
“Only 2. There was one, and one, and one, and one. No more than 2.”

276 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:35:39pm

re: #272 wrenchwench

Yes, including PA’s understanding of whose ideas we’re discussing. He doesn’t say whose ideas above, but he mentions Morgan Freeman.

I think Freeman was the narrator.

277 JEA62  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:35:45pm

Neanderthals didn’t believe in evolution either…

278 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:36:04pm

I’m enjoying this hashtag. For every idiot dudebro and glibertarian trying to defend Libertarianism there are at least 20 tweets mocking it:

279 Amory Blaine  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:36:32pm

Thinking of taking my nephew to see War Horse. I don’t spend enough time with him.

Youtube Video

280 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:36:42pm

re: #274 Decatur Deb

The Khoikhoi got by for millenia with “One, Two, Three, Many”.

en.wikipedia.org

I personally favour - none, one, two, three, another one and another one,…

281 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:36:50pm

re: #276 b_sharp

I think Freeman was the narrator.

I know that….

The producers say that Freeman joins in the discussions, so it is possible that he thought up this thing.

282 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:37:24pm
283 Mattand  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:38:08pm

re: #270 Varek Raith

One of my favorites.
Not sure why.
XD
[Embedded content]

I re-watched (is that a word?) the Mexican Santa Claus movie the other night. Wasn’t as funny as I originally remembered it. Still has one of my favorite lines:

Santa’s tendrils reach far and wide. There’s no escape from the KLAUS Organization!

See ya on the flip, Lizards.

284 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:38:50pm

re: #209 wrenchwench

By the man I meant the guy that was linking natural selection, an idea about black holes, complexity of a system and how that relates to a possibility that the universe itself has ancestors and a capacity for intelligence.

285 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:38:57pm

What, no “let them eat cake”?

286 b.d.  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:39:05pm

re: #282 Lidane

[Embedded content]

That one made me laugh

287 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:39:54pm

re: #284 Political Atheist

By the man I meant the guy that was linking natural selection, an idea about black holes, complexity of a system and how that relates to a possibility that the universe itself has ancestors and a capacity for intelligence.

I need to smoke like three more bowls before that looks like anything other than a shotgun-blast of meaningless gobbledygook.

288 b.d.  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:40:59pm
289 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:41:53pm

re: #287 erik_t

I need to smoke like three more bowls before that looks like anything other than a shotgun-blast of meaningless gobbledygook.

Might be one too many already.

290 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:42:47pm

HURR HURR

291 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:43:07pm

re: #279 Amory Blaine

Thinking of taking my nephew to see War Horse. I don’t spend enough time with him.

[Embedded content]

What great stage horses. Those are fantastic!

292 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:43:17pm
293 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:43:20pm

re: #287 erik_t

I need to smoke like three more bowls before that looks like anything other than a shotgun-blast of meaningless gobbledygook.

Made sense to me.
I disagree with it.
But it is understandable.

294 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:43:54pm

re: #290 Pie-onist Overlord

Bold move, went with “rotted” rather than “drooling.”

295 Stanley Sea  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:43:57pm

re: #264 Decatur Deb

Hope you’re feeling better!!

Damn kids.

296 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:44:23pm

re: #284 Political Atheist

By the man I meant the guy that was linking natural selection, an idea about black holes, complexity of a system and how that relates to a possibility that the universe itself has ancestors and a capacity for intelligence.

Who? Do you know his name?

297 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:46:07pm

re: #200 Political Atheist

Okay, I know you said you were leaving, but hopefully you have replies turned on. I emailed you around 10 days ago—I’m in no hurry for a reply, I’m just letting you know because I said I would email you and want you to know that I did follow through (but it’s entirely possible that my correspondence disappeared into one of those cyber black holes).

Wait a mi… *narrows eyes, looks around for Morgan Freeman*

298 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:46:26pm

#libertarianismin4words MINIMUM WAGE ROBOTICS ENGINEER

299 Amory Blaine  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:48:22pm

My desires above all.

300 The Mountain That Blogs  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:48:30pm

re: #290 Pie-onist Overlord

That sounds like the world’s worst museum.

301 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:48:35pm

re: #298 Pie-onist Overlord

They got robotic cooks, janitors, maintenance, and security there too?

302 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:49:01pm

re: #301 Kragar

They got robotic cooks, janitors, maintenance, and security there too?

Yes, and robotic customers.

303 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:50:42pm

Automated employees! Say hello to your new customers who never eat.

304 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:50:43pm

re: #298 Pie-onist Overlord

#libertarianismin4words MINIMUM WAGE ROBOTICS ENGINEER

[Embedded content]

We’re job creators!
But not if you want good jobs!
Then we’ll buy robots, because we need to eek out the last cent of profit, and fuck you!
But we’re job creators!

305 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:50:57pm

hmmm…
One of my sisters just arrived in Cartagena, where she will be staying for a month for extensive dental work.
Is this a something I didn’t know about until today?

O_o

306 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:51:34pm

re: #296 wrenchwench

Who? Do you know his name?

Don’t recall, Let me see if the episode is online to stream real quick… But this episode ran yesterday.

307 b.d.  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:51:56pm

I wonder if Russia is going to ask the USA if they can help out any on their Volgograd problem?

308 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:52:27pm

re: #281 wrenchwench

I know that….

The producers say that Freeman joins in the discussions, so it is possible that he thought up this thing.

Stop picking on Morgan Freeman!!11!

WTF? Just when you think you were starting to get to know & like someone. she pulls out a giant box of daddy long legs and starts picking on grandfatherly black men. What next—torturing small pets, then in the news we hear about this bike shop where they found a bunch of bodies buried under the floorboards…? //

309 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:53:48pm

re: #297 CuriousLurker

CL I missed it. Could you resend? danielgballard at the gmail. I’ll open up Tbird.

310 Belafon  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:53:54pm

re: #71 geoffm33

That’s one of the things I teach my kids about probability:

“Give me five random numbers.”
“1, 1, 1, 1, 1.”
“They have to be different.”
“1, 2, 3, 4, 5.”

311 Bulworth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:54:19pm

re: #298 Pie-onist Overlord

Libertarianism in 4 words?

Fire All The Workers.

Down with the workers.

Up with the bosses.

312 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:54:48pm
313 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:55:14pm

re: #311 Bulworth

Libertarianism in 4 words?

Fire All The Workers.

Down with the workers.

Up with the bosses.

Employees are just assets.

314 Bulworth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:55:27pm

Libertarianism in 4 words?

Workers suck.

(only two words needed, two other words too lazy to work for gruel)

315 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:55:30pm

re: #309 Political Atheist

CL I missed it. Could you resend? danielgballard at the gmail. I’ll open up Tbird.

Done.

316 Bulworth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:56:15pm

Libertarianism in 4 words—

Workers and consumers suck.

Bow down to bosses.

317 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:56:19pm

Hit a nerve:

318 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:56:21pm

Yow! Happening now in Casselton, ND:

319 geoffm33  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:56:39pm

re: #310 Belafon

That’s one of the things I teach my kids about probability:

“Give me five random numbers.”
“1, 1, 1, 1, 1.”
“They have to be different.”
“1, 2, 3, 4, 5.”

This is great.

From Yahoo Answers:

* Is all the number in lottery really has equal chance to win? *

If this was the case, then wouldn’t the number 123456 would be a winner in history? But can you really find it was a winner? Or for that matter 234567 or 345678….

But let me just choose another set:

9 13 22 29 35 49 I am pretty sure it has been a winner number in the past…

So obviously there is a pattern or more change of winning even in random number….

I think the more spread apart the numbers are, the better the possibility in a way…

- Additional Details -
You guys are so brainwashed by statistics, that you are confidently stating that “all” the number has same possibility. Just for simplicity’s purpose you all are saying winning chance of 123456 is same as 9 22 25 33 37 52! Which is apparently not true…Even if you believe in randomness, then you would know that if the first winning number was 1, then the chance of 2 rather then rest of the 49/50 numbers to be the next is really slim….And you guys said winning of 123456 in the history is same as 9 22 25 33 37 52! I can bet you 1000 dollar right now, if someone just go over the lottery numbers for just last year, I would at least have 3-4 winning numbers out of the 6. While 123456 wont even have a chance of upto 2 numbers…So how do you explain that???? And overall, if you believe in the universal laws of physics, everything happen for a reason, and it doesn’t go by your randomness theory of probably class in freshman year.
Again I say that the chance of winning 9 22 25 33 37 52 is much better than 123456 or 234567 or 345678

So to educate you brain washed statistics…If you do wanna spent that $1 and at least wanna match 4-5 numbers if not all 6, then don’t go for 123456 as suggested by some Probability head..Go for 9 22 25 33 37 52

320 Flying Squirrel Girl  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:56:45pm

re: #305 Backwoods_Sleuth

I know medical tourism is very popular in Costa Rica, probably other countries as well.

321 b.d.  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:57:00pm

re: #316 Bulworth

Libertarianism in 4 words—

Workers and consumers suck.

Bow down to bosses.

It’s my real hair.

322 Amory Blaine  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:57:02pm

I like how libertarian claim that currency should be based on tangible commodities like gold, and in the next breath claim that bitcoins are the future.

derp

323 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:58:27pm
324 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:58:33pm
325 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:58:38pm

re: #305 Backwoods_Sleuth

hmmm…
One of my sisters just arrived in Cartagena, where she will be staying for a month for extensive dental work.
Is this a something I didn’t know about until today?

O_o

Spain or Colombia?

326 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:58:43pm

re: #318 Backwoods_Sleuth

Yow! Happening now in Casselton, ND:

[Embedded content]

That was a freight train, right? Not a passenger train?

327 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:59:00pm

re: #319 geoffm33

This is great.

From Yahoo Answers:

WTF?

328 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 1:59:40pm

re: #318 Backwoods_Sleuth

Casselton is about 20 miles west of Fargo, N.D.
duluthnewstribune.com

Picturing Marge Gunderson investigating.

329 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:00:35pm

I know we joke about it being the 51st State and all, but Canada really is a sovereign nation:

330 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:00:43pm
331 Bulworth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:01:29pm

re: #323 Kragar

Homemade…shows creativity. //

332 b.d.  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:01:29pm

re: #326 Dr Lizardo

That was a freight train, right? Not a passenger train?

Oil? Canadian tar sands move via rail and not sure of North Dakota pipeline capacity?

333 Bulworth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:02:28pm

re: #329 Lidane

What happened to all the brownshirts ACORN people he supposedly had lined up down here? //

334 lawhawk  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:02:36pm


This looks real bad. Freight trains - real long ones involved. Derailment and explosion near an ethanol plant too (as if the danger level wasn’t already high enough with at least one bulk oil carrier already aflame.

335 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:03:34pm

Cartagena always reminds me of “Romancing the Stone”. But I liked “War of the Roses” better. Douglas and Turner were a good movie pairing.

336 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:03:47pm

Mental health break:

337 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:03:51pm

re: #308 CuriousLurker

Stop picking on Morgan Freeman!!11!

WTF? Just when you think you were starting to get to know & like someone. she pulls out a giant box of daddy long legs and starts picking on grandfatherly black men. What next—torturing small pets, then in the news we hear about this bike shop where they found a bunch of bodies buried under the floorboards…? //

Turns out the ugliest critters I’ve found in the shop are also arachnids.

Here they spell it (or at least pronounce it) Vinegarón.

338 geoffm33  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:04:12pm

re: #327 b_sharp

WTF?

Either a complete Moran, or Troll Level: Expert

339 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:04:14pm

P.S.: don’t click on that.

340 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:04:25pm

re: #315 CuriousLurker

Done.

And back at ya.

341 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:04:43pm

re: #334 lawhawk

[Embedded content]


This looks real bad. Freight trains - real long ones involved. Derailment and explosion near an ethanol plant too (as if the danger level wasn’t already high enough with at least one bulk oil carrier already aflame.

Those look like potash/sulfur cars, even grain cars rather than oil, but trains going through here frequently pull more than one kind of car.

342 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:05:11pm

re: #325 wrenchwench

Spain or Colombia?

Colombia

343 RealityBasedSteve  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:05:32pm

re: #337 wrenchwench

Turns out the ugliest critters I’ve found in the shop are also arachnids.

Here they spell it (or at least pronounce it) Vinegarón.

OMG!!! I’m hoping somebody has done a joke edit on Wiki.

Vinegaroons are found in tropical and subtropical areas excluding Europe and Australia. Also, only a single species is known from Africa: Etienneus africanus, probably a Gondwana relict endemic to Senegal, the Gambia and Guinea-Bissau.[5] They usually dig underground burrows with their pedipalps, to which they transport their prey.[2] They may also burrow under logs, rotting wood, rocks, and other natural debris. They prefer humid, dark places and avoid light. They also live in the Southern and Southwestern United States and also close to the Nashville downtown area.

RBS

344 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:06:06pm

re: #326 Dr Lizardo

That was a freight train, right? Not a passenger train?

freight train. One was derailed and then hit by another train. 12 cars carrying oil or ethanol. Details still sketchy.

345 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:06:17pm

re: #323 Kragar

[Embedded content]

It’s the “homemade” part about that I find the most intriguing.

346 RealityBasedSteve  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:06:28pm

re: #339 wrenchwench

P.S.: don’t click on that.

Too late. Scared the krud out of me.


RBS

347 Amory Blaine  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:06:28pm

re: #343 RealityBasedSteve

They like country music.

348 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:06:45pm

re: #339 wrenchwench

P.S.: don’t click on that.

I did, but it don’t look like no spider so it ain’t scary.

349 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:08:15pm

re: #305 Backwoods_Sleuth

hmmm…
One of my sisters just arrived in Cartagena, where she will be staying for a month for extensive dental work.
Is this a something I didn’t know about until today?

O_o

Looks like it’s a thing:
Medical tourism to Colombia increases
aldiatoday.com

350 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:08:32pm

re: #337 wrenchwench

Turns out the ugliest critters I’ve found in the shop are also arachnids.

Here they spell it (or at least pronounce it) Vinegarón.

Man, those things are fugly. I see they’re related to scorpions—that was the first thing I thought of when I saw the photo. So I guess they can’t sting, but it sounds like maybe they can bite? Ugh. (Feeling all itchy now. THANKS.)

351 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:08:52pm

re: #344 Backwoods_Sleuth

freight train. One was derailed and then hit by another train. 12 cars carrying oil or ethanol. Details still sketchy.

OK. I saw that mushroom cloud photo and my first thought was “I hope that’s not a passenger train - that’s like something out of a disaster movie.”

352 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:09:29pm

re: #350 CuriousLurker

Man, those things are fugly. I see they’re related to scorpions—that was the first thing I thought of when I saw the photo. So I guess they can’t sting, but it sounds like maybe they can bite? Ugh. (Feeling all itchy now. THANKS.)

Spiders and Scorpions I can handle.

Isopods creep me the fuck out.

353 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:09:31pm
According to Colombia’s Trade Ministry the most popular treatments sought by visitors are heart surgery (41%), general surgery (13%), gastric band surgery (10%), plastic surgery (10%), cancer treatment (6%), orthopedic treatment (4%, dental care (2%) and eye care (1%).
colombiareports.co
354 Amory Blaine  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:10:00pm

People wouldn’t eat lobsters if they crawled around on the land.

355 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:10:13pm

re: #344 Backwoods_Sleuth

freight train. One was derailed and then hit by another train. 12 cars carrying oil or ethanol. Details still sketchy.

Are they shaped like:

356 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:10:40pm

re: #350 CuriousLurker

Man, those things are fugly. I see they’re related to scorpions—that was the first thing I thought of when I saw the photo. So I guess they can’t sting, but it sounds like maybe they can bite? Ugh. (Feeling all itchy now. THANKS.)

I think all they can do is pinch. They are not venomous, so they can’t “bite” in the spider sense.

They are dreadfully skittish; I’ve never heard of anybody even touching one.

357 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:12:15pm

re: #352 Kragar

Spiders and Scorpions I can handle.

Isopods creep me the fuck out.

here you go;

358 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:12:16pm

re: #352 Kragar

Spiders and Scorpions I can handle.

Isopods creep me the fuck out.

Oh, oh, oh, isopods—ewwwwwwwww. I saw a photo of one in a fish’s mouth a couple of years ago. *gag, shudder…*

359 Lidane  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:13:31pm

Tell the truth, lose yer job:

360 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:13:38pm

Casselton Train Derailment (video by Dan Gunderson)
Youtube Video

361 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:13:42pm

re: #354 Amory Blaine

People wouldn’t eat lobsters if they crawled around on the land.

Most crustaceans just look like giant insects yo me. Yuck.

362 Kragar  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:13:42pm

re: #357 b_sharp

here you go;
[Embedded image]

Limbs just built to latch onto a face while it burrows into your eyes

363 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:13:54pm
364 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:14:34pm

re: #356 erik_t

I think all they can do is pinch. They are not venomous, so they can’t “bite” in the spider sense.

They are dreadfully skittish; I’ve never heard of anybody even touching one.

Thank goodness for that.

365 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:15:01pm

re: #361 CuriousLurker

Most crustaceans just look like giant insects yo me. Yuck.

Just took the wife out to supper for her birthday. She ate lobster and shrimp.

366 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:15:13pm

re: #359 Lidane

Tell the truth, lose yer job:

[Embedded content]

Oh yeah, that’s an old story…from Oct 25.

367 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:15:35pm

re: #357 b_sharp

here you go;

TIME FOR TICKLES

368 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:15:56pm

re: #357 b_sharp

here you go;
[Embedded image]

Arrrrghh—you too? I fucking hate all of you!! //

369 b.d.  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:15:57pm

re: #365 b_sharp

Just took the wife out to supper for her birthday. She ate lobster and shrimp.

The Duck Dynasty folks are going to be all over her for doing that anti-Bible stuff.

370 AlexRogan  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:17:39pm

re: #231 RealityBasedSteve

Watch out for the 135th Scooterized Division, the Rolling AARPS!

RBS

And the younger dudebros as attached infantry: the Screaming LARPs.

371 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:17:50pm

re: #363 Gus

[Embedded content]

WTFF? Awful, just awful.

372 Belafon  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:18:09pm

re: #298 Pie-onist Overlord

Like the cost of workers has anything to do with this being built.

373 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:19:32pm

re: #336 Lidane

Mental health break:

[Embedded content]

Instant vertigo.

374 dog philosopher  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:21:13pm

re: #365 b_sharp

Just took the wife out to supper for her birthday. She ate lobster and shrimp.

“i’ll have a big red boiled bug, please”

375 Amory Blaine  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:21:25pm

Everything is being automated and outsourced anyways even with the paltry minimum wage being what it is now. Aren’t McDonald’s drive thru tenders offsite at a call center or something?

376 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:21:31pm

So, someone without a second’s broadcasting experience get a job doing this?

Tim Tebow Hired by ESPN as Analyst for SEC Network

bleacherreport.com

377 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:21:43pm
378 Political Atheist  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:22:10pm

WW-

The web site for the show kinda sucks. Won’t show what ran yesterday. Hard to drill down to the full cast of any given episode. Sorry, I wanted to just have all that for ya.

379 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:22:23pm

re: #356 erik_t

I think all they can do is pinch. They are not venomous, so they can’t “bite” in the spider sense.

They are dreadfully skittish; I’ve never heard of anybody even touching one.

The ones I’ve found must have been half- or totally dead. I make it a practice to check the dressing room once a week, because I have found a vinegarón in there twice.

380 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:22:25pm

re: #364 CuriousLurker

Thank goodness for that.

This, on the other hand, is one of the most venomous spiders. They’ll also charge at you.
Image: Atrax_robustus.jpg

381 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:24:15pm

re: #354 Amory Blaine

People wouldn’t eat lobsters if they crawled around on the land.

umm, yes: crawdads & gumbo

382 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:24:33pm
383 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:25:18pm

re: #363 Gus

[Embedded content]

From the link:

Acevedo became a suspect in the murders of Pamela Pemberton, 30, and Christina Adkins, 18, after detectives took a closer look at disappearances on Seymour Avenue following Ariel Castro’s arrest for kidnapping and raping three women.

Sounds like law enforcement didn’t give that neighborhood the priority it deserved until someone handed them Castro on a platter.

384 jaunte  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:25:24pm

Don’t inhale.

385 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:25:36pm

re: #382 jaunte

Cool thermocline. It looks like the smoke plume hits a brick wall at 500 feet.

386 Belafon  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:27:26pm

re: #364 CuriousLurker

When I was a kid, I opened the shed door and the inside of it was covered in daddy long legs. The door looked like it was pulsing because they were all moving in unison.

387 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:27:55pm

re: #386 Belafon

They’re so cute! They look like little hovering potatoes.

388 Amory Blaine  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:27:58pm

if this is an oil explosion I expect the pipeline boosters to saturate the airwaves in 3..2..1..

389 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:28:16pm

re: #380 Varek Raith

This, on the other hand, is one of the most venomous spiders. They’ll also charge at you.
Image: Atrax_robustus.jpg

Alien.

390 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:29:03pm

re: #389 b_sharp

Alien.

Well, it is from Australia, Land of Everything Wants to Kill You.

391 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:29:16pm

re: #380 Varek Raith

This, on the other hand, is one of the most venomous spiders. They’ll also charge at you.
Image: Atrax_robustus.jpg

Looks just like the relatively harmless tarantula. Except those fangs….

392 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:29:18pm

OMG OMG OMG A TRAIN DERAILED IT’S THE END TIMES! THIS JUST PROVES THAT… Oh dear. Let me get my smelling salts.

393 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:29:59pm

re: #386 Belafon

When I was a kid, I opened the shed door and the inside of it was covered in daddy long legs. The door looked like it was pulsing because they were all moving in unison.

*whimpers, closes eyes, sticks fingers in ears*

I can’t hear youuuu…

394 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:30:04pm

re: #355 b_sharp

Are they shaped like:

[Embedded image]

Don’t know.

wday.com

CASSELTON - The train that derailed about a mile west of town here was eastbound carrying crude oil, according to a BNSF spokeswoman.

Emergency and fire-fighting crews are respond-ing to the derailment, which Amy McBeth, a spokeswoman for BNSF, said occurred at around 2:10 p.m.

McBeth said no crew members on the train were injured during the acci-dent. The train was 106 cars long and headed east-bound, she said.

McBeth said she didn’t know the train’s destination or how many cars derailed.

395 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:30:05pm

re: #380 Varek Raith

This, on the other hand, is one of the most venomous spiders. They’ll also charge at you.
Image: Atrax_robustus.jpg

Ah yes, the Sydney Funnel-web. Yet another reason why I stay away from the godforsaken land.

396 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:30:32pm

Anti-fracking weirdos in 3, 2, 1…

397 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:30:52pm

re: #380 Varek Raith

This, on the other hand, is one of the most venomous spiders. They’ll also charge at you.
Image: Atrax_robustus.jpg

Oh, great—you too. *throws hands in air*

398 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:31:06pm

re: #391 wrenchwench

en.wikipedia.org

399 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:31:07pm

re: #393 CuriousLurker

*whimpers, closes eyes, sticks fingers in ears*

I can’t hear youuuu…

I was wondering if it was OK without pictures, but I bet you have a vivid imagination that you can’t turn off…

400 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:33:24pm

re: #399 wrenchwench

I was wondering if it was OK without pictures, but I bet you have a vivid imagination that you can’t turn off…

Now I’m itchy.

401 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:34:03pm

Around here, just about everyone has a well, so you have to be very careful when removing the well cover. Black widows love to hide out in them. There was always one in residence when I hooked up the hose to water stuff.

402 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:34:26pm

re: #397 CuriousLurker

Oh, great—you too. *throws hands in air*

Uh, yeah… I’m evil. Remember?
:P

403 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:34:57pm

re: #399 wrenchwench

I was wondering if it was OK without pictures, but I bet you have a vivid imagination that you can’t turn off…

Bingo!

404 Flying Squirrel Girl  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:35:21pm

re: #386 Belafon

When I was a kid, I opened the shed door and the inside of it was covered in daddy long legs. The door looked like it was pulsing because they were all moving in unison.

One time I smashed a scorpion and baby scorpions came pouring off its back. According to my SO, I make a very distinct sound when confronted by scorpions and/or snakes.

405 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:35:28pm

re: #398 Varek Raith

en.wikipedia.org

The Mygalomorphae (also called the Orthognatha) are an infraorder of spiders. The scientific name comes from the orientation of the fangs which point straight down and do not cross each other (as opposed to araneomorph).

Includes the cutely named Mouse Spider.

Ooops, sorry CL!

406 Targetpractice  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:36:09pm

re: #405 wrenchwench

Includes the cutely named Mouse Spider.

[Embedded image]

Ooops, sorry CL!

HOLY FUCK! *scrambles away*

407 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:36:43pm
408 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:37:53pm

o/

409 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:37:57pm

re: #401 Justanotherhuman

Around here, just about everyone has a well, so you have to be very careful when removing the well cover. Black widows love to hide out in them. There was always one in residence when I hooked up the hose to water stuff.

When I was a kid I had a job throwing hay to some sheep and horses. Once in a while I had to clean out their drinking troughs, which were old bathtubs. There were always a bunch of black widows underneath. They don’t even faze me any more.

410 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:37:58pm

re: #401 Justanotherhuman

Around here, just about everyone has a well, so you have to be very careful when removing the well cover. Black widows love to hide out in them. There was always one in residence when I hooked up the hose to water stuff.

They aren’t the most aggressive of spiders. Thankfully.

Some years ago I had a wolf spider try to sneak up on me when I was on the treadmill. Every time I turned around she’d scurry under the wall.

I got off the treadmill and went upstairs when I lost track of her.

411 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:38:31pm

U.S. Coast Guard ends search for Canadian who jumped off cruise ship

Read more: cp24.com

“Guard crews spent 44 hours searching for 26-year-old Tien Phuoc Nguyen, who leaped from a Royal Caribbean Cruises ship late Saturday. They called off the search Monday afternoon.

“Other passengers reported seeing him jump overboard as the cruise ship was east of Mona Island, located between Puerto Rico and the Dominican Republic.”

412 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:38:35pm

re: #378 Political Atheist

WW-

The web site for the show kinda sucks. Won’t show what ran yesterday. Hard to drill down to the full cast of any given episode. Sorry, I wanted to just have all that for ya.

re: #379 wrenchwench

WW, if you go over to IMDb and choose an episode, it appears that there are posts on their message boards discussing them. Maybe that’ll help clarify where some of the info is coming from.

413 Varek Raith  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:39:27pm

re: #410 b_sharp

They aren’t the most aggressive of spiders. Thankfully.

Some years ago I had a wolf spider try to sneak up on me when I was on the treadmill. Every time I turned around she’d scurry under the wall.

I got off the treadmill and went upstairs when I lost track of her.

The are incredibly timid. You have to really work at getting one to bite you.

414 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:40:14pm

About to run out of my data limit. Whatever.

415 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:40:45pm

re: #414 Gus

About to run out of my data limit. Whatever.

Tomorrow is another day.

416 Stanley Sea  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:41:14pm
417 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:42:36pm

Why am I sitting here watching Defenders of Berk instead of downstairs making something?

Sometimes I am just too lazy.

418 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:43:21pm
419 erik_t  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:44:02pm

YOU ARE ALL TERRIBLE AND I’M LEAVING.

(pouts)

420 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:46:02pm

Even if you hate spiders you have to love this.
Youtube Video

421 dog philosopher  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:47:53pm

AS THE MINIMUM WAGE IS SET to increase to $15 per hour in SeaTac, Wash. — the highest in the nation — employers are looking for ways to absorb the big increase in labor costs, including reducing hours and cutting jobs.

On Jan. 1, an estimated 1,600 hotel and transportation workers in SeaTac, Wash., will see their pay jump to $15 an hour, a 60 percent increase from the state’s $9.32 minimum wage.

seattle-tacoma unemployment rate is currently about 6%, about a point and a quarter below the national average

422 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:48:25pm

re: #416 Stanley Sea

[Embedded content]

Welp, I guess pretty soon Gus won’t have to worry about exceeding his monthly data limit anymore. Me either—all us liberals & non-Christians will be too busy being roasted, much to the delight of Erick Erickson. //

423 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:48:44pm

re: #421 dog philosopher

Are these workers unionized?

424 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:49:57pm

re: #422 CuriousLurker

Welp, I guess pretty soon Gus won’t have to worry about exceeding his monthly data anymore. Me either—all us liberals & non-Christians will be too busy being roasted, much to the delight of Erick Erickson. //

Yeah. I have a $20 gift card handy. Plan on dragging my butt out tomorrow for a few things so I might pick up some moar funding. Right now I’d rather pout. :D

425 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:51:25pm

re: #424 Gus

Yeah. I have a $20 gift card handy. Plan on dragging my butt out tomorrow for a few things so I might pick up some moar funding. Right now I’d rather pout. :D

Woohoo, pity party! ;o)

426 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:51:36pm

re: #412 CuriousLurker

WW, if you go over to IMDb and choose an episode, it appears that there are posts on their message boards discussing them. Maybe that’ll help clarify where some of the info is coming from.

Sure enough! Haven’t located the ‘man’ yet, but here’s the first comment:

Watching the first two seasons of Through the Wormhole turned me into a science maniac and, accordingly, I have spent the past two years reading avidly and therefore consider that I have a fairly rounded view of quite a lot of the subjects covered.

This season in general is not up to par with the first two, but this episode hit the bottom of the barrel, bored a hole through it, dug its way to the nether regions and scraped up the worst examples of scientists imaginable.

The premise is simple: Is the Universe Alive

Unfortunately, this sort of question attracts a particular kind of lunatic with weird and truly demented answers, which include bouncing balls - supposed to represent the Universe expanding and contracting, which it almost certainly doesn’t do - quantum particle stooges convinced that subatomic particles represent living cells and various other kinds of people who, if born a couple of decades earlier, would have been considered strange even by the Flower-power generation.

Even Morgan Freeman couldn’t seem to find his usual enthusiasm when presenting the various theories, probably because he’s an extremely intelligent man quite capable of seeing the flaws in all the arguments presented.

And they synopsis is no help:

The cosmos may be a superorganism, a collection of separate bodies acting like a single being. Scientists are probing this colossal creature for its beating heart, quantum-computing brain and even its offspring. Or are space & time illusions we created?
- Written by Anonymous

It’s a rerun from June 2012.

427 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:52:25pm

re: #425 CuriousLurker

Woohoo, pity party! ;o)

I’ll bring the snotrags.

428 Gus  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:53:01pm

They should have a nightly show that reports on all the fatal car, truck and pedestrian accidents that take place during the day in the USA. Not for the gore but for some perspective on this accident thing.

429 Shiplord Kirel  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:53:29pm

re: #421 dog philosopher

AS THE MINIMUM WAGE IS SET to increase to $15 per hour in SeaTac, Wash. — the highest in the nation — employers are looking for ways to absorb the big increase in labor costs, including reducing hours and cutting jobs.

On Jan. 1, an estimated 1,600 hotel and transportation workers in SeaTac, Wash., will see their pay jump to $15 an hour, a 60 percent increase from the state’s $9.32 minimum wage.

seattle-tacoma unemployment rate is currently about 6%, about a point and a quarter below the national average

According to Galt-GOP math, this will make a Big Mac about $20; that is, they somehow believe that increasing a fraction of the whole by 60% will increase the whole by 400%. No wonder they think gold is a good investment.

430 dog philosopher  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:53:48pm

re: #423 Eclectic Cyborg

Are these workers unionized?

dunno

431 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 2:55:21pm

re: #426 wrenchwench

Sure enough! Haven’t located the ‘man’ yet, but here’s the first comment:

And they synopsis is no help:

It’s a rerun from June 2012.

Thanks! I don’t watch TV, so I’m not familiar with the show and couldn’t figure out which episode it was (or I’d have linked to it), but I know you’re a smart cookie and trusted that you’d find it.

432 wrenchwench  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 3:02:46pm

re: #431 CuriousLurker

Thanks! I don’t watch TV, so I’m not familiar with the show and couldn’t figure out which episode it was (or I’d have linked to it), but I know you’re a smart cookie and trusted that you’d find it.

Thanks! And sorry about the ‘piders. (That’s what I call ‘em. I talk to them as though they were kittehs when I find them. I love jumping spiders.)

433 Decatur Deb  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 3:05:36pm

re: #428 Gus

They should have a nightly show that reports on all the fatal car, truck and pedestrian accidents that take place during the day in the USA. Not for the gore but for some perspective on this accident thing.

nsc.org

434 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 3:07:43pm

re: #188 Feline Fearless Leader

Mine would have been. “Got Mine. F**k you.” Essentially the same concept.

I don’t tweet but someone is free to use, “Got mine. You’re next.”

435 b_sharp  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 3:12:08pm

re: #432 wrenchwench

Thanks! And sorry about the ‘piders. (That’s what I call ‘em. I talk to them as though they were kittehs when I find them. I love jumping spiders.)

Too weird.

436 CuriousLurker  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 3:22:35pm

re: #432 wrenchwench

Thanks! And sorry about the ‘piders. (That’s what I call ‘em. I talk to them as though they were kittehs when I find them. I love jumping spiders.)

Don’t be sorry! Some of the little jumping ones are kinda cute, it’s the big hairy mean-looking ones I don’t like. And daddy long legs.

437 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 3:23:02pm

re: #296 wrenchwench

Who? Do you know his name?

Yog Sothoth, the All-In-One and The One-In-All.

438 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 3:36:30pm

re: #329 Lidane

I know we joke about it being the 51st State and all, but Canada really is a sovereign nation:

[Embedded content]

Holy Christ! Canada has a conservative government. They’d tell Obama to go piss up a rope.

Now if Bush had asked, on the other hand.

439 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 3:44:56pm

re: #337 wrenchwench

Turns out the ugliest critters I’ve found in the shop are also arachnids.

Here they spell it (or at least pronounce it) Vinegarón.

Solpugids are scary looking.

440 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Dec 30, 2013 3:51:43pm

re: #390 Varek Raith

Well, it is from Australia, Land of Everything Wants to Kill You.

It’s been documented that this is the truth. A land that hates its people so much it can taste stabbing.


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