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1 thedopefishlives  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:08:39pm

Bonus points if the word “platypus” is uttered by either side.

2 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:09:21pm

Ken Ham came out of the gate doing the Gish Gallup like a man whose creationist museum is going broke.

3 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:09:26pm

4 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:09:35pm

The fact that there’s even a debate about evolution in 2014 is embarrassing for this country.

5 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:09:41pm

Yikes. Ken Ham is talking a mile a minute. Gish Gallop and strawmen all over the place.

6 Decatur Deb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:10:20pm

A distinction we haven’t resurrected today is YEC vs ‘Fire and Forget’ creation. The latter, typical of Catholics, simply sidesteps problems with evolution by making it the mechanism of creation.

7 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:10:25pm

“Hijacked by secularists” should have been on there.

8 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:10:29pm

where are shem and ashkenaz?

9 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:10:56pm
10 abolitionist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:10:58pm

re: #2 Charles Johnson

Ken Ham came out of the gate doing the Gish Gallup like a man whose creationist museum is going broke.

I’ve seen no updates recently about his Baghdad Creationist Museum.

11 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:10:58pm

If it really was “God’s Word” would it even be in a book? Sheeesh.

12 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:10:59pm
13 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:11:48pm
14 Dr Lizardo  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:11:59pm

re: #4 Lidane

The fact that there’s even a debate about evolution in 2014 is embarrassing for this country.

I sent a link of this to a Czech friend of mine; she’s a biology student at university here.

She messaged me back, “WTF?! Seriously?!”

15 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:12:06pm

Repost from downstairs:

16 thedopefishlives  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:12:28pm

re: #13 jaunte

[Embedded content]

There isn’t one. “Because goddidit” does not a scientific model make.

17 TedStriker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:12:50pm

re: #2 Charles Johnson

Ken Ham came out of the gate doing the Gish Gallup like a man whose creationist museum is going broke.

Youtube Video

18 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:13:05pm

re: #5 Gus

Yikes. Ken Ham is talking a mile a minute. Gish Gallop and strawmen all over the place.

And that is why you don’t debate creationists. The truth can’t keep up with the lies.

19 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:13:34pm

20 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:14:18pm

re: #12 Gus

[Embedded content]

I’m really looking forward to his version of Cosmos. Going to sit the kids down with me and watch it.

21 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:14:47pm

re: #5 Gus

Yikes. Ken Ham is talking a mile a minute. Gish Gallop and strawmen all over the place.

has he said “you [liberals:secularists:evolutionists] believe that…” yet?

22 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:15:04pm

Bill Nye’s actually doing pretty well with his opening statement, but he’s using them big words.

23 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:15:12pm

Did Ken Ham get run out of Australia?

24 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:16:15pm

re: #23 Justanotherhuman

Did Ken Ham get run out of Australia?

No, he set himself up with a little derp kingdom here in Kentucky with his creationist museum.

25 Decatur Deb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:16:59pm

re: #23 Justanotherhuman

Did Ken Ham get run out of Australia?

Dunno. They are very protective of their sheep.

26 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:17:31pm

He’s an MRI designer, but he can’t explain the geology of the Grand Canyon.

27 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:17:46pm

If you’re watching this, you’ve got a stronger stomach than me.

You can’t debate people who don’t even accept the basic idea of science. Bill Nye should know better.

28 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:18:21pm

These “scientists” Ham is introducing do a very good job of mixing their religion in with real science.

That’s enough to make me discount them, regardless of their accomplishments.

29 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:18:27pm

Ham has binders full of authoritative fallacy.

30 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:19:32pm

Bandwagon!

31 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:19:41pm

Straw man!

32 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:19:47pm

Ahtiests!

33 thedopefishlives  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:19:59pm

re: #30 Gus

re: #31 Gus

re: #32 Gus

Bingo!

34 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:20:01pm

re: #26 jaunte

He’s an MRI designer, but he can’t explain the geology of the Grand Canyon.

Aren’t inventors more slanted toward engineering than science?

35 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:20:05pm

re: #26 jaunte

He’s an MRI designer, but he can’t explain the geology of the Grand Canyon.

noyes fludde + miracles

36 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:21:17pm

Your Logical Fallacy Is Appeal to Authority

Example: Not able to defend his position that evolution ‘isn’t true’ Bob says that he knows a scientist who also questions evolution (and presumably isn’t a primate).

37 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:21:19pm

In the past, everything was up for grabs. Total fantasy.

38 nines09  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:21:24pm

“Evolution is a lie! That monkey I saw at the zoo last year looks the same!”
It’s pearls before swine Bill. They that will not know will not know.

39 thedopefishlives  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:21:31pm

re: #22 Charles Johnson

Bill Nye’s actually doing pretty well with his opening statement, but he’s using them big words.

“I can’t understand a word you’re saying, but I know you’re wrong.”

40 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:22:32pm

re: #34 Justanotherhuman

Aren’t inventors more slanted toward engineering than science?

Engineering still has a basis in science. You need the basics to understand how to apply them.

41 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:22:35pm

You “weren’t there”, either, Kenny Boy.

42 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:22:42pm

re: #34 Justanotherhuman

Aren’t inventors more slanted toward engineering than science?

well they’re definitely pretty slanted

43 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:22:55pm

“You weren’t there” = bingo hit.

44 wrenchwench  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:23:10pm

Ham shouldn’t be allowed to use a photo from NASA/JPL/Caltech.

45 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:23:20pm
46 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:23:39pm

re: #45 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Gallop. :D

47 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:24:19pm

re: #40 Lidane

Engineering still has a basis in science. You need the basics to understand how to apply them.

IIRC, there are enough young earth creationists with engineering backgrounds to be a bit of an embarrassment to engineering.

48 thedopefishlives  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:24:23pm

re: #34 Justanotherhuman

Aren’t inventors more slanted toward engineering than science?

Engineering is nothing but the application of science to reality.

49 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:24:37pm

re: #40 Lidane

Engineering still has a basis in science. You need the basics to understand how to apply them.

But it has nothing to do with carbon dating Pleistocene bones.

50 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:24:39pm

This is like listening to a high-functioning schizophrenic.

51 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:25:03pm
52 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:25:13pm

I’m now convinced, I don’t believe in the Grand Canyon.

53 abolitionist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:25:18pm

My lady friend gave me an autographed copy of Ken Ham’s Dinosaurs of Eden for my daughters. It went quickly to a landfill.

54 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:25:34pm

re: #52 b.d.

I’m now convinced, I don’t believe in the Grand Canyon.

There is no Grand Canyon in the bible

55 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:26:08pm

This is why Bill Nye probably should have avoided this debate. Ham is throwing out so much nonsense, how could anyone counter it all? Where does one start?

56 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:26:19pm
57 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:26:38pm

re: #54 b.d.

There is no Grand Canyon in the bible

Right. There are how many square miles in the bible?

58 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:27:11pm

re: #57 Justanotherhuman

Right. There are how many square miles in the bible?

they’re cubits, dammit!

/

59 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:27:17pm

re: #49 Justanotherhuman

But it has nothing to do with carbon dating Pleistocene bones.

True. In general, engineers aren’t biologists unless they work in fields like biomedical science or biosystems. Most engineers tend to work with math and physics.

Still, anyone with even the most basic understanding of physics can tell you that the universe is far older than the Creationists want to believe.

60 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:27:17pm
61 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:27:30pm

“Creationist scientist”

And my head started hurting.

62 Decatur Deb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:28:07pm

re: #58 Backwoods_Sleuth

they’re cubits, dammit!

/

How many cubic cubits in an engineer’s cubicle?

63 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:28:45pm

re: #62 Decatur Deb

How many cubic cubits in an engineer’s cubicle?

That’s one of God’s mysteries, my son. Ours is not to question…

/////////////////

64 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:29:09pm

Tasmanian wolf en.wikipedia.org

65 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:29:32pm
66 TedStriker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:29:50pm

re: #55 JeffM70

This is why Bill Nye probably should have avoided this debate. Ham is throwing out so much nonsense, how could anyone counter it all? Where does one start?

Nye can’t, which is the point of the Gish Gallop; rhetorically speaking, it already sounds like Nye is getting curbstomped.

Bill, I am disappoint.

67 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:29:55pm

I admit, I was a piss-poor science student, but Ken Ham is so full of bullshit.

Ken Ham obviously doesn’t believe in diversity in nature.

68 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:30:33pm

re: #66 TedStriker

Nye can’t, which is the point of the Gish Gallop; rhetorically speaking, it already sounds like Nye is getting curbstomped.

Bill, I am disappoint.

No shit. Bill, why give this nutter a platform?

69 Decatur Deb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:30:43pm

Ham/Wilma 2016

70 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:31:04pm

re: #59 Lidane

True. In general, engineers aren’t biologists unless they work in fields like biomedical science or biosystems. Most engineers tend to work with math and physics.

Still, anyone with even the most basic understanding of physics can tell you that the universe is far older than the Creationists want to believe.

That’s why I leave the biological nonsense by creationists alone —- that isn’t in my background, so I can’t properly refute it. But I do have a good appreciation for just how much of the physical sciences you have to ignore to pretend that young earth creationism is supported by evidence.

For starters, all of astronomy and cosmology have to go. Geology is also impossible. Nuclear physics is yet another no-go zone.

71 wrenchwench  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:31:15pm

One can now sequence DNA to determine species. No more looking at ‘trees’.

72 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:31:54pm

Rapid fire bullshit. Yeah, this is gonna be a very, VERY long slog.

73 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:33:39pm
74 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:34:20pm

Andrew Fabich, Ph.D. - Liberty University

75 wrenchwench  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:34:38pm

Liberty University is such a bastion of science.

76 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:35:16pm

Are Dog Breeds Actually Different Species?
A humorous take on using dog breeds to prove evolution

scientificamerican.com

77 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:35:18pm

re: #66 TedStriker

Nye can’t, which is the point of the Gish Gallop; rhetorically speaking, it already sounds like Nye is getting curbstomped.

Bill, I am disappoint.

this is teevee drama, not a real debate

nye should pick ham’s weakest point and drill him on it relentlessly

78 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:35:20pm

Cripes what a load of bullshit.

79 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:35:54pm

19th century textbook is proof that Darwin declared there to be 5 races of human! SCIENCE!!!

/////

80 Amory Blaine  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:36:00pm

We walked out of the Garden of Eden with our bronze cannons blazing.

81 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:36:20pm

They ought to time this like an election debate.

Ham likes the sound of his own voice too much.

82 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:36:24pm

Tip: Don’t use Ham’s one of Darwin’s ideas was wrong test on any religious text.

83 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:36:29pm
84 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:36:53pm

I can actually feel brain cells dying.

85 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:36:59pm

While listening to this guy, I keep checking to see if my wallet is still there

86 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:37:09pm
87 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:37:30pm

re: #83 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

I may have to have a fucking beer. This is awful.

88 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:37:38pm

re: #74 Gus

Andrew Fabich, Ph.D. - >Liberty University

Wow. I didn’t know Liberty U had the nerve to issue Ph.Ds. Dissertation topics must be swill like “How to lie for Jesus more effectively”.

The fact that the mainstream media will report on such ‘credentials’ without exposing them as the used toilet paper that they are is very irritating.

89 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:38:29pm

Charles, I’ll sell you my soul, just make the hurting stop!

//

90 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:38:31pm
91 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:38:39pm
92 abolitionist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:39:18pm

re: #91 Gus

Yup.

93 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:39:26pm

Which version of Genesis, Ham?

94 Amory Blaine  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:39:31pm

re: #91 Gus

It’s only available through this special offer.

95 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:39:35pm

re: #89 Targetpractice

Charles, I’ll sell you my soul, just make the hurting stop!

//

There’s no way I can deal with this directly. Judging it by the reaction of the commenters will suffice.

96 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:40:04pm

Oh man. That audience.

97 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:40:04pm

re: #88 EPR-radar

Wow. I didn’t know Liberty U had the nerve to issue Ph.Ds. Dissertation topics must be swill like “How to lie for Jesus more effectively”.

The fact that the mainstream media will report on such ‘credentials’ without exposing them as the used toilet paper that they are is very irritating.

Fair and balanced. “Does the earth rotate, or do flame dragons tow the sun across the sky? Tonight we have both sides of the issue!”

98 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:40:06pm

Geological dippery.

99 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:40:20pm

Dead things in Earth = proof of Biblical flood. Yup.

100 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:40:22pm

You cannot hold an honest debate with creo-liars because the ground rules require you to be polite and you cannot tell the truth if you stay within those rules. These people are liars, frauds, borderline criminals. Every single one of their barrage of talking points has been refuted over and over to the point of absurdity. Yet, they pretend that each represents an open, legitimate question. They are frauds, quacks, the evidence they cite is fabricated, their logic is childish. Stop legitimizing these people, science advocates. Judges don’t debate criminals as equals, why should you do so with creationists?

101 Amory Blaine  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:40:32pm

Confused and corrupt..

102 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:40:48pm
103 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:40:58pm

Shorter Ken Ham: blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

104 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:41:00pm

Damn it! We’re out of beer!

“God invented marriage.”

Oh fuck me.

105 Amory Blaine  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:41:04pm

Irish Spring

106 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:41:04pm

re: #96 Charles Johnson

Oh man. That audience.

I’m guessing they were all bused in from local churches.

107 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:41:19pm

Why are there marsupials in mammal niches? Genesis.

108 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:41:42pm

‘Cause gay marriage has everything to do with creation vs evolution. Sheesh.

109 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:41:48pm

Genesis was better when Peter Gabriel was in it.

110 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:41:48pm

WTF?

111 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:41:49pm

personally, i’m much more interested in debates about Who Were The Indo Europeans

everybody admits it’s all really just speculation, and there’s a lot more shouting and hitting people over the head

112 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:41:50pm

Hey Ham, explain the platypus.

113 TedStriker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:42:11pm

re: #68 Targetpractice

No shit. Bill, why give this nutter a platform?

My fear is that Ham is going to “win” this “debate” against Nye, with his skillful use of Gish Gallops; this is going to embolden him and the rest of his ilk.

Mark my words: After tonight, Ham is going throw out “the evolutionists sent the vaunted Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate me and he couldn’t refute a word I said! Is that the best you’ve got?”

Talk about the urge to perpetually headdesk…

114 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:42:26pm

re: #112 Targetpractice

Hey Ham, explain the platypus.

Satan, of course.
or teh gheys…

115 Decatur Deb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:42:28pm

Off to watch reruns of Storage Wars. Maybe they’ll find something new in those abandoned units.

116 Kid A  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:42:30pm

Gay marriage made its way into a “debate” about creationist bullshit versus evolution TRUTH. I’m shocked.

117 Amory Blaine  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:42:38pm

Derpity derp derp.

118 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:42:43pm

re: #106 aagcobb

I’m guessing they were all bused in from local churches.

No surprise at all. The only possible good that this debate might do is to reach people who can be persuaded by evidence. Ken Ham has the ability to prevent any such people from being in the audience, and has doubtless done so.

119 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:43:07pm

re: #112 Targetpractice

Hey Ham, explain the platypus.

God got stoned, and thought it was really funny at the time.

120 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:43:23pm
121 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:43:38pm

What’s going on here? How long is Ken Ham going to keep unrolling this idiocy?

122 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:43:40pm

re: #113 TedStriker

My fear is that Ham is going to “win” this “debate” against Nye, with his skillful use of Gish Gallops; this is going to embolden him and the rest of his ilk.

Mark my words: After tonight, Ham is going throw out “the evolutionists sent Bill Nye, the Science Guy, and he couldn’t refute a word I said! Is that the best you’ve got?”

That is what Creationists always do after these debates.

123 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:43:52pm

re: #113 TedStriker

My fear is that Ham is going to “win” this “debate” against Nye, with his skillful use of Gish Gallops; this is going to embolden him and the rest of his ilk.

Mark my words: After tonight, Ham is going throw out “the evolutionists sent Bill Nye, the Science Guy, and he couldn’t refute a word I said! Is that the best you’ve got?”

As I understand it, Ham has a solid half hour to do his hooting and hollering routine, and then Nye presumably gets half an hour to respond.

124 Kid A  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:43:54pm

That accent doesn’t make you sound intelligent either, you twat.

125 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:43:55pm

re: #121 Charles Johnson

What’s going on here? How long is Ken Ham going to keep unrolling this idiocy?

I thought this was a debate, not a sermon.

126 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:43:56pm

Science equals religion because they too observe. Riiight.

127 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:44:15pm

re: #121 Charles Johnson

What’s going on here? How long is Ken Ham going to keep unrolling this idiocy?

128 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:44:23pm
129 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:44:30pm

re: #123 EPR-radar

As I understand it, Ham has a solid half hour to do his hooting and hollering routine, and then Nye presumably gets half an hour to respond.

And he’s speaking with all the speed of a auctioneer.

130 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:44:48pm

Abortion?

131 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:44:56pm

Gay marriage?

132 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:45:03pm

I had to turn it off before I developed encephalitis.

133 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:45:05pm

This is a fucking sermon.

134 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:45:22pm

.
re: #129 Targetpractice

And he’s speaking with all the speed of a auctioneer.

Yes!
Dish dash? Or what is that term?

135 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:45:22pm

re: #128 Pie-onist Overlord

I prefer to believe God doesn’t resemble Todd Starnes.

136 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:45:26pm
137 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:45:29pm

re: #120 Pie-onist Overlord

[Embedded content]

Wait Bryan, you mean a Jewish rabbi believed the religious texts of his time to be the truth? Shit, why are we only hearing about this now?

///

138 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:45:36pm
139 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:45:37pm

So basically Nye has to tackle Ham’s comments on molecules to man, the Grand Canyon, speciation, finches, gay marriage, media bias, e coli, public education, moral relativity, abortion, the Biblical flood, naturalism as religion, random processes, and is that all?

140 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:45:56pm

What a fucking joke.

141 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:46:04pm

re: #129 Targetpractice

And he’s speaking with all the speed of a auctioneer.

It might literally take someone speaking normally 5 years to refute all of the idiocy in Ham’s half hour show for the rubes. Of course, that’s the whole point of a Gish Gallop —- it can’t be done in the allotted time.

142 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:46:09pm

re: #134 Political Atheist

.


Yes!
Dish dash? Or what is that term?

Gish gallup

143 Kid A  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:46:10pm

In other dangerous wingnuttery, Theodore of Cruz is accusing Obama of more abuses of power. You know, that executive order thingy that’s a presidential power. That Reagan used quite a bit.

144 KingKenrod  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:46:11pm

In case anyone’s forgotten, the debate question is:

Is creation a viable model of origins in today’s modern, scientific era?

I didn’t hear any evidence.

145 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:46:25pm
146 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:46:29pm

Ham has slopped so much shit atop the pile that there’s no real way that Nye can burn it all down in 30 minutes.

147 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:46:53pm

re: #142 aagcobb

Gish gallup

Ah thanks. Gish gallop. That was it. Classic example there.

148 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:47:01pm

re: #145 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

I’d like to believe it was polite clapping…but with that crowd? Ugh.

149 Amory Blaine  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:47:28pm

Heh is that a rock on his podium?

150 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:47:30pm

re: #128 Pie-onist Overlord

toddstarnes ✔ @toddstarnes

Evolutionists believe you evolved from a monkey slogging through primordial ooze. Creationists believe you were created in God’s image.

No, Starnes, you cretinous mountebank, “evolutionists” believe that we were a long damn way from primordial ooze by the time monkeys appeared on the scene, almost to the present on the scale of geological time.

151 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:47:34pm

re: #112 Targetpractice

Hey Ham, explain the platypus.

forget the platypus - make him explain how the angels are transmitting the teevee signals through the aether using only the will of the almighty

152 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:47:35pm
153 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:48:24pm

Boing!

154 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:48:45pm

re: #141 EPR-radar

It might literally take someone speaking normally 5 years to refute all of the idiocy in Ham’s half hour show for the rubes. Of course, that’s the whole point of a Gish Gallop —- it can’t be done in the allotted time.

nye will start to refute one point, and ham will constantly interrupt him and never let him finish

been there

155 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:48:52pm

Math is the great cleaver of bullshit from reality. heh.

156 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:49:18pm

re: #133 Gus

This is a fucking sermon.

Was it ever going to be anything else?

Debating a creationist is pointless and stupid. They don’t accept science or reality. They’re taking a few lines in Genesis and spinning a wild bullshit story that requires a lobotomy in order to believe.

157 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:50:12pm

re: #144 KingKenrod

In case anyone’s forgotten, the debate question is:

Is creation a viable model of origins in today’s modern, scientific era?

I didn’t hear any evidence.

Actually, the question as posed is bit imprecise, since it allows the real issue at hand to be evaded. For example, if the believer says “God did the Big Bang, science can deal with everything after that”, there’s really nothing left to debate.

158 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:50:31pm
159 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:51:22pm

Is it safe to turn it back on?

160 Internet Tough Guy  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:52:22pm

re: #159 Justanotherhuman

It’s not safe until it’s over.

161 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:53:14pm

re: #157 EPR-radar

I didn’t hear any evidence.

Actually, the question as posed is bit imprecise, since it allows the real issue at hand to be evaded. For example, if the believer says “God did the Big Bang, science can deal with everything after that”, there’s really nothing left to debate.

But Ham is a biblical literalist, and he insists that troooo Christianity requires a belief in Young Earth Creationism.

162 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:54:15pm

Layers at Grand canyon

163 kirkspencer  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:54:23pm

So where’s the test for creationism? Scientific method is that you propose tests that can prove your position wrong. Evolutionary theory has had quite a few, and has had to be refined when some of the answers weren’t expected. Things like five races of man.

But as near as I can tell there is no test for creationism. No way at all to disprove a creator.

That makes creationism a faith. A belief. Not science.

Until you show me a test that can measurably demonstrate there is no creator, creationism isn’t a science.

164 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:54:26pm

Kangaroo teleportation.

165 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:55:28pm
166 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:56:15pm

Goalposts! Keep moving ‘em! Like the old Shell Game!

167 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:56:16pm
168 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:56:32pm

Heh. Dawkins macaque.

169 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:56:33pm

re: #158 Charles Johnson

My personal favorite old earth evidence is magnetic field reversals in oceanic crust spreading out from mid ocean ridges and the Hawaiian Island — Emperor Seamount chain.

You’d have to be an idiot to look at that and cling to young earth creationism.

170 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:56:54pm

That audience is not getting a single word Nye is saying.

171 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:56:59pm

I sense many headaches in the audience.

172 Belafon  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:57:12pm
173 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:57:28pm

re: #170 Charles Johnson

That audience is not getting a single word Nye is saying.

“Is he supposed to be some sort of teacher or somethin’?”

174 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:57:31pm

re: #170 Charles Johnson

I think he may have scored with the kangaroo question.

175 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:57:33pm

re: #167 Gus

[Embedded content]

That is a big part of Ham’s argument. If you replace God with evolution, civilization literally goes to Hell.

176 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:58:20pm

So, Bill Nye started out as an engineer. Interesting.

177 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:58:36pm
178 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:58:44pm

“God put them there.”

179 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:59:37pm
180 Amory Blaine  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 4:59:51pm

“Extraordinary”. Very diplomatic of him.

181 Amory Blaine  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:00:18pm

I saw a girl rolling her eyes and twirling her hair.

182 TedStriker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:00:21pm

re: #176 Justanotherhuman

So, Bill Nye started out as an engineer. Interesting.

For Boeing, IIRC.

183 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:00:42pm

God showed Noah how to build the ark. duh.

184 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:00:45pm

“God helped Noah build the strongest biggest boat ever. That’s why!”

185 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:01:55pm

:D

186 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:02:05pm

Where did they bus this audience in from, the local Wal-Mart?

187 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:02:32pm

re: #175 aagcobb

That is a big part of Ham’s argument. If you replace God with evolution, civilization literally goes to Hell.

That’s the Creationist argument in general.

188 abolitionist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:02:46pm

“Fundamental understanding of gravity…”

Flag on the play!

189 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:02:57pm

re: #186 Targetpractice

Where did they bus this audience in from, the local Wal-Mart?

It’s being held at the Creation Museum - pretty good bet they’re all from the local churches.

190 TedStriker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:03:54pm

re: #189 Charles Johnson

It’s being held at the Creation Museum - pretty good bet they’re all from the local churches.

I’m sure a little screening of the audience members above and beyond that occurred as well.

191 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:04:04pm
192 calochortus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:04:21pm

I was going to watch this. Really, I was. Mercifully I have been saved from that fate (other than about 5 minutes) by the fact I keep getting interrupted by the phone, by needing to run over and pick my husband up, and shortly I need to go start dinner. Actually it’s probably a good thing. I don’t know that I could have stood it.

193 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:04:22pm

Yep, most people in Kentucky are watching the game, not this crap.

194 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:04:57pm
195 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:04:59pm

What might help is a litany, the long litany of religious scholars and officials (like the pope) that have accepted evolution and science. Same as they accepted earth orbiting sun, and how the calendar needed to change to the Gregorian calendar. they don’t pine for the old calendar which would put Christmas in summer now do they?


“Traditional fish sex” & “chin strokers” in the same breath . ROFL!

196 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:06:33pm

re: #189 Charles Johnson

It’s being held at the Creation Museum - pretty good bet they’re all from the local churches.

Yegods, backwoods Kentucky. Real brain trust territory there.///

197 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:06:43pm

“Sex on their Ow” Love to see a crowd shot of that moment!

198 Feline Fearless Leader  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:06:45pm

re: #195 Political Atheist

What might help is a litany, the loong litany of religious scholars and officials (like the pope) that have accepted evolution and science. Same as they accepted earth orbiting sun, and how the calendar needed to change to the Gregorian calendar. they don’t pine for the old calendar which would put Christmas in summer now do they?

“Traditional fish sex” & “chin strokers” in the same breath . ROFL!

But why would a scientist resort to an argument from authority?

199 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:06:46pm

re: #186 Targetpractice

Where did they bus this audience in from, the local Wal-Mart?

Local Southern Baptist Churches, most likely. We really like our deep fried food.

200 kirkspencer  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:07:04pm

re: #195 Political Atheist

What might help is a litany, the long litany of religious scholars and officials (like the pope) that have accepted evolution and science. Same as they accepted earth orbiting sun, and how the calendar needed to change to the Gregorian calendar. they don’t pine for the old calendar which would put Christmas in summer now do they?

“Traditional fish sex” & “chin strokers” in the same breath . ROFL!

Sadly, some do.

201 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:07:32pm

Teehee!

202 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:07:42pm

Bill should ask why most Christians aren’t Young Earth creationists.

203 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:08:07pm
204 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:08:30pm

re: #198 Feline Fearless Leader

But why would a scientist resort to an argument from authority?

Why not/ Every argument they have on their side is from church authority. Undermine the thinking.

205 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:08:43pm
206 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:08:51pm

Youtube Video

207 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:08:56pm
208 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:09:55pm

Neil deGrasse Tyson would have never subjected himself to this bullshit.

209 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:09:57pm

re: #204 Political Atheist

Why not/ Every argument they have on their side is from church authority. Undermine the thinking.

Most of these rubes are anti-Catholic only slightly less than they are anti- everything else. Appealing to that authority is a non-starter.

210 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:10:01pm
211 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:10:10pm

Several soccer fields? Like this crowd knows how long a soccer field is.

212 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:10:21pm

re: #113 TedStriker

My fear is that Ham is going to “win” this “debate” against Nye, with his skillful use of Gish Gallops; this is going to embolden him and the rest of his ilk.

Of course he’s going to win. Nye is an idiot for lending respectability to this buffoon, as I’ve been saying since the first time I heard this was going to happen.

213 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:10:24pm
214 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:10:34pm

Bill should explain light wavelengths and the science behind determining how far away stars and galaxies are and challenge Ham to explain how the math is wrong or how would he otherwise account for stars being billions of light years away.

215 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:10:46pm

re: #209 EPR-radar

Is the calendar just an authority? Nope.

216 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:11:00pm

re: #194 Gus

The same Bible that justifies slavery is racially correct?

217 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:11:04pm

I just can’t even…

218 TedStriker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:11:38pm

re: #212 Skip Intro

Of course he’s going to win. Nye is an idiot for lending respectability to this buffoon, as I’ve been saying since the first time I heard this was going to happen.

It’s easy to win when you’ve rigged the game, as Ham has.

219 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:11:51pm

re: #158 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Whatever the question, the correct answer is God.

It’s so simple.

220 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:12:24pm

re: #200 kirkspencer

Sadly, some do.

More details please. This is a kind of idiocy I haven’t heard of before.

221 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:12:58pm
222 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:13:08pm

re: #200 kirkspencer

Sadly, some do.

New one on me but hey it’s a big wide world.

223 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:13:11pm

re: #208 Justanotherhuman

Neil deGrasse Tyson would have never subjected himself to this bullshit.

I would’ve paid money to see Richard Dawkins eviscerate Ham, though.

224 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:13:21pm

re: #200 kirkspencer

Sadly, some do.

BOB HOPE: Some park.
GIRL: Some park.
BOB HOPE: Some grass.
GIRL: Some grass.
BOB HOPE: Some dew.
GIRL: I don’t. (walks away)

225 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:13:26pm

Does the audience know the meaning of “extant”, Bill?

I don’t think so…

226 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:14:36pm

re: #215 Political Atheist

Is the calendar just an authority? Nope.

More to the point, fundamentalists of this sort don’t accept any authority but their own. They will use arguments from authority for propaganda BS, as Ham has done, but will never accept counter-arguments in the same mode.

227 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:14:38pm

Facts pashaw! You can prove anything you want with facts!

//

228 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:14:53pm

Why thank you Bill for getting to the science behind determining the age of stars.

229 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:15:15pm
230 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:15:26pm

“Darwin was a racist!”

Maybe he was but evolutionary science is not based on his personal authority. This is a difficult concept for inherently authoritarian fundies and creo-liars, but it is true nonetheless.
Suppose we found an irrefutably genuine letter from Darwin in which he admitted to being the shaman of a secret druid cult that worshiped a golden ass and sacrificed virgins to Chtulhu. Suppose he went on to confess that all this evolution talk was just a way to make money to pay off teenage prostitutes and the ingenious procurers who managed to find enough virgins for his rituals.
Such a letter would create a sensation, not least among Lovecraft fans who have imagined that their guy discovered Cthulhu.
It would NOT, however, change one fact in the enormously extensive body of peer-reviewed research that constitutes the real basis of evolutionary science.

231 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:15:50pm

Audience: This is really too complicated. Easier to just believe in magik.

232 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:16:09pm

re: #223 Lidane

I would’ve paid money to see Richard Dawkins eviscerate Ham, though.

Dawkins doesn’t dignify these circuses with his presence. He’ll debate dignified Church of England ministers about the existence of God (heck the Church of England barely believes in God anymore anyway), but he isn’t about to get on stage with a buffoon like Ham.

233 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:16:21pm

Boom!

234 kirkspencer  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:16:42pm

re: #220 EPR-radar

More details please. This is a kind of idiocy I haven’t heard of before.

The google phrase you’ll want is “revised julian calendar”. You’re going to find some reasoned explanations as to why going to the Gregorian calendar was wrong, that the Julian calendar is better and just needs a minor adjustment.

and I’m not going to link for the same reason i don’t tend to link flat-earthers or creationists. Don’t like to feed the trolls, especially not by going to their lairs.

235 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:16:44pm
236 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:17:07pm

re: #231 Justanotherhuman

Audience: This is really too complicated. Easier to just believe in magik.

Exactly. When you know nothing, the supernatural wins every time.

237 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:17:34pm
238 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:17:39pm

re: #232 aagcobb

Dawkins doesn’t dignify these circuses with his presence. He’ll debate dignified Church of England ministers about the existence of God (heck the Church of England barely believes in God anymore anyway), but he is about to get on stage with a buffoon like Ham.

Yeah, I know. But it would’ve been great.

239 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:17:41pm

re: #228 JeffM70

Why thank you Bill for getting to science behind determining the age of stars.

Interesting. That’s more ambitious than I would have tried. My first instinct would be to focus on something simpler like plate tectonics, measured rates of plate motion, and features such as the Hawaii/Emperor seamounts that amply suffice to blow up the 6,000 year old Earth model.

240 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:17:49pm

Rebutal: ATHEISTS, DARWIN, EUGENICS, ABORTION, GAY MARRIAGE, GOD, THE BIBLE SAYS SO, NAZIS, HISTORICAL ORIGINS, SEX, DRUGS, HEROIN, RACISM, SLAVERY!

241 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:19:24pm

re: #240 Gus

Rebutal: ATHEISTS, DARWIN, EUGENICS, ABORTION, GAY MARRIAGE, GOD, THE BIBLE SAYS SO, NAZIS, HISTORICAL ORIGINS, SEX, DRUGS, HEROIN, RACISM, SLAVERY!

242 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:20:10pm

basalt lava flow Dumb fuck.

243 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:20:48pm
244 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:21:02pm

re: #238 Lidane

Yeah, I know. But it would’ve been great.

That wouldn’t work because science is hard. You can’t explain it in soundbites.

Nye may as well be debating someone who believes Harry Potter was a biography.

245 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:21:13pm

Meanwhile on Teh Twitters:

246 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:21:43pm

This is a dumb rebuttal.

247 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:21:51pm

248 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:21:59pm

re: #239 EPR-radar

It’s basically the speed of light and geometry.

249 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:22:12pm
250 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:22:23pm

WTF does Ham know about dating methods?

How many women has he dated, anyway?

251 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:22:50pm

re: #234 kirkspencer

The google phrase you’ll want is “revised julian calendar”. You’re going to find some reasoned explanations as to why going to the Gregorian calendar was wrong, that the Julian calendar is better and just needs a minor adjustment.

and I’m not going to link for the same reason i don’t tend to link flat-earthers or creationists. Don’t like to feed the trolls, especially not by going to their lairs.

Thanks for the link. The wikipedia description seems harmless enough —- the Orthodox church needs to change their calendar if they don’t want Christmas in July, and the revised Julian calendar seems to be one proposal for fixing things up.

I imagine it must have mutated into something more derpy in the far corners of the internet.

252 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:22:51pm

re: #244 Skip Intro

That wouldn’t work because science is hard. You can’t explain it in soundbites.

Nye may as well be debating someone who believes Harry Potter was a biography.

Good point. These creationist dipshits think The Flintstones was a documentary.

253 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:23:44pm

Bill Nye is actually doing much better than I thought he would. Big ups to Bill.

But it won’t matter. All the logic in the universe won’t convince creationists. It’s not about logic.

254 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:24:04pm

re: #248 JeffM70

It’s basically the speed of light and geometry.

That only gets you to an age if you have a distance scale, which is a nontrivial thing to determine.

255 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:24:25pm

re: #253 Charles Johnson

Bill Nye is actually doing much better than I thought he would. Big ups to Bill.

But it won’t matter. All the logic in the universe won’t convince creationists. It’s not about logic.

It’s about throwing as much chaff into the air and then saying that the “doubt” it creates is enough to say that science is “unreliable.”

256 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:24:25pm
257 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:24:51pm

re: #253 Charles Johnson

Bill Nye is actually doing much better than I thought he would. Big ups to Bill.

But it won’t matter. All the logic in the universe won’t convince creationists. It’s not about logic.

“God” can disprove anything.

258 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:25:31pm

Does that audience really understand the speed of light? They probably think astrology is the study of space.

259 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:26:11pm

re: #253 Charles Johnson

Bill Nye is actually doing much better than I thought he would. Big ups to Bill.

But it won’t matter. All the logic in the universe won’t convince creationists. It’s not about logic.

Oddly enough, an old term of art from religious disputes comes to mind here: “invincible ignorance”.

This is the foundation of US creationism.

260 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:26:16pm

“God was the only witness.”

“You’re a moron.”

261 Killgore Trout  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:26:16pm

WaPo factchecker: No, CBO did not say Obamacare will kill 2 million jobs

262 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:27:23pm

re: #261 Killgore Trout

WaPo factchecker: No, CBO did not say Obamacare will kill 2 million jobs

Wow, Kessler found himself a wingnut lie he couldn’t make an excuse for.

263 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:27:45pm

Lots of shit can get encased in a lava flow. Dumb.

264 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:27:56pm

Gah. The “laws of logic” are descriptive, not prescriptive.

265 Killgore Trout  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:28:18pm

re: #261 Killgore Trout

WaPo factchecker: No, CBO did not say Obamacare will kill 2 million jobs

The various versions of the faulty story are now at the top spot on google news news.google.com

266 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:28:41pm

re: #240 Gus

Rebutal: ATHEISTS, DARWIN, EUGENICS, ABORTION, GAY MARRIAGE, GOD, THE BIBLE SAYS SO, NAZIS, HISTORICAL ORIGINS, SEX, DRUGS, HEROIN, RACISM, SLAVERY!

HEROIN, RACISM, SLAVERY, DRUGS, NAZIS, NAZIS, NAZIS, NAZIS,

SEX, DRUGS, MARRIAGE, GOD, NAZIS, NAZIS, NAZIS

267 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:28:47pm
268 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:29:28pm

Can we get back to the fish sex already?

269 Killgore Trout  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:29:58pm

re: #262 Targetpractice

Wow, Kessler found himself a wingnut lie he couldn’t make an excuse for.

It also seems politifact found a claim by an opponent of the Fla drug testing law is true
Florida shelled out more money for drug testing than it saved by denying welfare benefits to people who tested positive for drugs.
Facts can be friends.

270 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:30:40pm

re: #265 Killgore Trout

The various versions of the faulty story are now at the top spot on google news news.google.com

it’s all over the entire internet even as we type

urk

271 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:31:28pm

Who says it couldn’t happen? SCIENCE, you fucking idiot!

272 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:31:36pm

More Gish gallop…

Yech.

273 freetoken  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:32:02pm

This is sad.

274 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:32:31pm

re: #237 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

The GOP is really an alliance of conmen out to shear the sheep. The fundies promote the culture war to bring in donations. The gun and ammo manufacturers promote gun confiscation paranoia to sell their goods. Big Energy promotes climate change denialism. The corporations and one percenters promote “trickle down” economics to get their big tax cuts. And the hawks promote Islamophobia for the military contracts. I can’t think of a single major GOP faction which isn’t about lying for money.

275 Killgore Trout  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:32:32pm

results show about 635 mostly faulty MSM headlines
news.google.com

276 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:32:42pm
277 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:33:02pm
278 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:33:06pm
279 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:33:29pm

That really is the entire creationist argument, boiled down to a single sentence: “Who says it couldn’t happen?” If you consider yourself a scientist and your approach to science is to say “Who says it couldn’t happen?,” then you’re a dishonest asshole.

280 Killgore Trout  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:33:33pm

re: #270 dog philosopher

it’s all over the entire internet even as we type

urk

I’m just noticing that. That’s pretty bad.

281 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:34:35pm

re: #276 Pie-onist Overlord

[Embedded content]

More inverse appeal to authority, predicated on a strawman. Standard fundy tactic.

282 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:35:33pm
283 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:35:47pm
284 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:36:05pm

“…evidence around them.” Yes, evidence. Something Ham doesn’t have.

285 freetoken  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:36:31pm

I would not go into my local mental health hospital and start “debating” those suffering from severe delusions.

286 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:36:35pm
287 CuriousLurker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:36:46pm

I tried, but I can’t stomach this absurd scientists stole our science whining. Some evil Other™ is always robbing them of things they sanctimoniously claim to be rightfully theirs.

It’s all theme parks, TV shows, seminars, books, fancy houses & cars, swimming pools, private jets… it’s all SO un-Christlike it makes me want to puke. How much can we bilk our followers out of this month?

Can you imagine Mary & Joseph showing up in today’s America?? No, I mean really. Think about it: A brown, ethnic looking, foreign couple that doesn’t speak English. The pregnant female unwed. These freaking grifters wouldn’t give them the time of day except maybe to slut-shame Mary (r.a.) and accuse the two of them of being lazy welfare leeches undeserving of a bed for the night or medical care lest they destroy these assholes’ precious notion of “their” America.

Okay, time to go do something else. Still, after all these years, I don’t cope well with fundies. G’nite, lizards.

288 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:36:49pm

re: #282 Gus

[Embedded content]

Neil is a sexy beast. : )

289 wrenchwench  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:36:53pm

Good. He mentioned Christians with opinions different from Ham’s.

290 freetoken  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:37:28pm

5 minutes… I’ve seen enough.

291 Dave In Austin  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:37:29pm

Bwhahaha!!!

292 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:37:42pm

Every time a creo liar opens his mouth, I see this country’s standing and potential go down a notch.

293 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:37:43pm

Oh God, questions from the audience. GIVE ME STRENGTH!!!

294 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:37:47pm

re: #279 Targetpractice

That really is the entire creationist argument, boiled down to a single sentence: “Who says it couldn’t happen?” If you consider yourself a scientist and your approach to science is to say “Who says it couldn’t happen?,” then you’re a dishonest asshole.

Precisely.

As a matter of philosophy, an omnipotent creator could have created everything 6,000 years ago (making it all look older). Of course, there’s nothing special about 6,000 years here, and 6 minutes ago is equally valid as a matter of logic.

Creationism goes off the rails when its supporters pretend that there is empirical evidence for their preferred fable and try to pass it off as science.

295 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:37:50pm

I’m drinking if I hear the word “gap.”

296 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:38:28pm

re: #293 Targetpractice

Oh God, questions from the audience. GOD GIVE ME STRENGTH!!!

FTFY ;)

297 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:39:15pm

re: #287 CuriousLurker

I tried, but I can’t stomach this absurd scientists stole our science whining. Some evil OtherTM is always robbing them of things they sanctimoniously claim to be rightfully theirs.

It’s all theme parks, TV shows, seminars, books, fancy houses & cars, swimming pools, private jets… it’s all SO un-Christlike it makes me want to puke. How much can we bilk our followers out of this month?

Can you imagine Mary & Joseph showing up in today’s America?? No, I mean really. Think about it: A brown, ethnic looking, foreign couple that doesn’t speak English. The pregnant female unwed. These freaking grifters wouldn’t give them the time of day except maybe to slut-shame Mary (r.a.) and accuse the two of them of being lazy welfare leeches undeserving of a bed for the night or medical care lest they destroy these assholes’ precious notion of “their” America.

Okay, time to go do something else. Still, after all these years, I don’t cope well with fundies. G’nite, lizards.

If the second coming were to occur in the US, Jesus would get the needle in TX for a crime he didn’t commit.

298 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:39:24pm

“Observational science,” i.e. “Shit we change on the fly to keep our faith intact.”

299 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:39:27pm

re: #295 jaunte

I’m drinking if I hear the word “gap.”

Let me know if Nye is asked if we evolved from monkeys why are there still monkeys.

300 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:40:16pm

Question for Mr. Ham: Who created God?

301 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:40:37pm

O.o

302 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:40:55pm

re: #300 Skip Intro

Question for Mr. Ham: Who created God?

Simpler challenge: Prove God exists.

303 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:41:05pm
304 Dr Lizardo  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:41:38pm

re: #292 Shiplord Kirel

Every time a creo liar opens his mouth, I see this country’s standing and potential go down a notch.

My Czech friend has been rather lively watching this, though I’m quite sure it’s past her bedtime. She’s been letting a stream of Czech invective on how astonishingly stupid Ken Ham is, and she’s convinced that whole swathes of American society are cretinous fools.

She’s flabbergasted, to say the least.

305 wrenchwench  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:41:42pm

Ham’s just proselytizing.

306 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:41:49pm

re: #302 Targetpractice

Simpler challenge: Prove God exists.

The real question: If there was nothing before God created the universe, then where was God?

307 makeitstop  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:42:06pm

re: #270 dog philosopher

it’s all over the entire internet even as we type

urk

I heard it on NYC news radio while I was out today.

My news stations often report wingnut news now. It depresses me.

308 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:42:16pm
309 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:42:29pm

OK. Dinner is ready and I’m off to watch Agents of SHIELD. Back later.

310 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:43:01pm

re: #304 Dr Lizardo

She’s been letting a stream of Czech invective on how astonishingly stupid Ken Ham is, and she’s convinced that whole swathes of American society are cretinous fools.

She’s flabbergasted, to say the least.

Your friend is correct.

311 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:43:20pm

What it comes down to is this. Science has demonstrated the earth to be nearly 5 billion years old. We’ve tested rocks from the moon to be 3 billion years old. We’ve tested the age of meteorites at more than 6000 years old. We’ve tested the speed of light and using math and light wavelength shifts have shown stars to be millions of light-years away. All of this evidence stacks on each other to show the universe is more than 6,000 years old. To Ken Ham, why are these observations wrong and what observable and testable evidence can you provide to support the Bible and your claim the Earth is 6000 years old?

312 GeneJockey  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:43:41pm

re: #276 Pie-onist Overlord

[Embedded content]

A thing is true or not regardless of who says it, and whether that person has always been correct about everything. Evolution does not hinge on Darwin’s beliefs.

313 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:43:43pm

Life here began out there, so says the ancient teachings of Kobol.

314 Killgore Trout  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:44:34pm

Interesting. I think this explains why Walmart supported ACA through contributions to groups like Center for American Progress. From WaPo….

One big issue: the health insurance subsidies in the law. That’s a substantial benefit that decreases as people earn more money, so at a certain point, a person has to choose between earning more money or continuing to get the maximum help with health insurance payments. In other words, people might work longer and harder, but actually earn no more, or earn even less, money. That is a disincentive to work. (The same thing happens when people qualify for food stamps or other social services.)

Thus, some people might decide to work part-time, not full time, in order to keep getting health-care subsidies. Thus, they are reducing their supply of labor to the market. Other people near retirement age might decide they no longer need to hold onto their job just because it provides health insurance, and they also leave the work force.

Look at this way: If someone says they decided to leave their job for personal reasons, most people would not say they “lost” their jobs. They simply decided not to work.

Low paid part time workers get insurance through government subsidies, not employer contributions.

315 wrenchwench  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:44:44pm

Later, lizards.

316 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:44:51pm

Oye.

317 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:44:57pm
318 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:46:16pm

re: #311 JeffM70

What it comes down to is this. Science has demonstrated the earth to be nearly 5 billion years old. We’ve tested rocks from the moon to be 3 billion years old. We’ve tested the age of meteorites at more than 6000 years old. We’ve tested the speed of light and using math and light wavelength shifts have shown stars to be millions of light-years away. All of this evidence stacks on each other to show the universe is more than 6,000 years old. To Ken Ham, why are these observations wrong and what observable and testable evidence can you provide to support the Bible and your claim the Earth is 6000 years old?

They are wrong because the scientists made the error of interpreting the evidence atheistically. If you interpret the evidence with the knowledge that the Bible is infallible, and literally true, then you can reach the correct conclusion that the earth is 6,000 years old.//

319 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:46:16pm

re: #311 JeffM70

To Ken Ham, why are these observations wrong and what observable and testable evidence can you provide to support the Bible and your claim the Earth is 6000 years old?

Ham would reply that God’s word is good enough for him, so no evidence or proof is required. In fact, the odds are that you’re an agent of Satan for asking such a question, and he’ll pray for your soul.

320 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:46:48pm

Predictions, you dipshit!

321 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:48:41pm

Derp.

Conflicting “Ages” of Tertiary Basalt and Contained Fossilized
Wood, Crinum, Central Queensland, Australia
Andrew A. Snelling, PhD,*
Answers In Genesis, PO Box 6302, Acacia Ridge, DC, Queensland, Australia, 4110.

PDF

322 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:49:16pm
323 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:51:14pm
324 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:51:19pm

Solipsist.

325 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:51:22pm

So Ham’s a one joke pony, “There’s a book out there…”

326 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:51:30pm

The point of life is life itself. So stupid.

327 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:52:22pm

“I’m a christian” explains everything to Ham.

Idiot.

328 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:52:26pm

Shorter answer: Nothing Ham can be presented with will ever make him change his beliefs.

329 freetoken  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:52:44pm

Nye’s lack of knowledge about the Bible and the history of Christianity is probably keeping him from giving the real answers that would make Ham blink.

For example:

Camel archaeology contradicts the Bible

It’s been known for some time that stories in the OT placing camels in the Levant during and before “David” were inaccurate. This is just one more piece of evidence. The OT compilers (“redactors”) during the 4th and 3rd century BCE wrote in stories based on their surroundings, not those of a millennium earlier.

If Nye knew this stuff, his approach would be much simpler: Ham is just ignorant of the Bible and a Bible scholar could point that out in a minute.

330 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:53:08pm

Ham is making it very clear that creationism is religion.

331 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:53:22pm

Life is according to the CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN bible.

332 TedStriker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:53:24pm

re: #287 CuriousLurker

I tried, but I can’t stomach this absurd scientists stole our science whining. Some evil OtherTM is always robbing them of things they sanctimoniously claim to be rightfully theirs.

It’s all theme parks, TV shows, seminars, books, fancy houses & cars, swimming pools, private jets… it’s all SO un-Christlike it makes me want to puke. How much can we bilk our followers out of this month?

Can you imagine Mary & Joseph showing up in today’s America?? No, I mean really. Think about it: A brown, ethnic looking, foreign couple that doesn’t speak English. The pregnant female unwed. These freaking grifters wouldn’t give them the time of day except maybe to slut-shame Mary (r.a.) and accuse the two of them of being lazy welfare leeches undeserving of a bed for the night or medical care lest they destroy these assholes’ precious notion of “their” America.

Okay, time to go do something else. Still, after all these years, I don’t cope well with fundies. G’nite, lizards.

Something for RWNJ “Christians” to think about: Jesus was the ultimate “anchor baby”.

333 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:53:24pm

Ken Ham: We are made in God’s image.

Bill: God is eternal, timeless, changeless, infinite, immaterial, omniscient, omnipotent, ominbenevolent, perfect and non-contigent. We are none of those things. How exactly are we made in God’s image?

334 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:53:48pm

“As a Christian.”

335 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:54:31pm

re: #328 Targetpractice

Shorter answer: Nothing Ham can be presented with will ever make him change his beliefs.

Of course not; Ham literally believes his very salvation depends upon him not changing his beliefs.

336 freetoken  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:54:38pm

As far as I am convinced, the only “debate” with creationism is whether creationists’ delusions ought to be enough to classify them so they can get mental health help.

337 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:55:06pm
338 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:55:27pm

re: #333 JeffM70

Ken Ham: We are made in God’s image.

Bill: God is eternal, timeless, changeless, infinite, immaterial, omniscient, omnipotent, ominbenevolent, perfect and non-contigent. We are none of those things. How exactly are we made in God’s image?

Ham: Well, maybe you aren’t, Bill, but I am.

339 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:55:27pm

CS Lewis, who debated scientists himself, would hang his head in shame at Ham’s tactics and his presentation of Christian faith.

340 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:56:03pm
341 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:57:35pm

Christian. God. Bible. Christian. God. Bible.

342 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:57:35pm

re: #339 Shiplord Kirel

The snake oil salesmen of the 19th century are the Ken Hams and Pat Robertsons and Bryan Fischers (add in a few thousand more) of today.

343 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:58:18pm

My question for Ken Ham: “Can I slap your silly face?”

344 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:58:21pm
Ancient rocks exceeding 3.5 billion years in age are found on all of Earth’s continents. The oldest rocks on Earth found so far are the Acasta Gneisses in northwestern Canada near Great Slave Lake (4.03 Ga) and the Isua Supracrustal rocks in West Greenland (3.7 to 3.8 Ga), but well-studied rocks nearly as old are also found in the Minnesota River Valley and northern Michigan (3.5-3.7 billion years), in Swaziland (3.4-3.5 billion years), and in Western Australia (3.4-3.6 billion years). [See Editor’s Note.] These ancient rocks have been dated by a number of radiometric dating methods and the consistency of the results give scientists confidence that the ages are correct to within a few percent.
pubs.usgs.gov
345 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 5:59:43pm

I haven’t watched Ken Ham for this long continuously before. I’m now convinced more than ever that he’s a charlatan. And I was already very convinced of that.

346 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:00:03pm
347 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:00:05pm

You’re not an expert at any subject, Ken, other than repeating “I’m a christian” like some kind of deranged puppet.

348 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:00:24pm

Because floods are magic.

349 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:00:24pm

re: #345 Charles Johnson

I haven’t watched Ken Ham for this long continuously before. I’m now convinced more than ever that he’s a charlatan. And I was already very convinced of that.

I’m convinced that he missed his calling as a televangelist.

350 freetoken  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:00:53pm

re: #349 Targetpractice

I’m convinced that he missed his calling as a televangelist.

He is a televangelist.

351 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:02:46pm

re: #350 freetoken

He is a televangelist.

Which shows how much attention I’ve paid this man.

352 Backwoods_Sleuth  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:04:35pm

Freezing rain here and ice is building up a bit, so I’m going to shut down the computer for now.
Hope to return sooner than later…

353 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:04:35pm

One of the earlier televangelists/con men, and he freely admitted it.

He raked in millions.

354 BongCrodny  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:04:49pm

re: #128 Pie-onist Overlord

Evolutionists believe you evolved from a monkey slogging through primordial ooze. Creationists believe you were created in God’s image. — Todd Starnes

If I was created in God’s image, and if I were gay, wouldn’t that be a contradiction?

I don’t recall God having a wife.

355 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:04:51pm

That was one of the worst explanations of the Second Law of Thermodynamics I’ve heard, Bill.

356 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:04:57pm

Christian. God. Bible. Christian. God. Bible.

357 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:05:25pm

Oh, fuck you, Ken Ham. Women produce life every single day. Every single hour. Every single minute.

358 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:05:28pm

re: #356 Gus

Sin.

359 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:05:30pm

Wut?

360 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:05:57pm

Christian. God. Bible. Christian. God. Bible.

361 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:06:09pm

Sin.

362 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:06:23pm

Christian. God. Bible. Sin.

363 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:06:35pm

Translation: “So long as I can refuse to acknowledge the means to prove the age of the Earth, I can keep asserting that it’s young!”

364 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:06:39pm

Authentic creationist gibberish.

365 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:07:55pm

Shorter Ham: If you believe in the fossil record, you’re not a Christian.

366 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:08:01pm

Obviously, I’m not actually watching this. Is it still going on? Is it a preview of what the 2016 GOP primary debates are going to be like?

367 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:08:36pm

re: #366 Skip Intro

Obviously, I’m not actually watching this. Is it still going on?

They’re still rockin’ the Creation Museum.

368 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:10:59pm

Christian. God. Bible. Sin.

369 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:11:01pm

Basically, Ham wants people to suspend any trust in science education and believe what he says.

370 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:11:42pm

Babbling.

371 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:12:05pm

The Bible and science go “hand in hand”? I’m sure Galileo will be heartened to hear that.

372 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:12:34pm

Define literally!

Help.

373 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:12:39pm

First, redefine “literally.”

374 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:13:02pm

I hate to break it to you, but literally and naturally are not the same thing, Ken.

375 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:13:23pm

Squid ink!

376 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:14:12pm

Cripes.

377 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:14:27pm

re: #374 Justanotherhuman

I hate to break it to you, but literally and naturally are not the same thing, Ken.

Forget it, he’s rolling.

378 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:15:03pm

Literal poetry, LOL.

379 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:15:38pm

The laws of logic and the law of uniformity do not exist objectively in external reality, Ken. In an empty universe devoid of all objects, they would not exist as there would be no one to apply them and nothing to apply them to.

380 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:15:56pm

I have to retract my earlier doubts that Bill Nye would handle this well. Apart from the issue of whether he should have done it at all, he’s doing great.

381 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:16:56pm

re: #380 Charles Johnson

I have to retract my earlier doubts that Bill Nye would handle this well. Apart from the issue of whether he should have done it at all, he’s doing great.

Yes, I agree, but I’m afraid some of it is flying over the heads of the audience.

382 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:17:17pm
383 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:18:09pm

Christian. God. Bible. Sin.

384 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:19:16pm

Bill Nye has amazing self-control.

385 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:19:25pm

re: #355 JeffM70

That was one of the worst explanations of the Second Law of Thermodynamics I’ve heard, Bill.

That’s not an easy topic, especially when the pump has been primed by creationist lies relating to it.

386 Decatur Deb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:19:47pm

re: #258 Justanotherhuman

Does that audience really understand the speed of light? They probably think astrology is the study of space.

The sad part is that half of them found their way to the debate using a GPS.

387 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:19:52pm

CHRISTIAN!

388 Belafon  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:20:49pm

re: #384 jaunte

He didn’t go into this blind. Remember, he’s the one who wrote the article about how parents who teach their kids creationism were bad parents.

389 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:21:05pm

Wait. It’s not about God. It’s about CHRISTIAN!

390 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:21:06pm

JUST NAME ONE NON CHRISTIAN SCIENTIST THAT I HAVE EVER HEARD OF!!!

//

391 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:21:33pm

The ol’ presuppositional trick, that atheists can argue God doesn’t exist is proof God exists because they are presupposing his existence whether they know it or not.

392 sagehen  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:22:08pm

re: #365 jaunte

Shorter Ham: If you believe in the fossil record, you’re not a Christian.

This is one of Slacktivist’s recurring themes, the house of cards built upon a particularly weird (and relatively recent) reading of scripture; it comes down to, “if evolution is real, Jesus doesn’t love you.”

If Adam and Eve and Cain and Abel weren’t actual real people who did exactly as described, if the snake didn’t talk, if there weren’t platypuses and kangaroos on Noah’s ark, if Joshua’s trumpet didn’t stop the Earth’s rotation, if any single detail of history didn’t happen exactly as their interpretation of their preferred translation of their selected portions of scripture suggests… then there’s no God and there’s no reason not to shoot people in traffic because there’s no hell and life is meaningless.

393 sagehen  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:23:09pm

re: #390 b.d.

JUST NAME ONE NON CHRISTIAN SCIENTIST THAT I HAVE EVER HEARD OF!!!

//

EINSTEIN!!!

394 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:23:36pm

re: #392 sagehen

It’s amazing that people can carry that burden without going crazy.

395 freetoken  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:24:22pm

Ham wins by default because the purpose of the whole stunt is to get more airtime for his gimmick.

Ham knows that in a nation where only 1/3 of the population accepts the premises of modern science and evolution specifically, and another 1/3 already agree with Ham, all Ham has to do is eat up time on the clock and get more name recognition.

The only way to defeat virulent delusion is to deny it battle.

396 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:24:37pm

re: #307 makeitstop

I heard it on NYC news radio while I was out today.

My news stations often report wingnut news now. It depresses me.

i think wingnut propaganda has become more and more widespread, but i don’t notice any increase in belief in it

remember when reagan used to talk up the “taxes up, economy down - taxes down, economy up” theory? i think people pretty much gave up on that one after 1992

397 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:24:52pm

re: #393 sagehen

EINSTEIN!!!

NEVER HEARD OF HIM!!!

398 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:25:02pm

Never heard so much bullshit in my life.

399 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:25:08pm

Ham didn’t get it.

400 Feline Fearless Leader  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:25:26pm

You thought the lands were safe - but the fishapod was already evolving to get you!

thisviewoflife.com

401 Justanotherhuman  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:25:44pm

re: #399 jaunte

Ham didn’t get it.

He doesn’t want to get it. He wants money.

402 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:25:52pm

Christian. God. Bible. Sin.

403 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:26:03pm

re: #402 Gus

Money.

404 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:26:28pm

Drone!

405 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:26:28pm
406 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:26:34pm

re: #398 Gus

Never heard so much bullshit in my life.

Creationism has evolved into the Platonic Essence of Bullshit. It’s the ur-Bullshit from which all other forms of bullshit derive their existence.

407 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:26:41pm

re: #404 jaunte

Drone!

NSA! :D

408 TedStriker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:26:44pm

re: #403 jaunte

Money.

Is what I want.

/

409 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:26:54pm
410 darthstar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:27:16pm
411 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:27:30pm

Jesus Christ.

412 darthstar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:27:51pm

The Bible borrows from other myths. Other myths don’t borrow from the bible.

413 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:28:34pm

That the Biblical flood story is nearly identical to the much older Sumerian flood story is proof the Bible is right.

414 Dr Lizardo  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:29:06pm

re: #390 b.d.

JUST NAME ONE NON CHRISTIAN SCIENTIST THAT I HAVE EVER HEARD OF!!!

//

Abū ⯺lī al-Ḥusayn ibn ⯺bd Allāh ibn Al-Hasan ibn Ali ibn Sīnā, aka Avicenna.

en.wikipedia.org

415 Romantic Heretic  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:29:16pm

re: #392 sagehen

This is one of Slacktivist’s recurring themes, the house of cards built upon a particularly weird (and relatively recent) reading of scripture; it comes down to, “if evolution is real, Jesus doesn’t love you.”

If Adam and Eve and Cain and Abel weren’t actual real people who did exactly as described, if the snake didn’t talk, if there weren’t platypuses and kangaroos on Noah’s ark, if Joshua’s trumpet didn’t stop the Earth’s rotation, if any single detail of history didn’t happen exactly as their interpretation of their preferred translation of their selected portions of scripture suggests… then there’s no God and there’s no reason not to shoot people in traffic because there’s no hell and life is meaningless.

It’s another way they resemble the Islamists. Both cannot fathom that the universe is a set of interconnected parts and one part can change without any effect, or little effect, on the others.

Instead their world view is so simple that there simply can’t be any challenge to any part of it because there is no ‘part of it.’ It stands as one or falls as one.

No wonder both of them treat thought as sin.

416 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:30:09pm

re: #413 JeffM70

That the Biblical flood story is nearly identical to the much older Sumerian flood story is proof the Bible is right.

I’ve always preferred the simple explanations for flood stories myself.

1) Early civilizations had a marked tendency to develop near rivers.

2) Rivers flood.

QED. Flood stories explained.

417 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:30:50pm

re: #414 Dr Lizardo

Citing Avicenna to a creationist is just rude. +1.

418 chadu  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:30:57pm

re: #409 Kragar

[Embedded content]

Vizzini: I can’t compete with you physically, and you’re no match for my brains.
Man in Black: You’re that smart?
Vizzini: Let me put it this way. Have you ever heard of Plato, Aristotle, Socrates?
Man in Black: Yes.
Vizzini: Morons.

419 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:31:09pm
420 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:31:20pm

How many times did Ham use the word Christian?

421 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:31:21pm

re: #416 EPR-radar

Rivers only flood because God is angry.

422 dog philosopher  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:31:24pm

re: #331 Gus

Life is according to the CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN, CHRISTIAN bible.

it’s a lot like the jewish bible except the exact same words mean something different

423 darthstar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:31:52pm

re: #413 JeffM70

That the Biblical flood story is nearly identical to the much older Sumerian flood story is proof the Bible is right.

That’s the Enuma Elish. Apsu and Tiamat - the sweet water and the bitter water…and the silt which makes the earth. It’s actually a very beautiful poem. Definitely worth the read.

THE FIRST TABLET

When in the height heaven was not named,
And the earth beneath did not yet bear a name,
And the primeval Apsu, who begat them,
And chaos, Tiamut, the mother of them both
Their waters were mingled together,
And no field was formed, no marsh was to be seen;
When of the gods none had been called into being,
And none bore a name, and no destinies were ordained;
Then were created the gods in the midst of heaven,
Lahmu and Lahamu were called into being…
Ages increased,…
Then Ansar and Kisar were created, and over them….
Long were the days, then there came forth…..
Anu, their son,…
Ansar and Anu…
And the god Anu…
Nudimmud, whom his fathers, his begetters…..
Abounding in all wisdom,…’
He was exceeding strong…
He had no rival -
Thus were established and were… the great gods.
But Tiamat and Apsu were still in confusion…
They were troubled and…
In disorder…

sacred-texts.com

424 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:32:08pm

God needs a better publicist.

425 sagehen  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:32:14pm

re: #412 darthstar

The Bible borrows from other myths. Other myths don’t borrow from the bible.

Shakespeare borrows a lot from the Bible…

426 chadu  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:32:32pm

re: #419 Kragar

[Embedded content]

Master of comparative religion, there.

427 JeffM70  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:32:48pm

re: #406 EPR-radar

Creationism has evolved into the Platonic Essence of Bullshit. It’s the ur-Bullshit from which all other forms of bullshit derive their existence.

Which is why Ham kept asking Bill to explain the laws of logic and the law of uniformity if natural processes is correct.

428 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:33:07pm

re: #424 b.d.

God needs a better publicist.

God is cool.

His fanboys are assholes.

429 darthstar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:33:27pm

re: #425 sagehen

Shakespeare borrows a lot from the Bible…

So does William Faulkner.

430 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:33:36pm

re: #419 Kragar

I’m honestly shocked. I expected Ken Ham to be a total pinhead about science etc., but to also be a total pinhead about religion really takes the cake.

Religions almost always have 1) a creation story, and 2) a story about the afterlife.

431 sagehen  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:34:43pm

re: #416 EPR-radar

I’ve always preferred the simple explanations for flood stories myself.

1) Early civilizations had a marked tendency to develop near rivers.

2) Rivers flood.

QED. Flood stories explained.

When the ice age ended, sea level rose by 20 feet. To believe the whole world was underwater…. just think of “my whole world!!” as a figure of speech. See how easy that is?

432 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:35:13pm

re: #430 EPR-radar

I’m honestly shocked. I expected Ken Ham to be a total pinhead about science etc., but to also be a total pinhead about religion really takes the cake.

Religions almost always have 1) a creation story, and 2) a story about the afterlife.

Don’t forget a virgin birth, an unjust death, and a resurrection.

433 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:35:22pm
434 Dr Lizardo  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:35:30pm

re: #419 Kragar

[Embedded content]

lolwut?!

435 b.d.  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:35:37pm

God throwing in that travel advisory worthy snowstorm in at the end was a pretty cool tip of the hat.

436 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:36:23pm

re: #434 Dr Lizardo

lolwut?!

I paraphrased

437 Romantic Heretic  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:36:26pm

re: #428 Kragar

God is cool.

His fanboys are assholes.

I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ. - Mahatma Gandhi

438 Kragar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:36:28pm
439 Dr Lizardo  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:36:42pm

re: #436 Kragar

I paraphrased

OK.

440 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:38:40pm

re: #431 sagehen

When the ice age ended, sea level rose by 20 feet. To believe the whole world was underwater…. just think of “my whole world!!” as a figure of speech. See how easy that is?

Ice damns also broke, flooding huge areas rapidly and deeply.

See articles about the Missoula Floods in this country over a 2000 year period 13000 to 15000 years ago.

441 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:39:06pm

Anything actually interesting in the debate? Or should I just stick to reading my copy of Lewin & Foley’s “Principles of Human Evolution” (2004 edition so it’s slightly dated already) for my Coursera class on Human Evolution: Past and Future before reading Evening Prayer?

442 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:39:50pm

re: #438 Kragar

[Embedded content]

BUT THEY BOTH HAVE APPLES!

//

443 Feline Fearless Leader  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:40:34pm

re: #442 Gus

BUT THEY BOTH HAVE APPLES!

//

Well, a bunch of people think Jobs was a snake. So no surprise there.

444 Killgore Trout  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:40:34pm

WaPo corrected by its own factchecker
Health-care law will prompt over 2 million to quit jobs or cut hours, a CBO report says

Correction:
The headline of an earlier version of this story incorrectly stated the CBO study estimated that health law will result in 2 million fewer jobs. The CBO says the health law will lead to 2 million fewer workers.

445 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:40:51pm

re: #441 William Barnett-Lewis

Anything actually interesting in the debate? Or should I just stick to reading my copy of Lewin & Foley’s “Principles of Human Evolution” (2004 edition so it’s slightly dated already) for my Coursera class on >Human Evolution: Past and Future before reading Evening Prayer?

Certainly not from the creationist side. It seems that Ken Ham’s theology might be just as bad as his science.

446 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:41:10pm

599 RTs!

447 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:41:24pm

re: #443 Feline Fearless Leader

Well, a bunch of people think Jobs was a snake. So no surprise there.

Proof!

448 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:41:55pm
449 chadu  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:43:11pm

Why didn’t they ask THIS?!?!?!

Are Militant Atheists Using Chemtrails to Poison the Angels in Heaven?

harddawn.com

450 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:43:20pm

re: #448 Charles Johnson

He still has a vegetarian T-Rex. This disproves his theology.

451 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:44:24pm

re: #449 chadu

Why didn’t they ask THIS?!?!?!

>Are Militant Atheists Using Chemtrails to Poison the Angels in Heaven?

harddawn.com

Wut?

452 Dr Lizardo  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:45:06pm

re: #440 Skip Intro

Ice damns also broke, flooding huge areas rapidly and deeply.

See articles about the Missoula Floods in this country over a 2000 year period 13000 to 15000 years ago.

Reminds me of the Black Sea Deluge Hypothesis.

453 Lidane  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:45:08pm

So did I miss anything or was it just the usual Creationist fail?

454 TedStriker  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:45:34pm

re: #449 chadu

Why didn’t they ask THIS?!?!?!

>Are Militant Atheists Using Chemtrails to Poison the Angels in Heaven?

harddawn.com

Well, that’s a new angle….

455 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:45:39pm

That’s gotta be satire.

456 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:46:09pm

re: #445 EPR-radar

Certainly not from the creationist side. It seems that Ken Ham’s theology might be just as bad as his science.

No real surprise. Most fundamentalists I’ve known are even more scared by real religious & especially theological education than by science.

457 Skip Intro  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:46:30pm

re: #449 chadu

Why didn’t they ask THIS?!?!?!

>Are Militant Atheists Using Chemtrails to Poison the Angels in Heaven?

harddawn.com

Whole swathes of government have been taken over by academic PhDs with an intense obsession with scientism.

It just keeps getting worser and worser. I think I’m going to develop something similar to a radiation badge to provide a warning when a person is reaching the fatal limit of RWNJ derp for the week (day?). I know it would sure help me.

458 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:48:06pm

re: #455 Gus

That’s gotta be satire.

The video? Nope, it’s straight from the Answers in Genesis YouTube account.

459 ObserverArt  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:48:41pm

I did not watch this as I personally see no reason to. People are going to be as smart or ignorant as they want to be.

But as I watching OSU Buckeye Basketball, I was reading all of your entertaining comments and they alone gave a good play by play.

On point on topic, and I don’t know if Bill Nye used it and or went there, but I always fought fundamentalists with my own simple argument. And remember I was dipped in Catholicism as a kid in school.

If science wasn’t an important key to life and understanding, why did God create the human brain and the desire to want to figure things out? Why did he create science? If he created all, then he sure as hell created science. He created Bill Nye.

If it was all about God creating everything, then he would have created an inherent acceptance that was the one answer to it all. Humans by “creationist” thinking wouldn’t need that aspect to our brains. Yet, there is that built in wonderment and desire to ask and seek why. In a way…maybe science is the path to creation, and if there is a God, then we will through our desire to understand fight hard to find it/him. Therefore nothing, not even creationism and God himself, can be found without the searches for knowledge through science. Scientists to me are way more religious than many a simple person calling themselves a believer in God.

And to me all that goes to everything about the plan of a God. Something as simple as a scientist wanting to know how to stop something like the flu that god put into “creation” and for what purpose. Was it for man to use that inherent wanting to know that man can figure out how to stop the flu and then that type of science leads to understand so much more about man and everything.

Creationism is way too simple. I think even God would expect a lot more out of Mr. Ham. He does his God a disservice. As well as those that also do their God a disservice by listening and accepting the simple Ham. They too deny their brains God gave them.

460 Political Atheist  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:49:53pm

Thinking who might have done much better than Bill Nye.
…

…

…

Got Nothin’

461 chadu  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:50:32pm

re: #451 Gus

Wut?

INORITE, how do atheists learn how to fly a plane?

///

462 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:50:42pm

re: #458 Charles Johnson

The video? Nope, it’s straight from the Answers in Genesis YouTube account.

Oh yeah. That was the opening to the debate. Meant this: harddawn.com

463 aagcobb  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:50:42pm

re: #455 Gus

That’s gotta be satire.

Poe’s Law in action. it looks like satire, but is it really less insane than World News daily?

464 GlutenFreeJesus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:51:12pm

re: #431 sagehen

When the ice age ended, sea level rose by 20 feet. To believe the whole world was underwater…. just think of “my whole world!!” as a figure of speech. See how easy that is?

Reminds me of the movie The Croods (great movie by the way). The father Crood thought the world ended when their cave was destroyed.

465 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:51:20pm

Tidying up operation.

466 Feline Fearless Leader  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:52:22pm

Chasing links about various science-y stuff and came across one that described an interesting way to do a test on Game Theory for a Behavioral Ecology class.

zocalopublicsquare.org

467 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:52:25pm

While we’re on the topic of science.

How is babby formed?

Youtube Video

468 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:53:01pm

re: #463 aagcobb

Poe’s Law in action. it looks like satire, but is it really less insane than World News daily?

I’ve been looking for evidence of satire in that Harddawn derpfest, but so far I’ve got nothing better than the author bio of the derpy article about chemtrails:

Dr. Stephenson Billings is an award-winning Investigative Journalist, Motivational Children’s Party Entertainer and Antique Soda Bottle Collector all in one special, blessed package!

No comment.

469 Charles Johnson  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:54:28pm

re: #462 Gus

Oh yeah. That was the opening to the debate. Meant this: harddawn.com

Looks like one of those “satire” sites that’s deliberately trying to trick people. A very creepy trend.

470 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:55:25pm

Satire.

The Guys Behind Christwire, Creating Parody From ‘Glenn Beck on Steroids’

…The most prolific of the Christwire authors, “Stephenson Billings,” author of the site’s biggest hits like “Is My Husband Gay?” and “The Golden Girls: How One TV Show Turned A Generation Of American Boys Into Homosexuals,” remains stubbornly anonymous. According to a pseudonymous Facebook profile:…

471 Single-handed sailor  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:55:33pm

re: #463 aagcobb

Poe’s Law in action. it looks like satire, but is it really less insane than World News daily?

*goes to read comments on debate at WND*

472 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:56:20pm

re: #449 chadu

Why didn’t they ask THIS?!?!?!

>Are Militant Atheists Using Chemtrails to Poison the Angels in Heaven?

harddawn.com

They’re on to us, Chad. Recall the swarms.

473 Killgore Trout  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:56:27pm

re: #455 Gus

That’s gotta be satire.

Yes, it’s a satire site
“Glory Holing,” The Shocking New Campus Sex Game Putting Young Men at Risk

Dr. Stephenson Billings is an award-winning Investigative Journalist, Motivational Children’s Party Entertainer and Antique Soda Bottle Collector all in one special, blessed package!

From the comments….

James
This is nothing new. I did this in college in the 90’s. glory holes have been around since at least the 50’s. library’s, truck stops, rest areas and shopping malls. jolly good fun if you ask me.

Stephenson_Billings Staff > James


You are one sick puppy. What happens when someone really need the toilets to defecate? Did you gays ever stop once to consider that?

474 chadu  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:58:12pm

re: #470 Gus

Satire.

The Guys Behind Christwire, Creating Parody From ‘Glenn Beck on Steroids’

But a lot of the comments ain’t satire.

Know Fear.

475 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:58:12pm

re: #470 Gus

Nice catch. Some of the commenters there seem to be sincere loons, and this kind of non-obvious satire agitates them, so I think I prefer satire to be flagged more clearly.

476 Single-handed sailor  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 6:59:07pm

Damn, I thought WND was covering it. I could have sworn they were promoting it recently.

477 chadu  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:00:36pm

More on HARDDAWN.COM: THE HARD HARDDAWNENING IS ON (geddit?):

Fuck yeah, man, we have the National Institute of Standards!

freethoughtblogs.com

478 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:00:46pm
479 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:00:55pm

We need more religion.

Cal Smith - The Lord Knows I’m Drinking

Youtube Video

480 blueraven  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:01:57pm

Bill Nye will be on The Last Word with Lawrence O’Donnell tonight.

481 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:01:57pm

re: #476 Single-handed sailor

Damn, I thought WND was covering it. I could have sworn they were promoting it recently.

They tried, but it didn’t have enough BENGHAZI!!1 for their readers.

482 ObserverArt  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:02:27pm

Speaking if science…damn it is snowing hard here in Columbus. Got to be three inches in 2 hours and no stopping in for a few hours by the way the weather maps are looking.

And it looks bad for ice down Backwoods Slueth’s way. Hang in there everyone in this mess…stay warm and hopefully connected to the power grid Slueth!

Later!

483 thedopefishlives  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:02:31pm

Evening (again) Lizardim. So how did things go while I was gone?

484 calochortus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:02:42pm

re: #392 sagehen

This is one of Slacktivist’s recurring themes, the house of cards built upon a particularly weird (and relatively recent) reading of scripture; it comes down to, “if evolution is real, Jesus doesn’t love you.”

If Adam and Eve and Cain and Abel weren’t actual real people who did exactly as described, if the snake didn’t talk, if there weren’t platypuses and kangaroos on Noah’s ark, if Joshua’s trumpet didn’t stop the Earth’s rotation, if any single detail of history didn’t happen exactly as their interpretation of their preferred translation of their selected portions of scripture suggests… then there’s no God and there’s no reason not to shoot people in traffic because there’s no hell and life is meaningless.

Damn. I’m 60, a lifelong atheist and have never shot anyone in traffic or elsewhere. Is it time to start?
But wait, I don’t consider my life meaningless. Is that where I went wrong?

485 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:04:40pm

re: #483 thedopefishlives

Evening (again) Lizardim. So how did things go while I was gone?

Snow, snow, and more damn snow. Chicago’s gonna get another 6 inches form this storm.

486 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:04:45pm

I do not hate Ken Ham. Hate the gobbledegook not the man. ;)

487 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:05:10pm

re: #477 chadu

Ack. I didn’t spot the pun in harddawn.com until I read about it elsewhere. Feeblemindedness is setting in early.

488 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:06:02pm

Of course Ham cannot change his beliefs about this. I am more convinced than ever that he doesn’t believe it himself. He and the other professional creo-liars are quacks, charlatans; in it for money and power. I am also beginning to suspect that only a small percentage of the least intelligent rank and file creo-fools actually believe it. The rest are in it for a backhanded way to attack intellect, justify their indefensible greed and bigotry, and just be general assholes

489 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:07:33pm
490 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:08:46pm

re: #433 jaunte

[Embedded content]

#tcot is just all gun-fucking memes.

491 Targetpractice  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:08:50pm

re: #489 Gus

[Embedded content]

Ham’s entire performance tonight, his entire argument, boils down to one sentence “Who says it couldn’t happen?” Why? Because he denies everybody who says it can’t.

492 Shiplord Kirel  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:09:41pm

re: #489 Gus

[Embedded content]

I think Ham is not telling the truth there either. If the fundy gravy train suddenly ran off the rails and he were reduced to poverty, he might change his mind, especially if it provided him with a new shtick.

493 Mattand  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:09:46pm

re: #484 calochortus

Damn. I’m 60, a lifelong atheist and have never shot anyone in traffic or elsewhere. Is it time to start?
But wait, I don’t consider my life meaningless. Is that where I went wrong?

We’ve been proving how atheists are without hope by shoveling our neighbor with the heart condition’s driveway.

Slowly destroying America with one kind act at a time.

494 thedopefishlives  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:09:50pm

re: #490 Pie-onist Overlord

#tcot is just all gun-fucking memes.

That presents a very disturbing image to my mind. The fact that it even fits…

495 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:11:58pm

re: #494 thedopefishlives

That presents a very disturbing image to my mind. The fact that it even fits…

That’s what she said!


/Sorry, I couldn’t resist.

496 thedopefishlives  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:12:19pm

re: #495 Dark_Falcon

That’s what she said!

/Sorry, I couldn’t resist.

No, you kinda nailed it there.

497 Pie-onist Overlord  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:13:24pm

Wingnuts do not realize that Leno is a comedian, and a Democrat.

498 EPR-radar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:13:47pm

re: #488 Shiplord Kirel

Of course Ham cannot change his beliefs about this. I am more convinced than ever that he doesn’t believe it himself. He and the other professional creo-liars are quacks, charlatans; in it for money and power. I am also beginning to suspect that only a small percentage of the least intelligent rank and file creo-fools actually believe it. The rest are in it for a backhanded way to attack intellect, justify their indefensible greed and bigotry, and just be general assholes

I’d certainly be happier to believe that the appalling poll results for young earth creationism in the US (~30% polling for literal interpretation of the Bible, which I take to include YEC) include a significant number of people that use it as a tribal identifier without being themselves that painfully stupid.

499 sagehen  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:16:30pm

re: #487 EPR-radar

Ack. I didn’t spot the pun in harddawn.com until I read about it elsewhere. Feeblemindedness is setting in early.

It took me two years and stacks of fanfic to catch the pun in the group name on Glee (“New Directions” sounds like…) — maybe I’m too old to notice high school level punnage.

500 jaunte  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:27:51pm
501 TrapGun  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:39:55pm

Observational science vs. Historical science. It’s like macro vs. micro evolution. Ken Ham had to come up with a new term to muddy the waters. Evolution is evolution and science is science. Historical science is just observational science. What happens now happened before.

502 Gus  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 7:45:20pm

So God creates man 5000 years ago and then waits until 200 BC before he sends a message down telling someone how he created humans effectively waiting 2,786 for human to evolve and create a language.

503 Mich-again  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 9:23:47pm

This is from the 13th century, before the printing press was invented.

“The truth of our faith becomes a matter of ridicule among the infidels if any Catholic, not gifted with the necessary scientific learning, presents as dogma what scientific scrutiny shows to be false.”
― Thomas Aquinas

504 darthstar  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 10:18:34pm
505 StephenMeansMe  Tue, Feb 4, 2014 11:03:03pm

Bill Nye was being pretty clever with his rhetoric. Did anyone notice how he kept deliberately pausing and then referring to the Creation Museum as a “facility” (definitely NOT a museum)? Or constantly referring to “conventional science”/”traditional science” done on “the outside”? It was a tour de force in playing to the Internet and not the po’ white church crowd in the seats. It sort of makes sense, since Nye’s more used to having his Science Guy persona on TV than participating in debates and giving speeches (at least, I think that’s probably true).

To Ham’s credit, he was at least polite, even when he was pulling out all the dirty tricks in the presuppositionalist/apologist handbook (morality! logic requires God! Darwin! racism! etc.) he didn’t ever interrupt Nye. So that was good.

506 rosiee  Wed, Feb 5, 2014 3:32:29am

Maimonides said almost one thousand years ago that “being created in God’s image is our gift of intellect.” Christian misinterpretation of Jewish biblical text goes hand in hand with their ignorance of science.

507 Ming  Wed, Feb 5, 2014 9:47:18pm

re: #212 Skip Intro

Nye is an idiot for lending respectability to this buffoon, as I’ve been saying since the first time I heard this was going to happen.

Of course Bill Nye has the best of intentions. But I’m afraid you’re right. Actually, this debate is plain dishonest, because it’s saying something which is simply untrue: “you, the creationist, are here in good faith to join me in a rational inquiry, searching for the truth, trying to advance the cause of learning.”

If Bill Nye were disciplined to stick with the truth, he could say, for example, “I regret that your museum is using some taxpayer money, I feel bad for the many people whose taxes are supporting your museum, against their will”. Isn’t it amazing, how CLEAN such a simple truth would be, compared with the endless lies of that “debate”?


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